Speaker 1: Al Zone Media Gaire.
Speaker 2: The last time that you and I spoke was about
Speaker 2: twelve hours after Trump announced the takeover of DC's police force.
Speaker 2: It had really just happened, so I didn't really have
Speaker 2: a ton of clarity about how things were going to
Speaker 2: be taking shape and what resistance or pushback would look like.
Speaker 2: Now today that we're speaking Friday, September twelfth, it's been
Speaker 2: a little over about thirty days since all of this
Speaker 2: went down, and I feel like we're due for an
Speaker 2: update from my hometown, the District of Columbia.
Speaker 3: What do you say?
Speaker 1: Absolutely, we're at the deadline. So now Trump can no
Speaker 1: longer do anything. The city's back. God, I wish you're
Speaker 1: free once again.
Speaker 2: Oh my God, from your lips to God's ears. So
Speaker 2: I did want to set the stage a little bit
Speaker 2: up top. You know, I'm a journalist, but I am
Speaker 2: also an advocate for DC statehood first and foremost. I
Speaker 2: feel like I need to make sure some thing is
Speaker 2: super clear, which is that how entwined all of this
Speaker 2: is to DC's lack of statehood. After the last time
Speaker 2: that you and I spoke, there a listener said, oh,
Speaker 2: why is she making this whole thing about statehood. How
Speaker 2: would DC being a state change anything? How would two
Speaker 2: more Democratic senators change anything? Why are you making it
Speaker 2: about that? And I thought, oop, I did not do
Speaker 2: a good enough job of making clear why the takeover
Speaker 2: in DC could happen at all, and the ways that
Speaker 2: DC's lack of statehood is at the heart of that issue.
Speaker 2: This is just sort of the soup that I swim
Speaker 2: in all day, every day, So I forget that's not
Speaker 2: true for everybody. For some of you, this might be
Speaker 2: a refresher, and you might know this already, But the
Speaker 2: reason why Trump started all of this in DC is
Speaker 2: because DC is not a state. You know, As president,
Speaker 2: Trump has a lot more authority over DC than he
Speaker 2: has over any other place in the country. So while
Speaker 2: Trump talking about sending the National Guard into other cities is.
Speaker 1: Awful, he wants to do it to Chicago's so bad,
Speaker 1: so bad, but he doesn't have the ability to. And
Speaker 1: he's really upset about that, so much so that he's
Speaker 1: probably going to cancel a degree of the plans for
Speaker 1: National Guard deployment to Chicago. Inst going to cooperate with
Speaker 1: Louisiana because the governor is okay with working with Trump
Speaker 1: on that in Louisiana.
Speaker 2: Yes, exactly exactly did you see this is like a
Speaker 2: non secorder. But the tweet that he put out, like
Speaker 2: the AI generated tweet that's they're gonna find out why
Speaker 2: we call it's the Department of War. Then it was like, oh,
Speaker 2: we were just deaf kidding and just yes, delete that tweet.
Speaker 1: Now that was just a joke, which is into like downplay,
Speaker 1: like the amount of federal resources currently in Chicago. ICE
Speaker 1: in DHS have been very busy in Chicago, and I
Speaker 1: believe Friday morning, the day that we recorded this, ICE
Speaker 1: killed somebody in Chicago during an enforcement action. So this
Speaker 1: isn't to say, you know, Chicago's freed from Trump's federal forces.
Speaker 1: ICE is still operating in Chicago as they have been,
Speaker 1: but at least the National Guard deployment like mass military
Speaker 1: style occupation is unlikely in the near future.
Speaker 2: Yes, that is great context, and I think it also
Speaker 2: illustrates why what's happening in DC is so unique and
Speaker 2: could not happen anywhere else in the country. So while
Speaker 2: Trump is talking about wanting to send the National Guard
Speaker 2: to other cities, he does not have the broad authority
Speaker 2: to take over local police forces. In those cities the
Speaker 2: way that he did in DC. And even if he did,
Speaker 2: let's say, exercise what authority he could have over local
Speaker 2: police and other cities, say like in an emergency situation,
Speaker 2: it still wouldn't be the attempt to take.
Speaker 3: Over the police force like we saw in DC.
Speaker 2: Like when this first happened, Tam Bondy was literally trying
Speaker 2: to replace DC's chief of police briefly successfully until DC's
Speaker 2: Attorney General, Brian Schwab sued. Right, and so yeah, Trump
Speaker 2: does not have the authority to oust local leaders and
Speaker 2: other cities and states. Even if Trump sent the National
Speaker 2: Guard to Memphis, Memphis still has a mayor, Tennessee has
Speaker 2: a governor, there's senators, congressional representation. Because DC is not
Speaker 2: a state, Trump working with Congress could take over our city, elset,
Speaker 2: our mayor, and our city council. He has been talking
Speaker 2: about doing that as recently as this morning. I want
Speaker 2: to play a quick clip. He does lie in this
Speaker 2: clip because technically he doesn't have the authority. It has
Speaker 2: to go through Congress. But you know, I don't see
Speaker 2: our Congress really standing up to whatever Trump wants anytime soon.
Speaker 2: And so if Congress were to provoke DC's home rule.
Speaker 2: Then Trump would be able to appoint whoever he wanted
Speaker 2: to run d C. So I want to play a
Speaker 2: clip of him talking about this weirdly in Oppressor about
Speaker 2: that Charlie Kirk murder.
Speaker 3: Here's what he had to say.
Speaker 4: Well, the mayor's asked us to say, you know, we
Speaker 4: have a Democrat mayor. He was asked us today. And
Speaker 4: DC's a little bit different because I could federalize it
Speaker 4: if I want. You know, DC's a little bit of different.
Speaker 4: So we have a lot of a lot. We have
Speaker 4: actually more power in DC because it's you know, I
Speaker 4: can change the mayor if I want, I can do
Speaker 4: whatever I want. I haven't had to. We've had a
Speaker 4: great relationship with the mayor. We've had a great relationship.
Speaker 4: Everybody's happy, and the mayor was not in favor of it,
Speaker 4: but first we forced and then she saw the results
Speaker 4: and everyone's.
Speaker 3: Going up them.
Speaker 4: Thank you her. We have no crime anymore.
Speaker 2: Ugh, Okay, I gotta stop it because I can't even
Speaker 2: I can't even listen to him bloviate on that.
Speaker 3: But again he's kind of lying here.
Speaker 2: But there is a reality where Trump single handedly is
Speaker 2: in control of DC. So it would have to take
Speaker 2: Congress overturning DC's home Rule, but I don't think that
Speaker 2: would be terribly difficult for him to achieve. And if
Speaker 2: that does happen, he is right that he could appoint
Speaker 2: whoever he wanted to be in control of DC. And
Speaker 2: so the GOP has already introduced legislation that would revoke
Speaker 2: DC's home rule entirely, something that Trump says that he
Speaker 2: wants to do. To be super clear, this would mean
Speaker 2: that all of the little things that you rely on
Speaker 2: and probably take for granted about your day to day
Speaker 2: local life, your social services, your trash pick up, how
Speaker 2: your streets are run, your public transport, Trump would be
Speaker 2: in charge of literally all of that. For me, it's
Speaker 2: important to me that people understand how bad of a
Speaker 2: situation that would be.
Speaker 1: Yeah, that would be unprecedented.
Speaker 2: So just to put a pin in that, even though
Speaker 2: Trump is talking about setting the National Guard to other cities,
Speaker 2: DC's lack of statehood really makes what's happening here unlike
Speaker 2: any other place in the country. DC is uniquely vulnerable.
Speaker 2: In addition to all of the racial equity and democracy
Speaker 2: implications for statehood, the reality is everyday lives of more
Speaker 2: than a half a million people who live here like
Speaker 2: me are made more vulnerable by DC's lack of statehood.
Speaker 2: So when I am like on my statehood soapbox, that
Speaker 2: is why, because the lack of statehood in DC just
Speaker 2: makes us very vulnerable to having somebody like Trump really
Speaker 2: exercise an unprecedented amount of control that we will not
Speaker 2: see anywhere else in the United States. So just wanted
Speaker 2: to make that clear. Okay, So now I have some
Speaker 2: updates about the situation. As you said, Garrison, the crime
Speaker 2: Emergency in DC, which sort of kicked all of this off, has.
Speaker 3: Come to an end. Free that's over. Mission accomplished.
Speaker 1: We did it, mission accomplished, So it.
Speaker 2: Lasted thirty days and it's come to an end. However,
Speaker 2: there is no guarantee that Trump couldn't just declare another one.
Speaker 2: The optics of that would be a little weird because
Speaker 2: he's been talking, as we just heard in that clip,
Speaker 2: he's been talking about how crime is down to zero
Speaker 2: in DC except for domestic violence, which everybody knows isn't
Speaker 2: really a crime, right, Like, he made it very clear
Speaker 2: that he feels like crime has gone to zero, So
Speaker 2: will be pretty weird to then institute another crime emergency
Speaker 2: in DC.
Speaker 1: He kind of got what he wanted to with the
Speaker 1: mayor agreeing to cooperate with him someone hmmm exactly.
Speaker 2: So, to be super clear, even with the crime emergency
Speaker 2: in DC ending that in no way means an end
Speaker 2: to things like the National Guard in our streets or
Speaker 2: checkpoints which have just been horrifying, and the surge that
Speaker 2: we're seeing in federal law enforcement, because those are two
Speaker 2: distant things. And in the last few weeks of this,
Speaker 2: what's really become just abundantly clear is that this whole
Speaker 2: thing was about immigration. Even after all the talk of
Speaker 2: crime and DC, it became very clear that this is
Speaker 2: less about crime and more about enforcing Trump's immigration agenda.
Speaker 2: As you sort of alluded to early on, before she
Speaker 2: really changed her tune about Tukes into the takeover, our mayor,
Speaker 2: Muriel Bowser held a press conference where she said, well,
Speaker 2: if Trump's goal was to deport migrants and bring an ice,
Speaker 2: you know, he didn't have to take over MPD to
Speaker 2: do that. He should have just outright said that's what
Speaker 2: he wanted to do, instead of making it this whole
Speaker 2: thing about crime. Don't ask her to repeat that sentiment. Now,
Speaker 2: because I don't think that she would. She's really really
Speaker 2: changed her tune, which we'll talk about.
Speaker 3: In a moment.
Speaker 2: And so one of the things that makes it complicated
Speaker 2: is that when you're talking about immigration detention versus other
Speaker 2: kinds of arrests, it just becomes a lot harder to
Speaker 2: have transparency into what's going on. But the Associated Press
Speaker 2: reported that dated from the federal operation analyzed by the
Speaker 2: AP shows that more than forty percent of the arrests
Speaker 2: made over the month long operation were related to immigration.
Speaker 2: They spoke to Austin Rose, a managing attorney for the
Speaker 2: AMICA Center for Immigrant Rights, who said the federal takeover
Speaker 2: has been a cover to do federal immigration enforcement. It
Speaker 2: became pretty clear early on that this was a major
Speaker 2: campaign of immigration enforcement, and that's just it's really hard
Speaker 2: to deny that this was just another increasing plank of
Speaker 2: the president's agenda on immigration.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and I think you can certainly look at the
Speaker 1: anti crime narratives getting a lot of traction on the
Speaker 1: right with that pretty gruesome murder in North Carolina last
Speaker 1: week as well, and like, absolutely the crime angle is
Speaker 1: part of the rhetorical strategy Trump is using. And yeah,
Speaker 1: a right wing populist president doing a crime crackdown. Oh,
Speaker 1: this is unheard of, this is unprecedented. No, like, of
Speaker 1: course they're going to use that angle. But yeah, the
Speaker 1: underdiscussed element of this is how much this has just
Speaker 1: been a cover to do a rapid increase in the
Speaker 1: number of immigration actions around DC. Well, like you said,
Speaker 1: that was like forty percent, So still another sixty percent
Speaker 1: of arrests is just affecting the other DC residents, and
Speaker 1: a lot of that is tying to this national crime
Speaker 1: wave narratives that these people are also pushing. I think
Speaker 1: these things work together. They're not necessarily like oppositional analyzes
Speaker 1: of what's going on. But the immigration angle has been
Speaker 1: very under discussed in the DC occupation.
Speaker 2: I agree, it's hard to discuss because I think we
Speaker 2: have to really have some honest conversations. It is true
Speaker 2: that DC experienced a surge in violent crime in twenty
Speaker 2: twenty three. That surge thankfully went down, But I think
Speaker 2: that crime is just one of those issues where people
Speaker 2: who other rise are invested in telling nuanced, thoughtful stories
Speaker 2: about complex issues. I see a lot of that nuance
Speaker 2: and thoughtfulness go right out the window when we're talking
Speaker 2: about crime. And I think that we really let the
Speaker 2: right dominate the conversation about crime in our cities and
Speaker 2: in some ways hijack that conversation. And I do think
Speaker 2: that dynamic is part and parcel to how we got here. Now,
Speaker 2: I have a b in my bonnet about some of
Speaker 2: the sloppy journalism, like local journalism, people who really should
Speaker 2: know better about crime. You know, we had a wave
Speaker 2: of businesses shut and they would say, oh, we're shutting
Speaker 2: because of crime, and it's like, yeah, look, you actually
Speaker 2: look and you're thinking, oh, well, this is a cashless business.
Speaker 3: What kind of crime were you experiencing?
Speaker 1: Yeah, there's no way. Using crime as this excuse in
Speaker 1: post COVID economic decline has been extremely convenient for a
Speaker 1: lot of corporations. And yeah, I guess like the degree
Speaker 1: to which we've seeded territory on that same way, you know,
Speaker 1: we see a territory on like the border and immigration,
Speaker 1: but specifically sitting territory on discussion of crime allowed operating
Speaker 1: space for Trump to deploy this narrative, which then was
Speaker 1: used to hurt a lot of immigrants exactly.
Speaker 2: And in DC we saw much tighter coordination with immigration
Speaker 2: officials with our local police force, especially at checkpoints where
Speaker 2: police would work with ice even if someone was not
Speaker 2: otherwise detained or in custody. I did an interview with
Speaker 2: the Washington Posts Tayu Armis, who covers immigrant communities here
Speaker 2: in DC, and he told me that this whole thing
Speaker 2: was essentially an attack on the policies that make a
Speaker 2: city like DC what is commonly thought of as a
Speaker 2: sanctuary city. I don't love the phrase sanctuary city, but
Speaker 2: you know what I mean, you know laws that do
Speaker 2: not require police departments to coordinate with immigration officials.
Speaker 3: Really that it was an attack.
Speaker 2: On those, Yeah, totally, Yeah, I mean, and I think
Speaker 2: that it's important that we call that out for what
Speaker 2: it is. And this is difficult for me personally, but
Speaker 2: not get lost in debating what Trump is laying out
Speaker 2: about crime, because when you understand that it's not really
Speaker 2: about crime, then you don't have to do that debating, right,
Speaker 2: And it's like, well, it's not really about crime, so
Speaker 2: let's not waste time debating what we both can plainly
Speaker 2: see this is not really about.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, because DC is just faking all crimes. Yes, anyway, right, bridget.
Speaker 3: Oh gosh, don't even get me started gare.
Speaker 2: And so something that Tayu told me in our interview
Speaker 2: that I found very troubling is that, again, when someone
Speaker 2: is detained because of a suspected immigration related issue, we
Speaker 2: just have a lot less information and transparency than if
Speaker 2: they were being arrested for another kind of crime. He
Speaker 2: described it as a black box that is difficult to penetrate,
Speaker 2: which is obviously heightened when you have masked agents pulling
Speaker 2: people out of cars at checkpoints and doing things like
Speaker 2: literally hitting delivery drivers with vehicles right like, it becomes
Speaker 2: very difficult to really even understand what's going on, and
Speaker 2: that's by design.
Speaker 1: It's hard to find them in the system because these
Speaker 1: people often aren't even charged with their crime, remaining in
Speaker 1: the country past. The explosion of a visa isn't a
Speaker 1: crime exactly, So so these people are brained as quoe
Speaker 1: uquote criminal migrants that often is factually incorrect, if factually
Speaker 1: incorrect even matters anymore, which it increasingly does not, it seems.
Speaker 2: Yeah, And I mean, as you said, we know that
Speaker 2: immigrant communities are not committing more crime than the rest
Speaker 2: of the population, and.
Speaker 1: So estimates would show less actually exactly because they don't
Speaker 1: want to get deported.
Speaker 2: And you know, again, I feel myself getting pulled back
Speaker 2: into Trump's he he gets me go like circling the
Speaker 2: drain with this where it's like, well, if you really
Speaker 2: cared about crime, you would want immigrant communities to feel
Speaker 2: comfortable talking to believes with the understanding that they weren't
Speaker 2: going to be deported if they reported a crime, or
Speaker 2: if they witnessed a crime, or if they saw crime.
Speaker 2: But again, it's not really about crime, so I don't
Speaker 2: have to I don't have to get myself pulled into.
Speaker 1: That, no, because it's entirely racialized. That's like the big
Speaker 1: common denominator here, even with the anti crime narrative and
Speaker 1: the immigration stuff, is that it's all racialized violence.
Speaker 2: Yes, And I mean, I'm glad that you brought that up.
Speaker 2: Just as a personal note. I live in Columbia Heights,
Speaker 2: which is a heavily black and brown neighborhood, a very
Speaker 2: thriving Latino population, and it really just has been awful.
Speaker 3: Right.
Speaker 2: I live on a very busy street that runs right
Speaker 2: through the city and like checkpoints on either side of
Speaker 2: my street.
Speaker 3: And I was listening to.
Speaker 2: I think it was a Kara Swisher podcast and She
Speaker 2: also lives in DC, and she was saying, oh, well,
Speaker 2: I haven't really noticed any big changes, and I'm thinking.
Speaker 1: Kara, Yeah, yeah, I bet, I bet you aren't noticing
Speaker 1: many changes.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I bet you haven't noticed any changes. And yeah,
Speaker 2: I mean I've lived in DC most of my whole life.
Speaker 2: I've never seen checkpoints where people are physically dragged out
Speaker 2: of cars and in this way. So I mean, if
Speaker 2: you don't live in a neighborhood like this, you might
Speaker 2: be able to get away with saying, oh, I haven't
Speaker 2: seen any big changes, or nothing's really changed, or maybe
Speaker 2: I just see the National Guard when I leave my house.
Speaker 2: But in neighborhoods like mine, the change.
Speaker 3: Is very real.
Speaker 2: I'll put it that way. So you brought up the mayor,
Speaker 2: which I did want to briefly touch on. I have
Speaker 2: been called out on this very podcast for being too
Speaker 2: sympathetic to our mayor, which is actually funny to me
Speaker 2: because on my other podcast all we do is call
Speaker 2: her out. But the point that I have tried to make,
Speaker 2: and I think this is the nature of that of
Speaker 2: that critique, is that I do think it is important
Speaker 2: that people understand that our lack of statehood in DC
Speaker 2: does put our mayor in a position where her authority
Speaker 2: is just realistically a lot more limited than other elected officials.
Speaker 2: But even in that situation with realistically limited authority, her
Speaker 2: play here has been cozying up to Trump. And that
Speaker 2: is one hundred percent a choice. That is not something
Speaker 2: that other elected officials in DC have done.
Speaker 3: That is one hundred percent a choice.
Speaker 1: And it's a choice in an attempt in some ways
Speaker 1: to diffuse the situation to not have Trump escalate, to
Speaker 1: not go into a even more like legally uncharted territory, right,
Speaker 1: to not accelerate the conflict. And I think a lot
Speaker 1: of people who are critiquing this move actually would be
Speaker 1: very interested in this point, in accelerating this conflict, seeing
Speaker 1: what Trump will actually do stress tests even more of
Speaker 1: our democracy, and a lot of people are interested in
Speaker 1: watching the results of that happen. And I can see
Speaker 1: how someone like Bowser doesn't want to do that, But
Speaker 1: that opens her up for a lot of critique. And
Speaker 1: I'm interested in what you said about like other city officials,
Speaker 1: that's not something I've heard as much about, is her
Speaker 1: kind of cooperating with Trump compared to the stance of
Speaker 1: other city officials.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 2: I mean, look at DC's Attorney General Brian Schwab, who
Speaker 2: has been out here suing the Trump administration somewhat successfully
Speaker 2: and has been a much more obvious fighter for DC. Right,
Speaker 2: so like, he is certainly not playing nice. He's like, oh,
Speaker 2: we're gonna fight this in the courts. If you want
Speaker 2: to try to take over our city, we will see.
Speaker 3: You in court.
Speaker 2: I'm so curious what the conversations are like between Bowser
Speaker 2: and Schwab, but it just reveals to me that capitulating
Speaker 2: and cozying up. I'm not gonna say it's not a strategy,
Speaker 2: but it's certainly a choice. And to your earlier there
Speaker 2: are definitely people who say, hey, she's playing nice with Trump.
Speaker 2: D C still has home rule, DC still has a mayor,
Speaker 2: and the crime emergency has ended. Those are all good things,
Speaker 2: and being a resident of DC, I will happily say
Speaker 2: I don't want to see how far Trump will go
Speaker 2: on this. I want this to end. I want you know,
Speaker 2: I'm not someone who was like, yeah, like, let the
Speaker 2: chips fall where they may. I want my trash picked up.
Speaker 2: I want my you know, my neighbors kids to be
Speaker 2: able to go to school all of that. I'm not.
Speaker 1: I'm not that's understandable.
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, it's the complex thing.
Speaker 2: I do think that, you know, early on in this,
Speaker 2: Bowser was talking about how crime in DC was down,
Speaker 2: and then Trump said on social media, oh, Bowser better
Speaker 2: get her story straight on the crime numbers or things
Speaker 2: are gonna get worse, And days later she was taking
Speaker 2: in a very different tune. She did a press conference
Speaker 2: where she thanked the federal government. She did stop short
Speaker 2: of thanking Trump specifically, but thanking the federal government for
Speaker 2: helping DC with the crime issue. And I guess, as
Speaker 2: somebody who's been following Bowser for as long as I have,
Speaker 2: it wasn't terribly surprising in an episode I did of it.
Speaker 3: Could happen here. I think back in January.
Speaker 2: We talked about how her stance with Trump this time
Speaker 2: around was like concession after concession after concession, So it
Speaker 2: wasn't surprising.
Speaker 1: This falls in line with that, I guess.
Speaker 2: Correct, And I do think that people need to understand
Speaker 2: that in a lot of ways Bowser and I don't
Speaker 2: mean this in the way that it's going to sound,
Speaker 2: but like, I do think that there is alignment between
Speaker 2: Bowser and Trump on a lot of issues, crime potentially
Speaker 2: being one of them. Right, when we were talking about
Speaker 2: how Trump wanted Bowser to dismantle encampments in DC, it
Speaker 2: wasn't like Bowser as some friend to the homeless.
Speaker 1: No no, no, no.
Speaker 2: Yeah, like the specific encampment in question, she already had
Speaker 2: plans to demolish, just later on on a slower timeline.
Speaker 1: There is a class alignment among people in the political
Speaker 1: quote unquote elite. Right. You can look at Gavin Newsom's
Speaker 1: extreme anti homeless policies and compare that to Trump's extreme
Speaker 1: anti homeless policies, and yeah, they have class alignment on
Speaker 1: that issue, even if Gavin might be against Trump on
Speaker 1: some other issues, though he has his own fair share
Speaker 1: of concessions to Trump.
Speaker 3: Oh you said it, friend.
Speaker 1: Also, I like that I'm on a first name basis
Speaker 1: with Gavin.
Speaker 3: I know, gab.
Speaker 1: Podcaster solidarity and as we've seen the past week, podcaster
Speaker 1: solidarity most important thing. Ooh yes, oh yes.
Speaker 3: Also also fellow, iHeart podcaster.
Speaker 1: I believe for Gavin. Yeah, and yeah, hope he joins
Speaker 1: the union.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 2: Same, And I guess I should say to your point
Speaker 2: about the complexities about you know, the way that Bowser,
Speaker 2: our mayor is playing this. It's true that it's good
Speaker 2: that the crime emergency has ended, that DC still has
Speaker 2: home rule. We still have a mayor, we saw the
Speaker 2: city council as of today. And even if you will say, well,
Speaker 2: that's you know, the mayor CosIng up with Trump, like
Speaker 2: you have that to thank that's why that's happening. Our
Speaker 2: mayor is really making no friends with other black mayors
Speaker 2: in cities like Chicago and Baltimore.
Speaker 3: I have to assume.
Speaker 2: Yeah, when she does press conferences where she talks about
Speaker 2: how having federal troops in DC has been good for
Speaker 2: the city, how crime it's gone down, when you have
Speaker 2: these other cities that are currently trying to fend off
Speaker 2: federal takeovers from Trump. So even if her CosIng up
Speaker 2: with Trump has led to d C specifically being able
Speaker 2: to enjoy home rule for another day, at what cost
Speaker 2: if it enables Trump's actions in other cities.
Speaker 1: You know, me putting on my skull mask as I
Speaker 1: bring out my chessboarding the accelerationist collapse of DC and
Speaker 1: how that affects a larger political situation in the United States. Yes,
Speaker 1: how much of DC am I willing to sacrifice to
Speaker 1: see how far Trump will go.
Speaker 3: Yeah, it's tough.
Speaker 2: It's complicated because obviously, as a DC resident, I want
Speaker 2: to have a safe and peaceful existence for myself here
Speaker 2: in DC. But it's not happening in a vacuum, and
Speaker 2: so I also have to think about, you know, the
Speaker 2: national implications for other cities. And you know, I don't
Speaker 2: envy our mayor. I guess I don't envy many mayors. Oh.
Speaker 2: I am firmly believe if you want to become the
Speaker 2: mayor of a city like DC, Baltimore, Chicago, something has
Speaker 2: to be wrong with you.
Speaker 1: And Bridget Todd has come out against Zorn Mamdani officially
Speaker 1: it could happen here podcast No.
Speaker 2: No, no, I'm just saying I mean, yeah, I'll say it.
Speaker 3: Who wants a job like that?
Speaker 4: Though?
Speaker 1: It sounds like aod nightmare.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 2: I had a friend who was like vying to be
Speaker 2: the head of comms for the Baltimore Police Department, and
Speaker 2: I was like, Wow, you are a massacre.
Speaker 1: That's even a weirder, that's even weirder.
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's like the I can't imagine to never know
Speaker 2: peace and not get into heaven. He's probably listening and thinking, oh,
Speaker 2: why should talking shit about me? And so it is complicated,
Speaker 2: and I do think it's important as an As much
Speaker 2: as I want DC to be a safe place where
Speaker 2: I can walk outside and not see people getting dragged
Speaker 2: out of cars and federal checkpoints and all of that,
Speaker 2: we do need to think about the larger picture here.
Speaker 2: And people that I've talked to with regards to the mayor,
Speaker 2: they tell me that, oh, it seems like she is
Speaker 2: just not interested in the like the polling of these decisions,
Speaker 2: because the conversations that I am having people are not
Speaker 2: happy with her. In the spaces I am in. The
Speaker 2: conversation is like, how do we recall this mayor? Like,
Speaker 2: even though we might have these sort of things that
Speaker 2: you consider victories, DC enjoying home rules, still having a mayor,
Speaker 2: a city council, all of that, people are really really
Speaker 2: really not happy with our mayor. Yeah, so looking ahead
Speaker 2: at what's coming up next. Even though the crime emergency
Speaker 2: is ending, this whole thing is.
Speaker 3: Very far from over.
Speaker 2: The fight for the self determination of DC as far
Speaker 2: from over in ways that have in a lot of
Speaker 2: ways nothing.
Speaker 3: To do with Trump.
Speaker 2: There are thirteen bills in the House aimed at directly
Speaker 2: taking action at DC. Many of them are direct assaults
Speaker 2: on DC's home rules. There are provisions that would make
Speaker 2: it easier for Congress to overturn DC home rule. There
Speaker 2: are provisions that lower the age of when you can
Speaker 2: be tried as an adult for crimes from sixteen to fourteen.
Speaker 2: There is a provision that would give Congress longer time
Speaker 2: to review DC's laws. Right now, it's thirty days. They
Speaker 2: would change it to sixty days. All of DC's laws
Speaker 2: have to go through Congress. It is a nightmare, Like
Speaker 2: it is a whole thing. The biggest of these bills
Speaker 2: in the House right now is of course, wanting to
Speaker 2: overturn DC's ability for district residents to elect our own
Speaker 2: attorney general instead of having an attorney general appointed by Trump.
Speaker 2: If that bill were to become law, it would mean
Speaker 2: that our current attorney general, the person who I would argue,
Speaker 2: has sort of emerged as the If there was a
Speaker 2: single person that you could look at and be like, oh,
Speaker 2: this person is trying to fight for DC's home rule
Speaker 2: and authority, Brian Schwab, he would be fired immediately and
Speaker 2: Trump would be able to replace him with whoever he chose.
Speaker 2: Not somebody that district residents elected or voted for or
Speaker 2: campaigned for, just whoever Trump wanted, and that term would
Speaker 2: run concurrent with the.
Speaker 3: President of the United States.
Speaker 2: So obviously, you know, some of these pieces are not
Speaker 2: overturning home rule entirely, but they are clearly attacks on
Speaker 2: DC's ability to govern itself and the self determination of
Speaker 2: folks here in the district.
Speaker 1: Are you going to discuss what's going to happen with
Speaker 1: the Safe and Beautiful Task Force? Oh no, but I
Speaker 1: can has mean passed the expiration of the order, Bowser's
Speaker 1: establishment of the task force to continue federal cooperation. Yes,
Speaker 1: I guess it's like one of the most immediate, like
Speaker 1: continuing aspects of this story. And it's like unclear how
Speaker 1: much this heightened federal presence will last past the expiration
Speaker 1: of the order.
Speaker 3: So in a.
Speaker 2: Press conference, I have to say, Bowser was pretty tight
Speaker 2: lipped when asked directly about all of that, and so
Speaker 2: a lot of it sounds like wade and see, like
Speaker 2: she really did not give clear answers. And so I
Speaker 2: walked away from that presser being just as confused as
Speaker 2: you probably are, just disconfused as listeners are. I do
Speaker 2: think in part that speaks to the unprecedented nature of
Speaker 2: the way that Trump is dealing with DC right now,
Speaker 2: of like they might genuinely not know, but the fact
Speaker 2: of the way that she has been so tight lipped.
Speaker 2: I hate giving this answer, but I think it's a
Speaker 2: wade and see kind of situation. Yeah, fair, Hi, this
Speaker 2: is Future Bridget coming in on Monday night to say
Speaker 2: that we actually got more clarity on the question of
Speaker 2: whether or not police in DC would continue working with
Speaker 2: federal immigration officials after DC's crime emergency ended. DC's Mayor
Speaker 2: Muriel Bowser was still being pretty tight lipped about this
Speaker 2: when Gary and I were speaking about it on Friday,
Speaker 2: but on Monday, September fifteenth, it was reported that Bowser
Speaker 2: had announced that d C's Police Department MPD would no
Speaker 2: longer be assisting immigration officials with immigration enforcement the way
Speaker 2: they had been during the crime emergency. Bowser said immigration
Speaker 2: enforcement is not what MPD does, and with the end
Speaker 2: of the emergency, it won't be what MPD does. Trump
Speaker 2: did not like this, and on Monday, Trump renewed threats
Speaker 2: to federalize DC's police again if the department does not
Speaker 2: cooperate with ice saying, quote, under pressure from the radical
Speaker 2: left Democrats, Mayor Muriel Bowser, who has presided over this violent,
Speaker 2: criminal takeover of our capital for years, has informed the
Speaker 2: federal government that the Metropolitan Police Department will no longer
Speaker 2: cooperate with ICE in removing and relocating dangerous illegal aliens.
Speaker 2: If I allowed this to happen, all caps crime would
Speaker 2: come roaring back to the people and businesses of Washington,
Speaker 2: d C. All caps, don't worry. I am with you
Speaker 2: and won't allow this to happen. I'll call a national
Speaker 2: emergency and federalized if necessary.
Speaker 3: Three exclamation points.
Speaker 2: And so I guess one of the big questions that
Speaker 2: I've been wrestling with is what does all of this
Speaker 2: mean for the future of DC. There was a time
Speaker 2: where it felt like lawmakers had DC's back, but it's
Speaker 2: really become clear that the days of DC being able
Speaker 2: to count on the Senate and Congress are over. I
Speaker 2: did an interview with a long time journalist here in DC,
Speaker 2: Marxy Graves, and he reminded me that DC has really
Speaker 2: been the most reliable jurisdiction in the country there is
Speaker 2: for Democrats. There's no other place that has given more
Speaker 2: electoral votes for president to Democrats every single election.
Speaker 1: It's extremely consistent extreme.
Speaker 2: I mean, have you seen that map where it's the
Speaker 2: election for Reagan and it's a whole big splotch of
Speaker 2: red and only I think Minnesota and DC are the
Speaker 2: only blotch of blue. Like nobody backs Democrats like d
Speaker 2: C backs Democrat every single time. California can't say that,
Speaker 2: Massachusetts can't say that. And in return, the party has
Speaker 2: essentially abandoned us. They circulated messaging nationally telling Democrats to
Speaker 2: tread carefully about how to talk about what is clearly
Speaker 2: an attempt at a fascist takeover of our city. DC
Speaker 2: has given Democrats this unwavering support since we had the
Speaker 2: ability to vote in presidential elections, which it hasn't been
Speaker 2: that long since, only since the sixties, but still right like,
Speaker 2: and this is how they do us. And we have
Speaker 2: known for years that Republicans like Mike Lee and others
Speaker 2: have had their eye on DC. They want to overturn
Speaker 2: DC rules, overturn DC laws, even things that have nothing
Speaker 2: to do with crime and public safety, things like abortion.
Speaker 3: It is so clearly about control.
Speaker 2: They have been eyeing control of DC for many, many,
Speaker 2: many many years. And now we have this big, wide, open,
Speaker 2: breezy window allowing them to do that.
Speaker 1: Is DC spiritually Midwestern? Because like it's same question.
Speaker 3: Tell me more about what you mean by.
Speaker 1: This, because like, in some ways, you know, it is
Speaker 1: like a coastal, elite place and it's like the you know,
Speaker 1: the heart of political power. But DC to me always
Speaker 1: has kind of had Midwest vibes. I don't I don't
Speaker 1: know how to express it any other way. Maybe it's
Speaker 1: because so many people from the Midwest move to d
Speaker 1: C to do politics work. But I'm sure people from
Speaker 1: all over move to DC to do politics work. But
Speaker 1: like DC and like Minneapolis feel like very similar cities
Speaker 1: to me in some ways.
Speaker 3: I have said this before.
Speaker 1: See that's what I'm saying.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I have said this before, Like I think there
Speaker 2: is something to this where And in that interview I
Speaker 2: did with Mark C.
Speaker 3: Graves, he kind of he kind of gets at it
Speaker 3: a little bit.
Speaker 2: But I do think that d C is the kind
Speaker 2: of place where you can just sort of take for
Speaker 2: granted that I will always live in this sort of
Speaker 2: progressive city.
Speaker 3: I will always sort of live in this city.
Speaker 2: Like I think it's easy to take things like home
Speaker 2: rule in DC for granted, and I think d s
Speaker 2: the nature of d C is a little bit weird
Speaker 2: that as kind of alluded to. It's a very transient city,
Speaker 2: and so there are people living in DC who have
Speaker 2: only known one Mayor Bowser because she's been mayor for
Speaker 2: like ten years.
Speaker 3: Right. They don't know Mayor Gray, they don't know Mayor Fenti.
Speaker 2: They don't know how kind of tenuous a lot of
Speaker 2: what holds DC together actually is. And it can be
Speaker 2: really easy when you're living in a city the historically
Speaker 2: has enjoyed low unemployment, has been pretty moneyed, is pretty progressive.
Speaker 2: The kinds of fights that we were having in DC
Speaker 2: before all this started, they seem so quaint now, bike
Speaker 2: lanes tipped minimum wage, like all of these. You know,
Speaker 2: it is sort of like Minneapolis in a kind of way.
Speaker 2: You're not You're not wrong.
Speaker 1: Well, I'm glad. I'm glad my vibes meter is still
Speaker 1: accurately attute.
Speaker 2: Yes, And I did want to spend a little bit
Speaker 2: of time talking about the protests and pushback that we've seen,
Speaker 2: because DC has not taken this quietly. There was a
Speaker 2: massive protest in March that I will say, I'm a
Speaker 2: little sad that it didn't get more national coverage. Weirdly,
Speaker 2: it got a lot of international coverage, but not a
Speaker 2: ton of national coverage, which is sort of part and
Speaker 2: parcel for DC. So many national outlets only think about
Speaker 2: DC when it comes to federal implications, and when it
Speaker 2: comes to what's happening locally in our streets and at
Speaker 2: Malcolm X Park and all of that, they're like, DC,
Speaker 2: who we don't know her?
Speaker 3: So like that protest was quite moving.
Speaker 2: We also have local groups like Harriet's Wildest Dreams and
Speaker 2: Free DC who are great resources.
Speaker 3: Free DC a lot of their work has.
Speaker 2: Been at the community level, leading things like cop watching trainings,
Speaker 2: like training residents to film enforcement stops, which when you
Speaker 2: consider what Tayu Armis told me from the Washington Post
Speaker 2: about how these immigration detentions and arrests are often just
Speaker 2: a black box. Like we've seen video where a resident
Speaker 2: is being detained by immigration officials and they're speaking to
Speaker 2: the person recording like please record this, please record this,
Speaker 2: you know, and so I do think like things like
Speaker 2: that are super important when you're dealing with this black
Speaker 2: box dynamic of immigration detensions and arrests.
Speaker 3: We also have things like educating residents on their legal rights.
Speaker 3: And this is like a weird saying in DC.
Speaker 2: DC has a ton of parks, actually more parks than
Speaker 2: any other part of the country. Were consistently voted the
Speaker 2: number one city in the country for parks, and so
Speaker 2: because DC is just a wonky place, sometimes you don't
Speaker 2: know if you're on federal versus city property. So you
Speaker 2: can find yourself in a park that's just a tiny
Speaker 2: little triangle of grass. Oh no, you're actually on federal property.
Speaker 2: So if you get arrested there, you're actually in a
Speaker 2: federal jurisdiction, even though you're miles from the White House
Speaker 2: and you thought like, oh, I'm just hanging out in
Speaker 2: a public park.
Speaker 3: So we have seen.
Speaker 2: Local activist groups and organized in groups really try to
Speaker 2: educate folks on their rights and some of those distinctions
Speaker 2: of like, hey, if you commit a crime here, you're
Speaker 2: technically on federal property and you should understand that. And
Speaker 2: I wanted to you mention this because I do think
Speaker 2: it's easier to think of resistance as this big, loud,
Speaker 2: visible thing happening in the streets, and as moving and
Speaker 2: powerful as that big protest was so far, I think
Speaker 2: a lot of the powerful resistance has been community oriented.
Speaker 3: Right.
Speaker 2: It's not as exciting as you know, being out on
Speaker 2: the streets necessarily, but it is no less important.
Speaker 1: Yeah, the non flashy stuff often goes under recognized.
Speaker 2: Yeah, And I will also say that folks might know
Speaker 2: DC has its own style of music called go go,
Speaker 2: which is sort of a city local artistic expression of
Speaker 2: music here. And I've even seen groups like Harriots, Wildest
Speaker 2: Dreams trying to organize joyful go go jams in public
Speaker 2: spaces just to remind folks that joy is also part
Speaker 2: of resistance, Just so that the only thing that we're
Speaker 2: talking about is not defending our cities and being on
Speaker 2: the defense, but also reconnecting to the things that make
Speaker 2: our cities joyful and exciting and and and lovely places
Speaker 2: to be. And I think it has been important to me,
Speaker 2: when you're sick to death of reporting about all of this,
Speaker 2: also getting to remember that.
Speaker 3: Joy is part of it.
Speaker 2: That's like why we're doing this, so that we can
Speaker 2: experience joy in our cities.
Speaker 1: Yes, I agree, we will allow a little bit of
Speaker 1: joy I suppose in this day. Yeah, semi un joyful time.
Speaker 2: Yeah, a tiny bit, I will speaking of joy I
Speaker 2: wanted to end on one last teeny tiny little tidbit
Speaker 2: about resistance, which is that when I when we were
Speaker 2: talking last time, Gare, I told you I think this
Speaker 2: was like the day that the takeover was announced, there
Speaker 2: was that guy who threw a sandwich at the parag Yes, yes,
Speaker 2: well they popped this dude on felony charges, but DC's
Speaker 2: grand jury failed to indict, and now he's down to
Speaker 2: a misdemeanor, so he pled not guilty I think just
Speaker 2: a couple of days ago, to just a misdemeanor. So yeah,
Speaker 2: I mean grand jury's they used to say, like, oh,
Speaker 2: you could get.
Speaker 3: A grand jury, then buy a ham sandwich.
Speaker 2: I guess not if it's thrown at a federal office,
Speaker 2: or you can't not in DC.
Speaker 1: It's just like the only good piece of grand jury
Speaker 1: news I have kind of ever heard in my life.
Speaker 1: Whenever I hear news about a grand jury, it's always
Speaker 1: like terrible, Like, oh no, that sounds awful. Yeah, this
Speaker 1: is uh the first, the first based grand jury I've
Speaker 1: ever seen.
Speaker 2: Yes, yes, I mean if you're listening in if you're
Speaker 2: listening in DC and you're on a grand jury, you
Speaker 2: know what to do.
Speaker 3: Well, does Souths put it that way. But yeah, that's
Speaker 3: all I have really.
Speaker 2: I would just say, you know, if you happen to
Speaker 2: be listening in a place that is not the district,
Speaker 2: we really need your voice. You know, when stuff happens,
Speaker 2: there's not really anybody I can call. We have a
Speaker 2: congressional representative, Eleanor Holmes Norton, Ugh. She has been a
Speaker 2: lifelong fighter for d C and d c's self determination
Speaker 2: and civil rights. She is also i think the second
Speaker 2: oldest person in Congress. And I'll just say it's showing
Speaker 2: I think, you know, we don't really have a lot
Speaker 2: of people who are fighting for us and being a
Speaker 2: voice for us. And so yeah, stay checked in to
Speaker 2: d C. Even if Trump moves to you know, deploy
Speaker 2: national guards in other places, other kinds of takeovers. What's
Speaker 2: happening in DC is unique. It cannot happen in any
Speaker 2: other place in the country. And we're so often overlooked
Speaker 2: and ignored. And so if there are bills moving through Congress,
Speaker 2: call your Congress people and please advocate for the self
Speaker 2: determination of DC residents, because we have no one to
Speaker 2: advocate for on our behalf.
Speaker 3: So please be our voice.
Speaker 1: Thank you for talking about DC once again, Bridget Where
Speaker 1: can people find you online and your other shows?
Speaker 2: You can check me out on my podcast. There are
Speaker 2: no girls on the Internet. On iHeartRadio, a co host
Speaker 2: a podcast called Citycast DC about local happenings and politics
Speaker 2: and news and DC. You can check that out. I'm
Speaker 2: on Instagram at Bridget Marine DC. I'm on TikTok at
Speaker 2: Bridget Marine DC, and I'm on YouTube. There are no
Speaker 2: girls on the Internet. Yeah, that's right, Okay.
Speaker 1: Cool, I'm glad we figured that out, all right.
Speaker 2: Noll I guess YouTube is is like, guess that's cool.
Speaker 3: I'm doing my best out there.
Speaker 1: So true. It could Happen Here is a production of
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Speaker 1: Could Happen here listed directly in episode descriptions. Thanks for listening.