WEBVTT - How to Feel Better with Sophie Grégoire Trudeau 0:00:01.280 --> 0:00:02.920 Life can be a lot, and it helps to have 0:00:02.960 --> 0:00:06.440 a therapist by your side. Register at talkspace dot com 0:00:06.440 --> 0:00:10.400 to connect with a licensed therapist within days for virtual support. 0:00:10.880 --> 0:00:15.280 Talkspace is in network with major insurers no insurance. Now 0:00:15.320 --> 0:00:17.919 get eighty five dollars off of your first month with 0:00:18.040 --> 0:00:21.800 promo code Katie when you go to talkspace dot com 0:00:21.840 --> 0:00:32.080 slash Katiekuric. Hi everyone, I'm Katikuric and this is next question. 0:00:35.479 --> 0:00:38.960 You've probably heard the name Sophie Trudeau, right, the young, 0:00:39.040 --> 0:00:43.000 glamorous wife of Justin Trudeau, the Prime Minister of Canada. 0:00:43.520 --> 0:00:47.000 But Sophie is a whole lot more than that. As 0:00:47.000 --> 0:00:50.040 a mental health advocate for the last twenty years, she 0:00:50.240 --> 0:00:54.640 is as passionate as she is compassionate. Her mission has 0:00:54.680 --> 0:00:58.600 been to better understand herself so we can all better 0:00:58.720 --> 0:01:02.880 understand each other. Her new book is called Closer Together, 0:01:03.400 --> 0:01:07.200 Knowing Ourselves, Loving each Other, and she candidly shares a 0:01:07.240 --> 0:01:10.840 lot about her life and struggles. But Sophie also has 0:01:10.920 --> 0:01:15.720 incorporated the best science and interviewed the leading researchers about 0:01:15.720 --> 0:01:20.200 how our brain handles life's biggest challenges. Her book tackles 0:01:20.319 --> 0:01:23.880 everything from mindfulness to the function of this thing we 0:01:24.000 --> 0:01:27.960 all have called the biggest nerve. The book is fascinating 0:01:28.360 --> 0:01:31.360 and best of all, it's hopeful. There really are simple 0:01:31.400 --> 0:01:34.360 things we can all do to live a more peaceful life. 0:01:34.680 --> 0:01:38.560 And here's a little hint, it's all about our nervous systems. 0:01:39.160 --> 0:01:45.520 So here's my conversation with Sophie Trudeau. Sophie, congratulations on 0:01:45.600 --> 0:01:47.880 your book. How does it feel putting it out in 0:01:47.920 --> 0:01:50.559 the world. Are you excited, terrified? 0:01:50.680 --> 0:01:53.960 What a little mix of everything? But to be honest 0:01:54.120 --> 0:01:56.760 right now, because people have read it in the advance 0:01:56.760 --> 0:01:59.880 and the response that I've been getting has been overwhelmingly 0:02:00.240 --> 0:02:04.280 touching and supportive, and I'm pinching myself, yes, because it 0:02:04.360 --> 0:02:07.480 was a labor of love and you know, teamwork. And 0:02:07.680 --> 0:02:10.280 it's not that I'm yes, I'm proud of the content, 0:02:10.720 --> 0:02:13.679 but I really want this book to serve. I want 0:02:13.720 --> 0:02:16.560 people to be able to have the tools to better 0:02:16.600 --> 0:02:19.680 know themselves so they can navigate the fault of life 0:02:19.720 --> 0:02:23.160 that feels overwhelming, you know, feeling more secure and more confident. 0:02:23.639 --> 0:02:26.800 It's a really wonderful format because it almost feels like 0:02:26.840 --> 0:02:34.560 an amalgamation of a memoir, a journal, a personal exploration, 0:02:34.960 --> 0:02:40.280 but also an exploration outside of yourself someone who is 0:02:40.320 --> 0:02:44.000 a reporter searching for answers. So tell me how you 0:02:44.120 --> 0:02:48.160 came upon this format, Sophie, and what you thought before 0:02:48.200 --> 0:02:50.040 you dove into the writing process. 0:02:50.480 --> 0:02:52.519 I think the format kind of overtook me. You know, 0:02:52.639 --> 0:02:55.000 although I'm a you know, I'm a great I'm a 0:02:55.040 --> 0:02:58.359 type a so organizer or you know, things have to 0:02:58.480 --> 0:03:01.000 be in category reason when I'm working, and my desk 0:03:01.000 --> 0:03:03.360 had to be clean and all that. But for me, 0:03:03.440 --> 0:03:05.399 the book was kind of like a labor of love 0:03:05.440 --> 0:03:08.480 where I only know, you know now at forty nine 0:03:08.520 --> 0:03:11.800 that we can only teach by experience. Therefore, I could 0:03:11.800 --> 0:03:14.440 include my story and have a sense of integrity, of 0:03:14.440 --> 0:03:17.600 congruence that people understand that if I expose myself and 0:03:17.639 --> 0:03:20.520 my vulnerability, that they feel safe enough to do the same. 0:03:21.080 --> 0:03:23.680 And then I've had the privilege in a way and 0:03:23.760 --> 0:03:27.360 the chance throughout my twenty years of advocacy for mental health, 0:03:27.400 --> 0:03:30.080 and you know, my ambassadorship working with different kinds of 0:03:30.240 --> 0:03:34.120 organizations on a volunteer basis, really was to bring together 0:03:34.200 --> 0:03:37.960 experts and have access to science, to knowledge. And I'm 0:03:38.000 --> 0:03:40.640 super curious. I'm an eternal student. I'm never going to stop, 0:03:40.680 --> 0:03:43.800 you know, eating up what I'm passionate about. And I 0:03:43.840 --> 0:03:46.160 told myself, I have access to all of this, I'm 0:03:46.240 --> 0:03:48.720 learning on my own path. Well what's the point if 0:03:48.760 --> 0:03:51.960 I don't share with other people? And because I do 0:03:52.040 --> 0:03:53.600 what I do, I see people are suffering, and I 0:03:53.640 --> 0:03:56.480 see that people are anxious that are depleted or try 0:03:56.520 --> 0:03:59.400 to read, you know know, make ends meet. And there's 0:03:59.440 --> 0:04:02.080 a neural by biological imperative behind all of that. So 0:04:02.480 --> 0:04:04.920 I wanted to this science and the best experts in 0:04:04.960 --> 0:04:07.520 their industry, in fields and domains to be able to 0:04:08.240 --> 0:04:11.320 really make it accessible for everybody, whether you're a teenager 0:04:11.640 --> 0:04:15.360 or you know a young adult or somebody who's aging, 0:04:15.760 --> 0:04:18.679 that it's all accessible to everybody. And I think that 0:04:18.680 --> 0:04:20.760 that's working out well as of now with the comments 0:04:20.760 --> 0:04:22.600 that I'm getting. So I just can't wait to get 0:04:22.640 --> 0:04:24.320 more comments all the people who will be reading it 0:04:24.360 --> 0:04:25.920 and canally it's so important. 0:04:26.240 --> 0:04:29.280 Meredith, who produced this segment for me, was talking about 0:04:29.360 --> 0:04:33.799 the format and the conversational the dialogue that you capture 0:04:34.040 --> 0:04:37.159 in the pages of this book, which she said made 0:04:37.200 --> 0:04:43.080 it feel much more readable and understandable than maybe an 0:04:43.200 --> 0:04:46.560 essay written by an expert that it really lent itself 0:04:46.680 --> 0:04:51.640 to accessibility, and I think when people see someone else learning, 0:04:51.920 --> 0:04:55.640 they're much more likely to take the journey with that person. 0:04:56.320 --> 0:04:59.560 When I did a documentary about our changing notion of 0:04:59.600 --> 0:05:04.200 gender identity, I sort of brought people along with me 0:05:04.400 --> 0:05:08.200 as I asked questions and channeled what I thought they 0:05:08.240 --> 0:05:12.200 would ask. And I think you used the same technique 0:05:12.200 --> 0:05:14.080 in your book, didn't you for me? 0:05:14.240 --> 0:05:16.919 I mean, yes, you're right that it is a technique, 0:05:16.920 --> 0:05:19.120 but that's not how I used it. I didn't think, 0:05:19.160 --> 0:05:21.599 in my mind, I'm going to use this technique. What 0:05:21.720 --> 0:05:24.880 I wanted was to have a conversation with the people 0:05:24.960 --> 0:05:28.440 and the peacemakers that I love to call scientists who 0:05:28.440 --> 0:05:31.480 are trying to better understand how our brains work, how 0:05:31.480 --> 0:05:33.880 our bodies work, and why we have the personality that 0:05:33.920 --> 0:05:37.479 we do. So I wanted it to be conversational, and 0:05:37.520 --> 0:05:41.600 in the conversation there's no real protocol, there's no you know, 0:05:41.839 --> 0:05:44.200 titles are not important. It's just you to me. When 0:05:44.240 --> 0:05:46.880 I think of the people, I don't think of other people. 0:05:46.880 --> 0:05:50.159 I think of me, so and them and us together. 0:05:50.520 --> 0:05:53.120 So I tried to really be in that conversation immerse 0:05:53.160 --> 0:05:57.480 myself in that conversation, keeps things straightforward, authentic and simple, 0:05:57.880 --> 0:06:00.480 and to make it accessible for everybody. And you know, 0:06:01.120 --> 0:06:05.039 I think that right now, I've had you know, grandparents, parents, 0:06:05.040 --> 0:06:08.680 teenagers read it. And I'm so touched, especially by youth, 0:06:08.720 --> 0:06:10.880 because sometimes we think, oh, you know, they won't have 0:06:10.920 --> 0:06:14.719 the maturity to understand, or it's so untrue. Our young 0:06:14.760 --> 0:06:19.320 people are so ready to receive resting wisdom because they're 0:06:19.400 --> 0:06:24.039 so overpowered and overwhelmed by information that I just really 0:06:24.040 --> 0:06:26.160 hope that more young people as well will be exposed 0:06:26.200 --> 0:06:27.120 to It's kind of content. 0:06:27.600 --> 0:06:29.880 Why do you think this is the right book at 0:06:29.920 --> 0:06:34.159 the right time, Because it does feel like the world 0:06:34.560 --> 0:06:40.240 is chaotic, people are overwhelmed, and there are just a 0:06:40.320 --> 0:06:43.679 lot of people who I think are feeling somewhat lost. 0:06:44.080 --> 0:06:46.880 And I'm wondering if do we know about it more 0:06:46.960 --> 0:06:51.080 because of social media, because our easy access to information, 0:06:51.360 --> 0:06:54.760 or does this feel, for you, Sophie, like a particularly 0:06:54.920 --> 0:06:58.840 fraught time, not only in America but in Canada, in 0:06:59.400 --> 0:07:02.159 so many places around the world. And maybe it's because 0:07:02.200 --> 0:07:05.960 we're witnessing such enormous change. 0:07:06.360 --> 0:07:09.279 Such enormous change, well fed Katie, in such a short 0:07:09.320 --> 0:07:12.920 period of time, the telephone and the slip phone and 0:07:12.960 --> 0:07:15.680 then the you know, reverse screen and self be It 0:07:16.080 --> 0:07:19.040 changed our brain, it changed our kids' brains. And because 0:07:19.080 --> 0:07:23.120 we come into the world with two main intrinsic vistubal needs. 0:07:23.400 --> 0:07:26.200 First onanted attachment to be in the care of somebody, 0:07:26.240 --> 0:07:31.920 under their touch, their gaze, their their presence, their joyful presence, 0:07:32.040 --> 0:07:36.520 their their playfulness. Right, that sets a tone in our 0:07:36.520 --> 0:07:39.600 brain and every single human being our bonnot attachment with 0:07:39.640 --> 0:07:41.160 the person who took care of us, whether it was 0:07:41.200 --> 0:07:43.920 a grandparent and auntie, your mother, or a father. It 0:07:44.040 --> 0:07:46.200 leaves an imprint in our brain that we charty that 0:07:46.240 --> 0:07:49.520 into our teenage years, rebellious or not, and into our 0:07:49.560 --> 0:07:53.560 adulthood and the child within us is still active. So 0:07:53.600 --> 0:07:56.280 that's the first thing attachment. The second thing is authenticity. 0:07:56.920 --> 0:07:59.080 So every human being comes up to this earth with 0:07:59.120 --> 0:08:03.480 a unique personnality and we're meant to express that uniqueness 0:08:03.520 --> 0:08:07.440 and that's a form of creativity. And therefore, in order 0:08:07.480 --> 0:08:11.800 to be loved, we change and we modify our behavior 0:08:12.160 --> 0:08:14.080 in order to please and be loved, and we all 0:08:14.120 --> 0:08:15.920 do it by the way we do it as children 0:08:16.000 --> 0:08:17.480 to be loved by our parents. We do it as 0:08:17.520 --> 0:08:20.800 adults in our loving relationships and in our friendships, because 0:08:20.880 --> 0:08:23.679 we want to be loved and validated in our own emotions. 0:08:23.680 --> 0:08:25.680 And we do it on different levels, of course, you know, 0:08:25.760 --> 0:08:29.080 depending on if that bond of attachment is more secure, 0:08:29.480 --> 0:08:33.000 it insecure or disorganized, which which turned the three big families. 0:08:33.120 --> 0:08:34.680 So if you think that the child with you and 0:08:34.760 --> 0:08:37.800 you not then is not active, now you're going to 0:08:37.840 --> 0:08:40.040 be surprised by what you learn in this book and 0:08:40.160 --> 0:08:41.840 to bring them back to what we're living in the 0:08:41.880 --> 0:08:45.679 world right now, Katie, the opposing forces, the darker forces. 0:08:45.720 --> 0:08:47.959 You know, we have the better angels of our nature. 0:08:48.000 --> 0:08:51.120 We have positivity, we have hope, we have creativity, we 0:08:51.160 --> 0:08:54.240 have self awareness and discernment and perspective. But then we 0:08:54.320 --> 0:08:57.080 have also the bad wolves. And it's all in us 0:08:57.120 --> 0:09:00.840 as well, the hatred, the division, the paralizing, the confusion, 0:09:00.880 --> 0:09:04.160 the illusion, the not understanding, and we all have it 0:09:04.200 --> 0:09:08.240 inside of us. And as the old Shayan proverb says, well, 0:09:08.400 --> 0:09:10.920 those two wolves are always fighting, which one is going 0:09:11.000 --> 0:09:12.800 to win. It's the one we feed. 0:09:13.120 --> 0:09:15.400 It's like they it and the ego exactly. 0:09:15.440 --> 0:09:17.400 And I have chills right now because in the world 0:09:17.440 --> 0:09:20.200 we live in we want to be esthentic, but we 0:09:20.360 --> 0:09:24.040 keep being rewarded for self betrayal, whether it's physically. We 0:09:24.080 --> 0:09:26.120 can't appear the way we do because it's not okay. 0:09:26.160 --> 0:09:27.599 The lions are not on the right spot, and we 0:09:27.600 --> 0:09:30.640 shouldn't be aging because we should be behaving a certain 0:09:30.720 --> 0:09:32.280 way and not the way that we really want to 0:09:32.320 --> 0:09:35.520 behave because we're being judged by you know, hundreds or 0:09:35.559 --> 0:09:38.040 thousands or millions of people out there through social media 0:09:38.160 --> 0:09:41.320 without even knowing them, and without them even knowing us. 0:09:41.720 --> 0:09:44.520 So the connection that we're supposed to have naturally face 0:09:44.600 --> 0:09:49.560 to face, the security presence is really fragmented and is 0:09:49.640 --> 0:09:53.640 really eroded, and that is making us suffer physically and mentally. 0:09:54.000 --> 0:09:57.040 So we're not surprised to learn that during the pandemic, 0:09:57.320 --> 0:09:59.880 eating disorders were up the right, depression was up, the right, 0:10:00.160 --> 0:10:04.400 anxiety was up the right, and again there's a neurobiological 0:10:04.440 --> 0:10:07.520 imperatives behind all of it, because in our nervous system, 0:10:07.640 --> 0:10:10.600 you have one, Katie, I have one, everybody listening has one, 0:10:11.000 --> 0:10:13.600 and it's all kind of made the same. It's the 0:10:13.679 --> 0:10:17.520 autonomic nervous system, and this sympathetic branch is our fight 0:10:17.559 --> 0:10:20.439 flight freeze. So if a cart passes by, we need 0:10:20.480 --> 0:10:23.040 to be able to stop, to not be bumped into. 0:10:23.520 --> 0:10:26.679 And then the parasympathetic, which is the rest and digest 0:10:26.800 --> 0:10:30.200 so to be able to relax, come to come back 0:10:30.240 --> 0:10:31.760 home within ourselves, knowing that. 0:10:31.679 --> 0:10:36.320 We're secure and having what they call homeostasis. 0:10:35.280 --> 0:10:39.400 Right homeostasis exactly, So to be able to come back 0:10:39.400 --> 0:10:41.920 to that shouldn't be kind of a natural state. But 0:10:41.920 --> 0:10:44.720 with the stressors that we have constantly in our lives, 0:10:45.000 --> 0:10:49.760 the rapidity of information, the clickbait, the quick judgment of 0:10:49.800 --> 0:10:52.840 people on social media, what's happening is that too many 0:10:52.840 --> 0:10:56.320 people are stuck in their sympathetic fight, flight, freeze vote. 0:10:56.440 --> 0:10:59.640 So guess what, when you're in your alert mode, it's 0:10:59.720 --> 0:11:03.560 very difficult to have self compassion and compassion and empathy 0:11:03.600 --> 0:11:05.520 for others. So look at the state of the world 0:11:05.640 --> 0:11:09.559 right now. The dynamics of the pandemic made us in 0:11:09.640 --> 0:11:12.120 part lean on our nagtiburs because we had to help 0:11:12.160 --> 0:11:14.559 each other out, but at the same time distance us 0:11:14.600 --> 0:11:18.040 from everybody else because we were isolated, and so we 0:11:18.160 --> 0:11:21.160 are not only before that there was a mental health crisis, 0:11:21.160 --> 0:11:23.640 and I'd been saying it for twenty years and it 0:11:23.720 --> 0:11:27.120 tisses me off because it's been there for a long time. 0:11:27.160 --> 0:11:29.240 People have been suffering from anxiety from the way we 0:11:29.280 --> 0:11:31.160 live for a long time, and the pandemic kind of 0:11:31.520 --> 0:11:35.040 exacerbated all of that. So the lesson to be learned 0:11:35.080 --> 0:11:39.760 here is one of hope, because not only can we 0:11:39.760 --> 0:11:43.400 we wire our nervous our brains and can we regulate 0:11:43.440 --> 0:11:46.240 our own nervous systudents, but there's a lot of education 0:11:46.360 --> 0:11:48.560 to be done there. It's not as complicated as we think. 0:11:48.800 --> 0:11:50.920 So in this book Closer Together, I want to make 0:11:50.960 --> 0:11:55.200 sure that the exercises, the technique that the experts talk about, 0:11:55.440 --> 0:11:58.680 and the micro habits, the baby steps, they don't have 0:11:58.760 --> 0:12:00.640 to be huge leaps for you to transport of your 0:12:00.640 --> 0:12:02.760 life because the brain is getting it. And the brain, 0:12:02.800 --> 0:12:04.880 by the way, way, when you come back from the office, 0:12:04.880 --> 0:12:07.240 you're tired, you're depleted, you want your beer or your 0:12:07.240 --> 0:12:09.240 glass of wine, you jump food and your TV. The 0:12:09.280 --> 0:12:11.880 brain's like, yes, I have no effort to make. But 0:12:11.960 --> 0:12:14.920 as the expert Lori Santo says in my book, we 0:12:15.040 --> 0:12:17.800 are in the own way over happiness because the brain 0:12:17.840 --> 0:12:19.880 isn't helping us. It just wants to be there on 0:12:19.880 --> 0:12:23.000 the couch. We have to say, wait a second, let 0:12:23.040 --> 0:12:25.840 me live more consciously, let me take care of myself, 0:12:26.040 --> 0:12:28.800 and Lendy know deeply that I am worthy of rest, 0:12:29.120 --> 0:12:30.920 but we live in a society where we don't even 0:12:30.920 --> 0:12:34.080 think that we are worthy of rest. But rest is 0:12:34.120 --> 0:12:36.839 how the mind and the body makes sense of life. 0:12:37.240 --> 0:12:39.000 So think about this on a global scale. 0:12:39.640 --> 0:12:43.760 Tell me how you got so interested in this, Sophie. 0:12:43.800 --> 0:12:46.920 Obviously you are approaching it from a personal and I 0:12:46.960 --> 0:12:49.080 want to ask a little bit about your personal story 0:12:49.080 --> 0:12:52.720 in a moment, but from a very scientific and sort 0:12:52.720 --> 0:12:56.560 of neuroscience point of view, how did you first say 0:12:56.880 --> 0:13:00.400 there are reasons for our emotions? And I want to 0:13:00.520 --> 0:13:01.560 understand that better. 0:13:02.200 --> 0:13:04.920 So I'm forty nine now. Twenty years ago when I 0:13:04.960 --> 0:13:07.560 shared my story as a very young television and radio 0:13:07.600 --> 0:13:10.240 hoist in Quebec, one of my girlfriends from high school 0:13:10.280 --> 0:13:13.240 had approached me to because she was putting up a 0:13:13.240 --> 0:13:16.000 foundation for eating disorders and she knew that I was 0:13:16.000 --> 0:13:18.040 suffering because we had talked about it at some point 0:13:18.040 --> 0:13:20.240 and I hadn't talked about it with many people, and 0:13:20.280 --> 0:13:22.800 she's Sophie, you want to get involved, and like absolutely, 0:13:22.840 --> 0:13:25.280 because I had heard so many stories around me, from 0:13:25.360 --> 0:13:28.920 girls and from boys who were suffering, and that really 0:13:28.960 --> 0:13:31.560 gave a course to my life. And I understood then 0:13:32.080 --> 0:13:34.680 that by sharing my story, first of all, I would 0:13:34.679 --> 0:13:37.080 be healing myself, you know, and taking the first step 0:13:37.120 --> 0:13:39.560 to healing. And then I had to remain curious of 0:13:39.600 --> 0:13:42.640 my own condition, to see how am I evolving, how 0:13:42.679 --> 0:13:44.720 am I healing? What are the solutions that I can 0:13:44.760 --> 0:13:45.839 apply into my own life? 0:13:45.960 --> 0:13:47.400 But also the root causes? 0:13:47.480 --> 0:13:50.400 Right, Yes, I was longing, you know, for my father 0:13:50.520 --> 0:13:53.240 to be more emotionally pressent. I wanted to save my 0:13:53.280 --> 0:13:55.760 mother from herself and my mother from my dad, and 0:13:55.800 --> 0:13:57.719 I wanted to save my dad from himself. I was 0:13:57.760 --> 0:14:00.880 an only child. Having that savior cape was way too 0:14:00.960 --> 0:14:03.960 heavy for me to carry, and I held a lot 0:14:04.040 --> 0:14:06.720 of sadness inside of me. And today, even when I 0:14:06.760 --> 0:14:09.520 talk about it with all the maturity that I've gained, 0:14:09.520 --> 0:14:11.440 with all the life experience, with all the love that 0:14:11.480 --> 0:14:14.600 I'm getting, and I still have my parents who are alive, 0:14:14.880 --> 0:14:19.200 you know, it still hurts. It still hurts when I 0:14:19.200 --> 0:14:21.600 pay attention to the suffering. And I'm sure I'm not alone. 0:14:21.680 --> 0:14:24.800 If you go back really with your eyes closed, how 0:14:24.800 --> 0:14:26.800 do you talk to yourself, how do you truly feel 0:14:26.840 --> 0:14:29.600 and what are your heart's truest wish from when you 0:14:29.640 --> 0:14:32.280 were a little child, What was your truest wish And 0:14:32.480 --> 0:14:35.000 is that being nourished in your life right now because 0:14:35.000 --> 0:14:37.280 a lot of people are suffering in their relationships. So 0:14:37.440 --> 0:14:40.400 for me, it's a responsibility to continue to be educated 0:14:40.440 --> 0:14:40.880 on the mouth. 0:14:41.360 --> 0:14:44.280 It's interesting because I thought it was fascinating that you 0:14:44.800 --> 0:14:48.040 are an only child and that you did feel responsible. 0:14:48.560 --> 0:14:50.960 I think maybe combined with the fact that you have 0:14:51.080 --> 0:14:56.240 extremely high emotional intelligence and were very sensitive, that you 0:14:56.680 --> 0:14:59.360 felt like you had to fix everything because it was 0:14:59.440 --> 0:15:02.040 just you and your mom and dad. I wonder if 0:15:02.080 --> 0:15:04.120 a lot of only children feel that way. 0:15:04.440 --> 0:15:08.040 It's funny you laugh that because I talk to parents who, 0:15:08.160 --> 0:15:09.960 you know, found out that I was an only child whatever, 0:15:10.000 --> 0:15:11.640 and they come to me and they're like, like, should 0:15:11.680 --> 0:15:15.920 I have another one? You know, And they do relate, 0:15:16.080 --> 0:15:18.920 and it does resonate, and they do say, I understand 0:15:18.920 --> 0:15:21.440 what you're saying because I see it in my child. 0:15:22.560 --> 0:15:25.160 And it's not because we're bad parents, you know. And 0:15:25.240 --> 0:15:27.760 this is not about finger pointing and saying, oh, you know, 0:15:28.360 --> 0:15:30.840 my parents were like this to me. Therefore, it expands 0:15:30.880 --> 0:15:35.880 my whole situation, It expands your situation profoundly, artly, yes, 0:15:36.520 --> 0:15:40.160 but then we have to realize that we have enough consciousness, 0:15:40.200 --> 0:15:43.160 awareness and strength to be able to sit with that pain, 0:15:43.480 --> 0:15:46.680 face it, and heal it so that we don't leave 0:15:46.800 --> 0:15:52.479 emotional luggage and baggage generations to come. That's the true responsibility. 0:15:52.520 --> 0:15:55.240 It seems in your life, Sophie that you're determined to 0:15:55.280 --> 0:15:58.040 be the one to bring it up. Is that were 0:15:58.320 --> 0:16:02.920 with hard topics like mental illness. So where did you 0:16:02.960 --> 0:16:05.800 get this mission to say these things out loud? I mean, 0:16:05.800 --> 0:16:08.360 it wasn't long ago, as you well know, since you've 0:16:08.400 --> 0:16:12.000 been in this space, that these things weren't discussed. I 0:16:12.040 --> 0:16:15.440 think reducing the stigma of mental illness and being much 0:16:15.480 --> 0:16:19.880 more transparent about your own issues as individuals and collectively 0:16:19.920 --> 0:16:24.680 as the society has really undergone this massive transformation. But 0:16:25.720 --> 0:16:29.120 why have you felt it's so important for you to 0:16:29.600 --> 0:16:31.280 bring these things out in the open. 0:16:32.160 --> 0:16:34.600 There is no doubt in my mind and in my 0:16:34.760 --> 0:16:37.280 heart that the reason why I'm doing this is because 0:16:37.320 --> 0:16:40.040 other people paved the way before me. I was following 0:16:40.080 --> 0:16:43.280 experts already, because I was interested in the topic, whether 0:16:43.400 --> 0:16:45.960 it was you know Yab or Mate or best or 0:16:46.040 --> 0:16:49.680 Vandercolt or you know as psychologists in French that it 0:16:49.840 --> 0:16:52.560 used to follow as well, And it's just been an 0:16:52.640 --> 0:16:56.600 area of passion of mine because you're right, Katie, I 0:16:56.640 --> 0:16:59.120 think I became hyper sensitive because it was an only 0:16:59.200 --> 0:17:01.800 child and I was surrounded with adults, and I had 0:17:01.840 --> 0:17:03.960 to tune in to be able to regulate and to 0:17:04.000 --> 0:17:06.600 see how I could save and be loved at the 0:17:06.640 --> 0:17:11.200 same time. So I got inspired along the way why 0:17:12.080 --> 0:17:15.639 incredible humans who I didn't even think would look at 0:17:15.680 --> 0:17:19.240 my book. But when I reached out to doctor gaber Matte, 0:17:19.840 --> 0:17:22.359 he read my chapter outline and it took everything I 0:17:22.400 --> 0:17:24.120 had because I had read his book in the Realm 0:17:24.160 --> 0:17:26.639 of Hungary Ghosts on Addiction is twelve years ago, and 0:17:26.680 --> 0:17:28.679 I was like, he's gonna think, why the heck? The 0:17:28.720 --> 0:17:32.680 first lady reached out right, so I was self doubting, 0:17:32.960 --> 0:17:34.960 and then when we sat down, he's like, hey, wait 0:17:35.000 --> 0:17:38.280 a minute, you've got something here, and I see your 0:17:38.400 --> 0:17:41.159 energy and I think people cut through the bs. I 0:17:41.200 --> 0:17:44.760 don't have any, so it's a natural way for me 0:17:44.840 --> 0:17:47.639 to interact with people and to serve. Yes, it's his 0:17:47.720 --> 0:17:52.119 value based mission. But I don't make it theoretical like that. 0:17:52.200 --> 0:17:54.480 In my mind, I just feel that I have clarity 0:17:54.520 --> 0:17:56.439 on how I can give to the world, and that 0:17:56.600 --> 0:17:58.479 for me is a gift, that's a blessing that I 0:17:58.560 --> 0:18:05.560 have to cherish. 0:18:02.280 --> 0:18:06.680 After this break. Sophie's profoundly insightful take on how trauma 0:18:07.119 --> 0:18:15.639 or lack thereof, shapes our lives. Everyone needs someone to 0:18:15.680 --> 0:18:18.520 talk to and text with about life's challenges, and while 0:18:18.560 --> 0:18:22.280 girlfriends are great listeners, there are limits to your group chat. 0:18:22.600 --> 0:18:26.159 A talkspace therapist will give you an objective perspective and 0:18:26.359 --> 0:18:30.280 professional guidance. Register at talkspace dot com to connect with 0:18:30.359 --> 0:18:33.800 a licensed therapist within days and you can start messaging 0:18:33.920 --> 0:18:37.840 back and forth and also schedule live video or audio sessions. 0:18:38.240 --> 0:18:42.240 Talkspace is in network with major insurers, and copays are 0:18:42.359 --> 0:18:46.400 usually twenty five dollars or less no insurance. Now get 0:18:46.440 --> 0:18:49.320 eighty five dollars off of your first month with promo 0:18:49.440 --> 0:18:53.880 code Katie when you go to talkspace dot com slash Katiecuric. 0:18:54.359 --> 0:18:59.160 Match with a licensed therapist at talkspace dot com slash Katiecuric. 0:19:07.000 --> 0:19:12.520 We're back with Sophie Trudeau. You just spoke of a doctor, 0:19:12.600 --> 0:19:18.280 Gavr Matte, and he talks a lot about hardwiring. And 0:19:18.359 --> 0:19:20.760 for our listeners who haven't read the book yet or 0:19:20.960 --> 0:19:24.520 just want to have an understanding before they do, what 0:19:24.720 --> 0:19:28.960 exactly are you talking about in terms of hardwiring, because 0:19:29.000 --> 0:19:31.760 I think a lot of people will be interested in that. 0:19:32.400 --> 0:19:34.560 I love that question and it's super important. So let 0:19:34.640 --> 0:19:37.200 me make it simple. So we've been sharing the same 0:19:37.240 --> 0:19:39.879 braining for two hundred thousand years, all right, it hasn't 0:19:39.880 --> 0:19:44.240 really changed. Now, imagine the brain as a hard disk 0:19:45.040 --> 0:19:48.200 of a computer. Okay, so we share that hard disk. Now, 0:19:48.240 --> 0:19:52.400 the programming going into that hard disk is different depending 0:19:52.400 --> 0:19:55.080 on your early bond of attachment, how you were taken 0:19:55.119 --> 0:19:58.800 care of from zero three, and your life experience. So 0:20:00.320 --> 0:20:04.320 et p genetics, how the environment can affect your brain 0:20:04.440 --> 0:20:08.560 and even you know yourselves exactly. It's fascinating. And then 0:20:08.640 --> 0:20:12.399 we learn how what we bring our attention to, what 0:20:12.440 --> 0:20:15.240 would we consume, how we sleep, what we hang out with, 0:20:15.359 --> 0:20:17.359 what we put in our bodies as food, how we 0:20:17.440 --> 0:20:21.520 interact with ourselves and others. That's the fabric overalized, and 0:20:21.640 --> 0:20:24.439 that is our mental health. You don't have to stuffer 0:20:24.480 --> 0:20:26.800 from a mental illness to be on this on the 0:20:26.920 --> 0:20:29.719 kind of big circle or spectrum of mental health, and 0:20:29.760 --> 0:20:32.840 we're all one trauma away from each other. And I 0:20:32.920 --> 0:20:36.199 remember discussing this with doctor Mattley that you know, it 0:20:36.320 --> 0:20:40.879 takes only a series of chronic little traumas or a 0:20:41.080 --> 0:20:44.520 huge trauma that you've been through to change your brain, 0:20:44.720 --> 0:20:46.800 to change the way you perceive yourself, especially if you 0:20:46.840 --> 0:20:48.760 don't talk about it, and to change the way you 0:20:48.800 --> 0:20:53.040 interact with the world. But here's the secret. Trauma isn't 0:20:53.200 --> 0:20:56.919 just what happened to you that was that. Trauma is 0:20:56.960 --> 0:20:59.480 also what should have happened that did not take place. 0:21:01.000 --> 0:21:04.360 And most people are not really aware of that. They 0:21:04.440 --> 0:21:06.960 long for something in their relationship. They feel that a 0:21:07.040 --> 0:21:10.960 piece is missing somewhere, like we're undernourished or we're getting 0:21:10.960 --> 0:21:14.679 emotional breadcrumbs and we want more. While that is the 0:21:14.800 --> 0:21:18.679 child who's still longing for something. And you know, we 0:21:18.760 --> 0:21:20.720 do have to be careful to not see this as 0:21:20.760 --> 0:21:23.720 a childish thing. It is not to be able to 0:21:23.760 --> 0:21:28.280 be aware and cognizant and conscious of our emotional patterns 0:21:28.600 --> 0:21:31.840 is a sign of emotional maturity and emotional leadership. So 0:21:31.920 --> 0:21:37.880 imagine what kind of leaders we would have all through schools, organizations, companies, 0:21:38.080 --> 0:21:44.280 government countries if people were better regulated and knew how 0:21:44.320 --> 0:21:46.879 to understand their emotions. In the book, I talk with 0:21:46.960 --> 0:21:50.960 David Livingstone Smith, who's an expert on dehumanization, and he 0:21:51.080 --> 0:21:55.400 explains how hatred is really a deep longing for connection. 0:21:56.680 --> 0:21:59.359 So it is clear that all these people who are 0:21:59.400 --> 0:22:04.080 committing a trial teeth probably have deep trauma and attachment, 0:22:04.600 --> 0:22:06.440 you know, trauma disorder. 0:22:06.200 --> 0:22:08.800