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Speaker 1: You you meet bad Buddy.

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Speaker 2: Oh yeah, I've met. We need tell multiple times because

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Speaker 2: he he has done a couple things for us from

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Speaker 2: time to time. He had an absolutely wonderful match with

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Speaker 2: Damian Priest in Puerto Rico a couple of years back.

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Speaker 2: He loves wrestling. That's that's insane. By the way, I

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Speaker 2: just want people to understand that he was a street fight.

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Speaker 2: It was like a no Olds Bar San Juan street fight.

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Speaker 2: He's going through tables, getting beat with chairs, getting choked, slammed.

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Speaker 2: This is the biggest artist in the world. This would

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Speaker 2: have been like Michael Jackson in nineteen eighty six at

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Speaker 2: Wrestle Mainey.

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Speaker 3: All my Life Running, All my Life, Sacrifice, Hustle, ped Price,

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Speaker 3: one Slice got the Brother, All my Life, Poppy grinning

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Speaker 3: in all my Life, All my Life, Running, all my Light, Sacrifice, Hussele,

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Speaker 3: ped Price, one Slice got the products all my Life,

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Speaker 3: pop be grinning in All My Life.

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Speaker 1: Today's episode is that the beautiful Redwood Room at the

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Speaker 1: Cliff Hotel in San Francisco, stopping by for conversation on

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Speaker 1: to drink Today is one of WWE's biggest and beloved superstars,

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Speaker 1: one of the greatest pro wrestlers to ever live. One

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Speaker 1: of the WWE's most reliable main events talents, with world championships,

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Speaker 1: WrestleMania moments, and multiple reinventions of his character. He's the

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Speaker 1: only superstar to hold both the WWE Championship and the

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Speaker 1: United States Championship simultaneously. A six time WWE World Champion,

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Speaker 1: a six time WWE Raw Tag Team Champion, the first

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Speaker 1: ever NXT champion, an elite level athlete, performer, and an entertainer.

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Speaker 1: He's a father and a husband, a revolutionary, a visionary,

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Speaker 1: and an architect. A future Hall of Famer of the WWE.

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Speaker 1: Here is ladies and gentlemen, Seth Freakin' Rallins.

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Speaker 2: Whoelroad that I deserves a raid?

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Speaker 1: Does that?

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Speaker 2: You go with yourself and let's pay this man more morning?

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Speaker 1: So, Seth, will you hear all the I mean, six

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Speaker 1: time ww E Champion, sixth time row Tag Team Champion,

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Speaker 1: the first w first w NXT champion, everything that you've accomplished.

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Speaker 1: Are you surprised that you've accomplished this at such a

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Speaker 1: young age?

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Speaker 2: I mean, gosh, am I still young? Yeah? I got

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Speaker 2: a little time left at it. Yeah, But I mean

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Speaker 2: I've been wrestling for over twenty years now, so you know,

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Speaker 2: you look at everything that I've been able to do

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Speaker 2: my body work in the last two decades, and I

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Speaker 2: guess I'm always sort of surprised. I'm always sort of like,

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Speaker 2: when you read that stuff or I hear that stuff,

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Speaker 2: it still doesn't feel like you're talking about me right now.

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Speaker 2: I grew up in a small town, less than a

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Speaker 2: thousand people in the middle of nowhere, so like it

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Speaker 2: feels like we're just reading, you know, the the accolades

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Speaker 2: of somebody else, some other Hall of famer, you know.

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Speaker 2: So it's really it's really cool, it's really humbling.

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Speaker 1: Actually, well, let's toast that. Let's tell me man, six

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Speaker 1: time champ, six time tag team champ, small Guy came

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Speaker 1: out of nowhere. Congratulations, congratulations and all you.

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Speaker 2: Success best as you have to come.

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Speaker 1: As you mentioned, from a very very small town of

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Speaker 1: a thousand people. Hell, that's even smaller than Glenville. We

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Speaker 1: had thirty five hundred people less than Yeah.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, we didn't have a stoplight.

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Speaker 1: You know, you don't have a high school.

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Speaker 2: No, no, we had to go and like travel to

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Speaker 2: the big city for the high school. You didn't have

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Speaker 2: a middle school. All we had was an elementary school.

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Speaker 1: That was it, And so you go straight from elementary

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Speaker 1: and then you have to start busting to go to

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Speaker 1: junior high and high school. So where are you from.

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Speaker 2: I grew up in Buffalo, Iowa.

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Speaker 1: Buffalo, Io.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, right outside of Davenport, Iowa.

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Speaker 3: Okay.

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Speaker 2: I spent most of my time. It's in the Quad Cities.

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Speaker 2: It's kind of like perched halfway between Chicago on to

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Speaker 2: the east and then Des Moines to the west. It's

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Speaker 2: like right there on the Mississippi River.

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Speaker 1: Is it still I mean, you've had an influx of

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Speaker 1: people since there's still not a thousand people, isn't it.

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Speaker 2: Oh? Probably less Man. That's one of those towns people

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Speaker 2: don't stay and they try to get out.

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Speaker 1: Did you graduate high school and you can get going?

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Speaker 2: Get me gone? Yeah?

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Speaker 1: Absolutely? Your upbringing, your last name is Lopez after your stepfather.

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Speaker 1: At what age did you change your last name?

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Speaker 2: Uh? My dad adopted me. I think when I was two, Yeah,

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Speaker 2: so I would have it would have been about I mean,

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Speaker 2: as long as I can remember, Lopez has been my

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Speaker 2: last name and he's been my dad. So I have

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Speaker 2: no like I only recently became semi acquainted with my

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Speaker 2: biological father in his offspring. That's recent, like within the

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Speaker 2: last five or six years. Via twenty three and me text. Yeah,

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Speaker 2: we got a surprise on that one. That was fun. Yeah,

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Speaker 2: I mean Lopez, that's my dad. His parents are my grandparents.

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Speaker 2: You know they've passed away now, but like that's those

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Speaker 2: are those are my people. I don't know anything any different.

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Speaker 1: Did you know your biological father when you were younger?

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Speaker 1: You said you became re acquainted with him in the

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Speaker 1: last five or six years, But so did you not

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Speaker 1: have you didn't have any type of relationship, You didn't

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Speaker 1: know anything about it.

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Speaker 2: No, I did nothing, and only his name.

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Speaker 1: That's it. That's it.

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Speaker 2: That's all my mom told me. Obviously she explained, you know,

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Speaker 2: what happened and why she didn't stay in that relationship

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Speaker 2: and all that stuff. But I, ever, he didn't have

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Speaker 2: any interests, and uh, you know I did. I wasn't

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Speaker 2: in need. I had my dad, Lopez, Ron Lopez his name.

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Speaker 2: He's a great role model for me, my grandpa, my uncles.

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Speaker 2: I had great male role models in my life. So

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Speaker 2: I wasn't There was never that need to.

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Speaker 1: To try to find out seeking out. Yeah, so what

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Speaker 1: does what does your stepdad, mean because you said he

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Speaker 1: like when you talk about him, you never said step

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Speaker 1: You said my dad, Ron Lopez was a great guy.

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Speaker 1: And his brothers, his uncles, they take they took me

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Speaker 1: in as if I was a blood red live His parents,

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Speaker 1: my grandparents. You speaking parent, uncle, no step step step

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Speaker 1: now dad, uncle, grandparents. What was it about him that

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Speaker 1: made him so special in your eyes except the fact

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Speaker 1: that he obviously married your mom and he took you in.

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Speaker 1: But there had to be something more to them too.

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Speaker 2: I mean, he always treated me exactly like I have

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Speaker 2: an older brother. He has another son who's few years

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Speaker 2: old than me. He always treated us equal. There was

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Speaker 2: never like any favoritism or anything like that. I never

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Speaker 2: felt slighted in anyway. But he was just like his

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Speaker 2: work ethic was legit, you know, and he didn't have

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Speaker 2: like a glamorous job or anything like that. You know,

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Speaker 2: he was a guy that kind of just worked in

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Speaker 2: like foundries and steel plants and stuff like that, worked

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Speaker 2: with his hands, you know, did stuff like that. But

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Speaker 2: he always made time to like coach my baseball team,

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Speaker 2: be around, you know, coach decide. He didn't know how

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Speaker 2: to play soccer, he coached a soccer team, you know,

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Speaker 2: like he was a part of my life in that way,

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Speaker 2: and so he was always there, always around. I got

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Speaker 2: to I got a sense between him and my mom

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Speaker 2: of what like what it meant to, you know, put

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Speaker 2: other people before you, what it meant to work hard,

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Speaker 2: what it meant to kind of just like take all

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Speaker 2: of the things that life would throw at you and

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Speaker 2: still put on like a happy face. You know, I

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Speaker 2: didn't grow up. I wasn't lower class, but I certainly

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Speaker 2: wasn't like a middle class. But we never knew the difference.

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Speaker 1: You know.

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Speaker 2: We had a happy family for the most part until

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Speaker 2: my folks got divorced. But like everything was like they

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Speaker 2: were just they were they were good salt of the

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Speaker 2: earth people.

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Speaker 1: They gave you an example of what family should be

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Speaker 1: or what it looked like.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, even even after even after they split up, they

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Speaker 2: got divorced when I was like ten or eleven, even

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Speaker 2: then they were amicable and it was like they still

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Speaker 2: there was still love for for me and for us

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Speaker 2: as children. There was never like a you know, there

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Speaker 2: was never an animus like he was my stepdad, so

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Speaker 2: he could have easily once that was the separation.

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Speaker 1: Haven't gone by his way and don't have any contact.

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Speaker 2: He could have easily done that, but he never did,

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Speaker 2: and he was always there. You know, my mom remarried

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Speaker 2: a couple of times, and her her second would have

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Speaker 2: been her third husband. He was an incredible, uh you

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Speaker 2: know stepfather for me as well. So I was. I was,

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Speaker 2: even though I had kind of a broken upbringing. I

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Speaker 2: always felt very fortunate that I had extremely positive male

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Speaker 2: role models around me. I think that that was like

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Speaker 2: super beneficial for me and kind of becoming, you know,

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Speaker 2: who I am as a person.

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Speaker 1: It seems to me that your your ron who adopted you,

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Speaker 1: and from that point on you experienced love.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean that's I did. I've never felt anything

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Speaker 2: but love from him in his own way. You know,

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Speaker 2: he's not one of those guys that's like physically affectionate

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Speaker 2: or anything like that, but you know, he's just you.

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Speaker 2: You you know, when you're around people and you feel love,

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Speaker 2: there's just a different there's a different feeling, there's a

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Speaker 2: different energy, and he always He's always been that way

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Speaker 2: for me.

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Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah, yeah, you said, uh Lopez, he he's Hispanic.

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Speaker 1: It's a good DESI Yeah, So what is it? What

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Speaker 1: was it about? That because I mean, you grew up

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Speaker 1: in a small town like ah, we like damn, yeah

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Speaker 1: we got we got Hispanics. And yeah, so what what

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Speaker 1: was it? What was it? Was it different? Did you

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Speaker 1: notice anything different?

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Speaker 3: Though?

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Speaker 1: You just this is my dad, this is my family,

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Speaker 1: and this is what this is how we are.

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Speaker 2: No, I never noticed, you know, and I think I

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Speaker 2: didn't notice probably until I got older and thought about it,

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Speaker 2: like until it like, yeah, yeah, it dawned on me

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Speaker 2: what was happening. We grew up in a small town

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Speaker 2: in the middle of Iowa, in the midwest ward. I

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Speaker 2: mean they were probably like the Lopezes were probably the

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Speaker 2: only Hispanic people in the entire town. But just at

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Speaker 2: the time when I was grown up, you know, probably

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Speaker 2: from at least like you know, a age two to

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Speaker 2: I would have been fourteen, it never even dawned on

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Speaker 2: me that my parents were in like an interracial relationship. Wow,

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Speaker 2: Like it never even occurred to me to think that way,

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Speaker 2: you know what I mean. It wasn't until that concept

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Speaker 2: started to like permeate your psyche at an older age,

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Speaker 2: you know, when you kind of understand relationships and like that,

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Speaker 2: like whatever the socio dynamics are between interracial relationships, especially

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Speaker 2: in the Midwest and in small towns like that where

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Speaker 2: it's not always just kosher. Then I was like, oh wow,

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Speaker 2: I bet my mom probably got a lot of crap

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Speaker 2: for that. Yeah, you know, And when I talked to

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Speaker 2: her about it later, yeah, she was like, oh yeah, yeah,

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Speaker 2: of course, we always got some weird looks and some

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Speaker 2: funny stuff. I never I never noticed that, And I

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Speaker 2: never received that treatment like in school from the other

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Speaker 2: character or anything like it. No, No, I never got

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Speaker 2: any of that, And I don't know if it helped that.

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Speaker 2: You know. I'm like, I'm a little like, I'm Armenian,

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Speaker 2: that's like half my descent, so I have a little

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Speaker 2: bit of like an olive tint to my skin. But

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Speaker 2: I never had I never experienced that, And it was,

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Speaker 2: like I said, it wasn't until later when I even

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Speaker 2: realized that my folks probably got some of those little

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Speaker 2: side eyes. Yeah exactly.

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Speaker 1: You mentioned you had an older brother, Yes, was that

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Speaker 1: the only sibling that you had.

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Speaker 2: For most of my Like I said, my mom's were

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Speaker 2: married three times, so she's married to my dad Ron

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Speaker 2: when I'm two older brother three years older than me.

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Speaker 2: My best friend, like he's my brother. I you know,

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Speaker 2: we're as close as blood, thicker than blood really because

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Speaker 2: there's real bond, real love there. And then she divorces.

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Speaker 2: She married second husband. He has a couple of kids,

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Speaker 2: but I don't keep in contact with them hardly at all.

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Speaker 2: And then third marriage, her final one, one daughter, so

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Speaker 2: younger than me, maybe like six years younger than me,

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Speaker 2: I think, And so she would be like a stepsister

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Speaker 2: I would consider.

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Speaker 1: But your father, your your birth father, yes, ha had

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Speaker 1: are they kids? And you just recently?

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Speaker 2: Yeah? I had done twenty three and me like because

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Speaker 2: because I didn't know any of my family history. So

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Speaker 2: I didn't know any of like any of them. You know,

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Speaker 2: you get asked like all the time you fill out

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Speaker 2: a form, it's like, hey, what's the uh you know what,

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Speaker 2: what's your family history on this side? Your heart disease something? Yes, yeah,

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Speaker 2: I don't know. I don't know anything. So I was

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Speaker 2: just like, you know what, I'll do one of these tests.

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Speaker 2: I'll see like where I'm from and kind of get

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Speaker 2: an idea of what my heritages and stuff like that.

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Speaker 2: So I put this thing in, get all the info,

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Speaker 2: look at it, forget about it, set it aside. I

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Speaker 2: got the app on my phone, but I never touch it,

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Speaker 2: you know, after I see all the cool info, then

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Speaker 2: like maybe two or three years later, I get a

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Speaker 2: random message, a ping on the twenty three and me,

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Speaker 2: and you get like, you know, if you have a

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Speaker 2: twenty three and me or an ancestry, you get like

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Speaker 2: DNA matches like occasionally, but they're like sixth cousin, like

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Speaker 2: emaither like way down. You just ignore them, you know.

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Speaker 2: You get the email. Yeah, yeah, a nude match, Oh,

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Speaker 2: fourteenth cousin. Get rid of it, you know. And this

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Speaker 2: one came with a message and I saw it and

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Speaker 2: I saw the last name, and it was from a

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Speaker 2: my what would have been my half sister, And I

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Speaker 2: clicked the message and I owe my and she said, uh,

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Speaker 2: who is your dad? And I said, oh no, oh no.

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Speaker 2: So I told her. I explained her what I knew

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Speaker 2: and what I knew she did not know. So she

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Speaker 2: yeah her her my biological father. Our father had never

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Speaker 2: told her what that he had possibly had another kid,

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Speaker 2: never told anybody, and so everybody and his family like

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Speaker 2: didn't know. It was called kind of a surprise. And

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Speaker 2: she went to try to like ask him about it.

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Speaker 2: He was like, no, no way. She's like, it's right here,

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Speaker 2: you know. I found It's like it's science. You can't

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Speaker 2: back up on this. And she's younger than me. Yeah,

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Speaker 2: and then she then and she has a brother who's

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Speaker 2: a little bit younger I think a little bit younger

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Speaker 2: than her as well, and so they, yeah, they they

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Speaker 2: once he fessed up to it, and then you know,

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Speaker 2: we're friends and we talk and all that stuff.

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Speaker 1: So your biological father never told that he had had kids.

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Speaker 1: So was he in your biomological mother married or anytime?

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Speaker 2: No? No, no, they were never married. She was from Iowa.

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Speaker 2: She in her twenties, moved to Chicago and was you know,

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Speaker 2: dating and stuff like that. She ended up getting pregnant

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Speaker 2: and then she was like, I don't want to be

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Speaker 2: here to raise this kid. I'd like to go back

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Speaker 2: to Iowa. And I don't know what the dynamics of

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Speaker 2: their relationship were at that time, but he was like, nah,

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Speaker 2: I'm not doing that. I'm gonna go like do my thing,

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Speaker 2: and she was like that's fine, just you know, don't

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Speaker 2: you know, I'll buzzy you. She like got in contact

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Speaker 2: with him a couple times after I was born and

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Speaker 2: was like, hey, would you like to see him, would

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Speaker 2: you like to be a part of his life? He's

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Speaker 2: like no, no, no. And I don't know if he

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Speaker 2: even knew or believed that I was his because they weren't.

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Speaker 2: I don't know if they were in any exclusive relationship.

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Speaker 2: So there's all sorts of you know, they're just young

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Speaker 2: kids having a good time. And she got pregnant, she

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Speaker 2: was happy to be a mom, and he just wasn't

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Speaker 2: ready to be a dad. And I never felt any

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Speaker 2: sort of like animus towards him for that. I just

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Speaker 2: was like, I get that. I get that. And again,

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Speaker 2: maybe if I had been in a situation where it

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Speaker 2: didn't turn out as well as it did for me

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Speaker 2: on the dad's side of things, I might have had

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Speaker 2: a different feeling about it. But I was fortunate.

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Speaker 1: About it everything that he wasn't.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, it was great, it was it worked out better

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Speaker 2: for me in that way. I think if she would

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Speaker 2: have stayed there and stayed with him my life, I mean,

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Speaker 2: we wouldn't even sitting here on this conversation today, you

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Speaker 2: know what I mean. That's the kind of butterfly effect

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Speaker 2: that those type of things have. So it's really incredible

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Speaker 2: that just one decision like that and changes the whole thing.

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Speaker 1: You mentioned that five or six years ago you met

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Speaker 1: your father and you know, trying to establish so.

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Speaker 2: I didn't meet him. I've never met him.

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Speaker 1: You've never met him.

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Speaker 2: I still have met him. I talked to him on

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Speaker 2: the phone one time. We talked about maybe maybe meeting up,

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Speaker 2: and I told him when my schedule was kind of

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Speaker 2: going to open up, or when I would be in

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Speaker 2: Chicago again, and he never followed up. So I really

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Speaker 2: I don't think he I don't know. I don't know

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Speaker 2: if it's a.

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Speaker 1: You think he's in bad Do you think he's embarrassed yet?

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Speaker 1: Probably because look at what that you say. It had

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Speaker 1: this situation that you might have not have turned out,

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Speaker 1: but you turned out to where you are. You're a superstar. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: and I'm sure people find I'm sure he's probably told someone.

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Speaker 1: He probably won't ever tell you. But you know, my

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Speaker 1: son is self Rallie, right, maybe, and it's like, hold on,

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Speaker 1: that's not your son.

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Speaker 2: It is maybe And if that's that's all it is,

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Speaker 2: and that's great, you know, that's just life. Life works

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Speaker 2: that way sometimes. So again I got no no ill will,

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Speaker 2: but no, I never met him so I haven't met

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Speaker 2: him one one chat on the phone. He's got a

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Speaker 2: granddaughter that he's never never met, you know, stuff like that.

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Speaker 1: So that's on him. That's that's Do you think he's embarrassed?

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Speaker 2: I mean I assume, so I don't pretend to put

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Speaker 2: myself in his shoes, but I assume there's like a

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Speaker 2: lot of complex feelings that go on there that you

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Speaker 2: that you know, he's probably in his I mean sixties now,

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Speaker 2: so there's probably just a lot to process that he's

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Speaker 2: like either doesn't want to process, doesn't know how to process,

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Speaker 2: and you know, whether it's shame and guilt and you know,

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Speaker 2: like xpertation. There's just a lot that goes on there.

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Speaker 2: So again, I have no like ill will towards him.

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Speaker 2: I don't feel any type of way. I just if

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Speaker 2: if he would want to, I would be available. But

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Speaker 2: he's never he's never made the strides.

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Speaker 1: What about the siblings that he that he had? Your

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Speaker 1: siblings that you have, have you met them? Have you

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Speaker 1: seen them in person?

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Speaker 2: And I have got good relationships with really that's awesome. Yeah,

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00:16:18,800 --> 00:16:21,320
Speaker 2: they're great. They were they were there. I mean they

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00:16:21,320 --> 00:16:23,200
Speaker 2: don't have like a they don't have that sense because

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00:16:23,240 --> 00:16:24,880
Speaker 2: it wasn't their decision, you know what I'm saying. So

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Speaker 2: they don't have any sort of feelings about it, aside

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Speaker 2: from like, oh this is this is cool. You know.

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Speaker 2: When I met my sister for the first time, uh,

363
00:16:33,360 --> 00:16:35,760
Speaker 2: All State Arena is where we would do our shows

364
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Speaker 2: in Chicago, and so we're all in the billboards in

365
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Speaker 2: Chicago all the time, and so she she would see

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Speaker 2: my face. I have no clue when she first like

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00:16:44,520 --> 00:16:47,360
Speaker 2: when she first saw the match, and you know, Colby

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00:16:47,360 --> 00:16:51,080
Speaker 2: Lopez pops up, which is my government name. She puts

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Speaker 2: she puts it into the Google machine, of course, Colby Lopez,

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Speaker 2: you know, and this seth rollins. Guy pops up and

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Speaker 2: she's like, what is this? Who is this? What's going on?

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Speaker 1: This is an aliens? Are you I?

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Speaker 2: What's going on? Let me try this again. This is

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00:17:05,480 --> 00:17:07,560
Speaker 2: not the same person. Why does it keep popping up this?

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Speaker 2: And then that's when she decided to send me the message.

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Speaker 2: So yeah, it's it's a it's a small world right

377
00:17:13,400 --> 00:17:13,879
Speaker 2: that way.

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Speaker 1: This episode is brought to you by Prize Picks. Whether

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Speaker 1: Pride Picks, It's good to be right. What's your favorite

397
00:18:12,160 --> 00:18:14,359
Speaker 1: childhood moment memory? Oh?

398
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Speaker 2: Man, my favorite? I mean, how young are we talking here.

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Speaker 1: Let's go back to what you probably can remember, say,

400
00:18:20,920 --> 00:18:24,840
Speaker 1: from the ages of say five to fourteenth?

401
00:18:24,359 --> 00:18:26,960
Speaker 2: Oh, my favorite, I mean the most formative memory that

402
00:18:27,040 --> 00:18:31,080
Speaker 2: I have that probably shaped a good part of my life.

403
00:18:31,119 --> 00:18:32,840
Speaker 2: I mean, cause you know, you remember small things like

404
00:18:32,880 --> 00:18:35,320
Speaker 2: you remember, like, you know, playing legos with your brother.

405
00:18:35,400 --> 00:18:37,200
Speaker 2: Like my brother and I used to have this big

406
00:18:37,280 --> 00:18:39,119
Speaker 2: maple tree in the front yard and we would just

407
00:18:39,119 --> 00:18:41,119
Speaker 2: climb to the top of it and sit and talk

408
00:18:41,600 --> 00:18:44,159
Speaker 2: about life, and I remember that being fun. But I

409
00:18:44,160 --> 00:18:45,840
Speaker 2: think the biggest thing for me is when I was

410
00:18:45,880 --> 00:18:49,120
Speaker 2: like five years old, maybe four or five, my dad

411
00:18:49,920 --> 00:18:54,560
Speaker 2: took me to my first professional wrestling show. Like I

412
00:18:54,680 --> 00:18:57,119
Speaker 2: was already like on the periphery of fandom because my

413
00:18:57,160 --> 00:18:59,479
Speaker 2: grandpa and my uncle and my dad all kind of like,

414
00:18:59,600 --> 00:19:02,520
Speaker 2: you know, into it enough, and and this is you know,

415
00:19:02,560 --> 00:19:05,200
Speaker 2: we're talking in early nineties, so Hulko Mania is really

416
00:19:05,240 --> 00:19:07,720
Speaker 2: big at the time, and they take me to my

417
00:19:07,760 --> 00:19:11,520
Speaker 2: first pro wrestling show, and I just was blown away

418
00:19:11,600 --> 00:19:13,040
Speaker 2: by what I was saying. If to me, it was

419
00:19:13,080 --> 00:19:16,040
Speaker 2: like just seeing real life superheroes, you know, like you

420
00:19:16,119 --> 00:19:18,920
Speaker 2: see Superman on your TV or you see Spider Man

421
00:19:18,960 --> 00:19:21,119
Speaker 2: in a comic book, but you can't like go to

422
00:19:21,240 --> 00:19:25,240
Speaker 2: a place and watch them like fight the bad guys.

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00:19:26,440 --> 00:19:28,960
Speaker 2: I saw it. I saw, you know, hul Cogan fight

424
00:19:29,000 --> 00:19:31,159
Speaker 2: the bad guy saw the Legion of Doom fight the

425
00:19:31,200 --> 00:19:34,080
Speaker 2: bad guys. So to me, that like changed my life.

426
00:19:34,119 --> 00:19:38,160
Speaker 2: I was so fascinated by that world and that that

427
00:19:38,800 --> 00:19:41,800
Speaker 2: that performance, like I was hooked from then on. So

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00:19:42,080 --> 00:19:43,399
Speaker 2: that's that's a big one for me.

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Speaker 1: I would say, did you play any sports growing up?

430
00:19:45,760 --> 00:19:47,360
Speaker 1: I did you played baseball? Say?

431
00:19:47,400 --> 00:19:52,200
Speaker 2: Baseball, basketball, football, Soccer? Was soccer. I was terrible soccer.

432
00:19:52,200 --> 00:19:53,719
Speaker 2: I don't know what we were doing. I played when

433
00:19:53,760 --> 00:19:55,560
Speaker 2: I was young with a bunch of kids, just like

434
00:19:55,560 --> 00:19:57,360
Speaker 2: like hurting hats with a ball, you know what I mean?

435
00:19:57,359 --> 00:19:59,840
Speaker 2: That was it. But yeah, I played basketball probably until

436
00:19:59,840 --> 00:20:04,119
Speaker 2: I was about fourteen. Football thirteen fourteen baseball. At some

437
00:20:04,200 --> 00:20:06,879
Speaker 2: point I realized that the baseball could hit me in

438
00:20:06,920 --> 00:20:08,359
Speaker 2: the face, and I was like.

439
00:20:08,280 --> 00:20:09,800
Speaker 1: That's I don't know, became scared of it.

440
00:20:09,880 --> 00:20:11,600
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, I like I'm in the batter's box and

441
00:20:11,640 --> 00:20:14,720
Speaker 2: I'm like, I don't know about this. Maybe you know,

442
00:20:14,920 --> 00:20:17,359
Speaker 2: I became one of those and the minute I did that,

443
00:20:17,440 --> 00:20:18,920
Speaker 2: I was like, oh, I got to get out. I'm

444
00:20:18,960 --> 00:20:19,399
Speaker 2: done with that.

445
00:20:19,520 --> 00:20:21,480
Speaker 1: Yeah. So what position did you play in football?

446
00:20:21,720 --> 00:20:24,680
Speaker 2: Football? I bounced around a little bit, played a little quarterback,

447
00:20:24,720 --> 00:20:29,280
Speaker 2: a little half back, little wide receiver defense. I'm trying

448
00:20:29,280 --> 00:20:31,520
Speaker 2: to think. I played the linebacker a little bit, played

449
00:20:31,560 --> 00:20:34,240
Speaker 2: safety a little bit. So yeah, I just it was

450
00:20:34,280 --> 00:20:35,520
Speaker 2: a mishmash. I didn't have won that.

451
00:20:35,720 --> 00:20:40,120
Speaker 1: You had one particular now particular position. So your your

452
00:20:40,200 --> 00:20:42,600
Speaker 1: dad took you and your uncles took you to this match.

453
00:20:43,880 --> 00:20:48,399
Speaker 1: You became hooked hooked. So who was your favorite who?

454
00:20:48,480 --> 00:20:51,800
Speaker 1: What wrestle wrestler did you adalyze when you was growing up?

455
00:20:51,960 --> 00:20:55,240
Speaker 2: Idolized? Well, my first favorite wrestlers whole Covid. He was

456
00:20:55,240 --> 00:20:57,240
Speaker 2: the big guy, was the biggest, he was the biggest

457
00:20:57,240 --> 00:21:00,119
Speaker 2: star in that in the eighties and the early nineties. Know,

458
00:21:00,160 --> 00:21:04,439
Speaker 2: he's in movies, he's in pop culture, he's he's he's propped.

459
00:21:04,600 --> 00:21:09,960
Speaker 1: He had a doll, he had lothing all and so

460
00:21:10,200 --> 00:21:12,320
Speaker 1: I wouldn't know that I idolized him because there was

461
00:21:12,359 --> 00:21:13,679
Speaker 1: never a like.

462
00:21:14,119 --> 00:21:16,320
Speaker 2: I never thought I could be Hal Cogan. Okay, you

463
00:21:16,359 --> 00:21:19,840
Speaker 2: know the first guys that I really idolized were smaller

464
00:21:20,000 --> 00:21:21,960
Speaker 2: because I never felt like I was going to be

465
00:21:21,960 --> 00:21:24,040
Speaker 2: the big guy. So, like, my favorite wrestler of all

466
00:21:24,119 --> 00:21:26,680
Speaker 2: time was Sean Michaels. Sean Michaels is about six foot,

467
00:21:26,760 --> 00:21:29,600
Speaker 2: he's about two hundred pounds brought the Hitman heart. They

468
00:21:29,600 --> 00:21:31,560
Speaker 2: were the two guys, the first two guys that I

469
00:21:31,560 --> 00:21:34,400
Speaker 2: watched on WWE. They were they were different. They were

470
00:21:34,720 --> 00:21:37,240
Speaker 2: they were smaller, they were faster, they had a different

471
00:21:37,280 --> 00:21:41,160
Speaker 2: style they were but they were still stars. And I

472
00:21:41,240 --> 00:21:44,119
Speaker 2: was like, oh, wait a minute, you don't have to

473
00:21:44,160 --> 00:21:46,800
Speaker 2: be Haul Cogan. You don't have to be the ultimate Warrior.

474
00:21:47,320 --> 00:21:50,000
Speaker 2: The Road Warriors leads in a doom to be stars.

475
00:21:50,000 --> 00:21:51,560
Speaker 2: You can be a star and do it that way.

476
00:21:51,600 --> 00:21:54,679
Speaker 2: And I'm like, well, I might be able to do that, right.

477
00:21:55,040 --> 00:21:58,720
Speaker 2: So they were the first ones that I really like, Okay,

478
00:21:58,800 --> 00:22:01,320
Speaker 2: all right, I I do see what they're doing. Let

479
00:22:01,359 --> 00:22:02,880
Speaker 2: me see if I can try this out.

480
00:22:03,200 --> 00:22:06,720
Speaker 1: And so that's when you like, Okay, all these other

481
00:22:06,760 --> 00:22:11,199
Speaker 1: things basketball, football, baseball, they're fine, but they're not calling

482
00:22:11,240 --> 00:22:12,760
Speaker 1: me like wrestling Hills. Yeah.

483
00:22:12,800 --> 00:22:16,160
Speaker 2: So I probably I was about thirteen. I remember it distinctly.

484
00:22:16,200 --> 00:22:19,440
Speaker 2: I remember it distinctly. I'm thirteen, maybe going on fourteen,

485
00:22:19,960 --> 00:22:23,600
Speaker 2: probably fourteen, and it's a summer before high school. So

486
00:22:23,680 --> 00:22:25,800
Speaker 2: I just got out of eighth grade and I remember

487
00:22:25,880 --> 00:22:29,280
Speaker 2: sitting at my dinner table with my parents and now

488
00:22:29,280 --> 00:22:32,960
Speaker 2: I'm fourteen, so I'm full of angst, full of piss

489
00:22:32,960 --> 00:22:37,600
Speaker 2: and vinegar, you know, full of just like anti established

490
00:22:38,600 --> 00:22:41,639
Speaker 2: bellious energy. I'm sitting at my table and I remember

491
00:22:41,720 --> 00:22:47,359
Speaker 2: telling like my parents with just this visceral anger of

492
00:22:47,400 --> 00:22:49,600
Speaker 2: over nothing of course in my heart, like I'm not

493
00:22:49,640 --> 00:22:53,080
Speaker 2: playing basketball. I want to be a professional wrestler. And

494
00:22:53,520 --> 00:22:56,320
Speaker 2: they were you could see like they look at they

495
00:22:56,320 --> 00:22:58,000
Speaker 2: were like, I don't like this. They were sad. It

496
00:22:58,119 --> 00:22:59,600
Speaker 2: was like a broken heart, you know, cause that was

497
00:22:59,600 --> 00:23:01,480
Speaker 2: pretty good basketball, and it was like a thing that

498
00:23:01,520 --> 00:23:03,439
Speaker 2: I did. And you know, it's just like a normal

499
00:23:03,440 --> 00:23:06,240
Speaker 2: pathway through high school. You play a sport, you go

500
00:23:06,320 --> 00:23:08,560
Speaker 2: to class, you try to get into college. And I

501
00:23:08,600 --> 00:23:11,080
Speaker 2: was like, no, I'm going to be a professional wrestler.

502
00:23:11,280 --> 00:23:17,040
Speaker 2: And at this time, my my I'm like I'm wrestling

503
00:23:17,040 --> 00:23:19,479
Speaker 2: in my backyard with my brother and our friends, and

504
00:23:19,560 --> 00:23:22,360
Speaker 2: like we're putting on matches and we're starting to do shows,

505
00:23:22,440 --> 00:23:24,760
Speaker 2: and like we're starting to emulate what we see on TV.

506
00:23:25,000 --> 00:23:27,120
Speaker 2: And it's about the age of the internet, like kind

507
00:23:27,119 --> 00:23:29,240
Speaker 2: of kicking off of two thousands, so that you can

508
00:23:29,240 --> 00:23:31,320
Speaker 2: get online and like kind of see other people doing

509
00:23:31,359 --> 00:23:34,720
Speaker 2: the same thing. And like backyard wrestling as a whole

510
00:23:34,840 --> 00:23:38,560
Speaker 2: is becoming like this thing for the first time, and

511
00:23:38,119 --> 00:23:40,960
Speaker 2: I was I was in. I'm like, we started like

512
00:23:41,000 --> 00:23:44,320
Speaker 2: handing out flyers at my school to get kids to

513
00:23:44,359 --> 00:23:46,679
Speaker 2: come and watch us, like jump on our trampoline through

514
00:23:46,720 --> 00:23:50,000
Speaker 2: these makeshift tables and stuff like that. And I got

515
00:23:50,000 --> 00:23:53,199
Speaker 2: the performance bug of like, I really like this. I

516
00:23:53,240 --> 00:23:54,680
Speaker 2: want to see how I can do it. So I

517
00:23:55,280 --> 00:23:57,439
Speaker 2: locked in. I'm like, what do I gotta do. I

518
00:23:57,440 --> 00:23:59,360
Speaker 2: gotta get jacked, Okay, give me a weight set, give

519
00:23:59,359 --> 00:24:01,080
Speaker 2: me a gym member ship, Okay. I got to learn

520
00:24:01,080 --> 00:24:04,280
Speaker 2: how to public speak. So let's take public speaking classes

521
00:24:04,280 --> 00:24:06,320
Speaker 2: in high school. Let's take acting classes. Like, what do

522
00:24:06,359 --> 00:24:08,760
Speaker 2: I gotta do? Let's let's lock in. I started growing

523
00:24:08,800 --> 00:24:11,040
Speaker 2: my hair out like Jahn Michaels, Brett Hart, they had

524
00:24:11,119 --> 00:24:13,800
Speaker 2: long hair like I, you know, Jeff Hardy, these are

525
00:24:13,800 --> 00:24:16,159
Speaker 2: my guys. I'm gonna do that. So that was it

526
00:24:16,160 --> 00:24:19,159
Speaker 2: at fourteen. And then I think my folks thought it

527
00:24:19,200 --> 00:24:23,560
Speaker 2: was a phase. They're like, oh yeah, And then I

528
00:24:23,680 --> 00:24:24,639
Speaker 2: just never grew out of it.

529
00:24:24,680 --> 00:24:29,560
Speaker 1: Man, And so you jumped full speak. You wrestle Stein.

530
00:24:29,960 --> 00:24:33,520
Speaker 2: In his last Stinger. Yes, I was very fortunate to

531
00:24:33,520 --> 00:24:36,919
Speaker 2: get in the ring with Stinger in his last WWF

532
00:24:37,040 --> 00:24:42,159
Speaker 2: match didn't go well for him unfortunately. But yeah, I

533
00:24:42,160 --> 00:24:44,399
Speaker 2: mean I he was a legend that I was very

534
00:24:44,720 --> 00:24:46,160
Speaker 2: very lucky to be in the ring with.

535
00:24:48,000 --> 00:24:48,880
Speaker 1: Who were you surprised?

536
00:24:48,920 --> 00:24:48,960
Speaker 3: You?

537
00:24:49,240 --> 00:24:50,399
Speaker 1: Do you remember your first.

538
00:24:50,119 --> 00:24:51,760
Speaker 2: Match, first match I ever had?

539
00:24:51,840 --> 00:24:52,359
Speaker 1: Yeah?

540
00:24:52,480 --> 00:24:56,440
Speaker 2: Oh man, not really, because I I did some stuff

541
00:24:56,520 --> 00:25:00,840
Speaker 2: before I was like trained properly to wrestle, Like sixteen seventeen,

542
00:25:00,880 --> 00:25:03,080
Speaker 2: I'm doing like I'll pay twenty bucks to do a

543
00:25:03,080 --> 00:25:05,359
Speaker 2: camp at a local show, and then you know, I

544
00:25:05,359 --> 00:25:08,240
Speaker 2: get tossed in like a Battle Royal or something like that.

545
00:25:08,480 --> 00:25:10,720
Speaker 2: I'm seventeen and we have a ring and we're putting

546
00:25:10,720 --> 00:25:13,640
Speaker 2: on this show. But I'm not trained, So it's hard

547
00:25:13,680 --> 00:25:16,960
Speaker 2: for me to like, what was my first match? You know,

548
00:25:17,000 --> 00:25:18,840
Speaker 2: it's hard for me to really pin it down.

549
00:25:18,720 --> 00:25:21,320
Speaker 1: Because you're going to independent restless thing for a minute.

550
00:25:21,400 --> 00:25:24,240
Speaker 2: Right about six years before I got signed to WWE. Y. Yeah,

551
00:25:24,240 --> 00:25:27,240
Speaker 2: so from like maybe maybe seven years, from like seventeen

552
00:25:27,320 --> 00:25:30,720
Speaker 2: to twenty four. Yeah, I signed with WWE at twenty four.

553
00:25:30,760 --> 00:25:33,400
Speaker 1: I think, did you ever did you ever get frustrated

554
00:25:33,520 --> 00:25:35,320
Speaker 1: because you're sleeping in your car and you're not making

555
00:25:35,320 --> 00:25:37,240
Speaker 1: a whole lot of money? Did you ever? Did you

556
00:25:37,280 --> 00:25:41,000
Speaker 1: ever become frustrated, like, man, this is just ain't working out.

557
00:25:41,280 --> 00:25:44,480
Speaker 2: Yes, I think there's tons of frustration that goes along

558
00:25:44,520 --> 00:25:46,600
Speaker 2: with it because it is a very you know, if

559
00:25:46,640 --> 00:25:50,240
Speaker 2: you're not making any money at it, you're making no money.

560
00:25:50,320 --> 00:25:53,560
Speaker 2: You're often losing money, and it's painful, and you know,

561
00:25:53,600 --> 00:25:55,920
Speaker 2: sometimes you're wrestling in front of like I would wrestle

562
00:25:55,960 --> 00:25:58,840
Speaker 2: in front of less than ten people sometimes, what yeah,

563
00:25:58,920 --> 00:25:59,639
Speaker 2: I mean it was.

564
00:25:59,760 --> 00:26:01,960
Speaker 1: It was I mean a lot of local YMC high

565
00:26:01,960 --> 00:26:02,840
Speaker 1: school gyms.

566
00:26:02,880 --> 00:26:06,560
Speaker 2: High school gyms. I wrestled in barns. I wrestled in

567
00:26:06,960 --> 00:26:10,000
Speaker 2: like you know, u A w halls. I wrestled anywhere

568
00:26:10,040 --> 00:26:11,879
Speaker 2: we could set up a ring and have shows. Like

569
00:26:12,000 --> 00:26:14,840
Speaker 2: I would drive my car and I would go do it.

570
00:26:15,240 --> 00:26:19,240
Speaker 2: And it was very frustrating, but it also like I

571
00:26:19,280 --> 00:26:24,119
Speaker 2: loved it. I just loved it. I loved getting I

572
00:26:24,160 --> 00:26:26,480
Speaker 2: loved going to a show, getting in a car with

573
00:26:26,560 --> 00:26:30,400
Speaker 2: my people, driving hours to a show, like getting snacks

574
00:26:30,440 --> 00:26:33,280
Speaker 2: on the way, talking about the business on the way there,

575
00:26:34,080 --> 00:26:41,240
Speaker 2: doing the match, taping it on your like video recorder things, camcorder,

576
00:26:41,280 --> 00:26:44,440
Speaker 2: you know whatever. I love taking it, you know, afterwards,

577
00:26:44,480 --> 00:26:47,640
Speaker 2: driving back, watching the match, talking about it, talking about

578
00:26:47,680 --> 00:26:50,000
Speaker 2: the show, feeling like we were trying to get better,

579
00:26:50,040 --> 00:26:52,200
Speaker 2: feeling like we were doing something, feeling like we were

580
00:26:52,200 --> 00:26:55,120
Speaker 2: trying to change something. I don't know. I just love

581
00:26:55,240 --> 00:26:57,480
Speaker 2: that process. And so even though there was a lot

582
00:26:57,520 --> 00:27:00,840
Speaker 2: of suffering involved, Like at some point, I just embraced that,

583
00:27:01,400 --> 00:27:05,040
Speaker 2: like I'm willing to suffer more than anybody. I don't care.

584
00:27:05,200 --> 00:27:08,040
Speaker 2: I love it and I will suffer until good things happen.

585
00:27:08,400 --> 00:27:11,439
Speaker 2: And you know, it's not like a linear, straight up shot.

586
00:27:11,560 --> 00:27:14,320
Speaker 2: It's it's ups and down, peaks and valleys. But like

587
00:27:15,080 --> 00:27:17,959
Speaker 2: I had enough peaks that it was like, you know,

588
00:27:18,040 --> 00:27:21,880
Speaker 2: like if you play golf occasionally, right, You're were, I'm

589
00:27:21,960 --> 00:27:24,240
Speaker 2: terrible at golf. Golf's extremely you gotta do it often.

590
00:27:24,359 --> 00:27:29,600
Speaker 2: But you're like, you'll hit one shot and I'm in

591
00:27:29,720 --> 00:27:32,160
Speaker 2: and I'm like, if I can just do that every time,

592
00:27:32,320 --> 00:27:34,840
Speaker 2: and you know, that's how golfers get better. They just

593
00:27:34,880 --> 00:27:37,879
Speaker 2: do it a million times and eventually every shot is

594
00:27:37,920 --> 00:27:40,840
Speaker 2: that one shot that you hit on whole seven, you know.

595
00:27:41,320 --> 00:27:43,399
Speaker 2: So that's how it was with wrestling. Eventually I just

596
00:27:43,440 --> 00:27:45,440
Speaker 2: started to get a little bit better, a little bit better,

597
00:27:45,440 --> 00:27:47,640
Speaker 2: and it's a slow process you don't even notice it.

598
00:27:47,800 --> 00:27:49,800
Speaker 2: And then by the time, you know, you got enough

599
00:27:49,840 --> 00:27:52,720
Speaker 2: peaks that you you get that itch to keep doing more.

600
00:27:53,160 --> 00:27:55,000
Speaker 2: I had to go to college, had to work part

601
00:27:55,000 --> 00:27:57,040
Speaker 2: time jobs while I was doing it. My mom wouldn't

602
00:27:57,080 --> 00:27:59,119
Speaker 2: let me live in the house and be a wrestler

603
00:27:59,160 --> 00:28:00,359
Speaker 2: and not go to school, so I had to go

604
00:28:00,359 --> 00:28:02,560
Speaker 2: to school. And then eventually I was like, hey, Mom,

605
00:28:02,560 --> 00:28:05,000
Speaker 2: I think I'm doing really good, but I can do

606
00:28:05,119 --> 00:28:07,560
Speaker 2: like I can really do something here if you just

607
00:28:07,640 --> 00:28:10,360
Speaker 2: let me, like drop out of the school, like I'm

608
00:28:10,359 --> 00:28:12,720
Speaker 2: not getting anything done in college like this is I

609
00:28:12,760 --> 00:28:14,240
Speaker 2: can do something elsewhere.

610
00:28:14,240 --> 00:28:15,400
Speaker 1: But I'm because of you.

611
00:28:15,520 --> 00:28:17,480
Speaker 2: Because of you, I'll do anything for you. You know,

612
00:28:17,520 --> 00:28:20,040
Speaker 2: whatever you need, like, I'll do it. But I'm telling

613
00:28:20,040 --> 00:28:22,199
Speaker 2: you I think there's something here. And she gave me

614
00:28:22,240 --> 00:28:24,800
Speaker 2: the go ahead, and you know, the rest is history

615
00:28:24,800 --> 00:28:25,240
Speaker 2: from there.

616
00:28:26,320 --> 00:28:29,040
Speaker 1: The Holts were always to get called by the WWE.

617
00:28:29,240 --> 00:28:33,000
Speaker 1: When they finally call, What's going through your mind? Are

618
00:28:33,040 --> 00:28:35,560
Speaker 1: you like, man, this is a prank? Are you extremely

619
00:28:35,560 --> 00:28:38,320
Speaker 1: excited or you thought your buddy would playing as playing

620
00:28:38,320 --> 00:28:40,640
Speaker 1: a joke on you? Because how did they even get

621
00:28:40,640 --> 00:28:42,400
Speaker 1: my number? How do they know to get in contact

622
00:28:42,400 --> 00:28:42,600
Speaker 1: with me?

623
00:28:42,800 --> 00:28:46,280
Speaker 2: Now, I I courted them a little bit I. So

624
00:28:46,320 --> 00:28:48,360
Speaker 2: I met a guy on the independence His name is

625
00:28:48,440 --> 00:28:50,760
Speaker 2: Joey Mercury. He's a great mentor of mine, and he

626
00:28:50,760 --> 00:28:53,080
Speaker 2: wrestled for WW for many years and he had gotten

627
00:28:53,120 --> 00:28:57,280
Speaker 2: fired from the company and I had met him, and

628
00:28:57,320 --> 00:28:59,960
Speaker 2: he the first time we ever met. He's like New York,

629
00:29:00,080 --> 00:29:02,280
Speaker 2: New York. We called WW New York because that's the

630
00:29:02,360 --> 00:29:04,520
Speaker 2: territory it used to be. He's like New York. You

631
00:29:04,520 --> 00:29:07,040
Speaker 2: ever talked to anybody in New York? So no, I

632
00:29:07,040 --> 00:29:09,080
Speaker 2: wouldn't even know how. He's like, heh, let me get

633
00:29:09,120 --> 00:29:11,160
Speaker 2: in touch with somebody for you. I think I still

634
00:29:11,200 --> 00:29:13,560
Speaker 2: have people there that might like me. So he's like,

635
00:29:13,600 --> 00:29:15,200
Speaker 2: you got like a tape or anything you can, like

636
00:29:15,280 --> 00:29:17,240
Speaker 2: a video, you know something, an email you can send.

637
00:29:17,240 --> 00:29:19,480
Speaker 2: And I'm like, I don't know. The time, I'm working

638
00:29:19,520 --> 00:29:21,320
Speaker 2: for a company called Ring of Honor, which was the

639
00:29:21,320 --> 00:29:24,520
Speaker 2: top independentive company at the time. Guy by the name

640
00:29:24,680 --> 00:29:29,160
Speaker 2: Dave Legana put together basically an email of here's video

641
00:29:29,240 --> 00:29:31,880
Speaker 2: of you know what he can do. Joey got me

642
00:29:31,920 --> 00:29:34,160
Speaker 2: the contact. I sent it out. At the time, my

643
00:29:34,240 --> 00:29:36,480
Speaker 2: contract with Ring of Honor was coming up. I was

644
00:29:36,480 --> 00:29:38,680
Speaker 2: like doing three years with him. I think my contract

645
00:29:38,720 --> 00:29:41,680
Speaker 2: was coming up, and I was ready to take the

646
00:29:41,720 --> 00:29:44,800
Speaker 2: next step. They weren't coming for guys like me at

647
00:29:44,800 --> 00:29:48,160
Speaker 2: the time. Still, this was two thousand and nine, twenty ten,

648
00:29:48,320 --> 00:29:53,120
Speaker 2: probably they were still looking for big dudes. They wanted you.

649
00:29:53,480 --> 00:29:56,520
Speaker 2: You know, I wanted someone with this size, right, they

650
00:29:56,560 --> 00:29:59,320
Speaker 2: wanted six' five two point. Fifty they'll teach you how

651
00:29:59,320 --> 00:30:01,560
Speaker 2: to do the. WRESTLING i was really good at the,

652
00:30:01,600 --> 00:30:03,480
Speaker 2: wrestling BUT i was never going to look like. That

653
00:30:03,800 --> 00:30:05,840
Speaker 2: so they were having a hard time recruiting guys like.

654
00:30:05,920 --> 00:30:09,360
Speaker 2: Me dave helped me. Out joey put in a word for.

655
00:30:09,480 --> 00:30:11,680
Speaker 2: ME i was trying to shop myself to some of

656
00:30:11,720 --> 00:30:14,280
Speaker 2: the other smaller companies at the, time AND i wasn't

657
00:30:14,320 --> 00:30:18,080
Speaker 2: getting any callback FROM. Wwe nobody was picking, up nobody

658
00:30:18,080 --> 00:30:20,280
Speaker 2: was answering. Emails SO i had a deal on the

659
00:30:20,320 --> 00:30:24,360
Speaker 2: table for another company WITH, tna AND i was, like

660
00:30:24,400 --> 00:30:26,120
Speaker 2: you know, WHAT i don't want to sign this. DEAL

661
00:30:26,280 --> 00:30:27,640
Speaker 2: i just don't know IF i want to sign this,

662
00:30:27,680 --> 00:30:30,160
Speaker 2: deal like ww's WHERE i want to. Be SO i

663
00:30:30,240 --> 00:30:33,640
Speaker 2: made one final call AND i, said, hey the, guys you,

664
00:30:33,640 --> 00:30:35,720
Speaker 2: KNOW i, said, hey the talent relations guy, said, Look

665
00:30:35,720 --> 00:30:37,280
Speaker 2: i'm going to sign this deal WITH tna IF i

666
00:30:37,280 --> 00:30:40,160
Speaker 2: don't hear back from. You, so you, know it's Like sunday.

667
00:30:40,240 --> 00:30:42,240
Speaker 2: Night i'm, Like i'm going to sign it in the.

668
00:30:42,240 --> 00:30:45,960
Speaker 2: Morning fifteen minutes, later he calls me, back, kid.

669
00:30:47,320 --> 00:30:48,360
Speaker 1: Let, me let me talk to my.

670
00:30:48,440 --> 00:30:52,560
Speaker 2: People so But i'm, Like i'm, like, oh oh, oh

671
00:30:53,800 --> 00:30:55,680
Speaker 2: earlier he didn't tell, yeah he didn't tell me nothing.

672
00:30:55,760 --> 00:30:57,480
Speaker 2: Yet he didn't like give me any. Indication he, said

673
00:30:57,600 --> 00:30:59,040
Speaker 2: call you back in the, morning And i'm, like oh,

674
00:30:59,160 --> 00:31:01,480
Speaker 2: god oh. God and Now i'm like sitting on, it you,

675
00:31:01,480 --> 00:31:03,400
Speaker 2: Know i'm, Waiting LIKE i, MEAN i couldn't sleep that.

676
00:31:03,520 --> 00:31:05,440
Speaker 2: NIGHT i was just, like come, on come, on come,

677
00:31:05,440 --> 00:31:06,960
Speaker 2: on come, on come, on because it could have just

678
00:31:06,960 --> 00:31:08,920
Speaker 2: been easy come. Back and he just say not never.

679
00:31:08,960 --> 00:31:10,920
Speaker 2: Mind you, know it's nothing was on the. Table and

680
00:31:10,920 --> 00:31:12,280
Speaker 2: then when he called, back he's, like you, know we're

681
00:31:12,320 --> 00:31:16,160
Speaker 2: gonna give you an, opportunity. DUDE i, LIKE i remember

682
00:31:16,200 --> 00:31:18,240
Speaker 2: WHERE i was, STANDING i remember WHERE i was, LOOKING

683
00:31:18,320 --> 00:31:21,560
Speaker 2: i remember. EVERYTHING i DIDN'T i didn't give. It damn

684
00:31:21,600 --> 00:31:23,720
Speaker 2: how much the money was, FOR i didn't. CARE i was,

685
00:31:23,720 --> 00:31:24,800
Speaker 2: like that's ALL i ever.

686
00:31:24,640 --> 00:31:25,120
Speaker 1: Wanted was an.

687
00:31:25,160 --> 00:31:28,080
Speaker 2: Opportunity this is the biggest wrestling company in the. World

688
00:31:28,280 --> 00:31:30,920
Speaker 2: this is my, Dream this is ALL i ever. Wanted i'm,

689
00:31:30,960 --> 00:31:33,280
Speaker 2: LIKE i do not even, Care LIKE i turned down

690
00:31:33,560 --> 00:31:36,360
Speaker 2: probably at least triple the money to go to the other.

691
00:31:36,400 --> 00:31:39,240
Speaker 2: Place Just i'm, LIKE i can this is WHERE i

692
00:31:39,280 --> 00:31:39,720
Speaker 2: can make my.

693
00:31:39,800 --> 00:31:43,800
Speaker 1: Way and you became a. Champion you became THE wwe

694
00:31:43,960 --> 00:31:49,120
Speaker 1: champion who was born After. WrestleMania what actually actually? Occurred, yes,

695
00:31:49,440 --> 00:31:51,680
Speaker 1: yes so you HAD i mean it took you a

696
00:31:51,720 --> 00:31:53,920
Speaker 1: while to get, there but once you got, there you

697
00:31:53,960 --> 00:31:54,720
Speaker 1: had a meteoric.

698
00:31:54,800 --> 00:31:57,600
Speaker 2: Rise, YEAH i mean we once we got TO, wwe

699
00:31:57,640 --> 00:32:00,480
Speaker 2: ONCE i got on the main, roster LIKE i they signed,

700
00:32:00,520 --> 00:32:02,760
Speaker 2: me they sent me down To, Tampa, florida which was

701
00:32:02,800 --> 00:32:05,240
Speaker 2: their training facility at the times now moved To. Orlando

702
00:32:05,320 --> 00:32:08,080
Speaker 2: it was this PRE. Nxt N xt is like the you,

703
00:32:08,120 --> 00:32:11,840
Speaker 2: know it's a great minor league facility now with its

704
00:32:11,880 --> 00:32:14,440
Speaker 2: own brand and its own. Production they did not have

705
00:32:14,520 --> 00:32:16,120
Speaker 2: that WHEN i went. There i'm In tampa and a

706
00:32:16,120 --> 00:32:21,200
Speaker 2: warehouse for two, years basically like in a holding cell and, waiting, waiting, waiting.

707
00:32:21,240 --> 00:32:26,600
Speaker 2: Waiting we finally got the call. UP i don't think

708
00:32:27,240 --> 00:32:32,680
Speaker 2: that my bosses knew exactly what they were getting themselves

709
00:32:32,720 --> 00:32:36,400
Speaker 2: into when they gave us the opportunity, Myself Roman, Reigns Dean,

710
00:32:36,440 --> 00:32:40,240
Speaker 2: Ambrose myself And Dean, ambrose Especially John. Moxley now we

711
00:32:41,440 --> 00:32:43,520
Speaker 2: had a little bit of a following because of what

712
00:32:43,560 --> 00:32:45,920
Speaker 2: we've done on The. Independence john was there as, well

713
00:32:46,240 --> 00:32:50,160
Speaker 2: and when we burst onto the, scene social media, Exploded

714
00:32:50,360 --> 00:32:53,680
Speaker 2: oh they're finally, here these, guys but we heard they've

715
00:32:53,680 --> 00:32:55,680
Speaker 2: been signed for a long. Time so this is the

716
00:32:55,720 --> 00:32:59,959
Speaker 2: beginning of social media playing a role in what happened

717
00:33:00,160 --> 00:33:04,520
Speaker 2: from an audience perspective ON wwe and that. Response you,

718
00:33:04,560 --> 00:33:06,560
Speaker 2: know they gave us the, ball and they kept giving

719
00:33:06,640 --> 00:33:09,440
Speaker 2: us the ball because we kept scoring. Touchdowns that's the, thing,

720
00:33:09,480 --> 00:33:11,840
Speaker 2: man if you get the ball and you make, plays

721
00:33:12,760 --> 00:33:15,480
Speaker 2: you know they're gonna call your number. More and that

722
00:33:15,600 --> 00:33:17,440
Speaker 2: was the. Thing i'm, like just give me the damn.

723
00:33:17,480 --> 00:33:19,760
Speaker 2: Ball that's ALL i ever. Wanted just give me the.

724
00:33:19,760 --> 00:33:22,600
Speaker 2: Ball i'm telling, you we can make this. Happen myself And,

725
00:33:22,720 --> 00:33:25,320
Speaker 2: john we were both of. That you, Know roman was

726
00:33:25,400 --> 00:33:27,280
Speaker 2: a little bit, greener he didn't have the, experience so

727
00:33:27,320 --> 00:33:29,880
Speaker 2: he was nice and along for the. Ride myself And

728
00:33:29,960 --> 00:33:31,920
Speaker 2: john we were ready and we knew we were, ready

729
00:33:31,960 --> 00:33:34,160
Speaker 2: and when the time, came we took that ball and

730
00:33:34,200 --> 00:33:35,520
Speaker 2: we ran with. It and we changed.

731
00:33:35,560 --> 00:33:39,360
Speaker 1: Everything what was the what would you say was the

732
00:33:39,360 --> 00:33:42,080
Speaker 1: hardest part of your? Journey and what would you say

733
00:33:42,120 --> 00:33:45,000
Speaker 1: to other young wrestlers that's trying to get in this

734
00:33:45,160 --> 00:33:47,719
Speaker 1: space that seemingly had a hard time like you did

735
00:33:47,760 --> 00:33:49,880
Speaker 1: in the beginning and thinking about giving? Up what was

736
00:33:49,920 --> 00:33:50,760
Speaker 1: the hardest part of this?

737
00:33:50,840 --> 00:33:54,280
Speaker 2: Journey, well lucky for, YOU i own my own wrestling,

738
00:33:54,320 --> 00:33:57,960
Speaker 2: school Which i've had for eleven or twelve. Years really,

739
00:33:58,080 --> 00:34:00,600
Speaker 2: yes back In, Davenport, IOWA i started at a wrestling

740
00:34:00,640 --> 00:34:04,160
Speaker 2: school called The black And Brave Wrestling. Academy still operates

741
00:34:04,200 --> 00:34:06,240
Speaker 2: to this. Day i'm not there as much AS i

742
00:34:06,320 --> 00:34:08,640
Speaker 2: used to, be but it still operates and it's, functional

743
00:34:08,719 --> 00:34:10,880
Speaker 2: And i'm a part of, it and it's great and

744
00:34:10,920 --> 00:34:12,919
Speaker 2: we have a lot of awesome people who've come through.

745
00:34:12,920 --> 00:34:16,120
Speaker 2: There BUT i get this question all the time because

746
00:34:16,440 --> 00:34:20,719
Speaker 2: as a young athlete or, performer it's. Hard it is

747
00:34:20,760 --> 00:34:23,080
Speaker 2: a hard, business and not everybody's going to make. IT

748
00:34:23,280 --> 00:34:26,480
Speaker 2: i think the one thing THAT i say, is but

749
00:34:26,560 --> 00:34:32,359
Speaker 2: there's really two. Things, one you have to understand that

750
00:34:32,440 --> 00:34:36,040
Speaker 2: it is a, marathon it's not a. Sprint you really

751
00:34:36,080 --> 00:34:38,960
Speaker 2: have to try to create a scope of time in your.

752
00:34:39,000 --> 00:34:41,720
Speaker 2: Brain it is just going to take a long. Time

753
00:34:42,600 --> 00:34:46,359
Speaker 2: but that process you have to learn to enjoy that.

754
00:34:46,440 --> 00:34:49,600
Speaker 2: Process it's. AWESOME i want you to shoot for the.

755
00:34:49,640 --> 00:34:51,799
Speaker 2: MOON i want you to set goals as high as you.

756
00:34:51,880 --> 00:34:53,959
Speaker 2: CAN i want you to think about and dream about

757
00:34:54,000 --> 00:34:57,200
Speaker 2: wrestling At WrestleMania in the main event and winning every

758
00:34:57,200 --> 00:35:00,560
Speaker 2: world title that there. Is but understand that it takes

759
00:35:00,719 --> 00:35:03,320
Speaker 2: little steps to get there and it is going to

760
00:35:03,360 --> 00:35:07,759
Speaker 2: be hard, sometimes but that difficulty is what makes it

761
00:35:07,880 --> 00:35:11,280
Speaker 2: worth it and that, journey and as cliches it, Sounds

762
00:35:11,400 --> 00:35:14,680
Speaker 2: i'm telling, you when you're done with it twenty years,

763
00:35:14,719 --> 00:35:17,800
Speaker 2: later the journey will be the thing that you. Remember

764
00:35:17,920 --> 00:35:21,120
Speaker 2: it's not the. Moments it's not the, milestones it's not the,

765
00:35:21,200 --> 00:35:23,799
Speaker 2: accolades it's not all that stuff that you read off

766
00:35:23,800 --> 00:35:27,000
Speaker 2: at the beginning of this. Interview it's the. Process it's

767
00:35:27,000 --> 00:35:29,640
Speaker 2: the people you met along the, way and it's the

768
00:35:29,680 --> 00:35:31,880
Speaker 2: process of getting there that you will look back on.

769
00:35:32,040 --> 00:35:36,520
Speaker 1: Fondly because WHAT i read off none of that. Mentioned

770
00:35:37,120 --> 00:35:41,920
Speaker 1: all the, nose the seven, years the, waiting, yeah the

771
00:35:43,160 --> 00:35:47,560
Speaker 1: not getting an opportunity of, wrestling and YMCA's and high

772
00:35:47,560 --> 00:35:51,240
Speaker 1: school gyms and, barns none of that's. There but people

773
00:35:51,280 --> 00:35:54,320
Speaker 1: only see. That, yep the people only see, that and

774
00:35:54,480 --> 00:35:56,799
Speaker 1: so they like it was. Easy it was easy for

775
00:35:56,840 --> 00:35:58,920
Speaker 1: them to it was easy for, HIM i mean so

776
00:35:58,960 --> 00:36:01,279
Speaker 1: forth in. Song but they don't don't realize like every

777
00:36:01,280 --> 00:36:04,440
Speaker 1: professional athlete or whatever Of Jeff bezos or, whomever you,

778
00:36:04,560 --> 00:36:07,719
Speaker 1: see it's a it's a it's a process to get.

779
00:36:07,800 --> 00:36:11,200
Speaker 2: There it's a. Slog, YEAH i mean it, is especially

780
00:36:11,640 --> 00:36:14,600
Speaker 2: the ROUTE i came. From now everybody's. Passed the success

781
00:36:14,719 --> 00:36:17,160
Speaker 2: or to the top is their. Own and sure there

782
00:36:17,160 --> 00:36:22,120
Speaker 2: are absolutely one people out there who didn't go through that,

783
00:36:22,160 --> 00:36:26,400
Speaker 2: process and they have been handed opportunities for whatever. Reason that,

784
00:36:26,520 --> 00:36:30,239
Speaker 2: happens for, sure but that's not for. You that's not your,

785
00:36:30,320 --> 00:36:32,759
Speaker 2: jurney that's not your journey, man and so you can't have.

786
00:36:32,840 --> 00:36:35,439
Speaker 2: That you can't look at it as as oh it's.

787
00:36:35,520 --> 00:36:37,680
Speaker 2: Unfair you just have to you have to focus on.

788
00:36:37,719 --> 00:36:40,520
Speaker 2: Yourself what's your? Journey how are you going to take

789
00:36:40,560 --> 00:36:42,920
Speaker 2: the next step to be better than you were the day?

790
00:36:42,960 --> 00:36:46,200
Speaker 1: Before when you finally got an opportunity to Meet vince,

791
00:36:46,280 --> 00:36:48,000
Speaker 1: McMahon what did then say to?

792
00:36:48,040 --> 00:36:50,600
Speaker 2: You, GOSH i don't. REMEMBER i WISH i could remember

793
00:36:50,600 --> 00:36:53,839
Speaker 2: the first TIME i Met. Vince SO i probably met

794
00:36:53,920 --> 00:36:55,759
Speaker 2: him in passing and like shook his hand and he,

795
00:36:55,800 --> 00:36:58,480
Speaker 2: said you know, nothing you, know we didn't nothing happened.

796
00:36:58,520 --> 00:37:01,640
Speaker 2: Whatever WHEN i was in an around DO ww doing

797
00:37:01,719 --> 00:37:04,799
Speaker 2: like some backstage work WHEN i was signed To, developmental

798
00:37:05,080 --> 00:37:08,239
Speaker 2: when we first got called up the like in the

799
00:37:08,320 --> 00:37:11,360
Speaker 2: Debut It's survivor, series it's twenty, twelve and we're in

800
00:37:11,360 --> 00:37:16,200
Speaker 2: these stupid, turtlenecks these cargo, pants and we are called

801
00:37:16,239 --> 00:37:19,919
Speaker 2: The shield and they they they literally tried to give

802
00:37:20,000 --> 00:37:24,520
Speaker 2: us riot, gear like shield riot, gear like these giant

803
00:37:24,560 --> 00:37:30,000
Speaker 2: plexiglass shields that said shield on, them and these night

804
00:37:30,120 --> 00:37:33,000
Speaker 2: these clubs like these like batons you know that you

805
00:37:33,040 --> 00:37:36,400
Speaker 2: police right people right at least beat people, with you,

806
00:37:36,400 --> 00:37:39,040
Speaker 2: Know and like we we we got rid of the

807
00:37:39,520 --> 00:37:43,160
Speaker 2: plexis pretty. Quickly but we're like we're rehearsing during the

808
00:37:43,239 --> 00:37:47,080
Speaker 2: day and we have these clubs and LIKE i remember

809
00:37:47,200 --> 00:37:49,520
Speaker 2: we're in like that we're running through the crowd because we're,

810
00:37:49,560 --> 00:37:51,879
Speaker 2: like you, know ambushing the. Show we're not coming Making

811
00:37:51,920 --> 00:37:54,120
Speaker 2: andrews running through the. Crowd so we're out in the

812
00:37:54,160 --> 00:37:56,799
Speaker 2: back To, Indianapolis, indiana and we're in the back and

813
00:37:56,880 --> 00:37:59,200
Speaker 2: Like vince's on the ring by the, ring and he's

814
00:37:59,200 --> 00:38:01,600
Speaker 2: like running the rehearse at the, time and he sees

815
00:38:01,680 --> 00:38:03,600
Speaker 2: us with these clubs because the camera's there and he's

816
00:38:03,640 --> 00:38:06,560
Speaker 2: watching the, monitor and he's like you could just hear

817
00:38:06,640 --> 00:38:10,239
Speaker 2: his deep voice like echo through the empty, arena and he's,

818
00:38:10,280 --> 00:38:14,200
Speaker 2: like what you need clubs to beat him? Up are

819
00:38:14,200 --> 00:38:16,799
Speaker 2: you really that? Tough we're all just like.

820
00:38:19,480 --> 00:38:22,840
Speaker 1: Dumped the. Club all, right let's, go you.

821
00:38:22,920 --> 00:38:26,160
Speaker 2: Know so that was like my first introduction To vince's.

822
00:38:26,280 --> 00:38:30,919
Speaker 1: Vincesms but you got to move the curve stomp That viz. Dump,

823
00:38:31,239 --> 00:38:34,200
Speaker 1: Yeah viz. Banded he banned, it banned.

824
00:38:34,200 --> 00:38:36,480
Speaker 2: IT i win the, RIGHT i literally wrote the day

825
00:38:36,520 --> 00:38:39,120
Speaker 2: AFTER i won my first world. TITLE I. WrestleMania we're

826
00:38:39,160 --> 00:38:41,600
Speaker 2: here In San. Francisco it was it was At Levi.

827
00:38:41,800 --> 00:38:44,840
Speaker 2: STADIUM i win, IT i win the. Title get on a,

828
00:38:44,920 --> 00:38:47,440
Speaker 2: jet fly To New, YORK i do The Today, Show

829
00:38:48,000 --> 00:38:50,279
Speaker 2: get back on the, jet fly back over here To

830
00:38:50,280 --> 00:38:52,279
Speaker 2: San jose for. All this is all on the same.

831
00:38:52,360 --> 00:38:55,120
Speaker 2: Day AND i get back To San jose at The

832
00:38:55,120 --> 00:38:57,319
Speaker 2: Shark tank and he, like you, know Then vince wants

833
00:38:57,360 --> 00:38:58,719
Speaker 2: to see. US i go in the. Office he's like

834
00:39:00,280 --> 00:39:06,680
Speaker 2: he does this. Thing he's so, yeah the the STOMP

835
00:39:06,760 --> 00:39:09,200
Speaker 2: i THINK i think we're gonna we're gonna move in

836
00:39:09,200 --> 00:39:12,759
Speaker 2: a different. Direction we're gonna find we'll find something. Else you,

837
00:39:12,760 --> 00:39:17,400
Speaker 2: know equally is good and equally is uh. Devastating BUT

838
00:39:17,920 --> 00:39:19,680
Speaker 2: i think we're gonna go in a different. Diarya he,

839
00:39:19,719 --> 00:39:22,839
Speaker 2: BANNED i don't know what somebody, LIKE i just did.

840
00:39:22,840 --> 00:39:26,799
Speaker 2: This i've been doing it for. Years this is WHAT

841
00:39:26,840 --> 00:39:29,480
Speaker 2: i think, happened AND i don't have. Confirmation he watched

842
00:39:29,480 --> 00:39:33,000
Speaker 2: The Today Show, peace he sees the, Stomp he sees

843
00:39:33,040 --> 00:39:35,600
Speaker 2: people referring it to the curb. Stump somebody in his

844
00:39:37,000 --> 00:39:40,719
Speaker 2: inner circle, said, Hmmm, VINCE i don't know ABOUT i

845
00:39:40,719 --> 00:39:42,279
Speaker 2: don't know about that. MOVE i think it might be

846
00:39:42,320 --> 00:39:45,480
Speaker 2: a little too. DANGEROUS i might, be you, know there

847
00:39:45,560 --> 00:39:47,960
Speaker 2: might be a connotation to. It AND i. DON'T i don't,

848
00:39:48,040 --> 00:39:50,720
Speaker 2: know you, Know and And i'm, Like i'm, like, brother

849
00:39:50,800 --> 00:39:54,040
Speaker 2: we've been doing it for. Years it's pro, wrestling none

850
00:39:54,080 --> 00:39:56,319
Speaker 2: of it. Is you can call it something else if you.

851
00:39:56,320 --> 00:39:57,920
Speaker 2: WANT i didn't come up with the. Name you came

852
00:39:58,000 --> 00:39:59,480
Speaker 2: up with the. Name you call it what it, calls the,

853
00:39:59,480 --> 00:40:01,959
Speaker 2: stomp ca. Whatever so, yeah he like took it away

854
00:40:02,239 --> 00:40:05,759
Speaker 2: with no, no no. Explanation at the, time just we're

855
00:40:05,800 --> 00:40:07,560
Speaker 2: not going to do it to my, okay and then

856
00:40:07,680 --> 00:40:10,000
Speaker 2: left me with no, finish his world champion with no finishing.

857
00:40:10,040 --> 00:40:13,280
Speaker 2: Move for it took me like a couple months BEFORE

858
00:40:13,320 --> 00:40:17,000
Speaker 2: i decided to just Steal Triple h's pedigree because he

859
00:40:17,080 --> 00:40:18,919
Speaker 2: wasn't he was he was. Off he was like done

860
00:40:18,920 --> 00:40:20,840
Speaker 2: at the, time like kind of not wrestling. Anymore SO

861
00:40:20,880 --> 00:40:22,440
Speaker 2: i was, like all, Right i'll take. IT i was

862
00:40:22,480 --> 00:40:24,879
Speaker 2: his protege. Anyway so what Did.

863
00:40:24,760 --> 00:40:26,919
Speaker 1: Advanced say when you started Using Triple h's?

864
00:40:26,920 --> 00:40:28,560
Speaker 2: Move, WELL i tried to use a couple of different,

865
00:40:28,560 --> 00:40:30,880
Speaker 2: things and like none of them really, took and LIKE

866
00:40:31,400 --> 00:40:33,399
Speaker 2: i was, afraid not, afraid BUT i was, like IF

867
00:40:33,400 --> 00:40:35,920
Speaker 2: i Asked TRIPLE h IF i can use the, PEDIGREE

868
00:40:35,960 --> 00:40:37,960
Speaker 2: i feel like he's gonna say. No he's the only

869
00:40:38,040 --> 00:40:40,399
Speaker 2: person who'd ever used. It SO i was, like here's

870
00:40:40,440 --> 00:40:44,120
Speaker 2: What i'll. Do i'll Ask vince about, it and THEN

871
00:40:44,160 --> 00:40:46,960
Speaker 2: i Know vince will say, yes just to Spite TRIPLE.

872
00:40:47,120 --> 00:40:50,360
Speaker 2: H TRIPLE h can't say nothing about. It it was

873
00:40:50,400 --> 00:40:52,919
Speaker 2: a good idea. Though, ANYWAY i was a bad. Guy

874
00:40:53,800 --> 00:40:57,319
Speaker 2: hunter was my. MENTOR i was his. Protege he wasn't.

875
00:40:57,360 --> 00:40:58,960
Speaker 2: Wrestling it WAS i was, like it's a good way

876
00:40:59,000 --> 00:41:02,319
Speaker 2: to carry on the legacy of the. Move so, Yeah, Vince.

877
00:41:02,400 --> 00:41:04,480
Speaker 2: Okay whether he did it because he liked it or

878
00:41:04,560 --> 00:41:06,120
Speaker 2: just to take a shot at his son in, LAW

879
00:41:06,160 --> 00:41:08,480
Speaker 2: i don't, know but either way it, was it. Was it.

880
00:41:08,480 --> 00:41:11,160
Speaker 1: Worked one of your most iconic moments in THE wwe

881
00:41:11,440 --> 00:41:13,799
Speaker 1: is that when you had to turn your back on your,

882
00:41:13,840 --> 00:41:14,960
Speaker 1: team your.

883
00:41:15,000 --> 00:41:17,759
Speaker 2: Friends, yeah.

884
00:41:18,400 --> 00:41:24,200
Speaker 1: You, like, Damn, vince that was. Painful IF i, MUST i,

885
00:41:24,320 --> 00:41:25,560
Speaker 1: must it.

886
00:41:25,600 --> 00:41:29,000
Speaker 2: Was it was the hard thing on it. Is they

887
00:41:29,120 --> 00:41:32,960
Speaker 2: they had pitched the story to break up The shield

888
00:41:34,000 --> 00:41:37,279
Speaker 2: a few months. Earlier we were, like, no, man we're not.

889
00:41:37,400 --> 00:41:40,080
Speaker 2: Ready we're not ready for. That, like we've been bad.

890
00:41:40,120 --> 00:41:42,480
Speaker 2: Guys the crowd was really starting to get behind. Us

891
00:41:42,480 --> 00:41:44,960
Speaker 2: we wanted to be good. Guys we wanted a longer,

892
00:41:45,080 --> 00:41:47,000
Speaker 2: Run like we felt like we had a lot more

893
00:41:47,000 --> 00:41:49,759
Speaker 2: in the. Tank and so we have a match with

894
00:41:49,800 --> 00:41:53,160
Speaker 2: The Wyatt family And Elimination chamber In. February then we

895
00:41:53,200 --> 00:41:56,000
Speaker 2: go To. WrestleMania we're full good guys at that. Point

896
00:41:56,160 --> 00:41:59,040
Speaker 2: we do two six man tags With evolution right after,

897
00:41:59,080 --> 00:42:02,640
Speaker 2: that like we're all. Awesome we're on cloud. Nine we're

898
00:42:02,680 --> 00:42:05,120
Speaker 2: feeling great about. Things the three of us we show

899
00:42:05,200 --> 00:42:08,759
Speaker 2: up To raw the day, after and they knew that

900
00:42:08,880 --> 00:42:12,520
Speaker 2: if we if they gave us heads, up we would

901
00:42:12,520 --> 00:42:14,279
Speaker 2: say no and we would find a way to try

902
00:42:14,320 --> 00:42:16,239
Speaker 2: to fight out of the. Breakup so they brought us

903
00:42:16,280 --> 00:42:18,879
Speaker 2: into the office and they just, said here's what we're

904
00:42:18,880 --> 00:42:22,920
Speaker 2: going to do tonight to. Night it was also In, Indianapolis,

905
00:42:23,000 --> 00:42:25,440
Speaker 2: indiana by the, way a lot Of shield history in that,

906
00:42:25,520 --> 00:42:30,200
Speaker 2: sound and they're, like this is what we're gonna, do

907
00:42:30,400 --> 00:42:32,160
Speaker 2: And seth is going to be the one to pull the.

908
00:42:32,200 --> 00:42:36,840
Speaker 2: Trigger AND i remember like in the, room just the,

909
00:42:37,280 --> 00:42:39,319
Speaker 2: silence and when we walked out of the, room it

910
00:42:39,440 --> 00:42:42,239
Speaker 2: was like what do we what do we? Do you,

911
00:42:42,320 --> 00:42:44,920
Speaker 2: know like can we stop? This like are we doing

912
00:42:44,960 --> 00:42:47,560
Speaker 2: the right? Thing and you, know it was it was

913
00:42:47,840 --> 00:42:50,120
Speaker 2: it was there was a lot of tension there and

914
00:42:50,160 --> 00:42:52,440
Speaker 2: it was you, know it was mostly we found our

915
00:42:52,440 --> 00:42:54,920
Speaker 2: comfort zone as a trio and we were really relying

916
00:42:54,960 --> 00:42:57,080
Speaker 2: on each other and we enjoyed the process and we

917
00:42:57,200 --> 00:42:59,960
Speaker 2: enjoyed performing together and we did feel like we had more.

918
00:43:00,239 --> 00:43:02,279
Speaker 2: Legs but at the end of the, day it was

919
00:43:02,320 --> 00:43:04,920
Speaker 2: one of the most shocking betrayals and shocking moments in

920
00:43:04,960 --> 00:43:08,040
Speaker 2: the history of our, company in our. Industry and what

921
00:43:08,120 --> 00:43:13,040
Speaker 2: it's set in motion over the last ten, years eleven

922
00:43:13,120 --> 00:43:17,759
Speaker 2: twelve years almost, now it has been a complete paradigm

923
00:43:17,840 --> 00:43:21,000
Speaker 2: shift in our. Industry you look at, Myself roman And

924
00:43:21,080 --> 00:43:24,600
Speaker 2: John moxley were at the very tippy top and if

925
00:43:24,600 --> 00:43:27,799
Speaker 2: we had stayed, together it just wouldn't be. Possible so

926
00:43:27,920 --> 00:43:31,160
Speaker 2: you needed that. BREAK i was super fortunate THAT i

927
00:43:31,320 --> 00:43:34,000
Speaker 2: was the one to be the catalyst for. THAT i

928
00:43:34,080 --> 00:43:37,480
Speaker 2: still feel the repercussions for that, today like people still

929
00:43:37,600 --> 00:43:41,560
Speaker 2: ask me to this, day twelve years, later why did

930
00:43:41,600 --> 00:43:44,080
Speaker 2: you break up the? Shield you know these are grown

931
00:43:44,480 --> 00:43:47,839
Speaker 2: people because they watched it when they were Taking you are.

932
00:43:48,000 --> 00:43:50,640
Speaker 2: Grown you know this stuff ain't. Real come, on, now

933
00:43:51,480 --> 00:43:52,160
Speaker 2: that hurts you that?

934
00:43:52,320 --> 00:43:52,560
Speaker 3: Bad?

935
00:43:52,719 --> 00:43:57,279
Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah who determines whether you're a good guy or.

936
00:43:57,400 --> 00:44:02,719
Speaker 2: Heel ultimately the? Audience ultimately the audience DOES i think you,

937
00:44:02,760 --> 00:44:09,000
Speaker 2: know there's suggestions about what feels. Good you, know what

938
00:44:09,000 --> 00:44:11,200
Speaker 2: would you, know do we need a babyface? Here do

939
00:44:11,239 --> 00:44:14,160
Speaker 2: we need to heal? Here the creative, team we'd like

940
00:44:14,200 --> 00:44:15,719
Speaker 2: you to do, This we'd like you to do, that

941
00:44:16,239 --> 00:44:18,960
Speaker 2: and you put forth your best. Effort, ultimately the audience

942
00:44:19,080 --> 00:44:22,319
Speaker 2: really decides if you're gonna be cheered or, booed you,

943
00:44:22,360 --> 00:44:24,040
Speaker 2: know and that's. It and then you got to you

944
00:44:24,160 --> 00:44:27,640
Speaker 2: gotta roll with that, punch you swim. Upstream it only

945
00:44:27,680 --> 00:44:31,440
Speaker 2: works so, well you, know eventually it's. It it, backfires

946
00:44:31,760 --> 00:44:34,480
Speaker 2: and SO i think you you saw. That you, Know

947
00:44:34,560 --> 00:44:36,600
Speaker 2: Roman rains is a really great example of. That Roman

948
00:44:36,680 --> 00:44:38,080
Speaker 2: rains is a guy that they wanted to be a,

949
00:44:38,080 --> 00:44:41,480
Speaker 2: babyface the top babyface for a long long, time and

950
00:44:41,520 --> 00:44:43,799
Speaker 2: they were, like you're we're going to do. THIS i

951
00:44:43,800 --> 00:44:47,080
Speaker 2: am going to force this to, happen force this to,

952
00:44:47,120 --> 00:44:51,319
Speaker 2: happen and it never took the way it needed. To

953
00:44:51,920 --> 00:44:55,000
Speaker 2: When Roman rains turns heel twenty twenty twenty twenty one

954
00:44:56,200 --> 00:44:59,840
Speaker 2: changed everything for. Him he became more, comfortable he, became you,

955
00:44:59,880 --> 00:45:02,719
Speaker 2: know a more honest version of his character and of his.

956
00:45:02,880 --> 00:45:07,160
Speaker 2: Self he was allowed to become the star THAT i

957
00:45:07,200 --> 00:45:11,000
Speaker 2: think everybody wanted him to be as a. Babyface and

958
00:45:11,040 --> 00:45:13,960
Speaker 2: now because he was so excellent at his role as a,

959
00:45:14,000 --> 00:45:16,719
Speaker 2: heel they were able to you, know now he's the

960
00:45:16,760 --> 00:45:19,880
Speaker 2: biggest babyface and biggest star arguably in our company and

961
00:45:19,920 --> 00:45:24,440
Speaker 2: in our. Industry and so the audience did. That they

962
00:45:24,640 --> 00:45:29,000
Speaker 2: they forced that by, rejecting, rejecting, rejecting for so, long

963
00:45:29,080 --> 00:45:32,400
Speaker 2: and so you, Know Brian danielson is another great, Example

964
00:45:32,480 --> 00:45:36,800
Speaker 2: Daniel Bryan. Wwe he was a guy that the fans

965
00:45:36,880 --> 00:45:40,360
Speaker 2: they just sometimes people just catch. Fire my, Wife Becky,

966
00:45:40,480 --> 00:45:43,400
Speaker 2: lynch they tried to force her into a role as a,

967
00:45:43,440 --> 00:45:47,120
Speaker 2: heel not reading the. Room this is summer, SLAM i

968
00:45:47,120 --> 00:45:51,399
Speaker 2: want to, say twenty eighteen, Maybe and she slaps The

969
00:45:51,840 --> 00:45:53,960
Speaker 2: jesus out Of Charlotte flair in the middle of the,

970
00:45:54,040 --> 00:45:56,319
Speaker 2: ring and everybody in the back thought she was going

971
00:45:56,360 --> 00:45:57,520
Speaker 2: to be a. Heel but if you would have been

972
00:45:57,520 --> 00:46:00,640
Speaker 2: paying any attention to what was, happening knew that when

973
00:46:00,680 --> 00:46:03,680
Speaker 2: she Slaps charlotte that place and it Was brooklyn was

974
00:46:03,719 --> 00:46:07,279
Speaker 2: gonna go. Nuts and they, did and it catapulted. Her

975
00:46:07,480 --> 00:46:10,360
Speaker 2: the audience took her into the you, know the biggest

976
00:46:10,360 --> 00:46:12,239
Speaker 2: female babyface that's ever lived in this.

977
00:46:12,320 --> 00:46:17,040
Speaker 1: Company is it harder to go heal babyface or babyface?

978
00:46:17,080 --> 00:46:23,960
Speaker 2: HEEL i don't know that. This if you do this

979
00:46:24,040 --> 00:46:27,799
Speaker 2: switch at the right, time neither one is. Difficult it

980
00:46:27,880 --> 00:46:31,400
Speaker 2: is harder to maintain being a babyface long. TERM i

981
00:46:31,440 --> 00:46:33,719
Speaker 2: FIND i just think it's easier to be a. Heel

982
00:46:33,760 --> 00:46:39,120
Speaker 2: it's people people, Naturally they just naturally. Hate you, know

983
00:46:39,600 --> 00:46:42,240
Speaker 2: we're all just full of, haters you, know they naturally

984
00:46:42,320 --> 00:46:45,279
Speaker 2: want to complain about. Something so it's just easier and

985
00:46:45,280 --> 00:46:47,920
Speaker 2: and you have more. Leeway you can't, like you, know

986
00:46:47,960 --> 00:46:49,759
Speaker 2: as a good, guy you have to be locked in.

987
00:46:49,920 --> 00:46:52,919
Speaker 2: Right any little misstep you you you have a bad,

988
00:46:52,960 --> 00:46:55,920
Speaker 2: promo you have a bad, match people can start to

989
00:46:55,960 --> 00:46:58,319
Speaker 2: turn on you. Easily when you're a, heel you have

990
00:46:58,400 --> 00:47:01,440
Speaker 2: so much. Freedom it's hard for you to screw, up you,

991
00:47:01,480 --> 00:47:03,480
Speaker 2: know because you screw up and they laugh at, you

992
00:47:03,560 --> 00:47:05,239
Speaker 2: and then you get mad that they laugh at, you

993
00:47:05,320 --> 00:47:07,960
Speaker 2: and then they get, mad then they hate you, more you.

994
00:47:08,000 --> 00:47:11,680
Speaker 2: Know so there's there's more of an antagonistic relationship with a,

995
00:47:11,719 --> 00:47:15,000
Speaker 2: Heel AND i think that's that's just easier to get,

996
00:47:15,040 --> 00:47:18,799
Speaker 2: done at least in a modern wrestling. Setting and it

997
00:47:18,880 --> 00:47:20,799
Speaker 2: might have been easier back in the, day you, know

998
00:47:20,880 --> 00:47:24,520
Speaker 2: when everybody to know. Everything but, yeah IT'S i find

999
00:47:24,560 --> 00:47:26,000
Speaker 2: it easier to be a. Heel but if you if

1000
00:47:26,000 --> 00:47:28,600
Speaker 2: you hit the transition point right when the audience is

1001
00:47:28,640 --> 00:47:31,520
Speaker 2: ready to make the, switch then IT'S i think it's

1002
00:47:31,719 --> 00:47:35,719
Speaker 2: in that immediate point after the. Turn either way kind

1003
00:47:35,719 --> 00:47:36,400
Speaker 2: of the, same.

1004
00:47:37,560 --> 00:47:41,040
Speaker 1: Whether you're a heel Or. Babyface do you need a sigmature?

1005
00:47:41,080 --> 00:47:46,000
Speaker 2: Move, yes very, important very, important because your audience gets

1006
00:47:46,400 --> 00:47:49,359
Speaker 2: like they get clued into, it you. Know it's it's

1007
00:47:49,600 --> 00:47:52,920
Speaker 2: that's one of the things about thing our business is

1008
00:47:52,960 --> 00:47:56,960
Speaker 2: the audience being having a pivotal role in the. Storytelling

1009
00:47:57,520 --> 00:47:59,879
Speaker 2: they when they feel like they're a part of what's,

1010
00:48:00,040 --> 00:48:03,640
Speaker 2: happening that's when it's the. Best you, know when they're

1011
00:48:03,680 --> 00:48:07,360
Speaker 2: not just they're not just. Voyeurs they're actually, in you,

1012
00:48:07,400 --> 00:48:09,880
Speaker 2: know they're in some. Way so that, participation whether it's

1013
00:48:09,920 --> 00:48:12,840
Speaker 2: a catchphrase or a signature move or a. Setup you,

1014
00:48:12,840 --> 00:48:15,000
Speaker 2: know you think of The rock and his all of

1015
00:48:15,000 --> 00:48:18,560
Speaker 2: his million finally the, rocks you know in the. Crowd,

1016
00:48:19,960 --> 00:48:22,520
Speaker 2: yeah AND i you, KNOW i do MY i am a,

1017
00:48:22,600 --> 00:48:25,640
Speaker 2: VISIONARY i am a seth and they do the freaking,

1018
00:48:25,719 --> 00:48:28,960
Speaker 2: rollins you, know or they sing the song and you

1019
00:48:29,040 --> 00:48:31,360
Speaker 2: have like some stuff Like sino where he's able to

1020
00:48:31,400 --> 00:48:33,920
Speaker 2: do his whole comeback and you can't see me and

1021
00:48:33,960 --> 00:48:35,960
Speaker 2: now they know it's the, end you. Know so it's

1022
00:48:36,000 --> 00:48:39,640
Speaker 2: like just those participation things and a, finisher having a

1023
00:48:39,680 --> 00:48:42,399
Speaker 2: great signature and finishing move is something they can look

1024
00:48:42,440 --> 00:48:43,479
Speaker 2: forward to as the match.

1025
00:48:43,520 --> 00:48:47,120
Speaker 1: Progresses you mentioned that THE wwe for the longest. Time

1026
00:48:47,160 --> 00:48:49,080
Speaker 1: they Wanted BIG i mean you had Hug, holding you

1027
00:48:49,080 --> 00:48:52,400
Speaker 1: Had andre The, giant you had you had these, massive massive,

1028
00:48:52,480 --> 00:48:55,120
Speaker 1: men you, know Your Triple, a's and you Had, undertaken

1029
00:48:55,200 --> 00:48:58,680
Speaker 1: you had you know these uh these guys you Wrestled

1030
00:48:58,760 --> 00:49:01,160
Speaker 1: Big show, came you wrestle some of The big and

1031
00:49:01,200 --> 00:49:04,319
Speaker 1: you've also Wrestled. Rayvensterious. Yes so when you're dealing with

1032
00:49:04,360 --> 00:49:06,799
Speaker 1: a guy like The Big, show he has to help

1033
00:49:06,840 --> 00:49:07,759
Speaker 1: you get him up off the.

1034
00:49:07,760 --> 00:49:09,239
Speaker 2: Ground i'm not Getting Big show up.

1035
00:49:09,600 --> 00:49:12,279
Speaker 1: AROUND i, mean you, know there have to be some

1036
00:49:12,360 --> 00:49:14,120
Speaker 1: jump to, it but you still got to be hal you,

1037
00:49:14,120 --> 00:49:17,120
Speaker 1: know strong enough to hold a man that sides up. There. Yeah, yeah.

1038
00:49:17,960 --> 00:49:21,440
Speaker 1: Yeah so when you, rehearsing like when you're rehearsing and

1039
00:49:21,480 --> 00:49:25,520
Speaker 1: you're dealing with a man you, know two's eighty three hundred, Pounds,

1040
00:49:25,680 --> 00:49:29,880
Speaker 1: YEAH i, mean, like, bro we gotta we gotta hit

1041
00:49:29,920 --> 00:49:31,600
Speaker 1: this thing BECAUSE i both of us.

1042
00:49:31,640 --> 00:49:35,799
Speaker 2: Can yeah, Yeah but you know it's one of those

1043
00:49:35,800 --> 00:49:37,400
Speaker 2: things where when you WERE i Mean Big show is

1044
00:49:37,440 --> 00:49:39,680
Speaker 2: an extreme. Example WHEN i when we wrestled With Big,

1045
00:49:39,680 --> 00:49:43,200
Speaker 2: show he was four hundred and fifty, pounds you, know

1046
00:49:43,719 --> 00:49:46,520
Speaker 2: strong as an Ox Mark henry the Same Mark henry

1047
00:49:46,560 --> 00:49:49,279
Speaker 2: literally the strongest human that several, ladies you know WHAT i.

1048
00:49:49,320 --> 00:49:51,440
Speaker 2: Mean in his prime and even in his like not,

1049
00:49:51,640 --> 00:49:54,440
Speaker 2: prime was you just crush your bones with his. Hands

1050
00:49:54,840 --> 00:49:58,480
Speaker 2: like you just help those people like you enough to cooperate, with,

1051
00:49:58,640 --> 00:50:01,279
Speaker 2: right because if they, don't your is.

1052
00:50:01,320 --> 00:50:03,840
Speaker 1: Over you. KNOW i Had Ric flair on and he was,

1053
00:50:03,960 --> 00:50:06,440
Speaker 1: like If andre didn't want you to do, something no

1054
00:50:06,480 --> 00:50:09,120
Speaker 1: matter what you, rehearse you was gonna get get.

1055
00:50:09,160 --> 00:50:11,160
Speaker 2: Done, yeah it's just not gonna have the same. Show

1056
00:50:11,280 --> 00:50:12,839
Speaker 2: is the same. Way you just hope that you catch

1057
00:50:12,880 --> 00:50:14,319
Speaker 2: them on a good. DAY i don't know what to tell.

1058
00:50:14,320 --> 00:50:15,879
Speaker 2: You otherwise they're the world.

1059
00:50:15,960 --> 00:50:20,359
Speaker 1: Champion that's. It that's. End this concludes the first half

1060
00:50:20,400 --> 00:50:23,160
Speaker 1: of my. Conversation part two is also posted and you

1061
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Speaker 1: can access it to whichever podcast platform you just listen

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Speaker 1: to part one. On just simply go back to club

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Speaker 1: profile And i'll see you. There