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Speaker 1: Welcome to Stuff to Blow your Mind from how Stuff

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Speaker 1: Works dot Com. That forthwith you come without tarrying, and

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Speaker 1: fulfill my desires and command, and persist until the end,

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Speaker 1: and according to my intentions, And I conjure you by

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Speaker 1: Him whom all creatures are obedient unto, and by his

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Speaker 1: ineffable name, of which be heard. The elements are overthrown,

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Speaker 1: the air is shaken, the sea runneth back, the fire

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Speaker 1: is quenched, the earth trembleth, and all of the hosts

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Speaker 1: of celestials, terrestrials and infernals du tremble and are troubled

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Speaker 1: and trouble founded together eight together together. Hey, welcome to

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Speaker 1: Stuff to Blow your Mind. My name is Robert Lamb. Hey,

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Speaker 1: I'm Christian Sega. Christian is joining us from brain Stuff

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Speaker 1: and you may be familiar with them as well from

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Speaker 1: the House Stuff Works video channel. Obviously, we kicked off

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Speaker 1: this episode a little different than normal. You. Generally, we

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Speaker 1: don't reach out into the ether and attempt to summon

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Speaker 1: any kind of extra dimensional forces. Yes, exactly, and that

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Speaker 1: reading was a direct quote from a conjuration spell within

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Speaker 1: a grimoire called the Lesser Key of Solomon. But for

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Speaker 1: your protection. I only read one paragraph from it, so

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Speaker 1: that no demons will manifest upon your listening to this podcast.

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Speaker 1: That's right. The last thing we want to do is

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Speaker 1: crash and the servers with demonic activity. Now, I think

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Speaker 1: a lot of people have some degree of pop culture

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Speaker 1: interface with this topic, if nothing else. We've all seen

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Speaker 1: movies with magical books in them. Um, I mean, how

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Speaker 1: often is the Necronomicon shown up in various horror property. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I'm I'm wondering where it first showed up, but I'm

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Speaker 1: assuming my first film interaction withhe it was probably Evil Dead.

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Speaker 1: But it's obviously a go to staple now. I think

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Speaker 1: even cartoons reference it now, Like I believe Adventure Time

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Speaker 1: and and and shows like that even have like kind

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Speaker 1: of wink wink nods to the Necronomicon. Yeah, if you

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Speaker 1: don't have the Necronomicon, you do some sort of um

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Speaker 1: take on it, right, Yeah, exactly, it's just this go

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Speaker 1: to dark forbidding manuscript from who knows where they contains

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Speaker 1: all sorts of secrets, contains all sorts of of power

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Speaker 1: and uh, and is the the gateway for for mortal

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Speaker 1: readers and users of the text. Yeah, and even Uh.

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Speaker 1: I think the Harry Potter movies books that were kind

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Speaker 1: of like that. They didn't call it the necronomicon or anything,

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Speaker 1: but wasn't like one of their books for class was

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Speaker 1: like a living book that like could bite you and

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Speaker 1: like lived under your bed or so. I think that

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Speaker 1: was the Monster Manual. The Monster Manual was itself a

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Speaker 1: monster yea, which which is is wonderful because I feel

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Speaker 1: like those Harry Potter examples played directly into a lot

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Speaker 1: of what we're going to talk about here, these books

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Speaker 1: of magic, these uh, these these highly fetishized tons and

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Speaker 1: then how we think about them, Yeah, exactly, And what's

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Speaker 1: really fascinating is that they actually existed. These books are

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Speaker 1: a huge part of real history. Uh, and specifically today

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Speaker 1: we're going to talk about their history mainly around the

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Speaker 1: medieval period. But you know what what a grimoire is,

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Speaker 1: what it means, what what people used them for, and uh,

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Speaker 1: sort of the political and historical purposes of them. Indeed,

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Speaker 1: I mean that's the really fascinating thing about this is

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Speaker 1: that you have this You have the fictional and fantastical

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Speaker 1: element here certainly, but but when you follow the threads

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Speaker 1: they lead, they lead back into history, and they lead

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Speaker 1: back into just how we interact with the written word. Yeah. Absolutely,

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Speaker 1: and so like starting off with that, do you think

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Speaker 1: this is a good point to start talking about the

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Speaker 1: etymology of the word grimoire, the actual the written wordmore

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Speaker 1: what what does it? What does it mean? Well, so

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Speaker 1: there's there's a couple of different interpretations. And I should

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Speaker 1: say that most of our our information here comes from

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Speaker 1: a book called Grimoires, A History of Magic Books, which

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Speaker 1: is written by a guy named Owen Davies, and it

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Speaker 1: came out in two thousand nine, and uh seems to

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Speaker 1: be from our research, like the go to book on

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Speaker 1: the history of these things. There are a couple of

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Speaker 1: books that came out earlier, but they weren't as completest

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Speaker 1: as this. And he does a really good job of

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Speaker 1: covering the the overall history, and a lot of what

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Speaker 1: we're gonna talk about today is really only from like

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Speaker 1: the first the introduction in the first chapter maybe and

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Speaker 1: he he keeps going with it down the road, but

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Speaker 1: we're mainly focus on the early period. Yeah, if after

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Speaker 1: this episode you want to deeper dive into that topic,

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Speaker 1: be sure to check out um Davy's book. I'll include

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Speaker 1: a link to it on the landing page for this episode.

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Speaker 1: So Davies has this uh. He says grimoire has been

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Speaker 1: interpreted as coming from the Italian word romario, which is

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Speaker 1: a word that means a book of rhymes or Bible verses,

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Speaker 1: but that there's also an interpretation which I found in

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Speaker 1: another source as well, that says that it's actually based

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Speaker 1: on the French word grammaire, which is, as we know it,

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Speaker 1: grammar referring to a work written in Latin. Specifically, these

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Speaker 1: books were almost always written in Latin at the time

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Speaker 1: that they were uh pretty popular, although they were influenced

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Speaker 1: by other languages and cultures, as we'll see as we

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Speaker 1: go through this. Now, those those fictional magic books we

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Speaker 1: we mentioned earlier are probably a good way to think

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Speaker 1: about what a gramoire uh consists of. But but really,

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Speaker 1: when we break down exactly what a gramore is, generally

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Speaker 1: we're talking about a few different attributes, typically a lot

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Speaker 1: of strange symbols, right, um, A lot of a lot

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Speaker 1: of the grim moore is just the sheer appearance of

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Speaker 1: the volume, particularly how it might appear to two individuals

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Speaker 1: who stand outside its tradition or in in in fact,

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Speaker 1: a literates who are looking at it and are just

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Speaker 1: impressed by the overall uh visual knowledge of the thing. Yeah. Absolutely,

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Speaker 1: In fact, there were M. Davies designates there being two

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Speaker 1: forms of these books. There's a small format kind, which

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Speaker 1: is around twenty to fifty pages, and he calls them

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Speaker 1: like pocketbooks basically because these weren't like generally like the

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Speaker 1: long texts. Uh So, yeah, twenty fifages for those. But

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Speaker 1: then there are also these large, massive folios that were

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Speaker 1: in a manuscript form. They're probably handwritten or copied from handwriting, uh,

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Speaker 1: and they're kind of fascinating le large and made of

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Speaker 1: strange materials or purported to be made of strange materials

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Speaker 1: like animal or human skin or the written in blood. Um,

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Speaker 1: and some of them actually were. But yeah, there's there's

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Speaker 1: fascinating kind of what what defines a grimoire, what what

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Speaker 1: makes it? And essentially it's it's an alternative library to

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Speaker 1: the Bible and that acts as a source for all

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Speaker 1: these different magical traditions that sort of spun out of

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Speaker 1: culture and superstition and the occult over the years. Yeah.

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Speaker 1: So you're talking of everything from recipes for for various

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Speaker 1: uh healing potions of you will or treatments um to

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Speaker 1: more supernatural ideas such as the conjuring of of demonic

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Speaker 1: forces or angelic forces, etcetera. Yeah, there seemed to be

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Speaker 1: a specific obsession with almost categorizing and naming demons and

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Speaker 1: angels and what each of it. It It was like the uh,

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Speaker 1: the the Handbook to the Marvel Universe of the medieval times,

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Speaker 1: where they like they listed all of their their names

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Speaker 1: and powers and the special things that they could do,

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Speaker 1: and how to summon each particular one and what they

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Speaker 1: could tell you at the end of the day. Most

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Speaker 1: of these books had one goal for their reader, which

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Speaker 1: is to give them hidden knowledge, to give them secret

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Speaker 1: knowledge that no one else had access to. I found

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Speaker 1: it interesting you mentioned some of you mentioned that the

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Speaker 1: large volumes and the smaller ones, the smaller ones being

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Speaker 1: the more mobile. Yeah, and there's one in particular where

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Speaker 1: the binding is has a longer fabric on it. You

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Speaker 1: can be tucked into your belt, so the mobile version

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Speaker 1: of the text that you would carry about during your

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Speaker 1: daily life. It's like an iPad case. Yeah. Yeah, they

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Speaker 1: are fascinating, and there was sort of an assumption about

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Speaker 1: them that you had to have a certain amount of

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Speaker 1: training or academic acumen to be able to even understand them,

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Speaker 1: and that if you didn't, there were rumors that you

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Speaker 1: would you know, there were traps intentionally laid into the

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Speaker 1: text that would cause curse is or somehow maligned the

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Speaker 1: person who is reading the book, but they didn't have

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Speaker 1: the you know, the expertise or skill to to harness

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Speaker 1: its power. In a way, this reminds this idea of

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Speaker 1: there being a trap in the in the manuscript. And

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Speaker 1: and if you think of these spells as kind of programs, uh,

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Speaker 1: it kind of lines up with if one is attempting

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Speaker 1: to illegally download something today, you'll you you might get

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Speaker 1: the file that you're looking for, but you might get

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Speaker 1: a little something extra there. And if you are informed

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Speaker 1: enough to uh to work around that curse, you can

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Speaker 1: still get exactly what you want. Yeah, exactly. It's and

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Speaker 1: and I think we'll get into this as we're going along,

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Speaker 1: but there is a a connection between those two things

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Speaker 1: throughout human history of the written word, and there being

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Speaker 1: something both powerful about the written word and uh potentially dangerous.

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Speaker 1: Oh indeed, um In in his book, Davies says, quote,

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Speaker 1: but glamors also exists because the very act of itiding

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Speaker 1: itself was imbued with occult or hidden power. Um. You know,

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Speaker 1: it's important to to keep in mind that it only

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Speaker 1: in recent times has the means to preserve written texts

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Speaker 1: become something that's cheap and accessible to everyone. For the longest,

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Speaker 1: literate cultures only utilized paper for extremely important texts, often

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Speaker 1: often magical or religious significance involved, and paper especially was

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Speaker 1: an expensive product, prized preserved for special occasions and religious rituals.

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Speaker 1: For instance, during the sixth century, Buddhist monks introduced paper

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Speaker 1: to Japan, and as in China, it became a rare

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Speaker 1: and expensive product, something he prized and reserved only for

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Speaker 1: these just highly specialized occasions. Yeah, and they that lended

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Speaker 1: more value to this idea of the written word as

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Speaker 1: being magical and powerful, that that paper was rare, and

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Speaker 1: maybe inc was rare at that time too, and certainly

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Speaker 1: literacy was rare, so being able to understand what was

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Speaker 1: even it much less have the quote unquote expertise to

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Speaker 1: navigator on magical trash. I mean, just to to sort

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Speaker 1: of step outside of our our current interaction with it

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Speaker 1: and think you really almost making an outrageous overstatement of

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Speaker 1: the obvious, like when you write something down, you're able

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Speaker 1: to to completely preserve the steps to carry out a

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Speaker 1: right to create a UM you know, a particular dish,

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Speaker 1: I mean, you name it. You're able to take uh,

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Speaker 1: something that is otherwise kind of ephemeral and subject to

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Speaker 1: forgetfulness and change, and you're able to to set it

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Speaker 1: in stone. And and it's it's like reaching into your

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Speaker 1: brain and taking something out of it and saying, here

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Speaker 1: it is. Here is the idea. Yeah. And I think

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Speaker 1: there's obviously a connection to this, to beyond magical grimoires.

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Speaker 1: I mean, early UH religious movements had access to the

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Speaker 1: clergy within Christianity. For instance, they had access to the

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Speaker 1: written version of the Bible and that they for a

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Speaker 1: long time were the only ones who could read it

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Speaker 1: and understand it and then subsequently pass on the word

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Speaker 1: of God to their congregation, UH, which in a way

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Speaker 1: was a kind of magic of its own at the time. Indeed,

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Speaker 1: UM Davies also points out that writing was primarily of

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Speaker 1: tool magic for the attack. There's a various ethnic groups

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Speaker 1: u UM that lived in modern day Sumatra dating back

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Speaker 1: a thousand years or so, and UH they would preserve

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Speaker 1: all of their their rights, religious rights more faithfully obviously,

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Speaker 1: and the written word versus the oral tradition. So the

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Speaker 1: art of writing was that was the domain of their

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Speaker 1: their datu priest magicians who wrote in magic books that

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Speaker 1: were unfolded strips of bark. Yeah, So this gets us

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Speaker 1: into this area where like, what you're writing on two

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Speaker 1: has has significance, right, So they wrote on bark, and

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Speaker 1: then I believe there are examples of of other um

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Speaker 1: cultures writing on particular kinds of food, and then subsequently

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Speaker 1: even with grimoires or sort of like early versions of

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Speaker 1: them that were just like one sheet of paper with

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Speaker 1: some magical incantation written upon them. There was a consumption

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Speaker 1: aspect to this that if you ate the writing, that

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Speaker 1: it would somehow affect you. Yeah. One of the things

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Speaker 1: I love about the Gramore subject here is that you

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Speaker 1: see so much the fetishization of books and the idea

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Speaker 1: that I've taken this idea, I've written it down, and

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Speaker 1: the book has become physical, and then I'm able to

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Speaker 1: interact with the physical embodiment of these ideas, of this

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Speaker 1: sacred knowledge, etcetera. Uh, in various ways. One way, of course,

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Speaker 1: it's just to have it on a shelf to impress people,

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Speaker 1: which you would see with magicians back in the day,

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Speaker 1: which you see in a modern day like lawyer's office,

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Speaker 1: or even academics like I remember when I was in

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Speaker 1: grad school, like the professors sort of had this unspoken

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Speaker 1: challenge amongst themselves of who had the large bookshelf space

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Speaker 1: in their office, and they were envious of one another

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Speaker 1: over who had the largest collection that they could display

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Speaker 1: and subsequently lend to students or other professors. Yeah. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: and ze still carries on today obviously. Um, despite the

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Speaker 1: popularity of e books, I don't know there's any professors

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Speaker 1: with just a one E reader sitting on their desk.

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Speaker 1: I mean, that's one of the things about e readers,

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Speaker 1: And one of the things I miss is being able

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Speaker 1: to sort of casually show off what you're reading to

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Speaker 1: other people if you're reading it, not because you want

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Speaker 1: to start, you know, to show off or or anything,

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Speaker 1: but occasionally you would strike up a conversation with someone

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Speaker 1: about the book the read and now it's yeah, yeah,

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Speaker 1: I mean I suppose that's a different topic for another time.

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Speaker 1: But there are attempts, I think from the electronic book

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Speaker 1: industry of trying to make them share able and social.

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Speaker 1: But it's not. It doesn't work the quite yet the

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Speaker 1: way that it used to, in the way that you

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Speaker 1: just hand like a tattered book to somebody and are

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Speaker 1: more difficult to eat. Yes, exactly, an e reader would

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Speaker 1: not grant you magical powers or even Uh. It's within

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Speaker 1: the Bible that there is a section about the consumption

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Speaker 1: of this. It's in numbers five from the Old Testament. Uh.

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Speaker 1: And this is I don't believe that this is from

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Speaker 1: the actual verse, but it says a woman who is

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Speaker 1: suspected of adultery can be brought to a priest and

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Speaker 1: made to undergo the trial of bitter water. And what

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Speaker 1: they mean by this is that the priest writes inside

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Speaker 1: of he writes curses inside of a book, and he

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Speaker 1: takes the book and he blots them out with water,

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Speaker 1: and then he makes this woman drink this water, and

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Speaker 1: it subsequently will tell if she's guilty or not by

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Speaker 1: causing her belly to swell and her thighs to rot.

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Speaker 1: So that's how you know whether or not somebody has

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Speaker 1: been adulteress by forcing them to drink dirty water, dirty

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Speaker 1: ink water. Fans to see this is amazing because it's

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Speaker 1: the again, the the idea has taken physical form, and

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Speaker 1: then you're able to interact with this physical embodiment of

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Speaker 1: the the idea or the or the faith uh in

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Speaker 1: the most primitive ways possible by consuming it, by drinking

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Speaker 1: waters from it. And you see a lot of this

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Speaker 1: just you know, to your point with the Bible itself.

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Speaker 1: I mean it, look look at the way that it is.

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Speaker 1: It has been used and continues to be used, held

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Speaker 1: up as a sort of gramore. It's not it's the

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Speaker 1: Bible is is not more. But you see some of

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Speaker 1: the same attributes applied, uh, such as you see Bibles

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Speaker 1: placed under the under pillows to protect people from evil spirits.

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Speaker 1: Even today it's touched, you swear an oath on it.

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Speaker 1: Obviously there's this is about the magical properties of the

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Speaker 1: physical text. And what was kind of fascinating to me,

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Speaker 1: like diving into their research on this subject of grimoires,

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Speaker 1: is that, uh, I'd never realized how deeply intertwined they

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Speaker 1: were with the history of the Bible, and that a

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Speaker 1: lot of what we think of today as being sort

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Speaker 1: of uh magical, whimsical, almost fantasy type ideas, they can

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Speaker 1: you can trace their origins back to the Bible and

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Speaker 1: back to the beginning of Christianity. Uh. And it's just

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Speaker 1: kind of fascinating. But there was even more of that

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Speaker 1: kind of ingesting of books and inks and holy writing

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Speaker 1: back in medieval times. I say that like medieval times,

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Speaker 1: like we're going to a Renaissance fair or something. But

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Speaker 1: but but yeah, it's just kind of fascinating that that

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Speaker 1: begins in this Old Testament area. I'm sure there were

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Speaker 1: probably origins of it before then, uh, and then trace

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00:17:33,520 --> 00:17:36,919
Speaker 1: their way up, you know, five years later, have multiple

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Speaker 1: cases of the Holy Word being either written on something

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Speaker 1: edible and then consumed uh to treat illnesses to you know,

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Speaker 1: other cases of rinsing the manuscript and drinking the water

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Speaker 1: from it. Um. Yeah. Again, in all of this we

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Speaker 1: see the fetishization of the written word, language made fixed

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00:17:56,080 --> 00:17:59,159
Speaker 1: uh in a way that it captures meaning, procedure, and story,

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Speaker 1: and it becomes the physical embodiment of idea made into

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Speaker 1: matter that can be utilized in both physical and imagine

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Speaker 1: spiritual means. Yeah. And and so you know, not to

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Speaker 1: uh the labor the point, but the ingestion of these

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00:18:15,280 --> 00:18:18,080
Speaker 1: books that wasn't the only thing that people did with them.

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Speaker 1: It's fascinating to us now to kind of look back

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00:18:19,840 --> 00:18:21,480
Speaker 1: and they go, wow, people just ate these books and

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Speaker 1: thought they were getting getting powers or or expelling curses

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Speaker 1: or something, but they you know, obviously they were using

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00:18:27,280 --> 00:18:29,480
Speaker 1: them for magical rituals as well. But then there's this

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Speaker 1: also kind of fascinating area in the fourteen hundreds and

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Speaker 1: fifteen hundreds where there were treasure hunters, kind of Indiana

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Speaker 1: Jones types, and they were accused by I believe the

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Speaker 1: clergy at the time of using grimoires and other kinds

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Speaker 1: of quote unquote magic to control spirits or demons who

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00:18:45,760 --> 00:18:48,560
Speaker 1: guarded wealth. So they were like, you know, breaking into

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Speaker 1: the Temple of Doom and using these books and just

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Speaker 1: you know, some way to to make it safe for

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Speaker 1: them to get through to get the buried treasure or whatever.

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Speaker 1: It all sounds like a D and D adventure, but

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Speaker 1: you know, it was at the very least, uh, something

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Speaker 1: that was It was a propaganda that was that was

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Speaker 1: used against the such kind of bounty hunters or treasure

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00:19:07,520 --> 00:19:12,439
Speaker 1: hunters or whatever. But ultimately we're talking about magical thinking

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Speaker 1: and magic here and and this is magic with the

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Speaker 1: capital m uh. The idea of there being distinct distinctions

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Speaker 1: in schools. Again very Harry Potter, very Dungeons and Dragons

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Speaker 1: um that these different books had aspects to them of

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Speaker 1: certain types of magic that they would teach you or

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Speaker 1: that they would give you control over. So some of

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Speaker 1: the ones we're gonna encounter and here natural magic, obviously,

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00:19:38,400 --> 00:19:42,520
Speaker 1: demonic magic, necromancy, and then there was an idea of

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00:19:42,560 --> 00:19:45,960
Speaker 1: astral magic too, that you were somehow harnessing the powers

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00:19:46,040 --> 00:19:51,360
Speaker 1: of the celestial bodies. This is obviously before astronomy really

336
00:19:51,400 --> 00:19:56,120
Speaker 1: took right, but the idea of using those as magical powers.

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Speaker 1: And one of the most infamous grimoires that does this

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00:19:58,920 --> 00:20:01,600
Speaker 1: is a book called The Picked Arrks. I believe is

339
00:20:01,640 --> 00:20:04,440
Speaker 1: how it's pronounced um, and it was. It was very influential.

340
00:20:04,600 --> 00:20:07,440
Speaker 1: It's also referred to as the aim of the Sage.

341
00:20:08,320 --> 00:20:11,680
Speaker 1: Now with natural magic um in this, we're we're getting

342
00:20:11,680 --> 00:20:15,680
Speaker 1: into almost science the magic, right about interacting with natural

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00:20:15,760 --> 00:20:18,960
Speaker 1: processes in the world. Yeah, So natural magic was sort

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00:20:19,000 --> 00:20:21,320
Speaker 1: of like if you're familiar with like the Dungeons and

345
00:20:21,359 --> 00:20:23,720
Speaker 1: Dragons breakdown, they were sort of like the druids as

346
00:20:23,760 --> 00:20:27,760
Speaker 1: compared to the wizards or sorcerers. They were more interested

347
00:20:28,480 --> 00:20:32,800
Speaker 1: natural magicians were more interested in using herbalism and finding

348
00:20:32,840 --> 00:20:35,919
Speaker 1: a inner magic within flora and fauna. But you know,

349
00:20:36,000 --> 00:20:40,160
Speaker 1: ultimately what that meant was kind of, uh, exactly like

350
00:20:40,200 --> 00:20:44,479
Speaker 1: a science to the natural world around them and what

351
00:20:44,520 --> 00:20:47,959
Speaker 1: they would they would share this knowledge within these books.

352
00:20:48,480 --> 00:20:52,200
Speaker 1: It wasn't as much here is such and such demons name,

353
00:20:52,359 --> 00:20:54,720
Speaker 1: he's the ruler of this level of hell. If you

354
00:20:54,800 --> 00:20:57,520
Speaker 1: say his name three times backwards, he'll show up and

355
00:20:57,600 --> 00:20:59,360
Speaker 1: give you a piece of gold. Right. It wasn't anything.

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00:20:59,440 --> 00:21:02,320
Speaker 1: It was more of out especially within the Christian tradition,

357
00:21:02,359 --> 00:21:06,400
Speaker 1: it could be seen as exploring God's creation rather than

358
00:21:07,280 --> 00:21:12,440
Speaker 1: trying to enact unnatural control over exterior forces. Yeah. So

359
00:21:12,520 --> 00:21:15,160
Speaker 1: it's kind of fascinating that all of these different things,

360
00:21:15,520 --> 00:21:18,000
Speaker 1: things that we now think of as being science of

361
00:21:18,280 --> 00:21:24,280
Speaker 1: you know, uh, biology or astronomy or chemistry or physics,

362
00:21:24,480 --> 00:21:27,119
Speaker 1: were at the time considered magic. And we're lumped together

363
00:21:27,240 --> 00:21:31,120
Speaker 1: with things like summoning demons and listing angels and being

364
00:21:31,160 --> 00:21:34,240
Speaker 1: able to raise the dead. Uh, and you know, maybe

365
00:21:34,280 --> 00:21:39,600
Speaker 1: we just haven't uncovered the scientific appropriation of that just yet.

366
00:21:39,840 --> 00:21:42,240
Speaker 1: And of course we also see the influence of Jewish

367
00:21:42,280 --> 00:21:46,600
Speaker 1: mysticism with the Book of Razziel and the Book of Mysteries.

368
00:21:47,200 --> 00:21:51,920
Speaker 1: You have these situations where Jewish Spanish scholars bring these

369
00:21:51,960 --> 00:21:55,920
Speaker 1: into the more tradition from the Torah. Yeah. In fact,

370
00:21:55,920 --> 00:21:58,399
Speaker 1: there's this really interesting story that I believe was in

371
00:21:58,480 --> 00:22:03,040
Speaker 1: Davis book about how in Cairo there was a stash

372
00:22:03,200 --> 00:22:08,280
Speaker 1: of of grimoires that were discovered, uh inside basically somebody's

373
00:22:08,320 --> 00:22:11,400
Speaker 1: abandoned home, I think. And it included the Kabbalah, which

374
00:22:11,440 --> 00:22:14,120
Speaker 1: we we know today as being you know, a type

375
00:22:14,119 --> 00:22:18,199
Speaker 1: of Jewish mysticism. Um. And this was sort of like

376
00:22:18,240 --> 00:22:22,320
Speaker 1: an interpretation of the Torah as being like actually the

377
00:22:23,080 --> 00:22:25,720
Speaker 1: using Hebrew as the language of God, right, and that

378
00:22:25,800 --> 00:22:29,040
Speaker 1: it had its own magical combination. Uh. If you move

379
00:22:29,119 --> 00:22:32,880
Speaker 1: the letters around you could you could create different effects

380
00:22:32,880 --> 00:22:36,720
Speaker 1: basically well, um, lining up with the if I remember correctly,

381
00:22:36,760 --> 00:22:41,120
Speaker 1: with the golem, Yeah, it was the word life and death. Uh.

382
00:22:41,480 --> 00:22:43,200
Speaker 1: I forgot which one, but there was a word that

383
00:22:43,240 --> 00:22:45,080
Speaker 1: would you would put on the forehead and if you

384
00:22:45,160 --> 00:22:47,280
Speaker 1: change one letter, it would spell death and that would

385
00:22:47,280 --> 00:22:53,000
Speaker 1: the activate Yeah. I believe the golem legend is check maybe. Um.

386
00:22:53,720 --> 00:22:55,760
Speaker 1: I remember being in Prague and there was a lot

387
00:22:55,800 --> 00:23:01,600
Speaker 1: of golem tourism around it. But um, but yeah, I

388
00:23:01,680 --> 00:23:04,040
Speaker 1: think that that's right, that that that the idea behind

389
00:23:04,080 --> 00:23:06,680
Speaker 1: that kind of magic for making a homunculous like that

390
00:23:07,000 --> 00:23:09,960
Speaker 1: was just by being able to manipulate the letters of

391
00:23:10,040 --> 00:23:14,000
Speaker 1: Hebrew language. And there's also this really interesting influence later

392
00:23:14,080 --> 00:23:18,000
Speaker 1: on on these these types of books from Scandinavia. Uh.

393
00:23:18,040 --> 00:23:21,720
Speaker 1: In fact, Iceland was part of this as well. And

394
00:23:21,760 --> 00:23:24,960
Speaker 1: the idea was that the runs from their language and

395
00:23:25,000 --> 00:23:29,560
Speaker 1: from from their religion were also used as magical symbols

396
00:23:29,560 --> 00:23:34,040
Speaker 1: and seen as they were things that uh, Europeans didn't understand.

397
00:23:34,119 --> 00:23:37,760
Speaker 1: They didn't even once they started to become more literate.

398
00:23:37,760 --> 00:23:42,000
Speaker 1: Then you saw, you know, Hebrew or uh or these

399
00:23:42,040 --> 00:23:46,040
Speaker 1: these these Nordic runes, and they had a mystery about them.

400
00:23:46,400 --> 00:23:48,240
Speaker 1: You didn't quite know what they meant, and they still

401
00:23:48,280 --> 00:23:50,639
Speaker 1: had power to them more than than you know, the

402
00:23:50,760 --> 00:23:55,040
Speaker 1: Romantic alphabet, I guess, uh. But you start seeing later

403
00:23:55,280 --> 00:23:58,040
Speaker 1: in the in the medieval era, these different languages get

404
00:23:58,040 --> 00:24:02,520
Speaker 1: incorporated into these grimoires that are about summoning demons and

405
00:24:02,520 --> 00:24:07,320
Speaker 1: are largely in Latin. So as we try to dive

406
00:24:07,359 --> 00:24:11,720
Speaker 1: into the deep history of grim wars, I mean, obviously

407
00:24:12,040 --> 00:24:14,639
Speaker 1: there's a lot that's lost to the mists of time

408
00:24:14,720 --> 00:24:19,080
Speaker 1: here and to you know, frankly, a lot of destruction

409
00:24:19,119 --> 00:24:24,120
Speaker 1: of books over religious wars basically when it comes down

410
00:24:24,119 --> 00:24:26,439
Speaker 1: to it. But a lot of these books were lost

411
00:24:26,520 --> 00:24:30,119
Speaker 1: to us, to history and to understanding because they were burned,

412
00:24:30,600 --> 00:24:34,440
Speaker 1: um for being against whatever was kind of the status

413
00:24:34,520 --> 00:24:39,400
Speaker 1: quo culture and theological interpretation of the time. Yeah, particularly

414
00:24:39,480 --> 00:24:46,240
Speaker 1: the more scandalous volumes or demonology themed as opposed to

415
00:24:46,280 --> 00:24:50,240
Speaker 1: the natural magic, which which again can often be uh

416
00:24:50,480 --> 00:24:54,440
Speaker 1: at least viewed in terms of being in keeping with

417
00:24:54,840 --> 00:24:58,000
Speaker 1: with with Christian standards. Yeah. In fact, let me see

418
00:24:58,000 --> 00:24:59,280
Speaker 1: if I can find it in my notes here. But

419
00:24:59,320 --> 00:25:02,920
Speaker 1: there's thisascinating part of during the Inquisition. I'm jumping a

420
00:25:02,960 --> 00:25:07,000
Speaker 1: little bit ahead here, but um that that during the

421
00:25:07,040 --> 00:25:11,760
Speaker 1: Inquisition there were actually, uh, there was less attention paid

422
00:25:11,800 --> 00:25:15,360
Speaker 1: to those natural magic books. In fact, in twelve fifty eight,

423
00:25:15,400 --> 00:25:20,920
Speaker 1: Pope Alexander the Fourth told inquisitors, look, just ignore books

424
00:25:20,920 --> 00:25:23,879
Speaker 1: that are about divinations, natural magic, that kind of stuff.

425
00:25:23,880 --> 00:25:28,399
Speaker 1: What we're looking for is quote unquote manifest heresy, praying

426
00:25:28,400 --> 00:25:32,240
Speaker 1: at the altars of idols to offer sacrifices, consult demons,

427
00:25:32,600 --> 00:25:35,720
Speaker 1: or to elicit a response from them, so they actually

428
00:25:35,800 --> 00:25:41,200
Speaker 1: ignored a lot of occult traditions that didn't necessarily challenge

429
00:25:41,359 --> 00:25:46,960
Speaker 1: their own religion or dominance. And it's kind of fascinating

430
00:25:47,280 --> 00:25:50,440
Speaker 1: because when you can go back, even with these demons

431
00:25:50,480 --> 00:25:55,600
Speaker 1: summoning uh magic books, there is a tradition that goes

432
00:25:55,680 --> 00:25:58,680
Speaker 1: all the way back to the beginning of Christianity from

433
00:25:58,760 --> 00:26:01,480
Speaker 1: these So so when you look at, according to Davies,

434
00:26:01,560 --> 00:26:04,440
Speaker 1: the history of Grimoire is the very first person who's

435
00:26:04,520 --> 00:26:08,240
Speaker 1: who's supposed to have written down magic is this astrologer

436
00:26:08,400 --> 00:26:11,840
Speaker 1: from four A d b c E. Who was named

437
00:26:12,840 --> 00:26:16,320
Speaker 1: I believe this is Austin Fenny's Austin Fanny's. I don't

438
00:26:16,400 --> 00:26:20,560
Speaker 1: I might be pronouncing this wrong. My my ancient language

439
00:26:20,560 --> 00:26:24,040
Speaker 1: pronunciation isn't that great. But he was. He was basically

440
00:26:24,040 --> 00:26:29,239
Speaker 1: like a courtier to King Xerxes. Xerxes and Uh in

441
00:26:29,280 --> 00:26:33,920
Speaker 1: an attempt to conquer Greece. They they, you know, purportedly

442
00:26:34,160 --> 00:26:37,680
Speaker 1: used these magic books. He's been described as being someone

443
00:26:37,720 --> 00:26:41,520
Speaker 1: who tried to infect the world with his quote hideous craft.

444
00:26:41,800 --> 00:26:45,440
Speaker 1: I like that. It's interesting that that charge would be

445
00:26:45,440 --> 00:26:48,639
Speaker 1: be leveled in an environment where one people's attempting to

446
00:26:48,720 --> 00:26:53,159
Speaker 1: conquer another engaged in in full blown out warfare with

447
00:26:53,200 --> 00:26:56,760
Speaker 1: all of its bloody consequences. Yeah, and then you know,

448
00:26:57,080 --> 00:27:01,040
Speaker 1: we go from there to supposedly the Dead Sea Scrolls

449
00:27:01,880 --> 00:27:04,960
Speaker 1: talk about the Books of Enoch, which or you know,

450
00:27:05,000 --> 00:27:07,959
Speaker 1: could possibly be a lost book from the Bible, uh,

451
00:27:08,119 --> 00:27:11,360
Speaker 1: circulated around the time of Christ, and it was largely

452
00:27:11,680 --> 00:27:15,200
Speaker 1: a book that was filled with astrological and angelic lore.

453
00:27:15,280 --> 00:27:17,920
Speaker 1: And in fact, there was this idea with a lot

454
00:27:18,000 --> 00:27:21,359
Speaker 1: of these books that angels actually either gave these books

455
00:27:21,359 --> 00:27:25,200
Speaker 1: to men, like handed these books to men, or came

456
00:27:25,240 --> 00:27:28,719
Speaker 1: down and uh spoke the words to man and and

457
00:27:28,800 --> 00:27:32,959
Speaker 1: man transcribed them from an angel's voice. So that's where

458
00:27:33,359 --> 00:27:37,760
Speaker 1: we initially gain this magical insight from, is that these

459
00:27:37,800 --> 00:27:41,480
Speaker 1: these beings came and and and delivered it to us. Right,

460
00:27:41,520 --> 00:27:44,000
Speaker 1: And with that, you're, I guess, depending on how far

461
00:27:44,119 --> 00:27:46,480
Speaker 1: you go with it, you could certainly get into heretical waters.

462
00:27:46,920 --> 00:27:49,000
Speaker 1: But to a certain extent, you're kind of playing it

463
00:27:49,040 --> 00:27:51,080
Speaker 1: safe because you're like, well, an angel brought it to him.

464
00:27:51,080 --> 00:27:53,040
Speaker 1: You're not going so far to say that God came

465
00:27:53,200 --> 00:27:55,720
Speaker 1: or that Jesus showed up, but but some sort of

466
00:27:55,760 --> 00:28:00,160
Speaker 1: angelic into decay. Yeah, there's the potential out there if

467
00:28:00,160 --> 00:28:02,800
Speaker 1: you're if you're caught. And and this is where it

468
00:28:02,800 --> 00:28:07,000
Speaker 1: gets into like the real uh tight connections with the

469
00:28:07,040 --> 00:28:11,920
Speaker 1: Bible is that one of the most popularized ideas within

470
00:28:11,920 --> 00:28:15,440
Speaker 1: these gramars was that Ham, known as the son of

471
00:28:15,480 --> 00:28:19,840
Speaker 1: Noah uh and brother of Shem, was one of the

472
00:28:19,880 --> 00:28:23,320
Speaker 1: main people who was responsible for writing these books of

473
00:28:23,359 --> 00:28:28,560
Speaker 1: conjuration and magic. Um. He Uh supposedly invented magic with

474
00:28:28,600 --> 00:28:31,760
Speaker 1: the help of demons, and then he taught his own son,

475
00:28:31,840 --> 00:28:37,200
Speaker 1: whose name was Kanan, to write these down in thirty volumes.

476
00:28:37,200 --> 00:28:41,000
Speaker 1: But that after Kanan wrote these thirty volumes down, that

477
00:28:41,040 --> 00:28:44,680
Speaker 1: there was a large battle and these books were burned, Uh,

478
00:28:44,720 --> 00:28:47,560
Speaker 1: but maybe some of them made their way out there

479
00:28:47,560 --> 00:28:49,840
Speaker 1: into the world. You know. That's how these these legends

480
00:28:49,840 --> 00:28:54,440
Speaker 1: of occult toms begin. So it's a real fascinating that

481
00:28:54,480 --> 00:28:58,480
Speaker 1: there's this direct connection between Noah, his family, the sort

482
00:28:58,520 --> 00:29:04,160
Speaker 1: of uh resurgence of humanity and magic. Yeah, that it's

483
00:29:04,200 --> 00:29:06,960
Speaker 1: interesting and certainly that's people we're talking about a time

484
00:29:07,240 --> 00:29:10,880
Speaker 1: and in a particular myth here that plays into not

485
00:29:11,000 --> 00:29:17,320
Speaker 1: only Christian and Jewish traditions, but also early religions like Zoroasternism,

486
00:29:17,360 --> 00:29:21,960
Speaker 1: also flowing into Asian and Egyptian beliefs to a certain extent. Yeah,

487
00:29:22,040 --> 00:29:25,080
Speaker 1: and by and large they all had one thing in common,

488
00:29:25,160 --> 00:29:30,440
Speaker 1: which was that these manuscripts were used to give financial, sexual,

489
00:29:30,960 --> 00:29:34,720
Speaker 1: or even social gain to their users. It was ultimately

490
00:29:34,720 --> 00:29:38,400
Speaker 1: about power. Um, whether it came from Ham or a

491
00:29:38,440 --> 00:29:43,080
Speaker 1: demon or an angel or whoever. Uh, these books were

492
00:29:43,120 --> 00:29:46,080
Speaker 1: by and large used to have power over other people,

493
00:29:46,280 --> 00:29:49,040
Speaker 1: or at least give the illusion of it. The exact

494
00:29:49,040 --> 00:29:51,760
Speaker 1: same topics that you might buy books of tape on

495
00:29:52,120 --> 00:29:54,520
Speaker 1: in the the eighties, you might buy any kind of

496
00:29:54,520 --> 00:29:57,680
Speaker 1: self help manual today was essentially the domain of the

497
00:29:57,680 --> 00:30:02,160
Speaker 1: gramoire in ancient times. Yeah, and it's interesting, so like, uh,

498
00:30:02,200 --> 00:30:04,400
Speaker 1: then you get you get, So it goes from Ham

499
00:30:04,480 --> 00:30:08,280
Speaker 1: to Moses. Um. Moses was actually seen as being a

500
00:30:08,280 --> 00:30:11,000
Speaker 1: magician because of the stories that are in the Old

501
00:30:11,040 --> 00:30:16,280
Speaker 1: Testament about turning throwing down like they're yeah, it's like

502
00:30:16,320 --> 00:30:18,320
Speaker 1: a contest of who can turn a staff into the

503
00:30:18,320 --> 00:30:21,520
Speaker 1: greatest snake exactly, and that because his God was more

504
00:30:21,560 --> 00:30:24,240
Speaker 1: powerful than their magic, he was seen as being this

505
00:30:24,560 --> 00:30:29,120
Speaker 1: incredibly powerful wizard. Essentially, he was the Gandalf of the

506
00:30:29,160 --> 00:30:33,480
Speaker 1: Bible to some people. Uh. And um, there's this interesting

507
00:30:33,560 --> 00:30:36,640
Speaker 1: idea that there were hidden books of Moses, that Moses

508
00:30:36,680 --> 00:30:40,920
Speaker 1: actually wrote books of the Bible that that didn't make

509
00:30:40,960 --> 00:30:43,880
Speaker 1: it into the final content that we know today as

510
00:30:43,960 --> 00:30:47,120
Speaker 1: the Christian Bible. Uh. And that within those is where

511
00:30:47,160 --> 00:30:50,760
Speaker 1: you would find this information about whatever, summoning demons, or

512
00:30:51,040 --> 00:30:53,760
Speaker 1: having magical powers, being able to turn water into blood,

513
00:30:53,760 --> 00:30:58,080
Speaker 1: all these kinds of things. Um and Moses is sometimes

514
00:30:58,160 --> 00:31:01,800
Speaker 1: conflated with or or maybe somewhat pitted against, the idea

515
00:31:01,880 --> 00:31:08,880
Speaker 1: of the great Egyptian magician Hermes Trismegastus. I don't know

516
00:31:08,880 --> 00:31:11,520
Speaker 1: how to pronounce his last name, but he's also known

517
00:31:11,600 --> 00:31:16,480
Speaker 1: as as as Tough, the god of wisdom and and

518
00:31:16,480 --> 00:31:19,280
Speaker 1: and and sometimes confused with the Greek god Hermes. There's

519
00:31:19,280 --> 00:31:24,440
Speaker 1: a lot of magical insight and uh power and knowledge

520
00:31:24,480 --> 00:31:27,200
Speaker 1: that supposedly flows out of the tradition of Hermes and

521
00:31:27,280 --> 00:31:31,640
Speaker 1: top And then of course you have Solomon, another another

522
00:31:31,720 --> 00:31:34,280
Speaker 1: character from from the Bible that has a lot of

523
00:31:34,840 --> 00:31:39,360
Speaker 1: a lot of superstition and occult um information woven around him.

524
00:31:39,600 --> 00:31:42,160
Speaker 1: This is the son of David, and the Testament of

525
00:31:42,200 --> 00:31:45,200
Speaker 1: Solomon is the first book attributed to him, showing up

526
00:31:45,240 --> 00:31:47,600
Speaker 1: at some point during the first five years of the

527
00:31:47,600 --> 00:31:50,920
Speaker 1: Common era. Yeah, And what's fascinating about the Testament of

528
00:31:50,960 --> 00:31:53,400
Speaker 1: Solomon and these other books that are supposedly written by

529
00:31:53,480 --> 00:31:57,320
Speaker 1: him is that they have this this common story and

530
00:31:57,360 --> 00:31:59,680
Speaker 1: you see this the book that I read from at

531
00:31:59,720 --> 00:32:02,040
Speaker 1: the beginning, The Lesser Key of Solomon is related to

532
00:32:02,080 --> 00:32:05,920
Speaker 1: the Testament of Solomon. Uh. The the idea was that

533
00:32:05,960 --> 00:32:11,080
Speaker 1: Solomon received a ring from the archangel archangel Michael, and

534
00:32:11,440 --> 00:32:13,560
Speaker 1: this ring had a symbol on it, which we now

535
00:32:13,560 --> 00:32:17,160
Speaker 1: refer to as the Seal of Solomon UH, which he

536
00:32:17,320 --> 00:32:21,080
Speaker 1: used to bind demons because these demons were attacking the

537
00:32:21,120 --> 00:32:24,920
Speaker 1: Holy Temple that he was building, and he was able

538
00:32:24,960 --> 00:32:27,400
Speaker 1: to control these demons so they would stop hampering the

539
00:32:27,400 --> 00:32:31,400
Speaker 1: construction of the temple and then make them help build

540
00:32:31,440 --> 00:32:34,400
Speaker 1: the temple, which is kind of fascinating. Uh. This is

541
00:32:34,400 --> 00:32:36,160
Speaker 1: the Temple of course. That how's the ark of the

542
00:32:36,160 --> 00:32:39,800
Speaker 1: Covenant and the seal. Today we think of it as

543
00:32:39,840 --> 00:32:44,160
Speaker 1: being the pentagram or sometimes a hexagram, but basically this

544
00:32:44,240 --> 00:32:46,760
Speaker 1: symbol that has become you know, largely associated with the

545
00:32:46,800 --> 00:32:49,480
Speaker 1: cult and Satanism and stuff like this. But in these

546
00:32:49,520 --> 00:32:54,200
Speaker 1: books we see Solomon using it to control demons actually too,

547
00:32:55,160 --> 00:32:58,880
Speaker 1: and that it's given to him by angels. By Heaven.

548
00:32:59,000 --> 00:33:01,520
Speaker 1: I love about this this account is that it sounds

549
00:33:01,600 --> 00:33:04,040
Speaker 1: very lazy on the angels part, like the angels is

550
00:33:04,120 --> 00:33:06,720
Speaker 1: supposed to be working security. Now, I look, we don't

551
00:33:06,720 --> 00:33:08,200
Speaker 1: have time for this. Here, here's the thing that I

552
00:33:08,240 --> 00:33:11,640
Speaker 1: was going to use. Just use it responsible, don't go crazy.

553
00:33:11,720 --> 00:33:14,240
Speaker 1: It's just the ex mock and a book of solom

554
00:33:14,640 --> 00:33:16,600
Speaker 1: He's like, well, I could just drive the demons away,

555
00:33:16,680 --> 00:33:18,960
Speaker 1: or heck, I could make them build the thing for me.

556
00:33:20,240 --> 00:33:22,040
Speaker 1: I'll just borrow it a little while longer. And he

557
00:33:22,120 --> 00:33:24,880
Speaker 1: also ends up using it, you know, after after his

558
00:33:25,000 --> 00:33:28,640
Speaker 1: practical reasons are done in the temple is finished, he

559
00:33:28,760 --> 00:33:32,080
Speaker 1: forces these demons to identify themselves. And this is where

560
00:33:32,080 --> 00:33:35,880
Speaker 1: we get this sort of encyclopedic knowledge of demons from

561
00:33:36,200 --> 00:33:38,360
Speaker 1: what their powers are. But he basically makes them all

562
00:33:38,400 --> 00:33:41,720
Speaker 1: tell them his name, tell him their names, and then

563
00:33:41,760 --> 00:33:44,560
Speaker 1: tell him what are your powers? And he lists them

564
00:33:44,600 --> 00:33:47,640
Speaker 1: all and what are weaknesses in case somebody else encounters

565
00:33:47,680 --> 00:33:50,720
Speaker 1: you down the road. Like so, for example, there was

566
00:33:50,720 --> 00:33:56,400
Speaker 1: a demon supposedly named uh An. These names are so

567
00:33:56,440 --> 00:34:00,960
Speaker 1: hard to pronounce a Junian, I believe, and he was

568
00:34:01,040 --> 00:34:05,240
Speaker 1: known for laying among babies swaddling clothes and causing mischief.

569
00:34:05,680 --> 00:34:08,000
Speaker 1: So I imagine that this is like the the demon

570
00:34:08,040 --> 00:34:11,560
Speaker 1: of dirty diapers apparently is what it sounds like. Um,

571
00:34:11,560 --> 00:34:15,880
Speaker 1: but if you wrote the word like her ghos on

572
00:34:15,960 --> 00:34:18,880
Speaker 1: a leaf, you could make him flee and run away

573
00:34:18,880 --> 00:34:22,400
Speaker 1: from the baby's swaddling clothes. So these are like Solomon

574
00:34:22,520 --> 00:34:25,680
Speaker 1: sort of interpretations of how to use magic to make

575
00:34:25,719 --> 00:34:28,120
Speaker 1: all these various demons. Was just sound to me like

576
00:34:28,239 --> 00:34:31,760
Speaker 1: kind of like everyday problems, like cleaning your baby's diaper.

577
00:34:32,280 --> 00:34:35,600
Speaker 1: Uh there was. It reminds me too of the lay

578
00:34:35,640 --> 00:34:38,799
Speaker 1: we already mentioned, like the the the inclination to name

579
00:34:38,840 --> 00:34:42,239
Speaker 1: every angel as well to the catalog those guys. I

580
00:34:42,280 --> 00:34:43,839
Speaker 1: think this is one that has been created partially out

581
00:34:43,840 --> 00:34:48,960
Speaker 1: of satire. Was a particular angel whose sole job perhaps

582
00:34:49,440 --> 00:34:53,040
Speaker 1: was to go around the monastery and if any particularly

583
00:34:53,080 --> 00:34:57,720
Speaker 1: the older monks, fell asleep during the service, he would

584
00:34:57,719 --> 00:35:01,160
Speaker 1: cause that monk to fart, and you know, as just

585
00:35:01,320 --> 00:35:05,040
Speaker 1: punishment for for for nodding off. Man, I wonder what

586
00:35:05,120 --> 00:35:07,480
Speaker 1: the fart angel's name is? Yeah, and how don't you

587
00:35:07,520 --> 00:35:10,360
Speaker 1: get that we need a ring to force him to

588
00:35:10,400 --> 00:35:14,360
Speaker 1: tell us all of his secrets? Uh? Well. The interesting

589
00:35:14,400 --> 00:35:17,480
Speaker 1: thing about the Testament of Solomon though, is that Solomon's

590
00:35:17,480 --> 00:35:20,080
Speaker 1: story in this I believe differs from the Bible. I

591
00:35:20,120 --> 00:35:24,279
Speaker 1: don't know. My Old Testament isn't that great. But supposedly

592
00:35:24,280 --> 00:35:26,719
Speaker 1: he lost the ring and these powers that were given

593
00:35:26,760 --> 00:35:29,960
Speaker 1: to him because he actually kind of turned away from

594
00:35:30,000 --> 00:35:34,280
Speaker 1: God and made human sacrifices to Uh, an older god

595
00:35:35,080 --> 00:35:38,880
Speaker 1: from you know, Canaanite times I believe named molok Uh

596
00:35:39,520 --> 00:35:42,480
Speaker 1: because Solomon wanted to sleep with a woman Uh. And

597
00:35:42,680 --> 00:35:46,840
Speaker 1: he built temples to other gods or demons. That Rafa

598
00:35:47,040 --> 00:35:49,000
Speaker 1: was one of them. In Bile is another one that's

599
00:35:49,000 --> 00:35:50,680
Speaker 1: a common name that you see pop up in these

600
00:35:50,680 --> 00:35:54,120
Speaker 1: grimoires as being a demon name. Um. So it's just

601
00:35:54,200 --> 00:35:57,479
Speaker 1: interesting that these tropes kind of like make their way

602
00:35:57,520 --> 00:36:01,719
Speaker 1: through many later grimoires that are so puposedly written by Solomon.

603
00:36:01,760 --> 00:36:03,719
Speaker 1: But there's this long story of that. You know, he

604
00:36:03,800 --> 00:36:06,080
Speaker 1: had the power, he was able to get all this

605
00:36:06,160 --> 00:36:09,160
Speaker 1: information out of these demons. He got it from angels.

606
00:36:09,400 --> 00:36:12,960
Speaker 1: But then he lost it because like like man, of course,

607
00:36:13,040 --> 00:36:16,800
Speaker 1: he let it go to his head. He had powerful

608
00:36:16,880 --> 00:36:21,400
Speaker 1: life hacks at his disposal, dangerous life hacks. Um. He

609
00:36:21,440 --> 00:36:23,319
Speaker 1: went away, but those life hacks are still out there,

610
00:36:23,360 --> 00:36:26,960
Speaker 1: if only we can we can claim him? Right? Yeah, yeah, exactly,

611
00:36:26,960 --> 00:36:29,359
Speaker 1: And that's it is that the idea is that they're

612
00:36:29,400 --> 00:36:33,279
Speaker 1: out there somewhere, uh, and not everybody has access to them,

613
00:36:33,320 --> 00:36:36,200
Speaker 1: but if you can find them, then you will also

614
00:36:36,280 --> 00:36:38,480
Speaker 1: have the power that he had, and maybe this time

615
00:36:38,600 --> 00:36:42,040
Speaker 1: you will be the human being who who doesn't fall

616
00:36:42,080 --> 00:36:45,480
Speaker 1: prey to his own ego. Perhaps, um, but yeah. There

617
00:36:45,480 --> 00:36:47,920
Speaker 1: are other books that were supposedly written by Solomon. So

618
00:36:47,960 --> 00:36:50,680
Speaker 1: there's one called the Rs Notorio, which is is pretty

619
00:36:50,680 --> 00:36:54,480
Speaker 1: famous that translates into the Notary Arts, which doesn't exactly

620
00:36:54,560 --> 00:36:58,400
Speaker 1: sound super a cult or or brutal to me nowadays,

621
00:36:58,640 --> 00:37:01,960
Speaker 1: but but I suspect that notarization carried a lot more

622
00:37:02,000 --> 00:37:04,239
Speaker 1: weight to it back then. Some of the titles of

623
00:37:04,280 --> 00:37:06,640
Speaker 1: these books at times kind of sound like the fake

624
00:37:06,719 --> 00:37:10,640
Speaker 1: names they send off out with the reels for for films. Yeah,

625
00:37:11,040 --> 00:37:13,920
Speaker 1: kind of blue harvest type stuff. Because there was one

626
00:37:13,960 --> 00:37:16,239
Speaker 1: that I was reading called the Sacred Book of the

627
00:37:16,280 --> 00:37:20,839
Speaker 1: Cow I believe, and it included some some very very

628
00:37:20,880 --> 00:37:24,560
Speaker 1: fascinating instructions on how to create a homunculous and then

629
00:37:24,600 --> 00:37:26,239
Speaker 1: of course the things you can do with the homunculus

630
00:37:26,320 --> 00:37:31,120
Speaker 1: once you've created it, to do things like walk on water, etcetera.

631
00:37:31,480 --> 00:37:33,680
Speaker 1: But yeah, that the title Sacred Book of the Cow.

632
00:37:34,160 --> 00:37:36,160
Speaker 1: It is kind of like the notary. It's kind of

633
00:37:36,200 --> 00:37:39,839
Speaker 1: burying the lead. Yeah, it should be called like homunculous

634
00:37:39,840 --> 00:37:43,120
Speaker 1: one on one exactly. Or you know, when you're talking

635
00:37:43,160 --> 00:37:45,759
Speaker 1: about a lesser Key of Solomon, like that sounds great,

636
00:37:46,160 --> 00:37:49,200
Speaker 1: that sounds like secret knowledge, the key to knowledge. Yea.

637
00:37:49,280 --> 00:37:52,000
Speaker 1: And in fact, the Lesser Key of Solomon is actually

638
00:37:52,000 --> 00:37:54,080
Speaker 1: like I guess you could call it a sequel because

639
00:37:54,120 --> 00:37:56,200
Speaker 1: there was the Key of Solomon as well, which is

640
00:37:56,239 --> 00:37:59,720
Speaker 1: also known as the Clavical of Solomon in some cases,

641
00:38:00,520 --> 00:38:03,120
Speaker 1: which I think is kind of interesting. But you know, ultimately,

642
00:38:03,160 --> 00:38:07,080
Speaker 1: it's about conjuring and performing rituals that will provoke people

643
00:38:07,120 --> 00:38:10,960
Speaker 1: to love you, or punish your enemies, or make you invisible.

644
00:38:11,160 --> 00:38:12,840
Speaker 1: So it's kind of all the things that you know

645
00:38:12,880 --> 00:38:15,960
Speaker 1: you could wish for if you're like a fourteen year

646
00:38:15,960 --> 00:38:19,680
Speaker 1: old boy. Yeah, I'm imagining Solomon like an infomercial late

647
00:38:19,680 --> 00:38:22,239
Speaker 1: at night. So would you like to meet women? Would

648
00:38:22,280 --> 00:38:24,120
Speaker 1: you would you like to be better at your at

649
00:38:24,120 --> 00:38:27,120
Speaker 1: your job? It's ultimately what these kind of these these

650
00:38:27,160 --> 00:38:29,880
Speaker 1: grimmars sort of work. Yeah, I think the like comparison

651
00:38:29,880 --> 00:38:34,520
Speaker 1: to self health books is somewhat interesting. But uh, the

652
00:38:34,560 --> 00:38:36,960
Speaker 1: idea that someone has this knowledge of how to live

653
00:38:37,000 --> 00:38:39,200
Speaker 1: a better life than the one I'm living right now,

654
00:38:39,800 --> 00:38:43,920
Speaker 1: and I'll I I will pay them tie to have

655
00:38:44,000 --> 00:38:46,799
Speaker 1: access to even a sliver of that knowledge. Yeah, and

656
00:38:46,800 --> 00:38:48,759
Speaker 1: then of course to to partake in a ritual, and

657
00:38:48,960 --> 00:38:51,080
Speaker 1: I mean any kind of ritual, like so you know

658
00:38:51,120 --> 00:38:52,839
Speaker 1: so much of the power and it is that you're

659
00:38:52,920 --> 00:38:54,600
Speaker 1: kind of you're giving up your own will for a

660
00:38:54,680 --> 00:38:58,560
Speaker 1: little bit to follow these particular instructions to become one

661
00:38:58,600 --> 00:39:02,120
Speaker 1: with this particular right and uh, and you Inrod something

662
00:39:02,200 --> 00:39:06,640
Speaker 1: just very attractive in and of itself there. Yeah. And

663
00:39:06,680 --> 00:39:10,080
Speaker 1: so of course we see these connections between Solomon and

664
00:39:10,200 --> 00:39:16,200
Speaker 1: Moses and Ham and these other religious figures, especially from Christianity,

665
00:39:16,239 --> 00:39:19,880
Speaker 1: in this sort of history of where they came from,

666
00:39:19,920 --> 00:39:22,839
Speaker 1: this mythology, I guess you could call it. But then

667
00:39:22,920 --> 00:39:27,600
Speaker 1: they're actually started to be a real history between Christianity

668
00:39:27,719 --> 00:39:31,799
Speaker 1: and these books in between these magical traditions that conflated

669
00:39:32,760 --> 00:39:34,959
Speaker 1: how how we understood them, and of course we talked

670
00:39:34,960 --> 00:39:39,600
Speaker 1: about ultimately destroyed many of these books. But what's fascinating

671
00:39:39,640 --> 00:39:42,600
Speaker 1: to me is that there was basically this battle for

672
00:39:42,719 --> 00:39:46,800
Speaker 1: influence of culture, for sort of understanding of the world

673
00:39:46,880 --> 00:39:50,839
Speaker 1: between these books and these traditions and early Christianity. Yeah,

674
00:39:50,840 --> 00:39:54,400
Speaker 1: and then plus you throw in influences from from Arabic

675
00:39:54,440 --> 00:39:57,319
Speaker 1: texts that are going in. Always reminds me of the

676
00:39:57,400 --> 00:40:00,680
Speaker 1: Umberto Eco line about the books speak with other books

677
00:40:00,719 --> 00:40:03,439
Speaker 1: and having conversations with each other across the ages. Yeah,

678
00:40:03,520 --> 00:40:06,880
Speaker 1: this is absolutely in a Umberto Echoes wheelhouse. I think

679
00:40:06,920 --> 00:40:10,080
Speaker 1: if you if you've ever read the novel fucos Pendulum,

680
00:40:10,239 --> 00:40:14,320
Speaker 1: it's it deals highly with the idea of these magical

681
00:40:14,440 --> 00:40:17,279
Speaker 1: ideas traced back to through libraries of the ages and

682
00:40:17,480 --> 00:40:22,040
Speaker 1: archives and secret knowledge cults all that kind of stuff. Yeah.

683
00:40:22,840 --> 00:40:27,040
Speaker 1: Uh so there's this I uh you know, it's actually

684
00:40:27,160 --> 00:40:30,160
Speaker 1: mentioned in the Bible about this this this sort of

685
00:40:30,200 --> 00:40:34,520
Speaker 1: battle going on between Christianity and and Grimoires. Uh So

686
00:40:34,680 --> 00:40:37,880
Speaker 1: it refers to it in Acts nineteen saying that they

687
00:40:37,920 --> 00:40:41,040
Speaker 1: were burning these kinds of books, and it actually gives

688
00:40:41,280 --> 00:40:45,200
Speaker 1: monetary value to these things, saying that they paid fifty

689
00:40:45,280 --> 00:40:48,400
Speaker 1: thousand silver for those that were burnt in the I

690
00:40:48,480 --> 00:40:51,480
Speaker 1: believe as the city of epsiasts Um. And so to

691
00:40:51,600 --> 00:40:55,839
Speaker 1: give you sort of a comparison. At the time, one

692
00:40:56,040 --> 00:40:59,239
Speaker 1: silver was the equivalent of a day's wage, so we're

693
00:40:59,239 --> 00:41:02,279
Speaker 1: talking about fifty thousand days worth of wages in these books.

694
00:41:02,320 --> 00:41:04,839
Speaker 1: These books had value to them even though they were

695
00:41:04,880 --> 00:41:10,279
Speaker 1: also reviled in some cases. And the Leach books are

696
00:41:10,320 --> 00:41:13,799
Speaker 1: the ones that I'm really fascinated with. Two is because

697
00:41:14,120 --> 00:41:18,880
Speaker 1: not only was Christianity at war with magical books and

698
00:41:19,440 --> 00:41:23,560
Speaker 1: and and literature and texts, but they were also using them.

699
00:41:24,200 --> 00:41:26,480
Speaker 1: Um that the clergy at the time had access to

700
00:41:26,560 --> 00:41:28,879
Speaker 1: these books. I think we now call them Leech books,

701
00:41:28,920 --> 00:41:32,920
Speaker 1: but they're basically like medical manuals, and they had it

702
00:41:33,000 --> 00:41:35,560
Speaker 1: was some of that natural magic we were talking about before,

703
00:41:35,600 --> 00:41:39,600
Speaker 1: so they were like ideas of of of herbalism in there.

704
00:41:39,760 --> 00:41:43,640
Speaker 1: But there was also spells for healing and protection. Again,

705
00:41:43,920 --> 00:41:46,040
Speaker 1: so for the D and D comparison, these would be

706
00:41:46,120 --> 00:41:49,360
Speaker 1: like the clerics, uh and and and there were actual

707
00:41:49,840 --> 00:41:52,399
Speaker 1: rights of exorcism within there as well too, so how

708
00:41:52,480 --> 00:41:54,680
Speaker 1: to banish a demon? Well. Of course you see this

709
00:41:54,800 --> 00:41:57,520
Speaker 1: throughout the history of Christianity, right as it spreads into

710
00:41:57,600 --> 00:42:00,440
Speaker 1: a new area and new people and a new culture. Um,

711
00:42:00,800 --> 00:42:05,040
Speaker 1: it's it's fighting against existing traditions but also absorbing existing

712
00:42:05,120 --> 00:42:09,000
Speaker 1: traditions and with with a hybrid to some degree. Yeah, exactly,

713
00:42:09,120 --> 00:42:11,600
Speaker 1: a lot of And that's a really interesting point too,

714
00:42:11,760 --> 00:42:17,200
Speaker 1: is that that's sort of like, um, mysticism of Christianity

715
00:42:18,000 --> 00:42:22,359
Speaker 1: is from incorporating other cultures as it spread around the world. Um.

716
00:42:22,520 --> 00:42:25,120
Speaker 1: But yeah, so there's that, there's that aspect. But then

717
00:42:25,360 --> 00:42:28,360
Speaker 1: this is really interesting to me that that, uh, some

718
00:42:28,520 --> 00:42:32,120
Speaker 1: people at the time started turning the the sort of

719
00:42:34,200 --> 00:42:38,400
Speaker 1: negative influence of grimoires back at Christianity. So there is

720
00:42:38,480 --> 00:42:41,840
Speaker 1: this point in time where there there were rumors that

721
00:42:42,000 --> 00:42:46,680
Speaker 1: popes and saints were actually behind closed doors delving into

722
00:42:46,719 --> 00:42:49,480
Speaker 1: these magical arts. And there's actually a book that's called

723
00:42:49,600 --> 00:42:55,360
Speaker 1: The Grimoire of Pope on Arius, which was largely basically

724
00:42:55,480 --> 00:43:00,239
Speaker 1: a smear campaign against this pope, persecuting him as being

725
00:43:00,280 --> 00:43:04,000
Speaker 1: a magician. Uh. And the idea was that maybe that

726
00:43:04,120 --> 00:43:07,000
Speaker 1: the papacy, because they protected the Knights Templar and the

727
00:43:07,080 --> 00:43:10,800
Speaker 1: Knights Templar, were associated with sorcery, or that there was

728
00:43:10,840 --> 00:43:14,680
Speaker 1: this idea that popes were actually summoning and controlling demons themselves.

729
00:43:15,200 --> 00:43:19,040
Speaker 1: But ultimately it all came out of this propaganda campaign

730
00:43:19,239 --> 00:43:22,840
Speaker 1: by Protestant reformers against the Catholic Church. It's kind of

731
00:43:22,880 --> 00:43:26,960
Speaker 1: fascinating that they sort of their pr campaign was to

732
00:43:27,160 --> 00:43:30,680
Speaker 1: incorporate hate a cult text into it and say, oh, well,

733
00:43:30,760 --> 00:43:33,560
Speaker 1: you think these books are bad, the Pope is actually

734
00:43:33,680 --> 00:43:35,920
Speaker 1: responsible for them, and he's written his own book on

735
00:43:36,000 --> 00:43:39,000
Speaker 1: how to summon demons. Yeah. I mean, you would see

736
00:43:39,040 --> 00:43:42,399
Speaker 1: anti Catholic propaganda. And the weird thing is you can

737
00:43:42,520 --> 00:43:44,000
Speaker 1: if you look in the right places, you can still

738
00:43:44,080 --> 00:43:47,600
Speaker 1: see this kind of like anti Catholic propaganda from other

739
00:43:47,800 --> 00:43:52,600
Speaker 1: Christian sex today where they essentially label Catholicism as some

740
00:43:52,760 --> 00:43:57,520
Speaker 1: sort of form of sorcery, especially in UH. I would say,

741
00:43:57,719 --> 00:44:02,719
Speaker 1: you know, there's there's a tradition of American uh distrust

742
00:44:02,880 --> 00:44:06,600
Speaker 1: of Catholicism, especially in politics. But that's probably going down

743
00:44:06,640 --> 00:44:10,480
Speaker 1: a different road. But yeah, So the monks and clergy

744
00:44:10,560 --> 00:44:13,759
Speaker 1: themselves were accused of you know, using these books and

745
00:44:13,880 --> 00:44:17,040
Speaker 1: writing these books and transcribing them, largely because you know,

746
00:44:17,160 --> 00:44:19,040
Speaker 1: like we were talking about earlier, they were the people

747
00:44:19,080 --> 00:44:21,560
Speaker 1: who could read and write uh and so of course

748
00:44:21,680 --> 00:44:23,440
Speaker 1: they would be the only other people who would have

749
00:44:23,600 --> 00:44:26,759
Speaker 1: access to these books. Uh. And and in fact, there

750
00:44:26,880 --> 00:44:29,480
Speaker 1: is historical evidence that they did have have some of

751
00:44:29,560 --> 00:44:32,080
Speaker 1: these books in their collections. Uh. There's a guy named

752
00:44:32,120 --> 00:44:35,400
Speaker 1: Friar John erg Holme, and he was found to have

753
00:44:35,480 --> 00:44:38,960
Speaker 1: three hundred occult volumes in his library. Uh. And there

754
00:44:39,080 --> 00:44:46,239
Speaker 1: was also uh infamous, not infamous, famous Franciscan Friar Roger Bacon. Uh.

755
00:44:46,400 --> 00:44:50,040
Speaker 1: And he actually at the time was a very critical

756
00:44:50,600 --> 00:44:53,920
Speaker 1: of the way that these books were sort of mythologized because, uh,

757
00:44:54,200 --> 00:44:56,800
Speaker 1: their writers were claiming that they were written by Solomon

758
00:44:56,960 --> 00:44:59,320
Speaker 1: or Moses or somebody else, so they could you know,

759
00:44:59,480 --> 00:45:05,919
Speaker 1: apply kind of magical significance to them. Uh. And what's

760
00:45:05,920 --> 00:45:08,520
Speaker 1: funny is, three hundred years after his death, people started

761
00:45:08,680 --> 00:45:11,600
Speaker 1: writing books of necromancy and claiming that they were secret

762
00:45:11,640 --> 00:45:14,200
Speaker 1: books that he had written. Uh. And so he gets

763
00:45:14,280 --> 00:45:16,280
Speaker 1: pulled into this whole thing, even though he was totally

764
00:45:16,320 --> 00:45:20,520
Speaker 1: against the idea of this mislabeling of the author within

765
00:45:20,600 --> 00:45:24,080
Speaker 1: these magical texts. Yeah, it's interesting to see the just

766
00:45:24,239 --> 00:45:26,719
Speaker 1: just hoew these books sort of cascade through time, but

767
00:45:26,800 --> 00:45:29,680
Speaker 1: of course various texts informing each other and then uh

768
00:45:29,960 --> 00:45:32,719
Speaker 1: and then the the the various attributed authors popping up

769
00:45:32,719 --> 00:45:36,640
Speaker 1: again and again almost like some sort of almost like

770
00:45:36,680 --> 00:45:40,480
Speaker 1: the like fan fiction following through the ages, spilling off

771
00:45:40,600 --> 00:45:46,719
Speaker 1: of organized religion and an older ritual magic. Yeah, exactly.

772
00:45:46,800 --> 00:45:49,360
Speaker 1: It would be like that the characters from the Bible

773
00:45:49,400 --> 00:45:52,480
Speaker 1: were like the Avengers of the time, and people were

774
00:45:52,560 --> 00:45:55,400
Speaker 1: writing their fan fiction about what kind of things they

775
00:45:55,480 --> 00:45:59,879
Speaker 1: got up to between the lines of the book. Yeah. Um. Unfortunately, though,

776
00:46:00,160 --> 00:46:02,800
Speaker 1: in a lot of cases, women were not allowed to

777
00:46:02,880 --> 00:46:07,440
Speaker 1: be uh you know, responsible for these texts or or

778
00:46:07,560 --> 00:46:10,279
Speaker 1: to even interact with them in any way. Uh. And

779
00:46:10,360 --> 00:46:13,760
Speaker 1: it's interesting, before the sixteenth century, they were very rarely

780
00:46:13,880 --> 00:46:16,360
Speaker 1: accused of even being involved with them at all, of

781
00:46:16,600 --> 00:46:19,280
Speaker 1: using them or writing them, any of these kinds of things.

782
00:46:19,960 --> 00:46:23,960
Speaker 1: Basically because this kind of magic was associated with masculinity,

783
00:46:24,360 --> 00:46:27,799
Speaker 1: and the idea was most of the men that were

784
00:46:27,880 --> 00:46:30,399
Speaker 1: using these books, we're doing it so that they could

785
00:46:30,400 --> 00:46:33,200
Speaker 1: figure out how to entice women or again, like turn invisible.

786
00:46:33,280 --> 00:46:36,719
Speaker 1: I'm just imagining those medieval version of porkies where they're

787
00:46:36,760 --> 00:46:39,600
Speaker 1: like turning invisible and trying to sneak into a locker

788
00:46:39,680 --> 00:46:43,000
Speaker 1: room or something like that. But but yeah, essentially, the

789
00:46:43,200 --> 00:46:46,719
Speaker 1: advice within these books was not only do these um,

790
00:46:48,680 --> 00:46:51,879
Speaker 1: are these the purview of men, but do not associate

791
00:46:52,040 --> 00:46:55,000
Speaker 1: with women when you're conducting these kinds of rituals because

792
00:46:55,000 --> 00:46:57,600
Speaker 1: perhaps something could go wrong there. Yeah, I mean you

793
00:46:57,640 --> 00:47:03,000
Speaker 1: see the division between sorcery and witchcraft, where, uh, with sorcery,

794
00:47:03,080 --> 00:47:06,320
Speaker 1: you're talking about learned men using these ancient texts to

795
00:47:07,400 --> 00:47:12,359
Speaker 1: communicate with demons, to bind generally masculine demons to their will.

796
00:47:13,000 --> 00:47:16,279
Speaker 1: Um and from a very sexy standpoint, that you would

797
00:47:16,280 --> 00:47:18,640
Speaker 1: not attribute that to women in the age, the idea

798
00:47:18,719 --> 00:47:22,280
Speaker 1: that this woman is going to uh enslave a male demon,

799
00:47:23,280 --> 00:47:27,359
Speaker 1: you know, or would have the knowledge to read one

800
00:47:27,400 --> 00:47:29,960
Speaker 1: of these texts. Yeah, witchcraft was sort of more about

801
00:47:30,120 --> 00:47:35,640
Speaker 1: the demons were seducing the women, the email emotions and yeah,

802
00:47:35,960 --> 00:47:40,160
Speaker 1: falling under the power of these demons. Yeah it. Well,

803
00:47:40,719 --> 00:47:44,480
Speaker 1: this is another fascinating statistic from the Davis book. He says,

804
00:47:45,239 --> 00:47:49,920
Speaker 1: before fifty over seventy of those people that were accused

805
00:47:49,920 --> 00:47:53,440
Speaker 1: of using magic and courts were men. But by the

806
00:47:53,520 --> 00:47:57,440
Speaker 1: time of the fifteenth century, so we're getting into witchcraft persecution,

807
00:47:57,520 --> 00:48:00,800
Speaker 1: then sixty to seventy percent of them were email and

808
00:48:00,880 --> 00:48:04,960
Speaker 1: that women had largely supplanted the sort of grimoire cultural

809
00:48:05,040 --> 00:48:08,719
Speaker 1: community from being male magic because of this, So the

810
00:48:08,800 --> 00:48:12,719
Speaker 1: inquisition ultimately kind of flips flips the gender roles there,

811
00:48:13,320 --> 00:48:16,239
Speaker 1: and of course throughout the Witchcraft persecution era you have

812
00:48:16,400 --> 00:48:20,239
Speaker 1: witchcraft theorists who are fighting the good fight, if you will,

813
00:48:20,400 --> 00:48:23,520
Speaker 1: against the witches. But in doing so, they are creating

814
00:48:23,560 --> 00:48:27,240
Speaker 1: their own grimoires. They're creating their own manuals of what's

815
00:48:27,280 --> 00:48:30,879
Speaker 1: going on, uh in the world of demonology, and all

816
00:48:30,880 --> 00:48:33,640
Speaker 1: of it's coming out of the testimony from from these

817
00:48:33,880 --> 00:48:36,360
Speaker 1: for these women and men and in some cases children

818
00:48:36,440 --> 00:48:40,359
Speaker 1: obtained via torture and the inner recesses of their own

819
00:48:40,400 --> 00:48:44,200
Speaker 1: mind and their own expectations. Yeah, and and and ultimately, uh,

820
00:48:45,160 --> 00:48:46,960
Speaker 1: it's all they're all kind of getting at the same

821
00:48:47,080 --> 00:48:49,799
Speaker 1: thing that within And this is where we've come full

822
00:48:49,800 --> 00:48:51,440
Speaker 1: circle here from what we were talking about the beginning,

823
00:48:51,560 --> 00:48:54,839
Speaker 1: is that within the written word, whether it be these

824
00:48:54,840 --> 00:48:59,040
Speaker 1: grimoires or the Bible or the manuals for was the

825
00:48:59,400 --> 00:49:02,960
Speaker 1: malifest Alphacarum, Yeah, the Hammer of the Witches. Yeah, books

826
00:49:03,000 --> 00:49:05,440
Speaker 1: on how to deal with witches and how to torture

827
00:49:05,480 --> 00:49:10,640
Speaker 1: and get witches to confess. These written words were they're

828
00:49:10,680 --> 00:49:13,239
Speaker 1: sort of understanding of the world. It was a way

829
00:49:13,400 --> 00:49:19,000
Speaker 1: for human beings to sort of limit the chaotic occurrences

830
00:49:19,080 --> 00:49:21,040
Speaker 1: around them so that they could, you know, kind of

831
00:49:21,560 --> 00:49:24,840
Speaker 1: kind of put a box around it and make some

832
00:49:24,960 --> 00:49:30,960
Speaker 1: sense of it. And that sense wasn't always uh necessarily positive,

833
00:49:31,400 --> 00:49:35,600
Speaker 1: had a lot of dangerous and and uh unfortunate effects,

834
00:49:35,640 --> 00:49:37,799
Speaker 1: I think. All right, So, so here's the questions we've

835
00:49:37,840 --> 00:49:42,480
Speaker 1: been talking about. In many cases, these uh, these painstakingly prepared,

836
00:49:42,960 --> 00:49:47,600
Speaker 1: handwritten tons of arcane knowledge, um. And then these have

837
00:49:47,719 --> 00:49:51,480
Speaker 1: traveled through the ages. They've been they've been translated, they've

838
00:49:51,560 --> 00:49:56,000
Speaker 1: been transcribed into new volume, they've been burned out of existence,

839
00:49:56,080 --> 00:49:58,440
Speaker 1: and they've been secreted away. But then you enter the

840
00:49:58,480 --> 00:50:02,080
Speaker 1: age of the printing press. And to what extent does

841
00:50:02,200 --> 00:50:07,040
Speaker 1: that destroy the mystique and the power of the grimoire? Yeah,

842
00:50:07,120 --> 00:50:10,600
Speaker 1: I mean, I think from from Davies book, uh, my

843
00:50:10,760 --> 00:50:14,160
Speaker 1: understanding is that it didn't destroy it, that it's still

844
00:50:14,239 --> 00:50:17,360
Speaker 1: continued on any and we even we still have versions

845
00:50:17,400 --> 00:50:20,320
Speaker 1: of these books today and they're largely popularized by different

846
00:50:20,400 --> 00:50:23,640
Speaker 1: movements at the beginning of the of the twenty century.

847
00:50:24,040 --> 00:50:28,120
Speaker 1: But um, but there was a certain kind of aura

848
00:50:28,600 --> 00:50:32,200
Speaker 1: to these books when they were handwritten and made uh

849
00:50:32,840 --> 00:50:36,799
Speaker 1: made of certain kinds of materials rather than mass produced. Um.

850
00:50:37,080 --> 00:50:42,040
Speaker 1: That is somewhat lost when they're mass produced. But there's

851
00:50:42,080 --> 00:50:48,360
Speaker 1: still something alien, something kind of uh foreign about not

852
00:50:48,600 --> 00:50:51,440
Speaker 1: understanding the thing considered within them, whether it's because you

853
00:50:51,520 --> 00:50:56,120
Speaker 1: don't read Latin, or you don't know what particular Nordic

854
00:50:56,280 --> 00:51:03,400
Speaker 1: runs mean or Jewish Hebrew letter forms mean. Uh, there's

855
00:51:04,080 --> 00:51:07,439
Speaker 1: there's something about it that not just every person, even

856
00:51:07,520 --> 00:51:12,560
Speaker 1: those who are literate, can necessarily translate and understand fully. Right.

857
00:51:12,640 --> 00:51:15,480
Speaker 1: So it's it's it comes back to this idea of

858
00:51:15,560 --> 00:51:18,480
Speaker 1: this hidden expertise and hidden knowledge that you have to have. Yeah,

859
00:51:18,480 --> 00:51:20,759
Speaker 1: because even if it's mass produced, it's still a mass

860
00:51:20,800 --> 00:51:23,080
Speaker 1: produced riddle, it's still a mass produced puzzle. It's still

861
00:51:23,120 --> 00:51:26,520
Speaker 1: a mass produced um item that requires a certain degree

862
00:51:26,680 --> 00:51:31,040
Speaker 1: of of expertise and in tink running to master exactly. Yeah,

863
00:51:31,200 --> 00:51:33,680
Speaker 1: you can't just open the pages and have the secrets

864
00:51:33,719 --> 00:51:36,720
Speaker 1: of the universe unveiled to You have to go into

865
00:51:36,800 --> 00:51:38,759
Speaker 1: it with and this is another like kind of very

866
00:51:39,280 --> 00:51:41,920
Speaker 1: male dominant idea from the time, but you have to

867
00:51:41,960 --> 00:51:46,960
Speaker 1: go into it with the knowledge and the maturity to

868
00:51:47,040 --> 00:51:49,800
Speaker 1: be able to control those forces, you know. And of

869
00:51:49,880 --> 00:51:52,120
Speaker 1: course that leads into our modern era of v readers.

870
00:51:52,560 --> 00:51:56,640
Speaker 1: To what degree these texts still maintain their mystique? Uh?

871
00:51:56,760 --> 00:51:59,120
Speaker 1: In an age when you can pull up you know,

872
00:51:59,760 --> 00:52:02,840
Speaker 1: does and some dozens of them on your handheld device

873
00:52:02,920 --> 00:52:05,319
Speaker 1: around the computer screen. Yeah, it's especially interesting. We were

874
00:52:05,360 --> 00:52:07,120
Speaker 1: talking about this. The quote that I read at the

875
00:52:07,160 --> 00:52:12,200
Speaker 1: top was actually um obtained from a site called Esoterica Archives,

876
00:52:12,280 --> 00:52:15,279
Speaker 1: where many of these have been translated into English and

877
00:52:15,360 --> 00:52:20,320
Speaker 1: then transcribed into ht email, including scanned images of some

878
00:52:20,440 --> 00:52:23,919
Speaker 1: of the sigils that are within them. UM. And it's

879
00:52:23,920 --> 00:52:26,719
Speaker 1: obviously a very different experience when you're reading it off

880
00:52:26,800 --> 00:52:30,879
Speaker 1: of Google Chrome rather than opening up a book made

881
00:52:30,920 --> 00:52:35,080
Speaker 1: of human flesh. But I find that there is still

882
00:52:35,200 --> 00:52:38,959
Speaker 1: something a little hair raising about reading through it. Maybe

883
00:52:39,040 --> 00:52:44,200
Speaker 1: it's the grammar, going back to the original you know,

884
00:52:44,360 --> 00:52:48,439
Speaker 1: idea of where this this word grimoire came from. There's

885
00:52:48,520 --> 00:52:50,920
Speaker 1: something about the way that the words are laid out

886
00:52:51,400 --> 00:52:56,440
Speaker 1: and the symbols are sort of unknown, and you know,

887
00:52:56,560 --> 00:52:59,840
Speaker 1: why did they choose those particular lines and and curb

888
00:53:00,640 --> 00:53:04,160
Speaker 1: for being able to summon the demon again, you know,

889
00:53:05,400 --> 00:53:11,000
Speaker 1: rather than you know, another symbol um. Yeah, it's just interesting.

890
00:53:11,200 --> 00:53:12,920
Speaker 1: I mean it leads right back again into just the

891
00:53:13,200 --> 00:53:16,520
Speaker 1: power of written language, the idea you it allows us

892
00:53:16,800 --> 00:53:21,799
Speaker 1: to submit these ephemeral notions to to to to take

893
00:53:22,520 --> 00:53:25,440
Speaker 1: to take this these thoughts and these these rituals that

894
00:53:25,560 --> 00:53:28,920
Speaker 1: someone can sive in you know, centuries even millennia, go

895
00:53:29,560 --> 00:53:34,279
Speaker 1: and uh programming them into your own mind. It's a yeah,

896
00:53:34,320 --> 00:53:36,359
Speaker 1: it's yeah. I would I would agree that they still

897
00:53:36,560 --> 00:53:39,120
Speaker 1: they still hold a certain amount of power, um, if

898
00:53:39,200 --> 00:53:41,560
Speaker 1: you are in the mind to engage with them. Yeah.

899
00:53:41,840 --> 00:53:45,440
Speaker 1: So they have historical influence and they're still around today,

900
00:53:45,640 --> 00:53:49,440
Speaker 1: and they're they're They're definitely fascinating to look through. I

901
00:53:49,520 --> 00:53:53,600
Speaker 1: don't know that I necessarily would use them to conjure

902
00:53:53,640 --> 00:53:58,120
Speaker 1: a demon or try to turn invisible anytime soon, but

903
00:53:58,560 --> 00:54:01,600
Speaker 1: it's fascinating to look at the history of them in

904
00:54:01,760 --> 00:54:08,480
Speaker 1: conjunction with religious and historical movements and uh rise and

905
00:54:08,600 --> 00:54:13,000
Speaker 1: fall of of society is basically especially in Western Europe. Yeah,

906
00:54:13,200 --> 00:54:14,839
Speaker 1: and if I were to use one today, I would

907
00:54:14,840 --> 00:54:17,080
Speaker 1: hope that there would be sort of a turbo tax

908
00:54:18,360 --> 00:54:20,880
Speaker 1: in the same way that the Turbo tax or or

909
00:54:21,040 --> 00:54:24,239
Speaker 1: various other tax programs are kind of like a user

910
00:54:24,280 --> 00:54:27,479
Speaker 1: interface for a more complex tax code. Yeah, I would

911
00:54:27,520 --> 00:54:31,359
Speaker 1: want a nice user interface for a more complex That's

912
00:54:31,480 --> 00:54:34,480
Speaker 1: exactly what what we need is. Somebody needs to come

913
00:54:34,480 --> 00:54:38,200
Speaker 1: out with an appy, just like what kind of demon

914
00:54:38,239 --> 00:54:41,080
Speaker 1: do you want today? Okay, I'll go for the sex, yeah, exactly.

915
00:54:41,160 --> 00:54:43,279
Speaker 1: And then what attributes am I looking for? I don't

916
00:54:43,320 --> 00:54:46,200
Speaker 1: click these off? And done? And then it's just like okay,

917
00:54:46,280 --> 00:54:50,680
Speaker 1: go get your wormwood and mirror and and you're done,

918
00:54:51,040 --> 00:54:54,400
Speaker 1: built in t timer and you're gonna go alright. So

919
00:54:54,480 --> 00:54:57,040
Speaker 1: there you have it, uh, a little a little dive

920
00:54:57,120 --> 00:55:00,919
Speaker 1: into the world of grim Wars, their histor three, their

921
00:55:01,120 --> 00:55:03,719
Speaker 1: their interface with our modern world or modern lives are

922
00:55:03,840 --> 00:55:07,719
Speaker 1: modern fiction. Um. If you would like to learn more

923
00:55:07,719 --> 00:55:09,799
Speaker 1: about this topic, be sure to check out the landing

924
00:55:09,840 --> 00:55:12,560
Speaker 1: page for this episode at stuff to Blow your Mind

925
00:55:12,600 --> 00:55:15,279
Speaker 1: dot com. I'll include a links to related content as

926
00:55:15,320 --> 00:55:18,920
Speaker 1: well links out to materials that we've discussed here. You

927
00:55:18,920 --> 00:55:21,400
Speaker 1: would like to send us an email, you can email

928
00:55:21,719 --> 00:55:23,480
Speaker 1: us at stuff to Blow your Mind at how Stuff

929
00:55:23,480 --> 00:55:25,799
Speaker 1: Works dot com and Christian if they want to reach

930
00:55:25,840 --> 00:55:28,000
Speaker 1: out to you in particular, what the email address can

931
00:55:28,040 --> 00:55:31,719
Speaker 1: they reach you at? You can find me online, uh,

932
00:55:31,960 --> 00:55:35,399
Speaker 1: in my personal capacity at Christian Sager dot tumbler dot com.

933
00:55:35,560 --> 00:55:38,759
Speaker 1: That's where my personal works. Whether I'm writing about comic

934
00:55:38,840 --> 00:55:42,799
Speaker 1: books or grimoires and a cult texts, you can find

935
00:55:42,880 --> 00:55:47,160
Speaker 1: that stuff and largely, I will be found on the

936
00:55:47,280 --> 00:55:51,760
Speaker 1: brain stuff channel here at how stuff Works are general

937
00:55:52,000 --> 00:55:54,799
Speaker 1: science YouTube show. So yeah, we'll catch you next time.

938
00:55:54,800 --> 00:55:56,440
Speaker 1: In the meantime, check us out at stuff to Blow

939
00:55:56,440 --> 00:55:59,000
Speaker 1: your Mind dot com and brain stuff Show dot com.

940
00:56:02,800 --> 00:56:05,319
Speaker 1: For more on thiss in thousands of other topics, visit

941
00:56:05,400 --> 00:56:06,520
Speaker 1: how staff works dot com.