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Speaker 1: What kind of a show you guys putting on here today?

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Speaker 2: You're not interested in armed now?

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Speaker 3: No, look, we're going to do this thing.

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Speaker 4: We're going to have a conversation.

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Speaker 1: A film spotter is Adam and Josh here with another

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Speaker 1: dip into the Film Spotting Archive, which has reviews, top

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Speaker 1: fives and more going all the way back to two

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Speaker 1: thousand and five. Access to that archive is just one

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Speaker 1: of the many benefits you get as a Film Spotting

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Speaker 1: Family member, which you can learn more about at film

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Speaker 1: Spottingfamily dot com. With a new Superman in theaters this weekend,

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Speaker 1: we're sharing something from the top five archive Batman Superman Moments.

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Speaker 5: This was from twenty sixteen, around the time of the

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Speaker 5: release of Batman vs. Superman Dawn of Justice. I was

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Speaker 5: away that week, so Adam was joined by pop culture

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Speaker 5: Happy Hours Glenn Walden and freelance critic Chris Klemick. Chris

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Speaker 5: He's a Superman officionado and Glenn is the author of

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Speaker 5: the Cape Crusade, Batman and the Rise of Nerd Culture.

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Speaker 5: From April twenty sixteen, here are the top five Batman

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Speaker 5: Superman moments.

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Speaker 1: Gosh, Batman, the Nobility of the almost human porps.

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Speaker 5: True, Robin, it was noble of that animal to hurl

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Speaker 5: himself into the path with that final torpedo.

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Speaker 6: He gave his.

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Speaker 2: Life for ours.

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Speaker 1: Holy dais x Makina Batman, Adam West and Bert Ward

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Speaker 1: in Batman the Movie from nineteen sixty six. Sadly, no

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Speaker 1: almost human porpoise was available to fill in during Josh

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Speaker 1: Larson's absence this week, so I've invited two super friends

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Speaker 1: in for this week's Top five Batman Superman movie moments.

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Speaker 1: First up, Chris Klemick. He's an NPR film critic. He's

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Speaker 1: an occasional panelist on NPR's Pop Culture Happy Hour and

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Speaker 1: occasional film spotting guest host in Top five Hired Gun

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Speaker 1: You know him and Love Him from our Top five

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Speaker 1: James Bond Tropes last November. He also shares initials and

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Speaker 1: a face with Clark Kent.

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Speaker 6: How are you doing, Chris, great Scott Adam to tell

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Speaker 6: everyone my secret?

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Speaker 1: Well, thank you, indeed, I'm spoiling your secret identity. Chris

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Speaker 1: playing the role of Superman. Obviously, that means Glenn Weldon

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Speaker 1: is our Batman. He's a regular panelist on pop Culture

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Speaker 1: Happy Hour. He's the author of twenty thirteen Superman, The

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Speaker 1: Unauthorized Biography, and the just released The Cape Crusade, Batman

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Speaker 1: and the Rise of Nerd Culture. Glenn, you don't look

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Speaker 1: like any incarnation of Bruce Wayne I'm familiar with. But

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Speaker 1: the one time we hung out together and had a

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Speaker 1: few beers at that bar in DC, you were wearing

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Speaker 1: a cowl, which seemed a little odd.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, I just it's casual. It's chapter six.

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Speaker 1: I just, you know, like to try it on nice. Well,

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Speaker 1: thank you both for being here, and thank you for

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Speaker 1: doing what will inevitably be the heavy lifting for this

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Speaker 1: Top five. I am far from the expert, and that's

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Speaker 1: where you guys come in. So I guess Chris will

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Speaker 1: start with you, and I want you number five. And

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Speaker 1: I want to know if you, like Josh and I

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Speaker 1: are want to do from time to time, if you

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Speaker 1: had any guiding principles that helps you form this list.

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Speaker 6: I'm a man of principal Adam starting with no treadmills ever,

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Speaker 6: But for this list, I chose to read Top five

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Speaker 6: Superman Batman movie moments as not simply moments from any

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Speaker 6: film starring one of those characters, but moments about those characters.

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Speaker 6: So my scenes had to have either Superman or Batman

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Speaker 6: in it and had to reveal something inherent to the character.

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Speaker 6: That's why the Nolan Dark Knight trilogy is maybe underrepresented here.

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Speaker 6: As much as I love those films, they feature an

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Speaker 6: unusually well developed supporting cast. You know, Jim Gordon is

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Speaker 6: a real character in those movies. Alfred the Butler is

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Speaker 6: a real character in those movies. So neither of those

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Speaker 6: guys are Batman or Superman. So they're here, but not

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Speaker 6: as prevalent as my love of those Nolan movies might hint.

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Speaker 1: At Got It, You're Number five.

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Speaker 6: Number five is from Tim Burton's Batman Returns, his second

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Speaker 6: and final Batman movie. This is near the conclusion of

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Speaker 6: the film when Max Shrek played by Christopher Walkin, has

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Speaker 6: been uncovered as the big bad here and his victim,

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Speaker 6: Selena Kyle, who has become Catwoman, is confronting him, and

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Speaker 6: Batman arrives and tries to talk her down, persuade her

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Speaker 6: to let them take Shrek to the police rather than

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Speaker 6: kill him. That speaks to Batman's quest for it for justice,

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Speaker 6: not vengeance in most representations of the characters. I'm sure

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Speaker 6: we'll discuss further. He does not use lethal force. You know,

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Speaker 6: this movie is really more of a Tim Burton movie

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Speaker 6: with Batman running around in it than a Batman movie

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Speaker 6: in a lot of ways. But I like that it

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Speaker 6: builds this symmetry between Catwoman and Batman and suggests that

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Speaker 6: they understand one another in a way. And I love

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Speaker 6: this moment where Bruce Wayne actually doesn't just remove his

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Speaker 6: cowl but tears it off, you know, suggesting a finality.

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Speaker 7: So don't you see we're the same, were the same?

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Speaker 2: Split raked up the center signa please.

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Speaker 6: So it's a powerful moment. And then Shrek has this

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Speaker 6: great tag on it where he says, Bruce Wayne, why

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Speaker 6: are you dressed like Batman? So it think is how

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Speaker 6: most people would react to, you know, a person who

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Speaker 6: is famous like Bruce Wayne, Yeah, being unmasked as some

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Speaker 6: figure of mystery.

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Speaker 1: It's a great pick. And I like the fact that

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Speaker 1: you went with Batman Returns, which you know you may

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Speaker 1: remember from our Sacred Cow discussion of Batman eighty nine.

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Speaker 1: I hadn't seen that since it originally came out. I

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Speaker 1: certainly have not seen Batman Returns either since it came

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Speaker 1: out originally in theaters. I think you just did rewatch it,

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Speaker 1: probably in prep for this list. Did it hold up?

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Speaker 1: And I guess did it hold up to what you

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Speaker 1: originally thought of it?

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Speaker 3: Well?

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Speaker 6: I certainly disliked it when I was a teenager and

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Speaker 6: it came out for you know, because it seemed like

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Speaker 6: it was just Burton doing what he wanted to do,

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Speaker 6: and you know, in order to get seventy million to

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Speaker 6: put Batman in it somewhere. That's what makes me appreciate

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Speaker 6: it so much now. It is a deeply weird film

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Speaker 6: but feels very personal in a way that none of

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Speaker 6: the Marvel movies, for example, do, even though I like

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Speaker 6: a lot of those. I didn't watch the entire thing again,

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Speaker 6: but I certainly went back to that scene every time

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Speaker 6: I revisit Batman returns. I seem to appreciate it more.

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Speaker 1: Glenn Weldon, you are up next your number five.

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Speaker 5: Yeah.

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Speaker 4: I wish I had some kind of grand, overarching scheme.

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Speaker 4: I do not just stuff. I like stuff that I

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Speaker 4: actually remember from all these films because I have watched them.

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Speaker 4: I haven't watched them all recently, but I certainly they

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Speaker 4: form a pretty large part of my psyche. And my

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Speaker 4: number five is the moment from the animated feature Mask

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Speaker 4: of the Phantasm when Bruce dons the batsuit for the

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Speaker 4: very first time. Now, this is just my way of

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Speaker 4: sneaking the animated series in here, and I'm doing it

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Speaker 4: on a technicality. This animated feature was released in theaters

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Speaker 4: very briefly and did very poorly. But the thing that

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Speaker 4: I talk about in the book a lot is that

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Speaker 4: whenever you take this character from the comics into say,

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Speaker 4: an action movie, you have to change them because you

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Speaker 4: have to give a comic book characters. You have to

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Speaker 4: give them something they don't get in the comics, which

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Speaker 4: is an ending. You have to take them through a

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Speaker 4: narrative arc.

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Speaker 6: You have to.

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Speaker 4: It's exactly what Chris was saying. That moment in Batman

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Speaker 4: Returns when he rips off the cowl is not a

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Speaker 4: thing you would do. It's not Batman's a violation of

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Speaker 4: the basic tenet of superheroedom. But to fit him into

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Speaker 4: a three x structure, you have to do it. And

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Speaker 4: that always pulls me out of these characters a little bit.

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Speaker 4: But once you get the animated series, the animated series

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Speaker 4: is as close as we are ever going to get

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Speaker 4: to the Batman of the comics. Basically, given any kind

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Speaker 4: of life, any kind of animation life, because the format

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Speaker 4: of that series apes the format of a comic book

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Speaker 4: very easily. So even in this particular animated feature, they're

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Speaker 4: still doing this thing where they're not really changing him,

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Speaker 4: but there's showing a moment in his life when he

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Speaker 4: could have made a different decision. It's mostly well, there's

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Speaker 4: a lot of flashback here, and it's about a romance

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Speaker 4: he had as he was deciding how to become Batman.

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Speaker 4: So yes, that means this is the Origin still yet again,

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Speaker 4: but percifully there's no Martha and Thomas Wayne get killed

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Speaker 4: yet again. No Pearls were harmed in the making of

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Speaker 4: this particular origin story, animated or otherwise animated or otherwise. Instead,

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Speaker 4: we focus on what the comic book Batman Year one

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Speaker 4: focuses on, which is how he decides to go about

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Speaker 4: what he does using the whole.

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Speaker 6: Bat get up.

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Speaker 4: He starts off trying to tech criminals just with a

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Speaker 4: scheme mask, but he doesn't scare them enough. So there

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Speaker 4: is a scene, and it is a very very brief

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Speaker 4: scene in which he dons the batsuit for the first time.

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Speaker 4: We will see him put on the mask and then

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Speaker 4: he turns to face Alfred, and very importantly, we see

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Speaker 4: the reaction on Alfred's face. We do not see him,

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Speaker 4: we won't see him in the full get up till

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Speaker 4: a little bit later. But the reaction on Alfred's face,

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Speaker 4: who has known this guy all his life, is one

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Speaker 4: of shock and tellingly, I think a bit of dismay.

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Speaker 4: And then we see something that is hugely important. I

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Speaker 4: think we see a close up of the cowls, slits,

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Speaker 4: the eyes, the white eyes. We see them narrow. Now

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Speaker 4: that recalls the beginning of every episode of the animated series.

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Speaker 4: That's the moment when a thing that we nerds who

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Speaker 4: have been reading these comics all our lives we've kind

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Speaker 4: of envisioned but we've never seen because it happens between

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Speaker 4: the gutters of the comic book page. Here we see it.

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Speaker 4: We see that intentionality, We see the force of his

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Speaker 4: will focused as his eyes narrow, and it is just

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Speaker 4: an awesome to see.

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Speaker 1: I will have to take your word for it, as

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Speaker 1: I'm not familiar with it, and that's why you're on

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Speaker 1: this show, Glenn, to give us those deeper cuts. So

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Speaker 1: there you go. It sounds fascinating. I'm going to do

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Speaker 1: something I never do during these top fives, which is

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Speaker 1: be brief, you guys are the stars of this segment,

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Speaker 1: and I certainly don't have the n sites that you

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Speaker 1: guys have to share. And the reality is, if I

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Speaker 1: was truly doing this top five, I would just pick

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Speaker 1: five moments from Superman the movie, the original. I'd pick

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Speaker 1: all five of them from that film, because that's the

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Speaker 1: one that probably looms the largest for me in my

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Speaker 1: memory growing up. I watched that movie obsessively, but I

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Speaker 1: did try to be a little bit more varied with

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Speaker 1: my picks, have a little bit of diversity and spread

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Speaker 1: it out and not just go with Superman. And my

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Speaker 1: number five is actually the sequence from Batman eighty nine

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Speaker 1: Tim Burtons where he Michael Keaton is over at Vicky

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Speaker 1: Vale's house Kim Basinger and the Joker shows up and

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Speaker 1: we get that great opening line where Keaton says to

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Speaker 1: the Joker, I know who you are.

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Speaker 8: Let me take you with this guy. I know Jack,

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Speaker 8: mean kid, bad seed, hurt people.

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Speaker 2: I like him already.

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Speaker 8: You know what the problem was, He got sloppy, you know, crazy,

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Speaker 8: He started to lose it. You had a head full

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Speaker 8: of bad wiring. I guess couldn't keep it straight up here.

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Speaker 8: He was the kind of guy who couldn't hear the

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Speaker 8: train until it was two feet from him.

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Speaker 2: You know what happened to this guy? Jack made mistakes?

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Speaker 2: Then he had a.

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Speaker 1: Nuts come on, let's get nuts.

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Speaker 7: Tell me something, my friend, you ever danced with the Devil?

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Speaker 2: In the Bale line?

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Speaker 1: What? I like the scene on its face because I

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Speaker 1: like the bit of irony where you have Michael Keaton

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Speaker 1: saying I know who you are. But then he proceeds

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Speaker 1: to tell this story about let me tell you about

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Speaker 1: a guy. I know he's being more general. He doesn't

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Speaker 1: literally mean I know who you are, it quite in

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Speaker 1: that way. And then when he hears later the Dance

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Speaker 1: with the Devil, when he says that line and he

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Speaker 1: says what Bruce Wayne says what he then knows, well, actually,

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Speaker 1: I really do truly know who you are. The real

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Speaker 1: reason I'm picking it, though, guys, is just because it's

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Speaker 1: the most Keaton moment in that movie where we finally

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Speaker 1: get him with the poker saying let's get nuts. You

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Speaker 1: want to get nuts, Let's get nuts. It just it's

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Speaker 1: something that doesn't really fit. I'm not even sure that

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Speaker 1: Keaton completely pulls it off. But it's just such a

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Speaker 1: Michael Keaton moment that you could see him doing in

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Speaker 1: any one of his other great roles from the eighties.

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Speaker 1: And I loved Michael Keaton in the eighties. He was

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Speaker 1: a great star. And then he brought that same kind

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Speaker 1: of just energy, manic energy to that part, and you

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Speaker 1: really get it in that scene. Now, it's a little

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Speaker 1: bit ridiculous that we get the bullet and he manages

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Speaker 1: to survive with his little bulletproof piece of metal somehow,

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Speaker 1: but you know, that's kind of the logic that you

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Speaker 1: get throughout that entire movie from Tim Burton. So I

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Speaker 1: don't know how brief I was there, guys, but that's

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Speaker 1: my pick and I'm sticking with it.

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Speaker 4: All right. Let me jump in there at him, because

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Speaker 4: that scene that you talk about is what's kind of

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Speaker 4: a late addition to the script. It wasn't even technically scripted.

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Speaker 4: It was kind of this exercise that the director kind

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Speaker 4: of took Michael Keaton and Jack Nicholson aside and said

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Speaker 4: we need to do something. Jack Nicholson said he didn't.

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Speaker 6: Have enough to do.

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Speaker 4: Michael Keaton wanted something a little bit chewier. So that

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Speaker 4: scene to me has an acting class exercise.

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Speaker 1: Field that makes sense.

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Speaker 4: It's less finished, it's less it's showier in all the

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Speaker 4: ways that you mentioned, and you can kind of tell.

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Speaker 4: I think it stops the film dead and its tracks. Ye,

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Speaker 4: but it does something very odd and it does give

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Speaker 4: you these We haven't seen these two together without the masks.

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Speaker 1: That's right, yep, all right, your number four, Chris Well.

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Speaker 6: One of among my many jobs, Adam, is I am

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Speaker 6: the court appointed attorney for Zack Snyder's Man of Steel

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Speaker 6: from twenty thirteen. So I'm going to go with a

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Speaker 6: brief scene from that movie that was I'm sure as

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Speaker 6: in the trailer it may be the only time we

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Speaker 6: actually see Henry Cavill's Superman speak in the trailer, I

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Speaker 6: don't really remember, but in the film, this is when

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Speaker 6: Superman has surrendered to the authorities and allowed the army

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Speaker 6: to put handcuffs on just as he explains to Lois Lane,

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Speaker 6: so they'll they'll feel more confident, even though the handcuffs

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Speaker 6: are clearly feudle. So they're sitting across the table in

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Speaker 6: an interrogation room from one another, with various military officials

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Speaker 6: behind of you know, a two way mirror, and she

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Speaker 6: asks him what's the S stand for? And he kind

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Speaker 6: of fixes her with that of those clear blue eyes

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Speaker 6: and says, it's not an S.

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Speaker 2: In my world it means hope.

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Speaker 8: Well, here it's an ass.

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Speaker 6: It is a perfect line reading. It is the only

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Speaker 6: hint of the warmer, friendlier, more inspiring Superman movie that

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Speaker 6: I wanted this to be. It's the only moment where

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Speaker 6: there is a hint of actual romantic chemistry between Henry

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Speaker 6: Cavill and Amy Adams. I like like fifty one percent

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Speaker 6: of this movie, and I strongly dislike the other forty nine.

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Speaker 6: But this is a scene that would have survived intact

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Speaker 6: in the film that I wish Man of Steel was,

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Speaker 6: so I had to give it some love here at

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Speaker 6: number four.

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Speaker 1: No, that's a really good pick and kind of a

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Speaker 1: cool coda to that scene obviously, where he just nonchalantly

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Speaker 1: takes the cuffs off and makes the military people look

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Speaker 1: a little bit silly before the glass there.

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Speaker 6: So I like that and even sustain it for one scene,

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Speaker 6: but I love that moment.

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Speaker 2: Yeah.

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Speaker 1: Indeed, all right, Glenn, you're number four.

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Speaker 4: My number four is the Junkyard fight from Superman three. Yes,

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Speaker 4: the Superman three makes an appearance in my top five.

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Speaker 4: I'm as surprised as anyone. But everything about the Superman

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Speaker 4: three is schlocky, I would say, agreeably so. And I

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Speaker 4: have talked to one number of people that surprisingly who

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Speaker 4: are younger than me, for whom the final scene, the

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Speaker 4: confrontation with the evil computer, in which that evil computer

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Speaker 4: takes over a woman's body, is very traumatic and it's

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Speaker 4: very scary to them, but because it's something that they

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Speaker 4: remember from the childhood. But this junkyard fight scene between

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Speaker 4: a good Clark Kent and an evil Superman, and you

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Speaker 4: can tell he's evil because he's got a five o'clock

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Speaker 4: shadow and he drinks whiskey and he blows out the

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Speaker 4: Olympic torch that scene, and you don't need to know

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Speaker 4: why it happened. Synthetic Kryptoni yet out. Yet it doesn't matter.

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Speaker 4: That scene is so quintessentially silver age comic book goodness

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Speaker 4: and evilness respectively, that it just captures something so pure.

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Speaker 4: I can see these panels as drawn by Kurt Swan Superman,

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Speaker 4: one of my favorite Superman artists. It just has a simple,

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Speaker 4: primal power. Agreeably schlocky as it is agreeably silly and

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Speaker 4: bad props A Kimbo. It doesn't matter.

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Speaker 6: I still love it.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I think, even as a younger man, still at

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Speaker 1: that point, I recognized that movie was not as good

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Speaker 1: as Superman the Movie or Superman two, but I still

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Speaker 1: really enjoyed it. And I don't know what that says

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Speaker 1: about me, Glenn.

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Speaker 4: No, no, no, It just means that Richard Pryor, even

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Speaker 4: bad Richard Pryor, is still Richard Pryor.

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Speaker 1: All Right, my number four. I can't believe I'm doing this, Chris,

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Speaker 1: you'll appreciate this. I'm no defender of Man of Steel.

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Speaker 1: I said earlier in the show with Michael that I

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Speaker 1: actually think Batman versus Superman might be slightly slightly better

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Speaker 1: than Man of Steel.

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Speaker 6: And yeah, third, Adam osird And yet.

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Speaker 1: That's what Michael said. And yet I am going with

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Speaker 1: a scene from Man of Steel for my number four.

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Speaker 1: And it's the flashback that an unconscious floating in the

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Speaker 1: water Superman Henry cavill is having, and he's thinking back

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Speaker 1: to the time when he was a young schoolboy, maybe

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Speaker 1: six to eight years old, maybe even a little bit younger,

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Speaker 1: kind of kindergarten, first grade, and he is having a

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Speaker 1: really tough time in school.

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Speaker 8: I'm here, Clark, Honey, Mom, do you open the door?

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Speaker 2: That's wrong with anywhere? He's such freey his parents.

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Speaker 7: Now, sweetie, how can I help you?

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Speaker 2: If you won't let me in the world's too big, mom,

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Speaker 2: then make it small.

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Speaker 1: Everything about that scene it ending with Diane Lane coming

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Speaker 1: and the conversation that the mother and son have where

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Speaker 1: he says, the world's too big, mom and she explains,

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Speaker 1: We'll just make it small. That's a nice little touching moment.

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Speaker 1: I don't know why all the school kids from the

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Speaker 1: classroom have to be out there as well, like adding

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Speaker 1: to his traumatic moment, but it's a really touching little

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Speaker 1: moment before that, though, is really what I love about

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Speaker 1: the scene, the fact that we got shades of that

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Speaker 1: in the original Superman, where yeah, okay, he gets picked

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Speaker 1: on a little bit, and boy, it's tough having these

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Speaker 1: special powers. He doesn't get to go hang out with

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Speaker 1: the cool kids and it has to act out a

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Speaker 1: little bit. But it's nothing like the real kind of terror.

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Speaker 1: We see what Zack Snyder perceives that that life would

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Speaker 1: have been like for a young Clark Kent and watching

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Speaker 1: that that's really kind of terrifying, watching him as he

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Speaker 1: perceives the world, where he hears the sounds in an

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Speaker 1: amplified way that is very hard for him to deal with.

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Speaker 1: He sees the teacher, he sees through her, of course,

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Speaker 1: sees the skeleton. It's a very imposing kind of sequence,

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Speaker 1: and there was something about that that I appreciate it,

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Speaker 1: mainly because again, it was something I'd never really seen

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Speaker 1: in one of these films before. It was a new

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Speaker 1: take on the young life of Superman that does make

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Speaker 1: sense in terms of how he later perceives the world,

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Speaker 1: and that he's got a little grimmer view of it.

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Speaker 1: So the World's too Big is my number four?

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Speaker 6: I like that scene too, Adam, I'm going to pump

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Speaker 6: up my evaluation of Man of Steel the fifty two percent.

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Speaker 1: Fair enough, that's fresh number three for you.

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Speaker 6: Chris, all right, Well, I swear I didn't pick this

381
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Speaker 6: one just so we could revisit our old saw over

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Speaker 6: what is or is not a reboot, but the other

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Speaker 6: I think underappreciated, not nearly as reviled as Man of

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Speaker 6: Steel is Superman film from the twenty first century. As

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Speaker 6: Brian singers, Superman returns from two thousand and six. This

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Speaker 6: is maybe it's a rewind qull in the sense that

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Speaker 6: it sort of pretends that Superman three and four never

388
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Speaker 6: happened and picks up the story. I think it's supposed

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Speaker 6: to be five years after Superman two or thereabouts. I

390
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Speaker 6: believe they specify that in the film. This is very

391
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Speaker 6: much a love letter to the first Richard Donner Superman

392
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Speaker 6: from seventy eight. Superman has been away for some long

393
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Speaker 6: period seeking remnants of Krypton or something. He is reintroduced

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Speaker 6: to the world in this fantastic action sequence, probably the

395
00:20:09,480 --> 00:20:11,879
Speaker 6: most elaborate one that we've ever seen that does not

396
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Speaker 6: involve destroying Metropolis. In a Superman film, where the space

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Speaker 6: Shuttle or some similar space vehicles being piggybacked on the

398
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Speaker 6: back of a passenger jet carrying coterie of journalists. Lois

399
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Speaker 6: Lane is among them. The rockets fire too soon, endangering

400
00:20:27,080 --> 00:20:31,160
Speaker 6: both vehicles, so Superman shows up to first physically separate

401
00:20:31,240 --> 00:20:35,280
Speaker 6: the spacecraft from the airplane and sees the space shuttle

402
00:20:35,320 --> 00:20:37,840
Speaker 6: make it safely into space, then looks down to see

403
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Speaker 6: that the passenger jet is flaming and disintegrating and falling

404
00:20:40,920 --> 00:20:43,520
Speaker 6: to Earth beneath him. You know, this is the kind

405
00:20:43,560 --> 00:20:46,280
Speaker 6: of elaborate action sequence that would not have been possible

406
00:20:46,280 --> 00:20:49,400
Speaker 6: when Richard Donner was making his Superman movie in the seventies. Obviously,

407
00:20:49,400 --> 00:20:53,280
Speaker 6: it is very heavily reliant on CGI, but the uncanny

408
00:20:53,359 --> 00:20:55,840
Speaker 6: Valley thing when you see a human figure rendered in

409
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Speaker 6: CGI doesn't really kick in here because it's so stylized.

410
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Speaker 6: It kind of the look of the Max Fleischer Superman

411
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Speaker 6: cartoons of the nineteen forties. So even though it doesn't

412
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Speaker 6: look quite photorealistic, it still looks really cool. There is

413
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Speaker 6: a brief homage to two thousand and one where as

414
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Speaker 6: the plane that Lois is in becomes weightless. Briefly, her

415
00:21:15,560 --> 00:21:18,600
Speaker 6: pen sort of floats her shirt pocket and she reaches

416
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Speaker 6: for it. And then one of the things that I

417
00:21:21,080 --> 00:21:24,720
Speaker 6: love about this sequence is it showcases some of Superman's

418
00:21:24,760 --> 00:21:27,480
Speaker 6: weirder powers. He gets to use super breath, among other things,

419
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Speaker 6: because he's not just super strong and capable of flight.

420
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Speaker 6: But my favorite element of it is he keeps trying

421
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Speaker 6: things to rescue this flaming, disintegrating, falling airplane that don't work.

422
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Speaker 6: You know, because even though he can do all these things,

423
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Speaker 6: he's probably not encountered this specific problem before I feel

424
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Speaker 6: like grab it by the wing and the wing snaps off.

425
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Speaker 6: You know, he's trying various things, really exhausting his reserve

426
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Speaker 6: of ideas, not his powers, to finally bring this plane

427
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Speaker 6: to a gentle halt just above a baseball diamond. So

428
00:21:56,480 --> 00:21:58,399
Speaker 6: there's a great shot where the you know, the batter

429
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Speaker 6: gets a good piece of the pits, and then the know,

430
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Speaker 6: the crowd cheers because he looks like he's going to

431
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Speaker 6: get a base hit, and then they all look up

432
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Speaker 6: and see this flaming aircraft come down. Yeah, and then

433
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Speaker 6: the scene has the perfect button where Superman takes the

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Speaker 6: door off the plane, boards it and then echoes his

435
00:22:12,880 --> 00:22:14,640
Speaker 6: line from Superman seventy eight.

436
00:22:15,040 --> 00:22:16,680
Speaker 2: Well, I hope.

437
00:22:16,480 --> 00:22:20,200
Speaker 1: This experience hasn't put any of you off flying. Statistically speaking,

438
00:22:20,680 --> 00:22:22,159
Speaker 1: it's still the safest way to travel.

439
00:22:23,240 --> 00:22:24,240
Speaker 6: I love that scene.

440
00:22:24,400 --> 00:22:27,000
Speaker 1: Yeah, I just saw that scene. I think because Superman

441
00:22:27,080 --> 00:22:29,520
Speaker 1: Returns has been playing on HBO, it was maybe a

442
00:22:29,520 --> 00:22:33,080
Speaker 1: week or so ago. I caught that scene and really

443
00:22:33,119 --> 00:22:35,840
Speaker 1: did enjoy it for all the reasons that you said.

444
00:22:35,880 --> 00:22:37,639
Speaker 1: And I like what you were saying as well about

445
00:22:37,640 --> 00:22:39,720
Speaker 1: how it compares to some of the CGI stuff where

446
00:22:39,760 --> 00:22:44,520
Speaker 1: clearly it needed cgi to be captured, and yet it

447
00:22:44,560 --> 00:22:46,920
Speaker 1: doesn't feel like all of the nonsense we get in

448
00:22:47,000 --> 00:22:48,760
Speaker 1: Man of Steel or that we get in the last

449
00:22:48,760 --> 00:22:52,640
Speaker 1: thirty or forty minutes of Batman v. Superman. It feels

450
00:22:52,880 --> 00:22:56,200
Speaker 1: a little bit closer to the kind of naturalistic type

451
00:22:56,200 --> 00:22:59,719
Speaker 1: stunts and action scenes that we get in the Nolan

452
00:23:00,400 --> 00:23:03,280
Speaker 1: I think the Batman movies from Christopher Nolan. So I agree,

453
00:23:03,320 --> 00:23:05,720
Speaker 1: it's a really good sequence and a good choice.

454
00:23:05,800 --> 00:23:07,760
Speaker 4: What about you, Glenn, Well, yeah, I pick up on that.

455
00:23:07,840 --> 00:23:10,160
Speaker 4: I mean, I think what you're picking up on there

456
00:23:10,200 --> 00:23:12,479
Speaker 4: is that it seems a more nuanced film because it

457
00:23:12,520 --> 00:23:15,639
Speaker 4: does come at this character with from a more mature place.

458
00:23:15,680 --> 00:23:18,760
Speaker 4: I'm not saying like adult, sexually mature. I'm saying there's

459
00:23:18,800 --> 00:23:21,800
Speaker 4: a note of melancholy throughout this movie.

460
00:23:22,119 --> 00:23:23,000
Speaker 6: More than a note.

461
00:23:23,240 --> 00:23:26,760
Speaker 4: Yeah, that is absolutely new to the character, not something

462
00:23:26,800 --> 00:23:30,359
Speaker 4: we associate with a character, a mournfulness, a lost something

463
00:23:30,560 --> 00:23:33,399
Speaker 4: that he's lost. And I think it's interesting. I do

464
00:23:33,560 --> 00:23:36,359
Speaker 4: think the film struggles because we are told at the

465
00:23:36,359 --> 00:23:39,680
Speaker 4: beginning that he's gone away an abandoned earth, and then

466
00:23:39,720 --> 00:23:42,000
Speaker 4: the movie spends the rest of its running time kind

467
00:23:42,000 --> 00:23:44,480
Speaker 4: of punishing him for doing a thing that We didn't

468
00:23:44,520 --> 00:23:46,800
Speaker 4: see him do a choice, we didn't see him make,

469
00:23:47,320 --> 00:23:51,480
Speaker 4: so it feels like it's dumping on him for something that,

470
00:23:51,720 --> 00:23:53,879
Speaker 4: if you know the character, seems like a thing we

471
00:23:53,880 --> 00:23:55,080
Speaker 4: would need more explanation of.

472
00:23:55,160 --> 00:23:56,440
Speaker 6: He wouldn't just go away.

473
00:23:56,200 --> 00:23:58,440
Speaker 4: Just because he saw there's a piece of crypton. He

474
00:23:58,480 --> 00:24:02,280
Speaker 4: would need more. But I do like that film more than.

475
00:24:02,160 --> 00:24:02,800
Speaker 6: A lot of people do.

476
00:24:02,880 --> 00:24:04,560
Speaker 1: Really, Okay, you're number three.

477
00:24:04,640 --> 00:24:07,360
Speaker 4: My number three is the is from Batman Begins. It's

478
00:24:07,359 --> 00:24:10,520
Speaker 4: a purely visual moment. I like Batman Begins. I like

479
00:24:10,560 --> 00:24:12,680
Speaker 4: Nolan's films better when they shut up. I do have

480
00:24:12,760 --> 00:24:14,439
Speaker 4: an issue with some of his dialogue, but it's the

481
00:24:14,920 --> 00:24:18,720
Speaker 4: bat baptism that happens at once A Bruce Wayne discovers

482
00:24:18,760 --> 00:24:22,080
Speaker 4: the bat cave and the bats swarm around him, and

483
00:24:22,240 --> 00:24:25,600
Speaker 4: Zimmer's score swells. That is one of the moments that

484
00:24:25,680 --> 00:24:37,040
Speaker 4: I remember from that trilogy. He's got a storytelling fetish

485
00:24:37,160 --> 00:24:42,040
Speaker 4: for groundedness and realism that can seem dour and kind

486
00:24:42,080 --> 00:24:45,320
Speaker 4: of talking and purely expository, but he couches it with

487
00:24:45,440 --> 00:24:49,960
Speaker 4: this cinematography, and especially this is Zimmer's score that's very

488
00:24:50,400 --> 00:24:54,280
Speaker 4: downright operatic in tone and swoony, and this moment melds

489
00:24:54,280 --> 00:24:57,720
Speaker 4: those two things together really nicely. It's something that could happen,

490
00:24:58,119 --> 00:25:00,800
Speaker 4: but it's given this touch of magic the way it's

491
00:25:00,800 --> 00:25:03,479
Speaker 4: shot and by the sound, by the score. It's one

492
00:25:03,480 --> 00:25:05,440
Speaker 4: of the most arresting visuals in the entire trilogy. I

493
00:25:05,440 --> 00:25:08,119
Speaker 4: would put the moment when Heath Ledgers Joker sticks his

494
00:25:08,119 --> 00:25:10,639
Speaker 4: head out of the police window like a dog as

495
00:25:10,680 --> 00:25:12,200
Speaker 4: he's driving. That might be the other one, but that's

496
00:25:12,280 --> 00:25:14,520
Speaker 4: the moment that I remember from that entire trilogy.

497
00:25:14,560 --> 00:25:14,919
Speaker 2: Huh.

498
00:25:14,960 --> 00:25:16,959
Speaker 1: Great stuff, and I'm glad you mentioned as well. One

499
00:25:16,960 --> 00:25:18,879
Speaker 1: that's certainly an honorable mention for me, the one with

500
00:25:19,440 --> 00:25:23,320
Speaker 1: the Joker and his head out the window in that film.

501
00:25:23,440 --> 00:25:26,080
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502
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508
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509
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Speaker 1: My number three is a choice that I'm not sure

510
00:25:51,440 --> 00:25:53,919
Speaker 1: if you guys are going to be on board with

511
00:25:54,320 --> 00:25:57,960
Speaker 1: and find halfway inspired, or you're just gonna shame me

512
00:25:58,240 --> 00:26:00,959
Speaker 1: miserably for the rest of this maybe a little bit

513
00:26:00,960 --> 00:26:05,760
Speaker 1: of both. I'm going to share my pick via this soliloquy. Darkness,

514
00:26:06,560 --> 00:26:12,240
Speaker 1: no parents, continued darkness, the opposite of light, black hole,

515
00:26:12,640 --> 00:26:16,159
Speaker 1: curtains drawn in the basement middle of the night, blacked

516
00:26:16,160 --> 00:26:21,560
Speaker 1: out windows, black suit, black coffee, darkness, no parents. Super

517
00:26:21,640 --> 00:26:25,720
Speaker 1: rich kind of makes it better. And scene that of

518
00:26:25,760 --> 00:26:29,440
Speaker 1: course from the Lego movie, not a Batman or Superman movie,

519
00:26:29,520 --> 00:26:33,480
Speaker 1: but you could argue it is Batman certainly a major

520
00:26:33,560 --> 00:26:35,879
Speaker 1: character in that film, voiced by Will Arnette. That is

521
00:26:35,920 --> 00:26:39,880
Speaker 1: self portrait, his original composition, and I just think it's

522
00:26:39,920 --> 00:26:44,680
Speaker 1: so neatly, so hilariously punctures the self seriousness of Batman.

523
00:26:44,960 --> 00:26:47,400
Speaker 1: And I think our Nett and his voice work is brilliant.

524
00:26:47,440 --> 00:26:49,160
Speaker 1: So it's my number three, guys.

525
00:26:49,680 --> 00:26:52,320
Speaker 4: Yeah, if I thought about it, it would be my number one.

526
00:26:52,320 --> 00:26:53,800
Speaker 4: That's perfect choice.

527
00:26:54,600 --> 00:26:57,280
Speaker 6: They rolled out the trailer for the Lego Batman movie

528
00:26:57,320 --> 00:27:00,399
Speaker 6: the same weekend that Batman the Superman came out. It

529
00:27:00,480 --> 00:27:03,520
Speaker 6: kind of seems like an insurance policy, doesn't it. Maybe

530
00:27:03,119 --> 00:27:05,239
Speaker 6: they know what they're sitting on.

531
00:27:05,440 --> 00:27:10,160
Speaker 1: Yeah, that brings us to your top two choices, Chris, all.

532
00:27:10,200 --> 00:27:12,600
Speaker 6: Right, well, it was really tough to try to pick

533
00:27:12,600 --> 00:27:15,960
Speaker 6: a scene to represent the whole Nolan trilogy, and where

534
00:27:15,960 --> 00:27:18,320
Speaker 6: I landed kind of surprised even me. Now in this

535
00:27:18,480 --> 00:27:22,480
Speaker 6: retcon of the story. And I'll preface this by recommending

536
00:27:22,520 --> 00:27:25,120
Speaker 6: both of Glenn's books, the Superman Book and his Batman Book,

537
00:27:25,119 --> 00:27:28,600
Speaker 6: where you will get a nuanced and lengthy critique of

538
00:27:28,920 --> 00:27:31,960
Speaker 6: the ways in which each film incarnation of Batman or

539
00:27:31,960 --> 00:27:34,600
Speaker 6: Superman is separately heretical.

540
00:27:34,760 --> 00:27:38,120
Speaker 1: Nuanced, and lengthy. That might be the best backhanded compliment ever.

541
00:27:38,160 --> 00:27:42,640
Speaker 6: Golen. Well, I had the honor of proofreading his Batman book,

542
00:27:42,640 --> 00:27:44,479
Speaker 6: and I then chose to listen to it again on

543
00:27:44,560 --> 00:27:46,480
Speaker 6: audio to have him read it to me in his

544
00:27:46,560 --> 00:27:49,440
Speaker 6: own voice. So that's if that's not an endorsement or

545
00:27:49,480 --> 00:27:52,960
Speaker 6: a comment on my own sanity, I don't know exactly

546
00:27:53,200 --> 00:27:56,399
Speaker 6: it's an endorsement. No, So in this in Nolan and

547
00:27:56,480 --> 00:27:59,800
Speaker 6: David Goyer's ret coon of the Batman myth, it's actually

548
00:28:00,040 --> 00:28:03,480
Speaker 6: a Batman villain who sort of plants the seed that

549
00:28:03,560 --> 00:28:06,240
Speaker 6: you know, he doesn't set Bruce Wayne on this crusade,

550
00:28:06,560 --> 00:28:10,640
Speaker 6: but not only is it well. In the audiobook, Glenn

551
00:28:10,680 --> 00:28:14,879
Speaker 6: corrects Liam Neeson's pronunciation of his name, rache Alghoul. Glenn,

552
00:28:14,880 --> 00:28:17,399
Speaker 6: can you.

553
00:28:16,320 --> 00:28:19,840
Speaker 4: Yeah, I mean in a live action film, they say raz.

554
00:28:20,040 --> 00:28:22,439
Speaker 4: In the animated series they say Rache. My heart's with

555
00:28:22,480 --> 00:28:23,399
Speaker 4: the animated series.

556
00:28:23,560 --> 00:28:26,240
Speaker 6: Okay. So rach Algoul is played by Liam Neeson. He

557
00:28:26,280 --> 00:28:27,960
Speaker 6: is the leader of the League of Shadows. So in

558
00:28:27,960 --> 00:28:30,399
Speaker 6: this version of the story will provide Bruce Wayne with

559
00:28:30,480 --> 00:28:32,960
Speaker 6: his ninja training. But also in the scene that I'm

560
00:28:32,960 --> 00:28:37,000
Speaker 6: picking the very idea of using the tools of theatricality

561
00:28:37,320 --> 00:28:40,040
Speaker 6: and a frightening costume. He hasn't arrived at specifically using

562
00:28:40,080 --> 00:28:43,280
Speaker 6: a bat image yet, but you know, a theatrical approach

563
00:28:43,360 --> 00:28:45,320
Speaker 6: to make him appear to be more than a man

564
00:28:45,800 --> 00:28:47,800
Speaker 6: when he comes to him in his cell and in

565
00:28:48,160 --> 00:28:52,440
Speaker 6: whatever unspecified country it is where Bruce has been imprisoned

566
00:28:52,520 --> 00:28:54,400
Speaker 6: kind of on purpose so he can fight a lot

567
00:28:54,400 --> 00:28:58,040
Speaker 6: of bad guys and toughen himself up. And then rache

568
00:28:58,160 --> 00:29:01,040
Speaker 6: comes into his cell and says, you know what are

569
00:29:01,040 --> 00:29:02,720
Speaker 6: you doing. You're a rich kid. You could only be

570
00:29:02,800 --> 00:29:06,000
Speaker 6: here if you chose to be here, and says, you

571
00:29:06,280 --> 00:29:08,880
Speaker 6: can make yourself more than a man, and yes, what.

572
00:29:08,880 --> 00:29:12,720
Speaker 2: That is, legend astoyane.

573
00:29:13,600 --> 00:29:16,920
Speaker 6: Now, there was one critic who who wrote that the

574
00:29:16,920 --> 00:29:20,000
Speaker 6: film's dialogue quote could have been markedly improved had Nolan

575
00:29:20,080 --> 00:29:25,280
Speaker 6: simply instituted a moratorium on abstract nouns. Who was that plan?

576
00:29:25,800 --> 00:29:26,880
Speaker 4: That would be me, Chris?

577
00:29:27,160 --> 00:29:30,320
Speaker 6: Oh right, right, Okay, Well I chose this scene to

578
00:29:30,360 --> 00:29:32,560
Speaker 6: stand in for the entire Nolan trilogy because I feel

579
00:29:32,600 --> 00:29:35,480
Speaker 6: like this kind of sets up what becomes the climax

580
00:29:35,520 --> 00:29:38,480
Speaker 6: of the Dark Knight, where, in order to propagate a legend,

581
00:29:38,520 --> 00:29:42,280
Speaker 6: Bruce agrees to take the blame for Harvey Dent's crime

582
00:29:42,400 --> 00:29:44,719
Speaker 6: so that the people of Gotham can continue to believe

583
00:29:44,800 --> 00:29:49,200
Speaker 6: in the unsullied reputation and goodness that they think Harvey represents.

584
00:29:49,200 --> 00:29:52,000
Speaker 6: And of course that becomes the you know, the tragedy

585
00:29:52,040 --> 00:29:56,600
Speaker 6: that feeds into the third film, the climax. But yeah, legend,

586
00:29:56,680 --> 00:29:59,320
Speaker 6: mister Wayne, I feel like, like the seeds of every

587
00:29:59,320 --> 00:30:02,680
Speaker 6: place that this telling of the Batman myth goes start

588
00:30:03,040 --> 00:30:05,960
Speaker 6: right there, like maybe twenty minutes into Batman begin that's

589
00:30:05,960 --> 00:30:06,600
Speaker 6: my number.

590
00:30:06,360 --> 00:30:08,000
Speaker 1: Two good stuff.

591
00:30:08,280 --> 00:30:10,120
Speaker 4: I fear you've made a good point there, Chris, But

592
00:30:10,480 --> 00:30:12,440
Speaker 4: ultimately my anger outweighs.

593
00:30:11,960 --> 00:30:12,640
Speaker 3: My fear.

594
00:30:14,840 --> 00:30:16,160
Speaker 1: What about your number two? Glenn.

595
00:30:16,320 --> 00:30:19,240
Speaker 4: This is a lengthy sequence. It's not really a montage,

596
00:30:19,280 --> 00:30:22,160
Speaker 4: but it is from Superman the movie. It's basically Superman's

597
00:30:22,200 --> 00:30:25,520
Speaker 4: first night on the town, his first appearance, the stuff

598
00:30:25,560 --> 00:30:29,960
Speaker 4: he does. It comes almost an hour in to this movie.

599
00:30:30,240 --> 00:30:33,080
Speaker 4: This is the moment we finally get to the fireworks factory.

600
00:30:33,240 --> 00:30:37,120
Speaker 4: We've had the austere and empty Krypton for a long time.

601
00:30:37,160 --> 00:30:39,760
Speaker 4: Then we get the green and empty Kansas, then we

602
00:30:39,800 --> 00:30:43,120
Speaker 4: get the cold and empty Fortress of Solitude, and all

603
00:30:43,200 --> 00:30:45,440
Speaker 4: of that is set up, set up, set up, and

604
00:30:45,440 --> 00:30:49,280
Speaker 4: now finally we're in the dark and bustling metropolis. It's

605
00:30:49,400 --> 00:30:52,360
Speaker 4: teeming with life, and we see something that we haven't

606
00:30:52,400 --> 00:30:56,440
Speaker 4: We feel something in this movie that we haven't felt before. Urgency.

607
00:30:56,880 --> 00:31:00,200
Speaker 4: This city needs him. We see it because Lois Lane

608
00:31:00,240 --> 00:31:02,960
Speaker 4: is in trouble. She's falling off a building with a helicopter.

609
00:31:03,400 --> 00:31:06,520
Speaker 4: So it starts with him making a change in front

610
00:31:06,560 --> 00:31:11,000
Speaker 4: of a troubling character, pimp character who says the immortal line,

611
00:31:11,160 --> 00:31:16,239
Speaker 4: say Jim fit exactly. So there's I thought you were

612
00:31:16,240 --> 00:31:20,480
Speaker 4: going to say, start the world engine, novate the world engine. Nope,

613
00:31:21,600 --> 00:31:24,320
Speaker 4: the codex nope, nope, nope, so say Jim. Then the

614
00:31:24,320 --> 00:31:28,520
Speaker 4: helicopter rescue, then rescuing a cat in a tree, then

615
00:31:28,720 --> 00:31:32,000
Speaker 4: a cat, burglars climbing up a building, then some more

616
00:31:32,040 --> 00:31:34,440
Speaker 4: burglars on a boat for some reason, and finally he

617
00:31:34,560 --> 00:31:38,400
Speaker 4: ends the evening by saving Air Force One. That whole

618
00:31:38,480 --> 00:31:42,640
Speaker 4: moment leans heavily into the comedy, which we haven't really

619
00:31:42,640 --> 00:31:45,440
Speaker 4: gotten before. Like when we introduce The Daily Planet, we

620
00:31:45,480 --> 00:31:48,560
Speaker 4: get screwball comedy kind of a very fast pattern. But

621
00:31:49,080 --> 00:31:53,000
Speaker 4: up to then we've had very sweeping myth making, you know,

622
00:31:53,080 --> 00:31:57,560
Speaker 4: impressive score, impressive landscapes, and now we're finally in the

623
00:31:57,600 --> 00:32:00,920
Speaker 4: middle of a seventies comedy. It's it has a completely

624
00:32:00,960 --> 00:32:03,520
Speaker 4: different feel, and it's when the film really takes off

625
00:32:03,560 --> 00:32:05,640
Speaker 4: into that. That's what I'm going.

626
00:32:05,400 --> 00:32:07,120
Speaker 5: With that.

627
00:32:13,720 --> 00:32:18,160
Speaker 2: I've got you, You've got me, Who's got you?

628
00:32:19,000 --> 00:32:22,520
Speaker 1: My number two is going to be from Christopher Nolan

629
00:32:22,920 --> 00:32:25,440
Speaker 1: as well, but not Batman begins I'm going with the

630
00:32:25,520 --> 00:32:30,000
Speaker 1: Dark Knight, and it's the introduction scene to the Joker

631
00:32:30,040 --> 00:32:34,120
Speaker 1: when he meets with all the mob bosses and says

632
00:32:34,200 --> 00:32:37,080
Speaker 1: that we all have to unite and our goal is

633
00:32:37,120 --> 00:32:39,560
Speaker 1: to kill the Batman. Of course, this is also the

634
00:32:39,560 --> 00:32:43,840
Speaker 1: scene where we get his great magic trick with the pencil.

635
00:32:45,600 --> 00:32:47,680
Speaker 2: I thought my jokes were bad.

636
00:32:48,000 --> 00:32:49,680
Speaker 3: Give me one reason why I shouldn't have my boy

637
00:32:49,720 --> 00:32:50,720
Speaker 3: here pull your head off.

638
00:32:50,960 --> 00:32:57,960
Speaker 2: How about a magic track. I'm gonna make this pencil disappear.

639
00:33:03,320 --> 00:33:04,080
Speaker 2: It's gone.

640
00:33:05,600 --> 00:33:08,680
Speaker 1: This one stands out obviously because it's our introduction to

641
00:33:08,840 --> 00:33:12,280
Speaker 1: the Joker, and after all the talk about Heath Ledger

642
00:33:12,600 --> 00:33:14,920
Speaker 1: and whether or not he'd really be able to inhabit

643
00:33:14,960 --> 00:33:18,080
Speaker 1: this character, and I know everybody was dissecting the trailers,

644
00:33:18,080 --> 00:33:21,240
Speaker 1: to actually see him on screen as the Joker for

645
00:33:21,280 --> 00:33:25,360
Speaker 1: the first time was memorable. It was kind of breathtaking

646
00:33:25,400 --> 00:33:28,640
Speaker 1: in a way too, because he so inhabited that character

647
00:33:28,880 --> 00:33:34,640
Speaker 1: and I love that mixture of insanity and coolness. And

648
00:33:34,920 --> 00:33:38,840
Speaker 1: right away we get him showing that he means business,

649
00:33:38,880 --> 00:33:41,600
Speaker 1: where someone comes to threaten him and intimidate him physically,

650
00:33:41,880 --> 00:33:44,880
Speaker 1: and he does that bit with humor. He puts the

651
00:33:44,880 --> 00:33:47,280
Speaker 1: pencil on the table, and then something really gruesome happens

652
00:33:47,320 --> 00:33:50,720
Speaker 1: where he takes the guy out with a pretty swift move.

653
00:33:50,880 --> 00:33:52,880
Speaker 1: And then we realized later too, he's thought of everything.

654
00:33:52,920 --> 00:33:55,440
Speaker 1: He's totally prepared this guy who's walking into a room

655
00:33:55,480 --> 00:33:58,480
Speaker 1: full of bad guys with lots of henchmen around, and

656
00:33:58,520 --> 00:34:01,880
Speaker 1: he doesn't seem at be you look at him as

657
00:34:01,960 --> 00:34:03,840
Speaker 1: the characters do. They call him a clown. He doesn't

658
00:34:03,840 --> 00:34:06,600
Speaker 1: seem to be that intimidating himself. But of course he

659
00:34:06,640 --> 00:34:09,920
Speaker 1: thought of everything. He's prepared. He's got himself wired with bombs.

660
00:34:10,280 --> 00:34:13,319
Speaker 1: And again the humor of Ledger and the Joker comes

661
00:34:13,400 --> 00:34:17,120
Speaker 1: through there where they have that guy who is talking

662
00:34:17,120 --> 00:34:20,360
Speaker 1: to them sort of via remote on a TV screen,

663
00:34:20,400 --> 00:34:22,920
Speaker 1: and at one point the Joker just calls him television.

664
00:34:23,040 --> 00:34:25,719
Speaker 1: That's how he refers to the guy in the television.

665
00:34:25,760 --> 00:34:28,080
Speaker 1: And when another guy later says, you think you can

666
00:34:28,120 --> 00:34:29,840
Speaker 1: just steal from us and just walk away, and he

667
00:34:29,840 --> 00:34:31,919
Speaker 1: says yeah, and he doesn't say it in a way

668
00:34:31,960 --> 00:34:35,320
Speaker 1: that is at all a punchline. He just says yeah,

669
00:34:35,400 --> 00:34:38,560
Speaker 1: because that's what he believes, and no one is certainly

670
00:34:38,560 --> 00:34:41,640
Speaker 1: going to change his mind otherwise. So I think just

671
00:34:41,719 --> 00:34:45,440
Speaker 1: seeing Leger really for the first time as that character

672
00:34:45,560 --> 00:34:49,960
Speaker 1: and really feeling the weight of it and the grimness

673
00:34:49,960 --> 00:34:52,839
Speaker 1: of it, but also that mixture of humor. Again, like

674
00:34:52,880 --> 00:34:55,200
Speaker 1: I said, I think it was it was something certainly

675
00:34:55,280 --> 00:34:56,360
Speaker 1: something that sticks with me.

676
00:34:56,680 --> 00:34:59,160
Speaker 6: I think the fact that all of those assorted crooks

677
00:34:59,160 --> 00:35:00,880
Speaker 6: in that room with him, all coming at him with

678
00:35:00,920 --> 00:35:03,600
Speaker 6: this this macho swagger, you know, which is so utterly

679
00:35:03,640 --> 00:35:06,160
Speaker 6: irrelevant to the Joker, and he's just so bored by it.

680
00:35:06,440 --> 00:35:08,839
Speaker 6: True he does not respond in kind, makes him even

681
00:35:08,880 --> 00:35:10,400
Speaker 6: even scarier in that Yeah.

682
00:35:10,239 --> 00:35:13,200
Speaker 1: Yeah, you're so right. All right, guys. Number one your

683
00:35:13,280 --> 00:35:16,279
Speaker 1: favorite Superman or Batman movie moment?

684
00:35:16,400 --> 00:35:20,040
Speaker 6: Chris, all right, well, my number one comes from Superman Colon,

685
00:35:20,200 --> 00:35:23,840
Speaker 6: the movie from nineteen seventy eight. It's strange to remember now,

686
00:35:23,880 --> 00:35:27,040
Speaker 6: knowing where the superhero movie has ended up, that Richard

687
00:35:27,080 --> 00:35:30,560
Speaker 6: Donner's watchword on the set of this film was versimilitude.

688
00:35:30,880 --> 00:35:33,160
Speaker 6: You know. He thought that this story needed to be

689
00:35:33,200 --> 00:35:36,920
Speaker 6: treated with a greater degree of Maybe realism isn't the

690
00:35:36,960 --> 00:35:39,839
Speaker 6: word than it had been previously, you know. And now

691
00:35:40,080 --> 00:35:42,279
Speaker 6: we've kind of seen this taken to an extreme in

692
00:35:42,360 --> 00:35:44,800
Speaker 6: Batman Versus Superman and other movies where there's no trace

693
00:35:44,800 --> 00:35:47,920
Speaker 6: of lightness or whimsy. But that's really what what Donner

694
00:35:48,120 --> 00:35:51,120
Speaker 6: and the screenwriter who he brought in to rewrite, Mario

695
00:35:51,200 --> 00:35:53,640
Speaker 6: Puzzo and Newman and you know, the all the other

696
00:35:53,680 --> 00:35:56,560
Speaker 6: writers who had been corralled on this thing. We're going

697
00:35:56,640 --> 00:35:59,960
Speaker 6: for My scene is the balcony scene where Superman present

698
00:36:00,280 --> 00:36:05,800
Speaker 6: himself to Lois Lane on her suspiciously luxurious, large outdoor

699
00:36:05,840 --> 00:36:10,279
Speaker 6: balcony of her Metropolis skyscraper apartment because he suspects but

700
00:36:10,400 --> 00:36:13,280
Speaker 6: the Daily Planet readers must have some questions about me Lois.

701
00:36:13,560 --> 00:36:15,960
Speaker 6: You know, when we think about how creepy this could

702
00:36:15,960 --> 00:36:19,640
Speaker 6: have seemed, this almost infinitely powerful being is showing up

703
00:36:19,680 --> 00:36:23,240
Speaker 6: at her home, but there's not a hint of menace.

704
00:36:23,320 --> 00:36:24,960
Speaker 6: You know. Some of that is down to the writing.

705
00:36:25,040 --> 00:36:28,200
Speaker 6: Some of that is down to Christopher Reeve and Margot

706
00:36:28,280 --> 00:36:31,400
Speaker 6: Kidder's just note perfect performances in this scene when she

707
00:36:31,440 --> 00:36:34,000
Speaker 6: invites him to sit down and they have a kind

708
00:36:34,000 --> 00:36:38,680
Speaker 6: of interview slash flirtation session that is just loaded with

709
00:36:38,719 --> 00:36:42,000
Speaker 6: sexual tension. But you know, if you're less than twelve

710
00:36:42,040 --> 00:36:44,479
Speaker 6: years old or something, you might just find the scene

711
00:36:44,520 --> 00:36:47,160
Speaker 6: kind of boring and talkie. You know, nothing about it

712
00:36:47,200 --> 00:36:52,440
Speaker 6: feels leude or inappropriate. It's just the fun. And you know,

713
00:36:52,560 --> 00:36:56,480
Speaker 6: Lois is clearly sort of starstruck being in Superman's presence.

714
00:36:56,880 --> 00:36:58,800
Speaker 6: The way that that comes across and the dialogue is

715
00:36:58,880 --> 00:37:00,839
Speaker 6: very funny. How big are you? I mean, how tall

716
00:37:00,840 --> 00:37:02,560
Speaker 6: are you? Well?

717
00:37:03,920 --> 00:37:08,640
Speaker 2: I assume then that the the rest of your bodily

718
00:37:08,680 --> 00:37:10,520
Speaker 2: functions are normal.

719
00:37:11,640 --> 00:37:12,799
Speaker 3: Sorry, I beg your pardon.

720
00:37:14,160 --> 00:37:18,319
Speaker 2: Well, putting it delicately. Do you.

721
00:37:19,920 --> 00:37:20,160
Speaker 7: Eat?

722
00:37:21,680 --> 00:37:24,520
Speaker 2: Yes, yes, I do when I'm hungry.

723
00:37:25,239 --> 00:37:27,360
Speaker 7: You do, of course you do?

724
00:37:28,640 --> 00:37:28,960
Speaker 3: Well?

725
00:37:29,280 --> 00:37:33,120
Speaker 7: Well, then is it true that you can.

726
00:37:34,520 --> 00:37:38,360
Speaker 6: See through anything supposed to be? Donner told man quitch.

727
00:37:38,400 --> 00:37:40,239
Speaker 6: If we get the romance right, then all of the

728
00:37:40,280 --> 00:37:42,640
Speaker 6: other elements will fall into place. There are a lot

729
00:37:42,640 --> 00:37:44,960
Speaker 6: of things about Superman seventy eight that I don't like,

730
00:37:45,280 --> 00:37:47,680
Speaker 6: and that certainly you know, I found boring or too

731
00:37:47,719 --> 00:37:49,600
Speaker 6: comedic and stuff, especially when I was a little kid

732
00:37:49,640 --> 00:37:52,520
Speaker 6: seeing it for the first time. But I think this

733
00:37:52,560 --> 00:37:56,200
Speaker 6: scene is tonally perfect. This might be my favorite four

734
00:37:56,239 --> 00:37:59,640
Speaker 6: minutes from any superhero movie ever. It's light, it's fun,

735
00:37:59,640 --> 00:38:02,040
Speaker 6: and then of course it goes right into the can

736
00:38:02,080 --> 00:38:05,160
Speaker 6: You Read My Mind sort of weirdo light across the

737
00:38:05,640 --> 00:38:10,520
Speaker 6: Metropolis skyline recitation flash, musical number whatever it is. But

738
00:38:10,640 --> 00:38:13,960
Speaker 6: the whole prologue to that, the interview on Lois's balcony

739
00:38:14,040 --> 00:38:15,759
Speaker 6: is just perfect. Yeah, my number one.

740
00:38:15,840 --> 00:38:17,120
Speaker 1: It really is so good. And I think it was

741
00:38:17,160 --> 00:38:19,759
Speaker 1: a listener on Twitter who pointed out this scene too.

742
00:38:19,880 --> 00:38:21,760
Speaker 1: Is it either the beginning or the end of the scene.

743
00:38:21,760 --> 00:38:23,879
Speaker 1: I haven't watched it in a while where we get

744
00:38:23,920 --> 00:38:26,680
Speaker 1: kind of that great trick shot where like Superman exits

745
00:38:26,719 --> 00:38:28,560
Speaker 1: but then Clark shows up or vice versa.

746
00:38:28,880 --> 00:38:31,640
Speaker 6: Yeah, that's the end, and you know, he makes his

747
00:38:31,680 --> 00:38:35,320
Speaker 6: excuses for why she's laid and Lois replies, that's Clark. Nice,

748
00:38:36,120 --> 00:38:37,400
Speaker 6: there you go, and so good.

749
00:38:37,480 --> 00:38:39,960
Speaker 4: And it's so important. That's scene. It's so important because

750
00:38:40,120 --> 00:38:42,160
Speaker 4: that was the screen test, right that was the one

751
00:38:42,160 --> 00:38:44,839
Speaker 4: that they trusted all the actors on, and you can

752
00:38:44,880 --> 00:38:47,520
Speaker 4: actually see them on YouTube right now. I think many

753
00:38:47,560 --> 00:38:50,319
Speaker 4: people Stocker channing trying it out, many people going through

754
00:38:50,360 --> 00:38:53,200
Speaker 4: that scene. It is so important. It's where the chemistry

755
00:38:53,280 --> 00:38:56,400
Speaker 4: is or isn't. And you can see Christopher Reeve in

756
00:38:56,440 --> 00:38:59,760
Speaker 4: an early version of the suit sweating through his giant

757
00:38:59,800 --> 00:39:03,520
Speaker 4: pitch stains as tryingtone in the lines. It's a lot

758
00:39:03,520 --> 00:39:03,880
Speaker 4: of fun.

759
00:39:03,960 --> 00:39:06,480
Speaker 1: Yeah, well, let's see if you can top that one. Glenn,

760
00:39:06,520 --> 00:39:07,320
Speaker 1: you're number one.

761
00:39:07,680 --> 00:39:11,280
Speaker 4: Well, I mean, I ultimately it shames me that Batman's

762
00:39:11,320 --> 00:39:15,120
Speaker 4: sixty six, the Adam West film, doesn't make it onto

763
00:39:15,160 --> 00:39:18,120
Speaker 4: this list only because there's no moment from that movie.

764
00:39:18,160 --> 00:39:20,600
Speaker 4: The whole movie is great. I can't pull anything out

765
00:39:20,800 --> 00:39:23,040
Speaker 4: when you try to pull out. Some days, you can't

766
00:39:23,040 --> 00:39:24,919
Speaker 4: get rid of a bomb. When he's just running around

767
00:39:24,920 --> 00:39:26,239
Speaker 4: the dock trying to throw a bomb away, but he

768
00:39:26,320 --> 00:39:31,480
Speaker 4: keeps turning running into people with infants or ducks or nuns.

769
00:39:32,600 --> 00:39:33,799
Speaker 4: Then you have to kind of get rid of the

770
00:39:33,800 --> 00:39:35,759
Speaker 4: exploding shark. How can get rid of the exploding chart?

771
00:39:35,840 --> 00:39:39,680
Speaker 4: So I just wrote the whole movie off. It exists

772
00:39:39,800 --> 00:39:42,920
Speaker 4: in my heart, but not necessarily on this list. My

773
00:39:43,400 --> 00:39:47,920
Speaker 4: number one is the entire Krypton opening from Superman, pulling

774
00:39:48,160 --> 00:39:50,640
Speaker 4: the movie for a very specific reason that has to

775
00:39:50,640 --> 00:39:52,600
Speaker 4: do with the comics. I always have to explain why

776
00:39:52,640 --> 00:39:55,680
Speaker 4: I love that stuff so much to non comics people,

777
00:39:55,719 --> 00:39:58,440
Speaker 4: because it's hard for me to convey to them what

778
00:39:58,560 --> 00:40:02,200
Speaker 4: a bold and bald move it was on Donner's part

779
00:40:02,280 --> 00:40:05,440
Speaker 4: to make Krypton look like that, because the Krypton of

780
00:40:05,480 --> 00:40:09,360
Speaker 4: the comics hadn't changed its look since it was introduced

781
00:40:10,000 --> 00:40:12,320
Speaker 4: in nineteen thirty nine or so, I mean, well, actually

782
00:40:12,320 --> 00:40:16,600
Speaker 4: technically nineteen thirty eight. It was a retro future Tomorrowland

783
00:40:16,760 --> 00:40:20,440
Speaker 4: place where every building was a tall spire and everybody

784
00:40:20,520 --> 00:40:23,840
Speaker 4: went around with headbands and shoulder hoops and tights and tunics.

785
00:40:24,440 --> 00:40:28,719
Speaker 4: It hadn't changed in forty years. It was kitchy, but

786
00:40:28,840 --> 00:40:31,960
Speaker 4: there was no way it would work cinematically, none, because

787
00:40:32,000 --> 00:40:34,080
Speaker 4: it was as soon as you try to put that

788
00:40:34,200 --> 00:40:36,799
Speaker 4: krypton on screen, you end up with Plan nine for

789
00:40:36,880 --> 00:40:40,640
Speaker 4: matter space. So they went in a completely opposite direction.

790
00:40:41,080 --> 00:40:43,000
Speaker 4: They made it grand, they made it a steer, they

791
00:40:43,080 --> 00:40:47,480
Speaker 4: made it really portentous. Now, granted, once the film settles

792
00:40:47,480 --> 00:40:49,160
Speaker 4: in little bit you realize that everybody's kind of wearing

793
00:40:49,160 --> 00:40:52,319
Speaker 4: aluminum foil, that's the thing. But once you get past that,

794
00:40:53,160 --> 00:40:56,760
Speaker 4: you notice that the first words spoken in the film

795
00:40:56,800 --> 00:40:59,759
Speaker 4: are jorel In toning basically to the camera as he's

796
00:41:00,160 --> 00:41:03,120
Speaker 4: condemning the three criminals to the phantom zone. He says,

797
00:41:04,239 --> 00:41:08,680
Speaker 4: this is no fantasy, no careless product of wild imagination,

798
00:41:09,239 --> 00:41:12,760
Speaker 4: and it is impossible to read that as as anything

799
00:41:12,840 --> 00:41:16,160
Speaker 4: but Donner's mission statement for this film exactly as Chris said,

800
00:41:16,800 --> 00:41:19,960
Speaker 4: very similitude right. We want you to believe this stuff.

801
00:41:19,960 --> 00:41:23,560
Speaker 4: You will believe a man can fly. That's what he's

802
00:41:23,600 --> 00:41:26,480
Speaker 4: trying to do there, this kind of mythic myth making

803
00:41:26,520 --> 00:41:30,120
Speaker 4: that has no tunics, no shoulder hoops, no headbands, just

804
00:41:30,800 --> 00:41:35,080
Speaker 4: Marlon Brando, Marlon Goddamn Brando to sell the thing, even

805
00:41:35,080 --> 00:41:36,520
Speaker 4: if he has to do it by reading his lines

806
00:41:36,560 --> 00:41:37,880
Speaker 4: off of Susanna Yorke's forehead.

807
00:41:38,080 --> 00:41:39,840
Speaker 6: He's going to sell it to you, even if he

808
00:41:39,880 --> 00:41:42,279
Speaker 6: has to do it by refusing to pronounce Krypton the

809
00:41:42,280 --> 00:41:46,480
Speaker 6: way everyone else in the movie pronounces it. It's Krypton. Ye,

810
00:41:46,600 --> 00:41:48,280
Speaker 6: no one is going to correct Marlon Brando.

811
00:41:48,360 --> 00:41:50,640
Speaker 4: Are you gonna go up to Marlon Brando and say, hmmm,

812
00:41:51,440 --> 00:41:52,280
Speaker 4: can we do that again?

813
00:41:52,520 --> 00:41:56,880
Speaker 1: So that's my pick, Glenn. You are guilty of making

814
00:41:56,920 --> 00:41:59,560
Speaker 1: a great choice for number one. That is a fantastic

815
00:41:59,600 --> 00:42:04,560
Speaker 1: sequence and so surprising in many ways. And the fact

816
00:42:04,600 --> 00:42:06,719
Speaker 1: is it's actually a little bit creepy. I remember as

817
00:42:06,719 --> 00:42:09,279
Speaker 1: a kid seeing those those heads and the way they

818
00:42:09,360 --> 00:42:12,000
Speaker 1: spoke when they said that they were guilty, and finding

819
00:42:12,040 --> 00:42:14,480
Speaker 1: it all a little bit bizarre, but in a really

820
00:42:14,920 --> 00:42:15,919
Speaker 1: good way. Yeah.

821
00:42:16,200 --> 00:42:19,040
Speaker 6: Yeah, Krypton is not a utopia. Krypton is really presented

822
00:42:19,080 --> 00:42:22,080
Speaker 6: as a steer, icy kind of forbidding place.

823
00:42:22,200 --> 00:42:24,600
Speaker 1: Yeah. Well, it's been a long time since I've seen

824
00:42:25,160 --> 00:42:27,719
Speaker 1: Superman the movie. I'm not going with the Colon and

825
00:42:27,719 --> 00:42:29,920
Speaker 1: I'm not going with Ray shah Ghoul either. I'm sorry.

826
00:42:30,040 --> 00:42:33,400
Speaker 1: I'm sorry, Glenn, but I'm picking the scene from that

827
00:42:33,560 --> 00:42:38,680
Speaker 1: Richard Donner film where Superman saves Lois the helicopter rescue. Now, Glenn,

828
00:42:38,800 --> 00:42:40,680
Speaker 1: correct me if I'm wrong here, but this isn't part

829
00:42:40,719 --> 00:42:42,920
Speaker 1: of that First Night sequence you had at number two.

830
00:42:42,800 --> 00:42:43,640
Speaker 6: Right, it is?

831
00:42:43,680 --> 00:42:44,560
Speaker 1: Actually Okay, it is.

832
00:42:44,640 --> 00:42:47,120
Speaker 4: It's between say Jim and rescuing the cat.

833
00:42:47,000 --> 00:42:47,359
Speaker 6: In the tree.

834
00:42:47,440 --> 00:42:49,839
Speaker 1: Okay. Yeah, I wasn't sure, and I wasn't sure if

835
00:42:49,840 --> 00:42:52,839
Speaker 1: I missed that in your comments. But I'm just picking

836
00:42:52,880 --> 00:42:56,360
Speaker 1: out that particular part, and I think maybe just because

837
00:42:56,800 --> 00:42:59,319
Speaker 1: it is the first sequence that comes to mind for

838
00:42:59,400 --> 00:43:02,640
Speaker 1: me when I about Superman where we really see him

839
00:43:02,960 --> 00:43:05,239
Speaker 1: in kind of all of his glory there, not only

840
00:43:05,239 --> 00:43:08,560
Speaker 1: saving Lois, but the way he manages to do that.

841
00:43:08,680 --> 00:43:10,680
Speaker 1: And then of course we get that next step where

842
00:43:10,920 --> 00:43:13,960
Speaker 1: the helicopter falls as well, and he's just so casual

843
00:43:14,200 --> 00:43:17,640
Speaker 1: about the way he saves them, saves everybody involved in

844
00:43:17,640 --> 00:43:19,360
Speaker 1: that sequence. And I think what really stood out to

845
00:43:19,400 --> 00:43:23,800
Speaker 1: me watching it again today on YouTube is the grace

846
00:43:24,120 --> 00:43:26,640
Speaker 1: that Christopher Reeve has as Superman, right, like you think

847
00:43:26,640 --> 00:43:29,600
Speaker 1: about Cavil, and I like Cavell generally, but in keeping

848
00:43:29,640 --> 00:43:33,000
Speaker 1: with his character every time he takes off or lands,

849
00:43:33,120 --> 00:43:36,120
Speaker 1: it's with this huge thud, you know, it's like he's

850
00:43:36,200 --> 00:43:40,960
Speaker 1: angry even when he's flying right. And here you just

851
00:43:41,040 --> 00:43:43,440
Speaker 1: get at the end of that scene where he talks

852
00:43:43,480 --> 00:43:46,520
Speaker 1: with Lois there up on the helipad, and then we

853
00:43:46,560 --> 00:43:49,440
Speaker 1: get that great exchange where she says, who are you

854
00:43:49,560 --> 00:43:52,359
Speaker 1: and he says, simply a friend, and then he just

855
00:43:52,760 --> 00:43:55,759
Speaker 1: gracefully goes up into the sky and takes off like

856
00:43:55,960 --> 00:43:58,520
Speaker 1: he is someone who is relishing a little bit, the

857
00:43:58,600 --> 00:44:02,120
Speaker 1: ability to do what he can do and what only

858
00:44:02,160 --> 00:44:03,600
Speaker 1: he can do. And of course we do get the

859
00:44:03,600 --> 00:44:05,960
Speaker 1: great exchange there in the middle after he saves her,

860
00:44:06,000 --> 00:44:08,319
Speaker 1: where he says I've got you and she says you've

861
00:44:08,320 --> 00:44:11,400
Speaker 1: got me? Who's got you? So that humor, that playfulness,

862
00:44:11,400 --> 00:44:13,759
Speaker 1: that banter that you're absolutely right comes through throughout that

863
00:44:13,800 --> 00:44:16,919
Speaker 1: whole movie between Margot Kidder and Christopher Reeve. It's really

864
00:44:16,920 --> 00:44:20,760
Speaker 1: on display there in that first meet cute disaster scene.

865
00:44:20,800 --> 00:44:24,120
Speaker 1: So the helicopter rescue my top choice. And those are

866
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Speaker 1: our top five Superman Batman movie moments. We'd love to

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