WEBVTT - Rebecca (Part 2) 0:00:04.880 --> 0:00:07.120 Have you ever had a partner who just could not 0:00:07.280 --> 0:00:10.000 let go of their X? I'm willing to bet Daphne 0:00:10.119 --> 0:00:14.040 du Maurier did. This is Popcorn Book Club. I'm Danis Schwartz, 0:00:14.120 --> 0:00:17.639 joined as always by Jennifer Wright, Kamadunqua, Tan Tran, and 0:00:17.720 --> 0:00:21.960 Melissa Hunter, and we're continuing our conversation about the novel. 0:00:22.400 --> 0:00:26.079 Rebecca is a very sociopath thing to do. I'm just saying, 0:00:26.600 --> 0:00:29.040 it's like, I'm so happy that my husband's going to 0:00:29.160 --> 0:00:31.040 murder me and then his life will be ruined. She 0:00:31.120 --> 0:00:33.120 knew how to arrange a party, she knew how to 0:00:33.159 --> 0:00:36.519 arrange a floral arrangement, she knew how to orchestrate a murder. 0:00:38.560 --> 0:00:40.840 I'm realizing now we didn't even talk about the plot, 0:00:40.920 --> 0:00:43.919 but there really is very little plot in one sentence. 0:00:44.760 --> 0:00:47.920 In one sentence, Uh, the second Mrs de Winter, who's 0:00:47.960 --> 0:00:51.320 the narrator we never know, start as a paid companion 0:00:51.360 --> 0:00:54.280 to an awful American in Monte Carlo. She meets this 0:00:54.520 --> 0:00:59.680 was paid by and doubt I can't wait. That really 0:00:59.760 --> 0:01:03.560 so fun. She meets uh, a handsome widower named Max 0:01:03.600 --> 0:01:06.480 to Winter, whose first wife died in a mysterious accident 0:01:06.840 --> 0:01:09.199 that no one wants to talk about. She goes back 0:01:09.200 --> 0:01:13.480 to Manderley, his ancestral home, finds it haunted by the 0:01:13.520 --> 0:01:16.920 everyone's memory of how fabulous Rebecca was. And then, as 0:01:16.959 --> 0:01:22.640 we mentioned, we find out that she was I don't 0:01:22.640 --> 0:01:25.560 want to say sociopath, but had tendencies that the lay 0:01:25.560 --> 0:01:29.080 person might call a sociopath. Uh. She and Maxim never 0:01:29.160 --> 0:01:34.440 were in love. She was a wild philanderer and had 0:01:34.480 --> 0:01:37.760 many lovers, and Mrs Danvers was loyal to her the 0:01:37.920 --> 0:01:41.679 entire time. And Max murdered her because she said she 0:01:41.800 --> 0:01:46.520 was pregnant with uh Jack's baby. But then spoiler alert twist, 0:01:46.720 --> 0:01:49.120 she wasn't actually pregnant. She was never pregnant. She had 0:01:49.320 --> 0:01:53.160 uterine cancer I believe, or cancer of some sort. And 0:01:53.360 --> 0:01:55.920 so the whole thing, she was trying to gone girl 0:01:56.200 --> 0:01:58.400 and trick Max into murdering her so at least she 0:01:58.400 --> 0:02:03.680 would go quick and then maybe Mac would get in trouble. Right, Yeah, yeah, 0:02:03.720 --> 0:02:06.800 that's good summary. I was like, I'll just do it 0:02:06.880 --> 0:02:10.080 super fast, get it out of the way. I was 0:02:10.120 --> 0:02:13.080 just gonna say, like the whole gone girl part of it, 0:02:13.080 --> 0:02:17.000 it made me really happy that at least Rebecca got 0:02:17.040 --> 0:02:21.320 her last joke you know, and that she like died smiling. 0:02:21.760 --> 0:02:24.640 It's just so it is a very sociopath thing to do. 0:02:24.720 --> 0:02:27.960 I'm just saying, it's like, I'm so happy that my 0:02:28.040 --> 0:02:29.800 husband's going to murder me and then his life will 0:02:29.840 --> 0:02:32.680 be ruined. But yeah, it was, I mean, it was 0:02:32.840 --> 0:02:36.040 very she she got it, she got hers in, she's 0:02:36.040 --> 0:02:38.239 gonna die, She's gonna go out for a little. She 0:02:38.320 --> 0:02:40.280 knew how to arrange a party, she knew how to 0:02:40.360 --> 0:02:43.600 arrange a floral arrangement, do a decorade of room. She 0:02:43.639 --> 0:02:49.200 knew how to orchestrate a murder. Side and again, like 0:02:49.360 --> 0:02:52.720 I know that the second Mrs de Winter really wants 0:02:52.760 --> 0:02:56.760 to believe that Rebecca was a sociopath, and Um and 0:02:57.320 --> 0:03:00.359 Maxim and apparently I do too, and Max I really 0:03:00.400 --> 0:03:04.280 want as this woman is associate paths. But Max a 0:03:04.440 --> 0:03:07.480 list two people that can super confirm that Rebecca was 0:03:07.520 --> 0:03:11.720 a sociopath for him, and it's Frank and it's his sister. Um. 0:03:11.840 --> 0:03:15.440 His sister does not seem to play into the idea 0:03:15.440 --> 0:03:17.760 of like Rebecca was the sociopath, we're also glad she's 0:03:17.800 --> 0:03:21.239 Dand his sister calls the second missister went about the phone. 0:03:21.240 --> 0:03:24.160 It's like she never would have committed suicide. This is crazy. 0:03:24.240 --> 0:03:27.480 You should look into it. That's not the way you 0:03:27.760 --> 0:03:31.120 behave if you think, I'm so glad this sociopaths is, 0:03:31.639 --> 0:03:35.440 but it was the sociopath. But also think they were murdered. 0:03:35.640 --> 0:03:38.600 But I still don't think they do. She deserved to 0:03:38.640 --> 0:03:41.920 be murdered. And I also think for me, it was 0:03:42.040 --> 0:03:45.680 just about Danny's description of her and made her and 0:03:45.720 --> 0:03:47.960 I think I think she hit it. Rebecca even hid 0:03:47.960 --> 0:03:51.200 it from the sister. I think the sister was sort 0:03:51.240 --> 0:03:53.880 of charmed by her public face but didn't like her 0:03:53.920 --> 0:03:58.320 because she maybe slept with her husband. She definitely went 0:03:58.360 --> 0:04:01.600 after the husband. So don't think that Beatrice was on herself. 0:04:01.760 --> 0:04:03.800 So Beatrice was sort of like I'm sure she was 0:04:03.840 --> 0:04:06.800 always like publicly charming to Beatrice, but then like Stuft 0:04:06.880 --> 0:04:08.839 with her husband said, she's like, no, I don't like her, 0:04:08.880 --> 0:04:11.840 but like she might like she sucks, but like she 0:04:11.920 --> 0:04:17.600 was always chilling. Yeah, I think Beatrice and her brother 0:04:17.720 --> 0:04:20.280 killed her. I think I don't think so. I think 0:04:20.320 --> 0:04:24.520 she's very nice. I thought I thought Beatrice was was 0:04:24.560 --> 0:04:27.000 one of the few redeeming characters in the book. Like 0:04:27.080 --> 0:04:30.760 she was very, very nice to the new Mrs Dewinter 0:04:31.120 --> 0:04:34.360 tried to like help her out whenever she could. When 0:04:34.360 --> 0:04:36.520 the whole dress thing happened, she was the only one 0:04:36.560 --> 0:04:39.159 who was like, hey girl, come on, let's take this 0:04:39.240 --> 0:04:42.960 off till out per minute. Uh. And you know we've 0:04:43.000 --> 0:04:46.520 all had that, you know, I have experienced dressing up 0:04:46.560 --> 0:04:48.480 for Halloween and becoming a bit of a mess and 0:04:48.520 --> 0:04:51.479 then your friend is helping you in contume, which is hilarious. 0:04:52.040 --> 0:04:55.600 So the thought of her like running around like in 0:04:55.680 --> 0:05:01.520 her fully culturally appropriate apple boy. But oh boy, but 0:05:01.600 --> 0:05:04.599 like that image to me is very funny to like 0:05:04.920 --> 0:05:08.560 help help a gal pal out when you're like fully 0:05:08.600 --> 0:05:20.680 in halloween costume. Is that's fun? Good job? Yeah? Oh yeah? 0:05:20.839 --> 0:05:24.480 Can we also just talk more about Mrs dan Verse, 0:05:24.520 --> 0:05:27.160 who plis? I think you accurately clocked, Wasn't you said 0:05:27.200 --> 0:05:31.760 the most interesting character in the book? Uh? Tian, what 0:05:31.839 --> 0:05:35.840 are your what are your dan Verse feelings? I mean, 0:05:35.880 --> 0:05:41.600 after after you learn that, like she clearly knows that 0:05:41.680 --> 0:05:44.800 this this very close person of her was murdered by 0:05:44.800 --> 0:05:47.560 this man. Like the fact that she is even being 0:05:47.640 --> 0:05:51.719 remotely chill about it, I'm like, she's really holding it together, 0:05:51.760 --> 0:05:54.599 Like I know she's kind of mean and cold to 0:05:54.880 --> 0:05:57.440 the Mrs the new Mrs de Winter, but I find 0:05:57.440 --> 0:05:59.719 it to be I have a question, do we think 0:06:00.000 --> 0:06:02.920 we're sure Mrs Danvers thinks it's murder or did she 0:06:03.080 --> 0:06:06.720 actually believe it was a voting accident. I think she believes. 0:06:07.360 --> 0:06:09.920 I think it's because like they talk about how Rebecca 0:06:10.040 --> 0:06:15.200 is so proficient at sailing that she like she wouldn't 0:06:15.200 --> 0:06:18.279 have had mistakes. And I also think that confirmation to 0:06:18.360 --> 0:06:22.559 me in retrospect was her having Jack come over when 0:06:23.920 --> 0:06:28.120 when Maxim was out and like make sure everyone else 0:06:28.200 --> 0:06:30.400 was out because they want to talk ship. They want 0:06:30.440 --> 0:06:32.960 to talk it and be like, yeah, she didn't. Like 0:06:33.000 --> 0:06:34.880 they want to talk about how she got murdered and 0:06:35.200 --> 0:06:36.840 what to do about it, And I think she was 0:06:36.920 --> 0:06:39.880 laying in wait, you really don't think it's that. I 0:06:39.920 --> 0:06:46.000 think mus really wants to believe that Rebecca had what 0:06:46.120 --> 0:06:50.000 would be for her a good death. U that Rebecca 0:06:50.080 --> 0:06:53.120 never wanted to grow old, she she was so strong, 0:06:53.360 --> 0:06:56.160 like the Mrs Dancrews wants to think the only thing 0:06:56.200 --> 0:07:01.320 that could conquer this indomitable woman is she talks about 0:07:01.360 --> 0:07:04.640 how like, yeah, she didn't die for a man. The 0:07:04.720 --> 0:07:08.159 scene that could take her UM, and I think, as 0:07:08.240 --> 0:07:13.440 someone who is Rebecca's mother and maybe love her UM, 0:07:13.520 --> 0:07:16.960 that's really tolerable for her. And I think she just 0:07:17.000 --> 0:07:20.000 wants to get together with jack because jack Um and 0:07:20.040 --> 0:07:22.960 Rebecca had this really close relationship, and she also had 0:07:22.960 --> 0:07:26.040 a really close relationship with Rebecca. Like the only way 0:07:26.080 --> 0:07:28.640 that they can kind of remember her is if they 0:07:28.680 --> 0:07:32.320 get together and tell stories about her, which is sad 0:07:32.400 --> 0:07:34.960 but makes perfect sense. And the reason I think all 0:07:35.000 --> 0:07:38.440 of this is because if Mrs Andrews had no one 0:07:38.480 --> 0:07:40.320 that Maxim killed her, she would have burned down that 0:07:40.360 --> 0:07:43.360 house of media, like she would not have weighted until 0:07:43.400 --> 0:07:48.200 he was all and I take it back. I also 0:07:48.280 --> 0:07:50.640 think that, like, just like you said, that monologue she's 0:07:50.680 --> 0:07:55.080 giving when she's suicide murdering the second Mrs de Winter, 0:07:55.400 --> 0:07:57.320 she makes it very clear that she thinks it was 0:07:57.960 --> 0:08:01.720 an accident. I full believe that Mrs Danvers has some 0:08:01.760 --> 0:08:07.200 sort of sexual tension with Rebecca, like that was immediately, 0:08:07.400 --> 0:08:11.400 especially in that segment where she talks about how like, oh, 0:08:11.760 --> 0:08:13.400 sex was just a game for her, it was all 0:08:13.400 --> 0:08:16.200 a game, And I'm like, oh, did you play the 0:08:16.240 --> 0:08:20.880 game and lose? Maybe I'm so sorry um. But I 0:08:20.920 --> 0:08:24.520 think that Mrs Danvers is fascinating in the art of 0:08:24.560 --> 0:08:28.720 psychological warfare in a way that is not fair to 0:08:28.800 --> 0:08:32.040 the new Mrs Winter, because it's like she went out 0:08:32.080 --> 0:08:35.880 to the battlefield wearing like her fuzzy slippers and Mrs 0:08:35.960 --> 0:08:40.280 Danvers is like a trained Amazon warrior from Greek mythology. 0:08:40.360 --> 0:08:43.079 It's not a fair fight. And I think that it's 0:08:43.120 --> 0:08:46.120 really fascinating to watch that dynamic, and it sort of 0:08:46.360 --> 0:08:50.720 mirrors the fact that there's this also uneven dynamic between 0:08:50.760 --> 0:08:54.120 Maxim and the new Mrs de Winters, and she's like 0:08:54.520 --> 0:08:56.679 at both terms. The person who's supposed to help her 0:08:56.679 --> 0:08:59.080 with the household stuff so that she can try and 0:08:59.120 --> 0:09:03.200 even out her relations with Maxim is like psychologically trying 0:09:03.320 --> 0:09:07.800 to annihilate her. And I find that dynamic really intriguing, 0:09:07.800 --> 0:09:09.240 which is why I said I think that there are 0:09:09.280 --> 0:09:12.520 some really interesting things about the story. I just did 0:09:12.559 --> 0:09:15.000 not like the way that the things were written, and 0:09:15.000 --> 0:09:17.079 so I'm excited to see the adaptations. And I think 0:09:17.080 --> 0:09:19.440 that's the thing about an adaptation. Sometimes you'll like a 0:09:19.440 --> 0:09:21.200 book and not like the movie, and something like a 0:09:21.200 --> 0:09:23.840 movie and not like a book. I will say about 0:09:23.920 --> 0:09:26.120 dan versus. One thing that I wanted to say about 0:09:26.440 --> 0:09:29.240 why I find her so fascinating is this kind of 0:09:29.800 --> 0:09:33.440 reframing of her throughout the book. And because in the 0:09:33.480 --> 0:09:37.720 beginning she is the ultimate antagonist. She's like the living, 0:09:38.160 --> 0:09:42.000 breathing version of like, this is Rebecca's home, I'm going 0:09:42.040 --> 0:09:45.240 to make your life a living hell for our narrator. 0:09:45.360 --> 0:09:49.360 And I hated her, and you know, I understood she 0:09:49.440 --> 0:09:52.120 was pissed, but she's channeling it to the wrong person. Like, 0:09:52.160 --> 0:09:55.480 if you're pissed Maxim got over Rebecca so fast, be 0:09:55.600 --> 0:09:59.240 mad at Maxim. Don't be mean to this poor girl. Uh, 0:09:59.280 --> 0:10:01.839 And that I mean and the fancy dress thing. It's 0:10:01.840 --> 0:10:06.079 like the end the day after with her like literally 0:10:06.120 --> 0:10:11.720 being like killing herself. But but then it's this whole 0:10:11.840 --> 0:10:16.280 flip of like she's realizing, you know, as Jennifer Riley 0:10:16.320 --> 0:10:19.880 point out pointed out that that Rebecca did not die 0:10:20.000 --> 0:10:22.839 on her own accord, that Maxim killed her. And it's 0:10:22.880 --> 0:10:29.160 this building mounting evidence and just this horrible, great new 0:10:29.280 --> 0:10:32.600 kind of grief for her, for this mother who like 0:10:32.880 --> 0:10:37.160 essentially mother who lost her child. And and then she 0:10:37.280 --> 0:10:40.120 becomes kind of the protagonist at the end in a 0:10:40.160 --> 0:10:44.160 weird way of like being like, oh, the system is 0:10:44.160 --> 0:10:46.280 not going to get this man, so I am going 0:10:46.320 --> 0:10:50.760 to ruin his life. And I loved that arc. Nobody 0:10:50.800 --> 0:10:53.000 treats her like a mother who lost her child, and 0:10:53.120 --> 0:10:58.920 that is infuriating to me. She from acency and people 0:10:58.920 --> 0:11:01.080 are all like, oh, dead, you will run the estate. 0:11:01.360 --> 0:11:03.920 She's clever, We'll fire her if she doesn't do a 0:11:03.920 --> 0:11:08.640 good job for you. Um No, like this, this woman 0:11:08.760 --> 0:11:12.040 is clearly clinging to Manderly because it is the last 0:11:12.080 --> 0:11:16.120 remnant of her child. That's why I think the psychological 0:11:16.160 --> 0:11:20.559 warfare is warned well from from Danny's From Danny's perspective, 0:11:20.960 --> 0:11:25.320 Max bring it on. You know her, his beloved wife, 0:11:25.320 --> 0:11:28.400 who's the most amazing person in the world dies in 0:11:28.480 --> 0:11:31.760 tragic ways. He's almost like good riddens, and then less 0:11:31.760 --> 0:11:35.640 than a year later brings home this teenage nobody to 0:11:35.679 --> 0:11:41.120 where Rebecca lived. The outrage, Yeah, I just felt like 0:11:41.160 --> 0:11:45.320 the outrage was misplaced on this for naive girl, that's like, 0:11:45.400 --> 0:11:49.480 what's going on. I'm so sorry for existing and not 0:11:49.559 --> 0:11:54.520 being mad at Maxim who like brings you don't know, 0:11:55.000 --> 0:12:00.240 you choose, Yeah, just in advance. If I die, your 0:12:00.240 --> 0:12:04.480 mysterious circumstances, and Daniel marry somebody else who was nineteen 0:12:04.480 --> 0:12:10.800 and under your burned down my fucking house. That went 0:12:10.880 --> 0:12:15.400 without saying okay, yeah, yeah, yeah, take it out on 0:12:15.480 --> 0:12:22.280 another woman, honestly, for burning down the house of any 0:12:22.480 --> 0:12:24.960 man over the age of forty that marries a woman 0:12:25.120 --> 0:12:29.720 under the age of twenty, regardless of prior relationships. Just 0:12:29.960 --> 0:12:34.080 burn it down. Just burn it. It's not normal. I 0:12:34.120 --> 0:12:37.320 don't think that I think that there's something going on there. 0:12:38.800 --> 0:12:43.319 I personally think that we should take breaks from this discussion, 0:12:43.400 --> 0:12:56.040 much like I took a break from reading the book. Okay, 0:12:56.080 --> 0:13:01.000 we're back with Popcorn book Club. On one character that 0:13:01.080 --> 0:13:03.360 we haven't mentioned yet, but who I think is also 0:13:03.840 --> 0:13:08.880 a Beatrice and it's very sweet, is Frank the property manager. Well, 0:13:08.880 --> 0:13:12.920 I love very sweet and very nice to the second 0:13:12.960 --> 0:13:15.560 Mrs de Winter. And you get the impression that Rebecca 0:13:15.720 --> 0:13:18.600 made unwanted advantage to him and he did not know 0:13:18.640 --> 0:13:25.000 how to handle it. He truly did not know. She 0:13:25.200 --> 0:13:29.560 was the most beautiful woman I bet creature. But also 0:13:30.280 --> 0:13:34.000 he was very complicit in the whole dang thing. I 0:13:34.040 --> 0:13:36.400 think he's the only one who really knew what happened. 0:13:37.120 --> 0:13:41.360 Uh oh yeah, I guess he did so. I he 0:13:41.480 --> 0:13:44.560 did cover a murder. He did. He also seems like 0:13:44.600 --> 0:13:48.439 that like the buddy of like the hot, like popular 0:13:48.960 --> 0:13:54.720 quarterback that's always like wanting to be like he wants. 0:13:54.920 --> 0:13:58.440 Oh yeah, I was thinking of Michael Sarah if they 0:13:58.440 --> 0:14:02.560 had made this in two thousand seven. I do like 0:14:02.880 --> 0:14:07.280 that him driving her back from the inquest after she 0:14:07.360 --> 0:14:09.959 fainted and they're both in the car, not sure if 0:14:10.000 --> 0:14:14.720 the other one knows that Maxim murdered her. Yeah, they 0:14:14.760 --> 0:14:17.880 both know that Maxim murdered this lady, and they both 0:14:17.920 --> 0:14:19.880 want him to get away with it. They have to 0:14:19.920 --> 0:14:25.880 communicate that somehow. Okay, we actually, oh my god, there's 0:14:25.880 --> 0:14:28.000 woulda be so good with the modern apptation because with 0:14:28.080 --> 0:14:31.480 like Instagram, you always know like how beautiful your new 0:14:31.560 --> 0:14:38.680 boyfriend or husband's X was. Yeah, yeah, that there was 0:14:38.760 --> 0:14:41.760 something when she when she's like, I'm just gonna go 0:14:42.040 --> 0:14:44.600 to the West Wing. I'm not gonna look, I'm just 0:14:44.600 --> 0:14:47.080 gonna go. It felt like somebody like I'm just gonna 0:14:47.400 --> 0:14:50.120 check her Instagram. I'm just gonna look for one second. 0:14:50.160 --> 0:14:53.760 I'm not going to go back to two thirteen. Absolutely not. 0:14:53.880 --> 0:14:56.960 That's crazy, who would do that? And just to see 0:14:56.960 --> 0:15:00.680 her body, what does it say? Oh my gosh, oh 0:15:00.720 --> 0:15:03.800 I love it her profile because just like Rebecca's if 0:15:03.800 --> 0:15:05.640 all her Instagram is just her on the boat, like 0:15:05.680 --> 0:15:09.480 it's just her on the sailing. Rebecca is a wellness 0:15:11.360 --> 0:15:13.760 but she writes. She writes thank you notes in fountain 0:15:13.800 --> 0:15:17.280 pen with like homemade baked goods that she sends everything 0:15:18.720 --> 0:15:22.640 feeling that girl. What's her name? Who started? Who founded 0:15:22.720 --> 0:15:28.480 moon Juice? Amanda shawntal Bacon's her? That's that's like. But 0:15:28.520 --> 0:15:35.040 I think fundamentally and like the aesthetic of it, I 0:15:35.040 --> 0:15:37.920 think she's like very classy like that, like the bo 0:15:38.320 --> 0:15:41.040 and the handwritten notes, and like she knows she's like 0:15:41.040 --> 0:15:46.520 a handwritten toastess. Has wonderful parties, like themed parties. She's fun. Yeah, 0:15:46.760 --> 0:15:50.280 I want her. I want her handwriting as a font. 0:15:50.480 --> 0:15:53.080 Like that should be a good marketing campaign for this 0:15:53.120 --> 0:15:56.160 because the way they describe it looks gorgeous. Who do 0:15:56.160 --> 0:16:00.080 we think the dan Verses in modern modern day? I 0:16:00.080 --> 0:16:04.560 think the casting is actually perfect. I think Kristin Stewart 0:16:05.640 --> 0:16:09.640 so good. She's going to be really good. Yeah, that's 0:16:09.640 --> 0:16:13.920 a very good one. I'm just now I'm really disappointed 0:16:14.040 --> 0:16:16.800 that and Owd plays the lady at the beginning, because 0:16:16.800 --> 0:16:20.160 she's only at the beginning and I want more and 0:16:20.400 --> 0:16:23.840 owed you know, she'll chew up the furniture. They'll just 0:16:23.880 --> 0:16:25.680 be like, all right, and Dowd, why don't you do 0:16:25.720 --> 0:16:27.640 one for fun like that, she just gets to go 0:16:27.680 --> 0:16:34.520 on some runs. Yeah, that this marriage was not gonna 0:16:34.560 --> 0:16:38.760 work out. I mean she was. She wasn't wrong, but 0:16:38.880 --> 0:16:41.440 she was wrong for the reason she wasn't wrong, you 0:16:41.480 --> 0:16:46.160 know what I mean, Like she was being a jealous necessarily, 0:16:46.560 --> 0:16:48.600 like looking out for her and being like, hey, sweetie, 0:16:48.640 --> 0:16:50.240 I know that you don't have a mom, and I 0:16:50.320 --> 0:16:52.680 know that I've been kind of shitty in that respect, 0:16:52.840 --> 0:16:55.520 but like, don't marry a dude you met on vacation 0:16:55.800 --> 0:17:02.320 three weeks ago. That's really good everyone. Uh look, I 0:17:02.360 --> 0:17:06.679 don't know that under normal circumstancesively be though, like otherwise, okay, 0:17:06.800 --> 0:17:12.399 if this hadn't happened, No, don't marry a stranger. Don't 0:17:12.480 --> 0:17:18.719 marry you got married, Daniel, and I knew we were 0:17:18.720 --> 0:17:22.600 getting married very early on. But okay, that's but you 0:17:22.800 --> 0:17:26.040 did not marry That's that's a good one. But I 0:17:26.040 --> 0:17:30.720 didn't said I was not like a penniless wife who 0:17:30.880 --> 0:17:34.240 was being trained to be a companion, which, by the way, 0:17:34.359 --> 0:17:39.280 is not a real job. Um whose like the greatest 0:17:39.440 --> 0:17:43.240 possibility was I was gonna keep trappling with this lady 0:17:43.400 --> 0:17:46.840 and they she's gonna leave you, and they have no skills. 0:17:48.040 --> 0:17:50.400 I figured it out the modern day equivalent. Sorry, she's 0:17:50.400 --> 0:17:55.960 a personal assistant. She's a personal assistant. Yeah, yeah, that's 0:17:55.960 --> 0:18:00.359 a real thing. That's like, okay, yeah, well that was 0:18:00.359 --> 0:18:06.840 a thing. Then if Maxim had not been a murderer whatever, 0:18:06.840 --> 0:18:09.280 her life had been worse than even if this is 0:18:09.320 --> 0:18:14.160 like a loveless, weird marriage with housekeeper who will tell 0:18:14.280 --> 0:18:21.760 you to kill yourself. Yeah, her, like she had an 0:18:21.760 --> 0:18:24.240 option to just go to maximum. It's like, Okay, this 0:18:24.359 --> 0:18:27.200 lady is crazy. She tried to push me out away, 0:18:27.359 --> 0:18:29.159 trying to push me out a window. We have to 0:18:29.440 --> 0:18:33.359 fire her. We'll hire somebody new. She'll be good too, 0:18:33.440 --> 0:18:36.280 It'll be fine. But I think also we forgetting that, 0:18:36.320 --> 0:18:39.520 like even before until the murder thing came to light, 0:18:39.880 --> 0:18:43.720 Maxim was a terrible husband to her, terrible, but her 0:18:43.760 --> 0:18:47.360 life is terrible, and terrible has to accommodate Mrs van Hopper, 0:18:47.680 --> 0:18:51.200 who is a terrible boy and who she's very attractive 0:18:51.240 --> 0:18:53.720 to Maxim, but like, what if she then meets someone 0:18:53.720 --> 0:18:56.800 who treats her he was that bad. I think that 0:18:56.920 --> 0:19:00.680 Mrs van Hopper was like kind of a ship employer, 0:19:01.280 --> 0:19:05.639 but not in like a completely abusive way like this. 0:19:05.920 --> 0:19:08.080 I know I've been using the term psychological warfare, but 0:19:08.080 --> 0:19:10.280 I feel like Maximum is also engaging in that to 0:19:10.359 --> 0:19:12.560 some degree, in terms of like she's like, oh, well, 0:19:12.560 --> 0:19:14.720 he didn't have time to say that he loved me, 0:19:15.440 --> 0:19:23.600 I'll say it later. Yeah, look a lot older than he. 0:19:23.840 --> 0:19:26.440 But Jennifer, she couldn't meet He's not the last. He 0:19:26.560 --> 0:19:29.720 doesn't seem to be great way twenty years and then 0:19:29.760 --> 0:19:36.080 you wait, I'm sorry. Was that the defense? Yeah, I 0:19:36.080 --> 0:19:45.560 mean she could get someone else to like, and he's 0:19:45.600 --> 0:19:49.280 definitely going to Maria Murder and Jennifer Wein did talk 0:19:49.359 --> 0:19:52.640 about this, we were texting a little bit. Her devotion 0:19:52.720 --> 0:19:55.280 to Maxim is sort of similar to like a Mrs 0:19:55.320 --> 0:20:00.320 Danvers to Rebecca, Like she instantly becomes obsessed with acts 0:20:00.320 --> 0:20:03.560 and is totally on board and justifies everything he says 0:20:03.600 --> 0:20:06.320 and does in a way that is unhealthy. I mean, 0:20:06.440 --> 0:20:09.280 it's it's right for her because there was no alternative. 0:20:09.320 --> 0:20:11.800 But in a dream world, you stay with Mrs van 0:20:11.840 --> 0:20:15.160 Hopper and then meet a nice, normal accountant who treats 0:20:15.200 --> 0:20:19.200 you well. She was never going to be is what 0:20:19.240 --> 0:20:21.320 the book should have been. This is what the book 0:20:21.320 --> 0:20:23.160 should have been. She should have gone to New York 0:20:23.520 --> 0:20:26.080 with Mrs van Hopper, and then when she got to 0:20:26.119 --> 0:20:28.520 New York, she should have saved up all her money, 0:20:28.920 --> 0:20:32.640 left her employ gone out into the city to be 0:20:32.880 --> 0:20:39.880 a city gal in New York. And yeah, met a fabulous, wonderful, 0:20:39.960 --> 0:20:43.320 mysterious woman who was like a socialite in the New 0:20:43.440 --> 0:20:48.439 York City like hot scene named Rebecca, and she learned 0:20:48.600 --> 0:20:52.879 how to be a cool it girl from Rebecca. This 0:20:53.040 --> 0:20:56.720 is then Rebecca Mysterious. It is very gossip girl. And 0:20:56.800 --> 0:21:01.320 then Rebecca mysteriously disappears and it's about her remembering her 0:21:01.320 --> 0:21:07.440 friend Rebecca. Hey, Karama, why are you telling this very 0:21:07.480 --> 0:21:10.240 good book that you should write. Write that book, everybody. 0:21:10.680 --> 0:21:12.600 We need to cut that out, and the need to 0:21:12.640 --> 0:21:20.159 write that book from Twilight. Not that, not that it 0:21:20.200 --> 0:21:21.919 will be much better than that. But you know, I 0:21:22.040 --> 0:21:27.000 love Twilight. Complete meant I loved Twilight. I'm a twyheart, 0:21:27.840 --> 0:21:31.760 but I meant fifty great, it's not, you know, but 0:21:32.000 --> 0:21:34.000 I will I will say it does feel like this 0:21:34.160 --> 0:21:37.080 whole book is, or the beginning of the book is 0:21:37.160 --> 0:21:40.760 just like the lesson as trust your instincts, like it, 0:21:41.680 --> 0:21:43.879 you know. And she just keeps like, I highlighted this 0:21:43.960 --> 0:21:48.720 one little section where it's like, um, then they suddenly 0:21:48.720 --> 0:21:51.040 decided to get married in there. It was such an adventure. 0:21:51.080 --> 0:21:52.880 I smiled to myself as I had my knees bla. 0:21:53.520 --> 0:21:55.439 I was to be Mrs Winter. It was foolish to 0:21:55.480 --> 0:21:57.280 go on having that pain in the pit of my 0:21:57.359 --> 0:22:00.080 stomach when I was so happy. Nerves, of course, and 0:22:00.119 --> 0:22:05.199 I just highlighted it and said, red flag when you 0:22:05.320 --> 0:22:08.760 have the nerves in the pit of your stomach, runaway. Yeah. 0:22:08.880 --> 0:22:10.639 My mom taught me always trust your gut, and then 0:22:10.640 --> 0:22:13.119 she told me several stories of people who were murdered 0:22:13.160 --> 0:22:15.280 when they didn't trust their gut. When I was like 0:22:15.320 --> 0:22:17.680 a teenager, She's like, so trust your gut otherwise you'll 0:22:17.720 --> 0:22:21.800 be murdered. Yeah, that's a good mom. Okay, let's take 0:22:21.960 --> 0:22:35.880 a brief moment here for an head break. So we're 0:22:35.920 --> 0:22:44.080 back with Popcorn Book Club for My Heart Radio. She 0:22:44.240 --> 0:22:46.199 was so obsessed that she was willing to be like, 0:22:46.280 --> 0:22:51.600 I'll just I'll just be your friends a dog. I 0:22:51.640 --> 0:22:56.000 don't care. I know you're you're still not over. Part 0:22:56.040 --> 0:22:59.280 that I did highly that I thought was absolutely crazy 0:22:59.760 --> 0:23:02.640 was where she was like in that exact conversation when 0:23:02.680 --> 0:23:05.359 she's like, I know you love Rebecca so much, and 0:23:05.359 --> 0:23:09.480 he goes, what why would you think I loved Rebecca? 0:23:10.119 --> 0:23:15.600 Why would you not red flag? Why would your wife 0:23:15.840 --> 0:23:21.920 think that you loved your fabulous ex wife? He's like, what, 0:23:22.160 --> 0:23:27.200 you stupid idiot, you thought I loved my wife. Here's 0:23:27.240 --> 0:23:30.200 the thing about red flags. I feel like, if there 0:23:30.200 --> 0:23:34.000 are some red flags, but there are an exponentially larger 0:23:34.080 --> 0:23:36.479 number of green flags, you can kind of forgive some 0:23:36.520 --> 0:23:40.359 of the red flags, but maxim to winter at zero 0:23:40.600 --> 0:23:49.600 green rich rich, handsome, nice house, rich rich rich rich flags. 0:23:49.800 --> 0:23:52.800 That is an economic state of being, that's not a 0:23:52.840 --> 0:23:56.480 green flags. I'm just saying those are his only positive attributes. 0:23:57.320 --> 0:24:00.240 There's a bow Jack Horseman quote that goes some thing 0:24:00.359 --> 0:24:03.159 like when you're looking through looking at the world through 0:24:03.240 --> 0:24:07.920 rose colored glasses, all the red flags just look like flags, um, 0:24:07.960 --> 0:24:09.520 And I feel like that's what it is. Like. She 0:24:09.640 --> 0:24:13.160 was so smitten by this handsome man with a good 0:24:13.280 --> 0:24:16.480 jaw line and a and Amanda Manderley that it's like, 0:24:16.920 --> 0:24:19.280 I don't know what these flags are there just flags. 0:24:19.800 --> 0:24:24.000 I love flags someone giving her attention for the first 0:24:24.000 --> 0:24:26.000 time in her life and like talking to her like 0:24:26.040 --> 0:24:30.520 an equal and not as a employ And I think 0:24:30.560 --> 0:24:32.760 on some levels she wants it, Like she wants the 0:24:32.800 --> 0:24:36.600 waiters to be more respectful of her when she's at 0:24:36.600 --> 0:24:39.920 the hotel. Dare she doesn't want people just throwing a 0:24:40.040 --> 0:24:46.439 cold ham at her. Yeah, that's so very understandable. But 0:24:46.520 --> 0:24:49.600 she also hasty of like alright, like I'll skip over 0:24:49.720 --> 0:24:53.040 all the hard parts of becoming an adult. It'll just 0:24:53.119 --> 0:24:55.800 skip to the part where I'm in my mid thirties 0:24:55.840 --> 0:24:58.280 and I'm the lady of the house and everybody respects 0:24:58.320 --> 0:25:00.720 me and thinks I'm fabulous. I will say, as someone 0:25:00.760 --> 0:25:03.879 who has dated older people, that is like a fantasy 0:25:03.920 --> 0:25:07.760 that I share, and it never goes Well, I keep 0:25:07.760 --> 0:25:13.439 telling you to stop doing I've stopped. Yeah, enjoy being young, Benome. 0:25:14.440 --> 0:25:17.160 It only took five years for you to start listening 0:25:17.200 --> 0:25:21.720