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Speaker 1: Hey guys, Saga and Crystal here.

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Speaker 2: Independent media just played a truly massive role in this election,

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Speaker 1: We need your help to build the future of independent

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Speaker 1: news media and we hope to see you at Breakingpoints

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Speaker 3: For the past many months, the BBC has been broiled

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Speaker 3: in a controversy in which it has been refusing to

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Speaker 3: air a documentary that kind of took on a life

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Speaker 3: of its own inside the organization, as the journalists there

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Speaker 3: have been demanding to know what happened to an investigation

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Speaker 3: that the BBC had commissioned into Israel's war on the

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Speaker 3: on medical professionals in the entire kind of medical community

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Speaker 3: inside of Gaza. That contrivers now resulted in the documentary

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Speaker 3: being acquired by Mehdi Hassen and Zeteo News for its

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Speaker 3: worldwide distribution and by Channel four inside the UK for

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Speaker 3: its UK distribution. So many's joining us now to talk

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Speaker 3: about this documentary and also the process that led up

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Speaker 3: to it being centered and now being finally released last night.

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Speaker 4: Maddie, thanks so much for joining us, Thanks for having me.

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Speaker 3: And I wanted to start by honoring several of the

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Speaker 3: medical professionals who have been killed in this genocide. If

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Speaker 3: we could put up I believe it is C three

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Speaker 3: drop site posted this yesterday. This is a picture from

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Speaker 3: a graduation ceremony at the Faculty of Medicine in Gaza.

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Speaker 3: Four of the people that you're looking at in this

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Speaker 3: photo doctor Omar Farwana, who was the dean of the

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Speaker 3: Faculty of Medicine, doctor Adnan al Bersh who was head

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Speaker 3: of orthopedic surgery at Al Shifa Medical Complex, got A

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Speaker 3: Rafat Lubad who was the head of internal medicine at

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Speaker 3: Al Shifa. And also then this week was the killing

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Speaker 3: of doctor Marwan al Sultan, who was the director of

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Speaker 3: the Indonesian Hospital and a cardiologist. So in that photo,

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Speaker 3: four of four of them have been assassinated, several targeted

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Speaker 3: at their homes, not collateral damage from attacks on you know,

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Speaker 3: fighters are caught in crossfire. But medi I want you

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Speaker 3: to talk about the targeting of medical professionals because that

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Speaker 3: is what I think people don't understand because it sounds

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Speaker 3: so insane to say it out loud, that.

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Speaker 5: It sounds insane to say it out loud.

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Speaker 6: It's I mean two things, three things I think sound

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Speaker 6: insane over the last twenty one months, twenty two months

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Speaker 6: that we've normalized. One obviously the deliberate killing of journalists,

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Speaker 6: which a lot of journalists in the.

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Speaker 5: West have a lot of problem comprehending.

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Speaker 6: The other is the deliberate killing of children, of course

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Speaker 6: gunshot wounds to the head, sniper shots, not collateral damage.

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Speaker 6: And of course the third is the doctors, the killing

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Speaker 6: of doctors, nurses, paramedics, the deliberate targeting.

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Speaker 5: And destruction of Garza's healthcare.

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Speaker 6: That is what the premise that was the basis of

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Speaker 6: this film is. And this film, produced by award winning

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Speaker 6: filmmakers at Basement Films in the UK, made over several months,

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Speaker 6: went through rigorous checks, went through the BBC editorial process

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Speaker 6: for much of it.

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Speaker 5: Ride of reply.

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Speaker 6: Fantastic lead report remain a Navai award winning war correspondent

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Speaker 6: and they put together this film, this hour long film

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Speaker 6: based on eyewitness testimony from Palestinian doctors and survivors, as

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Speaker 6: well as doctor Adnan old Brush, who you just mentioned.

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Speaker 6: He's in this film, but he's since been killed in

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Speaker 6: Israeli captivity, tortured and died in prison, killed in prison

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Speaker 6: as one of his colleagues. So you've got eyewitness testimony

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Speaker 6: from Palestinian doctors to what they have had to endure.

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Speaker 6: We also have an Israeli medic whistleblower in the film

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Speaker 6: who served at State Taman, the Israeli Gulag, the prison,

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Speaker 6: the black site where they've taken Palestinian detainees to be tortured, raped, killed.

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Speaker 5: So it's all there put together in the film.

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Speaker 6: And you mentioned, you know, the targeting of doctors saying

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Speaker 6: it out loud perhaps the most powerful moment for me

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Speaker 6: in the film, and we just I would urge breaking

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Speaker 6: points views to go to the Zeteo Twitter feed or

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Speaker 6: Zeteo Bluska.

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Speaker 5: We actually put up a clip from the.

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Speaker 6: Film last night, separate to the trailer, which is one

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Speaker 6: of the most powerful moments in the film from doctor

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Speaker 6: Khalid Hamouda who was a surgeon, who is a surgeon

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Speaker 6: in guards are now in Egypt, who was bombed in

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Speaker 6: his home with his family, a family of to other doctors.

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Speaker 6: At first ten people killed. They then flee him his

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Speaker 6: wife as child, and they go down the street by

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Speaker 6: the way. His house is blown up, not the entire street,

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Speaker 6: just his house. They then go down the street to

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Speaker 6: take refuge and a drone follows them down the street

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Speaker 6: and attacks them again. And he wakes up in a

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Speaker 6: hospital and sees a nurse carrying his child, his daughter,

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Speaker 6: who's dead.

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Speaker 5: The next morning, his wife, the mother of his child,

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Speaker 5: is also dead.

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Speaker 6: He's told Keled he's the only survivor or one of

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Speaker 6: the only survivors I believe, from that masacret And she says,

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Speaker 6: remin and Viler, what you were talking? He says, yes,

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Speaker 6: drone came and targeted us. And this is what we

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Speaker 6: heard from the world Central Kitchen folks when they were

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Speaker 6: in the humanitarian convoy and they were.

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Speaker 5: Targeted car to car to car.

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Speaker 6: This is what we've heard from journalists, of course, and

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Speaker 6: this is what we have to get our heads around.

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Speaker 6: The United States of America has been arming and funding

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Speaker 6: a country that is systematically. This is a key word here,

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Speaker 6: destroying the Gaza healthcare system, destroying doctors and medics. And

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Speaker 6: the key point here, and it comes out in the film.

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Speaker 6: You can rebuild hospitals in years to come. Trump can

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Speaker 6: turn Gaza into the Riviera of the Middle East and

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Speaker 6: build as many hospitals as you like. You cannot rebuild

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Speaker 6: that knowledge base, you cannot rebuild that human base.

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Speaker 5: You cannot just.

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Speaker 6: Get doctors back of Ghazan society palaces for years educating

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Speaker 6: itself in this way, and these Raelis have deliberately targeted it.

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Speaker 7: Well, let's take a look at the trailer.

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Speaker 8: This is one to get a sample of what people

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Speaker 8: can expect from the film.

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Speaker 3: Rome.

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Speaker 9: Israel has been killing the very people trying to keep

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Speaker 9: the healthcare system alive, its doctors and medics, despite hospitals

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Speaker 9: and healthcare workers being protected under international law. As Israel

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Speaker 9: has bonded Gaza, hundreds of Palestinian doctors and medics have

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Speaker 9: refused to leave their hospital.

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Speaker 10: We are in the theater and operating room, full of darkness,

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Speaker 10: no water, no electricity, but we have a hero surgeons

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Speaker 10: in Gaza.

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Speaker 9: Hundreds of medics have been killed, hundreds have been detained.

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Speaker 9: Many of them have been forcibly disappeared. Our Palestinian team

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Speaker 9: on the ground have gathered testimony from health workers and

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Speaker 9: their families.

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Speaker 4: Wings of them, and Israeli.

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Speaker 9: Whistleblowers have told us they witnessed Palestinian prisoners being tortured

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Speaker 9: and that some Israeli medics are complicit.

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Speaker 6: I don't even think that in the Israeli society there

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Speaker 6: is a need for cover up. These days, you can

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Speaker 6: do almost whatever you want when it comes to gardens.

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Speaker 8: One of the things people conceive METI is that this

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Speaker 8: is a high production value film. In the BBC funded

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Speaker 8: this film. The BBC then refused to err it and

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Speaker 8: was giving quote unquote bullshit reasons. According to a source

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Speaker 8: who told that to the Independent and medi you have

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Speaker 8: probably a lot of insight into this process of why

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Speaker 8: the BBC, which had recently aired row documentary, I believe

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Speaker 8: that was on BBC.

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Speaker 7: What happened?

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Speaker 8: What's your understanding of why they ended up getting rid

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Speaker 8: of a film that they funded?

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Speaker 6: So the BBC put out a very long statement, a

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Speaker 6: bullshit statement, I would argue as well. Their argument was

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Speaker 6: that they had this other documentary that they aired on GAZA,

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Speaker 6: which became super controversial, I would argue for unnecessary reasons.

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Speaker 5: It was narrated by a child in Gaza surviving the war.

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Speaker 6: And it turns out the child was the son of

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Speaker 6: a deputy agriculture minister in the Gaza government, some technocrat

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Speaker 6: who was then labeled, of course as just Hamas.

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Speaker 5: And there was a huge furory in the UK that.

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Speaker 6: The BBC had put out a film from the child

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Speaker 6: of a Hamas minister, even though again it was a

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Speaker 6: well sourced, well made, high production valuy film.

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Speaker 5: The child had not decided the editorial agenda.

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Speaker 6: But while they were quote unquote investigating how that happened,

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Speaker 6: they decided to park this film, which, as you say,

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Speaker 6: they'd spent a lot of money on, spent many months

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Speaker 6: making with Basement Films, who we are Detayo know well

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Speaker 6: because they made a film for his last year called

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Speaker 6: Israel's Real Extremism, which came on the show talking about

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Speaker 6: memory sells me correctly then and the fundamental argument for

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Speaker 6: the BBC was, well, Basement Films went out and talked

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Speaker 6: about the process while we were still trying to get

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Speaker 6: everything approved. They then put out Basement were frustrated. Of course,

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Speaker 6: my friend Benda Peir, who's the executive producer, formerhead of Channel.

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Speaker 5: Four News, very respected award winning journalists.

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Speaker 6: He went out at the Sheffield Documentary Festival and said,

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Speaker 6: come on, this is ridiculous. We've got doctors in the

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Speaker 6: film waiting for this film to come out. We're showing

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Speaker 6: disrespect to people who risked their lives to talk to us. Sources, whistleblowers,

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Speaker 6: you know, survivors are massacres. The BBC put out statements

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Speaker 6: saying well, if we put it out now, there will

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Speaker 6: be the perception of partiality, and the BBC can't have

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Speaker 6: the perception of partiality. The great irony being, of course,

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Speaker 6: that their decision not to air this film that they

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Speaker 6: commissioned that ran through their checks. That is the greatest

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Speaker 6: perception of partiality. It's partiality towards Israel. They have now

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Speaker 6: run one Gaza doc and then pulled it nowhere to

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Speaker 6: be seen because apparently it was the child of a

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Speaker 6: Hamas minister bullshit argument. And now they didn't even the

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Speaker 6: other Gaza documentary. And then add that to all of

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Speaker 6: the rest of the coverage of the BBC's of Gaza

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Speaker 6: over the last twenty one to twenty two months, which

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Speaker 6: has been abysmal, which has been which has caused multiple

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Speaker 6: internal you know, backlashes, protests from BBC staff who are

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Speaker 6: frustrated at what their broadcaster has done. This is a

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Speaker 6: BBC that has been cowed, intimidated, pressured, bullied.

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Speaker 5: This is a BBC. I used to work at the BBC.

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Speaker 6: I used to defend the BBC when I worked in

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Speaker 6: the UK from right wing bullshit attacks. But I think

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Speaker 6: I've never seen in my entire lifetime. I'm im about

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Speaker 6: to turn forty six years old, in my entire lifetime,

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Speaker 6: I'm watching the BBC.

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Speaker 5: I've been watching the BBC since.

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Speaker 6: Children's Cartoons on a Saturday morning, and I can honestly

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Speaker 6: say it's never taken a beating like this. I've never

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Speaker 6: had such a depressing, disappointing view of the national broadcast

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Speaker 6: in the UK that I've had since October twenty twenty three.

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Speaker 6: I know many other people who stopped watching the BBC,

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Speaker 6: stopped appearing on the BBC because their coverage has been

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Speaker 6: so shameful, not just in the documentary space, but in

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Speaker 6: the new space, the online space, the ridiculous headlines. There

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Speaker 6: was a study by the SENSE for Media Monitoring recently

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Speaker 6: which said they give thirty three times as much coverage

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Speaker 6: per Israeli casualty as they do per Palestinian casualty.

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Speaker 5: So there's not a perception of partiality.

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Speaker 6: There's a well documented evidence of partiality towards Israel.

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Speaker 4: And I want to linger on that point and connect.

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Speaker 3: It to the point that you made about the original

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Speaker 3: controversy that then put this documentary on ice.

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Speaker 4: Trying to imagine a world in which a.

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Speaker 3: Documentary was made about the difficulties faced by Israeli children

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Speaker 3: in the war, which are non trivial, often headed to

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Speaker 3: bomb shelters, which is absolutely even if nothing happens, it's

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Speaker 3: traumatizing for a child to have to hide, to hide

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Speaker 3: somewhere with their family in the dark, worried that they

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Speaker 3: might get hit by a bomb.

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Speaker 4: Like that alone is traumatizing.

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Speaker 3: So let's say that the BBC commission a documentary focused

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Speaker 3: on the way that the war was affecting children, and

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Speaker 3: then it turned out that the boy's father worked for

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Speaker 3: the Ministry of Agriculture in Israel, and they pulled the

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Speaker 3: documentary and apologized and and.

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Speaker 4: Investigated how that could happen?

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Speaker 3: How could you possibly have aired the thoughts of a

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Speaker 3: child whose father works for the Ministry of Agriculture in Israel.

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Speaker 4: That to me kind of tells you everything you need.

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Speaker 3: To know about the way that the BBC approached it.

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Speaker 3: So how difficult was it to kind of pry this

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Speaker 3: out of the BBC or were they like, thank you, Metti,

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Speaker 3: We're so glad to be done with this controversy.

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Speaker 6: So the heavy lifting was done by Ben de Paratt

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Speaker 6: Basement Films, who spent who made this film, sweat and

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Speaker 6: blood in this film, spent a long time.

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Speaker 5: In back and forth with the BBC. And you know,

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Speaker 5: he runs an independent production company.

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Speaker 6: It's very risky for him to pick a fight with

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Speaker 6: one of the biggest broadcasters in the world, which commissions

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Speaker 6: his staff. So props to my friend Ben really for

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Speaker 6: believing in this film and saying, look, I want it

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Speaker 6: out there. Doesn't matter if I screw up my relationship

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Speaker 6: with people, doesn't matter if I lose money on this.

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Speaker 5: I want it out there.

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Speaker 6: And the BBC did sit on it for a while

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Speaker 6: and weren't going to release it as far as I'm aware,

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Speaker 6: and eventually they did release it, partly because of Ben's cajoling,

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Speaker 6: partly because I think they just wanted to be done

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Speaker 6: with it, and then US and Channel four were able

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Speaker 6: to come in and say, well, we're going to give

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Speaker 6: it a platform. I knew from the moment they benched it,

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Speaker 6: if this film becomes available, I was messaging men, say

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Speaker 6: we want a platform. This is what Zato was created for,

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Speaker 6: right to give these voices to the world, to try

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Speaker 6: and platform these voices.

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Speaker 5: We know, Ryan, you and I that the right have

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Speaker 5: been arguing.

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Speaker 6: About cancel culture for decades and yet the single biggest

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Speaker 6: victims of cancel culture are Palestinians and supporters of the

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Speaker 6: Palestinian movement and journalism about Palestine and academia about Palestine,

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Speaker 6: and that has been a fundamental issue. We've seen that

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Speaker 6: in this conflict, and I think that was a frustrating

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Speaker 6: issue where the BBC we're not airing it and we're

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Speaker 6: not releasing it, and the moment they released it, we

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Speaker 6: move fast. And props to Channel four broadcaster in the

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Speaker 6: UK for running it, because again, Ryan, you say hamas

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Speaker 6: and everything shuts down, All critical faculties shut down, even

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Speaker 6: amongst smart liberal, progressive folks. And if you're able to

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Speaker 6: say anything's hamasked, and that's what you're able to throw

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Speaker 6: at it, and I'm sure people will throw that at

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Speaker 6: this film as well. One thing I took great pride

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Speaker 6: in doing was take you know, the BBC put out

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Speaker 6: statements saying this is not our film anymore. That's true,

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Speaker 6: it's not their film anymore. We made some We made

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Speaker 6: a few changes. One of the changes we made is

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Speaker 6: we took out all references to the Hamas run health ministry.

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Speaker 6: We call it the Garza Ministry of Health of this film.

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Speaker 6: That in itself is a propagandistic and loaded phrase, as

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Speaker 6: you well know, because it allows people to then cast

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Speaker 6: doubt on the deaths and torture pass it. And we

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Speaker 6: have eyewitness accounts of this film fro people who are

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Speaker 6: nothing knew Hamas about that suffering. Just one quick story

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Speaker 6: that your viewers might be interested in that I heard

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Speaker 6: recently from someone else. You talk about the kind of

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Speaker 6: imagine if this was the other way around. A production company,

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Speaker 6: I'm told went to a major American broadcaster at the

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Speaker 6: start of this conflict, at the start of the genocide

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Speaker 6: and had a story worry about a Palestinian family just

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Speaker 6: to kind of followed the moon around and the suffering

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Speaker 6: they were going through and the number of members of

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Speaker 6: the family had been killed, and the American broadcaster said,

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Speaker 6: we'll run it, but first go and find First, let

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Speaker 6: us go and find an Israeli family so we can

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Speaker 6: balance it and we'll run both stories. A few weeks later,

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Speaker 6: they came back to the production company and said, well,

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Speaker 6: we can't find the Israeli family that suffered like the

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Speaker 6: Palestinian Family show does.

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Speaker 5: Therefore we're not running your story. Not we'll just run yours,

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Speaker 5: but we won't run.

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Speaker 6: Anything now because we can't do this fake bullshit balance.

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Speaker 3: Right, And it would would have looked worse if you

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Speaker 3: try to do the balance, because you'd see.

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Speaker 6: They just dropped the whole thing. Right, This is what

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Speaker 6: happens if Palestinian voice is are silence.

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Speaker 8: The other interesting thing about the BBC's position here is

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Speaker 8: they're not disputing any facts in the film or any

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Speaker 8: of the journalism, right many they aren't. They aren't disputing

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Speaker 8: the quality of the journalism. They're not even saying that

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Speaker 8: it didn't meet their editorial standards, which is a pretty

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Speaker 8: usual excuse.

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Speaker 5: Yep, not at all. And I think they're hiding behind

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Speaker 5: this bullshit phrase perception of partiality.

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Speaker 6: So it's only and By the way, Emily, they're not

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Speaker 6: even saying it's a biased film. They're saying if we

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Speaker 6: run it now, people will say that we are biased

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Speaker 6: to one side, and we are scared of people people

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Speaker 6: being the pros ra A lobby, and therefore we are

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Speaker 6: not going to put it out. I mean, look, the

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Speaker 6: people who made this film of one Oscars and Emmy's

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Speaker 6: the reporter Ramita Nevai is of Iranian descent, has done

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Speaker 6: films all about Iran's human rights abuses.

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Speaker 5: She's traveled around the world. The credibility of these people

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Speaker 5: cannot be questioned. I'm sure it will be questioned by

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Speaker 5: bad faith actors.

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Speaker 6: And yet this is where we've reached now, in the

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Speaker 6: name of protecting Israel, wittingly or unwittingly, we've burned down

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Speaker 6: international law, and we've burned down journalistic credibility.

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Speaker 5: We've burned down so.

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Speaker 6: Many institutions which will not survive the last twenty two months.

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Speaker 4: So, Mady, where can people go to find this?

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Speaker 6: So they can go to find this at gazadoctors dot

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Speaker 6: film that's the website we set up for this film specifically,

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Speaker 6: or zateo dot com. It is available to paid subscribers

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Speaker 6: for now. People will say, well, why not put it

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Speaker 6: out for free to the world. Well, because the people

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Speaker 6: behind this film spent a lot of time and money

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Speaker 6: making this film, and I just want to remind people

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Speaker 6: that a free press isn't free. High quality journalism requires investment.

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Speaker 6: If you really want documentaries that are going to win

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Speaker 6: awards and report on the ground and break stories, then

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Speaker 6: we really have to support it financially. I'm proud that

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Speaker 6: Zeteo is financially supporting this film.

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Speaker 5: It costs a lot of money around Emily.

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Speaker 6: As you know, documentaries cost a lot, and therefore we

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Speaker 6: are airing it to our paid subscribers. I urge people

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Speaker 6: to become a paid subscriber. If you become a monthly

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Speaker 6: subscriber's less than the cost of going to the movie

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Speaker 6: theater to watch a film. And this film is more

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Speaker 6: important than any other film you're going to see this year,

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Speaker 6: including the f one movie, which I loved, But this

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Speaker 6: movie is more important.

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Speaker 4: It is true.

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Speaker 3: Journalism is expensive, and documentaries are particularly so.

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Speaker 4: The travel, the.

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Speaker 3: Sophistication that goes into the legally, the leegaling, oh my god,

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Speaker 3: don't get me started on the legaling. Well, Mettie, thank

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Speaker 3: you so much for joining us and congrats on this acquisition.

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Speaker 3: I'm glad that it's it's getting out there. Finally, a

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Speaker 3: new legal filing from attorneys for Kilmar Abrego Garcia alleges

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Speaker 3: that he was tortured while in Seacott custody in El Salvador.

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Speaker 4: We can put up this first element up on the screen.

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Speaker 3: Abreo Garcia was it has it has become the detainee

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Speaker 3: who has captured the most attention.

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Speaker 4: And it could have gone a lot of different ways.

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Speaker 3: It could have been the makeup artist who is still

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Speaker 3: facing these brutal conditions in El Salvadora. Could have been

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Speaker 3: the soccer the venezuela and soccer player who had absolutely

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Speaker 3: no connection to Toneo Ragua and yet remains down there.

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Speaker 3: Abrego Garcia has become the one that Democrats kind of

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Speaker 3: focus their attention on. He would He was returned from

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Speaker 3: Al Salvador, surprise by the administration to face face charges

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Speaker 3: for human trafficking in Nashville in the in the Nashville area,

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Speaker 3: charges which are now face kind of crumbling under scrutiny.

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Speaker 3: This this new allegation service as a part of these

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Speaker 3: ongoing proceedings, and we're still joined by a Sto's Mandy

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Speaker 3: Hassen to talk through some of this. Many thank you

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Speaker 3: for sticking around. We appreciate it.

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Speaker 5: It's a terrific story.

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Speaker 3: Run it really is they talk about and you know

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Speaker 3: what you know they they he says that you know,

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Speaker 3: he walked into Seacott and one of the guards said

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Speaker 3: to him and was saying to everybody who was coming in,

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Speaker 3: welcome to Seacott.

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Speaker 4: Those who enter, uh never leave and a break up.

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Speaker 3: Garcia is one of the only cases that I think

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Speaker 3: we even know of, whether in El Salvador or anywhere else,

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Speaker 3: of somebody leaving leaving Seacott alive soon after getting there.

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Speaker 3: It seems like they had them all kneel for twenty

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Speaker 3: four hours, which.

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Speaker 4: Maddy and I are old men at this point.

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Speaker 3: If we kneel for two minutes, were we are, we're

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Speaker 3: struggling hard and then they were beaten. If they if

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Speaker 3: they collapsed, and the filing says that he soiled himself,

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Speaker 3: you know, while they were being forced to kneel kind

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Speaker 3: of overnight among a bunch of the other abuses. Do

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Speaker 3: you think that this is the reason why the Trump

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Speaker 3: administration was initially so reluctant to and is still reluctant

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Speaker 3: to return anybody from the detention center because they can

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Speaker 3: then talk about what happened down there.

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Speaker 5: I think he's part of the reason. I don't think

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Speaker 5: it's the whole reason.

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Speaker 6: I think even if they weren't being tortured there, it's

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Speaker 6: a point of principle right for the bullies not to

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Speaker 6: give in, and they don't want to say that. All

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Speaker 6: the liberal media and the Democrats made and the human

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Speaker 6: rights science has.

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Speaker 5: Made us bring people back.

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Speaker 6: You remember that the ridiculous playing Homeland Security Secretary Christi

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Speaker 6: nom went in front of Congress and said, I guarantee

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Speaker 6: you he's never coming back. Well, he did come back,

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Speaker 6: but for this bullshit Tennessee indictment for human trafficking, human smuggling.

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Speaker 5: Yeah. I think it's part of the reason. It's not

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Speaker 5: the only reason.

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Speaker 6: And Human Rights to Watch have documented that this is

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Speaker 6: a prison where people never leave from and yes, they

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Speaker 6: are just literally disappeared inside of there. It's a horrific

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Speaker 6: gulag in El Salvador, created by a kind of autocrat

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Speaker 6: President Buckley Trump's ally.

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Speaker 5: People are treated horrifically.

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Speaker 6: He was threatened with being put into cells with gang

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Speaker 6: members where he would be killed. He was told by

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Speaker 6: the guards. He had his head shaved forcibly with a

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Speaker 6: zero razor. He was beaten with wooden batons, he was

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Speaker 6: punched in the head. He was, as you say, forced

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Speaker 6: to kneel all night long, kicked and beaten if they

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Speaker 6: weren't able to kneel all night long, soiled himself, deprived

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Speaker 6: of food, malnutrition, lost.

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Speaker 5: Dozens of pounds.

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Speaker 6: You'll remember that photo that the Trump administration released with

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Speaker 6: him and Chris van Holland having Margarita's which, as the

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Speaker 6: said from Mariland pointed that they didn't order it was

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00:22:02,160 --> 00:22:04,640
Speaker 6: placed in the picture by the El Salvadorans to.

441
00:22:04,560 --> 00:22:07,080
Speaker 5: Make it look like they were having this great time.

442
00:22:07,160 --> 00:22:08,360
Speaker 5: He was not having a great time.

443
00:22:08,400 --> 00:22:11,280
Speaker 6: And we can only dread to imagine what is happening

444
00:22:11,320 --> 00:22:13,400
Speaker 6: to some of the other innocent people who have been

445
00:22:13,440 --> 00:22:16,439
Speaker 6: sent there. The gay barber who was sent there, the

446
00:22:16,600 --> 00:22:19,320
Speaker 6: guy with the autism tattoos who was looking after his brother.

447
00:22:19,720 --> 00:22:21,560
Speaker 6: So many cases. There was a case just this week

448
00:22:21,600 --> 00:22:24,080
Speaker 6: I read of where the Trump administration have admitted for

449
00:22:24,160 --> 00:22:26,240
Speaker 6: once that they sent someone who shouldn't have been sent

450
00:22:26,240 --> 00:22:29,520
Speaker 6: out over but they can't find him anymore. I tweeted

451
00:22:29,520 --> 00:22:31,840
Speaker 6: this yesterday and I stand by this. You said you

452
00:22:32,040 --> 00:22:34,000
Speaker 6: and I are old men because we can't neel. We're

453
00:22:34,000 --> 00:22:36,160
Speaker 6: also old men who remember two thousand and one, two

454
00:22:36,160 --> 00:22:38,240
Speaker 6: thousand and two, two thousand and three. I think this

455
00:22:38,400 --> 00:22:40,840
Speaker 6: is as big a scandal, if not bigger scandal than

456
00:22:40,840 --> 00:22:44,760
Speaker 6: Abu Grebe and Guantanamo Bay. This is happening in plain sight.

457
00:22:44,840 --> 00:22:46,639
Speaker 6: At least we could argue in two thousand and one,

458
00:22:46,680 --> 00:22:49,840
Speaker 6: two three. We didn't know till much later. We didn't

459
00:22:49,880 --> 00:22:53,000
Speaker 6: know till Senator Diane Feinstein's report. We didn't know till

460
00:22:53,000 --> 00:22:56,440
Speaker 6: Seymour Hershe's reporting in the New Yorker. This is happening

461
00:22:56,480 --> 00:22:58,960
Speaker 6: in plain sight. We have known since day one. We

462
00:22:59,000 --> 00:23:01,840
Speaker 6: didn't even need kill Albrego Garcia's report. We saw the

463
00:23:01,960 --> 00:23:04,640
Speaker 6: video that the Trump administration put out. Remember they put

464
00:23:04,640 --> 00:23:08,000
Speaker 6: out a video to music showing off their torture and

465
00:23:08,040 --> 00:23:11,800
Speaker 6: beating enforcible shavings of innocent men sent to SEACOD. Now

466
00:23:11,800 --> 00:23:14,199
Speaker 6: we have this forty page amendment with the details in it.

467
00:23:14,600 --> 00:23:17,120
Speaker 6: I think history will judge what those of us who

468
00:23:17,160 --> 00:23:19,520
Speaker 6: know about it and saw did in this moment.

469
00:23:19,560 --> 00:23:20,400
Speaker 5: This is a scandal.

470
00:23:20,520 --> 00:23:23,400
Speaker 6: The Democrats in Congress should be screaming about from the rooftops,

471
00:23:23,400 --> 00:23:25,840
Speaker 6: which every Democrat who wants to be president in twenty

472
00:23:25,920 --> 00:23:28,600
Speaker 6: twenty eight should be talking about. The Trump administration took

473
00:23:28,640 --> 00:23:30,959
Speaker 6: a bunch of people in the United States, including possibly

474
00:23:31,040 --> 00:23:33,280
Speaker 6: legal residents. We don't know because they haven't told us

475
00:23:33,280 --> 00:23:35,840
Speaker 6: who went and sent them to a foreign gulag to

476
00:23:35,880 --> 00:23:38,640
Speaker 6: be tortured, and refused to bring them back, including when

477
00:23:38,640 --> 00:23:39,560
Speaker 6: the court said.

478
00:23:39,520 --> 00:23:41,359
Speaker 5: Send them back. That is a crime.

479
00:23:41,560 --> 00:23:43,240
Speaker 6: That is a scandal, and I think Americans need to

480
00:23:43,240 --> 00:23:45,120
Speaker 6: stop thinking it can't happen here.

481
00:23:45,320 --> 00:23:46,720
Speaker 5: We're not like those other countries.

482
00:23:46,760 --> 00:23:49,720
Speaker 6: The descriptions in this report, in this amendment are the

483
00:23:49,800 --> 00:23:51,640
Speaker 6: kind of descriptions you would read about from a North

484
00:23:51,680 --> 00:23:54,359
Speaker 6: Korean prison, an Iranian prison, a Russian prison.

485
00:23:54,480 --> 00:23:56,840
Speaker 5: Let's stop pretending we don't do what everyone else does.

486
00:23:57,040 --> 00:23:58,680
Speaker 8: Well, So this is something that Ryan and I actually

487
00:23:58,720 --> 00:24:01,160
Speaker 8: debated a little bit yesterday, and we can put D two.

488
00:24:01,760 --> 00:24:06,760
Speaker 8: This is a vo of Alligator Alcatraz flooding on the screen.

489
00:24:06,920 --> 00:24:07,480
Speaker 7: So this.

490
00:24:09,560 --> 00:24:13,040
Speaker 8: Engineering marvel that was constructed very quickly in the middle

491
00:24:13,040 --> 00:24:16,359
Speaker 8: of the Everglades is already flooding. Probably knows prize to

492
00:24:16,359 --> 00:24:20,480
Speaker 8: anybody who would conceive of what it might look like

493
00:24:20,560 --> 00:24:23,040
Speaker 8: after you throw up a massive three thousand bud facility

494
00:24:23,040 --> 00:24:26,520
Speaker 8: in the Everglades in like a week's time. And Ryan

495
00:24:26,600 --> 00:24:29,280
Speaker 8: raised the point that hurricane season could be especially devastating

496
00:24:29,280 --> 00:24:33,359
Speaker 8: to people who are kept there in the future. So

497
00:24:33,560 --> 00:24:35,680
Speaker 8: three thousand beds, they want to increase that to five

498
00:24:35,680 --> 00:24:38,240
Speaker 8: thousand beds, and they just got an infusion of funding

499
00:24:38,240 --> 00:24:43,639
Speaker 8: for immigration enforcement. But Maddie, I think the public hates

500
00:24:44,040 --> 00:24:46,200
Speaker 8: the Seacott stuff. I think most of the public hates

501
00:24:46,200 --> 00:24:50,240
Speaker 8: the Seacott stuff because it feels profoundly un American. I

502
00:24:50,320 --> 00:24:53,200
Speaker 8: think it's a blind spot for the Trump administration that

503
00:24:53,280 --> 00:24:56,480
Speaker 8: gets very online and you know, sort of falls for

504
00:24:56,560 --> 00:24:59,840
Speaker 8: the appeal of the memes on these types of things.

505
00:25:00,160 --> 00:25:02,359
Speaker 8: I think the Trump administration has sort of understood that,

506
00:25:02,359 --> 00:25:05,119
Speaker 8: which is why they didn't send another group of people

507
00:25:05,200 --> 00:25:08,840
Speaker 8: to Seacott, at least not yet on the political front. So,

508
00:25:09,359 --> 00:25:14,119
Speaker 8: I guess I'm curious what you make of Alligator Alcatraz,

509
00:25:14,680 --> 00:25:19,800
Speaker 8: which you mentioned christinoam like cosplaying. Honestly, I feel like it.

510
00:25:20,160 --> 00:25:21,879
Speaker 8: I think we need to take it seriously. I do

511
00:25:21,920 --> 00:25:25,120
Speaker 8: feel like the Trump administration likes to larp as Bucelli.

512
00:25:25,200 --> 00:25:28,640
Speaker 8: I don't think it's popular, but I don't foresee Alligator

513
00:25:28,680 --> 00:25:31,439
Speaker 8: Alcatraz looking like Seacott. That does mean I don't think

514
00:25:31,440 --> 00:25:33,080
Speaker 8: we should take the threat of that seriously. But I'm

515
00:25:33,119 --> 00:25:35,439
Speaker 8: curious what you expect to see from the facility in

516
00:25:35,480 --> 00:25:38,920
Speaker 8: the next several months as they start filling it.

517
00:25:38,680 --> 00:25:40,840
Speaker 6: The just on the lopping point, I should also point

518
00:25:40,880 --> 00:25:42,840
Speaker 6: out that when the history books are written about this

519
00:25:42,880 --> 00:25:45,159
Speaker 6: period and about the torture Now Salvador, you will have

520
00:25:45,200 --> 00:25:47,280
Speaker 6: a series of Republican members of Congress who went to

521
00:25:47,320 --> 00:25:49,920
Speaker 6: El Salvador, stood outside prison cell, said what a.

522
00:25:49,840 --> 00:25:53,320
Speaker 5: Great place this is. Christineom Christina led the charts.

523
00:25:53,359 --> 00:25:55,600
Speaker 6: She stood in front of a cell full of dozens

524
00:25:55,600 --> 00:25:58,879
Speaker 6: and dozens of men would shaved heads, lined up for

525
00:25:58,920 --> 00:26:01,399
Speaker 6: a photo op, many of those men who have been tortured,

526
00:26:01,400 --> 00:26:03,280
Speaker 6: as we now know. And this is what the American

527
00:26:03,280 --> 00:26:04,920
Speaker 6: guvernment was part of, which is what I'm saying. It's

528
00:26:04,960 --> 00:26:08,000
Speaker 6: worse in many ways than Abu Gray because the Bush administration,

529
00:26:08,160 --> 00:26:10,760
Speaker 6: Cheney and Ashcroft, didn't go and do.

530
00:26:10,760 --> 00:26:11,880
Speaker 5: Photo ops at Abu Gray.

531
00:26:11,920 --> 00:26:12,960
Speaker 7: They tried to keep it.

532
00:26:13,520 --> 00:26:14,440
Speaker 5: They tried to keep it hidden.

533
00:26:14,800 --> 00:26:17,040
Speaker 6: And this administration, as usual, the cruelty is the point

534
00:26:17,080 --> 00:26:20,080
Speaker 6: to borrow Adam Seller's line. So yes, and I think, look,

535
00:26:20,320 --> 00:26:22,880
Speaker 6: whether you call it alligator, alcarez, whatever stupid name these

536
00:26:22,880 --> 00:26:26,640
Speaker 6: people give to their concentration cabs. Even already, ice detention

537
00:26:26,760 --> 00:26:30,480
Speaker 6: facilities were overcrowded. We were hearing reports about abuse. We're

538
00:26:30,480 --> 00:26:33,119
Speaker 6: hearing stories about people not eating for days, not having beds,

539
00:26:33,119 --> 00:26:36,400
Speaker 6: sleeping on the floor, no blankets, all sorts of abuse.

540
00:26:37,160 --> 00:26:39,679
Speaker 6: Nine to one one calls from ice detention centers with

541
00:26:39,720 --> 00:26:42,679
Speaker 6: people collapsing that we had a death I believe of

542
00:26:42,880 --> 00:26:45,080
Speaker 6: a Cuban American man this week or a Cuban man

543
00:26:45,119 --> 00:26:46,199
Speaker 6: this week. I don't know what a stayed as well.

544
00:26:46,240 --> 00:26:48,199
Speaker 6: I can't remember who knows what this administration, what the

545
00:26:48,200 --> 00:26:48,879
Speaker 6: states of any.

546
00:26:49,160 --> 00:26:51,159
Speaker 3: Many Just to underline that, because I was just in

547
00:26:51,359 --> 00:26:53,560
Speaker 3: Miami and they were talking about this down there a lot.

548
00:26:54,080 --> 00:26:56,920
Speaker 3: He was a seventy five year old man who had

549
00:26:57,000 --> 00:27:01,240
Speaker 3: been in the United States since nineteen sixty five, since

550
00:27:01,280 --> 00:27:04,920
Speaker 3: the age of fifteen, So he fled what they will

551
00:27:05,440 --> 00:27:09,760
Speaker 3: call in Miami the Castro dictatorship, which I mean kind

552
00:27:09,760 --> 00:27:10,720
Speaker 3: of was dictator.

553
00:27:10,880 --> 00:27:14,080
Speaker 8: Yeah, we're glad to have you guys on the record.

554
00:27:14,080 --> 00:27:14,960
Speaker 5: Here we go that.

555
00:27:17,080 --> 00:27:19,440
Speaker 3: He so he'd been here for sixty years now, a

556
00:27:19,480 --> 00:27:25,679
Speaker 3: lot of people in Miami because it's its cultural nature.

557
00:27:25,800 --> 00:27:27,639
Speaker 3: Like maybe he never became a citizen. I don't know,

558
00:27:27,800 --> 00:27:29,719
Speaker 3: Like it's quite possibly he didn't. He easily could have.

559
00:27:30,119 --> 00:27:32,639
Speaker 3: If you've been here since nineteen sixty five as a Cuban,

560
00:27:32,760 --> 00:27:33,879
Speaker 3: you could have become a citizen.

561
00:27:33,920 --> 00:27:35,800
Speaker 4: But just in Miami, like a lot of people didn't.

562
00:27:36,000 --> 00:27:39,280
Speaker 3: He died in ICED attention, and Tom Homan responded, well,

563
00:27:39,400 --> 00:27:41,359
Speaker 3: you know, bad things.

564
00:27:41,600 --> 00:27:42,120
Speaker 5: In every prison.

565
00:27:42,240 --> 00:27:43,440
Speaker 4: People don't in every prison.

566
00:27:43,480 --> 00:27:45,560
Speaker 3: But we're saving so many lives with ICE anyway, So

567
00:27:45,680 --> 00:27:46,920
Speaker 3: I just wanted to ice prisons.

568
00:27:47,080 --> 00:27:49,879
Speaker 6: ICE prisons in particular are overcrowded. We know now we

569
00:27:49,920 --> 00:27:52,000
Speaker 6: have this new budget. We have this budget bill that's

570
00:27:52,040 --> 00:27:54,920
Speaker 6: gone through, giving them more money than most than a

571
00:27:54,960 --> 00:27:56,000
Speaker 6: lot of foreign militaries.

572
00:27:56,040 --> 00:27:57,119
Speaker 5: There's a lot of people appointed to that.

573
00:27:57,280 --> 00:27:58,960
Speaker 6: I believe they're going to be I believe they're gonna

574
00:27:58,960 --> 00:28:01,720
Speaker 6: have half the levels of personalnel as the United States

575
00:28:01,800 --> 00:28:03,320
Speaker 6: Marine Corps when all this sudden and done, if this

576
00:28:03,359 --> 00:28:05,639
Speaker 6: bill goes through. So they're getting lots of money for

577
00:28:05,840 --> 00:28:09,880
Speaker 6: fancy new centers and troops. But what I would say

578
00:28:10,040 --> 00:28:13,840
Speaker 6: is even already the overcrowding is insane. The conditions are horrific.

579
00:28:14,080 --> 00:28:16,640
Speaker 6: You mentioned the elderly Cuban man. There was an Iranian

580
00:28:16,680 --> 00:28:19,200
Speaker 6: woman who's been here fifty years. She came in nineteen

581
00:28:19,200 --> 00:28:21,640
Speaker 6: seventy nine her family and came to visit the United States,

582
00:28:21,680 --> 00:28:23,840
Speaker 6: and the revolution happened and they stayed and she never

583
00:28:23,880 --> 00:28:26,000
Speaker 6: got citizenship and they are now deputshake. I think they

584
00:28:26,000 --> 00:28:27,920
Speaker 6: got her in her front yard while she was gardening,

585
00:28:27,960 --> 00:28:31,040
Speaker 6: this dangerous threat, this elderly Iranian woman. So these are

586
00:28:31,160 --> 00:28:34,000
Speaker 6: kind of ridiculous stories coming out from the ICE detentions.

587
00:28:34,160 --> 00:28:36,960
Speaker 6: But the conditions, to go back to Emily's question, are horrific.

588
00:28:37,040 --> 00:28:38,960
Speaker 6: I don't think even if they get thirty seven billion

589
00:28:39,000 --> 00:28:41,360
Speaker 6: dollars from this bill, that they're somehow going to build

590
00:28:41,520 --> 00:28:42,560
Speaker 6: nicer facilities.

591
00:28:42,600 --> 00:28:44,160
Speaker 5: It's not about lack of resources.

592
00:28:44,280 --> 00:28:46,360
Speaker 6: The reason people are being abused in detention is not

593
00:28:46,360 --> 00:28:48,400
Speaker 6: because they lack resources. That's part of it, but it's

594
00:28:48,400 --> 00:28:50,600
Speaker 6: also because the cruelty is the point. They don't see

595
00:28:50,640 --> 00:28:52,880
Speaker 6: these people as fully human beings. They don't see these

596
00:28:52,880 --> 00:28:56,360
Speaker 6: people as deserving of right. You've heard United States senators

597
00:28:56,520 --> 00:28:59,720
Speaker 6: have gone on live television and said, no, foreigners don't

598
00:28:59,720 --> 00:29:02,959
Speaker 6: get you process. Foreigns aren't covered by the Constitution. This

599
00:29:03,000 --> 00:29:05,200
Speaker 6: is the kind of ridiculous shit that is said by

600
00:29:05,200 --> 00:29:07,680
Speaker 6: people with law degrees serving in the United States Senate,

601
00:29:07,720 --> 00:29:11,120
Speaker 6: which is obviously nonsense. Everyone gets due process. So that

602
00:29:11,280 --> 00:29:13,720
Speaker 6: is the fundamental problem. It's not about resources, it's not

603
00:29:13,720 --> 00:29:16,240
Speaker 6: about where you locate your concentration camp. It's about the

604
00:29:16,240 --> 00:29:19,320
Speaker 6: fundamental mindset of Tom Homan and Stephen Miller and Donald Trump,

605
00:29:19,480 --> 00:29:21,800
Speaker 6: which is that these people are not fully human.

606
00:29:21,880 --> 00:29:23,960
Speaker 5: These people are not people deserving of rights.

607
00:29:24,000 --> 00:29:26,280
Speaker 6: These people need to be punished to send a message,

608
00:29:26,280 --> 00:29:27,120
Speaker 6: and these people need to.

609
00:29:27,040 --> 00:29:28,920
Speaker 5: Be out of here. And I think that is the

610
00:29:29,000 --> 00:29:31,080
Speaker 5: key point that Ryan mentioned. Miami.

611
00:29:31,160 --> 00:29:33,320
Speaker 6: A bunch of Republicans in Florida members of the House

612
00:29:33,360 --> 00:29:35,280
Speaker 6: are saying, well, come on, can you tone it down

613
00:29:35,320 --> 00:29:38,200
Speaker 6: a bit because they're feeling some backlash from their constituents

614
00:29:38,200 --> 00:29:40,160
Speaker 6: who are like, you know, the leoparded, what's the face

615
00:29:40,360 --> 00:29:42,080
Speaker 6: the face eating leopard party meme?

616
00:29:42,160 --> 00:29:43,320
Speaker 5: Like, I didn't know they'd come for my.

617
00:29:43,440 --> 00:29:46,760
Speaker 8: Friends, Manny, I know you have to run. So thank

618
00:29:46,760 --> 00:29:48,880
Speaker 8: you so much for sticking around for a second segment.

619
00:29:48,920 --> 00:29:49,640
Speaker 7: We appreciate it.

620
00:29:50,280 --> 00:29:56,160
Speaker 3: Thank you guys, of course, Zoron Mom Donnie held a

621
00:29:56,200 --> 00:29:59,160
Speaker 3: press conference to respond to President Trump's threat that he

622
00:29:59,240 --> 00:30:01,440
Speaker 3: was going to do also of things to him, including

623
00:30:01,760 --> 00:30:04,240
Speaker 3: round him up, to port him jailum, et cetera.

624
00:30:04,840 --> 00:30:05,880
Speaker 4: Here's Mom, Donnie.

625
00:30:06,120 --> 00:30:11,840
Speaker 11: Yesterday, Donald Trump said that I should be arrested. He

626
00:30:11,880 --> 00:30:14,400
Speaker 11: said that I should be deported. He said that I

627
00:30:14,400 --> 00:30:21,720
Speaker 11: should be denaturalized. And he said those things about me,

628
00:30:23,360 --> 00:30:25,600
Speaker 11: someone who stands to be the first immigrant mayor of

629
00:30:25,600 --> 00:30:28,680
Speaker 11: this city in generation, someone who would also be the

630
00:30:28,720 --> 00:30:31,040
Speaker 11: first Muslim in the first South Asian mayor in this

631
00:30:31,080 --> 00:30:35,200
Speaker 11: city's history, less so because of who I am, because

632
00:30:35,200 --> 00:30:37,320
Speaker 11: of where I come from, because of how I look

633
00:30:37,400 --> 00:30:39,440
Speaker 11: or how I speak, and more so because he wants

634
00:30:39,480 --> 00:30:42,600
Speaker 11: to distract from what I fight for. I fight for

635
00:30:42,680 --> 00:30:45,840
Speaker 11: working people. I fight for the very people that have

636
00:30:45,880 --> 00:30:47,440
Speaker 11: been priced out of this city. And I fight for

637
00:30:47,480 --> 00:30:49,360
Speaker 11: the same people that he said he was fighting for.

638
00:30:50,280 --> 00:30:52,240
Speaker 11: This is the same president who ran on a campaign

639
00:30:52,280 --> 00:30:55,560
Speaker 11: of cheaper groceries, who ran on a campaign about easing

640
00:30:55,600 --> 00:30:59,160
Speaker 11: a suffocating cost of living crisis, And ultimately, it is

641
00:30:59,240 --> 00:31:01,920
Speaker 11: easier for him to fan the flames of division than

642
00:31:01,960 --> 00:31:03,960
Speaker 11: to acknowledge the ways in which he has betrayed those

643
00:31:04,000 --> 00:31:06,600
Speaker 11: working class Americans, not just in the city, but across

644
00:31:06,600 --> 00:31:08,840
Speaker 11: this country and the ways in which he continues to

645
00:31:08,840 --> 00:31:11,440
Speaker 11: betray them, because we know that he would rather speak

646
00:31:11,440 --> 00:31:13,720
Speaker 11: about me than speak about the legislation that he is

647
00:31:13,760 --> 00:31:18,600
Speaker 11: shepherding through Washington, DC, legislation that will quite literally take

648
00:31:18,640 --> 00:31:22,560
Speaker 11: healthcare away from Americans, legislation that will steal food from

649
00:31:22,560 --> 00:31:25,840
Speaker 11: the Hungary, legislation that looks to build upon one of

650
00:31:25,880 --> 00:31:28,480
Speaker 11: the largest transfers of wealth we've seen in recent history

651
00:31:28,480 --> 00:31:31,480
Speaker 11: in his first administration, and do it once again for

652
00:31:31,560 --> 00:31:34,080
Speaker 11: the very Americans who already have enough.

653
00:31:34,600 --> 00:31:35,280
Speaker 7: We should be.

654
00:31:35,320 --> 00:31:38,240
Speaker 11: Fighting for those that do not have what they need

655
00:31:38,280 --> 00:31:40,840
Speaker 11: to live a dignified life. That is what I will do,

656
00:31:41,040 --> 00:31:46,000
Speaker 11: and I am thankful to have the protection and to

657
00:31:46,040 --> 00:31:48,320
Speaker 11: have the support of so many New Yorkers who have

658
00:31:48,320 --> 00:31:51,480
Speaker 11: stood up and set how unacceptable this is, including our governor,

659
00:31:51,640 --> 00:31:54,680
Speaker 11: including members of the labor movement. And ultimately, what I

660
00:31:54,760 --> 00:31:57,600
Speaker 11: fear for is that if this is what Donald Trump

661
00:31:57,680 --> 00:32:01,880
Speaker 11: and his administration feel comfortable about saying about the Democratic

662
00:32:01,920 --> 00:32:04,600
Speaker 11: nominee for the mayor of New York City, imagine what

663
00:32:04,600 --> 00:32:07,360
Speaker 11: they feel comfortable saying and doing about immigrants whose names

664
00:32:07,400 --> 00:32:08,000
Speaker 11: they don't even know.

665
00:32:08,400 --> 00:32:11,000
Speaker 3: So also yesterday, and we can put up this element

666
00:32:11,040 --> 00:32:15,800
Speaker 3: here President Trump's Homeland Security Advisory Council, which is a

667
00:32:15,840 --> 00:32:19,760
Speaker 3: group that includes such luminaries as Bo Didel who is

668
00:32:19,800 --> 00:32:23,120
Speaker 3: the founder of Bikers for Trump, and Rudy Giuliani, who

669
00:32:23,200 --> 00:32:25,080
Speaker 3: is a believer or not the former mayor of New

670
00:32:25,160 --> 00:32:28,720
Speaker 3: York once in his life, as well as some other

671
00:32:28,760 --> 00:32:34,440
Speaker 3: folks they met, and they quickly decided that the main

672
00:32:34,480 --> 00:32:37,000
Speaker 3: thing the Homeland Security Advisory Council needed to focus its

673
00:32:37,200 --> 00:32:40,400
Speaker 3: meeting on was what they're going to do about zoron

674
00:32:40,480 --> 00:32:46,200
Speaker 3: Mam Donnie and talking about the Homeland Security Department having

675
00:32:46,640 --> 00:32:48,880
Speaker 3: authorities that haven't been used in the past that maybe.

676
00:32:48,640 --> 00:32:49,440
Speaker 4: Need to look into that.

677
00:32:49,840 --> 00:32:52,800
Speaker 3: So before we get into the actual threats on Mom Donnie,

678
00:32:52,840 --> 00:32:55,920
Speaker 3: Emily and I wanted to talk about his response to it,

679
00:32:55,960 --> 00:32:57,959
Speaker 3: because I think we both think that this is an

680
00:32:58,000 --> 00:33:01,719
Speaker 3: expression of a populist democratic party that could exist that

681
00:33:01,800 --> 00:33:03,840
Speaker 3: does not exist, but these are the kind of green

682
00:33:03,840 --> 00:33:06,920
Speaker 3: shoots of it popping up, and that if it did exist,

683
00:33:07,000 --> 00:33:10,800
Speaker 3: it would represent a genuinely interesting development on the scene

684
00:33:10,840 --> 00:33:13,880
Speaker 3: and would be kind of a party that was actually

685
00:33:15,000 --> 00:33:19,480
Speaker 3: worth working people respecting and voting for, which is stunning

686
00:33:19,520 --> 00:33:22,480
Speaker 3: because it's happening at a time when the Democratic Party

687
00:33:22,480 --> 00:33:24,160
Speaker 3: could not be at its lowest.

688
00:33:24,640 --> 00:33:28,640
Speaker 8: We saw when we were here yesterday. We saw a

689
00:33:28,680 --> 00:33:33,480
Speaker 8: preview of mom Donnie's strategy towards this when he just

690
00:33:33,520 --> 00:33:36,080
Speaker 8: first put out his statement after Trump made his comments

691
00:33:36,320 --> 00:33:38,240
Speaker 8: and pivoted, and we talked about that yesterday, how he

692
00:33:38,560 --> 00:33:42,840
Speaker 8: pivoted to basically class warfare. Did the same thing right here.

693
00:33:42,880 --> 00:33:45,720
Speaker 8: He pivoted not to I shouldn't say class warfare, because

694
00:33:45,720 --> 00:33:48,880
Speaker 8: I think that diminishes it. He pivoted to affordability. And

695
00:33:49,200 --> 00:33:51,240
Speaker 8: it's like, this is what you do if you realize

696
00:33:51,240 --> 00:33:54,120
Speaker 8: your average voter isn't Liz Cheney. This is how you

697
00:33:54,200 --> 00:33:57,600
Speaker 8: run a campaign where you're going after Trump, but you're

698
00:33:57,600 --> 00:34:00,200
Speaker 8: not fully taking Trump's bait. And I think it it's

699
00:34:00,200 --> 00:34:03,720
Speaker 8: genuinely a pretty interesting development for Democrats that they now

700
00:34:03,800 --> 00:34:05,560
Speaker 8: have a kind of textbook example of how.

701
00:34:05,400 --> 00:34:06,560
Speaker 4: To do the thing right.

702
00:34:07,240 --> 00:34:10,400
Speaker 3: It's not backing down on the initial charge. It's not

703
00:34:10,440 --> 00:34:13,640
Speaker 3: apologizing for any of the culture war stuff Trump is

704
00:34:13,680 --> 00:34:17,600
Speaker 3: doing here. It's pushing back on that, but then it's

705
00:34:17,640 --> 00:34:21,799
Speaker 3: moving and saying the reason you're doing this is because

706
00:34:21,840 --> 00:34:23,560
Speaker 3: you're a billionaire that doesn't care about people and you

707
00:34:23,600 --> 00:34:25,800
Speaker 3: just want to distract from the fact that you're stealing

708
00:34:25,840 --> 00:34:28,719
Speaker 3: everybody's medicaid and that you promise to run on making

709
00:34:28,760 --> 00:34:32,160
Speaker 3: groceres cheaper and you're not doing it. It's really interesting

710
00:34:32,200 --> 00:34:35,840
Speaker 3: because the twenty seventeen, you know, the first term version

711
00:34:36,200 --> 00:34:41,120
Speaker 3: of Democrats against Trump, would have just fully seized on

712
00:34:42,040 --> 00:34:46,760
Speaker 3: the culture war aspect of it and said Donald Trump

713
00:34:46,800 --> 00:34:49,439
Speaker 3: is a bigot, he's a xenophobe, we are a nation

714
00:34:49,480 --> 00:34:52,680
Speaker 3: of immigrants, and he doesn't back away from all of that. Rhetorically,

715
00:34:52,760 --> 00:34:55,799
Speaker 3: he believes all of those things, but that's not really

716
00:34:55,840 --> 00:34:56,960
Speaker 3: where he puts his energy.

717
00:34:57,400 --> 00:34:59,440
Speaker 8: But don't your response and what you're saying is that

718
00:34:59,480 --> 00:35:01,680
Speaker 8: twenty seven because I think this is so true and

719
00:35:01,840 --> 00:35:05,919
Speaker 8: easily Yeah, I feel like that's really what everyone would

720
00:35:05,920 --> 00:35:08,560
Speaker 8: have done. Like the conventional wisdom is that maybe you

721
00:35:08,719 --> 00:35:11,200
Speaker 8: throw in a couple of lines about grocery prices and

722
00:35:11,280 --> 00:35:14,879
Speaker 8: medicaid and snap, but actually you spend the bulk of

723
00:35:15,040 --> 00:35:17,840
Speaker 8: your response talking about how you are going to be

724
00:35:17,880 --> 00:35:20,319
Speaker 8: the first missile mayor of New York City and how

725
00:35:20,480 --> 00:35:23,800
Speaker 8: that's what scares Donald Trump. He's scared of brown people,

726
00:35:23,920 --> 00:35:28,680
Speaker 8: he's scared of change. I think that's totally true if

727
00:35:28,719 --> 00:35:30,439
Speaker 8: we put that in the time machine. If we put

728
00:35:30,440 --> 00:35:32,360
Speaker 8: mont Donnie in a time machine and say he was

729
00:35:32,400 --> 00:35:35,120
Speaker 8: running in twenty seventeen, maybe he would have been sparner

730
00:35:35,160 --> 00:35:35,560
Speaker 8: about it.

731
00:35:35,600 --> 00:35:38,759
Speaker 7: But the strategists on the.

732
00:35:38,760 --> 00:35:39,520
Speaker 5: Left would not have.

733
00:35:40,120 --> 00:35:41,239
Speaker 4: Yeah, they would not have.

734
00:35:41,360 --> 00:35:44,040
Speaker 3: And I think it's probably it's tied up in the

735
00:35:44,080 --> 00:35:49,640
Speaker 3: intrademocratic fight that happened at the time where Bernie Sanders had,

736
00:35:50,000 --> 00:35:53,400
Speaker 3: you know, just come off this very bitter primary, where

737
00:35:53,480 --> 00:35:55,760
Speaker 3: a lot of Hillary Clinton supporters were still even blaming

738
00:35:55,800 --> 00:35:58,399
Speaker 3: Bernie Sanders for the fact that Trump was in at all.

739
00:35:59,400 --> 00:36:03,959
Speaker 3: And anybody who said that Donald Trump supporters had quote

740
00:36:04,000 --> 00:36:07,480
Speaker 3: unquote economic anxiety, yes, was that was said to be

741
00:36:07,600 --> 00:36:12,080
Speaker 3: code for the real reason that they've supported Trump, which

742
00:36:12,160 --> 00:36:14,840
Speaker 3: is their their racism and their homophobia and their bigotry

743
00:36:14,880 --> 00:36:19,160
Speaker 3: and on and on and so, because that was the case,

744
00:36:19,239 --> 00:36:24,000
Speaker 3: if Democrats shied away from talking about economic anxiety because

745
00:36:24,040 --> 00:36:26,399
Speaker 3: they were afraid that they would then like, oh, look

746
00:36:26,400 --> 00:36:33,359
Speaker 3: at you, you racist much Mamdani instead takes Trump at

747
00:36:33,400 --> 00:36:35,880
Speaker 3: his word and says, if you notice in that clip

748
00:36:35,920 --> 00:36:40,720
Speaker 3: he says Trump ran on these things, people voted for him.

749
00:36:41,280 --> 00:36:42,840
Speaker 4: The point he's making is people voted.

750
00:36:42,640 --> 00:36:45,279
Speaker 3: For Trump because he promised he was going to lower

751
00:36:45,320 --> 00:36:46,880
Speaker 3: grocery prices. He was going to make the city more

752
00:36:46,880 --> 00:36:50,160
Speaker 3: affordable and fill their lives with some dignity, make their

753
00:36:50,200 --> 00:36:50,759
Speaker 3: lives better.

754
00:36:50,880 --> 00:36:52,560
Speaker 4: That's what Trump said he was going to do.

755
00:36:54,120 --> 00:36:57,560
Speaker 3: And he's talking to Trump supporters and saying he's not

756
00:36:57,600 --> 00:36:57,960
Speaker 3: doing that.

757
00:36:58,000 --> 00:36:58,640
Speaker 4: What is he doing?

758
00:36:58,680 --> 00:37:02,719
Speaker 3: He's getting you all riled up about me when all

759
00:37:02,760 --> 00:37:05,000
Speaker 3: I'm trying to do is lower grocery prices.

760
00:37:05,320 --> 00:37:11,400
Speaker 8: I revisited this last week when we talked to Zoron

761
00:37:11,760 --> 00:37:12,399
Speaker 8: in what.

762
00:37:12,440 --> 00:37:13,680
Speaker 7: Was that December?

763
00:37:13,840 --> 00:37:14,680
Speaker 4: Yeah, something like that.

764
00:37:15,440 --> 00:37:16,720
Speaker 7: Yeah, it was November December.

765
00:37:16,719 --> 00:37:18,840
Speaker 8: Actually, you know what, I think it was November because

766
00:37:18,880 --> 00:37:21,120
Speaker 8: he was going to say told.

767
00:37:21,000 --> 00:37:22,439
Speaker 4: He was interviewing the Trump people.

768
00:37:22,520 --> 00:37:25,040
Speaker 7: Yeah, yeah, he did. He sort of followed Alexander A.

769
00:37:25,120 --> 00:37:27,960
Speaker 8: Kazo Cortez's lead and went out into I think he

770
00:37:28,000 --> 00:37:30,520
Speaker 8: told this to the Bronx and he was in Queen's

771
00:37:30,880 --> 00:37:34,160
Speaker 8: he was interviewing people, talking to them, trying to pitch

772
00:37:34,239 --> 00:37:37,040
Speaker 8: himself to Trump voters, and he said the number one

773
00:37:37,040 --> 00:37:39,520
Speaker 8: thing they were concerned about was the price of groceries.

774
00:37:39,560 --> 00:37:42,879
Speaker 8: They feel like they have less in their bank accounts than.

775
00:37:42,800 --> 00:37:43,200
Speaker 4: They used to.

776
00:37:43,800 --> 00:37:49,239
Speaker 8: And that's again, it's so obvious. But twenty seventeen you

777
00:37:49,400 --> 00:37:52,120
Speaker 8: just couldn't make that argument period, which.

778
00:37:51,960 --> 00:37:54,440
Speaker 3: Is weird because of course you could, but like you could,

779
00:37:55,320 --> 00:37:57,399
Speaker 3: just the structures of the Democratic Party at the time

780
00:37:57,440 --> 00:37:59,520
Speaker 3: were just not allowing the party there was on And

781
00:37:59,560 --> 00:38:04,920
Speaker 3: also they were so thoroughly rewarded by the media for

782
00:38:06,280 --> 00:38:07,399
Speaker 3: leaning into the culture war.

783
00:38:08,120 --> 00:38:10,480
Speaker 4: Yes, yes, and rewarded.

784
00:38:10,040 --> 00:38:14,120
Speaker 3: By a significant chunk of their voters. Doesn't mean those

785
00:38:14,200 --> 00:38:17,759
Speaker 3: voters wouldn't also have been with them on other stuff. Now,

786
00:38:18,120 --> 00:38:21,400
Speaker 3: inflation was not what it was in twenty seventeen, like

787
00:38:21,480 --> 00:38:26,000
Speaker 3: we had you know, one percent inflation since basically the

788
00:38:26,040 --> 00:38:31,279
Speaker 3: financial crisis, so you know, the context is actually different now.

789
00:38:31,680 --> 00:38:34,160
Speaker 3: The economy is stunk, and that's why Trump won, I

790
00:38:34,160 --> 00:38:36,600
Speaker 3: think in twenty sixteen. But it wasn't exactly prices. It

791
00:38:36,640 --> 00:38:40,239
Speaker 3: was wages and joblessness which was slowly getting you know,

792
00:38:40,360 --> 00:38:43,319
Speaker 3: had gradually come back from the financial crisis, but not

793
00:38:43,840 --> 00:38:46,640
Speaker 3: but took so long, and people were mined in debt

794
00:38:46,680 --> 00:38:47,400
Speaker 3: and student teds.

795
00:38:47,400 --> 00:38:50,759
Speaker 8: So opioid crisis had plenty of local economy is.

796
00:38:50,960 --> 00:38:52,880
Speaker 3: Going on, So I think Democratic base would have been

797
00:38:52,880 --> 00:38:55,200
Speaker 3: there for it. But Democrats didn't need to go there

798
00:38:55,239 --> 00:38:57,680
Speaker 3: because they would get they would get donations, they get crowds,

799
00:38:58,360 --> 00:39:01,640
Speaker 3: and they would get fawning me media coverage for pointing

800
00:39:01,640 --> 00:39:05,360
Speaker 3: out what a big at Trump was, and so they

801
00:39:05,360 --> 00:39:07,800
Speaker 3: didn't need to go and be like, look, he actually

802
00:39:07,840 --> 00:39:09,600
Speaker 3: said he was going to run on all these things

803
00:39:10,200 --> 00:39:12,040
Speaker 3: to make your life better, and he's not doing that.

804
00:39:12,120 --> 00:39:14,839
Speaker 3: They didn't didn't want to take it seriously. They didn't

805
00:39:14,840 --> 00:39:17,120
Speaker 3: want to take seriously the idea that he actually.

806
00:39:16,880 --> 00:39:19,560
Speaker 8: Ran on that stuff because they thought that the silver

807
00:39:19,640 --> 00:39:23,839
Speaker 8: bullet was their own cultural arguments against Trump, and it wasn't.

808
00:39:23,880 --> 00:39:26,680
Speaker 8: That wasn't enough to persuade voters who have always baked

809
00:39:26,719 --> 00:39:28,680
Speaker 8: into their calculation. And this is what the media doesn't

810
00:39:28,719 --> 00:39:30,920
Speaker 8: understand because the media is pretty friendly with a lot

811
00:39:30,920 --> 00:39:31,640
Speaker 8: of politicians.

812
00:39:32,200 --> 00:39:34,399
Speaker 7: Other voters understand that.

813
00:39:34,600 --> 00:39:38,439
Speaker 8: Politicians are probably bad people, right like, they know that

814
00:39:38,480 --> 00:39:41,320
Speaker 8: you're not convincing people to stop supporting Trump by saying

815
00:39:41,640 --> 00:39:44,760
Speaker 8: he's a bad guy. That's not like a slam dunk

816
00:39:45,360 --> 00:39:49,160
Speaker 8: own on a Trump supporter. They actually are making a

817
00:39:49,200 --> 00:39:52,440
Speaker 8: calculated decision that he was going to disrupt the system.

818
00:39:52,640 --> 00:39:54,840
Speaker 8: And if you're not competing on that field, you're not

819
00:39:54,880 --> 00:39:59,319
Speaker 8: competing at all. You're arguing totally past what you could

820
00:39:59,320 --> 00:40:01,959
Speaker 8: possibly persuade people on yeah.

821
00:40:02,040 --> 00:40:05,240
Speaker 3: And I think also the party's donors are ambivalent about

822
00:40:05,560 --> 00:40:06,800
Speaker 3: any class first messaging.

823
00:40:07,000 --> 00:40:09,360
Speaker 7: Yeah, yeah, of course that.

824
00:40:09,800 --> 00:40:13,680
Speaker 4: They're like, eh, like, can we do some of the

825
00:40:13,680 --> 00:40:16,520
Speaker 4: other stuff. Were you at all or welcome?

826
00:40:16,760 --> 00:40:20,600
Speaker 8: When they did the asterisk after every mention of Trump. Yeah,

827
00:40:20,920 --> 00:40:22,319
Speaker 8: I look back in that and I remember it said

828
00:40:22,320 --> 00:40:25,319
Speaker 8: like Donald Trump is a racist, enophobic, chemophobic bigot and

829
00:40:25,360 --> 00:40:27,160
Speaker 8: something like that, and every mention of Trump it had

830
00:40:27,200 --> 00:40:29,719
Speaker 8: an asterisk and said that. I was like, I mean,

831
00:40:30,520 --> 00:40:32,719
Speaker 8: many people believe all of that is true. I mean,

832
00:40:32,760 --> 00:40:35,719
Speaker 8: you can make arguments about all of that, but it's

833
00:40:35,800 --> 00:40:38,480
Speaker 8: not persuasive. It actually distracts. I don't know, we don't

834
00:40:38,480 --> 00:40:40,520
Speaker 8: have to relitigate that. But it was a good example

835
00:40:40,560 --> 00:40:41,600
Speaker 8: of the approach at the time.

836
00:40:41,880 --> 00:40:44,040
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean, and I think if we went back

837
00:40:44,080 --> 00:40:45,680
Speaker 3: and looked at it, it didn't. I don't think it

838
00:40:45,719 --> 00:40:50,279
Speaker 3: had any class messaging in it because, like you could

839
00:40:50,280 --> 00:40:50,839
Speaker 3: have led with.

840
00:40:52,480 --> 00:40:57,200
Speaker 4: Donald Trump is a billionaire blah blah, right, But.

841
00:40:57,200 --> 00:40:59,560
Speaker 7: I think the only way that union busting.

842
00:40:59,719 --> 00:41:03,000
Speaker 3: Right only rips off everyone who's ever worked for him.

843
00:41:03,640 --> 00:41:06,480
Speaker 3: I think the only way huff Post was able to

844
00:41:06,480 --> 00:41:08,080
Speaker 3: get away with that, And yeah, I was, I was

845
00:41:08,120 --> 00:41:11,600
Speaker 3: there and involved with it at the time, like journalistically

846
00:41:12,160 --> 00:41:17,200
Speaker 3: was because it it would feel more part as than

847
00:41:17,280 --> 00:41:19,600
Speaker 3: if it was class in a way mm hmm, like

848
00:41:20,800 --> 00:41:24,759
Speaker 3: because what it was doing was pointing to their universal

849
00:41:24,800 --> 00:41:31,080
Speaker 3: American values, which are, you know, equality, justice, we treat

850
00:41:31,080 --> 00:41:34,960
Speaker 3: all people with dignity, civil rights like at least at

851
00:41:34,960 --> 00:41:39,000
Speaker 3: that time, Yeah, everyone believed in the civil rights movement,

852
00:41:39,040 --> 00:41:41,279
Speaker 3: like left to far right like that. The civil not

853
00:41:41,280 --> 00:41:43,960
Speaker 3: not far right, but left to right civil rights movement

854
00:41:44,000 --> 00:41:46,040
Speaker 3: was seen as like a very good thing that was

855
00:41:46,440 --> 00:41:49,919
Speaker 3: that was brought to people who fought for justice, brought

856
00:41:49,960 --> 00:41:50,680
Speaker 3: by people who were.

857
00:41:50,760 --> 00:41:53,520
Speaker 8: Charlie Kirk had not yet discovered Martin Luther King Jr.

858
00:41:54,200 --> 00:41:58,600
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, right, They hadn't gone down different rabbit holes

859
00:41:58,640 --> 00:42:02,040
Speaker 3: and come up with theories and and so it appealed

860
00:42:02,040 --> 00:42:07,000
Speaker 3: to these universal values, whereas if you say, he's a billionaire,

861
00:42:07,000 --> 00:42:09,719
Speaker 3: he wants to rip people off, like that feels that's

862
00:42:09,800 --> 00:42:13,960
Speaker 3: us against them. That's that's more partisan, in not in

863
00:42:13,960 --> 00:42:15,600
Speaker 3: a party sense, but in a.

864
00:42:17,560 --> 00:42:18,320
Speaker 4: We are.

865
00:42:19,760 --> 00:42:23,319
Speaker 3: There's just fundamental disagreements here that we're not going to

866
00:42:23,560 --> 00:42:25,120
Speaker 3: win by persuasion.

867
00:42:25,360 --> 00:42:28,320
Speaker 4: We're going to just have to beat the one percent.

868
00:42:29,440 --> 00:42:31,040
Speaker 3: We're just like or the one percent is going to

869
00:42:31,120 --> 00:42:33,400
Speaker 3: have to beat us, like this is a fight over

870
00:42:34,040 --> 00:42:37,439
Speaker 3: something that makes sense, and so then as journalists that

871
00:42:37,440 --> 00:42:41,239
Speaker 3: that feels like you're now engaging in the you're in

872
00:42:41,560 --> 00:42:44,440
Speaker 3: that fight in a way where if you're just upholding

873
00:42:44,520 --> 00:42:48,279
Speaker 3: universal values, like when the Washing Post says democracy dies

874
00:42:48,320 --> 00:42:51,520
Speaker 3: in darkness, like they can say that and not feel

875
00:42:51,560 --> 00:42:57,480
Speaker 3: partisan because ye, of course we're all for democracy and

876
00:42:57,520 --> 00:43:01,759
Speaker 3: we're all for transparency and we're all against darkness. When

877
00:43:01,800 --> 00:43:06,320
Speaker 3: you say, you know, the one percent are ripping us all.

878
00:43:06,160 --> 00:43:08,759
Speaker 7: Off, I don't think your owners will love it.

879
00:43:11,880 --> 00:43:14,680
Speaker 4: Yeah, and the point one percent of ripping the one percent.

880
00:43:14,440 --> 00:43:19,000
Speaker 3: Off, yeah yeah, then that feels now you're tangling.

881
00:43:19,200 --> 00:43:22,840
Speaker 8: Which is also the massive like unanswered question to the

882
00:43:22,880 --> 00:43:25,680
Speaker 8: extent that Democrats are able to replicate if they want

883
00:43:25,680 --> 00:43:28,799
Speaker 8: to win, if they put power above everything else, and

884
00:43:28,840 --> 00:43:30,799
Speaker 8: that's not all of them, you know, it's some like

885
00:43:31,000 --> 00:43:35,560
Speaker 8: some Republicans have genuine ideological values that they want to advance.

886
00:43:35,680 --> 00:43:38,480
Speaker 8: But if they just want to win, do they replicate

887
00:43:38,480 --> 00:43:42,640
Speaker 8: the Mom Donnie campaign in congressional races in the midterms,

888
00:43:42,680 --> 00:43:45,800
Speaker 8: for example, in gubernatorial races where you learn from.

889
00:43:45,680 --> 00:43:50,000
Speaker 3: Him and Democrats made affordability the thing that was associated

890
00:43:50,000 --> 00:43:50,520
Speaker 3: with them.

891
00:43:50,520 --> 00:43:54,200
Speaker 8: Right, but they're already getting hammered for what. There are

892
00:43:54,200 --> 00:43:58,520
Speaker 8: already Republicans running ads comparing like random DEM candidates. I

893
00:43:58,520 --> 00:44:00,160
Speaker 8: forget who the first one I saw was, but like

894
00:44:00,280 --> 00:44:03,160
Speaker 8: random D candidates to mom Donnie. I think Glenn Younkin

895
00:44:03,239 --> 00:44:07,880
Speaker 8: said it about the gubernatorial nominee in Virginia, Stanberger, right.

896
00:44:07,920 --> 00:44:11,560
Speaker 4: Exactly, exactly real, Mom Donnie.

897
00:44:11,800 --> 00:44:16,000
Speaker 3: It's suicidal and part of Democrats because the question is,

898
00:44:16,120 --> 00:44:19,280
Speaker 3: how do you define what he stands for to the

899
00:44:19,360 --> 00:44:23,520
Speaker 3: national public before you're then linked with him. And so

900
00:44:24,080 --> 00:44:26,080
Speaker 3: if the national public is like, oh, yeah, Mom Donnie,

901
00:44:26,080 --> 00:44:29,279
Speaker 3: this guy who like ran to make groceries cheaper in

902
00:44:29,320 --> 00:44:32,600
Speaker 3: New York, then when Republicans are like, spamburger is nothing

903
00:44:32,640 --> 00:44:34,759
Speaker 3: but another Mom Donnie, people are like, oh cool, so

904
00:44:34,840 --> 00:44:38,319
Speaker 3: she's also going to make groceries cheaper in Virginia. But

905
00:44:38,480 --> 00:44:41,719
Speaker 3: if Republicans are all saying that he's a Sharia law

906
00:44:41,920 --> 00:44:48,279
Speaker 3: loving jihadist, and then Democrats are also saying that they

907
00:44:48,880 --> 00:44:51,520
Speaker 3: have deep concerns about his use of the word global jihadis,

908
00:44:51,640 --> 00:44:53,920
Speaker 3: and then she and then cures in jail Brennapp apologizes

909
00:44:53,920 --> 00:44:55,680
Speaker 3: because he never said that, but like that, they have

910
00:44:55,719 --> 00:44:59,360
Speaker 3: all these concerns about him. Right, so all the leading

911
00:44:59,360 --> 00:45:03,640
Speaker 3: Democrats still not endorsed him, became Jefferies, Chuck Schumer, Jello Brand.

912
00:45:05,400 --> 00:45:09,080
Speaker 4: And it's Swosey just put Tom Sposey.

913
00:45:08,880 --> 00:45:11,480
Speaker 3: Long just had a op ed in the New York

914
00:45:11,520 --> 00:45:14,440
Speaker 3: Times about how bad he is. And so if Republicans

915
00:45:14,480 --> 00:45:17,960
Speaker 3: are saying he's really awful and like the worst and

916
00:45:18,000 --> 00:45:23,200
Speaker 3: basically a terrorist, and Democrats are saying, the leading Democrats

917
00:45:23,239 --> 00:45:26,680
Speaker 3: are saying, yeah, he's kind of bad, He's not that bad,

918
00:45:26,880 --> 00:45:29,040
Speaker 3: Like Republicans are over the top and then bigoted in

919
00:45:29,040 --> 00:45:30,080
Speaker 3: the way they're talking about him.

920
00:45:30,080 --> 00:45:32,160
Speaker 4: But I do have a lot of concerns about him.

921
00:45:32,480 --> 00:45:34,719
Speaker 3: Then nationally, if you're a voter, you're like, oh, this

922
00:45:34,760 --> 00:45:39,320
Speaker 3: guy seems pretty concerning. You have to actually like engage

923
00:45:39,320 --> 00:45:42,760
Speaker 3: with him or immedia that covers him honestly to get

924
00:45:42,960 --> 00:45:44,440
Speaker 3: the accurate impression.

925
00:45:44,480 --> 00:45:46,160
Speaker 4: And there aren't enough people that do that.

926
00:45:46,600 --> 00:45:48,440
Speaker 8: Yeah, I mean this is from a cure like just

927
00:45:48,440 --> 00:45:51,200
Speaker 8: a purely cynical perspective, but Republicans are basically able to

928
00:45:51,200 --> 00:45:54,480
Speaker 8: do this. With Nancy Pelosi back in twenty ten, socialist

929
00:45:54,600 --> 00:45:58,279
Speaker 8: Nancy Pelosi back in twenty ten, it's when they put

930
00:45:58,360 --> 00:46:02,319
Speaker 8: enough money behind it and enough like what's the right

931
00:46:02,320 --> 00:46:07,840
Speaker 8: word for it, craft into like carvilion public relations efforts

932
00:46:07,880 --> 00:46:08,600
Speaker 8: into it.

933
00:46:08,680 --> 00:46:08,960
Speaker 7: You can.

934
00:46:09,000 --> 00:46:11,280
Speaker 8: It's one of the scary things about politics meediing in general,

935
00:46:11,320 --> 00:46:15,680
Speaker 8: but you can in a red state pretty easily capitalize

936
00:46:15,680 --> 00:46:18,480
Speaker 8: on a mom Donnie narrative. It doesn't mean that mom

937
00:46:18,560 --> 00:46:20,600
Speaker 8: Donnie is in any way a net drag on the

938
00:46:20,600 --> 00:46:24,040
Speaker 8: Democratic Party, but I think it'll probably work for them

939
00:46:24,040 --> 00:46:25,000
Speaker 8: in red states.

940
00:46:25,040 --> 00:46:26,840
Speaker 7: Not so much of Virginia though.

941
00:46:26,920 --> 00:46:31,720
Speaker 3: But yeah, I think if Democrats wanted to like avoid

942
00:46:31,760 --> 00:46:35,440
Speaker 3: this problem, yeah, they would say, of course I support

943
00:46:35,920 --> 00:46:38,000
Speaker 3: I'm Donnie and it's call to make groceries cheaper.

944
00:46:39,200 --> 00:46:40,560
Speaker 4: But they just can't do that.

945
00:46:40,680 --> 00:46:42,200
Speaker 8: Just the guy wants to make I don't agree with

946
00:46:42,280 --> 00:46:44,000
Speaker 8: him on everything, but I sure as I'll agree with

947
00:46:44,040 --> 00:46:45,120
Speaker 8: him making groceries cheaper.

948
00:46:47,280 --> 00:46:48,960
Speaker 7: For advice here, I mean, we're always.

949
00:46:48,680 --> 00:46:50,520
Speaker 4: Just giving it out and nobody takes it.

950
00:46:50,719 --> 00:46:55,479
Speaker 7: Yeah, all right, Ryan, let's move on.

951
00:46:55,400 --> 00:46:59,280
Speaker 3: To the ditty tri Yes, so, uh, Sean ditty Collms

952
00:47:00,280 --> 00:47:02,360
Speaker 3: is not walking out of the courthouse a freeman, but

953
00:47:02,360 --> 00:47:05,120
Speaker 3: he thought he might for a second, so he was acquitted.

954
00:47:05,120 --> 00:47:06,640
Speaker 4: We could put this first element up on the screen.

955
00:47:06,680 --> 00:47:09,560
Speaker 3: He was quitted on the most serious charges, the racketeering

956
00:47:09,640 --> 00:47:13,000
Speaker 3: charge and the and the sex trafficking charges. But he

957
00:47:13,120 --> 00:47:18,560
Speaker 3: did get found guilty on two counts of transporting prostitutes.

958
00:47:19,200 --> 00:47:21,759
Speaker 3: He was not he did not get hit with any

959
00:47:21,760 --> 00:47:26,040
Speaker 3: domestic violence charges because they were outside the statute of limitations, right,

960
00:47:26,480 --> 00:47:32,200
Speaker 3: And so did he collapse to the floor and like

961
00:47:32,239 --> 00:47:34,280
Speaker 3: praying do we have that? Do we have that image

962
00:47:34,280 --> 00:47:38,239
Speaker 3: of him like praying? Seat there yet thanking a thank

963
00:47:38,360 --> 00:47:40,640
Speaker 3: to the jurors, and then it did it did seem

964
00:47:40,640 --> 00:47:41,960
Speaker 3: like he felt like he was about to get out,

965
00:47:41,960 --> 00:47:46,000
Speaker 3: and the judge said no, interestingly cited the domestic violence

966
00:47:46,080 --> 00:47:49,840
Speaker 3: that was in the case as the reason why she

967
00:47:50,000 --> 00:47:54,120
Speaker 3: was not giving bail before sentencing or he cheer.

968
00:47:53,920 --> 00:47:57,600
Speaker 4: He the judge the judge, I didn't watch enough of

969
00:47:57,600 --> 00:47:58,320
Speaker 4: the case.

970
00:47:59,640 --> 00:48:03,359
Speaker 3: Which is interesting because clearly he was guilty, it's on video,

971
00:48:03,920 --> 00:48:07,000
Speaker 3: but he was not tried for it. So it's this

972
00:48:07,040 --> 00:48:12,280
Speaker 3: gray area where bail and accusations can have an interplay

973
00:48:12,280 --> 00:48:15,440
Speaker 3: that leads to you being behind chart, behind behind bars.

974
00:48:15,760 --> 00:48:19,279
Speaker 3: But clearly a jury felt that it was not a conspiracy.

975
00:48:20,440 --> 00:48:23,719
Speaker 3: And what what did he had argued or did he's

976
00:48:23,760 --> 00:48:26,840
Speaker 3: lawyers had argued, is that yes, there was a plan

977
00:48:27,760 --> 00:48:28,880
Speaker 3: to have these freak offs.

978
00:48:29,200 --> 00:48:29,399
Speaker 5: Yep.

979
00:48:30,360 --> 00:48:33,400
Speaker 3: And they were organized, and in that sense, there was

980
00:48:33,440 --> 00:48:37,600
Speaker 3: a conspiracy because he would tell, hey, you do the drugs,

981
00:48:37,640 --> 00:48:38,040
Speaker 3: you do the.

982
00:48:37,960 --> 00:48:40,360
Speaker 4: Baby oil, you bring the women.

983
00:48:41,560 --> 00:48:45,239
Speaker 3: And he had and he had an overarching kind of

984
00:48:45,400 --> 00:48:49,799
Speaker 3: leverage campaign that he would use with women where some

985
00:48:49,840 --> 00:48:53,040
Speaker 3: would have beginning ten thousand a month and child support others,

986
00:48:53,160 --> 00:48:56,120
Speaker 3: others would have an emotional connection others.

987
00:48:56,200 --> 00:48:59,200
Speaker 4: You know, there's different various ways that he got them involved.

988
00:48:59,200 --> 00:49:00,360
Speaker 4: Plus some you know, just.

989
00:49:00,400 --> 00:49:03,680
Speaker 3: According to them and seems credible fear of violence. So

990
00:49:04,000 --> 00:49:06,440
Speaker 3: there are all these pieces. But he made this they

991
00:49:06,480 --> 00:49:11,680
Speaker 3: made this kind of loophole argument almost that the other

992
00:49:11,960 --> 00:49:15,120
Speaker 3: people were not partners in a conspiracy. There were just

993
00:49:15,120 --> 00:49:19,040
Speaker 3: his flunkies who he paid to do work, and that

994
00:49:20,040 --> 00:49:21,719
Speaker 3: if you could use Rico for this, you could use

995
00:49:21,800 --> 00:49:26,880
Speaker 3: Rico for anything where you didn't, you know, single handedly

996
00:49:27,040 --> 00:49:32,000
Speaker 3: carry out every aspect of the crime, like you know,

997
00:49:32,080 --> 00:49:34,960
Speaker 3: if you go and buy a handgun and then commit

998
00:49:35,000 --> 00:49:35,560
Speaker 3: a crime with.

999
00:49:35,520 --> 00:49:36,200
Speaker 4: It, like.

1000
00:49:37,880 --> 00:49:41,160
Speaker 3: And it was just a business transaction with the gun owner,

1001
00:49:41,920 --> 00:49:44,880
Speaker 3: like did you conspire with the gun owner even if

1002
00:49:44,880 --> 00:49:46,680
Speaker 3: the gun owner knew what you're gonna do? That would

1003
00:49:46,680 --> 00:49:48,280
Speaker 3: be and the point is that would be a different

1004
00:49:48,320 --> 00:49:53,520
Speaker 3: crime like that, that's the underlying crime, but layering conspiracy

1005
00:49:53,520 --> 00:49:56,520
Speaker 3: on top of it doesn't get you there. That That

1006
00:49:56,719 --> 00:49:59,640
Speaker 3: is my guess at trying to get into the jurors mindset.

1007
00:49:59,760 --> 00:50:02,200
Speaker 4: What what did you think of the response?

1008
00:50:02,719 --> 00:50:03,400
Speaker 7: Yeah, I mean I think that.

1009
00:50:03,640 --> 00:50:05,760
Speaker 4: What's your response to the jury's response?

1010
00:50:05,920 --> 00:50:06,879
Speaker 7: No, I think that's right.

1011
00:50:07,640 --> 00:50:10,480
Speaker 8: I think the rico is starting to look like an

1012
00:50:10,560 --> 00:50:13,880
Speaker 8: over prosecution. Bundling everything into a rico is starting to

1013
00:50:13,880 --> 00:50:15,120
Speaker 8: look like a real mistake.

1014
00:50:15,360 --> 00:50:16,680
Speaker 7: And you will be.

1015
00:50:16,640 --> 00:50:19,120
Speaker 8: Shocked to learn that one of the leading prosecutors on

1016
00:50:19,160 --> 00:50:22,200
Speaker 8: this case is Marine Comy, who is James Commey's daughter.

1017
00:50:22,520 --> 00:50:22,960
Speaker 4: Amazing.

1018
00:50:23,280 --> 00:50:26,560
Speaker 8: Yeah, it's just wild stuff, but it looks like a

1019
00:50:26,600 --> 00:50:31,799
Speaker 8: really overconfident prosecution team. To be clear, he could end

1020
00:50:31,880 --> 00:50:35,520
Speaker 8: up with twenty years in prison, so he was denied bail.

1021
00:50:35,680 --> 00:50:38,000
Speaker 8: He has to stay in prison until his sentencing, which

1022
00:50:38,040 --> 00:50:41,360
Speaker 8: is on October third, so he's still got a ways

1023
00:50:41,360 --> 00:50:45,719
Speaker 8: to go. But he could still also get twenty.

1024
00:50:45,480 --> 00:50:47,320
Speaker 4: Years, right, it's highly probably unlikely.

1025
00:50:47,440 --> 00:50:47,600
Speaker 5: Right.

1026
00:50:47,640 --> 00:50:51,760
Speaker 3: So each there's two charges and their ten years maximum. Right,

1027
00:50:52,440 --> 00:50:55,279
Speaker 3: So if they were served one after the other and

1028
00:50:55,440 --> 00:50:57,399
Speaker 3: both the maximum, then he could get twenty years.

1029
00:50:57,480 --> 00:50:58,279
Speaker 4: Right, But.

1030
00:50:59,719 --> 00:51:02,120
Speaker 3: This is when sentence and guidelines come in and you

1031
00:51:02,520 --> 00:51:04,719
Speaker 3: have to kind of set aside who he is and

1032
00:51:04,719 --> 00:51:08,799
Speaker 3: what we know about the case. And pretty sure he's

1033
00:51:08,840 --> 00:51:11,480
Speaker 3: the first time offender. Does he have any other charges

1034
00:51:11,520 --> 00:51:12,160
Speaker 3: from before?

1035
00:51:12,560 --> 00:51:12,960
Speaker 7: Yeah?

1036
00:51:13,320 --> 00:51:14,480
Speaker 4: Does he? What does he have?

1037
00:51:15,719 --> 00:51:18,480
Speaker 8: He was? I mean, he's been involved in so many things.

1038
00:51:18,320 --> 00:51:19,920
Speaker 4: Which he's got a bunch of lawsuits.

1039
00:51:21,760 --> 00:51:24,400
Speaker 8: Well, there was the I'm trying to remember whether he

1040
00:51:24,440 --> 00:51:25,200
Speaker 8: got charged.

1041
00:51:24,960 --> 00:51:27,080
Speaker 4: For it, but there was Michael j Lo mac is

1042
00:51:27,080 --> 00:51:28,279
Speaker 4: already screened mac get.

1043
00:51:28,239 --> 00:51:30,520
Speaker 8: Yeah, send this to us, producer back. But there was

1044
00:51:30,560 --> 00:51:35,440
Speaker 8: the j Lo shooting. There was the nightclub like fire

1045
00:51:35,560 --> 00:51:37,560
Speaker 8: that people died in that he was implicated in.

1046
00:51:37,680 --> 00:51:39,279
Speaker 4: Right, did he catch charges on any of that thing?

1047
00:51:39,400 --> 00:51:39,520
Speaker 8: Right?

1048
00:51:39,560 --> 00:51:40,320
Speaker 7: That's a good question.

1049
00:51:40,440 --> 00:51:42,440
Speaker 8: He's, by the way, he is fifty five, So if

1050
00:51:42,440 --> 00:51:45,200
Speaker 8: he gets twenty years and serves out twenty years, he'll

1051
00:51:45,200 --> 00:51:46,239
Speaker 8: be an old man before he.

1052
00:51:46,160 --> 00:51:46,840
Speaker 7: Gets out of prison.

1053
00:51:46,880 --> 00:51:50,560
Speaker 4: But my guess is that he definitely will not serve

1054
00:51:50,600 --> 00:51:53,080
Speaker 4: all twenty years. I don't think. I don't think even close.

1055
00:51:53,160 --> 00:51:56,440
Speaker 3: Even now, there's some indication from the fact that he

1056
00:51:56,520 --> 00:51:59,800
Speaker 3: was denied bail here that the judge is going to

1057
00:51:59,880 --> 00:52:03,239
Speaker 3: go as hard as they feel like they can get

1058
00:52:03,280 --> 00:52:03,759
Speaker 3: away with.

1059
00:52:04,000 --> 00:52:06,680
Speaker 4: But I'd be very surprised.

1060
00:52:07,160 --> 00:52:10,960
Speaker 8: I think he was acquitted of murder in the first

1061
00:52:11,040 --> 00:52:13,200
Speaker 8: I think there was like a big if I'm remember incorrectly,

1062
00:52:13,640 --> 00:52:18,520
Speaker 8: there was a big case in the nightclub murder situation.

1063
00:52:18,640 --> 00:52:21,879
Speaker 8: This would have been around two thousand and I want

1064
00:52:21,880 --> 00:52:24,000
Speaker 8: to say he was acquitted of that. Actually, let's take

1065
00:52:24,040 --> 00:52:28,200
Speaker 8: a listen to Megan Kelly's reaction. Followed the case very

1066
00:52:28,239 --> 00:52:31,720
Speaker 8: closely and had some legal experts on when the news

1067
00:52:31,719 --> 00:52:33,440
Speaker 8: came down, and go ahead and take a look at

1068
00:52:33,440 --> 00:52:34,000
Speaker 8: this next club.

1069
00:52:34,320 --> 00:52:37,400
Speaker 12: Combs shook his head vigorously and put his hands together

1070
00:52:37,480 --> 00:52:39,880
Speaker 12: in prayer. Oh, it's all just so chummy inside the

1071
00:52:39,880 --> 00:52:46,440
Speaker 12: courtroom for this disgusting pervert female abuser who I can't

1072
00:52:46,480 --> 00:52:49,040
Speaker 12: believe is about j Romar Streets. Again, I'm sorry, I'm

1073
00:52:49,040 --> 00:52:52,440
Speaker 12: disgusted by this verdict. This is fucking ridiculous. I just

1074
00:52:52,480 --> 00:52:55,480
Speaker 12: find it absolutely outrageous the amount of crime that this

1075
00:52:55,520 --> 00:52:57,840
Speaker 12: guy just got away with. I believe he committed arson.

1076
00:52:58,080 --> 00:53:02,560
Speaker 12: He definitely battered Cassie. He Jane too. The statute of

1077
00:53:02,600 --> 00:53:06,280
Speaker 12: limitations for battery in Los Angeles, California is one year

1078
00:53:06,840 --> 00:53:09,600
Speaker 12: one year, So if they didn't charge him for battery

1079
00:53:09,640 --> 00:53:12,359
Speaker 12: within one year, and they couldn't because he bought the

1080
00:53:12,400 --> 00:53:15,160
Speaker 12: tape and it remained hidden thanks to those security guards

1081
00:53:15,160 --> 00:53:18,440
Speaker 12: out there. Then they could never charge him with that. Again,

1082
00:53:18,640 --> 00:53:21,839
Speaker 12: there's no question he dragged her back into that hotel room.

1083
00:53:21,840 --> 00:53:24,760
Speaker 12: Why wasn't that kidnapping? They only talked about the kidnapping

1084
00:53:25,080 --> 00:53:30,239
Speaker 12: of Capricorn Clark, who was his sort of main assistant,

1085
00:53:30,560 --> 00:53:33,480
Speaker 12: because she said he grabbed her and made her go

1086
00:53:33,640 --> 00:53:36,040
Speaker 12: with him over to kid Cutty's house. There's no question

1087
00:53:36,120 --> 00:53:38,520
Speaker 12: he broke into kid Cutty's house in my view, and

1088
00:53:38,560 --> 00:53:40,560
Speaker 12: that he opened up the Christmas presidents and locked the

1089
00:53:40,560 --> 00:53:42,799
Speaker 12: door in and made a thread. There's no question in

1090
00:53:42,800 --> 00:53:45,640
Speaker 12: my mind he was behind the arson of kid Cutty's car.

1091
00:53:45,719 --> 00:53:48,440
Speaker 12: And there was proof, plenty of proof to prove that.

1092
00:53:49,080 --> 00:53:49,200
Speaker 10: No.

1093
00:53:49,360 --> 00:53:52,440
Speaker 12: Okay, there was female fingerprints they found on that, the

1094
00:53:52,440 --> 00:53:55,120
Speaker 12: firebomb that was left there, the Molotov cocktail, and the

1095
00:53:55,160 --> 00:53:57,840
Speaker 12: prosecution said, there's no question he didn't do it himself.

1096
00:53:58,200 --> 00:54:01,480
Speaker 12: But he said I'm going to bomb kid Cutty's car.

1097
00:54:01,640 --> 00:54:04,680
Speaker 12: It's in writing. Cassie Ventura emailed her mother saying, oh

1098
00:54:04,680 --> 00:54:06,560
Speaker 12: my god, he's threatening to bomb his car. And two

1099
00:54:06,600 --> 00:54:08,240
Speaker 12: weeks later it got bombed.

1100
00:54:08,400 --> 00:54:09,879
Speaker 5: Oh gee, it was just some.

1101
00:54:09,840 --> 00:54:11,560
Speaker 12: Third party who also had it's This is just like

1102
00:54:11,840 --> 00:54:14,880
Speaker 12: the proof was there, the beatings, the threats that if

1103
00:54:14,920 --> 00:54:17,359
Speaker 12: they didn't go back into those rooms and get off

1104
00:54:17,400 --> 00:54:19,520
Speaker 12: with these male escorts, that they were going to get beaten.

1105
00:54:19,800 --> 00:54:22,600
Speaker 12: The testimony from that Daniel Phillip, who was the male

1106
00:54:22,719 --> 00:54:27,400
Speaker 12: escort who heard Colmb's abusing Cassie behind the door and

1107
00:54:27,440 --> 00:54:30,120
Speaker 12: she was screaming, I'm sorry, I'm sorry, as he heard

1108
00:54:30,200 --> 00:54:32,920
Speaker 12: him slapping her. Get back out there. She came back out,

1109
00:54:32,960 --> 00:54:35,239
Speaker 12: she was shaking. She got back into the escort's lap,

1110
00:54:35,719 --> 00:54:38,480
Speaker 12: physically shaking. She was so scared to the point where

1111
00:54:38,480 --> 00:54:42,000
Speaker 12: that guy couldn't perform sexually because this was so horrifying

1112
00:54:42,000 --> 00:54:46,359
Speaker 12: to him. What in the actual f went on in there?

1113
00:54:47,000 --> 00:54:50,120
Speaker 8: Yeah, so I feel like that's probably the general public's reaction.

1114
00:54:50,360 --> 00:54:54,320
Speaker 8: It just baffling, and it seems ran like the prosecution

1115
00:54:54,680 --> 00:54:57,360
Speaker 8: just I mean, in that clip, at least one of

1116
00:54:57,360 --> 00:54:59,880
Speaker 8: the legal experts goes on to kind of blame the jury.

1117
00:55:00,920 --> 00:55:03,360
Speaker 8: But I would think that the onus for the failure

1118
00:55:03,360 --> 00:55:05,120
Speaker 8: here asked to lie with the prosecution.

1119
00:55:07,080 --> 00:55:09,880
Speaker 3: Yeah, sure, I mean, the they it's very hard to

1120
00:55:09,920 --> 00:55:12,960
Speaker 3: lose a federal case. Like it's like they've their conviction

1121
00:55:13,120 --> 00:55:15,560
Speaker 3: rate is absolutely through the roof, and.

1122
00:55:15,480 --> 00:55:18,600
Speaker 4: So yeah, they they clearly own the blame for this,

1123
00:55:19,640 --> 00:55:19,799
Speaker 4: you know.

1124
00:55:20,040 --> 00:55:22,160
Speaker 3: And what we didn't cover this trial a whole bunch,

1125
00:55:22,200 --> 00:55:24,000
Speaker 3: but whenever we did and would I would look into it.

1126
00:55:24,040 --> 00:55:26,759
Speaker 3: I remember, you know, I would think, like they're really

1127
00:55:26,880 --> 00:55:32,000
Speaker 3: leaning into the emotional aspect of this. You know, how

1128
00:55:32,239 --> 00:55:36,080
Speaker 3: poorly he treated Cassie and and these other women, and

1129
00:55:36,120 --> 00:55:41,600
Speaker 3: how just what an absolutely like repulsive lifestyle he was

1130
00:55:41,719 --> 00:55:47,359
Speaker 3: leading using violence and emotional manipulation to you know, pull

1131
00:55:47,400 --> 00:55:49,239
Speaker 3: these multi day freak coughs off.

1132
00:55:50,120 --> 00:55:54,839
Speaker 4: And but I remember thinking every time, like people, but

1133
00:55:54,880 --> 00:55:57,080
Speaker 4: where where what are the crimes here? M M.

1134
00:55:58,960 --> 00:55:59,680
Speaker 7: Was obvious?

1135
00:56:01,080 --> 00:56:03,920
Speaker 3: Yes, the violence, yeah, but then that's out of the

1136
00:56:03,960 --> 00:56:10,320
Speaker 3: statute of limitations, right, the drugs no charge, prostitution convicted,

1137
00:56:11,000 --> 00:56:16,360
Speaker 3: But like beyond that, like where's the I and trafficking

1138
00:56:16,400 --> 00:56:20,319
Speaker 3: is an interesting like yeah concept and charge. It's like

1139
00:56:20,400 --> 00:56:23,080
Speaker 3: it's interesting to get if you pay someone, if you

1140
00:56:23,080 --> 00:56:24,799
Speaker 3: can pay a prostitute to get in a car, yeah,

1141
00:56:25,280 --> 00:56:27,359
Speaker 3: and then go to go to a hotel.

1142
00:56:27,000 --> 00:56:29,880
Speaker 4: For a freak cough? Did you traffic them there?

1143
00:56:29,400 --> 00:56:29,520
Speaker 8: Right?

1144
00:56:30,200 --> 00:56:30,399
Speaker 7: Right?

1145
00:56:30,920 --> 00:56:32,759
Speaker 4: And it's like, what does that mean?

1146
00:56:33,280 --> 00:56:35,600
Speaker 8: Yeah, No, I mean that's a really good point. It's

1147
00:56:35,680 --> 00:56:38,080
Speaker 8: and so I guess partially another thing is not The.

1148
00:56:38,040 --> 00:56:41,200
Speaker 3: Jury was like, that's not trafficking, that's that's paying a prostitute.

1149
00:56:41,239 --> 00:56:44,000
Speaker 8: And it's not necessarily easy for the prosecution then to

1150
00:56:44,000 --> 00:56:46,160
Speaker 8: build a case based on all and I think a

1151
00:56:46,160 --> 00:56:48,200
Speaker 8: lot of it also is him. So he's alleged to

1152
00:56:48,200 --> 00:56:50,560
Speaker 8: have drugged people many many times.

1153
00:56:50,360 --> 00:56:52,520
Speaker 4: Which would be a crime if they didn't charge.

1154
00:56:52,239 --> 00:56:55,440
Speaker 8: That, right, And I think because it looks like they

1155
00:56:55,440 --> 00:56:58,600
Speaker 8: were overconfident started bundling things into the Rico case, thinking.

1156
00:56:58,320 --> 00:57:02,840
Speaker 7: That they had him right on racketeering because.

1157
00:57:02,920 --> 00:57:05,400
Speaker 3: He clearly conspired to organize these freak costs. But the

1158
00:57:05,440 --> 00:57:10,360
Speaker 3: jury was like, not really illegal, except that most of

1159
00:57:10,400 --> 00:57:13,480
Speaker 3: the pieces within it are actually illegal right within it.

1160
00:57:13,560 --> 00:57:17,320
Speaker 8: Yes, And so yeah, we were just looking up his

1161
00:57:17,480 --> 00:57:18,280
Speaker 8: criminal history.

1162
00:57:18,360 --> 00:57:20,200
Speaker 7: He has been charged many many times.

1163
00:57:20,280 --> 00:57:22,880
Speaker 3: He was he never got charged for the nine people dying.

1164
00:57:23,560 --> 00:57:25,720
Speaker 3: He should have been charged with some type of negligence there.

1165
00:57:25,920 --> 00:57:27,320
Speaker 7: It's a pretty if.

1166
00:57:27,880 --> 00:57:29,440
Speaker 4: Everybody probably knows about this case.

1167
00:57:29,560 --> 00:57:34,040
Speaker 3: This there was a stampede that a at a event

1168
00:57:34,080 --> 00:57:37,720
Speaker 3: that he put on. It's where he knew ninety I've

1169
00:57:37,760 --> 00:57:40,000
Speaker 3: got to hear December ninety one, where he knew that

1170
00:57:40,040 --> 00:57:42,720
Speaker 3: too many people were there, didn't care, wanted too many

1171
00:57:42,720 --> 00:57:45,040
Speaker 3: people to be there for the spectacle. Nine people end

1172
00:57:45,160 --> 00:57:50,240
Speaker 3: up dying, doesn't get charged for that. He got convicted

1173
00:57:50,280 --> 00:57:54,000
Speaker 3: nineteen ninety six, convicted of criminal mischief for threatening a

1174
00:57:54,040 --> 00:57:55,080
Speaker 3: photographer with a gun.

1175
00:57:55,120 --> 00:57:57,640
Speaker 4: So that's a conviction. That's something that the judge can

1176
00:57:57,680 --> 00:57:58,000
Speaker 4: point to.

1177
00:57:58,160 --> 00:58:03,280
Speaker 8: That's where he's that's a pretty easy denial of bail predicate, right.

1178
00:58:03,320 --> 00:58:08,560
Speaker 3: And then in ninety nine, Combs in his bodyguards are

1179
00:58:08,640 --> 00:58:12,120
Speaker 3: charged with attacking this is PBS I'm reading from, or

1180
00:58:12,160 --> 00:58:17,200
Speaker 3: attacking Interscope Records, music music executive over dispute over music video.

1181
00:58:17,720 --> 00:58:21,000
Speaker 3: He was sentenced to anger and anger management. Course didn't work,

1182
00:58:22,360 --> 00:58:26,240
Speaker 3: but that's at least that's something on the record that

1183
00:58:26,280 --> 00:58:29,800
Speaker 3: the judge can then point to. December ninety nine, he's

1184
00:58:29,880 --> 00:58:33,240
Speaker 3: arrested on gun possession charges for that nightclub shooting that

1185
00:58:33,280 --> 00:58:36,880
Speaker 3: you mentioned, where Jennifer Lopez.

1186
00:58:38,320 --> 00:58:38,800
Speaker 7: Was in the car.

1187
00:58:39,200 --> 00:58:40,120
Speaker 4: Three people got wounded.

1188
00:58:40,200 --> 00:58:42,000
Speaker 8: A woman still says that Diddy is the one who

1189
00:58:42,040 --> 00:58:43,600
Speaker 8: shot her, right, yeah.

1190
00:58:43,480 --> 00:58:45,360
Speaker 3: Yeah, there are people that say that he was shooting

1191
00:58:45,440 --> 00:58:50,320
Speaker 3: and that's that he shot her. He was later charged

1192
00:58:50,600 --> 00:58:55,360
Speaker 3: with offering his driver fifty grand to claim ownership of

1193
00:58:55,360 --> 00:58:59,160
Speaker 3: the nine millimeter that was found in the car. We

1194
00:58:59,240 --> 00:59:03,360
Speaker 3: know from this trial that him offering to pay people

1195
00:59:04,120 --> 00:59:07,840
Speaker 3: to get out of trouble is something that he does,

1196
00:59:08,280 --> 00:59:12,240
Speaker 3: so that's a quite credible charge there. However, he was

1197
00:59:12,240 --> 00:59:16,320
Speaker 3: then acquitted of all charges. Well, Shine took the took

1198
00:59:16,320 --> 00:59:20,120
Speaker 3: the fall for that. So the judge, can you point

1199
00:59:20,120 --> 00:59:21,640
Speaker 3: to the arrest, but you're not supposed to. If you're

1200
00:59:21,680 --> 00:59:24,320
Speaker 3: arrested and convicted, you're not. That's not really supposed to

1201
00:59:25,760 --> 00:59:29,120
Speaker 3: factor into your sentencing because you're supposed to have been

1202
00:59:29,360 --> 00:59:32,040
Speaker 3: found Like innocent is supposed to mean innocent doesn't always

1203
00:59:32,040 --> 00:59:35,439
Speaker 3: mean that, but that's how that's what's supposed to mean.

1204
00:59:35,840 --> 00:59:39,360
Speaker 3: Then he got arrested in twenty fifteen. He looks like

1205
00:59:39,360 --> 00:59:42,600
Speaker 3: he got in a fight at a UCLA game where

1206
00:59:42,640 --> 00:59:45,240
Speaker 3: his son was playing football, but the charges were dropped.

1207
00:59:46,040 --> 00:59:47,840
Speaker 8: This is why fifty cent referred to him yesterday as

1208
00:59:47,880 --> 00:59:48,800
Speaker 8: the gay John Gotti.

1209
00:59:49,480 --> 00:59:54,880
Speaker 4: Nothing's sticking to him, Teon Teflon Diddy, Yeah, it's all

1210
00:59:54,960 --> 00:59:55,600
Speaker 4: that baby oil.

1211
00:59:56,320 --> 00:59:58,320
Speaker 7: Yes, he charges slippery, yeah.

1212
00:59:58,240 --> 00:59:59,000
Speaker 4: Slip right off.

1213
01:00:00,440 --> 01:00:05,000
Speaker 3: And then these charges so he has not zero criminal record.

1214
01:00:05,040 --> 01:00:08,560
Speaker 3: He has a very long criminal record, most of it

1215
01:00:09,160 --> 01:00:13,400
Speaker 3: ending with acquittals or like misdemeanor stuff. So that's why

1216
01:00:13,440 --> 01:00:16,800
Speaker 3: it's going to be a real stretch for the judge

1217
01:00:16,800 --> 01:00:21,160
Speaker 3: to hit him with the maximum. And even if she does,

1218
01:00:21,200 --> 01:00:24,720
Speaker 3: he'll appeal this, so I expect he'll be walking free

1219
01:00:25,280 --> 01:00:26,880
Speaker 3: in a matter of several years.

1220
01:00:28,320 --> 01:00:29,280
Speaker 4: Five to ten max.

1221
01:00:29,880 --> 01:00:32,480
Speaker 7: Unbelievable. Well, on that note, Ryan.

1222
01:00:32,400 --> 01:00:34,040
Speaker 3: And a lot of people took a lot of risks

1223
01:00:34,760 --> 01:00:39,520
Speaker 3: coming forward, come forward, Yeah, that they are suffering greatly

1224
01:00:39,600 --> 01:00:40,040
Speaker 3: right now.

1225
01:00:40,800 --> 01:00:43,040
Speaker 7: Yeah, Oh my gosh. The trial was just awful.

1226
01:00:43,120 --> 01:00:43,280
Speaker 10: It was.

1227
01:00:43,440 --> 01:00:44,360
Speaker 7: It was one of those ones.

1228
01:00:44,400 --> 01:00:47,520
Speaker 8: It was just hard to follow because Cassie was testifying

1229
01:00:47,560 --> 01:00:49,640
Speaker 8: about all this while she was pregnant. It was just

1230
01:00:49,680 --> 01:00:53,880
Speaker 8: a really really really dark trial. And I forget I

1231
01:00:53,920 --> 01:00:54,360
Speaker 8: want to say.

1232
01:00:54,360 --> 01:00:55,040
Speaker 7: This was on Hulu.

1233
01:00:55,080 --> 01:00:59,560
Speaker 8: Someone did a fantastic documentary into the sort of influences

1234
01:00:59,640 --> 01:01:02,840
Speaker 8: emotion on that sort of forged did he like?

1235
01:01:03,200 --> 01:01:04,960
Speaker 7: How did he become who he became?

1236
01:01:05,040 --> 01:01:09,520
Speaker 8: And it is just incredibly sad and dark. So I

1237
01:01:09,560 --> 01:01:11,560
Speaker 8: hope that there's at least some closure for people who

1238
01:01:11,600 --> 01:01:12,160
Speaker 8: suffered from this.

1239
01:01:13,040 --> 01:01:15,720
Speaker 3: And I was saying yesterday I actually liked doing the

1240
01:01:15,760 --> 01:01:18,400
Speaker 3: show without the laptop here because fewer distractions.

1241
01:01:18,440 --> 01:01:20,840
Speaker 4: On the other hand, when it comes to something.

1242
01:01:20,640 --> 01:01:25,040
Speaker 3: I really don't remember, which is like Diddy's criminal record,

1243
01:01:25,600 --> 01:01:26,680
Speaker 3: actually helpful, not.

1244
01:01:26,680 --> 01:01:28,640
Speaker 7: At the top of your mind to have it here.

1245
01:01:28,760 --> 01:01:31,480
Speaker 3: Yeah, I knew it'd been in and out of trouble,

1246
01:01:31,480 --> 01:01:36,120
Speaker 3: but yeah, as so my memory actually served mostly correct

1247
01:01:36,120 --> 01:01:38,400
Speaker 3: that he's basically gotten out of all the jams that

1248
01:01:38,400 --> 01:01:38,800
Speaker 3: he's been in.

1249
01:01:38,880 --> 01:01:40,280
Speaker 7: Yeah, but there's so many of them, a lot.

1250
01:01:40,320 --> 01:01:41,760
Speaker 8: I think that's when you look it up, you're just like,

1251
01:01:41,800 --> 01:01:43,080
Speaker 8: holy smoked, it is.

1252
01:01:43,160 --> 01:01:44,240
Speaker 7: It's gotty esque.

1253
01:01:44,440 --> 01:01:49,000
Speaker 3: Yes, it is so no Friday show, It's July fourth,

1254
01:01:49,400 --> 01:01:53,000
Speaker 3: will be independent of our laptops in the morning, Happy independence.

1255
01:01:53,000 --> 01:01:55,440
Speaker 3: Say to everybody, I hope you enjoy the fireworks or

1256
01:01:55,440 --> 01:01:57,680
Speaker 3: a barbecue or whatever you're up to.

1257
01:01:58,080 --> 01:02:00,400
Speaker 4: Yeah, we'll be back on somebody will be back on Monday.

1258
01:02:00,440 --> 01:02:02,040
Speaker 8: Yeah, I think Crystal and Soccer back. There you go,

1259
01:02:02,360 --> 01:02:05,160
Speaker 8: so great news, get get rid of us.

1260
01:02:05,320 --> 01:02:06,760
Speaker 4: Yeah we promised they'll be here.

1261
01:02:06,920 --> 01:02:09,200
Speaker 8: Yeah, well, no, we don't, can't make promise.

1262
01:02:09,240 --> 01:02:11,560
Speaker 4: They're gonna try very hard they will be Yeah.

1263
01:02:11,600 --> 01:02:13,360
Speaker 7: Well maybe they'll get caught up in the system like

1264
01:02:13,400 --> 01:02:13,720
Speaker 7: we did.

1265
01:02:13,800 --> 01:02:16,080
Speaker 4: There you go, all right, all right, see you guys.

1266
01:02:16,080 --> 01:02:16,240
Speaker 4: Then