1 00:00:00,240 --> 00:00:04,680 Speaker 1: From UFOs to psychic powers and government conspiracies. History is 2 00:00:04,760 --> 00:00:09,080 Speaker 1: riddled with unexplained events. You can turn back now or 3 00:00:09,200 --> 00:00:12,080 Speaker 1: learn the stuff they don't want you to know. A 4 00:00:12,240 --> 00:00:26,279 Speaker 1: production of iHeartRadio. Hello, welcome back to the show. My 5 00:00:26,360 --> 00:00:29,720 Speaker 1: name is Matt, my name is Noel. They call me Ben. 6 00:00:29,840 --> 00:00:34,279 Speaker 1: We're joined as always with our superproducer Paul Mission controlled decans. 7 00:00:34,320 --> 00:00:37,599 Speaker 1: Most importantly, you are you. You are here, and that 8 00:00:37,680 --> 00:00:41,319 Speaker 1: makes this the stuff they don't want you to know. 9 00:00:42,479 --> 00:00:45,239 Speaker 1: All right, let's kick it off this way. Do you 10 00:00:45,240 --> 00:00:48,880 Speaker 1: guys watch the news? You know, guys needed now, it's 11 00:00:48,960 --> 00:00:50,960 Speaker 1: got a hard to avoid. We do do a segment 12 00:00:51,000 --> 00:00:55,000 Speaker 1: every week called Strange News. Yeah, maybe the stuff we're 13 00:00:55,000 --> 00:00:56,720 Speaker 1: looking at it's a little different than what the headlines 14 00:00:56,720 --> 00:00:59,120 Speaker 1: are talking about, but we we have we come across 15 00:00:59,160 --> 00:01:01,720 Speaker 1: those those as well. Yeah, not a lot of great 16 00:01:01,760 --> 00:01:06,240 Speaker 1: stuff happening. Well, uh yeah, I think I think the 17 00:01:06,600 --> 00:01:10,440 Speaker 1: few companies that own most media in this country or 18 00:01:10,480 --> 00:01:13,760 Speaker 1: in the world decided a long time ago that you 19 00:01:13,880 --> 00:01:19,680 Speaker 1: make money off of scaring people, right, be afraid you know, yeah, 20 00:01:19,880 --> 00:01:21,920 Speaker 1: tune in? Yeah, but you know, I don't know if 21 00:01:21,920 --> 00:01:25,080 Speaker 1: you guys have seen Mark Marin's latest stand up special 22 00:01:25,080 --> 00:01:28,640 Speaker 1: in HBO have but yeah, contend to agree with him. 23 00:01:28,640 --> 00:01:31,200 Speaker 1: I would just say, yeah, I'm so glad he's getting 24 00:01:31,200 --> 00:01:36,440 Speaker 1: into comedy. So uh, he's been threatening for years. Yeah. Yeah, 25 00:01:36,480 --> 00:01:40,360 Speaker 1: he's always been on the verge. And he'll probably end 26 00:01:40,480 --> 00:01:45,480 Speaker 1: up hanging out with us later because per his per 27 00:01:45,560 --> 00:01:50,320 Speaker 1: his earlier special, he likes hanging out with folks like us. Uh. 28 00:01:50,640 --> 00:01:54,800 Speaker 1: The thing is, a lot of people are divided in 29 00:01:54,880 --> 00:01:59,920 Speaker 1: the United States, especially these days. Many people who are 30 00:02:00,000 --> 00:02:04,000 Speaker 1: our our age and younger are getting the bulk of 31 00:02:04,080 --> 00:02:09,560 Speaker 1: their understanding about the world from social media, right, and 32 00:02:10,400 --> 00:02:14,480 Speaker 1: people who are a little bit older tend to get 33 00:02:14,520 --> 00:02:21,720 Speaker 1: their information from broadcast television or radio. Most of the time, 34 00:02:22,120 --> 00:02:26,560 Speaker 1: you know, most of the time, people can clearly see 35 00:02:26,680 --> 00:02:31,560 Speaker 1: the difference between those two rough sources or categories and sources, 36 00:02:31,680 --> 00:02:35,359 Speaker 1: and oftentimes they jibe, you know what I mean. Like 37 00:02:36,840 --> 00:02:40,720 Speaker 1: the events of September eleventh, two thousand and one, when 38 00:02:40,760 --> 00:02:45,960 Speaker 1: they occurred, it seemed like a lot of media was 39 00:02:46,040 --> 00:02:50,160 Speaker 1: in lockstep about that reporting, right, you get the same facts, 40 00:02:50,240 --> 00:02:55,280 Speaker 1: These are commonalities. Even competing news sources were reporting the 41 00:02:55,360 --> 00:02:58,880 Speaker 1: same things. That is no longer the case, but one 42 00:02:59,000 --> 00:03:03,520 Speaker 1: commonality does whole true. It is disturbing to watch the news. 43 00:03:03,560 --> 00:03:06,240 Speaker 1: It seems like every week, I mean every day, if 44 00:03:06,280 --> 00:03:09,680 Speaker 1: you'll look for it, something terrible has happened. The world 45 00:03:09,760 --> 00:03:13,720 Speaker 1: has ended for someone. And in today's episode, we're talking 46 00:03:13,760 --> 00:03:18,400 Speaker 1: about a tragic story, an ongoing disaster in a very 47 00:03:18,440 --> 00:03:21,720 Speaker 1: small Ohio village that a lot of us haven't heard of, 48 00:03:22,320 --> 00:03:26,200 Speaker 1: and through that we're going to explore some much larger, 49 00:03:26,880 --> 00:03:31,160 Speaker 1: profoundly disturbing implications. I don't know how this episode is 50 00:03:31,200 --> 00:03:34,280 Speaker 1: going to go, honestly, I mean the whole thing, from 51 00:03:34,960 --> 00:03:38,600 Speaker 1: stem to stern, or should I say, from locomotive to caboose, 52 00:03:39,840 --> 00:03:43,760 Speaker 1: it's kind of crazy. I don't hear the facts. Well, 53 00:03:43,840 --> 00:03:47,760 Speaker 1: let's begin in Ohio in a little place called East Palestine. 54 00:03:48,400 --> 00:03:50,360 Speaker 1: If you look at it online, if you see it 55 00:03:50,400 --> 00:03:53,920 Speaker 1: written down, it looks like Palestine. A lot of us 56 00:03:53,920 --> 00:03:56,640 Speaker 1: are used to seeing that more common than the name 57 00:03:56,680 --> 00:04:00,720 Speaker 1: of this town. So East Palestine, Ohio. It's a pretty 58 00:04:00,760 --> 00:04:04,880 Speaker 1: small place. In twenty twenty, the population was estimated to 59 00:04:04,880 --> 00:04:08,520 Speaker 1: be four thousand, seven hundred and sixty one, So a 60 00:04:08,520 --> 00:04:15,360 Speaker 1: pretty small place. Yeah, And candidly, before this February February 61 00:04:15,400 --> 00:04:19,000 Speaker 1: twenty twenty three, I had never heard of the place 62 00:04:19,560 --> 00:04:22,400 Speaker 1: I don't know about, Like, did you guys know, were 63 00:04:22,400 --> 00:04:26,040 Speaker 1: you up up to date? I have vaguely heard about Youngstown, 64 00:04:26,440 --> 00:04:31,279 Speaker 1: which is the biggest city in the area. Oh no, 65 00:04:31,600 --> 00:04:33,560 Speaker 1: I did. I didn't know about this place. It's right 66 00:04:33,600 --> 00:04:37,360 Speaker 1: on the border of Pennsylvania there in Ohio, on the 67 00:04:37,440 --> 00:04:42,320 Speaker 1: eastern side of Ohio, just about an hour from Pittsburgh, 68 00:04:42,520 --> 00:04:47,800 Speaker 1: I believe. Yeah. Yeah, as the crow drives, mister Rogers 69 00:04:47,839 --> 00:04:51,279 Speaker 1: Country right and uh, Andy Warhol Country, that's where the 70 00:04:51,279 --> 00:04:55,560 Speaker 1: Andy Warhol Museum, as people love it is. I think 71 00:04:55,560 --> 00:04:58,000 Speaker 1: that maybe it's a Pennsylvania. I think it's a Pittsburgh 72 00:04:58,120 --> 00:05:02,520 Speaker 1: by call themselves Burghers. But yeah, it's true. This village, 73 00:05:02,640 --> 00:05:06,479 Speaker 1: as you correctly identified it, matt Is was founded in 74 00:05:06,560 --> 00:05:11,760 Speaker 1: eighteen twenty eight and spent almost a century as home 75 00:05:11,920 --> 00:05:17,880 Speaker 1: to attire manufacturing and ceramics kind of industry there was. 76 00:05:17,880 --> 00:05:19,320 Speaker 1: It was kind of a buzzing hub for that. And 77 00:05:19,360 --> 00:05:23,719 Speaker 1: as we know, a lot of kind of monocultures where 78 00:05:23,720 --> 00:05:29,279 Speaker 1: I guess mono economies have a tendency to run into 79 00:05:29,320 --> 00:05:33,080 Speaker 1: trouble down the line, you know, when things change globally speaking, 80 00:05:33,200 --> 00:05:35,960 Speaker 1: you know, in terms of economics like housing crisis, a 81 00:05:36,000 --> 00:05:39,400 Speaker 1: lot of smaller towns that were tied to manufacturing things 82 00:05:39,440 --> 00:05:43,360 Speaker 1: like you know, drywall or whatever. Carpet really had had 83 00:05:43,360 --> 00:05:45,800 Speaker 1: a real tough go of it. Yeah, and this is 84 00:05:45,920 --> 00:05:50,880 Speaker 1: a scene familiar to countless of us listening today. If 85 00:05:50,960 --> 00:05:53,400 Speaker 1: you live in a small town, you grew up in one, 86 00:05:53,480 --> 00:05:57,159 Speaker 1: you spent time in one, you know this score. There's 87 00:05:57,320 --> 00:06:02,560 Speaker 1: there's a main street, right and once you get just 88 00:06:02,640 --> 00:06:06,080 Speaker 1: a little out of the way there there there residential neighborhoods. 89 00:06:06,080 --> 00:06:09,480 Speaker 1: But once you get out there, the surrounding area is 90 00:06:09,880 --> 00:06:16,400 Speaker 1: pretty rural. Here in East Palestine, there are beautiful sweeping 91 00:06:16,600 --> 00:06:19,640 Speaker 1: hills and forests. And if you if you go in 92 00:06:19,720 --> 00:06:22,360 Speaker 1: by car, which is you know, to be clear, this 93 00:06:22,440 --> 00:06:26,640 Speaker 1: is not a community with its own airport. If you 94 00:06:26,760 --> 00:06:30,719 Speaker 1: travel via car, then what you'll see is a lot 95 00:06:30,800 --> 00:06:35,400 Speaker 1: of rural roads with switchbacks through the hills. You know, 96 00:06:35,440 --> 00:06:38,480 Speaker 1: we're talking pavement with no lines on the road. It 97 00:06:38,520 --> 00:06:41,719 Speaker 1: looks like it looks kind of like scars across a 98 00:06:41,800 --> 00:06:47,560 Speaker 1: hand or tattoos perhaps, And it's I don't know if 99 00:06:47,600 --> 00:06:51,080 Speaker 1: this has ever happened to everyone listening, but if you're 100 00:06:51,279 --> 00:06:54,600 Speaker 1: crossing a state border in the United States and you're 101 00:06:54,640 --> 00:06:58,080 Speaker 1: not on an interstate. You don't see those big welcome 102 00:06:58,120 --> 00:07:01,279 Speaker 1: to blah blah blah sides. You know, you see a 103 00:07:01,320 --> 00:07:06,279 Speaker 1: little it looks almost like it looks almost like a 104 00:07:06,320 --> 00:07:09,279 Speaker 1: real estate side. There's just something stuck in in the 105 00:07:09,320 --> 00:07:14,040 Speaker 1: ground at about knee level that says, oh, you're in Ohio, 106 00:07:14,760 --> 00:07:19,560 Speaker 1: good job, something like that. And you know, Noel, you 107 00:07:19,680 --> 00:07:23,520 Speaker 1: and I actually saw this pretty frequently many years ago 108 00:07:23,680 --> 00:07:26,560 Speaker 1: when we filmed a documentary for one of my old 109 00:07:26,560 --> 00:07:30,720 Speaker 1: show's car stuff, right, and we're going through roads just 110 00:07:30,960 --> 00:07:34,080 Speaker 1: like this, Yeah, I mean like switchbacks. You know, you'd 111 00:07:34,080 --> 00:07:38,920 Speaker 1: call them very very treacherous at times, right, like like 112 00:07:38,960 --> 00:07:41,560 Speaker 1: winding their way up a mountains side, you know where 113 00:07:41,800 --> 00:07:45,720 Speaker 1: one false move and you're off into the abyss. Thankfully, 114 00:07:46,360 --> 00:07:51,480 Speaker 1: this part of the country is a little bit more welcoming. 115 00:07:51,640 --> 00:07:56,600 Speaker 1: It's an easier Mario kart course than West Virginia where 116 00:07:56,720 --> 00:07:59,239 Speaker 1: we were, but we were in Ohio for a time, 117 00:07:59,440 --> 00:08:05,320 Speaker 1: and look, other than those man made distinctions of state lines, 118 00:08:05,800 --> 00:08:09,640 Speaker 1: this is all a continuous country, right, And if you 119 00:08:09,760 --> 00:08:12,320 Speaker 1: get to East Palestine, you're going to see a lot 120 00:08:12,360 --> 00:08:16,720 Speaker 1: of local businesses, a very active series of community centers 121 00:08:16,880 --> 00:08:19,960 Speaker 1: and churches and so on, and you will also, I 122 00:08:20,000 --> 00:08:23,920 Speaker 1: think feel a relative air of tenacity. You know, this 123 00:08:24,040 --> 00:08:27,560 Speaker 1: is one of many small towns that continues to exist 124 00:08:28,000 --> 00:08:31,920 Speaker 1: in a country that often seems to forget them. You know, 125 00:08:32,160 --> 00:08:37,400 Speaker 1: it's flyover country is the phrase that's used often to 126 00:08:37,520 --> 00:08:42,800 Speaker 1: describe these places. But East Palestine, unlike some small towns, 127 00:08:43,280 --> 00:08:48,280 Speaker 1: has a lifeline to the larger world via the railroad. Yeah, 128 00:08:48,360 --> 00:08:52,439 Speaker 1: and Ben, you got to see this firsthand, right yeah, yeah, 129 00:08:52,520 --> 00:08:56,640 Speaker 1: so off the books as as you and will know 130 00:08:56,880 --> 00:09:02,959 Speaker 1: off the books. Met I went to East Palestine because 131 00:09:03,120 --> 00:09:07,760 Speaker 1: of the story that we're exploring today, and the people 132 00:09:07,840 --> 00:09:12,760 Speaker 1: there are incredibly kind, incredibly nice. One of the main 133 00:09:12,840 --> 00:09:16,239 Speaker 1: complaints I heard when I was there was the traffic 134 00:09:16,720 --> 00:09:20,120 Speaker 1: from all the people showing up and there weren't a 135 00:09:20,120 --> 00:09:22,800 Speaker 1: ton Actually, there weren't a ton of people. You know. 136 00:09:23,679 --> 00:09:27,040 Speaker 1: You may have heard about this town in the news 137 00:09:27,520 --> 00:09:32,600 Speaker 1: because former US President Donald Trump visited their. Several other 138 00:09:32,720 --> 00:09:37,960 Speaker 1: high muckety MUCKs of US politics visited in the past month, 139 00:09:38,320 --> 00:09:43,080 Speaker 1: all in quick succession. Because Biden though right, no, no, 140 00:09:43,280 --> 00:09:47,720 Speaker 1: Biden went to Ukraine conspicuously absent, and I believe Trump 141 00:09:47,800 --> 00:09:50,320 Speaker 1: kind of took the opportunity to, you know, do his 142 00:09:50,440 --> 00:09:53,600 Speaker 1: like tossing of the toilet paper to the hurricane victims 143 00:09:53,720 --> 00:09:57,960 Speaker 1: kind of tour at McDonald's, or he claimed to know 144 00:09:58,040 --> 00:10:01,520 Speaker 1: the menu better than anyone. Well, that last part I believe, 145 00:10:02,000 --> 00:10:06,880 Speaker 1: but the but the yeah, you're right, you're right. And 146 00:10:07,160 --> 00:10:11,640 Speaker 1: one of the things that former potus Trump said was 147 00:10:11,679 --> 00:10:17,440 Speaker 1: that the railroad regulations or lack thereof, had nothing to 148 00:10:17,480 --> 00:10:22,640 Speaker 1: do with him nor his previous administration. That's not true. Well, yeah, 149 00:10:22,679 --> 00:10:26,240 Speaker 1: it's probably untrue. But if you visit the place today, 150 00:10:27,559 --> 00:10:31,120 Speaker 1: you will see trains rolling through the town still on 151 00:10:31,240 --> 00:10:37,439 Speaker 1: a regular basis. We're talking seemingly endless lines of cargo containers, 152 00:10:37,559 --> 00:10:43,640 Speaker 1: coal haulers, the tankers, the cylindrical tankers that hold liquid 153 00:10:43,720 --> 00:10:49,240 Speaker 1: materials of all sorts. And in this town, on February third, 154 00:10:49,320 --> 00:10:53,160 Speaker 1: twenty twenty three, at around eight fifty four, eight fifty 155 00:10:53,160 --> 00:10:58,680 Speaker 1: five pm, one of these trains derailed, went off the tracks. 156 00:10:59,559 --> 00:11:03,120 Speaker 1: Not every Greek car went off the rails, but a 157 00:11:03,160 --> 00:11:05,600 Speaker 1: ton of them did. And this was a real chalker 158 00:11:05,640 --> 00:11:07,760 Speaker 1: of a train. Yeah, it was one hundred and fifty 159 00:11:07,880 --> 00:11:10,960 Speaker 1: cars in total. So if you just imagine that huge 160 00:11:11,120 --> 00:11:15,640 Speaker 1: line just rolling down, you imagine sitting there waiting for 161 00:11:15,679 --> 00:11:18,400 Speaker 1: one hundred and fifty cars to go by if you're stopped, 162 00:11:18,440 --> 00:11:21,360 Speaker 1: you know, waiting for it happened. That's a that's a 163 00:11:21,720 --> 00:11:26,120 Speaker 1: that's a good wait. It's pretty huge, and I mean 164 00:11:26,240 --> 00:11:29,000 Speaker 1: we'll look at that bend. Is it nine thousand, three 165 00:11:29,080 --> 00:11:32,600 Speaker 1: hundred feet long, which is well over a mile, that's 166 00:11:32,600 --> 00:11:37,240 Speaker 1: almost two miles. Yeah. Yeah, it's a long time. You know. 167 00:11:37,440 --> 00:11:39,360 Speaker 1: Don't be a hurry. Don't be in a hurry at 168 00:11:39,360 --> 00:11:42,520 Speaker 1: the stop light. Yeah, And honestly, there aren't There aren't 169 00:11:43,120 --> 00:11:46,480 Speaker 1: uh stop lights at the rail crossings I saw, or 170 00:11:46,520 --> 00:11:49,800 Speaker 1: at least where the derailment occurred. There's just the old 171 00:11:49,920 --> 00:11:52,960 Speaker 1: ding ding ding ding ding and the little uh what's 172 00:11:53,000 --> 00:11:57,240 Speaker 1: it called, a little obstacle goes down. Yeah, yeah, the 173 00:11:57,280 --> 00:12:02,720 Speaker 1: train crossing. Oh my god. I speak English, and it's 174 00:12:02,920 --> 00:12:07,440 Speaker 1: easy to move around it. I actually got into this 175 00:12:07,520 --> 00:12:10,760 Speaker 1: crash site, so I should probably, I don't know, wash 176 00:12:10,840 --> 00:12:13,720 Speaker 1: my hands. But yeah, this is a this is a huge, 177 00:12:14,080 --> 00:12:18,560 Speaker 1: huge train car. For most people, for the residents of 178 00:12:18,600 --> 00:12:25,080 Speaker 1: East Palestine, this is a normal event until things go south. Right. 179 00:12:25,640 --> 00:12:28,080 Speaker 1: There are only this might surprise people who are not 180 00:12:28,120 --> 00:12:33,000 Speaker 1: in the rail industry. There are three only three rail 181 00:12:33,080 --> 00:12:39,800 Speaker 1: employees aboard. And that's actually a bit overstaffing in the 182 00:12:39,880 --> 00:12:44,640 Speaker 1: opinion of their parent corporation, Norfolk Southern. You got an engineer, 183 00:12:44,840 --> 00:12:49,120 Speaker 1: you got a conductor. Third third person is a conductor trainee. 184 00:12:50,320 --> 00:12:55,520 Speaker 1: Stuff goes wrong, explosions, flames. At least eleven of those 185 00:12:55,640 --> 00:13:01,760 Speaker 1: derailed cars are carrying hazardous chemicals for Norfolk Southern, and 186 00:13:02,000 --> 00:13:04,720 Speaker 1: some of those cars are going to go on to 187 00:13:04,920 --> 00:13:09,600 Speaker 1: burn for two full days. Again, this is a small town. 188 00:13:09,920 --> 00:13:14,320 Speaker 1: People live close to this railroad line like you can. 189 00:13:14,720 --> 00:13:17,360 Speaker 1: You can see it, So imagine you're there. It's not 190 00:13:17,400 --> 00:13:20,560 Speaker 1: that late at night, it's not even nine pm, and 191 00:13:20,600 --> 00:13:25,600 Speaker 1: all of a sudden boom. You might be walking somewhere, 192 00:13:26,040 --> 00:13:28,920 Speaker 1: you might be at your house, you hear something, You 193 00:13:29,000 --> 00:13:31,960 Speaker 1: open the door and you can tell the train is 194 00:13:32,000 --> 00:13:35,280 Speaker 1: no longer running on time. But what sort of stuff's 195 00:13:35,320 --> 00:13:37,040 Speaker 1: in there? Yeah, well it just that has to be 196 00:13:37,040 --> 00:13:40,480 Speaker 1: a crazy sound because you know, we've seen footage of 197 00:13:40,520 --> 00:13:44,000 Speaker 1: where the derailment occurs, and one because it just takes 198 00:13:44,040 --> 00:13:47,560 Speaker 1: one of the cars to go off right once the 199 00:13:47,960 --> 00:13:52,800 Speaker 1: once one car derails, everything behind it and potentially attached 200 00:13:52,840 --> 00:13:55,240 Speaker 1: to the front of it can then go off the 201 00:13:55,320 --> 00:13:58,360 Speaker 1: rails and so it's like just a set of these 202 00:13:58,480 --> 00:14:01,679 Speaker 1: huge booms as these whole cars fall over carrying all 203 00:14:01,720 --> 00:14:05,320 Speaker 1: of these liquids and chemicals, as you're saying. And the 204 00:14:05,400 --> 00:14:09,640 Speaker 1: chem oh man, the chemicals are all the hits, just 205 00:14:09,880 --> 00:14:16,200 Speaker 1: horrible things that you don't want spilled anywhere in the environment. There. 206 00:14:16,200 --> 00:14:20,240 Speaker 1: And there's a huge list too, who wants who wants 207 00:14:20,240 --> 00:14:22,200 Speaker 1: to tackle it? Before we get to the one that's 208 00:14:22,720 --> 00:14:25,440 Speaker 1: the most often reported. I only knew three of these, 209 00:14:25,520 --> 00:14:29,960 Speaker 1: ben right, I can get yourself round roping it right, 210 00:14:30,040 --> 00:14:32,520 Speaker 1: Let's do two at a time. You're ready. We got 211 00:14:32,720 --> 00:14:43,960 Speaker 1: beutyl acrrelate to ethyl hexel acrrelate, ethylene glycol, monobutyl ether isobutylene, 212 00:14:45,040 --> 00:14:50,800 Speaker 1: and benzene residue and combustible liquids, which is a very 213 00:14:50,800 --> 00:14:57,000 Speaker 1: general term and the one that's most often reported. Chloroethine 214 00:14:57,760 --> 00:15:02,080 Speaker 1: street name vinyl chloride, not band not a limited issue 215 00:15:02,160 --> 00:15:05,200 Speaker 1: release from Athens. You don't need to be a chemist 216 00:15:05,240 --> 00:15:08,160 Speaker 1: to get the drift here, folks. This is stuff that 217 00:15:08,280 --> 00:15:10,400 Speaker 1: should not be in the field. It should not be 218 00:15:10,440 --> 00:15:12,480 Speaker 1: in the wild, and the form that it is it 219 00:15:12,520 --> 00:15:19,400 Speaker 1: can be tremendously dangerous to living organisms. Counting Earth's least 220 00:15:19,440 --> 00:15:24,240 Speaker 1: favorite primate, the human being, one hundred thousand gallons of 221 00:15:24,960 --> 00:15:30,320 Speaker 1: absolutely like Captain planet level evil stuff. We're everywhere in 222 00:15:30,360 --> 00:15:33,680 Speaker 1: the town, and as we record today right now, the 223 00:15:33,880 --> 00:15:39,240 Speaker 1: smartest people on the planet cannot reliably estimate the long 224 00:15:39,360 --> 00:15:44,000 Speaker 1: term consequences of this event. But people knew it was 225 00:15:44,040 --> 00:15:49,600 Speaker 1: a problem. State officials made the call, and the state 226 00:15:49,600 --> 00:15:55,800 Speaker 1: officials and the emergency crews met with a dilemma. They said, look, 227 00:15:56,480 --> 00:16:02,600 Speaker 1: this stuff due due to it's various chemical properties. I mean, 228 00:16:02,720 --> 00:16:07,600 Speaker 1: some of this stuff boils, like enters the atmosphere at 229 00:16:07,720 --> 00:16:13,800 Speaker 1: something like eight degrees And so the powers that be 230 00:16:14,320 --> 00:16:16,960 Speaker 1: made this decision. They said, we're going to need to 231 00:16:17,040 --> 00:16:22,600 Speaker 1: make a controlled burn to prevent a catastrophic explosion. And 232 00:16:22,720 --> 00:16:27,000 Speaker 1: this burn very creepy, especially if you're right over the 233 00:16:27,080 --> 00:16:30,720 Speaker 1: line in rural Pennsylvania. All of a sudden, you see 234 00:16:30,760 --> 00:16:35,640 Speaker 1: this massive wave of dark, ominous smoke, and it spreads 235 00:16:35,680 --> 00:16:38,760 Speaker 1: like a mushroom cloud. It's very easy to find a 236 00:16:38,800 --> 00:16:43,200 Speaker 1: picture of this or multiple pictures of this cloud. And 237 00:16:43,440 --> 00:16:47,800 Speaker 1: people in the town and in the area start wondering, 238 00:16:49,640 --> 00:16:52,040 Speaker 1: is it time to bug out? Should I go, you know, 239 00:16:52,560 --> 00:16:56,280 Speaker 1: stay with my aunt or something for a few weeks. Well, yeah, 240 00:16:56,320 --> 00:16:59,400 Speaker 1: this is we have to put this here. It occurs 241 00:16:59,400 --> 00:17:03,120 Speaker 1: on February third, right, the derailment the night of February third. 242 00:17:03,840 --> 00:17:08,880 Speaker 1: The materials that spilled were mostly isolated to that rail, 243 00:17:09,400 --> 00:17:12,400 Speaker 1: that rail line and where they had spilled out right. 244 00:17:12,720 --> 00:17:15,840 Speaker 1: I mean you imagine large amounts of liquids spreading out 245 00:17:15,920 --> 00:17:17,879 Speaker 1: from one place, like if you spilled something on the 246 00:17:17,880 --> 00:17:21,560 Speaker 1: floor in it and it widens out right, But it 247 00:17:21,640 --> 00:17:26,679 Speaker 1: was pretty isolated. The story behind that controlled burn is 248 00:17:26,720 --> 00:17:28,320 Speaker 1: I think one of the things we were really gonna 249 00:17:28,320 --> 00:17:31,920 Speaker 1: have to focus on today, because most of the liquids 250 00:17:31,960 --> 00:17:34,919 Speaker 1: were still contained within those rail cars, even if they 251 00:17:34,920 --> 00:17:38,000 Speaker 1: had flipped over, if they were just laying there. But 252 00:17:38,119 --> 00:17:42,720 Speaker 1: there was one railcar that was reported to the temperature 253 00:17:42,840 --> 00:17:45,360 Speaker 1: controls and the pressure controls that are on this thing 254 00:17:45,520 --> 00:17:49,760 Speaker 1: were failing, and that's the reason, at least that's the 255 00:17:49,800 --> 00:17:54,040 Speaker 1: official reason why they burned all of it, right, Yeah, 256 00:17:54,080 --> 00:17:56,919 Speaker 1: just so, And I asked when I was there, I 257 00:17:57,000 --> 00:18:02,960 Speaker 1: asked people about this before the railroad guys ram me 258 00:18:03,040 --> 00:18:09,640 Speaker 1: off and the cops are following me, and I want 259 00:18:09,680 --> 00:18:13,240 Speaker 1: to take a moment to say, look, the folks who 260 00:18:13,280 --> 00:18:17,160 Speaker 1: are working to try to mitigate this sort of stuff, 261 00:18:17,200 --> 00:18:20,720 Speaker 1: they're not jerks. They're not supervillains. They're regular people. They're 262 00:18:20,840 --> 00:18:24,840 Speaker 1: very tired, they're very overworked, as most people working in 263 00:18:24,840 --> 00:18:28,920 Speaker 1: the rail industry are, and they just want to get 264 00:18:28,920 --> 00:18:33,760 Speaker 1: their stuff done. They just don't want more problems, and 265 00:18:33,840 --> 00:18:36,760 Speaker 1: right now there are a lot of problems. This controlled 266 00:18:36,760 --> 00:18:40,479 Speaker 1: burn was it the best choice? I mean, we're not 267 00:18:40,520 --> 00:18:44,879 Speaker 1: the experts. It does seem like it did prevent a 268 00:18:45,560 --> 00:18:49,479 Speaker 1: larger explosion, But if you go to the derailment site now, 269 00:18:49,960 --> 00:18:52,560 Speaker 1: you can see a lot of that stuff is still 270 00:18:53,200 --> 00:18:57,280 Speaker 1: out there and people are just walking around, and they're 271 00:18:57,320 --> 00:19:04,000 Speaker 1: walking around because the evacuation was rescinded. In the immediate aftermath, 272 00:19:05,200 --> 00:19:09,280 Speaker 1: everybody in like a one mile radius was not only 273 00:19:09,480 --> 00:19:12,199 Speaker 1: ordered to evacuate, but they were told it would be 274 00:19:12,240 --> 00:19:15,960 Speaker 1: a federal crime, it would be a violation for them 275 00:19:16,040 --> 00:19:20,240 Speaker 1: to stay, and that order was quickly rescinded. Three other 276 00:19:20,600 --> 00:19:27,000 Speaker 1: three states in total initiated emergency protocols Ohio, Pennsylvania, West Virginia. 277 00:19:27,200 --> 00:19:32,280 Speaker 1: But but people were already trying to figure out what 278 00:19:32,560 --> 00:19:38,240 Speaker 1: specifically led to this incident. And to tell you what 279 00:19:38,359 --> 00:19:41,920 Speaker 1: specifically led to it, we've got to talk about two 280 00:19:41,960 --> 00:19:48,080 Speaker 1: weird things. First, the Pittsburgh Post gazette. And then breaks 281 00:19:49,280 --> 00:19:52,800 Speaker 1: like not at breaks, like actual breaks that you would 282 00:19:52,800 --> 00:19:57,359 Speaker 1: have on your car. Imagine, imagine if your car have 283 00:19:57,520 --> 00:20:00,399 Speaker 1: breaks from the Civil War. Well, how about we pump 284 00:20:00,440 --> 00:20:03,560 Speaker 1: the brakes and take a quick ad break and then 285 00:20:03,560 --> 00:20:06,800 Speaker 1: we'll come back and talk about other kinds of breaks. 286 00:20:13,240 --> 00:20:20,840 Speaker 1: And we're back. So we're talking about something that happens 287 00:20:21,119 --> 00:20:24,440 Speaker 1: all the time. We're talking about a system, an infrastructure 288 00:20:24,560 --> 00:20:27,880 Speaker 1: that is, you know, how things are moved still it's 289 00:20:27,920 --> 00:20:31,280 Speaker 1: an old system of infrastructure or the rails. Uh, you know, 290 00:20:31,320 --> 00:20:33,639 Speaker 1: we built the railroads and all that stuff. It was like, 291 00:20:33,680 --> 00:20:37,439 Speaker 1: you know what really got America where it is today 292 00:20:37,480 --> 00:20:40,359 Speaker 1: in terms of being able to move goods around and 293 00:20:40,400 --> 00:20:42,080 Speaker 1: all of that. And of course one of this was 294 00:20:42,320 --> 00:20:45,960 Speaker 1: built off of the back of disenfranchised people. That's neither 295 00:20:46,000 --> 00:20:48,440 Speaker 1: here nor the Maybe it is a little bit because 296 00:20:48,200 --> 00:20:53,280 Speaker 1: these rails still often run through communities that are maybe 297 00:20:53,320 --> 00:20:56,239 Speaker 1: a little bit lower income, perhaps maybe a little more 298 00:20:56,280 --> 00:21:00,879 Speaker 1: at risk. And usually I mean well maybe not usually, 299 00:21:00,920 --> 00:21:05,800 Speaker 1: but ideally things go pretty well and then things get 300 00:21:05,840 --> 00:21:10,119 Speaker 1: from A to B to see and you know, commerce 301 00:21:10,480 --> 00:21:14,320 Speaker 1: soldiers forth. But today we're talking about an example, an 302 00:21:14,359 --> 00:21:21,320 Speaker 1: extreme example of this system going totally awry, literally off 303 00:21:21,359 --> 00:21:25,320 Speaker 1: the rails. Yeah, so are two things. First, Let's start 304 00:21:25,400 --> 00:21:30,760 Speaker 1: with the Pittsburgh Post Gazette. Shortly after the derailment, they 305 00:21:30,920 --> 00:21:36,679 Speaker 1: discover and published some damning evidence that this train was 306 00:21:37,240 --> 00:21:43,120 Speaker 1: in trouble well before it hit East Palestine at eight 307 00:21:43,320 --> 00:21:46,680 Speaker 1: twelve pm. So, for all of us playing along at home, 308 00:21:46,800 --> 00:21:51,960 Speaker 1: just about a half an hour or so before the disaster, 309 00:21:53,600 --> 00:21:59,280 Speaker 1: a security camera at a business called Beautech Bliss in Salem, 310 00:21:59,400 --> 00:22:05,720 Speaker 1: Ohio happen to film this train rolling by, and you 311 00:22:05,760 --> 00:22:09,080 Speaker 1: can look at the footage now, and you can see 312 00:22:09,480 --> 00:22:13,080 Speaker 1: it's already on fire. One of the wheels due to 313 00:22:13,200 --> 00:22:16,480 Speaker 1: a wheel bearing right. One of the wheels is sparking, 314 00:22:16,720 --> 00:22:22,480 Speaker 1: it's throwing, it's throwing some firework hands and it looks 315 00:22:22,520 --> 00:22:25,720 Speaker 1: really cool objectively, but it's not what you want a 316 00:22:25,720 --> 00:22:31,520 Speaker 1: wheel on a multitun vessel to do in any any situation. 317 00:22:31,880 --> 00:22:38,720 Speaker 1: This is about eighteen miles northwest of the incident's site. Basically, 318 00:22:38,840 --> 00:22:42,000 Speaker 1: the brakes sucked, and you know, we got to give 319 00:22:42,040 --> 00:22:45,920 Speaker 1: a shout out to I think one of our collective 320 00:22:46,440 --> 00:22:50,720 Speaker 1: favorite people, John Stewart. John Stewart has a show called 321 00:22:50,800 --> 00:22:54,400 Speaker 1: The Problem with John Stewart, which is also a podcast, 322 00:22:54,440 --> 00:22:58,160 Speaker 1: and he does pretty excellent interviews with his staff writers. 323 00:22:58,200 --> 00:23:02,040 Speaker 1: He was talking with a guy named Matt Weaver, who 324 00:23:02,240 --> 00:23:07,520 Speaker 1: is a legislative director and member of the railroad Workers 325 00:23:07,680 --> 00:23:13,080 Speaker 1: United Union, and Matt Weaver, along with several other journalists, 326 00:23:13,440 --> 00:23:17,720 Speaker 1: points out that these break systems on trains running in 327 00:23:17,840 --> 00:23:23,040 Speaker 1: twenty twenty three use the same technology from the US 328 00:23:23,160 --> 00:23:26,840 Speaker 1: Civil War, not the one that our pal Robert Evans 329 00:23:27,040 --> 00:23:32,440 Speaker 1: is worried about happening now, the eighteen hundreds one. That 330 00:23:32,480 --> 00:23:36,440 Speaker 1: one back when what's the line and I'm quoting this 331 00:23:36,480 --> 00:23:42,240 Speaker 1: podcast back when the US armies recommended method for cleaning 332 00:23:42,320 --> 00:23:45,920 Speaker 1: silverware was to push it into the dirt and then 333 00:23:46,000 --> 00:23:51,440 Speaker 1: pull it out nice. Matt's like, I've been wasting all 334 00:23:51,480 --> 00:23:56,640 Speaker 1: this money on soap. You guys ever polished silverware? It's horrible, 335 00:23:56,680 --> 00:24:00,960 Speaker 1: It's horrible. Yeah, I think the silver polished smells good. 336 00:24:01,040 --> 00:24:08,040 Speaker 1: This I don't know. Chemicals speak chemicals. You get in situate, 337 00:24:08,160 --> 00:24:11,600 Speaker 1: Different time for me, fellas, okay, different time yeah, my 338 00:24:11,640 --> 00:24:17,119 Speaker 1: gummo days. Oh boy, So just kidding. Never or I 339 00:24:17,160 --> 00:24:21,760 Speaker 1: have ever been a huffer? Are we doing like McCarthy era, 340 00:24:22,440 --> 00:24:26,480 Speaker 1: which hunts? I have not now, nor have I ever been. 341 00:24:28,080 --> 00:24:30,480 Speaker 1: I don't know, man, there there are certain markers that 342 00:24:30,560 --> 00:24:36,560 Speaker 1: I feel like have made me creative. The Crayola ones, 343 00:24:36,640 --> 00:24:39,960 Speaker 1: the non toxic washable ones that you used to drop 344 00:24:40,000 --> 00:24:45,560 Speaker 1: beautiful pick tours. Well, okay, guys, all right, let's get back. 345 00:24:45,840 --> 00:24:48,280 Speaker 1: Let's get back to these breaks. Because I saw that 346 00:24:48,280 --> 00:24:51,359 Speaker 1: footage just like you guys did. I it looks pretty scary. 347 00:24:51,680 --> 00:24:54,080 Speaker 1: It's a train that clearly has some wheels on fire, 348 00:24:54,440 --> 00:24:58,119 Speaker 1: and it makes you think, well, okay, how does the 349 00:24:58,200 --> 00:25:01,960 Speaker 1: train not have some kind of sensor systems that would 350 00:25:01,960 --> 00:25:04,920 Speaker 1: allow the three people, as we've learned, that are operating 351 00:25:04,920 --> 00:25:07,600 Speaker 1: the train to know that it's happening to be able 352 00:25:07,640 --> 00:25:11,080 Speaker 1: to do something about it. Yeah, yeah, that's a great question. 353 00:25:11,240 --> 00:25:15,600 Speaker 1: So there are a series of I guess, safety measures 354 00:25:15,640 --> 00:25:19,040 Speaker 1: that Norfolk Southern has put in. What we need to 355 00:25:19,040 --> 00:25:21,920 Speaker 1: know about these is that in this area, they're posted 356 00:25:21,920 --> 00:25:25,680 Speaker 1: about every nineteen miles or so, and for anyone who 357 00:25:25,720 --> 00:25:32,240 Speaker 1: likes math word problems, this is nineteen miles and the 358 00:25:32,520 --> 00:25:35,680 Speaker 1: maximum speed of this train is something like fifty miles. 359 00:25:35,800 --> 00:25:39,639 Speaker 1: It's going like forty seven miles per hour anyway, So 360 00:25:40,400 --> 00:25:46,440 Speaker 1: these sensors are not on the train, on the rail 361 00:25:46,560 --> 00:25:51,320 Speaker 1: they're stationary, and the train passes by, and these things 362 00:25:51,480 --> 00:25:57,120 Speaker 1: get a it's like a temperature check, right, So we'll 363 00:25:57,119 --> 00:25:59,159 Speaker 1: do the story a little bit out of order. So 364 00:25:59,280 --> 00:26:03,520 Speaker 1: employees try to stop this train when they get an alert, 365 00:26:03,680 --> 00:26:08,600 Speaker 1: an alarm rings. The twenty third car has overheated. This 366 00:26:08,800 --> 00:26:12,159 Speaker 1: bearing is burning at something like two hundred and fifty 367 00:26:12,160 --> 00:26:17,440 Speaker 1: degrees fahrenheit above the outdoor temperature. The ambient temperatures about 368 00:26:17,480 --> 00:26:22,879 Speaker 1: ten degrees and the overheating does trigger an alarm, but 369 00:26:23,040 --> 00:26:29,919 Speaker 1: it's after multiple sensors have noted it's not at a 370 00:26:29,960 --> 00:26:33,040 Speaker 1: good temperature, and by the time the alarm rings, it's 371 00:26:33,119 --> 00:26:36,399 Speaker 1: too late. And these folks try to stop the train, 372 00:26:36,760 --> 00:26:40,320 Speaker 1: but that bearing, that will bearing, that's burning since Salem, 373 00:26:41,240 --> 00:26:47,240 Speaker 1: it fails and the train can't successfully stop. The guidelines 374 00:26:47,400 --> 00:26:52,639 Speaker 1: for this company, Norfolk Southern, do not require train operators 375 00:26:52,720 --> 00:26:57,080 Speaker 1: to take action of any sort, any mitigating action until 376 00:26:57,320 --> 00:27:01,440 Speaker 1: will bearings reach one hundred and seven d degrees fahrenheit 377 00:27:02,119 --> 00:27:05,479 Speaker 1: above ambient temperature. So in this case, it would be 378 00:27:05,800 --> 00:27:09,080 Speaker 1: one hundred and eighty degrees right, because it's ten degrees outside. 379 00:27:09,600 --> 00:27:12,440 Speaker 1: And the things, the little sensors they have, they're called 380 00:27:12,560 --> 00:27:18,920 Speaker 1: defect detectors. The street name is hot box detectors, I know, right, 381 00:27:19,280 --> 00:27:24,600 Speaker 1: and they are They are primarily focused on seeing if 382 00:27:24,680 --> 00:27:29,840 Speaker 1: something is screwy with signals and axles as these trains 383 00:27:29,880 --> 00:27:33,760 Speaker 1: pass by. And if you look back at the reporting, 384 00:27:33,800 --> 00:27:36,560 Speaker 1: there's a pretty great MPR article about this, you can 385 00:27:36,600 --> 00:27:41,920 Speaker 1: see that the train rules by multiple defect or hot 386 00:27:41,960 --> 00:27:47,080 Speaker 1: box detectors, and each one pings a higher temperature, but 387 00:27:47,160 --> 00:27:51,480 Speaker 1: it doesn't ever reach to fifty until that the one 388 00:27:51,640 --> 00:27:55,000 Speaker 1: just before it's what was it eighteen miles away from 389 00:27:55,000 --> 00:27:58,480 Speaker 1: East Palestine. Not until it's too late, man, Not until 390 00:27:58,480 --> 00:28:01,520 Speaker 1: it's too late. Oh, because that's isn't that why it 391 00:28:02,000 --> 00:28:04,959 Speaker 1: derailed in the first place. They did get that, they 392 00:28:05,440 --> 00:28:07,520 Speaker 1: saw those alarms, They're like, okay, we need to stop 393 00:28:07,560 --> 00:28:10,560 Speaker 1: the train. They're stopping the train and you've got some 394 00:28:10,760 --> 00:28:13,600 Speaker 1: a defective car at this point, and that's what causes 395 00:28:13,640 --> 00:28:17,760 Speaker 1: the derailment. Yep, that's exactly how it happens as far 396 00:28:17,800 --> 00:28:21,680 Speaker 1: as we understand, and speaking to people on the ground, yes, 397 00:28:22,160 --> 00:28:25,919 Speaker 1: that's their experience too. So we were able to confirm 398 00:28:26,119 --> 00:28:30,359 Speaker 1: at least that people living in the area believe that 399 00:28:30,520 --> 00:28:32,760 Speaker 1: is the cause, you know, And we have to be 400 00:28:32,800 --> 00:28:37,000 Speaker 1: careful with stories like this, because every time something like 401 00:28:37,080 --> 00:28:39,760 Speaker 1: this happens and it seems like a cover up ensues, 402 00:28:40,240 --> 00:28:44,960 Speaker 1: then you will find no shortage of people saying that's 403 00:28:45,080 --> 00:28:50,120 Speaker 1: not the real story. You know, the real story is right, 404 00:28:50,200 --> 00:28:53,640 Speaker 1: an improvised explosive or something like that. Of course, much 405 00:28:53,640 --> 00:28:57,640 Speaker 1: more led to this than just not great breaks. And 406 00:28:57,680 --> 00:28:59,600 Speaker 1: I think we have to be clear at this point. 407 00:29:00,320 --> 00:29:04,280 Speaker 1: This is not the fault of those three employees. This 408 00:29:04,400 --> 00:29:08,040 Speaker 1: is not on them, you know. I mean maybe we 409 00:29:08,160 --> 00:29:11,680 Speaker 1: talked a little bit about the aftermath, the government response, 410 00:29:11,800 --> 00:29:16,800 Speaker 1: academic response, corporate response, which was pretty interesting. Yeah, I mean, 411 00:29:17,920 --> 00:29:21,719 Speaker 1: we're gonna get to more about the whole corporate attitude 412 00:29:21,720 --> 00:29:26,440 Speaker 1: about things like this a little later. But the corporate 413 00:29:26,480 --> 00:29:28,840 Speaker 1: response of this kind of thing is always an interesting 414 00:29:28,920 --> 00:29:33,120 Speaker 1: calculation to be whole, isn't it, Because you have to. Yeah, 415 00:29:33,200 --> 00:29:35,800 Speaker 1: especially if something makes the news in such a massive 416 00:29:35,840 --> 00:29:38,360 Speaker 1: way like this and your name is being thrown around, 417 00:29:38,720 --> 00:29:42,800 Speaker 1: you got at the very least faint, uh, some amount 418 00:29:42,840 --> 00:29:46,520 Speaker 1: of concern, and I know everything, we're doing everything we 419 00:29:46,600 --> 00:29:48,840 Speaker 1: can on the ground and trying to figure all this 420 00:29:48,880 --> 00:29:52,320 Speaker 1: out while also you know, doing damage control and minimizing 421 00:29:53,000 --> 00:29:56,920 Speaker 1: you know, the the risk right in terms of you know, 422 00:29:57,240 --> 00:30:01,320 Speaker 1: app optics, you're not doing anything necessarily actually minimize the risk, 423 00:30:01,520 --> 00:30:05,720 Speaker 1: but you're downplaying it. Let's just say yeah, yeah. And 424 00:30:05,800 --> 00:30:10,400 Speaker 1: we mentioned the evacuation short lived as it was. We 425 00:30:10,560 --> 00:30:14,560 Speaker 1: mentioned the threats that some people on the ground encountered. 426 00:30:14,960 --> 00:30:19,280 Speaker 1: We did not mention a reporter named Evan Lambert who 427 00:30:19,360 --> 00:30:23,120 Speaker 1: was arrested at a press conference. As we record today, 428 00:30:23,160 --> 00:30:29,200 Speaker 1: those charges are dismissed, so Evan is a freeman. But 429 00:30:30,600 --> 00:30:34,400 Speaker 1: what we have to also understand is that when you 430 00:30:34,560 --> 00:30:39,920 Speaker 1: hear about a disaster an environmental screw up, and then 431 00:30:39,960 --> 00:30:43,960 Speaker 1: you hear that any reporter is arrested. I don't know 432 00:30:44,000 --> 00:30:47,880 Speaker 1: about you, guys, but my my Spidey sense tingle, my 433 00:30:48,160 --> 00:30:52,360 Speaker 1: defect detectors start going off. For sure. It is Yeah, guys, 434 00:30:52,360 --> 00:30:54,280 Speaker 1: I want to give just short time. I tried to 435 00:30:54,280 --> 00:30:57,240 Speaker 1: do this earlier and I completely messed up, just to 436 00:30:57,280 --> 00:31:02,360 Speaker 1: give timeline of the moment when people were told to 437 00:31:02,480 --> 00:31:04,920 Speaker 1: leave or they need to leave, to when they were told, hey, 438 00:31:04,920 --> 00:31:07,240 Speaker 1: it's all right to come back, everything's safe, come on back. 439 00:31:08,040 --> 00:31:11,640 Speaker 1: So February third is the derailment. The bad chemicals start 440 00:31:11,680 --> 00:31:16,640 Speaker 1: spilling out in between February third and February sixth is 441 00:31:17,120 --> 00:31:19,360 Speaker 1: when people are told to leave, like, oh, this is 442 00:31:19,360 --> 00:31:23,200 Speaker 1: a really bad derailment, it's kind of dangerous. Just before 443 00:31:23,400 --> 00:31:27,120 Speaker 1: or on February sixth, it was basically, everybody needs to 444 00:31:27,120 --> 00:31:29,960 Speaker 1: get out of town because we've now made the decision 445 00:31:30,000 --> 00:31:33,120 Speaker 1: to burn these chemicals and it's going to be really dangerous. 446 00:31:33,160 --> 00:31:35,120 Speaker 1: We need you to leave. So from the third to 447 00:31:35,160 --> 00:31:38,120 Speaker 1: the sixth, that's when that occurs. Then from the sixth 448 00:31:38,400 --> 00:31:41,680 Speaker 1: to the eighth is when people are told they could 449 00:31:41,680 --> 00:31:44,960 Speaker 1: come back. Everything burns on the sixth, On the eighth, 450 00:31:45,440 --> 00:31:49,000 Speaker 1: all's clear, come on back, everything's fine. Like that to 451 00:31:49,080 --> 00:31:52,440 Speaker 1: me is astounding. That does not seem like a long 452 00:31:52,560 --> 00:31:56,160 Speaker 1: enough time for all that stuff to disperse from the environment. 453 00:31:56,200 --> 00:31:59,080 Speaker 1: And it's not yeah, no, it's total, is it. Let's 454 00:31:59,120 --> 00:32:03,840 Speaker 1: go to academic spots. Is because chemist professors, policy walks 455 00:32:04,440 --> 00:32:07,160 Speaker 1: all though you know what else say it all the 456 00:32:07,320 --> 00:32:11,200 Speaker 1: folks like us, your faithful correspondence, all the nerds. The 457 00:32:11,240 --> 00:32:17,640 Speaker 1: public often ignores. They immediately clocked the long term dangers involved. 458 00:32:17,720 --> 00:32:20,480 Speaker 1: And this is when experts come out of the woodwork. 459 00:32:20,840 --> 00:32:23,520 Speaker 1: You know, there's a guy from the University of Pittsburgh who, 460 00:32:23,760 --> 00:32:28,400 Speaker 1: as part of his vocation studies the effects of vinyl 461 00:32:28,520 --> 00:32:33,760 Speaker 1: chloride and all the horrible stuff that can happen when 462 00:32:33,920 --> 00:32:39,560 Speaker 1: that is in the environment. They knew, they knew this 463 00:32:39,680 --> 00:32:42,360 Speaker 1: was bad. They were saying this, and it was a 464 00:32:42,360 --> 00:32:47,200 Speaker 1: little bit ignored. And the Texas at M Superfund Research 465 00:32:48,080 --> 00:32:53,040 Speaker 1: Center found that nine of the fifty chemicals reported by 466 00:32:53,080 --> 00:32:55,960 Speaker 1: the EPA when the EPA showed up and started looking 467 00:32:56,000 --> 00:33:01,760 Speaker 1: at the air, nine of those are higher than normal levels. 468 00:33:02,360 --> 00:33:06,440 Speaker 1: And the EPA tweeted, because everybody's doing Twitter now, the 469 00:33:06,480 --> 00:33:09,960 Speaker 1: EPA tweeted, if these levels continue, they may be of 470 00:33:10,080 --> 00:33:12,959 Speaker 1: health concern, which I know sounds kind of milk toast, 471 00:33:13,320 --> 00:33:16,600 Speaker 1: but again, let's consider this is the EPA, so this 472 00:33:16,720 --> 00:33:19,320 Speaker 1: is like a hot bar for them to drop. Maybe 473 00:33:19,480 --> 00:33:21,680 Speaker 1: we're very rare rare. Those are not the sounds of 474 00:33:21,840 --> 00:33:28,120 Speaker 1: emergency clacksons. Those are airhorns indicating firebars. There we go, 475 00:33:28,280 --> 00:33:34,200 Speaker 1: literal firebars. Yeah, and that means that no matter who 476 00:33:34,280 --> 00:33:40,040 Speaker 1: has infiltrated and compromised the EPA, which is true with 477 00:33:40,040 --> 00:33:45,120 Speaker 1: many government agencies, the concern was still enough that they 478 00:33:45,160 --> 00:33:48,760 Speaker 1: went on record for it. Maybe we go to corporate response. 479 00:33:48,800 --> 00:33:51,040 Speaker 1: I think that's the one a lot of us want 480 00:33:51,040 --> 00:33:56,840 Speaker 1: to hear Norfolk Southern these guys, these dudes, all right, yeah, 481 00:33:56,840 --> 00:33:58,320 Speaker 1: I kind of teased it a little bit, but I 482 00:33:58,320 --> 00:34:03,760 Speaker 1: mean the specific sir, pretty pretty bold. Sign this piece 483 00:34:03,760 --> 00:34:08,000 Speaker 1: of paper. Here's a thousand dollars. Don't worry about contacting 484 00:34:08,000 --> 00:34:10,600 Speaker 1: a lawyer, you know what I mean, Like you got 485 00:34:10,600 --> 00:34:15,480 Speaker 1: your back. Sure, we're the good guys. They're they're paying 486 00:34:15,520 --> 00:34:21,319 Speaker 1: out something like six point five million dollars currently, and 487 00:34:21,400 --> 00:34:24,040 Speaker 1: that sounds like a lot of money for like a 488 00:34:24,120 --> 00:34:28,640 Speaker 1: single you know, lawsuit for one recipient, you know, for 489 00:34:28,760 --> 00:34:31,760 Speaker 1: something like this. But that's like that's like their budget 490 00:34:31,840 --> 00:34:34,160 Speaker 1: for a toilet paper, you know, for a I mean, 491 00:34:34,160 --> 00:34:38,359 Speaker 1: it's it's nothing. It's embarrassing. According to some residents, they 492 00:34:38,360 --> 00:34:40,880 Speaker 1: were offered a thousand dollars, so a check for a 493 00:34:40,960 --> 00:34:44,160 Speaker 1: thousand dollars, and then they were required to sign something 494 00:34:44,440 --> 00:34:47,280 Speaker 1: that said they would not seek any more money after 495 00:34:47,320 --> 00:34:52,640 Speaker 1: this one payment from Norfolk Southern, right right, which is 496 00:34:52,680 --> 00:34:57,359 Speaker 1: something a couple of other corporations did in the wake 497 00:34:57,440 --> 00:35:00,000 Speaker 1: of things like deep water, in the wake of things 498 00:35:00,320 --> 00:35:05,759 Speaker 1: like Hurricane Katrina. The idea is to the idea is 499 00:35:06,280 --> 00:35:09,319 Speaker 1: candidly to get to folks when they're at their most 500 00:35:09,400 --> 00:35:13,480 Speaker 1: vulnerable and when they do not have full informed consent 501 00:35:13,760 --> 00:35:17,920 Speaker 1: of what they are agreeing to. Let's also consider that 502 00:35:18,120 --> 00:35:23,560 Speaker 1: Norfolk Southern just a few months ago in twenty twenty three, 503 00:35:24,600 --> 00:35:28,120 Speaker 1: stated that they're going to spend seven point five billion 504 00:35:28,200 --> 00:35:32,120 Speaker 1: dollars to do a share buy back. This is something 505 00:35:32,160 --> 00:35:35,560 Speaker 1: that benefits shareholders because I think they get a good 506 00:35:35,560 --> 00:35:41,919 Speaker 1: deal essentially, right, yeah, yeah, the money moves right and yes, yes, 507 00:35:42,320 --> 00:35:45,839 Speaker 1: the CEO of Norfolk Southern lives here in our fair 508 00:35:45,880 --> 00:35:50,279 Speaker 1: metropolis of Atlanta, Georgia. His name is Alan Shaw. He 509 00:35:50,440 --> 00:35:53,040 Speaker 1: is not going to appear on the show today because 510 00:35:53,480 --> 00:35:56,600 Speaker 1: he seems kind of busy. Did we reach out, Let 511 00:35:56,600 --> 00:36:02,479 Speaker 1: me reach out a little? Okay, Matt, did you call them? 512 00:36:02,840 --> 00:36:09,719 Speaker 1: Not yet, but I will. Matt loves telephones, so so other. 513 00:36:09,840 --> 00:36:12,400 Speaker 1: There were other corporate responses. I don't know how highly 514 00:36:12,400 --> 00:36:15,120 Speaker 1: publicize these are. I imagine they are because it's a 515 00:36:15,160 --> 00:36:19,960 Speaker 1: PR spin. But Amazon and Walmart, who are act both 516 00:36:19,960 --> 00:36:23,399 Speaker 1: of whom are active in the area, were sending out 517 00:36:23,520 --> 00:36:26,520 Speaker 1: stuff like if you go now, what you will see 518 00:36:26,800 --> 00:36:31,960 Speaker 1: is a great emphasis on bottled water, right because you can't. 519 00:36:33,760 --> 00:36:37,879 Speaker 1: I wouldn't personally trust taking a shower or washing your 520 00:36:37,880 --> 00:36:41,200 Speaker 1: hands or ingesting water from the tap there, you know, 521 00:36:41,360 --> 00:36:46,440 Speaker 1: off mic behind the curtain. Well, when when we were 522 00:36:46,480 --> 00:36:49,680 Speaker 1: talking about this, I sent some pictures on our group 523 00:36:49,719 --> 00:36:53,880 Speaker 1: text and you guys saw some pretty nasty creeks and 524 00:36:53,920 --> 00:36:56,480 Speaker 1: at least one of those pictures, right, Yeah, And one 525 00:36:56,520 --> 00:36:58,840 Speaker 1: of the things we're seeing online right now quite often 526 00:36:59,080 --> 00:37:01,719 Speaker 1: is if you just look at the surface of some 527 00:37:01,800 --> 00:37:04,560 Speaker 1: of those creeks that are passing through the area, it 528 00:37:04,600 --> 00:37:08,960 Speaker 1: doesn't look that bad. You might see a little discoloration. However, 529 00:37:09,560 --> 00:37:12,920 Speaker 1: when folks are throwing let's say a stone or something 530 00:37:12,960 --> 00:37:15,400 Speaker 1: heavy into that water, and it causes ripples and it 531 00:37:15,440 --> 00:37:19,600 Speaker 1: causes some of the sediment at the bottom to rise up, 532 00:37:20,120 --> 00:37:25,440 Speaker 1: you see basically bubbles of this multi colored as you said, Sheen, 533 00:37:26,000 --> 00:37:29,600 Speaker 1: that just covers the entire surface of the water. Which 534 00:37:29,719 --> 00:37:33,640 Speaker 1: makes me think about the water testing that has been 535 00:37:33,840 --> 00:37:37,520 Speaker 1: done in that area multiple times. It's pretty much constantly 536 00:37:37,600 --> 00:37:41,839 Speaker 1: being done at this point by varying agencies like FEMA, 537 00:37:42,000 --> 00:37:45,480 Speaker 1: the EPA, even the CDC has been getting involved. The 538 00:37:45,680 --> 00:37:49,960 Speaker 1: Department of Health and Human Services is involved, and they're 539 00:37:50,000 --> 00:37:52,680 Speaker 1: supposedly testing the water. And I know there are rigorous 540 00:37:52,719 --> 00:37:55,440 Speaker 1: standards for doing that kind of test, but dang. If 541 00:37:55,440 --> 00:37:59,280 Speaker 1: it doesn't feel like you could maybe dip a tester 542 00:37:59,560 --> 00:38:01,520 Speaker 1: into the top of that water and it would give 543 00:38:01,560 --> 00:38:03,800 Speaker 1: you one thing, or you could go down a little 544 00:38:03,840 --> 00:38:06,719 Speaker 1: deeper and you get something else. I don't know. That 545 00:38:06,800 --> 00:38:09,080 Speaker 1: just makes me. That makes me feel nervous. And I'm 546 00:38:09,080 --> 00:38:12,480 Speaker 1: not even drinking the stuff. Like one of those yogurt 547 00:38:12,520 --> 00:38:15,839 Speaker 1: cups in grocery stores that have fruit at the bottom, 548 00:38:15,920 --> 00:38:17,919 Speaker 1: you know, you just put the spoon in the top 549 00:38:17,960 --> 00:38:21,359 Speaker 1: and you're like, what, there are no strawberries here, something else. 550 00:38:22,920 --> 00:38:26,640 Speaker 1: It's just the Dela yogurt. Look. Here's the thing, though, 551 00:38:27,440 --> 00:38:33,360 Speaker 1: I'm wondering whether this corporate proactive response outside of Norfolk Southern, 552 00:38:33,520 --> 00:38:38,480 Speaker 1: like the big dynasties like Walmart and Amazon, I'm wondering 553 00:38:38,640 --> 00:38:45,400 Speaker 1: if their actions are triggered by grassroots social media attention, 554 00:38:45,800 --> 00:38:49,799 Speaker 1: because we already encounter a little bit of backlash when, 555 00:38:51,120 --> 00:38:54,279 Speaker 1: like some of our fellow conspiracy realists were saying, hey, 556 00:38:54,320 --> 00:38:57,000 Speaker 1: you're not talking about this. Why aren't you talking about it? 557 00:38:57,320 --> 00:39:00,319 Speaker 1: And one thing we want to establish is that if 558 00:39:00,360 --> 00:39:03,399 Speaker 1: something of this magnitude is occurring and you don't hear 559 00:39:03,440 --> 00:39:07,279 Speaker 1: from us immediately, it's because we're working on it. It's 560 00:39:07,360 --> 00:39:10,960 Speaker 1: not because we're ignoring it. And at this point, knock 561 00:39:11,120 --> 00:39:16,280 Speaker 1: on wood, no one has pulled our leash on this show. 562 00:39:16,440 --> 00:39:19,640 Speaker 1: No one has told us that we can or cannot 563 00:39:19,680 --> 00:39:23,080 Speaker 1: cover a thing. Can we confirm that, oh, Matt, oh yeah, fully, 564 00:39:23,080 --> 00:39:25,440 Speaker 1: we've never had our leash pulled. But to be honest, 565 00:39:25,440 --> 00:39:30,160 Speaker 1: we don't very often get an opportunity with our schedules 566 00:39:30,160 --> 00:39:32,319 Speaker 1: and everything else going on to you know, do the 567 00:39:32,320 --> 00:39:35,080 Speaker 1: boots on the ground thing. But what we do generally 568 00:39:35,480 --> 00:39:38,040 Speaker 1: is well, at least okay, what we do is make 569 00:39:38,080 --> 00:39:40,800 Speaker 1: phone calls, We go online, We reach out to everybody 570 00:39:40,840 --> 00:39:43,560 Speaker 1: we possibly can to get a clear picture. Right, Yeah, 571 00:39:43,760 --> 00:39:52,120 Speaker 1: we love primary sources, honestly, And unlike many many similar incidents, 572 00:39:52,719 --> 00:39:56,359 Speaker 1: this derailment occurred in the heyday of social media, which 573 00:39:56,400 --> 00:39:59,800 Speaker 1: means numerous folks across the US. We're asking, with a 574 00:40:00,040 --> 00:40:04,280 Speaker 1: out of validity, why mainstream news was spending so much 575 00:40:04,360 --> 00:40:10,520 Speaker 1: time focused on balloons, focused on UFOs in the Alaskan 576 00:40:10,600 --> 00:40:17,480 Speaker 1: Canadian border instead of these proven dangerous disasters with proven culprits. 577 00:40:18,120 --> 00:40:21,680 Speaker 1: So we have to ask, what else does this tell us? 578 00:40:22,280 --> 00:40:26,000 Speaker 1: What is the bigger picture? That's a question we're diving into, 579 00:40:26,560 --> 00:40:39,200 Speaker 1: right after our break. Here's where it gets crazy. What 580 00:40:39,360 --> 00:40:43,239 Speaker 1: happened and what is happening and what will happen in 581 00:40:43,360 --> 00:40:47,319 Speaker 1: East Palestine is far from unique. As a matter of fact, 582 00:40:47,360 --> 00:40:54,880 Speaker 1: one person on Instagram chimed in with something like, oh, 583 00:40:54,920 --> 00:41:00,680 Speaker 1: it's a shame that this derailment gets more attention than 584 00:41:00,680 --> 00:41:03,680 Speaker 1: the others. I can't remember the quote, but it seemed 585 00:41:03,719 --> 00:41:07,240 Speaker 1: to have this vibe that we were linking to focus 586 00:41:07,320 --> 00:41:10,000 Speaker 1: on one thing. Well, yeah, because there was another major 587 00:41:10,080 --> 00:41:15,920 Speaker 1: chemical spill like a couple of days after it's it 588 00:41:16,040 --> 00:41:17,759 Speaker 1: was oh lord, I can't even tell you what it is. 589 00:41:17,760 --> 00:41:20,439 Speaker 1: I opened links on my phone because we were thinking 590 00:41:20,440 --> 00:41:24,040 Speaker 1: about doing a strange news about this, and then it 591 00:41:24,080 --> 00:41:26,040 Speaker 1: was oh, well, maybe we'll do strange news about that 592 00:41:26,080 --> 00:41:29,520 Speaker 1: other one. And it's basically feeling to us like, oh wow, 593 00:41:29,560 --> 00:41:33,279 Speaker 1: these chemical spills are happening all the time, and infrastructure 594 00:41:33,280 --> 00:41:36,040 Speaker 1: attacks and all these things were bad stuff getting into 595 00:41:36,080 --> 00:41:42,240 Speaker 1: the environment and potentially affecting local residents of Name the Place, USA. Yeah, 596 00:41:42,280 --> 00:41:46,960 Speaker 1: I like that Name the Place, USA. We were talking 597 00:41:46,960 --> 00:41:50,640 Speaker 1: about this in I guess we're hanging out off air. 598 00:41:51,920 --> 00:41:55,600 Speaker 1: The Guardian had that excellent article. Matt. I think we 599 00:41:55,719 --> 00:41:57,680 Speaker 1: both read it. I found it on read it at 600 00:41:57,719 --> 00:42:06,439 Speaker 1: least about just how frequent these infrastructure industrial incidents are 601 00:42:06,719 --> 00:42:12,760 Speaker 1: in the US. We know that a lot of stuff 602 00:42:12,840 --> 00:42:15,840 Speaker 1: is happening beneath the fold. As journalists would say, it 603 00:42:15,920 --> 00:42:20,399 Speaker 1: doesn't get the same level of attention. The situation in 604 00:42:20,560 --> 00:42:27,560 Speaker 1: Ohio got a much larger than average amount of attention, 605 00:42:28,400 --> 00:42:32,799 Speaker 1: and it should. But everything else needs to be acknowledged. 606 00:42:32,840 --> 00:42:36,280 Speaker 1: This is one one tip of a very large iceberg. 607 00:42:36,320 --> 00:42:40,680 Speaker 1: There's one facet of a very dangerous diamond. Derailments are 608 00:42:40,760 --> 00:42:47,040 Speaker 1: not that uncommon in this country. Collisions, fatalities, you name it, 609 00:42:47,200 --> 00:42:50,960 Speaker 1: and this should bother people. Oh, yeah, Ben, it was. 610 00:42:51,040 --> 00:42:56,000 Speaker 1: It was LaSalle, That's what it's called, right, Illinois. It 611 00:42:56,080 --> 00:42:58,640 Speaker 1: happened in January, and I remember we had just talked 612 00:42:58,680 --> 00:43:03,160 Speaker 1: about that and it was another chemical spill and people 613 00:43:03,160 --> 00:43:05,480 Speaker 1: were worried about stuff in the air, just like they 614 00:43:05,520 --> 00:43:07,880 Speaker 1: are in Ohio right now. Yeah, it was the chemical 615 00:43:07,960 --> 00:43:12,400 Speaker 1: plant exploded, right, potassium permagnate or something, That's what it was. 616 00:43:12,840 --> 00:43:15,319 Speaker 1: They're happening so quickly, back to back to back. It's 617 00:43:15,360 --> 00:43:18,320 Speaker 1: hard for me to know wish one I'm even thinking 618 00:43:18,360 --> 00:43:21,359 Speaker 1: about because it really is. You name the small town, 619 00:43:21,760 --> 00:43:25,600 Speaker 1: you know, and it's interesting too. We talked about this 620 00:43:26,480 --> 00:43:31,200 Speaker 1: kind of method of of moving goods and people as 621 00:43:31,239 --> 00:43:33,840 Speaker 1: being a very legacy part of the history of the 622 00:43:33,880 --> 00:43:36,080 Speaker 1: United States, and I think everyone pretty much knows that. 623 00:43:36,160 --> 00:43:42,120 Speaker 1: But that also means that it's an aging and aged 624 00:43:42,640 --> 00:43:46,839 Speaker 1: you know, infrastructure, and as we know with things like 625 00:43:47,000 --> 00:43:51,439 Speaker 1: you know, subway tunnels and old pipes and things like that, 626 00:43:52,000 --> 00:43:56,240 Speaker 1: it's oftentimes not first priority to fix things before things 627 00:43:56,320 --> 00:43:59,400 Speaker 1: go wrong, whether it be because of lack of personnel 628 00:43:59,600 --> 00:44:02,160 Speaker 1: or the cost or whatever. So a lot of times 629 00:44:03,480 --> 00:44:07,319 Speaker 1: these things aren't really addressed until there's a there's a 630 00:44:07,360 --> 00:44:10,120 Speaker 1: there's a big problem. If then I'm really glad you 631 00:44:10,200 --> 00:44:13,880 Speaker 1: brought that up, because I was thinking about the aviation industry. 632 00:44:14,400 --> 00:44:19,200 Speaker 1: So when planes fly, when commercial planes fly and military planes, 633 00:44:19,200 --> 00:44:24,400 Speaker 1: to be honest, there's a full on check, right, problems 634 00:44:24,440 --> 00:44:30,200 Speaker 1: are proactively addressed. Maintenance is proactive. That does not seem 635 00:44:30,239 --> 00:44:34,120 Speaker 1: to be the case with rail and the US needs 636 00:44:34,160 --> 00:44:40,400 Speaker 1: the rail system. The US absolutely needs the rail system. 637 00:44:40,480 --> 00:44:47,359 Speaker 1: And anybody who's acting like railroad unions are bad there 638 00:44:47,360 --> 00:44:53,719 Speaker 1: either willingly misleading you or they're not in full possession 639 00:44:53,719 --> 00:44:57,800 Speaker 1: of the facts. You know, because railroad workers are called 640 00:44:57,880 --> 00:45:02,440 Speaker 1: essential workers. That means they get screwed over even more 641 00:45:02,640 --> 00:45:06,440 Speaker 1: than most people. And we talked about this on a 642 00:45:06,480 --> 00:45:11,439 Speaker 1: couple of different shows. The railroad unions attempted to negotiate 643 00:45:12,400 --> 00:45:16,560 Speaker 1: and they got curtailed. And look, it doesn't matter how 644 00:45:16,560 --> 00:45:21,040 Speaker 1: you feel politically, the current US administration screwed them over. 645 00:45:21,600 --> 00:45:25,279 Speaker 1: You know, they don't get sick days at all, right, 646 00:45:25,560 --> 00:45:30,160 Speaker 1: and so in addition to that, they have burdens placed 647 00:45:30,320 --> 00:45:35,160 Speaker 1: upon them that most people and most other professions could 648 00:45:35,239 --> 00:45:39,280 Speaker 1: never could never imagine. So think about this simply put. 649 00:45:39,320 --> 00:45:43,240 Speaker 1: The United States has fallen victim to a grand conspiracy. 650 00:45:43,560 --> 00:45:47,000 Speaker 1: And it's not a cool one. They're no ghosts, no aliens, 651 00:45:47,080 --> 00:45:50,000 Speaker 1: no psychic powers. It's people who have money and they 652 00:45:50,080 --> 00:45:57,200 Speaker 1: want more money. Private entities have infiltrated and compromised the state. 653 00:45:58,040 --> 00:46:01,080 Speaker 1: They hold the levers of power, they can make the 654 00:46:01,200 --> 00:46:05,960 Speaker 1: laws that are meant to govern them. The street name 655 00:46:06,000 --> 00:46:10,040 Speaker 1: for this is regulatory capture. Example would be Norfolk, Southern 656 00:46:10,480 --> 00:46:15,880 Speaker 1: other railroad companies. They actively lobbied and successfully lobbied the 657 00:46:16,000 --> 00:46:21,400 Speaker 1: US government to rescind regulations that would require and update 658 00:46:21,480 --> 00:46:24,520 Speaker 1: on the breaking systems. They did it, they did it, 659 00:46:24,520 --> 00:46:29,920 Speaker 1: they got away with it, and they also have exercise 660 00:46:30,040 --> 00:46:35,880 Speaker 1: that influence to prevent workers' rights for people in the 661 00:46:35,960 --> 00:46:39,239 Speaker 1: railroad industry. Right now, this is a true story. As 662 00:46:39,280 --> 00:46:44,880 Speaker 1: we're recording, our pal codenamed Doc Holiday just hipped us 663 00:46:44,880 --> 00:46:49,080 Speaker 1: to a story on Bloomberg that says Norfolk Southern has 664 00:46:49,120 --> 00:46:52,600 Speaker 1: been accused of trying to destroy evidence of the Ohio wreck, 665 00:46:53,040 --> 00:46:56,280 Speaker 1: which honestly I get because they're carton off toxic waste 666 00:46:56,440 --> 00:46:59,400 Speaker 1: to Michigan. People in Michigan didn't know about this in 667 00:46:59,560 --> 00:47:04,560 Speaker 1: Texas and Texas and now it's going to different parts 668 00:47:04,560 --> 00:47:07,440 Speaker 1: of Ohio. Well they were gonna haul It's so crazy. 669 00:47:07,800 --> 00:47:10,960 Speaker 1: I started trying to look at the timeline for this 670 00:47:11,040 --> 00:47:14,120 Speaker 1: thing to understand exactly what's going on. You guys, it 671 00:47:14,280 --> 00:47:19,840 Speaker 1: is clear that Norfolk Southern's priority was get those things, 672 00:47:20,120 --> 00:47:22,680 Speaker 1: all the mess that was on the rail, get it 673 00:47:22,680 --> 00:47:25,320 Speaker 1: out of there so that we can send more trains 674 00:47:25,440 --> 00:47:28,239 Speaker 1: through on that exact same rail well and repair the 675 00:47:28,320 --> 00:47:30,200 Speaker 1: rail and throw some more rocks on it right to 676 00:47:30,239 --> 00:47:33,160 Speaker 1: make sure it's all stable in running. But it's what 677 00:47:33,160 --> 00:47:36,400 Speaker 1: we talked about in our previous episodes, getting those trains 678 00:47:36,840 --> 00:47:40,200 Speaker 1: to their destinations on time, with all of that stuff 679 00:47:40,239 --> 00:47:44,080 Speaker 1: that makes our country continue to function in our small 680 00:47:44,120 --> 00:47:47,680 Speaker 1: towns and villages. That's what the priority is. Keep that 681 00:47:47,800 --> 00:47:50,640 Speaker 1: going because not only is it all the stuff that 682 00:47:50,719 --> 00:47:54,080 Speaker 1: we all need in all of our walmarts, it's also 683 00:47:54,160 --> 00:47:57,759 Speaker 1: a giant money valve that just if you turn it off, 684 00:47:59,640 --> 00:48:02,640 Speaker 1: it's not good for the company because they rely on 685 00:48:02,719 --> 00:48:08,080 Speaker 1: that pretty much constant flow of goods getting to their destinations. Yeah, 686 00:48:08,120 --> 00:48:10,759 Speaker 1: and you have to you know, one one point a 687 00:48:10,800 --> 00:48:14,800 Speaker 1: lot of people don't consider is that rail is actually 688 00:48:14,960 --> 00:48:19,520 Speaker 1: the best way to transport a lot of this stuff. 689 00:48:19,520 --> 00:48:23,320 Speaker 1: You don't want it on US highways. God forbid next 690 00:48:23,320 --> 00:48:26,520 Speaker 1: to someone driving a BMW because they still don't understand 691 00:48:26,560 --> 00:48:30,880 Speaker 1: turn signals, you know what I mean, Like, I don't know, 692 00:48:30,920 --> 00:48:34,840 Speaker 1: if you're listening, you drive a BMW, we promise you 693 00:48:34,840 --> 00:48:38,080 Speaker 1: you're not going to run out of turn signals. You can, 694 00:48:38,239 --> 00:48:42,479 Speaker 1: you can use them. It'll be okay, you might help 695 00:48:42,560 --> 00:48:45,759 Speaker 1: prevent an XT. Okay, you know what, BMW is gonna 696 00:48:45,800 --> 00:48:49,080 Speaker 1: hit us? Say that is my stereotype? True? Am I 697 00:48:49,160 --> 00:48:51,600 Speaker 1: being a jerk? I don't know. I mean, it definitely 698 00:48:51,640 --> 00:48:53,719 Speaker 1: feels like sometimes people that feel like they have they 699 00:48:53,760 --> 00:48:58,520 Speaker 1: need to have, like flexi type cars aren't the best 700 00:48:58,560 --> 00:49:00,680 Speaker 1: of drivers. If that's what you're getting that, I would 701 00:49:00,680 --> 00:49:03,239 Speaker 1: agree with that. Well, maybe they don't know. Maybe it's 702 00:49:03,280 --> 00:49:05,960 Speaker 1: not in the driver's manual. I mean, every time somebody 703 00:49:06,000 --> 00:49:09,320 Speaker 1: goes past me, blast pass being traffic with a I 704 00:49:09,440 --> 00:49:12,479 Speaker 1: just go, cool guy right there? Lookyet that cool guy? 705 00:49:12,800 --> 00:49:15,719 Speaker 1: You know, so it hard to not roll your eyes 706 00:49:15,760 --> 00:49:18,320 Speaker 1: at that. But I'm sure there are plenty of lovely 707 00:49:18,400 --> 00:49:21,799 Speaker 1: people that are very safe drivers who drive BMWs, you know, 708 00:49:22,120 --> 00:49:25,960 Speaker 1: not all hashtag not all. When I see when I 709 00:49:26,000 --> 00:49:29,440 Speaker 1: see h when I see a car rip roaring across 710 00:49:29,600 --> 00:49:31,840 Speaker 1: and then like try to do the three four lane 711 00:49:31,920 --> 00:49:36,440 Speaker 1: swerve into the exit, I'm always like, hey, man, I 712 00:49:36,480 --> 00:49:38,560 Speaker 1: know you probably don't get along with them, but I'm 713 00:49:38,600 --> 00:49:41,319 Speaker 1: sure your dad loves you. You should just talk to him. 714 00:49:42,000 --> 00:49:47,279 Speaker 1: Probably not though, that's why they are the way they are. 715 00:49:47,840 --> 00:49:51,160 Speaker 1: Come on, no one is beyond improvement, right, So true, 716 00:49:51,200 --> 00:49:53,880 Speaker 1: but you have to acknowledge that improvement is needed first, 717 00:49:53,920 --> 00:49:55,279 Speaker 1: and a lot of times people to get to that 718 00:49:55,400 --> 00:49:58,600 Speaker 1: level and I'm not capable of doing such. What were 719 00:49:58,600 --> 00:50:04,000 Speaker 1: we talking about? Yeah, exactly right, Yeah, disasters, many many 720 00:50:04,080 --> 00:50:07,120 Speaker 1: that occurred and more to come. That's the problem. Would 721 00:50:07,120 --> 00:50:13,080 Speaker 1: the East Palestine derailment have occurred with updated breaking technology. 722 00:50:13,280 --> 00:50:17,040 Speaker 1: It is honestly hard to tell, but we can say 723 00:50:17,080 --> 00:50:21,640 Speaker 1: the likelihood of this particular incident would have been much lower. 724 00:50:21,840 --> 00:50:26,680 Speaker 1: And as we record today February twenty seventh, twenty twenty three, 725 00:50:26,920 --> 00:50:32,400 Speaker 1: Norfolk Southern continues to pour millions of dollars into political influence. 726 00:50:32,760 --> 00:50:35,880 Speaker 1: You can find some version of the truth on their website. 727 00:50:36,280 --> 00:50:39,120 Speaker 1: You can find more accurate versions of the truth on 728 00:50:39,440 --> 00:50:43,600 Speaker 1: other sites. And please, please, folks, if you have not 729 00:50:43,719 --> 00:50:49,000 Speaker 1: read that chapter in our book on lobbying, please read it. 730 00:50:49,280 --> 00:50:52,239 Speaker 1: Please do check it out. But we can't stop there. 731 00:50:52,320 --> 00:50:55,799 Speaker 1: We have to ask what about the larger problem of 732 00:50:55,920 --> 00:51:01,839 Speaker 1: infrastructure in this country. The rail is the spine of 733 00:51:01,920 --> 00:51:05,200 Speaker 1: the country, right The rail has to exist for the 734 00:51:05,239 --> 00:51:08,600 Speaker 1: country to walk, for it to move. And infrastructure in 735 00:51:08,640 --> 00:51:12,920 Speaker 1: the US is no longer fully controlled by your elected representatives, 736 00:51:13,560 --> 00:51:16,359 Speaker 1: which I know is a very frightening thing to say. 737 00:51:16,600 --> 00:51:20,680 Speaker 1: Am I being hyperbolic? I don't think so, you don't 738 00:51:20,680 --> 00:51:27,480 Speaker 1: think so, well, I don't know. Like you see these 739 00:51:27,600 --> 00:51:30,240 Speaker 1: You see these folks who are acting in bad faith, 740 00:51:30,800 --> 00:51:32,759 Speaker 1: and they want the polls, they want the clicks, they 741 00:51:32,760 --> 00:51:37,520 Speaker 1: want the Etcas. And they say some government agency should 742 00:51:37,520 --> 00:51:40,720 Speaker 1: not exist right. Quite recently, I think someone was saying, 743 00:51:41,080 --> 00:51:44,200 Speaker 1: get rid of the Department of Education, get rid of 744 00:51:44,239 --> 00:51:47,120 Speaker 1: stuff like the Department of Energy. I can't remember who 745 00:51:47,560 --> 00:51:52,040 Speaker 1: who that was. But those politicians aren't even the full problem. 746 00:51:52,080 --> 00:51:56,600 Speaker 1: It's the people who own them. You know. Years ago, Matt, 747 00:51:57,760 --> 00:52:01,320 Speaker 1: all three of us we joked about how politicians should 748 00:52:01,560 --> 00:52:03,960 Speaker 1: have to be like race car drivers. You have to 749 00:52:04,040 --> 00:52:09,080 Speaker 1: wear patches on your suit for your sponsorship. Right Like, 750 00:52:09,120 --> 00:52:12,800 Speaker 1: if I'm getting a speech about an oil spill from someone, 751 00:52:13,440 --> 00:52:17,160 Speaker 1: I want to see their XON patch if XU paid them. 752 00:52:17,200 --> 00:52:22,719 Speaker 1: If I'm getting a speech about about train derailments, I 753 00:52:22,800 --> 00:52:25,359 Speaker 1: want to see whether they've got a Norfolk Southern patch 754 00:52:25,400 --> 00:52:28,120 Speaker 1: on their vest. That would be nice, it'd be really 755 00:52:28,120 --> 00:52:35,080 Speaker 1: cool that Ricky Bobby, that whole system like that. Yeah, well, 756 00:52:35,239 --> 00:52:40,399 Speaker 1: you know it's weird, guys, because we're seeing regulatory agencies 757 00:52:41,200 --> 00:52:44,840 Speaker 1: kind of step up because they challenged Norfolk Southern and 758 00:52:44,880 --> 00:52:47,520 Speaker 1: they said, hey, you're not if you don't clean this 759 00:52:47,640 --> 00:52:49,760 Speaker 1: up and you don't do the right things, we're gonna 760 00:52:49,800 --> 00:52:53,120 Speaker 1: go clean it up and we're gonna billy you for 761 00:52:53,480 --> 00:52:56,760 Speaker 1: all the expenses. And that appears to be what's happening 762 00:52:56,840 --> 00:53:01,360 Speaker 1: right now. There was an article in ABC News recently 763 00:53:01,680 --> 00:53:05,439 Speaker 1: titled Ohio train derailment. Federal intra agency teams go door 764 00:53:05,480 --> 00:53:13,000 Speaker 1: to door in East Palestine. So it does appear that FEMA, DHHS, 765 00:53:13,360 --> 00:53:17,440 Speaker 1: Environmental Protection Agency Centers for Disease Control of Prevention, they 766 00:53:17,480 --> 00:53:22,440 Speaker 1: are walking around, literally walking around East Palestine and talking 767 00:53:22,440 --> 00:53:27,200 Speaker 1: to people, testing air quality in homes, testing water sources 768 00:53:27,320 --> 00:53:32,520 Speaker 1: within homes. And they call it getting situational awareness, which 769 00:53:32,600 --> 00:53:35,440 Speaker 1: is theoretically really good, right because if they know what's 770 00:53:35,480 --> 00:53:39,319 Speaker 1: going on, all of these individual agencies they can at 771 00:53:39,400 --> 00:53:42,680 Speaker 1: least begin to do something about it if you've got 772 00:53:42,719 --> 00:53:46,120 Speaker 1: a sector or cluster of homes that are particularly contaminated 773 00:53:46,200 --> 00:53:50,400 Speaker 1: or something. And at least according to ABC News, these 774 00:53:50,520 --> 00:53:54,080 Speaker 1: groups are helping people to both get assistance from their 775 00:53:54,120 --> 00:53:58,600 Speaker 1: agencies as well as gets assistance from nonprofits that are 776 00:53:58,600 --> 00:54:01,400 Speaker 1: operating in the area right now. So at least I 777 00:54:01,480 --> 00:54:05,120 Speaker 1: just have to say, at least I'm feeling like something's 778 00:54:05,600 --> 00:54:08,280 Speaker 1: going right there. That feels like the right move, doesn't 779 00:54:08,280 --> 00:54:12,879 Speaker 1: it It does. The larger issue is that, like so 780 00:54:12,920 --> 00:54:18,600 Speaker 1: many other infrastructure disasters, this is going to disappear from 781 00:54:18,640 --> 00:54:21,759 Speaker 1: the news cycle. The world is ending for someone every day, 782 00:54:21,800 --> 00:54:25,240 Speaker 1: so there will be another iteration of that, probably within 783 00:54:26,320 --> 00:54:31,359 Speaker 1: a month at most, you know, And now we have 784 00:54:31,440 --> 00:54:33,840 Speaker 1: to look at I don't know, there's one thing I 785 00:54:33,880 --> 00:54:38,320 Speaker 1: wanted to spend time on here with your excellent appointment, Like, Okay, 786 00:54:38,840 --> 00:54:40,640 Speaker 1: I don't know if you guys saw it. I assume 787 00:54:41,040 --> 00:54:45,800 Speaker 1: I assume we all did. I was unaware of something 788 00:54:46,000 --> 00:54:51,160 Speaker 1: called ab scam, and we have to talk about regulatory capture. 789 00:54:51,440 --> 00:54:53,920 Speaker 1: That is the problem here. Even though the name is 790 00:54:54,040 --> 00:55:00,319 Speaker 1: very dry, this kind of stuff doesn't have to cur 791 00:55:01,040 --> 00:55:08,840 Speaker 1: near as frequently when an actual government agency is running 792 00:55:08,840 --> 00:55:11,040 Speaker 1: the stuff, when the watchmen are not in charge of 793 00:55:11,040 --> 00:55:16,120 Speaker 1: watching themselves. Abscam never heard about it until quite recently, 794 00:55:16,640 --> 00:55:22,280 Speaker 1: back before your favorite corporations launched a very effective burnet 795 00:55:22,400 --> 00:55:28,880 Speaker 1: style propaganda war and began infiltrating US government. The FBI 796 00:55:29,120 --> 00:55:33,800 Speaker 1: once held Congress accountable, Like, the FBI did a sting 797 00:55:34,000 --> 00:55:38,520 Speaker 1: on Congress and it's super messed up because they got people. 798 00:55:38,719 --> 00:55:41,759 Speaker 1: And unless you think that abscam is some sort of 799 00:55:42,400 --> 00:55:47,479 Speaker 1: you know, fad diet situation, you know snake oil, Yeah, 800 00:55:47,840 --> 00:55:52,800 Speaker 1: which would be great. Now it's actually shorthand for arab scam, 801 00:55:53,320 --> 00:55:56,440 Speaker 1: which is kind of funny because abscam and arab scams 802 00:55:56,440 --> 00:55:59,560 Speaker 1: really only saving one syllable, so understand, but maybe saying 803 00:55:59,600 --> 00:56:03,040 Speaker 1: arabs gam is problematic. I don't know. Anyway, Back in 804 00:56:03,080 --> 00:56:06,760 Speaker 1: the nineteen seventies and eighties, some of the og suits 805 00:56:07,960 --> 00:56:12,680 Speaker 1: over at the FBI, the MIBs, they did a sting 806 00:56:12,840 --> 00:56:15,279 Speaker 1: on some of America's most powerful allmakers, like you said, Ben, 807 00:56:15,360 --> 00:56:18,040 Speaker 1: and it worked thusly. Under a series of proxies, the 808 00:56:18,080 --> 00:56:22,680 Speaker 1: FBI contacted members of Congress, House, and Senate to arrange 809 00:56:22,680 --> 00:56:28,840 Speaker 1: support for private immigration deals. That sounds sketchy, and this 810 00:56:29,040 --> 00:56:34,359 Speaker 1: essentially allowed foreign actors associated with something called Abdul Enterprises, 811 00:56:34,440 --> 00:56:38,480 Speaker 1: which was made up. Yeah, I mean it sort of sounds. 812 00:56:38,520 --> 00:56:41,440 Speaker 1: It doesn't sound like vague. Abdul is just sort of 813 00:56:41,480 --> 00:56:45,600 Speaker 1: like a stereotypical Middle Eastern name. It sounds in the 814 00:56:45,640 --> 00:56:47,680 Speaker 1: way this is being used. I mean, it just seems 815 00:56:47,680 --> 00:56:49,200 Speaker 1: to me to be a little bit of a wink wink, 816 00:56:49,280 --> 00:56:55,279 Speaker 1: nudge nudge. Semi's xenophobic kind of name. The FBI is racist. Yeah, 817 00:56:55,280 --> 00:57:00,920 Speaker 1: so Abdual Enterprises. This would give the ability to invest 818 00:57:02,040 --> 00:57:09,719 Speaker 1: to certain foreign actors, but the project actually emphasized investing 819 00:57:09,760 --> 00:57:15,640 Speaker 1: in casinos. Yeah, yeah, let's move money because casinos are 820 00:57:15,640 --> 00:57:18,320 Speaker 1: a great way to move off the buck's money. You know, 821 00:57:18,920 --> 00:57:22,960 Speaker 1: that's where breaking Bad messed up. They opened a laundromat 822 00:57:23,000 --> 00:57:25,360 Speaker 1: they should have or they opened a car wash, should 823 00:57:25,360 --> 00:57:27,160 Speaker 1: have gone with laser tag. I was always on board 824 00:57:27,160 --> 00:57:29,320 Speaker 1: with laser tag. Laser tag so great, But why is 825 00:57:29,360 --> 00:57:32,640 Speaker 1: it so expensive? I mean, one day we'll know if 826 00:57:32,680 --> 00:57:35,080 Speaker 1: our show has ever been successful because we'll be able 827 00:57:35,120 --> 00:57:40,720 Speaker 1: to go to a laser tag. Oh wow, I just realized, Ben, 828 00:57:40,800 --> 00:57:43,880 Speaker 1: this is all in the FBI website. Yeah, but it's 829 00:57:44,000 --> 00:57:47,160 Speaker 1: it's I guess. On their own website, it is more 830 00:57:47,200 --> 00:57:49,760 Speaker 1: described as, hey, this is a sting to try and 831 00:57:49,760 --> 00:57:54,480 Speaker 1: prevent organized crime and corruption within the halls of Congress, right, 832 00:57:54,680 --> 00:57:59,840 Speaker 1: but their emphasis was on foreign actors. The idea was, 833 00:58:00,200 --> 00:58:04,640 Speaker 1: if you are a crooked member of the legislature, will 834 00:58:04,720 --> 00:58:10,480 Speaker 1: you take money from a foreign power to turn a 835 00:58:10,560 --> 00:58:16,480 Speaker 1: blind eye to some sketchy stuff like criminal laundry and money. 836 00:58:16,640 --> 00:58:21,080 Speaker 1: What they found was in exchange for as little as 837 00:58:21,320 --> 00:58:24,840 Speaker 1: fifty thousand dollars US back in the seventies, so it 838 00:58:24,880 --> 00:58:29,760 Speaker 1: was way more money than it's a lot, a ton 839 00:58:29,800 --> 00:58:33,680 Speaker 1: of a ton of your representatives. If you live in 840 00:58:33,680 --> 00:58:36,560 Speaker 1: the United States, a ton of them will play ball. 841 00:58:37,160 --> 00:58:42,320 Speaker 1: Thirty were investigated. Overall, most of them either proved innocent 842 00:58:42,600 --> 00:58:47,320 Speaker 1: or incompetent. We can say and look, I think I 843 00:58:47,360 --> 00:58:51,320 Speaker 1: think some of them obviously were able to leverage their 844 00:58:51,360 --> 00:58:57,840 Speaker 1: existing political influence to escape charges. Seven new peeping Yeah, 845 00:58:57,880 --> 00:59:00,520 Speaker 1: seven people got caught out. They were fish out of 846 00:59:00,520 --> 00:59:04,000 Speaker 1: water in this Marco polo game. Six of them were 847 00:59:04,040 --> 00:59:06,680 Speaker 1: members of the House reps. One of them was an 848 00:59:06,720 --> 00:59:11,680 Speaker 1: actual senator. Why is this important? Why is abscam important? 849 00:59:12,920 --> 00:59:19,400 Speaker 1: Because it shows the FBI sting like the FBI got 850 00:59:19,440 --> 00:59:23,920 Speaker 1: their knuckles wrapped for dairy the question their political betters, 851 00:59:24,400 --> 00:59:29,920 Speaker 1: and no one bothered with another operation of this sort 852 00:59:30,400 --> 00:59:32,960 Speaker 1: at this level. Isn't that interesting too, because we think 853 00:59:33,000 --> 00:59:35,280 Speaker 1: of the FBI as just being able to kind of 854 00:59:35,720 --> 00:59:38,960 Speaker 1: weave in and out of the circles of power. For 855 00:59:39,000 --> 00:59:41,920 Speaker 1: them to get reprimanded, you know, they had to have 856 00:59:41,920 --> 00:59:45,920 Speaker 1: been done by somebody real high up. Well, abscam is 857 00:59:45,960 --> 00:59:49,600 Speaker 1: a story that maybe it's own episode if we haven't 858 00:59:49,640 --> 00:59:52,000 Speaker 1: spoiled it yet. But I mean, think about things like 859 00:59:52,080 --> 00:59:55,600 Speaker 1: the CIA. No, you did a great show called Operation 860 00:59:55,680 --> 01:00:00,440 Speaker 1: Midnight Climax that looks into how government agencies can function 861 01:00:00,560 --> 01:00:05,200 Speaker 1: without oversight and at what point does oversight become corporate 862 01:00:05,280 --> 01:00:11,680 Speaker 1: influence unfortunately breft of solutions here to see, there are 863 01:00:11,680 --> 01:00:15,680 Speaker 1: a lot of problems. I mean, look, you can see 864 01:00:15,680 --> 01:00:19,959 Speaker 1: an insidious pattern occurring in the US and the modern day. 865 01:00:20,240 --> 01:00:23,600 Speaker 1: I mean, ask yourself why food that is green lit 866 01:00:23,800 --> 01:00:27,520 Speaker 1: in this country has ingredients that are banned in every 867 01:00:27,520 --> 01:00:30,840 Speaker 1: other developed country. And Matt, this is a question you 868 01:00:30,960 --> 01:00:33,240 Speaker 1: brought up when we're hanging out with our pals on 869 01:00:33,440 --> 01:00:43,080 Speaker 1: my MoMA told me, right, what is it? Bromanaded vegetable oil? Right? Yeah? 870 01:00:43,120 --> 01:00:48,000 Speaker 1: And look, East Palestine is by no means the first 871 01:00:48,040 --> 01:00:51,800 Speaker 1: example of this. What's happening there is terrible and people 872 01:00:51,800 --> 01:00:56,439 Speaker 1: don't fully understand the consequences, right, And what we wanted 873 01:00:56,440 --> 01:00:59,320 Speaker 1: to show is this is an example of a larger phenomenon, 874 01:00:59,720 --> 01:01:04,720 Speaker 1: one that has happened, is happening, and in all likelihood 875 01:01:05,640 --> 01:01:09,040 Speaker 1: these are the consequences of conspiracies that will continue in 876 01:01:09,080 --> 01:01:13,200 Speaker 1: the future. Is that too, soapoxy? No anything? No? Keep it. 877 01:01:13,280 --> 01:01:16,000 Speaker 1: I don't know. No. Because the Guardian said the US 878 01:01:16,120 --> 01:01:20,400 Speaker 1: is averaging one chemical accident every two days so far 879 01:01:20,600 --> 01:01:24,880 Speaker 1: in twenty twenty three, one chemical accident every two one 880 01:01:24,920 --> 01:01:27,360 Speaker 1: and a half days is really what their calculation was. 881 01:01:27,960 --> 01:01:30,440 Speaker 1: And some of them are tiny, some of them are 882 01:01:30,440 --> 01:01:32,080 Speaker 1: probably not going to be that big of a deal, 883 01:01:32,120 --> 01:01:36,040 Speaker 1: maybe three hundred people affected, but some of them are 884 01:01:36,080 --> 01:01:39,600 Speaker 1: like this one. But also that's a big deal. It's 885 01:01:39,600 --> 01:01:42,280 Speaker 1: a huge, a big deal. It's all a huge deal. 886 01:01:42,480 --> 01:01:46,040 Speaker 1: And the scary thing is that, Hey, remember the Earth 887 01:01:46,120 --> 01:01:49,680 Speaker 1: is an interconnected series of systems. So when there's one 888 01:01:49,760 --> 01:01:52,440 Speaker 1: chemical spill over here, no matter how big or small, 889 01:01:52,520 --> 01:01:55,360 Speaker 1: and those chemicals get into the water, hey guess what 890 01:01:55,600 --> 01:01:59,560 Speaker 1: that system now gets just a little bit more as 891 01:01:59,560 --> 01:02:03,320 Speaker 1: a whole. And uh, you know, it's just it's really 892 01:02:03,360 --> 01:02:05,600 Speaker 1: freaking me out, guys, I don't like it. Well, and 893 01:02:05,880 --> 01:02:08,800 Speaker 1: you know, and if we're if this is what it 894 01:02:08,840 --> 01:02:11,480 Speaker 1: takes for us to hear about it and for reporting 895 01:02:11,520 --> 01:02:15,400 Speaker 1: to really kind of call these companies to task to 896 01:02:15,520 --> 01:02:18,360 Speaker 1: a degree, what about the ones that we don't hear about? 897 01:02:18,680 --> 01:02:21,120 Speaker 1: And how many of those does it take for them 898 01:02:21,160 --> 01:02:24,640 Speaker 1: to actually do something about that aged infrastructure and those 899 01:02:25,080 --> 01:02:29,040 Speaker 1: crappy breaks, you know, because like you've you said, Ben, 900 01:02:29,080 --> 01:02:33,120 Speaker 1: I mean, it's a calculation to cost benefit analysis, which 901 01:02:33,160 --> 01:02:35,760 Speaker 1: as as as terrifying as that sounds, that it cost 902 01:02:35,760 --> 01:02:40,680 Speaker 1: benefit analysis involves potential harm to humans and their health 903 01:02:40,760 --> 01:02:46,720 Speaker 1: and potentially their lives and livelihood and just in the environment. 904 01:02:47,720 --> 01:02:50,280 Speaker 1: You know what other kind of callous things are happening 905 01:02:50,280 --> 01:02:52,760 Speaker 1: behind the scenes, What other kind of calculations are we 906 01:02:52,800 --> 01:02:55,640 Speaker 1: not aware of? You know, when the cost of a 907 01:02:55,720 --> 01:02:59,240 Speaker 1: parking ticket is less than the cost of paying to 908 01:02:59,400 --> 01:03:02,040 Speaker 1: park it apart parking deck, then you're just like an 909 01:03:02,120 --> 01:03:05,000 Speaker 1: a cost of business. You know, like when the when 910 01:03:05,000 --> 01:03:11,360 Speaker 1: the fine for egregious violation is still saving you money 911 01:03:11,400 --> 01:03:16,040 Speaker 1: and you're still profiting. A lot of people will say 912 01:03:16,160 --> 01:03:18,320 Speaker 1: that's just the way to go. You know. That was 913 01:03:18,400 --> 01:03:23,280 Speaker 1: the choice Norfolk Southern faced. Either spend a bunch of time, 914 01:03:23,760 --> 01:03:29,840 Speaker 1: get these these rail cars that are still intact, safely evacuated, 915 01:03:29,880 --> 01:03:31,760 Speaker 1: to take all those substances out of them, put them 916 01:03:31,760 --> 01:03:35,040 Speaker 1: on other train cars and send them away or onto 917 01:03:35,200 --> 01:03:37,640 Speaker 1: trucks or whatever they were going to load it onto. 918 01:03:38,080 --> 01:03:40,640 Speaker 1: Spend all that time and all that money doing that 919 01:03:40,720 --> 01:03:42,920 Speaker 1: so you could get them out safely, or set the 920 01:03:42,920 --> 01:03:46,120 Speaker 1: whole damn thing on fire. That was their choice. Guess 921 01:03:46,120 --> 01:03:50,080 Speaker 1: which one was cheaper? Fire? Oh it's fire, Oh okay. 922 01:03:50,560 --> 01:03:53,960 Speaker 1: I was hoping for a Shamalan moment at the end here. 923 01:03:54,240 --> 01:03:57,000 Speaker 1: But uh but yeah, that's that's where we're at. And 924 01:03:57,640 --> 01:04:01,480 Speaker 1: you know, honestly, folks, this is why this is the 925 01:04:01,560 --> 01:04:04,480 Speaker 1: kind of stuff that is important to us. And it 926 01:04:04,680 --> 01:04:10,120 Speaker 1: is statistically certain that someone listening today or in the 927 01:04:10,120 --> 01:04:14,200 Speaker 1: future has encountered an event in their neck of the 928 01:04:14,240 --> 01:04:19,600 Speaker 1: woods that hasn't been examined, asn't publicized. We don't know 929 01:04:19,960 --> 01:04:23,680 Speaker 1: how things work out when the very powerful make a 930 01:04:23,800 --> 01:04:29,320 Speaker 1: cost benefit analysis with the less powerful on the other 931 01:04:29,360 --> 01:04:32,040 Speaker 1: side of the equal sign, you know. And that's where 932 01:04:32,080 --> 01:04:34,880 Speaker 1: we want your help. So we passed the torch to you. 933 01:04:35,440 --> 01:04:40,360 Speaker 1: Let us know what other things you have seen in 934 01:04:40,360 --> 01:04:44,080 Speaker 1: this vein. We try to be easy to find online. 935 01:04:44,160 --> 01:04:46,960 Speaker 1: That's right. You can find this on the social media's 936 01:04:47,960 --> 01:04:52,440 Speaker 1: of your choosing. We are conspiracy stuff on Twitter, YouTube, 937 01:04:52,520 --> 01:04:55,439 Speaker 1: and Facebook where we have our Facebook group. Here's where 938 01:04:55,480 --> 01:04:59,880 Speaker 1: it gets crazy. Conspiracy stuff on Instagram and tickety talk. 939 01:05:00,560 --> 01:05:02,840 Speaker 1: If you like to use your phone, call one eight 940 01:05:03,080 --> 01:05:07,680 Speaker 1: three three std wy t K, leave us a message. 941 01:05:07,800 --> 01:05:10,200 Speaker 1: You've got three minutes, give us a cool name, nickname, 942 01:05:10,240 --> 01:05:11,920 Speaker 1: whatever you want it to be. That's great. Just let 943 01:05:11,960 --> 01:05:13,640 Speaker 1: us know if we can use your message and your 944 01:05:13,680 --> 01:05:16,800 Speaker 1: voice on one of our listener mail episodes. If you 945 01:05:16,800 --> 01:05:18,280 Speaker 1: don't want to do any of those things, why not 946 01:05:18,360 --> 01:05:20,720 Speaker 1: instead send us a good old fashioned email. We are 947 01:05:21,040 --> 01:05:43,440 Speaker 1: conspiracy at iHeartRadio dot com. Stuff they don't want you 948 01:05:43,480 --> 01:05:46,880 Speaker 1: to know is a production of iHeartRadio. For more podcasts 949 01:05:46,920 --> 01:05:50,160 Speaker 1: from my heart Radio, visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, 950 01:05:50,240 --> 01:05:52,120 Speaker 1: or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.