Speaker 1: Warning. Today's episode contains spoilers for the new Vince Gilligan
Speaker 1: sci fi show on Apple TV, plus Pluribus episodes one
Speaker 1: and two.
Speaker 2: You won't Hello.
Speaker 3: My name is Jason Kntepsion.
Speaker 4: Hello, I'm Rosy night, and welcome back to.
Speaker 1: Extra Vision of the podcast where we dive you but to
Speaker 1: your favorite shows, movies, comics of pop culture.
Speaker 3: Coming to you from My Heart Podcast. We'll bring you
Speaker 3: three episodes a weeks listeners.
Speaker 4: In today's episode, we talked about it with former Rolling
Speaker 4: Stone critic Alan Sepenwall. We tease that a little bit,
Speaker 4: but now we're able to dig fully into the absolutely
Speaker 4: wild Pluribus episodes one and two on Apple TV. Now, guys,
Speaker 4: just before we jump into that super crazy, unexpected pilot,
Speaker 4: a quick production this holiday season, we are going to
Speaker 4: be sharing some short stocking stuff for episodes with you.
Speaker 4: With so many great shows and movies coming out these
Speaker 4: next few months, these episodes will help us cover some
Speaker 4: extra content we wouldn't usually be able to get onto
Speaker 4: on our normal episodes, So stay tuned for our stocking
Speaker 4: stuff as starting the week of Thanksgiving.
Speaker 1: But first, Glory of bus I'm one too. The pilot
Speaker 1: opens with a counter showing that it is some four
Speaker 1: hundred and fifty plus days before the beginning of the
Speaker 1: actual show, so over a year before the events that
Speaker 1: we will see. Scientists discover that there's a message that's
Speaker 1: been beamed in the direction of Earth, and it's been
Speaker 1: going for an unknown amount of time. It's coming from
Speaker 1: six hundred light years away, and it certainly seems intelligent
Speaker 1: in origin, and everybody's very interested in this. When they
Speaker 1: discover it, one thing leads to another. It turns out
Speaker 1: that this message is divided into four parts, and each part,
Speaker 1: a guy figures out, is a representative of one of
Speaker 1: the protein ingredients for DNA, So it turns out to
Speaker 1: be a recipe for like an RNA strand, a strand
Speaker 1: of protein. Fast forward about a year later after this,
Speaker 1: but approximately fifty days or something like that before the
Speaker 1: events of the show. Military doctors at the United States
Speaker 1: Army Military Research Intelligence Division, I think that's correct, you,
Speaker 1: sam Rid, which I know about because of Stephen King's
Speaker 1: the stand have succeeded in creating this recipe which infectious
Speaker 1: diseases to get United States Army Military Research infectious diseases
Speaker 1: something and thank you. Ian super producer ian. So they
Speaker 1: make this protein, which is.
Speaker 3: That a good idea?
Speaker 1: But they make it.
Speaker 4: I feel like it's not a good idea, Like, let's
Speaker 4: be real happen.
Speaker 1: Yeah, they would definitely make it, and they're trying to
Speaker 1: be I guess as safe as possible. They're making it.
Speaker 1: They've been trying it out on animals, but they don't
Speaker 1: see like any.
Speaker 3: Effects at all. Like you.
Speaker 1: They're injecting into different species, but nothing's happening. And they
Speaker 1: have this big bank of like rats, and there's these
Speaker 1: two doctors in there doing the day's tasks with you know,
Speaker 1: injecting this protein and seeing what happens. And they notice
Speaker 1: that one of the rats is dead, and so they
Speaker 1: take it out and they're looking at it and it's
Speaker 1: like the heart is pumping really strong, but it's just
Speaker 1: like stunned. And this doctor takes off their gloves so
Speaker 1: they can feel the pulse of the rat, which I
Speaker 1: feel like, there's got to be a better way to
Speaker 1: do it. But whatever, take off the gloves, I fail.
Speaker 1: Never take off the glove. The rat bites the person
Speaker 1: and the virus has entered the human population. This doctor
Speaker 1: quickly goes about infecting the doctor that she is in
Speaker 1: the lab with and infecting, and they both go about
Speaker 1: infecting people throughout the facility, and very very quickly the
Speaker 1: facility falls like within a night or so easily easily,
Speaker 1: and all the people who have been infected are now
Speaker 1: like working together part of a hive mind, we will discover,
Speaker 1: so sharing a kind of consciousness, and they begin working
Speaker 1: together happily to like box up the samples of this
Speaker 1: protein and begin mailing it to different labs across the
Speaker 1: military labs we will later find out an episode two,
Speaker 1: and also like licking the doughnuts down in the lobby
Speaker 1: so that everybody who comes in and you know, including
Speaker 1: people who were at work today, will eventually become infected.
Speaker 1: And as this is going on, we meet author Carol
Speaker 1: Stirka in the midst of a book tour. She's kind
Speaker 1: of like like a down market Diana Galbadon.
Speaker 4: Yeah, I was gonna say, it's it's big like Apple
Speaker 4: book energy kind of.
Speaker 3: But not the top shelf.
Speaker 4: As no, no, no, this is this is the low
Speaker 4: If you sold out a fourth wing, this is what
Speaker 4: you pick up next.
Speaker 1: Right, she is like below Diana Galbadon below Sarah J.
Speaker 4: Moss. Oh, definitely she's like, you know, like thirtieth on
Speaker 4: the Chops.
Speaker 3: Right, Yeah, So.
Speaker 1: Carol's fans are very ardent, and they're mostly like these
Speaker 1: kind of you know, like white, very romance centric white ladies,
Speaker 1: with a few like very very very dedicated like nerds.
Speaker 1: And Carol's feelings about her work are clearly very complex.
Speaker 1: She doesn't think it's very artful or very like authentic
Speaker 1: to who she is as a creator, as an artist,
Speaker 1: but you know, it's work, and she's successful, and she's
Speaker 1: in a relationship with her manager, Helen, who is on
Speaker 1: tour with her, but also she is keeping that part
Speaker 1: of her life like deeply under wraps in order to
Speaker 1: keep selling books. Like the main romance in the books
Speaker 1: is it's a very it's a hetero romance with this
Speaker 1: kind of sexy figure known as Rabond. All these white
Speaker 1: women Rabon who all these ladies like love RoboN. But
Speaker 1: we're going to find out that originally Carol wanted Rabond
Speaker 1: to be a woman because that would be again more
Speaker 1: authentic to her, but then she decided not to and
Speaker 1: she feels like she's sold.
Speaker 3: Out because of this.
Speaker 1: About a week later, Carolyn Helen are returning from tour,
Speaker 1: Helen clearly has many dwi's on her record. Because she
Speaker 1: needs a breathalyzer to start her car. They stop at
Speaker 1: a bar.
Speaker 4: I had no idea this was the thing.
Speaker 1: By the way, until the show, it is a thing.
Speaker 1: It's a real thing. I like, it's a real thing.
Speaker 1: So they stop at a bar. They're discussing Carol's career,
Speaker 1: which again she's kind of like dissatisfied with. They notice
Speaker 1: outside that there's these planes flying overhead in perfect like
Speaker 1: parallel lines. Probably I'm guessing military planes that are dropping
Speaker 1: the virus like in aerosol form, like from the air,
Speaker 1: And very soon everybody begins falling sick, just like everybody
Speaker 1: in the Samurid facility.
Speaker 3: They like go into.
Speaker 1: This convulsion and then they come out as part of
Speaker 1: the hot mind. Helen, when she's becoming infected, falls and
Speaker 1: hits her head like really hard. She eventually dies of
Speaker 1: brain bleed. Carol is like trying to get her to
Speaker 1: the hospital, and every time she's trying to get to
Speaker 1: it's like a problem, one problem after another. She can't
Speaker 1: start the car because the breathalyser. She has to take
Speaker 1: another guy's car. She struggles Helen into the pickup truck.
Speaker 1: She gets there at the hospital, everybody's infected. A doctor
Speaker 1: tries to infect her by kissing her and very clearly
Speaker 1: doesn't work. Carol eventually ends up back home and has
Speaker 1: to leave Helen's body outside, and she turns on the
Speaker 1: TV is relieved to see a government emergency broadcast hosted
Speaker 1: by a guy who turns out as the under Secretary
Speaker 1: of Agriculture, like fifteenth down the bay whatever everyone else
Speaker 1: is somewhere else.
Speaker 4: As soon as I saw that, I was like, it's
Speaker 4: giving you know, designated leader or whatever that.
Speaker 1: So she's Carol is relieved that the government appears to
Speaker 1: be going, but then she's disturbed when she notices like
Speaker 1: all the graphics on the screen are addressing her by name,
Speaker 1: Like Caroll just calls everything that's gonna be okay.
Speaker 3: She calls the number.
Speaker 1: This guy, his name is Davis Tafler, the Undersecretary of
Speaker 1: agg and he addresses her like in the broadcast, addresses
Speaker 1: her phone call like he's listening to her, and he's like, listen,
Speaker 1: sorry about everything that's happening, So sorry about Helen, Sorry about.
Speaker 3: Everybody that's died.
Speaker 1: Long story short, like this alien broadcast, you know, was
Speaker 1: a recipe for a virus, and we're all infected with
Speaker 1: the virus and now we're very happy because we're all
Speaker 1: like this unified hive mind. And by the way, anything
Speaker 1: you need like food, medicine, whatever, Like we want this
Speaker 1: to be as comfortable and peacefullow transition transition for you
Speaker 1: as possible, Like don't whatever you want to do, you
Speaker 1: can do, but like we suggest you don't wander around
Speaker 1: too much because we're cleaning up all the dead bodies.
Speaker 4: In the streets.
Speaker 1: And we're so sorry about this, but like everything's gonna
Speaker 1: be fine after this, peace on Earth, the whole thing.
Speaker 3: And where's the president.
Speaker 1: The president unfortunately passed away during the transition, along with
Speaker 1: many other high ranking members of your government. But you
Speaker 1: are immune for some reason. We're studying it, and there's
Speaker 1: twelve other people that are immune just like you, and
Speaker 1: we're going to figure that out.
Speaker 3: Okay.
Speaker 1: And Carol like flips out and hangs up, as Davis
Speaker 1: is like on the TV being like Carol.
Speaker 4: Carol'll pick up.
Speaker 1: We just want to talk to you, Carroll pick up.
Speaker 1: That is a pilot.
Speaker 4: I wassilarly Bunker's pilot so well, mockted. I've had so
Speaker 4: many messages about this pilot.
Speaker 1: Quite intriguing. My wife, who's not a sci fi person,
Speaker 1: was into it. Let's go to a quick break. We'll
Speaker 1: come back recap episode two and then talk about our
Speaker 1: thoughts about this show so much. Pluribus Episode two, The
Speaker 1: Hive and the Body. We open in Tangiers, over in
Speaker 1: the North Africa, and you know, it's the same issue everywhere,
Speaker 1: not going great. You know, stuff's on fire, but the
Speaker 1: Hive Mind people are putting you know, putting out the
Speaker 1: fires and collecting the dead bodies, of which there are
Speaker 1: a lot. We see this woman who we will eventually
Speaker 1: learned his named Zosia, although does that really matter in
Speaker 1: this time when they all have the High Mind.
Speaker 3: Is helping clear corpses.
Speaker 1: And then she hops on a plane to go to Albuquerque,
Speaker 1: where Vince Gillian loves to set all his shows, and
Speaker 1: she goes basically to meet Carol. Carol is at home
Speaker 1: in New Mexico, and she's like burying Helen, trying to bury,
Speaker 1: digging grave, trying to bury Helen in the backyard. Very
Speaker 1: earth is very hard. It's a very difficult go of it.
Speaker 1: And in the middle of all this, Zosha appears cleaned up,
Speaker 1: you know, she having taken a shower at the airport,
Speaker 1: basically saying, hey, I'm from the Hive Mind. How are
Speaker 1: you and do you need any water? We're worried about
Speaker 1: your about your hydration. I am every medical doctor on earth,
Speaker 1: and I can look at you and I can tell
Speaker 1: you're dehydrated.
Speaker 3: Also, you've been watching.
Speaker 1: You from a from a reaper drone high above, high
Speaker 1: above your house, just to make sure if you're okay.
Speaker 1: Carol throws away the water bottle, believing I, you know,
Speaker 1: I get it, believing that perhaps it's poisoned.
Speaker 4: Or never have found.
Speaker 1: She. Carol notices something about Zosha, and that is that
Speaker 1: clearly the Hive Mind selected her because she very much
Speaker 1: resembles She goes inside and gets a copy of her
Speaker 1: latest book from inside, brings it out, holds it up
Speaker 1: to Zosha, and it's very clear that Zosha was selected
Speaker 1: because she looks very much like a female version of Rabond.
Speaker 4: Something only Carol knew.
Speaker 1: Wickero novels right, only Carol, only Helen. Only Carol knows currently.
Speaker 1: But Helen knew before she died, of course, that Carol
Speaker 1: wanted Rabond to be a woman and struggled with that
Speaker 1: for a while, and here is you know, the visual
Speaker 1: representation of female rabond Zsha is like, by the way,
Speaker 1: Helen is very happy with us. She was only alive
Speaker 1: for a few moments during the transition, but in those moments,
Speaker 1: and if you recall in the pilot, you see her
Speaker 1: smile in these final as she's passing away, and in
Speaker 1: the moment I read it as she sees Carol and
Speaker 1: is able to pass away peacefully because she's seen the
Speaker 1: person she loves. But what probably happened is she was
Speaker 1: finding peace and satisfaction as a member of the Hive
Speaker 1: Mind collective. And Carol is so mad at this. She
Speaker 1: tells Zoshita fuck off, and she's so angry. And you aliens,
Speaker 1: you motherfucker? Is this that and the other? And her anger,
Speaker 1: we discover in this moment, has the ability to short
Speaker 1: circuit people infected with the virus, and not just like
Speaker 1: one of them, the entire biomass of infected humans on
Speaker 1: the planet, the Hive Mind, that's like four We find
Speaker 1: out that they've about a billion let's round it up
Speaker 1: to a billion people have died, but like eight hundred
Speaker 1: million died in the initial transition. So there's like four
Speaker 1: whatever it is, five billion people like on Earth, and
Speaker 1: they all collapse because Carol's never frozen. Yes, Carol realizes
Speaker 1: that she had some kind of hand in this, and
Speaker 1: as she's driving across town, realizes that like all the
Speaker 1: people that she sees are having this convulsion. She's trying
Speaker 1: to save people's lives. She trying to get a guy
Speaker 1: down from like a cherry picker, and it's just it's
Speaker 1: just stressful and exhausting. But when they come back, it's fine,
Speaker 1: everything's fine. They're not mad at her. They just go
Speaker 1: about their peaceful, weird, hive mind lives. Zosha is gone,
Speaker 1: and Carol, exhausted, calls the numbers she saw on TV,
Speaker 1: which you know, basically gives the High Mind permission for
Speaker 1: them to retrieve her. Zosha comes back and is like, listen,
Speaker 1: you accidentally killed a few a few people, maybe how many,
Speaker 1: I don't know, like a couple of million, millions, Like
Speaker 1: we find out I think the number is eleven. Yeah,
Speaker 1: in this episode, So that's really troubling. That's very disturbing.
Speaker 1: Carol is horrified, but also chastened now kind of realizing
Speaker 1: like I need to get at this is all so
Speaker 1: stressful and traumatic, but I got to get a grip.
Speaker 1: She wants to finish Helen's grave by herself, but Sosha's like,
Speaker 1: let us help you, and she brings in like this
Speaker 1: fucking earth mover to dig up the soil and try
Speaker 1: and like, and they bring in by helicopter. It's incredible.
Speaker 1: All the resources of earth basically are at Carol's disposal
Speaker 1: if she should so want it. That night, Carol is like, well,
Speaker 1: I heard that there's the other uninfected. I would like
Speaker 1: to speak to them, the twelve of them. Zosha flies
Speaker 1: Carol to bill Bao in Spain, and Carol meets four
Speaker 1: of them there, each from a different country, along with
Speaker 1: their families, each traveling with you know, their love. Their
Speaker 1: loved ones are now part of the collective, but like
Speaker 1: they clearly it makes the uninfected happy to have them around.
Speaker 1: And then the fifth survivor shows up, Diabate from Mauritania,
Speaker 1: and mister Diabate, a very elegant French speaking man, comes
Speaker 1: onboard Air Force one and he's late because he was like, well,
Speaker 1: I'm gonna make the trip, but I'm going to make
Speaker 1: the trip in Air Force one and he's there with
Speaker 1: this harem of beautiful women and he's drinking champagne and
Speaker 1: he's very, very happy with the way things have turned.
Speaker 4: Out lately on Earth.
Speaker 1: They have lunch and they basically talk about like what's
Speaker 1: going on. Diabate is like Carol is clearly stridently against
Speaker 1: all of this, and she even says multiple times like
Speaker 1: we've seen this movie right, Invasion of the Body Snatchers,
Speaker 1: like bad, on and on and on, like this can't stand,
Speaker 1: Like this is whatever's going on here, it must be wrong.
Speaker 1: And Diabate is like, I don't know, like Earth at peace,
Speaker 1: no racism, I have Air Force one, I.
Speaker 4: Got horm beautiful, I got a hair all the time.
Speaker 1: Yeah, that love presumably to do whatever it is, like
Speaker 1: I'm asking for creepy, very very creepy. Carol pushes back,
Speaker 1: but it's not going well.
Speaker 4: Uh.
Speaker 1: Zosia says to Carol, listen, this is not this is
Speaker 1: not a violent It wasn't a violent takeover. It's just
Speaker 1: everybody is following a kind of biological protocol and everybody's
Speaker 1: like very happy the assimilation. We get more information about
Speaker 1: the assimilation. It turns out that the military kind of
Speaker 1: figured out somewhat sometime during the process like what was
Speaker 1: going on, which meant that the hive mind like had
Speaker 1: to escalate and go quickly and make sure that you know,
Speaker 1: the people in bunkers like underground and in space, like
Speaker 1: all those people were infected like in their early phases,
Speaker 1: so they wouldn't have any like wars or anything. And
Speaker 1: we get the number eight hundred and eighty six million
Speaker 1: dead in the transition and an eleven million gone after
Speaker 1: Carol's freaked out the first time, and unfortunately, Carol freaks
Speaker 1: out again because all the survivors are at best just
Speaker 1: kind of like rolling with it, and at worst either
Speaker 1: like diabaatee, like fully on board with it or kind
Speaker 1: of blinding themselves to what really is. And so Carol
Speaker 1: screams in the midst of dinner she's drinking like mad,
Speaker 1: like she needs to get that out very clearly. She's
Speaker 1: an alcoholic, right and this is not helping. But she flipped,
Speaker 1: she falls, and when the hive mind tries to like
Speaker 1: help her, she flips out like get away from me,
Speaker 1: don't touch me, and they all collapse. The entire high
Speaker 1: mind collapses once again, killing untold millions. By morning, it's
Speaker 1: it's only Diabate and Zosha. And Zosha's like, listen with
Speaker 1: your permission. Excuse me, Diabate says to Carol, listen with
Speaker 1: your permission. I would like to take Zosha with me.
Speaker 1: I've been talking to her all night, by the way,
Speaker 1: and I find her to be charming and beautiful, and
Speaker 1: I would love to add her to my harem. You
Speaker 1: don't even know her name. You've been calling her I
Speaker 1: forget what he she was calling her.
Speaker 4: Like she doesn't know what's going on. She's not doing
Speaker 4: like a good job connecting, and she wants to go.
Speaker 1: And then so Carol's like, well, let me talk to Zosha.
Speaker 1: And Zusha comes over and is like yeah, like I'm
Speaker 1: I'm happy to accompany him if you say it's okay,
Speaker 1: I don't want you. And then Carol is like, this
Speaker 1: is a very I thought this was very important. Carol's like,
Speaker 1: you decide. Susha's like, I can't decide because deciding would
Speaker 1: put you to in conflict. I would be disappointing one
Speaker 1: of you. And we learn through this that the hive
Speaker 1: mind really really cannot It's a lot like chat GPT.
Speaker 1: I tell you, it can't tell you like no or
Speaker 1: I don't like that it's always gonna be very It
Speaker 1: wants to please and.
Speaker 4: To use it more and to be more comfortable.
Speaker 1: Yes, So Carol's disgusted with this, and she's like, fly
Speaker 1: me home.
Speaker 3: I'm leaving.
Speaker 1: You can go with him. But she she locks eyes
Speaker 1: like through her plane window, like as she's leaving, she
Speaker 1: sees Zosha like boarding her first one. She locks eyes
Speaker 1: with her and decides, I'm stopping this. She runs in
Speaker 1: front of Air Force one, stops the plane and that's
Speaker 1: the end of episode two. Seek a quick break and
Speaker 1: come back. This fascinating show. Yeah, we're back. I love
Speaker 1: how mysterious Apple TV kept this because.
Speaker 4: They did the right thing. So many people of the
Speaker 4: meled me about this pilot because they had no idea.
Speaker 1: I think that was the right move because I think
Speaker 1: kind of allah severance. The more you would tell people,
Speaker 1: because there's so many tropes involved in this, right like
Speaker 1: the way that you would log line elevator pitch, this
Speaker 1: would basically reduce it to tropes. You know, there's an
Speaker 1: alien virus and people. Yeah I've mind and but but
Speaker 1: you know there's some people who are immune, and it
Speaker 1: would reduce the show to its parts in a way
Speaker 1: that I think would not do well to sell, like
Speaker 1: how interesting it is, and it really is a fascinating
Speaker 1: I was, I'm all in, what do you think?
Speaker 4: Yeah, I love this idea because something I think is
Speaker 4: so interesting is the essential kind of bass pitch is
Speaker 4: like what if the worst, most angriest person in the
Speaker 4: world had to save everyone from being happy?
Speaker 1: Right?
Speaker 4: But I love one Recijorn. She's a genius, so I
Speaker 4: love that. Vince was like, I'm definitely getting her the Emmy.
Speaker 4: But also there's just so much complexity in these first
Speaker 4: two episodes, this kind of wrinkle that he adds in,
Speaker 4: this insane, bombastic wrinkle of like, well, she can't be
Speaker 4: angry because that will kill people, So then that starts
Speaker 4: to become about her having to immediately change her behaviors.
Speaker 4: I also love something I've thought for a long time
Speaker 4: that had not been done properly in a kind of
Speaker 4: dystopian space is like, you know, we've gotten the comedy
Speaker 4: version of say a zombie land, where it's like I'm
Speaker 4: eating twinkies, I'm driving in a tank. But I've always
Speaker 4: felt like there's gonna be people in a situation like
Speaker 4: that who are flying Air Force one who are taking
Speaker 4: dates to the Eiffel empty Eiffel Tower and stuff like that.
Speaker 4: So I love that Vince and Apple went big enough
Speaker 4: that within the first two episodes you're in multiple countries
Speaker 4: and you feel like, Okay, well, yeah, this is what
Speaker 4: it would be like. You're not a bystander. You are
Speaker 4: essentially now the focus of the hive mind. Because there's
Speaker 4: only eleven of years. So the hive mind's job is
Speaker 4: to make you happy no matter what and make you
Speaker 4: ignore what's going on. AKA. When I was watching this
Speaker 4: this morning, rewatching it, it was I realized how much
Speaker 4: of a statement it obviously is on like social media
Speaker 4: and algorithms and stuff, and this kind of notion of
Speaker 4: like you can always be happy, there's something to distract
Speaker 4: you when even when the most horrific thing, like aside
Speaker 4: from obviously the infection around the world and the Hive mind,
Speaker 4: she lost the woman she loved in that moment, or
Speaker 4: at least the only woman she'd been close to, you know,
Speaker 4: and that to me getting to see her having to
Speaker 4: like deal with that anger and then now that kind
Speaker 4: of moral choice at the end of episode two of
Speaker 4: like I'm not letting them leave like, whatever happens, this
Speaker 4: is going to be my turning point. How do we
Speaker 4: work it out? And obviously it's also because they want,
Speaker 4: you know, the three of them to be together for
Speaker 4: the next episode, which I'm very excited to see because
Speaker 4: this is a great trio. I think one of the
Speaker 4: craziest things about this show is it is very impossible
Speaker 4: to see where it's going next. And I love this
Speaker 4: because that's absolutely what the first two were. Kind of
Speaker 4: the first episodes set you up in that way if
Speaker 4: you're never going to know what's happening. But oftentimes even
Speaker 4: with a surprise drop or a surprise pilot, let you know,
Speaker 4: for example, Yellowjackets, right once they're there, you know they're
Speaker 4: not getting out of the forest. You know something spooky's
Speaker 4: going to happen. Blah blah blah. This show could end
Speaker 4: up in space within like the next episode, and you
Speaker 4: have no idea. I'm so excited to see where else
Speaker 4: Vince goes with this because he's been so you know,
Speaker 4: virulently anti AI as a creative response and to call
Speaker 4: it a plagiarism machine. He's talked a lot about his
Speaker 4: feelings about social media and stuff, so I just feel
Speaker 4: like this is a really interesting take on all of that. Well,
Speaker 4: are you most excited to see going forward.
Speaker 3: Just where it's going to go?
Speaker 1: To your point, I don't. I've of course, I like
Speaker 1: empathize with Carol's desire to like end all this, I think,
Speaker 1: And I think on just kind of a base level,
Speaker 1: she's right, like this you keep you can't suddenly have
Speaker 1: a harem and think exactly fine, right, And I don't
Speaker 1: care what the hive mind says like this is. And
Speaker 1: I think Carol makes a good point when I didn't
Speaker 1: catch the woman's name who who she was mainly kind
Speaker 1: of arguing with the woman who is there with her
Speaker 1: mom and her.
Speaker 4: Son, who were actually in the hive mind, right, which
Speaker 4: is really.
Speaker 1: And and the woman was like, this is my son,
Speaker 1: this is my son. This is my son. And she's like, oh, yeah,
Speaker 1: it's your son. And she begins asking him. I'm like, oh,
Speaker 1: how would you do a pelvic exam, like as a gynecologist,
Speaker 1: since you're every gnecologist that was alive. And he begins
Speaker 1: answering these questions and it really disturbs this woman. And
Speaker 1: you know, when you it's clear that there's something beyond
Speaker 1: just like human morality going on, Like at some point,
Speaker 1: like that compass has to kick in, It still must
Speaker 1: kick in despite what this.
Speaker 4: Is the hive mind? How do you exist when you
Speaker 4: are part of the hive mind? Is are we going
Speaker 4: to get a glimpse of the kind of existential terra
Speaker 4: of being controlled by them?
Speaker 1: And I'm left wondering again, I think that I get
Speaker 1: Carol's mission to like stop this or cure everybody. I
Speaker 1: have no idea how it's possible that she could do it,
Speaker 1: like if that's where the show goes eventually, however many
Speaker 1: seasons downlined it she she cures it. I can't even
Speaker 1: imagine right now how it would be possible.
Speaker 3: To do that.
Speaker 1: And I think that there's also like a lot of
Speaker 1: really fascinating like different threads to pull out, so I
Speaker 1: can I can't wait to see where this shows. For instance,
Speaker 1: you know, if you if you're one of these, if
Speaker 1: you're this guy from Mauritania and Diavante, Like why can't
Speaker 1: we have fun with it? Like what is exactly the problem?
Speaker 4: Now?
Speaker 1: I'm not making excuses.
Speaker 4: For him, no, but that like be mindsets like that,
Speaker 4: especially if you were already somebody who had a lot
Speaker 4: of access to stuff. You're like, well, now there's no
Speaker 4: one else. Essentially, I was living eleven survivors.
Speaker 1: You would love to put things back the way it
Speaker 1: was because you were, you know, one of the privileged drivative. Yeah,
Speaker 1: in the in the in the days before this, but
Speaker 1: now you know, like I would like to enjoy this.
Speaker 1: So you get where he's coming from. I'm I just
Speaker 1: can't imagine to your point, I can't imagine where this is.
Speaker 1: That's why I think is so amazing.
Speaker 4: And also, guys, I'm just gonna tell you this. I
Speaker 4: know this is crazy. Jason mentioned his wife not a
Speaker 4: fan of sci fi. This is if you were given
Speaker 4: the chance to go back and watch Breaking Bad when
Speaker 4: it first debuted on AMC, would you want to be
Speaker 4: in from the beginning, Yes, you would. This is your
Speaker 4: chance to be in on that next show. Like Apple
Speaker 4: is going to commit to this. This is an incredible
Speaker 4: looking show, such a high concept idea, and Vince is
Speaker 4: obviously like a killer TV maker, So yeah, very fun.
Speaker 4: It's going to be really great to keep extening.
Speaker 1: What I think is cool is like Vince mining his
Speaker 1: X Files experience, you know, like it was a big
Speaker 1: time writer, producer, on The X Files. Yeah, responsible for
Speaker 1: many episodes, and the thing that for me, at least
Speaker 1: his work on Breaking Bad and Better Call Saul. The
Speaker 1: thing that is to me his kind of stylistic signature
Speaker 1: is putting characters into situations where they have to make
Speaker 1: some insane painting them into a corner and they have
Speaker 1: to make some insane choice that you can't even imagine
Speaker 1: how they got out of it Breaking Bad. What I
Speaker 1: loved about it was Walt was in that corner, painted
Speaker 1: in time and time and time and time again, and
Speaker 1: all the ways he got out of it never, not
Speaker 1: a single one of them ever felt like disx makna.
Speaker 1: It always felt like he earned his way out of it.
Speaker 1: And it was a surprise. If Gilligan can like recapture
Speaker 1: that kind of thing in this show, I can't I
Speaker 1: can't wait to see me Like I what are you? Do?
Speaker 1: You have anybody I have? Like?
Speaker 4: You know me? I'm a theory guy. But I think
Speaker 4: the way that they pitched this show, the way they
Speaker 4: market it, and the surprise of what it's truly about,
Speaker 4: makes me think like he's not just this is not
Speaker 4: going to be predictable. Also, this is something he's been
Speaker 4: working on for ten years, and I just want to
Speaker 4: say as well, Ari Breaking Bad, Right, I was watching
Speaker 4: an episode of it last night randomly on the AMC
Speaker 4: like kind of Stories channel, which is like a fast
Speaker 4: channel they have now, and they randomly were showing at
Speaker 4: season two episode thirteen, Right, dude, I was watching that,
Speaker 4: and I was just thinking, like, Skyla was so young
Speaker 4: and so beautiful in that show. When you're our age
Speaker 4: and you watch it now, you're like, oh my god,
Speaker 4: she was like incredible and he didn't understand. And it's
Speaker 4: so funny because so much of the conversation of that
Speaker 4: show was like, oh, Skylar was such a bomb, she's
Speaker 4: such a downer, Like let him just like do his thing, man.
Speaker 4: And I feel like Vince has always had this much
Speaker 4: more complicated insight into the human kind of condition that
Speaker 4: even at the time, maybe people weren't taking from Breaking Bad,
Speaker 4: you know, when it was kind of seen as a
Speaker 4: badass kind of indie movie show. But by the end,
Speaker 4: then when you get that reveal with you know, I
Speaker 4: am the one who knocks and everything, then you realize, like,
Speaker 4: oh no, if you were picking up on the fact
Speaker 4: that Skyla was right, she was right, like at every point,
Speaker 4: and that's why I'm most excited to see is like
Speaker 4: what happens with Carol? What is she right about? What
Speaker 4: is wrong about? How does this happen? Because also as well,
Speaker 4: I love that this is Vince going very comic Bookie
Speaker 4: in its own way, because like the eleven immune Individuals
Speaker 4: is very umbrella academy. No. Nine kids born all around
Speaker 4: the world at the same time, and this kind of
Speaker 4: how do these people connect, what do they do? My
Speaker 4: most thing I'm most excited about probably is meeting the
Speaker 4: other survivors who don't speak English.
Speaker 1: What I'm excited by is Gillian has painted himself into
Speaker 1: a corner in this show in an interesting way in
Speaker 1: that like listen Breaking Down and saw incredible suspense thrillers.
Speaker 3: That leaned heavily on.
Speaker 1: The feeling like an like a violent explosion was coming.
Speaker 1: This conflict, whether it's a conflict between you know, great
Speaker 1: Way Alamarca and and Walter or you know whoever and Walter,
Speaker 1: like you could feel like trains. It was so towards
Speaker 1: each other at old times in this show. The hive
Speaker 1: mind cannot be violent towards you could like Diabat could
Speaker 1: not be like you know what Carol's going to be
Speaker 1: a problem. Go hey, Hive Mind, kill her. They won't
Speaker 1: do it. They will only do things that are peaceful.
Speaker 1: In fact, they go so far as to not want
Speaker 1: to disappoint anyone, even like hurt their feelings.
Speaker 3: How do.
Speaker 4: So?
Speaker 1: How will conflict happen? And how can that be resolved?
Speaker 1: If not violently?
Speaker 3: What are the other workarounds?
Speaker 1: Like? You know, listen, here's there's a world in which
Speaker 1: if Carol wanted to take out Diabate And I don't
Speaker 1: think this is gonna happen. This is to you, this
Speaker 1: is I'm not a Vince Gilligan. Is Vince Gilligan a genie?
Speaker 3: Okay?
Speaker 1: But you know, Diabate gets on our first one. He
Speaker 1: flies away, and Carol decides, okay, now let me go
Speaker 1: scream at Zosha. She fritzes out the Hive Mind and
Speaker 1: his plane crashes exactly But how because I must? I
Speaker 1: feel like there will be conflict within the survivors. There
Speaker 1: has to be. How do you resolve it without them
Speaker 1: being able to even really yell at each other? It's
Speaker 1: gonna be interesting. That part of it is going to
Speaker 1: be real. I can't wait to see how that happens.
Speaker 1: Because that's kind of I mean, talk about putting yourself
Speaker 1: in handcuffs.
Speaker 4: That is like, I got wait, it's gonna be so
Speaker 4: interesting to see how he navigates that exact.
Speaker 1: Thing, and as ian Is is saying in the group chat,
Speaker 1: season two already greenlit, and yeah, I can't wait like it.
Speaker 1: It just brings up a lot of interesting questions about
Speaker 1: free will, like is this free will? They the hive
Speaker 1: mind will tell you that it's doing everything that it
Speaker 1: wants to do. At the same time, as Carol points out,
Speaker 1: they didn't ask permission to infect everybody. They just did it.
Speaker 4: They didn't come down and pose it. You know what's that?
Speaker 4: It's like, you know, extinction hive mind is just extinction
Speaker 4: with better pr or something. You know, no consent kind
Speaker 4: of peace without consent is a hive mind with better
Speaker 4: pr like.
Speaker 1: And so one wonders, and one wonders also like what
Speaker 1: is the why do this? Like what That's what I
Speaker 1: want to is the point? Like why did whoever? Why
Speaker 1: did the beings beings that built the signal and built
Speaker 1: the infrastructure to send the signal?
Speaker 3: Why did they do it?
Speaker 4: And why did they do it this way where it's
Speaker 4: making everyone happy instead of making everyone just like kill themselves.
Speaker 4: My guess is, like you need workers. That's kind of
Speaker 4: you need some if you have a hive mind. The
Speaker 4: implication is there's usually some kind of worker situation. Now,
Speaker 4: I'm going to put out a crazy theory. I do
Speaker 4: not think this is it, but I'm just saying we're
Speaker 4: talking about hive mind. The entire show is like colored.
Speaker 4: It's yellow coded. Maybe there's some kind of be analogy
Speaker 4: or some kind of alien hive that's a bit more
Speaker 4: like textual, but I don't know, and that is rare
Speaker 4: for us. So Vince Gilligan, thank you for giving us
Speaker 4: a show that we don't know what's gonna happen.
Speaker 1: Yeah, we don't know where it's gonna go. Can't wait
Speaker 1: to keep following this show, and it's gonna be a
Speaker 1: fun one. On the next episode of Xtra Vision, we're
Speaker 1: diving into Stranger Things to get you ready for the
Speaker 1: final season of Stranger Things. Whether you've seen every episode
Speaker 1: or just need a refresher, you've never seen a single episode,
Speaker 1: We're gonna get you to the point where you're ready
Speaker 1: for this final season.
Speaker 3: That's it for this episode. Thanks for listening. By X
Speaker 3: ray Vision is hosted by.
Speaker 1: Jason Concepcion and Rosie Night and is a production of
Speaker 1: iHeart Podcast.
Speaker 4: Our executive producers are Joel Monique and Aaron Korfman.
Speaker 3: Our supervising producer is Abusafar.
Speaker 4: Our producers are Common Laurent Dian Jonathan A Bee Wag.
Speaker 1: A theme song is by Brian Vasquez, with alternate theme
Speaker 1: songs by Aaron Kaufman.
Speaker 4: Special thanks to Soul Rubin, Chris Lord, Kenny Goodman and
Speaker 4: Heidi our discord moderator.