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Speaker 1: On the beck Doll Cast, the questions asked if movies

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Speaker 1: have women in them? Are all their discussions just boyfriends

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Speaker 1: and husbands? Do they have in individualism the patriarchy? Zef

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Speaker 1: invest start changing it with the beck Del Cast. Hello,

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Speaker 1: Welcome to the Bechdel Cast. My name is Jamie, my

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Speaker 1: name is Caitlin, and this is our podcast where we

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Speaker 1: talk about how women are represented in film, and wouldn't

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Speaker 1: you know women are not often represented very well? No kidding,

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Speaker 1: g whiz wow. That's why we have to do this

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Speaker 1: podcast to shame all these freaking idiots in Hollywood. It's

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Speaker 1: weird because everyone who's in my inbox and dams are

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Speaker 1: constantly so nice and respectful that I forget that people

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Speaker 1: actually hate women and want them to die, right, You know,

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Speaker 1: It's true. It is easy to forget. I'm often highly

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Speaker 1: respected in the community hot Break, so I sometimes forget

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Speaker 1: that generally don't respect women so well. Anyway. So this

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Speaker 1: is the Bechtel Cast. We talk about movies and how

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Speaker 1: they portray women. We use the Bactel test just sort

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Speaker 1: of like a measuring stick, a yard stick. We don't

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Speaker 1: only talk about whether or not a movie passes a

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Speaker 1: Bectel test. It's so much more would be funny if

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Speaker 1: it was though for just for no, if this is

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Speaker 1: like this is called snow white, and then we'd be

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Speaker 1: like no, and then that's the could just be a list.

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Speaker 1: So the Bechtel test, by our standards, has to be

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Speaker 1: two female characters talking. They both have to have names,

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Speaker 1: they have to be talking about something other than a

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Speaker 1: man for a total of two wines. Can this movie

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Speaker 1: do it? Let's find out. Yeah, but first we've all

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Speaker 1: kinds of stuff to do. We have to introduce our

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Speaker 1: guests some sex it first and foremost. He is the

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Speaker 1: head of comedy at the House Stuff Works podcast network

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Speaker 1: and the co host of the Daily Zeitgeist on that network.

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Speaker 1: Jack O'Brien, guys, Hi, thanks for haven't made certainly exciting.

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Speaker 1: I'm a big fan. Where oh where zy Guy's heads?

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Speaker 1: So Jack and I have both won Golden Globes last night. Congratulations. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I know you're saying you're highly respected, but do you

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Speaker 1: have a Golden Globe? I certainly don't. Okay, well, I

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Speaker 1: have to the university for Santi University. We won Best

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Speaker 1: Drama and Best Comedy Music. Amazingly. Yeah, it was a

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Speaker 1: real incredible barn Burner of a night Us and Gary

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Speaker 1: Oldman big winners. Have you talked about Santa University on

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Speaker 1: this podcast. I don't know that I have. I think briefly,

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Speaker 1: I don't remember what episode was recently, it does, but

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Speaker 1: Santa University does pass the back tole test. There's a

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Speaker 1: whole scene decades there's a whole scene where the two

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Speaker 1: characters just say, and now we passed back to it. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: that's good, incredible, useful. So Jack, you have brought us

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Speaker 1: snow White in the Seven Dwarfs. I have. I bring

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Speaker 1: it before you because I think it's an important feminist text. No,

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Speaker 1: because I feel like a lot of problems that I

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Speaker 1: have with Disney and Disney culture, like this is the

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Speaker 1: thesis statement for how Disney wanted to portray women, and

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Speaker 1: like Disney princesses, she is the archetypal Disney princess. I

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Speaker 1: just feel like it's a very influential film in terms

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Speaker 1: of creating the archetype of Disney princess. And they're just

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Speaker 1: some really weird things that happened in this movie that repeatedly,

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Speaker 1: And you know, I also like really like Disney's artwork

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Speaker 1: and stuff and I can see how it would have

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Speaker 1: like blown people's minds because this was like before they

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Speaker 1: had full length animated movies with color animation. This really

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Speaker 1: was the Avatar of its day, and it's beautiful. It

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Speaker 1: sucks that it's so fucking boring boring. There's something also

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Speaker 1: extremely annoying and completely nonsensical, like it's there farce. It

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Speaker 1: still get me though some parts. Well when did you

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Speaker 1: forst see this film? It's one of those movies I

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Speaker 1: don't remember seeing, I think, but it must have been

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Speaker 1: like before I was properly storing memories, so like, okay,

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Speaker 1: so from three yeah, they're abouts. Yeah. Same. I grew

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Speaker 1: up with this movie. I've seen it probably a dozen

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Speaker 1: times from ages five to twelve or so, and then

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Speaker 1: I hadn't rewatched it as an adult until yesterday. And wow,

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Speaker 1: it's quite different from what I remember as a child.

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Speaker 1: It really it's weird. I couldn't even get I was like,

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Speaker 1: this is just fucking bizarre in so many ways. This

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Speaker 1: is the first movie I ever remember seeing which is

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Speaker 1: not good. If like the first example of like, wow,

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Speaker 1: this is the guy. It's like the Prince is just

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Speaker 1: a guy in sweatpants who's scales biker biker pants that

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Speaker 1: just like tight tight pants. He fucking hops a wall

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Speaker 1: and is first words or did I scare you? And

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Speaker 1: they're just like like the prime of manhood. Yeah, so

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Speaker 1: I think that that explains the very choice I've ever made. Sure, well,

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Speaker 1: that's what I mean. Jack. You were saying how influential

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Speaker 1: it was, and the three of us grew up with

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Speaker 1: this movie. You saw it a ton as children, and

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Speaker 1: it shaped our worldview to some degree subconscious yeah, and

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Speaker 1: made us think that, like, oh, this is how romance

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Speaker 1: should be. This is what she we should strive for,

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Speaker 1: either as a man lining himself to Prince Charming or

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Speaker 1: a woman being like, oh I have to be all

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Speaker 1: passive and annoying like snow white, like so passive to

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Speaker 1: the point that she, like her big actions in the movie,

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Speaker 1: like where she saves herself are all done. Well, she's asleep.

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Speaker 1: They just they have to incapacitate her for her not

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Speaker 1: to fund things up. And she's still not the least

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Speaker 1: active Disney princess because there is the one that yeah,

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Speaker 1: well Disney clearly had a like I don't know, cosby

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Speaker 1: ish thing, because she was if you just saw this

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Speaker 1: movie enough times you would probably be like, oh, I

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Speaker 1: bet Disney has a weird thing for sleeping women. And

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Speaker 1: then it's like one of his next movies was Sleeping Beauty,

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Speaker 1: which I haven't seen nearly as much. Like the Disney

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Speaker 1: movies that I know best are this one and then Aladdin,

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Speaker 1: Lion King, Beauty and the Beast exactly. Yeah. So there's

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Speaker 1: like the Cinderella and the in the Sleeping Beauties and

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Speaker 1: that some of the older ones from like the fifties, sixties, seventies,

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Speaker 1: I don't know as well. There wasn't that much going

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Speaker 1: on then, but there's like the it's weird. The Disney

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Speaker 1: Renaissance princesses started this whole new thing where it's like, oh,

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Speaker 1: it's not like the princesses your mom grew up with,

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Speaker 1: because these princesses have one thing about them that is

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Speaker 1: the thing that they do, such as Bell who can

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Speaker 1: read read and there's that weird though the whole town

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Speaker 1: like burn her she's a witch because she likes books.

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Speaker 1: There's the whole song where they're like, man, even though

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Speaker 1: she can read, I'd still have sex with her. Whole

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Speaker 1: song also the last time, Okay, and then we'll get

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Speaker 1: into snow it. But the last time I saw Beautying

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Speaker 1: the Beast, you know, there's like that mob at the

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Speaker 1: end that they're going for the beast. The mob literally says,

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Speaker 1: we fear what we don't understand. They're like the most

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Speaker 1: self aware mob of all times. Like a line in

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Speaker 1: their song it's like, well then hold hold on, yeah,

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Speaker 1: maybe stop for a second and educate yourself on the

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Speaker 1: thing that you don't understand. And he was like, you know,

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Speaker 1: so if you ever find yourself saying we fear, well,

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Speaker 1: we don't understand, just take a second. So, well, it's

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Speaker 1: okay to get to snow. In the Seven Doors, there's

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Speaker 1: a line in the Dwarf song where they're like, we

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Speaker 1: don't know why we do this job? Why do we do?

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Speaker 1: We don't know? They just he doesn't care about plot. No,

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Speaker 1: they certainly, at least not in this movie. So speaking

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Speaker 1: up plot, I'll go over it. In my Caitlin's famous

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Speaker 1: recap White the Seven Dwarfs, we meet the Queen first Evil.

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Speaker 1: So the first word in the movie is not good.

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Speaker 1: We're like, which is what she is calling her mirror

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Speaker 1: right on the wall. Yes, okay, yeah, possibly a queer icon. Possibly,

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Speaker 1: let's not rule out that theor so it's uh. We

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Speaker 1: first meet this evil queen who consults this magic mirror

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Speaker 1: on the wall every day and says, who is the

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Speaker 1: fairest of them all? Basically saying, am I the hottest?

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Speaker 1: And every day does he say? Every day? Yes? Until

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Speaker 1: one day the mirrors like, actually, your stepdaughter, snow White

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Speaker 1: is the fairest of them all. And the evil queens like, well,

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Speaker 1: I better have her killed then, because she's so vain

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Speaker 1: and so petty that she cannot live with the idea

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Speaker 1: of knowing that she's not the hottest in all of

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Speaker 1: her kingdom. She says, a lash for her. It's like

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Speaker 1: an absolute monarchy where power is just determined and by

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Speaker 1: how pretty you are, Like, that's what rules the land

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Speaker 1: is just prettiness And she's like, well, now somebody's prettier.

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Speaker 1: I got to take him down. Yeah, the rules of

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Speaker 1: this kingdom. It's very confusing because the queen dies and

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Speaker 1: snow White does, and there is a whole year that passes.

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Speaker 1: We have no idea who is in charge, are there police,

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Speaker 1: are there people? And we don't know, we don't know.

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Speaker 1: Chaos And to give you an idea of how white

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Speaker 1: this movie is part of the Queen's motivation for killing

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Speaker 1: snow White is that snow White is whiter than her. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: they celebrate her whiteness to an insane degree. Snow white

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Speaker 1: skin is coveted so much, to the point where her

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Speaker 1: name is snow White, Like it's so and it's just

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Speaker 1: fucking weird. It's just weird. That classic movie starts like,

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Speaker 1: she's anyone whiter than me, so weird. So she basically

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Speaker 1: commissions a huntsman to go out and murder snow White,

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Speaker 1: and he is about to do it, but then he

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Speaker 1: looks at how beautiful she is and he's like, actually,

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Speaker 1: I cannot kill you. You're too hot. The hunt's been creepy, ugly,

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Speaker 1: almost like on purpose, I would I would assume he's

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Speaker 1: got bangs. Why does he have bangs? Anyway, So he

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Speaker 1: goes to kills no White and he's like, actually, I can't.

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Speaker 1: You should run away because the queen wants you dead.

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Speaker 1: So she runs off. She's terrified. She gets clawed at

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Speaker 1: by some trees and then she collapses in the middle

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Speaker 1: of the woods and then all these woodland critters come

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Speaker 1: and they're like, hey, we'll show you where to live,

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Speaker 1: and they take her to the house of the Seven Dwarfs,

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Speaker 1: and she goes up to the door and she knocks

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Speaker 1: on it. No one answers, and she's like, oh, I

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Speaker 1: guess no one tell him find a trespass. Better just

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Speaker 1: go in. And in her defense, she's hot, right exactly,

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Speaker 1: so they would have they would have been fine with

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Speaker 1: it because she's hot. So she goes in and she

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Speaker 1: realizes that it's dirty. So she's like, I better do

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Speaker 1: the only thing that I know how to do, which

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Speaker 1: is to clean, because I didn't mention that the evil stepmother,

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Speaker 1: the queen, even though she is like the guardian of

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Speaker 1: this young woman, she's like, actually, you're gonna be my

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Speaker 1: servant and you're just gonna clean, and I'm gonna dress

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Speaker 1: you in rags and you're not going to be a

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Speaker 1: princess really at all? Right, Snow also snow why she

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Speaker 1: doesn't state any motivation or intent about anything except for

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Speaker 1: like remaining alive until like an hour in the movie,

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Speaker 1: and that's when she tells the Dwarfs she would like

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Speaker 1: to get married. Please, Yes, you're just like Jesus Christ.

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Speaker 1: So she is, I think we can all agree a

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Speaker 1: feminist icon. So she cleans the Dwarf's house and then

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Speaker 1: they come home and they're like who are you and

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Speaker 1: she's like, I'm snow White, and they're like, oh, the princess, Okay,

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Speaker 1: you can stay. Especially, she steals the deal by saying, yeah,

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Speaker 1: I'll cook you some gooseberry pies and they're like, great,

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Speaker 1: you're in helliot. Cook and clean her two superpowers. Being

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Speaker 1: pretty wealthy, right, The doors are also like, oh she hot. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I really like her. They're literally about to pick ax

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Speaker 1: her to death. They have their pick axes raised in

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Speaker 1: their over her sleeping form, and then she like rolls

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Speaker 1: over and they're like, whoa, she's pretty better. Let her

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Speaker 1: be our mommy there. I also would like to start

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Speaker 1: a petition to rename the Dwarf named Bashful Horny, because

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Speaker 1: that's what he is every single time, because like, he's

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Speaker 1: not shy, he's just like horny, like that's his thing.

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Speaker 1: But they're all pretty horny. They're all horny, but especially

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Speaker 1: is also extremely horny. Dope is chaotic evil. It's straight

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Speaker 1: up a scary character because there's that part where you're

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Speaker 1: like what are they going for with dope? And then

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Speaker 1: they're like snow It's like can dope talk, and one

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Speaker 1: of them is like, we don't know, he's never tried topy,

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Speaker 1: just like I was like, oh cool, and we got

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Speaker 1: mediocrity firing on all cylinders here. He's never dried so

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Speaker 1: many lines like why completely hairless? Like he looks very unhealthy,

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Speaker 1: like like somebody who has like a drug or do

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Speaker 1: you guys know the band the Pogues Irish Run and

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Speaker 1: their lead singer is like aggressively alcoholic and like to

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Speaker 1: the point that like his teeth have started falling out

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Speaker 1: and like his face has no color. And I was like,

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Speaker 1: that's dopy. That's kind of what Dopey looks like, because

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Speaker 1: the rest of the Dwarves are all old looking men

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Speaker 1: with like long white beards, and then there's just like

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Speaker 1: Dopey a child I don't know. He's also very old

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Speaker 1: but very smooth. And when the music scene started, I

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Speaker 1: forgot who like played what in the music scene, But

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Speaker 1: the second it started, I was like, oh, for sure

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Speaker 1: he's the drummer. Yeah, yeah, true, because Grumpy plays the

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Speaker 1: organ sure, and it is also a libertarian. Grumpy is

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Speaker 1: not a feminist icon. Grumpy wants us to all owned plows.

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Speaker 1: He's weird, so those are two of the dwarves. The

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Speaker 1: other ones are doc happy, sleepy, bashful, sneezy, and they're

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Speaker 1: all horny. What did I get them all bashful? Oh?

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Speaker 1: I actually wrote soapy? What do I mean? Dope? Okay,

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Speaker 1: I just wrote it. But at one point Dope does

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Speaker 1: swallow a bar of so and he becomes pretty soapy.

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Speaker 1: I was not wrong. There's a seven minute scene where

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Speaker 1: they're just washing their hands. Stupid. It's stupid because Okay,

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Speaker 1: I love this movie as a kid, but now I

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Speaker 1: hate it so much as I think it's such trash.

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Speaker 1: I think that part of the reason this movie is

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Speaker 1: fun for kids to watch is it's like you can

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Speaker 1: tell that Disney was only doing these long cartoons before,

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Speaker 1: because you can break this movie into like five segments

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Speaker 1: where it's just like a series of visual jokes and

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Speaker 1: no story. So it's like, all, I get that, Like

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Speaker 1: kids want to watch animals wash stuff. I don't even

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Speaker 1: know that that's true, but there, I mean, it was

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Speaker 1: seven who knew what children found entertaining. They were all

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Speaker 1: playing with like I need to watch Like, yeah, there's

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Speaker 1: so many like extended scenes where we just see them

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Speaker 1: mining diamonds or washing their faces. For the first time

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Speaker 1: in their lives. Can we okay, can we talk about

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Speaker 1: the face washing scene, because the dwarf logic also is

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Speaker 1: nuts o where they work in a mind, they seem

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Speaker 1: to have a lot of money, they're dithering a lot

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Speaker 1: of wealth. Why don't they live in separate houses? Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I mean you can assume that they're mining these precious

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Speaker 1: jewels too then turn into capital. Well as they stay

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Speaker 1: in the in the song, they don't know why they

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Speaker 1: have that job, and they don't know what they're doing,

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Speaker 1: but they're all fucking each other, right right, definitely? Yeah,

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Speaker 1: in those little baby beds. Why are they all pushed together?

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Speaker 1: They live in a one bedroom cottage and they're all

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Speaker 1: seven beds are in one bedroom. Okay, so the rest

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Speaker 1: of the story, I'll just get through the rest of Sorry.

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Speaker 1: So they agree to let her stay, but they're like,

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Speaker 1: be careful because the queen she's coming to get you.

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Speaker 1: The next day, they go off to work and they're like,

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Speaker 1: don't let any strangers in. So the first thing that

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Speaker 1: happens after that is that a stranger comes because the

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Speaker 1: queen has been concocting this plan to kill snow Why

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Speaker 1: because she finds out that the huntsman did not in

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Speaker 1: fact murder her like she thought she used mummy dust.

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Speaker 1: Did you see that does? So she is also a witch.

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Speaker 1: The Queen is a witch. She's also a woman in

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Speaker 1: stem because she has her own lab. She has the

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Speaker 1: queen because she has both a murder dungeon. And she

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Speaker 1: chooses to go and like secretly slip this poisoned apple

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Speaker 1: to snow Why she chooses the unassuming disguise of like

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Speaker 1: a wild eyed witch like crazy, yeah, So she like

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Speaker 1: uses magic to poison this apple that's going to induce

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Speaker 1: the slee being death, which is this curse that won't

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Speaker 1: kill her, but we'll make it look like she's dead.

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Speaker 1: So she's just hoping the little her body doesn't rot, right, Yeah,

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Speaker 1: got it. So she's not actually dead, but as far

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Speaker 1: as the dwarf Snow, she is, but they just I'll

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Speaker 1: get there. So she poisons the apple. She uses magic

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Speaker 1: to transform her appearance into this like old hag lady.

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Speaker 1: She approaches snow White and the first thing snow White

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Speaker 1: does after being told don't let any strangers in the house,

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Speaker 1: She's like, yeah, come in, I'm just making some pies.

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Speaker 1: And the Queen in this disguise is like, here, use

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Speaker 1: this apple. It's a wishing apple and it will make

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Speaker 1: all your dreams come true. So snow White is like, yeah,

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Speaker 1: I wish for my Prince Charming to come and carry

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Speaker 1: me away into his castle. And then she takes it

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Speaker 1: by the apple and instantly falls into the sleeping death.

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Speaker 1: And then the dwarfs find out about this because all

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Speaker 1: the woodland critters, her best friends, the story for sure. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: they go and basically tell the Dwarfs what happened. So

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Speaker 1: they come back. They chase the queen up a hill,

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Speaker 1: she falls off of it and dies. She gets struck

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Speaker 1: by lightning, falls off a cliff, A boulder falls on

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Speaker 1: top of her, and then her pulverized body. It is

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Speaker 1: made abundantly clear by a shot of two vultures that

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Speaker 1: the two vultures are then going down to consume her remains.

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Speaker 1: It's like Jesus Christ, which is another Disney trend we

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Speaker 1: see later of just like gruesome, horrifying deaths of but

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Speaker 1: almost always falling off yea, because you can't show in

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Speaker 1: a Disney movie like a grizzly murder, so they have

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Speaker 1: to fall. How many Gaston falls off a cliff fast

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Speaker 1: falls off a cliff yes, huh, doesn't a character and

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Speaker 1: Hunchback of Rolo falls off a cliff, Well, not a

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Speaker 1: cliff off, he falls off a church into a fire pit.

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Speaker 1: To be fair, he also sings a whole song about

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Speaker 1: wanting to rape and murder the female protagonist of the movie.

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Speaker 1: That movie, It's Dark. I've only seen it once years ago,

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Speaker 1: I don't remember. It's very good, but it's very it's

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Speaker 1: shouldn't be seen by children. It's very weird. Okay. So

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Speaker 1: then the dwarfs mourn snow White, who they think is dead,

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Speaker 1: but they're like, well, she's too beautiful to bury in

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Speaker 1: the ground. Let's just build a glass coffin and put

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Speaker 1: her in there. And then like a year passes and

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Speaker 1: she's still just lying there, all hot and dead looking.

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Speaker 1: And then the plants, who has nothing to do, wonders,

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Speaker 1: it's you just like roaming around like knowing one song

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Speaker 1: for a whole year, bananas. So he comes and finds

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Speaker 1: snow White and her dead looking body, and he's like, well,

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Speaker 1: better kisser, and then it breaks the because that was

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Speaker 1: the one antidote to this curse. It is like true

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Speaker 1: love's first kiss or whatever, right, guy and Sweatpants makes

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Speaker 1: out with your corpse. Congrats baby, your royalty. There's something

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Speaker 1: weird about the year that they just kind of yat

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Speaker 1: yauta past where the dwarfs have her dead body just

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Speaker 1: laying in a glass coffin and they're just staring at her.

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Speaker 1: Yeah that all they did, just stared at her. They're

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Speaker 1: mining job just yeah, the old in front of her

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Speaker 1: for a year. And then a guy rolls up who

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Speaker 1: they've never seen before, and they're like, you want to

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Speaker 1: crack at her just like he did. They open the

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Speaker 1: coffin for him. They must, because it's like at one

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Speaker 1: point there's like a glass top to the coffin, and

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Speaker 1: then a dude rides up on a horse like singing

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Speaker 1: this crappy song and they're like, okay, have at her.

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Speaker 1: Like that's literally like the like the Prince, I feel

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Speaker 1: like it is on the verge of like doing a

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Speaker 1: little shot gun and pulling out a vape pen for

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Speaker 1: like every time he's just like, hey, what's up, Like

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Speaker 1: he just pops up out of nowhere. Where's his kingdom?

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Speaker 1: Why he's not busy? No, he's Jesus. Because at the

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Speaker 1: end they're like walking off and then like there's like

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Speaker 1: a big castle in the sky, like there, I forgot

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Speaker 1: about that. So it's like taxi driver in the sense

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Speaker 1: that it might just be in her mind and that

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Speaker 1: this is her dying or or like in the end

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Speaker 1: of Titanic where she dies. No, she's just asleep and

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Speaker 1: she has a dream. She does not die. Well, I

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Speaker 1: can't believe you just went back on your own Titanic.

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Speaker 1: I know, I meant I misspoke. She's just dreaming. She didn't.

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Speaker 1: She has a dream about Sad. It's yeah, there's that.

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Speaker 1: And also it's made clear or I thought it was

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Speaker 1: when the prince is like corpse back to life. Great news.

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Speaker 1: Time to get married. But it's clear that she's never

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Speaker 1: going to see the dwarves again for some reason, because

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Speaker 1: she has to say goodbye to all of them. And

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Speaker 1: it's like, oh, because, I mean, I guess in seven

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Speaker 1: this is probably true. Marriage is a prison and you

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Speaker 1: will not see anyone ever. He will not be allowed outside.

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Speaker 1: He picks her up, Jesus picks her up out of

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Speaker 1: the coffin and uh like just throws her on his

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Speaker 1: horse like some like thing he just bought. And well,

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Speaker 1: her muscles have probably atrophied. She's been dead for she

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Speaker 1: cannot walk. She covered in her own filth. Snow White

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Speaker 1: has less than no interest in what happened to her,

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Speaker 1: and she's not like, wait a second, what happened to

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Speaker 1: that old lady. From her point of view, she just

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Speaker 1: ate the apple, the wishing apple wished that this guy

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Speaker 1: would come, and then woke up and then instantly was

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Speaker 1: her wish came true that which is like her hero. Also,

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Speaker 1: snow White in theory, shouldn't she like care who's in

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Speaker 1: charge of the kingdom? She was the because like she

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Speaker 1: starts royal in this movie and gets royal by the end,

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Speaker 1: but like she's in theory, is supposed to care, right like,

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Speaker 1: but who is in charge? There is some power structure

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Speaker 1: there because at one point she says her name, and

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Speaker 1: all the doors are like the princess, like the famous.

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Speaker 1: So there must be like some sort of roll besides

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Speaker 1: just laying down and being kissed for her to fulfill.

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Speaker 1: But of course we do not see that in the

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Speaker 1: movie Cooking and Cleaning. Maybe the maybe the mirror is

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Speaker 1: in charge. Previously my job was saying who's hot and

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Speaker 1: who's not? Right now, I am her leader. God, so

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Speaker 1: that's the story of snow White. I have a lot

401
00:23:29,200 --> 00:23:33,720
Speaker 1: of thoughts about the movie. Where shall we start? Oh gosh, well,

402
00:23:34,040 --> 00:23:36,439
Speaker 1: you can sort of just boil the story down to

403
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Speaker 1: the narrative being a woman so petty that she has

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Speaker 1: to have the hotter person than her murdered. So that

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Speaker 1: doesn't send good feminist vibes a little bit, just a

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Speaker 1: smidge of woman and woman hatred just a bit me. Yeah, Jamie,

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Speaker 1: Actually you probably don't know this, but I have tried

408
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Speaker 1: to have you killed because your mirror is talking to

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Speaker 1: you again. But he did tell me to make some

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Speaker 1: calls if that started. Yeah, I should go to my therapist.

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Speaker 1: Get this checked out. That's that is so good that

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Speaker 1: she's just like, well, if a piece of glass says

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Speaker 1: that my teenage stepdaughter, who I'm enslaving is hot, she

414
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Speaker 1: simply must go. She's gotta die. Sorry. Okay, So snow

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Speaker 1: White's introduction in the movie is her singing about her

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Speaker 1: one true love, her Prince Charming, who she has not

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Speaker 1: yet met. She's just waiting around, waiting around, waiting to

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Speaker 1: be found and wooed by a Prince Charming. Right then,

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Speaker 1: Prince Charming does show up because he hears a pretty voice. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: we can't just say. He shows up. He scales a

421
00:24:50,960 --> 00:24:56,000
Speaker 1: wall and sweatpants and then frightens her and he's like, oh,

422
00:24:56,160 --> 00:24:58,800
Speaker 1: did I scare you? And then she runs into a castle.

423
00:24:59,560 --> 00:25:02,200
Speaker 1: But then the kind of have a song together. They're

424
00:25:02,200 --> 00:25:04,439
Speaker 1: sort of singing at each other, and this is like

425
00:25:04,520 --> 00:25:06,480
Speaker 1: kind of I feel like something that comes up again

426
00:25:06,520 --> 00:25:09,439
Speaker 1: again into movies where it's like she's scared, but don't worry,

427
00:25:09,560 --> 00:25:13,879
Speaker 1: she's also extremely horny. I'm just like, by scaring a woman,

428
00:25:14,200 --> 00:25:17,760
Speaker 1: she's yours daddy out Like it's very weird because she's

429
00:25:17,960 --> 00:25:22,040
Speaker 1: actively hiding from him. And I think that we're supposed

430
00:25:22,040 --> 00:25:24,480
Speaker 1: to think that's partially because she doesn't have a nice

431
00:25:24,560 --> 00:25:28,000
Speaker 1: dress or something like she's embarrassed that she's hiding. She

432
00:25:29,000 --> 00:25:31,919
Speaker 1: straightening out her dress and stuff, or maybe she's feeling herself.

433
00:25:31,960 --> 00:25:35,840
Speaker 1: She's so horny that this guy launched himself over a

434
00:25:35,880 --> 00:25:40,000
Speaker 1: wall and was like, are you scared? Regardless of the

435
00:25:40,040 --> 00:25:43,640
Speaker 1: message is that guys, girls want you to scale their

436
00:25:43,680 --> 00:25:47,560
Speaker 1: wall and scare them when they run away, they're probably

437
00:25:47,560 --> 00:25:49,960
Speaker 1: already in love with you, and then go to them

438
00:25:49,960 --> 00:25:52,520
Speaker 1: while they're asleep and just pick them up and take

439
00:25:52,600 --> 00:25:59,040
Speaker 1: them with you. Also, his song sucks, dude. His song

440
00:25:59,200 --> 00:26:09,760
Speaker 1: is so song that Scott Watts song. Everyone in this

441
00:26:09,800 --> 00:26:12,000
Speaker 1: movie it sounds like they're not high school production. It's not.

442
00:26:12,320 --> 00:26:15,240
Speaker 1: It's very annoying to listen to. Snow White is so

443
00:26:15,320 --> 00:26:19,080
Speaker 1: prow knowing out that her voice is. She sounds like

444
00:26:19,119 --> 00:26:23,359
Speaker 1: Betty Boop. I totally forgot how like high pitched and

445
00:26:23,600 --> 00:26:28,080
Speaker 1: like cartoonishly squeaky, and like kind of Mickey Mousey too,

446
00:26:28,840 --> 00:26:32,919
Speaker 1: Like yeah, well that's my interesting. Shitty man all the

447
00:26:32,960 --> 00:26:35,359
Speaker 1: time will use the excuse of a woman having a

448
00:26:35,400 --> 00:26:37,479
Speaker 1: shrill voice as a reason not to listen to her,

449
00:26:37,600 --> 00:26:39,280
Speaker 1: to take her seriously. So I don't want to sound

450
00:26:39,280 --> 00:26:42,040
Speaker 1: like I'm doing that. But my god, her voice is

451
00:26:42,080 --> 00:26:46,119
Speaker 1: so shrill and awful that all the blood vessels in

452
00:26:46,160 --> 00:26:48,520
Speaker 1: my brain did burst while I was watching this movie.

453
00:26:48,760 --> 00:26:50,760
Speaker 1: It's a lot of the early Disney process has had

454
00:26:50,800 --> 00:26:54,200
Speaker 1: like those like operatic voices, and then you hit Cinderella

455
00:26:54,320 --> 00:26:56,160
Speaker 1: and then it's like, all of a sudden, Cinderella has

456
00:26:56,160 --> 00:27:02,720
Speaker 1: like a husky, little fun voice. It's like snow Ie.

457
00:27:03,320 --> 00:27:06,040
Speaker 1: It's bad not to detract from the cost but she

458
00:27:06,280 --> 00:27:08,920
Speaker 1: is hard to listen to. She end a bit, but

459
00:27:09,160 --> 00:27:12,359
Speaker 1: So this scene where she's like falling in love with

460
00:27:12,440 --> 00:27:15,359
Speaker 1: Prince Charming even though he's actively invading her space and

461
00:27:15,400 --> 00:27:18,240
Speaker 1: scaring her, it was working because she's falling in love

462
00:27:18,320 --> 00:27:20,800
Speaker 1: with him even though they don't talk. They don't actualge

463
00:27:20,800 --> 00:27:23,960
Speaker 1: any words except for just like being like I'm looking

464
00:27:24,040 --> 00:27:26,160
Speaker 1: for my Prince Charming and he was like, one day

465
00:27:26,160 --> 00:27:30,840
Speaker 1: I'll find a beautiful princess, but like to know each other.

466
00:27:31,840 --> 00:27:34,600
Speaker 1: So they're in love all of a sudden, but that's

467
00:27:34,640 --> 00:27:37,919
Speaker 1: not clear until she tells the Dwarfs that like she

468
00:27:38,080 --> 00:27:41,000
Speaker 1: found her true love, because there's nothing about the interaction

469
00:27:41,000 --> 00:27:43,600
Speaker 1: that would suggest that like he had done anything to

470
00:27:43,640 --> 00:27:46,000
Speaker 1: impress her. All he did was make her run away

471
00:27:46,040 --> 00:27:48,520
Speaker 1: and then like an hour and she's like, yeah, I

472
00:27:48,560 --> 00:27:52,080
Speaker 1: am in love with this one guy. Really, all that

473
00:27:52,160 --> 00:27:55,080
Speaker 1: thing does is established HER's like just like this very delicate,

474
00:27:55,160 --> 00:27:59,800
Speaker 1: timid little girl, and we're supposed to be a little girl.

475
00:28:00,280 --> 00:28:03,480
Speaker 1: It's good, Yeah, I mean, isn't that like that's why

476
00:28:03,560 --> 00:28:06,240
Speaker 1: she becomes the fairest in the land, because she comes

477
00:28:06,280 --> 00:28:08,560
Speaker 1: of age or something like that. I think that's what

478
00:28:08,600 --> 00:28:11,640
Speaker 1: we're meant to assume. The mirror is like snow White

479
00:28:12,080 --> 00:28:19,760
Speaker 1: got her period less and now you are ugly. She's

480
00:28:19,760 --> 00:28:22,400
Speaker 1: also season on snow I had forgotten that snow White

481
00:28:22,480 --> 00:28:25,680
Speaker 1: is like land aquaman. She can just like control all

482
00:28:25,720 --> 00:28:29,320
Speaker 1: the animals of the forest, like just they're all just

483
00:28:29,440 --> 00:28:31,680
Speaker 1: going around her and helping her with stuff, which is

484
00:28:31,720 --> 00:28:35,080
Speaker 1: a pretty cool power, and it's just totally squandered on her.

485
00:28:35,480 --> 00:28:37,920
Speaker 1: She don't wants to do boring stuff with it, yeah,

486
00:28:37,960 --> 00:28:42,080
Speaker 1: like clean a house and cook. But then when they're

487
00:28:42,120 --> 00:28:45,320
Speaker 1: trying to like warn her away from a poison apple,

488
00:28:45,760 --> 00:28:48,280
Speaker 1: she's like, God, why are you guys being such assholes today?

489
00:28:48,360 --> 00:28:54,480
Speaker 1: She's like, old witch, let me eat this apple. Snow

490
00:28:54,520 --> 00:28:56,760
Speaker 1: White does tell a bird to smile, so she's not

491
00:28:56,800 --> 00:29:03,120
Speaker 1: a feminist. Hey, sad bird, you look prettier when you smiled.

492
00:29:04,040 --> 00:29:07,880
Speaker 1: Another logic question. The huntsman who is supposed to kill

493
00:29:07,880 --> 00:29:10,600
Speaker 1: snow White and then doesn't, is like, get out of here,

494
00:29:10,680 --> 00:29:14,240
Speaker 1: and then she snow is offer as she's like everything

495
00:29:14,360 --> 00:29:17,200
Speaker 1: is scary to me, and then we see like it's

496
00:29:17,200 --> 00:29:19,480
Speaker 1: a beautiful animated sequence of her being afraid of the

497
00:29:19,520 --> 00:29:22,160
Speaker 1: four but then it's like it appears to be the

498
00:29:22,200 --> 00:29:26,400
Speaker 1: next day, were she just thrashing around the forest all

499
00:29:26,480 --> 00:29:30,880
Speaker 1: damn night, like like and then it turns out nothing

500
00:29:31,000 --> 00:29:33,080
Speaker 1: was scary the whole time, and then she's like, hey,

501
00:29:33,320 --> 00:29:36,040
Speaker 1: birds should smile. Well yeah, I mean she has a

502
00:29:36,080 --> 00:29:39,400
Speaker 1: near death experience. There's like this kind of surreal sequence

503
00:29:39,440 --> 00:29:41,280
Speaker 1: where she's running through the woods and the trees look

504
00:29:41,360 --> 00:29:43,960
Speaker 1: like they have faces and they're grabbing at her. And

505
00:29:44,080 --> 00:29:46,040
Speaker 1: of course, I mean and it would make sense that

506
00:29:46,120 --> 00:29:49,320
Speaker 1: she is having a reaction like this because again she

507
00:29:49,400 --> 00:29:51,960
Speaker 1: was nearly just murdered. Yeah, but it does seem like

508
00:29:52,000 --> 00:29:55,080
Speaker 1: she just passes out for the whole night in the woods. Yeah,

509
00:29:55,600 --> 00:29:59,719
Speaker 1: her fight or flight is not good. She really couldn't

510
00:29:59,760 --> 00:30:01,960
Speaker 1: make a call. She's like, let they just play dead.

511
00:30:02,000 --> 00:30:05,240
Speaker 1: Actually there is a third its foreshadow of what happens later.

512
00:30:06,160 --> 00:30:08,560
Speaker 1: But it is almost like she has the opposite of

513
00:30:08,720 --> 00:30:14,680
Speaker 1: agency as a character. Like when she is incapacitated, good

514
00:30:14,720 --> 00:30:18,960
Speaker 1: things happened to her, But anytime she acts like proactively

515
00:30:19,080 --> 00:30:22,080
Speaker 1: in the story, she's just suck herself. Yeah. She runs

516
00:30:22,080 --> 00:30:25,440
Speaker 1: into the forest and like runs around until she passes out,

517
00:30:25,480 --> 00:30:27,959
Speaker 1: run into a pile of haro. Like what what does

518
00:30:28,040 --> 00:30:33,040
Speaker 1: she It's her hallucinations? Yeah, yeah, I mean, in what

519
00:30:33,280 --> 00:30:35,080
Speaker 1: would actually happen if you passed out in a forest?

520
00:30:35,080 --> 00:30:37,080
Speaker 1: For a night. Is like the animals would come and

521
00:30:37,600 --> 00:30:41,600
Speaker 1: eat the soft meat of your face, but because she's

522
00:30:41,640 --> 00:30:44,719
Speaker 1: so pretty when she's passed out, they again or just like,

523
00:30:44,760 --> 00:30:49,640
Speaker 1: oh you're too pretty to eat there, and then also

524
00:30:49,680 --> 00:30:52,000
Speaker 1: snow way when she comes to in the forest after

525
00:30:52,040 --> 00:30:57,680
Speaker 1: her wild night, she comes and she immediately apologizes to

526
00:30:57,840 --> 00:31:01,640
Speaker 1: the animals. She's like, I made such a fush. She's like,

527
00:31:01,760 --> 00:31:07,520
Speaker 1: so ashamed of the mess I've made, yea, and they're like,

528
00:31:07,800 --> 00:31:15,240
Speaker 1: don't worry about it, but that was pretty embarrassed. So well, okay,

529
00:31:15,240 --> 00:31:18,640
Speaker 1: So so she is the protagonist of this story, but Jack,

530
00:31:18,680 --> 00:31:21,720
Speaker 1: You're right, she does almost nothing. She's so inactive. She

531
00:31:21,760 --> 00:31:25,200
Speaker 1: has so little agency. In fact, the only choices I

532
00:31:25,240 --> 00:31:28,760
Speaker 1: think that she really actively makes to do anything in

533
00:31:28,760 --> 00:31:31,600
Speaker 1: the story to run into the woods away from that,

534
00:31:31,680 --> 00:31:34,760
Speaker 1: but only because he told her to run that way,

535
00:31:35,000 --> 00:31:40,240
Speaker 1: and she's like, you listen to the person who was

536
00:31:40,280 --> 00:31:42,520
Speaker 1: about to kill you, of like, hey, you know what

537
00:31:42,560 --> 00:31:46,280
Speaker 1: you should do it? Like right, So she does that,

538
00:31:46,400 --> 00:31:48,440
Speaker 1: and then she the next tree. She makes this to

539
00:31:48,480 --> 00:31:51,120
Speaker 1: go into the dwarf's house, which she doesn't even find,

540
00:31:51,320 --> 00:31:53,080
Speaker 1: Like it would be one thing if she was looking

541
00:31:53,080 --> 00:31:54,640
Speaker 1: around like, oh, what do I do let me like

542
00:31:54,680 --> 00:31:58,880
Speaker 1: try to, but yeah, the animals are just like here,

543
00:31:59,000 --> 00:32:02,240
Speaker 1: here's a house, leap here, and then she just goes in.

544
00:32:02,440 --> 00:32:04,680
Speaker 1: And then the next bed decision, by the way, just

545
00:32:04,800 --> 00:32:08,800
Speaker 1: find a house in the woods, just break in and

546
00:32:08,840 --> 00:32:13,280
Speaker 1: be like I'm gonna pass out in their beds, like

547
00:32:13,360 --> 00:32:16,440
Speaker 1: assume they'll be cool with it. Like getting pick ax

548
00:32:16,520 --> 00:32:19,400
Speaker 1: to death is what you would expect. Yeah, and it

549
00:32:19,480 --> 00:32:23,640
Speaker 1: almost happens, but she's too hot to Thank god, she's

550
00:32:23,680 --> 00:32:27,400
Speaker 1: so hot. There she does choose to run away from

551
00:32:27,440 --> 00:32:29,560
Speaker 1: the prince who she's in love with. That she says,

552
00:32:30,720 --> 00:32:33,200
Speaker 1: she makes the choice to be scared by a man

553
00:32:33,280 --> 00:32:36,000
Speaker 1: doing something scary. I don't even that's more of a

554
00:32:36,120 --> 00:32:39,080
Speaker 1: just a reaction, right, really she did something, she did

555
00:32:39,120 --> 00:32:43,800
Speaker 1: something just given her credit foray and hide her disgusting

556
00:32:43,880 --> 00:32:47,400
Speaker 1: self from the love of her life because she's not

557
00:32:47,640 --> 00:32:51,240
Speaker 1: made up and pretty yeah, embarrassing. And then the next

558
00:32:51,280 --> 00:32:55,520
Speaker 1: choice she makes is to clean the dwarf's house. And

559
00:32:55,560 --> 00:32:58,120
Speaker 1: then pretty much the next active choice she makes after

560
00:32:58,160 --> 00:33:00,400
Speaker 1: that is a while later in the movie when she

561
00:33:00,440 --> 00:33:03,920
Speaker 1: eats the apple that the queen gives her. It's fun.

562
00:33:03,960 --> 00:33:07,000
Speaker 1: The end sequence of this movie is a wild chase

563
00:33:07,080 --> 00:33:11,000
Speaker 1: to save snow White because she is literally too dumb.

564
00:33:11,320 --> 00:33:13,800
Speaker 1: Like that is the whole Like the animals are like,

565
00:33:13,800 --> 00:33:15,800
Speaker 1: oh no, she's dumb. She's dumb. What do we do?

566
00:33:16,800 --> 00:33:19,440
Speaker 1: Get apple? And so they run to get the dwarves

567
00:33:19,480 --> 00:33:21,600
Speaker 1: and then the dwarves figure it out. They're like, oh no,

568
00:33:21,680 --> 00:33:24,560
Speaker 1: she's too dumb, we gotta go and and they're right,

569
00:33:24,680 --> 00:33:29,120
Speaker 1: she's too dumb. It's it's very frustrating there. It's like

570
00:33:29,160 --> 00:33:33,800
Speaker 1: this relay race to stop snow White from doing anything

571
00:33:33,800 --> 00:33:37,800
Speaker 1: because whenever she does something, she almost kills herself. That's

572
00:33:38,000 --> 00:33:41,600
Speaker 1: the explicit message of the movie is if you are active,

573
00:33:41,760 --> 00:33:44,960
Speaker 1: if you make decisions for yourself, you will kill yourself.

574
00:33:45,040 --> 00:33:47,720
Speaker 1: But if you just sit back and like pray for

575
00:33:47,760 --> 00:33:51,280
Speaker 1: something to happen or pass out and just sleep it off,

576
00:33:51,440 --> 00:33:54,200
Speaker 1: like then things will work out in your favor. So

577
00:33:54,240 --> 00:33:58,760
Speaker 1: it's like brainwashing people and specifically children young women to

578
00:33:58,800 --> 00:34:01,200
Speaker 1: be like as passive as possible. Well, and then on

579
00:34:01,240 --> 00:34:03,959
Speaker 1: the other side of that is like the Queen is

580
00:34:04,160 --> 00:34:07,920
Speaker 1: always making active choices and it's just totally demonizes a

581
00:34:08,000 --> 00:34:11,200
Speaker 1: woman doing anything. It's like, well, if she's doing something,

582
00:34:11,280 --> 00:34:14,279
Speaker 1: it's probably going to be fucked up and evil, like

583
00:34:14,640 --> 00:34:17,319
Speaker 1: because the queen pretty much only makes active choices, and

584
00:34:17,360 --> 00:34:21,080
Speaker 1: they're always destructive to this character that we're supposed to love.

585
00:34:21,239 --> 00:34:24,319
Speaker 1: So it's like you're getting it from both sides, right,

586
00:34:24,400 --> 00:34:27,799
Speaker 1: Because as the protagonist of any story, we're supposed to

587
00:34:27,800 --> 00:34:30,640
Speaker 1: see them encountering obstacles and doing things to try to

588
00:34:30,719 --> 00:34:34,360
Speaker 1: overcome those obstacles and make active choices in the story.

589
00:34:34,400 --> 00:34:36,200
Speaker 1: But we see almost none of that in Snow White.

590
00:34:36,560 --> 00:34:39,520
Speaker 1: And I think because she is a woman in this movie,

591
00:34:39,560 --> 00:34:41,719
Speaker 1: and sure, this is you know, this is decades ago.

592
00:34:41,760 --> 00:34:44,719
Speaker 1: Its seven that this movie comes out. It's a whole

593
00:34:44,920 --> 00:34:47,719
Speaker 1: generations ago of an era. Like you know, it's no

594
00:34:47,880 --> 00:34:50,520
Speaker 1: mo Wanna thinks have changed a lot since then, But

595
00:34:51,000 --> 00:34:54,799
Speaker 1: young kids were consuming this and and still do and

596
00:34:54,840 --> 00:34:58,479
Speaker 1: still do. And seeing like other movies of this same

597
00:34:58,520 --> 00:35:01,239
Speaker 1: era where there's a male hero, we did see them

598
00:35:01,239 --> 00:35:04,200
Speaker 1: make active choices because they were like swashbucklers and like

599
00:35:04,560 --> 00:35:07,719
Speaker 1: you know, all these like adventure stories. But because this

600
00:35:07,800 --> 00:35:10,520
Speaker 1: is a female protagonist in this movie, I think a

601
00:35:10,560 --> 00:35:12,960
Speaker 1: deliberate choice was made. And of course it was adapted

602
00:35:13,000 --> 00:35:17,080
Speaker 1: from something material. Let's make a ten minute long story

603
00:35:17,080 --> 00:35:20,400
Speaker 1: that's bad women and eighty minute long story, right, they

604
00:35:21,040 --> 00:35:23,279
Speaker 1: in an adaptation, you can make choices to change the

605
00:35:23,320 --> 00:35:25,960
Speaker 1: source material. But yeah, they just made this very passive

606
00:35:26,080 --> 00:35:29,960
Speaker 1: female character which sends a message like, yeah, women shouldn't

607
00:35:29,960 --> 00:35:32,319
Speaker 1: be doing things woodmen shouldn't have any agency, and if

608
00:35:32,320 --> 00:35:35,040
Speaker 1: they're doing things, they're bad. They're making mistakes. Yeah, and

609
00:35:35,080 --> 00:35:37,680
Speaker 1: it's bad. Yeah. I think they did make a lot

610
00:35:37,719 --> 00:35:40,680
Speaker 1: of changes to the story from when it was a

611
00:35:40,680 --> 00:35:44,440
Speaker 1: fairy tale, but like all arbitrary and none like in

612
00:35:44,480 --> 00:35:47,239
Speaker 1: the intry, it was all just to simplify it. In

613
00:35:47,320 --> 00:35:50,640
Speaker 1: the fairy tale, I wonder if the dwarves knew. We

614
00:35:50,680 --> 00:35:53,839
Speaker 1: find out they've never taken a bath before, and then

615
00:35:53,840 --> 00:35:58,040
Speaker 1: there's a ten minute sequence of them washing them. So

616
00:35:58,560 --> 00:36:01,360
Speaker 1: it's hardly In the movie, it's mostly the dwarfs dock ship.

617
00:36:01,520 --> 00:36:03,160
Speaker 1: So yeah, I wanted to get to that too, because

618
00:36:03,160 --> 00:36:06,680
Speaker 1: there's like all the extended animated bits are either animals

619
00:36:06,719 --> 00:36:10,400
Speaker 1: or dwarves. There's like the animation problem that still exists

620
00:36:10,480 --> 00:36:14,800
Speaker 1: right now of like all the male characters look different

621
00:36:14,880 --> 00:36:17,000
Speaker 1: and look like cartoons and have like a lot of

622
00:36:17,040 --> 00:36:21,080
Speaker 1: different features, and the female characters, i mean, snow White

623
00:36:21,080 --> 00:36:24,600
Speaker 1: and the Queen basically have the same face. Like there's

624
00:36:24,719 --> 00:36:28,799
Speaker 1: very little difference between their faces, so that's infuriating. But

625
00:36:29,080 --> 00:36:33,279
Speaker 1: the dwarves don't know what water is. They also we

626
00:36:33,360 --> 00:36:35,799
Speaker 1: see them walking over a body of water on their

627
00:36:35,840 --> 00:36:38,279
Speaker 1: way back from work. But snow it's like, hey, you

628
00:36:38,320 --> 00:36:40,319
Speaker 1: have to wash your face or I'm not gonna give

629
00:36:40,360 --> 00:36:44,560
Speaker 1: you soup, and they're like, okay, it seems reasonable, and

630
00:36:44,560 --> 00:36:46,320
Speaker 1: and then one of them is like what is this

631
00:36:46,640 --> 00:36:49,799
Speaker 1: and then they learn how to wash their face and

632
00:36:49,840 --> 00:36:55,560
Speaker 1: grumpy the libertarian ten minutes long. It's so stupid, And yeah,

633
00:36:55,560 --> 00:36:57,160
Speaker 1: they don't know how to feed them, Like what were

634
00:36:57,160 --> 00:36:59,839
Speaker 1: they going to eat if she didn't make food for them?

635
00:36:59,840 --> 00:37:02,480
Speaker 1: Be because they're just like so amazed that she's willing

636
00:37:02,480 --> 00:37:04,120
Speaker 1: to make food for them. How do they not know

637
00:37:04,160 --> 00:37:06,080
Speaker 1: what water is? But they do know how to build

638
00:37:06,080 --> 00:37:10,120
Speaker 1: a glass coffin and throw a Christian funeral. It doesn't

639
00:37:10,160 --> 00:37:13,560
Speaker 1: make any sense, it's just And then to your point

640
00:37:13,600 --> 00:37:17,480
Speaker 1: about she and the Queen look like actual female forms,

641
00:37:17,520 --> 00:37:22,160
Speaker 1: not necessarily super realistical, though more realistic than in later

642
00:37:22,200 --> 00:37:25,440
Speaker 1: Disney movies like Jasmine, with like a tiny, tiny waist

643
00:37:25,520 --> 00:37:29,920
Speaker 1: kind of thing in Aladdin, right proportionally better better, but

644
00:37:30,160 --> 00:37:34,000
Speaker 1: not great better. She looks like a mature female form,

645
00:37:34,040 --> 00:37:37,440
Speaker 1: whereas the Dwarfs all look like I mean, well, that's

646
00:37:37,440 --> 00:37:40,319
Speaker 1: a whole other thing, which is like, how insensitive is

647
00:37:40,360 --> 00:37:43,880
Speaker 1: this movie to little people? Probably just as insensitive as

648
00:37:43,920 --> 00:37:47,040
Speaker 1: The Wizard of Oz is. Yeah, not good, right, not good?

649
00:37:47,120 --> 00:37:49,680
Speaker 1: But but just speaking from like how the male and

650
00:37:49,719 --> 00:37:51,920
Speaker 1: female characters are animated. We were talking about this in

651
00:37:51,920 --> 00:37:58,200
Speaker 1: our Hot Roundabout plug for our Patreon bonus episode about Ghostbusters.

652
00:37:58,239 --> 00:38:01,560
Speaker 1: How all the ghosts in the Ghostbusters, if they're male,

653
00:38:01,719 --> 00:38:04,000
Speaker 1: they look different, and you've got a slim er in there.

654
00:38:04,000 --> 00:38:06,640
Speaker 1: And but then the one female ghost you see is

655
00:38:06,840 --> 00:38:09,439
Speaker 1: literally a hot woman, but you can see through her. Yeah,

656
00:38:09,640 --> 00:38:15,840
Speaker 1: same thing in Casper. Not good, that's really transparent swish

657
00:38:16,280 --> 00:38:20,560
Speaker 1: point for Jecko. Yeah, and I think this movie is

658
00:38:20,600 --> 00:38:25,160
Speaker 1: important in the precedent. It's like Little Mermaid. Even though

659
00:38:25,600 --> 00:38:29,600
Speaker 1: Ariel has, you know, her own interests and she makes

660
00:38:29,640 --> 00:38:34,040
Speaker 1: active decisions, there's still weird stuff like the prince falls

661
00:38:34,080 --> 00:38:36,440
Speaker 1: in love with her when she can't speak, and like,

662
00:38:36,600 --> 00:38:40,040
Speaker 1: I feel like that's a holdover from this where people

663
00:38:40,360 --> 00:38:44,320
Speaker 1: only fall in love with characters when they're asleep, where

664
00:38:44,320 --> 00:38:46,640
Speaker 1: people like them better when they're asleep. So it's like

665
00:38:46,760 --> 00:38:51,960
Speaker 1: seem not heard clean cook and you know, don't make

666
00:38:52,000 --> 00:38:54,920
Speaker 1: any rash decisions. Yeah, it's like it's only possible to

667
00:38:54,960 --> 00:38:57,760
Speaker 1: fall in love with the woman when it's literally physically

668
00:38:57,800 --> 00:39:01,279
Speaker 1: impossible to get to know her right there, right it's

669
00:39:01,280 --> 00:39:05,239
Speaker 1: physically impossible for her to resist, like because she's unconscious.

670
00:39:05,480 --> 00:39:07,320
Speaker 1: Well it snow way. I want to talk about the

671
00:39:07,360 --> 00:39:10,080
Speaker 1: scene where she we find out that she wants something

672
00:39:10,120 --> 00:39:12,560
Speaker 1: in life for the first time, when the dwarves are like,

673
00:39:12,600 --> 00:39:15,880
Speaker 1: telling us a story, please, even though they're seventy and

674
00:39:15,960 --> 00:39:24,319
Speaker 1: need to relax. They're like, we're babies, creepy. But she said, okay,

675
00:39:24,360 --> 00:39:28,000
Speaker 1: I'll tell you a story. And she describes the prince

676
00:39:28,320 --> 00:39:33,520
Speaker 1: somehow without using the word sweatpants, which is but she

677
00:39:33,520 --> 00:39:36,520
Speaker 1: she says, anyone could see he was charming, even though

678
00:39:36,840 --> 00:39:39,480
Speaker 1: we've she's barely seen him. They don't know each other

679
00:39:39,560 --> 00:39:41,840
Speaker 1: at all. It's the same thing where a woman and

680
00:39:41,880 --> 00:39:44,240
Speaker 1: a man fall in love in these very hetero fucking

681
00:39:44,280 --> 00:39:46,919
Speaker 1: love stories, where they just fall in love because they're

682
00:39:46,960 --> 00:39:49,040
Speaker 1: near each other. They haven't gotten to know each other

683
00:39:49,080 --> 00:39:51,400
Speaker 1: at all. They're a bang up couple. They're not cute.

684
00:39:51,440 --> 00:39:54,800
Speaker 1: They're not cute. It's bad. They look like siblings. And

685
00:39:54,920 --> 00:39:59,719
Speaker 1: then and then one of the dwarves interjections like did

686
00:39:59,719 --> 00:40:02,919
Speaker 1: he steal a kiss? I was like, ah, man, come on,

687
00:40:03,280 --> 00:40:07,200
Speaker 1: and she's like, no, bunny, we and and then she's

688
00:40:07,280 --> 00:40:10,640
Speaker 1: and then she screams at them or as that's how

689
00:40:10,680 --> 00:40:14,319
Speaker 1: snow it sings. She just like everyone's like, oh, that

690
00:40:14,400 --> 00:40:20,680
Speaker 1: was so pretty. Sleep in our beds please. I want

691
00:40:20,719 --> 00:40:23,719
Speaker 1: to talk more about the all the domestic chores that

692
00:40:23,800 --> 00:40:26,200
Speaker 1: she does, because it's basically, as far as we know,

693
00:40:26,280 --> 00:40:28,439
Speaker 1: the only skills she has to offer in the movie,

694
00:40:28,520 --> 00:40:32,239
Speaker 1: apart from her sort of supernatural ability to communicate with

695
00:40:32,280 --> 00:40:36,279
Speaker 1: and control animals. But realistically, all we really see her

696
00:40:36,320 --> 00:40:40,279
Speaker 1: do is cook and clean. So that's the only thing

697
00:40:40,400 --> 00:40:43,239
Speaker 1: the audience really knows about her in terms of what

698
00:40:43,320 --> 00:40:46,239
Speaker 1: she's able to do. And not that there's anything wrong

699
00:40:46,280 --> 00:40:48,840
Speaker 1: with domestic chores. I do them all the time. I

700
00:40:48,880 --> 00:40:54,239
Speaker 1: wash some dishes earlier today, please drag. But like the

701
00:40:54,239 --> 00:40:57,160
Speaker 1: thing is, when society has historically seen women as people

702
00:40:57,280 --> 00:41:00,640
Speaker 1: who can only do domestic chores and should be barefoot

703
00:41:00,680 --> 00:41:03,719
Speaker 1: in the kitchen, this movie just reinforces that that's what

704
00:41:04,120 --> 00:41:07,120
Speaker 1: female characters only can do and should be doing. I

705
00:41:07,160 --> 00:41:11,400
Speaker 1: also think that the insane set up of when the

706
00:41:11,520 --> 00:41:16,520
Speaker 1: Queen comes in the disguise of an ugly old poor person,

707
00:41:17,520 --> 00:41:20,600
Speaker 1: shows up at her house. Snow White is singing about

708
00:41:20,600 --> 00:41:26,040
Speaker 1: how she wants a boyfriend making pots for these geriatrical

709
00:41:26,320 --> 00:41:29,640
Speaker 1: creeps that she takes care of. And it's only known

710
00:41:29,680 --> 00:41:31,799
Speaker 1: for her, I think a day a day. Why are

711
00:41:31,840 --> 00:41:34,120
Speaker 1: they more in her for a year because she's hot.

712
00:41:34,239 --> 00:41:36,319
Speaker 1: She's so hot. She's so hot. We only knew her

713
00:41:36,320 --> 00:41:38,360
Speaker 1: for a day. But god damn it if she wasn't

714
00:41:38,520 --> 00:41:42,600
Speaker 1: very hot. Yeah, she's taken from one place where she's

715
00:41:42,640 --> 00:41:46,279
Speaker 1: like seen cleaning and is basically safe there, and then

716
00:41:46,320 --> 00:41:48,880
Speaker 1: she's out in the woods like running by herself, and

717
00:41:48,960 --> 00:41:51,399
Speaker 1: that scene is very dangerous. Then she arrives at this

718
00:41:51,560 --> 00:41:53,759
Speaker 1: other house where she can like cook and clean and

719
00:41:53,800 --> 00:41:56,760
Speaker 1: she's safe, and then like is put in a coma.

720
00:41:56,840 --> 00:41:58,919
Speaker 1: But then the prince like picks her up to take

721
00:41:58,960 --> 00:42:02,200
Speaker 1: her off to first really carries her. She cannot even

722
00:42:02,480 --> 00:42:06,640
Speaker 1: walk her own legs, and well then the queen. What

723
00:42:06,760 --> 00:42:08,560
Speaker 1: I detail of the story I forgot was when the

724
00:42:08,640 --> 00:42:11,600
Speaker 1: queen does show or the whatever, the witch shows up

725
00:42:11,880 --> 00:42:14,840
Speaker 1: with the little apple that she like temps snow White,

726
00:42:14,880 --> 00:42:16,960
Speaker 1: not I I just remember Snowy eating the apple. I

727
00:42:17,000 --> 00:42:19,520
Speaker 1: didn't remember that. She's like, it's a wishing apple. What

728
00:42:19,600 --> 00:42:22,640
Speaker 1: do you want And she's like, um, well, there's this guy.

729
00:42:22,880 --> 00:42:26,319
Speaker 1: And she goes on for like a while, just shut up,

730
00:42:27,719 --> 00:42:30,920
Speaker 1: like we're actually ready for you to be dead. But

731
00:42:31,040 --> 00:42:33,279
Speaker 1: she she's like talking about like, oh, there's this guy

732
00:42:33,320 --> 00:42:36,440
Speaker 1: in sweatpants that came to my house and I just

733
00:42:37,520 --> 00:42:41,120
Speaker 1: if he doesn't rob dog me, I'll die. And then

734
00:42:41,239 --> 00:42:44,520
Speaker 1: she does die, right, But the fact that the queen

735
00:42:44,840 --> 00:42:50,040
Speaker 1: like that same crazy thing is stated again because there's

736
00:42:50,080 --> 00:42:52,759
Speaker 1: nothing else to talk about with snow White. That's the

737
00:42:52,800 --> 00:42:54,719
Speaker 1: only thing we know about her is that she wants

738
00:42:54,719 --> 00:42:57,480
Speaker 1: to date this guy in sweatpants she's met once, yeah,

739
00:42:57,840 --> 00:43:01,440
Speaker 1: and hardly interacted with at all, Like they sang in

740
00:43:01,440 --> 00:43:04,120
Speaker 1: each other a little bit or near each other, but

741
00:43:04,160 --> 00:43:06,759
Speaker 1: like they don't know anything about Okay, so you can

742
00:43:06,880 --> 00:43:09,360
Speaker 1: argue this is a fairy tale. There's a lot of

743
00:43:09,400 --> 00:43:13,560
Speaker 1: suspension of disbelief, like this is how fairy tales play out. Well,

744
00:43:14,239 --> 00:43:17,320
Speaker 1: fuck fairy tales. They're stupid and I hate them and

745
00:43:17,360 --> 00:43:20,200
Speaker 1: they just reinforce these like rigid gender roles that are

746
00:43:20,239 --> 00:43:23,920
Speaker 1: dictated by the patriarchy, and they are no good and

747
00:43:23,960 --> 00:43:30,560
Speaker 1: I'm over fairy tales, sorry, And I don't think that

748
00:43:30,719 --> 00:43:35,520
Speaker 1: all fairy tales necessarily did that. I'm trying to think

749
00:43:35,520 --> 00:43:38,120
Speaker 1: of fairy tales that I heard, but this like was

750
00:43:38,160 --> 00:43:41,439
Speaker 1: the first fairy tale that they brought to movies. Yeah,

751
00:43:41,440 --> 00:43:44,879
Speaker 1: I really think it was like a weird thing with Disney,

752
00:43:44,920 --> 00:43:47,560
Speaker 1: Like if they had had somebody who was less like

753
00:43:47,640 --> 00:43:50,759
Speaker 1: women should be seen, not heard and cook and make

754
00:43:50,800 --> 00:43:55,160
Speaker 1: me dinner, like, I feel like maybe we wouldn't have. Like,

755
00:43:55,360 --> 00:43:58,000
Speaker 1: it's just a very The Disney Princess is like very

756
00:43:58,040 --> 00:44:01,520
Speaker 1: specifically one guy's idea of like what women should be,

757
00:44:01,600 --> 00:44:04,000
Speaker 1: and I did a lot of damage. Sure, I mean

758
00:44:04,080 --> 00:44:06,320
Speaker 1: I would say of the fairy tales that sent her around,

759
00:44:06,400 --> 00:44:10,640
Speaker 1: a romantic relationship, usually between a prince and or princess,

760
00:44:10,680 --> 00:44:13,640
Speaker 1: usually one of them is a royal. Usually the woman

761
00:44:13,920 --> 00:44:17,600
Speaker 1: is unconscious for at least part of the story, and

762
00:44:17,640 --> 00:44:22,640
Speaker 1: if she's not unconscious, she is like if she's or something.

763
00:44:23,280 --> 00:44:25,520
Speaker 1: Of the ones that depict that type of story of

764
00:44:25,560 --> 00:44:31,359
Speaker 1: like a romantic story, they are very very damaging. Well,

765
00:44:31,360 --> 00:44:35,160
Speaker 1: it's like the whole message is like if she's unable

766
00:44:35,200 --> 00:44:39,560
Speaker 1: to give consent, it's true love, baby, Like it's crazy

767
00:44:40,120 --> 00:44:43,600
Speaker 1: so yeah, okay, let's talk about that scene where she

768
00:44:43,760 --> 00:44:46,759
Speaker 1: is unconscious. Everyone thinks she's dead, the dwarves, as far

769
00:44:46,800 --> 00:44:49,359
Speaker 1: as I know, she is dead, but they've kept her

770
00:44:49,360 --> 00:44:53,879
Speaker 1: in this like coffin above ground and the Prince has

771
00:44:53,920 --> 00:44:58,080
Speaker 1: heard about the woman in the coffin. He shows up

772
00:44:58,440 --> 00:45:00,120
Speaker 1: and it's like, oh, yeah, this is the girl that

773
00:45:00,160 --> 00:45:03,680
Speaker 1: I sang at for five minutes a year ago. He yeah.

774
00:45:04,000 --> 00:45:09,040
Speaker 1: He also has not written new material pretty sing song

775
00:45:11,320 --> 00:45:15,239
Speaker 1: singing his song. I have one song kind of it.

776
00:45:15,320 --> 00:45:17,919
Speaker 1: So he's staying on brand. At least he has one song.

777
00:45:17,960 --> 00:45:20,560
Speaker 1: And he just keeps saying he's very strong. But it's

778
00:45:20,600 --> 00:45:24,080
Speaker 1: like he the print heard that if he stumbled into

779
00:45:24,120 --> 00:45:29,840
Speaker 1: the woods he might find a corpse to marry, like okay, okay,

780
00:45:29,920 --> 00:45:33,520
Speaker 1: and then he, for whatever reason, makes the choice to

781
00:45:33,880 --> 00:45:38,160
Speaker 1: kiss that corpse. How did how did the prince? Here?

782
00:45:38,160 --> 00:45:40,520
Speaker 1: Were the dwarves like, hey, we've got a corpse in

783
00:45:40,560 --> 00:45:43,840
Speaker 1: the woods. You maybe if you make it sound like

784
00:45:43,920 --> 00:45:47,880
Speaker 1: word like everybody was gossiping about the girl in the

785
00:45:47,920 --> 00:45:51,760
Speaker 1: glass coffin. But keep in mind everybody thought she was dead,

786
00:45:52,000 --> 00:45:54,439
Speaker 1: so he was going to see a dead girl, right

787
00:45:54,520 --> 00:45:57,399
Speaker 1: the only coffin and kiss her the only person who

788
00:45:57,400 --> 00:46:00,560
Speaker 1: would have known was the queen, and she she's dead.

789
00:46:01,200 --> 00:46:03,480
Speaker 1: So yeah, there would be no reason for anyone to

790
00:46:03,520 --> 00:46:06,520
Speaker 1: think that by kissing her she would come back to life.

791
00:46:06,880 --> 00:46:10,680
Speaker 1: But setting aside that story logic or lack thereof, he

792
00:46:10,800 --> 00:46:14,480
Speaker 1: still kisses an unconscious woman. So she cannot consent to this.

793
00:46:15,120 --> 00:46:18,200
Speaker 1: But instead of it like having the consequences that it

794
00:46:18,239 --> 00:46:20,839
Speaker 1: should have, which is like, oh, you kissed me and

795
00:46:20,880 --> 00:46:24,200
Speaker 1: I wasn't able to consent to it, You're a fucking rapist.

796
00:46:24,400 --> 00:46:26,960
Speaker 1: Get away from me, it wakes her up and it

797
00:46:27,200 --> 00:46:32,280
Speaker 1: lifts the curse. He very good according to the story

798
00:46:32,800 --> 00:46:36,600
Speaker 1: that he kissed her unconscious body. It's literally like an

799
00:46:36,719 --> 00:46:42,360
Speaker 1: s VU episode. It's like so weird, it's just the

800
00:46:42,400 --> 00:46:45,680
Speaker 1: sounds a very very dangerous message to everyone watching this

801
00:46:45,800 --> 00:46:48,440
Speaker 1: that if you kiss an unconscious woman, hey, good things

802
00:46:48,520 --> 00:46:51,120
Speaker 1: might happen. It might bring her back to life. So

803
00:46:51,280 --> 00:46:54,760
Speaker 1: that's very irresponsible of any story that does this, which

804
00:46:55,040 --> 00:46:57,840
Speaker 1: is a lot and speaking of her being unconscious. Okay,

805
00:46:57,840 --> 00:47:02,480
Speaker 1: So there are a bunch of movies where in the

806
00:47:02,520 --> 00:47:06,200
Speaker 1: climactic sequence, and this is especially true of like action

807
00:47:06,239 --> 00:47:10,200
Speaker 1: adventure movies, the one female character of the story because

808
00:47:10,200 --> 00:47:13,839
Speaker 1: there's probably only one has been captured, tied up and

809
00:47:13,840 --> 00:47:16,520
Speaker 1: physically restrained in some way and unable to contribute it

810
00:47:16,560 --> 00:47:19,280
Speaker 1: all to the events of the story in this climactic sequence,

811
00:47:19,520 --> 00:47:22,040
Speaker 1: so she can't do anything to help the male hero

812
00:47:22,200 --> 00:47:24,600
Speaker 1: defeat the villain because she's all tied up. This is

813
00:47:24,640 --> 00:47:29,640
Speaker 1: true of Ghostbusters, The Mummy, Die Hard, Who Friend, Roger Rabbit,

814
00:47:29,960 --> 00:47:33,040
Speaker 1: dozens and dozens of other movies. What's even crazier is

815
00:47:33,040 --> 00:47:36,279
Speaker 1: when this happens in a movie with a protagonist is

816
00:47:36,280 --> 00:47:38,880
Speaker 1: a woman, and it still happens like she should be

817
00:47:38,920 --> 00:47:41,239
Speaker 1: the one in this movie snow White, because she's the

818
00:47:41,239 --> 00:47:44,479
Speaker 1: protagonist of the story. She should be driving the story.

819
00:47:44,600 --> 00:47:47,600
Speaker 1: She should have a strong desire and be actively doing

820
00:47:47,640 --> 00:47:50,480
Speaker 1: things to try to achieve that. But instead she is

821
00:47:50,520 --> 00:47:54,239
Speaker 1: rendered completely unconscious and cannot even contribute to the climax

822
00:47:54,360 --> 00:47:57,080
Speaker 1: of her own story, to the point where she has

823
00:47:57,120 --> 00:48:01,520
Speaker 1: no motivation for the majority of the movie, like she yeah,

824
00:48:01,600 --> 00:48:05,839
Speaker 1: she's literally being dragged around to the next location at all,

825
00:48:05,920 --> 00:48:09,399
Speaker 1: Like it's just it's then this is true for I mean,

826
00:48:09,719 --> 00:48:12,680
Speaker 1: it's less often that this happens where it's a female

827
00:48:12,680 --> 00:48:15,880
Speaker 1: protagonist who can't even dictate the outcome of her own story,

828
00:48:16,200 --> 00:48:19,200
Speaker 1: probably because there are not as many movies with a

829
00:48:19,239 --> 00:48:21,680
Speaker 1: female protagonist. But it happens in Snow White, it happens

830
00:48:21,680 --> 00:48:24,040
Speaker 1: in Sleeping Beauty, it happens in the first Twilight movie,

831
00:48:24,400 --> 00:48:27,800
Speaker 1: where like the female characters like, actually, um, sorry, I

832
00:48:27,800 --> 00:48:31,040
Speaker 1: can't do anything. I'm not awake, and it's just like, ah,

833
00:48:31,600 --> 00:48:36,160
Speaker 1: that is not how storytelling works. I'm very frustrated. It's

834
00:48:36,200 --> 00:48:40,840
Speaker 1: okay overboard that movie. I guess that's not the climate.

835
00:48:40,840 --> 00:48:42,759
Speaker 1: I still haven't seen that movie. I feel like I've

836
00:48:42,760 --> 00:48:46,040
Speaker 1: been hearing a lot about that movies. Well be on

837
00:48:46,040 --> 00:48:48,520
Speaker 1: the lookout. R Yeah, they're not. They're rebooting it, so

838
00:48:49,040 --> 00:48:53,200
Speaker 1: we'll probably do an episode about it. Yeah, comes on

839
00:48:53,280 --> 00:48:58,600
Speaker 1: in April kidnap and convinces her that she has amnesia

840
00:48:58,880 --> 00:49:01,640
Speaker 1: and that she is his wife. That is the story

841
00:49:01,760 --> 00:49:10,160
Speaker 1: of boredom. I'm so ashamed of the mess I've made. Oh,

842
00:49:10,200 --> 00:49:14,560
Speaker 1: we haven't talked about Grumpy fully a libertarian, but also

843
00:49:15,160 --> 00:49:17,480
Speaker 1: says a few different points like and you can you

844
00:49:17,520 --> 00:49:20,359
Speaker 1: can tell that this you know seven is getting big

845
00:49:20,400 --> 00:49:23,640
Speaker 1: old yucks in the audience of like women, you can't

846
00:49:23,800 --> 00:49:26,239
Speaker 1: trust them, you can't like what did they say? Oh?

847
00:49:26,280 --> 00:49:29,600
Speaker 1: He says, um all females is poison. Yeah, all females

848
00:49:29,640 --> 00:49:33,200
Speaker 1: are poison. They full of wicked wild He's basically he's

849
00:49:33,239 --> 00:49:35,800
Speaker 1: suggesting though, that she's going to use her feminine wiles

850
00:49:35,840 --> 00:49:39,640
Speaker 1: to corrupt them or do whatever the fuck. The point

851
00:49:39,719 --> 00:49:43,440
Speaker 1: is Grumpy hates women, hates and makes a point to

852
00:49:43,719 --> 00:49:46,879
Speaker 1: remind every one of this several times throughout the story.

853
00:49:47,120 --> 00:49:49,720
Speaker 1: He can't go to sleep before he's like, oh boy,

854
00:49:49,800 --> 00:49:53,439
Speaker 1: do I hate women? Good night? But he's a whole

855
00:49:53,560 --> 00:49:56,759
Speaker 1: archetype of like male movie character who's like acts like

856
00:49:56,800 --> 00:49:58,799
Speaker 1: he hates women. But then it's like, I hope she's

857
00:49:58,840 --> 00:50:01,439
Speaker 1: all right, and that supposed to like melt your heart

858
00:50:01,480 --> 00:50:07,200
Speaker 1: and like, right, this man of masculinity actually does, Karen,

859
00:50:07,239 --> 00:50:11,399
Speaker 1: we're supposed to he's redeemed and we're supposed to like him. Now, well,

860
00:50:11,440 --> 00:50:13,400
Speaker 1: that's like the whole like grade school myth of like

861
00:50:13,480 --> 00:50:18,920
Speaker 1: if someone treats you like shit, it means you. Because

862
00:50:18,920 --> 00:50:25,040
Speaker 1: she immediately is like, I hope Grumpy likes me, says Grumpy. Yeah.

863
00:50:25,120 --> 00:50:30,320
Speaker 1: She makes a pot over, but the bird somehow knows

864
00:50:30,360 --> 00:50:35,000
Speaker 1: English and knows how to spell the bird grumpy on

865
00:50:35,200 --> 00:50:38,400
Speaker 1: the pie on sanitary animals are stepping on the food

866
00:50:39,200 --> 00:50:41,120
Speaker 1: do you think they did that because they didn't want

867
00:50:41,120 --> 00:50:44,960
Speaker 1: to show a woman like knowing how to write, don't

868
00:50:44,960 --> 00:50:49,200
Speaker 1: get don't get as wrong, so I cannot. But when

869
00:50:49,800 --> 00:50:54,600
Speaker 1: the beds, it's fine for the Oh yeah, yeah, she guys.

870
00:50:54,680 --> 00:50:56,400
Speaker 1: I'm sorry if this makes her less hot to you,

871
00:50:56,480 --> 00:51:00,160
Speaker 1: but she can read. Gross that bird wants to see

872
00:51:00,200 --> 00:51:07,920
Speaker 1: her and Grumpy get back together. It's shipping ship. And

873
00:51:08,680 --> 00:51:11,879
Speaker 1: I don't care for the dwarf smooching. Why is there

874
00:51:11,920 --> 00:51:14,600
Speaker 1: a five minute scene where it kills all the dwarfs

875
00:51:14,760 --> 00:51:17,920
Speaker 1: before they go to work? And Dope keeps trying to

876
00:51:17,960 --> 00:51:24,000
Speaker 1: trick her into kissing him again and keeps like, you're

877
00:51:24,080 --> 00:51:27,160
Speaker 1: so adorable the way you keep trying to trick me

878
00:51:27,200 --> 00:51:30,919
Speaker 1: into kissing. At least she never falls for it, which

879
00:51:30,960 --> 00:51:34,560
Speaker 1: is saying a lot for her, because she is very dumb. Okay,

880
00:51:34,560 --> 00:51:36,840
Speaker 1: so I want to talk about anything. I want to

881
00:51:36,880 --> 00:51:39,160
Speaker 1: talk about how she's framed in this movie, which is

882
00:51:39,200 --> 00:51:42,000
Speaker 1: just like a very And granted, she is young. I

883
00:51:42,000 --> 00:51:45,640
Speaker 1: don't know if we ever know explicitly how old she's

884
00:51:45,719 --> 00:51:48,200
Speaker 1: supposed to be, but I think we can assume teenager,

885
00:51:49,239 --> 00:51:52,239
Speaker 1: So she is young. Therefore, it stands to reason that

886
00:51:52,280 --> 00:51:55,160
Speaker 1: she might be a little naive. But why are so

887
00:51:55,239 --> 00:51:59,000
Speaker 1: many movies about these young princesses who are so naive.

888
00:51:59,400 --> 00:52:01,120
Speaker 1: Put a third be five year old woman in your

889
00:52:01,160 --> 00:52:04,520
Speaker 1: fucking movie who has lived a little bit and seeing

890
00:52:04,680 --> 00:52:08,720
Speaker 1: the world and isn't such a naive piece of ship anyway.

891
00:52:08,760 --> 00:52:11,360
Speaker 1: So she's young, and she's but she's also very meek

892
00:52:11,680 --> 00:52:16,359
Speaker 1: and gentle and docile and delicate and borderline can't do

893
00:52:16,400 --> 00:52:21,920
Speaker 1: anything except domestic chores. She's yeah, she's like crippled by now,

894
00:52:22,120 --> 00:52:25,840
Speaker 1: unable she is to do anything except take care of men. Yeah,

895
00:52:25,960 --> 00:52:29,200
Speaker 1: she just does a lot of Oh, like she's like

896
00:52:29,320 --> 00:52:32,600
Speaker 1: shocked by everything and like take constantly. It's like she's

897
00:52:33,000 --> 00:52:35,440
Speaker 1: there are a couple of times when I heard her

898
00:52:35,480 --> 00:52:38,520
Speaker 1: say something, I was like, that's how a cartoon of

899
00:52:38,560 --> 00:52:41,520
Speaker 1: a dumb character would say that. Now, like it's like

900
00:52:41,960 --> 00:52:44,600
Speaker 1: somehow we got from that being like here's your hero

901
00:52:44,920 --> 00:52:47,600
Speaker 1: to this is how like I think when she says,

902
00:52:47,960 --> 00:52:50,400
Speaker 1: maybe if I clean up, they'll let me stay, I

903
00:52:50,480 --> 00:52:54,000
Speaker 1: was like, sounded like we were supposed to think she's

904
00:52:54,000 --> 00:52:59,960
Speaker 1: an idiot. And again, this is you know, nineteen thirties

905
00:53:00,040 --> 00:53:03,839
Speaker 1: audiences are watching this and they're like, yeah, we've never

906
00:53:03,880 --> 00:53:07,080
Speaker 1: seen a feature length cartoon before sure, I buy this

907
00:53:07,200 --> 00:53:09,400
Speaker 1: as I see it. I mean, it's just like, um,

908
00:53:09,719 --> 00:53:13,440
Speaker 1: because this movie is like a gigantic, enormous, like everyone

909
00:53:13,440 --> 00:53:15,840
Speaker 1: saw this movie, and I think that it was like

910
00:53:15,880 --> 00:53:18,440
Speaker 1: partially because of the story, because like, people wouldn't go

911
00:53:18,520 --> 00:53:20,440
Speaker 1: to see it if if they didn't like the story,

912
00:53:20,840 --> 00:53:22,640
Speaker 1: even though it's like you see it because it's the

913
00:53:22,719 --> 00:53:26,520
Speaker 1: really long cartoon. But there must have been something that

914
00:53:26,640 --> 00:53:30,520
Speaker 1: really worked for everybody, because I mean, this is a

915
00:53:30,520 --> 00:53:33,800
Speaker 1: more iconic movie than a lot of other earlier Disney movies.

916
00:53:34,320 --> 00:53:37,160
Speaker 1: So the fact that people are have watched it for

917
00:53:37,200 --> 00:53:41,920
Speaker 1: decades is upsetting because of how poorly it dreads women

918
00:53:42,440 --> 00:53:45,200
Speaker 1: and presents them in their story. Um. But so she's

919
00:53:45,239 --> 00:53:49,359
Speaker 1: so just like naive and docile that it leads to

920
00:53:49,400 --> 00:53:52,880
Speaker 1: her downfall that she doesn't even get to do anything

921
00:53:52,920 --> 00:53:56,840
Speaker 1: to try to redeem herself for but she gets tricked

922
00:53:56,880 --> 00:53:59,480
Speaker 1: into letting this old woman into her house, and she

923
00:54:00,120 --> 00:54:03,160
Speaker 1: tricked into taking a bye to the apple. But the

924
00:54:03,200 --> 00:54:06,280
Speaker 1: funniest part of this scene is when the old scary

925
00:54:06,320 --> 00:54:10,360
Speaker 1: hag who startles snow white and she's like because ocause

926
00:54:10,440 --> 00:54:16,399
Speaker 1: she does she She's like, hi, right, and she's being

927
00:54:16,440 --> 00:54:21,080
Speaker 1: trailed by those two vultures, which should be seen as

928
00:54:21,080 --> 00:54:25,280
Speaker 1: a bad son there that like look for dead stuff,

929
00:54:25,560 --> 00:54:28,240
Speaker 1: like following her, like ubbing their hands. And the first

930
00:54:28,280 --> 00:54:31,960
Speaker 1: thing that the old witch says to snow White is

931
00:54:32,480 --> 00:54:35,839
Speaker 1: are you all alone, my pet? Anyone call you my pet?

932
00:54:35,920 --> 00:54:39,040
Speaker 1: Do not eat their apples, and also leads with are

933
00:54:39,080 --> 00:54:43,719
Speaker 1: you alone? And she's like, uhuh, She's like are you sure.

934
00:54:43,880 --> 00:54:45,719
Speaker 1: She's like, well, there are some guys that live here,

935
00:54:45,760 --> 00:54:50,040
Speaker 1: but no, I'm by myself, so they're far far away

936
00:54:50,560 --> 00:54:54,160
Speaker 1: the okay, So she is visibly scared in this scene.

937
00:54:54,560 --> 00:54:56,600
Speaker 1: It takes a while for her to trust this woman,

938
00:54:56,600 --> 00:54:59,879
Speaker 1: and she doesn't even let her in until she's like, oh,

939
00:55:00,080 --> 00:55:02,839
Speaker 1: my heart, invite me in and let me sit. So

940
00:55:03,040 --> 00:55:05,560
Speaker 1: to snow White's credit, she doesn't let her in immediately.

941
00:55:06,040 --> 00:55:08,480
Speaker 1: But I don't think this is certainly an act of

942
00:55:08,760 --> 00:55:12,360
Speaker 1: comment on the fact that women are sort of conditioned

943
00:55:12,440 --> 00:55:15,160
Speaker 1: to be polite. I read that one too. I thought

944
00:55:15,200 --> 00:55:17,320
Speaker 1: that too, Yeah, because I mean, I don't think anyone

945
00:55:17,360 --> 00:55:19,760
Speaker 1: who was making this movie was thinking this at all.

946
00:55:19,840 --> 00:55:23,800
Speaker 1: But it is no question that women are conditioned tota

947
00:55:24,120 --> 00:55:29,360
Speaker 1: to people. Yeah, exactly, because if we don't the consequences

948
00:55:29,400 --> 00:55:33,080
Speaker 1: could be disastrous. That is a direct quote from Back

949
00:55:33,120 --> 00:55:38,640
Speaker 1: to the Future. But sorry, but yeah, I mean sometimes

950
00:55:38,760 --> 00:55:40,960
Speaker 1: if you say no to the wrong person, they will

951
00:55:40,960 --> 00:55:43,759
Speaker 1: get very scary and violent towards you, such as do

952
00:55:43,800 --> 00:55:45,640
Speaker 1: you remember earlier in the movie when that guy in

953
00:55:45,680 --> 00:55:52,040
Speaker 1: sweatpants scaled a wall and also scared snow. Yeah, yeah,

954
00:55:52,080 --> 00:55:54,960
Speaker 1: I'm just I'm just thinking of female characters and how

955
00:55:55,080 --> 00:55:58,279
Speaker 1: like movies further on down the road would sort of

956
00:55:58,360 --> 00:56:02,000
Speaker 1: rob them of agency. Like, for instance, I'm watching Pulp

957
00:56:02,080 --> 00:56:04,320
Speaker 1: Fiction again for the first time in like ten years

958
00:56:04,440 --> 00:56:10,600
Speaker 1: for another podcast most recent episode, and like Uma Thurman's

959
00:56:10,640 --> 00:56:13,839
Speaker 1: character is like awesome, and she's that's a great performance,

960
00:56:13,880 --> 00:56:18,640
Speaker 1: but her main action is to like like poison herself something,

961
00:56:18,719 --> 00:56:21,520
Speaker 1: so she's like unconscious. And then and then like Bruce

962
00:56:21,520 --> 00:56:25,640
Speaker 1: Willis's girlfriend is this like dizzy kind of foreign person

963
00:56:25,719 --> 00:56:29,080
Speaker 1: who sucks something up when like he's like, you had

964
00:56:29,160 --> 00:56:33,080
Speaker 1: one job, and I don't know, I just wonder, like

965
00:56:33,120 --> 00:56:35,000
Speaker 1: back to the future, you mentioned Back to the Future

966
00:56:35,040 --> 00:56:39,160
Speaker 1: to his girlfriend is knocked out the whole thing. Yeah,

967
00:56:39,239 --> 00:56:41,839
Speaker 1: Like again, it's just like let's just knock her out

968
00:56:41,920 --> 00:56:45,000
Speaker 1: and we can't use her in this story. Let's just

969
00:56:45,040 --> 00:56:47,920
Speaker 1: make her unconscious, right, right, But I wonder if this

970
00:56:48,000 --> 00:56:50,960
Speaker 1: movie set that up or if that had already that

971
00:56:51,080 --> 00:56:53,600
Speaker 1: was just like, I mean, the trope of women being

972
00:56:53,960 --> 00:56:58,319
Speaker 1: passive and just not well developed female characters has been

973
00:56:58,320 --> 00:57:01,879
Speaker 1: a thing throughout all of the nature. But I mean,

974
00:57:02,000 --> 00:57:05,560
Speaker 1: certainly movies like we have this podcast because of how

975
00:57:05,600 --> 00:57:10,080
Speaker 1: influential movies are and media is to our culture and

976
00:57:10,120 --> 00:57:13,959
Speaker 1: society and how they really like shapes the way other

977
00:57:14,080 --> 00:57:16,480
Speaker 1: media is. It's like, well, we saw this story and

978
00:57:16,520 --> 00:57:19,440
Speaker 1: that worked, so let's do a similar thing, for sure,

979
00:57:19,680 --> 00:57:23,000
Speaker 1: And that's why these troopes exist and keep being perpetuated,

980
00:57:23,120 --> 00:57:26,440
Speaker 1: especially movies like this, where it's like so embedded in

981
00:57:26,480 --> 00:57:29,920
Speaker 1: your head that you can't even like, you know the story,

982
00:57:30,080 --> 00:57:33,160
Speaker 1: but it's so vague that you don't even realize that

983
00:57:33,200 --> 00:57:39,360
Speaker 1: the particulars are so fucked up and bizarre, like totally well,

984
00:57:39,920 --> 00:57:42,240
Speaker 1: you know, if a woman is doing something, she's bad, uh,

985
00:57:43,320 --> 00:57:46,560
Speaker 1: according to this movie. No matter what, I feel like

986
00:57:46,600 --> 00:57:49,400
Speaker 1: this movie is an appropriate opening to the whole like

987
00:57:49,480 --> 00:57:52,680
Speaker 1: Disney movie thing, because I feel like the one consistent

988
00:57:52,760 --> 00:57:56,880
Speaker 1: theme in all Disney movies is how you look determines

989
00:57:57,000 --> 00:58:00,840
Speaker 1: how good you are. So if you're like a active person,

990
00:58:01,240 --> 00:58:04,520
Speaker 1: you are a good person, and then if you're evil,

991
00:58:04,600 --> 00:58:08,880
Speaker 1: you'll usually either eventually turn into a crone or like

992
00:58:09,200 --> 00:58:11,720
Speaker 1: b one from the start. And it is a very

993
00:58:11,720 --> 00:58:14,439
Speaker 1: big theme in the Wizard of Oz. Yeah, yeah, it's

994
00:58:14,480 --> 00:58:17,480
Speaker 1: all it's the whole universe is just like how you

995
00:58:17,520 --> 00:58:21,320
Speaker 1: look on the outside is exactly reflective of your your

996
00:58:21,360 --> 00:58:24,720
Speaker 1: personal worth and also how everyone around you treats you.

997
00:58:24,760 --> 00:58:26,880
Speaker 1: Because Snow it would be dead in the first ten

998
00:58:26,960 --> 00:58:30,880
Speaker 1: minutes if she were not, if that huntsman was like, oh,

999
00:58:30,920 --> 00:58:37,560
Speaker 1: she's ugly, so it's fine. But it opens that universe

1000
00:58:37,720 --> 00:58:41,360
Speaker 1: with a kingdom that is explicitly like I'm the prettiest,

1001
00:58:41,600 --> 00:58:44,000
Speaker 1: I have the power, I'm the queen, and then okay,

1002
00:58:44,040 --> 00:58:45,760
Speaker 1: I'm no longer the prettiest. I have to kill the

1003
00:58:45,760 --> 00:58:49,160
Speaker 1: prettiest to maintain that. So it's almost like he's setting

1004
00:58:49,240 --> 00:58:52,680
Speaker 1: up he's telling us what all the main value of

1005
00:58:52,720 --> 00:58:54,880
Speaker 1: his movies is going to be like from now on.

1006
00:58:55,200 --> 00:58:57,240
Speaker 1: And and in a lot of the like you know,

1007
00:58:57,360 --> 00:59:00,320
Speaker 1: Disney Princess movies, it's about a female character are sort

1008
00:59:00,360 --> 00:59:04,480
Speaker 1: of having to passively wait around for the prince or

1009
00:59:04,480 --> 00:59:08,760
Speaker 1: whoever to come and kind of rescue her, and they're

1010
00:59:08,760 --> 00:59:14,640
Speaker 1: often very damseled and or just noise only damsels and

1011
00:59:14,760 --> 00:59:18,840
Speaker 1: nothing else happens. And like I wenttioned before, we've seen

1012
00:59:18,960 --> 00:59:22,480
Speaker 1: a shift, but it's only been very recently with movies

1013
00:59:22,520 --> 00:59:28,040
Speaker 1: like mo Wanna Brave Frozen, where they are like princessy

1014
00:59:28,160 --> 00:59:32,280
Speaker 1: characters but they have much more agency. But those have

1015
00:59:32,360 --> 00:59:36,000
Speaker 1: only been in the past decade or less. And I

1016
00:59:36,040 --> 00:59:39,000
Speaker 1: feel like it kicked off with Frozen having the two

1017
00:59:39,280 --> 00:59:42,000
Speaker 1: female protagonists who were like their friendship was at the

1018
00:59:42,000 --> 00:59:44,360
Speaker 1: center of the movie, and that was a total accident.

1019
00:59:44,480 --> 00:59:47,000
Speaker 1: It was supposed to also was supposed to be the

1020
00:59:47,040 --> 00:59:51,360
Speaker 1: evil like Ice Princess, and then they wrote that song

1021
00:59:51,480 --> 00:59:53,320
Speaker 1: let It Go, and they were like, well, this is

1022
00:59:53,560 --> 00:59:57,760
Speaker 1: too good not used. So they rewrote the movie around

1023
00:59:57,760 --> 01:00:01,600
Speaker 1: that song and made them friends and and like when

1024
01:00:01,680 --> 01:00:04,040
Speaker 1: you look at the trailers for Frozen when it first

1025
01:00:04,040 --> 01:00:06,720
Speaker 1: came out, they tried to avoid the fact that it

1026
01:00:06,800 --> 01:00:10,960
Speaker 1: was about a female relationship, like between two women, like

1027
01:00:11,040 --> 01:00:13,800
Speaker 1: the plague, like all the first trailer that they showed

1028
01:00:13,800 --> 01:00:17,040
Speaker 1: I think during the Super Bowl was like the moose

1029
01:00:17,360 --> 01:00:19,760
Speaker 1: and like the Snowman, and like that's just what they

1030
01:00:19,800 --> 01:00:22,520
Speaker 1: put front and center. And then I mean they must

1031
01:00:22,560 --> 01:00:25,400
Speaker 1: have been totally surprised when it was their biggest hit ever,

1032
01:00:25,520 --> 01:00:28,240
Speaker 1: and now I feel like, so, I feel like they've

1033
01:00:28,480 --> 01:00:33,400
Speaker 1: just accidentally figured out that there's money and being progressive. Yeah. Well,

1034
01:00:33,440 --> 01:00:36,560
Speaker 1: I remember the marketing for mo Wanna. At least a

1035
01:00:36,560 --> 01:00:39,400
Speaker 1: few of the trailers I saw, we're basically framing Maui

1036
01:00:39,600 --> 01:00:41,440
Speaker 1: is the hero of the movie rather than Mohanna, And

1037
01:00:41,480 --> 01:00:44,160
Speaker 1: I was like, what, why would you market a movie

1038
01:00:44,200 --> 01:00:47,080
Speaker 1: that way? Because it's so misleading and not at all

1039
01:00:47,120 --> 01:00:50,880
Speaker 1: what the movie is. I just want to congratulate Gary

1040
01:00:50,880 --> 01:00:54,840
Speaker 1: Oldman on his Golden Globe award. Just everything is going

1041
01:00:55,080 --> 01:00:57,959
Speaker 1: very well and it's going great. Have you guys talked

1042
01:00:57,960 --> 01:01:03,040
Speaker 1: about why Gary Oldman was problematic? But well we'll link

1043
01:01:03,080 --> 01:01:10,160
Speaker 1: it into description surprise is Yeah, he abusive beat his wife.

1044
01:01:10,880 --> 01:01:14,280
Speaker 1: Oh how about that poor pig that the Huntsman did

1045
01:01:14,400 --> 01:01:18,280
Speaker 1: kill and steal the heart of icon the pig? Yeah,

1046
01:01:18,720 --> 01:01:21,880
Speaker 1: never trust a man in sweatpants. That's perhaps the most

1047
01:01:21,880 --> 01:01:26,600
Speaker 1: harmful lesson of all. If if you know like the

1048
01:01:26,640 --> 01:01:31,560
Speaker 1: Prince for sure, like he plays the bass like he's

1049
01:01:32,200 --> 01:01:36,880
Speaker 1: he's a disaster, his neighbors hate him. Disney had to

1050
01:01:37,320 --> 01:01:40,320
Speaker 1: like redo that character the most times because he kept

1051
01:01:40,320 --> 01:01:45,400
Speaker 1: being like he's too fruity, he walks like a fruit. Wow.

1052
01:01:45,440 --> 01:01:49,800
Speaker 1: I mean Disney was also very racist and anti Semitic, right,

1053
01:01:50,160 --> 01:01:52,760
Speaker 1: oh yeah, I mean his anti semitism is like one

1054
01:01:52,760 --> 01:01:55,360
Speaker 1: of one of the big old talking points. But what

1055
01:01:55,440 --> 01:01:59,880
Speaker 1: an imagination. I guess. You know. He had to drag

1056
01:02:00,080 --> 01:02:02,720
Speaker 1: his protagonists around as if she were dead and then

1057
01:02:02,840 --> 01:02:07,400
Speaker 1: actually kill her. That scene where snow White spends forty

1058
01:02:07,440 --> 01:02:10,000
Speaker 1: five minutes kissing all the dwarfs before they go off

1059
01:02:10,000 --> 01:02:12,760
Speaker 1: to work. She should she could be reading a book,

1060
01:02:12,960 --> 01:02:15,360
Speaker 1: or learning how to play an instrument, or just learning

1061
01:02:15,360 --> 01:02:18,720
Speaker 1: how to do anything besides cooking and cleaning. I don't know.

1062
01:02:18,840 --> 01:02:22,000
Speaker 1: I mean, there's just so like in terms of plot,

1063
01:02:22,240 --> 01:02:25,240
Speaker 1: this movie is fifteen minutes long, like there's so much,

1064
01:02:25,480 --> 01:02:28,240
Speaker 1: so many large spotsive time where it's like, oh thank god,

1065
01:02:28,280 --> 01:02:31,320
Speaker 1: we get to see a chipmunk wash a dish, like

1066
01:02:31,840 --> 01:02:36,000
Speaker 1: so long, surprisingly little like that. This movie moves quickly,

1067
01:02:36,360 --> 01:02:39,000
Speaker 1: like it's only ninety or below ninety minutes, I think,

1068
01:02:39,120 --> 01:02:41,560
Speaker 1: But it moves quickly in some senses and then in

1069
01:02:41,680 --> 01:02:43,880
Speaker 1: other senses it's like when is this going to end?

1070
01:02:44,200 --> 01:02:46,800
Speaker 1: I watched it like with my one year old, who

1071
01:02:46,840 --> 01:02:50,600
Speaker 1: like isn't allowed to watch stuff. So him getting to

1072
01:02:50,640 --> 01:02:53,400
Speaker 1: see a screen and something on the screen was like

1073
01:02:53,640 --> 01:02:56,560
Speaker 1: the best thing that's happened to him. And we're really

1074
01:02:56,600 --> 01:03:00,520
Speaker 1: mean to him usually and uh and he got bored

1075
01:03:00,560 --> 01:03:03,920
Speaker 1: after all, Like yeah, he was just like this sucks,

1076
01:03:04,120 --> 01:03:06,400
Speaker 1: like walk away. At first he thought the doors were

1077
01:03:06,400 --> 01:03:08,520
Speaker 1: funny and then he was just like fuck it. Yea,

1078
01:03:09,920 --> 01:03:13,320
Speaker 1: he's not wrong. Um, let's talk about whether or not

1079
01:03:13,360 --> 01:03:18,040
Speaker 1: the movie passes the Bechtel test. So I think it does.

1080
01:03:19,680 --> 01:03:23,080
Speaker 1: I know, Okay, so this proof that it is. You know,

1081
01:03:23,120 --> 01:03:26,160
Speaker 1: every metric is flawed. So there's only one scene in

1082
01:03:26,160 --> 01:03:29,040
Speaker 1: which it has the potential to pass, which is when

1083
01:03:29,360 --> 01:03:32,880
Speaker 1: the queen dressed as the old woman she refers to

1084
01:03:32,880 --> 01:03:36,760
Speaker 1: herself later as Granny, which another major red flag. But

1085
01:03:36,960 --> 01:03:41,200
Speaker 1: lady named Granny shows up. Hey, pet, it's me granted Granny.

1086
01:03:41,280 --> 01:03:48,160
Speaker 1: You alone. Men, they're not here, So she shows up

1087
01:03:48,200 --> 01:03:53,280
Speaker 1: because she knows where they I guess. She literally says

1088
01:03:53,720 --> 01:03:59,920
Speaker 1: making pies do a good impression, and then uh snow

1089
01:04:00,040 --> 01:04:03,320
Speaker 1: it says, yeah, gloseberry pie, and they're like, well, there

1090
01:04:03,360 --> 01:04:07,560
Speaker 1: it is. But because in the next line she's like, no,

1091
01:04:07,720 --> 01:04:11,840
Speaker 1: it's apple pie that drives the men. While so it

1092
01:04:11,920 --> 01:04:16,480
Speaker 1: just has to be according to our bar for it

1093
01:04:16,560 --> 01:04:21,200
Speaker 1: and revision, because there's no way this movie should pass

1094
01:04:21,440 --> 01:04:24,240
Speaker 1: A thing that says, like if it's about pies and

1095
01:04:24,320 --> 01:04:28,600
Speaker 1: baking pies, that doesn't pass a domestic. A lot of

1096
01:04:28,600 --> 01:04:30,520
Speaker 1: the movies that we talk about that do pass the

1097
01:04:30,600 --> 01:04:33,760
Speaker 1: Becto tests are often talking about either food or clothes,

1098
01:04:34,240 --> 01:04:37,480
Speaker 1: which also they're great. There's several movies we're done where

1099
01:04:37,480 --> 01:04:41,480
Speaker 1: it's like the past happens at a store where she's talking, right,

1100
01:04:42,200 --> 01:04:44,360
Speaker 1: why can't they talk about science? Well, it's like, well,

1101
01:04:44,400 --> 01:04:48,360
Speaker 1: if we if we revised our en to not include

1102
01:04:48,480 --> 01:04:54,160
Speaker 1: domestic or like whatever, you know, Yeah, let's explore that more, right, So, yes,

1103
01:04:54,240 --> 01:04:57,640
Speaker 1: the movie does pass the Bechdel test for like two

1104
01:04:57,640 --> 01:05:02,400
Speaker 1: seconds and it's about pie. Let's write the movie on

1105
01:05:02,400 --> 01:05:04,920
Speaker 1: her nipple scale zero to five nipples. Based on its

1106
01:05:04,960 --> 01:05:08,320
Speaker 1: portrayal of women, I have to give it zero. This

1107
01:05:08,400 --> 01:05:11,160
Speaker 1: is a zero nipple movie for me. Cool that it's

1108
01:05:11,160 --> 01:05:13,920
Speaker 1: a female protagonist, cool that it's a female villain. But

1109
01:05:14,200 --> 01:05:17,560
Speaker 1: snow White is extremely passive and does almost nothing, makes

1110
01:05:17,600 --> 01:05:20,480
Speaker 1: almost no choices. Her only desire in the entire movie,

1111
01:05:20,480 --> 01:05:24,400
Speaker 1: which we don't even really learn or fully understand until

1112
01:05:24,600 --> 01:05:28,040
Speaker 1: much later into the movie is that she wants Prince

1113
01:05:28,160 --> 01:05:34,680
Speaker 1: Charming to come and marry her over a horse. Because

1114
01:05:34,840 --> 01:05:38,680
Speaker 1: she does nothing to pursue this desire of hers, she's

1115
01:05:38,720 --> 01:05:42,240
Speaker 1: rendered completely inactive to the point where she's unconscious for

1116
01:05:42,400 --> 01:05:46,880
Speaker 1: the end sequence of the movie. Between that and Grumpy

1117
01:05:47,040 --> 01:05:50,880
Speaker 1: and his toxic masculinity and women hating speeches that he

1118
01:05:50,920 --> 01:05:55,160
Speaker 1: gives every few scenes, it is a movie I used

1119
01:05:55,160 --> 01:05:57,200
Speaker 1: to love as a kid, and now that I've seen

1120
01:05:57,240 --> 01:06:00,919
Speaker 1: it through the bacto cast lens might be my least

1121
01:06:00,920 --> 01:06:03,439
Speaker 1: favorite movie of all time. I hate it so much

1122
01:06:03,480 --> 01:06:08,880
Speaker 1: now and it is garbage at the end. I'm gonna

1123
01:06:08,920 --> 01:06:12,120
Speaker 1: give it half a nippy because the queen does have

1124
01:06:12,280 --> 01:06:16,760
Speaker 1: a murder dungeon that we see that is not addressed

1125
01:06:16,840 --> 01:06:20,400
Speaker 1: later she turns into a witch, goes downstairs, there's a

1126
01:06:20,480 --> 01:06:25,960
Speaker 1: skeleton steemed to die reaching for water, and then she

1127
01:06:26,040 --> 01:06:28,560
Speaker 1: just left it there to r right. She makes one

1128
01:06:28,560 --> 01:06:33,040
Speaker 1: of the skeleton. She's like theirs that like kicks the

1129
01:06:33,080 --> 01:06:38,200
Speaker 1: water kin and then gets into a canoe and rows

1130
01:06:38,280 --> 01:06:41,040
Speaker 1: out like she has a tunnel system so she can murder,

1131
01:06:42,080 --> 01:06:46,560
Speaker 1: And that is an that is very active. We never

1132
01:06:46,680 --> 01:06:50,000
Speaker 1: revisit how long was that there for? Yeah, I mean,

1133
01:06:50,120 --> 01:06:54,920
Speaker 1: this movie really stinks for and I do like I

1134
01:06:55,200 --> 01:06:57,080
Speaker 1: even after watching it this time, I do still have

1135
01:06:57,200 --> 01:07:01,840
Speaker 1: a weird subconscious attachment to it. So I recognize that

1136
01:07:01,880 --> 01:07:03,920
Speaker 1: it deserves zero nipples, but I'm gonna give it half

1137
01:07:03,960 --> 01:07:05,800
Speaker 1: a nipple. And I'm going to say it's because of

1138
01:07:05,840 --> 01:07:09,160
Speaker 1: the Murder Dungeon, because that did not remember that loved

1139
01:07:09,160 --> 01:07:12,200
Speaker 1: that she mocked a skeleton. I like to think that

1140
01:07:12,200 --> 01:07:19,080
Speaker 1: that was the king, how he touched kids getting so,

1141
01:07:19,200 --> 01:07:21,280
Speaker 1: I mean, we didn't talk about this, but this is

1142
01:07:21,320 --> 01:07:25,640
Speaker 1: another example of a Disney princess that has either one

1143
01:07:25,760 --> 01:07:27,840
Speaker 1: or no parents because a lot of them have a

1144
01:07:27,880 --> 01:07:31,040
Speaker 1: dead mom. She has a dead dad and then a

1145
01:07:31,040 --> 01:07:34,520
Speaker 1: stepmother who actively wants her to pass away, right, and

1146
01:07:34,600 --> 01:07:39,920
Speaker 1: that happens again in Um. Yes, I give it half

1147
01:07:39,920 --> 01:07:42,120
Speaker 1: a nipple for the murder Dungeon and give the nipple

1148
01:07:42,160 --> 01:07:46,440
Speaker 1: back to whoever that skeleton was. Yeah, I think I

1149
01:07:46,480 --> 01:07:49,320
Speaker 1: have to go zero just for all the damage it

1150
01:07:49,360 --> 01:07:52,000
Speaker 1: does and has done and the I mean, that's kind

1151
01:07:52,000 --> 01:07:54,880
Speaker 1: of why I chose it is because it's so horrible

1152
01:07:54,960 --> 01:07:58,400
Speaker 1: and it creates the archetype of the Disney princess as passive.

1153
01:07:58,760 --> 01:08:01,160
Speaker 1: I wanted to say that. You know, if the right

1154
01:08:01,200 --> 01:08:04,600
Speaker 1: little girl sees it, maybe she'd identify with the queen

1155
01:08:05,160 --> 01:08:09,760
Speaker 1: and be happy that she's like so manipulative and machiavellian.

1156
01:08:09,880 --> 01:08:12,080
Speaker 1: And yeah, she has that dungeon, but the fact that

1157
01:08:12,160 --> 01:08:16,320
Speaker 1: all of her manipulation and murdering is done to be

1158
01:08:16,439 --> 01:08:21,160
Speaker 1: the prettiest is kind of shitty. Yet do we know

1159
01:08:21,240 --> 01:08:24,560
Speaker 1: for sure the father is out of the picture. We

1160
01:08:25,360 --> 01:08:28,840
Speaker 1: never see them on screen, and there's nothing to indicate

1161
01:08:28,880 --> 01:08:32,840
Speaker 1: that he is around. I feel like though he's got

1162
01:08:32,840 --> 01:08:35,479
Speaker 1: to be dead, because otherwise the Queen wouldn't be in charge.

1163
01:08:35,520 --> 01:08:38,280
Speaker 1: But so many details in this movie are completely glossed over.

1164
01:08:38,560 --> 01:08:41,000
Speaker 1: We like the world building in this movie is not

1165
01:08:41,160 --> 01:08:45,000
Speaker 1: very good because we don't know who lives there or

1166
01:08:45,040 --> 01:08:49,280
Speaker 1: who's in charge. Because the dungeon could suggest that she

1167
01:08:49,680 --> 01:08:53,719
Speaker 1: has committed a genocide of all women who were prettier

1168
01:08:53,720 --> 01:08:56,120
Speaker 1: than her, and that's how she became the prettiest and

1169
01:08:56,160 --> 01:08:58,960
Speaker 1: the only reason she had done it to snow White

1170
01:08:59,320 --> 01:09:02,080
Speaker 1: was because as her father was there to be like,

1171
01:09:02,280 --> 01:09:06,519
Speaker 1: please don't kill my daughter, but killing like trying to

1172
01:09:06,520 --> 01:09:08,639
Speaker 1: do it on the low. Take him out and take

1173
01:09:08,640 --> 01:09:12,320
Speaker 1: her out of the woods. Good fan theory, Yeah, that's

1174
01:09:12,320 --> 01:09:17,360
Speaker 1: a hot woman's skeleton. Isn't that so taxy? Now? Okay,

1175
01:09:21,680 --> 01:09:26,240
Speaker 1: well this was a yeah, this harmful piece of media.

1176
01:09:26,479 --> 01:09:28,519
Speaker 1: I mean, I'm sure people would say, well it was

1177
01:09:28,560 --> 01:09:30,920
Speaker 1: the time, it was the nineteen thirties. I keep on

1178
01:09:31,000 --> 01:09:34,880
Speaker 1: rebooting it though, see if it resonates. Sure. Yeah, I

1179
01:09:34,920 --> 01:09:37,000
Speaker 1: have not seen any of the snow White and the

1180
01:09:37,080 --> 01:09:41,240
Speaker 1: Huntsman adaptation or the Mirror Mirror starting Julia Roberts. I

1181
01:09:41,280 --> 01:09:43,559
Speaker 1: haven't seen any. I'm sure there's a moment and in

1182
01:09:43,640 --> 01:09:46,160
Speaker 1: all of those movies where snow White does one thing

1183
01:09:46,200 --> 01:09:49,360
Speaker 1: and then like basically looks a camera. It's like, see,

1184
01:09:49,960 --> 01:09:54,160
Speaker 1: I fing hate the dumb Just write a better story, right, cool?

1185
01:09:54,200 --> 01:09:58,519
Speaker 1: Well that is our snow White and the Seven Dwarfs episode. Jack,

1186
01:09:58,760 --> 01:10:03,320
Speaker 1: thank you so much for join. Yeah. Where can people

1187
01:10:03,600 --> 01:10:06,599
Speaker 1: follow you online? Do you have anything you want to plug? Yeah?

1188
01:10:06,640 --> 01:10:08,960
Speaker 1: You can follow me on Twitter at Jack under Squirrel,

1189
01:10:09,080 --> 01:10:12,960
Speaker 1: Brian and yes search Daily's like we tell you what's

1190
01:10:13,000 --> 01:10:17,200
Speaker 1: going on on a daily basis and you know, have fun. Cool.

1191
01:10:17,320 --> 01:10:20,519
Speaker 1: You can follow us on Twitter and Instagram and Facebook

1192
01:10:20,560 --> 01:10:23,120
Speaker 1: and all the other all the social media's at becktel

1193
01:10:23,240 --> 01:10:26,240
Speaker 1: Cast and also if you live in the Los Angeles area.

1194
01:10:26,400 --> 01:10:30,360
Speaker 1: We have a live show coming up at NERD malt

1195
01:10:30,400 --> 01:10:34,479
Speaker 1: show Room February eight thirty. We will be doing for

1196
01:10:34,800 --> 01:10:37,400
Speaker 1: the month of feb the Month of Love. We're going

1197
01:10:37,439 --> 01:10:41,760
Speaker 1: to be doing The Notebook with Caitlyn Gill. Yes, I'm

1198
01:10:41,840 --> 01:10:44,360
Speaker 1: so excited. I haven't seen The Notebook in a very

1199
01:10:44,400 --> 01:10:48,719
Speaker 1: long time. Same. Yeah, so come through, come on down

1200
01:10:48,760 --> 01:10:53,800
Speaker 1: to that. Check our website backtelcast dot com for ticket information. Also, hey,

1201
01:10:53,800 --> 01:10:56,599
Speaker 1: our Patreon, don't forget about that. It's only five dollars

1202
01:10:56,600 --> 01:10:59,559
Speaker 1: a month and you get stuff to bonus episode every month.

1203
01:10:59,680 --> 01:11:03,000
Speaker 1: This is my we did both Ghostbusters movies about Ghostbusters.

1204
01:11:03,000 --> 01:11:08,479
Speaker 1: Give us five dollars. Yeah, indeed, Um, some day my

1205
01:11:09,240 --> 01:11:16,960
Speaker 1: second master's degree will come. Dude, listen to one song.

1206
01:11:17,240 --> 01:11:21,640
Speaker 1: It's crazy O. Goodbye.