1 00:00:06,240 --> 00:00:08,400 Speaker 1: Hey you welcome to Stuff to Blow your Mind. My 2 00:00:08,520 --> 00:00:11,280 Speaker 1: name is Robert Lamb and it is Saturday. We are 3 00:00:11,360 --> 00:00:13,440 Speaker 1: back with another Vault episode. This is going to be 4 00:00:13,520 --> 00:00:17,040 Speaker 1: part two of our two parter Oil and Troubled Water. 5 00:00:17,160 --> 00:00:21,040 Speaker 1: This one originally published eight three, twenty twenty three. Let's 6 00:00:21,120 --> 00:00:21,919 Speaker 1: dive right in. 7 00:00:25,320 --> 00:00:29,480 Speaker 2: Welcome to Stuff to Blow Your Mind, a production of iHeartRadio. 8 00:00:35,120 --> 00:00:36,960 Speaker 1: Hey you welcome to Stuff to Blow your Mind. My 9 00:00:37,040 --> 00:00:37,839 Speaker 1: name is Robert. 10 00:00:37,680 --> 00:00:41,199 Speaker 3: Lamb and I'm Joe McCormick. And after a little bit 11 00:00:41,200 --> 00:00:43,680 Speaker 3: of an interval, we are back with part two in 12 00:00:43,760 --> 00:00:47,400 Speaker 3: our series on pouring Oil over Troubled Waters. 13 00:00:48,080 --> 00:00:51,640 Speaker 1: That's right to refresh. In the last episode, which I 14 00:00:51,680 --> 00:00:53,920 Speaker 1: guess was over a week ago. At this point, we 15 00:00:54,000 --> 00:00:57,640 Speaker 1: discussed several interesting mentions from ancient and medieval writings, in 16 00:00:57,680 --> 00:01:02,440 Speaker 1: particular about the interaction between oil and water. We went 17 00:01:02,480 --> 00:01:04,640 Speaker 1: over some of the basics about this of you know, 18 00:01:04,640 --> 00:01:06,920 Speaker 1: the all idea that oil and water don't mix, and 19 00:01:06,959 --> 00:01:09,919 Speaker 1: that oil in water or oil mixed around with water 20 00:01:10,400 --> 00:01:14,400 Speaker 1: can create kind of this novel appearance that captivates our imagination, 21 00:01:15,319 --> 00:01:16,880 Speaker 1: and we also discussed how it may have been added 22 00:01:16,920 --> 00:01:19,280 Speaker 1: to stormy seas to calm them down, and it may 23 00:01:19,280 --> 00:01:22,120 Speaker 1: have been used in some capacity by free divers to 24 00:01:22,200 --> 00:01:27,560 Speaker 1: somehow smooth or clear or illuminate the waters they're diving 25 00:01:27,600 --> 00:01:29,920 Speaker 1: in so as to better see what they're looking for. 26 00:01:30,520 --> 00:01:32,520 Speaker 3: Now, that was an issue last time that I was 27 00:01:32,600 --> 00:01:36,000 Speaker 3: really confused by, because it wasn't even clear to me 28 00:01:36,200 --> 00:01:39,400 Speaker 3: exactly what these ancient authors were claiming. They were saying 29 00:01:39,440 --> 00:01:43,120 Speaker 3: that in some sense a diver might like swim underneath 30 00:01:43,120 --> 00:01:45,600 Speaker 3: the water with some oil in their mouth, and then 31 00:01:45,640 --> 00:01:48,160 Speaker 3: when they needed to see better, they would like spit 32 00:01:48,240 --> 00:01:51,080 Speaker 3: the oil out into the water, or I think you 33 00:01:51,120 --> 00:01:54,120 Speaker 3: said in some other sources people just talked about like 34 00:01:54,160 --> 00:01:57,760 Speaker 3: putting oil over their eyes before they went diving, and 35 00:01:57,800 --> 00:02:00,960 Speaker 3: I couldn't understand from the original verus. We looked at, 36 00:02:01,000 --> 00:02:04,080 Speaker 3: like what even the alleged method of action was there. 37 00:02:04,480 --> 00:02:06,640 Speaker 3: You finally have some answers on this, right. 38 00:02:06,840 --> 00:02:08,239 Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean, I don't know that I'll be able 39 00:02:08,240 --> 00:02:11,359 Speaker 1: to bring one hundred percent clarity to the issue. I 40 00:02:11,360 --> 00:02:14,000 Speaker 1: think there's still gonna I think there may still be 41 00:02:14,040 --> 00:02:17,360 Speaker 1: a certain amount of like historical telephone game going on 42 00:02:17,400 --> 00:02:19,520 Speaker 1: with some of these. But I did find a great 43 00:02:19,560 --> 00:02:22,679 Speaker 1: deal of clarity on this in a twenty twenty one 44 00:02:22,720 --> 00:02:26,240 Speaker 1: book that I picked up titled Neither Letters nor Swimming 45 00:02:26,280 --> 00:02:31,079 Speaker 1: The Rebirth of Swimming and Free Diving by John m McManamon. 46 00:02:31,680 --> 00:02:34,280 Speaker 1: So this is an interesting book which it's a little 47 00:02:34,280 --> 00:02:36,160 Speaker 1: harder to get your hands on this one, but it's 48 00:02:36,400 --> 00:02:38,440 Speaker 1: worth picking up if you're interested in the history of 49 00:02:38,560 --> 00:02:42,280 Speaker 1: diving and swimming in general. Oil comes up multiple times 50 00:02:42,280 --> 00:02:46,720 Speaker 1: in the book, sometimes just in general observances of waters 51 00:02:47,080 --> 00:02:50,720 Speaker 1: that were known to contain oil naturally in the ancient world. 52 00:02:51,240 --> 00:02:55,760 Speaker 1: Ancient writers mentioned a spring at Carthage. There's the Laparous 53 00:02:55,919 --> 00:02:58,520 Speaker 1: River in southern Turkey or what is now southern Turkey, 54 00:02:58,960 --> 00:03:00,960 Speaker 1: and there's also a lake an the Opia that were 55 00:03:01,000 --> 00:03:03,680 Speaker 1: singled out, all noted for oil that could either be 56 00:03:03,680 --> 00:03:05,960 Speaker 1: extracted for use. In the case of Carthage, I think 57 00:03:05,960 --> 00:03:10,560 Speaker 1: they used it with livestock or just waters that had 58 00:03:10,600 --> 00:03:15,240 Speaker 1: a quote unquote naturally lubricating effect on the swimmer. Hmmm, 59 00:03:15,720 --> 00:03:21,919 Speaker 1: sounds great now, This idea of lubricating yourself for a swim. 60 00:03:22,000 --> 00:03:24,519 Speaker 1: This was This was pretty interesting to me because I 61 00:03:24,960 --> 00:03:28,960 Speaker 1: swim several days a week, but I never oil myself 62 00:03:29,040 --> 00:03:32,919 Speaker 1: up beforehand, and I don't see anybody else doing it either. 63 00:03:32,960 --> 00:03:35,640 Speaker 3: I mean wait, I was gonna ask, is that even 64 00:03:35,680 --> 00:03:38,880 Speaker 3: a thing anybody does? I don't think so. 65 00:03:38,960 --> 00:03:41,360 Speaker 1: I mean, you see cases, certainly, there are cases of 66 00:03:41,440 --> 00:03:46,240 Speaker 1: people lubricating their body with lotions and oils afterwards, or 67 00:03:46,720 --> 00:03:49,520 Speaker 1: you know, something to that effect. But I mean, it 68 00:03:49,600 --> 00:03:51,680 Speaker 1: may be I don't know if it's anything that has 69 00:03:51,720 --> 00:03:54,920 Speaker 1: ever explored and say, competitive swimming. If it is, I'm 70 00:03:54,960 --> 00:03:56,400 Speaker 1: not aware of it off the top of my head. 71 00:03:56,480 --> 00:04:02,680 Speaker 1: But there are various mentions of oil lubricated swimmers in 72 00:04:02,840 --> 00:04:05,800 Speaker 1: ancient texts. The idea that before you entered the water 73 00:04:05,880 --> 00:04:08,760 Speaker 1: to swim, you'd want to rub your naked body down 74 00:04:08,760 --> 00:04:13,400 Speaker 1: with oil, okay, And the reasons for this is, you know, 75 00:04:13,480 --> 00:04:17,760 Speaker 1: seems to vary. So one account, during the Corinthian War 76 00:04:18,080 --> 00:04:21,640 Speaker 1: in the three eighty nine BC, the Athenian forces used 77 00:04:21,640 --> 00:04:28,599 Speaker 1: swimming infantry against Spartan forces near this place in Egypt, Habitus. 78 00:04:29,080 --> 00:04:32,839 Speaker 1: Apparently the waters there were quite cold, so they rubbed 79 00:04:32,839 --> 00:04:36,279 Speaker 1: themselves down with olive oil beforehand, and they drank a 80 00:04:36,279 --> 00:04:39,400 Speaker 1: lot of alcohol before they got into the water. Now 81 00:04:39,520 --> 00:04:42,760 Speaker 1: McManamon points out that, okay, the oil might have provided 82 00:04:42,800 --> 00:04:45,760 Speaker 1: some insulation that actually helped protect them against the cold, 83 00:04:46,360 --> 00:04:48,240 Speaker 1: but the drinking would have been counterproductive. 84 00:04:48,640 --> 00:04:50,920 Speaker 3: Drinking doesn't actually make you warmer. It might make you 85 00:04:51,040 --> 00:04:54,200 Speaker 3: feel warmer temporarily, but right, yeah, it doesn't help. 86 00:04:55,440 --> 00:04:57,839 Speaker 1: The General Hannibal is also said to have ordered his 87 00:04:58,080 --> 00:05:02,040 Speaker 1: soldiers to oil themselves down against the cold at the 88 00:05:02,080 --> 00:05:05,000 Speaker 1: Battle of Trevia River, the first major battle of the 89 00:05:05,040 --> 00:05:09,240 Speaker 1: Second Punic War in two eighteen BCE. So, in general, 90 00:05:09,279 --> 00:05:10,760 Speaker 1: there seems to be this idea that like, okay, you 91 00:05:10,760 --> 00:05:13,719 Speaker 1: can protect yourself against the cold by covering yourself with oil, 92 00:05:14,560 --> 00:05:16,880 Speaker 1: and then perhaps that would work in the water as well. 93 00:05:17,320 --> 00:05:17,719 Speaker 3: Okay. 94 00:05:18,720 --> 00:05:23,000 Speaker 1: Now, on the subject of ancient free diving pearl divers, 95 00:05:23,040 --> 00:05:26,120 Speaker 1: in particular in the Persian Gulf and in the waters 96 00:05:26,120 --> 00:05:29,440 Speaker 1: between India and Sri Lanka, mcmaamon writes that there's a 97 00:05:29,440 --> 00:05:32,520 Speaker 1: lot we don't know about their practices in the ancient world, 98 00:05:32,720 --> 00:05:35,280 Speaker 1: and then they were often working with kind of sketchy 99 00:05:35,360 --> 00:05:38,920 Speaker 1: ideas concerning the nature of oysters. So he mentioned this 100 00:05:39,680 --> 00:05:41,400 Speaker 1: idea that you see written in some of these old 101 00:05:41,440 --> 00:05:43,560 Speaker 1: texts about how oysters have leaders, and you have to 102 00:05:43,600 --> 00:05:45,520 Speaker 1: take out the first oyster first. You have to find 103 00:05:45,520 --> 00:05:47,800 Speaker 1: the leader, take it out first, and then the rest 104 00:05:47,839 --> 00:05:48,440 Speaker 1: will follow. 105 00:05:49,000 --> 00:05:53,480 Speaker 3: Okay, it's a decapitation strike against the oyster brigade. 106 00:05:53,800 --> 00:05:56,360 Speaker 1: Yeah, there's also talk about you need to watch your 107 00:05:56,360 --> 00:06:00,640 Speaker 1: fingers because the oysters may sever the fingers, and mcmammon 108 00:06:01,200 --> 00:06:03,200 Speaker 1: casts a lot of doubt on this. I mean, I 109 00:06:03,240 --> 00:06:06,320 Speaker 1: know that there are concerns with certain types of free 110 00:06:06,400 --> 00:06:11,840 Speaker 1: diving and foraging for various shells and creatures. There are 111 00:06:11,880 --> 00:06:14,839 Speaker 1: particular creatures where you do have to potentially worry about 112 00:06:14,839 --> 00:06:16,960 Speaker 1: a you know, finger getting caught or snagged or whatever. 113 00:06:17,680 --> 00:06:20,720 Speaker 1: But in this case McManamon seems to write that it 114 00:06:21,400 --> 00:06:24,480 Speaker 1: was not really a concern. But basically it all drives 115 00:06:24,480 --> 00:06:28,400 Speaker 1: home just how alien the environment was into which these 116 00:06:28,440 --> 00:06:32,120 Speaker 1: people were venturing. Just think about just how limited you 117 00:06:32,200 --> 00:06:35,279 Speaker 1: were as you gazed down into the water, as you 118 00:06:35,360 --> 00:06:38,279 Speaker 1: dived into the water and tried to find whatever you 119 00:06:38,279 --> 00:06:41,640 Speaker 1: were looking for. So in this particular case, they would 120 00:06:41,640 --> 00:06:45,680 Speaker 1: have likely used grafts, which makes sense. And in the 121 00:06:45,680 --> 00:06:48,679 Speaker 1: case of India and Sri Lanka in particular, there's apparently 122 00:06:48,680 --> 00:06:51,360 Speaker 1: evidence that they made condemned criminals do the work, and 123 00:06:51,520 --> 00:06:53,680 Speaker 1: I think in general it was considered dangerous work and 124 00:06:54,120 --> 00:06:59,200 Speaker 1: there's some writings reflect this. Whatever the case, the clear 125 00:06:59,520 --> 00:07:02,080 Speaker 1: the diving conditions, the better to see what you're doing 126 00:07:03,080 --> 00:07:05,640 Speaker 1: as you go down there too and try and venture 127 00:07:05,680 --> 00:07:09,800 Speaker 1: into the oyster kingdom. So mcmatamon writes, quote, if the 128 00:07:09,800 --> 00:07:12,560 Speaker 1: sea was choppy, the crew would spread oil on its 129 00:07:12,600 --> 00:07:16,200 Speaker 1: surface to settle it down. Modern fishermen use a similar 130 00:07:16,240 --> 00:07:20,480 Speaker 1: method to improve surface visibility, pouring shark oil at times 131 00:07:20,520 --> 00:07:24,200 Speaker 1: mixed with sand to settle the waters. So this is 132 00:07:24,520 --> 00:07:26,880 Speaker 1: the idea that we've discussed already, or were going to 133 00:07:27,000 --> 00:07:30,520 Speaker 1: continue to discuss. The idea here, I believe is that 134 00:07:30,960 --> 00:07:33,480 Speaker 1: friction of the oil on the water surface keeps the 135 00:07:33,520 --> 00:07:36,920 Speaker 1: surface from ruffling or breaking, at least for a short 136 00:07:36,960 --> 00:07:37,760 Speaker 1: period of time. 137 00:07:38,800 --> 00:07:43,760 Speaker 3: The question of the mechanism of how oil culmbs the water, 138 00:07:43,920 --> 00:07:45,960 Speaker 3: if it does, is something I'm going to get into 139 00:07:46,000 --> 00:07:48,040 Speaker 3: in a paper that I'll discuss in a minute here. 140 00:07:48,360 --> 00:07:50,800 Speaker 1: Yeah, but in general, it sounds like the idea that 141 00:07:50,920 --> 00:07:52,920 Speaker 1: is being expressed here is like, if you can make 142 00:07:52,960 --> 00:07:54,360 Speaker 1: the more you can make the surface of the water 143 00:07:54,480 --> 00:07:57,880 Speaker 1: like glass, supposedly through the application of some oil, the 144 00:07:57,960 --> 00:08:00,120 Speaker 1: better you can see down into where you're about to 145 00:08:00,160 --> 00:08:04,000 Speaker 1: send your divers, who again are free diving without masks, etc. 146 00:08:04,840 --> 00:08:06,800 Speaker 3: Okay, So in this case it would be a question 147 00:08:06,880 --> 00:08:10,679 Speaker 3: of being able to look down into the water from 148 00:08:10,720 --> 00:08:12,720 Speaker 3: the surface and see through it better. 149 00:08:13,080 --> 00:08:14,040 Speaker 1: That's my understanding. 150 00:08:14,120 --> 00:08:14,760 Speaker 3: Yes, okay. 151 00:08:15,040 --> 00:08:19,280 Speaker 1: Now The author also discusses a legendary free diver from 152 00:08:19,480 --> 00:08:23,960 Speaker 1: Italian traditions by the name of Cola pache Cola, the 153 00:08:24,040 --> 00:08:30,240 Speaker 1: fish in Italian, a Mediterranean hero whose exploits holding his 154 00:08:30,320 --> 00:08:34,920 Speaker 1: breath were apparently comparable to Coculon, to BeO Wolf, to 155 00:08:35,040 --> 00:08:37,680 Speaker 1: King Olaff and others. I often don't think about this, 156 00:08:37,800 --> 00:08:40,760 Speaker 1: but yeah, you have a lot of heroes who can 157 00:08:40,800 --> 00:08:42,760 Speaker 1: really hold their breath for a long time, and you 158 00:08:42,760 --> 00:08:44,439 Speaker 1: can take that into the modern area. I mean, look 159 00:08:44,480 --> 00:08:47,640 Speaker 1: at Indiana Jones right then he holds his breath on 160 00:08:47,640 --> 00:08:49,640 Speaker 1: that submarine or does he get in the submarine? 161 00:08:50,120 --> 00:08:53,520 Speaker 3: Oh? Wait, I know what you're talking about now. Yeah. 162 00:08:53,600 --> 00:08:56,720 Speaker 1: Anyway, in this particular case, this is an oral tradition 163 00:08:56,800 --> 00:09:00,600 Speaker 1: that was written down by medieval chroniclers during the twelve century. 164 00:09:01,520 --> 00:09:03,960 Speaker 1: He said to have had various adventures and was said 165 00:09:03,960 --> 00:09:05,800 Speaker 1: to spend so much time in the water that he 166 00:09:05,840 --> 00:09:08,040 Speaker 1: would die if he stayed on land for too long. 167 00:09:08,160 --> 00:09:12,040 Speaker 1: So more fish than man in some ways. It's certainly 168 00:09:12,080 --> 00:09:14,800 Speaker 1: a tall tale, to be sure, but ridings about him 169 00:09:14,800 --> 00:09:17,760 Speaker 1: do contain some insight into the use of oil in 170 00:09:17,840 --> 00:09:22,480 Speaker 1: free diving. Quote, while diving, Cola followed the ancients and 171 00:09:22,559 --> 00:09:26,160 Speaker 1: releasing oil into the water column in order to see better. 172 00:09:26,679 --> 00:09:29,960 Speaker 1: Sicilian fishermen still use that technique, especially when they are 173 00:09:30,000 --> 00:09:35,040 Speaker 1: hunting octopi. In the profound abyss of the Straits of Messina, 174 00:09:35,400 --> 00:09:39,000 Speaker 1: Cola reported to the sovereign that he had seen mountains 175 00:09:39,000 --> 00:09:45,720 Speaker 1: and valleys, woods and fields and trees with edible fruits. 176 00:09:44,640 --> 00:09:46,960 Speaker 3: Like another kingdom, just like we have on land, but 177 00:09:47,080 --> 00:09:48,280 Speaker 3: under the waves. 178 00:09:48,160 --> 00:09:52,240 Speaker 1: Exactly, which is something we've discussed before in terms of 179 00:09:52,280 --> 00:09:58,840 Speaker 1: how previous generations thought about the world underwater. And I 180 00:09:58,920 --> 00:10:00,480 Speaker 1: like that there's also kind of a I mean, there's 181 00:10:00,480 --> 00:10:03,719 Speaker 1: a hint of truth to this as well, Like he's 182 00:10:03,800 --> 00:10:08,520 Speaker 1: reporting that, hey, underneath the water, there's actually a robust ecosystem. Now, 183 00:10:08,640 --> 00:10:12,080 Speaker 1: whether it's actually woods and fields and trees with edible freed, well, 184 00:10:12,160 --> 00:10:16,240 Speaker 1: obviously not, but there is in a sense this rich 185 00:10:16,320 --> 00:10:18,280 Speaker 1: other world down there that you can imagine a free 186 00:10:18,280 --> 00:10:19,599 Speaker 1: diver being able to attest to. 187 00:10:19,840 --> 00:10:22,200 Speaker 3: So this passage is not just talking about putting oil 188 00:10:22,200 --> 00:10:25,880 Speaker 3: on the surface, but actually releasing oil down underneath the 189 00:10:25,920 --> 00:10:28,959 Speaker 3: water when you are down there and again that helping 190 00:10:29,040 --> 00:10:33,199 Speaker 3: to see, but this passage doesn't say why that would 191 00:10:33,200 --> 00:10:34,400 Speaker 3: work if it did. 192 00:10:34,640 --> 00:10:36,600 Speaker 1: Right, And I wish again, I wish I could have 193 00:10:36,640 --> 00:10:40,080 Speaker 1: one hundred percent clarity on this particular angle. I haven't 194 00:10:40,120 --> 00:10:43,760 Speaker 1: found anything. It's worth noting that there are multiple factors 195 00:10:43,760 --> 00:10:47,960 Speaker 1: that contribute to decreased visibility underwater. And you have particles 196 00:10:47,960 --> 00:10:52,800 Speaker 1: in the water, you have salinity gradients, temperature gradients, organic particles. 197 00:10:53,280 --> 00:10:55,640 Speaker 1: Just you know, issues of light and you know where 198 00:10:55,679 --> 00:10:57,640 Speaker 1: the sun is positioned in the sky and how much 199 00:10:57,720 --> 00:11:01,840 Speaker 1: light you're getting in a particular volume of water. Interestingly, 200 00:11:03,000 --> 00:11:04,840 Speaker 1: I was reading that you know sometimes there's a visible 201 00:11:04,920 --> 00:11:09,599 Speaker 1: layer between thermoclines that look like the smoothness of an oilchine. 202 00:11:10,040 --> 00:11:12,480 Speaker 1: So I couldn't help, but wonder if that might factor 203 00:11:12,480 --> 00:11:15,880 Speaker 1: into some of this, like things that may be encountered 204 00:11:15,960 --> 00:11:18,920 Speaker 1: underwater that have the feel or look of oil separation. 205 00:11:20,480 --> 00:11:24,359 Speaker 1: Now another interesting bit here on medieval pearl divers. Mcmanumon 206 00:11:24,840 --> 00:11:28,280 Speaker 1: has some interesting information on oil use from the Arabic 207 00:11:28,320 --> 00:11:30,720 Speaker 1: world of the time, and I want I'm going to 208 00:11:30,720 --> 00:11:33,000 Speaker 1: read a longer quote here and warning that it is 209 00:11:33,000 --> 00:11:35,960 Speaker 1: a little bit graphic as it includes mention of alleged 210 00:11:36,000 --> 00:11:40,520 Speaker 1: body modification for the purposes of free diving. Quote. Pearl 211 00:11:40,559 --> 00:11:43,320 Speaker 1: divers attempted to eliminate the pain in their ears and 212 00:11:43,360 --> 00:11:46,680 Speaker 1: block their nostrils. They ruptured their own ear drum and 213 00:11:46,760 --> 00:11:49,840 Speaker 1: knew they had succeeded when blood flowed out. They soaked 214 00:11:49,840 --> 00:11:52,840 Speaker 1: cotton in oil and inserted it into their ears. The 215 00:11:52,920 --> 00:11:55,800 Speaker 1: technique had an added benefit on the bottom, as the 216 00:11:55,840 --> 00:11:58,280 Speaker 1: oil leaked out and floated up. It clarified the water 217 00:11:58,320 --> 00:12:01,880 Speaker 1: column by allowing greater light to a train. For the nostrils, 218 00:12:02,040 --> 00:12:04,840 Speaker 1: pearl divers had various options. They could plug the openings 219 00:12:04,880 --> 00:12:08,439 Speaker 1: with small balls carved from a tortoise shell and use 220 00:12:08,480 --> 00:12:11,240 Speaker 1: a cloth soaked in oil like the ones used in 221 00:12:11,280 --> 00:12:14,840 Speaker 1: the ears. Alternatively, they could wear a clip over the 222 00:12:14,840 --> 00:12:18,040 Speaker 1: outside of their nostrils, carved from ivory or horn or 223 00:12:18,080 --> 00:12:21,400 Speaker 1: tortoise shell. The stated purpose of blocking the nostrils was 224 00:12:21,400 --> 00:12:23,720 Speaker 1: to keep water out, but it may also have aided 225 00:12:23,760 --> 00:12:27,280 Speaker 1: in equalizing pressure in the sinuses and ears. Professional free 226 00:12:27,320 --> 00:12:30,880 Speaker 1: divers still use a nose clip, and he also mentions 227 00:12:30,880 --> 00:12:32,199 Speaker 1: this at a later point in the book, as well, 228 00:12:32,240 --> 00:12:35,760 Speaker 1: attributing the oil soaked cotton swabs in one's ears as 229 00:12:35,800 --> 00:12:39,040 Speaker 1: being protective but also kind of having this side effect 230 00:12:39,080 --> 00:12:41,000 Speaker 1: of like, well, and as the oil leaks out, you're 231 00:12:41,040 --> 00:12:42,400 Speaker 1: only going to see better down there. 232 00:12:42,880 --> 00:12:43,280 Speaker 3: Hmmm. 233 00:12:44,240 --> 00:12:46,320 Speaker 1: So I think I think all of you, even though 234 00:12:46,360 --> 00:12:48,600 Speaker 1: again not one hundred percent clarity on all this, but 235 00:12:48,640 --> 00:12:51,040 Speaker 1: I think some of these examples are telling. On one hand, 236 00:12:51,360 --> 00:12:53,400 Speaker 1: they provide a little more insight into what some of 237 00:12:53,440 --> 00:12:57,000 Speaker 1: these accounts were talking about concerning free divers bringing down 238 00:12:57,040 --> 00:13:00,000 Speaker 1: oil in their mouths or even in around their eyes. 239 00:13:00,480 --> 00:13:03,480 Speaker 1: We also see plenty of examples where humans would have 240 00:13:03,600 --> 00:13:08,600 Speaker 1: had a chance to witness oil interacting with water whilst swimming, 241 00:13:08,640 --> 00:13:10,000 Speaker 1: you know, this idea of Okay, if we had some 242 00:13:10,040 --> 00:13:11,960 Speaker 1: sort of tradition of oiling your body up before you 243 00:13:12,040 --> 00:13:16,360 Speaker 1: go in, then perhaps you're bringing that information with you. 244 00:13:16,440 --> 00:13:19,520 Speaker 1: If there is some practice about, you know, calming the 245 00:13:19,520 --> 00:13:21,320 Speaker 1: water at the surface of the water so as to 246 00:13:21,360 --> 00:13:24,600 Speaker 1: better see down, then that can easily be translated into 247 00:13:24,640 --> 00:13:26,520 Speaker 1: this idea of like, well, bring the oil down with 248 00:13:26,559 --> 00:13:30,160 Speaker 1: you and make that clear as well. So, yeah, I 249 00:13:30,200 --> 00:13:33,360 Speaker 1: think there's still some mysteries remaining here, but I think 250 00:13:33,360 --> 00:13:36,200 Speaker 1: I can maybe sort of glimpse the shape of the 251 00:13:36,200 --> 00:13:37,040 Speaker 1: thing a little better. 252 00:13:37,400 --> 00:13:39,960 Speaker 3: Okay, Well, even if the answer is still a bit elusive. 253 00:13:40,000 --> 00:13:42,360 Speaker 3: I think valued effort at digging there. 254 00:13:44,160 --> 00:13:45,720 Speaker 1: We may have to come back to this particular book 255 00:13:45,720 --> 00:13:47,800 Speaker 1: in the future. He has a lot of great information 256 00:13:47,880 --> 00:13:52,840 Speaker 1: about like early ideas and developments in the creation of 257 00:13:52,920 --> 00:13:56,200 Speaker 1: like actual goggles and masks that would enable people to 258 00:13:56,240 --> 00:13:59,920 Speaker 1: eventually see under the water with the kind of clarity 259 00:14:00,040 --> 00:14:02,120 Speaker 1: were clearly reaching for. 260 00:14:02,679 --> 00:14:05,760 Speaker 3: Oh yeah, we could do some invention coverage on on 261 00:14:05,880 --> 00:14:09,800 Speaker 3: old school diving helmets, which are beautiful. 262 00:14:19,120 --> 00:14:21,240 Speaker 1: Now. I believe in the first episode we warned that 263 00:14:21,280 --> 00:14:24,200 Speaker 1: there would be Ben Franklin, that Ben Franklin would pop 264 00:14:24,320 --> 00:14:30,920 Speaker 1: up in this topic. So let's let's I see is okay, 265 00:14:30,960 --> 00:14:34,600 Speaker 1: he's here? He dies. He frequently pops up on the show, 266 00:14:34,720 --> 00:14:37,720 Speaker 1: especially in our invention episodes. Occasionally you didn't know that 267 00:14:37,760 --> 00:14:40,040 Speaker 1: you were going to have Ben Franklin content, but then 268 00:14:40,280 --> 00:14:40,920 Speaker 1: he appears. 269 00:14:41,440 --> 00:14:44,640 Speaker 3: That's right. So Benjamin Franklin often known as one of 270 00:14:44,720 --> 00:14:48,320 Speaker 3: the so called founding fathers of the United States. He 271 00:14:48,480 --> 00:14:51,480 Speaker 3: was an early American I don't even know what what 272 00:14:51,480 --> 00:14:53,880 Speaker 3: what are? What's the order that you put the things 273 00:14:53,880 --> 00:14:55,640 Speaker 3: he did when you say what he was? He was 274 00:14:55,640 --> 00:15:05,160 Speaker 3: an early American statesman, author, businessman, scientist, inventor. He kind 275 00:15:05,160 --> 00:15:05,840 Speaker 3: of did everything. 276 00:15:06,480 --> 00:15:11,360 Speaker 1: Yeah, just kind of a general American polymath and weird guy, 277 00:15:11,520 --> 00:15:15,720 Speaker 1: you know, an Enlightenment thinker that had a great deal 278 00:15:15,760 --> 00:15:19,840 Speaker 1: of curiosity about the world and entertaining those curiosities. 279 00:15:20,360 --> 00:15:24,920 Speaker 3: Now specifically in the domain of science. Benjamin Franklin, I think, 280 00:15:25,040 --> 00:15:28,680 Speaker 3: is best known for his experiments with electricity, and this 281 00:15:28,720 --> 00:15:32,280 Speaker 3: would include experiments with the storage and discharge of electrical 282 00:15:32,280 --> 00:15:36,720 Speaker 3: potential in what we now call a battery after Franklin's terminology, 283 00:15:36,920 --> 00:15:40,400 Speaker 3: like the Franklin battery was made by putting together a 284 00:15:40,440 --> 00:15:43,720 Speaker 3: series of a pre existing invention called a Leiden jar, 285 00:15:44,440 --> 00:15:46,360 Speaker 3: and he could He's like, oh wow, you can really 286 00:15:46,400 --> 00:15:49,080 Speaker 3: like stack these things up and really pack a punch 287 00:15:49,160 --> 00:15:53,520 Speaker 3: with the energy youer storing. One of these battery experiments 288 00:15:53,680 --> 00:15:55,480 Speaker 3: I know we've talked about on the show before because 289 00:15:55,480 --> 00:15:59,600 Speaker 3: of its weirdness, was the electrocution of a turkey for 290 00:15:59,680 --> 00:16:02,640 Speaker 3: a hull dinner, which he then said was to be 291 00:16:02,800 --> 00:16:07,280 Speaker 3: roasted upon an electric jack after it was electrocuted. But 292 00:16:08,040 --> 00:16:10,960 Speaker 3: for some reason, Franklin believed this would make the meat 293 00:16:11,080 --> 00:16:14,640 Speaker 3: especially tender and succulent. If he used electricity from one 294 00:16:14,680 --> 00:16:17,440 Speaker 3: of his batteries to kill the thing, but he ended 295 00:16:17,520 --> 00:16:22,360 Speaker 3: up badly shocking himself while attempting this. But on the 296 00:16:22,400 --> 00:16:26,520 Speaker 3: broader subject of electricity, Franklin's electrical research also entailed work 297 00:16:27,000 --> 00:16:31,280 Speaker 3: in support of the hypothesis that lightning was in fact 298 00:16:31,400 --> 00:16:35,920 Speaker 3: a form of electricity, was a type of electrical discharge, 299 00:16:36,280 --> 00:16:39,360 Speaker 3: and Franklin was not the first person to make this connection, 300 00:16:39,480 --> 00:16:43,760 Speaker 3: but did important work investigating it. The most famous anecdote here, 301 00:16:43,800 --> 00:16:47,360 Speaker 3: of course, is the one the kite and key experiment, 302 00:16:47,720 --> 00:16:51,720 Speaker 3: which is in a way of disputed historical status. Franklin 303 00:16:51,920 --> 00:16:57,000 Speaker 3: apparently never described himself doing this experiment in any of 304 00:16:57,040 --> 00:17:00,920 Speaker 3: his letters, though I think he described the experiment in 305 00:17:00,960 --> 00:17:03,360 Speaker 3: some writing as a kind of hypothetical, like this is 306 00:17:03,400 --> 00:17:07,280 Speaker 3: an experiment one could do, though after his death people 307 00:17:07,320 --> 00:17:09,560 Speaker 3: did say that he himself had carried it out. If 308 00:17:09,600 --> 00:17:11,520 Speaker 3: he did do it, it would have been probably in 309 00:17:11,880 --> 00:17:16,280 Speaker 3: June of seventeen fifty two. However, Franklin was correct about 310 00:17:16,359 --> 00:17:19,680 Speaker 3: lightning being a form of electrical discharge, and this led 311 00:17:19,720 --> 00:17:23,440 Speaker 3: to his advocacy of the use of sharpened iron lightning 312 00:17:23,520 --> 00:17:27,000 Speaker 3: rods to protect buildings during storms. And this is kind 313 00:17:27,000 --> 00:17:29,240 Speaker 3: of a tangent, but one I got interested in while 314 00:17:29,359 --> 00:17:33,040 Speaker 3: reading about Franklin's lightning rod research for this episode, I 315 00:17:33,080 --> 00:17:35,679 Speaker 3: wanted to share a paragraph I came across from an 316 00:17:35,760 --> 00:17:39,320 Speaker 3: article from the Franklin Institute, which is a museum of 317 00:17:39,359 --> 00:17:43,920 Speaker 3: Benjamin Franklin's life and work in Philadelphia, where they write, 318 00:17:44,000 --> 00:17:49,200 Speaker 3: quote Franklin began to advocate lightning rods that had sharp points. 319 00:17:49,680 --> 00:17:54,239 Speaker 3: His English colleagues favored blunt tipped lightning rods, reasoning that 320 00:17:54,280 --> 00:17:58,040 Speaker 3: sharp ones attracted lightning and increased the risk of strikes. 321 00:17:58,359 --> 00:18:01,520 Speaker 3: They thought blunt rods were less likely to be struck. 322 00:18:02,000 --> 00:18:04,679 Speaker 3: King George the Third had his palace equipped with a 323 00:18:04,720 --> 00:18:07,520 Speaker 3: blunt lightning rod. When it came time to equip the 324 00:18:07,520 --> 00:18:11,640 Speaker 3: colony's buildings with lightning rods, the decision became a political statement. 325 00:18:12,119 --> 00:18:16,399 Speaker 3: The favored pointed lightning rod expressed support for Franklin's theories 326 00:18:16,440 --> 00:18:19,880 Speaker 3: of protecting public buildings and the rejection of theories supported 327 00:18:19,920 --> 00:18:22,760 Speaker 3: by the king. The English thought this was just another 328 00:18:22,800 --> 00:18:26,080 Speaker 3: way for the flourishing colonies to be disobedient to them, 329 00:18:26,520 --> 00:18:28,600 Speaker 3: And I thought this was funny because it's an eighteenth 330 00:18:28,680 --> 00:18:32,639 Speaker 3: century example of a pure scientific question, just like what's 331 00:18:32,680 --> 00:18:36,240 Speaker 3: the ideal shape of a lightning rod? Where really all 332 00:18:36,240 --> 00:18:38,680 Speaker 3: we should care about is what is the correct answer 333 00:18:38,960 --> 00:18:42,439 Speaker 3: of this question being politicized? Now, which answer you favor 334 00:18:42,520 --> 00:18:46,360 Speaker 3: has political connotations, and there is political pressure to think 335 00:18:46,400 --> 00:18:47,520 Speaker 3: a certain way about it. 336 00:18:48,400 --> 00:18:50,840 Speaker 1: Well, who is right? Is it the American way or 337 00:18:50,880 --> 00:18:51,480 Speaker 1: the British way? 338 00:18:52,040 --> 00:18:54,199 Speaker 3: It seems in a way they were both wrong. But 339 00:18:54,480 --> 00:18:57,159 Speaker 3: it seems like the English had the better. The blunt 340 00:18:57,240 --> 00:19:00,879 Speaker 3: lightning rods were better overall, according to modern research. I 341 00:19:00,880 --> 00:19:03,679 Speaker 3: looked up there has been modern research on this, so 342 00:19:03,720 --> 00:19:07,720 Speaker 3: I found a paper by more Awlick and Risin in 343 00:19:07,880 --> 00:19:11,320 Speaker 3: the Journal of Applied Meteorology and Climatology in the year 344 00:19:11,320 --> 00:19:15,119 Speaker 3: two thousand and three, where they say, quote, an examination 345 00:19:15,200 --> 00:19:18,080 Speaker 3: of the relevant physics shows that very strong electric fields 346 00:19:18,080 --> 00:19:20,879 Speaker 3: are required above the tips of rods in order that 347 00:19:20,920 --> 00:19:24,439 Speaker 3: they function as strike receptors, but that the gradients of 348 00:19:24,480 --> 00:19:27,960 Speaker 3: the field strength over sharp tipped rods are so great 349 00:19:28,040 --> 00:19:31,160 Speaker 3: that at distances of a few millimeters, the local fields 350 00:19:31,160 --> 00:19:35,120 Speaker 3: are often too weak for the development of upward going streamers. 351 00:19:35,680 --> 00:19:39,199 Speaker 3: In field tests, rods with rounded tips have been found 352 00:19:39,200 --> 00:19:43,840 Speaker 3: to be better strike receptors than were nearby sharp tipped rods. 353 00:19:45,119 --> 00:19:47,560 Speaker 3: Though it gets kind of complicated, so they say, overall, 354 00:19:47,600 --> 00:19:51,320 Speaker 3: if you're trying to attract your lightning strikes to these rods. 355 00:19:51,400 --> 00:19:54,280 Speaker 3: The blunt ones are better. But as they explained in 356 00:19:54,320 --> 00:19:57,879 Speaker 3: the paper, Franklin's idea was that the purpose of a 357 00:19:57,920 --> 00:20:01,880 Speaker 3: sharp tipped lightning rod was not to attract lightning, but 358 00:20:01,920 --> 00:20:07,560 Speaker 3: to prevent lightning by allowing thunderclouds to sort of silently 359 00:20:07,640 --> 00:20:11,720 Speaker 3: and gently discharge electricity down to the rod, without actually 360 00:20:12,240 --> 00:20:16,240 Speaker 3: allowing a violent lightning strike to occur at all. Of course, 361 00:20:16,280 --> 00:20:19,000 Speaker 3: it was later recognized that a lightning rod could be 362 00:20:19,119 --> 00:20:22,960 Speaker 3: useful by providing just a conductive pathway to the ground, 363 00:20:23,080 --> 00:20:26,080 Speaker 3: rather than simply letting the lightning find its own way 364 00:20:26,119 --> 00:20:28,160 Speaker 3: to the ground through the structure of the building, which 365 00:20:28,160 --> 00:20:30,879 Speaker 3: would be a lot more destructive. So the authors of 366 00:20:30,880 --> 00:20:35,040 Speaker 3: this paper say that lightning rods don't actually discharge thunderclouds gently. 367 00:20:35,119 --> 00:20:38,200 Speaker 3: Franklin was wrong in thinking that would happen, they say, 368 00:20:38,320 --> 00:20:41,000 Speaker 3: quote it is now recognized that the sole function of 369 00:20:41,040 --> 00:20:43,880 Speaker 3: a lightning rod is to be the receptor or interceptor 370 00:20:44,160 --> 00:20:47,919 Speaker 3: of strikes for a lightning protection system that conducts lightning 371 00:20:47,960 --> 00:20:51,159 Speaker 3: discharges to the earth without damage to the structure on 372 00:20:51,200 --> 00:20:55,000 Speaker 3: which the system is mounted. So I would say Franklin 373 00:20:55,240 --> 00:20:58,560 Speaker 3: was correct about the nature of lightning being electrical. He 374 00:20:58,720 --> 00:21:01,960 Speaker 3: was correct that lightning rods were a good idea. He 375 00:21:02,119 --> 00:21:05,200 Speaker 3: was incorrect in part about how they worked. They don't 376 00:21:05,240 --> 00:21:09,199 Speaker 3: actually gently discharge lightning without a strike occurring. And he 377 00:21:09,359 --> 00:21:14,080 Speaker 3: was probably incorrect about the ideal design parameters because the 378 00:21:14,080 --> 00:21:17,560 Speaker 3: blunt rods, it seems, are better. But also, if you'll remember, 379 00:21:17,800 --> 00:21:20,879 Speaker 3: it seems like the English were also wrong because it 380 00:21:21,000 --> 00:21:24,160 Speaker 3: said that they thought the blunt rods were less likely 381 00:21:24,200 --> 00:21:26,960 Speaker 3: to be struck, and they're actually better because they're more 382 00:21:27,080 --> 00:21:29,600 Speaker 3: likely to be struck. So I thought that was interesting. 383 00:21:29,640 --> 00:21:33,000 Speaker 3: But anyway, we should come back to a different scientific question, 384 00:21:33,720 --> 00:21:36,119 Speaker 3: the one of today's episode. This was a different question 385 00:21:36,160 --> 00:21:39,600 Speaker 3: that captured Franklin's attention, and so I want to cite 386 00:21:39,680 --> 00:21:45,600 Speaker 3: a twenty thirteen historical science paper by Wang Stieglitz, Mardin, 387 00:21:45,840 --> 00:21:50,120 Speaker 3: and Tam in the Biophysical Journal published in the year 388 00:21:50,160 --> 00:21:54,239 Speaker 3: twenty thirteen called Benjamin Franklin, Philadelphia's favorite son was a 389 00:21:54,280 --> 00:22:00,480 Speaker 3: membrane biophysicist. So here's the biographical context. In the year 390 00:22:00,720 --> 00:22:05,760 Speaker 3: seventeen fifty seven, the American House of Assembly in Philadelphia 391 00:22:06,119 --> 00:22:10,000 Speaker 3: sent Benjamin Franklin as an envoy to King George the 392 00:22:10,040 --> 00:22:13,720 Speaker 3: second of Great Britain, and Franklin was traveling on one 393 00:22:13,720 --> 00:22:16,320 Speaker 3: of a fleet of ninety six ships that set out 394 00:22:16,359 --> 00:22:19,879 Speaker 3: to cross the Atlantic, departing from New York Harbor. Early 395 00:22:19,920 --> 00:22:22,719 Speaker 3: in their journey, the fleet hit some bad weather. There 396 00:22:22,720 --> 00:22:26,159 Speaker 3: were high winds and heavy waves, and the paper doesn't 397 00:22:26,160 --> 00:22:28,000 Speaker 3: mention this, but I will say I've read in other 398 00:22:28,080 --> 00:22:31,359 Speaker 3: sources that Franklin was very interested in storms and would 399 00:22:31,400 --> 00:22:34,879 Speaker 3: sometimes chase storms on horseback. So I kind of wonder 400 00:22:34,920 --> 00:22:37,639 Speaker 3: if he was out on deck observing the bad weather 401 00:22:37,760 --> 00:22:42,719 Speaker 3: with joyful curiosity while everybody else is vomiting. I don't know, 402 00:22:42,760 --> 00:22:45,160 Speaker 3: but whatever he was doing, he at some point made 403 00:22:45,160 --> 00:22:47,720 Speaker 3: an observation. He looked out at the rest of the fleet, 404 00:22:48,040 --> 00:22:50,720 Speaker 3: and he observed that a couple of the ships in 405 00:22:50,760 --> 00:22:54,520 Speaker 3: the fleet appeared to be sailing much more smoothly than 406 00:22:54,560 --> 00:22:57,480 Speaker 3: the rest. Everybody else is pitching back and forth violently 407 00:22:57,520 --> 00:22:59,680 Speaker 3: in the waves, and a couple looked like for some 408 00:22:59,800 --> 00:23:02,120 Speaker 3: rea and they weren't. They were just kind of cruising 409 00:23:02,119 --> 00:23:05,919 Speaker 3: along smoothly. And Franklin mentioned this to the captain of 410 00:23:05,920 --> 00:23:09,040 Speaker 3: his ship, and the captain said to him, apparently thinking 411 00:23:09,080 --> 00:23:12,359 Speaker 3: that he was stupid for even asking this question, the 412 00:23:12,400 --> 00:23:15,920 Speaker 3: captain said, the cooks have, I suppose, been just emptying 413 00:23:15,960 --> 00:23:19,240 Speaker 3: their greasy water through the scuppers which has greased the 414 00:23:19,280 --> 00:23:22,800 Speaker 3: sides of those ships a little, as if this was obvious, 415 00:23:22,960 --> 00:23:26,000 Speaker 3: and explained it totally, because, as we talked about in 416 00:23:26,000 --> 00:23:28,760 Speaker 3: the last episode, it had long been common knowledge among 417 00:23:28,840 --> 00:23:32,440 Speaker 3: sailors that oil or grease would calm the waves. 418 00:23:33,119 --> 00:23:36,560 Speaker 1: All right, Well, now Ben Franklin has been tipped off 419 00:23:36,920 --> 00:23:38,240 Speaker 1: and is on the case right. 420 00:23:38,280 --> 00:23:40,199 Speaker 3: Right, He's like, oh, I need to get me some 421 00:23:40,240 --> 00:23:43,399 Speaker 3: of that rancid cooking grease. Figure out what's so special 422 00:23:43,440 --> 00:23:46,800 Speaker 3: about it. So the authors of the paper here they 423 00:23:46,840 --> 00:23:48,359 Speaker 3: go over some of the things we talked about in 424 00:23:48,400 --> 00:23:51,600 Speaker 3: the previous episode that since ancient times, authors have mentioned 425 00:23:51,600 --> 00:23:54,840 Speaker 3: this here and there, this practice of pouring oil, sometimes 426 00:23:54,840 --> 00:23:57,480 Speaker 3: olive oil, on top of the sea to calm the 427 00:23:57,520 --> 00:24:02,560 Speaker 3: waters during storms. Remember that, though we don't have Aristotle's 428 00:24:02,560 --> 00:24:07,320 Speaker 3: original writing on this subject, the Roman historian Plutarch attributed 429 00:24:07,400 --> 00:24:11,320 Speaker 3: a view to Aristotle that quote, the oil produces calm 430 00:24:11,560 --> 00:24:15,280 Speaker 3: by smoothing the water's surface so that wind can slip 431 00:24:15,320 --> 00:24:19,120 Speaker 3: over it without making an impression. So when the captain 432 00:24:19,160 --> 00:24:21,880 Speaker 3: told Franklin this He's like, oh, yeah, they emptied their 433 00:24:21,960 --> 00:24:24,600 Speaker 3: nasty grease into the water after they're done cooking, and 434 00:24:25,520 --> 00:24:27,560 Speaker 3: it's greasing the side of the ship and the water 435 00:24:27,600 --> 00:24:30,959 Speaker 3: around it, so that's making the waves calm. Franklin suspected 436 00:24:31,000 --> 00:24:34,320 Speaker 3: that this explanation was wrong. He doubted that greasing the 437 00:24:34,400 --> 00:24:36,639 Speaker 3: outside of the ship would actually calm the water around it, 438 00:24:36,720 --> 00:24:41,680 Speaker 3: but the observation captured his curiosity, especially since it reminded 439 00:24:41,760 --> 00:24:45,840 Speaker 3: him of experiences playing with wax in his father's soap 440 00:24:45,880 --> 00:24:49,800 Speaker 3: factory when he was ten years old, and he observed 441 00:24:49,800 --> 00:24:53,240 Speaker 3: the same phenomenon several more times during voyages across the ocean, 442 00:24:53,320 --> 00:24:55,560 Speaker 3: so he decided at some point that he should make 443 00:24:55,640 --> 00:24:59,439 Speaker 3: experiments to better understand this. He finally got around to 444 00:24:59,480 --> 00:25:03,439 Speaker 3: it twelve years later in seventeen sixty nine during another 445 00:25:03,520 --> 00:25:06,080 Speaker 3: visit to Great Britain. So Franklin was staying in an 446 00:25:06,080 --> 00:25:09,840 Speaker 3: area called Clapham Common in South London, and together with 447 00:25:09,880 --> 00:25:13,000 Speaker 3: a friend of his name, Christopher Baldwin, Franklin made his 448 00:25:13,040 --> 00:25:16,359 Speaker 3: way to a local pond and started just dumping oil 449 00:25:16,400 --> 00:25:20,280 Speaker 3: in it. To quote from Franklin's own description of his 450 00:25:20,400 --> 00:25:24,280 Speaker 3: experiments at the length being at Clapham where there is 451 00:25:24,359 --> 00:25:27,399 Speaker 3: on the common a large pond which I observed to 452 00:25:27,440 --> 00:25:30,360 Speaker 3: be one day, very rough with the wind. I fetched 453 00:25:30,359 --> 00:25:33,600 Speaker 3: out a cruet of oil. And just to note, a 454 00:25:33,680 --> 00:25:36,760 Speaker 3: cruet is like a small flask or carafe with a 455 00:25:36,800 --> 00:25:40,000 Speaker 3: stopper on top, which you might use to store olive 456 00:25:40,000 --> 00:25:42,720 Speaker 3: oil or vinegar or lemon juice at a dining table. 457 00:25:42,800 --> 00:25:44,919 Speaker 3: Sort of. You can think of it as like, you know, 458 00:25:44,960 --> 00:25:48,320 Speaker 3: you taco bell sauce packet, but a rigid caraf. 459 00:25:48,960 --> 00:25:50,840 Speaker 1: Okay, that's good that we know how much oil, because 460 00:25:50,840 --> 00:25:52,639 Speaker 1: I think, as we discussed in the first episode, like 461 00:25:52,680 --> 00:25:55,440 Speaker 1: there's there's this one tale where it sounds like it's 462 00:25:55,480 --> 00:25:58,680 Speaker 1: a magic potion's worth of oil. Other cases it sounds 463 00:25:58,720 --> 00:26:00,840 Speaker 1: like you're talking about like a dumping out all the 464 00:26:00,920 --> 00:26:04,600 Speaker 1: kitchens excess oil. So there's always this question of, like, 465 00:26:04,640 --> 00:26:06,280 Speaker 1: how much oil are we talking about here? 466 00:26:06,680 --> 00:26:09,160 Speaker 3: This is going to be a fairly small amount of oil. 467 00:26:09,200 --> 00:26:13,000 Speaker 3: I think I've seen it described in the tablespoon range. Okay, 468 00:26:13,280 --> 00:26:15,600 Speaker 3: but so Franklin says, I fetched out a cruet of 469 00:26:15,640 --> 00:26:18,080 Speaker 3: oil and dropped a little of it on the water. 470 00:26:18,359 --> 00:26:22,080 Speaker 3: I saw it spread itself with surprising swiftness upon the surface, 471 00:26:22,520 --> 00:26:25,640 Speaker 3: and there the oil though not more than a teaspoonful. 472 00:26:25,720 --> 00:26:29,120 Speaker 3: Oh okay, so he says, a teaspoonful here produced an 473 00:26:29,160 --> 00:26:33,280 Speaker 3: instant calm over a space several yards square, which spread 474 00:26:33,320 --> 00:26:38,119 Speaker 3: amazingly and extended itself gradually till it reached the lee side, 475 00:26:38,520 --> 00:26:42,080 Speaker 3: making all that quarter of the pond, perhaps half an acre, 476 00:26:42,520 --> 00:26:46,359 Speaker 3: as smooth as a looking glass. The oil layer was 477 00:26:46,440 --> 00:26:49,480 Speaker 3: so thin as to produce the prismatic colors for a 478 00:26:49,520 --> 00:26:52,960 Speaker 3: considerable space, and beyond them so much thinner as to 479 00:26:53,000 --> 00:26:56,680 Speaker 3: be invisible except in its effect of smoothing the waves 480 00:26:56,720 --> 00:27:00,520 Speaker 3: at a much greater distance. So this is a very 481 00:27:00,680 --> 00:27:04,239 Speaker 3: simple experiment, simply pouring oil out over the surface of 482 00:27:04,280 --> 00:27:07,600 Speaker 3: a pond in windy weather. But out of this very 483 00:27:07,600 --> 00:27:12,280 Speaker 3: simple experiment Franklin got several interesting observations. So one is 484 00:27:12,280 --> 00:27:15,399 Speaker 3: that a tiny container of oil spreads out over a 485 00:27:15,600 --> 00:27:19,239 Speaker 3: shockingly vast area on the surface of the water. And 486 00:27:19,280 --> 00:27:22,359 Speaker 3: the second thing was it seemed true in the parts 487 00:27:22,400 --> 00:27:25,040 Speaker 3: where the oil spread, the water no longer rippled in 488 00:27:25,080 --> 00:27:28,000 Speaker 3: the wind, but became, in his words, as smooth as 489 00:27:28,040 --> 00:27:31,240 Speaker 3: a looking glass, smooth as a mirror. But what if 490 00:27:31,280 --> 00:27:35,480 Speaker 3: the effect was just something about this pond in particular 491 00:27:36,200 --> 00:27:39,200 Speaker 3: Franklin knew that you should repeat an experiment under different 492 00:27:39,200 --> 00:27:41,960 Speaker 3: circumstances to see if you get the same result or 493 00:27:42,000 --> 00:27:44,679 Speaker 3: a different one, So he wrote quote after this, I 494 00:27:44,720 --> 00:27:47,800 Speaker 3: contrived to take with me whenever I went into the 495 00:27:47,840 --> 00:27:50,960 Speaker 3: country a little oil in the upper hollow of my 496 00:27:51,119 --> 00:27:54,600 Speaker 3: bamboo cane, with which I might repeat the experiment as 497 00:27:54,640 --> 00:27:58,639 Speaker 3: opportunities should offer. And I found it constantly to succeed. 498 00:27:59,160 --> 00:28:02,680 Speaker 3: So I'm thinking of him a little bit like Gendalf 499 00:28:02,760 --> 00:28:05,880 Speaker 3: sort of wandering through the shires, stupefying the Hobbits by 500 00:28:05,880 --> 00:28:08,120 Speaker 3: pouring oil on the water out of his staff. 501 00:28:09,200 --> 00:28:12,239 Speaker 1: I guess so. But this makes me I ask all 502 00:28:12,280 --> 00:28:15,160 Speaker 1: sorts of questions about his cane. Did he always have 503 00:28:15,240 --> 00:28:18,359 Speaker 1: a secret compartment in his cane for some sort of 504 00:28:18,359 --> 00:28:21,800 Speaker 1: a flask or vial of some substance? And if so, 505 00:28:21,960 --> 00:28:24,359 Speaker 1: what usually goes in there? Is this like you have 506 00:28:24,400 --> 00:28:27,280 Speaker 1: a little bit of alcohol? Or is there is this? 507 00:28:27,400 --> 00:28:29,720 Speaker 1: I do you put some poison in there? I mean, 508 00:28:29,760 --> 00:28:33,080 Speaker 1: there's so many questions about this bamboo cane. 509 00:28:33,280 --> 00:28:35,119 Speaker 3: Yeah, what did he have in there when he was 510 00:28:35,160 --> 00:28:37,560 Speaker 3: not wandering the shire? Yeah? 511 00:28:37,680 --> 00:28:39,560 Speaker 1: Or maybe he had it specially. I mean, it's like 512 00:28:39,640 --> 00:28:41,800 Speaker 1: all these options around the table with Benjamin Franklin. I 513 00:28:41,840 --> 00:28:44,440 Speaker 1: can also easily imagine from what we've read of the 514 00:28:44,480 --> 00:28:46,400 Speaker 1: man him going into the cane shop and say, look, 515 00:28:46,680 --> 00:28:49,320 Speaker 1: I need to oil down some ponds in the as 516 00:28:49,320 --> 00:28:51,840 Speaker 1: I travel around, and I don't want to just carry 517 00:28:51,880 --> 00:28:54,480 Speaker 1: it on my person. I want to have it secreted 518 00:28:54,520 --> 00:28:57,000 Speaker 1: away within my bamboo cane. I would like to commission 519 00:28:57,040 --> 00:28:58,720 Speaker 1: such a bamboo cane. And they're like, all right, yeah, 520 00:28:58,720 --> 00:28:59,640 Speaker 1: we can do that for you. 521 00:29:00,120 --> 00:29:03,800 Speaker 3: Right, So then he crosses commissioned secret grease cane off 522 00:29:03,800 --> 00:29:07,640 Speaker 3: of his daily to do list. Well, anyway, so after 523 00:29:07,640 --> 00:29:10,440 Speaker 3: a while he'd observed this effect a lot of times, 524 00:29:10,520 --> 00:29:13,200 Speaker 3: and in trying to interpret the results, Franklin observed a 525 00:29:13,280 --> 00:29:16,880 Speaker 3: distinction between how oil behaves when you drop it onto 526 00:29:16,920 --> 00:29:21,040 Speaker 3: a solid surface versus onto the surface of water. He says, 527 00:29:21,080 --> 00:29:23,080 Speaker 3: if you put a drop of oil on a table 528 00:29:23,120 --> 00:29:26,400 Speaker 3: made of marble, or a table made of wood, or 529 00:29:26,480 --> 00:29:29,560 Speaker 3: on a mirror glass that's lying horizontal, the drop just 530 00:29:29,600 --> 00:29:32,400 Speaker 3: remains in place as a drop. It pretty much keeps 531 00:29:32,400 --> 00:29:35,040 Speaker 3: the same shape. It doesn't spread out. But on the 532 00:29:35,080 --> 00:29:40,120 Speaker 3: surface of water it spreads. There is a dramatically different behavior. 533 00:29:40,120 --> 00:29:42,360 Speaker 3: It's not just a little different like a single drop 534 00:29:42,400 --> 00:29:45,560 Speaker 3: of oil will spread over a vast area. I remember 535 00:29:45,600 --> 00:29:47,560 Speaker 3: he said, the pond in England. It was about a 536 00:29:47,600 --> 00:29:51,440 Speaker 3: tea spoonful, and that went to like a half acre. Wow. 537 00:29:52,480 --> 00:29:55,560 Speaker 3: So Franklin wrote, quote, if there be a mutual repulsion 538 00:29:55,640 --> 00:29:59,520 Speaker 3: between the particles of oil and no attraction between oil 539 00:29:59,520 --> 00:30:03,040 Speaker 3: and water, oil dropped on water will not be held 540 00:30:03,120 --> 00:30:06,800 Speaker 3: together by adhesion to the spot whereon it falls. It 541 00:30:06,840 --> 00:30:10,000 Speaker 3: will be at liberty to expand itself, and it will 542 00:30:10,000 --> 00:30:12,800 Speaker 3: spread on a surface that, besides being smooth to the 543 00:30:12,800 --> 00:30:17,000 Speaker 3: most perfect degree of polish, prevents, perhaps by repelling the 544 00:30:17,040 --> 00:30:21,200 Speaker 3: oil all immediate contact, keeping it at a minute distance 545 00:30:21,240 --> 00:30:24,720 Speaker 3: from itself, and the expansion will continue till the mutual 546 00:30:24,760 --> 00:30:28,000 Speaker 3: repulsion between the particles of the oil is weakened and 547 00:30:28,080 --> 00:30:32,000 Speaker 3: reduced to nothing by their distance. And while of course 548 00:30:32,000 --> 00:30:35,200 Speaker 3: Franklin believed there to be a natural repulsion between oil 549 00:30:35,240 --> 00:30:38,080 Speaker 3: and water, he thought that there was no natural repulsion 550 00:30:38,480 --> 00:30:41,840 Speaker 3: between water and air, so the water and air could 551 00:30:41,840 --> 00:30:45,200 Speaker 3: freely contact one another, and that was why he thought 552 00:30:45,280 --> 00:30:48,080 Speaker 3: it may be stilled the waves. So we'll come back 553 00:30:48,080 --> 00:30:50,920 Speaker 3: to a slightly different explanation of how it stills the 554 00:30:50,960 --> 00:30:56,400 Speaker 3: waves in a minute. But First, there's another interesting consequence 555 00:30:56,440 --> 00:31:00,840 Speaker 3: of this experiment. The concept of a molecule had not 556 00:31:00,960 --> 00:31:04,000 Speaker 3: yet taken root during Franklin's life. Franklin wouldn't have known 557 00:31:04,040 --> 00:31:07,120 Speaker 3: what a molecule was. But the author's right that what 558 00:31:07,240 --> 00:31:09,720 Speaker 3: Franklin had actually created here on the surface of the 559 00:31:09,760 --> 00:31:14,840 Speaker 3: water was a monomolecular layer of oil quote, which eventually 560 00:31:14,880 --> 00:31:19,040 Speaker 3: expanded into a two dimensional gas of oil molecules at 561 00:31:19,040 --> 00:31:22,240 Speaker 3: the air water interface. But what he had done is 562 00:31:23,280 --> 00:31:27,200 Speaker 3: create a layer of oil one molecule thick. That's what 563 00:31:27,280 --> 00:31:31,200 Speaker 3: happens when you allow oil to spread out without boundary 564 00:31:31,280 --> 00:31:34,640 Speaker 3: on the surface of water. And so Franklin never made 565 00:31:34,640 --> 00:31:38,360 Speaker 3: this next step, but later scientists observed that you could 566 00:31:38,480 --> 00:31:42,959 Speaker 3: use exactly this experiment to calculate the height of a 567 00:31:43,080 --> 00:31:46,880 Speaker 3: single molecule of oil, because you already know two things. 568 00:31:46,920 --> 00:31:49,960 Speaker 3: You know the starting volume of oil, and then when 569 00:31:50,000 --> 00:31:52,320 Speaker 3: you drop it on water, you can wait for it 570 00:31:52,320 --> 00:31:55,800 Speaker 3: to spread out completely into a monolayer and then measure 571 00:31:55,880 --> 00:31:57,680 Speaker 3: the area of the oil. So if you know this 572 00:31:57,800 --> 00:32:01,080 Speaker 3: starting volume and then the area that it spreads out to, 573 00:32:01,600 --> 00:32:05,480 Speaker 3: you can calculate the thickness of the single molecule layer. 574 00:32:06,400 --> 00:32:09,440 Speaker 3: Oh wow, if Franklin had thought to do this, and 575 00:32:09,480 --> 00:32:11,800 Speaker 3: they say that he would have been able to mathematically, 576 00:32:11,840 --> 00:32:13,920 Speaker 3: he apparently just didn't. It didn't occur to him to 577 00:32:13,960 --> 00:32:16,600 Speaker 3: do this. He could have come up with the first 578 00:32:16,760 --> 00:32:20,000 Speaker 3: roughly accurate estimate of the size of a molecule in history, 579 00:32:20,360 --> 00:32:22,480 Speaker 3: and he would have been one hundred years ahead of 580 00:32:22,480 --> 00:32:26,120 Speaker 3: the actual first people to do this. So one of 581 00:32:26,160 --> 00:32:28,600 Speaker 3: the later scientists who did make this kind of calculation 582 00:32:28,800 --> 00:32:32,240 Speaker 3: was the British mathematician and physicist Lord Rayleigh, who lived 583 00:32:32,240 --> 00:32:35,680 Speaker 3: eighteen forty two to nineteen nineteen, and he realized that 584 00:32:35,720 --> 00:32:38,920 Speaker 3: the spreading of the molecules of oil across the surface 585 00:32:38,960 --> 00:32:41,280 Speaker 3: of water would illuminate the question of what he called 586 00:32:41,400 --> 00:32:46,280 Speaker 3: molecular magnitudes the size of an oil molecule. So he 587 00:32:46,360 --> 00:32:49,960 Speaker 3: did experiments of putting olive oil in a sponge bath 588 00:32:50,320 --> 00:32:54,200 Speaker 3: to calculate the size of a molecule of triolene, which 589 00:32:54,240 --> 00:32:57,880 Speaker 3: is a main component of olive oil, and he put 590 00:32:57,920 --> 00:33:00,800 Speaker 3: it after his measurements at sixteen point three angstroms and 591 00:33:00,840 --> 00:33:05,040 Speaker 3: Angstrom is one ten billionth of a meter, and this 592 00:33:05,080 --> 00:33:07,480 Speaker 3: calculation was close but was still a little bit off, 593 00:33:07,560 --> 00:33:10,360 Speaker 3: and it was improved by the contributions of a German 594 00:33:10,680 --> 00:33:15,000 Speaker 3: self taught chemist named Agnes Pockels who lived eighteen sixty 595 00:33:15,000 --> 00:33:19,680 Speaker 3: two to nineteen thirty five. She had performed similar experiments 596 00:33:19,680 --> 00:33:22,640 Speaker 3: on her own before Lord Rayleigh, and she had done 597 00:33:22,680 --> 00:33:25,320 Speaker 3: them in her own kitchen at the counter. She was 598 00:33:25,560 --> 00:33:28,880 Speaker 3: not formally trained in science. She was an autodidact, and 599 00:33:28,960 --> 00:33:31,880 Speaker 3: when she saw his paper in eighteen ninety she contacted 600 00:33:31,960 --> 00:33:35,040 Speaker 3: him with her own results, which had been hers. Had 601 00:33:35,040 --> 00:33:37,160 Speaker 3: been accomplished with the help of an instrument that she 602 00:33:37,240 --> 00:33:40,920 Speaker 3: had invented for measuring surface tension, which helped get a 603 00:33:40,920 --> 00:33:45,400 Speaker 3: better calculation of the thickness of the oil, and with 604 00:33:45,480 --> 00:33:47,920 Speaker 3: her method she measured the thickness of a single oil 605 00:33:48,000 --> 00:33:52,440 Speaker 3: molecule or the sorry not just the oil, the trilene molecule, 606 00:33:52,480 --> 00:33:55,120 Speaker 3: the main component of the olive oil. She measured that 607 00:33:55,160 --> 00:33:59,320 Speaker 3: to thirteen angstroms, and this in turn led Raley to 608 00:33:59,360 --> 00:34:03,800 Speaker 3: improve his own measurements, and then later the American physicist 609 00:34:03,800 --> 00:34:08,000 Speaker 3: Irving Langmuir came along to do definitive work on oil 610 00:34:08,000 --> 00:34:10,759 Speaker 3: film chemistry, and when he did that, he did so 611 00:34:10,920 --> 00:34:13,959 Speaker 3: with the help of a surface tension measuring device which 612 00:34:14,040 --> 00:34:16,800 Speaker 3: was similar to the instrument that Agnes Pockles had already 613 00:34:16,800 --> 00:34:29,920 Speaker 3: invented in the nineteenth century. But anyway, why did the 614 00:34:29,920 --> 00:34:33,719 Speaker 3: oil actually calm the waves? What is going on when 615 00:34:33,920 --> 00:34:36,960 Speaker 3: the waves stop rippling in water where there's an oil 616 00:34:37,040 --> 00:34:40,600 Speaker 3: mono layer on top. The authors of this paper suggest 617 00:34:40,760 --> 00:34:44,600 Speaker 3: that the best explanation is the one offered by Lord Rayleigh, 618 00:34:45,080 --> 00:34:47,960 Speaker 3: So I'm going to read from Lord Rayleigh. Here. He wrote, 619 00:34:48,400 --> 00:34:52,080 Speaker 3: let us consider small waves as propagated over the surface 620 00:34:52,120 --> 00:34:55,719 Speaker 3: of clean water. As the waves advanced, the surface of 621 00:34:55,760 --> 00:35:00,200 Speaker 3: the water has to submit to periodic extensions and contractions. 622 00:35:00,520 --> 00:35:03,120 Speaker 3: At the crest of the wave, the surface is compressed, 623 00:35:03,520 --> 00:35:06,600 Speaker 3: while the trough it is extended. As long as the 624 00:35:06,600 --> 00:35:09,359 Speaker 3: water is pure, there is no force to oppose that, 625 00:35:09,680 --> 00:35:13,080 Speaker 3: and the wave can be propagated without difficulty. But if 626 00:35:13,120 --> 00:35:18,680 Speaker 3: the surface be contaminated, the contamination strongly resists the alternating 627 00:35:18,840 --> 00:35:23,520 Speaker 3: stretching and contraction. It tends always on the contrary to 628 00:35:23,719 --> 00:35:27,640 Speaker 3: spread itself uniformly, and the result is that the water 629 00:35:27,800 --> 00:35:31,719 Speaker 3: refuses to lend itself to the motion which is required 630 00:35:31,800 --> 00:35:34,560 Speaker 3: of it. The film of oil may be compared to 631 00:35:34,680 --> 00:35:40,080 Speaker 3: an inextensible membrane, membrane that can't stretch floating on the 632 00:35:40,120 --> 00:35:43,399 Speaker 3: surface of the water and hampering its motion. And under 633 00:35:43,440 --> 00:35:45,960 Speaker 3: these conditions it is not possible for the waves to 634 00:35:46,000 --> 00:35:49,800 Speaker 3: be generated unless the forces are very much greater than usual. 635 00:35:51,080 --> 00:35:53,840 Speaker 3: So if I'm understanding this correctly, it seems to me 636 00:35:53,920 --> 00:35:56,560 Speaker 3: what he's saying is that the oil, because of its 637 00:35:57,080 --> 00:36:00,520 Speaker 3: hydrophobic chemical reaction with the water and with its and 638 00:36:00,680 --> 00:36:03,920 Speaker 3: with itself, it strongly prefers to stretch out into this 639 00:36:04,040 --> 00:36:07,880 Speaker 3: single molecule thick layer. And if this oil really wants 640 00:36:07,920 --> 00:36:11,440 Speaker 3: to become and then stay a layer that's a single 641 00:36:11,480 --> 00:36:15,200 Speaker 3: molecule thick, that means it can't really stretch any thinner 642 00:36:15,400 --> 00:36:17,520 Speaker 3: unless the force of the waves is so strong that 643 00:36:17,560 --> 00:36:21,240 Speaker 3: the oil slick is actually ripped apart, and it repels 644 00:36:21,280 --> 00:36:25,840 Speaker 3: being contracted to become any thicker. Since it resists becoming 645 00:36:25,840 --> 00:36:29,280 Speaker 3: more than a molecule thick, so it resists any wave 646 00:36:29,440 --> 00:36:32,480 Speaker 3: motion at the surface. Though of course, at some point 647 00:36:32,840 --> 00:36:35,719 Speaker 3: waves could become so powerful that they would override the 648 00:36:35,840 --> 00:36:40,000 Speaker 3: hydrophobic chemical forces that caused this phenomenon, So it only 649 00:36:40,000 --> 00:36:41,719 Speaker 3: works up to a certain point. 650 00:36:41,880 --> 00:36:44,719 Speaker 1: And yet you might ask, well, could we stop a 651 00:36:44,760 --> 00:36:51,240 Speaker 1: hurricane with it? This actually is something that I found 652 00:36:51,239 --> 00:36:56,319 Speaker 1: discussed in a paper from two thousand and five. This 653 00:36:56,480 --> 00:36:59,320 Speaker 1: is it's titled A Note concerning the Light Hill Sandwich 654 00:36:59,400 --> 00:37:04,800 Speaker 1: Model of Typical Cyclones. The authors here are Baron Blot, Chorin, 655 00:37:05,320 --> 00:37:09,600 Speaker 1: and Prost Taukashan. These three individuals would be Alexander Chorin, 656 00:37:09,800 --> 00:37:16,480 Speaker 1: a Berkeley computational fluid mechanics expert, Russian mathematician Grigory Baron Blatt, 657 00:37:16,719 --> 00:37:22,960 Speaker 1: and VM Takashian. So they seem to be individuals who 658 00:37:23,360 --> 00:37:28,040 Speaker 1: are very well established in their field here, and I 659 00:37:28,080 --> 00:37:30,279 Speaker 1: looked at this paper and I tried to look at 660 00:37:30,280 --> 00:37:33,359 Speaker 1: the paper that it came before it, that they're kind 661 00:37:33,360 --> 00:37:36,080 Speaker 1: of This is kind of an addendum too. It's very 662 00:37:36,080 --> 00:37:40,759 Speaker 1: technical paper, full of equations and whatnot. But in this 663 00:37:41,840 --> 00:37:44,640 Speaker 1: A Note concerning the light Hill Sandwich Model of Tropical Cyclones, 664 00:37:45,000 --> 00:37:47,680 Speaker 1: they suggest that that oil spread on the surface of 665 00:37:47,719 --> 00:37:53,160 Speaker 1: water could potentially prevent the formation of quote turbulence dampening 666 00:37:53,480 --> 00:37:57,000 Speaker 1: ocean spray troplets. The idea here being that while there's 667 00:37:57,000 --> 00:38:00,239 Speaker 1: a lot going on in a hurricane, quote, flow acceleration 668 00:38:00,680 --> 00:38:03,920 Speaker 1: in an ocean spray that carries large water droplets unquote 669 00:38:04,160 --> 00:38:07,440 Speaker 1: is part of the whole scenario, and if one could 670 00:38:08,080 --> 00:38:12,799 Speaker 1: theoretically curtail flow acceleration by droplets, it might have an 671 00:38:12,840 --> 00:38:17,160 Speaker 1: impact on the storm's overall strength. I'm going to read 672 00:38:17,719 --> 00:38:21,240 Speaker 1: what the authors wrote here on the matter. 673 00:38:21,840 --> 00:38:22,240 Speaker 3: Quote. 674 00:38:22,480 --> 00:38:25,640 Speaker 1: In the present work, we demonstrated that the mechanism of 675 00:38:25,680 --> 00:38:28,680 Speaker 1: turbulent suppression by water droplets in the ocean spray can 676 00:38:28,719 --> 00:38:32,600 Speaker 1: substantially accelerate the flow so that the speeds of wind 677 00:38:32,920 --> 00:38:36,600 Speaker 1: characteristic of the strongest hurricanes can be reached. The complete 678 00:38:36,600 --> 00:38:40,839 Speaker 1: mathematical model, taking into account both thermal effects and Coriola's force, 679 00:38:41,160 --> 00:38:44,520 Speaker 1: can now be constructed in the form that allows effective 680 00:38:44,920 --> 00:38:48,720 Speaker 1: numerical calculations. Note that a model of dust storms taking 681 00:38:48,719 --> 00:38:53,000 Speaker 1: into account the thermal effects was proposed in reference seven. Furthermore, 682 00:38:53,080 --> 00:38:55,640 Speaker 1: the effects of particles on the dynamics of tornadoes can 683 00:38:55,640 --> 00:38:57,880 Speaker 1: be studied by similar meats. Anyway, they get to the 684 00:38:57,880 --> 00:39:01,080 Speaker 1: conclusion here they say, incan illusion. We want to make 685 00:39:01,120 --> 00:39:04,840 Speaker 1: a comment. Since antiquity semen have had barrels of oil 686 00:39:05,160 --> 00:39:07,960 Speaker 1: on the decks of their vessels and thrown the oil 687 00:39:08,239 --> 00:39:11,080 Speaker 1: on the sea surface in critical moments of stormy weather. 688 00:39:11,600 --> 00:39:15,000 Speaker 1: We think that the action of oil was exactly the 689 00:39:15,040 --> 00:39:19,160 Speaker 1: prevention of the formation of droplets. The turbulence was restored. 690 00:39:19,280 --> 00:39:22,680 Speaker 1: After the oil was dropped, the turbulent drag was increased 691 00:39:22,960 --> 00:39:26,960 Speaker 1: and the intensity of the squall was reduced. Possibly hurricanes 692 00:39:27,000 --> 00:39:32,320 Speaker 1: can be similarly prevented or dampened by having airplanes deliver fast, decaying, 693 00:39:32,719 --> 00:39:37,600 Speaker 1: harmless surfactants to the right places on the sea surface. 694 00:39:38,080 --> 00:39:42,040 Speaker 3: Okay, So, a surfactant is a substance that reduces the 695 00:39:42,080 --> 00:39:45,440 Speaker 3: surface tension of water when you or of any liquid, 696 00:39:45,440 --> 00:39:47,800 Speaker 3: I guess when you add it to the water. So 697 00:39:47,800 --> 00:39:52,839 Speaker 3: soap is a surfactant, and it increases the wetting properties 698 00:39:52,840 --> 00:39:55,160 Speaker 3: of water. It causes water to less want to cling 699 00:39:55,160 --> 00:39:57,800 Speaker 3: to itself and more to spread out over whatever. 700 00:39:58,320 --> 00:40:01,400 Speaker 1: Now, I do want to stress that this, this proposal 701 00:40:01,400 --> 00:40:04,719 Speaker 1: here is very much based in mathematical modeling, and you 702 00:40:04,760 --> 00:40:07,120 Speaker 1: have to sort of you have to take it with 703 00:40:07,200 --> 00:40:11,439 Speaker 1: that in consideration. On top of that, we have to 704 00:40:11,440 --> 00:40:13,640 Speaker 1: to mention that, Yeah, there have been various methods that 705 00:40:13,680 --> 00:40:17,120 Speaker 1: have been brought up over the years as possible means 706 00:40:17,120 --> 00:40:21,360 Speaker 1: of dampening hurricanes, or preventing hurricanes, or stopping a hurricane 707 00:40:21,560 --> 00:40:25,520 Speaker 1: and its growth. None of these I think has really 708 00:40:25,640 --> 00:40:29,680 Speaker 1: proven to be effective. We're not actually doing any of 709 00:40:29,280 --> 00:40:33,000 Speaker 1: those things. I mean, there are things we know that 710 00:40:33,040 --> 00:40:36,640 Speaker 1: we could do in the world a large scale to 711 00:40:36,760 --> 00:40:40,320 Speaker 1: prevent hurricanes from becoming worse in the years ahead, and 712 00:40:40,360 --> 00:40:42,799 Speaker 1: we're not necessarily doing all of those either. So but 713 00:40:42,880 --> 00:40:45,920 Speaker 1: you know, nobody wants to change their lives. They want 714 00:40:45,960 --> 00:40:49,000 Speaker 1: they want the really quick means of stopping the hurricane, 715 00:40:49,040 --> 00:40:51,600 Speaker 1: some dynamic idea, something you can drop out of an 716 00:40:51,600 --> 00:40:55,920 Speaker 1: airplane or so forth. But still, I don't know. The 717 00:40:55,960 --> 00:41:00,560 Speaker 1: modeling here is interesting, and it's it's neat to see 718 00:41:00,560 --> 00:41:06,400 Speaker 1: this more modern, like very technical approach to trying to 719 00:41:06,400 --> 00:41:09,440 Speaker 1: figure out the same thing that Benjamin Franklin was pondering 720 00:41:09,480 --> 00:41:14,200 Speaker 1: over and that the ancients in many cases just took 721 00:41:14,280 --> 00:41:19,000 Speaker 1: as fact. You have turbulent seas well, throw a little 722 00:41:19,040 --> 00:41:21,120 Speaker 1: oil in there and that's going to calm things down. 723 00:41:21,680 --> 00:41:24,200 Speaker 3: It would be very interesting if this worked, though, though. 724 00:41:24,320 --> 00:41:27,640 Speaker 3: I just pulled up a New Scientist article that was 725 00:41:27,920 --> 00:41:31,160 Speaker 3: covering this paper that consulted somebody else in the field. 726 00:41:31,160 --> 00:41:34,399 Speaker 3: They consulted Julian Hunt at the University College London, who 727 00:41:34,520 --> 00:41:37,280 Speaker 3: just said, quote, I am very doubtful about this approach. 728 00:41:38,320 --> 00:41:41,280 Speaker 1: Yeah, and again even the authors themselves are are pointing 729 00:41:41,280 --> 00:41:45,600 Speaker 1: out that they're taking the various factors involved in the 730 00:41:45,640 --> 00:41:48,240 Speaker 1: growth of a hurricane and reducing it to this one area. 731 00:41:48,719 --> 00:41:51,040 Speaker 1: So this is not a solution that would seem to 732 00:41:51,080 --> 00:41:54,840 Speaker 1: take everything into account, but just concerning like this one 733 00:41:54,880 --> 00:41:57,920 Speaker 1: aspect of storm strength building up. 734 00:41:58,080 --> 00:42:00,680 Speaker 3: I guess this does raise different questions because if you 735 00:42:00,719 --> 00:42:02,640 Speaker 3: go back to in part one we talked about that 736 00:42:02,719 --> 00:42:06,520 Speaker 3: story from the Venerable Bead about I think the deal 737 00:42:06,640 --> 00:42:11,080 Speaker 3: was a bishop gave a priest, so like King Oswe 738 00:42:11,440 --> 00:42:16,520 Speaker 3: sent out a priest to bring his bride home from Kent. 739 00:42:17,080 --> 00:42:19,600 Speaker 3: And then there was a bishop who gave a bottle 740 00:42:19,640 --> 00:42:21,840 Speaker 3: of oil, almost as if it was a magical potion, 741 00:42:22,600 --> 00:42:26,400 Speaker 3: to the priest and said, hey, you know, when you 742 00:42:26,400 --> 00:42:29,200 Speaker 3: get out on the sea, if there's a storm, you 743 00:42:29,239 --> 00:42:32,560 Speaker 3: pour this oil on the water and it'll calm the storm. 744 00:42:33,160 --> 00:42:36,799 Speaker 3: And so that raises two different interpretations. One could be like, oh, 745 00:42:36,880 --> 00:42:39,719 Speaker 3: is he just talking about the thing that is in 746 00:42:39,760 --> 00:42:41,600 Speaker 3: a way. I mean, I don't know how well it 747 00:42:41,640 --> 00:42:44,919 Speaker 3: would really work on a large scale around a boat, 748 00:42:45,080 --> 00:42:48,160 Speaker 3: but there is at least experimental evidence that you pour 749 00:42:48,239 --> 00:42:53,040 Speaker 3: oil on waters and somewhat will calm waves. Is that 750 00:42:53,160 --> 00:42:55,200 Speaker 3: all that this story is talking about, or should we 751 00:42:55,200 --> 00:42:57,960 Speaker 3: take it in the broader sense of it will actually 752 00:42:58,040 --> 00:43:00,800 Speaker 3: stop the storm, like it will effect to the weather 753 00:43:01,000 --> 00:43:03,920 Speaker 3: coming from above and the winds. 754 00:43:04,040 --> 00:43:06,680 Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean, in so many of these accounts, you're 755 00:43:06,719 --> 00:43:10,160 Speaker 1: dealing with retellings of the thing. And even though even 756 00:43:10,160 --> 00:43:13,760 Speaker 1: though bed was was maybe not too many degrees away 757 00:43:13,800 --> 00:43:17,440 Speaker 1: from from from the actual account, Yeah, it's easy to 758 00:43:17,480 --> 00:43:22,279 Speaker 1: imagine how the story could could be exaggerated, you know, 759 00:43:22,880 --> 00:43:25,799 Speaker 1: the calming of the waters to the overall you know, 760 00:43:25,920 --> 00:43:29,000 Speaker 1: calming of the storm in the same way that perhaps 761 00:43:29,080 --> 00:43:32,000 Speaker 1: an effect that makes the surface of the water more 762 00:43:32,080 --> 00:43:34,080 Speaker 1: like glass so that you can see down into it, 763 00:43:34,440 --> 00:43:38,600 Speaker 1: could I'm and I'm guessing here potentially be you know, 764 00:43:38,719 --> 00:43:43,960 Speaker 1: further exaggerated into making the entire water column illuminated and 765 00:43:44,080 --> 00:43:47,040 Speaker 1: diveable in a way that you can easily find what 766 00:43:47,080 --> 00:43:47,759 Speaker 1: you're looking for. 767 00:43:47,680 --> 00:43:48,240 Speaker 3: In the depths. 768 00:43:49,560 --> 00:43:51,760 Speaker 1: But this is all what I think makes the topic 769 00:43:51,880 --> 00:43:54,880 Speaker 1: so fascinating because it, you know, it seems to be 770 00:43:54,960 --> 00:43:57,919 Speaker 1: this realm where this some it seems on one hand 771 00:43:57,920 --> 00:43:59,960 Speaker 1: that this could not be that this seems like, surely 772 00:44:00,120 --> 00:44:03,480 Speaker 1: this is just fable. But on the other hand, we 773 00:44:03,600 --> 00:44:07,799 Speaker 1: do see you know, some of the science at play here. 774 00:44:07,840 --> 00:44:10,200 Speaker 1: We can see, like why it works at least to 775 00:44:10,239 --> 00:44:13,839 Speaker 1: some degree, so it's it's kind of has a has 776 00:44:13,840 --> 00:44:15,080 Speaker 1: a foot in both worlds. 777 00:44:16,000 --> 00:44:19,400 Speaker 3: Oh yes, I think this has been a delightful ramble 778 00:44:19,440 --> 00:44:21,440 Speaker 3: around the countryside with a bit of oil in our 779 00:44:21,440 --> 00:44:22,320 Speaker 3: bamboo cane. 780 00:44:23,640 --> 00:44:26,120 Speaker 1: Absolutely. All right, Well we're going to go ahead and 781 00:44:26,200 --> 00:44:29,799 Speaker 1: close out this episode and this exploration, but we'll be 782 00:44:29,880 --> 00:44:33,720 Speaker 1: back with more episodes in the future. Here. Core episodes 783 00:44:33,719 --> 00:44:35,560 Speaker 1: of Stuff to Blow Your Mind come out on Tuesdays 784 00:44:35,600 --> 00:44:39,920 Speaker 1: and Thursdays. We have our listener mail episodes on Mondays, 785 00:44:39,920 --> 00:44:43,560 Speaker 1: short form Monster Factor Artifact episode on Wednesdays, and on Fridays, 786 00:44:43,560 --> 00:44:46,080 Speaker 1: we set aside most serious concerns to just talk about 787 00:44:46,080 --> 00:44:49,720 Speaker 1: a weird film on Weird House Cinema. Let's see what 788 00:44:49,840 --> 00:44:52,440 Speaker 1: else do we need to mention? If you're if you 789 00:44:52,480 --> 00:44:54,840 Speaker 1: are a listener in the UK and you're still getting 790 00:44:54,880 --> 00:44:57,960 Speaker 1: these episodes, I don't know how much longer that's gonna 791 00:44:58,280 --> 00:45:01,680 Speaker 1: be the case. So as we've been trying to stress, 792 00:45:02,280 --> 00:45:04,400 Speaker 1: go out there and find the Stuff to Blow your 793 00:45:04,400 --> 00:45:07,840 Speaker 1: Mind UK feed on Apple Podcasts or on Spotify and 794 00:45:07,880 --> 00:45:10,799 Speaker 1: subscribe there. That way you can make sure that you're 795 00:45:10,800 --> 00:45:12,200 Speaker 1: going to keep getting these episodes. 796 00:45:12,560 --> 00:45:14,759 Speaker 3: It's the same thing you get the same episodes as 797 00:45:14,760 --> 00:45:17,759 Speaker 3: published in the other feed. It's just called Stuff to 798 00:45:17,800 --> 00:45:20,400 Speaker 3: Blow your Mind UK. That's all you got to do. 799 00:45:20,520 --> 00:45:22,799 Speaker 3: Just go sign up for that one. Huge thanks to 800 00:45:22,840 --> 00:45:26,120 Speaker 3: our excellent audio producer JJ Posway. 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