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Speaker 1: Hey, everybody, we want to let you know that that

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Speaker 1: great LP, the vinyl record of stuff you should know

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Speaker 1: about how vinyl works. It's old so well that Born

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Speaker 1: Losers Records has printed more.

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Speaker 2: Right, Yeah, we're in our second pressing, Chuck, that's how

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Speaker 2: great it was. And they're printing five hundred more and

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Speaker 2: now's the time to go get them. You can order

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Speaker 2: them now and they're in two new awesome color slash

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Speaker 2: styles that you can go see. Go check out our

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Speaker 2: website Stuff youshould Know dot com and click on the

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Speaker 2: button SYSK Vinyl and it will give you all the

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Speaker 2: facts and info you need, or just search stuff you

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Speaker 2: should know Vinyl and Born Losers will come up to

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Speaker 2: that's the official site. So if you got shut out

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Speaker 2: from the last press, well, hallelujah, here's pressing too.

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Speaker 1: You're welcome, Welcome to Stuff you should Know, a production

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Speaker 1: of iHeartRadio.

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Speaker 2: Hey, and welcome to the podcast. I'm Josh, and there's

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Speaker 2: Chuck and Jerry's here too, and this is stuff you

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Speaker 2: shoul no the problem Globe Trotter Edition. It's a little

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Speaker 2: on the nose as far as edition names go, but

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Speaker 2: it is what it is.

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Speaker 1: How's that pretty great. Oh are you gonna follow up?

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Speaker 2: I was just egging you on.

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Speaker 1: Okay, I feel like I get a little off key

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Speaker 1: because it goes in some you know, more subtle directions.

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Speaker 2: It does. And what you're referring to is, of course,

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Speaker 2: the song Sweet Georgia Brown by Brother Bones.

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Speaker 1: Right, Brother Bones, who was a halftime musical act for

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Speaker 1: the Globetrotters. And as the story goes, it was like, Hey,

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Speaker 1: I got this banging whistled version of Sweet Georgia Brown

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Speaker 1: that I'm doing during your little magic circle routine and

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Speaker 1: it stuck for seventy years.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, they decided to make it basically their unofficial official

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Speaker 2: team song. And if you remember, that was my first

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Speaker 2: forty five record ever?

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Speaker 1: Was it really?

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Speaker 2: Yeah? After seeing the Globetrotters, that's that song. So my

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Speaker 2: dad took me to probably Peaches Records in Toledo and

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Speaker 2: I got the forty five.

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Speaker 1: All right, Well, let's talk real quick. So you saw

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Speaker 1: the Globetrotters in what year? Roughly?

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Speaker 2: My guess is it would have been eighty two, eighty three.

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Speaker 1: I mean that's if not, you know, the Golden Era

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Speaker 1: just sort of it's just after just after the Golden.

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Speaker 2: Era Curly was still there, but Metal Lark left.

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Speaker 1: Okay. I loved watching the Harlem Globetrotters on Wide World

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Speaker 1: of Sports or wherever they played them on Sunday afternoons.

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Speaker 1: I thought it was the best thing ever. I loved basketball,

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Speaker 1: I love comedy. I thought it was funny.

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Speaker 2: Oh well, they were right up your alley then.

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Speaker 1: But I did not see the Harlem Globetrotters, my friend

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Speaker 1: until last year. Oh really, yep. I took Ruby and

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Speaker 1: Emily and my father in law Steve and Scotty who

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Speaker 1: you know, sure of course, and we went and saw

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Speaker 1: the Harlem Globetrotters here in Atlanta, and I gotta tell you, dude,

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Speaker 1: I was like a kid all over again. It was

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Speaker 1: so much fun. All those old bits they did, and

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Speaker 1: it was genuinely funny, like it wasn't like, oh well,

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Speaker 1: this is quaint and sort of old fashioned, like I was.

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Speaker 1: Scotty and I were dying laughing, and we just had

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Speaker 1: the best time. I highly recommend you anyone should still go.

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Speaker 1: It's still so much fun.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I would after doing this research, I would definitely

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Speaker 2: go to see them. And they have a twenty twenty three,

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Speaker 2: twenty four World tour plan, which I think is pretty

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Speaker 2: much par for the course with them every year.

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Speaker 1: Yep.

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Speaker 2: But if you look, you're like, wow, they're in three

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Speaker 2: different cities on this one day. And it's because, which

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Speaker 2: is a long standing tradition with the Globetrotters, they have

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Speaker 2: so many great players that they'll split them into multiple

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Speaker 2: teams and just send them out around the country. So

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Speaker 2: there is one hundred percent chance essentially that they are

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Speaker 2: coming within probably twenty miles of whatever town you live in.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, go see him. It's a lot of fun. I mean,

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Speaker 1: they still just have so much personality. I can't remember

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Speaker 1: the guy's name, at least at the one I saw

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Speaker 1: who sort of is the metal Arclemit who sort of

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Speaker 1: is the ringleader, But he was just he had so

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Speaker 1: much charisma. And they're great basketball players. So it's modernized

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Speaker 1: a little bit, but it's still what it always has been,

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Speaker 1: and it was just so much fun.

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Speaker 2: What's funny, is, Chuck, is that them being great basketball

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Speaker 2: players is actually a throwback to their original I guess

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Speaker 2: kind of iteration.

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Speaker 1: Look at you bringing it all around.

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Speaker 2: I like to do that sometimes, So.

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Speaker 1: Are we in the nineteen twenties, then.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, at the beginning of the Harlem Globetrotters. It's actually

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Speaker 2: predates the Harlem Globetrotters, and I think the early to

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Speaker 2: mid nineteen.

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Speaker 1: Twenties, that's right. So we're going to set up sort

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Speaker 1: of basketball at the time, which is to say, basketball

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Speaker 1: is pretty new. It was not hugely popular as far

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Speaker 1: as if you want to compare it to football and baseball,

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Speaker 1: it was well into third place if that behind you know,

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Speaker 1: horse racing and I'm sure a lot of other things

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Speaker 1: are more popular at the Why the NBA didn't even

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Speaker 1: come around until forty nine, so this was quite a

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Speaker 1: while before that. And what they did have though, and

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Speaker 1: we've seen this in other sports and other sort of entertainment,

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Speaker 1: it was touring. But they called it barnstormy. It was

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Speaker 1: when you traveled around to different small towns and they

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Speaker 1: would get teams together to go on these little tours

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Speaker 1: and barnstorm and play each other and you know, essentially

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Speaker 1: exhibition games because there wasn't a league, but they were

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Speaker 1: you know, competitive, real basketball games.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, they'd be like, hey, you, hay Seeds, look at

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Speaker 2: this exactly. Sometimes also like there wouldn't even be a team,

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Speaker 2: but like some of these teams would go play locals,

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Speaker 2: like local groups of farmers or whatever would take these

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Speaker 2: teams on. And I don't know why, but I think

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Speaker 2: think it was maybe like how sometimes wrestlers will take

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Speaker 2: on any comers at like some small town or whatever. Yeah,

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Speaker 2: But so that's the beginnings of basketball. And it's really

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Speaker 2: interesting that like there were people out there who loved

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Speaker 2: the game enough that they made a career for themselves

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Speaker 2: for they figured out how to do it. And this

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Speaker 2: was really really close to the beginning of the Harlem Globetrotters.

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Speaker 2: And in fact, the group that originally formed the first

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Speaker 2: Harlem Globetrotter started out as players at Wendell Phillips High

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Speaker 2: School and All Black High School in Chicago that said, hey,

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Speaker 2: we're pretty good, let's go start a barnstorming team ourselves.

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Speaker 1: That's right. And this is either in twenty five or

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Speaker 1: twenty six. They didn't have a name at first. They

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Speaker 1: were sponsored by the South Side Giles Post of the

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Speaker 1: American Legion, so there are some sources that'll say they

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Speaker 1: were they were called the Giles Post American Legion quintet Okay,

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Speaker 1: But then another thing happened the Savoy Ballroom and Chicago

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Speaker 1: in Bronzeville, it was a black owned entertainment venue, very popular,

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Speaker 1: and on the weekends they would have these big dances,

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Speaker 1: and they thought, well, hey, why don't we have a

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Speaker 1: little opening act and have a basketball game before these dances.

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Speaker 1: Maybe it'll sell some more tickets and at the very

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Speaker 1: least it'll be fun and sort of get people going

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Speaker 1: before the big dance. And in nineteen twenty six they

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Speaker 1: hired that Wendell Phillips team and they named them the

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Speaker 1: Savoy Big Five.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, and I don't know how long they played for

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Speaker 2: this dance hall, the Savoy Ballroom, but I don't get

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Speaker 2: the impression knows very long, because I think that they

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Speaker 2: weren't moving tickets like the owners thought they would, and

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Speaker 2: so they moved on to something else. I can't remember

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Speaker 2: what it was, but they basically got rid of the

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Speaker 2: basketball team, which left them essentially free agents. And it's

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Speaker 2: kind of lost to history exactly how this happened. But

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Speaker 2: a guy named Abe Sapperstein came in and attached himself

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Speaker 2: to the Savoy Big Five, scooped them up after they

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Speaker 2: were fired, took them away from the Savoy Who knows,

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Speaker 2: but this is about the time in the mid to

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Speaker 2: late nineteen twenties, about the mid nineteen twenties where Abe

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Speaker 2: Sapristine comes in, and you can say, like without qualification

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Speaker 2: that had it not been for Abe Sapristine entering, there

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Speaker 2: would be no Harlem Globetrotters.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, for sure. He was born in London, but he

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Speaker 1: was raised in He was Jewish and raised in an

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Speaker 1: Irish German neighborhood in Chicago. And he was a little guy.

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Speaker 1: He loved basketball. But they say he was like, you know,

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Speaker 1: five three, five four or something like that, so really

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Speaker 1: small to be playing basketball, even at the time when

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Speaker 1: guys weren't super tall playing basketball generally. Yeah, or you

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Speaker 1: could be, you know, a little shorter and still get by,

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Speaker 1: but he would play a little hard out. He tried

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Speaker 1: out for the University of Illinois team and did not

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Speaker 1: make the team, and then dropped out and worked for

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Speaker 1: the Chicago Park Department as a playground supervisor. And if

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Speaker 1: you you know, listen to him sort of tell his

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Speaker 1: own story of the lore, he's going to say, like,

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Speaker 1: you know, I saw these guys playing basketball on the playground.

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Speaker 1: I'd never seen basketball played like this before, and I

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Speaker 1: knew right away that you know, I had to get

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Speaker 1: these guys and you know, make them like the best

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Speaker 1: team that they could be.

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Speaker 2: Right, that's the that's the lore. Again, it's kind of

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Speaker 2: lost to history, but the I think by the nineteen

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Speaker 2: like nineteen twenty six, nineteen twenty seven, Abe Sapristein was

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Speaker 2: attached to this group of players from Wendell Phillips High

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Speaker 2: School that would become the Harlem Globetrotters.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, and one of the first thing he did was

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Speaker 1: changed that name because he wanted to take them barnstorming. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: He's like, I can make some money here. So he

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Speaker 1: named him the Harlem Globetrotters right out of the gate

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Speaker 1: because he was a savvy marketing guy, and he's bringing

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Speaker 1: this team on the road in the He's like small

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Speaker 1: towns and Kansas and Indiana who had never you know,

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Speaker 1: who knows how much interaction they had with black people

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Speaker 1: in rural Kansas at the time, they at the very

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Speaker 1: least they probably hadn't seen an all black basketball team

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Speaker 1: come through town. So he was like, this is a

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Speaker 1: sellable thing, you know, to turn these people onto this,

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Speaker 1: and so Harlem, like everybody knows what Harlem represents, it's

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Speaker 1: the center of black culture in the nineteen twenty So

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Speaker 1: if I put Harlem on the name, it's they're immediately

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Speaker 1: going to know this is a black team. And if

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Speaker 1: I call them the Globetrotters, even though we're really not

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Speaker 1: globe trotting yet, they're gonna you know, it's just it's

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Speaker 1: gonna guss him up to where they sound like this

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Speaker 1: sort of worldly team that's been everywhere playing this sport

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Speaker 1: and it just has a nice ring together and it

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Speaker 1: should sell some tickets.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, and I mean he was right, definitely does have

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Speaker 2: a nice ring. But it's ironic that this the Harlem

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Speaker 2: Globetrotters originated in Chicago, Yeah, and apparently didn't play their

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Speaker 2: first game in Harlem until nineteen sixty eight.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I had nothing to do with Harlem. I don't

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Speaker 1: think it.

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Speaker 2: Took forty years for them to finally get to play

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Speaker 2: in Harlem, right, but it was it was you could

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Speaker 2: almost call it today, a dog whistle that would would

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Speaker 2: guarantee that no, you know, Kansas Farmer would show up

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Speaker 2: at this game thinking he was coming to see a

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Speaker 2: white basketball team and giving like racially angry that he

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Speaker 2: had been tricked into giving his money to a black

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Speaker 2: basketball team. In addition to just kind of signaling that,

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Speaker 2: it also did say like, but not only is this

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Speaker 2: like a black team, this is like a black team

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Speaker 2: from the greatest black city in America. Yeah, so it's

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Speaker 2: prestigious too, but it also was a signal.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, absolutely so, Saprosine. He coached. He was with the

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Speaker 1: team for a long time. He coached them into his sixties.

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Speaker 1: And he was, you know, criticized many times throughout the

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Speaker 1: years for being too controlling, for underpaying his guys, for

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Speaker 1: not giving them any say and like what they did

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Speaker 1: or how they did it, kind of like I'm the boss,

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Speaker 1: and you do what I say, for perpetuating racial stereotypes.

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Speaker 1: He was not some perfect guy. But he also, you know,

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Speaker 1: as we'll see, in his own way, eventually led to

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Speaker 1: you know, the integration of the NBA and putting black

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Speaker 1: players on a stage that no one had ever done

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Speaker 1: before in sort of elevating their perception to the rest

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Speaker 1: of America and as you'll see the rest of the world.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, and he was inducted into the Basketball Hall of

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Speaker 2: Fame in nineteen seventy one. And I don't dispute the

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Speaker 2: impact that he had on it, but it is he

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Speaker 2: definitely it wasn't like mischievous or like in the gray

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Speaker 2: area he swindled some of his players.

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Speaker 1: Oh yeah.

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Speaker 2: He told one star player later on, Marcus Haynes, that

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Speaker 2: he believed black players didn't deserve or didn't need as

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Speaker 2: much money as white players. They just didn't. Black people

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Speaker 2: just didn't need as much money, and that was why

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Speaker 2: he underpaid his black players. Apparently they found out once

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Speaker 2: that a group of college all stars that was touring

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Speaker 2: as a warm up act for the Globetrotters was getting

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Speaker 2: paid more than the Globetrotters. He did a lot of

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Speaker 2: really shady, underhanded stuff. So he's a good study in

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Speaker 2: one of those things that's like, okay, this he was

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Speaker 2: not like a sterling example of somebody even for his time,

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Speaker 2: but he also did do some really amazing things that

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Speaker 2: benefited a lot of black people during his lifetime and

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Speaker 2: well beyond today actually, because you can kind of give

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Speaker 2: him credit for giving the NBA the stability it needed

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Speaker 2: to take off on its own too.

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Speaker 1: Yeah yeah, And you know that's also and this is

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Speaker 1: not defending him, but this is also the history of

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Speaker 1: pro sports ownership, right, Like in a nutshell. This is

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Speaker 1: how it was almost with everybody as far as not

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Speaker 1: integrating the leagues and sort of the ownership aspect. And

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Speaker 1: I mean that's why players still complain about this stuff.

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Speaker 1: That's why they formed players' unions and banded together for like,

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Speaker 1: you know, better treatment and better pay and where you're

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Speaker 1: not going to just pay us a little bit amount

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Speaker 1: of money and you take everything else. Right. Uh, it's

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Speaker 1: interesting we should I don't know, maybe there's an episode

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Speaker 1: in there somewhere about like the history of sports ownership,

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Speaker 1: because it's fraught with stories like this.

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Speaker 2: I could totally see that. I could totally Yeah, I

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Speaker 2: think that's a great idea. But to kind of wrap

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Speaker 2: up Sapirsteine at least his introduction, he owned the Globe Trotters,

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Speaker 2: not just the team, not just the name like the Globetrotters.

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Speaker 2: He believed not he believed that that if you wanted

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Speaker 2: to play on his team, he was the boss. He

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Speaker 2: was in charge, He called the shots, he was not

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Speaker 2: to be questioned. He even called himself coach to these

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Speaker 2: players that did not need a coach, but they kind

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Speaker 2: of humored him and played along. But he was in

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Speaker 2: charge and his whole jam was I'm creating a place

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Speaker 2: where if you're a black basketball player and you're good,

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Speaker 2: this is the team you want to be on.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, he created that absolutely. Uh, good time for break,

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Speaker 1: I think, good setup. And we'll come back and talk

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Speaker 1: a little bit about what you were talking about earlier,

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Speaker 1: the fact that they were not comedians at first. All right,

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Speaker 1: so we are back with promise to talk about the

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Speaker 1: Harlem Globetrotters as a serious basketball team, because that is

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Speaker 1: what they were for many years. They did not come

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Speaker 1: out of the gate doing you know, the confetti and

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Speaker 1: a bucket trick. They came out playing some really good basketball,

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Speaker 1: to the tune of a record reportedly of one hundred

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Speaker 1: and one and six over their first one hundred and

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Speaker 1: seventeen games or so, and they traveled throughout the thirties.

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Speaker 1: They would pile apparently into Abe Saperstein's giant model t

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Speaker 1: and they would play eight games a week for twenty

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Speaker 1: five bucks a game for the entire team, sapristein they

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Speaker 1: would split it up at Sapristine would get two shares,

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Speaker 1: and back then that wasn't even a lot of money.

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Speaker 1: But they loved the game and they were getting paid

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Speaker 1: to play it.

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Speaker 2: No today, they would be making five hundred dollars a week.

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Speaker 2: So you had to love the game to be doing

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Speaker 2: that for sure, because there was a lot of it

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Speaker 2: was hard work in addition to traveling constantly too, So

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Speaker 2: the people who are playing like really love to play,

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Speaker 2: and this is the one place they could play and

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Speaker 2: make any money at it. And by the way, that

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Speaker 2: winning percentage, it's zero point eight sixty three win percentage

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Speaker 2: in their first year, and only the twenty fifteen sixteen

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Speaker 2: Warriors and the ninety five ninety six Bulls have better

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Speaker 2: win percentages and they each only played eighty two games.

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Speaker 2: These guys played one hundred and seventeen. And it's kind

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Speaker 2: of joky now because everyone knows the Generals aren't supposed

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Speaker 2: to win. But as of twenty twenty two, the win

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Speaker 2: loss ratio for the Harlem Globe Charters was twenty seven

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Speaker 2: thousand to three and forty five.

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Speaker 1: And by the way, if you don't know, the Generals

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Speaker 1: are the team that they always play now on their

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Speaker 1: road show, right, we kind of assume people know that,

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Speaker 1: but we'll talk about them.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, yet not talk about the General Wait everybody, just

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Speaker 2: wait a second.

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Speaker 1: So they're traveling around the country. When they play in

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Speaker 1: the North, they're playing against white teams and black teams.

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Speaker 1: There was a team called the New York Renaissance, the Wrens.

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Speaker 1: They were the first all black professional basketball team. When

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Speaker 1: they went to the South, this was the Jim Crow South.

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Speaker 1: They would play in front of black crowds and only

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Speaker 1: against black teams. And it was rough. You know, they

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Speaker 1: were in a South that was obviously segregated, not treating

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Speaker 1: them equally, not letting them stay in hotels, not letting

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Speaker 1: them eat in restaurants. There was one story. Dave Ruse

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Speaker 1: helped us with this. He dug up that in Nebraska

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Speaker 1: they had to sleep in the county jail because they

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Speaker 1: could not find a hotel that would house them. Yeah.

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Speaker 2: They also they would play two games a night in

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Speaker 2: the South because they would play in front of a

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Speaker 2: black crowd and then they would go across town and

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Speaker 2: play in front of a white crowd, so they would

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Speaker 2: play two a day. I'm not sure if they got

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Speaker 2: paid for both games or not, but yeah, it was

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Speaker 2: in addition to riding around in a Model T with

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Speaker 2: five other people and getting twenty five bucks a game,

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Speaker 2: you also had to just face blatant, horrible racism every

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Speaker 2: day of your life, basically, especially when you were touring

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Speaker 2: the South.

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Speaker 1: Yeah. Absolutely. They were a really good team though, and

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Speaker 1: they wanted to prove that they were among the best

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Speaker 1: of any color in the country. And they entered the

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Speaker 1: World Basketball Championship in nineteen forty and won this tournament

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Speaker 1: was a fourteen team tournament in Chicago, and beat the

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Speaker 1: hometown Chicago Bruins to win the title. And this was

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Speaker 1: again pre NBA. This is when the only thing that

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Speaker 1: was around was the It was called the National Basketball

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Speaker 1: League at the time, the NBL.

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Speaker 2: And it was white teams only, right, All black teams

356
00:19:15,920 --> 00:19:18,400
Speaker 2: were independent. And there were other good black teams too,

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Speaker 2: like the New York Renaissance, the Wrens. They were like

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Speaker 2: the Globetrotters, but they were serious. They only played serious basketball.

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Speaker 2: There's no clowning whatsoever. And they actually were huge rivals,

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Speaker 2: not just on the court, but off the court as

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Speaker 2: well for players, for advancing their team, for getting crowds.

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Speaker 2: Like it was, they were both trying to carve out

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Speaker 2: a place for themselves in the same space and there

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00:19:43,920 --> 00:19:46,320
Speaker 2: was not really enough space for both.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, for sure. As for how the clowning around started

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Speaker 1: and the comedy element. It sort of depends on who

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Speaker 1: you ask. Some people will say that barnstorming in the

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Speaker 1: forties started losing steam, and so Sapristine, as the sort

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Speaker 1: of SPINALI, came up with this idea to keep the

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Speaker 1: show going by incorporating these funny bits. Other people say

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Speaker 1: that it just sort of kind of slowly evolved from

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Speaker 1: the fact that they were even before the clowning around,

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Speaker 1: they were playing a different style of basketball than what

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Speaker 1: white teams were playing at the time, which is a

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00:20:21,240 --> 00:20:23,560
Speaker 1: lot of like, it's kind of funny to look at

376
00:20:23,600 --> 00:20:26,400
Speaker 1: old basketball clips, these little two handed, flat footed set

377
00:20:26,440 --> 00:20:30,600
Speaker 1: shots and lots and lots and lots of passing, not

378
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Speaker 1: a lot of dribbling. All of a sudden, these guys

379
00:20:33,920 --> 00:20:38,240
Speaker 1: come in and they're running fast breaks. Dave said, they dunked.

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Speaker 1: I looked into the history of the dunk and it's

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Speaker 1: I think that the first dunk was in nineteen thirty six,

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Speaker 1: So it is plausible that they were dunking the basketball,

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Speaker 1: because immediately I was like, I don't think people were

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Speaker 1: dunking it all back then.

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Speaker 2: If anybody was, it was them, though.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, well the first person who dunk wasn't a Globetrotter,

387
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Speaker 1: but it was, you know, it wasn't. I think it

388
00:21:00,400 --> 00:21:01,919
Speaker 1: was looked at it as kind of a rude thing to

389
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Speaker 1: do in a basketball game.

390
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Speaker 2: Early on, well, it also seemed to be taken as wrong,

391
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Speaker 2: like the right way to do was to pass five

392
00:21:08,680 --> 00:21:13,000
Speaker 2: times and then you took your shot. And the Globetrotters

393
00:21:13,040 --> 00:21:15,560
Speaker 2: weren't playing like that at all. They were playing like

394
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Speaker 2: what you see when you watch a modern basketball game.

395
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Speaker 2: And in fact, there was a twenty twenty one letter

396
00:21:21,920 --> 00:21:26,040
Speaker 2: open letter from the Globetrotters to the NBA saying, you know,

397
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Speaker 2: we basically created the style of play that is like

398
00:21:30,520 --> 00:21:33,679
Speaker 2: the NBA, Now, why don't you let us in and

399
00:21:33,840 --> 00:21:37,360
Speaker 2: give us a franchise. Of course, the NBA just I think,

400
00:21:37,400 --> 00:21:40,640
Speaker 2: completely ignored it, but they make a really good case that,

401
00:21:40,720 --> 00:21:43,680
Speaker 2: like the style of play today dates back to the

402
00:21:44,800 --> 00:21:48,000
Speaker 2: Globe Trotters starting this stuff in the thirties and forties.

403
00:21:48,440 --> 00:21:50,520
Speaker 2: And if you watch like clips of say like Curly

404
00:21:50,600 --> 00:21:54,639
Speaker 2: Neil in like the seventies, shooting like a half court

405
00:21:54,960 --> 00:21:59,320
Speaker 2: three pointer, he looks exactly like Steph Curry does today

406
00:21:59,480 --> 00:22:01,520
Speaker 2: when you watch when you watch stuff, Curry do the

407
00:22:01,520 --> 00:22:04,880
Speaker 2: same thing. They have the same exact motion, everything about

408
00:22:05,000 --> 00:22:08,959
Speaker 2: that shot is the exact same, but Curly Neil is

409
00:22:09,000 --> 00:22:11,320
Speaker 2: doing it like fifty years earlier.

410
00:22:12,119 --> 00:22:15,280
Speaker 1: Yeah. Absolutely, And this was way earlier than Curly Neil too.

411
00:22:15,520 --> 00:22:18,200
Speaker 2: Yeah. I mean people didn't take half court three pointers

412
00:22:18,560 --> 00:22:20,760
Speaker 2: outside of the Harlem Globe Trotters.

413
00:22:21,280 --> 00:22:24,200
Speaker 1: Yeah, and that was sort of when things started getting

414
00:22:24,200 --> 00:22:27,520
Speaker 1: a little more interesting. Another story is that they were

415
00:22:27,560 --> 00:22:29,720
Speaker 1: blowing people out so much they started getting bored and

416
00:22:29,800 --> 00:22:32,280
Speaker 1: kind of just messing around and they would do no

417
00:22:32,359 --> 00:22:35,240
Speaker 1: look passes and they would take these super long hook

418
00:22:35,280 --> 00:22:39,280
Speaker 1: shots and people went crazy for it. Supposedly, one of

419
00:22:39,320 --> 00:22:43,200
Speaker 1: the original Savoy Big Five, this guy, Big Jack Johnson,

420
00:22:43,880 --> 00:22:48,000
Speaker 1: was the guy who kind of started developing these tricks.

421
00:22:48,000 --> 00:22:51,480
Speaker 1: He was a big, giant of a man, and he's

422
00:22:51,520 --> 00:22:53,680
Speaker 1: the guy who would put another player on his shoulders

423
00:22:54,520 --> 00:22:57,760
Speaker 1: to go in and dunk the ball. He's the guy

424
00:22:57,800 --> 00:23:00,359
Speaker 1: who started drop kicking it from the free throw line.

425
00:23:01,400 --> 00:23:04,040
Speaker 1: And so you know, this is sort of the err

426
00:23:04,119 --> 00:23:06,639
Speaker 1: version of what we would later see to be followed

427
00:23:06,640 --> 00:23:11,719
Speaker 1: by Reetatum Goose Tatum, who is known as the clown

428
00:23:11,760 --> 00:23:14,320
Speaker 1: Prints of the Globetrotters. He's a guy that really ramped

429
00:23:14,400 --> 00:23:15,040
Speaker 1: up the antics.

430
00:23:15,119 --> 00:23:18,520
Speaker 2: Yeah, he apparently got his clowning start on the Indianapolis Clowns,

431
00:23:18,520 --> 00:23:21,399
Speaker 2: which was a baseball team which were essentially the Globe

432
00:23:21,440 --> 00:23:23,879
Speaker 2: Trotters of baseball at the time in the Negro Leagues,

433
00:23:24,840 --> 00:23:27,040
Speaker 2: and he was sixteen when he started playing for them,

434
00:23:27,080 --> 00:23:30,320
Speaker 2: so he kind of was already exposed to the idea

435
00:23:30,359 --> 00:23:35,000
Speaker 2: of joking around while you're playing serious professional sports by

436
00:23:35,040 --> 00:23:37,000
Speaker 2: the time he got to the Globetrotter, so he was

437
00:23:37,040 --> 00:23:40,280
Speaker 2: like kind of a natural person to bring that. So

438
00:23:40,320 --> 00:23:42,520
Speaker 2: it makes a lot of sense that he would have

439
00:23:42,600 --> 00:23:46,159
Speaker 2: been kind of like the real kernel that created that.

440
00:23:46,960 --> 00:23:50,720
Speaker 2: I don't think that those stories of where it came

441
00:23:50,760 --> 00:23:54,439
Speaker 2: from it evolving over time, and Abe sapristein saying we

442
00:23:54,520 --> 00:23:58,159
Speaker 2: need to do some clowning because the crowds are getting

443
00:23:58,160 --> 00:24:01,199
Speaker 2: bored are mutually exclusive. I think that they could have

444
00:24:02,119 --> 00:24:05,159
Speaker 2: happened together, because apparently the crowds were getting bored, they

445
00:24:05,200 --> 00:24:07,280
Speaker 2: would just blow out the opponent so much that it

446
00:24:07,359 --> 00:24:10,320
Speaker 2: was like, what's what's the point of seeing these games?

447
00:24:10,720 --> 00:24:13,880
Speaker 2: So when they figured out that when they were clowning, though,

448
00:24:13,920 --> 00:24:17,800
Speaker 2: the crowds really responded to it, and eventually, over time

449
00:24:18,119 --> 00:24:21,120
Speaker 2: that would come to serve them well, because as other

450
00:24:21,200 --> 00:24:24,800
Speaker 2: basketball players in like the NBA got better and better

451
00:24:24,840 --> 00:24:29,960
Speaker 2: and sorted adopting more and more Globetrotters techniques, all the

452
00:24:29,960 --> 00:24:32,880
Speaker 2: tech all the Globetrotters had left was the clowning aspect.

453
00:24:32,920 --> 00:24:35,119
Speaker 2: So that's kind of what they became. So it's a

454
00:24:35,160 --> 00:24:38,760
Speaker 2: really neat evolution that it makes sense that this all

455
00:24:38,800 --> 00:24:41,480
Speaker 2: took place over coming up on one hundred years.

456
00:24:42,200 --> 00:24:46,400
Speaker 1: Yeah. Absolutely, And interestingly, Gouse Tatum was, you know, sort

457
00:24:46,400 --> 00:24:49,600
Speaker 1: of an early example of a two way sports star.

458
00:24:50,560 --> 00:24:53,240
Speaker 1: I believe the Globe Shrotters had ended up having four

459
00:24:53,280 --> 00:24:57,280
Speaker 1: different former professional baseball players on their team. Wow, So

460
00:24:57,880 --> 00:25:00,880
Speaker 1: there were you know, the Bo Jackson's, the Deon Sanders

461
00:25:01,119 --> 00:25:04,800
Speaker 1: way back then doing their things. So Goose was the

462
00:25:04,800 --> 00:25:06,919
Speaker 1: one who came up with some of these gags that

463
00:25:06,960 --> 00:25:11,560
Speaker 1: they still hues today, Like they're still doing the same stuff. Man, Well,

464
00:25:11,800 --> 00:25:15,120
Speaker 1: if it's funny, it's funny, I guess. So that the spying,

465
00:25:15,200 --> 00:25:17,360
Speaker 1: like going over in the other team's huddle, he came

466
00:25:17,440 --> 00:25:20,359
Speaker 1: up with that they still do that, hiding in the

467
00:25:20,400 --> 00:25:22,760
Speaker 1: crowd from the ref they still do that. It still

468
00:25:22,840 --> 00:25:27,840
Speaker 1: kills hilarious when you faint on the court, and someone waves,

469
00:25:27,880 --> 00:25:30,280
Speaker 1: takes off your shoe and puts it over your nose

470
00:25:30,320 --> 00:25:32,679
Speaker 1: and you, you know, you start up. They still do that,

471
00:25:33,040 --> 00:25:34,240
Speaker 1: and that all came from Goose.

472
00:25:34,560 --> 00:25:39,080
Speaker 2: Those things make people from eight to eighty just laugh,

473
00:25:39,680 --> 00:25:41,840
Speaker 2: I know. But if you're seven or you're eighty one,

474
00:25:41,960 --> 00:25:42,520
Speaker 2: forget it.

475
00:25:43,040 --> 00:25:46,680
Speaker 1: Yeah. Marcus Haynes was another guy in nineteen forty six,

476
00:25:46,720 --> 00:25:50,280
Speaker 1: he came along. He was a former college basketball star

477
00:25:50,440 --> 00:25:54,879
Speaker 1: and he's the guy that kind of was the inspiration

478
00:25:55,000 --> 00:25:58,119
Speaker 1: for Curly Neil. He's the guy that first started doing

479
00:25:58,160 --> 00:26:01,840
Speaker 1: like the insane dribbling and sliding around on his knees

480
00:26:01,880 --> 00:26:04,760
Speaker 1: and keeping that dribble alive and dribbling between other people's

481
00:26:04,840 --> 00:26:08,040
Speaker 1: legs and dribbling in circles around people. He was the first,

482
00:26:08,280 --> 00:26:09,560
Speaker 1: you know, ball handling master.

483
00:26:09,720 --> 00:26:13,040
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's kind of like one of the Globe Charter

484
00:26:13,240 --> 00:26:16,440
Speaker 2: characters that they always kind of filled at one time

485
00:26:16,520 --> 00:26:20,800
Speaker 2: or another. And like today it's Cherrille George, known as Torch,

486
00:26:21,400 --> 00:26:25,640
Speaker 2: and apparently she holds the world record for most under

487
00:26:25,680 --> 00:26:27,880
Speaker 2: the leg tumbles in a minute. So it's where you're

488
00:26:27,960 --> 00:26:30,560
Speaker 2: dribbling real load to the ground and then you you

489
00:26:30,680 --> 00:26:35,920
Speaker 2: basically do a sumrsault while you dribble the ball between

490
00:26:35,960 --> 00:26:39,480
Speaker 2: your legs and then when you come up on the sumrsault,

491
00:26:39,480 --> 00:26:41,400
Speaker 2: the ball goes right back to your hand. She did

492
00:26:41,480 --> 00:26:44,480
Speaker 2: thirty two of those, one after the other in one minute,

493
00:26:44,800 --> 00:26:48,119
Speaker 2: and that's I buy that being the world record for sure.

494
00:26:48,800 --> 00:26:49,480
Speaker 1: Did you say she?

495
00:26:50,280 --> 00:26:52,960
Speaker 2: I did say she because she is one of three

496
00:26:53,160 --> 00:26:57,399
Speaker 2: women on the the Harlem Globetrotter's team.

497
00:26:58,040 --> 00:26:58,520
Speaker 1: That's right.

498
00:26:58,600 --> 00:27:01,600
Speaker 2: And think about that. If the Globetrotters did somehow get

499
00:27:01,640 --> 00:27:04,960
Speaker 2: their own franchise in the NBA, the NBA then would

500
00:27:05,000 --> 00:27:09,320
Speaker 2: be integrated among the sexes as well. How nuts would

501
00:27:09,320 --> 00:27:11,359
Speaker 2: that be if they not only pushed the NBA to

502
00:27:11,440 --> 00:27:17,560
Speaker 2: integrate racially, but also by sex as well.

503
00:27:17,680 --> 00:27:19,960
Speaker 1: Well. I think if they said, you get a franchise,

504
00:27:20,000 --> 00:27:22,160
Speaker 1: they wouldn't just bring over these players. They would start

505
00:27:22,200 --> 00:27:25,000
Speaker 1: fresh and draft players. And I don't do man get

506
00:27:25,000 --> 00:27:27,480
Speaker 1: any other expansion team because these players are great, but

507
00:27:27,520 --> 00:27:29,840
Speaker 1: they're not NBA. They'd be in the NBA if they

508
00:27:29,840 --> 00:27:35,080
Speaker 1: were NBA caliber. It's true, Okay, no, I mean that's

509
00:27:35,080 --> 00:27:37,240
Speaker 1: where they get these players, their players from college that

510
00:27:37,280 --> 00:27:39,600
Speaker 1: were really good that couldn't go any further.

511
00:27:39,960 --> 00:27:45,240
Speaker 2: Okay, that's new. That's a generally new phenomenon that probably

512
00:27:45,280 --> 00:27:46,360
Speaker 2: started in the eighties.

513
00:27:48,040 --> 00:27:50,919
Speaker 1: I would say probably seventies, but sure, okay, but prior

514
00:27:50,960 --> 00:27:52,359
Speaker 1: to that, just fifty years.

515
00:27:52,400 --> 00:27:55,520
Speaker 2: But prior to that, the Harlem and this is significant,

516
00:27:55,600 --> 00:27:57,960
Speaker 2: the Harlem Globe Trotters were a place where you would go,

517
00:27:59,280 --> 00:28:01,800
Speaker 2: you could go and and create a career for yourself,

518
00:28:02,840 --> 00:28:05,720
Speaker 2: be as good, if not better than the best people

519
00:28:05,760 --> 00:28:08,040
Speaker 2: in the NBA. And the Globe Chartters prove that over

520
00:28:08,080 --> 00:28:09,040
Speaker 2: and over and over again.

521
00:28:09,680 --> 00:28:11,560
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean this was pre NBA, so it wasn't

522
00:28:11,560 --> 00:28:14,479
Speaker 1: even a thing yet still at this point. Okay, So

523
00:28:15,119 --> 00:28:17,480
Speaker 1: the magic circle we mentioned with Sweet Georgia Brown, that's

524
00:28:17,520 --> 00:28:20,800
Speaker 1: another thing they're very famous for. It's when they pregame.

525
00:28:20,840 --> 00:28:23,240
Speaker 1: They'll are in at halftime, they'll stand around in their circle.

526
00:28:23,880 --> 00:28:26,960
Speaker 1: Sweet Georgia Brown plays on the loud speakers and they

527
00:28:27,000 --> 00:28:29,960
Speaker 1: do that thing where they're going behind their back. They're

528
00:28:29,960 --> 00:28:32,600
Speaker 1: doing all these ball tricks. They're spinning it on their finger.

529
00:28:33,680 --> 00:28:35,879
Speaker 1: It's just a little little fun warm up to get

530
00:28:35,920 --> 00:28:37,240
Speaker 1: everybody excited.

531
00:28:37,680 --> 00:28:41,080
Speaker 2: And it works like a charm. It does you want

532
00:28:41,160 --> 00:28:42,440
Speaker 2: to take a break or keep going?

533
00:28:45,440 --> 00:28:46,040
Speaker 1: Let's keep going.

534
00:28:46,120 --> 00:28:50,200
Speaker 2: Okay. So one of the biggest watershed moments in Globe

535
00:28:50,240 --> 00:28:54,400
Speaker 2: Charter history was in nineteen forty eight when the Globe

536
00:28:54,440 --> 00:28:59,120
Speaker 2: Chartters challenge the Minneapolis Lakers, whose name makes way more

537
00:28:59,160 --> 00:29:02,200
Speaker 2: sense than the las Ai Angelus Lakers, as I've said

538
00:29:02,280 --> 00:29:06,600
Speaker 2: multiple times on this show, who were the champions of

539
00:29:06,680 --> 00:29:11,080
Speaker 2: the World Basketball or National Basketball League at the time,

540
00:29:11,280 --> 00:29:14,040
Speaker 2: challenged them to a game. And the Lakers were all white,

541
00:29:14,520 --> 00:29:16,760
Speaker 2: and their team was centered around a guy named George

542
00:29:16,840 --> 00:29:21,200
Speaker 2: McCann or Miken, and he was six feet ten, wore

543
00:29:21,280 --> 00:29:26,840
Speaker 2: glasses and could just he just took shots whenever he

544
00:29:26,880 --> 00:29:29,080
Speaker 2: wanted and he made basically all them. There's just nothing

545
00:29:29,120 --> 00:29:31,040
Speaker 2: you could do to stop him. And he was a

546
00:29:31,160 --> 00:29:36,200
Speaker 2: huge reason that Minneapolis were the champs. And in February

547
00:29:36,280 --> 00:29:39,959
Speaker 2: of nineteen forty eight, the Globetrotters played the Lakers and

548
00:29:40,000 --> 00:29:43,280
Speaker 2: they beat them, and they beat them like at the buzzer.

549
00:29:43,320 --> 00:29:48,040
Speaker 2: It was like a really dramatic, really amazing game that

550
00:29:48,160 --> 00:29:51,440
Speaker 2: showed the world like, whoa, these guys, who the sports

551
00:29:51,440 --> 00:29:57,000
Speaker 2: writers consider clowns and not serious, just beat the champions

552
00:29:57,080 --> 00:30:00,880
Speaker 2: of a very serious basketball league. What's going on here?

553
00:30:01,680 --> 00:30:04,800
Speaker 1: Yeah, And in the pre shot clock era, you could

554
00:30:04,880 --> 00:30:06,520
Speaker 1: dribble the ball around at the end of the game,

555
00:30:07,400 --> 00:30:09,600
Speaker 1: until somebody fouled you. And in this case they could

556
00:30:09,600 --> 00:30:13,760
Speaker 1: not catch Marcus Haynes, the ball handling master, So with

557
00:30:13,840 --> 00:30:15,600
Speaker 1: less than a minute left in the game was side.

558
00:30:15,600 --> 00:30:18,160
Speaker 1: He was dribbling all over the court, nobody could get

559
00:30:18,160 --> 00:30:21,760
Speaker 1: to him. He finally, as the time is expiring, gets

560
00:30:21,800 --> 00:30:24,360
Speaker 1: the ball over to Elma Robertson, who drains a twenty

561
00:30:24,400 --> 00:30:28,560
Speaker 1: footer and they beat the Lakers. And just to show like, hey,

562
00:30:28,600 --> 00:30:31,400
Speaker 1: this wasn't some fluke, are actually a good team, they played

563
00:30:31,440 --> 00:30:33,920
Speaker 1: them again in nineteen forty nine and beat them again.

564
00:30:34,120 --> 00:30:37,080
Speaker 2: Yeah the following year, and in the Lakers defense, the

565
00:30:37,160 --> 00:30:39,640
Speaker 2: Lakers were leading by ten at the half and the

566
00:30:39,680 --> 00:30:43,240
Speaker 2: Globe Charters were doing zero clowning. They were playing straight basketball.

567
00:30:43,600 --> 00:30:45,920
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, and they still almost lost, but they won.

568
00:30:46,280 --> 00:30:50,520
Speaker 2: So by winning those two back to back championships, I

569
00:30:50,520 --> 00:30:54,720
Speaker 2: guess the not just the Globe Charters, but also like

570
00:30:54,800 --> 00:30:58,000
Speaker 2: the Wrens and other black teams showed like we've got

571
00:30:58,080 --> 00:31:02,320
Speaker 2: better players over here. And for you basketball associations that

572
00:31:02,360 --> 00:31:05,360
Speaker 2: are eventually going to become the NBA, like you're shooting

573
00:31:05,360 --> 00:31:09,000
Speaker 2: yourselves in the feet by staying segregated, Like why would

574
00:31:09,040 --> 00:31:11,000
Speaker 2: you do that? Why wouldn't you just want to put

575
00:31:11,000 --> 00:31:14,960
Speaker 2: together the best team you possibly could, regardless of race.

576
00:31:15,560 --> 00:31:20,680
Speaker 2: And the Basketball Association said racism, and the Globetrotter said, yes,

577
00:31:20,920 --> 00:31:24,880
Speaker 2: clearly that's why, but stop doing that. And very quickly

578
00:31:24,920 --> 00:31:28,080
Speaker 2: shortly after those two wins against the Lakers, they did

579
00:31:28,080 --> 00:31:29,800
Speaker 2: start integrating basketball leagues.

580
00:31:31,160 --> 00:31:33,280
Speaker 1: Yeah. One of the first guys they signed, actually in

581
00:31:33,320 --> 00:31:38,080
Speaker 1: nineteen fifty was a Globetrotter, Sweetwater Clifton. And so you

582
00:31:38,120 --> 00:31:41,400
Speaker 1: know that what Abe Sabertine set out to do to

583
00:31:41,440 --> 00:31:43,640
Speaker 1: prove they were as good or better than anybody in

584
00:31:43,680 --> 00:31:45,880
Speaker 1: the pro leagues worked right away.

585
00:31:45,960 --> 00:31:48,120
Speaker 2: Yeah, and so he so this was actually like a

586
00:31:48,160 --> 00:31:51,760
Speaker 2: double edged sword that gave Abe Ceperstein like boasting rights,

587
00:31:51,760 --> 00:31:54,560
Speaker 2: which he did a lot about how the NBA wanted

588
00:31:54,560 --> 00:31:57,600
Speaker 2: his players. The first player to ever be signed who

589
00:31:57,680 --> 00:32:00,400
Speaker 2: was black, and the NBA came from the Globe ttris

590
00:32:00,800 --> 00:32:02,880
Speaker 2: at the same time, though it would start to become

591
00:32:02,920 --> 00:32:06,840
Speaker 2: a problem later on as the NBA got better and

592
00:32:06,880 --> 00:32:09,360
Speaker 2: better and stood more and more on its own two feet.

593
00:32:10,720 --> 00:32:13,560
Speaker 1: A great cliffhanger, think so too, All right, we'll be

594
00:32:13,640 --> 00:32:14,040
Speaker 1: right back.

595
00:32:37,920 --> 00:32:40,680
Speaker 2: That Sweetwater Clifton, by the way, was one of the

596
00:32:40,680 --> 00:32:43,680
Speaker 2: people who was swindled by Abe Sapristine. He sold his

597
00:32:43,800 --> 00:32:49,000
Speaker 2: contract to I think the Knicks for five thousand dollars

598
00:32:49,040 --> 00:32:53,960
Speaker 2: and gave half of it to Clifton, the player. And

599
00:32:54,000 --> 00:32:55,840
Speaker 2: it turns out he had sold the contract for twenty

600
00:32:55,880 --> 00:32:59,520
Speaker 2: thousand dollars and only gave Nat Clifton twenty five hundred

601
00:32:59,720 --> 00:33:02,360
Speaker 2: because Clifton thought he was getting half. Like that's the

602
00:33:02,440 --> 00:33:03,479
Speaker 2: kind of stuff he would do.

603
00:33:03,680 --> 00:33:07,200
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's not cool. Well, at least Nat Clifton got

604
00:33:07,240 --> 00:33:07,600
Speaker 1: to move on.

605
00:33:07,880 --> 00:33:09,680
Speaker 2: He did move on for sure, and he was ready

606
00:33:09,680 --> 00:33:11,880
Speaker 2: to move on too. They were having disputes over things

607
00:33:11,920 --> 00:33:14,520
Speaker 2: like pay and everything yea, and just treatment of players,

608
00:33:15,240 --> 00:33:18,000
Speaker 2: and yeah, Nat Clifton was one of the first black

609
00:33:18,800 --> 00:33:20,080
Speaker 2: greats in the NBA.

610
00:33:20,960 --> 00:33:25,120
Speaker 1: Yeah. Absolutely, So early days of the NBA, they're it's

611
00:33:25,120 --> 00:33:28,280
Speaker 1: not Gangbusters right away. They're sort of this new league

612
00:33:28,280 --> 00:33:33,000
Speaker 1: that's struggling to get going. The Globetrotters are huge stars,

613
00:33:33,680 --> 00:33:36,160
Speaker 1: way bigger stars than people in the NBA. At the time.

614
00:33:36,840 --> 00:33:38,440
Speaker 1: They were in movies. They were in a movie called

615
00:33:38,480 --> 00:33:42,480
Speaker 1: the Harlem Globetrotters, another one called Go Man Go, and

616
00:33:43,640 --> 00:33:46,920
Speaker 1: so Sapristine, you know, ever, the businessman in nineteen fifty

617
00:33:46,920 --> 00:33:50,760
Speaker 1: said all right, we're We're named the Globetrotters. We're gonna

618
00:33:50,760 --> 00:33:53,000
Speaker 1: start trotting the globe. And so set off on a

619
00:33:53,040 --> 00:33:56,480
Speaker 1: five month around the world tour. Took places like Rome

620
00:33:56,680 --> 00:34:00,000
Speaker 1: and Paris and London, and they ate it up everywhere

621
00:33:59,960 --> 00:34:00,280
Speaker 1: they went.

622
00:34:00,360 --> 00:34:04,280
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, they were treated like celebrities everywhere, Like they

623
00:34:04,280 --> 00:34:06,840
Speaker 2: would just sell out tens and tens of thousands of

624
00:34:06,880 --> 00:34:09,520
Speaker 2: seats in every city that they played a game in.

625
00:34:10,560 --> 00:34:12,680
Speaker 2: People just hadn't seen anything like it over there, and

626
00:34:12,719 --> 00:34:16,440
Speaker 2: they were just totally wild and blown over by the Globetrotters.

627
00:34:17,800 --> 00:34:20,799
Speaker 2: The State Department actually got in touch with Abe Saperstein

628
00:34:21,280 --> 00:34:24,439
Speaker 2: and said, hey, you know, we're in a cold war

629
00:34:24,560 --> 00:34:28,600
Speaker 2: with the USSR, and they like to basically point out

630
00:34:28,640 --> 00:34:32,360
Speaker 2: how poorly black Americans are treated back home, and the

631
00:34:32,360 --> 00:34:34,840
Speaker 2: Globe Trotters kind of suggest otherwise, So what if we

632
00:34:34,880 --> 00:34:38,520
Speaker 2: make the Globe Trotters goodwill Ambassadors? And so from that

633
00:34:38,719 --> 00:34:42,640
Speaker 2: point on, I think in the early fifties they were

634
00:34:42,760 --> 00:34:47,960
Speaker 2: essentially on the State Department team. They were playing in

635
00:34:48,040 --> 00:34:50,279
Speaker 2: part at the best of the State Department, who was

636
00:34:50,800 --> 00:34:52,880
Speaker 2: I don't know if they were helped funding their travels

637
00:34:52,920 --> 00:34:55,120
Speaker 2: or what, but they were definitely good Will ambassadors for

638
00:34:55,160 --> 00:34:56,080
Speaker 2: the United States.

639
00:34:56,840 --> 00:34:59,040
Speaker 1: Yeah. One of the first things they did was they

640
00:34:59,400 --> 00:35:03,359
Speaker 1: played in West Berlin at the Olympic Stadium. There the

641
00:35:03,520 --> 00:35:09,440
Speaker 1: very stadium where Jesse Owens made his name in nineteen

642
00:35:09,520 --> 00:35:13,200
Speaker 1: thirty six at the Berlin Games when Hitler very famously

643
00:35:13,239 --> 00:35:17,480
Speaker 1: refused to shake his hand. He came in, was helicoptered in.

644
00:35:18,120 --> 00:35:21,440
Speaker 1: Jesse Owens dropped in there on the field and he

645
00:35:21,520 --> 00:35:24,960
Speaker 1: ran a ceremonial lap to sort of just get everybody

646
00:35:25,040 --> 00:35:29,200
Speaker 1: pumped up before this basketball game in front of seventy

647
00:35:29,239 --> 00:35:30,840
Speaker 1: six thousand people.

648
00:35:31,000 --> 00:35:34,000
Speaker 2: Yeah, and the mayor of West Berlin used it as

649
00:35:34,000 --> 00:35:39,200
Speaker 2: an opportunity to reconcile with Jesse Owens on behalf of Germany.

650
00:35:39,480 --> 00:35:43,319
Speaker 2: And I was reading a description of that event, and

651
00:35:43,480 --> 00:35:48,400
Speaker 2: supposedly the Globetrotter's game post was delayed by ten fifteen

652
00:35:48,440 --> 00:35:52,080
Speaker 2: minutes because the ovation giving to Jesse Owens and the

653
00:35:52,120 --> 00:35:55,240
Speaker 2: mayor was so long. It just kept going and going.

654
00:35:55,280 --> 00:35:57,440
Speaker 2: So it was neat just to even read about it.

655
00:35:57,440 --> 00:35:59,000
Speaker 2: I can't imagine being there at the time.

656
00:35:59,560 --> 00:36:02,839
Speaker 1: Oh man, So they're on this world tour, they are

657
00:36:02,920 --> 00:36:07,400
Speaker 1: celebrities and they're treated as such, and they're having a blast.

658
00:36:07,440 --> 00:36:10,279
Speaker 1: I imagine they come back home to an America that

659
00:36:10,400 --> 00:36:14,879
Speaker 1: is still segregated, and Dave found this one just this

660
00:36:14,960 --> 00:36:19,040
Speaker 1: is hard to believe and so shameful. In Jacksonville, Florida

661
00:36:19,320 --> 00:36:22,840
Speaker 1: in the early fifties, a hotel refused them service, and

662
00:36:22,920 --> 00:36:29,000
Speaker 1: that same hotel allowed a chimpanzee named Judy, a celebrity

663
00:36:29,080 --> 00:36:36,080
Speaker 1: chimpanzee that bowled on television like Bowling, set Judy up

664
00:36:36,080 --> 00:36:38,680
Speaker 1: in the presidential suite, yet denied the Harlem Globe trotters.

665
00:36:38,880 --> 00:36:40,680
Speaker 2: Yeah, that was an eye opening thing for a lot

666
00:36:40,719 --> 00:36:43,920
Speaker 2: of the globetrotters at the time. It was just that bad.

667
00:36:44,719 --> 00:36:46,400
Speaker 2: On the one hand, they had, like the rest of

668
00:36:46,440 --> 00:36:49,799
Speaker 2: the world to go be received by, and they were,

669
00:36:50,320 --> 00:36:52,200
Speaker 2: but just the idea that to have to come back

670
00:36:52,239 --> 00:36:54,440
Speaker 2: home to that, yeah, I mean it just had to

671
00:36:54,480 --> 00:36:58,680
Speaker 2: be doubly bitter after being treated so well outside of

672
00:36:58,680 --> 00:37:00,439
Speaker 2: the United States outside home.

673
00:37:00,480 --> 00:37:02,840
Speaker 1: You know, of course this would be a good movie.

674
00:37:02,880 --> 00:37:03,800
Speaker 1: I I say that.

675
00:37:03,680 --> 00:37:09,239
Speaker 2: Totally for sure. So the late nineteen fifties that the

676
00:37:09,360 --> 00:37:12,239
Speaker 2: NBA started to really come into its own And one

677
00:37:12,280 --> 00:37:14,759
Speaker 2: of the reasons why I was saying, Abe Sapristin can

678
00:37:14,800 --> 00:37:17,160
Speaker 2: take a lot of credit for the NBA being around today.

679
00:37:17,640 --> 00:37:21,160
Speaker 2: Is he agreed to help this fledgling NBA make a

680
00:37:21,239 --> 00:37:24,600
Speaker 2: name for itself by playing double headers with them, either

681
00:37:24,680 --> 00:37:28,280
Speaker 2: having the Globetrotters play NBA teams or having the NBA

682
00:37:28,440 --> 00:37:30,600
Speaker 2: be like the second the NBA teams were like the

683
00:37:30,640 --> 00:37:35,320
Speaker 2: second game on a double header bill. Yeah, and apparently

684
00:37:35,520 --> 00:37:37,680
Speaker 2: most of the time the crowd would just leave after

685
00:37:37,719 --> 00:37:40,439
Speaker 2: the Globetrotter game, wouldn't stick around for the NBA game,

686
00:37:40,600 --> 00:37:43,440
Speaker 2: But enough people did that the NBA started to catch on,

687
00:37:43,800 --> 00:37:46,720
Speaker 2: and it took about ten years, but it was largely

688
00:37:46,760 --> 00:37:49,640
Speaker 2: thanks to the Globetrotters and Abe Sebristin for getting the

689
00:37:49,760 --> 00:37:52,439
Speaker 2: NBA to a place where it could stand on its own.

690
00:37:52,560 --> 00:37:55,440
Speaker 2: And then once it did, now Abe Sepristin and the

691
00:37:55,440 --> 00:37:59,040
Speaker 2: Globetrotters had a problem because no longer were they the

692
00:37:59,360 --> 00:38:04,279
Speaker 2: place where a great black basketball player would aspire to

693
00:38:04,320 --> 00:38:10,799
Speaker 2: go play. They were away station sometimes and then other

694
00:38:10,800 --> 00:38:14,479
Speaker 2: people just went directly around the Globe Charters and straight

695
00:38:14,520 --> 00:38:15,160
Speaker 2: to the NBA.

696
00:38:16,080 --> 00:38:19,520
Speaker 1: Yeah, you know, it was sort of be careful of

697
00:38:19,560 --> 00:38:22,439
Speaker 1: what you helped create, because not only like you said,

698
00:38:22,480 --> 00:38:25,440
Speaker 1: are they stealing or not stealing players, but just you know,

699
00:38:25,880 --> 00:38:29,120
Speaker 1: signing players away from the Globe Trotters. The Globe Charters

700
00:38:29,120 --> 00:38:32,720
Speaker 1: weren't necessary anymore as this sort of very high profile

701
00:38:32,800 --> 00:38:36,320
Speaker 1: minor league. In a way, Wilt Chamberlain was a Harlem Globetrotter.

702
00:38:36,400 --> 00:38:39,719
Speaker 1: He played for the nineteen fifty eight season. I don't

703
00:38:39,719 --> 00:38:41,480
Speaker 1: think a lot of people realize that, you know, one

704
00:38:41,480 --> 00:38:43,960
Speaker 1: of the all time great NBA players, Will the Stilt

705
00:38:44,640 --> 00:38:48,920
Speaker 1: was paid six supposedly sixty thousand dollars to play for

706
00:38:48,960 --> 00:38:51,279
Speaker 1: the Harlem Globetrotters for that one season, which would be

707
00:38:51,280 --> 00:38:53,200
Speaker 1: about six hundred thousand dollars today.

708
00:38:53,280 --> 00:38:55,520
Speaker 2: Yeah, which is I think below the minimum for a

709
00:38:55,560 --> 00:39:01,080
Speaker 2: starting salary in the NBA today anyway, but still.

710
00:39:00,960 --> 00:39:04,240
Speaker 1: Yeah, that time a ton of money, and the NBA's

711
00:39:04,320 --> 00:39:06,440
Speaker 1: salaries are very high.

712
00:39:06,480 --> 00:39:09,000
Speaker 2: So that brings up something that has nothing to do

713
00:39:09,040 --> 00:39:11,640
Speaker 2: with this, but that came up twice in research when

714
00:39:11,680 --> 00:39:15,480
Speaker 2: they were talking about what the what the Globe Chritters made.

715
00:39:15,560 --> 00:39:18,680
Speaker 2: Initially that like three dollars and fifty cents each per game,

716
00:39:19,320 --> 00:39:21,880
Speaker 2: and how little amount that was is like sixty two

717
00:39:22,000 --> 00:39:25,279
Speaker 2: fifty I think a player a game, and that's a

718
00:39:25,280 --> 00:39:29,880
Speaker 2: small amount of money in today's today's like money in

719
00:39:29,920 --> 00:39:33,600
Speaker 2: today's dollars, right, yeah, but that seems to indicate a

720
00:39:33,719 --> 00:39:39,120
Speaker 2: trend that even adjusted for inflation, things today are eye

721
00:39:39,120 --> 00:39:43,520
Speaker 2: poppingly more expensive. Like I looked up how much those

722
00:39:43,560 --> 00:39:46,240
Speaker 2: players could have gotten for their three dollars and fifty cents,

723
00:39:46,400 --> 00:39:48,600
Speaker 2: and I came across to like a nineteen twenty eight

724
00:39:49,000 --> 00:39:51,719
Speaker 2: menu for like what seems to be a pretty nice restaurant,

725
00:39:52,040 --> 00:39:55,600
Speaker 2: and you could get an amazing dinner with dessert and

726
00:39:55,640 --> 00:39:57,719
Speaker 2: like a couple of soups and salad and all that

727
00:39:57,760 --> 00:40:03,719
Speaker 2: stuff for like fifty sense right, Yeah, today, even in

728
00:40:03,880 --> 00:40:06,560
Speaker 2: today's dollars, that would be something like eight dollars or

729
00:40:06,600 --> 00:40:10,000
Speaker 2: something today. Imagine like having a nice center for just

730
00:40:10,080 --> 00:40:14,239
Speaker 2: eight dollars today. So what happened is my question. I'm

731
00:40:14,280 --> 00:40:18,400
Speaker 2: trying to figure out how to how to come up

732
00:40:18,440 --> 00:40:22,600
Speaker 2: with the right question to go research what happened? Like

733
00:40:22,880 --> 00:40:25,799
Speaker 2: why did things get more expensive? Why did people start

734
00:40:25,800 --> 00:40:30,439
Speaker 2: throwing more money at like basketball players, even adjusted for

735
00:40:30,719 --> 00:40:34,800
Speaker 2: today's dollars, Like, what happened? Why did money just blow

736
00:40:34,880 --> 00:40:37,080
Speaker 2: up in the last like twenty thirty years.

737
00:40:37,560 --> 00:40:40,600
Speaker 1: Well, in the case of sports, is because players stood

738
00:40:40,640 --> 00:40:42,080
Speaker 1: up at one point and we're like, wait a minute,

739
00:40:42,120 --> 00:40:44,640
Speaker 1: the owners are making that kind of money we're the

740
00:40:44,640 --> 00:40:47,000
Speaker 1: ones out here that are putting people in the seats,

741
00:40:47,040 --> 00:40:49,239
Speaker 1: and we're making this kind of money. And so they

742
00:40:49,360 --> 00:40:52,800
Speaker 1: unionized and were able to make great deals over the

743
00:40:52,840 --> 00:40:54,759
Speaker 1: year every time they sat down to the negotiating table.

744
00:40:54,800 --> 00:40:57,879
Speaker 2: Okay, but let's say that restaurant that was charging eight

745
00:40:57,920 --> 00:41:00,760
Speaker 2: dollars in today's dollars for a really nice, good dinner.

746
00:41:01,480 --> 00:41:05,840
Speaker 2: Sure you would say, okay, well, maybe there's like more

747
00:41:06,000 --> 00:41:08,360
Speaker 2: demand for that. More people have more money to go

748
00:41:08,400 --> 00:41:12,120
Speaker 2: out to dinner, so they're doing that. So the restaurants

749
00:41:12,120 --> 00:41:14,440
Speaker 2: are going to charge more because of supply and demand.

750
00:41:14,480 --> 00:41:17,560
Speaker 2: There's a higher demand and thus less supply. I would

751
00:41:17,880 --> 00:41:19,880
Speaker 2: argue there is not less supply. I would say that

752
00:41:19,920 --> 00:41:22,920
Speaker 2: the supply has increased even more than the demand has,

753
00:41:23,160 --> 00:41:26,080
Speaker 2: and yet that same dinner probably costs three to four

754
00:41:26,120 --> 00:41:29,560
Speaker 2: times what it should adjusted for today's dollars.

755
00:41:29,840 --> 00:41:32,840
Speaker 1: Why, yeah, I see what you mean. I'm sure that

756
00:41:32,920 --> 00:41:35,920
Speaker 1: somebody will ride in and say, well, guys, it's just

757
00:41:36,120 --> 00:41:41,280
Speaker 1: research the last forty years of the corporatization of whatever

758
00:41:41,400 --> 00:41:43,680
Speaker 1: or something like. There's probably something you can point to

759
00:41:43,800 --> 00:41:46,160
Speaker 1: that made things go really out of whack. And it

760
00:41:46,160 --> 00:41:50,680
Speaker 1: wouldn't surprise me if it was the consolidation of wealth

761
00:41:51,200 --> 00:41:52,600
Speaker 1: and corporations in general.

762
00:41:52,680 --> 00:41:54,759
Speaker 2: But that's exactly what I'm hoping for bringing this up.

763
00:41:54,800 --> 00:41:57,360
Speaker 2: I hope somebody who knows what I'm saying but just

764
00:41:57,400 --> 00:41:58,440
Speaker 2: don't know how to say it.

765
00:41:59,080 --> 00:42:02,319
Speaker 1: Yeah, like, how can we research this speak exactly? Yeah,

766
00:42:02,360 --> 00:42:06,400
Speaker 1: I'm with you. I'm with you. Thanks back to the

767
00:42:06,400 --> 00:42:12,240
Speaker 1: Harlem Globetrotters, though the NBA is getting these players from

768
00:42:12,320 --> 00:42:14,799
Speaker 1: the Globetrotters, you know, kind of one after the other,

769
00:42:15,400 --> 00:42:17,719
Speaker 1: and so the Globetrotters are like, all right, well, you

770
00:42:17,760 --> 00:42:20,759
Speaker 1: know what that means, Our days are numbered unless we

771
00:42:20,800 --> 00:42:25,600
Speaker 1: really lean into this comedy stuff. And from sort of

772
00:42:25,600 --> 00:42:29,600
Speaker 1: the mid nineteen fifties on, it really became the Harlem

773
00:42:29,640 --> 00:42:34,200
Speaker 1: Globetrotters like basketball, fun time comedy show that we all

774
00:42:34,239 --> 00:42:37,080
Speaker 1: know and love today. Starting with their leader who you mentioned,

775
00:42:37,080 --> 00:42:40,400
Speaker 1: metal ark Lemon, who was there from fifty four to

776
00:42:40,440 --> 00:42:42,280
Speaker 1: seventy eight, and he was kind of the central figure.

777
00:42:42,680 --> 00:42:45,319
Speaker 2: Yeah, they lucked out that metalw ark Lemon saw a

778
00:42:45,360 --> 00:42:49,120
Speaker 2: newsreel when he was eleven in nineteen forty five at

779
00:42:49,120 --> 00:42:53,160
Speaker 2: his movie theater in Wilmington, North Carolina, and decided like

780
00:42:53,239 --> 00:42:56,600
Speaker 2: he was going to grow up to be a Harlem Globetrotter.

781
00:42:56,680 --> 00:42:59,480
Speaker 2: That was his life's pursuit, and he made it happen.

782
00:42:59,520 --> 00:43:03,279
Speaker 2: I think in his twenties he joined the team and

783
00:43:03,320 --> 00:43:06,919
Speaker 2: became like kind of the ring master of the whole thing.

784
00:43:07,920 --> 00:43:11,160
Speaker 2: He became far and away their greatest star, not just

785
00:43:11,239 --> 00:43:14,479
Speaker 2: of his era, but of like all time essentially. Meadow

786
00:43:14,640 --> 00:43:18,960
Speaker 2: arc Lemon is well known even outside of exactly for sure,

787
00:43:19,920 --> 00:43:24,360
Speaker 2: he was the one who led the crew on Scooby Doo.

788
00:43:24,880 --> 00:43:29,920
Speaker 2: He was at the heart of the Harlem Globetrotter Saturday

789
00:43:29,920 --> 00:43:32,600
Speaker 2: Morning cartoon like that kind of stuff. Like it was

790
00:43:32,640 --> 00:43:35,400
Speaker 2: all meadow Lark all the time. And I get the

791
00:43:35,400 --> 00:43:37,319
Speaker 2: impression that some of the other members of the team

792
00:43:37,320 --> 00:43:41,200
Speaker 2: were not super happy about exactly how inequitable things were.

793
00:43:41,239 --> 00:43:44,719
Speaker 2: But he definitely brought the crowds and he was a

794
00:43:44,800 --> 00:43:46,200
Speaker 2: huge crowd pleaser for sure.

795
00:43:47,120 --> 00:43:49,600
Speaker 1: Yeah, he's the guy who invented the confetti bit, which

796
00:43:49,680 --> 00:43:52,879
Speaker 1: is you're chasing a referee down with what everyone thinks

797
00:43:53,000 --> 00:43:56,040
Speaker 1: is a bucket of water and he throws it into

798
00:43:56,040 --> 00:43:58,960
Speaker 1: the stands and misses the referee and everyone goes crazy,

799
00:43:59,040 --> 00:44:03,040
Speaker 1: but it's really confetti still works somehow. He's the one

800
00:44:03,040 --> 00:44:06,920
Speaker 1: that started pulling everyone shorts down and pantsing everybody, referees,

801
00:44:07,040 --> 00:44:11,000
Speaker 1: fellow players, Washington generals. He's a guy that started doing

802
00:44:11,080 --> 00:44:15,120
Speaker 1: that half court hook shot, which a guy still does

803
00:44:15,120 --> 00:44:17,080
Speaker 1: that now they're keeping that traditional alive. But I think

804
00:44:17,120 --> 00:44:19,440
Speaker 1: it was they have a guy from Atlanta because at

805
00:44:19,520 --> 00:44:21,600
Speaker 1: least in the one I saw, because it was you know,

806
00:44:21,680 --> 00:44:23,520
Speaker 1: played up that it was a hometown show for him

807
00:44:23,880 --> 00:44:26,200
Speaker 1: and he was the guy that was shooting the half

808
00:44:26,200 --> 00:44:28,239
Speaker 1: court hook shot, and he didn't make any of them,

809
00:44:28,239 --> 00:44:31,279
Speaker 1: but he came really really close. It's very hard to do.

810
00:44:31,360 --> 00:44:33,719
Speaker 1: Supposedly metal Arc Lemon was so good at it that

811
00:44:33,760 --> 00:44:37,680
Speaker 1: he would nail it seventy percent of the time. I'm

812
00:44:37,719 --> 00:44:38,680
Speaker 1: not so sure about well.

813
00:44:38,680 --> 00:44:40,719
Speaker 2: He has a lot of legend around him, like he

814
00:44:41,000 --> 00:44:44,040
Speaker 2: even on the Hall of Fame Basketball Hall of Fame website,

815
00:44:44,160 --> 00:44:47,720
Speaker 2: he's credited with playing sixteen thousand games as a Globe Trotter,

816
00:44:48,480 --> 00:44:50,680
Speaker 2: And all you have to do is the math and

817
00:44:50,719 --> 00:44:53,759
Speaker 2: you'll see that that's basically impossible. He would have had

818
00:44:53,800 --> 00:44:57,640
Speaker 2: to have played. He would have had to have played

819
00:44:57,960 --> 00:45:02,120
Speaker 2: two games a day every day for twenty one years

820
00:45:02,880 --> 00:45:04,799
Speaker 2: to reach that number, and he was only with the

821
00:45:04,800 --> 00:45:07,680
Speaker 2: Globetrotters for twenty four years and I'm quite sure the

822
00:45:07,719 --> 00:45:12,400
Speaker 2: math still isn't wash out, but it just kind of

823
00:45:12,440 --> 00:45:14,480
Speaker 2: goes to show like how willing everybody is to go

824
00:45:14,600 --> 00:45:16,640
Speaker 2: along with it. That's how good of a ballplayer. He

825
00:45:16,880 --> 00:45:20,680
Speaker 2: was that they're like, yeah, that's probably not that far off.

826
00:45:21,800 --> 00:45:25,719
Speaker 1: Yeah. Absolutely. As far as sort of the perception and

827
00:45:25,800 --> 00:45:29,719
Speaker 1: legacy of the Globetrotters at the time, some looked down

828
00:45:29,800 --> 00:45:33,359
Speaker 1: upon them from the civil rights community and said that,

829
00:45:33,440 --> 00:45:36,959
Speaker 1: you know, you guys are perpetuating these stereotypes. You're sort

830
00:45:36,960 --> 00:45:41,720
Speaker 1: of doing a basketball version of a traveling minstrel show.

831
00:45:42,760 --> 00:45:46,360
Speaker 1: Other people said, no, that's not what's going on. No

832
00:45:46,480 --> 00:45:49,239
Speaker 1: less than Jesse Jackson would stand up for them, and

833
00:45:49,440 --> 00:45:52,840
Speaker 1: his quote was the Globetrotters did not show blacks as stupid.

834
00:45:53,200 --> 00:45:56,640
Speaker 1: On the contrary, they were shown as superior. He was like,

835
00:45:56,680 --> 00:45:58,719
Speaker 1: they're you know, they're bringing this to an audience who

836
00:45:58,719 --> 00:46:02,320
Speaker 1: maybe has never seen something like this. It's fun. They're

837
00:46:02,600 --> 00:46:05,759
Speaker 1: really good at what they do, and stop with all that.

838
00:46:06,239 --> 00:46:09,879
Speaker 2: Yeah, So they made it through that really rough time.

839
00:46:09,920 --> 00:46:14,040
Speaker 2: They'd navigate that because they definitely were old school black

840
00:46:14,080 --> 00:46:18,200
Speaker 2: comedy in a time where that was increasingly looked upon

841
00:46:18,400 --> 00:46:24,799
Speaker 2: as offensive. To the black community. So they navigated that.

842
00:46:24,800 --> 00:46:27,560
Speaker 2: They managed to and I think I don't know how

843
00:46:27,600 --> 00:46:30,040
Speaker 2: much they changed. I think they made They just weathered

844
00:46:30,080 --> 00:46:32,279
Speaker 2: that criticism and came out the other side, you know.

845
00:46:33,400 --> 00:46:37,200
Speaker 2: So one of the reasons they were superior, though, is

846
00:46:37,239 --> 00:46:41,880
Speaker 2: because there was almost always a team in the Globe

847
00:46:41,960 --> 00:46:45,719
Speaker 2: chartter history that was paid to lose to them. Yeah,

848
00:46:45,719 --> 00:46:50,000
Speaker 2: which kind of explains their twenty two thousand to three

849
00:46:50,200 --> 00:46:52,520
Speaker 2: d and forty five win loss ratio.

850
00:46:53,800 --> 00:46:56,440
Speaker 1: Absolutely, they went by different names over the years, the

851
00:46:56,440 --> 00:47:00,480
Speaker 1: Boston Shamrocks, the New Jersey Reds, the Atlantic City See Goals.

852
00:47:01,239 --> 00:47:03,640
Speaker 1: But in modern times we all know and love them

853
00:47:03,680 --> 00:47:06,960
Speaker 1: as the Washington Generals. They used to be an all

854
00:47:07,000 --> 00:47:11,399
Speaker 1: white team. Now the Generals are integrated as well. And

855
00:47:11,800 --> 00:47:14,879
Speaker 1: you know, it's a it's a gig where you get

856
00:47:14,920 --> 00:47:18,000
Speaker 1: to keep playing basketball and you get to get paid

857
00:47:18,080 --> 00:47:22,319
Speaker 1: for playing basketball. You gotta be okay with being the

858
00:47:22,880 --> 00:47:27,520
Speaker 1: you know, the sucker sometimes and to be pants and

859
00:47:27,719 --> 00:47:32,080
Speaker 1: to lose. But these guys can play like they always

860
00:47:32,120 --> 00:47:34,080
Speaker 1: could play. But you know this team that I just

861
00:47:34,080 --> 00:47:36,600
Speaker 1: saw last year, like these guys were good. They had

862
00:47:36,600 --> 00:47:41,160
Speaker 1: this they had this point guard that was just draining

863
00:47:41,480 --> 00:47:45,799
Speaker 1: really really long jump shot three pointers like Steph Curry

864
00:47:45,800 --> 00:47:48,080
Speaker 1: style six to seven, Trey Young style eight feet behind

865
00:47:48,120 --> 00:47:51,640
Speaker 1: the three point line, and like, you can't. You can

866
00:47:51,719 --> 00:47:55,560
Speaker 1: fake and script things, but you can't, you know, make

867
00:47:55,600 --> 00:47:58,319
Speaker 1: that ball go in nothing but net unless you're really

868
00:47:58,320 --> 00:47:59,920
Speaker 1: good at that. And this guy was awesome.

869
00:48:00,200 --> 00:48:03,120
Speaker 2: So yeah, a handful of them have gone on to

870
00:48:03,160 --> 00:48:05,600
Speaker 2: play in the NBA. So it's almost like the no,

871
00:48:05,640 --> 00:48:07,359
Speaker 2: I'm not giving up yet, I'm going to play for

872
00:48:07,440 --> 00:48:11,120
Speaker 2: the Generals and then get back into the NBA, almost

873
00:48:11,120 --> 00:48:13,839
Speaker 2: like playing in Europe. How a lot of people do that,

874
00:48:13,960 --> 00:48:16,879
Speaker 2: whether it's like then doesn't take them up for a year,

875
00:48:17,000 --> 00:48:18,719
Speaker 2: so they go play in Europe somewhere and then try

876
00:48:18,760 --> 00:48:21,440
Speaker 2: again the next season. I think that's kind of what

877
00:48:21,480 --> 00:48:24,920
Speaker 2: the Generals were for a while. But there was one

878
00:48:25,239 --> 00:48:30,160
Speaker 2: instance where the Generals won, And if you go back

879
00:48:30,200 --> 00:48:34,960
Speaker 2: and read the details of this game in January of

880
00:48:35,000 --> 00:48:39,880
Speaker 2: nineteen seventy one, it's not clear whether it was purposeful

881
00:48:40,040 --> 00:48:44,480
Speaker 2: or accidental, but the Globe Triters weren't paying attention to

882
00:48:44,560 --> 00:48:48,000
Speaker 2: the score they didn't need to normally, and the Generals

883
00:48:48,000 --> 00:48:50,719
Speaker 2: were starting to creep up on them, and it came

884
00:48:50,800 --> 00:48:54,280
Speaker 2: down to I think a one point deficit, and somebody

885
00:48:54,280 --> 00:48:58,239
Speaker 2: took a shot, a guy named Lewis Herman Klotz, who

886
00:48:58,320 --> 00:48:59,600
Speaker 2: helped put the Generals together.

887
00:49:00,360 --> 00:49:01,120
Speaker 1: He was in his fifties.

888
00:49:01,200 --> 00:49:04,480
Speaker 2: Yeah, he took the last shot and he sunk it

889
00:49:04,560 --> 00:49:08,080
Speaker 2: and won accidentally one. According to a lot.

890
00:49:07,920 --> 00:49:12,160
Speaker 1: Of people, Yeah, amazing. It's like sort of at the

891
00:49:12,239 --> 00:49:16,080
Speaker 1: end of a modern NBA All Star game, when everyone's

892
00:49:16,120 --> 00:49:18,480
Speaker 1: goofing off and having fun until like the last two

893
00:49:18,600 --> 00:49:20,719
Speaker 1: or three minutes, and then they're like, all right, we

894
00:49:20,800 --> 00:49:23,000
Speaker 1: want to win, apparent and things get serious.

895
00:49:23,040 --> 00:49:26,080
Speaker 2: Apparently Klatts's quote was, it was like we had just

896
00:49:26,200 --> 00:49:27,640
Speaker 2: killed Santa Claus.

897
00:49:28,680 --> 00:49:34,319
Speaker 1: I that's funny. You know Scottie and I who you know,

898
00:49:34,360 --> 00:49:38,439
Speaker 1: a friend of ours. He was the DP for our

899
00:49:38,600 --> 00:49:40,960
Speaker 1: TV show and a very old friend of mine. We

900
00:49:41,239 --> 00:49:43,880
Speaker 1: had written some stuff here and there, screenplays and like

901
00:49:44,280 --> 00:49:47,120
Speaker 1: partnered up here and there, and at one point we

902
00:49:47,120 --> 00:49:51,719
Speaker 1: were writing a script on a Washington General's team. As

903
00:49:51,760 --> 00:49:54,800
Speaker 1: the centerpiece, like thinly veiled, there would be a Globe Trotters.

904
00:49:54,800 --> 00:49:56,799
Speaker 1: They wouldn't be called the Globetrotters or the Generals, but

905
00:49:57,640 --> 00:49:59,239
Speaker 1: we just thought it was a really funny idea to

906
00:49:59,280 --> 00:50:03,880
Speaker 1: follow this team that always has to lose and be

907
00:50:04,080 --> 00:50:07,080
Speaker 1: the sucker of this getting pants, and then they come

908
00:50:07,160 --> 00:50:09,319
Speaker 1: up with this plan to like win the game one time.

909
00:50:09,360 --> 00:50:13,400
Speaker 2: So is it gonna be more like a sports movie

910
00:50:13,440 --> 00:50:17,080
Speaker 2: where like it's really about the game, or is it

911
00:50:17,120 --> 00:50:19,520
Speaker 2: gonna be like slap Shot where it's more about the

912
00:50:19,560 --> 00:50:21,279
Speaker 2: lives of the people playing the.

913
00:50:21,239 --> 00:50:23,840
Speaker 1: Game, more slap Shot than Hoosiers.

914
00:50:23,960 --> 00:50:26,560
Speaker 2: Okay, yeah, okay, So but.

915
00:50:26,520 --> 00:50:29,600
Speaker 1: Then Will Ferrell did that basketball movie, and I think

916
00:50:29,600 --> 00:50:32,080
Speaker 1: this is sort of around the time we're thinking about it.

917
00:50:32,440 --> 00:50:33,439
Speaker 2: Oh, is it the same thing?

918
00:50:34,600 --> 00:50:37,080
Speaker 1: No, but it was just I don't know, it was

919
00:50:37,120 --> 00:50:39,040
Speaker 1: sort of like, all right, well, no one's gonna want

920
00:50:39,040 --> 00:50:40,919
Speaker 1: to make this movie because this one just came out

921
00:50:41,400 --> 00:50:42,719
Speaker 1: and did I don't think it did very well.

922
00:50:42,800 --> 00:50:45,400
Speaker 2: Yeah, I think that. I think enthusiasm for that particular

923
00:50:45,480 --> 00:50:47,200
Speaker 2: movie is cool. Do you guys can probably take a

924
00:50:47,200 --> 00:50:48,000
Speaker 2: shot at it again.

925
00:50:49,080 --> 00:50:51,040
Speaker 1: Yeah. I mean there's not a lot of great basketball movies.

926
00:50:51,239 --> 00:50:53,760
Speaker 1: Hoosiers is one of the all time great sports movies period,

927
00:50:55,680 --> 00:50:57,319
Speaker 1: but there's not a whole lot else. The Fish that

928
00:50:57,360 --> 00:51:00,680
Speaker 1: say Pittsburgh what you remember that though this is a

929
00:51:00,680 --> 00:51:02,759
Speaker 1: basketball movie, Doctor j was in it called the Fish

930
00:51:02,760 --> 00:51:06,560
Speaker 1: Who Save Pittsburgh. I remember that from when I was

931
00:51:06,600 --> 00:51:08,760
Speaker 1: a kid. But yeah, not a lot of great basketball movies.

932
00:51:09,239 --> 00:51:10,840
Speaker 2: Well, I say you and Scott should get to you

933
00:51:10,880 --> 00:51:11,279
Speaker 2: at Chuck.

934
00:51:12,080 --> 00:51:14,160
Speaker 1: All right, maybe it's time that movie has been forgotten

935
00:51:14,160 --> 00:51:14,440
Speaker 1: by now.

936
00:51:14,520 --> 00:51:18,120
Speaker 2: Well, since Chuck agreed to get back to producing his

937
00:51:18,200 --> 00:51:21,920
Speaker 2: basketball movie with Scott, I think that means that this

938
00:51:22,000 --> 00:51:25,120
Speaker 2: episode's over and it's time for listener man.

939
00:51:29,280 --> 00:51:31,680
Speaker 1: Yeah, it was a good one. That was That was

940
00:51:31,680 --> 00:51:32,960
Speaker 1: a fun episode. I enjoyed that.

941
00:51:33,040 --> 00:51:34,800
Speaker 2: I agree completely. It was a good episode.

942
00:51:34,920 --> 00:51:38,000
Speaker 1: Check. Yeah, that was fun. And again go see him everybody.

943
00:51:38,040 --> 00:51:40,760
Speaker 1: It's a lot of fun. They're not filling arenas anymore,

944
00:51:40,760 --> 00:51:42,479
Speaker 1: which it makes me sad, but they had a pretty

945
00:51:42,480 --> 00:51:47,799
Speaker 1: good crowd. Good all right. This is just a really

946
00:51:47,880 --> 00:51:49,640
Speaker 1: lovely thank you. We like to read those every now

947
00:51:49,640 --> 00:51:52,279
Speaker 1: and then. Hey, guys, you've been by my side for

948
00:51:52,320 --> 00:51:55,400
Speaker 1: fifteen years. You shared your voices, your stories, your laughter,

949
00:51:55,440 --> 00:51:58,359
Speaker 1: and your curiosity with me. You've been with me through

950
00:51:58,360 --> 00:51:59,840
Speaker 1: the highs and the lows of my life, during my

951
00:52:00,040 --> 00:52:03,520
Speaker 1: journey of moving multiple times, changing careers, surviving an accident

952
00:52:03,920 --> 00:52:07,560
Speaker 1: where walking after was painful for many years, recovering slowly

953
00:52:07,600 --> 00:52:11,600
Speaker 1: from those injuries, hiking again, and coping with divorce. You've

954
00:52:11,600 --> 00:52:13,760
Speaker 1: inspired me to keep exploring the world, to keep learning

955
00:52:13,800 --> 00:52:16,840
Speaker 1: new things, and keep finding joy. And every day you

956
00:52:16,880 --> 00:52:18,440
Speaker 1: make me feel like I'm a part of your family,

957
00:52:18,680 --> 00:52:21,400
Speaker 1: even though we've never met. Look for an episode on

958
00:52:21,440 --> 00:52:25,640
Speaker 1: that coming soon, Danny. You are some of my favorite teachers.

959
00:52:25,719 --> 00:52:30,600
Speaker 1: Sometimes silly, sometimes serious, sometimes wrong, but always genuine and generous.

960
00:52:30,760 --> 00:52:32,120
Speaker 2: Does Dany's got us pegged?

961
00:52:32,719 --> 00:52:34,960
Speaker 1: I know he didn't have to mention that, but that's fine.

962
00:52:35,480 --> 00:52:37,600
Speaker 1: For fifteen years, you have opened your hearts, your minds,

963
00:52:37,680 --> 00:52:39,920
Speaker 1: under your arms to all of us who listen. For

964
00:52:40,000 --> 00:52:42,399
Speaker 1: fifteen years, I've been lucky to know two amazing dudes

965
00:52:42,400 --> 00:52:44,400
Speaker 1: who make the world a better place. I hope you

966
00:52:44,480 --> 00:52:46,800
Speaker 1: never stopped making the show because I don't want to

967
00:52:46,840 --> 00:52:50,040
Speaker 1: stop listening. I know that life is unpredictable, that nothing

968
00:52:50,080 --> 00:52:52,640
Speaker 1: lasts forever, So I'm excited to finally see you both

969
00:52:52,680 --> 00:52:56,880
Speaker 1: at Nashville. In Nashville on the sixth, So Danny was

970
00:52:56,920 --> 00:52:59,680
Speaker 1: at our show and he just finishes out by saying,

971
00:52:59,680 --> 00:53:01,480
Speaker 1: thank you. Thank you so much for being the stability

972
00:53:01,520 --> 00:53:04,319
Speaker 1: some of us need, the platform of knowledge that help

973
00:53:04,400 --> 00:53:06,960
Speaker 1: us leap into a land of wonder and learning, and

974
00:53:07,239 --> 00:53:11,200
Speaker 1: just for being there for fifteen years. Seriously, thank you. Yeah,

975
00:53:11,400 --> 00:53:16,480
Speaker 1: and that is Danny Westfall. Danny, you, my friend, are

976
00:53:16,520 --> 00:53:17,000
Speaker 1: the MVP.

977
00:53:17,600 --> 00:53:19,759
Speaker 2: Yeah you are. Thanks a lot, Danny. Those are really

978
00:53:19,800 --> 00:53:23,120
Speaker 2: excellent email and we hope you enjoyed the Nashville show.

979
00:53:24,400 --> 00:53:25,840
Speaker 1: That's a good That was a great one.

980
00:53:26,000 --> 00:53:27,560
Speaker 2: If you want to be like Danny and write as

981
00:53:27,560 --> 00:53:30,600
Speaker 2: a truly great email, we love those. You can wrap

982
00:53:30,640 --> 00:53:33,680
Speaker 2: it up, dribble it on the bottom, and send it

983
00:53:33,719 --> 00:53:38,160
Speaker 2: off to Stuff podcast at iHeartRadio dot com.

984
00:53:39,280 --> 00:53:42,239
Speaker 1: You Know, Stuff you Should Know is a production of iHeartRadio.

985
00:53:42,760 --> 00:53:45,960
Speaker 1: For more podcasts my heart Radio, visit the iHeartRadio app,

986
00:53:46,160 --> 00:53:49,040
Speaker 1: Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.