WEBVTT - How mRNA Vaccines Work 0:00:01.480 --> 0:00:04.280 Welcome to Stuff You Should Know, a production of I 0:00:04.360 --> 0:00:13.760 Heart Radio. Hey, and welcome to the podcast. I'm Josh Clark, 0:00:13.800 --> 0:00:17.119 and there's Charles W Chuck Bryan over there. Jerry is 0:00:17.200 --> 0:00:22.239 persona non grata and that's that's stuff you should know, 0:00:22.320 --> 0:00:27.240 of course, just the usual. Yeah, that's so stuff you 0:00:27.240 --> 0:00:32.320 should know, stuff you should know regular mhm uh. So 0:00:32.560 --> 0:00:35.600 can I say a couple of things here? Oh preamble 0:00:35.720 --> 0:00:40.559 from Charles, let's hear it. So we're gonna be talking 0:00:40.600 --> 0:00:47.120 today about the COVID vaccines, uh, specifically M in our 0:00:47.400 --> 0:00:52.640 I'm sorry, oh boy episode m r NA vaccines a 0:00:52.760 --> 0:00:57.200 k A Mr Nah. How I like to call him 0:00:57.240 --> 0:00:59.160 head and picked up on that before. Now I can't 0:00:59.240 --> 0:01:03.840 unsee it. Well that's because the M is little. Yeah yeah, 0:01:03.920 --> 0:01:06.360 but still now I see it very clearly, the mr 0:01:06.440 --> 0:01:10.319 NO vaccine. Uh. And just quickly, I wanted to say 0:01:10.360 --> 0:01:13.040 that Josh put this together from whole cloth, from about 0:01:13.760 --> 0:01:17.400 eight sources, and you did a great job. This is 0:01:17.440 --> 0:01:20.360 a complicated thing that you did work your wonders on 0:01:20.400 --> 0:01:22.440 and you're really good at this. Is that what you 0:01:22.480 --> 0:01:25.920 wanted to say? Man, I wanted to say that, And 0:01:25.959 --> 0:01:29.880 also our hopes here are that you can understand this. 0:01:29.920 --> 0:01:31.480 I know we're kind of preaching to the choir a 0:01:31.480 --> 0:01:34.880 bit with our our listenership, not not fully, there's plenty 0:01:34.880 --> 0:01:36.880 of people. There's a lot of varying opinions among the 0:01:36.880 --> 0:01:39.520 stuff you should know listeners, absolutely, but I think when 0:01:39.560 --> 0:01:42.520 it comes to vaccine hesitancy, I think most of our 0:01:42.560 --> 0:01:44.720 listeners are on board. And and our hope is that 0:01:44.760 --> 0:01:48.200 you can understand this a little bit before Thanksgiving with 0:01:48.240 --> 0:01:51.960 your weird uncle, so maybe you can say, hey, you know, 0:01:52.160 --> 0:01:55.720 I know how these things work, and it's not something 0:01:55.760 --> 0:01:58.360 to be feared. It's something to be like to stand 0:01:58.440 --> 0:02:01.520 up from this turkey and a table and like applaud 0:02:02.640 --> 0:02:07.280 with full no reservation and full like, what in the 0:02:07.360 --> 0:02:10.240 world has science done? It's amazing? Yeah, it really is, 0:02:10.440 --> 0:02:13.680 because it is. It's unbelievable that science has figured this 0:02:13.720 --> 0:02:17.160 stuff out and they did it that quickly and that accurately. 0:02:17.440 --> 0:02:20.200 I know it is. It's a triumph of modern science 0:02:20.240 --> 0:02:22.640 for sure, um, one of the one of the biggest. 0:02:22.840 --> 0:02:25.119 And we're gonna well, you know you it's an It's 0:02:25.160 --> 0:02:27.400 impossible to talk about the M R and A vaccines 0:02:27.400 --> 0:02:30.400 without talking about how it differs from traditional vaccines, and 0:02:30.440 --> 0:02:34.520 it is a huge step forward in vaccine research and 0:02:34.600 --> 0:02:37.800 vaccine production. Like, it's the future of vaccines. It's amazing 0:02:37.880 --> 0:02:41.800 what what's just happened. But that's not to throw any 0:02:41.800 --> 0:02:45.480 shade whatsoever on traditional vaccines, which we still need, which 0:02:45.520 --> 0:02:50.560 we still use vaccines, yes, without which there would probably 0:02:50.639 --> 0:02:52.800 be a great many of us who would not be 0:02:52.880 --> 0:02:56.440 here because we hadn't survived, our parents hadn't survived, our 0:02:56.480 --> 0:02:59.760 grandparents hadn't survived some disease that a vaccine was developed 0:02:59.760 --> 0:03:04.320 to combat. So hats off to traditional vaccines. But m 0:03:04.400 --> 0:03:08.320 RNA vaccines are are pretty astounding and what what science 0:03:08.360 --> 0:03:10.919 has managed to come up with. Yeah, So we hope 0:03:10.960 --> 0:03:15.160 to clear up some myths about what the COVID vaccines 0:03:15.240 --> 0:03:18.440 are and are not. And hopefully by the end of 0:03:18.480 --> 0:03:21.120 this you will agree that it's it's literally when I like, 0:03:21.400 --> 0:03:24.640 there's some serious Nobel prizes coming in the future towards 0:03:24.680 --> 0:03:27.480 these people, for sure. At the very least, we hope 0:03:27.520 --> 0:03:29.520 that you hear this episode and are able to go, 0:03:29.800 --> 0:03:34.079 huh so that's what's in me? Yeah, exactly, Well it's 0:03:34.080 --> 0:03:36.560 not any anymore. We'll learn that too, that's true. Chuck 0:03:36.760 --> 0:03:41.520 Nice Nice foreshadowing, So it is really it's it's really 0:03:41.520 --> 0:03:43.640 hard to kind of overstate just how big of a 0:03:43.680 --> 0:03:47.120 breakthrough it was for for m RNA vaccines and that 0:03:47.200 --> 0:03:51.400 they do kind of read represent like this new path forward. 0:03:51.760 --> 0:03:54.280 But to kind of understand how the whole thing works 0:03:54.280 --> 0:03:58.480 and what makes it so magnificent as far as medical 0:03:58.520 --> 0:04:01.320 breakthroughs go, you kind and I have to first understand 0:04:01.640 --> 0:04:04.920 what m RNA actually is in what it does, don't 0:04:04.920 --> 0:04:08.080 you agree? Yeah, I mean all this stuff is really new. 0:04:09.680 --> 0:04:13.360 I mean, the quickest version of the history is that, uh, 0:04:13.400 --> 0:04:16.320 this stuff was identified man a messenger RNA is what 0:04:16.360 --> 0:04:19.760 we're talking about, identified in the nineteen sixties, and then 0:04:19.800 --> 0:04:23.240 in nineteen eighty four the very first strand of m 0:04:23.440 --> 0:04:25.760 r NA. I'm gonna say m n r A so 0:04:25.839 --> 0:04:31.560 many times. You know that that m stuff and mr NAH, 0:04:31.600 --> 0:04:34.520 the first strand of mr NAH was artificially produced in 0:04:34.520 --> 0:04:37.520 a lab in nineteen eighty four, which in terms of 0:04:37.560 --> 0:04:40.800 science is not that long ago. And since then they 0:04:40.839 --> 0:04:44.560 have made leaps and bounds to the point where they 0:04:44.640 --> 0:04:51.120 now can and did produce a COVID vaccine on a computer. Yeah, 0:04:51.200 --> 0:04:53.880 I mean, that's basically what they're doing. These days is 0:04:53.880 --> 0:04:56.880 is they're saying, Oh, I want I want a vaccine 0:04:56.920 --> 0:05:00.360 that produces this little viral protein. I know that nomic 0:05:00.400 --> 0:05:02.919 code of this little viral protein. It's something to taped 0:05:03.000 --> 0:05:05.640 and tap tap tap, tap, tap tap, and then press 0:05:05.800 --> 0:05:09.560 enter basically and the computer sets off some desktop machines 0:05:09.680 --> 0:05:13.520 that produced that. That's that exact version of m RNA. 0:05:13.960 --> 0:05:18.640 That is really really simplified version of what's going on. 0:05:18.800 --> 0:05:22.200 But in a nutshell, it's basically where we've arrived now. 0:05:22.400 --> 0:05:25.560 And like you were saying, that's that's in the last 0:05:25.640 --> 0:05:28.640 thirty five years that we first very first time we 0:05:28.720 --> 0:05:32.320 ever synthesized m RNA. And as easy as it sounds now, Chuck, 0:05:32.480 --> 0:05:39.080 there were a lot of obstacles between and when the 0:05:39.160 --> 0:05:41.840 very first m RNA vaccines ever in the history of 0:05:41.920 --> 0:05:46.839 humanity came out just in time for the COVID pandemic. Yeah, 0:05:46.880 --> 0:05:48.440 I mean there were a couple of big hurdles to 0:05:48.440 --> 0:05:54.480 actually turn that like original miracle into boys about to 0:05:54.520 --> 0:05:59.320 get so religious into fish to feed the masses. I 0:05:59.360 --> 0:06:03.120 would have gone with water into wine. Okay, Hey, that 0:06:03.200 --> 0:06:05.680 was a good one too. A couple of them being 0:06:05.720 --> 0:06:07.600 in we're gonna get more into this you know, as 0:06:07.600 --> 0:06:10.360 we go along. But uh, they learned how to that. 0:06:10.520 --> 0:06:12.960 You know, m RNA is really fragile, so they learned 0:06:12.960 --> 0:06:15.640 how to protect it by putting it in these little 0:06:15.720 --> 0:06:20.640 tiny fat capsules called lipid nano particles. And so now 0:06:20.680 --> 0:06:22.680 they've got a little sort of a little vehicle to 0:06:22.720 --> 0:06:26.000 travel in that helps them get into a cell. Uh. 0:06:26.040 --> 0:06:29.000 And then and I know we've talked about cytokine storms before, 0:06:29.120 --> 0:06:32.880 when the when the human body has a really overblown 0:06:32.960 --> 0:06:36.840 reaction uh and overblown immune response to the point where 0:06:36.880 --> 0:06:40.040 it can actually kill somebody. Yeah, and those cytokine storms 0:06:40.080 --> 0:06:43.480 just kept smacking down MR and A research over and 0:06:43.560 --> 0:06:46.200 over again, because even when they finally did manage to 0:06:46.240 --> 0:06:48.360 come up with a way to keep the fragile mr 0:06:48.400 --> 0:06:50.760 and A from falling apart in the body, the body 0:06:50.800 --> 0:06:52.800 would be like, what is this? Get this out of here. 0:06:53.160 --> 0:06:56.280 I'm I'm going to just overblow so hard against this 0:06:56.279 --> 0:06:59.479 this uh weird foreign invader that I'm gonna threaten to 0:06:59.560 --> 0:07:02.560 kill my human which is not at all what you want. 0:07:02.600 --> 0:07:05.400 And they finally figured out that if you use some 0:07:05.520 --> 0:07:09.560 different nucleotides in place of other nucleotides, which are the 0:07:09.600 --> 0:07:13.120 building blocks of life. Um, when you're building this mr 0:07:13.200 --> 0:07:16.160 and A and then you really purify it, you get 0:07:16.280 --> 0:07:20.480 like no slop whatsoever. You have a chance of um 0:07:20.520 --> 0:07:24.200 making something that is that appears natural enough to full nature. 0:07:25.040 --> 0:07:28.440 That's right, And we're able to really clean that stuff 0:07:28.520 --> 0:07:31.280 up because it's not a live virus. Yes not, it's 0:07:31.320 --> 0:07:33.200 not a living thing. And we'll get more into that, 0:07:33.280 --> 0:07:36.520 and that's another big way how it differs from other vaccines. 0:07:37.200 --> 0:07:39.520 But it's not a live virus, so you can you 0:07:39.560 --> 0:07:43.480 can just dump a bunch of bleach on it basically essentially, 0:07:43.600 --> 0:07:46.720 we'll say in a nutshell, but yes, it cuts down 0:07:46.760 --> 0:07:50.720 on any type of contamination that you might get. Yeah, 0:07:50.720 --> 0:07:53.800 and we have to thank for all of this, really 0:07:54.080 --> 0:07:58.720 the Human Genome Project, because if not for that, which 0:07:58.760 --> 0:08:01.040 started in the nineteen on these thanks to the U. S. 0:08:01.120 --> 0:08:05.320 Government's um funding of that, we wouldn't have had any 0:08:05.320 --> 0:08:08.160 of these breakthroughs to begin with. As far as reading 0:08:08.160 --> 0:08:10.760 the genetic code, yes, it was a huge investment and 0:08:10.760 --> 0:08:13.640 it really is paid off in multiple ways, and just 0:08:13.720 --> 0:08:18.600 one of them is m RNA vaccines. Um. The the 0:08:18.600 --> 0:08:21.400 whole thing that is just to me just amazing and 0:08:21.440 --> 0:08:24.880 astounding and just confirms that we are living in some 0:08:24.920 --> 0:08:29.160 sort of simulation that the breakthroughs that pushed this this 0:08:29.400 --> 0:08:33.320 research for m RNA vaccines from basically a pipe dream 0:08:33.400 --> 0:08:35.240 that we had no idea how we were ever going 0:08:35.280 --> 0:08:39.040 to to get there. Two. Okay, we're ready to actually 0:08:39.559 --> 0:08:43.520 create mRNA vaccines just in time for this pandemic that's 0:08:43.559 --> 0:08:47.080 coming along. Um. They they all just kind of came 0:08:47.120 --> 0:08:53.000 together in part because people were already working on coronavirus vaccines. 0:08:53.320 --> 0:08:56.680 And what's really cool about mRNA vaccines is you can 0:08:56.720 --> 0:09:00.320 plug and play different stuff. Thanks to the Human Genome ject, 0:09:00.600 --> 0:09:03.599 we've learned to kind of read the genetic codes of 0:09:03.640 --> 0:09:07.240 stuff and to write it and produce it. And because 0:09:07.280 --> 0:09:09.440 of that, because we can do that on computers, now 0:09:09.720 --> 0:09:12.320 you can say, I've got a template for a coronavirus, 0:09:12.480 --> 0:09:14.760 let me get specific with it and make it as 0:09:14.760 --> 0:09:18.600 stars COVID two coronavirus. Now that we've got the genetic code, 0:09:18.760 --> 0:09:22.000 we can deploy a vaccine against it. And that's how 0:09:22.040 --> 0:09:24.319 they were able to do it so quickly, that's right, 0:09:24.640 --> 0:09:29.520 And they estimate that as of July this year, that 0:09:29.600 --> 0:09:32.600 vaccine is saved almost two d and eighty thousand lives 0:09:33.600 --> 0:09:36.840 UH and prevented about one point five million hospitalizations when 0:09:37.360 --> 0:09:42.040 hospitals are overrun, and that's a really important thing. Um, 0:09:42.080 --> 0:09:45.720 I'm gonna lobby for an early ad break here so 0:09:45.760 --> 0:09:49.760 we can just get cooking and go uninterrupted and unmolested 0:09:50.840 --> 0:09:54.520 until the second had break. That sound good? Yeah, a 0:09:54.600 --> 0:09:58.240 lobbying approved. Okay, we'll be right back everyone and tell 0:09:58.280 --> 0:10:26.760 you how all this stuff works right after this learning's 0:10:26.800 --> 0:10:37.320 stuff with Joshua John. Okay, so, um, we should talk 0:10:37.360 --> 0:10:40.440 about like I was saying, what mrn A does. Thank 0:10:40.480 --> 0:10:43.080 you for swooping in and reminding me that, oh yeah, 0:10:43.160 --> 0:10:45.880 this article that you wrote. You got the history part first, 0:10:45.960 --> 0:10:48.520 let's start there. That makes it like he's skipping that. No, 0:10:48.679 --> 0:10:52.240 he's not skipping. I was. My vision is blurry. I'm 0:10:52.280 --> 0:10:55.679 so interested in this. Okay, So we're talking about m 0:10:55.760 --> 0:10:57.920 r n A and m RNA is short for messenger 0:10:58.240 --> 0:11:05.600 RNA and messenger RNA basically, UH is a. It's it's 0:11:05.640 --> 0:11:10.319 a blueprint, right. It translates, it copies a little strip 0:11:10.559 --> 0:11:13.679 of the blueprint that's encoded in your entire genome, in 0:11:13.720 --> 0:11:17.680 your DNA, and it takes that little bit usually which 0:11:17.760 --> 0:11:20.440 codes for like a protein or peptide which are really 0:11:20.520 --> 0:11:23.840 important things. That are our body uses to do everything 0:11:23.920 --> 0:11:27.320 from um contracting your muscles to making you feel hungry. 0:11:27.360 --> 0:11:30.679 Like basically everything comes down to a protein or peptide, 0:11:30.960 --> 0:11:33.640 and the instructions for building each of those proteins and 0:11:33.640 --> 0:11:37.640 peptides are encoded in our DNA. And it's messenger RNA 0:11:37.800 --> 0:11:40.120 that goes to the DNA says, Okay, we need some 0:11:40.160 --> 0:11:42.400 more of this protein. I'm here to make a copy. 0:11:42.600 --> 0:11:44.960 May I please make a copy? Here are some flowers. 0:11:45.000 --> 0:11:46.760 They said, if I brought you some flowers, you'd be 0:11:46.760 --> 0:11:49.840 cooler with this, And the DNA says proceed, And the 0:11:50.000 --> 0:11:54.640 m RNA goes and produces itself as a copy and 0:11:54.880 --> 0:11:59.000 leaves the nucleus. This is really important. M RNA goes 0:11:59.040 --> 0:12:01.640 to the DNA, makes a copy and then leads to 0:12:01.760 --> 0:12:04.480 nucleus and from that point on, the m RNA is 0:12:04.559 --> 0:12:08.920 all about the cytoplasm. Right. Uh So, I kind of 0:12:08.960 --> 0:12:12.800 like the and I've expanded upon the wonderful metaphor you 0:12:12.840 --> 0:12:17.120 have of like a building site. Uh And I guess 0:12:17.120 --> 0:12:21.079 I think we failed to mention that um, the amino 0:12:21.160 --> 0:12:23.959 acids in the body is what's really carrying out the work, 0:12:25.040 --> 0:12:27.240 like making your eyes blue. Let's say, yeah, Well, the 0:12:27.280 --> 0:12:30.320 amino acids, they're the building blocks of proteins, of peptides. 0:12:30.360 --> 0:12:32.840 If you arrange a certain set of amino acids in 0:12:32.880 --> 0:12:35.360 a certain way, you've got a polypeptide and you've got 0:12:35.360 --> 0:12:38.720 a protein. Right. So m n r A in this case, 0:12:38.720 --> 0:12:41.160 if we're talking about this is like a job site. 0:12:41.559 --> 0:12:43.319 Did I say n r A again? You said m 0:12:43.559 --> 0:12:48.360 r A, mem ra, Well, that's the n r A 0:12:48.480 --> 0:12:51.360 is just so like embedded in our that's just so sad. 0:12:51.720 --> 0:12:54.840 I haven't said an r A once. I know it 0:12:54.920 --> 0:13:00.440 sounds like it's so m r n A just like 0:13:00.480 --> 0:13:04.040 black angus. Yeah, that one got a good reaction to. 0:13:04.280 --> 0:13:07.200 That was good. So M and r chez m RNA 0:13:07.280 --> 0:13:10.640 in this case would be like the architect showing up 0:13:10.640 --> 0:13:15.080 with the blueprint wearing some like sensible like chinos, but 0:13:15.360 --> 0:13:17.840 work boots. But they're really expensive work boots. You can 0:13:17.840 --> 0:13:20.080 tell them there's not a scuff on them, okay, And 0:13:20.160 --> 0:13:22.520 so it heads over to the work site, which is 0:13:22.559 --> 0:13:26.480 the cytoplasm of the cell outside the nucleus, right. And 0:13:26.520 --> 0:13:30.400 then I think in this case the ribosomes would be 0:13:30.440 --> 0:13:35.440 the contractor sort of because the contractor maybe translates these 0:13:35.440 --> 0:13:41.480 blueprints into I guess marching orders for the little workers 0:13:41.520 --> 0:13:45.760 that are the amino acids. Yeah, the ribosome clears the 0:13:45.880 --> 0:13:49.120 sandwich off of like the drafting table and spreads out 0:13:49.160 --> 0:13:51.240 the mRNA blueprint is okay, let me see what we 0:13:51.240 --> 0:13:53.920 got here, wipes his mouth, some crumbs away from his mouth, 0:13:54.320 --> 0:13:57.920 and um gets to work taking that blueprint, taking that 0:13:58.040 --> 0:14:02.280 messenger RNA and trans eating it into those amino acids 0:14:02.360 --> 0:14:04.840 that get constructed in just a certain way to produce 0:14:04.880 --> 0:14:07.120 a protein. And the m R and A says, do 0:14:07.120 --> 0:14:09.520 it again, do it again, do it again. Let's keep going. 0:14:09.600 --> 0:14:12.240 I'm feeling good. Let's keep this going for a little while. 0:14:12.880 --> 0:14:15.079 That's right, For a little while, and it just happens, 0:14:15.160 --> 0:14:17.199 you know, a certain number of times. It's not specific, 0:14:17.679 --> 0:14:21.160 it varies, but it's limited. And then that m RNA 0:14:21.240 --> 0:14:24.960 starts to break down. Nice going, you said, m R 0:14:25.040 --> 0:14:29.160 n A. I know, and I'm really concentrated. Uh. And 0:14:29.200 --> 0:14:31.480 then it's carried away from the cell and eventually out 0:14:31.480 --> 0:14:35.480 of the body through the lymph nodes and it's disposed of. So, 0:14:35.920 --> 0:14:39.760 like all jobs, eventually the contractor will disappear on you, right, well, no, 0:14:39.880 --> 0:14:46.920 that was the architect out. Well, the architect disappears earlier. 0:14:46.920 --> 0:14:49.200 I guess sure, I guess so. But you always want 0:14:49.200 --> 0:14:51.600 the architect to come back sort of, Yes, well, the 0:14:51.680 --> 0:14:54.000 architect is gonna come back. You'll you'll get another architect. 0:14:54.040 --> 0:14:56.320 There's always more MR and A. The body is always 0:14:56.360 --> 0:14:58.720 happy to produce more m R and A with sending 0:14:58.720 --> 0:15:01.560 out blueprints in and instructions and go make this protein 0:15:01.680 --> 0:15:03.800 right now, Man, I really screwed up. I thought the 0:15:03.840 --> 0:15:06.120 contractor disappeared. How perfect would that have been. It would 0:15:06.120 --> 0:15:08.120 have been pretty great, and you still got the joke in. 0:15:08.240 --> 0:15:12.680 It was just wrong. And that's just wrong Jo scientifically. 0:15:12.880 --> 0:15:15.800 But the thing about M R and A vaccines is 0:15:15.840 --> 0:15:19.920 that researchers have figured out how to use this natural 0:15:20.000 --> 0:15:25.400 process to help us vaccinate ourselves against diseases. And they 0:15:25.440 --> 0:15:28.400 do that because we've reached a point where we can 0:15:28.920 --> 0:15:31.520 Rather than having the the M R and A produced 0:15:31.640 --> 0:15:34.280 in the nucleus of the celling going out into the cytoplasm, 0:15:34.680 --> 0:15:38.080 vaccine researchers produced the MR and A outside of the 0:15:38.120 --> 0:15:40.760 body and then injected into the body, and then it 0:15:40.800 --> 0:15:44.880 goes into the cytoplasm from outside of the cell, and 0:15:44.920 --> 0:15:48.120 then from that point on everything else follows the exact 0:15:48.120 --> 0:15:50.760 same process. That is where we're at right now, and 0:15:50.840 --> 0:15:53.360 that is where you're you can start to feel your 0:15:53.360 --> 0:15:57.040 head opening up like a bloomin onion and out back. Yeah. 0:15:57.080 --> 0:15:59.840 And I mean that in and of itself is remarkable. 0:16:00.000 --> 0:16:02.280 It is that they said, you know what, this stuff 0:16:02.320 --> 0:16:05.040 can actually go into a cell, even though and we'll 0:16:05.080 --> 0:16:06.760 get a little bit more into this, even though it's 0:16:06.800 --> 0:16:10.000 like can be up to ten thousand times too big 0:16:10.960 --> 0:16:14.240 to permeate that cell, We'll figure that part out. And 0:16:14.360 --> 0:16:16.640 they did. That's that's you know, courtesy of the of 0:16:16.680 --> 0:16:19.760 the little fatty lipids. That's the vehicle that allows that 0:16:19.760 --> 0:16:22.480 to happen. But just the notion that they thought, like, 0:16:22.560 --> 0:16:24.200 I wonder if we can get the stuff to go 0:16:24.280 --> 0:16:27.520 from the outside in, Yeah, was remarkable. It really is. 0:16:27.640 --> 0:16:30.480 And it was just this contribution from hundreds of researchers 0:16:30.520 --> 0:16:34.160 just building on one another's work, and um, that finally 0:16:34.280 --> 0:16:36.640 led to the point where it's like it went from wow, 0:16:36.680 --> 0:16:39.120 this is a really cool idea, to Okay, we're actually 0:16:39.160 --> 0:16:44.160 preventing deaths in the pandemic things, to these things now right, uh, 0:16:44.200 --> 0:16:46.160 and you know there are a couple of ways to 0:16:46.600 --> 0:16:49.600 a few ways that you can immunize a person, like 0:16:49.680 --> 0:16:53.720 literal techniques using m r N A. And it turns 0:16:53.720 --> 0:16:55.600 out that we got I don't know if it's lucky 0:16:55.800 --> 0:17:00.520 or just uh, you know, divine intervention smulation type stuff. 0:17:00.800 --> 0:17:03.520 It turns out that the one that we that works 0:17:03.640 --> 0:17:06.240 really well and that we're using for the COVID vaccine 0:17:06.240 --> 0:17:08.000 turned out to be sort of the cheapest and the 0:17:08.040 --> 0:17:13.720 easiest one, which means in vivo within the living So 0:17:13.840 --> 0:17:16.120 in other words, you just get injected into your arm, 0:17:16.400 --> 0:17:18.560 as opposed to like in vitro that's the other way, 0:17:18.600 --> 0:17:21.680 which is it takes a lot longer, it's really complicated, 0:17:21.720 --> 0:17:24.439 a lot more expensive. And they figured out, hey, we 0:17:24.440 --> 0:17:28.080 can just do this with a shot in the arm. Uh, 0:17:28.160 --> 0:17:30.760 And then it's a conventional m RNA as opposed to 0:17:31.200 --> 0:17:34.000 something called self amplifying that we're not gonna sort of 0:17:34.000 --> 0:17:37.800 get into now. But it's a conventional in vivo shot 0:17:38.040 --> 0:17:40.919 that goes into your arm. Yeah, it's the most straightforward 0:17:41.000 --> 0:17:43.560 it could possibly be at this point in our m 0:17:43.680 --> 0:17:47.560 RNA vaccine technology, which like you said, is rather lucky. Yeah, 0:17:47.600 --> 0:17:48.919 it didn't have to be that way. It could have. 0:17:48.960 --> 0:17:51.000 It could have been the most expensive and the most 0:17:51.000 --> 0:17:54.000 difficult in time consuming, and we'd be in a much 0:17:54.040 --> 0:17:57.879 different spot right now, Yes, for sure. So um to 0:17:58.160 --> 0:18:01.040 kind of explain how m RNA seems do their thing, 0:18:01.600 --> 0:18:03.280 it helps to kind of view it as like a 0:18:03.280 --> 0:18:06.840 metaphor for like a training session, like when you are 0:18:06.920 --> 0:18:10.920 vaccinated against something. Your your immune system is being trained 0:18:10.960 --> 0:18:13.760 to fight an invader. But it's like a training session 0:18:13.800 --> 0:18:17.560 that uses like blank rounds, So it's much safer than 0:18:17.920 --> 0:18:21.240 than say, like you know, capturing one of those enemies, 0:18:21.359 --> 0:18:24.320 pushing them onto the field and giving everybody live ammunition. 0:18:25.080 --> 0:18:27.040 Things can get messy in that sense. It's it's like 0:18:27.080 --> 0:18:30.560 a military training session, I guess. So sure, yeah, all right, 0:18:30.720 --> 0:18:34.840 I was thinking more SWAT team, but sure. So you know, 0:18:34.840 --> 0:18:37.560 we mentioned a couple of times those lipid nanoparticles that 0:18:37.760 --> 0:18:40.680 encase the m r N a uh, and that these 0:18:40.680 --> 0:18:43.040 things are anywhere from a thousand to ten thousand times 0:18:43.080 --> 0:18:46.200 too large for what normally could pass through the cell's membrane. 0:18:46.600 --> 0:18:50.480 But the lipid coding basically opens that gate and says, 0:18:50.560 --> 0:18:53.320 you know what, there with me, you love me. I'm 0:18:53.359 --> 0:18:57.159 a little slippery fat cell and just just coming along 0:18:57.240 --> 0:18:59.360 inside the cell with me and I'll shut the door 0:18:59.359 --> 0:19:02.040 behind us. Yeah, which is really something because you know, 0:19:02.080 --> 0:19:04.560 if the if any of the what are called toll 0:19:04.760 --> 0:19:07.600 like receptors in the cell, which are always looking out 0:19:07.680 --> 0:19:10.119 for something out of the norm, notice, like m rna, 0:19:10.280 --> 0:19:12.200 what are you doing out here? You should be in there? 0:19:12.240 --> 0:19:15.000 What's going on? Everybody? Hey, come quick, You've got a 0:19:15.080 --> 0:19:17.440 big problem. And you would not be able to actually 0:19:17.720 --> 0:19:22.040 successfully vaccinate somebody because you'd set off the alarm too early. Um, 0:19:22.040 --> 0:19:25.560 there's something called interfere on that uh, it actually does 0:19:25.680 --> 0:19:29.199 interfere with m rna from being transcribed. And so if 0:19:29.240 --> 0:19:32.600 it's perfect name, so if it caught m rna out, 0:19:32.840 --> 0:19:37.040 that interfere on would would come and and um prevent 0:19:37.080 --> 0:19:40.080 the m rna from ever being transcribed into the viral protein. 0:19:40.280 --> 0:19:43.200 That's a big one that that lipid coding helps protect. 0:19:43.520 --> 0:19:46.359 So say, now we've got the m RNA showing up 0:19:46.400 --> 0:19:49.119 in the cytoplasm again coming from outside the cell, but 0:19:49.160 --> 0:19:52.359 now it's in the cytoplasm. Everything's cool, everything is normal, 0:19:52.560 --> 0:19:55.360 and things can kind of proceed from there. That's right. 0:19:55.520 --> 0:19:57.760 And it shows up with those blueprints rolled up under 0:19:57.800 --> 0:20:00.760 their arm. It's got the little work order from from 0:20:00.760 --> 0:20:04.120 the big boss, and it says, all right, ribosomes, you're 0:20:04.119 --> 0:20:06.240 about to get a lot of work thrown your way. 0:20:06.600 --> 0:20:08.080 Are you gonna be okay with that? You've got to 0:20:08.080 --> 0:20:11.080 create all these different proteins that were coded for and 0:20:11.119 --> 0:20:13.440 in this case where we want to stop a pandemic, 0:20:13.520 --> 0:20:16.880 so it's coded uh for this virus. And we've got 0:20:16.920 --> 0:20:19.960 just a tiny little bit of this virus's body. And 0:20:20.119 --> 0:20:22.760 don't worry, you're not gonna get this person sick or 0:20:22.800 --> 0:20:27.920 anything because, uh, my friend Josh Clark taught me, you 0:20:28.000 --> 0:20:32.240 made another metaphor of like a piano player. Traditionally, if 0:20:32.280 --> 0:20:34.960 you want to play the piano, you're gonna use at 0:20:35.000 --> 0:20:40.560 least an arm and probably one of your ears traditionally, Uh, 0:20:40.920 --> 0:20:44.720 but you really want both those arms in both those ears, yes, 0:20:44.840 --> 0:20:46.520 and and like and the in a body to go 0:20:46.560 --> 0:20:48.400 along with it. Like just an ear and an arm 0:20:48.440 --> 0:20:51.639 can't play the piano. So just a little bit of 0:20:51.640 --> 0:20:55.080 this virus isn't gonna make you sick, no, exactly, so 0:20:55.400 --> 0:20:57.040 or let you spread it to someone else. That's a 0:20:57.080 --> 0:20:59.240 big one. And that's what and that's what the m 0:20:59.359 --> 0:21:01.280 R and A shows up coded for it's a little 0:21:01.320 --> 0:21:04.080 piece of the virus that you're you want to immunize 0:21:04.119 --> 0:21:06.720 the person against. And it says, hey, everybody, let's start 0:21:06.760 --> 0:21:09.760 making this. Huh Hey everyone, Hey, we're here. Come make 0:21:09.800 --> 0:21:13.600 this viral protein, which is called the anti antigen. And 0:21:13.640 --> 0:21:15.720 so the body starts doing that because it has it 0:21:15.760 --> 0:21:17.600 didn't know the m RNA was outside of the cell 0:21:17.720 --> 0:21:21.359 or was ever created in a lab um and so 0:21:21.400 --> 0:21:25.240 it starts transcribing the m rna and the viral proteins 0:21:25.280 --> 0:21:28.240 start getting made. And the whole point to all of this, 0:21:28.400 --> 0:21:32.119 if you want like a really good immune response, Chuck, 0:21:32.640 --> 0:21:36.520 you want to trigger both of the two immune systems 0:21:36.560 --> 0:21:39.320 that humans have. You've got the innate system and you 0:21:39.359 --> 0:21:42.920 have the adapted system. Adapted systems, yes, you've got to 0:21:43.560 --> 0:21:47.240 because you're a vertebrate. And um, if you can trigger 0:21:47.280 --> 0:21:50.200 them both to to a large degree but not so 0:21:50.280 --> 0:21:52.080 big a degree that you end up with a site 0:21:52.119 --> 0:21:55.040 to a keen storm that can accidentally kill you, you've 0:21:55.080 --> 0:21:59.399 got a good immunization going. That's right. Uh. And we 0:21:59.520 --> 0:22:02.639 talked about out with Great Wonder and Marvel about the 0:22:02.680 --> 0:22:06.679 human bodies immune system before, but as a refresher, we 0:22:06.720 --> 0:22:09.800 do have two of them. We have the innate which 0:22:09.840 --> 0:22:12.760 is the first line of defense. This is like, uh, 0:22:12.960 --> 0:22:16.440 Sergeant Slaughter, you know, if foreign invaders come in and 0:22:16.440 --> 0:22:19.280 and Sergeant Slaughter just wants to kill, kill, kill, kill 0:22:19.320 --> 0:22:22.480 everything that comes in his in his little scope, and 0:22:22.560 --> 0:22:26.000 that's the innate system. Just neutralize everything the second it 0:22:26.040 --> 0:22:27.719 sees it. Be on the lookout for everything, and if 0:22:27.760 --> 0:22:29.960 it looks weird, kill it. And that's like if you 0:22:29.960 --> 0:22:31.720 get a skin on your knee or a cut on 0:22:31.760 --> 0:22:35.440 your arm or something and it's mild, that inflammation around 0:22:35.440 --> 0:22:37.400 the cut is that innate system. And if it's mild 0:22:37.480 --> 0:22:41.000 enough and it doesn't get complicated or anything, that maybe 0:22:41.040 --> 0:22:44.119 all you need for something like that, Sergeant slaughters an 0:22:44.680 --> 0:22:47.119 that's all you need. But in this case, and with 0:22:47.160 --> 0:22:50.360 anything a little more sophisticated, you're gonna want to engage 0:22:50.400 --> 0:22:54.159 that adaptive system as well. Yeah, which if the innate 0:22:54.200 --> 0:22:57.920