1 00:00:04,320 --> 00:00:06,600 Speaker 1: Hey, and welcome to the Short Stuff. I'm Josh, and 2 00:00:06,640 --> 00:00:09,080 Speaker 1: there's Chuck and Jerry sitting in for Dave. And this 3 00:00:09,160 --> 00:00:14,240 Speaker 1: is short stuff, short stuff that's right, all about something 4 00:00:14,280 --> 00:00:17,520 Speaker 1: that big thanks to mental floss dot co and how 5 00:00:17,520 --> 00:00:20,119 Speaker 1: emotions are made. But the big thing that happens to 6 00:00:20,200 --> 00:00:23,439 Speaker 1: a lot of people is when and for me, it 7 00:00:23,440 --> 00:00:26,000 Speaker 1: happens when I say a word out loud too many times. 8 00:00:26,880 --> 00:00:29,080 Speaker 1: I've never had the experience of writing a word too 9 00:00:29,120 --> 00:00:33,279 Speaker 1: many times. Oh really, no, I guess because I just 10 00:00:33,320 --> 00:00:36,160 Speaker 1: don't sit around and write the same word over and over. 11 00:00:36,240 --> 00:00:39,360 Speaker 1: But it's it's the idea that if you say something 12 00:00:39,440 --> 00:00:42,640 Speaker 1: or write something over and over, that word starts to 13 00:00:42,720 --> 00:00:46,400 Speaker 1: sound weird or look weird. Then it starts to completely 14 00:00:46,440 --> 00:00:48,360 Speaker 1: kind of fall apart. The more you do it to 15 00:00:48,440 --> 00:00:53,520 Speaker 1: the point where you're like, what even is driveway right? 16 00:00:53,760 --> 00:00:57,639 Speaker 1: And it becomes just a string of sounds or if 17 00:00:57,640 --> 00:01:00,800 Speaker 1: you're just seeing it visually, a string of letters. Yeah, 18 00:01:00,800 --> 00:01:03,520 Speaker 1: it's a phenomenon. It is. It's an actual thing. It's 19 00:01:03,520 --> 00:01:07,520 Speaker 1: called semantic satiation, and it's actually a kind of a 20 00:01:07,640 --> 00:01:10,800 Speaker 1: window into the way our brain works. I believe to 21 00:01:10,920 --> 00:01:13,760 Speaker 1: conserve energy. But we'll dive a little more into it. 22 00:01:14,040 --> 00:01:18,759 Speaker 1: The thing is, semantic satiation is not new. We've been 23 00:01:18,920 --> 00:01:23,319 Speaker 1: probably doing it ever since we've been speaking or writing words, right, 24 00:01:23,400 --> 00:01:28,240 Speaker 1: so saying bronze age, and it was first described. Semantic 25 00:01:28,280 --> 00:01:30,959 Speaker 1: satiation was first described in nineteen oh seven in the 26 00:01:30,959 --> 00:01:34,959 Speaker 1: American Journal of Psychology. Should I read it? I think 27 00:01:34,959 --> 00:01:37,120 Speaker 1: you should, because I think it gets it across really well. 28 00:01:37,560 --> 00:01:40,000 Speaker 1: All right, If a printed word has looked at steadily 29 00:01:40,000 --> 00:01:42,679 Speaker 1: for some little time, will be found to take on 30 00:01:42,720 --> 00:01:47,360 Speaker 1: a curiously strange and foreign aspect. This loss of familiarity 31 00:01:47,400 --> 00:01:50,360 Speaker 1: in its appearance sometimes makes it look like a word 32 00:01:50,400 --> 00:01:54,800 Speaker 1: in another language. Sometimes proceeds further until the word is 33 00:01:54,800 --> 00:01:58,840 Speaker 1: a mere collection of letters, and occasionally reaches the extreme 34 00:01:59,240 --> 00:02:02,840 Speaker 1: where the letters to themselves look like meaningless marks on 35 00:02:02,880 --> 00:02:06,520 Speaker 1: the paper. Right. So these psychologists who are describing it 36 00:02:06,560 --> 00:02:09,800 Speaker 1: back in nineteen and seven are basically focused on seeing 37 00:02:09,800 --> 00:02:13,560 Speaker 1: it written right again. That's how I've normally experienced it, 38 00:02:13,600 --> 00:02:15,520 Speaker 1: and the best way to experience it is to just 39 00:02:15,639 --> 00:02:19,359 Speaker 1: have one word, that one word typed out on paper, right, 40 00:02:19,919 --> 00:02:23,280 Speaker 1: because it's in isolation, and it quickly falls apart. But 41 00:02:23,320 --> 00:02:26,280 Speaker 1: they nailed something, I think in their description. It's a 42 00:02:26,400 --> 00:02:31,520 Speaker 1: loss of familiarity. It just doesn't it's not itself any longer. 43 00:02:31,880 --> 00:02:35,400 Speaker 1: And it's completely subjective to you because the person sitting 44 00:02:35,440 --> 00:02:38,320 Speaker 1: next to you might not be experiencing that while you are. 45 00:02:38,520 --> 00:02:41,880 Speaker 1: You're just lost in the sea of unfamiliarity. And the 46 00:02:41,919 --> 00:02:45,320 Speaker 1: word driveway just doesn't make sense anymore, right, And I 47 00:02:45,360 --> 00:02:48,680 Speaker 1: guess what I was saying was writing or typing it 48 00:02:48,720 --> 00:02:50,519 Speaker 1: over and over. You don't have to do that, even 49 00:02:50,600 --> 00:02:53,440 Speaker 1: that can just be looking at it yes on paper 50 00:02:54,280 --> 00:02:56,200 Speaker 1: over and over, because I was thinking it might make 51 00:02:56,200 --> 00:02:58,520 Speaker 1: sense in the first days of writing, when they were 52 00:02:58,600 --> 00:03:03,320 Speaker 1: using writing long hand to do like logging pounds of 53 00:03:03,320 --> 00:03:06,280 Speaker 1: wheat or whatever, like writing the same word over and 54 00:03:06,280 --> 00:03:08,560 Speaker 1: over might have done it. But that's not necessarily the case. No, 55 00:03:08,680 --> 00:03:12,480 Speaker 1: But it can happen like that, right. Yeah. So there's 56 00:03:12,480 --> 00:03:16,440 Speaker 1: a guy named Leon James. He's the guy who coined 57 00:03:16,440 --> 00:03:18,959 Speaker 1: the term semantic satiation. There's other terms for it, to 58 00:03:19,200 --> 00:03:24,880 Speaker 1: word decrement, it's gross extinction, reminiscence, a little too broad, 59 00:03:25,480 --> 00:03:28,600 Speaker 1: verbal transformation, that's a good one, but semantic satiation is 60 00:03:28,600 --> 00:03:31,480 Speaker 1: the one that everybody said, that's that's the one. Yeah, 61 00:03:31,520 --> 00:03:35,160 Speaker 1: And that happened in nineteen sixty two. He's a professor 62 00:03:35,400 --> 00:03:38,200 Speaker 1: or was at least a professor of psychology at the 63 00:03:38,280 --> 00:03:42,200 Speaker 1: University of Hawaii at their College of Social Sciences, and 64 00:03:42,360 --> 00:03:45,320 Speaker 1: he did some interesting I mean, he described it as 65 00:03:45,360 --> 00:03:47,480 Speaker 1: a he did some experiments we'll talk about in a minute, 66 00:03:47,520 --> 00:03:49,560 Speaker 1: but he described it in a way that also kind 67 00:03:49,560 --> 00:03:53,040 Speaker 1: of helps drive it home as a kind of fatigue, right. Yeah, 68 00:03:53,080 --> 00:03:56,000 Speaker 1: And basically, like he explains how when a sell fires, 69 00:03:56,680 --> 00:03:58,680 Speaker 1: it's going to take more energy for it to fire 70 00:03:58,720 --> 00:04:01,840 Speaker 1: the second and third time on down the line, and 71 00:04:02,080 --> 00:04:03,640 Speaker 1: once you get down to like the fourth time that 72 00:04:03,680 --> 00:04:07,320 Speaker 1: cell is firing, apparently it won't even respond unless you 73 00:04:07,400 --> 00:04:10,480 Speaker 1: wait a few seconds. And so I guess is he 74 00:04:10,600 --> 00:04:15,120 Speaker 1: likening that to the repetition of the word. Yeah, he's saying, 75 00:04:15,160 --> 00:04:17,919 Speaker 1: if you if you just expose yourself to the word 76 00:04:17,960 --> 00:04:19,719 Speaker 1: the first time, your brain's going to go through the 77 00:04:19,760 --> 00:04:23,320 Speaker 1: process of recalling all the memories and emotions and everything 78 00:04:23,320 --> 00:04:26,640 Speaker 1: attached that you have attached to that word. Right, And 79 00:04:26,680 --> 00:04:28,920 Speaker 1: then if you do that again, if you just think 80 00:04:29,040 --> 00:04:31,159 Speaker 1: or look at the same order here, the same word again, 81 00:04:31,680 --> 00:04:33,960 Speaker 1: it's gonna do it again. But it's gonna be like, Okay, 82 00:04:34,000 --> 00:04:36,360 Speaker 1: I don't know why we're doing this again. Third time, 83 00:04:36,360 --> 00:04:39,120 Speaker 1: it's gonna sigh heavily while it's doing it. The fourth 84 00:04:39,120 --> 00:04:40,960 Speaker 1: time it's just going to stand there with its arms 85 00:04:41,000 --> 00:04:43,679 Speaker 1: crossed and say, I'm not recalling any of this stuff. 86 00:04:44,040 --> 00:04:47,640 Speaker 1: And again, it's probably because the brain likes to conserve 87 00:04:47,720 --> 00:04:51,159 Speaker 1: energy as much as possible, and it's being presented with 88 00:04:51,240 --> 00:04:53,719 Speaker 1: the same stimulus over and over again, and it's like, 89 00:04:53,760 --> 00:04:55,760 Speaker 1: I've already, I've already done my job here. I don't 90 00:04:55,760 --> 00:04:58,400 Speaker 1: need to keep doing it. This is a waste of energy, literally, 91 00:04:58,839 --> 00:05:03,159 Speaker 1: And that processes is not applied just to semantic satiation. 92 00:05:03,480 --> 00:05:08,400 Speaker 1: Semantic satiation is a type of a larger phenomenon, which 93 00:05:08,440 --> 00:05:12,080 Speaker 1: is what I just described called reactive inhibition. And that's 94 00:05:12,120 --> 00:05:14,520 Speaker 1: the same thing that's behind going nose blind to the 95 00:05:14,520 --> 00:05:18,640 Speaker 1: smells in your house. That's a type of reactive inhibition too. Yeah, 96 00:05:18,640 --> 00:05:21,400 Speaker 1: which was the most disturbing thing I've learned ever on 97 00:05:21,440 --> 00:05:23,880 Speaker 1: the show. It is because it's not great to come 98 00:05:23,920 --> 00:05:25,560 Speaker 1: back to your house a week later and be like, 99 00:05:25,600 --> 00:05:28,200 Speaker 1: this is what my house really smells like. I know, 100 00:05:28,680 --> 00:05:31,960 Speaker 1: it's sort of that we just tend to live with 101 00:05:31,960 --> 00:05:33,600 Speaker 1: our head in the sand. I think that's how I'm 102 00:05:33,640 --> 00:05:36,160 Speaker 1: going to proceed on that one, because if not, then 103 00:05:36,200 --> 00:05:38,600 Speaker 1: what you just know your house smells like rotten dangerines 104 00:05:38,680 --> 00:05:42,080 Speaker 1: or something. All right, well, let's take a break and 105 00:05:42,120 --> 00:05:43,920 Speaker 1: we'll come back and talk a little bit more about 106 00:05:43,960 --> 00:06:10,920 Speaker 1: this after this. That's why we should know. But Josh Clark, 107 00:06:12,160 --> 00:06:15,400 Speaker 1: all right, here's a very fun thing that Leon James did. 108 00:06:15,440 --> 00:06:18,400 Speaker 1: He did a lot of different research on how this 109 00:06:18,440 --> 00:06:21,240 Speaker 1: can be applied on not just words but other things. 110 00:06:21,720 --> 00:06:24,440 Speaker 1: And I find this fascinating. And we'll jump back to 111 00:06:24,480 --> 00:06:28,919 Speaker 1: the stuttering thing. But the music charts, like the you know, 112 00:06:28,960 --> 00:06:32,160 Speaker 1: Billboard Top one hundred or whatever. Yeah, he studied this 113 00:06:32,800 --> 00:06:37,799 Speaker 1: and he found a correlation where songs that that really 114 00:06:37,880 --> 00:06:41,119 Speaker 1: hit the top of the charts really really fast also 115 00:06:41,400 --> 00:06:44,560 Speaker 1: went off the charts really really fast, and songs that 116 00:06:44,680 --> 00:06:47,240 Speaker 1: kind of work their way up the top one hundred 117 00:06:47,279 --> 00:06:51,480 Speaker 1: or whatever to the top ten, let's say, also faded 118 00:06:51,560 --> 00:06:56,720 Speaker 1: away very slowly. Fascinating. Yeah, it's basically semantic satiation is 119 00:06:56,760 --> 00:06:59,440 Speaker 1: a type of burnout, And you can burn out on 120 00:06:59,640 --> 00:07:02,040 Speaker 1: hearing the same thing in your brain being triggered by 121 00:07:02,080 --> 00:07:03,919 Speaker 1: it over and over again, and the thing that's going 122 00:07:04,000 --> 00:07:06,080 Speaker 1: to storm the charts is going to get the most airplaced. 123 00:07:06,080 --> 00:07:08,360 Speaker 1: Everybody's gonna get sick of it faster, it's gonna lose 124 00:07:08,400 --> 00:07:11,280 Speaker 1: its effect more quickly. That's a pretty clever way of 125 00:07:11,320 --> 00:07:13,960 Speaker 1: showing that by looking at the pop charts. Yeah, but 126 00:07:14,040 --> 00:07:17,760 Speaker 1: it's not just like the charts themselves that show it. 127 00:07:17,800 --> 00:07:21,920 Speaker 1: The songs, individual songs have that same effect. Anybody who's 128 00:07:22,040 --> 00:07:25,720 Speaker 1: listened to any song made by Journey now in twenty 129 00:07:25,920 --> 00:07:29,360 Speaker 1: twenty three knows that you can burn out on a 130 00:07:29,400 --> 00:07:32,680 Speaker 1: song after hearing it too many times. Yeah, it's sad, 131 00:07:32,720 --> 00:07:35,600 Speaker 1: but true. Journeys songs are so great. But if I 132 00:07:35,720 --> 00:07:38,160 Speaker 1: hear don't stop believing one more time, I'm gonna drive 133 00:07:38,240 --> 00:07:41,520 Speaker 1: my car into a traffic poll. Yeah, I had, especially 134 00:07:41,560 --> 00:07:43,720 Speaker 1: with classic rock, I have a lot of instances of 135 00:07:43,800 --> 00:07:48,000 Speaker 1: bands that I loved, loved, loved forever and then I 136 00:07:48,080 --> 00:07:51,640 Speaker 1: was just like, I can't hear it any of it anymore, right, 137 00:07:51,720 --> 00:07:56,360 Speaker 1: But then fifteen years later I'm back on it right right. Well, 138 00:07:56,400 --> 00:07:59,760 Speaker 1: that's another feature of semantic satiation. Like Leon James said, 139 00:08:00,120 --> 00:08:03,240 Speaker 1: if you're or the nineteen oh seven old timey psychologists said, 140 00:08:03,360 --> 00:08:05,960 Speaker 1: if you wait a little bit, it'll come back to you. 141 00:08:06,040 --> 00:08:09,520 Speaker 1: It's a temporary thing where your brain is like, oh okay, 142 00:08:09,640 --> 00:08:12,040 Speaker 1: I'm being presented with us again and it's new enough, 143 00:08:13,480 --> 00:08:16,000 Speaker 1: but you can also get easily burned out on that 144 00:08:16,080 --> 00:08:21,000 Speaker 1: same stuff even faster after it comes back that second time, Right, Yeah, 145 00:08:21,040 --> 00:08:23,200 Speaker 1: I think so. And classic rock is a great example 146 00:08:23,200 --> 00:08:26,800 Speaker 1: because that's the genre that refuses to go away, right, 147 00:08:27,840 --> 00:08:30,360 Speaker 1: And you know, it's one where you turn it on 148 00:08:30,360 --> 00:08:32,800 Speaker 1: any classic rock station and you're gonna hear that Journey 149 00:08:32,800 --> 00:08:36,280 Speaker 1: song or that Boston song that you just may not 150 00:08:36,360 --> 00:08:38,240 Speaker 1: be able to handle anymore that you used to love, 151 00:08:39,080 --> 00:08:42,480 Speaker 1: right exactly. What's interesting about it, though, is so like 152 00:08:42,520 --> 00:08:47,000 Speaker 1: the words themselves lose their meaning. They stop evoking the 153 00:08:48,160 --> 00:08:51,719 Speaker 1: emotion or the thought or the association or the conceptual 154 00:08:51,760 --> 00:08:57,480 Speaker 1: information that you attached to those words, and the words 155 00:08:57,559 --> 00:09:00,920 Speaker 1: become like musical notes. It's like the vocals become the 156 00:09:01,000 --> 00:09:03,640 Speaker 1: same thing as an instrument, like a guitar or something 157 00:09:03,679 --> 00:09:05,800 Speaker 1: like that. And if you stop and think about it, 158 00:09:05,840 --> 00:09:08,960 Speaker 1: like you know, all the words to don't Stop Believing, 159 00:09:10,120 --> 00:09:14,440 Speaker 1: but they rarely have that same well, I shouldn't say rarely. 160 00:09:14,480 --> 00:09:17,000 Speaker 1: It depends on the person, but it can very easily 161 00:09:17,040 --> 00:09:20,520 Speaker 1: not have any impact on you whatsoever. It's I mean, 162 00:09:20,559 --> 00:09:23,560 Speaker 1: it can still evoke emotion, but the words themselves aren't 163 00:09:23,600 --> 00:09:26,760 Speaker 1: making you think of what Steve Perry's saying. And Steve 164 00:09:26,800 --> 00:09:28,760 Speaker 1: Perry's actually a really good example of that because his 165 00:09:28,840 --> 00:09:32,000 Speaker 1: vocals are so melodious that it's very easy for them 166 00:09:32,080 --> 00:09:35,920 Speaker 1: to transition into music rather than words. You know, Yeah, 167 00:09:35,960 --> 00:09:37,680 Speaker 1: I mean, you can be a small town girl living 168 00:09:37,720 --> 00:09:41,400 Speaker 1: in a lonely world and still feel nothing when that 169 00:09:41,480 --> 00:09:43,360 Speaker 1: song comes up, if you've heard it too many times, 170 00:09:43,960 --> 00:09:51,199 Speaker 1: nothing except rage. I think it's interesting that words a 171 00:09:51,320 --> 00:09:53,960 Speaker 1: word can spark an emotion or be tied to an 172 00:09:53,960 --> 00:09:57,720 Speaker 1: emotion period, just like seeing a word on a piece 173 00:09:57,760 --> 00:10:00,760 Speaker 1: of paper. And they've used an example, I believe, like 174 00:10:01,320 --> 00:10:05,880 Speaker 1: you know, even seeing the word anger can like kind 175 00:10:05,880 --> 00:10:08,280 Speaker 1: of prime the pump for you to be angry. It 176 00:10:08,320 --> 00:10:11,880 Speaker 1: doesn't necessarily make you angry, but it can spark an 177 00:10:11,880 --> 00:10:14,920 Speaker 1: emotion in you to that sort of gets you headed 178 00:10:14,920 --> 00:10:17,720 Speaker 1: in that direction, right right, Yeah, Like you can be 179 00:10:17,720 --> 00:10:20,080 Speaker 1: primed to feel anger. Whereas if you're if you see 180 00:10:20,120 --> 00:10:23,840 Speaker 1: that word anger written down or something like that, and 181 00:10:24,080 --> 00:10:27,480 Speaker 1: something comes along that would make you angry, you're more 182 00:10:27,559 --> 00:10:30,040 Speaker 1: likely to become angry at that thing if you've seen 183 00:10:30,080 --> 00:10:33,280 Speaker 1: that word. So yeah, that whole semantic satiation thing reveals 184 00:10:33,360 --> 00:10:36,440 Speaker 1: that that fact that words have that effect, they have 185 00:10:36,520 --> 00:10:39,800 Speaker 1: emotional attachments, they can evoke emotions in us. Yeah, it's 186 00:10:39,800 --> 00:10:44,240 Speaker 1: pretty cool. I did mention stuttering at the beginning, and 187 00:10:44,320 --> 00:10:46,040 Speaker 1: we'll probably just close with this a little bit. Leon 188 00:10:46,200 --> 00:10:48,959 Speaker 1: James did. He's like, well, I wonder if I could 189 00:10:49,000 --> 00:10:52,600 Speaker 1: apply this to people who stutter, and let me do 190 00:10:52,720 --> 00:10:55,040 Speaker 1: this experiment while where I call people who have a 191 00:10:55,040 --> 00:10:58,920 Speaker 1: stutter over and over again all day long and talk 192 00:10:58,960 --> 00:11:01,600 Speaker 1: to them and see how much I can annoy them. 193 00:11:02,360 --> 00:11:05,360 Speaker 1: But what he found was the more he called, the 194 00:11:05,480 --> 00:11:11,000 Speaker 1: less they stuttered. So the stress of receiving that phone 195 00:11:11,000 --> 00:11:15,280 Speaker 1: call apparently seems like it had been satiated as well. 196 00:11:16,120 --> 00:11:19,480 Speaker 1: And yeah, that's not This probably the same thing as 197 00:11:19,520 --> 00:11:22,640 Speaker 1: semantic satiation. I think Chris is Leon James showing off. 198 00:11:22,679 --> 00:11:26,200 Speaker 1: I think so too. But what it basically shows is 199 00:11:26,320 --> 00:11:28,440 Speaker 1: it's the same thing as exposure. Like if you fly 200 00:11:28,480 --> 00:11:30,560 Speaker 1: in an airplane a bunch and you're afraid to fly, 201 00:11:30,840 --> 00:11:33,480 Speaker 1: you're going to become less afraid to fly over time. 202 00:11:35,040 --> 00:11:37,720 Speaker 1: One way to explain it is that you're showing yourself 203 00:11:37,760 --> 00:11:40,240 Speaker 1: there's actually nothing to be afraid of. Another one is 204 00:11:40,280 --> 00:11:44,560 Speaker 1: that you're actually stimulating that stress or that anxiety enough 205 00:11:44,640 --> 00:11:47,760 Speaker 1: times that your brains just like, forget about it. I'm done, 206 00:11:47,760 --> 00:11:51,880 Speaker 1: I'm satiated. Yeah, very interesting. It is interesting. The brain 207 00:11:52,040 --> 00:11:56,360 Speaker 1: is interesting, John, it certainly is well check agreed with me, everybody. 208 00:11:56,400 --> 00:11:57,800 Speaker 1: So I'm going to end on a high note and 209 00:11:57,880 --> 00:12:03,439 Speaker 1: say short stuff is out. Stuff you should Know is 210 00:12:03,480 --> 00:12:06,880 Speaker 1: a production of iHeartRadio. For more podcasts my heart Radio, 211 00:12:07,160 --> 00:12:10,560 Speaker 1: visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen 212 00:12:10,600 --> 00:12:11,600 Speaker 1: to your favorite shows.