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Speaker 1: Well, this Sunday afternoon evening edition of Cardinal Territory was

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Speaker 1: supposed to be a series recap of the Cardinals Rais

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Speaker 1: series in Tampa, but that game has yet to be played.

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Speaker 1: It's around two thirty Central time as we record. This

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Speaker 1: first pitch was scheduled for eleven ten. Severe weather at

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Speaker 1: George Steinberner Field. Who could have forecasted that in the

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Speaker 1: late August certainly not us, And we should be used

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Speaker 1: to Cardinals rain delayers anyway, because, as Bernie and I

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Speaker 1: were just saying before we logged on for the show,

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Speaker 1: it's probably been the worst weather year for the Saint

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Speaker 1: Louis Cardinals all season long.

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Speaker 2: So we have no update for you right now for

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Speaker 2: the game.

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Speaker 1: The Rays released an announcement about an hour ago saying

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Speaker 1: they were hopeful to begin this game around three pm

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Speaker 1: Central time, weather permitting.

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Speaker 2: And then this.

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Speaker 1: Bad boy went out about ten minutes ago. I'll read

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Speaker 1: it to you because it just made me laugh. It's

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Speaker 1: so fitting for the weather trials and tribulations we've had

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Speaker 1: this year from the Tampa Bay Rays about fifteen minutes ago,

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Speaker 1: conditions have worsened and we are reassessing the situation. We

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Speaker 1: continue to monitor and will provide an update as more

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Speaker 1: information becomes available. So no estimated timeframe for first pitch.

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Speaker 1: We don't even know if the game is going to

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Speaker 1: be played, so no series recap. But guess what, We're

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Speaker 1: still here to break down some Cardinals things. Welcome back

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Speaker 1: to here.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, I'm sorry I had to mean the reupt Yeah,

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Speaker 3: I mean, I do care about the outcome of this game.

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Speaker 3: I think it'd be good for the Cardinals to win,

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Speaker 3: you know, back to back series. But then again, does

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Speaker 3: it really matter whether they have a four and two

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Speaker 3: road trip or three and three road trip. I mean again,

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Speaker 3: I'm not trying to demean them, but it just doesn't

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Speaker 3: matter all that much. So yeah, I think the show

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Speaker 3: must go on.

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Speaker 4: Katie. You know, the rain doesn't affect us.

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Speaker 3: It's dry in my house, so I'm sure s drive

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Speaker 3: where you are.

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Speaker 2: Lewis definitely funny talking about this.

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Speaker 1: It seems like every home homestand the weather is awful.

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Speaker 2: Then the Cardinals go on the road.

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Speaker 1: It becomes beautiful in Saint Louis, and wherever they're on

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Speaker 1: the road the weather is equally as bad.

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Speaker 2: So the good news is.

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Speaker 1: If you are so inclined to come watch four thrillion

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Speaker 1: games against the Cardinals and Pirates next week. It looks

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Speaker 1: to be perfect baseball weather, seventy five degrees, minimal humidity. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: who wouldn't want to see that? Who wouldn't want to

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Speaker 1: see Cardinals Pirates four games during the week in August?

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Speaker 2: Check it out.

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Speaker 4: Come to bus chanting with us pitch. I guess I

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Speaker 4: don't know. Well, maybe he's not scheduled. I don't know.

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Speaker 4: I haven't even looked ahead. I'm well prepared for this

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Speaker 4: show today, Katie, you.

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Speaker 2: And me both. I don't even know how it became

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Speaker 2: faker of the afternoon. My tea is thrilled.

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Speaker 1: You know what, Bertie, I think as we progress to September,

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Speaker 1: this won't be the you know what Cardinals September where

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Speaker 1: they're making their usual playoff push.

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Speaker 2: Right, this is a sad September.

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Speaker 1: We're going sending a lot of time focusing on next

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Speaker 1: year's roster, and there are a lot of things that

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Speaker 1: haven't gone well for the Cardinals. There are a lot

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Speaker 1: of problems they need to address. There will be plenty

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Speaker 1: of questions about Hey and Bloom's transition and what the

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Speaker 1: new front office will look like and We'll have plenty

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Speaker 1: of time to discuss that, but I think we could

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Speaker 1: all use some positivity right now. So I'm officially deeming

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Speaker 1: this a cardinal territory.

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Speaker 2: Hashtag positive EPISOD.

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Speaker 1: And I thought you and I could talk about a

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Speaker 1: couple of things that were either excited about or confident

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Speaker 1: about next year from a player perspective. So my first

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Speaker 1: question for you, which Cardinals starting pitcher are you most

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Speaker 1: confident in next year?

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Speaker 4: I'm going to say Matthew Libtor.

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Speaker 3: And perhaps that's counterintuitive because he got off to that

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Speaker 3: great start his first ten starts this year.

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Speaker 4: We're magnificent.

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Speaker 3: He really was statistically one of the best starting pitchers

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Speaker 3: in baseball. And then whether we want to say he

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Speaker 3: hit that wall, whether we say it's just, hey, you know,

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Speaker 3: this transition is starting in the major leagus for the

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Speaker 3: first time, I mean a full time starter. He hadn't

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Speaker 3: done that for a long time, or he hadn't done

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Speaker 3: that in the majors, I'm sorry, And yeah, I think

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Speaker 3: for I think each each individual pitcher is different, and

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Speaker 3: in his case, I think the the pile up of

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Speaker 3: innings you know, obviously got to him. Thankfully for him

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Speaker 3: and the Cardinals you know, he wasn't injured per se,

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Speaker 3: but he just just didn't have great stuff for a

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Speaker 3: while and he had to develop some survival skills.

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Speaker 4: And I think I've really liked the way.

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Speaker 3: He's handled all of this. I'm not saying it's been

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Speaker 3: handsome the whole way, because it has n't. But you

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Speaker 3: can see him bouncing back some. You can see the

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Speaker 3: life returning to his pitches. And Katie, I looked at

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Speaker 3: you know, I've taken the season and its entirety so far.

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Speaker 3: We know there was a great part and of not

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Speaker 3: good part, but he's basically I was looking at his

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Speaker 3: adjusted e R A or e r A plus.

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Speaker 4: He's basically a league average pitcher. But I actually think

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Speaker 4: that's good.

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Speaker 3: Because if in fact, he got through the hard part,

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Speaker 3: the part where you know, things just he didn't have sizzle, right,

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Speaker 3: If he gets through that, I think it'll set him

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Speaker 3: up for next season.

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Speaker 4: He'll know what it's like, his arm will be used

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Speaker 4: to it, he'll train accordingly. Everything like that.

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Speaker 3: I think it sets him up to have a really

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Speaker 3: nice season next year because I think the maturity, not

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Speaker 3: only mental maturity, but the physical maturity he'll be in better.

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Speaker 3: He'll be in a better spot going in the next season.

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Speaker 2: I agree from the Libby standpoint.

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Speaker 1: I think we've talked all season about how much this

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Speaker 1: was one thousand percent the correct decision for the organization

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Speaker 1: to do in terms of seeing what he has as

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Speaker 1: a full season as a starting pitcher.

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Speaker 2: This Cardinals transition season, as we know, was designed to

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Speaker 2: let the.

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Speaker 1: Organization know what they have and a player after a

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Speaker 1: full season of work, not April, not a couple months,

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Speaker 1: not a first half or a second half, an entire season,

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Speaker 1: and they identified very early on which players they wanted

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Speaker 1: to see that in and Libby was one of them.

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Speaker 1: So of course there are going to be ups and downs,

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Speaker 1: and Libby's had his fair share of setbacks. I really

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Speaker 1: like how he responded after his last start in Miami.

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Speaker 1: Was hoping to see him build out that today. Who's

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Speaker 1: to know if he actually will pitch today. But I

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Speaker 1: like what we're seeing in Libby because he has with

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Speaker 1: each setback, had.

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Speaker 2: The right mentality to overcome it.

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Speaker 1: And the innings limit or career innings that he was

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Speaker 1: coming up on that's a real thing. But the only

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Speaker 1: way you're going to get past that as a pitcher

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Speaker 1: is to pitch through it, and the Cardinals have been

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Speaker 1: I will say this about them, so cognizant and so

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Speaker 1: detailed about pitching usage and innings limits and keeping their

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Speaker 1: arms healthy.

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Speaker 2: I really like what we've seen out of Libby.

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Speaker 1: I hope he can turn, you know, finish the season

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Speaker 1: strong in September, log more innings, get that Veilo up,

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Speaker 1: sustain it, and I think come next year, if he

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Speaker 1: is your number three or number four, okay, that's fine.

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Speaker 1: I wouldn't pick him as my most confident one, though

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Speaker 1: I do have confidence in Libby. I would go with McGreevy.

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Speaker 1: And maybe that's recency bias, but I just really like

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Speaker 1: what we've seen out of his demeanor because it hasn't

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Speaker 1: been easy for him all season long. We know that

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Speaker 1: it's been a very unorthodox year for Michael mcgree in

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Speaker 1: terms of how the organization has used him.

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Speaker 2: But he's come up and whether he's been hit hard or.

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Speaker 1: Whether he's had success, he's the same, even killed guy

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Speaker 1: in the clubhouse, he's laughing around, he's joking, he's comfortable,

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Speaker 1: and he's still so serious. I think he has the

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Speaker 1: makeup of a true mid rotation star, and I think

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Speaker 1: that if the Cardinals start the season in twenty twenty six,

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Speaker 1: and Matthew Libertorre and Michael McGreevy are the three and

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Speaker 1: four pictures in your rotation or four and five. That's

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Speaker 1: pretty good, Okay, you'll take those guys as back end starters.

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Speaker 1: The issue that I have here, Bernie, is that the

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Speaker 1: Cardinals don't have three starters to slot above them right now.

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Speaker 1: You're not gonna put Andre Polante up there. If Sonny

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Speaker 1: Gray stays, sure could he's the number one. Obviously, they're

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Speaker 1: not bringing back Miles michaelis And you can make the

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Speaker 1: argument right now that the best way pictures in the

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Speaker 1: organization are Sonny Gray, Matthew Libertre, and Michael McGreevey. But

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Speaker 1: is that a rotation that's going to I don't know,

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Speaker 1: sparked fear in an opponent. Is that a rotation that's

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Speaker 1: really setting those guys up for success. Michael McGreevy and

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Speaker 1: Matthew Libertre next year to be confident in their abilities

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Speaker 1: and their careers should be the back end of the rotation.

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Speaker 2: If you have them.

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Speaker 1: Trying to produce like a number two or three or

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Speaker 1: one or two, that'd be worst case scenario. I'm not sure,

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Speaker 1: you're setting it up best for success. So in my

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Speaker 1: perfect world, Matthew Libertor, Michael mcgree three or four, four

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Speaker 1: and five, and I'm really confident in what they be

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Speaker 1: able to do at this point in their early careers

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Speaker 1: as back end starters.

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Speaker 4: No, I I agree, and I listen.

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Speaker 3: I think I think we basically, I think that both

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Speaker 3: of us would put McGreevy and limatare in the same

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Speaker 3: in the same category. I mean, there's a lot to

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Speaker 3: like about both of them, and I think we both

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Speaker 3: agree that the best is yet to come. And I

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Speaker 3: look at McGreevy, just to dovetail on your point, The

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Speaker 3: thing that impresses me is that, uh, all right, you know,

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Speaker 3: does he does he throw ninety seven?

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Speaker 2: No?

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Speaker 4: Is he going to strike out a bunch of guys?

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Speaker 3: No? But if you look at some of the some

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Speaker 3: of the underlying metrics, and you know me, I I do,

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Speaker 3: you know, get into that stuff. His his ability to

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Speaker 3: locate pitches exactly where he wants him to go. He's

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Speaker 3: way above average in that part. He's way above average,

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Speaker 3: and and some some other things like individual pitches. I

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Speaker 3: won't get too deep in the weeds here, but he's

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Speaker 3: a guy with with exceptional control and the Cardinals as

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Speaker 3: a rotation early in the season. The first couple months,

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Speaker 3: they were among the three or four best teams in

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Speaker 3: the Major at locating their pitches, and then that all

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Speaker 3: went to hell for a lot of them, right, But

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Speaker 3: McGreevy is the guy that if you look at the

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Speaker 3: minor leagues, and I know Baseball America had a thing

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Speaker 3: where they were talking about best tools they saw in

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Speaker 3: the miners this year and they mentioned McGreevy for his

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Speaker 3: ability to locate and hit his spots in his control.

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Speaker 3: So he's the type of pitcher. He's got a bulldog mentality.

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Speaker 3: He's a great competitor. He's really really smart. He doesn't

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Speaker 3: have to throw ninety seven ninety six to be effective

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Speaker 3: because he really, really really knows how to pitch.

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Speaker 4: And he doesn't beat.

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Speaker 3: Himself because he doesn't walk people, and he works quickly

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Speaker 3: and he had just during games. How many times we've

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Speaker 3: seen him do that where he has a like the

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Speaker 3: Dodgers got to him, there was another game, somebody got

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Speaker 3: to him early and then he just shuts shuts them

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Speaker 3: down after that. He's so smart he adjust within the

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Speaker 3: game and for an inexperienced major league starter.

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Speaker 4: That's a really good ability to have. So no, I'm

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Speaker 4: with you.

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Speaker 3: I think Liberator's physical talent can be outstanding. He just

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Speaker 3: has to be able to, you know, build, build, build

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Speaker 3: up that arm to the point where starting pitching and

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Speaker 3: throwing one hundred and eighty innings is nothing for him

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Speaker 3: and he can.

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Speaker 4: Sort of glide through it.

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Speaker 3: But these guys are both to me potentially exciting, but

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Speaker 3: for different reasons.

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Speaker 1: I agree, And I think you make two strong points

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Speaker 1: about McGreevy there. When you are pitch to contact guy

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Speaker 1: such as he is, the worst thing you can do

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Speaker 1: is walk batters, And to your point, he rarely does

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Speaker 1: issue a walk, so he does a nice job of

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Speaker 1: putting himself in positions to succeed. And his adaptability, his

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Speaker 1: ability to adjust and recover mid start, that's huge. That's

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Speaker 1: a sign of a pitcher that I think is only

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Speaker 1: going to continue improving and excelling at a much faster

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Speaker 1: rate than maybe a lot of competitors, because a lot

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Speaker 1: of times, especially where we are right now in an industry,

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Speaker 1: these pictures need to start to recover, all right, gone

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Speaker 1: or the day is We're a veteran, you know, you know,

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Speaker 1: veterans now can of course adjust mid game, but rookie's

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Speaker 1: coming up young guys, it's very hard for them to

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Speaker 1: do that. They need almost an entire start to start

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Speaker 1: over queen slate. But Greevy doesn't need that. To your point, Bernie,

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Speaker 1: he's been able to adjust mid game really well, and

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Speaker 1: that's encouraging.

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Speaker 4: So well.

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Speaker 3: I want to ask you this, and again, we've we've

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Speaker 3: we've emphasized a couple of pictures that we're really positive about.

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Speaker 3: What do we make Sonny Gray, Because Honey Gray, he's

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Speaker 3: just up and down. He's all over the place. You know,

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Speaker 3: I just don't know what to expect from him start

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Speaker 3: to start, and that's that's not good if you're talking

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Speaker 3: about someone who should be your prototype, number one starter.

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Speaker 4: And the thing with having problems in the heat.

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Speaker 3: I'm not making fun of him, you know, I'm not

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Speaker 3: trying to denegrate him for that, but gosh, summers get

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Speaker 3: pretty hot, and it's I don't know his chill, his

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Speaker 3: July era as a cardinal starter, you know, it's like

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Speaker 3: in the sevens, I think, and it's like I when

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Speaker 3: Sonny Gray is on man, he is a pleasure to

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Speaker 3: watch and he deals. He is fantastic, but there have

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Speaker 3: been way too many games where you know, you're like,

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Speaker 3: oh gosh, what's going on here?

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Speaker 4: So I don't. I don't look. Look, he's a very

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Speaker 4: talented guy, and he's a competitive guy. I just gush.

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Speaker 3: He'll be thirty six next season, and I'm just not

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Speaker 3: sure what to make.

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Speaker 4: Of him at this point.

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Speaker 3: You know, and you know, and he'll also be making

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Speaker 3: thirty five million next season that backloaded contract. So anyway,

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Speaker 3: I talk too much about Gray. I asked you the

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Speaker 3: question that I started talking, But what do you think?

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Speaker 3: Is there something I'm overlooking?

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Speaker 2: No, I don't think so.

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Speaker 1: And in one defense of Sunny Gray, when you look

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Speaker 1: at the Cardinals overall record on days that he starts,

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Speaker 1: they have won. And I don't know the record off

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Speaker 1: the top of my head because I have in check

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Speaker 1: since last start, but they've won an overwhelming majority of

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Speaker 1: those games. I'm with you, though, He's had a couple

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Speaker 1: of clunkers this year, much more than usual, more frequently

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Speaker 1: that have really spiraled out of his control. And we

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Speaker 1: I talked about this on the last episode. I'm not

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Speaker 1: sure if he's here next year, and that speculation, okay,

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Speaker 1: to clear this up. I've had no conversations with anyone

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Speaker 1: in the organization that would dictate this. This is just

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Speaker 1: my gut feeling and I've been wrong before. But to

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Speaker 1: your point about the backload of contract, thirty five million

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Speaker 1: dollars is a lot to pay for one player for

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Speaker 1: a team that's looking to rebuild and scale back on

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Speaker 1: payroll to an extent and look towards the future.

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Speaker 2: Sunny Gray has no trade clause.

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Speaker 1: I wonder if he's wanting to go to and play

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Speaker 1: competitive games because he has thirty six years old and

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Speaker 1: he's had a very decorated career, very talented pitcher. I'd

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Speaker 1: wonder if he is here next year if he is okay,

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Speaker 1: the Cardinals have a veteran that you know they can,

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Speaker 1: they know is going to take the ball every five days.

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Speaker 2: Cool.

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Speaker 1: If they don't, that is a lot of pitching to

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Speaker 1: pill and as we know Bernie, they don't really have

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Speaker 1: a lot of pitching internally. So either way, it's a problem,

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Speaker 1: and I think it'll be very interesting to monitor the

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Speaker 1: early offseason on how High Bloom approaches that situation, because

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Speaker 1: I'm not all that convinced any Gray will be in

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Speaker 1: Saint Louis next year. But again clarifying one more time

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Speaker 1: for the people at home, that is just my speculation.

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Speaker 1: There's been no actual reporting to back that up.

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Speaker 2: That's just a gutuling, and.

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Speaker 3: I think maybe I think that speculation is got some

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Speaker 3: footing because you're colleague Ken Roseveal the athletic when when

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Speaker 3: he was here for the Yankees Cardinals game on that Saturday,

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Speaker 3: he said he talked to Sonny Gray, and Sonny Gray

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Speaker 3: in effect indicated he'd be willing to listen about wavings

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Speaker 3: no trade clause. So if he's saying it's something he

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Speaker 3: would consider, well that that kind of changes the look

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Speaker 3: the outlook for that because until now he's always said no, no, no,

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Speaker 3: I like it here, and he does like it here.

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Speaker 3: But again, he'll be thirty six, and you know what,

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Speaker 3: if the Atlanta Braves want him, it's they're closer to

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Speaker 3: where he lives than Saint Louis's. It's really interesting, by

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Speaker 3: the way, since I can multitask, I looked it up

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Speaker 3: this year. In the two years that Gray's been a

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Speaker 3: starting pitcher for the Cardinals, they're thirty six and eighteen

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Speaker 3: in his starts, including nineteen and seven this year. And

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Speaker 3: I don't know that that nineteen and seven. I'm sure

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Speaker 3: there was some games there where he benefited for run support.

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Speaker 3: But I'm a big see I never look at a

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Speaker 3: pitcher's individual record, I swear I don't.

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Speaker 4: I think the team's record tells you a lot more.

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Speaker 3: I agree when a guy starts, because a lot of

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Speaker 3: it has to do his teammates are confident. You know,

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Speaker 3: they believe in him, and everybody knows. They go into

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Speaker 3: it thinking, even if they don't, they go into a

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Speaker 3: start thinking, Okay, Sonny's on the mound. Gosh, we win

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Speaker 3: at a high rate when he starts, Let's go get him.

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Speaker 3: I do think psychologically that kind of thing when you

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Speaker 3: look at they've twice as many wins as losses when

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Speaker 3: he starts for a team that's been five hundred ish,

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Speaker 3: but for him to be they're eighteen games over five

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Speaker 3: hundred when he starts in the last two years. There

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Speaker 3: is something to be said for that. It's not the

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Speaker 3: end all, be all stat I just think I think

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Speaker 3: it does tell us a lot more than an individual

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Speaker 3: win loss record, where you have to depend on the bullpen,

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Speaker 3: you have to depend on the offense, you have to

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Speaker 3: depend on the defense. You know, there's something about him

355
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Speaker 3: that this team's His teammates buy in when he's on

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Speaker 3: the mound. And I think that's an important thing because

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Speaker 3: confidence for a team that's kind of in the middle,

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Speaker 3: it's kind of hard to have that confidence all the time.

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Speaker 2: I'm with you, Bernie, I'm with you.

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Speaker 1: It'll be an interesting situation to monitor going forward, for sure.

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Speaker 1: I will say this low bar, I know, but this

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Speaker 1: offseason should be a lot more interesting than last year's.

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Speaker 1: All right, we did the pitching side to this.

364
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Speaker 2: We'll get to the position player side after a message

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00:16:36,120 --> 00:16:36,840
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Speaker 2: All right, Oh hold on, I pressed the wrong button

393
00:17:46,000 --> 00:17:47,760
Speaker 2: on my screen. There you are you want to wear?

394
00:17:48,800 --> 00:17:51,119
Speaker 2: All right? Bernie talked about the pitching.

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Speaker 1: Naturally, we're going to talk about the position playing side,

396
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Speaker 1: which I think is a lot somehow even more complicated

397
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Speaker 1: than the pitching side. But the positive episode, I'm reminding

398
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Speaker 1: myself positive, I have some Which position.

399
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Speaker 2: Player are you most confident in next year?

400
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Speaker 4: Oh? Boy, that's such a good question.

401
00:18:06,080 --> 00:18:08,600
Speaker 3: There are there are several candidates, and I don't think

402
00:18:08,640 --> 00:18:11,000
Speaker 3: you I don't think I know I'm not and I

403
00:18:11,000 --> 00:18:15,600
Speaker 3: don't think you're You're going to go overboard with maybe

404
00:18:16,280 --> 00:18:19,600
Speaker 3: overstating how good somebody is or whatever. But there's been

405
00:18:19,640 --> 00:18:23,200
Speaker 3: some encouraging performances this year. But I have to tell

406
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Speaker 3: you, you know, even though and I looked it up, you know,

407
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Speaker 3: just wanted to be sure even though he is below

408
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Speaker 3: average offensively, he's basically league average, but he's a little

409
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Speaker 3: bit under I.

410
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Speaker 4: Love Mason Wynn. I love what he does for this team. Uh.

411
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Speaker 3: He is a guy to build around. His defense is impeccable.

412
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Speaker 3: He's right well according to outs above average. He's he's

413
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Speaker 3: the best defensive player any position in the game this year.

414
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Speaker 3: And I'm very confident that the that the offense will come.

415
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Speaker 3: I think it will come. I listen, we know that

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Speaker 3: he's very talented, and we know that we saw his

417
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Speaker 3: number on his way up in the minors. He was

418
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Speaker 3: starting to develop to a really good hitter, and he

419
00:19:05,240 --> 00:19:07,080
Speaker 3: was really good a lot of the time last year,

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Speaker 3: and he faded, he got tired kind of late, and yeah,

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Speaker 3: you do worry about that knee. You do worry about,

422
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Speaker 3: you know, him getting banged up. And I think, Ali Marmle,

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Speaker 3: this is just my opinion, and I've talked to him

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Speaker 3: about this. I think he needs to be a little

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Speaker 3: more careful. Let's talk about twenty twenty six. Not to

426
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Speaker 3: wear certain guys down. They want to play, they're great competitors.

427
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Speaker 3: Mason Win wants to play every day and I love that.

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Speaker 3: But sometimes you have to sort of protect the player

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Speaker 3: from himself. And the last thing they need is to

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Speaker 3: have Mason Win banged up a lot of times because

431
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Speaker 3: he plays so hard. But I think offensively, he's got

432
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Speaker 3: so much upside. It's still amazing to me that he's

433
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Speaker 3: only twenty three years old. He's a firebrand, he's a

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Speaker 3: kind of as smart as could be. You never have

435
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Speaker 3: to worry about his level of compete. I mean, it's

436
00:19:58,880 --> 00:20:01,280
Speaker 3: all there. The only thing missing is he's got to

437
00:20:01,320 --> 00:20:04,679
Speaker 3: get that offense above average and continue to grow in

438
00:20:04,720 --> 00:20:06,480
Speaker 3: that area, and I think he will.

439
00:20:07,480 --> 00:20:09,560
Speaker 1: So I was convinced you were going to go somebody

440
00:20:09,600 --> 00:20:11,520
Speaker 1: else and I was actually going to go Mason Win.

441
00:20:11,720 --> 00:20:13,119
Speaker 4: Well, look at that.

442
00:20:13,560 --> 00:20:17,040
Speaker 3: You should have told me, you know, I would have deferred.

443
00:20:16,080 --> 00:20:19,520
Speaker 1: And I think this actually proves our point that Mason

444
00:20:19,560 --> 00:20:22,159
Speaker 1: Win is my player. I'm most confident next year. And

445
00:20:22,200 --> 00:20:23,880
Speaker 1: there are other players you can go, like, you can

446
00:20:23,920 --> 00:20:26,320
Speaker 1: go Donovan, but you know what, Donovan is all right,

447
00:20:26,400 --> 00:20:29,280
Speaker 1: and there weren't any questions about who Donovan was coming

448
00:20:29,320 --> 00:20:32,440
Speaker 1: into this year. You could go Herrera from an offensive standpoint,

449
00:20:32,480 --> 00:20:34,160
Speaker 1: but there are too many questions about where he fits

450
00:20:34,200 --> 00:20:36,280
Speaker 1: on the field for me and lasting the Cardinals need

451
00:20:36,320 --> 00:20:38,080
Speaker 1: is another DH, although at least this one would be

452
00:20:38,160 --> 00:20:41,520
Speaker 1: right handed. What a concept, But Mason Win. I'm trying

453
00:20:41,520 --> 00:20:45,320
Speaker 1: hard to be positive. Mason Win is the when you

454
00:20:45,359 --> 00:20:46,920
Speaker 1: look at what he was able to do this year

455
00:20:46,920 --> 00:20:50,320
Speaker 1: as a defensive shortstop, he solidified that position, and he

456
00:20:50,400 --> 00:20:53,160
Speaker 1: is still so young and has so much more growth

457
00:20:53,160 --> 00:20:55,040
Speaker 1: ahead of him. I don't think he's even touched his ceiling.

458
00:20:55,080 --> 00:20:56,480
Speaker 1: I know only Marmal thinks the same.

459
00:20:56,760 --> 00:20:57,240
Speaker 2: I'm with you.

460
00:20:57,280 --> 00:20:59,480
Speaker 1: The offense should tick up a little bit if he's

461
00:20:59,520 --> 00:21:02,280
Speaker 1: right around league average in a second full year in

462
00:21:02,320 --> 00:21:05,800
Speaker 1: the majors, based on what he's doing defensively, Okay. I

463
00:21:05,880 --> 00:21:08,640
Speaker 1: think the only reason that we're a little disappointed by

464
00:21:08,640 --> 00:21:10,440
Speaker 1: that is because we know he could be so much

465
00:21:10,480 --> 00:21:13,000
Speaker 1: more and that's going to take some time. But who

466
00:21:13,080 --> 00:21:16,439
Speaker 1: Mason Win is as a player, He's a competitor, He's gritty,

467
00:21:16,480 --> 00:21:18,600
Speaker 1: he grinds it out, you know, and I think the

468
00:21:18,640 --> 00:21:20,679
Speaker 1: more he plays, the more comfortable he's going to be,

469
00:21:20,960 --> 00:21:23,480
Speaker 1: the more that offense is going to come. Most importantly,

470
00:21:23,520 --> 00:21:25,720
Speaker 1: the more that base running is going to come, because

471
00:21:25,720 --> 00:21:30,280
Speaker 1: he can be a true three way threat defensively, offensively

472
00:21:30,400 --> 00:21:32,240
Speaker 1: and on the basis here. He just has to trust

473
00:21:32,240 --> 00:21:35,040
Speaker 1: this stuff a little bit more. But I'm excited and

474
00:21:35,080 --> 00:21:37,240
Speaker 1: confident to see what Mason Win does at shortstop. I

475
00:21:37,240 --> 00:21:41,200
Speaker 1: think he is minimum one of the top defensive shortstops

476
00:21:41,240 --> 00:21:44,160
Speaker 1: in the league, if not top three, and that offense

477
00:21:44,200 --> 00:21:46,240
Speaker 1: will come. I think it's so exciting to think about

478
00:21:46,240 --> 00:21:48,240
Speaker 1: with the player he could be, just given what we've

479
00:21:48,240 --> 00:21:50,920
Speaker 1: seen from him so far, I'm all bored on the

480
00:21:50,960 --> 00:21:51,720
Speaker 1: Mason Win train.

481
00:21:51,880 --> 00:21:54,920
Speaker 2: So Vernie, that's two. That's two votes for Mason from us.

482
00:21:55,119 --> 00:21:58,400
Speaker 4: Well, absolutely, and I think scouts would say the same thing. Now.

483
00:21:59,640 --> 00:22:02,000
Speaker 3: Just to throw in another element to this, because I

484
00:22:02,040 --> 00:22:05,080
Speaker 3: love this discussion. If I were to say, or if

485
00:22:05,080 --> 00:22:09,359
Speaker 3: you were to ask me, for example, well is there

486
00:22:09,400 --> 00:22:11,760
Speaker 3: a sleeper for next season, or is there somebody that

487
00:22:11,840 --> 00:22:14,879
Speaker 3: may not be at the forefront of everybody's mind, And

488
00:22:14,920 --> 00:22:17,560
Speaker 3: I would I would say, yeah, I got that guy,

489
00:22:17,680 --> 00:22:20,640
Speaker 3: because I think I think the progress Nolan Gorman has

490
00:22:20,680 --> 00:22:24,480
Speaker 3: made has been fantastic. Now I know he's still even

491
00:22:25,000 --> 00:22:27,720
Speaker 3: even though like since late May, he's going very very well,

492
00:22:28,240 --> 00:22:30,359
Speaker 3: and I know he still strikes out twenty nine to

493
00:22:30,400 --> 00:22:32,760
Speaker 3: thirty percent of the time. I'm not saying he's perfect,

494
00:22:33,280 --> 00:22:37,640
Speaker 3: but all these areas where he absolutely needed to improve

495
00:22:37,680 --> 00:22:42,320
Speaker 3: in swing and miss rate, chase rate, walk rate which

496
00:22:42,359 --> 00:22:45,480
Speaker 3: is really high, all of these things that he was

497
00:22:45,520 --> 00:22:48,080
Speaker 3: really bad in and where the arrow was just pointing

498
00:22:48,119 --> 00:22:50,720
Speaker 3: down and getting worse. He's cleaned all that up, and

499
00:22:50,760 --> 00:22:53,320
Speaker 3: his plate discipline is there. He's still going to have

500
00:22:53,680 --> 00:22:57,040
Speaker 3: two strikeout games, but he has less of them. And

501
00:22:57,119 --> 00:22:59,200
Speaker 3: the thing I love about what he's been doing since

502
00:22:59,280 --> 00:23:02,919
Speaker 3: late May has been drawing walk after walk after walk

503
00:23:03,040 --> 00:23:05,720
Speaker 3: after walk. So I've had some some people that read

504
00:23:05,760 --> 00:23:07,480
Speaker 3: me and watch my videos and they're little they're a

505
00:23:07,480 --> 00:23:10,359
Speaker 3: little cynical. They think I'm a little too positive about

506
00:23:10,359 --> 00:23:12,639
Speaker 3: Gorman and I understand that. I mean, he's got to

507
00:23:12,760 --> 00:23:14,480
Speaker 3: prove over a long period of time.

508
00:23:15,119 --> 00:23:16,800
Speaker 4: But when I.

509
00:23:16,720 --> 00:23:21,040
Speaker 3: See him not hacking at everything, and I see him

510
00:23:21,119 --> 00:23:24,080
Speaker 3: content to take walks and he's not, I see a

511
00:23:24,119 --> 00:23:27,840
Speaker 3: guy that no longer is going to like beat himself

512
00:23:27,920 --> 00:23:28,639
Speaker 3: all the time.

513
00:23:29,359 --> 00:23:30,600
Speaker 4: Dude, he's gonna He's not.

514
00:23:30,680 --> 00:23:34,239
Speaker 3: The he's not he's not as easy as out as

515
00:23:34,240 --> 00:23:36,760
Speaker 3: he used to be, not even closed. So he's not

516
00:23:36,800 --> 00:23:39,560
Speaker 3: gonna do the pictures favored by by hacking it stuff.

517
00:23:39,720 --> 00:23:43,480
Speaker 3: You know, it's a foot outside or whatever. When you

518
00:23:43,520 --> 00:23:46,240
Speaker 3: see a guy like since late May, you know he's

519
00:23:46,280 --> 00:23:51,119
Speaker 3: got a walk rate that's like thirteen percent, and you

520
00:23:51,160 --> 00:23:54,800
Speaker 3: know he's either first or second in every major category

521
00:23:54,880 --> 00:23:57,920
Speaker 3: on this team, and even his batting average since late

522
00:23:57,920 --> 00:23:59,040
Speaker 3: May is two fifty one.

523
00:23:59,160 --> 00:24:01,720
Speaker 4: I think he's coming. I really do.

524
00:24:01,920 --> 00:24:04,800
Speaker 3: And I know what about the defense, Bernie, I know,

525
00:24:05,960 --> 00:24:08,080
Speaker 3: got to smooth that out. He's got to get better.

526
00:24:08,600 --> 00:24:11,719
Speaker 3: But I think he has finally figured something out at

527
00:24:11,720 --> 00:24:13,520
Speaker 3: the plate. And I think if you're the Cardinals, that's

528
00:24:13,520 --> 00:24:14,200
Speaker 3: pretty exciting.

529
00:24:14,960 --> 00:24:16,840
Speaker 1: I couldn't agree with you more. In that walk rate,

530
00:24:16,960 --> 00:24:18,439
Speaker 1: not only is it a career high, I think it's

531
00:24:18,480 --> 00:24:21,080
Speaker 1: thirteen point two percent, coming into play Sunday. It's also

532
00:24:21,119 --> 00:24:23,880
Speaker 1: in the top eight percent of baseball. And when you're

533
00:24:23,920 --> 00:24:26,520
Speaker 1: looking at the strides Nolan Gorman needed to make offensively.

534
00:24:26,560 --> 00:24:29,160
Speaker 1: We talked about this before. It's about the approach. There's

535
00:24:29,160 --> 00:24:30,760
Speaker 1: always going to be swinging, missing his game. That's the

536
00:24:30,760 --> 00:24:33,359
Speaker 1: trade off for power. But there couldn't be a swing

537
00:24:33,400 --> 00:24:36,320
Speaker 1: and misrate strikeout percentage of nearly forty percent like last year.

538
00:24:36,400 --> 00:24:38,679
Speaker 1: That's just not competitive. That will not ply at the

539
00:24:38,680 --> 00:24:40,560
Speaker 1: major league level. So how do you fix that. You

540
00:24:40,640 --> 00:24:43,280
Speaker 1: change your approach, and all the underlying metrics suggest that

541
00:24:43,320 --> 00:24:45,760
Speaker 1: those changes are happening a higher walk rate. I think

542
00:24:45,800 --> 00:24:48,760
Speaker 1: a strikeout rate is under thirty percent this year, So

543
00:24:48,880 --> 00:24:50,960
Speaker 1: that's super encouraging given to where it was at this

544
00:24:51,000 --> 00:24:53,919
Speaker 1: point last year. With rates down, the average is up

545
00:24:53,920 --> 00:24:56,199
Speaker 1: a little bit, and he hasn't sacrificed a ton of

546
00:24:56,200 --> 00:24:57,639
Speaker 1: his power at the expense of that.

547
00:24:57,880 --> 00:24:59,200
Speaker 2: So yeah, the defense is.

548
00:24:59,119 --> 00:25:01,000
Speaker 1: Going to be a concern, trying to find a position

549
00:25:01,040 --> 00:25:04,560
Speaker 1: for him. They can't have next year seven left handed dhs. Okay,

550
00:25:04,600 --> 00:25:06,680
Speaker 1: they just can't do it. But I like what we've

551
00:25:06,680 --> 00:25:08,840
Speaker 1: seen from Gorman and I'm interested to see how September

552
00:25:08,840 --> 00:25:11,080
Speaker 1: looks for him as he closes out the season. Another

553
00:25:11,119 --> 00:25:12,840
Speaker 1: guy that I think is kind of under the radar

554
00:25:12,920 --> 00:25:15,600
Speaker 1: right now and is taking advantage of opportunity that he

555
00:25:15,600 --> 00:25:16,919
Speaker 1: probably wasn't going to get.

556
00:25:17,280 --> 00:25:19,720
Speaker 2: But because Nolan Arnatto got hurt, he's back.

557
00:25:20,040 --> 00:25:23,880
Speaker 1: We're seeing better selection and better quality of contact from

558
00:25:23,920 --> 00:25:26,400
Speaker 1: Thomas to jac. I think the biggest criticism you can

559
00:25:26,400 --> 00:25:28,119
Speaker 1: make from s JC this year, minus the fact that

560
00:25:28,119 --> 00:25:30,320
Speaker 1: he was just a little raw and a little inexperienced,

561
00:25:30,440 --> 00:25:31,919
Speaker 1: was that he swung at pretty much everything.

562
00:25:32,119 --> 00:25:34,320
Speaker 2: And he's a contact hitter. He's a good hitter, so

563
00:25:34,480 --> 00:25:34,959
Speaker 2: I get it.

564
00:25:35,280 --> 00:25:38,920
Speaker 1: But we're seeing him have slightly better approach and get

565
00:25:38,920 --> 00:25:41,240
Speaker 1: acclimated more and more to the major leagues. I like

566
00:25:41,280 --> 00:25:43,520
Speaker 1: that he can play around the diamond. I like that

567
00:25:43,600 --> 00:25:46,240
Speaker 1: each week you seem to find gradual improvement. I'm not

568
00:25:46,280 --> 00:25:48,480
Speaker 1: saying that he's a superstar or someone to build around

569
00:25:48,480 --> 00:25:50,840
Speaker 1: next year, but for a player who wasn't supposed to

570
00:25:50,880 --> 00:25:52,640
Speaker 1: see a lot of playing time in the majors this year,

571
00:25:52,920 --> 00:25:55,639
Speaker 1: but because of injuries and because of availability, he has

572
00:25:56,040 --> 00:25:58,000
Speaker 1: this second half. We're seeing a lot of improvement from

573
00:25:58,000 --> 00:26:00,479
Speaker 1: to JC, and that excites me going into twenty six

574
00:26:00,560 --> 00:26:01,680
Speaker 1: for him.

575
00:26:01,520 --> 00:26:03,840
Speaker 3: And I would throw in because this again, I'm enjoying

576
00:26:03,880 --> 00:26:07,360
Speaker 3: this discussion. I think Alec Burlison has checked a lot

577
00:26:07,359 --> 00:26:10,360
Speaker 3: of boxes this year. You know that last season, if

578
00:26:10,359 --> 00:26:12,280
Speaker 3: you go by way to runs great plus, he was

579
00:26:12,320 --> 00:26:15,919
Speaker 3: six percent above league average offensively. This year he's twenty percent.

580
00:26:16,000 --> 00:26:18,200
Speaker 3: So this is a second year in a row he's

581
00:26:18,200 --> 00:26:20,879
Speaker 3: taken a pretty big leak. But what I like about

582
00:26:20,880 --> 00:26:23,919
Speaker 3: it is he's swinging at more strikes, and that's a

583
00:26:23,920 --> 00:26:26,640
Speaker 3: bit that was a huge thing he had to do.

584
00:26:27,400 --> 00:26:30,000
Speaker 4: He would he would he makes contacts.

585
00:26:29,400 --> 00:26:33,040
Speaker 3: With pitches wherever they are. So he was making contact

586
00:26:33,119 --> 00:26:34,840
Speaker 3: last year even though he's really good. But when he

587
00:26:34,880 --> 00:26:36,720
Speaker 3: when he sort of faded out late or when he

588
00:26:36,760 --> 00:26:39,520
Speaker 3: had problems early, the root cause of it.

589
00:26:39,320 --> 00:26:40,680
Speaker 4: Was he's hitting.

590
00:26:40,800 --> 00:26:43,440
Speaker 3: He was swinging and connecting with the pitchers pitch rather

591
00:26:43,480 --> 00:26:44,160
Speaker 3: than his pitch.

592
00:26:44,600 --> 00:26:44,800
Speaker 4: You know.

593
00:26:44,960 --> 00:26:46,720
Speaker 3: So yeah, oh, you know, a guy can throw the

594
00:26:46,760 --> 00:26:48,720
Speaker 3: foot outside, he'll still put the ball in play. He's

595
00:26:48,720 --> 00:26:52,920
Speaker 3: got great bathtball skills. But he's being more selective. He's

596
00:26:52,920 --> 00:26:57,040
Speaker 3: punishing strikes a lot more consistently than he did last year,

597
00:26:57,440 --> 00:26:59,520
Speaker 3: and he seems to be waiting for a pitch that

598
00:26:59,600 --> 00:27:02,960
Speaker 3: he can so you know, he's twenty six years old.

599
00:27:03,040 --> 00:27:06,240
Speaker 3: He's not a kid, and he's got, oh, I don't

600
00:27:06,280 --> 00:27:11,680
Speaker 3: know about, almost fifteen hundred career played appearances, So he's

601
00:27:11,720 --> 00:27:14,919
Speaker 3: not a baby. But these last two years we have

602
00:27:15,040 --> 00:27:17,920
Speaker 3: seen what he can become. And I thought this year

603
00:27:18,000 --> 00:27:20,439
Speaker 3: was a big year for him because he got above

604
00:27:20,440 --> 00:27:22,840
Speaker 3: average last year, but there were still some bad habits,

605
00:27:23,080 --> 00:27:24,680
Speaker 3: it's swing decisions basically.

606
00:27:25,160 --> 00:27:27,600
Speaker 4: This year we've seen him take it to another level.

607
00:27:27,680 --> 00:27:30,480
Speaker 3: And I think there's even another level because anybody that

608
00:27:30,600 --> 00:27:35,439
Speaker 3: strong and anybody that has such superb contact skills like

609
00:27:35,520 --> 00:27:39,600
Speaker 3: he does, the more refined his approach, the more the

610
00:27:39,640 --> 00:27:42,720
Speaker 3: ball will fly, more extra base hits. I think he's

611
00:27:42,760 --> 00:27:44,840
Speaker 3: got a chance to maybe, you know, take it up

612
00:27:44,920 --> 00:27:48,320
Speaker 3: to thirty thirty five percent above average next season. So

613
00:27:48,760 --> 00:27:51,400
Speaker 3: it sounds weird because you and I are being optimistic

614
00:27:51,440 --> 00:27:52,879
Speaker 3: about several Cardinals hitters.

615
00:27:52,920 --> 00:27:56,400
Speaker 4: But listen, the entire offense has not been good this year.

616
00:27:56,440 --> 00:28:00,720
Speaker 3: We all know that, but that that doesn't mean we

617
00:28:00,760 --> 00:28:04,960
Speaker 3: should dismiss or condemn everybody who's in the lineup. There

618
00:28:05,000 --> 00:28:08,320
Speaker 3: are some bright spots that the problem is they're just

619
00:28:08,359 --> 00:28:11,120
Speaker 3: gonna have to add on to that and they're gonna

620
00:28:11,119 --> 00:28:12,640
Speaker 3: have to do the things you and I have talked about.

621
00:28:12,640 --> 00:28:14,800
Speaker 3: They're gonna have to alleviate these log dams. They're gonna

622
00:28:14,800 --> 00:28:17,359
Speaker 3: have to offload a left handed bat or two. So

623
00:28:17,920 --> 00:28:21,640
Speaker 3: but I do think it's important to recognize there's some

624
00:28:21,680 --> 00:28:24,359
Speaker 3: good stuff here, you know, you know, even though we

625
00:28:24,400 --> 00:28:27,639
Speaker 3: all get down on the team, let's be fair, there

626
00:28:28,240 --> 00:28:31,440
Speaker 3: really are some good things happening with some of these

627
00:28:31,440 --> 00:28:32,639
Speaker 3: individual hitters.

628
00:28:32,920 --> 00:28:35,359
Speaker 1: Agreed, agreed, And we talked about this before, Bernie, but

629
00:28:35,920 --> 00:28:38,800
Speaker 1: it's there are plenty of supplementary pieces on this roster.

630
00:28:38,880 --> 00:28:40,960
Speaker 2: The pieces just don't always fit because they are redundant.

631
00:28:41,160 --> 00:28:44,760
Speaker 1: But once you clear that out and you have a

632
00:28:44,800 --> 00:28:47,600
Speaker 1: better constructed active roster coming into next year or in

633
00:28:47,640 --> 00:28:50,680
Speaker 1: twenty twenty seven, some of these pieces can really augment

634
00:28:50,720 --> 00:28:52,880
Speaker 1: a lineup. They just need a star or two to

635
00:28:52,880 --> 00:28:55,240
Speaker 1: build around. That's not coming this year, that's not coming

636
00:28:55,240 --> 00:28:57,880
Speaker 1: in twenty twenty six. But if you're looking for the

637
00:28:57,920 --> 00:29:00,440
Speaker 1: future of the long term future of this organization, some

638
00:29:00,520 --> 00:29:02,400
Speaker 1: of these players and what they're showing right now.

639
00:29:02,440 --> 00:29:04,680
Speaker 2: I mean, we just went through four of them as.

640
00:29:04,520 --> 00:29:06,760
Speaker 1: They have maybe the peak in the prime of their careers,

641
00:29:07,200 --> 00:29:10,680
Speaker 1: will be key instrumental role players and hopefully the organization

642
00:29:10,760 --> 00:29:12,840
Speaker 1: is in a better spot to add a couple of stars,

643
00:29:13,160 --> 00:29:15,360
Speaker 1: and you'll see the Cardinals hopefully on the mend in

644
00:29:15,400 --> 00:29:16,120
Speaker 1: a couple of years.

645
00:29:16,120 --> 00:29:17,760
Speaker 2: That would be the dream, I would say.

646
00:29:17,880 --> 00:29:21,040
Speaker 3: Right, And I know one other thing to mention since

647
00:29:21,080 --> 00:29:23,320
Speaker 3: we're talking about next season, I mean.

648
00:29:24,640 --> 00:29:26,360
Speaker 4: JJ Weatherholt.

649
00:29:27,320 --> 00:29:30,240
Speaker 3: We already knew that this dude is potentially a great

650
00:29:30,320 --> 00:29:33,000
Speaker 3: hitter as far as like batting average, drawn walks, things

651
00:29:33,040 --> 00:29:35,800
Speaker 3: like that. The one question that I think was almost

652
00:29:35,880 --> 00:29:41,040
Speaker 3: universally held by independent evaluators is that, listen, he's probably

653
00:29:41,080 --> 00:29:42,760
Speaker 3: not going to be a twenty to twenty five home

654
00:29:42,840 --> 00:29:47,080
Speaker 3: run guy. Although your colleague, my friend Keith Law had

655
00:29:47,120 --> 00:29:50,080
Speaker 3: started to change his assessment and was saying, you know,

656
00:29:50,120 --> 00:29:52,000
Speaker 3: I think Keith Law told me he said, no, the

657
00:29:52,000 --> 00:29:54,320
Speaker 3: power is going to come. It's just a matter of

658
00:29:54,320 --> 00:29:55,880
Speaker 3: when it's going to come. He's just too good of

659
00:29:55,920 --> 00:29:58,800
Speaker 3: a hitter to where he understands what he's got to

660
00:29:58,840 --> 00:30:01,040
Speaker 3: do to hit for more power without like sort of

661
00:30:01,040 --> 00:30:03,560
Speaker 3: breaking his whole swing and messing himself up.

662
00:30:04,200 --> 00:30:06,040
Speaker 4: And it's actually.

663
00:30:05,680 --> 00:30:08,640
Speaker 3: Phenomenal this year the way he has made adjustments that

664
00:30:08,720 --> 00:30:10,960
Speaker 3: he is hitting for power now, a lot of power,

665
00:30:11,840 --> 00:30:12,760
Speaker 3: like every level.

666
00:30:12,840 --> 00:30:13,280
Speaker 4: He's been.

667
00:30:13,600 --> 00:30:15,959
Speaker 3: You know, you look at a ball last summer, then

668
00:30:15,960 --> 00:30:17,680
Speaker 3: you look at double A for the first part of

669
00:30:17,720 --> 00:30:21,239
Speaker 3: this year. Now triple A his isolated power number and

670
00:30:21,280 --> 00:30:22,600
Speaker 3: his slugging percentage.

671
00:30:23,440 --> 00:30:24,400
Speaker 4: That stuff is just.

672
00:30:24,400 --> 00:30:27,200
Speaker 3: Going up and up and up and up. And you know,

673
00:30:27,360 --> 00:30:30,320
Speaker 3: you look at him at Memphis. The dude is slugging

674
00:30:30,400 --> 00:30:34,560
Speaker 3: six point fifty in Memphis. And yet he hasn't He

675
00:30:34,640 --> 00:30:36,640
Speaker 3: hasn't sacrificed plate discipline.

676
00:30:37,080 --> 00:30:38,960
Speaker 4: I mean, he's still drawn a ton of walks.

677
00:30:39,000 --> 00:30:41,840
Speaker 3: He is striking out a little bit more, but he

678
00:30:41,920 --> 00:30:45,640
Speaker 3: has not like sacrificed contact or being able to hit

679
00:30:45,680 --> 00:30:46,800
Speaker 3: for high average.

680
00:30:46,480 --> 00:30:47,120
Speaker 4: Or draw walks.

681
00:30:47,160 --> 00:30:50,880
Speaker 3: He hasn't sacrificed that, even though he has adjusted his

682
00:30:50,960 --> 00:30:54,040
Speaker 3: swing to get to get more pull power, get the

683
00:30:54,080 --> 00:30:56,360
Speaker 3: ball in the air to the pull side. But this

684
00:30:56,520 --> 00:30:59,720
Speaker 3: tells us why he's such a great hitter, because he

685
00:30:59,720 --> 00:31:02,560
Speaker 3: he's waiting for pitches to do that. He's not just

686
00:31:02,640 --> 00:31:05,680
Speaker 3: going up there to, like, you know, randomly helter Skelter

687
00:31:05,880 --> 00:31:08,560
Speaker 3: try to pull a home run. He knows what he

688
00:31:09,040 --> 00:31:11,520
Speaker 3: when he sees the ball coming out of a pitcher's hand,

689
00:31:11,960 --> 00:31:14,400
Speaker 3: he knows right away, oh that's something I can drive.

690
00:31:15,000 --> 00:31:16,720
Speaker 4: And because he's so smart, So.

691
00:31:18,320 --> 00:31:22,720
Speaker 3: I was really excited about JJ Weatherholt before this, but

692
00:31:22,840 --> 00:31:25,880
Speaker 3: then it's like, well wait a minute. Now he's turning

693
00:31:25,920 --> 00:31:28,120
Speaker 3: on pitches and hitting him a mile and.

694
00:31:28,000 --> 00:31:32,400
Speaker 4: He's slug in six point fifty. It's like whoa. So

695
00:31:32,560 --> 00:31:34,640
Speaker 4: there was a lot more power there and we're starting

696
00:31:34,640 --> 00:31:35,000
Speaker 4: to see it.

697
00:31:35,000 --> 00:31:37,560
Speaker 3: That's pretty exciting. If you're a Cardinals fan. You got

698
00:31:37,600 --> 00:31:38,560
Speaker 3: to be excited about that.

699
00:31:39,160 --> 00:31:41,840
Speaker 1: See Cardinals fan so much to look forward to. It's

700
00:31:41,840 --> 00:31:43,800
Speaker 1: not always room and gloom. Well at it's not on

701
00:31:43,880 --> 00:31:44,600
Speaker 1: this episode.

702
00:31:44,760 --> 00:31:46,600
Speaker 2: All right, we'll hear from Arena Club and we'll wrap

703
00:31:46,600 --> 00:31:48,800
Speaker 2: this episode up real quick. Guess what's still no timeframe

704
00:31:48,800 --> 00:31:52,920
Speaker 2: for when this game could start. It is what it is.

705
00:31:53,000 --> 00:31:56,360
Speaker 6: We'll be right back, Okay, Krats, I opened up Arena Club,

706
00:31:56,560 --> 00:31:59,400
Speaker 6: put my own money in there, and I wasn't gonna

707
00:31:59,440 --> 00:31:59,720
Speaker 6: go big.

708
00:31:59,760 --> 00:31:59,880
Speaker 1: I know.

709
00:32:00,040 --> 00:32:02,720
Speaker 6: We went over the Ruby pack a week ago. This time,

710
00:32:02,840 --> 00:32:05,400
Speaker 6: I just went for the low level pack where it's

711
00:32:05,440 --> 00:32:07,719
Speaker 6: an easy entry point twenty five bucks. You can get

712
00:32:07,760 --> 00:32:10,880
Speaker 6: yourself a big boy card. The Grail has many good options.

713
00:32:11,280 --> 00:32:13,280
Speaker 6: I slice open the pack. We're looking at it if

714
00:32:13,320 --> 00:32:15,960
Speaker 6: you're watching us right now, and I pull a card

715
00:32:16,080 --> 00:32:20,200
Speaker 6: from the nineteen fifties. Super cool. I enjoyed the experience

716
00:32:20,280 --> 00:32:23,040
Speaker 6: looking at it. It's Jim Gilliam, It's the top set

717
00:32:23,080 --> 00:32:24,080
Speaker 6: from the mid fifties.

718
00:32:24,560 --> 00:32:25,080
Speaker 4: It's cool.

719
00:32:25,120 --> 00:32:28,480
Speaker 6: It's a Brooklyn Dodger. But it's worth more than the card.

720
00:32:28,520 --> 00:32:30,680
Speaker 6: Like I said, I'm gonna sell it back. I got

721
00:32:30,680 --> 00:32:32,959
Speaker 6: twenty eight bucks instantly, so I can buy another one

722
00:32:33,000 --> 00:32:34,920
Speaker 6: of those packs and try and get what I want.

723
00:32:36,040 --> 00:32:40,080
Speaker 7: Absolutely the excitement I heard Kip say before. The excitement's

724
00:32:40,120 --> 00:32:42,440
Speaker 7: in the chase. You sold it back. Now you get

725
00:32:42,440 --> 00:32:44,760
Speaker 7: to open another one. I enjoy when you slide it

726
00:32:44,800 --> 00:32:47,640
Speaker 7: across the screen there and the pack opens, you.

727
00:32:47,600 --> 00:32:48,120
Speaker 4: Know where to go.

728
00:32:48,280 --> 00:32:51,200
Speaker 6: Arenaclub dot com slash foul twenty percent off your first

729
00:32:51,200 --> 00:32:52,400
Speaker 6: slab pack or card purchase.

730
00:32:52,480 --> 00:32:53,040
Speaker 4: Get after it.

731
00:32:55,160 --> 00:32:55,400
Speaker 2: Okay.

732
00:32:55,480 --> 00:32:57,280
Speaker 1: So for those of you wondering why the Cardinals who

733
00:32:57,280 --> 00:32:59,440
Speaker 1: are now in our four of a random a it's

734
00:32:59,440 --> 00:32:59,880
Speaker 1: not funny.

735
00:33:00,040 --> 00:33:00,719
Speaker 2: It's not funny.

736
00:33:00,840 --> 00:33:03,400
Speaker 1: If I was in Tampa right now, I would be irate.

737
00:33:03,480 --> 00:33:05,640
Speaker 1: There is nothing worse when you are a beat writer

738
00:33:06,200 --> 00:33:08,040
Speaker 1: to be on the very last day of a road

739
00:33:08,040 --> 00:33:11,440
Speaker 1: trip on getaway day and have a home game on

740
00:33:11,560 --> 00:33:13,680
Speaker 1: the next day, than to have a delay because you're

741
00:33:13,720 --> 00:33:15,800
Speaker 1: not making any of your flights, you're gonna have to

742
00:33:15,800 --> 00:33:19,640
Speaker 1: scramble both, especially if you're on deadline, then you got

743
00:33:19,640 --> 00:33:21,240
Speaker 1: to fly out the first thing on Monday morning. It's

744
00:33:21,240 --> 00:33:23,600
Speaker 1: going to cost your company so much money. And then

745
00:33:23,600 --> 00:33:25,160
Speaker 1: you're going to show up to the first game the

746
00:33:25,200 --> 00:33:28,760
Speaker 1: homestand just completely done, just completely exhausted, and you'll never

747
00:33:28,800 --> 00:33:31,280
Speaker 1: get a chance to catch up. So my sympathy, use

748
00:33:31,320 --> 00:33:35,440
Speaker 1: my heartfelt sympathies to the writer's breathe the elements out

749
00:33:35,480 --> 00:33:35,959
Speaker 1: in Tampa.

750
00:33:36,160 --> 00:33:37,200
Speaker 2: But so no update.

751
00:33:37,240 --> 00:33:39,000
Speaker 1: And the reason why the Cardinals and Rays are waiting

752
00:33:39,080 --> 00:33:41,520
Speaker 1: so long to draw this out, I believe is because

753
00:33:41,920 --> 00:33:43,840
Speaker 1: there is no mutual off day that works for both

754
00:33:43,880 --> 00:33:46,000
Speaker 1: teams for the rest of the season, so they almost

755
00:33:46,080 --> 00:33:47,080
Speaker 1: have to play today.

756
00:33:47,560 --> 00:33:49,400
Speaker 2: I don't know if the weather is going to let them.

757
00:33:50,120 --> 00:33:51,320
Speaker 2: Then it becomes complicated.

758
00:33:51,800 --> 00:33:53,280
Speaker 1: I don't really know if either of these teams are

759
00:33:53,280 --> 00:33:56,160
Speaker 1: going to have playoff implications, So maybe it won't, but

760
00:33:56,240 --> 00:33:58,600
Speaker 1: too early, not laid enough in the season to firmly

761
00:33:58,640 --> 00:34:02,160
Speaker 1: dictate that. So maybe we'll see Matthew Libertorre tonight. If not,

762
00:34:02,240 --> 00:34:04,040
Speaker 1: we'll probably see him Monday to kick off a four

763
00:34:04,080 --> 00:34:06,640
Speaker 1: game set. And no, I also don't know the Pirates probables,

764
00:34:06,640 --> 00:34:10,200
Speaker 1: I'll get there, but I'm excited to see McGreevy pitch

765
00:34:10,239 --> 00:34:13,880
Speaker 1: this homestand Polante needs to show something. I don't know

766
00:34:13,880 --> 00:34:17,160
Speaker 1: what got to show something this Homestand and then three,

767
00:34:17,440 --> 00:34:19,759
Speaker 1: I guess kind of competitive series or games against the

768
00:34:19,840 --> 00:34:21,000
Speaker 1: Reds coming up this weekend.

769
00:34:21,320 --> 00:34:22,600
Speaker 2: Bernie, as we end.

770
00:34:22,480 --> 00:34:24,920
Speaker 1: This episode on a positive note, like the positive people

771
00:34:24,920 --> 00:34:27,439
Speaker 1: that we are, what's one thing that you are.

772
00:34:27,360 --> 00:34:29,799
Speaker 2: Hoping to see from the team against the Pirates.

773
00:34:32,239 --> 00:34:35,160
Speaker 3: That's a really good question. I just want to see

774
00:34:35,200 --> 00:34:40,239
Speaker 3: more consistent bets from this offense. You know, they we

775
00:34:40,280 --> 00:34:43,040
Speaker 3: all know it's a limited offense as far as upside,

776
00:34:43,600 --> 00:34:47,200
Speaker 3: but I just I want to see better situational hitting.

777
00:34:49,120 --> 00:34:53,719
Speaker 3: I want to see maybe less chasing. They're just they

778
00:34:53,800 --> 00:34:56,120
Speaker 3: just need to be a little sharper minded about their

779
00:34:56,160 --> 00:35:00,600
Speaker 3: approach and over long, long period of the sea and

780
00:35:00,920 --> 00:35:04,520
Speaker 3: I mean, you'll go through phases where you know, you're

781
00:35:04,600 --> 00:35:07,319
Speaker 3: just not sharp, you're tired, you're mentally tired, and people

782
00:35:07,360 --> 00:35:08,399
Speaker 3: don't want to hear it, but it's true.

783
00:35:08,400 --> 00:35:11,000
Speaker 4: It's a nature of the schedule mentally.

784
00:35:11,120 --> 00:35:13,920
Speaker 3: Yeah, right, And but there's still a lot of guys

785
00:35:13,920 --> 00:35:15,439
Speaker 3: that have a lot to prove and they know they're

786
00:35:15,440 --> 00:35:22,360
Speaker 3: playing for future considerations, and so I never have doubted

787
00:35:22,440 --> 00:35:25,120
Speaker 3: at any point their motivation. There was one series where

788
00:35:25,120 --> 00:35:28,040
Speaker 3: I thought they didn't maybe compete as well as I

789
00:35:28,080 --> 00:35:29,359
Speaker 3: was used to seeing. I mean, I was a little

790
00:35:29,400 --> 00:35:32,440
Speaker 3: disappointing that, but I never I never doubt that they're

791
00:35:32,480 --> 00:35:34,799
Speaker 3: going to compete and play hard. They went through that

792
00:35:34,840 --> 00:35:37,879
Speaker 3: stretch obviously where you know, you looked up and it's

793
00:35:37,920 --> 00:35:39,960
Speaker 3: the second inning and you're down five to nothing.

794
00:35:40,000 --> 00:35:42,919
Speaker 4: All the time, you're not gonna look that great.

795
00:35:43,120 --> 00:35:44,879
Speaker 3: Yeah, when you're in a that deep of a hole

796
00:35:45,000 --> 00:35:47,840
Speaker 3: over and over and over again, you're you're gonna look flat.

797
00:35:47,920 --> 00:35:51,120
Speaker 4: That's just the nature. That's human nature. But anyway, Yeah,

798
00:35:51,120 --> 00:35:52,879
Speaker 4: I just would like to see this.

799
00:35:52,840 --> 00:35:56,840
Speaker 3: Offense get more consistent because it's been kind of a long, slow,

800
00:35:57,000 --> 00:35:59,120
Speaker 3: gradual decline for this as a team.

801
00:35:59,719 --> 00:36:01,240
Speaker 4: I can see finished strong.

802
00:36:02,160 --> 00:36:05,920
Speaker 1: All right, let's manifest that some more consistency, some good weather.

803
00:36:06,239 --> 00:36:08,840
Speaker 1: We're gonna finally hopefully fingers cross the windows down in

804
00:36:08,840 --> 00:36:09,399
Speaker 1: the press box.

805
00:36:09,440 --> 00:36:12,680
Speaker 2: Haven't had that since May. Yeah, Bernie, this was fun.

806
00:36:13,080 --> 00:36:16,440
Speaker 1: Hopefully our viewers can find some silver linings here. As

807
00:36:16,440 --> 00:36:19,480
Speaker 1: we finished the season for as Natural and justified as

808
00:36:19,520 --> 00:36:21,520
Speaker 1: the frustration and apathy is about this team.

809
00:36:22,400 --> 00:36:24,680
Speaker 2: I do think at least we have a path forward.

810
00:36:24,760 --> 00:36:26,279
Speaker 1: It might be a little bit of a lengthy one,

811
00:36:26,320 --> 00:36:27,960
Speaker 1: but at least we're no longer sitting where we were

812
00:36:27,960 --> 00:36:29,960
Speaker 1: a couple of seasons ago with a big question mark

813
00:36:30,000 --> 00:36:31,719
Speaker 1: like when is this going to get better? I think

814
00:36:31,719 --> 00:36:33,839
Speaker 1: the Cardinals are on their way to having it get better.

815
00:36:33,880 --> 00:36:36,680
Speaker 1: It's going to take some time, but there's a blueprint,

816
00:36:36,680 --> 00:36:39,000
Speaker 1: there's a foundation in place, so hopefully the team can

817
00:36:39,040 --> 00:36:39,640
Speaker 1: stick to it.

818
00:36:39,760 --> 00:36:41,760
Speaker 2: A couple of housekeeping items for you all.

819
00:36:42,120 --> 00:36:44,279
Speaker 1: You can visit the Cardinal Territory shop dot com for

820
00:36:44,400 --> 00:36:46,600
Speaker 1: first look at new merch. I use my Cardinal Territory

821
00:36:46,680 --> 00:36:50,399
Speaker 1: mug this morning, and I have a Cardinal Territory Devil bag,

822
00:36:50,400 --> 00:36:53,480
Speaker 1: which is great because I've decided to drive to Cincinnati,

823
00:36:53,880 --> 00:36:54,839
Speaker 1: so I need to use.

824
00:36:54,760 --> 00:36:58,799
Speaker 2: It for my luggage. Why I'm driving Cincinnati, Oh, because

825
00:36:58,800 --> 00:36:59,719
Speaker 2: I forgot to book a flight.

826
00:36:59,640 --> 00:37:01,879
Speaker 1: And they're two expensive. So that is why it wasn't

827
00:37:01,920 --> 00:37:04,239
Speaker 1: my decision. It was a loser. You had one job,

828
00:37:04,560 --> 00:37:07,719
Speaker 1: so go check out the merge. We're hovering right around

829
00:37:07,760 --> 00:37:11,040
Speaker 1: four point five thousand subscribers. Let's get to five k

830
00:37:11,280 --> 00:37:13,839
Speaker 1: we'll do a giveaway. Really appreciate the support of the show.

831
00:37:13,880 --> 00:37:15,440
Speaker 1: I know Bernie does too, Bernie, what do you got

832
00:37:15,440 --> 00:37:16,359
Speaker 1: cooking up next week?

833
00:37:17,200 --> 00:37:20,360
Speaker 4: Oh? Just the usual. I will be doing some first

834
00:37:21,200 --> 00:37:24,960
Speaker 4: STL Sports Central. I'll be doing some college football stuff

835
00:37:24,960 --> 00:37:25,239
Speaker 4: this week.

836
00:37:25,320 --> 00:37:25,440
Speaker 1: You know.

837
00:37:25,480 --> 00:37:28,200
Speaker 4: Missoo opens our season on Thursday. I do. I love

838
00:37:28,360 --> 00:37:30,960
Speaker 4: college football. What are you doing? Who are you? Who

839
00:37:30,960 --> 00:37:31,719
Speaker 4: are you waving there?

840
00:37:31,760 --> 00:37:33,160
Speaker 2: What is that?

841
00:37:33,239 --> 00:37:36,040
Speaker 4: Oh? That's right, that's right? Of course? Please for please.

842
00:37:35,880 --> 00:37:40,960
Speaker 1: Number eleven in the country only going up from here.

843
00:37:40,280 --> 00:37:42,880
Speaker 3: They were awfully good man. It was a great story

844
00:37:42,960 --> 00:37:46,440
Speaker 3: last year. So no, I'm looking forward to college football,

845
00:37:46,719 --> 00:37:50,319
Speaker 3: you know, Katie. One of the reasons why people think

846
00:37:50,360 --> 00:37:52,080
Speaker 3: I'm just making this up, I'm not. One of the

847
00:37:52,480 --> 00:37:54,520
Speaker 3: reasons why I was. I had a big decision to

848
00:37:54,520 --> 00:37:57,600
Speaker 3: make with leave the Post Dispatch or stay, and I

849
00:37:57,640 --> 00:38:00,400
Speaker 3: was doing the you know, you're right down the reasons

850
00:38:00,440 --> 00:38:05,680
Speaker 3: to go, reasons to stay, and the tipping point was, well,

851
00:38:05,920 --> 00:38:08,320
Speaker 3: I wouldn't too, I wouldn't have to travel hundred and

852
00:38:08,320 --> 00:38:10,480
Speaker 3: fifty nights a year anymore. Number I was the number one.

853
00:38:10,560 --> 00:38:13,160
Speaker 3: Number two, I get to watch if I if I

854
00:38:13,280 --> 00:38:16,440
Speaker 3: quit the newspaper business, I get to watch all the

855
00:38:16,520 --> 00:38:20,880
Speaker 3: college football I want every Saturday from eleven am all

856
00:38:20,920 --> 00:38:22,160
Speaker 3: the way up until midnight.

857
00:38:22,719 --> 00:38:24,880
Speaker 2: Yes, twelve, never forget.

858
00:38:25,440 --> 00:38:29,680
Speaker 3: I love watching college football. Like you have no idea

859
00:38:30,000 --> 00:38:33,799
Speaker 3: how excited I am every Saturday morning. So yeah, so

860
00:38:33,840 --> 00:38:36,160
Speaker 3: I'm pretty fired up because, like I know, there were

861
00:38:36,160 --> 00:38:41,000
Speaker 3: some games this weekend, but but this coming Saturday, Uh,

862
00:38:41,960 --> 00:38:45,160
Speaker 3: you know, let's go, you know, Ohio State versus Texas.

863
00:38:45,280 --> 00:38:46,759
Speaker 4: That's pretty good. That's pretty good game.

864
00:38:47,160 --> 00:38:49,600
Speaker 1: So I'm I feel like college football is the one

865
00:38:49,600 --> 00:38:51,440
Speaker 1: sport that I can really still be a fan of

866
00:38:51,920 --> 00:38:54,359
Speaker 1: because I have like some weird personal connection obviously because

867
00:38:54,400 --> 00:38:56,759
Speaker 1: I went to Arizona State, so I'm very invested in there.

868
00:38:56,760 --> 00:38:59,320
Speaker 2: All of a sudden, good again football program. Uh.

869
00:38:59,360 --> 00:39:03,239
Speaker 1: And there is nothing better than like a November Saturday afternoon.

870
00:39:03,960 --> 00:39:04,400
Speaker 2: There's like a.

871
00:39:04,440 --> 00:39:06,120
Speaker 1: Chill in the air and you're sitting down and you

872
00:39:06,120 --> 00:39:09,040
Speaker 1: watch college football all day. And people someone called that

873
00:39:09,040 --> 00:39:11,200
Speaker 1: de generously, I would tell them to get a life,

874
00:39:11,280 --> 00:39:14,200
Speaker 1: because there was really nothing like that type of Saturday

875
00:39:14,400 --> 00:39:16,480
Speaker 1: when it starts in the morning, and then you know,

876
00:39:16,600 --> 00:39:18,239
Speaker 1: if your team plays in the afternoon, they better win

877
00:39:18,280 --> 00:39:20,000
Speaker 1: because the rest of the games for after that are done.

878
00:39:20,040 --> 00:39:22,239
Speaker 2: But in my perfect world. ASU goes undefeated and.

879
00:39:22,239 --> 00:39:25,040
Speaker 1: I'm happy for the rest of the off season. So look,

880
00:39:26,080 --> 00:39:29,279
Speaker 1: this season is like whatever. But if you have a

881
00:39:29,280 --> 00:39:33,759
Speaker 1: college football team, maszoo. I don't know, if you're Mike

882
00:39:33,760 --> 00:39:36,920
Speaker 1: gersh Notre Dame on the Rise probably doesn't want to

883
00:39:36,920 --> 00:39:39,000
Speaker 1: face ASU in in any bowl game. I get that,

884
00:39:39,239 --> 00:39:42,680
Speaker 1: But there are things to look forward to in this positivity.

885
00:39:42,120 --> 00:39:44,319
Speaker 3: Right and then then you see, you know, I grew

886
00:39:44,360 --> 00:39:48,480
Speaker 3: up in Annapolis and I love Navy football. Yeah see see,

887
00:39:48,560 --> 00:39:52,319
Speaker 3: i'd probably display that that that Navy uh watch all

888
00:39:52,320 --> 00:39:55,920
Speaker 3: their games too, So yeah, there's like a little kid

889
00:39:56,920 --> 00:39:59,000
Speaker 3: like it's one of the great weeks of the year.

890
00:39:59,280 --> 00:40:02,960
Speaker 4: So any way, all right, I'm fired up. We talked

891
00:40:03,000 --> 00:40:04,080
Speaker 4: to a little college football.

892
00:40:04,080 --> 00:40:07,760
Speaker 1: I love it, I know, and only good things. If

893
00:40:07,800 --> 00:40:09,600
Speaker 1: I do loses, don't ever talk to me. But if

894
00:40:09,600 --> 00:40:11,040
Speaker 1: they win, expect me to bring it up on the

895
00:40:11,080 --> 00:40:13,600
Speaker 1: show for the rest of the season.

896
00:40:13,719 --> 00:40:16,080
Speaker 2: So yeah, all right, Bertie, we will.

897
00:40:15,920 --> 00:40:19,080
Speaker 1: Talk again Cardinal Territory Friends next week. Got some fun

898
00:40:19,120 --> 00:40:20,960
Speaker 1: things lined up in terms of interviews once I actually

899
00:40:21,000 --> 00:40:22,719
Speaker 1: nail those down. But I promise I'm getting to that

900
00:40:23,400 --> 00:40:24,000
Speaker 1: for Bertie.

901
00:40:24,040 --> 00:40:24,520
Speaker 2: I'm Katie.

902
00:40:24,560 --> 00:40:26,680
Speaker 1: Thanks for watching. Cardinal territory. Maybe the Cardins will play

903
00:40:26,680 --> 00:40:28,279
Speaker 1: a game today, maybe not, but either way, we'll be

904
00:40:28,320 --> 00:40:43,760
Speaker 1: back with you next week