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Speaker 1: Year Rapper Up podcast Eliot Wilson.

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Speaker 2: My name is beat At beat Out. What's up, baby,

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Speaker 2: I'm feeling fantastically.

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Speaker 3: How you doing.

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Speaker 1: I'm feeling good. I'm a little tired. I'm little exhausted.

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Speaker 3: Man.

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Speaker 1: I tried to be a rap superhero go to these events.

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Speaker 3: Man.

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Speaker 2: I went to Washington, D C. And then I went

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Speaker 2: to the Barclays on Sunday. I was exhausted.

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Speaker 1: Man, I'm too old for this rap shit. Sometimes, man,

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Speaker 1: mister Wilson goes to Washington.

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Speaker 2: Huh yeah, man, shout out, shout out a guy. You know,

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Speaker 2: I got Riggs Morales. I think you I think Riggs

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Speaker 2: is gonna run for president one day. You know what

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Speaker 2: I'm saying. Like he's he's a smooth brother.

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Speaker 3: Man.

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Speaker 2: It used to be my assistant music at Her Source

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Speaker 2: magazine in the nineties. He went on to be in

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Speaker 2: A and R's, you know, with Shady Records and eminem

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Speaker 2: for Decent and all that. He's been to Atlantic Records

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Speaker 2: there are and all that great stuff. But he's really

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Speaker 2: cool with the good folks at the Recording Academy as

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Speaker 2: they're trying to do progressive things, and they had a

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Speaker 2: Kamala Harris our Vice President's Hip Hop fifty celebration at

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Speaker 2: her house, like the backyard of her house, and thanks

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Speaker 2: to Riggs, I was invited.

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Speaker 1: Man, I had a good time. If Riggs isn't rough

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Speaker 1: for president, at least go for Boroughs Broad But it

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Speaker 1: was funny though I was mingling about me that now.

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Speaker 1: It's like I was like, okay, like who's performing at

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Speaker 1: this thing?

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Speaker 2: And I saw the photographer I think his name is

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Speaker 2: Vivid Dope, and I was like from DC, and I

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Speaker 2: was like, what's performing?

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Speaker 1: Is like, I think, jeez, Fat Joe, if you think

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Speaker 1: the artist ten is over this, I just started walking.

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Speaker 2: It was funny because Secret Service was everywhere, but they

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Speaker 2: was kind of like on the outskirts of us and

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Speaker 2: kind of let it all the hip hop people and

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Speaker 2: all the black folks like mingle without any real security, right,

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Speaker 2: so they kind of was like an outside perimeter. So

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Speaker 2: I literally just walked into the artists artist camp little area,

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Speaker 2: had no credentials, and what I saw Gez and Fat Joe.

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Speaker 1: It was just like a party. Everybody was in there.

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Speaker 1: Where you saw. I saw Karen Silvil. They was hiding

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Speaker 1: Little Wayne somewhere in there.

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Speaker 2: I couldn't get the Little Wayne, but I saw like

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Speaker 2: Gez Fat Joe, I gut Saba while A came through

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Speaker 2: like so it was like a rap wall Star.

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Speaker 1: Then the OG's Dougie Fresh Slick Rick.

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Speaker 3: It was crazy.

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Speaker 1: So you let the Secret Service, Well, you bore past

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Speaker 1: the Secret Service meeting, yeasted. I don't got real. If

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Speaker 1: I got reality, man didn't know. I came in peace.

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Speaker 1: Though I came in peace, I ain't gun on the

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Speaker 1: stage when MC life was there.

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Speaker 2: I got on the side of the stage or she

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Speaker 2: was rocking out doing her classics, and I met Tierra

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Speaker 2: Wack and she was wrapping the lyrics along. I had

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Speaker 2: a good time, but you know, I wasn't even there long.

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Speaker 2: I stayed so I wouldn't So I went and see

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Speaker 2: Gun at the Barclays that night. So there's only two

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Speaker 2: trains that are the exceler trains in DC Express, so

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Speaker 2: I had to get out of there by two o'clock

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Speaker 2: to catch that. So I was only there for like

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Speaker 2: an hour or so, and then I dipped and catch

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Speaker 2: the trade and go to the Brooklyn show Gun at

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Speaker 2: the Barclays.

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Speaker 1: Man, that was a Gunner show. It looked kind of

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Speaker 1: chunky in there. Yo. He sold it.

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Speaker 2: I was worried because when I first got there, like

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Speaker 2: the crowd got there a little late, so it looked

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Speaker 2: like it was is this going to be packed out?

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Speaker 2: Like I don't know what to expect, and like they

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Speaker 2: had the floor open, it wasn't no seating, so the

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Speaker 2: fans were lining up almost like an SLB show, like

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Speaker 2: a giant Soob show. But by the time Gunna hit

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Speaker 2: that stage, it was fucking sold out. He killed it, man,

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Speaker 2: sat out, ran to fifteen hundred or nothing. You know,

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Speaker 2: they bought that whole You know how great they are

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Speaker 2: are with this stuff They've done with Jay and everybody else.

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Speaker 2: And I saw Rants the leader of.

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Speaker 3: The whole movement.

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Speaker 1: So the transition on this set was great. He tore

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Speaker 1: it up. Man, I know we don't agree.

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Speaker 2: Heat out for Gunner still got album of the Year

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Speaker 2: in my book, Buddy.

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Speaker 3: You a good thing. I'm in literate because I don't

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Speaker 3: know that book.

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Speaker 1: Come on, man, that good album gifted the curse.

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Speaker 2: Nah, man, we still rock with that killer Mike over here. Man, Oh,

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Speaker 2: I feel bad too, because Mike put me in. Mike

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Speaker 2: do some footage in my a new video. He got

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Speaker 2: us some footage of us. We shot some content thing

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Speaker 2: and he used some of the video footage of us

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Speaker 2: kicking it in Georgia under this new video that with

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Speaker 2: the mainard vignette.

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Speaker 1: I think it's this song. So I feel bad man,

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Speaker 1: because Mike's showing love. But then I feel like that

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Speaker 1: Gunner album might be a little better.

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Speaker 2: Man.

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Speaker 1: I'm sorry, Mike. I'm sorry. Pick a side, Elliott, pick

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Speaker 1: a side my Atlanta brothers. Man, I can't. I can't

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Speaker 1: choose between them. Man, you all in the videos and

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Speaker 1: you rock with the Gunner album. I see how you is.

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Speaker 1: I'm trying, brother, I'm trying. Man, I'm trying that.

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Speaker 3: Man.

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Speaker 1: You know, I'll say some about the airtract though.

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Speaker 2: When you traveler, the food is nasty, beat out, the

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Speaker 2: food is nasty when these trades, man, you need to

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Speaker 2: try to eat that food, like I Meg Gigs said

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Speaker 2: Gigs Man Gigs needs to be on the UK Tourism board.

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Speaker 1: Man, Yeah, I want another place to Dave Man. I

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Speaker 1: was like, I want I want a man, I want

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Speaker 1: proper food. When I go to Leadon, I'm like, I

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Speaker 1: never get proper food. Man.

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Speaker 2: I've been watching Top Boy. Now I keep speaking with

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Speaker 2: this British accent. Keep thinking about jigs but shout out

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Speaker 2: a gigause. That was a really dope conversation with him.

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Speaker 3: Man.

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Speaker 1: And yeah, man, he's a funny guy, man, a cool guy.

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Speaker 3: Man, he's really I'm glad.

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Speaker 1: He blessed us with his appearancon. He's a zero tolerance guy,

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Speaker 1: zero tolerance man.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, there's no This other guy had a lot of tolerance. Man,

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Speaker 2: This guy Alan Hughes Man, this guy I guess today, Man,

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Speaker 2: a guy from Minister Society to now, Man, it's Tupac documentary.

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Speaker 1: Man, My light skinned brother puts in that work. Man,

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Speaker 1: amazing filmmaker. Right, he's been putting it for over thirty years.

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Speaker 2: It's like you forget that he directed the Brenda's Got

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Speaker 2: a Baby videos of early Tupac stuff from Minister Society,

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Speaker 2: their President's Book of Eli And now you know you

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Speaker 2: have to Tupac Dear Mama documentary nominated for the Emmy.

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Speaker 1: Guy ain't stopping.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, And I didn't know, like I think you have

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Speaker 2: discovered the Drake in the future of the Dream Cruise

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Speaker 2: involved with it.

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Speaker 1: I didn't know that they had. They played a part

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Speaker 1: in the whole Poka documentary that's out right now.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, Mama, Absolutely dream Creuse. Shout out to Drake and

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Speaker 2: Matt Babe, all those guys over there. Yeah, they put

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Speaker 2: it in their work man. And he also has the

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Speaker 2: Arnold Documentary to the executive produced on Netflix as well.

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Speaker 2: While that he was right, he does it all, man,

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Speaker 2: I think he's bugging out. When he was like, I

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Speaker 2: was eight years old when I saw a Minace, I

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Speaker 2: mean I was eight yo. Society was one of my

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Speaker 2: fa It still is one of my favorite movies. Hey,

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Speaker 2: many get a little dangerous. I sometimes, man, I gotta

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Speaker 2: be out of spell.

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Speaker 1: But now I just don't. I just think Allan has

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Speaker 1: stories for days.

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Speaker 3: Man.

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Speaker 2: We shouldn't spoil it, but we feel like we got

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Speaker 2: at least what two of three exclusive stories that he

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Speaker 2: never spoke about before. Like absolutely absolutely, I'm still blown

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Speaker 2: by what he said. Amazing, amazing, enemy man, a good guy,

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Speaker 2: my lfe skinned brother man.

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Speaker 1: We felt like we could do a whole other hour

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Speaker 1: with him. Man, so much hip hop history.

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Speaker 2: Next time, we gotta get Albert in the picture so

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Speaker 2: we could do it the Hughes Brothers for real. You know,

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Speaker 2: I heard Albert is like overseas, like he moved to

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Speaker 2: like Prague or somewhere like you don't even live in America.

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Speaker 1: Alix said, f America. Well left the country, man, I

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Speaker 1: saw that.

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Speaker 2: He said they did the Johnny Depp movie with the

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Speaker 2: he played Jack the Ripper, like they shot that over

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Speaker 2: in Prague, I think, And then Alan would ever want

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Speaker 2: to leave, So Allen moved to Prague, so he think

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Speaker 2: he lives overseas. Brother I mean brother, brother Albert, I

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Speaker 2: mean Albert, my bad Albert. He's actually working on the

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Speaker 2: John Whick prequel that's coming out soon, so I look

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Speaker 2: on him for that.

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Speaker 1: Those Hughes brothers.

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Speaker 2: And then the final thing about Allen he was just

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Speaker 2: so dope, is that he's not even stopping with this

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Speaker 2: Park thing, as he's told us, he's doing a fucking

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Speaker 2: snoop bio pick.

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Speaker 1: Yep, you know he got Marvin Gaye bio pick. It's insane,

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Speaker 1: but especially.

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Speaker 2: With the Snoop thing, like you know he did snoop

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Speaker 2: this park thing, he did the Fine Ones with Dre,

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Speaker 2: like he's covering all the West Coast.

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Speaker 1: Giants and hip hop. Man, it's crazy.

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Speaker 2: It's look like I don't even think he even realized

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Speaker 2: that until you mentioned it. So hopefully this right to

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Speaker 2: strike is a rap and you know we could get

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Speaker 2: these movies out sooner than later.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, Man, two.

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Speaker 2: Thousand and four, Man, no hope got that movie too,

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Speaker 2: what I got from the bullet So mister Samuel, we

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Speaker 2: got to get him on the show when this time. Man,

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Speaker 2: the brothers gotta tell us about that movie they got

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Speaker 2: coming out top of the year. But yeah, twenty twenty four,

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Speaker 2: I think he's gonna hick back up with the cinema style.

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Speaker 3: Man.

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Speaker 1: We gotta tell these stories for.

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Speaker 2: The culture, absolutely, but for right now you're telling this

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Speaker 2: story with Alan Hughes Man, so check it out absolutely,

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Speaker 2: Alan hughes on the Rap Raid All Podcast.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, Rap Rate Up Podcast.

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Speaker 2: Elliot Wilson just beat out, beat out.

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Speaker 3: What's up? Baby's gonna got next to a legend?

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Speaker 2: A legend, Man, don't make extraordinary, Alan Hughes Baby. And

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Speaker 2: you know I have to saw off the top of

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Speaker 2: my other fellow podcast our like skinned brother Matt Barnes.

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Speaker 2: He plugged me in with you, so I gotta shout

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Speaker 2: out man all the Smoke family. Yeah, it was dope,

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Speaker 2: dope interview with them. But this tupac man, I mean,

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Speaker 2: I mean nominated.

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Speaker 4: Congratulations, congratulations it's been a long, torturous road to Yeah.

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Speaker 2: I finally sat and watched the whole thing last night,

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Speaker 2: and I didn't know I was walking into, as you say,

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Speaker 2: like an emotional five hours, like yeah, yeah, what made

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Speaker 2: you go with that format and be so extend?

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Speaker 3: The estate and the family wanted to meet with me,

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Speaker 3: and I was like, on this Marvin Gay journey, getting

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Speaker 3: this Marvin Gay film ready, and so I had no

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Speaker 3: plans of doing Tupac, and I was apprehensive, not because

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Speaker 3: the obvious, because I gotten I thought I had gotten

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Speaker 3: over that, but just because I didn't want to do

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Speaker 3: another documentary after defying ones, which damn near sent me

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Speaker 3: to the hospital. It's just really exhaustive to do those things.

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Speaker 3: You get to know these people, they become your family.

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Speaker 3: It's very emotional, and you know you're trying to do

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Speaker 3: new things, and sometimes you don't get the rights to things.

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Speaker 3: You guys know that music or whatever. Anyway, so I

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Speaker 3: didn't really want to do another doctor, but I said,

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Speaker 3: give me a few days to think about it. And

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Speaker 3: when I thought about it, I go, Man, if I

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Speaker 3: could do a dual narrative with him and his mother

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Speaker 3: and making multiple parts, I'll do it, and they agreed,

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Speaker 3: and I made the grand mistake of doing it in

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Speaker 3: a beautiful way.

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Speaker 2: You're saying sometimes like give me with Godfather Too, right

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Speaker 2: to tell some of these dual stories.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I like that. I like the idea of like

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Speaker 3: trying to push the medium, the narrative medium. And I

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Speaker 3: always say, we're educated from left to right, we read

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Speaker 3: from left to right, but we're wired. I meet Elliott,

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Speaker 3: I meet you at the age I meet you, and

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Speaker 3: I learned about maybe your college years or when you're

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Speaker 3: five or what you know. So we're wired. We're wired

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Speaker 3: to be more nimble with the way we received narrative.

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Speaker 3: So Godfather Too is my favorite of the Godfather films,

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Speaker 3: about the sins of the father falling on the son

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Speaker 3: and what the weight of that is, and back and

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Speaker 3: forth and the themes, the central themes with the father

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Speaker 3: and with the present day son. I said, well, this

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Speaker 3: would be the you know, single mother that is the activist,

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Speaker 3: incredible woman that a Fannie is, and the former black

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Speaker 3: panther is. What were her thoughts and actions and how

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Speaker 3: the day affect her son and to learn about him

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Speaker 3: through her? I thought, and using that device like that

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Speaker 3: god Father two device, I thought would be interesting. We

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Speaker 3: all know you know Tupac. Did you know Phoenne? Unfortunately

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Speaker 3: I didn't. I never got to meet her. And when

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Speaker 3: I knew Tupac, I believe if any was in rehab

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Speaker 3: or in New York, it's back east. This is ninety one,

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Speaker 3: so she wasn't. He was. He was still living in

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Speaker 3: Oakland at the time, and so his mother wasn't around

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Speaker 3: at that point. Yeah, you talk about building these personal relationships.

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Speaker 2: One thing I didn't know about when I saw it

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Speaker 2: was this aunt he has and how important she is

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Speaker 2: to me to the story and the narrative.

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Speaker 3: Can you speak to well? First of all, Glow was

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Speaker 3: like some people are just natural storytellers, like just gifted storytellers,

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Speaker 3: and they and they go back to that tradition of

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Speaker 3: spoken word. She reminds me of Richard Pryor and cross

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Speaker 3: with some blues man, you know. And she's just her story.

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Speaker 3: She didn't have to do that before. She didn't have

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Speaker 3: to hold her family down like that. That was not

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Speaker 3: her role. Tupac was the star and then it was

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Speaker 3: a Fanny, and a Fanny was the star first. So

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Speaker 3: Glow was a mother of six and is a mother

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Speaker 3: of six that supported them and was the aunt and

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Speaker 3: was the center, you know, was the the gravity of

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Speaker 3: the family and where everyone congregated. So but she didn't

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Speaker 3: play the role that she played for us in Dear Mama.

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Speaker 3: She had to step into that role. And you hear

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Speaker 3: her talk about in the last episode, ain't that something

284
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Speaker 3: they had to pass so we could be here to

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Speaker 3: tell their story? And how beautiful she tells her story

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Speaker 3: is like it's a testament to someone stepping into their greatness.

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Speaker 3: Because I told Glow, I said, you know, it may

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Speaker 3: not have occurred to you, Glow, but you're an artist,

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Speaker 3: but maybe you never got to be because you had to,

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Speaker 3: you know, take care of these children in this family

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Speaker 3: and be that rock for people. But the way she

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Speaker 3: tells how gifted she is a storytelling I go you

293
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Speaker 3: and she wasn't nervous either. Here's you turn the camera

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Speaker 3: on like a you know, a non industry person and

295
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Speaker 3: they locked it in a minute up and she looked

296
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Speaker 3: at me, she goes, you nervous, baby. Right before we

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Speaker 3: started rolling, I said, am I nervous? Did she made

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Speaker 3: me nervous? She wasn't nervous ready.

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Speaker 4: She pats the central part in the doc was anyone

300
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Speaker 4: that was reluctant to speak in the movie.

301
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Speaker 3: A lot of people, not as many as say, ten

302
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Speaker 3: years ago. So we had the good fortune of people

303
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Speaker 3: now with time and maybe a certain amount of healing,

304
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Speaker 3: because that thing, when when a guy like that goes

305
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Speaker 3: out the way he went out, it leaves bodies like

306
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Speaker 3: people just shook and traumatized, and you know, emotionally, you

307
00:12:29,280 --> 00:12:31,440
Speaker 3: lost your friend, you lost your loved one, your brother,

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Speaker 3: your uncle, whatever it may be, your fiance. In the

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Speaker 3: case of Kadata Jones and she, I was met with her.

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Speaker 3: She blessed the project and signed off on photos, but

311
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Speaker 3: she's very private and I really wanted to interview her.

312
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Speaker 3: And Jada was another one. Jada was close, but you know,

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Speaker 3: Jada's Jada, so you know, you know, because I was

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Speaker 3: hoping that I was hoping to more tell the story

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Speaker 3: of Tupac through the women and life, and unfortunately that

316
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Speaker 3: didn't happen. But I got this magical touch with Glow, you.

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Speaker 1: Know, right.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, today actually marks twenty seven years that Tupac was

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Speaker 4: shot in Las Vegas.

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Speaker 3: That day September when he got shot himself the seventh.

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Speaker 3: You guys, we didn't plan this, did we know.

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Speaker 2: The fact that he told me last night, and I

323
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Speaker 2: was like, wow, like, this is just the fact that

324
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Speaker 2: I didn't know that driving over here is crazy.

325
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Speaker 3: Do you remember where you were when you heard the news? No?

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Speaker 3: I blacked out on that one. You know. It's like,

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Speaker 3: I remember where I was when I heard the news

328
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Speaker 3: of Biggie. I'm driving my five year old son to school,

329
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Speaker 3: and I just remember that moment because my five year

330
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Speaker 3: old goes, Daddy, why did they kill Bickie? Why? It's

331
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Speaker 3: the It was on the radio. But with Tupac for

332
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Speaker 3: some reason, with all that personal history, and also I

333
00:13:45,960 --> 00:13:48,640
Speaker 3: also felt that was going to happen. If you knew him,

334
00:13:48,640 --> 00:13:51,400
Speaker 3: you felt like people talk about it. He talked about it.

335
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Speaker 3: He talked about it. I don't remember him talking about

336
00:13:53,840 --> 00:13:57,200
Speaker 3: it except for the music. But so I blacked out.

337
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Speaker 3: I don't remember where I was. You remember where you were? Yeah,

338
00:14:01,120 --> 00:14:03,640
Speaker 3: I was home. I just remember he was.

339
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Speaker 4: I was home, and I remember turning on the radio

340
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Speaker 4: and hearing about it. I was like, wow, this is

341
00:14:08,679 --> 00:14:09,600
Speaker 4: this is kind of crazy.

342
00:14:09,840 --> 00:14:11,840
Speaker 3: Yeah. Yeah, but we had heard in the radio.

343
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Speaker 2: But I think a lot of us in New York,

344
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Speaker 2: at least in my community, we didn't think he was

345
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Speaker 2: going to die because he seemed almost invincible. He shot

346
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Speaker 2: the cops at Atlanta, like you know, Pot got into it,

347
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Speaker 2: Pot got shot at Like, yeah, shot before.

348
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Speaker 3: He's going to survive. We didn't necessarily think he was

349
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Speaker 3: going to pass away.

350
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Speaker 2: So when he died six or seven days later, that's

351
00:14:29,400 --> 00:14:32,080
Speaker 2: when it was everything that was like shocking again, like

352
00:14:32,120 --> 00:14:33,760
Speaker 2: it was trouble that happened, but it was almost like

353
00:14:33,800 --> 00:14:36,280
Speaker 2: another thing had to happen for it to be a reality,

354
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Speaker 2: Like we just didn't think.

355
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Speaker 3: No, you're right, he was in his own time, he

356
00:14:40,600 --> 00:14:43,960
Speaker 3: was mythical exactly. Yep, you know, and because the quad

357
00:14:44,000 --> 00:14:48,440
Speaker 3: studio thing. I said this a few weeks ago. Also

358
00:14:48,640 --> 00:14:51,960
Speaker 3: at that time, it wasn't a reality to us that

359
00:14:52,080 --> 00:14:53,840
Speaker 3: one of our stars could be taken from him because

360
00:14:53,840 --> 00:14:55,000
Speaker 3: it had never happened before.

361
00:14:55,120 --> 00:14:56,800
Speaker 2: Only with someone you were friends would I want to

362
00:14:56,800 --> 00:14:58,960
Speaker 2: talk about easy? That was kind of the first time

363
00:14:58,960 --> 00:15:02,000
Speaker 2: when we kind of lost like this superstar like and

364
00:15:02,040 --> 00:15:04,920
Speaker 2: it just seemed mysterious and like, oh my god.

365
00:15:04,800 --> 00:15:06,960
Speaker 3: You think Skylar Rock kind of said that he was

366
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Speaker 3: the first shot.

367
00:15:07,960 --> 00:15:10,120
Speaker 2: Skylar Rock, he was the he was the first prominent

368
00:15:10,120 --> 00:15:11,000
Speaker 2: person in hip hop to.

369
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Speaker 3: Be that's murdered and it but still a hip hop

370
00:15:13,920 --> 00:15:17,000
Speaker 3: at the time. You had to know about b DP

371
00:15:17,440 --> 00:15:19,720
Speaker 3: and Boogiey Down productions and if you didn't know, then

372
00:15:19,720 --> 00:15:22,680
Speaker 3: you weren't a real true hip hop and you would

373
00:15:22,720 --> 00:15:25,160
Speaker 3: know about Scholar, but the world at large didn't really

374
00:15:25,320 --> 00:15:29,760
Speaker 3: you know, but it shook the first album, That's right

375
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Speaker 3: and Easy. In the case of Easy, my my first

376
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Speaker 3: real mentor at the same I think I met Tupac

377
00:15:36,000 --> 00:15:39,600
Speaker 3: later that year. I remember where I was. I was

378
00:15:39,640 --> 00:15:43,760
Speaker 3: at El Toedo in Beverly Hills, right down the street

379
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Speaker 3: from William Morris's Now Miss Shallows with Chris Tucker when

380
00:15:47,720 --> 00:15:50,440
Speaker 3: I found out about Easy. Now that one I remember, yeah,

381
00:15:50,560 --> 00:15:55,600
Speaker 3: because that age thing was getting shot. We know about that,

382
00:15:55,760 --> 00:15:57,640
Speaker 3: you know, like and there's certain people in the community

383
00:15:57,640 --> 00:16:00,240
Speaker 3: to know about loved ones passing of age, but ever

384
00:16:00,400 --> 00:16:06,320
Speaker 3: like this ultra you know, heterosexual toxic maskuling dying that

385
00:16:06,400 --> 00:16:08,800
Speaker 3: hadn't had That was shocking. In the case of Easy,

386
00:16:09,160 --> 00:16:12,120
Speaker 3: how did you Easy? For us? Connect? I was me

387
00:16:12,160 --> 00:16:14,680
Speaker 3: and my brother were trying to break into the film business.

388
00:16:14,720 --> 00:16:16,720
Speaker 3: We did I have the script for a minute yet Nope,

389
00:16:17,440 --> 00:16:19,800
Speaker 3: And we were in a set of always into something.

390
00:16:19,880 --> 00:16:23,720
Speaker 3: The second single on the Niggas for Life album and

391
00:16:23,760 --> 00:16:26,880
Speaker 3: it was late. We had somehow worked our way into

392
00:16:26,920 --> 00:16:30,360
Speaker 3: being some extras that get shot because we knew how

393
00:16:30,400 --> 00:16:33,640
Speaker 3: to take squib hits and well you're in the video

394
00:16:33,680 --> 00:16:36,840
Speaker 3: gets Oh my brother got shotgunned from Easy like blasted

395
00:16:36,840 --> 00:16:40,040
Speaker 3: off the speed. I don't am I am I in

396
00:16:40,040 --> 00:16:42,560
Speaker 3: that music video. We did, we did, we did some

397
00:16:42,600 --> 00:16:44,880
Speaker 3: stuff in there, but I saw it was late. Everyone

398
00:16:44,960 --> 00:16:47,800
Speaker 3: was drunk the DLC Dre. Everyone was drunk. And I

399
00:16:47,800 --> 00:16:50,520
Speaker 3: don't know what possessed me to walk over to doctor Dre.

400
00:16:50,640 --> 00:16:52,440
Speaker 3: I just felt like that was the guy because I

401
00:16:52,440 --> 00:16:55,720
Speaker 3: saw these cameras, these news cameras, and I found that

402
00:16:55,800 --> 00:16:57,840
Speaker 3: someone told me to Easy Eat owns those cameras that

403
00:16:57,880 --> 00:17:00,400
Speaker 3: those guys got. So I walked over to doctor said

404
00:17:00,400 --> 00:17:03,840
Speaker 3: can you introduce me to Easye. He introduced us, and

405
00:17:03,880 --> 00:17:05,880
Speaker 3: he goes, all right, man, yeah, write your number down,

406
00:17:05,920 --> 00:17:10,320
Speaker 3: you know. And by the way, so pause Andre. I

407
00:17:10,359 --> 00:17:14,680
Speaker 3: didn't me Andre are brothers? Now? I met him then,

408
00:17:14,720 --> 00:17:18,160
Speaker 3: but for two years I didn't. Me and Dre didn't

409
00:17:18,240 --> 00:17:20,520
Speaker 3: know each other. It was easy Easy called us the

410
00:17:20,560 --> 00:17:23,160
Speaker 3: next morning, Hey man, you know, why don't you guys

411
00:17:23,200 --> 00:17:25,080
Speaker 3: come out to Norwalk he had a house off the four.

412
00:17:25,440 --> 00:17:27,359
Speaker 3: I can't remember what freeway that is now six, so

413
00:17:27,640 --> 00:17:32,000
Speaker 3: five I'm fucked up. And that whole summer we were

414
00:17:32,040 --> 00:17:34,680
Speaker 3: with Easy. Uh he pick us up in this dually

415
00:17:34,800 --> 00:17:38,000
Speaker 3: or is a fifty BMW. We were nineteen. This was

416
00:17:38,040 --> 00:17:40,200
Speaker 3: the summer the Boys in the Hook came out. Two

417
00:17:40,200 --> 00:17:45,360
Speaker 3: things are happening while while while mainly I'm with Easy

418
00:17:45,359 --> 00:17:48,400
Speaker 3: because my brother would get impatient when we wouldn't get paid.

419
00:17:48,400 --> 00:17:51,119
Speaker 3: He was like, I'm out my brother hum for like

420
00:17:51,119 --> 00:17:53,000
Speaker 3: three weeks, maybe a month, and then I stuck the

421
00:17:53,000 --> 00:17:55,280
Speaker 3: whole summer with Easy and we shot some stuff with

422
00:17:55,359 --> 00:17:58,520
Speaker 3: n WA back then. But what was happened simultaneously with

423
00:17:59,119 --> 00:18:02,320
Speaker 3: Easy was we were hearing in the office about this

424
00:18:02,359 --> 00:18:06,160
Speaker 3: guy named Shug and something's funny with Dre. So Drey

425
00:18:06,320 --> 00:18:08,479
Speaker 3: was showing up because that album was the first I

426
00:18:08,480 --> 00:18:12,000
Speaker 3: believe hip hop album rap album to be inter number

427
00:18:12,080 --> 00:18:14,920
Speaker 3: one on the podcast Sounds being a SoundScan area. Yeah,

428
00:18:15,560 --> 00:18:17,840
Speaker 3: So they were doing these photo shoots and we were

429
00:18:17,840 --> 00:18:21,480
Speaker 3: there doing filming the photo shoots, and Dre would show

430
00:18:21,520 --> 00:18:23,879
Speaker 3: up at the last minute and Dre would leave right away.

431
00:18:24,080 --> 00:18:26,560
Speaker 3: So Dre was already there was something funny going on

432
00:18:27,840 --> 00:18:31,080
Speaker 3: CBE think about this. Boys in the Hood came out

433
00:18:31,119 --> 00:18:34,480
Speaker 3: that summer, and I remember being in Hollywood Boulevard would

434
00:18:34,480 --> 00:18:36,800
Speaker 3: Easy and Wren and they were they were having a

435
00:18:36,880 --> 00:18:39,479
Speaker 3: hard time with the success of it. Yeah, he had

436
00:18:39,560 --> 00:18:42,840
Speaker 3: left exactly, and he was blowing up. He had how

437
00:18:42,840 --> 00:18:46,119
Speaker 3: to survive a South central single America's most wanted had

438
00:18:46,160 --> 00:18:52,520
Speaker 3: already dropped kill. That EP was the ship, so it

439
00:18:52,640 --> 00:18:55,560
Speaker 3: was the hottest thing in hip hope and Drey was

440
00:18:55,560 --> 00:18:58,320
Speaker 3: out the door. So I'm what Easy as he's losing time,

441
00:18:58,680 --> 00:19:00,359
Speaker 3: And I didn't realize one day we went to his

442
00:19:00,400 --> 00:19:03,080
Speaker 3: house and he's getting the facts from some attorneys and

443
00:19:03,119 --> 00:19:06,320
Speaker 3: the thing that was wrongly depicted in the straight at

444
00:19:06,359 --> 00:19:10,120
Speaker 3: Compton film that he got the beatdown in the studio

445
00:19:10,600 --> 00:19:12,960
Speaker 3: that had just happened, but it wasn't a beatdown, and

446
00:19:13,000 --> 00:19:16,399
Speaker 3: he's getting he's trying to sue sug and the stuff

447
00:19:16,480 --> 00:19:19,800
Speaker 3: was coming through. But he had just went to the studio,

448
00:19:19,880 --> 00:19:22,720
Speaker 3: I guess a week prior, two weeks prior, and got

449
00:19:22,800 --> 00:19:25,960
Speaker 3: muscled into signing over the contract. So we were around

450
00:19:25,960 --> 00:19:27,959
Speaker 3: all that stuff and didn't know that's what was going on.

451
00:19:28,400 --> 00:19:31,199
Speaker 4: Another hot autist that you associated with is Drake he

452
00:19:31,240 --> 00:19:32,760
Speaker 4: gave you props recently on Twitter.

453
00:19:32,840 --> 00:19:34,680
Speaker 3: Oh yeah, yeah, yeah. How did he get on board

454
00:19:34,720 --> 00:19:38,560
Speaker 3: with the film? Well, here's a him future and a

455
00:19:38,720 --> 00:19:40,879
Speaker 3: producing partner of mine, friend of mine who works with

456
00:19:40,960 --> 00:19:45,000
Speaker 3: them now, Peter Nelson. Somewhere over a year or so ago,

457
00:19:45,119 --> 00:19:48,359
Speaker 3: we needed some help, you know, financially, we need some help,

458
00:19:48,440 --> 00:19:53,120
Speaker 3: like you know, we also wanted like a company that understood,

459
00:19:53,240 --> 00:19:55,159
Speaker 3: you know, like what we were doing to come and

460
00:19:55,200 --> 00:19:58,760
Speaker 3: just support us and help out in some of the

461
00:19:58,800 --> 00:20:01,640
Speaker 3: strategic marketing and stuff like that. And they were kind

462
00:20:01,760 --> 00:20:05,160
Speaker 3: enough to come on somewhere in the process of making it.

463
00:20:05,560 --> 00:20:11,400
Speaker 3: And because I was over budget too, overscheduled over budget,

464
00:20:11,760 --> 00:20:14,440
Speaker 3: so uh and there's several projects we've been talking about

465
00:20:14,480 --> 00:20:17,320
Speaker 3: doing together, you know, a film project. And I like

466
00:20:17,359 --> 00:20:20,560
Speaker 3: what Dream Crew is doing. It's not like typical all

467
00:20:20,760 --> 00:20:25,399
Speaker 3: just you know, hip hop centric stuff. It's eclectic. So

468
00:20:25,440 --> 00:20:27,280
Speaker 3: they're real smart about what they're doing over there. So

469
00:20:27,280 --> 00:20:29,560
Speaker 3: I wanted to get to know them. You know.

470
00:20:30,520 --> 00:20:32,679
Speaker 2: What's it like to because you think about somebody passes,

471
00:20:32,720 --> 00:20:34,680
Speaker 2: like the estate of this person, it seems to be

472
00:20:34,920 --> 00:20:36,600
Speaker 2: very intimidating, Like how do you deal with the estate

473
00:20:36,640 --> 00:20:37,920
Speaker 2: of this of this person?

474
00:20:37,960 --> 00:20:39,840
Speaker 3: Is don't look a living like what's that process like

475
00:20:39,840 --> 00:20:42,840
Speaker 3: like dealing with But depending on you know, depending on

476
00:20:42,880 --> 00:20:45,320
Speaker 3: the estate, I think it's probably always going to be

477
00:20:45,359 --> 00:20:48,000
Speaker 3: somewhat of a nightmare. You know, in this case, I

478
00:20:48,000 --> 00:20:50,280
Speaker 3: wouldn't say it was a nightmare at all because of Glow.

479
00:20:50,840 --> 00:20:53,440
Speaker 3: And and then you have other people at this state

480
00:20:53,520 --> 00:20:55,280
Speaker 3: that you know on the on the on the business

481
00:20:55,280 --> 00:20:59,399
Speaker 3: side that Fanny had left it that way, and because

482
00:20:59,440 --> 00:21:01,320
Speaker 3: I and I know I know all of them, I

483
00:21:01,359 --> 00:21:04,119
Speaker 3: have history with all the principles on the on the

484
00:21:04,119 --> 00:21:07,840
Speaker 3: business side. But it wasn't until I met Glow where

485
00:21:07,920 --> 00:21:12,359
Speaker 3: I was like, all right, this is she's all hard,

486
00:21:12,720 --> 00:21:16,080
Speaker 3: she's sharp woman too, but her heart is always in

487
00:21:16,080 --> 00:21:19,040
Speaker 3: the right place, even if she's struggling with something to

488
00:21:19,640 --> 00:21:22,160
Speaker 3: figure out whether it's the right or wrong thing. Because

489
00:21:22,160 --> 00:21:24,960
Speaker 3: I know Tom Wally, who was who signed Tupac and

490
00:21:25,000 --> 00:21:27,879
Speaker 3: he's the executor of the estate. I got to know Molly,

491
00:21:29,280 --> 00:21:32,600
Speaker 3: who works everything. It's like the gatekeeper there. And there's

492
00:21:32,640 --> 00:21:35,119
Speaker 3: other individuals in the family that really are prominent in

493
00:21:35,160 --> 00:21:37,639
Speaker 3: the in the so it's a you know, it's it's

494
00:21:37,680 --> 00:21:41,400
Speaker 3: it's family and it's executors. And it can't be difficult

495
00:21:41,400 --> 00:21:43,199
Speaker 3: because you're trying to do things in the case of

496
00:21:43,240 --> 00:21:45,000
Speaker 3: Dear Mama, where I'm like, all right, let me take

497
00:21:45,240 --> 00:21:47,760
Speaker 3: me get the A cappellas so I can put him

498
00:21:47,800 --> 00:21:51,879
Speaker 3: out to this and set him to score, so you know,

499
00:21:52,119 --> 00:21:55,280
Speaker 3: Grandma can understand this basically, right, because I know hip

500
00:21:55,320 --> 00:21:58,520
Speaker 3: hop as much as we love hip hop, sometimes when

501
00:21:58,520 --> 00:22:00,679
Speaker 3: you when you're just rocking with the B you're not

502
00:22:00,720 --> 00:22:03,280
Speaker 3: going to get your your parents or your grandmother or

503
00:22:03,280 --> 00:22:07,280
Speaker 3: someone that's foreigned a hip hop to understand the poetry.

504
00:22:07,760 --> 00:22:10,480
Speaker 3: So they were they weren't. They were challenging when it

505
00:22:10,520 --> 00:22:12,119
Speaker 3: came to that, like why do you want this? How

506
00:22:12,119 --> 00:22:13,600
Speaker 3: do you want you know, if we give you these

507
00:22:14,080 --> 00:22:16,520
Speaker 3: all everyone's out signed in das b or you know

508
00:22:16,600 --> 00:22:18,160
Speaker 3: that they're not going to let it leak out because

509
00:22:18,320 --> 00:22:22,359
Speaker 3: of DJ. You know all wanted them exclusives. Excuse me,

510
00:22:24,080 --> 00:22:26,199
Speaker 3: you want to be DJ? Right? Oh my god, for

511
00:22:26,280 --> 00:22:28,640
Speaker 3: sure all my life. But that's one of my favorite things.

512
00:22:28,680 --> 00:22:30,600
Speaker 2: I think your usage of music, like that creative way

513
00:22:30,600 --> 00:22:32,960
Speaker 2: that you're you know, using the alcapells are filtering out.

514
00:22:32,880 --> 00:22:34,240
Speaker 3: The backgrounds and changing production.

515
00:22:34,440 --> 00:22:36,520
Speaker 2: Like I think that's some of my favorite parts about

516
00:22:36,560 --> 00:22:37,320
Speaker 2: the project.

517
00:22:37,720 --> 00:22:39,840
Speaker 3: You know, it's something I take a lot of pride

518
00:22:39,880 --> 00:22:43,160
Speaker 3: in because you know, it's like love making or dancing

519
00:22:43,480 --> 00:22:46,199
Speaker 3: or kissing within the first two seconds. You know, if

520
00:22:46,200 --> 00:22:50,560
Speaker 3: you're in bad hands when you go to wherever you

521
00:22:50,640 --> 00:22:53,000
Speaker 3: go and there's a DJ and they're playing old these

522
00:22:53,040 --> 00:22:56,000
Speaker 3: say say it's all like sixty seventy stuff, and nowadays

523
00:22:56,000 --> 00:22:57,959
Speaker 3: these guys just play five second. I'm like, what kind

524
00:22:58,000 --> 00:23:00,479
Speaker 3: of eighty eight spe is this? Man? I don't want

525
00:23:00,480 --> 00:23:02,720
Speaker 3: to be nowhere where you're just cutting like right, So

526
00:23:02,760 --> 00:23:05,679
Speaker 3: there's like an art to like presenting it. If you've

527
00:23:05,680 --> 00:23:07,720
Speaker 3: got to taking Al Green treck and you got to

528
00:23:07,720 --> 00:23:10,080
Speaker 3: put a win wag on it, like, there's an art

529
00:23:10,119 --> 00:23:12,560
Speaker 3: to doing it where you're if you're a Dieard Al

530
00:23:12,640 --> 00:23:15,240
Speaker 3: Green fan, that you loved what this DJ is doing

531
00:23:16,600 --> 00:23:20,000
Speaker 3: essence and not destroying the thing. You know, it's a

532
00:23:20,080 --> 00:23:23,320
Speaker 3: it's a it's a it's a it's a precious thing.

533
00:23:23,400 --> 00:23:23,919
Speaker 3: I think, you know.

534
00:23:24,119 --> 00:23:26,680
Speaker 4: But the doc does feel very definitive too. I don't

535
00:23:26,680 --> 00:23:29,400
Speaker 4: think you could come out with another TUPAC documentary after

536
00:23:29,440 --> 00:23:29,919
Speaker 4: this one.

537
00:23:30,080 --> 00:23:32,919
Speaker 3: That would be nice. There's so many you.

538
00:23:32,920 --> 00:23:35,359
Speaker 2: Know, to speak to that did you feel like, wow,

539
00:23:35,400 --> 00:23:38,080
Speaker 2: this guy's been so much on this guy like besides

540
00:23:38,119 --> 00:23:41,639
Speaker 2: the dude narrative idea, what was your thoughts of, like

541
00:23:42,240 --> 00:23:44,600
Speaker 2: how important it was to get footage nobody had never seen,

542
00:23:44,760 --> 00:23:47,080
Speaker 2: or just the idea of how to tell the story

543
00:23:47,320 --> 00:23:49,399
Speaker 2: in a way that people may not have known, all

544
00:23:49,400 --> 00:23:50,119
Speaker 2: these different.

545
00:23:49,840 --> 00:23:52,879
Speaker 3: Parts of it. That's critical, all that stuff, you know,

546
00:23:52,960 --> 00:23:56,920
Speaker 3: getting unseen footage, unseen tracks, even those moments you heard

547
00:23:56,920 --> 00:23:59,760
Speaker 3: at the beginning where he's in the vocal booth and

548
00:23:59,800 --> 00:24:04,200
Speaker 3: he's in your cage full of the raide. You more

549
00:24:04,280 --> 00:24:06,880
Speaker 3: than my mama, You're my homie. He's mumbling a whole

550
00:24:06,920 --> 00:24:09,800
Speaker 3: other verse that you don't hear in Dear Mama. On

551
00:24:09,880 --> 00:24:12,040
Speaker 3: the Dear Mama track, we just unmuted the track and

552
00:24:12,080 --> 00:24:14,120
Speaker 3: he's over there mumbling a whole other verse that those

553
00:24:14,119 --> 00:24:16,359
Speaker 3: are the things that bring people close to the fans closer.

554
00:24:16,560 --> 00:24:19,320
Speaker 3: Now you were saying something about the other docks or whatever.

555
00:24:19,680 --> 00:24:21,680
Speaker 3: I think that's the interesting thing about Dear Mama is

556
00:24:21,720 --> 00:24:24,600
Speaker 3: like we did really well. We set some record records

557
00:24:24,600 --> 00:24:27,680
Speaker 3: for the network Ethics Network for the premiere. We did

558
00:24:27,720 --> 00:24:29,320
Speaker 3: real well with the critics, like one hundred percent with

559
00:24:29,440 --> 00:24:32,240
Speaker 3: Rot Tomatoes, doing well with the Emmys. However, I do

560
00:24:32,280 --> 00:24:34,439
Speaker 3: think there's this thing in the culture where a lot

561
00:24:34,440 --> 00:24:35,960
Speaker 3: of people are like, ah, yeah, I'll get to it.

562
00:24:36,200 --> 00:24:39,000
Speaker 3: I've seen everything there is about Tupac, because there's a

563
00:24:39,040 --> 00:24:41,520
Speaker 3: lot of people I meet that you would think there

564
00:24:41,560 --> 00:24:45,280
Speaker 3: were hip hop well Tupac fans, hip hop fans, and

565
00:24:45,320 --> 00:24:47,640
Speaker 3: they haven't seen it, and you go, why haven't they

566
00:24:47,640 --> 00:24:50,879
Speaker 3: seen it? Because they feel they've seen Tupac story, or

567
00:24:50,880 --> 00:24:55,040
Speaker 3: they know Tupac story, or there's a dizzying dozens of

568
00:24:55,320 --> 00:25:00,520
Speaker 3: documentaries out there on too well on YouTube, they all

569
00:25:00,600 --> 00:25:02,840
Speaker 3: really scratch the surface. Or are they dealing with the

570
00:25:02,920 --> 00:25:05,560
Speaker 3: murder or they're dealing with this or and there was

571
00:25:06,040 --> 00:25:10,159
Speaker 3: a well done one that was nominated for an Academy Award, Resurrection,

572
00:25:10,440 --> 00:25:12,200
Speaker 3: and it was done in his own Yeah, that was

573
00:25:12,240 --> 00:25:15,760
Speaker 3: always so you can't really and that was very particular.

574
00:25:16,000 --> 00:25:18,520
Speaker 3: So it's like, but without a without going into the

575
00:25:18,600 --> 00:25:22,280
Speaker 3: childhood or into a fanny story, I don't think you

576
00:25:22,320 --> 00:25:25,200
Speaker 3: to your point have a definitive story right or without

577
00:25:25,240 --> 00:25:27,240
Speaker 3: going If you watch Dear Mama, you'll see the number

578
00:25:27,280 --> 00:25:30,240
Speaker 3: one thing is it's a it's an emotional, psychological, and

579
00:25:30,320 --> 00:25:32,960
Speaker 3: spiritual journey. You could feel that it's not like a

580
00:25:33,080 --> 00:25:36,760
Speaker 3: logical journey. It's not like a stats this is what

581
00:25:36,840 --> 00:25:41,119
Speaker 3: this is you. It's always palpable, and I was always

582
00:25:41,160 --> 00:25:44,080
Speaker 3: cognizant of like what is he feeling right now? How

583
00:25:44,119 --> 00:25:47,480
Speaker 3: is he feeling? Why is he making this decision? How's

584
00:25:47,520 --> 00:25:50,679
Speaker 3: that affecting his mother? How's her decisions affecting him? So

585
00:25:50,720 --> 00:25:53,960
Speaker 3: it's always like an emotional spiritual and that part I

586
00:25:53,960 --> 00:25:58,160
Speaker 3: don't think it's ever been Why is this kid? How

587
00:25:58,200 --> 00:26:02,240
Speaker 3: did this kid because to hit him up? Dude? Yeah,

588
00:26:02,520 --> 00:26:05,080
Speaker 3: like that whole arc right there, which never made sense

589
00:26:05,119 --> 00:26:12,320
Speaker 3: to me. How the disc pure, almost innocent artist who

590
00:26:12,800 --> 00:26:15,639
Speaker 3: had all the talent in the world and was a

591
00:26:15,680 --> 00:26:19,280
Speaker 3: poet become the outro of hit him up?

592
00:26:20,560 --> 00:26:25,560
Speaker 2: You know, yeah, unbelievable, Like that was terrified. It's horrified.

593
00:26:25,800 --> 00:26:27,760
Speaker 2: My wife, Dane Smith's, he grew up in Oakland. There

594
00:26:27,800 --> 00:26:31,320
Speaker 2: were friends coming up and what they always syd about him,

595
00:26:31,320 --> 00:26:33,320
Speaker 2: and that it was that he did. He would go

596
00:26:33,359 --> 00:26:38,800
Speaker 2: there fast temper like, oh man, you know what's funny

597
00:26:38,880 --> 00:26:41,080
Speaker 2: is like and he was like that. He was always

598
00:26:41,119 --> 00:26:42,919
Speaker 2: like this was always like that. That wasn't death row. That

599
00:26:42,960 --> 00:26:44,639
Speaker 2: was always a part of it. I'm trying to say, right.

600
00:26:44,680 --> 00:26:46,800
Speaker 3: I would always say, oh he saw juice and I

601
00:26:46,840 --> 00:26:48,800
Speaker 3: think he saw Juice because we were with him when

602
00:26:48,840 --> 00:26:51,640
Speaker 3: he saw Juice for the first time and it clicked.

603
00:26:52,119 --> 00:26:54,359
Speaker 3: But he was always like that, like he can go

604
00:26:54,400 --> 00:26:57,879
Speaker 3: from like joy and love and happiness and something's happening

605
00:26:57,920 --> 00:27:00,399
Speaker 3: in that corner and he's like boom and he's going

606
00:27:00,480 --> 00:27:02,359
Speaker 3: to run right into it. You know. That's your favorite

607
00:27:02,400 --> 00:27:08,920
Speaker 3: POC album, probably Macavelly Macavelly, Yeah, even though I don't

608
00:27:09,280 --> 00:27:12,639
Speaker 3: like every track on the On the Tupac's had an

609
00:27:12,680 --> 00:27:15,280
Speaker 3: interesting career where because he was so loyal to so

610
00:27:15,280 --> 00:27:18,080
Speaker 3: many people shot g talks about this that the production

611
00:27:18,240 --> 00:27:21,199
Speaker 3: was never even you know, so he didn't have that

612
00:27:21,280 --> 00:27:26,480
Speaker 3: definitive producer. Yeah, exactly, And I'm a fidelity guy, so yeah,

613
00:27:26,680 --> 00:27:28,600
Speaker 3: I think Johnny J kind of was a little bit

614
00:27:28,760 --> 00:27:32,320
Speaker 3: no doubt in the beginning. In the beginning, but if

615
00:27:32,359 --> 00:27:34,720
Speaker 3: you listen to All Eyes on Me or Me Against

616
00:27:34,720 --> 00:27:40,280
Speaker 3: the World or strictly from My niggas, especially Tupacas, now

617
00:27:41,720 --> 00:27:43,800
Speaker 3: they're the like Brenda's got a baby sticks out on

618
00:27:43,840 --> 00:27:46,280
Speaker 3: the first album, You're like, wow, this this really sounds.

619
00:27:46,600 --> 00:27:49,360
Speaker 3: This is well produced. And there's always those songs shed

620
00:27:49,400 --> 00:27:51,640
Speaker 3: so many tears being one of them that I didn't

621
00:27:51,680 --> 00:27:55,040
Speaker 3: realize shot G produced Too Too Late, my personal favorite Tupac,

622
00:27:55,840 --> 00:28:00,320
Speaker 3: but mcavelly there's something in the spirit of that and

623
00:28:00,320 --> 00:28:04,960
Speaker 3: what he's saying where certain people, certain hip hop artists,

624
00:28:05,000 --> 00:28:09,200
Speaker 3: it never rarely happens like he went to another I

625
00:28:09,200 --> 00:28:12,879
Speaker 3: don't know how to described that. That blasphemy and hell, Mary, like,

626
00:28:13,040 --> 00:28:15,840
Speaker 3: what the fuck is this? This is? I remember hearing

627
00:28:15,880 --> 00:28:18,080
Speaker 3: that at the first time, going this is like beyond

628
00:28:19,400 --> 00:28:24,239
Speaker 3: heavy metal, Rod, this is there's this chanting going on,

629
00:28:24,320 --> 00:28:31,200
Speaker 3: there's this spiritual wicked thing. It was another level. Yeah,

630
00:28:31,359 --> 00:28:35,800
Speaker 3: that's the way to describe it. Powerful, but even the

631
00:28:35,840 --> 00:28:37,680
Speaker 3: doctor would mean not to draw too much. Every wore.

632
00:28:37,800 --> 00:28:39,400
Speaker 2: When I heard him up, it was like that was

633
00:28:39,400 --> 00:28:41,320
Speaker 2: different than any this song you had ever heard before.

634
00:28:41,600 --> 00:28:43,800
Speaker 2: When you hit him up, it just was like, Okay,

635
00:28:43,880 --> 00:28:45,320
Speaker 2: this is this is real life.

636
00:28:45,920 --> 00:28:48,600
Speaker 3: We I never heard anyone put that way. This is

637
00:28:48,600 --> 00:28:51,520
Speaker 3: real life. They captured that because we up until that point,

638
00:28:51,560 --> 00:28:56,440
Speaker 3: no vash Lean was the that was close. L L

639
00:28:56,560 --> 00:29:00,840
Speaker 3: and uh D had some whatever am I forgetting about

640
00:29:00,840 --> 00:29:03,400
Speaker 3: to There's so many of them, right, but no vash

641
00:29:03,480 --> 00:29:05,560
Speaker 3: Lean was the most personal one we had heard. I

642
00:29:05,600 --> 00:29:08,080
Speaker 3: believe someone said one of these A journalists in one

643
00:29:08,120 --> 00:29:11,160
Speaker 3: of these hip hop documentaries. God, that sounds so dismissed

644
00:29:11,160 --> 00:29:17,520
Speaker 3: about him. Don't say that's how we feel about he said.

645
00:29:17,600 --> 00:29:20,000
Speaker 3: He said something. He said something that was really I'm

646
00:29:20,000 --> 00:29:22,000
Speaker 3: gonna butcher it, but he goes. You know, the thing

647
00:29:22,040 --> 00:29:24,280
Speaker 3: that happened hip hop at one point was like, can

648
00:29:24,320 --> 00:29:29,840
Speaker 3: you imagine the Four Tops beefing with the Temptations and

649
00:29:29,880 --> 00:29:33,160
Speaker 3: not only beefing with the Temptations, talking about their neighborhood

650
00:29:33,200 --> 00:29:36,360
Speaker 3: and their mother and going hard like that. And that's

651
00:29:36,360 --> 00:29:38,600
Speaker 3: what hip hop had become. By the time we get

652
00:29:38,600 --> 00:29:44,160
Speaker 3: to hit a month, Tupac reinvented taking it to another level. Yeah,

653
00:29:46,200 --> 00:29:49,160
Speaker 3: like there's no ceiling. You're like, damn, damn. Why does

654
00:29:49,160 --> 00:29:53,840
Speaker 3: sickle cell though? Just don't for everyone's for everyone, there's

655
00:29:53,880 --> 00:29:56,760
Speaker 3: that one. My my personal one was a sickle cell one,

656
00:29:56,840 --> 00:29:59,560
Speaker 3: But for everyone there's other ones. Why that? Why that?

657
00:30:00,080 --> 00:30:02,080
Speaker 3: He blew past all the stop signs stuff.

658
00:30:03,480 --> 00:30:05,520
Speaker 4: Like Ali, you've been on your own for a while now,

659
00:30:05,520 --> 00:30:07,880
Speaker 4: you know, Dear Mama, you did it by yourself to

660
00:30:08,000 --> 00:30:08,480
Speaker 4: find ones.

661
00:30:08,520 --> 00:30:11,080
Speaker 3: He did it by yourself. Your brother Albert, why was

662
00:30:11,080 --> 00:30:15,120
Speaker 3: he not evolved this picture? Albert actually helped them on

663
00:30:15,600 --> 00:30:18,240
Speaker 3: Dear Mama. He shot some stuff. He cuts some stuff,

664
00:30:18,560 --> 00:30:20,840
Speaker 3: and me and my brother are always like this, twins. Twins

665
00:30:20,840 --> 00:30:23,680
Speaker 3: are worse than just siblings, right, But it's also like,

666
00:30:23,760 --> 00:30:26,520
Speaker 3: you know, it's like being in the Jackson five. That

667
00:30:26,520 --> 00:30:29,480
Speaker 3: shit is cute for the first few years and you

668
00:30:29,600 --> 00:30:32,240
Speaker 3: become men and you're like, man, this nigga is a Muslim.

669
00:30:32,320 --> 00:30:35,360
Speaker 3: I'm a you know, you know, I'm a Buddhist. Like

670
00:30:35,440 --> 00:30:40,280
Speaker 3: everybody changes right different, so it's it's only natural one.

671
00:30:41,000 --> 00:30:44,440
Speaker 3: And but he did come early on in Dear Mama,

672
00:30:44,760 --> 00:30:48,200
Speaker 3: and he set some looks, he shot some things, and

673
00:30:48,240 --> 00:30:50,880
Speaker 3: we had a wonderful like a month before he got

674
00:30:50,920 --> 00:30:54,320
Speaker 3: back to the brother stuff. And but he did. He

675
00:30:54,800 --> 00:30:56,720
Speaker 3: sliced and diced some things. He's really good on the

676
00:30:57,120 --> 00:30:59,880
Speaker 3: on the wheels like that, so he definitely put his

677
00:31:00,280 --> 00:31:03,200
Speaker 3: And I was shocked too, because we both have sensitivities

678
00:31:03,200 --> 00:31:06,920
Speaker 3: around our dynamic with Tupac. That's different, and I didn't

679
00:31:06,960 --> 00:31:09,360
Speaker 3: know how Albert was gonna feel. And he took a

680
00:31:09,400 --> 00:31:12,360
Speaker 3: tremendous amount of pride in coming on, and for the

681
00:31:12,400 --> 00:31:15,600
Speaker 3: handful of months he was involved, he showed a lot

682
00:31:15,640 --> 00:31:17,880
Speaker 3: of love and I was really proud to see him

683
00:31:17,880 --> 00:31:19,760
Speaker 3: do that, you know, because we hadn't talked about it.

684
00:31:20,000 --> 00:31:21,320
Speaker 3: We had never talked about it.

685
00:31:23,800 --> 00:31:26,120
Speaker 2: We felt about you getting into a pocket and things

686
00:31:26,160 --> 00:31:26,600
Speaker 2: like that, or.

687
00:31:26,720 --> 00:31:29,280
Speaker 3: We never Yeah, we never talked about me making the

688
00:31:29,280 --> 00:31:32,760
Speaker 3: decision to make the film. I remember me and my

689
00:31:32,800 --> 00:31:36,520
Speaker 3: brother had a three hour conversation, what's just difficult for us?

690
00:31:36,560 --> 00:31:39,760
Speaker 3: Now we don't talk like that? And I remember him saying,

691
00:31:40,720 --> 00:31:43,280
Speaker 3: damn had nothing to do with Tupac, but we had.

692
00:31:43,360 --> 00:31:45,640
Speaker 3: He says, what do you think easy saw on us?

693
00:31:46,240 --> 00:31:48,880
Speaker 3: He's asking them about that that day, easy callers. He goes,

694
00:31:48,920 --> 00:31:51,440
Speaker 3: what did you What did you think he saw on it?

695
00:31:51,440 --> 00:31:54,560
Speaker 3: I go, he saw, now you know, you get olden.

696
00:31:54,640 --> 00:31:57,160
Speaker 3: He saw two kids that wanted it. That ain't hard

697
00:31:57,200 --> 00:32:00,240
Speaker 3: for a guy that knows talent. And then he had

698
00:32:00,240 --> 00:32:03,080
Speaker 3: some other questions about Oh then he went into his

699
00:32:03,520 --> 00:32:06,160
Speaker 3: you know when Tupac comes out of the and I

700
00:32:06,200 --> 00:32:09,880
Speaker 3: get around video bust out the door at the first line.

701
00:32:11,200 --> 00:32:13,400
Speaker 3: My brother was like, yo when he did that, because

702
00:32:13,400 --> 00:32:15,760
Speaker 3: we were we were still beef with But he goes,

703
00:32:15,800 --> 00:32:18,480
Speaker 3: I knew it was a rap like that. It was

704
00:32:18,520 --> 00:32:21,080
Speaker 3: so dope. The way he came out, you could just

705
00:32:21,120 --> 00:32:23,400
Speaker 3: feel him. It was his first hit single too, But

706
00:32:23,440 --> 00:32:25,840
Speaker 3: to hear Albert say he's a rock star. You know.

707
00:32:25,920 --> 00:32:28,240
Speaker 4: I felt like that watching The Defying Ones, that scene

708
00:32:28,240 --> 00:32:30,680
Speaker 4: when y'all introduced Tupac and from Brenda Got the Baby.

709
00:32:30,680 --> 00:32:33,320
Speaker 3: That cut when it comes around that corner, it's like

710
00:32:33,440 --> 00:32:36,320
Speaker 3: the centerpiece of that episode. That's right, right, that's right.

711
00:32:36,920 --> 00:32:40,400
Speaker 2: You shot that video too, right, well, that's right experiences

712
00:32:40,960 --> 00:32:43,360
Speaker 2: videos with all his first videos, you shot that was.

713
00:32:43,480 --> 00:32:47,560
Speaker 3: That was by his insistence. We were up there to

714
00:32:47,600 --> 00:32:50,840
Speaker 3: meet Digital Underground. We were doing the our first music

715
00:32:50,960 --> 00:32:55,720
Speaker 3: video for Raw Fusion usually DJ Fuse and Tupac was there,

716
00:32:55,760 --> 00:32:57,280
Speaker 3: but he wasn't famous at the time, and he said,

717
00:32:57,280 --> 00:32:59,360
Speaker 3: I just signed a record deal. I saw you shorts.

718
00:32:59,720 --> 00:33:03,880
Speaker 3: I want you to shoot my first music videos. By

719
00:33:03,920 --> 00:33:05,400
Speaker 3: the time we got the Brenda's Got a Baby, it

720
00:33:05,440 --> 00:33:08,240
Speaker 3: was the second single the Trapped. We had done Trapped

721
00:33:08,240 --> 00:33:11,440
Speaker 3: first and in the intim after Trapped, and we were

722
00:33:11,720 --> 00:33:14,280
Speaker 3: kind of hot, getting hot. We were nineteen and I

723
00:33:14,320 --> 00:33:16,520
Speaker 3: remember we were we were very close to getting the

724
00:33:16,520 --> 00:33:21,240
Speaker 3: scenario video Tribe call Quest Wow, very close, and we're like,

725
00:33:21,320 --> 00:33:23,520
Speaker 3: oh my god, we get that Tribe album that that

726
00:33:23,600 --> 00:33:26,640
Speaker 3: summer was the album low End Theory, right, ye and

727
00:33:26,760 --> 00:33:31,320
Speaker 3: everyone and we knew the woman and Carlia Jive and

728
00:33:32,400 --> 00:33:34,480
Speaker 3: and she was a friend and she had to call

729
00:33:34,560 --> 00:33:37,600
Speaker 3: us and say, I'm sorry. I used to always remember

730
00:33:37,600 --> 00:33:40,560
Speaker 3: the director that got it too. We got to go

731
00:33:40,600 --> 00:33:42,520
Speaker 3: with the other guy, and we were so devasted. Was

732
00:33:43,760 --> 00:33:49,000
Speaker 3: Daniels No, nope, I think it was a white dude

733
00:33:49,000 --> 00:33:50,760
Speaker 3: that did that music. I may be wrong. I may

734
00:33:50,760 --> 00:33:54,640
Speaker 3: be wrong. Check pull my card on this one, but

735
00:33:54,720 --> 00:33:57,080
Speaker 3: I remember we were so devastated, and for a month

736
00:33:57,120 --> 00:33:58,880
Speaker 3: we didn't work either. We were used to working. We

737
00:33:58,880 --> 00:34:01,560
Speaker 3: were so devastated, and we were like, the next thing

738
00:34:01,600 --> 00:34:04,960
Speaker 3: we do, we're gonna pull out all the stops, like

739
00:34:04,960 --> 00:34:06,600
Speaker 3: we're going all in. And the next thing that came

740
00:34:06,640 --> 00:34:09,600
Speaker 3: up was Brendan's got a baby. And at that point

741
00:34:09,640 --> 00:34:13,360
Speaker 3: the relationship with Tupac was fracturing. So when his manager

742
00:34:13,440 --> 00:34:16,200
Speaker 3: Adrian Gregory called and says, he's got a lot to do,

743
00:34:16,840 --> 00:34:18,800
Speaker 3: So you guys got two hours with him in the morning,

744
00:34:19,320 --> 00:34:21,400
Speaker 3: you have to shoot him out, we were like perfect.

745
00:34:21,840 --> 00:34:24,320
Speaker 3: And because we had so much narrative to shoot in

746
00:34:24,360 --> 00:34:26,440
Speaker 3: that music video and it's one law, it's a beautiful

747
00:34:26,480 --> 00:34:30,879
Speaker 3: song of one long verse, true story, and Tupac came

748
00:34:30,920 --> 00:34:33,359
Speaker 3: in show you the power Tupac. He shot for two hours.

749
00:34:33,400 --> 00:34:35,719
Speaker 3: We put him in this setup that set up the

750
00:34:35,760 --> 00:34:38,000
Speaker 3: one on the street where the cameras doing all the

751
00:34:38,360 --> 00:34:40,279
Speaker 3: put him with the little girl, and he was out

752
00:34:40,280 --> 00:34:42,240
Speaker 3: of there and you wouldn't know it. He's so powerful

753
00:34:42,280 --> 00:34:44,040
Speaker 3: throughout the piece. You know, you're in a video too.

754
00:34:44,120 --> 00:34:47,200
Speaker 3: Is that your brother? That's me? Yeah? Is it true

755
00:34:47,200 --> 00:34:49,960
Speaker 3: story based on the incident that happened in New York? Yep. Okay, yep,

756
00:34:50,040 --> 00:34:53,480
Speaker 3: young female and that's how chronicled Dear Mama yep and

757
00:34:53,560 --> 00:34:56,440
Speaker 3: the opening of part two. Yep. What was the initial

758
00:34:56,440 --> 00:35:01,239
Speaker 3: conflict m with Tupac? Yeah, there wasn't. It was just

759
00:35:01,719 --> 00:35:04,279
Speaker 3: three nineteen year olds to plus a little older than us,

760
00:35:04,280 --> 00:35:07,600
Speaker 3: so he may have been twenty just I think Tupac

761
00:35:07,680 --> 00:35:11,000
Speaker 3: took a tremendous amount of pride in discovering people. And

762
00:35:11,040 --> 00:35:15,040
Speaker 3: there were always these teenage artists around hip hop artist

763
00:35:15,200 --> 00:35:18,600
Speaker 3: or whoever, producers or whatever, and he would take them

764
00:35:18,640 --> 00:35:20,880
Speaker 3: in and I think he felt that for I think

765
00:35:20,920 --> 00:35:25,759
Speaker 3: he felt he discovered us. And I think that when

766
00:35:25,760 --> 00:35:29,680
Speaker 3: we would uh like hold the line of something or

767
00:35:30,360 --> 00:35:32,360
Speaker 3: or like fight back or something, he didn't like that

768
00:35:33,040 --> 00:35:37,759
Speaker 3: and particularly and he but beyond that, I think he was.

769
00:35:38,200 --> 00:35:42,360
Speaker 3: He was having a difficult time. Although he wanted it

770
00:35:42,400 --> 00:35:43,800
Speaker 3: and he was a natural tour I think he was

771
00:35:43,800 --> 00:35:47,760
Speaker 3: having a difficult time with fame and and also keeping

772
00:35:47,800 --> 00:35:51,960
Speaker 3: in mind, like Tupac's really raised as a socialist, right,

773
00:35:52,239 --> 00:35:56,759
Speaker 3: and you're in an ultra capitalist gen capitalists you know,

774
00:35:57,239 --> 00:36:00,680
Speaker 3: jewels and you know this that and two box raised

775
00:36:00,680 --> 00:36:03,920
Speaker 3: to take care of women, and you're in the genre

776
00:36:03,960 --> 00:36:07,560
Speaker 3: there's the word toxic masculinity is now the thing to

777
00:36:07,600 --> 00:36:09,400
Speaker 3: say right about it, but like you're in the genre

778
00:36:09,480 --> 00:36:14,279
Speaker 3: that is disrespecting women. So especially back then especially, that's

779
00:36:14,280 --> 00:36:17,600
Speaker 3: a that's a key point, right, And so you can

780
00:36:17,680 --> 00:36:20,200
Speaker 3: see that he was struggling with that and the fame,

781
00:36:20,560 --> 00:36:23,640
Speaker 3: and he was getting more volatile. And I don't think

782
00:36:23,680 --> 00:36:29,279
Speaker 3: that the I don't think the weed helped. I don't

783
00:36:29,280 --> 00:36:30,799
Speaker 3: think I don't think it helped.

784
00:36:30,800 --> 00:36:32,759
Speaker 2: But so one of these he had to play like

785
00:36:32,840 --> 00:36:35,000
Speaker 2: he tried to play John Singleton against you, like I'm

786
00:36:35,200 --> 00:36:36,239
Speaker 2: doing moves with John.

787
00:36:36,320 --> 00:36:38,880
Speaker 3: He said that to everybody. But that's that's one of

788
00:36:38,920 --> 00:36:43,000
Speaker 3: the things that most u in I don't know, it's

789
00:36:43,000 --> 00:36:46,279
Speaker 3: actually quite an endearing about him, is that once he

790
00:36:46,320 --> 00:36:49,200
Speaker 3: would fine the big brother or the father figure role.

791
00:36:49,440 --> 00:36:52,800
Speaker 3: He fall fall hard for that person. So he told everyone,

792
00:36:53,000 --> 00:36:58,759
Speaker 3: including us, I'm only starring in John Singleton films. Me

793
00:36:58,840 --> 00:37:01,200
Speaker 3: and John are gonna be like score sac and de Niro.

794
00:37:02,040 --> 00:37:05,239
Speaker 3: And we were like, I remember being hurt by that

795
00:37:05,680 --> 00:37:08,160
Speaker 3: because we felt like we came up with him and

796
00:37:09,320 --> 00:37:11,680
Speaker 3: we knew he was talented. We wanted to make a

797
00:37:11,680 --> 00:37:14,520
Speaker 3: movie with him, but we agreed we didn't want to

798
00:37:14,520 --> 00:37:16,520
Speaker 3: do minutes with him in the starr ing row because

799
00:37:16,560 --> 00:37:19,040
Speaker 3: we knew he was becoming a handful. But he also

800
00:37:19,160 --> 00:37:21,759
Speaker 3: was very helpful in getting getting a greenlit. So he

801
00:37:21,800 --> 00:37:25,520
Speaker 3: agreed to this role of Sharif the Muslim right, And

802
00:37:25,520 --> 00:37:28,480
Speaker 3: I think he regretted that later because of the image

803
00:37:28,520 --> 00:37:33,080
Speaker 3: he was leaning into and he was die hard with John.

804
00:37:33,120 --> 00:37:34,719
Speaker 3: He was die hard at that point and then that

805
00:37:34,760 --> 00:37:35,320
Speaker 3: went south.

806
00:37:36,719 --> 00:37:39,439
Speaker 4: So, well, what was the process like going from doing

807
00:37:39,520 --> 00:37:41,520
Speaker 4: music videos into doing movies? I know you you and

808
00:37:41,560 --> 00:37:43,560
Speaker 4: brothers started like when you were like twelve years old,

809
00:37:43,560 --> 00:37:46,319
Speaker 4: started directing, So what was that transition like going from

810
00:37:46,320 --> 00:37:49,800
Speaker 4: like Brendi's got a baby to like doing major motion pictures.

811
00:37:50,080 --> 00:37:53,839
Speaker 3: Well, I remember like at the time, like let's think

812
00:37:53,880 --> 00:37:55,720
Speaker 3: back to eighty eight when we were in high school,

813
00:37:55,880 --> 00:37:59,760
Speaker 3: the OMTV raps, like you're seeing hip hop music videos

814
00:38:00,760 --> 00:38:03,320
Speaker 3: in your whole life, you're dreaming of making feature films,

815
00:38:03,360 --> 00:38:06,400
Speaker 3: and now you see this whole Oh, there's this transition stage.

816
00:38:06,440 --> 00:38:09,040
Speaker 3: We can break into this first because in eighty eight

817
00:38:09,719 --> 00:38:13,080
Speaker 3: people remember when those when even before you o MTV reps,

818
00:38:13,080 --> 00:38:16,239
Speaker 3: when you saw hip hop music videos, most of those

819
00:38:16,400 --> 00:38:21,239
Speaker 3: videos had a narrative thing to them. The lyrics had

820
00:38:21,239 --> 00:38:23,799
Speaker 3: a narrative, not all of them, but more sold in today.

821
00:38:23,880 --> 00:38:26,080
Speaker 3: Let's put that way right. And so you're seeing like

822
00:38:26,120 --> 00:38:29,120
Speaker 3: really innovative things happening, and for a little a bount

823
00:38:29,120 --> 00:38:31,360
Speaker 3: of money, like it wasn't the budgets of rock videos,

824
00:38:31,400 --> 00:38:33,480
Speaker 3: Like the average budget of a rock video was between

825
00:38:34,080 --> 00:38:38,320
Speaker 3: eighty two a million dollars. Back then, average budget for

826
00:38:38,320 --> 00:38:41,560
Speaker 3: a hip hop video was twenty thousand dollars twenty thirty

827
00:38:41,560 --> 00:38:43,600
Speaker 3: thousand doll Our first music video was thirty thousand dollars.

828
00:38:43,680 --> 00:38:48,279
Speaker 3: Brenda's Got a Baby was forty thousand dollars. So there's

829
00:38:48,320 --> 00:38:51,720
Speaker 3: this incredibly inventive storytelling going on, and these this camera

830
00:38:51,800 --> 00:38:54,759
Speaker 3: work and these lenses and things that you're like, wow,

831
00:38:54,760 --> 00:38:58,880
Speaker 3: there's this this this thing called hip hop music videos

832
00:39:00,080 --> 00:39:04,880
Speaker 3: happened while we were on our way to dreams of features,

833
00:39:05,160 --> 00:39:07,640
Speaker 3: and so I remember the biggest thing we said to

834
00:39:07,680 --> 00:39:11,560
Speaker 3: ourselves was don't get trapped too long in the music

835
00:39:11,600 --> 00:39:14,640
Speaker 3: videos because you'll develop a lot of bad habits, you know,

836
00:39:16,200 --> 00:39:18,040
Speaker 3: continuity being one of them. I noticed a lot of

837
00:39:18,080 --> 00:39:19,719
Speaker 3: people that do music videos for a long time, they

838
00:39:19,719 --> 00:39:22,280
Speaker 3: get up to movie sets and they don't even understand,

839
00:39:22,320 --> 00:39:24,320
Speaker 3: like with a script supervisor, and like that, you can't

840
00:39:24,440 --> 00:39:26,800
Speaker 3: the water is here, it can't be here. Now, this

841
00:39:26,840 --> 00:39:30,800
Speaker 3: is stupid shit, right that you've got details working with actors,

842
00:39:32,360 --> 00:39:34,919
Speaker 3: you know. They were like, there's so many glorious things

843
00:39:34,920 --> 00:39:37,560
Speaker 3: that come with the hip hop culture, and then there's

844
00:39:37,880 --> 00:39:41,440
Speaker 3: always a rub with everything. So even in rock, the

845
00:39:41,480 --> 00:39:43,960
Speaker 3: longer you're doing music videos in short form like that,

846
00:39:44,200 --> 00:39:47,920
Speaker 3: the more you under adopt a lot of bad habits.

847
00:39:48,200 --> 00:39:50,920
Speaker 3: Want that won't will not serve you in feature films.

848
00:39:51,160 --> 00:39:53,000
Speaker 3: So we were like, let's just do this for a year,

849
00:39:53,239 --> 00:39:55,040
Speaker 3: and thank god we got lucky and it was under

850
00:39:55,040 --> 00:39:57,880
Speaker 3: a year we had done like twenty two music videos. Wow.

851
00:39:58,239 --> 00:40:01,080
Speaker 3: And it was easy to make that transition because before

852
00:40:01,120 --> 00:40:03,799
Speaker 3: we did the music videos, the shorts that Tupac was

853
00:40:03,800 --> 00:40:05,759
Speaker 3: referring to that he saw when he went to hire us.

854
00:40:06,040 --> 00:40:08,000
Speaker 3: Was the same shorts that got us hired for our

855
00:40:08,000 --> 00:40:11,040
Speaker 3: first music video. One was called The drive By About

856
00:40:11,040 --> 00:40:14,240
Speaker 3: a drive By. One was called Men's Society. No relations

857
00:40:14,280 --> 00:40:16,919
Speaker 3: to film, both black and white. Both felt like rage

858
00:40:16,920 --> 00:40:20,920
Speaker 3: and bull both incredibly dramatic and in the use of

859
00:40:21,000 --> 00:40:21,960
Speaker 3: music and stuff like that.

860
00:40:22,000 --> 00:40:24,720
Speaker 4: You know mentioned Menister Society. It's one of my favorite

861
00:40:24,760 --> 00:40:27,799
Speaker 4: movies full time. This year mark thirty year anniversary of

862
00:40:27,800 --> 00:40:30,840
Speaker 4: the film. Yeah, I said that anniversarys. Why do you

863
00:40:30,880 --> 00:40:33,040
Speaker 4: think it's still revealed after all these years.

864
00:40:33,400 --> 00:40:36,239
Speaker 3: I think the energy, I think the you know, it's

865
00:40:36,239 --> 00:40:38,399
Speaker 3: probably one of the only times where the lunatics were

866
00:40:38,440 --> 00:40:42,360
Speaker 3: running the asylum. We're nineteen directing a film about eighteen

867
00:40:42,360 --> 00:40:46,440
Speaker 3: and nineteen year olds, so it had a hectic, visceral

868
00:40:46,600 --> 00:40:50,200
Speaker 3: randomness to it. I remember in the middle of shooting

869
00:40:51,040 --> 00:40:52,640
Speaker 3: we had to come to the set and put a

870
00:40:52,680 --> 00:40:56,880
Speaker 3: moratorium down on like saying nigga, because every we're watching

871
00:40:56,880 --> 00:41:01,359
Speaker 3: the dailies Nigga, nigga, Ni Nick Nick. And remember sitting

872
00:41:01,360 --> 00:41:04,839
Speaker 3: with m C eight, Lorenz, Tyre Turner, my friend Ryan

873
00:41:04,880 --> 00:41:08,200
Speaker 3: Williams and going like, you guys, we're gonna do some takes,

874
00:41:08,960 --> 00:41:12,000
Speaker 3: we could say nigga, but just not like as Commas

875
00:41:12,000 --> 00:41:15,919
Speaker 3: periods question making right and okay, okay, And I remember

876
00:41:16,080 --> 00:41:18,760
Speaker 3: it lasted like a day, right. And I also remember

877
00:41:18,840 --> 00:41:21,280
Speaker 3: when the movie came out, we officially broke the nigga

878
00:41:21,320 --> 00:41:23,800
Speaker 3: record which was held by Roots for all those years.

879
00:41:23,840 --> 00:41:26,480
Speaker 3: Wow wow, And it was I don't know how many

880
00:41:26,520 --> 00:41:28,160
Speaker 3: it was, three hundred and eighty seven. I don't know

881
00:41:28,160 --> 00:41:29,759
Speaker 3: if it was a thout. I can't remember what it

882
00:41:30,160 --> 00:41:32,480
Speaker 3: wasn't a record I was proud of holding, but we

883
00:41:33,120 --> 00:41:35,400
Speaker 3: probably still have it to this day. But to you,

884
00:41:35,520 --> 00:41:37,799
Speaker 3: to the to the point of your question, I think

885
00:41:37,840 --> 00:41:42,319
Speaker 3: there was a when youth is wasted on the youth,

886
00:41:42,440 --> 00:41:45,239
Speaker 3: as they say, and what you don't know, you don't know.

887
00:41:45,320 --> 00:41:47,759
Speaker 3: So you were just firing. And I think there was

888
00:41:47,800 --> 00:41:51,960
Speaker 3: a manic energy to the film and there and some

889
00:41:52,080 --> 00:41:54,960
Speaker 3: critics said, are lyricism to it? You know, because a

890
00:41:54,960 --> 00:41:57,520
Speaker 3: lot of it was ad lib too. God bless Tiger Williams,

891
00:41:57,560 --> 00:42:00,680
Speaker 3: who wrote a great script to I don't give enough credit,

892
00:42:00,719 --> 00:42:04,160
Speaker 3: and I should because without the fundamentals of like the

893
00:42:04,160 --> 00:42:06,640
Speaker 3: beats and the characters being flushed out, none of it matters.

894
00:42:06,920 --> 00:42:08,640
Speaker 3: But there was a lot of a lot of it

895
00:42:08,680 --> 00:42:12,000
Speaker 3: was ad libbed, or we would do the script and

896
00:42:12,040 --> 00:42:13,719
Speaker 3: go all right, throw that out, let's do this now.

897
00:42:14,000 --> 00:42:15,920
Speaker 3: And and it was in the time that it was

898
00:42:15,920 --> 00:42:18,640
Speaker 3: happening the movies about the time that it's in. So

899
00:42:19,080 --> 00:42:21,000
Speaker 3: it's crazy that you and your brother were only twenty

900
00:42:21,000 --> 00:42:21,640
Speaker 3: one years old.

901
00:42:21,640 --> 00:42:23,759
Speaker 4: Did you guys speak of records, You guys hold the

902
00:42:23,760 --> 00:42:26,799
Speaker 4: Guinness World Record of the youngest directors in a major

903
00:42:26,840 --> 00:42:27,480
Speaker 4: motion picture.

904
00:42:27,560 --> 00:42:29,520
Speaker 3: It's the only time I get arrogant. We were twenty

905
00:42:29,560 --> 00:42:32,160
Speaker 3: when we made the film twenty one. We got the

906
00:42:32,200 --> 00:42:35,040
Speaker 3: Guinness Book of World Record for the release of the film,

907
00:42:35,040 --> 00:42:38,200
Speaker 3: and I was always pissed, like, damn, twenty one years

908
00:42:38,239 --> 00:42:41,239
Speaker 3: old and it said twenty one years old fifty seven

909
00:42:41,320 --> 00:42:43,320
Speaker 3: days or something like that. Yeah, but we made it

910
00:42:43,360 --> 00:42:44,960
Speaker 3: when we were twenty. I wasn't an adult.

911
00:42:45,400 --> 00:42:48,560
Speaker 4: Twenty was like thirty one back in ninety three.

912
00:42:50,840 --> 00:42:53,200
Speaker 3: By the way, it's like that generationally. I just always

913
00:42:53,239 --> 00:42:55,000
Speaker 3: say I'll be a man when I'm thirty five, and

914
00:42:55,040 --> 00:42:57,000
Speaker 3: I got to thirty five of why am I man? Nigga.

915
00:42:57,080 --> 00:43:00,520
Speaker 3: Clint Eastwood is from your Granddaddy's that when he was

916
00:43:00,560 --> 00:43:04,920
Speaker 3: thirty five doing spaghetti westerns. They were milking cows, plowing fields,

917
00:43:04,960 --> 00:43:07,520
Speaker 3: getting asked, whipped by you know, bottles and shit. It's

918
00:43:07,560 --> 00:43:08,719
Speaker 3: a different experience.

919
00:43:09,239 --> 00:43:12,080
Speaker 2: So when any battles with like censorship of powers to

920
00:43:12,080 --> 00:43:15,040
Speaker 2: be to get such a like authentic film out.

921
00:43:14,840 --> 00:43:18,160
Speaker 3: There, oh hell yeah. There's a gentleman named Jack Falente

922
00:43:18,400 --> 00:43:21,719
Speaker 3: who was the head of the mp AA, the ratings board,

923
00:43:22,640 --> 00:43:24,680
Speaker 3: and by the time he was an elder gentleman. But

924
00:43:24,719 --> 00:43:28,280
Speaker 3: he goes back to the days of like Jaggar Hoover,

925
00:43:29,440 --> 00:43:33,200
Speaker 3: you gotta have They kept giving us an NC seventeen. Wow,

926
00:43:33,760 --> 00:43:36,840
Speaker 3: giving us in the ninety ninety three. Yeah, yeah, and

927
00:43:36,880 --> 00:43:39,600
Speaker 3: I checked this now me. My mom always said you

928
00:43:39,600 --> 00:43:41,239
Speaker 3: should have been an attorney because I come up with

929
00:43:41,280 --> 00:43:45,239
Speaker 3: like arguments, right, And I'm like, Schindler's List was out

930
00:43:45,239 --> 00:43:47,000
Speaker 3: that year. I'm like, you guys are telling us to

931
00:43:47,000 --> 00:43:50,560
Speaker 3: take shit out of our film that's in Schindler's List,

932
00:43:50,800 --> 00:43:53,399
Speaker 3: like the squibs heads blown up, like there's like thirty

933
00:43:53,480 --> 00:43:56,520
Speaker 3: of them in this movie. There's some nigga shit too.

934
00:43:56,760 --> 00:43:59,239
Speaker 3: It's always like, you guys can't do it because you know,

935
00:43:59,400 --> 00:44:02,239
Speaker 3: there's different standards. So I had to fight, fight, fight,

936
00:44:02,680 --> 00:44:06,600
Speaker 3: and eventually we got it there. But when Criterion collection.

937
00:44:06,680 --> 00:44:10,239
Speaker 3: Did the Laser disc that's the NC seventeen version. If

938
00:44:10,280 --> 00:44:12,800
Speaker 3: you ever get the Criterion disc on now, it's streaming

939
00:44:12,840 --> 00:44:15,879
Speaker 3: Criterion Collection. Yeah, yeah, you'll see, you'll see it's mostly

940
00:44:15,920 --> 00:44:19,799
Speaker 3: about the blood and the ship coming out, you know. Yeah,

941
00:44:19,960 --> 00:44:21,400
Speaker 3: but the reception was so amazing.

942
00:44:21,440 --> 00:44:24,520
Speaker 4: In nineteen ninety four of the MTV Movie Awards, you

943
00:44:24,520 --> 00:44:29,360
Speaker 4: guys beat out Jurassic Park. Yeah, the Fugitive Philadelphia shinless

944
00:44:29,360 --> 00:44:33,400
Speaker 4: list for the best Picture. Yeah, like answer school either

945
00:44:33,440 --> 00:44:34,279
Speaker 4: gave it two thumbs up.

946
00:44:34,800 --> 00:44:37,120
Speaker 3: Yeah, beyond what was like? How did that? How did

947
00:44:37,160 --> 00:44:39,479
Speaker 3: you guys response to that? That one? I remember telling

948
00:44:39,520 --> 00:44:44,160
Speaker 3: my publicis you read that list, You're like to Spilberg movie.

949
00:44:44,160 --> 00:44:47,120
Speaker 3: By the way, two definitive Spilberg movies, Matt the biggest

950
00:44:47,120 --> 00:44:50,240
Speaker 3: movie of all time at the time, Jurassic Park, The Fugitive,

951
00:44:50,239 --> 00:44:55,600
Speaker 3: which was a massive film Philadelphia, critically acclaimed. Denzellen Hanks,

952
00:44:55,600 --> 00:44:57,640
Speaker 3: there's no way we're winning, and we're not showing up

953
00:44:57,640 --> 00:45:01,400
Speaker 3: to the MTV Movie Awards. And I remember my publishers

954
00:45:01,400 --> 00:45:03,239
Speaker 3: calling a week later, she goes, you guys should show up,

955
00:45:03,440 --> 00:45:05,520
Speaker 3: should show up. I said, no, we're not, Stacy unless

956
00:45:05,560 --> 00:45:08,080
Speaker 3: they tell us we won we're not. She's like, I'm

957
00:45:08,120 --> 00:45:12,239
Speaker 3: telling you you should show up, Like, oh, okay, I

958
00:45:12,239 --> 00:45:14,920
Speaker 3: guess she knows something. And it was shocking. But I

959
00:45:15,000 --> 00:45:17,319
Speaker 3: also remember when we won, when we got backstage with

960
00:45:17,360 --> 00:45:20,080
Speaker 3: the press, it was it was it was it was

961
00:45:20,120 --> 00:45:22,440
Speaker 3: salty back there, really, you know, it was salty back there.

962
00:45:22,440 --> 00:45:24,239
Speaker 3: I remember remember me and my brother being taken it

963
00:45:24,280 --> 00:45:26,759
Speaker 3: back by that. But before we went back there, uh,

964
00:45:27,040 --> 00:45:30,000
Speaker 3: back there, Tom Hanks pulled this aside and he goes,

965
00:45:30,040 --> 00:45:32,719
Speaker 3: listen to me. He goes, you, guys, don't ever let

966
00:45:32,760 --> 00:45:36,920
Speaker 3: anyone tell you to do anything that's not you. Just

967
00:45:37,040 --> 00:45:40,279
Speaker 3: be you, just stay. You don't let anyone knock you

968
00:45:40,320 --> 00:45:42,680
Speaker 3: off of who you are and what you're doing. You

969
00:45:42,719 --> 00:45:44,880
Speaker 3: guys got it. And I remember that was like a

970
00:45:44,920 --> 00:45:47,680
Speaker 3: big deal to hear that from him, like, don't be

971
00:45:48,280 --> 00:45:50,520
Speaker 3: who you are, don't try to be something else, you know,

972
00:45:50,800 --> 00:45:54,320
Speaker 3: don't let this business take you out of here. Whatever.

973
00:45:54,360 --> 00:45:55,799
Speaker 3: And then we went back to the press room and

974
00:45:55,840 --> 00:45:58,719
Speaker 3: they were salty. They were salty. They wanted to see Spielberg,

975
00:45:59,600 --> 00:45:59,880
Speaker 3: that's what.

976
00:46:00,560 --> 00:46:03,040
Speaker 4: But you guys had sat Jackson, had Charles done and

977
00:46:03,080 --> 00:46:04,440
Speaker 4: at the height of rock, that's.

978
00:46:04,320 --> 00:46:09,200
Speaker 5: Right on, you know, the prey I hate that scene.

979
00:46:09,800 --> 00:46:13,560
Speaker 5: I hate that scene. I hate that scene. Hate It's

980
00:46:13,560 --> 00:46:15,040
Speaker 5: in the trailer and everything, and I hate it.

981
00:46:15,080 --> 00:46:20,080
Speaker 3: Yeah, it's just corny as it's still a class today.

982
00:46:20,560 --> 00:46:22,799
Speaker 3: I mean, he's saying the right ship, don't get me wrong,

983
00:46:22,840 --> 00:46:25,759
Speaker 3: but like you know, now I know I'm a I'm

984
00:46:25,800 --> 00:46:28,880
Speaker 3: a better director. I'll be like, all right, Charles, just

985
00:46:28,880 --> 00:46:31,040
Speaker 3: throw that away. We call it so you know, if

986
00:46:31,080 --> 00:46:33,840
Speaker 3: they throw it away, don't don't put you know, I

987
00:46:33,880 --> 00:46:35,640
Speaker 3: don't know. I would have been maybe more subtle, but

988
00:46:35,640 --> 00:46:38,360
Speaker 3: maybe it wouldn't have worked. He made listen, he's a

989
00:46:38,360 --> 00:46:40,680
Speaker 3: great actor. So those guys were holding uts down at

990
00:46:40,719 --> 00:46:43,359
Speaker 3: the time, Bill Duke as well, Bill Duke. Those guys

991
00:46:43,360 --> 00:46:46,440
Speaker 3: were holding us down, you know, like they had instincts

992
00:46:46,480 --> 00:46:48,320
Speaker 3: they you know, we didn't know what the fuck do.

993
00:46:48,680 --> 00:46:50,640
Speaker 4: I think sometimes that gets lost in the movie is

994
00:46:50,680 --> 00:46:52,359
Speaker 4: like the amount of rappers you had in there, right,

995
00:46:52,480 --> 00:46:54,799
Speaker 4: so you have to short You have the field who

996
00:46:54,800 --> 00:46:57,560
Speaker 4: plays Harrol m c a A Wax. Did you know

997
00:46:57,600 --> 00:47:00,319
Speaker 4: this j PO DJ Pool exactly, not.

998
00:47:00,280 --> 00:47:04,799
Speaker 3: DJ pooh Man poor Man, Yeah, corrected that. Yeah, did

999
00:47:04,800 --> 00:47:06,360
Speaker 3: you know that they could act? Like? Why did you

1000
00:47:06,440 --> 00:47:10,600
Speaker 3: cast those guys? We knew m c a can possibly

1001
00:47:10,600 --> 00:47:12,959
Speaker 3: because he came in an audition we had done like

1002
00:47:13,000 --> 00:47:16,279
Speaker 3: a couple of Too Short music videos in Shorts a

1003
00:47:16,320 --> 00:47:19,239
Speaker 3: pretty laid back guy. So it wasn't like and Short

1004
00:47:19,360 --> 00:47:21,600
Speaker 3: wasn't trying to be an actor, but we we loved Short.

1005
00:47:22,000 --> 00:47:25,000
Speaker 3: Let's put him in the Who else did we mention?

1006
00:47:25,280 --> 00:47:28,000
Speaker 3: Sofia I knew personally. I knew he wasn't afraid of

1007
00:47:28,000 --> 00:47:29,759
Speaker 3: no camera. That was going to stay war and that

1008
00:47:29,880 --> 00:47:35,640
Speaker 3: was like his first first role. Yeah, and Pooh, pooh, pooh, man,

1009
00:47:36,239 --> 00:47:37,160
Speaker 3: I think it's in prison.

1010
00:47:37,600 --> 00:47:37,839
Speaker 1: Wow.

1011
00:47:38,320 --> 00:47:40,399
Speaker 3: So much to check the record on that, I think, yeah,

1012
00:47:40,440 --> 00:47:43,279
Speaker 3: he was a natural. I mean, look at how many

1013
00:47:43,320 --> 00:47:46,200
Speaker 3: Bay Area people we brought down for minutes. So Sofia

1014
00:47:46,640 --> 00:47:50,359
Speaker 3: Pooh and too Short yep. Yeah.

1015
00:47:50,560 --> 00:47:52,759
Speaker 2: Also, like did you say we were talking about back then,

1016
00:47:52,840 --> 00:47:55,479
Speaker 2: especially like what what's the message of this black film?

1017
00:47:55,520 --> 00:47:57,480
Speaker 2: And you said this is about as a statement film?

1018
00:47:57,560 --> 00:48:00,839
Speaker 3: Yeah, Yeah, big difference because that was a differentiated us

1019
00:48:00,880 --> 00:48:04,600
Speaker 3: from boys in the Hood, and John as he should

1020
00:48:04,640 --> 00:48:07,719
Speaker 3: probably was like there's a message to to there's a

1021
00:48:07,719 --> 00:48:10,239
Speaker 3: message I'm trying to get across. I'm like that what

1022
00:48:10,560 --> 00:48:12,319
Speaker 3: you know? So you naturally got to go what are

1023
00:48:12,320 --> 00:48:16,000
Speaker 3: we doing? Is different? And we were never and to

1024
00:48:16,040 --> 00:48:18,399
Speaker 3: this day, I'm not a message guy. I'm a statement guy,

1025
00:48:18,480 --> 00:48:21,120
Speaker 3: Like this is the statement or this is the question

1026
00:48:21,200 --> 00:48:25,319
Speaker 3: I'm asking. There's no there's no message, you know, And

1027
00:48:25,400 --> 00:48:30,319
Speaker 3: maybe I'm being semantical, but I think it's like what

1028
00:48:30,480 --> 00:48:32,319
Speaker 3: as you learn as a as a grown woman a

1029
00:48:32,360 --> 00:48:35,520
Speaker 3: grown man, like, there's a big difference between reacting to

1030
00:48:35,600 --> 00:48:40,640
Speaker 3: something and responding to something. And I've in my wisdom

1031
00:48:40,680 --> 00:48:43,880
Speaker 3: now I would prefer that I respond and not react

1032
00:48:44,360 --> 00:48:48,759
Speaker 3: because reacting is gonna get you shot. So I think

1033
00:48:48,760 --> 00:48:51,080
Speaker 3: that's the difference between messages and statements. I think of

1034
00:48:51,600 --> 00:48:57,240
Speaker 3: a message is for you know, after school specials.

1035
00:48:57,239 --> 00:48:59,120
Speaker 4: The music also is like a character in the movie

1036
00:48:59,160 --> 00:49:01,799
Speaker 4: as well, like Yates title track Straight Up Menace, Yeah

1037
00:49:01,880 --> 00:49:03,960
Speaker 4: took on the life of its own and the soundtrack

1038
00:49:04,040 --> 00:49:06,759
Speaker 4: who you Know had his hell zone like did you

1039
00:49:06,800 --> 00:49:08,280
Speaker 4: guys have hands?

1040
00:49:08,280 --> 00:49:11,319
Speaker 3: In that as well? One thousand percent. It started with

1041
00:49:11,360 --> 00:49:16,640
Speaker 3: that because I made the back to Jive Records. I

1042
00:49:16,680 --> 00:49:19,480
Speaker 3: took it to I was me and my brother both

1043
00:49:19,480 --> 00:49:21,919
Speaker 3: were Epece and the soundtrack. But everything starts with music

1044
00:49:21,960 --> 00:49:25,640
Speaker 3: for me, So a n R the whole album or

1045
00:49:25,680 --> 00:49:28,360
Speaker 3: whatever you like. But you know, like a lot of

1046
00:49:28,360 --> 00:49:32,000
Speaker 3: the tracks like personally and I remember the thing that

1047
00:49:32,080 --> 00:49:34,000
Speaker 3: hurt me the most, and I'm gonna air him out

1048
00:49:34,040 --> 00:49:36,840
Speaker 3: right now is Jive Records, Barry Wise. We made a

1049
00:49:36,880 --> 00:49:40,719
Speaker 3: deal that R Kelly, this is before R Kelly was

1050
00:49:41,320 --> 00:49:44,600
Speaker 3: really big, he only had one album out. He's not

1051
00:49:44,719 --> 00:49:47,920
Speaker 3: give an original track for the for the for the soundtrack.

1052
00:49:48,160 --> 00:49:50,759
Speaker 3: So I flew to Chicago because R Kelly and I

1053
00:49:51,239 --> 00:49:55,239
Speaker 3: are our attorney. Business manager was the same guy. Gave

1054
00:49:55,320 --> 00:49:58,719
Speaker 3: him the Menace VHS tape and then next day I

1055
00:49:58,760 --> 00:50:00,640
Speaker 3: came back and he had a song for me that

1056
00:50:00,719 --> 00:50:03,560
Speaker 3: he wrote two minutes and I listened to this song.

1057
00:50:03,640 --> 00:50:06,760
Speaker 3: I goh shit, it's how involved I was in the soundtrack.

1058
00:50:07,080 --> 00:50:10,560
Speaker 3: I called Barry White's the Drive Records. I said, I said,

1059
00:50:10,920 --> 00:50:13,800
Speaker 3: I got I just heard R Kelly's first number one single,

1060
00:50:14,560 --> 00:50:16,040
Speaker 3: and he goes, oh shit, I can't wait there, I

1061
00:50:16,080 --> 00:50:18,600
Speaker 3: can't wait to hear it. A week later he calls me,

1062
00:50:18,680 --> 00:50:21,640
Speaker 3: He goes, I got good news and bad news. The

1063
00:50:21,680 --> 00:50:23,719
Speaker 3: good news is you're right, this is gonna be his

1064
00:50:23,760 --> 00:50:26,319
Speaker 3: first number one rack. The bad news is it's not

1065
00:50:26,400 --> 00:50:29,840
Speaker 3: going on the soundtrack. It was bumping grind wow. Wow.

1066
00:50:30,520 --> 00:50:31,920
Speaker 3: If you hear what he's saying. It's opening his song,

1067
00:50:31,960 --> 00:50:34,719
Speaker 3: he's talking about Caine. My body's telling me yes, but

1068
00:50:35,320 --> 00:50:37,799
Speaker 3: my mind's telling me no. But my body's saying yes,

1069
00:50:38,120 --> 00:50:43,440
Speaker 3: some about Caine because of Jada's character Ronnie and you

1070
00:50:43,480 --> 00:50:46,880
Speaker 3: know his father fig Pernell. Yah, that's what it's about. Wow.

1071
00:50:47,080 --> 00:50:49,680
Speaker 3: Mind blown. Wow. I've never said that publicly, but that's

1072
00:50:49,680 --> 00:50:52,600
Speaker 3: what that goes. Wow. And it was a massive hit

1073
00:50:52,640 --> 00:50:57,080
Speaker 3: for him because Honey as first hit. Wow. Okay was

1074
00:50:57,120 --> 00:50:59,600
Speaker 3: it Honey Love The scene that they used, yeah, because

1075
00:50:59,600 --> 00:51:03,080
Speaker 3: we took it because that was already there was already

1076
00:51:03,239 --> 00:51:08,000
Speaker 3: you know, like the successful music. So yeah, let Allen Hill. Yeah,

1077
00:51:08,320 --> 00:51:10,960
Speaker 3: that's exactly because you can use any of his music,

1078
00:51:11,840 --> 00:51:14,000
Speaker 3: but this one, like because that was what was meant

1079
00:51:14,000 --> 00:51:17,360
Speaker 3: to be in that scene. That's what he wrote it

1080
00:51:17,400 --> 00:51:17,960
Speaker 3: to that scene.

1081
00:51:18,200 --> 00:51:18,520
Speaker 5: Wow.

1082
00:51:18,880 --> 00:51:20,640
Speaker 4: But I love how like the music does like have

1083
00:51:20,719 --> 00:51:22,919
Speaker 4: a life of its own, Like even the al Green

1084
00:51:23,040 --> 00:51:25,560
Speaker 4: scene when they're in the car with a wax and

1085
00:51:25,560 --> 00:51:27,719
Speaker 4: they're just saying, you know, yeah, like a little bitch

1086
00:51:27,800 --> 00:51:28,120
Speaker 4: right now.

1087
00:51:28,200 --> 00:51:29,759
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, yeah, I love that.

1088
00:51:31,000 --> 00:51:33,040
Speaker 2: Well, well, last thing of minutes, I think another good point.

1089
00:51:33,160 --> 00:51:34,799
Speaker 2: So you say somewhere it was like the same thing

1090
00:51:34,800 --> 00:51:36,960
Speaker 2: with we Pop that you don't believe in the like

1091
00:51:37,200 --> 00:51:39,880
Speaker 2: ending something, don't end it pretty like, don't glorify to death?

1092
00:51:40,480 --> 00:51:42,560
Speaker 3: How important is that you think in the storytelling. It's

1093
00:51:42,560 --> 00:51:45,480
Speaker 3: funny because Spike did it on the nose at the

1094
00:51:45,640 --> 00:51:51,520
Speaker 3: end of school days. God, that's really what you're That's

1095
00:51:51,520 --> 00:51:53,720
Speaker 3: what you're really saying. You're really saying, wake up America,

1096
00:51:53,800 --> 00:51:57,040
Speaker 3: like you know, wake up? You know America each is young,

1097
00:51:57,080 --> 00:52:01,960
Speaker 3: but it's young will eat America first left unattended to?

1098
00:52:03,560 --> 00:52:07,320
Speaker 3: So I didn't. We didn't believe that you can get

1099
00:52:07,520 --> 00:52:10,960
Speaker 3: white America to wake up without ending it like that.

1100
00:52:11,640 --> 00:52:15,440
Speaker 3: It's a similar thing, and it gives me chills. You know.

1101
00:52:15,440 --> 00:52:18,000
Speaker 3: It's like with two. I was watching some of Dear

1102
00:52:18,080 --> 00:52:20,560
Speaker 3: Mama with people in a room with diverse people, you know,

1103
00:52:20,640 --> 00:52:22,839
Speaker 3: some of the scenes before it came out, and there

1104
00:52:22,880 --> 00:52:25,680
Speaker 3: was the one where he's doing the Don mcclaim movement

1105
00:52:25,719 --> 00:52:27,759
Speaker 3: piece in high school, and then you see this whole

1106
00:52:27,800 --> 00:52:31,160
Speaker 3: life fast forward and then he's now he's a slow

1107
00:52:31,200 --> 00:52:33,440
Speaker 3: motion and shot G's talking about you want to see

1108
00:52:33,440 --> 00:52:35,040
Speaker 3: a real nigga, you want to see a real man,

1109
00:52:35,160 --> 00:52:36,600
Speaker 3: I'll show you, and then he goes in to hit

1110
00:52:36,640 --> 00:52:38,880
Speaker 3: him up right. There's that whole nine minute sequence in

1111
00:52:38,920 --> 00:52:45,480
Speaker 3: part four, and I remember watching that with women, white people,

1112
00:52:45,680 --> 00:52:49,840
Speaker 3: black people, whatever, and people being brought to tears, like

1113
00:52:50,000 --> 00:52:52,600
Speaker 3: why are they being brought to tears about its beautiful sequence?

1114
00:52:52,640 --> 00:52:57,719
Speaker 3: But because they can. They love him and they see

1115
00:52:57,760 --> 00:53:00,560
Speaker 3: they're getting ready to lose them, and they see him

1116
00:53:00,600 --> 00:53:04,239
Speaker 3: running past the stop scigns, And you don't feel emotional

1117
00:53:04,239 --> 00:53:05,880
Speaker 3: for something you don't love. And I think in the

1118
00:53:05,920 --> 00:53:08,160
Speaker 3: case in Menace, when you get to the end, you

1119
00:53:08,200 --> 00:53:11,560
Speaker 3: love these kids. And it's so random. The whole movie's

1120
00:53:11,560 --> 00:53:13,000
Speaker 3: been so random. You're like, I don't know who's I

1121
00:53:13,000 --> 00:53:16,239
Speaker 3: see these motherfuckers coming around the corner. They going to Atlanta.

1122
00:53:16,719 --> 00:53:19,440
Speaker 3: They're going to Atlanta, you know, And that's how you

1123
00:53:19,480 --> 00:53:21,799
Speaker 3: get people, That's how you that's how you get people.

1124
00:53:21,800 --> 00:53:23,839
Speaker 3: But in particularly, I wanted to wake we wanted to

1125
00:53:24,120 --> 00:53:27,200
Speaker 3: wake white America up because, as they said, you know,

1126
00:53:27,239 --> 00:53:30,640
Speaker 3: you see on TV back then people crying over little

1127
00:53:30,719 --> 00:53:35,280
Speaker 3: seals getting killed or like really trying to rescue dogs,

1128
00:53:35,280 --> 00:53:39,279
Speaker 3: but not trying to rescue black children. And and so

1129
00:53:39,880 --> 00:53:44,719
Speaker 3: clearly there's a feeling missing here, you know, Compassion missing here,

1130
00:53:45,280 --> 00:53:49,480
Speaker 3: identity like identifying with black children as human beings. And say,

1131
00:53:49,480 --> 00:53:51,279
Speaker 3: all right, let's real them in, let's really them in,

1132
00:53:51,520 --> 00:53:54,640
Speaker 3: let's get them into these kids, and let's start popping

1133
00:53:54,680 --> 00:53:57,000
Speaker 3: them off randomly, the good one too, and maybe not

1134
00:53:57,080 --> 00:53:59,160
Speaker 3: the bad one lives, the bad one lives, you know,

1135
00:53:59,280 --> 00:54:03,839
Speaker 3: start just the way life is. And and it, thank god,

1136
00:54:03,880 --> 00:54:05,880
Speaker 3: it did wake him up. It did go wow, like

1137
00:54:05,960 --> 00:54:07,880
Speaker 3: this is this is not only that, but like this

1138
00:54:07,960 --> 00:54:10,160
Speaker 3: is what's going on. This is why it's going on,

1139
00:54:10,200 --> 00:54:14,000
Speaker 3: because the real thing is, like why, you.

1140
00:54:13,960 --> 00:54:16,120
Speaker 4: Know, I'm glad you rejected the idea of a sequel,

1141
00:54:16,120 --> 00:54:21,799
Speaker 4: even though I have still don't answer the questions. I'm like, what, like,

1142
00:54:21,800 --> 00:54:23,879
Speaker 4: like what happened to Anthony? Did he grow up? Did

1143
00:54:24,440 --> 00:54:26,799
Speaker 4: old dog get released from prison? I still don't know

1144
00:54:26,800 --> 00:54:30,120
Speaker 4: how to King steal the rims? This is the eight

1145
00:54:30,200 --> 00:54:34,960
Speaker 4: year old beat Society is so inappropriate. I know, I'm sorry.

1146
00:54:35,200 --> 00:54:36,560
Speaker 3: What was the last one you can say? You still

1147
00:54:36,560 --> 00:54:38,799
Speaker 3: don't know how what King stole the rims at the

1148
00:54:38,920 --> 00:54:41,960
Speaker 3: drive through? Well, he kicked the motherfucker off the car,

1149
00:54:42,040 --> 00:54:44,240
Speaker 3: took it to the shop, chopped it and took it

1150
00:54:44,360 --> 00:54:45,200
Speaker 3: chopped and screwed that.

1151
00:54:46,040 --> 00:54:47,799
Speaker 4: But there's just it's just it's just one of those

1152
00:54:47,840 --> 00:54:51,080
Speaker 4: movies you know what was your reaction to when menace

1153
00:54:51,120 --> 00:54:53,080
Speaker 4: don't be a menace to society, don't be a menace

1154
00:54:53,120 --> 00:54:53,520
Speaker 4: of South.

1155
00:54:53,360 --> 00:54:56,640
Speaker 3: Since it's always a compliment, you know, when it starts

1156
00:54:56,640 --> 00:54:59,239
Speaker 3: getting spoofed, that means it's in the culture hall. Yeah,

1157
00:54:59,640 --> 00:55:00,480
Speaker 3: I like those guys.

1158
00:55:00,640 --> 00:55:02,279
Speaker 2: You know, how do you have liked the dialogue like

1159
00:55:02,480 --> 00:55:06,480
Speaker 2: those movies with the dialogue of highlights of cern films

1160
00:55:06,480 --> 00:55:07,600
Speaker 2: and stuff like that that you have.

1161
00:55:08,440 --> 00:55:11,440
Speaker 3: That's you know, now thirty years you go, fuck, thank

1162
00:55:11,480 --> 00:55:14,160
Speaker 3: god we were young, because I don't feel old, you know,

1163
00:55:14,160 --> 00:55:15,839
Speaker 3: because say we did that shit when we were thirty,

1164
00:55:15,840 --> 00:55:20,600
Speaker 3: I would feel hold. But that's again you just go, damn.

1165
00:55:20,640 --> 00:55:23,000
Speaker 3: I can't believe. To this day, I can't. I can't

1166
00:55:23,000 --> 00:55:26,879
Speaker 3: believe people. I remember your cousin, I remember you. When

1167
00:55:26,880 --> 00:55:29,759
Speaker 3: the movie came out, it was maybe even that year.

1168
00:55:29,880 --> 00:55:31,879
Speaker 3: We were at the Essex House off the Central Park

1169
00:55:32,520 --> 00:55:35,719
Speaker 3: and little Leonardo DiCaprio ran up to us, and little Leo,

1170
00:55:35,760 --> 00:55:38,839
Speaker 3: I said, because he was seventeen. I never met Leo

1171
00:55:39,520 --> 00:55:41,239
Speaker 3: in my life. I don't even know who. I knew

1172
00:55:41,239 --> 00:55:43,399
Speaker 3: who he was, Gilbert Grapeist and the other he wasn't

1173
00:55:43,400 --> 00:55:45,719
Speaker 3: the Leo we know now absolutely he's a teenager. He

1174
00:55:45,800 --> 00:55:49,239
Speaker 3: ran up and said all those lines as if he

1175
00:55:49,360 --> 00:55:51,640
Speaker 3: was a black kid and he had the cadence and everything.

1176
00:55:51,640 --> 00:55:55,239
Speaker 3: I was like, what is this kid? This is in

1177
00:55:55,360 --> 00:55:58,000
Speaker 3: that time it came out and then the years ago

1178
00:55:58,040 --> 00:56:01,960
Speaker 3: on you go, I remember this, I remember Ended or Dragon.

1179
00:56:02,040 --> 00:56:07,439
Speaker 3: We memorized all the lines. I remember Scarface that number one.

1180
00:56:07,520 --> 00:56:12,480
Speaker 3: You memorize all the lines. It just that means you

1181
00:56:12,520 --> 00:56:15,799
Speaker 3: have something. Now. My problem is I always me and

1182
00:56:15,840 --> 00:56:18,799
Speaker 3: my brother both have problems with menace, and like, oh,

1183
00:56:19,000 --> 00:56:23,160
Speaker 3: that's fact that that's like you know. Like so I said,

1184
00:56:23,480 --> 00:56:25,359
Speaker 3: finally I had a piece I gave myself a piece

1185
00:56:25,360 --> 00:56:27,320
Speaker 3: of mind because two of my favorite films of all time,

1186
00:56:28,040 --> 00:56:31,319
Speaker 3: outside of Scarface, which is probably seen more than any

1187
00:56:31,320 --> 00:56:35,080
Speaker 3: film really because entered Dragon, Bruce Lee in Purple Rain.

1188
00:56:36,000 --> 00:56:38,600
Speaker 3: But if you watch both those films, they got a

1189
00:56:38,640 --> 00:56:41,080
Speaker 3: lot of corny moments in the right flo but not

1190
00:56:41,120 --> 00:56:43,600
Speaker 3: when the motherfuckers are performing brut when it's time to

1191
00:56:43,680 --> 00:56:46,359
Speaker 3: kick some masks, it's impeccable. When it's time at Purple

1192
00:56:46,440 --> 00:56:48,759
Speaker 3: Rain for Press to hit that stage, it's impeccable. The

1193
00:56:48,800 --> 00:56:50,880
Speaker 3: way it shot, the way he's moving, the way he's singing.

1194
00:56:50,920 --> 00:56:53,279
Speaker 3: So I go, I guess menace. When it was time

1195
00:56:53,480 --> 00:56:56,799
Speaker 3: for the jump off, we did our thing. There's some

1196
00:56:56,840 --> 00:56:59,080
Speaker 3: problems in between, and just move on al and let

1197
00:56:59,120 --> 00:57:01,600
Speaker 3: it go, you know, watch your stuff done. No, no,

1198
00:57:01,960 --> 00:57:04,800
Speaker 3: once it's done, it's nah. I can't watch that especially.

1199
00:57:04,880 --> 00:57:07,680
Speaker 3: That onen't hell though people tell me that. Like someone

1200
00:57:07,719 --> 00:57:09,359
Speaker 3: came up to me last Weekdear, I just saw minutes

1201
00:57:09,400 --> 00:57:14,000
Speaker 3: last time. I'm sorry. I feel like I like, Dan,

1202
00:57:14,040 --> 00:57:16,360
Speaker 3: don't judge me, you know, and I'm serious, Like there's

1203
00:57:16,400 --> 00:57:18,440
Speaker 3: some really corny shit in that movie. Yeah.

1204
00:57:18,640 --> 00:57:20,840
Speaker 2: You also said something about dead presidents that you feel

1205
00:57:20,880 --> 00:57:23,120
Speaker 2: you were too young to make that film big time.

1206
00:57:23,280 --> 00:57:26,959
Speaker 3: Wow, that's like a war Vets coming home, grown men

1207
00:57:27,000 --> 00:57:33,080
Speaker 3: coming home from grown man experiences black men, and it's like,

1208
00:57:33,200 --> 00:57:36,760
Speaker 3: real shit. We were twenty two and you know, we

1209
00:57:36,840 --> 00:57:39,080
Speaker 3: understood what we read and we did our research. But

1210
00:57:40,080 --> 00:57:43,000
Speaker 3: there's not enough experiential, there's not enough life lived to

1211
00:57:43,560 --> 00:57:46,240
Speaker 3: have really told that story and giving it justice. And again,

1212
00:57:46,840 --> 00:57:49,760
Speaker 3: there's some moments in it that are interesting and dynamic,

1213
00:57:49,800 --> 00:57:53,040
Speaker 3: but as a whole, it's a little uneven and doesn't

1214
00:57:53,080 --> 00:57:56,200
Speaker 3: work in areas and man, it is what's.

1215
00:57:55,960 --> 00:57:57,760
Speaker 4: Too hard on yourself out And man, I think such

1216
00:57:57,760 --> 00:58:01,040
Speaker 4: a great period piece, Like I watched it with thirty

1217
00:58:01,120 --> 00:58:02,840
Speaker 4: year old eyes as opposed to when I saw it

1218
00:58:02,880 --> 00:58:04,640
Speaker 4: as a teen, and I'm like, wow, this is like

1219
00:58:05,960 --> 00:58:07,760
Speaker 4: it feels like I'm back in New York City in

1220
00:58:07,760 --> 00:58:09,840
Speaker 4: the nineteen seventies, the time that I don't even know

1221
00:58:09,880 --> 00:58:12,280
Speaker 4: what feels. It looks like like even when I heard

1222
00:58:12,720 --> 00:58:16,880
Speaker 4: Isaac Hayes to Walk on By, it sounds identify with

1223
00:58:16,920 --> 00:58:17,640
Speaker 4: that movie.

1224
00:58:17,920 --> 00:58:21,439
Speaker 3: Yeah, And that saves a lot of scenes. Is when

1225
00:58:21,440 --> 00:58:24,480
Speaker 3: you have something because how authentic is you know who's

1226
00:58:24,480 --> 00:58:26,640
Speaker 3: on your T shirt and Isaac Hay's two of my

1227
00:58:26,680 --> 00:58:29,640
Speaker 3: favorites from that era. When you drop that needle as

1228
00:58:29,640 --> 00:58:32,200
Speaker 3: in Even with Menace, and you hit that needle and

1229
00:58:32,240 --> 00:58:34,760
Speaker 3: you play love and happiness, It's going to make you

1230
00:58:34,800 --> 00:58:37,000
Speaker 3: feel a certain way that the scene may not even

1231
00:58:37,400 --> 00:58:39,440
Speaker 3: really have in it. So that was the beauty of

1232
00:58:39,800 --> 00:58:42,320
Speaker 3: even on Dead Presidence. I remember we went and shot

1233
00:58:42,360 --> 00:58:44,440
Speaker 3: a music video out in the desert where they did

1234
00:58:44,440 --> 00:58:46,440
Speaker 3: the night ride or opening, you know, we did the

1235
00:58:46,800 --> 00:58:50,000
Speaker 3: Walk on By and we brought Lorenz, Chris Tucker and

1236
00:58:50,040 --> 00:58:55,320
Speaker 3: the Bushy Right and Isaac Hayes and we found the

1237
00:58:55,440 --> 00:58:58,560
Speaker 3: june bug glasses he used to wear and we shot

1238
00:58:58,560 --> 00:59:02,240
Speaker 3: a music video to a song twenty five years after

1239
00:59:02,240 --> 00:59:06,160
Speaker 3: the song wow, and Isaac Hayes looked exactly the same. Wow.

1240
00:59:06,480 --> 00:59:08,320
Speaker 4: You see the impact of that film all the time though,

1241
00:59:08,400 --> 00:59:11,960
Speaker 4: especially like in Halloween, Yeah, dressed up like yeah, what

1242
00:59:12,040 --> 00:59:12,880
Speaker 4: do you think about that?

1243
00:59:13,400 --> 00:59:16,479
Speaker 3: Again? It's an honor, you know, you just I think

1244
00:59:16,520 --> 00:59:20,480
Speaker 3: now the thing I think about just exciting to make two.

1245
00:59:21,360 --> 00:59:24,000
Speaker 3: I would have loved to make their presidence now, you know,

1246
00:59:24,000 --> 00:59:25,720
Speaker 3: because I know I know what I would be able

1247
00:59:25,760 --> 00:59:28,760
Speaker 3: to do now. But now I got twenty five thirty

1248
00:59:28,840 --> 00:59:30,400
Speaker 3: years of doing this, So now I'm like, all right,

1249
00:59:30,600 --> 00:59:34,680
Speaker 3: let's focus on Let's focus on storytelling now that I

1250
00:59:34,720 --> 00:59:36,640
Speaker 3: know what it is. When you're young, you don't have

1251
00:59:36,720 --> 00:59:39,640
Speaker 3: full command of everything, and you're young, you're on the set.

1252
00:59:39,680 --> 00:59:42,600
Speaker 3: And when we were young, we didn't realize there was

1253
00:59:42,600 --> 00:59:44,560
Speaker 3: this palpable thing on the set with these men. I

1254
00:59:44,640 --> 00:59:46,480
Speaker 3: didn't understand what it was. They were looking at us

1255
00:59:46,480 --> 00:59:51,440
Speaker 3: like these mother. I didn't understand that they were judging

1256
00:59:51,520 --> 00:59:54,520
Speaker 3: us and they were pushing back against us. So you're

1257
00:59:54,560 --> 00:59:59,200
Speaker 3: not you know, you're not. I don't know, you're not

1258
00:59:59,360 --> 01:00:03,440
Speaker 3: moving as effortlessly as you could. Every movie, everything is

1259
01:00:03,760 --> 01:00:07,560
Speaker 3: takes is challenging. But as you grow wiser in life,

1260
01:00:07,600 --> 01:00:10,960
Speaker 3: you find again the difference between reacting and responding. You know,

1261
01:00:11,040 --> 01:00:14,400
Speaker 3: you start to deal with things in wiser ways, and

1262
01:00:14,440 --> 01:00:16,160
Speaker 3: you know how to tell the fucking story.

1263
01:00:16,320 --> 01:00:18,320
Speaker 2: You know, I hope, how are you going to tell

1264
01:00:18,320 --> 01:00:21,080
Speaker 2: the story of Snoop dogg oh Man?

1265
01:00:21,480 --> 01:00:25,400
Speaker 3: That's a joy. But you know, it's funny because all

1266
01:00:25,720 --> 01:00:27,280
Speaker 3: through the years and a lot of what we're talking about,

1267
01:00:27,280 --> 01:00:30,480
Speaker 3: people always go speaking of the sequel to Menace, one

1268
01:00:30,480 --> 01:00:32,840
Speaker 3: of you guys are making a sequel to Menace, or

1269
01:00:33,040 --> 01:00:35,320
Speaker 3: one of you guys don't make another Hood film. And

1270
01:00:35,360 --> 01:00:37,680
Speaker 3: when Snoop brought this to me, and me and Stupid

1271
01:00:37,680 --> 01:00:40,000
Speaker 3: been trying to work on projects throughout the years. It's

1272
01:00:40,000 --> 01:00:45,280
Speaker 3: a Snoop Dog biopiict Universal Pictures like fast Track film.

1273
01:00:45,800 --> 01:00:49,560
Speaker 3: He made a big deal with them with his life story, writes,

1274
01:00:50,280 --> 01:00:53,920
Speaker 3: and I was like, wow, now here we have something

1275
01:00:53,960 --> 01:00:58,200
Speaker 3: because we get to do a Hood film. But it

1276
01:00:58,200 --> 01:01:01,240
Speaker 3: it also goes past the Hood, transcends the Hood and

1277
01:01:01,360 --> 01:01:05,760
Speaker 3: is inspiring ultimately. Right, you got a guy that was

1278
01:01:05,840 --> 01:01:08,919
Speaker 3: the rock star of that era, and in the same

1279
01:01:09,000 --> 01:01:12,720
Speaker 3: era he's on trial for murder and thank god beats

1280
01:01:12,760 --> 01:01:15,040
Speaker 3: the beats the case, and then you got all that

1281
01:01:15,040 --> 01:01:18,360
Speaker 3: little window where Snoop dimmed his light for Tupac. I

1282
01:01:18,400 --> 01:01:21,400
Speaker 3: never understood that back then. I remember Snoop just dimming

1283
01:01:21,400 --> 01:01:25,479
Speaker 3: his lighting letting Tupac shine when Snoop was the guy,

1284
01:01:25,840 --> 01:01:28,880
Speaker 3: you know, and then what happened after and what happened

1285
01:01:28,880 --> 01:01:32,640
Speaker 3: with Death Row. But the movies Snoop Dogg seventeen to

1286
01:01:32,680 --> 01:01:36,000
Speaker 3: twenty seven, it's from high school when two on three

1287
01:01:36,040 --> 01:01:40,800
Speaker 3: is formed with Nate Dogg and Warren g and all

1288
01:01:40,800 --> 01:01:45,760
Speaker 3: the music they were doing getting discovered, making the chronic

1289
01:01:48,120 --> 01:01:52,520
Speaker 3: doggy style, and then you know Tupac, Death Row era

1290
01:01:52,560 --> 01:01:54,880
Speaker 3: and Snoop out kind of you know. So it's like

1291
01:01:55,000 --> 01:01:57,280
Speaker 3: it's ten years of Snoop's life. Yea, has he begin

1292
01:01:57,360 --> 01:02:00,560
Speaker 3: shooting it? No? Right when the strike is over? Strike

1293
01:02:01,480 --> 01:02:03,640
Speaker 3: where we got to solve this strike got to date

1294
01:02:03,680 --> 01:02:06,400
Speaker 3: this podcast. When the strike is over, who do you

1295
01:02:06,440 --> 01:02:09,640
Speaker 3: cast a Snoop? That's the million dollar question. In fact,

1296
01:02:09,680 --> 01:02:11,439
Speaker 3: I thought about this last week. I said, I got

1297
01:02:11,440 --> 01:02:15,360
Speaker 3: a call to the executive at our executive at Universal

1298
01:02:15,360 --> 01:02:18,520
Speaker 3: Picture and say, you know what, even when the script

1299
01:02:18,560 --> 01:02:22,560
Speaker 3: is perfect, which there's no such thing, as, we cannot

1300
01:02:23,080 --> 01:02:26,640
Speaker 3: go into production until we're sure about the Snoop. Don't

1301
01:02:26,640 --> 01:02:29,400
Speaker 3: be half assed like, oh he kind is right, like

1302
01:02:29,640 --> 01:02:31,760
Speaker 3: we got to do like, holy shit, this guy Snoop,

1303
01:02:32,200 --> 01:02:35,800
Speaker 3: or don't shoot the film because he's so singular and

1304
01:02:35,920 --> 01:02:38,760
Speaker 3: just the sound of his voice and how he moves

1305
01:02:38,760 --> 01:02:40,440
Speaker 3: and whatever you go, and you don't want it to

1306
01:02:40,440 --> 01:02:43,000
Speaker 3: be a mimic. So it's he's a hard one to crack.

1307
01:02:43,040 --> 01:02:45,720
Speaker 3: I think for an actor, that's a difficult one. An

1308
01:02:45,760 --> 01:02:49,080
Speaker 3: unknown maybe I would prefer I would prefer. Yeah, he

1309
01:02:49,160 --> 01:02:52,760
Speaker 3: has sons. Yeah, I don't know if any of them

1310
01:02:52,840 --> 01:02:55,120
Speaker 3: is tall as Snoop though, that's the other thing. It

1311
01:02:55,200 --> 01:02:56,040
Speaker 3: was tall. Right.

1312
01:02:57,160 --> 01:03:01,240
Speaker 4: It's interesting he's coming from you from Detroit going and raised,

1313
01:03:01,320 --> 01:03:03,560
Speaker 4: well not raised, but it came to la right, what

1314
01:03:03,680 --> 01:03:04,400
Speaker 4: twelve years old?

1315
01:03:04,520 --> 01:03:06,000
Speaker 3: Well, I left when I was eight when you saw

1316
01:03:06,000 --> 01:03:06,360
Speaker 3: a menace?

1317
01:03:08,000 --> 01:03:12,120
Speaker 4: Right, yeah, and coming from l A that I mean,

1318
01:03:12,120 --> 01:03:13,800
Speaker 4: coming from Detroit. That has to be like a culture

1319
01:03:13,840 --> 01:03:16,480
Speaker 4: shock though, right, what was that transition like for you.

1320
01:03:17,320 --> 01:03:19,240
Speaker 3: Like anyone from the East coast or the Midwest When

1321
01:03:19,280 --> 01:03:22,040
Speaker 3: you see these palm trees and you see these palm

1322
01:03:22,040 --> 01:03:24,360
Speaker 3: trees and then the second thing you say is where

1323
01:03:24,360 --> 01:03:27,800
Speaker 3: the snake's at? We thought the snake was everywhere, right,

1324
01:03:29,320 --> 01:03:31,000
Speaker 3: it was, it was. It was a trip, but it

1325
01:03:31,040 --> 01:03:35,080
Speaker 3: was an easy transition because in Detroit, like Chicago, in

1326
01:03:35,160 --> 01:03:37,960
Speaker 3: any place back then, those winners are brutal. Yeah, so

1327
01:03:38,040 --> 01:03:40,240
Speaker 3: we were happy to be here, and we came here

1328
01:03:40,240 --> 01:03:41,480
Speaker 3: to be in front of the King. We thought we

1329
01:03:41,480 --> 01:03:44,320
Speaker 3: were going to be little child actors or you know.

1330
01:03:45,200 --> 01:03:48,480
Speaker 3: We started doing auditioning for Oscar Mayer commercials and between

1331
01:03:48,480 --> 01:03:51,200
Speaker 3: the big ass noses and the lack of talent that

1332
01:03:51,440 --> 01:03:57,120
Speaker 3: spluttered out really quickly. Back then, I had had the

1333
01:03:57,160 --> 01:04:01,840
Speaker 3: first thing. Yeah, we were you know, it was fucked up.

1334
01:04:02,760 --> 01:04:04,800
Speaker 3: So but we were out here. We had some of

1335
01:04:05,760 --> 01:04:08,840
Speaker 3: my mother's family was out here, are Armenion family, Some

1336
01:04:08,880 --> 01:04:11,240
Speaker 3: of our Armenian family was out here. So we came

1337
01:04:11,320 --> 01:04:14,439
Speaker 3: to beat with family and it was great. I don't

1338
01:04:14,480 --> 01:04:17,280
Speaker 3: remember culture shock. I don't remember, because how could you

1339
01:04:17,320 --> 01:04:20,640
Speaker 3: be shocked by not being in a cold ass snowy winter.

1340
01:04:21,080 --> 01:04:24,440
Speaker 3: Detroit was fucking and Detroit at the time, in the

1341
01:04:24,520 --> 01:04:27,920
Speaker 3: late seventies was fucked up. You know. It's now like

1342
01:04:28,800 --> 01:04:32,919
Speaker 3: you know, rebooted and reinvented itself, but it was really bad.

1343
01:04:33,040 --> 01:04:35,479
Speaker 3: He saw that film that Michael Jackson did the title

1344
01:04:35,520 --> 01:04:39,760
Speaker 3: track ben about the big ass rats, dim rats Detroit.

1345
01:04:40,440 --> 01:04:43,520
Speaker 3: I swear to God, like we got a cat and

1346
01:04:43,600 --> 01:04:46,120
Speaker 3: we were staying with our dad in the tenements. We

1347
01:04:46,160 --> 01:04:48,360
Speaker 3: got a cat to get rid of the motherfucking rats. Right,

1348
01:04:48,600 --> 01:04:51,520
Speaker 3: the cat went missing after like three days, the cat

1349
01:04:51,560 --> 01:04:53,760
Speaker 3: went missing. Me and my brother are pulling the sled

1350
01:04:53,880 --> 01:04:57,440
Speaker 3: around the back of the apartment building. That cat was

1351
01:04:57,520 --> 01:05:00,480
Speaker 3: laid open like this and the rats in it. Ah

1352
01:05:00,720 --> 01:05:06,000
Speaker 3: man in his ass, like that's Detroit, but that ain't

1353
01:05:06,040 --> 01:05:09,800
Speaker 3: his ass, that's his chest. Cameras guts everything but coming

1354
01:05:09,880 --> 01:05:10,320
Speaker 3: in la.

1355
01:05:10,440 --> 01:05:12,920
Speaker 4: Right, I'm thinking early eighties, he got colors, right, and

1356
01:05:13,000 --> 01:05:15,600
Speaker 4: you guys, no, that's ladies, late eighties, right, Okay, But

1357
01:05:15,680 --> 01:05:18,680
Speaker 4: how did you guys avoid like the trappings of gang life.

1358
01:05:18,800 --> 01:05:21,320
Speaker 3: That's a good question because that's funny you say early

1359
01:05:21,400 --> 01:05:25,920
Speaker 3: late because early eighties there's none of that. There's no crack.

1360
01:05:26,760 --> 01:05:29,080
Speaker 3: So you're doing the first four years of the eighties.

1361
01:05:29,560 --> 01:05:31,960
Speaker 3: We don't know about crack. We don't know nothing that

1362
01:05:32,000 --> 01:05:33,360
Speaker 3: hip hop. Ain't got nothing to do with that. But

1363
01:05:33,360 --> 01:05:36,640
Speaker 3: we don't know about no hip hop. And in gang

1364
01:05:36,800 --> 01:05:38,840
Speaker 3: it's still like the movies, like you get shot with

1365
01:05:38,880 --> 01:05:41,520
Speaker 3: a Saturday Night special type thing you can still get

1366
01:05:42,280 --> 01:05:46,680
Speaker 3: get shanked, stabbed like. It wasn't like Kalishnikoff's AK forty seven.

1367
01:05:47,000 --> 01:05:51,520
Speaker 3: You know, there's none of that. Once crack came, my

1368
01:05:51,560 --> 01:05:54,440
Speaker 3: mother started worked her way from welfare to being a

1369
01:05:54,440 --> 01:05:59,280
Speaker 3: millionaire through her just business acumen, putting herself through school

1370
01:06:00,040 --> 01:06:05,920
Speaker 3: so on the Williams side, and was becoming successful. In

1371
01:06:06,040 --> 01:06:11,120
Speaker 3: eighty four, my mom with her own business, and our

1372
01:06:11,200 --> 01:06:14,160
Speaker 3: friends had the Adida suits on and the chains. Their

1373
01:06:14,200 --> 01:06:17,280
Speaker 3: mother wasn't making no money, but her priority was to

1374
01:06:17,280 --> 01:06:19,919
Speaker 3: give her son what he wanted. My mom was like, nope,

1375
01:06:19,920 --> 01:06:21,680
Speaker 3: we're going to pay less shoes, get you pay lest,

1376
01:06:21,840 --> 01:06:24,680
Speaker 3: get your three jeans, three shirts, and rotate them shits

1377
01:06:24,680 --> 01:06:28,280
Speaker 3: throughout the week. And I'm like, damn. We could see

1378
01:06:28,280 --> 01:06:31,160
Speaker 3: she's making a little money. But she once she knew

1379
01:06:31,200 --> 01:06:33,240
Speaker 3: we wanted to make those movies, she would go get

1380
01:06:33,280 --> 01:06:36,960
Speaker 3: the the camera, rent the camera, spending the little equipment

1381
01:06:37,120 --> 01:06:39,840
Speaker 3: spending on that. And then she saw one time, we're twelve,

1382
01:06:39,840 --> 01:06:41,840
Speaker 3: we spent we're twenty. We at the camera for a day.

1383
01:06:42,000 --> 01:06:45,080
Speaker 3: We stepped the whole day and shot movies, not skateboard videos,

1384
01:06:45,280 --> 01:06:48,440
Speaker 3: not being X videos, not that you know shit that

1385
01:06:48,560 --> 01:06:52,120
Speaker 3: most kids, we should movies. And then the next summer

1386
01:06:52,160 --> 01:06:55,600
Speaker 3: she bought the camera. She brought the VCR that you

1387
01:06:55,600 --> 01:06:58,360
Speaker 3: can pop out and do shit with. And she always

1388
01:06:58,360 --> 01:07:00,760
Speaker 3: invested in the arts, and that's what. And then one

1389
01:07:00,760 --> 01:07:03,160
Speaker 3: time we sat her down and then we did a

1390
01:07:03,200 --> 01:07:08,200
Speaker 3: documentary about a crack dealer Pat then and five and

1391
01:07:08,240 --> 01:07:11,720
Speaker 3: then one day cut to now to what you just said.

1392
01:07:11,760 --> 01:07:15,080
Speaker 3: Eighty eight eighty eight our friends selling crack in a

1393
01:07:15,160 --> 01:07:18,280
Speaker 3: predominantly wealthy high school in Claremont, California. And he comes

1394
01:07:18,320 --> 01:07:20,880
Speaker 3: from the Cosby home. The kid I'm talking about, his

1395
01:07:20,920 --> 01:07:22,520
Speaker 3: house is like the Cosby How Like why is he

1396
01:07:22,600 --> 01:07:25,240
Speaker 3: selling crack with the money that your grandmother left you? Like?

1397
01:07:25,280 --> 01:07:28,040
Speaker 3: This is crazy? So but it was sexy. This is

1398
01:07:28,080 --> 01:07:30,480
Speaker 3: one thing no one wants to talk about. In eighty

1399
01:07:30,520 --> 01:07:33,760
Speaker 3: eight in hip hop, gang and colors and all that stuff,

1400
01:07:33,960 --> 01:07:36,800
Speaker 3: gang banging had you wanted a beeper even if you

1401
01:07:36,800 --> 01:07:39,000
Speaker 3: were a well due, you wanted to sell crack. No

1402
01:07:39,080 --> 01:07:41,400
Speaker 3: one ever wants to talk about this, But you wanted

1403
01:07:41,400 --> 01:07:43,919
Speaker 3: to be a drug dealer, even if your parents were

1404
01:07:43,960 --> 01:07:45,840
Speaker 3: doing well. You wanted to sell. Because I have plenty

1405
01:07:45,880 --> 01:07:48,040
Speaker 3: of friends that were selling drugs and they didn't need

1406
01:07:48,040 --> 01:07:50,640
Speaker 3: to sell drugs, but they wanted to low profile tires.

1407
01:07:51,000 --> 01:07:54,040
Speaker 3: They wanted to do whatever. So we sat down with

1408
01:07:54,040 --> 01:07:56,040
Speaker 3: our mother in eighty eight, now that we live in Claremont,

1409
01:07:56,080 --> 01:07:57,760
Speaker 3: we were living in Pomona at the time, which is

1410
01:07:58,080 --> 01:08:02,840
Speaker 3: the hood, and we said, Mom about selling crack something

1411
01:08:02,880 --> 01:08:06,960
Speaker 3: that's hard to her, and she's like, no, no, why

1412
01:08:07,200 --> 01:08:10,560
Speaker 3: you know, like, you know, going to this wealthy high school.

1413
01:08:10,560 --> 01:08:14,120
Speaker 3: All the kids got BMW's and they which they did Mercedes,

1414
01:08:14,160 --> 01:08:16,600
Speaker 3: and we got this piece of ship and you know,

1415
01:08:17,000 --> 01:08:18,280
Speaker 3: I was getting ready to name my friend. I'm going

1416
01:08:18,360 --> 01:08:20,120
Speaker 3: to throw one of those, you know, my man's over here.

1417
01:08:20,160 --> 01:08:22,840
Speaker 3: You got the ship. She's like, what do you need?

1418
01:08:23,280 --> 01:08:25,559
Speaker 3: What do you need? She took us to Circus City.

1419
01:08:25,880 --> 01:08:28,519
Speaker 3: You guys, remember did you just have Circus City. She

1420
01:08:28,600 --> 01:08:31,960
Speaker 3: bought us like three thousand dollars worth of equipment. Wow,

1421
01:08:32,200 --> 01:08:35,920
Speaker 3: stop that ship. Stop that ship. Right.

1422
01:08:36,920 --> 01:08:39,519
Speaker 4: But even during that time, obviously you're in the middle

1423
01:08:39,560 --> 01:08:42,680
Speaker 4: of hip hop's, you know, rides like but what were

1424
01:08:42,720 --> 01:08:43,760
Speaker 4: you listening to at that time?

1425
01:08:43,760 --> 01:08:46,200
Speaker 3: Like what did you gravitate? Easy E? Just easy easy

1426
01:08:46,240 --> 01:08:50,320
Speaker 3: E n w A. And of course there was a

1427
01:08:50,320 --> 01:08:53,519
Speaker 3: lot happening at that time. The first Tribe record I

1428
01:08:53,560 --> 01:08:56,559
Speaker 3: believe Big Daddy came was big. I'm trying to figure

1429
01:08:56,560 --> 01:08:59,360
Speaker 3: out what we were listening to. We were obsessed with

1430
01:08:59,400 --> 01:09:01,800
Speaker 3: the West Coast thing at the time. Of course LLL

1431
01:09:01,960 --> 01:09:04,280
Speaker 3: was always at the top of the list and run DMC,

1432
01:09:04,360 --> 01:09:07,320
Speaker 3: but by eighty eight they weren't no longer, even though

1433
01:09:07,439 --> 01:09:11,960
Speaker 3: LLL kept kidding them again in eighty eight, it was

1434
01:09:12,080 --> 01:09:14,479
Speaker 3: it was, it was, it was, it was, it was,

1435
01:09:14,800 --> 01:09:17,000
Speaker 3: it was. It was easy E and n w A

1436
01:09:17,479 --> 01:09:20,960
Speaker 3: and it was the DC. And I'm trying to remember

1437
01:09:21,000 --> 01:09:24,479
Speaker 3: who else I was fascinating just those on repeat. You know,

1438
01:09:24,760 --> 01:09:27,120
Speaker 3: I'm having to act like it was very eclectic back then.

1439
01:09:27,320 --> 01:09:27,800
Speaker 3: How proud it is?

1440
01:09:27,840 --> 01:09:29,960
Speaker 2: It not like its covering all the West Coast giants

1441
01:09:30,000 --> 01:09:33,400
Speaker 2: with POC, Dre Snoop coming up, Like you become that

1442
01:09:33,439 --> 01:09:35,760
Speaker 2: person who told these people's stories.

1443
01:09:36,800 --> 01:09:39,120
Speaker 3: You know, like I never even planned on that, which

1444
01:09:39,160 --> 01:09:43,400
Speaker 3: is but it's cool because you know, not only us

1445
01:09:43,479 --> 01:09:45,960
Speaker 3: all coming up in hip hop culture, but you know,

1446
01:09:46,640 --> 01:09:48,800
Speaker 3: if you just move hip hop culture aside and you

1447
01:09:48,840 --> 01:09:53,439
Speaker 3: go twenty thirty years ago when we were teenagers going

1448
01:09:53,479 --> 01:09:57,240
Speaker 3: into college, you didn't get the opportunity to tell you

1449
01:09:57,240 --> 01:10:01,400
Speaker 3: your story, tell your stories. You know, in the eighties,

1450
01:10:01,920 --> 01:10:05,040
Speaker 3: we didn't have the opportunity to tell our stories or

1451
01:10:05,120 --> 01:10:08,920
Speaker 3: control our stories hard, to control the narrative barely. Ever,

1452
01:10:08,960 --> 01:10:12,920
Speaker 3: there were some exceptions, Gordon Parks, the Spike Lee was

1453
01:10:12,960 --> 01:10:16,519
Speaker 3: coming on it in the eighties there, but you were

1454
01:10:16,600 --> 01:10:18,479
Speaker 3: if you sold the script or you sold something to

1455
01:10:18,640 --> 01:10:20,960
Speaker 3: particularly say it was about. We didn't have any hip

1456
01:10:20,960 --> 01:10:23,559
Speaker 3: hop history, so what would you be talking about? Right,

1457
01:10:23,680 --> 01:10:27,000
Speaker 3: And you know to that, But if you were wanted

1458
01:10:27,000 --> 01:10:30,400
Speaker 3: to tell the Miles Davis story in eighty five, you're

1459
01:10:30,400 --> 01:10:32,360
Speaker 3: not getting that done. And if you were lucky enough

1460
01:10:32,360 --> 01:10:37,800
Speaker 3: as a black filmmaker, they're not letting you. They're controlling everything, right,

1461
01:10:38,320 --> 01:10:40,800
Speaker 3: So it's surreal to be here now. They say hip

1462
01:10:40,840 --> 01:10:47,200
Speaker 3: hops turned fifty, but hip hops really turned thirty five,

1463
01:10:48,120 --> 01:10:50,240
Speaker 3: you know, talking about like as far as like the

1464
01:10:50,280 --> 01:10:53,519
Speaker 3: prominent thing in the culture where everyone like, yo, this

1465
01:10:53,600 --> 01:10:57,040
Speaker 3: is unless you're from New York and you were back then.

1466
01:10:57,120 --> 01:11:00,200
Speaker 3: We didn't hear that shit in the early eighties. There's

1467
01:11:00,280 --> 01:11:02,720
Speaker 3: little stuff that got to us. But it's surreal to

1468
01:11:02,760 --> 01:11:09,680
Speaker 3: go from Tupac and to Snoop and when you look

1469
01:11:09,680 --> 01:11:12,000
Speaker 3: at the find Ones, all that stuff with dre and

1470
01:11:12,080 --> 01:11:14,880
Speaker 3: Easy and all that stuff like that that's surreal, but

1471
01:11:14,920 --> 01:11:16,639
Speaker 3: also they have the presence of mind and go, let's

1472
01:11:16,640 --> 01:11:20,720
Speaker 3: do this right. Also, can't always have rose colored lenses on,

1473
01:11:20,920 --> 01:11:24,639
Speaker 3: like it's there's some rubs here too, Like there's there's

1474
01:11:24,680 --> 01:11:26,880
Speaker 3: there's a good, the bad, and the ugly, and let's

1475
01:11:27,000 --> 01:11:29,559
Speaker 3: let's keep it real. But let's celebrate it while we're

1476
01:11:29,640 --> 01:11:32,240
Speaker 3: keeping it real. And that's a that's a difficult challenging

1477
01:11:33,960 --> 01:11:35,559
Speaker 3: What was the biggest sounds doing to find ones?

1478
01:11:35,560 --> 01:11:37,960
Speaker 2: Because you look at Jimmy Ivan, Obviously he's he's a

1479
01:11:38,000 --> 01:11:39,439
Speaker 2: tough he's a tough cookie out there.

1480
01:11:39,840 --> 01:11:41,320
Speaker 3: And then Dre's whole reputation.

1481
01:11:41,400 --> 01:11:43,240
Speaker 2: He is such a perfectionist when it comes to music,

1482
01:11:43,320 --> 01:11:46,240
Speaker 2: like the being them being obviously you know your partners

1483
01:11:46,240 --> 01:11:48,679
Speaker 2: in it, Like what's the process of getting that project done?

1484
01:11:49,200 --> 01:11:53,280
Speaker 3: I think Dre was uh Drake. Drake could be challenging

1485
01:11:53,320 --> 01:11:55,720
Speaker 3: because because of what you say, he's very particular, but

1486
01:11:55,880 --> 01:11:58,439
Speaker 3: you know he also understood, like you gotta trust me

1487
01:11:58,479 --> 01:12:01,240
Speaker 3: with this because it's you, you know what I mean?

1488
01:12:01,439 --> 01:12:04,800
Speaker 3: Same thing with Jimmy is like how could you, you know,

1489
01:12:04,880 --> 01:12:07,640
Speaker 3: be objective about you and they and they? And you

1490
01:12:07,680 --> 01:12:10,240
Speaker 3: know we had we had some back and forth, but

1491
01:12:10,280 --> 01:12:13,439
Speaker 3: it was never over petty ship. And I think the

1492
01:12:13,520 --> 01:12:15,200
Speaker 3: key to the whole thing is me and Ray more

1493
01:12:15,240 --> 01:12:17,920
Speaker 3: like brothers and and and and the worst ways too.

1494
01:12:17,960 --> 01:12:20,439
Speaker 3: We can argue like brothers too, like really really get

1495
01:12:20,840 --> 01:12:24,639
Speaker 3: people to clear the room and me and him. In fact,

1496
01:12:24,640 --> 01:12:27,920
Speaker 3: he tells about me and alin't gonna go you guys

1497
01:12:27,960 --> 01:12:30,280
Speaker 3: go ahead, right, But so we know we know each

1498
01:12:30,280 --> 01:12:33,519
Speaker 3: other like that, you know and and and and we

1499
01:12:33,640 --> 01:12:37,719
Speaker 3: understand that because he understands brothership. You know. Now, Jimmy

1500
01:12:37,800 --> 01:12:41,080
Speaker 3: was more like the the uncle you know or whatever

1501
01:12:41,120 --> 01:12:44,360
Speaker 3: you want to say, like the big, bigger brother. And

1502
01:12:44,520 --> 01:12:48,920
Speaker 3: to get Jimmy. Once I knew Jimmy understood it, then

1503
01:12:49,000 --> 01:12:52,479
Speaker 3: we had something and Jimmy, Jimmy also led with like

1504
01:12:52,880 --> 01:12:55,000
Speaker 3: Jimmy said something I'll never forget. He goes, yeah, that one,

1505
01:12:55,080 --> 01:12:57,120
Speaker 3: that guy, that one guy, Yeah he hates me. Go

1506
01:12:57,160 --> 01:13:03,120
Speaker 3: interview him. But that was the key. Wow, that's the

1507
01:13:03,200 --> 01:13:06,880
Speaker 3: key to defining ones. Just like he was like, that's

1508
01:13:06,880 --> 01:13:09,400
Speaker 3: when I knew we had something special. I knew Dre's

1509
01:13:09,439 --> 01:13:13,280
Speaker 3: thing was special and it was magical and mysterious. But

1510
01:13:13,320 --> 01:13:16,120
Speaker 3: when Jimmy said that guy, I can't remember who it was,

1511
01:13:16,120 --> 01:13:18,519
Speaker 3: he goes, he hates me go interview him. I said,

1512
01:13:18,600 --> 01:13:21,240
Speaker 3: now we got something here, because before the Defining Ones,

1513
01:13:21,240 --> 01:13:24,519
Speaker 3: when you think about documentaries, everyone sat up and was stiff.

1514
01:13:24,800 --> 01:13:26,760
Speaker 3: There was no cursing, there was no what I called

1515
01:13:26,800 --> 01:13:29,120
Speaker 3: shootouts going back and forth like nah, wait a minute,

1516
01:13:29,120 --> 01:13:30,880
Speaker 3: that's not what I remember. That motherfuckers out of his

1517
01:13:31,520 --> 01:13:34,200
Speaker 3: define ones had that kind of energy where you were like,

1518
01:13:34,760 --> 01:13:38,160
Speaker 3: and this just I've never I've never even heard people

1519
01:13:38,200 --> 01:13:40,240
Speaker 3: talk like they really talk. They're really talking like they

1520
01:13:40,280 --> 01:13:43,000
Speaker 3: really talk. And I give I give jimmy credit for

1521
01:13:43,040 --> 01:13:45,240
Speaker 3: that because he set the tone. Because if your subject

1522
01:13:45,280 --> 01:13:49,080
Speaker 3: is if your subject is closed off, especially the white half,

1523
01:13:50,080 --> 01:13:51,280
Speaker 3: then you're gonna have a problem. Right.

1524
01:13:51,320 --> 01:13:53,400
Speaker 4: That surprised me too when I watched it. You had

1525
01:13:53,479 --> 01:13:55,080
Speaker 4: d Barnes there. I was like, how did you convince

1526
01:13:55,120 --> 01:13:55,639
Speaker 4: her to up here?

1527
01:13:55,640 --> 01:14:01,160
Speaker 3: And God bless her? You know, d Her, I said, D,

1528
01:14:01,640 --> 01:14:03,920
Speaker 3: I understand, you don't have to tell me anything. I

1529
01:14:04,000 --> 01:14:06,800
Speaker 3: get the whole thing, I said, but I would like

1530
01:14:06,880 --> 01:14:09,240
Speaker 3: to have you in the narrative before the thing happened,

1531
01:14:09,280 --> 01:14:12,479
Speaker 3: because that thing is not can't define your whole life

1532
01:14:12,560 --> 01:14:15,519
Speaker 3: or define his whole life. Because you were in the

1533
01:14:15,560 --> 01:14:19,840
Speaker 3: culture strong right years before this incident happened, and I

1534
01:14:19,880 --> 01:14:24,839
Speaker 3: want you not only in the narratives as a critic

1535
01:14:24,920 --> 01:14:27,360
Speaker 3: of it or a journalist in it speaking to what

1536
01:14:27,400 --> 01:14:30,439
Speaker 3: it was in the late eighties, but also you had

1537
01:14:30,439 --> 01:14:33,000
Speaker 3: your show, and then if the guys broke up, there's

1538
01:14:33,000 --> 01:14:35,000
Speaker 3: a whole bunch of stuff that happened that had nothing

1539
01:14:35,000 --> 01:14:38,280
Speaker 3: to do with that. So I think she was moved

1540
01:14:38,320 --> 01:14:42,000
Speaker 3: by the fact that she was being acknowledged as far

1541
01:14:42,040 --> 01:14:44,720
Speaker 3: as being part of the culture. And it wasn't just

1542
01:14:44,800 --> 01:14:49,240
Speaker 3: this violent thing that defined her journey. There was a

1543
01:14:49,280 --> 01:14:52,000
Speaker 3: whole thing before and there's a lot after. And she

1544
01:14:52,160 --> 01:14:53,760
Speaker 3: was kind enough to do it because there's a lot

1545
01:14:53,800 --> 01:14:56,280
Speaker 3: of people that wouldn't wouldn't have, you know, and I was.

1546
01:14:56,520 --> 01:14:58,400
Speaker 3: I've always been very grateful to her for doing that.

1547
01:14:59,000 --> 01:15:02,880
Speaker 3: And you know what, to be frank like, you know,

1548
01:15:03,360 --> 01:15:09,360
Speaker 3: in the case of Dre's legacy, that was a really

1549
01:15:09,400 --> 01:15:12,880
Speaker 3: forgiving thing she did, and it was it was selfless

1550
01:15:13,560 --> 01:15:16,760
Speaker 3: and it brought about a lot of healing and I

1551
01:15:16,760 --> 01:15:18,040
Speaker 3: can only give her credit for that.

1552
01:15:18,120 --> 01:15:20,360
Speaker 2: You know, Marvin Gay, before we get out of here,

1553
01:15:20,960 --> 01:15:25,120
Speaker 2: tell the Marvin Gay story. Jesus Christ, good luck with that, buddy.

1554
01:15:27,080 --> 01:15:27,840
Speaker 3: That's a dark one.

1555
01:15:28,200 --> 01:15:30,600
Speaker 4: Ray Kan has a really good song called Marvin on

1556
01:15:30,800 --> 01:15:34,160
Speaker 4: his last album the Wild. It's like talks about from

1557
01:15:34,320 --> 01:15:37,080
Speaker 4: the beginning to the end. Really check that out. Marvin's

1558
01:15:37,120 --> 01:15:40,920
Speaker 4: called no his last album about five years old. It's

1559
01:15:40,960 --> 01:15:43,160
Speaker 4: called Marvin on the Wise and it's about Marvin Gay.

1560
01:15:43,320 --> 01:15:45,519
Speaker 4: I encourage you to listen to it. See, I'm gonna

1561
01:15:45,520 --> 01:15:47,559
Speaker 4: be frank about Marvin Gay. I got a ray Kwan

1562
01:15:47,760 --> 01:15:52,040
Speaker 4: ray Kwan. I was meant to do Marvin now, you know.

1563
01:15:52,120 --> 01:15:54,960
Speaker 3: And then before the strike there was stuff that happened

1564
01:15:54,960 --> 01:15:58,080
Speaker 3: to the studios. People bought the company, things move whatever.

1565
01:15:58,120 --> 01:16:00,799
Speaker 3: But I said, man, when Snoop came to me with history,

1566
01:16:00,840 --> 01:16:05,040
Speaker 3: I'm like, I know this story, and I've done music

1567
01:16:05,080 --> 01:16:07,960
Speaker 3: in docs. There was a lot of music. I keep

1568
01:16:08,000 --> 01:16:10,080
Speaker 3: looking at my man al, there's a lot of music

1569
01:16:10,080 --> 01:16:12,360
Speaker 3: in the films. But I have never done a musical

1570
01:16:12,400 --> 01:16:15,559
Speaker 3: biopic like a scripted film and going, let's start with

1571
01:16:15,640 --> 01:16:19,320
Speaker 3: what we know. We know this one because Marvin is

1572
01:16:19,400 --> 01:16:24,719
Speaker 3: so complexed, not just the narrative but sonically what he

1573
01:16:24,720 --> 01:16:28,679
Speaker 3: he is mozart of vocals and vocalization. People don't realize

1574
01:16:29,120 --> 01:16:33,400
Speaker 3: and they say he was schizophrenic. In schizophrena is not

1575
01:16:33,439 --> 01:16:37,360
Speaker 3: all one thing. So when you hear the background vocals,

1576
01:16:37,720 --> 01:16:40,920
Speaker 3: and when you hear the counter melodies, that's all him,

1577
01:16:41,400 --> 01:16:45,240
Speaker 3: that's all him. When you hear a trouble man the

1578
01:16:45,320 --> 01:16:49,200
Speaker 3: song by the way, that's hip hop. I've been to

1579
01:16:49,280 --> 01:16:53,120
Speaker 3: places that I don't bother them, like the whole thing

1580
01:16:53,200 --> 01:16:59,040
Speaker 3: is that's nineteen seventy two bars. So, but when you

1581
01:16:59,080 --> 01:17:03,160
Speaker 3: hear his vocal arrangement and his production and what he

1582
01:17:03,240 --> 01:17:08,600
Speaker 3: does sonically. The challenge for me, because the story is Shakespearean.

1583
01:17:08,840 --> 01:17:10,960
Speaker 3: It's probably one of the greatest stories if you executed

1584
01:17:11,000 --> 01:17:13,120
Speaker 3: the right way that can ever be told about a

1585
01:17:13,160 --> 01:17:17,320
Speaker 3: man and his father, right and his love life. But

1586
01:17:18,640 --> 01:17:20,800
Speaker 3: that era now see now we go back to the

1587
01:17:20,840 --> 01:17:23,679
Speaker 3: dead President's thing. Now I'm going to go back. Let's

1588
01:17:23,680 --> 01:17:26,680
Speaker 3: get it right. So much research you got to do,

1589
01:17:27,200 --> 01:17:31,559
Speaker 3: but the complexity of like the way he was someone

1590
01:17:31,680 --> 01:17:34,920
Speaker 3: like have you seen Amadeis? The film I'm Adais? I've

1591
01:17:34,920 --> 01:17:37,240
Speaker 3: never seen a b of unfamiliar. You gotta check it out.

1592
01:17:37,280 --> 01:17:39,040
Speaker 3: You've seen it, No, you got to check it out.

1593
01:17:39,120 --> 01:17:41,800
Speaker 3: Came out in eighty four, produced a rock hick rock

1594
01:17:41,880 --> 01:17:43,639
Speaker 3: me I'm a Dais, but it wasn't in the film,

1595
01:17:43,920 --> 01:17:47,439
Speaker 3: and it's about Mozart and when you see it, you

1596
01:17:47,560 --> 01:17:50,120
Speaker 3: understand what's going on in his head. And it's not corny.

1597
01:17:50,160 --> 01:17:52,599
Speaker 3: It's like it's a whimsical film too, and it gets

1598
01:17:52,640 --> 01:17:55,320
Speaker 3: a little dark. But you're like that thing right there

1599
01:17:56,680 --> 01:18:01,439
Speaker 3: is very hard to execute in film, and so I'm

1600
01:18:01,479 --> 01:18:05,160
Speaker 3: gonna take my time as long when because we finally

1601
01:18:05,160 --> 01:18:08,400
Speaker 3: got the music rights, we finally got everything, and everyone's

1602
01:18:08,400 --> 01:18:11,360
Speaker 3: been trying for so so long because it is such

1603
01:18:11,400 --> 01:18:14,320
Speaker 3: a unique story when you see the details of Marvin's story.

1604
01:18:14,680 --> 01:18:17,519
Speaker 3: But I just think sonically what he was doing. I

1605
01:18:17,560 --> 01:18:20,759
Speaker 3: think that when you do a biopics right, people should

1606
01:18:20,760 --> 01:18:23,599
Speaker 3: walk away and go damn. I never knew you should

1607
01:18:23,600 --> 01:18:25,519
Speaker 3: hear the song in a different way. Now you should

1608
01:18:25,520 --> 01:18:27,240
Speaker 3: hear the record in a different way. And if you're

1609
01:18:27,240 --> 01:18:29,320
Speaker 3: not going to execute the film word like damn. I

1610
01:18:29,360 --> 01:18:32,479
Speaker 3: thought I loved the Let's get it on, but now

1611
01:18:32,520 --> 01:18:37,400
Speaker 3: I really hear it. I thought I loved my fucker

1612
01:18:37,479 --> 01:18:39,680
Speaker 3: got to give it Up, which I put in. I

1613
01:18:39,680 --> 01:18:42,320
Speaker 3: thought I love sexual Healing, one of my favorite mixed

1614
01:18:42,320 --> 01:18:44,720
Speaker 3: songs of all time. But when you when you do

1615
01:18:44,760 --> 01:18:46,280
Speaker 3: it right, people come out, they hear it in a

1616
01:18:46,280 --> 01:18:48,040
Speaker 3: different way. That takes a lot of work.

1617
01:18:48,120 --> 01:18:53,519
Speaker 4: You know, got the name for it too, Dear Papa,

1618
01:18:55,479 --> 01:18:56,839
Speaker 4: that's funny, but go see.

1619
01:18:56,640 --> 01:19:00,880
Speaker 3: Dem mama, man, stop stop sleeping on it. Oh, we

1620
01:19:00,920 --> 01:19:04,080
Speaker 3: got the find Ones coming to Hulu too this next week.

1621
01:19:04,120 --> 01:19:06,080
Speaker 3: To find Ones in on Hulu and dear Mama's on

1622
01:19:06,120 --> 01:19:10,240
Speaker 3: Hulu so you can watch all fucking uh nine hours

1623
01:19:10,439 --> 01:19:13,000
Speaker 3: actually twelve because you can watch Arnold on Netflix.

1624
01:19:13,439 --> 01:19:17,240
Speaker 2: Boom talking about ARNOLDGGA, that's the culture too.

1625
01:19:17,280 --> 01:19:19,080
Speaker 3: Baby was talking about Arnold real quick for we got

1626
01:19:19,400 --> 01:19:21,800
Speaker 3: I met. I walked in to meet Arnold. I met

1627
01:19:21,840 --> 01:19:27,800
Speaker 3: him in the night. See say that name again. I'm

1628
01:19:27,840 --> 01:19:31,680
Speaker 3: still a guy going Schwartzenegger. I walked in, and that

1629
01:19:31,800 --> 01:19:34,760
Speaker 3: dude in me a lot of thighs. I started telling

1630
01:19:34,800 --> 01:19:37,080
Speaker 3: him what I wanted to do. I had an idea

1631
01:19:37,160 --> 01:19:41,799
Speaker 3: for it, and you know, and man, that dude is uh.

1632
01:19:41,920 --> 01:19:46,080
Speaker 3: At one point, you know, I said to him, I said,

1633
01:19:46,720 --> 01:19:48,679
Speaker 3: you know, you remind me of like a black pimp

1634
01:19:48,760 --> 01:19:51,720
Speaker 3: or a black preacher. He's looking at me like what

1635
01:19:51,880 --> 01:19:54,000
Speaker 3: because if you hit him, like with a random question

1636
01:19:54,120 --> 01:19:55,919
Speaker 3: or something like that, because he's really good at messaging,

1637
01:19:56,120 --> 01:19:59,080
Speaker 3: He's really good at staying a message. He knows his life.

1638
01:19:59,120 --> 01:20:01,120
Speaker 3: But if you hit him when he starts saying the

1639
01:20:01,160 --> 01:20:04,040
Speaker 3: most profane, profound shit you've ever heard, and it's in

1640
01:20:04,120 --> 01:20:06,720
Speaker 3: rhythm and it's popping and it's going and I'm like,

1641
01:20:06,760 --> 01:20:10,960
Speaker 3: what is this shit right here? You realize? And when

1642
01:20:11,000 --> 01:20:12,439
Speaker 3: I made the movie, I was a fan in the

1643
01:20:12,840 --> 01:20:15,080
Speaker 3: eighties and nineties, but when I made a movie, I go, Oh,

1644
01:20:15,120 --> 01:20:17,799
Speaker 3: this dude's there's a reason why he had three different careers.

1645
01:20:18,000 --> 01:20:21,360
Speaker 3: Like he's a special, remarkable human being, and he's putting

1646
01:20:21,360 --> 01:20:26,320
Speaker 3: his energy and his money his mouth is too when

1647
01:20:26,360 --> 01:20:29,000
Speaker 3: you talk about like preserving democracy, and you see what

1648
01:20:29,040 --> 01:20:31,120
Speaker 3: he's doing when he when he spoke to those Charlottesville

1649
01:20:31,120 --> 01:20:36,080
Speaker 3: and Nazis, when he spoke to the January sixth rioters,

1650
01:20:36,479 --> 01:20:39,639
Speaker 3: when he spoke directly to the Russian soldiers going into Ukraine.

1651
01:20:40,080 --> 01:20:43,519
Speaker 3: Because he was born in a village in Austria where

1652
01:20:43,520 --> 01:20:45,760
Speaker 3: his father and those men were on the losing side

1653
01:20:45,760 --> 01:20:47,639
Speaker 3: of World War Two and they were with the Nazis,

1654
01:20:47,680 --> 01:20:50,680
Speaker 3: the Germans. So he comes from the reason why he

1655
01:20:50,720 --> 01:20:53,360
Speaker 3: loves America because so much is because he comes from

1656
01:20:53,400 --> 01:20:56,800
Speaker 3: a place where they took an ashrip so hard. But

1657
01:20:56,880 --> 01:21:00,280
Speaker 3: I was really happy that anything I'm doing now that

1658
01:21:00,360 --> 01:21:03,200
Speaker 3: someone can take their star and their legend and talk

1659
01:21:03,200 --> 01:21:07,760
Speaker 3: about preserving democracy and talk about his climate activism, talk

1660
01:21:07,800 --> 01:21:13,040
Speaker 3: about growing older and losing friends, and he talks about

1661
01:21:13,080 --> 01:21:16,120
Speaker 3: love at the end, but talks about meaningful things. He's

1662
01:21:16,120 --> 01:21:18,519
Speaker 3: not just an actor sitting here talking about himself. And

1663
01:21:18,520 --> 01:21:20,240
Speaker 3: that's one of the reasons why I love doing that project,

1664
01:21:20,280 --> 01:21:24,480
Speaker 3: because you go, what does that have to do? You know, anybody,

1665
01:21:24,600 --> 01:21:28,200
Speaker 3: dear Mama, for instance, they go, what this is? We're

1666
01:21:28,240 --> 01:21:30,920
Speaker 3: speaking to something in the culture. We're speaking to something

1667
01:21:30,920 --> 01:21:33,600
Speaker 3: in the condition and the struggle, right And anytime you

1668
01:21:33,600 --> 01:21:36,120
Speaker 3: can do a project where you're speaking to the thing

1669
01:21:36,160 --> 01:21:39,479
Speaker 3: and you're asking the why and the what, and it's

1670
01:21:39,520 --> 01:21:40,439
Speaker 3: for me, you know.

1671
01:21:41,400 --> 01:21:44,360
Speaker 2: Enjoy enjoy speaking with you, brother, Thank you, do it

1672
01:21:44,400 --> 01:21:46,400
Speaker 2: one more time, one more time.

1673
01:21:47,640 --> 01:21:57,679
Speaker 3: Thank you, gentlemen. Rap radar As The Interval presents original

1674
01:21:57,720 --> 01:22:01,000
Speaker 3: production from hyper House, produced by Laura whe Hopes and

1675
01:22:01,040 --> 01:22:03,400
Speaker 3: producers Elliott Wilson and Brian B. Dot Miller.

1676
01:22:03,680 --> 01:22:08,040
Speaker 4: From Interval presents executive producers Alan Coy and Jake Kleinberg,

1677
01:22:08,520 --> 01:22:12,400
Speaker 4: Executive producer Paul Rosenberg, editing his sound design by Dylan

1678
01:22:12,439 --> 01:22:18,000
Speaker 4: Alexander Freeman, recording engineer Jeremy Ogletree. Special thanks to Charatt Jenkins,

1679
01:22:18,160 --> 01:22:22,360
Speaker 4: Tammy Kim and Jasmine Sanchez, Operations Lead Sarah Yu, business

1680
01:22:22,360 --> 01:22:26,120
Speaker 4: development Lead Cheffie Allen Swig and Marketing lead Samara Still.

1681
01:22:26,400 --> 01:22:29,640
Speaker 4: Make sure to follow a rapperator or listen on Apple Podcasts, Spotify,

1682
01:22:29,760 --> 01:22:31,840
Speaker 4: Amazon Music, or wherever you get your podcasts.