Speaker 1: This is quite a wall here.
Speaker 2: Oh, these are some great photos.
Speaker 3: That's Jimmy Carter enough me. Uh huh, yes, me and
Speaker 3: Lorena Lynn. How did this come about? She was given
Speaker 3: a concert in Burman Allen.
Speaker 4: Uh huh.
Speaker 3: Carry me backstage to leader.
Speaker 2: Look at this.
Speaker 5: Suit that you have on.
Speaker 2: Maybe you've never heard of Bill Baxley, but here in
Speaker 2: Alabama he's a big deal.
Speaker 3: That Johnny Cash.
Speaker 6: Oh wow.
Speaker 2: Baxley is eighty two, slightly balding, with silver hair and eyebrows.
Speaker 2: In the pictures he's showing me on the wall of
Speaker 2: his office, I see him looking younger. His hair is dark,
Speaker 2: and he's standing with famous musicians and politicians.
Speaker 3: That's my daddy swearing me in for my first term.
Speaker 7: Wow.
Speaker 2: Baxley was elected as Alabama's Attorney General when he was
Speaker 2: just twenty eight years old. He later served as lieutenant governor,
Speaker 2: and he's still practicing law today. During his career, Baxley
Speaker 2: prosecuted hundreds of cases and sent three people to Alabama's
Speaker 2: death row.
Speaker 3: There are some crimes that are so wrong and so
Speaker 3: horrible that they only deserve one punishment.
Speaker 2: He's a lifelong defender of the death penalty, a true believer,
Speaker 2: like when the US Supreme Court outlawed the death penalty
Speaker 2: in the nineteen seventies, Baxley worked hard to bring executions
Speaker 2: back to Alabama. He's that kind of true believer. So
Speaker 2: it's not surprising that Baxley was skeptical when his son,
Speaker 2: who's also an attorney, asked his dad to look over
Speaker 2: a case because he believed an innocent man was on
Speaker 2: death row.
Speaker 3: Over the course of my long career, I've had dozens
Speaker 3: and dozens answances were these I'll call them do gooders,
Speaker 3: but they're good people. They take up there's causes of
Speaker 3: people that have been sentenced to death, and they get
Speaker 3: interested in trying to help them, and they all think
Speaker 3: they're always innocent.
Speaker 2: Baxley didn't even glance at the case file until weeks later.
Speaker 2: On an icy winter morning, it was too slippery to
Speaker 2: walk down the driveway and grab the newspaper, so he
Speaker 2: picked up the file that his son sent him and
Speaker 2: began reading about a black man named to Forrest Johnson,
Speaker 2: who was sentenced to death for killing a shriff's deputy.
Speaker 3: I mean, mid morning, I couldn't believe what I was reading.
Speaker 3: I wouldn't have believed that something like this could have happened.
Speaker 2: What was so unbelievable about it?
Speaker 3: Everything? Everything. I don't know how the guy got indicted,
Speaker 3: how they got I didn't see how the jury convicted him.
Speaker 3: I would have never believed that that could have happened
Speaker 3: in Alabama, no question mine. This guy was not guilty
Speaker 3: of this crime, and I couldn't comprehend how this could happen.
Speaker 2: There's only one other case where Basley thought the defendants
Speaker 2: were innocent, and that case is almost one hundred years old.
Speaker 2: So what is it about this case to Forrest's case
Speaker 2: that convinced Backsley that Alabama is trying to execute an
Speaker 2: innocent man's.
Speaker 3: It's a unique absurdity that I've never seen before. It's
Speaker 3: too late to give him back all those years he's
Speaker 3: been on death road, but it's not too late to
Speaker 3: correct it today and get him out for the future.
Speaker 3: It's wrong that it's gone this long. It's still not
Speaker 3: too late to correct.
Speaker 2: My name is Beth Shelburne. Like Bill Baxley, I was
Speaker 2: born and raised in all Obama. I grew up about
Speaker 2: a mile away from where the crime at the center
Speaker 2: of this story took place. I'm a journalist and writer,
Speaker 2: and for the last three years I've been investigating the
Speaker 2: case that rocked Bill Baxley's world. The story begins on
Speaker 2: a hot July night in nineteen ninety five. It unfolds
Speaker 2: in two places at once, the Crown Sterling Sweet's Hotel
Speaker 2: and a nightclub that's almost four miles away called Tea's Place.
Speaker 2: By the end of the night, one man will be
Speaker 2: shot dead and two others will encounter someone who will
Speaker 2: put them at the center of the murder investigation to
Speaker 2: Forrest Johnson is still on death row and he's running
Speaker 2: out of time. I'm Beth Shelburne. This is ear witness,
Speaker 2: Chapter one, Behind the Out.
Speaker 8: Yes, ma'am, this is very calling from Crowns Drilling Sweet's
Speaker 8: Hotel in Birmingham, Alabama. I'm calling because I've had several
Speaker 8: guests report what appears on the windows to have been
Speaker 8: two gunshots and people running in the parking lot.
Speaker 2: It's twelve fifty five am on July nineteenth, nineteen ninety five.
Speaker 9: It's twenty three great fight.
Speaker 8: That is correct. I have security on the premises, which
Speaker 8: is just to the county police, but I'm calling you
Speaker 8: because i want to make sure that the Birmingham pleats arrived.
Speaker 8: Please all right, we'll get the one out, thank you
Speaker 8: very much.
Speaker 10: All right.
Speaker 2: The Crown Sterling Suites Hotel was a nine story building
Speaker 2: in Birmingham. Today the hotel is an embassy suites. Inside
Speaker 2: the main entrance of the hotel, there's a pale tiled
Speaker 2: walkway that leads through the lobby. The front desk is
Speaker 2: to the left, but keep walking past it and you
Speaker 2: enter a huge atrium, an open space surrounded by windows,
Speaker 2: with an indoor garden of leafy green plants and trees.
Speaker 2: The tiled walkway leads to a coy pond with a
Speaker 2: fountain at the center. It's lush and humid inside, but
Speaker 2: despite all the windows, the field is dim and moody.
Speaker 2: Keep walking past the coy pond and there's a short
Speaker 2: hall that leads to the hotel's back parking lot. It
Speaker 2: was here outside the double doors of the Crown Sterling
Speaker 2: Sweet's Hotel where a deputy sheriff was killed. No one
Speaker 2: saw the murder, but a few people heard gunshots.
Speaker 7: I remember hearing popping noises from the distance.
Speaker 2: Barry Rushikov was working at the front desk when he
Speaker 2: made that nine to one one call.
Speaker 7: When I heard it, I believe that's when I tried
Speaker 7: to call Officer Hardy on the radio with no response.
Speaker 2: Officer William Hardy, who went by Bill, had been a
Speaker 2: deputy with the Jefferson County Sheriff's Office for twenty three years.
Speaker 2: He was also a security guard at the hotel, where
Speaker 2: he worked the night shift to make extra money. Hardy
Speaker 2: was five foot ten, had a thin mustache, and wore
Speaker 2: his hair in a Jerry curl. He was known to
Speaker 2: be easy going and friendly. When Deputy Hardy wasn't making
Speaker 2: hotel security rounds, Barry usually saw him wearing his brown
Speaker 2: and tan deputy uniform, sitting at one of the tables
Speaker 2: in the hotel's atrium, smoking more brand menthol cigarettes and
Speaker 2: drinking coffee.
Speaker 7: You know, when I worked there, and when I was
Speaker 7: working nights, it was me, you know, Officer Hardy or
Speaker 7: whatever officer on duty, and or we would sometime have
Speaker 7: a houseman who is cleaning floors or something, but very
Speaker 7: minimal group and I never felt unsafe.
Speaker 2: Barry wasn't the only person to hear the popping noises.
Speaker 2: A few guests at the hotel also heard gunshots, including
Speaker 2: Marshall Kelly Cummings a guest in a fourth floor room
Speaker 2: directly above the hotel's back exit.
Speaker 5: I can remember like it was yesterday, ma as far
Speaker 5: as the details.
Speaker 2: As I worked on this project, I started referring to
Speaker 2: Cummings as the Keebler cookie guy, because in nineteen ninety
Speaker 2: five he worked for Keebler as a truck driver Midfield.
Speaker 5: When I was with Keebler driving one of their step
Speaker 5: vans delivering cookies and crackers and stuff, and we had.
Speaker 2: A Cummings was staying at the Crown Sterling for a
Speaker 2: company training. After the workday was over, he drank a
Speaker 2: few beers at the hotel bar with some coworkers, and
Speaker 2: then he and the other Keepler employee he was rooming
Speaker 2: with turned in between ten and eleven PM. But Cummings
Speaker 2: was not asleep for long, but he.
Speaker 11: Just I woke up and it was I kept hearing
Speaker 11: somebody talk kind of talk.
Speaker 2: So you heard some voices and it sounded like they
Speaker 2: were arguing or not.
Speaker 11: Really bad, but they were.
Speaker 2: Having a conversation.
Speaker 1: Yeah it was male voices.
Speaker 11: Yeah.
Speaker 5: Well they quit arguing and then I didn't hear anything.
Speaker 5: So I laid back down and it probably wasn't twenty seconds,
Speaker 5: thirty seconds, forty five. I'm got I didn't count boom,
Speaker 5: small caliber gun. They won a big caliber and I'll
Speaker 5: sudden the few sects or a boom about the second time,
Speaker 5: I say, up a minute, that was a gun.
Speaker 2: He remembers, turning to the coworker he was sharing a
Speaker 2: room with.
Speaker 11: I said, you hear that? He says, yeah.
Speaker 5: So I stood up and opened the blind to get
Speaker 5: my eyes fixed because it was dark.
Speaker 11: Then they had the lights in the last week.
Speaker 2: Directly beneath his window, Cummings sees a four door car.
Speaker 2: It's dark copper or light brown with a vinyl top,
Speaker 2: parked facing the hotel's back double doors. He sees a
Speaker 2: tall person get into the driver's side of the car,
Speaker 2: close the door, and slowly pull away with the headlights off.
Speaker 11: And so I called down to the front desk. I said, hey,
Speaker 11: there's been shots fired. I heard. Did you hear that?
Speaker 7: I believe I got a phone call from someone in
Speaker 7: the room saying they heard gunshots.
Speaker 2: So Barry makes that initial nine one one call, hangs
Speaker 2: up and decides to investigate it.
Speaker 7: Jumped over the counter to walk back, and I was
Speaker 7: walked back. I saw Offsta Hardy's radio.
Speaker 2: Barry sees Deputy Hardy's radio on a table in the
Speaker 2: hotel's atrium, and right next to it his cigarette still
Speaker 2: burning in an ash tray. Meanwhile, back on the fourth floor,
Speaker 2: Marshall Kelly Cummings hangs up the phone with Barry and
Speaker 2: goes back to the window.
Speaker 11: And I kept looking, and I kept looking.
Speaker 5: Finally my eyes got to where I could see, and
Speaker 5: I looked down and I could see him laying on
Speaker 5: the ground.
Speaker 11: I went, oh, no, this ain't good.
Speaker 2: Cummings spots a body on the ground and realizes someone
Speaker 2: has been badly hurt. It's right around this time Barry
Speaker 2: makes the same terrible discovery.
Speaker 7: Here's a hallway that went to the door that went
Speaker 7: back out to the back parking lot. Turn in the
Speaker 7: corner to go down that hallway, and I looked out
Speaker 7: the door in the distance, I saw Offsta Hardy on
Speaker 7: the ground. That's when I ran back to the front desk,
Speaker 7: made an emergency phone call to the police.
Speaker 8: Just, ma'am, the spiritual cross to exist, and I have
Speaker 8: a pit what appears to be a Jupanan County police
Speaker 8: officer shot in the back of our building. She ends
Speaker 8: up moving people.
Speaker 10: In a car drove away and you see he's lying
Speaker 10: on the on the pavement.
Speaker 8: I'm a little afraid to go up.
Speaker 10: Yes, he is a Birmingham Police Office.
Speaker 8: Jefferson County. He is a hired nine time security for us.
Speaker 4: Right, do you know if you can sign.
Speaker 6: Out anything like if you breathe?
Speaker 8: I and how much blood? I'm trying, man, my, my,
Speaker 8: my promise. I don't know if the people are still
Speaker 8: out there.
Speaker 10: Okay, we we should be there showing that you find
Speaker 10: very much.
Speaker 8: I'm gonna go and talk about okay, but you.
Speaker 7: Go.
Speaker 10: Jesson's Catty debut has been shot on the back entrance
Speaker 10: of the Hotel Crown show sweep.
Speaker 5: It is one of us, and we are they have
Speaker 5: got one down who has been shot.
Speaker 10: And they said it looks great and it looks too bad.
Speaker 10: Three three two. Do we have any information? Do we
Speaker 10: have anything on a suspect to go anywhere?
Speaker 2: After he makes the second nine to one one call,
Speaker 2: Barry walks down the hallway to the back parking lot
Speaker 2: and then I went.
Speaker 7: Back out the office. Already he was not a good condition.
Speaker 7: He did have a wound to his face. He was
Speaker 7: making a gurgling, gasping noise. You know, he was not conscious.
Speaker 7: I believe I took my jacket off, my uniform jacket off,
Speaker 7: to try to cover him, or put under his head,
Speaker 7: or try to comfort him. But fortunately officers arrived so
Speaker 7: quickly and I was removed from that area immediately.
Speaker 2: More than a dozen officers from four different agencies arrive
Speaker 2: at the hotel. One of them is Detective Tony Richardson,
Speaker 2: who says he'd known Deputy Hardy since he first started
Speaker 2: working for the Jefferson County Sheriff's Office in nineteen seventy eight.
Speaker 9: Being black and bo being black, naturally I noticed him.
Speaker 9: I was told more than once to get a haircut.
Speaker 9: That you know, to be a deputy Shaff, you got
Speaker 9: to have your haircut. So the reason I mentioned that
Speaker 9: is because from the first day that I ever saw him,
Speaker 9: his hair was out.
Speaker 1: To hear big afro, big afro.
Speaker 11: And he would put on his hat. He wore that
Speaker 11: hat religiously.
Speaker 9: Everybody else's the Shaff's office hated those hats. They didn't
Speaker 9: want to wear him, you know, but he always.
Speaker 11: Wore his hat.
Speaker 2: Deputy Hardy often wore his traditional broad brimmed tan smoky
Speaker 2: the bear style sheriff's hat. It was later entered as
Speaker 2: evidence from the crime scene with a bullet hole through
Speaker 2: the brim.
Speaker 9: And he would have it on his head and all
Speaker 9: that hair would be on the side would be out here,
Speaker 9: And I'm like, who is this guy? How can he.
Speaker 11: Get away with that? And not only that, he is
Speaker 11: in the sheriff's office. How can he get away with that?
Speaker 9: So I was in tree by him, fascinated by him,
Speaker 9: but I was scared of him. I was scared to
Speaker 9: meet him because I thought, of my mind, this guy's
Speaker 9: got to be crazy, you know, to do that and
Speaker 9: get away with it, He's got to be great.
Speaker 11: I would scatter of him.
Speaker 9: But anyway, when I first met him, I met him
Speaker 9: and talked to him. He started to feel better about well.
Speaker 11: I started to feel better about him.
Speaker 9: We were never just busom buddies real close, but we
Speaker 9: were close and we knew each other.
Speaker 2: Tony Richardson and Bill Hardy had been colleagues at the
Speaker 2: Jefferson County Sheriff's Office for seventeen years. Richardson remembers the
Speaker 2: last time he saw Hardy alive.
Speaker 9: The last day I saw Bill, my brother and I
Speaker 9: my brother would put a sheriff's office offso and we
Speaker 9: were standing there smoking and Bill drove out the alley
Speaker 9: and he was pulling up twenty second and he stopped
Speaker 9: in the road and he started to talk to us
Speaker 9: and he said, hey, guys, hang out doing loan with
Speaker 9: some money. It's just you know, stuff like that. And
Speaker 9: we laughed and talked for a minute. And that was
Speaker 9: the last time I saw him. And the next time
Speaker 9: I heard Bill's name was about two o'clock in the
Speaker 9: morning when I got the call saying and he had
Speaker 9: been shot. At that time, I was what was considered
Speaker 9: a crimes against Persons detective, which meant that I worked homicides.
Speaker 9: The lieutenant felt like because it involved a deputy sheriff,
Speaker 9: and you know that we needed all the help that
Speaker 9: we could get.
Speaker 11: So I got called out.
Speaker 2: Did you go to the actual scene?
Speaker 11: Yeah?
Speaker 2: What did you encounter when you got there?
Speaker 11: Well, by the.
Speaker 9: Time I got there, Bill's body was gone.
Speaker 2: Paramedics had already lifted Bill Hardy into an ambulance and
Speaker 2: rushed him to the emergency room of Birmingham's largest hospital.
Speaker 2: He is gravely injured with two gunshot wounds to his head.
Speaker 2: And jaw. A medical examiner notes a bullet wound to
Speaker 2: Hardy's finger likely means he raised his hand in a
Speaker 2: defensive posture when he was shot. Police go to his
Speaker 2: house to tell his wife, Patricia Diane Hardy, and bring
Speaker 2: her to the hospital. Jim Woodward, the chief deputy in
Speaker 2: Jefferson County, also rushes over when he hears that Hardy
Speaker 2: was shot. What do you remember about the incident?
Speaker 6: I got to call that Hardy had been shot, and
Speaker 6: they told me said looked very serious. So I got
Speaker 6: in my car and went down to the hospital. I
Speaker 6: stood there while they were operating on me, and then
Speaker 6: I just heard one say that's it. It's over.
Speaker 3: We can't do it anymore.
Speaker 6: It's over. We can't save him.
Speaker 7: He's gone.
Speaker 2: What does that feel like when you are a career
Speaker 2: law enforcement officer?
Speaker 6: And well, it's kind of devastating to you. You know,
Speaker 6: you get to know these guys, and I knew Hardy.
Speaker 6: That's a very devastating thing that happened to you.
Speaker 2: Deputy Bill Hardy is pronounced dead seven hours after he
Speaker 2: was shot. The cause of death is two gunshot wounds
Speaker 2: fired at close range. I wanted to know more about
Speaker 2: Deputy Hardy. So I wrote to several family members inviting
Speaker 2: them to talk. They never responded, and I can only
Speaker 2: imagine his murder must be one of the hardest things
Speaker 2: they've ever experienced. But I have learned a few things
Speaker 2: about Deputy Hardy. He was married to Patricia Diane Hardy.
Speaker 2: He had two children and four adult step children. Hardy
Speaker 2: started working as a deputy in nineteen seventy two. His
Speaker 2: duties included delivering subpoenas and directing traffic outside the courthouse.
Speaker 3: You know.
Speaker 11: It was rough. It was rough. It's rough right now,
Speaker 11: it's a rough right This many working homicide.
Speaker 9: I worked at bunch, but none of them affected me
Speaker 9: like the killing of a deputy Share. You know, you
Speaker 9: have a bond with the guys you work with in
Speaker 9: that uniform. Whether you know them or not, you have
Speaker 9: a bond. So when I was a deputy Share working
Speaker 9: another deputy Shaff's murder, do you think that was emotional? Yes,
Speaker 9: it was very and had it been my decision the
Speaker 9: day we caught the people that did it, let's put
Speaker 9: them on death throat.
Speaker 2: Lead Detective Tony Richardson and his team of investigators have
Speaker 2: no eyewitnesses to the shooting and there's no known motive.
Speaker 2: A fellow officer has just been shot, and they have
Speaker 2: almost no evidence to go on. At the exact time
Speaker 2: that Deputy Bill Hardy was shot, to Forrest Johnson and
Speaker 2: his friend Ardregis Ford were four miles away from the
Speaker 2: crime scene at a downtown Birmingham nightclub called Tea's Place,
Speaker 2: but they would soon become the focus of Tony Richardson's investigation.
Speaker 2: Just a few hours before Deputy hart Is shot, ardregas
Speaker 2: Ford gets into the passenger side of his nineteen seventy
Speaker 2: one black Monte Carlo. It's an old car and the
Speaker 2: driver's side door doesn't open, so he slides over into
Speaker 2: the driver's seat, starts the ignition, and heads out to
Speaker 2: pick up his friend to Forrest Johnson to go to
Speaker 2: a club called Teas Place. I wasn't able to interview
Speaker 2: to Forest or Ardregas for this podcast. The Alabama Department
Speaker 2: of Corrections doesn't allow people on death road to do
Speaker 2: interviews with reporters like me, so I was unable to
Speaker 2: talk to Forest directly, and Ardregas died in twenty twenty one,
Speaker 2: I didn't get a chance to interview him before then.
Speaker 2: I was able to speak to Ardregas's mother, Joyce Ford.
Speaker 12: That particular night. They said they was going to tease
Speaker 12: and see he will go to teas every Tuesday and
Speaker 12: he have his particular same parking space and everything because
Speaker 12: he would give them good tips.
Speaker 2: Ardregas was willing to pay for a good parking space
Speaker 2: because he was in a wheelchair. When Ardregas was a teenager,
Speaker 2: a group of men began shooting outside an apartment building
Speaker 2: he was visiting. He was shot trying to shield his
Speaker 2: cousin and her baby from gunfire.
Speaker 12: My son when he got shot when he was fifteen,
Speaker 12: I had just gotten off of work. I was tied
Speaker 12: in the phone, rang, rang, rang, and I didn't answer
Speaker 12: the phone, you know, And I finally answered it and
Speaker 12: they stated that he had gotten shot. I need to
Speaker 12: rush to the murdency room. Who that was like a dream,
Speaker 12: you know. You hear about things happening to other people,
Speaker 12: but when it hit home, you know. And then he
Speaker 12: got spinal cord injury. He got shot in the bag.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and he was parallel.
Speaker 12: Te lie from chest down T four they called it.
Speaker 12: So that was like a nightmare.
Speaker 2: In his early twenties, ar Dragus outfitted his Monte Carlo
Speaker 2: with the makeshift system so he could throw his wheelchair
Speaker 2: in the back and drive the car using just his
Speaker 2: upper body.
Speaker 12: He would cut a broom you know that broomsticks. He
Speaker 12: would put one to the brakes, one to the salator,
Speaker 12: and he would tape it to the car. He would
Speaker 12: tape it to it.
Speaker 13: So he like retro fitted his Yeah, he did.
Speaker 12: Did. He didn't buy the regular equipment that he should
Speaker 12: have used.
Speaker 2: Ar Dragas and to Forest actually came up with this
Speaker 2: idea together. Here's to Forrest's cousin, Antonio.
Speaker 14: Green Dracu's was. I guess that was a pride thing.
Speaker 14: He didn't want the handicap accessible pedals and stuff in
Speaker 14: his car. But as far as come up with this great,
Speaker 14: this genius idea where they're gonna well some metal rods
Speaker 14: to the break and accelerator pedal so he could use
Speaker 14: his hands and dry. Well, he get to thinking about
Speaker 14: this thing and metal rods well did from the brake
Speaker 14: pedal or the accelerator. That's not too good of an
Speaker 14: idea in case you get in the accident. He hate
Speaker 14: to see Draga's impaled through the seat right here, So
Speaker 14: he goes and buys two brooms out of the little
Speaker 14: dollar store wherever, and no measurements, no, just nothing precise
Speaker 14: about it. He just gets the broom and breaks them
Speaker 14: and duct tape the sticks, one to the accelerated pedal
Speaker 14: and one to the brake pedal so Dragas could drive
Speaker 14: his car.
Speaker 9: Could he get around?
Speaker 1: Well?
Speaker 2: I mean did he drove?
Speaker 11: Real well?
Speaker 2: It's been a while since the Forest and Ardregas have
Speaker 2: hung out because to Forest had recently gotten out of prison.
Speaker 2: He was arrested for driving with a suspended license, and
Speaker 2: as officers padded him down at the city jail, he
Speaker 2: tossed something into a nearby trash can. Officers reached into
Speaker 2: the can and found a plastic bag of cocaine. To
Speaker 2: Forest ended up pleading guilty to drug possession. To Forest
Speaker 2: served about a year in prison, and by the night
Speaker 2: of Hardy's murder, he'd been out about three months. To
Speaker 2: Forest puts on jean shorts and a Tommy Hill figure
Speaker 2: blue and white shirt, then gets into the passenger side
Speaker 2: of Ardregis's car and they head downtown. They pull up
Speaker 2: and park outside Tea's place, but it's too early to
Speaker 2: go inside, so they hang out in the parking lot,
Speaker 2: flirting with some girls who work at the car dealership
Speaker 2: across the street. To Forest buys a hot dog from
Speaker 2: a cart on the sidewalk. Regulars start trickling and the
Speaker 2: club drinking, dancing and catching up inside. There's something music
Speaker 2: low lighting. It's Tasty Tuesday at Teas Place, which means
Speaker 2: women get in free.
Speaker 1: I used to go to Teas Tuesday, Thursday, Friday and Saturday.
Speaker 2: Barbetta Hunt was one of the regulars who was there
Speaker 2: that night. What was your nickname back then?
Speaker 1: Mama Cat.
Speaker 2: That's like in the world of nicknames, that's the best name.
Speaker 1: The word my mother, it's the purpose and my father,
Speaker 1: Fred Perkins, they gave me that night when I was born.
Speaker 1: But that's my name. My name is Mama Cat.
Speaker 2: When she was in her early twenties, Mama Cat spent
Speaker 2: a lot of nights hanging out at Tea's Place.
Speaker 1: When you walk into the door, that's my spot right there.
Speaker 1: It's on the right hand side. Every time I got
Speaker 1: that was my spot. I see, I don't move from
Speaker 1: this spot. I don't walk to the bag.
Speaker 6: I don't walk there.
Speaker 1: I say, were right there. Me and my friend Velliniciaqui Sanders.
Speaker 1: We were together.
Speaker 4: We got there before eleven because the club was always
Speaker 4: free on Tuesday, Thursday and Saturday before eleven for women.
Speaker 2: This is Belanique Sanders nicknamed Quisi.
Speaker 4: Anything after eleven it was five dollars and me and
Speaker 4: Barbetta was very cheap, so we tried to make sure
Speaker 4: we got there in free because the little money we
Speaker 4: had saved. We wanted to buy something to eat, and
Speaker 4: I love to get a chicken plate from there, a
Speaker 4: chicken breast with some French fries.
Speaker 2: Oh my god, did you know Trafforst Johnson?
Speaker 4: Yes, I did. I knew him from hanging out in
Speaker 4: the neighborhood in Ansley and I, oh my god, I
Speaker 4: had a crush on him. He was the finest.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 2: What do you remember about what he looked like?
Speaker 4: He was short, a nice body, Oh my god. Anyway,
Speaker 4: he was a ladies man. I will say that, sweet,
Speaker 4: always kind. He was just a nice gentleman like his
Speaker 4: mama had raised him.
Speaker 2: Really well, did you guys ever go out or did
Speaker 2: he know that you had a crush on him?
Speaker 4: He knew I had a crush on him, but we
Speaker 4: never went out. No, we would just see each other.
Speaker 4: I smiled, be like, Oh that he is, I'm gonna
Speaker 4: get him.
Speaker 15: Yeah, that's it.
Speaker 2: To Forest mostly grew up in Birmingham's Pratt City neighborhood,
Speaker 2: or Pratt for short.
Speaker 14: We grew up together, I mean closer than just cousins.
Speaker 14: We were like brothers because we were all pretty much
Speaker 14: raised right in the same little local community.
Speaker 2: While to Forest was growing up, most of his extended
Speaker 2: family also lived in or near Pratt, including his cousin
Speaker 2: Antonio Green.
Speaker 14: And since we were toddlers, i mean babies, we were
Speaker 14: kind of together took out in this thing, and he
Speaker 14: was a couple of years younger than I am, so
Speaker 14: he always kind of held on to my shirttail. And
Speaker 14: you know, so I've been closely connected with him for
Speaker 14: our entire life.
Speaker 11: Pretty much.
Speaker 2: To Forest's mom, Donna, was seventeen when she had him,
Speaker 2: and when to Forest was young, she was more like
Speaker 2: a sister to him than a mother. Donna leaned on
Speaker 2: her parents and siblings to help take care of to Forest,
Speaker 2: and as to Forrest got older, she leaned on him
Speaker 2: to help take care of his little brother.
Speaker 14: He started at a very young age, much too young
Speaker 14: to really be faced with the type of responsibility that
Speaker 14: he took on. He was at an age where he
Speaker 14: was still a kid. I'm talking about eleven twelve, you know,
Speaker 14: just in nirteen years and had to take on the
Speaker 14: responsibility of taking care of his little brother.
Speaker 11: You know, he had a little brother.
Speaker 14: That he got ready for school, he earned his clothes,
Speaker 14: he did.
Speaker 6: You know.
Speaker 14: He's always been that caring little dude, you know, and
Speaker 14: he he did that. So he had to take on
Speaker 14: some things during that time. You know, his mom and
Speaker 14: dad was dead, but his dad was a very very
Speaker 14: heavy drinker.
Speaker 2: To Forest's father, Ronald, was an alcoholic and would get
Speaker 2: violent when he drank, which was every day. This made
Speaker 2: home life extremely volatile for to Forrest, his younger brother,
Speaker 2: little ron and especially his mother, Donna. She eventually left
Speaker 2: Ronald when to Forest was a teenager and moved in
Speaker 2: with another man who had an apartment in the Tuxedo
Speaker 2: Projects in Birmingham's Insley community, also known as the Brickyard.
Speaker 4: Oh it was called the Brickyard.
Speaker 2: Velainique aka Queisi, the one who had a crush on
Speaker 2: to Forest, also grew up there.
Speaker 4: It was rough, dre you know, my mom had three girls,
Speaker 4: aunt had three and we lived in a five bedroom
Speaker 4: project with our grandparents, So it was it was just
Speaker 4: a bunch of girls in the house. But I mean,
Speaker 4: you know, I had just seen people get killed right
Speaker 4: in front of me, my cousin, guys shot in the stummy.
Speaker 4: You know, a lot of it was rough. You had
Speaker 4: family's daddy couldn't afford to eat, you know, kids come
Speaker 4: to school, you know, wearing the same clothes over and over.
Speaker 7: It was rough.
Speaker 4: It was rough growing up in the projects.
Speaker 2: To Forest and his little brother moved there when to
Speaker 2: Forest was sixteen. When he was seventeen, to Forrest was
Speaker 2: shot and a drive by shooting and spent three months
Speaker 2: in the hospital. To Forest's mom told me the bullet
Speaker 2: is still lodged in his chest. During this period, seven
Speaker 2: of to Forest's friends would be shot and killed. No
Speaker 2: one was ever prosecuted for any of these crimes, and
Speaker 2: it was around this time that to Forest dropped out
Speaker 2: of school. Several family members tell me that at twenty two,
Speaker 2: to Forrest was somewhat adrift. He spent his time working
Speaker 2: on old cars and playing video games. He was having
Speaker 2: a good time dating different women. He had five children
Speaker 2: who he loved, but he was also unsettled. He hadn't
Speaker 2: yet figured out his purpose, and he didn't know he
Speaker 2: was running out of time. As to Forest and Ardregas
Speaker 2: wait outside of Ardregas's beeper goes off a few times.
Speaker 2: The beeps are from a girl he met a few
Speaker 2: nights before, but he ignores her, hoping to meet someone
Speaker 2: else inside, tees to Forrest walks toward the club's entrance
Speaker 2: behind Ardregas and his wheelchair. They're focused on meeting girls
Speaker 2: and having a good time. They don't know that this
Speaker 2: night will change their lives, and the people they run
Speaker 2: into don't know they're about to become alibi witnesses.
Speaker 15: There was a love before eleven, and we were standing
Speaker 15: outside and they came up as far as it was
Speaker 15: pushing to Draga's.
Speaker 2: One of the first people they run into is Kenyara Pickett,
Speaker 2: who was standing near the entrance.
Speaker 15: I remember exactly where I was standing, right in front
Speaker 15: of the club when he walked up, because I thought
Speaker 15: I was shot that night out. You know, back in
Speaker 15: the days, it was TFC wearing big clothes back then,
Speaker 15: and I had all some black, some black big jeans
Speaker 15: but shorts, and I had on some black and white rebox,
Speaker 15: and then I think I had on the button down
Speaker 15: shut my sister. She had just got out of the hospital.
Speaker 15: She had a blood clot and I when she got
Speaker 15: out of the hospital, we just went down there, you know,
Speaker 15: to celebrate that she came home.
Speaker 2: To Forrest and Ardregas make their way past Kenyara and
Speaker 2: go into Tea's. Mama Cat and Velanik are already inside,
Speaker 2: perched at their table right by the front door.
Speaker 1: Tavarra Johnson, I remember he was pushing Adreka's four in
Speaker 1: the wheelchair. They came together.
Speaker 4: I had saw too far, was pushing a Draca's in
Speaker 4: the club, because we always standing at the front by
Speaker 4: the door so we can be nosy and see everything.
Speaker 2: You wanted to see who was coming in and who
Speaker 2: was leaving with who?
Speaker 4: Yes, yes, ma'am.
Speaker 13: About eleven o'clock I saw Tafarest come in pushing Ondrega's
Speaker 13: in and I was excited to seeing him because I
Speaker 13: hadn't seen him in year, because I had just got
Speaker 13: out the military.
Speaker 2: Stanley Chandler is also at Tease that night to catch
Speaker 2: up with friends. He and to Forrest knew each other
Speaker 2: as kids, and Pratt so we.
Speaker 13: Stood there and we start we talked, you know about
Speaker 13: old times, you know, and I mean we joked, laying
Speaker 13: and laugh.
Speaker 2: To Forrest and Ardregus settle in at a table chatting
Speaker 2: with people who stopped by watching the dance floor.
Speaker 4: I was sitting on the bathroom because when you go around,
Speaker 4: it's like a little balcony part that you could sit at.
Speaker 4: And so I seen Draca's and to Forest when they
Speaker 4: came in the door, because he was pushing them in
Speaker 4: a wheelchair.
Speaker 2: This is Dedra Carter, who was celebrating getting released from
Speaker 2: the hospital with her sister Kenyara. Dedra was also at
Speaker 2: teas that night.
Speaker 4: And him and my cousin Mona and my sister all
Speaker 4: us was just there talking and you know, I think
Speaker 4: Tofarres liked it Mona, so you know, he was trying
Speaker 4: to hook up with her, but she went no, she
Speaker 4: wouldn't never.
Speaker 9: Hook up with him.
Speaker 4: We used to laugh, talk, joking, like even we at
Speaker 4: the club music playing, We're still cracking up, you know,
Speaker 4: you know, just talking and stuff.
Speaker 2: To Forrest SIPs along island iced tea and orders our
Speaker 2: dragas up brandy and coke. At one point, to Forrest
Speaker 2: goes back to the bar because Dragas says his drink
Speaker 2: is too weak, and the bartender makes him a new one.
Speaker 2: They linger at the club into the early hours of
Speaker 2: Wednesday morning.
Speaker 4: When I said we would probably ship the club now
Speaker 4: we was there. I know, it's probably like they used
Speaker 4: to close about maybe one two o'clock, so we would
Speaker 4: leave right right before that, so I know it was
Speaker 4: like maybe one.
Speaker 13: I ain't leaving the club roughly about I'm gonna say
Speaker 13: around about right at one. And like I said, he
Speaker 13: was standing across the club.
Speaker 11: You know, you could see.
Speaker 13: Him because I mean, it wasn't a big, big club,
Speaker 13: you know. And I just sat to do signs up
Speaker 13: and I left and.
Speaker 2: He was still there.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I left.
Speaker 2: There are at least ten people who say they saw
Speaker 2: to Forrest and Ardregas at Teas Place between eleven PM
Speaker 2: and one thirty am. Deputy Bill Hardy was shot right
Speaker 2: in the middle of that time frame, around twelve fifty am,
Speaker 2: four miles away at the Crown Sterling Suites hotel. People
Speaker 2: like Kenyara, Dedra, Stanley Quisi, Mama Cat all remember that night.
Speaker 2: Their corroborated statements weave together a shield. That shield should
Speaker 2: protect to Forest and Ardregas from the accusations about to
Speaker 2: head their way. But it doesn't. The state would arrest
Speaker 2: to Forest and Ardregas, try them and seek the death
Speaker 2: penalty against both of them for Deputy Hardy's For the
Speaker 2: last three years, I've been trying to figure out how
Speaker 2: this happened. I've read through thousands of pages of court
Speaker 2: transcripts and investigative documents. I've done a full audit of
Speaker 2: all the media coverage and interviewed more than eighty people,
Speaker 2: including several who were directly involved in this investigation and prosecution,
Speaker 2: and many who have never spoken publicly about the case.
Speaker 2: I'm not trying to find the real killer of Deputy Hardy.
Speaker 2: I'm investigating why that person was never found. One of
Speaker 2: the first things I tried to unwind, how did to
Speaker 2: Forrest Johnson and Ardregis Ford end up at the center
Speaker 2: of the investigation when they were somewhere else at the
Speaker 2: time Deputy Hardy was killed. Here's one thing everyone agrees on.
Speaker 2: After they leave Tea's place, to Forrest and Ardregas pick
Speaker 2: up two girls in the Monte Carlo. One sits in
Speaker 2: the back by Ardregas's wheelchair, the other one sits between
Speaker 2: Ardregas and to Forest in the front and that girl,
Speaker 2: the one in the front seat. What she tells police
Speaker 2: will land to Forest and Ardregas right at the center
Speaker 2: of the investigation.
Speaker 9: I'm about to share his office headquarters along with Yolanda
Speaker 9: Michelle Chambers.
Speaker 4: Yolanda is a black female.
Speaker 15: She's fifteen years of age.
Speaker 2: That's next time. Ear Witness is a production of Lava
Speaker 2: for Good Podcasts in association with Signal Company Number one
Speaker 2: on one. Executive producers are Jason Flom, Jeff Kempler, Kevin Wardis,
Speaker 2: and me Beth Shelburne. The investigative reporting for this series
Speaker 2: was done by Me and MARAA McNamara. Producers are MARAA McNamara,
Speaker 2: Hannah bal and Jackie Pawley. Kara Kornhaber is our senior producer.
Speaker 2: Brit Spangler is our sound designer. Additional story editing from
Speaker 2: Marie Sutton, fact check help from Catherine Newhan, and special
Speaker 2: thanks to to Forrest Johnson's legal defense team. You can
Speaker 2: follow the show on Instagram, TikTok, Facebook and Twitter at
Speaker 2: Lava for Good. To see behind the scenes content from
Speaker 2: our investigation, visit Lava for Good dot com slash Ear
Speaker 2: Witness