WEBVTT - Jarvis Sam, The Rainbow Disruption 0:00:00.280 --> 0:00:03.080 Check me out at the annual Black Effect Podcast Festival, 0:00:03.160 --> 0:00:06.800 happening Saturday, April twenty seventh in Atlanta. Live podcasts are 0:00:06.800 --> 0:00:09.440 on deck from some of your favorite shows, including this one, 0:00:09.520 --> 0:00:11.760 Black Tech, Green Money, and also some of the best 0:00:11.800 --> 0:00:14.440 podcasts in the game like Deeply Well with Debbie Brown 0:00:14.560 --> 0:00:17.480 and Carefully Reckless. Atlanta is one of my favorite cities 0:00:17.480 --> 0:00:19.479 in the world. I've lived there for two years. Actually, 0:00:19.680 --> 0:00:23.000 in my worldview, seeing us successful in every industry and 0:00:23.040 --> 0:00:25.840 not having any limits on our potential largely was shaped 0:00:25.880 --> 0:00:28.040 by Atlanta. So to be there with you doing this 0:00:28.160 --> 0:00:31.360 podcast talking about how we build or leverage technology to 0:00:31.360 --> 0:00:34.120 bill wealth. Come on, man, doesn't get better. I want 0:00:34.120 --> 0:00:36.240 to see you there. Get your tickets today at Black 0:00:36.240 --> 0:00:39.720 Effect dot comback's last podcast festival. I'm Will Lucas and 0:00:39.720 --> 0:00:43.479 this is Black Tech, Green Money. Jarvis SAMs, founder and 0:00:43.560 --> 0:00:46.080 CEO at The Rainbow Disruption with the mission is to 0:00:46.120 --> 0:00:50.279 partner with organizations to develop practical solutions that champion DEI 0:00:50.320 --> 0:00:54.880 in the workplace and enables systemic progress where authenticity, empathy, growth, 0:00:54.920 --> 0:00:59.959 mindset and transparency are celebrated. Previously, he was Chief Diversity, 0:01:00.080 --> 0:01:04.160 Equity and Inclusion Officer at Nike. A large effort in 0:01:04.280 --> 0:01:07.759 DEI is to create equitable opportunities in spaces where people 0:01:07.760 --> 0:01:09.680 from various backgrounds can have a voice. 0:01:10.280 --> 0:01:11.720 These are achievable goals. 0:01:12.360 --> 0:01:16.200 So if we're successful in do DEI, executives ultimately work 0:01:16.240 --> 0:01:17.280 themselves out of jobs. 0:01:17.680 --> 0:01:20.640 I think that the work equity and inclusion is actually 0:01:20.680 --> 0:01:23.760 never done, as we see as time goes on in 0:01:23.840 --> 0:01:27.920 different horizons change, different groups ultimately end up being at 0:01:27.920 --> 0:01:30.240 the center of experiences of marginalization. 0:01:30.720 --> 0:01:33.400 Unfortunately, the raw reality of our work. 0:01:33.319 --> 0:01:37.520 Is that because so many different factors social, political, environmental, 0:01:37.840 --> 0:01:40.920 economic tie into the way that we do our work, 0:01:41.080 --> 0:01:43.959 there's always going to be a need for organizations to 0:01:44.080 --> 0:01:48.559 understand how do we create equitable approaches and equitable outcomes 0:01:48.560 --> 0:01:51.840 that serve people and teams. I think the product inclusion 0:01:51.880 --> 0:01:54.280 space is critical here will if you take a look 0:01:54.280 --> 0:01:58.280 at what new product development looks like within organizations. Every 0:01:58.400 --> 0:02:01.680 time a company drives in to stand up a new product, 0:02:01.960 --> 0:02:04.360 we have to consider it through the lens of ensuring 0:02:04.400 --> 0:02:08.560 that it's accessible to all people. I'llbe at disability status, 0:02:08.720 --> 0:02:11.600 language barriers, or otherwise. And so with some of those 0:02:11.639 --> 0:02:15.239 different constraints in mind, the work of equity practitioners to 0:02:15.440 --> 0:02:19.000 ensure great outcomes for all will forever be something that 0:02:19.040 --> 0:02:20.200 we have to continue doing. 0:02:20.680 --> 0:02:22.480 And to that point, you know, I've heard you talk 0:02:22.480 --> 0:02:25.200 about before, specifically the around the time of George Floyd 0:02:25.240 --> 0:02:27.520 and coming out of the pandemic, there was so much 0:02:27.600 --> 0:02:29.000 focus on making sure. 0:02:28.960 --> 0:02:32.119 Black people got equity in the workplace. 0:02:31.600 --> 0:02:34.280 And then there was this big uprising in you know, 0:02:34.320 --> 0:02:37.400 Pacific Islander and Asians talking about they needed, you. 0:02:37.400 --> 0:02:38.040 Know, equity. 0:02:38.440 --> 0:02:43.800 So how do corporations manage effectively so many people you know, 0:02:43.919 --> 0:02:45.760 chomping at their heels saying, hey, you got to pay 0:02:45.760 --> 0:02:48.760 attention to us too when it when it changes so frequently. 0:02:49.960 --> 0:02:53.560 Yeah, you know, for starters, organizations have got to not 0:02:53.680 --> 0:02:56.480 look at this as a zero of some game. Unfortunately, 0:02:56.800 --> 0:03:00.000 so many organizations have positioned the nature of this work 0:03:00.200 --> 0:03:03.519 through in us versus them mentality. The challenge is the 0:03:03.639 --> 0:03:08.520 USh and them are often too marginalized and minoritized communities ourselves. 0:03:08.760 --> 0:03:11.680 I recall the exact experience you're describing will when we 0:03:11.760 --> 0:03:14.960 saw the rise and recognition through a period of racial 0:03:14.960 --> 0:03:17.760 and social reckoning following the murder of George Floyd May 0:03:18.400 --> 0:03:21.000 twenty twenty, and then by March of twenty twenty one, 0:03:21.160 --> 0:03:24.560 we started to see increasing narratives and stories highlighting this 0:03:24.680 --> 0:03:26.200 notion of hashtag stop. 0:03:25.960 --> 0:03:28.519 Asian hate in numerous organizations. 0:03:28.560 --> 0:03:32.440 You saw this conflict begin to be developed between how 0:03:32.520 --> 0:03:36.000 communities are interacting with one another, where support systems are 0:03:36.000 --> 0:03:40.200 built versus none, and you literally saw organizations positioning a 0:03:40.280 --> 0:03:44.520 perspective that what, we gave this much money to black communities, 0:03:44.560 --> 0:03:46.160 and so we need to think about how do we 0:03:46.200 --> 0:03:50.720 support API communities. The harsh reality, though, is that the 0:03:50.760 --> 0:03:54.160 experiences of the communities are so different, and when you 0:03:54.200 --> 0:03:57.000 position it as a zero sum game, it assumes that 0:03:57.040 --> 0:03:59.960 there's only this amount of pie that's available for us 0:04:00.160 --> 0:04:03.240 to fight over. Meanwhile, those that exist in the space 0:04:03.240 --> 0:04:06.360 of the dominant discourse are enjoying all of their nourishment 0:04:06.440 --> 0:04:10.440 and fruits and delight on this side. For organizations to 0:04:10.480 --> 0:04:13.880 be successful here, the lens of equity requires us to 0:04:13.920 --> 0:04:18.880 consider the specific needs of key organizations and recognizing where 0:04:18.880 --> 0:04:23.000 our companies may have been complicit in the marginalization of 0:04:23.080 --> 0:04:26.719 those communities. Take, for example, the sports industry and certainly 0:04:26.720 --> 0:04:31.720 in the footwear industry. Arguably every streetwear, lifestylear performance space 0:04:31.800 --> 0:04:35.960 footwear brand has benefited off of the contributions of black bodies, 0:04:36.240 --> 0:04:39.320 whether it's the athletes that represent these organizations through a 0:04:39.320 --> 0:04:43.320 sports marketing lens or the consumers that patronize their businesses 0:04:43.320 --> 0:04:48.320 and organizations every single day in physical platforms and digital 0:04:48.720 --> 0:04:52.400 These organizations then have an obligation to think about how 0:04:52.480 --> 0:04:55.080 they support these communities that are a part of the 0:04:55.120 --> 0:04:59.480 building and development of their bottom line. To do this effectively, though, 0:04:59.720 --> 0:05:02.839 we can cannot see the work of support of marginalized 0:05:02.880 --> 0:05:06.279 communities at awe to one another, but rather recognize that 0:05:06.360 --> 0:05:10.400 to truly move towards systemic solutions means gaining a stronger 0:05:10.480 --> 0:05:13.400 understanding of where we've been and how we got here, 0:05:14.160 --> 0:05:16.560 how does this show up in the present and its 0:05:16.600 --> 0:05:20.240 impact and implication on people, and then what investments are 0:05:20.279 --> 0:05:23.279 we going to make as an organization, since you're a 0:05:23.279 --> 0:05:24.159 betterment of future. 0:05:25.000 --> 0:05:26.920 I want to go a level deeper there because I've 0:05:26.960 --> 0:05:30.080 heard black women talk about this. You know, black women's 0:05:30.120 --> 0:05:33.280 diversity and equity inside the workplace lags behind Black people 0:05:33.800 --> 0:05:36.599 in the workplace. And I've heard black women talk about 0:05:36.600 --> 0:05:40.080 when organizations and companies talk about well you talk about 0:05:40.080 --> 0:05:42.800 women's issues, is black women get left out and white 0:05:42.839 --> 0:05:46.719 women ultimately benefit from the efforts that black women have 0:05:46.839 --> 0:05:48.000 raised their arms about. 0:05:48.600 --> 0:05:49.560 What's your take on this? 0:05:50.760 --> 0:05:53.279 You know, well, in addition to my work as the 0:05:53.320 --> 0:05:56.440 founder and CEO of the Rainbow Disruption, I also teach 0:05:56.480 --> 0:05:58.839 in academic spaces. So I am a professor of practice 0:05:58.839 --> 0:06:01.280 at Brown University. When that I work as part of 0:06:01.279 --> 0:06:04.680 the fully Employed MBA program as well with the University 0:06:04.720 --> 0:06:07.440 of California, Berkeley. And so a lot of my academic 0:06:07.520 --> 0:06:11.880 research and pursuits center around the topics of intersectionality and 0:06:11.960 --> 0:06:15.200 identity covering, and so the experience that you're describing is 0:06:15.240 --> 0:06:19.520 squarely in that space of intersectionality. Originally a theory coined 0:06:19.560 --> 0:06:23.159 in nineteen eighty nine by Kimberly Crenshaw from UCLA. It 0:06:23.400 --> 0:06:28.360 argues that these interconnected identities that we have impact either 0:06:28.400 --> 0:06:32.200 certain privileges that we have in some cases or increasing 0:06:32.240 --> 0:06:35.960 marginalization in others. This is the exact experience that we 0:06:36.000 --> 0:06:39.080 see with black women in the workplace. When organizations talk 0:06:39.120 --> 0:06:43.279 about women's issues, when organizations talk about making investments in 0:06:43.320 --> 0:06:47.159 supportive women, they're typically talking about experiences for white women. 0:06:47.600 --> 0:06:51.719 Rarely do they consider the intersectional identity of the approach. 0:06:52.000 --> 0:06:54.360 You can see this in the way affirmative action policies 0:06:54.360 --> 0:06:57.359 have been built up. The biggest beneficiary of approaches to 0:06:57.360 --> 0:07:01.400 affirmative action have indep been white women. On the flip side, 0:07:01.480 --> 0:07:05.560 when many of these organizations, especially those in the technology industry, 0:07:05.920 --> 0:07:10.320 describe experiences of people of color or underrepresented communities, they're 0:07:10.360 --> 0:07:14.000 typically talking about black men or Asian men, and so 0:07:14.440 --> 0:07:17.280 black women end up getting lost in where and how 0:07:17.400 --> 0:07:20.200 does this work is positioned. And yet that means that 0:07:20.240 --> 0:07:22.880 we're not able to effectively solve for some of the 0:07:22.960 --> 0:07:26.480 challenges that become impediments to her ability to be successful 0:07:26.520 --> 0:07:30.000 in the workplace. Take pay equity will We often talk 0:07:30.040 --> 0:07:32.680 about the gender dynamic and the gender pay gap, and 0:07:32.720 --> 0:07:35.720 yet it was not until recently that we actually started 0:07:35.720 --> 0:07:40.120 to dig into conversations that found that globally around the world, 0:07:40.400 --> 0:07:43.200 if we look at where white women are positioned relative 0:07:43.200 --> 0:07:46.800 to non Hispanic identified white men and then applied another 0:07:46.920 --> 0:07:49.640 layer to look at black women, black women sit at 0:07:49.680 --> 0:07:54.760 levels even below her white female counterparts. Furthermore, in terms 0:07:54.800 --> 0:07:59.000 of development, namely mentorship and sponsorship, she's often met with 0:07:59.160 --> 0:08:02.559 resistance in so many ways around the ability to grow, 0:08:02.920 --> 0:08:06.600 advance and develop her career. And what's more, when you 0:08:06.720 --> 0:08:10.560 add on macro political and macro social layers like those 0:08:10.600 --> 0:08:13.400 surrounding the rhetoric and sentiment connected to the Crown Act, 0:08:13.960 --> 0:08:16.840 that's where we begin to see the biggest implication on 0:08:16.880 --> 0:08:20.600 her experience, where she has to make a concerted decision 0:08:21.080 --> 0:08:24.640 every single day how to wear her hair to avoid 0:08:24.680 --> 0:08:29.280 being the recipient of microaggressive behavior at best, an abject 0:08:29.600 --> 0:08:33.240 discontent and disrespect on what the evolution of her career 0:08:33.320 --> 0:08:37.720 could actually look like because of how she wears her hair, which, 0:08:37.760 --> 0:08:39.839 as we know in the context of hair of politics, 0:08:40.040 --> 0:08:43.920 has so many deep connections to our experiences and identity 0:08:43.960 --> 0:08:44.840 as black culture. 0:08:45.280 --> 0:08:48.040 When we think about the intersection of what it means 0:08:48.080 --> 0:08:51.480 to be both black and a woman, she finds herself 0:08:51.520 --> 0:08:56.400 at this intersection of certain aspects of marginalization where she's 0:08:56.480 --> 0:08:58.920 fighting to keep up in so many ways to not 0:08:59.000 --> 0:09:02.640 only the status of identity and experience, but she finds 0:09:02.640 --> 0:09:06.400 herself competing with her white female counterparts because we have 0:09:06.440 --> 0:09:09.559 been so preconditioned to believe that there is only one 0:09:09.600 --> 0:09:10.079 seat for. 0:09:10.120 --> 0:09:13.200 Us that are available. I'll just add to this world. 0:09:13.240 --> 0:09:15.800 This is why even more when I talk in my 0:09:15.920 --> 0:09:18.120 lectures and the work that I do. I often say 0:09:18.160 --> 0:09:22.440 that to truly democratize diversity, equity, and inclusion, we have 0:09:22.720 --> 0:09:27.400 got to create equitable solutions for the most marginalized amongst us, 0:09:27.760 --> 0:09:30.559 and my work and studies we've discovered that is black 0:09:30.600 --> 0:09:34.360 transgender women. To find yourself at the intersection of not 0:09:34.520 --> 0:09:38.920 only trans or queer identities, but female identities as well 0:09:38.960 --> 0:09:42.120 as being part of the black community or black identities 0:09:42.480 --> 0:09:46.559 means access to things like environmental protections from an environmental 0:09:46.640 --> 0:09:49.800 justice standpoint, health equity, and the ability to not only 0:09:49.960 --> 0:09:53.559 seek care and treatment from folks that understand your experiences, 0:09:53.840 --> 0:09:56.480 but also the ability to find a job and not 0:09:56.520 --> 0:10:00.319 be subjected to under or underemployment, because what was the 0:10:00.360 --> 0:10:03.360 experiences of those The further you get away from the center, 0:10:03.440 --> 0:10:06.040 as Bill Hooks describes it, and the further you get 0:10:06.080 --> 0:10:07.040 closer to the margin. 0:10:08.760 --> 0:10:12.120 You've talked about growing up, you know, giving speeches in 0:10:12.240 --> 0:10:14.640 debate as being critical to your success. I want to 0:10:14.679 --> 0:10:15.199 hear more about it. 0:10:16.960 --> 0:10:20.199 You know, well, my family has a very long history 0:10:20.200 --> 0:10:21.480 of the speech debate space. 0:10:21.600 --> 0:10:25.040 My mom was a debater, my older brother was a debater. 0:10:25.240 --> 0:10:27.480 And so in high school I didn't really feel like 0:10:27.520 --> 0:10:29.120 I had a choice. It was just kind of what 0:10:29.160 --> 0:10:33.040 we do in this houshold, and it had the biggest 0:10:33.120 --> 0:10:35.040 impact on my life and career. So I went on 0:10:35.120 --> 0:10:37.880 to debate throughout my years in high school and went 0:10:37.920 --> 0:10:41.720 on to be a national champion debater for Rice University, 0:10:41.920 --> 0:10:44.319 and then went on to coach a number of schools 0:10:44.360 --> 0:10:46.960 at both the high school and collegiate level, including coaching 0:10:47.160 --> 0:10:50.800 a number of national changions. What speech and debate provides 0:10:50.800 --> 0:10:54.800 for people is the ability to understand the mode and 0:10:54.920 --> 0:10:59.440 means of effective communication, both verbal and written. It allows 0:10:59.480 --> 0:11:02.920 you to under stand what self expression of identity is, 0:11:03.080 --> 0:11:05.480 and it allows you to not only find your voice, 0:11:05.760 --> 0:11:09.160 not only use your voice, but leverage your voice as 0:11:09.160 --> 0:11:11.960 a means of having power and impact. The beauty of 0:11:12.000 --> 0:11:14.480 it is well in the DEI space, we often talk 0:11:14.520 --> 0:11:16.960 about this concept of giving us a seat at the table, 0:11:17.240 --> 0:11:20.720 and I've often challenged that because this table could be broken, 0:11:21.120 --> 0:11:23.800 this table could be being held up under the bottom 0:11:23.840 --> 0:11:26.800 by communities that we don't even see down there, which 0:11:26.840 --> 0:11:29.920 is the case with many fortune one thousand organizations, this 0:11:30.000 --> 0:11:33.880 table could be ratch. I don't necessarily need the seat 0:11:33.920 --> 0:11:37.000 at the table. I want the voice in the conversation. 0:11:37.520 --> 0:11:40.120 I want you to understand my sentiments, I want you 0:11:40.160 --> 0:11:42.920 to respect it, and I want to have the ability 0:11:42.960 --> 0:11:46.400 for my sentiments and perspective to be built into the 0:11:46.440 --> 0:11:51.720 way that this organization runs and thrives strategically and operationally. 0:11:52.120 --> 0:11:55.560 Speech and debate gave me those skills to understand how 0:11:55.640 --> 0:11:59.520 to build an effective argument, how to build sound logic 0:12:00.400 --> 0:12:04.000 and rationale, and how to combine those great theories that 0:12:04.040 --> 0:12:06.680 are so deeply rooted in the idea of public speaking, 0:12:06.880 --> 0:12:10.160 to eat those logos and paint those that make the ethical, emotional, 0:12:10.160 --> 0:12:14.000 and logical appeals. To be able to forge connections for people, 0:12:14.280 --> 0:12:17.400 whether I'm informing you about a topic, attempting to persuade 0:12:17.400 --> 0:12:20.160 you about something, or just trying to make you laugh. 0:12:20.840 --> 0:12:25.480 This is why I highly encourage especially underrepresented communities. One 0:12:25.480 --> 0:12:28.199 of the biggest issues that we face in both governmental 0:12:28.240 --> 0:12:32.360 spaces and nonprofit spaces, academic institutions, as well as in 0:12:32.480 --> 0:12:36.560 our companies is feeling voiceless, feeling that we don't have 0:12:36.840 --> 0:12:37.720 a way or means to be. 0:12:37.760 --> 0:12:38.839 A part of this conversation. 0:12:39.320 --> 0:12:42.400 It's why I encourage underrepresented high school, middle school, and 0:12:42.440 --> 0:12:46.600 college students in role in public speaking courses, join speech 0:12:46.600 --> 0:12:49.400 and debate teams, because the confidence that you build and 0:12:49.440 --> 0:12:52.560 the ability to find your voice becomes something will that 0:12:52.720 --> 0:12:55.360 no one can take away from you, and it becomes 0:12:55.400 --> 0:12:59.120 so highly impactful in how we lead and thrive over time. 0:13:00.160 --> 0:13:04.320 I've had this conversation with several people recently who built 0:13:04.400 --> 0:13:07.360 companies or you know, whether they be small businesses or 0:13:07.480 --> 0:13:12.280 tech companies, but in traditionally non melanated spaces, right and so, 0:13:12.559 --> 0:13:15.520 and I ask, I'm always interested in how they manage 0:13:15.559 --> 0:13:19.880 themselves in environments where they are not represented. Particularly, I 0:13:19.920 --> 0:13:24.160 was talking to Derek from Cloudy Donut about the Nonisota 0:13:24.160 --> 0:13:26.280 tooe y'all. I was talking to him and all of 0:13:26.320 --> 0:13:29.240 his donut shops are in white neighborhoods, and he was 0:13:29.280 --> 0:13:31.760 talking about how he doesn't assimilate. He is who he 0:13:31.840 --> 0:13:34.320 is and completely who he is. He doesn't change his 0:13:34.400 --> 0:13:36.679 the vocal tone of his voice, you know. And I'm 0:13:36.720 --> 0:13:38.440 so interested in your take on this because I was 0:13:38.440 --> 0:13:41.200 reading something where you said where I finally began to 0:13:41.280 --> 0:13:43.320 understand the culture to which I wanted to be a 0:13:43.320 --> 0:13:45.640 part of. I no longer had to think about this 0:13:45.800 --> 0:13:49.800 construct of assimilation. I could be myself and I think 0:13:49.840 --> 0:13:52.880 about this from a perspective of there's got to be 0:13:52.880 --> 0:13:56.120 some wisdom behind that too, because and I want you 0:13:56.160 --> 0:13:58.560 to correct me if I'm thinking about this wrongly, because 0:13:58.960 --> 0:14:02.480 I think about, yes, you can be you, but you 0:14:02.880 --> 0:14:05.440 can't just give sometimes you got to give doses until 0:14:05.480 --> 0:14:08.640 you've proven yourself in the room. 0:14:08.760 --> 0:14:10.000 And so can you talk about that? 0:14:11.800 --> 0:14:15.480 You know, well, if the question is that I always 0:14:15.520 --> 0:14:17.160 look like this, no, I don't know. 0:14:18.280 --> 0:14:20.480 Fortunate one dousand spaces. 0:14:20.320 --> 0:14:24.200 With rainbow locks and living my truth, you know, it 0:14:24.240 --> 0:14:26.480 was a journey of authenticity, you know when I think 0:14:26.520 --> 0:14:29.440 about assimilation. And I'm actually really thrilled to share with 0:14:29.440 --> 0:14:31.800 the viewers of this podcast. It's actually the first time 0:14:31.840 --> 0:14:34.280 that I talk about this publicly. I have just finished 0:14:34.280 --> 0:14:36.880 the manuscript from my book Dei Credential, which will be 0:14:36.880 --> 0:14:40.360 coming out this summer, and in DEI Credential, one of 0:14:40.400 --> 0:14:43.400 the pieces that I described is a definition for me 0:14:43.520 --> 0:14:47.560 around assimilation, and I posit that assimilation is a tool 0:14:47.600 --> 0:14:50.240 of the oppressor, which is utilized as a means to 0:14:50.360 --> 0:14:56.320 destroy culture and character, to degradate history and heritage, and 0:14:56.400 --> 0:15:01.840 to overcome the personal to the personality. With assimilation, it 0:15:02.000 --> 0:15:06.440 forces us to think through gaslighting techniques that who we are, 0:15:06.640 --> 0:15:09.880 that our experiences, that the loves that we have in 0:15:09.960 --> 0:15:14.840 life are bad, are harmful or negative, and that to 0:15:14.960 --> 0:15:18.560 truly be successful and thrive in a deeply capitalistic environment, 0:15:18.840 --> 0:15:23.320 we have to harness perspectives that shies away from what 0:15:23.400 --> 0:15:26.760 our actual cultural heritage is and moves toward or in 0:15:26.880 --> 0:15:29.040 service of, everything that the. 0:15:29.000 --> 0:15:32.280 Dominant discourse tells us it should be. Well. 0:15:32.360 --> 0:15:35.640 I have rejected this almost every single day in my 0:15:35.760 --> 0:15:41.160 professional career. It's hard, the dissonance that exists between trying 0:15:41.200 --> 0:15:43.480 to show up as somebody else, to serve a group 0:15:43.520 --> 0:15:46.320 of folks, just to get to that next promotion, just 0:15:46.360 --> 0:15:49.840 to get that next raise. You end up working yourself 0:15:50.000 --> 0:15:54.800 so much that the burnout both physically, mentally and emotionally 0:15:55.160 --> 0:15:57.720 becomes so deeply pressured. In the book, I write about 0:15:57.720 --> 0:16:01.000 this conversation of the emotional tax, also known as the 0:16:01.000 --> 0:16:03.800 black tax. It's this construct of working twice as hard 0:16:03.920 --> 0:16:06.720 to only get half the progress, or have to work. 0:16:07.760 --> 0:16:10.960 Here's the challenge with that. When I was going into 0:16:11.000 --> 0:16:14.760 workplaces very early in my career, I found myself giving 0:16:14.840 --> 0:16:17.640 smaller doses than I should have, and so I found 0:16:17.680 --> 0:16:22.480 myself in conversations that felt microaggressive, that felt incredibly disrespectful, 0:16:22.560 --> 0:16:26.440 that felt racists, that felt homophobic in so many ways. 0:16:26.920 --> 0:16:28.720 And I was working in big oil and gas and 0:16:28.720 --> 0:16:32.520 telecommunications companies, and so when you're doing professional services or 0:16:32.520 --> 0:16:36.320 client services work, you don't always feel comfortable speaking out 0:16:36.320 --> 0:16:39.720 about the behaviors of those clients because those individuals are 0:16:39.800 --> 0:16:42.720 ultimately helping the firm grow and helping the firm drive. 0:16:43.480 --> 0:16:45.840 By the time I jumped into the technology industry, though, 0:16:45.840 --> 0:16:49.480 will I changed my whole perspective on this. Now, let 0:16:49.520 --> 0:16:51.680 me be clear, a lot of folks will will walk 0:16:51.720 --> 0:16:54.600 around and tell you to be your authentic self and 0:16:54.640 --> 0:16:58.240 bring your full self to work. My full self did 0:16:58.280 --> 0:17:01.680 not belong in anybody's corporate space or anybody's corpus. Seting 0:17:02.160 --> 0:17:05.000 me after five PM is real fun and probably does 0:17:05.040 --> 0:17:07.639 not belong in the four wall on the corporate But 0:17:08.280 --> 0:17:12.960 what I did find is that authenticity is defining those 0:17:13.080 --> 0:17:17.360 values that are important to you and being unwilling to sacrifice, 0:17:17.720 --> 0:17:20.320 shift or move away from those values at. 0:17:20.200 --> 0:17:23.240 Eighty and all costs. And so that is what was 0:17:23.320 --> 0:17:24.000 important to me. 0:17:24.680 --> 0:17:27.560 And so throughout my time at Nike, for example, you know, 0:17:27.640 --> 0:17:31.200 I came into Nike in April twenty eighteen, Ball fade 0:17:31.720 --> 0:17:33.920 part on the side, still trying to relive my early 0:17:34.000 --> 0:17:36.919 nineties truth and by the time I departed the company 0:17:36.960 --> 0:17:38.920 in November twenty twenty two to launch my firm, The 0:17:39.000 --> 0:17:41.520 Rainbow Disruption, you know, I was walking around navigating the 0:17:41.560 --> 0:17:45.040 world with rainbow locks and dressing exactly how I wanted 0:17:45.040 --> 0:17:48.359 to because those experiences of growing up as a black 0:17:48.400 --> 0:17:52.119 man in Houston, those experiences in surrounding myself in queer 0:17:52.160 --> 0:17:55.960 spaces and LGBTQ plus serving spaces, those are all a 0:17:56.000 --> 0:17:58.520 part of who I am, and so they have to 0:17:58.560 --> 0:18:00.840 be brought in spaces because they're a part of that 0:18:00.920 --> 0:18:04.480 value set that I hold and that I support. My 0:18:04.680 --> 0:18:08.200 message to the listeners on this will and I get 0:18:08.200 --> 0:18:11.560 that what I'm saying is not easy. I'm not saying 0:18:11.600 --> 0:18:13.520 that you go to your job tomorrow and you're like, 0:18:13.680 --> 0:18:17.680 I'm good here, Thomas show up. That's not the case. 0:18:18.200 --> 0:18:21.280 It is a journey. I recognize and understand that. But 0:18:21.359 --> 0:18:24.439 what I don't think enough of us do is write 0:18:24.480 --> 0:18:29.520 down what those values are and then be unwilling and 0:18:29.600 --> 0:18:34.520 unwavering in the lack of sacrificing those as you navigate workspaces, 0:18:35.160 --> 0:18:37.560 even if it may come at the impact. 0:18:37.160 --> 0:18:37.800 Of your career. 0:18:38.359 --> 0:18:43.000 We are brilliant, we are great, and so understand and 0:18:43.119 --> 0:18:46.199 leverage that and recognize that even if that's not a 0:18:46.200 --> 0:18:50.439 great fit here, there's a lot of organizations that desire 0:18:50.480 --> 0:18:50.880 your talent. 0:18:51.000 --> 0:19:02.639 There is DEI, the role of death. 0:19:03.080 --> 0:19:05.640 I mean, let's be honest, who people decide to work 0:19:05.680 --> 0:19:08.399 with can be very personal. People like to do business 0:19:08.400 --> 0:19:10.720 with people they like. But part of the work of 0:19:10.760 --> 0:19:13.560 diversity is to show that people outside their bubbles and 0:19:13.640 --> 0:19:14.920 norms add value. 0:19:15.600 --> 0:19:17.080 But there's still that human struggle. 0:19:17.960 --> 0:19:20.760 Does the work of pushing require you to put yourself 0:19:20.840 --> 0:19:22.200 on the line at every time? 0:19:23.400 --> 0:19:24.280 Jarvis speaks on. 0:19:24.240 --> 0:19:26.560 It, It is a really great question, Will and I 0:19:26.600 --> 0:19:31.000 think it depends on one, the maturation of the organization 0:19:31.160 --> 0:19:34.480 in terms of their readiness for great DEI programming and work. 0:19:34.960 --> 0:19:38.879 And then two, it depends on both the resilience and 0:19:39.240 --> 0:19:43.840 impact of the leader. I'll say this hand or heart, 0:19:44.200 --> 0:19:47.159 working for myself now owning my own firm and in 0:19:47.200 --> 0:19:49.400 the work that my team does with the Rainbow Disruption, 0:19:50.160 --> 0:19:53.800 I am no longer bridled or stifled by this duality 0:19:53.840 --> 0:19:58.200 of having to force the uncomfortable conversation while also having 0:19:58.240 --> 0:20:01.480 to worry about the political nature of my own career management, 0:20:01.880 --> 0:20:04.480 having to think about if I give this leader this 0:20:04.560 --> 0:20:07.560 type of feedback which is necessary for them to grow 0:20:07.600 --> 0:20:11.000 and develop and provide impact in the organization, is that 0:20:11.040 --> 0:20:14.199 going to impact my performance review or my ability to 0:20:14.240 --> 0:20:16.600 take on my next role in the company. It's just 0:20:16.720 --> 0:20:19.119 not something I have to worry about anymore. And so 0:20:19.200 --> 0:20:22.040 I can show up and authentically engage with the various 0:20:22.080 --> 0:20:25.520 different clients, partners, and organizations that I work with, because 0:20:25.800 --> 0:20:28.680 that constraints not fair, like I'm not on y'all's benefits play, 0:20:29.119 --> 0:20:32.119 and so I can talk to you about what is 0:20:32.200 --> 0:20:35.320 actually necessary in your organization. You know, well, over the 0:20:35.400 --> 0:20:38.760 last three years, the term diversity, equity and inclusion, and 0:20:38.800 --> 0:20:42.200 when it's positioned to people, it's met with resistance by 0:20:42.200 --> 0:20:46.320 a lot of communities. And the reason that happens is diversity, 0:20:46.359 --> 0:20:49.920 equity and inclusion, when done right, is literally a challenge 0:20:49.920 --> 0:20:52.879 to the status quo. It is a perspective that says, 0:20:52.880 --> 0:20:55.199 the way that we have done things historically have not 0:20:55.320 --> 0:20:58.439 fostered the outcomes to which we desire going forward, and 0:20:58.560 --> 0:21:01.960 so how do we create points of intervention to challenge 0:21:01.960 --> 0:21:05.760 that systemically. As you can imagine, this causes a lot 0:21:05.760 --> 0:21:08.040 of fear to a lot of people because if you 0:21:08.080 --> 0:21:11.040 have built your career and your last three promotions have 0:21:11.160 --> 0:21:15.080 come via some connection to systems of nepotism that have 0:21:15.200 --> 0:21:17.680 allowed you to grow and develop, and now I'm saying 0:21:17.680 --> 0:21:18.480 we're actually going. 0:21:18.400 --> 0:21:18.919 To change that. 0:21:19.480 --> 0:21:22.280 We're going to focus on inclusive hiring measures where we 0:21:22.320 --> 0:21:24.919 have a diverse slate of talent. We're going to position 0:21:24.960 --> 0:21:27.640 diversity in our interview panels, and by the way, we're 0:21:27.640 --> 0:21:30.840 going to think about inclusive succession planning and how we develop, 0:21:30.920 --> 0:21:35.400 advance and promote talent. This causes fear with folks where 0:21:35.400 --> 0:21:39.240 they end up resisting the future state approach. It's not 0:21:39.359 --> 0:21:42.080 that they actually have a problem with understanding the car 0:21:42.200 --> 0:21:45.920 tours of diversity and what elements of identity is. There 0:21:46.000 --> 0:21:48.919 is a fear that if you change the system so 0:21:49.160 --> 0:21:52.560 much that I have been a beneficiary of, I now 0:21:52.760 --> 0:21:57.360 have no clue what approaches to advancement and development might 0:21:57.440 --> 0:22:00.560 actually look like. And so well, I don't believe that 0:22:00.640 --> 0:22:02.760 it has to be the role of death. 0:22:02.800 --> 0:22:03.960