WEBVTT - Nuisance 0:00:01.480 --> 0:00:04.640 A group of high school student High school students Elizabeth 0:00:04.720 --> 0:00:07.480 and high school students started a project to research a 0:00:07.520 --> 0:00:11.840 string of unsolved murders. Their research led to the identification 0:00:12.080 --> 0:00:12.799 of the killer. 0:00:12.920 --> 0:00:15.880 Investigators now have an answer to a thirty four year 0:00:15.920 --> 0:00:16.640 old question. 0:00:17.600 --> 0:00:20.680 Once you start getting a few tips, or a few leads, 0:00:20.800 --> 0:00:25.360 or few identifications, then the cold case isn't so cold anymore. 0:00:25.800 --> 0:00:29.479 There's a pretty good chance he's still live. Everything that 0:00:29.520 --> 0:00:32.720 the students predicted through their profile turned out to be accurate. 0:00:33.120 --> 0:00:38.839 Redhead killer profile mal Caucasian, five nine, six hundred and 0:00:38.840 --> 0:00:42.120 seventy pounds, unstable home, absent father, and a domineering mother, 0:00:42.280 --> 0:00:45.880 right handed IQ above one hundred, most likely heterosexual. 0:00:46.360 --> 0:00:50.000 There is no profile of this killer except for the 0:00:50.040 --> 0:00:51.280 ones the students created. 0:00:51.840 --> 0:00:53.800 Just because some of these women no longer have people 0:00:53.840 --> 0:00:55.600 to speak for them does not mean that they desire 0:00:55.680 --> 0:00:56.800 to not be so anymore. 0:00:57.000 --> 0:00:58.680 What if this what do you mean? 0:00:58.720 --> 0:00:59.160 Comes after? 0:01:03.560 --> 0:01:07.679 This is Murder one oh one, Season one, episode seven, Nuisance. 0:01:13.360 --> 0:01:16.160 I'm Jeff Shane, a television and podcast producer at Katie 0:01:16.200 --> 0:01:20.960 Studios with Stephanie Leidecker, Courtney Armstrong, and Andrew Arnoult. Mister 0:01:21.000 --> 0:01:24.240 Campbell was eager to contact surviving victim Linda to ask 0:01:24.280 --> 0:01:27.080 her more questions and find out about her interactions with 0:01:27.160 --> 0:01:30.400 Jerry Johns, the man who was allegedly the Bible belt strangler. 0:01:34.760 --> 0:01:36.880 Did you how do you pick the case? 0:01:37.000 --> 0:01:38.720 I mean, how in the world would you come up with? 0:01:39.280 --> 0:01:42.000 Well, the reason I was, I guess I was drawn 0:01:42.200 --> 0:01:45.840 was we were actually working I was teaching sociology and 0:01:45.880 --> 0:01:48.400 we were working with a teacher who was down the hall, 0:01:48.720 --> 0:01:51.440 and he is the criminal justice teacher, and so we 0:01:51.640 --> 0:01:53.840 decided to kind of team up and put our classes together, 0:01:53.880 --> 0:01:56.600 and we were trying to look at the only cold 0:01:56.600 --> 0:02:00.240 case murder in our county that was unsolved. And so 0:02:00.600 --> 0:02:06.320 it was a redheaded teenage girl and she it was 0:02:06.400 --> 0:02:08.639 not so she's not really you wouldn't know her name 0:02:08.680 --> 0:02:13.360 because she was, oh, sorry, what it's okay. She she 0:02:13.480 --> 0:02:16.400 wasn't related those to any of those cases. What we 0:02:16.480 --> 0:02:18.960 found out is that most of the police felt she 0:02:19.040 --> 0:02:20.919 was They knew who had killed her. It was somebody 0:02:20.960 --> 0:02:24.560 here locally that she knew. But whenever I was researching, 0:02:24.680 --> 0:02:26.200 you know, I was just going online and see what 0:02:26.240 --> 0:02:28.800 I could find about it. And because she was young 0:02:28.880 --> 0:02:31.080 and teenager and it was in the eighties and she 0:02:31.120 --> 0:02:33.680 had red hair. It started bringing up these things about 0:02:33.720 --> 0:02:36.480 these these redhead murders. And you know, I was born 0:02:36.520 --> 0:02:38.639 in seventy eight, so I was growing up here in 0:02:38.680 --> 0:02:42.240 the eighties and I don't remember anything about it. So 0:02:42.280 --> 0:02:45.120 it was just it kind of fascinated me that there 0:02:45.120 --> 0:02:48.200 were things happening in East Tennessee where I grew up, 0:02:48.280 --> 0:02:50.040 and I had never heard about it. And then when 0:02:50.080 --> 0:02:52.160 I talked to people about it, they had never heard 0:02:52.160 --> 0:02:54.240 about it either, And so I guess what drew me 0:02:54.280 --> 0:02:56.240 to it was if I haven't heard about it and 0:02:56.280 --> 0:02:58.400 I live here and nobody else who lives here has 0:02:58.400 --> 0:03:00.760 heard about it, how are they ever. I kept reading 0:03:00.760 --> 0:03:02.360 the articles and TV I was like, you know, we 0:03:02.400 --> 0:03:04.680 hope to get more tips and we need the community 0:03:04.720 --> 0:03:07.359 to help us, but if nobody even remembers it, they're 0:03:07.400 --> 0:03:10.080 not going to get any tips or help. So I 0:03:10.080 --> 0:03:12.480 think that's why the students wanted to look into it, 0:03:12.520 --> 0:03:14.919 and I was kind of interested in it. Was because 0:03:15.160 --> 0:03:17.640 we wanted to bring attention to it so they could 0:03:17.639 --> 0:03:19.880 get some help, so people could call in tips or 0:03:19.880 --> 0:03:21.960 they could get some new leads. And actually that's exactly 0:03:22.040 --> 0:03:24.760 what happened. That's how Tina Farmer was identified, and I 0:03:24.760 --> 0:03:27.040 guess that's the reason I was drawn to the case. 0:03:27.639 --> 0:03:30.480 This may come as a surprise. Jerry John's was actually 0:03:30.520 --> 0:03:31.320 coutl blinde. 0:03:31.520 --> 0:03:33.200 Well, that's what I'm saying. 0:03:33.960 --> 0:03:36.320 None of us had like red hair. When you think 0:03:36.360 --> 0:03:39.040 of red hair. My not a red pint. If you 0:03:39.080 --> 0:03:40.680 got out in the sun. It looked like, you know, 0:03:40.800 --> 0:03:43.520 you know, like red highlights or something, but not red 0:03:43.520 --> 0:03:46.320 writ just you know, strawberry blonders. I don't know that. 0:03:46.960 --> 0:03:47.720 Have you seen the. 0:03:47.920 --> 0:03:51.400 Pictures of me in my host or afterwards? 0:03:51.640 --> 0:03:53.400 I have, yes, So. 0:03:53.680 --> 0:03:55.840 I don't know. I haven't seen it since that day, 0:03:55.920 --> 0:03:57.880 but I mean since the trial, I guess. 0:03:57.880 --> 0:04:00.320 But yeah, that's that's what it looked me. Looked like 0:04:00.360 --> 0:04:02.680 a dark kind of auburn, you know. And I could 0:04:02.760 --> 0:04:04.120 I could tell it had the silence. 0:04:04.480 --> 0:04:05.720 Yeah, I think it was. 0:04:05.880 --> 0:04:08.880 It was It wasn't did any intentionally get red? And 0:04:09.560 --> 0:04:11.760 I just they just had a red tent to it. 0:04:11.840 --> 0:04:15.200 So and it was different colors. 0:04:15.560 --> 0:04:16.400 What I was born with. 0:04:16.440 --> 0:04:21.240 So but what he said, what at the very last second, 0:04:22.040 --> 0:04:24.039 it wasn't. I said, are you gonna kill me? He 0:04:24.080 --> 0:04:27.080 said yes, And that's not any things he really mean, 0:04:27.200 --> 0:04:31.720 you know, mean like just oh god, yes, I said 0:04:31.720 --> 0:04:35.839 why he said, You're a nuisance and that was it. 0:04:35.839 --> 0:04:38.520 It was important to understand how the abduction occurred and 0:04:38.560 --> 0:04:40.320 what Jerry John's behavior was like. 0:04:41.200 --> 0:04:43.800 So had he been I guess when you first met 0:04:43.839 --> 0:04:44.720 him or throughout the night? 0:04:44.760 --> 0:04:45.240 Did he was? 0:04:45.279 --> 0:04:47.680 He like charming or what kind of person was he? 0:04:47.720 --> 0:04:48.159 At first? 0:04:48.680 --> 0:04:50.000 He was it was just nice. 0:04:50.040 --> 0:04:53.159 And I was in a really really, really bad movie 0:04:53.480 --> 0:04:57.039 and I had this friend who had much loose shirt, 0:04:57.240 --> 0:04:59.960 more room than I did, and would do just about anything. 0:05:00.560 --> 0:05:03.000 And she told me about these guys. 0:05:02.760 --> 0:05:05.880 With these hundred dollar bills and for me, you know, 0:05:06.640 --> 0:05:11.279 so I don't I mean, if I normally didn't do that, 0:05:11.440 --> 0:05:15.039 I mean it. It's I don't think I've ever left 0:05:15.160 --> 0:05:18.440 the stranger ever before, but you know, there were a 0:05:18.440 --> 0:05:21.320 couple of guys that had paid me money, but not 0:05:22.520 --> 0:05:25.200 never had I just left the put, you know, with 0:05:25.240 --> 0:05:29.400 someone like that. And even at the child they didn't 0:05:29.440 --> 0:05:34.200 believe that, but I remember this. One of my neighbors 0:05:34.240 --> 0:05:37.039 testified that I didn't even know he was confie and 0:05:38.400 --> 0:05:40.960 they said, well, she's probably slept. 0:05:40.600 --> 0:05:41.320 With him or something. 0:05:41.800 --> 0:05:44.919 And the judge said, she's frosted she probably slept with 0:05:44.960 --> 0:05:47.080 all of them, which is far from true. Of course, 0:05:47.080 --> 0:05:48.880 I never slept with him. He was you know, I 0:05:48.920 --> 0:05:54.599 mean not of course, I guess he didn't. Johnny didn't 0:05:54.600 --> 0:05:57.919 know that. He just assumed that since I, you know, 0:05:58.080 --> 0:06:01.240 read the medium and stuff, that that's what kind of 0:06:01.279 --> 0:06:05.360 person I was. And I I mean, I was no innocent. 0:06:05.480 --> 0:06:06.280 I mean just that. 0:06:07.520 --> 0:06:11.200 I mean from everybody I've spoken to, Jerry John's was 0:06:11.240 --> 0:06:14.040 a very at times, I guess he was a very 0:06:14.040 --> 0:06:17.479 likable person. They said he made friends easily. He actually 0:06:17.480 --> 0:06:21.200 stole a lot of cars because people trusted him, even 0:06:21.200 --> 0:06:23.400 at like car lots, to take it for a test drive, 0:06:23.440 --> 0:06:25.480 and then he would just drive off with it. So 0:06:25.839 --> 0:06:28.160 I was just curious if you had seen him as, 0:06:28.200 --> 0:06:31.320 you know, a likable, kind of normal, jovial, you know, 0:06:31.440 --> 0:06:32.560 kind of person at first. 0:06:33.200 --> 0:06:36.479 Well, actually when we went to Lee's, I don't know 0:06:36.520 --> 0:06:40.360 what happened to Shanon. We had different cars, and I 0:06:40.360 --> 0:06:44.640 guess Jerry and his brother had different cars. And I 0:06:44.720 --> 0:06:48.320 followed Jerry Johnson the hotel and the entire way there. 0:06:48.880 --> 0:06:50.680 I was so scared I wanted to turn off. 0:06:51.040 --> 0:06:51.359 I was. 0:06:51.640 --> 0:06:54.440 I was so scared, and I was even praying, because 0:06:54.520 --> 0:06:57.200 I just I didn't want to go. I wanted to 0:06:57.320 --> 0:06:59.960 and then I kept thinking, I've got two halfs to 0:07:00.040 --> 0:07:02.920 these hundred dollars bills, and he'll kill me over him 0:07:02.920 --> 0:07:06.840 if I don't show up, and that I said a 0:07:06.880 --> 0:07:09.280 thousand times. I started to turn off and don't follow him. 0:07:09.320 --> 0:07:10.360 But if I. 0:07:10.320 --> 0:07:12.720 Hadn't had those hundred dollars half hundred dollars bills in 0:07:12.720 --> 0:07:16.440 my purse, I would I would have I wouldn't have drunk. 0:07:17.240 --> 0:07:18.120 But he was nice. 0:07:18.160 --> 0:07:21.040 I'm not. He never said anything ugly. And when he 0:07:21.160 --> 0:07:24.400 pulled in and said told me was this, well, he 0:07:24.520 --> 0:07:27.080 put the gun on me and told me to get 0:07:27.080 --> 0:07:29.600 in my car, and he drove and told me he 0:07:29.760 --> 0:07:33.400 was a Texas ranger and that he was looking for drugs. 0:07:33.680 --> 0:07:35.200 So he looked at my arms and he said, well, 0:07:35.200 --> 0:07:38.000 you're not a drug user, but you know people i've 0:07:38.000 --> 0:07:41.320 met the dust drugs. So we're going to find Shannon. 0:07:42.000 --> 0:07:44.760 And then eventually he said, I'm going to drop you 0:07:44.800 --> 0:07:47.480 off here in these woods, and he'd already tied my 0:07:47.560 --> 0:07:50.840 hands and stuff, and he said, I'm gonna leave you 0:07:50.920 --> 0:07:53.200 here until I find her, because I don't want you 0:07:53.240 --> 0:07:56.040 warning her or whatever so that she can help them 0:07:56.080 --> 0:07:58.720 find somebody that's selling drugs. Of course, I had no 0:07:58.760 --> 0:08:02.440 idea that Texas Ranger didn't have couldn't arrest people here 0:08:02.680 --> 0:08:05.640 or whatever. I mean, I've never dealt with love before, 0:08:05.760 --> 0:08:10.080 so I just I, you know, back then, policemen told 0:08:10.120 --> 0:08:14.160 you do something, you did it, you know, And that's honestly. 0:08:13.800 --> 0:08:17.600 What I thought until the very last minute, I guess, but. 0:08:18.240 --> 0:08:19.920 He was really he never Oh, I doesn't know that. 0:08:19.920 --> 0:08:20.680 I was going to tell you. 0:08:21.640 --> 0:08:24.000 When he was turned my hate or you know, turned 0:08:24.040 --> 0:08:28.680 my hands up, he I said, oh, that's that hurts. 0:08:28.760 --> 0:08:32.079 That's time. So he loosened it or something keep from 0:08:32.200 --> 0:08:36.320 hurting me. Or I said something was uncomfortable. I can't 0:08:36.360 --> 0:08:38.319 I'd have to stop and think about it. 0:08:38.200 --> 0:08:41.640 But and he whatever he had tied. 0:08:41.440 --> 0:08:44.240 Or moved him, he loosened or put him in a 0:08:44.240 --> 0:08:47.839 different way so that I wouldn't be uncomfortable. And then 0:08:48.520 --> 0:08:53.920 my attorney, I can't even remember. Before the big trial, 0:08:53.960 --> 0:08:58.640 I guess something happened and my attorney said I needed 0:08:58.679 --> 0:09:01.560 to sue him even he didn't have any money, would 0:09:01.559 --> 0:09:02.760 never have any money. 0:09:03.480 --> 0:09:06.240 And I can't remember right now. Why are my attorney's dead? 0:09:06.280 --> 0:09:06.679 Also? 0:09:06.760 --> 0:09:08.720 But he said, you just need to. 0:09:08.800 --> 0:09:10.360 Do him, so to be down on paper. 0:09:10.720 --> 0:09:12.800 If he ever does get anything like a book dealer 0:09:12.840 --> 0:09:15.800 or something, then you know you'll get your part. But 0:09:16.040 --> 0:09:18.200 when I went to sign the papers that said that 0:09:18.520 --> 0:09:21.560 he had beaten me all around my face and stuff, 0:09:22.240 --> 0:09:24.080 I guess because he you know, he did knew about 0:09:24.120 --> 0:09:26.199 the brook and I said, bruised and my eyes were 0:09:26.840 --> 0:09:29.720 blood chalk for months because of breaking the blood vest. 0:09:30.880 --> 0:09:33.480 So I told him, I said, he didn't hit me. Ever, 0:09:33.600 --> 0:09:35.960 he was very nice to me, even, you know, made 0:09:35.960 --> 0:09:38.280 sure I was comfortable while I was being tied up, 0:09:38.960 --> 0:09:42.959 and he said, well that's okay because as you lost 0:09:42.960 --> 0:09:45.760 consciousness and he drugged you in put you in the covert. 0:09:46.440 --> 0:09:49.760 He I'm sure he hit hit and scratched and on 0:09:49.800 --> 0:09:52.760 the way or something like that. And so I was 0:09:52.880 --> 0:09:55.079 very very timid and shying. I just went ahead and 0:09:55.160 --> 0:09:59.400 signed it so that part he never hit me, he 0:10:00.080 --> 0:10:01.559 like I said, he you know, he wanted to make sure. 0:10:01.800 --> 0:10:02.560 And he was nice. 0:10:02.559 --> 0:10:07.880 When we got there. He ordered a pizza and I'm like, 0:10:08.040 --> 0:10:10.880 because I mean, I've never met him before. Yeah, he 0:10:11.040 --> 0:10:14.800 was just there and and he offered he gave me 0:10:15.200 --> 0:10:17.880 two half hundred dollar bills and sending to half hundred 0:10:17.880 --> 0:10:20.559 dollar bills, and then he had a whole stack of 0:10:20.640 --> 0:10:23.600 hundreds and said there's more, you know. But by the 0:10:23.640 --> 0:10:27.400 time I got there, and I was so scared that 0:10:27.480 --> 0:10:29.199 when it was over, I just wanted to leave. I 0:10:29.200 --> 0:10:31.080 didn't care if I got the other half. In fact, 0:10:31.080 --> 0:10:33.400 I didn't ask for him. I just wanted out of there. 0:10:34.520 --> 0:10:36.600 And then he said he'd walk into my car because 0:10:36.640 --> 0:10:40.240 it's dangerous. And that's when he when we're outside of 0:10:40.280 --> 0:10:42.040 the car, Oh yeah, I know. I was gonna tell 0:10:42.040 --> 0:10:44.760 you that's car I had that, you know, the two 0:10:44.800 --> 0:10:47.920 agc X, which was the I mean it wasn't brand new, 0:10:48.000 --> 0:10:50.600 but it was had louvers, he key tops. I mean, 0:10:50.640 --> 0:10:51.800 it was snishes for a car. 0:10:52.200 --> 0:10:55.280 Anyway, he said, what'd you give to this car? 0:10:55.360 --> 0:10:57.760 And I think, like fifteen thousand, I don't know. He said, 0:10:58.080 --> 0:11:01.680 I've got, you know, fifty seven car or however many 0:11:01.679 --> 0:11:03.840 twelve cars, eighteen I don't know what the number was, 0:11:04.240 --> 0:11:06.319 and all of mine together. He don't come to that. 0:11:07.440 --> 0:11:11.400 It's like he was upset because I paid that much money. 0:11:11.440 --> 0:11:14.200 I guess he thought what I was doing to earn 0:11:14.280 --> 0:11:17.520 the money wasn't right. And I was using it. I 0:11:17.640 --> 0:11:20.160 used it to buy a car that he couldn't afford something. 0:11:20.200 --> 0:11:22.520 I guess it's the way it sounded to me. 0:11:23.240 --> 0:11:25.360 So even like when he parked the car and you 0:11:25.400 --> 0:11:27.720 were walking off the side of the road, you felt 0:11:27.760 --> 0:11:29.240 like he was just gonna leave you there, and you 0:11:29.280 --> 0:11:31.400 really you felt like he was still a police officer. 0:11:31.840 --> 0:11:33.880 Yeah, he said he was gonna he was just don't 0:11:34.040 --> 0:11:38.320 leave me there, and it wait for a few miles 0:11:38.360 --> 0:11:40.400 down the road from the place where we were working, 0:11:41.000 --> 0:11:44.040 and he was gonna go back and get shining and 0:11:44.080 --> 0:11:46.720 then come back and get me. That he couldn't have 0:11:46.880 --> 0:11:50.360 me in the car when you really get hurts, so 0:11:50.520 --> 0:11:53.120 that I could because i'd warn him, or I could come. 0:11:53.400 --> 0:11:55.480 I don't know whether we're no cellphones rinsing back then, 0:11:55.520 --> 0:11:59.319 but somebody he was afraid of Warner or something, and 0:11:59.360 --> 0:12:01.640 so that's what he said he was going to do, 0:12:01.760 --> 0:12:05.080 just leave me there in the off the side roasiness 0:12:05.840 --> 0:12:07.640 that time into a tree or something. I don't know. 0:12:07.760 --> 0:12:11.600 Is what I can't remember exactly that my hands were tied. 0:12:19.080 --> 0:12:20.880 Let's stop here for a break. We'll be back in 0:12:20.880 --> 0:12:33.440 a moment. Murder one on. 0:12:33.280 --> 0:12:36.600 One, let me ask you this like, when did you 0:12:36.679 --> 0:12:40.760 realize that you were unsafe? You know, at what point 0:12:40.760 --> 0:12:43.280 did he say something or did something change that you 0:12:43.360 --> 0:12:45.080 realize like, oh, my life's in danger. 0:12:45.400 --> 0:12:50.000 Yes, that the very minute it happened, he had like 0:12:50.120 --> 0:12:52.920 he said, he held the gun on me, and he oh, 0:12:53.040 --> 0:12:55.960 I know. He kept saying if I tried to escape, 0:12:56.480 --> 0:12:58.040 if I tried to get out of the car, run, 0:12:58.600 --> 0:13:01.040 then he would he would shoot me and say that 0:13:01.080 --> 0:13:04.280 I tried to escape, which I believed there were word 0:13:04.320 --> 0:13:08.080 of because he was this policeman that they you know, 0:13:08.880 --> 0:13:12.480 Texas Ranger and he was here to find somebody that's 0:13:12.480 --> 0:13:16.880 telling drugs and arrest them. And he said it's I ran. 0:13:17.000 --> 0:13:21.000 That he'd cheat me back and that he said I 0:13:21.040 --> 0:13:25.360 tried to run, so that's why. And then when we stopped, 0:13:25.800 --> 0:13:28.880 he looked at he was ring slow along the interstate, 0:13:29.400 --> 0:13:31.000 and I think, I'm not ask him what he was 0:13:31.040 --> 0:13:33.000 doing or looking for him say I'm looking for a 0:13:33.040 --> 0:13:36.240 place where I can leave you until I go back 0:13:36.280 --> 0:13:38.560 and get your friend Salmon, and then I'll come back 0:13:38.600 --> 0:13:41.679 and get you. And I still thought, or maybe it's 0:13:41.760 --> 0:13:45.360 hopeful that that's what he meant to do. And at 0:13:45.360 --> 0:13:50.080 this first time he sounded mean or ugly. Was when 0:13:50.240 --> 0:13:52.000 I said, are you going to kill me? And his 0:13:52.160 --> 0:13:58.280 whole demeanor everything changed. He said yes, and that's that 0:13:58.440 --> 0:14:01.440 I knew of. And I said why, and he said, 0:14:01.440 --> 0:14:04.480 you're a nuisance and that was it. But the very 0:14:04.520 --> 0:14:06.960 last second was the only time I actually really knew 0:14:07.000 --> 0:14:11.559 that he was gonna do anything to hurt me, I guess. 0:14:11.840 --> 0:14:13.400 And so that was after you had already gotten out 0:14:13.400 --> 0:14:14.800 of the car and walked over to the side of 0:14:14.840 --> 0:14:15.160 the road. 0:14:15.200 --> 0:14:17.440 That's when you ask him, yeah, yeah, oh yeah. 0:14:17.480 --> 0:14:20.000 We were in the woods. 0:14:19.800 --> 0:14:22.640 You know, down there he had I guess maybe I 0:14:22.680 --> 0:14:25.640 had had my feet tied or something. So but whatever 0:14:25.640 --> 0:14:27.400 it was, he fixed it to where I could walk 0:14:28.880 --> 0:14:31.840 when we got out of the car. And then when 0:14:31.880 --> 0:14:34.840 we got down there, like it was down a little bank, 0:14:34.920 --> 0:14:38.000 and he was gonna leave me there. I don't know 0:14:38.040 --> 0:14:40.720 if he said he's gonna I don't know how he 0:14:40.760 --> 0:14:43.040 said I was gonna stay there. Probably tied me to 0:14:43.120 --> 0:14:46.000 a tree or something, I don't know, but he that's 0:14:46.080 --> 0:14:49.000 when he took the piece of the T shirt he 0:14:49.160 --> 0:14:53.080 ripped into shrip, he ripped into pieces to tie me up. 0:14:53.360 --> 0:14:55.080 So one of the pieces, maybe it was the ones 0:14:55.080 --> 0:14:57.800 that was around my leg. I can't remember running he 0:14:57.840 --> 0:15:00.280 wrapped it. He started rapping it around his fingers. That's 0:15:00.280 --> 0:15:02.440 why i'm That's when I said, are you going to 0:15:02.520 --> 0:15:05.800 kill me? Because that's when I saw him wrapping that 0:15:05.800 --> 0:15:08.440 thing around his fingers, and for some reason, I knew 0:15:08.480 --> 0:15:09.000 he was going. 0:15:08.840 --> 0:15:09.400 To strangle me. 0:15:09.920 --> 0:15:12.280 That is one thing I would like to ask about 0:15:12.800 --> 0:15:15.280 because some of the other victims, even ones who had 0:15:15.320 --> 0:15:19.640 been dead for many years. I am finding online that 0:15:19.720 --> 0:15:23.640 there were ligatures made of cloth, you know, clothing near 0:15:23.880 --> 0:15:27.360 those bodies, and I feel like that could actually be 0:15:27.560 --> 0:15:31.200 something that could help them determine if he was involved. 0:15:31.320 --> 0:15:33.080 Yes, there was another thing I meant to tell you 0:15:33.320 --> 0:15:36.600 is I'm interrupting you, but I forget if. 0:15:36.480 --> 0:15:37.120 I don't say it. 0:15:37.640 --> 0:15:40.920 The knot that he tied after he strangled me, the 0:15:41.000 --> 0:15:44.800 naughty tide was some sort of fancy knot that most 0:15:44.840 --> 0:15:48.240 people don't know. And what I don't remember what right 0:15:48.360 --> 0:15:52.160 had no idea, But every woman, all these women when 0:15:52.200 --> 0:15:54.760 they came, when they people came from these different states, 0:15:55.040 --> 0:15:58.680 all these women had had been there. The knot they 0:15:59.040 --> 0:16:03.640 it was tied was exactly the same with whatever material 0:16:03.760 --> 0:16:07.520 was there that he had. Somebody had tied that same 0:16:07.600 --> 0:16:10.160 exact knot. And that's one of the reasons they put 0:16:10.200 --> 0:16:13.400 the cases. They thought they might you know, people came 0:16:13.480 --> 0:16:16.640 up from Mississippi or we're all different states. That's what 0:16:16.760 --> 0:16:17.320 they were going. 0:16:17.440 --> 0:16:24.240 But then the judge that the media, god bless them, 0:16:24.520 --> 0:16:27.920 kept talking about, you know, every single day it was 0:16:27.960 --> 0:16:30.600 in the paper, but the Redhead murders, you know. 0:16:31.040 --> 0:16:35.120 But the judge said made them stop it and said 0:16:35.120 --> 0:16:37.800 they were none of that. Nobody was allowed to mention 0:16:38.080 --> 0:16:39.600 or say anything about anything. 0:16:39.440 --> 0:16:40.280 Said what happened to me? 0:16:40.840 --> 0:16:43.840 Because if if they kept on, he would get off 0:16:43.880 --> 0:16:47.520 on a technicality, because because it would paint the jury 0:16:47.640 --> 0:16:51.920 or something. That's why they all of a sudden worried 0:16:51.960 --> 0:16:53.880 about or just quit. 0:16:54.040 --> 0:16:54.200 You know. 0:16:54.240 --> 0:16:57.360 It wasn't that they didn't find anything to tie them together. 0:16:57.440 --> 0:16:59.160 It's just that the judge made them quit. 0:16:59.440 --> 0:17:02.840 And then when they sentenced him, the judge looked and 0:17:02.880 --> 0:17:05.760 he said he never ever wanted him to see the 0:17:05.840 --> 0:17:09.560 light of day again. And they gave him different sentences. 0:17:09.640 --> 0:17:11.440 Had come to one hundred and some years or something 0:17:11.480 --> 0:17:14.360 plus thirty days, and they said the thirty days at 0:17:14.400 --> 0:17:17.120 it on. There was what was some teaching in jail 0:17:17.160 --> 0:17:19.720 for the rest of his life, and that I didn't 0:17:19.720 --> 0:17:23.199 even have to be at the things where you you know, 0:17:23.240 --> 0:17:25.560 where he goes and tries to get out in a 0:17:25.600 --> 0:17:28.600 parole board or whatever, because he said there's no way 0:17:28.640 --> 0:17:31.399 they'd ever let him out, so I'd never even have 0:17:31.520 --> 0:17:34.720 to go there and testified or whatever. 0:17:35.440 --> 0:17:37.320 I'm sorry, I can I ask you about the knots. 0:17:37.400 --> 0:17:40.480 So did he did he cut the shirt with a 0:17:40.520 --> 0:17:41.720 knife or did he rip it up? 0:17:41.760 --> 0:17:41.840 Like? 0:17:41.880 --> 0:17:42.680 How did he do that? 0:17:43.640 --> 0:17:45.520 Did might have cut it with a knife, but he 0:17:45.680 --> 0:17:51.800 ripped it into like one or two inch strips. He 0:17:51.920 --> 0:17:54.320 ripped the shirt, the T shirt I was wearing, he 0:17:54.440 --> 0:17:57.200 ripped it into these all into these numerous strips. I 0:17:57.240 --> 0:18:00.560 don't know. Several could have been ten could and I 0:18:00.560 --> 0:18:02.240 don't know. I can't remember. 0:18:02.880 --> 0:18:05.119 And he may have started out cutting. 0:18:04.920 --> 0:18:06.879 Them, but I know he ripped them in. 0:18:06.960 --> 0:18:08.440 I think he just ripped them. 0:18:08.840 --> 0:18:10.800 Now, was that in the car or did he do that? 0:18:10.880 --> 0:18:14.040 It's a hotel. When did he do that in the car? 0:18:14.480 --> 0:18:17.840 When we had gone back to the catch one and 0:18:17.880 --> 0:18:20.199 we were in the second parking lot, there was a 0:18:20.240 --> 0:18:23.080 regular parking lot and then there was like an overflowed 0:18:23.160 --> 0:18:26.200 parking lot where big rigs could sit or if they 0:18:26.200 --> 0:18:29.440 had overflowed, you know, but nobody was there that ours 0:18:29.520 --> 0:18:32.119 was the only car, and like it he was driving, 0:18:32.880 --> 0:18:34.520 and he said that we'd gone back there to wait 0:18:34.560 --> 0:18:37.760 on chin. And that's when he tied me. 0:18:37.800 --> 0:18:40.320 Up and he told me to give me that what 0:18:40.400 --> 0:18:42.960 he was going to do, and everything that he did, 0:18:43.000 --> 0:18:46.600 he ripped it up and used it to tie my 0:18:46.640 --> 0:18:50.600 hands and feet and that was when I, you know, 0:18:52.359 --> 0:18:55.800 I just thought of something that happened that he said. 0:18:57.080 --> 0:18:57.960 Something that hadn't said. 0:19:01.000 --> 0:19:02.800 Well, can I ask you about the shirt? 0:19:02.840 --> 0:19:02.919 So? 0:19:03.000 --> 0:19:05.320 Were you wearing it and he made you take it off? 0:19:05.760 --> 0:19:06.520 Or did he have it. 0:19:06.480 --> 0:19:09.680 Already or yeah, it was a T shirt. I was 0:19:09.720 --> 0:19:12.080 wearing a T shirt. I wearing jeans and a T 0:19:12.200 --> 0:19:15.760 shirt and a black leather coat. And I'm assuming a 0:19:15.840 --> 0:19:19.520 broad I don't know, but he took my T shirt off, 0:19:19.800 --> 0:19:21.560 but I'm pretty sure I must have had a shirt 0:19:21.680 --> 0:19:23.880 under it or something or a bra and I had 0:19:23.960 --> 0:19:27.240 I know I had the black The black jacket saved 0:19:27.280 --> 0:19:27.760 my life. 0:19:28.520 --> 0:19:29.120 How is that? 0:19:29.600 --> 0:19:33.920 A corner of that jacket got in stuck underneath the 0:19:35.280 --> 0:19:39.360 stretchy tied around my neck. And when I woke dot 0:19:39.400 --> 0:19:43.479 conscious head again, I pulled and it came out, and 0:19:43.600 --> 0:19:46.320 it still wasn't enough room for me to breathe, but 0:19:46.400 --> 0:19:48.400 it was enough for me to start using my fingers 0:19:48.400 --> 0:19:51.000 and picking at it. And I thought, sure he was 0:19:51.080 --> 0:19:53.840