WEBVTT - Scary Fast Chips, AI to Get Regulated

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<v Speaker 1>From Bahard where Innovation, Money and power Collie in Silicon Valley, NBN.

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<v Speaker 1>This is Bloomberg Technology with Caroline Hyde and Ed Luod Love.

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<v Speaker 2>I'm Caroline Heide of Bloomberg's world headquarters in New York,

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<v Speaker 2>and I'm Met Ludlow in San Francisco.

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<v Speaker 3>This is Bloomberg Technology.

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<v Speaker 2>Coming up. We'll give you the key takeaways from Apple's

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<v Speaker 2>scary fast unveil, which featured new chips, laptops, so much more.

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<v Speaker 4>Plus we'll speak to an AI advisor to the White

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<v Speaker 4>House as President Biden takes the most significant step to

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<v Speaker 4>date in regulating artificial intelligence technology.

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<v Speaker 2>Meanwhile, in Vidia, it dips below one trillion dollars today

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<v Speaker 2>as concerns linger over US curbs on China and how

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<v Speaker 2>that may impact billions of dollars of existing orders. We'll

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<v Speaker 2>have that and so much more, but first let's just

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<v Speaker 2>check on on these marks. It is the end of

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<v Speaker 2>the month. We all know there's plenty of candy being

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<v Speaker 2>eyed for the day, but it is the end of

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<v Speaker 2>October and it was down, down, down, if you see

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<v Speaker 2>for the Really the Nasdaq currently off by some three

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<v Speaker 2>point three percent end the month, but it's the third

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<v Speaker 2>straight months of losses as we see for some of

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<v Speaker 2>the key big benchmarks across the US at the moment

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<v Speaker 2>ed and that as we worry about earnings, we worry

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<v Speaker 2>about of course geopolitics as well. This is the worst

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<v Speaker 2>therefore three month loss set of three months or so

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<v Speaker 2>that we've seen since back in what June twenty twenty two. Overall,

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<v Speaker 2>though this isn't as bad as September was. That's moving

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<v Speaker 2>on to some of the other benchmarks that we're keeping

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<v Speaker 2>an eye on. I'm looking the Nasdaq one hundred on

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<v Speaker 2>the day basically flat, which is pushing off of those

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<v Speaker 2>loads for the day, but the tenure yield is coming

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<v Speaker 2>down a little bit, so we've got a little bit

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<v Speaker 2>of buying head of the all important FED meeting that

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<v Speaker 2>comes tomorrow, and of course how much the Treasury Department

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<v Speaker 2>will actually be issuing a new debt. We've got a

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<v Speaker 2>little bit of a bid, but we're seeing the dollar

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<v Speaker 2>having a big bid against the Japanese end. This is

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<v Speaker 2>the key macro story of the day, really, the fact

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<v Speaker 2>that the back of Japan with Japan was not going

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<v Speaker 2>to be changing any of those yield curve controls, but

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<v Speaker 2>into the micro particularly the tech focus micro ed Yeah.

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<v Speaker 3>And earnings is still a story.

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<v Speaker 4>Pinterest a real surprise up more than eighteen percent, on

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<v Speaker 4>track for its biggest jump since August of twenty twenty two.

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<v Speaker 4>Top and bottom line beat, but a record monthly active

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<v Speaker 4>user base. We will get a key analyst conversation later

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<v Speaker 4>in the show on that name. Tesla's moving to the

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<v Speaker 4>upside modestly four tens and one percent, but it's kind

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<v Speaker 4>of rebounding from this slump since October eighteenth, and earnings

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<v Speaker 4>where it's down more than twenty percent. There's a lot

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<v Speaker 4>of concern about interest rates and how that's impacting EV demand.

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<v Speaker 4>We will have that conversation later in the program. And

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<v Speaker 4>on Semi we had the CEO on the show twenty

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<v Speaker 4>four hours ago, a tepid forecast for the fourth quarter,

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<v Speaker 4>a mystery OEM customer they wouldn't name that dragged down

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<v Speaker 4>results and the stock a second day of pressure.

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<v Speaker 1>There.

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<v Speaker 4>The key name that we're looking keeping it real this

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<v Speaker 4>Halloween is Apple.

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<v Speaker 3>They're scary fast event.

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<v Speaker 4>We got what we expected because of Bloomberg's Mark German

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<v Speaker 4>in his reporting. And I'm at a trio of Matt

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<v Speaker 4>book pros and the first volume may curve PCs with

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<v Speaker 4>a three nanometer processor, the M three, M three Pro

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<v Speaker 4>and M three Max chip.

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<v Speaker 3>What does this mean?

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<v Speaker 4>Does it put the mac back on track? We're joining

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<v Speaker 4>us now is Carolina Milianacy Creative Strategies, President and principle,

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<v Speaker 4>And listen, you just heard me Carolina. Does this put

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<v Speaker 4>the MacBook back on track?

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<v Speaker 5>I think it certainly puts Mac and ARM back on track.

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<v Speaker 5>I think coming out of the snap Dragon qualcom event

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<v Speaker 5>last week and seeing what they're able to do with

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<v Speaker 5>their platform and now having Apple with the N three

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<v Speaker 5>clearly puts the ARM architecture as a whole in a

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<v Speaker 5>much better place compared to Intel an X eighty six.

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<v Speaker 5>So I think that's what we're looking at, the excitement

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<v Speaker 5>around what this opportunity brings to the PC market.

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<v Speaker 2>What did you make at the price points?

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<v Speaker 5>Krolena, It was very interesting to see that the entry

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<v Speaker 5>level MacBook Pro was dropped in price visits. The one that,

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<v Speaker 5>together with the Mac Bugere as being the volume maker

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<v Speaker 5>and one that now at a lower price of one

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<v Speaker 5>five ninety nine starting point is going to really worry

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<v Speaker 5>the pcoems. You know the power that Apple has to

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<v Speaker 5>convince people that now that they own every from the

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<v Speaker 5>silicon to the harder to the software, and Tim Cook

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<v Speaker 5>pointed to that in the event yesterday, is really reassuring

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<v Speaker 5>customers that basically they're buying something that is in full

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<v Speaker 5>control of Apple and not like before at the mercy

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<v Speaker 5>of the Intel silicon, it.

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<v Speaker 2>Really was Apple silicon that was a selling point here, Carolina,

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<v Speaker 2>is that enough to drive significant well desire to be

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<v Speaker 2>buying in particularly as we had towards the holidays, You think.

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<v Speaker 5>Well, I think if the silicon doesn't convince you, the

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<v Speaker 5>black collar will was a lot of assignment on the

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<v Speaker 5>black color for the higher end s Q of the

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<v Speaker 5>book pro and I think that where Apple is pointing

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<v Speaker 5>is really upgrading current Intel based Mac owners and then

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<v Speaker 5>m one owners to really get into the newest and

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<v Speaker 5>fastest of their silicon product based. But you know, from

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<v Speaker 5>a holiday perspective, we are still in a tough economic

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<v Speaker 5>environment and that needs to be reconciled with We're looking

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<v Speaker 5>at also enterprise, not only consumers for Apple though, and

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<v Speaker 5>so there's definitely more opportunity there as we get into

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<v Speaker 5>the new year.

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<v Speaker 4>By the way, Caroline and Carolina, the entire event, according

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<v Speaker 4>to a blog post that Apple posted six minutes ago,

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<v Speaker 4>was shot on an i phone fifteen Promax the entire thing,

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<v Speaker 4>and it was edited on Max, So they're trying to

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<v Speaker 4>flex their product line across the board. What I think

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<v Speaker 4>is interesting, Carolina, is how they compare the performance of

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<v Speaker 4>M three and there's kind of an arc, right, M three,

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<v Speaker 4>M three Pro, M three Max relative to M one,

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<v Speaker 4>but also Intel, right, the top tier MacBook Pro they

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<v Speaker 4>said was eleven times faster than the most powerful Intel

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<v Speaker 4>Power PC.

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<v Speaker 3>So who are they going after here?

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<v Speaker 6>Right?

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<v Speaker 4>Are they going after just the high end PC market Intel,

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<v Speaker 4>you know, users that want an upgrade, or are they

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<v Speaker 4>just trying to keep refreshing those existing install base of

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<v Speaker 4>Apple devices.

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<v Speaker 5>Both is really trying to capture market share in the

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<v Speaker 5>higher end of a PC market, getting as many people

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<v Speaker 5>as possible off of Intel so they can experience the

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<v Speaker 5>higher seamless workflows that comes from owning all the pieces

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<v Speaker 5>of the equation and continue to vent upgrade from there.

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<v Speaker 5>I do think that, as you said, there's a lot

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<v Speaker 5>of flex there on. They had actually footnotes at the

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<v Speaker 5>end of the event about being shot on iPhone and

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<v Speaker 5>editor on Max, so they are really talking to creators.

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<v Speaker 5>By the same time, without ever mentioning jen Ai. They

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<v Speaker 5>were talking to AI developers two very high demanding workflows,

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<v Speaker 5>so there's definitely an attention there to where the conversation

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<v Speaker 5>is today.

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<v Speaker 3>Carolyn E.

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<v Speaker 4>MILNECI of Creative Strategies. Great to catch up here on

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<v Speaker 4>Bloomberg Technology.

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<v Speaker 3>Thank you.

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<v Speaker 4>Another Apple story that we've been tracking, the company could

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<v Speaker 4>be forced to scale back its app store fees for

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<v Speaker 4>developers after one of the EU's antitrust watchdogs said its

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<v Speaker 4>commissions violate the block's rules. The Dutch Authority for Consumers

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<v Speaker 4>and Market's ruled that Apple's commission on certain app subscriptions

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<v Speaker 4>are an abuse of the company's market power.

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<v Speaker 2>Caroc ongoing with the Dutch agency. Meanwhile, let's talk about

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<v Speaker 2>pinterest shares absolutely rallying today after reporting sales that men

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<v Speaker 2>expectations and mid of course, a push by the company

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<v Speaker 2>to make the platform basically a more shoppable. Tom Forte

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<v Speaker 2>da Davison, senior research analyst is with us and I mean, boy,

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<v Speaker 2>you had a by rating you reierated. This is the

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<v Speaker 2>best day for the stock since three years ago.

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<v Speaker 7>Tom, Yeah, they'd certainly delivered the treats that Pinterest Halloween.

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<v Speaker 7>So what you're seeing is the company's making it easier

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<v Speaker 7>for advertisers to prove that they're able to get conversion

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<v Speaker 7>or sales off of their platform. This is having a

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<v Speaker 7>huge positive impact to their revenue. You're seeing accelerating revenue

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<v Speaker 7>top line growth, and at the same time, like other

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<v Speaker 7>big tech companies, they have very much you know, belt

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<v Speaker 7>tightening going on managing expenses. So the combination of accelerating

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<v Speaker 7>revenue growth with belt tightening is tremendous revenue and tremendous earnings.

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<v Speaker 4>What was interesting Tom was monthly active uses hit a record,

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<v Speaker 4>or another way of looking at it is they eclipse

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<v Speaker 4>their pandemic peage. What was the more important metric for

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<v Speaker 4>you that monthly active use number or the fineinantals where

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<v Speaker 4>they beat top and bottom line.

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<v Speaker 7>What's very important on the monthly active users is they're

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<v Speaker 7>generating gen Z interest. So when you think about having

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<v Speaker 7>more engagement than they had in the early stages of

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<v Speaker 7>the pandemic, that's wonderful. How are they able to do

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<v Speaker 7>it so they stop trying to be TikTok. You've seen

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<v Speaker 7>meta platforms and others basically come up with metso products

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<v Speaker 7>to stay on parity with TikTok and they leaned into

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<v Speaker 7>what made pinterest unique and what made pinterest special, and

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<v Speaker 7>that's driven use in gen Z and it's had a

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<v Speaker 7>halo effect to the extent that the gen z's posting

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<v Speaker 7>content that other generations are liking as well. So very

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<v Speaker 7>impressive engagement growth for Pinterest.

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<v Speaker 3>Tom help us out with this one.

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<v Speaker 4>The CFO is saying that the investments they've made are

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<v Speaker 4>increasing shopability.

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<v Speaker 3>What is that? What does that mean?

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<v Speaker 7>The simple way to think about it is they have

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<v Speaker 7>a third party advertising initiative with Amazon. So let's say

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<v Speaker 7>you went to pinterest in the search for a green dress.

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<v Speaker 7>Among the many pictures you would see would be items

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<v Speaker 7>from Amazon. You could then click on those items and

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<v Speaker 7>buy those items.

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<v Speaker 6>So think about it.

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<v Speaker 7>In the past, you would see wonderful pictures on Pinterest,

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<v Speaker 7>but it wasn't always easy. Not easy to buy the sofa,

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<v Speaker 7>not easy to buy the apparel. They made it a

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<v Speaker 7>lot easier. That's improved the shoppability of Pinterest.

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<v Speaker 2>I mean, that's really what Bill Ready has been saying

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<v Speaker 2>since it's come aboard a little over a year ago.

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<v Speaker 2>It's about people come to Pinterest with intent. So clearly

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<v Speaker 2>advertiser seeing that for now, Tom Forte. Great to have

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<v Speaker 2>some time with you, Thank you, Da Davison.

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<v Speaker 8>Then one thing is clear. To realize the promise of

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<v Speaker 8>AI and avoid the risk, we need to govern this technology.

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<v Speaker 8>We face a genuine inflection point in history, one of

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<v Speaker 8>those moments where the decisions we make in the very

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<v Speaker 8>near term are going to set the course for the

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<v Speaker 8>next decade.

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<v Speaker 2>President Biden there after signing an Executive Order on Artificial Intelligence,

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<v Speaker 2>the most significant step to date in regulating the technology.

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<v Speaker 2>Joining us for more on all of this is doctor

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<v Speaker 2>Joey Bolowini, founder of the Algorithmic Justice League and author

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<v Speaker 2>of Unmasking AI. My Mission to Protect What is Human

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<v Speaker 2>in a World of Machines is published today. Congratulations spending

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<v Speaker 2>some time with us as well. It's great to have

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<v Speaker 2>you here. Equitable and Accountable AI, that's all about what

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<v Speaker 2>your Algorithmic Justice League is about. Does this EO get

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<v Speaker 2>us there in some way? Absolutely?

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<v Speaker 1>I will actually say this is a commendable step forward.

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<v Speaker 1>And part of this is because the EO that's been

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<v Speaker 1>issued includes teeth when it comes to government agencies using AI.

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<v Speaker 1>So once you're tying federal dollars too, who can procure

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<v Speaker 1>particular systems? Then we're actually starting to see something that's

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<v Speaker 1>going to compel change. So I am excited to see

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<v Speaker 1>the civil rights peace within this EO.

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<v Speaker 2>It's interesting you talk about teeth and there's sort of

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<v Speaker 2>the carrot teeth situation the US is using. There's the

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<v Speaker 2>teeth of finds. The EUAI Act has been talking about.

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<v Speaker 2>Everyone wants in on this pile of regulation or talking

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<v Speaker 2>about it. We've got the UKI Summit about to happen.

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<v Speaker 2>One of the critiques of that AI Summit is there's

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<v Speaker 2>not enough actual people from civil society at that summit.

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<v Speaker 2>How much do you think the US and lawmakers are

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<v Speaker 2>engaging with civil society on this.

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<v Speaker 1>I think that is a fair critique. I am glad

0:12:30.440 --> 0:12:33.480
<v Speaker 1>to share that a member of the Algorithmic Justice League

0:12:33.480 --> 0:12:36.440
<v Speaker 1>will be there, But when we look at the overall roster,

0:12:36.960 --> 0:12:40.920
<v Speaker 1>we don't want the tech companies writing the regulations, and

0:12:41.000 --> 0:12:43.800
<v Speaker 1>so I certainly think there's more work to be done,

0:12:43.920 --> 0:12:46.280
<v Speaker 1>and I also do think it's a good step forward

0:12:46.320 --> 0:12:49.920
<v Speaker 1>to have the AI Safety Summit at this time.

0:12:51.120 --> 0:12:51.800
<v Speaker 3>Doctor Joy.

0:12:51.920 --> 0:12:56.440
<v Speaker 4>The main mechanism or tool that the Executive Order puts

0:12:56.480 --> 0:13:00.920
<v Speaker 4>in place is big technology companies having to hand over

0:13:01.400 --> 0:13:05.880
<v Speaker 4>an LLM or foundation model for safety review before it

0:13:05.960 --> 0:13:09.000
<v Speaker 4>is released to the wider public. Just explain how you

0:13:09.080 --> 0:13:13.080
<v Speaker 4>think that will work as a safeguard as we develop

0:13:13.160 --> 0:13:15.320
<v Speaker 4>next generations of large language models.

0:13:15.960 --> 0:13:18.160
<v Speaker 1>I think it could go one of two ways. If

0:13:18.200 --> 0:13:23.320
<v Speaker 1>you actually have the companies themselves setting what the safety

0:13:23.360 --> 0:13:26.040
<v Speaker 1>measures are and what the safety test will be, will

0:13:26.080 --> 0:13:29.360
<v Speaker 1>have a situation of grading your own homework, which I

0:13:29.360 --> 0:13:32.200
<v Speaker 1>don't necessarily think is going to get us where we

0:13:32.280 --> 0:13:35.480
<v Speaker 1>want to go. If it is a situation where you

0:13:35.559 --> 0:13:39.599
<v Speaker 1>actually have third parties that are establishing what the standards

0:13:39.600 --> 0:13:43.199
<v Speaker 1>are and the guidelines are, then I think you actually

0:13:43.240 --> 0:13:47.200
<v Speaker 1>have a situation where the companies will have to meet

0:13:47.280 --> 0:13:51.120
<v Speaker 1>specific regulations that they themselves are not setting. So it

0:13:51.200 --> 0:13:55.680
<v Speaker 1>remains to be seen. I am cautiously optimistic, but companies

0:13:55.720 --> 0:13:58.400
<v Speaker 1>cannot be grading their own homework and then.

0:13:58.280 --> 0:14:00.880
<v Speaker 3>Turning in, Sorry to interrupt you.

0:14:00.920 --> 0:14:03.880
<v Speaker 4>The executive order kind of gives power to the agencies.

0:14:03.960 --> 0:14:07.360
<v Speaker 4>Twenty four hours ago, we had doctor faith A Lee

0:14:07.360 --> 0:14:09.360
<v Speaker 4>of Stanford on the show, and she basically said, I

0:14:09.400 --> 0:14:13.040
<v Speaker 4>want to see a more even distribution of funding and

0:14:13.120 --> 0:14:17.960
<v Speaker 4>control across academia, industry, and the public sector. Where do

0:14:18.000 --> 0:14:20.680
<v Speaker 4>you stand on that balance of who is working on

0:14:20.720 --> 0:14:23.400
<v Speaker 4>AI and who has the power to regulate it.

0:14:24.360 --> 0:14:28.640
<v Speaker 1>I think I would give more power to the government

0:14:28.840 --> 0:14:32.000
<v Speaker 1>and then to companies. But I do think it's commendable

0:14:32.360 --> 0:14:36.000
<v Speaker 1>to see increased AI capacity for academics. As we know,

0:14:36.400 --> 0:14:38.520
<v Speaker 1>a lot of the compute power and a lot of

0:14:38.560 --> 0:14:42.440
<v Speaker 1>the data access does go mainly to the large tech company,

0:14:42.520 --> 0:14:46.000
<v Speaker 1>so it does make it difficult for researchers and outsiders

0:14:46.040 --> 0:14:48.960
<v Speaker 1>to even have a sense of how to assess the

0:14:49.040 --> 0:14:51.440
<v Speaker 1>risk if you don't have that access. So that's a

0:14:51.440 --> 0:14:52.280
<v Speaker 1>good step forward.

0:14:52.600 --> 0:14:56.080
<v Speaker 2>Your whole Mighty thesis methodology basically showed the level of

0:14:56.120 --> 0:15:00.280
<v Speaker 2>bias whether it comes racial agenda within sort of AI

0:15:00.360 --> 0:15:03.520
<v Speaker 2>services from certain companies in the US. You are going

0:15:03.520 --> 0:15:05.160
<v Speaker 2>out on your book tour and talking to some of

0:15:05.200 --> 0:15:07.680
<v Speaker 2>the most notable names in technology, some Lpment for example

0:15:07.720 --> 0:15:09.840
<v Speaker 2>being one of them. How much they wanted to engage

0:15:10.280 --> 0:15:12.760
<v Speaker 2>with you. How much have they been trying to well

0:15:12.880 --> 0:15:15.560
<v Speaker 2>improve their homework before turning it in and having someone

0:15:15.560 --> 0:15:18.400
<v Speaker 2>else market I think it's a mixed bag.

0:15:18.480 --> 0:15:21.200
<v Speaker 1>I will say for Open AI, they have reached out

0:15:21.240 --> 0:15:24.280
<v Speaker 1>to the Algorithmic Justice League multiple times and when they

0:15:24.320 --> 0:15:28.200
<v Speaker 1>had their bug bounty program to try to look at

0:15:28.240 --> 0:15:32.560
<v Speaker 1>AI vulnerabilities, they mention one of our white papers and

0:15:32.600 --> 0:15:35.360
<v Speaker 1>so forth. So I think there is a good faith

0:15:35.800 --> 0:15:38.840
<v Speaker 1>effort to reach out, but I certainly don't think it's enough,

0:15:38.960 --> 0:15:42.680
<v Speaker 1>and we certainly have different views. For example, how do

0:15:42.840 --> 0:15:47.479
<v Speaker 1>you credit and compensate artist? I do think many companies

0:15:47.520 --> 0:15:51.400
<v Speaker 1>have gotten a free pass on building llms with data

0:15:51.480 --> 0:15:55.800
<v Speaker 1>that's been collected without consent and without compensation yourself.

0:15:55.840 --> 0:15:58.160
<v Speaker 2>Being an artist, a poet, not only just researcher and

0:15:58.240 --> 0:16:02.920
<v Speaker 2>policy guidance is important. Rate the media for a minute,

0:16:03.240 --> 0:16:05.880
<v Speaker 2>because I think there is this desire sometimes to go

0:16:05.960 --> 0:16:09.480
<v Speaker 2>for the biggest headline, which often is you know, terminator style,

0:16:09.560 --> 0:16:11.600
<v Speaker 2>AI is going to end us all. But much of

0:16:11.640 --> 0:16:14.160
<v Speaker 2>the criticism has been in the here and the now.

0:16:14.200 --> 0:16:16.360
<v Speaker 2>We need to tackle the bias in the real data

0:16:16.400 --> 0:16:19.040
<v Speaker 2>the application. Where we are today, are we managing to

0:16:19.080 --> 0:16:21.880
<v Speaker 2>move away from hyperboley and get to actually what really

0:16:21.920 --> 0:16:23.200
<v Speaker 2>is the risk when it comes to AI?

0:16:23.920 --> 0:16:28.200
<v Speaker 1>It depends on the outlet, right, and so I commend

0:16:29.320 --> 0:16:32.400
<v Speaker 1>news outlets that actually bring in voices like the Algorithmic

0:16:32.600 --> 0:16:37.120
<v Speaker 1>Justice League CDT and others. So we're getting a different perspective.

0:16:37.200 --> 0:16:39.520
<v Speaker 1>But I still think there is a lot of fear

0:16:39.680 --> 0:16:43.680
<v Speaker 1>mongering and numerism, and that's one of the concerns I

0:16:43.720 --> 0:16:47.840
<v Speaker 1>have even with the framing of the AI Safety Summit,

0:16:48.000 --> 0:16:50.480
<v Speaker 1>and so I certainly want to make sure we are

0:16:50.520 --> 0:16:54.400
<v Speaker 1>focused on immediate and emerging harms. It's not to say

0:16:54.400 --> 0:16:56.640
<v Speaker 1>we don't want to be forward looking, but we don't

0:16:56.640 --> 0:16:59.560
<v Speaker 1>want to be so distracted that we don't attend to

0:16:59.640 --> 0:17:02.160
<v Speaker 1>the thing things we already know how to address.

0:17:03.600 --> 0:17:07.240
<v Speaker 4>Doctor Joy bolh and Weeni, founder of the Algorithmic Justice League.

0:17:07.240 --> 0:17:09.439
<v Speaker 4>Great to have you here on Bloomberg Technology. Thank you

0:17:09.480 --> 0:17:11.760
<v Speaker 4>so much. Now coming up on the program in video.

0:17:11.800 --> 0:17:14.439
<v Speaker 4>Shares taking a hit today on reports they may have

0:17:14.520 --> 0:17:17.680
<v Speaker 4>to cancel billions of dollars worth of advanced chip sales

0:17:18.119 --> 0:17:21.080
<v Speaker 4>to China. More on how those new US export rules

0:17:21.080 --> 0:17:23.320
<v Speaker 4>are putting the company in a state of limbo. The

0:17:23.359 --> 0:17:27.159
<v Speaker 4>stockdown about one percent, more than two percent in the session.

0:17:27.240 --> 0:17:45.440
<v Speaker 4>This is Bloomberg Technology. Okay, it's time for talking tech

0:17:45.480 --> 0:17:48.160
<v Speaker 4>and first up, Vodaphone is agreeing to sell its Spanish

0:17:48.240 --> 0:17:51.359
<v Speaker 4>unit to Zagonda Communications. The deal is said to be valued

0:17:51.359 --> 0:17:54.760
<v Speaker 4>at roughly five point three billion dollars including debt. The

0:17:54.760 --> 0:17:58.399
<v Speaker 4>European Commission is currently examining that deal, which would shift

0:17:58.400 --> 0:18:03.320
<v Speaker 4>the telecommunications and open the door to more consolidation across Europe.

0:18:03.520 --> 0:18:06.400
<v Speaker 4>And Bunge, the Sony owned game studio behind the popular

0:18:06.400 --> 0:18:10.000
<v Speaker 4>Destiny Too franchise, has let go of an undisclosed number

0:18:10.000 --> 0:18:13.560
<v Speaker 4>of its workforce. This comes after Bungee delayed the upcoming

0:18:13.600 --> 0:18:16.520
<v Speaker 4>expansion of Destiny to, pushing it out of Sony's current

0:18:16.520 --> 0:18:19.280
<v Speaker 4>fiscal year. The move is part of a wider restructuring

0:18:19.280 --> 0:18:22.119
<v Speaker 4>at the company and reflects a recent bout of layoffs

0:18:22.320 --> 0:18:26.320
<v Speaker 4>across the gaming industry. Plus, Samsung is seeing encouraging signs

0:18:26.320 --> 0:18:29.760
<v Speaker 4>of recovery in the chips market after reporting profit for

0:18:29.840 --> 0:18:32.320
<v Speaker 4>the third quarter, which was well ahead of estimates. The

0:18:32.400 --> 0:18:34.920
<v Speaker 4>South Korean giant raked in more than four billion dollars

0:18:35.080 --> 0:18:38.120
<v Speaker 4>of net income in the September quarter, more than double

0:18:38.520 --> 0:18:42.520
<v Speaker 4>what was expected. Executives say that artificial intelligence is driving

0:18:42.560 --> 0:18:46.800
<v Speaker 4>demand and it plans increased spending on advanced chip making.

0:18:46.960 --> 0:18:50.520
<v Speaker 2>Caroline, Meanwhile, let's look at the fresh US curbs on

0:18:50.840 --> 0:18:53.880
<v Speaker 2>the advanced chip making that's going on to China. They're

0:18:53.880 --> 0:18:56.120
<v Speaker 2>presenting a new risk to in video. We understand now

0:18:56.160 --> 0:18:58.280
<v Speaker 2>a deep and dim in the shares that you've currently

0:18:58.320 --> 0:19:01.280
<v Speaker 2>see to push the market value just below that one

0:19:01.320 --> 0:19:03.200
<v Speaker 2>trillion dollar mark. So all off of the Wall Street

0:19:03.240 --> 0:19:07.000
<v Speaker 2>Journal reported, well, well that potentially in Video might have

0:19:07.040 --> 0:19:09.439
<v Speaker 2>to cancel five billion dollars worth of sales to China.

0:19:09.880 --> 0:19:12.640
<v Speaker 2>But please to welcome Conjan Zivani. He's been bag intelligence

0:19:12.640 --> 0:19:16.359
<v Speaker 2>analyst covering all things semiconductors. And was this in some

0:19:16.440 --> 0:19:18.840
<v Speaker 2>way obvious that they were going to have to pull

0:19:18.880 --> 0:19:21.760
<v Speaker 2>back from selling China sooner than some had anticipated.

0:19:23.560 --> 0:19:26.240
<v Speaker 9>Yeah, I mean the cancelation of the grace periods was

0:19:26.280 --> 0:19:29.560
<v Speaker 9>definitely a surprise for them, and we think now it

0:19:29.640 --> 0:19:32.280
<v Speaker 9>is the restrictions have reached a point where this does

0:19:32.320 --> 0:19:34.719
<v Speaker 9>start having some long term impacts. So when we look

0:19:34.720 --> 0:19:38.680
<v Speaker 9>at long term impacts next year, which is fiscal twenty five,

0:19:38.680 --> 0:19:41.680
<v Speaker 9>which is equal on to Calnar twenty four for them,

0:19:42.000 --> 0:19:44.520
<v Speaker 9>you know, we estimate about five to eight billion that

0:19:44.680 --> 0:19:47.120
<v Speaker 9>they would have shipped to China, so you can put

0:19:47.119 --> 0:19:50.600
<v Speaker 9>a five billion threshold baseline impact that it will have

0:19:50.720 --> 0:19:53.720
<v Speaker 9>to the top line. However, there are some avenues we

0:19:53.800 --> 0:19:58.120
<v Speaker 9>think where Nvidia can offset that loss, one being shipping

0:19:58.160 --> 0:20:01.560
<v Speaker 9>to other customers outside of because they're still as of

0:20:01.680 --> 0:20:04.760
<v Speaker 9>right now and things can change. Given the uncertain macro

0:20:04.960 --> 0:20:07.640
<v Speaker 9>there are still but there are still demand for Nvidia chips.

0:20:07.760 --> 0:20:10.920
<v Speaker 9>And second, there might be ways that n Media can

0:20:10.960 --> 0:20:14.680
<v Speaker 9>still get exposure to the Chinese market through alternate means.

0:20:15.119 --> 0:20:18.000
<v Speaker 4>What we're talking about in the AI chick context is

0:20:18.040 --> 0:20:21.960
<v Speaker 4>GPUs that are basically assemble components that go into data centers,

0:20:22.400 --> 0:20:24.800
<v Speaker 4>and for China that's always been twenty to twenty five

0:20:24.800 --> 0:20:28.480
<v Speaker 4>percent of its data center business right but their supply constrained,

0:20:28.480 --> 0:20:31.080
<v Speaker 4>and they never talk about it. Is it just simply

0:20:31.119 --> 0:20:34.560
<v Speaker 4>that they can sell to other nations, other startups around

0:20:34.560 --> 0:20:36.560
<v Speaker 4>the world the same product that they would have otherwise

0:20:36.560 --> 0:20:37.240
<v Speaker 4>sent to China.

0:20:37.720 --> 0:20:39.800
<v Speaker 9>Well, not exactly the same product, but a version of

0:20:39.840 --> 0:20:40.439
<v Speaker 9>the same product.

0:20:40.520 --> 0:20:40.720
<v Speaker 1>Yes.

0:20:41.000 --> 0:20:43.240
<v Speaker 9>And then the second key point is when we look

0:20:43.280 --> 0:20:46.600
<v Speaker 9>at these cloud providers, their CAPEX is not only the

0:20:46.680 --> 0:20:49.400
<v Speaker 9>only avenue that n media can get exposure. For example,

0:20:49.680 --> 0:20:53.280
<v Speaker 9>Microsoft has a compute offload through open AI, so when

0:20:53.320 --> 0:20:55.960
<v Speaker 9>we look at Microsoft Capex, that's not the only piece

0:20:56.000 --> 0:20:58.399
<v Speaker 9>that n media gets, but also through open AI. You

0:20:58.440 --> 0:21:00.919
<v Speaker 9>have the same thing going on with Alibab announcing that

0:21:00.960 --> 0:21:03.719
<v Speaker 9>they are going to offer Meda's large language models. So

0:21:03.760 --> 0:21:06.679
<v Speaker 9>there are still different avenues that sort of Nvidia can

0:21:06.720 --> 0:21:08.919
<v Speaker 9>get an indirect exposure to the Chinese market.

0:21:09.359 --> 0:21:12.879
<v Speaker 4>Counjen Savannia, Bloomberg Intelligence, the other mister chip out here

0:21:13.200 --> 0:21:26.360
<v Speaker 4>in San Francisco, Caroline.

0:21:22.240 --> 0:21:24.840
<v Speaker 2>Welcome back to Bloomberg Technology. I'm Caroline had in New York.

0:21:25.160 --> 0:21:27.040
<v Speaker 3>And I'm ed Louvelow in San Francisco.

0:21:27.119 --> 0:21:29.320
<v Speaker 4>Let's go to check on European markets which have just

0:21:29.400 --> 0:21:31.919
<v Speaker 4>closed all this week. Will bring you the European market

0:21:31.960 --> 0:21:34.280
<v Speaker 4>closed and the stock six hundred Europe kind of this

0:21:34.800 --> 0:21:38.320
<v Speaker 4>continent wide gauge of equities rising for a second straight day.

0:21:38.440 --> 0:21:40.880
<v Speaker 4>But we're ending the month of October, and this has

0:21:40.960 --> 0:21:43.880
<v Speaker 4>been the worst October going back to two thousand and four.

0:21:43.960 --> 0:21:46.960
<v Speaker 4>European stocks. A bright spot with Stilantis and their earnings.

0:21:47.200 --> 0:21:50.520
<v Speaker 4>That stock in its European trading up three point six percent.

0:21:50.840 --> 0:21:52.320
<v Speaker 3>Oil rebounding modesty.

0:21:52.400 --> 0:21:54.520
<v Speaker 4>Brent, which is kind of more of the global benchmark

0:21:54.520 --> 0:21:58.320
<v Speaker 4>as opposed to WTI, have been moving lower Monday over

0:21:58.359 --> 0:22:01.400
<v Speaker 4>the weekend due to the activity in the Israel hamass war,

0:22:01.680 --> 0:22:04.760
<v Speaker 4>rebounding modestly four tenths of one percent in euro dollar

0:22:04.800 --> 0:22:08.120
<v Speaker 4>one oh five six two softer the euro by half

0:22:08.160 --> 0:22:10.080
<v Speaker 4>a percentage point against the dollar.

0:22:10.119 --> 0:22:13.080
<v Speaker 2>Caroline tell you also, what's a little bit softer today

0:22:13.200 --> 0:22:15.480
<v Speaker 2>has been the Nasdaq and the NaSTA one hundred and

0:22:15.520 --> 0:22:17.280
<v Speaker 2>we're down by another tenth of a percent, but actually

0:22:17.320 --> 0:22:19.760
<v Speaker 2>all told, on the month of October we're down more

0:22:19.760 --> 0:22:21.960
<v Speaker 2>than three percent, not as bad as it was the

0:22:21.960 --> 0:22:23.760
<v Speaker 2>five percent sell off back in September, but it's three

0:22:23.760 --> 0:22:25.640
<v Speaker 2>straight months of losses for the NASDAK at the moment,

0:22:25.880 --> 0:22:28.280
<v Speaker 2>worse set of losing streets that we've seen all the

0:22:28.320 --> 0:22:30.800
<v Speaker 2>way back to, of course about June of last year.

0:22:30.880 --> 0:22:32.880
<v Speaker 2>So clearly pressure is on some of these big tech

0:22:32.920 --> 0:22:36.040
<v Speaker 2>naus A mid earnings amid these geopolitical stories that you

0:22:36.040 --> 0:22:38.080
<v Speaker 2>talk us through ed looking in in video, of course,

0:22:38.119 --> 0:22:40.040
<v Speaker 2>we're just talking about the JYMP politics there, the sales

0:22:40.080 --> 0:22:42.600
<v Speaker 2>into China and the issue with well maybe not being

0:22:42.640 --> 0:22:45.439
<v Speaker 2>able to put some of those orders through to that country.

0:22:45.600 --> 0:22:47.879
<v Speaker 2>So stock under pressure there. It just only tests that

0:22:47.960 --> 0:22:50.120
<v Speaker 2>up what about tenth of percent, two tens of percent,

0:22:50.200 --> 0:22:52.800
<v Speaker 2>let's call it. What a painful two weeks that's been

0:22:52.840 --> 0:22:54.199
<v Speaker 2>the wed dof You see the story at what one

0:22:54.280 --> 0:22:56.560
<v Speaker 2>hundred and forty five billion dollars wiped off in terms

0:22:56.600 --> 0:22:59.399
<v Speaker 2>of its market capitalization over the course of those two weeks.

0:23:00.560 --> 0:23:01.920
<v Speaker 2>That does seem to be in some way to do

0:23:02.040 --> 0:23:02.800
<v Speaker 2>with its earnings.

0:23:03.640 --> 0:23:05.800
<v Speaker 4>Yeah, I think if we go back to October eighteenth

0:23:05.800 --> 0:23:08.919
<v Speaker 4>when they reported earnings, until this point, we're down twenty

0:23:08.960 --> 0:23:11.479
<v Speaker 4>percent on Tesla's shares. The other way looking at it, though,

0:23:11.600 --> 0:23:14.120
<v Speaker 4>is that Tesla's up more than sixty percent year to date,

0:23:14.160 --> 0:23:16.400
<v Speaker 4>while the S and P five hundred is up much

0:23:16.440 --> 0:23:17.200
<v Speaker 4>more modestly.

0:23:17.280 --> 0:23:19.440
<v Speaker 3>But the concern is interest rates.

0:23:19.480 --> 0:23:21.760
<v Speaker 4>You know Elon Musk talking about the impact of interest

0:23:21.880 --> 0:23:24.719
<v Speaker 4>rates and they've used price cuts earlier in the year

0:23:24.760 --> 0:23:27.639
<v Speaker 4>to unlock demand. How much do we put emphasis on

0:23:27.840 --> 0:23:31.840
<v Speaker 4>high rate environment hurting consumers hitting that ev demand? But yeah,

0:23:31.880 --> 0:23:34.239
<v Speaker 4>that's a pretty telling chart, isn't it. The story at

0:23:34.280 --> 0:23:36.400
<v Speaker 4>least in the last two weeks has changed that we're

0:23:36.400 --> 0:23:37.800
<v Speaker 4>a little modestly higher.

0:23:38.840 --> 0:23:41.840
<v Speaker 2>It's Tuesday, and it has been interesting, hasn't it? Ultimately

0:23:41.880 --> 0:23:44.800
<v Speaker 2>that they've had pressure from China as well byd But

0:23:45.040 --> 0:23:47.320
<v Speaker 2>I don't know if you noticed overall that there was,

0:23:47.359 --> 0:23:49.440
<v Speaker 2>of course, well, the idea that we're going to be

0:23:49.480 --> 0:23:52.159
<v Speaker 2>seeing Elon Musk flying over to the UK. I think

0:23:52.200 --> 0:23:54.480
<v Speaker 2>he's actually just touched down. This is all about not

0:23:54.600 --> 0:23:57.119
<v Speaker 2>Tesla but art Intelligence, which of course, is a long

0:23:57.200 --> 0:23:58.119
<v Speaker 2>term theme for Tesla.

0:23:59.080 --> 0:24:01.320
<v Speaker 4>Yeah, it is a long term theme because the ultimate

0:24:01.560 --> 0:24:04.520
<v Speaker 4>business model is to have a fleet of robotaxis, which

0:24:04.520 --> 0:24:06.960
<v Speaker 4>are Tesla vehicles centrally controlled by Tesla.

0:24:07.320 --> 0:24:08.240
<v Speaker 3>The training of that is.

0:24:08.200 --> 0:24:11.400
<v Speaker 4>Done on Dojo, their supercomputer, and the neural network they're

0:24:11.440 --> 0:24:14.120
<v Speaker 4>building is their version of AI, which they have high

0:24:14.160 --> 0:24:16.480
<v Speaker 4>degree of confidence on. And AI is really top of

0:24:16.480 --> 0:24:17.639
<v Speaker 4>mind for mister Mask right.

0:24:17.520 --> 0:24:21.280
<v Speaker 2>Now, instantly is as he touches down for the UKAI Summit,

0:24:21.400 --> 0:24:23.560
<v Speaker 2>and of course all things AI have just been happening

0:24:23.600 --> 0:24:26.000
<v Speaker 2>right here in the United States with that Executive Order

0:24:26.040 --> 0:24:28.879
<v Speaker 2>as well, I speak to someone who's been there helping

0:24:28.960 --> 0:24:31.360
<v Speaker 2>craft what a NEO might look like with the President.

0:24:31.640 --> 0:24:34.000
<v Speaker 2>You are at this signing of the Executive Order, credo

0:24:34.080 --> 0:24:37.960
<v Speaker 2>a CEO Laverena singh Laverna. Really important to have some

0:24:38.080 --> 0:24:41.040
<v Speaker 2>time with you today because you're in the business of governance,

0:24:41.080 --> 0:24:45.560
<v Speaker 2>governance of AI systems. Ultimately, this Executive Order, I feel,

0:24:45.640 --> 0:24:48.360
<v Speaker 2>leaves a lot still yet to be ironed out when

0:24:48.359 --> 0:24:53.760
<v Speaker 2>it comes to actual guardrails, actual benchmarks, actual well really auditing.

0:24:54.160 --> 0:24:55.639
<v Speaker 2>How do you see this EO doing.

0:24:57.600 --> 0:25:00.320
<v Speaker 10>Thank you so much for having me here today. It

0:25:00.440 --> 0:25:03.560
<v Speaker 10>truly is a historic moment, and I am reporting here

0:25:03.680 --> 0:25:08.280
<v Speaker 10>life from DC. You know, this Executive Order was one

0:25:08.320 --> 0:25:13.160
<v Speaker 10>of the most comprehensive and expansive commitments to responsible AI

0:25:13.240 --> 0:25:16.439
<v Speaker 10>that we've seen from the federal government. And something that

0:25:16.480 --> 0:25:19.239
<v Speaker 10>I've stated in the past is we need to be

0:25:19.520 --> 0:25:22.919
<v Speaker 10>okay with adaptive policy making, and that's not exactly what

0:25:22.960 --> 0:25:25.560
<v Speaker 10>we are seeing at this moment in time. This year

0:25:25.800 --> 0:25:29.199
<v Speaker 10>is so comprehensive. I've barely made it through half of

0:25:29.240 --> 0:25:32.440
<v Speaker 10>it right now, but this is a strong signal from

0:25:32.520 --> 0:25:35.960
<v Speaker 10>the government that now it is not about just talking

0:25:36.000 --> 0:25:40.000
<v Speaker 10>about responsible AI, but making sure that not only the

0:25:40.119 --> 0:25:46.160
<v Speaker 10>US agencies but also private sector is showing success against

0:25:46.160 --> 0:25:49.320
<v Speaker 10>what those guardrails are. So Carolyn, absolutely, this is a

0:25:49.359 --> 0:25:50.119
<v Speaker 10>starting point.

0:25:50.359 --> 0:25:51.840
<v Speaker 2>There's a lot to unpack.

0:25:51.520 --> 0:25:53.919
<v Speaker 10>In this executive Order, but I think they're going to

0:25:53.920 --> 0:25:58.560
<v Speaker 10>see ripple effects across the world with this historic executive

0:25:58.640 --> 0:26:02.440
<v Speaker 10>order from the President the Vice President Navarna.

0:26:02.480 --> 0:26:05.679
<v Speaker 4>Of the fifty percent of the extensive EO that you

0:26:05.760 --> 0:26:09.520
<v Speaker 4>have read, what's your biggest criticism of the final form?

0:26:09.800 --> 0:26:11.960
<v Speaker 4>Where would you have liked to have seen the administration

0:26:12.119 --> 0:26:12.560
<v Speaker 4>do more?

0:26:14.600 --> 0:26:14.679
<v Speaker 11>So?

0:26:14.960 --> 0:26:17.520
<v Speaker 10>Ed, I think this goes back to we always want

0:26:17.600 --> 0:26:20.600
<v Speaker 10>more and especially as technologists, we want it to be precise.

0:26:20.880 --> 0:26:23.200
<v Speaker 10>But I think let's focus on what is so great

0:26:23.200 --> 0:26:26.400
<v Speaker 10>about the CEO. I think this EO think about it

0:26:26.480 --> 0:26:28.600
<v Speaker 10>as not a rule of the law, but this is

0:26:28.640 --> 0:26:32.480
<v Speaker 10>a work plan that is providing a very compressed timeline

0:26:32.520 --> 0:26:36.080
<v Speaker 10>for US agencies as well as the private sector to

0:26:36.200 --> 0:26:39.359
<v Speaker 10>start not only defining what does good look like in

0:26:39.440 --> 0:26:44.119
<v Speaker 10>terms of benchmarking and evaluation of these powerfolised systems, but

0:26:44.240 --> 0:26:48.000
<v Speaker 10>also holding them accountable in a very short timeframe to

0:26:48.040 --> 0:26:50.679
<v Speaker 10>come up with a game plan as to how we

0:26:50.720 --> 0:26:53.080
<v Speaker 10>are going to make sure that that whatever is defined

0:26:53.119 --> 0:26:56.439
<v Speaker 10>as good is actually adhere to. So two things that

0:26:56.440 --> 0:26:58.200
<v Speaker 10>I would like to call out in the EO that

0:26:58.240 --> 0:27:02.679
<v Speaker 10>we are very excited about is first and foremost, you know,

0:27:02.720 --> 0:27:08.520
<v Speaker 10>creation of standards led by NEST, especially for benchmarking and

0:27:08.600 --> 0:27:12.840
<v Speaker 10>auditing of artificial intelligence systems. We have about you know,

0:27:12.840 --> 0:27:16.200
<v Speaker 10>two hundred and seventy days for NEST to actually start

0:27:16.240 --> 0:27:18.879
<v Speaker 10>building a game plan for that. And then secondly, the

0:27:19.000 --> 0:27:22.919
<v Speaker 10>United States government agencies, you know, we're looking for the

0:27:22.960 --> 0:27:25.440
<v Speaker 10>OMB guidance which is going to come out any day,

0:27:25.880 --> 0:27:28.959
<v Speaker 10>which is going to put further focus on how procurement

0:27:29.400 --> 0:27:33.240
<v Speaker 10>of AI systems by US government and the agencies happen.

0:27:33.680 --> 0:27:35.600
<v Speaker 10>So I would say that right now we should be

0:27:35.640 --> 0:27:37.639
<v Speaker 10>focusing on all the great things that are in this

0:27:37.760 --> 0:27:41.000
<v Speaker 10>ear and then yes, there's lots more work ahead of us,

0:27:41.240 --> 0:27:44.200
<v Speaker 10>and we're going to continuously see over the coming months

0:27:44.600 --> 0:27:47.119
<v Speaker 10>more and more getting defined in terms of what is

0:27:47.160 --> 0:27:48.400
<v Speaker 10>really possible.

0:27:48.480 --> 0:27:51.240
<v Speaker 2>MIST being the national standard strategy for critical and Emerging

0:27:51.240 --> 0:27:56.159
<v Speaker 2>Technology in AVRENA. I'm interested that they're setting basically benchmark guidelines.

0:27:56.520 --> 0:28:00.760
<v Speaker 2>Your company already is kind of a private sector addition

0:28:01.040 --> 0:28:02.880
<v Speaker 2>that could be taken if you suddenly got a lot

0:28:02.880 --> 0:28:06.760
<v Speaker 2>of inbound from this, because when you're helping companies basically

0:28:07.200 --> 0:28:09.160
<v Speaker 2>build AI accountablity.

0:28:10.119 --> 0:28:14.399
<v Speaker 10>Yes, Carolyn so crew DOOAI is an AI governance platform

0:28:14.440 --> 0:28:18.880
<v Speaker 10>that provides continuous oversight and accountability of artificial intelligence systems.

0:28:19.480 --> 0:28:22.440
<v Speaker 10>I would say, not only because of this executive action,

0:28:22.720 --> 0:28:26.240
<v Speaker 10>but the need for trust, which is so critical as

0:28:26.280 --> 0:28:32.439
<v Speaker 10>companies are adopting building using artificial intelligence at scale, that

0:28:32.480 --> 0:28:36.080
<v Speaker 10>has really propelled and increased the need for CREDOI in

0:28:36.119 --> 0:28:38.920
<v Speaker 10>the market as well. And I think just to underscore

0:28:39.040 --> 0:28:42.719
<v Speaker 10>in CREDOAI, we are operationalizing what does good look like?

0:28:42.800 --> 0:28:47.560
<v Speaker 10>These might come from standards like nisst AI rmf ISO standards.

0:28:47.760 --> 0:28:50.560
<v Speaker 10>It could come from regulations like New York City Low

0:28:50.640 --> 0:28:53.240
<v Speaker 10>number one forty four. It can come from company policies

0:28:53.560 --> 0:28:57.520
<v Speaker 10>or industry best practices, and CREDOAI already has been at

0:28:57.560 --> 0:29:00.080
<v Speaker 10>the front of it. So now I would say the

0:29:00.120 --> 0:29:04.160
<v Speaker 10>companies as well as US government agencies are really requiring

0:29:04.240 --> 0:29:06.640
<v Speaker 10>creed OI as a core platform that's going to enable

0:29:06.720 --> 0:29:08.640
<v Speaker 10>trust with their consumers.

0:29:09.800 --> 0:29:10.240
<v Speaker 3>Nevrina.

0:29:10.320 --> 0:29:13.600
<v Speaker 4>In that light and in pursuit of a range of views,

0:29:13.600 --> 0:29:15.160
<v Speaker 4>I want to ask you the same question I've asked

0:29:15.200 --> 0:29:17.680
<v Speaker 4>all our guests in the last twenty four hours. The

0:29:17.720 --> 0:29:21.360
<v Speaker 4>main mechanism that the EO spells out and the Defense

0:29:21.640 --> 0:29:25.440
<v Speaker 4>Procurement Act empowers them to do, is to require makers

0:29:25.440 --> 0:29:28.840
<v Speaker 4>of large language models to offer them up for government

0:29:28.920 --> 0:29:33.000
<v Speaker 4>safety review before they are released to the wider public.

0:29:33.760 --> 0:29:37.480
<v Speaker 4>If a startups building in LM, is that a good mechanism.

0:29:37.480 --> 0:29:39.320
<v Speaker 4>Will that help the industry move forward?

0:29:41.960 --> 0:29:43.719
<v Speaker 2>I think that's a great question.

0:29:43.880 --> 0:29:47.720
<v Speaker 10>I am concerned about regulatory capture, and I think we

0:29:47.880 --> 0:29:50.080
<v Speaker 10>have to really focus on how do we bring this

0:29:50.320 --> 0:29:54.800
<v Speaker 10>entire startup innovation ecosystem forward, And something that we are

0:29:54.840 --> 0:29:59.400
<v Speaker 10>actively focused on at CREED OAI where executive orders as

0:29:59.440 --> 0:30:03.240
<v Speaker 10>well as reads are not a barrier for startups, especially

0:30:03.240 --> 0:30:06.400
<v Speaker 10>not the well capitalized startups, but it's an enabler for them.

0:30:07.080 --> 0:30:09.440
<v Speaker 10>So in terms of that, what the EO is spelling

0:30:09.480 --> 0:30:14.160
<v Speaker 10>out that the foundation model providers have to provide test

0:30:14.200 --> 0:30:18.760
<v Speaker 10>results to the government before releasing these models, especially for

0:30:18.800 --> 0:30:21.960
<v Speaker 10>government use. I think it's a good step, but it's

0:30:22.040 --> 0:30:25.520
<v Speaker 10>not comprehensive. And this is where I am encouraged to

0:30:25.560 --> 0:30:28.640
<v Speaker 10>see more action in the coming months, where we are

0:30:28.680 --> 0:30:32.400
<v Speaker 10>going to provide that oversight as well as benchmarking and

0:30:32.480 --> 0:30:37.480
<v Speaker 10>testing requirements across the entire value chain, the foundation model developers,

0:30:37.960 --> 0:30:42.280
<v Speaker 10>the application developers, the enterprises, and the consumers.

0:30:42.600 --> 0:30:43.640
<v Speaker 2>So you know, that's the.

0:30:43.600 --> 0:30:46.280
<v Speaker 10>Ripple effect of this executive order that I'm really excited

0:30:46.320 --> 0:30:48.000
<v Speaker 10>to see coming in the few months.

0:30:48.320 --> 0:30:51.920
<v Speaker 2>Everynessing Credo, AI CEO, thanks for making time with us

0:30:52.200 --> 0:30:54.400
<v Speaker 2>for of course you're at that White House event. And

0:30:54.440 --> 0:30:56.920
<v Speaker 2>of course one of the things that executive orders discussed

0:30:57.000 --> 0:31:00.120
<v Speaker 2>is well water marking, being able to understand when something

0:31:00.160 --> 0:31:03.040
<v Speaker 2>is fake or indeed created by AI. Well, we're going

0:31:03.080 --> 0:31:04.920
<v Speaker 2>to talk about investing in watermarking when it comes to

0:31:04.920 --> 0:31:07.880
<v Speaker 2>the art world. VC spotlights upnext, Christie's Ventures global head

0:31:07.920 --> 0:31:09.600
<v Speaker 2>Devan Thaka is going to be joining us on its

0:31:09.640 --> 0:31:30.240
<v Speaker 2>portfolio expansion. This is Blombog Technology in today's Ventures Spotlight.

0:31:30.320 --> 0:31:32.720
<v Speaker 2>We're going to sort of fuse art and VC with

0:31:32.840 --> 0:31:35.600
<v Speaker 2>Christie's Ventures of course, held at seventh edition of Art

0:31:35.600 --> 0:31:38.160
<v Speaker 2>and Tech Summit earlier this year, announcing a fair few

0:31:38.200 --> 0:31:42.440
<v Speaker 2>investments Manifold Technologies, Lay Zero Labs for example, Proto Hologram. Today,

0:31:42.640 --> 0:31:45.760
<v Speaker 2>Christie's Ventures is back expanding its portfolio, adding Eco Mark

0:31:45.880 --> 0:31:49.520
<v Speaker 2>and Atomic Form. Global head Divan Thacker joins us. Now,

0:31:49.800 --> 0:31:52.280
<v Speaker 2>I think from rather late in Hong Kong, where you're

0:31:52.320 --> 0:31:56.320
<v Speaker 2>on the road speaking to well companies building things, talk

0:31:56.360 --> 0:31:59.239
<v Speaker 2>to us about some of these investments. What is the

0:31:59.240 --> 0:32:02.400
<v Speaker 2>thesis behind ventures? Where are you backing? It looks as

0:32:02.400 --> 0:32:05.200
<v Speaker 2>though you're backing sort of authenticity in so large part.

0:32:05.240 --> 0:32:06.760
<v Speaker 2>We talk about that with AI at the moment.

0:32:08.360 --> 0:32:11.400
<v Speaker 11>Thank you for having me back, Carol and Ed and

0:32:11.440 --> 0:32:15.000
<v Speaker 11>hello from Hong Kong for us, like we take a

0:32:15.120 --> 0:32:19.720
<v Speaker 11>very principled approach on investing. As we mentioned last time,

0:32:19.760 --> 0:32:22.720
<v Speaker 11>we're early stage investors. We only invest in seed and

0:32:22.760 --> 0:32:26.320
<v Speaker 11>Series A companies, and Echomark for us is one of

0:32:26.320 --> 0:32:29.600
<v Speaker 11>those personally very near and dear to my heart company

0:32:29.640 --> 0:32:34.480
<v Speaker 11>based in Seattle, Washington that is looking to create deterrence

0:32:34.560 --> 0:32:39.040
<v Speaker 11>technology by adding invisible watermarks and AI based watermarks, something

0:32:39.040 --> 0:32:43.360
<v Speaker 11>that you just discussed with your prior panelists into documents.

0:32:42.800 --> 0:32:44.280
<v Speaker 6>To deter people from leaking them.

0:32:44.280 --> 0:32:46.160
<v Speaker 11>Whether it's the Supreme Court league that we saw a

0:32:46.240 --> 0:32:49.800
<v Speaker 11>few few quarters ago, or more recently things we've seen

0:32:49.880 --> 0:32:54.000
<v Speaker 11>from other corporate as well as government branches. Leaks are

0:32:54.040 --> 0:32:57.840
<v Speaker 11>a big problem, and echo Mark is attempting to use

0:32:58.160 --> 0:33:00.640
<v Speaker 11>state of the art technology to solve them, so that

0:33:00.720 --> 0:33:02.880
<v Speaker 11>even if you take a picture with your phone of

0:33:02.960 --> 0:33:05.960
<v Speaker 11>a little corner of a document, we're able to sort

0:33:06.000 --> 0:33:08.960
<v Speaker 11>of detect that and catch who leaked the document. And

0:33:09.080 --> 0:33:13.080
<v Speaker 11>Echomark just raised Series seed in collaboration Craft Ventures and

0:33:13.160 --> 0:33:14.680
<v Speaker 11>Chriss is proud to.

0:33:14.640 --> 0:33:15.520
<v Speaker 6>Be part of that round.

0:33:15.800 --> 0:33:19.120
<v Speaker 11>So for us, we see this technology applying directly to

0:33:19.160 --> 0:33:21.160
<v Speaker 11>our business because we have some of the most sensitive

0:33:21.160 --> 0:33:26.000
<v Speaker 11>client information in our business globally right who has what

0:33:26.280 --> 0:33:28.160
<v Speaker 11>art and who is looking to buy and.

0:33:28.080 --> 0:33:30.280
<v Speaker 6>Sell what art? So for us, this is critical data

0:33:30.280 --> 0:33:31.080
<v Speaker 6>to protect.

0:33:31.560 --> 0:33:34.240
<v Speaker 4>Well den That's what caught my eye and what's interesting

0:33:34.240 --> 0:33:37.520
<v Speaker 4>about echo Mark that Christie's auction House was one of

0:33:37.560 --> 0:33:40.080
<v Speaker 4>the first users of the echo mark technology. It came

0:33:40.120 --> 0:33:43.080
<v Speaker 4>out of stealth like a month ago. Just in very

0:33:43.080 --> 0:33:46.560
<v Speaker 4>simple terms, explain how the auction house uses it with

0:33:46.640 --> 0:33:49.280
<v Speaker 4>its client communications as a case study.

0:33:49.400 --> 0:33:51.000
<v Speaker 6>Yeah, no, absolutely.

0:33:51.040 --> 0:33:54.080
<v Speaker 11>So to take the example of a deal term and

0:33:54.160 --> 0:33:57.000
<v Speaker 11>say you have a piece of art which is iconic

0:33:57.120 --> 0:34:01.240
<v Speaker 11>and very expensive, and it's based in say some part

0:34:01.240 --> 0:34:03.480
<v Speaker 11>of the world, in your home in Hong Kong, for example,

0:34:04.480 --> 0:34:08.920
<v Speaker 11>the terms of that deal often exchanged in PDFs and

0:34:08.960 --> 0:34:12.960
<v Speaker 11>email attachments. Those could accidentally or non accidentally leak to

0:34:13.000 --> 0:34:16.320
<v Speaker 11>the public. Ecomark allows us to create another layer of

0:34:16.360 --> 0:34:19.840
<v Speaker 11>protection so that that document is personalized for the recipient.

0:34:20.080 --> 0:34:22.480
<v Speaker 11>So if you, as a recipient get this document and

0:34:22.600 --> 0:34:27.799
<v Speaker 11>accidentally leak it or maliciously leak it, we can immediately

0:34:27.840 --> 0:34:29.880
<v Speaker 11>know where the source of the leak comes from, so

0:34:29.920 --> 0:34:33.640
<v Speaker 11>that deters people from taking some malicious activity against sensitive data.

0:34:33.719 --> 0:34:36.239
<v Speaker 11>So that's the prototype, or that's the first use case

0:34:36.280 --> 0:34:38.680
<v Speaker 11>that we're working on. But I think the implications of

0:34:38.680 --> 0:34:41.520
<v Speaker 11>this are widespread. We can see that applying to all

0:34:41.560 --> 0:34:45.080
<v Speaker 11>forms of communication, including this call that we're having, could

0:34:45.080 --> 0:34:47.560
<v Speaker 11>also have invisible marks, so that if I took a

0:34:47.600 --> 0:34:50.239
<v Speaker 11>screenshot or a picture from my phone and leaked the

0:34:50.280 --> 0:34:51.520
<v Speaker 11>conversation that we were having.

0:34:51.719 --> 0:34:52.879
<v Speaker 6>I could immediately get caught.

0:34:52.920 --> 0:34:55.960
<v Speaker 11>So the implications of what ecomark is building are deeply

0:34:56.040 --> 0:34:59.759
<v Speaker 11>rooted in sort of better stewardship of documents, and that's

0:34:59.760 --> 0:35:02.080
<v Speaker 11>what we're using it in our business.

0:35:02.400 --> 0:35:05.759
<v Speaker 2>It's interesting that your other investment, atomic Form is still

0:35:05.760 --> 0:35:07.759
<v Speaker 2>a back on web three, is still a back on

0:35:08.120 --> 0:35:10.319
<v Speaker 2>non fungible tokens. Of course, I think back to the

0:35:10.360 --> 0:35:13.080
<v Speaker 2>b pal sixty nine million dollar auction that made sort

0:35:13.080 --> 0:35:16.040
<v Speaker 2>of put NFTs on the map with Christie's Why still

0:35:16.040 --> 0:35:18.520
<v Speaker 2>support this ecosystem when so many people.

0:35:18.280 --> 0:35:20.960
<v Speaker 6>Question, no great question.

0:35:21.280 --> 0:35:24.880
<v Speaker 11>We first met atomic Form very early in the days

0:35:24.920 --> 0:35:29.600
<v Speaker 11>of NFTs as a company that provided beautiful displays for

0:35:30.239 --> 0:35:32.840
<v Speaker 11>these pieces of digital art. I think my belief is

0:35:32.880 --> 0:35:37.359
<v Speaker 11>that in the long run, NFTs other sort of nomenclature,

0:35:37.400 --> 0:35:39.160
<v Speaker 11>whatever you want to call it, in the end, it's

0:35:39.160 --> 0:35:41.840
<v Speaker 11>all digital art, and what we've seen through the progression

0:35:41.840 --> 0:35:44.120
<v Speaker 11>of Christie's three point zero and investments we've made there,

0:35:44.400 --> 0:35:46.840
<v Speaker 11>digital art is here to stay. That's just our belief.

0:35:47.360 --> 0:35:49.000
<v Speaker 6>The bid that interested us.

0:35:49.000 --> 0:35:51.240
<v Speaker 11>In an atomic form is in addition to the hardware

0:35:51.280 --> 0:35:54.440
<v Speaker 11>bit they're also a great software company, which I believe

0:35:54.440 --> 0:35:58.400
<v Speaker 11>in software as a business model, as a scalable business model,

0:35:58.640 --> 0:36:02.400
<v Speaker 11>so traditional introdditional businesses. If you take comics books for example,

0:36:02.440 --> 0:36:04.759
<v Speaker 11>or comic books for example, there's a rating system. Right

0:36:04.760 --> 0:36:07.080
<v Speaker 11>when you go into a comic book store, you can

0:36:07.120 --> 0:36:10.319
<v Speaker 11>see a blue box that says the six star, seventh star.

0:36:10.800 --> 0:36:12.560
<v Speaker 6>No one's doing that for digital assets.

0:36:12.719 --> 0:36:14.680
<v Speaker 11>So tomic Form is one of those companies that's doing

0:36:14.719 --> 0:36:18.400
<v Speaker 11>innovative things with software, whether it's ratings, whether it's applying

0:36:19.160 --> 0:36:21.440
<v Speaker 11>physical activation data back to the blockchain.

0:36:21.480 --> 0:36:22.759
<v Speaker 6>For example, if I loaned.

0:36:22.520 --> 0:36:25.279
<v Speaker 11>You an NFT that happens in a physical world at

0:36:25.320 --> 0:36:28.840
<v Speaker 11>MoMA for example, that doesn't get captured back into the

0:36:28.960 --> 0:36:31.960
<v Speaker 11>NFT itself, this company is sort of adding that metadata

0:36:32.000 --> 0:36:35.120
<v Speaker 11>back to the NFT, really connecting the Web two and

0:36:35.160 --> 0:36:38.840
<v Speaker 11>Web three worlds. And we believe that whether it's Web

0:36:38.840 --> 0:36:41.960
<v Speaker 11>three in its current iteration or Web three with AI augmented,

0:36:42.400 --> 0:36:44.600
<v Speaker 11>we're going to live in a very fast and connected

0:36:44.680 --> 0:36:46.520
<v Speaker 11>universe where companies.

0:36:46.080 --> 0:36:47.759
<v Speaker 6>Like this are going to be very important. Hence the

0:36:47.800 --> 0:36:48.680
<v Speaker 6>support all.

0:36:48.640 --> 0:36:52.000
<v Speaker 4>Right devunk cekr Christy's ventures searching for startups at in

0:36:52.000 --> 0:37:03.000
<v Speaker 4>Hong Kong. Thank you for joining us here. X, the

0:37:03.040 --> 0:37:06.080
<v Speaker 4>platform formerly known as Twitter, is worth less than half

0:37:06.320 --> 0:37:08.080
<v Speaker 4>of what Elon must pay for it just a year

0:37:08.080 --> 0:37:11.000
<v Speaker 4>ago when he bought the company for forty four billion dollars.

0:37:11.080 --> 0:37:14.480
<v Speaker 4>According to a Bloomberg source, restrictive stock units awarded to

0:37:14.480 --> 0:37:18.200
<v Speaker 4>employees value the company at nineteen billion dollars based on

0:37:18.360 --> 0:37:20.719
<v Speaker 4>ursus of forty five dollars apiece joining us here in

0:37:20.800 --> 0:37:23.920
<v Speaker 4>SF Bloomberg's Asia accounts. You and I reported this story together,

0:37:23.960 --> 0:37:26.000
<v Speaker 4>and part of it is a drop off in sales.

0:37:26.320 --> 0:37:28.080
<v Speaker 4>Part of it is the debt burden, and part of

0:37:28.120 --> 0:37:30.680
<v Speaker 4>it is that this is a work in progres shall

0:37:30.680 --> 0:37:31.400
<v Speaker 4>we say.

0:37:31.200 --> 0:37:32.040
<v Speaker 2>It's so many things.

0:37:32.040 --> 0:37:34.080
<v Speaker 12>It's all the things that you just mentioned, right, I mean,

0:37:34.400 --> 0:37:36.480
<v Speaker 12>this is such a steep drop in valuation. Part of

0:37:36.520 --> 0:37:39.080
<v Speaker 12>it is the advertising revenue. In September it was down

0:37:39.160 --> 0:37:42.239
<v Speaker 12>sixty percent. And you think about advertising revenue historically for

0:37:42.600 --> 0:37:45.560
<v Speaker 12>X has been eighty ninety percent of the revenue, so

0:37:45.719 --> 0:37:48.200
<v Speaker 12>that's already huge, as you mentioned. And then you have

0:37:48.239 --> 0:37:50.319
<v Speaker 12>thirteen billion dollars of debts, so now you have to

0:37:50.360 --> 0:37:53.600
<v Speaker 12>pay one point two billion dollars in interest every year.

0:37:53.640 --> 0:37:55.080
<v Speaker 12>So you add all that up and they're in a

0:37:55.080 --> 0:37:57.040
<v Speaker 12>really tough smart financially and so it sort of makes

0:37:57.080 --> 0:37:58.319
<v Speaker 12>sense that the valuation is so well.

0:37:58.400 --> 0:38:00.200
<v Speaker 4>The other thing we reported in the last week or

0:38:00.239 --> 0:38:02.560
<v Speaker 4>so is like what the end result might look like.

0:38:02.640 --> 0:38:05.560
<v Speaker 4>Elon must saying we're going after LinkedIn and we're going

0:38:05.600 --> 0:38:08.360
<v Speaker 4>after YouTube in this all hands of employees.

0:38:08.360 --> 0:38:10.279
<v Speaker 3>What does that tell us about what X might be

0:38:10.360 --> 0:38:11.000
<v Speaker 3>in the future.

0:38:11.520 --> 0:38:14.680
<v Speaker 12>It's that everything ap idea, right that Elon has talked

0:38:14.680 --> 0:38:16.760
<v Speaker 12>about over and over again, But it could be interesting

0:38:16.760 --> 0:38:17.960
<v Speaker 12>if it sort of turns.

0:38:17.760 --> 0:38:18.440
<v Speaker 3>Out that way, right.

0:38:18.800 --> 0:38:20.560
<v Speaker 12>It's the idea of being able to do things like

0:38:20.640 --> 0:38:23.560
<v Speaker 12>areio and video calling. You mentioned LinkedIn, so they have

0:38:23.600 --> 0:38:27.560
<v Speaker 12>a hiring service doing more video aka YouTube and then

0:38:27.600 --> 0:38:29.879
<v Speaker 12>even having a wire service that they're planning the launch

0:38:29.960 --> 0:38:31.960
<v Speaker 12>for it for PR So it could be all those things.

0:38:32.080 --> 0:38:34.279
<v Speaker 4>And the lesson learned of covering test and SpaceX for

0:38:34.280 --> 0:38:37.040
<v Speaker 4>the last six years is don't discount Elon Musk because

0:38:37.360 --> 0:38:41.120
<v Speaker 4>they've been highly successful, but rocky adventures, bliebizhu accounts, thank

0:38:41.160 --> 0:38:42.399
<v Speaker 4>you Carrot, Yeah, and.

0:38:42.360 --> 0:38:45.399
<v Speaker 2>They're betting big maybe on being a payments focus as well.

0:38:45.480 --> 0:38:47.719
<v Speaker 2>Let's go back to the world of fintech. FTX co

0:38:47.800 --> 0:38:50.920
<v Speaker 2>founder Sam amun Fried just finished testifying in his criminal

0:38:50.920 --> 0:38:54.160
<v Speaker 2>fraud trial today, megs Max Chafkin, who was actually in

0:38:54.200 --> 0:38:57.160
<v Speaker 2>the court queuing for hours and the rain, you join

0:38:57.239 --> 0:38:59.840
<v Speaker 2>us for the latest, And I mean he was trying

0:38:59.880 --> 0:39:02.000
<v Speaker 2>to convinced that he didn't know as much as he

0:39:02.040 --> 0:39:02.640
<v Speaker 2>should have known.

0:39:03.080 --> 0:39:06.200
<v Speaker 13>Yes, and this testimony has been going on since Friday.

0:39:06.200 --> 0:39:08.800
<v Speaker 13>We've seen two and a half days of Sam Bankman Freed,

0:39:09.719 --> 0:39:12.640
<v Speaker 13>essentially the defense trying to paint a picture of a

0:39:13.080 --> 0:39:16.720
<v Speaker 13>well meaning but perhaps slightly out of touch executive, someone

0:39:16.920 --> 0:39:21.000
<v Speaker 13>with competence and at least a rough understanding of his responsibilities.

0:39:21.560 --> 0:39:24.759
<v Speaker 13>What we saw from the prosecution was kind of a

0:39:25.080 --> 0:39:31.120
<v Speaker 13>methodical portrayal of Sam Bankman Freed as essentially a professional liar.

0:39:31.239 --> 0:39:37.319
<v Speaker 13>We saw repeated instances or accusations of deception deceit, as

0:39:37.360 --> 0:39:40.560
<v Speaker 13>well as a refusal by the defendant to sort of

0:39:40.600 --> 0:39:42.839
<v Speaker 13>admit to any of it. And as it played out

0:39:42.840 --> 0:39:47.040
<v Speaker 13>in court, particularly yesterday and this morning, it was tough.

0:39:47.760 --> 0:39:51.000
<v Speaker 2>It was tough, perhaps less tough, obviously under friendly fare

0:39:51.040 --> 0:39:54.239
<v Speaker 2>from defense. Then when it came to the prosecutors, did

0:39:54.239 --> 0:39:56.400
<v Speaker 2>he lose his ground somewhat? What was the demeanor of

0:39:56.480 --> 0:39:57.280
<v Speaker 2>him in court?

0:39:57.640 --> 0:40:02.320
<v Speaker 13>His demeanor was extremely subdued, you know, very very voicing,

0:40:02.480 --> 0:40:05.040
<v Speaker 13>smaller than it had And as I was watching this,

0:40:05.160 --> 0:40:08.200
<v Speaker 13>I just kept thinking about the way that this performance

0:40:08.280 --> 0:40:10.480
<v Speaker 13>was playing, you know, during the rise of FTX, when

0:40:10.480 --> 0:40:13.440
<v Speaker 13>we had Crypto soaring and we saw him as this

0:40:13.520 --> 0:40:16.839
<v Speaker 13>kind of genius guy who was part of this like

0:40:16.880 --> 0:40:20.600
<v Speaker 13>story movement. As things have fallen apart, that affect has

0:40:20.640 --> 0:40:23.320
<v Speaker 13>not worked as well, and we've seen somebody who has seemed,

0:40:23.440 --> 0:40:27.160
<v Speaker 13>even even when under questioning from his own lawyers, somewhat

0:40:27.160 --> 0:40:29.719
<v Speaker 13>out of his depth. And then, you know, under fire

0:40:29.760 --> 0:40:32.520
<v Speaker 13>from a very adept federal prosecutor, you know, it only

0:40:32.560 --> 0:40:33.000
<v Speaker 13>got worse.

0:40:34.120 --> 0:40:37.359
<v Speaker 4>So now is this story of psychology and process because

0:40:37.360 --> 0:40:41.920
<v Speaker 4>the government could cool to other witnesses and it's about

0:40:41.960 --> 0:40:42.440
<v Speaker 4>the loss.

0:40:42.400 --> 0:40:45.359
<v Speaker 3>The impression of the jury. What do you reconmac say

0:40:45.440 --> 0:40:47.520
<v Speaker 3>does this go from here? Well, the government has rested

0:40:47.520 --> 0:40:47.919
<v Speaker 3>its case.

0:40:47.960 --> 0:40:51.320
<v Speaker 13>In fact, they were they had talked about a rebuttal case,

0:40:51.800 --> 0:40:54.640
<v Speaker 13>but that is not going to happen. They, it seems,

0:40:54.680 --> 0:40:58.080
<v Speaker 13>feel confident with the case they presented, which, as we've

0:40:58.080 --> 0:41:01.440
<v Speaker 13>talked about on this show before, it's been pretty comprehensive.

0:41:01.440 --> 0:41:06.200
<v Speaker 13>We've seen multiple close friends, former colleagues of Sam magun

0:41:06.200 --> 0:41:11.160
<v Speaker 13>freed testify to financial crimes as well as a not

0:41:11.480 --> 0:41:14.799
<v Speaker 13>especially inspiring performance by the defendant. On the other hand,

0:41:14.840 --> 0:41:18.040
<v Speaker 13>you know, this is a complicated case, seven counts. The

0:41:19.040 --> 0:41:22.080
<v Speaker 13>business FTX was in has a lot of financial nuance,

0:41:22.360 --> 0:41:24.960
<v Speaker 13>so you never know how it's going to play with

0:41:25.000 --> 0:41:26.879
<v Speaker 13>a jury, and we're just gonna have to wait and see.

0:41:27.520 --> 0:41:29.160
<v Speaker 13>I think it's possible the jury iful you get the

0:41:29.200 --> 0:41:32.640
<v Speaker 13>case as early as tomorrow, certainly some point this week.

0:41:33.560 --> 0:41:36.040
<v Speaker 2>We wait, We watched. We thank you for standing out

0:41:36.080 --> 0:41:38.080
<v Speaker 2>in the cold and getting inside that courtroom for us.

0:41:38.080 --> 0:41:41.319
<v Speaker 2>Smacks traffickin and do go see Ruin as well, which

0:41:41.360 --> 0:41:44.480
<v Speaker 2>he's currently in the original's piece on the undoing of FTX.

0:41:44.480 --> 0:41:46.920
<v Speaker 2>But that does it for this edition of BlueBag Technology yet.

0:41:47.640 --> 0:41:49.840
<v Speaker 4>Yeah, thanks to everyone that's been tuning into the podcast.

0:41:49.880 --> 0:41:52.400
<v Speaker 4>We had some pretty deep conversations around AI today, So

0:41:52.480 --> 0:41:56.280
<v Speaker 4>recap the show wherever you get your podcasts, Apple, Spotify, iHeart,

0:41:56.320 --> 0:41:58.360
<v Speaker 4>and of course we published the podcast to all of

0:41:58.360 --> 0:42:01.760
<v Speaker 4>the bloombag platforms as well. Two days in megaweek ahead

0:42:01.960 --> 0:42:03.759
<v Speaker 4>from San Francisco and New York City.

0:42:04.040 --> 0:42:05.400
<v Speaker 3>This is Bloomberg Technology