1
00:00:00,480 --> 00:00:04,240
Speaker 1: Hello the Internet, and welcome to season three, twelve, episode.

2
00:00:03,880 --> 00:00:05,520
Speaker 2: Two of turn Nightly Guy.

3
00:00:05,720 --> 00:00:09,160
Speaker 1: Yeah, my production by Heart Radio. Myles is currently doing

4
00:00:09,200 --> 00:00:12,080
Speaker 1: the little head tilt that dogs do when they're puzzled

5
00:00:12,080 --> 00:00:12,880
Speaker 1: by your behavior.

6
00:00:13,200 --> 00:00:16,320
Speaker 2: Yeah. Well so just look, like we said in the

7
00:00:16,360 --> 00:00:19,439
Speaker 2: trending episode Daylight Savings, it comes for us all in

8
00:00:19,520 --> 00:00:21,240
Speaker 2: some way, right. Yeah.

9
00:00:21,280 --> 00:00:23,760
Speaker 1: Anyways, Hey ma, this is a podcast where we take

10
00:00:23,760 --> 00:00:25,759
Speaker 1: a deep dive into america share consciousness.

11
00:00:26,200 --> 00:00:27,159
Speaker 2: Do we still want to do that?

12
00:00:27,640 --> 00:00:29,480
Speaker 1: Yeah? I guess it's kind of the premise of the show.

13
00:00:29,520 --> 00:00:32,880
Speaker 2: I guess we keep Yeah, well, this one's specifically American

14
00:00:33,000 --> 00:00:36,200
Speaker 2: and yeah, yeah, yeah, we're going, oh yeah, I'm gonna

15
00:00:36,200 --> 00:00:37,720
Speaker 2: have to open our eyes to some things. Today.

16
00:00:38,000 --> 00:00:40,560
Speaker 1: It's Tuesday, November seventh, twenty twenty three.

17
00:00:41,000 --> 00:00:45,360
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, this is kind of a bummer day. It's

18
00:00:45,440 --> 00:00:53,000
Speaker 2: International Merlow Day, National Canine Lymphoma Awareness Day, National Bittersweet

19
00:00:53,080 --> 00:00:56,880
Speaker 2: Chocolate with Almonds Day. Like that's it, that doesn't that's

20
00:00:57,240 --> 00:01:01,120
Speaker 2: we don't need that. International Day of Medical Physics. I'm

21
00:01:01,360 --> 00:01:04,360
Speaker 2: sure that's hopefully that's on the pseudoscience. But yeah, love

22
00:01:04,400 --> 00:01:07,120
Speaker 2: it all, love it all. Oh, a National retin all

23
00:01:07,200 --> 00:01:09,760
Speaker 2: Day for all of you skincare people out there.

24
00:01:10,120 --> 00:01:11,800
Speaker 1: I practice medical physics every day.

25
00:01:11,880 --> 00:01:16,360
Speaker 2: Bro. That doesn't it sound like some fucking Aaron Rodgers

26
00:01:16,440 --> 00:01:21,400
Speaker 2: asked ship to say, Yeah, I'm I mean nice, partake,

27
00:01:21,600 --> 00:01:25,000
Speaker 2: partook in some medical physics and things are good. But

28
00:01:25,440 --> 00:01:28,360
Speaker 2: luckily for us it's it's I'm pretty sure it's it's

29
00:01:28,400 --> 00:01:31,680
Speaker 2: all about physics. How physics plain to patient care? There

30
00:01:31,680 --> 00:01:35,280
Speaker 2: you go, so yeah, hope, And from my understanding, physics

31
00:01:35,319 --> 00:01:38,000
Speaker 2: is a pretty nailed on science. It's not like people

32
00:01:38,000 --> 00:01:40,520
Speaker 2: are like, nah, not the way I fuck with it.

33
00:01:41,000 --> 00:01:43,920
Speaker 1: When you drop a rock from a high height on

34
00:01:44,000 --> 00:01:45,000
Speaker 1: a patient.

35
00:01:44,959 --> 00:01:48,279
Speaker 2: It hurts them exactly. Thank you, physics, Thank you're welcome.

36
00:01:48,720 --> 00:01:52,200
Speaker 1: Uh well, my name is Jack O'Brien aka making my

37
00:01:52,240 --> 00:01:56,520
Speaker 1: way round clowns, walking fast faces, passing. I'm sure bound

38
00:01:56,840 --> 00:01:59,280
Speaker 1: no no no no no no no no no no

39
00:01:59,280 --> 00:02:03,760
Speaker 1: no no no no no no swear. I don't need depends,

40
00:02:03,880 --> 00:02:07,400
Speaker 1: just another day, another day, proven it now dinner no

41
00:02:07,720 --> 00:02:10,399
Speaker 1: no no no no no no, I'm gonna keep doing

42
00:02:10,400 --> 00:02:14,120
Speaker 1: no no no no no. And I pissed them dinner

43
00:02:14,360 --> 00:02:18,840
Speaker 1: dent and I peed them do dent and now I

44
00:02:19,080 --> 00:02:26,040
Speaker 1: wantder If I could go back on that ride, do

45
00:02:26,360 --> 00:02:31,480
Speaker 1: you think I could convince my wife, because you know,

46
00:02:31,960 --> 00:02:37,239
Speaker 1: I do a thousand trials if I could just keep

47
00:02:37,960 --> 00:02:43,080
Speaker 1: my pants dry dinner. Uh that is courtesy of res

48
00:02:43,400 --> 00:02:48,480
Speaker 1: on the Discord. Thank you for you know, keeping this

49
00:02:49,160 --> 00:02:52,760
Speaker 1: embarrassing incident from my past top of mind. And I'm

50
00:02:52,840 --> 00:02:56,000
Speaker 1: thrilled to be joined as always by my co host

51
00:02:56,040 --> 00:02:58,560
Speaker 1: mister Miles Gressvile's.

52
00:02:57,880 --> 00:03:06,720
Speaker 2: Break, I am doll bones, mouse bones, bat bones and

53
00:03:06,840 --> 00:03:13,600
Speaker 2: go to the chorus. Yeah is really wod okay, shout

54
00:03:13,639 --> 00:03:17,800
Speaker 2: out Nicole Adrian for that whole rendition. Doll parts. Didn't

55
00:03:17,800 --> 00:03:20,720
Speaker 2: do the whole thing because I couldn't man man hitting

56
00:03:20,720 --> 00:03:23,360
Speaker 2: all them Courtney Love. I was smoking. I don't smoked

57
00:03:23,360 --> 00:03:25,639
Speaker 2: cigarettes anymore, so I can't quite get that rasp out

58
00:03:26,000 --> 00:03:27,359
Speaker 2: a shout out to Nicole agents.

59
00:03:27,360 --> 00:03:29,919
Speaker 1: Plus I had just nailed mine so hard that it

60
00:03:29,919 --> 00:03:30,600
Speaker 1: would have been hard.

61
00:03:30,639 --> 00:03:33,120
Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah, that was like I forget.

62
00:03:33,160 --> 00:03:35,080
Speaker 1: It's like I no, no, no, no, no no no no

63
00:03:35,080 --> 00:03:35,960
Speaker 1: no no no no.

64
00:03:36,960 --> 00:03:40,480
Speaker 2: You know the musicality. Yeah, I did the equivalent of

65
00:03:40,520 --> 00:03:43,440
Speaker 2: pulling up like during a sprint, because I knew I

66
00:03:43,440 --> 00:03:45,200
Speaker 2: was getting beat and I didn't want to have that

67
00:03:45,360 --> 00:03:47,280
Speaker 2: l so I went, ah, my handy, my handy.

68
00:03:47,040 --> 00:03:49,880
Speaker 1: My hand when saw the smoke trail behind my vocals

69
00:03:50,120 --> 00:03:53,840
Speaker 1: that opened this episode. Miles, We're thrilled to be joined

70
00:03:54,360 --> 00:03:57,280
Speaker 1: in our third seat by today's special expert guests. He

71
00:03:57,440 --> 00:04:01,200
Speaker 1: is the senior researcher of US hate and Extremist Movements

72
00:04:01,520 --> 00:04:06,560
Speaker 1: at the Institute for a Strategic Dialogue. To quote Samuel L. Jackson,

73
00:04:07,040 --> 00:04:11,120
Speaker 1: hold onto your butts because it's the return of ultimania.

74
00:04:12,280 --> 00:04:16,280
Speaker 1: Welcome back to the show, Jared Hat Jared, Hey, thanks

75
00:04:16,279 --> 00:04:16,719
Speaker 1: for having me.

76
00:04:16,800 --> 00:04:17,160
Speaker 2: Guys.

77
00:04:17,320 --> 00:04:20,080
Speaker 3: I kind of feel like the janitor. I think, like

78
00:04:20,200 --> 00:04:22,159
Speaker 3: when you go see a concert and all the lights

79
00:04:22,160 --> 00:04:24,640
Speaker 3: come up and like after those musical renditions.

80
00:04:24,720 --> 00:04:26,479
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, all right, guys.

81
00:04:26,720 --> 00:04:29,520
Speaker 2: Hey, hey, oh oh hey, sweeping up around here. I

82
00:04:29,600 --> 00:04:32,240
Speaker 2: don't have to go home, but you really shouldn't stay here.

83
00:04:32,320 --> 00:04:34,440
Speaker 2: Guys left a lot of little plastic bags on the

84
00:04:34,440 --> 00:04:38,400
Speaker 2: ground here. Another one of those shows. I guess.

85
00:04:39,839 --> 00:04:43,040
Speaker 3: How you doing, Jared, Hey, I'm doing all right. Where

86
00:04:43,040 --> 00:04:46,120
Speaker 3: you coming to us from Chicago? Moved here a couple

87
00:04:46,160 --> 00:04:49,200
Speaker 3: of years ago, and it's getting a little cold here,

88
00:04:49,320 --> 00:04:50,760
Speaker 3: but love this city.

89
00:04:51,080 --> 00:04:56,880
Speaker 1: Yeah, the old two one three three one two three

90
00:04:56,960 --> 00:04:57,839
Speaker 1: one two damn it.

91
00:04:58,040 --> 00:05:00,880
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's so close. Hey, it's Okay, man, it's okay.

92
00:05:01,480 --> 00:05:02,960
Speaker 1: We covered this yesterday.

93
00:05:03,480 --> 00:05:07,479
Speaker 2: Yeah, literally, But so, Jerry, what's like, because you know,

94
00:05:07,560 --> 00:05:09,880
Speaker 2: when we first started the show, we had you on

95
00:05:10,120 --> 00:05:13,680
Speaker 2: when you're working at like right Wing Watch. Yeah yeah,

96
00:05:13,680 --> 00:05:16,880
Speaker 2: and now like you've there's like a whole lane to

97
00:05:17,000 --> 00:05:19,960
Speaker 2: be somebody who is so well versed in like extremist

98
00:05:20,040 --> 00:05:24,280
Speaker 2: semiotics and monitoring extremist movements that like, I just feel

99
00:05:24,279 --> 00:05:26,200
Speaker 2: like you're always moving up and I'm like, this is

100
00:05:26,400 --> 00:05:28,360
Speaker 2: this is fair. I love the glow up, but it's

101
00:05:28,360 --> 00:05:30,680
Speaker 2: always on the back of having to have your head

102
00:05:30,760 --> 00:05:32,919
Speaker 2: in some of the dark shit all the time. But

103
00:05:33,000 --> 00:05:36,200
Speaker 2: you're doing well otherwise despite this career path. I just

104
00:05:36,200 --> 00:05:38,120
Speaker 2: want to make sure because the work you do is fantastic.

105
00:05:38,120 --> 00:05:40,200
Speaker 2: The work that your colleagues do is fantastic. I could

106
00:05:40,279 --> 00:05:43,400
Speaker 2: never imagine being disengaged with it, even at the level

107
00:05:43,440 --> 00:05:46,160
Speaker 2: we do. But but shit, the level that like you

108
00:05:46,200 --> 00:05:49,000
Speaker 2: guys do is completely it's like completely different.

109
00:05:49,480 --> 00:05:51,880
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, I'm doing well. I appreciate all that.

110
00:05:52,000 --> 00:05:55,040
Speaker 3: It's uh, it's really interesting because I started doing this

111
00:05:55,120 --> 00:05:58,600
Speaker 3: kind of stuff full time something like eight years ago, right,

112
00:05:58,920 --> 00:06:00,800
Speaker 3: and I felt like when I was doing it then,

113
00:06:01,480 --> 00:06:04,479
Speaker 3: I was like the crazy guy on the town square

114
00:06:04,520 --> 00:06:08,200
Speaker 3: being like here, he, here, he please pay attention to

115
00:06:08,240 --> 00:06:12,000
Speaker 3: this shit, right, and now it's just like, I mean,

116
00:06:12,040 --> 00:06:14,720
Speaker 3: I guess I'm glad it's recognized, but it is really

117
00:06:14,800 --> 00:06:17,880
Speaker 3: unfortunate that, you know, in the grand scheme of things,

118
00:06:17,920 --> 00:06:19,240
Speaker 3: that it's necessary.

119
00:06:19,640 --> 00:06:21,400
Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah, but so long as.

120
00:06:21,240 --> 00:06:23,799
Speaker 3: I can help, you know, that's it's like a calling

121
00:06:23,839 --> 00:06:27,640
Speaker 3: of mine, I guess, And I don't know, there's it's

122
00:06:27,720 --> 00:06:29,719
Speaker 3: really dark, but then there's like a little bit of

123
00:06:29,760 --> 00:06:31,720
Speaker 3: gallows humor that keeps me coming back.

124
00:06:31,880 --> 00:06:33,599
Speaker 2: Sure. Yeah.

125
00:06:33,800 --> 00:06:37,640
Speaker 1: Would you say, like just kind of having taking a

126
00:06:37,720 --> 00:06:41,200
Speaker 1: step back, would January sixth be the thing that like

127
00:06:41,360 --> 00:06:46,159
Speaker 1: made sort of the mainstream world take right wing extremism

128
00:06:46,200 --> 00:06:46,960
Speaker 1: more seriously?

129
00:06:47,240 --> 00:06:47,920
Speaker 2: Was it?

130
00:06:48,080 --> 00:06:51,920
Speaker 1: Was it happening before that? Was it Charlottesville? What was

131
00:06:52,360 --> 00:06:54,120
Speaker 1: the kind of overall pattern?

132
00:06:54,680 --> 00:06:59,200
Speaker 3: I mean, I think Charlottesville was sort of the beginning

133
00:06:59,279 --> 00:07:03,440
Speaker 3: of it. And then in twenty nineteen there were a

134
00:07:03,480 --> 00:07:07,560
Speaker 3: few really really horrible extremist mass killings. That's when you

135
00:07:07,600 --> 00:07:11,280
Speaker 3: had like the Pittsburgh synagogue shooting. Christ Church was that year.

136
00:07:11,920 --> 00:07:15,360
Speaker 3: And then I think for you know, the normies of

137
00:07:15,400 --> 00:07:19,360
Speaker 3: the world that still didn't get it somehow, it's kind

138
00:07:19,360 --> 00:07:21,800
Speaker 3: of hard to think of a more powerful image than

139
00:07:22,160 --> 00:07:26,960
Speaker 3: you know, QAnon ants and car dealership uncles radicalized by

140
00:07:27,000 --> 00:07:30,000
Speaker 3: the Internet, you know, smashing through the halls of Congress.

141
00:07:30,040 --> 00:07:32,760
Speaker 3: I think that was pretty hard to you know, look

142
00:07:32,800 --> 00:07:35,800
Speaker 3: away from or right off. It's like, oh, well, it's

143
00:07:35,840 --> 00:07:38,480
Speaker 3: just some weird fringe you know, yes, and it's right

144
00:07:38,520 --> 00:07:39,560
Speaker 3: there in your face.

145
00:07:39,920 --> 00:07:42,119
Speaker 2: That's my fucking uncle. Fuck.

146
00:07:43,400 --> 00:07:48,040
Speaker 1: I remember how recently it was like such a fringe idea,

147
00:07:48,360 --> 00:07:52,440
Speaker 1: Like even after right wing extremism was responsible for the

148
00:07:52,480 --> 00:07:57,040
Speaker 1: Oklahoma City bombing, it was just like there was nobody

149
00:07:57,120 --> 00:08:00,080
Speaker 1: looking into it. Even after Trump got elected, like there

150
00:08:00,200 --> 00:08:04,440
Speaker 1: was still like right just people weren't taking it seriously

151
00:08:04,640 --> 00:08:05,280
Speaker 1: as a threat.

152
00:08:05,440 --> 00:08:08,600
Speaker 2: It's because we have such you know, white supremacist reflexes

153
00:08:08,800 --> 00:08:12,520
Speaker 2: that were like them, no, no, they're nice kids. They

154
00:08:12,800 --> 00:08:15,760
Speaker 2: have Jacki's on okay, and they're they're not they don't

155
00:08:15,760 --> 00:08:18,360
Speaker 2: look that imposing. Now, this group of people with these

156
00:08:18,400 --> 00:08:20,360
Speaker 2: signs over here, I don't know what's going on. It

157
00:08:20,400 --> 00:08:22,320
Speaker 2: may have to do with their complexion, I don't know,

158
00:08:23,080 --> 00:08:25,400
Speaker 2: but yeah, like I feel like that always has that's

159
00:08:25,440 --> 00:08:29,640
Speaker 2: always benefited especially like right wing extremism, is their whiteness

160
00:08:29,920 --> 00:08:32,240
Speaker 2: or just not whether not being taken seriously or this

161
00:08:32,320 --> 00:08:35,800
Speaker 2: idea of like, oh, it's nothing, it's just don't worry

162
00:08:35,800 --> 00:08:37,040
Speaker 2: about that over there kind of shit.

163
00:08:37,120 --> 00:08:39,200
Speaker 3: Well, I mean it still does, right, I mean I

164
00:08:39,240 --> 00:08:42,800
Speaker 3: think about, like, even in the field I work in,

165
00:08:42,840 --> 00:08:45,040
Speaker 3: which is weird to call it a field now, right,

166
00:08:45,600 --> 00:08:48,000
Speaker 3: It's every once in a while you'll catch, you know,

167
00:08:48,120 --> 00:08:51,920
Speaker 3: after some mass shooting or big event in extremism land,

168
00:08:52,480 --> 00:08:54,800
Speaker 3: a bunch of people trying to offer up all these

169
00:08:54,840 --> 00:08:57,959
Speaker 3: like different competing theories as to why it happened, whether

170
00:08:58,000 --> 00:09:01,560
Speaker 3: it's you know, like economic hardsh or whatever. It's like, right,

171
00:09:01,720 --> 00:09:04,360
Speaker 3: we don't, you know, as a culture, we don't cut

172
00:09:04,360 --> 00:09:08,840
Speaker 3: this slack or like try to you know, do armchair

173
00:09:08,880 --> 00:09:11,160
Speaker 3: psychology over other stuff.

174
00:09:11,480 --> 00:09:11,720
Speaker 1: You know.

175
00:09:11,920 --> 00:09:15,000
Speaker 3: It's it's always interesting to me, like where that gets applied,

176
00:09:15,040 --> 00:09:17,520
Speaker 3: because that's one of those I think kind of subtle

177
00:09:17,559 --> 00:09:21,440
Speaker 3: ways that you know, living in a culture defined by

178
00:09:21,440 --> 00:09:25,400
Speaker 3: white supremacy like comes out even in the field that

179
00:09:26,120 --> 00:09:28,640
Speaker 3: you know, it is hoping to try to counteract some

180
00:09:28,720 --> 00:09:29,160
Speaker 3: of that.

181
00:09:29,120 --> 00:09:32,200
Speaker 2: Right right, right exactly, But how did they grow up though,

182
00:09:32,280 --> 00:09:33,560
Speaker 2: these skinhead kids.

183
00:09:34,040 --> 00:09:37,640
Speaker 1: It's like, well it doesn't matter because yeah, exactly, let's

184
00:09:37,640 --> 00:09:40,800
Speaker 1: get to the point, here's a skinhead now and that

185
00:09:41,040 --> 00:09:41,440
Speaker 1: you know.

186
00:09:42,040 --> 00:09:43,800
Speaker 2: You hate to see it, don't you? You hate to

187
00:09:43,800 --> 00:09:45,800
Speaker 2: see I feel like that's like what people would say,

188
00:09:45,840 --> 00:09:48,720
Speaker 2: like in news rooms, like ah, you hate to see it?

189
00:09:48,840 --> 00:09:51,560
Speaker 2: Just these nice kids going on a foul But yeah,

190
00:09:53,040 --> 00:09:53,680
Speaker 2: talk about today.

191
00:09:53,800 --> 00:09:55,440
Speaker 1: Yeah, we got a lot to talk about. We're going

192
00:09:55,520 --> 00:09:57,160
Speaker 1: to get more into this than the rest of the

193
00:09:57,200 --> 00:10:00,240
Speaker 1: show as it applies to this present moment in the

194
00:10:00,280 --> 00:10:01,000
Speaker 1: near future.

195
00:10:01,280 --> 00:10:02,520
Speaker 2: Yeah, but before we.

196
00:10:02,480 --> 00:10:05,600
Speaker 1: Get to that, we do, of course, Jared like to

197
00:10:05,679 --> 00:10:09,800
Speaker 1: ask our guests, what is something from your search history

198
00:10:09,920 --> 00:10:12,120
Speaker 1: that's revealing about who you are or what you're up to.

199
00:10:12,880 --> 00:10:17,760
Speaker 1: So the revealing one is just me typing in random

200
00:10:17,800 --> 00:10:20,480
Speaker 1: celebrity names because I don't follow celebrity news at all,

201
00:10:20,559 --> 00:10:24,520
Speaker 1: So anytime there's like some name I don't recognize that

202
00:10:24,760 --> 00:10:27,160
Speaker 1: people are talking about, I just assume it's some celebrity

203
00:10:27,200 --> 00:10:28,840
Speaker 1: and I have to look them up, and then my

204
00:10:29,000 --> 00:10:32,319
Speaker 1: reaction is usually either like oh, I think I've seen

205
00:10:32,360 --> 00:10:35,040
Speaker 1: that guy before, or like, oh no, I don't I

206
00:10:35,080 --> 00:10:38,120
Speaker 1: don't know who that is. Okay, wow, us with your latest,

207
00:10:38,320 --> 00:10:40,880
Speaker 1: Like who's the biggest person you've had to look up recently?

208
00:10:41,600 --> 00:10:43,559
Speaker 2: It's like Margo.

209
00:10:45,600 --> 00:10:48,400
Speaker 1: Margo Robbie. Yeah, yeah, I didn't know who that was.

210
00:10:48,600 --> 00:10:49,840
Speaker 2: Jared, I.

211
00:10:51,320 --> 00:10:51,839
Speaker 1: Not love it.

212
00:10:54,800 --> 00:10:56,840
Speaker 2: You're like Joey Gibson, I'll tell you when he was

213
00:10:56,880 --> 00:11:01,760
Speaker 2: fucking born started Patriot prayer. Wait, who the fuck is Barbie?

214
00:11:02,280 --> 00:11:05,800
Speaker 1: Yeah? I know, I know, damn yeah, yeah, I know.

215
00:11:06,360 --> 00:11:07,959
Speaker 2: I don't know. No, no, I'm not even saying it

216
00:11:07,960 --> 00:11:11,880
Speaker 2: was just it's just wild though, like how much wow?

217
00:11:12,280 --> 00:11:15,400
Speaker 2: In a way that's also it's a blessing.

218
00:11:15,080 --> 00:11:16,199
Speaker 1: To mvu sir.

219
00:11:16,760 --> 00:11:19,319
Speaker 3: Yeah, Well, I just like don't watch a lot of movies,

220
00:11:19,400 --> 00:11:21,120
Speaker 3: and I always feel like, you know, I'm missing out

221
00:11:21,160 --> 00:11:24,680
Speaker 3: on this big like cultural thing, but I I don't

222
00:11:24,679 --> 00:11:26,600
Speaker 3: know what it is. Maybe the Internet has just like

223
00:11:26,640 --> 00:11:31,280
Speaker 3: destroyed my attention span or I like or paralysis trying

224
00:11:31,320 --> 00:11:34,280
Speaker 3: to pick something to watch, but I just don't. I'm

225
00:11:34,280 --> 00:11:36,720
Speaker 3: not caught up with movies, so like these big names,

226
00:11:36,720 --> 00:11:38,160
Speaker 3: I just don't recognize that.

227
00:11:38,240 --> 00:11:41,320
Speaker 2: Sure it could be forgiven because you're out here looking

228
00:11:41,360 --> 00:11:46,200
Speaker 2: at the iterations of third wave fucking white nationalism, right,

229
00:11:46,960 --> 00:11:49,360
Speaker 2: they're like, yeah, yeah, I'm seeing that coming in from

230
00:11:49,400 --> 00:11:53,920
Speaker 2: a long distance here right now. But what is what

231
00:11:54,080 --> 00:11:55,040
Speaker 2: is pop patrol?

232
00:11:56,280 --> 00:11:56,480
Speaker 1: Right?

233
00:11:57,080 --> 00:11:57,840
Speaker 2: Is that? Wow?

234
00:11:58,679 --> 00:12:01,280
Speaker 1: And so do you feel what like hell, because I

235
00:12:01,280 --> 00:12:03,080
Speaker 1: think there's probably a lot of people out there who

236
00:12:03,120 --> 00:12:05,640
Speaker 1: are like I envy you. I wish I could be

237
00:12:06,600 --> 00:12:10,000
Speaker 1: unplugged from all the bullshit. Maybe not everybody, but like,

238
00:12:10,120 --> 00:12:13,800
Speaker 1: do you feel lost in a lot of conversations, what

239
00:12:14,160 --> 00:12:17,520
Speaker 1: like not knowing who Margo Elise Robbie is. Yeah?

240
00:12:17,559 --> 00:12:20,520
Speaker 3: Yeah, So I like to go to like trivia with

241
00:12:20,559 --> 00:12:23,800
Speaker 3: my friends like every every couple of weeks, and whenever

242
00:12:24,320 --> 00:12:27,439
Speaker 3: the questions come around, and it's like who was the

243
00:12:27,559 --> 00:12:30,160
Speaker 3: actor of the year from twenty eighteen?

244
00:12:30,240 --> 00:12:30,800
Speaker 2: Who started?

245
00:12:31,160 --> 00:12:33,240
Speaker 1: And then they'll just like they'll just say.

246
00:12:33,080 --> 00:12:37,760
Speaker 2: Like the movie right, just like I haven't know what right, right? Right?

247
00:12:37,920 --> 00:12:38,559
Speaker 2: What movie is that?

248
00:12:38,720 --> 00:12:44,000
Speaker 3: And they're like, I was Transformers, dude, Yeah, yeah, I remember, yeah,

249
00:12:44,120 --> 00:12:47,120
Speaker 3: actor of the Year, Actor of the Year from Transformers.

250
00:12:49,440 --> 00:12:51,880
Speaker 2: See, I just hope isn't there like ever a moment

251
00:12:51,920 --> 00:12:55,559
Speaker 2: though you can stunt with your like broad sweeping knowledge

252
00:12:55,559 --> 00:12:59,360
Speaker 2: of like historical facts and like context where like yeah, yeah,

253
00:12:59,400 --> 00:13:03,000
Speaker 2: being like what did Ross say as his excuse for

254
00:13:03,160 --> 00:13:07,560
Speaker 2: going outside of the relationship when he was cheating? Quote unquote,

255
00:13:07,600 --> 00:13:09,360
Speaker 2: It's like, I don't know what that you know the

256
00:13:09,400 --> 00:13:18,800
Speaker 2: answer to that, Jared, No, Well, we were on a break. Okay,

257
00:13:19,600 --> 00:13:21,480
Speaker 2: just you guys don't need to dunk on me. Just

258
00:13:21,520 --> 00:13:25,440
Speaker 2: let me talk more about it. Apologies.

259
00:13:26,240 --> 00:13:27,360
Speaker 1: That's amazing though.

260
00:13:27,240 --> 00:13:29,120
Speaker 2: No, but where does it? But does it pay out?

261
00:13:29,120 --> 00:13:31,240
Speaker 2: I mean, because dude, I know you are such an

262
00:13:31,480 --> 00:13:35,840
Speaker 2: infinite wealth of like just actual functional knowledge, especially when

263
00:13:35,920 --> 00:13:40,040
Speaker 2: looking at the current hellscape that is like American culture

264
00:13:40,040 --> 00:13:42,520
Speaker 2: and extremism. But like, tell me that you at least

265
00:13:42,559 --> 00:13:44,160
Speaker 2: flip it up on switch it up on him, like

266
00:13:44,280 --> 00:13:46,559
Speaker 2: y'all need to come to one of my trivia nights.

267
00:13:47,040 --> 00:13:50,200
Speaker 3: Oh so I do well with the historical stuff, but

268
00:13:50,640 --> 00:13:52,600
Speaker 3: where I think maybe a lot of people watch movies

269
00:13:52,640 --> 00:13:55,480
Speaker 3: and stuff. I'm really into music, so oh hell yeah, okay,

270
00:13:55,480 --> 00:13:57,120
Speaker 3: so I can do music trivia pretty good.

271
00:13:57,240 --> 00:13:59,839
Speaker 2: Okay, all right, good, good check out. I wanted to

272
00:13:59,840 --> 00:14:02,360
Speaker 2: make sure you have some kind of like creative thing

273
00:14:02,400 --> 00:14:04,200
Speaker 2: you could look at other than trying to be like

274
00:14:04,200 --> 00:14:10,320
Speaker 2: what does this Peppi the Frog mean? Which artist? A?

275
00:14:11,200 --> 00:14:14,839
Speaker 1: Yeah, no, I that's great, Like I honestly so much

276
00:14:14,920 --> 00:14:19,120
Speaker 1: my brain is just regurgitating like pop culture quotes and

277
00:14:19,160 --> 00:14:23,200
Speaker 1: bullshit and like just at random, like yea, you know,

278
00:14:23,960 --> 00:14:26,680
Speaker 1: someone's like, let's take a quick break while I'm like,

279
00:14:27,360 --> 00:14:31,000
Speaker 1: you know, my wife and I are running and she's like,

280
00:14:31,080 --> 00:14:31,840
Speaker 1: let's take a quick break.

281
00:14:31,840 --> 00:14:34,120
Speaker 2: And I'm like, we were on a break. Why why

282
00:14:34,720 --> 00:14:38,920
Speaker 2: did that? What's Yeah, that's help that resonated with me.

283
00:14:39,480 --> 00:14:42,160
Speaker 2: But Jared is like okay, and yeah.

284
00:14:41,960 --> 00:14:49,840
Speaker 1: Yeah, maybe shut up. My wife response, Yeah, what's What's

285
00:14:49,840 --> 00:14:50,960
Speaker 1: something you think is overrated?

286
00:14:51,040 --> 00:14:51,240
Speaker 2: Jared?

287
00:14:51,800 --> 00:14:52,160
Speaker 1: AI?

288
00:14:52,880 --> 00:14:55,160
Speaker 3: Like what what people call like AI? It's going to

289
00:14:55,240 --> 00:14:56,960
Speaker 3: be the future. It's like a lot of the same

290
00:14:57,000 --> 00:15:00,440
Speaker 3: guys that hawked, you know, the like board ape and

291
00:15:00,480 --> 00:15:01,800
Speaker 3: the n f T s and stuff.

292
00:15:01,800 --> 00:15:03,720
Speaker 1: They're all about AI now and.

293
00:15:05,160 --> 00:15:08,280
Speaker 3: Like a lot of that technology is impressive, but if

294
00:15:08,320 --> 00:15:10,600
Speaker 3: you like it still just screws up all the time.

295
00:15:10,640 --> 00:15:14,360
Speaker 3: I think of all the pictures where it's like we

296
00:15:14,480 --> 00:15:17,800
Speaker 3: used AI to see what what kind of skateboard George

297
00:15:17,840 --> 00:15:22,440
Speaker 3: Washington would have written, and George Washington has like five legs.

298
00:15:22,600 --> 00:15:24,360
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's like, yeah, I don't know about that.

299
00:15:24,640 --> 00:15:27,600
Speaker 2: Or dude, I knew he'd skate alien workshop dude.

300
00:15:27,400 --> 00:15:30,840
Speaker 3: Exactly, yeah, exactly, Or like news outlets that are like, oh,

301
00:15:30,840 --> 00:15:32,480
Speaker 3: we're going to use AI and it's going to like

302
00:15:32,520 --> 00:15:36,160
Speaker 3: generate the shitty clickbait or whatever that actually pays the

303
00:15:36,200 --> 00:15:40,400
Speaker 3: bills on our blog and then the the articles just

304
00:15:40,440 --> 00:15:44,400
Speaker 3: like did you know headphones can help you listen to

305
00:15:44,520 --> 00:15:49,160
Speaker 3: things from your phone? And it's like I'm yeah, thanks man, Uh.

306
00:15:50,120 --> 00:15:51,440
Speaker 2: You're like, what's this article about?

307
00:15:51,800 --> 00:15:56,760
Speaker 3: Yeah, and you know it's it's just I the technology

308
00:15:56,800 --> 00:15:59,360
Speaker 3: is impressive, but I think the doom sayers and the

309
00:15:59,400 --> 00:16:01,440
Speaker 3: people that are like, this is going to change the world.

310
00:16:01,560 --> 00:16:02,480
Speaker 1: Maybe it will, but.

311
00:16:02,440 --> 00:16:05,160
Speaker 3: We're not, like it's it's not there yet, you know.

312
00:16:05,360 --> 00:16:09,240
Speaker 3: I think the biggest risk is this technology getting forced

313
00:16:09,280 --> 00:16:11,880
Speaker 3: through before it's ready by the people who want to

314
00:16:11,880 --> 00:16:15,040
Speaker 3: get rich on it, you know. And uh, you know,

315
00:16:15,280 --> 00:16:17,600
Speaker 3: but generally speaking, I think a lot of it is

316
00:16:17,640 --> 00:16:20,600
Speaker 3: like razzle dazzle without a whole lot of stuff to

317
00:16:20,640 --> 00:16:21,360
Speaker 3: like back it up.

318
00:16:21,560 --> 00:16:22,960
Speaker 1: It's not like AI is.

319
00:16:22,960 --> 00:16:26,440
Speaker 3: Actually conscious if we're anywhere close to anything like that.

320
00:16:26,520 --> 00:16:26,760
Speaker 3: You know.

321
00:16:27,400 --> 00:16:30,440
Speaker 1: Yeah, the razzle dazzle sucks. Like when somebody does razzle

322
00:16:30,520 --> 00:16:32,960
Speaker 1: dazzle in sports, it's like, man, that was a cool,

323
00:16:33,120 --> 00:16:36,800
Speaker 1: like little magic trick they did. The razz AI fucking sucks,

324
00:16:36,800 --> 00:16:37,280
Speaker 1: like Yo.

325
00:16:37,200 --> 00:16:38,680
Speaker 2: The wolf is dripped out.

326
00:16:39,040 --> 00:16:42,160
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, that's the one that's the is one good

327
00:16:42,200 --> 00:16:42,760
Speaker 1: piece of work.

328
00:16:42,800 --> 00:16:45,240
Speaker 2: I will like, Yo, that just that puffer that he

329
00:16:45,360 --> 00:16:47,840
Speaker 2: was in the fucking ill. Did you wait? Speaking of

330
00:16:47,920 --> 00:16:49,680
Speaker 2: bard Ape, did you see how they had like a

331
00:16:49,760 --> 00:16:52,840
Speaker 2: bord Ape convention in like h and all the people

332
00:16:52,840 --> 00:16:56,080
Speaker 2: got their eyes burned by UV lights. Yeah?

333
00:16:56,200 --> 00:16:59,160
Speaker 3: Yeah, And they put out some statement this morning that's

334
00:16:59,240 --> 00:17:02,520
Speaker 3: like we're away of eye related incidents.

335
00:17:04,000 --> 00:17:06,960
Speaker 2: It's incredible. People were like tweeting, I don't did you

336
00:17:06,960 --> 00:17:07,240
Speaker 2: see this?

337
00:17:07,359 --> 00:17:10,600
Speaker 1: Jack people the dance party and people being like this

338
00:17:10,720 --> 00:17:13,159
Speaker 1: is not how I would want to be blinded. And

339
00:17:13,280 --> 00:17:15,439
Speaker 1: I did not know what they were saying, so I

340
00:17:15,440 --> 00:17:18,680
Speaker 1: thought they were just like I don't know. I was like, man,

341
00:17:18,680 --> 00:17:20,120
Speaker 1: I got to invest in this so I can get

342
00:17:20,119 --> 00:17:22,480
Speaker 1: all the inside jokes.

343
00:17:23,520 --> 00:17:26,840
Speaker 2: Yeah, everyone's like, yeah, you actually have what's called welder's eyes,

344
00:17:28,520 --> 00:17:31,520
Speaker 2: like from not wearing a fucking mask? Fan? Is that real? Yeah?

345
00:17:31,600 --> 00:17:35,280
Speaker 2: That's like it's like, Yo, this ship is called Welder's eye. Dude,

346
00:17:35,280 --> 00:17:35,919
Speaker 2: can you believe?

347
00:17:36,040 --> 00:17:38,080
Speaker 3: Can you believe they only paid one hundred grand to

348
00:17:38,119 --> 00:17:38,960
Speaker 3: get Welder's eye?

349
00:17:39,200 --> 00:17:39,400
Speaker 2: Yeah?

350
00:17:39,440 --> 00:17:43,280
Speaker 1: I know, Wow, what a deal. It's just it does

351
00:17:43,400 --> 00:17:46,480
Speaker 1: like I don't take that much joy in it because

352
00:17:46,520 --> 00:17:50,680
Speaker 1: they're just like they getting dunked on while multiple much

353
00:17:50,800 --> 00:17:55,160
Speaker 1: money and just tripling down to get Welder's eye.

354
00:17:55,720 --> 00:17:57,880
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's like, yeah, because you feel bad like you've

355
00:17:57,880 --> 00:18:00,639
Speaker 2: been you got got like multiple times. Now it's like

356
00:18:00,680 --> 00:18:02,959
Speaker 2: you got got by buying these born apes and then

357
00:18:03,000 --> 00:18:04,520
Speaker 2: you go to the thing that's supposed to be with

358
00:18:04,560 --> 00:18:06,440
Speaker 2: you and the crew, and then you're getting Welder's I

359
00:18:06,640 --> 00:18:08,320
Speaker 2: at the fucking dance. Yeah.

360
00:18:08,800 --> 00:18:10,800
Speaker 3: The best reaction I saw to it is this writer

361
00:18:11,000 --> 00:18:14,199
Speaker 3: that I really enjoy, Molly White. She like pull you know,

362
00:18:14,240 --> 00:18:18,119
Speaker 3: posted a picture of the like avatars of the the

363
00:18:18,240 --> 00:18:20,800
Speaker 3: apes with like laser beam eyes, and she was like,

364
00:18:20,880 --> 00:18:24,639
Speaker 3: you know, I totally misinterpreted this. I thought the coming out.

365
00:18:27,560 --> 00:18:31,679
Speaker 1: Like, you know, you were getting freelance lasic, you know,

366
00:18:32,440 --> 00:18:35,400
Speaker 1: ambient lasik happening all around us.

367
00:18:35,359 --> 00:18:38,160
Speaker 2: The most imprecise lasick you could have it. It's really

368
00:18:38,200 --> 00:18:42,800
Speaker 2: just called photokeratosis or carotitis or something like that. Welder's eye.

369
00:18:42,960 --> 00:18:44,719
Speaker 2: Oh that sucks.

370
00:18:44,880 --> 00:18:47,320
Speaker 1: What. There's also like I've seen ads for things that

371
00:18:47,359 --> 00:18:52,760
Speaker 1: are like I stand with, like Crypto and various things

372
00:18:52,800 --> 00:18:55,920
Speaker 1: like that, like trying to turn the failure of that

373
00:18:56,160 --> 00:19:00,720
Speaker 1: product into like a movement where people are I feel like.

374
00:19:00,680 --> 00:19:05,280
Speaker 2: I saw that right after the the attacks on like

375
00:19:05,440 --> 00:19:09,119
Speaker 2: October seventh. Oh really, I don't know, it felt like

376
00:19:09,119 --> 00:19:12,440
Speaker 2: you were co opting that language for some really fucking

377
00:19:12,880 --> 00:19:16,480
Speaker 2: sad way to be. Like, I stand with Crypto, ok

378
00:19:16,800 --> 00:19:21,240
Speaker 2: what anyways, I stand with the bag holders. It sucks

379
00:19:21,280 --> 00:19:23,600
Speaker 2: for y'all, honestly, truly.

380
00:19:23,800 --> 00:19:25,879
Speaker 1: Me, I stand with JP Morgan Chase.

381
00:19:25,920 --> 00:19:30,880
Speaker 2: You know, there you go, that's a hutu fun. They've

382
00:19:30,920 --> 00:19:33,080
Speaker 2: been around, guys, they've been around so long they were

383
00:19:33,080 --> 00:19:37,240
Speaker 2: handling slave money. Okay, so I think they know they

384
00:19:37,640 --> 00:19:39,960
Speaker 2: they know what they're doing if they've lasted this long.

385
00:19:40,200 --> 00:19:42,080
Speaker 1: Jared, what's something you think is underrated?

386
00:19:42,480 --> 00:19:46,159
Speaker 3: I'll say Chicago is a city I feel like it

387
00:19:46,200 --> 00:19:50,639
Speaker 3: is underloved. But to me, it's like it has a

388
00:19:50,680 --> 00:19:54,159
Speaker 3: lot of stuff that New York promises, but you can

389
00:19:54,240 --> 00:19:58,520
Speaker 3: afford to live there if you, you know, have a

390
00:19:58,560 --> 00:20:02,840
Speaker 3: normal job, and and there's also just kind of like

391
00:20:02,920 --> 00:20:06,200
Speaker 3: the I don't know, I mean, maybe it's how I

392
00:20:06,200 --> 00:20:07,879
Speaker 3: grew up or whatever, but I just really vibe with

393
00:20:07,920 --> 00:20:10,800
Speaker 3: the Midwest spirit of like just being kind of down

394
00:20:10,840 --> 00:20:14,600
Speaker 3: to earth and like there's just not a lot of

395
00:20:14,760 --> 00:20:18,840
Speaker 3: bullshit flies here and people are pretty straight up and

396
00:20:19,240 --> 00:20:24,960
Speaker 3: generally nice, passive aggressive, like any good Midwestern town. But yeah,

397
00:20:25,200 --> 00:20:28,520
Speaker 3: you know, I feel like it's you know, people can

398
00:20:28,560 --> 00:20:30,520
Speaker 3: kind of see how it is here and city has

399
00:20:30,720 --> 00:20:32,920
Speaker 3: a lot to offer. I moved here a couple of

400
00:20:33,000 --> 00:20:35,920
Speaker 3: years ago with my wife and love it. So I

401
00:20:36,800 --> 00:20:39,520
Speaker 3: gotta rap Chicago. I've lived here just long enough to

402
00:20:39,600 --> 00:20:41,400
Speaker 3: be able to, you know, call it home.

403
00:20:41,520 --> 00:20:44,280
Speaker 2: So yeah, there you go, gotta wrap it. Yeah, I

404
00:20:44,400 --> 00:20:49,280
Speaker 2: love Chicago. My dad's family moved to LA from Chicago,

405
00:20:49,520 --> 00:20:52,159
Speaker 2: so like we I have those roots there too. But

406
00:20:52,720 --> 00:20:55,639
Speaker 2: I really the last time I went was like in

407
00:20:55,960 --> 00:20:59,119
Speaker 2: twenty twenty, like like like right before the pandemic started,

408
00:20:59,119 --> 00:21:01,480
Speaker 2: and I remember having the same thing or like, man,

409
00:21:01,880 --> 00:21:04,040
Speaker 2: I've been like I would go as a kid, but

410
00:21:04,119 --> 00:21:06,240
Speaker 2: I hadn't gone as like an adult really who could

411
00:21:06,280 --> 00:21:08,600
Speaker 2: like go out and like you know, like like oh

412
00:21:08,600 --> 00:21:10,560
Speaker 2: I'm gonna go check out this restaurant or do other things.

413
00:21:10,560 --> 00:21:12,639
Speaker 2: And I was really really realizing, like man, I was

414
00:21:12,680 --> 00:21:15,000
Speaker 2: fucking sleeping so hard on this ship because I was

415
00:21:15,040 --> 00:21:16,639
Speaker 2: like I came back and be like, yeah, so we

416
00:21:16,640 --> 00:21:19,520
Speaker 2: should just move to Chicago. Also, I can where everyone's

417
00:21:19,520 --> 00:21:21,440
Speaker 2: like you're gonna hate the winter. I'm like I want

418
00:21:21,520 --> 00:21:24,840
Speaker 2: my legs to fucking snap off from the wind, okay,

419
00:21:24,960 --> 00:21:26,879
Speaker 2: And I know people are like, yeah, wait, till it happens,

420
00:21:26,960 --> 00:21:29,600
Speaker 2: but allow me that ignorance so I may experience and

421
00:21:29,680 --> 00:21:31,320
Speaker 2: then come back and say, yeah, yeah, that was a

422
00:21:31,359 --> 00:21:31,920
Speaker 2: little too much.

423
00:21:33,000 --> 00:21:35,760
Speaker 1: But we went there like during it wasn't it wasn't

424
00:21:36,160 --> 00:21:39,520
Speaker 1: the summer, Like summer Chicago make you fall in love immediately?

425
00:21:39,760 --> 00:21:40,680
Speaker 1: Yeah we went there.

426
00:21:41,240 --> 00:21:44,560
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, I think we're there in January. Yeah it was.

427
00:21:44,840 --> 00:21:46,600
Speaker 2: I was, and then I went back for Also when

428
00:21:46,600 --> 00:21:48,560
Speaker 2: the NBA Al Star Game was it that was February.

429
00:21:48,920 --> 00:21:51,240
Speaker 1: So you've seen what Chicago has to offer in terms

430
00:21:51,240 --> 00:21:53,720
Speaker 1: of making your legs snap up. I guess I was

431
00:21:53,800 --> 00:21:57,600
Speaker 1: like on some like uh like episode two of Lord

432
00:21:57,640 --> 00:21:59,480
Speaker 1: of the Rings, Like I was like, is.

433
00:21:59,520 --> 00:22:03,720
Speaker 2: This all you can conjure? Saraman like, because it wasn't

434
00:22:03,960 --> 00:22:06,280
Speaker 2: that bad. But at the end of the day, maybe

435
00:22:06,320 --> 00:22:06,960
Speaker 2: that was a blessing.

436
00:22:07,320 --> 00:22:10,640
Speaker 1: All right, let's take a quick break and we'll come

437
00:22:10,720 --> 00:22:12,800
Speaker 1: back and get into it.

438
00:22:13,040 --> 00:22:13,879
Speaker 2: We'll be right back.

439
00:22:24,320 --> 00:22:25,480
Speaker 1: And we're back.

440
00:22:25,960 --> 00:22:26,520
Speaker 2: Oh we're back.

441
00:22:27,080 --> 00:22:32,280
Speaker 1: Oh we're back. So, Jared, something that your institute has

442
00:22:32,280 --> 00:22:37,560
Speaker 1: been talking about is sort of some of the opportunism

443
00:22:38,280 --> 00:22:42,239
Speaker 1: happening from the extreme right. It feels like there are

444
00:22:42,720 --> 00:22:47,840
Speaker 1: like avowed anti Semites that are using the current situation

445
00:22:47,960 --> 00:22:50,960
Speaker 1: in Gaza to like kind of get their message in

446
00:22:51,680 --> 00:22:54,119
Speaker 1: under the radar to people that are merely trying to

447
00:22:54,280 --> 00:22:57,000
Speaker 1: learn more about what is happening on the ground. Are

448
00:22:57,040 --> 00:22:59,399
Speaker 1: you Are you seeing a lot of this kind of

449
00:22:59,560 --> 00:23:04,440
Speaker 1: opportunit tunistic rhetoric happening both on the side of anti

450
00:23:04,520 --> 00:23:07,560
Speaker 1: Semitism and then kind of in other ways on the

451
00:23:07,600 --> 00:23:10,159
Speaker 1: side of Islamophobia. Yeah, definitely.

452
00:23:10,240 --> 00:23:13,920
Speaker 3: I mean any kind of like major cultural flashpoint like

453
00:23:14,080 --> 00:23:17,320
Speaker 3: this is going to be a big like source of

454
00:23:17,480 --> 00:23:22,480
Speaker 3: opportunism from extremist groups and on the extreme right, we've

455
00:23:22,520 --> 00:23:26,040
Speaker 3: seen you know, neo Nazis, white supremacists, you know, all

456
00:23:26,160 --> 00:23:29,359
Speaker 3: kinds of folks that have these really sort of ingrained

457
00:23:29,400 --> 00:23:33,359
Speaker 3: anti Semitic beliefs trying to insert themselves into the conversation,

458
00:23:33,800 --> 00:23:37,160
Speaker 3: and you know, they sort of rehearse these talking points

459
00:23:37,240 --> 00:23:41,119
Speaker 3: for so long they are absolutely obsessed with Israel and

460
00:23:41,240 --> 00:23:43,920
Speaker 3: that sort of stuff. So now that that is in

461
00:23:44,000 --> 00:23:46,440
Speaker 3: the news, you know, I think some of them have

462
00:23:46,520 --> 00:23:51,159
Speaker 3: been able to, you know, get on platforms like Twitter

463
00:23:51,440 --> 00:23:56,520
Speaker 3: or I guess it's x N and you know, kind

464
00:23:56,560 --> 00:23:59,280
Speaker 3: of convey this false sense of authority, right, you know,

465
00:23:59,400 --> 00:24:02,520
Speaker 3: and maybe they get people in by you know, just

466
00:24:02,640 --> 00:24:05,480
Speaker 3: kind of sharing news about what's going on or speculation

467
00:24:05,960 --> 00:24:08,720
Speaker 3: or whatever. And then you know, if they get people

468
00:24:08,760 --> 00:24:11,159
Speaker 3: along for the ride, then you know, that's when the

469
00:24:11,520 --> 00:24:14,400
Speaker 3: real shit comes out. You know, this is and these

470
00:24:14,480 --> 00:24:17,120
Speaker 3: kind of opportunities. You know, I think back to when

471
00:24:17,160 --> 00:24:19,000
Speaker 3: I started, and you know, I was hanging out on

472
00:24:19,200 --> 00:24:23,280
Speaker 3: four Chan during the Trump movement and whatever, and you know,

473
00:24:24,600 --> 00:24:27,919
Speaker 3: to this day, there's this obsession with like red pilling.

474
00:24:28,359 --> 00:24:30,840
Speaker 3: Not a lot of people like call it that explicitly anymore,

475
00:24:30,960 --> 00:24:34,360
Speaker 3: but just seeking these little opportunities to like plant these

476
00:24:34,400 --> 00:24:38,800
Speaker 3: little seeds and try to take these social movements that

477
00:24:38,880 --> 00:24:41,560
Speaker 3: have a lot of emotion, you know, that are maybe

478
00:24:42,320 --> 00:24:45,760
Speaker 3: debated or less clear on facts in some cases, like

479
00:24:45,840 --> 00:24:48,720
Speaker 3: in this one, where there's like both the time zone

480
00:24:48,800 --> 00:24:53,200
Speaker 3: gap and also just a disparity between like the amount

481
00:24:53,320 --> 00:24:55,880
Speaker 3: of reporters on the ground that are able to get

482
00:24:55,960 --> 00:24:59,159
Speaker 3: good information and like have it bounced through and then

483
00:24:59,200 --> 00:25:02,520
Speaker 3: wind up in a US audience. You know, in that gap,

484
00:25:03,600 --> 00:25:07,359
Speaker 3: that's where they're trying to leverage things and get people,

485
00:25:07,960 --> 00:25:09,600
Speaker 3: even if you know they're not going to go to

486
00:25:09,720 --> 00:25:12,960
Speaker 3: like a pro Palestine protest and walk away with a

487
00:25:13,000 --> 00:25:15,960
Speaker 3: crowd of two thousand neo Nazis, you know, they want

488
00:25:16,040 --> 00:25:19,560
Speaker 3: to at least get some of the some of their ideas,

489
00:25:20,720 --> 00:25:23,520
Speaker 3: even just slightly more popularized, because that has the effect

490
00:25:23,560 --> 00:25:26,480
Speaker 3: of sanitizing them right when they come out and maybe

491
00:25:26,520 --> 00:25:29,160
Speaker 3: they're a more extreme version of it. But if people

492
00:25:29,200 --> 00:25:31,280
Speaker 3: are acclimated at the very least, even if they don't

493
00:25:31,280 --> 00:25:35,000
Speaker 3: totally believe it, it still gives them an advantage in

494
00:25:35,400 --> 00:25:39,920
Speaker 3: the discourse. And like being viewed as legitimate or being

495
00:25:40,080 --> 00:25:44,160
Speaker 3: viewed as you know, being reflective of how people secretly

496
00:25:44,320 --> 00:25:46,720
Speaker 3: really feel, right is like the greatest gift in the

497
00:25:46,800 --> 00:25:48,639
Speaker 3: world to extremists.

498
00:25:48,240 --> 00:25:49,920
Speaker 2: Because I feel like, who's that was that? One of

499
00:25:50,000 --> 00:25:53,280
Speaker 2: Benny Johnson? Like a clown?

500
00:25:53,520 --> 00:25:53,879
Speaker 3: Clown?

501
00:25:54,000 --> 00:25:56,600
Speaker 2: Yeah, like I felt early on he was like tweeting

502
00:25:56,720 --> 00:26:01,800
Speaker 2: things that seemingly like appeared objective, like about like policies

503
00:26:01,880 --> 00:26:03,960
Speaker 2: of the Israeli government, and then people are like, dude,

504
00:26:03,960 --> 00:26:07,520
Speaker 2: this guy is fucking a trash racist, Like like, hold on,

505
00:26:07,640 --> 00:26:09,040
Speaker 2: the people that just do this is getting a ton

506
00:26:09,080 --> 00:26:11,960
Speaker 2: of retweets right now. Know that this person has like

507
00:26:12,440 --> 00:26:14,560
Speaker 2: does not have their head in this for the right reasons.

508
00:26:14,600 --> 00:26:17,359
Speaker 2: He's purely here to like insert himself to get an

509
00:26:17,440 --> 00:26:20,520
Speaker 2: audience that is eventually going to switch a certain way.

510
00:26:20,960 --> 00:26:23,080
Speaker 2: But like when you when you guys do an analysis,

511
00:26:24,040 --> 00:26:26,479
Speaker 2: you were obviously you're saying like you're seeing like an

512
00:26:26,560 --> 00:26:30,840
Speaker 2: uptick in both Islamophobic posts and anti Semitic posts, but

513
00:26:30,880 --> 00:26:32,840
Speaker 2: you're also very you're careful to do the thing, which

514
00:26:32,840 --> 00:26:34,640
Speaker 2: because right now I feel like we're in this environment

515
00:26:34,640 --> 00:26:39,200
Speaker 2: where people are conflating Israel with the entire religion of Judaism,

516
00:26:39,760 --> 00:26:43,800
Speaker 2: or conflating a call for a ceasefire to be anti semitic.

517
00:26:44,320 --> 00:26:46,520
Speaker 2: But how do you get like, so in that analysis,

518
00:26:46,600 --> 00:26:49,639
Speaker 2: what were you guys even finding from from from like

519
00:26:49,720 --> 00:26:50,639
Speaker 2: what's currently happening.

520
00:26:51,320 --> 00:26:58,240
Speaker 3: Yeah, so doing analysis over like several platforms on social media,

521
00:26:58,920 --> 00:27:03,280
Speaker 3: there's no like totally perfect methodology. Sure, so these are

522
00:27:03,359 --> 00:27:07,560
Speaker 3: like approximations based on like collections of keywords we put

523
00:27:07,600 --> 00:27:10,600
Speaker 3: together and then sort of calling and refining, you know,

524
00:27:10,680 --> 00:27:13,360
Speaker 3: getting the trash out of the data and that sort

525
00:27:13,359 --> 00:27:17,480
Speaker 3: of stuff. But we're seeing increases to the tune of

526
00:27:17,560 --> 00:27:19,760
Speaker 3: something like four hundred percent or like two and a

527
00:27:19,800 --> 00:27:23,720
Speaker 3: half time fold when it comes to anti Semitism. But yeah,

528
00:27:23,760 --> 00:27:27,480
Speaker 3: we try to be really careful in doing exactly what

529
00:27:27,560 --> 00:27:31,440
Speaker 3: you just said. You know, people criticizing the government of

530
00:27:31,560 --> 00:27:35,359
Speaker 3: Israel is not like inherently anti Semitic, right, so that

531
00:27:35,560 --> 00:27:39,040
Speaker 3: should not qualify And again, like you said, calling for

532
00:27:39,080 --> 00:27:42,320
Speaker 3: a ceasefire or you know, that sort of thing is

533
00:27:42,359 --> 00:27:45,960
Speaker 3: not necessarily like pro Hamas, right, right. I think the

534
00:27:46,080 --> 00:27:51,000
Speaker 3: powers that be, like these militaries and stuff, right, would

535
00:27:51,080 --> 00:27:52,800
Speaker 3: like love for us to just be like at each

536
00:27:52,800 --> 00:27:56,800
Speaker 3: other's throats, you know, failing to see this like middle

537
00:27:57,440 --> 00:28:03,600
Speaker 3: humanitarian ground of like what if killing innocent people is bad?

538
00:28:04,520 --> 00:28:05,280
Speaker 2: Right? Right?

539
00:28:05,400 --> 00:28:10,879
Speaker 3: Period that yeah, what if like children didn't have to

540
00:28:11,400 --> 00:28:15,320
Speaker 3: die in discriminately right, Like that's but you know in

541
00:28:15,440 --> 00:28:19,520
Speaker 3: these situations that that sort of headbutt that's happening is

542
00:28:19,800 --> 00:28:25,720
Speaker 3: just like producing these huge rises in online rhetoric that's

543
00:28:25,840 --> 00:28:31,080
Speaker 3: like very specifically islamophobic, very specifically anti Semitic, And those

544
00:28:31,119 --> 00:28:33,800
Speaker 3: trends are also reflected in some of the early like

545
00:28:33,920 --> 00:28:37,920
Speaker 3: offline data overseeing you know, leaders of synagogues getting targeted,

546
00:28:38,480 --> 00:28:41,560
Speaker 3: people showing up to pro Palestine protests with weapons, like

547
00:28:41,840 --> 00:28:44,040
Speaker 3: just north of Chicago and Skoki, someone showed up with

548
00:28:44,160 --> 00:28:46,840
Speaker 3: like a it's like a paintball gun type it's like

549
00:28:46,880 --> 00:28:49,080
Speaker 3: a less than lethal gun type thing, but it still

550
00:28:49,200 --> 00:28:52,160
Speaker 3: managed to like terrorize the crowd and all that. Right,

551
00:28:52,240 --> 00:28:56,800
Speaker 3: So it's you know, that conversation that's happening online is

552
00:28:56,840 --> 00:28:59,560
Speaker 3: also reflecting itself in real life. And you know, if

553
00:28:59,560 --> 00:29:02,240
Speaker 3: you remember or of either one of these communities, maybe

554
00:29:02,320 --> 00:29:04,440
Speaker 3: rightfully so, you would feel a little bit on.

555
00:29:04,600 --> 00:29:07,800
Speaker 2: Edge, right, Yeah, And I'm sure adding to that the

556
00:29:08,320 --> 00:29:12,000
Speaker 2: utter lack of moderation on Twitter, it's just like it's

557
00:29:12,080 --> 00:29:13,480
Speaker 2: just a free for all. And I know you guys

558
00:29:13,520 --> 00:29:15,240
Speaker 2: were pointing out that there's a four hundred and twenty

559
00:29:15,280 --> 00:29:17,719
Speaker 2: two percent rise in the use of anti Muslim language

560
00:29:18,120 --> 00:29:21,720
Speaker 2: on x since the start of this, and yeah, like

561
00:29:22,000 --> 00:29:24,280
Speaker 2: that's why, Like when I first reached out, I was like,

562
00:29:24,440 --> 00:29:26,960
Speaker 2: I'm really curious to get your perspective on this, because

563
00:29:27,560 --> 00:29:29,920
Speaker 2: I can I already was seeing, like at the start

564
00:29:29,960 --> 00:29:31,440
Speaker 2: of this that there were these like people I'm like,

565
00:29:31,520 --> 00:29:34,320
Speaker 2: I'm pretty sure I know that handle, but for bad reasons,

566
00:29:34,400 --> 00:29:36,880
Speaker 2: Like I'm pretty sure this person is a scumbag, like

567
00:29:37,000 --> 00:29:39,600
Speaker 2: neo Nazi, and then they'll just like kind of sanitize

568
00:29:39,600 --> 00:29:41,280
Speaker 2: their avatar to be like, no, I'm wearing a suit

569
00:29:41,800 --> 00:29:44,040
Speaker 2: and I have this like I have an Israeli and

570
00:29:44,120 --> 00:29:46,560
Speaker 2: American flag in it, but I'm also doing this like

571
00:29:46,680 --> 00:29:50,400
Speaker 2: really like really opportunistic shit. And I can just see

572
00:29:50,440 --> 00:29:54,840
Speaker 2: how because of how charged the entire situation is, it

573
00:29:54,960 --> 00:29:57,720
Speaker 2: must be like a very like the like extremists must

574
00:29:57,720 --> 00:30:00,440
Speaker 2: be just like rubbing their hands together to be like, oh,

575
00:30:00,520 --> 00:30:03,120
Speaker 2: we can really take advantage of this in either direction.

576
00:30:03,280 --> 00:30:04,960
Speaker 1: Really yeah, definitely.

577
00:30:05,080 --> 00:30:07,240
Speaker 3: It's like if I mean, if you look at the

578
00:30:08,000 --> 00:30:10,400
Speaker 3: you know, explosion of the hospital in Gaza, for example,

579
00:30:10,480 --> 00:30:12,200
Speaker 3: that was that was like a really good example of

580
00:30:12,280 --> 00:30:15,720
Speaker 3: the information gap that they're exploiting in this situation where

581
00:30:16,520 --> 00:30:21,920
Speaker 3: there's reports of this explosion, you know, some initial remarks

582
00:30:22,040 --> 00:30:25,840
Speaker 3: both from you know, government over Gaza and Israel.

583
00:30:26,760 --> 00:30:27,800
Speaker 1: Newsrooms in the.

584
00:30:27,920 --> 00:30:30,160
Speaker 3: US are trying to figure out what the hell is happening.

585
00:30:30,320 --> 00:30:32,320
Speaker 3: A few of them fall like flat on their face.

586
00:30:32,920 --> 00:30:36,320
Speaker 3: A lot of details still aren't clear. But in that gap,

587
00:30:36,600 --> 00:30:39,160
Speaker 3: you know, which can be several hours, if not days,

588
00:30:39,240 --> 00:30:42,360
Speaker 3: and you know, I mean we don't we still don't

589
00:30:42,400 --> 00:30:45,640
Speaker 3: have like the most insane like if you're taking this

590
00:30:46,040 --> 00:30:49,480
Speaker 3: position of being like inherently skeptical of like government claims

591
00:30:49,560 --> 00:30:54,280
Speaker 3: right like as far as hard concrete this is one

592
00:30:54,360 --> 00:30:56,840
Speaker 3: two three what happened, we still don't have that right,

593
00:30:57,360 --> 00:31:02,360
Speaker 3: and that gap is where the opportunity lies for these folks,

594
00:31:02,600 --> 00:31:04,920
Speaker 3: because they can come in and say, you know, you

595
00:31:04,960 --> 00:31:08,000
Speaker 3: should listen to me because X y Z, And while

596
00:31:08,000 --> 00:31:10,560
Speaker 3: you're here, I've got all this extra shit to say, right,

597
00:31:10,680 --> 00:31:15,040
Speaker 3: And then that's when they're getting sort of their They're

598
00:31:15,040 --> 00:31:17,880
Speaker 3: coming in this with ulterior motives, is right, you know?

599
00:31:18,080 --> 00:31:18,280
Speaker 2: Yeah?

600
00:31:18,680 --> 00:31:22,760
Speaker 1: Yeah, the conflating of anti Semitism and criticism of the

601
00:31:22,880 --> 00:31:26,480
Speaker 1: Israeli state is where a lot of these extremists are thriving.

602
00:31:27,000 --> 00:31:29,719
Speaker 1: And then on the side of Islamophobia, as Miles mentioned,

603
00:31:30,040 --> 00:31:32,680
Speaker 1: your your organization found a four hundred and twenty two

604
00:31:32,720 --> 00:31:35,160
Speaker 1: percent rise in the use of anti Muslim language on

605
00:31:35,760 --> 00:31:39,040
Speaker 1: Twitter since the start of the conflict. But it's like

606
00:31:39,160 --> 00:31:42,000
Speaker 1: it feels a little bit different there because so much

607
00:31:42,080 --> 00:31:45,920
Speaker 1: of the US government and like mainstream media's official default position,

608
00:31:46,800 --> 00:31:50,800
Speaker 1: like since two thousand and one, has had a lot

609
00:31:50,840 --> 00:31:52,960
Speaker 1: of Islamophobia baked into it.

610
00:31:53,640 --> 00:31:54,720
Speaker 2: So, like, how are you.

611
00:31:54,800 --> 00:32:00,640
Speaker 1: Guys, It seems like that this is metastasizing, Homophobia is

612
00:32:00,680 --> 00:32:06,040
Speaker 1: metastasizing in real time as this conflict is happening. How

613
00:32:06,120 --> 00:32:09,320
Speaker 1: do you see how do you kind of track that

614
00:32:09,680 --> 00:32:13,560
Speaker 1: and how are you seeing it change currently? Yeah?

615
00:32:13,800 --> 00:32:17,920
Speaker 3: So the numbers are you know, an analysis of data

616
00:32:18,080 --> 00:32:21,920
Speaker 3: that we're pulling off platforms using you know, both third

617
00:32:21,960 --> 00:32:25,120
Speaker 3: party tools tools. We have methodologies we have in house

618
00:32:25,200 --> 00:32:27,480
Speaker 3: to do this kind of stuff. But when it comes

619
00:32:27,520 --> 00:32:30,120
Speaker 3: to I think what you're speaking to Jack is like

620
00:32:30,200 --> 00:32:34,360
Speaker 3: the mainstreaming effect of this stuff, and that's a lot

621
00:32:34,440 --> 00:32:37,840
Speaker 3: harder to track. We are like actively at the drawing

622
00:32:37,960 --> 00:32:42,000
Speaker 3: board on that, like how can you quantify or like

623
00:32:42,520 --> 00:32:49,280
Speaker 3: illustrate in an unobjectable way or undisputable way a mainstreaming effect.

624
00:32:49,720 --> 00:32:53,480
Speaker 3: So that's kind of a work in progress. But I

625
00:32:53,560 --> 00:32:56,160
Speaker 3: will say generally, to see this kind of stuff also

626
00:32:56,400 --> 00:33:02,280
Speaker 3: reflected in institutions and individuals that should know better and

627
00:33:02,440 --> 00:33:05,200
Speaker 3: have a lot of power and sway in society is

628
00:33:06,240 --> 00:33:07,360
Speaker 3: totally disappointing.

629
00:33:07,680 --> 00:33:08,640
Speaker 1: And a lot of.

630
00:33:08,680 --> 00:33:12,440
Speaker 3: Research shows that when people in those positions of authority

631
00:33:13,000 --> 00:33:17,040
Speaker 3: in a society make positive statements, you know, condemning this

632
00:33:17,200 --> 00:33:21,000
Speaker 3: sort of thing, discouraging people from engaging in violence and

633
00:33:21,080 --> 00:33:23,720
Speaker 3: that sort of stuff, it actually does have an effect

634
00:33:23,800 --> 00:33:28,400
Speaker 3: on people. Yeah, so it's to me when I see

635
00:33:28,480 --> 00:33:30,360
Speaker 3: that kind of stuff reflected, I just think it's like

636
00:33:30,480 --> 00:33:35,840
Speaker 3: a forfeiting of a certain moral responsibility than as a

637
00:33:35,960 --> 00:33:40,480
Speaker 3: leader in a society I think you should be compelled to, right.

638
00:33:41,040 --> 00:33:44,120
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, we're seeing people resigning from The New York

639
00:33:44,160 --> 00:33:48,760
Speaker 1: Times for expressing opposition to the killing of innocent Palestinian people.

640
00:33:49,480 --> 00:33:55,880
Speaker 1: So yeah, it's a crazy time. Your organization recently released

641
00:33:55,880 --> 00:34:00,840
Speaker 1: a report about white supremacy three point zero, which got

642
00:34:00,920 --> 00:34:03,360
Speaker 1: me excited because I thought there might be some crypto

643
00:34:03,440 --> 00:34:07,440
Speaker 1: that I could purchase involved with this because web three

644
00:34:07,480 --> 00:34:09,840
Speaker 1: point oh, you know, you got to strike while the

645
00:34:09,880 --> 00:34:12,359
Speaker 1: iron's hot, these prices are low, you got to buy

646
00:34:12,480 --> 00:34:12,799
Speaker 1: the dip.

647
00:34:13,320 --> 00:34:16,080
Speaker 3: You know, you lost so many you know, you lost

648
00:34:16,120 --> 00:34:18,560
Speaker 3: so much money on the apes. You know, you gotta

649
00:34:18,600 --> 00:34:20,239
Speaker 3: find you got to figure out how to make that bad.

650
00:34:20,280 --> 00:34:23,000
Speaker 2: I told him, I said, there's some racist imagery in

651
00:34:23,080 --> 00:34:24,560
Speaker 2: that ship to Jack, I don't know, I.

652
00:34:24,560 --> 00:34:28,320
Speaker 1: Said, I'm blind right now, So how many wen?

653
00:34:28,320 --> 00:34:30,799
Speaker 2: I don't know what design, bro, But yeah, I mean

654
00:34:30,880 --> 00:34:33,960
Speaker 2: like this is it is wild because yeah, like seeing

655
00:34:34,000 --> 00:34:37,440
Speaker 2: this idea of white supremacy, white nationalism three point oh

656
00:34:38,320 --> 00:34:40,239
Speaker 2: like was like, okay, wait, so we're doing we're talking

657
00:34:40,239 --> 00:34:43,399
Speaker 2: about third wave racism basically, so one point oh being

658
00:34:43,480 --> 00:34:46,719
Speaker 2: what like skinheads like that era, which was that what

659
00:34:46,840 --> 00:34:47,759
Speaker 2: we call one point zero.

660
00:34:48,080 --> 00:34:52,280
Speaker 3: So one is yeah, kind of the old school before

661
00:34:52,480 --> 00:34:56,640
Speaker 3: people started doing point ohs, right, yeah, yeah, beta uh

662
00:34:57,280 --> 00:34:59,920
Speaker 3: you know the one point oh or I guess like

663
00:35:00,520 --> 00:35:02,120
Speaker 3: like all right, one point oh that would be like

664
00:35:02,239 --> 00:35:07,120
Speaker 3: the counter Currents blog Vdair Richard Spencer's of the World,

665
00:35:07,600 --> 00:35:10,080
Speaker 3: because that was like, you know, these kind of like

666
00:35:10,160 --> 00:35:13,400
Speaker 3: older folks, a lot of them were writers and whatnot.

667
00:35:13,640 --> 00:35:16,800
Speaker 3: Two point zero would be you know, sort of like

668
00:35:16,920 --> 00:35:19,040
Speaker 3: Charlottesville and what happened after that, and a lot of

669
00:35:19,080 --> 00:35:21,719
Speaker 3: one point oh types were like part of the two

670
00:35:21,760 --> 00:35:24,600
Speaker 3: point zero. It's not like these are completely distinct groups

671
00:35:24,719 --> 00:35:28,399
Speaker 3: or movements or whatever. And then like a three point

672
00:35:28,400 --> 00:35:32,560
Speaker 3: oh now is you know, kind of its own mess.

673
00:35:32,800 --> 00:35:35,200
Speaker 3: I think it maybe makes sense to think of it

674
00:35:35,360 --> 00:35:37,960
Speaker 3: less in terms of like generations and maybe more in

675
00:35:38,120 --> 00:35:42,360
Speaker 3: terms of tactics, right right, Like the version one was

676
00:35:42,400 --> 00:35:46,320
Speaker 3: all about like propaganda, you know, small groups on local levels.

677
00:35:46,360 --> 00:35:49,240
Speaker 3: Whatever two point oh was, you know, that big attempt

678
00:35:49,280 --> 00:35:52,920
Speaker 3: to go mainstream, really soaking in the Internet using that

679
00:35:53,080 --> 00:35:56,760
Speaker 3: to full advantage. And this three point zero is almost

680
00:35:56,800 --> 00:35:58,600
Speaker 3: like a little bit of return to form, going back

681
00:35:58,640 --> 00:36:01,400
Speaker 3: to that local model, but with like a whole host

682
00:36:01,520 --> 00:36:04,880
Speaker 3: of baggage that came from like the years before.

683
00:36:05,120 --> 00:36:08,239
Speaker 2: Right, because like even the term right is coming from

684
00:36:08,320 --> 00:36:11,799
Speaker 2: their movement. It's not something you guys like, point yeah,

685
00:36:11,840 --> 00:36:14,440
Speaker 2: it's not like we came up. It's like for their

686
00:36:14,480 --> 00:36:18,359
Speaker 2: own internal purposes, like we need a white nationalism three

687
00:36:18,440 --> 00:36:20,360
Speaker 2: point zero for lack of a better word, and like

688
00:36:20,440 --> 00:36:22,080
Speaker 2: for them, the aim is sort of to be able

689
00:36:22,160 --> 00:36:27,480
Speaker 2: to make this their their ideology basically palatable to normal people.

690
00:36:27,760 --> 00:36:29,400
Speaker 2: Is like kind of like a huge part of this

691
00:36:29,600 --> 00:36:30,839
Speaker 2: three point oh push right.

692
00:36:31,360 --> 00:36:33,200
Speaker 3: Yeah yeah, and you know you would think that, but

693
00:36:33,400 --> 00:36:35,880
Speaker 3: actually it's you know, our it guy called us and

694
00:36:36,080 --> 00:36:38,120
Speaker 3: was like, hey, we've we've got the leadst update for

695
00:36:38,360 --> 00:36:40,920
Speaker 3: white nationalism. We have to refresh your computer.

696
00:36:41,239 --> 00:36:42,160
Speaker 1: Yeah, point h.

697
00:36:42,320 --> 00:36:44,840
Speaker 2: So I need you to sign on to team Viewer

698
00:36:45,000 --> 00:36:47,480
Speaker 2: now or zend us. I'm gonna walk in through. Is

699
00:36:47,520 --> 00:36:49,960
Speaker 2: this a scam? No, But like yeah, like it feels

700
00:36:50,040 --> 00:36:52,360
Speaker 2: like like to your point, like the tactic now is

701
00:36:52,440 --> 00:36:54,839
Speaker 2: like okay, maybe that didn't work. What we really need

702
00:36:55,000 --> 00:36:56,360
Speaker 2: is to be able to just kind of blend in

703
00:36:56,600 --> 00:37:00,440
Speaker 2: and seem normal, so this becomes an acceptable kind of

704
00:37:00,640 --> 00:37:04,839
Speaker 2: ideology to subscribe to. And they have very like their

705
00:37:04,880 --> 00:37:07,239
Speaker 2: tactics are different now too, even for recruiting right.

706
00:37:07,760 --> 00:37:12,279
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, I mean so the report we're talking about

707
00:37:12,400 --> 00:37:14,399
Speaker 3: is about something called active clubs, which we can talk

708
00:37:14,400 --> 00:37:16,680
Speaker 3: about in a second, but more generally in the white

709
00:37:16,680 --> 00:37:21,520
Speaker 3: supremacist movement and just far right movements overall, they've kind

710
00:37:21,520 --> 00:37:27,360
Speaker 3: of realized something that the evangelical right has known for decades,

711
00:37:27,680 --> 00:37:33,160
Speaker 3: that like any effective organizing in the last few decades,

712
00:37:33,200 --> 00:37:37,280
Speaker 3: has understood very acutely, which is that winning a national

713
00:37:37,400 --> 00:37:41,160
Speaker 3: office is hard. Running a candidate for president is hard.

714
00:37:41,360 --> 00:37:46,960
Speaker 3: You know, even state government positions can be tricky, but

715
00:37:47,080 --> 00:37:51,440
Speaker 3: school boards, city council, you know, like trying to get

716
00:37:51,480 --> 00:37:53,880
Speaker 3: a sheriff him, right, Like a lot of these are

717
00:37:53,960 --> 00:37:57,360
Speaker 3: local elections that are won by you know in a

718
00:37:57,440 --> 00:38:00,160
Speaker 3: lot of places. You know, maybe not a Chicago go

719
00:38:00,480 --> 00:38:02,520
Speaker 3: or in LA or whatever, but like a lot of

720
00:38:02,560 --> 00:38:05,560
Speaker 3: places in the US can be one with like a

721
00:38:05,640 --> 00:38:09,520
Speaker 3: matter of a few hundred votes, right, So there's more

722
00:38:09,640 --> 00:38:13,399
Speaker 3: opportunities to take power there. And then you know, by

723
00:38:13,880 --> 00:38:19,400
Speaker 3: harassing these low level governments and threatening people showing up

724
00:38:19,440 --> 00:38:21,759
Speaker 3: at all these meetings, you know, going nuts, creating a

725
00:38:21,840 --> 00:38:24,560
Speaker 3: hostile environment. A lot of these folks that ran for

726
00:38:24,640 --> 00:38:27,400
Speaker 3: these local offices didn't sign up for that shit. They

727
00:38:27,440 --> 00:38:31,440
Speaker 3: don't have resources to like be safe when that shit's happening, Right,

728
00:38:31,960 --> 00:38:34,000
Speaker 3: So a lot of them resign, Like a lot of

729
00:38:34,080 --> 00:38:38,040
Speaker 3: election officials on the county level have resigned, you know,

730
00:38:38,080 --> 00:38:39,080
Speaker 3: over the last few years.

731
00:38:39,239 --> 00:38:41,359
Speaker 2: I just saw a report about that recently, about how

732
00:38:41,600 --> 00:38:44,120
Speaker 2: there's a lot of election officials that are resigning. People like,

733
00:38:44,200 --> 00:38:46,920
Speaker 2: buckle up for twenty four then, because this is exactly

734
00:38:47,000 --> 00:38:49,399
Speaker 2: the kind of situation like extremists want.

735
00:38:50,000 --> 00:38:52,759
Speaker 3: Yeah, because there's a big opening, right, and if these

736
00:38:52,800 --> 00:38:55,440
Speaker 3: offices are easier to win, if it's easier to get

737
00:38:55,480 --> 00:38:58,960
Speaker 3: their policies through, like their dream vote policies, or at

738
00:38:58,960 --> 00:39:02,600
Speaker 3: the very least smacking on policies they don't like, you

739
00:39:02,680 --> 00:39:08,440
Speaker 3: know that, if that happens at scale, then the idea

740
00:39:08,480 --> 00:39:13,759
Speaker 3: of national candidates of you know, big organizations starts to

741
00:39:13,800 --> 00:39:14,720
Speaker 3: become more feasible.

742
00:39:14,880 --> 00:39:15,000
Speaker 4: Right.

743
00:39:15,080 --> 00:39:19,680
Speaker 3: It's like the most time tested way to gain political power,

744
00:39:19,760 --> 00:39:22,560
Speaker 3: which is start at the bottom and work your way up.

745
00:39:23,480 --> 00:39:26,600
Speaker 1: Right, All right, let's take a quick break and we'll

746
00:39:26,640 --> 00:39:30,359
Speaker 1: come back. We'll keep talking about this strategy and we'll

747
00:39:30,400 --> 00:39:31,720
Speaker 1: get into active clubs.

748
00:39:32,040 --> 00:39:44,560
Speaker 2: We'll be right back, and we're back.

749
00:39:45,160 --> 00:39:48,080
Speaker 1: And so a lot of what we're talking about is

750
00:39:48,200 --> 00:39:52,400
Speaker 1: like this opportunism to try and like show up at

751
00:39:52,480 --> 00:39:57,040
Speaker 1: these flashpoint media events and where they think cameras will

752
00:39:57,080 --> 00:40:00,960
Speaker 1: be to you know, make themselves a peer. Are more numerous.

753
00:40:01,120 --> 00:40:04,120
Speaker 1: Like we've talked before about what's.

754
00:40:03,880 --> 00:40:08,920
Speaker 4: The mother's group Mothers for Liberty, Yeah, Moms for Liberty

755
00:40:09,000 --> 00:40:13,040
Speaker 4: that like oftentimes you know, they're they're not very numerous,

756
00:40:13,120 --> 00:40:16,480
Speaker 4: but they show up at other people's school board meetings,

757
00:40:16,719 --> 00:40:20,000
Speaker 4: and that that happens at a lot of these like

758
00:40:20,080 --> 00:40:23,560
Speaker 4: people are showing up at protests who don't have kids

759
00:40:23,640 --> 00:40:24,400
Speaker 4: going to that school.

760
00:40:24,440 --> 00:40:26,080
Speaker 2: Yeah, but they don't even live in the county.

761
00:40:26,520 --> 00:40:30,400
Speaker 1: Yeah, but they're spreading that ideology around to make it

762
00:40:30,480 --> 00:40:34,439
Speaker 1: to make it seem like it's more common, right, Yeah.

763
00:40:34,560 --> 00:40:37,320
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean part of the calculation there is that

764
00:40:37,400 --> 00:40:40,560
Speaker 3: they think maybe a'll inspire someone else to do this too,

765
00:40:40,960 --> 00:40:41,439
Speaker 3: right yeah.

766
00:40:41,560 --> 00:40:41,759
Speaker 1: Yeah.

767
00:40:41,880 --> 00:40:45,360
Speaker 3: And then a lot of it is just like bolstering

768
00:40:45,719 --> 00:40:49,240
Speaker 3: influence because it's it's about creating like a certain perception,

769
00:40:49,480 --> 00:40:53,839
Speaker 3: right because if you're maybe less so on like neo

770
00:40:53,920 --> 00:40:56,680
Speaker 3: Nazi groups for example, but like if you're a Mom's

771
00:40:56,719 --> 00:40:58,759
Speaker 3: for Liberty, you can maybe get the ear of a

772
00:40:58,800 --> 00:40:59,960
Speaker 3: politician a little bit easy.

773
00:41:00,080 --> 00:41:00,200
Speaker 2: Here.

774
00:41:00,239 --> 00:41:02,520
Speaker 3: If it's just like Look, we're the ones that actually

775
00:41:02,600 --> 00:41:05,719
Speaker 3: show up and do stuff. Look, everyone's scared of us.

776
00:41:05,840 --> 00:41:08,680
Speaker 3: They've got you know, we got all this media coverage.

777
00:41:08,880 --> 00:41:11,279
Speaker 3: We'll look at all these clips of whatever, like we

778
00:41:11,360 --> 00:41:13,560
Speaker 3: could we we can do that for you, but we

779
00:41:13,719 --> 00:41:18,719
Speaker 3: need some you know, classic political power broken, right. But

780
00:41:19,160 --> 00:41:25,280
Speaker 3: creating sort of this larger than life perception is extremely

781
00:41:25,360 --> 00:41:28,040
Speaker 3: common on the phone, right, because if you look at

782
00:41:28,120 --> 00:41:32,400
Speaker 3: polling on what they actually believe, it's not popular. Like,

783
00:41:33,360 --> 00:41:36,279
Speaker 3: so you have to like create the perception that you

784
00:41:36,400 --> 00:41:42,120
Speaker 3: are more acceptable than you are generally and then use

785
00:41:42,200 --> 00:41:44,440
Speaker 3: that to try to leverage your way to like get

786
00:41:44,440 --> 00:41:46,640
Speaker 3: into more rooms or have more of a lane to

787
00:41:46,719 --> 00:41:48,200
Speaker 3: run in politically.

788
00:41:48,120 --> 00:41:50,600
Speaker 2: Right, which is kind of like bittersweet because on one hand,

789
00:41:50,640 --> 00:41:53,120
Speaker 2: like I remember, like locally right in Glendale, there was

790
00:41:53,840 --> 00:41:56,880
Speaker 2: huge clashes with people who were merely just trying to

791
00:41:56,920 --> 00:42:00,840
Speaker 2: be like, uh, let's not criminalize like curriculum that acknowledges

792
00:42:00,880 --> 00:42:04,839
Speaker 2: like LGBTQ people, And you had all these like extremists

793
00:42:04,880 --> 00:42:07,520
Speaker 2: out there with their like protect our kids nonsense. But

794
00:42:07,600 --> 00:42:09,920
Speaker 2: a lot of people who like locally monitor like the

795
00:42:09,960 --> 00:42:13,080
Speaker 2: extremists right here, like it's the same like seven to

796
00:42:13,280 --> 00:42:17,799
Speaker 2: twelve people who just change shirts, show up at another thing,

797
00:42:17,880 --> 00:42:20,320
Speaker 2: and scare the shit out of people because they're like, damn, like,

798
00:42:20,400 --> 00:42:21,840
Speaker 2: there's a group for this, there's a group for this.

799
00:42:21,960 --> 00:42:23,239
Speaker 2: But a lot of it, to your point, is just

800
00:42:23,320 --> 00:42:26,400
Speaker 2: to sort of project this sort of like idea that

801
00:42:26,520 --> 00:42:30,200
Speaker 2: it's like they're there's they are numerous, and they are legion,

802
00:42:30,320 --> 00:42:32,719
Speaker 2: they're everywhere. Yeah yeah, yeah, that like to the and

803
00:42:32,800 --> 00:42:35,120
Speaker 2: that like which is frightening because you think, like, holy shit,

804
00:42:35,200 --> 00:42:36,800
Speaker 2: even where I live. But on the other side, just

805
00:42:37,000 --> 00:42:39,000
Speaker 2: make it bitter speed. You're like, Okay, this is a

806
00:42:39,200 --> 00:42:42,160
Speaker 2: tactic obviously, because that is it's all about the perception,

807
00:42:42,239 --> 00:42:45,240
Speaker 2: because perception is reality, and if they have they're perceived

808
00:42:45,320 --> 00:42:47,239
Speaker 2: to be this like larger than life group, then maybe

809
00:42:47,280 --> 00:42:48,960
Speaker 2: the reactions that they're going to get from people. I

810
00:42:49,000 --> 00:42:50,080
Speaker 2: was like, I don't know, I don't know if I

811
00:42:50,080 --> 00:42:52,080
Speaker 2: could fucking fuck with this or step to this kind

812
00:42:52,080 --> 00:42:52,640
Speaker 2: of kind of shit.

813
00:42:53,160 --> 00:42:55,000
Speaker 3: Yeah yeah, And I also just want to like say

814
00:42:55,000 --> 00:42:57,719
Speaker 3: all that with the caveat that like one person can

815
00:42:57,800 --> 00:43:01,640
Speaker 3: be dangerous. Yeah yeah, like even if these people aren't

816
00:43:01,800 --> 00:43:05,879
Speaker 3: actually like under the sewer grades like ready to jump

817
00:43:06,000 --> 00:43:07,960
Speaker 3: up and snatch you off the street or whatever, like

818
00:43:08,080 --> 00:43:12,320
Speaker 3: it's these groups can still cause a lot of harm, right, Like,

819
00:43:12,760 --> 00:43:15,359
Speaker 3: especially violence committed in the name of hate or whatever.

820
00:43:15,440 --> 00:43:21,080
Speaker 3: It can really really impact communities and like very profound ways. Right,

821
00:43:21,600 --> 00:43:23,640
Speaker 3: So I don't want to like say any of that

822
00:43:23,920 --> 00:43:27,520
Speaker 3: to minimize the risk or threat here, right, But like

823
00:43:27,680 --> 00:43:30,160
Speaker 3: it also is important if we think about like what

824
00:43:30,360 --> 00:43:33,960
Speaker 3: to do about it, to realize that like the source

825
00:43:34,000 --> 00:43:37,879
Speaker 3: of these problems that might seem really big, Like you said,

826
00:43:37,880 --> 00:43:39,480
Speaker 3: it's the same twelve guys.

827
00:43:39,480 --> 00:43:43,000
Speaker 1: Right, right, So just taking a soft topic for a second, wait,

828
00:43:43,440 --> 00:43:46,799
Speaker 1: like what they believe is not popular. But then when

829
00:43:46,800 --> 00:43:49,200
Speaker 1: you look at the polls for the and obviously we

830
00:43:49,280 --> 00:43:52,000
Speaker 1: don't like put a ton of stock into poles, but

831
00:43:52,080 --> 00:43:55,839
Speaker 1: the polls for the twenty twenty four presidential election would

832
00:43:55,880 --> 00:44:02,960
Speaker 1: have Trump like winning again, I guess partially because Biden.

833
00:44:02,680 --> 00:44:03,839
Speaker 2: Is so unpopular.

834
00:44:04,000 --> 00:44:08,560
Speaker 1: But like, how do you square these small numbers of

835
00:44:08,680 --> 00:44:13,440
Speaker 1: people who are thinking very strategically but like using you know,

836
00:44:13,520 --> 00:44:16,080
Speaker 1: basically smoke and mirrors to make themselves seem more popular,

837
00:44:16,200 --> 00:44:19,840
Speaker 1: more mainstream to people who are willing to vote for

838
00:44:20,280 --> 00:44:23,360
Speaker 1: Trump at this point when he has gone like fully

839
00:44:23,920 --> 00:44:26,600
Speaker 1: down the rabbit hole of being you know, just buying

840
00:44:26,680 --> 00:44:30,920
Speaker 1: into his own conspiracies and steering into the death cults

841
00:44:31,040 --> 00:44:35,560
Speaker 1: that wants him as its sort of messiah figure. Yeah.

842
00:44:35,719 --> 00:44:38,800
Speaker 3: I mean the way I think about it is, and

843
00:44:38,880 --> 00:44:41,440
Speaker 3: I have to remind myself this all the time, which

844
00:44:41,520 --> 00:44:49,000
Speaker 3: is that like not everybody is like terminally addicted to news,

845
00:44:49,520 --> 00:44:53,880
Speaker 3: like sure right, Like like the same way that I, like, know,

846
00:44:54,560 --> 00:44:58,520
Speaker 3: Jack shit about movies and Hollywood. It's like what a

847
00:44:58,600 --> 00:45:02,560
Speaker 3: lot of people are towards politics where they're just like, oh, yeah,

848
00:45:02,600 --> 00:45:04,640
Speaker 3: who's Like you can put like Lindsey Graham on the

849
00:45:04,640 --> 00:45:08,600
Speaker 3: screen and people will be like, yeah, he's like a politician.

850
00:45:08,160 --> 00:45:11,080
Speaker 2: Right, John Lithgow, you know, so yeah, yeah, yeah.

851
00:45:11,360 --> 00:45:13,840
Speaker 3: So I think that, you know, kind of the stories

852
00:45:13,920 --> 00:45:16,600
Speaker 3: that the campaign tells is going to be a lot

853
00:45:16,640 --> 00:45:18,400
Speaker 3: more important sort of the vibe they generate.

854
00:45:18,800 --> 00:45:21,880
Speaker 2: And you know, I heard this like.

855
00:45:21,960 --> 00:45:25,960
Speaker 3: Political polster consultant guy, I forget his name, but he

856
00:45:26,080 --> 00:45:29,359
Speaker 3: said something that sort of stuck with me a while ago,

857
00:45:29,400 --> 00:45:32,640
Speaker 3: which is that like a lot of times, presidential elections

858
00:45:32,680 --> 00:45:35,879
Speaker 3: are just reflections on who's currently in office. If people

859
00:45:35,920 --> 00:45:40,000
Speaker 3: are unhappy with like Biden, that's you know, just as

860
00:45:40,200 --> 00:45:42,880
Speaker 3: likely to push someone to vote for Trump rather than

861
00:45:43,360 --> 00:45:46,640
Speaker 3: you know, versus like a really deep committed thing where

862
00:45:46,640 --> 00:45:48,400
Speaker 3: he's like, oh, you know, Trump said he won all

863
00:45:48,440 --> 00:45:50,680
Speaker 3: fifty states, and you know what, I think that's true,

864
00:45:50,719 --> 00:45:52,560
Speaker 3: and that's why I'm going to vote for Trump. You know,

865
00:45:52,880 --> 00:45:55,840
Speaker 3: I think it's I think a lot of people just

866
00:45:55,960 --> 00:46:00,080
Speaker 3: don't get that deep into it, which is kind of know.

867
00:46:00,320 --> 00:46:02,520
Speaker 3: I'm not saying everybody has to get as deep as meat. God, no,

868
00:46:02,680 --> 00:46:05,440
Speaker 3: please don't, but like, you know, I do wish there

869
00:46:05,520 --> 00:46:08,719
Speaker 3: was maybe like a little bit better political. It's not

870
00:46:08,800 --> 00:46:12,160
Speaker 3: political civics, like just just more engaged civics in the US.

871
00:46:12,239 --> 00:46:14,240
Speaker 1: You know, there's more of us than them.

872
00:46:14,680 --> 00:46:17,279
Speaker 2: Right and yeah, and like to this point, it's people

873
00:46:17,320 --> 00:46:19,120
Speaker 2: are like, oh, I mean, I don't know, I don't

874
00:46:19,160 --> 00:46:21,440
Speaker 2: know what half of these policies are. I just like that,

875
00:46:21,560 --> 00:46:24,000
Speaker 2: I don't know. I just like Trump more like I

876
00:46:24,120 --> 00:46:27,840
Speaker 2: couldn't tell you what systemic oppression looks like. And so

877
00:46:27,960 --> 00:46:30,560
Speaker 2: I'm not necessarily like explicitly signing up for that. I

878
00:46:30,680 --> 00:46:33,360
Speaker 2: just I just don't care. But also I like the

879
00:46:33,480 --> 00:46:36,680
Speaker 2: vibe here I think is yeah, definitely one way people

880
00:46:36,760 --> 00:46:41,040
Speaker 2: are voting, Like I guess in terms of like recruiting now,

881
00:46:41,160 --> 00:46:43,720
Speaker 2: because like obviously, on its face, some of like obviously

882
00:46:44,000 --> 00:46:47,000
Speaker 2: a lot of most, if not all, of their ideologies

883
00:46:47,040 --> 00:46:50,919
Speaker 2: like repugnant to most like normal people. What's like now

884
00:46:51,080 --> 00:46:53,960
Speaker 2: the way they're like, okay, shit, it didn't work when

885
00:46:54,000 --> 00:46:57,960
Speaker 2: we're wearing like Nazi uniforms in public. What is the

886
00:46:58,800 --> 00:47:00,960
Speaker 2: How can we bring more people into this in a

887
00:47:01,040 --> 00:47:03,520
Speaker 2: way that seems more palatable? Like that's is this all

888
00:47:03,760 --> 00:47:05,440
Speaker 2: sort of like this is kind of why this active

889
00:47:05,520 --> 00:47:07,200
Speaker 2: club's movement is like on the rise.

890
00:47:08,440 --> 00:47:10,480
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean that's part of it. Like the whole

891
00:47:10,520 --> 00:47:13,520
Speaker 3: white supremacist movement isn't doing this, but they all seem

892
00:47:13,560 --> 00:47:16,560
Speaker 3: to be like kind of generally like curious or at

893
00:47:16,600 --> 00:47:19,160
Speaker 3: the very least like kind of indifferent to it. It's

894
00:47:19,280 --> 00:47:22,480
Speaker 3: long been a recruiting tactic of white supremacists to kind

895
00:47:22,480 --> 00:47:27,279
Speaker 3: of pick out like guys when usually men specifically that

896
00:47:28,440 --> 00:47:31,200
Speaker 3: you know or maybe kind of like down if that

897
00:47:31,280 --> 00:47:33,960
Speaker 3: makes sense. You know, they just their life just kind

898
00:47:34,000 --> 00:47:36,920
Speaker 3: of isn't working out and whatever, and they're looking for

899
00:47:37,040 --> 00:47:39,279
Speaker 3: something to fill it, and they say, check it out,

900
00:47:39,400 --> 00:47:40,400
Speaker 3: I got something to fill it.

901
00:47:40,960 --> 00:47:42,160
Speaker 1: It's hate.

902
00:47:43,480 --> 00:47:47,279
Speaker 3: So you know it along comes active clubs, which have

903
00:47:47,600 --> 00:47:49,800
Speaker 3: been around for a little bit but really really seem

904
00:47:49,920 --> 00:47:53,680
Speaker 3: to have taken off in the last year, and active clubs.

905
00:47:54,120 --> 00:47:56,440
Speaker 3: Part of it sounds fine, right, You meet up with

906
00:47:56,520 --> 00:47:59,839
Speaker 3: your bros, you work out your you know, form these

907
00:48:00,040 --> 00:48:05,360
Speaker 3: strong male friendships and bonds. Sounds cool, right, that's so fast,

908
00:48:07,600 --> 00:48:11,080
Speaker 3: you know, And essentially, like all these guys get together,

909
00:48:11,360 --> 00:48:14,680
Speaker 3: they get that sense of camaraderie, they get you know,

910
00:48:14,800 --> 00:48:18,120
Speaker 3: some level of self improvement, and then they are just

911
00:48:18,880 --> 00:48:24,239
Speaker 3: bludgeoned and like indoctrinated and also with very intense white

912
00:48:24,239 --> 00:48:30,400
Speaker 3: supremacists or you know, just outright fascistic philosophy and an outlook.

913
00:48:30,640 --> 00:48:35,440
Speaker 3: And some of these groups have felt emboldened by that,

914
00:48:35,760 --> 00:48:37,440
Speaker 3: you know, gotten to a point where they're feeling kind

915
00:48:37,440 --> 00:48:40,520
Speaker 3: of feeling themselves and they're going out and getting involved

916
00:48:40,719 --> 00:48:43,240
Speaker 3: in you know, there was a may or all election

917
00:48:43,400 --> 00:48:45,759
Speaker 3: in Tennessee where one of the Active clubs got like

918
00:48:45,880 --> 00:48:50,280
Speaker 3: really plugged into it. A lot of them are showing

919
00:48:50,400 --> 00:48:54,279
Speaker 3: up alongside other white supremacist groups for protests and you know,

920
00:48:54,440 --> 00:48:58,080
Speaker 3: dropping banners down the sides of highways and waving signs

921
00:48:58,120 --> 00:49:03,080
Speaker 3: around and whatnot. So you know, it's it's really kind

922
00:49:03,080 --> 00:49:07,279
Speaker 3: of taken off in the last year, and it's it's

923
00:49:07,480 --> 00:49:12,640
Speaker 3: very It's like some of the Nazis are getting buffed now, right, right,

924
00:49:13,200 --> 00:49:15,680
Speaker 3: So I remember a simplistic way to put it, but.

925
00:49:15,800 --> 00:49:17,640
Speaker 1: Yeah, I remember there was like a group in Orange

926
00:49:17,680 --> 00:49:21,560
Speaker 1: County that were just like these brawler like neo Nazi dudes,

927
00:49:21,600 --> 00:49:23,080
Speaker 1: and that was like, I think the first time I

928
00:49:23,200 --> 00:49:25,080
Speaker 1: had seen it sort of framed as like, no, these

929
00:49:25,120 --> 00:49:28,440
Speaker 1: guys that get together to like box and do like

930
00:49:28,600 --> 00:49:31,640
Speaker 1: jiu jitsu and shit, just so they can go out

931
00:49:31,680 --> 00:49:34,279
Speaker 1: into the streets and just you know, attack people, but

932
00:49:34,440 --> 00:49:37,640
Speaker 1: like using like those skills that they're cultivating as this

933
00:49:37,840 --> 00:49:42,840
Speaker 1: group to explicitly deploy against people like the LGBTQ community

934
00:49:43,440 --> 00:49:46,680
Speaker 1: or like against Jewish people or whatever their their targeted

935
00:49:46,800 --> 00:49:47,279
Speaker 1: group is.

936
00:49:47,520 --> 00:49:50,520
Speaker 2: And yeah, like it's now like it's to the point

937
00:49:50,520 --> 00:49:53,080
Speaker 2: where it seems like from the report that came out

938
00:49:53,160 --> 00:49:57,120
Speaker 2: from ISD, it's like it's really blowing up in the Pacific, Northwest,

939
00:49:57,160 --> 00:49:58,719
Speaker 2: New England, in the southeast now.

940
00:49:59,440 --> 00:50:01,880
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, and they are trying to get it to

941
00:50:02,400 --> 00:50:06,440
Speaker 3: replicate everywhere else too, but it's it's really caught on

942
00:50:06,560 --> 00:50:09,320
Speaker 3: in those areas. A lot of those areas have you know,

943
00:50:09,440 --> 00:50:13,320
Speaker 3: these sort of historical contacts with the far right. I

944
00:50:13,400 --> 00:50:15,720
Speaker 3: think maybe they have a little bit more like social

945
00:50:15,800 --> 00:50:18,960
Speaker 3: space to operate in. And you know, part of it

946
00:50:19,120 --> 00:50:21,040
Speaker 3: is also just like the people doing this, where do

947
00:50:21,120 --> 00:50:23,040
Speaker 3: they live? You know, they all right in this or

948
00:50:23,040 --> 00:50:26,160
Speaker 3: an area, but yeah, there's like a few parts of

949
00:50:26,200 --> 00:50:30,239
Speaker 3: the country where they're sort of concentrated there and then

950
00:50:30,320 --> 00:50:33,200
Speaker 3: just generally recruiting, like the active clubs do this the

951
00:50:33,280 --> 00:50:37,000
Speaker 3: same way other groups do and movements do right like,

952
00:50:37,040 --> 00:50:39,040
Speaker 3: because not everybody in the far right is in some

953
00:50:39,239 --> 00:50:41,360
Speaker 3: like group where they have a membership card and like

954
00:50:41,440 --> 00:50:44,040
Speaker 3: show up to meetings, or most of them aren't. I

955
00:50:44,080 --> 00:50:48,920
Speaker 3: would say, it's just this portrayal, not necessarily initially is

956
00:50:49,040 --> 00:50:52,120
Speaker 3: like you have to come come be a white supremacist

957
00:50:52,160 --> 00:50:54,560
Speaker 3: because white supremacy is awesome, right. A lot of it

958
00:50:54,800 --> 00:50:59,360
Speaker 3: has to do with you know, othering and then projecting

959
00:50:59,560 --> 00:51:04,720
Speaker 3: hate grievances onto out groups, which are often minority groups

960
00:51:04,760 --> 00:51:08,360
Speaker 3: in these cases. So it's you know, essentially the argument

961
00:51:08,440 --> 00:51:11,880
Speaker 3: is like the world is just so fucked up that.

962
00:51:13,360 --> 00:51:14,160
Speaker 1: What are you gonna do.

963
00:51:14,440 --> 00:51:16,800
Speaker 3: If you go along with this, you're gonna get destroyed.

964
00:51:17,320 --> 00:51:19,359
Speaker 3: Come with us, We'll help you out, you know, we'll

965
00:51:19,719 --> 00:51:22,000
Speaker 3: we're gonna fight back against this, and we're gonna do

966
00:51:22,239 --> 00:51:28,399
Speaker 3: you know, counteract this modern grievance that we have. And yeah,

967
00:51:28,480 --> 00:51:31,359
Speaker 3: I mean that that's used in these groups, that's used

968
00:51:31,400 --> 00:51:35,520
Speaker 3: sort of across the extremist spectrum generally to get people

969
00:51:35,600 --> 00:51:39,040
Speaker 3: in the movement. It's like it's all centered on like

970
00:51:39,920 --> 00:51:43,960
Speaker 3: the like what you're opposing, rather than like a very

971
00:51:44,200 --> 00:51:46,480
Speaker 3: clear and coherent like direction forward.

972
00:51:47,320 --> 00:51:50,040
Speaker 2: Do you see this working to the extent of like

973
00:51:51,560 --> 00:51:51,959
Speaker 2: that there?

974
00:51:52,800 --> 00:51:57,040
Speaker 1: We're in danger of seeing this thing just like take

975
00:51:57,120 --> 00:52:00,880
Speaker 1: off in a second Trump presidency because I think a

976
00:52:00,920 --> 00:52:03,080
Speaker 1: lot of people are coming to terms with the fact that,

977
00:52:03,200 --> 00:52:07,440
Speaker 1: like a second Trump presidency is a real possibility. We

978
00:52:07,719 --> 00:52:12,399
Speaker 1: feel like there's going to be more shamelessness, like more

979
00:52:12,680 --> 00:52:16,640
Speaker 1: just open aggression on his behalf and on behalf of

980
00:52:16,760 --> 00:52:19,480
Speaker 1: his administration. But do you do you like, how do

981
00:52:19,560 --> 00:52:24,440
Speaker 1: you see like these these things interacting with you know

982
00:52:24,719 --> 00:52:26,120
Speaker 1: that that possibility.

983
00:52:27,480 --> 00:52:31,200
Speaker 3: I mean, we saw extremist groups get really bold during

984
00:52:31,280 --> 00:52:33,719
Speaker 3: the first Trump administration, and I think a lot of

985
00:52:33,800 --> 00:52:35,640
Speaker 3: that had to do with things that Trump was saying

986
00:52:35,760 --> 00:52:39,160
Speaker 3: and had to do with stuff that was happening behind

987
00:52:39,200 --> 00:52:42,600
Speaker 3: the scenes, like you know, defunding task forces, looking at

988
00:52:42,680 --> 00:52:46,640
Speaker 3: domestic extremism and that sort of thing that essentially gave

989
00:52:47,040 --> 00:52:50,640
Speaker 3: like a longer leash to these folks. They were kind

990
00:52:50,640 --> 00:52:53,960
Speaker 3: of feeling themselves thinking, you know, okay, we're really getting somewhere.

991
00:52:54,239 --> 00:52:58,480
Speaker 3: We you know, have a popular political movement on our side.

992
00:52:58,560 --> 00:53:01,640
Speaker 3: Here we go some extremists, like some of the more

993
00:53:01,719 --> 00:53:05,320
Speaker 3: like really really hardcore ones are not huge on Trump

994
00:53:05,480 --> 00:53:08,520
Speaker 3: but kind of still dig a little bit what he represents.

995
00:53:09,400 --> 00:53:13,239
Speaker 3: I definitely think it's possible that, you know, a lot

996
00:53:13,280 --> 00:53:15,719
Speaker 3: of these movements just kind of go buck wild, you know,

997
00:53:15,920 --> 00:53:18,520
Speaker 3: if it's like a gloves or off the moment, right,

998
00:53:18,600 --> 00:53:21,120
Speaker 3: because if you look at the Trump campaign how it

999
00:53:21,239 --> 00:53:23,600
Speaker 3: exists now and sort of like how it looks like

1000
00:53:23,680 --> 00:53:26,200
Speaker 3: it's about to manifest ahead of next year, the whole

1001
00:53:26,280 --> 00:53:29,440
Speaker 3: theme is like you're mad at the stay of the world,

1002
00:53:29,560 --> 00:53:33,359
Speaker 3: Well I'm your retribution, right, Like come with me, come

1003
00:53:33,440 --> 00:53:35,520
Speaker 3: on the journey that I'm on, and then this is

1004
00:53:35,600 --> 00:53:36,640
Speaker 3: how we're gonna get.

1005
00:53:36,560 --> 00:53:40,880
Speaker 2: Those motherfuckers, right, and that's I'm going up for you

1006
00:53:41,239 --> 00:53:42,279
Speaker 2: like for me, right.

1007
00:53:42,719 --> 00:53:45,479
Speaker 3: That is the same message these groups send to people

1008
00:53:45,520 --> 00:53:48,759
Speaker 3: they're trying to recruit. So I think even if it does,

1009
00:53:49,080 --> 00:53:52,200
Speaker 3: you know, will there be an active club on every block?

1010
00:53:52,400 --> 00:53:52,800
Speaker 1: Probably not?

1011
00:53:53,280 --> 00:53:57,320
Speaker 3: Right, Like things are trending away from like really tightly

1012
00:53:57,600 --> 00:54:00,640
Speaker 3: like hierarchical groups and the extremist movement at the moment,

1013
00:54:00,920 --> 00:54:04,720
Speaker 3: but the general like energy of them and the general

1014
00:54:05,080 --> 00:54:11,160
Speaker 3: like tactics and to some extent like vision or shared

1015
00:54:11,400 --> 00:54:15,080
Speaker 3: enemy that they perceive like that, I could see that

1016
00:54:15,200 --> 00:54:18,280
Speaker 3: getting really energized. So I think, you know, while active

1017
00:54:18,320 --> 00:54:21,320
Speaker 3: clubs are like an important piece of this equation, and

1018
00:54:21,360 --> 00:54:25,359
Speaker 3: they're getting bolder and showing up at you know, city

1019
00:54:25,440 --> 00:54:27,960
Speaker 3: councils and kind of getting out in the wild a

1020
00:54:28,040 --> 00:54:30,759
Speaker 3: little bit more and posing you know, specific you know,

1021
00:54:30,880 --> 00:54:34,920
Speaker 3: really immediate threats to people in the broader schemes of things.

1022
00:54:35,600 --> 00:54:38,560
Speaker 3: I think that you know, in a second Trump presidency,

1023
00:54:39,120 --> 00:54:44,239
Speaker 3: unless things just radically change overnight, we could see a

1024
00:54:44,280 --> 00:54:47,000
Speaker 3: lot of sort of the animating forces behind this stuff

1025
00:54:47,920 --> 00:54:52,920
Speaker 3: really just like scream out and burn bright, yeah, happy stuff.

1026
00:54:53,680 --> 00:54:58,160
Speaker 2: Yeah. And that's so horrifying. And I think as we

1027
00:54:58,239 --> 00:55:02,279
Speaker 2: all look towards next year and being like, oh, fuck, man, like,

1028
00:55:02,440 --> 00:55:05,080
Speaker 2: what what are we in for this time? You know,

1029
00:55:05,280 --> 00:55:09,400
Speaker 2: I know you talked about Dinesh Desuza's latest quote unquote

1030
00:55:09,800 --> 00:55:11,800
Speaker 2: whatever film you want to whatever you want to call it,

1031
00:55:11,960 --> 00:55:15,880
Speaker 2: cinematic Masterpieces, whatever. Yeah, sorry, yeah, the Criterion collection. But

1032
00:55:16,040 --> 00:55:17,520
Speaker 2: like you were saying, like about how much is like

1033
00:55:17,600 --> 00:55:19,640
Speaker 2: about vibes you know that are being put out there?

1034
00:55:19,680 --> 00:55:21,960
Speaker 2: And I feel like there's a there's probably something we

1035
00:55:22,040 --> 00:55:25,520
Speaker 2: can learn right from this Dinish to SUSA piece of

1036
00:55:26,080 --> 00:55:29,319
Speaker 2: trash work of media that's come out that is maybe

1037
00:55:29,520 --> 00:55:32,000
Speaker 2: a little bit instructive or at least can indicate sort

1038
00:55:32,040 --> 00:55:35,640
Speaker 2: of where rhetorically this like movement is headed at least

1039
00:55:35,680 --> 00:55:37,640
Speaker 2: into next year. Can you like just sort of talk

1040
00:55:37,680 --> 00:55:39,440
Speaker 2: about that. I mean, I know broadly what this thing

1041
00:55:39,520 --> 00:55:42,560
Speaker 2: was about, but unlike you, I did not actually do

1042
00:55:42,719 --> 00:55:45,160
Speaker 2: the work to subject myself to watch the whole two

1043
00:55:45,200 --> 00:55:45,680
Speaker 2: hours of it.

1044
00:55:46,200 --> 00:55:49,320
Speaker 3: This is a police state, right, yeah, yeah, yeah, to

1045
00:55:49,400 --> 00:55:52,160
Speaker 3: be clear, the work was spending twenty dollars and giving

1046
00:55:52,239 --> 00:55:56,480
Speaker 3: up two hours of yeah, precious time that the and.

1047
00:55:56,520 --> 00:55:58,719
Speaker 2: You won't get those two hours back. And I apologized,

1048
00:55:58,800 --> 00:56:00,959
Speaker 2: but yeah, yeah, yeah, but I'll make it. We're worth

1049
00:56:01,040 --> 00:56:01,759
Speaker 2: something for us.

1050
00:56:02,600 --> 00:56:05,480
Speaker 3: I'll have to explain that to my grandkids one day. Yeah, right,

1051
00:56:05,719 --> 00:56:07,680
Speaker 3: your grandpa, you spent two hours watching this book.

1052
00:56:07,960 --> 00:56:10,320
Speaker 2: I saw your credit card statements. Are you sure you

1053
00:56:10,440 --> 00:56:13,839
Speaker 2: run into like right wing stuff? No? I was monitored. Ah,

1054
00:56:14,760 --> 00:56:17,200
Speaker 2: I can't keep telling you kids this shit. But yeah,

1055
00:56:17,400 --> 00:56:19,480
Speaker 2: what is police state kind of showing us? Like, what

1056
00:56:19,600 --> 00:56:20,880
Speaker 2: what kind of glimpse is it giving us?

1057
00:56:21,760 --> 00:56:25,240
Speaker 3: So police State was put out by Zanesh This, who's

1058
00:56:25,280 --> 00:56:28,400
Speaker 3: a damn bond Gino, biggest head in the right wing

1059
00:56:28,520 --> 00:56:32,399
Speaker 3: commentary game. Literally in a literal sense. Yeah, And it's

1060
00:56:33,000 --> 00:56:35,920
Speaker 3: like the name suggests it seeks to answer the question

1061
00:56:36,680 --> 00:56:40,480
Speaker 3: is the US becoming a police state? It it answers

1062
00:56:40,520 --> 00:56:43,520
Speaker 3: the question for itself, like the first like five minutes

1063
00:56:43,520 --> 00:56:45,680
Speaker 3: of the movie where they're just like, is it becoming

1064
00:56:45,719 --> 00:56:48,120
Speaker 3: the police state? And dam Bongino is like, hell, yeah, brother,

1065
00:56:48,200 --> 00:56:50,680
Speaker 3: it sure is. And it's like okay, cool, sorry, and

1066
00:56:50,760 --> 00:56:55,200
Speaker 3: then there's another hour and fifty minutes ago. But so

1067
00:56:55,440 --> 00:56:58,320
Speaker 3: it kind of goes around talking to all these different cranks.

1068
00:56:58,640 --> 00:57:02,440
Speaker 3: Some are just like weird and personalities. Some are like

1069
00:57:02,600 --> 00:57:04,440
Speaker 3: one of them is a guy who got fired from

1070
00:57:04,440 --> 00:57:07,640
Speaker 3: the Trump White House for speaking out a conference with

1071
00:57:07,760 --> 00:57:10,000
Speaker 3: white nationalists, which like, you know, I had to be

1072
00:57:10,080 --> 00:57:12,279
Speaker 3: bad to get fired out of that Trump administration for that.

1073
00:57:13,000 --> 00:57:16,400
Speaker 3: You've got people like Julie Kelly in there who have

1074
00:57:17,040 --> 00:57:20,200
Speaker 3: made a shit ton of money and fame doing like

1075
00:57:20,320 --> 00:57:24,320
Speaker 3: January six, revisionism, and it's all kind of trying to

1076
00:57:24,480 --> 00:57:30,440
Speaker 3: put together this argument through different stories of conservative activists

1077
00:57:30,560 --> 00:57:35,320
Speaker 3: getting you know, punished by law enforcement, Trump getting investigated

1078
00:57:35,400 --> 00:57:38,920
Speaker 3: by federal law enforcement and charged with crimes, you know,

1079
00:57:39,040 --> 00:57:43,840
Speaker 3: the way that some January sixth defendants, you know, experienced

1080
00:57:43,920 --> 00:57:47,600
Speaker 3: arrests and stuff, to all say that the United States, yes,

1081
00:57:48,360 --> 00:57:53,520
Speaker 3: is becoming a police state and it's you know, Democrats

1082
00:57:53,880 --> 00:57:56,800
Speaker 3: that are doing it and Republicans are actually opposed to it,

1083
00:57:56,920 --> 00:57:59,720
Speaker 3: and Trump, oh he is, he's the biggest victim of it,

1084
00:57:59,800 --> 00:58:05,000
Speaker 3: all right, know, And it's a very American thing to

1085
00:58:05,120 --> 00:58:08,400
Speaker 3: be like scared of your government and to like, I think,

1086
00:58:08,840 --> 00:58:12,080
Speaker 3: just in your heart a little bit hate it. And

1087
00:58:13,400 --> 00:58:16,640
Speaker 3: I do think that, you know, it's the stuff that

1088
00:58:16,760 --> 00:58:19,000
Speaker 3: was said in the movie, like is stuff that's been

1089
00:58:19,080 --> 00:58:22,120
Speaker 3: said in the pro Trump movement, like ad Nausim for

1090
00:58:22,720 --> 00:58:25,400
Speaker 3: the last year and a half, at least probably the

1091
00:58:25,480 --> 00:58:28,760
Speaker 3: last two years. So it's not that like there's a

1092
00:58:28,800 --> 00:58:30,600
Speaker 3: whole lot of new stuff in this movie.

1093
00:58:30,840 --> 00:58:31,720
Speaker 2: But for the people that.

1094
00:58:32,040 --> 00:58:35,120
Speaker 3: Aren't like terminally online, I'm thinking of the people that

1095
00:58:35,280 --> 00:58:39,680
Speaker 3: actually like show up to shit in your local Republican

1096
00:58:39,760 --> 00:58:43,600
Speaker 3: party office or your like local you know remnant of

1097
00:58:43,640 --> 00:58:46,600
Speaker 3: a tea party, conservative group that has a lot of

1098
00:58:46,680 --> 00:58:50,840
Speaker 3: sway in the state elections or whatever. They watch this stuff, right,

1099
00:58:51,160 --> 00:58:54,840
Speaker 3: They're getting their talking points from this stuff. And Dinesh

1100
00:58:54,920 --> 00:58:58,200
Speaker 3: Desusa is like very close to Trump world. Dan Bongino

1101
00:58:58,320 --> 00:59:01,200
Speaker 3: is very close to Trump world. So when I was

1102
00:59:01,280 --> 00:59:04,200
Speaker 3: watching this, it wasn't necessarily that I was just like,

1103
00:59:04,360 --> 00:59:06,040
Speaker 3: oh my god, where are they getting this from?

1104
00:59:06,160 --> 00:59:06,680
Speaker 2: Right? Right, right?

1105
00:59:06,920 --> 00:59:10,560
Speaker 3: I've heard all this stuff like forever, but or it feels.

1106
00:59:10,320 --> 00:59:11,160
Speaker 2: Like forever anyway.

1107
00:59:11,920 --> 00:59:16,040
Speaker 3: But the way that it was packaged, right, I thought was,

1108
00:59:16,920 --> 00:59:18,360
Speaker 3: I hate to say it, but it was like one

1109
00:59:18,440 --> 00:59:22,760
Speaker 3: of Disus's better movies in terms of just sheer production value.

1110
00:59:23,560 --> 00:59:28,120
Speaker 3: And I do wonder, like, what if you're like a

1111
00:59:28,240 --> 00:59:31,040
Speaker 3: Republican that hasn't fully drank the kool aid, will this

1112
00:59:31,160 --> 00:59:33,480
Speaker 3: resonate with you at all? Or is this like a

1113
00:59:33,600 --> 00:59:35,840
Speaker 3: movie by cranks for cranks right.

1114
00:59:35,920 --> 00:59:38,200
Speaker 2: Right, yeah, Because it seems like at the end it's

1115
00:59:38,240 --> 00:59:41,360
Speaker 2: sort of like these people are getting in trouble with

1116
00:59:41,520 --> 00:59:45,720
Speaker 2: law enforcement for breaking laws. It's a police state. It's

1117
00:59:45,840 --> 00:59:47,640
Speaker 2: kind of like the distillation of it. But I can

1118
00:59:47,680 --> 00:59:49,960
Speaker 2: see how some people who are clearly like sort of

1119
00:59:50,360 --> 00:59:53,240
Speaker 2: on the like rhetorically, they're like, no, whatever Trump does

1120
00:59:53,320 --> 00:59:54,960
Speaker 2: is in a crime. This is actually, this is just

1121
00:59:55,160 --> 00:59:57,520
Speaker 2: they're coming for us. Because I'm in that, I have

1122
00:59:57,640 --> 00:59:59,600
Speaker 2: that worldview is that they're coming for us, and I

1123
00:59:59,600 --> 01:00:03,040
Speaker 2: feel like that probably very neatly overlaps with that, especially

1124
01:00:03,080 --> 01:00:05,240
Speaker 2: to have people who are there like no, I'm like,

1125
01:00:05,440 --> 01:00:07,920
Speaker 2: it happened to me. And that's why you the viewer

1126
01:00:08,200 --> 01:00:09,680
Speaker 2: should also be tuned into this.

1127
01:00:10,360 --> 01:00:12,400
Speaker 3: Yeah, the world is changing in ways you don't like,

1128
01:00:12,480 --> 01:00:14,480
Speaker 3: but if you do something about it, the police are

1129
01:00:14,520 --> 01:00:16,440
Speaker 3: going to come for you. And the only way to

1130
01:00:16,480 --> 01:00:18,920
Speaker 3: fix this is electing Republicans. It's kind of like the

1131
01:00:18,960 --> 01:00:22,720
Speaker 3: message of this movie. And yeah, like you pointed out,

1132
01:00:22,840 --> 01:00:25,480
Speaker 3: like a lot of the retellings in this movie of

1133
01:00:25,600 --> 01:00:28,439
Speaker 3: people that were like supposedly targeted by the deep state

1134
01:00:29,480 --> 01:00:32,960
Speaker 3: really don't explain why. It's just they came after me

1135
01:00:33,040 --> 01:00:36,040
Speaker 3: and attacked me because I was a mom who's vocal

1136
01:00:36,080 --> 01:00:36,840
Speaker 3: in my community.

1137
01:00:37,600 --> 01:00:42,280
Speaker 1: Now because hard cut, I was a mom who I'm sorry.

1138
01:00:43,200 --> 01:00:46,400
Speaker 3: Actually, you were involved in a like you were implicated

1139
01:00:46,840 --> 01:00:50,160
Speaker 3: indirectly in a plot to like steal voting machines. That's

1140
01:00:50,200 --> 01:00:51,120
Speaker 3: why the FBI.

1141
01:00:50,880 --> 01:00:53,360
Speaker 2: Showed rut you right, like it came with someone who

1142
01:00:53,520 --> 01:00:57,080
Speaker 2: like presented themselves as law enforcement to gain access to machines.

1143
01:00:57,120 --> 01:01:00,400
Speaker 2: And now you're like, I didn't know well, and now

1144
01:01:01,040 --> 01:01:03,120
Speaker 2: I guess it's my turn. But yeah, how could they

1145
01:01:03,200 --> 01:01:07,320
Speaker 2: do that? Yeah? Yeah for real, it's uh yeah, all

1146
01:01:07,400 --> 01:01:09,800
Speaker 2: of it adds up, you know, for a very very

1147
01:01:11,240 --> 01:01:12,840
Speaker 2: you know, I feel we're just we just got to

1148
01:01:12,920 --> 01:01:16,680
Speaker 2: buckle up again. It's like I thought twenty twenty just happened,

1149
01:01:16,680 --> 01:01:18,720
Speaker 2: and I was like, this is gonna be a fucking nightmare.

1150
01:01:18,800 --> 01:01:22,400
Speaker 2: But we're we're fully stepping into another one now between

1151
01:01:23,240 --> 01:01:27,760
Speaker 2: just everything that is happening online in physical space, and

1152
01:01:28,280 --> 01:01:30,280
Speaker 2: like even with Trump's trial, you can see how much

1153
01:01:30,320 --> 01:01:34,240
Speaker 2: it's energizing people too, because he fully now gets to

1154
01:01:34,280 --> 01:01:36,920
Speaker 2: be like, here it is, folks. They're trying to do

1155
01:01:37,000 --> 01:01:40,080
Speaker 2: everything to me while most of us are like, is

1156
01:01:40,160 --> 01:01:43,040
Speaker 2: anything going to happen? Really? Who knows?

1157
01:01:43,240 --> 01:01:46,600
Speaker 1: Yeah, and when it does, they feel like this sort

1158
01:01:46,640 --> 01:01:51,120
Speaker 1: of propaganda seems like it has him positioned to actually

1159
01:01:51,200 --> 01:01:55,439
Speaker 1: benefit from when he actually faces consequences, because then they'll

1160
01:01:55,520 --> 01:01:58,080
Speaker 1: just be like, see, we told you it's all.

1161
01:01:59,600 --> 01:02:02,320
Speaker 3: If they can put a president in jail for doing crimes,

1162
01:02:02,720 --> 01:02:04,040
Speaker 3: think of what they can do to you when you

1163
01:02:04,120 --> 01:02:04,680
Speaker 3: did crimes.

1164
01:02:04,800 --> 01:02:05,200
Speaker 2: That's right.

1165
01:02:05,520 --> 01:02:10,840
Speaker 1: Yeah, I always thought that people got in trouble for

1166
01:02:10,960 --> 01:02:14,240
Speaker 1: doing crimes. It is kind of a brilliant strategy because

1167
01:02:14,280 --> 01:02:16,880
Speaker 1: they get to star in a spy movie that isn't

1168
01:02:16,920 --> 01:02:20,760
Speaker 1: really happening, so they just like get the fun and

1169
01:02:20,920 --> 01:02:25,400
Speaker 1: none of the consequences. Like they're like, there's this anecdote

1170
01:02:25,400 --> 01:02:29,160
Speaker 1: from Mother Jones article like who somebody who went to

1171
01:02:29,200 --> 01:02:31,840
Speaker 1: see the film in theaters because it was out for

1172
01:02:31,960 --> 01:02:36,040
Speaker 1: like two days and the author, Yeah, police state the

1173
01:02:36,880 --> 01:02:39,360
Speaker 1: to sue the film. The author says, perhaps the most

1174
01:02:39,440 --> 01:02:41,360
Speaker 1: unsettling part of the film occurs at the end, when

1175
01:02:41,400 --> 01:02:44,240
Speaker 1: Desusa calls on the audience. They sing a national anthem

1176
01:02:44,520 --> 01:02:47,440
Speaker 1: in solidarity with the January sixth political prisoners, one of

1177
01:02:47,480 --> 01:02:49,760
Speaker 1: whom was portrayed by an actor wearing an orange jump

1178
01:02:49,840 --> 01:02:52,360
Speaker 1: soit all around me. So this is in the theater,

1179
01:02:52,480 --> 01:02:55,520
Speaker 1: all around me. People jumped and chanted Usa Usa, and

1180
01:02:55,600 --> 01:02:58,600
Speaker 1: then they sang along. As we exited the theater. I

1181
01:02:58,760 --> 01:03:01,600
Speaker 1: overheard a guy urging his friends to cover their faces

1182
01:03:01,680 --> 01:03:04,120
Speaker 1: on the way out because obviously the deep State would

1183
01:03:04,120 --> 01:03:06,920
Speaker 1: be there watching. They'll be taking pictures, he warrant, to

1184
01:03:06,960 --> 01:03:09,320
Speaker 1: which his friend replied, I'm surprised I haven't gotten a

1185
01:03:09,400 --> 01:03:10,560
Speaker 1: knock on the door already.

1186
01:03:11,080 --> 01:03:11,520
Speaker 2: Oh boy.

1187
01:03:11,920 --> 01:03:15,400
Speaker 1: But it's like, yeah, so this allows them to like

1188
01:03:15,600 --> 01:03:22,000
Speaker 1: cause play as like a scot Yeah, victims, victims victims. Yeah,

1189
01:03:22,080 --> 01:03:23,800
Speaker 1: cool spy Simon in True Lies.

1190
01:03:24,160 --> 01:03:24,360
Speaker 2: You know.

1191
01:03:26,240 --> 01:03:30,080
Speaker 1: Yeah, well, Jared, it's I wish I could say it's

1192
01:03:30,120 --> 01:03:33,520
Speaker 1: been fun, but it's been very enlightening. And we really

1193
01:03:33,560 --> 01:03:37,680
Speaker 1: appreciate you doing the work of kind of monitoring this

1194
01:03:37,760 --> 01:03:41,560
Speaker 1: stuff and letting us know what what's happening, because it

1195
01:03:42,400 --> 01:03:45,560
Speaker 1: feels like we're we're on the precipice of some other

1196
01:03:45,680 --> 01:03:49,160
Speaker 1: bullshit this time. So so thank you for helping fill

1197
01:03:49,240 --> 01:03:52,760
Speaker 1: us in. Where can people find you? Follow you all

1198
01:03:52,800 --> 01:03:58,120
Speaker 1: that good stuff. I'm on Twitter and Blue Sky at

1199
01:03:58,560 --> 01:03:59,760
Speaker 1: Jared L. Holt.

1200
01:04:00,080 --> 01:04:02,320
Speaker 3: But what's way more important is that you go to

1201
01:04:02,440 --> 01:04:06,520
Speaker 3: Instagram and follow my dog at Pierre Turbo. He's a

1202
01:04:07,160 --> 01:04:10,240
Speaker 3: nine point eight pound Pomeranian. He's way cooler than me.

1203
01:04:10,720 --> 01:04:12,919
Speaker 3: And if you've listened to this point in the show,

1204
01:04:12,920 --> 01:04:15,240
Speaker 3: you've heard enough of this shit, So like, definitely go

1205
01:04:15,400 --> 01:04:17,040
Speaker 3: check out my dog for a little bit, check out

1206
01:04:17,040 --> 01:04:19,160
Speaker 3: Pierre Pierre, and then you can catch up with me

1207
01:04:19,320 --> 01:04:20,120
Speaker 3: later somewhere else.

1208
01:04:20,480 --> 01:04:22,400
Speaker 1: Yeah, I thought you're gonna be like, it's more important

1209
01:04:22,480 --> 01:04:26,040
Speaker 1: that you go follow the Institute for Strategic Dialogue. Oh,

1210
01:04:26,080 --> 01:04:28,360
Speaker 1: that's that's probably That's probably what I should have said, Nah,

1211
01:04:29,040 --> 01:04:30,760
Speaker 1: that I'm following your dog.

1212
01:04:31,000 --> 01:04:31,600
Speaker 2: That's helpful.

1213
01:04:32,320 --> 01:04:34,280
Speaker 1: Is there a work of media that you've been enjoying.

1214
01:04:34,920 --> 01:04:37,960
Speaker 3: One of the shows that I did watch was on

1215
01:04:38,200 --> 01:04:43,280
Speaker 3: Netflix they like get John Gottie docuseries. That was really

1216
01:04:43,320 --> 01:04:45,640
Speaker 3: good and that was really entertaining, and that's like classic

1217
01:04:46,240 --> 01:04:50,120
Speaker 3: you know, New York mob history and I have like

1218
01:04:50,240 --> 01:04:52,640
Speaker 3: a I'm always like fascinated.

1219
01:04:52,160 --> 01:04:52,800
Speaker 2: By that stuff.

1220
01:04:53,080 --> 01:04:56,600
Speaker 3: So it's yeah, yeah, I recommend that that was good.

1221
01:04:57,080 --> 01:04:59,680
Speaker 1: Awesome, Miles. Where can people find you as their work

1222
01:04:59,760 --> 01:05:00,840
Speaker 1: media you've been enjoying?

1223
01:05:01,720 --> 01:05:06,360
Speaker 2: Find me on the at base platforms at Miles of Gray,

1224
01:05:07,080 --> 01:05:10,000
Speaker 2: and also find Jack and I on our very not

1225
01:05:10,440 --> 01:05:14,400
Speaker 2: news politics or news and politics podcast Miles and Jacket,

1226
01:05:15,480 --> 01:05:19,840
Speaker 2: where we talk about the game of basketball. And also

1227
01:05:19,920 --> 01:05:23,400
Speaker 2: you can find me on what is It four fiance?

1228
01:05:23,720 --> 01:05:28,840
Speaker 2: Check that out. Let's see a tweet I like this

1229
01:05:29,040 --> 01:05:34,680
Speaker 2: is from Lucas Fabraro at Lucas Ferbraro was like replying

1230
01:05:34,800 --> 01:05:37,680
Speaker 2: to just like a like someone was showing how a

1231
01:05:38,360 --> 01:05:41,280
Speaker 2: new York Times headlines is how like the passive voice

1232
01:05:41,320 --> 01:05:43,640
Speaker 2: is just so wild because like it' said New York

1233
01:05:43,640 --> 01:05:47,880
Speaker 2: Times explosion Gossin say was airstrike leaves many casualties in

1234
01:05:48,080 --> 01:05:53,000
Speaker 2: dense neighborhood. Like, I'm sorry, what explosions they call airsta

1235
01:05:54,440 --> 01:05:57,360
Speaker 2: And then Lucas did a photoshop looks like a New

1236
01:05:57,440 --> 01:06:00,440
Speaker 2: York Times cover on September twelfth, two in one with

1237
01:06:00,520 --> 01:06:04,560
Speaker 2: the Twin Towers. It says, explosion happens twin towers damaged,

1238
01:06:04,960 --> 01:06:09,840
Speaker 2: witnesses report planes flying overhead. That's what that looks like.

1239
01:06:09,960 --> 01:06:12,320
Speaker 2: But yeah, it feels like a very It's kind of

1240
01:06:12,360 --> 01:06:14,320
Speaker 2: what we're dealing with now. We look at how cold?

1241
01:06:14,560 --> 01:06:15,680
Speaker 1: How could the planes do that?

1242
01:06:16,320 --> 01:06:16,560
Speaker 2: Yeah?

1243
01:06:16,680 --> 01:06:21,040
Speaker 1: Right? How could the explosion? Yeah?

1244
01:06:21,640 --> 01:06:26,160
Speaker 2: Yeah? Like just the lack of clarity, it's just so insidious, man.

1245
01:06:26,680 --> 01:06:29,120
Speaker 3: And when you learn journalism in school, like they teach

1246
01:06:29,200 --> 01:06:29,920
Speaker 3: you not to do this.

1247
01:06:30,240 --> 01:06:33,920
Speaker 2: There's really no good excuse for this. Truly tweet I've

1248
01:06:33,920 --> 01:06:34,560
Speaker 2: been enjoying.

1249
01:06:35,040 --> 01:06:37,400
Speaker 1: Marianna Zi tweeted, did you know if you lose a

1250
01:06:37,520 --> 01:06:40,400
Speaker 1: sock in the dryer, it comes back as a tougher

1251
01:06:40,480 --> 01:06:44,720
Speaker 1: wear lid that doesn't fit any of your containments that

1252
01:06:44,840 --> 01:06:46,360
Speaker 1: explains fucking everything.

1253
01:06:46,600 --> 01:06:50,800
Speaker 2: Wow, do you keep them? You keep those lids? Oh,

1254
01:06:50,880 --> 01:06:53,600
Speaker 2: I know you're talking about I rage quit them.

1255
01:06:54,160 --> 01:06:56,040
Speaker 1: I got a shed full of those motherfuckers.

1256
01:06:58,080 --> 01:07:01,840
Speaker 2: That storage unit filled with the didn't even open the door. Yeah.

1257
01:07:02,080 --> 01:07:06,480
Speaker 1: I also like this tweet from Dave It'scoff. He retweeted

1258
01:07:07,000 --> 01:07:11,040
Speaker 1: a still image from the New York Marathon and it

1259
01:07:11,160 --> 01:07:14,120
Speaker 1: had Helen o'biery, who's one of the runners, and it

1260
01:07:14,120 --> 01:07:18,000
Speaker 1: says born on December thirteenth, nineteen eighty nine parentheses, same

1261
01:07:18,080 --> 01:07:21,040
Speaker 1: day as Taylor Swift and David Coff was like, work

1262
01:07:21,080 --> 01:07:24,880
Speaker 1: your angle NYC Marathon, which it's just like all the

1263
01:07:24,960 --> 01:07:30,560
Speaker 1: sports are like, how do we relate sport to Taylor Swift? Right,

1264
01:07:31,440 --> 01:07:34,600
Speaker 1: find a runner who has the same birthday. Anyways, You

1265
01:07:34,640 --> 01:07:37,240
Speaker 1: can find me on Twitter at Jack Underscore O'Brien. You

1266
01:07:37,280 --> 01:07:39,880
Speaker 1: can find us on Twitter at Daily Zeitgeist. We're at

1267
01:07:39,920 --> 01:07:42,840
Speaker 1: the Daily Zeikeist on Instagram. We have a Facebook fanpage

1268
01:07:42,840 --> 01:07:45,200
Speaker 1: and a website Daily zeikeist dot com where we post

1269
01:07:45,240 --> 01:07:48,640
Speaker 1: our episodes and our footnote where we link off to

1270
01:07:48,720 --> 01:07:51,480
Speaker 1: the information that we talked about in today's episode. Well,

1271
01:07:51,560 --> 01:07:53,960
Speaker 1: is this song we think you might enjoy myles, What

1272
01:07:54,080 --> 01:07:55,479
Speaker 1: song do we think people might enjoy?

1273
01:07:56,040 --> 01:07:59,120
Speaker 2: I was listening, so you know, Tame and Paula is

1274
01:07:59,160 --> 01:08:03,439
Speaker 2: obviously Kevin Harker, but everybody in that band, they're also

1275
01:08:03,520 --> 01:08:05,440
Speaker 2: in like a ton of other bands. So if you

1276
01:08:05,560 --> 01:08:07,560
Speaker 2: like Tame and Paula, there's a chance that one of

1277
01:08:07,600 --> 01:08:10,520
Speaker 2: these offshoot bands you would also like. Case in point

1278
01:08:10,720 --> 01:08:13,920
Speaker 2: is Gum, which is led by I believe he's the

1279
01:08:13,960 --> 01:08:15,960
Speaker 2: guitar like one of the le guitar players in Tam

1280
01:08:16,040 --> 01:08:19,120
Speaker 2: and Paula. And this track is called Glamorous Damage. And

1281
01:08:19,200 --> 01:08:21,960
Speaker 2: if you like the Tam and Paula vibes, you're definitely

1282
01:08:21,960 --> 01:08:24,439
Speaker 2: gonna fuck with this track. So this is Glamorous Damage

1283
01:08:24,479 --> 01:08:26,400
Speaker 2: by Gum g U M dam.

1284
01:08:26,960 --> 01:08:29,160
Speaker 1: All right, well, the Daily Zeik is the production of

1285
01:08:29,200 --> 01:08:31,600
Speaker 1: iHeart Radio. For more podcast from my Heart Radio is

1286
01:08:31,640 --> 01:08:33,960
Speaker 1: the iHeartRadio app, Apple podcast or wherever you listen to

1287
01:08:33,960 --> 01:08:36,559
Speaker 1: your favorite shows, that is gonna do it for us

1288
01:08:36,720 --> 01:08:39,120
Speaker 1: this morning. We are back this afternoon to tell you

1289
01:08:39,240 --> 01:08:41,640
Speaker 1: what is trending and we will talk to you all

1290
01:08:41,680 --> 01:08:42,840
Speaker 1: then Bye bye,