WEBVTT - Senator Chris Murphy Talks National Defense Authorization Act

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<v Speaker 1>Bloomberg Audio Studios, podcasts, radio news.

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<v Speaker 2>We stay on national security and defense, and we head

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<v Speaker 2>back to the Aspen Security Forum. That's where we find

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<v Speaker 2>David Gera. He's the co host of Bloomberg This Week,

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<v Speaker 2>and he also is the co host of The Big

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<v Speaker 2>Take podcast. He's sitting down with Senator Chris Murfy, Democrat

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<v Speaker 2>of Connecticut. Hey, David, we.

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<v Speaker 3>Got word that just a few minutes ago the US

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<v Speaker 3>resumed strikes on Iran, and I guess I'd like to

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<v Speaker 3>start there if I could.

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<v Speaker 1>The situation we.

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<v Speaker 3>Find ourselves in the plasticity of the President's policy toward

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<v Speaker 3>the region right now, and your latest thinking on sort

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<v Speaker 3>of where we are and where things are headed.

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<v Speaker 4>I didn't know that we had stopped our strikes. This

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<v Speaker 4>war restarted about a week ago.

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<v Speaker 1>It shows no signs of ending.

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<v Speaker 4>This is the most significant foreign policy disaster in the

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<v Speaker 4>last twenty years. Around effectively has control of the Strait.

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<v Speaker 4>They are going to have control of the Straight for

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<v Speaker 4>the long run. As a price of opening that Straight,

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<v Speaker 4>they want all the sanctions released, which is going to

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<v Speaker 4>put a lot of new money into their economy, but

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<v Speaker 4>also allow them to send money out to their proxy

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<v Speaker 4>groups in the region. This war should have never started.

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<v Speaker 4>It's hard to figure out what to do now, because

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<v Speaker 4>it's kind of like asking somebody, now that the raw

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<v Speaker 4>egg is splattered over the floor, how do you put

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<v Speaker 4>it back together? But it seems as if the United

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<v Speaker 4>States is going to have to pay that vig billions

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<v Speaker 4>of dollars to Iran and sanctions relief, and we're going

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<v Speaker 4>to have to prevail upon the Israelis to permanently stop

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<v Speaker 4>the war with Lebanon. And if those two things happen,

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<v Speaker 4>maybe we can get that straight reopened. I have no

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<v Speaker 4>confidence that ultimately there's going to be any bigger deal

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<v Speaker 4>between the United States and Iran. I don't think they're

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<v Speaker 4>going to make any commitments on a nuclear program. So

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<v Speaker 4>I guess the best we can ask for right now

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<v Speaker 4>is to just stop the shooting, get the straight reopened.

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<v Speaker 4>And we're still seemingly a far away from that.

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<v Speaker 3>As we look at humpty dumpty there on the floor.

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<v Speaker 3>Do you think the administration gets that they are they

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<v Speaker 3>still confident that they can stare down Iran, I guess,

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<v Speaker 3>and find some solution by doing that.

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<v Speaker 4>Yeah, I think the sort of can't over hype the

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<v Speaker 4>degree that just plain old incompetence plays in this story.

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<v Speaker 1>I mean, the trum administration doesn't know what it's doing.

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<v Speaker 4>It's primary diplomats with Iran are the president's son in

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<v Speaker 4>law and a guy who is a real estate developer

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<v Speaker 4>two seconds ago who's never done diplomacy. So it's not

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<v Speaker 4>surprising that they're failing. They're going to either have to

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<v Speaker 4>put actual adults, like experienced diplomats in charge, or they're

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<v Speaker 4>just gonna have to step out of the way and

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<v Speaker 4>ask our European friends or our golf friends to come

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<v Speaker 4>in and try to seal an ultimate deal on reopening

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<v Speaker 4>the strait. So I have very little confidence that this

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<v Speaker 4>crowd that's in charge of our national security is going.

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<v Speaker 1>To be able to get anything done.

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<v Speaker 3>We've seen in recent weeks your colleagues on the other

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<v Speaker 3>side of the aisle, many of them expressing more reservations

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<v Speaker 3>about this. Do you detect a real change kind of

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<v Speaker 3>in their position as this is attenuated as it plays out.

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<v Speaker 4>I mean, this is, of course a deeply unpopular war.

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<v Speaker 4>The American people don't support the war. They want it

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<v Speaker 4>to end. They're paying the price, not just in higher

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<v Speaker 4>gas prices, is in higher diesel prices and higher fertilizer prices,

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<v Speaker 4>but also in the cost of the budget.

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<v Speaker 1>This is one hundred billion to two hundred billion dollars.

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<v Speaker 4>And what is going to happen is that Republicans are

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<v Speaker 4>going to cut funding for schools, for transportation, for nutrition

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<v Speaker 4>in order to pay for the war. That's part of

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<v Speaker 4>the reason that the American public don't want it. So

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<v Speaker 4>as you get closer to the election, this becomes an

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<v Speaker 4>issue that Republics are going to have to deal with

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<v Speaker 4>because this will be an issue where voters are going

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<v Speaker 4>to say, are you for the war or against it?

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<v Speaker 4>And it's going to matter in their choices. So yes,

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<v Speaker 4>I expect that you will get more Republicans saying time

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<v Speaker 4>to end the war. For the first time ever. About

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<v Speaker 4>three weeks ago, we passed a resolution in the Senate

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<v Speaker 4>to end the war. It ultimately was stymied by some

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<v Speaker 4>procedural moves in the Senate, but there is evidence that

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<v Speaker 4>Republicans are starting to wake up.

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<v Speaker 3>You mentioned is reel a moment ago. When I go

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<v Speaker 3>back to that memo of understanding, which it seems was

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<v Speaker 3>not worth the paper that it was it was printed on.

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<v Speaker 3>I think the President would agree with that now, Israel,

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<v Speaker 3>of course not a party to those conversations. And I'm

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<v Speaker 3>curious how you look at the US is power to

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<v Speaker 3>persuade as reel to scale back, pull back its campaign

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<v Speaker 3>and Lebanon and change tech.

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<v Speaker 4>I think you'll have to use the leverage that we have,

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<v Speaker 4>and the leverage that we have is our defense relationship.

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<v Speaker 4>So long as Israel believes that the Trump administration is

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<v Speaker 4>going to continue to feed them the weapons and the

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<v Speaker 4>intelligence that they need to carry out war on Lebanon,

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<v Speaker 4>They're going to continue.

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<v Speaker 1>To carry out that war. That's a very blunt tool.

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<v Speaker 4>It took me a long time to accept it as

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<v Speaker 4>a tool to try to influence their behavior in Gaza.

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<v Speaker 4>But if it is a precondition to getting the straight open,

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<v Speaker 4>then we have to consider using that tool, because as

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<v Speaker 4>long as the strait is closed, it is American citizens

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<v Speaker 4>families that are bearing the cost.

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<v Speaker 3>Let's talk a bit about that pulled a domestic politics here,

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<v Speaker 3>and you mentioned it's a deeply unpopular war. How do

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<v Speaker 3>you see that playing out in the months ahead, and

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<v Speaker 3>how do you and your fellow Democrats kind of maybe

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<v Speaker 3>capitalize is not the right word to use there, but

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<v Speaker 3>highlight the fact that it's this unpopular issay it is

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<v Speaker 3>with the electorate.

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<v Speaker 4>You know, what I found in my time in politics

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<v Speaker 4>is that most of the time, foreign policy doesn't matter

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<v Speaker 4>in elections until it's sometimes the only thing that matters.

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<v Speaker 4>And I do think that this election it's going to

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<v Speaker 4>be on the ballot. Even if Trump were to get

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<v Speaker 4>the straight reopen today, the cost of a gallon of

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<v Speaker 4>gasolene or fertilizer is not gonna come down to any

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<v Speaker 4>reasonable level by November, so it will be a voting issue.

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<v Speaker 4>And the president's foreign policy incompetence and that agreement you mentioned,

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<v Speaker 4>that ces fire agreement was just an example of incompetence, right.

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<v Speaker 4>He signed an agreement committing Israel to do something without

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<v Speaker 4>Israel at the table. He apparently by accident, signed an

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<v Speaker 4>agreement that actually gave control of the Strait permanently to Israel.

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<v Speaker 4>Excuse me, to Iran. His foreign policy disasters are I

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<v Speaker 4>think going to be relevant this November.

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<v Speaker 3>I had Invester Ramavanuel here earlier, and he really seemed

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<v Speaker 3>to welcome having this debate about US Israel relations going

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<v Speaker 3>into the midterms and the general action on the heels

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<v Speaker 3>of that. Do you likewise, I mean there's a lot

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<v Speaker 3>of ink being spilled here about which there's division the

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<v Speaker 3>Democratic Party. There's debate about Israel. How healthy that that

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<v Speaker 3>might be. Where do you fall on.

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<v Speaker 4>That, well, I mean, broadly, I don't think you're a

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<v Speaker 4>healthy party unless you're having debate, unless you have division.

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<v Speaker 4>Part of the reason that the Republican Party is about

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<v Speaker 4>to get their clock cleaned in this election is that

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<v Speaker 4>they don't have any.

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<v Speaker 1>Debate, you'd I am pretty confident of that.

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<v Speaker 4>I mean, they're going to try to cheat their way

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<v Speaker 4>to a win, but I'm confident that if it's a

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<v Speaker 4>free and fair election, Democrats are going to.

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<v Speaker 1>Do very well. Yeah.

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<v Speaker 4>I think in a healthy political party you have debate,

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<v Speaker 4>and we certainly do have a debate in the Democratic

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<v Speaker 4>Party about what to do with Israel. I mean, I'm

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<v Speaker 4>somebody that wants a strong US relationship with Israel. I

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<v Speaker 4>do believe in the preservation and protection of a Jewish

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<v Speaker 4>state in the Middle East. What Netanyahu is doing is

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<v Speaker 4>not serving that objective. He is actually, in the long run,

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<v Speaker 4>going to end up recruiting more enemies of Israel, both

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<v Speaker 4>terrorist enemies and frankly countries that don't support Israel's existence

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<v Speaker 4>Through his conduct in both Gaza and in leban and

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<v Speaker 4>that's why I think we have to use blunt tools

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<v Speaker 4>to get his policy to change.

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<v Speaker 3>He allude to election malfeasans the potential for that. Seven

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<v Speaker 3>o'clock Local time, nine o'clock Eastern time, the President is

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<v Speaker 3>going to give a speech to the nation and reportedly

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<v Speaker 3>we'll focus on the twenty twenty election and electional regularities

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<v Speaker 3>as he sees them. I'll ask you, if you're going

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<v Speaker 3>to tune into that bit more broadly here, what's the

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<v Speaker 3>message of that and in the danger of it, as

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<v Speaker 3>you might see it in him continue to espouse what

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<v Speaker 3>we know not to be true.

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<v Speaker 4>Well, the danger is that we, for the first time

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<v Speaker 4>in American history, don't have a free election. I don't

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<v Speaker 4>know what the President is going to recommend, but if

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<v Speaker 4>he is trying to build the case to put troops

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<v Speaker 4>out in the bolling places, he will likely be stopped

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<v Speaker 4>by the Supreme Court, and then we will see whether

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<v Speaker 4>our democracy collapses and he does not listen to the

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<v Speaker 4>decision of the Supreme Court.

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<v Speaker 1>This is a really dangerous moment, and I'm really.

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<v Speaker 4>Worried that so many am I Republican colleagues are quiet

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<v Speaker 4>about it. You know, their party as a cult right now,

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<v Speaker 4>and I am just still hopeful that some of my

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<v Speaker 4>Republican colleagues will stand up and when they hear his

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<v Speaker 4>speech tonight, call it out for what it likely will

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<v Speaker 4>be the most significant rhetorical attack on democracy on the

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<v Speaker 4>national airwaves that has ever been made in the history

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<v Speaker 4>of the country.

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<v Speaker 3>Let me ask you lastly, just about your counsel, your

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<v Speaker 3>vision for the Democratic Party. You have a new book out,

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<v Speaker 3>Crisis for the Common Good, and a lot of the

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<v Speaker 3>council in that book is just for us to come

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<v Speaker 3>together more through clubs and activities and kind of re

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<v Speaker 3>engage with the way things used to be. Not wholly

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<v Speaker 3>leaning on nostalogia, but that's a part of it. Here,

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<v Speaker 3>I could ask if you're running for present, I expect

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<v Speaker 3>you demurror on that. But let me ask you how

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<v Speaker 3>you see the future of the Democratic Party here visa

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<v Speaker 3>via text, or just how you're thinking about the way

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<v Speaker 3>your party should take shape here going to the next election.

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<v Speaker 4>Yeah, I mean I bought my party to recognize that crisis.

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<v Speaker 4>People are feeling less meaning and purpose in their lives.

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<v Speaker 4>They're feeling more disconnected from their family, from their community

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<v Speaker 4>than ever before. We've got to sort of preach a

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<v Speaker 4>gospel of happiness about how people can wake up every

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<v Speaker 4>day and feel like they have real dignity and meaning

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<v Speaker 4>in their work, How we can control these technologies that

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<v Speaker 4>are sending their kids into lives of isolation. Our party, sometimes,

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<v Speaker 4>you know, solves very technical problems like the price of

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<v Speaker 4>a prescription drug, but doesn't explain to people how that's

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<v Speaker 4>actually going to make them happier.

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<v Speaker 1>If we were to lead.

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<v Speaker 4>This November and two years from now with a really

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<v Speaker 4>aggressive plan on how to control the ravages of social

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<v Speaker 4>media and AI, a space that, by the way, is

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<v Speaker 4>open to the Democratic Party right now, like parents don't

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<v Speaker 4>know which party to pick if they want to protect

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<v Speaker 4>their children from AI. That would speak to families in

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<v Speaker 4>a spiritual way, because they feel like they're losing control

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<v Speaker 4>of their lives at the hands of these new technologies.

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<v Speaker 4>That's the conversation my book is trying to start in

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<v Speaker 4>the party. I mean, I think it's a little too

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<v Speaker 4>early because we're not to be sure that we're going

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<v Speaker 4>to have a democracy in twenty twenty eight, So let's

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<v Speaker 4>make sure that we have a free and fair election

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<v Speaker 4>in twenty twenty six, and then we'll all make our

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<v Speaker 4>decisions for twenty.

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<v Speaker 1>Twenty eight centumorphy.

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<v Speaker 3>Thank you very Muchsure frispav of Connecticut joining me here

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<v Speaker 3>at the Aspen Security Forum