1 00:00:01,720 --> 00:00:05,640 Speaker 1: Call Zone Media. 2 00:00:06,240 --> 00:00:09,440 Speaker 2: Welcome to taknapp and here show about things falling apart 3 00:00:09,480 --> 00:00:11,239 Speaker 2: and how to put them back together again. I am 4 00:00:11,240 --> 00:00:15,440 Speaker 2: your host Nia Long for another It's both episode, and 5 00:00:15,480 --> 00:00:17,720 Speaker 2: when I say both, I mean we are talking about 6 00:00:17,760 --> 00:00:21,119 Speaker 2: something that we've been covering kind of some extent in 7 00:00:21,160 --> 00:00:23,759 Speaker 2: a bunch of different cities, which is a bunch of 8 00:00:23,760 --> 00:00:29,400 Speaker 2: hospitals incredibly cowardly decision to not provide trans youth with 9 00:00:29,560 --> 00:00:32,640 Speaker 2: gender firming care that they need out of a combination 10 00:00:32,840 --> 00:00:36,560 Speaker 2: of fear, greed, and malice. And with me to talk 11 00:00:36,680 --> 00:00:39,320 Speaker 2: about one of the places where this has been happening 12 00:00:39,560 --> 00:00:43,320 Speaker 2: and how people have been trying to resist it, and 13 00:00:43,560 --> 00:00:46,640 Speaker 2: this in this case is the University of Pittsburgh Medical Center. 14 00:00:47,159 --> 00:00:48,959 Speaker 2: And so we're talking to two people who have been 15 00:00:49,040 --> 00:00:54,080 Speaker 2: fighting back against they're just hideous cowardice. One is Selena Binnock, 16 00:00:54,120 --> 00:00:58,280 Speaker 2: who is a therapist at UBMC, and then also Dena Staley, 17 00:00:58,320 --> 00:01:01,560 Speaker 2: who's the executive director and founder of Trans Uniting. Both 18 00:01:01,600 --> 00:01:02,840 Speaker 2: of you two, welcome to the show. 19 00:01:03,680 --> 00:01:06,920 Speaker 3: Thank you for having us, Thank you yeah. 20 00:01:06,680 --> 00:01:10,560 Speaker 2: And thank you for doing this genuinely really critical work 21 00:01:10,640 --> 00:01:15,560 Speaker 2: to try to get this hospital to not severely harm 22 00:01:15,600 --> 00:01:16,840 Speaker 2: their translations. 23 00:01:20,040 --> 00:01:22,160 Speaker 3: Lord, Yeah, who know, we would be fighting this battle 24 00:01:22,240 --> 00:01:23,560 Speaker 3: right right? 25 00:01:23,880 --> 00:01:27,480 Speaker 2: Yeah? So okay, I guess the place I want to 26 00:01:27,640 --> 00:01:31,040 Speaker 2: start is, can you explain sort of the exact situation 27 00:01:31,160 --> 00:01:34,720 Speaker 2: of what happened after their sort of recent Supreme Court 28 00:01:34,800 --> 00:01:40,800 Speaker 2: ruling and what the hospital decided to do and not do. 29 00:01:42,720 --> 00:01:46,600 Speaker 4: Yeah, So, from our understanding, what's been going on with 30 00:01:46,760 --> 00:01:50,160 Speaker 4: UPMC or the University of Pittsburgh Medical Center is they 31 00:01:50,200 --> 00:01:53,920 Speaker 4: have decided to end all gender firming care. This includes 32 00:01:54,000 --> 00:01:58,400 Speaker 4: puberty blockers hormone therapy surgeries for people under nineteen. 33 00:01:58,680 --> 00:02:00,240 Speaker 3: And this is in response. 34 00:01:59,840 --> 00:02:02,840 Speaker 4: To an executive order that was put out in the 35 00:02:02,880 --> 00:02:07,440 Speaker 4: spring by the Trump administration saying that providers who continued 36 00:02:07,520 --> 00:02:13,160 Speaker 4: to prescribe these medically necessary treatments would be at risk 37 00:02:13,240 --> 00:02:18,600 Speaker 4: of felony charges and that providers who supported accessing this 38 00:02:18,680 --> 00:02:21,080 Speaker 4: type of care could also be in trouble as far 39 00:02:21,120 --> 00:02:23,200 Speaker 4: as getting felony charges for aiding and a bedding. So 40 00:02:23,240 --> 00:02:25,240 Speaker 4: that's the way that the hospital system is interpreting this 41 00:02:25,320 --> 00:02:28,880 Speaker 4: executive order. So there has been a lot of pushback 42 00:02:28,960 --> 00:02:35,640 Speaker 4: from multiple providers people throughout UPMC, and the biggest issue 43 00:02:35,760 --> 00:02:39,760 Speaker 4: is that they created a deadline of making these changes 44 00:02:39,800 --> 00:02:42,680 Speaker 4: starting June thirtieth. This is an arbitrary date that they 45 00:02:42,720 --> 00:02:45,760 Speaker 4: decided within the hospital system the state was not given 46 00:02:45,800 --> 00:02:49,639 Speaker 4: to them by any kind of federal proceeding or legal mandate, 47 00:02:50,280 --> 00:02:52,720 Speaker 4: and after that time they're no longer going to be 48 00:02:52,720 --> 00:02:57,200 Speaker 4: prescribing these medications. So, starting in April, UPMC stopped taking 49 00:02:57,280 --> 00:03:01,320 Speaker 4: any new clients who are under nineteen who are looking 50 00:03:01,320 --> 00:03:04,079 Speaker 4: for hormone replacement therapy or any kind of gender firman care, 51 00:03:04,600 --> 00:03:07,840 Speaker 4: and starting June thirtieth, they are slowly tapering off all 52 00:03:07,919 --> 00:03:11,360 Speaker 4: clients from their pauby blockers or hormone therapy over the 53 00:03:11,400 --> 00:03:14,320 Speaker 4: course of three to six months, depending on what their 54 00:03:14,360 --> 00:03:17,720 Speaker 4: current medication course is. So what is happening, and the 55 00:03:17,760 --> 00:03:19,960 Speaker 4: thing that I think a lot of people aren't saying 56 00:03:20,160 --> 00:03:22,919 Speaker 4: out loud is that they're forcing these teens and young 57 00:03:22,960 --> 00:03:27,760 Speaker 4: adults to de transition or to or reverse their gender transition, 58 00:03:28,400 --> 00:03:31,520 Speaker 4: which the fear is that they will start seeking non 59 00:03:31,680 --> 00:03:35,720 Speaker 4: medically advised care to obtain and get the treatment that 60 00:03:35,720 --> 00:03:38,080 Speaker 4: they're seeking for. So that is kind of our understanding 61 00:03:38,120 --> 00:03:40,080 Speaker 4: of what's been going on behind the scenes with EPMC. 62 00:03:40,400 --> 00:03:42,480 Speaker 2: Yeah, I also just want to say, like I've had 63 00:03:42,520 --> 00:03:45,280 Speaker 2: like insurance bullshit, where like I've been taken off of 64 00:03:45,320 --> 00:03:47,560 Speaker 2: my stuff for like a month and a half and 65 00:03:47,640 --> 00:03:52,920 Speaker 2: it sucks. It is awful. It is psychologically painful in 66 00:03:53,000 --> 00:03:56,560 Speaker 2: ways that are like difficult to describe. 67 00:03:56,600 --> 00:03:57,880 Speaker 3: It really sucks. 68 00:03:59,000 --> 00:04:01,440 Speaker 4: Right from a physical state, you're going to get side effects, 69 00:04:01,480 --> 00:04:03,800 Speaker 4: don't have issues we're coming off these medications. 70 00:04:03,960 --> 00:04:05,680 Speaker 3: But from a mental standpoint. 71 00:04:05,280 --> 00:04:07,840 Speaker 4: Right, it's these people who are not your doctors are 72 00:04:07,840 --> 00:04:11,920 Speaker 4: determining what your care is and it's incredibly harmful in 73 00:04:12,080 --> 00:04:14,120 Speaker 4: both the physical and the mental aspect of it. 74 00:04:14,560 --> 00:04:17,800 Speaker 5: Yeah, and again we're just talking about healthcare. 75 00:04:17,440 --> 00:04:20,000 Speaker 6: For trans youth at the end of the day, and 76 00:04:20,080 --> 00:04:22,640 Speaker 6: a lot of them were on puberty boxers and just 77 00:04:23,200 --> 00:04:26,960 Speaker 6: a therapy. Are that they're taken away any persons over 78 00:04:27,040 --> 00:04:30,279 Speaker 6: eighteen years old, they're legally, you know, able to vote, 79 00:04:30,320 --> 00:04:32,120 Speaker 6: should be able to make their own decisions if they 80 00:04:32,160 --> 00:04:36,479 Speaker 6: want to with their health care. So it's really discussing 81 00:04:36,560 --> 00:04:40,520 Speaker 6: and disheartening what is happening. And here in Pennsylvania, UPMC 82 00:04:41,000 --> 00:04:43,839 Speaker 6: was the first large health provider, which is one of 83 00:04:43,880 --> 00:04:47,479 Speaker 6: the largest in the state, to start this domino effect 84 00:04:48,040 --> 00:04:50,600 Speaker 6: of stopping care for trans youth. 85 00:04:50,880 --> 00:04:53,200 Speaker 2: Yeah, and I mean it creates a cityous situation where 86 00:04:53,279 --> 00:04:57,960 Speaker 2: just like because of a combination of like some gender 87 00:04:58,000 --> 00:04:59,960 Speaker 2: bureaucrat at the White House was like, I get it 88 00:05:00,040 --> 00:05:02,080 Speaker 2: decide what your gender is now, and I get to 89 00:05:02,080 --> 00:05:03,800 Speaker 2: decide what your health care is because of that, and 90 00:05:03,800 --> 00:05:06,400 Speaker 2: then you have this like cascading effect of like some 91 00:05:06,520 --> 00:05:10,359 Speaker 2: like hospital admin was like, well, I don't know, I 92 00:05:10,360 --> 00:05:13,800 Speaker 2: think it would be easier for like me personally if 93 00:05:13,839 --> 00:05:16,360 Speaker 2: you didn't have health care. It's just like it's cascating 94 00:05:16,360 --> 00:05:17,200 Speaker 2: for the hospital system. 95 00:05:17,200 --> 00:05:18,039 Speaker 3: It's horrible. 96 00:05:18,200 --> 00:05:20,520 Speaker 4: It's horrible, and I appreciate that data makes that point 97 00:05:20,560 --> 00:05:23,680 Speaker 4: of we use this phrase gender affirming care to specify 98 00:05:23,680 --> 00:05:26,880 Speaker 4: what's going on, but it's healthcare. It's you know, not 99 00:05:26,920 --> 00:05:29,120 Speaker 4: that different from someone being forced to come off diabetes 100 00:05:29,160 --> 00:05:31,560 Speaker 4: medication or medication for a heart problem. You know, this 101 00:05:31,680 --> 00:05:34,599 Speaker 4: medication that makes people be able to function in their 102 00:05:34,680 --> 00:05:38,960 Speaker 4: life and feel safe and physically, well, that's what's being 103 00:05:39,000 --> 00:05:42,480 Speaker 4: forced out of their lives. So it is healthcare absolutely. 104 00:05:42,400 --> 00:05:46,120 Speaker 6: And going into spaces that are affirming for them, you know, 105 00:05:46,279 --> 00:05:48,839 Speaker 6: as kids. You know, so now that they don't have 106 00:05:48,960 --> 00:05:51,240 Speaker 6: this affirming space to have to go into spaces that 107 00:05:51,279 --> 00:05:55,960 Speaker 6: are not affirming, they will further damage their mental you know, 108 00:05:56,200 --> 00:05:59,360 Speaker 6: when are going to these spaces being this gender and all. 109 00:05:59,240 --> 00:06:00,640 Speaker 5: Of the other things. 110 00:06:01,000 --> 00:06:02,919 Speaker 6: You know, this is what we're talking about, just a safe, 111 00:06:02,920 --> 00:06:07,000 Speaker 6: affirming place where you can access safe, a firming health here. 112 00:06:07,480 --> 00:06:09,240 Speaker 2: I think it's worth expanding on that a little bit 113 00:06:09,279 --> 00:06:12,640 Speaker 2: in the sense that like a space that's not a 114 00:06:12,960 --> 00:06:16,760 Speaker 2: firming isn't like a neutral space. It's one that's actively 115 00:06:16,839 --> 00:06:21,359 Speaker 2: hostile to you. Absolutely that also just sucks. 116 00:06:21,279 --> 00:06:21,520 Speaker 3: Like. 117 00:06:22,920 --> 00:06:25,840 Speaker 2: It's hideous, and it's just like they decided to inflict 118 00:06:25,839 --> 00:06:29,560 Speaker 2: this on a bunch of children because they're mildly afraid. 119 00:06:29,800 --> 00:06:32,240 Speaker 4: Right, They're afraid, and they're afraid of losing money. And 120 00:06:32,279 --> 00:06:34,760 Speaker 4: there's no way to say that it's a neutral space, right, 121 00:06:34,839 --> 00:06:37,520 Speaker 4: It's you're affirming or a hostile and that's the rest. 122 00:06:37,560 --> 00:06:37,760 Speaker 5: Great. 123 00:06:37,800 --> 00:06:39,960 Speaker 3: Kids can't go to the doctor and feel safe at 124 00:06:39,960 --> 00:06:40,320 Speaker 3: this point. 125 00:06:40,839 --> 00:06:43,719 Speaker 2: Yeah, it's like cascading issues too. Right. We've been talking 126 00:06:43,920 --> 00:06:45,800 Speaker 2: about this a lot in like the context of someone 127 00:06:45,839 --> 00:06:48,280 Speaker 2: like the Medicaid cuts. But it's like anything that deters 128 00:06:48,279 --> 00:06:50,719 Speaker 2: people from going to the doctor, prevents them from going 129 00:06:50,800 --> 00:06:54,359 Speaker 2: in for like other stuff that you know could be 130 00:06:54,400 --> 00:06:57,200 Speaker 2: treated pretty easily. But then suddenly if it's like okay, well, 131 00:06:57,200 --> 00:07:00,960 Speaker 2: my hospital is now a hostile space. Just like, stop 132 00:07:01,200 --> 00:07:03,800 Speaker 2: going in all together until something really serious happens. I 133 00:07:03,800 --> 00:07:06,760 Speaker 2: could have been prevented. Eve the hospital wasn't paying assholes 134 00:07:06,800 --> 00:07:07,600 Speaker 2: to them, like. 135 00:07:09,360 --> 00:07:11,480 Speaker 4: You know, I think the fear is what we're going 136 00:07:11,560 --> 00:07:15,480 Speaker 4: to see as the side effects or the consequences of this. 137 00:07:15,640 --> 00:07:19,080 Speaker 4: You know, we've been told by our supervisors or management 138 00:07:19,080 --> 00:07:23,520 Speaker 4: at UPMC that we should expect an influx of suicidal 139 00:07:23,720 --> 00:07:26,640 Speaker 4: teenagers or young adults, teenagers who are struggling with greater 140 00:07:27,000 --> 00:07:31,800 Speaker 4: symptoms of depression or even psychosis, like acute psychotic symptoms 141 00:07:31,880 --> 00:07:35,000 Speaker 4: are a studied side effect of abruptly. 142 00:07:34,600 --> 00:07:35,880 Speaker 3: Coming off your hormone. 143 00:07:35,960 --> 00:07:37,840 Speaker 4: So not only do you now have these teens and 144 00:07:37,920 --> 00:07:40,760 Speaker 4: young adults who will be scared to access their care, 145 00:07:40,880 --> 00:07:43,720 Speaker 4: feel like they can't use their name, their pronouns get 146 00:07:43,760 --> 00:07:46,600 Speaker 4: the care that they need, but they're struggling with mental 147 00:07:46,640 --> 00:07:50,480 Speaker 4: health crises that are due to the changes that we're 148 00:07:50,480 --> 00:07:52,440 Speaker 4: seeing due to the withdrawal of their healthcare. 149 00:07:52,560 --> 00:07:54,320 Speaker 3: So you're seeing this in so many. 150 00:07:54,160 --> 00:07:58,280 Speaker 4: Different aspects hitting them and then the providers in this 151 00:07:58,320 --> 00:08:01,240 Speaker 4: hospital system, and I'm sure we're this all over the country. 152 00:08:01,520 --> 00:08:04,160 Speaker 4: The providers are here to pick up what's happening. That's 153 00:08:04,200 --> 00:08:07,880 Speaker 4: a decision based on administrative opinions. And like we said before, 154 00:08:07,920 --> 00:08:09,760 Speaker 4: fear so. 155 00:08:09,920 --> 00:08:10,400 Speaker 6: That was shuit. 156 00:08:10,480 --> 00:08:12,360 Speaker 2: A hospital admin told you that that was what was 157 00:08:12,400 --> 00:08:13,080 Speaker 2: going to happen. 158 00:08:13,520 --> 00:08:17,040 Speaker 4: So basically after this went into place, I work in 159 00:08:17,040 --> 00:08:20,640 Speaker 4: a suicide prevention clinic, so we were told by the 160 00:08:20,640 --> 00:08:23,840 Speaker 4: people that we work with to be ready and st 161 00:08:24,000 --> 00:08:26,520 Speaker 4: start having meetings and having discussions around how to better 162 00:08:26,560 --> 00:08:30,840 Speaker 4: support these kids, knowing that through research we've found that 163 00:08:31,040 --> 00:08:35,000 Speaker 4: coming off of hormones can cause increased risk of suicidal thoughts, psychosis, 164 00:08:35,040 --> 00:08:35,640 Speaker 4: and depression. 165 00:08:36,440 --> 00:08:39,120 Speaker 3: Sure as fuck does that, yes, and. 166 00:08:39,040 --> 00:08:41,360 Speaker 4: So it's like physical side effects, but also if you're 167 00:08:41,760 --> 00:08:44,920 Speaker 4: forced to detransition, you're going to be physically unsafe in 168 00:08:44,960 --> 00:08:47,520 Speaker 4: a space where you're no longer maybe passing, or you're 169 00:08:47,559 --> 00:08:49,240 Speaker 4: no longer able to be yourself, so you're a greater 170 00:08:49,360 --> 00:08:52,200 Speaker 4: risk of harassment and bullying, which then in turn can 171 00:08:52,280 --> 00:08:54,080 Speaker 4: cause higher risks of suicidal thoughts. 172 00:08:54,760 --> 00:08:57,640 Speaker 2: It's just like so hideous that there's people like you 173 00:08:57,679 --> 00:09:00,400 Speaker 2: in the hospital system who can just tell them that 174 00:09:00,440 --> 00:09:02,760 Speaker 2: this is going to happen, and they're doing it anyways. 175 00:09:03,240 --> 00:09:05,439 Speaker 4: It's hard because it's coming down so many layers, right, 176 00:09:05,440 --> 00:09:07,679 Speaker 4: So we're hearing it maybe from our direct management, whose 177 00:09:07,720 --> 00:09:09,839 Speaker 4: hearts are in the best place. They didn't make these decisions, 178 00:09:10,240 --> 00:09:12,520 Speaker 4: but where they're being told to follow up our management 179 00:09:12,559 --> 00:09:14,960 Speaker 4: who are making these decisions. And yes, because they were 180 00:09:15,040 --> 00:09:17,600 Speaker 4: in the hospital, they know the implications of it. But 181 00:09:17,679 --> 00:09:20,160 Speaker 4: the fear is outweighing the risks, and that's what we're 182 00:09:20,160 --> 00:09:21,120 Speaker 4: trying to fight against. 183 00:09:21,760 --> 00:09:24,000 Speaker 2: The lightest possible response that I have to this is 184 00:09:24,040 --> 00:09:27,080 Speaker 2: I'm thinking about that Lord Farquatt line from Shrek, where 185 00:09:27,080 --> 00:09:28,920 Speaker 2: you go some of you may die, but that's a 186 00:09:28,960 --> 00:09:30,120 Speaker 2: sacrifice I'm willing to make. 187 00:09:30,200 --> 00:09:32,520 Speaker 7: It's like these house to alignments are literally doing that. 188 00:09:32,920 --> 00:09:35,000 Speaker 2: They're like, yeah, no, some of these kids may die, 189 00:09:35,000 --> 00:09:37,400 Speaker 2: but like whatever, that's fine. I don't have to deal 190 00:09:37,440 --> 00:09:41,400 Speaker 2: with like maybe a lawsuit in like three years. 191 00:09:41,880 --> 00:09:45,560 Speaker 8: But they will absolutely still have to deal with lawsuits. 192 00:09:45,679 --> 00:09:47,440 Speaker 5: Yep, yep. At the end of the day. 193 00:09:47,800 --> 00:09:52,120 Speaker 8: These are people's basic human rights. So there will be 194 00:09:52,200 --> 00:09:56,920 Speaker 8: lawsuits that happened because of that. Again, what the president 195 00:09:56,960 --> 00:09:59,560 Speaker 8: did was not fall at all whatsoever. It was just 196 00:09:59,600 --> 00:10:02,200 Speaker 8: such a to say, hey, this is something that we 197 00:10:02,280 --> 00:10:05,199 Speaker 8: should do. This is not nothing that he can actually 198 00:10:05,280 --> 00:10:07,840 Speaker 8: put into law. So what they're doing is opreum. 199 00:10:08,760 --> 00:10:11,319 Speaker 6: The fans are sufficient to see what they can get 200 00:10:11,320 --> 00:10:13,559 Speaker 6: away with and what they can't get away with. This 201 00:10:13,640 --> 00:10:16,400 Speaker 6: is all about hav an autonomy over our healthcare and 202 00:10:16,520 --> 00:10:17,960 Speaker 6: our body at. 203 00:10:17,800 --> 00:10:18,520 Speaker 5: The end of the day. 204 00:10:18,559 --> 00:10:22,199 Speaker 6: And they're starting with the most vulnerable population of people, 205 00:10:22,240 --> 00:10:23,679 Speaker 6: which are trans youth. 206 00:10:24,640 --> 00:10:27,000 Speaker 4: Yeah, they're just testing, right, This is a test to 207 00:10:27,000 --> 00:10:28,280 Speaker 4: see what else they can get away with. 208 00:10:28,640 --> 00:10:32,199 Speaker 6: Absolutely, this is the test, and they're failing miserably. And 209 00:10:32,320 --> 00:10:35,480 Speaker 6: instead of fighting them back, you want to fight us back. 210 00:10:35,679 --> 00:10:37,719 Speaker 6: Instead of standing up and saying we're not going to 211 00:10:37,800 --> 00:10:40,400 Speaker 6: do this because it's not going to stop this. Transciits 212 00:10:40,400 --> 00:10:42,920 Speaker 6: this and never stop with trans people at all, whatsoever. 213 00:10:43,160 --> 00:10:44,600 Speaker 5: It starts with trans people. 214 00:10:45,559 --> 00:10:46,600 Speaker 3: And DTA makes a good point. 215 00:10:46,679 --> 00:10:49,480 Speaker 4: I mean, I know, Miya, you aren't based out of Pennsylvania, 216 00:10:49,520 --> 00:10:52,959 Speaker 4: but in Pennsylvania, gender firming care remains legal from a 217 00:10:53,000 --> 00:10:55,560 Speaker 4: state level, and the city of Pittsburgh, which we are 218 00:10:55,559 --> 00:10:58,480 Speaker 4: located in, has been working really hard to protect trans youth. 219 00:10:59,040 --> 00:11:01,400 Speaker 4: So the executive order that was put in placed by 220 00:11:01,440 --> 00:11:05,720 Speaker 4: Trump one is not a federal law and two is 221 00:11:05,760 --> 00:11:08,400 Speaker 4: not at all supported by state or city wide laws. 222 00:11:08,440 --> 00:11:11,240 Speaker 4: So from a legal standpoint, you know what we've learned 223 00:11:11,240 --> 00:11:13,320 Speaker 4: from consulting with people like Diana who have been doing 224 00:11:13,320 --> 00:11:15,760 Speaker 4: this work much longer than we have. We've talked with 225 00:11:15,760 --> 00:11:18,720 Speaker 4: our local ACLU and other government organizations that this would 226 00:11:18,720 --> 00:11:21,600 Speaker 4: not hold up in court. So you know, that's why 227 00:11:21,600 --> 00:11:23,560 Speaker 4: the fight I think is starting here and hoping to 228 00:11:23,600 --> 00:11:24,120 Speaker 4: get bigger. 229 00:11:25,200 --> 00:11:28,120 Speaker 2: Yeah, A lot of the way this administration does stuff 230 00:11:28,280 --> 00:11:31,760 Speaker 2: is just by like writing it down on paper and 231 00:11:31,800 --> 00:11:34,160 Speaker 2: then hoping that they can just sort of shock and 232 00:11:34,280 --> 00:11:38,320 Speaker 2: awe terror people into complying. But like, if you don't comply, 233 00:11:38,520 --> 00:11:42,160 Speaker 2: they can't make you. Like it's you know, I mean 234 00:11:42,200 --> 00:11:43,880 Speaker 2: this is only so, this is only you've seen across 235 00:11:43,920 --> 00:11:46,960 Speaker 2: issue areas, right, Like, if people don't comply with ice agents, 236 00:11:46,960 --> 00:11:48,920 Speaker 2: it suddenly becomes incredibly hard for them to just like 237 00:11:48,960 --> 00:11:52,840 Speaker 2: carry on massyportations. If people don't comply with their hospital crackdowns, 238 00:11:52,840 --> 00:11:54,920 Speaker 2: it's actually really hard for them to stop kids and 239 00:11:54,920 --> 00:11:59,160 Speaker 2: getting gender affirming care. But if you give up, then yeah, 240 00:11:59,200 --> 00:12:00,480 Speaker 2: it's really easy, see. 241 00:12:01,040 --> 00:12:05,160 Speaker 3: Right, right, giving up before the fight really starts. 242 00:12:05,679 --> 00:12:09,120 Speaker 8: Yeah, at some level of this, this is what they want, 243 00:12:09,120 --> 00:12:11,640 Speaker 8: You're okay with it, you know, because the dolls don't 244 00:12:11,679 --> 00:12:14,480 Speaker 8: really matter, Like, no, it doesn't matter which way it goes. 245 00:12:14,720 --> 00:12:15,920 Speaker 5: That we really want to fight it now. 246 00:12:15,960 --> 00:12:18,240 Speaker 8: We all want this a small group of people, we're 247 00:12:18,280 --> 00:12:18,920 Speaker 8: not going to fight it. 248 00:12:18,960 --> 00:12:21,079 Speaker 5: And if they fight it and they win, then we'll 249 00:12:21,120 --> 00:12:22,160 Speaker 5: give it back. Whatever. 250 00:12:23,120 --> 00:12:27,360 Speaker 6: Again, they have armies of lawyers UPMC has armies of 251 00:12:27,559 --> 00:12:31,640 Speaker 6: lawyers that can really go and really attack this from 252 00:12:31,679 --> 00:12:35,760 Speaker 6: all different angles. Bring in community ad kids, bring together 253 00:12:35,960 --> 00:12:38,920 Speaker 6: all these you know, the Woman's Lot Project, ACL you, 254 00:12:39,160 --> 00:12:41,720 Speaker 6: all these different folks that come in with them and 255 00:12:41,800 --> 00:12:45,960 Speaker 6: really hammer it to this administration. But they choose to 256 00:12:46,559 --> 00:12:49,240 Speaker 6: not do that and choose to be complicit in the 257 00:12:49,360 --> 00:12:49,959 Speaker 6: bull craft. 258 00:12:50,520 --> 00:12:53,800 Speaker 2: Yeah, okay, so we unfortunately need to go to ads. 259 00:12:53,920 --> 00:12:56,439 Speaker 2: When we come back, we will talk about how we're 260 00:12:56,480 --> 00:13:03,480 Speaker 2: going to fight back. Yeah, it would be great. We 261 00:13:03,760 --> 00:13:08,760 Speaker 2: are backed so remarkably quickly after this stuff all started. 262 00:13:09,160 --> 00:13:13,240 Speaker 2: There's a pretty large protest, like outside of the hospital 263 00:13:13,280 --> 00:13:15,200 Speaker 2: to get them to stop doing this. Can you talk 264 00:13:15,200 --> 00:13:18,520 Speaker 2: about how this all sort of started to come together 265 00:13:18,600 --> 00:13:20,480 Speaker 2: and how these efforts got organized. 266 00:13:20,880 --> 00:13:24,480 Speaker 6: So I started hearing rumbles about this in December and 267 00:13:24,559 --> 00:13:27,920 Speaker 6: in January, you know, once he got it into office 268 00:13:27,920 --> 00:13:31,680 Speaker 6: and things, and you know, immediately he signed the exxective order. 269 00:13:31,960 --> 00:13:35,199 Speaker 6: I think like a little bit after that, and by 270 00:13:35,280 --> 00:13:39,480 Speaker 6: April we start activating and figuring out what we wanted 271 00:13:39,520 --> 00:13:44,080 Speaker 6: to do because UPMC had made that first directive to 272 00:13:44,160 --> 00:13:46,400 Speaker 6: not accept anymore on trans youth. 273 00:13:46,240 --> 00:13:49,560 Speaker 8: At all, whatsoever, you think young adults, anyone under the 274 00:13:49,600 --> 00:13:50,360 Speaker 8: age of nineteen. 275 00:13:51,200 --> 00:13:53,600 Speaker 5: So we did our first action in April. 276 00:13:53,720 --> 00:13:57,280 Speaker 6: I may start following up getting information out to disseminate 277 00:13:57,320 --> 00:14:01,280 Speaker 6: the right information out to community members and doing all 278 00:14:01,320 --> 00:14:04,320 Speaker 6: of the behind the scenes work connecting folks to the 279 00:14:04,360 --> 00:14:07,280 Speaker 6: necessary resources that they need. So we could, you know, 280 00:14:07,440 --> 00:14:09,640 Speaker 6: start fighting back at UPMC. 281 00:14:11,280 --> 00:14:12,160 Speaker 3: Loan behold to us. 282 00:14:12,240 --> 00:14:14,240 Speaker 4: Dina and trans Uniting have been doing a lot of 283 00:14:14,280 --> 00:14:15,840 Speaker 4: work to kind of set the stage for us to 284 00:14:15,840 --> 00:14:19,240 Speaker 4: get involved, which is really awesome. We were made aware 285 00:14:19,240 --> 00:14:23,080 Speaker 4: of what's going on with UPMC well after, you know, 286 00:14:23,320 --> 00:14:25,400 Speaker 4: Dina and some of the community members have been so 287 00:14:26,360 --> 00:14:28,680 Speaker 4: I believe it was early June, maybe end of May. 288 00:14:29,000 --> 00:14:32,720 Speaker 4: Some of my really amazing coworkers and I decided, you know, 289 00:14:32,760 --> 00:14:34,960 Speaker 4: we can't really just sit back and do nothing. And 290 00:14:35,000 --> 00:14:36,560 Speaker 4: I think at the clinic I work in, there was 291 00:14:36,600 --> 00:14:39,360 Speaker 4: a big feeling of helplessness. You know, what can we do? 292 00:14:39,640 --> 00:14:41,800 Speaker 4: How do we fight back on our bosses. You know, 293 00:14:41,880 --> 00:14:46,480 Speaker 4: we were feeling stuck, and we are a suicide prevention clinic. 294 00:14:46,480 --> 00:14:49,200 Speaker 4: We're not specifically a gender clinic, but because we know 295 00:14:49,280 --> 00:14:51,320 Speaker 4: that there's a high proportion of trans and gay youth 296 00:14:51,360 --> 00:14:53,480 Speaker 4: who are at risk of suicide in the general population, 297 00:14:53,560 --> 00:14:55,840 Speaker 4: we work with a lot of trans youth. So we 298 00:14:55,840 --> 00:14:58,920 Speaker 4: were seeing this impact us directly in the sense of 299 00:14:58,960 --> 00:15:01,880 Speaker 4: the work that we do. So some of my coworkers 300 00:15:02,360 --> 00:15:06,080 Speaker 4: wrote a letter to UPMC explaining the way that we're 301 00:15:06,080 --> 00:15:09,520 Speaker 4: feeling about this, asking them to reverse this decision. The 302 00:15:09,600 --> 00:15:12,760 Speaker 4: letter discussed several local laws and state laws that would 303 00:15:12,760 --> 00:15:15,400 Speaker 4: protect them as well as hit them where they hurt, 304 00:15:15,440 --> 00:15:17,600 Speaker 4: as far as discussing the money that they have and 305 00:15:17,640 --> 00:15:20,160 Speaker 4: the available funds they have to fight this. The letter 306 00:15:20,400 --> 00:15:23,280 Speaker 4: was incredibly assigned by almost four hundred actually, I think 307 00:15:23,320 --> 00:15:25,760 Speaker 4: at this point over four hundred staff at the hospital 308 00:15:25,760 --> 00:15:26,480 Speaker 4: system we work it. 309 00:15:27,080 --> 00:15:27,800 Speaker 3: It's amazing. 310 00:15:28,000 --> 00:15:31,080 Speaker 4: Yes, And while this letter was being drafted, some of 311 00:15:31,120 --> 00:15:35,160 Speaker 4: my coworkers met with consultants through the ACLU and other 312 00:15:35,280 --> 00:15:38,560 Speaker 4: local organizations to one make sure what we were doing 313 00:15:38,880 --> 00:15:43,040 Speaker 4: was okay, that we were not jeopardizing too much of 314 00:15:43,080 --> 00:15:46,400 Speaker 4: our own safety as far as employment goes, but also 315 00:15:46,440 --> 00:15:49,200 Speaker 4: to get their opinions and start to rally organizations. So 316 00:15:49,240 --> 00:15:51,920 Speaker 4: the ACLU is to put us in touch with Dina 317 00:15:51,960 --> 00:15:55,840 Speaker 4: and Transuniting, and Dina jumped on it. In less than 318 00:15:55,880 --> 00:16:00,720 Speaker 4: two weeks, she and her coworkers had created built up 319 00:16:01,000 --> 00:16:03,040 Speaker 4: a rally for us, which we had outside of the 320 00:16:03,080 --> 00:16:06,720 Speaker 4: UPMC building downtown just a couple of weeks ago, and 321 00:16:07,080 --> 00:16:09,960 Speaker 4: we had local lawmakers speak. I spoke along with my 322 00:16:09,960 --> 00:16:12,520 Speaker 4: coworkers who helped write the letter being spoken to. You know, 323 00:16:12,520 --> 00:16:13,960 Speaker 4: if you want to speak more of about rally, I 324 00:16:13,960 --> 00:16:14,720 Speaker 4: think that'd be awesome. 325 00:16:15,360 --> 00:16:15,640 Speaker 5: Sure. 326 00:16:15,760 --> 00:16:17,320 Speaker 6: I just want to say, this is what a ship 327 00:16:17,360 --> 00:16:20,560 Speaker 6: feels like, you know, accomplices in the fight against this, 328 00:16:20,760 --> 00:16:23,760 Speaker 6: you know, heinous crime, because this is exactly what it is. 329 00:16:23,880 --> 00:16:26,320 Speaker 5: You know, it's an attack on trans Last. 330 00:16:26,440 --> 00:16:30,160 Speaker 8: But we broke a lot of folks together, community members, 331 00:16:30,240 --> 00:16:33,720 Speaker 8: politicians and workers from UPMC all together. 332 00:16:34,040 --> 00:16:36,600 Speaker 5: We had about three hundred and some folks that showed up. 333 00:16:37,120 --> 00:16:41,160 Speaker 6: We were on the steps of UPMC's headquarters in downtown Pittsburgh, 334 00:16:41,520 --> 00:16:45,360 Speaker 6: and we also coordinated with some state wife folks that 335 00:16:45,760 --> 00:16:49,160 Speaker 6: are actually doing a couple of actions throughout this month. 336 00:16:49,200 --> 00:16:52,280 Speaker 6: But they there were two actions that happened that same 337 00:16:52,360 --> 00:16:56,680 Speaker 6: day as well, and you know, what is happening is 338 00:16:56,680 --> 00:16:58,160 Speaker 6: not right, so we had to make sure that the 339 00:16:58,200 --> 00:17:02,360 Speaker 6: community is being educated and we're activating community members at 340 00:17:02,400 --> 00:17:04,399 Speaker 6: the same time, you know, I also wanted them to 341 00:17:04,480 --> 00:17:07,280 Speaker 6: know about this fund that we were launching to help 342 00:17:07,440 --> 00:17:10,879 Speaker 6: the kiddos in this situation, because folks. 343 00:17:10,600 --> 00:17:12,600 Speaker 5: Are still going to need to you know, be. 344 00:17:12,600 --> 00:17:14,960 Speaker 6: Able to access some type of health care, so you know, 345 00:17:15,040 --> 00:17:17,760 Speaker 6: making sure that they are aware of their options and 346 00:17:17,800 --> 00:17:20,719 Speaker 6: making sure they're able to have funds to do so, 347 00:17:21,040 --> 00:17:23,960 Speaker 6: because you know, with everything happening, they are probably going 348 00:17:24,000 --> 00:17:26,960 Speaker 6: to get cut off of their health care insurance as well, 349 00:17:27,640 --> 00:17:30,119 Speaker 6: you know, and that is a real scare and if 350 00:17:30,160 --> 00:17:34,240 Speaker 6: that happens, then what you know, So that was kind 351 00:17:34,280 --> 00:17:37,240 Speaker 6: of what happened with that situation, and it was amazing, 352 00:17:37,440 --> 00:17:39,040 Speaker 6: you know, everybody was amazing. 353 00:17:39,080 --> 00:17:41,800 Speaker 5: But I just you know, definitely want to shout. 354 00:17:41,520 --> 00:17:45,920 Speaker 8: Out to and our whole team because listen, we need 355 00:17:45,960 --> 00:17:47,920 Speaker 8: more accomplices like that in this fight. 356 00:17:48,119 --> 00:17:48,920 Speaker 5: You know, we are a. 357 00:17:48,880 --> 00:17:52,000 Speaker 6: Small but mighty community and we will not be able 358 00:17:52,040 --> 00:17:54,720 Speaker 6: to get the things done that needs to be done 359 00:17:54,760 --> 00:17:57,080 Speaker 6: to protect not just us, but all of us if 360 00:17:57,080 --> 00:17:58,240 Speaker 6: we're not all united. 361 00:17:59,000 --> 00:18:00,000 Speaker 3: Yeah, thank you. 362 00:18:00,240 --> 00:18:02,280 Speaker 4: I mean, we couldn't do it without you, guys, and 363 00:18:02,320 --> 00:18:05,080 Speaker 4: the power you've felt and the beautiful voices that you 364 00:18:05,119 --> 00:18:05,760 Speaker 4: bring to the fight. 365 00:18:05,800 --> 00:18:06,720 Speaker 3: It's truly awesome. 366 00:18:07,480 --> 00:18:09,480 Speaker 2: I think one of the things that we're seeing from this, 367 00:18:09,600 --> 00:18:12,280 Speaker 2: and you know that we've seen from all of the 368 00:18:12,280 --> 00:18:16,080 Speaker 2: anti trans repression is that like, on the one hand, yeah, 369 00:18:16,200 --> 00:18:18,320 Speaker 2: trans people are like one and a half percent of 370 00:18:18,320 --> 00:18:22,760 Speaker 2: the population, and we're disapportionately like the most broke and 371 00:18:22,800 --> 00:18:24,680 Speaker 2: fucked up percentage of that population. 372 00:18:26,040 --> 00:18:29,480 Speaker 7: And also we are significantly better organizers, like person for 373 00:18:29,520 --> 00:18:32,760 Speaker 7: a person than all of the people fighting us. It's like, yeah, 374 00:18:32,800 --> 00:18:37,080 Speaker 7: like they have unbelievable amounts of resources. However, Comma, we 375 00:18:37,119 --> 00:18:38,320 Speaker 7: are really good at like. 376 00:18:38,560 --> 00:18:41,359 Speaker 2: This specific thing of organizing and fighting back. 377 00:18:41,480 --> 00:18:44,119 Speaker 4: And yeah, well sadly, like trans people have had to 378 00:18:44,160 --> 00:18:47,160 Speaker 4: fight for so long, they've learned to do it. 379 00:18:47,600 --> 00:18:49,320 Speaker 3: And their loved ones, man, they were there. 380 00:18:49,320 --> 00:18:50,880 Speaker 4: When we were at the rally a couple of weeks ago, 381 00:18:50,920 --> 00:18:53,520 Speaker 4: I had parents of trans kids hugging me, you know, 382 00:18:53,640 --> 00:18:56,240 Speaker 4: like they show up and they fight for their people, 383 00:18:56,359 --> 00:18:57,800 Speaker 4: and it's really empowering. 384 00:18:58,760 --> 00:19:01,000 Speaker 9: We don't have that choice but to do that, you know, 385 00:19:01,160 --> 00:19:02,840 Speaker 9: we don't have that choice, but to show we don't 386 00:19:02,840 --> 00:19:05,119 Speaker 9: have that choice but to fight, because we had to 387 00:19:05,240 --> 00:19:08,320 Speaker 9: all of our lives in order to, you know, continue 388 00:19:08,359 --> 00:19:10,399 Speaker 9: to walk in our truth, you know. 389 00:19:11,320 --> 00:19:13,040 Speaker 2: Yeah, and like I mean, you know, I could talk 390 00:19:13,040 --> 00:19:15,120 Speaker 2: about sort of the structural factors that make that true, 391 00:19:15,119 --> 00:19:19,000 Speaker 2: but there's also just if you're gonna be trands at 392 00:19:19,080 --> 00:19:23,720 Speaker 2: some point you have to choose to accept it, and 393 00:19:23,920 --> 00:19:25,960 Speaker 2: like the fact that it's an identity that like you 394 00:19:26,080 --> 00:19:28,240 Speaker 2: have to make a choice to be like I'm gonna 395 00:19:28,280 --> 00:19:31,800 Speaker 2: fucking do this and like, Okay, I am this person 396 00:19:31,800 --> 00:19:33,720 Speaker 2: that I've always known that I am, etcetera, et cetera. 397 00:19:33,800 --> 00:19:36,600 Speaker 2: I think they're also just like it selects for like 398 00:19:36,640 --> 00:19:38,600 Speaker 2: a small extent for people who are willing to just 399 00:19:38,680 --> 00:19:43,040 Speaker 2: like fuck it, let's go. And I don't know, that's 400 00:19:43,080 --> 00:19:45,600 Speaker 2: been the thing I've always like appreciated about the way 401 00:19:45,600 --> 00:19:55,000 Speaker 2: that like these kind of organizing efforts unfold there. Okay, 402 00:19:55,000 --> 00:19:57,960 Speaker 2: so let's talk about what the reaction has been to 403 00:19:58,119 --> 00:20:01,399 Speaker 2: the protest, to the actions both from the hospital and 404 00:20:01,440 --> 00:20:02,760 Speaker 2: from the community at large. 405 00:20:03,240 --> 00:20:05,000 Speaker 4: Looking at both of those things, I guess one of 406 00:20:05,000 --> 00:20:07,640 Speaker 4: the coolest reactions we're seeing is a lot of people 407 00:20:08,320 --> 00:20:10,560 Speaker 4: coming out in solidarity who. 408 00:20:10,400 --> 00:20:12,000 Speaker 3: Work at the hospital system. 409 00:20:12,200 --> 00:20:15,919 Speaker 4: So the people who originally wrote the letter, who were 410 00:20:15,960 --> 00:20:18,840 Speaker 4: part of this rally, we are trying to organize more 411 00:20:18,880 --> 00:20:23,040 Speaker 4: community meetings, more town halls, contacting people through email, and 412 00:20:23,119 --> 00:20:24,919 Speaker 4: Dina has been very involved in that along with some 413 00:20:24,960 --> 00:20:28,600 Speaker 4: other local organizations. But the word is spreading and we're 414 00:20:28,680 --> 00:20:30,760 Speaker 4: getting in touch with a lot of people in a 415 00:20:30,840 --> 00:20:34,160 Speaker 4: lot of different departments throughout the hospital who are here 416 00:20:34,240 --> 00:20:35,160 Speaker 4: and want to show up. 417 00:20:35,200 --> 00:20:36,160 Speaker 3: You know, we're seeing. 418 00:20:36,119 --> 00:20:40,399 Speaker 4: Physicians, social workers. UPMC is also, of course a massive 419 00:20:40,400 --> 00:20:43,040 Speaker 4: insurance conglomerate, and we're seeing people who work in the 420 00:20:43,040 --> 00:20:45,840 Speaker 4: insurance side of things come out to support this. So 421 00:20:45,920 --> 00:20:49,560 Speaker 4: that's been really amazing as far as what things are 422 00:20:49,600 --> 00:20:54,800 Speaker 4: looking like. As administration feedback, we are being told the 423 00:20:54,840 --> 00:20:58,400 Speaker 4: same response repeatedly that UPMC is doing what they have 424 00:20:58,480 --> 00:21:01,840 Speaker 4: to do to quote unquote abide with the law, and 425 00:21:01,840 --> 00:21:04,639 Speaker 4: they're making the decisions that they are making because of 426 00:21:04,680 --> 00:21:08,200 Speaker 4: the quote unquote law, and they will continue to offer 427 00:21:08,720 --> 00:21:12,399 Speaker 4: behavioral health support to trans youth and young adults to 428 00:21:12,440 --> 00:21:16,200 Speaker 4: support them through this crisis. So, you know, we are 429 00:21:16,240 --> 00:21:17,800 Speaker 4: trying to meet together and talk a lot about what 430 00:21:17,800 --> 00:21:20,760 Speaker 4: that means. Of course, there is some fear of will 431 00:21:20,760 --> 00:21:23,399 Speaker 4: that be stripped away. You know, we actually saw not 432 00:21:24,240 --> 00:21:26,640 Speaker 4: that long ago. I think it was only last week 433 00:21:26,720 --> 00:21:29,320 Speaker 4: that you know, Ohio they built into their state budget 434 00:21:29,359 --> 00:21:32,760 Speaker 4: that Medicaid can no longer cover quote unquote transaffirming therapy. 435 00:21:33,440 --> 00:21:34,320 Speaker 3: So this isn't. 436 00:21:34,080 --> 00:21:37,440 Speaker 4: Even puberty blockers, it's not hormones. It's talk therapy. 437 00:21:37,600 --> 00:21:38,720 Speaker 3: And what will that mean? 438 00:21:38,880 --> 00:21:41,200 Speaker 4: You know, we hope that we're protected here in Pennsylvania, 439 00:21:41,240 --> 00:21:43,240 Speaker 4: but there's always risks that this can come into place 440 00:21:43,280 --> 00:21:46,160 Speaker 4: at a federal level. So these talking points that they're 441 00:21:46,200 --> 00:21:49,080 Speaker 4: sticking to, it's not too black and white as they're 442 00:21:49,080 --> 00:21:51,680 Speaker 4: presenting it. You know, they're not abiding with any certain law. 443 00:21:52,119 --> 00:21:54,360 Speaker 4: We don't know that therapy is protected. But that's what's 444 00:21:54,400 --> 00:21:56,680 Speaker 4: kind of they're sticking to. And that's just what's repeatedly 445 00:21:56,720 --> 00:22:00,680 Speaker 4: being stated throughout various press contacts because that are being 446 00:22:00,680 --> 00:22:01,760 Speaker 4: made through the hospital. 447 00:22:03,240 --> 00:22:04,800 Speaker 5: They're doing whatever the fuck they want to do. 448 00:22:04,960 --> 00:22:08,560 Speaker 3: Yeah, to put it lightly, yeah, yeah, this. 449 00:22:08,440 --> 00:22:11,840 Speaker 8: Is what's happening, and we just have to continue to 450 00:22:11,880 --> 00:22:14,320 Speaker 8: fight because they want to take us back to the 451 00:22:14,400 --> 00:22:16,119 Speaker 8: nineteen fifties and. 452 00:22:16,320 --> 00:22:18,720 Speaker 6: That's not going to happen. That's not going to happen 453 00:22:18,720 --> 00:22:21,320 Speaker 6: at all whatsoever. This ain't nineteen fifty. 454 00:22:21,480 --> 00:22:24,560 Speaker 8: This is twenty twenty five, and you can take away 455 00:22:25,040 --> 00:22:25,800 Speaker 8: all you want to. 456 00:22:26,400 --> 00:22:27,960 Speaker 5: We're going to fight and we're going to put it 457 00:22:28,000 --> 00:22:28,480 Speaker 5: back in place. 458 00:22:28,520 --> 00:22:31,000 Speaker 8: A lot of times it is so much harder to 459 00:22:31,080 --> 00:22:33,399 Speaker 8: take things away and try to get them back. 460 00:22:33,600 --> 00:22:37,280 Speaker 6: But you know, unfortunately we're here and a lot of 461 00:22:37,320 --> 00:22:41,359 Speaker 6: Americans didn't think that we would be in this predicament. 462 00:22:42,119 --> 00:22:44,600 Speaker 6: It's not going to get nothing but worse. So hopefully 463 00:22:44,640 --> 00:22:47,840 Speaker 6: it opens up people's ass and we have to unite 464 00:22:47,840 --> 00:22:48,359 Speaker 6: as a people. 465 00:22:48,400 --> 00:22:51,800 Speaker 5: That's it. That's it, That's all around all of these issues. 466 00:22:51,840 --> 00:22:54,679 Speaker 6: There's so much happening, so much being thrown on us 467 00:22:54,720 --> 00:22:58,560 Speaker 6: at one time, but we have to unite as minority 468 00:22:58,640 --> 00:23:04,359 Speaker 6: people or we will be in a place like nineteen fifties, 469 00:23:04,400 --> 00:23:06,960 Speaker 6: because I mean we broughtbly be in a great depression 470 00:23:07,119 --> 00:23:09,240 Speaker 6: Bay January, we will be in a great depression. 471 00:23:09,640 --> 00:23:10,520 Speaker 5: Everybody, get ready? 472 00:23:10,800 --> 00:23:14,440 Speaker 6: Hope you got your a good Yeah? 473 00:23:14,480 --> 00:23:16,480 Speaker 2: Well, I think there's there's another element of this too, 474 00:23:16,480 --> 00:23:19,160 Speaker 2: which is that like you can look at them doing 475 00:23:19,200 --> 00:23:21,520 Speaker 2: a like, oh, we're just following orders thing, but there's 476 00:23:21,520 --> 00:23:23,920 Speaker 2: no actual orders, which makes it even more pathetic than 477 00:23:23,920 --> 00:23:26,879 Speaker 2: like the original We're just following orders people, which again, 478 00:23:26,960 --> 00:23:29,760 Speaker 2: and I want to note this, just following orders did 479 00:23:29,800 --> 00:23:32,399 Speaker 2: not prevent you from being tried at Nuremberg, like that 480 00:23:32,520 --> 00:23:36,880 Speaker 2: was found to not be a defense, so like right, 481 00:23:37,240 --> 00:23:38,879 Speaker 2: remembering of where that went down here Strey. But the 482 00:23:38,880 --> 00:23:41,000 Speaker 2: second thing too, is like in terms of like there 483 00:23:41,000 --> 00:23:42,960 Speaker 2: being so many different things where like everyone needs to 484 00:23:42,960 --> 00:23:46,120 Speaker 2: sort of pull together and fight this the other advantage 485 00:23:46,160 --> 00:23:49,480 Speaker 2: that we have that's different from like thirties Nazi Germany, right, 486 00:23:49,760 --> 00:23:53,840 Speaker 2: Like this stuff is all really unpopular, like everyone hates it, 487 00:23:53,920 --> 00:23:56,680 Speaker 2: everyone hates trump Is approval ratings are terrible. The proof 488 00:23:56,760 --> 00:23:58,720 Speaker 2: rings for everything he's doing across the bord are just 489 00:23:58,760 --> 00:24:01,879 Speaker 2: really bad. The thing about the Nazis was that, like 490 00:24:03,560 --> 00:24:05,680 Speaker 2: Nazi Germany, people. 491 00:24:05,600 --> 00:24:07,520 Speaker 5: Wanted they were utified. 492 00:24:08,160 --> 00:24:09,800 Speaker 2: Yeah, like at least to some extent, they were able 493 00:24:09,840 --> 00:24:11,240 Speaker 2: to smash, like, you know, they were able to sort 494 00:24:11,240 --> 00:24:13,840 Speaker 2: of wipe out everyone who was supposing them, like significant 495 00:24:13,840 --> 00:24:16,120 Speaker 2: portions of the population wanted all of that shit to happen. 496 00:24:16,320 --> 00:24:19,040 Speaker 2: And then it's just not true here, right, And you know, 497 00:24:19,119 --> 00:24:20,960 Speaker 2: our job is to make sure that like the fact 498 00:24:20,960 --> 00:24:23,639 Speaker 2: that nobody wants the shit to happen actually turns into it, 499 00:24:23,720 --> 00:24:28,320 Speaker 2: not happening instead of just you know, this unhinged autocratic 500 00:24:28,920 --> 00:24:32,280 Speaker 2: like you're king is like writing decrees on piece of 501 00:24:32,320 --> 00:24:35,040 Speaker 2: paper and suddenly hospitals are following them even though there's 502 00:24:35,080 --> 00:24:35,920 Speaker 2: just nothing. 503 00:24:37,080 --> 00:24:40,359 Speaker 8: Nothing that's a bobo crap. But again, and we just 504 00:24:40,400 --> 00:24:41,440 Speaker 8: have to band together. 505 00:24:41,880 --> 00:24:44,920 Speaker 6: I think folks still in a sense, they're in that 506 00:24:45,400 --> 00:24:47,240 Speaker 6: mind frame of twenty twenty four. 507 00:24:47,520 --> 00:24:51,000 Speaker 8: It's like this is that twenty twenty four at all? Whatsoever? 508 00:24:51,280 --> 00:24:55,160 Speaker 8: And if we don't get with it, I don't know. Yeah, 509 00:24:55,359 --> 00:24:57,200 Speaker 8: but we're going to continue to fight. That's not going 510 00:24:57,200 --> 00:24:59,760 Speaker 8: to stop. We're going to continue to you know, make 511 00:24:59,800 --> 00:25:05,280 Speaker 8: way and activate, educate people about their rights and you know, 512 00:25:06,119 --> 00:25:10,199 Speaker 8: create spaces or transit to be and be safe as 513 00:25:10,280 --> 00:25:12,520 Speaker 8: much as possible can do it all. 514 00:25:12,600 --> 00:25:14,879 Speaker 5: But as much as we can do, we will do. 515 00:25:15,640 --> 00:25:18,880 Speaker 2: Yeah. And I think that also raises a question for 516 00:25:19,119 --> 00:25:21,000 Speaker 2: people listening to the show, which is that what can 517 00:25:21,040 --> 00:25:26,280 Speaker 2: people do to put pressure on this hospital or their 518 00:25:26,400 --> 00:25:30,080 Speaker 2: local hospital to do this, and how can people sort 519 00:25:30,119 --> 00:25:35,320 Speaker 2: of help the effort to get UPMC to fucking give 520 00:25:35,400 --> 00:25:36,560 Speaker 2: kids their health care? 521 00:25:37,280 --> 00:25:40,960 Speaker 8: Absolutely, so what they can do is they can go 522 00:25:41,160 --> 00:25:45,000 Speaker 8: visit transridg dot org, make a sign, a petition that 523 00:25:45,119 --> 00:25:49,000 Speaker 8: we have a you can donate to the fund that 524 00:25:49,040 --> 00:25:53,359 Speaker 8: we have going currently. Locally, what they can do is, 525 00:25:53,560 --> 00:25:58,439 Speaker 8: you know, work with their borough or city councils to 526 00:25:58,520 --> 00:26:03,399 Speaker 8: create legislation to protect trans kids and use young adults, 527 00:26:03,440 --> 00:26:06,280 Speaker 8: and on state wide levels as well. But what we 528 00:26:06,400 --> 00:26:09,320 Speaker 8: have to do is we have to put pressure from 529 00:26:09,359 --> 00:26:12,080 Speaker 8: the top and from the bottom, you know, on the 530 00:26:12,119 --> 00:26:16,880 Speaker 8: government to you know, the state government to make these changes, 531 00:26:17,000 --> 00:26:18,240 Speaker 8: because again there are no. 532 00:26:18,320 --> 00:26:19,879 Speaker 5: Laws in place at all whatsoever. 533 00:26:20,440 --> 00:26:23,280 Speaker 6: So now we have to take that and we have 534 00:26:23,400 --> 00:26:28,280 Speaker 6: to make laws state wide in each state protect not 535 00:26:28,440 --> 00:26:31,560 Speaker 6: just trans youth the young adults, but trans individuals and 536 00:26:31,640 --> 00:26:35,920 Speaker 6: any minority groups that are being attacked by this Orange 537 00:26:36,040 --> 00:26:36,719 Speaker 6: Man's regime. 538 00:26:37,200 --> 00:26:40,840 Speaker 4: Yeah, it's a lot of trailing together. And I think 539 00:26:41,359 --> 00:26:45,159 Speaker 4: what we've seen here is how amazingly we were all 540 00:26:45,320 --> 00:26:48,400 Speaker 4: able to come together as a community and fight and 541 00:26:48,440 --> 00:26:51,200 Speaker 4: I think reaching out to your local organizations. I mean, 542 00:26:51,240 --> 00:26:54,040 Speaker 4: if every city had a Dina Stanley, they would be 543 00:26:54,040 --> 00:26:56,159 Speaker 4: in a much better position to fight this fight. But 544 00:26:57,440 --> 00:27:00,399 Speaker 4: you know, working together with the people who know how 545 00:27:00,440 --> 00:27:02,720 Speaker 4: to organize and fight, but also not be afraid to 546 00:27:02,720 --> 00:27:05,040 Speaker 4: get your feet wet in that active organizing. 547 00:27:05,560 --> 00:27:05,760 Speaker 3: You know. 548 00:27:05,840 --> 00:27:08,919 Speaker 4: We have been working with Action Network to open up 549 00:27:09,000 --> 00:27:11,199 Speaker 4: letter writing to our community so that you don't have 550 00:27:11,240 --> 00:27:13,760 Speaker 4: to be a UPMC staff to let UPMC know how 551 00:27:13,800 --> 00:27:17,040 Speaker 4: you're feeling. We're trying to host more town halls and 552 00:27:17,119 --> 00:27:21,320 Speaker 4: community meetings. We hit Instagram. We have an account Club 553 00:27:21,320 --> 00:27:24,800 Speaker 4: Providers for Trans Justice, where we're trying to get the 554 00:27:24,800 --> 00:27:27,280 Speaker 4: word out so we can rally more together. I think 555 00:27:27,320 --> 00:27:30,960 Speaker 4: a big pieces if you're able to contribute financially. Trans 556 00:27:31,080 --> 00:27:33,840 Speaker 4: Uniting has their Youth Healing Fund. I believed, you know 557 00:27:33,880 --> 00:27:37,720 Speaker 4: that's what it's called, where people can financially support trans 558 00:27:37,760 --> 00:27:42,120 Speaker 4: youth who are having trouble accessing their care, and especially 559 00:27:42,280 --> 00:27:44,280 Speaker 4: knowing what we know what's going to happen with Medicaid, 560 00:27:44,320 --> 00:27:47,359 Speaker 4: this is even more important. So I mean, if you 561 00:27:47,480 --> 00:27:50,520 Speaker 4: want to support us in our fight against UPMC. 562 00:27:50,320 --> 00:27:52,399 Speaker 3: I think it's be loud. It's not stop. 563 00:27:52,680 --> 00:27:54,840 Speaker 4: I believe that the hospital is just waiting for everybody 564 00:27:54,880 --> 00:27:57,760 Speaker 4: to quiet down. But we're only going to get louder 565 00:27:57,760 --> 00:28:00,800 Speaker 4: because these taper plans just started for these teens and 566 00:28:00,880 --> 00:28:04,280 Speaker 4: young adults, they're still on their medications, and the further 567 00:28:04,320 --> 00:28:06,040 Speaker 4: way that gets, the ladder we're going to be because the 568 00:28:06,160 --> 00:28:08,480 Speaker 4: risk is really going to increase as the months go on. 569 00:28:10,640 --> 00:28:16,639 Speaker 6: Absolutely, So don't stop be loud all the time, the 570 00:28:16,760 --> 00:28:21,240 Speaker 6: accomplices in this fight because no matter what, and know 571 00:28:21,359 --> 00:28:24,840 Speaker 6: that you're next, So you can either join in or 572 00:28:24,880 --> 00:28:27,120 Speaker 6: you can wait for your turn, and by that time 573 00:28:27,600 --> 00:28:29,880 Speaker 6: may be too late and there won't be no one 574 00:28:30,000 --> 00:28:31,600 Speaker 6: to be able to stand up the fight. 575 00:28:32,080 --> 00:28:33,840 Speaker 2: Yeah. And I think I've been saying on the show 576 00:28:33,880 --> 00:28:36,840 Speaker 2: a lot is it's not even just that after they 577 00:28:36,880 --> 00:28:38,320 Speaker 2: come for us, they're going to come for you. It's 578 00:28:38,360 --> 00:28:41,280 Speaker 2: that in order to come for us, they are going 579 00:28:41,320 --> 00:28:44,480 Speaker 2: through you first. Like that's what this whole administration has been. 580 00:28:44,520 --> 00:28:47,040 Speaker 2: They are willing to destroy the entire global economy. They're 581 00:28:47,040 --> 00:28:49,000 Speaker 2: willing to turn the US into a police state. They 582 00:28:49,040 --> 00:28:52,680 Speaker 2: are willing to again just grab people off the street 583 00:28:52,720 --> 00:28:55,240 Speaker 2: in order to destroy very very small groups of people. 584 00:28:55,280 --> 00:28:57,560 Speaker 2: They are willing to inviserate the lives of every single 585 00:28:57,600 --> 00:29:00,880 Speaker 2: person in this country. And the good news is that 586 00:29:00,960 --> 00:29:03,640 Speaker 2: means that because we're all targets, we all have the 587 00:29:03,640 --> 00:29:07,680 Speaker 2: capacity to resist together and and we're going to. 588 00:29:08,160 --> 00:29:10,760 Speaker 6: It's just that people have to understand that you know 589 00:29:11,240 --> 00:29:14,320 Speaker 6: that we are targets and understand what is actually happening 590 00:29:14,440 --> 00:29:16,920 Speaker 6: like these are tacked on trans folks. It's not about 591 00:29:16,920 --> 00:29:20,400 Speaker 6: trans individuals. It's about autonomy of a women's body. The 592 00:29:20,560 --> 00:29:23,680 Speaker 6: tax over immigrants, it's not about the immigrants. 593 00:29:23,960 --> 00:29:27,120 Speaker 8: It's about citizenships for black and brown people that have it, 594 00:29:27,560 --> 00:29:29,880 Speaker 8: you know what I mean. So this again, it's just 595 00:29:29,880 --> 00:29:33,719 Speaker 8: about having control over folks period. And as soon as 596 00:29:33,720 --> 00:29:36,880 Speaker 8: people understand that and know that, you will, you know, 597 00:29:37,040 --> 00:29:39,960 Speaker 8: be a slave of this country and in a way 598 00:29:39,960 --> 00:29:43,080 Speaker 8: that you've never been because we all are but a 599 00:29:43,160 --> 00:29:45,880 Speaker 8: slave of this country like you've never been before. 600 00:29:46,400 --> 00:29:47,720 Speaker 5: You better get with it and. 601 00:29:47,840 --> 00:29:50,320 Speaker 6: Open your eyes up and stand up and fight back, 602 00:29:50,800 --> 00:29:54,280 Speaker 6: or you will be in a situation that you would 603 00:29:54,440 --> 00:29:56,800 Speaker 6: just be sitting there thinking like I should have could 604 00:29:56,840 --> 00:29:57,880 Speaker 6: have what you did. 605 00:29:59,120 --> 00:30:00,000 Speaker 5: So stand that now. 606 00:30:00,800 --> 00:30:03,440 Speaker 4: The fight we're having with UPNC, I mean, of course 607 00:30:03,440 --> 00:30:05,960 Speaker 4: it's important. It's this is my employer, this is where 608 00:30:05,960 --> 00:30:07,760 Speaker 4: I live. But it is just a small fight in 609 00:30:07,800 --> 00:30:10,560 Speaker 4: the broader scheme of the fights we have. And you know, 610 00:30:10,680 --> 00:30:14,080 Speaker 4: this brings up a good point of we fight for 611 00:30:14,360 --> 00:30:16,560 Speaker 4: trans youth because of what might come next, but it's 612 00:30:16,600 --> 00:30:17,240 Speaker 4: already coming. 613 00:30:17,360 --> 00:30:17,560 Speaker 5: Right. 614 00:30:17,600 --> 00:30:19,840 Speaker 4: We have a lot of people of color who are 615 00:30:19,840 --> 00:30:21,640 Speaker 4: already scared to leave the country because they don't know 616 00:30:21,680 --> 00:30:24,240 Speaker 4: if they'll be allowed back in with their passport status. 617 00:30:24,320 --> 00:30:26,680 Speaker 4: We have, you know, women who are no longer able 618 00:30:26,680 --> 00:30:30,040 Speaker 4: to access abortion care or reproductive care in many places 619 00:30:30,080 --> 00:30:32,280 Speaker 4: in this country. I mean, it's not if it's going 620 00:30:32,320 --> 00:30:35,160 Speaker 4: to happen, it's when, and it already is. So the 621 00:30:35,240 --> 00:30:37,280 Speaker 4: more we fight in, the louder we can be for 622 00:30:37,320 --> 00:30:40,680 Speaker 4: the people who are hit the most, the more likely 623 00:30:40,720 --> 00:30:42,880 Speaker 4: that this fight will drag on and hit them, so 624 00:30:43,280 --> 00:30:44,880 Speaker 4: less fights can start in the future. 625 00:30:45,280 --> 00:30:47,200 Speaker 3: But it's happening. We're seeing it everywhere. 626 00:30:47,720 --> 00:30:50,160 Speaker 2: Yeah, I think that's an amazing place to end. Thank 627 00:30:50,200 --> 00:30:53,160 Speaker 2: you to both so much for coming on and for 628 00:30:53,240 --> 00:30:54,000 Speaker 2: fighting this fight. 629 00:30:55,040 --> 00:30:57,560 Speaker 3: Absolutely, thank you for having us. 630 00:30:57,600 --> 00:31:00,240 Speaker 4: I think it's really awesome to get the platform to 631 00:31:00,320 --> 00:31:03,760 Speaker 4: show what we're doing and hope people, hopefully people will 632 00:31:03,760 --> 00:31:06,920 Speaker 4: feel less scared. Right, there's power numbers, there's power and solidarity. 633 00:31:07,440 --> 00:31:10,080 Speaker 4: The more people we have fighting along us, the easier 634 00:31:10,120 --> 00:31:10,760 Speaker 4: it gets to fight. 635 00:31:11,760 --> 00:31:13,640 Speaker 5: The power is the people, and we are the people. 636 00:31:13,960 --> 00:31:16,320 Speaker 2: I am incredibly looking forward to talking to you again. 637 00:31:16,360 --> 00:31:21,800 Speaker 2: Will be fucking win this lovebody that great. 638 00:31:23,440 --> 00:31:24,960 Speaker 3: Pop champagne over the microphone. 639 00:31:25,520 --> 00:31:33,160 Speaker 1: Okay, it could happen here is a production of cool 640 00:31:33,240 --> 00:31:36,440 Speaker 1: Zone Media. For more podcasts from cool Zone Media, visit 641 00:31:36,440 --> 00:31:39,480 Speaker 1: our website cool zonemedia dot com, or check us out 642 00:31:39,520 --> 00:31:42,680 Speaker 1: on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you. 643 00:31:42,680 --> 00:31:43,800 Speaker 3: Listen to podcasts. 644 00:31:44,120 --> 00:31:46,040 Speaker 1: You can now find sources for It could happen here 645 00:31:46,080 --> 00:31:49,040 Speaker 1: listened directly in episode descriptions. Thanks for listening.