Speaker 1: Welcome back to another edition to all the smoke, My guy,
Speaker 1: my brother, We're back. We're back here again. We got
Speaker 1: a very special guest, someone very close to myself, a mentor,
Speaker 1: someone we look up to, someone we are a fan of.
Speaker 1: Rachel Nichols. No one's looking up to me. We still
Speaker 1: find a way to ye. We put you on a pedestal.
Speaker 1: Absolutely all right, we're going to do serious business year.
Speaker 1: But before we start it is we're taping this on
Speaker 1: Steven Jack's birthday. Right, so here you go, right, something
Speaker 1: in the way of shape. I know it's a little
Speaker 1: something something. Thank you so much. I'm just saying, well,
Speaker 1: I only give alcohol for gifts. There are people in
Speaker 1: my life who are sober and then I get to
Speaker 1: find like a pet rock or something. This is all
Speaker 1: I know. Thank you so much, though, Thank you? How
Speaker 1: come with gifts? How does it feel being old? Uh?
Speaker 1: It feels great to be thank you old? Look good
Speaker 1: and especially what we've all been through as a country,
Speaker 1: as friends and families last year to be here and happy.
Speaker 1: So something we're celebrating you today. So Rachel with Jack
Speaker 1: saying that what is one thing you took from It's
Speaker 1: funny we talk all the time, like we should be grateful,
Speaker 1: we're also fortunate all that stuff. I don't think that
Speaker 1: landed with me enough before. And I can say that
Speaker 1: I would have argued with you before I get it.
Speaker 1: I would. I don't think it landed with me quite
Speaker 1: enough to just appreciate all the ship that goes right
Speaker 1: every day, because there's so much that goes wrong, and
Speaker 1: it's so easy to get caught up in that and
Speaker 1: this isn't fair, and this has happened to me, and
Speaker 1: there's important stuff that we have to channel that into.
Speaker 1: But that's kind of the point. That's the important ship,
Speaker 1: like the big injustices the big things and the little
Speaker 1: day to day things. I have done a much better
Speaker 1: job after this year of just not sweating that as
Speaker 1: much and being able to if they're little things that
Speaker 1: come into my mind and life, have them be the
Speaker 1: good stuff. You know, here we go, Rachel, tell us
Speaker 1: about you. Let's start tell us about your upbringing. The
Speaker 1: conversations than me and you've never had so tell us
Speaker 1: about your upbringing and we're on a hot seat today. Well,
Speaker 1: I think this is one of the things I love
Speaker 1: about the show. Not to even cut you off, but
Speaker 1: it's just like Rachel. We know each other, we conversated,
Speaker 1: we text, we work together. But like when we do
Speaker 1: stuff like this, you get to learn your friends more. Yes,
Speaker 1: and I think that it is dope. Well, you guys know,
Speaker 1: I grew up outside watched in d C, which gave
Speaker 1: me a very tortured sports existence because a Bullets fan.
Speaker 1: And let me explain to you it has been right,
Speaker 1: I would say. Now, so they played in an arena
Speaker 1: and landover Maryland. They had a different name than the
Speaker 1: team has now. They play in a different state than now,
Speaker 1: owned by a different person. So when people say to
Speaker 1: me like, oh, wouldn't be a team are you attached to?
Speaker 1: I'm kind of attached to a team. It doesn't exist anymore.
Speaker 1: The franchise still exists, and it's very sad because that
Speaker 1: franchise has not been in a even conference finals in
Speaker 1: forty years. So it has been a long desert. And
Speaker 1: people who are fans of teams that don't do so
Speaker 1: well with sometimes like, man, you're always ragging on our team.
Speaker 1: So I'm like, is the pain I know experience? This pain?
Speaker 1: The football team that was really great when I was
Speaker 1: a kid, Right, they won three championships I think in
Speaker 1: like fifteen years when I was growing up. So it
Speaker 1: really gave me that love of sports that was kind
Speaker 1: of bounced out by the fact that I was a sad,
Speaker 1: frustrated little girl Bullets fan that were these Bullets T
Speaker 1: shirts that people would laugh at me for. But the
Speaker 1: important thing is it was enough for me to know, like,
Speaker 1: this is what I want to do. And I just
Speaker 1: always felt like I don't want to be in an office,
Speaker 1: and there were so many paths in sports for women
Speaker 1: that are available now that frankly just were. So this
Speaker 1: was kind of the way to have a job in
Speaker 1: sports for me, and it tapped into some things that
Speaker 1: I'm kind of okay at and I was able to
Speaker 1: sort of just pursue that and say, Okay, this is
Speaker 1: what I want to do. But that's where it all
Speaker 1: came from, is growing up in d C and just
Speaker 1: the mix there is pretty awesome high school basketball there.
Speaker 1: Talk to us about your journey because it wasn't easy.
Speaker 1: You got pushed back. Some people didn't consider sports journalism serious.
Speaker 1: So talk to us about that in the pushback and
Speaker 1: what you had to overcome to not only be a
Speaker 1: woman but taking your what you want to do serious
Speaker 1: as well. Well. When I went to college, I had
Speaker 1: great journals and professors at Northwestern. Again, not the best
Speaker 1: sports teams. I I apparently can only go to places
Speaker 1: where there's a lot of struggle, But um, the journalism
Speaker 1: programs great. And to their credit because they were trying
Speaker 1: to help me, they were really trying to steer me
Speaker 1: into covering news. They're like, you, you're so smart, You're
Speaker 1: such a nice girl. You don't want to work in sports.
Speaker 1: This this won't you know. It's the toy department. That's
Speaker 1: what people used to call it in newspapers, and toy department.
Speaker 1: That was the thing. And I was just sort of like, no,
Speaker 1: this is actually what I want to do. And part
Speaker 1: of the deal in Northwestern is you have an internship
Speaker 1: program that the schools attached too, and you you have
Speaker 1: to do it. It's for credit. And I wanted to
Speaker 1: do it in sports, and I had to like go
Speaker 1: present to the board of the college and everything about
Speaker 1: why the program, about why I wanted to do it,
Speaker 1: and they've never done it before, but they finally let
Speaker 1: me do it, and that led to my first job.
Speaker 1: And my first job was covering the university of Miami
Speaker 1: football team back in the nineties when it was the
Speaker 1: and I graduate from college early. I was twenty one.
Speaker 1: Ray Lewis was a fifth year senior for that team,
Speaker 1: and that team was out of control, both both good
Speaker 1: ways and tough ways. Ray Lewis's roommate was murdered and
Speaker 1: ray came home and found him. I mean, there are
Speaker 1: a bunch of ship went down that year, and it
Speaker 1: was the education of a lifetime of preparing me for
Speaker 1: the rest of my life in this career. But it
Speaker 1: was awesome. And if I hadn't kind of convinced them
Speaker 1: to let me do it in the first place, I
Speaker 1: never would have gotten that job because that was the
Speaker 1: place I inter talk about your first time on television.
Speaker 1: Oh man, I was terrible. I'm still not very good.
Speaker 1: That's the problem is that I'm the things I'm good
Speaker 1: at is not what I'm you know, like when I
Speaker 1: grew up. I don't know about you guys. Like the
Speaker 1: women on TV. They were tall and blonde, largely and
Speaker 1: kind of very polished and that whole vibe, and that's
Speaker 1: just not my up. You guys are on TV with me.
Speaker 1: I'm if we make a mistake on the air. What
Speaker 1: do I was the first thing I do. I talk
Speaker 1: about it in the air. I talk the producers crazy.
Speaker 1: They're like, you don't have to say every time we
Speaker 1: mess up. But to me, I rather be this like
Speaker 1: rolling mess in front of everyone then try to like
Speaker 1: I'm just you know. And when I started out on TV,
Speaker 1: I just tried to be that glossy thing. I'm just
Speaker 1: not that person. So it took me a while to
Speaker 1: figure out. And Stuart Scott was actually great with me
Speaker 1: when I was kind of trying to feel my way
Speaker 1: because I think for the beginning for him, a lot
Speaker 1: of people wanted him to be something he wasn't, and
Speaker 1: he just kept saying to me, He's like, you could
Speaker 1: be great at being you, you were only gonna be
Speaker 1: like sixty or sev being someone else. And it sounds obvious,
Speaker 1: but it's hard when everybody looks an X like the other,
Speaker 1: like a cooks and cutter You've mentioned before. Craig Sager
Speaker 1: was someone you just mentioned, Stewart Scott, rest in peace.
Speaker 1: Who were some of the people you looked up to
Speaker 1: in this space Because in your in sports, there wasn't
Speaker 1: very many women for me, so I grew up in
Speaker 1: thet n DC area. The Washington Post, great newspaper. I
Speaker 1: think I read that book All the President's Men, like
Speaker 1: forty fifty times. It was very embarrassing that I could
Speaker 1: recite it. I wanted to work for the Washington Post.
Speaker 1: And part of that, too, was because Tony Cornheiser a
Speaker 1: woman named Christine Brennan who now is with USA Today
Speaker 1: and there's a lot of television on CNN and some
Speaker 1: other places where for the Washington Post, and she was
Speaker 1: the first female, like full time beat writer of an
Speaker 1: NFL team. She covered the Washington football team, and she
Speaker 1: was the first woman to do it full time. But
Speaker 1: I was a kid reading that and I didn't know
Speaker 1: she was the first person to do it full time.
Speaker 1: I just knew. I opened the newspaper and I read
Speaker 1: about the team I liked, and there was a woman
Speaker 1: who wrote about it. So I just assumed I could
Speaker 1: do that because I saw it. And it wasn't until
Speaker 1: much leader that people kept saying to me, like, come on,
Speaker 1: you can't really do that, and it was too late
Speaker 1: because I had already seen her do it, and that
Speaker 1: made such an impression on me. Once later I found
Speaker 1: out kind of have that dynamic plays when your kid
Speaker 1: you don't understand it, but it's why I think now
Speaker 1: you know, we use representation as we almost overuse it
Speaker 1: sometimes as losses meaning but if you can't fucking see
Speaker 1: anybody doing what you're doing is very hard to get there,
Speaker 1: and you can see people doing it, it just changes
Speaker 1: the whole equation. So she did that for me, beautiful.
Speaker 1: You haven't had second doubts what this the last five
Speaker 1: minutes is. And she was in your career, you think so,
Speaker 1: I mean, yeah, yeah, sure. I mean there's times where
Speaker 1: I sit there and whether it's like the practical stuff
Speaker 1: if it's two in the morning and you're exhausted and
Speaker 1: you've done X or Y and it didn't go the
Speaker 1: way you wanted to and you're like, why why am
Speaker 1: I giving up all the stuff in my life? I mean,
Speaker 1: I've missed weddings and miss family stuff, I miss whatever.
Speaker 1: There's times where I screw up and you're just sitting
Speaker 1: there like, okay, really, like that came out of my mouth? Why? Um?
Speaker 1: But I know it's the thing I love like I
Speaker 1: know I love it. I still love it all the time,
Speaker 1: and that's what keeps me feeling like I'm doing the
Speaker 1: right thing, you know, that's right, join ESPN and O
Speaker 1: four kind of worked your way around different sports, landed
Speaker 1: with NBA coverage towards the end, and kind of hit
Speaker 1: the ground running in that space. Talk to us about
Speaker 1: that journey and kind of finding your path on you know,
Speaker 1: the stage of ESPN presence. Yeah. So I started out
Speaker 1: basically covering what people let me cover, right. So one
Speaker 1: of my early imagined college football, one of my early
Speaker 1: jobs was covering hockey. I like hockey, but it wasn't
Speaker 1: like my dream to be doing hockey, but that's what
Speaker 1: was available, and that's you know, I told you guys,
Speaker 1: I wanted to work for the Lashing Post. There's a
Speaker 1: job that opened up in the Washington Poast covering the
Speaker 1: hockey beat. And I have been in this this experience
Speaker 1: where the newspaper I was working because the stork in
Speaker 1: newspapers in Florida. The Florida Panthers go to the NHL
Speaker 1: the Stanley Cup Finals in just their third year of existence,
Speaker 1: and they didn't have a ton of infrastructure in the
Speaker 1: media there to cover hockey because it was a brand
Speaker 1: new team, right, and all of a sudden, there was
Speaker 1: all this interest and all this stuff up. And I
Speaker 1: grew up in the Northeast and so I knew a
Speaker 1: lot about hockey. So my old sports letter, who was
Speaker 1: a great guy, was just like, yeah, I'm throwing you
Speaker 1: on with the other hockey people. And I had a
Speaker 1: person in the media, not who worked with me, but
Speaker 1: who worked in the media down there, who turned to
Speaker 1: me like, I don't know early in the Stanley Cup
Speaker 1: finals game and says, Rachel, why does the coach pull
Speaker 1: all the starters? Why is he pulling all the starters
Speaker 1: three minutes in? And I had to explain that they
Speaker 1: have line changes in hockey, and the new guys come
Speaker 1: over the boards every couple of minutes. That's how hockey works.
Speaker 1: But there was just such a sort of okay, that's
Speaker 1: not there. So at the end of that summer the
Speaker 1: hockey beat opened up at the Washington Post. I had
Speaker 1: done a little bit stuff that was by accident. It
Speaker 1: wasn't even what I was supposed to do with because
Speaker 1: the team the year before I went far and I
Speaker 1: got the job. So I did that, and then I
Speaker 1: covered baseball when they wanted me to cover baseball, and
Speaker 1: they covered golf when they wanted me to cover golf
Speaker 1: and a couple of tennis or I covered whatever. What
Speaker 1: I really love was football and basketball, and so the
Speaker 1: more I could try to get in that space I
Speaker 1: wanted to. I like sports where people hit each other,
Speaker 1: so I thought that was covery football and with basketball
Speaker 1: for me, just that there's not a bunch of crap
Speaker 1: in between you and the game. Right, So I'm watching
Speaker 1: you guys. You are right in front of me, you
Speaker 1: are four ft in front of me. You are doing
Speaker 1: your thing without equipment all over your face. I can
Speaker 1: see you. I can see sort of the like everything
Speaker 1: about that drive to the hoop. You experience it in
Speaker 1: a different way than you do some of these sports
Speaker 1: where they're more separation. And the more time I covered
Speaker 1: the n b A that drew me in both from
Speaker 1: an athletic point of view of where like I could
Speaker 1: fucking see Michael Jordan's do what he was doing, but
Speaker 1: also just personality wise, is like you can get to
Speaker 1: know you guys, is real people better? And that was
Speaker 1: one thing that I don't know, maybe this is a
Speaker 1: different perspective coming in as a woman, right, is that
Speaker 1: I felt like I could connect with all of you
Speaker 1: guys in a way that could make you full people
Speaker 1: and that I could then turn around and present you
Speaker 1: as a full person. And I don't know you guys,
Speaker 1: tell me I covered both of you different times. If
Speaker 1: I did that for you, but but and if I
Speaker 1: was able to to do it accurately. But that was
Speaker 1: my hope. I mean, I remember, you gave me clarity.
Speaker 1: You help me get clarity on a lot of everything.
Speaker 1: Every time we spoke, I was able to get clarity.
Speaker 1: And then I think it was it was times where
Speaker 1: I wasn't even the person you was supposed to talk to.
Speaker 1: But at times things were misunderstood about Man, you still
Speaker 1: give me opportunity to clear it up. So that's one
Speaker 1: reason why we always had a good relationship. So once
Speaker 1: you get into this ESPN space, you worked on what
Speaker 1: they gave you. But how did you end up in basketball?
Speaker 1: I really love the game, so I was always pitching
Speaker 1: a lot of ideas and a lot of things, and
Speaker 1: ESPNS changed a lot over the years. Right, we've had
Speaker 1: the basketball contract for a while, but there have been
Speaker 1: periods where we did a lot on opening Day and
Speaker 1: then didn't do a lot till Christmas. Right, and they
Speaker 1: did a lot of Christmas and then didn't do as
Speaker 1: much to the playoffs. It wasn't a three six five, right,
Speaker 1: And I would kind of be filling in those spaces
Speaker 1: as being like, what how about we do this? How
Speaker 1: about we do that again? I think one of the
Speaker 1: things I tell people who want to get started in
Speaker 1: my job, and I'm sure you guys are the same way,
Speaker 1: like a lot of it, is to just fucking work
Speaker 1: harder than everybody. You have to be the last person
Speaker 1: in the room. And if you do that, it's not
Speaker 1: a guarantee that you're going to do great, but you're
Speaker 1: probably not going to do great without it. So I
Speaker 1: was constantly willing to be like I'll take that trip,
Speaker 1: I'll go, I'll stay an extra day is fine, I'll
Speaker 1: do you know that kind of thing. And that kind
Speaker 1: of helped me in the space, and it helped me
Speaker 1: not only you know, sort of move around and move
Speaker 1: up at ESPN, but it helped me. I think again
Speaker 1: with you guys, with the with the league, people need
Speaker 1: to see it, right, And I think after a while,
Speaker 1: especially someone like me who doesn't look like someone who
Speaker 1: would naturally be covering the NBA for like twelve reasons, right, well,
Speaker 1: you show up every day, and that is something I
Speaker 1: think this league does better. The guys in this league
Speaker 1: do better than anyone else. They legit reward work and
Speaker 1: that if you bring come to the table and you're
Speaker 1: a worker, and you show that like you you actually
Speaker 1: are invested, that matters. And that's frankly not true in
Speaker 1: every sport, and it's not true with every business or
Speaker 1: every group of people, but it matters in the NBA.
Speaker 1: So that helped me too. Who did you enjoy working
Speaker 1: with had beside me? Who did you enjoy working with
Speaker 1: and have a barn with besides of me? Again, well,
Speaker 1: it's funny, you know. We started the show and I
Speaker 1: had been pitching doing a daily NBA show, and again
Speaker 1: ESPN just wasn't the three sixty five basketball coverage until
Speaker 1: maybe the last five or six years. But um, we
Speaker 1: had a great show NBA Tonight that was mostly in season,
Speaker 1: mostly driven around highlights at like you know, one in
Speaker 1: the morning, and for me, there was room to add
Speaker 1: in a daily afternoon kind of this a year round sport,
Speaker 1: man Like it's it's a year round kind of conversations
Speaker 1: and themes and stories and ideas. And I kept pitching
Speaker 1: this idea and my elevator pitch for the show when
Speaker 1: I was still was sort of at Turner and trying
Speaker 1: to figure out do I reap with Turner? Do I
Speaker 1: come back to ESPN? Was Hey, what if we had
Speaker 1: a basketball show that was the afternoon just sitting around
Speaker 1: with your friends talking about who but one of your
Speaker 1: friends was Tracy McGrady. And that's like how I kept
Speaker 1: pitching them because for me, I didn't want it to
Speaker 1: feel like a television show, because it's kind of what
Speaker 1: I said at the beginning about me on TV. I
Speaker 1: don't think I can really run like a television show,
Speaker 1: very like formal, kind a PowerPoint presentation. Way, I'm not
Speaker 1: that girl. So for me, I was like, what if
Speaker 1: we just sat around talking like we talk? And that
Speaker 1: was kind of the start of it. So t Mac
Speaker 1: for me, was the one where he had retired kind
Speaker 1: of in the space that we were trying to do this,
Speaker 1: and I felt like, next to Kobe, he was the
Speaker 1: guy so many of today's players, and I wasn't sure
Speaker 1: that some of the people outside basketball understood that the
Speaker 1: way I did, and I just kept saying like, no, no,
Speaker 1: he's the guy. And some of the people who were
Speaker 1: who were doing. I mean, they're awesome. They said yes,
Speaker 1: they gave they gave us the show, they said yes
Speaker 1: to Tea Max. So there wasn't obviously not that much
Speaker 1: convincing because they did it, but there was a little
Speaker 1: bit of like, oh, well, how is he on TV?
Speaker 1: And I just kept saying like, I don't know, we
Speaker 1: haven't we haven't tested him that much. But we don't
Speaker 1: need to. I said, we can teach him how to
Speaker 1: be on TV, I can't teach him to be a
Speaker 1: Hall of Famer. And that's kind of them, right, that's
Speaker 1: the attitude we've had with everyone, and that it's completely true,
Speaker 1: Like you have been one of my favorite people work with, Matt,
Speaker 1: you know how I feel about you, because for me,
Speaker 1: the guys on that show and the women on that show,
Speaker 1: it's kind of like a basketball team. You need the
Speaker 1: Hall of Famers, but you also need the guys. Guys,
Speaker 1: you need the people with this perspective or that perspective,
Speaker 1: you know. So I just kind of think that we've
Speaker 1: been so lucky getting a lot of those people on.
Speaker 1: And look, sometimes now you're off doing your own thing,
Speaker 1: which is amazing. Don't take him too far away from
Speaker 1: me for too long. I'm just he's behind. I can't
Speaker 1: take the grantity, but I trust me, I know. But
Speaker 1: it's great because you know, people come through, then they
Speaker 1: cycle out for a little bit, then they come back
Speaker 1: and it just keeps. It's like you're friend. It's like
Speaker 1: sitting around top of basketball with your friends, a great conversation. Well, congratulations,
Speaker 1: you just hit the five year mark in this past February,
Speaker 1: So congratulations on that. What is it like for you now,
Speaker 1: because you know, you started off in journalism and then
Speaker 1: you're like a real celebrity in this space because basketball
Speaker 1: has grown through much, don't lie, Rachel. I always see
Speaker 1: how my comments how much people love you. But I
Speaker 1: used to tell her the same thing. She's just being modest.
Speaker 1: I just had the same thing to blow up. Man,
Speaker 1: I love Rachel. Rachel got on today. Man, we love
Speaker 1: look at the hair, Rachel. I was showing you that
Speaker 1: the whole time. But it was that too. On top
Speaker 1: of the and the fact that obviously your parents is
Speaker 1: easy on the eyes, but the fact that in the
Speaker 1: other reason why you have our trust to is because
Speaker 1: you know what you're talking about. So it's you're a
Speaker 1: double edged sword. From that standpoint, but what has that
Speaker 1: been like without being modest? Like now you're recognized wherever
Speaker 1: you go now because you're on TV so much and
Speaker 1: you know what you're talking about. Well, the answer to
Speaker 1: all of that is, I'm just old. So if you're around,
Speaker 1: must be good. She's still here. I haven't doing it
Speaker 1: for a long time, like that is that is a
Speaker 1: big part of it. I was super like I went
Speaker 1: to Northwestern, as I said, so I was in Chicago,
Speaker 1: in Chicago when Michael Jordan played for the Bulls like that,
Speaker 1: that's the thing. And then I can keep going back
Speaker 1: to that or you know, I cover that was you know,
Speaker 1: Scotty Pippin's on our show sometimes now I met Scottie
Speaker 1: Pippen because I was a little during of this, even
Speaker 1: smaller than I am now, As hard as that is
Speaker 1: to believe, short human in the Bulls locker room nervously
Speaker 1: trying to get up the guts to ask him a
Speaker 1: question at nineteen when I was like stringing for newspaper
Speaker 1: trying to like, you know whatever. So I've been around
Speaker 1: a long enough time that yeah, I think it's good.
Speaker 1: I've earned that trust with people, and you know, how
Speaker 1: many basketball games do I probably watch you year, like
Speaker 1: two hundred, Like how many you know you do that enough?
Speaker 1: People get that you have. Like we're talking before you
Speaker 1: on the work, right, you do all the ship, so
Speaker 1: we'll speak on what kind of homework you almost have
Speaker 1: to do. You said you're a fan of it, about
Speaker 1: the same time I'm a fan, but I get tired
Speaker 1: of watching that ship, you know what I mean. But
Speaker 1: you're on TV every single day with like a daytime
Speaker 1: basketball talk shown. There's nothing like it. So how much preparation?
Speaker 1: How much time does that take? Because obviously you're a wife,
Speaker 1: you're a mother, but then you have such a demanding job.
Speaker 1: You were telling us before you've started your schedule heading
Speaker 1: all the way through the Olympics, Like your schedule in
Speaker 1: the next five months is crazy, So talk to us
Speaker 1: about how much preparation at time it takes to do
Speaker 1: what you're doing. Yeah. Well, first of all, I'm so lucky. Right,
Speaker 1: if my family wasn't set up and if everyone involved
Speaker 1: in my family, including my little twins, my husband, you
Speaker 1: couldn't do it without that, right, So that's the first thing.
Speaker 1: I could not do this job if it was not
Speaker 1: set up so that I could this weekend I'm going
Speaker 1: to Brooklyn Nets game in Brooklyn. Like, you know, I
Speaker 1: got children. You need to eat someone. We got to
Speaker 1: feed them. So I'm very very grateful. I'm very lucky
Speaker 1: about that. And then yeah, it's just kind of constantly
Speaker 1: being open to having that drift into your day. So
Speaker 1: whether it's ham, I drive to work, I'm listening to
Speaker 1: someone's basketball podcast, I listen to all of smoke. I'm
Speaker 1: listening to, you know, sort of the conversation that's going on.
Speaker 1: I'm at work, I'm listening to a bunch of different
Speaker 1: things and different people. You know. At night, I'm watching
Speaker 1: at least two or three games, kind of have on
Speaker 1: and see what's going on. I read a lot. And
Speaker 1: part of it is just so that not only can
Speaker 1: I do the show opens that we do and some
Speaker 1: of the stuff we do, but I want to be
Speaker 1: able to be there for you guys, Like when you're
Speaker 1: talking about something, I don't want you to have to
Speaker 1: feel that there isn't a safety net of oh if
Speaker 1: I said this wrong guy's name, like which, she'll be there.
Speaker 1: She'll she'll kind of set it up so smooth so
Speaker 1: it's not a problem later or anything like that. There's
Speaker 1: like a little course correct we need to do along
Speaker 1: the way in a discussion. I'm the one who's going
Speaker 1: to be able to have that answer, So I had
Speaker 1: to do my homework, and I kind of feel like
Speaker 1: that's that's why I get to have a seat at
Speaker 1: that table. I don't want a championship like you guys,
Speaker 1: So I am played that play basketball, So my value
Speaker 1: has to come from doing all that work a team
Speaker 1: at one time in your life. Again, this is what
Speaker 1: you see here is the result of a gross spurt good.
Speaker 1: I was never I put soccer growing up because it's
Speaker 1: low to the ground. What's it like being able to
Speaker 1: see former players you work with and kind of their
Speaker 1: growth in progress? Obviously said you know Tea Mac you
Speaker 1: had him as an infant When it comes to reporting,
Speaker 1: Paul Pierce has grown, Perk has turned into a star,
Speaker 1: and you see me and Jack start at the beginning
Speaker 1: and kind of grow. What does that like? Because obviously
Speaker 1: we all look up to you and got a chance
Speaker 1: to work with you, So what's that like? It's killer
Speaker 1: like we don't have people on the show I don't
Speaker 1: like so first and first almost say that way, but
Speaker 1: I mean, we're not going to right, because it's not
Speaker 1: gonna be a good conversation. It's not because I have
Speaker 1: oh my god, there's such decision making power. It's more
Speaker 1: just like everyone knows that be crappy, right, everyone we
Speaker 1: have on the show or people I'm legit really fond
Speaker 1: of and want to see get better and try to
Speaker 1: hopefully support to get better and put you in good
Speaker 1: positions so when it happens your sites, right, how many
Speaker 1: players career started on the jump though, that's a couple
Speaker 1: of you. Also, I'm a little bit of a stalker
Speaker 1: when it comes to that ship guys I know would
Speaker 1: be a good fit for us, like in the last
Speaker 1: month or two of whatever, the end of what they've
Speaker 1: already said is going to be the end of their career.
Speaker 1: I mean I have followed Vince Carter personally around more
Speaker 1: arenas where he's like, Rachel, I know, and I'm like,
Speaker 1: I know, but just want to remind you'll be good,
Speaker 1: You'll be you'll be coming on with us after this.
Speaker 1: And it was he used to come on with us,
Speaker 1: you remember to come out of this sometimes in the
Speaker 1: playoffs when his teams didn't make it, and I would
Speaker 1: just be like, all right, well you know what's happening
Speaker 1: when you retire, but you get nervous. Maybe they'll go
Speaker 1: somewhere else, maybe they'll do something else. So it's just
Speaker 1: it's a I call it light stalking. It's it's a
Speaker 1: light stalking. It's not tampering. McGrady was drawn in because
Speaker 1: of your knowledge of the game and couldn't turn you down.
Speaker 1: How did that feel hearing it again? Te Maxim light stalking.
Speaker 1: His wife helped me out with that, like it's it's good.
Speaker 1: I think there have been guys who have come in
Speaker 1: and I don't know if T Mac was like this.
Speaker 1: I mean again, guys have covered. I think it helps, right,
Speaker 1: So y'all dealt with me when you were playing. So
Speaker 1: I think it helps that you feel tracy. You just
Speaker 1: feel like you know me. So it's not like a
Speaker 1: big sell or anything. But I think there's still like
Speaker 1: a little bit of and this is earned by the way,
Speaker 1: why is she talking when I'm the one who played right?
Speaker 1: I think there's a little bit of that with with
Speaker 1: not anyone in particular, but with some just overall. And
Speaker 1: you gotta you gotta again, it's like everything else, you
Speaker 1: gotta earn it. And I can see sometimes when that
Speaker 1: flip comes for some of the guys when they're newer
Speaker 1: on the show, she knows she's talking about. Okay, you know,
Speaker 1: that's the one that feels good to answer that question,
Speaker 1: whether it was a MAC or with anyone else, that
Speaker 1: feels good because you're the opinion of you guys really
Speaker 1: matters to me. If you all think that we know
Speaker 1: the game and we know we're talking about on the
Speaker 1: show like that, that matters. And I think one of
Speaker 1: the great early things about the show. And you mentioned
Speaker 1: our five years and it's been awesome, and honestly, we
Speaker 1: had a six month try out with the show. So
Speaker 1: the fact that it turned into five years pretty killer.
Speaker 1: You know, it went from a half hour to an
Speaker 1: hour and went from just in the season to year round,
Speaker 1: like all that stuff made it feel really good. What
Speaker 1: meant more to me? And you guys worked with the
Speaker 1: great Gina and so you know, and she can vouch
Speaker 1: for this. Um when we had guys around the league
Speaker 1: say I watch that every day. That's the show where
Speaker 1: I have you know, coaches, head coaches who will text
Speaker 1: me during discussion or during the show. Yeah, and it's
Speaker 1: it's not usually to say that was wrong in a
Speaker 1: nice way. It's usually to chime in and be like, oh,
Speaker 1: you should tell them such as true, well you're right
Speaker 1: about that or whatever, And that feels that to me
Speaker 1: is kind of more important frankly than any rating or
Speaker 1: anything else. Sort of feels like, well, just if I'm
Speaker 1: doing right by you guys, then that means that we're
Speaker 1: doing it right absolutely. You know, take us back to
Speaker 1: last year, um, going into the bubble and really kind
Speaker 1: of being the voice of everything that went on there.
Speaker 1: You know, Jack is leading the biggest, you know, demonstration
Speaker 1: in the history of our country. The NBA decides to play,
Speaker 1: you get thrown in the bubble and you're kind of
Speaker 1: the sole person kind of keeping us in touch on
Speaker 1: what were the going on in there. Yeah, we were
Speaker 1: the only daily show in the bubble. Um. It was
Speaker 1: all the challenges you'd expect because you're a limited number
Speaker 1: of people who could even do stuff. So we're sitting around,
Speaker 1: We got how many cameras you got pointed at you
Speaker 1: right now to do this show? This fine endeavor one, two, three,
Speaker 1: four or five six is or nothing out there? We
Speaker 1: have like one producer with one camera, you know, and
Speaker 1: then helped by a second producer with a second camera.
Speaker 1: With these what these producers did, we had two or
Speaker 1: three in the bubble at a time, depending that people
Speaker 1: came in and out. I can't even speak to the
Speaker 1: acrobatics they had to do for us to put on
Speaker 1: a television show. So just to get to that was
Speaker 1: crazy because again it's just a limited number of people
Speaker 1: the NBA wanted in there, which I get considering every
Speaker 1: one person extra person is one more risk. And then
Speaker 1: to try to be in this crazy environment where we're
Speaker 1: living in the same place as the players, which is
Speaker 1: kind of nuts, and trying to sort of keep the
Speaker 1: right boundaries in terms of COVID and all of you
Speaker 1: have to be six feet away from people, but you
Speaker 1: have a conversation with a guy after a game, You
Speaker 1: want to talk to him, right, So can you do
Speaker 1: that from eight feet away? Can you? You don't want
Speaker 1: to shout this ship. So like trying to like stay
Speaker 1: within the rules but also do our job was kind
Speaker 1: of a whole thing, and it just it was It
Speaker 1: was crazy. And then of course because it was such
Speaker 1: an unusual situation with coronavirus and everything going on in
Speaker 1: the country leading up to this huge election. I mean,
Speaker 1: you kind of couldn't have a crazier confluence of events.
Speaker 1: And I always say about you guys that that the
Speaker 1: NBA and the w n b A as a whole
Speaker 1: are I mean, correct me if I'm wrong. These are
Speaker 1: the the most visible African American men and women in
Speaker 1: this country, right and therefore unfairly at times there is
Speaker 1: a responsibility and a mantle of having to answer for
Speaker 1: stuff that, like, I mean, we say it all the time,
Speaker 1: people being oppressed should not have to answer for that oppression.
Speaker 1: It is insane the way that mechanic works. But if
Speaker 1: you don't talk about it, who else is stuff we're
Speaker 1: talking about? So it's a catch way two and it
Speaker 1: put all this weight on these men and women in
Speaker 1: these two bubbles. And they did it. I mean, they
Speaker 1: kept the conversation where it should be. When it was
Speaker 1: time to stop, they stopped where it was time to start.
Speaker 1: Because they had people's attention. They started and they managed
Speaker 1: a lot of really calm, plex, nuanced stuff in a
Speaker 1: way that frankly, like I was so proud every day
Speaker 1: to be associated with this group of people because it
Speaker 1: was hard. Yes, take us back to when the Milwaukee
Speaker 1: Bucks decided to sit out a game. Well, it was
Speaker 1: so interesting to me that sort of how it happened,
Speaker 1: because there was this idea when it first happened, like, oh,
Speaker 1: they planned this, what do they want? Didn't planet? And
Speaker 1: then by the way, I shouldn't have had to a planet.
Speaker 1: It was real. There was a legit and the moment
Speaker 1: reaction to Okay, we found our breaking point. This is
Speaker 1: too much. It is too much, and I'm going to
Speaker 1: sit down in my place and not be moved because
Speaker 1: it is too much. And I think getting people to
Speaker 1: understand that and getting to understand then in the forty
Speaker 1: eight hours that followed, like people kept saying, well, what
Speaker 1: do they want to start playing again? It's not about
Speaker 1: that what we want. By the way, it's like people
Speaker 1: stop killing people in the street. I don't think that's
Speaker 1: happening in the next two days unfortunately. But like I
Speaker 1: think there was a there was a you'll misunderstanding at
Speaker 1: the beginning of kind of how it happened that Domino,
Speaker 1: and even within the bubble, there was some back and
Speaker 1: forth between some of the players. Right, Look, you had
Speaker 1: another team that was warming up on the court at
Speaker 1: the time, and they had some feelings, right, they were
Speaker 1: just sort of like why tell us about this because
Speaker 1: now we look like we don't support Jacob Blake and
Speaker 1: his family or that like we at least could have
Speaker 1: done this as a united front or whatever. And I
Speaker 1: think over time, you know, over those twenty four or
Speaker 1: forty hours, it came to be an understanding of like, Okay,
Speaker 1: this wasn't planned and we excluded you. It's just like
Speaker 1: in that moment, would not open the door and walk
Speaker 1: out out of it. Um. There are other players who
Speaker 1: felt like they were kind of put in a position
Speaker 1: like once the books don't play, nobody can really play right.
Speaker 1: You can't sit there and be like, oh, we're going
Speaker 1: to go out and play because you're not being supportive.
Speaker 1: So I think there were some other players that felt
Speaker 1: like kind of okay, and that tapped into to a
Speaker 1: moment in the bubble where guys have been there long
Speaker 1: enough where you just get I mean, I know, I
Speaker 1: get it. I hear all the criticism, oh millionaires sitting
Speaker 1: in a fancy Hope hell in Florida, whatever. It is
Speaker 1: hard when you cannot leave less than one square mile
Speaker 1: of land, like I would walk, you walk in a circle,
Speaker 1: walk back in a circle. If you're a runner. You're
Speaker 1: literally running in a half semi circle. You're allowed to
Speaker 1: run in and then back. You'd have to do like
Speaker 1: twenty or thirty of those just to get a run in. Like,
Speaker 1: you cannot leave the same four walls. It is not
Speaker 1: your home. You're not with your family, and you know,
Speaker 1: you guys have Paul georgia On, I thought what he
Speaker 1: said in the middle of the bubble about just sort
Speaker 1: of that mental health aspect of normally you can take
Speaker 1: a step away from the game and just you know,
Speaker 1: kids crawl all over you for two hours and like
Speaker 1: watch a stupid movie or do whatever. There's just none
Speaker 1: of that. So whatever was happening on the court is
Speaker 1: of your existence and then everything going on outside in
Speaker 1: the outside world. And I think those two things kind
Speaker 1: of conspired in that moment for the stoppage, and it
Speaker 1: just took a minute for everyone to kind of get
Speaker 1: their breath. But I also think there was a lot
Speaker 1: accomplished with that was sort of that refocus on voting
Speaker 1: and sort of even in Wisconsin, the focus on the
Speaker 1: laws about policing and sort of what people were allowed
Speaker 1: to do, and there was legislation that was already in
Speaker 1: the state government that just wasn't getting moved along, and
Speaker 1: the players helped shin to line on that. I just
Speaker 1: I don't think you can look at that as anything
Speaker 1: but a triumphant moment for the league and the players
Speaker 1: in terms of again, crazy fucking situation and rising to
Speaker 1: the occasion in a way that that you know, it
Speaker 1: wouldn't be fair to expect, but it's pretty awesome that
Speaker 1: And that was one thing, you know, Jack and I
Speaker 1: went back and forth on because we literally stood and
Speaker 1: know that are we not at the ten times we
Speaker 1: can agree with each other, but we didn't agree from
Speaker 1: a standpoint of He thought that they shouldn't play, they
Speaker 1: should set out and make their protests, and I thought
Speaker 1: the opposite. I thought there was no they're gonna there's
Speaker 1: no bigger way to get their message out then to
Speaker 1: have that NBA logo behind everyone the bush have you
Speaker 1: guys has either one change or shifted the position and
Speaker 1: talked about and we talked about it on the show,
Speaker 1: and we kind of we we came into an understanding
Speaker 1: and I understand his point of view. He understood my
Speaker 1: point of view, you know, I mean, but my thing was,
Speaker 1: just like you're gonna hear Lebron. You're gonna hear the
Speaker 1: big names, but do you hear the George Hills? Do
Speaker 1: you hear Ducks? Please? Do you hear you know, some
Speaker 1: of the people that aren't superstars but still had amazing
Speaker 1: things to say. And like I said, individually we're very famous,
Speaker 1: but together we're you know, our voice travels around the world,
Speaker 1: and I would be naive to say that it didn't
Speaker 1: make a difference. It made a huge difference, you know,
Speaker 1: But me being so into it, it was hard for
Speaker 1: me to see that for our head, you know what
Speaker 1: I mean. But everyone played their part because your ship
Speaker 1: was needed. Like I said, you say you move that
Speaker 1: you people meet in the middle ground, Well there's got
Speaker 1: to be people moving that middle ground to one side
Speaker 1: or the other. So if you're not moving the middle
Speaker 1: ground to one side and the other, than the middles
Speaker 1: further on the the other side. I do think one
Speaker 1: thing that we saw the beginning of with through the
Speaker 1: vote vote vote stuff from the players for the second
Speaker 1: half of the bubble that I hope continues as we
Speaker 1: go through because there's another election that's coming just months away.
Speaker 1: All that stuff is the messaging getting out that it's
Speaker 1: not just voting for president, and you and I talked
Speaker 1: about this on the air Off the air a bunch.
Speaker 1: Most of what affects our lives local, right, It's who's
Speaker 1: running the school board, who's running the police force, what
Speaker 1: resources are going where, where the food is coming to?
Speaker 1: Who like all of that stuff? What what businesses are
Speaker 1: zoned for what part of town? Because there's been all
Speaker 1: kinds of you know, as you know, all kinds of redistricting,
Speaker 1: all kinds of Oh no, that's so this kind of zone,
Speaker 1: that kind of zone. I wonder what neighborhood do you
Speaker 1: put those zones in. It's just such a crazy, random,
Speaker 1: so random. And I think some of the the players
Speaker 1: messaging on that, because I heard players talking about it,
Speaker 1: is the first time I've heard sort of at a
Speaker 1: national level, people that all the all these kids and
Speaker 1: communities look up to talking about that. And I think
Speaker 1: that's a real You've got to see it and hear
Speaker 1: it to believe it. You've personally been someone who has
Speaker 1: kind of stepped out on a lamb, considering, you know,
Speaker 1: your platform of ESPN, but talked about other issues outside
Speaker 1: of sports, and obviously we're talking about social justice now,
Speaker 1: but you know, having friends of the program. Carrie and
Speaker 1: Jamie were very outspoke, can you know, and and sometimes
Speaker 1: ran into some trouble. You've been on right there as well,
Speaker 1: and talking about stuff outside of sports, but affects us
Speaker 1: as players still in our communities and who we can
Speaker 1: you know where we came from? So where did that
Speaker 1: courage come from? Because, like I said, ESPN hasn't always
Speaker 1: been as lenient as they are now, and I think
Speaker 1: you've kind of helped change that narrative. Well, it's two things, right,
Speaker 1: and we all know the older you get, the more
Speaker 1: you're just comfortable with who you are and what you think, right,
Speaker 1: So there's some of that. I also, really, in my
Speaker 1: heart believe that a lot of these issues are not political.
Speaker 1: I understand that there are people who want to make
Speaker 1: them political, but a lot of this stuff is human
Speaker 1: rights issues and that should be okay to talk about.
Speaker 1: It's not about one side or the other. We can
Speaker 1: differ politically and how we want to solve these problems.
Speaker 1: It can't be political to just acknowledge that these fucking
Speaker 1: problems exist. So since I think that is the case,
Speaker 1: I don't feel like I'm stepping out politically. I feel
Speaker 1: I am talking about things that are just real and
Speaker 1: then we can argue over the politics of how to
Speaker 1: fix them. Um. There's an interesting interview with Barack Obama
Speaker 1: after Donald Trump was elected, and I think it was
Speaker 1: I'm gonna get this wrong. It was the New York Times,
Speaker 1: it was a New Yorker, it was someone it was
Speaker 1: it was Brock's Obama's first big interview after Hillary Clinton
Speaker 1: lost and turning over the White House to Donald Trump.
Speaker 1: And he said, the thing that frustrates me the most
Speaker 1: is it used to be like, hey, global warming is happening,
Speaker 1: or the environment. You know, we got to address this,
Speaker 1: and there was a lot of fighting over the e
Speaker 1: p A and like how we would solve the problem
Speaker 1: that they were small and all these cities, and then
Speaker 1: like our air and water was getting polluted and it
Speaker 1: was poisoning children, and that we had like nuclear reactor
Speaker 1: pollution and all that. There's a lot of argument over
Speaker 1: how to fix that. There was an argument about the
Speaker 1: fact it needed to be fixed, and he pointed out
Speaker 1: that now there's an argument about whether it the problem
Speaker 1: even exists at all. So for me, like that has
Speaker 1: been something that I don't feel like I'm stepping out
Speaker 1: on a limb too much because to me, I actually
Speaker 1: believe it is not political. And then some of it
Speaker 1: comes to of you sit there and you play it
Speaker 1: out and then like great. I have this sentence in
Speaker 1: my head always of like, Okay, what's the newspaper headline
Speaker 1: if I get suspended Rachel Nichols suspended from ESPN four
Speaker 1: And then it's like okay, I'm okay, right. So I
Speaker 1: really came out hard when the NBA was considered. I
Speaker 1: had its All Star game schedule for Charlotte, and there
Speaker 1: were some laws passed in Charlotte that I just felt
Speaker 1: were serious civil rights issues. I mean, this was lunch counters.
Speaker 1: I know that there was again politics. There was a
Speaker 1: side of the issue that tried to dubbed it the
Speaker 1: bathroom bill or the bathroom law that was not the
Speaker 1: heart of the law. The heart of the law was
Speaker 1: that businesses, including restaurants, including hotels, hospitality, could turn someone
Speaker 1: away for being gay. And they were going to hold
Speaker 1: an All Star game with an openly gay president of
Speaker 1: a team the Golden State Warriors, who was the reigning
Speaker 1: dynasty at the time, who could have come to town
Speaker 1: and been told I'm sorry you can't stay at the
Speaker 1: team hotel because we have this law. Now, like that's
Speaker 1: not okay. And I remember it was kind of early
Speaker 1: in the jump and talking to one of the executi producer,
Speaker 1: Kevin Wild's, who worked with us on the show then,
Speaker 1: and he was so great at being supportive, and I
Speaker 1: just kind of felt like, Okay, I'm gonna really go
Speaker 1: out here, and if someone calls me and says, I'm sorry,
Speaker 1: I'm taking you off the air for a week, I'm
Speaker 1: okay with that headline, you know what I mean. And
Speaker 1: that's kind of where for the right reason. I mean,
Speaker 1: we were just together. We broke because it came across
Speaker 1: the wire as we were working the All start the
Speaker 1: MLB deciding to move the All Star Game out of Atlanta,
Speaker 1: you know. And I think it's great that that that
Speaker 1: sports is kind of because it's it's it's always a
Speaker 1: touchy subject and people are scared to talk about human
Speaker 1: rights by the end of the the day racism, you know
Speaker 1: what I mean. So it's always very touching. Like you said,
Speaker 1: they'll turn it into political talk, but at the end
Speaker 1: of the day, it's basic human rights, you know. And
Speaker 1: I think it's beautiful that you're starting to see, especially MLB,
Speaker 1: that's America's past time. You know what I mean for
Speaker 1: them to take a step and say, hey, you know
Speaker 1: what you're doing in Georgia's not right, We're gonna move
Speaker 1: our business. To me, it's just like I kind of
Speaker 1: feel like a change of amongst us. I thought that
Speaker 1: the MLB, MLB did that. You and I were talking
Speaker 1: before the show, that Delta is doing it. Um, these
Speaker 1: are not businesses, as you say, that are so traditionally
Speaker 1: in support of some of the stuff that the NBA,
Speaker 1: let's say, or even the NFL players are have been
Speaker 1: in support of. And they really stepped out there and
Speaker 1: did it. And it is fascinating to me again. And
Speaker 1: you know, look, voting laws are more political by their nature,
Speaker 1: but isn't I mean, it's crazy to me that people
Speaker 1: who in one hand are waving an American flag are
Speaker 1: trying to limit what makes America America, which is democracy.
Speaker 1: It's just sort of how how do we get here?
Speaker 1: And it's a shame that we have to use the
Speaker 1: word courageous when talking about someone coming out against that
Speaker 1: limitation of democracy. But I guess it is now and
Speaker 1: I'm I'm psyched that that we're seeing people do it
Speaker 1: do it. How do you see the progression of sports
Speaker 1: journalism when it pertains to women compared to where you
Speaker 1: first came in. So definitely, the couple generations before me
Speaker 1: were the ones that had like the really shitty time.
Speaker 1: And I mean, there's a story about a woman who
Speaker 1: was the bright baseball be writer for a long time
Speaker 1: and she's amazing and worked her ass off, and baseball
Speaker 1: is a tough place to be breaking into and we're
Speaker 1: talking thirty or forty years ago, and one of the
Speaker 1: players kept saying, she's like a little rat in the
Speaker 1: locker room, and then they sent her a fucking rat
Speaker 1: in a box to open. Like there's all the stories
Speaker 1: about you know, guys inappropriate doing things, saying things in
Speaker 1: locker rooms, all that ship. So the women before me
Speaker 1: had to deal with the brunt of that. By the
Speaker 1: time I came in, it was not that bad. It
Speaker 1: was certainly not as good as it is now, which
Speaker 1: is you know, it's it's nice that we're seeing progress. Um,
Speaker 1: I don't think we had women hosting sports shows in
Speaker 1: the same way we do now. I mean I have
Speaker 1: to go back and look, I don't wanna if someone
Speaker 1: was doing it. I don't want to give light on
Speaker 1: their legacy, but in general it was not the thing
Speaker 1: that we saw. So being able to make that progress
Speaker 1: feels good. I think now the line is and I
Speaker 1: think it's the same thing with race. I see my
Speaker 1: friends deal with is the criticisms aren't overtly about race
Speaker 1: or gender, but you know that the standards different, right,
Speaker 1: you know that, like they're picking it the black guys,
Speaker 1: they're picking it the women. They're especially picking up women,
Speaker 1: picking at women of color in a way that they
Speaker 1: just aren't doing with some of the people that they
Speaker 1: are quote more used to or more comfortable with. And
Speaker 1: I think that's kind of the next hurdle because in
Speaker 1: some ways that's more insidious, it's harder to fight against.
Speaker 1: Like if I've had times where earlier in my career,
Speaker 1: I've had people say you can't go to the postgame
Speaker 1: locker room, you can't go to the press conference, And
Speaker 1: I will say to that security guard, well, here's my credential.
Speaker 1: You know I always have. I always have to have,
Speaker 1: Like even now, I always have to be the one
Speaker 1: to have my credential. It's not enough that I'm running
Speaker 1: around how my credential here I am, and I've had
Speaker 1: more than one had guys say to me one time
Speaker 1: in the hallway, oh, I'm sorry, honey, the anthem singer
Speaker 1: can't be back here or even like people, you know,
Speaker 1: show them a credential with the Amy Span or before
Speaker 1: that with the Washington Post and say, um, I look
Speaker 1: at you. You You can't go where the boys are, but
Speaker 1: boys are changing in there, and you're just like, that's
Speaker 1: not how this is set up. So that stuff is
Speaker 1: in some ways easier to deal with and battle against
Speaker 1: because you just get the right person in the right
Speaker 1: place and you just deal with it. Right. It's the
Speaker 1: more sort of the little chipping away. And you mentioned
Speaker 1: Carrier Jamal earlier. Jamal is a great example all kinds
Speaker 1: of criticisms of her that weren't overtly about her being
Speaker 1: a woman or overtly about race. But come on, we
Speaker 1: know why they're picking on her. Kamala Harris and the debate.
Speaker 1: She's shrill, she's making faces. That's all the cold for.
Speaker 1: We don't want a black woman out there, and that
Speaker 1: I think that's the thing that the women in my
Speaker 1: industry are sort of now that that's a level we're
Speaker 1: fighting against but that's true for everyone. You know. How
Speaker 1: do you feel being in a spotlight and being an
Speaker 1: example for young women that want to be in this space,
Speaker 1: How do you feel like being the standard in the blueprint? Well,
Speaker 1: I mean, I hope that I can be a good
Speaker 1: example when I'm you know, every day when I'm out there,
Speaker 1: there's so many that that's kind of the second half
Speaker 1: of that sentence is there's so there's We're lucky, there's
Speaker 1: so many women just at U sbm but even across
Speaker 1: the board, Um, so I don't. No one has to
Speaker 1: carry that weight on their own, and that is that
Speaker 1: is a relief. And as they say, different from the
Speaker 1: women who were maybe a generation before me, where a
Speaker 1: lot of them they were not the only one in
Speaker 1: the room. Sometimes they were the only woman in the
Speaker 1: room all the time. And now I'm still the only
Speaker 1: woman in the room sometimes, but it's not all the time,
Speaker 1: and that makes a huge difference. But I hope that
Speaker 1: I can show people and young women that they have
Speaker 1: the room to succeed, but also the room to screw
Speaker 1: up again. It's why every time on the jump when
Speaker 1: we do stupid ship, I'll be like, oh God, this
Speaker 1: fell apart, and that's not the video that's supposed to run. Now,
Speaker 1: I should have said that, I said, this is what
Speaker 1: I've meant to say, or whatever, because I do think
Speaker 1: when you are a minority in this space, whether it
Speaker 1: is race or gender or whatever it is, you feel
Speaker 1: like you have to be perfect, right, And there's that pressure.
Speaker 1: I need to be perfect because you're representing everyone and
Speaker 1: if you mess it up. I remember really clearly when
Speaker 1: I was covering more NFL for ESPN. I was the
Speaker 1: reporter on site at some football game and the guy's
Speaker 1: NFL Live or Countdown or whoever it was. We're talking
Speaker 1: and Michael Irvin kept talking about al Gore, al Gore,
Speaker 1: al Gore, al Gore, and it just didn't I was like, no,
Speaker 1: Frank or Frank Gore's who he was talking about. But
Speaker 1: he just kept slipping and saying the wrong name. And
Speaker 1: it was fun. It was funny, It was fine, It
Speaker 1: was totally fine. If I I do remember though, being
Speaker 1: listening with my FB waiting for my turn to talk,
Speaker 1: and thinking if I said that, I would be probably done.
Speaker 1: I was still young enough and new enough that, like,
Speaker 1: you know whatever, So you do feel that pressure of
Speaker 1: I have to be perfect, and I am so far
Speaker 1: from perfect that I hope that that kind of gives
Speaker 1: a little people some room. And also, like I do
Speaker 1: impress upon young women all the time and young men
Speaker 1: people who come to me for advice, like you just
Speaker 1: gotta do the work. It's not going to just be
Speaker 1: there for you. What's what's the chances of Michael Irvine
Speaker 1: saying al Gore, do you get the connection? I do?
Speaker 1: Do you not? The show? What are your thoughts on
Speaker 1: this current NBA season? Obviously the pandemic hit last year,
Speaker 1: we go into a bubble, you experienced that short offseason,
Speaker 1: late start All Star Game, Like, what is your thought
Speaker 1: just on covering the basketball for long enough time just
Speaker 1: to kind of see where the NBA is right now? Well,
Speaker 1: there's so much stuff going on right now. That's historic, right,
Speaker 1: quote unquote. We never had a seasonally, we never had
Speaker 1: a bubble like this. We never had a SEMNY two
Speaker 1: games season before. I don't know what's going to look
Speaker 1: like in the playoffs. You know, we never had COVID
Speaker 1: test before pandemic, So exactly the content I've been paying attention,
Speaker 1: by the way, when you guys have been given these
Speaker 1: stats and I just want to point out Stacks winning
Speaker 1: so undefeated, baby, Um, surprising with that nose. I'm surprised anything.
Speaker 1: A couple of creatips of them. You can get that
Speaker 1: basket all over anything. So that's I mean, that feels
Speaker 1: special right to be doing something that's never happened before.
Speaker 1: But I'm also and we've talked about this a little bit, Um,
Speaker 1: I want Stacks take So every day I say out
Speaker 1: of my mouth at some point during the show these days,
Speaker 1: is hey, that's a new NBA record, or that's a
Speaker 1: rookie record, or that's such and such record we have
Speaker 1: had because of a lot of just different conspiring events
Speaker 1: like this huge scoring inflation over the last couple of years,
Speaker 1: to the point where look, whatever day this errors, and
Speaker 1: you guys look it up on your stats. Just excuse
Speaker 1: me if this is changed by one point to oh degrees.
Speaker 1: But as I sit here, Um, nine of the top
Speaker 1: ten like highest producing, most efficient offenses have been offenses
Speaker 1: in the last two years in the history of the NBA.
Speaker 1: Does that that we've had suddenly like the second coming
Speaker 1: of the best NBA players ever in this last two seasons. No,
Speaker 1: it just means the teams that aren't playing defense the
Speaker 1: same way. The rules are different, the pandemic changes everything.
Speaker 1: You don't have practiced time, so therefore you can't like
Speaker 1: play solid defense all that ship. So part of what
Speaker 1: I'm trying to navigate right now in this unprecedented season
Speaker 1: is how do I talk about this right because we
Speaker 1: talked about, oh, this guy, I don't know if there's
Speaker 1: Anthony Edwards who had a record the other night where
Speaker 1: more points as a rookie than anyone but Lebron and
Speaker 1: k D. And I'm like, well, does that mean that
Speaker 1: he's in the Lebron and k D conversation or doesn't
Speaker 1: just mean that there's more points available right now, I
Speaker 1: don't have to talk about that a little bit take
Speaker 1: on it. I would say he has the upside to
Speaker 1: be in that conversation. He's headed in that direction. That's
Speaker 1: all I could say. I wouldn't put him in there,
Speaker 1: but overall with inflated numbers, because when we talked to
Speaker 1: Web the other day and he didn't say it, but
Speaker 1: Web would kill in this area, you know. But you've
Speaker 1: got the players now saying the game is softer. Yeah yeah,
Speaker 1: So so when we say it, we've being disrespectful. We
Speaker 1: hate but when the players did it is actually playing
Speaker 1: say the game it's all you know, they agree with it,
Speaker 1: but the game is definitely this is a scoring game
Speaker 1: now point blank. I mean, would you agree with scoring
Speaker 1: is would continue to help the game grow? Well? I
Speaker 1: do think that like the people it brought his kids
Speaker 1: brings kids in. I have, like we're the twin club.
Speaker 1: You'd see Webb on the other day. He's in the
Speaker 1: twin clubs. So you know, you are a twin in
Speaker 1: so many ways. I am great. Um. If not biologically
Speaker 1: then you know in spirit. Um. But it's funny. I
Speaker 1: have young twins. We moved here when they were like
Speaker 1: four and a half and it was in the height
Speaker 1: of Warriors Mania, and you know, their mommy had the
Speaker 1: games on at night all the time, and we had
Speaker 1: West Coast timing, right, so we had Steph Carey and whatever.
Speaker 1: And my kids fell in love with Steph at five
Speaker 1: years old, these two little girls like and Clay and
Speaker 1: the whole nine and and my daughter would say, oh,
Speaker 1: Steph's just like me. He's small, and I would say, no,
Speaker 1: you're four. He's actually six ft two. But her she
Speaker 1: felt like that. My other, my other, my other daughter
Speaker 1: loves Draymond. She just thinks he's the best, and she
Speaker 1: wants to play win on her basketball team. She wants
Speaker 1: to play defense like Draymond and all of that. And
Speaker 1: I watched that team bring them in in a way.
Speaker 1: If they had maybe been little kids in the arrow
Speaker 1: where I was covering you, I'm not sure Pacers Spurs game,
Speaker 1: they would have like really attached to the end in
Speaker 1: that same way. So I do think it helps. I've
Speaker 1: watched it happen in my own house. I don't know
Speaker 1: how your twins are all that same thing. I mean,
Speaker 1: I think, like I said, I think it comes to
Speaker 1: a point. And if you even talk about it from
Speaker 1: like what we do, I would much rather talk about
Speaker 1: highlights scoring than a defense. You know what I mean?
Speaker 1: Because I mean because I know that's what as a
Speaker 1: purest I would when mine talking about. But I know
Speaker 1: that the crowd of our fans want to see three
Speaker 1: point They want to see Step shooting from half, Dame
Speaker 1: shooting from half. They want to see Lebron Dunky like,
Speaker 1: that's what they want to see. They don't want to
Speaker 1: see that old school battle. I mean, when Damee pulls up,
Speaker 1: it's great. There's no arguing about that. You know exactly
Speaker 1: who has impressed you most team and players? Uh, you
Speaker 1: know what I'm impressed by. I'm this a little cop
Speaker 1: out answer, but it's just the truth. Like the under
Speaker 1: twenty five crowd in the NBA right now are so
Speaker 1: fucking together, like the donatonvisions of the world and like
Speaker 1: all that stuff, like self possessed and like understanding the game.
Speaker 1: And I don't even mean basketball, I mean like the
Speaker 1: big game better than certainly I did at that age.
Speaker 1: But I think even the future the past generations did
Speaker 1: and they have the benefit, right, They've grown up with
Speaker 1: social media, they've grown up with like kind of perspective,
Speaker 1: they've grown up with more new ideas like at them earlier,
Speaker 1: so they've been able to internalize that ship. But like
Speaker 1: I've I've been constantly kind of surprised that, like, wait,
Speaker 1: this kid's twenty three, like this kid is twenty four,
Speaker 1: and just sort of the possession self possession and sort
Speaker 1: of the way that they have been able to both try.
Speaker 1: It's still a lot of these guys are still trying
Speaker 1: to make their name in the game, but not afraid
Speaker 1: to put themselves their brand there. You know, everything on
Speaker 1: the line for what's important. And that's kind of really
Speaker 1: that that's stuck with me. I think it's a different
Speaker 1: way from when we came in. I mean, even what
Speaker 1: the conversations that happened, Like the business of basketball was
Speaker 1: never even across thought when we first came in. It's chains,
Speaker 1: it's cars, it's women, it's this system material things. But
Speaker 1: now the whole narrative of change, it's what are you
Speaker 1: investing in? Are you in bitcoin? Are you in this
Speaker 1: and you and that? What social justice issue are you
Speaker 1: standing behind? And like you said, guys aren't afraid to
Speaker 1: put there because I mean back when we say that's
Speaker 1: brand suicide, you know what I mean? You stay. If
Speaker 1: Jack stands up for what he stood up for for
Speaker 1: Georgie back in the day, who knows what would have happened,
Speaker 1: you know what I mean. So it's just a different time. Obviously,
Speaker 1: Well the money has changed, right, so you're not as
Speaker 1: dependent on the NBA specific paycheck in the same way
Speaker 1: you've gotten the money you've already made in your career,
Speaker 1: which is more earlier, So you can risk a little
Speaker 1: more earlier your brand paycheck from your shoes, from your sponsors,
Speaker 1: stuff like that. Is different and bigger, so you can
Speaker 1: step out, and brands and sponsors have changed because they
Speaker 1: now have to answer to a more educated consumer base
Speaker 1: that cares about this stuff. I love the guys that Nike.
Speaker 1: I don't know if they would have stood behind Calin
Speaker 1: Kaepernick twenty years ago, but they knew when they did
Speaker 1: it in the last few years. Not only was it
Speaker 1: in terms of the belief system of the people who
Speaker 1: worked there, it was also a good business decision. So
Speaker 1: that all has changed a little bit too. So I
Speaker 1: had a question for you guys about basketball. I mentioned
Speaker 1: this to you the other day. If I'm stepping out,
Speaker 1: we're talking about it. But I've been like super trying
Speaker 1: to figure this out. So we've been talking about James
Speaker 1: Harden right and quote forcing his way out of Houston.
Speaker 1: What do you guys think is the right move for
Speaker 1: players who are in a system where they get drafted right,
Speaker 1: because the way America, this is not the NBA. American
Speaker 1: professional sports work this way, right, they work this way overseas.
Speaker 1: Two you get drafted, it's a it's a monopoly, and
Speaker 1: they get to tell you where they go. You don't,
Speaker 1: you know, just go and sale. I'd like to live
Speaker 1: in Chicago. Um, you're under these contracts where they literally
Speaker 1: use the words in front offices like oh, we have
Speaker 1: control of that player's contract or we are control that
Speaker 1: player for X number of years or that kind of thing,
Speaker 1: And it's written into the system that you sign a contract,
Speaker 1: but the other side signs too for X number of
Speaker 1: years and then they can turn around within a certain
Speaker 1: number of months and trade you. Your kids don't go
Speaker 1: to that school anymore, like they shift your life, and
Speaker 1: that mechanism is not set up for players. And I
Speaker 1: don't actually know the answer because there can't be an
Speaker 1: m b A if everybody can just pick where they
Speaker 1: start out to go, because frankly, like there's a lot
Speaker 1: of like Jack, you probably would have picked the pacers, right,
Speaker 1: but but it turned out you know, like ha been
Speaker 1: a Hall of Nights every night, but you had great
Speaker 1: success there, you know what I mean, Like we can't
Speaker 1: we can't just sort of I get why the system
Speaker 1: isn't set up to just have everybody all the time,
Speaker 1: But what do you do because you have a thing
Speaker 1: this year And this came from our discussion about James Harden.
Speaker 1: We've been talking about like, Okay, is he gonna get
Speaker 1: quote penalized by m VP voters because of what happened
Speaker 1: in Houston at the beginning of the year. And I
Speaker 1: just don't know what a player is supposed to do.
Speaker 1: What are you going to think of players should do?
Speaker 1: Young Milcle. I think for the most part, James did
Speaker 1: what I don't think he could do. And because like
Speaker 1: when teams feel like you have no more value, they
Speaker 1: put you at the end of the bench. They demean you.
Speaker 1: It might not be in the media, but they have
Speaker 1: their little own fraternity of owners and managers, but they
Speaker 1: talk behind closed doors and if they both agree that
Speaker 1: you not in any good no more, they'll put you
Speaker 1: at the end of the bench like they try to
Speaker 1: do mellow. So my, my whole thing with James, I
Speaker 1: just felt like, you know, when you have a black
Speaker 1: coach like stave Side was getting a shot help him
Speaker 1: look good. But at the same time, I understand James
Speaker 1: too wanted to win and if they're not gonna move
Speaker 1: him him, then he has to force his way out
Speaker 1: because the same way he can force his way out,
Speaker 1: they can make him look bad to force him to
Speaker 1: stay there. So it's a tough situation, but the same
Speaker 1: way the teams can make you look bad, you should
Speaker 1: be able to way to make you a littself look
Speaker 1: good and speak on getting yourself out of there. But
Speaker 1: how do you do that without getting a label? Because
Speaker 1: that's what we're talking about, Like it is James wrong
Speaker 1: for wanting to get out? He's not wrong. But it's
Speaker 1: gonna be opinions either way, because you're gonna have fans
Speaker 1: that say, we've been loyal to this whole time. But
Speaker 1: then it's gonna be it's gonna be players like us
Speaker 1: that understand how you want to win. He don't want
Speaker 1: to finish his career like Charles Barkley. He want to
Speaker 1: be in a position to win the championship. So we
Speaker 1: understand it, but it's always the fans that's in their
Speaker 1: feelings that's been like, well, you should stay with us,
Speaker 1: you owe us this, and really he don't owe you anything. Well, then,
Speaker 1: but then we're asking too. I mean, because to me,
Speaker 1: if we're talking about basketball with Lebron getting hurt and
Speaker 1: and be getting hurt hardened to me, if it's not Joker,
Speaker 1: it's hardened to win m VP. But we were talking
Speaker 1: about what will some some voters hold it against hardened
Speaker 1: his issues he had getting out of Houston. I wouldn't.
Speaker 1: I wouldn't say that because how do how does that
Speaker 1: affect what he's doing on the court. He went there
Speaker 1: and immensely immediately made an impact. He's playing basketball, and
Speaker 1: to me, and I have to go against you'all, I
Speaker 1: would say he is the m v P, him and Kyrie,
Speaker 1: I would give him co MVP because what they've been
Speaker 1: able to do immediately. Most teams, when you bring in
Speaker 1: stars like that, it takes a year or two. Then
Speaker 1: then it even happens where one of the stars have
Speaker 1: to go because they didn't work out, you know. So
Speaker 1: the way they've been able to jail and bring all
Speaker 1: this together, you gotta give all the credit to James
Speaker 1: bro you have to. And I don't think him getting
Speaker 1: asking to leave should be a knock on anything he's
Speaker 1: able to do this season. I agree. I thought Harden
Speaker 1: was you know, to me, he's definitely worked his way
Speaker 1: to the top of the m v P conversation. But
Speaker 1: to me it's not. It's like, yes, I think in
Speaker 1: that m VP conversation, By the way, it's gonna keep going.
Speaker 1: And I'm still have a third of the season and
Speaker 1: I always say that, Like, how am I supposed to
Speaker 1: make a decision? Now, asked me a month ago. I
Speaker 1: didn't know Lebron was gonna get hurt. I didn't know
Speaker 1: when b was gonna get hurt. So like, how would
Speaker 1: I have like if I come out and said this
Speaker 1: is what I'm voting for, Like I would have looked
Speaker 1: a because I wouldn't have known that him, joyl and
Speaker 1: Bee was gonna end up you know, hurt or whatever.
Speaker 1: So I'm not making an m v P case for
Speaker 1: anyone at the moment, but it has brought up to
Speaker 1: me sort of one of these new frontiers of discussion
Speaker 1: with the m b A of what do we owe
Speaker 1: each other in terms of these contracts? What are the
Speaker 1: players like, what what vehicles do they have? Like I
Speaker 1: think player empowerment as an expression has been a little
Speaker 1: overused at this point, but like where is the line
Speaker 1: and what is fair? But also creates a functioning MBA
Speaker 1: because it is the business that everybody makes money off
Speaker 1: of it. If the league collapse, that would be a
Speaker 1: problem too. So it's kind of figuring out where the
Speaker 1: ground is and James situation. No matter which side of
Speaker 1: the argument you fall on whether somebody comes out in
Speaker 1: this final third, and Nikolaok is on fire and he's
Speaker 1: clearly the m v P doesn't really matter to this conversation.
Speaker 1: I just more mean, like, it's interesting to me because
Speaker 1: it's sort of the one place where we've accepted free
Speaker 1: agency and moving around in a way we didn't used
Speaker 1: to in the league, and like that idea of loyalty
Speaker 1: kind of doesn't isn't used to shame players anymore, which
Speaker 1: is really what it was for. And sometimes but that
Speaker 1: one frontier is something where I don't know what the
Speaker 1: answer is and I'm kind of curious. The question is
Speaker 1: brought up being a voter yourself, and we've discussed this
Speaker 1: on the show as well, what is it gonna take
Speaker 1: to see the whole instead of just being a regular
Speaker 1: season m v P, just a whole body m VP.
Speaker 1: Because yeah, obviously Janice is back to back and he
Speaker 1: struggled in the playoffs, that hasn't been able to get
Speaker 1: his team to that next level. When I picture m VPS,
Speaker 1: I'm picturing at the end of the game, it's a
Speaker 1: guy you can go to to get your team a win,
Speaker 1: you know what I mean. So there's obviously and I'm
Speaker 1: not the only one that things like that, but you
Speaker 1: know you as a voter, you know, Matt, we understand that.
Speaker 1: But it's the regular season. What would it take or
Speaker 1: why doesn't it look at the whole entire season? So
Speaker 1: that might of my big things over the years of
Speaker 1: the show, and the poor guys in the NBA office
Speaker 1: have heard this for me way too often. Um award reform, right,
Speaker 1: That's what I keep saying. We need some reward reform
Speaker 1: because the NBA has not made any kind of major
Speaker 1: change to its awards in so many years, and every
Speaker 1: other American pro sports league, the major ones, have all
Speaker 1: since then. So the NBA, which is usually so far
Speaker 1: ahead of the other league's just isn't in this category.
Speaker 1: And I get the tradition and all of that, and
Speaker 1: then when you make a change that affects the value
Speaker 1: quote unquote of other people's m vps or things in
Speaker 1: the past, But I just think the league has been
Speaker 1: so great about if something isn't right, like, let's not
Speaker 1: worry about how it looks, let's just fix it. And
Speaker 1: something that's not right to me is like most Valuable
Speaker 1: Player is not what we're really awarding right now? What
Speaker 1: we're really awarding is who's had the best statistical regular season.
Speaker 1: That's how that award has been sort of litigated and
Speaker 1: voted on. And partly that's the director we get from
Speaker 1: the NBA. It's only regular season. Here's the stats. It's
Speaker 1: partly what stats are available to us. Right. It used
Speaker 1: to be just kind of basic stats and offense and defense.
Speaker 1: Now we've got like hardcore offensive stats. We have a
Speaker 1: less defensive stats. We've got no stats for leadership. We
Speaker 1: got no stats for what someone says in the huddle
Speaker 1: or the judgment someone makes in like a key moment
Speaker 1: or decision. We've got clutch stats, but those don't always
Speaker 1: tell the whole story or anything. So because those statistics
Speaker 1: have taken on a greater part of how people analyze
Speaker 1: the game, and because the voters are being told it's
Speaker 1: only regular season, the m v P at the moment
Speaker 1: is who had the best statistical regular season. That is
Speaker 1: what we would call it. It's clunky, but that is
Speaker 1: what it actually is. I'd like to see the m
Speaker 1: v P before the m v P, who's a most
Speaker 1: valuable guy on this team in this league? We don't
Speaker 1: know who it is. Every heere and and sometimes it's debatable,
Speaker 1: like there was a point where it looked like Katie
Speaker 1: was going to rest that away from Laan, right, and
Speaker 1: then it gets hurt like like that can be a
Speaker 1: really interesting discussion. It's not always the same guy all
Speaker 1: the time, right, I mean there's a time where Kobe
Speaker 1: and like like You've had these changing in the guard moments.
Speaker 1: That could be fascinating if we gave an award for this,
Speaker 1: and it would also identify it's that I think Bill
Speaker 1: Simmons made made the point like the Aliens came down
Speaker 1: and you had to win one basketball game and pick
Speaker 1: one guy to lead your team the probably exactly we
Speaker 1: all we all know who it is. Well, I mean,
Speaker 1: originally that guy in space jam was Michael Jordan's mich
Speaker 1: Jordan should have one more MVPs. Like, I just think
Speaker 1: that that that high test or whatever you wanna call it,
Speaker 1: who is legit the most valuable guy in the league.
Speaker 1: The problem is the awards aren't set up right, and
Speaker 1: so it puts voters like me in kind of a
Speaker 1: crabby position. I know who the best guy in the
Speaker 1: league is, but I look at his numbers and during
Speaker 1: the regular season for reasons that could be that, as
Speaker 1: some of these guys age, it's not smart for them
Speaker 1: to go all out in the regular season. They would
Speaker 1: be doing their team a disservice if they chase stats
Speaker 1: in the regular season. But because of that, they're penalized
Speaker 1: and voting, and even me, as a voter, I have
Speaker 1: to say, Okay, well, like that's not what I'm being
Speaker 1: asked to vote on. So I just I would love
Speaker 1: to see us as an NBA lee. As a league,
Speaker 1: follow what the NFL does, follow what the Major League
Speaker 1: Baseball does. They give award the NHL, they give awards
Speaker 1: for scoring. They give awards for like best offensive player
Speaker 1: or best season or something like that. And it differs
Speaker 1: in every league. But you know the difference. And there
Speaker 1: are so many years where a guy like Janice could
Speaker 1: have won best season but someone else until he proved
Speaker 1: that he could be the guy to lead his team
Speaker 1: to a championship. It's hard to being v paying you're
Speaker 1: shooting a ball from the free throw line. Fam. He
Speaker 1: doesn't love being he doesn't He wants to win. He
Speaker 1: knows the bigger goal for him as the champion, get
Speaker 1: his team over the hump, right, Steven, know what you
Speaker 1: think yeah, but you can't be shooting the balls. It's
Speaker 1: free throw line. Fam. It's just hard for me to say,
Speaker 1: you're the best player in the league and you're shooting
Speaker 1: oxygen from the line. We asked Kobe at what he said,
Speaker 1: I've never done it with my left hands. Come on, man,
Speaker 1: all right, um, you've been apart along the ride for
Speaker 1: Lebron's journey from the beginning, high school too, where he's
Speaker 1: at just putting this past championship, the highs, the lows.
Speaker 1: What have you seen the most as maturity goes on
Speaker 1: and off the court. What's cool? First of all, to
Speaker 1: have a front row seat to someone's life. From I
Speaker 1: met Lebron when he was a senior in high school.
Speaker 1: We could be talking about someone who's a plumber if
Speaker 1: I met someone when they were a senior in high school,
Speaker 1: and then all the way through age thirty six, had
Speaker 1: this front row seat and being able to be there
Speaker 1: when they did the thing they were doing and watch
Speaker 1: them as they had kids or a family or like
Speaker 1: sort of had a social justice sort of figuring out
Speaker 1: how they could could do that, you know, grew in
Speaker 1: terms of he started goddamn school, Like, I mean, the
Speaker 1: whole thing that could be anyone, it would have been
Speaker 1: a fascinating thing. And the fact that it was someone
Speaker 1: who has done all this stuff this is has been
Speaker 1: that has been a cool thing for me. And I
Speaker 1: did start in Chicago of watching Michael Wilbon do that
Speaker 1: with Michael Thordan, right, and kind of tagging along to
Speaker 1: a lot of the stuff. And then you know, I
Speaker 1: happened to work in Washington, d C. When Jordan came
Speaker 1: to Washington, d C. And Michael Bon was obviously working
Speaker 1: with me then so again got to tag along to
Speaker 1: a lot of sort of that experience watching someone else
Speaker 1: do it, having that front row seat and getting to
Speaker 1: have done that with Lebron and then in turn as
Speaker 1: the younger guys come in, starting to have that with
Speaker 1: them too, has been really cool. I mean, as someone
Speaker 1: whose job it is to sort of interpret what I
Speaker 1: see and kind of create these stories, you can't ask
Speaker 1: for anything more than that. It's been pretty awesome. Thoughts
Speaker 1: on how the league and Adam self has how that the
Speaker 1: the NASH has passed events. I mean, look, I don't
Speaker 1: think you can argue like it's been an overall huge success, right,
Speaker 1: The fact that they got a league playing and they
Speaker 1: were able to navigate through a global pandemic and keep
Speaker 1: everyone safe and nobody has had, you know, knock on
Speaker 1: every surface near me because we're not out of this yet,
Speaker 1: but no one has had serious health problems while you
Speaker 1: are trying to move people around the country in groups
Speaker 1: and a contact sport where everyone speats all over each other.
Speaker 1: There's no easy thing. Have there been little things along
Speaker 1: the way that they may have wanted to do better?
Speaker 1: You know now that the hindsight they would tell you that,
Speaker 1: so so sure, but you know, it's kind of like
Speaker 1: I say, like, no one's perfect people. You just got
Speaker 1: to do the best you can. And I think they've
Speaker 1: made really good choices all at the time. Thoughts on
Speaker 1: the play in format because I absolutely love it. I
Speaker 1: love it too, I know a lot of people don't.
Speaker 1: I think it's awesome. It was really fun in the
Speaker 1: bubble and it just gives everybody a little bit more
Speaker 1: skin in the game. But in a way that doesn't
Speaker 1: feel like it's going to mess with the integrity of
Speaker 1: who wins, Like I don't think it's going to make
Speaker 1: it the plan tournament is going to have no effect
Speaker 1: on who wins the NBA title. I don't think whoever
Speaker 1: makes it into the playoff game is gonna win. We've
Speaker 1: never had an eight seed win a title before. Came
Speaker 1: close a little bit with Patrick Ewing, but never didn't happen. Um,
Speaker 1: And I certainly don't think a play in team is
Speaker 1: my guests. I mean, who knows someone's now going to
Speaker 1: do it? And does show this clip I'm looking at
Speaker 1: the I'm sorry, I doubt you who I don't even know,
Speaker 1: and I don't even know what team this is, but
Speaker 1: clearly I doubted you, and you can use that as motivation.
Speaker 1: I mean, if the Lakers slide, you know what a
Speaker 1: d and braun if they happen to slide, like to me,
Speaker 1: if they slide and get into a plain situation, as
Speaker 1: long as they're healthy, I still think they're the best
Speaker 1: team in the Western you know, outside of them, No,
Speaker 1: I think I think that's true. But that's the case
Speaker 1: of the plan in I just don't think the Plan
Speaker 1: is going to have a team that doesn't deserve it.
Speaker 1: I guess that's what I should say, because like in
Speaker 1: a single elimination thing, um, in that first game or
Speaker 1: two of the actual plan tournament, anyone can win. But
Speaker 1: that team then have to go into the playoffs. Right
Speaker 1: then you have to go into seven games series. So
Speaker 1: I just don't think you're going to get some outlier
Speaker 1: team that shouldn't be there win. So I I should,
Speaker 1: that's a good point. I should. I should have seen
Speaker 1: I messed up. I should. I got you, you got me?
Speaker 1: Um but but but yeah, I just think that it's
Speaker 1: it's only fun. Do you How do you feel about Jack?
Speaker 1: I just feel like it's an interestant twist, you know.
Speaker 1: I like the old school way you are. You gotta
Speaker 1: earn your way in. I don't like all this other ship.
Speaker 1: You know, top eight everybody else go home, get on
Speaker 1: that boat early one to three cancoom and uh, you know,
Speaker 1: everybody else that earned it get in there. I like
Speaker 1: it because I think it starts that the energy for
Speaker 1: the playoffs a little bit sooner. And it's a cool format.
Speaker 1: You know, seven plays eight or yeah, seven place eight
Speaker 1: and seven. The winner gets seven and then eight the
Speaker 1: winner the loser. The loser of the seven eight battle
Speaker 1: plays the winner and that's yeah, so and yeah, I
Speaker 1: just think it's great energy. I just think it gives
Speaker 1: the playoffs a jump star And like you said, something different.
Speaker 1: I mean I get tradition, but like we said, I mean,
Speaker 1: we're just a different time now, so why not try
Speaker 1: something different. I think something that they did that worked
Speaker 1: well in the bubble. Yeah, they're continuing. I ain't even
Speaker 1: to fight for the eight seed. Don't get them excited.
Speaker 1: I'm already here what I got to play. And by
Speaker 1: the way, the Raptors right this year, it depends on
Speaker 1: who you are. We've been sorry all you are. Rachel
Speaker 1: took a land in this eight spot. We don't deserve it.
Speaker 1: The Raptors this year at the trade deadline. This is
Speaker 1: a team that is two years removed from winning a title,
Speaker 1: playing in a state they don't even live in, like
Speaker 1: not even front of their fans, all this stuff, and
Speaker 1: they basically decided, you know what, we're going to try
Speaker 1: to keep our core, but we're not going to like
Speaker 1: go all out to win a playing game. We don't
Speaker 1: have to. Our fans don't expect that. They're not going
Speaker 1: to be happy with, oh, we want to play a
Speaker 1: game two years ago. So for teams like that, for
Speaker 1: teams like the Warriors, I get draymm being like I'm
Speaker 1: not excited, but you know what we had Darren Fox
Speaker 1: on the show the other day, he'd like to play,
Speaker 1: you know, and I get that too. That's a good
Speaker 1: experience for him. But even if you wouldn't be exciting,
Speaker 1: even though Draymond like a side when the ball goes
Speaker 1: up for you and the ball goes of him, and
Speaker 1: you guys are gonna play your asses. True, so, but
Speaker 1: I like moground playing for championships not a playing game.
Speaker 1: But I still get it. Who do you have in
Speaker 1: the finals? I don't predict. But here's why I swear
Speaker 1: it's not just a cop out. Here's what I love
Speaker 1: about sports and what really got me when you guys
Speaker 1: are asking at the very beginning about why you know
Speaker 1: how I grew up to do this is I love
Speaker 1: superhero movies, right, I love comic book movies. I love
Speaker 1: the whole thing. I'm unusually excited to a point where
Speaker 1: people are concerned about me about Star Wars movies or
Speaker 1: things like that. But I do know in the end
Speaker 1: who's gonna win. I sit down an adventurous movie, you
Speaker 1: know who's winning the fucking Avengers. You know. I sit
Speaker 1: down in Star Wars movie, I know which side is
Speaker 1: gonna win. When I go to a basketball game. I
Speaker 1: don't know who Spider Man is and I don't know
Speaker 1: who the villain is. I gotta wait till the end
Speaker 1: to find out who the winner is, who the guy
Speaker 1: I'm supposed to be rooting for is. That is so
Speaker 1: essential to me about why I love this game, that
Speaker 1: I fight so hard. We don't do a ton of
Speaker 1: picks on our show, as you guys both know. We
Speaker 1: do some because the players like it, but like I
Speaker 1: don't like. I am hoping to be surprised by who
Speaker 1: was in the finals this year because that will make
Speaker 1: it so much more. She's got Superman versus Captain exact
Speaker 1: Captain America. You recently did an interview with Wan to
Speaker 1: Skanell Anderson, and he was just in awe with the
Speaker 1: fact that he got interviewed by you. It wasn't it
Speaker 1: was a press question, was right question. It was like
Speaker 1: when you hear younger players and newer players. I mean,
Speaker 1: I think obviously it goes back to what we're saying
Speaker 1: at the beginning, like it's a sign of respect, Like
Speaker 1: people look respect you and look up at But how
Speaker 1: does that make you feel without being all modest Well,
Speaker 1: I mean, look again, it's I'm sorde of that. Here's
Speaker 1: the thing it makes me feel that it is not
Speaker 1: modesty because it's me saying, hey, I did this. Is
Speaker 1: that it makes me feel like the work right, That's
Speaker 1: what it makes me feel like. It doesn't mean oh, man,
Speaker 1: I know everything, or oh I'm a big deal with
Speaker 1: these guys, because that goes away. And you know, you guys,
Speaker 1: you're not gonna take no credit from from me being
Speaker 1: where well, yeah for you being No, I'm not taking
Speaker 1: any credit for you. You've done this all yourself. Yeah,
Speaker 1: but you My first opportunity was with you, my first opportunity,
Speaker 1: and I knew how good you could be, and I
Speaker 1: knew who you were as a person, and I give
Speaker 1: you credit for it. I love what you used to
Speaker 1: wear though your flannels, with your gold chains hanging out.
Speaker 1: I was weak. I was weak. It was weeks. Sometimes
Speaker 1: I came back with the SUSI I got tiddy. I
Speaker 1: talked about me, so I came back with the suits.
Speaker 1: I used to see. I was like one of my homeboys.
Speaker 1: That might even my brother, you know, Jack's on this
Speaker 1: new ESPN show with like a boyz in the hood.
Speaker 1: Flannels goes back to what we wanted to show to
Speaker 1: be at the front. Was h chill who you you great?
Speaker 1: To you that you're definitely good at that changing speeds
Speaker 1: a little bit. You had an amazing sit down with
Speaker 1: Mac and Kobe at the Mamba Academy. Made me cry,
Speaker 1: that's last. It's okay talk to us just about what
Speaker 1: that interview on what you took from them, because their
Speaker 1: journeys were very similar coming up together. How special was
Speaker 1: that interview for you? Yeah? I meant allowed to me
Speaker 1: because I had covered the thick of them competing against
Speaker 1: each other, so I knew what that really. I knew
Speaker 1: all the nuance of that relationship and what it was
Speaker 1: and how tight they had been at the beginning, and
Speaker 1: then how they had some separation, not because anyone did
Speaker 1: anything wrong and there was no beef, but just like
Speaker 1: as competitors and you grow apart and everything. And I
Speaker 1: knew too from covering them both or haven't been friendly
Speaker 1: and working with them both post career, that they weren't
Speaker 1: really in touch in that close way. They were good again,
Speaker 1: they were totally good with each other. I don't even
Speaker 1: given or implying anything else, but they just you know, life,
Speaker 1: life is afraid and I knew I could see in
Speaker 1: the moment, the minute we brought them back to together,
Speaker 1: just that all that energy was like just like that
Speaker 1: when they were like twenty years old, and it was
Speaker 1: just everything. And then what was pretty awesome after that
Speaker 1: was seeing in the year that followed, unfortunately that's all
Speaker 1: we had. It was it was really less than a
Speaker 1: year before he died, but that they really got close again.
Speaker 1: And I think it was having that that sort of moment,
Speaker 1: a reason to be together, to have a two hour conversation,
Speaker 1: and then from that it became like, oh, hey, my
Speaker 1: kids in this au jury right your kids saying out
Speaker 1: at the eighth Churaman. They're rooting for each other's kids
Speaker 1: and games and ship and talking. And that felt, especially
Speaker 1: now knowing what we know about the time that Kobe
Speaker 1: had left, like that felt really nice to me that
Speaker 1: in some tiny way, like just that circumstance helped bring
Speaker 1: them again, like not because there was any beat, but
Speaker 1: just back together into each other's circle again in a
Speaker 1: way that I think was really special. Um and Kobe
Speaker 1: for me and I've talked about this. Um I was
Speaker 1: starting out when Kobe was starting out, and it was
Speaker 1: hard sometimes people just you know, I'm very short, I'm
Speaker 1: very girl, I'm by all the stuff um and didn't
Speaker 1: want to talk to me about stuff, didn't want him around,
Speaker 1: didn't take me seriously, you know, all the stuff. That's
Speaker 1: just it's just harder. It's harder when you're starting. It's
Speaker 1: hard to get people to trust you. One of the
Speaker 1: early teams I covered the code, the captain of the
Speaker 1: team and the general manager of the team would not
Speaker 1: answer a single question of mine. They would just say
Speaker 1: next question because they I was the first woman to
Speaker 1: cover them. They did not want a woman be writer,
Speaker 1: and they thought if they just didn't give me information
Speaker 1: or access that I would just fail and not do
Speaker 1: well and then shockingly, there'll be a man next time.
Speaker 1: So that that was some of the early stuff you
Speaker 1: have to deal with her I had to deal with.
Speaker 1: And Kobe's rookie year, and you guys know this from
Speaker 1: knowing him. It was not a picnic. You know, there
Speaker 1: were a lot of people who did not want him there.
Speaker 1: This kid from high school. I thought he could do
Speaker 1: everything that we turned out he could do. But at
Speaker 1: that point knew for sure he could do. There was
Speaker 1: a lot of resistance on an older Lakers team. There
Speaker 1: was stupid stuff like because Kobe was there and he
Speaker 1: was under twenty one, they couldn't have beer in the
Speaker 1: locker room anymore. I mean just like from the little
Speaker 1: to the big, you know, and he comes in like
Speaker 1: a bowl in the china shop. So all of that.
Speaker 1: So we really that rookie year. Um I came out
Speaker 1: to l A to do a story on him, and
Speaker 1: it started as an interview and we just ended up.
Speaker 1: I remember, like I can tell you exactly whe we
Speaker 1: were sitting on a bench, like you know, after long
Speaker 1: and it's like one of those time lapses were like
Speaker 1: the end of practice ends around you and then everybody
Speaker 1: slowly leaves and like the lights didn't actually go out,
Speaker 1: but that sort of felt like and just talking and
Speaker 1: talking about what it felt like to be the kid
Speaker 1: that nobody wanted there and kind of had that early
Speaker 1: bond of that and then kind of to watch what
Speaker 1: he became. And in my tiny, microscopically smaller way, what
Speaker 1: I got to become was something that that was very
Speaker 1: special throughout twenty years. Again a front row seat to
Speaker 1: his life and a bomb we had and conversations we'd have,
Speaker 1: and to be able to have had that moment with
Speaker 1: him and Mac so soon close to the end. It's
Speaker 1: not enough, It's never early enough, but it felt like
Speaker 1: a pretty good thing to have gotten in you and I.
Speaker 1: I mean that's when he passed. Obviously, the coverage we
Speaker 1: did on the jump was was NonStop and wasn't easy,
Speaker 1: but it was. I just found it was so cool
Speaker 1: to get everyone's different story of Kobe, you know, I mean,
Speaker 1: because everyone had this perception mamba asshole, this isn't that,
Speaker 1: but if he lets you in, you got to see
Speaker 1: how especially well so to be able to hear everyone
Speaker 1: share their different Kobe's story and how he affected him
Speaker 1: and realized how many people he affected. Obviously, I didn't
Speaker 1: want it to happen, and once it did happen, I mean,
Speaker 1: I guess you know the way you celebrate life was
Speaker 1: being able to hear all these amazing stories from you know,
Speaker 1: this amazing person. So that was a tough, tough, tough time,
Speaker 1: very tough times, tough journey and another example to people
Speaker 1: by the way that like you can grow and learners
Speaker 1: person like what you do in your life doesn't have
Speaker 1: to be the end of your story and be a
Speaker 1: better person afterward. And I think that's something that I
Speaker 1: would that, you know, talking about messages from like, no
Speaker 1: one's story ends. There's no there's no period at the end.
Speaker 1: I mean obviously death, but even then, you know Kobe
Speaker 1: has lived on since then. So you gotta keep going
Speaker 1: and keep getting better every day. You have the honor
Speaker 1: of telling Paul Pierce and Chris Bosh they were finalists
Speaker 1: for the NBA Hall of Fame. How was that? That
Speaker 1: was really fun. We did it first with Max when
Speaker 1: he had actually did a show from the Hall of
Speaker 1: Fame show from the Hall of Fame when he was inducted.
Speaker 1: But back then there wasn't like now, there's a little
Speaker 1: bit of a procedure where it's sort of like the
Speaker 1: finalist announced on this day and this day, and people
Speaker 1: even if they don't know what's coming on that day
Speaker 1: on that show, which Paul Pierce and Chris Bosh we
Speaker 1: got to tell on the show that day they had
Speaker 1: no idea. I had to have this whole plan with
Speaker 1: Chris's very kind wife, who was I was like, can
Speaker 1: you get him in front of a phone where he
Speaker 1: can face time at X time, but don't tell why?
Speaker 1: And here's you know, that kind of thing, um. But
Speaker 1: with Tacy, like there was no I mean, it was
Speaker 1: just completely He came in one day and it was
Speaker 1: he didn't even know he was eligible because they had
Speaker 1: changed the eligibility rules like within that year about the
Speaker 1: number of years you had to be off. So for him,
Speaker 1: it was just it was totally. It was emotional. It
Speaker 1: was emotional to being with that. A little less so
Speaker 1: with these guys because they kind of knew it was
Speaker 1: again not coming on that day, but knew it was coming.
Speaker 1: In general, it feels so special though, I mean, the
Speaker 1: Hall of Fame, it's a it's it's just sort of
Speaker 1: that thing and that that I don't lose that ever,
Speaker 1: Like what a big deal that is to guys. Every
Speaker 1: interview you do is obviously different. Who is your most
Speaker 1: memorable and why? I'm gonna give you like quick hit
Speaker 1: list of someone's and why, And I'm being a terrible person.
Speaker 1: I'm not picking just one, but whatever, al Right. I
Speaker 1: interviewed Tiger Woods in Turkey and an airplane hangar after
Speaker 1: he hit golf balls across a bridge in Istanbul that
Speaker 1: went from one continent to the other. That was weird, definitely, um,
Speaker 1: something I have never done again yep, yeah, a plane hangar,
Speaker 1: you can drop out of continent. Okay. And here's a
Speaker 1: guy who, by the way, who would show up at
Speaker 1: Orlando Magic games all the time. And yet when I
Speaker 1: was like, Hey, I really want to do this interview.
Speaker 1: We get a bunch of stuff going on in his life,
Speaker 1: a bunch to talk about. They were like, well, can
Speaker 1: you fly to Turkey? And I was like, okay, but
Speaker 1: I live really close to where he would Okay, there
Speaker 1: you go. Um. I got to interview Serena Williams a bit,
Speaker 1: especially early in her career, and having covered tennis at
Speaker 1: a time when Venus and Serena came on and then
Speaker 1: really getting into it and talking to them about everything
Speaker 1: that they fought through and faced is something that is
Speaker 1: always going to be super special to me. And those
Speaker 1: are interviews I'm gonna always really be so grateful to
Speaker 1: have gotten to do. And Um, in basketball, I grew
Speaker 1: up thinking Michael Jordan's was Michael fucking Jordan's And the
Speaker 1: fact that in college I got to like sit there
Speaker 1: behind a notebook and he occasionally spoke to me when
Speaker 1: I would be terrified. I didn't talk for like the
Speaker 1: first three or four practices that we covered, and you
Speaker 1: know how it is, you got this clot and media
Speaker 1: around you with their little stuff, and I was just
Speaker 1: trying to not be noticed and learn and do And
Speaker 1: by like the fourth time, he just like looked at
Speaker 1: me in the middle of a press comp of people
Speaker 1: and was like, what you don't speak? Do you not speak?
Speaker 1: And I was just like, oh, okay, and then ask
Speaker 1: my probably ridiculous question at that point because that was
Speaker 1: so nervous. So when the first time I got to
Speaker 1: do like a real formal, this is official sit down
Speaker 1: with Michael Jordan's, I was just I was like, Okay,
Speaker 1: I'm good, this is good, you know that sort of thing.
Speaker 1: So there's been those kind of moments along the way
Speaker 1: where I felt like I've gotten to at least get
Speaker 1: a little peek about these these people who have done
Speaker 1: extraordinary things, and that feels special to kind of add
Speaker 1: on to this. And this is not a normal quick hitter,
Speaker 1: But like I said, you enjoy what you're doing, So
Speaker 1: how cool is it? Like how do you keep the
Speaker 1: fan in you in Sometimes when you're getting to meet
Speaker 1: some of these legends or people, you really look up.
Speaker 1: But but that's because I think It's easier because I'm
Speaker 1: not really a fan, as I discussed that the basketball
Speaker 1: team I grew up being a fan of, Okay, so
Speaker 1: I would be biased thinking that like George Morrison and
Speaker 1: the New Bowl were special. Like I mean, I'm not
Speaker 1: anyone I am quote biased as a fan of is not.
Speaker 1: It would not bother anyone like I have complete bias
Speaker 1: about Allen Iverson, and anyone who's been around me knows
Speaker 1: I have no chill um. I grew up loving Georgetown
Speaker 1: basketball and everything that man has ever done. I don't
Speaker 1: care you cannot talk to me about He's perfect, as
Speaker 1: I introduced him on the show. All the time, he
Speaker 1: is our greatest living American. I think being open about
Speaker 1: those biases is fine. And then when I'm excited and
Speaker 1: let the fan out of me, it's normally of people
Speaker 1: who have done cool things like so I don't I
Speaker 1: feel like it's okay and it's never stopped me and
Speaker 1: you guys have both been on the other end of this.
Speaker 1: I don't think I asked soft questions. I wanted to
Speaker 1: ask the easy questions, you know, because I I feel
Speaker 1: like if I am a fan of what you do
Speaker 1: and respect you, I'm gonna have enough perspect for you
Speaker 1: to think that you don't want to ship and soft
Speaker 1: you around you. Let's be real. So your dream one
Speaker 1: on one interview? Who would it be? Steven Jackson life story?
Speaker 1: Oh wow, you show you ready for that? How many
Speaker 1: hours would we have to do? We do like sixty hours.
Speaker 1: We're gonna need some time right right, because guy's gonna
Speaker 1: be some crime. It's gonna be some laughing. It's gonna
Speaker 1: be it's gonna be some what the funk? Why did
Speaker 1: you do that? It's gonna be a whole bunch of that.
Speaker 1: It's gonna be a whole bunch of that. But don't
Speaker 1: you think he's like the most interesting person. He's been
Speaker 1: through so much, especially like his journey and then now
Speaker 1: post career, Like I said, for us to both be
Speaker 1: kind of reinventing ourselves for our second act um. I
Speaker 1: mean I tell him all the time, but that'd be
Speaker 1: a definitely one tell Jesse's story. I will be honor
Speaker 1: range if you can relive one sporting event you covered
Speaker 1: in the past. Which one would it be? And why? Oh? Man?
Speaker 1: I mean, you know the emotional part is, like you
Speaker 1: know the night Code had his last game and dropped sixty.
Speaker 1: The Warriors also one right they had at Memphis. We
Speaker 1: were in. Yeah, we didn't get to see Kobe's last game,
Speaker 1: and they smacked us right. So sorry to bring up
Speaker 1: a surject remember that they gave me the choice of
Speaker 1: being at either game. They were both on our air,
Speaker 1: by the way. One was on ESPN, one was on
Speaker 1: ESPN two I think or whatever. And I just looked.
Speaker 1: I was like, I'm one of the Kobe game. And
Speaker 1: and I think there was because the Warriors were so
Speaker 1: the story and Kobe, yes, he had been on this
Speaker 1: sort of retirement tour, and there was a little bit
Speaker 1: less of like, well, we've seen him, We've done all that.
Speaker 1: These waved goodbyes, waved you know, it's like Jerk Jeter,
Speaker 1: how many times can you like wave at the crowd?
Speaker 1: And I was just like, no, I'm going on the
Speaker 1: Kobe game. And it was as incredible as advertised, and
Speaker 1: I don't need to relive it because it's still fresh
Speaker 1: and like whatever, But I mean, how much would you
Speaker 1: love to see him out there energy? There's a little
Speaker 1: bit of that. I think I would like to see again.
Speaker 1: Five Dinner Guests, dead or alive. Oh Man, well, Alan
Speaker 1: Iverson clearly great. I don't know. I'm not good at
Speaker 1: this game. I mean I think I think some of
Speaker 1: the women would be from two hundred years ago. But
Speaker 1: who did their ship no matter who was telling them
Speaker 1: what they had to do. Those are largely who would
Speaker 1: make up my dinner guest list. And you know, it's
Speaker 1: still it's funny. We just had like women's and what
Speaker 1: are we calling it? Empowerment, Women's History Month, Women's Appreciation Month.
Speaker 1: I know how everyone feels about Black History Months too.
Speaker 1: It's just sort of like, oh, we get a month,
Speaker 1: thank you so much. What I would like is women
Speaker 1: not to be paid eighty cents on the dollar right
Speaker 1: across the country, and by the way, women of color
Speaker 1: significantly less so. The ones who sort of were able
Speaker 1: to go through those circumstances. I think those are those
Speaker 1: who I wanted my dinner table. And Neverson, because he's
Speaker 1: ever since, sorry, that's just gonna happen. He gets to
Speaker 1: see with a bunch of great women. If you can
Speaker 1: have one guest on all the smoke, who would it be?
Speaker 1: And why who do I want you guys to get
Speaker 1: into it with? Man, that's a good one. Um. I
Speaker 1: mean you've had everyone first of all, so I'd like
Speaker 1: you to I'd like you to get here with Michael
Speaker 1: with some cigars and that whiskey that we saw next
Speaker 1: to him, what was that? We feel whiskey bourbon? What?
Speaker 1: What was that? But but but the level of the
Speaker 1: level of the ship kept going and his eyes were
Speaker 1: changing colors in the process. He was killing it. I
Speaker 1: would I think we have to make that like a
Speaker 1: live show. So m J because he's a guy who
Speaker 1: again I covered him while he was playing both in
Speaker 1: Chicago and d C. And then I remember being in
Speaker 1: Charlotte for something when he had just started his ownership
Speaker 1: stant there and I was sitting in his office and
Speaker 1: we were just kind of shooting the ship and just
Speaker 1: start talking about old stuff, and of course, like at
Speaker 1: the end of it, I'm like Michael, like, why don't
Speaker 1: you come downstairs and come like beyond with us, like
Speaker 1: come beyond? And he just looks at me. He goes,
Speaker 1: I don't do that anymore, he said, because I don't
Speaker 1: have to. And I was like, oh, yeah, so he
Speaker 1: really does. He does, like one cigar fish Unado cover
Speaker 1: like every X number of years. I think he's talked
Speaker 1: to Bray Thompson in her place once or twice, but
Speaker 1: he has not done anything like this. I that is
Speaker 1: what I want to see. We can make someone send
Speaker 1: this clip to Mike. Rachel said, look, Gina parody so
Speaker 1: she can make anything. All your guests here has a
Speaker 1: lot of pressure. Gy. We got faith in you. I
Speaker 1: got no doubts. I am so grateful to you guys
Speaker 1: for the time. Thank you, thank you right here, so
Speaker 1: thank you. That's a rap. All the smoke special guests,
Speaker 1: Rachel Nichols, thank you for your time. And on Showtime
Speaker 1: Basketball YouTube in the I Heart platform Black Effects. We'll
Speaker 1: see you all next week. Walking like a fos. Wow,
Speaker 1: that's Spaniard archer Letta, which just be him. We title
Speaker 1: on the line against number one contender Sergio Pettis Vegetoria
Speaker 1: lat or m m A Live Friday May seven on
Speaker 1: Showtime where Warriors Rule h