Speaker 1: On this episode of Sports Illustrated Weekly, with the last
Speaker 1: of the World Cup qualifiers finally upon us, we take
Speaker 1: a look at the US men's team draw in the
Speaker 1: overall field, and later we introduce you to the young
Speaker 1: Spanish star who hopes to step into Rafael Nadal's well
Speaker 1: worn tennis shoots. But first, Texas A and M's Jimbo
Speaker 1: Fisher and Alabama's Nick Saban recently got into a very messy,
Speaker 1: very public argument about recruiting practices. As I senior writer
Speaker 1: Pat Forty joins us to discuss their feud and how
Speaker 1: n I L rules have changed college sports forever. It's Wednesday,
Speaker 1: June one. I'm your host, John Gonzalez from Sports Illustrated
Speaker 1: and I Heart Radio. This is Sports Illustrated Weekly. The
Speaker 1: date is October eight. Texas A and M at Alabama
Speaker 1: circle it in red, He'll circle it in blood. This
Speaker 1: is immediately escalated into the most bitter rivalry of two,
Speaker 1: if not ever. On an otherwise unremarkable Wednesday in May,
Speaker 1: Alabama's head coach Nick Saban attended a public event in
Speaker 1: Birmingham that had nothing to do with college football, But
Speaker 1: then at one point the conversation turned to name, image
Speaker 1: and likeness rights or n I L and boy did
Speaker 1: that change the tone of the event out of nowhere?
Speaker 1: Nick Saban took a big swipe at Texas A and
Speaker 1: M and his one time assistant jimbo Fisher. I mean,
Speaker 1: we were second in recruiting last year and M was first.
Speaker 1: N M bought every player on their team, made a
Speaker 1: deal for a name, image and likeness. All right, we
Speaker 1: didn't buy one player. When Nick Saban says something this incendiary,
Speaker 1: it turns everyone's heads in college football, including SI senior
Speaker 1: writer Pat Forty and Jim bowl Fisher. Then the next
Speaker 1: day didn't just retaliate, he went scorched earth as he did.
Speaker 1: I don't mind confrontation, lived with him a whole life,
Speaker 1: kind of like it myself back and away from it.
Speaker 1: When way I was raised, he went to the point
Speaker 1: where it sounded like he was on the therapist couch
Speaker 1: unloading every resentment and grievance he ever had against Nick Saban,
Speaker 1: some of it quite personal. It's despicable. Did a repartable
Speaker 1: head coach could come out and say this, Well, he
Speaker 1: doesn't get his way or things don't go his way.
Speaker 1: The narcissist and he doesn't allow those things to happen.
Speaker 1: Here's part of what Pat wrote in ne s I.
Speaker 1: He did everything but mobilized the A and M Corp
Speaker 1: of Cadets to march on tuscan Loosa. I've been covering
Speaker 1: college football for thirty two years, and I've never seen
Speaker 1: anything like this. The comments, especially those from Fisher, were
Speaker 1: the stuff of a w W E script. Some people
Speaker 1: think their God. Go dig into how God did his
Speaker 1: his deal. You may find out about about a guy
Speaker 1: that a lot of things you don't want to know.
Speaker 1: We built him up to be the Tsar of football.
Speaker 1: Go dig into his past or anybody's ever coached with him.
Speaker 1: You can find out anything you want to find out
Speaker 1: what he does and how he does it. College coaches
Speaker 1: tend to talk a lot off the record about who's
Speaker 1: breaking rules were in vague generalities on the record. Here
Speaker 1: were two national championship coaches very publicly going there on
Speaker 1: each other. When people show you who they are, believe him.
Speaker 1: He's showing you who he is. They've violated the mutually
Speaker 1: as your destruction credo that has long existed in the
Speaker 1: sport where everyone is likely cheating. Coaches could all take
Speaker 1: down each other, which helped enforce a collective silence because
Speaker 1: the retaliatory strikes could be devastating to whoever launches first. Well,
Speaker 1: forget that utterly. The nuclear option has been deployed. You
Speaker 1: can't call me anything you want to call me. You
Speaker 1: ain't call me cheat. I don't cheat and I don't lie.
Speaker 1: I learned that when I was a kid. If you did,
Speaker 1: the old man slapped us out of the head, maybe
Speaker 1: somebody should have slapped him hot my lord, that is
Speaker 1: a lot. It is. Jimbo did what coaches often do,
Speaker 1: is they stopped short of anything specific. Okay, Now, Jimbo
Speaker 1: worked for Nick Saban for four years at l s U.
Speaker 1: They won a national championship together in two thousand three,
Speaker 1: but he didn't quite fully go there because if he
Speaker 1: was on the staff and knew what happened, well, Jimbo,
Speaker 1: what happened. Why don't you tell us. Let's hear how
Speaker 1: God did his deal. Let's hear what happened. And so
Speaker 1: even then and there, as as pointed as that was,
Speaker 1: it was not specific enough to necessarily turn this into
Speaker 1: anything other than wow, that was nasty. Jimbo coached for
Speaker 1: and with Nick Saban. It would seem to me that
Speaker 1: they've got this previous relationship. Obviously now that is quite strained.
Speaker 1: But what was it like before? I mean, were they friendly,
Speaker 1: were they on good terms? Did this thing nuke that
Speaker 1: relationship completely? The relationship is knew completely now, there's no
Speaker 1: doubt about that. Jimbo himself Ian said, quote, we're done.
Speaker 1: Have you had any contact with Nick since you just
Speaker 1: didn't take the call? Not going to We're done? And
Speaker 1: he shows you who he is. And then I just
Speaker 1: wanted to as the greatest ever huh. And then I
Speaker 1: just wanted You've got all the advantages. It's easy. They
Speaker 1: at least had never publicly led on that there was
Speaker 1: any falling out or any you know, bad blood between them.
Speaker 1: You can talk to some people who were involved in
Speaker 1: like on that staff at that time, or or familiar
Speaker 1: with the Saban Fisher Dynamics and said, yeah, Jimbo always
Speaker 1: kind of bristled at the Saban, you know, defense Remontra.
Speaker 1: It didn't feel like he got much credit or much
Speaker 1: of a lease to call creative plays when he was
Speaker 1: under SABAN. So I think there was a little bit
Speaker 1: of that, but we didn't really know about until all
Speaker 1: of this spilled fourth. So Nick Saban goes after Jimbo Fisher.
Speaker 1: But it wasn't specifically and solely about Jimbo Fisher. He
Speaker 1: was trying to make a broader point about n I
Speaker 1: L Name, image, and likeness, writes, this whole thing has
Speaker 1: gotten incredibly messy. They have, I mean, everything's been turned
Speaker 1: on its ear, and the grown ups aren't handling it
Speaker 1: terribly well. What's basically transpired is athletes can be compensated
Speaker 1: for name, image and lightness. That started on July one.
Speaker 1: The premise was that if you are a star player
Speaker 1: at Alabama, the local pizza place can pay you put
Speaker 1: your name on a billboard or do an advertisement for
Speaker 1: them or whatever. But that is quickly morphed into collectives
Speaker 1: now that all these schools have put together, where you're
Speaker 1: basically just compiling a war chest of money. The collective
Speaker 1: is an outside marketing agency that's funded by alumni, and
Speaker 1: they give this collective millions of dollars, and that marketing
Speaker 1: agency then funnels it to the players, and the coach
Speaker 1: actually knows how much money is in the collective, so
Speaker 1: he knows how much he can promise every player. Texas
Speaker 1: A and M no matter what jimbo Fisher says. It
Speaker 1: is widely believed that they signed the number one recruiting
Speaker 1: class largely because they had a humongous war chest of
Speaker 1: collective money. They have collective I know that's a collective here.
Speaker 1: I don't know who's got what, Winns got what, had
Speaker 1: no idea last year. I just say that's by design.
Speaker 1: You're saying, hey, I'm staying out of this. Yeah, I mean,
Speaker 1: am I gonna? I mean, I have no sponsorships and
Speaker 1: those things. That's the crux of it is the flat
Speaker 1: out pay for play inducements, and that's what the NZ
Speaker 1: is trying to get their arms around. Nick Sitans trying
Speaker 1: to get their arms around. Everybody's trying to figure out.
Speaker 1: I'm not sure it's necessarily a bad thing, but it's
Speaker 1: a very different thing, and it's different than what the
Speaker 1: n C double A originally intended. It seems like the
Speaker 1: n C double A tried to solve for a problem
Speaker 1: that everybody agreed was a problem, and then they came
Speaker 1: up with this quote unquote solution and it's just really
Speaker 1: gotten away from them. Yeah, and that's why that's the
Speaker 1: story of n C double A legislation. It really is
Speaker 1: like the the list of changes that they've tried to
Speaker 1: make that ended up with unintended consequences is almost endless.
Speaker 1: It's one of the reasons you n C Double A
Speaker 1: Rules Manual is as thick as a bible, because they
Speaker 1: come up with a rule like, oh jeez, everybody, figure
Speaker 1: out a way around the rule. Now we can need
Speaker 1: another rule. You know. The n C Double A was
Speaker 1: so reactive instead of proactive to compensating players to begin with.
Speaker 1: They fought it and fought it and fought it. They
Speaker 1: got behind, they lost the public relations battle, they gave in,
Speaker 1: and they really didn't structure the new rules very well
Speaker 1: at all. And so this is part of the consequence
Speaker 1: of it is they just kind of threw their hands
Speaker 1: in there and said, well, okay, have n I L.
Speaker 1: Maybe Congress will figure it out for us. Congress hadn't
Speaker 1: done anything, and so what stepped into the vacuum the
Speaker 1: boosters and the programs like, okay, hey, we've got rules
Speaker 1: on the books where players can get stuff. We're just
Speaker 1: going do you think this is sustainable the system? I mean,
Speaker 1: because now this is what we have, right, we have
Speaker 1: that n I L and the n C Double a
Speaker 1: kind of just threw up its hands and said, well,
Speaker 1: maybe Congress will fix this for us. Good luck with that.
Speaker 1: Congress has a lot going on. So what are we
Speaker 1: looking at in terms of college sports as we move
Speaker 1: forward with the system. That's a good question. Is it sustainable?
Speaker 1: Our colleague, Ross Doling, you had a very good story
Speaker 1: on Wednesday talking to Lane Kiffin in the Mississippi coach
Speaker 1: who said, yeah, it's sustainable. People said that the coaching
Speaker 1: contracts weren't sustainable, and they have been. The money is there.
Speaker 1: You no longer have to spend that money gold plating
Speaker 1: your facilities as much. You don't have to sell a
Speaker 1: waterfall in the football facility and a miniature golf course
Speaker 1: and a barber job if you can pay the players directly.
Speaker 1: So I think it is sustainable. You know, it may
Speaker 1: not look exactly like this, There may be a settling
Speaker 1: of the dust, but I think that this model is
Speaker 1: here to stay. In one for more Fashion, we had
Speaker 1: you on a previous episode to discuss a guy named
Speaker 1: Merle Code, who you also wrote about for us I
Speaker 1: dot com. He was a former executive for Nike and
Speaker 1: Adidas and his job was basically two funnel money from
Speaker 1: those shoe companies to college kids who were athletes to
Speaker 1: sort of circumvent the rules that you couldn't pay college athletes.
Speaker 1: He went to prison for basically funneling money from shoe
Speaker 1: companies to college athletes. And you and I had discussed
Speaker 1: how basically he thought all programs were dirty in a way,
Speaker 1: and this was happening, and so what was the big deal.
Speaker 1: He's behind bars because of that, And now the n
Speaker 1: I L Is bringing all of that stuff out of
Speaker 1: the shadows and putting it in front of us. What
Speaker 1: do you think he thinks about all this? Well, that's
Speaker 1: a great question. I'm EARL has to be sitting there
Speaker 1: saying why couldn't name image of light and lightness have
Speaker 1: been on the books four or five years ago when
Speaker 1: I was getting busted for this. So, you know, it's
Speaker 1: wild how things have turned. It really is in terms
Speaker 1: of things that used to be big scandals. You know,
Speaker 1: player gets hundred thousand dollars to go to school X.
Speaker 1: You know, here comes the postseason ban and player in
Speaker 1: eligibility and stuff, and now it's like, yeah, people are
Speaker 1: talking about it openly. Yeah, you have agents putting deals
Speaker 1: on Twitter. This is what my client is getting to
Speaker 1: go to this school. So yeah, the moral codes of
Speaker 1: the world. They lived a little too early in this space.
Speaker 1: If they were there now, things will be a lot
Speaker 1: more equitable. I would say. It reminds me sort of
Speaker 1: of at one moment marijuana is criminalized and the next
Speaker 1: moment you go to the store and it looks like
Speaker 1: it's an apple boutique store and the people who were
Speaker 1: behind bars are out of luck. A and m is
Speaker 1: at Alabama on October eighth, Pat, how's that going to go?
Speaker 1: Oh boy, that's big and it's interesting. CBS which has
Speaker 1: the sec contract, the main contract and the right of
Speaker 1: first refusal on their three thirty window games, and they
Speaker 1: get one game a year that they can exercise the
Speaker 1: option for a prime time window. It's usually been L
Speaker 1: s U and Alabama. Guess what date they chose the
Speaker 1: eight pm time slot October eight. We think we know
Speaker 1: what game they're putting on. Then that will be absolute
Speaker 1: must see TV, must see TV, can't wait for it?
Speaker 1: Read him on SI dot com. He does not have
Speaker 1: any blood feuds because nobody would dare mess with him.
Speaker 1: Pat forty, thank you for this my pleasure. Pat forty
Speaker 1: wrote the article, Nick Saban, Jimbo Fisher and an all
Speaker 1: out sec war Well link to it in our show notes.
Speaker 1: After a break, a long look at the World Cup field.
Speaker 1: With the final qualifiers being played out over the next
Speaker 1: few days, the World Cup field is nearly set. Luis
Speaker 1: Miguel at You Away from CBS Sports and the Keglazzo Podcast,
Speaker 1: joins us to preview the group stages, the US men's
Speaker 1: national team draw, and the various controversies surrounding the host nation.
Speaker 1: Quitar Luise, Welcome to Sports Illustrated Weekly. Thank you, my friend.
Speaker 1: I'm glad to be back in my alma mater. I
Speaker 1: feel so connected to you already. John, I'm happy to
Speaker 1: be here. Yeah, you're old, stomping grounds, you know the
Speaker 1: lay of the land. This is great. We had to
Speaker 1: get a soccer expert on. We immediately went to you,
Speaker 1: and I think for a lot of US soccer fans
Speaker 1: there was a little worry, a little concern about whether
Speaker 1: the men's team would qualify. They pulled it off, and
Speaker 1: like when the draw happened, that's a big thing. When
Speaker 1: the draw happens, you want to see what group you're in.
Speaker 1: I really like this group for the United States, and
Speaker 1: they're in Group eight with England, Iran and either Whales,
Speaker 1: Scotland or the Ukraine. This feels like on its surface
Speaker 1: that it's them and England that should advance. No, yeah,
Speaker 1: I mean, listen, I think the first thing to mention
Speaker 1: regarding this specific World Cup I say that there's no
Speaker 1: such thing as a group of death in any of them.
Speaker 1: They're all pretty well balanced. In fact, they're all a
Speaker 1: little bit like groups of involuntary manslaughter. Each one can accidentally,
Speaker 1: you know, ruin somebody's day. And to your point, I
Speaker 1: think when the U s mm T looks at their group,
Speaker 1: and by the way, your listeners should know that I
Speaker 1: have no dog in this fight. Okay, Peruvian grew up
Speaker 1: in England, like you know, my wife's American. That's about
Speaker 1: I've been here for twenty years in New York. So
Speaker 1: I'm very neutral when it comes to the standpoint. And
Speaker 1: when I look at Group B with as you mentioned,
Speaker 1: England around and of course the euro play Off winner,
Speaker 1: it's a doable group. It's a doable group. I mean,
Speaker 1: England is clearly on paper the favorite, and I think
Speaker 1: American fans should know that. But there's no reason to
Speaker 1: not believe that you the U s MT can't get
Speaker 1: out of this and hopefully do something. And the one
Speaker 1: advantage that the U s m NT has in this
Speaker 1: World cop john ahead of any other World Cup before
Speaker 1: this is the fact that now you have players that
Speaker 1: have legitimate European experience. Yes they're very young, but they
Speaker 1: know what it takes to play in the ultimate competition. Politics,
Speaker 1: won a Champions League, etcetera, etcetera, etcetera. So yeah, it's
Speaker 1: a doable group. It's a good one. So about the
Speaker 1: U s m m T, what do you make of
Speaker 1: their construction so far? I mean, I believe at the
Speaker 1: time of the draw they were ranked fifteenth in the world. Correct,
Speaker 1: So it feels like they're starting to get it together.
Speaker 1: Forever it felt like American soccer was sort of disjointed,
Speaker 1: that it didn't always have a planet, didn't have those players,
Speaker 1: as you mentioned, that had that European experience. What do
Speaker 1: you make of this group? I think if I'm an
Speaker 1: American fan of a fan of the U s m
Speaker 1: n T, I should be very excited. With a hint
Speaker 1: of cautious optimism, I think always yeah exactly, which is
Speaker 1: actually difficult to do when you are trying to talk
Speaker 1: to American fans of any sport. To be honest, sometimes
Speaker 1: the optimism lets you get carried away it. Here's the thing.
Speaker 1: The number one objective of Greg Burr Holter and this
Speaker 1: U S M m T side was to qualify to
Speaker 1: the World Cup, something they didn't do for various reasons,
Speaker 1: one of them being overlooking the opponent and thinking that
Speaker 1: they were maybe too big for the shoes to fill
Speaker 1: in Conker Calf. Now they qualified to the World Cup.
Speaker 1: Having said that they qualified to the World Cup, not
Speaker 1: as the top contender in concert that was Canada same
Speaker 1: points that Mexico achieved. The U S MNT reached third.
Speaker 1: So there's something to be said about that. This is
Speaker 1: still a work in progress. So I think it's an
Speaker 1: advantage actually that the World Cup for the U S
Speaker 1: m m T s in November, because now you have
Speaker 1: a little bit more of a window to experiment, to experience,
Speaker 1: play some key competitive friendlies that can help you develop.
Speaker 1: And now the next part of that, John is to
Speaker 1: understand that this squad is young, probably the youngest that's
Speaker 1: entering the World Cup out of any nation, super super young,
Speaker 1: but very experienced and very willing What I want to
Speaker 1: see from between if I'm a U S M and
Speaker 1: T fan, be between now and November is what teams
Speaker 1: am I playing in my warmups and my friendlies. They
Speaker 1: have to be somewhere outside of conker Caff because all
Speaker 1: we've seen for the majority of the time is conker
Speaker 1: Cuff centric teams like your Mexico as your Canada's, even Jamaica, etcetera.
Speaker 1: I want to see you play against europe European nations.
Speaker 1: I want you to play against African nations. I want
Speaker 1: to see what you can do there, and hopefully by
Speaker 1: that time, by the time the World Cup comes, then
Speaker 1: the U S M. T has a better picture of
Speaker 1: what they can do. They're young, they're hungry, but boy
Speaker 1: or boy, they are very very relentless or it's gonna
Speaker 1: be exciting to see what they can do. Young and
Speaker 1: hungry and exciting. I'll take I'll take them just being
Speaker 1: in the World Cup because as you mentioned, they didn't
Speaker 1: make it. I want to go back toeen though, because
Speaker 1: you as you mentioned, the favorites are England and that group.
Speaker 1: I was in London, I was in a pub. I
Speaker 1: watched them beat Sweden. It was all lined up everybody's going, oh,
Speaker 1: what if it's France and England in the finals, won't
Speaker 1: just be amazing? And then they lose to Croatia and
Speaker 1: it was devastating, and I'm wondering what kind of ripple
Speaker 1: effect that kind of disappointment has. And then what you
Speaker 1: make of this group? Well, first of all, let me
Speaker 1: just tell you, as a Peruvian who grew up in
Speaker 1: England and now been living living in New York in
Speaker 1: America for twenty years, there is a lot of bravado
Speaker 1: from both sides. Okay. So when the American side thinks, oh, England,
Speaker 1: you think you're so full of it, England thinks exactly
Speaker 1: the same of you, okay, So that just needs to
Speaker 1: be the second thing that needs to be taken into
Speaker 1: consideration is that there is no better pessimists than the
Speaker 1: British media, so already, you know, leading up to it,
Speaker 1: despite looking at that about them, you know, Kate Winslet
Speaker 1: wins the Oscar, and I remember every single newspaper which
Speaker 1: just like did she have to go on and on
Speaker 1: on her speech? It's like one of your country people
Speaker 1: just want an Oscar? Like why are you so upset?
Speaker 1: So you know, there's that that's sort of like everlasting,
Speaker 1: lifelong pessimism that you know England, the facts are there.
Speaker 1: They haven't won the World Cups since nineteen sixty six,
Speaker 1: they haven't won a major trophy since nineteen sixty six.
Speaker 1: They went to the final in your twenty twenty last
Speaker 1: summ they lost to Italy. We know how that went.
Speaker 1: So England is very cautious about this. I will say though,
Speaker 1: and this is not just me with an opinion, it's
Speaker 1: collectively shared. This is probably the best England team since
Speaker 1: nineteen six six. They're so talented all the way from
Speaker 1: Harry Kane to the midfield which has declin rice even
Speaker 1: at the back when people have question marks over Harry
Speaker 1: McGuire John starts, it's still a very good side and
Speaker 1: they have positions everywhere. Everywhere. We're talking about legitimate players
Speaker 1: like Jared Burrown who plays for West hamp who probably
Speaker 1: maybe might not make it, and he should because he's
Speaker 1: so good. But England is very, very good. England's biggest
Speaker 1: opponent John at the World Cup is England themselves, England
Speaker 1: being their own biggest opponent twas ever, thus the other
Speaker 1: potential teams in that group, Wales, Scotland or Ukraine, anybody
Speaker 1: there that could be surprising. Yeah, it's a little conflicting
Speaker 1: and troubling, right because obviously we have to wait and
Speaker 1: see what happens with Ukraine. There are things life way
Speaker 1: bigger than sports, and it's what's happening to Ukraine. Of course,
Speaker 1: Whales they're good, but they have Gareth Bale, who is
Speaker 1: on his day one of the best players in the world.
Speaker 1: Even at his age. We already know what he did
Speaker 1: in the playoffs to get to here in the first place.
Speaker 1: Scotland I think are living in a really good moment
Speaker 1: right now. A lot of young talented players that are
Speaker 1: coming through. I'm an aston Villa fan, so my you
Speaker 1: know John McGinn, it's just a tremendous place. He's just
Speaker 1: one of many strong players. So any contender in that
Speaker 1: European sector is going to be a tough battle. They're
Speaker 1: they're all very good. I would if I were to
Speaker 1: guess right now, I would say that Wales will make
Speaker 1: it and that will be a very tough opponent because
Speaker 1: Gareth Bale on his day can win a game by
Speaker 1: his arm. As you mentioned, a lot going on that's
Speaker 1: more important than just sports. And with Ukraine and the
Speaker 1: invasion there, FIFA end up banning Russia from this World Cup,
Speaker 1: and at first they wanted to do something similar to
Speaker 1: what the IOC did with the Russian Olympic Committee, which
Speaker 1: was takeaway the flat, I can have them play under
Speaker 1: this different sort of framing, right, And then there was
Speaker 1: so much pressure that they changed that and decided to
Speaker 1: ban Russia. Resurprised by that, I wasn't surprised by any
Speaker 1: of it now, because I just think FIFA, first of all,
Speaker 1: we're just kind of feeling them. Let's not forget World
Speaker 1: Cup was in Russia. Let's not forget Gianni and Fantino's
Speaker 1: relationship with put It in the first place leading up
Speaker 1: from there. So I think that FIFA was just feeling
Speaker 1: the waters to see how the world was going to react.
Speaker 1: And at first, as you mentioned, they were meaning to
Speaker 1: do what the IOC was initially stating, right, which is
Speaker 1: done in the Olympics. That wasn't enough, and actually FIFA
Speaker 1: had to follow suit because it really was countries like
Speaker 1: Poland who said we're not playing Russia, like I'm sorry,
Speaker 1: whatever you think, it's not happening. And that was thanks
Speaker 1: to players as well. Robert Lewandowski, et cetera, saying we're
Speaker 1: not playing them. It's just not happening because this is
Speaker 1: a different thing. We're talking about war here, and that
Speaker 1: followed suit a ripple effect, and eventually FIFA said, yeah,
Speaker 1: well it's not happening indeed. So I'm not surprised by
Speaker 1: how it developed. I'm not surprised by Russia trying to
Speaker 1: go through the Court of Arbitration reports and saying I know,
Speaker 1: we we want to play, and obviously that was upheld.
Speaker 1: So nothing really surprises me when it comes to FIFA.
Speaker 1: And in fact, you know, I wouldn't call him heroes
Speaker 1: in any way, but that's just the way that it went.
Speaker 1: And and again it followed suit to what teams and
Speaker 1: nations did specifically with Poland by stating we're not playing
Speaker 1: you in that play off regardless, and that's what happened. Yeah,
Speaker 1: we talk a lot about the intersection of sports and
Speaker 1: politics on this podcast, and not surprisingly with this World
Speaker 1: Cup there's a lot going on. And it's not just
Speaker 1: with Russia invading Ukraine. The host country, Qatar has been
Speaker 1: accused of a lot of human rights and labor abuses,
Speaker 1: and they were they won't be able to hide from
Speaker 1: it either, Luis because they're they're in Group A with
Speaker 1: the Netherlands, and the Dutch manager called it ridiculous quote
Speaker 1: ridiculous for the World Cup to be in Quitar. What
Speaker 1: do you make about the World Cup being in Qatar?
Speaker 1: Obviously FIFA and the IOC have long been accused of corruption,
Speaker 1: but this is a controversial World Cup for a lot
Speaker 1: of reasons. We can't shy away from talking about everything
Speaker 1: that's wrong with selecting Guitar as a host nation in
Speaker 1: the same way that we can shy away from having
Speaker 1: to discuss the tournament. We have to do both. We
Speaker 1: have to and we have to begin, by the way,
Speaker 1: by how Qatar got this ticket to host it in
Speaker 1: the first place, which is already controversial, and then everything
Speaker 1: that followed suit after that you talk about the human
Speaker 1: rights abuse, I mean, it's just tremendously overwhelming to read
Speaker 1: just the amount of information that's coming out of there,
Speaker 1: and how immigrant workers have been treated and injuries and
Speaker 1: deaths and so on and so on. It's just awful.
Speaker 1: We have to talk about it, and at the same
Speaker 1: time we have to accept the fact that it's happening
Speaker 1: and it will happen. This World Cup is inevitable, and
Speaker 1: I think that we, as journalists and represent a gives
Speaker 1: of this game, have a responsibility to do both. Yeah,
Speaker 1: you're right, we can hold two thoughts on our head
Speaker 1: at the same time. This is the kind of conversation
Speaker 1: we had with Ben Rhodes about the Beijing Olympics, where
Speaker 1: it's like, yes, the host nation is accused of these
Speaker 1: various atrocities and this is awful and we should absolutely
Speaker 1: discuss it. At the same time, there is going to
Speaker 1: be this sporting event and we're going to discuss that too,
Speaker 1: So let's talk a little bit more about football. There's
Speaker 1: always a group of death, as you mentioned, who's your
Speaker 1: group of death? This time around? They're all tough, John,
Speaker 1: Like I said at the beginning, I hate to use
Speaker 1: this line, but I know I don't hate it. I
Speaker 1: made it. It's a great line. Don't out of it.
Speaker 1: They're all groups of involuntary manslaughter. Like all of them
Speaker 1: have a chance. Like here's the thing. The difference between
Speaker 1: the favorites, your Brazil's, your England's, your frances The difference
Speaker 1: between those favorites and sort of the second tier is
Speaker 1: very thin. Probably the thinnest has ever been. So when
Speaker 1: I look, for example, at a group like Group F Belgium, right,
Speaker 1: the Golden generation of Belgium, Kevin de Bruner, Tibo Cortoire
Speaker 1: La Luco, who haven't won anything yet, it's unbelievable. This
Speaker 1: is their last chance to win anything, Belgium. But then
Speaker 1: the Canada, the winner of conker Cat. They weren't the
Speaker 1: lowest tier. That's disrespectful to Canada. Canada are ridiculously good.
Speaker 1: And then you have Morocco who is no joke in Africa,
Speaker 1: and Croatia who were in the finals in you know.
Speaker 1: Then you go to another group like Group G Brazil
Speaker 1: my tip to win the whole thing, Serbia never a joke,
Speaker 1: Switzerland who did very well in your and Cameroon as well,
Speaker 1: full of loaded talent. It's you can do this with
Speaker 1: any group, John, That's my point. So, yes, there are favorites,
Speaker 1: but when you ask me about a group of death,
Speaker 1: I can't really give you just one. They're all ridiculous.
Speaker 1: I mean Group C at Argentina, who haven't lost the
Speaker 1: game in thirty one matches Mexico who you never know
Speaker 1: what they can do. Poland with Robert Levan that they're
Speaker 1: all just so good. So you know, from that perspective,
Speaker 1: they're all groups of involuntary manslaughter. Yeah, you've gotten me
Speaker 1: so excited. We still have so much time to wait
Speaker 1: for this, but your yours energized as anybody we've spoken
Speaker 1: with about anything on this program. So now all of
Speaker 1: a sudden, I can't wait for the World Cup on
Speaker 1: on five coffees and ready to talk about soccer. Sorry,
Speaker 1: I I love it. So you mentioned Brazil. They've won
Speaker 1: five World Cups. They're always in the conversation there your favorite.
Speaker 1: What makes this particular Brazil teams so good? Yeah, good question.
Speaker 1: I think let's let's talk about some statistics. First of all,
Speaker 1: you Brazil, obviously you know five World Cups, but they
Speaker 1: haven't wonted in a while, right, It's been a long time,
Speaker 1: and they don't do really that well aside from the fifties,
Speaker 1: you know, with pale et cetera. They don't do that
Speaker 1: well when the World Cup is hosted in Europe. So
Speaker 1: this isn't a World Cup in Europe. So that's already,
Speaker 1: like statistically speaking, historically speaking, something that favors him. Coach
Speaker 1: who's been there from t Sien has done a tremendous
Speaker 1: job with this project. We all know Brazilian talent name
Speaker 1: our junior of course, Roberto Fermino. You can go all
Speaker 1: the way at the back where they have you have
Speaker 1: like two goalkeepers who are in like the top fifteen
Speaker 1: in the world. They're all fighting for a spot. So
Speaker 1: now you have talent everywhere. One makes Brazil so interesting.
Speaker 1: And by the way, qualifying to the World Cup, they
Speaker 1: earned a record number of points in their qualifying campaign.
Speaker 1: They didn't lose a single game. They are the real
Speaker 1: deal and they have multiple players in every position that
Speaker 1: are available. Raffinia Vensius Jr. I talked about Nama, Roberto
Speaker 1: Fermino at the back. You of Casamino, one of the
Speaker 1: best midfielders in the world. At the back, you have
Speaker 1: so much talent like Marquinios, Thiago Silva. I mean, they're
Speaker 1: just loaded with talent, and I think they are looking
Speaker 1: at themselves thinking it's time for us to win this
Speaker 1: again and we're not in Europe and it's coach chech
Speaker 1: Is the last campaign. He leaves Brazil after this World Cup,
Speaker 1: so they're romantic. In me also thinks that there's Brazilian
Speaker 1: national teams thinking let's win one for coach. And when
Speaker 1: you look at their group, they'll win the group I
Speaker 1: think Serbia, Switzerland, Cameroon and then after that, you know,
Speaker 1: it's just a knockout competition. I see. And here's the
Speaker 1: other thing, and this is something that we can talk about. Argentina.
Speaker 1: They don't rely on name our junior, name our junior,
Speaker 1: maybe doesn't even start in a specific game. Like that's
Speaker 1: how good they are. They're very, very good. So I'm
Speaker 1: excited to see what they do. You know, you bring
Speaker 1: up Argentina, and that's something that I wanted to run
Speaker 1: past you because you're talking about the romantic and you.
Speaker 1: I love that about you. I feel the same way.
Speaker 1: Looks like the last run for Messi and Ronaldo five
Speaker 1: World Cups apiece. Neither of them have ever won a
Speaker 1: World Cup. Do you give Argentina or Portugal any shot? Well,
Speaker 1: let's make it easy at the beginning. Portugal, I don't think. So.
Speaker 1: They have a lot of talent, not just Christiana Ronaldo,
Speaker 1: you are Felix Bruno, Fernandez. Of course, I mean they're
Speaker 1: they're very talented group, but their biggest that kills hell.
Speaker 1: I feel, and I know it's a bit of an insult.
Speaker 1: Is there a manager themselves because he's he's a little
Speaker 1: too reactive, a little too conservative. Let's read remember how
Speaker 1: they got into this World Cup in the first place.
Speaker 1: They had to go through a playoff, beating North Macedonia, etcetera.
Speaker 1: So it wasn't convincing. They have to face Ghana. Ghana,
Speaker 1: no joke, John like, they're very good, Uruguay who beat
Speaker 1: them in the knockout stages in the last World Cup.
Speaker 1: And South Korea. I mean, if anybody saw what Song
Speaker 1: Hugh and men did, you should be very nervous of
Speaker 1: South Korea. So it's gonna be tough. You know. Getting
Speaker 1: out of the group is one thing. Winning it, I
Speaker 1: don't think so. In terms of Argentina, they have a
Speaker 1: much better chance and they are one of the favorites.
Speaker 1: I would say Brazil, England, France and Argentina is my
Speaker 1: fourth favorite to win this whole thing. The reason why
Speaker 1: I don't put them higher is because Lionel's Colonia, their manager,
Speaker 1: who's been in the setup for a very long time,
Speaker 1: has done amazing things with this team. Just like Brazil,
Speaker 1: they didn't lose the game in qualifiers. They haven't lost
Speaker 1: the game in thirty one matches. But just like the
Speaker 1: U S M and T argument, I want to see
Speaker 1: what they do against European competition as well, because they
Speaker 1: haven't played that many. Leonel Messi, by the way, they
Speaker 1: don't rely on him anymore. There's a thing in Spanish
Speaker 1: and Argentina called Messi that pendencia, where like they depend
Speaker 1: on Leonel Messi so much in games that doesn't happen.
Speaker 1: They don't need him. Obviously they need him, but they
Speaker 1: don't need to put all their eggs in his basket.
Speaker 1: They can do a lot. In fact, Martinez is probably
Speaker 1: their most dangerous weapon. They have a bigger chance. It's
Speaker 1: just that Leonel Scolone has never been in this situation
Speaker 1: being at the World Cup. They've won Copa America, but
Speaker 1: the World Cup is a different thing. So if you
Speaker 1: ask me Messio Ronaldo, who has a better chance of
Speaker 1: winning it, clearly it's Leonel Messi and Argentina clearly Messy.
Speaker 1: What a story that would be too, if he could
Speaker 1: ride off into the sunset finally winning a World Cup
Speaker 1: and just his excellence. I mean, as somebody who really
Speaker 1: enjoys the World Cup and international soccer getting treated to
Speaker 1: one final messy performance would be fantastic. A team that
Speaker 1: did not get to the World Cup, Luis and this
Speaker 1: is where I will finish up. Italy fails to qualify again,
Speaker 1: the second straight World Cup they've missed. Explained that everybody
Speaker 1: how shocking this is. It's very shocking. It's extremely shocking.
Speaker 1: It's but in many ways to some it's not that surprising.
Speaker 1: Their relationship with the World Cup recently, it's a little
Speaker 1: bit like Harrie Matheson in Homeland. It's very you know,
Speaker 1: it's all over the place. Honestly, Sometimes you know where
Speaker 1: you're getting and the other time you're scared to death.
Speaker 1: The fact that they didn't make it to Russia in
Speaker 1: ten says a lot. The World Cup before that, they
Speaker 1: didn't get out of the group stages and then they
Speaker 1: go and when you're a twenty twenty in incredible fashion
Speaker 1: and you think, wow, it's at least back Roberto Mancini
Speaker 1: has done amazing things. You have amazing players from all
Speaker 1: over that Atti who plays for Paris and jama He's amazing,
Speaker 1: don't at one of the best goalkeepers in the world,
Speaker 1: Lorenzo and seen all these great you know, Cheeto, I Mobila,
Speaker 1: all these great Italian players and they win your twenty twenty,
Speaker 1: you think, oh, there's no stopping. Then they're gonna make
Speaker 1: it to the World Cup, and they might win the
Speaker 1: World Cup, you never know. And then they face North
Speaker 1: Macedonia unbelievable in like the last moments of that game,
Speaker 1: and and then they're out. You know, Listen, we have
Speaker 1: a lot of good colleagues here at CBS Sports, where
Speaker 1: the rights holders for said, yeah, so Italian football is
Speaker 1: very important to us, and we always ask I always
Speaker 1: ask my Italian colleagues what what do you think it is?
Speaker 1: And a lot of it has to do with development
Speaker 1: in Italy. They're not seeing enough of them. There's a
Speaker 1: lot of very good young players, local Telli, Nico Barella,
Speaker 1: but there's not enough to put Like England produces a
Speaker 1: ridiculous amount. France they're under twenty one team can make
Speaker 1: it to the World Cup. John, Like, that's how good
Speaker 1: friends are Italy. They're like scraping, they're scraping the barrel
Speaker 1: for development in Italian youth. So that's part of the reason.
Speaker 1: But honestly, it's amazing and so shocking the fact that
Speaker 1: the European champions are not going to be at the
Speaker 1: World Cup. It's so wild I mean it was it
Speaker 1: was wilden when they didn't make it and you thought, okay,
Speaker 1: well that's an aberration, but for them to miss two
Speaker 1: in a row, it's just crazy. And as you said,
Speaker 1: they're all over the place. I love a Homeland reference
Speaker 1: even in two perfectly described. This was delightful, Louise. Uh,
Speaker 1: you cover soccer for CBS Sports. Tell everybody where they
Speaker 1: can find you on social and and plug what you
Speaker 1: have going on. No, thank you, John. Yes, you can
Speaker 1: find me on Twitter at LM that I if you
Speaker 1: don't know how to say my name, don't weren't just
Speaker 1: read it out when you read this uh podcast of course,
Speaker 1: but I host our premium soccer show podcast on YouTube
Speaker 1: show gig O Lasso YouTube dot com, forward Slash Lasso
Speaker 1: and Lasso put on Twitter. But yeah, it's been a blast.
Speaker 1: I love this sport to the death and I can't
Speaker 1: wait to see uh more of the World Cup. This
Speaker 1: was great. As the World Cup unfolds, hopefully we'll have
Speaker 1: you back, Louise. This was a pleasure. Good luck to Peru.
Speaker 1: Thank you so much, John, And just one last tip,
Speaker 1: equal or keep your eye on them They are soccer's
Speaker 1: Memphis Grizzlies. They're young, they're hungry, and they don't give
Speaker 1: an f about anybody. I'm in. This is great, this
Speaker 1: is amazing. We're having you back all the time after
Speaker 1: a break. The Spanish phenomen who might be the next
Speaker 1: big thing in tennis? Oh, listen, such a m cis
Speaker 1: Pas Siska. The fact that a teenager lost at the
Speaker 1: French Open to the world number three Alexander Zeverev not
Speaker 1: that surprising. But the fact that nineteen year old Carlos
Speaker 1: Alcarez was the pre match favorite, well, that tells you
Speaker 1: a lot about the summer Alcarez is having. But don't
Speaker 1: take my word for it. Here from some of the
Speaker 1: players he's beaten this year, starting with Severev, and listen
Speaker 1: closely because you can hear the resignation in their voices.
Speaker 1: Alter us, he's one of the best players in the
Speaker 1: world right now, and I'm pretty sure he's not gonna
Speaker 1: go worse. Both speed was incredible. I've never seen someone
Speaker 1: both so hard. He's the future of men's tennis but
Speaker 1: also present. I think he's un a stoppable. He has
Speaker 1: all the ingredients, he has the passion, he's humbling off
Speaker 1: to work hard. I like him. I wish him all
Speaker 1: the very best. I want to play big buttle, some
Speaker 1: tough bottles, I guess the best player in the word.
Speaker 1: To tell this story, senior producer Dan Bloom called up
Speaker 1: S I S. John Wertheim, who's currently based in Paris
Speaker 1: for the French Open and to begin the summer of Alcarez.
Speaker 1: We actually have to go back to January in Melbourne
Speaker 1: at the start of the Australian Open, the Tennis World
Speaker 1: and the world World was consumed with a snow back
Speaker 1: joke of it's soap opera Would he play? Would he
Speaker 1: be deported? He would be deported. Then Carlos Alcarez shows
Speaker 1: up with a considerably different looking physique he had been
Speaker 1: posting about all of his workout. Part of it was
Speaker 1: the boy has become a man. But I think it
Speaker 1: also just sort of went to the this this guy's
Speaker 1: not fooling around. I'm eighteen years old, but you know,
Speaker 1: I'm taking this seriously. This is someone who already had
Speaker 1: some buzz and showed up to Australia looking like that,
Speaker 1: showing off his guns, and it really did. It did
Speaker 1: not go unnoticed by tennis fans. It also did not
Speaker 1: go unnoticed by his tears cal There's another While and
Speaker 1: moves into the third ran of the histriod Artic That
Speaker 1: was simply outstanding. That was one of the performances of
Speaker 1: the tournament. Interestingly, one of his peers can now be
Speaker 1: counted as Raphael Nadal, a man who also has been
Speaker 1: known to rock a sleeveless shirt, who is also from Spain.
Speaker 1: And it turned out to be an absolutely grand moment
Speaker 1: for Rafael Nadal at that very Australian Open. It's the
Speaker 1: Miracle and Malva. It's the titles, one of the greatest
Speaker 1: plays of old time and one of the most improbable
Speaker 1: victories of old time. Australian Open will be remembered for
Speaker 1: for Rough and Nadal, But pretty soon it was Alcaraz
Speaker 1: who sort of took back the attention baton. And you
Speaker 1: know it's funny. I mean, people are there just a
Speaker 1: rivalry and you want to say, well, wait a second.
Speaker 1: Nadal turns thirty six in June. Alcarez just turned nineteen.
Speaker 1: I mean it's literally literally young enough to be his son.
Speaker 1: And yet there are so many parallels the attire you mentioned,
Speaker 1: the viceps, the Spanish provenans, but also I just think
Speaker 1: the way they go about their careers, it really has
Speaker 1: a lot of the same echoes. When Nadal was exactly
Speaker 1: the same age, he had a very similar effect on
Speaker 1: who was just running through draws well, quite astonishing with
Speaker 1: by young man whose progress was sudle passed so rapid.
Speaker 1: But what one does wear it will all end. Nadal
Speaker 1: is the player to whom he's most often compared, But
Speaker 1: it's another Spanish player, Juan Carlos Ferrero, who really should
Speaker 1: be talked about when we talk about Alcarez, his coach.
Speaker 1: So what is Ferrero brought to the mix? One Carlos Ferrero.
Speaker 1: Were not for Roth, Nadal would probably be one of
Speaker 1: these towering Spanish sportsman. He's a French Open champion, he
Speaker 1: got to number one of the rankings and it's the
Speaker 1: sweet smell of victory for the King of clay Clon.
Speaker 1: Carlos Ferrero, he's been out of tennis for a good decade,
Speaker 1: always been very highly regarded as a coach. He coached
Speaker 1: Alexander Zavera. Ferrero complained that all that guy does is
Speaker 1: check his phone. Ferrero had them a much more committed
Speaker 1: and docile pupil and Alcarez, but they really seem to
Speaker 1: get along. They really have a bond Spanish players. They
Speaker 1: speak the same language, they've same sensibilities. Tennis coach is
Speaker 1: always tricky, right, because it's a player out there that's
Speaker 1: actually having to execute. But I think in the case
Speaker 1: of Alcarraz, his relationship with Ferrero and he's he's spoken
Speaker 1: about this, but I think that's really uh strong component
Speaker 1: of this success story. Carlos Alcarez in Indian Wells plays
Speaker 1: a very very tight match against Nadal, comes up a
Speaker 1: little short, but you know, has turned a lot of heads.
Speaker 1: Alcarraz goes to Miami, Nadal's injury, there's no Nadal, there's
Speaker 1: no Djokovic, and wins what's often referred to as you know,
Speaker 1: the fifth or sixth biggest tournament. He masters the Feld
Speaker 1: in Miami, Carlo scars Shine's brightest in the Sunshine State.
Speaker 1: And now heads are are really turned. And he's eighteen
Speaker 1: years old. Can that possibly be right? Here? We thought
Speaker 1: we were pas the age when teenagers could make any
Speaker 1: dand it's such a physical sport. So he's he's riding
Speaker 1: this nice wave after Miami, and then the kid just
Speaker 1: continues to uh justify the height, not least in Madrid,
Speaker 1: his hometown, which is an added bit of pressure. Wait, wait,
Speaker 1: time out. We gotta back up because Barcelona is a
Speaker 1: part of this story too. This guy just came to
Speaker 1: Spain and he's like, oh, that's fantastic. Let me just
Speaker 1: destroy everyone and show my home fans what time it is.
Speaker 1: Alcarez has this great success in Miami. All right, well,
Speaker 1: now let's see what he can do back home. He
Speaker 1: goes to Spain. The surface has changed from hardcourt's to
Speaker 1: play and none of it has any bearing on Alcarez whatsoever.
Speaker 1: So callus Alcarez is the two thousand and twenty two
Speaker 1: Barcelona Open Banks sabbadel Champion, Big High five with Juan
Speaker 1: Kondas Herrero. He wins this title twenty one years on
Speaker 1: from Wine. Ranconnell sticks south back into eyes and have one.
Speaker 1: He wins the title in Barcelona and he jumps into
Speaker 1: the pool, jumps in the pool with the ball kids,
Speaker 1: and everybody says, oh, what a lovely guy, and he said,
Speaker 1: wait a second, these are his peers. This is a
Speaker 1: guy who's hanging out with her. It's about time he's
Speaker 1: acting his age. He wins Barcelona the hype is continuing
Speaker 1: to Bubble goes to Madrid, which which is a bigger tournament.
Speaker 1: When Alcaraz turned eighteen, the day he turned eighteen, he
Speaker 1: played the doll in Madrid, and it was framed, Oh,
Speaker 1: here's this dream moment. It's it's make a wish. He
Speaker 1: gets to play the doll and he's not gonna mount
Speaker 1: much resistance. But what a fun way to spend your
Speaker 1: eighteenth birthday? Who would thunking? And the doll beat the
Speaker 1: guy handily and they eat cake and everybody's happy. A
Speaker 1: year later, he turns nineteen, same event. This time the
Speaker 1: whole stadium knows that this birthday they're all singing along.
Speaker 1: But he's not here to get a selfie with Nadal.
Speaker 1: He's here to beat Nadal, beat Djokovic, Carlos Alcarez. He
Speaker 1: becomes the first player ever to defeat Nadal and Djokovic
Speaker 1: back to back on the clay court. And then you say,
Speaker 1: how does this kid have anything possibly left physically, spiritually, emotionally,
Speaker 1: how does he have anything left for the final? And
Speaker 1: he ends up beating Alexander Zverev, the number three player
Speaker 1: in the world, and about the time it will take
Speaker 1: us to conduct this interview. Carlos Alcarez is the champion
Speaker 1: in Madrid. It's a second title at this level in
Speaker 1: the space of six weeks, an hour of total domination.
Speaker 1: Djokovic just turned thirty five, Nadal's gonna turn thirty six
Speaker 1: the first week of June. Roger Federer's next birthday. There's
Speaker 1: a big gap of players who have not been able
Speaker 1: to mount like of a challenge against the big three
Speaker 1: for more than a decade. I mean literally ten years,
Speaker 1: which is the length of a good tennis career. We've
Speaker 1: been asking who who is the next person that's gonna
Speaker 1: make a dance against Fedder, Nadal, Djokovic, does this the
Speaker 1: guy that's gonna break through? Is this the person that's
Speaker 1: finally gonna, you know, take down the three headed monster.
Speaker 1: I have not seen hype like this, the kind of
Speaker 1: outa rozz that's very rightly generating. This guy is really
Speaker 1: the future of the sport. And it does seem as
Speaker 1: though men's tennis now has the the answer to this
Speaker 1: ten year old plus question of who's going to succeed
Speaker 1: the big three. You have to have a good goal,
Speaker 1: good dreams, trying to follow your dream work high every
Speaker 1: day I think that's the secret. You watch this guy
Speaker 1: play the way he's fearless when it matters, You watch
Speaker 1: the drop shots, and there's a creativity. This is not
Speaker 1: a tennis robot apart from the results, and you can
Speaker 1: look at his match record and you see how his
Speaker 1: ranking is still ascending. But I think a lot of
Speaker 1: this is just the kids different and it's exactly the
Speaker 1: same thing people are saying about Nadal eighteen years ago.
Speaker 1: You can just tell watching this kid has something that
Speaker 1: the others don't. Is he going to number one? I
Speaker 1: don't think he's going to number one by the end
Speaker 1: of the summer, but yeah, he's going to number one
Speaker 1: for sure. I mean, if these big three hang around
Speaker 1: for five more years, alcare Has is still only twenty four,
Speaker 1: so it's a good time to be buying stock. I'm
Speaker 1: all in. John Worthheim, thank you so much. Thanks that
Speaker 1: was great. That was fun. John Wortheim as a senior
Speaker 1: writer for s I and our resident tennis expert. We'll
Speaker 1: have a link to his dispatches from Roland Garrows in
Speaker 1: our show notes. Sports Illustrator Weekly is a production of
Speaker 1: Sports Illustrated and I Heart Radio For more podcasts from
Speaker 1: my Heart Radio visit the I Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts,
Speaker 1: or wherever you get your favorite shows. And for more
Speaker 1: of Sports Illustrated It's best stories and podcasts, visit SI
Speaker 1: dot com. This episode of Sports Illustrator Weekly was produced
Speaker 1: by Cooper McKim, Jessica your Moski, and Isaac Lee, who
Speaker 1: was also our sound engineer. Our senior producer is Dan Bloom.
Speaker 1: Our executive producers are Scott Brody and me John Gonzalez.
Speaker 1: Our theme song is by Nolan Schneider. Thanks for listening,
Speaker 1: and if you've stuck around this long, we leave you
Speaker 1: with this. By the way, Louise, is it right that
Speaker 1: you were an actor and you were in a John
Speaker 1: Malkovic movie? I was, Yes, I was an actor for
Speaker 1: fifteen years and then I flipped the switch. I won.
Speaker 1: It's a terrible movie. You can watch it on Amazon Prime.
Speaker 1: School Mutant Chronicles terrible, but it's it's good, ridiculous cast.
Speaker 1: So it was fun. Berefully