WEBVTT - Ep. 314: Skip the Flip 0:00:08.960 --> 0:00:13.320 This is Me eat podcast coming at you shirtless, severely 0:00:13.480 --> 0:00:17.680 bug bitten, and in my case, underwear listening un podcast. 0:00:18.280 --> 0:00:23.360 You can't protet anything presented by first, like creating proven 0:00:23.640 --> 0:00:27.920 versatile hunting apparel from Marino bass layers to technical outerwear 0:00:27.960 --> 0:00:35.640 for every hunt first like go farther, stay longer. Isn't 0:00:35.640 --> 0:00:40.680 Bill Smith the most popular name? Listen, start the machine. 0:00:40.760 --> 0:00:47.080 I'll tell you listen. There are some names that the 0:00:47.080 --> 0:00:51.600 world's gonna run out of, Yes and Bill, the world 0:00:51.600 --> 0:00:55.560 will will there will be like the world will run 0:00:55.600 --> 0:00:58.240 out of bills before people get back in the name 0:00:58.240 --> 0:01:01.840 of their kids Bill, Like after Harry Potter came out, 0:01:01.880 --> 0:01:04.559 everybody named their kid Henry. They wanted to name him Harry, 0:01:06.200 --> 0:01:08.000 but they thought they knew that people know that it 0:01:08.040 --> 0:01:10.720 was because they liked those books, so they named him Henry. 0:01:11.319 --> 0:01:15.160 Huge proliferation to Henry's. I didn't know that well they were. 0:01:15.240 --> 0:01:17.319 We almost ran out of Henry's and not. Now you 0:01:17.319 --> 0:01:20.800 can't throw a rock without hitting the Henry Under all 0:01:20.840 --> 0:01:23.720 ten years older Under, I feel like we're not even 0:01:23.880 --> 0:01:27.440 runn out of bills. What about Frank? Frank seems to 0:01:27.480 --> 0:01:31.520 be dying to Okay, Yeah, my dad was frank. We 0:01:31.640 --> 0:01:35.240 almost named our daughter Frankie, so I was gonna name 0:01:35.280 --> 0:01:41.440 her frank after her paternal grandfather, and then Rose, yeah, 0:01:41.520 --> 0:01:46.640 and Rose after her paternal grandmother and great grandmother. So 0:01:46.680 --> 0:01:49.640 I was gonna name her Frankie Rose, and then found 0:01:49.640 --> 0:01:52.280 out that there's some musician named Frankie Rose and just 0:01:52.400 --> 0:01:55.800 change it to Rosemary because that's my mom's name. But yeah, 0:01:55.840 --> 0:02:00.600 we'll probably run out of Frank's, but they'll Frankie's. What 0:02:00.680 --> 0:02:05.200 about George. I think we'll get very low on George's. Yeah, 0:02:05.240 --> 0:02:08.160 but do you think there's gonna be revival. It's hard 0:02:08.200 --> 0:02:10.040 to know what's going to be revival. No one saw 0:02:10.040 --> 0:02:12.440 it coming that everyone was going to name their kid Henry. 0:02:12.440 --> 0:02:14.320 They named their kids Henry because I think they thought 0:02:14.360 --> 0:02:16.840 that they'd be smart. I like the name Henry, but 0:02:16.840 --> 0:02:20.120 I had no clue. There's like a majority of kids 0:02:20.160 --> 0:02:24.240 now are named him. I know nobody. I don't know 0:02:24.280 --> 0:02:26.519 what it was a city. You go to a city, 0:02:26.840 --> 0:02:30.040 you can't throw a rock at a playground without hitting Henry, 0:02:31.080 --> 0:02:32.799 and you think it's for Harry Potter. Do you think 0:02:32.840 --> 0:02:36.720 that's like my theory? I think it's a sound theory, 0:02:36.720 --> 0:02:38.520 but it's just I think they were, like, I really 0:02:38.520 --> 0:02:40.440 want to name him Harry, but then everybody's gonna know 0:02:40.440 --> 0:02:43.480 I like those kids books. So they named him Henry 0:02:43.520 --> 0:02:45.280 cause that seemed because it reminded them. I thought you 0:02:45.280 --> 0:02:50.119 were pulling legitimate research into that, But that's just your feelings. 0:02:51.240 --> 0:02:53.720 There's certain theories I'm into that are hard to substantiate. 0:02:53.800 --> 0:02:57.440 Like my brother Danny believes that he can't untangle in 0:02:57.560 --> 0:03:01.680 his head that Bill Clinton became president and all kids 0:03:01.720 --> 0:03:04.800 started wearing bike helmets, Like he feels that there's like 0:03:05.600 --> 0:03:08.280 he feels that something he doesn't he hasn't untangled it yet, 0:03:08.320 --> 0:03:10.440 but he feels that there was a somehow a link 0:03:11.040 --> 0:03:16.560 mhm between the Clinton presidency and for how many hundreds 0:03:16.600 --> 0:03:19.520 of years kids didn't have bike helmets and then they 0:03:19.600 --> 0:03:22.440 all got a bike helmet when Bill Clinton became president. 0:03:22.520 --> 0:03:24.400 That's his theory. So I don't know. I don't share 0:03:24.440 --> 0:03:26.480 the theory. I'm saying, like some theories are hard to 0:03:26.560 --> 0:03:29.160 like prove and disprove. They all started playing saxophone in 0:03:29.200 --> 0:03:35.160 their boxers too. Now, in terms of names, it would 0:03:35.200 --> 0:03:38.400 be interesting to know, like, just to tie this all together, 0:03:40.280 --> 0:03:47.280 did Monica drop off in prevalence following the Clinton presidency. 0:03:47.520 --> 0:03:52.400 I could see that happening very probable. I don't know, 0:03:52.640 --> 0:03:57.240 because that was during that Friend show where the peak 0:03:57.280 --> 0:04:01.400 friends popularity. Like right now, I wouldn't be surprised. And 0:04:01.440 --> 0:04:03.080 if this podcast had a different if we had a 0:04:03.080 --> 0:04:05.200 different sort of focus, we could dig into this stuff 0:04:05.200 --> 0:04:08.119 a little bit more. I wouldn't be surprised if Jeffrey, 0:04:08.320 --> 0:04:09.920 if there were some people who were going to go 0:04:10.000 --> 0:04:15.080 with Jeffrey, had a change of heart. I'm not falling 0:04:15.600 --> 0:04:21.520 the fellow named Jeffrey Epstein I'm following was hung to 0:04:21.560 --> 0:04:29.040 death in his jail cell. No, I didn't say, no, 0:04:29.640 --> 0:04:31.800 that's right. If I put it like hung to death, 0:04:31.880 --> 0:04:36.120 like someone did it, I feel like I think there's 0:04:36.120 --> 0:04:42.240 a chance that's true. Which, since we're off topic, do 0:04:42.240 --> 0:04:43.720 you want to know the leading do you want to 0:04:43.720 --> 0:04:46.840 know the leading conspiracy theory? Someone explained I didn't understand, 0:04:46.839 --> 0:04:49.560 like what they're leading. You want to the lead conspiracy 0:04:49.560 --> 0:04:53.520 theory about Epstein? This might be now, but like at 0:04:53.520 --> 0:04:56.359 a time, this was the one has explained to me 0:04:56.360 --> 0:04:59.640 by someone who traffics heavily and conspiracy theories. It was 0:04:59.720 --> 0:05:06.760 that Epstein was a massad agent. That's good man, that's 0:05:06.760 --> 0:05:10.320 old news man. Listen, Tode, I didn't if I made 0:05:10.320 --> 0:05:12.120 it up, I would have said I made it up. 0:05:12.160 --> 0:05:14.120 I'm saying this is so you know this, Sean. You 0:05:14.160 --> 0:05:16.960 follow this kind of stuff. Oh you're talking about that 0:05:17.040 --> 0:05:22.040 rabbit hole for like two years. Um, Shawn's here, Sean. 0:05:22.080 --> 0:05:23.720 We were's here to talk about ducks. But somehow and 0:05:23.839 --> 0:05:25.679 he's not a big and he's not a big Jeffrey 0:05:25.680 --> 0:05:30.360 Epstein expert o. Can you tell us the theory? Sean? Yeah, 0:05:30.400 --> 0:05:34.120 I know the link or the thing that they say 0:05:34.320 --> 0:05:37.080 is that I'll tell you this. No, you did not 0:05:37.120 --> 0:05:43.000 tell me this. Mm hmm. Is that Gallaine Maxwell, the 0:05:43.480 --> 0:05:46.760 lady that was just on trial. Yeah, as it goes, 0:05:47.160 --> 0:05:50.760 her dad was a massad. That's what they say. It 0:05:50.880 --> 0:05:54.000 starts to make some gravy m Yeah, but here you're 0:05:54.000 --> 0:05:55.360 not filling it in. Let me just fill it in. 0:05:55.480 --> 0:05:57.159 This is we're so far off. This is not what 0:05:57.240 --> 0:05:59.839 this show is about, ladies and gentlemen. It's just not 0:06:00.000 --> 0:06:02.799 what it's about. In fact, Stue Miller from Coon Creek 0:06:02.800 --> 0:06:04.719 Outdoors is here and he's supposed to be flipping a 0:06:04.760 --> 0:06:08.120 bobcat hide right now, which he's gonna explain in one second, 0:06:08.160 --> 0:06:11.520 So bear with us. We're gonna get into appropriate subject matter. 0:06:12.480 --> 0:06:17.240 Epstein was a massad agent. How he served the Massad 0:06:17.279 --> 0:06:23.480 was he would get prominent academics, politicians, financial individuals into 0:06:23.520 --> 0:06:31.320 compromising situations, film them, film them whatever he did, and 0:06:31.360 --> 0:06:35.720 then later, when Israel needed them to do or not 0:06:35.920 --> 0:06:42.520 do something, okay, they would say, oh, and by the way, 0:06:43.000 --> 0:06:46.479 we happen to have a very interesting video. You might 0:06:46.520 --> 0:06:51.760 not like to be out. And as the conspiracy theory goes, 0:06:52.320 --> 0:06:55.400 that was why Jeffrey Epstein had to be silenced on 0:06:55.440 --> 0:06:59.360 that fateful night in his jail cell while the guards 0:06:59.400 --> 0:07:06.480 slept in the security camera malfunctioned. M plausible mm hmm. Anyway, 0:07:06.720 --> 0:07:10.120 Phil looks very titillated. You can tell Phil like really 0:07:10.240 --> 0:07:12.440 want us to get into it, but he's also uncomfortable. 0:07:12.480 --> 0:07:17.239 How off subject matter this is to introduce yourself, Oh, Brodie, 0:07:17.400 --> 0:07:22.400 real quick, Brodies here Chester the die Master, which Chester 0:07:22.520 --> 0:07:24.880 is a very dying name. It's just been hanging on 0:07:25.000 --> 0:07:27.400 for like a hundred years. I feel like, yeah, I 0:07:27.400 --> 0:07:29.040 feel like that might be why I like you so much, 0:07:30.080 --> 0:07:32.920 because you're the only Chester I've ever known. The pets 0:07:32.960 --> 0:07:38.200 are keeping it alive though like dogs. Yeah, Rick Huttons here, 0:07:38.680 --> 0:07:40.679 Ses here, we're gonna talk about sets up coming wedding 0:07:40.680 --> 0:07:43.720 a little bit. I'm here, high folks. Yeah, we're also joined. 0:07:43.920 --> 0:07:46.680 He's remote, but I still feel his presidents. Sean Weavers 0:07:46.720 --> 0:07:48.880 here and he's gonna hit us with the latest installment 0:07:48.920 --> 0:07:51.160 of Shawn's Duck Report, which is one of my favorite 0:07:51.200 --> 0:07:54.400 things we do. What's up, Sean, what's going on with you? Well? 0:07:54.400 --> 0:07:58.080 I just finally got off the road after two straight 0:07:58.120 --> 0:08:00.520 months of film and Duck lawre are you duck hut 0:08:00.560 --> 0:08:04.160 and show Um I'm actually the reason I'm doing this 0:08:04.240 --> 0:08:06.280 remote is I got a little sick, got a little 0:08:06.320 --> 0:08:09.600 ran down from being on the road that long. The 0:08:09.720 --> 0:08:12.880 utility company actually called while I was gone and they 0:08:12.920 --> 0:08:17.560 wanted to check if my water meter was broke because 0:08:17.720 --> 0:08:20.120 I hadn't used any water in my place for two months, 0:08:20.880 --> 0:08:27.280 so he's been like dead or Yeah. It was kind 0:08:27.280 --> 0:08:31.160 of a nice wellness check. Knowing the utility companies got 0:08:31.160 --> 0:08:34.559 me coming, like, dude, at least someone knows what I've 0:08:34.559 --> 0:08:39.240 been gone. Also, Duck Lore, the first episode is coming 0:08:39.240 --> 0:08:43.120 out February, and that's a Texas teel hunt with me 0:08:43.320 --> 0:08:48.000 and Jean Paul and I like it. It's it's pretty cool. 0:08:48.679 --> 0:08:50.560 Walk us through a couple more episodes that are gonna 0:08:50.559 --> 0:08:54.080 be coming up. Yeah, so first few episodes are going 0:08:54.120 --> 0:08:59.000 to be Texas Teal, then Callahan and Me in North Dakota, 0:08:59.520 --> 0:09:04.880 Janna in Nebraska, and yourself in Michigan. So jumping kind 0:09:04.920 --> 0:09:10.480 of all over the Midwest. Ads. Yep, learn a lot 0:09:10.480 --> 0:09:12.040 about ducks with a guy that knows a lot about 0:09:12.080 --> 0:09:16.880 duck Seawan Weaver. Uh but okay, now, stew introduce yourself alright. 0:09:16.960 --> 0:09:20.880 So I'm Stu Miller. I uh run a couple different 0:09:20.920 --> 0:09:24.640 YouTube channels. Uh, con Creek Outdoors is the one that 0:09:24.640 --> 0:09:27.280 that I'm here for um and I'm kind of a 0:09:27.720 --> 0:09:31.640 trapper more or less. So that's how I came to 0:09:31.720 --> 0:09:35.480 meet Steve. And uh yeah, I dabble in uh trapping 0:09:35.520 --> 0:09:38.080 and for handling. So tell her everybody where you're from. 0:09:38.240 --> 0:09:42.960 I'm from Illinois, Southern Illinois. Oh we get into this 0:09:43.000 --> 0:09:48.800 for a minute. So this is on point, Phil, don't 0:09:48.800 --> 0:09:54.400 don't get nervous. I have a problem with I have 0:09:54.480 --> 0:09:56.840 a real problem with people in southern Illinois who think 0:09:56.880 --> 0:10:03.080 they're southern. And I told you to if people ice 0:10:03.160 --> 0:10:07.840 fish in your state. You are not Southern, Like, I 0:10:07.840 --> 0:10:11.360 don't care where the Mason Dixon line is. That's the thing. 0:10:12.240 --> 0:10:14.920 There's a lot of people ice fishing right now because 0:10:14.920 --> 0:10:18.000 they call this is the perfect time for this. You 0:10:18.120 --> 0:10:20.680 can't be a Southerner in a state where ice fishing 0:10:20.760 --> 0:10:29.400 is occurring. Stu says that he explained to me that 0:10:29.440 --> 0:10:32.760 there's so much dissatisfy that there's such a cultural divide 0:10:32.840 --> 0:10:36.640 between the greater Chicago area and then like the agricultural 0:10:36.800 --> 0:10:40.200 segment of Illinois, and I am I okay to say this. 0:10:41.000 --> 0:10:43.680 There's such a cultural finance, like just as a huge 0:10:43.679 --> 0:10:48.400 cultural divide that that it's pushed southern Illinois to the 0:10:48.440 --> 0:10:54.280 south in mentality rather than be associated with with the 0:10:55.240 --> 0:10:59.800 the political corruption and ongoings in Chicago. I'm saying it. Yeah, 0:11:00.120 --> 0:11:02.440 you get somebody five miles south of Chicago and they're 0:11:02.440 --> 0:11:06.320 gonna say they're from southern Yeah, they're like by which 0:11:06.360 --> 0:11:10.520 I mean not Chicago, not Chicago. I fell in love 0:11:10.559 --> 0:11:14.960 with Steve's videos because I would go, um, I found 0:11:14.960 --> 0:11:17.520 you in a totally organic way. I would be curious 0:11:17.520 --> 0:11:22.720 about how to do something with her handling, Like for instance, 0:11:23.000 --> 0:11:26.760 last year, UM a little over well over uh fourteen 0:11:26.760 --> 0:11:30.200 months ago. Um, we got onto a couple of red 0:11:30.240 --> 0:11:34.920 foxes one morning and got the red foxes. I had 0:11:34.960 --> 0:11:39.120 a little uh seventeen h mr with me. We got 0:11:39.200 --> 0:11:42.000 a breeding pair of red foxes, and I was like, 0:11:42.320 --> 0:11:43.760 I wanted to get him tanned and put up real 0:11:43.880 --> 0:11:46.280 nice And now they adorned my daughters. Actually they hanged 0:11:46.280 --> 0:11:48.320 for my daughter's bunk bead thing and she loves him, 0:11:48.920 --> 0:11:54.520 but and I wanted to like get him tanned for myself. 0:11:55.080 --> 0:11:56.640 And I used to put up red foxes and sell 0:11:56.720 --> 0:11:57.840 them when I was young. But I was just kind 0:11:57.880 --> 0:11:59.280 of curious about how to do the feet, you know, 0:11:59.320 --> 0:12:01.640 and all that kind stuff different than how you do 0:12:01.720 --> 0:12:05.040 for fur handling for fur trade. And I would get 0:12:05.120 --> 0:12:06.760 typed in like how do you do x Y and Z? 0:12:06.920 --> 0:12:09.240 And I'd wind up on your thing, or how do 0:12:09.240 --> 0:12:10.559 you do x Y and Z with a skunk? And 0:12:10.600 --> 0:12:13.200 I'd wind up on your page. So then I sent 0:12:13.200 --> 0:12:17.440 you an email and it's been we've been interacting ever since. 0:12:17.520 --> 0:12:19.360 Oh yeah, every day I asked him a question. No, 0:12:19.440 --> 0:12:22.920 it's been it's been fun. So, Um, that's how we met. 0:12:22.960 --> 0:12:24.760 We're gonna talk about that. Now. Here's what I wanted 0:12:24.800 --> 0:12:26.400 we had a lot of stuff we gotta cover off on. 0:12:26.760 --> 0:12:29.240 But I want you to to explain Grab the Bobcat 0:12:30.559 --> 0:12:33.360 and explain what's been done and what people can listen 0:12:33.400 --> 0:12:36.160 to you now do like why we did what we 0:12:36.200 --> 0:12:40.720 did and where we're at with it now. Alright, So yesterday, um, 0:12:40.840 --> 0:12:44.720 we took a bobcat that was skinned and then Steve 0:12:44.800 --> 0:12:48.000 you fleshed it and we tubeskin. Tell everybody with tub 0:12:48.080 --> 0:12:52.520 skin skin. So basically, um, the way that furs are 0:12:52.600 --> 0:12:55.760 sold through the fur market is their tube skin. And 0:12:55.800 --> 0:12:59.120 that's basically where you're gonna make a cut kind of 0:12:59.120 --> 0:13:01.280 on its back end and you're gonna kind of peel 0:13:01.360 --> 0:13:04.360 the hide off, very similar to it like taking off 0:13:04.360 --> 0:13:07.120 a sock. Basically, Yeah, that's you know, and you're gonna 0:13:07.200 --> 0:13:09.840 peel that that critter down and you're gonna end up 0:13:09.920 --> 0:13:13.080 with it. As you say, a tube of it's not 0:13:13.120 --> 0:13:15.960 gonna be cut open where you know, if you've seen 0:13:16.640 --> 0:13:20.240 like traditional pictures, you know you see where they split them, 0:13:20.400 --> 0:13:22.880 split them up the belly across the back and imagine 0:13:22.880 --> 0:13:25.079 that you're like the the incision being that like when 0:13:25.080 --> 0:13:27.839 you're gutting a deer, you make that incision all the 0:13:27.840 --> 0:13:29.280 way up to his chin, and then you've got like 0:13:29.280 --> 0:13:31.600 an open hide. So then you would lay the hide 0:13:31.679 --> 0:13:35.120 or the pelt flatways, Um this is it's not gonna 0:13:35.160 --> 0:13:37.360 look like a bear rug when you're dumb. No, it's 0:13:37.360 --> 0:13:40.120 gonna be all all together. And as like you said, 0:13:40.120 --> 0:13:42.480 a tube skin you cut, just think about like this, 0:13:42.720 --> 0:13:44.719 cut around and like the only cut you make through 0:13:44.720 --> 0:13:47.680 the hider around the ankles. Right, Yeah, that's it. So 0:13:48.120 --> 0:13:50.800 imagine that you cut around the back, cut around the 0:13:50.840 --> 0:13:55.120 rear ankle, a circle around it on each leg, and 0:13:55.120 --> 0:13:59.440 then you run a slit up to the anus, and 0:13:59.480 --> 0:14:01.880 then the whole thing comes off just like that, peel 0:14:01.880 --> 0:14:04.280 it right off. So that's what I did to that bobcat. 0:14:04.559 --> 0:14:08.280 That's a small female bobcat, small female bobcat. Yeah. And 0:14:08.320 --> 0:14:11.080 then so after it's my favorite my prize possession. My 0:14:11.120 --> 0:14:13.200 favorite thing I owned used to be my buffalo skull 0:14:13.240 --> 0:14:14.640 that I found that I wrote a book about. But 0:14:14.679 --> 0:14:18.680 now it's that we better not screwed up there. So 0:14:18.760 --> 0:14:20.720 now after you after you fleshed it, then we put 0:14:20.760 --> 0:14:23.240 on flesh and beam and we used the flesh and 0:14:23.280 --> 0:14:26.280 knife to flesh all the all the all the membrane 0:14:26.280 --> 0:14:28.040 and the fat and all the residual fats. So we 0:14:28.120 --> 0:14:31.560 got it just down to the skin. And after we 0:14:31.600 --> 0:14:35.000 did that, we split the ears because you're gonna tan 0:14:35.080 --> 0:14:36.800 it for yourself, so we wanted to make sure. You know, 0:14:36.960 --> 0:14:39.440 that's something I never had done before, So we split 0:14:39.480 --> 0:14:42.160 the ears and then we put it on a board. 0:14:43.080 --> 0:14:47.720 So different critters are sold different ways and with like 0:14:47.760 --> 0:14:51.160 a canine. So your fox or coyotes and your bobcats, 0:14:51.200 --> 0:14:53.760 all those are sold for out so you can see 0:14:53.800 --> 0:14:56.880 the the presentation the pelt. Uh. Some of your other 0:14:56.920 --> 0:15:02.000 critters like muskrats, minks, and coons, they're all sold for in. 0:15:02.760 --> 0:15:06.520 So do you know why Seth and I were speculating 0:15:06.520 --> 0:15:11.320 about that the other day? Who decided that has does 0:15:11.360 --> 0:15:13.880 it ever change? Have you ever heard of changing? Back 0:15:13.880 --> 0:15:18.080 in the day they sold coons actually flat, you would 0:15:18.120 --> 0:15:23.360 split them up. The reason that I always been told is, 0:15:23.680 --> 0:15:26.320 you know, with with a bobcat, say, and a coyote, 0:15:26.720 --> 0:15:30.080 you're you're using basically all of that. So you want 0:15:30.080 --> 0:15:33.680 to be able to visually see that that whole hide. 0:15:33.880 --> 0:15:36.320 You want you want to see the fur all of it. 0:15:36.440 --> 0:15:39.560 So whereas like on a coon, you know, we we 0:15:39.720 --> 0:15:44.080 boredom for in, but you also cut a window and 0:15:44.160 --> 0:15:48.040 inspection window and the greater will actually grade that. And 0:15:48.080 --> 0:15:50.720 that's actually kind of the prized part of that hide 0:15:50.920 --> 0:15:53.080 is what's in that inspection windows. He can get a 0:15:53.080 --> 0:15:57.120 good general idea of the quality of that hide through 0:15:57.120 --> 0:16:02.000 that inspection window. Take a muskrat, for instance. I remember 0:16:02.040 --> 0:16:08.600 selling muskrats at auction and they would still sort of open. 0:16:09.600 --> 0:16:11.920 They would bend it up to look inside it, to 0:16:12.040 --> 0:16:15.040 look at the back. For why is a muskrat not 0:16:15.160 --> 0:16:18.120 just stretched first side out? I think a lot of 0:16:18.120 --> 0:16:20.160 it is so they can see the prime nous of 0:16:20.200 --> 0:16:22.800 the pelt, you know, because you know how a muskrat 0:16:22.880 --> 0:16:25.680 so muskrats and we'll kind of talk pelt prime nous. 0:16:25.760 --> 0:16:28.280 But you know the reason that we trapped critters in 0:16:28.320 --> 0:16:31.320 the winters, because that's whenever the furs prime, the pelt 0:16:31.400 --> 0:16:34.920 is prime. And if you ever, it's because it's because 0:16:35.480 --> 0:16:37.680 you do it between big game hunting and ice fish. 0:16:37.720 --> 0:16:43.920 You know, it's because there's a month when you might 0:16:43.960 --> 0:16:47.680 get bored. Now, this goes way way back. This goes 0:16:47.760 --> 0:16:51.560 why they set regulations in Europe like four hundred years 0:16:51.600 --> 0:16:54.880 ago to trapping regulations, so where you would actually target 0:16:55.320 --> 0:16:58.760 prime critters. And uh so if you ever heard the 0:16:58.920 --> 0:17:02.240 term a blue pet pelt, Okay, so blue pelt is 0:17:02.320 --> 0:17:07.359 essentially kind of an unprimed pelt early season pelt or 0:17:07.520 --> 0:17:11.280 or late So that's point out. I mean literally blue. 0:17:11.320 --> 0:17:13.560 It's blue like if you ever kill a deer, like 0:17:13.600 --> 0:17:15.800 an early if you live in a state where you're 0:17:15.800 --> 0:17:18.600 allowed to, like get rolling in September something, you skin 0:17:18.720 --> 0:17:21.439 that deer and it's like the leather is blue. It's blue. Yep. 0:17:21.960 --> 0:17:24.639 So that's what they call it blue pelt. And what 0:17:24.800 --> 0:17:27.680 happens is a lot of people are in the assumption 0:17:27.720 --> 0:17:31.480 that temperature is what makes that for a prime and 0:17:31.520 --> 0:17:34.560 that's actually false. It's actually based more on daylight hours, 0:17:35.119 --> 0:17:39.199 which has a correlation to temperature obviously. So you know, 0:17:39.560 --> 0:17:43.640 as as winter progresses further north you are, you're losing 0:17:43.720 --> 0:17:47.280 daylight quicker than south, so the pelts will generally prime 0:17:47.400 --> 0:17:51.000 up quicker. So like the winter, the hell they call 0:17:51.080 --> 0:17:54.040 the shortest day of the year winter. So yeah, that's 0:17:54.040 --> 0:17:58.720 when yany goes out burning log around his house bunch times. 0:17:59.640 --> 0:18:07.080 People hits all kinds of lavian things. Um when he's 0:18:07.119 --> 0:18:10.320 doing that. Uh, the shortest day of the year like 0:18:11.200 --> 0:18:14.960 peak prime nous. Well, not necessarily, no, not well, because 0:18:15.000 --> 0:18:18.480 there's other factors too. So you know, for instance, um, 0:18:18.520 --> 0:18:21.200 whenever we're talking with coons, they have a running season, 0:18:21.240 --> 0:18:23.280 which is you know, kind of right now, a couple 0:18:23.320 --> 0:18:25.680 of weeks ago and we're talking, you know, kind of 0:18:25.680 --> 0:18:28.480 the middle into January where I'm from. So they will 0:18:28.480 --> 0:18:31.160 actually go from Dan to Dan to DN to rut, 0:18:31.320 --> 0:18:33.840 no different than like a buck will. But what will 0:18:33.880 --> 0:18:36.640 happen is going from Dan to Den to DN, they'll 0:18:36.640 --> 0:18:38.879 start to get a patch and rub fur on their 0:18:38.920 --> 0:18:41.400 back and it will actually become bald from squeezing into 0:18:41.440 --> 0:18:43.639 the hole from running around so much from Dan to 0:18:43.720 --> 0:18:46.720 DN to DN. So you've seen I was here like that. 0:18:46.720 --> 0:18:49.200 They're rubbed. You've seen it where they actually wear their 0:18:49.200 --> 0:18:53.160 hair out squeezing into holes and logs. It will become 0:18:53.359 --> 0:18:58.120 infected that they will rub it down raw raw meat 0:18:58.600 --> 0:19:00.600 from going. I mean, they get crazy. It's just no 0:19:00.640 --> 0:19:03.520 different than a deer and rut. You see, I haven't 0:19:03.520 --> 0:19:05.440 seen it. I've seen it worn down. I haven't seen 0:19:05.480 --> 0:19:09.400 it worn down like raw. It'll be scabbed over. And 0:19:09.520 --> 0:19:13.080 you know that's obviously I'm not prime pelt, you know, 0:19:13.119 --> 0:19:14.800 if you want to trap, so you know, even though 0:19:14.800 --> 0:19:18.159 there's a season for him, generally quit trapping. Then you know, 0:19:18.240 --> 0:19:19.920 I gotta interrupt you real quick. So I don't want to. 0:19:19.920 --> 0:19:22.320 I don't want to establish a rivalry between you and Seth. 0:19:22.359 --> 0:19:25.280 But there's something you need to know about Seth. When 0:19:25.280 --> 0:19:29.400 Seth was a little boy, he uh would go down 0:19:29.440 --> 0:19:34.720 to a fur buyer in in Uh flesh and stretch raccoons. 0:19:35.119 --> 0:19:38.560 In high school. That was my job. Piece work, no hourly, 0:19:39.160 --> 0:19:42.280 no piece work, peace work, piece work. How would they 0:19:42.280 --> 0:19:44.760 give you for one not much? Is like three or 0:19:44.760 --> 0:19:50.600 four bucks? Sound like more than stuff's worth. Now anyway, 0:19:50.760 --> 0:19:54.040 I was like, I forget what it was. No, it wasn't. Yeah, 0:19:54.440 --> 0:19:56.600 it didn't seem well at the time, it seemed like 0:19:56.600 --> 0:19:59.919 a lot. Oh, I U appeal log home logs for 0:20:00.040 --> 0:20:03.879 thirty five cents a foot, which at the time it 0:20:03.920 --> 0:20:06.200 was pretty good. I wouldn't be able to feed one kid. 0:20:06.960 --> 0:20:08.560 I would be able to feed one of my kids 0:20:08.600 --> 0:20:11.000 on that. Now it was a good night. Then it 0:20:11.080 --> 0:20:16.200 was a good good night flash And then oh man, 0:20:16.240 --> 0:20:19.000 it all depended because we would sometimes we'd like get 0:20:19.040 --> 0:20:21.600 behind freeze a bunch of hides. You know, we we 0:20:22.200 --> 0:20:25.359 guys would guys would bring him in either like you know, 0:20:25.960 --> 0:20:28.800 like whole animal, or they would bring him in skinned 0:20:28.800 --> 0:20:30.879 all already. Just I just needed to flash and put 0:20:30.920 --> 0:20:32.639 them up. But would you go down and skin the 0:20:32.640 --> 0:20:37.560 whole ones too? Yeah? Oh you would, okay, Yeah, so 0:20:38.040 --> 0:20:40.840 you get paid more for like one that you had 0:20:40.880 --> 0:20:43.440 to skin, flash and put up. Yeah. It was like 0:20:43.760 --> 0:20:47.000 it was like two two or three bucks to skin it, 0:20:47.080 --> 0:20:49.199 two or three bucks to flesh it and put it 0:20:49.280 --> 0:20:53.040 up something like that. Um, but I mean we used 0:20:53.080 --> 0:20:57.639 to do we should flash from dark to dark some 0:20:57.640 --> 0:21:02.480 some like start early in the morning, start before it 0:21:02.480 --> 0:21:05.000 got light out, and quit after the dark. And what 0:21:05.119 --> 0:21:07.040 might you do in today? You know you remember I 0:21:07.040 --> 0:21:11.520 don't remember at all more than ten oh yeah, yeah, yeah, 0:21:11.560 --> 0:21:15.040 I do, like ten or so in an evening after school, 0:21:15.359 --> 0:21:19.440 m sometimes more. Sometimes it all depends on what people 0:21:19.440 --> 0:21:23.119 were bringing in going to school all greasy, No I 0:21:23.200 --> 0:21:27.520 was after school. Um yeah. So anyways, I don't want 0:21:27.520 --> 0:21:28.919 you to I don't want you, you and Seth to 0:21:28.960 --> 0:21:30.520 have like a little thing in an hour you like 0:21:30.560 --> 0:21:32.200 feel like you're at odds with one another, And I 0:21:32.240 --> 0:21:34.760 just want you to know you're you're across from across. 0:21:34.800 --> 0:21:37.120 I feel like I feel I feel like we're brothers. Yeah, 0:21:37.359 --> 0:21:39.879 you're a crossing. You're sitting across from a former professional. 0:21:40.080 --> 0:21:43.240 It's a dying trade. So like, yeah, that's very young. 0:21:43.280 --> 0:21:45.520 So this isn't that long ago. If I say high school, 0:21:45.560 --> 0:21:49.359 it's like people look like that, Like, uh, like, you 0:21:49.400 --> 0:21:53.960 know a lot different back then. Alright, So go on 0:21:54.560 --> 0:21:56.760 and circle background of the damn Bobcats too. Yeah, you 0:21:56.800 --> 0:21:59.400 keep getting me dist They go into holes, they rub 0:21:59.440 --> 0:22:01.560 their hair off. Talking about I was trying to make 0:22:01.600 --> 0:22:04.640 the claim that like prim nous might be the winter solstice, 0:22:04.680 --> 0:22:07.000 but you're saying there's other factors that override that, a 0:22:07.040 --> 0:22:09.920 lot of other variables. Yeah, kyotes, you know, their prime 0:22:10.000 --> 0:22:12.520 nous is usually earlier in the season. They'll start to 0:22:12.560 --> 0:22:16.000 degrade fairly quickly. Um, you know, a lot depends on 0:22:16.400 --> 0:22:18.440 like his hair, the hair wears out or what, depending 0:22:18.480 --> 0:22:21.000 on where they're at. If they're in like an open country, 0:22:21.400 --> 0:22:23.000 you know, where they're not having to like push through 0:22:23.000 --> 0:22:25.879 a lot of brush and stuff, they're gonna stay you know, 0:22:26.359 --> 0:22:29.000 prime longer. Where if you're out you know west, where 0:22:29.000 --> 0:22:31.359 they're pushing through a bunch of sage brush and different things. 0:22:31.359 --> 0:22:34.920 Like that that'll slowly wear out that fur. Oh yeah, 0:22:35.119 --> 0:22:38.200 there's a bunch of different variables. Yeah, they tell about 0:22:38.200 --> 0:22:41.200 the one that happens the beavers in the spring. So 0:22:41.320 --> 0:22:44.480 what d what what sort of ends the season on beavers. 0:22:44.520 --> 0:22:47.520 So beavers will actually start fighting as they come out, 0:22:47.600 --> 0:22:49.200 depending on if you have ice or not, but they'll 0:22:49.200 --> 0:22:52.240 start fighting and they'll start biting each other. And so 0:22:52.640 --> 0:22:55.280 whenever the beavers start, they'll have bite marks on them, 0:22:55.320 --> 0:22:57.720 very similar to muskrats to do the same thing. Whenever 0:22:57.760 --> 0:22:59.959 you start getting beaver with a bunch of bite more 0:23:00.160 --> 0:23:02.760 and two marks on them, it's time to quit. And 0:23:02.840 --> 0:23:05.920 that might happen before the season even ends. Yeah, yeah, 0:23:05.960 --> 0:23:09.280 no difference in like like the ar coon season right now, Um, 0:23:09.400 --> 0:23:12.560 you're you're gonna get coons that are rubbed during season. 0:23:12.600 --> 0:23:14.239 They are still in so you've got to make that 0:23:14.320 --> 0:23:17.600 decision to either release them or quit trapping or you 0:23:17.640 --> 0:23:19.720 know whatever. So you know, let him growing on a 0:23:19.760 --> 0:23:22.119 better pelt. Yeah, and you'll see that, you know, because 0:23:22.720 --> 0:23:25.560 especially on your boar coons, they'll have a big scar patch, 0:23:25.640 --> 0:23:28.480 usually right on the back and it'll be from years 0:23:28.480 --> 0:23:32.080 and years and years. Really, Yeah, it's all you'll notice 0:23:32.119 --> 0:23:33.960 it will be a darker patch right down the center, 0:23:34.400 --> 0:23:37.200 and that's all scars. And whenever you're skinning and flesh them, 0:23:37.320 --> 0:23:38.800 you've got to be kind of careful of it too, 0:23:38.800 --> 0:23:41.800 because that's not like all scar tissue, and it's all 0:23:41.800 --> 0:23:45.399 scar tissue. Yeah. On a lot of your older big boards, 0:23:45.520 --> 0:23:47.760 you'll see that. And as you as the pelt dries, 0:23:47.800 --> 0:23:51.119 you'll see that kind of brownish, darker brown hue right 0:23:51.119 --> 0:23:53.200 down the back. And that's that's from them rubbing year 0:23:53.200 --> 0:23:57.600 after year after year going into squeezing into dense just constantly. Yep, 0:23:58.280 --> 0:24:01.040 they just go from densite to denside, didn't. They will 0:24:01.119 --> 0:24:04.680 run themselves. I mean you'll see them out in the daytime. 0:24:05.200 --> 0:24:07.919 They'll get real skinny and just just just like a 0:24:07.960 --> 0:24:11.720 buck and rut, they'll just run themselves stupid covering ground. Okay, 0:24:11.760 --> 0:24:14.280 back to the Bobcat. Back to the Bobcat. So we've 0:24:14.280 --> 0:24:16.879 got the Bobcat and uh so we put them on here. 0:24:16.920 --> 0:24:18.399 You know what we're talking about his wife for in, 0:24:18.560 --> 0:24:21.440 for out and all that. Okay, yeah, yeah, well that's 0:24:21.440 --> 0:24:23.720 what we got distracted on. So we put the Bobcat 0:24:23.760 --> 0:24:27.400 on a board yesterday. Um, because this Bobcat is going 0:24:27.440 --> 0:24:30.440 to be we want them fur out um and that's 0:24:30.440 --> 0:24:32.399 how they're sold, which you're gonna tan it. So it 0:24:32.440 --> 0:24:35.280 really doesn't matter because on a Bobcat, the buyers want 0:24:35.320 --> 0:24:37.080 to see they want to see the spots. You know, 0:24:37.280 --> 0:24:40.000 that's your prime. You know, on a coyote, it's kind 0:24:40.000 --> 0:24:42.880 of that back or the belly. Um a coon, it's 0:24:42.920 --> 0:24:44.879 the back. But on the Bobcat, they really want to 0:24:44.880 --> 0:24:47.080 see those spots. That's that's where the money is at, 0:24:47.119 --> 0:24:50.240 the spotted belly, that spotted belly and generally, you know, 0:24:50.640 --> 0:24:55.119 the clear more predominant spots are you're hired dollar furs. 0:24:55.240 --> 0:24:58.160 So I've heard guys say that if the belly like, 0:24:58.400 --> 0:25:02.280 they'll go buy you. How many fingers the belly strip is? Like, 0:25:02.320 --> 0:25:04.400 if you have a belly strip that's like four fingers 0:25:04.440 --> 0:25:07.919 wide and nice bright clear spots, that's a good one. Now, 0:25:08.040 --> 0:25:09.600 I gotta admit the one your hand on right there 0:25:09.640 --> 0:25:11.960 is a two f it's got a two finger belly 0:25:12.000 --> 0:25:14.680 on it. Yeah. I just got a pretty nice one 0:25:15.440 --> 0:25:18.800 believable Bobcat. Yeah, that was a nice one. That's like 0:25:18.920 --> 0:25:23.600 two hands wide belly. That was a big boy. And 0:25:23.640 --> 0:25:25.880 if you look at them compared to like the Western 0:25:25.920 --> 0:25:29.320 bobcats versus the Eastern bobcats. You know these bobcats out 0:25:29.320 --> 0:25:32.639 here a lot clearer our Our Eastern bobcats are just 0:25:32.680 --> 0:25:36.679 almost brown. Yeah, totally different trash cats. Yeah, not not 0:25:36.720 --> 0:25:41.480 worth so uh okay, tell everybody it's on a split board. 0:25:41.880 --> 0:25:44.640 A splain all that. So we we boarded this cat 0:25:44.720 --> 0:25:47.560 on a split board. Um, you know you can board 0:25:47.600 --> 0:25:49.760 them on a solid board or split board. I have 0:25:49.840 --> 0:25:52.720 a preference of a split board simply because with the 0:25:52.720 --> 0:25:56.119 split boards we're going to flip this heide anyway, so 0:25:56.119 --> 0:25:58.359 we're gonna have to manipulate them, and the split board 0:25:58.440 --> 0:26:01.800 just allows us to remove the animal from the board 0:26:01.880 --> 0:26:04.159 just a little bit easier. Now, if if, if it 0:26:04.200 --> 0:26:07.080 needs to be if it needs to be fur out, 0:26:07.960 --> 0:26:11.160 why did we start it for in because we want 0:26:11.160 --> 0:26:14.840 to get that critter to dry. There's a there's and 0:26:14.920 --> 0:26:17.280 depending on who you talked to, some guys will what 0:26:17.320 --> 0:26:20.960 they call skip the flip, which is they will that's 0:26:20.960 --> 0:26:24.760 a good T shirt, skip the slip flip. Yeah, but 0:26:25.000 --> 0:26:27.000 we need an illustration Hunters. We need to call Hunter 0:26:27.040 --> 0:26:29.480 Spencer and see if he can capture in an image 0:26:29.720 --> 0:26:34.359 a man who has simply not flipped it. Skip the flips. 0:26:34.760 --> 0:26:36.119 There's a lot of because it's a picture of a 0:26:36.160 --> 0:26:37.560 dude with a bobcat. How do you know if he 0:26:37.600 --> 0:26:43.040 flipped it or not. It's a hard illustration. I'm gonna 0:26:43.080 --> 0:26:45.639 think about that. How would you capture that illustration? And 0:26:45.640 --> 0:26:48.960 then it would say skip the flip. But we're gonna 0:26:49.000 --> 0:26:51.880 flip this one because the reason why we're gonna flip 0:26:51.920 --> 0:26:53.480 it is we want to make sure that hide is 0:26:53.800 --> 0:26:55.919 good and dry and that we're not going to have 0:26:55.960 --> 0:26:59.600 any issues with you know, molding or drying issues. So 0:26:59.640 --> 0:27:02.480 we bore did this thing for in on a split 0:27:02.520 --> 0:27:06.040 board and we've let it sit, you know, depending on 0:27:06.080 --> 0:27:09.879 temperature and humanity, everythings like that. Twelve sixteen hours. But 0:27:10.040 --> 0:27:12.800 that one, because of because of our schedule day, he's 0:27:12.840 --> 0:27:15.000 been sitting and sitting a little longer, a little longer, 0:27:15.080 --> 0:27:16.280 so it's gonna be a little bit more of a 0:27:16.320 --> 0:27:19.200 trick now. One day I called stew and I asked, 0:27:18.960 --> 0:27:22.080 I was doing a martin and I had to leave town. 0:27:22.800 --> 0:27:25.600 I wasn't gonna be around to flip, so I didn't 0:27:25.720 --> 0:27:28.880 know the slogan skip the flip, And I said, can 0:27:29.000 --> 0:27:33.480 I skip the flip, and he said, people do and 0:27:33.520 --> 0:27:35.800 it's something that you can get away with. And that's 0:27:35.840 --> 0:27:39.439 some of a bit dried on that board. I was. 0:27:39.560 --> 0:27:40.920 I got to where I was thinking about how I 0:27:41.000 --> 0:27:44.679 was going to try to destroy the board because somehow 0:27:44.760 --> 0:27:47.000 get my I wanted the Martin more than the board, 0:27:47.080 --> 0:27:49.760 and I was like, maybe I can split this board 0:27:49.760 --> 0:27:51.919 and crack it into little pieces and somehow get it 0:27:51.920 --> 0:27:54.919 out of there. And then after much trial and error, 0:27:54.960 --> 0:27:57.359 I eventually got that some bitch off but dried on 0:27:57.440 --> 0:28:01.520 the board. When I do him right for in overnight 0:28:01.600 --> 0:28:04.000 and then flip it, it just falls off just so 0:28:04.080 --> 0:28:06.439 much easier, no different than this. So I see you 0:28:06.440 --> 0:28:09.400 guys got it salted too, or a little bit of borax. 0:28:10.040 --> 0:28:12.800 Sorry about that now, Phil, Sorry not Phil. You know 0:28:12.840 --> 0:28:17.000 I don't want to Phil talking about that. But Bill, 0:28:19.400 --> 0:28:22.760 Phil his name Bill, he'd know, Uh yeah, explain the 0:28:22.760 --> 0:28:25.239 borax a little bit, A little bit borax. So a 0:28:25.280 --> 0:28:29.520 lot of people assume use salt for whatever reason. I guess, 0:28:29.520 --> 0:28:32.560 just an old timey thing you salted hide. If you're 0:28:32.600 --> 0:28:35.160 selling to the fur trade, that's actually you don't want 0:28:35.160 --> 0:28:37.960 to use salt. And the reason being is the salt 0:28:38.000 --> 0:28:42.600 interacts with the hide negatively, whereas the whenever they actually 0:28:42.640 --> 0:28:44.320 go to tann it, you know, it has a negative 0:28:44.360 --> 0:28:47.480 impact on the hide. So we use borax, which is 0:28:47.520 --> 0:28:49.840 just twenty mule team borax. It's just detergent, is all 0:28:49.880 --> 0:28:53.040 what it is. And it just helps us. Uh. In 0:28:53.200 --> 0:28:55.880 areas that would be like under the arms that are 0:28:55.880 --> 0:28:58.600 not able to have air circulate quite as good, use 0:28:58.640 --> 0:29:01.160 a little borax just to help help the drying process. 0:29:01.480 --> 0:29:03.680 A trick I learned on Coon Creek Outdoors that I 0:29:03.720 --> 0:29:07.280 need that you need. You need some feedback on is 0:29:08.000 --> 0:29:11.640 uh where you live it's more humid. So you were 0:29:11.680 --> 0:29:14.480 talking about you have a block of boax, like you 0:29:14.560 --> 0:29:16.120 let it sit out and it turns into a brick 0:29:16.360 --> 0:29:17.840 and you just rub it on. Yeah, so you have 0:29:17.880 --> 0:29:19.080 a thing that looks like a bar of soap, but 0:29:19.080 --> 0:29:20.719 it's a block of boax and you rub it on. 0:29:21.080 --> 0:29:23.200 I was like, man, that's like a ship. It works great. Yeah, 0:29:23.400 --> 0:29:26.920 you can't get that here. I don't care how long 0:29:27.120 --> 0:29:29.480 you let that stuff sit in your garage, it will 0:29:29.760 --> 0:29:33.520 not turn into a block. It's too arid. Put it 0:29:33.520 --> 0:29:36.000 in the bathroom with you take a shower, let it 0:29:36.000 --> 0:29:37.960 collect a little bit moisture, then go stick it outside. 0:29:38.400 --> 0:29:41.480 That's a good idea. You need to make a video 0:29:41.520 --> 0:29:43.840 addendum to your video and then you need it. It It 0:29:43.960 --> 0:29:46.120 needs a pause and like you hit a certain button 0:29:46.120 --> 0:29:47.600 if you're from the air. It was see me in 0:29:47.600 --> 0:29:51.000 my bathroom in the shower of block of box. So 0:29:51.040 --> 0:29:52.200 you think i'd be able to get a block of 0:29:52.240 --> 0:29:55.480 boar X. If I did that, you're putting humidity to 0:29:55.600 --> 0:29:57.360 I almost was gonna have you send me a block 0:29:57.360 --> 0:29:59.040 of boar. Actually, I thought he'd get to where I 0:29:59.080 --> 0:30:02.440 live and dry out the fall turn back into powder. 0:30:03.120 --> 0:30:05.800 So there's a lot of goods. There's not a situation 0:30:05.840 --> 0:30:09.479 where you'd salted. No, no, not. The only situation if 0:30:09.480 --> 0:30:10.960 you're gonna salt it is if you are going to 0:30:11.040 --> 0:30:14.400 tan it yourself, So then you're actually gonna use and 0:30:14.600 --> 0:30:16.800 and you know, there's a lot of different ways to tan. 0:30:17.520 --> 0:30:21.720 But essentially what the salt does is really remove all 0:30:21.760 --> 0:30:24.760 the oils from the hide and pull all the oils out. 0:30:25.280 --> 0:30:27.760 But the tanning process that you're gonna do at home 0:30:27.880 --> 0:30:30.760 versus a tanning process that's done commercially is different. So 0:30:31.280 --> 0:30:33.320 the salt kind of has a negative impact on it 0:30:33.360 --> 0:30:35.960 in that manner. So I've heard people describe I'm curious 0:30:35.960 --> 0:30:38.400 if you'd agree with this. I've heard people describe home 0:30:38.480 --> 0:30:43.800 tanning as more of a preservation method than like uh 0:30:43.920 --> 0:30:47.959 then than uh kind of like an archival. I'm not 0:30:48.000 --> 0:30:52.840 finding the right words, but that that you're talking to quality, Yeah, 0:30:52.880 --> 0:30:56.160 that that it's more like it's it's pretty temporary home 0:30:56.240 --> 0:30:58.360 tan job. Like maybe you get ten years out of it, 0:30:58.400 --> 0:30:59.880 but you're not gonna get out of it what you 0:31:00.000 --> 0:31:01.920 get out of it from a commercial tannery. Do you 0:31:01.960 --> 0:31:04.120 agree with that or not agree? Not necessarily. I think 0:31:04.120 --> 0:31:07.200 it's all it's all how much love you put into 0:31:07.240 --> 0:31:09.320 tanning it. You know, that's where a lot of people 0:31:09.360 --> 0:31:12.560 will fail. A lot has to go into the breaking 0:31:12.560 --> 0:31:17.520 process and the way that further or tan commercially, they're 0:31:17.560 --> 0:31:20.160 able to be broken like like garment material, you know, 0:31:20.360 --> 0:31:23.680 very soft, you know, but home tanning, you know, you 0:31:23.720 --> 0:31:26.160 can brain tan something, which is what the Indians did. 0:31:26.320 --> 0:31:29.480 So there's I was at a museum yesterday and there's 0:31:29.480 --> 0:31:31.920 still stuff around from this been brain tanning. That's that 0:31:31.960 --> 0:31:33.440 was that was brain That's kind of what I was 0:31:33.440 --> 0:31:36.280 hearing about brain tanning is that it didn't um that 0:31:36.760 --> 0:31:40.000 like moisture can really be hard on it. You know, 0:31:40.440 --> 0:31:42.320 it's all in how you like I said, how you 0:31:42.360 --> 0:31:45.640 tann it. A lot of the brain tanning involves like 0:31:45.680 --> 0:31:49.560 a smoking process to water proof it, keep the bugs 0:31:49.560 --> 0:31:52.760 out of it. You know what, You're basically just replacing 0:31:52.800 --> 0:31:57.239 the natural tannins in the hide with some sort of 0:31:58.080 --> 0:32:02.160 synthetic material for the majority of your home tanning. So 0:32:02.240 --> 0:32:04.960 like if you've seen the orange bottle or the different 0:32:05.160 --> 0:32:08.160 acid I mean there's a million different ways acid tanning. 0:32:08.320 --> 0:32:11.640 There's some egg white tanning. I mean, you're what methods 0:32:11.680 --> 0:32:14.400 do you do? You use? I brain tan and I 0:32:14.520 --> 0:32:18.040 use the Orange bottle Hunters and Trappers high tanning formula. 0:32:18.200 --> 0:32:20.200 Those are my two favorite that I've had a lot 0:32:20.200 --> 0:32:24.320 of success with deer brains, any brains. It's the I 0:32:24.360 --> 0:32:26.360 believe it's the landeline. I believe is what it is 0:32:26.400 --> 0:32:29.520 in the brains. And there's tell me what all kinds 0:32:29.520 --> 0:32:32.880 of brains you've used. I've used everything everything I can 0:32:32.880 --> 0:32:35.680 get my hands on deer. Deer brains are the easiest, 0:32:35.720 --> 0:32:38.360 you know, to acquire during the season. But there's this 0:32:39.000 --> 0:32:40.760 kind of a myth, and I've found it to be 0:32:40.760 --> 0:32:47.040 fairly accurate where whatever animal you have, basically their brain 0:32:47.240 --> 0:32:50.520 is sized accordingly to tan there and I've found that 0:32:50.520 --> 0:32:54.080 to be fairly act. Yeah, So which I I just 0:32:54.120 --> 0:32:55.680 save everything up at the end of the year and 0:32:55.720 --> 0:32:57.520 mix it all together. And big old bucket of brain, 0:32:57.600 --> 0:32:59.600 big old bucket of brains. I'd like to see that 0:33:00.360 --> 0:33:05.280 big old bucket of brains. Don't drink that. Um. Okay, 0:33:05.320 --> 0:33:07.239 back to the Bobcat because then we gotta cover off 0:33:07.280 --> 0:33:08.360 on some stuff. I just want to get to the 0:33:08.360 --> 0:33:10.800 part where you're flipping it, okay, and tell people how 0:33:10.840 --> 0:33:13.800 not to tear it. All right, So this thing's dried 0:33:13.840 --> 0:33:16.320 on the board for set a number of ours and 0:33:16.400 --> 0:33:17.920 it's uh, I don't know if you can hear it 0:33:17.920 --> 0:33:21.360 through the microphone, but it sounds almost like dry paper. 0:33:21.360 --> 0:33:23.240 And that's kind of what you're going for. You know, 0:33:23.320 --> 0:33:26.520 you don't want it to be to dry it's gonna 0:33:26.520 --> 0:33:28.040 be hard to flip, but you also don't want it 0:33:28.080 --> 0:33:30.320 to be too wet where you're gonna have mold issues. 0:33:30.360 --> 0:33:32.400 So we've got it to that point right now. You 0:33:32.400 --> 0:33:35.080 know what, Brod, I gotta tell you something. You really 0:33:35.120 --> 0:33:38.120 distract me on this, but I'm trying to but to 0:33:38.160 --> 0:33:40.120 your credits I'm trying to get everything that you know 0:33:40.240 --> 0:33:44.080 outright for a wall, because that's gonna be a wall hanger. 0:33:45.080 --> 0:33:51.240 Stu turned the ears, which is not something that most 0:33:51.280 --> 0:33:54.320 like trappers for the commercial market would do, but he 0:33:54.440 --> 0:33:57.960 turned the ears out of concern for my wall hanger. Bobcat, 0:33:58.000 --> 0:33:59.960 you better explain that, all right. So we split the 0:34:00.040 --> 0:34:02.920 ears side, Yeah, split them. We split the ears. And 0:34:03.560 --> 0:34:09.560 traditionally anything from below the ears up in the commercial 0:34:09.600 --> 0:34:13.480 trade is not used. So generally, you know, flashing process, 0:34:13.600 --> 0:34:16.000 different things like that, we don't normally use that. But 0:34:16.040 --> 0:34:17.440 since you're gonna tan it and use it for a 0:34:17.440 --> 0:34:21.160 wall hanger, we went ahead and split the ears. And basically, 0:34:21.200 --> 0:34:24.520 on on an ear of of most critters, you have 0:34:24.600 --> 0:34:26.719 an inner ear kind of in an outer ear. The 0:34:26.760 --> 0:34:29.880 inner ear is actually what has the cartilage and on 0:34:29.960 --> 0:34:32.319 like a coyote, say, that's what makes the ears pronounced 0:34:32.920 --> 0:34:36.120 stand up, and then the outer skin has the fur 0:34:36.239 --> 0:34:38.799 on it that you see. But on a bobcat there's 0:34:38.840 --> 0:34:40.839 fur on both sides, and you want to keep that 0:34:41.000 --> 0:34:45.680 so in order to let the tan solution penetrate. And 0:34:45.800 --> 0:34:48.000 this is just over my ears of doing it. If 0:34:48.080 --> 0:34:51.560 you actually separate the cartilage from the skin in the ear, 0:34:52.239 --> 0:34:55.799 you're able to let that tan solution kind of penetrate 0:34:55.920 --> 0:34:59.759 up the ear and ideally save both sides of the ear, 0:35:00.280 --> 0:35:03.080 and then by doing so, you've actually saved the cartilage 0:35:03.360 --> 0:35:06.080 as well. So after you get your tan pelt back, 0:35:06.320 --> 0:35:09.399 your ears still look like ears. Basically, it don't look 0:35:09.440 --> 0:35:12.640 all all wrinkled up, you know and kind of shriveled up. 0:35:12.640 --> 0:35:14.600 But I like a way to imagine it is imagine 0:35:14.600 --> 0:35:16.200 that you're going to cut off your own ear and 0:35:16.239 --> 0:35:20.040 tan it, because I think about like, like grab your 0:35:20.040 --> 0:35:25.359 ear flap, right, you have skin and skin, Yeah, you'd 0:35:25.360 --> 0:35:27.000 have to get like how are you gonna you know, 0:35:27.080 --> 0:35:28.800 you'd want to get in there and split it open 0:35:28.960 --> 0:35:32.520 so that you were getting each side of the skin 0:35:34.080 --> 0:35:36.719 to keep your ear properly tanned up. Yeah, And I mean, 0:35:36.920 --> 0:35:38.960 you know, just from my experience over the years, it 0:35:39.000 --> 0:35:41.800 just seems like if you don't split the ears, generally 0:35:41.880 --> 0:35:44.880 that inner part where the cartilage sets, it won't take 0:35:44.960 --> 0:35:47.319 the tan solution very well, and then it'll end up 0:35:47.360 --> 0:35:50.120 slipping the ferral slip, which basically just means it it'll 0:35:50.160 --> 0:35:52.640 fall off. So, yeah, we tried to do a favor 0:35:52.719 --> 0:35:55.319 here and split the ears and hopefully whenever it gets 0:35:55.360 --> 0:35:59.319 tand it'll they'll come out right. So we did that, 0:35:59.400 --> 0:36:01.960 and now it's time to finally flip this this critter. 0:36:02.080 --> 0:36:04.520 So I'm gonna take it off the board. There's a 0:36:04.520 --> 0:36:06.440 couple of different ways to flip it. And basically, like 0:36:06.480 --> 0:36:09.120 I said, we've got this thing tube skin, so we 0:36:09.200 --> 0:36:13.719 want to turn it out outward and we're gonna roll 0:36:13.800 --> 0:36:17.600 it kind of like you would turn a sock inside out. Um. So, 0:36:17.719 --> 0:36:21.480 generally you have a lot more tendency to rip the 0:36:21.560 --> 0:36:23.879 hide if you start from the bottom and go up. 0:36:24.960 --> 0:36:26.920 But if you turn them from the nose in and 0:36:26.960 --> 0:36:29.040 kind of push the head in and roll it down, 0:36:29.520 --> 0:36:33.120 generally that's a safer bet uh to not not ripping 0:36:33.120 --> 0:36:35.239 the hide or tearing the hide. You know, a lot 0:36:35.280 --> 0:36:37.600 has to go on how far you let this thing dry. 0:36:38.000 --> 0:36:41.680 There's just that fine window uh in in flipping the 0:36:41.760 --> 0:36:43.719 hides that you know you kind of need to hit. 0:36:43.840 --> 0:36:45.960 But I think we'll I think we'll be okay. Is 0:36:45.960 --> 0:36:49.280 there some critters that their hide tears a lot easier, 0:36:49.320 --> 0:36:53.680 so like fox have really thin skin. Um. There there's 0:36:53.719 --> 0:36:57.440 a big number trapper that I follow and he's skipped 0:36:57.440 --> 0:37:01.000 the flip on foxes for years. You know. Uh, he 0:37:01.080 --> 0:37:03.480 puts them up on wire too, so a lot of wire. 0:37:03.680 --> 0:37:07.040 So you know, there's just there's one way to do it, 0:37:07.040 --> 0:37:08.799 and then there's a hundred other different ways to do it. 0:37:08.800 --> 0:37:11.080 You know, there's not really one set way, which is 0:37:11.280 --> 0:37:13.600 which is kind of cool. So it depending on who 0:37:13.600 --> 0:37:15.120 you talk to and what part of the country it's. 0:37:15.840 --> 0:37:17.480 But we're gonna do it this way because it's the 0:37:17.520 --> 0:37:20.400 way I've always done it, and we're gonna basically start 0:37:20.440 --> 0:37:22.520 at the nose and we're gonna just kind of need 0:37:22.640 --> 0:37:25.759 that head down through the body and and pull it 0:37:25.800 --> 0:37:29.440 through and then we'll have the have the bobcat fur 0:37:29.520 --> 0:37:32.000 out and you'll be able to see your cat. All right. 0:37:32.200 --> 0:37:34.960 So Stu Miller, Coon Creek Outdoors, he's gonna start turning 0:37:35.080 --> 0:37:37.359 do it as loud as you can because we're gonna 0:37:37.400 --> 0:37:39.040 cover off on our other stuff and I want people 0:37:39.040 --> 0:37:41.200 to be ablit to hear you doing it, and I'll 0:37:41.280 --> 0:37:43.759 keep people posting on what's going on. Let's hope I 0:37:43.760 --> 0:37:47.680 don't rip it. Oh, if you rip it, dude, first 0:37:47.680 --> 0:37:49.480 thing it's gonna happen is this show is over. If 0:37:49.480 --> 0:37:50.920 you rip it. Stew All you have to do is 0:37:50.960 --> 0:37:55.120 say just do it yourself next time. Then I ripped 0:37:55.120 --> 0:37:57.399 a few of my day people get pissed. It's like, well, 0:37:57.640 --> 0:38:00.720 I can't imagine. Maybe I'll be living taking to someone 0:38:00.719 --> 0:38:04.760 else and here someone so mad that they become apoplectic. 0:38:05.920 --> 0:38:07.839 They'll be me. I've never heard of that. If Steve 0:38:07.920 --> 0:38:11.719 rips my bobcat All right, so we gotta touch off 0:38:11.760 --> 0:38:14.839 on this. You weren't even here when I was talking 0:38:14.840 --> 0:38:16.160 about this. What are you are you going? I was 0:38:16.200 --> 0:38:18.439 going to run in the bathroom quick, but I'll stick 0:38:18.480 --> 0:38:23.200 around talking about your marriage. Oh yeah, I had better 0:38:23.239 --> 0:38:29.640 stick around. Um am I still officiating. Yakay, No we haven't. 0:38:29.680 --> 0:38:33.480 We haven't found someone else. Uh, because if you want to, 0:38:34.360 --> 0:38:36.040 Yeah that I was reading up on what I gotta 0:38:36.080 --> 0:38:38.839 do very simple to become a minister. No, you didn't 0:38:38.840 --> 0:38:42.200 tell me, but I listened to the podcast, okay the listeners, 0:38:42.520 --> 0:38:45.719 and I had a guy was pointing out interesting thing 0:38:45.719 --> 0:38:49.719 that you can get married. Um, in Montana you get 0:38:49.760 --> 0:38:53.680 married by proxy. Mm hmm. You could have a wedding 0:38:53.719 --> 0:38:57.560 that you're not at. I didn't realize this. Montana recognizes 0:38:57.680 --> 0:39:02.120 what's called a double proxy marriage. So both of us 0:39:02.120 --> 0:39:05.120 don't to be here. There's a marriage. Yeah, you could 0:39:05.120 --> 0:39:11.640 get married here where no one shows up. Huh that yeah, well, 0:39:11.760 --> 0:39:14.240 let me I'll run that by Kelsey. See what she says. 0:39:14.560 --> 0:39:16.120 The guy that wrote and this is interesting about the 0:39:16.320 --> 0:39:19.320 the US military. So the guy wrote in his active 0:39:19.360 --> 0:39:25.560 duty military we're to the front legs. Now, it's gonna 0:39:25.560 --> 0:39:27.319 be hard. Do you like it that there's a loud 0:39:27.320 --> 0:39:29.160 noise in the background. I mean, I think it's great. 0:39:29.800 --> 0:39:32.640 Normally I would hate it, but in this circumstances, what 0:39:32.680 --> 0:39:34.600 I'm worried about. Here's what I'm worried about, is how 0:39:34.600 --> 0:39:40.160 he's gonna get those legs inverted. It sounds like paper crinklin. 0:39:40.760 --> 0:39:44.680 Like you know, guy, this guy's active duty military. And 0:39:45.440 --> 0:39:47.760 I didn't realize this, but it makes sense. The military 0:39:47.800 --> 0:39:53.320 does not recognize engagements in terms of like shuffling you around, 0:39:54.200 --> 0:39:56.680 so you could get sent somewhere else there. Yeah, you 0:39:56.680 --> 0:39:59.200 could be like, oh, we're engaged, like it doesn't matter 0:39:59.239 --> 0:40:02.960 to them. No, no paperwork or price speak of this 0:40:02.960 --> 0:40:07.680 a little bit um. So he and his woman were 0:40:07.719 --> 0:40:11.560 getting a PCs, a permanent change of station where they 0:40:11.640 --> 0:40:16.600 be sent to different military basis. But they're both gone 0:40:16.680 --> 0:40:22.440 on they were both gone uh un deployment, so neither 0:40:22.520 --> 0:40:25.520 of them is there and they got married anyway double proxy. 0:40:27.400 --> 0:40:29.040 Then they were able to move back to the same 0:40:29.080 --> 0:40:31.759 location because in the military recognized their union. Isn't that 0:40:31.840 --> 0:40:35.240 happy ending, Phil, That's great because you get to skip 0:40:35.280 --> 0:40:37.840 all the bullshit and just have a party later. I 0:40:37.840 --> 0:40:39.479 don't want to call you outside. But you don't seem 0:40:39.520 --> 0:40:46.000 like you're too warm to that idea. Well listen, it's yeah, 0:40:46.719 --> 0:40:48.799 Kelsey is not gonna be warm to that idea. Do 0:40:48.840 --> 0:40:51.719 you guys have one of those little registries going? No, 0:40:52.480 --> 0:40:55.080 you can do that. I think you should get one going. 0:40:55.160 --> 0:40:59.000 We should advertise it on the podcast. What else we're 0:40:59.000 --> 0:41:03.000 gonna be talking do single We gotta get to that 0:41:04.120 --> 0:41:07.439 to find stew more girlfriends. Um no, no, So we're 0:41:07.440 --> 0:41:10.200 not doing the registry thing. We're saying like, if you 0:41:10.360 --> 0:41:12.839 if you feel if you feel like you want to 0:41:13.200 --> 0:41:16.200 wanna give us something, just throw us a little cash 0:41:16.239 --> 0:41:19.680 because there ain't no, there's no registry out there. It's 0:41:19.680 --> 0:41:22.400 gonna like knock a wall out in my house. I 0:41:22.480 --> 0:41:24.560 got it. So you're just like you just want money, Yeah, 0:41:24.600 --> 0:41:26.839 that's great. You don't need China. I don't. I don't 0:41:26.840 --> 0:41:29.000 need like kitchen aid mixer or something like that. You know, 0:41:30.320 --> 0:41:32.520 it's Kelsey going to listen to this podcast and here 0:41:32.800 --> 0:41:35.640 you throw her under the bus so savagely like that. No, 0:41:35.840 --> 0:41:38.440 she is, She's totally on board with this. No I 0:41:38.680 --> 0:41:41.919 I was going about the double proxy. Yeah she ain't 0:41:42.080 --> 0:41:48.400 like that. Yeah, okay, yeah, uh in Florida right now? Update? 0:41:48.440 --> 0:41:51.359 Oh yeah, okay, we're gonna give up Bobcat update. Look 0:41:51.360 --> 0:41:54.840 at that. You know, I should have brought my fur brush, 0:41:54.880 --> 0:41:57.560 my fur home, because right now he's the way can 0:41:57.600 --> 0:42:01.480 I can I see it from ittt Oh? You know, 0:42:02.520 --> 0:42:04.319 while we're speaking of updates, I just want to up 0:42:04.360 --> 0:42:09.040 there our listeners that the kayak is sold. So tell 0:42:09.239 --> 0:42:11.200 tell about what the guy that bought it gave us. 0:42:11.719 --> 0:42:15.600 Oh yeah, so the the guy that bought the kayak, 0:42:16.680 --> 0:42:19.720 I should I forget his name? Man, I'll look it up. Um, 0:42:19.840 --> 0:42:24.480 did you have a lot of people wanted the kayaka? Um? 0:42:24.600 --> 0:42:28.360 The guy that bought the kayak was. He's active duty military. 0:42:28.640 --> 0:42:31.600 He's up at stationed up in Great Falls, and he 0:42:31.719 --> 0:42:36.280 gave Steve and I a hundred and five millimeter shell casings, 0:42:36.680 --> 0:42:40.600 which my son is very interested in that. Uh, we're 0:42:40.640 --> 0:42:44.000 fired on a deployment. And I think he said like 0:42:44.200 --> 0:42:51.680 Afghanistandard or Iraq or Syria. I got. I don't know 0:42:51.719 --> 0:42:53.680 what I'm gonna do with my It's sweet. Here comes 0:42:53.719 --> 0:42:55.879 the front legs? Oh? Is he doing the front legs? Now? Okay, 0:42:55.920 --> 0:42:58.840 the Bobcat is now revealed. We can see the hide 0:42:59.000 --> 0:43:01.920 the beautifully speed years and he's trying to do the 0:43:01.960 --> 0:43:06.600 final thing of get the legs inverted, which is tough 0:43:06.800 --> 0:43:09.239 because you left him so long whenever you skinned him. 0:43:10.080 --> 0:43:12.239 So we're trying to pull them through like I left 0:43:12.280 --> 0:43:16.000 him too long. Well that's differen a wall hanger and 0:43:16.200 --> 0:43:22.879 in a commercial trade Bobcat, it's very exciting. Uh. In Florida, see, 0:43:22.920 --> 0:43:24.200 I don't know what the weather is going. I want 0:43:24.200 --> 0:43:25.960 to cover off on a news bit. But the problem 0:43:25.960 --> 0:43:28.520 is this, this isn't gonna release right away. It's gonna 0:43:28.520 --> 0:43:30.359 be a couple of days. So the cold snap might 0:43:30.400 --> 0:43:35.600 be over, but there was a national cold snap um 0:43:35.600 --> 0:43:41.040 still going on right now. And in Florida, they they 0:43:41.120 --> 0:43:47.480 they're releasing warnings about the iguana is falling from trees. 0:43:48.440 --> 0:43:52.880 So Florida is full of gotta got an invasive iguana problem. 0:43:52.960 --> 0:43:55.719 We actually had some of that iguana fat, and uh, 0:43:55.960 --> 0:43:58.880 Kevin Gillespie made us iguana fat cookies, which are wonderful, 0:43:58.920 --> 0:44:03.200 like sugar cookies with a on a fat um. And 0:44:03.200 --> 0:44:08.480 the guy rode in how these frozen iguanas fall from 0:44:08.480 --> 0:44:10.719 trees and get stunned and they're just laying around on 0:44:10.840 --> 0:44:12.759 roads and sidewalks. We have a bunch of pictures of 0:44:12.800 --> 0:44:16.240 just iguana as it fell from outer space, laying around, 0:44:17.480 --> 0:44:19.680 and he's kind of wandering about if there's like an 0:44:19.680 --> 0:44:25.360 ethical dilemma to picking up in to dispatching iguanas that 0:44:25.400 --> 0:44:28.280 are in such a compromised position, kind of like shooting 0:44:28.320 --> 0:44:30.520 cariboo in a river or something like shooting cariboan a 0:44:30.600 --> 0:44:35.120 river or whatever, shooting fish in a barrel. Yeah. Uh, 0:44:35.400 --> 0:44:37.640 we're also thinking about whether or not this falls under 0:44:38.120 --> 0:44:40.360 the umbrella of chetica. I feel that does not. What 0:44:40.400 --> 0:44:43.680 do you think, Chester, No, it's more of an ethics thing, 0:44:44.160 --> 0:44:47.920 just a moral dilemma, which Karin, what did she right 0:44:48.040 --> 0:44:53.200 up there? Cheffical? Is it cheftical? I mean, like I said, 0:44:53.239 --> 0:44:56.799 it's a moral dilemma. I think if you knew how 0:44:56.840 --> 0:45:01.440 good that fat was for making cookies and if you 0:45:01.680 --> 0:45:04.440 like eating them, why the heck not? They want them 0:45:04.440 --> 0:45:08.160 out of there. Um, But this guy's moral dilemma is 0:45:08.239 --> 0:45:11.239 like some of these are too small to eat, so 0:45:11.880 --> 0:45:13.799 he doesn't want to damage the resources. Like he doesn't 0:45:13.840 --> 0:45:16.440 want to damage the resource. He doesn't like killing things 0:45:16.600 --> 0:45:21.040 that he doesn't eat, you know, So so he's weighing 0:45:21.040 --> 0:45:25.560 out do I serve the goal of eliminating the iguana 0:45:25.600 --> 0:45:30.960 from Florida or do I serve my personal ethic, which is, 0:45:31.280 --> 0:45:35.360 don't kill stuff you're not gonna eat, which Trump's which? Man? 0:45:36.000 --> 0:45:42.520 I mean, it sounds like these guys really have a problem. Um, 0:45:43.000 --> 0:45:46.279 are you clear of what the problem is? What do 0:45:46.280 --> 0:45:49.520 we do A lot of burrowing and like sea walls 0:45:49.640 --> 0:45:54.040 and house foundations and things. That's the problem. It's not 0:45:54.120 --> 0:45:57.480 like a biological issue, I don't think so, Like I 0:45:57.480 --> 0:46:00.080 don't think they're eating native bird eggs and stuff off 0:46:00.200 --> 0:46:02.920 like that that I that I know of. And you 0:46:02.960 --> 0:46:05.600 think that you think think that I thought they were 0:46:05.640 --> 0:46:09.799 like doing something to native that's possible, But what I've 0:46:09.800 --> 0:46:13.600 heard a lot is like they're doing damage to structures 0:46:13.640 --> 0:46:16.279 and like that. We have a headline in front of 0:46:16.320 --> 0:46:19.360 his cold weather could bring frozen too iguanas this weekend. 0:46:21.440 --> 0:46:24.400 It's just like a picture of some iguanas just taking 0:46:24.400 --> 0:46:29.359 a quick nap um. But yeah, I think like, if 0:46:29.360 --> 0:46:32.960 you take the ones you're gonna eat, you know, do 0:46:33.040 --> 0:46:38.480 a little a little both there. I don't know, no, 0:46:38.600 --> 0:46:41.560 I would think so man. But here's the thing I 0:46:41.560 --> 0:46:43.640 could weigh out. Let's say I really developed the taste 0:46:43.640 --> 0:46:45.880 for iguanas down there, okay, and I had like a 0:46:45.880 --> 0:46:48.480 little yard and now and that would get me a 0:46:48.520 --> 0:46:51.520 big fat iguana. And I was watching some small ones 0:46:51.600 --> 0:46:53.319 lurking around, and I knew that I I don't know 0:46:53.400 --> 0:46:55.320 what their life expectancy is, but I knew that they'd 0:46:55.320 --> 0:46:58.120 get big. And then I'd have like, I'm never eating 0:46:58.360 --> 0:47:00.359 I've eating their fat. I never eat. Let's add loved it. 0:47:01.200 --> 0:47:04.839 I could see a situation where one would fall from 0:47:04.840 --> 0:47:06.479 a tree, A little one would fall from a tree, 0:47:06.560 --> 0:47:09.880 and I would resuscitate it and warm it up in 0:47:10.000 --> 0:47:13.800 order to grow it big because I love the iguana 0:47:13.840 --> 0:47:16.920 met and not and not go out and do what 0:47:16.960 --> 0:47:19.080 I was supposed to do, which is go out and 0:47:19.160 --> 0:47:21.319 kill it. Here's the thing, I don't know if it's 0:47:21.360 --> 0:47:23.600 legal or not. Why don't you just make a little 0:47:23.600 --> 0:47:27.720 iguana cage, take those iguanas, start feeding, and start raising 0:47:27.760 --> 0:47:31.200 them yourself. It's like, get out. Just thought of a 0:47:31.239 --> 0:47:33.680 real I just remembered the real world version of what 0:47:33.719 --> 0:47:35.919 I'm talking about, not that this isn't the real world, 0:47:35.960 --> 0:47:40.040 but a personal version. You know how lake trout um 0:47:40.360 --> 0:47:44.760 got into Yellowstone Lake and started there real hard on cuts, 0:47:44.800 --> 0:47:49.719 not bull trout, yellowstone cutthroat. So someone thought was a 0:47:49.760 --> 0:47:52.960 good idea to let some lake trout go in Yellowstone Lake, 0:47:53.000 --> 0:47:55.120 which is in Yelsta National Park, and it's the head 0:47:55.120 --> 0:47:57.799 of the Yellowstone River. And it was it was very 0:47:57.840 --> 0:48:02.360 detrimental to the native cut wrote the east slope cuts cracked. 0:48:03.160 --> 0:48:07.520 I believe it was a yellow actually, which is like 0:48:07.560 --> 0:48:13.080 a more of a pumpkin colored orangeish yellowish cutthroat got 0:48:13.120 --> 0:48:17.440 it um. They at a point made it that you 0:48:17.560 --> 0:48:23.680 were not allowed to turn back a live lake trout. 0:48:23.800 --> 0:48:28.200 It was a mandatory kill situation. No like like catch 0:48:28.200 --> 0:48:31.040 and release became illegal. It might still be today. I 0:48:31.080 --> 0:48:33.239 don't know. I had a friend. I don't want to 0:48:33.239 --> 0:48:34.560 tell what his name is. I'll tell you. I don't 0:48:34.600 --> 0:48:36.680 want to tell his last name because he was a lawbreaker. 0:48:37.320 --> 0:48:41.560 His name was Mike Uh And Mike would always go 0:48:42.600 --> 0:48:45.160 and fish there and he really liked he made like 0:48:45.280 --> 0:48:49.400 smoke lake trout. He made lake trout sushi rolls. He 0:48:49.520 --> 0:48:52.719 was big time into eating lake trout. He would turn 0:48:52.800 --> 0:48:57.319 back the small ones and would be and wouldn't want 0:48:57.320 --> 0:48:59.760 to hit it too hard. And he was very nervous 0:48:59.760 --> 0:49:03.839 about what he called damaging the resource and just wasn't 0:49:03.920 --> 0:49:06.200 buying the whole thing about He was like, I love 0:49:06.239 --> 0:49:09.320 those fish. I hope they stay there forever. Yes, his 0:49:09.440 --> 0:49:11.759 take on it. I mean in an area like that, 0:49:11.840 --> 0:49:14.760 man though, like there's not many places in the world 0:49:14.800 --> 0:49:19.279 that have yellow stone cutthroat um and there are a 0:49:19.280 --> 0:49:21.480 lot of places in the world that have lake trout, 0:49:22.520 --> 0:49:24.680 Like you gotta get them out of there, and no, 0:49:24.880 --> 0:49:29.560 I know it's almost impossible, but like they've made some progress. Yeah, 0:49:29.880 --> 0:49:32.479 so Chester, you know your idea about how you're gonna 0:49:32.520 --> 0:49:34.400 keep them and fatten them up. Yeah, I was saying, 0:49:34.520 --> 0:49:38.240 I don't know if it's legal or not. Well, Karan 0:49:38.640 --> 0:49:43.640 um Uh just pointed out here that you would be 0:49:43.680 --> 0:49:48.560 in violation of law. And and so if if you 0:49:48.600 --> 0:49:51.640 know everybody has the joy cooking in their house, the cook, 0:49:51.640 --> 0:49:55.120 the joy cook cooking. I have one that's so old. 0:49:55.239 --> 0:49:59.680 There's information in it about how to fatten a possum. Really, yeah, 0:50:00.120 --> 0:50:04.120 you've caught a possum and how to fatten it and 0:50:04.400 --> 0:50:07.600 like m put it on a good diet for consumption. 0:50:08.360 --> 0:50:13.239 That's not in there anything. It's not by now, it's 0:50:13.400 --> 0:50:15.680 not in there. That's pretty awesome. They have that one. 0:50:16.080 --> 0:50:18.520 So Chester has this idea like, Okay, a little dinky, 0:50:18.680 --> 0:50:21.160 little dinker falls out of the tree. You're trying to 0:50:21.200 --> 0:50:24.000 do the right thing by law, and you say to yourself, well, 0:50:24.120 --> 0:50:26.000 I feel bad letting it back out because I'm supposed 0:50:26.040 --> 0:50:28.719 to kill it. It's not big enough to eat. I'm 0:50:28.760 --> 0:50:35.280 gonna warm them up, resuscitate them, pen him, and fatten him, 0:50:35.320 --> 0:50:39.960 which is illegal. Turns out, so Florida has a list 0:50:40.000 --> 0:50:46.480 of like stuff you can't have. It's Florida's prohibited species list, 0:50:47.840 --> 0:50:51.680 and it has it had sixteen new and it had 0:50:51.760 --> 0:50:57.960 recently added sixteen new high risk non native reptiles you're 0:50:58.000 --> 0:51:02.080 not allowed to have in your possession. The Argentine black 0:51:02.120 --> 0:51:04.719 and white tigoose. What the hell is that? I think 0:51:04.760 --> 0:51:08.239 they're like monitor lizards. I think you're not allowed to 0:51:08.280 --> 0:51:12.080 have a tigu. You look it up, Brodie. Yeah, you 0:51:12.120 --> 0:51:14.040 can't have one of those in Florida. You can't have 0:51:14.120 --> 0:51:18.160 a green iguana. You can't have a nile monitor lizard. 0:51:19.200 --> 0:51:23.080 You cannot have a Burmese python, which is a big issue. 0:51:23.160 --> 0:51:24.879 They got no shorte of them done. Yeah, they look 0:51:24.960 --> 0:51:27.319 like a monitor lizard. They're pretty they're pretty big. You 0:51:27.360 --> 0:51:33.520 cannot have a reticulated python. You cannot have a green anaconda. 0:51:35.080 --> 0:51:38.520 H uh. I mean it makes sense, you know. They 0:51:39.760 --> 0:51:42.600 that's how they kind of got there. Right of them 0:51:42.600 --> 0:51:46.920 can survive in Florida. I was years ago in South 0:51:46.960 --> 0:51:50.640 America and m and I was with a Makushi, a 0:51:50.680 --> 0:51:54.000 guy who is Mkushi from the Mkuschi tribe, and we 0:51:54.000 --> 0:51:58.360 were standing there looking at a green anaconda. It's probably 0:51:58.880 --> 0:52:02.040 I don't know, fourteen a teen feet long. This your 0:52:02.080 --> 0:52:06.200 bullet anti Nope, no, different times he was telling me 0:52:07.840 --> 0:52:09.359 I wanted to It was just sitting there. I mean 0:52:09.360 --> 0:52:12.120 you could walk right up to it. And I was 0:52:12.200 --> 0:52:14.080 asking about is it okay if we kind of like 0:52:14.160 --> 0:52:16.080 jab it with a stick to see what it does, right, 0:52:16.920 --> 0:52:19.279 And he was pointing out to me like their in 0:52:19.360 --> 0:52:23.359 their mythology. He was saying, if I touched that antaconda 0:52:23.480 --> 0:52:27.320 with the limb of my bow, it will die a 0:52:27.480 --> 0:52:31.600 very painful death that takes about forty five minutes. But 0:52:31.680 --> 0:52:33.800 you can touch it with another stick and that's fine. 0:52:34.760 --> 0:52:37.759 But you can't touch it with a bowl limb just 0:52:37.920 --> 0:52:40.000 to bow limb or is it? What was it like weapon? 0:52:41.120 --> 0:52:43.080 He said, if I touch it with my bowl limb, 0:52:43.280 --> 0:52:49.200 that will kill it very painful. Really, Yeah, there's like 0:52:49.239 --> 0:52:51.560 a limit. I mean, it was just part of their mythology, 0:52:51.560 --> 0:52:52.840 and there was like a limit to how much we 0:52:52.840 --> 0:52:55.359 could communicate about it. But I gathered that much. Can't 0:52:55.400 --> 0:52:57.279 touch him with a bow limb, can't touch a green 0:52:57.320 --> 0:53:02.319 antaconda with a bow limb. You didn't try it, No, 0:53:02.640 --> 0:53:05.960 I didn't. I didn't say, like, I just I thought 0:53:06.040 --> 0:53:08.200 that was a great little you know, a great little thing. 0:53:17.880 --> 0:53:21.959 Oh did you get one leg? Ste got one leg? 0:53:22.000 --> 0:53:25.040 He's close to getting there leg the bobcat is nearly inverted. 0:53:26.280 --> 0:53:28.280 Then it's gonna be exciting because it goes back onto 0:53:28.280 --> 0:53:33.680 the board. However, here's another ethics question. This is that 0:53:33.800 --> 0:53:35.840 this is This seems like an ethics question, but it 0:53:35.920 --> 0:53:39.120 ends up being a practical question. This guy works for 0:53:39.160 --> 0:53:42.600 a small town police department in the Greater Yellowstone ecosystem, 0:53:42.719 --> 0:53:47.360 Regent and he he mentions that they are at the 0:53:47.360 --> 0:53:50.759 time of this writing in an ongoing c w D 0:53:50.960 --> 0:53:57.640 management hunt f w P. He's saying, the state Fish 0:53:57.680 --> 0:54:01.200 and Game Agency is allowing antler bucks to be harvested 0:54:01.280 --> 0:54:05.919 on this hunt. A lot of this guy's bodies believe 0:54:05.960 --> 0:54:08.600 the hunt should be since it's meant to lower the 0:54:08.640 --> 0:54:13.759 population to slow the spread of c w D. He's like, 0:54:13.840 --> 0:54:15.680 why is it that you can kill bucks? It seems 0:54:15.719 --> 0:54:17.400 like you'd be killing does because if you want to 0:54:17.440 --> 0:54:19.640 lower a deer population, the way to lower it is 0:54:19.719 --> 0:54:23.120 killing does. Like Bucks doesn't like have a long Killing 0:54:23.160 --> 0:54:27.160 Bucks doesn't have a long term impact on deer numbers. 0:54:27.680 --> 0:54:30.279 Killing dose does because you kill her and you kill 0:54:30.360 --> 0:54:34.600 every baby that she'll ever have. I would point out, 0:54:34.760 --> 0:54:37.120 if this gentleman really wants to get into understanding this, 0:54:39.800 --> 0:54:43.400 there's quite a bit of data that suggests that c 0:54:43.719 --> 0:54:46.439 w D is more readily transmitted by bucks. They move 0:54:46.480 --> 0:54:50.200 around a bunch, They traveled to daim much. I think 0:54:50.239 --> 0:54:53.400 there's a couple of reasons they're They're they want any 0:54:53.440 --> 0:54:58.200 deer eliminated right and to convince people that hunt white 0:54:58.200 --> 0:55:03.440 tails in February and Monte Hannah or January, you know, 0:55:05.360 --> 0:55:08.160 sweet sweeten the deal. Yeah, we're letting you get a buck. 0:55:08.600 --> 0:55:11.960 And then I remember some stuff with Doug looking at 0:55:12.000 --> 0:55:15.359 the and you know, all the things like c w DS, 0:55:15.400 --> 0:55:17.600 like COVID a little bit where the information changes so 0:55:17.640 --> 0:55:19.720 fast it's hard to keep hip to what, like what's 0:55:19.800 --> 0:55:25.480 actually the current sort of academic consensus. But at the 0:55:25.600 --> 0:55:32.480 time it was the young bucks dispersed more. They like 0:55:32.600 --> 0:55:36.040 young bucks left their population dispersed farther distances were more 0:55:36.120 --> 0:55:40.400 likely to be bringing c w D into introducing c 0:55:40.719 --> 0:55:45.280 w D chronic waste and disease into new herd groups. 0:55:45.920 --> 0:55:50.920 I read something recently about that, though, where in a 0:55:50.960 --> 0:55:54.279 study where they studied a certain amount of you know, 0:55:54.360 --> 0:55:58.440 let's say they study fifteen bucks and and twenty dos, 0:55:58.480 --> 0:56:03.600 the does traveling you know, five miles and the bucks 0:56:03.640 --> 0:56:06.440 were traveling like six miles on average, So it wasn't 0:56:06.560 --> 0:56:13.719 a crazy difference between the two. But again, now I 0:56:13.800 --> 0:56:17.400 was just saying that the like they've done studies. I 0:56:17.440 --> 0:56:20.560 was reading a recent study where they took a set 0:56:20.640 --> 0:56:22.600 number of deer and studied them how far they go 0:56:22.760 --> 0:56:25.400 and the distance between how far the dose traveled and 0:56:25.440 --> 0:56:27.920 the distance between how far the bucks traveled was not 0:56:28.080 --> 0:56:34.640 that um but that was just one article. So uh, 0:56:35.160 --> 0:56:38.040 you guys got you guys got the appetite for one more. Um, 0:56:38.200 --> 0:56:42.800 I guess two more etiquette, two more ethics etiquettes. People 0:56:42.840 --> 0:56:50.680 looking for feedback. Your dog kills a deer? What then? 0:56:52.640 --> 0:56:55.120 What then? My friend's dog killed a deer not too 0:56:55.120 --> 0:56:58.040 long ago. Well, this guy, this guy was asking, like, 0:56:58.480 --> 0:57:01.120 you know, should he eat it? You to do whatever? 0:57:01.200 --> 0:57:02.880 I think he did the right thing, he said. He 0:57:02.920 --> 0:57:08.680 called the local authorities, the game warden, which is a 0:57:08.760 --> 0:57:11.640 good thing to do, and then from there, you know this, 0:57:13.719 --> 0:57:15.960 it said, the warden determined it did not have c 0:57:16.200 --> 0:57:22.360 w D, which is you can't really necessarily. Um so 0:57:22.400 --> 0:57:26.640 I'm not quite sure they're but like, well, because he okay, 0:57:26.680 --> 0:57:30.240 in this case, the warden did a little knee cropsy 0:57:30.560 --> 0:57:34.760 and saw that it had two busted legs. And that's 0:57:34.760 --> 0:57:36.280 why the dog is able to get ahold of it. 0:57:36.360 --> 0:57:39.120 And that's why it looks like what are the Yeah, 0:57:39.160 --> 0:57:41.120 that's why it looks sickly, likes like what are the 0:57:41.120 --> 0:57:43.240 odds that had c w D and then broke two 0:57:43.320 --> 0:57:45.439 legs from a car hitting it. But what this guy 0:57:45.480 --> 0:57:48.520 seems to be trying to do is is like say, 0:57:48.600 --> 0:57:51.840 what his dog did is not like there's not a 0:57:51.880 --> 0:57:54.440 problem with it, Like that's what it seems to be 0:57:54.480 --> 0:57:57.840 getting at. Well. I mean, you don't want your dogs 0:57:57.880 --> 0:58:00.840 obviously killing deer, but when in a blue moon, you 0:58:00.920 --> 0:58:03.880 just never know what's gonna happen. So I think calling 0:58:03.920 --> 0:58:07.600 the warden, and then if this deer had two broken legs, 0:58:07.640 --> 0:58:10.360 he's also asking what should I do with the meat? 0:58:10.920 --> 0:58:12.560 I would say, if the warden lets you take it 0:58:12.600 --> 0:58:15.120 and eat it, eat it, But if it's got two 0:58:15.160 --> 0:58:17.640 broken legs, you might want to check for infection and 0:58:17.680 --> 0:58:21.840 stuff first as well. Um, you know, yeah, I would say. 0:58:21.880 --> 0:58:25.360 So it is an interesting conundrant because a lot of 0:58:25.400 --> 0:58:29.240 times in public land you're supposed to have your dog 0:58:29.280 --> 0:58:33.160 under control. So if you're on public land somewhere and 0:58:33.280 --> 0:58:36.280 your dog kills a deer, you might, I mean, you 0:58:36.360 --> 0:58:39.120 might find whether you self report or someone else reports 0:58:39.120 --> 0:58:40.640 you you're asked, might be in trouble with the state. 0:58:40.760 --> 0:58:43.280 There are places where if you're out hunting deer and 0:58:43.360 --> 0:58:46.439 you see a dog chasing deer, you can shoot the dog. 0:58:46.520 --> 0:58:52.040 I think, Yeah, there's definitely places like that. Yeah, it's 0:58:52.040 --> 0:58:56.080 pretty easy to train your dog to not mess with deer. 0:58:56.640 --> 0:58:58.480 You know, I've had a couple of bird dogs, and 0:58:59.520 --> 0:59:01.520 you can train and him just not pay attention to 0:59:01.560 --> 0:59:04.800 those deer. When our dog chases a deer, it comes 0:59:04.800 --> 0:59:08.240 back knowing it's in trouble, like it can't help itself. 0:59:09.320 --> 0:59:11.400 It's like it's like I know I did like I 0:59:11.440 --> 0:59:13.120 did it, I know I shouldn't have done it. And 0:59:13.160 --> 0:59:14.840 they come back like they know they're going to get 0:59:14.840 --> 0:59:17.520 in trouble, but they just couldn't help themselves. So I 0:59:17.520 --> 0:59:20.200 think a proper etiquette is just train your dog not 0:59:20.320 --> 0:59:24.000 mess with deer. But if it does, I think that, yeah, 0:59:24.080 --> 0:59:28.200 you know the salvage dude, call your call your game warden. 0:59:28.360 --> 0:59:30.880 That's probably the first step if you're deal with any 0:59:30.880 --> 0:59:36.960 of that stuff. Here's another one. This guy is righting in. Uh. 0:59:37.120 --> 0:59:38.880 This guy lives in the state Virginia. Were you allowed 0:59:38.880 --> 0:59:42.480 to hunt turkeys with a rifle? And he says, I 0:59:42.520 --> 0:59:46.360 believe rifles should be outlawed like it is in Maryland 0:59:46.480 --> 0:59:48.480 in most states. You can't quite say most dates. There's 0:59:48.480 --> 0:59:50.280 a lot of states. Three you can kill turkey with 0:59:50.320 --> 0:59:55.520 a rifle in the fall. He's got friends that killed 0:59:55.520 --> 1:00:02.280 turkey's at two yards with Varmitt rifle setups. What do 1:00:02.280 --> 1:00:08.120 you think about that? I just don't where's the fun. 1:00:08.440 --> 1:00:10.400 I just want to say this, I'm not talking about 1:00:10.440 --> 1:00:13.600 laws and not laws and all that. Spring turkeys is 1:00:13.640 --> 1:00:15.680 meant to be something you do with a shotgun. There's 1:00:15.800 --> 1:00:18.160 there's a purpose to it, the calling, the getting them 1:00:18.200 --> 1:00:21.160 to come in. And we used to bush whag turkeys 1:00:21.200 --> 1:00:22.920 in the spring. I don't think there's any reason to 1:00:22.920 --> 1:00:26.640 shoot a turkey with a rifle in the spring. One thing, 1:00:26.680 --> 1:00:32.680 it's like it's dangerous, using camel out in the woods, 1:00:32.680 --> 1:00:35.880 making turkey noises, sitting against trees, trying to sit close, 1:00:36.080 --> 1:00:38.959 trying to be close to turkeys. When I was very young, 1:00:39.120 --> 1:00:42.040 you could hunt. I'm pretty sure you could hunt turkeys 1:00:42.080 --> 1:00:45.920 with a rifle in Pennsylvania in the spring. Really, I 1:00:45.960 --> 1:00:49.560 know you can changed it. Yeah, well, especially with decoys 1:00:49.560 --> 1:00:53.080 getting better and better every year, you know, dude. Yeah, 1:00:53.480 --> 1:01:00.520 Like I look at my own decoy. It's about going 1:01:00.680 --> 1:01:03.080 and the fall. It finds out hunting deer and had 1:01:03.360 --> 1:01:06.600 turkey tag in my pocket. I probably, Yeah, I think 1:01:06.640 --> 1:01:10.080 it's different and what's interesting people people don't understand here 1:01:10.080 --> 1:01:13.040 is that in a lot of in states where you 1:01:13.080 --> 1:01:15.920 are allowed to kill turkeys in the fall with the rifle, 1:01:15.960 --> 1:01:20.000 you're often allowed to kill females. But they're also not 1:01:20.120 --> 1:01:22.320 I mean, they're spending time out in those open areas 1:01:22.320 --> 1:01:24.320 in the fall. But I feel like spring gets predictable. 1:01:24.640 --> 1:01:27.360 You know, those birds are gonna be out on strut 1:01:27.440 --> 1:01:29.520 zones and be out and open. So that's like another 1:01:29.560 --> 1:01:33.200 thing that's just makes it easier picking and the spring 1:01:33.240 --> 1:01:35.360 you shoot him, And why I don't, I don't personally 1:01:35.640 --> 1:01:37.520 like that. Or I just think if you're like sitting 1:01:37.560 --> 1:01:40.280 there in your truck and there's a turkey hunter fifty 1:01:40.320 --> 1:01:44.520 yards way out in the field, and you decided to 1:01:44.520 --> 1:01:47.120 take a couple of rips at it with your fifty 1:01:47.520 --> 1:01:50.160 it's like, I don't. It feels very dangerous to me 1:01:50.200 --> 1:01:52.160 because you don't know if there's some camel up dude 1:01:52.160 --> 1:01:55.280 and his kids sitting back there. Yep, yep, yep, yep. 1:01:55.480 --> 1:01:57.560 It just takes the fun right out of that spring 1:01:57.600 --> 1:02:01.000 turkey hunting too. Well. I hear the story one time, 1:02:01.160 --> 1:02:05.800 and I believe the story. I heard that, and so 1:02:06.640 --> 1:02:08.200 it was a time when Florida. You were allowed to 1:02:08.240 --> 1:02:11.840 hunt turkeys in the spring with a rifle, okay, And 1:02:13.160 --> 1:02:15.400 a lot of turkey hunters felt that it just was 1:02:15.440 --> 1:02:20.480 not a good idea. You got flat country okay, get 1:02:20.520 --> 1:02:23.920 people out in camel with decoys, like it's like a 1:02:23.960 --> 1:02:28.880 safety issue. And they even went to they took the 1:02:29.040 --> 1:02:33.400 time to go to the gun community and be like, 1:02:33.640 --> 1:02:37.440 this is not like, this is a safety turkey issue. 1:02:37.600 --> 1:02:40.600 Let's not make this like a gun gun right issue. 1:02:40.640 --> 1:02:44.040 This is a safety turkey issue. And it got turned 1:02:44.080 --> 1:02:48.400 into a like gun right, gun got turned into a 1:02:48.440 --> 1:02:51.200 gun rights issue when they were I remember someone telling me, 1:02:51.240 --> 1:02:53.440 who was on the side of not being able to 1:02:53.520 --> 1:02:56.080 rifle hunt turkeys, that they always felt a little bit 1:02:56.080 --> 1:02:58.920 disappointed that they couldn't get it framed. Outside of that 1:02:59.600 --> 1:03:03.400 the disc rushing about it, you know, it was more 1:03:03.480 --> 1:03:06.920 like I don't want to get shot. Yeah, there was 1:03:06.960 --> 1:03:11.040 a centerfire rifle. There was that one video that viral 1:03:11.240 --> 1:03:13.600 a couple of years ago with that the two there 1:03:13.640 --> 1:03:15.840 was two young guys turkey hunting and they were filming 1:03:15.880 --> 1:03:17.240 it and I think they were working a bird on 1:03:17.280 --> 1:03:20.360 the edge of a big opening and in the footage 1:03:20.400 --> 1:03:23.480 you too see like the all the dirt get kicked up. 1:03:23.480 --> 1:03:25.520 Someone shot with like a two forty three there decoy 1:03:25.640 --> 1:03:27.479 and they were on the opposite end and it blew 1:03:27.480 --> 1:03:29.520 into the tree next to him and bark went flying 1:03:29.600 --> 1:03:32.800 and everything, and they immediately jumped up. It was a 1:03:32.800 --> 1:03:34.760 couple of years ago, but it went viral, but I'm 1:03:34.760 --> 1:03:36.520 sure you can find it on YouTube. But it was 1:03:36.960 --> 1:03:39.240 guys shooting at a decoy a centerfire rifle, and they 1:03:39.240 --> 1:03:42.240 were If he would have been a foot or even 1:03:42.360 --> 1:03:44.520 six inches offset, he would have hit one of those 1:03:44.520 --> 1:03:48.680 guys and killed them. So yeah, I've seen videos like 1:03:48.720 --> 1:03:50.760 that guy shooting a goose decoy, Sean, you might have 1:03:50.800 --> 1:03:54.800 seen something like that, but shooting a shooting goose decoys 1:03:54.800 --> 1:03:58.280 of centerfire rifles just like you know, totally illegally, Yeah, totally. 1:03:58.360 --> 1:04:01.640 There's nowhere you're allowed to do that. Well, New Zealand 1:04:01.640 --> 1:04:05.080 you can do that. I killed Uh, I killed a 1:04:05.120 --> 1:04:09.560 Canada goose in New Zealand with a seven millimeter m meg. Yeah, 1:04:09.600 --> 1:04:14.640 they're kind of like a that's a good shot, wonderful shot. 1:04:15.480 --> 1:04:17.240 All right, brought you ready for your book report? Oh, 1:04:17.240 --> 1:04:21.400 how's a bobcat that's ready to be bordered? I wish 1:04:21.400 --> 1:04:23.880 we had our fur home with us. Man. Snap it, 1:04:24.120 --> 1:04:26.080 You've got more room over there. Snap it real hard, 1:04:26.640 --> 1:04:29.240 set all the fur. Snapp it hard. A couple of times. 1:04:30.680 --> 1:04:33.000 Are you ready for your book? Your part, Brody? Yeah, 1:04:33.120 --> 1:04:37.960 my article report. Um. So, there's been a push to 1:04:38.200 --> 1:04:46.400 dlist grizzlies from the Endangered Species List from both Montana 1:04:46.720 --> 1:04:52.200 Governor Gene Forte and Wyoming Governor Mark Gordon. So to 1:04:52.240 --> 1:04:57.240 give some background, Uh, grizzly bears were put on the 1:04:57.280 --> 1:05:01.640 e S A in I think something like that. There's 1:05:01.680 --> 1:05:04.720 like a hundred and fifty of them left threatened, not 1:05:04.720 --> 1:05:07.280 not in danger. Yeah, there's about a hundred fifty of 1:05:07.320 --> 1:05:10.160 them left in the seventies, hundred thirty six. And the 1:05:10.320 --> 1:05:14.560 g y E the thing that Steve hates saying, Oh, 1:05:15.000 --> 1:05:17.680 I don't know, I'm somewhat okay with that. You're okay 1:05:17.680 --> 1:05:23.680 with a greater Yellowstone ecosystem? Okay, a little bit okay. Anyway, Uh, 1:05:23.840 --> 1:05:29.840 fast forward to current times, and the estimates vary, right, 1:05:29.960 --> 1:05:36.640 like minimum is seven hundred. A new population study model 1:05:36.680 --> 1:05:41.640 that Wyoming used places them over a thousand. But either way, 1:05:42.000 --> 1:05:45.760 the recovery goal was I believe five hundred bears in 1:05:45.840 --> 1:05:50.560 the Greater Yellowstone ecosystem, which was met you know, twenty 1:05:50.640 --> 1:05:54.439 years ago or so. Um, so there's there's been these 1:05:54.480 --> 1:05:57.880 off and on pushes to get them off the list. 1:05:57.880 --> 1:06:01.960 Wyoming Governor Mark Gordon is petitioning the US Fish and 1:06:02.000 --> 1:06:04.920 Wildlife Service to get him removed again. I said, the 1:06:04.960 --> 1:06:09.640 same things going on in here in Montana, and uh, 1:06:09.800 --> 1:06:13.080 you know, it's this back and forth fight that never 1:06:13.120 --> 1:06:20.200 seems to end. It doesn't. Yeah, it's just NonStop. And uh. 1:06:20.360 --> 1:06:24.240 I was interviewed for an article for Fox News Digital. 1:06:24.720 --> 1:06:27.960 Um and and uh, apparently they think I'm a grizzly 1:06:28.000 --> 1:06:32.680 bear expert. They also interviewed, uh, Wyoming governor's Wyoming Governor 1:06:33.160 --> 1:06:37.760 Gordon was quoted pretty heavily in the article. Um and 1:06:37.840 --> 1:06:42.880 they quoted what is her name, Andreas A Cardi from 1:06:42.920 --> 1:06:47.240 a Center for Biological Diversity. They always have names like that, 1:06:47.360 --> 1:06:49.720 you know that that makes them sound like there's something 1:06:49.800 --> 1:06:52.560 other than what they are, which is like, you know, 1:06:52.760 --> 1:06:57.520 animal rights, anti hunting group. Um. The most interesting thing 1:06:57.760 --> 1:07:00.840 I think she said, She's said a couple of things 1:07:00.840 --> 1:07:03.960 that are interesting. There's no science to back the claim 1:07:04.040 --> 1:07:07.400 that grizzlies no longer need protection, meaning they I don't 1:07:07.440 --> 1:07:10.520 understand what that means. I don't know, but I mean 1:07:10.560 --> 1:07:14.360 there's plenty of science because their way past the stated 1:07:14.680 --> 1:07:19.120 recovery goals. Um. And that's such a such a subjective 1:07:19.160 --> 1:07:22.440 statement too, because to her, grizzlies will always need protection 1:07:22.560 --> 1:07:28.720 no matter what, everywhere. And uh. She also says, of course, Um, 1:07:28.920 --> 1:07:32.320 this outrageous request from my Wyoming's governor is the latest 1:07:32.320 --> 1:07:35.360 attack on animals like grizzly, embarrassed by states that see 1:07:35.400 --> 1:07:41.120 them as little more than targets for trophy hunters. Um, pushpins. 1:07:41.160 --> 1:07:47.480 Do you know? It was just like absolutely untrue. Um. 1:07:47.600 --> 1:07:49.760 Here's here We've covered to so many times. I ever 1:07:49.800 --> 1:07:51.440 wrote an op end the New York Times about this 1:07:51.520 --> 1:07:54.080 the last time they were trying to do it. The 1:07:54.200 --> 1:07:57.840 last thing the states are gonna do. That's what they 1:07:58.320 --> 1:08:02.120 the state Why Montana are not going to lobby their 1:08:02.160 --> 1:08:07.360 asses off for decades to get state management of grizzlies 1:08:07.400 --> 1:08:10.840 back in order to then really quickly kill them all 1:08:10.840 --> 1:08:13.160 and get them back driven back onto the endangered speed. 1:08:13.520 --> 1:08:15.360 The whole point is trying to get them recovered and 1:08:15.440 --> 1:08:18.320 off the list, right and then like they're just like 1:08:18.560 --> 1:08:20.439 they're like rubbing their hands, like who the minute I 1:08:20.479 --> 1:08:22.479 can get them off the list, I'm gonna put them 1:08:22.520 --> 1:08:25.880 back on the list again. Yeah, and let's say ridiculous 1:08:25.880 --> 1:08:30.120 Wyoming or mon Montana. Let's let's say they get taken 1:08:30.120 --> 1:08:33.040 off the list and and a hunting season gets approved. 1:08:33.560 --> 1:08:38.000 The number they're gonna be so careful with a number 1:08:38.040 --> 1:08:40.960 of tags that they issue for these bears. That's it's 1:08:41.000 --> 1:08:44.240 going to have absolutely zero impact on the Like, do 1:08:44.320 --> 1:08:46.120 you know how many tags the last go around? You 1:08:46.160 --> 1:08:48.880 know how many tags Idaho is going to issue one 1:08:51.200 --> 1:08:55.679 Wyoming I think was a total of low twenties. Maybe 1:08:55.840 --> 1:08:58.760 in Montana, I thought at the time. And I don't know, 1:08:58.840 --> 1:09:00.920 there's a different administration now, so I think we'd have 1:09:00.920 --> 1:09:02.640 a different approach. I thought it was a little bit 1:09:02.720 --> 1:09:06.759 chicken ship. Yeah, And and you know, in a decision 1:09:07.479 --> 1:09:10.479 there was coming from people who I admire, just like 1:09:10.520 --> 1:09:13.280 an area where I disagreed with them is they were 1:09:13.280 --> 1:09:16.200 going to sit it out, obviously sitting it out because 1:09:16.200 --> 1:09:19.120 they didn't want to wade into the they didn't want 1:09:19.120 --> 1:09:23.960 to wade into the social Yeah. I respected Wyoming fishing 1:09:23.960 --> 1:09:26.760 game for how they just I mean, they knew it 1:09:26.800 --> 1:09:28.200 was gonna they were gonna take a lot of flak 1:09:28.280 --> 1:09:30.360 and heat for everything, and I think they did a 1:09:30.360 --> 1:09:33.799 great job and how they handled it, and that bummed 1:09:33.840 --> 1:09:37.240 me out. That f WP kind of I don't know 1:09:37.360 --> 1:09:40.800 but that But basically the gist of the article here is, 1:09:41.160 --> 1:09:44.479 and we've said this before, the point of the endangered 1:09:44.520 --> 1:09:47.080 species list is not to keep them on the list 1:09:47.120 --> 1:09:51.320 forever it stood, recover them, get them off the list, 1:09:51.479 --> 1:09:55.720 turnover management to the states. And these groups like this 1:09:55.800 --> 1:10:01.120 just used lawsuits to like postpone thing and delay things 1:10:01.160 --> 1:10:03.759 and keep them on the list, you know, potentially forever. 1:10:05.040 --> 1:10:08.080 So that's where we're at. Montana and Wyoming are trying 1:10:08.120 --> 1:10:13.240 to In Montana, it's the the Northern Continental Divide population 1:10:13.280 --> 1:10:16.759 that they're trying to get delisted. What winds up happening 1:10:16.760 --> 1:10:18.840 with this, I mean, like I said, we've we've covered 1:10:18.840 --> 1:10:24.000 the dickens out of this. Winds up happening UM around 1:10:24.000 --> 1:10:29.920 grizzly delisting, around wolf delisting is you have two situations 1:10:29.960 --> 1:10:34.839 where we had species that were legitimately imperiled, like wolves 1:10:34.840 --> 1:10:39.160 are legitimately imperilled at a time, UM, grizzlies were legitimately 1:10:39.240 --> 1:10:43.440 imperiled and they needed at that they that needed protections 1:10:44.640 --> 1:10:46.720 and they put protections in place, and you in in 1:10:47.200 --> 1:10:49.640 the different you know, stakeholders and has come together and 1:10:49.680 --> 1:10:52.639 they're like, okay, what does recovery look like? Right? And 1:10:52.800 --> 1:10:54.719 people agree on like, well, if we had this many 1:10:54.760 --> 1:10:57.639 of this, that many of that living in this many places, 1:10:57.680 --> 1:11:00.360 we would accept that that was like recovery at which 1:11:00.400 --> 1:11:04.120 will move on to the next problem. Um. What happens 1:11:04.120 --> 1:11:07.760 is people really kind of like get used to there 1:11:07.800 --> 1:11:12.479 being no hunting for these animals, and later when recovery 1:11:12.479 --> 1:11:16.360 objectives are met and hunting might be resumed, people just 1:11:16.720 --> 1:11:20.080 they get where they just cannot accept that. And so 1:11:20.479 --> 1:11:23.439 the way these things get held up in court, no 1:11:23.479 --> 1:11:27.400 one comes and argues that there aren't like no one's 1:11:27.400 --> 1:11:29.639 gonna argue in courts that there aren't enough of them. 1:11:29.680 --> 1:11:34.439 They're gonna argue in court weird little you know, like 1:11:34.479 --> 1:11:39.639 technical issues be like oh you did uh, you did uh, 1:11:39.880 --> 1:11:44.520 you did a study, but did you consider the potential 1:11:44.680 --> 1:11:50.839 impacts of white bark pine blister rust and if anything, 1:11:51.000 --> 1:11:54.240 always didn't fully consider the impacts blister rust. So then 1:11:54.240 --> 1:11:56.240 a judge and it's always that it's always a judge 1:11:56.240 --> 1:11:58.879 of Missoula because that always winds up in that district 1:11:59.280 --> 1:12:01.719 and a judgement rule and throw all the whole thing. Yeah, 1:12:01.920 --> 1:12:05.200 based on a technicality and why they're not they're never 1:12:05.280 --> 1:12:08.720 arguing the main point. Yeah. And another thing that kind 1:12:08.760 --> 1:12:13.000 of never comes up is that there's like, like take 1:12:13.080 --> 1:12:16.920 the Greater Yellowstone ecosystem, Like you can't have bears every 1:12:17.000 --> 1:12:20.840 grizzlies everywhere. There's only so many places that can support them. 1:12:20.920 --> 1:12:23.400 And so in the g y E there's like a 1:12:23.560 --> 1:12:27.960 finite number of grizzlies that that place can support. And 1:12:27.960 --> 1:12:32.080 then they start moving out into like the urban uh 1:12:32.240 --> 1:12:35.479 wild interface like around here in Bozeman, and they get 1:12:35.479 --> 1:12:38.160 in trouble and then they get shot for getting in 1:12:38.160 --> 1:12:42.760 a dumpster. Um. There's like a carrying capacity there, And 1:12:43.120 --> 1:12:47.160 you can't have bears running around in Golden Gate Park. 1:12:47.200 --> 1:12:51.000 You say, grizzlies. I wish they were everywhere, Sure, but 1:12:51.080 --> 1:12:53.920 I have a high tolerance. It's just not possible, but 1:12:54.000 --> 1:12:56.559 I do. Yeah. The other part of this that gets 1:12:56.600 --> 1:13:00.960 really technical is is people instead of saying like, like, 1:13:00.960 --> 1:13:03.479 if you're gonna what is the entirety of grizzly bear range, 1:13:03.520 --> 1:13:07.800 the entirety of grizzly bear ranges um basically the Hunter 1:13:08.040 --> 1:13:12.040 Meridian and westward like everything. If you're if you're like 1:13:12.160 --> 1:13:15.800 west of the Big Bend in the Missouri Um, you're 1:13:15.840 --> 1:13:19.320 in grizzly bear habitat. So people are like, it's not 1:13:19.400 --> 1:13:21.760 really plausible that we're going to cover bears across the 1:13:21.920 --> 1:13:26.280 entirety of the American West. So let's pick adequate areas 1:13:26.320 --> 1:13:28.600 where they could feasibly be, and then when one of 1:13:28.600 --> 1:13:32.559 those areas is full, you delist the area. And people 1:13:32.600 --> 1:13:35.000 are always using they're always attacking that logic, Well, we 1:13:35.040 --> 1:13:37.280 can't recover them everywhere. But you know, I always point 1:13:37.320 --> 1:13:42.160 out elk are only recovered across what of their native range? 1:13:43.240 --> 1:13:46.839 How come no one says that about elk elkrt recovered 1:13:46.840 --> 1:13:50.720 in Illinois, but you can hunt them in Utah? Yep? 1:13:51.360 --> 1:13:53.880 Why would someone not say, we haven't recovered elk across 1:13:53.920 --> 1:13:55.600 the entirety of their range. You shouldn't be allowed to 1:13:55.640 --> 1:13:58.320 hunt out. Yeah, they should be an endangered species in 1:13:58.360 --> 1:14:01.160 Illinois by their logic. Yeah, it should be that no 1:14:01.200 --> 1:14:03.559 one in Utah should be able to hunt an elk 1:14:03.600 --> 1:14:09.320 because Illinois doesn't have them yet they need to hire 1:14:09.400 --> 1:14:11.639 us to do these arguments. I like that the Broidy 1:14:11.720 --> 1:14:15.280 gets some you're such a that from doing these book 1:14:15.280 --> 1:14:16.680 reports and stuff that you get to go on the 1:14:16.680 --> 1:14:19.280 news and talk about it. Yeah, man, it was fun. 1:14:20.720 --> 1:14:22.599 But you know what bugs me is that they never 1:14:22.680 --> 1:14:27.679 interviewed a damn biologist for these articles, like a from 1:14:27.720 --> 1:14:30.040 the US Fish and Wildlife Service or from a state 1:14:30.040 --> 1:14:32.840 game agency. Do you point that out to him? I did. 1:14:32.920 --> 1:14:34.679 He said he should talk to some of those people. 1:14:36.520 --> 1:14:38.320 Did you say, like, you shouldn't talk to me, you 1:14:38.320 --> 1:14:41.040 should talk to them. I said, I am not a 1:14:41.080 --> 1:14:44.320 grizzly bear expert. I have an opinion you should talk 1:14:44.400 --> 1:14:47.040 to a grizzly bear expert. Yeah. You know what it 1:14:47.120 --> 1:14:48.720 might be is that they're not going to get a 1:14:48.720 --> 1:14:52.559 fiery They're not going to get a fiery opinion of either, 1:14:52.760 --> 1:14:54.920 like a like a grizzly bear expert isn't gonna give 1:14:55.000 --> 1:14:57.679 a fiery opinion because they only need to be careful 1:14:57.720 --> 1:14:59.800 what they say. They had to get a raging hot 1:15:00.120 --> 1:15:05.000 like Brodie Henderson. Yeah, Brody smoke coming out of his 1:15:05.120 --> 1:15:08.639 years all the time. Alright, Sean, you ready you bet 1:15:09.400 --> 1:15:13.760 Shawn's duck report. Yeah, you have an assignment. You gotta. 1:15:13.880 --> 1:15:17.000 We gave you an assignment, right, Yeah, you did last 1:15:17.240 --> 1:15:19.920 last time we did a duck report, you had brought 1:15:20.000 --> 1:15:24.160 up that you wanted uh age demographics to be discussed. Yeah, 1:15:24.240 --> 1:15:27.439 like what's the old asked duck. Mm hmm. And you 1:15:27.520 --> 1:15:31.519 had referenced a sand hill crane you'd shot when you 1:15:31.560 --> 1:15:36.280 were in Texas that you said you believed was seventeen 1:15:36.320 --> 1:15:41.280 years old. And to be fair, I called Dr Chris 1:15:41.400 --> 1:15:45.360 Nikolai from Delta Waterfowl about this because age demographics gets 1:15:45.360 --> 1:15:49.640 pretty complex, um, and there's a lot to it, but 1:15:50.640 --> 1:15:54.160 for starters, um. He told me to go look at 1:15:54.720 --> 1:15:59.320 the U. S g S website that they have a 1:15:59.520 --> 1:16:02.120 They have a cool called the Longevity Records of North 1:16:02.120 --> 1:16:06.439 American Birds and this tool allows you to look up 1:16:06.680 --> 1:16:11.920 all the all the band reporting and the age of 1:16:11.960 --> 1:16:16.000 those birds that are reported. And it's not just waterfowl, 1:16:16.200 --> 1:16:22.160 it's kind of everything. It's got snow buntings and sparrows, 1:16:22.200 --> 1:16:25.519 you name it, pretty much anything they can report, um 1:16:25.560 --> 1:16:28.519 on how old some of these birds live. It's on there. 1:16:28.920 --> 1:16:31.400 For example, I did look up a snow bunting, which, 1:16:31.520 --> 1:16:33.960 by the way, the oldest one reported was eight years 1:16:33.960 --> 1:16:40.840 and nine months old. Um. Anyway, I also went ahead 1:16:41.080 --> 1:16:45.479 and looked up sandhill crane. Since you had referenced shooting 1:16:45.520 --> 1:16:50.519 one seventeen years old, the oldest sandhill crane was thirty 1:16:50.560 --> 1:16:56.639 seven years and three months old, And which is so old? 1:16:57.479 --> 1:17:01.200 And it was banding older than Seth? Yeah, not way older, 1:17:01.200 --> 1:17:04.719 but I would have been in first grade. How Seth 1:17:04.840 --> 1:17:07.479 was born? How old can parrots live? I'm just thinking 1:17:07.479 --> 1:17:10.439 about birds in general, Yeah, because they're like I remember 1:17:10.479 --> 1:17:12.200 how I had a girlfriend whose mom had a great 1:17:12.240 --> 1:17:14.599 parrot and she had to have a will about what 1:17:14.640 --> 1:17:16.200 was going to happen to the parrot after she died. 1:17:17.960 --> 1:17:20.639 But that's living in a cage. Yeah, that's true. Because 1:17:20.680 --> 1:17:22.320 what happened to this and tell everybody what happened to 1:17:22.320 --> 1:17:25.240 this crane? Man, what happened to this crane is sad. 1:17:25.560 --> 1:17:29.920 So it's banded in Florida in nine two. And what 1:17:30.080 --> 1:17:32.080 finally got it was it got hit by a car 1:17:32.120 --> 1:17:38.439 in Wisconsin coming home from the bar. Coming home to 1:17:38.479 --> 1:17:43.479 the bar, hop up on cheese kurds, double bubble. No, 1:17:43.680 --> 1:17:46.760 everyone talks about hitting deer in Wisconsin, and nobody talks 1:17:46.760 --> 1:17:52.760 about hitting sandhill cranes. Thirties seven years old, super old. 1:17:53.320 --> 1:17:56.200 So then I went ahead and looked up. I went 1:17:56.360 --> 1:17:59.719 real down the rabbit hole looking up pretty much every 1:17:59.760 --> 1:18:03.080 speed sees I could looked up, like blue geese and 1:18:03.160 --> 1:18:07.120 snow geese. Which oldest blue goose was thirty years old 1:18:07.120 --> 1:18:11.080 and eight months oldest mallard was twenty seven years and 1:18:11.200 --> 1:18:13.920 seven months. Is this is that off banding data too? 1:18:14.880 --> 1:18:19.040 M hmm yep. So these are all and Chris Nikolai 1:18:19.120 --> 1:18:22.880 did bring this up as well. All these are based 1:18:22.920 --> 1:18:29.439 on either found dead or hunter harvest shot and removed bands. 1:18:29.840 --> 1:18:38.320 These are not recapture data. So Nikolai has had birds 1:18:38.320 --> 1:18:41.519 where they catch them in rocket nets, you know, thirty 1:18:41.600 --> 1:18:45.880 thirty five years later and they're they're putting third or 1:18:45.920 --> 1:18:49.639 fourth set of bands on birds that are still alive. Yeah, 1:18:49.680 --> 1:18:51.599 like all these birds that were looking at all these 1:18:51.640 --> 1:18:55.040 ages like this mallard it's twenty almost twenty eight years, 1:18:56.360 --> 1:18:59.439 it was lesser snow it's twenty seven and a half years. 1:18:59.840 --> 1:19:03.479 These are things that, um, they didn't die of old 1:19:03.520 --> 1:19:08.280 age mm hmm. Yeah, these these ones died of getting shot. 1:19:08.560 --> 1:19:12.280 So they're teal that got banded in Saskatchewan got shot 1:19:12.320 --> 1:19:18.120 in Cuba. Yeah, twenty three years later. That's crazy. It's 1:19:18.120 --> 1:19:23.320 pretty cool by like Castro because that sounds like an 1:19:23.600 --> 1:19:28.120 a real life story. It's amazing because you look at 1:19:28.160 --> 1:19:30.040 it like you see a deer in a duck, and 1:19:30.080 --> 1:19:33.160 you have so much more empathy for a deer at lesa, 1:19:33.280 --> 1:19:35.559 you know what I mean, It's got eyelashes and everything. 1:19:36.920 --> 1:19:42.240 They're like, you could fit seven deer lives inside of 1:19:42.280 --> 1:19:45.599 a duck. Yeah, it's crazy. You don't look you when 1:19:45.600 --> 1:19:47.760 you see a duck on a pond. You don't think like, oh, 1:19:47.840 --> 1:19:51.200 there's something that's twenty five years old. No, definitely not. 1:19:51.400 --> 1:19:55.519 It was wild turkeys a long time. Oh yeah, wild 1:19:55.560 --> 1:19:59.960 turkeys like dude, I'm lucky to get become too well. 1:20:00.760 --> 1:20:03.759 To be fair, though, where these numbers are these ages 1:20:03.880 --> 1:20:09.000 really become wild is when you start calculating what the 1:20:09.040 --> 1:20:13.880 average age of waterfowl is like, when you get down 1:20:13.920 --> 1:20:19.000 to what's actually probably gonna happening actual. So the numbers 1:20:19.040 --> 1:20:22.320 that Dr Nikolai had given me to work with our 1:20:23.720 --> 1:20:28.480 survival rate year over year on Drake Mallard's and sixties 1:20:28.800 --> 1:20:33.479 six on hen Mallards, those are not exact numbers, but 1:20:33.520 --> 1:20:38.840 they're close and they flesh out the thought experiment here. Um. 1:20:38.920 --> 1:20:41.679 I'll also come back to the why there's a difference 1:20:41.720 --> 1:20:48.200 between drake and hen survival rate. But if so, if 1:20:48.200 --> 1:20:51.080 you start with a hundred of each, you know, year one, 1:20:51.240 --> 1:20:53.920 you get down to seventy drakes and sixty hens. By 1:20:54.000 --> 1:20:56.679 year two, year at forty nine drakes and thirty six hens. 1:20:56.800 --> 1:21:00.680 So now you're below fifty how alf or dead. So 1:21:00.720 --> 1:21:04.400 there's your average age um. Your average age for a 1:21:04.520 --> 1:21:06.880 duck is two years for a drake mallard and not 1:21:06.960 --> 1:21:10.280 even two years for a hen mallard. So it makes 1:21:10.360 --> 1:21:15.040 a seven year old mallard that much more impressive. The 1:21:15.120 --> 1:21:17.920 hens live shorter because they just are they getting so 1:21:18.040 --> 1:21:21.600 beat up from you know. Yeah, that's what I was 1:21:21.640 --> 1:21:24.599 wanderings why hens? I was thinking maybe because of they're 1:21:24.600 --> 1:21:28.280 sitting on nests and getting eaten while they're on nests. Yep, 1:21:29.840 --> 1:21:34.640 that's the average then, Yeah, the average age man is 1:21:35.439 --> 1:21:38.240 twenty seven years. Imagined the attrition rate of friends. You 1:21:38.320 --> 1:21:40.000 go through a lot of friends, and that if you're 1:21:40.000 --> 1:21:43.840 that mallard that made it to twenty seven years, how 1:21:43.840 --> 1:21:46.680 many friends have coming gone? Yeah? How is it that? 1:21:46.800 --> 1:21:50.679 Like you remember in Sand County Almanac, Uh, in Sand 1:21:50.760 --> 1:21:53.120 County Almanac when he's doing the stuff with the chicken, 1:21:53.160 --> 1:21:57.000 eas like he's like catching a chicken ee Elder Leopold. 1:21:58.360 --> 1:22:01.040 This isn't the twenties. He's like catching chicken's. He made 1:22:01.080 --> 1:22:02.800 up a little chickenie trap and he's like putting a 1:22:02.840 --> 1:22:07.040 band on chicken eas and you know they all just die. 1:22:07.479 --> 1:22:11.600 But this one that just never makes a mistake and 1:22:11.640 --> 1:22:13.960 he gets a year after year after year after year 1:22:14.000 --> 1:22:16.679 at the same bird feeder. I don't remember that part 1:22:16.680 --> 1:22:21.120 of that, but everyone else just gets dusted like he doesn't. 1:22:22.000 --> 1:22:26.240 He's like very special. I wonder what the O dometer 1:22:26.360 --> 1:22:30.080 would be on a seven year old Mallard the miles 1:22:30.080 --> 1:22:32.160 he's put on, Sean, that's a good one for your 1:22:32.160 --> 1:22:37.000 book report, dude, Okay, I'll start. You know, there's uh 1:22:37.320 --> 1:22:40.960 some real cool GPS work being done by a group 1:22:41.040 --> 1:22:45.519 called Osborne Labs. I'll see what the highest sodometer they've 1:22:45.560 --> 1:22:49.800 got on a GPS tracker is right now, Yeah, that'd 1:22:49.800 --> 1:22:54.559 be really cool. So where that survival rate gets even 1:22:54.640 --> 1:22:59.760 more nuanced, right, is that that's based on pretty much 1:22:59.760 --> 1:23:02.479 a going from year one to year two and then 1:23:02.560 --> 1:23:05.439 year two to year three, so to speak. That's not 1:23:05.680 --> 1:23:10.639 counting when they're in the egg or even once they've hatched. 1:23:10.840 --> 1:23:14.720 And are going through, you know, the whole process of 1:23:14.760 --> 1:23:19.000 growing up to be old enough to fly. So Chris 1:23:19.120 --> 1:23:21.960 gave me some even more staggering numbers that make you 1:23:22.000 --> 1:23:24.519 wonder how we even have any ducks to hunt to 1:23:24.560 --> 1:23:27.639 begin with, Like, how there's any around at all. Yeah, 1:23:27.800 --> 1:23:32.160 it's amazing that there's even ducks. So right now, a 1:23:32.680 --> 1:23:37.840 good nest success is point one five or fIF so 1:23:38.000 --> 1:23:41.759 fifteen eggs even ever hatch out of a hundred eggs 1:23:41.800 --> 1:23:49.120 laid then from then from not catching enough raccoons. Oh yeah, 1:23:49.200 --> 1:23:55.080 so that's that's the real end of the story here. Um, 1:23:55.120 --> 1:23:59.639 So if fifteen eggs hatch, half of those will die 1:24:00.040 --> 1:24:03.240 before they ever get too old enough to fly. But 1:24:03.400 --> 1:24:05.680 she brings you down to you know, seven and a 1:24:05.760 --> 1:24:11.080 half ducks eggs that hit the ground m hmm, and 1:24:11.120 --> 1:24:15.680 then won't make it through that first fall roughly, so 1:24:15.720 --> 1:24:18.240 you get too about after that first fall, you got 1:24:18.280 --> 1:24:23.360 about three ducks out of a hundred eggs, and then 1:24:23.439 --> 1:24:26.759 some duck went on and lived in twenty five years. 1:24:29.520 --> 1:24:33.360 So I'll circle back to the hen and drakes survival 1:24:33.439 --> 1:24:37.280 rate thing, and we already kind of touched on it. 1:24:37.400 --> 1:24:41.200 But the reason that hens have a lower survival rate 1:24:41.880 --> 1:24:48.640 than drake's. Especially right now is nest predation. If drake's, 1:24:48.680 --> 1:24:50.920 you know, drake's don't have to go sit in grassland, 1:24:51.040 --> 1:24:57.040 they don't have to risk um, risk getting jumped on 1:24:57.040 --> 1:24:59.160 on a nest. He can hang out out in the 1:24:59.160 --> 1:25:03.600 middle of some big lake. Mm hmm exactly. And what 1:25:03.800 --> 1:25:06.559 that's led to the last thirty or forty years, they've 1:25:06.600 --> 1:25:11.960 really noticed it since the late nineteen eighties is we've 1:25:11.960 --> 1:25:15.840 seen a population wide change in the sex ratio. We 1:25:15.920 --> 1:25:20.160 have more drakes than hens, and not by just a 1:25:20.160 --> 1:25:26.280 little bit. Um. In the late nineteen eighties, pintails were 1:25:27.320 --> 1:25:30.880 about one point to drakes for every hen, and now 1:25:31.240 --> 1:25:34.519 they're at four and a half drakes to every hen. 1:25:36.560 --> 1:25:39.880 So we're at a hen shortage and a drake surplus 1:25:39.960 --> 1:25:44.920 by a lot. And that's been going over how long, Uh, well, 1:25:45.000 --> 1:25:47.639 it's it's going up every year. But it's been really 1:25:47.680 --> 1:25:52.880 noticeable Incline since the late nineteen eighties. They do they 1:25:52.880 --> 1:25:59.240 relate that to low fur prices. Delta waterfowl definitely points 1:25:59.280 --> 1:26:03.720 to miso predators because there's a there's a Turkey biologist 1:26:03.760 --> 1:26:08.479 that we had on the show one time, um that 1:26:09.360 --> 1:26:12.519 you know, he felt that was a very interesting argument, 1:26:13.240 --> 1:26:16.960 is looking at for prices relative to predation of birds. 1:26:17.200 --> 1:26:19.640 That's kind of when you got out of the professional 1:26:19.680 --> 1:26:23.080 trapping game when in the late eighties, I set my 1:26:23.160 --> 1:26:28.759 last trap for seth No. I set my last trap 1:26:28.960 --> 1:26:35.720 for commercial purposes in nine but it was dismal by then. 1:26:37.479 --> 1:26:41.000 Ten years earlier it had been really something, but I 1:26:41.040 --> 1:26:44.240 was only ten years old. Another thing Chris had brought 1:26:44.280 --> 1:26:48.679 up there like North Dakota hadn't even described raccoons living 1:26:48.680 --> 1:26:54.400 there until the nineteen fifties and now they're everywhere. So 1:26:54.439 --> 1:26:57.640 it's interesting. Uh, well, we'll talk more on that in 1:26:57.720 --> 1:27:02.120 another Duck report because there is so much interesting information 1:27:02.120 --> 1:27:06.479 about the sex ratio and predation on nests and all that. 1:27:06.640 --> 1:27:12.120 But the age disparities are are wild. How you can 1:27:12.160 --> 1:27:14.720 have a thirty year old or thirty three year old 1:27:14.760 --> 1:27:18.840 Canada goose, but then you know a lot of them 1:27:18.880 --> 1:27:21.840 never even make it out of the nest. And Barry 1:27:21.840 --> 1:27:26.720 Lopez's book Arctic Dreams, he's with a pilot and they're 1:27:26.720 --> 1:27:28.680 doing some polar bear work and they're talking about how 1:27:28.720 --> 1:27:30.800 old polar bear can get and didn't get pretty old, 1:27:31.120 --> 1:27:34.559 and he mentions how the biologist says to him, if 1:27:34.600 --> 1:27:38.120 it doesn't make any mistakes, you know, which is just 1:27:38.160 --> 1:27:40.040 not something you'd like that, you know what I mean, 1:27:41.120 --> 1:27:42.840 It's just not something you think about. If it doesn't 1:27:42.840 --> 1:27:46.840 make any mistakes, it never messes up. It's never like, hey, 1:27:46.880 --> 1:27:50.800 that looks like a real duck even though it's not moving. 1:27:50.880 --> 1:27:55.360 It seems Sean, I have a question for you through 1:27:55.400 --> 1:27:58.720 that research did that? Is there anything about that like 1:27:59.439 --> 1:28:03.880 snowball ing or turning in and eat, like that separation 1:28:04.000 --> 1:28:06.880 of how many hens to drake's because of the drake's, Like, 1:28:06.960 --> 1:28:09.080 since the drakes are so rough on hands usually when 1:28:09.120 --> 1:28:14.759 they're mating, like with that many drake's to low hand ratio, 1:28:14.920 --> 1:28:17.960 couldn't actually start killing more hens and lower that and 1:28:18.000 --> 1:28:20.879 that separation, that gap is gonna widen. Is there anything 1:28:21.760 --> 1:28:24.599 research you know? I don't know. I don't think there's 1:28:24.640 --> 1:28:28.280 any talk about I don't think Drake's. I mean, I 1:28:28.320 --> 1:28:30.800 guess I can't speak for biologists, but I don't think 1:28:30.840 --> 1:28:33.200 they kill enough hens to have a Okay, you don't 1:28:33.200 --> 1:28:38.839 think it's like a right now, It's definitely a definitely 1:28:38.920 --> 1:28:43.320 a habitat and predation story. You know, when you buy 1:28:43.360 --> 1:28:48.760 a dozen or six pack of decoys. It's like mostly Drake's. 1:28:48.320 --> 1:28:53.400 It turns out that's actually accurate. I wonder if that 1:28:53.479 --> 1:28:55.439 by I thought you feel like you're getting more value 1:28:57.800 --> 1:29:00.160 or just a contrast thing easy for the duck to 1:29:00.200 --> 1:29:03.639 see the Drake's. I don't know. I don't know either. Oh, 1:29:03.680 --> 1:29:06.000 they're probably just doing it because we like looking at 1:29:06.040 --> 1:29:12.120 the pretty decoys. Right, So you're good on at Sean, Yeah, no, 1:29:12.240 --> 1:29:15.479 that's what's the next report? What are you working on? Well, 1:29:15.520 --> 1:29:23.200 I think we'll dive more into the predator story. Oh 1:29:23.439 --> 1:29:25.760 some of the people start thinking ran I predator, which 1:29:25.760 --> 1:29:28.360 I'm not. But you're gonna get into that little bit 1:29:28.360 --> 1:29:33.960 predation mm hmm yep, definitely. I'm ready for you. Man. 1:29:34.560 --> 1:29:37.680 What Stu I'm gonna slowly transition is into talking to you. 1:29:37.680 --> 1:29:39.719 You want to see how I'm gonna do it. Can't 1:29:39.760 --> 1:29:44.360 wait check this one out. Uh. We were talking on 1:29:44.560 --> 1:29:48.400 previous episodes about mistaken song lyrics. When you all your 1:29:48.439 --> 1:29:50.000 life you think they're saying one thing, you realize of 1:29:50.040 --> 1:29:54.160 saying something else. Um, there's a song and you heard 1:29:54.160 --> 1:29:59.160 this damn song Loggins and Messina, who's that? Kenny Loggins 1:29:59.200 --> 1:30:01.720 and oh they Andy Loggins. You said I looked like 1:30:01.800 --> 1:30:03.840 him one time. Well, you know when your hair was long. 1:30:04.800 --> 1:30:08.880 Oh so the Loggins and Messina's Kenny Loggins. What a 1:30:08.960 --> 1:30:11.360 weird groove. He had gone for a while of doing 1:30:11.640 --> 1:30:17.760 movies movie the main songs, and movies foot loose, what's 1:30:17.760 --> 1:30:20.960 the one with the pilots Top Gun? So they got 1:30:20.960 --> 1:30:23.200 a song called Danny Song and in the song they 1:30:23.240 --> 1:30:28.040 say Pisces that they get into astronomy. Pisces virgo rising 1:30:28.120 --> 1:30:32.800 is a very good sign. This guy thought he was 1:30:32.840 --> 1:30:36.639 saying the price of fur is rising. It's a very 1:30:36.640 --> 1:30:41.160 good sign. I like when this dude wrote in he 1:30:41.280 --> 1:30:49.160 signed off with negative tempts here in West Michigan making nice. Okay, 1:30:49.320 --> 1:30:51.280 we're gonna get a new, big old thing about where 1:30:51.280 --> 1:30:54.519 trappers and predator hunters are having a versus hound hunters 1:30:54.520 --> 1:30:56.720 in Virginia. We're gonna put that on hold. That's very 1:30:56.720 --> 1:31:00.400 interesting to me though, in fighting hunter, in fighting and 1:31:00.640 --> 1:31:05.960 unlikely enemies. We're gonna cover this very soon, how trappers 1:31:06.000 --> 1:31:10.639 and predator hunters are and and hound hunters are all 1:31:10.680 --> 1:31:19.000 at each other's throats. Mhmm, cannibalism. I don't see it. 1:31:19.479 --> 1:31:27.760 I hound hunt and I trapped, Stu hates himself. It's 1:31:27.800 --> 1:31:30.000 a rich field of inquiry. We're gonna cover it, but 1:31:30.000 --> 1:31:32.200 I want to do a real quick one. Colorado, who 1:31:32.240 --> 1:31:35.720 seems like every other day as bannings trying to ban something. Uh, 1:31:35.800 --> 1:31:39.599 this time they were trying their eighteenth time to ban lying. 1:31:40.080 --> 1:31:42.639 It's so funny. They always throw in links. That's the thing, man. 1:31:42.760 --> 1:31:46.720 They are like, didn't Arizona include jaguar When they tried that, 1:31:46.760 --> 1:31:49.040 they always got a sneak in an animal that you 1:31:49.080 --> 1:31:51.760 can't hunt anyway, because people because they're standing out in 1:31:51.800 --> 1:31:54.960 front of the whole foods getting signatures for these things, right, 1:31:55.280 --> 1:31:57.040 and so like here comes someone lady hasn't seen a 1:31:57.080 --> 1:32:01.200 wild animal three years. Uh, comes the long and they're like, 1:32:01.240 --> 1:32:04.400 were you sign our petition? Right? And they want to 1:32:04.439 --> 1:32:07.840 sweeten the pot. So they're like in band links, honey, 1:32:07.880 --> 1:32:11.640 because he's like, Jesus, I can't. They're killing links, like 1:32:11.720 --> 1:32:15.160 you can't kill links in Colorado, but they're gonna ban it. Yep, 1:32:16.160 --> 1:32:19.400 lest I don't know. Yeah in Arizona, like and no 1:32:19.640 --> 1:32:23.840 killing jaguars by the way, Yeah, you can't kill jaguars, 1:32:24.600 --> 1:32:26.360 but they like the because yeah, I think it is 1:32:26.479 --> 1:32:29.759 adds like it sweetens the pot. You know. The great 1:32:29.760 --> 1:32:32.799 thing about this one is it didn't get dragged out 1:32:32.880 --> 1:32:35.200 over a long period of time, but like came up 1:32:35.439 --> 1:32:40.479 and whamo got rejected right away. It's great. Crim was 1:32:40.520 --> 1:32:43.280 pointing out that a guy named Vinny from New Jersey 1:32:43.360 --> 1:32:45.360 road in, which makes that the second Vinny to ever 1:32:45.439 --> 1:32:47.640 have anything to do with this podcast. So at this 1:32:47.680 --> 1:32:51.479 point we had two Vinny's, both New Jersey mentioned on 1:32:51.560 --> 1:32:54.640 this show, and not a cat lady from New Jersey. 1:32:55.160 --> 1:32:59.160 So yeah, that builds over, it'll come up again. Yeah, 1:32:59.200 --> 1:33:02.439 I just like, here's the thing, man, here's the thing. 1:33:03.760 --> 1:33:06.960 This is all I want in the world. I want 1:33:07.000 --> 1:33:10.960 there to be a I want the environment to be 1:33:11.040 --> 1:33:18.040 extremely clean, clean air, clean water, healthy wildlife. I don't 1:33:18.080 --> 1:33:19.760 want to I want to leave as much of it 1:33:19.800 --> 1:33:22.720 as pristine as humanly possible, even to the point where 1:33:22.760 --> 1:33:25.600 we have to make sacrifices. I want the earth to 1:33:25.640 --> 1:33:27.719 be the let's just keep in the country. I want 1:33:27.720 --> 1:33:32.920 this America to be full of pristine wild places, full 1:33:32.960 --> 1:33:36.000 of animals that we have access to as renewable resources. 1:33:36.000 --> 1:33:40.200 It's not that complicated. If you want to help cats, 1:33:40.840 --> 1:33:45.800 help habitat yeah, if you want to help the How 1:33:45.800 --> 1:33:50.240 many links are in Colorado right now? Not very many? 1:33:50.760 --> 1:33:57.160 Secure Linx habitat, Yeah, sure, Lynx habitats. What what there 1:33:57.280 --> 1:34:00.680 is in Colorado is doing. It's great, you know, like 1:34:00.840 --> 1:34:04.720 will betterly protected wilderness areas. You know, keep it secure, 1:34:05.600 --> 1:34:07.960 keep it secure. That will be the thing if you 1:34:08.000 --> 1:34:10.479 want links in Colorado. The thing that will make it 1:34:10.520 --> 1:34:13.839 that there's links in Colorado is that there's habitat. Quit skiing. 1:34:14.840 --> 1:34:20.439 Quit skiing too. There's I can hear people typing already. 1:34:22.320 --> 1:34:25.200 There's a battle over those skiers and big horns down 1:34:25.200 --> 1:34:28.400 in Jackson right now. If you want the links to 1:34:28.400 --> 1:34:31.400 be fine, make it that there's a shipload of links habitat, 1:34:31.880 --> 1:34:34.439 and then all your problems will be solved. It won't 1:34:34.439 --> 1:34:38.599 be because someone who can't anyways were too. It's just 1:34:38.880 --> 1:34:51.680 you're missing the point. Yeah, let's move on, all right, 1:34:51.720 --> 1:34:56.280 ste how on the Sam Hill. Because here's the thing, 1:34:57.400 --> 1:35:00.519 here's my biggest question for you, here's my excuse for 1:35:00.560 --> 1:35:03.519 becoming a trapper. I was born in nineteen seventy four, 1:35:05.200 --> 1:35:08.960 the great fur boom of the of like seventy eight 1:35:09.080 --> 1:35:12.840 to eighty two. I was born in seventy four, and 1:35:12.880 --> 1:35:15.439 so I was aware of that, and I didn't set 1:35:15.479 --> 1:35:18.640 a trap till the last year of the fur boom, 1:35:18.680 --> 1:35:22.880 but I was informed by the fur boom like all this, 1:35:22.960 --> 1:35:26.599 you know, this is in four dollars, seventy five dollar 1:35:26.720 --> 1:35:33.120 red fox, fifty dollar mink, forty dollar raccoons, eighty dollar beavers, 1:35:33.680 --> 1:35:37.599 seven dollar muskrats. Somebody, Phil, what was all? What's all 1:35:37.640 --> 1:35:41.680 that mean in today's dollars? And that was in the round. 1:35:42.600 --> 1:35:46.559 Can you can you real quick explain why the prices 1:35:46.600 --> 1:35:49.640 were so high at that time, like just based on 1:35:49.760 --> 1:35:52.680 demand for I think there was at that time there 1:35:52.720 --> 1:35:56.439 was still strong domestic demand. And I'm guessing I don't know, 1:35:56.920 --> 1:36:01.280 maybe still remembers are better. But the big consumers China, 1:36:01.840 --> 1:36:10.160 South Korea, Russia, right so at times Italy. So I'm 1:36:10.200 --> 1:36:15.200 guessing that those economies were very strong. I'm guessing the 1:36:15.240 --> 1:36:18.599 oil prices, well, we know oil prices got incredibly high. 1:36:19.560 --> 1:36:22.600 Their economies are strong. Oil prices are high, and you 1:36:22.640 --> 1:36:25.720 had tons of consumer demand, and you had domestic you 1:36:25.760 --> 1:36:30.680 had us demand for luxury stuff. One hundred dollars in 1:36:30.760 --> 1:36:33.920 nineteen seventy four would be about five hundred and sixty 1:36:33.960 --> 1:36:36.560 nine dollars according to okay, so tell me what a 1:36:36.600 --> 1:36:38.519 seven dollar telling me would have No, tell me what 1:36:38.600 --> 1:36:43.840 at I did. A forty dollars in nineteen eighty four 1:36:43.880 --> 1:36:45.960 would have been a hundred nine dollars today. Okay, So 1:36:46.000 --> 1:36:51.160 a hundred nine dollar mink today pretty good money. And 1:36:51.200 --> 1:36:53.560 I was seduced by those figures because we mow a 1:36:53.600 --> 1:36:57.040 lawn for five bucks and a muskrat was worth more 1:36:57.120 --> 1:36:59.439 than well, it depends on who's law. Like the Musselmans 1:36:59.439 --> 1:37:02.439 paid fifteen bucks to molder lawn. Yes, you have to 1:37:02.479 --> 1:37:05.559 take a lunch break. You couldn't get it done at 1:37:05.600 --> 1:37:07.599 one shot. You had like mo a bunch and then 1:37:07.640 --> 1:37:09.400 like you'd go home and eat and go swimming and 1:37:09.400 --> 1:37:13.360 ship and go back and mow again. So two muskrats 1:37:14.520 --> 1:37:17.800 was like musculiman's lawn. That's why I got into it. 1:37:18.680 --> 1:37:20.719 There were guys, but there were guys taking two weeks 1:37:20.720 --> 1:37:25.120 of vacation and then like teaming it up with like 1:37:25.160 --> 1:37:31.799 their holiday vacation and buying trucks with muskrat money. Pretty 1:37:31.800 --> 1:37:34.519 cool considering you could go, I built up, I built 1:37:34.520 --> 1:37:37.120 a barn. You could really live off the land back then. 1:37:38.160 --> 1:37:42.840 So what's your excuse? How old you you missed all that. 1:37:42.880 --> 1:37:49.479 I missed all that occasionally though, right occasionally, every now 1:37:49.520 --> 1:37:54.559 and then, something like last year or two years ago, 1:37:55.360 --> 1:38:00.160 like Western coyotes, it was like, yeah, boom, they were 1:38:00.160 --> 1:38:01.680 worth a lot of months a good point now and 1:38:01.720 --> 1:38:04.559 then to be a freak. But it's because of some 1:38:04.640 --> 1:38:10.880 type of weird niche market typically, right that like typically 1:38:11.000 --> 1:38:13.080 so like the fur boom, like you're talking the fur 1:38:13.200 --> 1:38:16.240 room that I remember with the upper case F. Yeah, 1:38:16.720 --> 1:38:21.040 would have been like two thousand eleven, two thousand fourteen. 1:38:21.080 --> 1:38:23.280 Well that's what you called your that's my that's my 1:38:23.320 --> 1:38:27.640 generation for boom, that's your generation muskrats. Yeah, I was 1:38:27.680 --> 1:38:31.799 selling fourteen dollar muskrats. I averaged almost twenty five dollars 1:38:31.800 --> 1:38:34.240 on coons that year. I sold several coyotes, you know, 1:38:34.240 --> 1:38:38.400 which we were talking Midwestern coyotes, so yeah, pretty bad ones, 1:38:38.479 --> 1:38:41.960 you know, and having an average of seventy seventy on them. 1:38:42.320 --> 1:38:44.360 You know, that was a good little fur room. I Yeah, 1:38:44.400 --> 1:38:47.200 I did really good then. So yeah, you were making money. 1:38:47.320 --> 1:38:50.040 I was making money. Yeah, I was actually making money trapping. 1:38:50.120 --> 1:38:52.599 Now you're just doing it pretty much for the hobby 1:38:52.640 --> 1:38:55.800 of it. But fur prices definitely have gone down. But 1:38:55.840 --> 1:38:58.760 that's the fur boom that I remember. So is that 1:38:58.800 --> 1:39:02.879 what got you into it? No? So you know, traffing 1:39:03.000 --> 1:39:07.320 is traffic is hard, like it really is hard. And 1:39:07.479 --> 1:39:10.320 you know, growing up, I I was outdoorsman. You know. 1:39:10.360 --> 1:39:12.400 I deer hunted, I bow hunted, I duck hunted. I 1:39:12.680 --> 1:39:15.400 did everything. You know, ski though, did you I did 1:39:15.400 --> 1:39:19.360 not ski, being a Southerner, we just didn't have the 1:39:19.400 --> 1:39:24.840 ability there, so I didn't ski. But you know I 1:39:24.880 --> 1:39:27.280 was I was hunting everything. There was a season four 1:39:27.280 --> 1:39:29.120 I was fishing for everything that there was a season, 1:39:29.200 --> 1:39:33.160 you know, we could catch and trapping. Just it was hard. 1:39:33.240 --> 1:39:35.840 And I remember this was kind of never hard, like 1:39:35.960 --> 1:39:40.839 technically hard or physically hard. I know the answer both both. 1:39:41.080 --> 1:39:43.880 And I remember this is kind of whenever. Like inline 1:39:43.920 --> 1:39:47.439 muzzleloaders were really becoming a thing, you know, like really 1:39:47.640 --> 1:39:52.200 and in Illinois we can't use rifles centerfire rifles, and 1:39:52.280 --> 1:39:55.599 so it's shotgun or muzzleloader or pistol. And I remember, 1:39:56.000 --> 1:39:58.519 you know, muzzleloaders were coming out, and I bought a 1:39:58.560 --> 1:40:00.720 real good in line muzzleloader. And remember I shot a 1:40:00.760 --> 1:40:03.720 deer like two hundred fifty yards. You know, I'm like, well, 1:40:03.800 --> 1:40:06.800 it's I'm done like what you peeked, you know. I 1:40:06.800 --> 1:40:09.120 mean it's just deer walk out across forty acre field 1:40:09.160 --> 1:40:10.840 and you just drop him. You know, It's there's not 1:40:10.920 --> 1:40:12.920 much to that. You know, it's sitting a deer stand. 1:40:13.360 --> 1:40:16.120 And I'd always trapped as a kid, and you know, 1:40:16.320 --> 1:40:18.720 after that, I remember I kind of I bought some 1:40:18.840 --> 1:40:20.920 sets and you know the time, there wasn't a lot 1:40:20.920 --> 1:40:23.000 of education about it or information. You know, you pretty 1:40:23.080 --> 1:40:25.760 much had to kind of learn on the fly or 1:40:25.880 --> 1:40:29.720 was self taught, and uh, they just slowly progressed from there. 1:40:29.840 --> 1:40:33.120 You know, Trapping is one of those things that if 1:40:33.160 --> 1:40:35.280 you get past the whole Disney thing where you know, 1:40:35.320 --> 1:40:36.720 you go out and set three sets and you come 1:40:36.720 --> 1:40:38.880 back next day and you have three critters, what Disney 1:40:38.880 --> 1:40:41.439 youre talking about? That's what everybody always tells me, you 1:40:41.439 --> 1:40:44.920 know that that's the assumption I would say, is that 1:40:45.120 --> 1:40:48.080 there's Disney movies where people have super high catch rates. Well, 1:40:48.120 --> 1:40:50.040 I mean, you know, you get the Big Bear traps, 1:40:50.120 --> 1:40:52.840 and you know, just the the illusion of that people 1:40:52.920 --> 1:40:56.559 have of that trapping is almost like a there's just 1:40:56.600 --> 1:40:59.360 like it's just mayhem blood. I call it Disney, But 1:40:59.400 --> 1:41:01.720 I mean, you know, actually the general assumption, you know, 1:41:01.800 --> 1:41:04.920 which it's not. Um. You know, you're going out there 1:41:05.040 --> 1:41:09.160 and you're trying You're going out in an area that 1:41:09.240 --> 1:41:11.479 this critter, you know, he knows the same as you 1:41:11.479 --> 1:41:15.080 know your backyard. You're going out in their area, and 1:41:15.120 --> 1:41:17.599 you are trying to trick that animal. For the most part, 1:41:18.000 --> 1:41:20.680 to step on an area that is the size of 1:41:20.720 --> 1:41:24.200 a top of a soda can, that's pretty hard to do. 1:41:24.240 --> 1:41:26.920 You know, consider that that critter could go anywhere he wants, 1:41:26.920 --> 1:41:28.880 and that's what you're trying to do. And I think 1:41:28.960 --> 1:41:31.280 that's what drew me to it more than anything like 1:41:31.360 --> 1:41:34.519 a thousand acre home range, is the challenge to step 1:41:34.560 --> 1:41:37.240 on a beer can, the top of a beer can. 1:41:37.720 --> 1:41:39.320 You're trying to get that critter to put his foot 1:41:39.360 --> 1:41:42.400 on and that's that, to me was kind of the 1:41:42.439 --> 1:41:45.479 allure of it. That's what drew me to it. Was 1:41:45.479 --> 1:41:49.000 was the challenge, because I mean, you've trapped, you know, 1:41:49.040 --> 1:41:52.240 you've trapped. Trappers are a different breed, you know. And 1:41:52.720 --> 1:41:56.160 I don't mean that being like the you know, Jeremiah 1:41:56.240 --> 1:41:59.400 Johnson or old Dingy construction worker, you know, one of those, 1:41:59.520 --> 1:42:03.559 which I him. But I mean, you've got to be driven, 1:42:03.840 --> 1:42:07.719 and you know, there's a different mentality to it to trap, 1:42:07.720 --> 1:42:10.080 and you there's a lot of work involved with it, 1:42:10.880 --> 1:42:15.760 um physically, mentally, you know, I'll say so deer hunting, 1:42:15.760 --> 1:42:18.000 a lot of people can relate to deer hunting. So 1:42:18.040 --> 1:42:21.000 you're gonna deer hunt, and you're gonna you're gonna deer 1:42:21.040 --> 1:42:25.120 hunt every day in December or every chance you get. Right. So, 1:42:25.520 --> 1:42:27.800 for the majority of us that work a forty hour week, 1:42:27.800 --> 1:42:29.280 you're not gonna be able to hunt during the week. 1:42:29.680 --> 1:42:31.680 You're gonna be able to hunt on the weekends, right 1:42:31.680 --> 1:42:35.120 because sunrises it seven o'clock and sets at four thirty. 1:42:35.200 --> 1:42:38.719 So you hunt every single chance you can. During December, 1:42:39.080 --> 1:42:42.160 you're gonna get to hunt eight times eight days basically. Right. 1:42:43.160 --> 1:42:44.400 If I want to go trap and I want to 1:42:44.439 --> 1:42:48.080 trap every day in December, I'm in the woods thirty 1:42:48.080 --> 1:42:51.479 one days in December. That takes a lot of drive 1:42:51.520 --> 1:42:54.840 and a lot of you know, a lot of you know, 1:42:54.920 --> 1:42:57.280 you just gotta be involved with it so much more. 1:42:57.720 --> 1:42:59.840 And I think that's that's what drives me to do it, 1:42:59.880 --> 1:43:01.559 is just the challenge of it. That's a pretty good 1:43:01.560 --> 1:43:05.160 point where one of the four years that I really 1:43:05.200 --> 1:43:07.360 trapped hard. Would be like my last two years of 1:43:07.439 --> 1:43:09.360 high school where I got where I could get out 1:43:09.360 --> 1:43:12.479 of school early. I'd go early, but get out earlier, 1:43:12.479 --> 1:43:15.880 and i'd get out pretty like remarkably early, be done 1:43:15.920 --> 1:43:18.680 like one forty or something like that. UM. And then 1:43:18.640 --> 1:43:21.120 in my two first years of college, I did community college. 1:43:21.120 --> 1:43:23.080 I took all night classes so I could trap, so 1:43:23.120 --> 1:43:26.280 I didn't have to show up until five. No, I 1:43:26.320 --> 1:43:28.400 either had to be there at six or seven, and 1:43:28.400 --> 1:43:30.720 I only went four days a week and i'd be 1:43:30.760 --> 1:43:34.759 there until ten at night. UM. I would start October 1:43:34.800 --> 1:43:39.280 fifteen when Fox opened, and I would be in the 1:43:39.320 --> 1:43:47.519 woods every single day. Every day between October and the 1:43:47.640 --> 1:43:49.960 end of January. I would have some business in the 1:43:50.000 --> 1:43:52.559 woods every day. And don't you feel that you have 1:43:52.640 --> 1:43:55.800 a kind of a little better relationship with kind of 1:43:55.920 --> 1:43:58.880 I guess the outdoors or your area, and you're seeing 1:43:58.920 --> 1:44:02.639 stuff every single day. You're in the woods way more 1:44:02.640 --> 1:44:05.040 than like the average deer hunter. I mean, you're interacting 1:44:05.080 --> 1:44:07.559 with stuff that most people can't, and that to me 1:44:07.680 --> 1:44:10.280 is just that's cool. You know, looking for tone ail 1:44:10.320 --> 1:44:13.840 marks in the mud, Yeah, that's all you're prints in 1:44:13.880 --> 1:44:16.519 the mud. But no, to me, That's that's what draws 1:44:16.560 --> 1:44:19.519 me to it is just the challenge. And then you know, 1:44:19.880 --> 1:44:22.280 for my instance, I go ahead and I take it 1:44:22.280 --> 1:44:24.519 a step further if you will, with with my fur 1:44:24.600 --> 1:44:26.040 handling side of it. So, I mean, you know a 1:44:26.080 --> 1:44:28.840 lot of people selling the round or they sell green, 1:44:28.920 --> 1:44:32.439 which is just a skinned critter um and it round 1:44:32.600 --> 1:44:35.680 is hole on the carcass. You caught the thing, you 1:44:35.760 --> 1:44:39.160 dispatched it there lays that's in the round, and like, 1:44:39.200 --> 1:44:43.040 who explain who the hell you'd sell a raccoon in 1:44:43.040 --> 1:44:47.120 the round. Two. So whenever we have times of high 1:44:47.160 --> 1:44:51.320 fur prices, um, there are you know the auction companies 1:44:51.320 --> 1:44:53.479 of fur buyers that will buy that, you know back 1:44:53.640 --> 1:44:56.680 like your fur boom, remember people talking about that's they 1:44:56.680 --> 1:45:01.080 wouldn't even bother taking the time to skin their coons 1:45:01.840 --> 1:45:05.000 because the price difference between finish fur and in the 1:45:05.120 --> 1:45:08.040 round it wasn't enough to justify going through all the 1:45:08.040 --> 1:45:09.840 trouble of it. They could just go out and catch 1:45:09.840 --> 1:45:13.360 more coons and there every night dropping by the fur buyer, 1:45:14.200 --> 1:45:16.280 or you could freeze them, you know, depending on depending 1:45:16.320 --> 1:45:18.519 on your climate too. But yeah, selling in the round 1:45:18.600 --> 1:45:21.200 or selling in the green, um, nafa there at the 1:45:21.280 --> 1:45:25.759 end of their kind of run. They were offering um skinning. 1:45:25.760 --> 1:45:28.759 You could you could, you could send them green furs 1:45:28.840 --> 1:45:31.479 and they would flesh them and stretch them. So a 1:45:31.560 --> 1:45:33.960 lot of buyers, to a lot of your county buyers 1:45:34.360 --> 1:45:39.639 sometimes prefer having green fur or or in the round, 1:45:39.800 --> 1:45:42.760 mainly just green, simply because they know you're not gonna 1:45:42.760 --> 1:45:46.040 screw it up. Got so, I mean, they know that 1:45:46.080 --> 1:45:48.400 they've got a skill set. They're gonna flesh and stretch 1:45:48.400 --> 1:45:51.719 it just how they want it. Because your local buyers 1:45:51.720 --> 1:45:55.040 are selling to the auction houses anyway, so they want 1:45:55.040 --> 1:45:57.280 to get a premium and they want to have it right. 1:45:57.400 --> 1:45:59.960 So you want to know something that's gonna increase tension 1:46:00.080 --> 1:46:03.479 between you and Seth, and it's going to create tension 1:46:03.520 --> 1:46:07.120 between you and Rick, making all sorts of enemies. Seth 1:46:07.200 --> 1:46:10.040 had a top lot mink, Yeah, which he's gonna tell 1:46:10.080 --> 1:46:12.040 what that means. And you had a top lot something. 1:46:12.040 --> 1:46:14.640 I had a top lot gray fox. Okay, tell tell 1:46:14.720 --> 1:46:19.880 Stu all about that. What that means? Oh, the top lot, uh, 1:46:20.000 --> 1:46:22.679 Stu priority knows. Yes, Stu knows about the top lit guarantee. 1:46:23.160 --> 1:46:27.080 I've had a few. Yes, we talked about it. What 1:46:27.200 --> 1:46:29.200 hurts me more is I got that top lot and 1:46:29.760 --> 1:46:34.599 seth He's like, hey, Rick, you're gonna back up, back up, 1:46:34.600 --> 1:46:37.080 back up. Okay, who wants to explain what the hell 1:46:37.080 --> 1:46:39.040 the top lot is? I've never had one, but I 1:46:39.080 --> 1:46:44.439 can do it. Yeah, whoever go for to explain the 1:46:44.479 --> 1:46:46.680 top lot? Yes, his for knowledge is because this is 1:46:46.680 --> 1:46:49.040 for handling one on one okay. So a top lot 1:46:49.840 --> 1:46:51.679 and generally when we we're talking top lot, we're talking 1:46:51.720 --> 1:46:54.479 about selling through the auction houses. So you've got a 1:46:54.479 --> 1:46:56.600 few different ways to sell. Obviously, you can sell to 1:46:56.640 --> 1:47:00.160 your county or local buyer, and then normally they will 1:47:00.160 --> 1:47:02.920 actually sell to the auction houses. So a few years 1:47:02.960 --> 1:47:05.040 ago there were two main auction houses. There was NAPFA, 1:47:05.080 --> 1:47:08.960 which was North American for auction and then FH for harvesters. Right, 1:47:09.600 --> 1:47:11.519 NAPFA went under a few years ago, so now there's 1:47:11.520 --> 1:47:14.880 just for harvesters. So these auction houses they will gather 1:47:15.000 --> 1:47:18.080 up giant lots of fur and they will grade them 1:47:18.080 --> 1:47:22.000 down by size, by color, whole, different whole, different lists 1:47:22.000 --> 1:47:26.120 of stuff. So to get a top lot basically means 1:47:26.160 --> 1:47:31.639 that you have your your pelt in the very top 1:47:32.240 --> 1:47:34.519 of what's selling. So you've got the best color, the 1:47:34.560 --> 1:47:39.280 best size, the best quality. You've got the best of say, 1:47:39.560 --> 1:47:41.839 all the coyotes that are being sold at that auction, 1:47:42.200 --> 1:47:46.240 that top lot. You've got your your pelt in that 1:47:46.320 --> 1:47:49.519 lot that's being sold. And I mean it's a pretty 1:47:49.560 --> 1:47:51.320 big honor really, you know, to be able to get 1:47:51.360 --> 1:47:53.880 that um and they give you a hat, they give 1:47:53.920 --> 1:47:55.880 you a hat, they give you a pen, they give 1:47:55.880 --> 1:47:58.080 you a little certificate with your name on it. It 1:47:58.160 --> 1:48:01.240 tells you so you gotta hear rix very sad story though, 1:48:02.320 --> 1:48:09.160 So it was. It was actually because or maybe actually 1:48:09.240 --> 1:48:14.120 yeah it was. And uh, I gotta this certificate in 1:48:14.160 --> 1:48:16.080 the mail the top lot for that gray fox. And 1:48:16.120 --> 1:48:18.400 I told Seth about it, and he was like all 1:48:18.439 --> 1:48:20.800 pumpt He's like, hey, when you go sell for next time, 1:48:20.840 --> 1:48:23.880 you could take your certificate and show the driver and 1:48:23.880 --> 1:48:25.519 you'll you'll get a hat. And I'm like, oh, sweet, 1:48:25.520 --> 1:48:28.559 well explain what the driver's Oh yeah, okay, so well 1:48:28.720 --> 1:48:31.400 Stu can talk so much better this, but you gotta 1:48:31.520 --> 1:48:34.599 it's a very it's a weird. It's a weird. So 1:48:34.840 --> 1:48:38.680 I'll back up even more. You're doing something illegal to 1:48:38.760 --> 1:48:42.479 the point, and the gentleman Seth used to work for. 1:48:42.680 --> 1:48:45.000 We're kind of my trapping mentors, and they're telling me. 1:48:45.000 --> 1:48:47.080 He's like, all right, you gotta sell your fur now, 1:48:47.120 --> 1:48:50.280 you gotta. I'm like, how do I do that? So 1:48:50.280 --> 1:48:52.760 they're explaining they you gotta go with the th a 1:48:52.840 --> 1:48:59.479 truck seven thirty and drive around back just a truck stop. 1:48:59.600 --> 1:49:03.800 And I thought, Seth and this, gentlemen, we're messing with me, 1:49:03.840 --> 1:49:05.720 and side to show up and then I'll just know 1:49:05.760 --> 1:49:07.840 what to do. And I have my little my little 1:49:08.400 --> 1:49:11.559 bag they gave me and my my sat my Napha sack, 1:49:12.040 --> 1:49:14.320 and I'm sitting there and then when you get there, 1:49:14.600 --> 1:49:24.600 pull your pants, don't and it's always a sketchy And 1:49:25.120 --> 1:49:27.120 I'm sitting there and I started noticing all these other 1:49:27.120 --> 1:49:29.720 trucks pull up and I'm like, okay, I think, and 1:49:29.720 --> 1:49:31.959 it's yeah, like six in the morning. Then this budget 1:49:31.960 --> 1:49:35.240 rental truck comes ripping into the parking lot, just parks 1:49:35.240 --> 1:49:37.960 in the middle back. Guy gets out, opens the back door, 1:49:38.520 --> 1:49:40.800 and I think, I told you. I felt like it's 1:49:40.840 --> 1:49:42.720 like when you're young kid going into gym class for 1:49:42.720 --> 1:49:44.880 the first time in the showers and I'm like, have this. 1:49:45.360 --> 1:49:47.439 I have this little bag I'm like, yeah, I got 1:49:47.479 --> 1:49:49.360 twenty furs in here, and then these dudes are just 1:49:49.400 --> 1:49:53.080 on loaded white bags. I'm like, oh shit, wow, that's 1:49:53.120 --> 1:49:56.800 a lot um. But that was the first couple of times. 1:49:56.840 --> 1:50:00.320 So you you you go there and you get in 1:50:00.360 --> 1:50:02.479 the line, hand in all your bags. They give you. 1:50:03.439 --> 1:50:06.800 It was like the old certificate styles, like they'd write 1:50:06.800 --> 1:50:09.280 on it. They'll be like a pink sheet, a yellow sheet, 1:50:09.320 --> 1:50:10.920 and you'd have to throw one in the bag and 1:50:10.920 --> 1:50:13.360 they'd hand you your you know, and I'm butchering this 1:50:13.400 --> 1:50:18.280 stup and no money changes hands. But that's the pickup 1:50:18.320 --> 1:50:22.320 I'm referring to. So a couple like in the next year, 1:50:22.920 --> 1:50:26.519 I'm at this pickup and I'm like, I have last 1:50:26.600 --> 1:50:29.080 year's top Lot certificate in my hand and I can't 1:50:29.080 --> 1:50:31.360 wait to get that naff a top Lot trapper hat. 1:50:31.400 --> 1:50:35.599 I know it sounds so stupid because I was so 1:50:35.680 --> 1:50:40.559 into it great because the Golden broadered anyway feel and 1:50:40.720 --> 1:50:42.400 I walked up. I was one of the last guys 1:50:42.400 --> 1:50:45.920 in line. We did my for exchange. He uh did 1:50:46.040 --> 1:50:47.519 my sheet and I was like, sir, I also have 1:50:47.560 --> 1:50:49.679 a top Lot certificate here. I was like, I'm wondering 1:50:49.680 --> 1:50:52.240 do you have the hats. And it was this old guy. 1:50:52.280 --> 1:50:55.599 He looks right, just so serious. He's like, oh, I'm sorry, son, 1:50:55.840 --> 1:50:57.960 I'm all out of those hats. I just gave them all, 1:50:58.040 --> 1:51:00.000 like my last one out. And I was like, oh, 1:51:00.280 --> 1:51:02.559 that's all right, you know. But I was so crushed. 1:51:03.160 --> 1:51:05.080 I walked off like I was tough, but I was like, 1:51:05.080 --> 1:51:07.559 oh my god. All I wanted was a damn hat. 1:51:08.640 --> 1:51:10.280 To this day, I don't have one in it. Like 1:51:10.280 --> 1:51:13.519 you're tearing up right now. Man, it's emotional. Yeah, see, man, 1:51:13.560 --> 1:51:15.439 I want to see. I've never had a top lot 1:51:15.479 --> 1:51:19.080 but kind of what I mean, I never would and 1:51:19.400 --> 1:51:22.559 you should be shot if you do. But I'd be 1:51:22.640 --> 1:51:27.680 very tempted to wear that hat. Yeah you got you got? 1:51:27.720 --> 1:51:29.600 What did you wore? And got exposed? People like, let 1:51:29.640 --> 1:51:31.479 me see your certificate? Do you know I'm gonna I 1:51:31.560 --> 1:51:33.760 was gonna frame my certificate. After we talked about it 1:51:33.800 --> 1:51:35.720 a few months, I was like, you have it, I 1:51:35.760 --> 1:51:38.160 still have it. Can hang in the studio here of course. Yeah, 1:51:38.160 --> 1:51:41.160 we're talking about You're like you should frame that, and 1:51:41.200 --> 1:51:42.840 I was like sitting in your truck, like you know 1:51:42.880 --> 1:51:47.160 what I should? Yeah, I've got mine frames? How many 1:51:47.160 --> 1:51:49.760 top lots you got, I've got three through NAFA for 1:51:49.840 --> 1:51:52.599 which ones. I've got a coon, I've got a beaver, 1:51:52.960 --> 1:51:56.160 and I've got a kyote because see the problem is 1:51:56.200 --> 1:51:59.640 now I say a kyote because I'm from Illinois, Midwest, right, 1:52:00.040 --> 1:52:03.280 So there's kind of this thing amongst trappers. You have 1:52:03.400 --> 1:52:06.440 your top lot and then you have your top lot sections. 1:52:07.520 --> 1:52:10.360 So like my beaver, I my beaver was the top lot, 1:52:10.760 --> 1:52:14.479 My coon was the top lot. My coyote was the 1:52:14.479 --> 1:52:17.880 top lot of the section. So like the top the 1:52:17.920 --> 1:52:20.879 best of the ship. It's like you're standing on the podium, 1:52:20.920 --> 1:52:23.080 but the guy your top of the podium, but there's 1:52:23.080 --> 1:52:26.960 still somebody just above you because it's not the top top, 1:52:27.000 --> 1:52:30.360 but it's still the top of that section. The Western 1:52:30.400 --> 1:52:32.680 Pales would be top. They are top. Like I'm never 1:52:32.720 --> 1:52:35.080 gonna get a top lot kyo or I trap ever, 1:52:35.200 --> 1:52:37.360 It's just not gonna happen. But I got the top 1:52:37.439 --> 1:52:40.240 lot of the section. Do you got three hats? No? 1:52:40.400 --> 1:52:42.920 I got one hat because I've got two similar stories 1:52:42.960 --> 1:52:45.439 to what they really dropped the ball on the hats. 1:52:45.560 --> 1:52:47.920 I've got three pins though, yeah, I see how don't 1:52:47.920 --> 1:52:51.479 know the pins with so I cheated out of a 1:52:51.520 --> 1:52:53.920 pin and and yeah, man, but the hats were cool, 1:52:54.000 --> 1:52:56.240 like ninety I've wore mine until it was so ratty 1:52:56.320 --> 1:53:01.320 and nasty. Stu, you kind of talked hat and I'm 1:53:01.320 --> 1:53:04.240 not a hacky. I don't. I very rarely actually wear hats. 1:53:04.240 --> 1:53:06.680 But that was like a badge of honor because I 1:53:06.720 --> 1:53:09.559 do think in the tear of like outdoorsman, trapper is 1:53:09.560 --> 1:53:12.320 a pinnacle and like not a lot of people in 1:53:12.320 --> 1:53:14.280 our generation, we're in the trap and that's what it's like. 1:53:14.320 --> 1:53:16.400 I want that hat so I can wear it, and 1:53:16.520 --> 1:53:17.960 I don't know, I just yeah, I felt like it 1:53:18.000 --> 1:53:20.200 was like a metal And when that old man told 1:53:20.200 --> 1:53:22.040 me I couldn't have one or didn't have it, I 1:53:22.080 --> 1:53:24.840 was like, where's your hat, Seth. I think it's back 1:53:24.880 --> 1:53:29.560 at my mom's place in Pennsylvania. Do you have your certificate? 1:53:29.960 --> 1:53:32.080 I think it's there too, somewhere. Can you ever hunt 1:53:32.080 --> 1:53:35.599 it down? Yeah? You probably have her. Look look around 1:53:35.600 --> 1:53:37.439 for it. Do you want to plug your mass Boot company? 1:53:37.479 --> 1:53:40.960 While we're talking about the Center Boot Company in Belfont, Pennsylvania, 1:53:41.040 --> 1:53:42.880 check it out. If you need to buy boots, don't 1:53:42.920 --> 1:53:45.439 buy him anywhere else. Don't buy him at Zappos. Don't 1:53:45.439 --> 1:53:49.280 buy him at Amazon. Drive to Seth's Mom's store Center 1:53:49.280 --> 1:53:56.439 Boot Company, um Work Hunting Western. They also sell all 1:53:56.439 --> 1:54:00.240 sorts of stuff like belt buckles and leather good If 1:54:00.240 --> 1:54:01.760 you're over there in Pensylvan If you're ever here, go 1:54:01.840 --> 1:54:04.639 to Schnads. If you are there, go to Sasma check 1:54:04.680 --> 1:54:09.680 them out. I have a booth at the the the 1:54:09.800 --> 1:54:13.560 Big Sportsman Show in Harrisburg. Here you can actually go 1:54:13.600 --> 1:54:16.240 meet the real Sess mom. Go go look up their 1:54:16.240 --> 1:54:18.599 booth if you're gonna be there and ask her if 1:54:18.640 --> 1:54:21.760 she can please find Sess hat and top lots certificate. 1:54:21.880 --> 1:54:25.040 Yes that I'm sure that hats because you had it 1:54:25.080 --> 1:54:28.360 in college. You had it on like your wall. Yeah, 1:54:28.560 --> 1:54:29.880 that kind of lost track of it. I don't know 1:54:29.880 --> 1:54:32.360 where it is. But you see, they only give top 1:54:32.400 --> 1:54:35.840 lots for certain species. So for some reason where I'm at, 1:54:36.000 --> 1:54:41.120 we grow like awesome possums. I don't know why, right, 1:54:41.440 --> 1:54:43.840 but back in the day you could pay for all 1:54:43.880 --> 1:54:46.800 your gas by by putting up possums. What is the 1:54:46.880 --> 1:54:51.400 day eleven through fourteen? That's that's my fur boom. Okay, 1:54:51.440 --> 1:54:55.480 so explain the possum market. Well, I mean, you know 1:54:55.520 --> 1:54:58.000 you've got kind of a lower end market with the possums. 1:54:58.280 --> 1:55:01.280 But normally you catch them as I catch and I 1:55:01.280 --> 1:55:03.600 would put them up and I mean, we we grow 1:55:03.680 --> 1:55:07.520 some big possums there, and I would remember, I can't 1:55:07.560 --> 1:55:10.240 say the exact I want to say, like seventeen dollars 1:55:10.240 --> 1:55:12.880 I sold a possum for back in the day. I 1:55:12.880 --> 1:55:15.800 mean I averaged like twelve dollars on them. Yeah, And 1:55:15.920 --> 1:55:19.160 is that is that market collapse now? Yeah? Yeah, yeah, 1:55:19.240 --> 1:55:20.920 it's hard to even get rid of them right now. 1:55:21.080 --> 1:55:22.640 But you were saying. One thing you're telling me that's 1:55:22.680 --> 1:55:28.680 interesting is the skunk for market doesn't fluctuate, not really, No, 1:55:28.880 --> 1:55:31.120 depending on who you go through in the different avenues 1:55:31.200 --> 1:55:34.240 you go through. Skunks are at least what I trapped 1:55:34.240 --> 1:55:37.640 in my area. They're the most consistent cell every year, 1:55:38.200 --> 1:55:42.480 mainly just because their novelty item. So who do you 1:55:42.520 --> 1:55:45.600 sell the skunks to. I've got a couple of private 1:55:45.640 --> 1:55:49.120 buyers who I'm not gonna say, but got you. I mean, 1:55:49.160 --> 1:55:51.360 it's it's kind of a it's it's a niche market, right, 1:55:51.400 --> 1:55:53.400 So I mean, you know you flood the market with 1:55:53.440 --> 1:55:56.400 these niche buyers, then you know you're not gonna have 1:55:56.440 --> 1:55:59.840 your market but yeah, it's it's a very consistent market. 1:56:00.080 --> 1:56:02.080 And how many skunks did you put up this year? 1:56:03.160 --> 1:56:06.560 Probably I don't know number. I'm saying between sixty and 1:56:06.560 --> 1:56:10.000 seventy so far you flushed and stretched between sixty and 1:56:10.040 --> 1:56:13.480 seventy skunks this year. You don't even smell, Like, how 1:56:13.480 --> 1:56:18.960 do you dispatch them? Because that's that's always real controversial. Uh, 1:56:19.000 --> 1:56:22.560 A lot of guys will inject them with acidtone. I 1:56:22.560 --> 1:56:24.760 I shoot everything. I'm not going to take the time. 1:56:24.840 --> 1:56:27.160 I'm running in gunning the whole time, So I do 1:56:27.240 --> 1:56:29.920 a center body shot, try to hit the vitals. I 1:56:29.960 --> 1:56:33.680 think the trick is a very slow bullet, something that's 1:56:33.720 --> 1:56:36.720 not going to create a lot of impact, and you 1:56:36.880 --> 1:56:40.160 probably get maybe one out of eight, one out of 1:56:40.240 --> 1:56:43.040 nine that spray because I want the essence, right, So 1:56:43.120 --> 1:56:45.560 that adds to the value of the skunk, is that 1:56:45.680 --> 1:56:48.120 you sell the fur. But then you there's also a 1:56:48.160 --> 1:56:51.120 market for the essence, and so essence right now is 1:56:51.480 --> 1:56:56.840 you know right about ounds average? Yeah, So how much 1:56:56.840 --> 1:57:00.880 do you get out of one skunk about? I mean, like, oh, 1:57:01.360 --> 1:57:04.600 since wise, So it just depends on if they spray 1:57:04.680 --> 1:57:07.240 or not, if they're full, you know, all over half 1:57:07.240 --> 1:57:10.720 an ounce. So you take a skunk that's you know, 1:57:12.000 --> 1:57:15.120 if he's got good white stripes, and if he's full essence, 1:57:15.440 --> 1:57:17.520 you know, throw another ten to twelve dollars on it. 1:57:18.360 --> 1:57:21.400 That's not a bad deal for something you're not necessarily 1:57:21.440 --> 1:57:23.520 targeting either. I mean there are guys that target them, 1:57:23.520 --> 1:57:27.000 but for me, there by catch, ye, So well why 1:57:27.040 --> 1:57:31.280 not just set specifically for him because I'm out there 1:57:31.280 --> 1:57:35.240 targeting other species And I say by catch and the 1:57:35.280 --> 1:57:38.600 fact that I'm in the same general area so I 1:57:38.640 --> 1:57:40.000 catch them in a lot of my coon sets is 1:57:40.000 --> 1:57:41.840 where I catch them. Because you're gonna catch them whether 1:57:41.840 --> 1:57:45.200 you're targeting him or not. Yeah. So, and like I said, 1:57:45.200 --> 1:57:47.200 you want that, you want the good ones. Um, you 1:57:47.200 --> 1:57:48.760 know you're gonna get a little bit more money for 1:57:48.760 --> 1:57:51.560 the good white stripes. That's what they want. I mean, 1:57:51.600 --> 1:57:53.960 that's that's what the novelty market is wanting. But no, 1:57:54.080 --> 1:57:56.800 the skunk is an underrated for for sure. And if 1:57:56.800 --> 1:57:59.560 you have never seen a skunk for in general, they've 1:57:59.600 --> 1:58:03.000 got all some for it's real long, kind of silky 1:58:03.120 --> 1:58:06.400 for I mean, it really is a student you say, 1:58:06.480 --> 1:58:09.320 they're trappers even starting to target them now just because 1:58:09.320 --> 1:58:11.640 of that market for sure. Yeah, there there's several guys 1:58:11.680 --> 1:58:14.960 that I know that they go out and pretty much 1:58:15.000 --> 1:58:16.520 target them. You know, do you think me and Rick 1:58:16.520 --> 1:58:18.520 would be all pull top Lot off those giants I 1:58:18.560 --> 1:58:21.000 was showing you earlier today, we'll see. That's one funny. 1:58:21.840 --> 1:58:24.160 I never did get a top Lot skunk. I don't 1:58:24.160 --> 1:58:26.480 think they give out the certificates. That's a funny, you know, 1:58:26.480 --> 1:58:28.880 it's kind of I haven't gotten that hat. Yeah, and 1:58:28.920 --> 1:58:31.560 I never sold a skunks. I don't know because those 1:58:31.560 --> 1:58:35.720 are some big skunks though. You have to Yeah, you 1:58:35.840 --> 1:58:37.640 have to go to Fern harvests now. And I don't 1:58:37.640 --> 1:58:41.000 know if they give out for forgiven my ignorance here, 1:58:41.160 --> 1:58:44.040 what is the market for the essence? Like what are 1:58:44.040 --> 1:58:46.800 people using it for? What do they want it for? 1:58:47.720 --> 1:58:52.560 So the main market is for bait makers. Um, it's 1:58:52.600 --> 1:58:56.440 also you can google essence and come up with I 1:58:56.440 --> 1:58:59.040 mean it it is there's a large market for The 1:58:59.120 --> 1:59:04.040 main market is essence for for lure, for trapping. That 1:59:04.120 --> 1:59:07.680 takes a lot of it. Um. You know when it's 1:59:07.680 --> 1:59:10.440 so like we were running Martin sets, right, There's not 1:59:10.480 --> 1:59:12.520 a lot of skunks in the mountains, so those guys 1:59:12.560 --> 1:59:15.240 can't access you know they don't have access to skunks. 1:59:15.240 --> 1:59:18.520 So but there are different different markets for it too 1:59:18.520 --> 1:59:22.920 as well. Um, I think I could be wrong. I 1:59:22.960 --> 1:59:27.000 think there's some food additives that stu you might have hurt. 1:59:27.400 --> 1:59:29.640 I feel like years ago was used in perfumes a 1:59:29.640 --> 1:59:32.600 lot perfect. They would pull apart the scent, but like 1:59:32.640 --> 1:59:36.240 what sticks and there's some way to break it down? 1:59:36.760 --> 1:59:40.360 Casts huge? Yeah, casts a hundred bucks of pound right 1:59:40.360 --> 1:59:43.080 now casts a hunter bucks. So like castor is always 1:59:43.080 --> 1:59:46.200 funny because like around the holidays, we're talking about it. 1:59:46.240 --> 1:59:47.640 We're talking about a thing that like when you skin 1:59:47.720 --> 1:59:50.160 a beaver on each side of the vent, it would 1:59:50.200 --> 1:59:52.000 be like if you're like if you reach down and 1:59:52.080 --> 2:00:01.160 grab on yourself male or female whatever, above your how 2:00:01.200 --> 2:00:04.200 would I put it? What would be that little area? 2:00:05.560 --> 2:00:08.520 I know, a vulgar term for that little area exactly 2:00:08.600 --> 2:00:15.760 between the in between zones, not your taint. It's like 2:00:17.080 --> 2:00:19.600 just like a vulgar term for what that is? What 2:00:19.680 --> 2:00:22.640 is it like if you were gonna I don't know, 2:00:22.920 --> 2:00:26.800 like above your genitals and on either side it's like 2:00:26.800 --> 2:00:29.040 a little soft area where your legs join up to 2:00:29.080 --> 2:00:32.240 your body. What is that called that spot? If you 2:00:32.280 --> 2:00:36.600 had a hernia. Oh yeah, picture you had a hernia 2:00:37.360 --> 2:00:40.640 on a beaver, there sits. If you had a double hernia, 2:00:41.960 --> 2:00:44.480 growing area, Yeah, you're growing area. There sits. These two 2:00:44.520 --> 2:00:47.400 sacks full of castor, it looks like a brain, looks 2:00:47.400 --> 2:00:51.680 like two brains hiding out down in there um. And 2:00:51.720 --> 2:00:55.839 they use it for imitate like artificial vanilla. Vanilla extracts 2:00:55.840 --> 2:00:58.080 a big one, a lot of the goals. I think 2:00:58.080 --> 2:01:00.520 there's a big market in Turkey for something. They fume. 2:01:00.600 --> 2:01:02.600 It's huge and perfume because it really does have a 2:01:02.680 --> 2:01:06.280 sweet smell. Hundred bucks of pound right now, the castor. 2:01:06.360 --> 2:01:08.360 If you get a beaver loaded with castor, his caster 2:01:08.480 --> 2:01:11.160 is worth more than all of his other parts. Is 2:01:11.160 --> 2:01:14.080 that has I've been with Steve sitting on a bunch 2:01:14.080 --> 2:01:17.760 of pounds of it trapping? Is it the weight the 2:01:18.160 --> 2:01:21.560 dried out weight? Yeah? Generally there's a few different ways, 2:01:21.560 --> 2:01:24.440 but generally the accepted way is to have it dried. 2:01:24.640 --> 2:01:26.680 Can I give you a huge bag of beaver casters 2:01:26.720 --> 2:01:29.680 and then you'll like on me like a stretcher or 2:01:29.680 --> 2:01:32.200 something like that. Were already gave me two stretchers. If 2:01:32.240 --> 2:01:33.960 I give you a big bag of beaver casters, we 2:01:34.000 --> 2:01:38.600 call it into even get that hat from him? Would 2:01:38.640 --> 2:01:41.400 you fly home with the beaver casters? We can fly 2:01:41.480 --> 2:01:42.920 home with. I don't know. I'm gonna let you home 2:01:42.920 --> 2:01:44.720 with a bunch of beaver casters. Now you need him 2:01:44.760 --> 2:01:47.640 for bait, because that's one universal bait. I know, it's 2:01:47.640 --> 2:01:51.840 a universal attracting No beaver caster is is where it's 2:01:51.840 --> 2:01:54.680 at if you're trapping right now. So I'm gonna give 2:01:54.680 --> 2:01:56.480 you a bunch of beaver cast and the oil sacks too. 2:01:56.640 --> 2:01:58.120 You can also take the oil sacs. I kind of 2:01:58.200 --> 2:02:00.800 quit saying because me and Seth here we're old lure makers. 2:02:00.800 --> 2:02:04.520 I don't let you know that, and we would we 2:02:04.600 --> 2:02:08.320 made We made like a lot. Oh yeah, is that 2:02:08.320 --> 2:02:09.960 that stuff we used the other day? Is that's still 2:02:10.040 --> 2:02:12.880 from the main stuff? We made like a couple of 2:02:12.960 --> 2:02:15.760 quart jars of that stuff, and we took a valerian 2:02:15.880 --> 2:02:19.960 root appalescence and a lot of beaver caster and a 2:02:20.040 --> 2:02:29.040 lot of glycering. I should work that stuff now, the 2:02:29.080 --> 2:02:33.200 castor definitely where it's at. Are you selling castor I'm 2:02:33.200 --> 2:02:35.560 selling caster? I take what because I make a lout 2:02:35.560 --> 2:02:38.280 of my own bait, So I take every year what 2:02:38.400 --> 2:02:40.360 I need to get me through Basically the next year 2:02:40.600 --> 2:02:42.480 and then I'll sell the rest. Let me give you 2:02:42.520 --> 2:02:44.560 a couple of bags of it. Okay, that's why you'd 2:02:44.600 --> 2:02:47.280 have it. I want it. What's your beaver pressure like 2:02:47.880 --> 2:02:49.840 in southern Illinois is is there a lot of people 2:02:49.880 --> 2:02:52.000 trying to catch beavers there? There's not a lot of 2:02:52.000 --> 2:02:55.280 beavers where I'm at. Okay, So that's that's the problem, 2:02:55.280 --> 2:02:57.200 more than anything, is that you've got to be very 2:02:57.360 --> 2:03:00.600 conscious about. You know, I've always said where I'm at 2:03:00.720 --> 2:03:02.680 right now, if I wanted to, I could take two 2:03:02.720 --> 2:03:06.240 weeks and I could basically trap out my my area. 2:03:06.440 --> 2:03:08.840 And so I've got to be very conscious about how 2:03:08.840 --> 2:03:11.120 I trapped the beaver. I trapped far away from the house, 2:03:11.480 --> 2:03:14.320 trying to get the big, the big you know, parent 2:03:14.360 --> 2:03:16.520 beat far away from the beaver house. Yeah, because generally 2:03:16.560 --> 2:03:19.080 the further way you get from the house, you'll kind 2:03:19.080 --> 2:03:22.120 of keep yourself from catching the small kit beavers. They 2:03:22.120 --> 2:03:24.760 just don't travel as far. Uh. And then I just 2:03:25.080 --> 2:03:26.880 you know, once I go in, I'll take you know, 2:03:27.000 --> 2:03:28.760 two or three out of the house and then I'm done. 2:03:28.800 --> 2:03:30.600 I'll leave it just to kind of have seed for 2:03:30.680 --> 2:03:34.040 next year. And that's just like how big is your 2:03:34.080 --> 2:03:38.640 trapping area. Like, so my trapping area is dictated a 2:03:38.640 --> 2:03:41.160 lot by my work, being that I work construction, so 2:03:41.200 --> 2:03:44.120 I have a giant range that I've worked over the years, 2:03:44.160 --> 2:03:48.000 and over the years I've set up sort of trap 2:03:48.080 --> 2:03:51.680 lines to correlate with where I'm working, you know, because 2:03:51.680 --> 2:03:53.400 I mean I'm working every day, so I want to 2:03:53.440 --> 2:03:55.680 be able to run the line on the way back 2:03:55.680 --> 2:03:58.080 home from work. You know, tell tell priority this, This 2:03:58.160 --> 2:04:01.400 will help them conceptualize it. Like if you tell them 2:04:01.440 --> 2:04:05.800 how many permissions permissions, how many permissions you maintain at 2:04:05.720 --> 2:04:10.800 any given time, between a hundred fifty landowner permission getting 2:04:10.840 --> 2:04:14.520 that many white tail permissions, it would never happen. Well, 2:04:14.560 --> 2:04:16.760 because that's the only way I can trap. So we 2:04:16.840 --> 2:04:19.400 have very We have no public land where I'm at. 2:04:19.560 --> 2:04:23.440 But yeah, he mad, but you don't give him your spiel. Yes, 2:04:23.560 --> 2:04:27.320 So I mean he walks up with traps and starts 2:04:27.480 --> 2:04:30.839 jamming his hands into him. Don't give him an education, 2:04:30.960 --> 2:04:33.560 you know, because I mean the first So in general, 2:04:33.840 --> 2:04:37.560 people are worried about their dogs. So in general, I'm 2:04:37.600 --> 2:04:42.600 gonna get nine knows to one yes, even for trapping permission. Yeah, 2:04:42.600 --> 2:04:45.320 that's people, don't they don't understand. They don't want you 2:04:45.360 --> 2:04:47.080 on it, which you know, it's their lands whatever, But 2:04:47.120 --> 2:04:49.600 I mean that's kind of my ratio is is nine 2:04:49.600 --> 2:04:51.800 knows to one yes. So you'll go up, you'll have 2:04:51.800 --> 2:04:55.360 a conversation with them. That's better than Spencer's white Tail 2:04:55.480 --> 2:04:57.840 ratio wasn't like a hundred and fifty and he got 2:04:57.880 --> 2:05:03.120 one or something. He got one a hundred and fifty letters. 2:05:03.200 --> 2:05:07.879 He got like an A plus. He was like grading. 2:05:07.920 --> 2:05:11.080 He got like an A plus, a couple of season 2:05:11.120 --> 2:05:14.280 a D minus. Anyway, go on, So no, I'll go 2:05:14.360 --> 2:05:16.040 up and try to, you know, more than anything, try 2:05:16.040 --> 2:05:17.880 to educate the people about trapping, because I mean a 2:05:17.920 --> 2:05:19.320 lot of people just don't know about it, you know. 2:05:19.400 --> 2:05:21.560 And then, like I said, then they have the illusion 2:05:21.680 --> 2:05:23.840 that I'm gonna go trap where you're gonna bring out 2:05:23.840 --> 2:05:26.800 a giant bear trap with teeth, you know, and and 2:05:27.040 --> 2:05:29.400 you know it's just not the case. So you know, 2:05:29.440 --> 2:05:32.680 if that fails, I'll normally get out traps and I'll hear, 2:05:32.760 --> 2:05:35.320 this is what I'm gonna use, and you know, nine 2:05:35.320 --> 2:05:36.760 times out of ten, I'll stick my hand in him 2:05:36.800 --> 2:05:39.120 and show, you know, I'm not losing fingers or breaking 2:05:39.120 --> 2:05:42.000 bones or anything. And you know for me where I'm at, 2:05:42.080 --> 2:05:43.840 because I do live in what I would consider a 2:05:43.880 --> 2:05:47.760 fairly populated area. Kind of last resort, I'll go to 2:05:47.800 --> 2:05:51.600 the dog proof traps, which if you not understand what 2:05:51.640 --> 2:05:55.560 a dog proof is, it's basically a cylinder and so 2:05:55.680 --> 2:05:58.520 like a coon of skunk apossum, they all have a 2:05:58.520 --> 2:06:00.320 lot of dexterity in their paws. They kind of have 2:06:00.320 --> 2:06:02.600 a hand, if you will. So with a dog proof trap, 2:06:02.640 --> 2:06:05.760 if you can picture about a three inch tube that's 2:06:05.800 --> 2:06:08.440 about an inch and a quarter in diameter and very 2:06:08.440 --> 2:06:11.440 bottom of it as a lever on it that you 2:06:11.480 --> 2:06:14.080 actually have to pull, as opposed to a foothold trap, 2:06:14.360 --> 2:06:16.200 where you know, the critter just puts his paw in 2:06:16.200 --> 2:06:18.520 it and then the jaws closed around. With these dog 2:06:18.600 --> 2:06:23.120 proof traps, the opening is small enough that that ideally 2:06:23.360 --> 2:06:25.880 a dog can't get his paw down in there, and 2:06:25.880 --> 2:06:27.760 you have to actually have dextery to pull up on 2:06:27.800 --> 2:06:29.560 that track. You can only catch things that could pick 2:06:29.560 --> 2:06:33.080 a lot pretty much. So I will use that as 2:06:33.320 --> 2:06:36.120 you know, kind of a last resort so to speak, 2:06:36.120 --> 2:06:37.840 to get permission, you know, and say hey, I can 2:06:37.880 --> 2:06:40.120 you know, with the right bait, I can trap around 2:06:40.120 --> 2:06:42.720 all your cats and you know, your farm dogs and 2:06:42.760 --> 2:06:45.120 everything like that, and sometimes that kind of seals the deal. 2:06:45.360 --> 2:06:46.760 If you have a hunter, let's say you had a 2:06:47.800 --> 2:06:50.200 how many you got like a hundred permissions? If you 2:06:50.320 --> 2:06:53.120 let's say that hundred permissions, how many those are dog 2:06:53.160 --> 2:06:58.600 proof only? I would say close to half. Huh, close 2:06:58.640 --> 2:07:00.440 to half. I mean that's the only way I can 2:07:00.440 --> 2:07:02.000 do it. And that's the reason I use so many 2:07:02.000 --> 2:07:05.440 dog proofs in my trapping is because you know, I've 2:07:05.440 --> 2:07:07.080 gotta do what I gotta do what I like. You 2:07:07.160 --> 2:07:09.920 can't do kyote work on those places. Can't do kyote work, 2:07:10.000 --> 2:07:12.560 can't set one and A have no two twenties. Have 2:07:12.640 --> 2:07:18.000 you had any luck like getting permission where like a 2:07:18.200 --> 2:07:21.560 hunting leases where they're like after white tails or turkeys 2:07:21.640 --> 2:07:24.680 or waterfowl because those guys want you coming into there's 2:07:24.720 --> 2:07:28.240 a few. Yeah, they want the predators gone. Um, you 2:07:28.280 --> 2:07:31.440 know which they always have stipulations though, I don't want 2:07:31.440 --> 2:07:33.200 you in here a week before season or you know, 2:07:33.200 --> 2:07:35.400 a week after season, and they want to really make 2:07:35.440 --> 2:07:37.520 you work for it, you know, which is at least 2:07:37.520 --> 2:07:40.839 in Illinois. You know, we've got a shotgun firearm season 2:07:41.560 --> 2:07:45.600 starting November. Every other weekend for a month and a half. 2:07:45.640 --> 2:07:48.480 So it makes it really difficult to work around, you know, 2:07:48.520 --> 2:07:50.360 so you've got to do a lot of planning and 2:07:50.360 --> 2:07:51.840 and different things like that to be able to work 2:07:51.840 --> 2:07:54.600 around and actually trap an area like that. Explain your 2:07:54.880 --> 2:07:58.000 we talked about otters today, Explain how it works for you, 2:07:58.040 --> 2:08:00.760 like in a regulatory sense when you talk about like 2:08:01.080 --> 2:08:04.120 you talk about like getting my honors, so to get 2:08:04.200 --> 2:08:06.360 my orders in Illinois, we got a season. I guess 2:08:06.400 --> 2:08:10.680 it was eight nine years ago or so by now, Uh, 2:08:10.880 --> 2:08:13.280 so I can go out in Illinois. I'm allowed five 2:08:13.400 --> 2:08:17.320 orders for my license, so I can go out and 2:08:17.320 --> 2:08:20.000 and target the order. Once I catch it, I make 2:08:20.040 --> 2:08:22.240 a phone call to the d n R and they 2:08:22.280 --> 2:08:25.800 send me a a site tag and then I tag 2:08:25.880 --> 2:08:27.800 that order wants it as a site tag on it, 2:08:28.040 --> 2:08:34.240 Then I'm good to sell it. And you every year 2:08:34.320 --> 2:08:36.440 can get five. I can get every yeah, every year. 2:08:36.640 --> 2:08:38.400 And what do you do with those five? I sell 2:08:38.480 --> 2:08:41.800 them to taxidermy trade or fur trade. I sell a 2:08:41.880 --> 2:08:44.160 couple every year to taxidermy, but the majority of them 2:08:44.160 --> 2:08:47.560 goes to fur trade. Normally I can find somebody local 2:08:47.640 --> 2:08:49.720 that wants I'm as a wall hanger that I could 2:08:49.760 --> 2:08:51.800 sell them to, you know, because we're only dealing with five. 2:08:51.920 --> 2:08:54.680 So it comes and goes back in the day. You know, 2:08:54.720 --> 2:08:58.920 I was selling them back in the day again, you know, 2:08:58.960 --> 2:09:00.520 there's more money and so on them at the fur 2:09:00.560 --> 2:09:02.960 trade than it was selling them local. But what was 2:09:03.000 --> 2:09:04.760 the highest and otter Pelt went for it that you 2:09:04.760 --> 2:09:08.240 can remember in terms of your furbroom. I remember selling 2:09:08.240 --> 2:09:11.440 a couple for fifty bucks, So I mean nothing crazy, 2:09:11.720 --> 2:09:14.240 you know, which whenever you're looking at a fifty dollar 2:09:14.320 --> 2:09:15.840 or you're looking at a huge critter, you know, you 2:09:15.840 --> 2:09:17.680 feel like you should be getting more for him anyway, 2:09:17.800 --> 2:09:20.560 you know. But so how is it that you wand 2:09:20.640 --> 2:09:23.880 up deciding to do like all the instructional videos. Did 2:09:23.880 --> 2:09:25.240 you do it as a way to like did you 2:09:25.240 --> 2:09:28.040 think it would be a way to make money? No? No, 2:09:28.160 --> 2:09:31.440 because there's there's no money in it. But there's no 2:09:31.520 --> 2:09:34.640 money just making YouTube videos not for me, because YouTube 2:09:34.720 --> 2:09:36.640 so restricted and you don't have and you don't have 2:09:36.760 --> 2:09:39.960 you don't sell equipment or anything. No. No, so YouTube 2:09:40.080 --> 2:09:43.040 so restricted on their stuff that you know, everybody hears 2:09:43.040 --> 2:09:48.320 about monetization of videos, and my content is not monetization, 2:09:48.800 --> 2:09:52.120 you know, the YouTube won't let you monetize your videos, 2:09:52.320 --> 2:09:55.880 or YouTube won't monetize because of my content because they 2:09:55.880 --> 2:09:58.720 feel that it's it's like an animal cruelty issue, and 2:09:58.760 --> 2:10:00.960 there's a fine line you to play. You know, YouTube 2:10:01.000 --> 2:10:03.200 is huge with blood. You know you can't show blood, 2:10:04.000 --> 2:10:06.160 and you know there's a strike rule too, so you're 2:10:06.200 --> 2:10:08.840 always kind of walking that fine line of you know, 2:10:09.080 --> 2:10:12.320 even if this is demonetized per se, I've still gotta 2:10:12.480 --> 2:10:14.880 not get a strike on my channel because then they 2:10:14.880 --> 2:10:16.360 could just you could wake up one morning and it 2:10:16.400 --> 2:10:18.360 could just be done. You know. But you've never lost 2:10:18.360 --> 2:10:20.920 your channel, never lost my channel. I've had two strikes before. 2:10:21.240 --> 2:10:24.120 And you're telling me that too, that YouTube's policy makes 2:10:24.120 --> 2:10:27.600 it that you're afraid to like redo and make new 2:10:27.760 --> 2:10:31.120 versions of your high performing videos. Correct. Yeah, yeah, so 2:10:31.160 --> 2:10:33.120 a lot of my videos, which I guess to kind 2:10:33.120 --> 2:10:36.360 of get back to your initial questions. So we're talking 2:10:36.440 --> 2:10:39.480 back back in the day. Um, this was ten years ago. 2:10:39.520 --> 2:10:41.200 I've been doing YouTube now for this is my tenth 2:10:41.280 --> 2:10:45.440 here doing it, and uh, which kind of correlates right 2:10:45.480 --> 2:10:48.560 with the middle of the last fur boom. And I've 2:10:48.560 --> 2:10:50.160 been trapping for a few years, you know, and I've 2:10:50.160 --> 2:10:52.320 been putting on my fur and you know, not to 2:10:52.360 --> 2:10:53.840 pat myself on the back, but I mean I kind 2:10:53.840 --> 2:10:55.760 of felt like I knew what I was doing. And 2:10:55.800 --> 2:10:57.400 I remember, like what was Rick was saying. You go 2:10:57.480 --> 2:10:59.640 up to the NAFA truck, you know, and you're sitting 2:10:59.640 --> 2:11:02.560 there and it standing there, and you know, of course 2:11:02.800 --> 2:11:04.520 during a fur boom, you've got a lot of new 2:11:04.560 --> 2:11:06.640 guys coming in. You know that that aren't there because 2:11:06.640 --> 2:11:09.960 they're just there for the money. And red fox are 2:11:10.040 --> 2:11:13.000 pretty rare around my area, you know, not very common. 2:11:13.800 --> 2:11:17.600 And at this time, you know, ten years ago, there 2:11:17.640 --> 2:11:19.920 wasn't a lot of literature out there about trapping. You know, 2:11:20.000 --> 2:11:22.840 you were fur fishing game, you were trappers, but there 2:11:22.880 --> 2:11:24.520 was just a few magazines, you know, but for the 2:11:24.520 --> 2:11:26.840 most part, there wasn't a lot of information out there. 2:11:27.400 --> 2:11:30.320 It was kind of secretive. Really. I remember walking up 2:11:30.320 --> 2:11:33.600 to the NAFFA truck and there was this guy and 2:11:33.640 --> 2:11:36.040 he must have found a pocket or red fox, which 2:11:36.080 --> 2:11:37.920 you know, like I said, around my are is pretty rare, 2:11:38.520 --> 2:11:40.240 and he had him hanging there and he didn't have 2:11:40.280 --> 2:11:42.200 an alfa back because it was the first year and 2:11:42.280 --> 2:11:45.440 those things were just butchered. I mean, they you could 2:11:45.440 --> 2:11:47.440 just tell the guy did not know what he was doing. 2:11:47.840 --> 2:11:51.040 And I remember that I told myself. I was like, well, 2:11:51.400 --> 2:11:52.960 I could do this. I could. I could put out 2:11:53.520 --> 2:11:56.280 content you know that people could could view and put 2:11:56.360 --> 2:11:58.240 up there their fur right, you know, because I feel 2:11:58.240 --> 2:12:00.240 like you're gonna take the animally, might as well do 2:12:00.320 --> 2:12:02.640 it justice and put it up right. And it was 2:12:02.680 --> 2:12:04.880 actually that night I went home, made a YouTube channel. 2:12:04.920 --> 2:12:09.000 And then that following season, Yeah, that following I was 2:12:09.040 --> 2:12:11.560 the first thing you launched on it. I was hunting 2:12:11.560 --> 2:12:14.600 with my coonhound because the season was still in the 2:12:14.640 --> 2:12:16.720 season was still in for that. So that was the 2:12:16.720 --> 2:12:19.600 first video I ever uploaded. Was was hunting with my coonhound. 2:12:20.400 --> 2:12:24.680 And then that following year, uh, that following trapping season, 2:12:24.760 --> 2:12:27.680 I started with the for handling videos, and I did 2:12:27.880 --> 2:12:29.880 for handling videos on them just about all the all 2:12:29.920 --> 2:12:33.320 the critters in my area from you know, the processes 2:12:33.440 --> 2:12:35.760 catching them, skinning them, fleshing. I'm stretching them, the whole deal. 2:12:35.880 --> 2:12:38.280 So and and talk about why you can't why you 2:12:38.320 --> 2:12:40.760 don't want to redo them. So I've tried to redo 2:12:40.800 --> 2:12:43.280 them a couple of times, and every time I upload them, 2:12:43.360 --> 2:12:46.800 they very quickly get demonetized, which sucks because you know, 2:12:46.920 --> 2:12:50.000 they find it because it's new, Yeah, because YouTube finds it. 2:12:50.040 --> 2:12:52.960 Because so all my old videos are demonetized anyway, but 2:12:53.040 --> 2:12:55.600 they're still up there, so it's not like they can 2:12:55.880 --> 2:12:58.120 strike me on them. You know, they've already demonetized them, 2:12:58.120 --> 2:13:01.120 but new videos, so they don't go strike you about 2:13:01.120 --> 2:13:04.000 ten year old stuff. No. I woke up one morning 2:13:04.000 --> 2:13:06.640 a few years ago and I had like seventy five 2:13:06.760 --> 2:13:10.880 videos that were all demonetized, and I had a strike overnight. Yeah, 2:13:11.200 --> 2:13:13.520 it's just all yellow on my on my page. They 2:13:13.600 --> 2:13:17.440 hit me hard. I couldn't I couldn't upload for fifteen, 2:13:17.480 --> 2:13:19.480 fifteen or twenty days. I can't remember what it was. 2:13:19.480 --> 2:13:22.960 They like banned me from it. So yeah, no, I've 2:13:23.000 --> 2:13:25.320 tried in the past because I said, obviously I didn't 2:13:25.320 --> 2:13:26.880 know what the hell I was doing back then. You know, 2:13:26.920 --> 2:13:29.200 I had a borrowed camera that I set up in 2:13:29.280 --> 2:13:31.400 my shop, you know. And do you ever think about 2:13:31.440 --> 2:13:34.520 doing what's that called? Were you like a lot of 2:13:34.560 --> 2:13:38.000 podcasts are doing it Patreon? Right, have you ever thought 2:13:38.000 --> 2:13:41.640 about trying to do a fur handling thing? Um, a 2:13:41.640 --> 2:13:45.880 fur handling series like Patreon where people just donate like 2:13:45.920 --> 2:13:48.160 people just come in and view and donate a little money. 2:13:48.600 --> 2:13:52.080 So I actually do have a Patreon I and I've 2:13:52.120 --> 2:13:56.920 tried it. The problem is, especially nowadays, YouTube is where 2:13:56.920 --> 2:14:01.240 the traffic is I understand. So you the video streaming 2:14:01.240 --> 2:14:04.080 service on the plan. So you've got to have that 2:14:04.160 --> 2:14:07.960 audience in that draw to be able to So if 2:14:07.960 --> 2:14:09.520 you do on yourself, you're just never gonna people are 2:14:09.560 --> 2:14:11.640 gonna find it. You're gonna go find something find and 2:14:11.960 --> 2:14:14.640 very few people I mean especially now. You know, back 2:14:14.640 --> 2:14:17.320 then I was one of the first people. I was 2:14:17.320 --> 2:14:20.120 putting out trapping content, you know, and and that kind 2:14:20.120 --> 2:14:23.040 of content. Now everybody and the Brothers got a channel. 2:14:23.120 --> 2:14:26.240 You know, they're putting out the content. So people aren't 2:14:26.240 --> 2:14:29.200 gonna go pay to watch something that you know, they 2:14:29.200 --> 2:14:31.920 can just go right down the search bar and go 2:14:32.000 --> 2:14:34.720 search too. So it's tough. You know, you're in a 2:14:34.760 --> 2:14:38.760 real pickle. Pickle, Yeah, but it's been fun. Can they 2:14:38.800 --> 2:14:43.440 just still support though? Anyway? Yeah, I've got to pay 2:14:43.920 --> 2:14:47.480 be set up for it. But I mean it doesn't 2:14:47.520 --> 2:14:49.280 have a lot of traffic that goes towards it. Like 2:14:49.320 --> 2:14:54.560 I said, huh, some people it just searched con Creek 2:14:54.560 --> 2:14:59.440 Outdoors on on Patreon, but you won't find it through YouTube. No, No, 2:14:59.560 --> 2:15:02.000 it's and a link underneath all my videos. So if 2:15:02.000 --> 2:15:04.000 people are out there to listen to this that like 2:15:04.080 --> 2:15:07.120 Stue Miller's Coon Creek Outdoors for handling and trapping videos, 2:15:07.160 --> 2:15:09.600 they would need to go to Patreon and then find 2:15:09.680 --> 2:15:12.320 you there and give you a little jingle. Yeah, that's 2:15:12.360 --> 2:15:14.040 one way to support, you know. I feel like that's 2:15:14.040 --> 2:15:15.840 why I'm gonna give you all that beaver cast, because 2:15:15.880 --> 2:15:19.080 I haven't been in that page to pay you. There's 2:15:19.120 --> 2:15:20.960 not there's not a lot there, and I don't honestly, 2:15:20.960 --> 2:15:23.040 I don't post a lot of videos there simply just 2:15:23.080 --> 2:15:27.200 because the traffic there is not justifiable to all the 2:15:27.200 --> 2:15:30.080 work that goes into it. But no, it's like I said, I, 2:15:30.440 --> 2:15:32.480 you don't do it for the money, you know, just 2:15:32.640 --> 2:15:35.360 like Rick probably knows. You know, you don't trap for 2:15:35.360 --> 2:15:36.920 the money either, not right now. I mean you can 2:15:37.000 --> 2:15:40.040 trap for the heritage and the sport of it, you know. 2:15:40.280 --> 2:15:45.000 Yeah that romantic Yeah, it just drips the roman you know, 2:15:45.200 --> 2:15:48.640 you're all about traditional practices and trapping is one of 2:15:48.680 --> 2:15:52.400 the oldest. You know, it drips the romance. Yeah, that's 2:15:52.400 --> 2:15:53.600 all I wanted to read about when I was a 2:15:53.680 --> 2:15:55.800 kid man, because kids want to go live out in 2:15:55.840 --> 2:15:57.680 the woods and make the living off the woods. And 2:15:57.720 --> 2:15:59.640 I didn't know about writing. I thought you had to 2:15:59.640 --> 2:16:03.480 do it through trapping. What was I am for a surprise? 2:16:07.080 --> 2:16:10.480 Do you ever do uh any uh like road trip 2:16:10.600 --> 2:16:13.680 trapping vacations for stuff you don't get to trap for 2:16:13.920 --> 2:16:16.400 this year near home? This was my first year. Yeah, 2:16:16.680 --> 2:16:19.840 this year. Yeah, the one to me, Stu came out 2:16:19.840 --> 2:16:23.640 and me and Rick and Stu uh got abused out 2:16:23.640 --> 2:16:27.880 in the that was that was a hard, hard trip. 2:16:27.920 --> 2:16:30.560 But no, that's a tough road to home. Podcast is 2:16:30.600 --> 2:16:34.120 not from that trip, is no, No, definitely not. No. 2:16:34.240 --> 2:16:36.119 That is one thing that YouTube has given me. It's 2:16:36.160 --> 2:16:38.800 it's let me meet people, go places and do things 2:16:38.800 --> 2:16:40.520 that I would never been able to do. You know, 2:16:40.959 --> 2:16:45.680 So plug your plug your hunting fishing channel. So if 2:16:45.720 --> 2:16:47.520 you want to check me out, you can search Coon 2:16:47.600 --> 2:16:50.320 Creek Outdoors. That's where the good stuff is. That's where 2:16:50.360 --> 2:16:52.800 the gold is. Yeah. Yeah, that's that's where I put 2:16:52.879 --> 2:16:55.080 up all my content. When I say the gold, that's 2:16:55.080 --> 2:16:57.560 where like the stuff that like, Um, I shouldn't say 2:16:57.560 --> 2:16:59.720 that cause I want to hack on yourself saying that's 2:16:59.760 --> 2:17:04.560 where like like you excel um at like a skill 2:17:04.600 --> 2:17:08.040 set that's not widely known, and like the fur handling 2:17:08.800 --> 2:17:13.160 trapping information like to me is like there's I don't 2:17:13.160 --> 2:17:16.200 think there's anyone When I want to know something, I'm 2:17:16.200 --> 2:17:18.480 gonna go look at that. I appreciate that, you know 2:17:18.600 --> 2:17:21.240 that means a lot. But yeah, I pride myself on 2:17:21.240 --> 2:17:23.640 on the put up and the fur handling side of it. 2:17:23.720 --> 2:17:26.200 So I mean, you know, there's nothing special about what 2:17:26.360 --> 2:17:28.000 I do, you know. I mean I'm not the best 2:17:28.080 --> 2:17:30.199 trapper and I'm not the best of putting up stuff. 2:17:30.240 --> 2:17:31.960 But you made a boat from scratch. I made a 2:17:32.000 --> 2:17:33.920 boat from Yeah. I came across the video at one 2:17:33.920 --> 2:17:38.519 time looking up just like looking up boat stuff on YouTube. Yeah, 2:17:38.760 --> 2:17:41.800 well welded a boat because he likes to fish, catfish. 2:17:41.800 --> 2:17:43.959 He likes fish crappy, so he weld it up a 2:17:44.080 --> 2:17:49.120 catfish crappy combo boat, Sweet che On. That's on my 2:17:49.160 --> 2:17:52.600 main chapel, Conker Outdoors. Okay, tell peopleout the other channel though, 2:17:52.760 --> 2:17:56.520 So I've got another channel branched off of my main 2:17:56.600 --> 2:17:58.760 channel simply because the audience just wasn't there. But I've 2:17:58.760 --> 2:18:00.800 got a fish and channel that I do a lot 2:18:00.800 --> 2:18:02.680 of content on in summer. It's a couple of years 2:18:02.720 --> 2:18:05.440 old now called Total Angling Experience. And that's that's where 2:18:05.440 --> 2:18:08.520 I'm slowly trying to put all my fishing content and 2:18:08.600 --> 2:18:11.320 you know, educational side electronics and different things like that. 2:18:11.320 --> 2:18:13.680 Because you like, you like cats, like cats, and like 2:18:13.760 --> 2:18:16.480 crop That's that's what I fished for home. So cats 2:18:16.480 --> 2:18:20.720 and croppies speaking, if you're interested in that kind of stuff, yeah, 2:18:20.760 --> 2:18:24.680 that's I don't bass fish, so catfish and croppies where 2:18:24.680 --> 2:18:26.879 I'm at. I think that everyone out there needs to 2:18:26.920 --> 2:18:30.640 send stum Miller a few pounds of beaver castor or 2:18:30.959 --> 2:18:33.920 go to the Patreon deal and throw a little jingle 2:18:33.959 --> 2:18:37.080 this guy's way. Well, you're you're your fishing stuff is 2:18:37.120 --> 2:18:40.800 probably not demonetized, right, Fishing stuff is not demonetized. That's 2:18:40.840 --> 2:18:43.560 that's another reason, you know, I wanted to have kind 2:18:43.560 --> 2:18:46.240 of a backup, if you will, you know, just because 2:18:46.520 --> 2:18:48.520 all the problems with YouTube, you know, I mean, there's 2:18:48.680 --> 2:18:51.400 there's a huge deal right now with just kind of 2:18:51.440 --> 2:18:54.800 all the outdoor community with YouTube, you know, kind of 2:18:54.840 --> 2:18:57.640 demonetizing and picking what they want to see. Man a 2:18:57.640 --> 2:19:01.080 conversation we have all the time is how can you 2:19:01.200 --> 2:19:06.840 come in and, ah, how could you come in and 2:19:06.879 --> 2:19:11.840 create an alternative for outdoor How could you come in 2:19:11.879 --> 2:19:17.240 and create an an alternative for outdoor pursuits that would 2:19:17.280 --> 2:19:19.760 get that you would build up so big that it 2:19:19.800 --> 2:19:22.480 would actually have traffic, would be a reliable place to 2:19:22.520 --> 2:19:26.400 go look. But it's like YouTube is so that the 2:19:26.560 --> 2:19:29.440 most it's where all the traffic is, you know. I mean, 2:19:29.560 --> 2:19:31.040 you want to know something, you search it on you 2:19:31.080 --> 2:19:33.480 think I don't know what it is. Every minute, four 2:19:33.600 --> 2:19:36.039 hundred hours of stuff gets up volded to YouTube or 2:19:36.040 --> 2:19:40.560 something like that. YouTube is a Google company, aren't they? 2:19:42.200 --> 2:19:45.520 Man like if somehow? But it's it's almost like it's 2:19:45.520 --> 2:19:48.680 like the Q tip thing. It's just YouTube's not even 2:19:48.920 --> 2:19:51.720 it's just where do you find information? It's not it's 2:19:51.760 --> 2:19:55.800 a It's bigger than just seeing I feel like socially now, No, 2:19:55.959 --> 2:20:00.840 we launched, we put every day every day our company. 2:20:00.959 --> 2:20:03.680 We put material on YouTube every day, like I'm not 2:20:03.720 --> 2:20:06.760 hacking on it. But what I don't like is I 2:20:06.800 --> 2:20:10.359 don't like the hostility to the hostility to the disciplines. 2:20:10.720 --> 2:20:13.600 It's like uncertainty in that environment, right, you never know 2:20:13.680 --> 2:20:17.840 what's going to happen like putting out that kind of content. Yeah, yeah, 2:20:17.840 --> 2:20:19.480 they can take it. They can take it away from 2:20:19.480 --> 2:20:23.199 you tomorrow if they really want, without any questions. Because 2:20:23.280 --> 2:20:25.760 their platforms, so you know, as much as you want 2:20:25.760 --> 2:20:27.640 to be on their love it or right it, you 2:20:27.680 --> 2:20:30.240 still got played by their rules. I do want to 2:20:30.240 --> 2:20:34.600 say just is a very humble person. But I started 2:20:34.600 --> 2:20:37.800 trapping right around the time student and Just. I love 2:20:37.840 --> 2:20:40.200 old trapping books, but there's a lot of times I 2:20:40.240 --> 2:20:42.520 read that where I'm like, yeah, someone's gonna have to 2:20:42.560 --> 2:20:46.879 show me how to actually do that, like ses or 2:20:46.959 --> 2:20:49.160 the black and white photos that are so horrible on 2:20:49.200 --> 2:20:52.720 my I was gonna ask to like how, Like where'd 2:20:52.760 --> 2:20:54.640 you learn it all? How did you get good at it? 2:20:54.959 --> 2:20:57.560 I was self taught for the most part everything, you know, 2:20:57.560 --> 2:21:00.000 because like I said, I did learn a lot um 2:21:00.240 --> 2:21:02.560 for fishing game. I've had a subscription to them forever, 2:21:03.000 --> 2:21:05.800 and there was a lot of educational stuff then a 2:21:05.840 --> 2:21:08.000 lot was just trial and error. I thought Trapper and 2:21:08.000 --> 2:21:11.200 Predator Collar blew fur fishing game away on instructional that 2:21:11.480 --> 2:21:15.200 you think. So when I was a kid, fur fishing 2:21:15.240 --> 2:21:18.480 game was more fun to read, but instructional I mean 2:21:18.520 --> 2:21:21.400 a lot of it. And like like Rick said, you know, 2:21:21.480 --> 2:21:23.240 you can read and you can watch somebody do it, 2:21:23.280 --> 2:21:24.959 but a lot of us just getting out there and 2:21:25.000 --> 2:21:27.119 doing it trial and error. You know, there's a lot 2:21:27.160 --> 2:21:30.800 of real rough DVDs out there that will get you by. 2:21:31.640 --> 2:21:34.640 I appreciate your channel, though. You kind of one thing 2:21:34.800 --> 2:21:37.400 and we talked about what we were trapping, was you 2:21:37.400 --> 2:21:40.080 you cut through the bullshit pretty well because I went 2:21:40.120 --> 2:21:42.920 down rabbit holes on like Trapperman Forum and stuff where 2:21:42.920 --> 2:21:44.879 I'm like, oh my god, I gotta I gotta wear 2:21:44.920 --> 2:21:49.080 it has matt suit. So when you're making a set, 2:21:49.120 --> 2:21:51.240 you need to squint your left and your left hand 2:21:51.280 --> 2:21:54.720 and I you know, I guess the work. I got 2:21:54.800 --> 2:21:57.200 so wound up on that. And your channel is really good. 2:21:57.200 --> 2:22:00.200 It cuts through it and it's so yeah, everyone, don't 2:22:00.200 --> 2:22:04.240 you go subscribe to Con't Creek Outdoors. And I appreciate that. No, 2:22:04.520 --> 2:22:05.879 that means a lot. And like I said, you know, 2:22:05.879 --> 2:22:07.720 a lot of guys are just out there to make content. 2:22:07.800 --> 2:22:10.640 But like so, I mean, it doesn't take a lot 2:22:10.640 --> 2:22:13.480 of people overthink trapping. They really do. Like you said, 2:22:13.480 --> 2:22:15.160 they go down a rabbit hole and they got to 2:22:15.200 --> 2:22:17.600 be this and nine inches sit back and four inches 2:22:17.680 --> 2:22:21.200 over and this, that and the other. You know, there's 2:22:21.959 --> 2:22:25.680 whenever you really break it down, there's there's a few 2:22:25.680 --> 2:22:27.640 simple things that you gotta do to be able to 2:22:27.680 --> 2:22:30.040 be successful at it. And once you have those few 2:22:30.040 --> 2:22:34.800 fundamentals down, you're golden. I want to just touch on 2:22:34.800 --> 2:22:36.840 one of the things you taught me that I walked 2:22:36.840 --> 2:22:40.760 away from our little trip with that I ignored very much, 2:22:41.040 --> 2:22:43.440 and I think it's that romantic little side of it. 2:22:43.560 --> 2:22:45.600 You were like set on sign and every time we 2:22:45.640 --> 2:22:48.360 came to a picture perfect area, you were like, well, 2:22:48.400 --> 2:22:50.320 is there a sign here? Because if there's not, we're 2:22:50.320 --> 2:22:55.320 not putting trap. And it hit me such a reality checks, like, man, 2:22:55.360 --> 2:22:59.039 I put traps in areas like this is what the 2:22:59.120 --> 2:23:01.560 manual tone to do. This is what that little book 2:23:01.760 --> 2:23:03.840 told me, and this is perfect. I don't see any 2:23:03.959 --> 2:23:05.880 sign here, but I'm gonna put a set here. And 2:23:06.000 --> 2:23:09.480 these animals are so dumb they don't know they're supposed 2:23:09.520 --> 2:23:13.480 to be. Uh So, just something like that, Yeah, I 2:23:13.480 --> 2:23:16.160 took away from that stew and yeah, so no, you 2:23:16.240 --> 2:23:18.200 gotta you gotta be setting where the critters are, you know, 2:23:18.400 --> 2:23:21.119 and a lot of people I'm trying to catch kyotes 2:23:21.120 --> 2:23:22.800 and I can't catch because everybody gets a heart on 2:23:22.840 --> 2:23:26.000 for kyotes, right, Like that's like kind of the pinnacle predator. 2:23:26.120 --> 2:23:28.280 You know, well, if you're gonna catch a kyle, you 2:23:28.360 --> 2:23:30.680 gotta be where a kyo it is. You know, you 2:23:30.800 --> 2:23:33.600 gotta be where he's gonna travel. And you know, it's 2:23:33.640 --> 2:23:35.720 the same thing with a lot of things we're doing 2:23:35.720 --> 2:23:38.560 in the outdoors, like fishing. You gotta be fishing where 2:23:38.560 --> 2:23:40.920 the fish are. And yeah, I mean it's easy set 2:23:41.080 --> 2:23:43.480 you know, you can say that and people like, of course, 2:23:43.600 --> 2:23:48.240 but you gotta put your time in scouting, and sure 2:23:48.280 --> 2:23:50.520 there's a lot of you're not setting where you want 2:23:50.560 --> 2:23:56.000 them to be. It's do you do social media too? Yeah, 2:23:56.040 --> 2:23:58.800 a little bit. I got Facebook, Instagram, So tell people 2:23:58.800 --> 2:24:01.640 where that's at. Conkerg out Wars. It's all you need 2:24:01.680 --> 2:24:03.760 to remember. Coon Creek Outdoors as simple as it gets. 2:24:04.120 --> 2:24:06.800 Let's say you fella has a Kyle, they're out deer hunting. 2:24:07.560 --> 2:24:10.040 Here comes a beautiful cow run along. They're like, man, 2:24:10.040 --> 2:24:13.160 I'm gonna hang that sucker on my wall. What do 2:24:13.200 --> 2:24:16.280 you do? Go to Coon Creek Outdoors you can find 2:24:16.360 --> 2:24:19.160 videos of how to set the traps, skin and flesh, 2:24:19.200 --> 2:24:22.840 and I've got videos on tanning for home use and 2:24:22.959 --> 2:24:25.680 garment use everything else. So remember send him a pound 2:24:25.680 --> 2:24:31.680 of castor or go to what's it called not Pantheon patrion, 2:24:33.720 --> 2:24:39.640 don't go there? Who stude? Thanks for coming out, man, 2:24:39.680 --> 2:24:42.400 No appreciate. It's been a blast. Man, it's been awesome. 2:24:42.640 --> 2:24:46.000 Speaking of wall hanger coyotes. You know what you're doing next. 2:24:46.160 --> 2:24:50.800 Now we're doing stuff going over to my garage, all right, man, 2:24:50.800 --> 2:25:05.600 Thank you very much,