1 00:00:01,480 --> 00:00:04,280 Speaker 1: Welcome to Stuff you should know, a production of I 2 00:00:04,360 --> 00:00:13,160 Speaker 1: Heart Radio. Hey you welcome to the podcast. I'm Josh, 3 00:00:13,200 --> 00:00:16,000 Speaker 1: and there's Chuck and Jerry's here too. So it's a 4 00:00:16,040 --> 00:00:19,200 Speaker 1: good old fashioned bout of stuff you should know. Ready 5 00:00:19,200 --> 00:00:23,360 Speaker 1: to kick you in the duff. Oh my gosh, about 6 00:00:23,520 --> 00:00:29,440 Speaker 1: where we a sickness? Yeah, some some would say, oh dear, 7 00:00:30,240 --> 00:00:33,280 Speaker 1: I'm ready for this one. I'm so excited because awesome, 8 00:00:33,360 --> 00:00:38,199 Speaker 1: I understand genetics and chemistry like I've never understood it 9 00:00:38,200 --> 00:00:41,480 Speaker 1: before in my life. Well, I think that a little 10 00:00:41,520 --> 00:00:44,240 Speaker 1: credit goes to our palagraphs or who has a knack 11 00:00:44,320 --> 00:00:48,360 Speaker 1: for explaining very complex science stuff. Uh. And we also 12 00:00:48,440 --> 00:00:51,519 Speaker 1: need to shout out, as usual when it comes to science. 13 00:00:52,560 --> 00:00:55,680 Speaker 1: A kid's website, which is in this case Frontiers for 14 00:00:55,800 --> 00:00:58,720 Speaker 1: Young Minds. That was a really good one. Yeah. They 15 00:00:58,720 --> 00:01:03,320 Speaker 1: had a pretty good breakdown on albinism. Not albinism, let's 16 00:01:03,320 --> 00:01:05,160 Speaker 1: just get that out of the way. Yeah. And I 17 00:01:05,200 --> 00:01:09,080 Speaker 1: also tried to find out it it doesn't seem appropriate 18 00:01:09,280 --> 00:01:13,880 Speaker 1: to say albinos. Uh. I didn't expressly see that anywhere, 19 00:01:13,880 --> 00:01:16,320 Speaker 1: but it just it seems like with the how we 20 00:01:16,440 --> 00:01:19,040 Speaker 1: refer to things these days, that that that that stands 21 00:01:19,040 --> 00:01:21,920 Speaker 1: out as something that we shouldn't do. Certainly did you 22 00:01:21,920 --> 00:01:25,839 Speaker 1: find that though I did not, I didn't um, although 23 00:01:25,880 --> 00:01:29,160 Speaker 1: there are all sorts of like um like pro social 24 00:01:29,520 --> 00:01:33,480 Speaker 1: sites for people with albinism all over the place. I'm 25 00:01:33,520 --> 00:01:35,520 Speaker 1: surprised we didn't run into that, but because I saw 26 00:01:35,600 --> 00:01:38,880 Speaker 1: it used. But I'm gonna err on the side of 27 00:01:38,880 --> 00:01:44,800 Speaker 1: caution and just say albinism, yeah, totally, or people with 28 00:01:44,840 --> 00:01:50,840 Speaker 1: albinism right well sure, or plants. Yeah, that's that's something 29 00:01:50,880 --> 00:01:53,920 Speaker 1: that came up. Like certainly you've you're familiar that you know, 30 00:01:54,120 --> 00:01:57,320 Speaker 1: not all it's not just people who can have albinism, 31 00:01:57,760 --> 00:02:00,600 Speaker 1: but that um animals can too. Every once in a 32 00:02:00,600 --> 00:02:03,840 Speaker 1: while you hear about it very rare like um uh, 33 00:02:03,920 --> 00:02:06,360 Speaker 1: like a shark with albinism or like you said, an 34 00:02:06,360 --> 00:02:10,359 Speaker 1: alligator with albinism. It's just so um stark and surprising. 35 00:02:10,600 --> 00:02:13,320 Speaker 1: One of the reasons why is because it's exceedingly rare 36 00:02:13,840 --> 00:02:17,280 Speaker 1: in the animal kingdom. UM. But it's still around, and 37 00:02:17,400 --> 00:02:20,400 Speaker 1: it's not just mammals that can have albinism too, although 38 00:02:20,639 --> 00:02:22,680 Speaker 1: it would make a lot more sense if it was 39 00:02:22,840 --> 00:02:26,080 Speaker 1: just mammals that got it because it affects a very 40 00:02:26,120 --> 00:02:31,440 Speaker 1: specific part of the body, the Melana sites, which we'll 41 00:02:31,440 --> 00:02:35,079 Speaker 1: talk about in great, great, great detail a little bit um. 42 00:02:35,880 --> 00:02:40,360 Speaker 1: But but that like, uh, like a whole cascade of 43 00:02:40,400 --> 00:02:43,640 Speaker 1: events goes from or it takes place within those Melana sites, 44 00:02:43,680 --> 00:02:46,919 Speaker 1: and any part of that can get messed up or disordered. 45 00:02:47,320 --> 00:02:50,400 Speaker 1: And those those are what are the basis of the 46 00:02:50,440 --> 00:02:53,040 Speaker 1: different types of albanism, as we'll see. Yeah, and you 47 00:02:53,040 --> 00:02:55,800 Speaker 1: know the reason that you you indicated that it was 48 00:02:55,800 --> 00:02:58,919 Speaker 1: super rare to see like a guerilla with albinism, although 49 00:02:58,960 --> 00:03:01,680 Speaker 1: you can see that's because and we'll get into the 50 00:03:01,680 --> 00:03:06,280 Speaker 1: genetics more specifically, but it's in autosomal recessive trait, which 51 00:03:06,320 --> 00:03:11,040 Speaker 1: means that both of your parents have to have this 52 00:03:11,200 --> 00:03:14,960 Speaker 1: Albanism gene. So, I mean, it's rare enough in humans 53 00:03:15,200 --> 00:03:17,720 Speaker 1: when two people fall in love and mate for life 54 00:03:17,720 --> 00:03:21,320 Speaker 1: and stuff like that. But when you're counting on two 55 00:03:21,320 --> 00:03:25,240 Speaker 1: sharks that happened to swim by, that happened to have that, uh, 56 00:03:25,880 --> 00:03:28,880 Speaker 1: express their genes that way, and they happen to, you know, 57 00:03:29,720 --> 00:03:33,040 Speaker 1: get friendly with one another, bump up against one another. 58 00:03:33,360 --> 00:03:38,200 Speaker 1: Sure rub fins, however sharks do that thing. Uh, it 59 00:03:38,280 --> 00:03:41,120 Speaker 1: makes it even more rare because you're counting on um 60 00:03:41,240 --> 00:03:44,440 Speaker 1: almost just like you know, fate or destiny, not destiny. 61 00:03:44,520 --> 00:03:46,520 Speaker 1: Let's not get hippie dippy about it. But you know, 62 00:03:46,920 --> 00:03:50,520 Speaker 1: a couple of guerillas getting together in the midst that 63 00:03:50,640 --> 00:03:53,400 Speaker 1: both have this genetic gene. They wait for the mist 64 00:03:53,480 --> 00:03:56,280 Speaker 1: to settle and then they're like, no one can see 65 00:03:56,400 --> 00:03:58,640 Speaker 1: I just said genetic gene too. That's just what I know. 66 00:03:59,040 --> 00:04:02,120 Speaker 1: So yeah, for whatever reason, Chuck, whether it's like because 67 00:04:02,200 --> 00:04:04,800 Speaker 1: the populations are isolated or what, but it it does 68 00:04:04,800 --> 00:04:07,600 Speaker 1: seem to be much rarer. Albanism does seem to be 69 00:04:07,680 --> 00:04:11,400 Speaker 1: much rare in like the wild than it is among humans. 70 00:04:11,880 --> 00:04:15,480 Speaker 1: And even in like some human populations, it's like you 71 00:04:15,520 --> 00:04:17,680 Speaker 1: could call it not rare at all. Like if you 72 00:04:17,720 --> 00:04:20,479 Speaker 1: go to some parts of Africa, UM, some parts of 73 00:04:20,560 --> 00:04:24,799 Speaker 1: central or South America, UM, you'll find you'll find groups 74 00:04:24,880 --> 00:04:30,800 Speaker 1: that like are fairly small genetically speaking, um and and 75 00:04:30,839 --> 00:04:33,360 Speaker 1: the and albinism has just become kind of like an 76 00:04:33,440 --> 00:04:37,159 Speaker 1: endemic trade among the population. Yeah. And I think that's 77 00:04:37,160 --> 00:04:40,840 Speaker 1: even where the first uh, the word albino was first 78 00:04:40,960 --> 00:04:45,000 Speaker 1: used in the eighteen hundreds in Africa for people that 79 00:04:45,120 --> 00:04:47,880 Speaker 1: had albinism. And it's I think the root is the 80 00:04:47,960 --> 00:04:53,960 Speaker 1: Latin albus or albo from Spanish, Spanish and Portuguese. That's right. 81 00:04:54,880 --> 00:04:57,320 Speaker 1: So when we're talking about albinism, I think most people 82 00:04:57,320 --> 00:05:00,160 Speaker 1: probably know what we're talking about. But um use, really, 83 00:05:00,200 --> 00:05:04,719 Speaker 1: when you see a person with albinism, they have either 84 00:05:05,040 --> 00:05:08,880 Speaker 1: totally white hair or a very light colored hair UM 85 00:05:09,000 --> 00:05:14,360 Speaker 1: usually UM, little to no skin pigmentation UM. Or they 86 00:05:14,360 --> 00:05:19,320 Speaker 1: can have kind of like a yellowish or pinkish skin pigmentation. UM. 87 00:05:19,480 --> 00:05:24,000 Speaker 1: They might have eyes that lack color or seem red, 88 00:05:24,360 --> 00:05:27,080 Speaker 1: which apparently has to do with the blood vessels in 89 00:05:27,120 --> 00:05:31,159 Speaker 1: the eye reflecting the red light from well back out 90 00:05:31,200 --> 00:05:33,280 Speaker 1: at you the viewer. But all of this has to 91 00:05:33,320 --> 00:05:37,320 Speaker 1: do with a complete in total or a greatly reduced 92 00:05:37,360 --> 00:05:41,080 Speaker 1: lack of melanin. Right. Yeah, And you know, if we're 93 00:05:41,080 --> 00:05:43,279 Speaker 1: gonna crumble a myth, we can crumble the myth that 94 00:05:44,080 --> 00:05:49,120 Speaker 1: um you are not. Like, if you have albinism and 95 00:05:49,200 --> 00:05:52,200 Speaker 1: you don't have red eyes or pink eyes, then you 96 00:05:52,200 --> 00:05:54,480 Speaker 1: don't have true albinism, And that's not true at all. 97 00:05:54,880 --> 00:05:57,159 Speaker 1: There are a lot of different kinds of albinism, and 98 00:05:57,600 --> 00:06:00,960 Speaker 1: depending on the way that genes express themselves, there can 99 00:06:00,960 --> 00:06:05,640 Speaker 1: be a range of of effects on your body. Uh 100 00:06:05,800 --> 00:06:09,040 Speaker 1: ed was mentioned even with the plant Kingdom with maize, 101 00:06:09,720 --> 00:06:12,599 Speaker 1: you know, there's uh you can have and it's not 102 00:06:12,680 --> 00:06:15,600 Speaker 1: white corn. That's a different thing altogether. But if you, 103 00:06:15,680 --> 00:06:19,279 Speaker 1: because it trusts me, if you look up albanism and corn, 104 00:06:19,640 --> 00:06:21,320 Speaker 1: the first thing you're gonna see as a corn snake. 105 00:06:22,600 --> 00:06:24,960 Speaker 1: Even if you so you have to type in maze 106 00:06:25,320 --> 00:06:27,480 Speaker 1: and then you're just gonna see white corn. But there 107 00:06:27,480 --> 00:06:30,640 Speaker 1: are a few different kinds of albinism and maze, one 108 00:06:30,640 --> 00:06:33,680 Speaker 1: of which basically is no pigment or chlorophyll, and that's 109 00:06:33,720 --> 00:06:36,960 Speaker 1: not even gonna survive because it's a plant, one that 110 00:06:37,520 --> 00:06:40,520 Speaker 1: will eventually become just a regular ear of corn. And 111 00:06:40,560 --> 00:06:42,920 Speaker 1: then a third type, which is really interesting. It's striped 112 00:06:43,839 --> 00:06:47,280 Speaker 1: and some parts have that pigment in some parts don't. Yeah, 113 00:06:47,360 --> 00:06:51,080 Speaker 1: And like, if you put two different types of albinism, 114 00:06:51,080 --> 00:06:55,800 Speaker 1: whether it's corn or humans together, the person who has 115 00:06:55,880 --> 00:06:59,159 Speaker 1: both of those different traits probably won't appear to have 116 00:06:59,240 --> 00:07:04,720 Speaker 1: albinism all because you have to have matching gene mutations 117 00:07:04,800 --> 00:07:10,680 Speaker 1: to have an autosomal recessive uh uh genetic disorder in 118 00:07:10,760 --> 00:07:14,360 Speaker 1: albi is one of those, like you said, yeah, And interestingly, 119 00:07:14,560 --> 00:07:17,480 Speaker 1: if you just sort of look at it in a vacuum. 120 00:07:17,600 --> 00:07:23,840 Speaker 1: Albinism isn't necessarily harmful. Uh. There can be comorbidities, and 121 00:07:23,880 --> 00:07:26,080 Speaker 1: there can be other effects that happen, of course, like 122 00:07:26,360 --> 00:07:29,160 Speaker 1: with things like sun and sunburn and sun exposure, and 123 00:07:29,640 --> 00:07:31,840 Speaker 1: there's our vision problems that can happen, and we'll get 124 00:07:31,880 --> 00:07:36,480 Speaker 1: into all this more specifically, but just by itself, albinism 125 00:07:36,520 --> 00:07:41,080 Speaker 1: isn't necessarily harmful to a person or a population, right, 126 00:07:41,160 --> 00:07:44,680 Speaker 1: And there's different types to their syndromic and non syndromic, 127 00:07:44,720 --> 00:07:48,600 Speaker 1: and syndromic means that you usually have other related health issues, 128 00:07:48,800 --> 00:07:52,000 Speaker 1: and there are syndromic types of albinism. But one of 129 00:07:52,040 --> 00:07:57,480 Speaker 1: the things that tends to UM tends to go along 130 00:07:57,520 --> 00:07:59,920 Speaker 1: with albinism, along with the lack of skin and hair 131 00:08:00,080 --> 00:08:04,640 Speaker 1: or pigmentation UM is vision problems, which we'll talk about, 132 00:08:05,000 --> 00:08:08,360 Speaker 1: but there's other stuff too. There's they've correlated UM autism 133 00:08:08,440 --> 00:08:12,040 Speaker 1: with albinism, which I couldn't find a lot on, but 134 00:08:12,120 --> 00:08:16,040 Speaker 1: it maybe wonder there's also a correlation between vision um 135 00:08:16,080 --> 00:08:20,320 Speaker 1: problems and autism, and it's possible, they theorize because no 136 00:08:20,360 --> 00:08:23,040 Speaker 1: one knows at this point what the correlation is, but 137 00:08:23,120 --> 00:08:26,200 Speaker 1: they theorized that UM has to do with a low 138 00:08:26,360 --> 00:08:30,840 Speaker 1: level of visual input leading to autism. So it's possible 139 00:08:30,880 --> 00:08:33,000 Speaker 1: that if you have a low level of visual input 140 00:08:33,440 --> 00:08:38,400 Speaker 1: because of albinism, that could lead to autism as well, potentially. Right, 141 00:08:38,640 --> 00:08:41,079 Speaker 1: so much we don't know, but we do know that 142 00:08:41,160 --> 00:08:45,520 Speaker 1: it is albinism is a neural crest disorder. And this 143 00:08:45,640 --> 00:08:48,959 Speaker 1: basically means, I mean, we can get as as wonky 144 00:08:49,000 --> 00:08:51,520 Speaker 1: here science wise as you want to, but the easy 145 00:08:51,600 --> 00:08:56,600 Speaker 1: version is it means that it's very early in embryonic development, uh, 146 00:08:56,640 --> 00:08:58,640 Speaker 1: when a group of cells is folding into a crest, 147 00:08:59,200 --> 00:09:01,040 Speaker 1: and at this point, if something is going on with 148 00:09:01,080 --> 00:09:02,960 Speaker 1: those cells, it can affect a lot of different things 149 00:09:03,000 --> 00:09:08,480 Speaker 1: moving forward, including albinism. Right, Because those neural crests, when 150 00:09:08,480 --> 00:09:15,600 Speaker 1: they form the extremely early embryonic stage, they form um cartilage, bone, skin, 151 00:09:16,360 --> 00:09:19,320 Speaker 1: smooth muscle, cells, neurons, They differentiate into a bunch of 152 00:09:19,320 --> 00:09:22,079 Speaker 1: different stuff. But the point of that is is that 153 00:09:22,160 --> 00:09:27,160 Speaker 1: like you're the gene that is responsible for whatever type 154 00:09:27,200 --> 00:09:32,600 Speaker 1: of albinism you have, um like differentiated like really early on, 155 00:09:32,679 --> 00:09:36,280 Speaker 1: long before many other genes were active. It also it 156 00:09:36,320 --> 00:09:39,160 Speaker 1: also points out, Chuck, I think, um, something that's that's 157 00:09:39,160 --> 00:09:43,160 Speaker 1: worth mentioning that at this point because it's a genetic disorder, 158 00:09:43,200 --> 00:09:48,040 Speaker 1: and apparently in extraordinarily early in development genetic disorder. Um, 159 00:09:48,080 --> 00:09:51,320 Speaker 1: there's no treatment for albinism. Everything treating is just to 160 00:09:51,360 --> 00:09:54,440 Speaker 1: take care of the the symptoms that come along with it. 161 00:09:56,080 --> 00:09:58,840 Speaker 1: I think that's a good overviewed to get us going. 162 00:09:59,000 --> 00:10:01,400 Speaker 1: Don't you think so too. Yeah, let's let's take a break. 163 00:10:01,440 --> 00:10:04,320 Speaker 1: I smell a break. Yeah. Well, in fact, I could 164 00:10:04,360 --> 00:10:05,920 Speaker 1: just be done and we could just run a bunch 165 00:10:05,920 --> 00:10:07,280 Speaker 1: of ads if you want to do it that way. 166 00:10:07,559 --> 00:10:10,160 Speaker 1: I don't think everybody would like that. I think they'd 167 00:10:10,240 --> 00:10:12,920 Speaker 1: rather hear is muddle through albinism. All right, we'll do 168 00:10:12,960 --> 00:10:15,720 Speaker 1: a couple of messages from our sponsors and we'll be 169 00:10:15,800 --> 00:10:37,559 Speaker 1: right back as watch skul So, when most people think 170 00:10:37,559 --> 00:10:40,520 Speaker 1: of albinism, chuck Um, what they're actually thinking of is 171 00:10:40,559 --> 00:10:44,400 Speaker 1: a specific type called oculo cutaneous albinism or O c A, 172 00:10:44,920 --> 00:10:47,560 Speaker 1: which is the most prevalent form, but it's also the 173 00:10:47,600 --> 00:10:50,920 Speaker 1: most distinct form as well. Yeah, and this is you know, 174 00:10:51,360 --> 00:10:54,960 Speaker 1: if you've ever seen the musician Johnny Winner or or 175 00:10:55,320 --> 00:10:58,520 Speaker 1: Edgar Winner or uh, you know a lot of times 176 00:10:59,320 --> 00:11:02,960 Speaker 1: people with alba is m will be cast in movies unfairly. 177 00:11:03,000 --> 00:11:05,000 Speaker 1: A lot of times it's it's the bad guy because 178 00:11:05,040 --> 00:11:08,560 Speaker 1: they have a unique look. Uh, and you know, it's 179 00:11:08,640 --> 00:11:13,760 Speaker 1: Hollywood and that's kind of what they do exactly. And 180 00:11:13,760 --> 00:11:16,839 Speaker 1: we'll get into that later on too. But um, it's 181 00:11:16,840 --> 00:11:18,640 Speaker 1: funny though. I did see a couple of videos where 182 00:11:18,640 --> 00:11:23,320 Speaker 1: people with albinism sat and watched movie characters of people 183 00:11:23,320 --> 00:11:26,640 Speaker 1: with albinism and basically just sort of made fun of it. 184 00:11:27,800 --> 00:11:30,120 Speaker 1: They're just like, Okay, another bad guy. That's a surprise. 185 00:11:31,520 --> 00:11:34,040 Speaker 1: But that's exactly that's what you're talking about. It. That's 186 00:11:34,040 --> 00:11:36,560 Speaker 1: o c A. One is when you're talking about maybe 187 00:11:36,559 --> 00:11:39,400 Speaker 1: someone with the pink or red eyes, the lack of pigment, 188 00:11:39,480 --> 00:11:44,560 Speaker 1: the skin, that white white hair, right, um, and that one. 189 00:11:44,760 --> 00:11:48,400 Speaker 1: So there's supposedly there's somewhere between four and maybe even 190 00:11:48,520 --> 00:11:54,040 Speaker 1: nine different forms, but most scientists who study albinism recognize 191 00:11:54,120 --> 00:11:57,839 Speaker 1: maybe four to five different forms. The rest of them are, um, 192 00:11:57,960 --> 00:12:01,720 Speaker 1: these really really almost ex oddic rare mutations that have 193 00:12:01,800 --> 00:12:05,880 Speaker 1: occurred in these really isolated communities where albinism is actually 194 00:12:06,320 --> 00:12:09,160 Speaker 1: common enough that it just is mutating in a new form. 195 00:12:09,280 --> 00:12:12,720 Speaker 1: So most people say four to five forms. Um, And 196 00:12:12,800 --> 00:12:14,960 Speaker 1: if you're like the easygoing type, you just call it 197 00:12:15,000 --> 00:12:17,760 Speaker 1: type one type two. If you're high strung like me, 198 00:12:17,840 --> 00:12:20,440 Speaker 1: you probably call the most common one O C A 199 00:12:20,520 --> 00:12:23,760 Speaker 1: one A. There's also O C A one B, O 200 00:12:23,920 --> 00:12:27,000 Speaker 1: C A two, O C A UM three and four 201 00:12:27,040 --> 00:12:29,280 Speaker 1: and so on, actually not so on. That's that's all 202 00:12:29,320 --> 00:12:33,000 Speaker 1: of them. But the thing that all of these are, 203 00:12:33,200 --> 00:12:36,240 Speaker 1: at least most of them sharing common is that there's 204 00:12:36,280 --> 00:12:41,559 Speaker 1: either a total or complete lack of pigmentation. And then 205 00:12:41,600 --> 00:12:46,880 Speaker 1: again it affects the eyes because it's that ocular cutaneous albinism. 206 00:12:46,960 --> 00:12:51,160 Speaker 1: And so with this lack of pigmentation, that one, uh, 207 00:12:51,280 --> 00:12:54,160 Speaker 1: that's that most people think of when they think of albinism. 208 00:12:54,160 --> 00:12:59,080 Speaker 1: O C A one A there's like no pigmentation whatsoever. 209 00:12:59,760 --> 00:13:04,240 Speaker 1: And everybody with albinism has those those pigment forming cells 210 00:13:04,320 --> 00:13:08,880 Speaker 1: melana sites. It's just the for different reasons, those melano 211 00:13:08,920 --> 00:13:12,719 Speaker 1: sites are not producing pigments to varying degrees, and in 212 00:13:12,840 --> 00:13:17,040 Speaker 1: O C A one eight they're not producing pigment at all. Right, So, 213 00:13:17,120 --> 00:13:18,880 Speaker 1: like you kind of said at the beginning, if you 214 00:13:18,920 --> 00:13:22,120 Speaker 1: see someone that has the red or pinkish eyes, it's 215 00:13:22,200 --> 00:13:24,360 Speaker 1: those are the blood vessels that you're saying. Because of 216 00:13:24,400 --> 00:13:27,160 Speaker 1: the lack of pigment, and that's what's also going to 217 00:13:27,280 --> 00:13:30,040 Speaker 1: lead to those vision problems. Uh. Like you kind of 218 00:13:30,200 --> 00:13:32,400 Speaker 1: hinted at it. You know, a lot more light is 219 00:13:32,400 --> 00:13:35,640 Speaker 1: going to be entering your eye that's not being absorbed 220 00:13:35,679 --> 00:13:37,320 Speaker 1: like it would if you have pigment in your eye. 221 00:13:37,480 --> 00:13:40,720 Speaker 1: It's not being diffracted. Uh at the very least, if 222 00:13:40,760 --> 00:13:44,440 Speaker 1: you have albinism, you're probably gonna be really sensitive delight. Um. 223 00:13:44,480 --> 00:13:48,480 Speaker 1: But it can also actually damage the retina as well, right, 224 00:13:48,559 --> 00:13:51,160 Speaker 1: which is a big one. Um. As we'll see, that's 225 00:13:51,160 --> 00:13:54,000 Speaker 1: a it's a huge problem that the idea that um 226 00:13:54,040 --> 00:13:57,960 Speaker 1: it's called photophobia, like deep sensitivity to light. Yeah. Um. 227 00:13:58,080 --> 00:14:00,600 Speaker 1: And then also you you just can't see as well, 228 00:14:00,720 --> 00:14:03,679 Speaker 1: um like you can in that in turn can lead 229 00:14:03,720 --> 00:14:06,000 Speaker 1: to problems with learning in high school drops. It's like 230 00:14:06,000 --> 00:14:08,680 Speaker 1: a cascading effect that all just chickins with not enough 231 00:14:08,679 --> 00:14:12,280 Speaker 1: pigment in the eye. It's really astounding with just something 232 00:14:12,320 --> 00:14:15,360 Speaker 1: that seems kind of small has like the impacts that 233 00:14:15,480 --> 00:14:18,240 Speaker 1: it has. Yeah. And you know the great thing about 234 00:14:18,600 --> 00:14:23,040 Speaker 1: most schools systems these days is they make great efforts 235 00:14:23,160 --> 00:14:26,840 Speaker 1: for any kind of uh kid in school that has 236 00:14:26,880 --> 00:14:29,240 Speaker 1: any sort of a challenge to say like, all right, 237 00:14:29,280 --> 00:14:31,960 Speaker 1: well we have something to accommodate for that now. But 238 00:14:32,040 --> 00:14:33,560 Speaker 1: it you know, it's taken a long time to get 239 00:14:33,560 --> 00:14:34,880 Speaker 1: to this point and we still have a long way 240 00:14:34,920 --> 00:14:37,960 Speaker 1: to go. But you know, you can't imagine somebody with 241 00:14:38,000 --> 00:14:43,000 Speaker 1: albinism in the nineteen you know, thirties, forties, fifties, sixties, seventies, 242 00:14:43,840 --> 00:14:46,720 Speaker 1: and what schooling must have been like when it was 243 00:14:46,800 --> 00:14:49,840 Speaker 1: basically just like sorry, you know, you can't you obviously 244 00:14:49,880 --> 00:14:53,280 Speaker 1: can't keep up. You're struggling to learn to read, and 245 00:14:53,320 --> 00:14:55,720 Speaker 1: we don't quite know what to do with that, right 246 00:14:56,600 --> 00:14:59,760 Speaker 1: and there, and and they always punctuated with him. And 247 00:14:59,800 --> 00:15:02,280 Speaker 1: by the way, everything your classmates are saying about you 248 00:15:02,440 --> 00:15:07,480 Speaker 1: is true. Hopefully teachers are at least kind about it 249 00:15:07,520 --> 00:15:10,600 Speaker 1: even back then. Maybe, but kids are always mean. Yeah, 250 00:15:10,640 --> 00:15:14,160 Speaker 1: for sure. They're getting nicer, though, are they. That's great, man, 251 00:15:14,200 --> 00:15:17,840 Speaker 1: that's a huge improvement. Well, they are, but it's um, 252 00:15:17,920 --> 00:15:19,640 Speaker 1: I mean, obviously they're still bullying and a lot of 253 00:15:19,640 --> 00:15:21,920 Speaker 1: problems with that stuff. But the kids are getting better 254 00:15:22,000 --> 00:15:25,840 Speaker 1: because it's I think we've proven as parents and educators 255 00:15:25,840 --> 00:15:28,520 Speaker 1: that that can be taught, that you start them at 256 00:15:28,560 --> 00:15:31,480 Speaker 1: a young age teaching about facial differences. Or just any 257 00:15:31,560 --> 00:15:34,600 Speaker 1: kind of differences and that you know that we're all 258 00:15:34,640 --> 00:15:36,960 Speaker 1: the same. Uh. You know, it sounds very free to 259 00:15:36,960 --> 00:15:38,120 Speaker 1: be you and me, but we're all the same on 260 00:15:38,160 --> 00:15:41,560 Speaker 1: the inside. And so that kind of like teaching that 261 00:15:41,600 --> 00:15:45,120 Speaker 1: stuff actually works. That's why it's frustrating when people push 262 00:15:45,160 --> 00:15:47,640 Speaker 1: back on that kind of thing. Yeah, I don't want 263 00:15:47,680 --> 00:15:50,360 Speaker 1: Mike could be nice. You can't make my kid be nice. 264 00:15:50,400 --> 00:15:54,240 Speaker 1: It's a First Amendment issue. That was just a little 265 00:15:54,280 --> 00:15:56,960 Speaker 1: soapox moment for me. I like it. I put one 266 00:15:56,960 --> 00:16:00,480 Speaker 1: foot up on there with you too, Thank you so 267 00:16:00,640 --> 00:16:03,880 Speaker 1: um so there's room for you in eat chuck. Yeah, 268 00:16:04,000 --> 00:16:07,440 Speaker 1: Jerry's always up here. Of course she won't stop. It's 269 00:16:07,480 --> 00:16:09,760 Speaker 1: a little much if you ask me, so, chuck. Before 270 00:16:09,800 --> 00:16:11,960 Speaker 1: we keep moving on, because I think we need to 271 00:16:11,960 --> 00:16:16,760 Speaker 1: talk about that social aspect of albinism now. Um but 272 00:16:16,760 --> 00:16:18,400 Speaker 1: but before we hit that, I want to say, there's 273 00:16:18,440 --> 00:16:21,160 Speaker 1: one other thing that one of the big differentiators about 274 00:16:21,360 --> 00:16:24,960 Speaker 1: between the different types of albinism is, like we were saying, 275 00:16:25,640 --> 00:16:29,960 Speaker 1: at what point in the process of creating melanin that 276 00:16:30,440 --> 00:16:36,240 Speaker 1: the pigmentation um is disrupted, means that you could actually 277 00:16:36,280 --> 00:16:40,880 Speaker 1: produce some levels of pigment or some different types of pigment. Like, 278 00:16:40,920 --> 00:16:43,400 Speaker 1: we have a couple of types of pigment that we 279 00:16:43,480 --> 00:16:47,640 Speaker 1: produce us humans. You melanin, that's one. That's the money melanin. 280 00:16:47,760 --> 00:16:51,400 Speaker 1: Everybody thinks about its like it produces like the browns 281 00:16:51,440 --> 00:16:53,480 Speaker 1: and everything like that. It gives you your tan if 282 00:16:53,520 --> 00:16:56,080 Speaker 1: you have brown or dark hair, that's all you melanin. 283 00:16:56,480 --> 00:17:00,080 Speaker 1: But there's also fail melanin, which is kind of a 284 00:17:00,120 --> 00:17:05,320 Speaker 1: red yellow pigment producer. And people can have types of 285 00:17:05,359 --> 00:17:10,480 Speaker 1: albinism where you're producing uh no you melanin whatsoever, but 286 00:17:10,600 --> 00:17:14,560 Speaker 1: plenty of yellow red pao melanin. So that will adjust 287 00:17:15,280 --> 00:17:17,879 Speaker 1: the different kinds of skin pigments you have. And sometimes 288 00:17:17,880 --> 00:17:20,040 Speaker 1: you'll see people with albinism we have like you know, 289 00:17:20,359 --> 00:17:23,639 Speaker 1: totally pale skin, but like a big shock of yellow 290 00:17:23,680 --> 00:17:27,480 Speaker 1: gold hair. They're producing plenty of phao melanin. Just no 291 00:17:27,640 --> 00:17:30,760 Speaker 1: you ma melanin. And those are the different like the 292 00:17:30,800 --> 00:17:34,840 Speaker 1: different gradiations of of albinism have to do with how 293 00:17:34,920 --> 00:17:38,360 Speaker 1: much in what type of melanin can escape out into 294 00:17:38,400 --> 00:17:41,440 Speaker 1: the skin, into the eyes and into the hair. Yeah, 295 00:17:41,480 --> 00:17:46,000 Speaker 1: And interestingly, birds and mammals are the only living things 296 00:17:46,040 --> 00:17:49,680 Speaker 1: that have melanostes, which are those cells that produced the melanin. 297 00:17:50,720 --> 00:17:53,600 Speaker 1: So this is why you're not going to see a 298 00:17:53,600 --> 00:17:56,600 Speaker 1: lot of bright colored mammals. Like, you're not gonna see 299 00:17:56,600 --> 00:17:59,359 Speaker 1: a lot of bright green or blue mammals. Uh. And 300 00:17:59,400 --> 00:18:01,360 Speaker 1: then when its to birds to but you're like, wait 301 00:18:01,440 --> 00:18:05,320 Speaker 1: a minute, why are humans you know, basically shades of 302 00:18:05,440 --> 00:18:09,119 Speaker 1: sort of brown? Uh? And why can birds be like 303 00:18:09,480 --> 00:18:11,920 Speaker 1: pink and orange and red. It's for a lot of reasons. 304 00:18:11,920 --> 00:18:14,240 Speaker 1: So we talked about some of these before. But one 305 00:18:14,280 --> 00:18:17,000 Speaker 1: of the reasons is their diet, like in the case 306 00:18:17,040 --> 00:18:20,520 Speaker 1: of the flamingo, of flamingo is white except uh for 307 00:18:20,560 --> 00:18:24,800 Speaker 1: their diet, which turns them red or pink. Yeah, they can. Um. 308 00:18:25,080 --> 00:18:28,280 Speaker 1: They can also produce certain kinds of chains of amino 309 00:18:28,400 --> 00:18:31,880 Speaker 1: acids that produce blue or green. They can combine some 310 00:18:31,920 --> 00:18:35,159 Speaker 1: of the pigments they produce with some structural stuff, like 311 00:18:35,480 --> 00:18:37,920 Speaker 1: in in the way that their feathers are built, to 312 00:18:38,480 --> 00:18:42,040 Speaker 1: create entirely new colors. Um. There's a lot of stuff 313 00:18:42,080 --> 00:18:44,119 Speaker 1: you can do, but that's typically birds. And the reason 314 00:18:44,160 --> 00:18:46,960 Speaker 1: they think that birds are so colorful is because the 315 00:18:47,240 --> 00:18:49,800 Speaker 1: visual acuity in the bird world is a little more 316 00:18:49,840 --> 00:18:53,280 Speaker 1: important even in the human world. As important as it 317 00:18:53,359 --> 00:18:56,080 Speaker 1: is for us. But there's also another thing that that 318 00:18:56,240 --> 00:18:59,240 Speaker 1: um melanin does is it can provide like structure and 319 00:18:59,320 --> 00:19:02,840 Speaker 1: toughness UM. Like if you look at the outer layer 320 00:19:02,880 --> 00:19:06,880 Speaker 1: of fur and like a cold um, like a cold 321 00:19:06,960 --> 00:19:12,080 Speaker 1: dwelling animal, that's usually gonna be fairly dark UM. And 322 00:19:12,200 --> 00:19:14,720 Speaker 1: one of the reasons why it's dark is because it's 323 00:19:15,000 --> 00:19:18,119 Speaker 1: also providing like structure and toughness to that that outer 324 00:19:18,240 --> 00:19:23,800 Speaker 1: layer for not just you know, UM, preventing U light 325 00:19:23,880 --> 00:19:26,880 Speaker 1: to get through, UV to get through, right, But then 326 00:19:26,960 --> 00:19:31,040 Speaker 1: you start scritching underneath, you get to that little baby soft, 327 00:19:31,800 --> 00:19:35,800 Speaker 1: lighter colored undercoat. Even with my dog Charlie, who's got 328 00:19:35,800 --> 00:19:38,080 Speaker 1: the longer hair, she's you know, she has an outer 329 00:19:38,160 --> 00:19:41,240 Speaker 1: coat and an undercoat, and that undercoat is different. It 330 00:19:41,520 --> 00:19:44,600 Speaker 1: feels a little different, it looks a little different. The 331 00:19:44,640 --> 00:19:47,480 Speaker 1: exception to that, of course, is polar bears. They're not 332 00:19:47,520 --> 00:19:50,800 Speaker 1: actually producing any kind of white pigment. I think it's 333 00:19:50,880 --> 00:19:54,600 Speaker 1: the structure of their um, their hairs, their clear hollow tubes, 334 00:19:54,680 --> 00:19:58,440 Speaker 1: so they refract light so that all of the light 335 00:19:58,520 --> 00:20:01,760 Speaker 1: comes back at you. Yeah, just google green polar bear 336 00:20:01,880 --> 00:20:04,200 Speaker 1: if you want to freak your kids out a little bit. 337 00:20:04,520 --> 00:20:08,280 Speaker 1: Oh yeah, yeah, it sounds sousical. It's kind of a 338 00:20:08,359 --> 00:20:13,120 Speaker 1: green polar bear. So while we're on that though we talk, 339 00:20:13,200 --> 00:20:14,520 Speaker 1: you know, I want to talk a little bit about 340 00:20:14,560 --> 00:20:19,240 Speaker 1: the um sort of social implicate implications of having Albanism. 341 00:20:19,320 --> 00:20:22,920 Speaker 1: And you know, it's interesting that it's much more common 342 00:20:23,440 --> 00:20:26,879 Speaker 1: in parts of Africa, especially in Sub Saharan Africa, but 343 00:20:26,960 --> 00:20:29,600 Speaker 1: that's also where you can find some of the most 344 00:20:30,080 --> 00:20:34,960 Speaker 1: uh stigma and people being ostracized, which is I don't know, 345 00:20:35,000 --> 00:20:37,359 Speaker 1: it's really kind of sad that it seems like something 346 00:20:37,359 --> 00:20:39,879 Speaker 1: that is more common might be accepted a little bit more, 347 00:20:39,920 --> 00:20:42,120 Speaker 1: but that's not really the case, is it. No, it's not. 348 00:20:42,280 --> 00:20:46,400 Speaker 1: And unfortunately the reason why is because people with Albanism 349 00:20:46,480 --> 00:20:50,920 Speaker 1: in Africa are in some parts of Africa. We've learned 350 00:20:51,040 --> 00:20:53,080 Speaker 1: over the years you can't just be like in Africa 351 00:20:53,160 --> 00:20:57,800 Speaker 1: because it's just so ridiculously different culturally and geographically. But 352 00:20:57,880 --> 00:21:01,760 Speaker 1: in some parts of Africa, I believe Bigeria, Um parts 353 00:21:01,760 --> 00:21:05,840 Speaker 1: of Nigeria, if you're if you have alb albinism, you 354 00:21:06,080 --> 00:21:11,080 Speaker 1: are extraordinarily valuable. I think the body of a person 355 00:21:11,119 --> 00:21:14,200 Speaker 1: with albinism is worth about seventy five thousand U S 356 00:21:14,320 --> 00:21:18,800 Speaker 1: dollars in in places where people are living on like 357 00:21:18,920 --> 00:21:22,320 Speaker 1: six dollars a day is for like medical research. No 358 00:21:24,200 --> 00:21:25,639 Speaker 1: oh no, no no, no, I know you're talking about for 359 00:21:25,720 --> 00:21:30,240 Speaker 1: witchcraft and sourcery. They're considered the bone. They there's lower, 360 00:21:30,359 --> 00:21:33,640 Speaker 1: there's so here's here's the problem. Um. Not only are 361 00:21:33,640 --> 00:21:37,240 Speaker 1: people with albinism subject to being ostracized and isolated because 362 00:21:37,240 --> 00:21:41,160 Speaker 1: they're different and they look different the people and people 363 00:21:41,359 --> 00:21:43,920 Speaker 1: not just in Africa, but in other places where education 364 00:21:44,000 --> 00:21:47,119 Speaker 1: is less prevalent and less standardized and science is less 365 00:21:47,440 --> 00:21:53,840 Speaker 1: um relied on. I guess um, there's just a lot 366 00:21:53,880 --> 00:21:58,040 Speaker 1: of myth and lower surrounding albinism, and so people think 367 00:21:58,040 --> 00:22:01,080 Speaker 1: that it's like contagious. So you just want to stay 368 00:22:01,080 --> 00:22:04,040 Speaker 1: away from those people because you don't want to catch it. Um. 369 00:22:04,080 --> 00:22:06,800 Speaker 1: And then all the way across the spectrum to their 370 00:22:06,840 --> 00:22:09,120 Speaker 1: bones are made of gold dust. And if you get 371 00:22:09,160 --> 00:22:13,600 Speaker 1: your hands on the cadaver of an person without albinism, 372 00:22:13,680 --> 00:22:16,200 Speaker 1: you can you can create potions and sell them to 373 00:22:16,280 --> 00:22:19,400 Speaker 1: people in in the wholesale market. You can. You would 374 00:22:19,400 --> 00:22:22,800 Speaker 1: pay seventy five dollars for the the corpse of a 375 00:22:22,840 --> 00:22:25,760 Speaker 1: person with albinism. And it happens like people get murdered 376 00:22:26,400 --> 00:22:30,200 Speaker 1: for their bodies because they're they have albinism, and it's 377 00:22:30,280 --> 00:22:33,840 Speaker 1: just it's it's a despicable practice and trade. But part 378 00:22:33,880 --> 00:22:36,960 Speaker 1: of it is like figuring out how to get across 379 00:22:37,040 --> 00:22:41,320 Speaker 1: to like these large groups and populations the science behind 380 00:22:41,359 --> 00:22:43,239 Speaker 1: all this, and that at the very least it's not 381 00:22:43,320 --> 00:22:48,480 Speaker 1: contagious and at best their their bones are not filled 382 00:22:48,520 --> 00:22:51,200 Speaker 1: with gold dust, so please stop chopping them up kind 383 00:22:51,200 --> 00:22:54,560 Speaker 1: of thing. Yeah, And as far as you know here 384 00:22:54,600 --> 00:22:57,959 Speaker 1: in the United States, if you know this is like 385 00:22:58,000 --> 00:23:00,320 Speaker 1: we talked about, you know, kids teasing or stay airing. 386 00:23:00,720 --> 00:23:03,919 Speaker 1: As as parents and educators, you should be armed, I 387 00:23:03,960 --> 00:23:07,199 Speaker 1: think with the barest bones of information at least to 388 00:23:07,240 --> 00:23:09,240 Speaker 1: be able to say, oh, well, you know, that is 389 00:23:09,240 --> 00:23:12,200 Speaker 1: somebody with albinism and that means their body doesn't produce 390 00:23:12,240 --> 00:23:14,360 Speaker 1: pigment and so their skin looks different than ours does. 391 00:23:14,960 --> 00:23:16,679 Speaker 1: And if your parents you can just leave it at that. 392 00:23:18,160 --> 00:23:20,200 Speaker 1: And that's really all you have to do. Like, if 393 00:23:20,200 --> 00:23:22,600 Speaker 1: you want to listen to this episode and get into 394 00:23:22,840 --> 00:23:28,359 Speaker 1: uh Melana sites, knock yourself out, that's parenting plus. But 395 00:23:28,400 --> 00:23:31,000 Speaker 1: at the very least you should be able to describe it. 396 00:23:31,240 --> 00:23:32,840 Speaker 1: And like I know when I was a kid and 397 00:23:32,880 --> 00:23:34,400 Speaker 1: this is not a knock on my parents. They were 398 00:23:34,400 --> 00:23:37,040 Speaker 1: both smart people and teachers. But but just scared to 399 00:23:37,119 --> 00:23:40,240 Speaker 1: death of people with albinism. No, no, but they probably 400 00:23:40,240 --> 00:23:43,520 Speaker 1: would not have known what to tell me. Uh. They 401 00:23:43,520 --> 00:23:46,760 Speaker 1: probably would have said, oh, that's an albi now full stop, 402 00:23:46,960 --> 00:23:50,000 Speaker 1: steer clear of them. That's contagious. No, I don't think 403 00:23:50,080 --> 00:23:52,920 Speaker 1: that either. But I just think we have a duty 404 00:23:52,960 --> 00:23:56,720 Speaker 1: these days, like to educate ourselves to the to the 405 00:23:56,760 --> 00:24:00,760 Speaker 1: lowest level of understanding other people, you know, yeah, you know. 406 00:24:00,800 --> 00:24:03,680 Speaker 1: That's something that I've carried with myself for many, many years, 407 00:24:03,760 --> 00:24:06,320 Speaker 1: is like people didn't explain the why to me, and 408 00:24:06,359 --> 00:24:09,680 Speaker 1: so there didn't seem to be purposed to anything. I couldn't. 409 00:24:09,880 --> 00:24:13,160 Speaker 1: I couldn't time to appreciate the things that the reasons 410 00:24:13,240 --> 00:24:15,600 Speaker 1: why we were doing things, the strategy to football, it 411 00:24:15,680 --> 00:24:17,720 Speaker 1: was just get out there and make sure that person 412 00:24:17,840 --> 00:24:20,960 Speaker 1: doesn't get past you kind of stuff, no reason why doesn't. 413 00:24:21,040 --> 00:24:24,000 Speaker 1: And it's like a stupid example, but it's a good 414 00:24:24,040 --> 00:24:26,520 Speaker 1: case of it that like nobody stopped and said, here's 415 00:24:26,560 --> 00:24:29,000 Speaker 1: the grand picture, here's the grand scheme of things. And 416 00:24:29,040 --> 00:24:30,840 Speaker 1: the more information I would have had, the more I 417 00:24:30,840 --> 00:24:34,280 Speaker 1: would have appreciated life and probably appreciated other people too, 418 00:24:34,480 --> 00:24:36,600 Speaker 1: So I agree with you completely. I think that that 419 00:24:36,760 --> 00:24:39,320 Speaker 1: is that is a part and parcel with making the 420 00:24:39,320 --> 00:24:43,040 Speaker 1: world a better places is providing more information. Um two 421 00:24:43,119 --> 00:24:47,760 Speaker 1: kids especially. Yeah, and again this is slightly tangential and soapboxy, 422 00:24:47,840 --> 00:24:50,320 Speaker 1: but I think in our day, and certainly before our 423 00:24:50,400 --> 00:24:52,399 Speaker 1: day as kids, there was a lot of just like 424 00:24:52,400 --> 00:24:55,000 Speaker 1: shut up and don't ask questions sort of attitude. Yeah, 425 00:24:55,040 --> 00:24:58,000 Speaker 1: that's a terrible thing to do. You should do is 426 00:24:58,040 --> 00:25:01,840 Speaker 1: ask questions and get questions sort. My lord, it's frustrating 427 00:25:02,480 --> 00:25:04,920 Speaker 1: the whole like because I said so kind of thing, 428 00:25:05,200 --> 00:25:08,600 Speaker 1: which is so prevalent when we were kids. As I understand, 429 00:25:08,640 --> 00:25:10,400 Speaker 1: it's going the way of the dinosaur, which I think 430 00:25:10,480 --> 00:25:13,880 Speaker 1: is great. It is, but boy, when you accidentally catch 431 00:25:13,920 --> 00:25:17,199 Speaker 1: yourself saying it, that's apparent you're just like, oh no, 432 00:25:17,359 --> 00:25:20,399 Speaker 1: i'll be right back. I'm gonna go flog myself. Oh 433 00:25:20,480 --> 00:25:22,840 Speaker 1: I'm sure there's plenty of parent groups just waiting to 434 00:25:22,840 --> 00:25:26,399 Speaker 1: flog you outside your door too. Yeah. The because I 435 00:25:26,400 --> 00:25:29,320 Speaker 1: said so crowd, Yeah yeah, they're like the Guilty Remnant, 436 00:25:29,320 --> 00:25:31,320 Speaker 1: the Leftovers. They just stand outside your house and smoke, 437 00:25:32,960 --> 00:25:35,280 Speaker 1: which were two episodes away from finishing by the way 438 00:25:35,320 --> 00:25:39,280 Speaker 1: that appens tonight. That's great man. Congratulations from from all 439 00:25:39,320 --> 00:25:42,600 Speaker 1: of the stuff you should know listeners. I just have 440 00:25:42,720 --> 00:25:44,159 Speaker 1: to say, and I knew this was the show that 441 00:25:44,440 --> 00:25:48,440 Speaker 1: got progressively better and more bonkers, but boy, what they're 442 00:25:48,440 --> 00:25:50,920 Speaker 1: thrown down in season three. I am all over it. 443 00:25:51,200 --> 00:25:54,480 Speaker 1: I don't believe I made it that far. What. Yeah, 444 00:25:54,480 --> 00:25:56,359 Speaker 1: and I thought you I thought you like said you 445 00:25:56,359 --> 00:25:58,440 Speaker 1: wish you could go back and do it over again. Yeah, yeah, 446 00:25:58,440 --> 00:26:00,199 Speaker 1: the first time. I don't think I realized and then 447 00:26:00,760 --> 00:26:05,920 Speaker 1: kept going after season one. Yeah, yeah, there were three seasons. Okay, 448 00:26:05,960 --> 00:26:09,640 Speaker 1: well good, I've got some sticks and I gotta reframe everything. Now. 449 00:26:09,720 --> 00:26:13,640 Speaker 1: I'll watch this on your recommendation. So, Chuck, I feel 450 00:26:13,680 --> 00:26:15,560 Speaker 1: like we can button this up by saying society has 451 00:26:15,560 --> 00:26:18,040 Speaker 1: a long way to go toward learning how to treat 452 00:26:18,080 --> 00:26:22,520 Speaker 1: people with albinism. Equally agreed. Yeah, but let's do that. 453 00:26:23,080 --> 00:26:25,240 Speaker 1: All right, Let's do that, and let's take a break, 454 00:26:25,600 --> 00:26:28,240 Speaker 1: and we'll talk a little bit more about what limited 455 00:26:28,280 --> 00:26:30,359 Speaker 1: amount we know about what causes this right after this 456 00:26:39,600 --> 00:26:52,800 Speaker 1: as watched by SKA. All right, so we're back. We 457 00:26:52,960 --> 00:26:55,679 Speaker 1: know and we've talked about this already that it's a 458 00:26:55,720 --> 00:27:00,320 Speaker 1: recessive gene that causes albinism. But it's it's like, all right, 459 00:27:00,359 --> 00:27:02,480 Speaker 1: so that's a recessive gene. This is like when you're 460 00:27:02,480 --> 00:27:06,760 Speaker 1: not off in biology class when I woke up. You 461 00:27:06,800 --> 00:27:08,520 Speaker 1: wake up and you go, Okay, well, I know the 462 00:27:08,520 --> 00:27:12,960 Speaker 1: answer is a recessive gene. But how does that happen? Uh? 463 00:27:13,000 --> 00:27:15,440 Speaker 1: And the secret to it all is a little protein 464 00:27:15,960 --> 00:27:21,240 Speaker 1: called tirasinase. Right, how would you pronounce it? I just 465 00:27:21,359 --> 00:27:28,400 Speaker 1: exactly like that taraskay, those tyros sinase. But that's how 466 00:27:28,440 --> 00:27:31,440 Speaker 1: it's spelled tyrosinas. But tarrasin is surely is the way 467 00:27:31,480 --> 00:27:34,520 Speaker 1: that you'd say, right, I think probably. So, So that's 468 00:27:34,520 --> 00:27:36,960 Speaker 1: the one that's the one that is like the the 469 00:27:37,080 --> 00:27:43,000 Speaker 1: catalyst for basically everything that comes after to create melanin. Right, 470 00:27:43,080 --> 00:27:47,320 Speaker 1: whether it's you melanin or phao melanin doesn't matter. Tarrasse 471 00:27:47,400 --> 00:27:50,240 Speaker 1: is like the beginning of it. And so in that 472 00:27:50,400 --> 00:27:53,040 Speaker 1: O C A one A, the type of albinism where 473 00:27:53,080 --> 00:27:59,080 Speaker 1: you just utterly lack of pigmentation altogether, tarrasinse um is 474 00:27:59,119 --> 00:28:03,360 Speaker 1: an impacted. So when your terracins is impacted, your melanin 475 00:28:03,400 --> 00:28:06,720 Speaker 1: production just doesn't happen. In your melano sytes and therefore 476 00:28:06,760 --> 00:28:11,480 Speaker 1: you have O C A one A albinism. That's right. Uh, 477 00:28:11,520 --> 00:28:16,000 Speaker 1: And if that happens early on, that whole chain reaction 478 00:28:16,119 --> 00:28:18,119 Speaker 1: is going to shut down, and that's when you're going 479 00:28:18,160 --> 00:28:21,760 Speaker 1: to have the complete lack of pigmentation. In the other forms, 480 00:28:22,119 --> 00:28:25,439 Speaker 1: it might affected at different stages along the way of 481 00:28:25,520 --> 00:28:28,159 Speaker 1: that melanin creation. So that's why you might you know, 482 00:28:28,200 --> 00:28:31,359 Speaker 1: not be totally absent of pigmentation. Yeah. And again, like 483 00:28:31,400 --> 00:28:35,240 Speaker 1: there's different slightly different processes that produce you melanin and 484 00:28:35,400 --> 00:28:39,000 Speaker 1: other processes that produce FO melanin, so um any any 485 00:28:39,040 --> 00:28:41,880 Speaker 1: one of those things. It's a very like complex intricate 486 00:28:42,040 --> 00:28:45,880 Speaker 1: production to to create melanin. And so that means that 487 00:28:45,920 --> 00:28:48,320 Speaker 1: there's a lot of different points where that that process 488 00:28:48,360 --> 00:28:52,520 Speaker 1: can break down. It's just I just find that extremely fascinating. 489 00:28:52,760 --> 00:28:55,360 Speaker 1: And then also one other thing I find fascinating when 490 00:28:55,360 --> 00:28:59,800 Speaker 1: you talked about um autosomal recessive traits, did you mention 491 00:28:59,840 --> 00:29:04,520 Speaker 1: that means that two parents can both have the gene 492 00:29:05,320 --> 00:29:09,360 Speaker 1: for albinism, but neither one have albinism, but they're considered 493 00:29:09,440 --> 00:29:12,760 Speaker 1: carriers and so they can pass it along or not 494 00:29:12,880 --> 00:29:17,080 Speaker 1: pass it along to their kids. Well, yeah, because I mean, 495 00:29:17,360 --> 00:29:19,440 Speaker 1: and I think this is something that you would often 496 00:29:19,480 --> 00:29:23,320 Speaker 1: see is two parents without albinism have a child with albinism, 497 00:29:23,320 --> 00:29:25,560 Speaker 1: and someone might just be like, well, how does that work. Well, 498 00:29:25,560 --> 00:29:28,520 Speaker 1: it's just very easy because you have to have both parents, 499 00:29:28,640 --> 00:29:32,040 Speaker 1: and if obviously these parents didn't have both of their 500 00:29:32,080 --> 00:29:34,560 Speaker 1: parents that had that genetic mutation, then they're not gonna 501 00:29:34,600 --> 00:29:37,000 Speaker 1: have it. But it's interesting. It's one of those things 502 00:29:37,000 --> 00:29:40,960 Speaker 1: where you sort of like the sharks sharks bumping in 503 00:29:41,000 --> 00:29:44,960 Speaker 1: the night. Did you say sharks first? I think I 504 00:29:45,040 --> 00:29:48,080 Speaker 1: did say sharks. That's a whole different problem. That's bumping 505 00:29:48,080 --> 00:29:52,880 Speaker 1: in the night. H sharks bumping in the night. It's like, uh, 506 00:29:53,200 --> 00:29:56,320 Speaker 1: you wouldn't know this. You probably wouldn't know this about 507 00:29:56,360 --> 00:30:00,440 Speaker 1: yourself if you only had one, if you were just carrier, 508 00:30:00,520 --> 00:30:03,160 Speaker 1: you know what I mean, right, So you probably wouldn't 509 00:30:03,160 --> 00:30:05,760 Speaker 1: find this out until you had a kid exactly. And 510 00:30:05,880 --> 00:30:07,640 Speaker 1: that was that's one reason why there's a lot of 511 00:30:07,640 --> 00:30:11,640 Speaker 1: lower and myth around um albinism in less educated areas, 512 00:30:11,680 --> 00:30:14,880 Speaker 1: like there's like a question of paternity, like this can't 513 00:30:14,920 --> 00:30:18,120 Speaker 1: possibly be my kid um that kind of thing. But 514 00:30:18,200 --> 00:30:21,080 Speaker 1: then on the same token too, as far as passing 515 00:30:21,080 --> 00:30:26,120 Speaker 1: it along Uh, if you have albinism and you fall 516 00:30:26,160 --> 00:30:29,560 Speaker 1: in love and reproduce with a person who doesn't have albinism, 517 00:30:29,600 --> 00:30:32,400 Speaker 1: but it also is in a carrier of albinism, your 518 00:30:32,480 --> 00:30:36,560 Speaker 1: children won't have albinism. Have both those parents. You gotta 519 00:30:36,600 --> 00:30:39,160 Speaker 1: have both those parents that have passed along both those things, 520 00:30:39,200 --> 00:30:42,160 Speaker 1: because again, you can have siblings that don't have albinism. 521 00:30:43,120 --> 00:30:46,440 Speaker 1: Because like I think, you have a chance of getting 522 00:30:46,480 --> 00:30:49,840 Speaker 1: albinism or of being passed along to you, you have 523 00:30:49,880 --> 00:30:52,800 Speaker 1: a fifty percent chance or seventy chance of it not 524 00:30:52,840 --> 00:30:55,240 Speaker 1: being passed along, But there's a different combination of what's 525 00:30:55,240 --> 00:30:59,200 Speaker 1: not passed along. Yeah. Yeah. What I also thought was 526 00:30:59,280 --> 00:31:03,200 Speaker 1: interesting was um when Ed towards the end started talking 527 00:31:03,200 --> 00:31:06,920 Speaker 1: a little bit about in the animal kingdom, and you 528 00:31:06,960 --> 00:31:09,600 Speaker 1: know the fact that it's for sure a disadvantage if 529 00:31:09,600 --> 00:31:12,920 Speaker 1: you're living in the jungle and you're an animal, because 530 00:31:13,000 --> 00:31:17,080 Speaker 1: coloration is a big part of your camouflage and survival, 531 00:31:17,160 --> 00:31:20,680 Speaker 1: blending into your natural habitat as both the predator and 532 00:31:20,760 --> 00:31:24,800 Speaker 1: a prey. So if you are, you know, an alligator 533 00:31:24,960 --> 00:31:28,400 Speaker 1: or a guerilla with albinism, you're definitely in a disadvantage 534 00:31:28,880 --> 00:31:32,440 Speaker 1: in the wild. Um. I don't know that it's you know, 535 00:31:33,160 --> 00:31:35,000 Speaker 1: it's definitely in the wild, because he said, if you 536 00:31:35,040 --> 00:31:37,760 Speaker 1: have like a bunch of lab rats just sort of 537 00:31:37,800 --> 00:31:40,280 Speaker 1: doing their thing, then it's really not going to affect 538 00:31:40,280 --> 00:31:42,640 Speaker 1: them much at all. But you know, we talked a 539 00:31:42,640 --> 00:31:47,120 Speaker 1: little bit in the Cave Dwellers episode about these organisms 540 00:31:47,800 --> 00:31:50,520 Speaker 1: and I think reptiles that live deep in these caves 541 00:31:50,520 --> 00:31:54,440 Speaker 1: that are essentially I have no pigment and in there 542 00:31:54,480 --> 00:31:56,520 Speaker 1: it doesn't really matter, and in fact, some of the 543 00:31:56,560 --> 00:32:00,840 Speaker 1: vision stuff might be an advantage. Yeah, like the fact 544 00:32:00,880 --> 00:32:03,960 Speaker 1: that you don't have pigments like bouncing light and refracting 545 00:32:04,000 --> 00:32:07,120 Speaker 1: it off. UM. I guess basically keeping it from bouncing 546 00:32:07,160 --> 00:32:11,240 Speaker 1: around means that you should be able to get more light, 547 00:32:11,680 --> 00:32:15,600 Speaker 1: more visual information in very low levels of light, So 548 00:32:15,640 --> 00:32:18,320 Speaker 1: that would be an advantage for sure. Yeah, I think 549 00:32:18,320 --> 00:32:21,680 Speaker 1: it's pretty interesting. It is interesting. So I guess before 550 00:32:21,720 --> 00:32:24,200 Speaker 1: we go chuck um, we should we should talk about 551 00:32:24,200 --> 00:32:27,640 Speaker 1: there's a lot of other um conditions that can happen 552 00:32:28,080 --> 00:32:31,800 Speaker 1: that have to do with pigmentation melanin um that really 553 00:32:31,840 --> 00:32:35,520 Speaker 1: don't have anything to do with albinism, which really kind 554 00:32:35,520 --> 00:32:38,760 Speaker 1: of goes to show you, like just how complex melanin 555 00:32:38,800 --> 00:32:43,520 Speaker 1: production actually is you know. Yeah, and we talked recently. 556 00:32:43,560 --> 00:32:47,920 Speaker 1: I don't know why, but we did mention viddle igo recently. Um, 557 00:32:47,960 --> 00:32:50,360 Speaker 1: this is not the same thing as albinism. This is 558 00:32:50,360 --> 00:32:52,920 Speaker 1: when you have these sort of very defined areas of 559 00:32:52,960 --> 00:32:55,560 Speaker 1: your body that have no melanin. Uh. It is similar 560 00:32:55,560 --> 00:32:59,280 Speaker 1: because it has to do with melanin, but not albinism. No. 561 00:32:59,400 --> 00:33:02,360 Speaker 1: They think that, um, there's either some sort of uh, 562 00:33:02,600 --> 00:33:08,080 Speaker 1: really bad sunburn mechanical insult, like something happened to your 563 00:33:08,080 --> 00:33:12,880 Speaker 1: milana sites, uh, you know, mechanically, or you might have 564 00:33:13,360 --> 00:33:16,880 Speaker 1: had like some sort of chemical reaction and that whatever 565 00:33:16,920 --> 00:33:20,840 Speaker 1: trauma happens to the milana sites, it triggers your immune 566 00:33:20,840 --> 00:33:23,600 Speaker 1: system to target them as foreign invaders. So they think 567 00:33:23,640 --> 00:33:27,920 Speaker 1: now that viduligo is some sort of autoimmune disorder. That's right. 568 00:33:28,680 --> 00:33:32,480 Speaker 1: What else is there? There's poliosis, which I looked and no, 569 00:33:32,680 --> 00:33:35,800 Speaker 1: it does not have anything to do with polio. They 570 00:33:35,800 --> 00:33:38,760 Speaker 1: should they miss titled this one. I think they really 571 00:33:38,760 --> 00:33:41,560 Speaker 1: did because it has nothing to do with it. But 572 00:33:41,640 --> 00:33:43,720 Speaker 1: that's the one where someone will have like just a shock, 573 00:33:43,840 --> 00:33:47,120 Speaker 1: like a little patch of white hair, just totally pigment 574 00:33:47,200 --> 00:33:49,440 Speaker 1: free hair. Yeah. I know a couple of people that 575 00:33:49,520 --> 00:33:54,840 Speaker 1: have that the little h like the white schwa. Sure like. 576 00:33:55,000 --> 00:33:58,920 Speaker 1: Um remember John Henson from Talk Soup. Uh, yeah, he 577 00:33:58,960 --> 00:34:02,000 Speaker 1: had the white schwa RT example of that guy living 578 00:34:02,000 --> 00:34:05,800 Speaker 1: with poliosis. That's right. Uh. Emily calls any kind of 579 00:34:05,920 --> 00:34:08,040 Speaker 1: hair thing like that a schwa. I don't know why 580 00:34:08,200 --> 00:34:10,120 Speaker 1: it makes sense. I've heard it before, but I don't 581 00:34:10,239 --> 00:34:13,080 Speaker 1: know what it means. I think it means exactly what 582 00:34:13,120 --> 00:34:16,040 Speaker 1: it means, right, I don't. I think she just means 583 00:34:16,080 --> 00:34:17,520 Speaker 1: what like if I poof my hair up in a 584 00:34:17,920 --> 00:34:20,239 Speaker 1: with a big like like a pompadour, she would call 585 00:34:20,280 --> 00:34:24,480 Speaker 1: that a schway. Okay, I got you. It's very I 586 00:34:24,520 --> 00:34:26,919 Speaker 1: think no one outside my household really understands what it means. 587 00:34:26,920 --> 00:34:30,880 Speaker 1: It's a tuft of hair. Yeah, it's a tough Okay. 588 00:34:30,880 --> 00:34:33,520 Speaker 1: I don't think I realized that's what poliosis was. Yeah, 589 00:34:33,560 --> 00:34:35,520 Speaker 1: that's that's what it is. What do you think it was? 590 00:34:35,600 --> 00:34:37,160 Speaker 1: You thought I had to do with polio, didn't you? 591 00:34:37,600 --> 00:34:41,400 Speaker 1: I totally did. Actually I did too until I confirmed. Nope, 592 00:34:41,640 --> 00:34:48,360 Speaker 1: just terribly named. There's also Wardenburg syndrome. Uh. This is 593 00:34:48,520 --> 00:34:51,360 Speaker 1: abnormality with the pigment and the hair and skin and eyes. 594 00:34:51,960 --> 00:34:55,600 Speaker 1: But this is a congenital disease also not have anything 595 00:34:55,640 --> 00:34:59,319 Speaker 1: to do with albinism, right, um, and I think that's 596 00:34:59,320 --> 00:35:01,759 Speaker 1: about it. There's piebald is m. You know the kind 597 00:35:01,800 --> 00:35:05,240 Speaker 1: of piebald horses where there's a big um white patch, 598 00:35:05,440 --> 00:35:09,280 Speaker 1: usually a like a large one sometimes on the chataful. 599 00:35:09,520 --> 00:35:13,800 Speaker 1: It's the type of horse. It's actually a condition um 600 00:35:13,880 --> 00:35:16,840 Speaker 1: that that humans can have as well. It's just that 601 00:35:16,960 --> 00:35:20,640 Speaker 1: they bred a certain type of horse. They selected it 602 00:35:20,680 --> 00:35:24,480 Speaker 1: in a certain type of horse called the piebald horse. Uh. 603 00:35:24,560 --> 00:35:26,600 Speaker 1: You know, I have a tuxedo catos. I'm kind of 604 00:35:26,600 --> 00:35:29,400 Speaker 1: curious about how that happens. I'm gonna look into that. 605 00:35:29,400 --> 00:35:34,719 Speaker 1: That's classy. Yeah, classy tuxedo cat. That's right. Well that's 606 00:35:34,719 --> 00:35:38,040 Speaker 1: it for albinism. Huh. That's it. If you want to 607 00:35:38,080 --> 00:35:40,879 Speaker 1: learn more about albinism, you should go out and do that. 608 00:35:41,040 --> 00:35:43,440 Speaker 1: There's a lot to learn, um. And you could do 609 00:35:43,480 --> 00:35:46,960 Speaker 1: worse than starting at um Frontiers for Kids on their 610 00:35:47,200 --> 00:35:49,839 Speaker 1: Albanism article, because it's a pretty good one, and then 611 00:35:49,880 --> 00:35:52,640 Speaker 1: just go from there. Uh. And since I said just 612 00:35:52,680 --> 00:35:57,920 Speaker 1: go from there, it's time for a listener mail. Yeah. 613 00:35:57,960 --> 00:36:00,360 Speaker 1: This is short and sweet. We got called out on 614 00:36:00,440 --> 00:36:03,480 Speaker 1: something and whenever we get something wrong, we certainly like 615 00:36:03,640 --> 00:36:06,400 Speaker 1: to uh and and not just a correction on a 616 00:36:06,520 --> 00:36:08,480 Speaker 1: fact or something. But when we get something wrong that 617 00:36:08,520 --> 00:36:10,520 Speaker 1: we shouldn't have gotten wrong, then we like to call 618 00:36:10,560 --> 00:36:13,239 Speaker 1: attention to it and we try and do better. Uh. 619 00:36:13,280 --> 00:36:16,600 Speaker 1: This is from Natalie from California. I wanted to start 620 00:36:16,640 --> 00:36:18,480 Speaker 1: out with saying a big fan of the show, found 621 00:36:18,480 --> 00:36:20,239 Speaker 1: it during lockdown and made a big difference from my 622 00:36:20,280 --> 00:36:23,160 Speaker 1: boredom level as levels while working from home. But I 623 00:36:23,160 --> 00:36:25,480 Speaker 1: was a bit disappointed guys listening to the child chillibus 624 00:36:25,560 --> 00:36:30,200 Speaker 1: kidnapping as multiple times you guys implied that not being 625 00:36:30,239 --> 00:36:33,880 Speaker 1: able to spell means that you're not smart. Uh. And 626 00:36:33,960 --> 00:36:36,319 Speaker 1: you're totally right, Natalie. I didn't even think about that, 627 00:36:36,400 --> 00:36:40,000 Speaker 1: but Uh, Natalie says, I'm an adult with dyslexia and 628 00:36:40,000 --> 00:36:42,680 Speaker 1: I cannot spell, but save my life, in spite of this, 629 00:36:42,719 --> 00:36:46,000 Speaker 1: I'm a highly intelligent and successful adult. Uh. And it's 630 00:36:46,400 --> 00:36:48,800 Speaker 1: fairly able us to correlate ability to spell with overall 631 00:36:48,840 --> 00:36:52,399 Speaker 1: intelligence and I expect more. And Natalie, you are totally right, 632 00:36:52,600 --> 00:36:56,319 Speaker 1: and that is on us and big apologies. We uh 633 00:36:56,640 --> 00:36:59,960 Speaker 1: did not think that one through. No, indeed, we definitely 634 00:37:00,000 --> 00:37:01,800 Speaker 1: we weren't trying to throw any shade on people with 635 00:37:01,920 --> 00:37:05,160 Speaker 1: dyslexia at all, of course not. But you know, it's 636 00:37:05,239 --> 00:37:08,120 Speaker 1: another thing like we all learn as we go through life, 637 00:37:08,680 --> 00:37:11,000 Speaker 1: and when you learn on the air, it can be 638 00:37:11,120 --> 00:37:15,160 Speaker 1: a little embarrassing sometimes. Just that's what we do as 639 00:37:15,200 --> 00:37:17,600 Speaker 1: a job and so we we take that. Yeah, so 640 00:37:17,800 --> 00:37:20,600 Speaker 1: was that from Natalie. Yeah, yeah, thank you for for 641 00:37:20,640 --> 00:37:23,319 Speaker 1: that one, Natalie. We appreciate it. And if you have 642 00:37:23,480 --> 00:37:26,839 Speaker 1: something you want to call us out on, we'll we'll 643 00:37:26,840 --> 00:37:30,600 Speaker 1: take it and you can address it to stuff podcast 644 00:37:31,040 --> 00:37:37,080 Speaker 1: at iHeart radio dot com. Stuff you Should Know is 645 00:37:37,120 --> 00:37:39,960 Speaker 1: a production of I Heart Radio. For more podcasts my 646 00:37:40,040 --> 00:37:43,279 Speaker 1: heart Radio, visit the i heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, 647 00:37:43,400 --> 00:37:45,240 Speaker 1: or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.