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Speaker 1: Hey what I'm welcome in. I'm done Godliba and this

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Speaker 1: is all ball. Um uh quick note, we are going

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Speaker 1: to have a summer league recap all ball for you

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Speaker 1: coming up. I have a litany of really good and

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Speaker 1: interesting guests and um, you know, we've we've diverged at

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Speaker 1: some point from always basketball. We had Maurice Clarette. If

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Speaker 1: you missed all three parts of that, it was pretty

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Speaker 1: amazing stuff. This week's all ball. I think you're really

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Speaker 1: gonna like because I love interesting, brilliant people, and I

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Speaker 1: really like people that love the sport that you love.

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Speaker 1: But also sometimes you're not good enough to always play

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Speaker 1: it right, but you can still find an incredible career

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Speaker 1: in it. Ty Tyder Amazar is an amazing story. Right.

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Speaker 1: Son of immigrants. He grew up for the most part

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Speaker 1: in um in Norco, California. He'll tell you what Norco

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Speaker 1: was like forty years ago. But he grew up in

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Speaker 1: like kind of farm country just outside of Los Angeles,

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Speaker 1: really near Chino Hills where the Ball brothers grew up,

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Speaker 1: and became a very good basketball player. But even though

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Speaker 1: he had good grades, wasn't recruited a high level walked

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Speaker 1: on to U C l A got a scholar. Well,

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Speaker 1: I don't want to give away the whole story anyway, Um,

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Speaker 1: how do you become the youngest agent in NBA history?

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Speaker 1: How did he where the relationships come from? What are

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Speaker 1: his thoughts and agents running teams? What's it like to

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Speaker 1: get fired as a representative of a player? All of

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Speaker 1: that stuff is in here, plus some some awesome stories

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Speaker 1: about playing basketball at U c l A. All right,

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Speaker 1: I think you'll like it. By the way, if you

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Speaker 1: like my stuff, you can listen to dug Outlive Show

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Speaker 1: daily three to six Eastern twelve three Pacific on the

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Speaker 1: I Heart Radio app or on Fox Sports Radio dot

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Speaker 1: com or um. You can also download that podcast at

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Speaker 1: your at your discretion. All right, without further ado, here's

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Speaker 1: superstar agent Dodd ramazar Um. When you he became a

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Speaker 1: certified A twenty four years old, which sounds really young,

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Speaker 1: but I mean one of the things that's interesting about

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Speaker 1: your basketball life was you really young when you graduated

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Speaker 1: high school. Let's go back. Okay, so you grew up

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Speaker 1: in Norco. Now, for people who don't know where dorcoes,

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Speaker 1: it's really close to Chino Hills. But again we're talking

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Speaker 1: about Dorko twenty years ago, ago, years ago. Even now

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Speaker 1: you drive into Norco and it says Horse Country US.

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Speaker 1: That right. How does an immigrant family, um from the

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Speaker 1: West Indies, How did you guys make it? Yeah? So

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Speaker 1: I have an older brother, Dougie. He was born in

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Speaker 1: New York. My parents, Um, my parents are from two

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Speaker 1: different countries, Haiti and British Guyana. So they met in

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Speaker 1: New York. My dad was in the telephone company, my

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Speaker 1: mother was in a r N and uh my dad

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Speaker 1: got a transfer requests from the telephone company. So it

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Speaker 1: was either Florida or California. And I just found this

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Speaker 1: out recently from my mom. She had dreams a call Fornia.

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Speaker 1: She had never been so side unseen. She's like, We're

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Speaker 1: going to California. So we ended up in uh. You know,

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Speaker 1: I was born in Fullerton. We ended up you know,

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Speaker 1: I was born in Orange County. He lived in Orange

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Speaker 1: County until probably right before I was two years old,

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Speaker 1: and then we moved to uh. We moved to Norco

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Speaker 1: in nineteen I think nine. So as you mentioned with

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Speaker 1: you being from Testin, doug you know, you know, even

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Speaker 1: Anaheim Hills, that whole corridor area wasn't what it is

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Speaker 1: now or even twenty years ago. This is you know,

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Speaker 1: forty years ago almost. So it was more far you know,

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Speaker 1: farmland cattle, more of a Midwest field than anything else. Yeah.

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Speaker 1: Um so, so your love for basketball because you played

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Speaker 1: football and you're kind of a study at football early

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Speaker 1: on in high school. But was it because your your

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Speaker 1: brother played? Like what what drew you to basketball? Yeah?

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Speaker 1: It was my It was my older brother. You know,

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Speaker 1: I got on the football because of my older cousin.

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Speaker 1: He was eight years older than me. This is back

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Speaker 1: when the Inland Empire didn't have too many high schools.

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Speaker 1: He played in Norco High School, which was was the

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Speaker 1: powerhouse high school Thatton Eisenhower in the Inland Empire before

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Speaker 1: Corona Centennial. So I was always playing with older guys,

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Speaker 1: my older brother, my older cousin in football. But when

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Speaker 1: my brother started playing basketball at the young age, I

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Speaker 1: just fell in love with it. And then, as you know, Doug.

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Speaker 1: For us growing up in southern California, the Lakers were hot.

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Speaker 1: So my idol was Magic. You know, you're you're you're

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Speaker 1: watching you're growing up in southern California. You know, the

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Speaker 1: Lakers were in what the finals, nine out of eleven

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Speaker 1: years or ten years. I mean, it's hard not to

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Speaker 1: love basketball. So that's where my affinity for the game grew.

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Speaker 1: And I would emulate. I would try to emulate magic

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Speaker 1: on the on the court. It is interesting, right that

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Speaker 1: your your first big client with Barrett, who's like, it's

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Speaker 1: just a mini magic, right, like a way more athletic magic.

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Speaker 1: That was that was you, Baron remind did everybody, I've

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Speaker 1: just disability to control a game. And the truth is

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Speaker 1: Baron's not really old enough. I mean, I know he

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Speaker 1: played against him at events Jim, so you know, but

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Speaker 1: not really old enough to have experienced the real magic.

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Speaker 1: There is an interesting kind of full circle to it. Okay, so, um,

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Speaker 1: you're playing high school basketball, but you went to j W.

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Speaker 1: North how fars And for people who don't know j W.

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Speaker 1: North is that's Reggie Miller right, No, no, no, Doug,

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Speaker 1: Reggie went to Riverside Riverside Poly. Sorry. Uh. Quincy Brewer

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Speaker 1: I think was the was right before you. He was

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Speaker 1: like a two three combo score. JDub always had dudes, right,

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Speaker 1: Benjamin what heym ballers right? Like that was in the

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Speaker 1: Empire was producing some dudes back then. Um Keith and

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Speaker 1: Horne was was he wasn't that for his diamond bar? Right? Yeah?

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Speaker 1: I remember you had you had I'll go through a

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Speaker 1: really quick one team. One team had four starters in

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Speaker 1: the Pac ten on it on that j W North

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Speaker 1: teams Quincy board. I went to a s U ed Grave.

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Speaker 1: I ended up at now Sonny Benjamin at Oregon State

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Speaker 1: and then Corey Benjamin as well, and then we were

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Speaker 1: all the generation right after. But they went to UH

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Speaker 1: eight finals, c IF Southern Section Finals in a row. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: Traylon Carmichael was right, Yeah, Sean, what happened to him?

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Speaker 1: He was? He was, I mean, we we have to

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Speaker 1: do where the world because Traylon Carmichael. I remember we

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Speaker 1: went to a B C. D and nineteen four and

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Speaker 1: he was three and he was on the team. We

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Speaker 1: had never heard of this dude and he was like

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Speaker 1: six four. It looks like a football player. He was asked.

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Speaker 1: He was billed deep dun dud the guy was, I

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Speaker 1: swear the guy was jumping off with two feet from

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Speaker 1: free throw line in games. It seems like uh and

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Speaker 1: him and Corey were him Coorey and and Jamal Slaughter

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Speaker 1: were team It's at Fontana after Corey transferred from North

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Speaker 1: but Talented team. Yeah, it was pretty legit back then.

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Speaker 1: Um okay, so so um what education? I was a

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Speaker 1: huge inner in your household? Now is that did your

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Speaker 1: parents come home and and you know make you do work? Like?

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Speaker 1: How was Why was education so such an important part

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Speaker 1: of your upgrade? I think, you know, I would say

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Speaker 1: this is probably the immigrant mentality overall. It's like, you know,

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Speaker 1: everyone I think that tends to immigrate to the US

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Speaker 1: is for a better way of life, not just for

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Speaker 1: themselves but for their kids. And so like you know,

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Speaker 1: like a lot of immigrant families is, hey, you're gonna

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Speaker 1: be a doctor or a lawyer. So you know, my

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Speaker 1: brothers or maybe or maybe if you're if you like

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Speaker 1: this Jewish families, doctor lawyer and if you get you

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Speaker 1: got nothing going for your account, give me to count

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Speaker 1: right exactly and and maybe that change are evolved. Now

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Speaker 1: I got I got some Indian buddies or they're like, yeah, Todd,

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Speaker 1: it was a doctor, attorney or engineer, and now it's

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Speaker 1: like okay, entertainment, entertainment, executive other things. But for us,

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Speaker 1: is that's that's the route we took. My brother's owns,

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Speaker 1: his own practice. He's a chiropractor. Technically, I guess you

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Speaker 1: could say a doctor. He went that route. I know, right,

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Speaker 1: I'm trying to him. Here's here's the here's the here's

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Speaker 1: the thing with Rotor Okay, is not a doctor. Doctor

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Speaker 1: is somebody gets sick on a plane. Okay, So as

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Speaker 1: somebody gets sick on a plane and he says, there

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Speaker 1: a doctor here, like chiropractors, Like, yeah, I got you right.

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Speaker 1: On the other hand, on the other hand, let's be

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Speaker 1: honest in terms of daily health and usefulness. Oh, when

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Speaker 1: you get a rib out or you're not right, there's

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Speaker 1: nobody in the world you'd rather have than a chiropractor,

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Speaker 1: like on your on yourself beauty of having a chiropractor

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Speaker 1: in the family. You wake up with the stiff knacker

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Speaker 1: has been a long road trip, ten minutes away, I

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Speaker 1: go see him, okay. And then for me, it was

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Speaker 1: you know, I went to I ended up leaving law

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Speaker 1: school when I went to I went to law school.

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Speaker 1: That was it was kind of you know, for me,

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Speaker 1: that was the path I was going to pursue, but

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Speaker 1: not used my law degree to be say just a

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Speaker 1: traditional uh lawyer from the sense of you know, corporate

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Speaker 1: law or something like that. It was always in pursuing

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Speaker 1: sports as an agent. So, um, take me through the

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Speaker 1: decision to go to u c l A. What was

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Speaker 1: what was it like? This is still Herrick right. They

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Speaker 1: were they were rolling. I mean I would me, I'm

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Speaker 1: the year before and and I turned them down and

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Speaker 1: they take Brandon oh Man, what's the kid's name? He

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Speaker 1: was from Oklahoma? You know, uh Man, Brandon? What's the

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Speaker 1: news thing? He was a sophomore when you're a freshman.

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Speaker 1: We had Far, we had Far, we had Farnham, we

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Speaker 1: had back would from so so they so Stephon Marbury

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Speaker 1: was the guy everybody wanted, and I was like the

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Speaker 1: fallback guy. And my sister was a cheerlier there. A

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Speaker 1: brother went there, and then I turned down. I go

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Speaker 1: to Notre Dame and then they win the national championship.

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Speaker 1: I'm sitting there like, are you kidding me? Right? Like

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Speaker 1: I love U c l A Basketball, they win the

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Speaker 1: national championship? What what went into your decision to go there?

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Speaker 1: I mean it was just that Like for me, it

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Speaker 1: was a dream. If you for me growing up playing

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Speaker 1: football and basketball. If I was playing football, I was

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Speaker 1: going to USC You know, that's just what it is.

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Speaker 1: And uh, for basketball, my dream since I was playing

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Speaker 1: that growing up, it was to go to U C.

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Speaker 1: L A. And then so because I satisfied both things.

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Speaker 1: It was always athletics, academics. Both schools are great, right,

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Speaker 1: I'm proud to be a Brewing and it was it

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Speaker 1: was it was a natural choice for me. But you know,

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Speaker 1: I I checked into school Duck so young. I was seventeen.

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Speaker 1: I was a late wimmer, the top one hundred. I

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Speaker 1: ended up king on because I got turned down some

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Speaker 1: other schools. Like that was my dream. Plus I was competitive.

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Speaker 1: I thought I could, Uh, I could walk on and

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Speaker 1: earned a scholarship, which I did, And I just wanted

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Speaker 1: to be part of the special class with you know

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Speaker 1: that class out of Southern California. I think we could

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Speaker 1: argue might have been one of the most talented classes

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Speaker 1: in Southern California, right, Chris Burgess, Baron Davis. Uh, you

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Speaker 1: know Shaye Cotton, Kenny Bruner, um, the Collins Twins. I

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Speaker 1: mean you don't like look you go back to I

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Speaker 1: think it's there was a class with Tracy Murray, Don

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Speaker 1: McLean Um. Uh, I think that was Sean Mills. What

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Speaker 1: was in that class? As well, Um, who else was

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Speaker 1: who else was in that? Chris Mills, I mean Chris Mills,

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Speaker 1: Chris Mills, Derek Martin, like they were all like staying class.

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Speaker 1: That was I think Adam keep was that class together,

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Speaker 1: a crazy class. Then my junior year, which is I

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Speaker 1: actually I was a late little or so I stayed

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Speaker 1: back in eighth grade. So you're seven team in you

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Speaker 1: graduated high post nine team when I graduate high school.

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Speaker 1: But but ninety four had a couple of your teammates

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Speaker 1: Chris Johnson, Jared Henderson, right, Toby Toby Bailey, um had

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Speaker 1: Miles Simon and had uh god you go through it

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Speaker 1: was that was awesome. My teammate Cameron Murray h Tracy's brother,

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Speaker 1: Tracy's brother as well. Like there's there's been some really

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Speaker 1: really so okay, So when you first get there as

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Speaker 1: a walk on, but you're like a recruited walk on,

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Speaker 1: you're not like a dude. And my brother went there

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Speaker 1: to walk on. Herrick helped him get in and then um,

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Speaker 1: uh Lou Lou Roe beat Lulu Uh what's his name?

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Speaker 1: He He end up transferring to Clemson and playing and

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Speaker 1: now he's coach at Northern California yeah, well and like

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Speaker 1: nobody knew he was showed up and kicked his ass

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Speaker 1: to tryouts and Greg was like, I didn't make a team,

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Speaker 1: so it was better than me. And he goes on

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Speaker 1: and starts at Clemson. So so when did Herrick give

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Speaker 1: you a scholarship? So Herrick got fired? So my freshman

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Speaker 1: year laugh, that was Lab. We were LABS first recruiting class, right,

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Speaker 1: so we were all recruited by Romar Herrick laugh. And

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Speaker 1: then then that that was junior year. By senior year

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Speaker 1: and the time we were checking in is when all

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Speaker 1: that all that happened and Herrick was no longer there.

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Speaker 1: Romar had left and laughed as head coach. So we

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Speaker 1: were They componed Eric, they componed him, they got him,

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Speaker 1: They got a expense receipts. Come on, man, they go

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Speaker 1: anywhere else in the country. That that that's a flyer,

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Speaker 1: Like that's that's a that's a give come on, come on. Okay,

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Speaker 1: So so you're you're a freshman, what do you remember

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Speaker 1: about how it went down? So for people who don't

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Speaker 1: have forgotten, Okay, when they signed Barron, they did some

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Speaker 1: I mean frankly, some crazy stupid ship right like his

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Speaker 1: his sister worked in the bast Ball office and Herrick's

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Speaker 1: son sold him as like Chevy Blazer, I like, I

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Speaker 1: don't even and and it was front page of the

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Speaker 1: l A Times and really was a bunch of other

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Speaker 1: little stuff. And then they like found the expense report

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Speaker 1: Steele and they But what was it like for you?

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Speaker 1: Like here you are seventeen year old kid from Riverside,

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Speaker 1: walk On trying to make it and all the stuff

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Speaker 1: goes down, there's a coaching change. What do you remember

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Speaker 1: about that time? Lab was my lead recruiter. So it

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Speaker 1: wasn't I didn't get caught up, to be honest in

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Speaker 1: any of it. It was just Lab. Still. You know,

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Speaker 1: Harry got fired Lab coach the year prior in which

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Speaker 1: they went to the lead eight. I want to say,

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Speaker 1: Johnny went down with an injury to a stern. Hum,

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Speaker 1: there's another one. McCoy. He was nice, yeah, yeah, So

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Speaker 1: you know, coming in it's like their freend, you know

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Speaker 1: for us as a fresh off the championship. In some

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Speaker 1: ways in Nive they made the run the year before.

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Speaker 1: We're coming in with the number one recruiting class, you know,

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Speaker 1: Shae Cotton Baron, Earl Wattson, Rico Hins Moose had just transferred.

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Speaker 1: You know, I'm walking on and I'm I'm seven, you know,

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Speaker 1: ranked seventy five in the country, and you know, Billy Night,

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Speaker 1: Travis Reid, we were loaded. So there was nothing but excitement.

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Speaker 1: I wasn't even thinking about that. And then, as you know, Doug,

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Speaker 1: you going into the men's gym, playing against Magic and

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Speaker 1: uh and doing the summer program. It was a dream

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Speaker 1: come true. I didn't think twice about it. Fox Sports

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Speaker 1: Radio has the best sports talk lineup in the nation.

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Speaker 1: Catch all of our shows at Fox Sports Radio dot

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Speaker 1: com and within the I Heart Radio app search f

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Speaker 1: s R to listen live. So you get there, Um

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Speaker 1: when did when did lad give you I'm going into

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Speaker 1: my sophomore year. What was that conversation like with your parents? Um? Oh,

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Speaker 1: they were a static they you know, because I really

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Speaker 1: put in a lot of work between my freshman and

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Speaker 1: sophomore year, and you know, freshman year is an adjustment,

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Speaker 1: you know, as you said, you know, coming in a seventeen.

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Speaker 1: You know, the seniors were all the guys that won

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Speaker 1: the championship as freshman, Toby j R. Chris Johnson and

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Speaker 1: of course Julie McCoy was there, and Brandon Lloyd, and

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Speaker 1: then you got all these guys coming from all over

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Speaker 1: the country, Rico's coming from hard Grave and St. John's

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Speaker 1: prospect called Barons there Earl, you know, so it was

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Speaker 1: a diverse competitive group. I think we walked away bloodied

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Speaker 1: every day in practice. So for me, it was great.

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Speaker 1: You know, I can't say I was surprised because that

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Speaker 1: was a goal, but it was great to at least

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Speaker 1: take that burden and and hit that accomplishment of earning

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Speaker 1: that scholarship at u c l A. Okay, here's one

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Speaker 1: of the things that I always found to be interested,

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Speaker 1: So that the national champion team had like eleven dudes

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Speaker 1: that played me. It was like something crazy terms of

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Speaker 1: number of dudes that played the NBA, right, like everybody

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Speaker 1: I mean, and honestly, Chris Johnson didn't play. But if

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Speaker 1: Chris Johnson was now like guys are stretching guys a

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Speaker 1: small ball four or five, unbelieving some perfect, perfect guy, right,

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Speaker 1: So unbelievable talented team wins the national chance if you

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Speaker 1: got I just had, dude. But and if you would

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Speaker 1: have walked in that locker room and asked how many

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Speaker 1: you guys are going to the NBA. Everybody would have

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Speaker 1: raised their hands, right, everyone wended in your mind, you

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Speaker 1: think like, hey, agent, it was probably my my, It

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Speaker 1: was probably my I would say going into my sophomore year. Actually,

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Speaker 1: you know, I take that back. If I had to revisit,

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Speaker 1: it's probably my sophomore year I ended up starting. But

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Speaker 1: you know, we we have the number one recruiting class

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Speaker 1: coming in night, followed by another number one recruiting class,

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Speaker 1: Matt Barnes, Geron Rush, Ray Young, Dan Gazer, Restore Moiso.

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Speaker 1: I mean they were loaded, dude. Yeah, So coming in,

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Speaker 1: putting in all that work, starting for a game or two,

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Speaker 1: and then not seeing the court until the end of

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Speaker 1: my sophomore year in like sporadic minutes, it was like, no,

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Speaker 1: that was a reality check. You know. I thought about

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Speaker 1: transferring and everything, but I was like, you know what,

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Speaker 1: why am I trans for? Yeah, I could play, but

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Speaker 1: getting this degree from u C l A. I know

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Speaker 1: I'm gonna be in southern California, and I knew I

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Speaker 1: wanted to go to grad school. So at the end

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Speaker 1: of that sophomore years, when I started working for arm

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Speaker 1: telling bearing him left Gon Pro, all the U C.

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Speaker 1: L A guys were assigning with Arn at the time,

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Speaker 1: which was telling the associates, and then that was my

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Speaker 1: segue into the business. At nineteen, I got so many things, gosh,

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Speaker 1: and just so much stuff. Okay, I would make that.

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Speaker 1: I'd make the case Barn towards a c L on

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Speaker 1: a filthy crossover dunks on the dude um in in

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Speaker 1: the n c A tournament. Um, I know we were

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Speaker 1: in the same region. I saw it. I think we're

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Speaker 1: in saving I saw it happen and um, which but

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Speaker 1: do you that was still there. I've never seen somebody

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Speaker 1: tear their a c L on a more nasty play

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Speaker 1: than that. That was. I tell people all the time

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Speaker 1: that was when he was when he landed, or when

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Speaker 1: he jumped. He jumped so high, Doug and I was

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Speaker 1: looking down the court. He jumped so high his head

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Speaker 1: was the rim eye level. He pulled himself up with

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Speaker 1: his momentum. I don't think Baron knew how high he was.

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Speaker 1: So it was on the landing. He put all that weight,

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Speaker 1: all his weight on one one leg when he landed,

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Speaker 1: and that's what made it pops. It's interesting he doesn't

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Speaker 1: like me. I still don't know why. We haven't ever

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Speaker 1: had wept chopping up at some point in time. It's

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Speaker 1: interesting because my because my my dad was like when

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Speaker 1: I because that the year before he when he was

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Speaker 1: a senior, I was sitting out after transfer from Notre Dame,

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Speaker 1: and they basically like, look we get Baron, We're gonna

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Speaker 1: take Baron and if not, and I was like people's

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Speaker 1: second choice, Georgia Tech's second choice, Kansas. I was somewhere

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Speaker 1: down the line or whatever anyway, but my dad was like, look,

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Speaker 1: that's the best high school point guard I've ever seen.

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Speaker 1: He used to Gilanni Gardner used to be the guy

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Speaker 1: that he thought was the next Man Johnson. And then

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Speaker 1: he was like, Baron's the best I've ever seen. Um,

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Speaker 1: he still had a very very good career, very good career.

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Speaker 1: What would he have been like had he not Doug.

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Speaker 1: I think baroness was such if you really revisit that,

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Speaker 1: you know, and that's our generation when he when he

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Speaker 1: tore it, that was still at a time when the

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Speaker 1: A c L surgery, like the procedure it could go

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Speaker 1: either way like it was. It wasn't like now we're

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Speaker 1: you come back stronger. So we were right there where

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Speaker 1: like you know Baron tears it in March. He was

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Speaker 1: back playing by the end of that same year. That's

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Speaker 1: the type of freaky was a lot of people don't

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Speaker 1: know this. Kobe would come to our practices the following year,

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Speaker 1: Baron wasn't clear to play. Him and Kobe are playing

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Speaker 1: one on one on the sideline and Baron's wearing this

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Speaker 1: huge knee brace. So I don't honestly if he if

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Speaker 1: he doesn't tear it, I think he's still the same player.

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Speaker 1: Maybe maybe he's the number one player because maybe we

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Speaker 1: continue going on in in March. But that sophomore year,

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Speaker 1: he comes back and he's healthy, you know, and he

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Speaker 1: was a highlight reel. It still goes number three. Well

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Speaker 1: what I so if you remember his first game back

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Speaker 1: to play against US, I got thrown out of the

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Speaker 1: game and halftime whatever. He flopped into a technical foul.

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Speaker 1: But he wasn't he wasn't moving right yet you're still

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Speaker 1: heavy and he had that brace. And that that month

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Speaker 1: was December, right, that was November. That was December. Yeah. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: if you think about that, that's only eight months after

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Speaker 1: the injury. Yeah, nine months. Yeah, that's crazy even in

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Speaker 1: today's standards. I'm Thomas Bryant had towards a c L

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Speaker 1: and you know it's eleven to twelve months until they're

391
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Speaker 1: you know, he's fully back, is what they're protecting. Don't

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Speaker 1: tell me that I tore mine like two months ago.

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Speaker 1: I just got my surgery two weeks ago. But I'm

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Speaker 1: too old to make it. I'm too old to make

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Speaker 1: a real cup. But my goal is my goal is

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Speaker 1: to play basketball and tennis next summer. That's my personal

397
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Speaker 1: personal Okay. So so you're in your mind, you're like,

398
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Speaker 1: I mean between Arntell him and I don't know how

399
00:22:02,840 --> 00:22:05,960
Speaker 1: Big Wasserman was at that time as well, Like you're

400
00:22:06,000 --> 00:22:10,879
Speaker 1: in l A u c A basketball super hot. Um,

401
00:22:10,920 --> 00:22:15,680
Speaker 1: you would you start interning during Here's a here's a sorry,

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00:22:15,680 --> 00:22:21,240
Speaker 1: here's a question. Why do you think, um, why do

403
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Speaker 1: you think more guys don't have the mentality or the

404
00:22:26,440 --> 00:22:32,760
Speaker 1: understanding or maybe the value of that degree. I understand

405
00:22:32,840 --> 00:22:36,080
Speaker 1: and respect that the best, the best, You're gonna make

406
00:22:36,119 --> 00:22:38,320
Speaker 1: so much money. I for you an NBA player, But

407
00:22:38,480 --> 00:22:41,439
Speaker 1: I just guys bounce around schools now and it's like

408
00:22:41,640 --> 00:22:44,080
Speaker 1: there's there's a couple of parts to it. There's one,

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00:22:44,080 --> 00:22:47,240
Speaker 1: there's the degree, but there's two. There's the connection you

410
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Speaker 1: make with the university and you don't. You don't get

411
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Speaker 1: that as a as a grad transfer. And the place

412
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Speaker 1: you leave you're not really in a lumba, and the

413
00:22:57,600 --> 00:23:00,560
Speaker 1: place you go to you're not real you in a lumba.

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Speaker 1: Like look, dude, you're there for six seven months like that?

415
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Speaker 1: Ain't that? Ain't your school? You know? So? I mean

416
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Speaker 1: I was lucky, like o Globa States my school. I

417
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Speaker 1: went to Notre Dame. I love Notre Dame. I would

418
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Speaker 1: love to have And the reason the reason I went

419
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Speaker 1: there is the connection to the subway a lumps I thought,

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Speaker 1: I'd love to play. If I can't play, I'd love

421
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Speaker 1: to broadcast or coach all of it is, or be

422
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Speaker 1: in business and all that. Notre Dame's unbelievable connection of

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Speaker 1: a lumps um. But but I don't I don't really

424
00:23:27,240 --> 00:23:32,800
Speaker 1: understand why so many, so many, even even professional athletes,

425
00:23:33,200 --> 00:23:36,399
Speaker 1: don't tell kids like, hey, look at Todd's path and

426
00:23:36,480 --> 00:23:40,240
Speaker 1: Todd's understanding of it that maybe not even being an agent,

427
00:23:40,280 --> 00:23:42,760
Speaker 1: but just using the value of that degree and the

428
00:23:42,800 --> 00:23:46,359
Speaker 1: connections at a university in order to propel you for

429
00:23:46,400 --> 00:23:50,280
Speaker 1: the rest of your life. So this is purely a theory, right,

430
00:23:50,440 --> 00:23:57,880
Speaker 1: because well hypotheses then, right, um is different from our

431
00:23:57,920 --> 00:24:02,439
Speaker 1: generation because we're getting older. We're gonna be old timers

432
00:24:02,480 --> 00:24:06,480
Speaker 1: here pretty soon. Right. But think the mentality of us

433
00:24:06,560 --> 00:24:09,359
Speaker 1: playing it was pure and not saying it's not pure

434
00:24:09,400 --> 00:24:12,159
Speaker 1: for all the guys now. But it was sports. It

435
00:24:12,240 --> 00:24:17,120
Speaker 1: wasn't entertainment. Now it's much more synonymous with entertainment. So

436
00:24:17,480 --> 00:24:21,800
Speaker 1: I'm not I'm not an entertainment agent or represent any

437
00:24:21,920 --> 00:24:25,920
Speaker 1: actors or actresses or or even musicians for that matter.

438
00:24:25,960 --> 00:24:28,400
Speaker 1: But what I can imagine is how many of them

439
00:24:28,600 --> 00:24:32,440
Speaker 1: went to college as well before they started acting. And

440
00:24:32,480 --> 00:24:36,119
Speaker 1: my point being is, like athletes now, their goal is

441
00:24:36,160 --> 00:24:38,919
Speaker 1: to become a pro. So the quickest path to becoming

442
00:24:38,960 --> 00:24:43,080
Speaker 1: a pro it's not having that relationship with the university

443
00:24:43,240 --> 00:24:46,600
Speaker 1: or going there for four It's just different, in my opinion,

444
00:24:46,640 --> 00:24:49,000
Speaker 1: a different way of thinking than how we thought. Because

445
00:24:49,440 --> 00:24:52,600
Speaker 1: you weren't a one and done back then, to two

446
00:24:52,680 --> 00:24:56,159
Speaker 1: and done. That was that was quick steph Baron, you

447
00:24:56,160 --> 00:24:59,040
Speaker 1: know you usually went three or four years, right, even

448
00:24:59,080 --> 00:25:02,560
Speaker 1: Michael Jordan three, you know, magic Bird, like all these

449
00:25:02,560 --> 00:25:05,360
Speaker 1: guys that were even before us, It wasn't the one

450
00:25:05,359 --> 00:25:09,119
Speaker 1: and done or even now having um, you know, the

451
00:25:09,200 --> 00:25:13,280
Speaker 1: G League Ignite program or overtime like that wasn't there.

452
00:25:14,040 --> 00:25:20,560
Speaker 1: I understand that everyone's story is different, right, totally respect that, okay.

453
00:25:20,680 --> 00:25:24,720
Speaker 1: And so when you say is it the right mentality

454
00:25:24,800 --> 00:25:28,160
Speaker 1: the wrong mentality, You're gonna get people that would say, well,

455
00:25:28,240 --> 00:25:30,000
Speaker 1: like you haven't grown up my shoes, you don't know

456
00:25:30,359 --> 00:25:33,840
Speaker 1: kids could go and play. I respect that, okay, But

457
00:25:34,160 --> 00:25:37,840
Speaker 1: isn't that the wrong aren't we? Is it the wrong mentality? Like,

458
00:25:38,480 --> 00:25:42,639
Speaker 1: the truth is that this is this is my honest belief, okay,

459
00:25:42,680 --> 00:25:45,480
Speaker 1: that the like our education system at the high school

460
00:25:45,480 --> 00:25:48,000
Speaker 1: and lower levels still stay. There's still a great education

461
00:25:48,080 --> 00:25:51,119
Speaker 1: disparity based upon where you where you grow up, and

462
00:25:51,160 --> 00:25:57,119
Speaker 1: what you put your background. And the equalizer is the scholarship.

463
00:25:57,240 --> 00:25:59,320
Speaker 1: That's the whole intent of the whole the equalizer. It

464
00:25:59,359 --> 00:26:01,640
Speaker 1: puts you on even footing where you were not even

465
00:26:01,640 --> 00:26:03,959
Speaker 1: footing when you came up with your education in high school.

466
00:26:04,400 --> 00:26:08,480
Speaker 1: And I guess I don't there's there's there's just too

467
00:26:08,480 --> 00:26:14,800
Speaker 1: many bad actors in my opinion in basketball that it's

468
00:26:14,840 --> 00:26:16,760
Speaker 1: not that they want the kid to achieve, they want

469
00:26:16,760 --> 00:26:18,200
Speaker 1: a little piece of that. They want a little piece

470
00:26:18,200 --> 00:26:21,440
Speaker 1: of the action, you know. But but but I think

471
00:26:21,600 --> 00:26:24,960
Speaker 1: that's I just think I understand that's the new mentality.

472
00:26:25,800 --> 00:26:27,800
Speaker 1: I think it's the wrong mentality. I think it's the

473
00:26:28,440 --> 00:26:31,480
Speaker 1: anything really good is worth waiting for, working for. I

474
00:26:32,000 --> 00:26:35,040
Speaker 1: know there's exceptions. I know there's guys that don't need

475
00:26:35,080 --> 00:26:37,640
Speaker 1: four years of college, that don't need three years of college.

476
00:26:38,200 --> 00:26:41,119
Speaker 1: But what you think you don't need is the college basketball,

477
00:26:41,280 --> 00:26:45,240
Speaker 1: which you do need is everything else, and and and

478
00:26:45,280 --> 00:26:48,240
Speaker 1: I just I think all of us soon to be

479
00:26:48,320 --> 00:26:51,160
Speaker 1: old timers, we get to like, well, it's the new generation.

480
00:26:51,280 --> 00:26:53,760
Speaker 1: You just gotta accept, do you or can you try

481
00:26:53,760 --> 00:26:55,560
Speaker 1: and find a way to gather enough of us to

482
00:26:55,640 --> 00:26:57,880
Speaker 1: go like, look, I get it, there's gonna be jail

483
00:26:57,920 --> 00:27:01,800
Speaker 1: and greens. There's gonna be Kate cutting. Those guys are freaks, okay,

484
00:27:01,960 --> 00:27:04,399
Speaker 1: But for the rest of everybody else, this is what

485
00:27:04,480 --> 00:27:06,200
Speaker 1: you need. This is the best thing for your rest

486
00:27:06,200 --> 00:27:09,040
Speaker 1: of your life. And that that mentality is a bad one,

487
00:27:09,359 --> 00:27:11,760
Speaker 1: you know what, Doug, It's all based on circumstance. Like

488
00:27:11,960 --> 00:27:14,560
Speaker 1: we could like Kobe didn't go to college, right, and

489
00:27:14,600 --> 00:27:17,080
Speaker 1: God rest his soul, But like if you if he's

490
00:27:17,520 --> 00:27:20,720
Speaker 1: assuming Kobe continues on the path this guy guy that

491
00:27:20,760 --> 00:27:23,920
Speaker 1: didn't step foot on college and had very successful right,

492
00:27:24,160 --> 00:27:27,960
Speaker 1: and it's a brilliant start individual. But I tell you this,

493
00:27:28,080 --> 00:27:30,320
Speaker 1: like even when I stepped foot on campus with my

494
00:27:30,359 --> 00:27:35,520
Speaker 1: background um in education being a priority, it was intimidating.

495
00:27:35,760 --> 00:27:38,240
Speaker 1: I'll be honest with you. Like the pro the summer

496
00:27:38,280 --> 00:27:41,840
Speaker 1: program where you're having to produce papers and if you

497
00:27:41,880 --> 00:27:43,680
Speaker 1: know you could have guys that go through high school

498
00:27:43,680 --> 00:27:45,760
Speaker 1: want to go to college, It's like, hold on, Like,

499
00:27:46,119 --> 00:27:49,080
Speaker 1: I don't know if I could balance both, And you know,

500
00:27:49,160 --> 00:27:53,119
Speaker 1: it depends on the program where if you're working, you know,

501
00:27:53,200 --> 00:27:56,360
Speaker 1: practicing three hours and you know lab had is practicing

502
00:27:56,400 --> 00:27:58,359
Speaker 1: three hours a day, then it's an hour of waits,

503
00:27:58,680 --> 00:28:01,160
Speaker 1: then you're getting pt, then you need to get extra

504
00:28:01,200 --> 00:28:03,160
Speaker 1: work in, and then you got study hall. Like it's

505
00:28:03,160 --> 00:28:07,879
Speaker 1: a it's a tough load. So is it good or bad?

506
00:28:08,080 --> 00:28:10,560
Speaker 1: I don't know, Like I'm a I'm a proponent of college,

507
00:28:10,560 --> 00:28:12,440
Speaker 1: but at the same time, it's like, you know, it's

508
00:28:12,440 --> 00:28:15,360
Speaker 1: all relative to circumstances. Like my guy Josh Primo this year,

509
00:28:15,400 --> 00:28:18,080
Speaker 1: youngest guy in the draft. People were saying, why, you know,

510
00:28:18,119 --> 00:28:19,919
Speaker 1: why why are you going? Why are you going in

511
00:28:19,960 --> 00:28:22,160
Speaker 1: the draft? You came off the bench the average under

512
00:28:22,200 --> 00:28:24,760
Speaker 1: ten points, and then here he is, he's a lottery pick.

513
00:28:25,440 --> 00:28:29,399
Speaker 1: And you know, can you argue that next year, you know,

514
00:28:29,480 --> 00:28:32,280
Speaker 1: God forbid, if there's an injury or something else, then

515
00:28:32,680 --> 00:28:34,680
Speaker 1: then people are being critical and saying you should have

516
00:28:34,760 --> 00:28:37,919
Speaker 1: left earlier, you should have left when you were projected higher.

517
00:28:38,000 --> 00:28:43,240
Speaker 1: So I look kindsights always. I'm a big data guy.

518
00:28:43,720 --> 00:28:46,160
Speaker 1: I say, I'm not the smartest guy in the room.

519
00:28:46,240 --> 00:28:48,600
Speaker 1: Let me look at the data. I could argue, going

520
00:28:48,640 --> 00:28:51,800
Speaker 1: back to the days of high school players turning pro

521
00:28:52,360 --> 00:28:54,840
Speaker 1: that the percentage of high school players that term pro

522
00:28:55,280 --> 00:28:57,880
Speaker 1: had greater success than the ones that maybe saved four

523
00:28:57,920 --> 00:29:00,440
Speaker 1: years in college at the end of their career. If

524
00:29:00,480 --> 00:29:04,400
Speaker 1: you look back the Kevin Garnett, Jermaine O'Neil's right, but

525
00:29:04,440 --> 00:29:07,760
Speaker 1: those those guys were the more talented ones to begin with, right,

526
00:29:07,880 --> 00:29:11,920
Speaker 1: And it's the you know, my issues with the Angel

527
00:29:12,080 --> 00:29:16,520
Speaker 1: Collins is the special tail bears, the guys who who

528
00:29:16,920 --> 00:29:20,280
Speaker 1: uh you know, did go and like the rest of

529
00:29:20,320 --> 00:29:22,240
Speaker 1: their life their left, they were left searching. It's a

530
00:29:22,280 --> 00:29:24,200
Speaker 1: really hard thing. Like the NBA is that responsible for

531
00:29:24,240 --> 00:29:27,440
Speaker 1: the rest of your life? Okay? So um, so you

532
00:29:27,480 --> 00:29:31,400
Speaker 1: get done playing and you decided to go to law school?

533
00:29:32,960 --> 00:29:35,600
Speaker 1: What is what? What was where'd you go law school?

534
00:29:35,600 --> 00:29:38,560
Speaker 1: What was that? What was that experience? Yeah, so Doug,

535
00:29:38,920 --> 00:29:41,560
Speaker 1: it was all you know, it's funny. It was all

536
00:29:41,640 --> 00:29:44,720
Speaker 1: happening at the same time. So just to kind of recap,

537
00:29:45,760 --> 00:29:49,360
Speaker 1: So Wasserman was not in existent existence. Tell him in

538
00:29:49,440 --> 00:29:53,120
Speaker 1: Associates was the precursor, right even before he was at

539
00:29:53,280 --> 00:29:56,000
Speaker 1: AR and sold as company to SFS and joined David Falk.

540
00:29:56,360 --> 00:29:58,920
Speaker 1: I was there through all of that when I was

541
00:29:59,000 --> 00:30:01,760
Speaker 1: working there as an intern and for three years. So

542
00:30:02,240 --> 00:30:04,400
Speaker 1: by the time by the time I'm going into my

543
00:30:04,520 --> 00:30:08,200
Speaker 1: senior year, I had actually an extra year of eligibility.

544
00:30:08,240 --> 00:30:11,600
Speaker 1: I had shoulder surgery and I did not want to

545
00:30:11,640 --> 00:30:15,800
Speaker 1: play out my fifth year, so I actually left, took

546
00:30:15,960 --> 00:30:20,000
Speaker 1: nine classes of summer school to graduate, uh quicker, while

547
00:30:20,000 --> 00:30:23,040
Speaker 1: my scholarship still lasted, and one class and fall. So

548
00:30:23,120 --> 00:30:27,320
Speaker 1: I started working for arn uh you know, full time

549
00:30:27,360 --> 00:30:29,880
Speaker 1: as I'm going to class to get ready for law school.

550
00:30:30,560 --> 00:30:35,239
Speaker 1: So because every agent at Arns Practice did the same thing.

551
00:30:35,320 --> 00:30:38,600
Speaker 1: Bob Myers was there. Bob was at Loyola right working

552
00:30:38,640 --> 00:30:42,160
Speaker 1: while working for arned to then become an agent. Um,

553
00:30:42,200 --> 00:30:44,840
Speaker 1: you know Joe Wolf all the age. Rob Polinka was there,

554
00:30:44,880 --> 00:30:47,440
Speaker 1: he was already an attorney and in law school. So

555
00:30:47,640 --> 00:30:49,960
Speaker 1: you know we were loaded. I mean, Warren la Garry

556
00:30:50,080 --> 00:30:53,480
Speaker 1: was there. Aren't tell him, uh, Bob Myers, Rob Polinka,

557
00:30:53,600 --> 00:30:58,000
Speaker 1: Bad Fouchet and Neil Lollsha was doing the pre draft

558
00:30:58,080 --> 00:31:00,680
Speaker 1: pre draft with Tim Gurgert. So you got five guys.

559
00:31:01,080 --> 00:31:03,720
Speaker 1: We're running NBA teams, are owning the NBA Summer League.

560
00:31:03,760 --> 00:31:06,600
Speaker 1: About office and here I am at nineteen through one

561
00:31:07,400 --> 00:31:10,440
Speaker 1: with the firm. So I was I was there's only

562
00:31:10,480 --> 00:31:13,920
Speaker 1: two law schools because my plan was to be there

563
00:31:13,960 --> 00:31:16,560
Speaker 1: working as an agent and going to school. There's only

564
00:31:16,560 --> 00:31:20,760
Speaker 1: two law schools in southern California. That's LOYALA Merrimont in

565
00:31:20,800 --> 00:31:23,200
Speaker 1: Southwestern to have a part time program where you could

566
00:31:23,200 --> 00:31:26,880
Speaker 1: go to school at night and and still work during

567
00:31:26,880 --> 00:31:30,360
Speaker 1: the day. That were accredited law schools. Right, and this

568
00:31:30,440 --> 00:31:33,320
Speaker 1: is post nine eleven, So the competition in law school

569
00:31:33,360 --> 00:31:36,680
Speaker 1: was thick in terms of you know, taking your l

570
00:31:36,760 --> 00:31:39,880
Speaker 1: SATs and and applying and going to the schools you want.

571
00:31:39,920 --> 00:31:44,120
Speaker 1: So I'm in law school and um I actually had

572
00:31:44,280 --> 00:31:47,280
Speaker 1: I left ARN and I was in crisis management for

573
00:31:47,360 --> 00:31:51,440
Speaker 1: a big crisis management firm in l A called Winner

574
00:31:51,440 --> 00:31:54,200
Speaker 1: and Associates, And probably about four months in in my

575
00:31:54,240 --> 00:31:56,480
Speaker 1: first semester of law school, that's when Baron reached out

576
00:31:56,520 --> 00:32:00,160
Speaker 1: to me and asked me to manage them. But end

577
00:32:00,160 --> 00:32:02,680
Speaker 1: of that first year in law school, we're on a

578
00:32:02,720 --> 00:32:07,800
Speaker 1: trip in in uh in South in Central America, UM

579
00:32:07,840 --> 00:32:11,360
Speaker 1: with a Reebok tour and I'm sick as hell, Doug like,

580
00:32:11,440 --> 00:32:13,280
Speaker 1: I felt like I was gonna die. Literally, I don't

581
00:32:13,320 --> 00:32:16,240
Speaker 1: even remember Santa Domingo when we were part of that tour,

582
00:32:17,000 --> 00:32:18,920
Speaker 1: and I remember getting on the plane. I coudn't even

583
00:32:18,920 --> 00:32:21,240
Speaker 1: see straight. He was like, I want you to be

584
00:32:21,320 --> 00:32:25,120
Speaker 1: my agent. So I was twenty three turning twenty four,

585
00:32:25,160 --> 00:32:28,600
Speaker 1: and that that was the start of representing Barren. He

586
00:32:28,640 --> 00:32:33,760
Speaker 1: was my first client. UM, how were you treated in

587
00:32:33,800 --> 00:32:40,320
Speaker 1: the field? Always? You know, Baron's friend young, you know

588
00:32:41,160 --> 00:32:44,520
Speaker 1: a number I was, you know, it's everyone was respectful

589
00:32:44,560 --> 00:32:48,200
Speaker 1: to my face, but Lord knows behind the scenes. And

590
00:32:48,640 --> 00:32:50,880
Speaker 1: because I have no gray hairs behind me, you know,

591
00:32:51,120 --> 00:32:57,440
Speaker 1: I was four, just recently graduated college. Uh, not too

592
00:32:57,480 --> 00:33:00,280
Speaker 1: many years prior, and I you know, I don't want

593
00:33:00,280 --> 00:33:01,680
Speaker 1: to say Baron was my client. He was more of

594
00:33:01,720 --> 00:33:04,000
Speaker 1: a partner. We just we had a partnership he had

595
00:33:04,080 --> 00:33:06,320
Speaker 1: he had a he had a blueprint, as he would

596
00:33:06,320 --> 00:33:09,720
Speaker 1: call it, and I was there to execute. How did

597
00:33:09,840 --> 00:33:13,360
Speaker 1: he it felt like it was always I know, Cash

598
00:33:13,400 --> 00:33:16,440
Speaker 1: Warning was really close, He's really close with right. How

599
00:33:16,480 --> 00:33:20,920
Speaker 1: did he always seem to have this like plan, Like

600
00:33:21,360 --> 00:33:25,080
Speaker 1: here's a dude raised by his grandma south Central l A. Right,

601
00:33:25,760 --> 00:33:27,760
Speaker 1: but he always seemed to have a plan. You want

602
00:33:27,800 --> 00:33:30,959
Speaker 1: to do movies and entertainment, not just and now blessed

603
00:33:31,000 --> 00:33:33,960
Speaker 1: as an amazing basketball player? Was that you and him?

604
00:33:34,400 --> 00:33:36,440
Speaker 1: Was that something he had already established? Like? Where did

605
00:33:36,480 --> 00:33:39,760
Speaker 1: that come from? Baron? Already? He always had that? I

606
00:33:39,760 --> 00:33:43,280
Speaker 1: think that's barons uh, you know, lens or perspective on

607
00:33:43,320 --> 00:33:45,920
Speaker 1: the world, growing up in South Central and then going

608
00:33:46,000 --> 00:33:49,960
Speaker 1: to crossroads in Santa Monica. Baron Baron is a phenomenal one.

609
00:33:49,960 --> 00:33:53,280
Speaker 1: He's a trendsetter, Doug, but he's I tell you, he's

610
00:33:53,320 --> 00:33:56,400
Speaker 1: a phenomenal talent evaluator. You know in terms of like

611
00:33:56,480 --> 00:33:59,040
Speaker 1: you could talk to people that he's crossed across paths

612
00:33:59,160 --> 00:34:02,880
Speaker 1: with in business that have either worked in partnership with

613
00:34:02,960 --> 00:34:05,400
Speaker 1: him or worked for him. A lot of those people

614
00:34:05,440 --> 00:34:10,239
Speaker 1: have moved on to uh, you know, executive positions and entertainment, Uh,

615
00:34:10,280 --> 00:34:12,840
Speaker 1: you know myself even you know, running my own agency

616
00:34:12,880 --> 00:34:16,239
Speaker 1: and continue to represent players. You know, Cash is a

617
00:34:16,600 --> 00:34:21,080
Speaker 1: serial entrepreneur. So Baron has always just been good at identifying,

618
00:34:21,680 --> 00:34:24,640
Speaker 1: you know, talented young people as he's progressing his career

619
00:34:25,000 --> 00:34:27,040
Speaker 1: that have moved on to you know, if they're not

620
00:34:27,080 --> 00:34:30,720
Speaker 1: working alongside him, moved on to bigger and even greater things.

621
00:34:30,719 --> 00:34:34,440
Speaker 1: So and that's a that's a talent in itself, I think, yes, No,

622
00:34:34,600 --> 00:34:37,520
Speaker 1: it's it's just like it's no different than to be

623
00:34:37,560 --> 00:34:40,680
Speaker 1: a to be a you know, a GM, to be

624
00:34:40,719 --> 00:34:42,320
Speaker 1: a coach, to be an agent, you've got to be

625
00:34:42,360 --> 00:34:46,600
Speaker 1: able to evaluate talent and see, Okay, in two years,

626
00:34:46,640 --> 00:34:49,040
Speaker 1: this guy is going to be this with the right

627
00:34:49,120 --> 00:34:51,280
Speaker 1: you know, putting the right position. It's an amazing gift

628
00:34:51,520 --> 00:34:54,839
Speaker 1: gift to have. So you're representing who is your second club,

629
00:34:55,560 --> 00:35:00,040
Speaker 1: Trevor Reasa. The following year, you know Trevor was It

630
00:35:00,120 --> 00:35:02,240
Speaker 1: was eighteen coming out of u c L a average

631
00:35:02,239 --> 00:35:05,719
Speaker 1: twelve and seven. No one anticipated him leaving, he was

632
00:35:05,760 --> 00:35:09,200
Speaker 1: gonna leave. I ended up representing Trevor, getting him drafted

633
00:35:09,239 --> 00:35:14,959
Speaker 1: to the Knicks. What was it what was that like, Um,

634
00:35:15,120 --> 00:35:17,800
Speaker 1: it was great. Trevor was Greatvor. You know, Trevor and

635
00:35:17,840 --> 00:35:21,759
Speaker 1: I are still friends now. Um it was I tell

636
00:35:21,800 --> 00:35:24,240
Speaker 1: you man, we were fearless. It was kind of crazy.

637
00:35:24,280 --> 00:35:26,120
Speaker 1: I looked back, like, what the hell were we doing

638
00:35:26,400 --> 00:35:29,600
Speaker 1: because we don't like you're using we're using common sense

639
00:35:29,719 --> 00:35:32,840
Speaker 1: or for me, it's like trial and error. But we

640
00:35:32,840 --> 00:35:36,000
Speaker 1: we prep. You know, Recohins, who's still a best friend

641
00:35:36,000 --> 00:35:38,720
Speaker 1: of mine, who's one of the best player development coaches.

642
00:35:38,760 --> 00:35:41,960
Speaker 1: He put Trevor through player development for the draft process,

643
00:35:42,800 --> 00:35:46,320
Speaker 1: and uh, you know, Trevor ends up playing extremely well

644
00:35:46,400 --> 00:35:49,160
Speaker 1: in the in the l A Summer League at the time,

645
00:35:49,200 --> 00:35:52,360
Speaker 1: this is precursor of the Vegas and you know, Isaiah

646
00:35:52,440 --> 00:35:55,560
Speaker 1: Thomas took him. Uh it's a funny story. I still

647
00:35:55,640 --> 00:36:01,560
Speaker 1: laugh about with Isaiah. My first contract negotiation was was

648
00:36:01,680 --> 00:36:05,839
Speaker 1: interesting because I was completely prepped for it. But you're

649
00:36:05,880 --> 00:36:09,800
Speaker 1: not prepped for Isaiah Thomas or somebody that, you know

650
00:36:09,880 --> 00:36:12,720
Speaker 1: what I mean. Yeah, Plus here you grew up in

651
00:36:12,880 --> 00:36:16,200
Speaker 1: l A in the eighties. He was awesome, but I

652
00:36:16,239 --> 00:36:20,759
Speaker 1: hate him and he has this incredib the guys that

653
00:36:20,800 --> 00:36:25,040
Speaker 1: are the starts and you know this, like we've been

654
00:36:25,080 --> 00:36:28,000
Speaker 1: around the guys that they have an aura to them,

655
00:36:28,680 --> 00:36:32,239
Speaker 1: they just do right they have it or okay, so

656
00:36:32,680 --> 00:36:35,880
Speaker 1: still with him? No, no, well I sat down with him.

657
00:36:35,920 --> 00:36:38,720
Speaker 1: I think Isaiah was testing me. This is post Summer

658
00:36:38,800 --> 00:36:42,759
Speaker 1: League and um and Isaiah asked to meet me at

659
00:36:42,800 --> 00:36:45,400
Speaker 1: the Four Seasons in Beverly Hills, but not at like

660
00:36:45,600 --> 00:36:49,160
Speaker 1: nine am or ten am, seven am, because Isaiah knew

661
00:36:49,200 --> 00:36:51,040
Speaker 1: I was young. So let's say I think it was

662
00:36:51,080 --> 00:36:53,040
Speaker 1: a test. Let's see if this guy shows up on time.

663
00:36:53,080 --> 00:36:57,319
Speaker 1: I was there. I think probably am Is mom was

664
00:36:57,360 --> 00:37:00,680
Speaker 1: there with him initially, and then we sit down and talk.

665
00:37:01,239 --> 00:37:03,760
Speaker 1: But the funny thing is I always say this in negotiations,

666
00:37:03,800 --> 00:37:06,560
Speaker 1: to their strength and numbers. Right, if if you and

667
00:37:06,560 --> 00:37:08,719
Speaker 1: I are negotiating against each other, Doug, and as you

668
00:37:08,800 --> 00:37:10,920
Speaker 1: by yourself and I have two other people with me,

669
00:37:11,400 --> 00:37:16,360
Speaker 1: attorneys and other experienced people, their strength naturally in numbers.

670
00:37:16,400 --> 00:37:19,880
Speaker 1: So in that negotiation we started the talks in l A.

671
00:37:20,040 --> 00:37:22,440
Speaker 1: He goes back to New York and now they have

672
00:37:22,560 --> 00:37:26,160
Speaker 1: the you know, the lead counsel for the Knicks and

673
00:37:26,440 --> 00:37:30,040
Speaker 1: they have me on speaker phone negotiating, which which was Uh?

674
00:37:31,040 --> 00:37:34,759
Speaker 1: I sit back and think about that conversation. Uh, there

675
00:37:34,800 --> 00:37:37,279
Speaker 1: was some curveballs thrown at me that I handled. But

676
00:37:37,440 --> 00:37:41,680
Speaker 1: more more than anything that intimidation tactics. I think I

677
00:37:41,719 --> 00:37:43,480
Speaker 1: held my own at least Isaiah said I did, and

678
00:37:43,520 --> 00:37:46,120
Speaker 1: I got a good deal for Trevor. What is it

679
00:37:46,239 --> 00:37:48,680
Speaker 1: like like for Trevor? What is it like for a

680
00:37:48,680 --> 00:37:51,279
Speaker 1: guy who's a client at a very young age to leave,

681
00:37:51,960 --> 00:37:55,680
Speaker 1: to leave you? What's that? What's that feeling like? Uh?

682
00:37:55,719 --> 00:37:58,560
Speaker 1: To leave me as a as an agent? Yes? Like

683
00:37:58,600 --> 00:38:02,600
Speaker 1: what I mean inevitable late? Yeah? What is that? What

684
00:38:02,680 --> 00:38:05,080
Speaker 1: is that like? From your perspective? Oh? Man? It was.

685
00:38:05,200 --> 00:38:09,000
Speaker 1: It was like losing your first your first love, like

686
00:38:09,040 --> 00:38:12,000
Speaker 1: your your first you know, like a girl breaking up

687
00:38:12,000 --> 00:38:14,120
Speaker 1: with you in high school, right your first life. Like

688
00:38:14,200 --> 00:38:16,600
Speaker 1: it hurts. I was like, God, I'm not going to

689
00:38:16,680 --> 00:38:18,600
Speaker 1: be able to survive as an agent, Like it's over,

690
00:38:18,680 --> 00:38:21,480
Speaker 1: My reputation is done, x Y and Z and I

691
00:38:21,800 --> 00:38:24,879
Speaker 1: countless stories Doug where it's just like you figure it out,

692
00:38:25,000 --> 00:38:27,480
Speaker 1: you learn from it, you pick yourself back up, and

693
00:38:27,520 --> 00:38:31,880
Speaker 1: you keep moving forward. But that was devastating. But in hindsight,

694
00:38:32,600 --> 00:38:36,200
Speaker 1: you know, based on how green I was in certain areas,

695
00:38:36,280 --> 00:38:39,719
Speaker 1: not in the negotiations or preparation, it was more just

696
00:38:39,920 --> 00:38:42,800
Speaker 1: life experience. In terms of guiding him. I don't fault

697
00:38:42,880 --> 00:38:45,680
Speaker 1: him for making that change at the time when you

698
00:38:45,960 --> 00:38:49,160
Speaker 1: now professionality you've been in for twenty years against super

699
00:38:49,239 --> 00:38:57,920
Speaker 1: successful um better worse, different? What in terms of recruiting players,

700
00:38:58,280 --> 00:39:02,000
Speaker 1: what's the experience? It's it's it's much better because I

701
00:39:02,040 --> 00:39:04,840
Speaker 1: don't waste time. I'm much more efficient for me. It

702
00:39:04,960 --> 00:39:07,120
Speaker 1: is because Doug, I'm a big believer, and I tell

703
00:39:07,200 --> 00:39:10,880
Speaker 1: my staff this is I don't. I don't sugarcoat things.

704
00:39:11,040 --> 00:39:14,040
Speaker 1: I don't. I'm not. I'm not selling anything that I

705
00:39:14,080 --> 00:39:17,160
Speaker 1: don't think I could deliver on. So the client stopped

706
00:39:17,160 --> 00:39:20,200
Speaker 1: buy into what I'm selling as a service. Are the

707
00:39:20,200 --> 00:39:23,359
Speaker 1: guys I'm supposed to be representing, and look, those guys

708
00:39:23,440 --> 00:39:27,680
Speaker 1: are experiencing success. I tend to evaluate talent for what

709
00:39:27,800 --> 00:39:30,839
Speaker 1: I could develop them into. So, you know, you look

710
00:39:30,880 --> 00:39:33,960
Speaker 1: at the Pascal Siakam. You know, Pascal wasn't supposed to

711
00:39:34,000 --> 00:39:35,560
Speaker 1: be a first round It wasn't supposed to be an

712
00:39:35,600 --> 00:39:38,280
Speaker 1: All Star or a max player, but he's those things.

713
00:39:38,640 --> 00:39:42,239
Speaker 1: You know. Tom Thomas Bryant second round pick, you know,

714
00:39:42,360 --> 00:39:44,680
Speaker 1: waved by the Lakers, and now he's the starting center.

715
00:39:44,719 --> 00:39:47,640
Speaker 1: He just turned twenty four. I think Thomass position to

716
00:39:47,680 --> 00:39:50,920
Speaker 1: earn twenty five million per year next year, if not

717
00:39:51,040 --> 00:39:53,320
Speaker 1: greater once he recovers from his nation. Okay, so so

718
00:39:53,640 --> 00:40:00,600
Speaker 1: go back Pascal. Okay I called pascals tournament. Yeah, his coach.

719
00:40:00,880 --> 00:40:05,279
Speaker 1: Uh uh. You know Margaret is like my brother's best

720
00:40:05,280 --> 00:40:08,279
Speaker 1: friend in the business. Okay, But if you told me

721
00:40:09,239 --> 00:40:11,520
Speaker 1: that this is how good he could be, I would

722
00:40:11,520 --> 00:40:15,879
Speaker 1: be like, when did you first see Pascal? I saw

723
00:40:15,960 --> 00:40:21,160
Speaker 1: him at in Bakersfield, playing against Bakersfield, and you know,

724
00:40:21,200 --> 00:40:23,799
Speaker 1: I want to evaluate talent. It's like, is he really

725
00:40:23,880 --> 00:40:27,440
Speaker 1: six nine, six ten? What's his body type? Can you

726
00:40:27,440 --> 00:40:29,920
Speaker 1: shoot the ball? Does you have touched you know? And

727
00:40:29,960 --> 00:40:31,760
Speaker 1: I could tell those things even if he's not shooting

728
00:40:31,840 --> 00:40:34,200
Speaker 1: jumpers at the free throw line? And then how good

729
00:40:34,200 --> 00:40:36,840
Speaker 1: earth's feet? What's his athleticism, and like what does he

730
00:40:36,880 --> 00:40:40,319
Speaker 1: do well? And then the other component And Doug, here's

731
00:40:40,320 --> 00:40:43,279
Speaker 1: the thing is you you would not have thought I

732
00:40:43,320 --> 00:40:46,240
Speaker 1: was crazy if you're in the gym every day watching

733
00:40:46,320 --> 00:40:48,920
Speaker 1: him like I am. See you you have a basketball

734
00:40:48,960 --> 00:40:51,480
Speaker 1: pedigree as well. That's the big thing that people forget

735
00:40:51,560 --> 00:40:54,759
Speaker 1: is I'm in the gym every day watching the development

736
00:40:54,760 --> 00:40:57,000
Speaker 1: of my guys doing my calls, like how you are

737
00:40:57,080 --> 00:40:58,719
Speaker 1: right now, I'm doing my calls in the gym, so

738
00:40:59,080 --> 00:41:03,160
Speaker 1: I'm watching the ascension of their development. So it's by

739
00:41:03,160 --> 00:41:06,280
Speaker 1: the end of the summer three months. If I'm watching

740
00:41:06,320 --> 00:41:09,840
Speaker 1: Pascal compete at a high level against Paul George lebron

741
00:41:09,960 --> 00:41:12,759
Speaker 1: or or Chris Paul or James Harden and those guys,

742
00:41:12,800 --> 00:41:15,520
Speaker 1: I'm starting to, you know, an earshot away hearing them

743
00:41:15,600 --> 00:41:19,160
Speaker 1: talk about Pascal. It's easy for me to know where

744
00:41:19,239 --> 00:41:21,759
Speaker 1: what direction my guys going in terms of his development.

745
00:41:22,440 --> 00:41:24,960
Speaker 1: But if you're if you're on outside looking in saying, oh,

746
00:41:24,960 --> 00:41:27,640
Speaker 1: this guy is from New Mexico State, or you know,

747
00:41:27,800 --> 00:41:29,839
Speaker 1: I don't know this guy, or i've seen him play once,

748
00:41:29,880 --> 00:41:32,920
Speaker 1: I don't know, but you're not seeing his his development,

749
00:41:33,800 --> 00:41:36,400
Speaker 1: then I could see how somebody may think I'm crazy

750
00:41:36,480 --> 00:41:39,839
Speaker 1: or biased to my client opposed to actually seeing where

751
00:41:39,840 --> 00:41:44,120
Speaker 1: there are what what is it? You know your role?

752
00:41:44,239 --> 00:41:46,680
Speaker 1: You're so you get I mean, look, one of the

753
00:41:46,719 --> 00:41:48,040
Speaker 1: one of the sales. Can you tell if I'm wrong?

754
00:41:48,239 --> 00:41:52,200
Speaker 1: Is you have a great, strong relationship with your clients.

755
00:41:52,239 --> 00:41:55,000
Speaker 1: It's a partnership, it's a friendship. It's more than just hey,

756
00:41:55,040 --> 00:41:58,000
Speaker 1: I'm gonna get your next deal, right, Okay, So Pascal

757
00:41:58,200 --> 00:42:02,480
Speaker 1: struggles in the playoff. Right, here's a young guy. It's

758
00:42:02,520 --> 00:42:05,919
Speaker 1: the highest level of the NBA is different. What what's

759
00:42:05,960 --> 00:42:08,600
Speaker 1: that like for you to deal with knowing what he

760
00:42:08,640 --> 00:42:11,520
Speaker 1: has in them but also knowing the reality of in

761
00:42:11,640 --> 00:42:14,719
Speaker 1: play as well as as he as he can as

762
00:42:14,760 --> 00:42:17,160
Speaker 1: the agent, but also the partner and the friend. What

763
00:42:17,239 --> 00:42:20,520
Speaker 1: does that experience. It's being honest. I gotta be honest

764
00:42:20,560 --> 00:42:24,520
Speaker 1: with him, and and it's also bringing in, um, you know,

765
00:42:24,600 --> 00:42:28,080
Speaker 1: some other stories or examples of other players, because every

766
00:42:28,239 --> 00:42:31,360
Speaker 1: all great players go through adversity, every single one. We

767
00:42:31,400 --> 00:42:34,120
Speaker 1: can't name one that didn't struggle at some point on

768
00:42:34,160 --> 00:42:37,520
Speaker 1: their path to maybe be being you know, taking it

769
00:42:37,600 --> 00:42:40,719
Speaker 1: up and notch to greatness and and having that level

770
00:42:40,760 --> 00:42:44,680
Speaker 1: of consistency. Even you know Lebron, not saying Pascal is

771
00:42:44,680 --> 00:42:47,040
Speaker 1: is Lebron, but you know Lebron has gone through it

772
00:42:47,120 --> 00:42:49,600
Speaker 1: or Steph has gone through it. All the great players

773
00:42:49,640 --> 00:42:52,480
Speaker 1: go through it. It's how they handle that adversity and

774
00:42:52,520 --> 00:42:55,359
Speaker 1: come out on the other side. So for me having

775
00:42:55,360 --> 00:43:00,279
Speaker 1: those conversations with Pascal, it's not sugarcoating it. It's like, hey, eight,

776
00:43:00,520 --> 00:43:02,319
Speaker 1: you need to get your wrestler, Let's go get some

777
00:43:02,360 --> 00:43:05,160
Speaker 1: extra reps in or this is all part of the process,

778
00:43:05,280 --> 00:43:07,319
Speaker 1: like it's okay, let's get back to work in the

779
00:43:07,360 --> 00:43:10,920
Speaker 1: off season. So it's not and then actually not just

780
00:43:11,040 --> 00:43:14,520
Speaker 1: saying things but backing it up as an agent with

781
00:43:14,560 --> 00:43:18,000
Speaker 1: a plan of action for them to take to get better.

782
00:43:18,520 --> 00:43:22,279
Speaker 1: But it's never yeah, hey, it's everybody else's follower. You're

783
00:43:22,320 --> 00:43:24,239
Speaker 1: the victim and X, Y and Z. It's like, no,

784
00:43:24,480 --> 00:43:27,360
Speaker 1: let's look at it from all angles. Understand this business

785
00:43:27,360 --> 00:43:29,880
Speaker 1: and what it is. Let's understand what your role is.

786
00:43:29,920 --> 00:43:33,359
Speaker 1: Because Pascal's path is is a is a is an

787
00:43:33,480 --> 00:43:37,000
Speaker 1: unconventional one. If we look at it from NBA All

788
00:43:37,040 --> 00:43:40,040
Speaker 1: Star standards, is this wasn't a guy that's supposed to

789
00:43:40,080 --> 00:43:42,520
Speaker 1: be an All Star. He came out of nowhere. So

790
00:43:42,680 --> 00:43:45,479
Speaker 1: him being thrust into a leadership role as an All

791
00:43:45,520 --> 00:43:48,719
Speaker 1: Star Max player, that's all new to him. He's the

792
00:43:48,760 --> 00:43:52,120
Speaker 1: youngest of six, right, so we understand family dynamics as well.

793
00:43:52,680 --> 00:43:55,600
Speaker 1: He's learning and being more comfortable as in his skin

794
00:43:56,160 --> 00:43:59,360
Speaker 1: in terms of leadership roles. So it's it's literally coaching

795
00:43:59,440 --> 00:44:01,960
Speaker 1: him through that. It's talking to the team and management.

796
00:44:02,320 --> 00:44:05,239
Speaker 1: You know, in some cases even Nick Nurse about those

797
00:44:05,239 --> 00:44:08,000
Speaker 1: things to bring it to his attention and then you

798
00:44:08,000 --> 00:44:10,560
Speaker 1: know it's a partnership with the team understanding his success

799
00:44:10,600 --> 00:44:13,600
Speaker 1: as a team success, Pascal success is what was my own.

800
00:44:13,719 --> 00:44:19,200
Speaker 1: So for me it's again I always say relationships outside

801
00:44:19,239 --> 00:44:22,319
Speaker 1: looking in could be contentious or you can look at

802
00:44:22,360 --> 00:44:25,400
Speaker 1: us a part as a partnership and and make it

803
00:44:25,440 --> 00:44:28,680
Speaker 1: make sense so that both sides benefit. You know, whatever

804
00:44:28,680 --> 00:44:32,160
Speaker 1: it is, whatever it is in terms of outcomes, we

805
00:44:32,200 --> 00:44:39,640
Speaker 1: want turn here, go to law school. You know, probably

806
00:44:40,320 --> 00:44:42,120
Speaker 1: skipped the step that even you want to skip and

807
00:44:42,360 --> 00:44:45,239
Speaker 1: starting with Baron, you know, before you finished doing what

808
00:44:45,280 --> 00:44:50,000
Speaker 1: you want to do. Um. But if somebody wants to

809
00:44:50,040 --> 00:44:54,320
Speaker 1: be you, what, how would you like? There's a college

810
00:44:54,320 --> 00:44:56,520
Speaker 1: basketball player out there is like and I like, I

811
00:44:56,600 --> 00:45:00,200
Speaker 1: love this game, I love the sport. What what would

812
00:45:00,200 --> 00:45:02,120
Speaker 1: you what would you recommend to them as the first

813
00:45:02,160 --> 00:45:04,320
Speaker 1: step in trying to see if they like the process

814
00:45:04,360 --> 00:45:09,600
Speaker 1: of being an agent? Yeah, they would recommend a credible

815
00:45:09,640 --> 00:45:13,840
Speaker 1: internship with a credible firm, because we're we're all judged

816
00:45:13,840 --> 00:45:16,840
Speaker 1: by a resume, um, and you want to learn and

817
00:45:16,880 --> 00:45:20,520
Speaker 1: pick up those good habits or see great agents at

818
00:45:20,560 --> 00:45:24,280
Speaker 1: work to understand their habits or what it entails. Oftentimes

819
00:45:24,320 --> 00:45:26,480
Speaker 1: I have young people that reach out to me and says,

820
00:45:26,880 --> 00:45:29,560
Speaker 1: you know, have said, hey, I've interned here, I've worked

821
00:45:29,600 --> 00:45:33,000
Speaker 1: in sports, and then I say where, And it may

822
00:45:33,040 --> 00:45:36,319
Speaker 1: not have been a credible firm in which I know,

823
00:45:36,440 --> 00:45:39,360
Speaker 1: they may not have picked up great habits. In terms

824
00:45:39,360 --> 00:45:41,160
Speaker 1: of what it takes to be an agent. I think

825
00:45:41,719 --> 00:45:44,120
Speaker 1: most people get it confused now that hey, if I

826
00:45:44,160 --> 00:45:47,000
Speaker 1: have a player, I could just go get certified and

827
00:45:47,040 --> 00:45:48,520
Speaker 1: I know how to be an agent, or I'm an

828
00:45:48,560 --> 00:45:51,279
Speaker 1: agent all of a sudden, like that's is disrespectful to

829
00:45:51,320 --> 00:45:54,880
Speaker 1: be honest with you, Like there's an art and a

830
00:45:55,120 --> 00:45:57,040
Speaker 1: there's a there's an art to being an agent for

831
00:45:57,120 --> 00:46:02,600
Speaker 1: one understanding the business and what it entails. And then um, yeah,

832
00:46:02,840 --> 00:46:04,960
Speaker 1: you want to surround yourself with great people that have

833
00:46:05,040 --> 00:46:08,320
Speaker 1: had success being an agent because we're fiduciaries of our clients.

834
00:46:09,040 --> 00:46:14,880
Speaker 1: M Um, you mentioned Rob who you worked with? You mentioned,

835
00:46:15,040 --> 00:46:19,840
Speaker 1: aren't um Leon Rose? Now running a team? Like is

836
00:46:19,880 --> 00:46:22,799
Speaker 1: that is that the dream? Is that the gold is there?

837
00:46:22,960 --> 00:46:25,600
Speaker 1: Is there any part of you that says, I love

838
00:46:25,640 --> 00:46:28,919
Speaker 1: what I'm doing, but man, I would love to run

839
00:46:28,920 --> 00:46:33,839
Speaker 1: the team and rebuild something I'm naturally a builder. That's

840
00:46:33,840 --> 00:46:37,600
Speaker 1: why I'm running my own company. If that opportunity presented itself,

841
00:46:37,640 --> 00:46:40,680
Speaker 1: I would I would look at it. Obviously, my clients

842
00:46:40,680 --> 00:46:43,160
Speaker 1: are family for me, so it's a conversation I would

843
00:46:43,200 --> 00:46:46,600
Speaker 1: have have with them as well and my family. But

844
00:46:46,840 --> 00:46:50,000
Speaker 1: I mean that could always be interesting because I don't

845
00:46:50,040 --> 00:46:52,520
Speaker 1: know about you, Doug, in terms of you know, growing

846
00:46:52,600 --> 00:46:54,640
Speaker 1: up as an as an athlete is like I love

847
00:46:54,800 --> 00:46:57,239
Speaker 1: being a part of a team, Like there's nothing better

848
00:46:57,280 --> 00:47:01,560
Speaker 1: than that, you know, um, you know, having in um colleagues,

849
00:47:01,600 --> 00:47:05,880
Speaker 1: are having um, you know, associates or people that you're

850
00:47:05,920 --> 00:47:09,200
Speaker 1: looking in the same direction building towards you know, at

851
00:47:09,239 --> 00:47:11,960
Speaker 1: least in sports and building towards a championship. So that

852
00:47:12,080 --> 00:47:15,640
Speaker 1: aspect always intrigues me. For me on on the company's side,

853
00:47:15,719 --> 00:47:18,920
Speaker 1: is the same thing as like, uh, you know, as

854
00:47:19,000 --> 00:47:23,680
Speaker 1: building towards our client's personal success or. In some ways

855
00:47:23,719 --> 00:47:26,719
Speaker 1: we're even sharing in the championships, you know, even as

856
00:47:26,800 --> 00:47:30,799
Speaker 1: recently for me with Pascal or even Caban Looney. Right now,

857
00:47:30,840 --> 00:47:34,200
Speaker 1: here's the here's the you you mentioned your honesty. Do

858
00:47:34,320 --> 00:47:38,640
Speaker 1: you cheer for other agents to succeed because like, if

859
00:47:38,680 --> 00:47:41,520
Speaker 1: they succeed, that means hey, this is a good plan,

860
00:47:41,760 --> 00:47:45,719
Speaker 1: or did you not want agents to succeed? What? What's

861
00:47:45,760 --> 00:47:48,640
Speaker 1: what's the experience like of watching other people who have

862
00:47:48,719 --> 00:47:51,560
Speaker 1: done what you've done? Playing Bob obviously has had an

863
00:47:51,560 --> 00:47:54,960
Speaker 1: incredible amount of success. Rob's had success, is won the title.

864
00:47:55,040 --> 00:48:00,080
Speaker 1: Do you cheer for those guys, um, because that I

865
00:48:00,200 --> 00:48:02,880
Speaker 1: was maybe that path open up for you. You know,

866
00:48:02,920 --> 00:48:07,000
Speaker 1: I wouldn't necessarily say cheer, but there's a tremendous amount

867
00:48:07,000 --> 00:48:10,480
Speaker 1: of respect I have because conversations come up sometimes where

868
00:48:10,520 --> 00:48:13,560
Speaker 1: people are critical of other agents and their work or

869
00:48:13,560 --> 00:48:17,959
Speaker 1: even their transition, and I'm I'll be protective of other

870
00:48:18,080 --> 00:48:21,360
Speaker 1: agents or other guys because a lot of again, a

871
00:48:21,440 --> 00:48:24,240
Speaker 1: lot of people don't understand what goes into our jobs.

872
00:48:24,640 --> 00:48:27,600
Speaker 1: And for an agent to have success for extended period

873
00:48:27,640 --> 00:48:32,200
Speaker 1: of time, especially uh, managing a you know, high level talent,

874
00:48:32,320 --> 00:48:35,680
Speaker 1: it's not easy, you know, And people can make the assumption, oh,

875
00:48:35,680 --> 00:48:38,200
Speaker 1: well that guy was a lottery pick already or he

876
00:48:38,320 --> 00:48:41,759
Speaker 1: was a superstar. Well you gotta deliver for those guys too,

877
00:48:41,760 --> 00:48:46,040
Speaker 1: that the expectations are greater as well. So I give

878
00:48:46,080 --> 00:48:48,839
Speaker 1: a lot of credit to those agents or even those

879
00:48:48,840 --> 00:48:52,439
Speaker 1: guys that make the transition to the front office, and

880
00:48:52,440 --> 00:48:54,920
Speaker 1: and and I say, in some ways, those guys are

881
00:48:55,480 --> 00:48:58,759
Speaker 1: better prepared. And that's not taken away from the front

882
00:48:58,800 --> 00:49:03,759
Speaker 1: office execs that have been agents. But you're every day

883
00:49:03,960 --> 00:49:07,160
Speaker 1: you're deal dealt with the set of circumstances that you

884
00:49:07,200 --> 00:49:11,680
Speaker 1: didn't know was coming the day before, right because ten percent,

885
00:49:11,800 --> 00:49:13,799
Speaker 1: you know, if if I'm looking at my business or

886
00:49:13,840 --> 00:49:16,240
Speaker 1: my role, you know, ten percent of it is probably

887
00:49:16,239 --> 00:49:21,600
Speaker 1: contract negotiations. The other nine are managing the client and

888
00:49:21,719 --> 00:49:24,839
Speaker 1: managing the curveballs that no one seeing. If if I'm

889
00:49:24,840 --> 00:49:27,960
Speaker 1: doing a good job managing the curve balls that nobody's

890
00:49:28,000 --> 00:49:30,719
Speaker 1: reading about or no one else has seen, you know,

891
00:49:30,960 --> 00:49:34,879
Speaker 1: and you know that's it. So I in some ways, I,

892
00:49:35,000 --> 00:49:38,080
Speaker 1: like I said, I'm not I can't say I'm outright cheering,

893
00:49:38,680 --> 00:49:41,560
Speaker 1: but I'm when I see them, I pay my respect

894
00:49:41,600 --> 00:49:45,439
Speaker 1: and acknowledge the work that they're doing and and want

895
00:49:45,480 --> 00:49:49,640
Speaker 1: them to be successful. I think there's everybody, Yeah, that

896
00:49:49,760 --> 00:49:52,560
Speaker 1: that's I mean, that's obvious. I believe that to be true.

897
00:49:52,600 --> 00:49:54,640
Speaker 1: And I also think that's why you know, I'm sure

898
00:49:54,640 --> 00:49:56,839
Speaker 1: you champion your own kind of young guys. Right, there's

899
00:49:57,520 --> 00:50:01,040
Speaker 1: there's play. Um, you mentioned your own firm. How hard

900
00:50:01,160 --> 00:50:05,759
Speaker 1: is that your own things, your own thing. It's extremely hard.

901
00:50:06,120 --> 00:50:09,279
Speaker 1: It's extremely hard, especially for me when I when I

902
00:50:09,280 --> 00:50:12,200
Speaker 1: went back after I left B d A in two

903
00:50:12,200 --> 00:50:17,560
Speaker 1: thousand thirteen, I didn't have a marquee client to uh,

904
00:50:17,880 --> 00:50:22,680
Speaker 1: I guess he could say to to use to gain

905
00:50:22,760 --> 00:50:25,080
Speaker 1: other clients. So for me, I had to change my

906
00:50:25,160 --> 00:50:30,640
Speaker 1: approach to the business to identify um undervalued talent that

907
00:50:30,680 --> 00:50:34,680
Speaker 1: I could develop into those um players that I thought

908
00:50:34,719 --> 00:50:37,440
Speaker 1: that could be very successful. So you know, when I

909
00:50:37,520 --> 00:50:40,320
Speaker 1: left in thirteen, I had to In two thousand fifteen,

910
00:50:40,320 --> 00:50:44,560
Speaker 1: I had Cavan Looney and even Norman Powell that that

911
00:50:44,640 --> 00:50:48,000
Speaker 1: I got drafted. Followed by the next year sixteen Pascal

912
00:50:48,080 --> 00:50:51,200
Speaker 1: Siakam picked up March and gor Toad as a client,

913
00:50:51,680 --> 00:50:55,040
Speaker 1: seventeen Thomas Bryant and then just kind of just continued

914
00:50:55,080 --> 00:50:57,920
Speaker 1: to build on momentum. But at the time, if you

915
00:50:57,960 --> 00:51:00,920
Speaker 1: look back in hindsight, like those guys were marquee guys,

916
00:51:01,360 --> 00:51:05,160
Speaker 1: I had that's a lot in their player development, not

917
00:51:05,239 --> 00:51:08,080
Speaker 1: just in the pre draft process but every offseason to

918
00:51:08,200 --> 00:51:10,319
Speaker 1: help get them to where they're at in terms of

919
00:51:10,320 --> 00:51:14,279
Speaker 1: their second contracts. Also, though again falling back on your relationships,

920
00:51:14,360 --> 00:51:17,239
Speaker 1: right Luney At u c l A, a a place that

921
00:51:17,360 --> 00:51:20,040
Speaker 1: you've played, and of course he gets drafted by Bob Meyers,

922
00:51:20,080 --> 00:51:22,080
Speaker 1: a guy who went to us l A. And you

923
00:51:22,120 --> 00:51:25,560
Speaker 1: work with the firm, right this. It doesn't mean that

924
00:51:25,640 --> 00:51:29,799
Speaker 1: there's anything illicit, but business is business. It's about relationships

925
00:51:29,800 --> 00:51:33,680
Speaker 1: and who you know. And if you're telling Bob, Bob

926
00:51:34,160 --> 00:51:37,440
Speaker 1: you can play like you know, that's different than an

927
00:51:37,440 --> 00:51:40,600
Speaker 1: agent he doesn't have a long standing relationship with and

928
00:51:40,760 --> 00:51:42,440
Speaker 1: understands that. Is that a fair way to look at it?

929
00:51:42,600 --> 00:51:46,000
Speaker 1: I think it's fair. But you know, Bobby, regardless of relationship,

930
00:51:46,280 --> 00:51:49,120
Speaker 1: Bob is, you know, and obviously this is as in

931
00:51:49,160 --> 00:51:53,080
Speaker 1: their run and uh you know, uh Gavan fell in

932
00:51:53,120 --> 00:51:56,719
Speaker 1: the draft for for medical reasons. You know it's me

933
00:51:56,880 --> 00:51:59,840
Speaker 1: saying that to Bob, But I think he's not in

934
00:51:59,880 --> 00:52:04,040
Speaker 1: the moment of drafting Cavan as much as him thinking

935
00:52:04,080 --> 00:52:10,080
Speaker 1: about the relationship long term because of of our dynamic. Um,

936
00:52:10,120 --> 00:52:12,080
Speaker 1: because Bob is gonna have to pick the best player

937
00:52:12,160 --> 00:52:15,040
Speaker 1: for the Golden State Warriors at any give. I'm not

938
00:52:15,360 --> 00:52:19,080
Speaker 1: because I'm his the player's agent, but because that's the

939
00:52:19,080 --> 00:52:22,600
Speaker 1: best talent available. So in some ways it works hand

940
00:52:22,600 --> 00:52:26,040
Speaker 1: in hand. But you know, it's I'd like to think

941
00:52:26,080 --> 00:52:29,160
Speaker 1: that my relationship with any team is I'm not I'm

942
00:52:29,160 --> 00:52:31,520
Speaker 1: not one of the bullshit. I'm just gonna tell it

943
00:52:31,560 --> 00:52:34,080
Speaker 1: how it is and I and I love that process

944
00:52:34,160 --> 00:52:38,520
Speaker 1: because I guess through experience. Whether again Josh Primo, I

945
00:52:38,560 --> 00:52:40,880
Speaker 1: could call a team when he's projected in the second

946
00:52:40,920 --> 00:52:44,400
Speaker 1: round and say, guys, look like Pascal or like a

947
00:52:44,480 --> 00:52:48,719
Speaker 1: Thomas Bryan or Cavan where I'm telling you, guys the

948
00:52:48,760 --> 00:52:51,520
Speaker 1: talent that I'm seeing and you guys know what I'm

949
00:52:51,560 --> 00:52:54,120
Speaker 1: gonna do. This kid is going to be a superstar.

950
00:52:54,800 --> 00:52:57,600
Speaker 1: And the ones that believe believe and the ones that don't.

951
00:52:57,719 --> 00:52:59,279
Speaker 1: You know, I remind him in the future when I

952
00:52:59,320 --> 00:53:04,560
Speaker 1: have the next player, there's there's satisfactors or that's the

953
00:53:04,640 --> 00:53:07,200
Speaker 1: chip on my shoulder dog and maybe that's a former

954
00:53:07,239 --> 00:53:09,400
Speaker 1: athlete in me. It's like I told you so, so

955
00:53:09,480 --> 00:53:12,600
Speaker 1: you don't believe me, I'll do it again. Um. I

956
00:53:12,920 --> 00:53:19,840
Speaker 1: I had a my TV and radio agent um for

957
00:53:20,640 --> 00:53:22,960
Speaker 1: five or six years. My second agent was guy named

958
00:53:23,040 --> 00:53:26,200
Speaker 1: Nick con Nick now runs w W Right and he

959
00:53:26,280 --> 00:53:29,200
Speaker 1: was at CIA. He was very powerful, brilliant guy. And

960
00:53:29,280 --> 00:53:30,840
Speaker 1: Nick used to tell me all the time, He's like

961
00:53:30,960 --> 00:53:34,120
Speaker 1: being an agent is a young man's job. It's a

962
00:53:34,160 --> 00:53:37,879
Speaker 1: grinder's job. Fifty is about like he's like, fifties about

963
00:53:37,960 --> 00:53:41,160
Speaker 1: kind of the cutoff. Okay, so you're in your early forties,

964
00:53:41,400 --> 00:53:46,480
Speaker 1: you've been really successful. UM what is what are your

965
00:53:46,520 --> 00:53:52,239
Speaker 1: thoughts on the next five ten years? For you? Personally, it's, um,

966
00:53:52,440 --> 00:53:55,200
Speaker 1: you know, I'm always thinking when you know, it's it's

967
00:53:55,239 --> 00:53:59,280
Speaker 1: continuing to help develop my current roster of clients, helped

968
00:53:59,360 --> 00:54:02,759
Speaker 1: groom the next generation of agents that are working with me,

969
00:54:03,480 --> 00:54:06,319
Speaker 1: because that's a that's a big part of my I guess,

970
00:54:06,360 --> 00:54:08,960
Speaker 1: my ethos and businesses. I it's not just helping my

971
00:54:09,040 --> 00:54:12,440
Speaker 1: clients go, it's helping the people that are working for me,

972
00:54:12,480 --> 00:54:16,080
Speaker 1: are working alongside me grow. I think there's no greater satisfaction.

973
00:54:16,120 --> 00:54:19,600
Speaker 1: And you know, whether it's within my company or you know,

974
00:54:20,040 --> 00:54:22,520
Speaker 1: you know, helping them grow their wings to where they're

975
00:54:22,520 --> 00:54:25,880
Speaker 1: an executive somewhere else and having tremendous success, Like I

976
00:54:26,040 --> 00:54:29,000
Speaker 1: value that. UM. But for me, the next eight to

977
00:54:29,080 --> 00:54:32,160
Speaker 1: ten years is just see where the industry evolves into.

978
00:54:32,640 --> 00:54:35,600
Speaker 1: Look at n I L being introduced. UM. You know,

979
00:54:35,640 --> 00:54:38,720
Speaker 1: I'm very big into sports science and investments in sports

980
00:54:38,719 --> 00:54:43,640
Speaker 1: science for athletes. UM. I think with technology that's going

981
00:54:43,680 --> 00:54:48,040
Speaker 1: to impact our industry tremendously like it has every other

982
00:54:48,120 --> 00:54:51,960
Speaker 1: sector of business and finance and in other areas. So

983
00:54:52,080 --> 00:54:56,440
Speaker 1: for me, it's the satisfaction I get. Honestly, Doug is

984
00:54:57,040 --> 00:54:59,720
Speaker 1: not going along with the status quo of how things

985
00:54:59,719 --> 00:55:03,160
Speaker 1: have always been. Is like, how can I disrupt a

986
00:55:03,200 --> 00:55:07,080
Speaker 1: business that people say is not scalable from a business

987
00:55:07,080 --> 00:55:09,920
Speaker 1: perspective because it's a service business, But how can I

988
00:55:09,960 --> 00:55:14,040
Speaker 1: introduce new technologies in a way that we've never seen

989
00:55:14,080 --> 00:55:17,520
Speaker 1: before because quite frankly, the business has been done the

990
00:55:17,600 --> 00:55:20,200
Speaker 1: same way from agents the last forty or fifty years,

991
00:55:20,200 --> 00:55:24,799
Speaker 1: starting with McCormick and I MG to where now if

992
00:55:24,840 --> 00:55:28,560
Speaker 1: you're I think wise and and um and diligent about

993
00:55:28,600 --> 00:55:31,719
Speaker 1: the technologies that you can integrate for clients in their

994
00:55:31,719 --> 00:55:34,600
Speaker 1: development off the court in terms of sports science, but

995
00:55:34,680 --> 00:55:37,319
Speaker 1: also on how we represent them, I think you know,

996
00:55:37,480 --> 00:55:39,759
Speaker 1: it can be interesting for the future because if you're

997
00:55:39,800 --> 00:55:42,840
Speaker 1: not adding value to your clients now because Dot we

998
00:55:42,880 --> 00:55:45,480
Speaker 1: haven't even talked about Like, look at the contracts these

999
00:55:45,480 --> 00:55:48,560
Speaker 1: guys are signing, right Uh. Steph Curry signed I think

1000
00:55:48,560 --> 00:55:52,799
Speaker 1: two oh seven on an extension over four years with

1001
00:55:52,880 --> 00:55:58,239
Speaker 1: the new media rights deal. Coming in in four is expiration.

1002
00:55:58,360 --> 00:56:01,960
Speaker 1: Seventy five billion dollars occur. It deals billion. And if

1003
00:56:02,000 --> 00:56:04,799
Speaker 1: we go back to when that influx of money came in,

1004
00:56:05,200 --> 00:56:09,120
Speaker 1: we saw the level of contracts how that was impacted, right,

1005
00:56:09,640 --> 00:56:14,920
Speaker 1: seventy billion, three times more. I did some projections. Rookie

1006
00:56:15,080 --> 00:56:18,000
Speaker 1: like Josh Primo could be eligible to sign probably an

1007
00:56:18,000 --> 00:56:21,400
Speaker 1: extension as a twenty one year old between two hundred

1008
00:56:21,440 --> 00:56:25,040
Speaker 1: and fifty and three hundred million dollars depending on it

1009
00:56:25,600 --> 00:56:29,680
Speaker 1: a Max or super Max player. Right. So for me,

1010
00:56:29,760 --> 00:56:33,520
Speaker 1: it's also looking into the future forecasting because now you're

1011
00:56:33,560 --> 00:56:37,240
Speaker 1: talking about athletes having their own family office and raise

1012
00:56:37,360 --> 00:56:41,239
Speaker 1: their level of sophistication to a whole different level. Uh,

1013
00:56:41,760 --> 00:56:45,000
Speaker 1: forget off the court earnings, just their on court earnings.

1014
00:56:45,040 --> 00:56:48,239
Speaker 1: So for me, it's also you know, how do you

1015
00:56:48,600 --> 00:56:53,520
Speaker 1: I'm not waiting until that happens. It's what mechanisms or

1016
00:56:53,560 --> 00:56:56,000
Speaker 1: what services can I put in place now to make

1017
00:56:56,040 --> 00:56:58,640
Speaker 1: sure that I could address all the needs of my

1018
00:56:58,719 --> 00:57:02,719
Speaker 1: clients in the future when they are earning that level

1019
00:57:02,719 --> 00:57:06,919
Speaker 1: of income. Uh, Todd, You've been so gracious with your time, dude,

1020
00:57:07,120 --> 00:57:11,960
Speaker 1: It's really really amazing. It's been good. I really appreciate it,

1021
00:57:12,160 --> 00:57:14,960
Speaker 1: let's do it in person. And I'm a fan of Primo,

1022
00:57:15,680 --> 00:57:17,920
Speaker 1: so I can't wait to see what he does this

1023
00:57:18,000 --> 00:57:20,959
Speaker 1: year in San Antonio in future years. And thanks again

1024
00:57:21,000 --> 00:57:23,600
Speaker 1: for joining us, and no, I appreciate it, Doc and

1025
00:57:23,920 --> 00:57:28,520
Speaker 1: look forward to the next time. Pretty amazing stuff, right,

1026
00:57:28,560 --> 00:57:33,080
Speaker 1: I mean, just the the ability at nineteen years old ago, like, hey,

1027
00:57:33,200 --> 00:57:35,520
Speaker 1: let me pivot and think about becoming an agent and

1028
00:57:35,520 --> 00:57:39,360
Speaker 1: then using the connections that you have established at U

1029
00:57:39,360 --> 00:57:42,040
Speaker 1: c l A to build really a business and then

1030
00:57:42,040 --> 00:57:44,400
Speaker 1: breaking out and building the business on your own, all

1031
00:57:44,400 --> 00:57:46,960
Speaker 1: those challenges all right in here. I thought you'd love that.

1032
00:57:47,520 --> 00:57:50,640
Speaker 1: And that's the type of guy who you will see

1033
00:57:51,200 --> 00:57:53,600
Speaker 1: whether you talked about being a super agent or you

1034
00:57:53,640 --> 00:57:56,000
Speaker 1: talk about evolving into a guy running a team. He

1035
00:57:56,040 --> 00:57:58,320
Speaker 1: has such a wherewithal and is so respected in the sport.

1036
00:57:58,360 --> 00:58:00,480
Speaker 1: I thought he'd just be a good listen, and he was.

1037
00:58:00,760 --> 00:58:02,360
Speaker 1: I'm I'm fast, and I want to grab him back

1038
00:58:02,360 --> 00:58:04,840
Speaker 1: and talk for another hour about other who guys that

1039
00:58:04,840 --> 00:58:07,640
Speaker 1: that he's discovered. In the meantime, remember The Doug Gotliep

1040
00:58:07,680 --> 00:58:10,120
Speaker 1: Show is daily three to six eastern twelve three Pacific.

1041
00:58:10,360 --> 00:58:13,200
Speaker 1: I Heart Radio, Fox Sports Radio app, I Heart Radio

1042
00:58:13,240 --> 00:58:16,200
Speaker 1: app etcetera, etcetera. Wherever you listen to our sports radio,

1043
00:58:16,280 --> 00:58:19,560
Speaker 1: we can also download that as a podcast. In the meantime,

1044
00:58:19,960 --> 00:58:23,120
Speaker 1: if you have questions, comments at gotleiep Show, Twitter or Instagram.

1045
00:58:23,160 --> 00:58:24,560
Speaker 1: The best way to get a hold of me. I'm

1046
00:58:24,600 --> 00:58:26,840
Speaker 1: Doug Gottlieban. This is all ball