WEBVTT - From the Vault: Tree of Life 0:00:05.720 --> 0:00:07.400 Hey, you welcome to Stuff to Blow Your Mind. My 0:00:07.480 --> 0:00:10.240 name is Robert Lamb and I'm Joe McCormick. And today 0:00:10.280 --> 0:00:13.320 we're venturing into the vault for an episode that originally 0:00:13.320 --> 0:00:18.120 published November. This is an episode you did with Christian. Right, 0:00:18.280 --> 0:00:20.280 this was the last episode I did with Christian, last 0:00:20.280 --> 0:00:23.080 episode Stuff to Blow Your Mind. Yeah, this was his 0:00:23.079 --> 0:00:25.439 his final episode. He got to pick the topic he 0:00:25.480 --> 0:00:28.680 had been wanting to do one on on the Tree 0:00:28.680 --> 0:00:31.200 of Life and the motif of the of the tree 0:00:31.440 --> 0:00:35.839 in in human uh cultures around the world and uh 0:00:35.920 --> 0:00:37.680 and yeah, so it was like his last episode he 0:00:37.720 --> 0:00:39.639 got to choose, and and in doing so he kind 0:00:39.640 --> 0:00:43.760 of accidentally um made us to a Christmas episode because 0:00:43.760 --> 0:00:47.000 we end up talking a little bit about holiday trees 0:00:47.080 --> 0:00:50.360 Christmas trees in this episode as well. Uh, thus are 0:00:50.760 --> 0:00:54.720 rerunning of of this episode during the holiday season. You're 0:00:54.720 --> 0:00:57.720 gonna make people cry all over again for Christians. Farewell, 0:00:58.000 --> 0:01:00.680 welcome cry if you must. But yeah, we were sad 0:01:00.680 --> 0:01:03.480 to see him go. It's your party, all right. Uh, 0:01:03.520 --> 0:01:05.840 so I guess we should get right into the episode. 0:01:05.840 --> 0:01:11.039 We hope you enjoy The Tree of Life. Men call 0:01:11.160 --> 0:01:15.360 the Swatha the Banyan tree. Which hath its bows beneath, 0:01:15.400 --> 0:01:18.960 its roots above the ever holy tree Yea, for its 0:01:19.040 --> 0:01:24.039 leaves are green and waving hymns which whisper truth, who 0:01:24.080 --> 0:01:28.880 knows the Aswatha knows vEDS, and all its branches shoot 0:01:28.920 --> 0:01:31.959 to heaven and sink to earth, even as the deeds 0:01:32.000 --> 0:01:36.200 of men, which take their birth from qualities. Its silver 0:01:36.360 --> 0:01:40.160 sprays and blooms, and all the eager verdure of its 0:01:40.240 --> 0:01:44.400 girth leap to quick life at kiss of sun and air, 0:01:45.000 --> 0:01:49.360 as men's lives quickened to the temptings fair of wooing sense. 0:01:49.760 --> 0:01:53.920 It's hanging Rootlets seek the soil beneath, helping to hold 0:01:53.960 --> 0:01:57.280 it there as actions rought amid this world of men 0:01:57.560 --> 0:02:06.600 buying them by ever tightening bond again. Welcome to stuff 0:02:06.640 --> 0:02:15.639 to blow your mind from How Stuff Works dot com. 0:02:15.639 --> 0:02:17.520 Hey you, welcome to stuff to blow your mind. My 0:02:17.600 --> 0:02:20.040 name is Robert Lamb and my name is Christian Saga. 0:02:20.040 --> 0:02:23.840 And that was a reading from a book I can't 0:02:23.840 --> 0:02:27.000 pronounce the right way, but it's the arnold translation. Chapter fifteen. 0:02:27.080 --> 0:02:29.200 You say it yes, the bag geta, or you know 0:02:29.240 --> 0:02:30.840 you can just call it the geta. I always say 0:02:30.840 --> 0:02:35.160 it wrong, baga geta. Yeah, or just the geta. You know, 0:02:35.160 --> 0:02:37.200 you can be impersonal with it if you like. Okay, 0:02:37.200 --> 0:02:40.600 but yeah, that's the Arnold translation Chapter fifteen, referring to 0:02:40.840 --> 0:02:44.280 one of the many world trees, the sacred trees, the 0:02:44.360 --> 0:02:48.720 trees of life that seemed to crop up from cultures 0:02:48.760 --> 0:02:51.920 and traditions around the world, and the roots of these 0:02:51.919 --> 0:02:56.120 trees seemed to dive down deep into human prehistory. Yeah. 0:02:56.200 --> 0:02:58.680 I have been thinking about this topic for a few 0:02:58.760 --> 0:03:00.480 years now. I've I've had this the back of my 0:03:00.520 --> 0:03:02.880 head when I joined the show. Uh, here's a little 0:03:02.919 --> 0:03:05.600 behind the scenes for you all. We have this huge 0:03:06.240 --> 0:03:09.040 spreadsheet document that has all of our potential topics in it, 0:03:09.080 --> 0:03:10.760 and when I first joined the show, I probably put 0:03:10.800 --> 0:03:13.120 I don't know, like two ideas into it, and this 0:03:13.240 --> 0:03:14.720 was like one of the first ones I put in 0:03:14.720 --> 0:03:16.880 there because I was like, I know what Robert's into, 0:03:16.919 --> 0:03:19.680 I know what the show has covered before. I need 0:03:19.680 --> 0:03:21.360 the answer to this question. And the way I had 0:03:21.400 --> 0:03:24.880 framed it was, why are the Kundalini, ig, DRIs Sill, 0:03:25.200 --> 0:03:30.239 and seff Rof also similar? And these are all basically 0:03:30.280 --> 0:03:31.560 and we're going to get into this. These are all 0:03:31.600 --> 0:03:36.240 representations of tree of life symbology across the world, right. 0:03:36.880 --> 0:03:38.760 And it first struck me when I was reading these 0:03:38.880 --> 0:03:42.200 esoteric books about things like yoga and Norse myths and 0:03:42.440 --> 0:03:45.880 cobbalistic mysticism. And then it occurred to me that these 0:03:45.920 --> 0:03:49.960 cosmological symbols, they're so similar, despite the fact that the 0:03:50.200 --> 0:03:53.440 cultures that they come from are vastly different and very 0:03:53.440 --> 0:03:56.160 far away from one another. But I didn't originally think 0:03:56.160 --> 0:03:58.760 of them as trees per se. And now that we've 0:03:58.760 --> 0:04:00.680 sat down and we've done our homework for this episode, 0:04:00.680 --> 0:04:03.520 it's it's pretty obvious that they're they're all trees. Yeah. 0:04:03.640 --> 0:04:05.880 And if you if you don't know what those those 0:04:05.880 --> 0:04:09.000 three names were, you don't know these particular world trees 0:04:09.120 --> 0:04:13.240 by name. I feel like most people, you're probably connected 0:04:14.240 --> 0:04:18.719 with some culture or another that has a tree symbol 0:04:18.800 --> 0:04:22.400 within it. And even if you're completely like somehow completely 0:04:22.440 --> 0:04:26.919 removed from uh, you know, ancient traditions and spiritual practices 0:04:27.120 --> 0:04:30.599 and religious history, you are still going to encounter the 0:04:30.720 --> 0:04:33.960 symbol of the tree somewhere in your world. And as 0:04:34.000 --> 0:04:37.000 as with all the symbols, symbols come into contact with 0:04:37.040 --> 0:04:40.680 each other, UH and you you really can't interact with 0:04:40.720 --> 0:04:45.080 the symbol of the tree, I feel without um engaging 0:04:45.400 --> 0:04:47.640 with the legacy of that symbol, which we're going to 0:04:47.680 --> 0:04:50.839 discuss here today. Yeah, exactly, and so we're gonna provide 0:04:50.880 --> 0:04:53.679 you with examples too. Well, we'll get into all of those, 0:04:54.080 --> 0:04:57.160 but really our core question here today is why are 0:04:57.279 --> 0:05:03.320 trees so intimately connected with spiritual training and development everywhere 0:05:03.360 --> 0:05:05.680 in the world. And we'll find that this actually goes 0:05:05.720 --> 0:05:09.000 along with scientific development as well, that the tree symbology 0:05:09.040 --> 0:05:11.680 has been applied there too. Now I have to note 0:05:11.720 --> 0:05:14.880 here we could do the whole episodes just on all 0:05:14.960 --> 0:05:18.839 the various world trees and sacred trees in human tradition. 0:05:19.080 --> 0:05:21.520 We could do a whole episode just on tree spirits 0:05:21.520 --> 0:05:23.479 and the idea that the tree is a home for 0:05:23.520 --> 0:05:26.479 the soul of the departed, But obviously we don't have time. 0:05:26.480 --> 0:05:28.279 We're going to try and at least dip our toes 0:05:28.400 --> 0:05:31.480 and and all the appropriate waters, but we're not gonna 0:05:31.480 --> 0:05:34.320 really have time to immerse ourselves. Yeah, this is one 0:05:34.360 --> 0:05:36.160 of those where you could do just like an entire 0:05:36.240 --> 0:05:38.800 podcast called Tree of Life, and it would be just 0:05:38.880 --> 0:05:41.240 every episode would be about a different one. Because the 0:05:41.320 --> 0:05:43.599 further we dug into this, the more obvious. It was. 0:05:43.640 --> 0:05:46.839 It was in every culture everybody has and each one's fascinating. 0:05:46.880 --> 0:05:51.279 Each one has its own particular you know, flourishes. Uh so, yeah, 0:05:51.320 --> 0:05:53.120 you could. You could just have a Tree of the Week, 0:05:53.640 --> 0:05:57.080 but unfortunately I won't be able to join you for 0:05:57.200 --> 0:05:59.480 that Tree of the Week on Stuff to Blow Your 0:05:59.480 --> 0:06:02.440 Mind at least because this is my last episode of 0:06:02.440 --> 0:06:05.640 Stuff to Blow your Mind. I'm actually moving to Portland, Oregon, 0:06:05.839 --> 0:06:08.359 So if any of our listeners are out that way 0:06:08.520 --> 0:06:10.640 and you want to help me get situated as I move, 0:06:10.800 --> 0:06:13.039 I would love your advice. So what we're gonna do 0:06:13.040 --> 0:06:15.160 is at the end of this episode, I will provide 0:06:15.200 --> 0:06:17.720 information on how to get in contact with me where 0:06:17.720 --> 0:06:19.599 you can find me online. But I want to thank 0:06:19.720 --> 0:06:22.880 everybody out there, all of you for accepting me into 0:06:22.880 --> 0:06:25.800 your ears for the last few years. I've learned so 0:06:25.880 --> 0:06:29.600 much working on this show and interacting with its wonderful community, 0:06:29.640 --> 0:06:32.240 and I've made so many friends from being on this show. 0:06:32.320 --> 0:06:34.960 So thank you everybody. And I wanted to choose a 0:06:35.000 --> 0:06:37.800 topic that was something I've really wanted to cover on 0:06:37.839 --> 0:06:41.360 this show, but that's also it's universal, man. Yeah, Well, 0:06:41.400 --> 0:06:43.279 I mean, for for starters, I want to thank you 0:06:43.279 --> 0:06:45.240 for everything you've done for the show and UH and 0:06:45.680 --> 0:06:48.760 you have helped to shape its voice over the past 0:06:48.839 --> 0:06:51.320 a few years here, and I wish you the absolute 0:06:51.360 --> 0:06:54.600 best in Portland's and UH and as we'll get into 0:06:54.640 --> 0:06:56.720 at the end of the show, also your your your 0:06:56.760 --> 0:07:00.440 future podcast endeavors. Yeah, You're gonna remain a friend of 0:07:00.440 --> 0:07:02.600 Stuff to Boil your Mind going forward, and I want 0:07:02.600 --> 0:07:05.840 everyone to to to be clear on that, like, like 0:07:05.960 --> 0:07:07.760 five years from now, I'm going to show up and 0:07:07.760 --> 0:07:11.200 we're gonna do UH an episode on some kind of 0:07:11.600 --> 0:07:16.160 paraphilia and then we'll mix in like the science of 0:07:16.240 --> 0:07:19.240 some kind of psychedelic drug into it. Right on that note, 0:07:19.480 --> 0:07:21.760 I am glad that your final episode doesn't have to 0:07:21.800 --> 0:07:24.920 be the zoophilia episode. That was one of the ones. 0:07:25.000 --> 0:07:27.160 I'm kind of your Stuff to Boil your Mind bucket 0:07:27.200 --> 0:07:30.800 was my hit list. Yeah, yeah, after the necrophilia episode, 0:07:30.800 --> 0:07:34.040 I was like, we gotta do another paraphilia and so 0:07:34.080 --> 0:07:35.680 I'm glad we got that out of the way as 0:07:35.760 --> 0:07:39.360 a as ikey as it made us both feel when 0:07:39.400 --> 0:07:41.480 we did it. You know, one of the other things 0:07:41.480 --> 0:07:44.480 I like here is that your last episode is kind 0:07:44.480 --> 0:07:47.280 of accidentally a Christmas episode, or at least a Christmas 0:07:47.280 --> 0:07:50.600 Tree episode, because I found at least one source referring 0:07:50.680 --> 0:07:54.400 to the Christmas tree as as yet another symbol, as 0:07:54.440 --> 0:07:58.800 yet another echo of this global tradition, which which honestly 0:07:58.840 --> 0:08:00.880 I didn't even really think. I guess it's just because 0:08:00.920 --> 0:08:04.560 the Christmas tree is just so it's kind of so 0:08:04.680 --> 0:08:08.280 overdone in Western tradition, especially because we cut them down right. 0:08:08.320 --> 0:08:10.000 But yeah, I hadn't thought of it either, And it's 0:08:10.040 --> 0:08:12.640 so obvious now that you pointed out. Yeah, and this 0:08:12.680 --> 0:08:15.480 comes out like somewhat at the beginning of December, So 0:08:15.600 --> 0:08:18.680 maybe this will be an appropriate, uh, going into the 0:08:18.680 --> 0:08:22.720 Holidays episode for everybody to listen to and think about trees. 0:08:24.240 --> 0:08:27.440 So some of you out there are probably wondering, what 0:08:27.640 --> 0:08:31.040 are you guys talking about? What is a tree of life? Well, 0:08:31.600 --> 0:08:35.360 a tree of life it's a widespread archetype or motive 0:08:35.520 --> 0:08:38.200 that shows up in many human myths across the world. 0:08:38.240 --> 0:08:41.240 There seemed to be two main forms that show up, 0:08:41.520 --> 0:08:44.640 the world tree and the tree of life. Sometimes it's 0:08:44.640 --> 0:08:48.640 called the cosmic tree or the tree of knowledge in symbology. 0:08:48.679 --> 0:08:51.520 But the first one is a tree that has a 0:08:51.640 --> 0:08:55.520 vertical center that binds together heaven and Earth. And the 0:08:55.559 --> 0:08:58.360 second one is a tree that is the source of 0:08:58.400 --> 0:09:01.720 life at the horizontal so uner of the earth, and 0:09:01.760 --> 0:09:05.679 the concepts that are associated with it include life giving force, 0:09:05.880 --> 0:09:10.080 eternal life, desire for heaven, and fertility. So if we 0:09:10.120 --> 0:09:12.160 look at the world tree one first, this is the 0:09:12.280 --> 0:09:17.560 vertical tradition. The tree extends between earth and heaven and 0:09:17.720 --> 0:09:21.040 is the connection between humans and the gods, and the 0:09:21.080 --> 0:09:24.480 base of the tree is where oracles and profits perform 0:09:24.559 --> 0:09:28.000 their activities. But because the top of this tree reaches 0:09:28.080 --> 0:09:31.319 up into the heavens, it was seen as an entity 0:09:31.320 --> 0:09:34.439 that actually connected the three spheres of what most people 0:09:34.440 --> 0:09:38.920 thought of as existence Heaven, Earth, and then underground, which 0:09:38.960 --> 0:09:41.280 would be the land of the dead in some cultures. Now, 0:09:41.280 --> 0:09:43.120 what I think is interesting about this is that you 0:09:43.160 --> 0:09:48.240 can easily compare it to the Holy Mountain in global traditions. 0:09:48.280 --> 0:09:50.840 But though the mountain is a like a thing, this 0:09:50.920 --> 0:09:54.599 is not geologically speaking, but speaking from like human perspective. 0:09:54.880 --> 0:09:57.560 The mountain is a thing that exists and is solid 0:09:57.600 --> 0:09:59.400 and is unchanging, but the tree is a thing that 0:09:59.480 --> 0:10:03.120 is obviously grown um, which puts it more in keeping 0:10:03.160 --> 0:10:07.480 with for instance, the idea of of a tower of Babbel, 0:10:07.559 --> 0:10:10.679 the idea of power to reach the heavens of false mountain, 0:10:11.040 --> 0:10:14.080 except that the tree is is authentic. And it also 0:10:14.120 --> 0:10:17.720 reminds me, of course, of of space elevators, man made 0:10:18.080 --> 0:10:21.480 thing that has grown or built and used to reach 0:10:22.080 --> 0:10:24.960 the heavenly realm or at least you know, lower orbit. Yeah, 0:10:25.000 --> 0:10:27.840 those are all metaphors that have shown up in other cultures, 0:10:27.840 --> 0:10:30.400 not space elevators yet, but we still have time. We 0:10:30.440 --> 0:10:33.920 can do like the space Elevator of Life movie at 0:10:33.920 --> 0:10:37.880 some point. But you're right, mountains actually are interchangeable with 0:10:37.960 --> 0:10:41.720 trees and some of these symbolic legends. But I think 0:10:41.760 --> 0:10:45.760 that trees are usually the fallback because they grow and 0:10:45.840 --> 0:10:50.000 because of their cycle of fertility. Uh. But let's look 0:10:50.000 --> 0:10:53.520 at the horizontal tradition and see how that I think 0:10:53.520 --> 0:10:56.120 that plays into that further. That's this is again the 0:10:56.160 --> 0:10:58.959 tree of life versus the world tree. So this version 0:10:59.000 --> 0:11:01.520 has the tree plan did at the center of the 0:11:01.559 --> 0:11:05.640 world and usually it's protected by supernatural guardians. The tree 0:11:05.679 --> 0:11:09.040 is the source of fertility and life, and we humans 0:11:09.040 --> 0:11:12.319 are actually descended from the tree. If it's cut down, 0:11:12.360 --> 0:11:15.840 the ability to reproduce in the world would cease to exist, 0:11:16.440 --> 0:11:18.840 and the tree is common in quest myths, so that 0:11:18.960 --> 0:11:20.600 you see a lot of myths where like somebody has 0:11:20.600 --> 0:11:22.880 to go and get something, the trees usually involved. So 0:11:22.960 --> 0:11:27.559 for example Gilgamesh he obtains the elixir of immortality after 0:11:27.679 --> 0:11:30.840 fighting the guards of the Tree of Life, and its 0:11:30.880 --> 0:11:36.320 fruit and sap are thought to bestow both knowledge and enlightenment. Now, 0:11:36.360 --> 0:11:39.000 in some variations this is interesting. I only found this 0:11:39.040 --> 0:11:42.000 in a few. There are goats at the base of 0:11:42.040 --> 0:11:46.000 the tree, and they are also worshiped and seen as 0:11:46.280 --> 0:11:49.400 symbolic of birth and fertility. That's interesting. I was looking 0:11:49.440 --> 0:11:54.360 through um the writings of James Frasier and he made 0:11:54.400 --> 0:11:57.839 some connections there as well, between antlered or horned animals 0:11:58.360 --> 0:12:01.000 and the branches of trees. Well, it seems like the 0:12:01.040 --> 0:12:05.360 goat represents the ibex, which was once worshiped as an 0:12:05.400 --> 0:12:09.679 incarnation of human and herd fertility, so that would make sense, 0:12:09.679 --> 0:12:13.600 and the horn formations connecting together. That also makes sense. 0:12:14.160 --> 0:12:16.720 In other variations, though instead of a goat, it's a 0:12:16.800 --> 0:12:20.560 dragon or a serpent. I guess dragons sometimes have horns, 0:12:20.559 --> 0:12:22.960 but serpents don't. Usually, Yeah, I mean you do see 0:12:23.040 --> 0:12:25.720 dragons with horns or antlers, a lot of traditions. I mean, 0:12:25.760 --> 0:12:28.440 just kind of a reminder that the dragon is essentially 0:12:28.480 --> 0:12:32.000 a chimera. It's a it's a you know, it's a 0:12:32.080 --> 0:12:34.240 it's a creature created out of pieces of all these 0:12:34.280 --> 0:12:38.200 other animals, including, uh, say, a deer or a goat, right, 0:12:38.440 --> 0:12:42.240 and so these seem to symbolize the spirit of the earth. 0:12:42.480 --> 0:12:46.720 But the serpent is also an image for the quicksilvery 0:12:46.840 --> 0:12:49.400 sap that's within the tree as well, because of the 0:12:49.400 --> 0:12:51.560 way it moves, So that's interesting as well. Yeah, I 0:12:51.559 --> 0:12:53.640 had not realized that. Yeah, and obviously we'll get to this, 0:12:53.679 --> 0:12:56.040 but when we go to the Judeo Christian version of this, 0:12:56.120 --> 0:12:58.360 obviously the serpent in the tree in the Garden of Eden, 0:12:58.720 --> 0:13:01.600 that all fits together. Right now, I want to remind 0:13:01.640 --> 0:13:04.640 everybody about archetypes before we get into this, because we're 0:13:04.640 --> 0:13:08.040 gonna definitely throw that term around a lot. Uh. Robert 0:13:08.080 --> 0:13:10.120 and I have covered that in previous episodes. We did 0:13:10.160 --> 0:13:13.040 an episode on just myth in general and taking a 0:13:13.040 --> 0:13:15.679 look at myths across history. We also did an episode 0:13:15.720 --> 0:13:18.280 on the hero myth and we talked about archetypes, and 0:13:18.320 --> 0:13:21.679 we specifically talked about Karl Gustav Young in those episodes, 0:13:22.320 --> 0:13:25.200 but just to give you a primer refresher what have you. 0:13:25.480 --> 0:13:29.079 He was a psychoanalyst whose main theory was that archetypes 0:13:29.280 --> 0:13:34.240 reappear in the collective unconscious that all human societies share. 0:13:34.240 --> 0:13:37.960 And he saw this as a ancient universal mind that 0:13:38.040 --> 0:13:42.000 was common to all humans. It's like an ancestral memory. Uh. 0:13:42.040 --> 0:13:47.240 And explains why we had the same archetypes across different cultures. 0:13:47.240 --> 0:13:49.840 This is his answer to my question, why why is 0:13:49.920 --> 0:13:53.200 this this symbology exactly the same in these cultures all 0:13:53.240 --> 0:13:56.800 around the world. Uh. And for instance, the hero, as 0:13:56.840 --> 0:13:59.040 we talked about in in in that previous episode, was 0:13:59.080 --> 0:14:02.680 one of the most prominent of these archetypes. Young posits 0:14:02.679 --> 0:14:05.640 that there's this deeper unconscious level that's going on that 0:14:05.760 --> 0:14:10.560 manifests itself as dreams or sometimes in more complex forms 0:14:10.600 --> 0:14:14.719 as myths or fairy tales. So this is in his 0:14:15.000 --> 0:14:18.200 you know, worldview. And we'll cover some some more frameworks 0:14:18.240 --> 0:14:21.360 like this later on in the episode why these all 0:14:21.400 --> 0:14:25.680 connect together? So the tree itself has been used since 0:14:25.800 --> 0:14:31.080 prehistoric humanity as a representation for the cosmos, for God, 0:14:31.200 --> 0:14:34.800 for fertility, knowledge, and eternal life. In fact, there are 0:14:34.840 --> 0:14:39.440 representations of it in prehistoric artistic productions. That's pretty interesting. 0:14:39.440 --> 0:14:42.800 I didn't I didn't realize that. Uh. We also find 0:14:43.200 --> 0:14:47.120 the tree in our conceptions of physical matter. So whether 0:14:47.120 --> 0:14:50.840 you're looking at vegetation or rivers or the circulation systems 0:14:50.880 --> 0:14:55.560 of animals, they're all we use terms from trees, like 0:14:55.640 --> 0:14:59.240 branches for instance, right. Uh. And the human brain in 0:14:59.280 --> 0:15:03.080 these network actually resembles the trees crown in the spinal 0:15:03.080 --> 0:15:06.040 cords its trunk, so you can see why human beings 0:15:06.040 --> 0:15:09.760 would automatically gravitate towards this symbol. Yeah, the tree is 0:15:09.800 --> 0:15:13.600 just a like a natural symbol, a natural metaphor for 0:15:13.720 --> 0:15:16.960 all of these other things were encountering, and it's it's complete. 0:15:17.000 --> 0:15:19.160 You can see it as a silhouette on a hill 0:15:19.760 --> 0:15:22.640 and then use it as a model as kind of 0:15:22.640 --> 0:15:26.560 an externalization of cognition to help you understand the rest 0:15:26.600 --> 0:15:30.600 of your world exactly. And they're obviously a symbol for 0:15:30.760 --> 0:15:34.360 the cycle of seasons, right like early humanity to now, 0:15:34.800 --> 0:15:39.320 we all know that trees cycle through seasons, blossom, fruit, decay, 0:15:39.440 --> 0:15:42.560 and then are reborn. This is seen as a reflection 0:15:42.760 --> 0:15:46.720 of the regenerative cycle of the cosmos. Itself and trees. Then, 0:15:46.760 --> 0:15:50.000 because they have a longer lifespan than ours, they seem 0:15:50.040 --> 0:15:52.440 inexhaustible to us. Right, it seems like they have this 0:15:52.760 --> 0:15:55.960 natural vigor that lasts forever. But that's just because they 0:15:55.960 --> 0:15:58.840 live longer than us. It's like uh, ents in a 0:15:58.920 --> 0:16:01.800 Lord of the rinks. There you go, So yet another 0:16:01.840 --> 0:16:04.320 world tree that we we didn't add to the notes 0:16:04.360 --> 0:16:06.600 here today. Yeah yeah, I also don't think we mentioned 0:16:06.800 --> 0:16:08.600 Game of Thrones at all. But of course they have those, 0:16:08.680 --> 0:16:11.120 uh the spirit trees that the at least the people 0:16:11.160 --> 0:16:12.920 of the north use the where would is that what 0:16:13.000 --> 0:16:16.080 it's calla with the faces of the children of the forest. 0:16:16.200 --> 0:16:19.920 Yeah yeah, Now remember too that in this symbology, the 0:16:20.000 --> 0:16:23.720 fruit of these trees bestows both knowledge and eternal life. Right, 0:16:23.760 --> 0:16:27.320 So here's an example. The golden apples of Igdrasill are 0:16:27.400 --> 0:16:31.320 said to be stored in Valhalla to restore the youthfulness 0:16:31.360 --> 0:16:34.960 of the gods. But and this is this pun is intended? 0:16:35.000 --> 0:16:38.960 What if it all stemmed from a psychotropic agent that 0:16:39.080 --> 0:16:44.000 was in trees in the original representation. So actually, ethnobotanists 0:16:44.040 --> 0:16:46.480 have been throwing theories around trying to figure this out 0:16:46.480 --> 0:16:49.160 for a while now and some of the examples that 0:16:49.200 --> 0:16:51.800 they looked at as possibilities where the fly a garrick 0:16:52.240 --> 0:16:55.120 or the Syrian ru trees, But so far they haven't 0:16:55.120 --> 0:16:59.800 been able to find a specific hallucinogenic plant that satisfactorily 0:17:00.360 --> 0:17:03.720 fits with the description of world trees. See, I actually 0:17:03.720 --> 0:17:06.680 found out a way to work in UH psychedelics into 0:17:06.800 --> 0:17:09.520 my last episode. Well, you know, this does make me 0:17:09.760 --> 0:17:12.400 wonder though, it's would it be necessary to be able 0:17:12.440 --> 0:17:15.919 to find like the one the one to one example 0:17:16.000 --> 0:17:18.440 of like here's a tree that produced a psychedelic fruit, 0:17:18.560 --> 0:17:20.280 when it would be seems like it would be just 0:17:20.320 --> 0:17:22.440 as likely that you have the symbol of the tree. 0:17:22.560 --> 0:17:25.760 But then there's this vast knowledge of these other plants 0:17:25.800 --> 0:17:30.120 in your environment that produce various medicinal or psychotropic effects. 0:17:30.200 --> 0:17:33.000 You know, Yeah, I agree. I think that some of 0:17:33.040 --> 0:17:37.320 these researchers, what they're trying to do is pinpoint the 0:17:37.359 --> 0:17:40.680 origin place where the myth first started. And a lot 0:17:40.720 --> 0:17:42.479 of it we'll get into this later, but a lot 0:17:42.520 --> 0:17:44.359 of it seems to point to the Middle East. So 0:17:44.400 --> 0:17:46.639 I think that's why they're looking at those particular trees. 0:17:46.680 --> 0:17:50.000 But you're right, I think that as this UH myth 0:17:50.160 --> 0:17:54.200 spread throughout cultures around the world. Obviously, various trees could 0:17:54.240 --> 0:17:57.520 influence it depending on what locations are in. So let's 0:17:57.520 --> 0:17:59.480 get Christmas e again for a second. M I ran 0:17:59.520 --> 0:18:02.640 across the um. This article in Nature from two thousand 0:18:02.920 --> 0:18:06.960 by ecologist gear hess Mark titled Temptations of the Tree 0:18:07.240 --> 0:18:11.120 a perennial image of life, history and enlightenment and uh 0:18:11.160 --> 0:18:14.000 and he did a wonderful job tying it all into Christmas. 0:18:14.040 --> 0:18:16.560 He says, at this time of year, many people the 0:18:16.560 --> 0:18:18.680 world over bring a Christmas tree into their living room 0:18:18.720 --> 0:18:20.960 to celebrate life. The tree is one of the most 0:18:20.960 --> 0:18:23.720 powerful images in human thought and worship, a feature of 0:18:23.800 --> 0:18:31.520 human environments from tiger to rainforest, and a symbol of persistence, fertility, life, descent, destiny, purification, 0:18:31.600 --> 0:18:34.880 and strength, a vertical link between the earth and the heavens, 0:18:35.080 --> 0:18:38.520 a place to seek knowledge. Yeah, you know what this 0:18:38.600 --> 0:18:41.040 is interesting? Actually, do you do you and your family 0:18:41.200 --> 0:18:43.919 get a Christmas tree every year? We do? Yeah? I 0:18:44.240 --> 0:18:46.960 used to. In fact, my family, like my extended family, 0:18:46.960 --> 0:18:49.320 owned a Christmas tree farm in New England, so it 0:18:49.400 --> 0:18:53.080 was like part of the family like business, you know. Um, 0:18:53.160 --> 0:18:55.520 and it's always sort of been in the back of 0:18:55.560 --> 0:18:57.960 my head that that's why we use Christmas trees. But 0:18:58.280 --> 0:19:00.520 you know what I mean, Like, as you're saying beginning, 0:19:00.880 --> 0:19:04.280 we in American culture at least don't really specifically think 0:19:04.280 --> 0:19:07.040 about the fertility stuff that's connected with it. It's more 0:19:07.080 --> 0:19:09.600 about the I guess, like the holiday itself from the 0:19:09.640 --> 0:19:13.400 commercial Well, you know, I was more inclined to recognize 0:19:13.480 --> 0:19:15.720 the fertility aspects of it because it's like you're bringing 0:19:15.760 --> 0:19:18.800 an average tree, an evergreen tree into your home during 0:19:18.920 --> 0:19:22.360 the winter, and and they're all these various pagan connotations there. 0:19:22.880 --> 0:19:25.000 But for some reason, I never really thought about the 0:19:25.040 --> 0:19:27.480 whole bridge from earth to heaven, despite the fact that 0:19:27.680 --> 0:19:31.320 most in most traditions, you're putting a star or an angel, 0:19:31.480 --> 0:19:34.679 you know, a heavenly being on the very top of 0:19:34.720 --> 0:19:36.680 the tree. Like you couldn't have it. It couldn't be 0:19:36.720 --> 0:19:40.520 anymore clear when you think about it, is tree is 0:19:40.560 --> 0:19:43.960 in your house, reaching up and connecting your house to heaven. 0:19:44.480 --> 0:19:47.240 We actually have a ceramic tree now, we just have 0:19:47.320 --> 0:19:50.240 like a little like one ft tall ceramic tree. So 0:19:50.280 --> 0:19:52.760 maybe that's why I stopped thinking that it doesn't reach 0:19:52.800 --> 0:19:54.280 to the heaven. What does it mean that we put 0:19:54.320 --> 0:19:57.280 gifts under the tree you have really like the root 0:19:57.480 --> 0:20:00.119 system of the tree would be the underworld. Yeah, all 0:20:00.160 --> 0:20:03.840 of our gifts are from Hell. I'll leave that one 0:20:03.880 --> 0:20:06.600 for the listeners to figure out. All right, we should 0:20:06.600 --> 0:20:09.400 probably take a quick break, and when we get back, 0:20:09.560 --> 0:20:14.159 we will jump into some various global examples of the 0:20:14.160 --> 0:20:16.760 sacred Tree, the Tree of life, the Holy Tree, so 0:20:16.800 --> 0:20:22.080 that we can further ground this discussion. Alright, we're back, 0:20:22.400 --> 0:20:24.879 So why don't we start with the example that is 0:20:24.920 --> 0:20:28.800 probably most obvious for many of our listeners, the jude 0:20:28.880 --> 0:20:30.800 and Christian tree. We were already kind of getting into 0:20:30.800 --> 0:20:33.280 it with a Christmas tree, that's right. Yeah. Western audiences 0:20:33.280 --> 0:20:36.080 are likely familiar with the trees of Eden Uh and 0:20:36.160 --> 0:20:38.960 the Fall of Man and the Bible. Humans were denied 0:20:39.160 --> 0:20:41.520 the fruit of the Tree of eternal life, but the 0:20:41.800 --> 0:20:45.840 ate of the Tree of knowledge. Later in Christianity, the 0:20:45.920 --> 0:20:50.160 god incarnate Jesus Christ dies upon an artificial tree of sorts, 0:20:50.280 --> 0:20:53.600 the Cross and Uh. In that essay that I was 0:20:53.840 --> 0:20:58.439 referencing earlier um ecologist gear hess Mark, he quotes a St. 0:20:59.040 --> 0:21:02.840 Justin mar who said that the Lord quote reigned from 0:21:02.840 --> 0:21:06.080 the tree, meaning both the Cross and the Tree of life. 0:21:06.080 --> 0:21:08.639 So two were kind of combined into one symbol. I 0:21:08.680 --> 0:21:10.919 never thought about that before that the cross is a 0:21:10.960 --> 0:21:14.640 tree a dead tree, weird. And the way the crown 0:21:14.680 --> 0:21:17.719 of thorns too, well, yeah, you can definitely make that 0:21:17.840 --> 0:21:21.040 case as well. Huh. Now, outside of just the Christian tradition, 0:21:21.040 --> 0:21:24.520 in Jewish tradition, we have plenty of examples of this 0:21:24.560 --> 0:21:28.199 as well. The minora, for example, symbolizes the expansion and 0:21:28.240 --> 0:21:31.200 illumination of consciousness in the image of the tree. Yeah, 0:21:31.240 --> 0:21:34.320 and obviously, as I mentioned earlier, the tree is represented 0:21:34.359 --> 0:21:39.000 in Christianity by the tree that's in the Garden of Eden. Interestingly, 0:21:39.160 --> 0:21:42.880 the Christian Church interpretation seems to be one of the 0:21:42.920 --> 0:21:46.240 only ones that associates the tree with guilt and sin. 0:21:46.880 --> 0:21:51.240 It became a loathsome quote tree of temptation only in 0:21:51.359 --> 0:21:53.959 Christian Europe, So that's kind of interesting. As we go 0:21:54.000 --> 0:21:56.959 through our other examples here, you don't really see that. Yeah, well, 0:21:56.960 --> 0:21:58.320 I mean, I guess you could make a case that, 0:21:58.520 --> 0:22:02.280