WEBVTT - What's Left 0:00:00.160 --> 0:00:02.480 What you hear in this podcast does not implicate any 0:00:02.480 --> 0:00:05.880 individual or entity in any criminal activity. The views and 0:00:05.920 --> 0:00:09.200 opinions are solely those of the individuals participating in the podcast. 0:00:15.160 --> 0:00:17.560 In January of this year, I made my way to 0:00:17.600 --> 0:00:21.440 the courthouse in Ginger. It had been almost exactly a 0:00:21.560 --> 0:00:24.360 full year since the case against Renee was filed and 0:00:24.440 --> 0:00:28.560 we started looking into it. The courthouse was full of 0:00:28.640 --> 0:00:34.040 journalists from the States, Germany, the Netherlands, Ireland, all waiting 0:00:34.080 --> 0:00:40.239 for news. The plaintiffs were also here. Gimbo Zubda, the 0:00:40.280 --> 0:00:43.720 mother of Tlali, was in the courtyard speaking with her lawyers, 0:00:44.479 --> 0:00:48.040 and Kakai Rose, the other mother in the case, was 0:00:48.040 --> 0:00:52.199 sitting in a corner by herself. I waved hello and 0:00:52.240 --> 0:00:55.200 she gave me a smile. I had met Kakai a 0:00:55.240 --> 0:00:58.320 couple of times by then. In the beginning, she was 0:00:58.360 --> 0:01:01.960 shy and didn't open up very easy way, but over 0:01:02.000 --> 0:01:04.160 the course of that year she became a bit more 0:01:04.200 --> 0:01:07.440 friendly with me. We didn't speak the same language, but 0:01:07.520 --> 0:01:09.800 she always waved and greeted me when she saw me, 0:01:10.360 --> 0:01:14.039 asked me how I was doing that day. No one 0:01:14.080 --> 0:01:17.160 was interpreting for her, but she seemed glad to be there, 0:01:17.760 --> 0:01:23.080 to just be present. Sitting on a wooden bench outside 0:01:23.080 --> 0:01:25.839 the courtroom, I couldn't help but think about the first 0:01:25.880 --> 0:01:28.959 time I was here, about the energy that Kelsey and 0:01:28.959 --> 0:01:32.520 Olivia brought with them into this courthouse when they joined 0:01:32.520 --> 0:01:35.240 the lawyers who were filing a civil suit against Renee 0:01:35.280 --> 0:01:39.880 and serving his children back in twenty nine. So this 0:01:39.959 --> 0:01:42.040 is what I want to see right now. For me, 0:01:42.280 --> 0:01:45.720 this is so important, you know, it will help me 0:01:45.800 --> 0:01:48.800 more forward. This is historical. It's going down the books 0:01:48.840 --> 0:01:51.320 of history in my country, in Uganda and the world 0:01:51.360 --> 0:01:53.600 as well, that this is the first time that someone 0:01:53.720 --> 0:01:56.240 is looking into work that is done by a white person. 0:01:56.600 --> 0:02:00.440 More feels that they're helping so much, like we compass 0:02:00.520 --> 0:02:04.080 of Africa and we're sacrificing. To Livia, I just wanted 0:02:04.080 --> 0:02:06.720 to show the wall that it's not sacrifice. She was 0:02:06.760 --> 0:02:09.880 not doing us any sacrifice, but she was just humming 0:02:10.000 --> 0:02:17.400 us like she was destroying our society. A lot had 0:02:17.480 --> 0:02:20.480 changed since those early days when I used to think 0:02:20.480 --> 0:02:24.040 that No Waite Saviors was our story. It had gotten 0:02:24.080 --> 0:02:27.080 so much bigger. It was about a whole system of 0:02:27.120 --> 0:02:31.840 international aid and injustice, the trauma of people affected by it, 0:02:32.560 --> 0:02:37.520 and the moral dilemma of doing the right thing. Renee 0:02:37.560 --> 0:02:40.720 and no White Saviors began to seem like small characters 0:02:40.919 --> 0:02:45.320 in a much larger saga. Eventually we made our way 0:02:45.320 --> 0:02:48.600 into the courtroom. After an hour of hearing news on 0:02:48.639 --> 0:02:55.040 other local cases, the judge finally mentioned Renee's case in 0:02:55.080 --> 0:02:59.840 association with iHeart Media, I'm ROGI Gola, I'm Hee make Con, 0:03:00.560 --> 0:03:05.079 I'm Malcolm Burnley and this is the missionary Episode eight. 0:03:06.080 --> 0:03:17.800 What's left? Media interest in Renee Bach and serving his 0:03:17.919 --> 0:03:21.760 children has ebbed and flowed throughout the past year. One 0:03:21.760 --> 0:03:24.120 of the only things I found to be consistent in 0:03:24.160 --> 0:03:27.280 the story was the lawyer representing the women in the case. 0:03:27.960 --> 0:03:31.000 Her name is Prima qua Gala. She runs the Women's 0:03:31.000 --> 0:03:33.760 pro bono initiative in Uganda, and she was one of 0:03:33.800 --> 0:03:37.000 the very first people I interviewed for this story last year. 0:03:37.800 --> 0:03:40.680 Even then, she seemed pretty confident about the case she 0:03:40.760 --> 0:03:44.560 had in hand. Perhaps every lawyer feels that way, but 0:03:44.680 --> 0:03:48.120 Prima is one of the few health rights lawyers in Uganda, 0:03:48.800 --> 0:03:51.560 and she had taken people bigger than Renee to court, 0:03:52.040 --> 0:03:56.200 even litigated against the Ugandan government. So Prima had guts 0:03:56.400 --> 0:03:59.400 and experience. I thought it was crazy, according to much 0:03:59.400 --> 0:04:03.160 doing something like that taking place in our country, especially 0:04:03.280 --> 0:04:06.480 I mean from a white person. We look at white 0:04:06.560 --> 0:04:11.000 people as very good people. They have very good intentions 0:04:11.040 --> 0:04:14.120 for us. So when someone told me that, I said, 0:04:14.200 --> 0:04:17.760 oh my god. I have been doing cases in the 0:04:17.839 --> 0:04:21.160 health sector for almost tamyas now I had never come 0:04:21.200 --> 0:04:25.479 across anything like that. By early two thousand nineteen, Prima 0:04:25.560 --> 0:04:28.640 had the testimonies of these two women. She also had 0:04:28.680 --> 0:04:32.160 clear evidence that serving his children had been an unlicensed 0:04:32.200 --> 0:04:36.360 health facility and was still providing advanced medicine to children 0:04:36.440 --> 0:04:40.280 like tolal A. That alone is illegal in Uganda, as 0:04:40.320 --> 0:04:42.360 we've said, in the same way that it is in 0:04:42.400 --> 0:04:46.480 the US, where it's a felony. Keep in mind, medical 0:04:46.560 --> 0:04:51.799 malpractice and fraud isn't a uniquely Ugandan problem. Imagine finding 0:04:51.800 --> 0:04:54.840 out your doctor didn't have a license to practice. Like 0:04:54.960 --> 0:04:57.920 so many other fake health care workers in Colorado, this 0:04:57.960 --> 0:05:01.200 one is also accused of tending to be someone she's 0:05:01.240 --> 0:05:04.279 not to treat some of our state's most vulnerable people. 0:05:04.400 --> 0:05:06.800 Police say they got an anonymous tip that Golden was 0:05:06.839 --> 0:05:10.120 practicing as a medical doctor but with no license. In 0:05:10.160 --> 0:05:14.000 North Carolina, state regulators are letting dozens of these impostors 0:05:14.000 --> 0:05:17.640 go unlicensed and unpunished. The system is flawed. She's able 0:05:17.680 --> 0:05:19.839 to slip through these cracks like this over and over again. 0:05:20.640 --> 0:05:22.840 Over the past year. I would check in on and 0:05:22.880 --> 0:05:26.320 off with Prima and her partner, Beatrice Kayaga to see 0:05:26.360 --> 0:05:28.760 if they had made any other breakthroughs in this case, 0:05:29.240 --> 0:05:33.080 found any new witnesses that we hadn't, or any outstanding 0:05:33.120 --> 0:05:36.719 piece of evidence, maybe a video of Renee performing surgery 0:05:37.120 --> 0:05:40.640 or something like that, And for the most part, there wasn't, 0:05:41.160 --> 0:05:44.039 but they didn't need it. My cass is not really 0:05:44.080 --> 0:05:47.839 about her character who she is. A case is very simple. 0:05:48.560 --> 0:05:51.800 It's just that she was not licensed to do any 0:05:51.880 --> 0:05:58.480 medical work. Her facility did not have license. Prima's focused, 0:05:58.680 --> 0:06:02.000 simple and narrow approach to this case always struck me 0:06:02.600 --> 0:06:05.480 because it was such a stark contrast from the full 0:06:05.640 --> 0:06:09.800 range and volume of accusations against Renee that Renee had 0:06:09.839 --> 0:06:15.840 stolen babies from hospitals, experimented on children, and bribed Ugandan officials. 0:06:16.320 --> 0:06:20.040 An unlicensed facility seems like a rather minor, albeit still 0:06:20.080 --> 0:06:24.600 illegal fact, and that's been the most frustrating and challenging 0:06:24.640 --> 0:06:29.120 part of reporting this story. The more complex the accusations became, 0:06:29.440 --> 0:06:32.080 the harder it was to be able to know factually 0:06:32.440 --> 0:06:35.600 was it true or not, because they relied on conflicting 0:06:35.680 --> 0:06:40.599 anecdotal evidence and interpretations of Renee's actions. I learned this 0:06:40.720 --> 0:06:42.799 as I went to track down more than a dozen 0:06:42.920 --> 0:06:46.040 Ugandan health workers who had worked at serving his children, 0:06:46.440 --> 0:06:52.159 as well as senior health officials. So I can see 0:06:52.200 --> 0:06:56.360 why Prima kept her case so narrow to her. Those 0:06:56.360 --> 0:07:00.880 other questions are besides the point her cases that you 0:07:01.000 --> 0:07:04.600 gone and women like Kakai had a basic right for 0:07:04.680 --> 0:07:09.080 themselves and their children to be treated at legitimate health 0:07:09.200 --> 0:07:19.640 facilities within Uganda's health care system by licensed professionals, the 0:07:19.800 --> 0:07:22.360 right to dignity for me to ask for what has 0:07:22.400 --> 0:07:26.600 given my child, and you can't give me answers because 0:07:26.640 --> 0:07:30.600 I don't deserve any. But you took my child away 0:07:30.640 --> 0:07:34.000 with the promise that you're going to help them, but 0:07:34.080 --> 0:07:39.200 then you can't give me feedback. That's in human, it's degrading. 0:07:39.360 --> 0:07:43.239 It's for years on end. She can't get any answers 0:07:43.360 --> 0:07:47.280 until we by the case. She says Renee had violated 0:07:47.320 --> 0:07:51.440 the rights of the most vulnerable women. Rights given are 0:07:51.560 --> 0:07:56.000 Uganda's Constitution. Most of these women are illiterate. They've never 0:07:56.040 --> 0:07:59.120 been to school, they can't speak a word but English. 0:07:59.680 --> 0:08:03.600 They don't have jobs, they can't and even fifty dollars 0:08:03.600 --> 0:08:09.160 in a year they can't. Someone who is vulnerable, very poor, 0:08:09.960 --> 0:08:13.760 and is looking at her child dying, when someone tells 0:08:13.760 --> 0:08:16.920 her that Rainie's hope and Rainy is doing this, they 0:08:17.000 --> 0:08:20.000 go because they're looking for help. And then here's a 0:08:20.000 --> 0:08:22.280 white person saying, oh, I'm going to give your food. 0:08:22.360 --> 0:08:24.600 I mean, you go to her home. There's a bed, 0:08:24.720 --> 0:08:28.240 there is porridge, there is tea, you can use the bathroom, 0:08:28.440 --> 0:08:33.360 you can wash your clothes. It seems like heaven to them. 0:08:33.440 --> 0:08:36.239 Wouldn't you gone and have gone that long without oversight? 0:08:37.679 --> 0:08:41.920 They wouldn't last a year, not even five months. People 0:08:41.920 --> 0:08:46.600 would say where are you getting that money? Who are you? 0:08:46.440 --> 0:08:49.440 You know, even those illiterate women would ask are you 0:08:49.520 --> 0:08:52.720 qualified to do this? They stand up to you and 0:08:52.760 --> 0:08:56.320 ask that. But this is a white person that's intimate 0:08:56.360 --> 0:08:59.079 dating already that you're white, and we assume that the 0:08:59.200 --> 0:09:03.760 white people are educated people. In fact, in May two 0:09:03.760 --> 0:09:07.480 thousand fifteen, only two months after serving his children, was 0:09:07.520 --> 0:09:11.679 shut down. Health clinics in northern Uganda were shut down 0:09:11.920 --> 0:09:16.360 for nearly the same reasons. Officials say the clinics at 0:09:16.360 --> 0:09:18.800 the level of health center to are being operated by 0:09:18.880 --> 0:09:22.520 underqualified people. The aim of the operation is to protect 0:09:22.559 --> 0:09:25.400 the public from home. Those who are arrested will be 0:09:25.480 --> 0:09:31.760 changed in court. Seven people were arrested and while serving 0:09:31.800 --> 0:09:35.560 his children was shut down. Renee was never arrested, nor 0:09:35.760 --> 0:09:39.840 were any members of her staff, and they were able 0:09:39.880 --> 0:09:43.960 to reopen, albeit in a different district. Now, whether that 0:09:44.120 --> 0:09:48.480 was due to pour oversight, bribes or genuine reform, we 0:09:48.559 --> 0:09:52.160 still don't know. The wise in the house. In both 0:09:52.240 --> 0:09:55.600 Uganda and in the US, people have gone to jail 0:09:55.679 --> 0:10:01.000 for these violations or faced other repercussions were it's still 0:10:01.000 --> 0:10:04.760 in Virginia. Oh. There is no such thing as running 0:10:04.760 --> 0:10:08.640 away from the law in this world, especially in a 0:10:08.760 --> 0:10:13.760 civil case. WHOA that can be enforced anywhere. It can 0:10:13.840 --> 0:10:17.480 even be enforced on us soil. We just have to 0:10:17.640 --> 0:10:21.920 forward the judgment to the authorities in the U s 0:10:21.960 --> 0:10:25.360 and they'll get her. Prina also told me that whether 0:10:25.400 --> 0:10:27.640 they win or lose the case, it will have still 0:10:27.679 --> 0:10:30.760 made a difference. I see people are becoming more alive 0:10:30.840 --> 0:10:34.040 to challenging the system. People are starting to say, no, 0:10:34.480 --> 0:10:39.319 we can't do better, start questioning the system and the services. 0:10:39.920 --> 0:10:44.680 So it is through cases like this I like to say, 0:10:44.720 --> 0:10:46.960 sometimes it's not that we want to win, but we 0:10:47.000 --> 0:10:50.520 want to cause people to learn to question because maybe 0:10:50.520 --> 0:10:53.800 I will lose. But next time a white person comes around, 0:10:53.840 --> 0:10:58.480 they're going to think about the expenses they have to 0:10:58.480 --> 0:11:03.400 to incur if someone came up with a suit against them, 0:11:03.480 --> 0:11:07.000 because you would say, oh, you lost, No I did not. 0:11:07.200 --> 0:11:12.520 Really has spent money defending herself, so she is aware 0:11:12.600 --> 0:11:14.880 that she can't get away with what she's doing anymore. 0:11:15.760 --> 0:11:19.079 So it's a stut. We always have to start from somewhere. 0:11:23.320 --> 0:11:27.560 This story has tapped into a much bigger conversation about 0:11:27.600 --> 0:11:30.679 the role of white people in Africa more broadly, a 0:11:30.800 --> 0:11:34.600 discussion that Africans and black people have been having for decades. 0:11:35.480 --> 0:11:40.880 In the past, the conversation was about colonizers, missionaries, imperialists. 0:11:41.320 --> 0:11:47.040 These days it extends to white journalists, aid workers, humanitarians, activists, 0:11:47.040 --> 0:11:52.040 and social entrepreneurs. Why do white journalists have certain privileges, 0:11:52.520 --> 0:11:56.000 Why are white people called expats instead of immigrants, Why 0:11:56.000 --> 0:11:59.319 do white aid workers have these six figure salaries? Well, 0:11:59.440 --> 0:12:02.480 you've gone an experts get pennies on the dollar. Why 0:12:02.520 --> 0:12:05.920 do white entrepreneurs get so much more venture capital compared 0:12:05.960 --> 0:12:09.720 to local African startups. These are all questions that I 0:12:09.800 --> 0:12:14.280 hear constantly, and Serving his Children and Renee were smack 0:12:14.320 --> 0:12:18.559 in the middle of this conversation. But the question that 0:12:18.640 --> 0:12:23.679 remains is what's next? Do white foreigners have a role 0:12:23.720 --> 0:12:30.320 in contemporary Africa at all? Months into reporting this story, 0:12:30.520 --> 0:12:33.840 I finally went to Serving his Children's current facility in 0:12:33.960 --> 0:12:39.040 Chi Gondolo. Remember now, it's operating within a government facility, 0:12:39.120 --> 0:12:41.959 and from what we could tell, was operating by the books. 0:12:42.440 --> 0:12:45.679 It's run by Ugandan health professionals, but is funded by 0:12:45.720 --> 0:12:50.800 Serving his Children. Inside there's a small sign with the 0:12:50.880 --> 0:12:54.400 logos of Serving His Children on one side and Uganda's 0:12:54.400 --> 0:12:58.480 Ministry of Health on the other. The staff invited me 0:12:58.559 --> 0:13:01.280 into the children's ward, so I took off my shoes 0:13:01.320 --> 0:13:05.200 and entered. It looked like an ordinary clinic with child 0:13:05.320 --> 0:13:09.360 sized hospital beds lining both sides of the room, cartoons 0:13:09.400 --> 0:13:13.000 on the walls. But when I saw the children, I 0:13:13.120 --> 0:13:19.320 was shocked. By then, I had passed through countless photos 0:13:19.360 --> 0:13:23.559 of emaciated, bloated and utterly sick children who had been 0:13:23.640 --> 0:13:27.200 posted on Serving His Children's website over the years, or 0:13:27.280 --> 0:13:31.800 on the blogs of other missionaries and volunteers. Standing in 0:13:31.840 --> 0:13:35.080 that room, I was struck with such a strong sense 0:13:35.080 --> 0:13:38.800 of deja vu. In the center, there were mothers sitting 0:13:38.840 --> 0:13:42.920 on the floor with their babies whose skin was peeling 0:13:43.080 --> 0:13:48.760 off due to infections related to severe malnutrition. The mothers 0:13:48.800 --> 0:13:52.559 were bathing their children in a brownish liquid that nurses 0:13:52.600 --> 0:13:56.160 said was an iodine solution to help their skin heal. 0:13:58.960 --> 0:14:01.640 The staff told me these mothers had come from far 0:14:01.720 --> 0:14:07.040 off rural areas where severe malnutrition is still a problem 0:14:07.080 --> 0:14:13.480 and access to affordable healthcare is still limited. I still 0:14:13.520 --> 0:14:17.520 think back to that day a year later, after trying 0:14:17.520 --> 0:14:20.520 to piece together the parts of this story to figure 0:14:20.520 --> 0:14:23.560 out the facts. The clearest thing to me still is 0:14:23.600 --> 0:14:27.720 that the problem of severe child malnutrition, this problem that 0:14:27.840 --> 0:14:30.760 a young Renee thought she could end, that the Ugandan 0:14:30.800 --> 0:14:36.280 government has been trying to tackle, is still a big problem. 0:14:36.320 --> 0:14:40.440 The news attention for this story will eventually fade, and 0:14:40.520 --> 0:14:45.200 the court case could settle, but there are still mothers 0:14:45.280 --> 0:14:49.480 who are desperately looking for care and children who are 0:14:49.560 --> 0:14:54.960 still suffering from severe malnutrition. So When I think back 0:14:55.000 --> 0:14:58.760 to that day, I still wonder what will happen to 0:14:58.840 --> 0:15:26.440 them m Back in the summer, I was shocked that 0:15:26.520 --> 0:15:29.920 Renee ever spoke to me, But the truth is she 0:15:30.040 --> 0:15:33.880 was never fully bought into this podcast. I figured early 0:15:33.960 --> 0:15:36.280 on that the best way to keep her involved would 0:15:36.320 --> 0:15:38.760 be to indulge her point of view, to make it 0:15:38.800 --> 0:15:41.880 abundantly clear that part of my process was to see 0:15:41.880 --> 0:15:44.760 her side of things. And I spent more than a 0:15:44.800 --> 0:15:49.400 dozen hours talking with her, but each interaction felt like 0:15:49.480 --> 0:15:55.040 meeting her all over again. The real Renee was walled off, unknowable. 0:15:56.200 --> 0:16:00.080 There was always an emotional barrier. Sometimes it was a 0:16:00.160 --> 0:16:04.320 hard time limit, a lawyer listening by phone, or the 0:16:04.440 --> 0:16:08.000 over politeness of my questions trying not to offend her. 0:16:08.560 --> 0:16:12.840 We went long gaps without speaking because Renee stopped participating 0:16:12.880 --> 0:16:16.640 at multiple points. The closest I got to a breakthrough 0:16:16.960 --> 0:16:21.320 was a few weeks before Christmas of last year. Are 0:16:21.680 --> 0:16:32.400 good talking about well marked? It doesn't have these people 0:16:32.400 --> 0:16:36.360 that are using. Renee invited me over for lunch and 0:16:36.440 --> 0:16:41.320 what wound up being our last interview. Her place was small, 0:16:41.560 --> 0:16:45.720 a converted garage on a friend's property, surrounded by woods 0:16:45.720 --> 0:16:50.160 and farmland. When I entered, there was the aroma of 0:16:50.200 --> 0:16:53.640 fresh bread in the kitchen above a space heater. In 0:16:53.640 --> 0:16:56.800 the living room next to Renee's bed, there were a 0:16:56.840 --> 0:16:59.960 few stockings and tinsel on the wall, and the rest 0:17:00.040 --> 0:17:03.760 to the apartment was dedicated to the baby. The younger 0:17:03.840 --> 0:17:06.640 of her two adopted daughters, less than two years old, 0:17:07.040 --> 0:17:10.119 was awake when I got there. She was scrambling around 0:17:10.119 --> 0:17:13.880 the place and smashing face first into a mirror, from 0:17:13.920 --> 0:17:19.520 which she got up giggling to look at yourself, because 0:17:19.520 --> 0:17:26.919 you're so cute. Renee left Uganda in October two thousand 0:17:27.000 --> 0:17:31.720 eighteen to finalize her daughter's adoption. The court case against 0:17:31.720 --> 0:17:35.800 her was filed three months later, and Renee hasn't returned since. 0:17:36.680 --> 0:17:39.280 It's why there are almost no mementos in her house 0:17:39.520 --> 0:17:42.639 from her entire time in Uganda, which is we're wondering, 0:17:42.800 --> 0:17:45.320 is anything from Uganda or is it pretty much all 0:17:45.320 --> 0:17:53.439 stuff you required names. My sister made that Eileen Chrism. 0:17:54.359 --> 0:17:57.200 She's talking about a cow skull named Boris on her wall. 0:18:00.359 --> 0:18:03.159 When her daughter took a nap, Renee, her mom and 0:18:03.200 --> 0:18:08.879 I walked around outside for a bit. The property was 0:18:08.920 --> 0:18:13.200 a hundred forty acres. The trails went back for miles, 0:18:13.240 --> 0:18:16.000 but right next to Renee's apartment was a k barn. 0:18:16.920 --> 0:18:20.480 It looked like a wedding venue with polished carriages inside, 0:18:21.560 --> 0:18:23.600 just like the how she grew up in. There were 0:18:23.680 --> 0:18:29.840 quotations inscribed throughout the property Psalm nine one. The heavens 0:18:29.880 --> 0:18:33.000 declare the glory of God, the skies proclaimed the work 0:18:33.040 --> 0:18:37.080 of his hands. And there are far better things ahead 0:18:37.320 --> 0:18:42.720 than any we leave behind. C. S. Lewis from our 0:18:42.840 --> 0:18:46.440 very first interview, Renee used famous quotes as a way 0:18:46.440 --> 0:18:50.520 of grounding herself amidst all this controversy. There's a really 0:18:50.560 --> 0:18:53.520 great quote on my brain now, but basically just talking 0:18:53.560 --> 0:18:56.199 about like there are so many people that will just 0:18:56.680 --> 0:18:59.440 sit and point fingers at people that are in the arena, 0:18:59.640 --> 0:19:04.040 you know of blood, sweat and tears um, but like 0:19:04.080 --> 0:19:07.520 who are they to really speak into that. She found 0:19:07.520 --> 0:19:10.359 the quote later and texted it to me. It came 0:19:10.440 --> 0:19:14.680 from Teddy Roosevelt. It is not the critic who counts, 0:19:15.440 --> 0:19:17.960 not the man who points out how the strong man 0:19:18.080 --> 0:19:22.480 stumbles or where the doer of deeds could have done 0:19:22.480 --> 0:19:26.119 the better. The credit belongs to the man who is 0:19:26.240 --> 0:19:31.399 actually in the arena. Whose face is mob Bob dustin 0:19:31.600 --> 0:19:37.080 sweat and blood, who straws valiantly, who airs, who comes 0:19:37.080 --> 0:19:41.360 short again and again, because there is no effort without 0:19:41.520 --> 0:19:46.720 error and shortcoming. If he fails, at least fails while 0:19:46.800 --> 0:19:50.919 daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with 0:19:50.960 --> 0:19:57.400 those cold and timid souls who neither know victory nor defeat. 0:19:59.400 --> 0:20:02.320 During the we published this, it was announced that the 0:20:02.320 --> 0:20:06.440 Teddy Roosevelt statue outside the American Museum of Natural History 0:20:06.600 --> 0:20:11.439 would be removed expressly because of its racist depiction of 0:20:11.560 --> 0:20:16.760 black and indigenous people. Under the President's subjugation, he was 0:20:16.800 --> 0:20:21.840 a cheerleader for colonization, which he justified with poetic passages 0:20:22.080 --> 0:20:32.400 like the one Renee shared. Was it worth it? Did 0:20:32.440 --> 0:20:36.520 I hear God wrong? These were the questions Renee said 0:20:36.560 --> 0:20:40.600 she'd been asking herself lately, the things she never stopped 0:20:40.600 --> 0:20:43.399 to ask of herself all those years in Uganda. So 0:20:43.600 --> 0:20:47.800 I'm really curious to talk about, you know, especially leading 0:20:47.840 --> 0:20:51.639 up to if there were moments that you recall of 0:20:51.760 --> 0:20:55.040 having self doubt about not so much submission of the organization, 0:20:55.119 --> 0:20:57.479 just about how are you were going about it, how 0:20:57.560 --> 0:20:59.919 much work you were doing, For example, like the workaholic 0:21:00.080 --> 0:21:04.520 thing that a I was so busy that I almost 0:21:04.560 --> 0:21:07.280 like didn't have time to probably doubt the things that 0:21:07.359 --> 0:21:10.720 were going on. Um, whether that's like right, wrong or indifferent, 0:21:10.960 --> 0:21:16.200 But I felt with such strong certainty that like serving 0:21:16.240 --> 0:21:18.440 as children was doing what it was supposed to do. 0:21:19.400 --> 0:21:21.919 As like ignorant and like kind of pumpous as it sounds, 0:21:21.960 --> 0:21:23.800 I didn't have a lot of self doubt back then, 0:21:23.800 --> 0:21:25.280 and I think part of that was because I was 0:21:25.320 --> 0:21:28.720 like young and ignorant and ambitious, and you know, like 0:21:29.280 --> 0:21:31.680 I didn't know what I didn't know. And I think 0:21:31.720 --> 0:21:35.680 that's some more now, Like did I just like totally 0:21:36.040 --> 0:21:38.840 waste my life and like ruin other people's lives? But 0:21:39.560 --> 0:21:42.720 doing the last decade of my life, um is more 0:21:42.840 --> 0:21:48.000 thought now. And I think I've always felt like sure 0:21:48.040 --> 0:21:51.160 of my decisions when I come to them, like all 0:21:51.200 --> 0:21:53.320 growing up and through high school and even like my 0:21:53.359 --> 0:21:55.080 decision to go to you gone to the first time, 0:21:55.119 --> 0:21:59.040 and once I made those decisions, I felt like such 0:21:59.080 --> 0:22:01.719 a strong conviction it was what I was supposed to do. 0:22:02.320 --> 0:22:07.200 And yeah, like I missed. I missed that feeling of 0:22:07.200 --> 0:22:09.640 of being assured that like I'm on the right path 0:22:09.680 --> 0:22:13.440 in life, and um, I definitely don't have that anymore. 0:22:25.280 --> 0:22:27.880 When I first began working on this story, I thought 0:22:27.880 --> 0:22:31.040 we were going to figure out the truth. Either Renee 0:22:31.080 --> 0:22:34.160 was a monster and she'd killed those kids, or she'd 0:22:34.160 --> 0:22:36.840 been wrongly accused and she was the victim of a 0:22:36.880 --> 0:22:40.959 tremendous injustice. But then I spent time with her and 0:22:41.000 --> 0:22:44.919 discovered what a mess this whole thing was, and I 0:22:44.960 --> 0:22:48.199 came to believe that Renee wants and has always wanted 0:22:48.400 --> 0:22:51.199 to be a force for good in this world. I 0:22:51.240 --> 0:22:55.480 really do believe that. Still, as we sat on the 0:22:55.480 --> 0:22:58.960 floor of her home, eating her mom's stew, I kept 0:22:59.040 --> 0:23:03.920 thinking about one simple fact, the same thing Helema could 0:23:03.960 --> 0:23:08.240 never get past. Renee had run an unlicensed facility where 0:23:08.280 --> 0:23:12.280 medicine was practiced on vulnerable children, something she'd never have 0:23:12.320 --> 0:23:15.639 gotten away with in the US, And if Renee wanted 0:23:15.680 --> 0:23:18.280 to make a difference, then she should go to jail 0:23:18.359 --> 0:23:21.240 for it. That's the only way there's going to be 0:23:21.280 --> 0:23:24.200 systemic change that we might have a shot at ending 0:23:24.200 --> 0:23:29.639 white saviorism. Watching Renee be a mom the empathy I 0:23:29.760 --> 0:23:34.040 felt it was hard to reconcile with these thoughts. But 0:23:34.080 --> 0:23:36.840 as we said before, this story was about so much 0:23:36.880 --> 0:23:40.160 more than just one woman. Renee was now a symbol. 0:23:40.920 --> 0:23:44.200 She's the monument that has to be topic and it's 0:23:44.840 --> 0:23:49.880 very hard. But I didn't say anything. I just sat there, listen. 0:23:50.160 --> 0:23:52.000 Did you even make a difference, because like, all I 0:23:52.040 --> 0:23:54.160 wanted to do was like make a difference and help people. 0:23:54.720 --> 0:23:56.959 But did I not help anyone? And did I not 0:23:57.000 --> 0:23:59.760 make a difference? Like that's why I'm being told that 0:24:00.040 --> 0:24:02.840 art by the world, you know, um, And so wrestling 0:24:02.840 --> 0:24:09.040 through that stuff really tough. Um. Before I left, I 0:24:09.080 --> 0:24:11.879 asked Renee if she had any pictures of the early 0:24:11.960 --> 0:24:15.760 days of serving his children before this all happened. So 0:24:15.800 --> 0:24:17.000 this was at the house. I don't know if you 0:24:17.040 --> 0:24:19.640 ever seen it. I guess I don't actually think I've seen. 0:24:20.560 --> 0:24:23.440 She pulled out an old laptop and began combing through 0:24:23.480 --> 0:24:26.360 folders and so like, this was my bedroom right here, 0:24:26.600 --> 0:24:29.160 and there's like a little small room and there were 0:24:29.160 --> 0:24:31.840 pictures of kids on pink swing sets on the porch, 0:24:33.840 --> 0:24:36.400 a photo of a camel that arrived one day at 0:24:36.400 --> 0:24:40.160 the center and never left. The day when ten baby 0:24:40.200 --> 0:24:43.600 goats were born and the staff cradled them all at once. 0:24:43.920 --> 0:24:45.600 It was a pretty happy place with the most part 0:24:45.640 --> 0:24:50.080 people were pretty I'm sure this was. This was our kitchen, 0:24:50.200 --> 0:24:54.320 and these two rooms turned into also rooms with cribs 0:24:54.359 --> 0:25:00.240 for kids, and that was the intensive care room. Then 0:25:00.280 --> 0:25:02.320 we got to photos that we talked about a lot 0:25:03.320 --> 0:25:06.760 sick kids before coming to serving his children and happy 0:25:06.880 --> 0:25:09.920 kids going home. And this little girl was actually admitted 0:25:10.240 --> 0:25:14.120 to the center when we um closed in two thousand fifteen. 0:25:14.119 --> 0:25:16.679 She was less than a kilo. She was like a 0:25:16.680 --> 0:25:19.680 pound or something. Yeah, she was in the center. Yeah, 0:25:19.720 --> 0:25:22.560 this was her in the ICU. So he was some 0:25:22.760 --> 0:25:25.480 before and after one. They were hung like this, so 0:25:25.600 --> 0:25:28.679 like before and after, before and after we had, you know, 0:25:28.760 --> 0:25:31.600 almost a thousand of those. They went like all the 0:25:31.640 --> 0:25:35.760 way down and all the way to the ceiling. After 0:25:35.760 --> 0:25:39.160 our center closed, these photos stayed up for a really 0:25:39.160 --> 0:25:42.840 long time. It was actually like a very emotional process 0:25:42.880 --> 0:25:45.119 for me to take. It was kind of like a 0:25:45.200 --> 0:25:49.000 morning I guess process too. That's probably a lot of 0:25:49.000 --> 0:25:55.760 a lot of things. That was where I left Renee, 0:25:56.600 --> 0:26:00.640 sorting through the memories, taking the good ones with her, 0:26:01.359 --> 0:26:05.720 leaving the bad ones behind, while her daughter, who knew 0:26:05.760 --> 0:26:11.000 nothing of this, slept peacefully in the other room. I mean, 0:26:11.080 --> 0:26:13.800 I would love to be able to work in the 0:26:13.880 --> 0:26:20.080 like humanitarian service industry. Again, um, I don't know if 0:26:20.119 --> 0:26:25.480 that's possible for a while. I'm not super favorably looked 0:26:25.560 --> 0:26:29.440 upon and so some of those circles. But I think 0:26:29.440 --> 0:26:35.160 this has helped remind me that like that is still 0:26:35.160 --> 0:26:37.800 my heartbeat, and I still do love that, And even 0:26:37.920 --> 0:26:41.639 though I've been so burned by it, I still a 0:26:41.680 --> 0:26:45.320 big part of my heart is still in that world. 0:27:04.320 --> 0:27:06.760 That day in the courtroom, the judge announced that after 0:27:06.840 --> 0:27:11.960 months enclosed or negotiations, both sides, Renee and the mothers 0:27:12.480 --> 0:27:15.639 still hadn't reached an agreement, so he ordered the case 0:27:15.760 --> 0:27:19.240 back to legal mediation, a last dig attempt to settle 0:27:19.280 --> 0:27:23.520 things out of court. After a whole year, it was 0:27:23.600 --> 0:27:26.040 tough to see any ending or any answers to this 0:27:26.040 --> 0:27:29.560