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Speaker 1: Welcome to the Crime Round Up. I'm Cheryl McCollum.

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Speaker 2: And we are joined by the one, the only, the incomparable,

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Speaker 2: Nancy Grace.

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Speaker 1: Good morning, Good morning.

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Speaker 3: Luigi man Jianni just caught a federal charge.

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Speaker 1: Right on, Wait, can I tell you something real quick? Yes,

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Speaker 1: hold on, David, come here.

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Speaker 3: Shut David. I had to make it, really had to

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Speaker 3: be in the room before I told him to shut up. Okay,

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Speaker 3: I can just pretend to say shut up. We don't

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Speaker 3: say the S word, but I reserve it just for David.

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Speaker 3: Did you know, MANJIONI caught a federal chargers means he

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Speaker 3: can get the death penalty. Okay, that's what I was

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Speaker 3: going to tell you. When I was prosecuting people with

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Speaker 3: Judge Alberson, who is my favorite judge of all time,

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Speaker 3: Luther Alberson was so old that he was he the

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Speaker 3: mandatory retirement age did not apply to him because he

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Speaker 3: was already I don't know who you may have been

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Speaker 3: too old at the time they passed it, but I

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Speaker 3: can tell you this, This is what it meant to

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Speaker 3: me in practical terms. He wanted to be known as

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Speaker 3: fit as a fiddle and the best judge in the courthouse,

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Speaker 3: so we would have to keep our jail count the lowest.

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Speaker 3: What is a jail count? That means that of all

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Speaker 3: the hundreds and hundreds of cases you have pending, the

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Speaker 3: number of defendants that are sitting in jail waiting for

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Speaker 3: the resolution of their case. It would come out every Monday,

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Speaker 3: and you would see what judge is not attending to business?

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Speaker 3: Uh huh, Because if you got people sitting in the jail,

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Speaker 3: you need to try them, or blead them, or drop

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Speaker 3: the case, do something. And all the judges would compare

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Speaker 3: that jail count secretly and see which judge, like Eldridge Lord,

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Speaker 3: he would have a jail count up round eighty ninety hundred,

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Speaker 3: and Albertson wanted his jail count under twenty. Okay, And

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Speaker 3: since they wouldn't plead anybody out cheap, they all had

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Speaker 3: to go to trial. Okay. I loved him so much,

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Speaker 3: so what he would force us to do, which was

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Speaker 3: finally made and forced me on one day a week,

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Speaker 3: we would bring in the defendant from the jail and

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Speaker 3: the attorney and me and my investigator, and we'd go

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Speaker 3: through the file and I'd give a plea deal. If

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Speaker 3: there was a deal to be had. They were saying,

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Speaker 3: miss Grace, I caught a little robbery charge, like somebody

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Speaker 3: threw it at them and they just happened to catch it.

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Speaker 1: Yeah.

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Speaker 3: So I sat me and Jony just caught a federal charge.

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Speaker 3: It made me think I called a little robbery charge,

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Speaker 3: miss Grace.

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Speaker 1: Yep, I'm just carge.

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Speaker 3: Oh man, Okay, So this is what I know. In

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Speaker 3: the last twenty four hours, prosecutors unseal a murder case

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Speaker 3: against Menzioni, holding out the possibility of the death penalty

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Speaker 3: after a trial on separate state charges. There you go

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Speaker 3: the federal charges on one count using firearm to commit

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Speaker 3: murder death whose stalking counts and a firearms offense? What

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Speaker 3: about that?

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Speaker 2: I think it's the right call, and I think it's

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Speaker 2: going to send a really good message for some of

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Speaker 2: these copycats intended idiots, because you.

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Speaker 1: Know, these people think this is a game.

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Speaker 2: They think this is something Hey, we can go around

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Speaker 2: and you know, stab the CEO in a meeting, you know,

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Speaker 2: make threats on line to this one. It's going to

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Speaker 2: be shut down. And the more people that you know

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Speaker 2: play these games and go to jail, it's going to

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Speaker 2: regulate the other ones.

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Speaker 3: I've got a big, big, overarching question. Why are there

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Speaker 3: so many idiots running around? I was reading an article

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Speaker 3: about Mangoni and some lawyer. If I could remember their name,

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Speaker 3: I would absolutely tell you so well, this isn't a

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Speaker 3: federal case because crossing state lines to commit a crime

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Speaker 3: does not make it federal. I'm like, what, who saidn't that?

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Speaker 3: Because the complaint accuses me and Gione of crossing state

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Speaker 3: lines from Atlanta to the Port Authority in New York

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Speaker 3: to stalk and kill Thompson, which gives the FEDS jurisdiction

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Speaker 3: to prosecute him.

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Speaker 2: Yep, and he did so with an illegal weapon with

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Speaker 2: the intent to get in murder, which he did.

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Speaker 3: I just had to crack open another can first thing

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Speaker 3: in the morning, tea of the eight lood sodium, and

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Speaker 3: I'm hitting it hard Today's Cheryland.

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Speaker 1: Hey, I gotta jail you something.

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Speaker 2: What in nineteen ninety six when you left Atlanta ninety seven,

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Speaker 2: you know, all night we didn't even have cable TV. So, like,

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Speaker 2: I knew this was a big deal. I knew it

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Speaker 2: was super cool. I didn't get to watch you every week,

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Speaker 2: you know, every night, and then when you came back

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Speaker 2: and was it two thousand and five, you started a Jillian.

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Speaker 3: Let me say, David, when was it. I think it

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Speaker 3: was before then. It was before then. Let me think,

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Speaker 3: because for the longest time I did Court TVD. Then

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Speaker 3: I'm across town. You know, it can take an hour

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Speaker 3: to cross town. I don't mean go up down downtown.

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Speaker 3: I mean go from the east side to the west side.

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Speaker 3: Oh my goodness. And then for a while my EP

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Speaker 3: wanted me to do a podcaster. It wasn't a podcast.

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Speaker 3: It was filmed in the car, in the car on

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Speaker 3: the way where we would have our meeting about what

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Speaker 3: were we gonna? What were the was the focus that night? Anyway?

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Speaker 3: It was insane. Yes. So then at some point it

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Speaker 3: was after I had oh and when I was pregnant.

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Speaker 3: No one knew I was pregnant except the makeup ladies,

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Speaker 3: Anita and Vincenza, and they need because I throw up

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Speaker 3: at the trash can almost every morning. And then okay,

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Speaker 3: I'm fine, put on the makeup.

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Speaker 1: Let's go okay.

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Speaker 3: And then ultimately I moved back to Atlanta and started

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Speaker 3: shooting the hl In Show from the Atlanta Flagship.

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Speaker 1: Correct And that's and you know I was on with

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Speaker 1: you a lot.

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Speaker 3: Oh gosh, yah.

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Speaker 2: I mean I knew that you were well known, especially

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Speaker 2: in Atlanta. I mean, but I didn't understand nationally what

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Speaker 2: you were if that makes any sense. Conceptually, Yes, you

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Speaker 2: were on TV people knew you, but even back in

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Speaker 2: the day in Fulton County, everybody knew you.

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Speaker 1: So it was two thousand and six. I'll never forget it.

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Speaker 3: I know this story is going somewhere.

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Speaker 1: It is.

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Speaker 2: I watched The Gilmour Girls and Nancy. That's I don't

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Speaker 2: know if you know that show. But it's about a

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Speaker 2: mom and a daughter. It's really cute.

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Speaker 3: You're not talking about Setar Hollow, are you.

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Speaker 1: I am.

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Speaker 3: Lisey loves it. Yes, I've been forced to watch it now.

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Speaker 3: I actually like it.

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Speaker 1: Okay, I don't.

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Speaker 3: Know if it's Orwellian or not. You know, you do

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Speaker 3: it so much, you think that's wonderful.

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Speaker 1: It's wonderful.

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Speaker 2: But you know that mom on the show, her humor

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Speaker 2: was so funny but so quick. I mean, she would

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Speaker 2: have these lines, she would say, I'm so fast that

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Speaker 2: if you weren't paying attention, you would miss some of

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Speaker 2: the embedded humor. Well, I'm watching that show in two

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Speaker 2: thousand and six and she's talking about her mama. Her

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Speaker 2: mama drives her crazy sometimes, you know, she can just

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Speaker 2: strangle her whatever.

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Speaker 3: Her mother was very often right, I might add.

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Speaker 1: And so she was saying she.

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Speaker 2: Needs a buffer of her best friend sometimes between she

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Speaker 2: and her mom. And she was like, look, that buffer

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Speaker 2: is my mom's best friend. Without that buffer, Nacy Grace

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Speaker 2: is going to be camping out or miss Patty's front law.

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Speaker 2: And I was like, what n praise and how could

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Speaker 2: the Gilmore girls make a reference that fast?

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Speaker 1: I knew in that moment just how famous you were.

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Speaker 2: Fast forward two nights ago, Huck and Caroline busting this

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Speaker 2: house talking about Nancy Grace.

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Speaker 1: They just did a parody onth andel.

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Speaker 3: Y.

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Speaker 1: I didn't know if you saw it, but girl, you

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Speaker 1: are still iconic.

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Speaker 3: I really appreciate all that you're saying I do. And

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Speaker 3: it was flattering. I got a flutter text one hated

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Speaker 3: I hurt your feelings.

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Speaker 1: Hurt your feeling No.

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Speaker 3: Not at all. I was, you know, flattered and honored.

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Speaker 3: And it could have been so much worse. Basically, oh hockey.

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Speaker 1: Caroline loved it and they were both going with am

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Speaker 1: I rag this right? You know? It was awesome?

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Speaker 2: So yeah, I dig it and I sit there and

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Speaker 2: I think, and I've said this before to you, but

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Speaker 2: I'm gonna say it again. It took so much guts

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Speaker 2: to do what you did, leave what was familiar, all

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Speaker 2: these people that loved you, with a track record that

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Speaker 2: you had, and go to a city you had never

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Speaker 2: lived in before to do a show and.

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Speaker 1: Then to use your name. And I've told Hunt and

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Speaker 1: Caroline this.

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Speaker 2: If she had failed, Nancy Grace would have failed if

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Speaker 2: you had called the show anything else, you know, legal breaths.

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Speaker 2: Nobody would even remember you if it hadn't worked. But

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Speaker 2: what you did was just legendary. So I just wanted

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Speaker 2: to say it was super cool for my own children

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Speaker 2: of us in to be champion for you because they

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Speaker 2: thought it was that just fantastic.

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Speaker 3: Well, I don't really know how to take a compliment.

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Speaker 3: I really appreciate that, but i'd like to I feel

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Speaker 3: better talking about cases than I do about any of that.

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Speaker 3: And I also am just oblivious to everything going on

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Speaker 3: around me other than in the Twins, David Mother and

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Speaker 3: the cases. Everything else is just like what, oh yeah,

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Speaker 3: and the dog, So thank you? But can we talk

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Speaker 3: about MANZIONI now, yes, absolutely, there's no telling what's going

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Speaker 3: to happen next with Menngione. But what do you make

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Speaker 3: of the federal charges? Are they a bargaining chip, are

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Speaker 3: they real? Are the Feds going to actually go forward

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Speaker 3: with it? Or is it something to hold over his

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Speaker 3: head to get a plea. I don't see him entering plate,

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Speaker 3: not with these lawyers. You know, it's freaky. His lawyer

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Speaker 3: is married to the diddy lawyer Sean Combs.

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Speaker 1: Yes, I saw that, and.

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Speaker 2: I'll tell you I take a different stance. I don't

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Speaker 2: think they're going to offer him a plea. I think

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Speaker 2: you've got every ceo with every fortune five hundred saying

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Speaker 2: this has got the end. You've got to stop it.

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Speaker 2: These people are exposed. Everybody knows where they are seventy

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Speaker 2: hours a week. They know their entrance, their exit. And

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Speaker 2: that's the reason folks like Home Depot and Cocola and

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Speaker 2: Delta and all these other people have CEOs with drivers

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Speaker 2: and private security because they need them.

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Speaker 3: Did you know that a new poll was just conducted.

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Speaker 3: I mean, if you believe polls that states younger voters

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Speaker 3: are evenly divided on whether what means you Oni did

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Speaker 3: was assassination or whether it was righteous.

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Speaker 1: I'm going to say again, and I've said it.

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Speaker 2: I have had so many people send me screenshots, whether

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Speaker 2: it's the New Robinhood, he's a hero, he's so good looking.

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Speaker 1: All these things.

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Speaker 2: All I can think of is how lucky you are

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Speaker 2: that You're lie has never been touched by this level

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Speaker 2: of violence, that you can think that it's okay. Any group,

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Speaker 2: any group that you can say, oh, they deserve to

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Speaker 2: be killed in the street, you have got to look

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Speaker 2: at that on some level and go, wait a minute.

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Speaker 1: I am so out of bounds here, because.

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Speaker 2: Like you and I have talked about privately, you change

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Speaker 2: that rich with any other word, and you know you

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Speaker 2: sound crazy as a rat in a coffee camp.

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Speaker 3: I want to talk about the notebook, the spiral notebook

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Speaker 3: that you keep mentioning, and I like the way you

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Speaker 3: mention it in the context in which you mention it.

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Speaker 3: The notebook. I can't wait to read the entries because

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Speaker 3: it's going to be his handwritten notes of his amusings.

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Speaker 3: I've always wondered what was O. J. Simpson writing in

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Speaker 3: that notebook Cochran would give him to make him look

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Speaker 3: like he was studious and paying it to the trial

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Speaker 3: they're probably just doodlings. But I do know that one

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Speaker 3: entry dated August fifteenth. I know very little at this juncture,

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Speaker 3: but I do know that entry said, quote, the details,

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Speaker 3: the details are finally coming together. And I'm getting this

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Speaker 3: from the federal federal complaint. Quote. I'm glad in a

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Speaker 3: way that I've procrastinated. He says. It gave him more

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Speaker 3: time to learn about the company he was targeting. He says,

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Speaker 3: the target is insurance. It checks every box. I mean,

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Speaker 3: we're gonna learn a lot, as you've described, a rat

238
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Speaker 3: and a cofee. Again, that's right about what's going on

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Speaker 3: in his hand. I mean it's because I'm curious. I

240
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Speaker 3: don't want to get too If I were trying the case,

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Speaker 3: I wouldn't get too deeply in it except for the

242
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Speaker 3: probate of value. This entry shows that. And that shows

243
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Speaker 3: this because if you really get tangled up in the

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Speaker 3: inner workings of his mind, I mean, it's like walking

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Speaker 3: through five feet a queu income. I mean, you're not

246
00:14:09,880 --> 00:14:13,360
Speaker 3: going to get anywhere. It's just ramblings and musings. And

247
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Speaker 3: I don't know that I would even want the jury

248
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Speaker 3: to have it. Well, I guess you'd have to give

249
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Speaker 3: it to him because it's probably full of bizarreities. It's

250
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Speaker 3: not a word and I don't wouln't want the jury

251
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Speaker 3: bogged down. But that said, I would love to read it.

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Speaker 1: And that's why he's a contradiction.

253
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Speaker 2: Nothing he does versus what he says, versus what he

254
00:14:35,200 --> 00:14:39,640
Speaker 2: believes versus his actions add up. So on the one hand,

255
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Speaker 2: he's a tech expert, but he's going to use a

256
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Speaker 2: spiral notebook. He wants to hide and get away with this.

257
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Speaker 2: Yet this is in your handwriting and found on your person.

258
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Speaker 2: A lot of playing and went in but no streat

259
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Speaker 2: wise activity, Like he doesn't understand how if I used

260
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Speaker 2: a face ide and cash money, how in the world

261
00:15:02,280 --> 00:15:07,400
Speaker 2: did they find me? Because he doesn't understand law enforcement,

262
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Speaker 2: especially one of the best law enforcement agencies in the world.

263
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Speaker 2: And then you've got the Internet, the very thing that

264
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Speaker 2: he wasn't even trying to be a part of because

265
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Speaker 2: he quote.

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Speaker 1: Went off the grid prior to the assassination.

267
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Speaker 3: Wait, you call Livin and a forty story higher eyes

268
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Speaker 3: on the Honolulu Beach going off the grid?

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Speaker 1: Oh what?

270
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Speaker 3: No, off the grid? Is Eric Rudolph this mansionity at

271
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Speaker 3: what tells me? Wait minute, can I tell you something else.

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Speaker 3: We need to talk about this. I hate to give

273
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Speaker 3: you all my AMMO that I planned to use on

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Speaker 3: crime stories, but I will, Sister at arms, all of

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Speaker 3: these photos. Look at them. One of them, he's laying

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Speaker 3: on his back. Okay, think about it. He's laying on

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Speaker 3: his back. Think of somebody laying on a bend and

278
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Speaker 3: you're at the end of the bed with your camera

279
00:16:01,360 --> 00:16:03,040
Speaker 3: and they lay on their back and hang their head

280
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Speaker 3: down and look at you upside down. There's a shot

281
00:16:05,960 --> 00:16:07,960
Speaker 3: of him like that with a bunch of girls. Do

282
00:16:08,120 --> 00:16:09,760
Speaker 3: not throw away that last donut?

283
00:16:11,120 --> 00:16:11,200
Speaker 1: Oh?

284
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Speaker 3: Okay, never mind, they're Krispy Kremes. Why are there so

285
00:16:15,720 --> 00:16:17,480
Speaker 3: many duncans and so fi Crispies?

286
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Speaker 1: Right?

287
00:16:18,960 --> 00:16:21,800
Speaker 3: What's that all about? Everybody knows Krispies are better.

288
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Speaker 1: And that hot sign come on now.

289
00:16:24,480 --> 00:16:27,480
Speaker 3: Hot donuts now sign. It's not a hot sign, it's

290
00:16:27,520 --> 00:16:32,480
Speaker 3: an HDN hot donuts now now. So all the teachers

291
00:16:32,480 --> 00:16:34,760
Speaker 3: are trying to cram everything in before they go for

292
00:16:34,880 --> 00:16:37,360
Speaker 3: Christmas tests and all that. So we've been living off

293
00:16:37,440 --> 00:16:41,400
Speaker 3: Krispy Kreme donuts all week. Anyway, I thought David was

294
00:16:41,440 --> 00:16:44,160
Speaker 3: actually make sure there's not one left in there, because

295
00:16:44,440 --> 00:16:47,960
Speaker 3: I'm pretty sure mother only. Okay, it's so hard to

296
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Speaker 3: give my mother anything for breakfast that she likes. And

297
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Speaker 3: I've just discovered she never really likes sweets. In the

298
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Speaker 3: last couple of weeks, she loves Krispy Kream donuts, so

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Speaker 3: I usually have to make her oatmeal with those golden

300
00:17:02,720 --> 00:17:04,879
Speaker 3: raisins in it. Okay, she got turned to that. Okay,

301
00:17:05,000 --> 00:17:08,160
Speaker 3: cheese grips with bacon in it, got turned to that cheese.

302
00:17:08,640 --> 00:17:10,639
Speaker 3: Got tired of that. Now She's just send a Krispy

303
00:17:10,720 --> 00:17:14,720
Speaker 3: Kreme donuts and I'm so happy. I hope it lasts forever. Okay,

304
00:17:14,760 --> 00:17:18,040
Speaker 3: where was I? Oh? Oh? The photos? How can he

305
00:17:18,280 --> 00:17:21,480
Speaker 3: lay on his back and hang his head there? I'm

306
00:17:21,600 --> 00:17:25,760
Speaker 3: backwards off like a hammock or something, smiling and giggling

307
00:17:26,160 --> 00:17:30,000
Speaker 3: with a back problem. Then he is pictured in a

308
00:17:30,040 --> 00:17:34,280
Speaker 3: hallway pickling two girls at once as they laughed giddily.

309
00:17:34,680 --> 00:17:37,879
Speaker 3: He is surfing, he is running on the beach. There

310
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Speaker 3: was one photo. And I know you're stealing all this

311
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Speaker 3: from me by thought process. You loved who you know.

312
00:17:43,880 --> 00:17:46,800
Speaker 3: It's like smoked. You suck it in, then you spit

313
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Speaker 3: it out like us. You're right now, I'm just looking

314
00:17:48,280 --> 00:17:51,080
Speaker 3: at it. You going, I just said that. Then wait,

315
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Speaker 3: there was one with a girl riding piggyback on his back.

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Speaker 3: I'm starting to be suspicious of this whole back thing.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, bit, And you know, he's hunched over building a firearm,

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Speaker 2: which took hours and hours and hours. He's hunged over

319
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Speaker 2: right in a manifesto. He's hunged over writing messages on

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Speaker 2: shell cases. He's running from the scene. He's bicycling from

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Speaker 2: the scene. He's riding a bus.

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Speaker 3: You know, there's a lot of low grade heels in

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Speaker 3: Central Park, some of them not that low grade because

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Speaker 3: the Twins, they grew up in New York. The Twins

325
00:18:31,040 --> 00:18:35,960
Speaker 3: love to play in their gray rocks and they're really

326
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Speaker 3: They're all over Central Park and they're really tall. They

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Speaker 3: love to get up on those rocks. That'll be a

328
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Speaker 3: nervous wreck. And I'm thinking that's where he ditched his

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Speaker 3: backpack and they had to climb up those rocks to

330
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Speaker 3: do that.

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Speaker 1: Again, does not sound like a back problem.

332
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Speaker 3: Oh, you know, he's going to lay it on thick

333
00:18:52,920 --> 00:18:53,720
Speaker 3: in the courtroom though.

334
00:18:53,800 --> 00:18:55,480
Speaker 2: You're right, and I think all they need to do

335
00:18:55,600 --> 00:18:58,640
Speaker 2: is show the video of him riding that bicycle over

336
00:18:58,800 --> 00:19:00,400
Speaker 2: speed bumps and everything else.

337
00:19:01,320 --> 00:19:02,240
Speaker 1: He's not wincing.

338
00:19:02,760 --> 00:19:06,760
Speaker 2: And again he chose a bus which took four times

339
00:19:06,840 --> 00:19:09,600
Speaker 2: as long to get to New York. If you've got

340
00:19:09,640 --> 00:19:12,040
Speaker 2: a back problem, you're not gonna want to sit for

341
00:19:12,160 --> 00:19:12,680
Speaker 2: that long.

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00:19:13,359 --> 00:19:14,560
Speaker 3: Have you ever had a back problem?

343
00:19:15,119 --> 00:19:15,320
Speaker 1: Never?

344
00:19:15,760 --> 00:19:19,560
Speaker 3: I'm anock on would I haven't either. But they're excruciating.

345
00:19:19,760 --> 00:19:25,280
Speaker 3: They're really painful from what I understand. So I don't

346
00:19:25,359 --> 00:19:28,600
Speaker 3: know for me the Jory's out on the back ELM.

347
00:19:28,840 --> 00:19:32,000
Speaker 3: Because I see the X ray with the pins, I

348
00:19:32,040 --> 00:19:34,840
Speaker 3: guess those are pins in his spine and his vertebra.

349
00:19:35,280 --> 00:19:38,560
Speaker 3: But his activities, how can you do that with all

350
00:19:38,600 --> 00:19:41,880
Speaker 3: the back? Why do we wait a minute? Number one?

351
00:19:42,320 --> 00:19:44,640
Speaker 3: I think it shows he's a liar, But that has

352
00:19:44,760 --> 00:19:49,720
Speaker 3: nothing to do with any sort of justification for gunning

353
00:19:50,040 --> 00:19:52,520
Speaker 3: anybody down, much less somebody you've never met.

354
00:19:52,840 --> 00:19:55,080
Speaker 2: You can't give me a reason. And that's the reason

355
00:19:55,160 --> 00:19:57,520
Speaker 2: when people say, well, what is the motive, I don't care.

356
00:19:58,160 --> 00:20:00,200
Speaker 2: There's a reason we don't have to even say what

357
00:20:00,280 --> 00:20:03,280
Speaker 2: the motive is in court. To me, it's not relevant.

358
00:20:04,359 --> 00:20:08,159
Speaker 2: What is relevant is this young man decided on his

359
00:20:08,359 --> 00:20:11,720
Speaker 2: own that he was going to murder somebody in cold

360
00:20:11,800 --> 00:20:13,760
Speaker 2: blood from the bat.

361
00:20:14,480 --> 00:20:18,320
Speaker 1: I mean, what a coward, what a punk move. You

362
00:20:18,440 --> 00:20:20,720
Speaker 1: won't even step to somebody face to face.

363
00:20:21,000 --> 00:20:24,080
Speaker 3: The only reason he's getting the celebrity treatment is because

364
00:20:24,119 --> 00:20:29,200
Speaker 3: he is rich, educated, white. Yes I said it, and

365
00:20:29,880 --> 00:20:33,399
Speaker 3: some people, not me, but some people think he's handsome.

366
00:20:34,200 --> 00:20:38,600
Speaker 3: That's why. If this were anybody else, h'd be under

367
00:20:38,640 --> 00:20:41,840
Speaker 3: the jail. They'd be like, screw him. That is it.

368
00:20:42,080 --> 00:20:45,840
Speaker 3: It is elitist and it is wrong. And if anybody else,

369
00:20:46,200 --> 00:20:48,520
Speaker 3: and let me just throw in while we're on a

370
00:20:48,560 --> 00:20:54,159
Speaker 3: two tier justice system rup now uh huh No, he

371
00:20:54,560 --> 00:20:57,000
Speaker 3: is a school shooter, and we're all like, oh, she

372
00:20:57,240 --> 00:21:02,720
Speaker 3: was so tortured you maybe because her parents got married,

373
00:21:02,800 --> 00:21:05,560
Speaker 3: got divorced, got married, got divorced, and she would be

374
00:21:05,960 --> 00:21:08,400
Speaker 3: two days with this one, two days with that one,

375
00:21:08,640 --> 00:21:12,080
Speaker 3: three days with this one, back and forth. Children all

376
00:21:12,400 --> 00:21:17,000
Speaker 3: around the country have that whacked out shared cope. Iarantine

377
00:21:17,400 --> 00:21:21,560
Speaker 3: because the parents want to be with the child, Thank god,

378
00:21:21,960 --> 00:21:24,280
Speaker 3: they want to be with the child. Well one of

379
00:21:24,320 --> 00:21:26,960
Speaker 3: them just doesn't take off for California and leave the

380
00:21:27,040 --> 00:21:29,720
Speaker 3: other parent with the child to raise on their own.

381
00:21:30,040 --> 00:21:34,280
Speaker 3: I don't know. When I'm looking at her, and aside

382
00:21:34,320 --> 00:21:38,600
Speaker 3: from her, she's fifteen the twenty year old man that

383
00:21:38,840 --> 00:21:41,080
Speaker 3: was conspiring with her online.

384
00:21:41,240 --> 00:21:46,320
Speaker 2: What a freak, right, And somehow they connected, somehow they

385
00:21:46,400 --> 00:21:49,639
Speaker 2: found each other. And then he's telling her, Hey, I'm

386
00:21:49,680 --> 00:21:51,000
Speaker 2: going to get a gun and I'm going to go

387
00:21:51,080 --> 00:21:52,800
Speaker 2: do a mass shooting into the government building.

388
00:21:53,359 --> 00:21:56,400
Speaker 1: Same time, she's getting a gun from somewhere we don't

389
00:21:56,440 --> 00:21:59,399
Speaker 1: know from where yet. And she goes to her school

390
00:21:59,560 --> 00:22:00,080
Speaker 1: of only.

391
00:22:00,200 --> 00:22:06,119
Speaker 2: Four hundred kids. I mean, what a tiny environment. Everybody

392
00:22:06,240 --> 00:22:09,480
Speaker 2: had to know each other. And then she decides, I'm

393
00:22:09,520 --> 00:22:12,480
Speaker 2: gonna kill however many I can kill. She had two

394
00:22:12,560 --> 00:22:15,480
Speaker 2: weapons with her and then took her own life in

395
00:22:15,560 --> 00:22:17,720
Speaker 2: that same incident, Cheryl, I can't.

396
00:22:17,480 --> 00:22:19,840
Speaker 3: Believe he's man it through an entire crime round up

397
00:22:19,840 --> 00:22:21,880
Speaker 3: and in and talked about Eric Rudolff, and I even

398
00:22:21,920 --> 00:22:25,520
Speaker 3: threw out the bait baby Camp said his name was.

399
00:22:25,720 --> 00:22:28,399
Speaker 3: And he didn't tell Rudolph story, not about him and

400
00:22:28,480 --> 00:22:30,960
Speaker 3: his scraggly hair and a stinky self and eating nuts

401
00:22:30,960 --> 00:22:32,080
Speaker 3: and berries. Nothing.

402
00:22:32,560 --> 00:22:33,879
Speaker 1: Well, you know, there were a lot of people that

403
00:22:33,960 --> 00:22:35,200
Speaker 1: thought he was good looking too.

404
00:22:35,920 --> 00:22:37,280
Speaker 3: I never thought he was good looking.

405
00:22:37,640 --> 00:22:39,359
Speaker 2: There was a lot of people that thought he was

406
00:22:39,600 --> 00:22:43,520
Speaker 2: especially the composite that Marla Lawson did they thought he

407
00:22:43,640 --> 00:22:47,080
Speaker 2: was a good looking kid. The problem is again you've

408
00:22:47,119 --> 00:22:49,719
Speaker 2: got somebody that is mentally not okay.

409
00:22:50,359 --> 00:22:51,080
Speaker 1: Well it did not.

410
00:22:51,200 --> 00:22:54,119
Speaker 3: Start that up, doctor Bethany Marshall and doctor Karen start

411
00:22:54,520 --> 00:22:57,800
Speaker 3: don't He is not and was not insane. And when

412
00:22:57,800 --> 00:23:00,560
Speaker 3: you say he's not mentally okay, whatever that means. But

413
00:23:00,680 --> 00:23:03,400
Speaker 3: it does not rise to the level of insanity under

414
00:23:03,440 --> 00:23:06,680
Speaker 3: the law, which means under the old McNaughton rule, which

415
00:23:06,760 --> 00:23:11,080
Speaker 3: is brought over from Great Britain, the foundation of our

416
00:23:11,520 --> 00:23:16,159
Speaker 3: common law, which means case law not codified as in

417
00:23:16,560 --> 00:23:21,320
Speaker 3: the Criminal Code. Whether you know right or wrong at

418
00:23:21,480 --> 00:23:25,760
Speaker 3: the time of nan that's all it means. Not like

419
00:23:25,920 --> 00:23:29,480
Speaker 3: Toltmum Laurie Valo who pretended to get crazier and crazier

420
00:23:29,560 --> 00:23:31,800
Speaker 3: as the day's passed Bible. She was in jail at

421
00:23:32,440 --> 00:23:35,160
Speaker 3: the time. Oh, by the way, you do knows she's

422
00:23:35,160 --> 00:23:37,480
Speaker 3: representing herself. Now, I would pay money to watch this,

423
00:23:37,640 --> 00:23:39,440
Speaker 3: but I don't have time to go and watch that trinal.

424
00:23:39,880 --> 00:23:43,320
Speaker 3: But yes, she is going to represent herself.

425
00:23:43,600 --> 00:23:46,880
Speaker 1: I cannot wait. But I do want to make something clear.

426
00:23:47,560 --> 00:23:49,639
Speaker 3: It's about Eric Rudolph. Because I've been waiting for you

427
00:23:49,680 --> 00:23:51,560
Speaker 3: to jump on the Rudolph vandwagon go ahead.

428
00:23:52,040 --> 00:23:55,400
Speaker 2: But his bandwagon is relevant because there's so many similarities.

429
00:23:55,440 --> 00:23:58,320
Speaker 2: But I was not in any way suggestion he was

430
00:23:58,520 --> 00:24:01,080
Speaker 2: legally insane, not at all. That's the reason he ran,

431
00:24:01,560 --> 00:24:03,520
Speaker 2: That's the reason he hid, That's the reason he had

432
00:24:03,520 --> 00:24:05,919
Speaker 2: a plan to get away with it because he absolutely

433
00:24:06,000 --> 00:24:08,119
Speaker 2: knew it was wrong, just like Rudolph knew it was

434
00:24:08,160 --> 00:24:10,840
Speaker 2: wrong and had a plan to go hide in the

435
00:24:10,960 --> 00:24:11,960
Speaker 2: Nandahala forest.

436
00:24:12,680 --> 00:24:15,520
Speaker 1: That is part and I've said it and I'm going

437
00:24:15,560 --> 00:24:16,320
Speaker 1: to keep saying it.

438
00:24:16,680 --> 00:24:21,320
Speaker 2: Every step you may to commit a crime, you leave

439
00:24:21,560 --> 00:24:24,920
Speaker 2: yourself open to make a mistake. So the more steps

440
00:24:25,000 --> 00:24:28,359
Speaker 2: you make, the more chances we have to catch you

441
00:24:28,480 --> 00:24:29,639
Speaker 2: because you're going to screw up.

442
00:24:30,040 --> 00:24:33,160
Speaker 3: Yeah, the more elaborate the planning and the more elaborate

443
00:24:33,240 --> 00:24:36,159
Speaker 3: the cover up. A nightmare is when it's a random

444
00:24:36,280 --> 00:24:38,840
Speaker 3: act on the spur of the moment and the person

445
00:24:38,960 --> 00:24:42,720
Speaker 3: just disappears. That's really hard to solve the case like that,

446
00:24:42,960 --> 00:24:44,480
Speaker 3: and they do happen. Hey, you know what I was

447
00:24:44,480 --> 00:24:47,400
Speaker 3: talking about. The federal charges I mentioned a few. There

448
00:24:47,520 --> 00:24:54,480
Speaker 3: are the federal complaint added four new federal charges Choot

449
00:24:54,520 --> 00:24:57,119
Speaker 3: count second ary murderer. Oh gosh, I'm just looking at

450
00:24:57,119 --> 00:25:00,720
Speaker 3: a picture of him right now. Oh, before I outlined

451
00:25:00,720 --> 00:25:03,240
Speaker 3: the federal charges. You do know that he was out

452
00:25:03,240 --> 00:25:06,120
Speaker 3: of street crows and looking all let me just say, well,

453
00:25:06,200 --> 00:25:09,520
Speaker 3: dressed in court. So he's pulling a coburger.

454
00:25:09,840 --> 00:25:10,600
Speaker 1: It's gonna fail.

455
00:25:11,000 --> 00:25:13,800
Speaker 2: It's every bit of it's gonna fail, just like these

456
00:25:13,840 --> 00:25:16,879
Speaker 2: people that are saying he's the new Robin Hood. Robinhood

457
00:25:17,000 --> 00:25:19,960
Speaker 2: killed plenty of people. That's the reason he ran in

458
00:25:20,040 --> 00:25:22,800
Speaker 2: the forest in the first place. He killed the sheriff.

459
00:25:23,440 --> 00:25:25,200
Speaker 2: He killed at least three that I can think of

460
00:25:25,320 --> 00:25:28,879
Speaker 2: from the original book. They don't get it, Nancy, And

461
00:25:28,960 --> 00:25:32,200
Speaker 2: I'm going to say this. You know the whole steal

462
00:25:32,280 --> 00:25:34,919
Speaker 2: from the rich and give to the poor. You changed

463
00:25:34,960 --> 00:25:38,960
Speaker 2: the word rich with any other group, and it sounds disgusting.

464
00:25:42,480 --> 00:25:44,080
Speaker 3: The other day we were talking about and I don't

465
00:25:44,080 --> 00:25:45,879
Speaker 3: even know why, Oh it was because of me and

466
00:25:45,960 --> 00:25:51,440
Speaker 3: JIONI Robinhood. And someone said Robinhood never killed anyone, but

467
00:25:51,640 --> 00:25:55,600
Speaker 3: actually he did. He killed the foresters. He killed fifteen

468
00:25:55,800 --> 00:26:00,720
Speaker 3: foresters who mocked him and wouldn't pay him. Okay, he

469
00:26:00,840 --> 00:26:02,600
Speaker 3: killed the sheriff of nodding him. I don't know who

470
00:26:02,640 --> 00:26:04,800
Speaker 3: else it killed, but I know he killed those that many.

471
00:26:05,240 --> 00:26:06,320
Speaker 1: Yeah, he was a punk too.

472
00:26:06,800 --> 00:26:10,119
Speaker 3: You know, I'm not going to get into tearing down Robinhood, okay,

473
00:26:11,000 --> 00:26:14,159
Speaker 3: but because we go down that path, somebody brings up

474
00:26:14,280 --> 00:26:19,159
Speaker 3: Robinhood every time we talk about me and JIONI, and

475
00:26:19,320 --> 00:26:23,399
Speaker 3: I'm just wondering, go with me on this? Is that

476
00:26:23,560 --> 00:26:27,040
Speaker 3: what they're going to do at trial. If they do that,

477
00:26:27,160 --> 00:26:29,480
Speaker 3: they have to admit he's the killer, because you can't

478
00:26:29,600 --> 00:26:32,760
Speaker 3: compare him to Robinhood if you're not admitting he's the killer.

479
00:26:33,080 --> 00:26:34,720
Speaker 3: So I don't know how wise that would be, but

480
00:26:35,000 --> 00:26:37,399
Speaker 3: I mean, the evidence may be so strong that they

481
00:26:37,520 --> 00:26:39,520
Speaker 3: have to. I think they're going to go with mental

482
00:26:39,560 --> 00:26:40,440
Speaker 3: defect and pain.

483
00:26:40,840 --> 00:26:43,680
Speaker 2: I do too, because the reality is we've got a video,

484
00:26:44,240 --> 00:26:47,440
Speaker 2: so there's not a lot they can do. Oh it

485
00:26:47,560 --> 00:26:50,080
Speaker 2: was a mistaken identity. Oh it wasn't him. Oh he

486
00:26:50,240 --> 00:26:53,760
Speaker 2: was nowhere near there. We've got him on video. So

487
00:26:53,920 --> 00:26:55,919
Speaker 2: they've got to come up with something. But if they

488
00:26:56,000 --> 00:26:59,159
Speaker 2: do the Robinhood defense, I would welcome that.

489
00:26:59,400 --> 00:26:59,680
Speaker 1: Honey.

490
00:27:00,240 --> 00:27:03,520
Speaker 2: Let's please play that guard, because not only would you

491
00:27:03,640 --> 00:27:06,600
Speaker 2: have to admit he's the murderer, what is it going

492
00:27:06,640 --> 00:27:07,159
Speaker 2: to leave you with?

493
00:27:07,400 --> 00:27:10,159
Speaker 1: As far as trying to wiggle out or make some kind.

494
00:27:10,040 --> 00:27:13,760
Speaker 2: Of deal, because I do not believe that the prosecutor

495
00:27:13,920 --> 00:27:15,960
Speaker 2: is going to make a deal in this case. I

496
00:27:16,080 --> 00:27:19,800
Speaker 2: think the people that are quiet are going to hold

497
00:27:19,840 --> 00:27:23,200
Speaker 2: more power. The only people you're hearing from are these

498
00:27:24,680 --> 00:27:28,440
Speaker 2: misinformed people that want his tattoo and are saying that

499
00:27:28,560 --> 00:27:30,920
Speaker 2: he's a martyr and saying he's a hero, and saying

500
00:27:30,960 --> 00:27:32,000
Speaker 2: he's the new Robin Hood.

501
00:27:32,520 --> 00:27:35,639
Speaker 1: Those are the only people you're hearing from. They are

502
00:27:35,760 --> 00:27:37,159
Speaker 1: not the majority.

503
00:27:37,800 --> 00:27:40,159
Speaker 3: That is the one thing I learned from Lewis Slayton.

504
00:27:40,440 --> 00:27:43,480
Speaker 3: I learned so much from him. My boss, my beloved boss,

505
00:27:43,520 --> 00:27:46,320
Speaker 3: the elected district attorney, is like a grandfather to me.

506
00:27:48,160 --> 00:27:52,399
Speaker 3: Never speak to the press. Never and when I would,

507
00:27:52,680 --> 00:27:55,760
Speaker 3: as a prosecutor, speak when I would be caught. Let's

508
00:27:55,760 --> 00:28:00,680
Speaker 3: say the same thing. I believe the jury will render

509
00:28:00,760 --> 00:28:03,879
Speaker 3: a verdict that speaks the truth, something along those lines.

510
00:28:04,200 --> 00:28:07,920
Speaker 3: And you ever noticed baseball players always say the same thing, Well,

511
00:28:08,400 --> 00:28:10,320
Speaker 3: we're going to give it all we've got, you know

512
00:28:10,440 --> 00:28:12,399
Speaker 3: it's going to be tough. They say the same thing

513
00:28:12,480 --> 00:28:16,840
Speaker 3: every time. I do the same thing, because it's a no.

514
00:28:17,040 --> 00:28:20,320
Speaker 3: When if you start talking about your case and you're right,

515
00:28:20,680 --> 00:28:23,720
Speaker 3: the Feds and the prosecutors have said very very little,

516
00:28:23,960 --> 00:28:24,360
Speaker 3: as they.

517
00:28:24,320 --> 00:28:27,479
Speaker 1: Should, but I think when they do speak, it's going

518
00:28:27,560 --> 00:28:28,480
Speaker 1: to be powerful.

519
00:28:29,119 --> 00:28:33,119
Speaker 3: So question to you, what are you doing for Christmas?

520
00:28:33,480 --> 00:28:35,600
Speaker 1: Oh? I had just about ready believed or not.

521
00:28:36,160 --> 00:28:39,600
Speaker 2: Our family we do a huge party Christmas Eve, that's

522
00:28:39,720 --> 00:28:43,440
Speaker 2: the tradition that our family has. And then Christmas Morning,

523
00:28:43,520 --> 00:28:46,680
Speaker 2: of course, Santa comes for all the children, and then

524
00:28:46,720 --> 00:28:49,040
Speaker 2: we go to my sister Charlene's, and then.

525
00:28:49,000 --> 00:28:51,600
Speaker 1: We go to my mother in laws, so we'll be

526
00:28:52,000 --> 00:28:54,640
Speaker 1: stacked up. How about y'all, you're.

527
00:28:54,480 --> 00:28:58,400
Speaker 3: Just gonna have a hoot nanny. We do you traditionally

528
00:28:59,040 --> 00:29:04,800
Speaker 3: the limp Christmas the Saturday before Christmas, whatever Saturday that

529
00:29:04,920 --> 00:29:09,840
Speaker 3: may be, and we have it here and we put

530
00:29:09,880 --> 00:29:13,560
Speaker 3: on a big dig and we cook it all ourselves.

531
00:29:14,960 --> 00:29:17,160
Speaker 3: This year we've cooked all different sort of things. But

532
00:29:17,400 --> 00:29:23,000
Speaker 3: this year, David, my beloved, is going to stay up

533
00:29:23,360 --> 00:29:27,800
Speaker 3: all night smoking butt. And he's in a panic because

534
00:29:27,800 --> 00:29:31,480
Speaker 3: he doesn't have enough butt, so he kiss he's going

535
00:29:31,520 --> 00:29:35,320
Speaker 3: all over town trying to find Boston butts. Okay, and

536
00:29:35,480 --> 00:29:39,360
Speaker 3: then we do a barbecue sauce that I can conct.

537
00:29:40,080 --> 00:29:43,880
Speaker 3: Then let's see what. Then we have traditional sides probably

538
00:29:43,920 --> 00:29:48,800
Speaker 3: sauted green beans. David's got a thing about coleslaw. Blah

539
00:29:48,840 --> 00:29:53,480
Speaker 3: blah blah blah. Okay, then the Graces get together on

540
00:29:53,640 --> 00:29:59,200
Speaker 3: Christmas Eve and normally I make turkey, but the Greases

541
00:29:59,280 --> 00:30:02,400
Speaker 3: have requested Boston butt, so we're going to do the

542
00:30:02,440 --> 00:30:05,880
Speaker 3: whole thing the whole night before Christmas Eve Eve. It

543
00:30:05,960 --> 00:30:10,680
Speaker 3: stept that night too, smoking Boston butts for the Grace bunch.

544
00:30:11,760 --> 00:30:14,800
Speaker 3: And then there's Christmas and then there's a Christmas Eve

545
00:30:16,160 --> 00:30:19,000
Speaker 3: pageant at the church where the twins don't know it yet,

546
00:30:19,080 --> 00:30:22,760
Speaker 3: but they're act tollites because you know, Lucy does not

547
00:30:23,080 --> 00:30:27,760
Speaker 3: like anything to do with being in public or speaking

548
00:30:27,840 --> 00:30:31,680
Speaker 3: in public. She's very shy. So what we've learned is

549
00:30:31,760 --> 00:30:33,760
Speaker 3: we have to tell them at the last minute. Like

550
00:30:34,280 --> 00:30:37,120
Speaker 3: I pull up to the church in the Swank Mobile,

551
00:30:37,320 --> 00:30:40,360
Speaker 3: the Mini them, I opened the door, I let my

552
00:30:40,480 --> 00:30:44,080
Speaker 3: window down about half an inch, and as she gets out,

553
00:30:44,160 --> 00:30:46,040
Speaker 3: the door shuts and I'm locking. Oh, by the way,

554
00:30:46,040 --> 00:30:49,440
Speaker 3: you're an actolyte, and I drive off. If we don't

555
00:30:49,480 --> 00:30:51,320
Speaker 3: do it that way for a whole week or so,

556
00:30:51,400 --> 00:30:51,760
Speaker 3: it will go.

557
00:30:51,880 --> 00:30:52,800
Speaker 1: I don't want to do it.

558
00:30:53,120 --> 00:30:55,200
Speaker 3: I don't want to be in front of everybody blah

559
00:30:55,240 --> 00:30:58,560
Speaker 3: blah blah. So that's we've learned. That's the best way

560
00:30:58,640 --> 00:31:00,920
Speaker 3: to do it. So don't tell her unless she listens

561
00:31:00,920 --> 00:31:04,160
Speaker 3: to crime around it. She won't know until about five

562
00:31:04,320 --> 00:31:07,600
Speaker 3: minutes before they come to her with that big long

563
00:31:07,800 --> 00:31:09,480
Speaker 3: robe and the rope they tire.

564
00:31:11,520 --> 00:31:12,440
Speaker 1: That's so adorable.

565
00:31:12,600 --> 00:31:14,800
Speaker 3: Don David's fine with it, and he's got his big

566
00:31:14,920 --> 00:31:17,280
Speaker 3: long legs hanging out the bottom because there's not enough,

567
00:31:17,600 --> 00:31:19,040
Speaker 3: no robe long enough for hell.

568
00:31:19,720 --> 00:31:22,160
Speaker 2: Hey, how about that jump ball the other night? He

569
00:31:22,360 --> 00:31:26,720
Speaker 2: was in a mouse towering over the opponent, and.

570
00:31:27,040 --> 00:31:28,920
Speaker 3: I loved I love that. Pet Tromas didn't get it

571
00:31:29,000 --> 00:31:30,800
Speaker 3: was part of a video and I had to use

572
00:31:30,880 --> 00:31:35,320
Speaker 3: all my technical prowess to steal the video get a

573
00:31:35,400 --> 00:31:39,200
Speaker 3: still shot out of that. Oh, he loves basketball so much.

574
00:31:39,880 --> 00:31:43,840
Speaker 3: So that's what I've got going on. And of course

575
00:31:44,440 --> 00:31:47,120
Speaker 3: my mom is here. I wish my sister and her

576
00:31:47,160 --> 00:31:50,080
Speaker 3: family could be here from California, but all of her

577
00:31:50,560 --> 00:31:53,440
Speaker 3: children are coming to her in California. My brother is

578
00:31:53,480 --> 00:31:54,880
Speaker 3: in this neck of the woods, so I hope I

579
00:31:54,920 --> 00:31:57,320
Speaker 3: get to see them. But I'll see my nephew and

580
00:31:57,760 --> 00:32:00,920
Speaker 3: his wife and their children. And the Loches have a

581
00:32:01,080 --> 00:32:03,400
Speaker 3: whole bunch of relatives. So I'm looking forward to that.

582
00:32:03,560 --> 00:32:07,720
Speaker 3: Do you know, in all the years I have known David,

583
00:32:08,360 --> 00:32:13,040
Speaker 3: I never had a single, not one crossword with either

584
00:32:13,120 --> 00:32:16,360
Speaker 3: his mother or father, or sister or brother, either one.

585
00:32:16,640 --> 00:32:18,520
Speaker 3: You me believe it. Yeah, I fell on a pot

586
00:32:18,520 --> 00:32:21,520
Speaker 3: of honey. I sure did. And then I think about

587
00:32:22,000 --> 00:32:24,360
Speaker 3: I think about, like the Kentucky moms talk about an

588
00:32:24,400 --> 00:32:27,920
Speaker 3: evil mother in law, whoa and it happens a lot.

589
00:32:28,400 --> 00:32:31,160
Speaker 3: I thought it was a rarity. It's not where mother

590
00:32:31,240 --> 00:32:33,600
Speaker 3: in law's killed the daughter in law and vice versa.

591
00:32:34,320 --> 00:32:36,600
Speaker 1: It's insane the Kentucky mom.

592
00:32:36,800 --> 00:32:39,520
Speaker 2: That's how I knew she did it because when they

593
00:32:39,720 --> 00:32:41,960
Speaker 2: said we were going to meet to shange the children.

594
00:32:42,360 --> 00:32:44,239
Speaker 2: Because if she hadn't ha done it, she'd have been

595
00:32:44,280 --> 00:32:46,880
Speaker 2: the first one telling God and country this piece of

596
00:32:46,960 --> 00:32:49,080
Speaker 2: crab didn't show up. You know, she ain't no good,

597
00:32:49,160 --> 00:32:51,680
Speaker 2: she's no kind of mama. When she didn't do that,

598
00:32:52,520 --> 00:32:55,320
Speaker 2: she was my single focus. Don't you just miss those days?

599
00:32:55,360 --> 00:32:56,560
Speaker 3: Do it? Riding around the car together?

600
00:32:57,040 --> 00:32:58,440
Speaker 1: Yes, every freaking day.

601
00:32:58,880 --> 00:33:00,960
Speaker 3: But now we have children, so that's somewhat of a

602
00:33:01,040 --> 00:33:06,040
Speaker 3: consolation prize. Okay, I want to know if we're married

603
00:33:06,040 --> 00:33:06,880
Speaker 3: to Christmas I love you.

604
00:33:07,280 --> 00:33:08,880
Speaker 1: Merry Christmas. I love you too, Sugar,