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Speaker 1: Alz Media.

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Speaker 2: Hey everyone, Robert Evans here. Earlier this week, we had

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Speaker 2: a one partner on Dracula. Could have been long enough

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Speaker 2: actually for a two part, but I just felt it

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Speaker 2: ran better as a one parter. But this is a

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Speaker 2: holiday week, the most sacred day on my calendar, Halloween,

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Speaker 2: so I'm taking the rest of the week off. So

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Speaker 2: we've decided on Thursday, we're giving you a blast from

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Speaker 2: the past. We're doing a rewind episode and this is

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Speaker 2: our episode on Ediamine from like almost five years ago,

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Speaker 2: I think something like that. It's really a fascinating story.

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Speaker 2: If you're a newer listener, you might have missed it,

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Speaker 2: so check it out. Hello friends, and welcome back to

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Speaker 2: Behind the Bastards. I'm Robert Evans, and this is the

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Speaker 2: show that tells you everything you don't know about the

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Speaker 2: very worst people in all of history. Today. My guest

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Speaker 2: who I will be who's coming in cold with this

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Speaker 2: tale and who I'll be reading a story to is

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Speaker 2: Brody Reid, comedian.

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Speaker 3: Hello, Hey, esteemed guest.

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Speaker 2: I think steamed guest, Yes, yeah, Esquire. Brodie read Esquire.

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Speaker 2: I think means you're the editor for Esquire magazine.

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Speaker 3: Right, I'm a lawyer, and I'm also the headed editor

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Speaker 3: of Esquire magazine. Those are my credits, yea, and I

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Speaker 3: won't change them.

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Speaker 2: That's what that means. Now, we're doing a little bit

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Speaker 2: different today. Normally we're pretty upfront about who the subject

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Speaker 2: of the podcast is, but there's a lot of background

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Speaker 2: to get to before we can really properly introduce this guy. Okay,

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Speaker 2: So I'm kind of curious as to when you figure

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Speaker 2: out who we're talking about, and I also kind of

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Speaker 2: want it to be a little bit of a surprise

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Speaker 2: for the audience. So okay, if you're good, I'm just

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Speaker 2: going to get into it.

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Speaker 3: Okay. I mean, I'm kind of like an amateur private investigator,

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Speaker 3: so I might get it real off the bat, and

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Speaker 3: I want to ruin your flow or anything. But let's

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Speaker 3: let's try.

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Speaker 2: All right, let's se let's let's see how this goes.

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Speaker 3: Time on the clock.

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Speaker 2: Maybe this will be you know, my, my, my great disaster, but.

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Speaker 3: I think it'll be fun.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, all right, so today you know, right now twenty eighteen,

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Speaker 2: Britain is a tiny, adorable nation filled with wizards and

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Speaker 2: a conspicuously broad definition of the word pudding. It's easy.

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Speaker 3: I'm going to guess Valdemort.

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Speaker 2: No, no, no, I'm just getting it that it's easy

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Speaker 2: for us to forget today considering how docile the British

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Speaker 2: people are, that for a while they ruled the entire world.

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Speaker 2: The British Empire was the largest empire in human history.

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Speaker 2: The Mongol Empire at its height held about twenty four

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Speaker 2: million kilometers in area, sixteen percent of the world's population.

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Speaker 2: The British Empire was over thirty five million kilometers in

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Speaker 2: area and ruled nearly a quarter of the planets.

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Speaker 3: Trust me, I did not forget that they colonized everything.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, and they I think what's most shocking to me

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Speaker 2: when I read about this is that they controlled that

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Speaker 2: huge chunk of the planet with probably the smallest army

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Speaker 2: than any empire has ever had. You know, the Roman

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Speaker 2: Empire at its height was about seven hundred and fifty

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Speaker 2: thousand regular soldiers. The British Empire at its you know

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Speaker 2: height before the World War started, was about one hundred

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Speaker 2: and twenty thousand British soldiers. They never spent more than

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Speaker 2: about two and a half percent of their GDP on defense.

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Speaker 3: Wow, which is as a regular soldiers were like super

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Speaker 3: serum like Captain America soldier.

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Speaker 2: So you have predicted a little bit where this is going. Now,

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Speaker 2: these soldiers are regular soldiers. They're volunteers, which is different

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Speaker 2: from most Most militaries in this period are not volunteer,

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Speaker 2: permanent standing military. So the British are a little bit

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Speaker 2: different there. But they're just normal, you know, soldiers. They

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Speaker 2: have machine guns, which certainly helps with the whole colonizing thing,

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Speaker 2: or they have machine guns for a chunk of this.

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Speaker 2: But you know, it does beg the question when you've

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Speaker 2: only got one hundred and twenty thousand guys and for

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Speaker 2: most of the British Empire they don't have machine guns,

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Speaker 2: how do you hold a quarter of the planet in

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Speaker 2: bondage for two hundred years with the whole army that's

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Speaker 2: a little larger than the modern Coast Guard in the

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Speaker 2: United States nukes?

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Speaker 3: Is that not the correct? No?

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Speaker 2: No, no, I mean you get the locals to oppress themselves.

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Speaker 3: Oh yeah, that's my second guy. Yeah.

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Speaker 2: So Michael Codner, who was the head of Military science

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Speaker 2: for the Royal United Services Institute, described the British Empire's

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Speaker 2: military is essentially quote the Royal Navy and a system

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Speaker 2: of indigenous constabularies overseen by a small but professional British army.

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Speaker 2: Now I found that quote in the BBC article from

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Speaker 2: back in twenty eleven. The article also quoted a military

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Speaker 2: historian named doctor Hugh Davies, who noted that all of

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Speaker 2: British India was controlled by just thirty thousand British troops

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Speaker 2: supervising hundreds of thousands of local Indian soldiers or sepoys.

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Speaker 2: He was quoted as saying, the empire had to pay

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Speaker 2: for itself, and it had to be profitable, and if

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Speaker 2: you put too much into building up the army, the

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Speaker 2: empire is no longer a profitable enterprise.

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Speaker 3: He sounds like the a rap mogul. Yeah, so that

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Speaker 3: sentence sounds and has a build itself.

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Speaker 2: In his defense, I don't think he's justifying imperialism. I

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Speaker 2: think he's just explained this was the attitude that the

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Speaker 2: imperialists had is we can't spend too much money on

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Speaker 2: the army. Otherwise. Yeah, everything is for profits exact, And

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Speaker 2: British India was conquered in the first place by a

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Speaker 2: for profit corporation, the East India Trading Company. The East

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Speaker 2: India Company had a private army of over a quarter

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Speaker 2: of a million men.

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Speaker 3: Wow.

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Speaker 2: Most of those were indigenous soldiers. So you know, local Indians,

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Speaker 2: people from Burma, whatever.

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Speaker 3: That's great local jobs.

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Speaker 2: Yeah no, yeah, exactly by local, very ethical with our

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Speaker 2: modern as a job creator.

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Speaker 3: Yeah.

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Speaker 2: Yeah. So the East India companies started taking over India

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Speaker 2: in the sixteen hundreds and by eighteen oh three they

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Speaker 2: controlled most of what's now India, Pakistan, and Burma. In

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Speaker 2: eighteen fourteen, this giant multinational corporation declared war on Nepal,

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Speaker 2: which was at that point known as the Kingdom of Gorka.

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Speaker 2: They fought for two brutal years before the kingdom seated

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Speaker 2: a third of its territory to the company in exchange

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Speaker 2: for peace. The British won, but the Gorkas had put

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Speaker 2: up a really vicious fight, and the East India Company

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Speaker 2: was impressed by their warriors, so they started recruiting these

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Speaker 2: men into their army. At first, these Gurkhas were used

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Speaker 2: to keep the peace in ever rebellious India, but the

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Speaker 2: Gurkhas quickly proved themselves to be very capable warriors. In

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Speaker 2: eighteen fifty eight, when the Queen formally took control of

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Speaker 2: India away from the company, Gurkhas were integrated into the

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Speaker 2: Greater British Army. They served as elite shock troops in

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Speaker 2: World War One and two. The British Army today still

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Speaker 2: fields battalions of Gurkis recruited basically as mercenaries from Nepal

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Speaker 2: and paid far less than their British citizens counterpart.

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Speaker 3: This sounds like Game of the rounds. This sounds like

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Speaker 3: some unsullied.

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Speaker 2: It's a little bit like that.

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Speaker 3: Now.

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Speaker 2: The British like the Gurkhas because they were loyal and

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Speaker 2: just incredibly deadly. They carry these big knives called kukries

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Speaker 2: in there. There's a lot of if you go online,

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Speaker 2: you can find threads today where British veterans talk about

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Speaker 2: the stories their NCOs told about Gurkhas and like there's

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Speaker 2: a common one where you have to tie your shoes

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Speaker 2: a certain way, okay, because the Gurkhas cut your foot off. Well. No,

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Speaker 2: when they're doing espionage missions in the night, they'll tell

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Speaker 2: who they want to kill by feeling their bootlaces. They

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Speaker 2: could tell like in World War Two they knew what

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Speaker 2: German bootlaces felt like, and so if an Allied soldier

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Speaker 2: took boots off of a dead German he might get

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Speaker 2: cut by a Girka like that. It's a possibly apocryphal story,

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Speaker 2: the variants of it are still told today.

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Speaker 3: So they'll kill you if you tie your shoes.

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Speaker 2: Wrong, essentially, if you tie your shoes like the enemy.

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Speaker 3: Yeah I heard that. Yeah.

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Speaker 2: So the Gurkhas were like super soldiers of the British

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Speaker 2: Empire of what you were getting at.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, they sound like sword guys to me. Yeah, the

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Speaker 3: knives equally.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, they're scary and they weren't the only super soldiers

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Speaker 2: in the British Empire. Over their period of time conquering

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Speaker 2: huge chunks of the world, the British encountered a number

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Speaker 2: of warrior peoples. Some of these peoples, like the Gurkhas,

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Speaker 2: had their own well developed warrior culture already when the

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Speaker 2: British arrived, and the British just exploited it. But in

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Speaker 2: other parts of the world the process occurred less naturally.

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Speaker 2: Take the tribes of the West Nile region of Africa.

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Speaker 2: Their first contact with more technologically advanced peoples came in

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Speaker 2: the early eighteen hundreds, when successive groups of Arab slavers

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Speaker 2: started preying on them. Certain tribes who were the best

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Speaker 2: fighters were enslaved by these Arab slavers and used as

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Speaker 2: soldiers to capture other Africans who were then sent off

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Speaker 2: to markets in North Africa and the Middle East.

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Speaker 3: Sad.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, it's a bumber. This whole story is going

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Speaker 2: to be kind of a bomber. Oh great, when you're

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Speaker 2: talking colonialism, it's never not a heartbreak.

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Speaker 3: I mean, when aren't you talking colonialism? If we want

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Speaker 3: to get real.

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Speaker 2: Well, I mean, and that's one of the point, Like

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Speaker 2: when you start talking about dictators, especially from the seventies, eighties, nineties,

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Speaker 2: you can trace nearly all of them back to colonialism.

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Speaker 3: Oh yeah, for sure.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, that's that's more or less this story. So by

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Speaker 2: the eighteen seventies, the British had become abolitionists in a

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Speaker 2: big way, perhaps because they felt kind of bad about,

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Speaker 2: you know, the whole Atlantic slave trade thing, but mostly

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Speaker 2: because it was a way to justify conquering colonies in Africa,

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Speaker 2: saying we're going to stop the Arab slave traders, but

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Speaker 2: we have to conquer this whole chunk of Africa in

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Speaker 2: order to stop the slave trade. Right way to do it.

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Speaker 3: They're a good guy with the gun mm hmm, with

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Speaker 3: a lot with all the with a lot of mascots. Yeah.

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Speaker 2: So the British took over a huge chunk of North Africa,

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Speaker 2: including the Sudan, and with public pressure behind them, they

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Speaker 2: sent armies down to stop the slave traders. These armies,

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Speaker 2: like all British armies, were made mostly of locals. Many

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Speaker 2: of those locals were recently freed slave soldiers that the

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Speaker 2: British were happy to induct into their army. So they

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Speaker 2: would free these slave soldiers from the Arab slave traders

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Speaker 2: and then they would induct them into a colonial military

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Speaker 2: and use them to fight slave traders.

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Speaker 3: Yeah sounds like college sounds like the job market.

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Speaker 2: I thought you were going to compare this like college football,

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Speaker 2: but well, yeah, that's too absolutely.

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Speaker 3: So.

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Speaker 2: One such army of former slaves was headed by a

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Speaker 2: German doctor and a Muslim convert named Emin Pasha. In

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Speaker 2: the eighteen eighties, m and Pasha and his army were

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Speaker 2: besieged by an Islamic army during the Modest Insurrection. They

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Speaker 2: were eventually freed by a guy named Henry Morton Stanley,

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Speaker 2: who regular listeners of the podcast will recognize as the

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Speaker 2: guy who mapped the Congo for King Leopold of Belgium.

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Speaker 2: Stanley took Pasha with him when he left, and Pasha's

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Speaker 2: men stayed behind in the West Nile region on garrison

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Speaker 2: duty for a few years until they were picked up

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Speaker 2: by agents for the Imperial British East Africa Company. Now

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Speaker 2: the company representatives were always alert for new warrior people

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Speaker 2: to enlist, and they considered these men to be quote

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Speaker 2: the best material for soldiery in Africa. These tribes came

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Speaker 2: to be called Nubi or Nubians and became the British

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Speaker 2: Empire's shock troopers in Africa. The East Africa Company used

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Speaker 2: their Nubians to carve an empire out of the continent

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Speaker 2: heart They named their new colony Uganda. As the British

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Speaker 2: Empire grew, the Nubians were inducted into their regular British

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Speaker 2: army and became the elite fourth Battalion of the King's

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Speaker 2: African Rifles. They were Muslims, which differentiated them from most

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Speaker 2: of the peoples they were sent to suppress in Central

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Speaker 2: and West Africa. The British basically turned the Nubian people

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Speaker 2: into a living, breathing factory for the production of the

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Speaker 2: deadliest colonial soldiers in Africa and yes being bred for

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Speaker 2: war had a negative impact on the Nubians themselves. Here's

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Speaker 2: what one former commanding officer of the King's African Rifles

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Speaker 2: wrote about them. Quote, the Nubians became the most feared

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Speaker 2: and influential ethnic group in Uganda, mercilessly suppressing uprisings and

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Speaker 2: tribal sippruts at the behest of their British masters. It

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Speaker 2: was the success of these early operations that gave them

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Speaker 2: contempt for all pagan and Christian tribes in the country.

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Speaker 2: In nineteen seventy four, a journalist named David martinek of

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Speaker 2: this sentiment. Quote. Among their fellow countrymen, they enjoyed an

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Speaker 2: unenviable reputation of having one of the world's highest homicide rates.

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Speaker 2: The Nubians were renowned for their statistic brutality, lack of

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Speaker 2: formal education for poor enemies, and for the refusal to

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Speaker 2: integrate even in the urban centers. Martin was in Uganda

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Speaker 2: to write about one Nubian in particular, one of the

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Speaker 2: deadliest warriors to ever serve in the King's African Rifles,

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Speaker 2: a man named Idiot.

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Speaker 3: I mean, okay, wow, okay, So that's these guys sound

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Speaker 3: like black Republicans. To me, guys are on the wrong team.

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Speaker 2: I mean they're like did they ever have a choice,

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Speaker 2: Like no, yeah, exactly.

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Speaker 3: You're right.

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Speaker 2: If you recruited people as soldiers for one hundred years

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Speaker 2: and don't really give them any other options for anything

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Speaker 2: to do, it's it's not going to be pretty.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I hear that. I mean I grew up in

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Speaker 3: a bad neighborhood also, but I didn't become a tough warrior.

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Speaker 3: I just became a comedian with a smart mouth.

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Speaker 2: I'm sure there were a few Nubian comedians and that

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Speaker 2: like part of the difficulty here is like all these

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Speaker 2: stories about how brutal they are coming from like British

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Speaker 2: and American white guys.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, totally, they're probably just like pretty cool. They're probably

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Speaker 3: just like, I don't know, trying to event whatever a

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Speaker 3: sports game that they had. I'm trying to play some

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Speaker 3: football and they were like, well, these guys are brutal.

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Speaker 3: They're kicking our ass.

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Speaker 2: Well, I mean it's like British football, so yeah, for sure,

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Speaker 2: can it be?

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Speaker 3: I mean I feel like if Colinizers came over to

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Speaker 3: Africa and then the Africans just like dunked a basketball,

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Speaker 3: they'd be like, whoa, he's brutal power.

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Speaker 2: It's a shame of basketball. Get over there first, now

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Speaker 2: I know. So Idiomine was born sometime between nineteen twenty

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Speaker 2: five and nineteen twenty eight. We don't really know for sure.

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Speaker 2: He was probably born in the village of Koboco in

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Speaker 2: northwest Uganda. He was for sure a Kakwaw, which were

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Speaker 2: one of the Nubian tribes that British considered to be

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Speaker 2: a warrior people. Now Iddy's father served with the British Army,

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Speaker 2: the King's African Rifles, and was generally out of the picture.

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Speaker 2: His mother is usually described as a witch or a

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Speaker 2: self proclaimed sorceress. I watched a documentary when I was

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Speaker 2: sort of prepping for this thing that was called, I mean,

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Speaker 2: The Rise and Fall, and it was it was a

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Speaker 2: terrible documentary, one of those like nineties made for TV

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Speaker 2: movies where all the acting's bad and it's very sensational,

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Speaker 2: super biased, and it leans into the stuff that I

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Speaker 2: think what most people have heard about Idiomine, which was

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Speaker 2: like witchcraft, cannibalism, that sort of thing, which we'll be

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Speaker 2: we'll be talking about a little bit later.

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Speaker 3: But is uh, I mean that just sounds like Los

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Speaker 3: Angeles culture, witchcraft, astrology, and the veganism not much, not

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Speaker 3: so much cannibalism.

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Speaker 2: Yeah yeah, yeah, veganisms. Yeah, a better ism than day.

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Speaker 2: But we're we're going to get into, uh sort of

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Speaker 2: how a lot of these facts are unreliable about Iddie.

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Speaker 2: But the way that this terrible documentary summed up Idy's

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Speaker 2: childhood I found humorous, which is the child grew up

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Speaker 2: by the river learning the ways of manhood and the

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Speaker 2: spells of witchcraft, which that sort of sums up I

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Speaker 2: think the general common popular perception of who this guy was.

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Speaker 2: It sounds like a fished a lot boy. Yeah, there's

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Speaker 2: all there's gonna be a lot of dark stories about rivers.

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Speaker 2: Whenever you read about.

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Speaker 3: The scary Yeah, how did the ocean get to the

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Speaker 3: land that way?

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Speaker 2: Yeah, it's one of those Like anytime you read about

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Speaker 2: a place with that's like famous for its rivers and

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Speaker 2: they have some sort of like horrible butchery happen, there's

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Speaker 2: just always tons of stories about kids finding heads in

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Speaker 2: the rivers. We were just in the Cambodia when it

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Speaker 2: was the same thing.

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Speaker 3: Just like I mean, you find all kinds of weird

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Speaker 3: stuff in there.

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Speaker 2: Yeah tbh. So, yeah, the witchcraft stuffed is almost certainly

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Speaker 2: racist bullshit. What witchcraft was and is still common in

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Speaker 2: parts of Uganda, I mean, was a practicing Muslim. You

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Speaker 2: Gandan Muslims had their own kind of witchcrafty tradition where

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Speaker 2: people would use the Koran to foretell the future, and

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Speaker 2: he certainly used that, but he wasn't doing like pagan

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Speaker 2: blood magic or anything like that.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, all of this sounds like astrology so far.

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Speaker 2: What was the sign?

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Speaker 3: Doesn't it say?

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Speaker 2: Well, it was like in the Islamic version of astrology, Okay,

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Speaker 2: but I don't know, probably Aquarius. Yeah, witchcraft was less

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Speaker 2: of a factor in his regime than the tradition and

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Speaker 2: rituals of his beloved British Army, so Itdy was eventually

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Speaker 2: abandoned by his father and by some accounts his mother too.

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Speaker 2: It's kind of hard to tell what happened there. He

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Speaker 2: got as far as the fourth grade before he dropped

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Speaker 2: out of school. When he was at most seventeen, a

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Speaker 2: British Colonial Army officer noted his tremendous size and recruited

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Speaker 2: him into the King's African Rifles. He started his service

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Speaker 2: as a cook's assistant literally peeling potatoes, which is like

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Speaker 2: the stereotypical bottom of the wrong Army.

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Speaker 3: John. But it seems like if you're big that you

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Speaker 3: shouldn't be a rifleman. We're gonna make you target. Go ahead.

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Speaker 2: You're a pragmatic man, Yeah.

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Speaker 3: I mean, I would only recruit the little guys, the

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Speaker 3: most beard army.

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Speaker 2: Ever, he didn't stay at the bottom long it. He

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Speaker 2: was gigantic. He was like six foot four, well over

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Speaker 2: two hundred pounds, and he was in his younger days.

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Speaker 2: He gets kind of heavier as an older guy, but

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Speaker 2: like you go get picturement and he's young. He is

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Speaker 2: solid muscle. He's just a mountain of a man. Yeah,

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Speaker 2: me too.

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Speaker 3: He's got about three inches and that's about it.

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Speaker 2: So he was perfect candidate to become a heavyweight boxer,

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Speaker 2: which is exactly what happened. According to Robert Keeley, deputy

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Speaker 2: chief of the US Mission in Campaula, quote, his advancements

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Speaker 2: came essentially through boxing. He was very tall, with a

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Speaker 2: tremendous reach in big hands. He was big and strong

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Speaker 2: and tough. In general. You could picture him in any

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Speaker 2: culture as a heavyweight champion, and that's what he was.

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Speaker 2: The Ugandans are very fine boxers. They still prove it

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Speaker 2: to this day in the Olympics. They have a strong

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Speaker 2: boxing tradition which the British encouraged. The main avenue for

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Speaker 2: advancement in the army was boxing, so Amin eventually became

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Speaker 2: the heavyweight champion of the Army and in nineteen fifty

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Speaker 2: one to fifty two the heavyweight champion of all Uganda.

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Speaker 2: His ability to punch people proved useful in maintaining discipline

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Speaker 2: among other soldiers in his unit. Here's another quote from Keighley.

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Speaker 2: Idiomin became prominent as the link between the two. The

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Speaker 2: officers sitting around sipping their tea or their brandy or

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Speaker 2: their port, upon hearing some noises and disruptions outside, would

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Speaker 2: call in Sergeant Amine and tell him to take care

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Speaker 2: of the problem. I mean, goes out. There are some

368
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Speaker 2: shouts and screams as he knocks him heads together and

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Speaker 2: kicks some butt, and then silence. The officers resume their

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Speaker 2: sipping and a very appreciate performance. They eventually made him

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Speaker 2: the top sergeant. Wow okay, because of course sergeant was

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Speaker 2: as high as an actual African could raise in the

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Speaker 2: King's African Rifles. We're not allowed to have any Africans

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Speaker 2: be officers in any of the British colonial armies the world,

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Speaker 2: or I think in India for that matter, which is

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Speaker 2: you know, if you're a racist colonial power, you don't

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Speaker 2: want anybody in your army. You can't have like you've

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Speaker 2: got to recruit soldiers from the locals, but you don't

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Speaker 2: want them learning about supply lines and logistics and stuff.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, good point.

381
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Speaker 2: Yeah, then they'll know how to you know, overthrow the

382
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Speaker 2: seven guys that you have there.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, that's why I haven't been promoted to any officer ranks.

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Speaker 2: I mean, how's your boxing?

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Speaker 3: I mean very very, very bad. But if we're talking

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Speaker 3: about a wee game, then still very bad.

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Speaker 2: So we need an army where yet where we as

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Speaker 2: the product? I mean with drones nowadays, that's that's the future.

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Speaker 2: I feel like that's the future drone box.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I hear you.

391
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Speaker 2: So he was the perfect soldier for the British Empire.

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Speaker 2: Everyone who served with him in those days was impressed

393
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Speaker 2: both by his toughness and by his almost superhuman strength.

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Speaker 2: His commanding officer, Ian Graham, said that his body was

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Speaker 2: quote like that of a Grecian sculpture during one terrible march,

396
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Speaker 2: when all of the other men could barely continue. Quote,

397
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Speaker 2: one man was an example and an inspiration to us all.

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Speaker 2: As we finally passed the finishing post, Idioman was marching

399
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Speaker 2: beside me at the head of the column, head held

400
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Speaker 2: high and still singing for all he was worth. Across

401
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Speaker 2: one shoulder were two brin guns, And a brin is

402
00:18:37,200 --> 00:18:39,639
Speaker 2: like a machine gun. It's like a twenty two pound

403
00:18:40,000 --> 00:18:42,960
Speaker 2: like machine gun that you put on a tripod on

404
00:18:43,000 --> 00:18:44,320
Speaker 2: the ground. So he with two of those in one

405
00:18:44,359 --> 00:18:46,919
Speaker 2: hand and over the other was a crippled ascari. And

406
00:18:46,960 --> 00:18:49,600
Speaker 2: the askari was a British word for like a local soldier.

407
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Speaker 2: So he had one of his wounded comrades on one

408
00:18:51,720 --> 00:18:55,080
Speaker 2: arm and two machine guns on the other. That's like

409
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Speaker 2: the kind of soldier he made. He was just he

410
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Speaker 2: was like he was a super so man.

411
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Speaker 3: He invented CrossFit. Apparently this guy's some Joe Rogan alpha

412
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Speaker 3: brim kind of guy.

413
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Speaker 2: Now. Ian Graham said that seeing this reminded him of

414
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Speaker 2: a translation of another of a King's African Rifles marching song.

415
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Speaker 2: I'm about to read you the song, which is explained

416
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Speaker 2: sort of how the British viewed men no singing. Oh boy,

417
00:19:20,760 --> 00:19:23,920
Speaker 2: that's I think I can do a good British accent here,

418
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Speaker 2: but I don't know that I can sing again. It

419
00:19:28,480 --> 00:19:31,800
Speaker 2: does pressed, It definitely rhymes, and it's a bit racist.

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Speaker 2: Now for this, you know, you need to understand the

421
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Speaker 2: word Sudi is another word for Nubian, like it's like

422
00:19:37,840 --> 00:19:40,159
Speaker 2: a local term for like people who are from his

423
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Speaker 2: group of Ugandans. So here's the British fighting song that

424
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Speaker 2: this guy thought of when he saw idiot mean marching.

425
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Speaker 2: It's the Sudi, my boy, it's the Sudi with his

426
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Speaker 2: grim set, ugly face, but he looks like a man,

427
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Speaker 2: and he fights like a man, for he comes of

428
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Speaker 2: a fighting race. Which that's exactly what these people were

429
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Speaker 2: to the British. Is the whole art. So I assumed

430
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Speaker 2: there was more, But this was the lion that this

431
00:20:02,960 --> 00:20:05,560
Speaker 2: guy recalled, which is like it shows you exactly what

432
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Speaker 2: the British thought of these guys. Is that they are soldiers.

433
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Speaker 2: That's why, and that's what they were bred for and

434
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Speaker 2: encouraged for. And they didn't have to do people of

435
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Speaker 2: like the coquit tribe didn't have to do anything other

436
00:20:15,640 --> 00:20:17,800
Speaker 2: than send their sons to fight for the British army

437
00:20:17,840 --> 00:20:19,200
Speaker 2: and the British would take care of them.

438
00:20:19,280 --> 00:20:21,679
Speaker 3: And did they respond with their own distract or?

439
00:20:22,840 --> 00:20:25,159
Speaker 2: I know how these people press as a distrack at

440
00:20:25,200 --> 00:20:28,800
Speaker 2: that point, that's too bad, Yeah it is, and it

441
00:20:28,840 --> 00:20:31,879
Speaker 2: gets yeah, it gets better. So young a Man was

442
00:20:31,880 --> 00:20:34,000
Speaker 2: sent to war several times on behalf of the British Empire.

443
00:20:34,040 --> 00:20:36,360
Speaker 2: In nineteen forty nine he went to Somalia to suppress

444
00:20:36,400 --> 00:20:39,360
Speaker 2: the shift of rebellion. In nineteen fifty two he sent

445
00:20:39,400 --> 00:20:42,360
Speaker 2: to Kenya to suppress the Mau Mau uprising. We don't

446
00:20:42,359 --> 00:20:44,720
Speaker 2: talk about the Mau Mau uprising a lot these days,

447
00:20:44,720 --> 00:20:46,720
Speaker 2: but it basically started as a bunch of Kenyan rebels

448
00:20:46,720 --> 00:20:49,400
Speaker 2: who were angry because the British were whipping people half

449
00:20:49,400 --> 00:20:51,639
Speaker 2: to death, which that's how British kept discipline and all

450
00:20:51,640 --> 00:20:56,280
Speaker 2: their African colonies. Was just horrific amounts of whipping. So

451
00:20:56,320 --> 00:20:58,960
Speaker 2: these guys rose up and they killed some British people,

452
00:20:59,000 --> 00:21:01,560
Speaker 2: and the British sin an army and brutally suppressed it.

453
00:21:01,600 --> 00:21:03,560
Speaker 2: They put more than one and a half million kenyons

454
00:21:03,560 --> 00:21:07,560
Speaker 2: and concentration camps, they hanged thousands of them. Edie probably

455
00:21:07,560 --> 00:21:09,600
Speaker 2: would have been doing a good amount of the hanging,

456
00:21:10,920 --> 00:21:13,200
Speaker 2: and he also killed a number of warriors and vicious

457
00:21:13,240 --> 00:21:15,959
Speaker 2: battles in places like Kenyoma and Kangheema. So he's been

458
00:21:16,080 --> 00:21:19,280
Speaker 2: raised just as a soldier and now he's been brutalized

459
00:21:19,480 --> 00:21:23,680
Speaker 2: suppressing multiple colonial wars very violently.

460
00:21:24,000 --> 00:21:28,040
Speaker 3: Man, successful black man, and then he just turned around

461
00:21:28,359 --> 00:21:31,719
Speaker 3: and betrays his culture. Classic story.

462
00:21:32,000 --> 00:21:34,520
Speaker 2: I mean, he kind of starts with the betrayal. Right,

463
00:21:34,720 --> 00:21:38,440
Speaker 2: yea many later, Well we'll get to later right now.

464
00:21:38,480 --> 00:21:40,920
Speaker 3: Actually, oh ma'am is more okay, correct, there's a lot.

465
00:21:41,480 --> 00:21:43,320
Speaker 2: So by the late nineteen fifties, Idy had risen as

466
00:21:43,400 --> 00:21:45,600
Speaker 2: high as an African could and the King's African Rifles,

467
00:21:46,080 --> 00:21:48,280
Speaker 2: which is sergeant. The British, yeah, as I said, didn't

468
00:21:48,359 --> 00:21:51,880
Speaker 2: let their locals be officers in their armies. This policy

469
00:21:51,920 --> 00:21:53,280
Speaker 2: came back to bite them in the ass in the

470
00:21:53,359 --> 00:21:55,600
Speaker 2: late fifties because by that point it had become clear

471
00:21:55,600 --> 00:21:58,160
Speaker 2: that colonialism was on its way out. The British were

472
00:21:58,160 --> 00:22:01,960
Speaker 2: preparing to release Uganda as an independent nation. Unfortunately, the

473
00:22:01,960 --> 00:22:04,600
Speaker 2: British hadn't governed any of their colonies as countries. They

474
00:22:04,600 --> 00:22:08,280
Speaker 2: basically just treated them as money making enterprises, corporations. Essentially

475
00:22:08,320 --> 00:22:10,359
Speaker 2: with all the business of state craft kept out of

476
00:22:10,359 --> 00:22:13,280
Speaker 2: the hands of the locals. The British were required by

477
00:22:13,320 --> 00:22:16,920
Speaker 2: international the international community to leave Uganda with an army

478
00:22:16,960 --> 00:22:19,920
Speaker 2: so it could defend itself, but they hadn't trained any

479
00:22:19,960 --> 00:22:23,040
Speaker 2: sort of officer corps into Uganda, which is an important

480
00:22:23,040 --> 00:22:25,119
Speaker 2: thing to have, which is why every military in the

481
00:22:25,119 --> 00:22:28,280
Speaker 2: world has an officer corps. You know, you train people

482
00:22:28,320 --> 00:22:31,479
Speaker 2: to do certain jobs. But the Ugandans just didn't have that,

483
00:22:31,920 --> 00:22:34,040
Speaker 2: and rather than spend more money in time to build

484
00:22:34,080 --> 00:22:36,399
Speaker 2: an officer corps for there soon to be country, the

485
00:22:36,440 --> 00:22:39,520
Speaker 2: British just randomly promoted the sergeants they liked best. One

486
00:22:39,520 --> 00:22:41,600
Speaker 2: of those sergeants was a boxer with a fourth grade

487
00:22:41,680 --> 00:22:42,600
Speaker 2: education named Idi.

488
00:22:42,680 --> 00:22:44,280
Speaker 3: I mean, is it okay? Cool?

489
00:22:44,440 --> 00:22:47,160
Speaker 2: Yeah? He was commissioned in nineteen sixty two, right before

490
00:22:47,240 --> 00:22:49,800
Speaker 2: uganda independence. He found himself in charge of a platoon

491
00:22:49,880 --> 00:22:53,200
Speaker 2: in northwest Kenya, captured a bunch of prisoners and ordered

492
00:22:53,240 --> 00:22:55,760
Speaker 2: them to be executed. The British governor of Uganda, Sir

493
00:22:55,800 --> 00:22:58,639
Speaker 2: Walter Coates, vetoed the possibility of Idy being charged for

494
00:22:58,680 --> 00:23:01,600
Speaker 2: this war crime. Was one of the few African soldiers

495
00:23:01,600 --> 00:23:04,320
Speaker 2: in the entire officers in the entire army and prosecuting

496
00:23:04,359 --> 00:23:07,919
Speaker 2: him right before independence was deemed politically undesirable. No one

497
00:23:07,920 --> 00:23:09,880
Speaker 2: stopped to consider whether or not it might be bad

498
00:23:09,880 --> 00:23:12,320
Speaker 2: for Uganda if one of their high ranking military leaders

499
00:23:12,320 --> 00:23:15,520
Speaker 2: was a war criminal. Okay, So when we get back,

500
00:23:15,520 --> 00:23:19,720
Speaker 2: we're going to get into how Idiomine rose to power

501
00:23:19,880 --> 00:23:23,720
Speaker 2: and to be the president of Uganda and what happened next,

502
00:23:24,119 --> 00:23:27,720
Speaker 2: which it's going to be a dark story, but we

503
00:23:28,080 --> 00:23:31,800
Speaker 2: have we have some ads first off, and before we

504
00:23:31,840 --> 00:23:34,760
Speaker 2: get into some ads, you know, I've been talking a

505
00:23:34,760 --> 00:23:37,000
Speaker 2: lot about the Dorito's people. We're trying to get Doritos

506
00:23:37,040 --> 00:23:37,919
Speaker 2: to sponsor the podcast.

507
00:23:37,920 --> 00:23:39,760
Speaker 3: Oh I hear you. I love that crunchy crown show

508
00:23:39,840 --> 00:23:41,840
Speaker 3: that the Rito's.

509
00:23:41,480 --> 00:23:45,000
Speaker 2: Chip nothing washes the horrible taste of colonialism out of

510
00:23:45,040 --> 00:23:50,360
Speaker 2: your mouth like a cool ranch. I was gonna say

511
00:23:50,400 --> 00:23:53,480
Speaker 2: nacho cheese. But that's what's great about Dorito's is freedom,

512
00:23:54,240 --> 00:23:58,200
Speaker 2: the freedom to cleanse your palate with whatever exciting flavor

513
00:23:58,240 --> 00:23:59,200
Speaker 2: combination you want.

514
00:23:59,240 --> 00:24:00,600
Speaker 3: How are they not as sponsor yet?

515
00:24:00,720 --> 00:24:03,800
Speaker 2: I well, maybe they will be after this video. Let's

516
00:24:03,840 --> 00:24:13,000
Speaker 2: hear from some other sponsors and we're back. Sorry was

517
00:24:13,040 --> 00:24:21,080
Speaker 2: that so? Yeah? I did want to get into before

518
00:24:21,119 --> 00:24:22,800
Speaker 2: we dig into the rest of the story. What you

519
00:24:22,920 --> 00:24:27,240
Speaker 2: recall about idiomin before we get into his career. Not much.

520
00:24:27,640 --> 00:24:30,399
Speaker 3: I have heard the name before. I've heard that he

521
00:24:30,440 --> 00:24:32,880
Speaker 3: was a president of Uganda, who's a bad guy. I

522
00:24:32,920 --> 00:24:36,280
Speaker 3: don't know the details. I mean already, I've learned way

523
00:24:36,320 --> 00:24:41,480
Speaker 3: more than I thought. Yeah, before you know, it was

524
00:24:41,560 --> 00:24:45,040
Speaker 3: even it even became an independent nation. I didn't realize that.

525
00:24:45,760 --> 00:24:47,919
Speaker 3: You know, they killed so many people.

526
00:24:48,600 --> 00:24:51,120
Speaker 2: Yeah, well, it was one of those things I had.

527
00:24:51,320 --> 00:24:53,680
Speaker 2: I had vaguely heard yet he was president of Uganda.

528
00:24:53,720 --> 00:24:57,080
Speaker 2: There were these rumors of witchcraft and cannibalism. I hadn't

529
00:24:57,119 --> 00:24:59,639
Speaker 2: known any of this stuff about sort of how the

530
00:24:59,680 --> 00:25:02,440
Speaker 2: British military worked at the time, and the fact that

531
00:25:02,560 --> 00:25:07,280
Speaker 2: he was basically bred to suppress insurgencies, Like that's what

532
00:25:07,320 --> 00:25:12,320
Speaker 2: the British used his people for, was controlling populations through brutality,

533
00:25:13,480 --> 00:25:15,840
Speaker 2: which I think is an important thing to get into here,

534
00:25:15,880 --> 00:25:19,119
Speaker 2: because otherwise it's just a story of like this dictator.

535
00:25:19,119 --> 00:25:21,000
Speaker 2: But he didn't rise up out of anything. He was

536
00:25:21,080 --> 00:25:24,320
Speaker 2: like and I think he went up the system. He

537
00:25:24,359 --> 00:25:28,160
Speaker 2: paid his dues, and he was also trained, like you're

538
00:25:28,160 --> 00:25:29,800
Speaker 2: going to when we get into the things he did

539
00:25:29,800 --> 00:25:32,280
Speaker 2: in Uganda that were brutal. They're all echoes of things

540
00:25:32,320 --> 00:25:35,760
Speaker 2: he was doing for the British, like they like, it's

541
00:25:35,800 --> 00:25:40,000
Speaker 2: it's not just a story of like some horrible dictator

542
00:25:40,080 --> 00:25:43,440
Speaker 2: rose up and did terrible things. It's the British trained

543
00:25:43,480 --> 00:25:45,679
Speaker 2: this guy to do terrible things on their behalf and

544
00:25:45,680 --> 00:25:47,760
Speaker 2: then abandoned the country of Uganda to him.

545
00:25:48,080 --> 00:25:51,600
Speaker 3: Yeah, this is basically this guy's completely might meets right

546
00:25:51,800 --> 00:25:53,679
Speaker 3: and yeah, that's dangerous.

547
00:25:53,840 --> 00:25:58,280
Speaker 2: It's really dangerous, and it's dangerous if you don't like.

548
00:25:58,880 --> 00:26:00,840
Speaker 2: People like that exist in every culture. We've got more

549
00:26:00,880 --> 00:26:02,719
Speaker 2: than our fair share of them in the United States.

550
00:26:03,040 --> 00:26:06,239
Speaker 2: We have a we have structures built up to like

551
00:26:06,320 --> 00:26:08,520
Speaker 2: make sure that those people don't wind up in charge

552
00:26:08,520 --> 00:26:12,480
Speaker 2: of the military or whatever. Like, yeah, at least not

553
00:26:12,600 --> 00:26:16,200
Speaker 2: to the extent where it's like, there's a reason we've

554
00:26:16,200 --> 00:26:21,080
Speaker 2: never had the army seize power like it's in our country. Yeah,

555
00:26:21,119 --> 00:26:22,280
Speaker 2: we've definitely.

556
00:26:22,440 --> 00:26:25,359
Speaker 3: Well it's because we give them so much money.

557
00:26:26,680 --> 00:26:32,680
Speaker 2: Okay, so not just cool cool ranch. Fuck, let's get

558
00:26:32,720 --> 00:26:35,879
Speaker 2: back to idiot. I mean all right, but seriously, Derido's

559
00:26:35,880 --> 00:26:38,800
Speaker 2: people send us a drop us on We're at bastards

560
00:26:38,840 --> 00:26:42,200
Speaker 2: pot on Twitter. Yeah, Idiomine has just committed a war

561
00:26:42,280 --> 00:26:44,520
Speaker 2: crime right before you've got an independence, and the British

562
00:26:44,560 --> 00:26:46,880
Speaker 2: governor of Uganda has sort of hushed up the whole

563
00:26:46,960 --> 00:26:49,080
Speaker 2: thing because he's one of the only officers and they

564
00:26:49,080 --> 00:26:51,720
Speaker 2: didn't want to, you know, they just they just didn't

565
00:26:51,720 --> 00:26:54,920
Speaker 2: want any complications. They said it would be politically undesirable

566
00:26:55,000 --> 00:26:59,600
Speaker 2: if this came up right before independence. So idioman now

567
00:26:59,600 --> 00:27:02,760
Speaker 2: in off Serve, rises again rapidly through the ranks. According

568
00:27:02,800 --> 00:27:06,040
Speaker 2: to Robert Keeley, he advanced by eliminating his rivals in

569
00:27:06,040 --> 00:27:08,840
Speaker 2: one fashion or another, either physically or by discrediting them,

570
00:27:08,920 --> 00:27:10,840
Speaker 2: or by scaring them or some way or another. His

571
00:27:10,920 --> 00:27:14,520
Speaker 2: promotions came frequently, so he's good at working the system.

572
00:27:15,080 --> 00:27:17,760
Speaker 2: He understands how the British military works.

573
00:27:17,520 --> 00:27:18,600
Speaker 3: In respect the hustle.

574
00:27:18,840 --> 00:27:21,760
Speaker 2: Yeah, and if there's one man who knows how to hustle,

575
00:27:21,840 --> 00:27:25,840
Speaker 2: it's Idiomine. Now. On October ninth, nineteen sixty two, Uganda

576
00:27:25,920 --> 00:27:28,880
Speaker 2: gains its independence from Great Britain. You got his first

577
00:27:28,920 --> 00:27:31,320
Speaker 2: prime minister was a guy named Milton Obote, and the

578
00:27:31,359 --> 00:27:34,560
Speaker 2: president was a guy named Edward Mutessa. Mutessa was also

579
00:27:34,600 --> 00:27:36,760
Speaker 2: the king of the Baganda, who were a southern tribe

580
00:27:36,800 --> 00:27:39,919
Speaker 2: in Uganda, he was better known as King Freddie. For

581
00:27:39,960 --> 00:27:42,200
Speaker 2: a little while, Mutessa and a Bote co existed and

582
00:27:42,240 --> 00:27:46,080
Speaker 2: things were all right in Uganda. Milton Obote, like Idiomine,

583
00:27:46,080 --> 00:27:49,360
Speaker 2: came from northern Uganda. He advocated for a great African awakening.

584
00:27:49,440 --> 00:27:52,000
Speaker 2: He was a socialist, although not a very dogmatic one.

585
00:27:52,800 --> 00:27:56,920
Speaker 2: The West generally disliked him. But he was also super corrupt,

586
00:27:56,920 --> 00:27:58,520
Speaker 2: which is going to be a theme in this story.

587
00:27:58,960 --> 00:28:01,800
Speaker 2: So by nineteen sixty four, Idiomine had been named deputy

588
00:28:01,840 --> 00:28:05,000
Speaker 2: army commander under a dude with the really cool name

589
00:28:05,119 --> 00:28:08,159
Speaker 2: Shaban Appelat, which is one of my favorite names that

590
00:28:08,200 --> 00:28:13,480
Speaker 2: I've encountered in this podcast research. He saw action again,

591
00:28:13,560 --> 00:28:16,320
Speaker 2: fighting alongside Katanga rebels who were battling the government of

592
00:28:16,400 --> 00:28:18,960
Speaker 2: zaiir It. He took gold and diamonds from the rebels

593
00:28:19,000 --> 00:28:21,040
Speaker 2: and gave them guns from the Ugandan army in exchange.

594
00:28:21,040 --> 00:28:23,760
Speaker 2: He then sold the loot for cash. A Bote, the President,

595
00:28:23,800 --> 00:28:26,359
Speaker 2: got in on the racket. There was a brief parliamentary inquiry,

596
00:28:26,520 --> 00:28:28,159
Speaker 2: but a Bote had all the other people in this

597
00:28:28,200 --> 00:28:32,639
Speaker 2: scheme arrested and so he and he and Idie were fine. Now,

598
00:28:32,680 --> 00:28:34,720
Speaker 2: in nineteen sixty six, a Bote got tired of sharing

599
00:28:34,760 --> 00:28:37,760
Speaker 2: power and suspended the constitution. He sent Colonel Idiamine to

600
00:28:37,800 --> 00:28:40,400
Speaker 2: attack the palace and bring the king back dead or alive.

601
00:28:40,920 --> 00:28:42,840
Speaker 2: The king managed to flee the country, but the coup

602
00:28:42,840 --> 00:28:45,240
Speaker 2: succeeded and a Bote was left as the sole power

603
00:28:45,240 --> 00:28:48,560
Speaker 2: in Uganda. Now this did not make the British happy.

604
00:28:49,000 --> 00:28:52,400
Speaker 2: The Baganda were their favorite tribe in Uganda. Winston Churchill,

605
00:28:52,480 --> 00:28:54,640
Speaker 2: under Secretary of State for the Colonies from nineteen oh

606
00:28:54,680 --> 00:28:57,840
Speaker 2: five to nineteen three eight. Yeah, super good guy. Never

607
00:28:58,160 --> 00:29:00,680
Speaker 2: caused a famine that four and a half million Yeah,

608
00:29:01,840 --> 00:29:05,400
Speaker 2: not even well once. But let he among us who

609
00:29:05,400 --> 00:29:07,560
Speaker 2: has not starved for four and a half millionaire. Yeah,

610
00:29:08,280 --> 00:29:12,520
Speaker 2: we all cause a couple of famines, you know. He

611
00:29:12,600 --> 00:29:15,920
Speaker 2: considered the Baganda to be civilized, which means basically that

612
00:29:15,960 --> 00:29:19,240
Speaker 2: they'd all converted to Christianity easily. Their territory was just

613
00:29:19,280 --> 00:29:21,280
Speaker 2: where the British wound up putting the railroad and their

614
00:29:21,320 --> 00:29:24,360
Speaker 2: administration buildings. So the Begandans were the people the British

615
00:29:24,400 --> 00:29:26,680
Speaker 2: had spent the most time within Uganda. They considered them

616
00:29:26,680 --> 00:29:29,960
Speaker 2: civilized because they acted like British people are the good

617
00:29:29,960 --> 00:29:34,520
Speaker 2: ones yeah, exactly. Now. The Ugandan people, most of whom

618
00:29:34,520 --> 00:29:38,920
Speaker 2: weren't Begondans, supported a Botes kicking down the king. They

619
00:29:38,960 --> 00:29:41,280
Speaker 2: saw him as casting down a British backed monarch. They

620
00:29:41,320 --> 00:29:42,920
Speaker 2: saw this as a true break from the past and

621
00:29:43,000 --> 00:29:45,240
Speaker 2: chance at a new beginning. It was an exciting time,

622
00:29:45,360 --> 00:29:47,480
Speaker 2: but the excitement soon faded in the reality of a

623
00:29:47,480 --> 00:29:51,480
Speaker 2: botes ridiculous corruption. People protested, of course, and by nineteen

624
00:29:51,520 --> 00:29:53,480
Speaker 2: sixty nine the government could only stay in power with

625
00:29:53,520 --> 00:29:56,840
Speaker 2: the military's backing. Edie had been popular with the British

626
00:29:56,840 --> 00:29:58,680
Speaker 2: because he was a great soldier and because he spoke

627
00:29:58,720 --> 00:30:00,800
Speaker 2: English with just the right a accent that made them

628
00:30:00,840 --> 00:30:02,760
Speaker 2: think he was cute and dumb because they were racist

629
00:30:02,760 --> 00:30:05,240
Speaker 2: as fuck. But Idy was not dumb. Well, the government

630
00:30:05,240 --> 00:30:07,960
Speaker 2: had grown more dependent on his military. He started recruiting

631
00:30:08,040 --> 00:30:10,520
Speaker 2: hundreds of his relatives and fellow Nubians into the army

632
00:30:10,560 --> 00:30:12,800
Speaker 2: and putting them in the positions he would want them

633
00:30:12,800 --> 00:30:15,760
Speaker 2: in when it was time to take power. This was

634
00:30:15,760 --> 00:30:18,680
Speaker 2: disrupted in nineteen seventy when an assassin tried to kill

635
00:30:18,720 --> 00:30:21,320
Speaker 2: President a Bote and shot him through the mouth. American

636
00:30:21,360 --> 00:30:24,760
Speaker 2: diplomat Beavou, now recalled the army, went a muck in

637
00:30:24,800 --> 00:30:27,560
Speaker 2: for about twelve hours. It was a pretty horrifying situation.

638
00:30:28,080 --> 00:30:30,360
Speaker 2: Itdy appears to have gotten confused and thought the attempt

639
00:30:30,360 --> 00:30:32,440
Speaker 2: was a coup against both him and a Bote, so

640
00:30:32,520 --> 00:30:35,040
Speaker 2: he ran he quote jumped out the back window of

641
00:30:35,040 --> 00:30:37,760
Speaker 2: his house and his pajamas and disappeared, which really mystified

642
00:30:37,840 --> 00:30:41,320
Speaker 2: us all because they were expecting that this assassination attempt

643
00:30:41,320 --> 00:30:43,560
Speaker 2: was him seizing power, but it was just somebody else.

644
00:30:43,920 --> 00:30:45,560
Speaker 2: So he was mocked for weeks in the wake of

645
00:30:45,600 --> 00:30:47,880
Speaker 2: the attack because he'd ran out in the night in

646
00:30:47,920 --> 00:30:50,560
Speaker 2: his pajamas, and a number of people counted him out

647
00:30:50,560 --> 00:30:52,600
Speaker 2: as a force and new gund in politics at this point.

648
00:30:52,800 --> 00:30:55,080
Speaker 2: But Idy embarked on a redemption tour. Part of that

649
00:30:55,280 --> 00:30:58,000
Speaker 2: was having a bunch of people clandestinely executed in the night.

650
00:30:58,280 --> 00:31:00,400
Speaker 2: Part of it was showing up in public within a

651
00:31:00,400 --> 00:31:03,920
Speaker 2: bunch of his armed friends and just scaring people. Nall

652
00:31:04,200 --> 00:31:05,520
Speaker 2: was there for part of that too. He was out

653
00:31:05,520 --> 00:31:08,080
Speaker 2: at a bar one night and he quote, you know,

654
00:31:08,160 --> 00:31:10,520
Speaker 2: he saw Idio. Quote I walked out of the bar

655
00:31:10,560 --> 00:31:12,880
Speaker 2: and there was a mean, a huge man, an enormous

656
00:31:12,880 --> 00:31:15,000
Speaker 2: fellow with his officers and their weapons sitting in the

657
00:31:15,000 --> 00:31:18,760
Speaker 2: main lounge, sitting at attention, not talking, just looking around.

658
00:31:18,920 --> 00:31:21,480
Speaker 2: I thought, Jesus, what's going to happen. They sat there

659
00:31:21,480 --> 00:31:23,600
Speaker 2: for about half an hour and then Amen said something

660
00:31:23,600 --> 00:31:25,320
Speaker 2: in one of the local languages, and they all got

661
00:31:25,400 --> 00:31:27,440
Speaker 2: up and walked out of there. What it was, I'm

662
00:31:27,440 --> 00:31:29,560
Speaker 2: convinced to this day was a threat on the part

663
00:31:29,560 --> 00:31:32,200
Speaker 2: of a mean about re establishing his position. He knew

664
00:31:32,200 --> 00:31:34,160
Speaker 2: that he was laughed at because he ran away. This

665
00:31:34,320 --> 00:31:36,920
Speaker 2: was his reprisal, his counter threat, and it worked. People

666
00:31:36,960 --> 00:31:39,880
Speaker 2: were scared to death. So they might have been more

667
00:31:39,920 --> 00:31:42,040
Speaker 2: scared by the fact that Idi had had a number

668
00:31:42,040 --> 00:31:42,680
Speaker 2: of people killed.

669
00:31:43,040 --> 00:31:44,680
Speaker 3: Yeah, and the fact that he just sat there for

670
00:31:44,720 --> 00:31:46,640
Speaker 3: a half hour for his heave. That's crazy.

671
00:31:46,840 --> 00:31:49,200
Speaker 2: Yeah, it was a little bit like some guy just

672
00:31:49,240 --> 00:31:51,360
Speaker 2: sits in the bar staring at you with like his

673
00:31:51,360 --> 00:31:55,920
Speaker 2: friends and all their guns. You know, that's intimidating. So yeah.

674
00:31:55,920 --> 00:31:58,280
Speaker 2: In nineteen seventy one, President of BOTE went to Singapore

675
00:31:58,320 --> 00:32:00,760
Speaker 2: for a conference. Before he left, he put out the

676
00:32:00,880 --> 00:32:03,560
Speaker 2: order that idiom In was to be arrested for massive

677
00:32:03,720 --> 00:32:06,240
Speaker 2: corruption and murder, which Idiot was guilty of, but which

678
00:32:06,240 --> 00:32:09,720
Speaker 2: a Bote was guilty of. Two before the warrant could

679
00:32:09,720 --> 00:32:13,640
Speaker 2: be served, Idiomin launched his coup. The killing started right away.

680
00:32:13,680 --> 00:32:16,320
Speaker 2: At least a thousand soldiers from tribes that Idie didn't

681
00:32:16,320 --> 00:32:20,000
Speaker 2: trust were massacred. The river filled with corpses, which is

682
00:32:20,160 --> 00:32:20,440
Speaker 2: you know.

683
00:32:21,160 --> 00:32:23,360
Speaker 3: So when you tell the story, like when I hear

684
00:32:23,400 --> 00:32:26,640
Speaker 3: stories like this, I'm like, I don't even know where

685
00:32:26,640 --> 00:32:28,920
Speaker 3: all these people. How many people are are they going

686
00:32:28,960 --> 00:32:30,840
Speaker 3: to kill before they just completely run out of people?

687
00:32:30,880 --> 00:32:33,760
Speaker 3: You know, it's like Jesuise.

688
00:32:33,960 --> 00:32:37,320
Speaker 2: Yeah, they really go pretty far. And by the time

689
00:32:37,360 --> 00:32:39,440
Speaker 2: this is all over, Idio will have killed something like

690
00:32:39,480 --> 00:32:42,800
Speaker 2: one in fifty seven of the people in Uganda. And

691
00:32:42,880 --> 00:32:44,880
Speaker 2: he's not the worst of them, which we'll get to

692
00:32:45,000 --> 00:32:46,720
Speaker 2: as well. Oh my god, he's just the one that

693
00:32:46,760 --> 00:32:49,280
Speaker 2: everyone focuses on because there's rumors that he ate people.

694
00:32:49,480 --> 00:32:49,760
Speaker 3: Wow.

695
00:32:51,040 --> 00:32:54,800
Speaker 2: So Nall was the American diplomatic officer in Uganda, so

696
00:32:54,880 --> 00:32:56,800
Speaker 2: he had responsibility for all of the eight hundred Dish

697
00:32:56,840 --> 00:33:00,480
Speaker 2: American citizens and country. He told those people to hold

698
00:33:00,520 --> 00:33:02,080
Speaker 2: fast and chill at home, and that went fine. But

699
00:33:02,120 --> 00:33:03,880
Speaker 2: there was also a tourist group in town who were

700
00:33:03,880 --> 00:33:05,920
Speaker 2: furious that this coup got in the way of their vacation.

701
00:33:06,520 --> 00:33:08,160
Speaker 2: So I want to read this story just because it's

702
00:33:08,160 --> 00:33:12,720
Speaker 2: a levity. It's just America. Help. It's rich Americans acting

703
00:33:12,760 --> 00:33:14,600
Speaker 2: like rich Americans in the middle of a coup that's

704
00:33:14,680 --> 00:33:16,640
Speaker 2: life and death for their people. In Uganda.

705
00:33:16,720 --> 00:33:18,560
Speaker 3: We just wanted to go on a nice vacation on

706
00:33:18,840 --> 00:33:20,480
Speaker 3: some endangered animals.

707
00:33:22,120 --> 00:33:24,840
Speaker 2: I said to them, look, the airport is closed. And

708
00:33:24,920 --> 00:33:27,360
Speaker 2: later the tour leader turned to me and said, well, mister, now,

709
00:33:27,520 --> 00:33:30,600
Speaker 2: these are important people. They haven't got time to wait around.

710
00:33:30,680 --> 00:33:33,720
Speaker 2: They're going to miss their connections in Nairobi. I said,

711
00:33:33,760 --> 00:33:36,440
Speaker 2: you're damn right. They're going to miss their connections in Nairobi,

712
00:33:36,600 --> 00:33:38,400
Speaker 2: and they're going to get hungry, they're going to get tired,

713
00:33:38,400 --> 00:33:39,920
Speaker 2: they're going to get dirty, and they're going to want

714
00:33:39,920 --> 00:33:41,760
Speaker 2: to get their laundry done. And it's not going to

715
00:33:41,760 --> 00:33:43,840
Speaker 2: be done because I don't see any chance of these

716
00:33:43,840 --> 00:33:46,280
Speaker 2: folks leaving for four or five days. And that was

717
00:33:46,360 --> 00:33:49,360
Speaker 2: just the case. They were furious. One guy, the president

718
00:33:49,400 --> 00:33:52,240
Speaker 2: of this big liquor distributing company in Hartford, Connecticut, High

719
00:33:52,280 --> 00:33:54,800
Speaker 2: Blood or Hugh Mind or something. He beat me about

720
00:33:54,800 --> 00:33:56,440
Speaker 2: that on the head and shoulders. He said he had

721
00:33:56,480 --> 00:33:58,880
Speaker 2: to get back to sign a contract. I said, you

722
00:33:58,920 --> 00:34:01,280
Speaker 2: can't do it. There are soldiers at the airport who

723
00:34:01,320 --> 00:34:07,600
Speaker 2: will kill you, which I just love. Like, there's people

724
00:34:07,600 --> 00:34:09,399
Speaker 2: getting murdered in the street and you're like, I've got

725
00:34:09,400 --> 00:34:10,680
Speaker 2: a contract to get back to.

726
00:34:11,000 --> 00:34:16,200
Speaker 3: Yeah. That sounds like every screenplay where a businessman is inconvenience.

727
00:34:18,000 --> 00:34:20,640
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's like that. Yeah, there's a terrorist hijacking the

728
00:34:20,640 --> 00:34:22,560
Speaker 2: airplane and he's like, I'm gonna miss the account.

729
00:34:22,600 --> 00:34:25,640
Speaker 3: I gotta get home for Christmas.

730
00:34:27,360 --> 00:34:29,520
Speaker 2: So okay, that was a nice little interlude. So in

731
00:34:29,520 --> 00:34:32,839
Speaker 2: short order, Idiomine is the new president of Uganda. That's

732
00:34:32,880 --> 00:34:34,600
Speaker 2: a position he would hold for more than eight years.

733
00:34:35,040 --> 00:34:37,799
Speaker 2: The Western powers, mainly the British and the Americans, were

734
00:34:37,800 --> 00:34:40,200
Speaker 2: hopeful at first. They hated a Bote because he was

735
00:34:40,239 --> 00:34:42,440
Speaker 2: a socialist and because he was even more corrupt than

736
00:34:42,440 --> 00:34:45,160
Speaker 2: they were prepared to forgive. Idiomine had a good reputation

737
00:34:45,200 --> 00:34:47,520
Speaker 2: among the British. He trained as a paratrooper in Israel,

738
00:34:47,560 --> 00:34:51,200
Speaker 2: so Israel really liked the guy too. So yeah, at first,

739
00:34:51,200 --> 00:34:54,600
Speaker 2: it seems like this new dictator is going to be

740
00:34:54,680 --> 00:34:59,600
Speaker 2: great for white people. You know Lady Listowell, who was

741
00:34:59,600 --> 00:35:03,360
Speaker 2: a hungary noblewoman and a journalist who became Idio's first biographer,

742
00:35:03,400 --> 00:35:05,239
Speaker 2: I met him around this time, and here's how she

743
00:35:05,360 --> 00:35:07,480
Speaker 2: described meeting him for the first time, to give you

744
00:35:07,480 --> 00:35:09,960
Speaker 2: an idea of like how this guy comes across quote.

745
00:35:10,360 --> 00:35:12,719
Speaker 2: I looked into the smiling face of a tall, muscular

746
00:35:12,800 --> 00:35:15,160
Speaker 2: officer with shrewd eyes who invited me to a cup

747
00:35:15,160 --> 00:35:17,040
Speaker 2: of coffee. He was a hooking figure of a man,

748
00:35:17,080 --> 00:35:20,480
Speaker 2: and I was fascinated by his hands. Beautiful, slim hands

749
00:35:20,520 --> 00:35:21,920
Speaker 2: with long, tapering fingers.

750
00:35:22,239 --> 00:35:25,719
Speaker 3: We got your horny, we gotta.

751
00:35:25,880 --> 00:35:28,360
Speaker 2: I just love. We did a podcast on King Leopold

752
00:35:28,360 --> 00:35:31,160
Speaker 2: of Belgium, the guy who massacred fifteen million people in

753
00:35:31,200 --> 00:35:33,480
Speaker 2: the Congo, and in his biography there was like a

754
00:35:33,480 --> 00:35:36,560
Speaker 2: whole paragraph talking about how beautiful his hands were. So

755
00:35:36,680 --> 00:35:38,799
Speaker 2: I just that's apparently that's now if I can find

756
00:35:38,840 --> 00:35:45,440
Speaker 2: one more that's officially trains beautiful hands. I'm just always

757
00:35:45,440 --> 00:35:48,040
Speaker 2: shocked that apparently some people are really staring at hands

758
00:35:48,080 --> 00:35:48,439
Speaker 2: a lot.

759
00:35:48,760 --> 00:35:51,160
Speaker 3: Yeah, I know, and you never hear about like, you know,

760
00:35:51,400 --> 00:35:55,080
Speaker 3: his cuticles weren't not well manicured. Yeah, his piranos were

761
00:35:55,120 --> 00:35:55,680
Speaker 3: a little long.

762
00:35:56,360 --> 00:35:59,239
Speaker 2: It was really yeah, yeah, there were actually reasons that

763
00:35:59,280 --> 00:36:01,919
Speaker 2: a reasonable person and who wasn't you know, purely looking

764
00:36:01,960 --> 00:36:03,480
Speaker 2: at this from like the British point of view, might

765
00:36:03,480 --> 00:36:05,680
Speaker 2: have thought Idiomine had a shot at being a good president.

766
00:36:07,200 --> 00:36:09,480
Speaker 2: For one thing, he was a fun guy. Everybody who

767
00:36:09,560 --> 00:36:12,880
Speaker 2: met him really spoke highly of him, Like everybody, like

768
00:36:13,120 --> 00:36:14,960
Speaker 2: even people who later were like, oh yeah, he definitely

769
00:36:15,000 --> 00:36:18,439
Speaker 2: committed atrocities. He was charming. It was a fun guy

770
00:36:18,440 --> 00:36:19,040
Speaker 2: to be around.

771
00:36:19,160 --> 00:36:21,840
Speaker 3: Yeah. I met him and I was so scared. I

772
00:36:21,920 --> 00:36:23,440
Speaker 3: was like, this guy is gonna kill me. So I

773
00:36:23,480 --> 00:36:26,560
Speaker 3: was like, ha haha, nice guy, great guy.

774
00:36:27,880 --> 00:36:29,840
Speaker 2: He was obsessed with Scotland, which is one of the

775
00:36:30,200 --> 00:36:33,360
Speaker 2: famous things about idioman Yeah. All of the officers in

776
00:36:33,400 --> 00:36:38,400
Speaker 2: the African Rifles. Yeah, and he had he loved people

777
00:36:38,440 --> 00:36:41,920
Speaker 2: playing bagpipes. Time's weird. Yeah, all of the officers in

778
00:36:41,920 --> 00:36:44,399
Speaker 2: the King's African Rifles had been Scottish, and so Edie

779
00:36:44,640 --> 00:36:47,359
Speaker 2: just really loved Scottish culture. He had huge He had

780
00:36:47,520 --> 00:36:48,080
Speaker 2: a whole plane.

781
00:36:48,280 --> 00:36:51,359
Speaker 3: Do you remember seeing him in like clothing and he's

782
00:36:51,400 --> 00:36:52,960
Speaker 3: wearing like plaid and stuff.

783
00:36:53,160 --> 00:36:55,800
Speaker 2: And there's a movie about him that's not super accurate,

784
00:36:55,800 --> 00:37:00,000
Speaker 2: but it's called The Last King of Scotland, right, Yeah, yeah, Yeah,

785
00:37:00,080 --> 00:37:02,240
Speaker 2: And he had a whole plane dedicated to just bringing

786
00:37:02,280 --> 00:37:06,719
Speaker 2: Scottish whiskey into uh Uganda. Like there was like a

787
00:37:06,840 --> 00:37:10,480
Speaker 2: presidential plane. That's just the Whiskey Express, which is a

788
00:37:10,520 --> 00:37:15,200
Speaker 2: cool thing to desert. Yeah no, that's that's that's legitimately fine.

789
00:37:16,640 --> 00:37:17,920
Speaker 3: Here you cool of flying.

790
00:37:18,239 --> 00:37:24,359
Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm fine. No, we have a vodka guy fly

791
00:37:24,440 --> 00:37:29,640
Speaker 2: the Whiskey Express. He's fine until he gets home. Uh

792
00:37:29,680 --> 00:37:32,920
Speaker 2: Idio adopted a number of British military traditions for his

793
00:37:32,920 --> 00:37:35,320
Speaker 2: own military. He sent a musician to Scotland for a

794
00:37:35,400 --> 00:37:38,399
Speaker 2: year to learn the bagpipes. He also established a state

795
00:37:38,480 --> 00:37:41,200
Speaker 2: military jazz band with perhaps the best name of for

796
00:37:41,239 --> 00:37:45,200
Speaker 2: a band I've ever heard, the Revolutionary Suicide Jazz Band,

797
00:37:45,640 --> 00:37:49,239
Speaker 2: also known as the Revolutionary Suicide Mechanized Regiment Band or

798
00:37:49,280 --> 00:37:52,279
Speaker 2: the Suicide Mechanized Jazz Band. And here's there.

799
00:37:52,760 --> 00:37:53,840
Speaker 3: Were they like a punk band.

800
00:37:54,239 --> 00:37:56,080
Speaker 2: No, they were just a jazz band. They should have

801
00:37:56,080 --> 00:38:00,920
Speaker 2: been a punk bandide they were there. This is a

802
00:38:00,960 --> 00:38:03,759
Speaker 2: really great picture. They were the regimental band. They were

803
00:38:03,800 --> 00:38:05,680
Speaker 2: a military band. And the band they were a Unit

804
00:38:05,719 --> 00:38:08,279
Speaker 2: four was one of the elite mechanized regiments in the

805
00:38:08,360 --> 00:38:11,239
Speaker 2: Ugandan army. That was a suicide mechanized regiment. So it

806
00:38:11,320 --> 00:38:13,239
Speaker 2: was like to try to make them sound scary, because

807
00:38:13,320 --> 00:38:15,920
Speaker 2: guys don't care if they die. They're the suicide regiment

808
00:38:15,960 --> 00:38:19,520
Speaker 2: for And this amazing picture, with several others, will be

809
00:38:19,600 --> 00:38:22,040
Speaker 2: up on our website behind the Bastards dot com. You

810
00:38:22,120 --> 00:38:25,719
Speaker 2: owe it to yourself to check it out. Yeah, So

811
00:38:26,120 --> 00:38:29,000
Speaker 2: it also seems I should note that from reports at

812
00:38:29,040 --> 00:38:31,239
Speaker 2: the time, most of the musicians and the Suicide Revolutionary

813
00:38:31,320 --> 00:38:33,279
Speaker 2: Jazz Band were sort of press ganged and forced to

814
00:38:33,320 --> 00:38:37,799
Speaker 2: play Yeah, they don't look exactly happy, they don't look

815
00:38:38,239 --> 00:38:45,240
Speaker 2: jazz wow. So Iddy's reign was brutal by all measures,

816
00:38:45,840 --> 00:38:47,920
Speaker 2: and got increasingly brutal as time went on. There are

817
00:38:47,920 --> 00:38:50,120
Speaker 2: a number of theories as to why Robert Keey thinks

818
00:38:50,120 --> 00:38:52,760
Speaker 2: he was just promoted out of his depth, like Michael Scott.

819
00:38:53,000 --> 00:38:55,040
Speaker 2: Basically he was a fine sergeant, but he never should

820
00:38:55,040 --> 00:38:58,160
Speaker 2: have been an officer, let alone running the nation, which

821
00:38:58,200 --> 00:39:01,080
Speaker 2: is one way or another probably fair Keeley says quote

822
00:39:01,080 --> 00:39:03,200
Speaker 2: he had learned to use his fists and translated that

823
00:39:03,320 --> 00:39:05,600
Speaker 2: into how you hold your position, how you protect yourself.

824
00:39:05,640 --> 00:39:07,640
Speaker 2: He applied all of the brutal boxing lessons he had

825
00:39:07,719 --> 00:39:11,520
Speaker 2: learned against his rivals. Lady Listowel also thought that this

826
00:39:11,560 --> 00:39:13,200
Speaker 2: poor guy had just been forced to jump into a

827
00:39:13,239 --> 00:39:16,160
Speaker 2: position too complex for his mind. Quote. The Kakwa have

828
00:39:16,160 --> 00:39:18,600
Speaker 2: a great respect for personalities, but not for rank or position.

829
00:39:18,680 --> 00:39:21,200
Speaker 2: They never had chiefs or recognized clan leaders. I mean

830
00:39:21,320 --> 00:39:23,560
Speaker 2: was brought up to believe that all Kaqwa tribesmen are equal.

831
00:39:23,680 --> 00:39:25,880
Speaker 2: Some of his recent measures illustrate all too well that

832
00:39:25,920 --> 00:39:27,840
Speaker 2: he had to leap from a peasant background into the

833
00:39:27,840 --> 00:39:31,759
Speaker 2: complicated politics of the modern world without any intermediate feudal preparation.

834
00:39:32,640 --> 00:39:34,520
Speaker 2: I think this attitude that Idy was just a guy

835
00:39:34,560 --> 00:39:36,680
Speaker 2: that who got promoted beyond his talents is inaccurate and

836
00:39:36,719 --> 00:39:39,480
Speaker 2: based pretty heavily in racism. It shifts the brain the

837
00:39:39,480 --> 00:39:41,959
Speaker 2: blame over to Uganda for letting such a man rise

838
00:39:42,000 --> 00:39:43,960
Speaker 2: that high, and I think the real blame lies with

839
00:39:44,000 --> 00:39:46,800
Speaker 2: the British. Again, there's guys like Idio in every country,

840
00:39:47,120 --> 00:39:49,879
Speaker 2: violent authoritarians who seek to impose their will on others.

841
00:39:50,320 --> 00:39:54,280
Speaker 2: Established nations, build antibodies, up checks and balances and legal systems,

842
00:39:54,280 --> 00:39:57,400
Speaker 2: and established bureaucracies to stop men with fourth grade educations

843
00:39:57,400 --> 00:39:59,480
Speaker 2: and histories of head injuries from heading the army.

844
00:40:00,080 --> 00:40:00,920
Speaker 3: Sounds nice, Rabo.

845
00:40:01,040 --> 00:40:08,960
Speaker 2: Now well, clearly ours aren't perfect, so but you know,

846
00:40:09,120 --> 00:40:12,400
Speaker 2: Uganda didn't have any any of that. The British didn't

847
00:40:12,440 --> 00:40:16,120
Speaker 2: put any of that in place before. They just abandoned them.

848
00:40:14,760 --> 00:40:17,520
Speaker 2: M Like. It's one of those things where if you

849
00:40:17,600 --> 00:40:21,320
Speaker 2: look at what was set up when the Uganda was freed,

850
00:40:21,960 --> 00:40:24,640
Speaker 2: I don't see someone like idiot was bound to at

851
00:40:24,719 --> 00:40:25,840
Speaker 2: least try to take control.

852
00:40:25,960 --> 00:40:28,000
Speaker 3: Yeah, it sounds like they set up the country like

853
00:40:28,040 --> 00:40:29,000
Speaker 3: a reality show.

854
00:40:29,520 --> 00:40:31,400
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, it is almost like that.

855
00:40:31,480 --> 00:40:33,560
Speaker 3: Yeah, they were like, here you guys, go hear some

856
00:40:33,600 --> 00:40:35,000
Speaker 3: sticks survive.

857
00:40:34,840 --> 00:40:36,920
Speaker 2: And they didn't. They didn't consider any of the ways

858
00:40:36,920 --> 00:40:40,000
Speaker 2: it could go badly, and they didn't like they know,

859
00:40:40,640 --> 00:40:43,399
Speaker 2: like the British have never had a military coup and

860
00:40:43,440 --> 00:40:46,279
Speaker 2: they have an officer cadre for a reason. They like

861
00:40:46,480 --> 00:40:48,880
Speaker 2: set like they know how you set up a military

862
00:40:48,920 --> 00:40:51,600
Speaker 2: so it doesn't destroy the country. And they didn't do

863
00:40:51,719 --> 00:40:53,840
Speaker 2: any of that in Uganda because they were lazy and

864
00:40:53,880 --> 00:40:58,839
Speaker 2: they didn't care. So fuck the British.

865
00:40:58,560 --> 00:41:01,839
Speaker 3: Yeah, fucked and Flint, Michigan still doesn't have clean water.

866
00:41:01,920 --> 00:41:04,319
Speaker 2: Yeah, and fuck us too, for sure, for sure, for sure.

867
00:41:04,680 --> 00:41:07,160
Speaker 2: This one is actually this one sort of our bad too,

868
00:41:07,160 --> 00:41:10,479
Speaker 2: because we're we supported the Idiomine regime for a while.

869
00:41:10,640 --> 00:41:14,399
Speaker 2: We being the United States, Fuck us, fuck everybody, Fuck

870
00:41:14,440 --> 00:41:19,919
Speaker 2: everybody except for Uganda. They didn't deserve any except for now.

871
00:41:20,160 --> 00:41:24,279
Speaker 2: Dorito's had nothing to do with this. Okay, that's that's fair.

872
00:41:24,480 --> 00:41:28,280
Speaker 2: And you could argue that Dorito's has stopped similar monsters

873
00:41:28,280 --> 00:41:31,280
Speaker 2: from arising in other countries by filling them with nacho goodness.

874
00:41:31,360 --> 00:41:33,480
Speaker 3: Yeah, that's right, stop the monster of hunger.

875
00:41:33,600 --> 00:41:36,400
Speaker 2: As far as we know, Idiomine never got to experience

876
00:41:36,520 --> 00:41:39,920
Speaker 2: extreme nacho flavor, and that might be the secret of

877
00:41:39,920 --> 00:41:40,520
Speaker 2: his madness.

878
00:41:40,600 --> 00:41:44,920
Speaker 3: Yeah, the only extremism he should have been into is

879
00:41:45,920 --> 00:41:47,160
Speaker 3: not choke cheesy crunch.

880
00:41:50,360 --> 00:41:53,640
Speaker 2: So yeah. When the British first started the Ugandan Colony,

881
00:41:53,680 --> 00:41:56,080
Speaker 2: they had carried out a policy of bringing in South Asians,

882
00:41:56,120 --> 00:41:58,880
Speaker 2: mostly from India, to Uganda to quote service a buffer

883
00:41:58,920 --> 00:42:01,640
Speaker 2: between Europeans and Africans in the middle rungs of commerce

884
00:42:01,680 --> 00:42:04,919
Speaker 2: and administration. This had started when the British brought thirty

885
00:42:04,960 --> 00:42:08,359
Speaker 2: thousand Indians over to build railways in Uganda. These folks

886
00:42:08,400 --> 00:42:10,640
Speaker 2: had a lot more experience with Western style capitalism than

887
00:42:10,640 --> 00:42:12,919
Speaker 2: the average Ugandan, and as a result, they saw great

888
00:42:12,920 --> 00:42:15,520
Speaker 2: success setting up businesses in the new colony. By the

889
00:42:15,560 --> 00:42:18,680
Speaker 2: early nineteen seventies, Ugandan Asians owned ninety percent of the

890
00:42:18,680 --> 00:42:22,280
Speaker 2: country's businesses and contributed ninety percent of its tax revenue,

891
00:42:22,360 --> 00:42:25,040
Speaker 2: despite making up a small minority of the actual population.

892
00:42:26,080 --> 00:42:29,440
Speaker 2: This had obviously caused a lot of unrest between native

893
00:42:29,440 --> 00:42:33,960
Speaker 2: ethnic Ugandans and the Ugandan Asians. President de Bote had

894
00:42:33,960 --> 00:42:37,560
Speaker 2: pursued a policy called Africanization, which attacked Ugandan Asians with

895
00:42:37,640 --> 00:42:40,920
Speaker 2: laws aimed at reducing their economic dominance it. He expanded

896
00:42:40,920 --> 00:42:43,080
Speaker 2: on that policy and added in a healthy dollop of

897
00:42:43,160 --> 00:42:45,600
Speaker 2: straight up racism. He announced that the government would be

898
00:42:45,600 --> 00:42:48,879
Speaker 2: reviewing the status of Ugandan Asians who'd been given citizenship.

899
00:42:49,320 --> 00:42:52,279
Speaker 2: So basically they were looking at naturalized Ugandan citizens and

900
00:42:52,320 --> 00:42:54,440
Speaker 2: finding excuses to take away their citizenship.

901
00:42:54,600 --> 00:42:56,120
Speaker 3: Yeah, that's what's happening right now.

902
00:42:56,280 --> 00:42:59,880
Speaker 2: Yes, it's exactly what's happening right now to naturalized American citizens,

903
00:43:00,960 --> 00:43:01,600
Speaker 2: which is a.

904
00:43:02,480 --> 00:43:04,200
Speaker 3: Huge bummer, huge bummer.

905
00:43:04,239 --> 00:43:06,880
Speaker 2: Weird how these shitty guys have the same playbook in

906
00:43:06,920 --> 00:43:11,160
Speaker 2: a lot of cases. Yeah, I mean, also canceled all

907
00:43:11,200 --> 00:43:15,880
Speaker 2: in progress citizenship applications from Asians, and then in August

908
00:43:15,920 --> 00:43:18,120
Speaker 2: of nineteen seventy two, he gave all Asians in Uganda

909
00:43:18,200 --> 00:43:21,040
Speaker 2: ninety days to vacate the country. So we're going to

910
00:43:21,080 --> 00:43:24,279
Speaker 2: get into how that policy went and what a clusterfuck

911
00:43:24,560 --> 00:43:28,560
Speaker 2: ensued afterwards, and what happened once the West finally decided

912
00:43:28,560 --> 00:43:32,560
Speaker 2: that Idiomine wasn't their man. But first we've got some

913
00:43:33,160 --> 00:43:37,919
Speaker 2: capitalism to get into. Oh, yay, yay, capitalism, the thing

914
00:43:37,960 --> 00:43:40,800
Speaker 2: that has nothing to do with the tens of millions

915
00:43:40,840 --> 00:43:44,560
Speaker 2: of death to colonialism. Not a thing, not a thing.

916
00:43:44,800 --> 00:43:53,880
Speaker 2: Here's some ads and we're back. So as the story

917
00:43:53,920 --> 00:43:57,920
Speaker 2: has come up here, Idiomine has seized power, He's executed

918
00:43:57,920 --> 00:44:00,840
Speaker 2: a bunch of people, and he has decided to expel

919
00:44:01,000 --> 00:44:04,160
Speaker 2: all of the Asians in Uganda. He's given him ninety

920
00:44:04,200 --> 00:44:07,520
Speaker 2: days to vacate the country. This policy affected eighty five

921
00:44:07,600 --> 00:44:10,440
Speaker 2: thousand people, twenty three thousand of whom are already citizens

922
00:44:10,440 --> 00:44:13,280
Speaker 2: of Uganda. I'm going to play a clip of idiomy

923
00:44:13,280 --> 00:44:15,760
Speaker 2: In talking to the press to hear how he justified

924
00:44:15,760 --> 00:44:17,799
Speaker 2: the policy. And I think what's interesting about this is

925
00:44:18,360 --> 00:44:21,080
Speaker 2: how friendly the foreign press is to him, which sort

926
00:44:21,080 --> 00:44:23,799
Speaker 2: of gives you an idea of how charming this guy

927
00:44:23,920 --> 00:44:25,719
Speaker 2: was in person. So even though he's introduced, he's talking

928
00:44:25,719 --> 00:44:28,400
Speaker 2: about something pretty awful, like people are they?

929
00:44:28,719 --> 00:44:34,000
Speaker 4: Yeah, I'll play it decision for the economy of Uganda,

930
00:44:34,520 --> 00:44:38,560
Speaker 4: and I must make sure that ever Ugandans get a

931
00:44:38,680 --> 00:44:43,840
Speaker 4: fruit of independent since independent actually Uganda is not yet independent.

932
00:44:43,880 --> 00:44:46,919
Speaker 4: I will say that even when the British handed over

933
00:44:47,239 --> 00:44:51,160
Speaker 4: on the ninth of October nineteen sixty two, the Uganda

934
00:44:51,280 --> 00:44:55,600
Speaker 4: is still not yet independent. Uganda will be independent after

935
00:44:55,719 --> 00:45:00,080
Speaker 4: this my decision. After I want to see that the

936
00:45:00,800 --> 00:45:04,919
Speaker 4: whole Campala street is not full of Indians. It must

937
00:45:05,080 --> 00:45:09,600
Speaker 4: be proper black and the administration in those shops is

938
00:45:09,680 --> 00:45:10,800
Speaker 4: run by the Ugandans.

939
00:45:10,800 --> 00:45:12,799
Speaker 2: Would you like to get all Asians out of really?

940
00:45:13,480 --> 00:45:15,799
Speaker 4: Yes, they must go to their country.

941
00:45:15,560 --> 00:45:17,040
Speaker 2: Even on nationals of Uganda.

942
00:45:17,800 --> 00:45:21,040
Speaker 4: If they want to go, they're they're, they're they're, They're

943
00:45:21,080 --> 00:45:21,840
Speaker 4: welcome to go.

944
00:45:22,160 --> 00:45:23,480
Speaker 2: What's what happened to these people?

945
00:45:23,719 --> 00:45:27,279
Speaker 4: If they don't go, by the time, I think they

946
00:45:27,280 --> 00:45:30,279
Speaker 4: will be sitting like they're sitting on the fire. I

947
00:45:30,320 --> 00:45:31,040
Speaker 4: will tell you this.

948
00:45:31,400 --> 00:45:32,120
Speaker 2: You just wait.

949
00:45:32,200 --> 00:45:34,640
Speaker 4: After three months, what will you do to them? Okay,

950
00:45:34,800 --> 00:45:39,800
Speaker 4: you will see. I think they will not a city

951
00:45:39,840 --> 00:45:42,440
Speaker 4: comfortable here in Uganda. I will tell you this. I

952
00:45:42,520 --> 00:45:48,919
Speaker 4: must actually tell you the truth. Take camp for them.

953
00:45:48,960 --> 00:45:49,560
Speaker 1: If you're not.

954
00:45:49,480 --> 00:45:53,839
Speaker 4: Doing I am not responsible for building them transity camp.

955
00:45:55,160 --> 00:45:56,840
Speaker 4: Have you asked the British to take them away?

956
00:45:58,520 --> 00:45:58,719
Speaker 2: Yes?

957
00:45:58,760 --> 00:46:01,880
Speaker 4: It is a British high mission is here. He's a responsibility.

958
00:46:02,560 --> 00:46:04,879
Speaker 4: I have told him. You've said you wanted to teach

959
00:46:04,920 --> 00:46:08,040
Speaker 4: Britain a lesson President, Why is that? And that is

960
00:46:08,040 --> 00:46:11,960
Speaker 4: now listen, I'm teaching the British. I am teaching now

961
00:46:12,000 --> 00:46:15,040
Speaker 4: the listen because I am correcting them from the mystic

962
00:46:15,120 --> 00:46:17,960
Speaker 4: they had admit if they had to think before Elia

963
00:46:18,560 --> 00:46:22,560
Speaker 4: that that as the African here, who can even work

964
00:46:23,160 --> 00:46:27,480
Speaker 4: and building the railway with the instruction given to them

965
00:46:27,520 --> 00:46:31,120
Speaker 4: by the British, this problem will not happen.

966
00:46:32,560 --> 00:46:34,040
Speaker 3: Wow, that was like a Monty Python.

967
00:46:34,960 --> 00:46:38,560
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's remarkable that he's like talking about like these

968
00:46:38,600 --> 00:46:42,000
Speaker 2: twenty thousand people, terrible things will happen and they don't leave,

969
00:46:42,040 --> 00:46:45,040
Speaker 2: and then all of these guys laugh like just because

970
00:46:45,040 --> 00:46:49,440
Speaker 2: it's disgusting. It's yeah, and it's so I mean, he

971
00:46:49,480 --> 00:46:51,080
Speaker 2: has a point at the end there when he says

972
00:46:51,120 --> 00:46:52,719
Speaker 2: like it was fucked up to the British to bring

973
00:46:52,760 --> 00:46:54,840
Speaker 2: these people in the build railroads and not just have

974
00:46:55,040 --> 00:46:57,680
Speaker 2: us build railroads because it's our fucking country, which is

975
00:46:57,719 --> 00:46:59,840
Speaker 2: you know, a fair point. But at this point, the

976
00:47:00,080 --> 00:47:03,319
Speaker 2: guys are like third generation Ugandans, Like, it's messed up

977
00:47:03,320 --> 00:47:06,800
Speaker 2: to kick people out of your country and take their businesses.

978
00:47:07,440 --> 00:47:10,360
Speaker 2: It's just weird to me. How friendly the press was

979
00:47:10,360 --> 00:47:11,719
Speaker 2: to him still at this point.

980
00:47:11,560 --> 00:47:13,520
Speaker 3: Well, they were all British guys and they didn't really

981
00:47:13,520 --> 00:47:15,759
Speaker 3: give a FuG about brown people either way. They were

982
00:47:15,840 --> 00:47:16,839
Speaker 3: just there because they had to.

983
00:47:16,719 --> 00:47:20,799
Speaker 2: Being yeah, and they thought he was fun and they liked, yeah,

984
00:47:20,960 --> 00:47:25,320
Speaker 2: it's yeah. So Iddy's main defense of his policy was

985
00:47:25,360 --> 00:47:27,440
Speaker 2: that he was trying to give you guanna back to Ugandans.

986
00:47:27,760 --> 00:47:29,200
Speaker 2: He also said that God had told him in a

987
00:47:29,280 --> 00:47:31,960
Speaker 2: dream that South Asians were to blame for Ugandis economic

988
00:47:32,040 --> 00:47:34,880
Speaker 2: woes and corruption. It's probable that this policy had a

989
00:47:34,920 --> 00:47:36,560
Speaker 2: lot to do with the fact that Great Britain had

990
00:47:36,560 --> 00:47:39,360
Speaker 2: just refused to sell them guns so he could invade Tanzania.

991
00:47:39,440 --> 00:47:41,760
Speaker 2: So he was basically just being like, Okay, Great Britain,

992
00:47:41,800 --> 00:47:44,000
Speaker 2: you have to deal with eighty thousand refugees now because

993
00:47:44,040 --> 00:47:46,160
Speaker 2: you wouldn't give me the weapons I needed to fund

994
00:47:46,200 --> 00:47:49,720
Speaker 2: with my neighbor. Idy was brutal to the Ugandan Asians,

995
00:47:49,800 --> 00:47:52,560
Speaker 2: but he was equally brutal to ethnic Ugandans. His particular

996
00:47:52,600 --> 00:47:55,759
Speaker 2: targets were a Choli and Langhi tribesman. In the first

997
00:47:55,800 --> 00:47:57,800
Speaker 2: few days of his regime, he executed more than a

998
00:47:57,840 --> 00:48:00,560
Speaker 2: thousand members of these tribes in the army. As his

999
00:48:00,560 --> 00:48:02,799
Speaker 2: reign wore on, the purchase spread from the military to

1000
00:48:02,880 --> 00:48:05,799
Speaker 2: the general population. Bullets were in short supply in the

1001
00:48:05,800 --> 00:48:08,040
Speaker 2: country and desperately needed for all the wars id he

1002
00:48:08,120 --> 00:48:10,480
Speaker 2: planned to start, so the murder squads he dispatched had

1003
00:48:10,480 --> 00:48:12,400
Speaker 2: to find other ways of doing their work. Their preferred

1004
00:48:12,440 --> 00:48:18,360
Speaker 2: tools were sledgehammers, crowbars, and sometimes crocodiles. Oh my god, yeah, yeah,

1005
00:48:18,440 --> 00:48:22,480
Speaker 2: I mean, if you have crocodiles, every problem looks like crocodile.

1006
00:48:22,640 --> 00:48:25,120
Speaker 3: No one has ever wielded a crocodile. It's been a

1007
00:48:25,160 --> 00:48:25,560
Speaker 3: good guy.

1008
00:48:25,840 --> 00:48:29,399
Speaker 2: It's never a tool of the good guy. No, what

1009
00:48:29,440 --> 00:48:35,960
Speaker 2: about Yeah, So, the most feared government agency, sort of

1010
00:48:35,960 --> 00:48:39,920
Speaker 2: the idiomine equivalent of the German SS, was the State

1011
00:48:40,000 --> 00:48:43,000
Speaker 2: Research Bureau, which is maybe my favorite name for like

1012
00:48:43,080 --> 00:48:47,480
Speaker 2: a secret police organization. Sounds so like seems like the

1013
00:48:47,480 --> 00:48:49,760
Speaker 2: guys who should be like, oh, yeah, your soils pH

1014
00:48:49,880 --> 00:48:53,080
Speaker 2: is off. But yeah, these are the murder police, as

1015
00:48:53,080 --> 00:48:56,120
Speaker 2: opposed to you know, countries where all of the police

1016
00:48:56,120 --> 00:49:00,640
Speaker 2: are the murder police anyway. Apollo Lawalco survived one hundred

1017
00:49:00,680 --> 00:49:03,480
Speaker 2: ninety six days in the pink stucco building where they

1018
00:49:03,480 --> 00:49:06,640
Speaker 2: tortured and executed their captives. He gives us our clearest

1019
00:49:06,640 --> 00:49:08,719
Speaker 2: picture of what life was like for people deemed by

1020
00:49:08,719 --> 00:49:11,840
Speaker 2: Idioman to be enemies of the state. Quote, when the

1021
00:49:11,840 --> 00:49:13,880
Speaker 2: prisoner's name was called out, the guards would go and

1022
00:49:13,920 --> 00:49:16,080
Speaker 2: grab him. We were all in handcuffs already. We were

1023
00:49:16,120 --> 00:49:18,239
Speaker 2: in handcuffs twenty four hours a day. But they would

1024
00:49:18,320 --> 00:49:20,600
Speaker 2: change the position when they called a man, putting them

1025
00:49:20,640 --> 00:49:22,719
Speaker 2: on and back, and then they would place a long

1026
00:49:22,800 --> 00:49:25,640
Speaker 2: rope with a loop around his neck. Then someone would

1027
00:49:25,680 --> 00:49:28,000
Speaker 2: drag him by the rope along the staircase going up

1028
00:49:28,000 --> 00:49:30,120
Speaker 2: to the ground floor, and people would beating him on

1029
00:49:30,160 --> 00:49:32,080
Speaker 2: all parts of his body. Then his head would be

1030
00:49:32,080 --> 00:49:33,840
Speaker 2: beaten in. By the time he reached the top of

1031
00:49:33,880 --> 00:49:37,640
Speaker 2: the stairs, he was dead. So Looko claims the guards

1032
00:49:37,640 --> 00:49:40,239
Speaker 2: made sure the prisoners saw every execution. That was part

1033
00:49:40,280 --> 00:49:42,520
Speaker 2: of the point. He claims that between one hundred and

1034
00:49:42,560 --> 00:49:44,839
Speaker 2: fifty and two hundred people were executed every night while

1035
00:49:44,840 --> 00:49:47,880
Speaker 2: he was there in nineteen seventy seven. Looko believes he

1036
00:49:47,920 --> 00:49:50,800
Speaker 2: saw more than fifteen thousand Ugandans clubbed and beaten to

1037
00:49:50,840 --> 00:49:54,080
Speaker 2: death over just five months. At least two hundred and

1038
00:49:54,080 --> 00:49:57,359
Speaker 2: fifty thousand Ugandans perished during Idiomin's terror. In the real

1039
00:49:57,440 --> 00:50:00,640
Speaker 2: number maybe more like half a million. Roughly every fifty

1040
00:50:00,680 --> 00:50:03,440
Speaker 2: seven were to die over the next eight years. So

1041
00:50:04,000 --> 00:50:06,399
Speaker 2: Idy himself has said to have participated in a number

1042
00:50:06,400 --> 00:50:08,960
Speaker 2: of these murders. Luoko claims to remember seeing him beat

1043
00:50:09,000 --> 00:50:11,920
Speaker 2: men to death with sledgehammers while wearing a gas mask. Quote,

1044
00:50:12,120 --> 00:50:14,520
Speaker 2: I mean was actually participating. He turned to us at

1045
00:50:14,520 --> 00:50:17,920
Speaker 2: one point and told us to relax. The state research

1046
00:50:17,920 --> 00:50:20,880
Speaker 2: buomen were mostly Nubians like Idy, former super soldiers of

1047
00:50:20,920 --> 00:50:23,600
Speaker 2: the British Empire, doing what they'd always done, just for themselves.

1048
00:50:23,680 --> 00:50:27,279
Speaker 2: Now and again, this is not savagery that he's executing

1049
00:50:27,800 --> 00:50:30,600
Speaker 2: suddenly now that he's in charge. This is exactly what

1050
00:50:30,680 --> 00:50:33,560
Speaker 2: he was doing on British orders in Kenya. You know,

1051
00:50:34,520 --> 00:50:36,239
Speaker 2: I'm going to go ahead and guess that when he

1052
00:50:36,320 --> 00:50:38,200
Speaker 2: was president is not the first time he had people

1053
00:50:38,280 --> 00:50:39,279
Speaker 2: killed with sledgehammers.

1054
00:50:39,840 --> 00:50:46,040
Speaker 3: Like it never ceases to amaze me, just the capability

1055
00:50:46,080 --> 00:50:47,760
Speaker 3: of brutality of some people.

1056
00:50:48,120 --> 00:50:51,640
Speaker 2: No, and these all, all these deaths, Like, obviously these

1057
00:50:51,680 --> 00:50:55,480
Speaker 2: deaths aren't idiot mean, but they're also on colonialism, which is.

1058
00:50:55,719 --> 00:50:58,319
Speaker 3: Well, yeah, for sure, I blame everything on colonialism, just

1059
00:50:58,320 --> 00:50:59,280
Speaker 3: so restraight.

1060
00:50:59,000 --> 00:51:04,320
Speaker 2: And that you can it's totally fair. It's like being

1061
00:51:05,000 --> 00:51:06,840
Speaker 2: being a white kid who was educated in the South,

1062
00:51:06,960 --> 00:51:09,920
Speaker 2: I did not hear very much about colonialism growing up,

1063
00:51:10,320 --> 00:51:12,360
Speaker 2: and so it's once I've started researching a lot of

1064
00:51:12,360 --> 00:51:15,040
Speaker 2: these guys in the show and learning about King Leopold

1065
00:51:15,040 --> 00:51:16,920
Speaker 2: and the fifteen million who died in the Belgian Congo,

1066
00:51:16,960 --> 00:51:20,040
Speaker 2: which is probably the worst single crime of colonialism that

1067
00:51:20,040 --> 00:51:24,560
Speaker 2: I've come across. But like it's I think it would

1068
00:51:24,560 --> 00:51:27,920
Speaker 2: probably be fair to say that, like if you add

1069
00:51:27,960 --> 00:51:31,480
Speaker 2: together the Nazis and the Stalinist and Maoist communists and

1070
00:51:31,520 --> 00:51:33,600
Speaker 2: all the people they killed, it doesn't come close to

1071
00:51:34,080 --> 00:51:37,520
Speaker 2: the deaths to colonialism. Yeah, absolutely, And you know, in

1072
00:51:37,560 --> 00:51:39,880
Speaker 2: a shorter time, you know, the Nazis were great at

1073
00:51:39,960 --> 00:51:44,000
Speaker 2: killing people fast, but there's I will never know most

1074
00:51:44,000 --> 00:51:46,160
Speaker 2: of what was done on behalf of the British Empire.

1075
00:51:46,440 --> 00:51:47,920
Speaker 3: Yeah.

1076
00:51:47,960 --> 00:51:54,400
Speaker 2: Anyway, so while most secret police organizations were you know,

1077
00:51:54,440 --> 00:51:56,840
Speaker 2: wear leather trench coats and dress in all black and

1078
00:51:56,920 --> 00:51:59,320
Speaker 2: like you know, like your cat. You're in central casting.

1079
00:51:59,360 --> 00:52:01,360
Speaker 2: You're trying to like cast a secret police a Like

1080
00:52:01,360 --> 00:52:03,600
Speaker 2: they're all in black. They look like the Matrix guys.

1081
00:52:03,719 --> 00:52:07,160
Speaker 3: Yeah, were turtlenecks.

1082
00:52:08,000 --> 00:52:11,000
Speaker 2: Not the men of the Research Bureau. They wore wore

1083
00:52:11,120 --> 00:52:15,319
Speaker 2: flowered Hawaiian shirts, platform shoes and sunglasses. Oh no, they're

1084
00:52:15,360 --> 00:52:21,560
Speaker 2: dressed real cool like me. Oh, I appreciate someone doing

1085
00:52:21,600 --> 00:52:24,400
Speaker 2: it different. If you're if you're gonna massacre hundreds of

1086
00:52:24,440 --> 00:52:27,319
Speaker 2: thousands of people, at least try a new You know,

1087
00:52:27,360 --> 00:52:29,320
Speaker 2: there's no arm bands here, it's it's.

1088
00:52:29,200 --> 00:52:35,400
Speaker 3: Yeah style, dressed like parroteads. I guess we're sandals.

1089
00:52:35,600 --> 00:52:40,200
Speaker 2: If if Jimmy Buffett carried out a massacre, it would

1090
00:52:40,200 --> 00:52:40,839
Speaker 2: look like this.

1091
00:52:41,920 --> 00:52:44,040
Speaker 3: Every time you killed somebody, get a lay Yeah.

1092
00:52:44,120 --> 00:52:46,040
Speaker 2: Well, and you know they're all drunk. They've got a

1093
00:52:46,040 --> 00:52:50,719
Speaker 2: whiskey plane. Yeah yeah. Uh So. The Research Brio headquarters

1094
00:52:50,800 --> 00:52:53,480
Speaker 2: was connected to president a Means Home by an underground tunnel,

1095
00:52:53,520 --> 00:52:55,719
Speaker 2: so we could show up and participate in the executions

1096
00:52:55,760 --> 00:52:58,120
Speaker 2: when he wanted to. Most of the work was headed

1097
00:52:58,120 --> 00:53:00,759
Speaker 2: by a man named Major faruquin Men. He was sort

1098
00:53:00,800 --> 00:53:03,319
Speaker 2: of the Laventi Barria type figure, and Barria was the

1099
00:53:03,360 --> 00:53:07,520
Speaker 2: head of the KGB for a while under Stalin. So

1100
00:53:07,560 --> 00:53:09,319
Speaker 2: he's the kind of guy who could murder his own

1101
00:53:09,360 --> 00:53:11,480
Speaker 2: friends after a night of drinking and hanging out with them.

1102
00:53:11,520 --> 00:53:14,400
Speaker 2: At one point, he had his wife and three daughters executed.

1103
00:53:14,480 --> 00:53:17,000
Speaker 3: Fuck dude, that guy should have waited till a grand

1104
00:53:17,040 --> 00:53:17,799
Speaker 3: the photo came out.

1105
00:53:18,960 --> 00:53:20,720
Speaker 2: Just didn't get it out of his system.

1106
00:53:20,719 --> 00:53:21,239
Speaker 3: I think so.

1107
00:53:22,680 --> 00:53:26,200
Speaker 2: He suspected his wife and daughters were helping gun and

1108
00:53:26,239 --> 00:53:30,040
Speaker 2: rebels because they were Bagandas, which is like the tribe

1109
00:53:30,080 --> 00:53:33,600
Speaker 2: one of the tribes that ID he hated. So yeah,

1110
00:53:33,640 --> 00:53:36,200
Speaker 2: It's important to understand that all the oppression apparatus id

1111
00:53:36,239 --> 00:53:39,320
Speaker 2: he created was very decentralized, So most of the deaths

1112
00:53:39,360 --> 00:53:42,560
Speaker 2: during this period were not idiomins signing someone's death warrant.

1113
00:53:43,000 --> 00:53:44,719
Speaker 2: It was as a result of the fact that all

1114
00:53:44,800 --> 00:53:48,040
Speaker 2: soldiers and intelligence officers in his country were allowed to

1115
00:53:48,160 --> 00:53:51,680
Speaker 2: arrest or kill any person they considered dangerous to peace

1116
00:53:51,719 --> 00:53:54,160
Speaker 2: and good order. Man so Idy gave his men a

1117
00:53:54,239 --> 00:53:57,680
Speaker 2: legal excuse to pursue their personal grudges and steal from people.

1118
00:53:58,040 --> 00:54:02,759
Speaker 3: Wow, abolish ice, you guys just dropping out in there.

1119
00:54:02,880 --> 00:54:05,600
Speaker 2: No, And that is the official line of the podcast

1120
00:54:05,719 --> 00:54:06,680
Speaker 2: is Abolish Ice.

1121
00:54:06,800 --> 00:54:09,720
Speaker 3: Bid ritas a ball of science. I'm drinking all water

1122
00:54:09,880 --> 00:54:11,640
Speaker 3: lukewarm until ice is abolished.

1123
00:54:14,360 --> 00:54:18,320
Speaker 2: It is funny that, like our Gestapo equivalent is is ice,

1124
00:54:18,440 --> 00:54:19,319
Speaker 2: because if.

1125
00:54:19,200 --> 00:54:21,040
Speaker 3: They had known fifteen years ago, they probably would have

1126
00:54:21,080 --> 00:54:22,120
Speaker 3: named it something cooler.

1127
00:54:22,560 --> 00:54:26,280
Speaker 2: Ice is. Yeah, it's not cool. It's not that cool.

1128
00:54:26,840 --> 00:54:27,080
Speaker 3: Yeah.

1129
00:54:28,280 --> 00:54:31,680
Speaker 2: Amen gave his men excuses, yeah, to pursue personal grudges

1130
00:54:31,680 --> 00:54:34,520
Speaker 2: and steal from people. One survivor recalled, quote, everything you

1131
00:54:34,560 --> 00:54:37,080
Speaker 2: have seen in Wild West movies was everyday life. Here

1132
00:54:37,120 --> 00:54:39,800
Speaker 2: someone bumping off the husband and publicly taking the wife,

1133
00:54:39,880 --> 00:54:42,200
Speaker 2: or someone bumping you off and openly driving off with

1134
00:54:42,280 --> 00:54:45,640
Speaker 2: your car. So I hope we presented kind of a

1135
00:54:45,680 --> 00:54:48,239
Speaker 2: picture of how brutal Amin's regime was. Let's dig a

1136
00:54:48,280 --> 00:54:51,280
Speaker 2: little deeper into the man himself. You can't understand idiomine

1137
00:54:51,280 --> 00:54:56,160
Speaker 2: without understanding that he was great at fucking Who wrote that? Well,

1138
00:54:57,040 --> 00:55:00,000
Speaker 2: at least he needed everyone to believe that he was great,

1139
00:55:00,640 --> 00:55:02,520
Speaker 2: So one way or the other, it's it's important to

1140
00:55:02,560 --> 00:55:04,480
Speaker 2: understand that was a part of his public image. That's

1141
00:55:04,480 --> 00:55:08,680
Speaker 2: how he knew his bad ladies, No and and almost

1142
00:55:08,760 --> 00:55:12,239
Speaker 2: all like the only person, the only famous person I'm

1143
00:55:12,280 --> 00:55:16,360
Speaker 2: convinced who is ever actually good at fucking. I was

1144
00:55:16,440 --> 00:55:18,080
Speaker 2: gonna say Marlon Brando, but oh.

1145
00:55:18,040 --> 00:55:21,359
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, yeah, well Marlon Brando makes sense.

1146
00:55:21,600 --> 00:55:26,680
Speaker 2: Yeah yeah, he was method. So he was method anyway.

1147
00:55:26,760 --> 00:55:31,080
Speaker 2: Yeah so, I mean was it was important to him

1148
00:55:31,080 --> 00:55:33,719
Speaker 2: that there be a public image that he was virile

1149
00:55:33,880 --> 00:55:37,520
Speaker 2: and good at sex. His former Minister for Health, Henry Kimba,

1150
00:55:37,640 --> 00:55:41,320
Speaker 2: said this, besides his five wives. Also, he had five wives.

1151
00:55:41,640 --> 00:55:43,600
Speaker 3: That's kind of low honestly for what I thought.

1152
00:55:44,080 --> 00:55:47,720
Speaker 2: Yeah, No, he's he's he's he's a conservative fellow. Besides

1153
00:55:47,719 --> 00:55:50,480
Speaker 2: his five wives, Amine has had countless other women, many

1154
00:55:50,520 --> 00:55:52,600
Speaker 2: of whom have borne him children. His sex life is

1155
00:55:52,640 --> 00:55:55,600
Speaker 2: truly extraordinary. He regards his sexual energy as a sign

1156
00:55:55,640 --> 00:55:58,160
Speaker 2: of his power and authority. He never tries to hide

1157
00:55:58,160 --> 00:56:01,480
Speaker 2: his lust, his eyes locked onto any beautiful woman. His

1158
00:56:01,520 --> 00:56:04,800
Speaker 2: reputation for sexual performance is so startling that women often

1159
00:56:04,840 --> 00:56:08,000
Speaker 2: deliberately make themselves available, and his love affairs have included

1160
00:56:08,000 --> 00:56:10,920
Speaker 2: women of all colors in many nations, from schoolgirls to

1161
00:56:10,960 --> 00:56:16,400
Speaker 2: mature women, from street girls to university lecturers, which is

1162
00:56:17,200 --> 00:56:18,319
Speaker 2: who knows how true that is.

1163
00:56:18,719 --> 00:56:19,800
Speaker 3: It sounds like a lot of rape.

1164
00:56:20,080 --> 00:56:23,080
Speaker 2: Definitely, definitely a lot, because there's a ton of stories

1165
00:56:23,120 --> 00:56:25,439
Speaker 2: of him having husbands executed so he could fuck their way.

1166
00:56:25,440 --> 00:56:28,680
Speaker 2: Oh my gosh, but this is you know, his former

1167
00:56:28,719 --> 00:56:30,920
Speaker 2: minister of health giving what is This is what idiot

1168
00:56:30,920 --> 00:56:33,759
Speaker 2: men wanted people to hear about him, that he's because

1169
00:56:34,120 --> 00:56:36,680
Speaker 2: this was important, of course. Yeah, I'm great at fighting

1170
00:56:36,719 --> 00:56:37,600
Speaker 2: and I'm great at fucking.

1171
00:56:37,760 --> 00:56:39,240
Speaker 3: Yeah. He sounds like Wilt Chamberlain.

1172
00:56:39,880 --> 00:56:43,160
Speaker 2: There's just something about authoritarian assholes and needing people to

1173
00:56:43,160 --> 00:56:44,680
Speaker 2: believe they're tough and good at fucking.

1174
00:56:44,760 --> 00:56:48,600
Speaker 3: Mm hmm. I want everyone to know I am bad

1175
00:56:48,760 --> 00:56:58,319
Speaker 3: at sex, which means good sex over there. Yeah.

1176
00:56:58,360 --> 00:57:01,040
Speaker 2: I'm trying to think about which of our presidents were

1177
00:57:01,200 --> 00:57:04,600
Speaker 2: definitely the bit because I hear JFK was terrible. Really yeah,

1178
00:57:04,640 --> 00:57:07,280
Speaker 2: I've heard LBJ said JFK was terrible.

1179
00:57:07,320 --> 00:57:08,319
Speaker 3: Well, you can't trust that guy.

1180
00:57:08,360 --> 00:57:09,319
Speaker 2: You can't trust that guy.

1181
00:57:09,440 --> 00:57:10,920
Speaker 3: He was he was jealous.

1182
00:57:12,719 --> 00:57:15,080
Speaker 2: And he called his dick jumbo, which means he did.

1183
00:57:16,040 --> 00:57:19,280
Speaker 3: Well, maybe that's true. Then I don't know. Nixon seems

1184
00:57:19,320 --> 00:57:19,800
Speaker 3: pretty bad.

1185
00:57:20,480 --> 00:57:25,680
Speaker 2: Nixon can't have been good, right, no way, No, I

1186
00:57:25,680 --> 00:57:27,520
Speaker 2: feel like Teddy Roosevelt.

1187
00:57:27,840 --> 00:57:30,400
Speaker 3: Well he was in a wheelchair. No, it was FDR

1188
00:57:30,880 --> 00:57:31,360
Speaker 3: never mind.

1189
00:57:31,440 --> 00:57:33,360
Speaker 2: Well he was a big stick guy, right, Yeah, it

1190
00:57:33,440 --> 00:57:34,240
Speaker 2: was a big stick guy.

1191
00:57:34,360 --> 00:57:35,360
Speaker 3: Yeah, that guy could fuck.

1192
00:57:35,480 --> 00:57:37,800
Speaker 2: That guy could fuck. And I feel like FDR was

1193
00:57:37,840 --> 00:57:40,880
Speaker 2: probably pretty good, but like he would have been like

1194
00:57:40,920 --> 00:57:43,640
Speaker 2: a hands an oral man. That's my guess for FDR.

1195
00:57:44,840 --> 00:57:47,240
Speaker 2: I think he leaves them satisfied. As what I'm saying,

1196
00:57:47,240 --> 00:57:52,800
Speaker 2: I don't think I agree. Yeah yeah, so idiot mean

1197
00:57:52,880 --> 00:57:55,120
Speaker 2: Again had five wives. His favorite wife was a lady

1198
00:57:55,160 --> 00:57:57,720
Speaker 2: named Sarah. He met her when she was eighteen and

1199
00:57:57,760 --> 00:58:01,200
Speaker 2: a go go dancer for the Revolutionary Suicide jazz band. Okay,

1200
00:58:02,080 --> 00:58:06,880
Speaker 2: story as oldest time Idy fell in love, but tragically,

1201
00:58:07,000 --> 00:58:09,760
Speaker 2: Sarah already had a fiance and she was pregnant. So

1202
00:58:09,800 --> 00:58:12,080
Speaker 2: when she gave birth on Christmas Day nineteen seventy four,

1203
00:58:12,160 --> 00:58:14,200
Speaker 2: oh god it he just told everyone that the kid

1204
00:58:14,240 --> 00:58:16,400
Speaker 2: was his and had the birth announced on state television.

1205
00:58:16,440 --> 00:58:17,160
Speaker 3: Oh what the fuck.

1206
00:58:17,240 --> 00:58:19,720
Speaker 2: Sarah's fiance was not happy with this, but he died

1207
00:58:19,720 --> 00:58:22,200
Speaker 2: in a car crash immediately after this, so it worked out.

1208
00:58:22,280 --> 00:58:24,240
Speaker 3: No suspicion, no but then at all.

1209
00:58:24,400 --> 00:58:27,200
Speaker 2: Nope, just a random car crash the like the day

1210
00:58:27,200 --> 00:58:28,280
Speaker 2: that he complains.

1211
00:58:27,960 --> 00:58:28,680
Speaker 3: Oh poor guy.

1212
00:58:28,760 --> 00:58:34,120
Speaker 2: Yeah yeah, yeah, I shouldn't laughed there. I may be

1213
00:58:34,360 --> 00:58:36,040
Speaker 2: getting a little callous with all these stories.

1214
00:58:36,080 --> 00:58:39,080
Speaker 3: I mean, it's hard not to disassociate a little bit.

1215
00:58:39,200 --> 00:58:42,800
Speaker 3: I mean, so far in the last hour, I've learned

1216
00:58:42,800 --> 00:58:44,600
Speaker 3: of many millions of people died.

1217
00:58:44,800 --> 00:58:49,200
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's it's horrific. So Idy, I mean married Sarah

1218
00:58:49,240 --> 00:58:51,920
Speaker 2: in nineteen seventy five was a small private ceremony, but

1219
00:58:51,960 --> 00:58:54,840
Speaker 2: Iddy was concerned that having a small private ceremony might

1220
00:58:54,880 --> 00:58:57,560
Speaker 2: be portrayed or might be seen as excluding the people

1221
00:58:57,560 --> 00:59:01,880
Speaker 2: of Uganda, so he remarried her in a gigantic televised ceremony. Yes,

1222
00:59:01,920 --> 00:59:04,919
Speaker 2: Sir Arafat was his best man. The banquet cost two

1223
00:59:04,920 --> 00:59:08,360
Speaker 2: million dollars, the banquet, not the whole wedding, just that,

1224
00:59:08,400 --> 00:59:11,080
Speaker 2: which I would kind of want to check out a TOI.

1225
00:59:10,960 --> 00:59:15,640
Speaker 3: I mean, I've seen Super sixteen, you know whatever it's called.

1226
00:59:15,720 --> 00:59:20,120
Speaker 2: So President Amine cut the rudding wedding cake with a sword.

1227
00:59:20,480 --> 00:59:22,840
Speaker 2: Knowing his history, there's no chance he didn't also use

1228
00:59:22,880 --> 00:59:23,920
Speaker 2: that sword to stab people.

1229
00:59:24,000 --> 00:59:26,160
Speaker 3: Obviously. This sword guy is a sort of guy.

1230
00:59:26,280 --> 00:59:30,320
Speaker 2: Fucking sword guy to the problem. That's how you know

1231
00:59:30,400 --> 00:59:33,880
Speaker 2: someone's trusted if they're a fucking sword guy. M hmm.

1232
00:59:35,120 --> 00:59:36,720
Speaker 2: Machete is a people's weapon.

1233
00:59:37,920 --> 00:59:41,880
Speaker 3: While you were learning about colonialism, I was studying a Blockchaine.

1234
00:59:47,040 --> 00:59:49,360
Speaker 2: So Idy had five wives and something like forty or

1235
00:59:49,400 --> 00:59:52,480
Speaker 2: fifty children. He married his first two wives in the

1236
00:59:52,480 --> 00:59:55,120
Speaker 2: same year, nineteen sixty six, when he was twenty eight.

1237
00:59:55,960 --> 00:59:58,480
Speaker 2: One of those marriages went all right and produced several children,

1238
00:59:58,520 --> 01:00:01,680
Speaker 2: but his second wife Ka divorced. He murdered the best

1239
01:00:01,720 --> 01:00:04,760
Speaker 2: man and then murdered k Her arms and legs were

1240
01:00:04,800 --> 01:00:06,439
Speaker 2: found in a sack in the trunk of a car.

1241
01:00:06,520 --> 01:00:08,840
Speaker 2: So Idy had her body sewn back together and marched

1242
01:00:08,840 --> 01:00:11,760
Speaker 2: around in front of his children and other wives, or

1243
01:00:11,800 --> 01:00:14,880
Speaker 2: he didn't. So this is again where we get into

1244
01:00:14,880 --> 01:00:18,240
Speaker 2: some controversy because his kids are still around and talking

1245
01:00:18,280 --> 01:00:21,840
Speaker 2: today and do speeches, and like several of them, they

1246
01:00:21,840 --> 01:00:24,520
Speaker 2: don't like necessarily doubt the crimes that were committed in

1247
01:00:24,560 --> 01:00:27,880
Speaker 2: their dad's reign. But they are all pretty consistent about

1248
01:00:27,880 --> 01:00:29,280
Speaker 2: the fact that no, he was a good dad and

1249
01:00:29,360 --> 01:00:31,680
Speaker 2: very normal around us. So it's possible this is a

1250
01:00:32,000 --> 01:00:35,800
Speaker 2: this story is a lie, like the Witchcraft stuff. Hard

1251
01:00:35,800 --> 01:00:39,320
Speaker 2: to tell because again, his kids even today, are all

1252
01:00:39,360 --> 01:00:42,680
Speaker 2: pretty much he was fun, So he might not have

1253
01:00:42,680 --> 01:00:47,960
Speaker 2: brought it home. I really don't know. I wasn't there. Yeah, Okay,

1254
01:00:48,000 --> 01:00:50,240
Speaker 2: it's one of those things. It's impossible to know the truth.

1255
01:00:50,240 --> 01:00:52,880
Speaker 2: There's stories that he was brutal to his kids and

1256
01:00:52,920 --> 01:00:55,440
Speaker 2: fucking had corpses creating around them, and then his kids

1257
01:00:55,440 --> 01:00:58,320
Speaker 2: say stuff like, here's a quote from his son, it

1258
01:00:58,360 --> 01:01:00,160
Speaker 2: was fun with my dad. All the time was on

1259
01:01:01,000 --> 01:01:04,520
Speaker 2: His daughter Maimuna Amin said, he was such a lovely man,

1260
01:01:04,600 --> 01:01:07,040
Speaker 2: so good, so lovely. He never beats any children when

1261
01:01:07,040 --> 01:01:08,640
Speaker 2: he's at home. He just wanted us all to be

1262
01:01:08,680 --> 01:01:10,600
Speaker 2: on him. He's like a mother, a father, a sister,

1263
01:01:10,680 --> 01:01:13,080
Speaker 2: a brother in one. He loved music and he's always

1264
01:01:13,120 --> 01:01:14,560
Speaker 2: on his accordion singing.

1265
01:01:14,960 --> 01:01:17,600
Speaker 3: Wow, what are revisionist history this jickass?

1266
01:01:17,960 --> 01:01:20,560
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean it's also possible that he was a

1267
01:01:20,600 --> 01:01:24,000
Speaker 2: brutal monster everywhere outside of the home and was fine

1268
01:01:24,000 --> 01:01:24,640
Speaker 2: with his kids.

1269
01:01:24,880 --> 01:01:26,680
Speaker 3: Yeah, and they just never heard about the other stuff.

1270
01:01:26,760 --> 01:01:28,640
Speaker 2: No, they heard about it, but again they know a

1271
01:01:28,720 --> 01:01:31,200
Speaker 2: lot of them don't deny the brutality of the regime.

1272
01:01:31,240 --> 01:01:33,640
Speaker 2: They're just like at home, he was a normal guy.

1273
01:01:33,960 --> 01:01:36,560
Speaker 2: That's fucked which that happens, like, you can find plenty

1274
01:01:36,560 --> 01:01:38,960
Speaker 2: of stories about people hanging out with Hitler and being

1275
01:01:39,040 --> 01:01:41,520
Speaker 2: like he was super nice and he was like my uncle, and.

1276
01:01:41,560 --> 01:01:44,800
Speaker 3: Yeah, people always say dictators are charismanic and stuff. I mean,

1277
01:01:45,560 --> 01:01:48,760
Speaker 3: even if we I feel this same thing with celebrities,

1278
01:01:48,760 --> 01:01:49,440
Speaker 3: I don't really know.

1279
01:01:49,440 --> 01:01:52,160
Speaker 2: But yeah, and I can't know what we do know,

1280
01:01:52,480 --> 01:01:54,760
Speaker 2: and what we do know for certain is that Idiomine

1281
01:01:54,800 --> 01:01:58,560
Speaker 2: played the accordion fucking constantly. He was apparently if you're

1282
01:01:58,560 --> 01:02:01,360
Speaker 2: an accordion guy, he was apparently good at playing the accordion.

1283
01:02:01,440 --> 01:02:03,400
Speaker 2: And here is here's a picture of him doing the

1284
01:02:03,400 --> 01:02:04,040
Speaker 2: weird al thing.

1285
01:02:04,240 --> 01:02:08,840
Speaker 3: Oh my god, right, it's weird that dorks are truly

1286
01:02:08,880 --> 01:02:11,360
Speaker 3: the worst people in the world because this guy's in

1287
01:02:11,400 --> 01:02:13,280
Speaker 3: the swords, accordions, bagpipes.

1288
01:02:13,920 --> 01:02:16,840
Speaker 2: This guy has bad taste. Everyone with bad tish needs

1289
01:02:16,880 --> 01:02:20,120
Speaker 2: to be called no. And if he had grown up now, like, yeah,

1290
01:02:20,160 --> 01:02:22,200
Speaker 2: he would still play the accordion and have a bunch

1291
01:02:22,240 --> 01:02:23,880
Speaker 2: of swords, but he would also be able to talk

1292
01:02:23,880 --> 01:02:26,600
Speaker 2: to you about anime for sixteen hours. Oh yeah, absolutely,

1293
01:02:26,800 --> 01:02:29,040
Speaker 2: m yeah, I'm sorry anime fans.

1294
01:02:29,120 --> 01:02:32,640
Speaker 3: I mean, anime is pretty cool. Yeah, sagoy some of it.

1295
01:02:35,480 --> 01:02:38,040
Speaker 2: So the stuff idi Amine is probably most famous for

1296
01:02:38,280 --> 01:02:41,760
Speaker 2: is again cannibalism, witchcraft, and his obsession with Scotland, because

1297
01:02:41,800 --> 01:02:43,480
Speaker 2: that's like the sensational stuff or you can.

1298
01:02:43,440 --> 01:02:46,280
Speaker 3: Do so he's for sure eight people we don't know.

1299
01:02:46,640 --> 01:02:49,520
Speaker 2: Okay again, that's one of those Yeah, we're about to

1300
01:02:49,560 --> 01:02:52,160
Speaker 2: get into that. So it's an arguably true that he

1301
01:02:52,240 --> 01:02:55,080
Speaker 2: loved Scotland. There's a shitload of documented evidence of that.

1302
01:02:55,160 --> 01:02:57,520
Speaker 3: Yeah. Maybe he just was eating some hagas and people

1303
01:02:57,520 --> 01:02:59,440
Speaker 3: thought it was like a human intestine.

1304
01:02:59,160 --> 01:03:01,919
Speaker 2: Or they just wished it. Yeah exactly, Oh please eat

1305
01:03:01,960 --> 01:03:05,560
Speaker 2: some people. Stop with that shit. It is very much

1306
01:03:05,880 --> 01:03:07,320
Speaker 2: up for debate as to whether or not he was

1307
01:03:07,360 --> 01:03:10,560
Speaker 2: really into black magic and cannibalism. The rumors that he

1308
01:03:10,880 --> 01:03:14,000
Speaker 2: was in the magic and eating people started with the Begondans,

1309
01:03:14,920 --> 01:03:17,160
Speaker 2: and the Begondans were the people from South Uganda and

1310
01:03:17,200 --> 01:03:20,600
Speaker 2: they did not like the people from North Uganda. A

1311
01:03:20,600 --> 01:03:23,080
Speaker 2: lot of these rumors originate from one Begondan who served

1312
01:03:23,080 --> 01:03:26,400
Speaker 2: in Idioman's cabinet. He wrote in his book, which was

1313
01:03:26,440 --> 01:03:28,520
Speaker 2: one of the major sources for the Last King of Scotland,

1314
01:03:28,600 --> 01:03:32,400
Speaker 2: quote A means bizarre behavior derives partly from his tribal background.

1315
01:03:32,480 --> 01:03:35,480
Speaker 2: Like many other warrior societies, the kakua Amans tribe are

1316
01:03:35,480 --> 01:03:38,640
Speaker 2: known to have practiced blood rituals on slain enemies. These

1317
01:03:38,640 --> 01:03:40,640
Speaker 2: involve cutting a piece of flesh from the body to

1318
01:03:40,680 --> 01:03:43,480
Speaker 2: subdue the dead man's spirit, or tasting the victim's blood

1319
01:03:43,480 --> 01:03:46,800
Speaker 2: to render the spirit harmless. Such rituals still exist among

1320
01:03:46,800 --> 01:03:48,680
Speaker 2: the Coaqua. If they kill a man, it is their

1321
01:03:48,720 --> 01:03:50,800
Speaker 2: practice to insert a knife in the body and touch

1322
01:03:50,800 --> 01:03:53,040
Speaker 2: the bloody blade to their lips. I have reason to

1323
01:03:53,040 --> 01:03:55,840
Speaker 2: believe that it means practices do not stop at tasting blood.

1324
01:03:55,880 --> 01:03:58,040
Speaker 2: On several occasions, he has boasted to me and others

1325
01:03:58,040 --> 01:04:00,560
Speaker 2: that he has eaten human flesh. On to say that

1326
01:04:00,600 --> 01:04:02,920
Speaker 2: eating human flesh is not uncommon in his home area.

1327
01:04:03,520 --> 01:04:05,800
Speaker 2: It's possible that this is true. The British noted that

1328
01:04:05,840 --> 01:04:09,000
Speaker 2: the Kaqua engaged in quote sacrifices of humans and animals,

1329
01:04:09,400 --> 01:04:11,520
Speaker 2: but it's also worth noting that most of the claims

1330
01:04:11,560 --> 01:04:14,880
Speaker 2: about cannibalism came from Iddy's enemies. A major source for

1331
01:04:14,920 --> 01:04:17,600
Speaker 2: this podcast was an article from the University of Groningen

1332
01:04:17,680 --> 01:04:21,600
Speaker 2: in the Netherlands titled idiamin Icon of Evil. This article

1333
01:04:21,680 --> 01:04:24,480
Speaker 2: notes that the witchcraft and cannibalism myths may have started

1334
01:04:24,480 --> 01:04:27,560
Speaker 2: as a result of local racism within Uganda, so racism

1335
01:04:27,600 --> 01:04:32,680
Speaker 2: from southern Ugandans towards northern Ugandans. Quote the Southern Ugandans

1336
01:04:32,680 --> 01:04:36,520
Speaker 2: are particularly contemptuous of the southern Sudanese and Nubies, not

1337
01:04:36,640 --> 01:04:39,720
Speaker 2: of other northern tribes as wild and uncivilized. It is

1338
01:04:40,080 --> 01:04:42,320
Speaker 2: from them that we have reports of Amen and his

1339
01:04:42,400 --> 01:04:45,040
Speaker 2: nubies tasting the blood of their victims and eating their livers,

1340
01:04:45,320 --> 01:04:47,480
Speaker 2: and the explanation that such a custom is either a

1341
01:04:47,560 --> 01:04:48,920
Speaker 2: nubie or Kakua one.

1342
01:04:49,240 --> 01:04:50,600
Speaker 3: So we don't know.

1343
01:04:50,840 --> 01:04:54,640
Speaker 2: It's possible he licked blood. It's possible he ate flesh.

1344
01:04:54,680 --> 01:04:57,440
Speaker 2: It's also possible that's just racism from people in the South.

1345
01:04:57,560 --> 01:05:00,840
Speaker 3: Hey, I mean I would argue, you know, you kill

1346
01:05:01,520 --> 01:05:04,600
Speaker 3: thousands of people, that is worse anyway. I mean, like,

1347
01:05:04,800 --> 01:05:08,400
Speaker 3: I wouldn't be completely surprised if you know, he got

1348
01:05:08,400 --> 01:05:10,320
Speaker 3: into desecrating some bodies at all.

1349
01:05:10,200 --> 01:05:13,240
Speaker 2: It wouldn't be beyond the pale to assume. But it's

1350
01:05:13,280 --> 01:05:17,440
Speaker 2: also I think this is something that happens in Western

1351
01:05:17,480 --> 01:05:20,760
Speaker 2: media a lot with these dictators where if you can

1352
01:05:20,800 --> 01:05:22,920
Speaker 2: get like that, there's a bunch of stories about the

1353
01:05:22,960 --> 01:05:26,400
Speaker 2: North Korean regime that are bullshit that have no basis

1354
01:05:26,400 --> 01:05:28,680
Speaker 2: in reality about like and it's always like the kooky

1355
01:05:28,800 --> 01:05:32,520
Speaker 2: ones about like ridiculous claims that Kim's made and like

1356
01:05:32,560 --> 01:05:36,240
Speaker 2: the stuff that sounds really funny, like that you can

1357
01:05:36,320 --> 01:05:39,160
Speaker 2: laugh at. And some of those are true because like

1358
01:05:39,200 --> 01:05:41,680
Speaker 2: any authoritarian regime is going to have some silly stuff

1359
01:05:41,720 --> 01:05:45,320
Speaker 2: around it, huh, because it's a silly thing. But a

1360
01:05:45,320 --> 01:05:48,680
Speaker 2: lot of it's just lies, and it's the same thing.

1361
01:05:49,440 --> 01:05:51,800
Speaker 2: It's lies that make it seem like something other than

1362
01:05:51,800 --> 01:05:54,360
Speaker 2: what it is, which is a brutal dictatorship as opposed

1363
01:05:54,400 --> 01:05:56,880
Speaker 2: to like, no, it's this crazy cannibal madman who ruled

1364
01:05:56,880 --> 01:05:58,919
Speaker 2: the country, and it's like, well, no, there's nothing really crazy.

1365
01:05:58,960 --> 01:06:01,200
Speaker 2: He's just a monster like all of the other.

1366
01:06:01,280 --> 01:06:03,280
Speaker 3: That's less scary to me than just a person who

1367
01:06:03,320 --> 01:06:05,520
Speaker 3: knows exactly what they're doing and does it anyway. That's

1368
01:06:05,560 --> 01:06:10,000
Speaker 3: like an oil tycoon or something. And then there was

1369
01:06:10,040 --> 01:06:12,840
Speaker 3: a rumor they're like, did you hear that he litters? Yeah,

1370
01:06:13,640 --> 01:06:14,800
Speaker 3: he's running the environment.

1371
01:06:16,120 --> 01:06:19,200
Speaker 2: Yeah. And that's kind of why I wanted to dig

1372
01:06:19,240 --> 01:06:21,720
Speaker 2: into these myths about him a lot, because that's what

1373
01:06:21,760 --> 01:06:24,040
Speaker 2: most people know about idiot mean, which I think is

1374
01:06:24,120 --> 01:06:26,720
Speaker 2: less I think the fact that the idea that, oh,

1375
01:06:26,760 --> 01:06:28,840
Speaker 2: maybe this guy was a cannibal and a dictator is

1376
01:06:28,920 --> 01:06:31,240
Speaker 2: less interesting than like, this guy was trained to be

1377
01:06:31,280 --> 01:06:34,640
Speaker 2: a brutal dictator in the British army who raised him

1378
01:06:34,680 --> 01:06:36,920
Speaker 2: to be a soldier and then abandon him and his

1379
01:06:37,000 --> 01:06:40,440
Speaker 2: country to whatever was going to happen next, which I

1380
01:06:40,440 --> 01:06:45,240
Speaker 2: think is a more accurate story, But that one isn't

1381
01:06:45,360 --> 01:06:50,200
Speaker 2: fun for Americans because it implicates all of Western civilization

1382
01:06:51,480 --> 01:06:54,160
Speaker 2: as opposed to some cannibal gotten in charge over there

1383
01:06:54,200 --> 01:07:01,400
Speaker 2: in Africa. Anyway, that's my thinking on the man. So

1384
01:07:03,160 --> 01:07:07,040
Speaker 2: obviously by this time, and you know, by the middle

1385
01:07:07,040 --> 01:07:09,800
Speaker 2: of his reign, kind of the bloom was off the rose.

1386
01:07:10,320 --> 01:07:13,520
Speaker 2: The British were no longer fans of idiomin What if

1387
01:07:13,520 --> 01:07:15,919
Speaker 2: his atrocities had filtered out to the world. Europe turned

1388
01:07:15,960 --> 01:07:18,160
Speaker 2: away and idiot did what he always did when someone

1389
01:07:18,240 --> 01:07:21,240
Speaker 2: questioned him. He flipped out and attacked. He declared himself

1390
01:07:21,360 --> 01:07:24,400
Speaker 2: conquer of the British Empire. He had T shirts printed

1391
01:07:24,440 --> 01:07:26,000
Speaker 2: up with his face on it and Conquer of the

1392
01:07:26,040 --> 01:07:29,800
Speaker 2: British Empire printed beneath, which is a pretty pro move.

1393
01:07:30,440 --> 01:07:33,840
Speaker 2: He developed a love for having white guys, particularly British guys,

1394
01:07:33,920 --> 01:07:35,720
Speaker 2: bow to him. So there's a bunch of pictures like

1395
01:07:35,800 --> 01:07:39,040
Speaker 2: this of British businessmen, like I mean wearing oaths to him.

1396
01:07:39,160 --> 01:07:41,200
Speaker 3: Now, this is the first cool thing that you showed me.

1397
01:07:41,440 --> 01:07:44,040
Speaker 2: Oh, just wait, because it's about to get fucking better.

1398
01:07:45,360 --> 01:07:47,560
Speaker 2: Because at one point he made a bunch of British

1399
01:07:47,600 --> 01:07:50,520
Speaker 2: businessmen carry him around on a sedan chair while a

1400
01:07:50,600 --> 01:07:54,640
Speaker 2: crowd cheered, which is that's a solid move.

1401
01:07:54,840 --> 01:07:55,840
Speaker 3: Yeah, I do like that.

1402
01:07:56,480 --> 01:07:58,240
Speaker 2: It's hard not to support that.

1403
01:07:58,400 --> 01:08:01,120
Speaker 3: For sure. He's got a little he's got Okay, someone's

1404
01:08:01,160 --> 01:08:02,360
Speaker 3: holding an umbrella for him.

1405
01:08:02,680 --> 01:08:05,720
Speaker 2: Yeah, And that's the kind of wackiness that we know

1406
01:08:05,920 --> 01:08:10,880
Speaker 2: went down. And again he's not all wrong, Like the

1407
01:08:10,920 --> 01:08:15,560
Speaker 2: whiskey plane was a solid idea. Yeah. Yeah, So Edie

1408
01:08:15,680 --> 01:08:18,240
Speaker 2: desperately wanted to be a major player on the global stage.

1409
01:08:18,280 --> 01:08:21,439
Speaker 2: He wasted no opportunity to wade into any global conflict

1410
01:08:21,479 --> 01:08:23,840
Speaker 2: that he could. When the Watergate scandal broke, he sent

1411
01:08:23,840 --> 01:08:26,120
Speaker 2: a letter to Richard Nixon and gave him advice on

1412
01:08:26,160 --> 01:08:32,200
Speaker 2: how to handle Watergate. Nice quote. When the stability of

1413
01:08:32,240 --> 01:08:35,320
Speaker 2: a nation is in danger, the only solution is, unfortunately,

1414
01:08:35,400 --> 01:08:40,320
Speaker 2: to imprison the leaders of the opposition. Yeah. The longer

1415
01:08:40,320 --> 01:08:42,320
Speaker 2: he was in power, the more unhinged and braggy he

1416
01:08:42,400 --> 01:08:44,840
Speaker 2: became president, I mean, started to inflate the stories of

1417
01:08:44,880 --> 01:08:47,439
Speaker 2: his military service, claiming he'd fought in Burma during World

1418
01:08:47,479 --> 01:08:50,759
Speaker 2: War Two. He offered to marry Princess Anne of Great Britain.

1419
01:08:51,000 --> 01:08:53,400
Speaker 2: He also offered to become King of Scotland and lead

1420
01:08:53,400 --> 01:08:57,080
Speaker 2: the Scots to independence from Britain. Britain for the most part,

1421
01:08:57,080 --> 01:08:59,640
Speaker 2: the international response to Eddiemine was laughter. The same kind

1422
01:08:59,680 --> 01:09:01,120
Speaker 2: of laugh do you find a day when people talk

1423
01:09:01,120 --> 01:09:05,120
Speaker 2: about ridiculous smith Korean propaganda. Alan Coren, a British comedian,

1424
01:09:05,160 --> 01:09:07,800
Speaker 2: had a popular column in Punch magazine where he'd write

1425
01:09:07,840 --> 01:09:11,920
Speaker 2: out fake Idioman speeches that were very racist. If you've

1426
01:09:11,920 --> 01:09:14,880
Speaker 2: got Spotify, you can find the album that was made

1427
01:09:14,920 --> 01:09:17,479
Speaker 2: based on these columns with a white guy doing Idie's voice,

1428
01:09:17,520 --> 01:09:19,439
Speaker 2: and it is it was. I mean, this was like

1429
01:09:19,479 --> 01:09:22,479
Speaker 2: in the mid seventies. Okay, if you look up Idiomin

1430
01:09:22,560 --> 01:09:26,320
Speaker 2: on Spotify, you'll find the album and it's like infuriating wow,

1431
01:09:26,400 --> 01:09:30,000
Speaker 2: because it's just it's joking about what was in reality

1432
01:09:30,040 --> 01:09:33,400
Speaker 2: a horrific, crime filled regime, making fun of the fact

1433
01:09:33,400 --> 01:09:36,559
Speaker 2: that Idioman talks funny, which he doesn't even talk that funny.

1434
01:09:36,800 --> 01:09:43,559
Speaker 2: He speaks better English than I do, fucking Ugandan. So yeah,

1435
01:09:43,760 --> 01:09:46,080
Speaker 2: but this is again that's the international reaction is they're

1436
01:09:46,160 --> 01:09:48,400
Speaker 2: laughing at this guy, They're making fun of him. He's like,

1437
01:09:48,680 --> 01:09:50,960
Speaker 2: this horror show is playing out in Africa and it's

1438
01:09:51,360 --> 01:09:55,040
Speaker 2: being treated as kind of like a freak show to

1439
01:09:55,120 --> 01:09:59,519
Speaker 2: the rest of the world. So yeah, the caricature of

1440
01:10:00,000 --> 01:10:03,479
Speaker 2: Idioman is based a lot in white European racism, but

1441
01:10:03,520 --> 01:10:07,680
Speaker 2: it's also based in some local Ugandan regional racism. So

1442
01:10:07,760 --> 01:10:11,160
Speaker 2: they're north. North of Uganda is basically the social equivalent

1443
01:10:11,200 --> 01:10:14,280
Speaker 2: of the American South, and the well educated, well to

1444
01:10:14,320 --> 01:10:17,679
Speaker 2: do Southern Ugandans considered Idiomin to be like a hillbilly.

1445
01:10:17,760 --> 01:10:20,479
Speaker 2: They thought his accent when he spoke in Uganda, they

1446
01:10:20,520 --> 01:10:24,000
Speaker 2: thought his accent was painful. So it's basically he was

1447
01:10:24,120 --> 01:10:25,880
Speaker 2: like to a lot of people in southern Uganda, he

1448
01:10:26,000 --> 01:10:27,680
Speaker 2: was like if we had a president who came from

1449
01:10:27,720 --> 01:10:30,200
Speaker 2: the dirty South and talked like he was grew up

1450
01:10:30,240 --> 01:10:34,120
Speaker 2: on the box, ye president. Yeah, yeah, exactly. That That

1451
01:10:34,240 --> 01:10:37,920
Speaker 2: is the attitude that like the Southerners have towards him.

1452
01:10:38,120 --> 01:10:41,559
Speaker 2: In reality, Idioman was a pretty smart guy. He wasn't

1453
01:10:41,640 --> 01:10:44,000
Speaker 2: educated obviously, but he was. He had a lot of

1454
01:10:44,040 --> 01:10:47,680
Speaker 2: intelligence because you don't carry out a regime like this

1455
01:10:47,720 --> 01:10:49,920
Speaker 2: and keep it going for eight years without that. Most

1456
01:10:49,920 --> 01:10:52,840
Speaker 2: of his actions were pretty logical. Mass murder is a

1457
01:10:52,880 --> 01:10:55,679
Speaker 2: time honored way to stay in power. Exiling the Asians

1458
01:10:55,720 --> 01:10:58,240
Speaker 2: tank Uganda's economy, but it provided idiot with a host

1459
01:10:58,280 --> 01:11:00,439
Speaker 2: of businesses that he could give away to his porters

1460
01:11:00,479 --> 01:11:02,920
Speaker 2: in exchange for their loyalty. And for a while his

1461
01:11:03,000 --> 01:11:06,200
Speaker 2: tactics worked pretty well. But he made more mistakes as

1462
01:11:06,240 --> 01:11:09,360
Speaker 2: time went on. One of those was alienating Israel. He

1463
01:11:09,400 --> 01:11:11,880
Speaker 2: had initially been friendly to the country he'd trained there

1464
01:11:11,920 --> 01:11:14,559
Speaker 2: again as a paratrooper, but he wound up switching around

1465
01:11:14,560 --> 01:11:17,240
Speaker 2: and backing the Palestinian cause, which is fine, but he

1466
01:11:17,280 --> 01:11:21,559
Speaker 2: also descended into horrific anti Semitism. In nineteen seventy two,

1467
01:11:22,040 --> 01:11:24,479
Speaker 2: he told the UN Secretary General that Hitler had been

1468
01:11:24,560 --> 01:11:28,160
Speaker 2: quote right to burn six million Jews, and he promised

1469
01:11:28,200 --> 01:11:31,760
Speaker 2: to build a monument to Hitler in Campala. He was

1470
01:11:31,760 --> 01:11:34,439
Speaker 2: eventually convinced to cancel this plan because everyone around him

1471
01:11:34,479 --> 01:11:37,439
Speaker 2: was like, that's fucking bad idea idiot mean, but he

1472
01:11:37,520 --> 01:11:40,160
Speaker 2: continued pissing off Israel as the years rolled by. On

1473
01:11:40,280 --> 01:11:43,360
Speaker 2: June twenty seventh, nineteen seventy six, an Air France flight

1474
01:11:43,439 --> 01:11:46,040
Speaker 2: with two hundred and forty eight passengers was hijacked by

1475
01:11:46,040 --> 01:11:50,000
Speaker 2: two members of the Popular Front for the Liberation of Palestine. Now,

1476
01:11:50,000 --> 01:11:51,960
Speaker 2: this was back in the day when terrorist plane hijackers

1477
01:11:52,000 --> 01:11:54,400
Speaker 2: didn't kill people as a general rule. They just kind

1478
01:11:54,400 --> 01:11:56,320
Speaker 2: of have the plane flow to an airport and hold

1479
01:11:56,360 --> 01:11:59,160
Speaker 2: everyone hostage until their comrades were released from prison or

1480
01:11:59,200 --> 01:12:01,360
Speaker 2: they got a bunch of money or whatever. This was

1481
01:12:01,400 --> 01:12:03,000
Speaker 2: like a common thing. There's a period of time in

1482
01:12:03,040 --> 01:12:05,600
Speaker 2: the seventies where every week there'd be a new fucking hijacking.

1483
01:12:07,280 --> 01:12:10,200
Speaker 2: So these particular hijackers and this plane, most of the

1484
01:12:10,240 --> 01:12:13,800
Speaker 2: passengers or Israeli. So these particular hijackers land first in

1485
01:12:13,840 --> 01:12:17,360
Speaker 2: Libya and then at Intebbe Airport in Uganda. President I

1486
01:12:17,360 --> 01:12:20,559
Speaker 2: mean welcome them enthusiastically. This proved to be a mistake

1487
01:12:20,640 --> 01:12:24,120
Speaker 2: when one week later Israeli commandos raided the airport, liberated

1488
01:12:24,120 --> 01:12:26,759
Speaker 2: the captives, and destroyed a sizable chunk of the Ugandan

1489
01:12:26,800 --> 01:12:30,080
Speaker 2: air Force while it was sitting on the tarmac. Oh wow, Yeah,

1490
01:12:30,120 --> 01:12:32,360
Speaker 2: there's a movie called raid On in Tebbi about it.

1491
01:12:32,360 --> 01:12:35,439
Speaker 2: It's a very famous like commando raid thing. So it

1492
01:12:35,600 --> 01:12:38,280
Speaker 2: he flipped out of this, he'd already switched from ming

1493
01:12:38,280 --> 01:12:41,000
Speaker 2: pro is Reel to pro Palestine, of course, but he

1494
01:12:41,439 --> 01:12:43,240
Speaker 2: went over the deep end. He had a seventy three

1495
01:12:43,280 --> 01:12:45,439
Speaker 2: year old Jewish woman in a yuguand in hospital named

1496
01:12:45,479 --> 01:12:49,639
Speaker 2: Dora Block, pretty brutally murdered, and then he went on

1497
01:12:49,800 --> 01:12:52,920
Speaker 2: kind of a world insult tour. So this is kind

1498
01:12:52,960 --> 01:12:56,519
Speaker 2: of a little bit, and there's growing local resistance to

1499
01:12:56,600 --> 01:12:59,320
Speaker 2: him at this point too, so he starts to in

1500
01:12:59,360 --> 01:13:01,599
Speaker 2: the late seven hees go off the rails a bit.

1501
01:13:02,040 --> 01:13:04,760
Speaker 2: He called the President of Tanzania a coward, an old

1502
01:13:04,760 --> 01:13:07,960
Speaker 2: woman in a prostitute. He called the President of Zambia

1503
01:13:08,000 --> 01:13:11,360
Speaker 2: an imperialist puppet and boot liquor. He called Henry Kissinger

1504
01:13:11,400 --> 01:13:14,439
Speaker 2: a murderer and a spy, which was pretty fair. He

1505
01:13:14,520 --> 01:13:17,439
Speaker 2: also said that Queen Elizabeth should send him her twenty

1506
01:13:17,479 --> 01:13:20,760
Speaker 2: five year old knickers to celebrate her silver Juwilee. So

1507
01:13:20,800 --> 01:13:23,639
Speaker 2: he was like se year old underwear Queen of England. Yeah,

1508
01:13:23,640 --> 01:13:27,080
Speaker 2: which is I appreciate a good diss. Yeah, that's a solid.

1509
01:13:27,960 --> 01:13:30,559
Speaker 2: He steadily expanded his list of titles over the years.

1510
01:13:30,600 --> 01:13:32,880
Speaker 2: In nineteen seventy seven, he announced that he must now

1511
01:13:32,880 --> 01:13:37,839
Speaker 2: be addressed as quote his Excellency Field Marshal Alhaji doctor

1512
01:13:37,880 --> 01:13:41,120
Speaker 2: idi Amin Dada, life President of Uganda, Conqueror of the

1513
01:13:41,120 --> 01:13:45,799
Speaker 2: British Empire, Distinguished Service Order of the Military Cross, Victoria Cross,

1514
01:13:46,000 --> 01:13:47,400
Speaker 2: and Professor of Geography.

1515
01:13:49,920 --> 01:13:52,400
Speaker 3: What a good tag at the end, this guy is funny.

1516
01:13:52,479 --> 01:13:55,759
Speaker 2: Yeah, that professor of geography thing is really what sets

1517
01:13:55,760 --> 01:14:01,120
Speaker 2: it off. On October thirtieth night, seventy eight, he made

1518
01:14:01,120 --> 01:14:04,360
Speaker 2: the biggest mistake of his dictator career. He invaded Tanzania.

1519
01:14:05,160 --> 01:14:07,280
Speaker 2: This was over a pretty useless piece of land, like

1520
01:14:07,320 --> 01:14:09,600
Speaker 2: there was no good reason to attack the spot that

1521
01:14:09,640 --> 01:14:14,160
Speaker 2: he did. Tanzania counterattacked, and since their military was much

1522
01:14:14,320 --> 01:14:17,719
Speaker 2: more functional than the Ugandan military, the Ugandans were quickly

1523
01:14:17,720 --> 01:14:21,240
Speaker 2: thrown back. Next, Tanzania marched on Uganda. Aided by Begandan

1524
01:14:21,400 --> 01:14:25,439
Speaker 2: Ugandan exiles. They moved to unseat idy from power. For

1525
01:14:25,479 --> 01:14:28,360
Speaker 2: his part, Idiomine announced that he now loved the Tanzanian

1526
01:14:28,400 --> 01:14:30,840
Speaker 2: president and quote would have married him if he had

1527
01:14:30,880 --> 01:14:34,240
Speaker 2: been a woman. This didn't work and did not turn

1528
01:14:34,320 --> 01:14:37,400
Speaker 2: back the Tanzanian army, so Idiomine had to flee from power,

1529
01:14:37,760 --> 01:14:40,320
Speaker 2: first to Libya and then to Saudi Arabia, where he

1530
01:14:40,360 --> 01:14:43,240
Speaker 2: spent the rest of his life. In exile. Somehow, not

1531
01:14:43,320 --> 01:14:45,640
Speaker 2: being a warlord anymore seemed to calm him down. He

1532
01:14:45,680 --> 01:14:48,479
Speaker 2: lived a quiet life, regularly visiting Mecca and living with

1533
01:14:48,560 --> 01:14:52,160
Speaker 2: just one wife and several of his children. Oooh yeah, yeah,

1534
01:14:52,240 --> 01:14:53,600
Speaker 2: he's one of the ones who got away with it.

1535
01:14:53,840 --> 01:14:54,840
Speaker 3: Ugh itd.

1536
01:14:54,840 --> 01:14:57,439
Speaker 2: He explained in a rare nineteen ninety three interview that quote,

1537
01:14:57,640 --> 01:14:59,559
Speaker 2: when I am no longer president, some of them say

1538
01:14:59,600 --> 01:15:01,840
Speaker 2: they don't want I accept it. Frankly, I have had

1539
01:15:01,880 --> 01:15:04,360
Speaker 2: one wife since and have found also to have one

1540
01:15:04,400 --> 01:15:07,880
Speaker 2: wife as better. So Idiomine lapsed into a coma on

1541
01:15:07,960 --> 01:15:10,800
Speaker 2: July nineteenth, two thousand and three. He was put on

1542
01:15:10,840 --> 01:15:13,200
Speaker 2: life support at a hospital in Jedda. His family had

1543
01:15:13,200 --> 01:15:15,160
Speaker 2: begged the New Yugan and government to let him return

1544
01:15:15,200 --> 01:15:17,200
Speaker 2: home to die. They were told he'd have to stand

1545
01:15:17,200 --> 01:15:20,040
Speaker 2: trial if he returned. So I mean he didn't go back,

1546
01:15:20,400 --> 01:15:22,800
Speaker 2: and on August sixteenth, two thousand and three, Idiomine died

1547
01:15:22,800 --> 01:15:26,040
Speaker 2: peacefully in a hospital bed in Saudi Arabia. And that's

1548
01:15:26,160 --> 01:15:30,240
Speaker 2: unfortunately not the end of the story or ugandas problems. Oh,

1549
01:15:30,640 --> 01:15:33,920
Speaker 2: because President of the ghosts ghost do this is going

1550
01:15:34,000 --> 01:15:39,639
Speaker 2: to happen. President of Bote returned after idiot was ousted.

1551
01:15:39,760 --> 01:15:42,840
Speaker 2: A Bote was not outwardly ridiculous. He didn't make crazy

1552
01:15:42,880 --> 01:15:45,760
Speaker 2: claims about the Holocaust or randomly insult foreign leaders. He

1553
01:15:45,800 --> 01:15:48,360
Speaker 2: didn't have a wacky title. What he did do was

1554
01:15:48,479 --> 01:15:52,120
Speaker 2: vastly expand the purges that Idiomine had begun. While Amine

1555
01:15:52,160 --> 01:15:55,200
Speaker 2: had mostly targeted certain tribe members in the military and government,

1556
01:15:55,439 --> 01:15:58,839
Speaker 2: a Bote targeted huge chunks of civilians based on their tribe.

1557
01:15:59,080 --> 01:16:01,720
Speaker 2: He probably killed more people in his second term than

1558
01:16:01,800 --> 01:16:05,160
Speaker 2: died during the entirety of Idea means reign Jesus. A

1559
01:16:05,240 --> 01:16:09,640
Speaker 2: Bote was eventually overthrown by a general named Bazzello Olaro Okello,

1560
01:16:09,760 --> 01:16:15,040
Speaker 2: who was violently overthrown by Yoweri Musevenni's National Resistance Army

1561
01:16:15,040 --> 01:16:18,080
Speaker 2: in nineteen eighty six. Mussevenni is still the president of

1562
01:16:18,200 --> 01:16:20,960
Speaker 2: Uganda today. He had term limits abolished in two thousand

1563
01:16:20,960 --> 01:16:24,640
Speaker 2: and five and removed the presidential aid limit in twenty seventeen.

1564
01:16:25,280 --> 01:16:28,519
Speaker 2: Uganda has to this day never seen a peaceful transition

1565
01:16:28,600 --> 01:16:29,040
Speaker 2: of power.

1566
01:16:29,640 --> 01:16:30,559
Speaker 3: Wow, so.

1567
01:16:32,920 --> 01:16:33,759
Speaker 2: That's the story.

1568
01:16:34,160 --> 01:16:35,719
Speaker 3: Oh, that's a heartwarming tale.

1569
01:16:35,800 --> 01:16:39,640
Speaker 2: It is it is, and it's a tale where like

1570
01:16:40,560 --> 01:16:44,559
Speaker 2: I mean, Idiomine is the organ through which all of

1571
01:16:44,600 --> 01:16:49,600
Speaker 2: this repression and violence was executed, But the real bastard

1572
01:16:49,640 --> 01:16:52,519
Speaker 2: of this is the British Empire, in my opinion at least.

1573
01:16:52,560 --> 01:16:54,960
Speaker 3: Yeah, for sure, I mean I'll trace all the blame

1574
01:16:54,960 --> 01:16:59,160
Speaker 3: back to white people at any time, for sure. But man,

1575
01:16:59,280 --> 01:17:03,680
Speaker 3: I really just can't imagine living in a country or

1576
01:17:05,160 --> 01:17:10,679
Speaker 3: so much bloodshed is like happening constantly all the time. Yeah, politically, yeah,

1577
01:17:10,720 --> 01:17:13,599
Speaker 3: I would move away so fast.

1578
01:17:13,800 --> 01:17:16,120
Speaker 2: Well, and that's it's one of those things that.

1579
01:17:16,280 --> 01:17:16,920
Speaker 3: How are you Ghanna?

1580
01:17:17,000 --> 01:17:19,240
Speaker 2: But yeah, how are you Ghana? And it's you get

1581
01:17:19,280 --> 01:17:21,559
Speaker 2: all these people in Europe and the United States now,

1582
01:17:21,560 --> 01:17:24,120
Speaker 2: because most of the people who like flee parts of

1583
01:17:24,160 --> 01:17:26,160
Speaker 2: Africa are going to wind ap heading to Europe because

1584
01:17:26,200 --> 01:17:28,040
Speaker 2: it's very it's easier to get there than it is

1585
01:17:28,080 --> 01:17:30,760
Speaker 2: to get to the US. And you know, get this,

1586
01:17:30,880 --> 01:17:33,640
Speaker 2: like what is our We can't take care of all

1587
01:17:33,640 --> 01:17:35,639
Speaker 2: these people. It's like, well you could steal their shit

1588
01:17:35,720 --> 01:17:38,479
Speaker 2: for two hundred years, like and then leave them without

1589
01:17:38,520 --> 01:17:42,479
Speaker 2: because Uganda there at no point in prior history there

1590
01:17:42,479 --> 01:17:46,240
Speaker 2: were like kingdoms and states and whatnot all over Africa,

1591
01:17:46,880 --> 01:17:49,960
Speaker 2: but there was there never been a Uganda. Like all

1592
01:17:49,960 --> 01:17:52,160
Speaker 2: of these groups of people had never been forced together

1593
01:17:52,280 --> 01:17:55,120
Speaker 2: before the British did that, and if you're going to

1594
01:17:55,240 --> 01:17:56,920
Speaker 2: do that, you shouldn't do that in the first place.

1595
01:17:56,920 --> 01:17:58,280
Speaker 2: But if you're going to do that, if you're going

1596
01:17:58,280 --> 01:18:01,360
Speaker 2: to force these people into a state, you owe it

1597
01:18:01,400 --> 01:18:08,400
Speaker 2: to them to like create a functional state before you leave. Yeah, which, yeah,

1598
01:18:08,560 --> 01:18:13,519
Speaker 2: it's fucked up, it's real fucked up. Well, I hope

1599
01:18:13,520 --> 01:18:14,559
Speaker 2: you learned something today.

1600
01:18:14,600 --> 01:18:20,519
Speaker 3: I did. I somehow left more grim than I came in.

1601
01:18:21,560 --> 01:18:23,000
Speaker 2: That's the fun of colonialism.

1602
01:18:23,120 --> 01:18:25,519
Speaker 3: But that's okay. I mean, like sometimes you got to

1603
01:18:25,560 --> 01:18:32,519
Speaker 3: know the monstrous capabilities of what you know, what we

1604
01:18:32,560 --> 01:18:36,679
Speaker 3: can do as human beings to prevent it. Yeah, jeez,

1605
01:18:36,720 --> 01:18:37,120
Speaker 3: I don't know.

1606
01:18:38,000 --> 01:18:39,800
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's hard to take a good lesson out of

1607
01:18:39,840 --> 01:18:43,559
Speaker 2: this other than don't be a colonialist and don't take

1608
01:18:43,960 --> 01:18:46,200
Speaker 2: a people and train them to be soldiers and nothing

1609
01:18:46,200 --> 01:18:47,000
Speaker 2: else for a century.

1610
01:18:47,160 --> 01:18:51,520
Speaker 3: Yeah, don't What are some of the things? Don't play bagpipes,

1611
01:18:51,520 --> 01:18:52,520
Speaker 3: sim play the accordion?

1612
01:18:52,800 --> 01:18:54,360
Speaker 2: Well, that's okay, let's not attack.

1613
01:18:57,200 --> 01:18:58,000
Speaker 3: Let's attack.

1614
01:18:58,520 --> 01:19:00,360
Speaker 2: The bagpipes aren't the problem here.

1615
01:19:03,520 --> 01:19:04,720
Speaker 3: Yeah, I don't know what else to learn.

1616
01:19:04,840 --> 01:19:06,280
Speaker 2: I'll meet with you about accordions.

1617
01:19:06,600 --> 01:19:10,080
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean I haven't watched what's it called Lasking

1618
01:19:10,120 --> 01:19:11,320
Speaker 3: of Scotland. Have you watched it?

1619
01:19:11,479 --> 01:19:13,559
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's I don't. I didn't enjoy it very much.

1620
01:19:13,680 --> 01:19:16,679
Speaker 3: Is it too, Is it sympathetic or no?

1621
01:19:17,640 --> 01:19:22,280
Speaker 2: It's it plays into the brutality of it. One thing

1622
01:19:22,280 --> 01:19:25,200
Speaker 2: that does a decent job of is showing you how

1623
01:19:25,240 --> 01:19:28,080
Speaker 2: he might have charmed people early huh. But I think

1624
01:19:28,160 --> 01:19:31,320
Speaker 2: it leans more into the sensational side of.

1625
01:19:31,240 --> 01:19:34,559
Speaker 3: Things, which eating people and stuff and it.

1626
01:19:34,720 --> 01:19:37,599
Speaker 2: Yeah, and it doesn't. It doesn't talk at all about

1627
01:19:37,920 --> 01:19:40,559
Speaker 2: a means past in a meaningful way. And that's why

1628
01:19:40,600 --> 01:19:43,880
Speaker 2: I led this by talking about British military policy in

1629
01:19:43,920 --> 01:19:46,880
Speaker 2: their colonies, because I don't think you can understand, I mean,

1630
01:19:46,960 --> 01:19:50,000
Speaker 2: without understanding where he and his people came from.

1631
01:19:50,080 --> 01:19:54,760
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean that alone is interesting by itself as

1632
01:19:54,800 --> 01:19:57,840
Speaker 3: a story, I mean, not a not a fun story, but.

1633
01:19:57,880 --> 01:20:02,960
Speaker 2: It's definitely not a fun story. But it's an important one. Uh.

1634
01:20:03,000 --> 01:20:06,920
Speaker 2: And I will say, uh, if you are starting a

1635
01:20:06,960 --> 01:20:10,679
Speaker 2: punk band in the near future, the Suicide Revolutionary Jazz Band,

1636
01:20:10,720 --> 01:20:12,080
Speaker 2: it's a pretty fucking name.

1637
01:20:12,120 --> 01:20:16,120
Speaker 3: They honestly sound like a ska band and look like one.

1638
01:20:16,479 --> 01:20:18,960
Speaker 2: They do look like a ska band. They're all dressed nice,

1639
01:20:19,000 --> 01:20:23,240
Speaker 2: they got their shirts tucked in ah man, I could

1640
01:20:23,280 --> 01:20:26,360
Speaker 2: go for some suicide revolutionary ska music.

1641
01:20:26,600 --> 01:20:29,479
Speaker 3: Yeah. I think the worst part of that story was

1642
01:20:29,520 --> 01:20:30,680
Speaker 3: that he died peacefully.

1643
01:20:30,960 --> 01:20:34,160
Speaker 2: That is, it's always a bummer when that happens, because,

1644
01:20:34,240 --> 01:20:36,599
Speaker 2: like we're I think Kadafi is going to be running

1645
01:20:36,640 --> 01:20:39,759
Speaker 2: shortly before this podcast comes out, and that's a story

1646
01:20:39,800 --> 01:20:42,160
Speaker 2: where the monster gets like, that's what you want to

1647
01:20:42,200 --> 01:20:44,160
Speaker 2: see happen to these guys is they get dragged out

1648
01:20:44,200 --> 01:20:47,040
Speaker 2: into the street and murdered by their own people. Yeaeople

1649
01:20:47,200 --> 01:20:47,840
Speaker 2: they fucked over.

1650
01:20:48,080 --> 01:20:49,439
Speaker 3: Yeah. I can think of a couple of people I'd

1651
01:20:49,439 --> 01:20:50,240
Speaker 3: like to see that happen to.

1652
01:20:50,920 --> 01:20:54,439
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, whose names we won't give because there are

1653
01:20:54,760 --> 01:20:57,800
Speaker 2: laws against that sort of thing. But yeah, there's it's

1654
01:20:57,840 --> 01:21:00,280
Speaker 2: hard not to want certain people dragged out into the

1655
01:21:00,280 --> 01:21:03,960
Speaker 2: street and at least, like, you know, maybe not even killed,

1656
01:21:04,040 --> 01:21:06,760
Speaker 2: just pete on by dozens of people. Well, I guess

1657
01:21:06,760 --> 01:21:08,680
Speaker 2: there's nothing left for us to do but for me

1658
01:21:08,720 --> 01:21:11,599
Speaker 2: to ask you to plug. Yeah.

1659
01:21:11,880 --> 01:21:17,240
Speaker 3: Cool, you could you know, uh, maybe get some laughs

1660
01:21:17,320 --> 01:21:22,800
Speaker 3: from looking at some videos. I don't know how to

1661
01:21:22,800 --> 01:21:25,040
Speaker 3: transition this either. I have some videos on my website

1662
01:21:25,080 --> 01:21:27,880
Speaker 3: britdiread dot com. You can follow me on Twitter at

1663
01:21:27,920 --> 01:21:34,920
Speaker 3: ao bro Bro, where I just usually complain about people

1664
01:21:34,960 --> 01:21:39,240
Speaker 3: getting casts in Hollywood and making some jokes and you

1665
01:21:39,280 --> 01:21:42,280
Speaker 3: can see me perform with jokes all around La. And

1666
01:21:43,040 --> 01:21:45,519
Speaker 3: you know, if you have any more questions, I will

1667
01:21:45,960 --> 01:21:48,240
Speaker 3: refer you to this guy because I don't know anything.

1668
01:21:48,280 --> 01:21:50,920
Speaker 2: Well, if you like complaining about casting, they did just

1669
01:21:51,040 --> 01:21:53,680
Speaker 2: cast a new idiom in movie. Uh did that? Yes,

1670
01:21:53,680 --> 01:21:58,960
Speaker 2: Scarlett Johansson's gonna play him. Fuck, you got me? You

1671
01:21:59,120 --> 01:22:02,040
Speaker 2: got me? I'm Robert Evans. You can find me on

1672
01:22:02,080 --> 01:22:04,599
Speaker 2: Twitter at I write okay, just the two letters there.

1673
01:22:04,680 --> 01:22:06,960
Speaker 2: I get a book on Amazon called A Brief History

1674
01:22:06,960 --> 01:22:10,200
Speaker 2: of Vice. You can find that on Amazon. You can

1675
01:22:10,200 --> 01:22:12,880
Speaker 2: find this podcast at behind the Bastards dot com, where

1676
01:22:12,880 --> 01:22:16,439
Speaker 2: we will have pictures of the incredible Suicide Revolutionary Jazz

1677
01:22:16,479 --> 01:22:19,400
Speaker 2: Band and some other pictures from Amine's Rain, as well

1678
01:22:19,439 --> 01:22:22,240
Speaker 2: as links to all the sources for this podcast. I

1679
01:22:22,280 --> 01:22:25,280
Speaker 2: really do recommend reading that University of gron Again article.

1680
01:22:25,280 --> 01:22:29,200
Speaker 2: It's a fascinating analysis of why idiots seen sort of

1681
01:22:29,200 --> 01:22:32,240
Speaker 2: the way he is today and where he came from.

1682
01:22:32,960 --> 01:22:37,120
Speaker 2: So you can also find us on Twitter and Instagram

1683
01:22:37,160 --> 01:22:40,320
Speaker 2: social media at Bastards pod, So look us up. Check

1684
01:22:40,400 --> 01:22:43,880
Speaker 2: us out. This has been Behind the Bastards for the

1685
01:22:43,920 --> 01:22:47,160
Speaker 2: week I've been Robert Evans. Check back in next Tuesday,

1686
01:22:47,200 --> 01:22:49,760
Speaker 2: when we will be talking about someone else who is

1687
01:22:49,840 --> 01:22:50,639
Speaker 2: also terrible.

1688
01:22:53,200 --> 01:22:56,160
Speaker 1: Behind the Bastards is a production of cool Zone Media.

1689
01:22:56,240 --> 01:22:58,840
Speaker 1: For more from cool Zone Media, visit our website cool

1690
01:22:58,920 --> 01:23:02,880
Speaker 1: zonemedia dot com, or check us out on the iHeartRadio app,

1691
01:23:02,960 --> 01:23:05,360
Speaker 1: Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

1692
01:23:07,400 --> 01:23:11,439
Speaker 3: M hm, m h m hm