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Speaker 1: On the Doll Cast, the questions asked if movies have

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Speaker 1: women and them, are all their discussions just boyfriends and husbands,

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Speaker 1: or do they have individualism? The patriarchy? Zef and best

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Speaker 1: start changing it with the bec Del Cast. Hey, Caitlin,

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Speaker 1: Hey Jamie. So we're about to graduate from high school, right,

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Speaker 1: and I'm trying to trying to like plan the next phase.

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Speaker 1: Can I just like pitch you what my ideas and

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Speaker 1: then let me know what your plans are? Please? Okay?

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Speaker 1: My plans are to graduate from high school, moved to Europe,

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Speaker 1: Mary Alfred Molina, and then die. What are your plans? Oh? Um?

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Speaker 1: I was thinking I would just like accept my fate

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Speaker 1: as a vampire slayer and kill a bunch of vampires.

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Speaker 1: Because you're not like other girls? I know? Are you?

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Speaker 1: I am? I am exactly like other girls. Isn't that wild?

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Speaker 1: That that's that becomes the truck question of the movie? Um,

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Speaker 1: Welcome to the Bechtel Cast. My name is Jamie Loftus,

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Speaker 1: my name is Caitlin Durante, and this is our show

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Speaker 1: in which we examine movies through an intersectional feminist lens,

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Speaker 1: using the Bechdel test simply as a jumping off point now, Jamie, Yes,

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Speaker 1: whatever is the Bechtel test, Well, i'll tell you it's

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Speaker 1: and and I we told Alfred Molina this, so it's

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Speaker 1: good that we're all like my future husband, Alfred Molina,

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Speaker 1: who famously hates men's rights activists, as he said on

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Speaker 1: our show. Absolutely he's got to come back, okay the

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Speaker 1: Bechdel test, we're and we're okay. So that's an example

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Speaker 1: of something that does not pass the Vitel test because

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Speaker 1: the version that we use, uh, it's a media metric

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Speaker 1: created by queer cartoonist Alison Bechdel, sometimes called the Bechdel

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Speaker 1: Wallace Test. Lots of different versions of it. The version

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Speaker 1: that we use requires that two people of a marginalized

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Speaker 1: gender with names speak to each other about something other

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Speaker 1: than a man for more than two lines of dialogue,

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Speaker 1: and the dialogue exchange should have some sort of meaning

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Speaker 1: and not just an offhand like would you like spaghetti? No,

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Speaker 1: although unless it's very plot spaghetti, and it's very important,

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Speaker 1: sometimes there's plot spaghetti. What's an example of plot spaghetti?

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Speaker 1: Huh oh? Actually maybe in another vampire movie, which the

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Speaker 1: name of it is Escaping Me right now, but it's

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Speaker 1: the one that key for Sutherland is in not Donald Sutherland.

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Speaker 1: What the hell movie am I thinking of The Lost Boys?

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Speaker 1: The Lost Boy? Yes? Sorry, I was like The Lost Boys.

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Speaker 1: There's plot spaghetti in that movie. I've never seen it. Well,

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Speaker 1: I wouldn't call it plots spaghetti necessarily, or it might

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Speaker 1: not even be spaghetti. But there's a scene where there's

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Speaker 1: like some noodle dish and then they're like feeding it

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Speaker 1: to humans and then they're like just kidding, its worms

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Speaker 1: or something iconic, and then they're like they use their

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Speaker 1: vampire powers to turn the spaghetti into worms. I might

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Speaker 1: be completely remember that the name of the movie. I have, Look,

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Speaker 1: it's been a minute. My brain works in mysterious ways.

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Speaker 1: Move over, Mom's spaghetti plot. Spaghetti has entered the chat. Well,

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Speaker 1: I'm glad that we got that. I think that that

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Speaker 1: was a very perfect way to introduce our Absolutely, yes,

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Speaker 1: let's get her in the mix. She is the senior

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Speaker 1: vice president of Development at Crypt TV. She is a

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Speaker 1: co executive producer on Peacock's The Girl in the Woods.

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Speaker 1: It's Jasmine Johnson. Thank you guys for having me, Thanks

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Speaker 1: for being here. I'm always like to talk about Buffy,

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Speaker 1: the Vampires, are the movie in particular, Yes, So what

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Speaker 1: is your relationship and history with the movie the franchise

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Speaker 1: in general? Tell us everything? Yeah, you know, Um, it's

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Speaker 1: really interesting because in my line of work, my line

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Speaker 1: of work being like being a producer and a development executive,

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Speaker 1: where I have to meet with a lot of writers

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Speaker 1: and a lot of directors, specifically those who like genre

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Speaker 1: because that's what I produce. I would say, like a

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Speaker 1: third of the time, I always have people who will

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Speaker 1: cite Buffy as such a big inspiration to them, and

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Speaker 1: when they cite it, they're talking about the TV show, always, always,

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Speaker 1: always talking about the TV show. And I think I

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Speaker 1: might be maybe the rare person who when I say

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Speaker 1: I was obsessed with Buffy as a kid, I'm talking

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Speaker 1: about the movie, not the show. I've seen like a

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Speaker 1: season of Buffy the Vampire Slayer, the TV show, but

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Speaker 1: the movie was what I watched Pete as a kid

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Speaker 1: over and over and over, so much so that I

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Speaker 1: was convinced, And do not laugh at me, because it

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Speaker 1: still may be true, but I was convinced that I

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Speaker 1: was in line to be the Slayer because I have

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Speaker 1: a similar birthmark to the one that it tells Buffy

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Speaker 1: that she has uh and I just knew. I just

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Speaker 1: knew that I was supposed to be one of the

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Speaker 1: slayers of the vampires. I hate to tell you guys,

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Speaker 1: it didn't happen. But yet this was so short, you

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Speaker 1: know yet maybe maybe yet. I feel like my my

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Speaker 1: hey day is sort of behind me at this point

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Speaker 1: as far as being able to like fight and kill

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Speaker 1: and I don't know, takedown vampires. But you never know,

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Speaker 1: you never know. It's very like sixteenth birthday. Like I

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Speaker 1: remember the pilot episode of Sabrina the Teenage which she

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Speaker 1: I think she woke up on her sixteenth birthday levitating

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Speaker 1: above the bed, and that was the thing that I

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Speaker 1: was like, absly, that's going to happen the morning of

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Speaker 1: my sixteenth birthday. I will be floating. I just really

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Speaker 1: want the show or movie that's about like you turn

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Speaker 1: forty and then realize you have magical monster slaying powers me.

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Speaker 1: I guess I could. Yeah, that's the next thing that

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Speaker 1: I want to be responsible for making. Oh that is

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Speaker 1: such a good idea. That would actually be amazing because

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Speaker 1: everything is like sixteen, seventeen eighteen, But like what happens

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Speaker 1: when you're like me and I'm thirty three, and I

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Speaker 1: have no powers to look forward to coming into its

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Speaker 1: kind of kind of sex a little bit. It's pretty

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Speaker 1: agest the fact that, Yeah, like so much media I

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Speaker 1: mean in general revolves around young people like thirty and younger,

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Speaker 1: and it's like, what about the people I feel like

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Speaker 1: I come of age every five years, Like I have

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Speaker 1: another coming of age like every few years, and I'm like,

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Speaker 1: what what coming of age thing am I going to

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Speaker 1: have when I'm fifty? Like that should be a story

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Speaker 1: for that. I mean, that's so true. I mean, I

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Speaker 1: I always use the term I say that I love

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Speaker 1: coming of age content, and people always equate that with

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Speaker 1: like y A meaning you're in your teens or like

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Speaker 1: your young adults, and I always have to correct them

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Speaker 1: and say, when I see coming of age, I'm not

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Speaker 1: necessarily talking about like teenagers. Obviously you do come of

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Speaker 1: age at that age, but you never like truly stopped

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Speaker 1: coming of age. And I think, um, you know, having

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Speaker 1: more things that explore what that looks like when you're

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Speaker 1: past whatever the ages that media has deemed as the

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Speaker 1: one that is the most important, I think should be

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Speaker 1: done more, you know, Like it's it's just as important. Totally. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I think we just got a pitch together in a space. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: and hey, I heard that you're a development executive, so

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Speaker 1: I am. I am anyway, that's all. That's all to say.

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Speaker 1: I was convinced I was going to be the next Layer.

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Speaker 1: It didn't happen. But maybe in the real world you

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Speaker 1: can be four and be a Slayer. So or maybe

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Speaker 1: the slayer before me killed all the vampires one of them.

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Speaker 1: That could be possible. Hard to say, Jamie. What's your

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Speaker 1: relationship with the Buffy franchise? Extremely limited? I think I've

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Speaker 1: said this this might have been on Maiturion episode. But

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Speaker 1: I had like a very bizarre experience with the Buffy

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Speaker 1: series where like my first day of college, there was

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Speaker 1: a girl who like locked me in her dorm room

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Speaker 1: and made me watch ten episodes in a row, and

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Speaker 1: it was like, I think, well intentioned, but felt like

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Speaker 1: a hostage situation, and I just the whole experience left

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Speaker 1: a bad taste of my mouth towards Buffy culture. So

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Speaker 1: because it was just like I was like, God, what

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Speaker 1: a stressful thing to happen on your first day of anyways,

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Speaker 1: So I have very limited experience with it. I knew

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Speaker 1: I thought it was interesting going into preparing for this

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Speaker 1: episode only knowing like the impression I had was that

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Speaker 1: fans of Feed the TV series hate this movie, and

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Speaker 1: I was curious. I was like, I wonder why, Like,

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Speaker 1: I've definitely seen ten episodes of Buffy under Duress, so

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Speaker 1: I get that the tone of the shell um, but I,

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Speaker 1: you know, it's it's dated in a lot of aspects.

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Speaker 1: But I really thought the movie was perfectly fine and

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Speaker 1: everyone was being a baby about it, like it's very

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Speaker 1: different from the show. But if there's anything that that

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Speaker 1: Caitlin and I were texting about this before we started recording, uh,

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Speaker 1: there's anything that we've learned on this show in the

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Speaker 1: past month, because we also covered Alien Resurrection another Weeden script,

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Speaker 1: it's that Josh Weeden loves to have a tantrum when

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Speaker 1: he doesn't have complete creative control over something, and he'll

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Speaker 1: like shit talk anything that he didn't have a million,

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Speaker 1: which is like whatever that bears out in his personal

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Speaker 1: behavior too, but like any time he doesn't have complete

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Speaker 1: creative control, he's like, that was the worst thing that

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Speaker 1: ever happened, and pee pee poo poo, and it's like, dude,

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Speaker 1: the movie is like pretty good. I really enjoyed it

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Speaker 1: so good. It's fun. Uh, Caitlyn, what's your history with Buffy?

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Speaker 1: So I am admittedly a fan of the show, although

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Speaker 1: I would I have not engaged with it in many years.

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Speaker 1: I binged, all is it seven seasons? Somewhere around like

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Speaker 1: twenty twelve. I want to say, I watched it with

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Speaker 1: my best friend j T, who was always a big

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Speaker 1: fan of the show. Then I watched a little bit

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Speaker 1: of the spinoff show Angel, I read some of the comics.

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Speaker 1: I at some point, I think after I saw the series,

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Speaker 1: I went and watched the movie. I don't remember if

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Speaker 1: I watched the movie before or after. I think it

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Speaker 1: was after the series, which probably explained why I didn't

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Speaker 1: like it as much as the series, because I was like, oh,

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Speaker 1: this is different and blah blah blah, and then going

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Speaker 1: back and rewatching the movie for this episode, I was like, oh,

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Speaker 1: I was hard on the movie back then. It's not

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Speaker 1: as bad as I thought, or it's not even like

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Speaker 1: bad at all, although I would say the third act

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Speaker 1: gets a little it's kind of messy at the edge. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: it gets a little flimsy. I could have stood to

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Speaker 1: have maybe like a more epic, less weirdly sexually charged.

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Speaker 1: I was just like, dude, pee wee is a vampire

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Speaker 1: who like jumps on the hood of a car. I

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Speaker 1: was like, Yeah, how can you feel dislike this movie?

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Speaker 1: That's so um Yeah, I was. I was too hard

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Speaker 1: on the movie the first time I saw it. I

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Speaker 1: generally enjoyed it watching it back this time to prep

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Speaker 1: for the episode. And that's my general history with Buffy.

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Speaker 1: Should we dive into the recap of the movie, let's

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Speaker 1: do it, and Jasmine feel free to jump in whatever. Yes, okay, okay.

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Speaker 1: So we open on a quick scene in the dark Ages.

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Speaker 1: We see a young woman fighting some vampires and we

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Speaker 1: get some voice over about vampires and vampire slayers. Then

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Speaker 1: we cut to nineteen nineties southern California. The light ages

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Speaker 1: very funny. Um. We meet Buffy played by Christy Swanson,

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Speaker 1: who is doing a cheer routine with her fellow cheerleaders.

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Speaker 1: Then she goes to the mall with three of her

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Speaker 1: friends who I do not know what those characters names are,

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Speaker 1: because we did they happy, we don't really love. I

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Speaker 1: think I know one's name is Jenny. I remember that

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Speaker 1: because I think I don't know which I think it

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Speaker 1: was the one with the curly here because I remember

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Speaker 1: Jenny not to spoil the end, but the dance. But

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Speaker 1: outside of that, I'm not sure. Did they even give

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Speaker 1: those characters names barely? I think so. Hillary Swank is

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Speaker 1: one of the friends, and she I think it's Kimberly. Yes, okay, yes, yes, yes.

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Speaker 1: But then there's a third one who in fact, like

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Speaker 1: the one black friend. What's her name? What's her name?

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Speaker 1: I don't know. We don't know anything about her, Okay,

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Speaker 1: we because I kept like waiting for waiting to find

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Speaker 1: out what her name is. I kept waiting for those

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Speaker 1: characters in general to become important relevant to the story,

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Speaker 1: and they never like, uh that was That was one

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Speaker 1: of the things where I'm like, Buffy needs like and

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Speaker 1: I know that that's a huge part of this show,

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Speaker 1: is like Buffy is like connection with her like crew

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Speaker 1: or other women and yeah, movie Buffy, no dice in

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Speaker 1: that department. Yeah, it's kind of a bummer. Um. It's

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Speaker 1: one of the things that I also I didn't realize

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Speaker 1: like in watching it as a kid, but it had

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Speaker 1: been maybe like fifteen years since I saw the movie

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Speaker 1: and then rewatched, and I sort of hate the idea

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Speaker 1: that like Buffy has to be such a lone fighter,

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Speaker 1: Like I think that that messaging that you know your

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Speaker 1: friends are not going to support you and you have

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Speaker 1: to sort of give up everything in order to save

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Speaker 1: the world is not quite right. And I understand that

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Speaker 1: the show didn't go that route. And if I was

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Speaker 1: going to remake this movie in the day and age,

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Speaker 1: I wouldn't do that. Like I wouldn't her friends can, like,

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Speaker 1: they can all start that way, and you can have

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Speaker 1: some who maybe don't believe in vampires or don't support Buffy,

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Speaker 1: But I don't think that every single person in her

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Speaker 1: friends group needed to be so terrible all the way

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Speaker 1: through the way. It almost felt like another way of

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Speaker 1: like because it's like kind of goofy and funny to

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Speaker 1: be but it's you know, definitely a thing where it

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Speaker 1: becomes a big part of the movie as it goes

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Speaker 1: on to telegraph that Buffy is not like other girls,

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Speaker 1: and it seems like that's how they demonstrate it by

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Speaker 1: making other girls mean and vapid and awful, which is

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Speaker 1: like that that's not the move, right, Yeah, we can

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Speaker 1: talk about that more because there's a lot to cover

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Speaker 1: their Okay, So Buffy has friends and they go shopping

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Speaker 1: and they do cheerleading together, and at the mall, they

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Speaker 1: have a brief encounter with Donald Sutherland, who is giving

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Speaker 1: off some weird vibes. He's wearing a trench coat, like

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Speaker 1: he's just staring at them, not saying anything. So they

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Speaker 1: briefly encounter him, but then they go about their day

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Speaker 1: and head to the movies. A couple of their classmates

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Speaker 1: are there. Pike played by Luke Perry and Benny played

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Speaker 1: by David Arquette are there at the movie theater and

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Speaker 1: they're like these like burnout quote unquote loser types. And

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Speaker 1: then that night Buffy links up with her basketball star

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Speaker 1: boyfriend Jeffrey. Meanwhile, one of Jeffrey's friends is walking through

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Speaker 1: a park and crosses paths with Paul ol Rubens, who

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Speaker 1: is looking very creepy and it seems like he is

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Speaker 1: probably a vampire. I love he's having so much fun

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Speaker 1: in this movie. I love him in this movie. He's great,

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Speaker 1: I think because would have like overlapped with pee weee

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Speaker 1: to like I don't know, not to whatever. This is

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Speaker 1: a feminist podcast, so I'm not going to just hand

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Speaker 1: it to Paul Rubens for an hour. But it is like,

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Speaker 1: I feel like he's like underrated in like how versatile

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Speaker 1: he is because he's so associated with Pee wee. He's

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Speaker 1: got range. He certainly I'm a scene stealer in this movie.

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Speaker 1: I can't wait till we get to his death scene.

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Speaker 1: Oh my goodness, hot five best deaths. It's so good.

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Speaker 1: Oh gosh. Then we cut to a news report about

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Speaker 1: a bunch of people having been attacked and dying from

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Speaker 1: severe neck wounds. Then Buffy has a dream about the

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Speaker 1: vampire slayer who we saw briefly at the beginning of

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Speaker 1: the movie, who I think is also played by Christie Swanson. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: it's like her in a wig. That was a confusing

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Speaker 1: part of the Lord to Be. It was like the

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Speaker 1: lure is kind of messy when I thought about it,

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Speaker 1: where I was like, okay, so there's always been slayers,

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Speaker 1: but they all seemed to be Christie Swanson reincarnated over

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Speaker 1: and over. Question marks. See that I've gotten in debates

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Speaker 1: about this as a child, because hit it, you know,

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Speaker 1: it's kind of it kind of sucks a little bit

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Speaker 1: because as a kid, you want to play like as

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Speaker 1: your favorite characters, Like we want to play power Rangers.

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Speaker 1: You want to play whatever, and so playing Buffy is

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Speaker 1: not a game. But if I wanted to play Buffy,

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Speaker 1: I wanted to be Buffy. But it's the early nineties

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Speaker 1: and kids would tell me like, you can't be Buffy

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Speaker 1: because you don't like Buffy. Or even if if I

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Speaker 1: was playing Power Rangers, you can't be the pink Ranger.

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Speaker 1: You have to be the yellow one because the yellow

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Speaker 1: one is black. And I'm like, shut up, I will

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Speaker 1: be who I want to be. But in diving into

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Speaker 1: the lore, as I was watching this movie, I had

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Speaker 1: flashbacks to being a kid and being told I couldn't

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Speaker 1: be Buffy because this is how Buffy looks, and I

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Speaker 1: was listening to what Buffy was saying. Um. And this

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Speaker 1: comes a little bit later when Mark says like, have

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Speaker 1: you been having these dreams? And she's like, yeah, you know,

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Speaker 1: I was a handmading maiden or something. And she's also

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Speaker 1: like I was a slave in Virginia And I picked

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Speaker 1: up on that like so quickly. And again this may

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Speaker 1: just be my own personal history with Buffy and just

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Speaker 1: growing up in a society that I wanted to marginalize

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Speaker 1: me and tell me I could only be but a

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Speaker 1: certain character. But I was like, there's no way that

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Speaker 1: like Buffy. If she looked like Buffy would have been

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Speaker 1: a slave girl in Virginia. So I believe, and I'm

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Speaker 1: sorry to go on such a deep tante point, but

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Speaker 1: this is important to me, only me, maybe, but it's important.

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Speaker 1: I believe that Buffy was just when she was dreaming,

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Speaker 1: she was putting herself in the situations of these girls.

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Speaker 1: I don't think it was actually the slayer looked exactly

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Speaker 1: like Buffy every single time. I just think that she

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Speaker 1: was dreaming and putting herself in the shoes of all

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Speaker 1: of these I'm not even sure if it was only

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Speaker 1: um women, who knows, anyone could be a Slayer, but

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Speaker 1: so I think any one of us could have been

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Speaker 1: a Slayer, including me. Know. That's a very good point though. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: and that makes sense that like she would just insert

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Speaker 1: herself into her own dreams. But yeah, no, that's a

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Speaker 1: really good point. I hadn't thought about that sequence in

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Speaker 1: context of because the other the only other one you

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Speaker 1: see as her in a wig. That totally makes sense. Yeah, yeah,

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Speaker 1: because in the show you see like slayers of by

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Speaker 1: gone days, and I if I'm remembering correct, there's one

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Speaker 1: who is like a Slayer in the nineteen seventies, who

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Speaker 1: is a black woman in the show who like pops

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Speaker 1: up now and then throughout the series. So the Slayer

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Speaker 1: is not just Christie Swanson or Sarah Michelle Geller. Um. Okay.

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Speaker 1: So during this dream though, we see this vampire Loathos

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Speaker 1: played by Rutger Howard, and he seems to be like

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Speaker 1: the big bad vampire in charge. Then we cut back

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Speaker 1: to the present where Paul Rubens vampire tells his master,

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Speaker 1: presumably Loathos, that he is building an army. Uh. Then

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Speaker 1: the next night, Buffy and her friends go out to

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Speaker 1: plan their upcoming senior dance. A drunk Pike and Benny

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Speaker 1: are there. They all give each other a hard time.

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Speaker 1: Then the guys leave and then Benny gets bitten by

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Speaker 1: Paul Rubens. Pike doesn't notice because he's passed out for

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Speaker 1: being so drunk. And then Donald Sutherland shows up and

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Speaker 1: takes Pike with him. Then Donald Sutherland ak Merrick. It

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Speaker 1: takes him a while for us to know what his

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Speaker 1: name and his name and this is like Donald Sutherland,

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Speaker 1: They're not great with names. Donald Sutherland in a trench

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Speaker 1: cut three. Donald Sutherlands in a trench cat so he

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Speaker 1: is Merrick. He pays a visit to Buffy and tells

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Speaker 1: her that her birthright, her like destiny, is to be

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Speaker 1: a vampire slayer and that he is her watcher, and

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Speaker 1: she's like, what are you even talking about? So then

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Speaker 1: he takes her to a graveyard to show her and

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Speaker 1: prove to her you know that she is in fact

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Speaker 1: the slayer. A couple of vampires come out of the

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Speaker 1: graves and Buffy is able to kill them with relative ease.

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Speaker 1: She seems to be a natural at this. Then we

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Speaker 1: cut back to Pike and Ben Benny shows up and

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Speaker 1: he is a vampire. Now he wants Pike to invite

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Speaker 1: him in he's floating. Pike is like, what the hell, dude,

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Speaker 1: get away from me. I don't want any part of

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Speaker 1: whatever you're doing. Yeah. Meanwhile, Lothos, the big bad vampire,

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Speaker 1: is getting more and more powerful. Buffy, on the other hand,

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Speaker 1: is not too sure about this whole being a vampire

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Speaker 1: slayer thing. She just wants to be a normal teenager

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Speaker 1: and go to cheerleading practice. But Marek shows up again

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Speaker 1: and he proves that she is the true slayer by

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Speaker 1: throwing a knife at her head, big swing, really really

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Speaker 1: a risk, but she catches it. What would he have

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Speaker 1: done if that went straight through her forehead? Right? Like, congratulations,

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Speaker 1: you just killed the child. I wonder how many like

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Speaker 1: teen girls he has accidentally killed because he's like, you're

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Speaker 1: probably the Slayer. Let me just test this out, and

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Speaker 1: then a knife through her skull. You know, I never

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Speaker 1: thought about that. That's pretty dark. I actually don't feel

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Speaker 1: like Marek is a great trainer. We can talk about

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Speaker 1: that anymore, maybe later. So I do now that you

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Speaker 1: say that, I feel like he probably went through like

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Speaker 1: at least three or four girls before he finally got

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Speaker 1: to the right one with Buffy. Dark because his gauge

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Speaker 1: also isn't that great. Because he sees Buffy doing some

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Speaker 1: gymnastics and he's like, wow, you're a gymnast. You must

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Speaker 1: be the Slayer. And it's like the pretty basic gymnastics too.

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Speaker 1: I mean, I can't do any gymnastics, so none of

386
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Speaker 1: it is like super basic. But she's doing a couple

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Speaker 1: of cart wheels and like a backhand spring or something.

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Speaker 1: It's not like she's doing Olympic levels of gymnastics, but

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Speaker 1: still she's I guess that makes her quality find to

390
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Speaker 1: be the best slayer, right, like, uh, dude, your criteria

391
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Speaker 1: seems to be a bit off. Um. But he was right.

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Speaker 1: She is the slayer because she catches the knife and

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Speaker 1: he's like, only the true slayer could have done that,

394
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Speaker 1: and she's like, okay, I guess I am the slayer.

395
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Speaker 1: So then she starts training so that she can be

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Speaker 1: fully prepared to take on vampires, and then we get

397
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Speaker 1: a fun training montage. We see Buffy slay her first vampire.

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Speaker 1: I guess not her first because she slayed some in

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Speaker 1: the graveyard, but like her first one is like the

400
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Speaker 1: official slayer. Meanwhile, other vampires, including Paul Rubens vampire, attack

401
00:24:43,000 --> 00:24:47,320
Speaker 1: Pike in his van, but Buffy and Marek show up

402
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Speaker 1: and save him, and then Buffy and Pike have a

403
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Speaker 1: conversation about like, oh wow, he's so surprised that she

404
00:24:54,640 --> 00:24:59,359
Speaker 1: kills vampires. He thought that she was like just like

405
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Speaker 1: the other girl, Arles or whatever. Um, And there's also

406
00:25:03,480 --> 00:25:09,600
Speaker 1: some romantic tension in the air between them. Buffy again

407
00:25:09,640 --> 00:25:12,360
Speaker 1: wants to continue to keep up her normal life with

408
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Speaker 1: her friends and cheerleading, so one night, when she's cheering

409
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Speaker 1: at a basketball game, one of the players Grueler is

410
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Speaker 1: now a vampire, so she chases him out of the

411
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Speaker 1: game and fights him. Pike shows up to help, and

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Speaker 1: then Lothos shows up, and there's a weird interaction between

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Speaker 1: him and Buffy where he's like, I'm waiting for you

414
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Speaker 1: to ripen. Yeah, and so we'll talk all about that,

415
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Speaker 1: because yeah, the last thing you want to hear someone

416
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Speaker 1: say to a young woman is exactly that. So or

417
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Speaker 1: a young person at all, Like, yes, it's just like getaway,

418
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Speaker 1: get away, And then Lothos kills Merrick very easily, barely tries.

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Speaker 1: It is every time Lothos is on screen, I'm just like,

420
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Speaker 1: what is happening? What is he doing? How? Why is

421
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Speaker 1: anyone reacting the way they're reacting. I find it all

422
00:26:20,280 --> 00:26:24,520
Speaker 1: very confusing. But he so he kills Mark and then

423
00:26:24,560 --> 00:26:29,800
Speaker 1: just leaves, so Buffy is still safe. She's sad over

424
00:26:29,880 --> 00:26:32,440
Speaker 1: the death of Merrick. She also just feels in way

425
00:26:32,480 --> 00:26:35,400
Speaker 1: over her head, and then she and Pike have an

426
00:26:35,480 --> 00:26:38,240
Speaker 1: argument because she's like, I can't handle this. I just

427
00:26:38,280 --> 00:26:41,200
Speaker 1: want to go to the senior dance and he's like, oh, well,

428
00:26:41,240 --> 00:26:44,640
Speaker 1: I thought you wanted to do important things like kill vampires,

429
00:26:45,160 --> 00:26:50,399
Speaker 1: and then he drives off on his motorcycle. Um So,

430
00:26:50,440 --> 00:26:54,000
Speaker 1: then Buffy goes to the senior dance. Her boyfriend Jeffrey

431
00:26:54,119 --> 00:26:58,400
Speaker 1: dumps her there, which is like who cares, right, We're

432
00:26:58,440 --> 00:27:01,080
Speaker 1: lucky cares because she's like, oh, yeah, here's the other

433
00:27:01,080 --> 00:27:05,320
Speaker 1: guy that I'm a sort of already dating. Yes, because

434
00:27:05,400 --> 00:27:09,240
Speaker 1: Pike shows up after all, and then he and Buffy kiss,

435
00:27:09,880 --> 00:27:14,280
Speaker 1: but then a bunch of vampires invade the dance and

436
00:27:14,280 --> 00:27:18,359
Speaker 1: Buffy fights them. Then she heads off to face Lothos.

437
00:27:19,119 --> 00:27:22,480
Speaker 1: She gets there, she kills Paul Rubens, where again, his

438
00:27:22,600 --> 00:27:27,440
Speaker 1: death scene is just, I would say, totally inconsistent with

439
00:27:28,000 --> 00:27:30,280
Speaker 1: the other things that are happening in this moment in

440
00:27:30,280 --> 00:27:35,679
Speaker 1: the movie, very long and drawn out, extremely campy. But

441
00:27:35,760 --> 00:27:39,000
Speaker 1: I wouldn't want it any other way. You can't have

442
00:27:39,160 --> 00:27:45,560
Speaker 1: it any other way. Um So, then Lothos is about

443
00:27:45,600 --> 00:27:50,840
Speaker 1: to bite Buffy, but then she fights back, she gets away.

444
00:27:51,000 --> 00:27:54,320
Speaker 1: She returns to the dance where her classmates have killed

445
00:27:54,359 --> 00:27:58,000
Speaker 1: a bunch of vampires, and then Lothos bursts in again

446
00:27:58,680 --> 00:28:02,960
Speaker 1: and Buffy finally kills him, and then she and Pike

447
00:28:03,240 --> 00:28:07,200
Speaker 1: ride off on his motorcycle. That's the end of the movie.

448
00:28:07,600 --> 00:28:09,800
Speaker 1: Let's take a quick break and then we'll come right

449
00:28:09,840 --> 00:28:22,399
Speaker 1: back and we are back, all right. Where shall we begin, Jasmine,

450
00:28:22,440 --> 00:28:24,960
Speaker 1: is there anywhere in particular that, like, was there anything

451
00:28:25,000 --> 00:28:27,000
Speaker 1: that stood out to you on this rewatch that you

452
00:28:27,080 --> 00:28:33,000
Speaker 1: want to talk about in particular? Um uh? Maybe too

453
00:28:33,080 --> 00:28:35,120
Speaker 1: much for me to be able to like center my

454
00:28:35,280 --> 00:28:39,200
Speaker 1: brain where to start. So why don't you guys pick something?

455
00:28:39,280 --> 00:28:42,160
Speaker 1: And I'm sure I will have a lot to say. Sure,

456
00:28:43,720 --> 00:28:45,880
Speaker 1: I just wanted to start with a little bit of

457
00:28:45,920 --> 00:28:49,560
Speaker 1: like context on the movie and get through kind of

458
00:28:49,600 --> 00:28:52,520
Speaker 1: the jos Sweden of it all because I'm always trying

459
00:28:52,520 --> 00:28:54,920
Speaker 1: to get in and out there because I feel like

460
00:28:54,960 --> 00:28:56,760
Speaker 1: we've been talking about him too much on the show

461
00:28:56,800 --> 00:29:00,440
Speaker 1: recently and I'm I'm sick of it. Um Okay, So

462
00:29:00,800 --> 00:29:05,960
Speaker 1: this movie was written by Josh Weeden. The characters are

463
00:29:06,160 --> 00:29:08,000
Speaker 1: his creation, and then he goes on to do the

464
00:29:08,040 --> 00:29:11,480
Speaker 1: TV show later. It's also directed. I feel like it's

465
00:29:11,480 --> 00:29:14,160
Speaker 1: not discussed enough. This movie is directed by a woman,

466
00:29:14,640 --> 00:29:18,640
Speaker 1: fran Rubel kuzy Uh and she's I don't know she

467
00:29:18,800 --> 00:29:23,280
Speaker 1: she's been a director of various romps over the course

468
00:29:23,360 --> 00:29:27,080
Speaker 1: of her career. I think that it's interesting, Like the

469
00:29:27,120 --> 00:29:30,880
Speaker 1: main takeaway, I don't know like listeners of the show

470
00:29:30,920 --> 00:29:34,760
Speaker 1: will know jos Sweden bothers me. I don't like him,

471
00:29:34,800 --> 00:29:37,640
Speaker 1: and I think it is so interesting how he has

472
00:29:37,800 --> 00:29:41,040
Speaker 1: kind of managed to shape the entire narrative around this

473
00:29:41,120 --> 00:29:45,240
Speaker 1: movie and in the process whatever a writer who was

474
00:29:45,320 --> 00:29:47,920
Speaker 1: really tooting his own horn for being Mr Feminist for

475
00:29:47,960 --> 00:29:52,000
Speaker 1: a while, like repeatedly dumped on the woman who directed

476
00:29:52,000 --> 00:29:55,560
Speaker 1: this movie and kind of blamed her and Donald Sutherland

477
00:29:55,640 --> 00:29:58,040
Speaker 1: for the reason that it didn't turn out the exact

478
00:29:58,080 --> 00:30:02,600
Speaker 1: way that he wanted it, as if like whatever, he's

479
00:30:02,680 --> 00:30:06,560
Speaker 1: like screenwriting nepotism. He should know that when you've write

480
00:30:06,600 --> 00:30:09,160
Speaker 1: a script, it's not going to appear word for word

481
00:30:09,240 --> 00:30:14,080
Speaker 1: on the fucking screen, you baby. Anyways, So, but but

482
00:30:14,160 --> 00:30:19,880
Speaker 1: he's such a feminist. Yeah google google that, Um whatever, Okay, So, uh,

483
00:30:20,160 --> 00:30:24,320
Speaker 1: I'm like having a hot flash now. It's upsetting. I mean,

484
00:30:24,360 --> 00:30:27,360
Speaker 1: it's really upsetting because for a long time, like you said,

485
00:30:27,400 --> 00:30:31,320
Speaker 1: he was sort of like the voice of I don't know,

486
00:30:31,520 --> 00:30:34,640
Speaker 1: but you're right, women, like kind of like women in

487
00:30:34,800 --> 00:30:38,920
Speaker 1: genre like badass women. I don't It just is kind

488
00:30:38,960 --> 00:30:44,200
Speaker 1: of a bit. Uh. It's so rough when you think

489
00:30:44,200 --> 00:30:48,080
Speaker 1: about it, it just it makes you there's so many

490
00:30:48,080 --> 00:30:51,640
Speaker 1: things that we did wrong in the past. Um, but

491
00:30:52,720 --> 00:30:55,640
Speaker 1: allowing that to sort of be the voice of of

492
00:30:55,800 --> 00:30:59,760
Speaker 1: badass women is maybe one of them. But it shows

493
00:31:00,040 --> 00:31:02,400
Speaker 1: inspire a lot of writers. But now we do have

494
00:31:02,440 --> 00:31:05,520
Speaker 1: to sort of contend with what does that mean to

495
00:31:05,600 --> 00:31:10,479
Speaker 1: have someone like that have shaped such an influential female character.

496
00:31:11,440 --> 00:31:14,960
Speaker 1: It's a it's a messy topic, um, and it seems

497
00:31:14,960 --> 00:31:16,640
Speaker 1: like you guys are sick of talking about it. So

498
00:31:18,760 --> 00:31:21,720
Speaker 1: just in the context of him specifically, he's just been

499
00:31:21,720 --> 00:31:24,640
Speaker 1: coming up a bunch um. But yeah, I mean, I

500
00:31:24,640 --> 00:31:26,480
Speaker 1: guess the long and short of it there is that

501
00:31:26,560 --> 00:31:31,320
Speaker 1: he in multiple interviews, has said that Donald Sutherland was

502
00:31:31,400 --> 00:31:33,640
Speaker 1: very difficult than the set he was writing rewriting his

503
00:31:33,680 --> 00:31:37,400
Speaker 1: own lines, which I do fully believe. It's there's like

504
00:31:37,600 --> 00:31:40,800
Speaker 1: so many stories about Donald Sutherland being a pain in

505
00:31:40,840 --> 00:31:43,600
Speaker 1: the as to work with. Fine, I'll concede at that point.

506
00:31:43,600 --> 00:31:45,640
Speaker 1: But he he also was like, oh and this director

507
00:31:45,760 --> 00:31:48,080
Speaker 1: was so like weak willed and she would let Donald

508
00:31:48,080 --> 00:31:50,520
Speaker 1: Sutherland kind of walk all over her. And I'm just like,

509
00:31:51,240 --> 00:31:55,160
Speaker 1: do you hear yourself? In any case, I think it

510
00:31:55,280 --> 00:31:58,720
Speaker 1: is interesting that you know, in retrospect, Josh Weeden kind

511
00:31:58,720 --> 00:32:02,000
Speaker 1: of actively turned his own fan base against this movie,

512
00:32:02,480 --> 00:32:05,800
Speaker 1: and I think that's why people don't really critically engage

513
00:32:05,800 --> 00:32:10,360
Speaker 1: with it. But there's, uh, there's quite a bit going on. Yeah, yeah, Um,

514
00:32:10,720 --> 00:32:14,400
Speaker 1: starting with I mean, just the kind of basic idea

515
00:32:14,600 --> 00:32:18,960
Speaker 1: of this being a movie that centers a a woman

516
00:32:19,120 --> 00:32:22,480
Speaker 1: is like the hero, like the ass kicking like action

517
00:32:23,200 --> 00:32:28,040
Speaker 1: star of the movie, which like a lot of movies

518
00:32:28,120 --> 00:32:31,600
Speaker 1: of this genre or this type don't do. This is

519
00:32:31,600 --> 00:32:35,600
Speaker 1: a pretty male heavy thing, as is the idea of

520
00:32:35,640 --> 00:32:39,920
Speaker 1: like kind of the hero's journey chosen one narrative that

521
00:32:40,080 --> 00:32:43,520
Speaker 1: is something that women and girls like usually don't get

522
00:32:43,520 --> 00:32:46,600
Speaker 1: to be the chosen one in most stories. This is

523
00:32:46,600 --> 00:32:51,920
Speaker 1: like a pretty male centric idea, and so it's just

524
00:32:51,960 --> 00:32:56,680
Speaker 1: like very cool to have this movie that, as simple

525
00:32:56,720 --> 00:32:59,960
Speaker 1: as it might seem, and like, like you mentioned, Jasmine

526
00:33:00,080 --> 00:33:03,160
Speaker 1: was like a very empowering thing for you to watch,

527
00:33:03,160 --> 00:33:05,040
Speaker 1: Like to be able to like see this woman and

528
00:33:05,720 --> 00:33:09,400
Speaker 1: watch her kicking ass and have this like chosen one

529
00:33:09,560 --> 00:33:15,000
Speaker 1: narrative be about a teen girl, Like that's an empowering

530
00:33:15,080 --> 00:33:18,640
Speaker 1: thing for you know, the target audience of this movie

531
00:33:18,800 --> 00:33:23,360
Speaker 1: being like teens and you know, young people generally, I imagine.

532
00:33:24,000 --> 00:33:27,480
Speaker 1: So yeah, I mean I think that's just like a

533
00:33:27,480 --> 00:33:32,320
Speaker 1: a cool thing in general. Yeah, the movie has things

534
00:33:32,640 --> 00:33:37,160
Speaker 1: to discuss, but the but the I mean, like the

535
00:33:37,240 --> 00:33:41,760
Speaker 1: action scenes are fucking cool and like funny and dynamic,

536
00:33:41,840 --> 00:33:45,640
Speaker 1: and she's in control, like I was really worried about

537
00:33:45,720 --> 00:33:47,640
Speaker 1: at the end. I was like, oh, no, please don't

538
00:33:47,680 --> 00:33:50,560
Speaker 1: say that, you know. I feel like it's so we

539
00:33:50,760 --> 00:33:53,720
Speaker 1: very often see in this kind of this specific era

540
00:33:53,960 --> 00:33:57,280
Speaker 1: of when women are fighting or even when they're the hero,

541
00:33:57,760 --> 00:34:00,560
Speaker 1: they're kind of like tossed out of the climax scene

542
00:34:00,560 --> 00:34:03,280
Speaker 1: and it's like, no, now you will be saved. And

543
00:34:04,040 --> 00:34:08,360
Speaker 1: this happens in another vampire movie with Twilight, where Bella

544
00:34:08,480 --> 00:34:13,319
Speaker 1: Swan is the protagonist of that franchise, and yet in

545
00:34:13,360 --> 00:34:18,160
Speaker 1: the first movie she's just like rendered unconscious almost immediately

546
00:34:18,280 --> 00:34:21,560
Speaker 1: during the climax and then like doesn't get to do anything. Yeah,

547
00:34:21,640 --> 00:34:24,759
Speaker 1: and then like the other example, I always go to

548
00:34:24,880 --> 00:34:29,480
Speaker 1: his like Kristen Kirsten, Sorry, it was getting like the

549
00:34:29,520 --> 00:34:33,080
Speaker 1: oh the Christians and the Kirsten movie stars Kirsten Dunce

550
00:34:33,160 --> 00:34:35,680
Speaker 1: like caught in a just like held on the side

551
00:34:35,680 --> 00:34:37,840
Speaker 1: of the scene in a spider web for the entire

552
00:34:37,920 --> 00:34:42,200
Speaker 1: climax of Spiderman too. Um, you're just like, okay, so

553
00:34:42,440 --> 00:34:45,560
Speaker 1: you're not invited to proticit like, but Buffy remains in

554
00:34:45,800 --> 00:34:49,760
Speaker 1: control of basically all of the action. And it's really

555
00:34:49,800 --> 00:34:52,279
Speaker 1: I thought Christie Swanton did a really good job. She's

556
00:34:52,719 --> 00:34:55,520
Speaker 1: I thought so too. I also really loved like, at

557
00:34:55,560 --> 00:34:58,680
Speaker 1: the very end, you have you have Pike, and I

558
00:34:58,719 --> 00:35:02,959
Speaker 1: appreciated the Pike was the damsel here. You know, Pike

559
00:35:03,719 --> 00:35:06,839
Speaker 1: always fainted. There was even one time I think where

560
00:35:06,840 --> 00:35:08,680
Speaker 1: I heard him saying like, at least I did faint

561
00:35:08,760 --> 00:35:11,799
Speaker 1: this time. And you get to the very end and

562
00:35:12,160 --> 00:35:14,919
Speaker 1: Buffy has saved the day. I mean, Pike didn't really

563
00:35:15,200 --> 00:35:18,279
Speaker 1: do much. I don't really know what he did, uh,

564
00:35:18,320 --> 00:35:20,759
Speaker 1: But he looks up and he's like, oh, did I

565
00:35:20,800 --> 00:35:24,640
Speaker 1: do all this? And she's like, no, no, you absolutely

566
00:35:24,640 --> 00:35:28,120
Speaker 1: did not. And he's like, yeah, yeah, he did all this,

567
00:35:28,480 --> 00:35:30,919
Speaker 1: and it's it is totally fine with that. I don't

568
00:35:30,960 --> 00:35:33,719
Speaker 1: I never felt like he felt like his masculinity was

569
00:35:33,800 --> 00:35:35,920
Speaker 1: threatened in any way, not that it should have been,

570
00:35:35,960 --> 00:35:38,520
Speaker 1: but this is the early nineties we're talking about, um,

571
00:35:38,560 --> 00:35:41,520
Speaker 1: and I just really think that, like, as a young

572
00:35:41,680 --> 00:35:45,520
Speaker 1: girl watching this, I didn't realize this obviously at the time,

573
00:35:45,600 --> 00:35:49,160
Speaker 1: but I internalized a lot of the good There's there's

574
00:35:49,200 --> 00:35:51,160
Speaker 1: some rough stuff we'll talk about that, but a lot

575
00:35:51,280 --> 00:35:53,720
Speaker 1: of the good things. The main thing being watching this

576
00:35:54,200 --> 00:35:57,520
Speaker 1: woman like really like you said, take over, take ownership,

577
00:35:57,840 --> 00:36:00,520
Speaker 1: kick butt, and like come out and on top, and

578
00:36:00,600 --> 00:36:03,239
Speaker 1: she is She's the one. No one else does this

579
00:36:03,320 --> 00:36:06,960
Speaker 1: but her. She saves the world basically. Um. I think

580
00:36:06,960 --> 00:36:11,200
Speaker 1: it was really informative, especially now as I'm getting into making,

581
00:36:11,360 --> 00:36:13,840
Speaker 1: you know, being able to help make my own content,

582
00:36:14,000 --> 00:36:16,720
Speaker 1: the kind of things that I value and the kinds

583
00:36:16,760 --> 00:36:19,400
Speaker 1: of stuff that I want to make. I really do

584
00:36:19,480 --> 00:36:21,160
Speaker 1: think that if I think about it, I can trace

585
00:36:21,200 --> 00:36:24,880
Speaker 1: it back to very early on, like watching and loving

586
00:36:25,280 --> 00:36:28,319
Speaker 1: Buffy as a kid. You just never know like what

587
00:36:28,360 --> 00:36:30,960
Speaker 1: someone's going to watch and how it's going to influence them,

588
00:36:30,960 --> 00:36:33,399
Speaker 1: which is why I think that it's really important like

589
00:36:33,520 --> 00:36:36,040
Speaker 1: what we put out there, what we put on on

590
00:36:36,160 --> 00:36:40,640
Speaker 1: our screens, um, because you just you just don't know that.

591
00:36:41,880 --> 00:36:46,960
Speaker 1: And with that romantic subplot with Pike, as you said,

592
00:36:47,120 --> 00:36:50,200
Speaker 1: there's like I mean, it starts out it's it's like

593
00:36:50,200 --> 00:36:53,839
Speaker 1: one of those enemies to lovers dynamics, which is like,

594
00:36:54,520 --> 00:36:59,640
Speaker 1: which I kind of I do. I'm a sucker for that. Um.

595
00:36:59,680 --> 00:37:03,680
Speaker 1: But like we mentioned, like their dynamic is mostly this

596
00:37:03,840 --> 00:37:06,640
Speaker 1: like almost like gender flipped, because we're so used to

597
00:37:06,640 --> 00:37:09,719
Speaker 1: seeing it the other way, where you know, we're used

598
00:37:09,760 --> 00:37:13,440
Speaker 1: to seeing a man be the fighter, the protector, the

599
00:37:13,520 --> 00:37:17,560
Speaker 1: action hero and his love interest a woman because everything

600
00:37:17,800 --> 00:37:22,719
Speaker 1: is hetero in movies. Um that she's the damsel. She's

601
00:37:22,719 --> 00:37:24,359
Speaker 1: the one who has to be saved. She's the one

602
00:37:24,360 --> 00:37:27,680
Speaker 1: who's not really participating in any of the action in

603
00:37:27,680 --> 00:37:31,120
Speaker 1: this movie, though, it's like completely flipped where he does

604
00:37:31,200 --> 00:37:34,879
Speaker 1: help out sometimes and almost he he assumes this role

605
00:37:35,000 --> 00:37:38,879
Speaker 1: is almost like her sidekick. I would say, I think

606
00:37:38,880 --> 00:37:40,640
Speaker 1: he kind of gets in the way a little bit more,

607
00:37:42,000 --> 00:37:45,719
Speaker 1: which like is funny and like, yeah, I don't know,

608
00:37:45,760 --> 00:37:49,600
Speaker 1: I just I appreciated that where there's yeah, various scenes

609
00:37:49,640 --> 00:37:53,080
Speaker 1: where he like he doesn't fight at all and then

610
00:37:53,080 --> 00:37:56,360
Speaker 1: he instead fates or he does like help out a

611
00:37:56,400 --> 00:37:59,440
Speaker 1: little bit, but it's still buffy like taking the reins

612
00:37:59,520 --> 00:38:02,759
Speaker 1: and like getting ship mostly done. And then like you said,

613
00:38:02,760 --> 00:38:05,920
Speaker 1: like at the end, like he acknowledges that he hasn't

614
00:38:05,960 --> 00:38:10,680
Speaker 1: contributed much. This is not a blow to his ego.

615
00:38:11,040 --> 00:38:14,680
Speaker 1: He's just like, wow, you're And I also think that

616
00:38:14,719 --> 00:38:18,320
Speaker 1: there's something to be said for him kind of encouraging

617
00:38:18,520 --> 00:38:21,040
Speaker 1: her to like continue to be the slayer because there's

618
00:38:21,040 --> 00:38:23,280
Speaker 1: like a moment where she's like, I'm in over my head,

619
00:38:23,440 --> 00:38:25,880
Speaker 1: like I just want to be a normal teenager, Like

620
00:38:25,960 --> 00:38:28,560
Speaker 1: this was sprung on me and I never asked for

621
00:38:28,560 --> 00:38:31,359
Speaker 1: this and blah blah blah. And he was just like, well, like,

622
00:38:31,560 --> 00:38:33,719
Speaker 1: you have this opportunity, now, don't you want to like

623
00:38:33,760 --> 00:38:37,120
Speaker 1: make something of it and like do this important stuff.

624
00:38:37,160 --> 00:38:40,279
Speaker 1: And you know, the way he handles it is like

625
00:38:40,400 --> 00:38:42,239
Speaker 1: maybe a little I don't know, I feel like he

626
00:38:42,440 --> 00:38:44,319
Speaker 1: could have handled that better. But the fact that he's

627
00:38:44,360 --> 00:38:51,439
Speaker 1: like cheering her, he's her cheerleader. Wow. I also love

628
00:38:51,560 --> 00:38:55,840
Speaker 1: that he even though he felt like it was beneath

629
00:38:56,320 --> 00:39:00,520
Speaker 1: Buffy and definitely beneath himself, he still showed up the dance.

630
00:39:00,760 --> 00:39:03,800
Speaker 1: He still came to the dance, and he came prepared.

631
00:39:04,160 --> 00:39:09,120
Speaker 1: I think you bought a bunch of spikes, a bunch

632
00:39:09,120 --> 00:39:13,399
Speaker 1: of wood and it came in. Yeah. I was I'm

633
00:39:13,440 --> 00:39:16,520
Speaker 1: glad for having this this talk because I was back

634
00:39:16,560 --> 00:39:20,399
Speaker 1: and forth it on like Okay, what function does this

635
00:39:20,880 --> 00:39:24,839
Speaker 1: love story serve? And like, as I was watching it

636
00:39:24,880 --> 00:39:28,520
Speaker 1: to to prepare, I do think that like there is,

637
00:39:29,080 --> 00:39:31,640
Speaker 1: I don't know. We're always arguing that it's like, is

638
00:39:31,680 --> 00:39:34,480
Speaker 1: this head of real love story necessary to the story,

639
00:39:34,680 --> 00:39:37,200
Speaker 1: and well, and I you know, we'll get to this,

640
00:39:37,280 --> 00:39:39,640
Speaker 1: and we've sort of already started talking about this, but um,

641
00:39:40,120 --> 00:39:42,520
Speaker 1: how I do wish that one of just like the

642
00:39:42,520 --> 00:39:44,719
Speaker 1: glaring things about this movie is that there are no

643
00:39:45,040 --> 00:39:48,680
Speaker 1: women in Buffy's life that provide any support or like

644
00:39:48,760 --> 00:39:52,000
Speaker 1: real narrative importance for her, And so I wish that

645
00:39:52,080 --> 00:39:55,840
Speaker 1: she also had like a friendship. But I did feel like, yeah,

646
00:39:55,920 --> 00:39:58,759
Speaker 1: the dynamic with her Pike, especially as the movie goes on,

647
00:39:58,920 --> 00:40:03,239
Speaker 1: does serve a function like you're describing Jasmine of like

648
00:40:04,120 --> 00:40:07,560
Speaker 1: you know, it's still extremely heteronormative and and stuff that

649
00:40:07,640 --> 00:40:12,640
Speaker 1: it's like movies from to be, but it's he's not

650
00:40:13,040 --> 00:40:15,440
Speaker 1: threatened by her, because I feel like even when you

651
00:40:15,520 --> 00:40:21,960
Speaker 1: do have these like very active female action stars the

652
00:40:22,080 --> 00:40:25,120
Speaker 1: guy that they'll partner with, even if they're very in love,

653
00:40:25,560 --> 00:40:29,719
Speaker 1: sometimes it's like he's not totally okay with the dynamic

654
00:40:30,000 --> 00:40:34,880
Speaker 1: or like he's threatened by it. Almost feels like a competition. Yeah,

655
00:40:35,000 --> 00:40:37,040
Speaker 1: and this doesn't feel that way at all, And it's

656
00:40:37,120 --> 00:40:39,960
Speaker 1: like it sounds like that that does have like a

657
00:40:40,000 --> 00:40:44,520
Speaker 1: real positive application of like Pike is still this like

658
00:40:44,760 --> 00:40:52,720
Speaker 1: traditionally cool like outsider motorcycle like like he's so he's cool, right,

659
00:40:52,960 --> 00:40:56,719
Speaker 1: but also is very secure in himself and is like

660
00:40:56,840 --> 00:40:59,400
Speaker 1: okay with his girlfriend being the one who saves the

661
00:40:59,440 --> 00:41:02,840
Speaker 1: world and was rooting for them by the end. I

662
00:41:02,880 --> 00:41:07,840
Speaker 1: just wish that she had some friendships. Um, some friends

663
00:41:08,560 --> 00:41:11,520
Speaker 1: she can have that and friends right, like her best

664
00:41:11,560 --> 00:41:14,600
Speaker 1: friend ended up being Donald Sutherland in a trench coat.

665
00:41:15,200 --> 00:41:19,880
Speaker 1: I needed a I needed a little more than that. Yeah. Uh.

666
00:41:19,920 --> 00:41:23,600
Speaker 1: The one thing about the romantic subplot that was all

667
00:41:23,800 --> 00:41:28,680
Speaker 1: for me was like really this again, where at the

668
00:41:28,760 --> 00:41:33,120
Speaker 1: dance he's like, Puffy, you're not like other girls, but

669
00:41:33,360 --> 00:41:37,319
Speaker 1: she's like, yes, I am. I liked that. I liked that.

670
00:41:37,520 --> 00:41:39,800
Speaker 1: I was glad because when I heard that, I like, groan,

671
00:41:40,200 --> 00:41:42,759
Speaker 1: why what what was your What problem did you have

672
00:41:42,960 --> 00:41:45,880
Speaker 1: with it? I mean mostly just that like the idea

673
00:41:45,960 --> 00:41:50,080
Speaker 1: of like Heateroman especially will use the you're not like

674
00:41:50,120 --> 00:41:53,239
Speaker 1: other girls as a compliment when it's really just like

675
00:41:53,719 --> 00:41:56,080
Speaker 1: that's just a way to tear down other women or

676
00:41:56,160 --> 00:42:00,759
Speaker 1: to like paint femininity or just like womanhood or girlhood,

677
00:42:00,880 --> 00:42:06,359
Speaker 1: and these broad strokes and as like bad, right, but like, oh,

678
00:42:06,400 --> 00:42:08,680
Speaker 1: but if you're not like the other girls, you're different

679
00:42:08,719 --> 00:42:11,480
Speaker 1: in like X y Z ways, Like that's awesome. So

680
00:42:11,520 --> 00:42:13,560
Speaker 1: it just like is a way to kind of demonize

681
00:42:14,400 --> 00:42:17,560
Speaker 1: femininity and like girlhood and womanhood and things like that.

682
00:42:17,640 --> 00:42:20,040
Speaker 1: So it's like always like it always pings for us

683
00:42:20,080 --> 00:42:23,440
Speaker 1: when we hear like, oh, you're not like the other girls.

684
00:42:23,520 --> 00:42:25,959
Speaker 1: But then she's just like So what I liked about

685
00:42:25,960 --> 00:42:29,359
Speaker 1: it is that she immediately challenges him and it's just like, yeah,

686
00:42:29,400 --> 00:42:33,279
Speaker 1: I am because there's nothing wrong with other girls. Who

687
00:42:33,320 --> 00:42:36,279
Speaker 1: doesn't say that, but like that's the implication I just

688
00:42:36,320 --> 00:42:38,600
Speaker 1: wish to. The script also followed through on that and

689
00:42:38,680 --> 00:42:44,520
Speaker 1: gave us some likable women in the script that weren't Buffy,

690
00:42:44,640 --> 00:42:47,000
Speaker 1: which which we know that like Jos Sueden is capable

691
00:42:47,040 --> 00:42:49,239
Speaker 1: of doing. So I'm assuming that that had to do

692
00:42:49,360 --> 00:42:53,319
Speaker 1: with studio stuff, because it like we do know that he,

693
00:42:53,960 --> 00:42:56,799
Speaker 1: you know, for all his faults, does right women who

694
00:42:56,800 --> 00:42:59,040
Speaker 1: are friends with each other and important to each other.

695
00:42:59,200 --> 00:43:02,080
Speaker 1: But yeah, that I don't know. I'd like I And

696
00:43:02,200 --> 00:43:05,760
Speaker 1: I also another like little moment that I appreciated from

697
00:43:05,920 --> 00:43:10,680
Speaker 1: Buffy was also at the end where I think Pike

698
00:43:10,800 --> 00:43:13,080
Speaker 1: says something like he asked her to dance after she's

699
00:43:13,160 --> 00:43:18,640
Speaker 1: killed every vampire ever, and he's like, I'm assuming you

700
00:43:18,680 --> 00:43:21,960
Speaker 1: want to lead, and she's like, no, I don't. And

701
00:43:22,000 --> 00:43:25,759
Speaker 1: I liked that. I was like, that's I didn't think

702
00:43:25,760 --> 00:43:27,879
Speaker 1: it until she said that. I was like, oh, yeah,

703
00:43:27,960 --> 00:43:31,719
Speaker 1: like action girl protagonists, I feel like we're so like

704
00:43:32,120 --> 00:43:34,400
Speaker 1: painted with a broad stroke of like and she's in

705
00:43:34,560 --> 00:43:37,319
Speaker 1: charge of fucking everything and she's the boss of blah

706
00:43:37,320 --> 00:43:39,560
Speaker 1: blah blah blah blah, where it's like people are complicated,

707
00:43:39,600 --> 00:43:43,120
Speaker 1: and she's like, nope, I don't want to be you

708
00:43:43,160 --> 00:43:45,920
Speaker 1: can do this. It's all good and it's fine. Like

709
00:43:46,120 --> 00:43:49,399
Speaker 1: I thought that was a very sweet exchange. Yeah, it's

710
00:43:49,440 --> 00:43:51,640
Speaker 1: it's kind of like you guys said, I guess a

711
00:43:51,640 --> 00:43:55,680
Speaker 1: little bit unfortunate that in the whole if you look

712
00:43:55,680 --> 00:43:59,719
Speaker 1: at the way that they paint that they be particularly

713
00:43:59,719 --> 00:44:02,360
Speaker 1: teen age girls. But I guess you could say, um,

714
00:44:02,480 --> 00:44:05,400
Speaker 1: women in general, since there are no like adult figures

715
00:44:05,520 --> 00:44:09,760
Speaker 1: in her life because her mom is awful as well. Uh,

716
00:44:09,880 --> 00:44:14,560
Speaker 1: it's a very very negative view of them and even

717
00:44:14,640 --> 00:44:17,239
Speaker 1: like take like Buffy herself. I don't know if you

718
00:44:17,280 --> 00:44:21,319
Speaker 1: guys tracked this, but I happen to. I love, love,

719
00:44:21,400 --> 00:44:25,520
Speaker 1: love like outfits in fashion, and I particularly love the

720
00:44:25,600 --> 00:44:30,600
Speaker 1: stuff in this movie. Um, but Buffy goes from wearing

721
00:44:31,160 --> 00:44:34,759
Speaker 1: the sun dresses and like her hair down and all

722
00:44:34,800 --> 00:44:38,600
Speaker 1: that to wearing cut off shorts with like a flannel

723
00:44:38,800 --> 00:44:42,799
Speaker 1: and boots. Like the implications sort of being that if

724
00:44:42,880 --> 00:44:45,320
Speaker 1: you are into this stuff, you're into Even at the

725
00:44:45,360 --> 00:44:46,880
Speaker 1: end when she's going to look for like a dress

726
00:44:46,880 --> 00:44:49,560
Speaker 1: and she's shopping, she's not like super into it anymore

727
00:44:49,600 --> 00:44:52,279
Speaker 1: because now she's evolved. She's better than that. She's like

728
00:44:52,600 --> 00:44:55,279
Speaker 1: the next level of woman, which I have a huge

729
00:44:55,320 --> 00:44:59,760
Speaker 1: problem with. I think, like you said, Jamie, people are multifaceted,

730
00:45:00,160 --> 00:45:03,759
Speaker 1: and I don't love this idea that it doesn't only

731
00:45:03,800 --> 00:45:05,960
Speaker 1: come up in Buffy. That comes up quite a bit

732
00:45:06,000 --> 00:45:09,160
Speaker 1: that if you happen to be quote unquote girl or

733
00:45:09,160 --> 00:45:13,280
Speaker 1: into fashion or whatever it is, um that is deemed

734
00:45:13,320 --> 00:45:17,080
Speaker 1: to be like I said, uh, feminine activity, that it's

735
00:45:17,200 --> 00:45:19,000
Speaker 1: less than and it makes you less than. And in

736
00:45:19,120 --> 00:45:22,200
Speaker 1: order to ascend, you have to put that behind you

737
00:45:22,239 --> 00:45:24,680
Speaker 1: and realize that that is not something that you need

738
00:45:24,719 --> 00:45:27,040
Speaker 1: to care about. And once you do that, you will

739
00:45:27,080 --> 00:45:29,480
Speaker 1: become the person that you should be. And I think

740
00:45:29,520 --> 00:45:33,239
Speaker 1: the two things can completely and totally exist together, which

741
00:45:33,239 --> 00:45:35,480
Speaker 1: is why I wish that at least one of her

742
00:45:35,560 --> 00:45:39,640
Speaker 1: friends had like stood by her in addition to Pike

743
00:45:39,800 --> 00:45:42,800
Speaker 1: and didn't have to. I mean, they were pretty awful

744
00:45:42,800 --> 00:45:44,680
Speaker 1: in the beginning, but I don't think that like some

745
00:45:44,719 --> 00:45:47,240
Speaker 1: of the stuff that they loved needed to have changed

746
00:45:47,640 --> 00:45:53,840
Speaker 1: to still support their friend and take down vampires together. Yeah,

747
00:45:53,960 --> 00:45:57,120
Speaker 1: I totally agree. Yeah, where it's like and again, it's

748
00:45:57,160 --> 00:45:59,440
Speaker 1: like I don't even know who would have been the

749
00:45:59,600 --> 00:46:02,200
Speaker 1: purpose trader of that stuff, because Josh Weeden has like

750
00:46:02,280 --> 00:46:05,640
Speaker 1: distanced himself so much from this script, so who knows.

751
00:46:05,680 --> 00:46:08,880
Speaker 1: But but yeah, it does seem to like in a

752
00:46:08,920 --> 00:46:10,920
Speaker 1: way that feels very nineties, but I feel it does

753
00:46:11,000 --> 00:46:16,719
Speaker 1: still happen sometimes in media like demonize whatever a more

754
00:46:16,800 --> 00:46:21,000
Speaker 1: traditional form of femininity and make it seem like, oh,

755
00:46:21,120 --> 00:46:26,600
Speaker 1: this is an inherently weak and vapid way to live

756
00:46:26,680 --> 00:46:30,920
Speaker 1: and feel. Where it's like that is so like there's

757
00:46:31,000 --> 00:46:34,240
Speaker 1: no gray area there, and there needs to be gray area,

758
00:46:34,400 --> 00:46:37,560
Speaker 1: especially because I don't know even like style Lize, I

759
00:46:37,600 --> 00:46:41,600
Speaker 1: was like, I want Buffy's costumes from the beginning, not

760
00:46:41,719 --> 00:46:45,719
Speaker 1: the end, or like some modification because I know It's like,

761
00:46:45,960 --> 00:46:48,200
Speaker 1: you know, I want her to be able to fight comfortably,

762
00:46:48,280 --> 00:46:50,520
Speaker 1: but I'm like, you could modify your style at the

763
00:46:50,560 --> 00:46:54,560
Speaker 1: beginning to make it like vampire killing friendly. I liked

764
00:46:54,560 --> 00:46:57,080
Speaker 1: all of the outfits. I like Buffy in the beginning

765
00:46:57,160 --> 00:47:01,680
Speaker 1: and the end, then all of her outfits for the

766
00:47:01,760 --> 00:47:06,480
Speaker 1: training montage too. I really liked that training montage me too, right,

767
00:47:06,760 --> 00:47:09,960
Speaker 1: But the movie does like subscribe to this idea that

768
00:47:10,000 --> 00:47:14,520
Speaker 1: like Buffy is the one good female character in this story,

769
00:47:14,640 --> 00:47:18,080
Speaker 1: and all the other women because they like, quote unquote

770
00:47:18,120 --> 00:47:22,360
Speaker 1: like feminine things that the movie deems to be like vapid,

771
00:47:22,680 --> 00:47:27,000
Speaker 1: like shopping and like wearing dresses and caring about going

772
00:47:27,040 --> 00:47:30,960
Speaker 1: to a dance and like all that stuff all the

773
00:47:31,040 --> 00:47:35,520
Speaker 1: other women in the movie equals bad to the point where,

774
00:47:35,600 --> 00:47:39,400
Speaker 1: like to bring up the costuming thing again, when Buffy

775
00:47:39,440 --> 00:47:41,920
Speaker 1: goes leaves the dance to go fight this like Horde

776
00:47:41,920 --> 00:47:45,520
Speaker 1: of Vampires, she's wearing a dress, but Luke Perry throws

777
00:47:45,560 --> 00:47:49,120
Speaker 1: her his leather jacket as if to say, like, you'll

778
00:47:49,200 --> 00:47:53,960
Speaker 1: need this to fight vampires. I said that exact thing

779
00:47:54,000 --> 00:47:55,720
Speaker 1: when I was watching it. I was like, what's the point,

780
00:47:56,040 --> 00:47:59,000
Speaker 1: what is that gonna do? I feel like it's going

781
00:47:59,040 --> 00:48:01,279
Speaker 1: to like encumber her arms, it's going to make it

782
00:48:01,360 --> 00:48:06,480
Speaker 1: harder for but cool. I gotta LEVI jacket great, but

783
00:48:06,920 --> 00:48:09,239
Speaker 1: it looks cool. I guess I don't know, but yeah,

784
00:48:09,280 --> 00:48:12,239
Speaker 1: I think. In addition, so not only are all the

785
00:48:12,520 --> 00:48:15,440
Speaker 1: all the other female characters in this story, you know,

786
00:48:15,640 --> 00:48:19,600
Speaker 1: painted with these broad strokes of just like portrayed as

787
00:48:19,640 --> 00:48:26,560
Speaker 1: being too hyper feminine equals vapid equals bad kind of logic. Um,

788
00:48:26,600 --> 00:48:31,000
Speaker 1: it means that all of Buffy's most significant relationships in

789
00:48:31,040 --> 00:48:34,120
Speaker 1: the movie are with men. And you know, we talked

790
00:48:34,160 --> 00:48:36,880
Speaker 1: about her and the love interest Pike already, but then

791
00:48:36,880 --> 00:48:40,680
Speaker 1: there's also like Buffy and her mentor Merrick, Buffy and

792
00:48:40,920 --> 00:48:44,759
Speaker 1: the villain Loathos, So like we can have separate discussions

793
00:48:44,840 --> 00:48:48,279
Speaker 1: about that. But yeah, the movie does subscribe to this

794
00:48:48,440 --> 00:48:51,200
Speaker 1: idea that like, Buffy is kind of not like the

795
00:48:51,239 --> 00:48:54,439
Speaker 1: other girls and that's a good thing, right, And it's

796
00:48:54,480 --> 00:48:57,439
Speaker 1: like that's not the message that we should be putting

797
00:48:57,480 --> 00:48:59,719
Speaker 1: out into the world, which is wild, yeah, because it's

798
00:48:59,719 --> 00:49:04,080
Speaker 1: like the character pushes against that, but then the movie

799
00:49:04,120 --> 00:49:08,839
Speaker 1: doesn't quite follow through on effectively commenting on it. It's

800
00:49:08,840 --> 00:49:13,760
Speaker 1: a little bit messie. Yeah, let's take another quick break,

801
00:49:13,800 --> 00:49:22,239
Speaker 1: and then we will come right back and we're back.

802
00:49:22,680 --> 00:49:29,120
Speaker 1: Should we talk about Buffy and Merrick? Which why not?

803
00:49:33,640 --> 00:49:37,400
Speaker 1: I mean he he like also starts out being like, Wow,

804
00:49:37,440 --> 00:49:42,560
Speaker 1: I've never met such a like vacuous and vapid slayer.

805
00:49:42,760 --> 00:49:46,320
Speaker 1: I can't believe I'm stuck with you right now. And

806
00:49:47,440 --> 00:49:51,960
Speaker 1: but then she's constantly challenging him, and it gets to

807
00:49:51,960 --> 00:49:57,080
Speaker 1: a point where they actually develop a bond and mutual trust,

808
00:49:57,440 --> 00:50:00,600
Speaker 1: and at one point she's like, what do you even do, sir?

809
00:50:00,920 --> 00:50:03,560
Speaker 1: Like I'm out here putting my neck on the line.

810
00:50:04,200 --> 00:50:07,000
Speaker 1: What are you doing? Like? Oh, I'm kind of like

811
00:50:07,040 --> 00:50:10,839
Speaker 1: a trainer kind of guy, a very bad one because

812
00:50:10,880 --> 00:50:15,400
Speaker 1: it's been centuries and he has not defeated the vampires.

813
00:50:15,440 --> 00:50:17,399
Speaker 1: I'm like, how do you still have this job? In

814
00:50:17,440 --> 00:50:20,160
Speaker 1: any other line of work? If you consistently do not

815
00:50:20,280 --> 00:50:23,480
Speaker 1: deliver the results, you are replaced. Yeah, here you are

816
00:50:23,960 --> 00:50:27,680
Speaker 1: to lead another girl to the slaughter. Men get a

817
00:50:27,760 --> 00:50:31,239
Speaker 1: million chances, don't they? They a million chance to do

818
00:50:31,320 --> 00:50:35,239
Speaker 1: one thing? He also like he admits he's like, oh,

819
00:50:35,480 --> 00:50:38,759
Speaker 1: I should have found you so like so many years ago.

820
00:50:39,200 --> 00:50:41,520
Speaker 1: We should have started your training a long time ago.

821
00:50:41,680 --> 00:50:45,600
Speaker 1: But I don't I don't know. I just it was like, well,

822
00:50:45,600 --> 00:50:47,520
Speaker 1: what do you what were you doing? Like, isn't it

823
00:50:47,520 --> 00:50:50,399
Speaker 1: your job to find her and then like early on

824
00:50:50,640 --> 00:50:53,319
Speaker 1: and train her. So it's also such a like a

825
00:50:53,400 --> 00:50:56,840
Speaker 1: blase sort of thing to say, considering this is Buffy's

826
00:50:57,000 --> 00:51:00,800
Speaker 1: life her, like she's putting her life on the line,

827
00:51:01,239 --> 00:51:04,680
Speaker 1: and Mary's just like, oh, sorry, you probably should have

828
00:51:04,760 --> 00:51:06,759
Speaker 1: years of training under your belt, but you're still going

829
00:51:06,800 --> 00:51:09,680
Speaker 1: to have to sort of condense everything into a four

830
00:51:09,760 --> 00:51:12,040
Speaker 1: week timeline. I think at one point Buffy says, it's

831
00:51:12,040 --> 00:51:14,800
Speaker 1: been like three weeks or four weeks or something years

832
00:51:14,800 --> 00:51:20,640
Speaker 1: and training condensed four weeks. Marek is awful, trash, He's

833
00:51:20,800 --> 00:51:23,799
Speaker 1: bad at his job, like I felt like, and I

834
00:51:23,840 --> 00:51:26,279
Speaker 1: feel like Buffy. Buffy did so much of the like

835
00:51:26,360 --> 00:51:30,120
Speaker 1: emotional lifting in that like she like whatever, She's like, oh,

836
00:51:30,160 --> 00:51:32,880
Speaker 1: he made a joke, like she kind of like brings

837
00:51:32,920 --> 00:51:35,279
Speaker 1: out a lighter side of him. But it's like, yeah,

838
00:51:35,360 --> 00:51:38,200
Speaker 1: he put her in an impossible situation that was like

839
00:51:38,360 --> 00:51:41,799
Speaker 1: for sure, and she pulls it off like she's I

840
00:51:41,800 --> 00:51:44,400
Speaker 1: don't know, I thought that that that montage cracked me

841
00:51:44,480 --> 00:51:47,600
Speaker 1: up because she's wearing the same outfit at the beginning

842
00:51:47,640 --> 00:51:50,640
Speaker 1: and end of the montage, So I guess that she

843
00:51:50,760 --> 00:51:52,879
Speaker 1: just happened to be wearing the same outfit exactly three

844
00:51:52,920 --> 00:51:56,799
Speaker 1: weeks later, which is like true to like clothes, but

845
00:51:57,040 --> 00:52:00,239
Speaker 1: was confusing movie wise, like what it seems like no

846
00:52:00,440 --> 00:52:03,000
Speaker 1: time has past because he's always wearing the same trench coat,

847
00:52:03,040 --> 00:52:09,600
Speaker 1: so you're like, what day is it? Whatever? Gosh, Yeah,

848
00:52:09,640 --> 00:52:12,000
Speaker 1: but yeah, I mean, I guess I don't totally know

849
00:52:12,040 --> 00:52:14,759
Speaker 1: how to feel about this relationship because he also like

850
00:52:15,120 --> 00:52:19,719
Speaker 1: dies like and then there's like forty more minutes of

851
00:52:19,760 --> 00:52:24,320
Speaker 1: the movie. But I guess I appreciate that that dynamic

852
00:52:24,560 --> 00:52:27,520
Speaker 1: grows and that they come to respect each other, and

853
00:52:27,560 --> 00:52:30,759
Speaker 1: then he's even like, wow, you're you were the right

854
00:52:30,800 --> 00:52:33,680
Speaker 1: person for the job after all. And then I think

855
00:52:33,719 --> 00:52:37,240
Speaker 1: as he's dying, she's like, sorry, I keep doing this wrong,

856
00:52:37,320 --> 00:52:42,080
Speaker 1: and he's like, no, don't do that. Yeah, do what

857
00:52:42,120 --> 00:52:44,960
Speaker 1: you're doing. Don't play our game. Don't play by our rules,

858
00:52:45,000 --> 00:52:49,360
Speaker 1: because clearly it never works because there's still vampires around,

859
00:52:50,440 --> 00:52:54,560
Speaker 1: So do it your way, Buffy. And so he respects

860
00:52:54,560 --> 00:52:57,960
Speaker 1: her and admires her, and yeah, So I don't know.

861
00:52:58,000 --> 00:53:01,560
Speaker 1: I guess I was like fine all of that. Yeah,

862
00:53:01,600 --> 00:53:03,600
Speaker 1: I think the relationship you know, it ended up being

863
00:53:03,760 --> 00:53:07,839
Speaker 1: kind of sweet. My issues specifically come with Mark as

864
00:53:07,920 --> 00:53:10,800
Speaker 1: the trainer of the Slayers, and I've said my piece

865
00:53:10,880 --> 00:53:17,320
Speaker 1: about that, like story was like I didn't hate Mark.

866
00:53:17,400 --> 00:53:20,160
Speaker 1: I just felt like their connection Like again, I just

867
00:53:20,200 --> 00:53:23,279
Speaker 1: feel like there were stronger options for a character for

868
00:53:23,320 --> 00:53:25,800
Speaker 1: Buffy to connect with because they truly had nothing in common.

869
00:53:25,920 --> 00:53:29,040
Speaker 1: He wasn't doing a good job. And then when he died,

870
00:53:29,480 --> 00:53:32,319
Speaker 1: like she was, she was sad, but it was also like,

871
00:53:32,520 --> 00:53:34,040
Speaker 1: I don't know, I feel like the movie wanted you

872
00:53:34,080 --> 00:53:37,040
Speaker 1: to really feel his death and I was like, oh wow,

873
00:53:37,360 --> 00:53:41,399
Speaker 1: Donald Sutherland died pretty early in the movie. That's that's interesting, right.

874
00:53:42,719 --> 00:53:45,279
Speaker 1: I was like, well that was kind of easy. That

875
00:53:45,400 --> 00:53:47,879
Speaker 1: was simple. I thought it would have lasted the whole time,

876
00:53:48,040 --> 00:53:52,200
Speaker 1: all right. There was like no fight, Like suddenly he

877
00:53:52,480 --> 00:53:56,480
Speaker 1: was just stabbed. There was like no fighting leading up

878
00:53:56,520 --> 00:54:06,840
Speaker 1: to that. I was like, what how? Who was all back? Um? Also, okay,

879
00:54:06,920 --> 00:54:11,760
Speaker 1: so Marek is like, hey, how about those menstrual cramps

880
00:54:11,800 --> 00:54:16,440
Speaker 1: you're feeling? Oh my god? Yes, okay, Josh, is that

881
00:54:16,520 --> 00:54:18,919
Speaker 1: a thing on the TV show? Please say it's not. No,

882
00:54:19,120 --> 00:54:21,600
Speaker 1: I do not think so. I was like, what are

883
00:54:21,600 --> 00:54:27,200
Speaker 1: you doing? So what is happening here is that basically,

884
00:54:27,440 --> 00:54:33,440
Speaker 1: when vampires are nearby, Buffy feels menstrual cramps. It's like

885
00:54:33,480 --> 00:54:38,120
Speaker 1: a warning sign to let her know that vampires are afoot.

886
00:54:38,600 --> 00:54:41,320
Speaker 1: And she's like, what is this all about? And Mark

887
00:54:41,440 --> 00:54:47,440
Speaker 1: explains it's a natural reaction to their unnatural nous to

888
00:54:47,600 --> 00:54:52,719
Speaker 1: vampires unnatural nous. So basically I know that, like Josh

889
00:54:52,719 --> 00:54:55,640
Speaker 1: Weeden does not consider this movie to be cannon, but

890
00:54:55,680 --> 00:54:58,520
Speaker 1: if you're looking at like this movie and the show,

891
00:54:59,280 --> 00:55:03,480
Speaker 1: the lore seems to be that the vampire slayer is

892
00:55:03,520 --> 00:55:08,120
Speaker 1: always a cis woman. So at least with this movie,

893
00:55:08,160 --> 00:55:14,040
Speaker 1: with this like world building thing of menstrual cramps equals

894
00:55:14,160 --> 00:55:18,960
Speaker 1: vampires are nearby, the logic is that like if you're

895
00:55:19,000 --> 00:55:21,759
Speaker 1: a slayer, you're a woman, and being a woman means

896
00:55:21,800 --> 00:55:25,040
Speaker 1: you have a womb and that you're a menstruating person

897
00:55:25,200 --> 00:55:30,000
Speaker 1: and that's natural. So it's like this very sis normative idea.

898
00:55:30,200 --> 00:55:32,080
Speaker 1: And I think it's also supposed to be kind of

899
00:55:32,120 --> 00:55:35,680
Speaker 1: like a joke to like I don't know what it was.

900
00:55:35,760 --> 00:55:38,680
Speaker 1: It was so random. Yeah, that didn't work for me

901
00:55:39,040 --> 00:55:41,800
Speaker 1: at all. It's like and it doesn't really come back

902
00:55:41,840 --> 00:55:45,400
Speaker 1: either where. Yeah, it's like very and it's like sis

903
00:55:45,400 --> 00:55:49,759
Speaker 1: normativity and also just and it's like, oh, well, I'm

904
00:55:49,760 --> 00:55:53,200
Speaker 1: writing a character that menstruates. I better bring that up

905
00:55:53,440 --> 00:55:57,799
Speaker 1: like that. You don't need to bring that up like if,

906
00:55:57,840 --> 00:56:01,320
Speaker 1: like if the Slayer was written to be a SIS man,

907
00:56:01,800 --> 00:56:04,000
Speaker 1: I feel like there would not be anything like that

908
00:56:04,040 --> 00:56:06,560
Speaker 1: attributed to his character. It wouldn't be like, oh, your

909
00:56:06,560 --> 00:56:11,200
Speaker 1: scrotum is gonna hurt when vampires are around? Like did

910
00:56:11,239 --> 00:56:17,319
Speaker 1: that happen to the last Boys? Kaylin remembers the movie

911
00:56:17,360 --> 00:56:24,560
Speaker 1: better than both of us. Yeah, like, what are you what?

912
00:56:25,560 --> 00:56:28,239
Speaker 1: It was so weird? Yeah? I found that to be

913
00:56:28,880 --> 00:56:34,600
Speaker 1: very very bizarre. It was two? Really? Uh was what

914
00:56:35,400 --> 00:56:40,720
Speaker 1: two ing there? It was really having a two? Um? Okay,

915
00:56:40,760 --> 00:56:46,000
Speaker 1: So the other like major relationship or like whatever dynamic

916
00:56:46,080 --> 00:56:48,880
Speaker 1: there is between Buffy and another character in this movie

917
00:56:49,000 --> 00:56:53,600
Speaker 1: is with her and Loathos And I'm gonna need some

918
00:56:53,680 --> 00:56:57,759
Speaker 1: help understanding what. I don't know if we can help

919
00:56:57,800 --> 00:57:01,960
Speaker 1: you there. I had talked, there's any help? That was?

920
00:57:04,239 --> 00:57:09,120
Speaker 1: I have no words, Yeah I have, here's my spiel

921
00:57:09,160 --> 00:57:12,880
Speaker 1: about it. So what appears to be happening is what

922
00:57:13,040 --> 00:57:19,120
Speaker 1: feels like a very sexually charged hero slash villain dynamic

923
00:57:19,360 --> 00:57:22,320
Speaker 1: that feels extremely gendered, because again, I don't think it

924
00:57:22,320 --> 00:57:26,080
Speaker 1: would be written that way if the hero was a man.

925
00:57:26,280 --> 00:57:30,240
Speaker 1: But because it's a teen girl, this weird like heterosexual

926
00:57:30,320 --> 00:57:33,600
Speaker 1: dynamic gets introduced, which is especially creepy because she's a

927
00:57:33,600 --> 00:57:37,040
Speaker 1: teenager and Lothos is played by a much older actor

928
00:57:37,400 --> 00:57:42,360
Speaker 1: and also the characters hundreds of years old. Right, Yeah,

929
00:57:42,480 --> 00:57:45,880
Speaker 1: I feel like this happens in other movies where the

930
00:57:45,920 --> 00:57:48,800
Speaker 1: protagonist is a girl or a woman and the villain

931
00:57:49,120 --> 00:57:53,160
Speaker 1: is a man. I thought immediately of Labyrinth with like

932
00:57:53,240 --> 00:57:55,960
Speaker 1: Jennifer Connelly and David Bowie and like that weird like

933
00:57:56,240 --> 00:58:00,360
Speaker 1: dance they have together. Um, But there are all these

934
00:58:00,400 --> 00:58:03,840
Speaker 1: scenes where like Buffy has a dream where she gets

935
00:58:03,880 --> 00:58:07,640
Speaker 1: into bed with Lothos and he embraces her. There's that

936
00:58:07,720 --> 00:58:09,480
Speaker 1: scene where like the first time they come in in

937
00:58:09,480 --> 00:58:12,240
Speaker 1: face to face contact, Lothus is like, oh, I'm ready,

938
00:58:12,240 --> 00:58:17,360
Speaker 1: I'm ready for you to ripen because like it seems

939
00:58:17,360 --> 00:58:19,560
Speaker 1: like he doesn't want to fight her so much as

940
00:58:19,680 --> 00:58:25,880
Speaker 1: like have this weird like seduction sex, Like he's like

941
00:58:25,960 --> 00:58:29,840
Speaker 1: fetishizing the idea that she's a slayer, which feels very

942
00:58:29,880 --> 00:58:34,800
Speaker 1: like vampire culture as well of like this old creepy

943
00:58:34,880 --> 00:58:38,760
Speaker 1: guy trying to like engage with a teenage girl, and

944
00:58:38,800 --> 00:58:42,880
Speaker 1: that's kind of like cannon to this genre in a

945
00:58:42,960 --> 00:58:44,920
Speaker 1: way that I was kind of hoping that the movie

946
00:58:45,120 --> 00:58:48,360
Speaker 1: was going to comment on, because this movie does a

947
00:58:48,400 --> 00:58:51,280
Speaker 1: lot of things that vampire movies don't usually do. But

948
00:58:51,360 --> 00:58:55,439
Speaker 1: that was something that felt kind of bizarrely very much

949
00:58:55,520 --> 00:59:00,720
Speaker 1: in place. Yeah, I just and I didn't understand logistically

950
00:59:01,560 --> 00:59:03,280
Speaker 1: what the heck was going on. Like the first time

951
00:59:03,320 --> 00:59:09,800
Speaker 1: that Buffy has an actual showdown with Lothos and she

952
00:59:10,000 --> 00:59:15,680
Speaker 1: sees him and is mesmerized. Is that? Is that what's happening? Right?

953
00:59:15,760 --> 00:59:19,040
Speaker 1: I don't know. I'm like, stab him and she can't.

954
00:59:19,040 --> 00:59:21,640
Speaker 1: She's not really moving, she's looking at him, she's coming closer,

955
00:59:21,680 --> 00:59:24,320
Speaker 1: and like you said, there's this weird sexually charged energy.

956
00:59:24,520 --> 00:59:26,760
Speaker 1: I didn't quite understand what was happening. All I kept

957
00:59:26,760 --> 00:59:29,360
Speaker 1: shouting was what are you doing? Stab him with your

958
00:59:29,360 --> 00:59:34,480
Speaker 1: wooden staately um and some he kept saying like we're

959
00:59:34,520 --> 00:59:36,640
Speaker 1: drawn to each other, and it was just like all

960
00:59:36,840 --> 00:59:40,280
Speaker 1: very weird and the movie could very much so exist

961
00:59:40,440 --> 00:59:43,600
Speaker 1: and should have existed without that. And I don't know,

962
00:59:43,680 --> 00:59:47,760
Speaker 1: even from a story perspective, I actually think it undermines

963
00:59:47,840 --> 00:59:49,680
Speaker 1: the logic of what was going on because I have

964
00:59:49,760 --> 00:59:53,160
Speaker 1: no clue like why that was happening exactly, and if

965
00:59:53,240 --> 00:59:57,000
Speaker 1: like they insist on that happening in the movie because

966
00:59:57,120 --> 01:00:00,360
Speaker 1: like vampires, I mean, like vampire lore is very much that,

967
01:00:00,440 --> 01:00:04,080
Speaker 1: like they're seducers. They like draw people in with the

968
01:00:04,360 --> 01:00:07,840
Speaker 1: you know, they glamour people. So like if that's a

969
01:00:07,960 --> 01:00:10,480
Speaker 1: thing that needs to be established just part of like

970
01:00:11,400 --> 01:00:13,400
Speaker 1: the world building, and it just isn't. So it gets

971
01:00:13,440 --> 01:00:17,400
Speaker 1: really confusing to the point where we're wondering, Yeah, Buffy,

972
01:00:17,400 --> 01:00:20,080
Speaker 1: why aren't you killing him? Why aren't you trying to

973
01:00:20,120 --> 01:00:23,360
Speaker 1: fight him? Because it seems like in in her character

974
01:00:23,480 --> 01:00:25,520
Speaker 1: because she is so like one of the things I

975
01:00:25,560 --> 01:00:29,320
Speaker 1: like about her is she's so self assured against people that,

976
01:00:29,520 --> 01:00:32,440
Speaker 1: you know, whatever, against people who are giving her ship.

977
01:00:32,560 --> 01:00:37,200
Speaker 1: Like she rejects Donald Sutherland in a trench coat several times,

978
01:00:37,320 --> 01:00:41,800
Speaker 1: is like fuck off. Like she's she's like very confidently

979
01:00:42,000 --> 01:00:44,800
Speaker 1: rejecting the call to adventure, and she's like, fuck you,

980
01:00:44,840 --> 01:00:47,360
Speaker 1: Like I maybe you don't like that. I want to

981
01:00:47,400 --> 01:00:50,320
Speaker 1: like graduate high school, moved to Europe, married Christian Slater,

982
01:00:50,400 --> 01:00:54,000
Speaker 1: and die iconic line. She's like, but that's what I

983
01:00:54,080 --> 01:00:56,840
Speaker 1: want so like leave me at like alone. And then

984
01:00:56,840 --> 01:01:01,880
Speaker 1: there's that amazing thing where her like shitty boyfriend's friend

985
01:01:02,000 --> 01:01:04,720
Speaker 1: slaps her button then she like slams him to the ground.

986
01:01:04,800 --> 01:01:07,320
Speaker 1: It's like this is a girl who like is not

987
01:01:07,560 --> 01:01:11,720
Speaker 1: afraid to fight back when someone's fucking with her, and

988
01:01:11,760 --> 01:01:14,760
Speaker 1: so it does feel like out of like I don't know, Yeah,

989
01:01:14,800 --> 01:01:17,120
Speaker 1: that didn't feel fully realized because it's like we've seen

990
01:01:17,240 --> 01:01:20,960
Speaker 1: her give so many people ships. Yeah, it's not consistent. Yeah,

991
01:01:21,080 --> 01:01:24,400
Speaker 1: So I was just so confused by that. But then

992
01:01:24,480 --> 01:01:27,439
Speaker 1: like based on some weird thing that Mark had said

993
01:01:27,480 --> 01:01:30,160
Speaker 1: where he's like, listen to the music and when the

994
01:01:30,280 --> 01:01:33,919
Speaker 1: music stops and then he like boh dies. But then

995
01:01:33,960 --> 01:01:37,200
Speaker 1: like the music has stopped in that scene with her

996
01:01:37,200 --> 01:01:39,200
Speaker 1: and Lothos, and she's like, oh my god, it was

997
01:01:39,800 --> 01:01:42,480
Speaker 1: I knew it all along music and we're like what

998
01:01:42,560 --> 01:01:44,680
Speaker 1: are you. I'm like, did you forget to have a

999
01:01:44,760 --> 01:01:48,600
Speaker 1: scene here? I never quite understood like what she realized.

1000
01:01:48,720 --> 01:01:54,080
Speaker 1: I never got it. I was like, Okay, confused she

1001
01:01:54,200 --> 01:01:57,440
Speaker 1: understood what it was that was her next move, because

1002
01:01:57,520 --> 01:02:01,960
Speaker 1: I certainly didn't understand. I mean, I think it is

1003
01:02:02,000 --> 01:02:04,920
Speaker 1: important for the audience to make it clear to the

1004
01:02:04,960 --> 01:02:08,160
Speaker 1: audience what that's all about, but whatever, whatever, it is

1005
01:02:08,440 --> 01:02:11,680
Speaker 1: fair enough. She then kind of like snaps out of it,

1006
01:02:11,840 --> 01:02:16,360
Speaker 1: and then she finally starts to fight back and then

1007
01:02:16,360 --> 01:02:19,080
Speaker 1: you know, lands the killing blow in in the next

1008
01:02:19,120 --> 01:02:22,680
Speaker 1: scene and you know, defeats him finally. But there's so

1009
01:02:22,760 --> 01:02:27,360
Speaker 1: much of like that dynamic where he's like being uber

1010
01:02:27,440 --> 01:02:31,000
Speaker 1: creepy and like uber predatory, which again, this is what

1011
01:02:31,120 --> 01:02:35,640
Speaker 1: vampires do, but there's nothing to establish why what is

1012
01:02:35,680 --> 01:02:40,280
Speaker 1: exactly happening, what Lothos wants, why he wants to seduce

1013
01:02:40,320 --> 01:02:42,560
Speaker 1: the player rather than kill her since she is an

1014
01:02:42,600 --> 01:02:46,520
Speaker 1: immediate threat to him, or why why she's responding to it,

1015
01:02:46,560 --> 01:02:49,000
Speaker 1: and the way that she is that it's just like

1016
01:02:49,680 --> 01:02:53,280
Speaker 1: just feels like very weirdly like gendered and sexualized in

1017
01:02:53,280 --> 01:02:56,040
Speaker 1: a way that like just made no sense to me.

1018
01:02:56,440 --> 01:03:02,680
Speaker 1: Absolutely none. Okay, I'm glad we're all in agreement. Say,

1019
01:03:02,920 --> 01:03:05,720
Speaker 1: have any any other stuff they wanted to to talk

1020
01:03:05,720 --> 01:03:09,760
Speaker 1: about for this one? Just a couple quick things. One,

1021
01:03:09,840 --> 01:03:13,240
Speaker 1: this is another teen movie that ends with a big dance.

1022
01:03:14,080 --> 01:03:19,160
Speaker 1: I don't think here that's a stable. Yeah, it was

1023
01:03:19,200 --> 01:03:21,160
Speaker 1: a staple. I'm just pointing it out. I'm not saying

1024
01:03:21,160 --> 01:03:25,840
Speaker 1: I gender, you know, I love a dance. You hate

1025
01:03:25,880 --> 01:03:29,320
Speaker 1: that detail, he said, am I just more notice it

1026
01:03:29,360 --> 01:03:32,920
Speaker 1: as a as a very consistent trope. I love it.

1027
01:03:33,080 --> 01:03:37,160
Speaker 1: Sometimes sometimes I'm just I'm annoyed by it, depending on

1028
01:03:37,240 --> 01:03:39,680
Speaker 1: kind of what happens or what the implications of the dance,

1029
01:03:39,720 --> 01:03:44,600
Speaker 1: because sometimes it's like, well, a movie starring a teen

1030
01:03:45,280 --> 01:03:50,880
Speaker 1: girl has to end in some big romantic thing because

1031
01:03:50,920 --> 01:03:54,120
Speaker 1: girls like romance and love stories and glamourus balls where

1032
01:03:54,160 --> 01:03:57,840
Speaker 1: she hetero kisses her one true love. And then other

1033
01:03:57,880 --> 01:04:01,640
Speaker 1: times I'm like, uh, you know, the high schools have dances,

1034
01:04:01,720 --> 01:04:05,240
Speaker 1: so it makes sense that like you'd have the big

1035
01:04:05,640 --> 01:04:09,200
Speaker 1: third act it like a significant social event kind of thing.

1036
01:04:09,320 --> 01:04:11,280
Speaker 1: It didn't bother me because I felt like that like

1037
01:04:11,400 --> 01:04:15,360
Speaker 1: brought together Buffy's two worlds so cleanly, whereas like she

1038
01:04:15,520 --> 01:04:18,800
Speaker 1: was on the dance planning committee, those are where her

1039
01:04:18,840 --> 01:04:21,240
Speaker 1: previous friends were. I felt like in this, like this

1040
01:04:21,280 --> 01:04:24,520
Speaker 1: movie kind of uniquely because sometimes you're just truly at

1041
01:04:24,560 --> 01:04:26,720
Speaker 1: a dance because it just feels like, well, this is

1042
01:04:26,720 --> 01:04:28,480
Speaker 1: where teen movies end. But in this movie, I did

1043
01:04:28,480 --> 01:04:31,240
Speaker 1: feel like it was justified in like bringing her worlds together,

1044
01:04:31,600 --> 01:04:35,120
Speaker 1: that is fair, right. It was also like, like you said, Jamie,

1045
01:04:35,120 --> 01:04:38,560
Speaker 1: we've throughout. Um you start at the beginning where she's like, fully,

1046
01:04:38,880 --> 01:04:41,400
Speaker 1: you know, they're one of the second or third scenes

1047
01:04:41,440 --> 01:04:43,360
Speaker 1: we see with Buffy and her friends. They're planning, they're

1048
01:04:43,360 --> 01:04:45,320
Speaker 1: trying to figure out what the theme should be, and

1049
01:04:45,360 --> 01:04:49,400
Speaker 1: they settle on environmentalism, and that was kind of funny.

1050
01:04:49,400 --> 01:04:52,800
Speaker 1: Bugs or something. Yeah, they're like, we hate bugs, bugs,

1051
01:04:54,600 --> 01:05:01,200
Speaker 1: let's get rid of the ozone there. So it was

1052
01:05:01,280 --> 01:05:04,400
Speaker 1: like weaved in and like Jamie said, it was I

1053
01:05:04,400 --> 01:05:07,000
Speaker 1: felt like it was a nice little having the two

1054
01:05:07,200 --> 01:05:12,680
Speaker 1: worlds come together. And maybe I just I don't know,

1055
01:05:12,720 --> 01:05:14,760
Speaker 1: maybe I'm a sheep that just likes everything that everybody

1056
01:05:14,760 --> 01:05:17,400
Speaker 1: else likes. But I loved that in Dance with her

1057
01:05:17,480 --> 01:05:19,520
Speaker 1: and Pike, I thought it was very sweet and I

1058
01:05:19,560 --> 01:05:22,640
Speaker 1: was off for their romance. Um, I was okay with

1059
01:05:22,640 --> 01:05:25,000
Speaker 1: it in this instance. I will say I did not

1060
01:05:25,160 --> 01:05:30,000
Speaker 1: mind the hetero teen romantic subplot in this movie, because

1061
01:05:30,000 --> 01:05:37,800
Speaker 1: which is saying something because it's vile, right, but I think, like, yeah,

1062
01:05:37,800 --> 01:05:40,160
Speaker 1: the way that you know, we already talked about it,

1063
01:05:40,200 --> 01:05:43,480
Speaker 1: but it's um the way it was handled I appreciated.

1064
01:05:44,200 --> 01:05:48,440
Speaker 1: Another thing I appreciated was the fight choreography. Um where

1065
01:05:48,480 --> 01:05:50,640
Speaker 1: we've talked about this a lot, where a lot of

1066
01:05:50,680 --> 01:05:56,000
Speaker 1: movies with a woman as the action hero doing fighting

1067
01:05:56,840 --> 01:06:01,360
Speaker 1: often has like very gendered and sexual fight choreography. We

1068
01:06:01,440 --> 01:06:07,040
Speaker 1: talked about that vagina slam slam. I wasn't getting any

1069
01:06:07,080 --> 01:06:09,919
Speaker 1: of that really in this movie. It was just like

1070
01:06:10,560 --> 01:06:14,760
Speaker 1: what you'd expect as far as just like non gendered combat.

1071
01:06:15,360 --> 01:06:18,920
Speaker 1: And I also really liked the fight choreography, like wove

1072
01:06:19,120 --> 01:06:22,880
Speaker 1: in what Buffy was already really good at, Like she's

1073
01:06:22,880 --> 01:06:27,040
Speaker 1: a very gymnastic fighter, Like it's cool, I don't know, Yeah,

1074
01:06:27,480 --> 01:06:29,600
Speaker 1: like her being a cheerleader as part of why she's

1075
01:06:29,640 --> 01:06:32,920
Speaker 1: a good fighter, which I feel like that's that on

1076
01:06:33,040 --> 01:06:34,960
Speaker 1: top of it, Like I mean, I guess we we

1077
01:06:34,960 --> 01:06:38,600
Speaker 1: don't really talk about this very much because we've probably

1078
01:06:38,600 --> 01:06:40,840
Speaker 1: talked about this and they bring it on episode, but

1079
01:06:41,240 --> 01:06:46,360
Speaker 1: like cheerleaders are so athletic and strong and it is

1080
01:06:46,400 --> 01:06:49,720
Speaker 1: like so physically taxing to do, and so to see

1081
01:06:49,760 --> 01:06:53,440
Speaker 1: that like applied to combat was really cool. Yeah. Yeah,

1082
01:06:53,480 --> 01:06:57,920
Speaker 1: Bubby was already starting out, uh like at a hive

1083
01:06:57,960 --> 01:07:01,440
Speaker 1: in the beginning of the training montage. This isn't fighting,

1084
01:07:01,480 --> 01:07:04,760
Speaker 1: but I remember watching her climb do the rope climb

1085
01:07:05,080 --> 01:07:07,440
Speaker 1: and she just like sails up that rope. And I

1086
01:07:07,440 --> 01:07:09,680
Speaker 1: don't know if you guys have tried to climb a rope,

1087
01:07:10,320 --> 01:07:17,800
Speaker 1: but that is not easy. She was tried and not succeeded,

1088
01:07:18,000 --> 01:07:20,000
Speaker 1: so she was already starting like at a high And

1089
01:07:20,080 --> 01:07:23,400
Speaker 1: I do love that they incorporated the gymnastics um in

1090
01:07:23,480 --> 01:07:27,680
Speaker 1: the show that I have coming out this month. We

1091
01:07:27,800 --> 01:07:32,000
Speaker 1: also have a main character, much like Queen Buffy, who

1092
01:07:32,040 --> 01:07:34,680
Speaker 1: was a monster fighter, and we had a lot of

1093
01:07:34,680 --> 01:07:37,520
Speaker 1: conversations about like what does it look like, what do

1094
01:07:37,600 --> 01:07:40,800
Speaker 1: those fight scenes look like? Because you mentioned this being

1095
01:07:41,040 --> 01:07:45,000
Speaker 1: um non gendered fighting style, But I do think that

1096
01:07:45,200 --> 01:07:48,480
Speaker 1: when we were talking about our own character, there are

1097
01:07:48,640 --> 01:07:52,920
Speaker 1: differences between the ways that people fight, especially depending on

1098
01:07:53,000 --> 01:07:55,400
Speaker 1: who your opponent is going to be, and you want

1099
01:07:55,440 --> 01:07:58,040
Speaker 1: to make sure that you're utilizing what you would actually

1100
01:07:58,320 --> 01:08:00,840
Speaker 1: as the person how you would actually fight, and so

1101
01:08:00,880 --> 01:08:03,360
Speaker 1: a lot of times you'll see that people don't take

1102
01:08:03,400 --> 01:08:07,200
Speaker 1: that into consideration, especially when it comes to female characters,

1103
01:08:07,280 --> 01:08:09,000
Speaker 1: like what are the ways that they are going to

1104
01:08:09,080 --> 01:08:12,920
Speaker 1: approach a fight UM versus like a male character. And

1105
01:08:12,960 --> 01:08:14,840
Speaker 1: one of the things that I love about Buffy, like

1106
01:08:14,880 --> 01:08:17,320
Speaker 1: you said, is they were using what she would already

1107
01:08:17,360 --> 01:08:20,280
Speaker 1: have considered as her strength, which is her gymnastics. So

1108
01:08:20,320 --> 01:08:22,599
Speaker 1: it's nice that they took the time to think about

1109
01:08:22,640 --> 01:08:26,880
Speaker 1: that and really incorporate that into the style. Uh. And

1110
01:08:26,920 --> 01:08:28,840
Speaker 1: it's cool to watch, you know, I love watching her

1111
01:08:29,320 --> 01:08:31,960
Speaker 1: flip around and stuff. Yeah. I guess the better way

1112
01:08:32,240 --> 01:08:35,680
Speaker 1: to frame it is that her fight choreography didn't seem

1113
01:08:35,720 --> 01:08:39,320
Speaker 1: sexualized in the way that a lot of women's fight

1114
01:08:39,400 --> 01:08:44,600
Speaker 1: choreography tends to be. Right. So yeah, um, this is

1115
01:08:44,640 --> 01:08:50,200
Speaker 1: also a very white movie. Yeah. The cast is very white.

1116
01:08:50,680 --> 01:08:57,200
Speaker 1: Any people of color, which I think is hardly there's

1117
01:08:57,200 --> 01:09:00,880
Speaker 1: her one friend, her one friend who we might not

1118
01:09:00,960 --> 01:09:03,719
Speaker 1: even know the name of. I think she has two lines,

1119
01:09:05,520 --> 01:09:10,680
Speaker 1: hardly says anything. Yeah, so any people of color are

1120
01:09:10,760 --> 01:09:15,320
Speaker 1: relegated to like secondary or tertiary like background characters who

1121
01:09:15,320 --> 01:09:21,160
Speaker 1: we learned nothing about. You know, every major character is white. Yeah,

1122
01:09:21,200 --> 01:09:27,120
Speaker 1: which is um uh. You know I already went in

1123
01:09:27,200 --> 01:09:31,760
Speaker 1: a whole speel about how, you know, growing up like

1124
01:09:31,840 --> 01:09:34,640
Speaker 1: wanting to play certain characters and not having any that

1125
01:09:35,120 --> 01:09:38,920
Speaker 1: there certainly were black characters, but like you said, they

1126
01:09:38,960 --> 01:09:43,040
Speaker 1: oftentimes had no lines or just were very much in

1127
01:09:43,040 --> 01:09:45,519
Speaker 1: the background. And this wasn't just the early nineties, like

1128
01:09:45,600 --> 01:09:50,240
Speaker 1: I want to say, like even still sometimes still now,

1129
01:09:51,000 --> 01:09:54,400
Speaker 1: but especially in my formative years as a child and

1130
01:09:54,439 --> 01:09:56,640
Speaker 1: a teenager, even watching some of the shows that I

1131
01:09:56,720 --> 01:10:00,920
Speaker 1: love to watch, like I was a huge Small Bill

1132
01:10:01,000 --> 01:10:05,519
Speaker 1: fan for a while, um and that show I Love,

1133
01:10:05,560 --> 01:10:09,400
Speaker 1: Love Love, but like they had a character who was

1134
01:10:10,080 --> 01:10:13,400
Speaker 1: Superman's best friend who was black, and over the course

1135
01:10:13,400 --> 01:10:15,160
Speaker 1: of like literally I want to say, the first season

1136
01:10:15,280 --> 01:10:17,880
Speaker 1: was pushed to the background and was very much just

1137
01:10:18,000 --> 01:10:21,759
Speaker 1: showed up to expose it some stuff and then leave.

1138
01:10:21,920 --> 01:10:24,840
Speaker 1: And that's kind of what I felt like most how

1139
01:10:24,880 --> 01:10:28,479
Speaker 1: most black characters were treated um and still are sometimes

1140
01:10:28,479 --> 01:10:31,880
Speaker 1: where they never have their own storylines, they never have

1141
01:10:31,960 --> 01:10:35,080
Speaker 1: their own agency. They are just there to either be

1142
01:10:35,920 --> 01:10:39,200
Speaker 1: uh like the voice of wisdom or come in and

1143
01:10:39,240 --> 01:10:43,600
Speaker 1: relay just enough information so that the producers and the

1144
01:10:43,720 --> 01:10:46,519
Speaker 1: network executives can say, oh, but we have a character

1145
01:10:46,720 --> 01:10:50,040
Speaker 1: of color. But they're never given like the meat and potatoes,

1146
01:10:50,520 --> 01:10:54,599
Speaker 1: which is unfortunate because people want to see themselves on screen,

1147
01:10:54,680 --> 01:10:56,720
Speaker 1: which is why I would get into fights about how

1148
01:10:56,720 --> 01:10:58,720
Speaker 1: I want to be Buffy even though I don't look

1149
01:10:58,760 --> 01:11:02,320
Speaker 1: like Buffy. Um And it's just you know, I'm glad

1150
01:11:02,360 --> 01:11:05,320
Speaker 1: that we're sort of talking about these things and and

1151
01:11:05,400 --> 01:11:07,840
Speaker 1: changing it. I think the changes are coming slowly, but

1152
01:11:08,080 --> 01:11:10,360
Speaker 1: it really is important that people are able to see

1153
01:11:10,400 --> 01:11:14,280
Speaker 1: themselves and like, yeah, like you're saying, not just in

1154
01:11:14,320 --> 01:11:19,880
Speaker 1: a surface way and like an impactful, fully realized character way.

1155
01:11:20,880 --> 01:11:23,639
Speaker 1: And also it's a it's a very straight movie as well,

1156
01:11:23,720 --> 01:11:29,240
Speaker 1: which is always like I don't understand why vampire. I understand,

1157
01:11:29,240 --> 01:11:33,400
Speaker 1: but it's like I understand because society, but also I'm

1158
01:11:33,400 --> 01:11:38,880
Speaker 1: just like vampires being repeatedly coded as strictly hetero. I'm like,

1159
01:11:39,320 --> 01:11:43,960
Speaker 1: it just doesn't track for me. It doesn't like, never has,

1160
01:11:44,120 --> 01:11:47,760
Speaker 1: never will. Vampires I feel like, are queer cannon, like

1161
01:11:47,840 --> 01:11:53,960
Speaker 1: what very hetero movie vampires are pan sexual, all of them?

1162
01:11:54,000 --> 01:11:58,400
Speaker 1: For sure. I think that's true for sure. For sure,

1163
01:11:59,479 --> 01:12:02,400
Speaker 1: there's no way that you can live hundreds of lives.

1164
01:12:02,960 --> 01:12:06,280
Speaker 1: I couldn't even live this life that I'm in without

1165
01:12:06,360 --> 01:12:13,960
Speaker 1: exploring my sexuality and figuring out that straight. So you're

1166
01:12:13,960 --> 01:12:17,439
Speaker 1: trying to tell me that hundreds of years like no

1167
01:12:17,520 --> 01:12:22,040
Speaker 1: one explored outside of just you know, And I don't

1168
01:12:22,080 --> 01:12:23,680
Speaker 1: buy it. I don't buy it at all, not not

1169
01:12:23,760 --> 01:12:27,320
Speaker 1: a chance. And again, tell me if I'm misremembering Caitlin.

1170
01:12:27,400 --> 01:12:31,960
Speaker 1: But the TV show isn't quite as hetero uh normative, right,

1171
01:12:31,960 --> 01:12:34,839
Speaker 1: there are queer there is at least a queer character, correct,

1172
01:12:35,120 --> 01:12:40,040
Speaker 1: there's several queer characters or queer relationships like you actually

1173
01:12:40,080 --> 01:12:42,240
Speaker 1: see in fact that might I think that was one

1174
01:12:42,240 --> 01:12:46,640
Speaker 1: of the first shows on network television or not, I

1175
01:12:46,680 --> 01:12:49,960
Speaker 1: guess cable television that had um or what that word?

1176
01:12:50,000 --> 01:12:53,519
Speaker 1: I don't my television bub for a while, wasn't it,

1177
01:12:53,600 --> 01:12:56,840
Speaker 1: and like you can if you remember that, maybe I'm

1178
01:12:57,000 --> 01:13:01,280
Speaker 1: arranging myself like with UPN But it was not one

1179
01:13:01,320 --> 01:13:04,280
Speaker 1: of those I don't know cab or what it was.

1180
01:13:04,920 --> 01:13:08,559
Speaker 1: In any case, it featured one of the first lesbian

1181
01:13:08,640 --> 01:13:13,680
Speaker 1: kisses on on screen on television. Yeah, so yeah, there

1182
01:13:13,800 --> 01:13:19,360
Speaker 1: was not quite so much heteronormativity as there is in

1183
01:13:19,680 --> 01:13:24,599
Speaker 1: this movie and most movies. Feels worth mentioning that, especially

1184
01:13:24,600 --> 01:13:27,200
Speaker 1: toward the beginning of the movie, Buffy and her friends

1185
01:13:27,280 --> 01:13:31,240
Speaker 1: make different jokes that are like at the expense of

1186
01:13:31,640 --> 01:13:36,400
Speaker 1: the unhoused population or they don't um. There's some like

1187
01:13:36,560 --> 01:13:41,000
Speaker 1: xenophobic remarks that are made and things like that, But

1188
01:13:41,040 --> 01:13:45,360
Speaker 1: I think that's done to show who Buffy used to

1189
01:13:45,400 --> 01:13:48,240
Speaker 1: be or like who like who what her friend group

1190
01:13:48,320 --> 01:13:52,040
Speaker 1: is like these again kind of like self centered, sort

1191
01:13:52,080 --> 01:13:57,160
Speaker 1: of like rich elitist types. Um. But you know there's

1192
01:13:57,280 --> 01:14:00,000
Speaker 1: there's still like jokes made at the expensive on housed

1193
01:14:00,080 --> 01:14:06,439
Speaker 1: people and stuff. So you know, feels pretty nineties. Does

1194
01:14:06,479 --> 01:14:10,679
Speaker 1: feel very nineties. Ben Affleck is in this movie. I know,

1195
01:14:11,320 --> 01:14:17,160
Speaker 1: like five seconds, like two seconds, And I actually read somewhere, um,

1196
01:14:17,240 --> 01:14:20,559
Speaker 1: just in casual googling of this movie, which one does,

1197
01:14:22,720 --> 01:14:25,240
Speaker 1: I read that his line, the one line he had,

1198
01:14:25,280 --> 01:14:28,920
Speaker 1: was actually dubbed because the director hated his delivery, like

1199
01:14:29,080 --> 01:14:31,920
Speaker 1: to be to have one line in a movie in

1200
01:14:32,000 --> 01:14:35,080
Speaker 1: that line be completely dubbed over. Couldn't even get that.

1201
01:14:35,080 --> 01:14:40,160
Speaker 1: I couldn't even get that right. But yes, Ben Affleck

1202
01:14:40,240 --> 01:14:43,920
Speaker 1: is in this movie. So is Thomas Jane, who was

1203
01:14:44,000 --> 01:14:47,320
Speaker 1: not as bigger an athlete. I did not catch. I

1204
01:14:47,360 --> 01:14:49,439
Speaker 1: did not catch that either. But I was watching this

1205
01:14:49,520 --> 01:14:52,040
Speaker 1: with my girlfriend over the weekend and she was like,

1206
01:14:52,520 --> 01:14:55,200
Speaker 1: that's Thomas Jane and I was like, no, only Ben

1207
01:14:55,240 --> 01:15:00,439
Speaker 1: Affleck is the that the only star that just like

1208
01:15:00,479 --> 01:15:05,439
Speaker 1: briefly appeared. Uh, Thomas Jane plays Oh you know that

1209
01:15:05,520 --> 01:15:08,120
Speaker 1: character had a name. They are horrible with the names.

1210
01:15:08,160 --> 01:15:12,519
Speaker 1: And when Pike goes to get I guess his van

1211
01:15:13,439 --> 01:15:16,000
Speaker 1: service because he's trying to leave because he knows vampires

1212
01:15:16,000 --> 01:15:17,720
Speaker 1: are out and about and he's like, I want no

1213
01:15:17,800 --> 01:15:20,400
Speaker 1: part of this. The mechanic and I have no idea

1214
01:15:20,439 --> 01:15:22,680
Speaker 1: how my girlfriend was able to spot that this was

1215
01:15:22,800 --> 01:15:26,120
Speaker 1: Thomas Jane. I don't like to even still, like I

1216
01:15:26,120 --> 01:15:28,639
Speaker 1: wouldn't be able to pick that up. Um, but yeah,

1217
01:15:28,840 --> 01:15:34,240
Speaker 1: Thomas Jane appearance. Even Ben Affleck have ran random appearances.

1218
01:15:34,280 --> 01:15:38,280
Speaker 1: And uh, this movie also Stephen Root, who is one

1219
01:15:38,280 --> 01:15:41,400
Speaker 1: of my favorite character actors, plays like the school principal

1220
01:15:41,560 --> 01:15:45,519
Speaker 1: in this movie. Yes, there's a lot of people this

1221
01:15:45,560 --> 01:15:50,639
Speaker 1: movie is apparently kind of stacked with with the cast here. Yeah,

1222
01:15:51,040 --> 01:15:53,040
Speaker 1: and then I kind of assumed. I was like, oh, like,

1223
01:15:53,120 --> 01:15:55,800
Speaker 1: whatever happened to Christy Swanson. I've never seen her in

1224
01:15:55,840 --> 01:15:59,519
Speaker 1: anything else. She has been consistently working this entire time.

1225
01:15:59,560 --> 01:16:02,000
Speaker 1: But she's She's in a lot of like TV movies

1226
01:16:02,120 --> 01:16:05,719
Speaker 1: and stuff that I tend not to watch. But yeah,

1227
01:16:05,720 --> 01:16:08,439
Speaker 1: she's she's still around working. Shouts out to her. I

1228
01:16:08,439 --> 01:16:13,599
Speaker 1: thought she was awesome as Buffy. She's great, like just

1229
01:16:13,600 --> 01:16:18,880
Speaker 1: just a quality quality super heroine. And then Paul Rubens

1230
01:16:18,920 --> 01:16:24,760
Speaker 1: giving the performance of a lifetime stealing every scene is

1231
01:16:24,840 --> 01:16:28,720
Speaker 1: so wonderful. Yeah, it's a fun movie. Like if you

1232
01:16:28,840 --> 01:16:30,880
Speaker 1: if you have been on the fence about giving this

1233
01:16:30,920 --> 01:16:33,240
Speaker 1: movie a chance just because of kind of the bizarro

1234
01:16:33,479 --> 01:16:37,840
Speaker 1: cultural reputation it has, watched the movie. It's fun, You'll

1235
01:16:37,840 --> 01:16:41,120
Speaker 1: have a good time. Yeah, But does it pass the

1236
01:16:41,160 --> 01:16:45,000
Speaker 1: Bechtel test? I feel like it does. Even though the

1237
01:16:45,000 --> 01:16:50,479
Speaker 1: Buffy's friends barely have names and we barely learn them

1238
01:16:50,600 --> 01:16:54,920
Speaker 1: and they mostly talk about a yellow leather jacket and um,

1239
01:16:56,040 --> 01:16:58,559
Speaker 1: but they talk about like planning the upcoming dance and

1240
01:16:58,640 --> 01:17:01,719
Speaker 1: stuff like that. So yeah, and they have that whole

1241
01:17:01,720 --> 01:17:04,360
Speaker 1: scene that's about like that. I mean, they do talk

1242
01:17:04,400 --> 01:17:07,519
Speaker 1: about men for a part of the scene, but about

1243
01:17:07,640 --> 01:17:11,760
Speaker 1: the conflict of like Buffy, you've changed, Like why do

1244
01:17:11,800 --> 01:17:14,400
Speaker 1: you think what we like it is not cool anymore?

1245
01:17:14,520 --> 01:17:18,479
Speaker 1: Like that was a meaning Like yeah, I'll always be

1246
01:17:18,600 --> 01:17:21,479
Speaker 1: bummed out that there were not stronger friendships. But I

1247
01:17:21,479 --> 01:17:23,960
Speaker 1: feel like that's a lot of that scene pretty firmly passed.

1248
01:17:24,000 --> 01:17:25,960
Speaker 1: And then I think maybe a few exchanges with Buffy

1249
01:17:26,000 --> 01:17:28,559
Speaker 1: and her mom as well, like when she's like what

1250
01:17:28,640 --> 01:17:30,519
Speaker 1: time is it? And then Buffy lies and she's like

1251
01:17:30,720 --> 01:17:33,680
Speaker 1: my watch is so slow? Like yeah, I guess that that,

1252
01:17:36,080 --> 01:17:43,640
Speaker 1: Oh Buffy's Mom, where's that spin off? Yea, So it

1253
01:17:43,680 --> 01:17:47,360
Speaker 1: does pass the Bechdel test as far as our nipple scale,

1254
01:17:47,520 --> 01:17:52,120
Speaker 1: in which we assign zero to five nipples to the

1255
01:17:52,160 --> 01:17:57,080
Speaker 1: movie based on examining it through an intersectional feminist lens,

1256
01:17:58,000 --> 01:18:00,200
Speaker 1: I feel like I would give it like a three,

1257
01:18:00,720 --> 01:18:03,160
Speaker 1: maybe even like a three and a half, so we

1258
01:18:03,200 --> 01:18:08,240
Speaker 1: can get half a nipple. Yeah, we give quarter nipples sometimes, Yeah,

1259
01:18:09,200 --> 01:18:13,759
Speaker 1: decimal to your heart's content. I think we've given pie

1260
01:18:13,880 --> 01:18:18,400
Speaker 1: nipples before three point one four, it's given negative nipples

1261
01:18:18,520 --> 01:18:27,280
Speaker 1: before inverted. Yeah. Yeah, the nipple score spectrum is fluid. Um.

1262
01:18:27,560 --> 01:18:31,840
Speaker 1: I think I'll give it three and uh half. Maybe

1263
01:18:31,840 --> 01:18:35,599
Speaker 1: that's too generous, but especially for like an early nineties movie,

1264
01:18:35,720 --> 01:18:38,880
Speaker 1: because oh my gosh, comparing this to other early nineties

1265
01:18:39,000 --> 01:18:43,200
Speaker 1: movies in any genre really like things were not great.

1266
01:18:43,960 --> 01:18:47,439
Speaker 1: So kind of maybe like adjusted for time inflation almost,

1267
01:18:47,560 --> 01:18:51,559
Speaker 1: but inflation. The fact that you have the fact that

1268
01:18:51,600 --> 01:18:55,799
Speaker 1: you have this female centered story about a woman chosen

1269
01:18:55,840 --> 01:19:00,400
Speaker 1: one narrative about a woman who like kicks ass and

1270
01:19:00,760 --> 01:19:04,680
Speaker 1: doesn't really need help from men because Marek, as she

1271
01:19:04,760 --> 01:19:08,879
Speaker 1: points out, is not really doing anything. Pike is her

1272
01:19:09,040 --> 01:19:12,680
Speaker 1: sidekick who barely does anything, who gets like damseled, and

1273
01:19:12,680 --> 01:19:16,519
Speaker 1: that she has to save several times, like she never

1274
01:19:16,600 --> 01:19:22,080
Speaker 1: really has to be saved. She's doing all of the work.

1275
01:19:22,200 --> 01:19:25,960
Speaker 1: She has all of the agency in the movie. Although

1276
01:19:26,000 --> 01:19:28,680
Speaker 1: I guess you could argue like being a chosen one

1277
01:19:28,960 --> 01:19:32,000
Speaker 1: kind of like inherently takes agency away from you because

1278
01:19:32,000 --> 01:19:36,360
Speaker 1: she's just sort of like your voice a gendered way, though, right, right, right,

1279
01:19:36,400 --> 01:19:40,160
Speaker 1: right exactly. Um, So, as far as the circumstances go,

1280
01:19:40,479 --> 01:19:43,120
Speaker 1: like she's got agency, she's doing things. She's a very

1281
01:19:43,160 --> 01:19:47,800
Speaker 1: active character. I didn't hate the hetero romantic subplot. I

1282
01:19:47,840 --> 01:19:51,519
Speaker 1: did hate the weird dynamic between her and Loathos that

1283
01:19:51,640 --> 01:19:57,800
Speaker 1: did feel oddly gendered. Yeah, yeah that that. I don't

1284
01:19:57,800 --> 01:20:00,960
Speaker 1: know what's happening to the weird men's oh cramps thing.

1285
01:20:01,439 --> 01:20:05,000
Speaker 1: We should have just been absolutely deleted from the movie. Um,

1286
01:20:05,080 --> 01:20:09,400
Speaker 1: the fact that there's no racial diversity, there's no like

1287
01:20:09,600 --> 01:20:16,120
Speaker 1: body type diversity, it's all very heteronormative. But yeah, I

1288
01:20:16,160 --> 01:20:18,960
Speaker 1: think there's enough like cool stuff going on. I think

1289
01:20:19,000 --> 01:20:22,759
Speaker 1: I'll land on a three three and a quarter nipple

1290
01:20:24,040 --> 01:20:28,800
Speaker 1: and I'll give one to Buffy. I will give one

1291
01:20:29,000 --> 01:20:36,719
Speaker 1: to Paul Ruben's death scene. I'll give one to Buffy's

1292
01:20:36,760 --> 01:20:39,720
Speaker 1: black friend, who we who the movie doesn't even care

1293
01:20:39,800 --> 01:20:44,839
Speaker 1: to give her a name. And I'll give a quarter

1294
01:20:45,560 --> 01:20:49,639
Speaker 1: nipple to the little baby kitty that Lothos is about

1295
01:20:49,640 --> 01:20:52,680
Speaker 1: to go snack on in that one scene, because I

1296
01:20:52,680 --> 01:20:57,800
Speaker 1: feel really bad for the cat. I'll meet you there.

1297
01:20:57,840 --> 01:20:59,880
Speaker 1: I'll go three and a half as well. I think

1298
01:21:00,240 --> 01:21:04,599
Speaker 1: the issues this movie has with a glaring lack of

1299
01:21:05,080 --> 01:21:10,080
Speaker 1: diversity across the board is both very obvious and extremely

1300
01:21:10,160 --> 01:21:13,640
Speaker 1: of its time. Yeah. I mean, I'm kind of just

1301
01:21:13,680 --> 01:21:16,559
Speaker 1: co signing our discussion and what you just said, Caitlin

1302
01:21:16,840 --> 01:21:20,920
Speaker 1: Um because I like Buffy a lot. I like how

1303
01:21:21,000 --> 01:21:26,599
Speaker 1: much she subverts I wish that the villain subverted more

1304
01:21:26,720 --> 01:21:30,479
Speaker 1: about this genre. Yeah. I wasn't actively rooting against the

1305
01:21:30,520 --> 01:21:33,400
Speaker 1: central relationship, but I do wish that she had women

1306
01:21:33,439 --> 01:21:36,639
Speaker 1: in her life to talk to and it was like extra,

1307
01:21:36,800 --> 01:21:39,960
Speaker 1: like they were right there. Give her a connection with

1308
01:21:40,000 --> 01:21:43,000
Speaker 1: her mom of some sort, even if it's not positive,

1309
01:21:43,080 --> 01:21:46,280
Speaker 1: Like give us something like give us some friendship. Give

1310
01:21:46,439 --> 01:21:49,400
Speaker 1: you know there there are opportunities, or like why are

1311
01:21:49,439 --> 01:21:52,639
Speaker 1: all the vampire villains men? Like what you know? There's

1312
01:21:52,680 --> 01:21:56,640
Speaker 1: like so many opportunities for her to not just have

1313
01:21:56,960 --> 01:21:59,880
Speaker 1: the pivotal figures in her life be a bunch of

1314
01:22:00,160 --> 01:22:03,479
Speaker 1: white guys and but that's not how it went. However,

1315
01:22:03,880 --> 01:22:08,639
Speaker 1: I love buttfy. I really loved the performances in this movie.

1316
01:22:08,680 --> 01:22:10,640
Speaker 1: And I'm gonna give it three and a half. So

1317
01:22:10,640 --> 01:22:13,479
Speaker 1: I'm gonna give one to Christie Swanson. I'm gonna give

1318
01:22:13,920 --> 01:22:20,280
Speaker 1: one to the director of the movie, fran Rubel Kuzooe,

1319
01:22:20,600 --> 01:22:24,760
Speaker 1: I will give one to the Motorcycle, and I'll give

1320
01:22:24,760 --> 01:22:30,479
Speaker 1: my half to Paul Rubbin's nice Jasmine. What about you? Um,

1321
01:22:31,040 --> 01:22:37,320
Speaker 1: I will give this three and three quarter nipples, so

1322
01:22:37,360 --> 01:22:41,479
Speaker 1: I'm slightly higher than you guys. Three point seven five nipples.

1323
01:22:42,360 --> 01:22:45,920
Speaker 1: Three quarters of those nipples goes exclusively to the scene

1324
01:22:46,120 --> 01:22:49,720
Speaker 1: where the friend grabs buffies but and she flips them

1325
01:22:49,760 --> 01:22:52,760
Speaker 1: over and slams them against the locker, because that is

1326
01:22:52,960 --> 01:22:57,600
Speaker 1: the proper response to when that happens. So good, UM,

1327
01:22:57,640 --> 01:23:00,840
Speaker 1: I mean, you guys have already touched on. Um, you

1328
01:23:00,840 --> 01:23:03,240
Speaker 1: guys already touched on the things here. I agree with

1329
01:23:03,280 --> 01:23:08,200
Speaker 1: everything that you said. I I will focus mostly on

1330
01:23:08,360 --> 01:23:10,800
Speaker 1: the positive here because, like I said, this had like

1331
01:23:10,840 --> 01:23:14,280
Speaker 1: such a positive influence on me and seeing a character

1332
01:23:15,160 --> 01:23:19,519
Speaker 1: like Buffy, especially growing up as a child of the

1333
01:23:19,640 --> 01:23:22,519
Speaker 1: nineties and a teen of the early thousands, you just

1334
01:23:22,800 --> 01:23:26,240
Speaker 1: never saw I shouldn't say never, but mostly did not

1335
01:23:26,280 --> 01:23:29,320
Speaker 1: see women portrayed in this way. So I already gave

1336
01:23:29,520 --> 01:23:31,479
Speaker 1: my three quarters of a nipple to that one scene.

1337
01:23:31,800 --> 01:23:34,840
Speaker 1: Obviously one goes to Buffy. I gotta give one to

1338
01:23:35,479 --> 01:23:38,680
Speaker 1: my man Pike. I'm a big Pike fan. I appreciated

1339
01:23:39,120 --> 01:23:41,360
Speaker 1: what they did with that romance and with that character,

1340
01:23:42,120 --> 01:23:44,280
Speaker 1: and I guess what do I have? One more? One

1341
01:23:44,280 --> 01:23:47,840
Speaker 1: more nipple. I will give one more nipple to just

1342
01:23:48,120 --> 01:23:51,160
Speaker 1: the influence that that movie had on me and how

1343
01:23:51,200 --> 01:23:54,559
Speaker 1: it continues to have influence on me, and the stuff

1344
01:23:54,600 --> 01:23:58,240
Speaker 1: that I want to champion developing now that I am

1345
01:23:58,760 --> 01:24:04,000
Speaker 1: an adult, over thirty woman who gets to help put

1346
01:24:04,000 --> 01:24:09,559
Speaker 1: content out into the world. Yes, which, speaking of tell

1347
01:24:09,760 --> 01:24:14,879
Speaker 1: us about your show, Yes, yes, I would love to um.

1348
01:24:14,960 --> 01:24:18,000
Speaker 1: So the show is called The Girl in the Woods

1349
01:24:18,040 --> 01:24:21,920
Speaker 1: and it premieres October one, which I believe is in

1350
01:24:22,080 --> 01:24:27,120
Speaker 1: Thursday very soon on Peacock um and the show, much

1351
01:24:27,200 --> 01:24:30,840
Speaker 1: like Buffy, the show revolves around our main character, whose

1352
01:24:30,920 --> 01:24:35,200
Speaker 1: name is Carrie Ecker, and she is a monster slayer.

1353
01:24:35,360 --> 01:24:39,599
Speaker 1: She lives in this colony on the outskirts in the

1354
01:24:39,600 --> 01:24:43,679
Speaker 1: woods of this mining town, and this colony soul job

1355
01:24:44,040 --> 01:24:47,400
Speaker 1: is to protect a door, a very mysterious dore that

1356
01:24:47,520 --> 01:24:50,800
Speaker 1: stands in the woods. Um. The door is a door

1357
01:24:50,840 --> 01:24:54,760
Speaker 1: to a monster dimension and it is the number one

1358
01:24:54,760 --> 01:24:57,120
Speaker 1: priority that that door does not open and the monsters

1359
01:24:57,120 --> 01:24:59,200
Speaker 1: do not come out. But this is a TV show,

1360
01:24:59,240 --> 01:25:04,080
Speaker 1: so you can guess what is going to happen. If

1361
01:25:04,080 --> 01:25:06,360
Speaker 1: you can't guess, the girl's gonna open and monsters are

1362
01:25:06,360 --> 01:25:10,680
Speaker 1: going to come out. Um. And so Carrie uh is

1363
01:25:10,720 --> 01:25:14,280
Speaker 1: going to eventually find herself in this mining town and

1364
01:25:14,360 --> 01:25:17,040
Speaker 1: she's going to come across two new friends whose name

1365
01:25:17,600 --> 01:25:20,120
Speaker 1: names are Tasha and Nolan, and together they are going

1366
01:25:20,160 --> 01:25:23,760
Speaker 1: to have to uh fight the monsters that have been

1367
01:25:23,840 --> 01:25:27,120
Speaker 1: released and try and say this town. It is a

1368
01:25:27,240 --> 01:25:32,080
Speaker 1: very fun show. It has a lot of great themes

1369
01:25:32,200 --> 01:25:35,599
Speaker 1: that I think are very relevant today. It is a

1370
01:25:35,760 --> 01:25:39,280
Speaker 1: very queer show. Um. I say that with so much

1371
01:25:39,280 --> 01:25:43,760
Speaker 1: pride being a queer woman myself. Um and Uh, I

1372
01:25:43,840 --> 01:25:48,640
Speaker 1: just think much like Buffy, it is very fun. It

1373
01:25:48,760 --> 01:25:52,320
Speaker 1: is very fun, um and uh. We have three main

1374
01:25:52,439 --> 01:25:56,040
Speaker 1: characters and I think they all sort of you get

1375
01:25:56,080 --> 01:26:00,439
Speaker 1: to see the three mains play characters that you don't

1376
01:26:00,479 --> 01:26:05,240
Speaker 1: really see very much even today. Um. And I'm just

1377
01:26:05,280 --> 01:26:08,840
Speaker 1: really excited for for everyone to to check it out.

1378
01:26:08,880 --> 01:26:14,840
Speaker 1: At the very least. If you love watching teens fight monsters,

1379
01:26:15,000 --> 01:26:18,840
Speaker 1: check out the show. But if you also like character development,

1380
01:26:19,000 --> 01:26:24,679
Speaker 1: you like scary content that has uh social and very

1381
01:26:24,720 --> 01:26:28,160
Speaker 1: like human themes at the heart of it. Uh and

1382
01:26:28,280 --> 01:26:33,000
Speaker 1: you love teen romance, especially with a little dash of

1383
01:26:33,600 --> 01:26:39,080
Speaker 1: queer inserted into it. All of the things that I love, um,

1384
01:26:39,120 --> 01:26:43,120
Speaker 1: you'll love. Hell yeah, everyone check out The Girl in

1385
01:26:43,120 --> 01:26:47,639
Speaker 1: the Woods on Peacock. Is there anything else you want

1386
01:26:47,640 --> 01:26:51,479
Speaker 1: to plug? Social media? If you want to find me

1387
01:26:51,600 --> 01:26:56,880
Speaker 1: on Instagram? UM or Twitter at the same handle, it's

1388
01:26:57,160 --> 01:27:00,760
Speaker 1: jazz face Killer. It's jazz with twosy ease killer with

1389
01:27:00,840 --> 01:27:05,320
Speaker 1: two els, jazz face Killer. UM and please him me up.

1390
01:27:05,439 --> 01:27:07,280
Speaker 1: Let me know what you think about the show. Let

1391
01:27:07,280 --> 01:27:09,800
Speaker 1: me know what you think about Buffy the movie. Um,

1392
01:27:09,960 --> 01:27:13,120
Speaker 1: spread the word about Buffy the movie. So many people

1393
01:27:13,120 --> 01:27:16,040
Speaker 1: talk about the show and that's fine, but like, let's

1394
01:27:16,120 --> 01:27:19,280
Speaker 1: bring up you know, the movie's profile because I think

1395
01:27:19,320 --> 01:27:22,519
Speaker 1: you're right, Jamie and that Joss Wheden did some damage

1396
01:27:22,560 --> 01:27:24,560
Speaker 1: out there. And it's not fair because this movie is

1397
01:27:24,680 --> 01:27:28,360
Speaker 1: very fun. Yeah it is. It is. Let the Buffy

1398
01:27:28,439 --> 01:27:37,559
Speaker 1: Movie Live totally. Thank you so much for this was

1399
01:27:37,600 --> 01:27:40,559
Speaker 1: a lot of fun. Thanks for inviting me to be

1400
01:27:40,640 --> 01:27:43,200
Speaker 1: on the show. I loved talking about all this stuff

1401
01:27:43,200 --> 01:27:47,759
Speaker 1: with you, guys. Our pleasure. Come back anytime. Thank you.

1402
01:27:48,000 --> 01:27:51,840
Speaker 1: And then you can follow us on Twitter and Instagram

1403
01:27:51,880 --> 01:27:57,240
Speaker 1: at Bechtel Cast. We've got our Patreon ak Matreon that

1404
01:27:57,800 --> 01:28:00,839
Speaker 1: gives you two bonus episodes every single month, plus access

1405
01:28:00,880 --> 01:28:03,400
Speaker 1: to the back catalog. It's five dollars a month at

1406
01:28:03,479 --> 01:28:08,840
Speaker 1: patreon dot com slash bechtel Cast. You can also get

1407
01:28:09,040 --> 01:28:13,200
Speaker 1: our march at t public dot com slash v bechtel Cast.

1408
01:28:13,840 --> 01:28:15,880
Speaker 1: It'll be there if you need it. If you don't

1409
01:28:15,880 --> 01:28:20,519
Speaker 1: need it, that's okay too. And with that, do you

1410
01:28:20,520 --> 01:28:23,439
Speaker 1: both want to get on my motorcycle and let's get

1411
01:28:23,439 --> 01:28:27,120
Speaker 1: out of here? Oh my gosh, yeah, let's blow this joint.

1412
01:28:27,600 --> 01:28:31,080
Speaker 1: Can I wear a leather jacket? Oh yeah, you can, sorrow,

1413
01:28:31,960 --> 01:28:37,280
Speaker 1: you can borrow my yellow leather jacket, Jasmine, so five

1414
01:28:37,280 --> 01:28:45,040
Speaker 1: minutes ago? Okay, win, No, it's retro alright, Bye bye

1415
01:28:45,040 --> 01:28:45,720
Speaker 1: bye