1 00:00:00,480 --> 00:00:04,800 Speaker 1: Hey, they're Sacred Scandal listeners. I'm Nando Vila. We're taking 2 00:00:04,840 --> 00:00:07,840 Speaker 1: over the feed to share a pretty wild story with you. 3 00:00:08,360 --> 00:00:12,760 Speaker 1: It's called Shoot the Messenger, Espionage, murder and Pegasus Spyware. 4 00:00:13,560 --> 00:00:16,320 Speaker 1: I've been working on this project for over two years. 5 00:00:16,800 --> 00:00:20,240 Speaker 1: Shoot the Messenger is a new bi weekly serialized podcast 6 00:00:20,360 --> 00:00:24,960 Speaker 1: from Exile Content. Season one is all about Pegasus spyware. 7 00:00:25,560 --> 00:00:29,320 Speaker 1: Pegasus is the world's most sophisticated spyware to date. It 8 00:00:29,400 --> 00:00:33,520 Speaker 1: can give full access to your phone. That means everything, 9 00:00:33,840 --> 00:00:39,120 Speaker 1: your texts, emails, phone calls, camera, microphone everything. How did 10 00:00:39,120 --> 00:00:43,040 Speaker 1: this spyware come to be? We'll investigate how it works, 11 00:00:43,120 --> 00:00:47,320 Speaker 1: who makes it, and the industry booming around it. An 12 00:00:47,320 --> 00:00:49,919 Speaker 1: episode one, which you're about to hear, will start with 13 00:00:49,960 --> 00:00:53,840 Speaker 1: the murder of journalist Jamal Kashogi and uncover how Pegasus 14 00:00:53,880 --> 00:00:56,600 Speaker 1: was found on the phones of many in his inner circle. 15 00:00:57,800 --> 00:01:07,120 Speaker 1: Here is Shoot the Messenger. Dubai is known for luxury, 16 00:01:07,800 --> 00:01:11,880 Speaker 1: high end shopping and a bump in nightlife. The heat 17 00:01:11,920 --> 00:01:15,920 Speaker 1: and the United Arab Emirates can be oppressive, but in 18 00:01:16,000 --> 00:01:20,360 Speaker 1: springtime Dubai can be pleasant. You can expect sunshine with 19 00:01:20,400 --> 00:01:29,000 Speaker 1: clear skies, balmy but not too hot. It was a 20 00:01:29,080 --> 00:01:33,679 Speaker 1: night like this on ap when Hanan, a latter, landed 21 00:01:33,720 --> 00:01:37,720 Speaker 1: in her hometown of Dubai. After twenty two years as 22 00:01:37,720 --> 00:01:41,399 Speaker 1: a flight attendant with Emirates Airlines, the routine had long 23 00:01:41,440 --> 00:01:45,479 Speaker 1: turned to muscle memory. On this Saturday night, Hanan had 24 00:01:45,520 --> 00:01:48,640 Speaker 1: just finished a long flight from Toronto. Her shift was 25 00:01:48,720 --> 00:01:51,320 Speaker 1: over and she was tired and ready to go home. 26 00:01:53,680 --> 00:01:57,120 Speaker 1: Hanan would have been wearing the standard Amarani uniform, a 27 00:01:57,200 --> 00:02:00,840 Speaker 1: fitted cream colored blazer with red piping with signature red 28 00:02:00,840 --> 00:02:03,920 Speaker 1: pill box hat. And this is where I like to 29 00:02:03,960 --> 00:02:07,280 Speaker 1: imagine Hanan and red pumps clacking along in the manner 30 00:02:07,320 --> 00:02:10,560 Speaker 1: which is distinctive to crew and pilots no matter how 31 00:02:10,600 --> 00:02:13,320 Speaker 1: often you fly, pulling a black roll away behind her, 32 00:02:13,480 --> 00:02:16,799 Speaker 1: always black, and maybe she had one of those squarish 33 00:02:16,840 --> 00:02:21,920 Speaker 1: topebags trapped on top of her roll away. Hannan had 34 00:02:22,000 --> 00:02:25,799 Speaker 1: deboarded a plane, exited the gate area, and walked through 35 00:02:25,800 --> 00:02:30,959 Speaker 1: immigration at Dubai's International Airport thousands of times, but this 36 00:02:31,120 --> 00:02:37,280 Speaker 1: time something was different. And this immigration people they know 37 00:02:37,440 --> 00:02:40,560 Speaker 1: me by name. He normally took my passport to speak 38 00:02:40,600 --> 00:02:43,799 Speaker 1: to me about my flight, but in this case, he 39 00:02:43,919 --> 00:02:47,960 Speaker 1: said Hannan within the side. The system is down and 40 00:02:48,080 --> 00:02:52,120 Speaker 1: I feel there is something wrong. Hannan rushed into a 41 00:02:52,160 --> 00:02:56,360 Speaker 1: nearby bathroom and locked herself in install She called the 42 00:02:56,360 --> 00:02:59,240 Speaker 1: person she always called once she landed at home, her sister, 43 00:03:00,160 --> 00:03:02,880 Speaker 1: and I told you, my sister, there's something go and 44 00:03:03,000 --> 00:03:06,799 Speaker 1: go on. Hanan had a terrible feeling that the Emiadi 45 00:03:06,840 --> 00:03:10,320 Speaker 1: men hanging around immigration had something to do with her fiance. 46 00:03:11,680 --> 00:03:14,360 Speaker 1: Her fiance was a journalist known for speaking out on 47 00:03:14,520 --> 00:03:18,680 Speaker 1: human rights, and in the UAE, loudly defending human rights 48 00:03:18,960 --> 00:03:23,760 Speaker 1: could get you detained or even jailed. Hanan's fiance had 49 00:03:23,800 --> 00:03:25,920 Speaker 1: already told her he worried about the way his work 50 00:03:25,919 --> 00:03:30,320 Speaker 1: would impact her life. He gave me the engagement drink, 51 00:03:30,600 --> 00:03:33,000 Speaker 1: and when he put the rink in my hand, he said, 52 00:03:33,080 --> 00:03:36,640 Speaker 1: Hannan and his kids, I might be a curse in 53 00:03:36,720 --> 00:03:42,280 Speaker 1: new life. I might create a problem for you. Hanan 54 00:03:42,520 --> 00:03:45,720 Speaker 1: wasn't involved in politics, She hadn't had any run ins 55 00:03:45,760 --> 00:03:48,680 Speaker 1: with the police. But sitting in that bathroom stall in 56 00:03:48,720 --> 00:03:52,240 Speaker 1: the Dubai airport, her fiance's words echoed in her head. 57 00:03:53,200 --> 00:03:58,760 Speaker 1: I remember this wound. I was very scared. She gathered 58 00:03:58,760 --> 00:04:02,720 Speaker 1: herself and left the stall. When Hanan walked out, of 59 00:04:02,760 --> 00:04:06,440 Speaker 1: the bathroom. She was quickly flanked by Emirati intelligence officers. 60 00:04:08,160 --> 00:04:13,000 Speaker 1: One of the member woke was us quietly and the 61 00:04:13,040 --> 00:04:20,200 Speaker 1: behavior shift. I realized you just have to comply with Jim. 62 00:04:20,200 --> 00:04:24,200 Speaker 1: Hanan was unhandcuffed, blindfolded, put in a car, and taken 63 00:04:24,279 --> 00:04:28,240 Speaker 1: to an interrogation cell. I cannot express to you what 64 00:04:28,480 --> 00:04:31,480 Speaker 1: is my feeling is this time the band in my 65 00:04:31,680 --> 00:04:36,000 Speaker 1: stomach from the bannock. The intelligence officers demanded she hand 66 00:04:36,040 --> 00:04:39,440 Speaker 1: over all of her devices, a laptop and two Android phones, 67 00:04:39,800 --> 00:04:43,520 Speaker 1: and that to share her passwords. She was taken to 68 00:04:43,600 --> 00:04:46,880 Speaker 1: a remote location where she was questioned overnight and into 69 00:04:46,920 --> 00:04:53,839 Speaker 1: the morning. Seventeen hours later, the intelligence officers returned Hanan's 70 00:04:53,839 --> 00:04:59,120 Speaker 1: devices and took her home. Hanan wanted to resume the 71 00:04:59,160 --> 00:05:02,280 Speaker 1: life she had built for herself, leading a cabin crew 72 00:05:02,279 --> 00:05:06,240 Speaker 1: across trans atlantic flights, traveling and visiting family. She looked 73 00:05:06,240 --> 00:05:09,400 Speaker 1: forward to her wedding ceremony in Washington, d C. Just 74 00:05:09,440 --> 00:05:13,080 Speaker 1: a couple of months away. But after she was detained, 75 00:05:13,560 --> 00:05:18,279 Speaker 1: everything changed. It turns out that while Hanan was being questioned, 76 00:05:18,480 --> 00:05:22,400 Speaker 1: the Emirati intelligence officers were executing a much more effective 77 00:05:22,400 --> 00:05:25,839 Speaker 1: plan to get information from her. I never had my 78 00:05:26,000 --> 00:05:30,600 Speaker 1: normal life back. That's because when Amiradi intelligence officers had 79 00:05:30,640 --> 00:05:35,320 Speaker 1: Hanan's phone, they installed a highly sophisticated piece of spywear, 80 00:05:36,480 --> 00:05:39,159 Speaker 1: and as Hanan went about her life, the spy where 81 00:05:39,200 --> 00:05:43,320 Speaker 1: had unknowingly turned her into an informant, providing a direct 82 00:05:43,400 --> 00:05:52,400 Speaker 1: window to the person she cared about. Most fears are 83 00:05:52,480 --> 00:05:56,960 Speaker 1: growing over the fate of missing Saudi journalist Jamaka, who 84 00:05:57,120 --> 00:06:01,159 Speaker 1: vanished after entering the Saudi Arabian consulate in Restrountable details 85 00:06:01,200 --> 00:06:03,520 Speaker 1: are pouring in about the likely death of this Washington 86 00:06:03,520 --> 00:06:09,480 Speaker 1: Post columnist because and they are just simply horrified. Jamal 87 00:06:09,560 --> 00:06:13,320 Speaker 1: Kashogi Hannan's newly what husband, the Saudi journalist who had 88 00:06:13,320 --> 00:06:16,080 Speaker 1: been living in Washington, d C. In South exile writing 89 00:06:16,080 --> 00:06:19,440 Speaker 1: op eds for the Washington Post, was assassinated just months 90 00:06:19,480 --> 00:06:26,200 Speaker 1: after her detention. We never thought me under Jomal, they 91 00:06:26,240 --> 00:06:30,120 Speaker 1: will be extremists to their level to kill him, and 92 00:06:30,279 --> 00:06:35,600 Speaker 1: this terrible way. When Kashoki disappeared from the Saudi consulate 93 00:06:35,640 --> 00:06:38,720 Speaker 1: in it would be weeks before the world learned what 94 00:06:38,880 --> 00:06:42,680 Speaker 1: occurred in his final hours. But it's taken years for 95 00:06:42,760 --> 00:06:46,400 Speaker 1: us to learn he wasn't just killed, he was systematically 96 00:06:46,480 --> 00:06:50,440 Speaker 1: hunted in a way we have never seen before. And 97 00:06:50,480 --> 00:06:52,920 Speaker 1: what we now know is that the first weapon used 98 00:06:52,920 --> 00:06:58,279 Speaker 1: against Kashogi was digital and it's called Pegasus. Pegasus is 99 00:06:58,279 --> 00:07:00,960 Speaker 1: probably the most advanced piece of spy where it is 100 00:07:01,000 --> 00:07:05,200 Speaker 1: effectively the most invasive form of surveillance imaginable licenses this 101 00:07:05,360 --> 00:07:10,360 Speaker 1: software to intelligence and law enforcement agencies. Worldwime tool can 102 00:07:10,520 --> 00:07:15,600 Speaker 1: also be deployed by a government to crush descent. Pecasus 103 00:07:15,640 --> 00:07:17,400 Speaker 1: is a kind of software that can be used to 104 00:07:17,480 --> 00:07:22,000 Speaker 1: hijack your phone. It's a military grade spying software. It's 105 00:07:22,000 --> 00:07:25,800 Speaker 1: this magic thing. It can infect your phone, and once 106 00:07:25,880 --> 00:07:28,600 Speaker 1: it does, it's inside of your phone and it's like 107 00:07:28,640 --> 00:07:33,600 Speaker 1: a little worm and it can burrow into every piece 108 00:07:33,680 --> 00:07:37,600 Speaker 1: of equipment in your phone. This is Dana Priest. She 109 00:07:37,720 --> 00:07:41,520 Speaker 1: covers national security for the Washington Post, the same newspaper 110 00:07:41,600 --> 00:07:46,640 Speaker 1: as Jamal Kashogi. It can turn the microphone on, it 111 00:07:46,680 --> 00:07:49,680 Speaker 1: can turn the camera on. It can go into all 112 00:07:49,760 --> 00:07:54,000 Speaker 1: of your photos, all of your emails, even your deleted messages, 113 00:07:54,600 --> 00:07:59,360 Speaker 1: and scoop them up and take them somewhere seven and 114 00:07:59,440 --> 00:08:03,760 Speaker 1: you'll never know it. You'll never know it. Pegasus implicates 115 00:08:03,880 --> 00:08:08,680 Speaker 1: several countries and multiple government agencies. And unites unlikely allies. 116 00:08:09,960 --> 00:08:13,960 Speaker 1: It's part of a massive and mostly unregulated, multibillion dollar 117 00:08:14,040 --> 00:08:19,559 Speaker 1: global industry. Battlefields aren't physical anymore. They aren't far away 118 00:08:19,600 --> 00:08:23,440 Speaker 1: across oceans or borders. They're in our pocket. And the 119 00:08:23,520 --> 00:08:26,320 Speaker 1: threats that journalists face as they seek out and reveal 120 00:08:26,440 --> 00:08:30,360 Speaker 1: uncomfortable truths are threats that we are all vulnerable to, 121 00:08:31,000 --> 00:08:34,000 Speaker 1: no matter where we live, who we know, and what 122 00:08:34,040 --> 00:08:39,679 Speaker 1: we do. Jamaica Showgi's assassination reveals that journalists are the 123 00:08:39,679 --> 00:08:42,800 Speaker 1: canaries in the coal mine these days. You don't have 124 00:08:42,880 --> 00:08:45,640 Speaker 1: to be a high profile journalists or a dissident or 125 00:08:45,679 --> 00:08:48,880 Speaker 1: a famous truth teller to get swept up. If you've 126 00:08:48,920 --> 00:08:51,400 Speaker 1: ever had a phone, if you've ever had a secret, 127 00:08:52,120 --> 00:08:59,520 Speaker 1: you're at risk too. I'm Nando Vila and I'm Rose 128 00:08:59,559 --> 00:09:03,920 Speaker 1: Reed and this is Shoot the Messenger, a new investigative 129 00:09:03,920 --> 00:09:09,160 Speaker 1: reporting podcast from Exile Content Studio. Every season, we investigate 130 00:09:09,240 --> 00:09:12,880 Speaker 1: one international news story. You may have heard the headlines. 131 00:09:13,520 --> 00:09:16,920 Speaker 1: This is the deep dive. Nando and I started the 132 00:09:16,960 --> 00:09:20,160 Speaker 1: series with one question, what is the biggest threat to 133 00:09:20,240 --> 00:09:23,559 Speaker 1: journalists today? We put up a bulletin board and stuck 134 00:09:23,559 --> 00:09:26,479 Speaker 1: a pen for every journalist who was threatened or assassinated, 135 00:09:26,840 --> 00:09:29,000 Speaker 1: or if they had a family member who was threatened 136 00:09:29,080 --> 00:09:32,000 Speaker 1: or assassinated directly because of their work in the last 137 00:09:32,080 --> 00:09:36,120 Speaker 1: five years, and we found one link that kept coming 138 00:09:36,200 --> 00:09:40,000 Speaker 1: up again and again from Mexico to d C to 139 00:09:40,080 --> 00:09:44,920 Speaker 1: the United Arab Emirates Pegasus. How did this spyware come 140 00:09:44,960 --> 00:09:48,840 Speaker 1: to be? How does it work? And how vulnerable are you? 141 00:09:49,679 --> 00:09:52,360 Speaker 1: Over the course of ten episodes, we're doing a special 142 00:09:52,400 --> 00:09:57,280 Speaker 1: partnership with the Committee to Protect Journalists on espionage, murder 143 00:09:57,320 --> 00:10:01,200 Speaker 1: and Pegasus spyware put in the hell could have happened 144 00:10:01,200 --> 00:10:04,839 Speaker 1: in there? Which he's together what happened? Almost like who 145 00:10:04,960 --> 00:10:08,160 Speaker 1: done it? Given one instance of an attack, can we 146 00:10:08,240 --> 00:10:11,680 Speaker 1: trace that to other instances in other countries as well? 147 00:10:11,800 --> 00:10:14,960 Speaker 1: Regarding the spying and the Bagatis, we did not know 148 00:10:15,920 --> 00:10:19,400 Speaker 1: they did drag through me because they do and the 149 00:10:19,480 --> 00:10:26,160 Speaker 1: closest to hunt him they started with me. Episode one 150 00:10:26,840 --> 00:10:32,319 Speaker 1: Jamaica Shogi, a story told in three parts his life, 151 00:10:32,800 --> 00:10:40,559 Speaker 1: death and betrayal. Jamal was a great man as a 152 00:10:40,679 --> 00:10:45,320 Speaker 1: journalist and as a husband. Hanana latter first met Jamalka 153 00:10:45,360 --> 00:10:48,840 Speaker 1: Shogi at a conference in two thousand and nine. Jamal 154 00:10:49,000 --> 00:10:51,280 Speaker 1: is a kind of person we can say is not 155 00:10:51,559 --> 00:10:54,400 Speaker 1: in the right or left. He's in the middle in 156 00:10:54,440 --> 00:10:58,480 Speaker 1: his opinion and his vision because he's very open minded. 157 00:10:59,360 --> 00:11:02,360 Speaker 1: Any bad ground can sit down with Jamal, any race, 158 00:11:02,679 --> 00:11:07,000 Speaker 1: any doluji and do you have a different view home him? 159 00:11:07,040 --> 00:11:10,760 Speaker 1: But you will walk away with a smile. Nana Kashoki 160 00:11:10,840 --> 00:11:13,080 Speaker 1: captain touch and they are friends for almost a decade 161 00:11:13,120 --> 00:11:17,160 Speaker 1: before their romance began. I met Jamal first time with 162 00:11:17,600 --> 00:11:20,840 Speaker 1: was a nine in Dubai where I grown up and 163 00:11:21,960 --> 00:11:25,840 Speaker 1: I remember very well. We had a conversation over two hours. 164 00:11:26,080 --> 00:11:29,400 Speaker 1: He was talking about the Middle East politics and form 165 00:11:29,520 --> 00:11:35,199 Speaker 1: policy of US toward the Middle East, and we realize 166 00:11:35,280 --> 00:11:39,320 Speaker 1: we are like a twin and we continue. And I 167 00:11:39,480 --> 00:11:42,560 Speaker 1: always used to give him a feedback in any article 168 00:11:42,760 --> 00:11:45,320 Speaker 1: in the published opinion. I used to give him a 169 00:11:45,320 --> 00:11:48,600 Speaker 1: feedback and he was always waiting for me, calling me up, 170 00:11:48,679 --> 00:11:52,360 Speaker 1: discussing with me. Kahoki spent most of his career as 171 00:11:52,400 --> 00:11:55,440 Speaker 1: a writer and editor for Amadina, one of the oldest 172 00:11:55,480 --> 00:11:59,640 Speaker 1: and biggest newspapers in Saudi Arabia. Kashoki had grown up 173 00:11:59,679 --> 00:12:03,560 Speaker 1: among a social elite and considered himself a moderate, but 174 00:12:03,679 --> 00:12:06,400 Speaker 1: over time he developed a reputation in the Middle East 175 00:12:06,760 --> 00:12:11,320 Speaker 1: for speaking truth to power. Speaking out cost him several jobs. 176 00:12:12,120 --> 00:12:14,920 Speaker 1: He was fired from Almadina for publishing pieces that were 177 00:12:14,920 --> 00:12:18,680 Speaker 1: critical of the Saudi regime, supporting women's rights to drive, 178 00:12:19,320 --> 00:12:22,120 Speaker 1: or blowing the whistle on corruption among the religious police. 179 00:12:23,600 --> 00:12:28,200 Speaker 1: Kaushoki then worked for Saudi ambassadors and diplomats, living between Washington, 180 00:12:28,280 --> 00:12:31,840 Speaker 1: d C. And Saudi Arabia. This way he was able 181 00:12:31,880 --> 00:12:35,520 Speaker 1: to maintain his elite social status in the kingdom, and 182 00:12:35,559 --> 00:12:39,680 Speaker 1: then in the Arab spring erupted across the Middle East. 183 00:12:40,520 --> 00:12:44,920 Speaker 1: It's the first Arab revolution of three or it will 184 00:12:44,920 --> 00:12:49,720 Speaker 1: be that people were fearless, but that they were joyous deposed. 185 00:12:49,840 --> 00:12:57,080 Speaker 1: Egypt eighteen day revolution defies all expectations. Protesters across Tunisia, Libya, Egypt, 186 00:12:57,120 --> 00:13:00,800 Speaker 1: Syria and Bahrain used social media to nice the masses 187 00:13:01,040 --> 00:13:04,439 Speaker 1: and take to the streets. In turn, many leaders in 188 00:13:04,480 --> 00:13:07,440 Speaker 1: the region began to heavily surveil social media in order 189 00:13:07,480 --> 00:13:11,880 Speaker 1: to curtail public discourse and dissent. A new industry developed 190 00:13:11,920 --> 00:13:15,480 Speaker 1: to keep up with government's demand to surveil. The press 191 00:13:15,520 --> 00:13:18,920 Speaker 1: was a major target. The Committee to Protect Journalists has 192 00:13:18,960 --> 00:13:22,840 Speaker 1: reported that at the end of more than three hundred 193 00:13:22,840 --> 00:13:28,480 Speaker 1: and sixty journalists, which is increase over around the world. 194 00:13:28,520 --> 00:13:32,480 Speaker 1: Are currently imprisoned, either charged with crimes against the state 195 00:13:32,720 --> 00:13:36,520 Speaker 1: like treason, or their paper of record charged with libel, 196 00:13:37,200 --> 00:13:41,040 Speaker 1: or even a personal matter exposed if illegal in their country, 197 00:13:41,200 --> 00:13:45,840 Speaker 1: like committing adultery. Journalism such a critical component at the 198 00:13:45,880 --> 00:13:48,559 Speaker 1: outset of the Arab Spring has become one of its 199 00:13:48,640 --> 00:13:51,920 Speaker 1: long term casual. For the very first time, a lot 200 00:13:51,960 --> 00:13:55,200 Speaker 1: of the main television channels in Egypt are directly owned 201 00:13:55,440 --> 00:13:58,559 Speaker 1: by the Egyptian military. This is new. You only need 202 00:13:58,640 --> 00:14:02,200 Speaker 1: to target a handful of journalists before the rest of 203 00:14:02,240 --> 00:14:07,600 Speaker 1: them are in line. Enjoying the episode, make sure to 204 00:14:07,679 --> 00:14:11,640 Speaker 1: subscribe to Shoot the Messenger Espionage Murder and Pegasus spyware. 205 00:14:12,400 --> 00:14:15,040 Speaker 1: You can find exiles Shoot the Messenger anywhere you get 206 00:14:15,040 --> 00:14:20,880 Speaker 1: your podcasts. Okay, let's get back to the episode. Following 207 00:14:20,920 --> 00:14:23,920 Speaker 1: the Arab Spring in two thousand and eleven, authorities across 208 00:14:23,960 --> 00:14:27,800 Speaker 1: North Africa and the Middle East increased online censorship and 209 00:14:27,840 --> 00:14:32,600 Speaker 1: took over broadcast networks and media companies. Revolution did not 210 00:14:32,760 --> 00:14:37,480 Speaker 1: come to Saudi Arabia, but in Saudi Arabia got a 211 00:14:37,480 --> 00:14:41,200 Speaker 1: new leader, now a thirty one, an astonishing rights to 212 00:14:41,240 --> 00:14:46,560 Speaker 1: power appears complete. They call him MBS. He's young, popular 213 00:14:46,800 --> 00:14:51,160 Speaker 1: and promising more change than these country's ever seen. The 214 00:14:51,160 --> 00:14:55,480 Speaker 1: Crown Prince Mohammed bin Salman, commonly referred to as MBS, 215 00:14:55,880 --> 00:14:59,560 Speaker 1: initially spoke of reforms. He allowed women to drive and 216 00:14:59,600 --> 00:15:04,800 Speaker 1: attend sporting events. But while MBS endorsed some social reform, 217 00:15:04,840 --> 00:15:09,600 Speaker 1: he crushed any type of political reform or opposition. Here's 218 00:15:09,600 --> 00:15:12,280 Speaker 1: a clip of Jamal ka Shogi commenting on the new leadership, 219 00:15:12,360 --> 00:15:16,480 Speaker 1: taken from an interview he did with Global News. I 220 00:15:16,560 --> 00:15:20,120 Speaker 1: have fixed freelings about that. I'm very much supportive for 221 00:15:20,320 --> 00:15:23,640 Speaker 1: his reform, for his social reform, but in the same 222 00:15:23,640 --> 00:15:29,960 Speaker 1: time I immediately say he doesn't need to disintimidation. Mohammed 223 00:15:30,040 --> 00:15:32,960 Speaker 1: bin Samon took the new social media playbook to a 224 00:15:32,960 --> 00:15:36,760 Speaker 1: new level in Saudi Arabia. He worked closely with authorities 225 00:15:36,800 --> 00:15:42,440 Speaker 1: to watch, target and silence any opposition, either discrediting opponents 226 00:15:42,520 --> 00:15:47,240 Speaker 1: and complex media campaigns or arresting them and sometimes their 227 00:15:47,280 --> 00:15:52,680 Speaker 1: family members as well. Kahoki's friends advised him to be careful. 228 00:15:54,680 --> 00:15:57,040 Speaker 1: It was sad to me, but it is not that 229 00:15:57,080 --> 00:16:00,360 Speaker 1: I time to shave MBS and his media is our 230 00:16:00,640 --> 00:16:05,280 Speaker 1: singled out independent journalists after Koshogi openly questioned the Saudi 231 00:16:05,320 --> 00:16:08,400 Speaker 1: regime support for the newly elected American President Donald Trump 232 00:16:08,440 --> 00:16:12,960 Speaker 1: on Twitter. Authorities told Koshogi to stay offline in two 233 00:16:13,000 --> 00:16:17,520 Speaker 1: thousand sixteen because he said a negative opinion about electing 234 00:16:17,560 --> 00:16:21,520 Speaker 1: President Donald Trump. The Saudi authority did most like he 235 00:16:21,840 --> 00:16:25,440 Speaker 1: speaking frankly and ask him to sit down at home, 236 00:16:25,760 --> 00:16:28,880 Speaker 1: not to write anything. Most to a bear almost under 237 00:16:28,920 --> 00:16:36,920 Speaker 1: house arrested in the summer of two thousand seventeen, Jamak 238 00:16:36,960 --> 00:16:40,160 Speaker 1: Kashogi decided it was time to leave his home country 239 00:16:40,280 --> 00:16:44,000 Speaker 1: of Saudi Arabia. What iver ner space I had was 240 00:16:44,040 --> 00:16:47,240 Speaker 1: getting nerwer So I just decided to leave before I 241 00:16:47,400 --> 00:16:50,160 Speaker 1: just do it. Sixty years old and they want to 242 00:16:50,240 --> 00:16:53,040 Speaker 1: enjoy life and they want to be three to speak 243 00:16:53,080 --> 00:16:57,600 Speaker 1: for my country. Kashoki continued his reporting, but he never 244 00:16:57,640 --> 00:17:02,720 Speaker 1: considered himself a dissident. Jammal did not leave to criticize, 245 00:17:02,840 --> 00:17:06,840 Speaker 1: only just for a sick of criticize. Jam l was 246 00:17:06,920 --> 00:17:11,080 Speaker 1: of domestic about future of his country. He loved his country, 247 00:17:11,200 --> 00:17:14,879 Speaker 1: but he loved to be identified as in Saogia and Arabs. 248 00:17:15,880 --> 00:17:18,920 Speaker 1: Kashoki went to d C and began writing Our Beds 249 00:17:18,960 --> 00:17:22,400 Speaker 1: for the Washington Post. Kashogi put more than six thousand 250 00:17:22,400 --> 00:17:25,480 Speaker 1: miles between himself and the Crown Prince, and thought he 251 00:17:25,480 --> 00:17:27,800 Speaker 1: would start a new chapter, one where he could be 252 00:17:27,840 --> 00:17:34,359 Speaker 1: free to speak his mind. Hanan allowed her remembers the 253 00:17:34,480 --> 00:17:38,280 Speaker 1: day Kaushoki arrived in the United States. I was in 254 00:17:38,400 --> 00:17:42,159 Speaker 1: London in this day, operating my flights. Immediately I called 255 00:17:42,160 --> 00:17:45,520 Speaker 1: to him to chicken him. I was so happy, and 256 00:17:45,680 --> 00:17:48,400 Speaker 1: I did tell him something and I believe in it. 257 00:17:48,720 --> 00:17:53,800 Speaker 1: I said, make use of your freedom. Speak up, And 258 00:17:53,880 --> 00:17:57,320 Speaker 1: Kashoki did speak up. He used his new platform in 259 00:17:57,359 --> 00:18:00,119 Speaker 1: the United States to comment on his home country and 260 00:18:00,200 --> 00:18:04,280 Speaker 1: Middle Eastern politics, and his first columns for The Washington Post, 261 00:18:04,560 --> 00:18:08,760 Speaker 1: Kashogi wrote, quote Saudi Arabia's Crown Prince is acting like Putin, 262 00:18:09,320 --> 00:18:14,679 Speaker 1: and quote Saudi Arabia wasn't always this repressive. Now it's unbearable. 263 00:18:16,600 --> 00:18:19,960 Speaker 1: As Jamaka Shogi worked in exile, his fan base grew 264 00:18:20,000 --> 00:18:23,880 Speaker 1: to over a million followers on Twitter. Saudi has an 265 00:18:23,880 --> 00:18:27,720 Speaker 1: extremely active Twitter base. There's data showing that more than 266 00:18:27,880 --> 00:18:32,080 Speaker 1: seventy of Saudis are Twitter users. Even in ocean away 267 00:18:32,080 --> 00:18:35,159 Speaker 1: from Saudi Arabia Jamaica, Shogi still knew he had to 268 00:18:35,160 --> 00:18:38,960 Speaker 1: be cautious. He avoided going to Saudi embassies and would 269 00:18:39,000 --> 00:18:42,560 Speaker 1: tell his fellow exiled friends to avoid them too, But 270 00:18:42,640 --> 00:18:46,520 Speaker 1: he wasn't scared. As Hanan would describe, he was trying 271 00:18:46,560 --> 00:18:50,359 Speaker 1: to be careful, but he wasn't scared for his life. 272 00:18:50,440 --> 00:18:53,720 Speaker 1: He never come back home and the books that change 273 00:18:53,760 --> 00:18:56,440 Speaker 1: fifty chin in the door I used to do before 274 00:18:56,440 --> 00:19:00,200 Speaker 1: we go to sleep. Kashoki got comfortable with his new 275 00:19:00,240 --> 00:19:03,800 Speaker 1: life in exile, but he was homesick. He wanted to 276 00:19:03,800 --> 00:19:07,520 Speaker 1: build a more permanent home and turned to Istanbul, Turkey, 277 00:19:07,680 --> 00:19:10,960 Speaker 1: a mix between east and West, closer to his home country, 278 00:19:11,000 --> 00:19:14,680 Speaker 1: but what Kashogi considered a safe enough distance. We agree. 279 00:19:14,760 --> 00:19:16,960 Speaker 1: You have to buy a fleft in the stumble, to 280 00:19:16,960 --> 00:19:19,439 Speaker 1: get a passport and to get a shelter from the 281 00:19:19,520 --> 00:19:24,439 Speaker 1: Turkish authority. Moving a Turkey this is where things got 282 00:19:25,080 --> 00:19:29,440 Speaker 1: a little more complicated. Well, Jamal's personal life was more 283 00:19:29,480 --> 00:19:37,120 Speaker 1: complex than we knew before he died. He had two relationships. 284 00:19:37,760 --> 00:19:42,320 Speaker 1: One was a longer relationship and he was married and 285 00:19:42,400 --> 00:19:47,159 Speaker 1: that was Hanan. And the second relationship that we knew 286 00:19:47,240 --> 00:19:54,400 Speaker 1: more about was his recent fiance Hatija in Turkey, so 287 00:19:55,119 --> 00:19:58,119 Speaker 1: the two women did not know each other. During a 288 00:19:58,119 --> 00:20:01,720 Speaker 1: trip to Istanbul, a friend entroduce Koshogi to a Turkish scholar, 289 00:20:02,119 --> 00:20:06,920 Speaker 1: Hatija Sindas. Around the same time, Kashoki married Hanan in 290 00:20:06,960 --> 00:20:10,760 Speaker 1: a religious Muslim ceremony and Washington d c he began 291 00:20:10,880 --> 00:20:15,919 Speaker 1: dating Hatija and Istanbul and Hanan didn't know about Hadija, 292 00:20:16,040 --> 00:20:20,920 Speaker 1: and Atisha didn't know about Hanan, and most people, honestly, 293 00:20:21,080 --> 00:20:24,960 Speaker 1: even his good friends, did not know about Hanan. We're 294 00:20:25,000 --> 00:20:29,040 Speaker 1: not here to focus on Koshogi's romantic endeavors. He's not 295 00:20:29,080 --> 00:20:32,240 Speaker 1: here to explain himself to us or to the women 296 00:20:32,240 --> 00:20:36,199 Speaker 1: in his life. But it's important to know because to 297 00:20:36,280 --> 00:20:39,879 Speaker 1: understand how Koshoki died, we need to unpack the logistical 298 00:20:40,000 --> 00:20:45,359 Speaker 1: details around the engagement to Turkish scholar Hatija Sindas because 299 00:20:45,840 --> 00:20:50,800 Speaker 1: to get legally married in Turkey, Kashogi needed paperwork, and 300 00:20:51,080 --> 00:20:54,439 Speaker 1: to get that paperwork, Kashoki had to go to the 301 00:20:54,440 --> 00:21:09,320 Speaker 1: Saudi consulate in Istanbul. On Friday, septem eighteen, Jamal Ko 302 00:21:09,359 --> 00:21:12,360 Speaker 1: Shogi didn't make an appointment to visit the Saudi consulate. 303 00:21:12,680 --> 00:21:18,040 Speaker 1: He just walked in and to kashogi surprise, he was 304 00:21:18,119 --> 00:21:22,800 Speaker 1: greeted warmly. After years of experiencing harassment and intimidation from 305 00:21:22,840 --> 00:21:25,640 Speaker 1: the government, which had ultimately forced him to live in exile. 306 00:21:26,160 --> 00:21:29,320 Speaker 1: Kaushogi found himself being offered tea by the Saudi officials 307 00:21:29,320 --> 00:21:32,520 Speaker 1: in Istanbul. They told him to come back Tuesday, October 308 00:21:32,560 --> 00:21:36,520 Speaker 1: two to get the final paperwork. In the last five days, 309 00:21:36,600 --> 00:21:40,159 Speaker 1: Kashogi was alive. He lived like a freeman. He traveled 310 00:21:40,200 --> 00:21:42,719 Speaker 1: to London for a conference, made plans for the future. 311 00:21:43,400 --> 00:21:46,400 Speaker 1: He was emailing his editors at the Washington Post, bloodsapping 312 00:21:46,400 --> 00:21:49,800 Speaker 1: with friends across the world, texting with Hanan, and arranging 313 00:21:49,840 --> 00:21:55,280 Speaker 1: logistics with Hatch back in Istanbul. The morning of Tuesday 314 00:21:55,359 --> 00:21:59,720 Speaker 1: October two, two eighteen, Kashogi met Hatija at an empty 315 00:21:59,760 --> 00:22:02,600 Speaker 1: apart minut in his temple one that would be their 316 00:22:02,600 --> 00:22:06,880 Speaker 1: new home. CCTV captured the couple holding hands on their 317 00:22:06,920 --> 00:22:10,119 Speaker 1: walk to the Saudi consulate. They went together to the 318 00:22:10,119 --> 00:22:14,080 Speaker 1: points to look and it's in a quiet, leafy, very 319 00:22:14,200 --> 00:22:18,440 Speaker 1: pretty residential area. This is Carlotta Golf, the bureau chief 320 00:22:18,440 --> 00:22:20,720 Speaker 1: of the New York Times in is Stumble who reported 321 00:22:20,720 --> 00:22:24,280 Speaker 1: on the Jamaica Shogi case. He handed her his bones 322 00:22:25,560 --> 00:22:30,320 Speaker 1: and goes in, and so she waited outside. It was 323 00:22:30,359 --> 00:22:34,520 Speaker 1: one four pm when Kashogi entered the consulate and then 324 00:22:34,520 --> 00:22:37,360 Speaker 1: that was the last, only one sort of thing um, 325 00:22:37,400 --> 00:22:42,480 Speaker 1: and then she's hanging around for hours after until finally 326 00:22:42,520 --> 00:22:46,520 Speaker 1: it's clear that concerts closed and she asks the god. 327 00:22:47,000 --> 00:22:49,440 Speaker 1: They say there's no one here. She asks the police 328 00:22:49,720 --> 00:22:52,400 Speaker 1: and they say everyone's gone. And that's when she started 329 00:22:52,440 --> 00:22:56,320 Speaker 1: and it calls to people. Her teacher made many calls 330 00:22:56,359 --> 00:23:00,000 Speaker 1: that night, including some to journalists, which is how Carlotta 331 00:23:00,080 --> 00:23:03,160 Speaker 1: got the tip. Because Shogi had disappeared from the Saudi consulate. 332 00:23:05,359 --> 00:23:09,920 Speaker 1: The next day, I went up to consulate and that's 333 00:23:09,920 --> 00:23:12,240 Speaker 1: where I ran into her teacha and she was sort 334 00:23:12,240 --> 00:23:16,320 Speaker 1: of still there, pacing sidewalk, and she'd been there all 335 00:23:16,400 --> 00:23:21,320 Speaker 1: that previous night, and then um was outstanding outside the 336 00:23:21,359 --> 00:23:23,919 Speaker 1: whole one next day, and I was the first interview 337 00:23:23,920 --> 00:23:26,560 Speaker 1: she gave in. But actually when she saw me, she 338 00:23:26,720 --> 00:23:31,080 Speaker 1: just started to open up the society dissidents who wouldn't 339 00:23:31,080 --> 00:23:34,840 Speaker 1: go near a Saudi concert or embassy. I knew there 340 00:23:34,880 --> 00:23:38,720 Speaker 1: were stories of previous kidnappings. I was thinking he might 341 00:23:38,760 --> 00:23:40,960 Speaker 1: have been taken out in the trunk of a car, 342 00:23:41,440 --> 00:23:44,880 Speaker 1: and I was imagining she had been taken to an airport, 343 00:23:44,960 --> 00:23:50,520 Speaker 1: private airport, and already deport or renditioned as the word 344 00:23:50,600 --> 00:23:57,040 Speaker 1: goes what happened from Jamaica security camera captured the last 345 00:23:57,080 --> 00:24:00,400 Speaker 1: time journalist Jamaica Shogi was seen a lot. The group 346 00:24:00,400 --> 00:24:03,359 Speaker 1: of senators is also written to trigger an investigation. The 347 00:24:03,400 --> 00:24:12,320 Speaker 1: State Department says that is premature. Dana Priest remembers the 348 00:24:12,359 --> 00:24:16,639 Speaker 1: day Jamaka Shogi went missing. My mind kept flashing back 349 00:24:16,680 --> 00:24:18,560 Speaker 1: to the two of us. We were seated around this 350 00:24:18,720 --> 00:24:24,080 Speaker 1: gigantic empty table, very beautiful white tent, white tablecloth. That 351 00:24:24,240 --> 00:24:26,960 Speaker 1: face kept coming back to me, and I just kept saying, 352 00:24:27,800 --> 00:24:30,439 Speaker 1: what in the hell could have happened in there? You know, 353 00:24:30,840 --> 00:24:35,280 Speaker 1: in no way could I have imagined what was happening. 354 00:24:36,000 --> 00:24:41,600 Speaker 1: Mm hmm yeah. As news of Kashogi's disappearance spread across 355 00:24:41,640 --> 00:24:44,760 Speaker 1: the world, local reporters on the scene in Istanbul, including 356 00:24:44,800 --> 00:24:48,760 Speaker 1: Carlotta Gal, We're working together to get more information, but 357 00:24:49,000 --> 00:24:52,960 Speaker 1: none of us had any idea of what really had happened. 358 00:24:53,520 --> 00:24:57,000 Speaker 1: We pieced together what happened, almost like who done it? 359 00:24:58,000 --> 00:25:02,080 Speaker 1: For one week, Jamaka Shogi remained unaccounted for, the Saudi 360 00:25:02,119 --> 00:25:06,000 Speaker 1: government evaded questions about his disappearance. It was as if 361 00:25:06,040 --> 00:25:10,840 Speaker 1: he had vanished into thin air. And then Turkish intelligence 362 00:25:11,000 --> 00:25:14,679 Speaker 1: released secret tapes. So We've been able to piece together 363 00:25:14,720 --> 00:25:19,960 Speaker 1: the last minutes of Kashogi's life. Be warned, it's quite explicit. 364 00:25:20,480 --> 00:25:24,560 Speaker 1: Major breaking news this morning, A jaw dropping exclusive on 365 00:25:24,600 --> 00:25:28,120 Speaker 1: the murder of Washington Post journalist Jamaka Shogi. New footage 366 00:25:28,160 --> 00:25:32,439 Speaker 1: that is flat out shocking. Lying in white inside was 367 00:25:32,560 --> 00:25:37,480 Speaker 1: a Saudi hit squad. The transcript indicates noises as people 368 00:25:37,640 --> 00:25:42,160 Speaker 1: set upon KOI can be heard saying I can't breathe. 369 00:25:42,240 --> 00:25:45,800 Speaker 1: Kashogi was then injected with a sedative and suffocated with 370 00:25:45,840 --> 00:25:49,240 Speaker 1: a plastic bag brought with them an autopsies expert and 371 00:25:49,520 --> 00:25:52,760 Speaker 1: a bone sawed to put the body in a bug 372 00:25:52,960 --> 00:25:56,680 Speaker 1: no too heavy, very cool. Kagi was allegedly beheaded and 373 00:25:56,760 --> 00:25:59,960 Speaker 1: dismembered limb by Limb, apparent leader of the team. May 374 00:26:00,359 --> 00:26:03,639 Speaker 1: at least three phone calls during the murder to a 375 00:26:03,720 --> 00:26:07,520 Speaker 1: number of Turkish officials identify as being in the Saudi 376 00:26:07,640 --> 00:26:11,840 Speaker 1: Royal court. The thing is done, It's done. It is 377 00:26:11,880 --> 00:26:16,200 Speaker 1: possible that Jamal's body was transported back on on one 378 00:26:16,200 --> 00:26:18,280 Speaker 1: of the planes. A lot of meat was bought for 379 00:26:18,320 --> 00:26:22,719 Speaker 1: a barbecue that took place in the console's garden just 380 00:26:22,880 --> 00:26:25,520 Speaker 1: after the murder took place, and that the theory being 381 00:26:25,640 --> 00:26:30,640 Speaker 1: that Jamal's body was mixed with this meat and incinerated 382 00:26:30,680 --> 00:26:35,520 Speaker 1: at a very high temperature. And it's still kind of 383 00:26:35,560 --> 00:26:39,920 Speaker 1: appalls me that we were standing there in the street 384 00:26:40,000 --> 00:26:44,560 Speaker 1: outside this building where this unbelievable murder had already occurred, 385 00:26:44,680 --> 00:26:47,520 Speaker 1: you know. And I still think of that of Paul 386 00:26:47,720 --> 00:26:50,440 Speaker 1: her dj to think that she was just standing there 387 00:26:50,480 --> 00:26:53,760 Speaker 1: while he was being hacked to death inside. And I'm 388 00:26:53,800 --> 00:27:01,480 Speaker 1: sure she's still thinks about every day. Koshoki's murder caused 389 00:27:01,560 --> 00:27:06,520 Speaker 1: an international uproar. The grizzly details came out because Turkish 390 00:27:06,560 --> 00:27:10,280 Speaker 1: intelligence admitted that they had been bugging the Saudi consulate. 391 00:27:11,320 --> 00:27:13,560 Speaker 1: The Turk shared the tapes with the u N so 392 00:27:13,640 --> 00:27:16,480 Speaker 1: the world would know what had happened to Jamal ka Shogi. 393 00:27:17,760 --> 00:27:22,280 Speaker 1: Investigations by both the u N and the CIA unequivocally 394 00:27:22,320 --> 00:27:27,880 Speaker 1: linked Kashoki's murder with direct orders from inside the Saudi Kingdom. 395 00:27:27,920 --> 00:27:31,280 Speaker 1: We have breaking news this afternoon. Saudi Arabia's Crown Prince 396 00:27:31,359 --> 00:27:35,399 Speaker 1: Mommed Bin Salman approved the assassination of Washington Post columns 397 00:27:35,440 --> 00:27:40,480 Speaker 1: Jamal ka In. In one of Kashi's last columns for 398 00:27:40,520 --> 00:27:43,920 Speaker 1: the Washington Post, he wrote, what the Arab world needs 399 00:27:43,960 --> 00:27:47,640 Speaker 1: most is free expression. It has been four years since 400 00:27:47,680 --> 00:27:50,720 Speaker 1: Kashoki's murder, and the link to the Crown Prince is 401 00:27:50,800 --> 00:27:54,240 Speaker 1: just the tip of the iceberg. That's after the break 402 00:27:59,640 --> 00:28:02,800 Speaker 1: after or his murder, there were a number of roundups 403 00:28:02,800 --> 00:28:08,719 Speaker 1: of Saudis whose numbers appeared in the phones of people 404 00:28:08,880 --> 00:28:13,720 Speaker 1: who were around Jamal. But I believe the Saudis picked 405 00:28:13,800 --> 00:28:17,760 Speaker 1: up and in this case detained for months and months 406 00:28:18,080 --> 00:28:22,840 Speaker 1: people who were in contact with some of the people 407 00:28:23,080 --> 00:28:25,679 Speaker 1: the Jamals in contact with. So you're seeing this kind 408 00:28:25,720 --> 00:28:28,159 Speaker 1: of ripple effect. You know, Jamal's in the middle, and 409 00:28:28,200 --> 00:28:34,679 Speaker 1: then there's people who followed people who followed Jamal. What 410 00:28:34,800 --> 00:28:37,600 Speaker 1: new evidence has revealed and what we are piecing together 411 00:28:37,640 --> 00:28:40,280 Speaker 1: on this series is that Jamal ka Shogi was being 412 00:28:40,320 --> 00:28:44,800 Speaker 1: tracked more deliberately than anyone ever imagined. Several of the 413 00:28:44,880 --> 00:28:49,080 Speaker 1: people that he was in touching where surveyed by Pegasus. 414 00:28:49,160 --> 00:28:53,560 Speaker 1: Pegasus has been linked to human rights abuses on ethical surveillance. 415 00:28:53,640 --> 00:28:56,400 Speaker 1: The Pegasus spy where made by Israeli company and s 416 00:28:56,440 --> 00:28:59,040 Speaker 1: O Group, has been used to target journalist, dissidents, and 417 00:28:59,080 --> 00:29:03,120 Speaker 1: activists around The Pegasus spyware it is the most sophisticated 418 00:29:03,160 --> 00:29:06,360 Speaker 1: spyware made to date. It was created by an Israeli 419 00:29:06,400 --> 00:29:09,320 Speaker 1: tech company. It's marketed to governments as a way to target, 420 00:29:09,400 --> 00:29:13,800 Speaker 1: track and capture criminals and terrorists. But our investigation shows 421 00:29:13,960 --> 00:29:17,800 Speaker 1: that many confirmed targets of Pegasus are not criminals or terrorists. 422 00:29:19,040 --> 00:29:23,160 Speaker 1: The big question remains, did Jamal ka Shogi have Pegasus 423 00:29:23,200 --> 00:29:26,840 Speaker 1: on his phone? We may never be able to answer 424 00:29:26,880 --> 00:29:30,760 Speaker 1: that questions phones are still with Turkish authorities more than 425 00:29:30,800 --> 00:29:33,680 Speaker 1: four years after his death, but what we can do 426 00:29:34,080 --> 00:29:37,280 Speaker 1: is examined the lives and the phones of those closest 427 00:29:37,320 --> 00:29:42,080 Speaker 1: to him. We all obviously had an interest in knowing 428 00:29:42,400 --> 00:29:47,160 Speaker 1: whether Pegasus was used in any way to surveil, track 429 00:29:47,480 --> 00:29:51,360 Speaker 1: and then aid the killers in murdering Jamal ka Shogi. 430 00:29:52,000 --> 00:29:54,760 Speaker 1: Dana Priest from the Washington Post as one of dozens 431 00:29:54,760 --> 00:29:58,760 Speaker 1: of journalists working on the Pegasus project, a coalition of 432 00:29:58,840 --> 00:30:02,800 Speaker 1: journalists and activist that uncovers who has been infected with 433 00:30:02,960 --> 00:30:07,400 Speaker 1: and surveilled by Pegasus, and together they found a list 434 00:30:07,480 --> 00:30:11,480 Speaker 1: of confirmed cases, a list of phone numbers. Danna Priest 435 00:30:11,600 --> 00:30:14,240 Speaker 1: was focused on finding out if any of them were 436 00:30:14,280 --> 00:30:17,880 Speaker 1: connected to Jamal Kashogi. I drew a big circle of 437 00:30:17,920 --> 00:30:21,240 Speaker 1: his friends and tried to get as many phone numbers 438 00:30:21,240 --> 00:30:26,200 Speaker 1: that we could and we found about ten people. And 439 00:30:26,240 --> 00:30:29,680 Speaker 1: then a colleague of mine uh here at the post 440 00:30:29,800 --> 00:30:33,840 Speaker 1: had was able to match a number that was in 441 00:30:33,880 --> 00:30:38,440 Speaker 1: the database and was known to be associated with him, 442 00:30:38,680 --> 00:30:44,720 Speaker 1: which was Hanan a Lotter. At that time, Hanan was 443 00:30:44,840 --> 00:30:49,320 Speaker 1: really still in the background. Dana priests learned about Hanana 444 00:30:49,400 --> 00:30:53,880 Speaker 1: Lotter three years after the death of Kashogi. How could 445 00:30:53,880 --> 00:30:57,960 Speaker 1: Hanan's experiences reveal new information about the plot to murder 446 00:30:58,040 --> 00:31:04,080 Speaker 1: Jamal Kashogi. Let's rewind to five months before the murder 447 00:31:04,080 --> 00:31:09,520 Speaker 1: of Jamaica Shogy April. They took me to a horrible 448 00:31:09,640 --> 00:31:14,320 Speaker 1: place in the border of Dubai called Allawire. I didn't 449 00:31:14,320 --> 00:31:17,080 Speaker 1: know where I am because they blinded me and they 450 00:31:17,120 --> 00:31:22,400 Speaker 1: han'dcuffed me. It was very high security place. I've never 451 00:31:22,520 --> 00:31:26,440 Speaker 1: seen it in my life. And they took sample from 452 00:31:26,480 --> 00:31:29,360 Speaker 1: my d n A from my mouth, They take a 453 00:31:29,400 --> 00:31:33,320 Speaker 1: photo for me from different angle, They take a finger 454 00:31:33,400 --> 00:31:37,680 Speaker 1: brand and then they took me to this room for investigation. 455 00:31:38,240 --> 00:31:41,560 Speaker 1: When Hannan was taken by ui A government officials, they 456 00:31:41,560 --> 00:31:44,760 Speaker 1: were looking for something on Hanan's phone during her interrogation. 457 00:31:45,400 --> 00:31:48,200 Speaker 1: Till this moment, I don't know why they've taken me. 458 00:31:48,720 --> 00:31:51,160 Speaker 1: I came to know why they took me because they 459 00:31:51,200 --> 00:31:53,480 Speaker 1: have my phone with them in another room. They have 460 00:31:53,640 --> 00:31:57,080 Speaker 1: my password, and he sent me a message and they 461 00:31:57,120 --> 00:31:59,920 Speaker 1: came back to me and showed me and they said. 462 00:32:02,280 --> 00:32:05,600 Speaker 1: In the middle of Hanan's interrogation, she received a text 463 00:32:05,600 --> 00:32:09,720 Speaker 1: from Jama Kashogi. The officials saw the text and their 464 00:32:09,800 --> 00:32:13,600 Speaker 1: questions took a different turn. They asked about Koshoki's colleagues, 465 00:32:13,680 --> 00:32:17,959 Speaker 1: his friends, his plans. They wanted to know what he 466 00:32:18,000 --> 00:32:21,360 Speaker 1: was working on and who he was working with. This 467 00:32:21,480 --> 00:32:25,760 Speaker 1: interrogation continued into the morning. After seventeen hours, she was 468 00:32:25,800 --> 00:32:29,120 Speaker 1: given back her devices and taken home. They put me 469 00:32:29,160 --> 00:32:32,080 Speaker 1: on the house arrisk. They have my boss porst. They 470 00:32:32,160 --> 00:32:36,760 Speaker 1: belectlisted me and my family. My entire family could don't fly, 471 00:32:37,080 --> 00:32:41,040 Speaker 1: and after that I couldn't know how to communicate with him. 472 00:32:41,600 --> 00:32:44,760 Speaker 1: Amarati officials. Detaining a flight attendant in what appears to 473 00:32:44,800 --> 00:32:47,680 Speaker 1: be a favorite of the Saudi government is a critical moment. 474 00:32:48,520 --> 00:32:52,000 Speaker 1: Hanan understood that this was a bold act, but didn't 475 00:32:52,000 --> 00:32:55,600 Speaker 1: know what it all meant for her or for Kashogi. 476 00:32:56,120 --> 00:32:59,600 Speaker 1: After she was detained, she did not tell Jamal right away. 477 00:32:59,840 --> 00:33:02,040 Speaker 1: She didn't want to tell him on the phone, but 478 00:33:02,200 --> 00:33:05,480 Speaker 1: she didn't know who was listening to her, how they 479 00:33:05,720 --> 00:33:07,960 Speaker 1: knew where to come and get her, and you know, 480 00:33:08,000 --> 00:33:10,719 Speaker 1: so she was so afraid to talk to him and 481 00:33:10,760 --> 00:33:13,960 Speaker 1: tell him what had happened. Hanan was under house arrest 482 00:33:14,080 --> 00:33:16,920 Speaker 1: for several weeks after she was detained and interrogated by 483 00:33:16,920 --> 00:33:19,920 Speaker 1: the Emeraldi intelligence and could not meet Jamal ka Shogi 484 00:33:20,000 --> 00:33:22,720 Speaker 1: as they had planned in Washington, d C. But she 485 00:33:22,760 --> 00:33:26,000 Speaker 1: didn't know how to tell him what had happened. Jamal 486 00:33:26,120 --> 00:33:31,200 Speaker 1: went to airport Washington, DC airport was waiting for me 487 00:33:31,360 --> 00:33:35,720 Speaker 1: in the airport. Suddenly he called me in Dubai. He 488 00:33:35,880 --> 00:33:38,760 Speaker 1: told me, Hannan, I'm waiting for you and airport where 489 00:33:38,800 --> 00:33:42,440 Speaker 1: are you? I said, General, I'm not coming. He said why. 490 00:33:42,800 --> 00:33:46,200 Speaker 1: I said so, I tost me just I told him 491 00:33:46,200 --> 00:33:51,000 Speaker 1: I could to understand what's is my situation. Hanan's Code 492 00:33:51,120 --> 00:33:54,600 Speaker 1: is the name of an Egyptian actress. Both hananaka Shogi 493 00:33:54,640 --> 00:33:57,600 Speaker 1: shared a love for Egyptian cinema and are very familiar 494 00:33:57,600 --> 00:34:07,800 Speaker 1: with the star suart hostnik eat so what Hostne is 495 00:34:07,840 --> 00:34:12,160 Speaker 1: often called the Cinderella of Egyptian cinema. In two thousand 496 00:34:12,200 --> 00:34:15,560 Speaker 1: one swat host Ny fell from an apartment balcony in 497 00:34:15,640 --> 00:34:19,240 Speaker 1: London and died. Many believed she had ties to Egyptian 498 00:34:19,280 --> 00:34:22,759 Speaker 1: intelligence officials and that she was pushed from the balcony. 499 00:34:23,680 --> 00:34:26,319 Speaker 1: So what host me was an nonced code word to 500 00:34:26,440 --> 00:34:30,560 Speaker 1: indicate she didn't trust their line of communication. And he said, 501 00:34:30,600 --> 00:34:35,520 Speaker 1: so I tost me. He understood, He said to Hannah 502 00:34:35,760 --> 00:34:39,560 Speaker 1: and you, I would protect you. They kept changing ways 503 00:34:39,600 --> 00:34:45,239 Speaker 1: of communicating in an effort not to get surveilled. They 504 00:34:45,320 --> 00:34:49,840 Speaker 1: used all sorts of things at different times. So signal EMU, 505 00:34:50,040 --> 00:34:53,880 Speaker 1: what's that? A couple other things. They came and went. 506 00:34:54,520 --> 00:34:57,279 Speaker 1: After two months on house arrest, Hanan was released and 507 00:34:57,320 --> 00:35:00,200 Speaker 1: got her passport back. She was back to work okay 508 00:35:00,560 --> 00:35:02,319 Speaker 1: and went on a trip to the United States to 509 00:35:02,360 --> 00:35:06,239 Speaker 1: meet Kashog. They had plans to get married. We got 510 00:35:06,280 --> 00:35:09,960 Speaker 1: to marriage in June two thousand eighteen. They got married 511 00:35:10,520 --> 00:35:14,920 Speaker 1: here in Washington where Jamal had a house an apartment 512 00:35:15,040 --> 00:35:19,239 Speaker 1: in McLean, Virginia, and they were married in Islamics ceremony 513 00:35:19,360 --> 00:35:23,399 Speaker 1: only in part to protect her and all. They didn't 514 00:35:23,440 --> 00:35:27,080 Speaker 1: want to have any record in the civil courts that 515 00:35:27,160 --> 00:35:31,280 Speaker 1: she even existed here in the United States. Hanan Kashi 516 00:35:31,360 --> 00:35:33,719 Speaker 1: were married at a mosque, but they decided not to 517 00:35:33,719 --> 00:35:36,360 Speaker 1: get a civil license as Hanan did not have residents 518 00:35:36,400 --> 00:35:39,480 Speaker 1: in the US at the time. The summer of eighteen, 519 00:35:39,560 --> 00:35:42,520 Speaker 1: Hannan tried to put her detention behind her. She was 520 00:35:42,560 --> 00:35:47,480 Speaker 1: cautious but not paranoid. You think they are watching us 521 00:35:47,520 --> 00:35:50,560 Speaker 1: in a hotel lobby or in our room, but she 522 00:35:50,680 --> 00:35:55,560 Speaker 1: didn't move when we was in our room, Jamal unplug 523 00:35:56,000 --> 00:36:01,359 Speaker 1: the TV. This is what is the highest conscience for 524 00:36:01,440 --> 00:36:06,200 Speaker 1: him about buying or watching or something. Once I remember 525 00:36:06,600 --> 00:36:10,600 Speaker 1: he was trying to understood open in my bubile in 526 00:36:10,719 --> 00:36:13,600 Speaker 1: case I'm an our house in Virginia and his mother 527 00:36:13,719 --> 00:36:16,160 Speaker 1: there and they need to go around for my shopping 528 00:36:16,280 --> 00:36:19,920 Speaker 1: or something. He tried to install Uber and he was 529 00:36:20,040 --> 00:36:23,880 Speaker 1: going to put his credit card to number. Then he 530 00:36:24,080 --> 00:36:27,480 Speaker 1: deleted and they said why deleted German. He said, no, 531 00:36:27,640 --> 00:36:30,120 Speaker 1: if they get the phone from you and Dubai Hannah, 532 00:36:30,680 --> 00:36:36,920 Speaker 1: they can get get into my account. Hannan did not 533 00:36:37,040 --> 00:36:40,480 Speaker 1: know what to do after Kashoki was murdered, and occasionally 534 00:36:40,800 --> 00:36:45,680 Speaker 1: Amaradi intelligence officers will come by and ask questions, and 535 00:36:46,080 --> 00:36:50,480 Speaker 1: then Jamal's killed and she has nowhere to go. She's 536 00:36:50,640 --> 00:36:54,520 Speaker 1: frying for her life. She can't live in the U 537 00:36:54,640 --> 00:36:58,000 Speaker 1: a e. Anymore, So she comes to the United States 538 00:36:58,000 --> 00:37:00,680 Speaker 1: to talk to her lawyer, and her lawyers she just 539 00:37:00,680 --> 00:37:04,359 Speaker 1: just stay here and we'll apply for political asylum. And 540 00:37:04,440 --> 00:37:08,520 Speaker 1: so she is literally a forgotten woman. Here's this woman 541 00:37:08,520 --> 00:37:13,839 Speaker 1: that has potentially so much evidence to share in her 542 00:37:13,880 --> 00:37:18,600 Speaker 1: devices about Jamal's travels and who might have been tracking them, 543 00:37:18,640 --> 00:37:21,759 Speaker 1: and who might have been complicit with the Saudias, and 544 00:37:21,840 --> 00:37:24,640 Speaker 1: trying to figure out, you know, what his travel plans were, 545 00:37:24,760 --> 00:37:27,120 Speaker 1: what his other plans were, what he was thinking of doing, 546 00:37:27,920 --> 00:37:31,400 Speaker 1: and nobody had ever contacted her. So I took your 547 00:37:31,440 --> 00:37:35,400 Speaker 1: advices to a second group that does a lot of forensics, 548 00:37:35,560 --> 00:37:39,440 Speaker 1: Citizen Lab. So we worked with Bill. I'm Bill Marzac, 549 00:37:39,719 --> 00:37:43,479 Speaker 1: a senior research fellow at the University of Toronto's Citizen Lab. 550 00:37:44,040 --> 00:37:48,920 Speaker 1: I study government surveillance, basically trying to determine which governments 551 00:37:48,920 --> 00:37:53,400 Speaker 1: are hacking activists, dissidents, civil society and trying to defend 552 00:37:53,560 --> 00:37:57,040 Speaker 1: civil society against this this hacking. Bill Marzac is one 553 00:37:57,080 --> 00:38:00,160 Speaker 1: of the first people to discover Pegasus. He would need 554 00:38:00,200 --> 00:38:04,480 Speaker 1: to look at Hanan's phone. Who when I've been approached 555 00:38:04,520 --> 00:38:08,920 Speaker 1: first to cool from Washington post they asking me to corporate. 556 00:38:09,320 --> 00:38:12,880 Speaker 1: The exciplent to me, is they need my devices? I 557 00:38:12,920 --> 00:38:17,400 Speaker 1: did hand it over. Bill has experience reverse engineering Pegasus 558 00:38:17,440 --> 00:38:20,600 Speaker 1: and knew exactly what to look for examining Hanan's phone. 559 00:38:21,080 --> 00:38:22,560 Speaker 1: That's pretty much the only thing you can do when 560 00:38:22,560 --> 00:38:24,880 Speaker 1: you get a sample of something that might be interesting 561 00:38:24,920 --> 00:38:27,799 Speaker 1: spyware is you have to run it yourself and see 562 00:38:27,800 --> 00:38:30,680 Speaker 1: what happens. And I was monitoring the phone's Internet traffic, 563 00:38:31,200 --> 00:38:33,640 Speaker 1: so I was seeing everything that came into the phone 564 00:38:33,680 --> 00:38:36,320 Speaker 1: that left the phone. When I was monitoring the Internet traffic, 565 00:38:36,440 --> 00:38:40,320 Speaker 1: a bunch of weird traffic going to the spiral website 566 00:38:40,320 --> 00:38:43,120 Speaker 1: like it was downloading stuff. It was uploading stuff. Uh, 567 00:38:43,200 --> 00:38:45,680 Speaker 1: And that was sort of the first key that Oh wow, 568 00:38:46,000 --> 00:38:48,840 Speaker 1: so far as closed, but this connectivity is still happening 569 00:38:48,840 --> 00:38:52,680 Speaker 1: and it's sending information back. Pegasus can bypass any encryption 570 00:38:52,800 --> 00:38:55,440 Speaker 1: because it uses a loophole in a phone software to 571 00:38:55,480 --> 00:38:59,800 Speaker 1: be an incognito but active parasite. When Pegasus is on 572 00:38:59,840 --> 00:39:03,080 Speaker 1: a phone, Bill can see the evidence of it right away. 573 00:39:04,520 --> 00:39:06,759 Speaker 1: You can turn on the microphone to snoop in on 574 00:39:06,840 --> 00:39:09,960 Speaker 1: conversations happening around the device. You can take pictures through 575 00:39:09,960 --> 00:39:13,400 Speaker 1: the webcam, you can get passwords, you can get WhatsApp messages, 576 00:39:13,440 --> 00:39:16,360 Speaker 1: you can get signal messages, you can record calls, you 577 00:39:16,400 --> 00:39:18,680 Speaker 1: can track GPS, you can do other things with the 578 00:39:18,680 --> 00:39:23,640 Speaker 1: phone sensors. It was full access to the phone. And 579 00:39:23,680 --> 00:39:26,560 Speaker 1: there was something else they knew from the types of 580 00:39:26,640 --> 00:39:30,359 Speaker 1: text messages she had been sent, which had already been 581 00:39:30,400 --> 00:39:34,920 Speaker 1: identified as Pegasus bait, that they had tried to target 582 00:39:35,000 --> 00:39:39,560 Speaker 1: her uh several times. So why did the Emeraldi intelligence 583 00:39:39,600 --> 00:39:43,960 Speaker 1: officers detain Hanan a ladder and question her overnight. It 584 00:39:44,000 --> 00:39:46,600 Speaker 1: turns out they had been trying to trick Hanan into 585 00:39:46,680 --> 00:39:51,120 Speaker 1: downloading Pegasus herself. She had received random texts in the 586 00:39:51,160 --> 00:39:54,920 Speaker 1: months prior to her detention, but she never clicked on 587 00:39:54,960 --> 00:39:58,120 Speaker 1: the links. The bait to get Hanan to infect her 588 00:39:58,160 --> 00:40:02,279 Speaker 1: phone in two thousand eight teen were things like, you 589 00:40:02,360 --> 00:40:06,200 Speaker 1: have a package downtown at this address, Click here and 590 00:40:06,239 --> 00:40:08,600 Speaker 1: tell us that you want us to send it to you. 591 00:40:08,840 --> 00:40:13,400 Speaker 1: There was a message from her sister saying, oh, here's 592 00:40:13,400 --> 00:40:17,279 Speaker 1: a photo, click this to see the photo. And then 593 00:40:17,280 --> 00:40:20,640 Speaker 1: there was one saying you have a bouquet of flowers 594 00:40:20,640 --> 00:40:23,799 Speaker 1: waiting for you. Click this and we will get them 595 00:40:23,800 --> 00:40:26,839 Speaker 1: to you. Then Dana priest had to tell her non 596 00:40:26,920 --> 00:40:30,040 Speaker 1: the truth that she had spy wear on her phone, 597 00:40:30,520 --> 00:40:33,960 Speaker 1: and that she'd had it since April, since the day 598 00:40:34,040 --> 00:40:39,360 Speaker 1: she had been detained. When I recalled the moment this happened, 599 00:40:39,840 --> 00:40:44,400 Speaker 1: I took and I feel like my life force in 600 00:40:44,400 --> 00:40:46,960 Speaker 1: in a green affront of them. I'm talking about the 601 00:40:47,000 --> 00:40:51,640 Speaker 1: people miss use this technology, the be able who humped 602 00:40:51,640 --> 00:40:57,000 Speaker 1: my husband and humped me. The Hamaradi intelligence officials had 603 00:40:57,120 --> 00:41:00,680 Speaker 1: full access to Hanan's phone every part of her life 604 00:41:01,080 --> 00:41:04,640 Speaker 1: for five months before Koshoi was killed. No matter the 605 00:41:04,680 --> 00:41:08,560 Speaker 1: steps Hanan had taken, the codes she had used, or 606 00:41:08,640 --> 00:41:11,799 Speaker 1: the length she had gone to protect Koshoki, they could 607 00:41:11,800 --> 00:41:16,600 Speaker 1: still watch her and they did. I was feeling very bad, 608 00:41:16,640 --> 00:41:20,000 Speaker 1: and I'm still feeling very bad. Hanan is still trying 609 00:41:20,040 --> 00:41:24,000 Speaker 1: to get Koshogis devices from the Turkish authorities. In addition 610 00:41:24,040 --> 00:41:26,960 Speaker 1: to Hanana Lader, others close to Jamal Ka Shogi have 611 00:41:27,120 --> 00:41:31,120 Speaker 1: also discovered Pegasus on their phones. Every detail of their 612 00:41:31,160 --> 00:41:37,040 Speaker 1: digital footprint was surveiled, including Koshogi's Turkish fiance teacher sings 613 00:41:37,719 --> 00:41:43,640 Speaker 1: I blamed myself a lot, and Kashogi's close friend Omar 614 00:41:43,719 --> 00:41:47,920 Speaker 1: Abdulla ziz A fellow outspoken Saudi journalist living in exile 615 00:41:48,080 --> 00:41:53,360 Speaker 1: in Canada. All of their correspondences were monitored. The hacken 616 00:41:53,440 --> 00:41:57,680 Speaker 1: of my phone played the major role what happened to 617 00:41:57,760 --> 00:42:02,120 Speaker 1: jama that. On the next episode of Shoot the Messenger, 618 00:42:02,760 --> 00:42:05,719 Speaker 1: we find out how Omar Abduaziz found out he was 619 00:42:05,800 --> 00:42:08,640 Speaker 1: being hacked and discovered more than four hundred of his 620 00:42:08,760 --> 00:42:13,280 Speaker 1: text messages with Jamaica Shogi were compromised. We'll go into 621 00:42:13,280 --> 00:42:17,200 Speaker 1: how this technology works and how Pegasus was first discovered. 622 00:42:19,120 --> 00:42:22,360 Speaker 1: On this series, we investigate how Pegasus byware came to be, 623 00:42:22,960 --> 00:42:26,719 Speaker 1: what its capabilities are, and ask how does it implicate 624 00:42:26,800 --> 00:42:30,840 Speaker 1: ordinary people. Over the next nine episodes will follow the 625 00:42:30,880 --> 00:42:34,279 Speaker 1: thread of Pegasus to understand how it was intended to 626 00:42:34,280 --> 00:42:38,120 Speaker 1: be used, how it's abused, and the impact of its surveillance. 627 00:42:39,000 --> 00:42:42,160 Speaker 1: Pegasus spyware has been a boom for the cyber surveillance 628 00:42:42,160 --> 00:42:46,359 Speaker 1: industry and it's impacted the global economy. If you live 629 00:42:46,360 --> 00:42:49,560 Speaker 1: in the US and have mutual funds or pension, your 630 00:42:49,600 --> 00:42:53,120 Speaker 1: money could be supporting the organization that makes Pegasus spyware. 631 00:42:55,600 --> 00:42:58,239 Speaker 1: You've heard about Jamaica Shogu, but there are so many 632 00:42:58,280 --> 00:43:02,040 Speaker 1: others others who have been targeted and hacked, blackmailed, or 633 00:43:02,120 --> 00:43:06,239 Speaker 1: humiliated who have been hunted and killed. Some of the 634 00:43:06,320 --> 00:43:10,160 Speaker 1: names you may recognize, like Emmanuel mccron, the president of France, 635 00:43:10,440 --> 00:43:13,640 Speaker 1: or Jeff Bezos, the founder of Amazon. And then there 636 00:43:13,640 --> 00:43:17,319 Speaker 1: are stories you haven't heard about. I know, I don't 637 00:43:17,360 --> 00:43:19,200 Speaker 1: long her felt safe. Do you know if they got 638 00:43:19,280 --> 00:43:22,959 Speaker 1: the information that they were looking for. I don't think 639 00:43:23,000 --> 00:43:26,239 Speaker 1: they were looking for any information. I think it was 640 00:43:26,280 --> 00:43:29,719 Speaker 1: a form of psychological warfare. I would get a phone 641 00:43:29,719 --> 00:43:32,120 Speaker 1: call from someone, but never anyone on the end of 642 00:43:32,120 --> 00:43:34,840 Speaker 1: the phone. They would try to track my GPS. It 643 00:43:34,920 --> 00:43:37,600 Speaker 1: does seem like it's always your favorite people who are 644 00:43:37,640 --> 00:43:40,319 Speaker 1: being hacked and followed. We have to be way more 645 00:43:40,360 --> 00:43:43,680 Speaker 1: careful even about things like this. How do I know 646 00:43:43,760 --> 00:43:46,400 Speaker 1: who you are? It's kind of like the nuclear era 647 00:43:46,600 --> 00:43:50,359 Speaker 1: before there were nuclear arms treaties. Are you saying that 648 00:43:50,400 --> 00:43:54,160 Speaker 1: you think these texts I'm getting are Pegasus? Do you 649 00:43:54,160 --> 00:43:58,160 Speaker 1: think I'm being targeted? Oh? For sure? Now it don't 650 00:43:58,200 --> 00:44:02,080 Speaker 1: makes sense that it's on season one of Shoot the Messenger. 651 00:44:02,880 --> 00:44:06,120 Speaker 1: Shoot the Messenger is a production of Exile Content Studio. 652 00:44:06,880 --> 00:44:10,680 Speaker 1: We are distributed by PRX, hosted and produced by me 653 00:44:11,040 --> 00:44:16,280 Speaker 1: Rose Red with Nando Vila, Sabiniansen, Nora Kibness, Zak Kirsch, 654 00:44:16,719 --> 00:44:20,960 Speaker 1: and Anna Isabel Octavio. Written by Me rose Red with 655 00:44:21,080 --> 00:44:26,120 Speaker 1: story editing by Nando Vila, Danny Sadia, Jen Atschell, Zak Kirsch, 656 00:44:26,280 --> 00:44:32,200 Speaker 1: and Rachel Ward. Production assistant by Avro Saspatis Andrea Zavaios, 657 00:44:32,360 --> 00:44:38,560 Speaker 1: Jen Shipman, Stella Emmett and Aaron Reese. Special thanks to 658 00:44:38,640 --> 00:44:42,520 Speaker 1: Sonic Union and Gail and Matthew Reid. Sound design and 659 00:44:42,600 --> 00:44:47,520 Speaker 1: mixing by Patti Kens Daniel Batista, Overseas audio at Exile 660 00:44:47,600 --> 00:44:53,480 Speaker 1: Content Studio. Executive producers are myself rose Red with Nando Vila, 661 00:44:53,800 --> 00:44:59,080 Speaker 1: Carmen Bradol, and Isaac Lee. For more information on the 662 00:44:59,120 --> 00:45:02,160 Speaker 1: status of journal US and freedom of the press, visit 663 00:45:02,200 --> 00:45:06,239 Speaker 1: the Committee to Protect Journalists at CPUJ dot org. To 664 00:45:06,360 --> 00:45:09,360 Speaker 1: learn more about Exile and our other podcasts and films, 665 00:45:09,600 --> 00:45:14,960 Speaker 1: visit Exile content dot com. The next episode is out now. 666 00:45:15,520 --> 00:45:18,080 Speaker 1: Subscribe so you can hear every twist and turn of 667 00:45:18,160 --> 00:45:21,640 Speaker 1: this ten part series. You can find Exiles, Shoot the Messenger, 668 00:45:21,880 --> 00:45:25,799 Speaker 1: Espionage Murder, and Pegasus Spyware anywhere you get your podcasts.