1 00:00:05,840 --> 00:00:20,720 Speaker 1: Crime Stories with Nancy Greece, a beloved female pediatrician now 2 00:00:20,800 --> 00:00:29,560 Speaker 1: facing serious fallony charges of what hiring a hit man? Yes, 3 00:00:30,360 --> 00:00:36,320 Speaker 1: this so called beloved family doctor, a pediatrician that has 4 00:00:36,640 --> 00:00:41,560 Speaker 1: literally ministered to thousands and thousands of children, is now 5 00:00:41,640 --> 00:00:48,240 Speaker 1: charged with hiring a hit man to commit murder. I mean, Nancy, Grace, 6 00:00:48,360 --> 00:00:50,559 Speaker 1: this is Crime Stories. Thank you for being with us 7 00:00:50,600 --> 00:00:54,240 Speaker 1: here at Fox Nation and Serious M one eleven. You know, 8 00:00:54,400 --> 00:00:57,520 Speaker 1: when I take my children to the pediatrician, number one, 9 00:00:57,600 --> 00:01:01,520 Speaker 1: I don't leave the room, but number two, I got 10 00:01:01,520 --> 00:01:04,640 Speaker 1: to trust that doctor. I've got to trust that doctor 11 00:01:04,840 --> 00:01:09,640 Speaker 1: with my children's life. And you know what, we have 12 00:01:09,680 --> 00:01:13,160 Speaker 1: a lady doctor. We have a lady doctor. And she's 13 00:01:13,200 --> 00:01:20,200 Speaker 1: so warm, and she's motherly and empathetic and sympathetic and 14 00:01:20,959 --> 00:01:25,559 Speaker 1: talks to you for a long time to the point 15 00:01:25,560 --> 00:01:28,040 Speaker 1: where I'm thinking, I know she's got other patients. How 16 00:01:28,080 --> 00:01:32,160 Speaker 1: can she be spending this much time with my twins? 17 00:01:32,160 --> 00:01:36,840 Speaker 1: Because she loves children, right, That's the way this doctor is. 18 00:01:37,600 --> 00:01:42,280 Speaker 1: So how does that compete with hiring a hitman to 19 00:01:42,440 --> 00:01:47,040 Speaker 1: commit a murder? Again? Welcome, this is Crime Stories. I mean, 20 00:01:47,120 --> 00:01:48,920 Speaker 1: see Grace, and I want to thank you for being 21 00:01:48,960 --> 00:01:52,360 Speaker 1: with us here at Fox Nation in series six one eleven. 22 00:01:53,240 --> 00:01:56,880 Speaker 1: Let's Go, Jackie Hit It. Doctor Stephanie Russell is of 23 00:01:56,920 --> 00:02:00,480 Speaker 1: a loved pediatrician with over three thousand patients in her practice. 24 00:02:00,840 --> 00:02:04,960 Speaker 1: Kid's Life Pediatric's website shows a child's dream office think 25 00:02:05,000 --> 00:02:08,200 Speaker 1: Disney overload with promises of things like a live finding 26 00:02:08,240 --> 00:02:11,440 Speaker 1: Nemo fish tank. Russell, a graduate from the University of 27 00:02:11,480 --> 00:02:14,640 Speaker 1: Louisville School of Medicine, has been a licensed doctor for 28 00:02:14,840 --> 00:02:17,440 Speaker 1: nearly twenty five years. I wanted you to hear that 29 00:02:17,520 --> 00:02:21,880 Speaker 1: because that is exactly what the twins pediatrician's office looks like. 30 00:02:22,400 --> 00:02:26,640 Speaker 1: They have these giant They look real, but they are 31 00:02:26,720 --> 00:02:30,600 Speaker 1: three D pictures of fish tanks with the finding Nemo 32 00:02:30,720 --> 00:02:35,680 Speaker 1: fish swimming around, and tons of books for children of 33 00:02:35,760 --> 00:02:40,840 Speaker 1: all ages, just everything a child or even a twin 34 00:02:41,280 --> 00:02:44,799 Speaker 1: would want to keep them amused and their mind off 35 00:02:44,800 --> 00:02:47,600 Speaker 1: the fact they're probably about to get a shot. That's 36 00:02:47,639 --> 00:02:51,160 Speaker 1: what I thought of when I learned about this woman, 37 00:02:51,320 --> 00:02:56,960 Speaker 1: doctor Stephanie Russell. Now you heard about her kid friendly workspace, 38 00:02:57,160 --> 00:03:02,200 Speaker 1: her office, well listen to. Russell and her ex husband 39 00:03:02,280 --> 00:03:05,720 Speaker 1: Morgan Stanley, financial planner Rick Crabtree, have been in a 40 00:03:05,800 --> 00:03:10,200 Speaker 1: contentious custody battle for over two years. Allegations of abuse 41 00:03:10,240 --> 00:03:13,519 Speaker 1: were leveled against the husband, and allegations of a murder 42 00:03:13,560 --> 00:03:17,800 Speaker 1: plot levied against Stephanie Russell. In twenty nineteen, a detective 43 00:03:17,840 --> 00:03:22,640 Speaker 1: with the Louisville Metro Police Department was assigned to investigate Crabtree. 44 00:03:23,080 --> 00:03:27,079 Speaker 1: During that investigation, Crabtree told the detective that Russell wanted 45 00:03:27,160 --> 00:03:29,920 Speaker 1: him dead so that she could take full custody of 46 00:03:30,000 --> 00:03:34,080 Speaker 1: their two children. Crabtree's attorney gave police a sworn statement 47 00:03:34,160 --> 00:03:37,640 Speaker 1: from the couple's former nanny which said that she identified 48 00:03:37,680 --> 00:03:41,160 Speaker 1: as KS, had been approached by doctor Russell on multiple 49 00:03:41,160 --> 00:03:45,640 Speaker 1: occasions about getting rid of Crabtree. Ks assumed Russell was 50 00:03:45,720 --> 00:03:51,160 Speaker 1: joking until Russell specifically asked if Ks knew really bad people. 51 00:03:51,680 --> 00:03:55,040 Speaker 1: The FBI interviewed various people about the plot, but none 52 00:03:55,040 --> 00:03:59,800 Speaker 1: could colloborate Crabtree's allegations, and the case was closed soon 53 00:03:59,840 --> 00:04:04,480 Speaker 1: after Russell's claims of abuse were found to be unsubstantiated. 54 00:04:04,800 --> 00:04:08,240 Speaker 1: Crabtree was awarded custody of the children, with Russell getting 55 00:04:08,280 --> 00:04:12,800 Speaker 1: twice weekly supervised visits. Well, there's nothing to clinch your 56 00:04:12,800 --> 00:04:15,760 Speaker 1: custody case like trying to hire a hitman. With me 57 00:04:15,800 --> 00:04:17,440 Speaker 1: and All Star panel to make sense of what we 58 00:04:17,520 --> 00:04:22,200 Speaker 1: know right now about this beloved female pediatrician out of Kentucky. 59 00:04:22,560 --> 00:04:25,920 Speaker 1: Kathleen Murphy, family lawyer joining us out of North Carolina. 60 00:04:26,000 --> 00:04:30,559 Speaker 1: She's at NC Domestic Law dot com. Renowned psychologists joining 61 00:04:30,600 --> 00:04:33,920 Speaker 1: us from Manhattan. Karen Stark at Karen Stark dot com. 62 00:04:33,920 --> 00:04:37,920 Speaker 1: That's Karen with a see Paul Zike special guests joining us. 63 00:04:38,080 --> 00:04:43,320 Speaker 1: Former police commander and Albuquerque author of Stop Him From 64 00:04:43,400 --> 00:04:47,800 Speaker 1: Killing Them on Amazon. You can find him on Twitter 65 00:04:48,000 --> 00:04:52,200 Speaker 1: at Workplace Threat. But first to Alexis Terreschuck, crime online 66 00:04:52,240 --> 00:04:55,240 Speaker 1: dot Com investigative reporter. You were just hearing from our 67 00:04:55,440 --> 00:05:00,839 Speaker 1: friends at crime Online. But alexis Terreschuk, let's to start 68 00:05:01,000 --> 00:05:05,080 Speaker 1: with hiring a hitman. I mean, I know we're going 69 00:05:05,120 --> 00:05:08,520 Speaker 1: to have to backtrack and talk about this mom losing 70 00:05:08,560 --> 00:05:10,919 Speaker 1: custody of her children. And you know what, you gotta 71 00:05:11,000 --> 00:05:14,560 Speaker 1: bend over backwards and do some sort of a contortion 72 00:05:14,920 --> 00:05:20,480 Speaker 1: for a mother to lose custody. Okay, we all know 73 00:05:20,560 --> 00:05:23,599 Speaker 1: that alexis terres Chuck, you have a baby, as I 74 00:05:23,680 --> 00:05:26,360 Speaker 1: like to call him, I have a baby. And as 75 00:05:26,400 --> 00:05:31,800 Speaker 1: many times as I would probably like to do my husband, harm, 76 00:05:31,880 --> 00:05:40,279 Speaker 1: I would never jeopardize being with the twins ever. Never. Plus, 77 00:05:40,320 --> 00:05:45,080 Speaker 1: I mean, you know David, he's very lovable. So Alexis Treschuk, 78 00:05:45,400 --> 00:05:50,120 Speaker 1: How do we get to hiring a hitman? What evidence 79 00:05:50,360 --> 00:05:55,000 Speaker 1: is there that she, this beloved pediatrician wanted to hire 80 00:05:55,000 --> 00:05:59,320 Speaker 1: a hitman? Now? What did I hear about coworkers? She 81 00:06:00,000 --> 00:06:03,039 Speaker 1: actually tried to hire a hitman two different times. The 82 00:06:03,120 --> 00:06:06,440 Speaker 1: first time she kept talking to her nanny, the couple, 83 00:06:06,839 --> 00:06:09,960 Speaker 1: the couple headed nanny, her husband, No, the pediatrician cousin, 84 00:06:10,200 --> 00:06:14,120 Speaker 1: Alexis Holton. Just a moment. I mean, really, Kathleen Murphy, 85 00:06:14,720 --> 00:06:19,919 Speaker 1: you want to hire a hitman? Murder, bloody, stinking, gooey, 86 00:06:20,160 --> 00:06:24,440 Speaker 1: sticky murder, and you go to of course, hitman Central. 87 00:06:24,800 --> 00:06:32,480 Speaker 1: You're nanny, really stupidest, stupidest, stupidest booth. Ever, this woman 88 00:06:32,600 --> 00:06:36,280 Speaker 1: has a medical degree. She is not an idiot. She's 89 00:06:36,320 --> 00:06:39,920 Speaker 1: got a practice of about three thousand children. She's rolling 90 00:06:39,960 --> 00:06:45,080 Speaker 1: in money. What a nanny. She's not stupid. Clearly she's 91 00:06:45,080 --> 00:06:50,680 Speaker 1: a Psychopathlet she thinks that her she's not connected. Obviously 92 00:06:50,720 --> 00:06:52,760 Speaker 1: she's missing some links. I don't know how Okay, Now, 93 00:06:52,800 --> 00:06:55,520 Speaker 1: when you say she's not connected to me. That means 94 00:06:55,800 --> 00:06:57,880 Speaker 1: you don't know anybody, any gang or a mom. If 95 00:06:57,880 --> 00:07:01,359 Speaker 1: you're not connected, what do you mean she's not connected mentally, 96 00:07:01,480 --> 00:07:03,880 Speaker 1: she's not all there. For her to be able to 97 00:07:03,920 --> 00:07:08,400 Speaker 1: think that nobody is going to speak about this is ludicrous. 98 00:07:08,400 --> 00:07:12,320 Speaker 1: Everybody loves to talk, especially if there's a custody trial 99 00:07:12,640 --> 00:07:15,480 Speaker 1: and they want to share the gossip, which they do, 100 00:07:15,720 --> 00:07:17,840 Speaker 1: and they will come into court. And that's exactly what 101 00:07:17,880 --> 00:07:20,240 Speaker 1: this nanny did. She came into court and gave a 102 00:07:20,280 --> 00:07:24,120 Speaker 1: deposition and spoke about how she had come to her 103 00:07:24,160 --> 00:07:28,160 Speaker 1: and approached her with a murder for hire. Wish you know, 104 00:07:28,400 --> 00:07:31,080 Speaker 1: Kathleen Murphy, I was expecting a little more from you. 105 00:07:31,200 --> 00:07:36,480 Speaker 1: Then she's not connected. Guys, hold on just a moment. 106 00:07:36,520 --> 00:07:40,679 Speaker 1: I want you to hear. I'm looking for proof, because 107 00:07:40,720 --> 00:07:42,920 Speaker 1: it's going to take a lot of proof from me 108 00:07:43,000 --> 00:07:49,720 Speaker 1: to believe that this mom, this mother, this beloved pediatrician 109 00:07:50,160 --> 00:07:53,040 Speaker 1: that has a client list of over three thousand children 110 00:07:53,440 --> 00:07:57,880 Speaker 1: that everybody loved, They all love her, would try to 111 00:07:57,920 --> 00:08:00,840 Speaker 1: commit murder. And that's what hiring him, man is, You're 112 00:08:00,880 --> 00:08:04,880 Speaker 1: commanding murder. In fact, it's even worse under the criminal 113 00:08:04,920 --> 00:08:11,200 Speaker 1: Code because murder for hire is an aggravating circumstance under 114 00:08:11,200 --> 00:08:13,880 Speaker 1: which the state can seek the death penalty. That is 115 00:08:13,880 --> 00:08:17,400 Speaker 1: not true. And every barbrawl that ends into death, but 116 00:08:17,600 --> 00:08:23,120 Speaker 1: this is murder with a pecuniary or money interest involved, 117 00:08:23,480 --> 00:08:27,560 Speaker 1: and that is taken even more seriously by the criminal codes. 118 00:08:28,360 --> 00:08:30,920 Speaker 1: Take a less in hour cut seven see our friends 119 00:08:30,920 --> 00:08:34,840 Speaker 1: at w LKY. New documents show Russell used the code 120 00:08:35,080 --> 00:08:38,480 Speaker 1: flowers and text messages when discussing the murder with two 121 00:08:38,559 --> 00:08:42,120 Speaker 1: nurses at her practice. One of the employees told Russell 122 00:08:42,160 --> 00:08:45,120 Speaker 1: in December she knew someone who would commit the crime. 123 00:08:45,880 --> 00:08:49,200 Speaker 1: According to text messages, Russell wanted the murder to take 124 00:08:49,280 --> 00:08:53,680 Speaker 1: place before Christmas. Documents show when that employee told Russell 125 00:08:53,720 --> 00:08:56,400 Speaker 1: the alleged hitmen had died and couldn't commit the hit. 126 00:08:56,640 --> 00:09:00,319 Speaker 1: Russell then asked if the employee would pull the trigger themselves. 127 00:09:00,760 --> 00:09:03,960 Speaker 1: That employee said no and soon after left the practice. 128 00:09:04,559 --> 00:09:08,079 Speaker 1: I guess so, I guess she did leave the practice. 129 00:09:08,360 --> 00:09:12,479 Speaker 1: I mean Paul Zeye, former police commander in Albuquerque and author. 130 00:09:13,440 --> 00:09:16,560 Speaker 1: I wouldn't put a whole lot of stock in one 131 00:09:16,760 --> 00:09:19,440 Speaker 1: nanny that said, yeah, she told me she wanted her 132 00:09:19,480 --> 00:09:24,480 Speaker 1: husband dead. Did I know anybody that could kill him? No? 133 00:09:24,720 --> 00:09:28,280 Speaker 1: That's not enough to make a case. But now I 134 00:09:28,440 --> 00:09:35,760 Speaker 1: have an employee that says she was approached by the defendant, 135 00:09:36,120 --> 00:09:41,560 Speaker 1: the female pediatrician, and when that hitman didn't work out, 136 00:09:42,880 --> 00:09:45,160 Speaker 1: she asked, well, could you do it yourself? Can you 137 00:09:45,240 --> 00:09:50,400 Speaker 1: kill him? Well, the woman or man says no and 138 00:09:50,640 --> 00:09:56,040 Speaker 1: leaves the practice. Now we're cooking with gas, Paul Zeye, 139 00:09:56,400 --> 00:09:59,320 Speaker 1: Now I feel like we might have an investigation going. 140 00:09:59,440 --> 00:10:03,160 Speaker 1: Absolutely when you reach a pointed an investigation where you 141 00:10:03,200 --> 00:10:09,480 Speaker 1: have collaborative witnesses that have direct evidence things that they've 142 00:10:09,480 --> 00:10:12,880 Speaker 1: seen themselves or heard themselves, who have nothing to gain 143 00:10:13,080 --> 00:10:17,160 Speaker 1: from the situation. By telling the truth absolutely, you now 144 00:10:17,200 --> 00:10:21,040 Speaker 1: are starting to build a foundation to move this case forward. Again, 145 00:10:22,360 --> 00:10:28,440 Speaker 1: one witness, an ear witness with no further corroboration. That's 146 00:10:28,480 --> 00:10:30,760 Speaker 1: not going to convince a Jerry. You gotta work this 147 00:10:30,800 --> 00:10:52,280 Speaker 1: case harder. But then another witness appears, an employee Crime 148 00:10:52,360 --> 00:10:58,560 Speaker 1: Stories with Nancy Grace Karen Stark joining me, a New 149 00:10:58,600 --> 00:11:02,400 Speaker 1: York psychologist. Of course, the person left the practice because 150 00:11:02,640 --> 00:11:05,240 Speaker 1: not only does she pressure the employee to find a hitman, 151 00:11:05,320 --> 00:11:08,719 Speaker 1: find a hitman, then the hitman goes and dies. Did 152 00:11:08,800 --> 00:11:11,240 Speaker 1: she ask the employee to pull the trigger for Pete's 153 00:11:11,280 --> 00:11:14,520 Speaker 1: sake too. Two of the nurses that work for her, Nancy, 154 00:11:14,960 --> 00:11:19,120 Speaker 1: she had a code with them. Oh, I forgot that part. 155 00:11:19,400 --> 00:11:23,079 Speaker 1: She used the code word flowers and takes messages when 156 00:11:23,080 --> 00:11:26,280 Speaker 1: discussing the murder. And you're right, Karen, starting not one 157 00:11:26,320 --> 00:11:30,880 Speaker 1: but two nurses, we're talking about murder, and you know, Nancy, 158 00:11:30,960 --> 00:11:34,840 Speaker 1: that's how in these kind of situations they get caught 159 00:11:35,480 --> 00:11:38,480 Speaker 1: all the time because who do they know that they 160 00:11:38,520 --> 00:11:43,000 Speaker 1: can turn to To find somebody to do away with 161 00:11:43,080 --> 00:11:45,840 Speaker 1: the person they're trying to kill, they have to go 162 00:11:45,920 --> 00:11:48,240 Speaker 1: to people that are close to them because they're not 163 00:11:48,440 --> 00:11:52,640 Speaker 1: associating with people that would be hitman. But the irony 164 00:11:52,760 --> 00:11:55,920 Speaker 1: here is, though, Karen Stark, I mean, you're a healthcare professional. 165 00:11:56,800 --> 00:12:00,400 Speaker 1: You're asking a nurse who I know, doctor have to 166 00:12:00,400 --> 00:12:05,880 Speaker 1: take the Hippocratic oath where you vow to quote do 167 00:12:06,080 --> 00:12:09,000 Speaker 1: no harm, and I assume nurses take a similar oath. 168 00:12:09,679 --> 00:12:13,240 Speaker 1: You're asking a nurse, not one, but two nurses to 169 00:12:14,920 --> 00:12:18,960 Speaker 1: murder somebody. I mean, that's hard for me to believe, 170 00:12:19,320 --> 00:12:23,240 Speaker 1: which I'm actually starting to buy into. Kathleen Murphy zany 171 00:12:23,559 --> 00:12:26,560 Speaker 1: dare I say it. She's a veteran trial lawyer tough 172 00:12:26,600 --> 00:12:31,760 Speaker 1: as nails that she's quote not connected. I mean, Karen Stark, 173 00:12:32,000 --> 00:12:35,439 Speaker 1: how many times have we talked about that idiot O. J. 174 00:12:35,679 --> 00:12:40,079 Speaker 1: Simpson about a million and the possibility that it was 175 00:12:40,120 --> 00:12:44,200 Speaker 1: all just a big police cover up. Do you really think, 176 00:12:44,679 --> 00:12:49,880 Speaker 1: Karen Stark, that all those cops have stayed quiet, silent, 177 00:12:51,679 --> 00:12:54,840 Speaker 1: quiet as the grave for all these years when they 178 00:12:54,840 --> 00:12:58,320 Speaker 1: could have sold out for a big book deal and 179 00:12:58,440 --> 00:13:02,720 Speaker 1: made millions of dollars in granting movie rights if there 180 00:13:02,720 --> 00:13:06,280 Speaker 1: had been a cover up, if there had been a conspiracy. 181 00:13:07,000 --> 00:13:10,560 Speaker 1: People cannot keep their yap shut. We've discussed a million times, 182 00:13:10,640 --> 00:13:15,080 Speaker 1: Karen start for whatever reason, so there's no way these 183 00:13:15,160 --> 00:13:17,720 Speaker 1: nurses were not going to blab. Well, of course, that's 184 00:13:17,760 --> 00:13:21,160 Speaker 1: the whole point, Nancy. I mean, there's no judgment involved 185 00:13:21,200 --> 00:13:25,520 Speaker 1: in this, and no conscience, as we know, because not 186 00:13:25,679 --> 00:13:29,400 Speaker 1: thinking twice about the idea of killing somebody. I mean 187 00:13:30,200 --> 00:13:33,800 Speaker 1: that that's somebody who could you know, just go point 188 00:13:33,800 --> 00:13:35,960 Speaker 1: to somebody in the street and say, why don't we 189 00:13:36,000 --> 00:13:40,280 Speaker 1: shoot them? Because she has no conscience, it doesn't matter, 190 00:13:40,600 --> 00:13:43,920 Speaker 1: and her judgment is so us it's a little scary 191 00:13:44,000 --> 00:13:48,600 Speaker 1: because she's a medical professional. People will talk Karen start. 192 00:13:48,679 --> 00:13:51,840 Speaker 1: You've been with me from the beginning when I dreamed 193 00:13:51,840 --> 00:13:55,240 Speaker 1: of a family, and then when I got pregnant. I 194 00:13:55,280 --> 00:13:57,640 Speaker 1: think you were in on the secret for several months 195 00:13:57,679 --> 00:14:03,680 Speaker 1: before other people are you. I mean, I would want 196 00:14:04,000 --> 00:14:07,360 Speaker 1: to kill anybody that got between me and the twins, 197 00:14:07,480 --> 00:14:11,959 Speaker 1: but I certainly wouldn't say it out loud. Beats like, 198 00:14:12,480 --> 00:14:19,760 Speaker 1: but I mean nothing, Nothing could make me more angry 199 00:14:20,200 --> 00:14:23,160 Speaker 1: than if this were to happen to me. Take a 200 00:14:23,240 --> 00:14:26,000 Speaker 1: listen to our cut one a our friends at w 201 00:14:26,280 --> 00:14:30,040 Speaker 1: l k Y. Russell lost custody of her children in 202 00:14:30,040 --> 00:14:34,160 Speaker 1: twenty twenty and was only allowed supervised visits. The documents 203 00:14:34,200 --> 00:14:38,000 Speaker 1: also explain her ex husband's concerns about safety, saying he 204 00:14:38,120 --> 00:14:41,680 Speaker 1: testified that Russell had quote main statements that she would 205 00:14:41,760 --> 00:14:44,920 Speaker 1: kill him in his sleep. That concern was also echoed 206 00:14:44,920 --> 00:14:47,840 Speaker 1: by a quarter pointed doctor who stated Russell could quote 207 00:14:48,080 --> 00:14:51,240 Speaker 1: escalate her behavior and presents a high risk for violence, 208 00:14:51,520 --> 00:14:55,000 Speaker 1: with the doctor phrasing it as quote I'm comfortably high. 209 00:14:55,240 --> 00:14:59,320 Speaker 1: Harrolson believes the evidence was mounting against Russell. They finally 210 00:14:59,400 --> 00:15:03,000 Speaker 1: did a war on her phone and found text messages 211 00:15:03,080 --> 00:15:07,560 Speaker 1: that or other evidence that corroborated the first attempt to 212 00:15:07,640 --> 00:15:11,400 Speaker 1: hire a headman. They found all these videos in the 213 00:15:11,520 --> 00:15:16,120 Speaker 1: phone where she was having the kids practice making false 214 00:15:16,160 --> 00:15:18,840 Speaker 1: allegations against If they didn't say it right, she'd start 215 00:15:18,960 --> 00:15:22,400 Speaker 1: over again. So she turned these videos over to authorities, 216 00:15:22,640 --> 00:15:27,600 Speaker 1: but all the failed videos were still on her phone. Oh, 217 00:15:27,640 --> 00:15:34,160 Speaker 1: dear Lord in heaven. This is a medical doctor that 218 00:15:34,360 --> 00:15:40,800 Speaker 1: graduated with high grades at the Louisville Medical School, and 219 00:15:40,920 --> 00:15:45,040 Speaker 1: she kept the videos on her phone of her children 220 00:15:45,360 --> 00:15:50,680 Speaker 1: practicing a script accusing their dad of wrongdoing. Wow, I'm 221 00:15:50,760 --> 00:15:53,200 Speaker 1: drinking from the fire hijrah here, I just don't even know. 222 00:15:53,760 --> 00:15:55,240 Speaker 1: It's more than I could take at once. I don't 223 00:15:55,240 --> 00:15:57,080 Speaker 1: know where to start, but I'm going to start at 224 00:15:57,120 --> 00:15:59,760 Speaker 1: the beginning of what you were hearing from our friends 225 00:15:59,760 --> 00:16:04,920 Speaker 1: at Belky. First of all, she loses soul custody. She 226 00:16:05,000 --> 00:16:10,600 Speaker 1: lost custody of her children and only got supervised visits. 227 00:16:10,680 --> 00:16:14,440 Speaker 1: First of all, let me start there to you, Kathleen Murphy, 228 00:16:14,480 --> 00:16:18,160 Speaker 1: family lawyer joining us out of North Carolina, explain what 229 00:16:18,440 --> 00:16:23,960 Speaker 1: is a supervised visit. Typically, a supervised visitor is professionally supervised. 230 00:16:24,320 --> 00:16:26,960 Speaker 1: There are people that are paid and they can report 231 00:16:26,960 --> 00:16:30,240 Speaker 1: to the court any violations of the conditions of the 232 00:16:30,280 --> 00:16:34,560 Speaker 1: supervision and typically there for short periods of time. There 233 00:16:34,560 --> 00:16:38,640 Speaker 1: are two types of supervised visitation locations. One can be 234 00:16:38,640 --> 00:16:44,360 Speaker 1: a supervised visitation center and the children are inside and 235 00:16:44,400 --> 00:16:47,080 Speaker 1: it's pretty weird. But the other one is where people 236 00:16:47,080 --> 00:16:53,000 Speaker 1: will go to public parks or libraries or museums or 237 00:16:53,160 --> 00:16:56,520 Speaker 1: swim pools and the parents can have more of a 238 00:16:56,600 --> 00:17:00,800 Speaker 1: normal experience with their children. My understanding is that the 239 00:17:00,840 --> 00:17:05,520 Speaker 1: woman that doctor in question here had supervised visitation at 240 00:17:05,520 --> 00:17:09,600 Speaker 1: her office, which could be okay since the children may 241 00:17:09,600 --> 00:17:11,919 Speaker 1: have been familiar with the location, but it was inside 242 00:17:12,720 --> 00:17:16,600 Speaker 1: and it was only two times a week, which is 243 00:17:17,280 --> 00:17:23,840 Speaker 1: really really a harsh type of supervised visitation order. It's 244 00:17:23,840 --> 00:17:28,719 Speaker 1: a harsh order supervised visits. Kathleen Murphy joining me out 245 00:17:28,720 --> 00:17:34,160 Speaker 1: of North Carolina is the case of Josh Powell. Rang 246 00:17:34,440 --> 00:17:39,640 Speaker 1: a bell to you. Yes, the social worker was bringing 247 00:17:39,680 --> 00:17:43,280 Speaker 1: the children though to his house where he had control. 248 00:17:43,840 --> 00:17:47,040 Speaker 1: And that's why they do the supervised centers, and people 249 00:17:47,040 --> 00:17:50,120 Speaker 1: are padded down and they have to go through a security. 250 00:17:50,440 --> 00:17:53,919 Speaker 1: They not rather to bring gifts and they are very controlled. 251 00:17:54,040 --> 00:17:57,000 Speaker 1: And for Josh Powell to be able to have those 252 00:17:57,080 --> 00:18:01,960 Speaker 1: children supervised by soul shore worker at his own home 253 00:18:02,800 --> 00:18:05,080 Speaker 1: may have been a stale mistake, was a fatal mistake. 254 00:18:05,520 --> 00:18:10,399 Speaker 1: Josh Powell murdered his two little boys during a supervised 255 00:18:10,640 --> 00:18:15,640 Speaker 1: visit because the social worker let the children run into 256 00:18:15,640 --> 00:18:19,240 Speaker 1: the home and then Josh Powell slammed the door, hacked 257 00:18:19,320 --> 00:18:21,760 Speaker 1: them with an axe, and set the home on fire 258 00:18:21,800 --> 00:18:25,480 Speaker 1: and blew up the home. He had already murdered their mother, 259 00:18:25,680 --> 00:18:29,880 Speaker 1: Susan Cox. Powell. Cox never did anything about it, even 260 00:18:29,920 --> 00:18:34,240 Speaker 1: though the boys drew pictures of mommy in a trunk 261 00:18:34,560 --> 00:18:38,520 Speaker 1: the car trunk with the boys and dad driving the car. 262 00:18:41,280 --> 00:18:44,080 Speaker 1: That's a whole other can of worms. No doubt that 263 00:18:44,119 --> 00:18:48,600 Speaker 1: he murdered his wife, but he was never prosecuted, so 264 00:18:48,640 --> 00:18:51,879 Speaker 1: he was still out and somehow got supervised of visits 265 00:18:51,880 --> 00:18:56,000 Speaker 1: with his children. That's what a supervised visit is. You're 266 00:18:56,119 --> 00:18:59,920 Speaker 1: either sitting in the room with a court official why 267 00:19:00,000 --> 00:19:03,240 Speaker 1: watching you with your children, or you are somewhere in 268 00:19:03,320 --> 00:19:06,119 Speaker 1: public like a park or a McDonald's, or in this case, 269 00:19:06,359 --> 00:19:10,440 Speaker 1: the pediatrician could only have two supervised visits a week 270 00:19:10,920 --> 00:19:16,240 Speaker 1: with her children. Karen Stark, do you know how crazy 271 00:19:16,600 --> 00:19:19,399 Speaker 1: that would make me? Even when I have to go 272 00:19:19,440 --> 00:19:21,159 Speaker 1: out of town to travel, which I have to do 273 00:19:21,240 --> 00:19:25,040 Speaker 1: a lot for various criminal investigations. I go crazy. I 274 00:19:25,080 --> 00:19:27,560 Speaker 1: have a rule. I try to never stay away over 275 00:19:27,640 --> 00:19:31,480 Speaker 1: one night. The children are fine, Karen start because when 276 00:19:31,520 --> 00:19:34,720 Speaker 1: I'm not at home they get to order pizza and 277 00:19:34,800 --> 00:19:38,919 Speaker 1: watch TV during dinner while holding their cell phone staring 278 00:19:38,920 --> 00:19:41,520 Speaker 1: at it. See, none of that would happen with if 279 00:19:41,560 --> 00:19:45,600 Speaker 1: I were home. Absolutely not. It's veggies around the table 280 00:19:45,960 --> 00:19:49,040 Speaker 1: where you interact. You say a prayer first, and you 281 00:19:49,119 --> 00:19:52,199 Speaker 1: talk about your day and your next day or anything 282 00:19:52,240 --> 00:19:54,720 Speaker 1: else you happen to think of. Oh all that just 283 00:19:54,760 --> 00:19:56,760 Speaker 1: goes to hell in a handbasket if I go out 284 00:19:56,760 --> 00:20:00,679 Speaker 1: of town. But they're fine. It's me. I suffer, hate 285 00:20:00,720 --> 00:20:03,800 Speaker 1: it to be away from the children. Can you even 286 00:20:03,840 --> 00:20:07,240 Speaker 1: imagine you didn't like that from the very beginning, Nancy, 287 00:20:07,520 --> 00:20:09,800 Speaker 1: right from the start, you would not spend a night 288 00:20:09,800 --> 00:20:12,359 Speaker 1: away from them. Awful. It's I can attest to that 289 00:20:12,720 --> 00:20:16,640 Speaker 1: appruciating and I mean, finally, by the end of it, 290 00:20:16,800 --> 00:20:20,200 Speaker 1: my son I do yet another Facei'm He's like, hi, Mom, 291 00:20:21,480 --> 00:20:28,679 Speaker 1: this is like the faceside we've done. But anyway, how 292 00:20:28,720 --> 00:20:33,680 Speaker 1: mad do you think this mom is? She's so smart, 293 00:20:33,800 --> 00:20:37,680 Speaker 1: she's so educated, and somehow she's painted herself into the 294 00:20:37,760 --> 00:20:43,000 Speaker 1: corner of two supervised visits a week at her office 295 00:20:43,119 --> 00:20:46,800 Speaker 1: with her children. That's it. And that's because she's a 296 00:20:46,960 --> 00:20:50,399 Speaker 1: danger to those children. Nancy, She's not am I'm asking 297 00:20:50,440 --> 00:20:53,600 Speaker 1: you how mad did that make her? I'm just making 298 00:20:53,680 --> 00:20:57,840 Speaker 1: me madges saying it. Obviously she was mad to begin with. 299 00:20:58,480 --> 00:21:02,800 Speaker 1: She was right right from this start. Who's jumping in 300 00:21:03,119 --> 00:21:06,280 Speaker 1: This is Kathleen Murphy. And she was mad that she 301 00:21:06,320 --> 00:21:09,640 Speaker 1: had supervised visitation. But as Karen said, she was mad 302 00:21:09,680 --> 00:21:13,320 Speaker 1: before that. She was crazy before that, and that's what Look, 303 00:21:13,440 --> 00:21:16,200 Speaker 1: do you know, you're you, of all people, Kathleen Murphy 304 00:21:16,200 --> 00:21:21,600 Speaker 1: cannot throw around the term crazy at at will willy nilly. 305 00:21:22,160 --> 00:21:25,080 Speaker 1: Crazy means something under the lawn to the old McNaughton 306 00:21:25,119 --> 00:21:28,760 Speaker 1: test that we brought over to our country from Great Britain, 307 00:21:29,240 --> 00:21:32,719 Speaker 1: all right, it means did you know right from wrong 308 00:21:32,920 --> 00:21:35,920 Speaker 1: at the time of the act? That is crazy, That 309 00:21:36,160 --> 00:21:40,000 Speaker 1: is insane. She clearly knew what she was doing was wrong. 310 00:21:40,080 --> 00:21:42,119 Speaker 1: But that was the beginning of what we learned from 311 00:21:42,119 --> 00:22:06,919 Speaker 1: our friends at w LK Y Time Stories with Nancy Grace. 312 00:22:09,920 --> 00:22:15,040 Speaker 1: She was reduced to two supervised visits a week at 313 00:22:15,040 --> 00:22:19,320 Speaker 1: her office. But then we go on to a court 314 00:22:19,359 --> 00:22:24,919 Speaker 1: appointed doctor who stated her behavior escalated and the doctor 315 00:22:25,040 --> 00:22:32,000 Speaker 1: found it was quote uncomfortably high that Russell would spin 316 00:22:32,119 --> 00:22:36,639 Speaker 1: out after these text messages were found on her phone 317 00:22:36,680 --> 00:22:40,160 Speaker 1: and the videos, Alexis Treshak tell me about the videos 318 00:22:40,240 --> 00:22:43,320 Speaker 1: on her phone, was she trying to frame the husband? 319 00:22:43,600 --> 00:22:47,720 Speaker 1: So yes, as their divorce began, she accused her husband 320 00:22:47,760 --> 00:22:50,560 Speaker 1: of sexually abusing the children. They were really young, because 321 00:22:50,560 --> 00:22:52,560 Speaker 1: at this point now I think they are four and two, 322 00:22:52,600 --> 00:22:54,639 Speaker 1: So this is a couple years ago, their little babies. 323 00:22:55,320 --> 00:22:58,840 Speaker 1: And she had videos, she'd taken videos on her phone 324 00:22:59,640 --> 00:23:02,080 Speaker 1: of them that she gave to the authorities where the 325 00:23:02,160 --> 00:23:05,560 Speaker 1: children explained how they had been abused by the dad 326 00:23:05,600 --> 00:23:09,640 Speaker 1: in little kid Verdens. But also on the phone were 327 00:23:09,760 --> 00:23:12,680 Speaker 1: videos where she was coaching the children. So she would 328 00:23:12,680 --> 00:23:15,880 Speaker 1: say to the little child, the little child Wood would 329 00:23:15,920 --> 00:23:18,000 Speaker 1: give a statement, you know, this is what happened to me. 330 00:23:18,080 --> 00:23:19,440 Speaker 1: Daddy did this to me. And she's wait, wait, you're 331 00:23:19,480 --> 00:23:21,120 Speaker 1: not You're not doing it right. Let's back up, let's 332 00:23:21,119 --> 00:23:23,199 Speaker 1: try again. Have to say it this dear lord and 333 00:23:23,240 --> 00:23:25,640 Speaker 1: her and so she had videos. She didn't even delete 334 00:23:25,640 --> 00:23:27,440 Speaker 1: those videos, they were still on her phone of her 335 00:23:28,200 --> 00:23:30,680 Speaker 1: prompting the children and leaving them and making them say 336 00:23:30,680 --> 00:23:33,520 Speaker 1: these things. So that was also given to the judge, 337 00:23:33,560 --> 00:23:38,280 Speaker 1: Paul Zeke joining me former police commander and Albuquerque and author, 338 00:23:38,320 --> 00:23:43,520 Speaker 1: I'll stop him from killing them on Amazon. Man, the 339 00:23:43,600 --> 00:23:47,240 Speaker 1: cops just got handed a case on a silver platter. 340 00:23:47,320 --> 00:23:48,760 Speaker 1: You might as well put that on top of the 341 00:23:48,840 --> 00:23:52,199 Speaker 1: Christmas tree and open it up on Christmas morning. To 342 00:23:52,359 --> 00:23:55,200 Speaker 1: have all that. One search of her phone reveals all 343 00:23:55,320 --> 00:23:59,040 Speaker 1: that A lot of harder. Usually we don't have things 344 00:23:59,080 --> 00:24:02,080 Speaker 1: served up to us so easily. We've got tons of 345 00:24:02,119 --> 00:24:05,520 Speaker 1: software investigative means to find things that have been a race, 346 00:24:05,600 --> 00:24:08,280 Speaker 1: but things that are actually still on the phone, Phones 347 00:24:08,280 --> 00:24:11,360 Speaker 1: that are still you know, literally just have the data there. 348 00:24:11,400 --> 00:24:14,360 Speaker 1: You just have to look for it. We don't get 349 00:24:14,359 --> 00:24:17,560 Speaker 1: it so easily, especially when you're looking at something as 350 00:24:17,560 --> 00:24:20,800 Speaker 1: serious as this. And I think that speaks to another 351 00:24:20,840 --> 00:24:25,119 Speaker 1: point that she just literally, you know, the whole the 352 00:24:25,119 --> 00:24:28,879 Speaker 1: whole issue of having restricted access to her children. And 353 00:24:28,920 --> 00:24:31,960 Speaker 1: we've seen this in cases with domestic violence and stalking 354 00:24:32,000 --> 00:24:35,200 Speaker 1: over the years, is that that's a conduct inhibitor. It's 355 00:24:35,280 --> 00:24:38,560 Speaker 1: something that makes people go a little more out of 356 00:24:38,560 --> 00:24:41,400 Speaker 1: their mind, a little more extreme, and take more risk. 357 00:24:41,880 --> 00:24:46,639 Speaker 1: To do harm. What did you call that? A conduct inhibitor? 358 00:24:46,640 --> 00:24:48,760 Speaker 1: A conduct inhibitor, that's one of the things in like 359 00:24:49,200 --> 00:24:52,320 Speaker 1: that that are that's things that I have a list 360 00:24:52,320 --> 00:24:54,680 Speaker 1: of them in my book that when you remove them 361 00:24:54,800 --> 00:25:00,080 Speaker 1: from rational people or even irrational people, and especially and 362 00:25:00,119 --> 00:25:02,960 Speaker 1: you remove them in groups you know, like custody status 363 00:25:03,040 --> 00:25:05,639 Speaker 1: in the community, you know, ability to take care of 364 00:25:05,680 --> 00:25:09,720 Speaker 1: your children, you know, upcoming restraining restraining order hearings. There's 365 00:25:09,720 --> 00:25:12,280 Speaker 1: a whole list of them that in my you know, 366 00:25:12,359 --> 00:25:14,800 Speaker 1: ten years of work in those cases that I found 367 00:25:15,200 --> 00:25:18,280 Speaker 1: caused people to do unexpected things. Right, you're starting to 368 00:25:18,320 --> 00:25:21,800 Speaker 1: sound like the crazy old guys in trading places, you know. 369 00:25:22,000 --> 00:25:26,440 Speaker 1: With adding Martine, Essentially you take away somebody's money, their credit, 370 00:25:26,920 --> 00:25:31,760 Speaker 1: their home, their family, their loved ones, their status, their position, 371 00:25:31,880 --> 00:25:35,199 Speaker 1: and they start committing crimes. Okay, dan Ackroy did not 372 00:25:35,280 --> 00:25:38,480 Speaker 1: start Actually he did start committing crimes, never mind. So 373 00:25:38,680 --> 00:25:43,320 Speaker 1: you're saying conduct inhibitors are when you take away what 374 00:25:43,560 --> 00:25:48,080 Speaker 1: people value the most, they are more likely to commit 375 00:25:48,080 --> 00:25:50,560 Speaker 1: a crime. Is that what you're saying? Paul's like absolutely 376 00:25:50,680 --> 00:25:53,560 Speaker 1: not just a crime, especially a crime of passion, a 377 00:25:53,560 --> 00:25:57,720 Speaker 1: crime where you you know, you somebody gets stabbed fifty 378 00:25:57,720 --> 00:26:01,680 Speaker 1: eight times instead of twice. That are really out of 379 00:26:01,720 --> 00:26:04,119 Speaker 1: the box things that you know, people go there. They 380 00:26:04,119 --> 00:26:06,119 Speaker 1: were such a quiet, you know, neighbor quiet to this 381 00:26:06,320 --> 00:26:08,720 Speaker 1: and that, and then we didn't expect any of this. Well, 382 00:26:09,240 --> 00:26:13,440 Speaker 1: you remove enough conduct inhibitors from people, and you can 383 00:26:13,520 --> 00:26:16,600 Speaker 1: just about get anybody to do anything if you remove 384 00:26:16,720 --> 00:26:19,600 Speaker 1: enough of them, especially if it's done quickly. Paul Zyke 385 00:26:19,720 --> 00:26:22,280 Speaker 1: is with me and he's saying that this information is 386 00:26:22,280 --> 00:26:26,440 Speaker 1: in his book stop him from killing them on Amazon. 387 00:26:27,119 --> 00:26:28,840 Speaker 1: You know, I see what you're saying, and I think 388 00:26:28,880 --> 00:26:32,919 Speaker 1: you're right, Paul Zyke. You take away the chance of 389 00:26:33,000 --> 00:26:38,200 Speaker 1: her being with her children, and she goes haywire. But 390 00:26:39,359 --> 00:26:43,000 Speaker 1: when was it, Alexis Treschuk, was it before or after 391 00:26:43,080 --> 00:26:45,360 Speaker 1: she lost It had to be before she lost custody 392 00:26:45,520 --> 00:26:48,000 Speaker 1: that she was getting the children to create these videos 393 00:26:48,040 --> 00:26:50,840 Speaker 1: accusing their dad of sex mostation, it was before she 394 00:26:50,920 --> 00:26:54,800 Speaker 1: lost custody. That was their divorce started, and that would 395 00:26:54,880 --> 00:26:58,879 Speaker 1: her attempt to have full custody of the children. Oh okay, 396 00:26:58,960 --> 00:27:01,800 Speaker 1: I see what she means. She was threatened with losing 397 00:27:01,840 --> 00:27:05,919 Speaker 1: custody as she started doing these videos. So Paul zikes 398 00:27:05,960 --> 00:27:10,359 Speaker 1: theory dot conduct inhibitors is actually correct in this case. Guys, 399 00:27:10,359 --> 00:27:13,960 Speaker 1: take a listen to our cut for our friends a wave. 400 00:27:14,840 --> 00:27:17,439 Speaker 1: Russell was the one to lose custody in twenty twenty 401 00:27:17,640 --> 00:27:20,840 Speaker 1: after a court appointed representative for the children claimed she 402 00:27:20,920 --> 00:27:24,400 Speaker 1: was coaching the kids into making allegations about her ex husband, 403 00:27:24,680 --> 00:27:27,840 Speaker 1: and in May twenty eighteen that she tried to hire 404 00:27:27,840 --> 00:27:31,360 Speaker 1: a hitman to kill him. According to court records, Russell's 405 00:27:31,400 --> 00:27:35,320 Speaker 1: attorney called the allegation preposterous in a lawsuit against the judge, 406 00:27:35,440 --> 00:27:38,880 Speaker 1: writing in this complaint there have never been any criminal charges. 407 00:27:39,240 --> 00:27:42,040 Speaker 1: They would come four years later, when the FED set 408 00:27:42,119 --> 00:27:45,640 Speaker 1: up a sting on May fifteenth, twenty twenty two. Officials 409 00:27:45,680 --> 00:27:48,320 Speaker 1: say Russell reached out to a hitman and agreed to 410 00:27:48,359 --> 00:27:51,240 Speaker 1: pay him seven thousand dollars to kill her ex husband. 411 00:27:51,600 --> 00:27:54,520 Speaker 1: On May eighteenth, Officers say she put half the cash 412 00:27:54,520 --> 00:27:57,080 Speaker 1: in her dropbox at her office and promised to pay 413 00:27:57,119 --> 00:28:00,560 Speaker 1: the rest once the murder was complete. According to records, 414 00:28:00,760 --> 00:28:04,200 Speaker 1: the next day, she was behind bars because agents say 415 00:28:04,240 --> 00:28:08,040 Speaker 1: the person Russell thought was a hitman was an undercover cop. 416 00:28:08,119 --> 00:28:13,200 Speaker 1: Of course he was. You can't swing a stick around 417 00:28:13,240 --> 00:28:19,879 Speaker 1: your head without hitting an FBI agent posing as a hitman. Oh, so, 418 00:28:19,960 --> 00:28:23,479 Speaker 1: not only does she leave the videos on her phone, 419 00:28:23,520 --> 00:28:26,919 Speaker 1: coaching her children to make claims of sex moallestation by dad, 420 00:28:28,560 --> 00:28:31,640 Speaker 1: reach out to her nanny and two of her nurses 421 00:28:31,720 --> 00:28:35,159 Speaker 1: in her practice to hire a hitman or commit the 422 00:28:35,240 --> 00:28:40,240 Speaker 1: murder themselves. It just keeps getting worse. Now, what did 423 00:28:40,280 --> 00:28:44,600 Speaker 1: I hear about a previous attempt to hire a hitman? 424 00:28:45,120 --> 00:28:48,040 Speaker 1: Take a listen to our friends at crime online dot 425 00:28:48,080 --> 00:28:52,560 Speaker 1: com our cut seven g. The investigation into a second 426 00:28:52,680 --> 00:28:56,240 Speaker 1: murder for Higher Plant came after a Louisville Metro detective 427 00:28:56,320 --> 00:29:00,360 Speaker 1: contacted the FBI. The detective had been contacted by local 428 00:29:00,400 --> 00:29:05,240 Speaker 1: private investigator who had potential information, and that information came 429 00:29:05,320 --> 00:29:09,480 Speaker 1: from someone who worked at Kids Life Pediatrics. The PI 430 00:29:09,600 --> 00:29:13,560 Speaker 1: learned Russell had approached several employees about killing her ex husband, 431 00:29:13,840 --> 00:29:17,520 Speaker 1: and then the PI urged the employee to contact the FBI. 432 00:29:17,920 --> 00:29:20,920 Speaker 1: The informant met with agents, saying that Russell had been 433 00:29:20,960 --> 00:29:24,400 Speaker 1: asking for help in killing Crabtree for the last ten months. 434 00:29:24,760 --> 00:29:28,480 Speaker 1: One of the nurses provided screenshots of text conversations with 435 00:29:28,520 --> 00:29:33,200 Speaker 1: her boss, doctor Stephanie Russell, discussing delivery of Christmas flowers. 436 00:29:33,480 --> 00:29:37,360 Speaker 1: Russell's code word for murder. A screenshot of the exchange 437 00:29:37,400 --> 00:29:40,880 Speaker 1: in part went like this, are you still looking for flowers? 438 00:29:41,240 --> 00:29:44,760 Speaker 1: I actually do need flowers. Russell replied, Oh nice, Can 439 00:29:44,800 --> 00:29:49,440 Speaker 1: I drop by your house tonight Tomorrow night, Friday night, Saturday, Sunday. Ultimately, 440 00:29:49,640 --> 00:29:52,520 Speaker 1: Russell and the nurse met in person, but the nurse 441 00:29:52,600 --> 00:29:56,600 Speaker 1: was wired for audio and video courtesy of the FBI. Yeah, 442 00:29:56,640 --> 00:29:58,600 Speaker 1: you don't want to say no to an FBI agent 443 00:29:58,760 --> 00:30:03,120 Speaker 1: if possible. I mean Kathleen Murphy joining US veterans trial 444 00:30:03,200 --> 00:30:07,960 Speaker 1: lawyer out of North Carolina, Kathleen Murphy. So there's not 445 00:30:08,280 --> 00:30:13,200 Speaker 1: just this attempt to hire hitman. There's another, a first 446 00:30:13,240 --> 00:30:18,600 Speaker 1: attempt to hire hitman. There were three total attempts in 447 00:30:17,360 --> 00:30:22,680 Speaker 1: my in my reading, First she wanted the nurse, or 448 00:30:22,720 --> 00:30:25,240 Speaker 1: at first she wanted her nanny to help her hire hitman. 449 00:30:25,880 --> 00:30:29,280 Speaker 1: Then the nurse in her practice, and then the second 450 00:30:29,360 --> 00:30:32,600 Speaker 1: nurse in her practice, because the first nurse said that 451 00:30:32,680 --> 00:30:35,560 Speaker 1: the hitman that she was going to send her way 452 00:30:35,640 --> 00:30:38,920 Speaker 1: had died, and then that nurse left the practice, so 453 00:30:39,000 --> 00:30:41,800 Speaker 1: she went to the second nurse in the practice. I mean, 454 00:30:41,920 --> 00:30:48,560 Speaker 1: the evidence continues to mount. I'm just curious. Paul Zyke, 455 00:30:48,720 --> 00:30:52,840 Speaker 1: former police commander in Albuquerque. The FBI must have a 456 00:30:52,920 --> 00:30:57,200 Speaker 1: whole wing of agents that are posing as hitman. It's 457 00:30:57,240 --> 00:31:00,120 Speaker 1: something they specialize in. I mean, they're really good at it. 458 00:31:00,120 --> 00:31:02,560 Speaker 1: It's one of the you know, just like economic crimes 459 00:31:02,760 --> 00:31:05,840 Speaker 1: type of thing where they can follow the uh you know, 460 00:31:05,880 --> 00:31:09,520 Speaker 1: the breadcrumbs if you will. Um. A lot of these 461 00:31:09,520 --> 00:31:13,880 Speaker 1: things cross state lines and um, you know, and generally speaking, 462 00:31:14,160 --> 00:31:16,720 Speaker 1: there is some complexity to it. But yes, they have 463 00:31:17,080 --> 00:31:20,040 Speaker 1: a lot of field agents that are highly skilled at this. 464 00:31:20,600 --> 00:31:22,920 Speaker 1: They're looking, you know, the first time they looked at this, 465 00:31:23,640 --> 00:31:26,360 Speaker 1: you know, it's not something you see a whole lot 466 00:31:26,400 --> 00:31:30,760 Speaker 1: of Unfortunately, well I should say fortunately when when it 467 00:31:30,840 --> 00:31:33,280 Speaker 1: was brought to their attention they kind of closed the case. Well, 468 00:31:33,320 --> 00:31:36,680 Speaker 1: the second time around, it was enough to get their attention, 469 00:31:36,880 --> 00:31:39,960 Speaker 1: and they got lucky because if it would have happened 470 00:31:39,960 --> 00:31:42,840 Speaker 1: after the first time, they would have been you know, 471 00:31:42,920 --> 00:31:45,040 Speaker 1: left holding the back because they had some of the 472 00:31:45,040 --> 00:31:48,120 Speaker 1: information before. But obviously the second time they were given 473 00:31:48,120 --> 00:31:50,640 Speaker 1: the case they grabbed downto it with both hands. That 474 00:31:50,760 --> 00:31:52,440 Speaker 1: is not giving me a lot of confidence that they 475 00:31:52,480 --> 00:31:55,480 Speaker 1: just quote, as you said, kind of close the case. 476 00:31:55,560 --> 00:31:58,360 Speaker 1: The first time you try to hire a hit man, Hey, 477 00:31:58,400 --> 00:32:02,040 Speaker 1: Alexis Terrez, Chuck, this happens to me at the dentist, 478 00:32:02,200 --> 00:32:06,200 Speaker 1: and I hope my dentist. Who crazy story, Jackie. He 479 00:32:06,480 --> 00:32:09,520 Speaker 1: hang them out and he was doing something goes you know, 480 00:32:09,560 --> 00:32:11,000 Speaker 1: I was on one of your juris right, I'm like 481 00:32:13,960 --> 00:32:17,080 Speaker 1: then then suddenly it all came rushing back to back. 482 00:32:17,080 --> 00:32:20,120 Speaker 1: And even remember what he wore as a juror. He 483 00:32:20,160 --> 00:32:24,520 Speaker 1: wore a ten pullover. It looked like cashmir V neck 484 00:32:25,240 --> 00:32:30,080 Speaker 1: sweater with a kind of a brown shirt underneath. He's 485 00:32:30,320 --> 00:32:36,920 Speaker 1: perfectly dressed, perfectly everything. This dentist, he's awesome, but he'll 486 00:32:36,960 --> 00:32:39,880 Speaker 1: do whatever he's doing. And then it has to wait 487 00:32:40,000 --> 00:32:44,080 Speaker 1: sometimes and I can sit there, I can't move, I 488 00:32:44,200 --> 00:32:46,880 Speaker 1: can't get on my phone or anything else. I can 489 00:32:47,040 --> 00:32:53,040 Speaker 1: hear the dental assistance talking, and they're always talking about 490 00:32:53,040 --> 00:32:57,120 Speaker 1: like their vacation or this or that. It's never anything incendiary. 491 00:32:57,160 --> 00:33:00,000 Speaker 1: They're not talking about other patients. They're just passing the time, 492 00:33:00,680 --> 00:33:05,400 Speaker 1: don't you know. These nurses were all talking about she 493 00:33:05,520 --> 00:33:10,160 Speaker 1: wants to hire a hit man, she wants to kill Crabtree, 494 00:33:10,240 --> 00:33:13,960 Speaker 1: the husband. You know, they were all talking about it right, well, 495 00:33:14,000 --> 00:33:15,640 Speaker 1: and then what they would have had to have done 496 00:33:15,720 --> 00:33:17,560 Speaker 1: the end of the one says well, I'm so sorry 497 00:33:17,600 --> 00:33:19,640 Speaker 1: it is a hitman that I tried to get you died. 498 00:33:20,720 --> 00:33:22,800 Speaker 1: There's nothing like oh my gosh, how was he killed? 499 00:33:22,800 --> 00:33:24,680 Speaker 1: What happened there? Or anything like that. Like that is 500 00:33:24,720 --> 00:33:26,760 Speaker 1: also a huge red flag, like did they talk to 501 00:33:26,840 --> 00:33:28,680 Speaker 1: the nurses talk to each other and say how can 502 00:33:28,720 --> 00:33:30,040 Speaker 1: we get out of this? And she's like, just tell 503 00:33:30,160 --> 00:33:31,920 Speaker 1: me died and then you'll get out of it because 504 00:33:31,920 --> 00:33:34,440 Speaker 1: you think, oh, well, he died, okay. How many people 505 00:33:34,520 --> 00:33:38,520 Speaker 1: know more than one hit man? It's absolutely crazy, And 506 00:33:38,600 --> 00:33:41,719 Speaker 1: so she kept doing it again. The first time she 507 00:33:41,840 --> 00:33:44,720 Speaker 1: was investigated for it, so she must have known that 508 00:33:44,800 --> 00:33:48,080 Speaker 1: they were on to her, but yet so arrogant, so 509 00:33:48,120 --> 00:33:51,560 Speaker 1: confident in her own ability to trick law enforcement and 510 00:33:51,600 --> 00:33:54,360 Speaker 1: the judges and her ex husband who is a very 511 00:33:54,400 --> 00:33:57,960 Speaker 1: smart finance guy, and that she could still hire a 512 00:33:58,040 --> 00:34:00,200 Speaker 1: hitman to do it. Can we talk about him from 513 00:34:00,400 --> 00:34:04,120 Speaker 1: can you imagine how his whole life would have been 514 00:34:04,240 --> 00:34:10,120 Speaker 1: ruined with these allegations of molesting his own children? I mean, 515 00:34:10,280 --> 00:34:14,120 Speaker 1: does that bother anybody but me? Kathleen Murphy, you're a 516 00:34:14,200 --> 00:34:18,760 Speaker 1: family lawyer, and that is certainly a euphemism because family 517 00:34:18,880 --> 00:34:22,600 Speaker 1: law sounds all cozy, is actually down and dirty. Have 518 00:34:22,719 --> 00:34:26,680 Speaker 1: you ever seen that where one party tries to get 519 00:34:26,719 --> 00:34:30,040 Speaker 1: the children to fabricate allegations against the other parent. I do, 520 00:34:30,120 --> 00:34:32,600 Speaker 1: But Nancy, you know it's worse is when I have 521 00:34:32,640 --> 00:34:36,600 Speaker 1: a client who believes that there's something going on, and 522 00:34:36,640 --> 00:34:38,960 Speaker 1: they're damned if they do, and they're damned if they don't, 523 00:34:39,000 --> 00:34:43,200 Speaker 1: if they don't say anything, and they have these realistic concerns, 524 00:34:44,000 --> 00:34:46,560 Speaker 1: you know, that's not good. And then if they say something, 525 00:34:47,200 --> 00:34:50,840 Speaker 1: then they're seen in this light of she's just making 526 00:34:50,880 --> 00:34:53,640 Speaker 1: it up to get leverage in a custody age. It's 527 00:34:53,880 --> 00:34:57,040 Speaker 1: very difficult, but people would always wonder did he do it? 528 00:34:57,320 --> 00:34:59,680 Speaker 1: Did he molest his children? You know, just making a 529 00:34:59,760 --> 00:35:03,240 Speaker 1: no to talk to you about Kathleen Murphy, high profile 530 00:35:03,320 --> 00:35:08,080 Speaker 1: lawyer joining me out of North Carolina. To prove a conspiracy, 531 00:35:08,800 --> 00:35:11,440 Speaker 1: you have to have more than just shop talk. You 532 00:35:11,480 --> 00:35:13,440 Speaker 1: can't just hey, I want to kill him, you know, 533 00:35:13,440 --> 00:35:16,959 Speaker 1: a hitman. You have to make what is called under 534 00:35:17,000 --> 00:35:21,920 Speaker 1: the law and overt act. You actually have to do something, 535 00:35:22,160 --> 00:35:25,440 Speaker 1: Otherwise you could just say it trial. Yeah. I dreamed 536 00:35:25,480 --> 00:35:27,520 Speaker 1: about it, I talked about it. I knew it was wrong. 537 00:35:27,520 --> 00:35:31,560 Speaker 1: I'd never do it. But here she's accused of putting 538 00:35:31,560 --> 00:35:35,720 Speaker 1: nearly four thousand dollars in a drop box to pay 539 00:35:36,160 --> 00:35:40,360 Speaker 1: the hitman, and under the law, that is an overt act, 540 00:35:40,719 --> 00:35:43,720 Speaker 1: is it not. Kathleen Murphy not only putting the money 541 00:35:43,800 --> 00:35:48,480 Speaker 1: in there, but then giving the individual a code to 542 00:35:48,520 --> 00:35:53,160 Speaker 1: get in that medical lockbox to retrieve the money. That's 543 00:35:53,160 --> 00:35:54,920 Speaker 1: how they were able to connect it because they didn't 544 00:35:54,960 --> 00:35:58,200 Speaker 1: have a video of her during the surveillance of her 545 00:35:58,200 --> 00:36:01,239 Speaker 1: putting the money in the drop box. But what they 546 00:36:01,280 --> 00:36:03,600 Speaker 1: had to connect it was that she had provided the 547 00:36:03,640 --> 00:36:07,120 Speaker 1: code for that individual to remove the money from the 548 00:36:07,200 --> 00:36:11,080 Speaker 1: job box. And even wiring the nurse still may not. 549 00:36:11,400 --> 00:36:14,440 Speaker 1: It may have been helpful, but it's still just talk. 550 00:36:14,800 --> 00:36:17,759 Speaker 1: Does not a conspiracy make? There has to be that 551 00:36:17,920 --> 00:36:21,280 Speaker 1: over Guys, take a listen to our friend Rachel Drose 552 00:36:21,320 --> 00:36:25,160 Speaker 1: and our cut six from WHA S and I actually 553 00:36:25,280 --> 00:36:27,480 Speaker 1: ran into one parent who was here today trying to 554 00:36:27,480 --> 00:36:30,480 Speaker 1: pick up his children's medical records. She's been their primary 555 00:36:30,520 --> 00:36:34,719 Speaker 1: caregiver for six years. So it's just freaking It's shocking 556 00:36:34,800 --> 00:36:38,320 Speaker 1: to say the least, and it's very sad. The FBI 557 00:36:38,440 --> 00:36:41,800 Speaker 1: arrested doctor Stephanie Russell last night and charged her with 558 00:36:41,920 --> 00:36:44,920 Speaker 1: trying to hire someone to murder her ex husband. Instead 559 00:36:44,920 --> 00:36:49,000 Speaker 1: of hiring a hitman, Russell actually hired an undercover FBI employee, 560 00:36:49,200 --> 00:36:52,400 Speaker 1: according to court filings. The Louisville pediatrician works in the 561 00:36:52,440 --> 00:36:55,920 Speaker 1: Norton Commons neighborhood at Kids' Life Pediatrics. I know several 562 00:36:55,960 --> 00:36:58,719 Speaker 1: parents in this area that bring their children here, and 563 00:36:59,040 --> 00:37:02,080 Speaker 1: like I said, I've only hard positive, wonderful things about them. 564 00:37:02,120 --> 00:37:04,759 Speaker 1: When I went by there, a handwritten closed sign was 565 00:37:04,800 --> 00:37:06,920 Speaker 1: posted on the door, and when I tried to call, 566 00:37:07,040 --> 00:37:09,760 Speaker 1: there was no answer. With doctor Russell, everything was fine, 567 00:37:09,920 --> 00:37:14,680 Speaker 1: like she was pleasant, she was sweeked, The girls liked 568 00:37:14,680 --> 00:37:17,120 Speaker 1: her lance. Dueley, the dad trying to pick up his 569 00:37:17,200 --> 00:37:20,040 Speaker 1: kids medical records, wasn't able to get in touch with anyone. 570 00:37:20,120 --> 00:37:24,160 Speaker 1: We're right around the corner, and money drop offs were 571 00:37:24,160 --> 00:37:28,359 Speaker 1: happening right around the corner. Like that freaks us out, 572 00:37:28,719 --> 00:37:30,960 Speaker 1: I guess, So now I'll take a listen to this. 573 00:37:31,200 --> 00:37:35,200 Speaker 1: After the arrest, she tried valiantly to get a bond 574 00:37:35,440 --> 00:37:38,040 Speaker 1: and get out. Don't you know that husband was hiding 575 00:37:38,160 --> 00:37:40,480 Speaker 1: under his bed. Take a listen to our cut seven 576 00:37:40,560 --> 00:37:44,160 Speaker 1: b our friends a whas the judge ruled Russell will 577 00:37:44,239 --> 00:37:47,200 Speaker 1: stay in custody, saying that the evidence presented so far 578 00:37:47,480 --> 00:37:51,200 Speaker 1: shows she was persistent in her desire to execute that 579 00:37:51,280 --> 00:37:54,960 Speaker 1: murder for higher plot. Doctor Stephanie Russell faces up to 580 00:37:55,080 --> 00:37:58,040 Speaker 1: ten years in prison. Court documents show an employee at 581 00:37:58,120 --> 00:38:01,720 Speaker 1: Russell's pediatric office came for word, saying Russell asked several 582 00:38:01,719 --> 00:38:04,800 Speaker 1: people to help her find someone to kill her ex husband. 583 00:38:05,080 --> 00:38:08,160 Speaker 1: Prosecutors argued the nature of the crime and her commitment 584 00:38:08,440 --> 00:38:11,160 Speaker 1: or reason to keep her in jail. Russell's attorneys argued 585 00:38:11,200 --> 00:38:13,440 Speaker 1: she'd never been convicted of a crime and needed to 586 00:38:13,440 --> 00:38:18,000 Speaker 1: be released on home incarceration to keep running her pediatric practice. 587 00:38:18,280 --> 00:38:21,120 Speaker 1: The judge ultimately said Russell needed to stay in custody, 588 00:38:21,160 --> 00:38:24,280 Speaker 1: believing she could be a danger. In an affidavit, text 589 00:38:24,320 --> 00:38:27,319 Speaker 1: between Russell and a witness show her seeking information about 590 00:38:27,440 --> 00:38:30,839 Speaker 1: hiring a hitman, contacting the witness several times over the 591 00:38:30,880 --> 00:38:34,280 Speaker 1: course of months. Central to this case as well Russell's 592 00:38:34,320 --> 00:38:37,960 Speaker 1: contentious divorce, during which she accused her ex husband of abuse. 593 00:38:38,239 --> 00:38:41,360 Speaker 1: Court documents show and investigation found no evidence, and he 594 00:38:41,480 --> 00:38:45,040 Speaker 1: was granted custody, a decision that is currently being appealed 595 00:38:45,480 --> 00:38:49,479 Speaker 1: to You Alexis Terreschuk. Now she's not getting bond as 596 00:38:49,480 --> 00:38:53,680 Speaker 1: she awaits the resolution of this case. Can you imagine 597 00:38:53,719 --> 00:38:58,680 Speaker 1: her and that sale oh my goodness, gnashing her teeth 598 00:38:58,760 --> 00:39:01,920 Speaker 1: and switching her Tell no way is she going to 599 00:39:02,000 --> 00:39:04,080 Speaker 1: get out on bond. She'll probably go kill the husband. 600 00:39:04,440 --> 00:39:08,480 Speaker 1: And she is facing like at least ten years in 601 00:39:08,560 --> 00:39:13,040 Speaker 1: prison for this, at least, oh ten years while you 602 00:39:13,160 --> 00:39:16,520 Speaker 1: sit in a jail cell while your children grow up 603 00:39:16,560 --> 00:39:20,600 Speaker 1: without you. Oh that is pure hell. H a double 604 00:39:20,760 --> 00:39:23,200 Speaker 1: l right there to Alexi's Terrestchuk and the rest of 605 00:39:23,239 --> 00:39:25,279 Speaker 1: the panel jump in. Remember this is not a tea 606 00:39:25,320 --> 00:39:29,040 Speaker 1: party at High Grove with Queen Elizabeth. Jump. And when 607 00:39:29,040 --> 00:39:31,200 Speaker 1: you have a thought, I'm looking at her mug shot 608 00:39:31,480 --> 00:39:35,480 Speaker 1: and she is actually wearing her scrubs, her doctor's smock. 609 00:39:35,840 --> 00:39:38,759 Speaker 1: I guess they arrested her right there at her practice. 610 00:39:38,960 --> 00:39:42,279 Speaker 1: So Alexi's terrestchuck jump. I was gonna ask where the 611 00:39:42,360 --> 00:39:45,000 Speaker 1: case stands, Alexis, So get that question in your mind. 612 00:39:45,200 --> 00:39:49,480 Speaker 1: Go ahead, Kathleen. She's facing ten years, but they may 613 00:39:49,520 --> 00:39:52,439 Speaker 1: be stacking some charges on her because of the fake 614 00:39:52,680 --> 00:39:56,759 Speaker 1: videos and causing false testimony in court. They can have 615 00:39:57,360 --> 00:40:01,680 Speaker 1: many more charges on this individual. Aside from the murder 616 00:40:01,680 --> 00:40:05,120 Speaker 1: for higher pot. The only place she can go because 617 00:40:05,120 --> 00:40:09,040 Speaker 1: she is caught red handed is depleted some kind of 618 00:40:09,080 --> 00:40:13,360 Speaker 1: a mother insanity that the thought of losing her children 619 00:40:13,400 --> 00:40:16,520 Speaker 1: pushed her over the edge. So alexis terresta crime online 620 00:40:16,560 --> 00:40:20,160 Speaker 1: dot com. Where does the case stand? She is facing 621 00:40:20,200 --> 00:40:23,640 Speaker 1: an indictment and she is behind bars. She is waiting 622 00:40:23,680 --> 00:40:26,239 Speaker 1: for the next hearing, and she's not she has been 623 00:40:26,239 --> 00:40:28,839 Speaker 1: denied vond she did, You were exactly right, she asked. 624 00:40:28,880 --> 00:40:31,040 Speaker 1: She said, can I go work with my patients? They 625 00:40:31,040 --> 00:40:33,680 Speaker 1: don't have anyone else to help them, which you heard 626 00:40:33,719 --> 00:40:36,520 Speaker 1: from the local news reporting patients were showing up thing, 627 00:40:36,520 --> 00:40:38,960 Speaker 1: I need my kids records, My kids need to see 628 00:40:39,000 --> 00:40:42,560 Speaker 1: a doctor, and they were having trouble even getting that. 629 00:40:42,719 --> 00:40:44,719 Speaker 1: But but Joe, she said, no way, You're staying locked 630 00:40:44,800 --> 00:40:48,520 Speaker 1: up with him bar. She is awaiting indictment, which means 631 00:40:48,600 --> 00:40:51,800 Speaker 1: that will be put before and and panel to grand jury. 632 00:40:52,880 --> 00:40:57,959 Speaker 1: We wait as justice unfoalds Nancy Grace Crime Story signing off, 633 00:40:58,200 --> 00:40:58,920 Speaker 1: Goodbye friend,