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Speaker 1: Hello, and welcome to Cool People who did cool stuff.

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Speaker 1: Your podcast about the stuff that I already said. And

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Speaker 1: I love making that joke every week, but it is

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Speaker 1: what it is. I'm your host, Margaret Kiljoy, and every

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Speaker 1: week I bring to you a story about rebels and

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Speaker 1: radicals and pirates and things like that. Uh. This week,

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Speaker 1: I am excited about a returning guest, Miriam Rocheck. Miriam, Miriam,

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Speaker 1: how are you doing today? I'm doing okay. Happy to

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Speaker 1: be back. Miriam. Is it fun that every time I

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Speaker 1: introduce you on this podcast I claim that the only

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Speaker 1: thing that you've done of note is that you used

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Speaker 1: to be a tall ship sailor and at one point

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Speaker 1: you all hijacked your own boat because you weren't getting paid,

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Speaker 1: and then started running the tours yourself. Um, you know,

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Speaker 1: I think it's it's good to lead with my strengths,

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Speaker 1: and my history of piracy is definitely that. Yeah, not

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Speaker 1: the fact that you save people for a living, any

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Speaker 1: of that stuff. And also with us is the voice

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Speaker 1: of Sophie Hello, that's not that is not your usual voice,

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Speaker 1: my voice. Hello. I feel like I like my caffeine

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Speaker 1: intake today is either too much or too little, and

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Speaker 1: I don't know what it is, so this will be

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Speaker 1: fun for everybody. Well, there's only one way to attempt

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Speaker 1: to fix that problem, and that's more caffeine, because you

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Speaker 1: can't take less caffeine. Yeah. Yeah, we'll see how this goes,

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Speaker 1: friends away. So today I want to tell you a

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Speaker 1: story about black Beard. Black Beard the Pirate. Who a

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Speaker 1: vast stop right there, I am hijacking this podcast. Oh no,

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Speaker 1: I'm seizing the means of podcast production. I'm taking over.

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Speaker 1: I'm going to tell you a story this time. Yay,

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Speaker 1: that's good. I didn't know that much about black Beard. Um,

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Speaker 1: you've you've probably seen the Gay Pirate Show. You could

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Speaker 1: have faked it. Yeah, no, totally. That was pretty much

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Speaker 1: my plan until you interrupted. I mean this was completely unscripted. Wow,

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Speaker 1: I'm so surprised my podcast has been hijacked. Yes, we

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Speaker 1: haven't been planning this for months. All right, we're very

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Speaker 1: good at fiction. You're you are actually good at fiction. Um,

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Speaker 1: this is about all the fiction I can handle producing.

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Speaker 1: So now that I've taken control, Margaret, have you ever

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Speaker 1: heard of a guy named Suleim schwartz Bard, a name

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Speaker 1: that coincidenceally means Blackbeard in Yiddish. I have only heard

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Speaker 1: the shortest cliff notes version of of this man. I

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Speaker 1: think when you say cliff notes version, you mean that

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Speaker 1: you've been around me when I've consumed alcohol. Yes, you've

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Speaker 1: heard me talking about Slim schwartz Bard. Because if I'm drunk,

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Speaker 1: I'm talking about Slim swarts Bard. Today I am stone cold, sober,

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Speaker 1: and I'm going to tell you a lot about Sholim

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Speaker 1: schwartz Bart because he deserves more than my drunken ramblings

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Speaker 1: at people who are being very polite at me. So.

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Speaker 1: He was an early twentieth century clockmaker. He was a

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Speaker 1: Yiddish poet, and he was also an anarchist, a veteran

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Speaker 1: of two wars, a community self defense organizer, and a

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Speaker 1: remarkably successful one hit wonder assassin and avatar of Jewish vengeance.

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Speaker 1: I yeah, I think you're gonna like him. Actually, I

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Speaker 1: think he was a cool person and I think he

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Speaker 1: did some cool stuff. Um. Before I start, I want

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Speaker 1: to say I am hugely indebted to the work of

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Speaker 1: Kelly Johnson, who did a dissertation called Sholem Schwartzbart Biography

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Speaker 1: of a Jewish Assassin, which was available online. UM, and

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Speaker 1: that has been my main source for info on Sholem's life.

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Speaker 1: I also want to thank Anna Elena Tarres, a poet,

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Speaker 1: scholar of you To studies and anarchists history, who was

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Speaker 1: incredibly helpful and kind. Eliua d Am and Karen Finlayson

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Speaker 1: were also very kind and helpful, UM in terms of

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Speaker 1: helping me get translated versions of Sholem's work. I also

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Speaker 1: want to say I'm not at any kind of basic

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Speaker 1: level pro assassination. UM. I think assassination is often not

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Speaker 1: a good strategy broadly speaking. UM. There are exceptions, and

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Speaker 1: I think this story is one of them, which I

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Speaker 1: will make a case for when we get to that part.

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Speaker 1: But for both legal and actual reasons, UM, this podcast

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Speaker 1: should not be taken as an endorsement of assassins, although

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Speaker 1: it should be taken as an endorsement of Stephen Sondheim's Assassins.

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Speaker 1: Is that the play, Yeah, it's musical, it's really good.

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Speaker 1: That's how anyone it knows who show gosh is. That's

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Speaker 1: why people know how to pronounce choal gosh. That's why

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Speaker 1: everyone else knew how to pronounce shal gosh. It's because

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Speaker 1: you need more musical theater in your life. Margaret, Actually

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Speaker 1: that's not true. But you know we will, Okay, but

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Speaker 1: but claw this man as a clockmaker. He is, But

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Speaker 1: we're going to actually start when this man is a baby.

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Speaker 1: He was born to it's a Kayah schwartz Bard in

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Speaker 1: the town of Ismail and what is now Ukraine in

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Speaker 1: eight six, Just two years later, there's a Czarus decree

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Speaker 1: banning all Jews from the area. So his family left

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Speaker 1: and headed to the city of Balta, which was where

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Speaker 1: they were originally from. But they've left. Guess why? Program?

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Speaker 1: It was a program. Um, So if you're counting everything,

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Speaker 1: not the answer it the sad answer. The reason. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: it's it's going to come up a lot. So they

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Speaker 1: had left in two due to a program. So um,

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Speaker 1: you know, if you're counting, that's six years and two

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Speaker 1: moves due to anti Semitic violence for Slim's family. But

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Speaker 1: this moment here, at age two, as far as I

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Speaker 1: can tell, it marks the absolutely last time Sholem runs

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Speaker 1: from anti semitism. Um. From here on out, it's all fighting.

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Speaker 1: He did not have fond memories of growing up in Balta.

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Speaker 1: He was actually very frustrated by the local Jewish community.

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Speaker 1: He thought they were too urban and insufficiently focused on

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Speaker 1: Jewish thought and religion. Um. He was like, and I'm

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Speaker 1: paraphrasing from his own writing here, this place sucks. We

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Speaker 1: don't even have any notable rabbinical scholars here, which was

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Speaker 1: how I felt about. I enjoyed that voice over thank you.

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Speaker 1: That's my that's my surly teen voice. And I can

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Speaker 1: relate because that's how I felt about as my hometown

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Speaker 1: is about my hometown as a kid, except instead of

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Speaker 1: notable rabbinical scholars, it was all ages punk shows, but

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Speaker 1: like you know, potato potato, yeah, exactly. The big advantage

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Speaker 1: of being back in Balta was that that was where

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Speaker 1: It's San Kaia's extended families were, so there was a

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Speaker 1: big community for them there. The family dynamics are actually

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Speaker 1: very messy, um, irrelevant. I'm not going to get into it.

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Speaker 1: There's like eighteen people named Schmool and I'm just not

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Speaker 1: We're not going to get into it. Slim's mother Kaya

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Speaker 1: supported her family with a seltzer business, which, apart from

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Speaker 1: a story that gets confusing because of how many people

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Speaker 1: named Schmueller in it, is the most Jewish fucking thing

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Speaker 1: I've ever heard. Yeah, Kai actually died when Slim was

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Speaker 1: still young. Um and his father remarried, and at ten

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Speaker 1: years old he got pulled out of religious school, which

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Speaker 1: he had loved. And Chilian's relationship with Judaism and Jewishness

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Speaker 1: are pretty unique for his time and place, and that

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Speaker 1: kind of starts here because Jewish texts were hugely important

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Speaker 1: to him, but they were also something that he had

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Speaker 1: been deprived of. UM, So his rebellion later in life

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Speaker 1: managed to be against tradition but not against religion. Huh yeah, yeah,

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Speaker 1: it's kind of fascinating to me. We can talk about

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Speaker 1: it more later when we get to like what his

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Speaker 1: beliefs ended up being. But he never got the full

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Speaker 1: religious experience, so it wasn't something he felt the need

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Speaker 1: to rebel against. And it's it's actually something I think

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Speaker 1: a lot of radical Jews today might find resonent. But uh,

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Speaker 1: like I said, we can get into that later. Once

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Speaker 1: he's pulled out of school, he gets apprentice to a clockmaker,

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Speaker 1: old fashioned apprenticeship. He works for this clockmaker, including doing

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Speaker 1: chores around the house in exchange for training room, and

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Speaker 1: is the room like behind a secret puzzle wall where

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Speaker 1: the once the clock like chimes a certain thing. Then

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Speaker 1: the door swings open and you only have like a

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Speaker 1: few moments to get in and out. It's more of

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Speaker 1: a cuckoo clock situation. You know. His bed is on

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Speaker 1: like a giant spring, and at a certain hour it

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Speaker 1: just shoots out and he's at work. Yeah, I'm glad

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Speaker 1: you asked about that. Actually, I forgot to mention it.

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Speaker 1: What he does not have? Um, he does not get paid,

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Speaker 1: and he is a grumpy teen about it. He uses

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Speaker 1: the voice I was using before, which I that's like understandable.

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Speaker 1: I don't think anyone asked him how he felt about,

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Speaker 1: you know, an apprentice. Wi, am I doing this labor

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Speaker 1: and not getting paid? Yes, that's yeah, and um, funny

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Speaker 1: you should mention that you might have some feelings about

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Speaker 1: that later. M He did learn how to make clots though,

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Speaker 1: which is going to end up being his main job

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Speaker 1: for the next few decades. Speaking of feelings about the

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Speaker 1: compensation for your labor. Pretty at sixteen, So you know,

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Speaker 1: a few years later, someone invites to him to a

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Speaker 1: socialist meeting and he learns about a little thing called Marxism,

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Speaker 1: and he's on board. He's fully in. He dives it

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Speaker 1: right in. But what he doesn't do is let go

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Speaker 1: of his religious beliefs, which is a little unusual. You know,

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Speaker 1: most leftist radicals then as now our secular or atheist.

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Speaker 1: And he just decides God's on the side of the socialists.

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Speaker 1: M pisss off the other socialists. He actually says that

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Speaker 1: one spat in his face and refused to talk to

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Speaker 1: him after learning he believed in God. It look a

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Speaker 1: bit much right, exactly, They never change, but don't worry.

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Speaker 1: He also went into Jewish religious spaces and offered radical

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Speaker 1: socialist interpretations of sacred texts, which fists everyone off there too,

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Speaker 1: So it's it's the same everywhere. He's making friends exactly

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Speaker 1: nowhere with this. Over the years, he's taking on more

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Speaker 1: of a leading role in the local socialist scene. When

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Speaker 1: at nineteen, he makes a trip to Odessa, you know,

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Speaker 1: which is the big city, and he brings back some

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Speaker 1: extremely illegal radical socialist leaflets which he quietly distributes among

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Speaker 1: trusted comrades. Sorry, just getting he nails one to the

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Speaker 1: fucking door of the local noble estate. Okay, because apart

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Speaker 1: from Judaism and socialism, one of his most cherished beliefs

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Speaker 1: is that subtlety is for cowards. So pretty soon after this,

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Speaker 1: he's out on the street and here's a mob of

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Speaker 1: drunk Russian soldiers forming up to attack the town's Jews.

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Speaker 1: So he retreats and gathers a group of sympathetic comrades,

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Speaker 1: including experienced fighters, and forms a strategy. Too. Sorry, I'm

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Speaker 1: kidding again. He ran at the group all on his

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Speaker 1: own and just started wailing on them with a club

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Speaker 1: that he called his socialist stick, and he got the

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Speaker 1: absolute ship beating out of him. But it actually works

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Speaker 1: because they were like looking for Jews who were not

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Speaker 1: going to fight back, and so after you know, meeting

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Speaker 1: at least this much resistance from like one extremely fearless

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Speaker 1: teenager with a stick, they're like, maybe not, they fucked

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Speaker 1: off and they left the other Jews alone. So the

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Speaker 1: way to interrupt bigoted violence in this case is to

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Speaker 1: go hit people with a big stick. While it worked

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Speaker 1: for him. Yeah, no, I'm no, notes that sounds sarcastic,

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Speaker 1: but I'm actually just excited about this, all right. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: so fighting anti Semitism physically is part of his politics

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Speaker 1: and even part of his religion. Um years later, he

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Speaker 1: compares himself to Moses, describing how in another occasion he

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Speaker 1: used a stick to beat soldiers because he did that

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Speaker 1: a lot who were attacking an old Jewish man. And

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Speaker 1: and he said, I showed that a rod was not

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Speaker 1: only created to split the sea, but also to split

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Speaker 1: the heads of hooligan's cool. I like black beards so far.

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Speaker 1: Yeah right, he fucking rules. I like this guy very much,

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Speaker 1: greater black Beard. We'll call him, oh, far and away,

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Speaker 1: far and away, the better black Beard. Now around this time,

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Speaker 1: he gets his hands on a gun through my absolute

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Speaker 1: favorite means of all time. He buys it from a

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Speaker 1: Russian soldier. M hm. Now, Margaret, you and I have

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Speaker 1: talked about the whole issue of soldiers selling their guns

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Speaker 1: back in the Warsaw Ghetto Uprising episode. But what makes

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Speaker 1: this instant a little different is he buys it from

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Speaker 1: one of the soldiers who had been sent to arrest,

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Speaker 1: specifically him and his comrades. I have literally no idea

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Speaker 1: how this went down. I assume the guy showed up

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Speaker 1: and was like, you're under arrest and show him was like, nah, man,

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Speaker 1: that's not going to work for me. Cool gun, though,

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Speaker 1: you know, guys just like, oh, this whole thing for you,

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Speaker 1: twenty rubles at whatever they had um. So he's got

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Speaker 1: a gun. Now the Russian soldier was there to arrest him,

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Speaker 1: doesn't arrest I don't. I do not know how this happened.

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Speaker 1: But yeah, I mean, you're not going to successfully arrest

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Speaker 1: the guy after you sell him your gun. Right, shifted

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Speaker 1: in a fundamental way, absolutely, and now you have drinking money.

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Speaker 1: So what are you doing arresting this guy? Anyway? You're

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Speaker 1: gonna go to have some fun. Yeah, okay, works for everybody, right,

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Speaker 1: And I have to say, you know, as with a

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Speaker 1: lot of stuff show him does in this story, I

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Speaker 1: don't necessarily recommend this approach like it worked for him.

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Speaker 1: You can't imagine it working for any of people. I know,

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Speaker 1: can't imagine it working for me. But works out for him.

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Speaker 1: He goes back to Balta where his family is, and

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Speaker 1: he can just tell that a pot girl mis coming,

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Speaker 1: you know, because like Jews in early twentieth century Russia,

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Speaker 1: Russian occupied land, like had a pretty specific spiky sense

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Speaker 1: about that. I think, I mean, it might have just

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Speaker 1: been always on. I was gonna say, you're what you're

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Speaker 1: describing sounds like a supernatural spiky sense situation. Yeah, I mean,

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Speaker 1: I can't say like my own anti Semitism senses are

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Speaker 1: that finely honed, but like there is a definite vibe

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Speaker 1: alarm that goes off in my head sometimes. Um. I

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Speaker 1: think it's called generational trauma, which is unfortunately not supernatural

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Speaker 1: and not fun like spidy senses, and does not mean

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Speaker 1: you can fly from building to building. Well I can,

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Speaker 1: but that's because the new active spider bite, because con

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Speaker 1: generational trauma. To know good to know, it's not inherented Judaism,

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Speaker 1: no fashtag, not all Jews. Correct some people that have

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Speaker 1: told some things. Okay, anyway, we're always correcting misconceptions around here.

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Speaker 1: So he organizes a few dozen people for community defense,

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Speaker 1: and when the program comes, they build barricades and they

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Speaker 1: tried to fight off the attackers. He's got a cool

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Speaker 1: new gun. He uses it. Now. Unfortunately, Russian soldiers come

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Speaker 1: to join the attack. It had been civilians primarily attacking initially.

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Speaker 1: Russian soldiers come and join, and the resistance fighters end

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Speaker 1: up being pushed back. Some of them are killed, and

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Speaker 1: they do fail to stop the program, which obviously sounds

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Speaker 1: like a defeat to us. Um, but it's much less

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Speaker 1: devastating than the one that had hit the same place

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Speaker 1: back in eighty two, and so Solom considers it a

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Speaker 1: success that like he was able to mitigate the harm

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Speaker 1: that was done to the Jewish community. What year is

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Speaker 1: this that was in? Okay, so like around the same

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Speaker 1: time as there was that revolution thing that almost worked. Yes,

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Speaker 1: we're going to talk some more about revolutions in this uh,

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Speaker 1: in this story, but not actually about that one. Sholim

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Speaker 1: is busy fighting off. Yeah, so he considers it a

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Speaker 1: success because the harm is like not as much as

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Speaker 1: as it had been in the past. He also he

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Speaker 1: fought alongside his dad, who joined him on the barricades,

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Speaker 1: and he was actually the only one of the observant

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Speaker 1: Jews in town to join the fight. Everybody else who

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Speaker 1: joined was like more secular and the observant Jews were

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Speaker 1: just praying for help during the fighting. And for a

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Speaker 1: guy with a gun, Sholim was pretty respectful of this choice. Um.

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Speaker 1: He was actually like kind of impressed by it, I think, Okay,

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Speaker 1: but he had to be impressed while on the run

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Speaker 1: because now he's wanted for being a radical and for

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Speaker 1: being a Jew who shoots at Christians. Um, and he

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Speaker 1: apparently doesn't have enough money to buy all the guns off,

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Speaker 1: all the soldiers who were coming after and yeah, all right,

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Speaker 1: So Insteady skips town he heads to the border of

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Speaker 1: Austria Hungary. He starts going by Nabat, which means alarm,

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Speaker 1: because what's a leftist about a youthful phase of going

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Speaker 1: by a one word random down name. Am I right,

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Speaker 1: magpie talking about boat face? That was what I went by,

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Speaker 1: and I went by boat face. Yeah. So he gets

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Speaker 1: to work as Nabat, smuggling guns, band radical literature and

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Speaker 1: other people on the run over the border. Yeah. He

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Speaker 1: also has to get a job, so he finds work

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Speaker 1: making clocks and like also immediately starts organizing a garment

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Speaker 1: workers strike because the guy simply cannot help himself. He

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Speaker 1: gets ratted out to the authorities, though he goes to

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Speaker 1: jail for a few months. Okay, So now the most

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Speaker 1: relatable part of the story I think so far is coming.

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Speaker 1: Pay attention if you if you don't see yourself in

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Speaker 1: Sholom yet um. I think this is where it's going

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Speaker 1: to change for a lot of listeners. So, a woman

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Speaker 1: known to history only as Comrades Sophia had taken an

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Speaker 1: interest in sholom Um. She had actually been offering to

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Speaker 1: pay his way to America so he could get away

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Speaker 1: from the law because she knew he was on the front.

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Speaker 1: He hadn't taken her up on it because he was like,

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Speaker 1: no way, better to be arrested Diane Siberia than abandoned

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Speaker 1: the you know, blah blah blah martyr. This this isn't

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Speaker 1: the relatable stuff. Don't worry. And she works to get

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Speaker 1: him released from prison, and he somehow makes parole. You know,

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Speaker 1: maybe through her efforts. We're not really sure, but you

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Speaker 1: know he's out and being very good at getting across

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Speaker 1: the border. By now he gets across the border and

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Speaker 1: he is in Austria, Hungary when he stops and goes, ah,

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Speaker 1: she was like into me, you know, like when you're

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Speaker 1: talking with a girl and then the next thing you know,

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Speaker 1: you've gotten arrested and done a few months time, gotten paroled,

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Speaker 1: fled across the border, and then you're like, oh, she

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Speaker 1: was hitting on me. Yeah, Sholem schwartzword was a lesbian.

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Speaker 1: That's that's basically my thesis. No counter argument to offer.

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Speaker 1: So anyway, they do not hook up because he's over

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Speaker 1: the border. Comrade Sophia, Comrade Sophia. Is there like any

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Speaker 1: like is this like person like weave their way through

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Speaker 1: other stuff? Is this like a rich anarchist heiress, like

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Speaker 1: like who's who's comrade Sophia. I think she's whatever our

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Speaker 1: imaginations want her to be at this point, because we

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Speaker 1: know like literally two things about her. One she was

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Speaker 1: in this time and place, and two she dug sholom.

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Speaker 1: All right, all right, rich anarchist heiress? Maybe maybe not

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Speaker 1: maybe rich? Okay, well let's not. We'll make anarchist bank

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Speaker 1: robber we don't know, yeah, or like, um, maybe like

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Speaker 1: a gold digger who got the money the through honest

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Speaker 1: work of gold digging and then turned around and used it.

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Speaker 1: There's so many possibilities Okay, yeah, options are limitless. Um.

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Speaker 1: So he did they do? Like I said, they do

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Speaker 1: not hook up, But he does refer to her as

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Speaker 1: his first love, which I think is very sweet, also

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Speaker 1: very like Russian of that era, to be like my

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Speaker 1: first love who I never really interacted with in any sense,

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Speaker 1: like yeah, exactly like some letters or whatever, who I

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Speaker 1: loved from across the border. He actually, he won't come

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Speaker 1: back to Russia for over a decade. The next time

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Speaker 1: he comes back to Russia will be for the revolution. Okay,

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Speaker 1: yeah exactly, But speaking of anarchists. He spunds the next

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Speaker 1: few years drifting around Austria, Hungary working leading strikes, and

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Speaker 1: then finally the moment we or you know, I was

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Speaker 1: gonna say at least I, but I'm sure you too, Margaret,

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Speaker 1: we're waiting for He becomes an anarchist who he meets

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Speaker 1: a man named David Haskin who introduced him to the philosophy,

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Speaker 1: and like, as soon as he is where the anarchism

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Speaker 1: is an option, he is fully on board, which I

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Speaker 1: think is what happens to a lot of people. They're like,

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Speaker 1: oh you can like, yeah, you can do that. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: that's a choice. I've been trying to make all these

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Speaker 1: other different cludgy things fit together. Yeah exactly. I've been

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Speaker 1: trying to reconcile all this stuff, and I can just

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Speaker 1: be an anarchist. No one can tell me that I

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Speaker 1: can't believe. Well, some anarchists would probably tell you can't

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Speaker 1: believe in God, but they don't have the the way

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Speaker 1: to do that. But do you know who else doesn't

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Speaker 1: believe in God? Miriam? Um me, uh huh. Some of

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Speaker 1: the products and services that support this podcast. Do you

359
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Speaker 1: really never know what you're going to get? No, I

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Speaker 1: really don't. It could just be like all Christian ministry ads.

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Speaker 1: They could all be all Christian ministry ads. It's true. Well,

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Speaker 1: they need to revise their ad buying algorithm. If that's

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Speaker 1: the case, they slip they like we we like, We're

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Speaker 1: able to like kind of like block out categories and

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Speaker 1: you'd be surprised to see where they what they come

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Speaker 1: in as labeled as in order to reach audiences that

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Speaker 1: are totally not interested in them, but they Yeah, it's

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Speaker 1: that kind of the m O of missionaries. What do

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Speaker 1: you think that schwartz Bard would pick for a sponsor

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Speaker 1: for this episode? Clocks Clock was mostly sponsored by clocks,

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Speaker 1: you know, for a lot of his life, much like

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Speaker 1: Blackbeard himself. This show is sponsored by clocks, and we

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Speaker 1: are back, and no one has thought to themselves, I

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Speaker 1: wonder what else clocks could be used for in a

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Speaker 1: direct action sense, like timing devices onward. All right, so

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Speaker 1: when when last we left, Slim had just become an

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Speaker 1: anarchist UM. So if he gets involved with a group

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Speaker 1: that is printing and distributing anarchist literature, UM and they

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Speaker 1: actually pay people for their labor just sick. Yeah, there's

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Speaker 1: but Shulm actually turns the money down and he helps

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Speaker 1: them with the money making operation that was supporting this,

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Speaker 1: you know, zene manufacturing, which is smuggling saccharin like the

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Speaker 1: chemical sugar substitute. Whoa it is and like it's that Um,

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Speaker 1: I guess it was that restricted in UM. I don't

385
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Speaker 1: know smuggling ring. I have so many questions about the

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Speaker 1: saccharin smuggling ring. I would have had to have done

387
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Speaker 1: a lot of research that I I already did a

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Speaker 1: lot of research, so I wasn't going to look into

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Speaker 1: like the economics of illegal saccharin operations. Comrades Sophia got

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Speaker 1: her money. She does sound pretty sweet, but but with

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Speaker 1: kind of a weird aftertaste, you know, the weird aftertaste

392
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Speaker 1: being like cross border longing. Yeah, exactly. Anyway, I mean,

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Speaker 1: I'm just picturing it as like a cocaine smuggling operation,

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Speaker 1: only like they're smuggling bricks of just bake sweetener, which

395
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Speaker 1: is just very funny to me. But anyway, while doing this,

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Speaker 1: he at some point is on the road with somebody's

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Speaker 1: and they get arrested and detained as a thing I

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Speaker 1: have also never heard of, um like Sacharin smuggling underage travelers.

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Speaker 1: Someone with more knowledge of Austro Hungarian imperial lack and

400
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Speaker 1: maybe explain this to me. But he's like twenty two

401
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Speaker 1: at the time. So apparently it is illegal to be

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Speaker 1: a twenty something wandering the roads of Austria Hungary. And

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Speaker 1: I know that a lot of different places in time

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Speaker 1: there have been I mean, if frankly, like like internal

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Speaker 1: passport type things where you're not allowed to go from

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Speaker 1: place to place without certain permissions. I I don't know

407
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Speaker 1: this about Austria Hungary and eight. But okay, so there

408
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Speaker 1: was just like rules about who could be on the road.

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Speaker 1: Maybe I don't know. Well, either way, he is not

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Speaker 1: allowed to be on the road. Um, so he and

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Speaker 1: his friends spend six weeks in something called an unofficial

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Speaker 1: jail in the source I looked at. They just didn't

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Speaker 1: have bribe money on them. Well that that will come back. Um,

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Speaker 1: So they're they're stuck there for six weeks. They're all

415
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Speaker 1: they've all got lice, they're getting sick, and by this

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Speaker 1: point they're like in serious danger of somebody dying of

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Speaker 1: their illness before some older prisoner is like, oh, you

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Speaker 1: actually have to pay for your own release. Nobody told

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Speaker 1: them that. They just kind of threw them in a cage,

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Speaker 1: and we're like, figure it out. Unofficial jail is such

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Speaker 1: a clear example of what actual jail is, just a

422
00:25:37,760 --> 00:25:42,480
Speaker 1: light like distilled to the raw bits. It's like how

423
00:25:43,240 --> 00:25:45,879
Speaker 1: somebody grabs you when you're walking down the street and

424
00:25:45,960 --> 00:25:49,440
Speaker 1: throws you in a vehicle and drives you away. That's kidnapping.

425
00:25:49,440 --> 00:25:54,240
Speaker 1: But if a cop does it, it's like arrest. Um. Yeah,

426
00:25:54,320 --> 00:26:00,240
Speaker 1: so it's a it's a more obvious example locking people

427
00:26:00,280 --> 00:26:02,320
Speaker 1: up in a cage. But so they find out they

428
00:26:02,400 --> 00:26:05,600
Speaker 1: need to pay a bribe or a fine because of

429
00:26:05,680 --> 00:26:08,720
Speaker 1: fine is just an official bribe for their release. But

430
00:26:08,760 --> 00:26:11,360
Speaker 1: obviously they don't have money, so they write to their

431
00:26:11,400 --> 00:26:16,120
Speaker 1: you know, zene making smuggling sacrament smuggling anarchist friends, and

432
00:26:16,320 --> 00:26:19,800
Speaker 1: they get the money to be let go. Now show

433
00:26:19,880 --> 00:26:23,840
Speaker 1: him there's actually cool zone media got it start? Oh nice,

434
00:26:24,000 --> 00:26:27,680
Speaker 1: Yeah it was. It was actually this specific publishing ring.

435
00:26:31,280 --> 00:26:33,200
Speaker 1: I like it. They took care of their they took

436
00:26:33,240 --> 00:26:36,720
Speaker 1: care of their friends. So he feels super bad about

437
00:26:36,760 --> 00:26:39,199
Speaker 1: the movement having to waste money getting his ass out

438
00:26:39,240 --> 00:26:41,280
Speaker 1: of jail. So he decides he's going to pay them back.

439
00:26:42,560 --> 00:26:44,840
Speaker 1: He's having trouble finding work though, probably because of all

440
00:26:44,880 --> 00:26:49,159
Speaker 1: the strikes that he keeps organizing everywhere he goes. So

441
00:26:49,280 --> 00:26:55,600
Speaker 1: he decides he's going to do an expropriation a crime. Yeah, Margaret,

442
00:26:55,640 --> 00:26:59,600
Speaker 1: tell the people what an expropriation is. Expropriation is the

443
00:26:59,680 --> 00:27:02,600
Speaker 1: fans a word for crime when you take things that

444
00:27:02,720 --> 00:27:04,520
Speaker 1: belong to the rich people and you say, now they

445
00:27:04,560 --> 00:27:06,760
Speaker 1: belong to everyone else. But you don't want to use

446
00:27:06,800 --> 00:27:09,919
Speaker 1: the word theft because you want to sound fancy. Get

447
00:27:09,920 --> 00:27:12,360
Speaker 1: it right, exactly? Yeah, you want to throw some extra

448
00:27:12,440 --> 00:27:16,040
Speaker 1: syllables in there. Okay. So Slim and his friend are

449
00:27:16,080 --> 00:27:19,720
Speaker 1: going to rob a bar for the revolution. Okay, so

450
00:27:19,800 --> 00:27:26,320
Speaker 1: the straight edge, Yes, probably all right? Um. And they

451
00:27:26,440 --> 00:27:35,000
Speaker 1: hatch a completely lousy plan, just a terrible dogship plan. Um. Okay,

452
00:27:35,400 --> 00:27:37,119
Speaker 1: here it is. You know, you can see if you

453
00:27:37,160 --> 00:27:40,440
Speaker 1: spot the flaw as I describe it. The two of

454
00:27:40,520 --> 00:27:44,280
Speaker 1: them go into a bar together. The friend stands at

455
00:27:44,320 --> 00:27:46,520
Speaker 1: the bar, has a couple of drinks, and then leaves,

456
00:27:46,800 --> 00:27:50,320
Speaker 1: while Slim hides himself away in a dark corner, waits

457
00:27:50,359 --> 00:27:52,280
Speaker 1: for the bar to clothes and the staff to lock up.

458
00:27:52,359 --> 00:27:54,879
Speaker 1: And go home. Then he comes out and he robs

459
00:27:54,960 --> 00:27:56,560
Speaker 1: the till and he passes the money out to his

460
00:27:56,680 --> 00:28:00,040
Speaker 1: friend through a crack in the metal window coverings of

461
00:28:00,080 --> 00:28:02,800
Speaker 1: this too. Do you see the flaw? Okay, there's two problems.

462
00:28:03,119 --> 00:28:05,320
Speaker 1: One is this is how you rob money in the

463
00:28:05,480 --> 00:28:09,080
Speaker 1: game Morrow Wind, an old role playing game. If you

464
00:28:09,160 --> 00:28:11,200
Speaker 1: want to steal money in that game, you go into

465
00:28:11,240 --> 00:28:13,600
Speaker 1: the store and you hit T for weight and then

466
00:28:13,640 --> 00:28:15,720
Speaker 1: you just wait for the store to be closed and

467
00:28:15,800 --> 00:28:17,879
Speaker 1: then there's no one there and then you can rob it.

468
00:28:18,359 --> 00:28:23,359
Speaker 1: And so they doesn't. The other problem is that if

469
00:28:23,400 --> 00:28:28,680
Speaker 1: you pass the money through, you're still inside. Yeah, that's correct. Um,

470
00:28:29,440 --> 00:28:31,640
Speaker 1: there is no actual plan for showan to get out.

471
00:28:32,600 --> 00:28:36,920
Speaker 1: Is in there in the morning with the money gone. Hey,

472
00:28:38,000 --> 00:28:41,680
Speaker 1: I must have passed out drunk because I'm not straight edge,

473
00:28:41,800 --> 00:28:45,560
Speaker 1: he said, it's yeah, it's it's literally I don't know

474
00:28:45,640 --> 00:28:47,320
Speaker 1: what happened to the money. I was passed out the

475
00:28:47,360 --> 00:28:50,960
Speaker 1: whole time. It's literally the worst plan. Um, you know

476
00:28:51,040 --> 00:28:52,760
Speaker 1: what it feels like to me, It's like, okay, you

477
00:28:52,800 --> 00:28:55,960
Speaker 1: know I love heist movies. You know the low point

478
00:28:56,000 --> 00:28:57,840
Speaker 1: of a heist movie where it looks like the gang

479
00:28:57,880 --> 00:29:00,280
Speaker 1: has been caught you know, and the plans failed, and

480
00:29:00,360 --> 00:29:02,880
Speaker 1: then like, oh, what's this. It's the secret part of

481
00:29:02,920 --> 00:29:05,360
Speaker 1: the plan they didn't tell the audience about, and everything

482
00:29:05,520 --> 00:29:07,719
Speaker 1: is actually fine, and it's so much clever and more

483
00:29:07,800 --> 00:29:10,680
Speaker 1: complicated than you realized that. Like, actually the crew was

484
00:29:10,800 --> 00:29:14,200
Speaker 1: the swat team, you know, they forgot to do that part.

485
00:29:14,400 --> 00:29:18,560
Speaker 1: Oh no, they didn't secretly own the bar. No, they

486
00:29:18,640 --> 00:29:22,640
Speaker 1: forgot to do the twist. No understanding of the narrative

487
00:29:22,640 --> 00:29:28,440
Speaker 1: conventions of heists. It's embarrassing. Actually, now the bar also

488
00:29:28,640 --> 00:29:31,560
Speaker 1: claims that they stole about three times as much as

489
00:29:31,640 --> 00:29:34,600
Speaker 1: stole M says he stole, and he has no way

490
00:29:34,640 --> 00:29:37,200
Speaker 1: to dispute that. So he's charged with you know, because

491
00:29:37,360 --> 00:29:40,600
Speaker 1: it's gone. So he's charged with stealing more money than

492
00:29:40,680 --> 00:29:44,880
Speaker 1: he did. But importantly, he does not give up the

493
00:29:44,960 --> 00:29:47,680
Speaker 1: name of the friend, you know, the one who took

494
00:29:47,760 --> 00:29:49,640
Speaker 1: zero risk and left him locked inside the bar all

495
00:29:49,720 --> 00:29:52,200
Speaker 1: night to be arrested in the morning. It was probably

496
00:29:52,360 --> 00:29:55,520
Speaker 1: his idea, so you know what, schwartz bart idea. So

497
00:29:55,680 --> 00:30:00,120
Speaker 1: the friend. Yeah, this has young idealist idea written it

498
00:30:00,240 --> 00:30:03,640
Speaker 1: for it. But this is actually pretty huge because there's

499
00:30:03,760 --> 00:30:06,280
Speaker 1: very good reason to think that the friend is a

500
00:30:06,360 --> 00:30:09,800
Speaker 1: guy known to history as Peter the Painter. Margaret, have

501
00:30:09,880 --> 00:30:12,760
Speaker 1: you heard of Peter the Painter. I've heard the name,

502
00:30:12,800 --> 00:30:15,200
Speaker 1: but I I don't know. Tell me who Peter the

503
00:30:15,240 --> 00:30:18,960
Speaker 1: Painter is. He's hanging out with Comrade Sophia. Okay, so

504
00:30:19,040 --> 00:30:20,080
Speaker 1: this is this is going to be kind of a

505
00:30:20,160 --> 00:30:22,720
Speaker 1: lengthy sidebar because this story really has nothing to do

506
00:30:22,880 --> 00:30:24,720
Speaker 1: with the rest of the story. But I think it's

507
00:30:24,800 --> 00:30:27,800
Speaker 1: very cool, so I'd like to real quick talk about it.

508
00:30:28,760 --> 00:30:33,920
Speaker 1: Peter the Painter's real name is maybe Janice Shocklish, maybe not.

509
00:30:34,480 --> 00:30:37,080
Speaker 1: We don't actually know who he was or where exactly

510
00:30:37,120 --> 00:30:39,680
Speaker 1: he came from. We know he was a Latvian anarchist

511
00:30:39,680 --> 00:30:42,600
Speaker 1: who moved to London sometime after this whole bar heist thing,

512
00:30:43,320 --> 00:30:46,360
Speaker 1: which is where history really catches his scent. Is he

513
00:30:46,440 --> 00:30:50,560
Speaker 1: a painter? See? I didn't do a deep dive on him,

514
00:30:50,600 --> 00:30:53,200
Speaker 1: because you know, this is sulm story, not Peter's. But

515
00:30:53,640 --> 00:30:55,440
Speaker 1: I could not figure out why he was called Peter

516
00:30:55,520 --> 00:30:57,760
Speaker 1: the Painter. Somebody with like more time on their hands

517
00:30:57,800 --> 00:30:59,640
Speaker 1: than they can figure out why he was called Peter

518
00:30:59,720 --> 00:31:04,320
Speaker 1: the paint What a punk name, right, Like, I'm Peter

519
00:31:04,440 --> 00:31:06,400
Speaker 1: the Painter, but your name is not Peter, Yeah, I'm

520
00:31:06,440 --> 00:31:10,120
Speaker 1: not a painter either, and then like that's like funny

521
00:31:10,200 --> 00:31:11,440
Speaker 1: the first time you have to say it, but then

522
00:31:11,440 --> 00:31:12,760
Speaker 1: you have to say it six times a night for

523
00:31:12,800 --> 00:31:16,400
Speaker 1: the rest of your life. But you keep up the bit, okay. Yeah.

524
00:31:17,400 --> 00:31:19,960
Speaker 1: So he joins the London based Latin and anarchist group

525
00:31:20,200 --> 00:31:23,920
Speaker 1: that pulled off expropriations and when they were caught busting

526
00:31:23,960 --> 00:31:27,480
Speaker 1: into a jewelers in nineteen eleven, they killed not one,

527
00:31:27,640 --> 00:31:32,120
Speaker 1: not two, but three cops. Um A lot of people

528
00:31:32,160 --> 00:31:35,200
Speaker 1: think Peter specifically is the one who killed them. I

529
00:31:35,320 --> 00:31:38,000
Speaker 1: have no idea, neither does anyone else. He was definitely

530
00:31:38,080 --> 00:31:40,600
Speaker 1: there at the time. Now, as you can imagine, this

531
00:31:40,680 --> 00:31:43,520
Speaker 1: started a major man hunt, which was a problem for

532
00:31:43,560 --> 00:31:46,200
Speaker 1: the London police because they were looking for a Latvian

533
00:31:46,280 --> 00:31:48,600
Speaker 1: gang based in a Russian Jewish neighborhood and they did

534
00:31:48,680 --> 00:31:51,480
Speaker 1: not have anyone on the forest who spoke Latvian, Yiddish

535
00:31:51,640 --> 00:31:59,200
Speaker 1: or Russian. After Tommy very so, two members of the

536
00:31:59,280 --> 00:32:02,000
Speaker 1: gang ended up hold up in a house and seven

537
00:32:02,120 --> 00:32:06,840
Speaker 1: hundred and fifty cops as well as the then Interior Minister,

538
00:32:07,200 --> 00:32:11,160
Speaker 1: Winston fucking Churchill showed up, so lay siege to the

539
00:32:11,200 --> 00:32:15,880
Speaker 1: place and they exchanged some gunshots, and after about seven hours,

540
00:32:16,280 --> 00:32:22,280
Speaker 1: the house burned down under unclear circumstances and both anarchists

541
00:32:22,320 --> 00:32:26,640
Speaker 1: inside were killed. Um Winston Churchill personally gave the order

542
00:32:26,760 --> 00:32:29,160
Speaker 1: to the fire department to let the building burn down,

543
00:32:29,520 --> 00:32:32,160
Speaker 1: just in case you needed another reason to hate that

544
00:32:32,240 --> 00:32:38,040
Speaker 1: fucking guy. Damn Peter the Painter. Well, Peter the Painter

545
00:32:38,320 --> 00:32:40,520
Speaker 1: was not one of the guys who died in the fire.

546
00:32:40,720 --> 00:32:45,960
Speaker 1: What and he was not arrested after this, He just vanished. Yes,

547
00:32:46,360 --> 00:32:50,720
Speaker 1: it happened to him after that. Yeah, Peter the Painters

548
00:32:50,720 --> 00:32:53,400
Speaker 1: still with us. He could be here right now. It

549
00:32:53,440 --> 00:32:56,120
Speaker 1: could be me. Who knows, I mean comrades Sophie has

550
00:32:56,160 --> 00:32:59,960
Speaker 1: clearly Sophie. I wasn't going to say it, but sorry,

551
00:33:00,080 --> 00:33:04,480
Speaker 1: security culture. Okay, none of you heard that talks in me.

552
00:33:04,720 --> 00:33:13,880
Speaker 1: That's cool. Um m m mmm mm hmmm. Also, no

553
00:33:17,720 --> 00:33:23,320
Speaker 1: Sophie's Sophie's never claimed to be Sophia's, so their rivalry there.

554
00:33:23,960 --> 00:33:28,240
Speaker 1: Uh I guess, So does that mean you're Peter the Painter?

555
00:33:29,400 --> 00:33:33,640
Speaker 1: Oh ship you figured it out? Well, this is awkward,

556
00:33:34,120 --> 00:33:37,080
Speaker 1: can edit this out? Yeah? Maybe the London police are

557
00:33:37,120 --> 00:33:42,760
Speaker 1: definitely still looking for you. Yeah, so anyway, well so actually,

558
00:33:43,120 --> 00:33:45,880
Speaker 1: so he becomes a legend, right does this like elusive criminal,

559
00:33:46,040 --> 00:33:51,080
Speaker 1: slash rebel. There's a yeah, slash possibly a painter. Um,

560
00:33:52,160 --> 00:33:54,360
Speaker 1: there's actually a gun that like is supposed to be

561
00:33:54,400 --> 00:33:56,320
Speaker 1: the gun that the type of gun that he used

562
00:33:56,400 --> 00:33:59,040
Speaker 1: becomes known as the Peter the Painter in I think

563
00:33:59,120 --> 00:34:04,000
Speaker 1: the ira Um you would know better than me. Irish

564
00:34:04,080 --> 00:34:08,200
Speaker 1: conflict in the nineteen twenties, the Civil War, the Revolution,

565
00:34:08,760 --> 00:34:12,000
Speaker 1: the Civil War. Okay, yes, but there's a gun named

566
00:34:12,040 --> 00:34:15,160
Speaker 1: after him as this like random cool guy who killed

567
00:34:15,360 --> 00:34:19,040
Speaker 1: three English police officers painting the walls with blood. I'm

568
00:34:19,080 --> 00:34:23,040
Speaker 1: are right, that's um, that's how Peter the Painter got

569
00:34:23,120 --> 00:34:27,640
Speaker 1: his name. Okay, so this was maybe the guy. Sorry wait,

570
00:34:27,719 --> 00:34:30,680
Speaker 1: wait wait, I'm not done the Painter's legacy. I'm sorry

571
00:34:30,840 --> 00:34:33,239
Speaker 1: all right, Because in two thousand and eight there were

572
00:34:33,280 --> 00:34:35,879
Speaker 1: two tower blocks built in London and they were named

573
00:34:35,960 --> 00:34:39,319
Speaker 1: Peter House and Painter House, and the London police were

574
00:34:39,400 --> 00:34:44,000
Speaker 1: fucking furious because of a mean fair enough, but like

575
00:34:44,560 --> 00:34:46,719
Speaker 1: because because they were like a hundred years ago, this

576
00:34:46,840 --> 00:34:49,879
Speaker 1: guy killed three of us, and everyone else was like, well,

577
00:34:50,120 --> 00:34:52,520
Speaker 1: we don't know for sure that he killed any cops.

578
00:34:52,600 --> 00:34:55,279
Speaker 1: He's a folk here, leave us alone a cab. You know,

579
00:34:55,360 --> 00:34:57,160
Speaker 1: I could have been his two friends who he was

580
00:34:57,280 --> 00:35:01,680
Speaker 1: in codes he died in a fire. So they don't

581
00:35:01,800 --> 00:35:03,880
Speaker 1: they don't listen to the London cops and they just

582
00:35:04,000 --> 00:35:05,800
Speaker 1: make Peter House and Painter House, which I think is

583
00:35:05,840 --> 00:35:10,439
Speaker 1: really nice. Um, so yeah, that is the guy allegedly

584
00:35:11,400 --> 00:35:14,239
Speaker 1: show him did this absolutely bird brained robbery with Yeah,

585
00:35:15,320 --> 00:35:16,879
Speaker 1: I mean, Peter the Painter does not have a good

586
00:35:16,920 --> 00:35:20,640
Speaker 1: success rate. Let's be real, getting away, it is not

587
00:35:20,719 --> 00:35:24,239
Speaker 1: a very good idea to do crime with Peter the Painter. No,

588
00:35:24,480 --> 00:35:26,080
Speaker 1: it is a very good idea to be Peter the

589
00:35:26,160 --> 00:35:28,399
Speaker 1: Painter if you are doing crime, because he will get

590
00:35:28,480 --> 00:35:32,680
Speaker 1: out of there, he will be absolutely fine. His comrades

591
00:35:32,840 --> 00:35:35,920
Speaker 1: will end up in jail or burned alive. But you know,

592
00:35:36,880 --> 00:35:39,359
Speaker 1: all right, so shol him doesn't give up his name

593
00:35:39,600 --> 00:35:43,759
Speaker 1: and served four months hard labor, okay, which I think

594
00:35:43,800 --> 00:35:45,359
Speaker 1: he's sort of fine with because he's like, well, it's

595
00:35:45,400 --> 00:35:48,439
Speaker 1: not money, and I'm trying to pay back the money, yeah,

596
00:35:48,920 --> 00:35:52,160
Speaker 1: to the to the movement. So like it's basically free

597
00:35:52,280 --> 00:35:55,040
Speaker 1: to do four months hard labor. So once he's out,

598
00:35:55,600 --> 00:35:57,759
Speaker 1: it's hard to find work, um, you know, which is

599
00:35:57,760 --> 00:36:02,800
Speaker 1: a familiar story for people getting of incarceration. So you know,

600
00:36:02,920 --> 00:36:06,200
Speaker 1: he goes wandering again. He does odd jobs, eventually winds

601
00:36:06,280 --> 00:36:09,600
Speaker 1: up in the Carpathian Mountains, where two things happen, first,

602
00:36:09,760 --> 00:36:13,600
Speaker 1: as he starts writing poetry, and the second, probably not coincidentally,

603
00:36:13,680 --> 00:36:18,520
Speaker 1: as he falls in love his second love. Yeah, his

604
00:36:18,640 --> 00:36:22,960
Speaker 1: second love. It also doesn't work out. The woman he's

605
00:36:23,000 --> 00:36:24,960
Speaker 1: fallen in love with has a family that finds his

606
00:36:25,120 --> 00:36:28,080
Speaker 1: level of piety inadequate. Um, you know, which I think

607
00:36:28,160 --> 00:36:33,359
Speaker 1: is harsh. He's very pious. You know he can do better. Yeah,

608
00:36:33,480 --> 00:36:36,640
Speaker 1: she's missing it. Yeah, they don't know what they're missing

609
00:36:36,719 --> 00:36:40,360
Speaker 1: in a sun outlaw. So you know, he leaves feeling

610
00:36:40,360 --> 00:36:43,359
Speaker 1: all bitter and romantic, and he keeps writing poetry because

611
00:36:43,840 --> 00:36:45,880
Speaker 1: feeling bitter and romantic has to be good for something.

612
00:36:47,120 --> 00:36:48,640
Speaker 1: I'm not going to share any of his poetry at

613
00:36:48,680 --> 00:36:51,719
Speaker 1: this moment, but I will later. I think it's nice.

614
00:36:51,840 --> 00:36:55,480
Speaker 1: I think it's good. People say meaning about his way

615
00:36:55,520 --> 00:36:59,800
Speaker 1: to dangle that carrot in front of her face. Some

616
00:37:00,000 --> 00:37:01,640
Speaker 1: people an mean about his poetry. I'm not going to

617
00:37:01,680 --> 00:37:05,279
Speaker 1: be mean about his poetry. People about people, Yeah, people

618
00:37:05,280 --> 00:37:09,800
Speaker 1: are really mean about Louise Michelle's poetry Absolute dicks, just

619
00:37:11,280 --> 00:37:13,279
Speaker 1: UM and actually Um one of the people that I

620
00:37:13,360 --> 00:37:16,480
Speaker 1: mentioned who helped me out with the research for this.

621
00:37:16,840 --> 00:37:20,319
Speaker 1: Um and Lena Tauris has a forthcoming book that will

622
00:37:20,360 --> 00:37:23,560
Speaker 1: be linked in the show notes that will include translations

623
00:37:23,719 --> 00:37:26,239
Speaker 1: of more of his poetry. That is, so if you're

624
00:37:26,360 --> 00:37:29,319
Speaker 1: like I want to hear more of that, that's how

625
00:37:29,360 --> 00:37:33,520
Speaker 1: you can follow up. It's called oh Noetry by Peter

626
00:37:33,640 --> 00:37:40,680
Speaker 1: the Painter's Front, Peter the Painter's Friend. So during this

627
00:37:40,840 --> 00:37:45,680
Speaker 1: round of travels he meets for the first time Zionists.

628
00:37:46,640 --> 00:37:52,360
Speaker 1: Don't don't bo he is not a Zionist, you know,

629
00:37:52,480 --> 00:37:56,080
Speaker 1: he's an anarchist. He's very much a Jewish nationalist, but

630
00:37:56,200 --> 00:37:59,719
Speaker 1: he's against the formation of a nation state. And there's

631
00:37:59,760 --> 00:38:02,080
Speaker 1: kind this weird thing going on where Zionists like him

632
00:38:02,120 --> 00:38:05,880
Speaker 1: because he's a Jewish nationalist, but when they publish his

633
00:38:06,000 --> 00:38:08,960
Speaker 1: work sometimes they just cut out anti Zionist parts of

634
00:38:09,000 --> 00:38:15,319
Speaker 1: it that would suck so much, right, and his biographer

635
00:38:15,440 --> 00:38:19,360
Speaker 1: Kelly Johnson describes his relationship with them as indicative of

636
00:38:19,480 --> 00:38:23,080
Speaker 1: his quote openness to political persuasions different from his own,

637
00:38:23,960 --> 00:38:26,960
Speaker 1: which he super needed because he occupies a political position

638
00:38:27,120 --> 00:38:29,200
Speaker 1: that is at the overlapping of so many different ven

639
00:38:29,280 --> 00:38:33,120
Speaker 1: diagram circles that it's it's basically just him in there. Um.

640
00:38:33,200 --> 00:38:35,719
Speaker 1: You know, other anarchists are put off by his Jewish nationalism,

641
00:38:35,920 --> 00:38:39,120
Speaker 1: Other Jewish naturalists are put off by his anarchism. Religious

642
00:38:39,200 --> 00:38:41,480
Speaker 1: Jews are put off by his anarchism, and anarchists are

643
00:38:41,480 --> 00:38:43,560
Speaker 1: put off by his religiousness. You know. So it's like

644
00:38:44,040 --> 00:38:47,759
Speaker 1: and then everyone's put off by his poetry. No, I

645
00:38:48,800 --> 00:38:53,800
Speaker 1: haven't read it, um. And so basically the only person

646
00:38:54,040 --> 00:38:57,160
Speaker 1: whose beliefs sold them will mostly identify with um is

647
00:38:57,160 --> 00:38:59,879
Speaker 1: a man who will later become his mentor, Rabbi yak

648
00:39:00,000 --> 00:39:02,239
Speaker 1: of Salkin. He's not actually in the story at this

649
00:39:02,320 --> 00:39:03,640
Speaker 1: point in the store, but I just want to bring

650
00:39:03,719 --> 00:39:07,640
Speaker 1: him up because we're talking about his beliefs. Everyone should

651
00:39:07,680 --> 00:39:12,680
Speaker 1: read more about him, um. Again. Torres has an essay

652
00:39:12,680 --> 00:39:16,280
Speaker 1: about him available online. Zalkin actually started out as a Zionist,

653
00:39:16,360 --> 00:39:18,440
Speaker 1: but then he became an anarchist. And while he retained

654
00:39:18,440 --> 00:39:21,080
Speaker 1: a desire to create a stateless community of Jews, Arabs

655
00:39:21,120 --> 00:39:24,640
Speaker 1: and everyone else in Palestine, Um, he writes that because

656
00:39:24,760 --> 00:39:27,600
Speaker 1: Zion He later writes that because Zion is a displaced people,

657
00:39:27,640 --> 00:39:30,839
Speaker 1: to make a home for Jewish refugees. Quote. Our first

658
00:39:30,880 --> 00:39:33,600
Speaker 1: step into the realm of colonialistic ethics is a mark

659
00:39:33,680 --> 00:39:36,000
Speaker 1: of shame for the Jews, which can never be washed off.

660
00:39:36,040 --> 00:39:38,279
Speaker 1: It is the blackest blood to have been written into

661
00:39:38,320 --> 00:39:41,120
Speaker 1: the black history of colonial politics, a crime of which

662
00:39:41,200 --> 00:39:45,520
Speaker 1: the conquistadors of America would barely have been able. Damn.

663
00:39:45,600 --> 00:39:51,959
Speaker 1: Subtleties for cowards, Subtleties for cowards. Zalkind also once broke

664
00:39:52,080 --> 00:39:57,560
Speaker 1: his cane over some Nazis. Um. Yeah. He takes a

665
00:39:57,719 --> 00:40:00,600
Speaker 1: mystical and revolutionary approach to Judy, a some which sees

666
00:40:00,640 --> 00:40:04,840
Speaker 1: anarchism is a fundamental aspect of Jewish tradition and teaching,

667
00:40:05,040 --> 00:40:08,719
Speaker 1: which I dig, even though I'm not particularly into mysticism.

668
00:40:08,760 --> 00:40:11,160
Speaker 1: I think it's very cool. And I bring up zalkindin

669
00:40:11,239 --> 00:40:15,520
Speaker 1: Sholem's you know, fairly unpopular at the time beliefs, because

670
00:40:15,560 --> 00:40:18,719
Speaker 1: I think there's a lot for contemporary people, especially contemporary

671
00:40:19,000 --> 00:40:22,480
Speaker 1: Jewish radicals, in their thinking if I can sort of

672
00:40:22,920 --> 00:40:27,319
Speaker 1: do inside baseball on anarchist Jews for a second here. Yeah,

673
00:40:28,040 --> 00:40:30,920
Speaker 1: I recently saw a scholar of Jewish anarchism comment that

674
00:40:31,080 --> 00:40:34,400
Speaker 1: contemporary Jewish anarchists seemed to be turning back towards religion,

675
00:40:34,600 --> 00:40:37,279
Speaker 1: engaging with Jewish religious thought and ritual a lot more

676
00:40:37,360 --> 00:40:42,040
Speaker 1: than say, Emma Goldman's generation did Friend of the Pod

677
00:40:42,200 --> 00:40:44,080
Speaker 1: if you want, if anyone wants to know Emma Goldman,

678
00:40:44,120 --> 00:40:48,040
Speaker 1: as the birth Control episode talks about her absolute friend

679
00:40:48,040 --> 00:40:50,880
Speaker 1: of the Pod, she will return later in this story.

680
00:40:52,120 --> 00:40:54,279
Speaker 1: You know. But but that that shift was kind of

681
00:40:54,320 --> 00:40:56,880
Speaker 1: framed as a betrial, like the anarchists, you know, who

682
00:40:56,960 --> 00:40:59,560
Speaker 1: famously held balls and picnics on Young Kippur would be

683
00:40:59,600 --> 00:41:03,000
Speaker 1: disappoint did in their philosophical descendence for re engaging with religion.

684
00:41:03,600 --> 00:41:05,799
Speaker 1: And I disagree. You know, firstly, I think it would

685
00:41:05,840 --> 00:41:08,640
Speaker 1: be way more disappointing if we just imitated our predecessors.

686
00:41:08,800 --> 00:41:12,319
Speaker 1: Like that's just being prisoners to a different tradition. Um,

687
00:41:12,400 --> 00:41:14,880
Speaker 1: I think it's our obligation to our anarchists forbears, not

688
00:41:15,000 --> 00:41:18,600
Speaker 1: to turn them into the authorities that they hated, and like,

689
00:41:18,680 --> 00:41:19,920
Speaker 1: it makes a ton of sense to me that we

690
00:41:19,960 --> 00:41:22,799
Speaker 1: have a different relationship to Jewish religious practice because people

691
00:41:22,880 --> 00:41:30,320
Speaker 1: like Emma Goldman grew up oppressed. Damn it, Margaret, sorry,

692
00:41:30,600 --> 00:41:35,239
Speaker 1: let's continue. You know, they grew up oppressed by their

693
00:41:35,520 --> 00:41:37,839
Speaker 1: communities religion in a very real way, Like I think

694
00:41:37,880 --> 00:41:39,680
Speaker 1: you talked about this in the birth control episode that

695
00:41:39,760 --> 00:41:41,279
Speaker 1: you know, her father told her. You know, all a

696
00:41:41,360 --> 00:41:43,480
Speaker 1: Jewish girl needs to know how to do is make

697
00:41:43,520 --> 00:41:46,239
Speaker 1: a filter fish and pop out babies, right, And like,

698
00:41:46,520 --> 00:41:48,680
Speaker 1: when that's the version of a religion that you grew

699
00:41:48,760 --> 00:41:51,239
Speaker 1: up with, it makes sense to rebel against it. And

700
00:41:52,280 --> 00:41:56,279
Speaker 1: many contemporary Jewish anarchists, like including me, we grew up

701
00:41:56,280 --> 00:41:59,080
Speaker 1: in liberal, secular Jewish homes and so a lot of

702
00:41:59,200 --> 00:42:02,000
Speaker 1: us weren't a pressed by Jewish tradition. And you know,

703
00:42:02,120 --> 00:42:04,800
Speaker 1: especially in a post Holocaust environments, a lot of the

704
00:42:04,960 --> 00:42:07,360
Speaker 1: turning away from Jewish culture that was popular in the

705
00:42:07,400 --> 00:42:11,640
Speaker 1: early twentieth century feels less like liberation and more like assimilation. So,

706
00:42:12,520 --> 00:42:15,200
Speaker 1: you know, as an atheist anarchist Jew, I think they're

707
00:42:15,400 --> 00:42:18,080
Speaker 1: basically infinite ways to be an anarchist Jew, which rules

708
00:42:18,200 --> 00:42:21,200
Speaker 1: and Zalkin and Schwartzward offer a really interesting example of

709
00:42:21,280 --> 00:42:23,279
Speaker 1: some ways to do that, you know, not my way

710
00:42:23,320 --> 00:42:27,120
Speaker 1: exactly because they believe in God, but still an interesting

711
00:42:27,200 --> 00:42:29,680
Speaker 1: thing I think people will relate to. And you know

712
00:42:30,080 --> 00:42:32,799
Speaker 1: who else offers a really interesting way to be an

713
00:42:32,840 --> 00:42:39,880
Speaker 1: anarchist Jew clocks exactly, and other goods and services. We're

714
00:42:39,920 --> 00:42:44,520
Speaker 1: so good at this, We're like, we're fucking pros. Yeah,

715
00:42:45,320 --> 00:42:49,480
Speaker 1: we're really good at add transitions were co signing professionals

716
00:42:50,000 --> 00:42:52,400
Speaker 1: love to see it. You know who else likes to

717
00:42:52,440 --> 00:43:02,880
Speaker 1: be paid for their labor? Everybody? Uh, here's some advertisements.

718
00:43:07,640 --> 00:43:10,000
Speaker 1: We are back and we are talking about the devices

719
00:43:10,080 --> 00:43:14,760
Speaker 1: that slowly tick forward, reminding us of our doom clocks.

720
00:43:15,480 --> 00:43:19,880
Speaker 1: You mean, devices that progress ever forward, bringing about the

721
00:43:19,960 --> 00:43:25,480
Speaker 1: inevitability of revolution Marxist clocks. Yeah, I guess so what

722
00:43:25,560 --> 00:43:27,960
Speaker 1: you're saying about this like ritual stuff is it actually

723
00:43:28,080 --> 00:43:30,040
Speaker 1: is really interesting to me because I think that that

724
00:43:30,200 --> 00:43:34,200
Speaker 1: is one of the things I've noticed that I'm not Jewish.

725
00:43:34,280 --> 00:43:36,800
Speaker 1: People probably are aware of that, but I've noticed that

726
00:43:37,360 --> 00:43:40,200
Speaker 1: with a lot of the more religious radicals, like not

727
00:43:40,360 --> 00:43:43,040
Speaker 1: like radically religious, but the people who are radical, who

728
00:43:43,280 --> 00:43:46,600
Speaker 1: who um are religious or care about their like um

729
00:43:46,960 --> 00:43:50,640
Speaker 1: religious cultural backgrounds and things like that. It's just really

730
00:43:50,680 --> 00:43:52,520
Speaker 1: interesting to me because, yeah, people are coming from just

731
00:43:52,680 --> 00:43:56,040
Speaker 1: completely different contexts, and I really appreciate that people are

732
00:43:56,920 --> 00:44:00,279
Speaker 1: applying their current context to a situation and stead of

733
00:44:00,400 --> 00:44:04,120
Speaker 1: just kind of yeah, blindly saying, well, someone from the

734
00:44:04,200 --> 00:44:05,880
Speaker 1: nineteenth century, I said I have to do this, so

735
00:44:05,920 --> 00:44:08,960
Speaker 1: I have to do that. I just reiterated what you said,

736
00:44:09,040 --> 00:44:12,640
Speaker 1: but it sounded really clever when I said it. No,

737
00:44:12,800 --> 00:44:14,759
Speaker 1: but I mean, I'm glad that it has like some

738
00:44:14,920 --> 00:44:18,840
Speaker 1: residents for people coming from other religious and cultural traditions.

739
00:44:19,080 --> 00:44:21,800
Speaker 1: That's you know. I think there's a lot here for

740
00:44:21,920 --> 00:44:24,799
Speaker 1: people who are coming from wherever. I think everyone should

741
00:44:24,840 --> 00:44:28,200
Speaker 1: read more about these traditions. I think they're great. Or

742
00:44:28,280 --> 00:44:31,320
Speaker 1: when in doubt, just break your cane over Nazis. I

743
00:44:31,400 --> 00:44:34,080
Speaker 1: mean always, if you can't figure out the rest of

744
00:44:34,120 --> 00:44:37,839
Speaker 1: the ship, just break your cane over Nazis. We should,

745
00:44:37,840 --> 00:44:39,880
Speaker 1: I should add. I super don't have time to get

746
00:44:39,920 --> 00:44:41,960
Speaker 1: into it. But there is good reason to think that

747
00:44:42,040 --> 00:44:44,879
Speaker 1: Sholem didn't spend his whole life believing in God. Based

748
00:44:44,960 --> 00:44:47,440
Speaker 1: on private correspondence is that I don't really have access

749
00:44:47,440 --> 00:44:50,480
Speaker 1: to because the dual lingo owl has not yet gotten

750
00:44:50,520 --> 00:44:53,719
Speaker 1: me to like that point of Yiddish fluency that the

751
00:44:54,320 --> 00:45:03,120
Speaker 1: talking about h v uh ussan politics level. Yeah, you know, okay,

752
00:45:03,320 --> 00:45:11,360
Speaker 1: this isevik debate is not adequately cover Hi, my my

753
00:45:12,200 --> 00:45:14,359
Speaker 1: parts of my family speak check. But I didn't really

754
00:45:14,400 --> 00:45:16,640
Speaker 1: grow up speaking it. So when I got to college,

755
00:45:16,640 --> 00:45:18,719
Speaker 1: I took a class and like tried to learn check.

756
00:45:19,440 --> 00:45:21,959
Speaker 1: And I was giving a report in class in check

757
00:45:22,560 --> 00:45:27,960
Speaker 1: on Jon Huss, which was who was a famous check heretic.

758
00:45:28,920 --> 00:45:31,920
Speaker 1: And then the professor Lake started asking me questions and

759
00:45:32,000 --> 00:45:35,719
Speaker 1: I realized I was supposed to be explaining transubstantiation in

760
00:45:35,920 --> 00:45:38,880
Speaker 1: check when I don't even understand it in English. No

761
00:45:39,000 --> 00:45:46,600
Speaker 1: one does. It's like it was like so bred people

762
00:45:47,719 --> 00:45:55,520
Speaker 1: cannibalism in check. It was very uh, very embarrassing. Any

763
00:45:55,560 --> 00:45:58,000
Speaker 1: other embarrassing stories that you would like to tell right now?

764
00:45:58,480 --> 00:46:03,840
Speaker 1: It's just us. That's all I've got. Anyway. Yeah, I'd

765
00:46:03,880 --> 00:46:06,680
Speaker 1: love to do more research on like shol Him's personal beliefs,

766
00:46:06,760 --> 00:46:09,800
Speaker 1: but uh, I didn't, so I'm kind of going with

767
00:46:09,920 --> 00:46:13,600
Speaker 1: like publicly, he really always expressed belief in God. So

768
00:46:15,760 --> 00:46:20,720
Speaker 1: so around this time, Slan goes to Paris. He spends

769
00:46:20,800 --> 00:46:25,440
Speaker 1: four years there and he spends the entire time outside

770
00:46:25,520 --> 00:46:31,040
Speaker 1: of jail. Who yeah, pretty good run. He also meets

771
00:46:31,120 --> 00:46:34,320
Speaker 1: a woman named Anna. She is a Jewish immigrant from Odessa.

772
00:46:34,480 --> 00:46:38,600
Speaker 1: They hit it off, fall in love, and shol Him

773
00:46:38,719 --> 00:46:41,120
Speaker 1: of course writes home to his father to tell him

774
00:46:41,120 --> 00:46:43,680
Speaker 1: about this wonderful girl that he's met, But then like

775
00:46:43,800 --> 00:46:46,359
Speaker 1: halfway through the letter, he changes the subject to how

776
00:46:46,440 --> 00:46:49,120
Speaker 1: he's thinking of starting a group to take vengeance on

777
00:46:49,200 --> 00:46:55,240
Speaker 1: behalf of Jews murdered in pogroms. H for what to quote?

778
00:46:55,760 --> 00:46:58,960
Speaker 1: For one drop of innocent blood, for one violated Jewish girl,

779
00:46:59,040 --> 00:47:02,160
Speaker 1: we will destroy all their cities are motto tremble for

780
00:47:02,280 --> 00:47:05,160
Speaker 1: a day is coming, an ominous day of reckoning for

781
00:47:05,280 --> 00:47:10,520
Speaker 1: all bloodthirsty beasts. I I hope as long as Anna

782
00:47:10,600 --> 00:47:13,600
Speaker 1: is cool with this, this just rules. If Anna feels

783
00:47:13,640 --> 00:47:16,560
Speaker 1: a little bit like sidelined, it's not so great. But

784
00:47:16,680 --> 00:47:20,319
Speaker 1: if Anna's down such bad news about that, No, don't

785
00:47:20,360 --> 00:47:23,640
Speaker 1: sideline Anna Schwartz part you must be perfect in every way.

786
00:47:23,680 --> 00:47:28,799
Speaker 1: This is uncomplicated. Cool people with Margaret and Miriam. Are

787
00:47:28,880 --> 00:47:32,120
Speaker 1: you reading my script? Because like literally the next paragraph

788
00:47:32,200 --> 00:47:35,200
Speaker 1: is about how he sidelines Ata. Okay, fine, tell me

789
00:47:35,239 --> 00:47:38,560
Speaker 1: about how he sidelines Anna. You can't have nice things

790
00:47:38,600 --> 00:47:42,600
Speaker 1: because of patriarchy. I know, it's it's the worst. So

791
00:47:42,840 --> 00:47:45,839
Speaker 1: at this point, he's twenty eight, he's got no sense

792
00:47:45,880 --> 00:47:49,160
Speaker 1: of self preservation, and the First World War breaks out?

793
00:47:49,800 --> 00:47:52,120
Speaker 1: Does he join? Is he? Is he Team krip Popkin?

794
00:47:53,600 --> 00:47:57,680
Speaker 1: That is all? Are you reading my script? Okay? So, um,

795
00:47:58,800 --> 00:48:02,200
Speaker 1: he marries Anna and then he immediately volunteers to fight. Yeah,

796
00:48:02,520 --> 00:48:06,040
Speaker 1: Anna is not happy about this, which is going to

797
00:48:06,080 --> 00:48:09,240
Speaker 1: become a pattern because he makes major decisions without consulting

798
00:48:09,280 --> 00:48:12,400
Speaker 1: her and then asked fucking baffled when she responds with

799
00:48:12,480 --> 00:48:16,160
Speaker 1: anything but unbridled support and hero worship. Motherfucker. All right.

800
00:48:17,440 --> 00:48:20,000
Speaker 1: It's it's absolutely a theme of historical anarchists that while

801
00:48:20,000 --> 00:48:23,040
Speaker 1: they sound like brad people, they also sound like absolutely

802
00:48:23,440 --> 00:48:27,440
Speaker 1: terrible partners. I wish you were an exception. He is not.

803
00:48:28,640 --> 00:48:30,839
Speaker 1: But Margaret, since you bring it up, can you tell

804
00:48:30,880 --> 00:48:33,560
Speaker 1: us how anarchists felt about World War One? I only

805
00:48:33,719 --> 00:48:36,279
Speaker 1: kind of get got into this because it's it's like

806
00:48:36,360 --> 00:48:38,879
Speaker 1: a part of the history that like, isn't really cool

807
00:48:38,920 --> 00:48:42,400
Speaker 1: people died cool stuff. It's messy stuff that messy people

808
00:48:42,600 --> 00:48:46,480
Speaker 1: felt messy about. But there was this whole big split where, um,

809
00:48:47,239 --> 00:48:49,920
Speaker 1: half the people, half the anarchists, were like, we need

810
00:48:50,000 --> 00:48:52,279
Speaker 1: to stay that goddamn over loving funk out of this

811
00:48:52,400 --> 00:48:55,680
Speaker 1: war because this is a war between nation states and

812
00:48:55,840 --> 00:48:59,360
Speaker 1: past not passivism, but antimilitarism is the only useful response.

813
00:48:59,760 --> 00:49:03,960
Speaker 1: And there was another half, most notably led by Prince

814
00:49:04,040 --> 00:49:06,239
Speaker 1: Peter Kropotkin, who I believe first came up in our

815
00:49:06,640 --> 00:49:09,440
Speaker 1: Nihilist episode Friend of the pot Yeah, and he's like

816
00:49:09,480 --> 00:49:10,880
Speaker 1: one of the He had a lot of cool stuff

817
00:49:10,880 --> 00:49:15,279
Speaker 1: like evolution and and all this, but he was like, well,

818
00:49:16,120 --> 00:49:20,960
Speaker 1: Germany is being bad, and stopping Germany is good, and

819
00:49:21,680 --> 00:49:23,600
Speaker 1: and I mostly know about it because people try to

820
00:49:23,680 --> 00:49:28,480
Speaker 1: draw parallels to Russia invasion of Ukraine and all this stuff.

821
00:49:28,600 --> 00:49:30,800
Speaker 1: I am not trying to opine about this. I have

822
00:49:30,960 --> 00:49:34,920
Speaker 1: no opinion about this. I haven't looked into it enough. Miriam.

823
00:49:36,320 --> 00:49:39,279
Speaker 1: Take on World War One, I know I'm about I

824
00:49:39,360 --> 00:49:42,719
Speaker 1: could have bad hot takes about other stuff. Um uh,

825
00:49:42,880 --> 00:49:48,439
Speaker 1: potato is the better way to pronounce it? Controversial? Yeah,

826
00:49:49,719 --> 00:49:57,919
Speaker 1: that's how you pronounced World War One, all right, Miriam. Yeah,

827
00:49:58,000 --> 00:50:01,400
Speaker 1: so I I My understanding of KRP. P. Hopkins position

828
00:50:01,480 --> 00:50:04,919
Speaker 1: here is that in addition to like Germany is being bad,

829
00:50:04,960 --> 00:50:07,520
Speaker 1: he was basically like, France is right now the best

830
00:50:07,600 --> 00:50:10,120
Speaker 1: bastion of liberty we have got because they're like a

831
00:50:10,160 --> 00:50:14,279
Speaker 1: republic or whatever. Yeah whatever, yeah, something like that. Um

832
00:50:14,360 --> 00:50:16,200
Speaker 1: so it's it's very important to prevent it from being

833
00:50:16,239 --> 00:50:19,799
Speaker 1: occupied by an imperial power. And that's basically the page

834
00:50:19,840 --> 00:50:23,279
Speaker 1: that shalim is on um and but it was like

835
00:50:23,280 --> 00:50:25,800
Speaker 1: a little more complicated. He also wanted to join because

836
00:50:25,800 --> 00:50:28,279
Speaker 1: he wanted to prove that Jews were willing to fight,

837
00:50:28,880 --> 00:50:31,799
Speaker 1: which you know we've we've seen has been important to him. Sure,

838
00:50:32,160 --> 00:50:39,239
Speaker 1: I mean fight what, just fight anything. I guess that guy,

839
00:50:39,800 --> 00:50:43,600
Speaker 1: that guy, yeah, funk that guy. I mean, I guess

840
00:50:43,640 --> 00:50:47,040
Speaker 1: Germany was invading a country anyway. Yeah, yeah, I mean

841
00:50:47,080 --> 00:50:50,400
Speaker 1: I think like most people, um could look at this

842
00:50:50,480 --> 00:50:52,800
Speaker 1: situation and be like, well, we know which side is

843
00:50:52,920 --> 00:50:56,040
Speaker 1: wrong here, Um, it's just a little harder to find

844
00:50:56,080 --> 00:50:59,680
Speaker 1: decide that's right. Yeah, m hm, you know. So, basically

845
00:50:59,719 --> 00:51:03,360
Speaker 1: he thinks defending France from German militarism is more important

846
00:51:03,400 --> 00:51:07,799
Speaker 1: than remaining antimilitarist himself. But that does not stop him

847
00:51:07,840 --> 00:51:10,680
Speaker 1: from being, you know, deeply critical of the side he's on.

848
00:51:11,520 --> 00:51:14,359
Speaker 1: He's in the foreign legion because he's not a citizen um.

849
00:51:14,440 --> 00:51:17,080
Speaker 1: And he says of the average professional legionary who he's

850
00:51:17,120 --> 00:51:21,720
Speaker 1: fighting alongside in their work civilizing, civilizing is in quotes

851
00:51:22,080 --> 00:51:25,560
Speaker 1: the quiet inhabitants of Africa, killing the men, raping the women,

852
00:51:25,640 --> 00:51:28,759
Speaker 1: and through various military reports, they reach a certain rank

853
00:51:28,960 --> 00:51:32,040
Speaker 1: become a corporal and receive a Copper Soldiers medal. This

854
00:51:32,280 --> 00:51:35,200
Speaker 1: is the sum of their morality, I mean, And it's

855
00:51:35,239 --> 00:51:37,560
Speaker 1: so interesting, right because this is like France is a

856
00:51:37,640 --> 00:51:40,839
Speaker 1: colonial power, right, it's just not he didn't colonize another

857
00:51:40,880 --> 00:51:45,480
Speaker 1: country in Europe just now, right, And he recognizes, right,

858
00:51:45,600 --> 00:51:48,040
Speaker 1: He's like, these guys are colonial pieces of ship and

859
00:51:48,120 --> 00:51:52,319
Speaker 1: I'd hate them, and he even I mean, I think

860
00:51:52,360 --> 00:51:56,040
Speaker 1: it's kind of notable that, like his disgusted description of

861
00:51:56,360 --> 00:51:59,600
Speaker 1: French colonialism in Africa uses fairly similar language to how

862
00:51:59,640 --> 00:52:05,160
Speaker 1: he discribes pogroms yeah elsewhere. So I mean it's pretty

863
00:52:05,160 --> 00:52:07,680
Speaker 1: clear he feels more solidarity with the victims of colonization

864
00:52:07,760 --> 00:52:11,080
Speaker 1: than the guys that he's fighting alongside. Right, but he

865
00:52:11,160 --> 00:52:13,719
Speaker 1: still fights a lot. He didn't go volunteer to go

866
00:52:13,840 --> 00:52:16,320
Speaker 1: fight the French in Africa volunteer. I'm not trying to

867
00:52:17,200 --> 00:52:18,759
Speaker 1: I'm a little bit trying to drag him, but like

868
00:52:20,200 --> 00:52:24,040
Speaker 1: it's just like this interesting blood valid Yeah, like he

869
00:52:24,160 --> 00:52:27,960
Speaker 1: recognizes that what that you know, the whole idea of Potkinstle,

870
00:52:28,000 --> 00:52:30,160
Speaker 1: idea that like France's this bastion of liberty is like

871
00:52:31,200 --> 00:52:37,600
Speaker 1: is it um you know maybe in France, but um, yeah,

872
00:52:37,640 --> 00:52:42,400
Speaker 1: he he recognizes that, but like also really wants to

873
00:52:42,600 --> 00:52:50,319
Speaker 1: go fight or really thinks he should go fight. Yeah, nefect, Yeah,

874
00:52:50,760 --> 00:52:55,640
Speaker 1: But um, I think we're going to have to leave

875
00:52:55,719 --> 00:53:00,120
Speaker 1: it there for now because, um, the next chapter on

876
00:53:00,239 --> 00:53:02,759
Speaker 1: my outline here is more experience and we're going to

877
00:53:02,800 --> 00:53:08,200
Speaker 1: get into some World War one ship and poetry. Cool.

878
00:53:08,920 --> 00:53:14,280
Speaker 1: So when we return World War one ship. No, Margaret,

879
00:53:14,320 --> 00:53:16,560
Speaker 1: I know what you're thinking. We haven't talked about assassination

880
00:53:16,640 --> 00:53:19,400
Speaker 1: at all. You're right, it's going to be a minute,

881
00:53:19,719 --> 00:53:22,480
Speaker 1: but it's coming. I swear I didn't just say assassination

882
00:53:22,600 --> 00:53:25,480
Speaker 1: to like get you interested. It is definitely going to happen. Now.

883
00:53:25,560 --> 00:53:29,640
Speaker 1: You said clocks to get me interested, and there's been flocks.

884
00:53:32,160 --> 00:53:34,520
Speaker 1: The clocks are always in the background. There're always taken

885
00:53:34,520 --> 00:53:37,840
Speaker 1: away in the background, paying for paying for Sholem's like

886
00:53:38,400 --> 00:53:42,239
Speaker 1: continued existence. And and speaking of clocks, it's about that

887
00:53:42,760 --> 00:53:50,680
Speaker 1: time pluga goals I hate myself are Margaret? Do you

888
00:53:50,840 --> 00:53:52,520
Speaker 1: do you happen to have a book that's out that

889
00:53:52,600 --> 00:53:55,160
Speaker 1: people can purchase? Why? Yes, I have a book called

890
00:53:55,200 --> 00:53:56,960
Speaker 1: we Won't Be Here Tomorrow that is available from a

891
00:53:57,000 --> 00:53:58,960
Speaker 1: K Press. It's short fiction. If you've listened to any

892
00:53:59,000 --> 00:54:00,960
Speaker 1: other episode this podcast. You've heard me talk about it,

893
00:54:01,560 --> 00:54:04,359
Speaker 1: and you can follow me on the internet by looking

894
00:54:04,400 --> 00:54:08,840
Speaker 1: in my name. Up cool Miriam, really good Miriam. Is

895
00:54:08,880 --> 00:54:13,000
Speaker 1: anything you'd like to plug? Um? I encourage people to

896
00:54:13,080 --> 00:54:16,680
Speaker 1: go to land back dot org and um, there's some

897
00:54:16,840 --> 00:54:21,040
Speaker 1: really cool education resources there and also, um, you can

898
00:54:21,120 --> 00:54:24,080
Speaker 1: give them some money and they can work on land

899
00:54:24,120 --> 00:54:31,399
Speaker 1: back projects. Awesome. Alright, then until Wednesday. Until Wednesday, I'm

900
00:54:31,480 --> 00:54:33,759
Speaker 1: going to go away for several days and then talk

901
00:54:33,840 --> 00:54:35,840
Speaker 1: to you more. That's right. We aren't just going to

902
00:54:35,920 --> 00:54:39,840
Speaker 1: record the second half after a five minute break half

903
00:54:39,880 --> 00:54:44,880
Speaker 1: five minute break for us two long break for you

904
00:54:46,680 --> 00:54:51,960
Speaker 1: by Cool People Who Did Cool Stuff is a production

905
00:54:52,000 --> 00:54:55,200
Speaker 1: of cool Zone Media. For more podcasts on cool Zone Media,

906
00:54:55,400 --> 00:54:58,239
Speaker 1: visit our website cool zone media dot com, or check

907
00:54:58,320 --> 00:55:00,960
Speaker 1: us out on the I Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts,

908
00:55:01,160 --> 00:55:06,719
Speaker 1: or wherever you get your podcasts. M