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Speaker 1: Welcome to Jay dot il a production of I Heart Radio.

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Speaker 1: Well Hello, hi everybody, welcome back to our roum Jay

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Speaker 1: dot Elder podcast. It is a pleasure to be here

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Speaker 1: with you. This is Jill Scott and I'm here with

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Speaker 1: my sister friends. You know who they are, but I'm

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Speaker 1: always always gonna tell their names because i just want

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Speaker 1: to make sure it makes certain that this point with

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Speaker 1: your first time listening to j dot Elga podcast. But

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Speaker 1: h here goes. I have the lovely Aga Graden Dans. Yes, ma'am, Yes,

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Speaker 1: ma'am that's me. That's who I am. I'm the brilliantly

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Speaker 1: wind of my head. Lies. St Clair had a whole

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Speaker 1: like bonjou mean, that's all right? What's up? Hi body?

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Speaker 1: So thank you so much for listening to us today.

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Speaker 1: We have a very very interesting conversation because you know,

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Speaker 1: that's what we do. We like to have conversation at Sparks,

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Speaker 1: conversation and action. M So, I saw something recently, I

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Speaker 1: think it was uh la la uh and she had

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Speaker 1: talked about marriage and how marriage um is like miserable

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Speaker 1: for people, and I thought that was really sad. First

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Speaker 1: of all, I mean as a two time divorce. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I gotta honest with you'all all the way there. I

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Speaker 1: know that it can be kind of miserable, but I

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Speaker 1: think that happens when you got the wrong motherfucker. You

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Speaker 1: just got the wrong person. You picked the wrong person.

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Speaker 1: They don't have the the the same kind of dreams

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Speaker 1: or goals or determination to reach those goals either. And

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Speaker 1: that's that's like, that's sad. I mean to be with anybody,

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Speaker 1: but it happens. Do happen, That's happened. There's ways around that.

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Speaker 1: I'm sure, um one probably taking your sweet time and

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Speaker 1: finding somebody that uh, you know, actually suits you. Or

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Speaker 1: you could get lucky. You could get lucky, really really lucky,

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Speaker 1: super blessed by meeting somebody like agr grading dance like

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Speaker 1: uh like trip up booming robot right rot. Hey, let's

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Speaker 1: have a thousand kids. Let's just have a thousand of them.

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Speaker 1: Let's just have a whole lot of those, you know.

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Speaker 1: And then some people want to, you know, make a

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Speaker 1: whole bunch of money together. But ultimately, I think people

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Speaker 1: really want to if they're going to get married, they

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Speaker 1: ultimately want to enjoy life together. Everybody has to go out.

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Speaker 1: Everybody wants to enjoy the life that you know, as

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Speaker 1: as as a general rule like no, every not absent

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Speaker 1: of challenges, but you know, to have a deep sense

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Speaker 1: of joy. Yeah, a deep sense of joy. Well, today

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Speaker 1: we've got some people here. Huh. We've got some people

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Speaker 1: will tell you all the bottom. Huh. There's a Polly.

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Speaker 1: The Polly couple next door. Um follows the marital journey

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Speaker 1: of Mickey Bay and Rahimli from getting engaged on their

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Speaker 1: first date date they got a date, marrying ninety days later,

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Speaker 1: to deciding to have an open marriage after four years

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Speaker 1: of monogamy. They take you along as they learn the

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Speaker 1: ins and outs of open relating in a polyamorous lifestyle. Now,

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Speaker 1: after seven years of marriage, most people, you know, a

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Speaker 1: lot of people don't make the past five, y'all. Okay,

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Speaker 1: one of them. That's actually that's actually the number that's

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Speaker 1: when the ship really starts hitting the fan. After seven

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Speaker 1: years of marriage, Mickey and Rheem have decided to publicly

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Speaker 1: share their story in hopes of educating people on the options.

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Speaker 1: Uh huh, say that options that exists in relationships structures.

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Speaker 1: And they are here with us today. They're gonna talk

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Speaker 1: to us about polyamorous relationships because uh uh, you know,

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Speaker 1: there's a lot of misconceptions about it. So a lot

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Speaker 1: of people think that y'all just wiling. You know that,

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Speaker 1: oh just everybody get to do everything. But you're welcome

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Speaker 1: and rheal, thanks for coming and and thank you. Let's

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Speaker 1: start there. Let's because I know some of y'all are

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Speaker 1: sitting there like the people. Oh no, thank you so

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Speaker 1: much for having us. It's a hell of the stories.

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Speaker 1: Oh yeah, we have to have you all on because

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Speaker 1: I don't think there's another story out there like this, right,

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Speaker 1: I don't think so. I think we're probably the only

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Speaker 1: ones to at least say it. You know that we

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Speaker 1: were married in ninety days after getting engaged on the

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Speaker 1: first date, and now we're in an open marriage. I

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Speaker 1: haven't heard that anywhere else. Let's go, let's start from

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Speaker 1: the beg. I don't even know should we start from

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Speaker 1: the beginning? And y'all, I don't even know if this

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Speaker 1: you started at the beginning of the window. I would

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Speaker 1: love to know. How did you know? How? I like

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Speaker 1: how she tell So what I will say is that

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Speaker 1: at that time in my life, I was very spiritual,

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Speaker 1: I was very religious, and I was fed up I

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Speaker 1: lived in l A for ten years. I was single, single, single, single,

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Speaker 1: and I just looked up and I said, you know what, God,

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Speaker 1: I know that I'm a wife, and I'm just gonna

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Speaker 1: give this to you because I can't take it anymore.

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Speaker 1: So it was during Lent I went on a fast

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Speaker 1: and during that fast, I started feeling what I thought

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Speaker 1: was my husband's energy coming closer to me. And I

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Speaker 1: had asked for some specific things. I said, I'm so

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Speaker 1: tired of dating. Please let this man see me and

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Speaker 1: know that it is me. So when I met him

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Speaker 1: on that first date, we went to get pancakes in

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Speaker 1: the valley and we only had one converse that the

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Speaker 1: conversation the night before we get there, he hugs me,

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Speaker 1: and immediately when he hugged me, I knew that he

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Speaker 1: was my husband because I had been having a reoccurring

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Speaker 1: dream since I was twenty six about this man who

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Speaker 1: was dark skinned and bald. I couldn't see his face,

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Speaker 1: but he hugged me in the dream, and I could

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Speaker 1: feel the when he hugged me, I felt the exact

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Speaker 1: same energy, and I was like, this is him. So

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Speaker 1: then when he asked me about forty five minutes into

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Speaker 1: the conversation, would I marry him? I initially said no,

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Speaker 1: and he said why and I said, because I want

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Speaker 1: a better post. So I went to the bathroom, came back.

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Speaker 1: He made me a ring out of the paper packets,

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Speaker 1: the sugar paper packets, and proposed to me outside the

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Speaker 1: front of this pancake place and it was a million

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Speaker 1: people because it's a Sunday in l A for branch, right,

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Speaker 1: so it's a million people outside. Gets down, asked me

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Speaker 1: to marry him with my whole government day and I

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Speaker 1: said yes, And literally we are strangers at this point, right.

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Speaker 1: So that particular day, he was moving from l A

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Speaker 1: to go back to Philly, and so we literally went

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Speaker 1: back to his empty apartment and try to figure out

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Speaker 1: if you really engaged. And I'm looking at him, He's

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Speaker 1: looking at me. He's like, you're real all for real?

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Speaker 1: Are you for real? Alf real? So we just said,

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Speaker 1: you know what, why don't we go ahead with your

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Speaker 1: plan to move back to Philly and let's see how

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Speaker 1: it goes long distance. But that did not work out.

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Speaker 1: He ended up moving back to l A. Two weeks later.

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Speaker 1: We got into Christian marriage counseling. The very next day.

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Speaker 1: Did that for eleven weeks and got married the day

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Speaker 1: after we graduated. Well, see, you need to come back

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Speaker 1: and talk about this separate from the pole and reach y'all.

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Speaker 1: That's a whole other. That's a whole other. But I'm

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Speaker 1: glad you said this. First of all, Every part, every

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Speaker 1: bit of me is filled with glee because number one,

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Speaker 1: like I think it's so important for people who are listening,

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Speaker 1: who are Christian or who are Abrahamic religion based to

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Speaker 1: sit here to listen to you say this was your

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Speaker 1: starting space, right, because a lot of times people think

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Speaker 1: that all kinds of people get to the end of

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Speaker 1: the road without any of that as a foundation. They

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Speaker 1: want to throw those things out there, and I'm not

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Speaker 1: assuming what people will think. I'm just glad that that

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Speaker 1: is a part of your story because it takes away

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Speaker 1: that immediate like response of like defensiveness that I think

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Speaker 1: people would have at this moment. They have been calling

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Speaker 1: us godless, I mean, they have been saying every We

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Speaker 1: have been called everything under the sun. But I expect

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Speaker 1: that and really my reason, my reasoning for wanting to

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Speaker 1: have this conversation out in the open in a very

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Speaker 1: public format is because we as black people need to

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Speaker 1: know that we have options in everything, including how we

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Speaker 1: relate to people, and so much of our lives we

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Speaker 1: default just to what our parents wanted, what is expected

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Speaker 1: of us from society, and we have to fit into

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Speaker 1: this little box. And my reason for this is just

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Speaker 1: to say my way might not be your way, but

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Speaker 1: maybe there's a way for you not to be miserable

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Speaker 1: in your marriage, for you to be able to actually

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Speaker 1: grow old with someone, because I am a completely different

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Speaker 1: person than I was seven years ago when I got married, Like,

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Speaker 1: I don't even recognize her right so, and and if

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Speaker 1: we stay married twenty five more years, I'm probably gonna

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Speaker 1: be seven more people. So the idea is not that

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Speaker 1: you know the person that you're married today, God willing

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Speaker 1: is not the same person twenty five years later. You

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Speaker 1: want to be and you want to be exactly. And

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Speaker 1: so I'm grateful that I did not choose my husband.

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Speaker 1: I allowed God to choose my husband, and therefore we

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Speaker 1: have been able to make it room so much, and

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Speaker 1: we've had a lot. My mother died the very next

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Speaker 1: day after I met him, so and then his best

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Speaker 1: friend died six months later, so we were grieving the

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Speaker 1: first few years of our marriage, on top of getting

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Speaker 1: to know each other, on top of leaving l A

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Speaker 1: to start a life in Houston, on top of getting

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Speaker 1: my my bonus daughter's coming to live with us two

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Speaker 1: weeks after we got married. I mean we added brown

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Speaker 1: at us more real talk after the break. So you

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Speaker 1: guys were clearly not really afraid of like therapy and

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Speaker 1: counseling and stuff like that because you started in that space.

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Speaker 1: Once you guys realize, Okay, we have jumped into something

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Speaker 1: that we both want deeply. But it has come with

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Speaker 1: like you said, grief, with uh, you know, extended family,

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Speaker 1: it has come with you know, distance, all of these things.

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Speaker 1: What was the thing that you all decided to do

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Speaker 1: together to address these kind of really large, overarching issues

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Speaker 1: that could have really literally broke you up? And talk

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Speaker 1: about two where you were in your head because I

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Speaker 1: loved that we got key perspective, but you had to

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Speaker 1: be able to receive go ahead. Absolutely. So a lot

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Speaker 1: of people always ask me, how could I do this

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Speaker 1: on the first day? Right obvious questions? And I always

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Speaker 1: tell people is it was the vulnerability of where we

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Speaker 1: were together, right. I was in l A for I

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Speaker 1: was in l A for four years, l A had

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Speaker 1: did the thing too, it just did not work out.

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Speaker 1: Liar was there, was there at the end. Um l

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Speaker 1: A was just not working out. So when I met her,

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Speaker 1: the first message that I sent to her on a

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Speaker 1: dating map where I felt that I shouldn't have been

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Speaker 1: anyway because I was literally moving in a week. So

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Speaker 1: we had breakfast, and what what was evident to me

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Speaker 1: is that if we can always be this honest with

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Speaker 1: each other and this vulnerable, we can conquer anything. Because

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Speaker 1: I was on my last I was literally moving back

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Speaker 1: to Philly that afternoon, like literally we had breakfast at nine.

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Speaker 1: I was taking a train from l A to Philly

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Speaker 1: at like four, And when she asked me to breakfast

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Speaker 1: that morning, I'm I'm in my head. I'm like, yeah,

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Speaker 1: I'd like to meet you, but I'm literally out in

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Speaker 1: a couple of hours. My daughters we all lived in

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Speaker 1: l A. My daughters and their mother lived in l A.

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Speaker 1: They dropped me off. They were gonna take me to

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Speaker 1: the train station because I lost my car, Like everything

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Speaker 1: bad was happening in my life. And I said, you

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Speaker 1: know what what I mean, one little shining moment before

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Speaker 1: I leave l A. All right, let's go to breakfast, right,

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Speaker 1: And it was the vulnerability and that goes into which

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Speaker 1: your question aga is I said, and we said that

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Speaker 1: if we can just be vulnerable and and have transparency

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Speaker 1: and to stee with each other through all the things

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Speaker 1: that we know is gonna trip us up, we can survive.

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Speaker 1: Like we had a really rough but at the end

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Speaker 1: of the day, we said, you know what, let's get

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Speaker 1: back to what we said we were gonna do, be

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Speaker 1: honest with each other, be vulnerable. And it's not the

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Speaker 1: most uh, it's not the simple thing, right, but we

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Speaker 1: always try to go back to the point with you know,

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Speaker 1: let's just be vulnerable, right, because like she said, we

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Speaker 1: are going to continuously change, and we're changing literally right now.

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Speaker 1: And the fact that we could still remain vulnerable even

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Speaker 1: when it's really really tough is what helped us get

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Speaker 1: through all of these changes. And it's been up and

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Speaker 1: down seven years. But we've lived in five different states,

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Speaker 1: we've lived in six different cribs. You know, my daughters

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Speaker 1: had a rough year last year. They're in Delaware now,

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Speaker 1: so they're in college. You know, we have a three

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Speaker 1: year old son almost four, like, so we we've been

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Speaker 1: dodging a lot of things. But at the end of

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Speaker 1: the day, we decided that the honesty, the vulnerability, even

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Speaker 1: when we struggle for it, UM is like the common

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Speaker 1: denominator for us. I'm looking here. You also, the two

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Speaker 1: of you have a skill set, you know, UM for

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Speaker 1: for for anybody UM listening here, understand that Mickey Bay

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Speaker 1: is a relationship expert and life coach specializing in manifestation

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Speaker 1: and emotional regulation. Okay, like that's okay, okay, emotional regulation. Wow, Okay, Yeah,

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Speaker 1: that's a good partner to have. I wasn't that seven

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Speaker 1: years ago, though, got it right? So? You know, evolution, yes,

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Speaker 1: and the evolution of I mean, I've been everything from

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Speaker 1: a celebrity bankup artist, lash lash uh owner. You know,

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Speaker 1: I had a business in l A. I was an

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Speaker 1: eyelash sension um technician. So I've done done a lot

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Speaker 1: of different things. And he's been with me on that journey.

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Speaker 1: And I think the good thing to know is that

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Speaker 1: good relationships still go through bad times, and don't make

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Speaker 1: the bad times the culmination of what you are and

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Speaker 1: know that this is a conflict that can actually cause

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Speaker 1: you to go deeper with your mate. And I always

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Speaker 1: look at people who say, like oh we have. We've

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Speaker 1: been together five years and we haven't ever had an argument.

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Speaker 1: I'm like, well, y'all not being really right. You're not

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Speaker 1: giving yourself even an opportunity to go and load the

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Speaker 1: surface with this person that you're with, who is multifaceted, right,

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Speaker 1: and you're not even giving yourself an opportunity. Conflict is

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Speaker 1: a gift, and when people are conflict avoided, they're really

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Speaker 1: um not allowing themselves to grow for themselves, for their

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Speaker 1: own evolution, and also not allowing the growth of the relationship.

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Speaker 1: And you pick a partner who would later um become

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Speaker 1: a up level communication coach? What is up level? That

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Speaker 1: mean up level is a system was developed by a

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Speaker 1: woman named Ken and Kate Stevens. You've probably seen her

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Speaker 1: if you haven't noticed, Like, she's like the Polly Queen.

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Speaker 1: She's one with the two husbands I have locks, right, Yeah,

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Speaker 1: So that's my coach. She has a whole new paradigm

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Speaker 1: of communication and uh, she's been in this this space

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Speaker 1: of communication relating in uh polyamory for like twenty years.

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Speaker 1: So I took her course in conflict resolution and it's

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Speaker 1: it's changed my relationship, Our relationship is changed. How I

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Speaker 1: communicate with partners, how how I communicate with my kids,

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Speaker 1: how to communicate with my son. And he's only three

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Speaker 1: years old. So it's like she's talking about conflict is

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Speaker 1: a gift. It's really a gift when you know how

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Speaker 1: to do it right right, when you're not beating your

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Speaker 1: your partner up for being you know, fulfilling all these

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Speaker 1: you know, checking all these boxes and meeting all these

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Speaker 1: expectations that you might have. So that has been in

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Speaker 1: the last I guess six months. We started that process

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Speaker 1: and we do it every day. It's a whole process.

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Speaker 1: It's not difficult, but it starts with just realizing that

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Speaker 1: I you uh the self. We create our own lives.

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Speaker 1: We create every situation that we're in, and life is

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Speaker 1: happening for us and not to us, and things that

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Speaker 1: things that happen are not happening to us. Right. We

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Speaker 1: all have a different perspective and that communication style and

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Speaker 1: the things that I'm coaching on, I mean, just revolutionalized

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Speaker 1: our relationship. How we communicate with each other. We don't

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Speaker 1: stay mad at each other, you know, the whole don't

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Speaker 1: go to bid angry type of bility. We can do

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Speaker 1: that because we're really processing conflict and in in a

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Speaker 1: way where we say is the right? But yeah, the

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Speaker 1: things that our elders were telling us, you know, those

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Speaker 1: those simple things, don't they They had happiness and but

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Speaker 1: it never said how. They never said that's what I'm

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Speaker 1: about to say, So what does that look like for you? Guys?

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Speaker 1: They never say how. They never say how. When we

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Speaker 1: we um, the first step is called the venting process.

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Speaker 1: When you set a container for um for conflict. Now,

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Speaker 1: instead of rushing in the house and saying I'm mad

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Speaker 1: about this thing, what I'm saying is, babe, can you

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Speaker 1: hold space for me to vent something that's on my heart?

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Speaker 1: I'm asking permission, right, I'm I'm asking her to set

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Speaker 1: space for me. I'm telling her what level one, Hey,

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Speaker 1: I'm at a level five of anger? Right, can you

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Speaker 1: hold space for me? And she agrees to hold that

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Speaker 1: space for me. I let her have it. I give

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Speaker 1: everything I had. She doesn't say one word, and at

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Speaker 1: the end of that she just says, thank you. How

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Speaker 1: can I support you? And if she does that, if

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Speaker 1: she's like, I don't have it. If she doesn't she's

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Speaker 1: like I don't have it right now, then I either

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Speaker 1: wait till she does or event to someone else, because

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Speaker 1: I still got I still got what. You know, if

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Speaker 1: she says, you know what, the boy needs to be fed,

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Speaker 1: Let's put him to bed, and then I can hold

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Speaker 1: space for you. Right, I'm not coming at her anger,

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Speaker 1: because if I come at her with walking the door

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Speaker 1: and say I'm mad, the boy still needs to be

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Speaker 1: put to bed. Right, she had a long day. I

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Speaker 1: had a long day. Now she's mad at the fact

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Speaker 1: that I'm not respecting that she's busy. Right, So now

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Speaker 1: we got anger on top of anger. But now she

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Speaker 1: holds that space for me. Now she's calm, she knows

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Speaker 1: that it's coming, she knows that I have a lot

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Speaker 1: on my heart, she can receive it. And at the

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Speaker 1: end of the day, and this is for everybody. What

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Speaker 1: you want, what we want out of an argument or event,

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Speaker 1: we just want to feel better. We don't expect that

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Speaker 1: that thing that we want to happen is going to

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Speaker 1: happen in the second that you express yourself. Right, you

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Speaker 1: know you didn't watch the dishes. Well, the dishes are

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Speaker 1: not gonna be washed in the next two minutes. That

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Speaker 1: you're anger. But what we want is to feel heard

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Speaker 1: and to feel better after we get that off our chests.

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Speaker 1: So once she says, how can I soothe you? I

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Speaker 1: have a list of things she can soothe me with touch.

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Speaker 1: Uh she can uh repeat what I said. She can

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Speaker 1: simulate something for me. We were making agreements to to

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Speaker 1: to feel better because at the end of the love language,

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Speaker 1: I just want to feel better. I want to know

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Speaker 1: that I'm hurt and I just want to feel better.

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Speaker 1: So wait, so y'all have the tools now. Y'all have

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Speaker 1: the tools now. However, when the polyamory conversation was introduced

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Speaker 1: between you guys, the tools weren't necessarily there. So tell

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Speaker 1: us I just I really want you all to tell

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Speaker 1: the story about how this first came up in conversation.

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Speaker 1: We have a difference of opinion on how it initially

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Speaker 1: came up. I said that we were laying in the

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Speaker 1: bed and you know, I brought it up to him.

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Speaker 1: He says that we were actually in conflict when it happens.

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Speaker 1: I'll let him tell that one. Oh, but down, let

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Speaker 1: me get let me get my tea. The real version

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Speaker 1: is a combination of the two. Where where it started was,

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Speaker 1: you know, we're in not set third year marriage and

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Speaker 1: we just started questioning stuff like forty years right, right, yeah,

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Speaker 1: forever ever, Like we just kept coming up with questions

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Speaker 1: like why My main question is why hasn't marriage evolved

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Speaker 1: from the first marriage, Like, it's the same thing if

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Speaker 1: you say I'm married, and assuming you're hetero sexual, and

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Speaker 1: this is very Eurocentric, what's the first man? This is

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Speaker 1: what I'm saying. This is exactly what I'm saying. This

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Speaker 1: exactly what I'm saying, going to our Western way of thinking.

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Speaker 1: If you say I'm married, it means one thing. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: if you're a woman, that you're married to a man,

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Speaker 1: and that's your monogamous that's it. There's no vows of

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Speaker 1: the same like if you say viows you you know,

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Speaker 1: you know for good or for bad, blah blah blah blah,

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Speaker 1: what means something. And the conversation that came kept coming

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Speaker 1: up for us was that why can't it be a

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Speaker 1: little different? Why why can't I have female friends when

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Speaker 1: I'm in a monogamous relationship, Because generally when you get married,

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Speaker 1: and Micky'll tell you she lost some male friends because

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Speaker 1: she just assumed that she just had to get rid

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Speaker 1: because she was married. Now, y'all were always thinking like this,

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Speaker 1: how do I know because I was friends with Roanheme,

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Speaker 1: so I'm like, no, it was a process. Yea, yeah,

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Speaker 1: so that's what I was saying. We just start having

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Speaker 1: conversations and like little jokes over a course of a

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Speaker 1: year where we're just like, you know what, this is

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Speaker 1: gonna be difficult, Like we need to choose each other

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Speaker 1: every single day, as opposed to thinking thirty years from

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Speaker 1: that because we don't know who we're gonna be next week,

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Speaker 1: and to think thirty years from now that I'm gonna

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Speaker 1: love you the same, I'm gonna meet you saying I'm

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Speaker 1: gonna want you to say and you know, and thirty

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Speaker 1: years it was just nuts to me, and we just said,

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Speaker 1: you know, let's do this every single day now. Where

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Speaker 1: the conflict came in my version is that we were

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Speaker 1: in a fight and she, uh, you know, I wasn't listening.

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Speaker 1: I was a dumb boy, and she said, you know what,

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Speaker 1: fucking we pollock And now we got to put that

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Speaker 1: on a T shirt. Because people like well spun version,

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Speaker 1: so we're trying to combine those versions. I think, well,

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Speaker 1: I personally like the I like the Mickeys, I like

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Speaker 1: that fuck it we Polly and what and what And

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Speaker 1: then the next day we were like, you know, and

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Speaker 1: this was like during COVID, so we were like Polly Polly,

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Speaker 1: but we were open to the idea of like really

403
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Speaker 1: trying to have friendships and partnerships and seeing what that

404
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Speaker 1: really looked like. It's seeing how we felt doing all

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Speaker 1: that stuff, and it we we settled into it, and

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Speaker 1: then we moved to Atlanta afterwards, so we no, no, no,

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Speaker 1: you're going fast because you gotta established Like, Okay, Mickey

408
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Speaker 1: Bay say fuck it. We Polly, what does that mean

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Speaker 1: to Mickey Bay and Rahim we could do this. I

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Speaker 1: meet the person, like, how do you? What's the We

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Speaker 1: went all the way in, We went all the way in.

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Speaker 1: I think when that happened, we were both like on

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Speaker 1: dating sites the next day, you know, so it was

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Speaker 1: pretty much like we were on dating sites separate, separately, correct,

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Speaker 1: So we we do not date together. There are some

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Speaker 1: couples who do, but we decided that we wanted to

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Speaker 1: date separately. And at that time, I mean, I have

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Speaker 1: a different awareness now that I didn't have when I

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Speaker 1: was asking for the open marriage. I was really questioning

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Speaker 1: a lot about my sexuality at that time, and I

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Speaker 1: didn't know what was going on. I just knew that

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Speaker 1: we had a terrible mismatch in his sex drive and

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Speaker 1: my sex drive, and it was really really painful for

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Speaker 1: me to feel like I could not provide the level

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Speaker 1: of intimacy that my husband really wanted for me, and

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Speaker 1: I tried, and then it just got worse after the baby, right,

427
00:25:09,119 --> 00:25:12,879
Speaker 1: So I was really struggling trying to find a way

428
00:25:13,000 --> 00:25:16,440
Speaker 1: to keep my marriage because I love him and we're

429
00:25:16,520 --> 00:25:20,680
Speaker 1: great together, but this one piece was not there for us, right,

430
00:25:20,760 --> 00:25:23,199
Speaker 1: It just was not, And I didn't have the awareness

431
00:25:23,200 --> 00:25:25,320
Speaker 1: then that I have now. Now I know that I'm

432
00:25:25,320 --> 00:25:29,840
Speaker 1: on the A sexual spectrum and that has really been

433
00:25:29,920 --> 00:25:32,639
Speaker 1: so clarifying to me, and I'm so glad I didn't

434
00:25:32,640 --> 00:25:36,040
Speaker 1: wait to figure that piece out before we opened our marriage,

435
00:25:36,080 --> 00:25:38,440
Speaker 1: because who knows if we wouldn't be made it this

436
00:25:38,640 --> 00:25:42,560
Speaker 1: far right. So, I think just our willingness to take

437
00:25:42,600 --> 00:25:46,240
Speaker 1: into account the people who are actually in the marriage

438
00:25:46,440 --> 00:25:50,600
Speaker 1: versus the marriage as the main thing. I see him

439
00:25:50,720 --> 00:25:54,560
Speaker 1: as an individual who I'm married to. He still gets

440
00:25:54,640 --> 00:25:56,919
Speaker 1: to be who he is and I still get to

441
00:25:56,920 --> 00:26:00,160
Speaker 1: be who I am, And for me being Pobby, it's

442
00:26:00,200 --> 00:26:03,800
Speaker 1: more so about the freedom of it, and especially as

443
00:26:03,800 --> 00:26:06,400
Speaker 1: a black woman. I just feel like it's so revolutionary

444
00:26:06,440 --> 00:26:09,639
Speaker 1: to be able to say I get to decide who, what,

445
00:26:10,000 --> 00:26:13,600
Speaker 1: when where, even though I'm a married woman. No one

446
00:26:13,640 --> 00:26:15,679
Speaker 1: gets to decide that for me because I am an

447
00:26:15,680 --> 00:26:19,480
Speaker 1: adult and I get to decide how I relate to

448
00:26:19,520 --> 00:26:22,320
Speaker 1: any other adult. And that is not something I'm willing

449
00:26:22,359 --> 00:26:25,399
Speaker 1: to advocate just because I'm married. Girl, you just blew

450
00:26:25,600 --> 00:26:29,200
Speaker 1: the child. You just blew the wigs off. You just

451
00:26:31,080 --> 00:26:33,320
Speaker 1: you just brew the wigs off for many many a person.

452
00:26:33,560 --> 00:26:36,680
Speaker 1: Just now. So people listening right now, like, well, god,

453
00:26:36,800 --> 00:26:41,639
Speaker 1: that in my child. I feel like, what's interesting and

454
00:26:41,880 --> 00:26:46,920
Speaker 1: actually really needed is this idea that a person can

455
00:26:46,960 --> 00:26:51,560
Speaker 1: be married and have a conversation with their mate that

456
00:26:51,720 --> 00:26:55,560
Speaker 1: is strictly about who they are as a person and

457
00:26:55,600 --> 00:26:57,560
Speaker 1: how to live the life that they want to live.

458
00:26:58,080 --> 00:27:02,679
Speaker 1: Specifically about that, because I think that's not really what happens.

459
00:27:02,680 --> 00:27:05,480
Speaker 1: People get married and it's like every conversation that you

460
00:27:05,560 --> 00:27:08,679
Speaker 1: have has to be about us, has to be about

461
00:27:08,880 --> 00:27:12,600
Speaker 1: the group, what's good for the group and so, and

462
00:27:12,680 --> 00:27:14,840
Speaker 1: I mean, and that's just the way that it goes.

463
00:27:15,480 --> 00:27:17,840
Speaker 1: But I think that that that kind of shifting of

464
00:27:17,880 --> 00:27:20,280
Speaker 1: culture around like, well, no, the marriage is also a

465
00:27:20,320 --> 00:27:24,240
Speaker 1: place to talk about and always has been. That's the

466
00:27:24,280 --> 00:27:27,160
Speaker 1: funny part is that basically what y'all are actually saying

467
00:27:27,280 --> 00:27:30,239
Speaker 1: is that marriage was never not that. It was just

468
00:27:30,280 --> 00:27:33,639
Speaker 1: not that because you decided it was not that. Was like,

469
00:27:33,760 --> 00:27:36,080
Speaker 1: it wasn't that because everybody told you it was not that,

470
00:27:36,200 --> 00:27:37,600
Speaker 1: and you just went on the head with it and

471
00:27:37,680 --> 00:27:41,040
Speaker 1: never questioned it, never did anything else, and then may

472
00:27:41,080 --> 00:27:43,520
Speaker 1: have lost out on somebody who you really could have

473
00:27:43,720 --> 00:27:46,720
Speaker 1: had a good life with because they didn't fit into that,

474
00:27:47,119 --> 00:27:53,480
Speaker 1: into that box. You know what I'm saying. We're gonna

475
00:27:53,480 --> 00:27:55,560
Speaker 1: take a quick break and then we'll be right back.

476
00:28:06,080 --> 00:28:11,040
Speaker 1: People say that, um, that marriage is like the death

477
00:28:11,160 --> 00:28:16,040
Speaker 1: of yourself, and I thought that was the saddest thing

478
00:28:16,119 --> 00:28:20,560
Speaker 1: I've said. I mean, I I totally believe in marriage.

479
00:28:20,600 --> 00:28:23,960
Speaker 1: So you know, even though I have been divorced twice, Um,

480
00:28:24,000 --> 00:28:28,560
Speaker 1: I don't even count that. We count it. If you don't,

481
00:28:28,600 --> 00:28:32,400
Speaker 1: we won't don't acknowledge we won't. I mean is that

482
00:28:32,400 --> 00:28:36,000
Speaker 1: that I don't acknowledge it because definitely, you know, what

483
00:28:36,080 --> 00:28:38,480
Speaker 1: you learn about yourself is that you can make some

484
00:28:38,600 --> 00:28:43,520
Speaker 1: dumb decisions for reasons that the society has put on you,

485
00:28:43,680 --> 00:28:47,600
Speaker 1: or a reason for you know, your grandma. My grandma

486
00:28:47,640 --> 00:28:53,480
Speaker 1: was like, you're that man without getting married. You got

487
00:28:53,480 --> 00:28:58,560
Speaker 1: to get married, you know. Um yeah, I'm just saying that. Um,

488
00:28:58,640 --> 00:29:03,120
Speaker 1: it's so mature. God just sitting there like I'm impressed.

489
00:29:03,240 --> 00:29:06,360
Speaker 1: I'm impressed with the and to jump there without the

490
00:29:06,360 --> 00:29:09,040
Speaker 1: tools first either. So it's not like y'all have the

491
00:29:09,040 --> 00:29:11,760
Speaker 1: tools and then y'all ended up there. Y'all just took

492
00:29:11,760 --> 00:29:14,880
Speaker 1: a chance and then decided to grow in it. To

493
00:29:15,040 --> 00:29:18,320
Speaker 1: grow in it? Whoa the other side of it though,

494
00:29:19,160 --> 00:29:21,360
Speaker 1: as you have just did all the work on yourself,

495
00:29:21,600 --> 00:29:24,120
Speaker 1: my question is after you decided that you're brave enough

496
00:29:24,160 --> 00:29:27,240
Speaker 1: and you have uh the right partner that you can

497
00:29:27,240 --> 00:29:30,440
Speaker 1: express all this too, what about when your partner actually

498
00:29:30,480 --> 00:29:33,560
Speaker 1: starts enjoying the company of other women And you know,

499
00:29:33,600 --> 00:29:36,040
Speaker 1: some people say it's the sex, but a lot of

500
00:29:36,080 --> 00:29:39,400
Speaker 1: times with polyamory is not about just a sex. It's

501
00:29:39,440 --> 00:29:43,640
Speaker 1: like I am enjoying this person so like the confidence

502
00:29:43,680 --> 00:29:46,960
Speaker 1: that it takes for another woman or man, because I

503
00:29:46,960 --> 00:29:49,160
Speaker 1: feel like what raight heem is y'all are equals in this,

504
00:29:49,320 --> 00:29:52,960
Speaker 1: like as a man having another man enjoy your wife,

505
00:29:53,440 --> 00:29:57,680
Speaker 1: not just sexually, but intellectually emotionally like it takes a

506
00:29:57,800 --> 00:30:01,280
Speaker 1: certain kind of confidence in person to get there. And

507
00:30:01,480 --> 00:30:03,280
Speaker 1: that's to me a whole another step from what you

508
00:30:03,360 --> 00:30:06,000
Speaker 1: just said, like, how do you do that? Well? I

509
00:30:06,040 --> 00:30:09,840
Speaker 1: think the thing that is really necessary is to realize

510
00:30:09,960 --> 00:30:14,200
Speaker 1: you do not own that person, that that person still

511
00:30:15,280 --> 00:30:19,240
Speaker 1: should be able to decide how they're interacting with someone.

512
00:30:19,360 --> 00:30:22,440
Speaker 1: And I think what men, especially get really tripped up

513
00:30:22,480 --> 00:30:28,040
Speaker 1: on is that's my woman, right, and anyone defiles my woman.

514
00:30:28,120 --> 00:30:30,680
Speaker 1: I mean you should see the intere Beyonce's Internet is

515
00:30:30,720 --> 00:30:37,200
Speaker 1: going crazy telling him about Okay, yeah, oh, I saw

516
00:30:37,320 --> 00:30:40,520
Speaker 1: you all kinds of you know everything. I'm like, y'all,

517
00:30:41,000 --> 00:30:44,040
Speaker 1: it's the a sexual part. But anyways, um, but the

518
00:30:44,040 --> 00:30:47,320
Speaker 1: thing about it is the thing about it is I

519
00:30:47,360 --> 00:30:50,440
Speaker 1: think that when you start to really look at the

520
00:30:50,560 --> 00:30:55,240
Speaker 1: person as their own entity and what is going to

521
00:30:55,320 --> 00:31:00,720
Speaker 1: make that person happy. I am committed to his happiness,

522
00:31:00,720 --> 00:31:05,720
Speaker 1: whether it involves me or not. And I want for

523
00:31:05,840 --> 00:31:10,480
Speaker 1: him to enjoy the time that he is away from myself,

524
00:31:10,520 --> 00:31:13,240
Speaker 1: away from his family. I do not expect that he

525
00:31:13,400 --> 00:31:16,120
Speaker 1: is going out in the world and coming back stressed.

526
00:31:16,440 --> 00:31:19,320
Speaker 1: I want him to be coming back happy, right. I

527
00:31:19,320 --> 00:31:22,960
Speaker 1: want him to enjoy his time with whomever he's with,

528
00:31:23,040 --> 00:31:26,120
Speaker 1: whether it's a woman, whether it's an old friend, whoever

529
00:31:26,160 --> 00:31:29,440
Speaker 1: it is, because I'm not concerned that he's going to

530
00:31:29,520 --> 00:31:32,560
Speaker 1: walk in the door and and pack his bags and leave.

531
00:31:33,120 --> 00:31:36,800
Speaker 1: I know that if that were to happen, I would

532
00:31:36,800 --> 00:31:38,800
Speaker 1: have known well before he gets to the point of

533
00:31:38,840 --> 00:31:44,000
Speaker 1: packing a bag, because we talk. We have that openness

534
00:31:44,040 --> 00:31:46,600
Speaker 1: between us that he could tell me, you know what,

535
00:31:46,800 --> 00:31:49,239
Speaker 1: I'm thinking that I want to be over here and

536
00:31:49,280 --> 00:31:50,760
Speaker 1: this is what I want to do. And I would

537
00:31:50,800 --> 00:31:54,400
Speaker 1: say if he ever decided that, if that is what

538
00:31:54,480 --> 00:31:57,600
Speaker 1: it's going to make him happy, I am for it.

539
00:31:57,720 --> 00:31:59,480
Speaker 1: And I get that that does not sound like a

540
00:31:59,560 --> 00:32:02,680
Speaker 1: married part and talking like that, But ultimately, why would

541
00:32:02,680 --> 00:32:04,280
Speaker 1: I want to be in a marriage with someone who

542
00:32:04,320 --> 00:32:07,600
Speaker 1: doesn't want to be here? So why is that even

543
00:32:07,600 --> 00:32:10,800
Speaker 1: a fear? It's an irrational fear to even to even

544
00:32:10,840 --> 00:32:12,640
Speaker 1: have that in the first place, Because do you really

545
00:32:12,720 --> 00:32:15,000
Speaker 1: want to hang on to someone who's saying I want

546
00:32:15,040 --> 00:32:17,800
Speaker 1: to be over here? And in our marriage, and we've

547
00:32:17,800 --> 00:32:21,560
Speaker 1: been through many different seasons um in these past few

548
00:32:21,640 --> 00:32:25,120
Speaker 1: years that we've been Polly, I had fallen in love

549
00:32:25,160 --> 00:32:31,080
Speaker 1: with someone and it was very, very difficult or both

550
00:32:31,080 --> 00:32:32,880
Speaker 1: it is. It was difficult for me to have strong

551
00:32:32,920 --> 00:32:36,640
Speaker 1: feelings for someone else. So being Polly means that you

552
00:32:36,720 --> 00:32:40,240
Speaker 1: have the capability to have more than one loving relationship.

553
00:32:40,360 --> 00:32:44,440
Speaker 1: That is the definition. So yes, the expectation for us

554
00:32:45,160 --> 00:32:48,360
Speaker 1: is that we are treating all of our partners with love.

555
00:32:48,520 --> 00:32:50,560
Speaker 1: I expect that he's going to love the women that

556
00:32:50,640 --> 00:32:52,800
Speaker 1: he's a no matter. In fact, I make sure they

557
00:32:52,800 --> 00:32:58,520
Speaker 1: get the treatment they're supposed to get. Well. It means

558
00:32:58,600 --> 00:33:02,560
Speaker 1: that for instant he has he has a partner whose

559
00:33:02,560 --> 00:33:05,600
Speaker 1: birthday is coming up, like what you getting her for

560
00:33:05,680 --> 00:33:09,920
Speaker 1: her birthday? Oh? Or are you gonna? Did you? And

561
00:33:10,280 --> 00:33:12,600
Speaker 1: they had a little spat and I said, you need

562
00:33:12,640 --> 00:33:17,480
Speaker 1: to work it out, go use your tools, right, So sure,

563
00:33:18,680 --> 00:33:20,600
Speaker 1: I mean I don't know something. Actually, some of this

564
00:33:20,720 --> 00:33:23,680
Speaker 1: does sound slightly familiar because I do know people who

565
00:33:23,680 --> 00:33:30,160
Speaker 1: are involved in polygamy and so sometimes same tools. Um,

566
00:33:30,240 --> 00:33:34,200
Speaker 1: you know, it is not nearly as equitable, you know

567
00:33:34,240 --> 00:33:37,800
Speaker 1: what I'm saying. But but that's coming from a mono lens.

568
00:33:37,880 --> 00:33:40,640
Speaker 1: It is exactly. It is equitable because the women are

569
00:33:40,680 --> 00:33:44,680
Speaker 1: actually choosing that relationship dynamic. They're actually choosing that right,

570
00:33:44,760 --> 00:33:48,200
Speaker 1: They're actually making that choice. Except for in situations where

571
00:33:48,200 --> 00:33:49,840
Speaker 1: they feel like they have to do it under the

572
00:33:49,840 --> 00:33:52,360
Speaker 1: rest where it's like economic or whatever the case may be.

573
00:33:52,920 --> 00:33:56,360
Speaker 1: In some instances it's not quite equitable, but in theory

574
00:33:56,520 --> 00:33:58,920
Speaker 1: yet and there are some people participate in it and

575
00:33:58,960 --> 00:34:02,480
Speaker 1: it is very equital. But but yeah, I mean yeah,

576
00:34:02,480 --> 00:34:05,360
Speaker 1: I mean, I hear. I've heard these kinds of tools

577
00:34:05,400 --> 00:34:08,440
Speaker 1: being used in that instance as well. Just like this

578
00:34:08,520 --> 00:34:10,920
Speaker 1: is just high level communication. And we talked about this

579
00:34:10,960 --> 00:34:12,440
Speaker 1: before we got on with you guys. That is like,

580
00:34:12,520 --> 00:34:15,560
Speaker 1: if you don't have a very strong constitution between the

581
00:34:15,600 --> 00:34:18,759
Speaker 1: two people and that those people are willing to make

582
00:34:18,800 --> 00:34:21,600
Speaker 1: sure that that is important to them, then you know,

583
00:34:21,680 --> 00:34:23,840
Speaker 1: then you cannot exist in this. And this is really

584
00:34:23,880 --> 00:34:28,320
Speaker 1: like high level communication and high level honesty as well.

585
00:34:28,840 --> 00:34:31,680
Speaker 1: And can I just say this, I feel ashamed. I'm sorry, Like, yeah,

586
00:34:31,719 --> 00:34:34,359
Speaker 1: I love you. I'm ashamed that the way that we

587
00:34:34,600 --> 00:34:36,799
Speaker 1: I'm thinking and I'm ashamed that the way that we

588
00:34:36,840 --> 00:34:40,000
Speaker 1: describe our relationships with each other. Number one, that we

589
00:34:40,040 --> 00:34:43,680
Speaker 1: would assume that sex means defilement. That's just sad, and

590
00:34:43,719 --> 00:34:46,239
Speaker 1: that too, and that and that everything everything that we

591
00:34:46,280 --> 00:34:49,800
Speaker 1: expect to connect with people is um is only sexual.

592
00:34:50,280 --> 00:34:52,319
Speaker 1: And the third thing that really kind of made me

593
00:34:52,360 --> 00:34:55,960
Speaker 1: sad was the idea that the possession of each other.

594
00:34:56,920 --> 00:34:58,920
Speaker 1: And it's funny because I have said my man and

595
00:34:58,960 --> 00:35:01,080
Speaker 1: my husband and millions he is my husband. But you

596
00:35:01,160 --> 00:35:04,839
Speaker 1: understand I'm saying, like the possession aspect of it. I'm

597
00:35:04,880 --> 00:35:07,720
Speaker 1: not sure if I really focused in on how toxic

598
00:35:07,800 --> 00:35:11,040
Speaker 1: that type of language is, even if you're monogamous. That

599
00:35:11,239 --> 00:35:17,480
Speaker 1: is just that that's a problem. That is a problem,

600
00:35:17,680 --> 00:35:20,719
Speaker 1: and it feeds and festers a thing that I'm no

601
00:35:20,760 --> 00:35:24,640
Speaker 1: longer interested in doing something supremacy. Come on, we don't

602
00:35:24,680 --> 00:35:26,800
Speaker 1: because we don't mess with the white supremacy up and

603
00:35:26,840 --> 00:35:30,040
Speaker 1: here we stomp it, we smash it. It's funny, is

604
00:35:30,080 --> 00:35:34,120
Speaker 1: I actually when I'm describing my wife, I actually try

605
00:35:34,160 --> 00:35:37,400
Speaker 1: to say my wife as little as possible. I tried

606
00:35:37,440 --> 00:35:40,759
Speaker 1: to address about her name anytime I'm talking about her

607
00:35:40,760 --> 00:35:46,200
Speaker 1: because we have slowly moved away from those Western frames

608
00:35:46,200 --> 00:35:49,880
Speaker 1: of thought and relationship. Like I literally do that consciously

609
00:35:49,880 --> 00:35:52,839
Speaker 1: where I'm like, I'm if I'm talking about Mickey, I'm

610
00:35:52,840 --> 00:35:54,800
Speaker 1: talking about me. Even if you don't know my wife,

611
00:35:54,840 --> 00:35:57,319
Speaker 1: I'll say that's my wife, you know, something like that,

612
00:35:57,560 --> 00:35:59,839
Speaker 1: where I'm describing who this person is because like she's

613
00:36:00,560 --> 00:36:03,440
Speaker 1: we we have our own things. We are individuals in

614
00:36:03,560 --> 00:36:08,839
Speaker 1: this in this relationship. Okay, yeah, this is a lot

615
00:36:08,960 --> 00:36:17,920
Speaker 1: of merch. I got a question here. I think that

616
00:36:18,920 --> 00:36:23,200
Speaker 1: when you hear or when we hear polyamorous, you think

617
00:36:23,239 --> 00:36:29,160
Speaker 1: that that you know, it's so great for the for

618
00:36:29,239 --> 00:36:31,920
Speaker 1: the male. You know, he could just go out in

619
00:36:31,920 --> 00:36:35,040
Speaker 1: the world and smash smash the world and then come

620
00:36:35,080 --> 00:36:38,960
Speaker 1: home to a loving family. And I would like to

621
00:36:39,000 --> 00:36:43,239
Speaker 1: ask you, Rohan, what do you feel are the benefits

622
00:36:43,880 --> 00:36:49,600
Speaker 1: for Mickey Bay How does this benefit from your perspective.

623
00:36:49,640 --> 00:36:52,600
Speaker 1: I'm sure she can absolutely answer, and she did how

624
00:36:53,120 --> 00:36:55,400
Speaker 1: well to a certain degree, But you know, how do

625
00:36:55,480 --> 00:37:00,319
Speaker 1: you feel it benefits your partner that you love? On one,

626
00:37:00,400 --> 00:37:03,440
Speaker 1: let me get back to the practicality of what it

627
00:37:03,560 --> 00:37:06,919
Speaker 1: really looks like for me to be Polly and and

628
00:37:06,920 --> 00:37:09,080
Speaker 1: and Mickey and I just had this conversation other day

629
00:37:09,080 --> 00:37:12,000
Speaker 1: where I was like, yeah, I have the capability and

630
00:37:12,120 --> 00:37:15,520
Speaker 1: opportunity to have partners and stuff, but it's not super practical,

631
00:37:16,000 --> 00:37:19,120
Speaker 1: Like it's not practical to be out five nights a

632
00:37:19,120 --> 00:37:22,600
Speaker 1: week with different partners or even one partner just because

633
00:37:22,640 --> 00:37:25,560
Speaker 1: I can, right, So you know I have a capacity

634
00:37:25,880 --> 00:37:27,920
Speaker 1: you know I have a capacity. I can't, you know,

635
00:37:28,000 --> 00:37:30,440
Speaker 1: just be hollering and everybody and having sex with everybody.

636
00:37:30,480 --> 00:37:33,080
Speaker 1: So that that's a misconception that we talked about the

637
00:37:33,120 --> 00:37:36,239
Speaker 1: sex part of it, like that, that's not reality. Right.

638
00:37:36,400 --> 00:37:38,879
Speaker 1: If I'm able to see one person every other week,

639
00:37:39,560 --> 00:37:42,840
Speaker 1: I'm lucky just because life be life it right, um

640
00:37:43,600 --> 00:37:45,919
Speaker 1: uh life? And then I like my own personal time.

641
00:37:45,960 --> 00:37:48,680
Speaker 1: I like time with my family, So it leaves very

642
00:37:48,719 --> 00:37:54,040
Speaker 1: little time for to to to really be fruitful in this, right. Um.

643
00:37:54,080 --> 00:37:56,680
Speaker 1: But it's the freedom, the freedom of mind that I

644
00:37:56,719 --> 00:38:00,200
Speaker 1: can do it. Um. But to answer your question, I

645
00:38:00,239 --> 00:38:02,840
Speaker 1: think the benefit, like she said, like Micky said, I

646
00:38:02,840 --> 00:38:05,719
Speaker 1: think the benefit of it is to know that we

647
00:38:06,000 --> 00:38:09,280
Speaker 1: talk a lot about checking every single box for your partner,

648
00:38:10,040 --> 00:38:12,719
Speaker 1: Like I think for me and hopefully for Mickey, is

649
00:38:12,800 --> 00:38:16,000
Speaker 1: that she doesn't She doesn't have to do that. She

650
00:38:16,080 --> 00:38:19,239
Speaker 1: doesn't have to fulfill every single desire that I have.

651
00:38:19,320 --> 00:38:21,759
Speaker 1: And I'm not even talk about sexually. I'm talking about

652
00:38:21,800 --> 00:38:24,399
Speaker 1: if I want to go my My wife's not a hiker, right,

653
00:38:24,560 --> 00:38:26,600
Speaker 1: but I like the outdoors. I like to be out

654
00:38:26,680 --> 00:38:28,880
Speaker 1: there having fun. I'm on my bike. I like to

655
00:38:28,880 --> 00:38:31,840
Speaker 1: do all these things like I unless I got a

656
00:38:31,880 --> 00:38:34,040
Speaker 1: homeboy that wants to do that with me. I can

657
00:38:34,120 --> 00:38:36,759
Speaker 1: choose to have a female friend that does that, and

658
00:38:36,800 --> 00:38:39,719
Speaker 1: like she said, I can come back fulfilled and the

659
00:38:39,760 --> 00:38:43,000
Speaker 1: things that my wife does do for me. We can

660
00:38:43,040 --> 00:38:47,200
Speaker 1: focus on what we're good at, raising our families, starting businesses,

661
00:38:47,320 --> 00:38:50,160
Speaker 1: loving on each other in the way that we want

662
00:38:50,200 --> 00:38:53,200
Speaker 1: to love on each other without me having to fill

663
00:38:53,320 --> 00:38:58,080
Speaker 1: this box that might be difficult for me or difficult

664
00:38:58,120 --> 00:39:01,880
Speaker 1: for her. Right, we release each other from the things

665
00:39:01,880 --> 00:39:04,839
Speaker 1: that we're not good at together. You know we were.

666
00:39:05,080 --> 00:39:09,359
Speaker 1: It's a release because again, Western Western law tells us

667
00:39:09,440 --> 00:39:15,239
Speaker 1: that your mate has to check all every single one

668
00:39:15,520 --> 00:39:21,120
Speaker 1: and not only today, but forever. And I tell it

669
00:39:21,239 --> 00:39:27,920
Speaker 1: is a insane proposition, right forever, were telling the vows

670
00:39:28,080 --> 00:39:31,799
Speaker 1: forever ever. Now, So you get married at twenty five

671
00:39:31,840 --> 00:39:34,480
Speaker 1: and you love your spouse, right, you're talking about to

672
00:39:34,640 --> 00:39:37,600
Speaker 1: seventy eighty years old, I gotta check every single box

673
00:39:37,600 --> 00:39:40,920
Speaker 1: for you. Right? Did you forget that that married when

674
00:39:40,920 --> 00:39:43,480
Speaker 1: I was nineteen and you on the phone with somebody

675
00:39:43,480 --> 00:39:46,960
Speaker 1: that's been together for twenty five years this September? No? Yea,

676
00:39:47,600 --> 00:39:49,719
Speaker 1: I'm happy he feels free to sell his truth. I mean,

677
00:39:50,320 --> 00:39:53,600
Speaker 1: I'm just saying like, I'm like, I hear you, like,

678
00:39:53,719 --> 00:39:57,480
Speaker 1: that's crazy, And not one single person that's been married

679
00:39:57,560 --> 00:40:01,680
Speaker 1: multiple decades and had that conversation. No, I'm saying, yeah,

680
00:40:01,840 --> 00:40:04,080
Speaker 1: to be able to release each other from that, from

681
00:40:04,120 --> 00:40:06,279
Speaker 1: every single thing you say, you know what, these are

682
00:40:06,280 --> 00:40:08,960
Speaker 1: our five things. Let's make sure we go hard with

683
00:40:09,040 --> 00:40:12,160
Speaker 1: these five whatever whatever number we descernine, but let's go

684
00:40:12,239 --> 00:40:14,879
Speaker 1: hard with these things. Like we have our date night,

685
00:40:15,160 --> 00:40:18,120
Speaker 1: date day, whatever, can't be broken. This is what we

686
00:40:18,200 --> 00:40:21,600
Speaker 1: do on this particular day, right, this is what we do.

687
00:40:21,840 --> 00:40:24,680
Speaker 1: We gotta schedule for our son, you know, we take

688
00:40:24,840 --> 00:40:27,040
Speaker 1: you know, we have lunch, you know, a couple of

689
00:40:27,040 --> 00:40:29,520
Speaker 1: times a week, we have a date night. We figure

690
00:40:29,560 --> 00:40:32,319
Speaker 1: things out. We're doing this now, we're speaking out more so.

691
00:40:32,360 --> 00:40:34,719
Speaker 1: Now this is a part of our life. Right. So

692
00:40:35,760 --> 00:40:38,600
Speaker 1: it's really the release of being able to say, you

693
00:40:38,640 --> 00:40:41,439
Speaker 1: know what, that's that's not on my mikulst. I ain't

694
00:40:41,440 --> 00:40:43,960
Speaker 1: gotta worry about that. But we're focused on the things

695
00:40:44,000 --> 00:40:46,880
Speaker 1: that we're good at together. And you know, one of

696
00:40:46,920 --> 00:40:49,479
Speaker 1: those things is like raising our family and like being

697
00:40:49,520 --> 00:40:51,879
Speaker 1: in real commune with each other. We'll talk about that.

698
00:40:52,200 --> 00:40:55,279
Speaker 1: It's your internal world. The thing is we got on

699
00:40:55,320 --> 00:40:58,879
Speaker 1: this podcast to talk about polyamory, but I think you

700
00:40:58,880 --> 00:41:03,320
Speaker 1: guys have done a lot more to give relationships tools,

701
00:41:03,400 --> 00:41:07,520
Speaker 1: all kinds of relationships tools that they can use. This

702
00:41:07,160 --> 00:41:12,720
Speaker 1: this conversation has really been at its core about that

703
00:41:12,440 --> 00:41:15,360
Speaker 1: and that right there. I don't want that to get

704
00:41:15,360 --> 00:41:17,759
Speaker 1: lost on people, Like if you listen to this body,

705
00:41:17,880 --> 00:41:20,120
Speaker 1: if you're at this point in the podcast and you

706
00:41:20,120 --> 00:41:22,719
Speaker 1: ain't got a jewel yet, I just I don't even

707
00:41:22,760 --> 00:41:25,479
Speaker 1: know more. Can we beef? Are we friends? For real?

708
00:41:26,400 --> 00:41:31,000
Speaker 1: Are we you know what I'm saying? Okay, A lot

709
00:41:31,040 --> 00:41:34,319
Speaker 1: of people jumped to the conclusion. I remember years ago

710
00:41:34,360 --> 00:41:37,200
Speaker 1: I was on Twitter and I was asking how people

711
00:41:37,239 --> 00:41:41,920
Speaker 1: felt about being in a I guess it's polyamory. No,

712
00:41:42,040 --> 00:41:45,120
Speaker 1: I don't think so when you have more than one spouse,

713
00:41:49,080 --> 00:41:51,279
Speaker 1: and I was asking what they felt about it, and

714
00:41:51,440 --> 00:41:55,920
Speaker 1: all of a sudden, it was a range shower of no, jail,

715
00:41:56,600 --> 00:41:59,719
Speaker 1: you can't do that, jail. I didn't think you thought so,

716
00:42:00,120 --> 00:42:08,040
Speaker 1: some of yourself, jil. I actually even presented it for myself.

717
00:42:08,080 --> 00:42:12,200
Speaker 1: I just wanted to hear their thoughts. Don't because y'all

718
00:42:12,200 --> 00:42:14,839
Speaker 1: are enlightened, And that's just people and saddened in their

719
00:42:14,880 --> 00:42:18,520
Speaker 1: little boxes of traditions and they think, you know, this

720
00:42:18,560 --> 00:42:22,360
Speaker 1: relationship or relationship like yours is about some freak ships

721
00:42:22,960 --> 00:42:26,439
Speaker 1: and it's the furthest Yeah, and you know what I think.

722
00:42:26,520 --> 00:42:29,200
Speaker 1: I think it's it's a matter of perspective. And I

723
00:42:29,280 --> 00:42:33,240
Speaker 1: say this every time I have this conversation because black

724
00:42:33,320 --> 00:42:36,839
Speaker 1: people are familiar with this. We were just unethical. You

725
00:42:36,880 --> 00:42:39,880
Speaker 1: had a grandfather, uncle, or somebody who had a whole

726
00:42:39,920 --> 00:42:42,279
Speaker 1: family across the town. We all knew it, and you

727
00:42:42,320 --> 00:42:46,319
Speaker 1: didn't talk about it. Your grandmother knew exactly. You know

728
00:42:46,360 --> 00:42:49,520
Speaker 1: what I'm saying. My grandmother was gonna relate. Oh my god. Yes,

729
00:42:50,719 --> 00:42:53,719
Speaker 1: let's not act like we don't know how to do

730
00:42:53,760 --> 00:42:56,960
Speaker 1: this as a community. We absolutely do. The only thing

731
00:42:57,040 --> 00:43:00,920
Speaker 1: that is different is that everyone is considered team to this.

732
00:43:01,239 --> 00:43:06,359
Speaker 1: My grandmother didn't consent, right, She she accepted, but she

733
00:43:06,400 --> 00:43:08,719
Speaker 1: didn't consent. And I'm not saying my actual grandmother for

734
00:43:08,760 --> 00:43:12,279
Speaker 1: all my family listen, right, But um, I was just saying,

735
00:43:12,320 --> 00:43:17,360
Speaker 1: like for for women generations ago who were in marriages,

736
00:43:17,480 --> 00:43:20,600
Speaker 1: that it was understood. As long as she don't call

737
00:43:20,719 --> 00:43:22,920
Speaker 1: my house and she seen me as she crossed the street,

738
00:43:23,480 --> 00:43:26,280
Speaker 1: we're all good. So let's not act like this has

739
00:43:26,360 --> 00:43:31,440
Speaker 1: not been a part of what our cultural fabric is. Okay.

740
00:43:31,600 --> 00:43:34,360
Speaker 1: And if you take a look at even the celebrities

741
00:43:34,600 --> 00:43:38,719
Speaker 1: who are going through very public nasty um, you know,

742
00:43:38,880 --> 00:43:43,520
Speaker 1: cheating allegations and all kinds of stuff, what could this

743
00:43:43,640 --> 00:43:45,839
Speaker 1: do for you to not have to break up your

744
00:43:45,840 --> 00:43:48,640
Speaker 1: whole entire family if you just felt like you could

745
00:43:48,640 --> 00:43:51,239
Speaker 1: go to your partner and say, hey, I'm feeling like this,

746
00:43:51,920 --> 00:43:54,640
Speaker 1: and I would I like because you know, there are

747
00:43:54,680 --> 00:43:58,560
Speaker 1: all types of situations in marriages. There are people who

748
00:43:58,600 --> 00:44:01,560
Speaker 1: are you know, have hall passes once a year. If

749
00:44:01,600 --> 00:44:04,520
Speaker 1: you go to Brazil to do longest you don't bring

750
00:44:04,520 --> 00:44:06,400
Speaker 1: me on the Dominican Republic if you ain't got as

751
00:44:06,480 --> 00:44:10,480
Speaker 1: much money, okay, Dominican Republic. There are people who are

752
00:44:10,520 --> 00:44:13,960
Speaker 1: having threesomes. That is also ethical nonmonogamy. They don't want

753
00:44:13,960 --> 00:44:16,600
Speaker 1: to call it that, but threesomes are a part of

754
00:44:17,400 --> 00:44:20,719
Speaker 1: underneath the umbrella because you're all consenting to this, right.

755
00:44:21,000 --> 00:44:24,160
Speaker 1: So there are a lot of different ways in which

756
00:44:24,200 --> 00:44:26,920
Speaker 1: you can be open relating, but the key word is

757
00:44:27,040 --> 00:44:31,840
Speaker 1: consensual non monogamy. Right. And also I want to ask

758
00:44:31,920 --> 00:44:35,880
Speaker 1: answer Jill's question um about how does this benefit me?

759
00:44:36,160 --> 00:44:38,840
Speaker 1: And on a larger scale, how does it benefit women?

760
00:44:39,560 --> 00:44:45,480
Speaker 1: So for me, polyamory has been the biggest teacher for

761
00:44:45,680 --> 00:44:48,440
Speaker 1: me about who I am, and it has peeled that

762
00:44:48,520 --> 00:44:51,800
Speaker 1: onion back about who I am because you are forced

763
00:44:52,120 --> 00:44:55,480
Speaker 1: to deal with your own insecurities, you are forced to

764
00:44:55,520 --> 00:44:58,359
Speaker 1: deal with your triggers, you are forced to deal with

765
00:44:58,400 --> 00:45:01,480
Speaker 1: all of those things that you don't necessarily want to

766
00:45:01,520 --> 00:45:04,279
Speaker 1: have to say. But in this situation, I have to

767
00:45:04,480 --> 00:45:07,840
Speaker 1: actually verbalize what I'm feeling and what I'm thinking, or

768
00:45:07,880 --> 00:45:11,879
Speaker 1: else everything will crumble. So I have had to not

769
00:45:12,000 --> 00:45:15,719
Speaker 1: have to. I can't have an internal monologue about this.

770
00:45:16,080 --> 00:45:17,920
Speaker 1: I have to bring it to him. I have to

771
00:45:17,960 --> 00:45:21,280
Speaker 1: be able to say, hey, babe, I'm feeling jealous, Hey babe,

772
00:45:21,320 --> 00:45:24,040
Speaker 1: I'm feeling like I'm not getting enough time. Hey babe,

773
00:45:24,120 --> 00:45:26,600
Speaker 1: I feel like I need you to rub my feet tonight. Hey.

774
00:45:26,640 --> 00:45:29,560
Speaker 1: But whatever it is, and it has taught me to

775
00:45:29,719 --> 00:45:32,640
Speaker 1: have a voice about what I need and what I

776
00:45:32,719 --> 00:45:35,799
Speaker 1: don't need as well, because in my case, like I said,

777
00:45:35,840 --> 00:45:38,759
Speaker 1: with this a sexuality thing, which we are still very

778
00:45:38,840 --> 00:45:43,120
Speaker 1: much figuring out what that means for me, I am demisexual,

779
00:45:43,280 --> 00:45:46,000
Speaker 1: I am grace sexual, I am phrase sexual, which to

780
00:45:46,200 --> 00:45:49,719
Speaker 1: sum it up, Um, it mean I need an emotional

781
00:45:49,760 --> 00:45:52,560
Speaker 1: connection to even think about sex. It means that I

782
00:45:52,640 --> 00:45:57,640
Speaker 1: may have spikes in desire or attraction that maybe years apart. Right,

783
00:45:57,760 --> 00:45:59,960
Speaker 1: I was able to I was able to be cellib

784
00:46:00,000 --> 00:46:02,920
Speaker 1: it for years and not even think about it. And

785
00:46:03,000 --> 00:46:05,760
Speaker 1: I didn't I didn't realize that that was not something

786
00:46:05,800 --> 00:46:08,680
Speaker 1: that people can do. Right, I've always been able to

787
00:46:08,719 --> 00:46:11,719
Speaker 1: do that. I don't have sexual thoughts and desires in

788
00:46:11,760 --> 00:46:14,920
Speaker 1: my brain right, So a lot of my friends will

789
00:46:14,960 --> 00:46:17,440
Speaker 1: tell me, oh, we're fantasizing during the day, and I'm

790
00:46:17,480 --> 00:46:19,359
Speaker 1: like really, like that was news to me. So you

791
00:46:19,360 --> 00:46:21,640
Speaker 1: don't even masturbate then, right, it's a sexual men, you

792
00:46:21,640 --> 00:46:24,759
Speaker 1: don't even masturbate. No, So so that's a big misconception.

793
00:46:24,840 --> 00:46:27,640
Speaker 1: So a sexuality is a huge spectrum and where I

794
00:46:27,840 --> 00:46:30,479
Speaker 1: fall it doesn't mean I don't have any desire, doesn't

795
00:46:30,480 --> 00:46:34,200
Speaker 1: mean I don't have any any attraction. But it's like this,

796
00:46:34,320 --> 00:46:36,239
Speaker 1: it's up and down, it's up and down, and I

797
00:46:36,280 --> 00:46:38,760
Speaker 1: can't solve for what it's going to make me attractive,

798
00:46:38,800 --> 00:46:42,239
Speaker 1: and I cannot solve for what's gonna give me desire. Oh, right,

799
00:46:42,680 --> 00:46:47,040
Speaker 1: that would mean RAHIM would have to be not deeply

800
00:46:47,080 --> 00:46:49,799
Speaker 1: not take that personal so like before knowing that you

801
00:46:49,840 --> 00:46:52,319
Speaker 1: were on the spectrum, it could come across as my

802
00:46:52,320 --> 00:46:55,600
Speaker 1: wife's not attracted to me periods of time without wanting

803
00:46:55,640 --> 00:46:58,320
Speaker 1: to sleep with me, and he could take that personally

804
00:46:58,360 --> 00:47:02,239
Speaker 1: and internalize it understood through that, And I think that

805
00:47:02,400 --> 00:47:05,080
Speaker 1: right there, even black women understanding that they could even

806
00:47:05,120 --> 00:47:09,880
Speaker 1: be on that spectrum is because I can imagine, you know,

807
00:47:09,920 --> 00:47:12,040
Speaker 1: one of the things that people come to us all

808
00:47:12,040 --> 00:47:13,960
Speaker 1: the time, I was, Oh, I feel like I was

809
00:47:14,000 --> 00:47:17,719
Speaker 1: in a loveless marriage or a sexist marriage. Now I'm

810
00:47:17,719 --> 00:47:19,200
Speaker 1: thinking back on so many of the people who have

811
00:47:19,239 --> 00:47:21,880
Speaker 1: said that and thought, Wow, had they known that that

812
00:47:21,960 --> 00:47:24,160
Speaker 1: was a possibility, that's who they could have said who

813
00:47:24,160 --> 00:47:27,520
Speaker 1: they were. I mean, my mind is like blown because

814
00:47:27,560 --> 00:47:31,080
Speaker 1: a lot of the issues that married people talk about

815
00:47:31,840 --> 00:47:35,400
Speaker 1: are interwoven and folded into the conversation that you're talking about.

816
00:47:35,680 --> 00:47:37,960
Speaker 1: Not saying that they were all polyamorous or that that

817
00:47:38,000 --> 00:47:40,919
Speaker 1: would have you know, that would have solved it. I's

818
00:47:40,920 --> 00:47:43,880
Speaker 1: saying that, Just saying that it really kind of circles

819
00:47:43,880 --> 00:47:45,640
Speaker 1: back to what you were saying in the very beginning,

820
00:47:45,680 --> 00:47:48,520
Speaker 1: which was like, this is about you understanding your options

821
00:47:48,800 --> 00:47:51,440
Speaker 1: that you as black people can relate to one another

822
00:47:51,520 --> 00:47:58,879
Speaker 1: in multiple ways. I mean, I'm just saying more conversation

823
00:47:59,120 --> 00:48:13,440
Speaker 1: after the break. Real quick question, when did you guys?

824
00:48:13,520 --> 00:48:16,239
Speaker 1: Because Rahi talked about his daughters who are of a

825
00:48:16,280 --> 00:48:18,319
Speaker 1: certain age and you guys been together. He said it

826
00:48:18,360 --> 00:48:22,239
Speaker 1: was five seven, So when you guys got together, how

827
00:48:22,239 --> 00:48:27,439
Speaker 1: old were the girls? They turned fourteen? Okay this year.

828
00:48:27,680 --> 00:48:30,279
Speaker 1: So at what point or have you I thought that

829
00:48:30,400 --> 00:48:32,320
Speaker 1: you needed to have this conversation? I know you have,

830
00:48:32,440 --> 00:48:35,279
Speaker 1: but for the for the radio, what point did you

831
00:48:35,520 --> 00:48:37,360
Speaker 1: did you think that you needed to have this conversation

832
00:48:37,400 --> 00:48:41,040
Speaker 1: and how did you do that? Um? Well, it was

833
00:48:41,080 --> 00:48:44,480
Speaker 1: what just a couple of years ago that m Um

834
00:48:44,560 --> 00:48:47,120
Speaker 1: we were we were visiting. Actually did we tell them?

835
00:48:47,239 --> 00:48:51,920
Speaker 1: We we did? We told them so, but I told them.

836
00:48:52,000 --> 00:48:54,680
Speaker 1: I thought it was important to tell them because one

837
00:48:54,719 --> 00:48:58,719
Speaker 1: of my daughters, UM told us maybe five years ago

838
00:48:59,239 --> 00:49:03,760
Speaker 1: that she thought she was bisexual. And for a fifteen

839
00:49:03,840 --> 00:49:07,319
Speaker 1: year old to be that open, We've always had that relationship,

840
00:49:07,600 --> 00:49:10,200
Speaker 1: but just to be that open and it was really

841
00:49:10,200 --> 00:49:13,160
Speaker 1: a matter of fact, he dad, guess what it was

842
00:49:13,200 --> 00:49:17,160
Speaker 1: really just stuff like that. So just that because they

843
00:49:17,200 --> 00:49:20,360
Speaker 1: had that openness with me and with us, I just

844
00:49:20,400 --> 00:49:23,520
Speaker 1: thought that it was important to um to make sure

845
00:49:23,600 --> 00:49:26,080
Speaker 1: that you know, we we we told them what our

846
00:49:26,120 --> 00:49:28,360
Speaker 1: lifestyle was like. Especially they were older, you know, so

847
00:49:28,400 --> 00:49:32,400
Speaker 1: they were about eighteen when so, but they were I

848
00:49:32,400 --> 00:49:35,040
Speaker 1: mean sometimes my one of my daughters might ask, are

849
00:49:35,040 --> 00:49:36,719
Speaker 1: you dating? Who are you dating? You know what I mean?

850
00:49:36,760 --> 00:49:39,480
Speaker 1: They haven't met anybody, but they asked questions about it.

851
00:49:39,880 --> 00:49:44,160
Speaker 1: Yeahn I know people have wondered. Yeah, that is incredible

852
00:49:45,320 --> 00:49:49,400
Speaker 1: to be you know, a child growing into you know,

853
00:49:50,239 --> 00:49:52,920
Speaker 1: womanhood and being able to first of all speak to

854
00:49:52,960 --> 00:50:03,839
Speaker 1: her father, you know about that mom, to her black

855
00:50:03,920 --> 00:50:08,320
Speaker 1: gen X daddy. Yeah. Yeah, and then the step mama

856
00:50:08,360 --> 00:50:11,240
Speaker 1: and then my step mama. If I need something else,

857
00:50:11,400 --> 00:50:13,040
Speaker 1: she's gonna care. She's gonna bring it to me. Let

858
00:50:13,040 --> 00:50:14,560
Speaker 1: me know, like bring it down in ways that I

859
00:50:14,560 --> 00:50:18,439
Speaker 1: can understand. Like that's yeah, they were you know. I

860
00:50:18,480 --> 00:50:21,960
Speaker 1: was so happy that they took it the way that

861
00:50:22,000 --> 00:50:24,160
Speaker 1: they did, and it really gave us. They were the

862
00:50:24,200 --> 00:50:27,479
Speaker 1: first people to know, really when it comes to who

863
00:50:27,520 --> 00:50:29,680
Speaker 1: we who we told in the family, they were the

864
00:50:29,719 --> 00:50:33,200
Speaker 1: first family members to know. And I think about that

865
00:50:33,280 --> 00:50:35,640
Speaker 1: all the time that at least they know that you

866
00:50:35,680 --> 00:50:38,120
Speaker 1: do not have to default to monogamy if you don't

867
00:50:38,120 --> 00:50:41,920
Speaker 1: so choose. I was monogamous happily for four years of

868
00:50:41,920 --> 00:50:44,840
Speaker 1: our marriage, right, but I knew that ultimately this was

869
00:50:44,880 --> 00:50:47,239
Speaker 1: not gonna work because I had some things going on

870
00:50:47,239 --> 00:50:49,680
Speaker 1: on the inside of me that I didn't have all

871
00:50:49,719 --> 00:50:53,480
Speaker 1: the information about yet, but I knew something was off right.

872
00:50:53,560 --> 00:50:56,360
Speaker 1: And so I think what my main message to people

873
00:50:56,440 --> 00:50:58,600
Speaker 1: is it may not be Polly, Polly, may not be

874
00:50:58,760 --> 00:51:01,640
Speaker 1: the thing that's for you, but design your life and

875
00:51:01,719 --> 00:51:05,080
Speaker 1: your marriages, your relationships to fit the people who are

876
00:51:05,239 --> 00:51:09,120
Speaker 1: in it, and be willing, be willing to think outside

877
00:51:09,120 --> 00:51:12,600
Speaker 1: of the box to get everything that you need right.

878
00:51:12,640 --> 00:51:16,640
Speaker 1: Because your happiness is your responsibility. That is not something

879
00:51:16,719 --> 00:51:21,239
Speaker 1: I can outsource to anyone partner, husband, anybody. I have

880
00:51:21,360 --> 00:51:24,359
Speaker 1: to make sure that I'm happy within myself first, and

881
00:51:24,440 --> 00:51:28,160
Speaker 1: I think that is what goes into what Jill said

882
00:51:28,200 --> 00:51:30,880
Speaker 1: earlier about people being in miserable marriages. Well, you're a

883
00:51:30,880 --> 00:51:34,200
Speaker 1: miserable person. So if you're a miserable person, you're gonna

884
00:51:34,200 --> 00:51:36,480
Speaker 1: be in a miserable marriage too, so that you're going

885
00:51:36,520 --> 00:51:39,239
Speaker 1: to have to do your own inner work. You're going

886
00:51:39,280 --> 00:51:42,840
Speaker 1: to have to stop making it the other person's problem

887
00:51:42,880 --> 00:51:46,320
Speaker 1: and look at yourselves, look at yourself, because I truly

888
00:51:46,360 --> 00:51:49,880
Speaker 1: believe that anyone can make any relationship work. And the

889
00:51:49,920 --> 00:51:52,360
Speaker 1: reason why I say that is because you guys know

890
00:51:52,440 --> 00:51:54,920
Speaker 1: we didn't. We were complete strangers. We were basically ninety

891
00:51:54,960 --> 00:51:59,160
Speaker 1: day fiance. There is no reason we have outlasted people

892
00:51:59,160 --> 00:52:01,399
Speaker 1: who were together to years and got married and stay

893
00:52:01,440 --> 00:52:10,000
Speaker 1: married a year. I want you to pull out y'all

894
00:52:10,120 --> 00:52:23,640
Speaker 1: favorite right now. I mean, there has to be something,

895
00:52:24,040 --> 00:52:26,120
Speaker 1: There has to be something to it, and I think

896
00:52:26,640 --> 00:52:29,080
Speaker 1: Rahan said it best, which is we choose each other

897
00:52:29,200 --> 00:52:32,640
Speaker 1: every day. My expectation is not that he's perfect, is

898
00:52:32,680 --> 00:52:37,279
Speaker 1: that he's present. My expectation for myself is that I

899
00:52:37,400 --> 00:52:40,759
Speaker 1: show up as myself in every single setting. And I

900
00:52:40,800 --> 00:52:43,160
Speaker 1: have to do that first for myself and then for

901
00:52:43,280 --> 00:52:46,040
Speaker 1: my for my my partner, my person that I'm with

902
00:52:46,280 --> 00:52:48,600
Speaker 1: and sharing life with. And this is ultimately because I

903
00:52:48,640 --> 00:52:50,640
Speaker 1: want to be a really good example for our kids

904
00:52:51,000 --> 00:52:52,960
Speaker 1: that you do get to design your life. You get

905
00:52:53,000 --> 00:52:55,719
Speaker 1: to be, do or have anything that you want, and

906
00:52:55,800 --> 00:53:01,520
Speaker 1: that includes marriage, no marriage, multiple marriages, whatever is Can

907
00:53:01,600 --> 00:53:03,239
Speaker 1: I just add I'm sorry, I was just I was

908
00:53:03,280 --> 00:53:04,719
Speaker 1: looking at my text with me and around he real

909
00:53:04,800 --> 00:53:07,080
Speaker 1: quick and I just wanted to mention this because Mickey

910
00:53:07,080 --> 00:53:09,080
Speaker 1: Bay talked about her manifest stations and things that led

911
00:53:09,120 --> 00:53:12,280
Speaker 1: to her finding her husband, and as Ran was telling

912
00:53:12,280 --> 00:53:14,560
Speaker 1: his story, he may not have admitted to this, or

913
00:53:14,560 --> 00:53:18,000
Speaker 1: maybe he forgot, but before he started really knowing what

914
00:53:18,080 --> 00:53:21,880
Speaker 1: the manifestation, he was manifesting you. And it's so interesting

915
00:53:21,920 --> 00:53:24,080
Speaker 1: to see the circle back as his friends sitting there

916
00:53:24,440 --> 00:53:27,320
Speaker 1: listening to him tell me exactly what he wanted and

917
00:53:27,560 --> 00:53:31,399
Speaker 1: his wife and we're like looking at her, like, this

918
00:53:31,480 --> 00:53:33,560
Speaker 1: is a man who said we would sit that light here.

919
00:53:33,600 --> 00:53:35,719
Speaker 1: This is what I want, I wanted, I have to

920
00:53:35,760 --> 00:53:38,520
Speaker 1: have it. This is I'm just so proud. I'm just

921
00:53:38,560 --> 00:53:41,680
Speaker 1: so proud of y'all. Like he is a master manifest

922
00:53:41,719 --> 00:53:45,279
Speaker 1: er um. And he did not he did not say this,

923
00:53:45,440 --> 00:53:48,239
Speaker 1: but one of the very sweet things that he did.

924
00:53:48,640 --> 00:53:51,880
Speaker 1: We had one conversation before we went to breakfast that

925
00:53:52,000 --> 00:53:56,080
Speaker 1: next day, and he wrote in his notes that I

926
00:53:56,120 --> 00:53:59,400
Speaker 1: think I found my wife. Her name is Mickey Bay

927
00:53:59,520 --> 00:54:02,960
Speaker 1: and I will only changed this note if something changes.

928
00:54:03,080 --> 00:54:05,600
Speaker 1: But he said that before we even met, so he

929
00:54:05,719 --> 00:54:08,840
Speaker 1: and his spirit also knew. And this is why I

930
00:54:08,920 --> 00:54:12,319
Speaker 1: do what I do, because I truly believe that anybody

931
00:54:12,400 --> 00:54:16,640
Speaker 1: can have love if they really look in themselves and say,

932
00:54:16,680 --> 00:54:18,480
Speaker 1: you know what, I believe that I can attract the

933
00:54:18,520 --> 00:54:21,120
Speaker 1: love that I want. And he did that and I

934
00:54:21,160 --> 00:54:25,440
Speaker 1: did that as well. Yes, listen, let's let's put some

935
00:54:25,520 --> 00:54:35,840
Speaker 1: applause up, proud. I'm just saying, you have one more question, um,

936
00:54:36,040 --> 00:54:38,279
Speaker 1: because this is I'm taking notes and everything like this

937
00:54:38,360 --> 00:54:42,040
Speaker 1: is great. Okay, Yeah, I mean, m one more question.

938
00:54:42,920 --> 00:54:49,600
Speaker 1: Since you too have been really public about your your relationship,

939
00:54:50,719 --> 00:54:53,240
Speaker 1: how do you deal with the people that are coming

940
00:54:53,400 --> 00:54:57,920
Speaker 1: with the with the you know, the confusion and the

941
00:54:58,040 --> 00:55:01,759
Speaker 1: judgment and the whole vitryo all of it all. How

942
00:55:01,760 --> 00:55:04,919
Speaker 1: are you how are you dealing with that? Well, it's funny.

943
00:55:05,000 --> 00:55:07,399
Speaker 1: Micky just just say other day and said, look, I'm

944
00:55:07,520 --> 00:55:09,760
Speaker 1: used to some of this stuff. I've done some line

945
00:55:09,880 --> 00:55:12,000
Speaker 1: like stuff and I'm used to a little bit of hate.

946
00:55:12,280 --> 00:55:14,520
Speaker 1: You new to it. And I said, you know what,

947
00:55:14,640 --> 00:55:17,080
Speaker 1: I don't mind because I know what the truth is, right,

948
00:55:17,239 --> 00:55:19,200
Speaker 1: I know what the truth is, like, I know what

949
00:55:19,320 --> 00:55:23,040
Speaker 1: my relationship is based on. And I actually find the

950
00:55:23,080 --> 00:55:25,600
Speaker 1: comments funny. I mean, I'll go back and forth with

951
00:55:25,640 --> 00:55:27,520
Speaker 1: you too, because at the end of the day, I'm

952
00:55:27,520 --> 00:55:30,640
Speaker 1: going to educate you like I want to educate you.

953
00:55:30,920 --> 00:55:34,520
Speaker 1: I expect you to be an a sayer. I expect

954
00:55:34,560 --> 00:55:38,879
Speaker 1: you not to understand right, So I literally just oh, word,

955
00:55:38,920 --> 00:55:41,320
Speaker 1: that's how you feel? Well, how about this? How about

956
00:55:41,360 --> 00:55:43,879
Speaker 1: you think about it this way? Like I'm I'm all

957
00:55:43,960 --> 00:55:48,120
Speaker 1: about shifting a conversation somebody on Instagram was saying, how

958
00:55:48,600 --> 00:55:51,400
Speaker 1: I'm going to divorce my wife after, you know, I

959
00:55:51,520 --> 00:55:54,680
Speaker 1: realized that she's been with another man and that that

960
00:55:54,680 --> 00:55:57,359
Speaker 1: that he did this tour and once I think about it,

961
00:55:57,520 --> 00:55:59,640
Speaker 1: I'm gonna want to divorce. I'm like, You've been in

962
00:55:59,680 --> 00:56:02,480
Speaker 1: this for almost three years, bro, We've we've been seeing

963
00:56:02,640 --> 00:56:05,719
Speaker 1: all the different iterations of her being in love, her

964
00:56:05,800 --> 00:56:08,680
Speaker 1: being having a breakup, me having a breakup, and having

965
00:56:08,719 --> 00:56:13,680
Speaker 1: to nurture her after she's stopped seeing somebody and vice versa.

966
00:56:13,880 --> 00:56:16,799
Speaker 1: Like we've seen it all. We talk about the emotions

967
00:56:16,840 --> 00:56:20,839
Speaker 1: that goes into what what how I feel about how

968
00:56:20,880 --> 00:56:23,680
Speaker 1: she's feeling outside the house, Like We've done all that.

969
00:56:23,840 --> 00:56:28,160
Speaker 1: So I'm already able to steer conversations of people who

970
00:56:28,200 --> 00:56:32,280
Speaker 1: would you know, like you said the vitriol, I'm able

971
00:56:32,320 --> 00:56:35,440
Speaker 1: to steer those conversations into some kind of education, And

972
00:56:35,480 --> 00:56:37,120
Speaker 1: by the time I get to the education point, it

973
00:56:37,280 --> 00:56:39,080
Speaker 1: was like, well, it's not a thing. I get that

974
00:56:39,160 --> 00:56:41,640
Speaker 1: so much, where they's just like, well, I'm not trying

975
00:56:41,680 --> 00:56:44,120
Speaker 1: to argue, well, neither of mine. I'm trying to educate,

976
00:56:44,360 --> 00:56:47,480
Speaker 1: Like I'm all about educating people because like Micky said,

977
00:56:47,520 --> 00:56:50,600
Speaker 1: at the beginning, people do not even know that this

978
00:56:50,640 --> 00:56:54,919
Speaker 1: is an option. And you go forty years unmarried person

979
00:56:54,960 --> 00:56:57,080
Speaker 1: go forty years, no one. The relationship is supposed to

980
00:56:57,120 --> 00:56:59,400
Speaker 1: be one thing, and then we come with the curveball

981
00:56:59,560 --> 00:57:02,200
Speaker 1: and it's like, oh no, they ain't how I supposed

982
00:57:02,200 --> 00:57:04,440
Speaker 1: to go because that's not my my mama did. The

983
00:57:04,480 --> 00:57:07,479
Speaker 1: resentment of being able of having to think, of having

984
00:57:07,520 --> 00:57:11,200
Speaker 1: to think critically about your life situation. It is the

985
00:57:11,280 --> 00:57:13,839
Speaker 1: people resent the fact that they have not been able

986
00:57:13,880 --> 00:57:16,280
Speaker 1: to get to that point themselves, and they take it

987
00:57:16,320 --> 00:57:19,480
Speaker 1: personally when it's just a moment, it's a moment to

988
00:57:19,600 --> 00:57:22,840
Speaker 1: release yourself from that. It's a moment to learn. And

989
00:57:22,920 --> 00:57:25,640
Speaker 1: one thing I've learned in two was that it's a

990
00:57:25,680 --> 00:57:28,560
Speaker 1: difficult thing for people to learn. And the other part

991
00:57:28,720 --> 00:57:31,560
Speaker 1: is we're getting I get just in the same amount

992
00:57:31,560 --> 00:57:33,840
Speaker 1: of people who are saying, how can I have this

993
00:57:33,920 --> 00:57:37,920
Speaker 1: conversation with my spouse, like whoa you like, We've done

994
00:57:38,120 --> 00:57:41,120
Speaker 1: what like five podcasts of lines in the last week,

995
00:57:41,360 --> 00:57:44,320
Speaker 1: and I'm getting people saying, Yo, I thought I was

996
00:57:44,400 --> 00:57:49,240
Speaker 1: abnormal for for thinking that I could have a different

997
00:57:49,280 --> 00:57:53,360
Speaker 1: relationship monogamy. It's crazy to me. I'm sorry I have

998
00:57:53,440 --> 00:57:55,920
Speaker 1: this question because we were out of time, but but

999
00:57:56,000 --> 00:57:57,880
Speaker 1: we talked about this earlier and I got to ask

1000
00:57:57,920 --> 00:58:01,040
Speaker 1: you before we go, what would you say or how

1001
00:58:01,160 --> 00:58:03,920
Speaker 1: is it? Or do you have the ability to like

1002
00:58:04,200 --> 00:58:07,720
Speaker 1: weed out when you're talking to other men and it

1003
00:58:07,760 --> 00:58:12,480
Speaker 1: feels like their intention towards polyamory could be a little predatory, Like,

1004
00:58:14,120 --> 00:58:20,040
Speaker 1: oh my gosh, so this is something that is very

1005
00:58:20,040 --> 00:58:23,400
Speaker 1: different on my end. So men typically do not care

1006
00:58:23,560 --> 00:58:26,440
Speaker 1: that I'm married, right, so I can meet a monogamous

1007
00:58:26,560 --> 00:58:30,240
Speaker 1: end quote man who I tell I'm polyamorous and I'm

1008
00:58:30,240 --> 00:58:32,560
Speaker 1: buried and they don't care. They're like, whatever, I still

1009
00:58:32,600 --> 00:58:35,240
Speaker 1: want to date you, right. Well, the problem comes in

1010
00:58:35,520 --> 00:58:39,000
Speaker 1: with your monogamous thinking because at some point, like while

1011
00:58:39,040 --> 00:58:41,120
Speaker 1: you don't know me and you don't have any feelings

1012
00:58:41,200 --> 00:58:43,520
Speaker 1: for me, is cool, But the minute you start to

1013
00:58:43,560 --> 00:58:46,160
Speaker 1: catch feelings, then you're gonna be like, well, I need

1014
00:58:46,160 --> 00:58:48,240
Speaker 1: to see you this day or I can't. I got

1015
00:58:48,280 --> 00:58:50,480
Speaker 1: something going on, you know, at my house with a son,

1016
00:58:50,560 --> 00:58:54,400
Speaker 1: with my husband whatever, and they cannot take it. So

1017
00:58:54,600 --> 00:58:58,400
Speaker 1: I have steered away, and I have literally like cut

1018
00:58:58,440 --> 00:59:02,360
Speaker 1: off people because they just don't have the mindset to

1019
00:59:02,480 --> 00:59:05,280
Speaker 1: be able to be really a part of this, because

1020
00:59:05,280 --> 00:59:09,000
Speaker 1: we really pride ourselves on community and we want people

1021
00:59:09,200 --> 00:59:11,560
Speaker 1: our partners. We want these people to be a part

1022
00:59:11,600 --> 00:59:15,400
Speaker 1: of our family, right, even if it's peripherally. We don't

1023
00:59:15,440 --> 00:59:18,800
Speaker 1: want people bringing a certain type of energy to our

1024
00:59:18,840 --> 00:59:22,120
Speaker 1: household and to each other, right, And so I think

1025
00:59:22,160 --> 00:59:25,760
Speaker 1: both of us have been really good about making sure

1026
00:59:25,800 --> 00:59:30,720
Speaker 1: that we're choosing people who fit with our energy and

1027
00:59:30,840 --> 00:59:33,680
Speaker 1: understand our values and what we're trying to do here.

1028
00:59:33,960 --> 00:59:37,080
Speaker 1: I always say the women that I have met that

1029
00:59:37,320 --> 00:59:40,880
Speaker 1: Raheim has dated, I would be friends with all of them,

1030
00:59:40,960 --> 00:59:43,840
Speaker 1: and some of them I do have friendships with because

1031
00:59:43,880 --> 00:59:47,560
Speaker 1: they are dope women. And when we did our lives,

1032
00:59:47,560 --> 00:59:49,400
Speaker 1: I had one of my friends on there like please

1033
00:59:49,440 --> 00:59:52,120
Speaker 1: get my give your husband my mother, right. I mean,

1034
00:59:52,160 --> 01:00:01,520
Speaker 1: there are people they're looking for about that. It It

1035
01:00:01,640 --> 01:00:05,160
Speaker 1: didn't know, but it happens. And I think that the

1036
01:00:05,320 --> 01:00:08,680
Speaker 1: more we are having these types of conversations, I welcome

1037
01:00:08,800 --> 01:00:13,680
Speaker 1: people to ask questions and to figure out, you know,

1038
01:00:14,040 --> 01:00:16,720
Speaker 1: if this could be something that is right for them

1039
01:00:16,800 --> 01:00:18,600
Speaker 1: or not. I love man. You don't think anything's wrong

1040
01:00:18,600 --> 01:00:20,400
Speaker 1: with Manoby. I just think that there's more than one

1041
01:00:20,400 --> 01:00:24,880
Speaker 1: way to skin a cat. M hm. That is and

1042
01:00:24,960 --> 01:00:28,640
Speaker 1: there it is a cat. Go girl. I used to

1043
01:00:28,680 --> 01:00:31,680
Speaker 1: say back in the day that you know, if I

1044
01:00:31,680 --> 01:00:34,080
Speaker 1: could afford it, why can't I have more than one husband?

1045
01:00:34,440 --> 01:00:38,840
Speaker 1: There you go afford it. You know what. One of

1046
01:00:38,840 --> 01:00:42,439
Speaker 1: the things I always say to people is if you had,

1047
01:00:42,920 --> 01:00:44,640
Speaker 1: just like you said, if you had all the money

1048
01:00:44,680 --> 01:00:48,080
Speaker 1: that you that you that you needed. You have money,

1049
01:00:48,400 --> 01:00:52,560
Speaker 1: you pair of shoes, more than one car, more than

1050
01:00:52,600 --> 01:00:57,320
Speaker 1: one and everything. But when it comes to relationships, it

1051
01:00:57,520 --> 01:01:00,960
Speaker 1: just don't make us feel that. Don't do it in

1052
01:01:08,840 --> 01:01:18,720
Speaker 1: so you think you better than me. All I can

1053
01:01:18,800 --> 01:01:21,680
Speaker 1: say about that is that I changed my perspective when

1054
01:01:21,680 --> 01:01:25,240
Speaker 1: I found the person. Um, how do I know that

1055
01:01:26,080 --> 01:01:28,880
Speaker 1: in ten years it will be the same. I don't

1056
01:01:28,920 --> 01:01:36,000
Speaker 1: know that. But currently I'm enjoying my monogamy, and you know,

1057
01:01:36,120 --> 01:01:42,200
Speaker 1: I really believe that. Sincerely, it is to each his

1058
01:01:42,440 --> 01:01:45,880
Speaker 1: or her own. Thank you so much for listening to

1059
01:01:46,000 --> 01:01:49,520
Speaker 1: Jay dot Il the podcast. This has been eye opening.

1060
01:01:50,000 --> 01:01:54,720
Speaker 1: We are having conversation to spark conversation and action. Thank

1061
01:01:54,720 --> 01:02:03,160
Speaker 1: you so much. Yeah, how do you eat an elephant?

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Speaker 1: One by it? Kid? Hey listeners? Is Amber your producer here?

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Speaker 1: I hope this episode sparked some conversations and broadens your perspectives.

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Speaker 1: My favorite takeaway from this one was that we have choices.

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01:02:21,320 --> 01:02:24,600
Speaker 1: We have choices young, we can evolve in whatever ways

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Speaker 1: feel good to us. We are not a monolith confined

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Speaker 1: to one way of being, one way of loving or

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01:02:31,080 --> 01:02:33,600
Speaker 1: having a family. And if you want to explore the

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Speaker 1: polyamorous lifestyle more in depth making a raheem, recommend two books.

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Speaker 1: One The Ethical Slat what a title. This guide helps

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01:02:43,240 --> 01:02:47,560
Speaker 1: you navigate the infinite possibilities that open relationships can offer

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01:02:47,920 --> 01:02:51,720
Speaker 1: into The book is called More Than Two A Practical

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Speaker 1: Guide to Ethical Polyamory. Now. This book dies into the

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01:02:56,160 --> 01:02:59,880
Speaker 1: history of non monogamy and the joys and very real

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Speaker 1: challenges of navigating modern polyamory. Love is love is love

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01:03:07,720 --> 01:03:12,080
Speaker 1: is love above all, no matter what lifestyle you prescribed

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Speaker 1: to I hope that your love is safe, deeply nourishing

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Speaker 1: an abundant love. You was HI If you have comments

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Speaker 1: on something you said in this episode called eight six six. Hey, Jill,

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01:03:39,720 --> 01:03:42,400
Speaker 1: if you want to add to this conversation, that's eight

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01:03:42,480 --> 01:03:46,520
Speaker 1: six six nine five four five five. Don't forget to

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01:03:46,560 --> 01:03:49,040
Speaker 1: tell us your name and the episode you're referring to.

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01:03:49,520 --> 01:03:52,800
Speaker 1: You might just hear your message on a future episode.

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Speaker 1: Thank you for listening to Jill Scott Presents Jay dot Ill.

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Speaker 1: The podcast j dot ill is a production of I

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Speaker 1: heart Radio. For more podcasts from I heart Radio, visit

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01:04:08,040 --> 01:04:12,280
Speaker 1: the i heart Radio app, Apple podcast, or wherever you

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Speaker 1: listen to your favorite shows.