Speaker 1: It's the quintessential archetypical record scratch. You falling off the
Speaker 1: side of a building, running at top speed in the
Speaker 1: middle of the street, record scratch, freeze frame. You're probably
Speaker 1: wondering how I got here. Listen. I was at a
Speaker 1: homies house. This was when our family had moved to
Speaker 1: the Inland Empire, which is about an hour outside of
Speaker 1: Los Angeles. And if you follow a hip hop I'm
Speaker 1: in this area where hit Boy is from, in Fontana,
Speaker 1: and hit Boy just produced Nazi's new record. It was
Speaker 1: incredible album. He murdered that mug. Shout out your boy.
Speaker 1: We've never met, but you represent with a jazz board
Speaker 1: on there. Jazz board j you know what I'm saying.
Speaker 1: He from the code six to six. Anyway, I'm getting
Speaker 1: off topic. Playing pool at this dude's house. I don't
Speaker 1: even think my family knows the story. There's baggaweed that's
Speaker 1: in this drawer, which was like this older brother or
Speaker 1: sister whatever, bagaweed this in the drawer, and one of
Speaker 1: my friends, somehow or another, put together the right amount
Speaker 1: of words that would convince me that I was the
Speaker 1: perfect person to steal this bag from this this person's
Speaker 1: older brother while we was over there playing pool. And
Speaker 1: I don't know what it was about the magical phrases
Speaker 1: and things that this person said that actually convinced me
Speaker 1: to think that this nigga knew exactly what he was
Speaker 1: talking about. But I was convinced we got it, had
Speaker 1: to figure out and out. And while we was figuring
Speaker 1: out out, the same dude was Jimmy Jabby Jabby jibby
Speaker 1: jabby blasi blog whoopy whoop. While we figured out a
Speaker 1: way out, and then we got out, and as we
Speaker 1: were leaving, we're here to hey. And I don't know
Speaker 1: if I failed to mention how dangerous this older brother
Speaker 1: that we just thought as we broke was. Either way,
Speaker 1: it was trying to run. So ran to the homeboy
Speaker 1: who had this little v W bug that was just
Speaker 1: like you know, busted up two doors with the blink
Speaker 1: of missing you know what I'm saying, and just stupid
Speaker 1: high school like buddy at a car. So hopped in
Speaker 1: a way, ran as fast as we could. Somehow another
Speaker 1: I decided to go that my backyard was the wisest
Speaker 1: backyard to come smoke this bag of weed at which,
Speaker 1: for some reason, I don't know why, I thought, I
Speaker 1: don't know how the niggas convinced me that my house
Speaker 1: was the best choice. But somehow we went back to
Speaker 1: my mama house in the back yard, and I think
Speaker 1: it might have been because maybe my mama was at
Speaker 1: like follow me now Wednesday night Bible study, choose at
Speaker 1: a prayer meeting something. I just figured this was the
Speaker 1: best idea to come do this. And as they as
Speaker 1: we smoked this thing, and then they took off and
Speaker 1: then everybody left. I remember standing in my driveway like
Speaker 1: did I just steal this bag of weed and take
Speaker 1: it back to my house? And spoke out with umies
Speaker 1: why my mama was at a prayer meeting? It just
Speaker 1: all hit me up that and I was like, how
Speaker 1: did how did you convince me to do this? It's
Speaker 1: some people just got to give to gab y'all. Let's
Speaker 1: talk about lobbyists, hood politics. What's up y'all today? We
Speaker 1: gotta guess we're got talked to the illustrious Miles Gray
Speaker 1: of the Daily Zeigeist. And you know, before cool zone
Speaker 1: media took off, you know, sandwich on me in right now.
Speaker 1: You know what I'm saying, Uh, Miles was my boss.
Speaker 1: But either way he's he's what Sophie called a podfather,
Speaker 1: him and him and Jack yeah saying and I take that,
Speaker 1: you know they geez, you know what I'm saying. Respect
Speaker 1: do uh, but we're gonna have him in here. Miles
Speaker 1: has lived a ton of lives and I'm a had
Speaker 1: a hummy in to talk about lobbying. But I think
Speaker 1: a way to get your brain around this is like
Speaker 1: I remember I had a friend walk out the principal's
Speaker 1: office that we was all positive was gonna get either
Speaker 1: suspended or expelled. Somehow, another this nigga talked his way
Speaker 1: out of a suspension. I don't know. I still don't
Speaker 1: know how he did it. I still to this day,
Speaker 1: I have no idea how this nigga talked himself out
Speaker 1: of a suspension. And he won't tell us. It's just
Speaker 1: like and he wouldn't tell us. I mean, I ain't
Speaker 1: seen the nigga in years, but I just remember, like
Speaker 1: this fool could talk his way out of anything. He
Speaker 1: did what the hell he wants Because he could talk
Speaker 1: his way. I was just like, how are you doing?
Speaker 1: Like how some people could just convince other people to
Speaker 1: do stuff even though they know they shouldn't do stuff.
Speaker 1: I'm like, what's this motivation? Is? This? Is this a like?
Speaker 1: Are you a super villain? I just sometimes I feel
Speaker 1: like some Niggers have got the gifted gap but just
Speaker 1: super villains or you have to learn how to use
Speaker 1: your power for good. But dog, I feel like every
Speaker 1: hood got somebody. Every neighborhood got somebody could just talk
Speaker 1: their way in and out of anything. When I was
Speaker 1: in uh, when I was in college, I used to
Speaker 1: work with these these brothers, these uh Puerto Rican brothers
Speaker 1: uh out in Cove and no lie, y'all. These were
Speaker 1: these these two brothers. They were gorgeous. I can't this listen, listen,
Speaker 1: you already know Puerto Rican man, look are beautiful. These
Speaker 1: two nicks just just gorgeous. Anyway. They never paid full
Speaker 1: price or for any entrance into any club festival event.
Speaker 1: They talked their way in and would just let somebody
Speaker 1: just tell me no. You could see if somebody find you,
Speaker 1: you'll get to a no. And if you get to
Speaker 1: a no, you could either keep going or not. That
Speaker 1: was once I remember they talked their way into the
Speaker 1: v I P section for like wrestling event, and they
Speaker 1: just said that they were Dwayne's cousins, Oh you know
Speaker 1: him as the Rock, Like, yeah, no, they just talked
Speaker 1: their way into I'm like, how are you just listen?
Speaker 1: If you got the gift and you got the confidence,
Speaker 1: you could do it. But as uh the joker says,
Speaker 1: if you're good at something, never do it for free.
Speaker 1: Let's talk about lobbyists. Hood politics y'all. How you so
Speaker 1: hood right now? Whole politics y'all of politics? Yo. The
Speaker 1: cheese mosuls mediicas cheese more size. You know there silver
Speaker 1: tongue folks that are just like always gossiping. I said,
Speaker 1: cheese mo soul. It's like that's a gossip. You know.
Speaker 1: Medic is like, Yo, you're so nosy like stuff being
Speaker 1: a medica, you know. And I just sometimes think like,
Speaker 1: as a lobbyist, you kind of gotta be both of those.
Speaker 1: You gotta have a silver tongue and you gotta be
Speaker 1: nosy as hell, you know what I'm saying, because you
Speaker 1: got a game going on. But rather than listening to
Speaker 1: me talk to this talk about this stuff, I gotta
Speaker 1: guess which is funny because this is, uh, this is
Speaker 1: the two way page I got from my boy Jay Boy.
Speaker 1: Let's go from back then because his aunt worked at
Speaker 1: this fucking big gas real estate company and she was
Speaker 1: in charge of selling sending out all the corporate phones.
Speaker 1: So they had a side hustle where she could just
Speaker 1: attribute a couple of loose phones every week to some
Speaker 1: whatever that. Yeah, so that's how I was talking two
Speaker 1: this is media and fucking two thousand four with my
Speaker 1: two way pager. Anyway, shout out the boy, the two
Speaker 1: ray page. Yo, this is the best way to start this. Ever,
Speaker 1: that's the exactly you just proved the premise of the
Speaker 1: whole ship. Ladies and gentlemen, Miles Gray has already wedn't
Speaker 1: even started yet, and he had already proved the premise.
Speaker 1: First of all, welcome to the hip. Politics were putting
Speaker 1: all Miles Gray, say, what's up to the folks? Hey, hey,
Speaker 1: thank you for having me, thank you for having to
Speaker 1: talk about my past life. You know, it's always it's
Speaker 1: always a wonderful pleasure to do that, and especially to
Speaker 1: do it with you, you know, to do it, do
Speaker 1: it the right way. Let's go, y. Miles has lived
Speaker 1: a number of lives. We were just discussing his time
Speaker 1: in radio, uh, his time underwear modeling. I was pretty
Speaker 1: sure that was bish I had known you then, man, Yeah,
Speaker 1: that was just I was an intern at Aftermath, you know, um,
Speaker 1: trying to make my way up, I wake your way up,
Speaker 1: making a little side money modeling draws. Was that you?
Speaker 1: That was you actually doing like the double he was
Speaker 1: doing all the b gvs for the Hero years. Anyway,
Speaker 1: we're here to talk about lobbying, like what is it
Speaker 1: what makes a good lobbyist? Because that was one of
Speaker 1: miles past lives. But as you know, the premise of
Speaker 1: this show is if you've not only if you if
Speaker 1: you grew up in the inner city, drew in the city,
Speaker 1: grew up in the hood, not only do you understand politics,
Speaker 1: I'm gonna take it a step further. You'd probably be
Speaker 1: very good at it because of having to navigate the
Speaker 1: world you were in. So I'm gonna ask Myles a
Speaker 1: few questions. Then we're gonna go into the particulars of um,
Speaker 1: what it means to be a lobbyist, how to be
Speaker 1: good at it, and all this good stuff. But we're
Speaker 1: setting up the premise like this imagine not so here.
Speaker 1: One of my past life was when I was in college. Uh,
Speaker 1: I found that the best like part time college job
Speaker 1: is to like substitute teach because you kind of just
Speaker 1: kind of make your own schedule. It's like hundred fifty
Speaker 1: bucks a day. You just kind of show I don't
Speaker 1: have to grade nothing, or they don't have to care.
Speaker 1: You know what I'm saying, Like breaking up a couple
Speaker 1: of fights, You're not gonna hurt my feelings. Like I'm
Speaker 1: not gonna be here tomorrow. You know what I'm saying,
Speaker 1: Like I'll write a note for your teacher, like I
Speaker 1: guess your teacher say you gotta do this. It don't
Speaker 1: matter to me. You gotta be here tomorrow. I don't
Speaker 1: know what I'm saying. Uh So it's the greatest thing ever.
Speaker 1: But I felt like, Okay, what's I'm still son of
Speaker 1: a black panther. I still believe in justice, and I'm like,
Speaker 1: I'm gonna go where nobody else would go. So I
Speaker 1: worked in juvenile halls. That's where I substitute to East
Speaker 1: Lake Correctional Facility. I Rocky Appleball, you know, Lucky for me, my,
Speaker 1: um my, my criminal record was all non violent offenses
Speaker 1: because they was because it was just graffiti. Um So
Speaker 1: I was able to get into these Oh man, I
Speaker 1: can't tell you that, bro, I was just kid. Now,
Speaker 1: I've always been I've always been propaganda. I've been prop
Speaker 1: for years. You know what I'm saying. Um, But yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: I just throw up prop um anyway. So I I oftentimes,
Speaker 1: even when I'm setting up this show the premises, like
Speaker 1: the terms I used when I decided to like I
Speaker 1: probably should explain this vocabulary word whatever the case may be,
Speaker 1: I'm always thinking about the kids in juvie like that's like,
Speaker 1: that's like that's my target, you know what I'm saying,
Speaker 1: Like I calibrate everything to being like there's a kid
Speaker 1: in juven the hall. Understand what I'm saying. So here's
Speaker 1: here's our question for you, miss using your your knowledge
Speaker 1: of both lobbying and I'm gonna ask you later on
Speaker 1: like how you got into that. But just like uh
Speaker 1: and growing up in the city, survey that room, describe
Speaker 1: the kid that you would go, honest, fool would be
Speaker 1: really good at lobbying. I would probably find out. I
Speaker 1: would say, who was running with a group of people
Speaker 1: they shouldn't have been running with and you know you
Speaker 1: shouldn't have been running with this group of people, and
Speaker 1: then have everyone just raise your hand. Okay, Okay, So
Speaker 1: now between all of you, how many of you were
Speaker 1: the smartest kid in that crew and everybody said you
Speaker 1: shouldn't really be running with us, but you're still there. Okay,
Speaker 1: that's my wife. Also, how many any of y'all in
Speaker 1: here have cheated on a test or done some ship
Speaker 1: in school and somehow the teacher you talked your way
Speaker 1: out of it. Okay, your way out of anything, Okay,
Speaker 1: talk your way out of you gotta be smooth, um.
Speaker 1: And also who who who all here and understands that
Speaker 1: cash rules everything around us? Okay? Great? So whoever has
Speaker 1: their hands still raised at that point, I'd say is
Speaker 1: would be good. I mean, lobbying is like about it's
Speaker 1: it's really like it's like organizing in a way. You know,
Speaker 1: you want to get people. You're trying to convince people
Speaker 1: of something, You're trying to create a base of people
Speaker 1: to move with you. But also when the ship goes down,
Speaker 1: you can slide right out the back and you can
Speaker 1: be like, damn, look at that mess that just happened.
Speaker 1: Look I love that last part to where you could
Speaker 1: slide out like damn, I don't know what. Yeah, damn.
Speaker 1: They're like that I believe they said that what's out
Speaker 1: doing down here? Anyway? That's crazy? Okay, I'm gonna go yo.
Speaker 1: I feel like one of the I've said it so
Speaker 1: many times, one of the one of the greatest tools
Speaker 1: you can have in your tool belt is knowing when
Speaker 1: it's time to leave. It's just you. You just gotta
Speaker 1: know when it's like you have you able to read
Speaker 1: the room and be like, A that's probably right, and
Speaker 1: not to say like you're just planting bombs and then leaving.
Speaker 1: But if you think of, like how so much of
Speaker 1: the lack of progress that we have legislatively is due
Speaker 1: to lobbyists, It's like it's more that like nobody's looking
Speaker 1: at them, you know what I mean, and everyone's looking
Speaker 1: at the politicians when you can draw many straight lines
Speaker 1: straight back to the lobbying efforts of corporations or business groups,
Speaker 1: industries and things like that, which is why there's a
Speaker 1: you know, why there's so much gridlock to politically. We're
Speaker 1: gonna come back to that, because that's that's a good thing.
Speaker 1: I would love to hammer home. Um because I'm even
Speaker 1: thinking about a future episode with like kind of just
Speaker 1: talking about a little bit of like a mission drift,
Speaker 1: you know, when you know you come in, especially as
Speaker 1: a politician, with these you know, even sometimes very lofty
Speaker 1: ideas or or just an understanding that like, yo, this
Speaker 1: is my this is my base. You know, these are
Speaker 1: my fans, this is my crowd, and I'm out here
Speaker 1: doing this for them. And then you get into the
Speaker 1: work and then you realize, like, I actually can't accomplish
Speaker 1: what they want right without giving these certain concessions. And
Speaker 1: then it's almost like you just know how it works
Speaker 1: in Washington or on the Capitol, and it's like you
Speaker 1: come home and out of hood, don't even recognize you,
Speaker 1: and everybody mad at you because it is, but it's
Speaker 1: it's because none of us really see what's happening, what
Speaker 1: happens to you when you go that when you get
Speaker 1: like when you sign them, you know with a major label,
Speaker 1: like what happened to the Weekend? You know, Okay, he
Speaker 1: went from I'm gonna just do this ship independent. Still
Speaker 1: I will force a label. Labels have a bidding war
Speaker 1: over my signature. And then you get in that machine
Speaker 1: and suddenly you're doing all this weird pop shit that
Speaker 1: wasn't even like the Horny House of balloons type mixtape
Speaker 1: stuff you used to do, or you're talking about snort
Speaker 1: and molly off a toilet and you know, messing the
Speaker 1: strippers and things like that. That's sort of like there's
Speaker 1: a there's something you know, your instincts can get old.
Speaker 1: But that's also because you're moving into an environment that
Speaker 1: is just dealing with so much money that it's it's
Speaker 1: hard to sort of stand against the current and be
Speaker 1: a fixed object, like it will typically just sweep you away. Yeah,
Speaker 1: it's like do I do I keep this job? And
Speaker 1: like using the weekend as an example, just's like, hey man,
Speaker 1: you want to number one hit or not? Right? Like
Speaker 1: why are we why are we even here that? Why
Speaker 1: do you so start pop locking with daft punk? Okay? Yeah,
Speaker 1: I can't feel my face when I'm with you. You
Speaker 1: know you want to perform the super Bowl? Like you
Speaker 1: can do that or keep making these like or keep
Speaker 1: it real? Yeah and make and I get it. It's then,
Speaker 1: and that's I think a decision a lot of people
Speaker 1: have to make her and sometimes people know it was like,
Speaker 1: you know, maybe he was just a shrewd business person
Speaker 1: the whole time and just knew that was his way
Speaker 1: to get the most revenue for himself. But other times,
Speaker 1: I mean that was even me, Like before I got
Speaker 1: into politics, I was so fucking optimistic and so naive
Speaker 1: um that it only took a few election cycles for
Speaker 1: me to realize, Oh this, I'm like in the complete
Speaker 1: fucking devil's asshole of the whole thing. Wow, I want
Speaker 1: to get the funk out. He's like, I am I'm
Speaker 1: the problem. Yeah, oh yeah, I'm like, I'm I'm the
Speaker 1: fucking I'm the bad guy. And and I knew that
Speaker 1: so clearly. So it was just it became a very
Speaker 1: quickly untenable situation for me, Like emotionally, morally, is it
Speaker 1: a part of that job that like, if you're good
Speaker 1: at it, that's inevitably where you're gonna land to where
Speaker 1: you're like, because I'm assuming with like if it's a
Speaker 1: lobbying firm, like you're not choosing the the things you're
Speaker 1: lobbying for, right, well, I mean typically right, So lobbyists,
Speaker 1: you know, just generally right that they say that etymology
Speaker 1: comes from like back in the day in parliament, uh
Speaker 1: in England, where the the MPs would gather in like
Speaker 1: the lobbies in the House of Commons, and that was
Speaker 1: the moment where people who weren't elected officials could have
Speaker 1: a chance to bend the ear of somebody that was attached.
Speaker 1: I was going to ask that where the term. Yeah,
Speaker 1: so you're kind of like, you know, its fans waiting
Speaker 1: in the hotel lobby for the afters. You know, the
Speaker 1: groupies are at um. It's like, oh, there's their bust,
Speaker 1: I want to talk about this bill. So, you know,
Speaker 1: a lot of it has to do with typically, right,
Speaker 1: the most the lobbyists that do the best are ones
Speaker 1: that come out of a part like a you know,
Speaker 1: a bureaucracy or typically held office themselves. That's why the
Speaker 1: revolving door is such a true thing about lobbying is
Speaker 1: that the people who really really get it in are
Speaker 1: the ones that have that very small degree of separation
Speaker 1: between themselves and the decision makers. So for me where
Speaker 1: I was at, I was very far removed from doing
Speaker 1: like you know what they call inside lobbying, which is
Speaker 1: like the face to face with the legislators to get
Speaker 1: ship done. Then there's outside lobbying, which is like you
Speaker 1: are working on the forces around the legislators to to
Speaker 1: kind of get them to act okay and so are
Speaker 1: the firm that I would I worked for, um, you know,
Speaker 1: has a mix of those things. The lobbyists like that
Speaker 1: we're out there like interface face to face with like politicians.
Speaker 1: They they're typically lawyers because they also have a degree
Speaker 1: of like legal understanding because half the time they're fucking
Speaker 1: writing actual bills anyway. UM, So you have to have
Speaker 1: that like legislative knowledge and legal lease knowledge to make
Speaker 1: sure that you're writing bills that don't have loopholes and
Speaker 1: ship like that. So those people, you know, like, there's
Speaker 1: definitely levels to like how it works. Um. But in
Speaker 1: that instance, the people who you know, you might just
Speaker 1: you might just be in the fossil fuels because they
Speaker 1: pay the most. I don't know how many people are
Speaker 1: like I'm really you know, dedicated to this thing unless
Speaker 1: it's things like if you were for the Double A
Speaker 1: c P or other groups that do lobbying. Because it's
Speaker 1: not just corporations, but there are people who do it
Speaker 1: for you know, because they're seriously trying to change to happen.
Speaker 1: But other times it's just about who's cutting the check. Yeahtane,
Speaker 1: that's that's that Seeing that that two different the two
Speaker 1: differences between being like outsider versus insider, Like if you're
Speaker 1: not you know, again using the using the city, you
Speaker 1: know as the motif, it's like, well, if you if
Speaker 1: you're not really, if you ain't really gang gang already,
Speaker 1: I'm like, I'm probably not gonna really hear what you
Speaker 1: got to say, you know what I'm saying. But if
Speaker 1: I'm like, oh man, you know I was I went
Speaker 1: to Camp Rocky with this dude, you know what I'm saying,
Speaker 1: or like, oh man, we were sitting you know, we
Speaker 1: were sitting in County, you know what I mean, Like
Speaker 1: you know who was at the same kickback running from
Speaker 1: so on. So like, I know, this dude know what
Speaker 1: it's like out here. So if he talking that yang,
Speaker 1: she talking that yang, then it's like I may I
Speaker 1: may have I may be more interested in hearing what
Speaker 1: they have to say, and that person is probably gonna
Speaker 1: know what I want to hear about because that Yeah,
Speaker 1: I mean, did you watch House of Cards of course? Okay?
Speaker 1: So me herschel Ali's character, Remy Dance, He's a perfect
Speaker 1: example of this. Remy used to work for Frank as
Speaker 1: his chief of staff when he was like when he
Speaker 1: was in the you know, the House of Representatives, and
Speaker 1: so what happens is so then he becomes president. So
Speaker 1: now if you're if you're if you're like a lobbyist,
Speaker 1: and you're looking at how can I bend the ear
Speaker 1: of the president or a top senator, you start looking
Speaker 1: at people who used to work for them, and this second,
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, that's the that's the first. That's the most
Speaker 1: effective way of like being like, you know what, I'm
Speaker 1: gonna get them and put a big pile of money
Speaker 1: in front of them, and then I got their ass
Speaker 1: because now when they go to see their old boss,
Speaker 1: their old boss, I'm like, oh, what's up, what's good?
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, let me know that the okay you're working
Speaker 1: with them, Oh, the fossil fuels thing, okay, the fracking
Speaker 1: right right right, okay, let me let me. I'm busy
Speaker 1: right now, but get back to me because you know
Speaker 1: I've got time for you. That's that's sort of the
Speaker 1: cynicism involved, is to say you get people that are
Speaker 1: already familiar with the mark, so to speak, the fucking
Speaker 1: senator of the congress, person and the president, the mayor,
Speaker 1: the governor, whoever, because it's at every level, and that's
Speaker 1: the person that you use to start funneling your information
Speaker 1: through m HM. So is there a part of it,
Speaker 1: you know in uh in Spanish, the like the the
Speaker 1: medic or like the cheese mosa, like the just the gossip,
Speaker 1: like somebody got their nose into everything? Is that? Do
Speaker 1: you kind of have to have a little bit of
Speaker 1: like a little bit of that too. You just gotta
Speaker 1: be nosy, I mean to a certain extent, but I
Speaker 1: feel like so much stuff is known in the open
Speaker 1: that you you just kind of you'll maybe just look
Speaker 1: at polling or things like that. Maybe that you get
Speaker 1: you know, you get nosy by doing research because the
Speaker 1: other part of it is if you can't compel a
Speaker 1: legislator with just saying like you know, typically just money,
Speaker 1: then the next phase is to show them that it's
Speaker 1: a politically uh positive or accepted thing, or there's favorable
Speaker 1: polling around a certain bill, to say like, well look
Speaker 1: at this, you know, here's some other stuff to show
Speaker 1: you just to sway you and like the streets are
Speaker 1: working with it. So maybe you're on board now, but
Speaker 1: a lot of it is to you know, the big
Speaker 1: thing is like lobbyists mostly trying not to lie, especially
Speaker 1: if you're direct lobbying because the second you lie about
Speaker 1: something and they know about it, it kind of ruins
Speaker 1: your cred completely. So there's a lot of finessing that
Speaker 1: you have to do to not really give half truths
Speaker 1: or over promised things, but also be you know, somewhat
Speaker 1: clear enough to like sell somebody on a vision. And again,
Speaker 1: more than that, it's it's all going to go back
Speaker 1: to money more than anything, because that's why you see
Speaker 1: people voting against their own interests in you know, in Congress,
Speaker 1: and you're like, what the fun that's gonna sunk their
Speaker 1: own state up? And you're like, well, it's because it's
Speaker 1: because the money that's coming in. So yeah, So I
Speaker 1: think of it too. Is like I always say, like,
Speaker 1: think of like a person who someone who's in Congress
Speaker 1: or the Senate as like a you know, like those
Speaker 1: NASCAR jackets that got all the sponsors and shipped on them.
Speaker 1: That's like what a senator should be rocking when they
Speaker 1: walk into the Indo Capitol Hill. So you already know
Speaker 1: who's paying the biggest chunks of their bills. You know,
Speaker 1: that's that's crazy. So you already you should be running
Speaker 1: in here flying your flag already yoh, yeah, yeah, I
Speaker 1: mean because then it makes things so much easier. So
Speaker 1: you're like, of course he's gonna vote. Look at his back,
Speaker 1: says Texico. They got the hood, like the hood, the
Speaker 1: hood sponsor of the NASCAR. Not like the hood, but
Speaker 1: the on the hood of the car. That literally the
Speaker 1: prime real estate for a NASCAR Right, You're like, that's
Speaker 1: the fucking that's the be all, end all for sponsorship.
Speaker 1: So that's the same thing to a lot of people
Speaker 1: have certain industries that they're beholding to because lobbyists, they
Speaker 1: do a lot of ship to help save people in
Speaker 1: Congress a lot of time by fundraising. You know, that's
Speaker 1: really how you lean on him, because you say, bag okay, yeah,
Speaker 1: I've well, damn you know, re elections campaigns are so expensive.
Speaker 1: I mean, man, like, I mean, I'm pretty sure I
Speaker 1: can get a few people. I think I can get
Speaker 1: a couple hundred thousand a million or so together from
Speaker 1: people I know to help you out, because you know,
Speaker 1: we like working together. And so that's what you mean
Speaker 1: by like, it's the dude that can slide that motorola
Speaker 1: two way page or two you right, Yeah, he just
Speaker 1: got something like and they're able to get shipped quick.
Speaker 1: But you got a guy quickly, yeah, quickly. And a
Speaker 1: lot of lobbies will talk about how they have many clients, right,
Speaker 1: but they'll even get their other clients to maybe help
Speaker 1: with another another thing dealing with another client, to say
Speaker 1: this is how we move like if we can put
Speaker 1: if we're all kind of sort of on a similar trajectory,
Speaker 1: then if I say we need to help this person out,
Speaker 1: we need to help this person out, because there's you know,
Speaker 1: the whole thing with it is so many um you
Speaker 1: know with members of Congress in the Senate, they're allo
Speaker 1: committees and they have specialties when it when it comes
Speaker 1: to like legislating on certain areas of interest or industries
Speaker 1: and things like that. So if you, let's say you
Speaker 1: run a for profit college, you want to look at
Speaker 1: the people who are on the education committees, and you
Speaker 1: want to look at people within the Department of Education
Speaker 1: that maybe you can talk to, but mostly the it's
Speaker 1: the it's it's the actual um politicians themselves whose influence
Speaker 1: that you want because if you have somebody on that committee,
Speaker 1: then you can kind of sway the bills that are
Speaker 1: going to affect your industry because you you're heading it
Speaker 1: off right there. Yeah, So okay, so um um, like
Speaker 1: you said, I'm um divry Institute president. I don't know,
Speaker 1: I'll just show that out of nowhere, right And I'm like, okay, Yo,
Speaker 1: they talk about I don't know, we gotta retro fit
Speaker 1: these buildings I'm gonna cost, Like you know what I'm saying.
Speaker 1: You started thinking about like how much it's gonna cost.
Speaker 1: So do I So do I hit lobbyists and go hey, Hony,
Speaker 1: like hey, who you know it's so and so, like hey,
Speaker 1: tell them dudes, like, man, I don't I won't need that.
Speaker 1: You know what I'm saying, Like what I what can
Speaker 1: I do? What can I do? Yeah? To make it?
Speaker 1: Just make make my bills a little bit smaller. Come on,
Speaker 1: like you know what I'm saying. So okay, that's dope. Okay,
Speaker 1: So now I'm getting even a more picture of like
Speaker 1: how to the two ways kind of work? Because again,
Speaker 1: if you're that kid that I could always call like
Speaker 1: the the guy that's on the end of I got
Speaker 1: a guy, right, So you're the guy. So if I'm like, oh,
Speaker 1: I got a homeboy that can like you are the homeboy. Yeah,
Speaker 1: you're the one that's like I got you, Yeah, I
Speaker 1: holl that so and so. But but that only works
Speaker 1: if you deliver. Yeah. But also the hard part is
Speaker 1: though too. I don't want to get too ahead of
Speaker 1: myself because I just back to that point, right. So,
Speaker 1: for example, and even in that example of education and
Speaker 1: like more specifically pell grants, those are things that the
Speaker 1: government spends money on to allow people like veterans or
Speaker 1: other people to get college money. But if you're putting
Speaker 1: money into like let's say a for profit college that
Speaker 1: isn't really giving people the education you need, that isn't
Speaker 1: gonna necessarily create somebody with the job skills that are
Speaker 1: hirable that can justify giving the grant, because you're the
Speaker 1: hope was the grant is going to create somebody with
Speaker 1: the job skills to enter the job market and have
Speaker 1: some upward mobility. So let's say you're of shy sty
Speaker 1: fucking for profit college and you're like, all we do
Speaker 1: is pressure these people into getting loans and ship and
Speaker 1: we laugh them out the building when they say like
Speaker 1: master's degree, and nobody hires me Like yeah you thought man. Yeah. So,
Speaker 1: for example, if let's say a committee like an education
Speaker 1: saying we need to do it, and we need to
Speaker 1: do an analysis on the efficiency of PELL grants. The
Speaker 1: last thing you fucking want is somebody looking into how
Speaker 1: inefficient that program is, because that's that's your fucking cash flow.
Speaker 1: So what do you do? If you're smart, you talk
Speaker 1: to somebody who's either running ship in the Senate or
Speaker 1: has massive influence in one of these chambers, or is
Speaker 1: you know, the chairperson of a committee, and you're like, hey,
Speaker 1: if something, if a bill like that comes across, you're
Speaker 1: dead that ship the second you see it, because that's
Speaker 1: it's gonna be ugly. Yes, So I'm but like, okay,
Speaker 1: that's dope. So if I'm if I'm the guy on
Speaker 1: this committee and I noticed crooked ass dude is hollering
Speaker 1: at me, like okay, so you've fin a dirty my rep.
Speaker 1: If I if everybody sees that this happens, or you
Speaker 1: don't give a shit, it's yeah, it's it's so on
Speaker 1: the open, it's normal. Yeah, that's the and I think,
Speaker 1: and that's why we have such a problem with it.
Speaker 1: It's not it's not a thing we're like, oh, did
Speaker 1: you see him talking to that fucking lobbyists. No, it's
Speaker 1: it's everybody is going because the same thing is going
Speaker 1: to happen. They'll they'll talk to many people and say, hey,
Speaker 1: my client would love to give you a max out
Speaker 1: donation for this next election cycle. Oh my, you know,
Speaker 1: and we were in exchange that we'd love for you
Speaker 1: to meat or you'll do some ship like if they're
Speaker 1: like nah, I'm good or whatever, you're like, we're actually
Speaker 1: gonna give you an award. You know. There's so many
Speaker 1: ways that this ship happens. Yeah, oh yeah, that's why
Speaker 1: people have these bullshit awards like that are essentially just
Speaker 1: they're they're vapor where they're just stupid things to stroke
Speaker 1: someone's ego, but really just curry more favor with somebody.
Speaker 1: And at that point, as long as you have enough
Speaker 1: sort of loyalty so to speak, it makes it easier
Speaker 1: to sort of act out the aims of your client.
Speaker 1: And that's sort of what like, you know, there's like
Speaker 1: a tired quote about sort of like you know, the
Speaker 1: one number one goal for a lobbyes like I'm just
Speaker 1: trying to get done what's best for my client no
Speaker 1: matter what. And but again it's not looked at it
Speaker 1: cynically because it's so such a normal part of the
Speaker 1: process because there is also good lobby you know, there's
Speaker 1: also stuff to say like we need things to like
Speaker 1: reform bail and I want to talk to these people,
Speaker 1: blah blah blah. But on the other side of it
Speaker 1: is when you have industries that are multibillion dollar in
Speaker 1: the stories, it also creates levels of lobbies for some
Speaker 1: people are gonna be like, oh, you want to talk
Speaker 1: to them because they control a lot of money, or
Speaker 1: they control a lot of influence, because there's ways to
Speaker 1: retaliate if you fall out of line. So that actually
Speaker 1: leads to like one of my my next question of like,
Speaker 1: is lobbying and politics just it's just inherently cursed, Like
Speaker 1: it's just bad. And I think that this example you're
Speaker 1: giving of, like there are important issues that you're trying
Speaker 1: your best to like been that person's ear. I'm wondering
Speaker 1: if it's like I mean, if it's if you're saying
Speaker 1: lobbying is so out in the open and we noticed
Speaker 1: just slash with money, what I look like appealing to
Speaker 1: this person's morality about this issue when he's like, wow,
Speaker 1: don't know this bail bond's place just offered me five
Speaker 1: million dollars. You know what I'm saying, Like, is there okay, Well,
Speaker 1: it's you know, it's not always like sort of seen
Speaker 1: as like oh, here comes this person with a bag
Speaker 1: of cash. I mean, on on some level that's sort
Speaker 1: of the subtext, but just overall, like the idea, the
Speaker 1: concept of it is to basically be able to have
Speaker 1: access to the decision makers to help sway something in
Speaker 1: one direction or another. So there is a certain benefit
Speaker 1: to lobbying too, because a lot of politicians don't have
Speaker 1: expertise in the areas of maybe like energy or criminal
Speaker 1: justice reform. So a lot of the times, if you
Speaker 1: don't have staff around you who's focused on that and
Speaker 1: knows the ins and outs, there is a benefit to
Speaker 1: hear from somebody who can offer you some insight to
Speaker 1: a very complex issue. Because we've seen how stupid these
Speaker 1: politicians are. They don't know a lot of ship so
Speaker 1: they it helps where people come through. But again that's
Speaker 1: where it gets murky, because someone can come you know,
Speaker 1: they're saying we need to look at this given issue,
Speaker 1: but at the end of the day they might just
Speaker 1: be ending up writing the whole bill and then be like,
Speaker 1: all right, now go find some people to vote for
Speaker 1: this one, um, and then off you go. Um. And
Speaker 1: that's where like a politician has also got to do
Speaker 1: a little bit of their networking as well to be
Speaker 1: able to you know, sort of find people that are
Speaker 1: going to support a given piece of legislation and move
Speaker 1: forward in the same way. Um. So it's like, yeah,
Speaker 1: it can, it can, it can. Sort of it has
Speaker 1: a broad spectrum, so it's not always you know, I
Speaker 1: think it's when a lot of scandals come out and
Speaker 1: you can actually hear what these people are sort of
Speaker 1: cynically saying out in the open um, and it sort
Speaker 1: of begins to kind of give people a clear picture
Speaker 1: of what's going on there. They make for a good villain,
Speaker 1: just like I mean, just like herschel Aali was, Yeah,
Speaker 1: he's a villain in the in the show because you
Speaker 1: knew when he showed up. You're like, oh fuck, yeah,
Speaker 1: what the fund is remy here to say? Yeah. But
Speaker 1: the part, yeah, the part that became so interesting to me,
Speaker 1: especially like again using the lens of the show, was
Speaker 1: like it's a good villain. But I'm also like God,
Speaker 1: but I like that dude, Like you're like, yeah, you know,
Speaker 1: what I'm saying. I'm like the guy that talked us
Speaker 1: into like you said, we had no business. It was
Speaker 1: this fool's idea. You know what I'm saying. That we
Speaker 1: hopped in the car right, drove all the way up
Speaker 1: to Lancaster. You know what I'm saying for this dumbass
Speaker 1: party right that. I don't know how this nigga convinced us.
Speaker 1: You know, I'm saying, but like we are, all of
Speaker 1: our lives are endangered, but damn that was kind of
Speaker 1: fun though, did Why didn't we? Yes? And it turns
Speaker 1: out they just needed to ride home. You know, You're
Speaker 1: just like you don't even know nobody there, like like
Speaker 1: how are we here? And it's like, but am I
Speaker 1: gonna call him next weekend? Yeah? Probably because he fun?
Speaker 1: Like you know, that's the part to me that I'm like,
Speaker 1: as it's such an interesting thing that happens in our
Speaker 1: and and I imagine it's I imagine, like you said,
Speaker 1: the way that you describe that kid to where you
Speaker 1: like you're the smartest person on this block. I know
Speaker 1: you angling for something. When you have an idea, you
Speaker 1: got all these reasons why, And despite my better judgment,
Speaker 1: I'm still like, god, oh, he kind of kind of
Speaker 1: makes sense though he seemed like, you know what he's
Speaker 1: talking about, you know what I'm saying, And I'm like,
Speaker 1: what a that's to me? It's like, that's a person,
Speaker 1: you know what I'm saying like that, And I feel
Speaker 1: like that kids at every tape, every lunch table. I
Speaker 1: don't care what little sub genre you in, and you
Speaker 1: know what I'm saying. But the interesting thing is like,
Speaker 1: and it's not, but there's a whole thing behind this
Speaker 1: one guy. Yeah, And that's the So it's seemingly one guy, yeah,
Speaker 1: but this person has they're they're they're hooked up, they're connected,
Speaker 1: they know, they have ways to gather, you know, Like
Speaker 1: I think that's the interesting thing is just on the
Speaker 1: other side, right, Like if a lobbyist comes and it's
Speaker 1: like saying, oh, you know, we'd love to max out
Speaker 1: to your campaign and things like that. You know that's
Speaker 1: in this very narrow example, and you start doing some
Speaker 1: ship that's going, you know, counter to what the people
Speaker 1: who gave you a check did, then you might get
Speaker 1: a someone might knock knock and pull up and say, hey,
Speaker 1: what's going on? You know? I thought we were cool
Speaker 1: that's strange because I mean, I'd hate to I'd hate
Speaker 1: for someone to primary you before your next election. That
Speaker 1: would just be awful, you know, because we you know,
Speaker 1: there's there's I heard there's a scandal with your son
Speaker 1: in law or something I just heard from because I
Speaker 1: used Lexus Nexus illegally, but I just saw some ship
Speaker 1: on there that I thought probably wouldn't be great if
Speaker 1: it came out anyway, So let us know about the
Speaker 1: next you know, the next vote that you have coming up,
Speaker 1: because there are ways to you know, get politicians who
Speaker 1: aren't in line with the aims of an industry like
Speaker 1: out like and so that's why you see a lot
Speaker 1: of especially politicians who are like have a backbone and
Speaker 1: they're just like, yo, dude, I'm I can't be bought.
Speaker 1: I'll fucking vote against your ass every time. Like no,
Speaker 1: I'm here to actually do a service for people. They
Speaker 1: don't last a lot of the time unless they're in
Speaker 1: a really insulated district because outside money, this is the
Speaker 1: other thing where lobbying comes in. There's dark money, there's
Speaker 1: super PACs and ship like that that now suddenly have
Speaker 1: all these ads popping up. You got robo calls, talking
Speaker 1: about you all this other stuff that starts destabilizing your
Speaker 1: district and your incumbency. So damn those are all kinds
Speaker 1: of you know, that's what I'm saying that So you
Speaker 1: know what I'm saying. Yeah, that's like, hey, I heard
Speaker 1: I'm just saying I just heard it, right, Like, hey,
Speaker 1: they're saying. Look, that's what they're saying. That's not what
Speaker 1: I'm saying. That's there, that's just out there. I mean,
Speaker 1: I'm saying the streets is watching. I'm like, I'm just
Speaker 1: saying for you, homie, like if you're trying to still
Speaker 1: be good, it's like I wouldn't do what you're doing
Speaker 1: right now. I wouldn't. I'm not saying, but hey man,
Speaker 1: you can do whatever the funk you want. Man, that's
Speaker 1: all good man, because we all got to meet our
Speaker 1: maker at some point. But yeah, go ahead. You're free.
Speaker 1: You're free to do what you want. And I mean
Speaker 1: it's like an exaggerated version, but that's how it works,
Speaker 1: you know. Like just when I would do like more
Speaker 1: sort of outside influence kind of things, you start thinking
Speaker 1: of like the op research you can do and looking
Speaker 1: into what you can find out if there are things
Speaker 1: to talk about if there's a like a narrative you
Speaker 1: can create to start painting somebody as an unfit leader, legislator, etcetera,
Speaker 1: and not like and that's just one of the many
Speaker 1: tools like at People's disposal. I mean, there were even
Speaker 1: times where you can straight up set politicians up, um
Speaker 1: like you know, like let's say they're gonna go speak
Speaker 1: out of high school and you start going, okay, you
Speaker 1: can see their calendar and said, okay, this is their campaign.
Speaker 1: They're about to go to this high school. Let me
Speaker 1: go find out to see if I know anybody who
Speaker 1: knows somebody who goes to the high school. And then
Speaker 1: maybe give them a camera, maybe give them some questions,
Speaker 1: maybe give them tell them to tell other kids about
Speaker 1: some things they can ask this politician because there's gonna
Speaker 1: be cameras around, and put them on the spot right
Speaker 1: there in a place they didn't think someone was gonna
Speaker 1: pop up on them and get them on camera saying
Speaker 1: some dumb ship. And then you take that sound people
Speaker 1: that you know that work in the newspaper, work in
Speaker 1: the local news, and you say, yo, I need you
Speaker 1: to run this ship because I can't believe they just
Speaker 1: said that ship out loud, I don't think this person
Speaker 1: can be it's fit for office, and then boom, you've
Speaker 1: been got. So it's there's, it's, it's it's there's so much. Yeah,
Speaker 1: that's coal is ice, and what's called about it is
Speaker 1: how normal it is. Yeah. And I think that's where
Speaker 1: I I started to get sour a little bit on
Speaker 1: it because I was like, damn, it's so fucking cynical. Um.
Speaker 1: But that's also meat. Like you know, going in two
Speaker 1: thousand and eight, two thousand nine, you know, Barack Obama,
Speaker 1: change and all this ship and thinking like, oh, yeah,
Speaker 1: it's probably it's different, or like it's something maybe moving
Speaker 1: in in the right direction that will look after working
Speaker 1: people and the marginalized. And you're like, all the people
Speaker 1: that have the most face time with these decision makers
Speaker 1: represent industries. They industries that are predicated on making sure
Speaker 1: people aren't liberated. So you you ain't gonna get to
Speaker 1: the table, no, no. And I think that's the other
Speaker 1: I think that's really the funked up part about lobbying
Speaker 1: is that it's just created this insulated world where only
Speaker 1: the biggest money is truly going to have this guy.
Speaker 1: That's why the fucking focus of Congress is so fucked
Speaker 1: up half the time, like where they're going to spend
Speaker 1: months talking about, well, we're doing debit card fees. That's
Speaker 1: because these fucking lobbyists have too much access telling you
Speaker 1: that's the be all, end all, when we're not looking
Speaker 1: at real ship like decriminalizing drugs or other things like
Speaker 1: things that it can end yeah, cultural benefit. So you
Speaker 1: know it's it. It factors into so many of the
Speaker 1: ills and you know, the suboptimal operation of our government
Speaker 1: because there's too many distractions that can be injected through
Speaker 1: lobby Okay, wow, so you gave us a lot here.
Speaker 1: So again we're back in the jew I'm learning all
Speaker 1: this stuff. We're back in the juvie. It's like, Okay,
Speaker 1: you can talk somebody into anything. Um, you got a
Speaker 1: whole network of people outside of this room. So when
Speaker 1: you say, hey, that's what I'm gonna do, you can
Speaker 1: deliver this. Um. And you also got the balls with
Speaker 1: balls whatever guts, let's not, let's not let's be gender
Speaker 1: neutral here. You got you got the guts in here
Speaker 1: that got not you know what I'm saying to like,
Speaker 1: if you gotta if you gotta pull triggers. If you
Speaker 1: gotta make a call, you know what I'm saying, if
Speaker 1: you got to run the mission on somebody to be like,
Speaker 1: this fool is not putting their work. We need to
Speaker 1: bust this discipline. And because this is what this is
Speaker 1: what I need from you. And I'm not scared of you.
Speaker 1: You know, if you're down to do that, Okay, if
Speaker 1: you got if you got the stomach to do it,
Speaker 1: then you'd probably be you could probably do this job
Speaker 1: my lap. Okay, go ahead. Oh no. Just the other
Speaker 1: thing is though, but the but more than that, these
Speaker 1: lobbyists don't have agency though, you know what I mean.
Speaker 1: They have the agency to maneuver how they have to
Speaker 1: because because at the end of the day, they answer
Speaker 1: to someone else. Answers to stimie, yeah, remi he answers
Speaker 1: to the natural gas company, conglomerate. You're gonna answer to somebody. Yeah.
Speaker 1: So that's where So that's really where it starts, is
Speaker 1: that it's like the Koch brothers. They're like, you know,
Speaker 1: if they tell you to run your ship, then it
Speaker 1: is what it is because they have the resources and
Speaker 1: they can get you. And so that's really how the
Speaker 1: lobbyist is more like the you're just the your foot
Speaker 1: soldier who you can trust thing. Yeah, yeah, but but
Speaker 1: you know they're gonna get it done. But you know
Speaker 1: they're gonna get it done. But and they're not gonna
Speaker 1: they're gonna stick to the script and they're not gonna
Speaker 1: start improving with it and fucking shut up. But at
Speaker 1: the end of the day, you know they're going to
Speaker 1: deliver on what you need, because that's really how it
Speaker 1: ends up. At the end of the day, the lobbyists
Speaker 1: will be summoned by the client to say, what is
Speaker 1: happening This person voted this way, this, this bill is
Speaker 1: getting too much? What is happening out there? What are
Speaker 1: y'all doing out there? Damn? And then so you gotta
Speaker 1: dry down to Watts and figure out what the hell
Speaker 1: happening down at Watts right exactly. And if you gotta unfortunately,
Speaker 1: do whatever the funk you gotta do and maybe not
Speaker 1: tell them how you did it, then yeah, maybe that happens,
Speaker 1: but yeah, you're your you will your career will be
Speaker 1: short if you don't deliver on those things. So that's
Speaker 1: why it can get really murky or other people get
Speaker 1: caught being really sloppy with it because they'll just do
Speaker 1: ship like bribe people and then it's like that and
Speaker 1: and that's sort of the art of it is because
Speaker 1: even though everyone knows sort of what the deal is
Speaker 1: like that obviously it's like there's money, there's it's all
Speaker 1: transactional that you never wanted to arrive to the point
Speaker 1: of like just a straight bribe because there's like rules
Speaker 1: to ship, and so ship blow up in your face
Speaker 1: real quick. So it's almost like you can never do
Speaker 1: it like that. It may seem like the most efficient
Speaker 1: way it's just maybe threatened somebody and then put a
Speaker 1: pipe bag of cash in front of him. But that's
Speaker 1: the art to it is that it's about creating all
Speaker 1: this Yeah, and you start creating all these externals like damn,
Speaker 1: somebody called CPS, aren't you? Oh yeah, dog get coming
Speaker 1: to get you out chill. Yeah, like you know, like
Speaker 1: like but you know what I mean, like how you
Speaker 1: might you know, some grimy ship you might handle with.
Speaker 1: I don't know, neighbors are weird, I don't know whatever
Speaker 1: the fuck you know. All I'm saying is there are
Speaker 1: ways to ship. Happened that isn't coming from you, but
Speaker 1: it's coming from you. Damn, Miles, that's a cold piece.
Speaker 1: And I see why. You was like, I think I'll
Speaker 1: start podcasting, yeah, just like comedy better. Like I was just, yeah,
Speaker 1: it's more fun to be funny. Yeah. Because I started
Speaker 1: out as an organizer, Yeah, because I liked talking to people.
Speaker 1: I liked just you know, I could go to a
Speaker 1: college campus and start being like, Okay, let me talk
Speaker 1: to MITCHA, let me talk to like the Black student Union,
Speaker 1: let me talk to this group of kids, let me
Speaker 1: talk to the group of whatever it is. Because the
Speaker 1: first campaign I worked on was one for like renewable energy,
Speaker 1: and I was doing a lot of like campus organizing
Speaker 1: for this, like ballot proposition in California to try and
Speaker 1: get the energy mix like way super high, like and
Speaker 1: be like sort of first in the nation with renewables.
Speaker 1: And it was fun and I really like doing that.
Speaker 1: I liked talking to people, like educating people. I like
Speaker 1: to see that moment where like ship clicks and they're
Speaker 1: like right, if we do this, like this helps the environment,
Speaker 1: it is good for jobs, and like wow, the way
Speaker 1: we make energy is so inefficient, like this is great,
Speaker 1: Like I'm I'm motivated, and so I really liked doing that.
Speaker 1: I really like speaking to people and and sort of
Speaker 1: being able to influence them like that. So yeah, after
Speaker 1: this um this campaign with this ballot initiative, like a
Speaker 1: political strategy firm reached out through like other people that
Speaker 1: I knew in politics and offered me a job to
Speaker 1: work at this political strategy lobbying firm. And at that
Speaker 1: point I was like, this is this could be dope,
Speaker 1: Like you know, this is uh, this is an opportunity
Speaker 1: I wouldn't get otherwise, Like I had no job prospects
Speaker 1: because I graduated college in two thousand seven, and I
Speaker 1: felt like, oh, this is something I can do and
Speaker 1: apply like my knowledge of history and like, you know,
Speaker 1: my desire to for a more equitable future. Like oh ship,
Speaker 1: I didn't even I always thought I would do comedy
Speaker 1: and stuff, but this might offer me an opportunity to
Speaker 1: do something really worthwhile. And then I, you know, quickly
Speaker 1: realized like I'm on the side of the I'm on
Speaker 1: the dark side. Okay, So I guess lastly would be
Speaker 1: like all right, so you got in on the organizing side,
Speaker 1: which you know, especially like with a lot of the
Speaker 1: young homies that I'm interfacing in like that part still
Speaker 1: brings them life. It feels encouraging, It feels like you're
Speaker 1: doing something, and you know, I can even think about
Speaker 1: the times that like, you know, you feel like when
Speaker 1: you it doesn't you're not doing anything if you're not
Speaker 1: at the table, Like it feels like that sometimes, you know.
Speaker 1: But you know, now coming out the other end of that,
Speaker 1: I know, I know that's not necessarily how it works.
Speaker 1: I understand, you know, stakeholders and stuff like that. Like
Speaker 1: I get it now, but it took a few years too.
Speaker 1: Took a lot of years to get to that place.
Speaker 1: What would you say to some young sort of like
Speaker 1: excited you know, future activists, Like again, we're still in
Speaker 1: this juvenile all year, you know what I'm saying. That's like, like,
Speaker 1: what would you say to that kid as far as
Speaker 1: like because again, some of the one one of the
Speaker 1: main purposes of the show is like I want to
Speaker 1: on board kids like me and you that look just
Speaker 1: like me and you into politics, you know what I'm saying,
Speaker 1: So like, what would you say to them? Yeah, organize
Speaker 1: your block. You know, if you look, there's gonna be
Speaker 1: the companies that spend so much money bombarding people with
Speaker 1: ads and ship like that, and that works. You know,
Speaker 1: we've seen that that works. That misinformation and you know,
Speaker 1: propaganda for lack of a better work that it works. Um,
Speaker 1: And but there's also something to being able to mobilize
Speaker 1: your community and get your community intact and in touch
Speaker 1: with what's at stake. So yeah, while maybe running for
Speaker 1: office is really glamorous, I think if you could say,
Speaker 1: if I told if I just went around and made
Speaker 1: three calls, I could get a hundred of my neighbors
Speaker 1: to show up somewhere. Damn. Yeah, that's real power. That's real.
Speaker 1: That's real power. Because I'll tell you this, lobbyists pay
Speaker 1: for that kind of ship. They pay. That's that's why
Speaker 1: they call lobbyists pay for that kind of ship. Listen,
Speaker 1: that's what I'm saying. Look here, you hear that little
Speaker 1: how many like that that out you got on your block,
Speaker 1: that shot call it level you got on your block
Speaker 1: where you could make a call, get forty five fifty
Speaker 1: heads onto the block right now. Lobbyists pay for that
Speaker 1: for that, That's what And that's what happened with Obamacare,
Speaker 1: you know, the Affordable Care Act. We had all this
Speaker 1: astroturfing going on, which means astroturfing is fake grassroots. It's
Speaker 1: fake it in grassroots the ship that we're I'm trying,
Speaker 1: we're talking about that, we're trying to you know, get
Speaker 1: people on to really organize, like your neighborhood or you're
Speaker 1: a group of people your you know, your community. That's grassroots.
Speaker 1: When they have these people showing up in costumes looking
Speaker 1: like in seventeen seventy six and ship with their gags
Speaker 1: and flags, and that's bullshit. That's paid that's paid less
Speaker 1: because that and you talk to the people that are there,
Speaker 1: they don't know why they're there. They oh, man, it's
Speaker 1: all cap okay exactly. But you see some ship where
Speaker 1: and again, this is what happened last summer. You saw
Speaker 1: even organically, people just kind of knew, all, no, this
Speaker 1: is this isn't some ship. I'm just gonna stand idly
Speaker 1: by for I'm gonna get out in the streets. And
Speaker 1: that's that. God. People shook it to see that people
Speaker 1: were organized, even organically, that they could just in numbers
Speaker 1: show up in physical space to say we don't agree
Speaker 1: with this or we don't like this. It's a it's
Speaker 1: a lot different when you just get emails or calls.
Speaker 1: You can ignore that ship. You see, you see bodies
Speaker 1: in physical space. It's a whole other thing. And so
Speaker 1: that's why I give it up to organizers. That ship
Speaker 1: is so hard and in the most you know, high
Speaker 1: stakes situations, organizers have come through to organize people to
Speaker 1: properly know them about their own voting situations or to
Speaker 1: know about like even if, for example, getting Jackie Lacey's
Speaker 1: ass out as d A, a lot of people didn't
Speaker 1: know because they go, what's this a black woman and
Speaker 1: she's a Democrat, and we all, yeah, look like no,
Speaker 1: she's protecting the fucking cops. She does. But the problem
Speaker 1: is we don't connect enough people with the outrage. So
Speaker 1: if people and and you know a lot of people
Speaker 1: suddenly were like because the last summer, they're like, hmm
Speaker 1: right there, let me look into it. Yeah, how do
Speaker 1: cops keep getting away with this? Oh? Because the city
Speaker 1: won't prosecute because they have a relationship with p D.
Speaker 1: And that's how it works. But when people figured it
Speaker 1: out now suddenly're like, oh, no, no, no, we don't
Speaker 1: need this. She gotta go. Yeah. So that's that's real power,
Speaker 1: is like connecting people to their own power because too
Speaker 1: many of us are apathetic or just feel so fucking
Speaker 1: disillusioned and powerless over the thing. And I get it
Speaker 1: because you will look out there and you say, how
Speaker 1: the fuck do we not have any kind of proper
Speaker 1: you know, let's say, even gun legislations where we're just
Speaker 1: trying to say, let's keep kids safe at schools. Just
Speaker 1: that's simple, that's simple. But somehow these politicians are like, well,
Speaker 1: they're starting to about they don't know about that ship.
Speaker 1: But that's because the lobbyists got to them and they
Speaker 1: know that if they don't, the n r A can
Speaker 1: damn sure get a bunch of people to leave angry
Speaker 1: voicemails and ship like that. And that's that's really one
Speaker 1: of the ways that they're just scared. They're scared of
Speaker 1: people showing up. So if you can get people to
Speaker 1: show up, or if you can at least get people
Speaker 1: to get on the same page if you that's fucking
Speaker 1: that's real power. And at the end of the day,
Speaker 1: even if you're getting violated by the police or the
Speaker 1: fucking city or what things like that, if your network
Speaker 1: is that tight, you can help each other out. There's
Speaker 1: ways to figure there's ways to actually support your community
Speaker 1: because everyone is so networked and knows, you know, sort
Speaker 1: of what's at stake. So I I honestly think, you know,
Speaker 1: if you can, if you have the ability to get
Speaker 1: your community together and get them in touch with the
Speaker 1: things that are actually really important to your future, and
Speaker 1: get them to understand that, like going places and and
Speaker 1: and supporting each other and and protesting and things like that,
Speaker 1: that's that that's real fucking power. And that's unfortunately, that's
Speaker 1: why you see, especially conservatives, they always accuse uh, you know,
Speaker 1: people of color or whatever, or anyone who's out there, progressives,
Speaker 1: leftists who've come out to support a cause. They say, oh,
Speaker 1: they're paid. They're paid. They're paid because that's what they do.
Speaker 1: And the left does it too. The Democrats will do
Speaker 1: it too here and there. But not enough people can
Speaker 1: get connected with the outrage for them to show up
Speaker 1: for healthcare. I mean, now, with all the propaganda and misinformation,
Speaker 1: they are definitely are showing up, but that's for like
Speaker 1: a whole other funked up reason that they're not even
Speaker 1: really sure of. But to connect people to that sort
Speaker 1: of sense of purpose, that's again, that's the real power.
Speaker 1: And again, and you know what, you might be one
Speaker 1: of those people who sells your community out because someone said, hey,
Speaker 1: if you can get people here, I'll give you sixty dollars.
Speaker 1: You know, but it is money, I guess. But yeah, wow, Miles,
Speaker 1: I think this might be shaping up as one of
Speaker 1: the most important episodes we've done. I appreciate you so
Speaker 1: much for taking his time. Oh yeah, anytime, anytime. I
Speaker 1: mean I haven't even barely scratched the surface. Dark Dark
Speaker 1: Money a whole other episode. That's a whole other episode.
Speaker 1: We okay, we're gonna do dark Money. Damn yeh come
Speaker 1: back because it's really fucked up again, you know, we do.
Speaker 1: You hear the term lobbyists, and it's a really nebulous term,
Speaker 1: like it can mean so many things, but essentially it's
Speaker 1: about groups that try to exert influence on decision makers
Speaker 1: and it happens in many different ways. But to know
Speaker 1: that when we're trying to actually further bills and things
Speaker 1: like that, you look at even people like Joe Manchin
Speaker 1: and Kirsten Cinema who are in the Senate right now,
Speaker 1: who are holding a lot of even just the most
Speaker 1: basic ship like voting bills back. Yeah, there. The reason
Speaker 1: they're not budging is because someone's in their ear. No
Speaker 1: one is knowing. They don't have a real ideological argument
Speaker 1: against although they'll try and articulate one, but it's that's
Speaker 1: not what's going on. It's that there is just a
Speaker 1: complex network of influencers that work on, you know, the
Speaker 1: realities of these politicians that keep them sort of in line.
Speaker 1: And it was the same thing you heard. I don't
Speaker 1: know if you saw those leaked um I think it's
Speaker 1: ex on mobile calls that came out from the BBC
Speaker 1: or that one that one lobbyist straight up says, yeah,
Speaker 1: oh yeah, we work with Joe Manchin all the time,
Speaker 1: and like, yeah, we know what time it is, Like
Speaker 1: that's how it works. He just said it out loud
Speaker 1: like that, that's our dude. Yeah yeah, oh yeah, we
Speaker 1: love them. Yeah, we work with a great guy, great guy.
Speaker 1: Yeah yeah, we're working on something else with them right now.
Speaker 1: It's like, that's that's how it all. It all comes together.
Speaker 1: And I think if people knew that it wasn't just
Speaker 1: like these tired ass politicians making decisions and that that
Speaker 1: there's people just kind of fucking pushing them around until
Speaker 1: them like a better deliciou, it would be a lot
Speaker 1: easier to figure out that, like, oh, we actually need
Speaker 1: a lot of reform, especially as it relates to a
Speaker 1: campaign finance and things like that, because it's not a
Speaker 1: level playing field. Facts. I'm blown away, bro, I'm blown away.
Speaker 1: Thank you again, Miles, Thank you for having me yo
Speaker 1: show tow to uh the way they can find us
Speaker 1: and all that good Miles of Gray Twitter, Instagram, Go
Speaker 1: to check out the Daily Zeitgeist. That's a daily politics
Speaker 1: news culture, you know, comedy show I do every day. Uh.
Speaker 1: And if you and if you need something not so heavy,
Speaker 1: check and you like ninety day Fiance. I got a
Speaker 1: ninety day fiance podcast called four D Fiance where we're
Speaker 1: smoking on that TLC pack and it's it's a good
Speaker 1: old time. I gotta, I gotta. I got a big
Speaker 1: dark money pack over here. Smoke on? Did we can
Speaker 1: smoke on? All right? Well man, Thank you again. Appreciate you, y'all.
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