Speaker 1: Hey, welcome to the Short Stuff. I'm Josh and there's
Speaker 1: Chuck and we're Chucked and this is short stuff, so
Speaker 1: let's go. So we're talking today about the death of
Speaker 1: Billy the Kid, which I thought I learned from a
Speaker 1: Billy Joel song called the Ballad of Billy the Kid.
Speaker 1: It seems like an appropriate place to learn it. Great song.
Speaker 1: But it turns out that Billy Joel stopped at the
Speaker 1: what was to be the hanging of Billy the Kid,
Speaker 1: and growing up, I thought that's how his story ended. Boy,
Speaker 1: you are misinformed, buddy. Yeah, I mean the song literally
Speaker 1: stops with the townfolk in their kin like the c
Speaker 1: came rolling in to watch the hanging of Billy the
Speaker 1: Kid and there's one more course and that's it. You
Speaker 1: know Now that makes me question if whether we really
Speaker 1: did start the fire. Hey, did you see that video
Speaker 1: of him playing the piano on the street the other day?
Speaker 1: And uh wherever he's from Island. I did see a
Speaker 1: tweet that mentioned it in um link that I surmised
Speaker 1: from the headline what had happened. So yeah, basically it
Speaker 1: was pretty neat. Someone was throwing out of piano and
Speaker 1: Billy Joel goes over there and he's playing it, and
Speaker 1: he's like, hey, it's a good piano. It's out of tune,
Speaker 1: but he's got good actions. The petals work. You said,
Speaker 1: somebody should donate this thing. It sounds like he's like
Speaker 1: Rodney Dangerfield. Now, well at least not too far off.
Speaker 1: So um No, it turns out that Billy the Kid.
Speaker 1: Everything I know about Billy the Kid I learned from
Speaker 1: Young Guns and Billy the Kid didn't die at all.
Speaker 1: He went on to live to about a hundreds something
Speaker 1: years old in New Mexico. Um, because he escaped and
Speaker 1: his death was faked. That's right. It was was that
Speaker 1: Emilia was he Billy? Yes? Yes? Yeah? And uh man,
Speaker 1: that was a great movie to me. Billy the Kid
Speaker 1: is Chris Christofferson from the Great Great Sam Pecumpalm movie
Speaker 1: Pat Garrett and Billy the Kid. I never saw that one. Well,
Speaker 1: there's two versions, and see if you can watch the
Speaker 1: director's cut, because the other ones a mess. Oh is
Speaker 1: that right? It's like a Hurricanes episode. Yeah, And funny
Speaker 1: enough you mentioned Hurricane. Bob Dylan is in that movie
Speaker 1: and does the soundtrack and score. Who does he play
Speaker 1: in the movie? Let me guess the Undertaker. No, something
Speaker 1: like that. I think he's just like a stranger in
Speaker 1: town that does a couple of things. It's not a
Speaker 1: big part Sam Peck. And Paul was a Bob Dylan fan. Sure,
Speaker 1: he did tons of drugs and was an alcoholic, sure,
Speaker 1: but Bob Dylan fan. Yeah. Man, huh. Alright, So can
Speaker 1: we get going on this? This is a short stuff.
Speaker 1: We wasted three and a half minutes. Well, we'll just
Speaker 1: say this, Billy the Kid died. That's that. That's right.
Speaker 1: I think we should kind of reverse this a little
Speaker 1: bit and talk a little bit about Billy the Kid first. Yeah, agreed.
Speaker 1: Did you know he was a born New Yorker? I
Speaker 1: did because I'm kind of into these old West dudes,
Speaker 1: and I've researched some of them to certain degrees. And
Speaker 1: he was born William Henry McCarty Jr. Uh. And if
Speaker 1: you've heard the name William Bonnie, that was a name
Speaker 1: he went by a lot. I think you've heard William
Speaker 1: Bonnie a lot more, probably than McCarty. Yeah, for sure.
Speaker 1: I actually had never heard Henry McCarty until today. Yeah.
Speaker 1: And he was orphaned at fourteen and became one of
Speaker 1: the Lincoln County regulators. Yeah, and so regulators will sound
Speaker 1: familiar if one you are a Young Guns fan or
Speaker 1: if you're a Nate Dog and Warren g fan. Either way,
Speaker 1: the regulators were kind of a group of hired hands
Speaker 1: for a guy and hired guns, I believe too young ones,
Speaker 1: um for a guy named Tunstall, I believe down in
Speaker 1: Lincoln County, New Mexico. And Um, toun Stall was killed
Speaker 1: from what I understand, fairly unfairly um, and that kind
Speaker 1: of set Billy the Kid and his his posse of
Speaker 1: regulators off on a bit of a killing spree. Started
Speaker 1: what's known as the Lincoln County War. That's right. And uh,
Speaker 1: during one of those skirmishes there was some murders that happened.
Speaker 1: And Pat Garrett, who was a sheriff in New Mexico
Speaker 1: played by James Coburn in the Bob Dylan movie played
Speaker 1: by Bob Dylan and Young Guns, Uh he was. I
Speaker 1: haven't seen Young Guns a long time. That was a
Speaker 1: big college movie for us. I need to see that again.
Speaker 1: It was like it didn't come out when you were
Speaker 1: in college. Sure, No, yeah, I don't think so. Look
Speaker 1: it up and I'll keep going all right live corrections.
Speaker 1: So Pat Garrett formed a posse. UH captured Billy and
Speaker 1: that part of the Billy Joel song checks out, and
Speaker 1: he was sentenced to hang. They captured him at Stinking Springs,
Speaker 1: New Mexico, and while he was awaiting his execution, he
Speaker 1: was kept in a it wasn't even a prison, it
Speaker 1: was a room, a locked room at the Lincoln County Courthouse. Uh.
Speaker 1: I found this article says too, I heard, I saw
Speaker 1: there were five other prisoners. Um. Regardless, there were other
Speaker 1: prisoners being guarded by some armed men. Uh. One of
Speaker 1: them was an enemy of Billy's named Bob Ollinger. And
Speaker 1: at one point he took all the rest of the
Speaker 1: guys over to a hotel across the street to eat,
Speaker 1: left Billy there under the charge of Deputy James bell Man.
Speaker 1: These are some great old timey Old West names, aren't they. Oh? Yeah,
Speaker 1: when was Young Guns out? So if you if you
Speaker 1: were in college at age seventeen, then I'm impressed. I
Speaker 1: said it was a big movie in college. I didn't
Speaker 1: say it came out in college. I asked you, than
Speaker 1: came out in college? And you said, oh yeah, I
Speaker 1: thought you mean, was it out in college? As if
Speaker 1: it came out after that thought that that's what I meant. Now,
Speaker 1: it came out in high school, but we watched the
Speaker 1: heck out of it in college. I should have that,
Speaker 1: should have said. So James Bell is watching Billy. Billy says, uh, hey, gout,
Speaker 1: he's a bathroom. Can you take me out to the outhouse?
Speaker 1: He said, I really gotta go. He shackled, his arms
Speaker 1: and legs are shackled. Take him out use the bathroom.
Speaker 1: On the way back end, they're going up the steps.
Speaker 1: Billy's in front, and the account I read was that
Speaker 1: he ducked around a blind corner, got his hands out,
Speaker 1: and then smashed this guy in the head with his
Speaker 1: arm irons. The guy went, what Billy pulled his gun
Speaker 1: from his holster. The other guys holter, Yeah, of course
Speaker 1: Billy didn't have a gun on him. Why would they
Speaker 1: do that. He's like, why didn't I think they're using
Speaker 1: that first? They're like, well, he's in handcuffs, just go
Speaker 1: ahead and keep his gun on him. And so he
Speaker 1: pulls the guy's gun on him, and the guy tries
Speaker 1: to run and Billy shoots him dead in the back.
Speaker 1: And so now roughly we reached the end of the
Speaker 1: Billy Joel song, which I think is a good time
Speaker 1: for an ad break. What do you think, Sure, we'll
Speaker 1: be right back. M alright, Chuck, We're back. And um,
Speaker 1: Billy the kid has just shot the deputy that's in
Speaker 1: charge of watching him. Another deputy runs back, uh or
Speaker 1: runs back from the hotel and okay, Olinger, um apparently
Speaker 1: is he's running and he hears his name and looks up,
Speaker 1: and Billy the kids got Olinger's own rifle on him
Speaker 1: and shoots him dead like a dog in the street.
Speaker 1: So Billy the kids killed two people. Now he's out
Speaker 1: of his shackles and he grabs a horse and high
Speaker 1: tails it out of town for a life on the
Speaker 1: run that would last about four more months. Yeah, that's
Speaker 1: um the only dispute I have with that accoun on us.
Speaker 1: It supposedly took him about an hour to get out
Speaker 1: of his leg shackles with an axe, and I guess
Speaker 1: no one just came up there. When Olinger came to
Speaker 1: find him, Billy actually yelled down, look up, old boy,
Speaker 1: and see what you get. Wow, And that's the last
Speaker 1: words that he heard. So Billy's on the run at
Speaker 1: this point uh, And obviously Pat Garrett has be in
Speaker 1: his bonnet to go get him again. Well, sure, he's
Speaker 1: the Sheriff of Lincoln County and Billy the kid, who's
Speaker 1: become one of the most notorious bandits in the country
Speaker 1: has just escaped out from under his watch. So yeah,
Speaker 1: there's a reward. Well, sure there's a reward too. So
Speaker 1: Pat Garrett had this um history of lying in wait,
Speaker 1: in ambushing people and shooting them, whether they were ready
Speaker 1: to shoot back or not, killing them very frequently. He'd
Speaker 1: done it before, and um, he wanted to do it again.
Speaker 1: He went to go look for Billy a kid. Um.
Speaker 1: Like we said, he he made his way as an outlaw,
Speaker 1: like a double outlaw by this point, um on the
Speaker 1: lamb for good four months before he was caught up
Speaker 1: with I think still in New Mexico in um July
Speaker 1: of eight one, and he apparently was staying at the
Speaker 1: house or nearby the house of a friend named Peter Maxwell.
Speaker 1: And Peter Maxwell had a younger sister that Billy the
Speaker 1: Kid was sweet on, and Peter Maxwell didn't like that
Speaker 1: Billy the Kid was sweet on her. And by sweet
Speaker 1: on her, I mean that they were having extramarital sexual relations,
Speaker 1: and Peter didn't like that because he was planning on
Speaker 1: marrying off his his sister to a rich Land baron nearby,
Speaker 1: and Billy the Kid was kind of toying with that possibility.
Speaker 1: Um so Peter Maxwell is in this kind of mindset
Speaker 1: allegedly when Pat Garrett shows up. That's right, Garrett shows up.
Speaker 1: This isn't well, he doesn't show up at night, but
Speaker 1: eventually night falls, and uh, well, actually maybe he did
Speaker 1: show up because supposedly he he found him asleep. Uh
Speaker 1: Pete Maxwell, that is, And Garrett very presumptuously goes into
Speaker 1: his room and sits down next to him and says, Pete,
Speaker 1: wake up, wake up. And then he wakes up, and
Speaker 1: he says, where's that Billy the Kid? And as the
Speaker 1: story goes, and we're gonna poke holes at it in
Speaker 1: a second, right, then Billy the Kid actually walks into
Speaker 1: that room, that dog gone room, and has a gun
Speaker 1: and a knife because he had just went to cut
Speaker 1: some meat off. He was hungry, I guess after some
Speaker 1: he had post coital hunger pains and carves some meat
Speaker 1: off and was from a yearling supposedly and had just
Speaker 1: eaten a little bit, and so he has a knife
Speaker 1: and a gun and can't really see him the dark
Speaker 1: and starts going Keyennis Keiennis Spanish for who is it?
Speaker 1: Who's there? And Maxwell or I'm sorry. Pat Garrett supposedly
Speaker 1: recognizes the voice as Billy in the dark and shoots
Speaker 1: him dead. Yeah, and I just want to make sure
Speaker 1: we're all on the same page. Heart Yearling is a
Speaker 1: young horse. He was after some horse meat to eat.
Speaker 1: That's right. So this was the death as far as
Speaker 1: Pat Garrett said of Billy the Kid. But like we
Speaker 1: said before, Pat Garrett already kind of had developed a
Speaker 1: reputation of ambushing people, of lying in wait, catching him
Speaker 1: off guard when they least expected it, And even in
Speaker 1: this story that he told this this is the official
Speaker 1: line that Pat Garrett told in the biography he wrote
Speaker 1: about Billy the Kid, Um, that that was how he died.
Speaker 1: But even that, which is kind of on the edges
Speaker 1: of fair um is disputed, is probably untrue, and that
Speaker 1: the truth is probably involves even more of an ambush
Speaker 1: and more surprise, and even less of Billy the Kid
Speaker 1: being able to defend himself than that. Yeah, I think
Speaker 1: the other version is that he was actually ambushed and
Speaker 1: set up by Maxwell because he didn't like him being
Speaker 1: with Paulita, his little sister, and basically said, hey man,
Speaker 1: it's uh, it's all going down here, and here's your
Speaker 1: here's your chance to come over to Fort Sumner and
Speaker 1: take care of this kid once and for all. And
Speaker 1: so he did so, and a lot of people say
Speaker 1: that's how it really went down. And then and then
Speaker 1: he tipped off pat Garrett, right, yeah, and that he
Speaker 1: in fact even changed his age. Who was he was
Speaker 1: supposedly like eighteen or nineteen when he was shot dead
Speaker 1: and said no, no, no no, he was really twenty one.
Speaker 1: So I didn't have this extra judicial killing him some kid.
Speaker 1: He was a full grown man and it was just
Speaker 1: happenstance that he happened to walk in the room where
Speaker 1: I was sitting there with a loaded gun. Yeah, And
Speaker 1: the other people historians think, like, probably Billy the kid
Speaker 1: didn't walk in with a gun and a knife looking
Speaker 1: for some yearling meat. He probably walked in fully unarmed,
Speaker 1: expecting Pete Maxwell's sister to be waiting for him there,
Speaker 1: and instead pet Garrett and his gun was waiting for
Speaker 1: him there. So he probably was fully ambushed and killed murdered.
Speaker 1: I guess it's the other way to put it in
Speaker 1: that that's probably how Billy the Kid died. Either way,
Speaker 1: he died at the other end of Pat Garrett's gun.
Speaker 1: That much we know about, right, even though there are
Speaker 1: were and have been rumors over the years that uh,
Speaker 1: he was in cahoots with Pat Garrett and he let
Speaker 1: him escape, and that he lived to be a ripe
Speaker 1: old age. There have been exhumations, they've been DNA tists
Speaker 1: over the years. Obviously, nothing has ever come back with
Speaker 1: any sort of conclusion. Uh, Young guns seem to be
Speaker 1: pretty concluding. I got a little cherry on top two
Speaker 1: if you're interested, let's hear it. You know that very
Speaker 1: famous picture of Billy the Kid, sort of one of two,
Speaker 1: although the second one they aren't quite sure at him.
Speaker 1: But there's that one, very very famous perotype, which is
Speaker 1: a picture on like a metal plate. Um that photo,
Speaker 1: that farotype, the original plate was bought for uh two
Speaker 1: point three million dollars by none other than William Coke,
Speaker 1: who's that the Koke brothers. Oh, yeah, I forgot. He's
Speaker 1: super into like Old West stuff apparently, Yeah, I forgot
Speaker 1: about that. Well, that's pretty interesting, quite a quite a
Speaker 1: quite quite a cherry on top. I'm glad a millionaire
Speaker 1: gets what he wants in the end. As for Garrett Uh,
Speaker 1: he was originally denied the five hundred dollar reward. A
Speaker 1: bunch of the city's felt bad for him and raised
Speaker 1: seven thousand dollars, and then a year later there was
Speaker 1: I think an injunction or a vote or something where
Speaker 1: he actually finally got the reward. So in today's dollars, supposedly,
Speaker 1: if that all checks out, he got about two hundred
Speaker 1: and something thousand dollars for killing Billy the kids. He's
Speaker 1: like that barista from Starbucks who refused service to that
Speaker 1: woman You wouldn't wear a mask. Now they're rich, right Dan,
Speaker 1: I don't serve anyone coffee without a mask. There you gifts,
Speaker 1: We'll start to go fund me for Chuck everybody. Um, well,
Speaker 1: that's it for short stuff, right, Chuck. That's right? Get
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