WEBVTT - Whine About It: Ride or Die

0:00:01.960 --> 0:00:07.360
<v Speaker 1>Wind down with Janet Kramer an I'mheart Radio podcast. All right,

0:00:07.440 --> 0:00:10.800
<v Speaker 1>this line about it. We have Laura Tremaine. So she

0:00:10.840 --> 0:00:13.239
<v Speaker 1>grew up in Oklahoma. She moved to Los Angeles when

0:00:13.280 --> 0:00:14.960
<v Speaker 1>she was twenty two years old. So she's worked in

0:00:15.000 --> 0:00:19.480
<v Speaker 1>film television production for many years, MTV, VH one, Fox,

0:00:19.520 --> 0:00:22.840
<v Speaker 1>Paramount Pictures, but now she is full time writing. She

0:00:23.000 --> 0:00:26.640
<v Speaker 1>has shared a lot about her life with anxiety, mother,

0:00:26.680 --> 0:00:30.000
<v Speaker 1>had a marriage. She has a podcast as well, but

0:00:30.920 --> 0:00:33.120
<v Speaker 1>right now she's got a book out called The Life Council,

0:00:33.800 --> 0:00:36.680
<v Speaker 1>Ten Friends every Woman Needs. There's a lot of times

0:00:36.760 --> 0:00:40.040
<v Speaker 1>I get questions about friendships, frind breakup. So let's dive

0:00:40.080 --> 0:00:42.199
<v Speaker 1>in with Laura tremain. How are you?

0:00:42.920 --> 0:00:45.920
<v Speaker 2>I'm good? How are you look? We both have neon

0:00:46.040 --> 0:00:46.559
<v Speaker 2>behind us.

0:00:46.560 --> 0:00:47.800
<v Speaker 1>Our signs? What's your sign?

0:00:47.840 --> 0:00:50.519
<v Speaker 2>Say? It says share your stuff. It's kind of hard

0:00:50.560 --> 0:00:51.080
<v Speaker 2>to see on the.

0:00:51.320 --> 0:00:54.680
<v Speaker 1>Oh, yep, there it is. You Do you share your stuff?

0:00:54.720 --> 0:00:55.800
<v Speaker 1>You like sharing your stuff?

0:00:56.960 --> 0:00:58.240
<v Speaker 2>I mean I've made a career of it.

0:00:58.680 --> 0:01:04.720
<v Speaker 1>Same girl. What's the downside for you of sharing your stuff?

0:01:05.080 --> 0:01:07.559
<v Speaker 1>I'm curious, like we're because I have some.

0:01:08.880 --> 0:01:14.080
<v Speaker 2>I mean there's a few. The obvious one would be relational,

0:01:14.240 --> 0:01:17.400
<v Speaker 2>like with people in my real life. Of like, there

0:01:18.160 --> 0:01:20.679
<v Speaker 2>I attract people in my real life who are the

0:01:20.720 --> 0:01:26.039
<v Speaker 2>opposite of sharers, and so they don't love that I

0:01:26.040 --> 0:01:27.520
<v Speaker 2>share my stuff. Even though I try to be very

0:01:27.560 --> 0:01:31.680
<v Speaker 2>mindful and respectful of that, it's still it's tricky. And

0:01:31.720 --> 0:01:34.000
<v Speaker 2>then the other part, the second hardest part, I think

0:01:34.040 --> 0:01:35.960
<v Speaker 2>would be because I've been doing this for so long

0:01:37.040 --> 0:01:40.920
<v Speaker 2>that when you change, you change your mind on something,

0:01:41.400 --> 0:01:47.000
<v Speaker 2>you change the way you believe, the way you vote

0:01:47.240 --> 0:01:49.800
<v Speaker 2>a take you might have had ten years ago. When

0:01:49.840 --> 0:01:54.520
<v Speaker 2>that changes, it's harder to walk it through because what

0:01:54.600 --> 0:01:56.880
<v Speaker 2>makes sense to you in your spirit or even would

0:01:56.880 --> 0:01:59.800
<v Speaker 2>make sense to people in your real life. People online

0:01:59.800 --> 0:02:02.000
<v Speaker 2>are whatever, have not followed all the dots, you know

0:02:02.000 --> 0:02:04.400
<v Speaker 2>what I mean. So it's just like and nor do

0:02:04.520 --> 0:02:06.440
<v Speaker 2>they have to, but like it's just harder to unpack

0:02:06.480 --> 0:02:07.000
<v Speaker 2>a little bit.

0:02:07.160 --> 0:02:09.880
<v Speaker 1>Why do you think you attract more people that are

0:02:09.919 --> 0:02:14.160
<v Speaker 1>private like relationally? Because it's interesting because I when I

0:02:14.200 --> 0:02:17.320
<v Speaker 1>was dating post divorce, a lot of the people that

0:02:17.639 --> 0:02:21.040
<v Speaker 1>were very like, very private, like they just they wanted

0:02:21.040 --> 0:02:24.720
<v Speaker 1>to stay private. They relationally wanted to stay private like

0:02:25.120 --> 0:02:28.000
<v Speaker 1>you know, And I was like, this is interesting that

0:02:28.040 --> 0:02:29.440
<v Speaker 1>I keep picking the same person.

0:02:31.840 --> 0:02:33.720
<v Speaker 2>I mean, I like, is the is it dumb to

0:02:33.720 --> 0:02:37.359
<v Speaker 2>say opposites attract I honestly think my first instinct when

0:02:37.360 --> 0:02:39.040
<v Speaker 2>you asked that question, I always try to go with

0:02:39.080 --> 0:02:41.920
<v Speaker 2>my kind of gut instinct is not that I'm necessarily

0:02:41.919 --> 0:02:44.960
<v Speaker 2>attracted to private people. It's that private people are very

0:02:45.000 --> 0:02:52.919
<v Speaker 2>attracted to me. Like I don't feel like I am

0:02:53.000 --> 0:02:57.040
<v Speaker 2>as overtly taking something from their privacy as they might

0:02:57.160 --> 0:03:00.440
<v Speaker 2>need from someone who likes to share and talk. And

0:03:01.840 --> 0:03:03.560
<v Speaker 2>doesn't mean I don't take anything from them, but I

0:03:03.560 --> 0:03:05.520
<v Speaker 2>mean just that particular aspect.

0:03:05.160 --> 0:03:07.000
<v Speaker 1>Like you're saying, like it's a trait that they wish

0:03:07.040 --> 0:03:07.600
<v Speaker 1>they had.

0:03:08.600 --> 0:03:11.080
<v Speaker 2>Or that they're attracted to, that they want more of,

0:03:11.400 --> 0:03:14.480
<v Speaker 2>or that they like observing. You like being in proximity

0:03:14.560 --> 0:03:17.720
<v Speaker 2>to because a lot of people they don't necessarily I

0:03:17.760 --> 0:03:20.640
<v Speaker 2>don't necessarily teach them to open up over time, but

0:03:20.720 --> 0:03:23.320
<v Speaker 2>they like being in proximity to people who open up,

0:03:23.560 --> 0:03:28.880
<v Speaker 2>but they like listening or observing. Yeah, my husband would

0:03:28.880 --> 0:03:31.040
<v Speaker 2>say that for sure, and then some of my closest

0:03:31.080 --> 0:03:33.840
<v Speaker 2>friends would also say that, And then I have family

0:03:33.880 --> 0:03:35.720
<v Speaker 2>members who would never say that. They're like, Nope, they

0:03:35.720 --> 0:03:38.680
<v Speaker 2>don't like it, and they still don't like it right.

0:03:39.440 --> 0:03:44.920
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, my boyfriend, he's he's definitely way more private, and

0:03:45.720 --> 0:03:48.560
<v Speaker 1>you know, he was kind of had that conversation like,

0:03:48.600 --> 0:03:50.840
<v Speaker 1>you know, I'm like, I'm I talk about a lot

0:03:50.840 --> 0:03:53.520
<v Speaker 1>of things now. He's like, well, I think the only

0:03:53.560 --> 0:03:55.800
<v Speaker 1>thing I wouldn't want, you know, to talk about is

0:03:56.760 --> 0:03:59.200
<v Speaker 1>when we have those we face those hardships up. Because

0:03:59.200 --> 0:04:00.840
<v Speaker 1>I used to have a podcast with Max husband, So

0:04:00.840 --> 0:04:04.800
<v Speaker 1>I'm like, I would never go back to that because

0:04:04.840 --> 0:04:08.720
<v Speaker 1>that was like two open wounds, you know, that was

0:04:08.720 --> 0:04:10.880
<v Speaker 1>an oversharing and that I think affected us in the

0:04:10.920 --> 0:04:14.480
<v Speaker 1>long run. So like, I wouldn't I would never do

0:04:14.520 --> 0:04:17.800
<v Speaker 1>that again with any relationship moving forward again because I

0:04:17.839 --> 0:04:24.160
<v Speaker 1>saw the negative effects of that. Now they were positive, sure,

0:04:24.200 --> 0:04:26.080
<v Speaker 1>but at the you know, but also I think more

0:04:26.120 --> 0:04:27.600
<v Speaker 1>so like negative. So I was like, I would never

0:04:27.640 --> 0:04:29.360
<v Speaker 1>come in and be like, oh, I'm you know, I'm

0:04:29.480 --> 0:04:31.240
<v Speaker 1>mad am I this person, you know what I mean,

0:04:31.279 --> 0:04:33.520
<v Speaker 1>Like I always I will I said, I will always

0:04:33.640 --> 0:04:36.880
<v Speaker 1>share us as in a positive light, you know, and

0:04:37.080 --> 0:04:39.680
<v Speaker 1>because I think that helps, you know, keep the relationship

0:04:39.720 --> 0:04:42.080
<v Speaker 1>strong too, not think because when you were having all

0:04:42.080 --> 0:04:44.240
<v Speaker 1>these negative thoughts, it's like it's not good.

0:04:45.920 --> 0:04:48.279
<v Speaker 2>I kind of worried about that with my book writing

0:04:48.279 --> 0:04:51.440
<v Speaker 2>a book about friendship, even though I wrote about it

0:04:51.520 --> 0:04:56.120
<v Speaker 2>very positively, it felt like a little bit like what

0:04:56.160 --> 0:04:58.080
<v Speaker 2>you're saying, like when you know, when you see married

0:04:58.120 --> 0:05:00.839
<v Speaker 2>couples go on a reality show about their marriage, and

0:05:00.880 --> 0:05:04.520
<v Speaker 2>then what always happens is they get worsd Like I

0:05:04.600 --> 0:05:06.520
<v Speaker 2>felt that way about writing a book about friendship. I

0:05:06.560 --> 0:05:08.039
<v Speaker 2>was like, if am I going to write about all

0:05:08.080 --> 0:05:10.160
<v Speaker 2>my friends and then end up friendless? Like this is

0:05:10.160 --> 0:05:12.760
<v Speaker 2>what's going to happen? Is this the natural trajectory of

0:05:12.800 --> 0:05:16.160
<v Speaker 2>things that has not happened so far? But I think

0:05:16.200 --> 0:05:18.400
<v Speaker 2>it is human nature. It's almost like we're jinxing it

0:05:18.640 --> 0:05:22.760
<v Speaker 2>or when you put it out there, you know, that's

0:05:22.760 --> 0:05:27.640
<v Speaker 2>a vulnerability that you're exposing yourself to. And I try

0:05:27.680 --> 0:05:30.279
<v Speaker 2>not to believe that God or the universe works that way,

0:05:30.360 --> 0:05:32.240
<v Speaker 2>like in a vengeful way, like you put yourself out there,

0:05:32.240 --> 0:05:34.960
<v Speaker 2>so then you're going to get something bad back. I

0:05:35.000 --> 0:05:37.719
<v Speaker 2>have to train my brain to not think like that.

0:05:38.080 --> 0:05:40.880
<v Speaker 1>No, I totally a hear you I've written something and

0:05:40.920 --> 0:05:43.960
<v Speaker 1>it's you know, writing things like what if you know

0:05:44.240 --> 0:05:47.160
<v Speaker 1>something happens or whatever. But it's like your friends are

0:05:47.320 --> 0:05:48.919
<v Speaker 1>especially I'm sure the ones that you write about in

0:05:48.920 --> 0:05:51.880
<v Speaker 1>your book are friends that have been on such a

0:05:51.960 --> 0:05:55.159
<v Speaker 1>journey with you through a lot of your seasons. Now

0:05:55.520 --> 0:05:59.359
<v Speaker 1>I'm curious, like in that, like are there because you

0:05:59.360 --> 0:06:01.880
<v Speaker 1>talk about the friends that you need, you know, are

0:06:01.920 --> 0:06:04.160
<v Speaker 1>there new season friends in there? Are those? The ones

0:06:04.160 --> 0:06:05.720
<v Speaker 1>that you worry about? Are the ones that have been

0:06:05.720 --> 0:06:07.200
<v Speaker 1>there for for a long time.

0:06:09.400 --> 0:06:12.400
<v Speaker 2>Both, I probably care more about those that have been

0:06:12.400 --> 0:06:16.320
<v Speaker 2>there for a long time. To damage those would be

0:06:16.440 --> 0:06:20.039
<v Speaker 2>really detrimental to me as a human versus new friends,

0:06:20.040 --> 0:06:22.360
<v Speaker 2>which I love new friends. Actually the new friend chapter

0:06:22.640 --> 0:06:25.960
<v Speaker 2>in the book is one of my favorite sections. But

0:06:27.279 --> 0:06:31.400
<v Speaker 2>there's less stakes with a new friend if that ended

0:06:31.560 --> 0:06:35.000
<v Speaker 2>or if there was damage there with an old friend,

0:06:35.040 --> 0:06:36.919
<v Speaker 2>you know, it's like such a part of your heart.

0:06:37.279 --> 0:06:41.040
<v Speaker 1>Oh yeah, I mean yes, my best friend Kat and

0:06:41.120 --> 0:06:44.320
<v Speaker 1>I mean the very few times we've had disagreements, it's like,

0:06:44.440 --> 0:06:48.960
<v Speaker 1>oh my god, it feels like a like it's that

0:06:49.120 --> 0:06:51.080
<v Speaker 1>scary feeling of like I can't lose this. It's like

0:06:51.120 --> 0:06:53.760
<v Speaker 1>a family member, you know. It's like that's how fifteen

0:06:53.839 --> 0:06:58.760
<v Speaker 1>years of like love and but you know, people change

0:06:58.800 --> 0:07:01.920
<v Speaker 1>and they grow and you just hope that they're they're

0:07:01.960 --> 0:07:04.400
<v Speaker 1>there through you and I mean, I feel very fortunate

0:07:04.440 --> 0:07:06.680
<v Speaker 1>with the friends that I have that it's stuck with

0:07:06.760 --> 0:07:10.960
<v Speaker 1>me through some of my best seasons and some of

0:07:10.960 --> 0:07:14.400
<v Speaker 1>my worst seasons, and some of my ugly seasons, you know,

0:07:14.560 --> 0:07:16.520
<v Speaker 1>where I haven't been the best version of myself. But

0:07:16.600 --> 0:07:19.800
<v Speaker 1>I think, you know, I'm curious with your book. You

0:07:19.840 --> 0:07:22.680
<v Speaker 1>know a lot of why I think my friends like

0:07:22.720 --> 0:07:24.680
<v Speaker 1>I have the friends that will be like I need

0:07:24.720 --> 0:07:26.720
<v Speaker 1>you to look in the mirror on this one, you know,

0:07:26.760 --> 0:07:29.480
<v Speaker 1>and kind of call me out because I need that.

0:07:31.280 --> 0:07:34.840
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I mean, I start the book out with a

0:07:34.880 --> 0:07:36.760
<v Speaker 2>little bit of a call out. The first section of

0:07:36.760 --> 0:07:39.760
<v Speaker 2>the book is called a friendship reckoning because in twenty twenty,

0:07:40.880 --> 0:07:46.840
<v Speaker 2>I said something hurtfull accidentally. I just was multitasking and

0:07:46.880 --> 0:07:50.640
<v Speaker 2>not thinking it through on a group text, and it

0:07:50.800 --> 0:07:54.800
<v Speaker 2>hurt one of my friends so badly she was almost

0:07:54.880 --> 0:07:57.560
<v Speaker 2>willing to end our friendship over it. Now. It was

0:07:57.720 --> 0:08:02.400
<v Speaker 2>the height of the pandemic, emotions were running high. Texts

0:08:02.440 --> 0:08:05.160
<v Speaker 2>can obviously be misconstrued, but.

0:08:06.960 --> 0:08:08.440
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, it was. It was.

0:08:10.040 --> 0:08:12.120
<v Speaker 2>It was definitely a thing like I've had to walk

0:08:12.160 --> 0:08:16.960
<v Speaker 2>through those hard friendship moments, had hard conversations, had to

0:08:17.000 --> 0:08:20.400
<v Speaker 2>say do we want to move forward? It's terrible. I

0:08:20.400 --> 0:08:22.200
<v Speaker 2>wanted to start the book out that way because I

0:08:22.200 --> 0:08:24.160
<v Speaker 2>didn't want anyone to think that I was coming from

0:08:24.160 --> 0:08:27.120
<v Speaker 2>a place of perfect friendships, right or not? Right?

0:08:27.160 --> 0:08:29.280
<v Speaker 1>Why did you want to write a friendship book? Where

0:08:29.320 --> 0:08:29.600
<v Speaker 1>was that?

0:08:30.160 --> 0:08:34.800
<v Speaker 2>Because I've been sharing myself on the internet for over

0:08:35.000 --> 0:08:38.560
<v Speaker 2>ten years and the friendship topic kept coming up. Now,

0:08:38.600 --> 0:08:41.000
<v Speaker 2>I will say I started when I was a blogger,

0:08:41.400 --> 0:08:43.480
<v Speaker 2>like in two thousand and nine, like a long time ago.

0:08:43.880 --> 0:08:47.040
<v Speaker 2>I started that blog from a place of loneliness. I

0:08:47.200 --> 0:08:51.079
<v Speaker 2>had moved to Los Angeles from Oklahoma, where I'd had,

0:08:51.400 --> 0:08:53.720
<v Speaker 2>you know, a hometown friend group and a college friend

0:08:53.720 --> 0:08:55.720
<v Speaker 2>group and a summer camp friend group and a youth

0:08:55.760 --> 0:08:57.800
<v Speaker 2>group friend group and all these things when I was young,

0:08:58.080 --> 0:09:00.640
<v Speaker 2>and I moved to this city of ten million people

0:09:00.640 --> 0:09:02.960
<v Speaker 2>thinking I would have the same types of friends. And

0:09:03.000 --> 0:09:06.560
<v Speaker 2>I didn't. And I spent a lot of my twenties

0:09:06.600 --> 0:09:09.400
<v Speaker 2>working in film and television production. When I got married

0:09:09.400 --> 0:09:11.199
<v Speaker 2>and we decided to start a family, I was at

0:09:11.200 --> 0:09:14.200
<v Speaker 2>home without work friends, without very many local friends, and

0:09:14.240 --> 0:09:17.560
<v Speaker 2>I was super lonely. And so I started this blog. Well,

0:09:17.600 --> 0:09:19.360
<v Speaker 2>I blogged about a lot of things. I wrote about

0:09:19.360 --> 0:09:21.400
<v Speaker 2>a lot of things for many years, but I did

0:09:21.480 --> 0:09:24.440
<v Speaker 2>blog about this idea of not having very many local

0:09:24.440 --> 0:09:26.880
<v Speaker 2>friends and this huge city that came up a lot,

0:09:27.200 --> 0:09:31.880
<v Speaker 2>and so many women would reach out and say they

0:09:31.920 --> 0:09:34.640
<v Speaker 2>were lonely, but they were lonely in their hometowns, or

0:09:34.679 --> 0:09:36.959
<v Speaker 2>they were lonely in their new cities or in their

0:09:37.000 --> 0:09:39.959
<v Speaker 2>new marriages or whatever, and nobody could figure out why,

0:09:41.280 --> 0:09:44.800
<v Speaker 2>like nice people couldn't make friends, you know, like what

0:09:45.440 --> 0:09:48.440
<v Speaker 2>was wrong with us? And so that just came up

0:09:48.480 --> 0:09:50.760
<v Speaker 2>time and time again. I always knew that I wanted

0:09:50.800 --> 0:09:52.480
<v Speaker 2>to write about it, but what held me back from

0:09:52.559 --> 0:09:56.880
<v Speaker 2>writing about it for a long time was, first of all,

0:09:56.920 --> 0:09:58.920
<v Speaker 2>there's a lot a ton out there about friendships, Like

0:09:58.920 --> 0:10:00.480
<v Speaker 2>there's a lot a lot of books out there, and

0:10:00.520 --> 0:10:04.520
<v Speaker 2>the ones that are out there are like very research driven,

0:10:04.760 --> 0:10:07.800
<v Speaker 2>or they're like by therapists or you know, a psychologist

0:10:07.920 --> 0:10:09.679
<v Speaker 2>or whatever. And I was like, I don't have like

0:10:09.720 --> 0:10:14.080
<v Speaker 2>the credentials to write, to write a book about relationships,

0:10:14.120 --> 0:10:16.280
<v Speaker 2>because I don't. I only have my own lived experience.

0:10:16.320 --> 0:10:21.559
<v Speaker 2>I don't have, you know, academic background, but I do

0:10:21.679 --> 0:10:25.400
<v Speaker 2>have like hundreds literally hundreds of hours of talking on

0:10:25.440 --> 0:10:28.640
<v Speaker 2>my own podcast, writing on this blog, talking about on

0:10:28.679 --> 0:10:32.320
<v Speaker 2>social media, of hearing from other women over a decade

0:10:32.480 --> 0:10:36.760
<v Speaker 2>about this topic. So I finally got to myself. I

0:10:36.840 --> 0:10:38.640
<v Speaker 2>finally got myself to a place where I felt like

0:10:39.320 --> 0:10:41.400
<v Speaker 2>I can write about this as long as I set

0:10:41.440 --> 0:10:43.719
<v Speaker 2>it up as I'm not an expert or I'm you know,

0:10:43.840 --> 0:10:47.440
<v Speaker 2>not a researcher here. I just want to start this

0:10:47.559 --> 0:10:50.360
<v Speaker 2>as a conversation. This book should be a conversation, much

0:10:50.440 --> 0:10:53.640
<v Speaker 2>like my own show is, because I want other women

0:10:53.679 --> 0:10:56.080
<v Speaker 2>talking about it with their friends and they talk about

0:10:56.080 --> 0:10:57.320
<v Speaker 2>it with me. They need to talk about it in

0:10:57.360 --> 0:11:02.640
<v Speaker 2>their friend circles or with their you know, online buddies, whoever.

0:11:02.679 --> 0:11:04.679
<v Speaker 2>But we need to be talking about some of these

0:11:04.679 --> 0:11:07.280
<v Speaker 2>aspects of friendships. Nobody ever talks about friendship. We talk

0:11:07.320 --> 0:11:11.120
<v Speaker 2>about marriage, we talk about parenthood, we talk about aging parents,

0:11:11.240 --> 0:11:15.920
<v Speaker 2>we talk about childhood trauma. People do not talk about friends.

0:11:15.960 --> 0:11:18.600
<v Speaker 2>We have like friends, it's just like water, just like they're.

0:11:18.720 --> 0:11:20.600
<v Speaker 1>Or that they're going to stay there too, you know.

0:11:20.720 --> 0:11:22.920
<v Speaker 1>And I think, you know, it's a you bring up

0:11:22.920 --> 0:11:25.079
<v Speaker 1>a good point with what you how you start the

0:11:25.080 --> 0:11:29.040
<v Speaker 1>book because something happened and that was again like my

0:11:29.080 --> 0:11:31.240
<v Speaker 1>best friend Kat, who's one of my co hosts on

0:11:31.280 --> 0:11:35.360
<v Speaker 1>my Monday show, like we we've maybe had in fifteen years.

0:11:37.480 --> 0:11:43.560
<v Speaker 1>Three arguments that really, you know, were like rocked us.

0:11:43.600 --> 0:11:48.080
<v Speaker 1>And the one recently happened when I was over in

0:11:48.160 --> 0:11:53.160
<v Speaker 1>England because my I don't take a minute when I

0:11:53.200 --> 0:11:56.360
<v Speaker 1>when I respond back to something, I don't respond. I

0:11:56.440 --> 0:12:01.480
<v Speaker 1>respond kind of feelingless I because I'm not meaning to

0:12:01.520 --> 0:12:02.880
<v Speaker 1>hurt feelings. And I don't think that I'm going to

0:12:02.960 --> 0:12:07.160
<v Speaker 1>hurt feelings because I'm my intention is not to hurt feelings.

0:12:07.679 --> 0:12:10.800
<v Speaker 1>But I said a text that ended up hurting your feelings.

0:12:10.800 --> 0:12:12.560
<v Speaker 1>But I was like, I didn't mean to hurt your feelings.

0:12:12.760 --> 0:12:15.040
<v Speaker 1>But I didn't even think about how it because I

0:12:15.120 --> 0:12:17.960
<v Speaker 1>just put the text message out. It was very work related,

0:12:18.000 --> 0:12:21.280
<v Speaker 1>but it was how I like said it, and you know,

0:12:21.320 --> 0:12:22.960
<v Speaker 1>her feelings are hurt and I'm you know, I'm talking

0:12:23.000 --> 0:12:25.160
<v Speaker 1>to my boyfriend like I don't understand. But then I'm like,

0:12:25.240 --> 0:12:27.319
<v Speaker 1>oh my god, that's not that wasn't my intention. He's like, well,

0:12:27.320 --> 0:12:29.200
<v Speaker 1>when you write it like that, I'm like, but that's like,

0:12:29.440 --> 0:12:32.040
<v Speaker 1>why would she even think that, Like she's my best friend, like,

0:12:32.480 --> 0:12:35.640
<v Speaker 1>and so I think that's hard because we just think

0:12:36.320 --> 0:12:40.040
<v Speaker 1>that their bullet proof when they're not. And that was

0:12:40.120 --> 0:12:42.280
<v Speaker 1>kind of a lesson than I had to go. Well, shoot,

0:12:42.320 --> 0:12:44.280
<v Speaker 1>I have to be mindful now of how I use

0:12:44.400 --> 0:12:48.839
<v Speaker 1>my words, even in my girlfriend friendships. And I've been

0:12:48.880 --> 0:12:51.199
<v Speaker 1>so aware since I because I'm like, she's one of

0:12:51.240 --> 0:12:52.800
<v Speaker 1>the most important people in my life. I don't want

0:12:52.800 --> 0:12:54.960
<v Speaker 1>to upset her or make her think that she's not

0:12:55.000 --> 0:12:58.160
<v Speaker 1>important or any of those things. You know well.

0:12:58.160 --> 0:13:01.280
<v Speaker 2>And also the other part of that is is one

0:13:01.280 --> 0:13:03.839
<v Speaker 2>of my core I have five core friendship philosophies in

0:13:03.880 --> 0:13:06.440
<v Speaker 2>the book, and one of them is believe the best.

0:13:07.320 --> 0:13:11.640
<v Speaker 2>So it doesn't mean that you didn't say it in

0:13:11.800 --> 0:13:14.160
<v Speaker 2>your best way. I mean clearly you didn't.

0:13:14.480 --> 0:13:16.800
<v Speaker 1>Right, I just I just can be very direct because

0:13:16.840 --> 0:13:18.720
<v Speaker 1>we work together too. She's my day to day manager,

0:13:18.840 --> 0:13:19.920
<v Speaker 1>like you know what I mean. So it's just like

0:13:19.960 --> 0:13:22.800
<v Speaker 1>I can. I just am very direct sometimes.

0:13:22.640 --> 0:13:25.040
<v Speaker 2>Right, So, and I believe you, and I'm sure she

0:13:25.240 --> 0:13:29.560
<v Speaker 2>knows that about you, so she can still say this

0:13:29.640 --> 0:13:31.760
<v Speaker 2>hurt my feelings. I don't like it when you speak

0:13:31.840 --> 0:13:35.040
<v Speaker 2>like this to me, Like I, you know, need a

0:13:35.080 --> 0:13:38.000
<v Speaker 2>little bit more padding in a direct comment whatever however

0:13:38.040 --> 0:13:40.240
<v Speaker 2>she wants to phrase it for you. But when you're

0:13:40.280 --> 0:13:43.640
<v Speaker 2>having that hard conversation about this hurt my feelings. Please,

0:13:43.720 --> 0:13:47.240
<v Speaker 2>don't you know, speak this way or whatever. To believe

0:13:47.480 --> 0:13:50.600
<v Speaker 2>you start that conversation believing the best about one another,

0:13:51.679 --> 0:13:54.880
<v Speaker 2>like if she believed the worst about you, or even

0:13:55.000 --> 0:13:57.360
<v Speaker 2>not the best of like yeah, you were trying to

0:13:57.360 --> 0:14:00.400
<v Speaker 2>be mean, you treat me like an employee, I don't

0:14:00.400 --> 0:14:04.199
<v Speaker 2>know whatever wherever her brain went. Instead, if you can

0:14:04.240 --> 0:14:07.120
<v Speaker 2>both start a hard conversation believing the best, like I

0:14:07.200 --> 0:14:08.920
<v Speaker 2>know that you didn't mean it this way because I

0:14:08.960 --> 0:14:11.880
<v Speaker 2>know you and I trust your heart. However, when you

0:14:12.000 --> 0:14:15.520
<v Speaker 2>text like this, it bums me out. And then you

0:14:15.559 --> 0:14:18.440
<v Speaker 2>can believe the best about her. You believe you know

0:14:18.520 --> 0:14:20.520
<v Speaker 2>that she's coming to you with pure intentions, that she's

0:14:20.560 --> 0:14:22.960
<v Speaker 2>not trying to like cause a big work fight or whatever.

0:14:24.400 --> 0:14:26.520
<v Speaker 2>If you don't believe the best about each other in

0:14:26.560 --> 0:14:28.880
<v Speaker 2>one of these hard conversations, this is when you get

0:14:28.920 --> 0:14:31.200
<v Speaker 2>these like deep riffs, when you start to like think, oh,

0:14:31.240 --> 0:14:36.320
<v Speaker 2>she's actually secretly thinking this, or that she doesn't believe

0:14:36.360 --> 0:14:38.400
<v Speaker 2>the best about me, so that it makes us defensive,

0:14:38.600 --> 0:14:41.200
<v Speaker 2>like how could like you just said, how could you

0:14:41.200 --> 0:14:44.520
<v Speaker 2>think I was being mean? Like you know me? You

0:14:44.800 --> 0:14:46.760
<v Speaker 2>on both sides. You have to believe the best because

0:14:46.760 --> 0:14:48.960
<v Speaker 2>you want them to believe the best about you, you

0:14:49.000 --> 0:14:51.720
<v Speaker 2>have to offer the same grace to her, which it

0:14:51.760 --> 0:14:55.200
<v Speaker 2>sounds like you guys did, but it's it's easier said

0:14:55.200 --> 0:14:56.120
<v Speaker 2>than done, for sure.

0:15:08.920 --> 0:15:13.000
<v Speaker 1>Why do you think friendship conversations like aren't talked about?

0:15:13.240 --> 0:15:15.520
<v Speaker 1>Is it just because people can just they're fine to

0:15:15.640 --> 0:15:20.320
<v Speaker 1>let go of them, or is it like another work

0:15:20.840 --> 0:15:22.760
<v Speaker 1>thing that they feel like they have to, like you know,

0:15:22.840 --> 0:15:24.440
<v Speaker 1>then going to like therapy with your friend.

0:15:25.000 --> 0:15:27.200
<v Speaker 2>Well, I do not think people are good to let

0:15:27.240 --> 0:15:31.600
<v Speaker 2>go of them. We already mentioned friendship breakups are it's

0:15:31.720 --> 0:15:35.120
<v Speaker 2>so painful. I have talked to so many women who've

0:15:35.160 --> 0:15:37.720
<v Speaker 2>said that their friendship breakup of a best friend, like

0:15:37.760 --> 0:15:41.600
<v Speaker 2>a deep friendship ending, was more painful than their divorce,

0:15:42.160 --> 0:15:45.280
<v Speaker 2>was more painful than romantic breakups. Like it was that devastating,

0:15:45.360 --> 0:15:48.560
<v Speaker 2>and culturally we do not give it any weight. Like

0:15:48.560 --> 0:15:51.760
<v Speaker 2>if you go through a romantic breakup, people are like, yes,

0:15:52.040 --> 0:15:56.200
<v Speaker 2>stay in bed, have your grieving period. Nobody says that

0:15:56.200 --> 0:15:58.520
<v Speaker 2>about friendship breakups. You just act like, oh, you're just

0:15:58.520 --> 0:16:01.800
<v Speaker 2>gonna pick up another friend. You know you're out of milk,

0:16:01.840 --> 0:16:04.320
<v Speaker 2>you get more milk. Like people treat friendships like it's

0:16:04.400 --> 0:16:08.200
<v Speaker 2>this unending resource when I don't find that to be true.

0:16:08.880 --> 0:16:10.520
<v Speaker 2>But to answer you a question of why we don't

0:16:10.520 --> 0:16:13.200
<v Speaker 2>talk about it more, I think we've learned about friendships

0:16:13.920 --> 0:16:16.120
<v Speaker 2>when we're really young, like elementary school age, when you

0:16:16.160 --> 0:16:19.640
<v Speaker 2>first start to learn how to be friends, like be kind, share,

0:16:20.120 --> 0:16:22.480
<v Speaker 2>you know, that kind of thing, and then we just

0:16:22.680 --> 0:16:26.280
<v Speaker 2>never revisit the rules that we learn when we're young,

0:16:26.480 --> 0:16:28.360
<v Speaker 2>or the patterns that we get in when we're young.

0:16:29.000 --> 0:16:34.360
<v Speaker 2>We literally never revisit it because it's almost like these

0:16:34.560 --> 0:16:36.160
<v Speaker 2>this thing in life that we take for granted, Like

0:16:36.160 --> 0:16:37.880
<v Speaker 2>you learn to read, you don't need to relearn to

0:16:37.920 --> 0:16:40.160
<v Speaker 2>read when you're an adult, like you just it's a

0:16:40.200 --> 0:16:43.200
<v Speaker 2>thing we learned, we got it, you do it or

0:16:43.200 --> 0:16:48.520
<v Speaker 2>you don't, which actually isn't true, because we learn friendships

0:16:48.560 --> 0:16:51.800
<v Speaker 2>and how to be a friend like under a completely

0:16:51.800 --> 0:16:55.120
<v Speaker 2>different life circumstances. So like we learn to be friends

0:16:55.160 --> 0:16:58.520
<v Speaker 2>primarily at school, so we're at school together eight hours

0:16:58.560 --> 0:17:00.800
<v Speaker 2>a day. Even when we get to be on adulthood,

0:17:00.960 --> 0:17:04.560
<v Speaker 2>like in college or post college life, if you have roommates, whatever,

0:17:04.600 --> 0:17:08.880
<v Speaker 2>you are learning friendship with a lot of time on

0:17:08.920 --> 0:17:14.520
<v Speaker 2>your hands, like a lot less responsibility, a lot more resilience, frankly,

0:17:14.960 --> 0:17:17.399
<v Speaker 2>and then you get to adulthood, life is so different.

0:17:17.440 --> 0:17:20.920
<v Speaker 2>You have work, you have a mortgage, maybe you have kids,

0:17:21.680 --> 0:17:24.440
<v Speaker 2>maybe you have health stuff. I don't know, And suddenly

0:17:24.480 --> 0:17:27.040
<v Speaker 2>you can be like, I don't I don't have the

0:17:27.040 --> 0:17:29.480
<v Speaker 2>same amount of time to give toffriends. I don't have

0:17:29.520 --> 0:17:31.960
<v Speaker 2>the same amount of energy. I don't understand why making

0:17:32.000 --> 0:17:34.560
<v Speaker 2>friends take so much effort when earlier in my life

0:17:34.920 --> 0:17:36.760
<v Speaker 2>it was so easy. It was sort of served up

0:17:36.800 --> 0:17:40.440
<v Speaker 2>to me that was my problem is friends were always around.

0:17:40.680 --> 0:17:42.439
<v Speaker 2>So when I got to Los Angeles, I was like,

0:17:42.480 --> 0:17:45.439
<v Speaker 2>I didn't know you had to like make all this effort,

0:17:45.760 --> 0:17:48.800
<v Speaker 2>like ask people on a friend date or like introduce yourself.

0:17:48.960 --> 0:17:51.760
<v Speaker 2>Like I'd never had to practice any of those skills

0:17:51.800 --> 0:17:54.119
<v Speaker 2>in the first twenty years of my life, and so

0:17:54.160 --> 0:17:57.520
<v Speaker 2>it was really eye opening to me to become an adult.

0:17:58.040 --> 0:17:59.560
<v Speaker 2>And I think that this is true for a lot

0:17:59.600 --> 0:18:02.440
<v Speaker 2>of people, Like we had no idea. We're never taught

0:18:02.480 --> 0:18:08.560
<v Speaker 2>that there's maintenance involved and effort involved and friendship and

0:18:08.359 --> 0:18:10.160
<v Speaker 2>and for a lot of people, we don't ever really

0:18:10.200 --> 0:18:13.000
<v Speaker 2>examine it until something bad happens, until we go through

0:18:13.000 --> 0:18:15.560
<v Speaker 2>a lonely period, until we have a friend break up,

0:18:17.280 --> 0:18:19.600
<v Speaker 2>you know, until we go through something where we're like, oh,

0:18:20.240 --> 0:18:23.440
<v Speaker 2>I maybe haven't paid much as much attention to friends

0:18:23.600 --> 0:18:24.280
<v Speaker 2>as I should have.

0:18:25.800 --> 0:18:27.320
<v Speaker 1>Well, I think that piece is hard. Like I mean,

0:18:27.359 --> 0:18:30.960
<v Speaker 1>I have a high school, high school best best friend,

0:18:31.000 --> 0:18:34.560
<v Speaker 1>you know, since middle school, and we don't talk hardly

0:18:34.720 --> 0:18:38.280
<v Speaker 1>at all. Really, I mean, you know, we maybe catch

0:18:38.359 --> 0:18:41.400
<v Speaker 1>up once a month. You know, it's been a little

0:18:41.440 --> 0:18:44.440
<v Speaker 1>bit more now, but before I was a couple every

0:18:44.720 --> 0:18:47.919
<v Speaker 1>or so months. But I still love her, you know,

0:18:48.080 --> 0:18:51.040
<v Speaker 1>very much. It's just you know, with kids and getting older,

0:18:51.119 --> 0:18:53.960
<v Speaker 1>it's different states. Like it's it's really hard. But I

0:18:54.000 --> 0:18:57.280
<v Speaker 1>will say that the fallout friendships I'm curious about because

0:18:57.280 --> 0:18:59.400
<v Speaker 1>in my mind, I'm like, there's you know, there's been

0:18:59.440 --> 0:19:03.000
<v Speaker 1>one for sure that really hurt. But in my mind,

0:19:03.040 --> 0:19:06.359
<v Speaker 1>I go, Okay, well, I guess that friendship just didn't

0:19:06.400 --> 0:19:08.440
<v Speaker 1>mean as much to them as it did to me.

0:19:08.520 --> 0:19:11.920
<v Speaker 1>And like do do I did? I wouldn't have wanted

0:19:11.960 --> 0:19:14.640
<v Speaker 1>that anyways, if that's how it was gonna.

0:19:14.760 --> 0:19:18.320
<v Speaker 2>Be, Well, why do you assume it didn't mean as

0:19:18.359 --> 0:19:20.280
<v Speaker 2>much to her because she was willing to end it?

0:19:21.920 --> 0:19:25.320
<v Speaker 1>She was Well, it wasn't a she, it was a yeah,

0:19:25.359 --> 0:19:30.680
<v Speaker 1>he like he sold something to a story. Oh and yeah,

0:19:30.880 --> 0:19:34.080
<v Speaker 1>and it was my best friend, so it was that

0:19:34.160 --> 0:19:36.399
<v Speaker 1>was really hard, you know, because like we had a

0:19:36.440 --> 0:19:39.080
<v Speaker 1>fallout and then you go do that, so it's like,

0:19:39.160 --> 0:19:40.439
<v Speaker 1>were you even my best friend?

0:19:41.000 --> 0:19:47.120
<v Speaker 2>Yeah? No, that is a betrayal. Yeah, so that's different.

0:19:47.840 --> 0:19:51.360
<v Speaker 2>I think that's like in a different category of friendship breakup.

0:19:51.560 --> 0:19:55.640
<v Speaker 2>Like a betrayal especially like of that magnitude is enormous

0:19:55.640 --> 0:19:57.520
<v Speaker 2>and something you'll you'll never get over that. I mean,

0:19:57.520 --> 0:20:01.360
<v Speaker 2>that can't be repaired most ship breakups, I think, are

0:20:02.000 --> 0:20:04.640
<v Speaker 2>you know, you hurt my feelings, we're growing apart.

0:20:04.800 --> 0:20:06.920
<v Speaker 1>Do you think those kind of friendships are repaired.

0:20:07.800 --> 0:20:10.760
<v Speaker 2>I think they can be, But I don't think most

0:20:10.800 --> 0:20:16.400
<v Speaker 2>friendship breakups or friendship changes like we're talking about, involve

0:20:18.080 --> 0:20:21.080
<v Speaker 2>immense betrayal. What you're describing is a mince betrayal. I'm

0:20:21.119 --> 0:20:23.159
<v Speaker 2>just saying that to affirm to you that that is

0:20:23.200 --> 0:20:26.720
<v Speaker 2>a whole different level of grief that you have to

0:20:26.800 --> 0:20:29.320
<v Speaker 2>go through on top of leaving, on top of losing

0:20:29.359 --> 0:20:29.760
<v Speaker 2>the friend.

0:20:30.280 --> 0:20:32.760
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, it was a long time ago, but yeah, and

0:20:33.000 --> 0:20:35.920
<v Speaker 1>it was not fun. But that's what I always kind

0:20:35.920 --> 0:20:38.200
<v Speaker 1>of that's l like my arm kind of went out

0:20:38.200 --> 0:20:40.080
<v Speaker 1>to a lot of like I keep people at very

0:20:40.960 --> 0:20:42.440
<v Speaker 1>I have a very small circle, and I have a

0:20:42.480 --> 0:20:47.000
<v Speaker 1>hard time letting other new friends come in just because

0:20:47.000 --> 0:20:49.960
<v Speaker 1>I don't like who can I trust, right, and like

0:20:50.040 --> 0:20:53.080
<v Speaker 1>who's not going to say something or you know.

0:20:54.440 --> 0:20:58.399
<v Speaker 2>Well, it seems like that would be harshly a public

0:20:58.440 --> 0:21:00.760
<v Speaker 2>figure problem, like in some way, like you're going to

0:21:00.840 --> 0:21:05.560
<v Speaker 2>have different considerations than sure other people do. But that

0:21:06.480 --> 0:21:08.280
<v Speaker 2>affects a lot of people too, Like I grew up

0:21:08.280 --> 0:21:11.760
<v Speaker 2>in a really small town, so public figure is relative, right,

0:21:11.760 --> 0:21:16.080
<v Speaker 2>But it's the same thing of who can you trust?

0:21:16.320 --> 0:21:21.080
<v Speaker 2>Who is going to harm my reputation or share a

0:21:21.119 --> 0:21:26.680
<v Speaker 2>secret or anything like that. Anyone who's gone through something

0:21:27.280 --> 0:21:30.120
<v Speaker 2>hard will tell you that they circle the wagons right

0:21:30.160 --> 0:21:38.600
<v Speaker 2>with like the closest people. Because your betrayal happened in adulthood.

0:21:38.720 --> 0:21:40.960
<v Speaker 2>But this happens to a lot of us when we're young.

0:21:41.040 --> 0:21:43.720
<v Speaker 2>If you get mean girled, if you're bullied, if your

0:21:43.720 --> 0:21:46.080
<v Speaker 2>best friend in high school steals your boyfriend, all those

0:21:46.080 --> 0:21:48.560
<v Speaker 2>different stories that can for sure affect the way that

0:21:48.600 --> 0:21:52.280
<v Speaker 2>you do friendship going forward, even on you know, just

0:21:52.320 --> 0:21:54.880
<v Speaker 2>in your own life, it only affects you, but it

0:21:54.920 --> 0:21:58.280
<v Speaker 2>affects you, like for the rest of your life of

0:21:58.359 --> 0:22:04.359
<v Speaker 2>how you walk in friendship, Like I A lot of

0:22:04.400 --> 0:22:08.879
<v Speaker 2>times hear women say some version of this diminishes a

0:22:08.920 --> 0:22:11.359
<v Speaker 2>little as we get older. But when we're younger, don't

0:22:11.400 --> 0:22:13.600
<v Speaker 2>you hear women who are like, oh, I'm a guys girl,

0:22:13.680 --> 0:22:18.040
<v Speaker 2>Like I only have guy friends. All I hear when

0:22:18.040 --> 0:22:20.760
<v Speaker 2>I hear a woman say that is who hurt you?

0:22:21.480 --> 0:22:23.600
<v Speaker 2>Like somebody hurt you. It doesn't mean that you can't

0:22:23.600 --> 0:22:26.120
<v Speaker 2>prefer to be around men, and like, really love that dynamic.

0:22:26.160 --> 0:22:29.919
<v Speaker 2>I'm sure you do. But when you swear off a

0:22:29.960 --> 0:22:33.720
<v Speaker 2>whole gender set that is probably coming from a place

0:22:33.760 --> 0:22:36.200
<v Speaker 2>of hurts. You probably got mean girled. You probably lost

0:22:36.240 --> 0:22:38.240
<v Speaker 2>your best friend in some really painful way, and so

0:22:38.320 --> 0:22:41.680
<v Speaker 2>now you don't trust women anymore, you know, you only

0:22:41.680 --> 0:22:45.080
<v Speaker 2>trust men? And yeah, I just think we get into

0:22:45.080 --> 0:22:48.080
<v Speaker 2>these habits a lot of times. They start when we're young,

0:22:48.280 --> 0:22:51.280
<v Speaker 2>and we never examine them when we're older, of like, well,

0:22:51.280 --> 0:22:53.679
<v Speaker 2>why don't I have more friends? Or why is it

0:22:53.680 --> 0:22:56.000
<v Speaker 2>hard for me to make friends? Or why don't I

0:22:56.040 --> 0:22:56.639
<v Speaker 2>trust people?

0:22:57.520 --> 0:22:59.280
<v Speaker 1>And do you write all about all that in your book?

0:22:59.600 --> 0:23:03.000
<v Speaker 2>I mean yet not quite as exactly as we're talking

0:23:03.000 --> 0:23:05.760
<v Speaker 2>about it, but for sure I talk about the patterns

0:23:06.640 --> 0:23:09.440
<v Speaker 2>that we learned when we're young and how it affects

0:23:10.160 --> 0:23:13.280
<v Speaker 2>our adult friendships. The main point of the book is

0:23:13.320 --> 0:23:18.879
<v Speaker 2>more though, about addressing our loneliness, because so many of

0:23:18.920 --> 0:23:22.040
<v Speaker 2>us feel lonely in so many different types of circumstances

0:23:22.080 --> 0:23:26.720
<v Speaker 2>in so many cities, big and small. And I really

0:23:26.840 --> 0:23:30.800
<v Speaker 2>wanted to write about what I had to do, which

0:23:30.880 --> 0:23:33.960
<v Speaker 2>was changed my perspective on friendships. When I didn't have

0:23:34.040 --> 0:23:37.280
<v Speaker 2>very many local friends in LA I had to make

0:23:37.320 --> 0:23:40.000
<v Speaker 2>something work for myself. I turned to the internet. I

0:23:40.040 --> 0:23:43.360
<v Speaker 2>made internet friends, which I do write about. I poured

0:23:43.440 --> 0:23:46.040
<v Speaker 2>into my childhood friends that were back in Oklahoma, which

0:23:46.040 --> 0:23:48.760
<v Speaker 2>is where I was from. But I was like, I'm

0:23:48.800 --> 0:23:50.960
<v Speaker 2>just going to invest in these relationships even though they're

0:23:50.960 --> 0:23:53.840
<v Speaker 2>not local, Like I'm going to call more, email, more,

0:23:53.920 --> 0:23:57.359
<v Speaker 2>that kind of thing. I looked around at co workers

0:23:57.520 --> 0:24:02.080
<v Speaker 2>and even though they weren't like my type of galpal

0:24:02.160 --> 0:24:05.399
<v Speaker 2>that I pictured, like this was a coworker, but we

0:24:05.680 --> 0:24:08.320
<v Speaker 2>that's an intimacy because we saw each other every single day,

0:24:08.359 --> 0:24:10.600
<v Speaker 2>we had lunch together every day. They understood a part

0:24:10.640 --> 0:24:14.160
<v Speaker 2>of my life, my work life that other people didn't understand.

0:24:14.240 --> 0:24:17.919
<v Speaker 2>So I'm going to sort of elevate these people that

0:24:17.960 --> 0:24:19.720
<v Speaker 2>are in my life, which is what a lot of

0:24:19.760 --> 0:24:24.000
<v Speaker 2>the book is about. Looking around at your existing landscape

0:24:24.200 --> 0:24:27.680
<v Speaker 2>and instead of feeling like I don't have any friends

0:24:27.760 --> 0:24:30.920
<v Speaker 2>or I don't have enough friends, or feeling this lack

0:24:31.080 --> 0:24:32.720
<v Speaker 2>that a lot of us feel, which makes us feel

0:24:32.720 --> 0:24:38.520
<v Speaker 2>lonely disconnected, to look around who is there and see like, Okay,

0:24:38.920 --> 0:24:41.080
<v Speaker 2>maybe I wouldn't have given this person the title of

0:24:41.160 --> 0:24:44.800
<v Speaker 2>friend because they're my neighbor, they're a sports mom, they're

0:24:44.800 --> 0:24:49.240
<v Speaker 2>a coworker, whatever, but I'm going to see that actually

0:24:49.280 --> 0:24:51.960
<v Speaker 2>they are a part of my daily life. I'm a

0:24:51.960 --> 0:24:55.240
<v Speaker 2>part of theirs, and sort of elevating all of these

0:24:55.560 --> 0:24:58.560
<v Speaker 2>relationships in our life that we either don't give credit

0:24:58.640 --> 0:25:03.359
<v Speaker 2>to or like. Another big piece I think is we

0:25:03.520 --> 0:25:06.960
<v Speaker 2>have a friend, but she doesn't tick a certain box

0:25:07.000 --> 0:25:10.320
<v Speaker 2>for us, like she's super fun, but like you would

0:25:10.359 --> 0:25:13.200
<v Speaker 2>not have a heart to heart with her, or the opposite,

0:25:13.240 --> 0:25:15.320
<v Speaker 2>like she's great for a heart to heart, but like

0:25:15.880 --> 0:25:19.000
<v Speaker 2>maybe she's a stick in the mud. I say that

0:25:19.040 --> 0:25:21.560
<v Speaker 2>because I'm that person, like I will love to deep

0:25:21.600 --> 0:25:25.360
<v Speaker 2>die with you, but like I'm not ever described as fun. Probably,

0:25:26.000 --> 0:25:30.359
<v Speaker 2>So instead of seeing like our friends like uh, like

0:25:30.440 --> 0:25:33.639
<v Speaker 2>she's not quite like she's not this or that or whatever.

0:25:33.720 --> 0:25:35.680
<v Speaker 2>Like I really want a friend that's x y Z

0:25:36.200 --> 0:25:38.080
<v Speaker 2>that we can be Like no, let the heart to

0:25:38.119 --> 0:25:40.640
<v Speaker 2>heart girl be the heart to heart girl, and then

0:25:40.680 --> 0:25:43.200
<v Speaker 2>find you a fun friend that never wants to go deep.

0:25:43.480 --> 0:25:45.919
<v Speaker 2>Those are two different people that does not have to

0:25:45.920 --> 0:25:48.560
<v Speaker 2>be the same person, and they are going to serve

0:25:48.600 --> 0:25:51.280
<v Speaker 2>on your life counsel. And what a joy it is

0:25:51.320 --> 0:25:56.320
<v Speaker 2>to like see people in their strengths instead of thinking

0:25:56.320 --> 0:25:59.480
<v Speaker 2>that they're not fulfilling you in some way. This also

0:25:59.560 --> 0:26:02.320
<v Speaker 2>freezy up for you to be that way too. Like

0:26:02.359 --> 0:26:04.280
<v Speaker 2>I just said, like I'm not exactly the fun friend.

0:26:04.400 --> 0:26:07.200
<v Speaker 2>I have other people that I let be the fun friend,

0:26:07.240 --> 0:26:10.000
<v Speaker 2>Like I'm gonna live for sure. Yeah, Like yeah, call

0:26:10.080 --> 0:26:11.720
<v Speaker 2>me when you want a heart to heart. If you

0:26:11.720 --> 0:26:14.520
<v Speaker 2>want a margarita, call Tracy, Like I just for sure.

0:26:15.080 --> 0:26:17.280
<v Speaker 2>That's how we have, Like there's five of us in

0:26:17.320 --> 0:26:19.320
<v Speaker 2>a little queendom. We have like a little quendom chat.

0:26:19.400 --> 0:26:21.080
<v Speaker 2>But it's like every single one of us have the

0:26:21.200 --> 0:26:23.000
<v Speaker 2>like if you're gonna go if you want just like

0:26:23.040 --> 0:26:26.760
<v Speaker 2>a really fun get dressed up, You're gonna go with Pammy.

0:26:26.920 --> 0:26:28.880
<v Speaker 2>If you want like a heart to heart. You're gonna

0:26:28.880 --> 0:26:31.639
<v Speaker 2>come to me like I will. We will spill everything together.

0:26:31.680 --> 0:26:33.840
<v Speaker 2>If you want just to like chill out watch TV,

0:26:33.960 --> 0:26:35.840
<v Speaker 2>you're gonna go to cat like it's like we're all

0:26:36.040 --> 0:26:37.879
<v Speaker 2>we all have our thing and it's like but together

0:26:38.320 --> 0:26:39.920
<v Speaker 2>we we're great.

0:26:40.160 --> 0:26:40.399
<v Speaker 1>You know.

0:26:40.760 --> 0:26:43.040
<v Speaker 2>Well that is the life Counsel. That's the whole book.

0:26:43.080 --> 0:26:44.880
<v Speaker 2>You already have it. You don't need to read.

0:26:44.960 --> 0:26:47.240
<v Speaker 1>Oh very okay, Well that was my next question because

0:26:47.240 --> 0:26:48.560
<v Speaker 1>you say you know the ten friends you knew. I

0:26:48.560 --> 0:26:50.800
<v Speaker 1>was like, give meet because I was like, obviously I

0:26:50.840 --> 0:26:53.040
<v Speaker 1>want the listeners to read read the book as well,

0:26:53.119 --> 0:26:55.080
<v Speaker 1>so not give them all away, but like, what's one

0:26:55.200 --> 0:26:56.400
<v Speaker 1>friend you really need?

0:26:56.520 --> 0:26:58.400
<v Speaker 2>Oh, I'll give them all away. I have no problem.

0:26:58.800 --> 0:27:02.560
<v Speaker 2>I want to read the book, but I also like

0:27:02.960 --> 0:27:04.920
<v Speaker 2>want people to kind of know what they're getting into.

0:27:05.040 --> 0:27:06.879
<v Speaker 2>I'll read you all ten, but we can focus on

0:27:06.920 --> 0:27:10.680
<v Speaker 2>whichever ones kind of peek your interest. Okay, there's the

0:27:10.800 --> 0:27:13.480
<v Speaker 2>daily duty friend, which, by the way, I did not

0:27:13.520 --> 0:27:15.800
<v Speaker 2>have a daily duty friend till I was forty years old.

0:27:16.040 --> 0:27:18.240
<v Speaker 1>There's the best that's my that's my girl, Tanya. That's

0:27:18.280 --> 0:27:20.160
<v Speaker 1>like I think if I hear when I hear daily duties,

0:27:20.200 --> 0:27:22.040
<v Speaker 1>it's like things that we you know, we have the

0:27:22.040 --> 0:27:25.560
<v Speaker 1>same sports kids and we do the exports activities together

0:27:25.720 --> 0:27:29.200
<v Speaker 1>and like we you know, I help pick up kids,

0:27:29.440 --> 0:27:31.399
<v Speaker 1>same school stuff like that.

0:27:31.520 --> 0:27:35.800
<v Speaker 2>Same mine is a fellow sports mom. But I think

0:27:35.880 --> 0:27:38.840
<v Speaker 2>when we think of friendship, we think all friends should

0:27:38.840 --> 0:27:41.320
<v Speaker 2>be daily duty friends, like only text every day, we

0:27:41.440 --> 0:27:44.760
<v Speaker 2>talk all the time. And my deepest friendships are not

0:27:44.920 --> 0:27:46.680
<v Speaker 2>all that. I didn't have a daily duty friend, like

0:27:46.720 --> 0:27:49.680
<v Speaker 2>I said, till I was forty, But I've always had friends. Okay,

0:27:49.680 --> 0:27:55.359
<v Speaker 2>here's the other the old friend, the business bestie, the

0:27:55.480 --> 0:28:00.400
<v Speaker 2>fellow obsessive. So that's a big one. That's a pop one.

0:28:02.000 --> 0:28:06.480
<v Speaker 2>The battle buddy, Okay, what's the battle buddy? Someone who

0:28:06.520 --> 0:28:08.360
<v Speaker 2>is going through the same battle you are.

0:28:09.560 --> 0:28:11.000
<v Speaker 1>Okay, got it, And that can.

0:28:10.880 --> 0:28:15.960
<v Speaker 2>Be any battle, you know, surface level or deep. And

0:28:16.480 --> 0:28:19.920
<v Speaker 2>they understand this battle in a way that other people don't.

0:28:20.040 --> 0:28:24.320
<v Speaker 2>And maybe you only bond on the battle like again,

0:28:24.400 --> 0:28:27.959
<v Speaker 2>kind of like the coworker. Maybe you aren't connecting in

0:28:28.000 --> 0:28:30.919
<v Speaker 2>other ways. Your life circumstances don't look anything else alike,

0:28:31.000 --> 0:28:34.560
<v Speaker 2>but you're both walking through this particular fire. That kind

0:28:34.640 --> 0:28:39.520
<v Speaker 2>of companion is like absolutely priceless. Okay. Then there's the

0:28:39.640 --> 0:28:43.880
<v Speaker 2>yes friend, that's the fun friend, the mentor.

0:28:44.680 --> 0:28:46.760
<v Speaker 1>The yes friend's also a dangerous friend. Though I've had

0:28:46.800 --> 0:28:47.760
<v Speaker 1>to really nip.

0:28:47.560 --> 0:28:49.720
<v Speaker 2>Those wait say more.

0:28:51.320 --> 0:28:54.120
<v Speaker 1>Because I need to be challenged, I need to like

0:28:54.240 --> 0:28:57.840
<v Speaker 1>be held to being and I can do it on

0:28:57.880 --> 0:29:00.680
<v Speaker 1>myself now. But in my twenties the friends were the

0:29:00.720 --> 0:29:05.120
<v Speaker 1>worst of my friends because twenty Jana's was not great.

0:29:05.920 --> 0:29:08.080
<v Speaker 1>Thirty is you know, now I can like, I'm going

0:29:08.120 --> 0:29:10.080
<v Speaker 1>to be forty this year, so like now I'm like, okay,

0:29:10.120 --> 0:29:11.960
<v Speaker 1>like I can call myself out now. I don't really

0:29:12.000 --> 0:29:14.240
<v Speaker 1>like whether it's a yes or no. It's like, but

0:29:14.560 --> 0:29:18.040
<v Speaker 1>back in twenty is, those were like, they were fun,

0:29:19.240 --> 0:29:21.800
<v Speaker 1>but they didn't help me become a better version of myself.

0:29:21.840 --> 0:29:23.560
<v Speaker 1>But I guess that wasn't their job. It was mine

0:29:23.600 --> 0:29:24.000
<v Speaker 1>all along.

0:29:25.480 --> 0:29:27.360
<v Speaker 2>I hope that they gave you some good memories.

0:29:27.840 --> 0:29:28.440
<v Speaker 1>They sure did.

0:29:28.640 --> 0:29:31.240
<v Speaker 2>That's right, that's right, and that's a value you can

0:29:31.280 --> 0:29:34.520
<v Speaker 2>be like and my my yes friends are in the past.

0:29:34.640 --> 0:29:36.000
<v Speaker 2>They live in my scrap books.

0:29:35.800 --> 0:29:39.320
<v Speaker 1>Don't really, Yeah, they live in Los Angeles and they're

0:29:39.360 --> 0:29:39.840
<v Speaker 1>still there.

0:29:41.920 --> 0:29:45.760
<v Speaker 2>The other oh, here we go, okay, the mentor, the

0:29:45.800 --> 0:29:52.400
<v Speaker 2>password protector, the new friend, the soul sister, and then

0:29:52.400 --> 0:29:54.280
<v Speaker 2>there's a bonus that I write about, not one of

0:29:54.320 --> 0:29:57.280
<v Speaker 2>the ten friends, but there's a seat at the table

0:29:57.600 --> 0:29:58.960
<v Speaker 2>called the empty chair.

0:30:00.280 --> 0:30:03.240
<v Speaker 1>I love that sounds like my therapist. I thought, the

0:30:03.240 --> 0:30:19.080
<v Speaker 1>empty chair. What do you signify as the empty chair?

0:30:19.240 --> 0:30:21.440
<v Speaker 1>Is it someone that's like in the like a moment,

0:30:21.720 --> 0:30:24.520
<v Speaker 1>or is it just a feeling thing or well.

0:30:24.520 --> 0:30:27.160
<v Speaker 2>I wanted to write about the empty chair because I

0:30:27.160 --> 0:30:30.480
<v Speaker 2>wanted to give space in the book for friendship breakups,

0:30:30.520 --> 0:30:33.640
<v Speaker 2>friendship loss, which we already talked about, but I also

0:30:33.840 --> 0:30:37.160
<v Speaker 2>really wanted so that's the first part of the empty

0:30:37.200 --> 0:30:42.040
<v Speaker 2>chair section. But I also really wanted to keep a

0:30:42.160 --> 0:30:48.640
<v Speaker 2>chair empty at your metaphorical life council table as like

0:30:48.840 --> 0:30:51.600
<v Speaker 2>hope for the friends to come, like almost like I

0:30:51.760 --> 0:30:53.640
<v Speaker 2>leave a light on for you, like I'll leave an

0:30:53.640 --> 0:30:56.560
<v Speaker 2>empty chair for you. Because I think sometimes, as we

0:30:56.600 --> 0:31:01.000
<v Speaker 2>already talked about circling our wagons, sometimes we have like

0:31:01.520 --> 0:31:04.040
<v Speaker 2>a closed off vibe of like I have all the

0:31:04.040 --> 0:31:06.000
<v Speaker 2>friends I need, I don't need it more on my

0:31:06.120 --> 0:31:09.160
<v Speaker 2>to do list, I don't have capacity for a new person.

0:31:10.280 --> 0:31:12.320
<v Speaker 2>And if that's the energy that we're putting out and

0:31:12.360 --> 0:31:14.000
<v Speaker 2>some once we go through seasons where that's the us,

0:31:14.040 --> 0:31:17.320
<v Speaker 2>we can do, which makes sense. But also there are

0:31:17.440 --> 0:31:20.960
<v Speaker 2>so many amazing people that can come into our life,

0:31:20.960 --> 0:31:23.280
<v Speaker 2>that can flow into our life, and if we do

0:31:23.320 --> 0:31:27.040
<v Speaker 2>not have a metaphorical empty chair for them, we are

0:31:27.080 --> 0:31:30.920
<v Speaker 2>going to miss out on an amazing relationship. And so

0:31:31.320 --> 0:31:36.040
<v Speaker 2>I always wanted my circle to be open and not closed,

0:31:36.560 --> 0:31:41.080
<v Speaker 2>and so that required having an empty chair. It's two sided.

0:31:41.240 --> 0:31:44.840
<v Speaker 2>It's the chair can be held in grief, in memorial

0:31:45.200 --> 0:31:48.960
<v Speaker 2>in you know, sadness of a friendship ending, but then

0:31:48.960 --> 0:31:51.080
<v Speaker 2>it can also turn and be like, well, I have

0:31:51.120 --> 0:31:53.880
<v Speaker 2>an open seat at my table sort of like that's

0:31:53.880 --> 0:31:56.440
<v Speaker 2>like Taylor Swift's blank space. I have a blank space

0:31:56.440 --> 0:31:56.680
<v Speaker 2>for you.

0:31:57.400 --> 0:32:00.480
<v Speaker 1>I know. I love that because I'm I'm a big

0:32:00.480 --> 0:32:02.760
<v Speaker 1>believer that God sends you people all the time, and

0:32:02.800 --> 0:32:08.800
<v Speaker 1>so it's being open open eyes to that, like I'm

0:32:09.000 --> 0:32:13.440
<v Speaker 1>I will I will welcome people in when it feels like,

0:32:13.840 --> 0:32:15.640
<v Speaker 1>you know, that empty seat, like I just I love

0:32:15.680 --> 0:32:17.920
<v Speaker 1>that even though I can be guarded and not trust,

0:32:18.000 --> 0:32:20.200
<v Speaker 1>I still am open to the like, Okay, is this

0:32:20.360 --> 0:32:22.800
<v Speaker 1>someone that, like I'm, it's supposed to move and me

0:32:22.920 --> 0:32:25.360
<v Speaker 1>in a certain way and like, you know, help me

0:32:25.680 --> 0:32:28.920
<v Speaker 1>with the season or something or so I'm very mindful

0:32:28.960 --> 0:32:32.120
<v Speaker 1>of that piece, and I'm also curious to wrap up.

0:32:32.200 --> 0:32:35.160
<v Speaker 1>There's a lot of when we do talk about friendships,

0:32:35.200 --> 0:32:36.680
<v Speaker 1>a lot of people are like, how do you deal

0:32:36.760 --> 0:32:38.880
<v Speaker 1>with friendship breakup? So it's like, if there's someone out

0:32:38.880 --> 0:32:42.400
<v Speaker 1>there that's listening that wants to reconcile a friendship breakup,

0:32:42.440 --> 0:32:43.800
<v Speaker 1>but they don't want to be the first one, right

0:32:43.840 --> 0:32:45.760
<v Speaker 1>because like I know, like with me and my best friend,

0:32:45.800 --> 0:32:48.720
<v Speaker 1>it's like sometimes we're just so stubborn and so we

0:32:48.720 --> 0:32:49.880
<v Speaker 1>don't want to be the first one to be like

0:32:49.960 --> 0:32:53.680
<v Speaker 1>I'm sorry, and so like, how would you, like, what

0:32:53.720 --> 0:32:55.680
<v Speaker 1>would you say to the person that like misses their

0:32:55.680 --> 0:32:58.240
<v Speaker 1>best friend they had to fall out and they want

0:32:58.280 --> 0:32:59.080
<v Speaker 1>to like get it back.

0:32:59.680 --> 0:33:01.680
<v Speaker 2>Okay, well you have to lose the ego part of it.

0:33:02.040 --> 0:33:05.160
<v Speaker 2>You have to. You just have to talk yourself off

0:33:05.200 --> 0:33:07.400
<v Speaker 2>that legend be the first to reach out. And then

0:33:07.480 --> 0:33:11.040
<v Speaker 2>let me explain what I did with my friend that

0:33:11.080 --> 0:33:14.440
<v Speaker 2>I described that we had a text rift in the

0:33:14.440 --> 0:33:16.520
<v Speaker 2>middle of the pandemic. It's how I start the book off.

0:33:17.480 --> 0:33:22.520
<v Speaker 2>I could tell by our interactions after I said the

0:33:22.560 --> 0:33:25.840
<v Speaker 2>thing that hurt her feelings, that she was so willing

0:33:25.840 --> 0:33:27.920
<v Speaker 2>to end our friendship, and I did not want that

0:33:28.000 --> 0:33:30.480
<v Speaker 2>to happen. So what I did was, this is a

0:33:30.480 --> 0:33:34.760
<v Speaker 2>silly story, but I am glad to tell it. I

0:33:34.800 --> 0:33:36.480
<v Speaker 2>asked her to come over so we could talk face

0:33:36.480 --> 0:33:40.800
<v Speaker 2>to face. We sat in the backyard because this was

0:33:40.800 --> 0:33:43.240
<v Speaker 2>fall twenty twenty. Who sat in the backyard six feet apart?

0:33:43.760 --> 0:33:48.440
<v Speaker 2>I set up my backyard. It looked like a date night.

0:33:49.280 --> 0:33:50.640
<v Speaker 1>Oh my god, I am obsessed.

0:33:50.720 --> 0:33:55.960
<v Speaker 2>I love that I had flowers, I had champagne. I

0:33:56.000 --> 0:33:58.760
<v Speaker 2>put like candles out like I almost giggled once I

0:33:58.840 --> 0:34:00.800
<v Speaker 2>kind of got it going because I'll like, this fully

0:34:00.800 --> 0:34:03.440
<v Speaker 2>looks like I'm trying to seduce her. It's fine. I

0:34:03.560 --> 0:34:07.760
<v Speaker 2>wanted to give the conversation and the friendship like a reverence.

0:34:08.480 --> 0:34:11.680
<v Speaker 2>Like I wanted her to walk in the backyard and

0:34:11.880 --> 0:34:16.640
<v Speaker 2>feel like I cared because I did right, and that

0:34:16.800 --> 0:34:21.920
<v Speaker 2>this was like my last ditch effort to make this work.

0:34:22.480 --> 0:34:25.360
<v Speaker 2>So I did this because I had had a friendship

0:34:25.360 --> 0:34:27.960
<v Speaker 2>breakup in the past, A dear, dear friendship breakup in

0:34:28.040 --> 0:34:32.600
<v Speaker 2>my past, that I didn't fight for that friendship. I

0:34:32.719 --> 0:34:35.759
<v Speaker 2>let it end. I had so many regrets after for

0:34:35.800 --> 0:34:37.800
<v Speaker 2>all the things I didn't say, even if the friendship

0:34:37.840 --> 0:34:40.680
<v Speaker 2>was going to end, I wish that I had expressed

0:34:40.719 --> 0:34:42.200
<v Speaker 2>things in a different way, you know, just like we

0:34:42.280 --> 0:34:44.880
<v Speaker 2>do with romantic relationships when we are like I understand

0:34:44.880 --> 0:34:48.200
<v Speaker 2>why this is ending, but also I want to like

0:34:48.400 --> 0:34:50.000
<v Speaker 2>leave it all on the table, like I want to

0:34:50.040 --> 0:34:52.600
<v Speaker 2>say all the things. I had not done this with

0:34:52.600 --> 0:34:56.000
<v Speaker 2>this friendship in my past. So if this this twenty

0:34:56.080 --> 0:34:58.759
<v Speaker 2>twenty friendship rift I was going through, if it was

0:34:58.800 --> 0:35:00.520
<v Speaker 2>going to end, I was not going to make the

0:35:00.560 --> 0:35:02.680
<v Speaker 2>same mistake like I was going to leave it all

0:35:02.719 --> 0:35:06.359
<v Speaker 2>out on the blanket with the flowers like I was.

0:35:06.880 --> 0:35:09.160
<v Speaker 2>I was going to let her know if she chose

0:35:09.200 --> 0:35:11.600
<v Speaker 2>to end it. I wanted her to know I loved

0:35:11.600 --> 0:35:14.080
<v Speaker 2>her and that I was sorry and everything and.

0:35:14.200 --> 0:35:16.120
<v Speaker 1>Did everything you could do. I did everything like you

0:35:16.160 --> 0:35:17.960
<v Speaker 1>could walk away going okay, I did everything.

0:35:18.040 --> 0:35:21.200
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, why are we Why do we only put that

0:35:21.239 --> 0:35:25.920
<v Speaker 2>type of effort into romantic relationships? Like my friendships are

0:35:26.040 --> 0:35:28.799
<v Speaker 2>so important to me. I didn't want it to end.

0:35:29.120 --> 0:35:32.640
<v Speaker 2>I treated it like the weighty conversation that it was.

0:35:33.239 --> 0:35:36.160
<v Speaker 2>And she told me later when she walked into the backyard,

0:35:36.680 --> 0:35:39.040
<v Speaker 2>she was definitely sort of mad and like a defensive

0:35:39.080 --> 0:35:41.080
<v Speaker 2>mode whatever. And then when she walked in, she sort

0:35:41.120 --> 0:35:44.120
<v Speaker 2>of melted because she could see immediately what I was

0:35:44.160 --> 0:35:45.920
<v Speaker 2>trying to do. And we still went on to have

0:35:45.960 --> 0:35:48.520
<v Speaker 2>a card conversation. We still both cried, we still had

0:35:48.520 --> 0:35:51.879
<v Speaker 2>moments where we were defensive and irritated, but we were

0:35:51.920 --> 0:35:54.560
<v Speaker 2>sitting with these flowers and candles.

0:35:56.120 --> 0:35:58.959
<v Speaker 1>Did she accept the final rose? Yes? She did.

0:35:59.520 --> 0:36:01.440
<v Speaker 2>And you know, this actually sort of ties back to

0:36:01.480 --> 0:36:03.520
<v Speaker 2>the empty chair in a weird way, because you have

0:36:03.600 --> 0:36:06.960
<v Speaker 2>to be willing to receive. You have to be willing

0:36:07.000 --> 0:36:12.120
<v Speaker 2>to receive what people are offering to you. And I

0:36:12.280 --> 0:36:16.160
<v Speaker 2>was offering a sincere apology and a hope to mend

0:36:16.520 --> 0:36:20.640
<v Speaker 2>that friendship, and she chose to receive it. I'm glad

0:36:20.640 --> 0:36:22.000
<v Speaker 2>she did, right.

0:36:22.680 --> 0:36:24.800
<v Speaker 1>I love that. Well, that's I mean. I'm excited to

0:36:24.840 --> 0:36:28.239
<v Speaker 1>read your book. So thank you Laura so much for

0:36:28.280 --> 0:36:31.040
<v Speaker 1>coming on the show. Everyone get the life console ten

0:36:31.160 --> 0:36:34.960
<v Speaker 1>friends every woman needs. I love it. Thank you so

0:36:35.040 --> 0:36:37.040
<v Speaker 1>much for coming on the show. I really appreciate it.

0:36:37.200 --> 0:36:39.239
<v Speaker 2>This was awesome. Thank you for having me.