WEBVTT - Taking A Life To Save Another 0:00:00.200 --> 0:00:02.080 We're not just talking about self defense here. We're talking 0:00:02.120 --> 0:00:07.680 about at the stake of your wife's life. An intruder 0:00:07.720 --> 0:00:11.200 breaks into your house and he is going to kill 0:00:11.920 --> 0:00:25.560 members of your family. Well, what's up, everybody? Welcome to 0:00:25.600 --> 0:00:30.200 the podcast. A special episode for me, maybe special episode 0:00:30.200 --> 0:00:34.319 for you two. I don't know, absolutely so, everybody. This 0:00:34.400 --> 0:00:40.400 is Marv miller, a, a Mennonite pastor. But that's really 0:00:40.440 --> 0:00:43.440 irrelevant compared to what I'm about to say next. Long 0:00:43.600 --> 0:00:48.480 time listener to the podcast, first listener to the podcast 0:00:48.840 --> 0:00:49.680 turned guest. 0:00:51.520 --> 0:00:52.880 I should pat myself on the back. 0:00:53.440 --> 0:00:57.880 That's how literally how we met was through this podcast. Yeah, 0:00:58.120 --> 0:01:01.400 you emailed the podcast. That's what we do here. I 0:01:01.560 --> 0:01:05.480 just read your emails and you were one of the emails, 0:01:06.200 --> 0:01:09.600 and it was very intriguing to me. I'm not exactly 0:01:09.640 --> 0:01:12.880 sure it wasn't that it was more special than other emails, 0:01:13.440 --> 0:01:17.119 but something in my spirit says, reply to this guy. 0:01:18.440 --> 0:01:21.520 And that reply. We can't remember if it was two 0:01:21.560 --> 0:01:25.120 or three years ago you emailed, but that reply led 0:01:25.160 --> 0:01:29.400 to a brotherhood between you and I, a friendship that 0:01:29.480 --> 0:01:34.319 has grown just from one email and from my reply. 0:01:34.720 --> 0:01:36.720 That led to a few more replies that led to 0:01:36.760 --> 0:01:40.039 a phone call between us. You live in South Carolina 0:01:40.280 --> 0:01:43.840 with your family. I live in Texas. We then met 0:01:43.880 --> 0:01:47.400 in Pittsburgh for a concert of mine. 0:01:47.240 --> 0:01:48.440 Yes, just last September. 0:01:48.560 --> 0:01:52.800 Last September, and then there was a conference, a pastor's 0:01:52.840 --> 0:01:57.560 conference in Austin, and I said, hey, Marv, what about 0:01:57.560 --> 0:02:01.200 you come to this pastor's conference and come stay with 0:02:01.280 --> 0:02:04.520 us in the barn. So that's literally what you've been 0:02:04.520 --> 0:02:07.360 doing the last three or four days is staying here 0:02:07.560 --> 0:02:11.160 at the house. And now you're on the podcast the 0:02:11.200 --> 0:02:15.079 same place, full circle where we first met. I think 0:02:15.080 --> 0:02:18.000 it's just a it's a fascinating story just for me 0:02:18.720 --> 0:02:21.520 what this podcast has done in the friendship that like, 0:02:21.600 --> 0:02:25.000 if if nothing else mattered on this podcast, I got 0:02:25.040 --> 0:02:26.080 a great friend out of it. 0:02:26.639 --> 0:02:30.400 Yeah. Well, it's it's really an honor and it feels 0:02:30.440 --> 0:02:33.680 so undeserving to actually be here. I was talking with 0:02:33.720 --> 0:02:36.160 my wife the other day and it just feels like 0:02:36.639 --> 0:02:40.400 we're walking on holy ground here because, like she said, 0:02:40.400 --> 0:02:43.240 there's no reason on earth that we should be here, 0:02:43.919 --> 0:02:49.280 and the likelihood of Granger reaching out, like if you're 0:02:49.320 --> 0:02:53.880 reaching out to an email that I sent, you know 0:02:53.880 --> 0:02:55.760 what caught your attention and why did you decide to 0:02:55.800 --> 0:02:58.720 reach out to me, and I just love the thought 0:02:58.760 --> 0:03:01.840 that are you know what I wrote. I wrote a 0:03:01.840 --> 0:03:04.520 little bit of my testimony, and somehow our spirits connected 0:03:04.760 --> 0:03:11.480 in that email. And definitely our friendship was built off 0:03:11.520 --> 0:03:14.960 of our spiritual connection. And that's we're not really friends 0:03:15.120 --> 0:03:18.360 as much as we're brothers. True and uh and so 0:03:18.480 --> 0:03:21.280 to actually be able to well, when I started listening 0:03:21.320 --> 0:03:27.679 to your podcast, I connected with your perspective. It resonated 0:03:27.720 --> 0:03:30.160 with me when I when I listened and I had 0:03:30.160 --> 0:03:33.200 first heard your music, and then when I started actually 0:03:34.000 --> 0:03:36.520 uh listening to the podcast, which I I'm not sure 0:03:36.560 --> 0:03:38.560 at what point I found out you actually had a podcast, 0:03:39.200 --> 0:03:41.840 I want to start listening to it. I knew right 0:03:41.880 --> 0:03:44.520 away that your life was changed and you had found 0:03:44.560 --> 0:03:48.080 what you're looking for. And of course I wasn't always 0:03:48.120 --> 0:03:50.520 making the connection between what you were saying in your 0:03:50.520 --> 0:03:52.680 podcast and some of the music, and that that was 0:03:52.760 --> 0:03:54.840 the curious question. That's why I emailed you. 0:03:55.080 --> 0:03:56.880 Yeah you want me to tell them, because yeah, you do, 0:03:57.000 --> 0:03:59.400 because they might be thinking, what in the world did 0:03:59.400 --> 0:04:01.880 he say? In an E that made Granger actually reply 0:04:01.920 --> 0:04:03.640 because I never ever reply. 0:04:04.320 --> 0:04:06.240 I just instead put him in the queue. 0:04:06.520 --> 0:04:09.960 By the way, that email is podcast at grangersmith dot com. 0:04:10.160 --> 0:04:12.520 You email and we answer your questions. That's what the 0:04:12.560 --> 0:04:15.920 format is. You emailed, and I, instead of putting it 0:04:15.920 --> 0:04:17.520 in the queue to read it on the podcast, I 0:04:17.520 --> 0:04:20.560 felt compelled to reply. People might be thinking, what was it? Well, 0:04:20.920 --> 0:04:24.160 it was part of your testimony. But then the end 0:04:24.480 --> 0:04:27.479 was what will you do? I'm paraphrasing, what will you 0:04:27.480 --> 0:04:31.600 do with Earl Dibbles Junior? And how will that how 0:04:31.640 --> 0:04:33.919 will that character still bring people to the truth? 0:04:34.279 --> 0:04:36.679 Yes, like, how do you connect Earl Dibbles with your faith? 0:04:37.040 --> 0:04:38.280 Yeah? 0:04:38.320 --> 0:04:42.599 And at the time when you emailed, I already knew 0:04:43.080 --> 0:04:46.880 that I was going to Lord willing leave touring, that 0:04:46.920 --> 0:04:50.000 things were going to change for me, and you are 0:04:50.080 --> 0:04:54.400 almost eluding it. Hey, you know that the road you're on, 0:04:54.839 --> 0:04:56.680 you know where this is headed. If you take, if 0:04:56.680 --> 0:04:59.960 you take what you believe Granger to its fullest extent, 0:05:01.240 --> 0:05:03.480 you're going to start leaving the secular life behind. 0:05:03.920 --> 0:05:06.760 Yes, you knew that in a way, Yes, yes, I did. 0:05:06.839 --> 0:05:08.680 I mean that's exactly so it's. 0:05:08.920 --> 0:05:12.239 Either that or you don't really believe what you're saying, 0:05:12.279 --> 0:05:12.520 do you. 0:05:13.120 --> 0:05:15.120 I was so curious how you're going to make the connection, 0:05:15.200 --> 0:05:17.680 because I was thinking, I've heard you talk enough. I 0:05:18.040 --> 0:05:21.080 know you've had to have thought about this, and because 0:05:21.080 --> 0:05:25.360 I knew at that point, well, you weren't just living 0:05:25.400 --> 0:05:27.880 two different lives. I knew you had made a connection somehow. 0:05:27.880 --> 0:05:31.200 There was some reason that you were singing the songs 0:05:31.200 --> 0:05:33.560 you were singing, but then also sharing the faith you 0:05:33.600 --> 0:05:36.160 were sharing. And not every song, of course, there was 0:05:36.200 --> 0:05:39.440 a few that caught my attention, and I think the 0:05:40.240 --> 0:05:43.600 first one that really made me start thinking, I need 0:05:43.600 --> 0:05:45.440 to ask him a question. And I never told you this, 0:05:45.560 --> 0:05:48.760 but was the song if You're Happy in if your 0:05:48.760 --> 0:05:51.360 Country and you know it raised a beer? Yeah, And 0:05:51.400 --> 0:05:55.480 that was a children's song that I knew growing up, 0:05:55.480 --> 0:05:57.200 If You're happy and you know it clap your hands. 0:05:57.440 --> 0:05:59.880 And then this was like a rewritten song, and so 0:06:00.000 --> 0:06:02.919 so I thought, now, how does he connect that with 0:06:03.040 --> 0:06:05.440 his with what I hear you say on the podcast. 0:06:06.000 --> 0:06:09.640 And that's what really made me start thinking about the question. 0:06:10.160 --> 0:06:13.560 Not that well, I'm I'm from the men Inite culture, 0:06:13.600 --> 0:06:16.440 and so that just caught my attention. That song that 0:06:16.480 --> 0:06:19.880 you'd taken a children's song and rewrote it into a 0:06:19.920 --> 0:06:22.400 country song like that, I knew there was a connection somehow, 0:06:22.400 --> 0:06:24.080 so I was looking forward to hearing you explain it 0:06:24.640 --> 0:06:29.599 when you actually emailed back and said, I'm trying to 0:06:29.600 --> 0:06:32.800 remember exactly what your words were. He said, a lot 0:06:32.839 --> 0:06:34.440 will be changing for me in the next ten to 0:06:34.480 --> 0:06:37.320 twelve months, and I don't think Earl will be making 0:06:37.360 --> 0:06:39.080 the journey with me. I think that's what she said. 0:06:39.080 --> 0:06:41.919 It took me off guard. I expected to hear some 0:06:42.120 --> 0:06:45.599 kind of a response of well, this is the reason 0:06:45.960 --> 0:06:49.719 I sing this and then I say this, and not 0:06:49.800 --> 0:06:52.040 everybody may say there was a conflict or anything. It 0:06:52.080 --> 0:06:56.960 was just sure. It was just that question that your 0:06:57.000 --> 0:07:00.600 answer that was just well I'm actually changing directtions here 0:07:01.520 --> 0:07:04.440 was so authentic and so honest and just it really 0:07:04.440 --> 0:07:08.240 caught me off guard. And then I knew you were 0:07:08.279 --> 0:07:11.880 for real when you responded what you did that like 0:07:11.960 --> 0:07:14.240 took all the doubtside of my mind. So then after that, 0:07:14.280 --> 0:07:16.880 listening to your podcast is where I It's like your 0:07:16.880 --> 0:07:19.840 perspective connected with me, and I just built a trust 0:07:19.880 --> 0:07:22.360 off of the perspective. You know, I may have given 0:07:22.360 --> 0:07:25.040 different answers different times as a as a pastor. I 0:07:25.120 --> 0:07:29.280 love listening to your podcast because it I run those 0:07:29.360 --> 0:07:32.080 questions and then your answers through my head all the time. 0:07:32.200 --> 0:07:34.239 You know, when when I do counseling, when we're meeting 0:07:34.280 --> 0:07:37.360 with young couples or young people, you know, we're essentially 0:07:37.400 --> 0:07:41.080 sitting across the campfire from people in person. We have 0:07:41.120 --> 0:07:44.800 them in our living room a lot, and those questions 0:07:44.840 --> 0:07:50.240 have really given me years worth of experience in just knowing, oh, 0:07:50.280 --> 0:07:52.440 this is the direction that would be good to go 0:07:52.840 --> 0:07:56.040 with a question like this, So what does this really 0:07:56.120 --> 0:07:56.480 help me? 0:07:56.640 --> 0:07:57.640 What is this room? 0:07:58.840 --> 0:08:01.400 The perspective of sitting in this chair looking out instead 0:08:01.400 --> 0:08:04.800 of looking from the camera in how does that perspective 0:08:05.000 --> 0:08:05.280 for you? 0:08:05.360 --> 0:08:06.000 What is that like? 0:08:06.120 --> 0:08:09.040 Well, I had no idea what to expect, and I'm 0:08:09.160 --> 0:08:14.520 not familiar with talking on a podcast, especially not with 0:08:14.760 --> 0:08:18.520 like a video podcast, and. 0:08:18.600 --> 0:08:21.320 So I weird, looks great on video. 0:08:22.600 --> 0:08:24.880 We'll wait, We'll have to wait and make that call. 0:08:26.120 --> 0:08:30.800 But so so, sitting here, it feels surreal, really it does. 0:08:32.679 --> 0:08:37.320 But it's in another way, it feels just like you 0:08:37.360 --> 0:08:40.079 and I are having a conversation. It really does. It's 0:08:40.120 --> 0:08:44.160 a it's a nice atmosphere you have here and I'm 0:08:44.160 --> 0:08:45.400 looking forward to. 0:08:45.520 --> 0:08:48.360 And that's so cool, And you're speaking for all the 0:08:48.400 --> 0:08:50.400 people that have listened as long as you have for 0:08:50.480 --> 0:08:54.000 several years, that have wondered what it might be like 0:08:54.080 --> 0:08:55.240 sitting in that chair. 0:08:55.360 --> 0:08:58.120 Yeah, it's it's it's amazing. It actually feels good so far. 0:08:58.559 --> 0:09:01.719 Well, I'm not going just because you're here. I'm not 0:09:01.760 --> 0:09:03.319 going to change the format of what we do. We're 0:09:03.320 --> 0:09:06.120 still going to answer questions. And I think it would 0:09:06.120 --> 0:09:11.280 be interesting because we're both brothers in Christ. But we 0:09:11.440 --> 0:09:14.920 do come from different cultures, yes, quite different, And just 0:09:14.960 --> 0:09:17.000 like a lot of people that are listening right now 0:09:17.640 --> 0:09:21.360 come from different cultures, and that's okay, and so I 0:09:21.360 --> 0:09:26.040 think a different culture will probably prompt a different answer. 0:09:26.559 --> 0:09:29.360 Before we get started, I will say something ironic about 0:09:29.360 --> 0:09:32.760 this conversation today is that Earl Dibbles actually filmed video 0:09:32.840 --> 0:09:33.319 this morning. 0:09:34.880 --> 0:09:37.120 So Earl is not dead. He filmed the. 0:09:37.120 --> 0:09:40.000 Video because there is a girl at our office at 0:09:40.000 --> 0:09:44.319 the Yegee Farm that has a cyber truck, the Tesla truck, 0:09:44.920 --> 0:09:48.840 and so we filmed Earl's reaction to a Tesla truck 0:09:49.160 --> 0:09:50.240 and what he thinks about it. 0:09:50.360 --> 0:09:54.880 That's awesome, But the Earl these days is different. I 0:09:54.880 --> 0:09:56.199 didn't think Earl should be killed. 0:09:56.559 --> 0:09:57.160 He's not dead. 0:09:57.200 --> 0:09:59.240 How did I say he should be converted, not condemned. 0:09:59.400 --> 0:10:01.040 He should be verded. I could do it, so. 0:10:01.480 --> 0:10:01.600 Uh. 0:10:01.960 --> 0:10:04.680 The first question, by the way, if I'll say it again, 0:10:04.760 --> 0:10:09.280 the email is podcast at grangersmith dot com, and you're 0:10:09.320 --> 0:10:11.959 you're emailing my producer ant Man, who is going to 0:10:12.080 --> 0:10:14.720 put your question in Q. So we ask just don't 0:10:14.720 --> 0:10:16.920 send the same question a bunch for ant Man's sake, 0:10:17.280 --> 0:10:20.240 and don't send it longer than about a phone length, 0:10:21.080 --> 0:10:23.800 because it makes it harder to read in this in 0:10:23.880 --> 0:10:27.959 this setting. The first question and I already I've already 0:10:27.960 --> 0:10:29.960 scanned it because I could see it right now, and 0:10:30.000 --> 0:10:31.520 this is already going to be interesting with a mind 0:10:31.640 --> 0:10:34.760 night pastor. It comes from Caden. It says, Hey, Granger, 0:10:35.120 --> 0:10:39.720 what are your thoughts on concealed Carrie self defense? Is 0:10:39.760 --> 0:10:44.320 it okay to kill someone if it saves someone else's life. 0:10:44.880 --> 0:10:46.360 I know this is a deep question, and I'm just 0:10:46.400 --> 0:10:48.320 curious what your thoughts are. I enjoy your music and 0:10:48.360 --> 0:10:52.120 your podcast. Thanks Caden Anderson from Illinois. 0:10:52.120 --> 0:10:52.640 Interesting. 0:10:53.120 --> 0:10:55.800 Uh, great way to start. 0:10:56.160 --> 0:10:59.160 I'm really interested in this because in the mind of 0:10:59.200 --> 0:11:04.400 night culture, you. 0:11:02.360 --> 0:11:03.280 You follow the. 0:11:04.800 --> 0:11:10.959 I don't want to say law, you follow the. 0:11:08.720 --> 0:11:10.559 Teaching, teaching of. 0:11:12.320 --> 0:11:13.160 Non resistance. 0:11:13.240 --> 0:11:16.280 Is that what it's called, that of non resistance, and 0:11:16.320 --> 0:11:19.400 that's that's literally taking the Gospel to the fullest extent 0:11:19.480 --> 0:11:23.800 of believing Jesus when he says, love your enemies, turn 0:11:23.840 --> 0:11:30.160 the other cheek. So I'll start with you, Marv. What 0:11:30.240 --> 0:11:34.560 are your thoughts. Of course, we're not just talking about 0:11:34.559 --> 0:11:37.120 self defense here. We're talking about at the stake of 0:11:37.160 --> 0:11:43.360 your wife's life, an intruder breaks into your house and 0:11:43.400 --> 0:11:47.160 he is going to kill members of your family. I 0:11:47.160 --> 0:11:49.360 would love to hear your answer on that. 0:11:50.400 --> 0:11:57.000 So the the worst case scenario is something that is 0:11:57.040 --> 0:12:00.679 always given out as an example. Sure, so this is 0:12:00.160 --> 0:12:03.520 a worst case scenario, and let me just go ahead. 0:12:03.559 --> 0:12:09.920 Very very rare for this scenario to happen. If if 0:12:10.760 --> 0:12:13.360 once in a lifetime, that's one in a thousand families. 0:12:13.800 --> 0:12:16.079 I don't personally know anyone that this has actually happened to, 0:12:16.600 --> 0:12:18.840 but you're right, we throw the exception out. 0:12:18.880 --> 0:12:19.800 Is what do you do here? 0:12:20.080 --> 0:12:23.040 So I'm not trying to trap you, no gotcha or 0:12:23.200 --> 0:12:25.160 just I'm asking. 0:12:24.960 --> 0:12:26.040 What everyone is thinking. 0:12:26.320 --> 0:12:29.199 Yes, okay, yes, and worst case scenario is actually good 0:12:29.200 --> 0:12:31.080 to talk about because it can give you then a 0:12:31.120 --> 0:12:34.560 good precedent to build off of for other scenarios that 0:12:34.640 --> 0:12:38.880 are not worst case, but often they don't have good answers. 0:12:39.400 --> 0:12:43.080 So I can give good things to think about. But 0:12:44.000 --> 0:12:47.000 the thought of and this is a conversation that has 0:12:47.040 --> 0:12:49.760 been happening for a long time around a lot of 0:12:49.760 --> 0:12:54.480 dinner tables and couches, and even around Mennonite dinner tables, 0:12:54.600 --> 0:12:58.120 what if this would happen? What would you do? And 0:12:58.840 --> 0:13:01.680 it's hard to know what you would do. For me, 0:13:01.880 --> 0:13:04.880 I don't know what I would do. So the position 0:13:04.960 --> 0:13:07.640 that I generally take, and I don't condemn someone for 0:13:07.720 --> 0:13:10.280 taking a different position. I have good friends that that 0:13:10.400 --> 0:13:17.640 actually carry and they actually have a weapon of self 0:13:17.679 --> 0:13:23.360 defense at their disposal. I've decided to take the position. Well, 0:13:23.360 --> 0:13:25.960 I've decided to not put myself in a position where 0:13:25.960 --> 0:13:29.840 I have to decide I'm going to use a weapon 0:13:29.880 --> 0:13:33.240 that can kill someone or not, And so I don't. 0:13:33.280 --> 0:13:36.080 I don't sleep with a pistol beside my bed. I 0:13:36.080 --> 0:13:39.120 don't have a pistol that I carry on me on 0:13:39.160 --> 0:13:44.400 a regular basis. And I've chosen not to do that because, well, 0:13:44.440 --> 0:13:46.280 for me, it comes down to it, it's a it's 0:13:46.320 --> 0:13:49.360 a step of faith, because I would want nothing better 0:13:49.440 --> 0:13:52.839 than to be able to fully protect my family. I'm 0:13:52.880 --> 0:13:56.320 a protector and a provider, but I'm also called to 0:13:56.320 --> 0:14:00.240 trust God. And by by saying that, I'm not saying 0:14:00.280 --> 0:14:03.959 that someone that decides to have concealed cary and actually 0:14:04.360 --> 0:14:07.440 use a weapon isn't trusting God. I'm just speaking for myself, 0:14:07.480 --> 0:14:10.160 and I think i'd be speaking to for a lot 0:14:10.200 --> 0:14:13.800 within the culture, it's a step of faith to decide 0:14:13.800 --> 0:14:15.880 to not put yourself in that position where you have 0:14:15.920 --> 0:14:20.760 to make that choice. And a lot of times, you know, 0:14:20.760 --> 0:14:23.840 we would look at the scripture where Jesus would would 0:14:23.880 --> 0:14:26.080 have told his disciples that he that lives by the 0:14:26.120 --> 0:14:29.560 sword will die by the sword paraphrasing there. Sure, but 0:14:29.640 --> 0:14:34.960 that if you decide to have that as your protection, 0:14:35.160 --> 0:14:37.600 then very likely that will have to be your protection. 0:14:39.640 --> 0:14:40.920 That's just something to think about. 0:14:41.160 --> 0:14:41.320 Now. 0:14:41.560 --> 0:14:43.600 Great, I would love to hear your thoughts. I don't 0:14:43.640 --> 0:14:45.560 know if you have any other questions for me, I'd 0:14:45.560 --> 0:14:47.360 be happy to answer. That's just the short version of 0:14:47.440 --> 0:14:48.840 kind of where we find ourselves. 0:14:49.600 --> 0:14:53.680 That's that's building up to it. So now it happens 0:14:54.080 --> 0:14:58.040 you're saying your answer is I don't know what I 0:14:58.040 --> 0:15:01.520 would do but I'm not putting myself in a position 0:15:01.600 --> 0:15:04.720 to have something readily available to kill, right. 0:15:04.920 --> 0:15:09.280 Okay, Yes, that's not saying that I wouldn't use what 0:15:09.360 --> 0:15:11.880 I have to try to take care of the situation. 0:15:12.000 --> 0:15:13.680 But for sure i'd be crying out to the Lord 0:15:13.720 --> 0:15:16.320 in a situation that like that, knowing that he's actually 0:15:16.320 --> 0:15:19.120 seeing what's happening, and that it's certainly not in my 0:15:19.240 --> 0:15:22.760 heart to It's not from a position of being a 0:15:22.800 --> 0:15:28.160 coward or a position of not shouldering my responsibility. We 0:15:28.200 --> 0:15:30.360 want to shoulder our responsibility as men with all our 0:15:30.400 --> 0:15:34.760 hearts in our culture. But it would be the Anabaptists, 0:15:34.800 --> 0:15:38.000 and the position of non resistance would largely be taken 0:15:38.040 --> 0:15:43.200 from Jesus attitude of if my servants, if my disciples 0:15:43.760 --> 0:15:47.000 were of this world, if my kingdom was of this world, 0:15:47.000 --> 0:15:48.720 then would my servants fight. I think that's how he 0:15:48.760 --> 0:15:50.920 said it. If my kingdom was of this world, then 0:15:50.960 --> 0:15:53.960 would my servants servants fight? But now my kingdom's not 0:15:53.960 --> 0:15:57.320 not from here, And based on that, he let the 0:15:57.560 --> 0:16:01.520 Jews and the Romans capture him and cify him. And 0:16:02.160 --> 0:16:05.480 whether that's a totally accurate interpretation of that verse, I 0:16:05.480 --> 0:16:07.880 think that's where a kind of a foundational verse for 0:16:07.920 --> 0:16:11.840 the Mennonites to live a non resistant life, and it's 0:16:12.280 --> 0:16:15.240 been a blessed life. You know, the Mennonites were severely 0:16:15.280 --> 0:16:20.200 persecuted when they first broke off of the Catholic Church 0:16:20.480 --> 0:16:24.040 back in the beginning of like in the fifteen hundreds, 0:16:24.080 --> 0:16:28.040 and it was their non resistant stance that really made 0:16:28.040 --> 0:16:30.360 them who they were. It was kind of their their 0:16:30.400 --> 0:16:36.400 foundation of one of their foundational beliefs away from the beginning. 0:16:37.240 --> 0:16:38.840 So there's just some stuff to think about. 0:16:38.920 --> 0:16:44.440 Yeah, I don't have a problem with anything you said, 0:16:45.400 --> 0:16:48.800 and I don't know if I would answer it differently. 0:16:49.920 --> 0:16:54.160 I love though, I love the idea that I'm not 0:16:54.280 --> 0:16:57.680 going to have something on me that would tempt me 0:16:58.320 --> 0:17:00.640 to taking a life because I've I've joked in the 0:17:00.640 --> 0:17:03.360 past with Amber like as a Christian, Well, I'm taking 0:17:03.360 --> 0:17:06.879 out all the kneecaps. I'm gonna take out their kneecaps 0:17:06.880 --> 0:17:08.480 and I'm gonna preach the gospel to them. 0:17:08.560 --> 0:17:09.240 I can't say that. 0:17:10.720 --> 0:17:13.200 My head as I'm wrapping a tourniquet around their leg 0:17:14.080 --> 0:17:16.119 in my living room. Yes, in the middle of the night, 0:17:16.119 --> 0:17:18.000 I'm wrapping a tourniquet around their leg and telling them 0:17:18.040 --> 0:17:20.200 about Jesus with nine to one one in my left hand. 0:17:20.240 --> 0:17:25.000 You know that's I like that, I do, but it's 0:17:25.040 --> 0:17:27.480 going to another level saying and I'm also not going 0:17:27.560 --> 0:17:30.000 to have anything in my house that would tempt me 0:17:30.520 --> 0:17:33.600 to blow in their head off, because who knows in 0:17:33.600 --> 0:17:36.680 that moment if that's what you would be tempted to do. 0:17:37.800 --> 0:17:39.840 I don't have a problem with your answer. 0:17:40.720 --> 0:17:46.320 I I think, first of all, once again, I have 0:17:46.359 --> 0:17:48.520 to reiterate on this podcast. Right now, we're talking about 0:17:48.520 --> 0:17:54.119 an extreme, isolated occurrence that is very very rare. To 0:17:54.640 --> 0:17:58.320 sleep with a pistol under your pillow for this kind 0:17:58.320 --> 0:18:00.720 of scenario is as like winning the lottery if it 0:18:00.760 --> 0:18:06.159 actually happened, especially living in a first world country. And 0:18:06.200 --> 0:18:09.040 there are a lot of people that will disagree, but 0:18:09.160 --> 0:18:13.960 I would challenge them to test their heart and their faith. 0:18:15.880 --> 0:18:16.960 If that. 0:18:18.760 --> 0:18:22.000 Resistance in their mind to this idea is coming from 0:18:22.160 --> 0:18:24.520 culture or coming from God. 0:18:25.359 --> 0:18:25.840 That's good. 0:18:26.000 --> 0:18:27.600 There are biblical. 0:18:27.240 --> 0:18:31.840 Arguments to make for an armed resistance. There are biblical 0:18:31.960 --> 0:18:38.520 arguments from thirteen. For Christians serving in law enforcement or military, 0:18:38.560 --> 0:18:41.000 there is a biblical argument for it, and there's a 0:18:41.000 --> 0:18:44.440 biblical argument against it. People email. You've probably heard all 0:18:44.480 --> 0:18:48.960 the time. I feel a calling to go into the military, 0:18:49.000 --> 0:18:52.119 but I'm now I'm torn as a Christian if I 0:18:52.160 --> 0:18:54.840 should be someone who kills. I know that we have 0:18:54.880 --> 0:18:57.200 a lot of stories in World War Two where there 0:18:57.240 --> 0:19:00.560 was a draft and people went in. They followed the 0:19:00.680 --> 0:19:04.720 Romans thirteen governmental rule of going into the draft because 0:19:04.760 --> 0:19:07.360 that's that was the law. But then when they got 0:19:07.359 --> 0:19:10.800 into the to the army, they said, I will not 0:19:10.920 --> 0:19:14.119 carry a weapon. I'll do anything else. I will carry 0:19:14.119 --> 0:19:19.240 the coffee, I'll help with the tourniquets, I'll carry the 0:19:19.680 --> 0:19:20.720 sick out. 0:19:20.920 --> 0:19:22.199 But I can't. I can't. 0:19:22.280 --> 0:19:25.879 I need a religious exemption for carrying a weapon. So 0:19:26.440 --> 0:19:31.199 we do see a faithful authority to Romans thirteen carrying 0:19:31.240 --> 0:19:36.399 out the law and a faithful observance to Jesus in 0:19:36.520 --> 0:19:39.560 non resistance. So I think it could it can work. 0:19:40.320 --> 0:19:43.720 There's arguments either way. I think if you were going 0:19:43.760 --> 0:19:45.720 to fall on one side and say this is the 0:19:45.800 --> 0:19:49.400 side I'm falling on, I think non resistance is decide. 0:19:49.080 --> 0:19:49.560 To fall on. 0:19:50.800 --> 0:19:55.000 Well. I think sometimes there's not explicit, like you said, 0:19:55.080 --> 0:20:00.480 arguments both ways. It's not always completely clear or right 0:20:00.520 --> 0:20:04.280 and wrong, But sometimes there's blessing that goes with believing 0:20:04.760 --> 0:20:07.400 a certain way. The thing with you could say, the 0:20:07.440 --> 0:20:10.760 thing that we could fault on as non resistant people 0:20:11.880 --> 0:20:15.399 is that non resistance is a lifestyle. It's not just 0:20:15.520 --> 0:20:20.080 deciding not to carry a pistol. But often we would 0:20:20.160 --> 0:20:22.760 draw a line there, we're not going to kill someone, 0:20:22.800 --> 0:20:25.920 but then we really don't live non resistant in other 0:20:25.960 --> 0:20:27.919 areas of our life. And for us to really believe that, 0:20:28.000 --> 0:20:32.159 you know, we're not typically involved in the court system, 0:20:32.160 --> 0:20:35.919 we're not typically involved in we're not considered patriotic, we 0:20:36.000 --> 0:20:41.840 don't involve ourselves in governmental affairs in general. Now, Mennonites, 0:20:42.480 --> 0:20:45.440 they're kind of on a spectrum of conservative liberal. I 0:20:45.480 --> 0:20:47.960 guess that's the right words to use. But sure there's 0:20:48.040 --> 0:20:51.120 some that are more involved than others, for sure, But 0:20:51.200 --> 0:20:54.280 in general, we would consider that a lifestyle, not just 0:20:54.560 --> 0:20:59.600 an instance based or a specific thing like carrying a pistol. 0:21:00.320 --> 0:21:04.240 You're you're doing such a great job, and I'm it's 0:21:04.240 --> 0:21:06.480 occurring to me as we're talking that I also don't 0:21:06.480 --> 0:21:09.040 want to put you in a in a situation because 0:21:09.080 --> 0:21:12.240 you are a pastor representing your church, and you're also 0:21:12.320 --> 0:21:16.359 representing a culture and and there are many Mennonites that 0:21:16.400 --> 0:21:18.760 listen to this podcast, many Amish, which maybe we could 0:21:18.800 --> 0:21:21.240 talk later about the difference between the two, since a 0:21:21.280 --> 0:21:24.720 lot of people associate the two cultures together. 0:21:24.440 --> 0:21:25.159 Even though they're not. 0:21:26.600 --> 0:21:29.119 So I don't want to put you in this situation. 0:21:29.560 --> 0:21:31.320 I don't I don't okay, put in I don't want 0:21:31.359 --> 0:21:31.600 to put you. 0:21:31.640 --> 0:21:32.960 I don't want to put you in a corner. 0:21:33.200 --> 0:21:35.640 It feels like an opportunity for me. Great, and it's 0:21:35.760 --> 0:21:36.560 wonderful great. 0:21:36.840 --> 0:21:38.600 You know, the question has often come up to me 0:21:38.880 --> 0:21:41.760 where people say, what was your first dance at your 0:21:41.760 --> 0:21:45.280 wedding with Amber? What song did you use? And my 0:21:45.359 --> 0:21:48.560 answer is, I wrote my own song. And that's just 0:21:48.640 --> 0:21:51.560 kind of what I've always done, and that's been what 0:21:51.600 --> 0:21:55.320 I've enjoyed doing, is capturing a moment with lyrics and 0:21:55.359 --> 0:21:58.000 melody and then and then making that very special moment 0:21:58.000 --> 0:22:00.920 of our lives live forever through that song. So then 0:22:00.960 --> 0:22:03.240