WEBVTT - No Voice, No Choice 0:00:11.800 --> 0:00:14.720 Good morning, peeps, and welcome to bokayf Daily with Meet 0:00:14.800 --> 0:00:19.200 your Girl Danielle Moody, recording from the Home Bunker. Folks, 0:00:19.320 --> 0:00:23.040 Often on this show we talk about democracy and the 0:00:23.079 --> 0:00:26.960 fact that, regardless of whether or not we stop the 0:00:27.080 --> 0:00:31.240 actual physical insurrection that happened on January six, twenty twenty one, 0:00:31.760 --> 0:00:35.320 that there is a continuing coup that has been unfolding 0:00:35.520 --> 0:00:39.280 at the state and local and national level since then, 0:00:39.400 --> 0:00:44.000 and if not before that, we have watched as regular 0:00:44.040 --> 0:00:48.120 citizens have been co opted into the Magadum and QAnon 0:00:48.240 --> 0:00:51.479 belief system that has led them to believe that they 0:00:51.479 --> 0:00:53.640 can no longer trust their government, that they can no 0:00:53.720 --> 0:00:56.480 longer trust their boat, that they can no longer trust 0:00:56.560 --> 0:01:00.960 their voice. And frankly, if you were to dare to 0:01:01.120 --> 0:01:05.039 decide that you wanted to volunteer your time to be 0:01:05.400 --> 0:01:09.319 a public servant, to volunteer on a campaign, to run 0:01:09.360 --> 0:01:13.760 for school board or city council, to work at a pole, well, 0:01:13.760 --> 0:01:17.360 basically in this current political climate, you're putting your fucking 0:01:17.440 --> 0:01:20.600 life in your hands. Because we have seen as the 0:01:20.800 --> 0:01:24.840 rise in political violence has taken shape, that good people 0:01:25.400 --> 0:01:30.800 have been driven underground, lost their normal day to day 0:01:30.800 --> 0:01:35.360 lives because of terrorism. Let's call it what it is, 0:01:35.920 --> 0:01:39.920 because we love to use euphemisms in mainstream media where 0:01:39.959 --> 0:01:43.480 they'll say harassment. But you all have listened to the 0:01:43.520 --> 0:01:47.360 conversations that I've had with Jennifer Jenkins, who is a 0:01:47.400 --> 0:01:52.560 school board member in Brevard County, who detail painstakingly the 0:01:52.760 --> 0:01:55.960 kind of violent terrorism that she was faced with for 0:01:56.040 --> 0:02:00.280 having the audacity to run for school board in her town. Right, 0:02:00.960 --> 0:02:05.040 we saw what happened to the poll workers in Georgia 0:02:05.200 --> 0:02:08.720 who had the audacity to decide that they wanted to 0:02:08.840 --> 0:02:13.040 volunteer in their community and help their fellow neighbors get 0:02:13.080 --> 0:02:16.359 to the polls, and what happened to them because of 0:02:16.440 --> 0:02:22.000 Donald Trump's targeting. So on today's show, I am very 0:02:22.040 --> 0:02:28.480 excited to welcome Miila Atmost and Mila is the producer 0:02:28.560 --> 0:02:33.760 and host of Future Hindsight, a show that is weekly 0:02:33.919 --> 0:02:38.200 a weekly podcast that is aimed at sparking civic engagement 0:02:38.280 --> 0:02:42.680 through in depth conversations with different civic leaders and change makers. 0:02:43.960 --> 0:02:48.280 Mila is about trying to activate people to realize their 0:02:48.360 --> 0:02:51.200 power and their voice. We talk about this all the time. 0:02:51.800 --> 0:02:54.800 No one would be trying to steal your vote or 0:02:54.880 --> 0:02:58.880 suppress your vote. If your vote did not matter, no 0:02:58.919 --> 0:03:03.200 one would be trying to funnel the airwaves and social 0:03:03.240 --> 0:03:08.240 media with disinformation If an informed citizenury is one that 0:03:08.280 --> 0:03:13.280 representatives had to actually be responsible to. The goal is 0:03:13.320 --> 0:03:17.680 to gaslight, as Miriam Webster pointed out as their word 0:03:17.680 --> 0:03:22.280 of the year in twenty twenty two. Their goal the 0:03:22.400 --> 0:03:25.520 Republican cult Party, it's to make you feel like you 0:03:25.560 --> 0:03:29.200 have no power, no voice, and frankly, no choice but 0:03:29.320 --> 0:03:32.160 to live a life that is filled with fear and 0:03:32.360 --> 0:03:37.720 hatred of the other. This is how they win. This 0:03:37.760 --> 0:03:41.520 has been a tactic that they have used for decades, 0:03:42.040 --> 0:03:45.800 and now they have the ability, with technology and social 0:03:45.840 --> 0:03:49.760 media and the likes of Elon Musk to be able 0:03:49.760 --> 0:03:53.080 to spread as much hate and disinformation as possible, making 0:03:53.200 --> 0:03:56.560 us believe that there is more of them than there 0:03:56.600 --> 0:03:59.320 are of us. But we know that that's not true. 0:03:59.680 --> 0:04:04.360 They just exist inside of an echo chamber. We were 0:04:04.440 --> 0:04:07.760 able to fight back in the twenty twenty election, to 0:04:07.800 --> 0:04:12.560 fight back again in this past midterm election, to continue 0:04:12.640 --> 0:04:16.000 saying that no, you will not take my democracy from me. 0:04:16.600 --> 0:04:20.920 So coming up next, my conversation with Mila is about 0:04:20.960 --> 0:04:24.600 you know, how we are feeling right as people who 0:04:24.839 --> 0:04:28.560 have used our platform and our voice to try and 0:04:28.839 --> 0:04:33.560 create a conscious and woke citizenry in this country, and 0:04:33.760 --> 0:04:37.800 what our hopes are and our worries are as we 0:04:37.880 --> 0:04:41.880 transition into twenty twenty three, which will all for all 0:04:41.920 --> 0:04:45.559 intensive purposes, be the run up to the twenty twenty 0:04:45.560 --> 0:04:51.400 four election. Democracy has been saved not once, but twice. 0:04:52.040 --> 0:04:55.679 Will we have the ability to do it again? Coming 0:04:55.760 --> 0:05:00.520 up next, my conversation with host and produce sir A 0:05:00.600 --> 0:05:09.560 Future Hindsight Mila at Most. Folks, I am very excited 0:05:09.760 --> 0:05:13.520 to welcome to Woke f Daily for the first time 0:05:13.600 --> 0:05:18.560 fellow podcaster Mila Atmost, a global citizen based in New 0:05:18.640 --> 0:05:22.839 York City and the producer and series host A Future Hindsight, 0:05:23.040 --> 0:05:26.840 a weekly podcast that aims to spark civic engagement through 0:05:26.880 --> 0:05:32.320 in depth conversations with citizen change makers. Mila, it's wonderful 0:05:33.240 --> 0:05:38.000 to see you love your show, because I think that 0:05:38.080 --> 0:05:42.320 a lot of people they want to listen, but they 0:05:42.360 --> 0:05:45.880 want to feel like they can do something about their democracy. 0:05:45.920 --> 0:05:49.919 They want to listen to understand and get great analysis, 0:05:49.960 --> 0:05:53.400 but then it's like what do I do with that information? 0:05:53.440 --> 0:05:55.679 So I just wanted to give you an opportunity to 0:05:55.680 --> 0:06:00.880 talk about why you started the pod and and maybe 0:06:01.000 --> 0:06:04.280 how it's evolved over the time that you've started it 0:06:04.360 --> 0:06:07.360 to kind of this very critical moment in our politics 0:06:07.360 --> 0:06:10.400 and our democracy that we're in. Thank you, Thank you 0:06:10.520 --> 0:06:13.119 very much for having me on. Really, I really enjoy 0:06:13.160 --> 0:06:15.200 your show as well, and I listened to it on 0:06:15.360 --> 0:06:18.440 the regular, So thank you for sharing of all your 0:06:18.480 --> 0:06:21.440 knowledge and your guests with us. So I started the 0:06:21.520 --> 0:06:25.480 pod because after Trump was elected, I thought, you know, 0:06:25.600 --> 0:06:28.920 what's ailing our country is that not enough people are involved, 0:06:29.000 --> 0:06:32.000 not enough people care to vote, not enough people care 0:06:32.040 --> 0:06:35.080 to be engaged in their communities. And a lot of 0:06:35.080 --> 0:06:37.640 people I spoke to the time, you know, they were 0:06:37.640 --> 0:06:40.400 so desponded, and they said, you know, I voted, but 0:06:40.440 --> 0:06:42.560 it just didn't work out, Like what else can I 0:06:42.600 --> 0:06:44.200 be doing? You know, because I think a lot of 0:06:44.200 --> 0:06:48.080 people think that the next step after voting, if you 0:06:48.120 --> 0:06:50.520 want to get engaged is to run for office, and 0:06:50.640 --> 0:06:53.960 I thought, you know, that just can't be true. You know, 0:06:54.040 --> 0:06:57.240 we can't all be running for office. And so one 0:06:57.279 --> 0:07:01.039 of my guiding principles in the show is to figure 0:07:01.040 --> 0:07:04.520 out what can everyday people do that's beyond voting. Because 0:07:04.560 --> 0:07:06.480 for sure, at the very least we should be voting. 0:07:07.560 --> 0:07:10.360 So beyond voting, but shorter running for office. And as 0:07:10.400 --> 0:07:11.960 it turns out, there are a lot of things that 0:07:11.960 --> 0:07:14.760 you could be doing. So in the beginning, I really 0:07:14.800 --> 0:07:17.239 wanted to showcase the things that you could be doing 0:07:17.320 --> 0:07:19.960 and also share with you the people who are already 0:07:20.000 --> 0:07:23.800 doing it. So that's why we call them citizen change makers. 0:07:23.800 --> 0:07:28.760 So we really want to showcase to people that, look, 0:07:28.800 --> 0:07:31.400 you're not alone. Other people are doing this and some people, 0:07:31.440 --> 0:07:33.520 of course, the people that we interview normally have done 0:07:33.520 --> 0:07:37.160 something that's exemplaries, so they can, you know, inspire you 0:07:37.240 --> 0:07:39.800 to take action. And then over time, I would say, 0:07:40.200 --> 0:07:45.640 what is really changed with the podcast as I've learned 0:07:45.680 --> 0:07:49.000 more and more about how people are engaged about what 0:07:49.040 --> 0:07:54.880 people can do, is well, I would say to backtrack, 0:07:54.920 --> 0:07:58.600 I would say I discovered first and foremost that people 0:07:58.640 --> 0:08:00.600 have a lot of power. We just don't don't know it. 0:08:00.720 --> 0:08:03.080 We don't understand how to wield our own power. We 0:08:03.120 --> 0:08:06.840 don't know how we can make change in our communities, 0:08:06.880 --> 0:08:10.080 whether that's on the local or state level, or even 0:08:10.080 --> 0:08:14.640 on a national level. And I think as as I 0:08:14.680 --> 0:08:18.160 have learned more and more I'm understanding better that there 0:08:18.200 --> 0:08:24.400 are parties who want to obstruct your ability to wield power, 0:08:24.840 --> 0:08:28.040 and that I didn't fully understand when I set out 0:08:28.080 --> 0:08:32.800 in the beginning, and I appreciate that so much more today. 0:08:32.960 --> 0:08:34.600 You know, Well, what's funny. I think that when you 0:08:34.720 --> 0:08:37.840 started out, we started our pots roughly around the same time, 0:08:37.960 --> 0:08:42.520 kind of in response to the Trump presidency, or at 0:08:42.559 --> 0:08:45.120 least the potential of the Trump presidency, which would become 0:08:45.120 --> 0:08:49.560 the Trump presidency. And you know, I think that at 0:08:49.600 --> 0:08:54.800 that time we weren't we were watching the rise of 0:08:54.840 --> 0:08:59.400 the Tea Party, but it wasn't the rise of anti 0:08:59.520 --> 0:09:06.440 democrat cradicum sentiments, right, Like there were things with regard 0:09:06.480 --> 0:09:10.160 to President Obama and with regard to him not being 0:09:10.200 --> 0:09:12.680 a citizen, and you know, for for people of color 0:09:12.720 --> 0:09:15.240 and particularly black people, that's just like that's just racism, 0:09:15.280 --> 0:09:18.040 par for the course, right, Like, you know, we get that. 0:09:18.200 --> 0:09:21.040 And I think that what has happened over the last 0:09:21.080 --> 0:09:26.400 seven plus years, right is this embrace of anti democratic 0:09:26.440 --> 0:09:29.680 sentiment sentiments in such a way that you don't need 0:09:29.760 --> 0:09:33.120 to be a political science scholar. You don't need to 0:09:33.240 --> 0:09:38.080 be um, someone who who went to school like you know, uh, 0:09:38.320 --> 0:09:42.000 to study this work to understand what's going on. It's 0:09:42.160 --> 0:09:45.480 very clear, and I think for a lot of people, 0:09:45.520 --> 0:09:49.400 because it has become so clear, so apparent, it's also 0:09:49.480 --> 0:09:53.600 become quite scary. Um. You know. One of the things 0:09:53.600 --> 0:09:56.400 when I when I think about your show, You've had 0:09:56.440 --> 0:09:59.800 some of my friends on, uh, like like Rebecca co 0:10:00.520 --> 0:10:04.760 who who I endure so much, has been on the 0:10:04.800 --> 0:10:11.360 forefront of disability advocacy in this country. And you know, 0:10:11.559 --> 0:10:14.800 is this idea that civic engagement used to be something 0:10:14.840 --> 0:10:19.360 that gives us pride? Mila? As you have seen again 0:10:19.440 --> 0:10:24.800 this rise in political rhetoric and violence, do you find 0:10:25.040 --> 0:10:28.559 that your listeners, while they want to get engaged, are 0:10:28.559 --> 0:10:33.200 they more fearful of what that kind of civic engagement 0:10:33.920 --> 0:10:37.760 could mean for their day to day lives. I don't 0:10:37.840 --> 0:10:40.880 know if my guests are more fearful, but for sure 0:10:41.040 --> 0:10:44.160 I would say I am more fearful. You know sometimes 0:10:44.200 --> 0:10:47.720 when I'm in situations and I feel like, well, did 0:10:47.760 --> 0:10:49.720 you really say that just now? I went to a 0:10:49.760 --> 0:10:53.560 wedding recently and I sat next to somebody, the cousin 0:10:53.840 --> 0:10:59.880 of the groom, and he didn't say that he was 0:11:00.040 --> 0:11:03.800 a Qann believer, but it was pretty clear that he 0:11:03.880 --> 0:11:06.040 was viewing in that direction, and it was the kind 0:11:06.080 --> 0:11:08.760 of thing where I was so thrown. You know, we 0:11:08.760 --> 0:11:14.000 were talking about gun legislation. Somehow I never do that 0:11:14.040 --> 0:11:19.560 at what was happening, I don't know. We were talking 0:11:19.600 --> 0:11:22.400 about Trump. He was telling me he doesn't like Trump anymore, 0:11:22.400 --> 0:11:24.480 And this was my missed opportunity. I should have asked 0:11:24.520 --> 0:11:26.280 him why don't you like Trump anymore? Even though he 0:11:26.280 --> 0:11:29.360 had voted for him twice. And then he basically said, well, 0:11:29.400 --> 0:11:31.800 you know, it doesn't really matter if we vote or not, 0:11:32.000 --> 0:11:38.880 because you know, they just install whoever they want. And 0:11:38.920 --> 0:11:42.160 I was like, who's day? You know? They right? And 0:11:42.200 --> 0:11:45.000 so in any case, I said, well, you know, Biden 0:11:45.080 --> 0:11:46.839 isn't perfect, but he's gotten a lot of really good 0:11:46.840 --> 0:11:49.480 things done, for example, gun safety legislation. And then he 0:11:49.559 --> 0:11:52.520 tried to put words in my mouth about taking guns away, 0:11:52.559 --> 0:11:54.040 and I said, no, no, I didn't say that. I 0:11:54.040 --> 0:11:56.320 didn't say any of those things. And then he says, well, 0:11:56.480 --> 0:11:58.760 I think a lot of the mass shootings are false 0:11:58.800 --> 0:12:02.360 flag operations anyway, and I thought what so I was like, 0:12:02.679 --> 0:12:04.760 which was and so he said, well a lot of them, 0:12:05.080 --> 0:12:07.880 And so he couldn't pinpoint of course any of them. 0:12:08.160 --> 0:12:11.560 And so you know, we kept on going down this road, 0:12:11.600 --> 0:12:14.080 and finally I said, wait, are you just saying this 0:12:14.160 --> 0:12:16.320 to egg me on or do you really believe this? 0:12:16.440 --> 0:12:19.080 Like at some point I thought, I'm in the twilight 0:12:19.160 --> 0:12:22.720 zone here, and maybe he's just saying this because you know, 0:12:22.800 --> 0:12:25.120 he clearly knows from what I was saying that I'm 0:12:25.160 --> 0:12:28.120 progressive and he maybe just as poking at me. And 0:12:28.200 --> 0:12:31.320 I think he was thrown when I said that that 0:12:31.440 --> 0:12:36.360 I assumed that maybe he's not serious. It was really strange, 0:12:36.480 --> 0:12:38.120 and it was the kind of thing where actually, in 0:12:38.160 --> 0:12:41.560 that moment, I felt incredibly unsafe. I mean, I knew 0:12:41.559 --> 0:12:43.160 I was at a wedding, nothing was going to happen, 0:12:43.280 --> 0:12:45.520 but I was like, oh, I need to get out 0:12:45.559 --> 0:12:47.720 of this conversation, and maybe I should get up from 0:12:47.760 --> 0:12:50.560 the table and hit the dance floor because this feels 0:12:50.679 --> 0:12:53.720 very uncomfortable, right, And so these are the kind of 0:12:53.720 --> 0:12:55.200 things you don't want to have. You don't want to 0:12:55.200 --> 0:12:58.360 have these kind of conversations because it's you don't feel safe. 0:12:58.880 --> 0:13:01.000 But at the same time, I think it's important to 0:13:01.040 --> 0:13:04.120 have these conversations because if you don't, then they never 0:13:04.280 --> 0:13:07.240 hear that there's this other world out there where people 0:13:07.280 --> 0:13:11.280 don't believe what he believes. You know. It's so interesting 0:13:11.320 --> 0:13:13.520 because I want to dig in a little bit. When 0:13:13.559 --> 0:13:16.520 you say that you felt unsafe. Is it because of 0:13:17.200 --> 0:13:21.240 what we know that people who believe in this q 0:13:21.480 --> 0:13:25.920 Andon line of thinking are capable of or was there 0:13:26.000 --> 0:13:31.480 something that happened during the conversation, an escalation that made 0:13:31.480 --> 0:13:35.480 you actually feel unsafe. I think it's the former. But also, 0:13:35.520 --> 0:13:37.800 you know, because they you know, because we were talking 0:13:37.840 --> 0:13:40.839 about gun legislation. So I thought to myself, Yeah, maybe 0:13:40.880 --> 0:13:43.720 this guy came to the wedding with a gun, you 0:13:43.800 --> 0:13:45.839 know that. I mean, I don't think that he did, 0:13:45.880 --> 0:13:47.480 but it was the kind of thing was right, wait, 0:13:47.679 --> 0:13:50.319 you know what you know, like for example, if I'm 0:13:50.360 --> 0:13:53.280 in Texas, I don't want to do anything, you know, 0:13:53.440 --> 0:13:57.760 silly because people can open carry. I want to talk 0:13:57.800 --> 0:13:59.280 me a lot for a minute about the way that 0:13:59.320 --> 0:14:06.400 the media has been presenting these conspiracy theorists. They still 0:14:06.440 --> 0:14:11.520 present them as if it is logical, as if it 0:14:11.760 --> 0:14:14.640 is just a different ideology than the rest of us. 0:14:15.440 --> 0:14:20.440 We're existing on Earth one saying no, no one's installing people. 0:14:20.920 --> 0:14:24.080 This is still not yet a banana republic. It's not 0:14:24.160 --> 0:14:28.080 a dictatorship regime. But when I turn on CNN, when 0:14:28.080 --> 0:14:32.040 I turn on MSNBC, when I am listening to these folks, 0:14:33.080 --> 0:14:37.920 they're like, well, Marsh retailer Green thinks blah blah blah 0:14:37.960 --> 0:14:41.400 blah blah, as if it's a normal line of thinking. 0:14:41.400 --> 0:14:44.720 And I think that the reason why we're in this 0:14:44.880 --> 0:14:52.400 place is because outside of podcasts, outside of progressives where 0:14:52.440 --> 0:14:57.640 people are getting their mainstream news, are presenting these both 0:14:57.680 --> 0:15:01.800 sides as if they're normal. We're still talking about bipartisanship 0:15:01.920 --> 0:15:05.840 is if it's something that is readily accessible, as if 0:15:05.880 --> 0:15:08.920 one party hasn't become a cult. And so I'm curious 0:15:08.960 --> 0:15:13.040 as to what you have thought about the progression or 0:15:14.000 --> 0:15:18.680 I guess devolving of our political conversations. And then how 0:15:18.880 --> 0:15:22.840 you can be sitting at a wedding talking to a 0:15:22.880 --> 0:15:25.600 guest where you're thinking, probably at this wedding most people 0:15:25.640 --> 0:15:29.280 are probably you know, think like me, you know, voted 0:15:29.400 --> 0:15:32.600 like me because of who your friends are, the family, 0:15:32.640 --> 0:15:35.160 what have you. And then you realize, oh, no, this 0:15:35.240 --> 0:15:38.000 is actually your first thing. Maybe it was your first encounter. 0:15:38.080 --> 0:15:41.400 I've never had an encounter yet with I mean, this 0:15:41.480 --> 0:15:43.600 is like the raccoon. I saw it side my window 0:15:43.720 --> 0:15:46.920 just now. Like I've never had an encounter with a 0:15:47.000 --> 0:15:50.560 Q non person, it still seems like mythical in its thinking. 0:15:51.120 --> 0:15:55.200 But what do you think about the way it has 0:15:55.280 --> 0:16:02.080 been encapsulated in conversation as if it's normal. Yeah, I mean, first, yes, 0:16:02.160 --> 0:16:04.600 this is the first encounter and hopefully my last encounter 0:16:04.720 --> 0:16:08.960 in the wild with a Q and On supporter. But 0:16:08.960 --> 0:16:11.080 but in terms of the media, yeah, I think that 0:16:11.120 --> 0:16:14.480 the mainstream media is really doing us a disservice. And 0:16:14.520 --> 0:16:16.560 I think this is one of the reasons that Trump 0:16:16.640 --> 0:16:21.200 was elected in the first place. It's because you know, basically, 0:16:21.320 --> 0:16:24.560 they covered Trump every day, every day of the week, 0:16:24.640 --> 0:16:30.840 several times a day, and over everything, every single outlandish 0:16:31.120 --> 0:16:35.280 thing he said or did, and it basically normalized this 0:16:35.360 --> 0:16:38.320 person being in the media, and then it normalized the 0:16:38.440 --> 0:16:42.240 views that he espoused. And I think people just became 0:16:42.280 --> 0:16:44.480 inured and just was like, oh, you know, it's just 0:16:44.520 --> 0:16:46.680 what it is, and you move on, or you try 0:16:46.720 --> 0:16:49.280 not to think about it because it's just too depressing 0:16:49.320 --> 0:16:51.800 if you think about it too much, right, or if 0:16:51.840 --> 0:16:53.880 you're an everyday person. And then I think the other 0:16:53.920 --> 0:16:56.720 thing about the media, like you said they they I 0:16:56.720 --> 0:17:01.960 mean I think that they are just you know, their 0:17:02.080 --> 0:17:08.960 their profit motive is I think not considered in the 0:17:09.040 --> 0:17:13.400 long term. You know, we talked about this separately before. 0:17:13.600 --> 0:17:19.159 Where look if something, if a regime like the Trump 0:17:19.240 --> 0:17:23.280 regime really comes into being full on, if fascism succeeds 0:17:23.320 --> 0:17:25.560 in the United States, there will be no free press. 0:17:25.680 --> 0:17:28.280 You know, CNN will have zero profits and there will 0:17:28.320 --> 0:17:31.000 be one state press and it will be like nineteen 0:17:31.080 --> 0:17:34.440 eighty four. But I think people don't don't think through 0:17:34.480 --> 0:17:39.239 the logical conclusion, and that's really a bummer. And I 0:17:39.280 --> 0:17:42.000 think that this idea that you know, we have a 0:17:42.040 --> 0:17:44.679 free press here, I think there is a misconception of 0:17:44.720 --> 0:17:49.520 what that really means because I think, or at least 0:17:51.320 --> 0:17:54.119 this is my own, this is maybe my own interpretation. 0:17:54.160 --> 0:17:56.720 I feel like the free press, I don't think it's 0:17:56.760 --> 0:18:01.160 their job. I don't think that the free press means 0:18:01.240 --> 0:18:03.640 you can just lie about a lot of things all 0:18:03.640 --> 0:18:07.080 the time. Yeah, death can't be you know, if you 0:18:07.119 --> 0:18:10.920 have libel lawsuits, you know, we should be suing CNN 0:18:10.960 --> 0:18:13.520 for Liabel. Right, Why are you telling us straight up 0:18:13.560 --> 0:18:17.000 about Q and on conspiracies as if they're real? You 0:18:17.080 --> 0:18:20.439 know that you know, and I'm so glad that you 0:18:20.520 --> 0:18:23.880 said that, because I have written about this so many 0:18:23.920 --> 0:18:28.359 times where I'm asking I'm not a lawyer, but I 0:18:28.400 --> 0:18:32.760 asked the question as to why the FCC, which is 0:18:32.800 --> 0:18:38.320 supposed to regulate right communications, national broadcasts, all of these things, 0:18:38.600 --> 0:18:43.159 find people for the slightest things. Why aren't these outlets 0:18:43.600 --> 0:18:48.640 being fined significant that it would be significant enough right 0:18:48.760 --> 0:18:52.280 for them to stop. There is no there's no reason 0:18:52.640 --> 0:18:57.800 other than your own soul searching as a television executive 0:18:57.880 --> 0:19:01.240 to say, oh, maybe we shouldn't put that out right, 0:19:01.320 --> 0:19:07.520 like it isn't free speech when you are poisoning the pool, 0:19:07.560 --> 0:19:12.480 whether it is about COVID, right, which I again think 0:19:12.520 --> 0:19:16.400 that there should have been and still should be, massive 0:19:16.560 --> 0:19:22.000 lawsuits against those who then caught COVID, who lost family members, 0:19:22.080 --> 0:19:25.320 loved ones because they were listening to Fox News and 0:19:25.320 --> 0:19:27.600 deciding that they weren't going to wear a mask, that 0:19:27.680 --> 0:19:32.200 it was their freedom and liberty to walk around massless 0:19:32.240 --> 0:19:35.840 at the height of our global health pandemic. But why 0:19:35.880 --> 0:19:38.439 were they doing that? Well, because they were being spoon 0:19:38.480 --> 0:19:42.560 fed lies and nobody's been held accountable for it. And 0:19:42.640 --> 0:19:44.800 it says if you know you can do whatever you 0:19:44.840 --> 0:19:48.960 want in media, on radio, you can say whatever it 0:19:49.000 --> 0:19:51.680 is you want. And I thought that we had regulatory 0:19:51.800 --> 0:19:56.719 bodies that were supposed to oversee, right what the public 0:19:56.840 --> 0:20:01.920 is supposed to know, and ingest totally yeah, totally agree, 0:20:02.000 --> 0:20:04.120 Please go ahead. Yeah, no, I totally agree. I think, 0:20:04.240 --> 0:20:06.760 why hasn't anyone been held accountable? And like, look at 0:20:06.800 --> 0:20:09.520 these text messages that came out yesterday with Mark Meadows. 0:20:09.520 --> 0:20:11.840 How come these people are not under arrest for you know, 0:20:11.880 --> 0:20:14.720 for treason. I don't really understand, like, you know, these 0:20:14.760 --> 0:20:18.800 congressmen and congressmen are still in office and they're walking 0:20:18.800 --> 0:20:21.920 around freely. I don't really I don't get it. So, yeah, 0:20:22.080 --> 0:20:24.520 it's a good question. And I feel like, why don't 0:20:24.520 --> 0:20:29.399 we have the answers? You know? And so we see 0:20:29.680 --> 0:20:31.560 there were I'm so glad you brought up the Mark 0:20:31.560 --> 0:20:35.520 Meadows text messages. Close to twenty five hundred text messages 0:20:36.080 --> 0:20:38.879 are now released, ones that we haven't seen before, the 0:20:38.880 --> 0:20:42.960 public has not seen before. Thirty four members thirty four 0:20:43.000 --> 0:20:49.119 Republican members of Congress calling for martial law, calling for 0:20:49.320 --> 0:20:56.879 a way to disrupt a free, fair, transparent election in 0:20:57.000 --> 0:21:01.480 order to install Donald Trump, saying things like we need 0:21:01.560 --> 0:21:08.760 to save our democracy. These are supposed to be representatives 0:21:08.760 --> 0:21:13.399 that know better. So what does it say, like, what 0:21:13.600 --> 0:21:17.280 what does it say to the American public again, who 0:21:17.400 --> 0:21:22.800 is still working on restoring their belief right in our government, 0:21:24.080 --> 0:21:29.240 that they see these trolls of text messages with elected 0:21:29.240 --> 0:21:34.560 officials calling for their votes to be null envoying? Yeah, 0:21:34.640 --> 0:21:36.960 I think that's really fascinating. This is again where the 0:21:37.000 --> 0:21:39.520 media could have helped us a lot, especially in the beginning. 0:21:39.920 --> 0:21:42.800 You know, I think that we did not talk about 0:21:43.000 --> 0:21:46.920 enough in twenty twenty what an amazing feat be pulled 0:21:46.960 --> 0:21:51.000 off as the American people turned out in droves to vote, 0:21:51.040 --> 0:21:55.280 and that most all the states really facilitated voting in 0:21:55.320 --> 0:21:57.520 the middle of a pandemic, and that this is the 0:21:57.560 --> 0:22:02.880 most audited, most watched election in our lifetimes, and it 0:22:03.000 --> 0:22:06.359 was safe and secure, you know, and it was the 0:22:06.480 --> 0:22:08.879 kind of thing where I feel like all the press 0:22:08.920 --> 0:22:13.199 did was talk about, you know, Trump's shenatigans to deny 0:22:13.280 --> 0:22:16.960 the election results, as opposed to saying this was a 0:22:17.080 --> 0:22:21.280 historic election. We the American people turned out in droves 0:22:21.480 --> 0:22:25.600 and look, democracy is alive and well in this country. 0:22:25.640 --> 0:22:27.800 I think those things would have helped so much in 0:22:27.880 --> 0:22:31.280 order to frame the things that have come out subsequently, 0:22:31.359 --> 0:22:33.919 and even to frame the January sixth thing. You know, 0:22:34.080 --> 0:22:37.879 if they had just said that since November, I would 0:22:37.880 --> 0:22:41.760 think that January sixth would have been perceived totally differently. 0:22:42.240 --> 0:22:44.320 You know. Maybe I don't want to say it would 0:22:44.320 --> 0:22:47.560 have prevented that that sounds that sounds very unlikely, but 0:22:47.640 --> 0:22:52.040 at least it would have really made the American public 0:22:52.640 --> 0:22:56.480 more shocked, Whereas I think a lot of people shrugged 0:22:56.480 --> 0:22:58.800 their shoulders and they were like, oh, those crazies, you know, 0:23:00.080 --> 0:23:03.240 you know, But I think that collectively on that day, 0:23:03.720 --> 0:23:06.639 as we all watched, whether you were watching on television, 0:23:06.720 --> 0:23:09.600 you were watching streaming on your phone, you were following 0:23:09.640 --> 0:23:14.640 it unfold on Twitter, were absolutely stunned. We have never 0:23:14.680 --> 0:23:17.560 seen anything like this in our entire lives. There's a 0:23:17.600 --> 0:23:22.400 reason why Marian Webster adopted the word gas lighting as 0:23:22.440 --> 0:23:26.000 their word of the year, because then following that, after 0:23:26.080 --> 0:23:30.080 maybe a couple of weeks of outrage, then it was 0:23:30.200 --> 0:23:33.760 back to business as usual. This is as if attacking 0:23:33.760 --> 0:23:37.320 the capital and threatening to hang the vice president of 0:23:37.320 --> 0:23:40.439 the United States is just par for the political course 0:23:40.520 --> 0:23:44.800 in America, and it's not. And here we are coming 0:23:44.880 --> 0:23:52.040 up on the two year anniversary of this extraordinarily devastating 0:23:52.080 --> 0:23:57.959 event in our country's history, and the architects upset event 0:23:58.760 --> 0:24:03.119 have been walking around free have been walking around, you know, 0:24:03.280 --> 0:24:06.919 still tenning at maur Lago. And so I wonder, like, 0:24:07.040 --> 0:24:11.560 what do you think as we're heading into twenty twenty three, 0:24:11.920 --> 0:24:15.679 the presidential cycle is going to rev up. Donald Trump 0:24:15.720 --> 0:24:18.960 has already announced that he is running again, despite the 0:24:19.119 --> 0:24:22.320 myriad of lawsuits that he has against him, actually because 0:24:22.840 --> 0:24:25.240 of the myriad of lawsuits that he has against him. 0:24:26.400 --> 0:24:31.440 Where do you feel that like the people are and 0:24:31.520 --> 0:24:35.639 where are you in terms of feeling like are we 0:24:35.760 --> 0:24:40.960 going to be able to thwart fascism again? Or was 0:24:41.040 --> 0:24:45.159 twenty twenty like lightning in a bottle? You know, I 0:24:45.200 --> 0:24:48.200 wish I had a crystal ball. I don't know if 0:24:48.240 --> 0:24:52.640 we will, but high what a turnout is always encouraging. 0:24:53.160 --> 0:24:55.480 I think this is the work that we have to 0:24:55.520 --> 0:25:00.159 engage in between now and twenty twenty four. You know, 0:25:00.200 --> 0:25:03.879 I was really invested in the race in Texas for governor, 0:25:04.280 --> 0:25:07.160 and when I looked at the numbers, you know, post 0:25:07.160 --> 0:25:10.440 fact after the election, it was something like forty two 0:25:10.440 --> 0:25:14.920 percent of Democrats registered Democrats in Texas turned out to vote, 0:25:14.960 --> 0:25:18.240 and I thought forty two percent. Really, you know, nine 0:25:18.280 --> 0:25:21.840 point six million registered voters in Texas did not vote, 0:25:21.880 --> 0:25:24.520 and in fact, both the Republicans and the Democrats in 0:25:24.560 --> 0:25:27.600 Texas thought two million more people would vote than actually did. 0:25:28.400 --> 0:25:32.040 And so it's the kind of thing where I thought, oh, 0:25:32.200 --> 0:25:35.560