WEBVTT - Thursday Therapy: The Good Anxiety 0:00:01.920 --> 0:00:05.359 Wind Down with Janet Kramer and I'm Heart Radio Podcast. 0:00:06.720 --> 0:00:10.240 This week's Thursday Therapy, We've got Yasmin Shan. She has 0:00:10.320 --> 0:00:13.160 a book out called Wisdom of the Path, The Beautiful 0:00:13.160 --> 0:00:16.079 and Bumpy Ride to Healing and Trusting our Inner Guide. 0:00:16.200 --> 0:00:16.840 Let's get her on. 0:00:18.000 --> 0:00:21.640 I am so excited to talk to you. I feel 0:00:21.680 --> 0:00:24.920 like this is coming at such a good time because 0:00:25.239 --> 0:00:29.520 I find myself taking just really heavy deep breaths all 0:00:29.560 --> 0:00:33.159 the time. And I just had my uh, I had 0:00:33.200 --> 0:00:35.640 just I just had a third baby in my pelvic floor. 0:00:35.720 --> 0:00:37.440 Lady just came over and she's like, I need you 0:00:37.560 --> 0:00:40.040 just to first take a deep breath. And I'm like, oh, okay, 0:00:40.400 --> 0:00:44.879 So you feel the you feel the tension, I know. 0:00:44.960 --> 0:00:49.800 So I'm excited about your book because I think for me, 0:00:49.920 --> 0:00:52.320 one of the hardest things, especially in the early beginning 0:00:52.400 --> 0:00:56.640 of my healing journey, was actually trusting myself in it. 0:00:58.640 --> 0:01:00.640 Now I feel like I trust myself a lot more, 0:01:00.680 --> 0:01:02.880 But in the beginning, it's like it's a new way 0:01:03.040 --> 0:01:06.920 of being that it's it's weird. So how do you 0:01:07.400 --> 0:01:10.440 for the people that are just on this new journey 0:01:10.440 --> 0:01:13.920 of healing and trusting themselves, how do you even trust 0:01:13.959 --> 0:01:16.600 yourself when you're not even sure what to trust around you. 0:01:17.520 --> 0:01:18.839 Oh my gosh, that's such a good question. 0:01:18.880 --> 0:01:21.120 I think that's the hardest part, and it's one of 0:01:21.120 --> 0:01:24.240 the reasons I wrote this book, because when we make mistakes, 0:01:24.400 --> 0:01:29.120 we often tear ourselves up so badly that we are 0:01:29.240 --> 0:01:31.520 unwilling to take another chance on ourselves. 0:01:31.560 --> 0:01:32.920 We say, oh, I don't know if I want to 0:01:32.959 --> 0:01:34.520 take another chance on love. I don't know if I 0:01:34.560 --> 0:01:36.400 want to change my career. I'm not sure what can happen. 0:01:36.920 --> 0:01:38.800 But I think that we really are afraid that we're 0:01:38.800 --> 0:01:41.160 going to make the wrong choice again. And the worst 0:01:41.160 --> 0:01:44.080 part about that is the disappointment in knowing. 0:01:43.800 --> 0:01:45.560 That we thought it was the right thing to do. 0:01:45.680 --> 0:01:48.960 So Unfortunately, the only way that we can learn to 0:01:48.960 --> 0:01:52.240 trust ourselves is by taking that risk. Through it, we 0:01:52.360 --> 0:01:56.360 learn wow, that gut feeling was telling me no, got it, 0:01:56.920 --> 0:02:00.720 Or we learn that was actually which and pushing me 0:02:00.800 --> 0:02:01.520 to move forward. 0:02:01.600 --> 0:02:04.280 It's through the experience, it's through the lessons. 0:02:04.320 --> 0:02:06.880 It's through the tough times that we gain the wisdom 0:02:06.920 --> 0:02:08.600 that leads us forward in the first place. 0:02:10.000 --> 0:02:12.239 It's so interesting that you say that, because I think 0:02:12.639 --> 0:02:16.160 I definitely felt that with my my new relationship. In 0:02:16.200 --> 0:02:18.840 the very beginning stages, I'm like, Okay, it feels different, 0:02:19.280 --> 0:02:21.400 but I'm so afraid to trust it because I don't 0:02:21.440 --> 0:02:24.000 want to look like a fool again that I jumped 0:02:24.000 --> 0:02:27.359 into something and it's like, oh, I'm proven to be 0:02:27.639 --> 0:02:30.919 you know, I picked wrong again, or and it's that 0:02:32.040 --> 0:02:34.399 murky kind of feeling like I don't want to look 0:02:34.440 --> 0:02:37.960 like a fool, especially because publicly, you know, I'll be made. 0:02:37.800 --> 0:02:39.080 To look like that again. 0:02:40.760 --> 0:02:44.480 But there's something too that you're right, like in people 0:02:44.480 --> 0:02:46.280 will always be like, well, how do you know? How 0:02:46.280 --> 0:02:49.400 do you trust again? It's like I'd rather try to 0:02:49.400 --> 0:02:50.880 trust again than never trust again. 0:02:52.680 --> 0:02:55.800 And I think especially when you're talking about relationships, romantic relationships, 0:02:55.800 --> 0:02:59.880 but even if friendships. I think that when we when 0:03:00.040 --> 0:03:02.679 someone turns out to be different than we thought they were. 0:03:02.760 --> 0:03:05.120 When they feel like the rug was literally pulled from under. 0:03:05.000 --> 0:03:07.080 Us and it's like you're a completely different person than 0:03:07.080 --> 0:03:09.880 I thought you were, or in hindsight, we think, actually, 0:03:09.880 --> 0:03:12.160 there were tons of signs telling me that this person 0:03:12.240 --> 0:03:14.600 was not for me, and I was maybe ignoring it, 0:03:14.960 --> 0:03:17.400 maybe afraid to admit it to myself, hoping they would 0:03:17.440 --> 0:03:20.160 change all the things that we all do, and I 0:03:20.200 --> 0:03:24.640 think reminding ourselves in romantic relationships that I deserve love 0:03:25.000 --> 0:03:27.560 and I deserve to be in a relationship with someone 0:03:27.560 --> 0:03:30.320 who is providing healthy love, and if this feels. 0:03:30.040 --> 0:03:32.680 Healthy to me, I'm going to follow. 0:03:32.360 --> 0:03:35.400 That until I see red flags, and I'm going to 0:03:35.480 --> 0:03:38.280 follow it with intention. I'm not just going to blindly 0:03:38.360 --> 0:03:40.680 jump into a relationship. I'm going to ask questions the 0:03:40.760 --> 0:03:42.960 questions I was too afraid to ask the last time. 0:03:43.480 --> 0:03:47.320 I'm going to take my time getting to know them, 0:03:47.440 --> 0:03:50.160 versus ignoring all the things that are telling me that 0:03:50.200 --> 0:03:51.640 they're not being an open book with me. 0:03:51.800 --> 0:03:52.960 Like, we have to be. 0:03:53.000 --> 0:03:55.920 Willing to give ourselves the benefit of the doubt, and 0:03:55.960 --> 0:03:59.520 I think even in romantic relationships and friendships, give ourselves 0:03:59.560 --> 0:04:02.800 grace because sometimes people are pretending to be someone that 0:04:02.840 --> 0:04:06.520 they're not, and with all the questions and all the experience, 0:04:06.560 --> 0:04:09.800 we still might find ourselves in a relationship with someone who's. 0:04:09.560 --> 0:04:11.880 Not aligned with who we would want in our lives, 0:04:11.880 --> 0:04:14.840 and we couldn't have we couldn't have seen it otherwise. 0:04:15.240 --> 0:04:18.000 Yeah. No, that piece is so huge to the being 0:04:18.000 --> 0:04:21.880 fooled again, because I think there's a piece where in 0:04:21.920 --> 0:04:25.040 the healing journey to be able to go all right. 0:04:26.040 --> 0:04:29.600 I trust myself enough to be able to you know, 0:04:29.720 --> 0:04:32.080 to move forward in this, but I don't. I feel 0:04:32.080 --> 0:04:37.120 like early on if you don't so like, Okay, if 0:04:37.120 --> 0:04:40.400 I was to look back on my ex relationship, I'd 0:04:40.400 --> 0:04:42.200 have been like, oh, I had all the gut signs 0:04:42.560 --> 0:04:44.840 to not trust this person, but I, you know, it 0:04:44.920 --> 0:04:48.640 was like it's okay, it's all good, everything's fine, and 0:04:48.760 --> 0:04:52.160 I wasn't blindsided. I think I would be massively blindsided 0:04:52.320 --> 0:04:55.280 and if anything were to ever happen in my relationship now, 0:04:55.320 --> 0:04:58.880 because I don't have any of those signs. But I 0:04:58.920 --> 0:05:02.080 think that's a piece of that healing too, because when 0:05:02.240 --> 0:05:04.800 I look back on even guys that I dated post divorce, 0:05:04.880 --> 0:05:07.040 I'm like, oh, well that was a you know, he 0:05:07.120 --> 0:05:09.520 wasn't matching his words and actions and he lied about this, 0:05:09.680 --> 0:05:14.480 or you know, it's I wouldn't have continued dating someone 0:05:14.760 --> 0:05:17.120 like that because I've done the work to go all right. 0:05:17.200 --> 0:05:19.400 That's that's not aligning with what I want and how 0:05:19.440 --> 0:05:21.520 it's going to most likely probably end too. It's not 0:05:21.560 --> 0:05:25.359 going to be a good relationship. So I think a 0:05:25.360 --> 0:05:27.400 lot of times like what is what is some of 0:05:27.440 --> 0:05:31.479 your biggest tips in your book to have that intuition 0:05:31.760 --> 0:05:34.719 to trust, to keep going, and to trust yourself. 0:05:35.880 --> 0:05:37.720 I talk about this in my book in terms of 0:05:37.760 --> 0:05:40.280 like I've been divorced, I'm I'm married again. 0:05:40.320 --> 0:05:41.120 I've been married for. 0:05:42.560 --> 0:05:46.520 Wow, almost a decade now. And I think that when 0:05:46.839 --> 0:05:48.760 you meet someone and I was a single mom, I 0:05:48.800 --> 0:05:50.760 don't know if you had that experience, but like it's 0:05:50.760 --> 0:05:54.479 a whole new ballgame and you're dating with kids because 0:05:54.480 --> 0:05:57.480 it's like you cannot come in and jack this up, 0:05:59.279 --> 0:06:02.960 so you just can't. So you know when we are 0:06:04.000 --> 0:06:05.680 even if you're not dating and you're listening to this 0:06:05.760 --> 0:06:08.200 and you're in a situation where I thought I knew 0:06:08.200 --> 0:06:11.800 what I was getting myself into before I didn't, And 0:06:11.839 --> 0:06:14.480 now I want to trust myself again, and how can 0:06:14.520 --> 0:06:18.040 I really allow it in I think one of the 0:06:18.720 --> 0:06:20.640 really interesting things we can do is. 0:06:20.600 --> 0:06:22.360 Get curious with ourselves. 0:06:22.800 --> 0:06:25.920 We're often looking for the validation that we're doing the 0:06:26.040 --> 0:06:27.280 right thing in other people. 0:06:27.440 --> 0:06:28.840 We're looking for the right flags. 0:06:29.040 --> 0:06:31.279 We're looking for them to show up with particular behavior, 0:06:31.320 --> 0:06:32.440 which I think is important. 0:06:32.720 --> 0:06:34.760 We want to see people showing up and being who 0:06:34.760 --> 0:06:35.479 they say they are. 0:06:35.760 --> 0:06:38.200 But get curious within yourself. How do I feel when 0:06:38.200 --> 0:06:41.240 I'm around them? I think in previous relationships, if I'm 0:06:41.279 --> 0:06:45.080 honest with myself, even friendships, I didn't feel comfortable with 0:06:45.200 --> 0:06:48.560 certain people that I was trying to make it work with, 0:06:49.120 --> 0:06:51.520 and I was paying attention to what they were doing. Okay, 0:06:51.560 --> 0:06:54.040 they showed up great this time. Maybe I'm maybe I'm 0:06:54.240 --> 0:06:57.000 maybe I'm overreacting. They did the thing this time, they 0:06:57.000 --> 0:06:59.200 got me a gift. Oh my gosh, maybe I'm you know, 0:06:59.440 --> 0:07:02.960 wrong about them. But in my gut, if I was 0:07:03.040 --> 0:07:06.040 being curious, it's myself. I feel nervous when I'm around them. 0:07:06.080 --> 0:07:09.880 I feel anxious when I'm around them. I'm always on eggshells. 0:07:10.080 --> 0:07:14.600 And so if we just lead with curiosity when we're 0:07:14.640 --> 0:07:17.600 trying again, when we're trying to put ourselves out there again, 0:07:17.640 --> 0:07:19.760 when we're trying to learn to trust ourselves. 0:07:19.440 --> 0:07:24.200 Again, we'll learn that our bodies actually give us a lot. 0:07:24.080 --> 0:07:27.120 Of information and that it is safe to trust ourselves 0:07:27.200 --> 0:07:28.680 because our bodies are telling us. 0:07:28.600 --> 0:07:29.280 How we feel. 0:07:29.840 --> 0:07:33.640 And when we follow those breadcrumbs, we often get that 0:07:34.480 --> 0:07:38.600 hopefully compassionate truth that yes, this is aligned or this isn't. 0:07:39.440 --> 0:07:41.000 And I know it's hard when I'm saying it in 0:07:41.040 --> 0:07:42.400 that way, people are like, oh my god, I feel 0:07:42.400 --> 0:07:45.040 so many things in my body. It does take time, 0:07:45.120 --> 0:07:48.280 and it does take patience, and it does, and I'll 0:07:48.320 --> 0:07:50.960 be honest. For me, I teach this work and I 0:07:51.040 --> 0:07:53.920 still feel like for myself, it's a lifelong journey in 0:07:54.640 --> 0:07:57.000 giving myself the grace to be human and know that 0:07:57.560 --> 0:07:59.120 it's not always going to work out the way that 0:07:59.160 --> 0:07:59.559 I hope. 0:07:59.720 --> 0:07:59.920 You know. 0:08:00.960 --> 0:08:02.320 That's such an important piece too. 0:08:02.400 --> 0:08:04.680 The listening to your body, because I remember I this 0:08:04.720 --> 0:08:07.480 is when I was in the dating phases post divorce, 0:08:07.520 --> 0:08:09.840 and I went to therapy and I told my therapist 0:08:09.880 --> 0:08:11.480 and I was like, oh, I'm like I'm just having 0:08:11.520 --> 0:08:13.400 so much anxiety. And she's like, all right, well let's 0:08:13.480 --> 0:08:15.400 let's talk it out. And I was like, you know, 0:08:15.440 --> 0:08:18.000 I got I got done with anxiety, and now I'm 0:08:18.000 --> 0:08:19.960 having it again, Like this is so frustrating. So when 0:08:19.960 --> 0:08:23.520 we started to piece it together, it was every time 0:08:23.560 --> 0:08:26.400 I was around the guy that I was dating, and 0:08:26.440 --> 0:08:28.640 I was like, I'm like, okay, so can we do 0:08:28.680 --> 0:08:31.360 some emdr to like fix this anxiety. She's like no, 0:08:31.560 --> 0:08:34.000 She's like, listen to your body. Your body is telling 0:08:34.080 --> 0:08:36.280 you that you either you're not safe or like, what 0:08:36.440 --> 0:08:37.679 is the and I'm like, and then so the when 0:08:37.720 --> 0:08:39.480 we talked about it, I was like, whoa, I don't 0:08:39.520 --> 0:08:41.960 feel you know, I don't feel like I can trust this. 0:08:42.320 --> 0:08:44.200 And so she's like, that is your sign. She's like, 0:08:44.200 --> 0:08:46.280 you have to listen to your body. She's like, that's 0:08:46.320 --> 0:08:48.480 the piece of anxiety. We don't want to go away. 0:08:48.679 --> 0:08:50.840 She's like, because when that comes up, you have to go, Okay, 0:08:50.840 --> 0:08:53.120 what about this place feels unsafe? What about this person 0:08:53.160 --> 0:08:57.000 feels unsafe? What is making me feel you know, not certain? 0:08:57.280 --> 0:08:59.920 Like those are the pieces. She's like, that's the piece 0:09:00.080 --> 0:09:02.240 anxiety that you want to keep, you know, is the 0:09:02.559 --> 0:09:04.560 parts of listening to your body. And that was just 0:09:05.440 --> 0:09:08.960 so interesting to me because I've never really placed that 0:09:09.160 --> 0:09:11.160 in that kind of situation. I just thought I was like, Oh, 0:09:11.160 --> 0:09:13.600 it's me, I'm a problem. I have anxiety. 0:09:14.400 --> 0:09:17.320 Yeah, And we can light to ourselves for so long, right, Like, 0:09:17.920 --> 0:09:21.240 we can meet someone that sounds amazing, and we'll begin 0:09:21.320 --> 0:09:24.200 to operate in that relationship the exact same way that 0:09:24.240 --> 0:09:27.160 we've seen our parents operate in relationships or people in. 0:09:27.120 --> 0:09:29.040 The past or friends, and so we'll. 0:09:28.960 --> 0:09:31.120 Light to ourselves and when I say lie, I don't 0:09:31.160 --> 0:09:35.040 mean like intentionally, like unconsciously, we are lying to ourselves 0:09:35.040 --> 0:09:37.760 that everything is great, because if we were honest, we'd 0:09:37.800 --> 0:09:40.520 have to leave. So we start to like, oh, you know, 0:09:41.440 --> 0:09:44.680 like gaze over things, and we don't really tell ourselves 0:09:44.679 --> 0:09:48.199 the truth. But our body cannot. Our body will continue 0:09:48.240 --> 0:09:50.960 to like blaze that red flag. Our body will continue 0:09:51.000 --> 0:09:54.160 to found these alarms. If you're around people and you 0:09:54.200 --> 0:09:58.680 feel nervous, you feel shaky, you feel egg shelly, you 0:09:58.679 --> 0:10:00.280 don't feel like you can be yourself. Oh, if you 0:10:00.320 --> 0:10:02.920 don't feel like you can say hard things or have 0:10:03.000 --> 0:10:08.360 tough conversations, being uncomfortable is completely different than not feeling safe. 0:10:08.400 --> 0:10:09.480 We all feel uncomfortable. 0:10:09.559 --> 0:10:11.920 We have tough conversations, even with the people we trust, 0:10:12.080 --> 0:10:15.120 because it's you know, nobody wants to have tough conversations. 0:10:15.559 --> 0:10:19.800 But feeling like you aren't safe saying something being yourself, 0:10:20.200 --> 0:10:22.480 that's completely different. And it doesn't have to be physical 0:10:22.559 --> 0:10:24.960 abuse for you to feel unsafe. It can just be 0:10:25.120 --> 0:10:29.760 an emotionally unsafe environment for you, and it may be 0:10:29.840 --> 0:10:32.679 great for somebody else, but honoring that it's not. 0:10:32.720 --> 0:10:35.200 Working for you is how we learn to trust ourselves. 0:10:35.280 --> 0:10:38.320 The moment that we choose ourselves and we don't ignore, 0:10:38.400 --> 0:10:41.000 because unfortunately, you know what we do ignore, we're kind 0:10:41.040 --> 0:10:42.640 of betraying ourselves. 0:10:43.160 --> 0:10:43.959 We all do it. 0:10:44.200 --> 0:10:47.360 So it's like, give yourself that grace and give yourself 0:10:47.360 --> 0:10:50.280 that self forgiveness, like I was doing the best that 0:10:50.320 --> 0:10:53.040 I could in that moment, and then move forward knowing 0:10:53.440 --> 0:10:55.680 but my body knows, and I can remember how my 0:10:55.720 --> 0:10:59.400 body knew, and I trust that I'll choose myself the 0:10:59.440 --> 0:11:02.480 next time I have a choice between myself and someone else. 0:11:02.840 --> 0:11:05.040 Right when was it for you that you kind of 0:11:05.040 --> 0:11:06.560 had that wisdom aha moment? 0:11:07.960 --> 0:11:10.640 The first time that that moment happened for me, I 0:11:10.679 --> 0:11:15.360 would say, when I was going through my divorce, I 0:11:15.440 --> 0:11:19.240 don't think that there's anything because when you get married, 0:11:20.200 --> 0:11:22.080 and I know that this is going to sound really naive, 0:11:22.160 --> 0:11:23.560 but you really think. 0:11:23.840 --> 0:11:28.920 That this is it. And when someone begins to. 0:11:30.360 --> 0:11:33.160 When it doesn't work the way that you imagined, and 0:11:33.240 --> 0:11:35.520 when things start to fall apart, the first thing that 0:11:35.559 --> 0:11:37.080 you start to ask yourself. 0:11:36.760 --> 0:11:40.120 Is how did I get here? How am I here? 0:11:40.640 --> 0:11:42.920 And I think when I started to ask myself that question, 0:11:43.440 --> 0:11:47.120 I realized and I posted about this yesterday. I was 0:11:47.160 --> 0:11:50.679 trying to make things work. And if I'm honest with 0:11:50.800 --> 0:11:53.800 myself and I look back, it could have fallen apart 0:11:53.840 --> 0:11:55.720 before I got to marriage. It could have fallen apart 0:11:55.720 --> 0:11:58.200 before I chose a certain career. But I was really 0:11:58.280 --> 0:12:01.040 holding on, like clinching, like I'm going to make this work. 0:12:01.760 --> 0:12:05.240 And I think that that first moment of wisdom for 0:12:05.320 --> 0:12:08.360 me was, first of all, let things go when they 0:12:08.360 --> 0:12:12.480 want to go, let them go. But secondly, if it's 0:12:12.520 --> 0:12:15.480 not meant to be, if it's not aligned, it's going 0:12:15.520 --> 0:12:18.240 to end. So it would it's going to be painful, 0:12:18.840 --> 0:12:21.959 but it would be easier and better for myself if 0:12:21.960 --> 0:12:26.800 I choose myself as early as I know that it's 0:12:26.880 --> 0:12:30.680 time to let something go, rather than wait and try 0:12:30.720 --> 0:12:33.959 to make something work that it's clear it's not already working. 0:12:33.960 --> 0:12:35.960 So that was probably the first time for me that 0:12:36.040 --> 0:12:39.439 I really begin to realize I already have the wisdom 0:12:39.520 --> 0:12:42.840 in me. I'll just be honest and say, though I 0:12:42.880 --> 0:12:46.360 was like, I'm scared because what I think I want 0:12:46.640 --> 0:12:49.600 and what i'm the signs i'm getting and what my 0:12:49.640 --> 0:12:51.320 body's telling me I want are not the same. 0:12:51.440 --> 0:12:54.400 So how am I going to find what's really for me? 0:12:54.480 --> 0:12:56.440 Because I've never even done this, nor have I seen 0:12:56.480 --> 0:12:59.200 anyone done this before. I've never seen anyone in a 0:12:59.280 --> 0:13:02.480 relationship with they felt like they were aligned and with 0:13:02.600 --> 0:13:03.280 the person. 0:13:03.040 --> 0:13:05.640 That they were supposed to be with. So it was this. 0:13:05.720 --> 0:13:10.240 Very conflicting feeling of recognizing I trust myself and also 0:13:11.040 --> 0:13:13.720 I have never seen this done before, and I'm terrified 0:13:13.720 --> 0:13:15.040 of what this is going to look like if I 0:13:15.040 --> 0:13:16.160 put myself out there again. 0:13:28.960 --> 0:13:30.560 Well, I think there's that piece, and I think there's 0:13:30.559 --> 0:13:33.640 also in this day and age, I feel like it's 0:13:33.640 --> 0:13:37.760 hard to let go because of perception of things, right, 0:13:37.880 --> 0:13:40.320 So like you might be holding on, like I know 0:13:40.440 --> 0:13:43.720 I was. I held on to something for too long 0:13:43.760 --> 0:13:45.480 for a lot of reasons, but mostly because I didn't 0:13:45.480 --> 0:13:48.040 want to look like a fool again, you know, and 0:13:48.480 --> 0:13:53.120 because especially living life publicly, it's like, all right, I'm 0:13:53.160 --> 0:13:55.240 going to have the criticism. I'm going to have, you know, 0:13:55.440 --> 0:13:57.440 people coming at me and saying now I'm the problem 0:13:57.520 --> 0:13:59.560 or there she goes again in their failed marriage, and 0:13:59.600 --> 0:14:02.800 it's like, and I think people, you know, they they 0:14:02.840 --> 0:14:06.440 want the perception. I don't think everything's perfect, right, so 0:14:06.520 --> 0:14:08.160 I don't you know, you shouldn't just let go of 0:14:08.160 --> 0:14:11.320 the second that things are hard. I'm a big advocate 0:14:11.360 --> 0:14:17.079 for working through things, but I think it is difficult too, because, 0:14:17.360 --> 0:14:21.000 at least for me, I was I just deem myself 0:14:21.040 --> 0:14:23.160 as unlovable, so no one would most. 0:14:22.920 --> 0:14:24.960 Likely love me if I got divorced. 0:14:24.960 --> 0:14:27.480 I've got two kids, I'm almost forty at that time, 0:14:27.560 --> 0:14:30.680 and so I think it's just hard because I think 0:14:30.720 --> 0:14:33.440 people go to, well, this is probably as good as 0:14:33.440 --> 0:14:35.720 it's going to get for me. Yeah, So what would 0:14:35.800 --> 0:14:38.360 you say to the person that is having a hard 0:14:38.400 --> 0:14:41.360 time trusting that they actually do deserve better than what 0:14:41.440 --> 0:14:42.680 they're being dealt in the moment? 0:14:43.640 --> 0:14:45.200 Oh my goodness. I think that. 0:14:46.760 --> 0:14:50.360 So many of us have been in situations where someone 0:14:50.400 --> 0:14:52.840 has said to us, you have to love yourself before 0:14:53.040 --> 0:14:55.720 you can love somebody else. You know, I got to 0:14:55.760 --> 0:14:58.680 be honest with you. I do not believe that you 0:14:58.800 --> 0:15:01.040 have to love yourself where you can love somebody else. 0:15:01.240 --> 0:15:03.720 I always say like, I had to love myself before 0:15:03.720 --> 0:15:04.800 I could let someone love me. 0:15:04.920 --> 0:15:05.480 But I had to. 0:15:05.640 --> 0:15:07.960 But for me, it was I had to know that 0:15:08.040 --> 0:15:11.320 I was worth loving. So I had to like love 0:15:11.440 --> 0:15:13.640 the broken parts of me so that I didn't have 0:15:13.720 --> 0:15:16.840 to always constantly feel like I was defending myself or 0:15:17.440 --> 0:15:18.640 you know, yeah. 0:15:18.880 --> 0:15:22.280 I also don't even believe we're broken. I think that 0:15:23.640 --> 0:15:26.240 we useage language. And I'm not saying that you can't 0:15:26.280 --> 0:15:29.600 use the self, but for listeners, I think it's just 0:15:30.240 --> 0:15:32.040 we use this language that people say, oh, I was 0:15:32.080 --> 0:15:34.680 broken or I was insecure. And I do think it's 0:15:34.720 --> 0:15:38.400 true that learning to love yourself is a journey, especially 0:15:38.440 --> 0:15:40.320 if it's not something you were taught growing up. I 0:15:40.400 --> 0:15:41.600 wasn't taught that growing up. 0:15:41.680 --> 0:15:42.440 I thought I was. 0:15:42.520 --> 0:15:45.240 I thought I was pretty confident. I learned that confidence 0:15:45.240 --> 0:15:48.480 and loving yourself and walking around in the world like 0:15:48.520 --> 0:15:51.120 you love yourself, and making decisions like you love yourself. 0:15:51.160 --> 0:15:53.280 It's very different than confidence, because I'm sure you would 0:15:53.280 --> 0:15:55.720 agree to like in business, you'll come in, you'll kick ass, 0:15:55.880 --> 0:15:57.320 but then in other areas. 0:15:57.000 --> 0:15:59.520 It's like right. 0:16:00.120 --> 0:16:02.520 So I do not think that we have to love 0:16:02.560 --> 0:16:06.440 ourselves in order to love the people or allow love in. 0:16:06.680 --> 0:16:09.960 And I think that that is a blessing, because if. 0:16:09.800 --> 0:16:14.080 We had to absolutely love ourselves fully in order to 0:16:14.200 --> 0:16:16.160 allow people to be there for us, to show it, 0:16:16.280 --> 0:16:18.920 for us, to care for us, to show kindness to us, 0:16:18.960 --> 0:16:21.680 to be empathetic to us, I don't think healing would 0:16:21.720 --> 0:16:22.320 be possible. 0:16:22.760 --> 0:16:24.840 So then what is it? Then you tell me what 0:16:25.560 --> 0:16:26.440 do you think it should be? 0:16:26.480 --> 0:16:28.760 Then I do think we have to be willing to 0:16:28.760 --> 0:16:32.000 see the hard parts of ourselves. I don't think that 0:16:32.040 --> 0:16:35.080 we have to necessarily love the hard parts that we're seeing. 0:16:35.400 --> 0:16:37.040 I think a lot of people are waiting for the 0:16:37.080 --> 0:16:39.560 moment that it's like, all right, I finally feel like 0:16:39.600 --> 0:16:43.000 I hold myself together. I think that comes after I'm 0:16:43.000 --> 0:16:45.440 willing to be vulnerable and say to someone, you know what, 0:16:45.640 --> 0:16:48.200 I don't think that I care about myself in the 0:16:48.240 --> 0:16:52.040 way that I should, or I don't think that I 0:16:52.080 --> 0:16:55.040 think positively about myself, or I don't think that my self. 0:16:54.840 --> 0:16:55.680 Worth is where it should be. 0:16:55.760 --> 0:16:58.560 I think that we're willing to and I don't know 0:16:58.600 --> 0:17:00.680 if you agree with this, but for me, it was 0:17:00.720 --> 0:17:02.840 with friends. It was in my community that I was 0:17:02.880 --> 0:17:05.359 willing to finally admit and let them see. 0:17:05.880 --> 0:17:08.159 That the perception that I may have been shown was 0:17:08.200 --> 0:17:08.600 not the. 0:17:08.520 --> 0:17:11.280 Reality that I didn't feel as good about myself as 0:17:11.320 --> 0:17:13.679 I thought I did. That I was settling in relationships 0:17:13.720 --> 0:17:16.359 and not just romantically and friendships in a lot of 0:17:16.400 --> 0:17:19.520 areas where I was allowing people to have more access 0:17:19.560 --> 0:17:21.080 to me or to have more. 0:17:21.400 --> 0:17:23.840 Of me, and the relationship wasn't reciprocal. 0:17:24.119 --> 0:17:26.840 It took me admitting that with my friends. It took 0:17:26.880 --> 0:17:28.800 me admitting that in therapy. It took me admitting that 0:17:28.800 --> 0:17:32.640 with myself and letting those walls down because I had 0:17:32.760 --> 0:17:35.399 so many barriers up. Not because I didn't want anyone, 0:17:35.440 --> 0:17:38.880 in the complete opposite, I did, but I didn't believe 0:17:38.920 --> 0:17:41.159 that it was possible. I didn't believe I could trust people. 0:17:41.680 --> 0:17:44.760 And I think I think sharing this is important because 0:17:44.760 --> 0:17:46.840 I think there's so many people that will hear this, 0:17:46.920 --> 0:17:48.760 and I think there's so many people that feel like 0:17:49.280 --> 0:17:52.440 I'm not healing correctly because it still don't fully love myself. 0:17:52.480 --> 0:17:55.159 I still don't have this all figured out, and I. 0:17:55.040 --> 0:17:57.000 Still have moments where I beat myself up. 0:17:57.200 --> 0:17:59.240 I still have moments where I say thanks to myself, 0:17:59.280 --> 0:18:03.320 and I catch myself now saying terrible things, and then 0:18:03.359 --> 0:18:07.040 I say, Wow, you know what do you need right now? 0:18:07.119 --> 0:18:07.320 Yeah? 0:18:07.440 --> 0:18:09.520 Let's you know, let's let's go on a friend, let's 0:18:09.680 --> 0:18:11.360 write in your journal, let's do whatever it is that's 0:18:11.359 --> 0:18:13.000 going to bring you back to yourself. I think the 0:18:13.040 --> 0:18:15.520 evidence of healing and the evidence that you loved yourself. 0:18:15.880 --> 0:18:18.000 Is that when you're in those moments, you're able to 0:18:18.040 --> 0:18:21.159 see it, You're able to find whoever or whatever is 0:18:21.200 --> 0:18:23.640 going to connect you back to yourself, and then you're 0:18:23.720 --> 0:18:25.800 able to make the change and the choice from there 0:18:26.880 --> 0:18:29.440 to allow someone or to allow life to come in. 0:18:29.880 --> 0:18:30.840 Does that make sense? 0:18:30.960 --> 0:18:31.320 It does? 0:18:31.520 --> 0:18:33.840 Yeah? Yeah, no, it definitely, it definitely does make sense. 0:18:33.920 --> 0:18:36.880 I mean, I definitely I hear you on that. I'm curious. 0:18:36.920 --> 0:18:40.160 So okay, so you have you had another book too, 0:18:41.200 --> 0:18:44.840 the Sugar Jarts, about creating boundaries in your life, do 0:18:44.880 --> 0:18:49.200 you think? I mean, I know there's the boundaries is 0:18:49.200 --> 0:18:51.160 like have boundaries with people. But I also think it's 0:18:51.240 --> 0:18:53.680 really important, right for boundaries for yourself. And I think 0:18:53.680 --> 0:18:58.920 that that coincides with then the healing and the trusting right. 0:18:59.520 --> 0:19:03.560 Absolutely, I talk about it in the book. But I 0:19:03.600 --> 0:19:05.600 don't think that we can set boundaries with other people 0:19:05.720 --> 0:19:06.640 until we're willing. 0:19:06.400 --> 0:19:08.280