WEBVTT - 91: Communion On Earth Goodwill To Aliens 0:00:00.160 --> 0:00:04.920 Welcome to Nightcall, a production of My Heart Radio. Hello, 0:00:05.200 --> 0:00:08.560 and welcome to a Nightcall holiday special release of a 0:00:08.600 --> 0:00:12.559 book club episode. Normally, these book Club episodes are reserved 0:00:12.680 --> 0:00:15.480 solely for our patreons, but we're opening it up for 0:00:15.520 --> 0:00:18.000 the holidays to try and convince more of you to 0:00:18.079 --> 0:00:23.440 join our book club Patreon, and also as a little treat. 0:00:23.640 --> 0:00:27.800 This book club episode is Communion by Whitley Striber, a 0:00:28.000 --> 0:00:33.080 very strange sort of holiday tale about an alien abduction 0:00:33.680 --> 0:00:37.240 that may or may not have happened. Please enjoy and 0:00:37.479 --> 0:00:44.159 we will be back with more night Calls in It's 0:00:44.200 --> 0:00:48.680 eleven PM in a cabin in upstate New York and 0:00:48.720 --> 0:01:02.400 you're listening to the Night Call book Club. Hello, and 0:01:02.480 --> 0:01:05.680 welcome back to the Nightcall book Club. My name is Tesline, 0:01:05.720 --> 0:01:08.920 I'm in Los Angeles, and with me I have Molly Lambert, 0:01:08.959 --> 0:01:13.600 name Emily Yoshida. Guys. For this month's book club, we're 0:01:13.640 --> 0:01:17.440 doing Communion and this was probably I thought this was 0:01:17.480 --> 0:01:22.479 our most difficult and dance book to get through. Because 0:01:22.520 --> 0:01:25.480 I show it, I'm excited of that challenge. But yes, 0:01:25.880 --> 0:01:28.480 it was like the first thing that felt like a 0:01:28.600 --> 0:01:34.280 primary source into the paranormal. Yeah, with all the baggage 0:01:34.440 --> 0:01:38.360 that comes with that. Um. But I'll just say up front, 0:01:38.520 --> 0:01:41.280 in the interest of total transparency, I did not finish 0:01:41.319 --> 0:01:43.960 this book this month. I'm very very sorry to all 0:01:44.000 --> 0:01:48.160 of our Patrion subscribers. I will always try to finish 0:01:48.160 --> 0:01:49.280 it from here on out. I was just in the 0:01:49.280 --> 0:01:51.920 middle of moving it. Also, if you don't finish the 0:01:51.920 --> 0:01:54.320 book club book, if life gets in the way and 0:01:54.400 --> 0:01:56.960 you don't finish the book, that's okay, well in this 0:01:57.320 --> 0:01:59.080 in this in the case of this one, it can 0:01:59.120 --> 0:02:03.360 be a book club for like Whitley Striber's personal website 0:02:03.520 --> 0:02:06.800 or media entry or like anything having to do with him. 0:02:06.880 --> 0:02:09.280 I generally hate book clubs actually because as soon as 0:02:09.280 --> 0:02:11.000 I get assigned a book, it's like the last thing 0:02:11.040 --> 0:02:13.000 I want to do. It just takes me to high 0:02:13.000 --> 0:02:15.960 school in that way always. You know, anytime I've ever 0:02:16.000 --> 0:02:19.200 been in a book club before, it's just been like, oh, 0:02:19.240 --> 0:02:21.919 what a big responsibility yourself up to get in trouble 0:02:21.960 --> 0:02:24.600 with your friends. But the book club is I love 0:02:24.639 --> 0:02:27.200 the night call book club because I also, yeah, I 0:02:27.200 --> 0:02:31.720 feel like nobody's judgmental about it's a cool book. Yeah, 0:02:31.880 --> 0:02:33.760 you can read the book however you like. You can 0:02:33.800 --> 0:02:36.400 watch the movie. It's not like that Seinfeld episode. If 0:02:36.440 --> 0:02:38.720 you watched the movie of Communion and that's what you're 0:02:38.760 --> 0:02:41.000 working off of, that's fine too. I really wanted to 0:02:41.000 --> 0:02:43.440 see the movie at and I haven't yet the same. Yeah, 0:02:43.480 --> 0:02:46.720 we should maybe do a bonus up or something because 0:02:46.760 --> 0:02:48.919 I'm so I like because that was the first thing 0:02:48.960 --> 0:02:51.720 when we started reading it. I of course saw, oh 0:02:51.760 --> 0:02:53.880 there was a movie made with Christopher walking In. It 0:02:54.440 --> 0:02:57.320 must check this out and the images from it are incredible. 0:02:57.639 --> 0:03:00.760 Uh So I was very very area and the author 0:03:00.800 --> 0:03:03.240 didn't approve of it. Connect thought Christopher Walkin played him 0:03:03.240 --> 0:03:07.160 as a dick. Yeah, um, let's talk about what what 0:03:07.280 --> 0:03:10.400 communions about? How about you guys? So I let's talking 0:03:10.400 --> 0:03:13.600 about Whitley Striber too. Yeah. Well, Whittie Streiber is kind 0:03:13.600 --> 0:03:17.280 of the most interesting thing about because Communion derailed his 0:03:17.480 --> 0:03:21.320 entire career. So basically Communion they say, but it's like 0:03:21.360 --> 0:03:25.400 it started his career as a ufo ologist guy phthologist. 0:03:25.880 --> 0:03:28.960 He also post. So we should say about Whitley Striber. 0:03:29.400 --> 0:03:31.600 He's an author, He's a horror author. He was supposed 0:03:31.600 --> 0:03:34.359 to be like the next Stephen King. Almost, if not 0:03:34.520 --> 0:03:37.040 every single one of his books has been turned into 0:03:37.160 --> 0:03:41.880 a movie, most of them very high grossing movies. Yeah. Um. 0:03:41.920 --> 0:03:44.600 He wrote The Hunger, which is like turned into a 0:03:44.640 --> 0:03:47.080 movie with was a personal favorite of mine by Tony Scott, 0:03:47.160 --> 0:03:51.240 starting Katherine de Neve and David Bowie. He did The 0:03:51.320 --> 0:03:53.600 Day After the Book. The Day After Tomorrow was based 0:03:53.640 --> 0:03:56.160 on That was recently, and that was recently, and that 0:03:56.800 --> 0:03:59.520 was post his life getting ruined. I'm doing air quotes 0:03:59.600 --> 0:04:04.119 right now by Communion. So he's like done okay for himself, 0:04:05.280 --> 0:04:07.280 and he's made It's almost as if he's made a bargain. 0:04:08.680 --> 0:04:11.760 Part of what he talks about being exiled from is 0:04:11.840 --> 0:04:15.920 that his like super rich New York penthouse friends started 0:04:15.960 --> 0:04:20.800 to think he was too weird to associate with, which 0:04:20.839 --> 0:04:23.880 is well, to be fair, he started associating with a 0:04:23.880 --> 0:04:28.919 lot of upologists and you know, alien fans. Some of 0:04:29.000 --> 0:04:32.000 his friends were really fringy, right but right, But some 0:04:32.080 --> 0:04:34.640 of these people were like taking a plane to secret 0:04:35.279 --> 0:04:39.160 petto Island. So I'm just saying, maybe Whatley Striper chose 0:04:39.200 --> 0:04:43.320 the right stripe of the conspiracy world towards being those 0:04:43.360 --> 0:04:47.680 like secretive petto Island New Yorker conversation. So you could 0:04:47.680 --> 0:04:50.800 be talking about what did he say he like hung 0:04:50.839 --> 0:04:53.800 out with lou Reid and they talked about about UFOs 0:04:53.839 --> 0:04:56.360 with lou Reid like spiracy theories. I don't know, it 0:04:56.440 --> 0:05:01.599 seems pretty chilled me with a striper. It's from Texas. 0:05:01.880 --> 0:05:06.560 He's from San Antonio or near San Antonio originally, and 0:05:06.600 --> 0:05:09.080 then he wrote a bunch of horror novels that got adapted, 0:05:09.200 --> 0:05:14.440 and then Communion he started writing in the eighties. It's 0:05:14.480 --> 0:05:17.240 based on it's based on a bunch of experiences. But 0:05:17.279 --> 0:05:19.640 the primary experiences, the one that started all happened in 0:05:19.839 --> 0:05:25.520 UM late nine October and December nineteen, the day after Christmas, 0:05:25.560 --> 0:05:29.320 after he had finished his Christmas Goose, finished his Christmas 0:05:29.360 --> 0:05:32.920 Goose and working on a hearty novel about the Russian Revolution, 0:05:32.960 --> 0:05:36.040 and he's cross country skiing a lot. Um. Yeah, so 0:05:36.080 --> 0:05:39.400 he had two experiences, I believe in one in October 0:05:39.440 --> 0:05:41.440 and one the day after Christmas are the two that 0:05:41.480 --> 0:05:44.240 he kind of focuses on. Both at this upstate house, 0:05:44.839 --> 0:05:50.520 UM that he's gotten with his Hollywood riches. It's his 0:05:50.600 --> 0:05:54.000 weekend house. UM. But then yeah, over the course, so 0:05:54.040 --> 0:05:57.680 the book was published in seven very soon after these 0:05:57.720 --> 0:06:01.560 events transpired. UM and then over the course of the 0:06:01.600 --> 0:06:05.240 book he kind of goes back into his past via 0:06:05.720 --> 0:06:11.360 regressive hypnosis and discovers that he has had earlier contacts 0:06:11.400 --> 0:06:14.080 with visitors. But also one of the weird things about 0:06:14.120 --> 0:06:18.240 Communion is that it's kind of credited with like establishing 0:06:18.320 --> 0:06:24.920 the gray as the stereotypical alien form. But he Whitley Striver, 0:06:25.080 --> 0:06:28.320 is really clear throughout the book that he has no 0:06:28.480 --> 0:06:33.480 reason to believe that these are extraterrestrials, right, He's kind 0:06:33.480 --> 0:06:36.599 of like, I think maybe, but I have no evidence 0:06:36.680 --> 0:06:39.400 that they when people say that that's what it is, 0:06:39.440 --> 0:06:41.840 because he's like, I never said that, And he said 0:06:42.000 --> 0:06:45.880 it could be just crazy military experiments where they come 0:06:45.960 --> 0:06:48.920 kidnap people in the night and do things on them, 0:06:49.120 --> 0:06:52.279 which is way scarier. Well, there's a interview that was 0:06:52.360 --> 0:06:55.039 earlier this year, so a very recent interview that I 0:06:55.080 --> 0:06:57.239 think test linked to for us UM and will included 0:06:57.279 --> 0:06:59.560 in our notes. He says something, and I think this 0:06:59.640 --> 0:07:01.360 is sort of similar to some some things he said 0:07:01.360 --> 0:07:05.040 in the book where he says, I've also unfortunately had 0:07:05.080 --> 0:07:09.200 an influence on modern UFO folklore. I think it's all folklore. 0:07:09.440 --> 0:07:12.080 It's something that people don't understand and they generate stories 0:07:12.120 --> 0:07:15.160 about it. What I'm interested in is this something that's there? 0:07:15.280 --> 0:07:19.040 What's behind them? Um and so. Yeah, And he talks 0:07:19.080 --> 0:07:21.200 a lot about like he's he goes and does research 0:07:21.200 --> 0:07:24.640 on other people's UFOLK experiences prior to that, kind of 0:07:24.680 --> 0:07:29.800 comparing recurring images and experiences and commonalities and stuff and like, 0:07:30.440 --> 0:07:32.320 and that approach to it is like one of the 0:07:32.320 --> 0:07:35.040 things where I'm like, this feels like a very rational 0:07:35.160 --> 0:07:38.320 way too if you have an experience that feels unexplained 0:07:38.320 --> 0:07:41.080 like this, Like he's going about like he's doing what 0:07:41.120 --> 0:07:44.680 I would do basically. So I feel like all that 0:07:44.800 --> 0:07:46.880 is super interesting because it's not it's not like, oh, 0:07:46.920 --> 0:07:49.160 I've been visited by aliens. It's like I'm having an 0:07:49.160 --> 0:07:51.920 experience that's similar to these other kind of abnormal experiences 0:07:51.920 --> 0:07:54.600 that other people have had. What can we learn from 0:07:54.640 --> 0:07:57.200 the sum total of these experiences? No, I mean, as 0:07:57.200 --> 0:08:00.840 a testimonial, especially from the beginning, it's free really well. 0:08:01.120 --> 0:08:04.800 I mean, obviously he's a horror novelist. It's sort of 0:08:04.800 --> 0:08:08.080 written like a horror novel. It reminded me a lot 0:08:08.160 --> 0:08:10.560 of some of the HP Lovecraft stuff of just like 0:08:11.560 --> 0:08:14.960 was living my life in a weird part of the 0:08:15.040 --> 0:08:18.320 East Coast, and then an inexplicable thing completely out of 0:08:18.360 --> 0:08:21.840 my frame of reference happens that completely horrifies me and 0:08:21.880 --> 0:08:25.480 makes me unable to function in life. Ah After he 0:08:25.560 --> 0:08:29.840 has one of the experiences, he tries to kill his 0:08:29.960 --> 0:08:33.559 son accidentally, sort of, doesn't he like pull a knife 0:08:33.559 --> 0:08:36.959 on his son or something. I don't think. There's a 0:08:36.960 --> 0:08:38.760 part where he's talking about it has like this weird 0:08:38.880 --> 0:08:41.000 encounter with his son, which again we'll get to that later. 0:08:41.160 --> 0:08:47.800 Whether well it's after the it's after the October incident 0:08:48.400 --> 0:08:53.120 where they have friends over and everybody at least shares 0:08:53.120 --> 0:08:56.319 a recollection of like strange lights and a sound a 0:08:56.400 --> 0:09:00.160 blue light and crashing noise, like things clattering down. And 0:09:00.160 --> 0:09:02.120 then he talks to his son about it. And this 0:09:02.200 --> 0:09:04.200 is so like you said, it was like a horror book. 0:09:04.240 --> 0:09:06.640 This this book scared me more than like most other 0:09:06.679 --> 0:09:09.320 books ever have, because there's this part where he goes 0:09:09.400 --> 0:09:12.040 to like ask his son and he's like, yeah, I 0:09:12.080 --> 0:09:14.160 was worried for a second, but then the little doctors 0:09:14.200 --> 0:09:16.000 came and told me like it was all going to 0:09:16.040 --> 0:09:19.679 be okay, And I was just like, it's so like 0:09:19.760 --> 0:09:22.760 the and those those sort of unexplainable things. I mean, 0:09:22.800 --> 0:09:25.000 it really gets into kind of like subconscious stuff. It 0:09:25.000 --> 0:09:27.800 gets into a lot of like like childhood memories and 0:09:27.840 --> 0:09:30.520 the weird foggy you're not really quite sure what was 0:09:30.520 --> 0:09:32.839 a dream and what wasn't that comes out of childhood memories, 0:09:32.880 --> 0:09:35.920 including his own. That stuff is all super super interesting 0:09:35.920 --> 0:09:38.720 to me. Yeah, And actually I think that's the scariest 0:09:39.040 --> 0:09:42.640 part is just this unrelized the the idea that your memories, 0:09:43.240 --> 0:09:45.280 that some of your memories are are what he calls 0:09:45.280 --> 0:09:48.080 screen memories or memories that replace And I mean a 0:09:48.120 --> 0:09:50.480 lot of if you, if you kind of go down 0:09:50.720 --> 0:09:53.600 the web hole from Whitley s Driver to his friend 0:09:53.640 --> 0:09:57.600 Bud Hopkins UM, who's mentioned in the book as for 0:09:57.760 --> 0:10:01.959 the hypnosis he guides the with Dr Klein. But Bud 0:10:01.960 --> 0:10:05.080 Hopkins kind of became famous in his own right because 0:10:05.160 --> 0:10:09.200 he he would observe these hypnosis sessions and then he 0:10:09.280 --> 0:10:13.520 kind of started these like therapy groups for survivors of 0:10:13.760 --> 0:10:17.920 alien abductions. Um. But he had no background in psychology 0:10:18.000 --> 0:10:20.120 and he was kind of playing fast and loose with 0:10:20.200 --> 0:10:23.920 people who were describing like really intense and you know, 0:10:24.000 --> 0:10:28.160 often the experiences were a lot like rape or child abuse. Um. 0:10:28.200 --> 0:10:31.880 And Bud Hopkins was very sure that the alien abductions 0:10:31.920 --> 0:10:35.280 were real and this is like the only answer. And 0:10:35.320 --> 0:10:39.000 so the regressive memories through hypnosis and the screen memories, 0:10:39.679 --> 0:10:42.920 they just obviously as you're reading the book, there's a 0:10:42.920 --> 0:10:46.000 feeling of being you know, the fact that that is 0:10:46.040 --> 0:10:49.240 like a very dangerous kind of thing to do. There's 0:10:49.280 --> 0:10:53.280 something so eighties about it. So that is what I 0:10:53.320 --> 0:10:57.800 remember being the big like panic constantly in the eighties 0:10:58.480 --> 0:11:03.480 was things like that was repressed memories. People doing regressions 0:11:03.520 --> 0:11:06.920 that lead to like recovered memories that aren't real. And 0:11:06.960 --> 0:11:08.840 that was like how they did all the satanic panics 0:11:08.840 --> 0:11:11.520 stuff supposed to be like hey do you remember when 0:11:11.640 --> 0:11:14.280 this crazy thing happened? And kids are like, oh, yeah, yeah, 0:11:14.320 --> 0:11:17.200 I remember that happened. Yeah. I mean, you're still kind 0:11:17.240 --> 0:11:20.719 of getting out of the trend of analysis as as 0:11:20.800 --> 0:11:23.199 your main kind of form of therapy, and that very 0:11:23.240 --> 0:11:26.000 kind of old school still for Freudian way, because screen 0:11:26.040 --> 0:11:29.120 memory is like a freud thing, um and all this 0:11:29.200 --> 0:11:35.040 sort of like psycho sexual such a scary idea, but 0:11:35.160 --> 0:11:40.760 I totally it makes sense though. But again, like in 0:11:40.800 --> 0:11:44.400 that case, a lot of this stuff does feel like 0:11:44.520 --> 0:11:48.360 a you stories, like it has the pattern of it, 0:11:48.480 --> 0:11:51.360 the kind of yeah, the way that the mind shields 0:11:51.400 --> 0:11:56.280 it from from oneself is it feels really um and 0:11:56.320 --> 0:11:59.280 then that makes it even scarier than like that's not 0:11:59.400 --> 0:12:02.200 less scary than you epposed. And I think the tricky 0:12:02.240 --> 0:12:05.680 thing is that Willie Striber has I think the forward 0:12:05.720 --> 0:12:08.120 to this book, which was written much later, but when 0:12:08.120 --> 0:12:11.720 he talks about how depressed he became and how you know, 0:12:11.880 --> 0:12:14.760 he was just so frustrated because he feels as though, 0:12:14.960 --> 0:12:17.360 you know, he's been cleared by neurologists. He doesn't they 0:12:17.360 --> 0:12:20.520 thought maybe at temporal lobe epilepsy or something very clear 0:12:20.559 --> 0:12:25.719 about that. He talks about it a lot, but he's 0:12:25.760 --> 0:12:28.800 just saying, just take me at my word what I'm describing. 0:12:29.040 --> 0:12:32.840 There were physical symptoms in some cases witnesses who who 0:12:32.840 --> 0:12:35.120 were at the cabin, who saw something weird happening. So 0:12:35.160 --> 0:12:37.240 I think he was finding it very upsetting. Like we're 0:12:37.280 --> 0:12:39.559 not obviously the first people to say this is not 0:12:40.000 --> 0:12:43.559 probably what happened. What happened could have been something real. 0:12:44.000 --> 0:12:46.400 All of that stuff, when you're saying it does just 0:12:46.440 --> 0:12:49.520 sound like such abuse stuff, like you're telling everybody what happened, 0:12:49.559 --> 0:12:54.640 but nobody believes you, well, even like the one thing. 0:12:54.720 --> 0:12:57.080 So maybe we should go through and just like talk 0:12:57.120 --> 0:13:03.600 about at least the ive incidents. And because one thing 0:13:03.760 --> 0:13:06.560 that I think happens in the the first one he 0:13:06.600 --> 0:13:10.360 talks about, not the first one chronologically, the day after 0:13:10.440 --> 0:13:14.959 Christmas one is like this recurring thing that also happens 0:13:15.040 --> 0:13:18.680 in the the one on the train when he's a kid, 0:13:18.840 --> 0:13:21.120 is like this feeling of like, oh, and then suddenly 0:13:21.160 --> 0:13:24.440 I was above whatever was going on, Like I was 0:13:24.480 --> 0:13:27.240 seeing everything from a bird's eye view, which is just 0:13:27.760 --> 0:13:31.280 like I'm just like, oh, that's an out of body experience. Yeah, 0:13:31.760 --> 0:13:34.880 like that's what that feels like. Yeah, that stuff all too. 0:13:34.920 --> 0:13:37.480 I was just because somebody who's had like anxiety attacks 0:13:37.480 --> 0:13:40.600 and I was like, oh, yeah, like disassociating because you're 0:13:40.679 --> 0:13:43.400 having something happened that you'd like you have to leave 0:13:43.440 --> 0:13:47.040 your body for him. But the day after Christmas one, yes, 0:13:47.080 --> 0:13:50.840 he had his Christmas goose went crossing. He went cross 0:13:50.880 --> 0:13:54.680 country skiing later afterwards and was like unusually fatigued by it. 0:13:54.760 --> 0:13:57.120 That was like one of his first symptoms that something 0:13:57.200 --> 0:14:01.680 wasn't right. But click interjection. I hate cross country skiing 0:14:01.960 --> 0:14:05.920 so much, and it's such a like weekender thing to 0:14:06.040 --> 0:14:07.920 do at your country home, where I'm just like, you 0:14:07.960 --> 0:14:10.520 take something that's like fun and dangerous, you suck the 0:14:10.520 --> 0:14:13.600 fun out and then you're like take a walk, but 0:14:13.640 --> 0:14:15.839 we're gonna make it hard. Always I fully understood it. 0:14:15.880 --> 0:14:18.160 I always thought it was like a competitive sport where 0:14:18.200 --> 0:14:20.480 you just like ski for a really long time, like 0:14:20.920 --> 0:14:24.320 just I mean, that's what it is. But it's like 0:14:24.360 --> 0:14:28.280 you're walking on ski literally what you're on an order chack. 0:14:28.320 --> 0:14:31.680 You're hiking on ski. It's not snowshoeing some you know. 0:14:31.960 --> 0:14:37.680 I always thought it sounded delightful because like all activity 0:14:37.760 --> 0:14:41.160 so bundled up and having to swish, swish swish, any 0:14:41.160 --> 0:14:43.280 winter activity. I was like, God, that must be the 0:14:43.320 --> 0:14:45.640 most fun thing ever and I'll never get to do it, 0:14:45.720 --> 0:14:49.880 so I'll never know sledding skiing that I did for 0:14:49.960 --> 0:14:52.560 so long because my mom used to live in Minnesota 0:14:52.760 --> 0:14:57.600 and so she had ski still then like downhill skiing 0:14:57.720 --> 0:15:00.160 was too expensive you had to get the real or 0:15:00.200 --> 0:15:02.280 in the lift pass and all that stuff. But like 0:15:02.320 --> 0:15:04.520 we would go to Mount Rainier and go cross country skiing, 0:15:04.560 --> 0:15:06.440 and I hated it when I was little. The biggest, 0:15:06.520 --> 0:15:09.040 biggest fight I ever had with my parents as a 0:15:09.120 --> 0:15:12.200 child was they would beg me to go across country 0:15:12.200 --> 0:15:15.120 skiing with them, and for some reason I just always refused. 0:15:15.120 --> 0:15:18.200 And it was like a two year battle because your 0:15:18.240 --> 0:15:26.760 parents were no anyway, we digressed. I just wanted to 0:15:26.800 --> 0:15:31.280 go on the way tree Wood for the walk off 0:15:31.320 --> 0:15:33.480 some of that Christmas goose. I would be home eating 0:15:33.520 --> 0:15:36.800 my goose and my gams. So it's like he gets 0:15:36.880 --> 0:15:39.560 a little guy comes into his room, a little guy 0:15:39.600 --> 0:15:43.600 wearing like a plate of armor or something, yeah, which 0:15:43.600 --> 0:15:46.520 he thinks is like because they've found his gun and 0:15:46.560 --> 0:15:48.400 they think he's going to shoot him, so they've like 0:15:48.520 --> 0:15:52.480 pre armed themselves or something. Um, and he just like 0:15:52.840 --> 0:15:55.280 suddenly is standing up with his clothes off in his 0:15:55.400 --> 0:16:00.400 room and then is being transported outdoors. He kind of 0:16:00.480 --> 0:16:04.120 it's like he describes a bunch of like witless hands 0:16:04.120 --> 0:16:07.640 with gentle hands like shuttling him out the door, and 0:16:07.680 --> 0:16:12.920 he's like frozen. Yeah, he can't move. Um. It's very dreamlike. 0:16:13.160 --> 0:16:14.720 There's one part where he talks. I don't know if 0:16:14.720 --> 0:16:16.480 it's when he's leaving his room or some other part 0:16:16.480 --> 0:16:18.280 where they're moving him but it's like he talks about 0:16:18.320 --> 0:16:23.000 being like he's like mid stride and frozen and getting 0:16:23.000 --> 0:16:25.520 like shuttled out, like floating out, and I just like 0:16:25.560 --> 0:16:28.920 that just sounds like dreams I've had. It's very it's 0:16:29.000 --> 0:16:32.400 very evocative. It also sounds like sleep paralysis. That's what 0:16:32.520 --> 0:16:34.320 I also is like, this just sounds like you had 0:16:34.360 --> 0:16:38.920 a really vivid nightmare that you had sleeper. But he 0:16:38.960 --> 0:16:43.760 would say that the physically he had been you know, 0:16:43.800 --> 0:16:45.840 it looked as though he had been roughed up. So 0:16:45.920 --> 0:16:49.520 that's his defense against the sleep paralysis argument, is there 0:16:49.560 --> 0:16:52.520 were physical marks. But yeah, so he is he's brought 0:16:52.840 --> 0:16:57.600 to this like clearing in the woods. Yeah, and I 0:16:57.680 --> 0:17:00.720 forget if something happens there, does he get some kind 0:17:00.720 --> 0:17:03.400 of that's where he goes up? He goes up and 0:17:03.440 --> 0:17:06.040 then he's in a ship. Yeah, but he's just like 0:17:07.000 --> 0:17:16.280 he's like, I'm chamber room and he's up and then 0:17:16.320 --> 0:17:19.439 he's brought into the reality of the experience when he 0:17:19.800 --> 0:17:24.520 smells the Yeah, she's like, what can we do to 0:17:24.600 --> 0:17:27.040 get you to stop screen? When it's like a two 0:17:27.080 --> 0:17:30.000 thousand's parenting thing of the like how can we help 0:17:30.000 --> 0:17:32.879 your body? And he's like, let me, let me smell 0:17:32.920 --> 0:17:37.600 your hand, the only normal response. Doesn't it smells like cinnamon? Yeah? 0:17:37.640 --> 0:17:39.600 And he's like, that's how I knew it was real 0:17:40.320 --> 0:17:45.600 because I can smell the cinnamon so strongly. I mean again, like, 0:17:46.080 --> 0:17:48.840 can you remember a smell from a dream? Like I don't. 0:17:48.840 --> 0:17:51.080 I don't think dreams have something I can, but I can. 0:17:51.240 --> 0:17:53.800 I can't remember smelling something in a dream, but I 0:17:53.840 --> 0:18:00.320 can remember like everyone acknowledge ideas. Yeah, yeah, um, that 0:18:00.359 --> 0:18:02.520 part is so compelling to me. You would think he 0:18:02.520 --> 0:18:04.920 would have asked to read something because you can't read 0:18:04.960 --> 0:18:08.119 and dream. That's true. That's like the litmus test that 0:18:08.240 --> 0:18:11.320 supposedly in dreams you can, like you can't look at 0:18:11.359 --> 0:18:15.840 a page of letters. There are no rules and dreams. 0:18:15.920 --> 0:18:18.480 Have you ever read a book in a dream? Probably 0:18:18.880 --> 0:18:21.040 you can. You can be holding a book, and you 0:18:21.080 --> 0:18:24.199 can be understreading. You can be understanding a story, but 0:18:24.240 --> 0:18:26.480 you can't physically read in a dream. I don't have 0:18:26.560 --> 0:18:29.600 dreams anymore because I spoke too much pot. But when 0:18:29.640 --> 0:18:33.480 I stop, I have the type of vivid nightmares such 0:18:33.520 --> 0:18:37.560 as might produce a communion dream. I'm so very clear 0:18:37.600 --> 0:18:40.040 that he doesn't do any drugs, although then He's like, 0:18:40.200 --> 0:18:43.760 he's such a liar about that, talks about in interviews 0:18:43.800 --> 0:18:45.960 he'll talk about like he went to England. He was 0:18:46.000 --> 0:18:48.760 like in and out of Eric Clapton's child, Like, come on, 0:18:48.880 --> 0:19:03.600 many there were zero cocaine. Yeah. I mean again, that's 0:19:03.600 --> 0:19:07.360 another possible explanation. A lot of that stuff causes very 0:19:07.440 --> 0:19:14.960 infect psychological side effects down the road, especially um but 0:19:15.160 --> 0:19:17.360 I don't know. I'm not going to diagnosequally striper. I'm 0:19:17.400 --> 0:19:21.320 just saying other people have tried and failed. Yes, um so, yeah, 0:19:21.400 --> 0:19:24.680 he that was his first experience. He was returned eventually. 0:19:24.760 --> 0:19:31.280 I forget did they sample him and then they did? They? Okay, 0:19:31.280 --> 0:19:34.280 the anal probe and that is where that comes from. 0:19:34.400 --> 0:19:37.080 It's what I've learned. That was like the beginning of 0:19:37.119 --> 0:19:41.159 that being south Park because he says it ruined his 0:19:41.240 --> 0:19:44.359 career because that was the first South Park episode. Was 0:19:44.400 --> 0:19:49.040 I guess entirely about this particular alien abduction book. That's 0:19:49.119 --> 0:19:51.120 so weird. I never know. I think I just thought 0:19:51.119 --> 0:19:54.240 these were even older tropes of alien abduction. But now 0:19:54.320 --> 0:19:56.679 that I think about it, it's very eighties for somebody 0:19:56.720 --> 0:20:01.000 to introduce like and also their sexual assault involved, you know, 0:20:01.119 --> 0:20:03.280 because it does seem like in the fifties and sixties, 0:20:03.280 --> 0:20:05.359 it's sort of just like and then the cow comes 0:20:05.359 --> 0:20:09.640 back down weird. Um. I mean obviously because I was looking, 0:20:09.680 --> 0:20:13.080 I was like, where when did they first start documenting 0:20:13.520 --> 0:20:16.439 UFO sightings? Well, this is what's interesting. So there was 0:20:16.920 --> 0:20:18.679 an I say, it was like actually a back and 0:20:18.760 --> 0:20:21.560 forth between two people on we are the Mutants. It 0:20:21.640 --> 0:20:24.920 was so fascinating to me because they talked about how 0:20:25.400 --> 0:20:27.679 I think it was in this one, Um, how in 0:20:27.720 --> 0:20:31.360 the fifties the the UFO was seen as a largely 0:20:31.480 --> 0:20:34.640 like non intervening kind of thing. It was just sort 0:20:34.680 --> 0:20:38.160 of like an observational thing. Um. But then in the 0:20:38.200 --> 0:20:41.600 eighties this is when there was like this explosion of 0:20:41.680 --> 0:20:45.840 people claiming to have had interactions. And one of the things, um, 0:20:45.880 --> 0:20:47.879 that they say that I think is really interesting is 0:20:47.920 --> 0:20:51.080 just how this is a book that is completely really 0:20:51.160 --> 0:20:55.239 about Striber's fear and the way that he tries to 0:20:55.320 --> 0:20:58.040 protect and arm this cabin in the woods. So he 0:20:58.080 --> 0:21:00.639 has an apartment in New York. He doesn't even really 0:21:00.680 --> 0:21:04.760 talk about his sense of fear there. He talks about 0:21:04.760 --> 0:21:07.119 how in the country he's afraid and he's installed like 0:21:07.200 --> 0:21:11.080 motion sensor lights and has a shotgun. There's a security system. 0:21:11.160 --> 0:21:13.720 So eighties. It is eighties, but it's also it is 0:21:13.800 --> 0:21:16.760 very strange to go from a city where you would 0:21:16.840 --> 0:21:21.440 understand feeling like, especially if you're from like urban Texas. 0:21:21.480 --> 0:21:23.360 But I just thought of that, like he's clearly such 0:21:23.400 --> 0:21:26.080 a paranoid person, and he talks about how, like the 0:21:26.119 --> 0:21:28.159 reason they went to the country was because he was 0:21:28.200 --> 0:21:30.520 having like nervous breakdowns in his apartment in the city 0:21:30.520 --> 0:21:32.359 where he was ready to be a paranoid person to 0:21:32.400 --> 0:21:35.480 have nervous breakdown, right, he was having nervous takedowns, and 0:21:35.680 --> 0:21:40.440 he was having like intruder famas, like like nightmares, specifically 0:21:40.480 --> 0:21:44.080 intruder nightmares and like home invasion nightmares, which I feel 0:21:44.080 --> 0:21:46.159 like we're also just like super stoked by news all 0:21:46.200 --> 0:21:48.240 the time in the eighties. Yes, well, also he had 0:21:48.280 --> 0:21:50.280 this experience. I don't know if he talks about it 0:21:50.280 --> 0:21:52.080 in the book, but he talks about it in the 0:21:52.080 --> 0:21:56.199 medium interview about like his parents left him alone for 0:21:57.200 --> 0:22:00.240 two nights or something when he was eleven. I was, 0:22:00.400 --> 0:22:02.480 I feel like, a totally normal thing back then, but 0:22:02.600 --> 0:22:05.720 it's still so striking that they took the rest at 0:22:06.480 --> 0:22:08.680 they took his siblings and then just left him. And 0:22:08.680 --> 0:22:11.160 they just left him at home, and then he looked 0:22:11.200 --> 0:22:13.560 into a room and there was like the window above 0:22:13.600 --> 0:22:16.080 an air conditioning here and it was open. And he 0:22:16.119 --> 0:22:17.920 called his parents and like, well, if you think of 0:22:18.040 --> 0:22:20.199 someone who's like come in and call the cops. And 0:22:20.240 --> 0:22:23.040 then the cops came, and he said they were really 0:22:23.040 --> 0:22:26.760 freaked out, and then they just left. But I feel 0:22:26.760 --> 0:22:29.880 like that will put like a fear of an intruder. 0:22:29.920 --> 0:22:33.960 I mean I had intruder fears really home alone had 0:22:34.200 --> 0:22:38.400 I had a wicked fear of being home alone. Yeah, 0:22:38.560 --> 0:22:41.399 I think everybody does at a certain point. Also just 0:22:41.440 --> 0:22:45.080 because again like local news especially as always like putting 0:22:45.119 --> 0:22:47.000 that out there. It's like a reason to be afraid 0:22:47.000 --> 0:22:48.920 and to never leave your home. I feel like that 0:22:49.000 --> 0:22:51.480