1 00:00:07,080 --> 00:00:16,240 Speaker 1: Diversion audio. A note this episode contains descriptions of violence 2 00:00:16,239 --> 00:00:19,960 Speaker 1: and torture that may be disturbing for some audiences. Please 3 00:00:20,000 --> 00:00:25,079 Speaker 1: take care in listening. This series is based on historical 4 00:00:25,200 --> 00:00:28,880 Speaker 1: characters and real events. Some dialogue has been imagined for 5 00:00:29,000 --> 00:00:36,599 Speaker 1: dramatic purposes when no primary source material is available. Give 6 00:00:36,680 --> 00:00:48,000 Speaker 1: them a father account had heard the words a thousand 7 00:00:48,040 --> 00:00:54,400 Speaker 1: times for giving me fai for I have sinned. It 8 00:00:54,400 --> 00:01:02,000 Speaker 1: has been since my last confession. As the priest listened, 9 00:01:02,360 --> 00:01:04,880 Speaker 1: he considered the turns his life had taken that led 10 00:01:04,959 --> 00:01:08,080 Speaker 1: him to this moment. He joined the clergy a few 11 00:01:08,200 --> 00:01:12,080 Speaker 1: years earlier with a call to serve the people. But now, 12 00:01:12,160 --> 00:01:15,160 Speaker 1: as he sat outside an isolated prison cell near Paris, 13 00:01:15,760 --> 00:01:20,200 Speaker 1: meeting with anonymous prisoners, he wasn't listening for sins. He 14 00:01:20,280 --> 00:01:26,319 Speaker 1: was listening for secrets. The prisoner continued listing his personal failings, 15 00:01:26,760 --> 00:01:32,400 Speaker 1: a scandalous affair of broken marriage, dishonesty, lustful thoughts. Believing 16 00:01:32,400 --> 00:01:34,959 Speaker 1: the Germans would execute him in a few months, he 17 00:01:35,080 --> 00:01:38,759 Speaker 1: bared his soul to the priest in hopes of spiritual redemption. 18 00:01:39,560 --> 00:01:43,360 Speaker 1: But Father Accom wasn't interested in saving this man's soul. 19 00:01:45,720 --> 00:01:50,320 Speaker 1: You have a pattern of disloyalty, my son? Have you 20 00:01:50,440 --> 00:01:56,120 Speaker 1: also been disloyal to Germany? The man in the cell 21 00:01:56,200 --> 00:01:59,640 Speaker 1: spit at the priest's feet, ranting and raving against the 22 00:01:59,680 --> 00:02:04,880 Speaker 1: knots the occupation. Father Accolm listened patiently. After the prisoner 23 00:02:04,920 --> 00:02:08,480 Speaker 1: had worn himself out, A calm press forward, frightening the 24 00:02:08,520 --> 00:02:11,760 Speaker 1: man with ghost stories about the hell that awaited him 25 00:02:11,840 --> 00:02:17,120 Speaker 1: if he didn't come clean. Unburden yourself with the truth 26 00:02:17,440 --> 00:02:22,639 Speaker 1: and save your soul. How have you been disloyal to Germany? 27 00:02:22,880 --> 00:02:31,359 Speaker 1: My son? Then the prisoner cracked says a plan here, 28 00:02:31,600 --> 00:02:40,120 Speaker 1: it's a prison to help Piere to Bonco escape and 29 00:02:40,360 --> 00:02:47,080 Speaker 1: tell me who is involved in this plan. Finally, the 30 00:02:47,080 --> 00:02:50,080 Speaker 1: man who went by father account had found the secret 31 00:02:50,120 --> 00:02:57,639 Speaker 1: he was after. It was in. Just a few months earlier, 32 00:02:57,880 --> 00:03:02,639 Speaker 1: the Nazis had captured British spy Pierre de van cour Vomcorps, 33 00:03:02,840 --> 00:03:07,120 Speaker 1: was a top agent with Britain's Special Operations Executive or 34 00:03:07,400 --> 00:03:11,600 Speaker 1: s OE. He was responsible for leading a network of 35 00:03:11,680 --> 00:03:16,080 Speaker 1: French resistors and British agents in the Nazi occupied regions 36 00:03:16,160 --> 00:03:20,200 Speaker 1: of France, and his capture was considered a major victory 37 00:03:20,560 --> 00:03:25,200 Speaker 1: for German secret intelligence. He has since become the celebrity 38 00:03:25,240 --> 00:03:29,560 Speaker 1: inmate in the prison. The Gestapo had known vom Cour's 39 00:03:29,639 --> 00:03:32,840 Speaker 1: arrest would light up the resistance. He was a man 40 00:03:32,960 --> 00:03:36,360 Speaker 1: full of secrets and if the Brits didn't rescue him quickly, 41 00:03:36,960 --> 00:03:40,040 Speaker 1: years of British strategy would become known to the Germans 42 00:03:40,560 --> 00:03:44,200 Speaker 1: and they would have to start from scratch. The Nazis 43 00:03:44,240 --> 00:03:47,880 Speaker 1: had difficulty persuading the prisoners to give up any information 44 00:03:47,960 --> 00:03:51,920 Speaker 1: they had, and so they opted for a more emotional approach. 45 00:03:52,560 --> 00:03:55,640 Speaker 1: They informed them of their execution dates and sent in 46 00:03:55,720 --> 00:03:59,440 Speaker 1: Father Akong to give them one final shot at redemption. 47 00:04:00,120 --> 00:04:06,280 Speaker 1: One of them took the babe, where are you going? 48 00:04:07,320 --> 00:04:21,400 Speaker 1: I have not start since that, the priest promptly notified 49 00:04:21,440 --> 00:04:25,680 Speaker 1: his Nazi superiors of the escape plan. The prisoners involved 50 00:04:25,880 --> 00:04:30,400 Speaker 1: were quickly executed. Bomb Corps was moved to solitary confinement 51 00:04:30,760 --> 00:04:33,600 Speaker 1: and then transferred to a concentration camp by the end 52 00:04:33,600 --> 00:04:37,039 Speaker 1: of the year. The priests expected some kind of promotion 53 00:04:37,120 --> 00:04:41,880 Speaker 1: for his hard work. He'd been interrogating prisoners for weeks. Instead, 54 00:04:42,320 --> 00:04:47,680 Speaker 1: the s S would broadcast a different message. Return them immediately. 55 00:04:48,600 --> 00:05:03,280 Speaker 1: You'll have a new target. I'm Steven Talty and from diversion. 56 00:05:03,640 --> 00:05:08,520 Speaker 1: This is good Assassin's Season two. Being killed would be 57 00:05:08,520 --> 00:05:11,400 Speaker 1: the easy part. Being tortured would be the hard part. 58 00:05:12,200 --> 00:05:15,800 Speaker 1: Our intel suggests she is behind many of the prison 59 00:05:15,839 --> 00:05:21,400 Speaker 1: bricks all over the country. She is dangerous, so sabotage 60 00:05:21,920 --> 00:05:27,480 Speaker 1: plus a little espionage paramilitary operations make things blow up. 61 00:05:27,800 --> 00:05:31,960 Speaker 1: The message for Captain Bobby and I believe I have 62 00:05:32,120 --> 00:05:39,679 Speaker 1: found the mist of the Limping Lady. Episode three, The Priest. 63 00:05:46,960 --> 00:05:52,560 Speaker 1: The VS government begins to intensify it's exclusionary policies over 64 00:05:52,640 --> 00:05:57,039 Speaker 1: the years and its repression of resists, of Communists, of Jews, etcetera. 65 00:05:58,120 --> 00:06:02,800 Speaker 1: That's Dr Ludavine Brock from previous episodes, Jesus Scholar of 66 00:06:02,839 --> 00:06:06,560 Speaker 1: World War two French history from the University of Westminster. 67 00:06:07,880 --> 00:06:09,560 Speaker 1: At the start of the war, there were about three 68 00:06:09,640 --> 00:06:14,320 Speaker 1: hundred thousand Jews living in France. Once Nazis occupied the country, 69 00:06:14,520 --> 00:06:18,400 Speaker 1: the government began collecting data like addresses and names of 70 00:06:18,440 --> 00:06:21,880 Speaker 1: the Jews currently living there. In the summer of nineteen 71 00:06:21,920 --> 00:06:25,800 Speaker 1: forty two, using these lists, the French police began rounding 72 00:06:25,839 --> 00:06:30,320 Speaker 1: up Jews across the country. In total, about seventy six 73 00:06:30,360 --> 00:06:34,520 Speaker 1: thousand get deported between ninety ninety four. More than half 74 00:06:34,560 --> 00:06:37,440 Speaker 1: of those get deported. In that single summer of nineteen 75 00:06:37,480 --> 00:06:41,680 Speaker 1: forty two, you have thousands of Jews, of Jewish Men, 76 00:06:41,720 --> 00:06:45,560 Speaker 1: women and children who are in turned into this feldive, 77 00:06:45,560 --> 00:06:47,960 Speaker 1: who are taken from their homes, drive from their homes 78 00:06:47,960 --> 00:06:50,920 Speaker 1: and brought to this feldive and then transferred to a camp. 79 00:06:51,400 --> 00:06:53,640 Speaker 1: Now this is a very visible process. It's also very 80 00:06:53,640 --> 00:06:57,599 Speaker 1: clear that it's the French police. They need the alliance 81 00:06:57,760 --> 00:07:01,120 Speaker 1: of the French police in order to carry out this crime. 82 00:07:02,320 --> 00:07:06,520 Speaker 1: This very public atrocity set off widespread alarm and outrage, 83 00:07:07,040 --> 00:07:10,640 Speaker 1: and as Dr Brock adds, not only does the French 84 00:07:10,680 --> 00:07:13,320 Speaker 1: police help with the mass roundup of over ten thousand 85 00:07:13,400 --> 00:07:18,360 Speaker 1: Jews in July, but it also transports Jews who were 86 00:07:18,360 --> 00:07:20,760 Speaker 1: interned into camps in the south of France win the 87 00:07:20,840 --> 00:07:25,080 Speaker 1: Free Zone. It transfers them to draw which is also 88 00:07:25,160 --> 00:07:27,960 Speaker 1: known as the Entertamber, to Auschwitz, which is the biggest 89 00:07:27,960 --> 00:07:30,760 Speaker 1: interman camp for for Jews in France at the time, 90 00:07:31,120 --> 00:07:35,120 Speaker 1: and it basically hands over its foreign Jews to the Germans. 91 00:07:39,880 --> 00:07:43,960 Speaker 1: The romantic city of Paris was stained with blood and violence. 92 00:07:44,960 --> 00:07:48,520 Speaker 1: In addition, living conditions had deteriorated in the years since 93 00:07:48,560 --> 00:07:54,160 Speaker 1: the Germans invaded. In food was scarce, local transit uprooted, 94 00:07:54,600 --> 00:07:59,520 Speaker 1: the economy tarnished, and violence all too common. And there 95 00:07:59,520 --> 00:08:02,960 Speaker 1: were the red was to deal with. Hidden around the country, 96 00:08:03,240 --> 00:08:07,000 Speaker 1: British and French agents telegraphs secret German plots back to 97 00:08:07,040 --> 00:08:10,520 Speaker 1: the UK, hoping to give the English a much needed 98 00:08:10,640 --> 00:08:25,880 Speaker 1: edge against Hitler's forces. One of the Nazi operatives tasked 99 00:08:25,880 --> 00:08:30,080 Speaker 1: with uncovering the underground spine networks was Robert Alesh, a 100 00:08:30,160 --> 00:08:34,319 Speaker 1: Luxembourger priest better known in France by his alias father 101 00:08:34,440 --> 00:08:38,200 Speaker 1: Robert account. At the start of the war, he'd actually 102 00:08:38,240 --> 00:08:42,120 Speaker 1: aligned himself first with the French and worked hiding immigrant 103 00:08:42,200 --> 00:08:45,400 Speaker 1: Jews from the Germans in his parish. He was never 104 00:08:45,520 --> 00:08:49,440 Speaker 1: named an official with any particular agency, but Robert Alesh 105 00:08:49,520 --> 00:08:53,760 Speaker 1: became instrumental in the spy networks, connecting refugees and other 106 00:08:53,840 --> 00:08:57,800 Speaker 1: agents to safe houses throughout the country. But when the 107 00:08:57,880 --> 00:09:01,520 Speaker 1: Nazis took over France, they captured Alesh and made him 108 00:09:01,520 --> 00:09:05,040 Speaker 1: a simple offer become a double agent or be sent 109 00:09:05,080 --> 00:09:09,640 Speaker 1: to the camps. He didn't hesitate and immediately began turning 110 00:09:09,640 --> 00:09:19,160 Speaker 1: over what he knew to the s S. The subsequent 111 00:09:19,320 --> 00:09:24,120 Speaker 1: rates arrests and executions that Alesha's deadly work made possible, 112 00:09:24,480 --> 00:09:29,000 Speaker 1: said British intelligence back months. In an effort to maintain 113 00:09:29,080 --> 00:09:32,640 Speaker 1: some anonymity while he worked in the field, Alesha began 114 00:09:32,720 --> 00:09:39,440 Speaker 1: going by a cone. So as an intelligence officer, I 115 00:09:39,520 --> 00:09:44,680 Speaker 1: tell people, when I did the work, I never was comfortable. 116 00:09:45,200 --> 00:09:50,680 Speaker 1: I always had a level of discomfort. That's Chris Costa, 117 00:09:51,000 --> 00:09:55,199 Speaker 1: the executive director of the International Spy Museum. He worked 118 00:09:55,240 --> 00:09:59,320 Speaker 1: as an intelligence officer for twenty five years. I just 119 00:09:59,480 --> 00:10:04,440 Speaker 1: couldn't afford to be overconfident. So the only time I 120 00:10:04,480 --> 00:10:07,800 Speaker 1: could rest is when I was home, I was recovered 121 00:10:08,160 --> 00:10:12,360 Speaker 1: and the operation was successful or complete. But even then, 122 00:10:13,000 --> 00:10:16,480 Speaker 1: even to this day, I reflect back and I don't 123 00:10:16,920 --> 00:10:22,000 Speaker 1: know how many surveillance I might have missed somewhere along 124 00:10:22,040 --> 00:10:25,080 Speaker 1: the way. And I don't know if subsequently some of 125 00:10:25,080 --> 00:10:29,320 Speaker 1: our sources weren't compromised years later, or people that I 126 00:10:29,360 --> 00:10:33,880 Speaker 1: met with and trained. I don't know if many of 127 00:10:34,400 --> 00:10:38,199 Speaker 1: the my Iraqi counterparts are alive or dead. I can 128 00:10:38,240 --> 00:10:42,000 Speaker 1: say the same thing for many of my Afghan partners 129 00:10:42,040 --> 00:10:45,480 Speaker 1: that I worked with or I trained, And I'd be 130 00:10:45,559 --> 00:10:48,360 Speaker 1: lying to you if I said I wasn't scared. There's 131 00:10:48,440 --> 00:10:51,760 Speaker 1: no sense of false bravado. There are times where it's 132 00:10:51,800 --> 00:10:58,040 Speaker 1: just scary. That's Karen Shafer, another former intelligence operative, reflecting 133 00:10:58,040 --> 00:11:01,600 Speaker 1: on the taxing nature of spy work when you're out 134 00:11:01,720 --> 00:11:05,440 Speaker 1: on the streets, I mean it is a solitary job 135 00:11:05,800 --> 00:11:07,760 Speaker 1: more often than not. I mean, yes, you can work 136 00:11:07,800 --> 00:11:11,240 Speaker 1: with others, you might have joint operations, but generally speaking, 137 00:11:11,240 --> 00:11:17,560 Speaker 1: it's a solitary life. It necessarily takes its toll on 138 00:11:17,600 --> 00:11:25,120 Speaker 1: you physically, emotionally, mentally. Absolutely, there's no question that it does. 139 00:11:25,360 --> 00:11:28,600 Speaker 1: I would say for most of us, it's offset by 140 00:11:28,640 --> 00:11:35,280 Speaker 1: the incredible sense of mission, the incredible sense of contribution. Alesh, 141 00:11:35,400 --> 00:11:38,480 Speaker 1: on the other hand, didn't have that same sense of mission, 142 00:11:38,760 --> 00:11:42,080 Speaker 1: that sense of duty. He was doing this because he 143 00:11:42,120 --> 00:11:47,599 Speaker 1: gave in. He was fully collaborating with the Nazis. Alesia's 144 00:11:47,640 --> 00:11:49,960 Speaker 1: time as a priest served him well in his search 145 00:11:50,040 --> 00:11:54,200 Speaker 1: for Jews and Allied spies. He was a relatively handsome 146 00:11:54,200 --> 00:12:00,959 Speaker 1: man n and considered approachable and friendly. He would attempt 147 00:12:00,960 --> 00:12:04,160 Speaker 1: to establish rapport with those he interrogated, and was soon 148 00:12:04,240 --> 00:12:08,240 Speaker 1: favored by the s S as a top hunter. After 149 00:12:08,320 --> 00:12:11,000 Speaker 1: uncovering the plot to break Pierre de von Corps out 150 00:12:11,040 --> 00:12:14,560 Speaker 1: of prison, he embarked de Jean France, where he had 151 00:12:14,640 --> 00:12:18,040 Speaker 1: learned the details of his next mission from his Nazi handlers. 152 00:12:18,840 --> 00:12:21,720 Speaker 1: It was in Dijon where Lesh first met. And there's 153 00:12:21,760 --> 00:12:23,760 Speaker 1: really no other way to put this. One of the 154 00:12:23,800 --> 00:12:27,960 Speaker 1: most evil men in history, the head of the local Gestapo, 155 00:12:28,440 --> 00:12:35,520 Speaker 1: Klaus Barbie. I'll introduce you to Barbie after the break. 156 00:12:44,520 --> 00:12:49,280 Speaker 1: Cruis Barbie was the head of the Gestapo in leon In. 157 00:12:50,440 --> 00:12:52,920 Speaker 1: So by this point the situation in France is pretty bad, 158 00:12:53,000 --> 00:12:57,480 Speaker 1: is quite tense. That's Ludivin Brock again, the French World 159 00:12:57,480 --> 00:13:02,559 Speaker 1: War Two historian. His mission is to suppress resistors and Jews. 160 00:13:02,600 --> 00:13:04,680 Speaker 1: That's what he's supposed to do, and that's exactly what 161 00:13:04,720 --> 00:13:08,240 Speaker 1: he's going to carry out. I think he probably causes 162 00:13:08,360 --> 00:13:12,200 Speaker 1: the deportation, slash death of over ten tho people, maybe 163 00:13:12,200 --> 00:13:17,200 Speaker 1: almost people. Barbie was so ferocious he earned the nickname 164 00:13:17,400 --> 00:13:22,320 Speaker 1: the Butcher of Theone. In one particularly galling case, Barbie 165 00:13:22,320 --> 00:13:26,640 Speaker 1: discovered and deported fifty children between the ages of five 166 00:13:26,720 --> 00:13:30,199 Speaker 1: and twelve who are hiding out in an orphanage. The 167 00:13:30,280 --> 00:13:34,840 Speaker 1: captured children were sent to their deaths at Auschwitz. In 168 00:13:34,880 --> 00:13:37,960 Speaker 1: the following clip from our interview with Ms. Brock, she 169 00:13:38,040 --> 00:13:42,200 Speaker 1: makes an interesting and horrific point about Klaus Barbie, his 170 00:13:42,280 --> 00:13:46,679 Speaker 1: Nazi police force and their quote zeal for their genocidal work. 171 00:13:47,600 --> 00:13:49,880 Speaker 1: It's interesting that the word zell comes up a lot 172 00:13:49,920 --> 00:13:54,040 Speaker 1: in the archives. He's going to carry out his mission of, 173 00:13:54,360 --> 00:13:58,320 Speaker 1: you know, suppressing Jews and resistance groups with great zell 174 00:13:59,240 --> 00:14:02,559 Speaker 1: and if if they act with cell it's more problematic, 175 00:14:03,160 --> 00:14:10,920 Speaker 1: you know, if you're not just following orders. Hello, Captain 176 00:14:10,960 --> 00:14:16,560 Speaker 1: Bobby Aleft, just good to finally meet you, High hit La, 177 00:14:17,280 --> 00:14:24,480 Speaker 1: high hit ler. I have been reading reports. M hm. 178 00:14:25,480 --> 00:14:28,520 Speaker 1: Yes you've been the kind of busines this country needs mine. Friends, 179 00:14:29,720 --> 00:14:35,240 Speaker 1: It's a forwarding job and to impress, Sir gustapo Ah, 180 00:14:35,280 --> 00:14:38,160 Speaker 1: but I would give for an army of men with 181 00:14:38,240 --> 00:14:42,200 Speaker 1: your attitude. We have so many bouncing about in the 182 00:14:42,320 --> 00:14:47,960 Speaker 1: streets playing police, no real respect. They salute straight and 183 00:14:48,120 --> 00:14:53,280 Speaker 1: enjoys the work. But in you they see a pride. 184 00:14:54,320 --> 00:14:59,120 Speaker 1: This is what I'm looking for. Thank you, sir. Are 185 00:14:59,120 --> 00:15:03,640 Speaker 1: you familiar? This's the city of Lyon here alesh of 186 00:15:04,080 --> 00:15:09,560 Speaker 1: would you prefer abbey either title? Sir? And yes I'm familiar. 187 00:15:10,520 --> 00:15:18,360 Speaker 1: Have you heard of this woman? This they call has 188 00:15:18,400 --> 00:15:23,040 Speaker 1: a limping lady? No, I haven't do is this your 189 00:15:23,080 --> 00:15:26,800 Speaker 1: Heidenstein's talk about her. She struts all over town with 190 00:15:26,920 --> 00:15:32,080 Speaker 1: an injured lake, a major asset to the resistance. Our 191 00:15:32,160 --> 00:15:35,880 Speaker 1: intel suggests she is behind many of the prison bricks 192 00:15:36,080 --> 00:15:42,000 Speaker 1: all over the country. She is dangerous m hm English French. 193 00:15:42,840 --> 00:15:46,240 Speaker 1: We believe she is Canadian, and that is the extent 194 00:15:46,320 --> 00:15:49,960 Speaker 1: of what we know. But she has become an effective 195 00:15:49,960 --> 00:15:54,520 Speaker 1: replacement for vombe care and we cannot have another of 196 00:15:54,600 --> 00:15:57,840 Speaker 1: him running around. I would like you to go to 197 00:15:57,960 --> 00:16:03,680 Speaker 1: Leon and sniff her out, use any method you deem necessary. 198 00:16:04,840 --> 00:16:09,040 Speaker 1: I found that engaging in good conversation is often enough 199 00:16:09,720 --> 00:16:11,680 Speaker 1: if there's more of work to be done in lyon 200 00:16:11,800 --> 00:16:15,080 Speaker 1: beyond this woman. I don't want to leave the impression 201 00:16:15,160 --> 00:16:23,960 Speaker 1: we are animals. Animals, yes, so many of our men 202 00:16:24,040 --> 00:16:30,320 Speaker 1: are animals. Animals are mindless. They attack to eat, to 203 00:16:30,560 --> 00:16:33,400 Speaker 1: fill their bellies, and then they said, I'm away to 204 00:16:33,480 --> 00:16:39,120 Speaker 1: find more. You and I we are not beasts. We 205 00:16:39,400 --> 00:16:46,720 Speaker 1: are philosophers, thinkers with responsibilities the exterminate these Jewish rats 206 00:16:46,960 --> 00:16:51,040 Speaker 1: for the good of others, for our children. Never let 207 00:16:51,040 --> 00:16:55,800 Speaker 1: yourself falter in madness or become a machine. These hands 208 00:16:55,800 --> 00:17:01,120 Speaker 1: of your skill, but only because it is our duty. ALESH. 209 00:17:01,480 --> 00:17:07,080 Speaker 1: They belonged to a man, never an animal. Now go 210 00:17:07,400 --> 00:17:17,439 Speaker 1: kills at one. As Alash made his way into Leone 211 00:17:17,440 --> 00:17:20,200 Speaker 1: by train, he thought about what he knew of Klaus 212 00:17:20,200 --> 00:17:25,080 Speaker 1: Barbie and his methods of interrogation. He never witnessed them himself, 213 00:17:25,560 --> 00:17:29,600 Speaker 1: but they become infamous. I should note for you here's 214 00:17:29,600 --> 00:17:31,960 Speaker 1: where I tell you a bit about tactics that can 215 00:17:32,040 --> 00:17:35,680 Speaker 1: only be described as torture. So take care in listening. 216 00:17:37,000 --> 00:17:41,000 Speaker 1: Rumors abounded that an interrogation from Klaus Barbie meant the 217 00:17:41,080 --> 00:17:44,520 Speaker 1: skin on your hands would be peeled off, starting at 218 00:17:44,520 --> 00:17:49,320 Speaker 1: the fingertips, and then doused with scalding hot water. There 219 00:17:49,320 --> 00:17:52,480 Speaker 1: are reports Barbie would hang his subjects on meat hooks 220 00:17:52,600 --> 00:17:55,800 Speaker 1: inserted through their shoulder blades and dumped them into ice 221 00:17:55,840 --> 00:18:00,320 Speaker 1: buckets to keep them conscious during questioning. He had actually 222 00:18:00,400 --> 00:18:04,120 Speaker 1: made handcuffs with inward facing spikes that would crank into 223 00:18:04,119 --> 00:18:07,840 Speaker 1: the wrist with the turn of the key. Every method 224 00:18:07,920 --> 00:18:11,840 Speaker 1: was effective. The Allegh believed the horrifying legend of Klaus 225 00:18:11,840 --> 00:18:16,840 Speaker 1: Barbie had already gotten around France. Everyone he encountered would 226 00:18:16,840 --> 00:18:19,800 Speaker 1: have their guard up. An alleghed like to work in 227 00:18:19,840 --> 00:18:38,639 Speaker 1: a different way. Now in Leone, Alesha had to figure 228 00:18:38,680 --> 00:18:41,760 Speaker 1: out his first move. He had burned through most of 229 00:18:41,760 --> 00:18:45,359 Speaker 1: his old resistance contacts two years earlier, so you'd have 230 00:18:45,440 --> 00:18:48,239 Speaker 1: to start from scratch. He'd have to put a lot 231 00:18:48,280 --> 00:18:52,640 Speaker 1: of miles into actual footwork and observe the people around him. 232 00:18:52,680 --> 00:18:57,000 Speaker 1: He realized quickly he couldn't approach people as an intimidating Nazi. 233 00:18:57,560 --> 00:18:59,919 Speaker 1: He had to play the part of the kind priest. 234 00:19:01,359 --> 00:19:05,040 Speaker 1: At the time, the Catholic Church in France officially supported 235 00:19:05,200 --> 00:19:08,919 Speaker 1: the new Fishy regime. There was a kind of sense 236 00:19:09,040 --> 00:19:15,119 Speaker 1: that authoritarian regimes, the top down authority, are interested in 237 00:19:15,160 --> 00:19:19,880 Speaker 1: working with the Catholic Church. That's Thomas Cassellman, a professor 238 00:19:19,920 --> 00:19:25,840 Speaker 1: emeritus at Notre Dame University who specializes in French religious history. 239 00:19:26,080 --> 00:19:29,240 Speaker 1: In the summer of nineteen forty, after Paton took power, 240 00:19:29,760 --> 00:19:32,640 Speaker 1: the leaders of the Catholic Church welcomed the new authoritarian 241 00:19:32,720 --> 00:19:37,600 Speaker 1: government with seemingly open arms. So there is a longstanding 242 00:19:37,960 --> 00:19:43,200 Speaker 1: hostility between republican regimes in France and the Catholic Church, 243 00:19:43,320 --> 00:19:47,120 Speaker 1: going back to the French Revolution and the Third Republic, 244 00:19:47,600 --> 00:19:52,040 Speaker 1: which began in eighteen seventy and lasted to nineteen forty. 245 00:19:52,080 --> 00:19:55,679 Speaker 1: They officially separated Church and state. So if you're a 246 00:19:55,760 --> 00:19:59,840 Speaker 1: bishop or a priest in nineteen forty and the rep 247 00:20:00,000 --> 00:20:04,600 Speaker 1: public is collapsing, you're not gonna feel bad about that, 248 00:20:04,680 --> 00:20:07,919 Speaker 1: and you might even embrace as in fact, the French 249 00:20:08,240 --> 00:20:14,199 Speaker 1: religious leadership did an alternative regime. Their their concern is 250 00:20:14,240 --> 00:20:17,920 Speaker 1: to protect their own interests, and leaders of the church 251 00:20:18,240 --> 00:20:21,960 Speaker 1: reaped the benefits. So in the early years of the 252 00:20:22,080 --> 00:20:27,320 Speaker 1: VC regime, especially Catholics were appointed to high positions for 253 00:20:27,400 --> 00:20:30,679 Speaker 1: the first time in the Third Republic, and so the 254 00:20:30,760 --> 00:20:34,800 Speaker 1: regime is reaching out to bring Catholics in and they 255 00:20:34,800 --> 00:20:39,840 Speaker 1: are happy to come on board. Although the official line 256 00:20:39,840 --> 00:20:43,840 Speaker 1: of the Catholic Church was one of support, dissent still endured. 257 00:20:44,720 --> 00:20:49,240 Speaker 1: Resistance to the regime from inside the Catholic Church grows 258 00:20:49,240 --> 00:20:52,200 Speaker 1: in the forties, but it grows from the bottom up 259 00:20:52,200 --> 00:20:55,920 Speaker 1: and not from the top down. One of the precipitating 260 00:20:55,960 --> 00:20:59,280 Speaker 1: events was the government roundup of Jews in the summer 261 00:20:59,359 --> 00:21:04,760 Speaker 1: of nineteen party two. The regime doesn't defend its Jewish citizens, 262 00:21:05,320 --> 00:21:07,480 Speaker 1: and that is a principle of factor, as I have 263 00:21:07,520 --> 00:21:12,919 Speaker 1: said already, for the creation of both general resistance but 264 00:21:13,000 --> 00:21:18,040 Speaker 1: also Catholic Resisians in particular, it is important to note However, 265 00:21:18,480 --> 00:21:22,159 Speaker 1: the top leaders of the Catholic Church remained steadfast, at 266 00:21:22,200 --> 00:21:26,880 Speaker 1: least publicly, in their support of the Vichy regime. Active 267 00:21:26,880 --> 00:21:32,920 Speaker 1: resistors remained a small minority. Alessious background is a man 268 00:21:33,000 --> 00:21:36,680 Speaker 1: of God pointed him in the direction of parishes where 269 00:21:36,680 --> 00:21:40,320 Speaker 1: he offered himself as a substitute priest and an additional 270 00:21:40,440 --> 00:21:44,919 Speaker 1: hand in services. Once he had access to a confessional booth, 271 00:21:45,280 --> 00:21:47,960 Speaker 1: he began to work the way he had with the prisoners, 272 00:21:48,480 --> 00:21:53,119 Speaker 1: balancing empathy and understanding with well chosen moments for guilt 273 00:21:53,400 --> 00:22:00,280 Speaker 1: and pressure. Oh my god, that's one of the worst 274 00:22:00,280 --> 00:22:04,359 Speaker 1: things a Catholic priest can do. In our interview with Casselman, 275 00:22:04,760 --> 00:22:09,440 Speaker 1: we explained Alesia's methods for uncovering resistance secrets because Elman 276 00:22:09,480 --> 00:22:12,119 Speaker 1: walked us through the gravity of what Alesha was doing, 277 00:22:12,640 --> 00:22:18,680 Speaker 1: the sacred code he was violating in a confessionals absolutely 278 00:22:19,640 --> 00:22:26,040 Speaker 1: between you and your confession. Your confessor can't tell anybody anything, superiors, nothing, 279 00:22:26,600 --> 00:22:34,159 Speaker 1: It's a sacred bond linking the confessor with his confess e. 280 00:22:35,119 --> 00:22:40,320 Speaker 1: Confession is what guarantees Catholics who are sentners. It is 281 00:22:40,400 --> 00:22:42,840 Speaker 1: their get out of jail card I means, it's what 282 00:22:42,960 --> 00:22:46,320 Speaker 1: allows them to think I'm not going to hell. And 283 00:22:46,359 --> 00:22:51,840 Speaker 1: so somebody who's committed a murder blown up, sabotaged a 284 00:22:51,920 --> 00:22:55,200 Speaker 1: train of Germans and killed him. Let's say, and feel 285 00:22:55,240 --> 00:22:58,560 Speaker 1: like I kill people. I gotta confession. I'm just playing 286 00:22:58,560 --> 00:23:01,840 Speaker 1: out a scenario here. He goes to this priest and says, 287 00:23:03,200 --> 00:23:05,879 Speaker 1: I blew up a train and I don't want to 288 00:23:05,880 --> 00:23:08,280 Speaker 1: go to hell. So can you ebsolve me? And he 289 00:23:08,359 --> 00:23:12,080 Speaker 1: said what train? Or can you say? You know? So 290 00:23:12,119 --> 00:23:14,679 Speaker 1: from the point of view of the person going into confession, 291 00:23:15,600 --> 00:23:18,959 Speaker 1: this priest is going to exolve me from my sins 292 00:23:19,840 --> 00:23:23,399 Speaker 1: uh and and allow me to go to heaven and 293 00:23:23,520 --> 00:23:29,040 Speaker 1: avoid eternal hell fire. And he's thinking, this guy is 294 00:23:29,040 --> 00:23:31,640 Speaker 1: going to give me intelligence I could bring to the Germans. 295 00:23:32,320 --> 00:23:34,720 Speaker 1: We don't know what was going on in his mind, 296 00:23:35,440 --> 00:23:41,240 Speaker 1: but his behavior is is shocking. It was through these 297 00:23:41,240 --> 00:23:44,919 Speaker 1: base methods that Alesh found the neugget of information he 298 00:23:45,000 --> 00:23:59,680 Speaker 1: was looking for. Forgive me, my son, But I feel 299 00:23:59,680 --> 00:24:02,280 Speaker 1: ass though I have not done enough in this war. 300 00:24:03,560 --> 00:24:07,480 Speaker 1: If there were a way to get involved, what would 301 00:24:07,520 --> 00:24:12,119 Speaker 1: you suggest. Do you know a doctor named Jean who 302 00:24:12,240 --> 00:24:16,640 Speaker 1: say I do not he is helpful to the resistance. 303 00:24:17,520 --> 00:24:19,800 Speaker 1: We have just lost the man to the Nazis, who 304 00:24:19,840 --> 00:24:24,000 Speaker 1: acted there's a girl of salts and we'll say it 305 00:24:24,080 --> 00:24:30,920 Speaker 1: needs another m. But the job would require travel. M 306 00:24:32,680 --> 00:24:41,080 Speaker 1: Where can I find this? Who say doctor Jean we 307 00:24:41,240 --> 00:24:44,960 Speaker 1: say was a French gynecologist would become a major anchor 308 00:24:45,040 --> 00:24:49,119 Speaker 1: point for the French resistance since the German occupation. We 309 00:24:49,280 --> 00:24:51,440 Speaker 1: say it was at the center of the web, with 310 00:24:51,480 --> 00:24:57,600 Speaker 1: connections to allies, spies, refugees and safe houses. While he 311 00:24:57,640 --> 00:25:01,000 Speaker 1: was recognized by the resistance and British and intelligence, he 312 00:25:01,080 --> 00:25:03,960 Speaker 1: didn't have an official title. He believed he could do 313 00:25:04,040 --> 00:25:08,080 Speaker 1: more as a citizen. To Robert Alesh, doctor Hussey had 314 00:25:08,119 --> 00:25:11,159 Speaker 1: the potential to be a gold mine of information and 315 00:25:11,160 --> 00:25:14,679 Speaker 1: could undoubtedly lead him to the location and identity of 316 00:25:14,760 --> 00:25:20,680 Speaker 1: his target. The limping Lady Lesh quickly informed Klaus Barbie 317 00:25:20,680 --> 00:25:24,479 Speaker 1: of doctor Roussey and told the Gestapo they'd already captured 318 00:25:24,520 --> 00:25:28,639 Speaker 1: the doctor's career unknowingly in a previous raid. If they 319 00:25:28,640 --> 00:25:32,040 Speaker 1: could discover which of their prisoners was this courier, they 320 00:25:32,040 --> 00:25:36,280 Speaker 1: could use the information against Dr Hussay and infiltrate the resistance. 321 00:25:36,880 --> 00:25:40,560 Speaker 1: The Gestapo went to work combing through arrest files and 322 00:25:40,640 --> 00:25:45,680 Speaker 1: interrogating their captives until they found the spy. Through this prisoner, 323 00:25:45,920 --> 00:25:48,479 Speaker 1: they were able to learn code words that would give 324 00:25:48,520 --> 00:25:51,840 Speaker 1: the Nazis access to doctor Hussay, but they failed to 325 00:25:51,880 --> 00:25:56,159 Speaker 1: retrieve any information on the limping. Lady Lesh asked the 326 00:25:56,200 --> 00:25:59,439 Speaker 1: prisoner to write a letter to Roussay telling him a 327 00:25:59,480 --> 00:26:03,200 Speaker 1: replacement courier that he could trust would contact him. Soon 328 00:26:07,920 --> 00:26:21,520 Speaker 1: after the break Robert Alsh executes his opening move. So 329 00:26:21,560 --> 00:26:23,119 Speaker 1: if you're part of the resistance, hey, you want to 330 00:26:23,160 --> 00:26:27,399 Speaker 1: keep it quiet. That's Ludivin Brock again talking about the 331 00:26:27,520 --> 00:26:31,480 Speaker 1: risks of joining the French resistance. If you get find out, 332 00:26:31,480 --> 00:26:33,719 Speaker 1: you will get arrested, in turn put into a prison 333 00:26:33,840 --> 00:26:38,240 Speaker 1: and possibly eventually deported. They try to torture confessions out 334 00:26:38,240 --> 00:26:41,760 Speaker 1: of many people, and you can be executed. But they 335 00:26:41,800 --> 00:26:46,240 Speaker 1: also they also do retaliations. When a German officer is murdered, 336 00:26:46,359 --> 00:26:51,080 Speaker 1: there will be retaliation. So the stakes are very very high, 337 00:26:52,080 --> 00:26:56,760 Speaker 1: and they get even higher by any hint at resistance 338 00:26:57,040 --> 00:27:01,440 Speaker 1: is shut down. You have a famous case called where 339 00:27:01,520 --> 00:27:03,879 Speaker 1: everyone gets killed in the village and the village gets 340 00:27:03,880 --> 00:27:07,639 Speaker 1: burnt down and entirely destroyed out of retaliation for resistance acts. 341 00:27:09,680 --> 00:27:13,240 Speaker 1: The Gestapo gave a Lesh microfilm of old German plans, 342 00:27:13,800 --> 00:27:16,960 Speaker 1: knowing that the courier was expected to deliver new information 343 00:27:17,080 --> 00:27:20,320 Speaker 1: to the resistance, but they also had to give him 344 00:27:20,359 --> 00:27:24,040 Speaker 1: some small amount of fresh intel too, knowing this would 345 00:27:24,080 --> 00:27:28,480 Speaker 1: ensure Alesh could develop a relationship with the enemy. If 346 00:27:28,520 --> 00:27:31,800 Speaker 1: Alesh was successful and both Dr Russy and the Limping 347 00:27:31,880 --> 00:27:35,720 Speaker 1: Lady were arrested, Klaus Barbie would come to Leone himself 348 00:27:36,080 --> 00:27:40,480 Speaker 1: and set up operations. Lesh saw this only in selfish 349 00:27:40,600 --> 00:27:43,320 Speaker 1: terms and what this could mean for his own career, 350 00:27:44,200 --> 00:27:47,720 Speaker 1: so he set out again, adopting the persona of father. 351 00:27:47,800 --> 00:28:02,679 Speaker 1: ACoM we it's father, I can have you treated the 352 00:28:02,800 --> 00:28:07,200 Speaker 1: cats on the roofles. She had arrived at doctor who 353 00:28:07,240 --> 00:28:12,280 Speaker 1: says home and immediately engaged the man in code. Yes, 354 00:28:12,680 --> 00:28:19,159 Speaker 1: but they won't take Brandy coming, my friend. You have 355 00:28:19,240 --> 00:28:23,240 Speaker 1: the package from Paris. Yes, it's micro film. You're late. 356 00:28:23,800 --> 00:28:26,040 Speaker 1: The gush stop stopped me in the cafe where I 357 00:28:26,080 --> 00:28:29,480 Speaker 1: was waiting, but I felt I couldn't move. They would 358 00:28:29,480 --> 00:28:35,760 Speaker 1: search me. He all knew what this. Hoping to get better, 359 00:28:36,600 --> 00:28:39,320 Speaker 1: we need all the help we can get. I was 360 00:28:39,320 --> 00:28:42,240 Speaker 1: worried about it, enne he thought he had been arrested. 361 00:28:42,760 --> 00:28:46,720 Speaker 1: His letter was a comfort. Yes, I believe he's become 362 00:28:46,760 --> 00:28:52,000 Speaker 1: ill ill. He didn't say anything about that. Yes, but 363 00:28:52,240 --> 00:28:58,160 Speaker 1: would he You know, Etienne, that's true, that's true. Well, 364 00:28:58,200 --> 00:29:02,000 Speaker 1: I I hope he imp moves. Is there anything you 365 00:29:02,040 --> 00:29:07,440 Speaker 1: want me to take back to Bury? No, but Marie 366 00:29:07,480 --> 00:29:13,120 Speaker 1: may Marie, Yeah, I'll give you the address, same code 367 00:29:13,360 --> 00:29:16,560 Speaker 1: to enter. She'll be easy to spot. She has a 368 00:29:16,560 --> 00:29:20,440 Speaker 1: bit of a limp. A limp. She'll be the one 369 00:29:20,480 --> 00:29:28,040 Speaker 1: to pay you as well. Huh. And so unless received 370 00:29:28,120 --> 00:29:31,800 Speaker 1: his first heart evidence of the existence of the limping Lady. 371 00:29:32,520 --> 00:29:36,400 Speaker 1: And with that, Robert Alesh and Virginia Hall began a 372 00:29:36,440 --> 00:29:42,880 Speaker 1: game of cat and mouse coming up this season on 373 00:29:43,040 --> 00:29:48,920 Speaker 1: Good Assassins, you're offering me a post. I don't exactly 374 00:29:48,920 --> 00:29:54,480 Speaker 1: have an elegant hiring history with intelligence agencies. Deep your 375 00:29:54,680 --> 00:29:59,240 Speaker 1: ends are cutbird. The best Nazi is a dead Nazi. 376 00:30:00,680 --> 00:30:03,960 Speaker 1: Let's win the war first, shall I. You'll be very 377 00:30:04,000 --> 00:30:08,440 Speaker 1: busy both aiding our men and gathering intel from the Nazis. 378 00:30:10,440 --> 00:30:27,400 Speaker 1: She has a limp. Yeah, interesting indeed, in limp. If 379 00:30:27,400 --> 00:30:30,200 Speaker 1: you have any questions for us about Good Assassins, if 380 00:30:30,240 --> 00:30:33,440 Speaker 1: you're curious about some aspect of Virginia hall story, or 381 00:30:33,480 --> 00:30:36,080 Speaker 1: have any comments on the podcast. We'd love to hear 382 00:30:36,120 --> 00:30:39,600 Speaker 1: from you. Please email us at good Assassins at diversion 383 00:30:39,640 --> 00:30:44,200 Speaker 1: audio dot com. Make sure you spell assassins correctly again, 384 00:30:44,280 --> 00:30:47,720 Speaker 1: that's good Assassins at diversion Audio dot com. We'll try 385 00:30:47,760 --> 00:30:51,440 Speaker 1: to answer your questions on a future episode. Find us 386 00:30:51,440 --> 00:30:56,520 Speaker 1: on Twitter, Facebook, and Instagram at diversion pods. Good Assassins 387 00:30:56,560 --> 00:30:59,520 Speaker 1: is a production of Diversion Audio in association with I 388 00:30:59,680 --> 00:31:03,920 Speaker 1: Heart Podcasts. This season is hosted by Steven Talti and 389 00:31:04,000 --> 00:31:08,480 Speaker 1: written by Cede Carpenter, Produced and directed by Kevin Thompson 390 00:31:08,640 --> 00:31:13,080 Speaker 1: for Real Jet Packs Productions. Story editing by Jacob Bronstein, 391 00:31:13,400 --> 00:31:18,360 Speaker 1: with editorial direction from Scott Waxman, additional research and reporting 392 00:31:18,360 --> 00:31:23,440 Speaker 1: by Sophie McNulty. Theme music by Tyler Cash featuring the 393 00:31:23,520 --> 00:31:27,840 Speaker 1: voices of mikhaela Is Caerdo, Raphael cork Kill, Lenna Klingeman, 394 00:31:28,040 --> 00:31:33,520 Speaker 1: John Perks, Andrew polk or Lock, Cassidy Manoel Falciano, Sean Gormley, 395 00:31:33,840 --> 00:31:38,720 Speaker 1: Matthew Amant, and Steve Rautman. Sound design, mixing and mastering 396 00:31:38,760 --> 00:31:44,680 Speaker 1: by Paul Goodrich, Sound editing by Justin Kilpatrick. Executive producers 397 00:31:44,760 --> 00:31:48,959 Speaker 1: Jacob Bronstein, Mark Francis and Scott Waxman for diversion audio, 398 00:32:01,280 --> 00:32:08,160 Speaker 1: see SIM for diversion audio.