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Speaker 1: What does recovery look like when it's not designed for you?

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Speaker 1: I'm doctor Zga Harrison, and in season four of Unaddictioned podcast,

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Speaker 1: we're featuring black and brown guests sharing their journeys through

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Speaker 1: the unique barriers to recovery shaped.

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Speaker 2: By their identities.

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Speaker 1: These guests have not only defined recovery on their terms,

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Speaker 1: but they're also creating pathways and communities that can help

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Speaker 1: you or a loved one find recovery too. Today I

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Speaker 1: was honored to speak with James Beard Award winner Chef

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Speaker 1: Gregory Gorday. Chef Gregory gave us a detailed timeline of

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Speaker 1: his nine years in active addiction while he was trying

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Speaker 1: to establish himself in the food and beverage industry. It

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Speaker 1: was at work in a roch infested kitchen in Portland, Oregon,

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Speaker 1: where Chef Gregory first considered the possibility of recovery. This

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Speaker 1: was after his sioux chef mentioned that he had two years.

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Speaker 1: We uncovered conversations around black excellence, the pressures of the

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Speaker 1: immigrant experience, and the importance of sharing your truth with

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Speaker 1: substance use and recovery. Chef Gregory is an active member

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Speaker 1: of Ben's Friends, which provides a sober community to hospitality

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Speaker 1: workers who are struggling with substance use and addiction across

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Speaker 1: the US. And with that said, if you have a

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Speaker 1: truth to share about your addiction or recovery journey, we

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Speaker 1: would love to hear from you. Send us an email

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Speaker 1: or voicemail. You can find our email address and our

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Speaker 1: phone number in the episode notes. Okay, welcome to the

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Speaker 1: un Addiction Podcast. We have been trying to get this

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Speaker 1: going for a long time, so I appreciate you so much.

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Speaker 2: For making it.

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Speaker 3: Oh thanks, thanks for having me, And I'll just clue.

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Speaker 1: The listeners in, like listen. We just had twenty minutes

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Speaker 1: of tech problems. But neither me, nor Chef nor Jada

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Speaker 1: agreed to be defeated by technology.

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Speaker 2: This morning, so weird here.

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Speaker 1: Okay, I'll give you a short intro. I'm doctor Anthon Harrison.

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Speaker 1: I'm a psychiatrist. I specialize in caring for people that

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Speaker 1: have addiction. I recently wrote a book recently, meaning January

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Speaker 1: twenty twenty four, so soon I'll have to stop saying recently.

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Speaker 1: But it's called an Addiction, and it's laying out a

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Speaker 1: new framework for understanding what our risk factors for addiction are.

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Speaker 1: And really the subtitle is six mind changing Conversations that

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Speaker 1: Could Save a life. And so the point of the

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Speaker 1: Unaddictioned podcast, which we're currently on is to really talk

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Speaker 1: to people who have had their own experience with addiction,

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Speaker 1: who are living their own journey of recovery, and just

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Speaker 1: hear all of the million different experiences with addiction and

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Speaker 1: recovery so that maybe somebody listening recognizes a piece of

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Speaker 1: your experience and says, huh, that feels like what I'm

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Speaker 1: going through, what I went through, Oh, I want to

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Speaker 1: try what he's trying.

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Speaker 2: Just giving people tools. So that's why we're here.

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Speaker 1: All right, So can we start with I always ask

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Speaker 1: this very like I'm a psychiatrist question with letting our

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Speaker 1: listeners know who is chef Gregory Gorda.

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Speaker 4: That's a broad question, I know, right me.

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Speaker 3: Well, I think, first and foremost, I am a person in.

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Speaker 4: Recovery and.

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Speaker 3: I wear that badge very proudly, and it's taking some

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Speaker 3: time to get there, but here we are. You know,

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Speaker 3: I'm a very passionate person. I'm a creative, I'm an artist,

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Speaker 3: I'm an athlete. I am a leader, I am a mentor,

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Speaker 3: I'm a mentee, a lot of things, and I'm just

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Speaker 3: very happy to be here on earth and trying to

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Speaker 3: be the best person I can be and surround myself

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Speaker 3: with good people and.

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Speaker 4: Cooking along the way.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I love all of that so much because this

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Speaker 1: is like one of my biggest soapboxes is language militant

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Speaker 1: and so I you know, I grew up celebrating Kwansa

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Speaker 1: and the second principle of quansas kuji chagaliya name yourself,

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Speaker 1: speak for yourself, to find yourself instead of being name

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Speaker 1: spoken for and defined by others. And so I fully

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Speaker 1: respect how people refer to themselves, but I never refer

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Speaker 1: to anybody who has experienced addiction experienced addiction as an addict,

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Speaker 1: because it gives the idea that that's the only thing. Right,

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Speaker 1: Like I'm gonna say, tell the listeners who chef Greg

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Speaker 1: gre Gordat is and you're gonna be like addict, you

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Speaker 1: were like person and recovery mentor, coach, athlete, passionate leader,

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Speaker 1: mentee chef, Right, And that's really the truth. It is

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Speaker 1: one aspect of your life experience, but it is not

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Speaker 1: the only aspect that is defining. So you mentioned I'm

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Speaker 1: where this pet bad person in recovery proudly, but it

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Speaker 1: took me a bit.

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Speaker 2: To get there.

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Speaker 1: Can you talk about the journey to get to out

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Speaker 1: loud and proud in recovery?

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Speaker 4: Absolutely?

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Speaker 3: You know, I mean I think for me, you know,

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Speaker 3: we unenter recovery because we grow tired of the life

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Speaker 3: that we're living, you know, the life of lives, the

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Speaker 3: life of shame.

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Speaker 4: You know, the life of getting fired, the life of.

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Speaker 3: Having to move, you know, not having resources, not having money,

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Speaker 3: you know, the life of being irresponsible. And we leave

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Speaker 3: that life in search of something better, but with it

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Speaker 3: comes a lot of shame.

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Speaker 4: You know.

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Speaker 3: I was an active addiction for about nine years, so

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Speaker 3: there it took quite some time to unpack all of that.

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Speaker 4: You know, I think seven years of that was bad,

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Speaker 4: and two years of that was very, very bad. It

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Speaker 4: took two years.

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Speaker 3: From rehab to my first true AA meeting to really

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Speaker 3: finally get sober and start seeing things the right way.

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Speaker 3: But you know, I'm someone who got sober in AA,

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Speaker 3: sober from alcohol in AA, and it took some time.

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Speaker 4: You know, I made a lot of mistakes. You know,

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Speaker 4: I hurt a lot of people.

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Speaker 3: I missed really important events for my family, and you know,

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Speaker 3: I often say because I have the life that I

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Speaker 3: have today and because I'm so driven and motivated and passionate,

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Speaker 3: because I know that, you know, my life is so

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Speaker 3: much better in recovery that I don't know if I

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Speaker 3: would have it any other way. But there are still

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Speaker 3: things I regret because you know, I missed my sister's wedding,

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Speaker 3: you know, like I went out the night before. You know,

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Speaker 3: it's like things like that where you will always regret that.

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Speaker 3: You know, we have a very strong relationship today, but

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Speaker 3: at the same time, there are moments where you know.

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Speaker 4: It takes some time. It definitely takes some time.

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Speaker 3: And from the first time you raise your hand in

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Speaker 3: a meeting and say I am an alcoholic or I

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Speaker 3: am an addict. You know, I remember that day at

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Speaker 3: my voice cracked, you know, and it was the first

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Speaker 3: that I said to that I meant it. And now

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Speaker 3: I send someone in recovery. You know, I've I'm living

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Speaker 3: my truth. You know, I'm healthy, I'm happy. You know,

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Speaker 3: life is still life. You know, life is still not hard.

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Speaker 3: I still have to make day decisions which affect a

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Speaker 3: lot of people and affect my future. But I have

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Speaker 3: clarity now, you know, and I feel like they make

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Speaker 3: those decisions more honestly.

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Speaker 4: So, Yes, you know, I.

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Speaker 3: Think speaking publicly about addiction and recovery has been very

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Speaker 3: very powerful as someone who again got sober in AA,

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Speaker 3: even though I know that's not the only program or

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Speaker 3: resource or way to recover. I know a has changed

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Speaker 3: or is changing, but you know, nominimity and you know

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Speaker 3: kind of like not really talking so much about the process.

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Speaker 3: You know, I think being vocal and being loud and

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Speaker 3: doing things like talking to you right now is extremely

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Speaker 3: important because this is how we communicate with each other.

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Speaker 3: And you know, I got sober because I saw a

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Speaker 3: bunch of sober chefs who are living their life. Was

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Speaker 3: them who draw me into something. I was like, you know,

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Speaker 3: you have something that I want and and I think

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Speaker 3: by us speaking and being vocal and living our truth

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Speaker 3: and showing that there's a way to live, we can

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Speaker 3: inspire people to kind of look for the roal to recovery.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I love it so much, And this is exactly

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Speaker 1: why we're doing this podcast. Right, Like, I'm gonna double

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Speaker 1: down on this recent sentence you just said, I got

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Speaker 1: sober because I saw a lot of chefs sober living

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Speaker 1: a great life, right, I didn't say it exactly the

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Speaker 1: way you said it, but it's just kind of like

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Speaker 1: intor ship, Like if you can see it, you're like,

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Speaker 1: that could be for me. And the more we stay

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Speaker 1: quiet about the ability to take the first steps to

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Speaker 1: the path of recovery and define what an amazing life

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Speaker 1: looks like for you and have the support and community

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Speaker 1: and warm arms to wrap around you as you kind

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Speaker 1: of like go in pursuit of amazing for yourself, Like,

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Speaker 1: the more people can believe it is for me, because

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Speaker 1: a lot of active addiction comes with hopelessness, right, like,

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Speaker 1: like it doesn't feel like things could be any better.

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Speaker 1: You said you struggled in active addiction. Did you say

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Speaker 1: for nine years? Seven were bad, two were very bad.

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Speaker 4: Yeah.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I was thinking about the timeline, you know, And

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Speaker 3: you know, I remember the first day I.

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Speaker 4: Was late for work. You know, the first day I

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Speaker 4: was late for work, I woke up in a pool

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Speaker 4: of urine on my friend's couch after telling my boss

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Speaker 4: I wasn't going out.

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Speaker 3: And you know that day, I timestamped that day as

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Speaker 3: kind of really like the first time, you know, it

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Speaker 3: all became a problem. The end of my time in

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Speaker 3: New York was really a very very bad bottom.

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Speaker 4: You know, it's meth and.

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Speaker 3: That kind of you know, turned into me moving and

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Speaker 3: leaving and finally entering telling my parents how to cooking

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Speaker 3: and not call addiction, entering outpation rehab. But again, you know,

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Speaker 3: being the only person in my friend group or my

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Speaker 3: family to kind of fall into the perils of addiction,

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Speaker 3: I really had no kind of close resources or through

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Speaker 3: understanding of what it meant to be an addict or

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Speaker 3: what recovery would look like. So, you know, even my

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Speaker 3: friends were like, you know, you need to go to rehab,

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Speaker 3: or my employer of being like, you can't work for

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Speaker 3: unless you go to rehab, and then they're to rehab

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Speaker 3: and they're like, okay, cool, you're in rehab.

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Speaker 4: So you should be able to drink like us now.

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Speaker 3: Or you're in rehab, you know, so you should stop

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Speaker 3: doing drugs and you should just drink, you know, And

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Speaker 3: that's really not how it works. Of course, it's for everyone,

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Speaker 3: but that's really not how it works. And it took

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Speaker 3: some time, you know, you know, I left rehab early.

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Speaker 3: I did not by any means finish rehab, and I

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Speaker 3: followed up with two arrests. I got a DUI, and

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Speaker 3: of course I was, you know, forced to go to meetings.

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Speaker 3: But it took you know, a good year and a

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Speaker 3: half after leaving rehab and really kind of falling into

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Speaker 3: a very bad alcohol addiction.

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Speaker 4: At the end of it.

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Speaker 3: All that I finally moved to Portland, Oregon, and again

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Speaker 3: I moved.

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Speaker 4: I took a job.

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Speaker 3: I got fired within the first few weeks for not

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Speaker 3: showing up and I took another job at the smaller place,

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Speaker 3: and you know, I was, I was like feeling bad

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Speaker 3: on myself.

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Speaker 4: Was like the place, you know, hot roaches, it was small,

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Speaker 4: you know.

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Speaker 3: I was like, you know, like this is reminded me

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Speaker 3: of like working in New York City at some of

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Speaker 3: the worst places I've ever worked at.

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Speaker 4: But this is where I am in life, unfortunately.

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Speaker 3: But one of my first days there, my sous chef

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Speaker 3: he told me that he hadn't drank in two years.

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Speaker 3: And that was the first that was one of the

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Speaker 3: first things he told me, and it was the first

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Speaker 3: time it clicked to me. I was like, this is

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Speaker 3: I've I've never met anyone who hasn't drank in two years.

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Speaker 3: Is incredible, you know.

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Speaker 4: And that was a very powerful moment.

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Speaker 3: I tell that story quite a bit, because sometimes when

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Speaker 3: you hear something, you hear for the first time, even

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Speaker 3: though it's kind of been buzzing around, so, you know.

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Speaker 3: And this was a kid that was much younger than me,

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Speaker 3: much younger than me, half my age, you know. So

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Speaker 3: he would take me out and we would spend time

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Speaker 3: with his friends.

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Speaker 4: We you know, smoke.

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Speaker 3: Cigarettes and hang out on the porch, and you know,

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Speaker 3: that was it, you know, and I would leave them

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Speaker 3: and I would go to the bar, you know, and

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Speaker 3: for months and months and months, you know, same pattern,

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Speaker 3: and then and you know, series of events, you know,

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Speaker 3: like my bottom of my bottom that was in New

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Speaker 3: York City, but you know, this is all happening for

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Speaker 3: the Oregon and I just looked around and for the

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Speaker 3: first time, I was like, I, you know, my parents,

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Speaker 3: my friends are having children and buying houses, and I'm

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Speaker 3: getting drunk at the bar with you know, like young people.

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Speaker 3: This is not, you know, the life that I want.

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Speaker 3: And I asked that guy Tom, and his name was Tom.

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Speaker 3: I was like, Tom, I'm ready take me to an

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Speaker 3: a meeting room. And that was fifteen and a half

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Speaker 3: years ago, and I haven't had to look back, which

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Speaker 3: is very powerful. You know, so you know, you know,

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Speaker 3: I think some other very impactful life moments, you know,

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Speaker 3: because I've you know, been on TV, you know, like

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Speaker 3: and I've had to talk about who I am, you know,

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Speaker 3: as someone in recovery. You know, like every opportunity had

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Speaker 3: to be public. They helped me peel a ala or

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Speaker 3: I did a TED talk on recovery. I was asked

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Speaker 3: to do a TED talk, and I was like, I

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Speaker 3: wanted to be a very personal story. So really was

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Speaker 3: so I don't have to like memorize too much. I

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Speaker 3: was like, I wanted to be very personal so I

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Speaker 3: can just kind of talk about myself and not do

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Speaker 3: a bunch of research.

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Speaker 4: And it was an opportunity to again and talk about.

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Speaker 3: My recovery and to peel a beaver other layer and

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Speaker 3: tell people some of the stories I hadn't told anyone publicly,

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Speaker 3: you know, my deepest, darkest secrets, you know, that lived

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Speaker 3: in the shadows of my addiction, and that was extremely

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Speaker 3: powerful and freeing. And through that, you know, people from

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Speaker 3: all of a country were called me. My friend celebrated

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Speaker 3: ten years sober just last week, and I remember, I know,

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Speaker 3: and I remember when he called me.

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Speaker 4: You know, I didn't. I wasn't close with him. I

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Speaker 4: had never given my phone number.

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Speaker 3: He called me from across the country and he had

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Speaker 3: just gotten his fourth DUI and he's like, what do

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Speaker 3: I do?

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Speaker 4: And I was like, you need to go to a

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Speaker 4: and and he celebrated ten years sober just last week.

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Speaker 3: So you know, the power of us talking to each other,

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Speaker 3: of us, you know, being vocal, being present, being visible

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Speaker 3: is extremely important.

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Speaker 1: I felt the power in that moment when you were like,

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Speaker 1: I'm not in the right place. I'm in this small

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Speaker 1: restaurant with roaches and it's not right and it was

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Speaker 1: the right place.

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Speaker 2: For that God, for you right. That is so powerful.

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Speaker 2: So to your point about being visible.

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Speaker 1: Season four is dedicated to black and brown people and

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Speaker 1: recovery because, as we were doing seasons one, two, and three,

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Speaker 1: we're super intentional, like, I want people to see them well,

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Speaker 1: I guess hear themselves in this podcast, and so we

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Speaker 1: were being very intentional about trying to get quote all

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Speaker 1: different kinds of people right to show that quote all

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Speaker 1: different kinds of people have had addiction and have found

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Speaker 1: a path to recovery. And what I heard over and

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Speaker 1: over from our guests that identified as black with like

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Speaker 1: I didn't see black people in recovery. It was like

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Speaker 1: I didn't even know this is a thing. And I

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Speaker 1: rems Phil Rutherford's episode.

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Speaker 2: He said.

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Speaker 1: Someone took him to an AA meeting of black men

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Speaker 1: and like that was a pivotal moment where he was like, whoa,

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Speaker 1: this is for me and there are people you know

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Speaker 1: that like I can have this experience with or just

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Speaker 1: even just like you said, the message has been buzzing around,

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Speaker 1: but there's a moment at which you hear it.

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Speaker 2: And so.

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Speaker 1: As a black and brown person, do you think there's

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Speaker 1: anything particularly unique about your recovery experience or about finding

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Speaker 1: the path to recovery that comes from that part of

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Speaker 1: your identity?

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Speaker 4: Yeah, I mean I.

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Speaker 3: Think for me, if anything gets inspired me to work

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Speaker 3: harder on my recovery, you know, I think, you know,

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Speaker 3: it's it's it's. This is a really interesting and great

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Speaker 3: question because when we think about black eccel and black success,

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Speaker 3: you know, recovery is a huge part of that for me,

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Speaker 3: you know, so it has forced me to work even harder, I.

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Speaker 4: Think, to achieve the things that I have been able

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Speaker 4: to achieve.

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Speaker 3: And you know, like I don't want to be a statistic,

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Speaker 3: you know, because society wants us to be statistics.

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Speaker 4: You know.

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Speaker 3: So for me, you know, you know again to have

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Speaker 3: parents that are immigrants, immigrants from Haiti, who has you know,

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Speaker 3: who have had you know, the patient people have a

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Speaker 3: very bad publicity, you know, like it's been one under

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Speaker 3: challenging you know, in Haiti.

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Speaker 4: But at the same time, you know, media has not

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Speaker 4: been kind to Haiti.

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Speaker 3: So to have that parents who worked multiple jobs to

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Speaker 3: revived from my sister and I and for me to

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Speaker 3: kind of squander all those opportunities and you know, end

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Speaker 3: up in this place of addiction, which I inflicted upon

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Speaker 3: myself through constant drug and alcohol abuse.

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Speaker 4: You know. So it really kind of wanted me to

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Speaker 4: work harder to just be.

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Speaker 3: A representation of black excellence, black success because I do

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Speaker 3: feel that responsibility and I want to show people that

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Speaker 3: we can't overcome any hardship.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I love that, and I love this idea because

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Speaker 1: black excellence and black success hangs over all of us.

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Speaker 2: Right, we were kind of like out here.

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Speaker 1: And then the fall from grace if you fall is

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Speaker 1: even a bigger deal because it exactly, like you said,

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Speaker 1: an example of what black and brown people cannot be

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Speaker 1: knowing black and brown people can be all the things

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Speaker 1: because hello, and so I love this idea of being

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Speaker 1: able to be so out loud and so proud about

349
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Speaker 1: having navigated the experience of addiction and currently navigating the

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Speaker 1: experience of recovery in a way that is part of

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Speaker 1: black excellence, right, Like I guess, just like the resilience

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00:19:18,400 --> 00:19:22,760
Speaker 1: through generational trauma, and like you said, they're an additional

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Speaker 1: You're kind to say the media has not been kind.

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Speaker 1: That's like a very way to find way to put it,

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Speaker 1: the way we have treated the narratives and the stories

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Speaker 1: of people.

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Speaker 2: From Adi as a barony, as a baron.

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Speaker 1: And so I want to go back to this because

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Speaker 1: I think it's a universal experience and I think it

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Speaker 1: probably has some unique additional elements for black people and

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Speaker 1: some unique additional elements for black and brown immigrants to

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Speaker 1: this country.

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Speaker 2: Which is telling your parents, right.

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Speaker 1: So can you talk to talk to us about the

365
00:20:02,640 --> 00:20:08,000
Speaker 1: space between deciding I'm going to tell my parents about

366
00:20:08,080 --> 00:20:12,520
Speaker 1: this addiction and kind of like what you went through

367
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Speaker 1: to the point you actually told them, if this is

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Speaker 1: not too vulnerable of a question, what it was like after.

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Speaker 4: No, I mean for me, God, God, bless my parents.

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Speaker 3: They have in support of you know, my entire life,

371
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Speaker 3: my entire career, and you know, part of you know,

372
00:20:29,440 --> 00:20:31,720
Speaker 3: my my journey now is giving back to them so

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Speaker 3: they can they'll spend their last twenty years on this earth,

374
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Speaker 3: you know, in peace. But you know, it's it's it's

375
00:20:40,359 --> 00:20:43,880
Speaker 3: odd because the opportunities that they offered me in pursuit

376
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Speaker 3: of education and pursuit of a better life, you know,

377
00:20:46,720 --> 00:20:48,320
Speaker 3: expose me to a lot of different things.

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Speaker 4: You know, like my father grew up in Haiti with

379
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Speaker 4: no running water or electricity.

380
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Speaker 3: You know, I grew up in New York City in

381
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Speaker 3: the nineties, you know, at the height of club culture,

382
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Speaker 3: you know, at the height of designer drugs.

383
00:21:01,840 --> 00:21:04,040
Speaker 4: So you know, I I went to.

384
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Speaker 3: Private school, and you know, and it was kind of

385
00:21:07,280 --> 00:21:11,280
Speaker 3: like reverse you know, diversity because I grew up in

386
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Speaker 3: a very Caribbean African American Haitian neighborhood and you know,

387
00:21:16,880 --> 00:21:19,080
Speaker 3: I was I went to a boarding school in Delaware

388
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Speaker 3: and I was only black male in my class.

389
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Speaker 4: You know, so it was a wonderful experience.

390
00:21:26,240 --> 00:21:28,520
Speaker 3: But you know, I started experimenting and you know, I

391
00:21:28,560 --> 00:21:30,919
Speaker 3: got suspended it from high school very early sophomore year,

392
00:21:30,960 --> 00:21:34,040
Speaker 3: I got to spend for you know, smoking marijuana. You know,

393
00:21:34,119 --> 00:21:37,119
Speaker 3: so it was an early start at that. You know,

394
00:21:37,160 --> 00:21:40,080
Speaker 3: that trickled over time. And you know, so my parents

395
00:21:40,080 --> 00:21:42,120
Speaker 3: are not surprised, you know, like i'd be Mom and Dad,

396
00:21:42,119 --> 00:21:44,399
Speaker 3: I need to move back in with you, you know,

397
00:21:44,680 --> 00:21:46,760
Speaker 3: like in the middle of working in New York City,

398
00:21:46,800 --> 00:21:48,480
Speaker 3: and you know, they just took me in without a

399
00:21:48,480 --> 00:21:51,080
Speaker 3: lot of questions or a I don't work there anymore.

400
00:21:51,320 --> 00:21:53,959
Speaker 3: You know, they accepted it without a lot of questions.

401
00:21:54,040 --> 00:21:55,919
Speaker 3: Can you help me move to hear you know, like

402
00:21:56,000 --> 00:21:59,120
Speaker 3: they accept it without many questions. You know, don't call

403
00:21:59,119 --> 00:22:01,840
Speaker 3: home for three days, you know, they start asking questions.

404
00:22:01,960 --> 00:22:04,879
Speaker 3: You know, Sunday dinner, my mom cooks all day. I

405
00:22:04,920 --> 00:22:06,359
Speaker 3: eat and I fall asleep. I'm the couch.

406
00:22:06,480 --> 00:22:08,360
Speaker 4: You know. They think I'm just tired from work, but

407
00:22:08,480 --> 00:22:11,400
Speaker 4: there is some suspicion, you know. So it was bubbling.

408
00:22:11,440 --> 00:22:14,800
Speaker 3: It was bubbling for quite some time, you know, And

409
00:22:14,840 --> 00:22:18,320
Speaker 3: I mean I'm grateful that I was ready to at

410
00:22:18,400 --> 00:22:21,240
Speaker 3: least accept that I had an addiction issue when I did,

411
00:22:21,440 --> 00:22:22,800
Speaker 3: you know, and even though I didn't.

412
00:22:22,680 --> 00:22:26,240
Speaker 4: Understand recovery, I didn't understand rehab. None of my friends did.

413
00:22:26,320 --> 00:22:28,280
Speaker 3: At least I knew that I was an addict and

414
00:22:28,280 --> 00:22:31,120
Speaker 3: an alcoholic and I could say that, and I told them,

415
00:22:31,200 --> 00:22:33,520
Speaker 3: you know, that was a very very easy decision.

416
00:22:33,920 --> 00:22:36,679
Speaker 4: You know. It was like I was laid forward again.

417
00:22:36,920 --> 00:22:38,919
Speaker 3: And my friend and my boss at the time, was like,

418
00:22:38,920 --> 00:22:40,320
Speaker 3: you can't work for unless you go to rehab.

419
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Speaker 4: And I was like, you're right, you know, And it

420
00:22:42,560 --> 00:22:45,080
Speaker 4: was very easy. Mom and dad, I'm addicted cooking alchol

421
00:22:45,400 --> 00:22:46,479
Speaker 4: I need to go to rehab.

422
00:22:46,760 --> 00:22:52,920
Speaker 3: I've done my research. I'm going here. So they were

423
00:22:53,440 --> 00:22:55,240
Speaker 3: not that surprised.

424
00:22:54,800 --> 00:22:58,359
Speaker 4: You know. And I think, you know, for them, you know, having.

425
00:22:58,119 --> 00:23:00,800
Speaker 3: Never done drugs or alcohol and growing up completely and

426
00:23:00,880 --> 00:23:03,920
Speaker 3: I have, they also had no understanding of what to do.

427
00:23:04,040 --> 00:23:09,560
Speaker 3: They were just supported, so you know, you know, me

428
00:23:09,720 --> 00:23:12,600
Speaker 3: moving across the country leaving rehab, you know, they let me,

429
00:23:12,840 --> 00:23:17,560
Speaker 3: you know, but they had major concerns, huge concerns, you know.

430
00:23:18,160 --> 00:23:21,239
Speaker 3: And in the end of the day, you know, that

431
00:23:21,480 --> 00:23:23,840
Speaker 3: same year I got arrested twice, I got a duy

432
00:23:24,119 --> 00:23:29,239
Speaker 3: I totable car, you know, But the next year I

433
00:23:29,280 --> 00:23:33,120
Speaker 3: got sober, you know, So it worked out and we're

434
00:23:33,160 --> 00:23:38,920
Speaker 3: all grateful, and you know, it's it's interesting.

435
00:23:38,480 --> 00:23:41,240
Speaker 4: Because I I.

436
00:23:40,280 --> 00:23:45,119
Speaker 3: I always give everyone a second chance because I used

437
00:23:45,119 --> 00:23:46,560
Speaker 3: my second chance, you know.

438
00:23:46,960 --> 00:23:50,160
Speaker 2: And fourth unlimited chances, you.

439
00:23:50,119 --> 00:23:53,760
Speaker 3: Know, yes, yes, yes, I mean yeah, I mean employees

440
00:23:53,800 --> 00:23:55,560
Speaker 3: are a little different, but well, I mean.

441
00:23:58,040 --> 00:24:00,680
Speaker 4: But yeah, but I mean, you know, I get it.

442
00:24:00,760 --> 00:24:02,240
Speaker 4: You know, it took me two years.

443
00:24:02,359 --> 00:24:05,239
Speaker 3: It took me two years sometimes to get sober, you know,

444
00:24:05,320 --> 00:24:09,800
Speaker 3: and so you know, I would consider you know, I.

445
00:24:09,720 --> 00:24:11,760
Speaker 4: Don't really have an alcohol.

446
00:24:11,320 --> 00:24:14,439
Speaker 3: Relapse in my story since hey hey, but yeah, it

447
00:24:14,480 --> 00:24:16,040
Speaker 3: takes people a lot of time.

448
00:24:16,119 --> 00:24:20,159
Speaker 4: And you know, this disease gets us in different ways,

449
00:24:20,240 --> 00:24:20,439
Speaker 4: you know.

450
00:24:21,200 --> 00:24:23,480
Speaker 3: So you have to be there for people, you have

451
00:24:23,520 --> 00:24:26,480
Speaker 3: to be vocal, you have to believe in them. But

452
00:24:26,520 --> 00:24:28,720
Speaker 3: also sometimes it's self love. You might have to cut

453
00:24:28,720 --> 00:24:32,879
Speaker 3: someone off, you know, like in the sad truth is,

454
00:24:33,440 --> 00:24:35,560
Speaker 3: some of us don't recover. You know, a lot of

455
00:24:35,640 --> 00:24:41,080
Speaker 3: us don't make it. And it's hard. You know, I

456
00:24:41,119 --> 00:24:42,959
Speaker 3: lose people every year to this addiction.

457
00:24:43,240 --> 00:24:46,160
Speaker 4: You know, that's pretty much.

458
00:24:46,440 --> 00:24:50,400
Speaker 3: If anyone my age who is still an active addiction,

459
00:24:50,960 --> 00:24:53,560
Speaker 3: I know it's going to be really really hard for them,

460
00:24:53,760 --> 00:24:57,560
Speaker 3: you know, because the body cannot do this for thirty years,

461
00:24:57,640 --> 00:25:00,959
Speaker 3: you know, for forty years, you know, it cannot cannot,

462
00:25:01,240 --> 00:25:02,000
Speaker 3: you know, So.

463
00:25:02,119 --> 00:25:04,840
Speaker 1: I want to bolster what you said with a few statistics,

464
00:25:05,080 --> 00:25:09,200
Speaker 1: and I want to magnify the beauty of your parents' response.

465
00:25:09,240 --> 00:25:12,679
Speaker 1: A lot of times, as parents, it is expected that

466
00:25:12,800 --> 00:25:16,040
Speaker 1: we have the answers, right, and you said my parents

467
00:25:16,080 --> 00:25:18,479
Speaker 1: didn't know what to do, what they were supportive, Like

468
00:25:18,640 --> 00:25:22,160
Speaker 1: that is legitimately all we need, right, like I don't

469
00:25:22,160 --> 00:25:24,440
Speaker 1: know what to do, but like, okay, if we need

470
00:25:24,440 --> 00:25:26,320
Speaker 1: to help figure this out, like, let us help figure

471
00:25:26,359 --> 00:25:26,760
Speaker 1: this out.

472
00:25:27,480 --> 00:25:30,200
Speaker 2: My hope is by having these conversations.

473
00:25:30,200 --> 00:25:33,399
Speaker 1: You also said your parents were not surprised, and so

474
00:25:33,720 --> 00:25:37,120
Speaker 1: probably when you came with this i'll call it revelation,

475
00:25:37,840 --> 00:25:41,879
Speaker 1: is a sense of relief, right, like we were we

476
00:25:41,960 --> 00:25:44,439
Speaker 1: knew it was something, and now we know what it

477
00:25:44,560 --> 00:25:46,879
Speaker 1: is and we're supportive, and it's a sense of relief

478
00:25:46,880 --> 00:25:49,520
Speaker 1: and let's figure it out. My hope is by having

479
00:25:49,520 --> 00:25:54,240
Speaker 1: these conversations that we start this cultural change i'll just

480
00:25:54,280 --> 00:25:55,399
Speaker 1: call it here in the US.

481
00:25:55,840 --> 00:26:00,120
Speaker 2: That makes it easier for parents to consider.

482
00:26:01,160 --> 00:26:04,520
Speaker 1: Maybe it's addiction, because our red flags go up very

483
00:26:04,560 --> 00:26:07,600
Speaker 1: early as parents, but it's very scary to consider the

484
00:26:07,680 --> 00:26:10,439
Speaker 1: idea that's maybe it's addiction and put that idea on

485
00:26:10,480 --> 00:26:15,240
Speaker 1: the table, and because we don't know what to do right,

486
00:26:15,640 --> 00:26:17,600
Speaker 1: so it's like you don't even have to know what

487
00:26:17,680 --> 00:26:20,119
Speaker 1: to do. It's just like put the idea on the

488
00:26:20,160 --> 00:26:23,040
Speaker 1: table and see if that's the idea. Maybe it plants

489
00:26:23,040 --> 00:26:26,640
Speaker 1: a seed. But the statistics I want to drop. You said,

490
00:26:26,680 --> 00:26:29,720
Speaker 1: everybody doesn't make it. Seventy five percent of people with

491
00:26:29,800 --> 00:26:33,320
Speaker 1: addiction consider themselves in recovery today. Twenty five percent is

492
00:26:33,359 --> 00:26:36,640
Speaker 1: a lot, and a big number of those twenty five

493
00:26:36,680 --> 00:26:40,000
Speaker 1: percent are not just an active addiction today, like people

494
00:26:40,080 --> 00:26:42,680
Speaker 1: are dying, which is why we have to have these

495
00:26:42,720 --> 00:26:46,639
Speaker 1: conversations earlier and earlier. It may sound to people like,

496
00:26:46,840 --> 00:26:51,439
Speaker 1: oh my god, nine years, seven years bad, two years

497
00:26:51,480 --> 00:26:57,800
Speaker 1: really bad. That is literally in the medical literature exactly

498
00:26:58,640 --> 00:27:02,640
Speaker 1: the timeframe people start using drugs from the point they

499
00:27:02,720 --> 00:27:07,520
Speaker 1: realize I'm struggling. It's usually five years of trying to

500
00:27:07,560 --> 00:27:11,480
Speaker 1: stop without telling anybody, and then they get to treatment

501
00:27:11,520 --> 00:27:13,600
Speaker 1: and it's usually an additional two.

502
00:27:13,400 --> 00:27:14,080
Speaker 2: To three years.

503
00:27:14,080 --> 00:27:16,879
Speaker 1: So like you said, across the country and then leaving

504
00:27:16,920 --> 00:27:21,840
Speaker 1: reading early, like when I say, your experience is the

505
00:27:22,080 --> 00:27:27,760
Speaker 1: classic experience of a severe addiction, and then by the

506
00:27:27,800 --> 00:27:30,640
Speaker 1: time you get to that one year off, we call

507
00:27:30,720 --> 00:27:34,119
Speaker 1: it remission in medicine, which is where risk starts to

508
00:27:34,160 --> 00:27:38,199
Speaker 1: significantly fall. People have been in the struggle twelve to

509
00:27:38,240 --> 00:27:42,760
Speaker 1: fifteen years, right, Like, this is your story, and what

510
00:27:42,960 --> 00:27:46,480
Speaker 1: can we do to shorten that five years that people

511
00:27:46,600 --> 00:27:49,800
Speaker 1: are struggling alone before they can reach out, to make

512
00:27:49,840 --> 00:27:53,360
Speaker 1: it easier to get to get people connected. I think

513
00:27:53,440 --> 00:27:55,800
Speaker 1: that's that's what you're doing by using your voice in

514
00:27:55,840 --> 00:27:56,280
Speaker 1: this way.

515
00:27:57,080 --> 00:28:01,159
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean, I think you know, generationally, I think

516
00:28:01,640 --> 00:28:04,120
Speaker 3: I'm not aware of this. Is this maybe you know them,

517
00:28:04,160 --> 00:28:09,399
Speaker 3: but generationally, to me, it seems that younger generations are,

518
00:28:09,920 --> 00:28:11,920
Speaker 3: you know, using less drugs and.

519
00:28:11,960 --> 00:28:13,600
Speaker 4: There might be less addiction issues.

520
00:28:13,800 --> 00:28:16,520
Speaker 3: Although like case in point, I spoke in my high

521
00:28:16,560 --> 00:28:19,760
Speaker 3: school graduated from thirty years ago and.

522
00:28:20,000 --> 00:28:23,680
Speaker 2: Hey in nineteen ninety four, I just year graduation.

523
00:28:23,800 --> 00:28:25,879
Speaker 4: Yeah yeah, that was a couple of week. Yeah, but

524
00:28:26,480 --> 00:28:28,439
Speaker 4: one year I was last year, last summer.

525
00:28:28,600 --> 00:28:30,600
Speaker 2: Oh okay, Oh yeah, so you're older than me.

526
00:28:30,760 --> 00:28:32,760
Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, one seems like one year.

527
00:28:33,160 --> 00:28:35,159
Speaker 1: Okay, I would like to go on the record that

528
00:28:35,240 --> 00:28:36,800
Speaker 1: I'm than chef CD recorded.

529
00:28:36,960 --> 00:28:40,200
Speaker 5: I'm just kidding, but yeah, but like you know, they

530
00:28:40,240 --> 00:28:42,760
Speaker 5: don't spoke, you know, like they don't drink on campus

531
00:28:42,800 --> 00:28:46,040
Speaker 5: and like I was embarrassed to tell them what we

532
00:28:46,040 --> 00:28:48,280
Speaker 5: were doing well at the school there, you know, But

533
00:28:48,600 --> 00:28:51,000
Speaker 5: at the same time, you know, they're you know, with

534
00:28:51,120 --> 00:28:51,959
Speaker 5: penol around.

535
00:28:52,160 --> 00:28:53,600
Speaker 4: You know, it's it's.

536
00:28:53,360 --> 00:28:57,320
Speaker 3: Extremely more dangerous these days, you know, for the group

537
00:28:57,360 --> 00:29:00,160
Speaker 3: of people who are are experimenting with drugs, you know,

538
00:29:00,560 --> 00:29:04,280
Speaker 3: and what is available these days, you know, so it's

539
00:29:04,320 --> 00:29:07,200
Speaker 3: like a double edged sword in a way, or you know,

540
00:29:07,240 --> 00:29:12,080
Speaker 3: it's like a give and take situation where maybe you know,

541
00:29:12,560 --> 00:29:16,600
Speaker 3: broad drug use and experimentation is is a little bit

542
00:29:16,680 --> 00:29:19,719
Speaker 3: less with general generations, which is great because they're more

543
00:29:19,760 --> 00:29:24,640
Speaker 3: self aware. You know, alcohol consumption is down generally across

544
00:29:25,320 --> 00:29:28,400
Speaker 3: many aspects of it, but there is still a lot

545
00:29:28,440 --> 00:29:32,840
Speaker 3: of danger that prevails. And you know, I think if

546
00:29:32,880 --> 00:29:36,280
Speaker 3: we can just keep talking about these topics and we

547
00:29:36,360 --> 00:29:40,320
Speaker 3: know that there are resources out and you know, with

548
00:29:40,480 --> 00:29:43,280
Speaker 3: the advent of you know, social media and and just

549
00:29:43,320 --> 00:29:46,240
Speaker 3: like more access to things more quickly, you know, I

550
00:29:46,280 --> 00:29:52,080
Speaker 3: think we can all realize notes of addiction trends that

551
00:29:52,160 --> 00:29:55,640
Speaker 3: might lead to addiction and and have us talking about

552
00:29:55,640 --> 00:29:56,880
Speaker 3: these conversations sooner.

553
00:29:58,840 --> 00:29:59,880
Speaker 4: I remember my.

554
00:29:59,800 --> 00:30:02,560
Speaker 3: Parents and saw me marijuana is a gateway drug. And

555
00:30:03,480 --> 00:30:07,520
Speaker 3: I was like sixteen fourteen, you know, and they're right.

556
00:30:07,720 --> 00:30:11,280
Speaker 3: You know, they were right, And so I think we

557
00:30:11,320 --> 00:30:13,760
Speaker 3: can have these conversations here, you know, and it's.

558
00:30:13,640 --> 00:30:15,920
Speaker 2: Important, you know, Yeah, spot on one.

559
00:30:16,320 --> 00:30:20,760
Speaker 1: Jessica Happy's episode just recently came out here on an addiction.

560
00:30:20,920 --> 00:30:23,160
Speaker 1: She wrote a book called First in the Family, which

561
00:30:23,200 --> 00:30:26,960
Speaker 1: is interesting because that's what she said about yourself, right, yeah,

562
00:30:26,960 --> 00:30:30,160
Speaker 1: also is me. Yeah, she also is daughter of immigrant

563
00:30:30,240 --> 00:30:36,000
Speaker 1: parents and she oh no, it's so good. Wait, oh yeah,

564
00:30:36,240 --> 00:30:38,520
Speaker 1: it's over there. It's over there on the other table.

565
00:30:38,560 --> 00:30:40,840
Speaker 1: I'll come show you the the cover of it. But

566
00:30:42,280 --> 00:30:44,280
Speaker 1: to your point that you just said, marijuana is the

567
00:30:44,320 --> 00:30:47,600
Speaker 1: gateway drug, and it really like I have thought about

568
00:30:47,600 --> 00:30:50,080
Speaker 1: her at least three times while you've been talking, because

569
00:30:50,120 --> 00:30:59,880
Speaker 1: she said the pressure of American excellence for an immigrant child,

570
00:31:00,240 --> 00:31:03,680
Speaker 1: right for the daughter of immigrants, was the gateway drug,

571
00:31:04,200 --> 00:31:06,640
Speaker 1: and it was like for her, it was kind of

572
00:31:06,800 --> 00:31:11,600
Speaker 1: she started drinking in response to kind of that pressure,

573
00:31:11,680 --> 00:31:14,320
Speaker 1: like we were talking about earlier black excellence and the

574
00:31:15,880 --> 00:31:18,720
Speaker 1: pressure of being the face and of all the all

575
00:31:18,720 --> 00:31:20,520
Speaker 1: the black people, and for her, for all.

576
00:31:20,400 --> 00:31:22,320
Speaker 2: Of the the Latina immigrants.

577
00:31:22,360 --> 00:31:24,120
Speaker 1: And when you went to boarding school and you were

578
00:31:24,120 --> 00:31:26,600
Speaker 1: the only black man and the whole male, in the

579
00:31:26,600 --> 00:31:28,640
Speaker 1: whole school, because you were still a child at that time,

580
00:31:28,720 --> 00:31:32,280
Speaker 1: not man, and kind of like, how how all of

581
00:31:32,320 --> 00:31:37,600
Speaker 1: that comes into the the risk factors that have you

582
00:31:37,680 --> 00:31:41,120
Speaker 1: take that first smoke of marijuana and what it feels

583
00:31:41,200 --> 00:31:43,320
Speaker 1: like when you get that first sense of calm, Because

584
00:31:43,400 --> 00:31:46,280
Speaker 1: drugs s feel good until they don't. Write like, yeah,

585
00:31:46,360 --> 00:31:48,760
Speaker 1: they help until they don't. They take the pressure off

586
00:31:48,840 --> 00:31:51,800
Speaker 1: until they don't. But Okay, I'm going to show you

587
00:31:51,800 --> 00:31:53,520
Speaker 1: this book cover before we get off of here, but

588
00:31:53,600 --> 00:31:55,480
Speaker 1: let's do a little bit of a pivot in our

589
00:31:55,600 --> 00:31:59,440
Speaker 1: last minutes here. We have this concept that we introduced

590
00:31:59,440 --> 00:32:02,360
Speaker 1: in the book, which is called the magic formula. The

591
00:32:02,400 --> 00:32:06,680
Speaker 1: magic formula says there are infinite number of paths to addiction,

592
00:32:07,240 --> 00:32:09,880
Speaker 1: so there have to be infinite number of paths to recovery.

593
00:32:09,880 --> 00:32:13,880
Speaker 1: And your recovery is yours, and your formula that you're

594
00:32:14,000 --> 00:32:17,440
Speaker 1: working to help keep yourself grounded in your definition of

595
00:32:17,480 --> 00:32:21,360
Speaker 1: recovery has lots of different pieces that will change over

596
00:32:21,400 --> 00:32:23,880
Speaker 1: time depending on what's going on in your life. Some

597
00:32:23,960 --> 00:32:26,880
Speaker 1: that will stay stable because they're the core. And so

598
00:32:27,000 --> 00:32:31,600
Speaker 1: if you had to think about what is your magic formula,

599
00:32:31,680 --> 00:32:36,320
Speaker 1: and we talk about biologically, we talk about psychologically, we

600
00:32:36,400 --> 00:32:39,360
Speaker 1: talk about community and culture and health and life meaning

601
00:32:39,440 --> 00:32:42,600
Speaker 1: and purpose, and all of this goes.

602
00:32:42,400 --> 00:32:43,800
Speaker 2: Into a magic formula.

603
00:32:43,840 --> 00:32:48,720
Speaker 1: What are the things that you're doing intentionally that make

604
00:32:48,800 --> 00:32:52,440
Speaker 1: up your magic formula because maybe somebody hears it and says,

605
00:32:52,520 --> 00:32:54,600
Speaker 1: you know what, I can put that in my formula.

606
00:32:55,560 --> 00:32:59,160
Speaker 3: You know, for me, I think longevity is something that's

607
00:32:59,240 --> 00:33:02,560
Speaker 3: really important to me. And you know, as in someone

608
00:33:02,920 --> 00:33:05,280
Speaker 3: as a middle aged person, you know, I you know,

609
00:33:05,800 --> 00:33:08,880
Speaker 3: I turn fifty next year. You know, I think being

610
00:33:08,960 --> 00:33:12,360
Speaker 3: cautious of my health is extremely important and take care

611
00:33:12,400 --> 00:33:15,320
Speaker 3: of my body is extremely important, and just being aware

612
00:33:15,320 --> 00:33:18,560
Speaker 3: of the natural aging process, you know, and being able

613
00:33:18,640 --> 00:33:21,120
Speaker 3: to kind of like look at you know, five year

614
00:33:21,200 --> 00:33:24,120
Speaker 3: stands where you know I felt healthy and strong and

615
00:33:24,160 --> 00:33:27,880
Speaker 3: life has been good, or times where I've been, you know,

616
00:33:28,040 --> 00:33:32,000
Speaker 3: needing surgery or overweight and life has been very challenging.

617
00:33:32,480 --> 00:33:32,640
Speaker 4: You know.

618
00:33:32,680 --> 00:33:35,480
Speaker 3: The thing is like once we recover, life does not stop.

619
00:33:35,600 --> 00:33:38,160
Speaker 3: Recovery is simply a way for us to deal with

620
00:33:38,200 --> 00:33:42,200
Speaker 3: life with a clear head because but all challenges of

621
00:33:42,240 --> 00:33:44,680
Speaker 3: life are still there. So for me, I know that

622
00:33:44,840 --> 00:33:46,840
Speaker 3: I want to be healthy, I want to be strong,

623
00:33:48,000 --> 00:33:50,080
Speaker 3: I want to feel good as I age, and I

624
00:33:50,080 --> 00:33:51,720
Speaker 3: want to take care of my body, you know, and

625
00:33:52,560 --> 00:33:57,080
Speaker 3: drugs and alcohol in a reckless use don't provide for

626
00:33:57,160 --> 00:33:58,120
Speaker 3: any of that, you know.

627
00:33:59,200 --> 00:34:02,200
Speaker 4: I think the seconds just general responsibility. You know. I

628
00:34:02,240 --> 00:34:06,880
Speaker 4: have so much to do, and why would I want

629
00:34:06,880 --> 00:34:08,319
Speaker 4: to wake up on over? You know.

630
00:34:08,880 --> 00:34:12,120
Speaker 3: I know that when I start drinking, I have no

631
00:34:12,239 --> 00:34:18,280
Speaker 3: control over how much I drink, you know, and that's

632
00:34:18,400 --> 00:34:21,120
Speaker 3: I just don't have time, you know, Like I have

633
00:34:22,440 --> 00:34:26,640
Speaker 3: eighty people, I'm responsible for their salary. You know, I

634
00:34:26,719 --> 00:34:31,399
Speaker 3: have two beautiful nieces that I need to be around for.

635
00:34:32,000 --> 00:34:35,319
Speaker 3: You know, I have aging parents that need me, you know.

636
00:34:35,960 --> 00:34:39,120
Speaker 3: So when I look at all I have today and

637
00:34:39,160 --> 00:34:41,880
Speaker 3: how integral I am to all these people's lives, and

638
00:34:41,920 --> 00:34:45,000
Speaker 3: how much joy they bring to my life, you know,

639
00:34:45,239 --> 00:34:48,120
Speaker 3: as an honest person, as someone who's there, someone who

640
00:34:48,160 --> 00:34:50,759
Speaker 3: can you know, get on a plane and see them

641
00:34:50,800 --> 00:34:52,960
Speaker 3: if I need to, as someone who can you know,

642
00:34:53,600 --> 00:34:57,880
Speaker 3: do like a you know, twenty minute FaceTime, and everyone

643
00:34:57,960 --> 00:35:01,200
Speaker 3: feels so much stronger and better. All these things are

644
00:35:01,320 --> 00:35:04,960
Speaker 3: really really important to me today, you know, more important

645
00:35:05,000 --> 00:35:07,880
Speaker 3: than any other kind of late night.

646
00:35:07,719 --> 00:35:09,320
Speaker 4: Activity ever made and felt.

647
00:35:09,960 --> 00:35:14,040
Speaker 3: And you know, take some maturity, but I see that,

648
00:35:14,160 --> 00:35:17,640
Speaker 3: and I'm super grateful. Yeah, and you know, just being

649
00:35:17,920 --> 00:35:20,120
Speaker 3: a leader. You know, it's something that's very important to me,

650
00:35:21,520 --> 00:35:24,319
Speaker 3: not because it's something that I want, but because it's

651
00:35:24,360 --> 00:35:27,800
Speaker 3: something that allows me to give back and it helps

652
00:35:27,840 --> 00:35:31,239
Speaker 3: others and that creates community, you know.

653
00:35:31,840 --> 00:35:37,560
Speaker 1: Yes, beautiful, beautiful. Okay, So we usually finished. I'm gonna

654
00:35:37,560 --> 00:35:40,040
Speaker 1: go grab this book. But while I grab the book,

655
00:35:40,040 --> 00:35:41,440
Speaker 1: I'm going to give you the last question.

656
00:35:41,520 --> 00:35:43,360
Speaker 4: You can be right, okay, Okay when I get that.

657
00:35:44,600 --> 00:35:45,560
Speaker 2: So I used to.

658
00:35:45,600 --> 00:35:48,839
Speaker 1: I started out four seasons asking everybody this exact question,

659
00:35:48,920 --> 00:35:52,880
Speaker 1: and then Flavor. Flav was basically like, I'm not answering

660
00:35:52,920 --> 00:35:55,040
Speaker 1: that question, and then I was like I changed the

661
00:35:55,120 --> 00:35:56,080
Speaker 1: question because he was right.

662
00:35:56,600 --> 00:35:58,520
Speaker 2: So I was like, you're right. Life.

663
00:35:58,840 --> 00:36:01,640
Speaker 1: So the name of the book is unaddictioned, a word

664
00:36:01,640 --> 00:36:04,239
Speaker 1: that we made up, and it was like, what stigma

665
00:36:04,440 --> 00:36:07,319
Speaker 1: do we what do we want people to unlearn about

666
00:36:07,360 --> 00:36:09,719
Speaker 1: addiction that they think they know but it's wrong.

667
00:36:09,520 --> 00:36:12,360
Speaker 2: And it's dangerous. What are the stigmas we want to

668
00:36:12,640 --> 00:36:15,600
Speaker 2: undo that are killing people?

669
00:36:16,080 --> 00:36:18,880
Speaker 1: And what are the conversations we want to uncover that

670
00:36:18,920 --> 00:36:21,680
Speaker 1: we think we can save a life? And Flave said,

671
00:36:22,680 --> 00:36:24,799
Speaker 1: I can't answer the first two, He's like, because once

672
00:36:24,840 --> 00:36:25,759
Speaker 1: you've done it, it's done.

673
00:36:25,800 --> 00:36:29,080
Speaker 2: You can't undo it. And I was like, word, So

674
00:36:29,200 --> 00:36:30,120
Speaker 2: I changed the question.

675
00:36:30,440 --> 00:36:33,520
Speaker 1: Rather than a behavior to undo, what is a new

676
00:36:33,560 --> 00:36:38,400
Speaker 1: behavior that we want and rather than a stigma to

677
00:36:39,080 --> 00:36:42,080
Speaker 1: or to something to unlearn? What is something new that

678
00:36:42,160 --> 00:36:44,920
Speaker 1: we want to learn? So my question is what is

679
00:36:45,000 --> 00:36:48,720
Speaker 1: something you want people to know about addiction?

680
00:36:49,360 --> 00:36:49,960
Speaker 2: What is.

681
00:36:51,320 --> 00:36:55,279
Speaker 1: Some stigma you want people to think differently about, or

682
00:36:55,280 --> 00:36:59,280
Speaker 1: what is some conversation you want us to be having

683
00:36:59,640 --> 00:37:02,239
Speaker 1: that do you think we'll save Blines? Okay, I'm We'll

684
00:37:02,280 --> 00:37:04,240
Speaker 1: get the book. I'll be back in thirty seconds.

685
00:37:04,800 --> 00:37:07,320
Speaker 4: Okay, am I thinking or my answering?

686
00:37:08,040 --> 00:37:12,239
Speaker 1: Okay, answer before I get back.

687
00:37:12,280 --> 00:37:13,719
Speaker 2: What kind of question is this?

688
00:37:15,200 --> 00:37:18,560
Speaker 1: God? Okay, here's the book, the first in the family

689
00:37:18,680 --> 00:37:23,240
Speaker 1: Jessica Happy all right, and the tagline says a story

690
00:37:23,320 --> 00:37:26,080
Speaker 1: of survival, recovery and the American dream.

691
00:37:26,760 --> 00:37:28,400
Speaker 2: It is Oh I'm telling you.

692
00:37:28,680 --> 00:37:31,080
Speaker 4: Yeah, Okay, purchase today.

693
00:37:31,560 --> 00:37:33,640
Speaker 2: Okay, Okay, you know.

694
00:37:33,960 --> 00:37:36,359
Speaker 3: I mean, I think one of the most important things

695
00:37:36,400 --> 00:37:40,520
Speaker 3: is understanding that addiction is a disease and that it

696
00:37:40,640 --> 00:37:45,880
Speaker 3: is a brain disease. He's correct me if that has changed,

697
00:37:45,920 --> 00:37:51,120
Speaker 3: but and that it takes treatment, and it takes a

698
00:37:51,160 --> 00:37:55,680
Speaker 3: lot of work. And it's also a lifelong disease. You know,

699
00:37:55,760 --> 00:37:59,880
Speaker 3: it does not go away, it gets managed. So I

700
00:38:00,160 --> 00:38:05,759
Speaker 3: think when we talk about disease management, health management, that

701
00:38:05,840 --> 00:38:08,920
Speaker 3: becomes a lifelong journey, and a lot of it is

702
00:38:09,000 --> 00:38:12,600
Speaker 3: very personal because the person living in that body is

703
00:38:12,640 --> 00:38:17,279
Speaker 3: the person that has to manage the cravings, manage dependings,

704
00:38:17,320 --> 00:38:21,640
Speaker 3: manage anxiety, manage trauma from the past, you know. So

705
00:38:21,840 --> 00:38:26,120
Speaker 3: that takes first self understanding and self awareness and be

706
00:38:26,600 --> 00:38:30,719
Speaker 3: that takes community resources. What meetings are you going to

707
00:38:31,880 --> 00:38:36,560
Speaker 3: Do you have a you know, therapist that you're talking

708
00:38:36,600 --> 00:38:40,760
Speaker 3: to about your addiction related life issues.

709
00:38:41,480 --> 00:38:43,840
Speaker 4: What resources in your network do you have? Are you

710
00:38:43,840 --> 00:38:45,360
Speaker 4: surrounded by people in recovery who.

711
00:38:45,200 --> 00:38:47,839
Speaker 3: Have the same kind of values and things that they're

712
00:38:47,840 --> 00:38:49,080
Speaker 3: working on to feel better?

713
00:38:50,239 --> 00:38:50,440
Speaker 4: You know?

714
00:38:50,680 --> 00:38:54,719
Speaker 6: I think we need to see this as a lifelong

715
00:38:54,760 --> 00:38:59,719
Speaker 6: disease that needs constant management management and that takes a

716
00:38:59,760 --> 00:39:01,640
Speaker 6: lot of firstal work, and that takes a lot.

717
00:39:01,480 --> 00:39:06,600
Speaker 2: Of New York boom, Mike dropped. This is this has

718
00:39:06,680 --> 00:39:09,479
Speaker 2: been amazing so much.

719
00:39:09,840 --> 00:39:12,120
Speaker 1: Yeah, we worked really hard to get here, and I'm

720
00:39:12,160 --> 00:39:14,200
Speaker 1: so glad that we got here.

721
00:39:14,280 --> 00:39:15,680
Speaker 2: This has been amazing.

722
00:39:16,960 --> 00:39:17,439
Speaker 4: So much.

723
00:39:19,480 --> 00:39:22,680
Speaker 1: I did just this morning by a Halloween costume for

724
00:39:22,840 --> 00:39:24,360
Speaker 1: my cat and it's a chef.

725
00:39:25,040 --> 00:39:26,080
Speaker 2: It's a little chef hat.

726
00:39:31,680 --> 00:39:33,840
Speaker 1: So he's the white cat is going to be a

727
00:39:33,880 --> 00:39:35,640
Speaker 1: little chef, and then the black cat.

728
00:39:35,480 --> 00:39:37,400
Speaker 2: Is going to be a bet I know, don't.

729
00:39:42,719 --> 00:39:48,400
Speaker 7: Yeah really quickly, Chef Gregory, can you I know that

730
00:39:48,440 --> 00:39:53,800
Speaker 7: you are really involved in Ben's Friends. I am curious

731
00:39:53,800 --> 00:39:56,479
Speaker 7: if you can just give us the four one one

732
00:39:56,680 --> 00:40:00,640
Speaker 7: on Ben's Friends. How people in the industry can find

733
00:40:00,840 --> 00:40:06,800
Speaker 7: resources or support if they're seeking to, you know, address

734
00:40:06,800 --> 00:40:11,920
Speaker 7: something to do with substances in the food and beverage industry.

735
00:40:12,040 --> 00:40:16,239
Speaker 7: And then how people can connect with you, how they

736
00:40:16,280 --> 00:40:20,080
Speaker 7: can I don't know, come to either any of your

737
00:40:20,120 --> 00:40:22,720
Speaker 7: restaurants or establishments.

738
00:40:23,280 --> 00:40:28,560
Speaker 3: Sure so, I am a leader and a local chapter

739
00:40:28,640 --> 00:40:32,600
Speaker 3: founder of Ben's Friends. Ben Sprints is a national recovery

740
00:40:32,600 --> 00:40:35,960
Speaker 3: group for people in the restaurant industry. So it's a

741
00:40:36,000 --> 00:40:41,520
Speaker 3: safe space for people who are chefs, servers, bartenders, wine makers,

742
00:40:41,600 --> 00:40:45,520
Speaker 3: anyone in putt in beverage space. And it is not

743
00:40:45,600 --> 00:40:49,160
Speaker 3: as structured as some other more traditional recovery programs, but

744
00:40:49,239 --> 00:40:51,720
Speaker 3: it is really just a needing safe space to talk

745
00:40:52,160 --> 00:40:58,760
Speaker 3: to discuss issues, maybe discuss issues that are specifically restaurant

746
00:40:58,800 --> 00:41:03,840
Speaker 3: and strut focused that do pertain to the service of alcohol,

747
00:41:04,120 --> 00:41:05,080
Speaker 3: et cetera.

748
00:41:07,400 --> 00:41:11,640
Speaker 4: And we all talk. You know, we meet on Zoom.

749
00:41:11,840 --> 00:41:14,880
Speaker 3: We meet every day at ten am Pacific time on

750
00:41:15,000 --> 00:41:16,479
Speaker 3: a PM Eastern time.

751
00:41:16,960 --> 00:41:18,319
Speaker 4: There's also subgroups.

752
00:41:18,640 --> 00:41:23,080
Speaker 3: There's Bench Friends, Women's Excuse Me fems, there's men's meetings.

753
00:41:23,080 --> 00:41:26,840
Speaker 3: There's been meetings. We also have kind of topics. So

754
00:41:27,360 --> 00:41:31,640
Speaker 3: there are local chapters in many many states around the country,

755
00:41:31,680 --> 00:41:36,279
Speaker 3: including Portland, Oregon, Charlotte, Austin, but we also meet nationwide

756
00:41:36,280 --> 00:41:36,760
Speaker 3: on Zoom.

757
00:41:37,080 --> 00:41:39,319
Speaker 4: It's actually a global meeting. We have people from all

758
00:41:39,320 --> 00:41:42,040
Speaker 4: over the world during that meeting as well, so.

759
00:41:43,840 --> 00:41:47,480
Speaker 3: Many many, many people have gone sober just through Ben's

760
00:41:47,480 --> 00:41:51,959
Speaker 3: friends and it's a really really safe space, so that's

761
00:41:51,960 --> 00:41:58,320
Speaker 3: really wonderful. You know, at my restaurant Con which is

762
00:41:58,320 --> 00:42:01,719
Speaker 3: a Haitey restaurant poland Oregon Soul, which is our bar

763
00:42:01,840 --> 00:42:05,279
Speaker 3: beneath our restaurant con, we also offer tons of zer

764
00:42:05,320 --> 00:42:10,360
Speaker 3: group options so you can enjoy and ivibe.

765
00:42:10,400 --> 00:42:11,319
Speaker 2: That are really good.

766
00:42:11,400 --> 00:42:16,440
Speaker 7: By the way, yes, so good, so artistic. It's not

767
00:42:16,719 --> 00:42:19,800
Speaker 7: just like lemonade and tea.

768
00:42:20,560 --> 00:42:21,200
Speaker 4: Gets incredible.

769
00:42:22,160 --> 00:42:26,640
Speaker 3: Yeah, so you know it's it's great. We have tons

770
00:42:26,680 --> 00:42:29,640
Speaker 3: of sober folks who are in our restaurant bar. One

771
00:42:29,640 --> 00:42:32,919
Speaker 3: of our bar leads she's actually sober as well, so

772
00:42:34,080 --> 00:42:36,000
Speaker 3: you know that that perspective is there.

773
00:42:36,680 --> 00:42:39,040
Speaker 4: So yeah, you can find me anywhere of those places.

774
00:42:39,960 --> 00:42:40,480
Speaker 2: Amazing.

775
00:42:40,560 --> 00:42:44,000
Speaker 7: Thank you for listeners. We'll put all of the links

776
00:42:44,000 --> 00:42:46,120
Speaker 7: and information in the show notes. I know that you

777
00:42:46,239 --> 00:42:48,200
Speaker 7: have to get to you might have to get to

778
00:42:48,239 --> 00:42:50,239
Speaker 7: a meeting right now, So thank you.

779
00:42:50,320 --> 00:42:52,040
Speaker 4: Okay, thank you so much.

780
00:42:52,239 --> 00:42:53,479
Speaker 2: Gratitude so good.

781
00:42:54,760 --> 00:42:59,279
Speaker 1: Okay, thank you so much for tuning in. And if

782
00:42:59,320 --> 00:43:01,840
Speaker 1: you like this episo, so please check out my book

783
00:43:02,080 --> 00:43:06,920
Speaker 1: An Addiction Six Mind Changing Conversations that Could Save a Life,

784
00:43:07,160 --> 00:43:12,279
Speaker 1: available at Barnes and Noble, Bookshop dot Org, Union Squaring Company, Amazon,

785
00:43:12,680 --> 00:43:14,080
Speaker 1: and wherever books are sold.

786
00:43:14,600 --> 00:43:15,759
Speaker 2: We want to hear from you.

787
00:43:16,239 --> 00:43:19,040
Speaker 1: If you identify as black or brown and have a

788
00:43:19,080 --> 00:43:22,880
Speaker 1: recovery story to share, something you've learned, a stigma that

789
00:43:22,920 --> 00:43:26,680
Speaker 1: you've undone, or a conversation that you've had about addiction.

790
00:43:27,200 --> 00:43:32,360
Speaker 1: Send us a voicemail at speakpipe dot com, slash uapod

791
00:43:33,040 --> 00:43:39,560
Speaker 1: that's speak pipe dot com, slash you a pod