WEBVTT - Brinsley Schwarz 0:00:08.560 --> 0:00:13.160 Welcome, Welcome, Welcome back to the Bobmasu's podcast. My guest 0:00:13.200 --> 0:00:16.920 today is Brinsley Schwartz. Brinsley, good to have you here, 0:00:17.120 --> 0:00:20.520 could be here? What think okay? For the Americans were 0:00:20.520 --> 0:00:24.200 out of the loop? What exactly was pub rock? Easy? Rock? 0:00:24.360 --> 0:00:26.920 Was any music than any band wanted to play in 0:00:26.960 --> 0:00:30.160 a pub. There wasn't as no such thing as a 0:00:30.160 --> 0:00:33.400 a music genre that you could say was pub rock. 0:00:34.080 --> 0:00:39.000 It was just what everybody played. Anybody played in a pub. Okay, 0:00:39.040 --> 0:00:41.159 So then why did it get a label? What was 0:00:41.280 --> 0:00:46.040 different about it from what came before? I was well 0:00:46.520 --> 0:00:50.199 so musically I'd say that the biggest difference between the 0:00:50.240 --> 0:00:54.800 two things was, Hey, you get into words like honest um, 0:00:55.320 --> 0:00:59.560 but pub rock was down to earth, just playing songs. 0:01:00.360 --> 0:01:05.200 And there were no no long sometimes tedious guitar solos 0:01:05.319 --> 0:01:08.560 or keyboard silos or drum solos. He never saw a 0:01:08.640 --> 0:01:12.600 drub solo in a pub, so so much more focused 0:01:12.680 --> 0:01:16.080 on the songs and the and the excitement. The level 0:01:16.080 --> 0:01:21.360 of energy was was higher, The audience was really close 0:01:21.440 --> 0:01:24.320 that they could they could get the vibe and see 0:01:24.360 --> 0:01:28.000 what was going on, much better than bigger bands that 0:01:28.040 --> 0:01:33.040 played in big places and It also provided a place 0:01:33.080 --> 0:01:35.200 for bands that were never going to be able to 0:01:35.240 --> 0:01:41.120 play get up to playing in in big places, somewhere 0:01:41.160 --> 0:01:43.760 to play, and eventually some of them did get up 0:01:43.800 --> 0:01:47.000 to play in big places. So well, let's set the scene, 0:01:47.080 --> 0:01:50.400 let's put it in context. When did pub rock begin? Well, 0:01:51.080 --> 0:01:53.639 so it depends when you when you think it begun. 0:01:54.240 --> 0:01:59.200 Um Eggs Over Easy with the band the first band 0:01:59.280 --> 0:02:03.960 that any of us saw playing in a in a pub. 0:02:04.200 --> 0:02:10.520 They were American from San Francisco area, I believe Um. 0:02:10.560 --> 0:02:14.240 We saw that we we were fed up and playing 0:02:14.560 --> 0:02:19.840 in bigger places, mostly colleges, and the idea of playing 0:02:19.840 --> 0:02:21.880 with an audience in front of you, not having to 0:02:21.880 --> 0:02:26.200 play your set of album songs, you could play whatever 0:02:26.240 --> 0:02:32.800 you wanted appealed. So in the timeline we saw Eggs 0:02:32.840 --> 0:02:39.800 Over Easy. Um. Two weeks later, Oh Dave Robinson, our manager, 0:02:39.840 --> 0:02:45.360 and myself went around pubs in London trying to persuade 0:02:45.440 --> 0:02:47.760 landlords that would be a really good idea to have 0:02:47.960 --> 0:02:50.720 us play in the pub. A lot of them didn't 0:02:50.880 --> 0:02:53.079 didn't get it, but they did get that we would 0:02:53.120 --> 0:02:57.640 play for nothing until until they were making enough money 0:02:57.680 --> 0:03:01.120 to be able to pay us, which so they liked 0:03:01.160 --> 0:03:06.000 that idea, and a few weeks later we were we 0:03:06.040 --> 0:03:11.240 started playing in pubs and pretty pretty soon and it 0:03:11.280 --> 0:03:14.240 went down really well. It's pretty soon there were as 0:03:14.280 --> 0:03:17.959 many people outside as there were inside. It was summer, 0:03:18.120 --> 0:03:20.200 so it was a good time of year to be 0:03:20.240 --> 0:03:24.840 doing it. And pretty soon other other bands joined in, 0:03:25.040 --> 0:03:29.600 got gigs in some of the pubs, and I would say, 0:03:29.639 --> 0:03:33.720 but that that's when it became pub rock. Well that's when, 0:03:34.440 --> 0:03:39.480 roughly when the press took notice and labeled it pub rock. Okay, 0:03:39.480 --> 0:03:44.480 this would be what year for what year did you 0:03:44.520 --> 0:03:49.360 start playing the pubs? Yeah, I would say seventy summer 0:03:49.360 --> 0:03:54.560 of seventy one. Okay, So for those of us who 0:03:54.640 --> 0:03:57.040 are not English, this is in London or did it 0:03:57.120 --> 0:04:01.560 spread throughout the nation? It was it was mostly in London, 0:04:02.320 --> 0:04:06.120 uh and closely around London. But yeah, i'd say it 0:04:06.160 --> 0:04:10.800 was in London. Okay, So we don't have pubs in 0:04:10.800 --> 0:04:15.120 the US. How large would these pubs be? How many 0:04:15.280 --> 0:04:22.320 people could be there when you performed? Um? Probably maybe 0:04:22.440 --> 0:04:25.839 the larger ones could hold hundred fifty two hundred people. 0:04:26.839 --> 0:04:29.320 There was a place, a pub called the Kensington, which 0:04:29.520 --> 0:04:35.760 was had a large mainly road but large paving part outside. 0:04:36.680 --> 0:04:41.400 And I definitely remember going out one very hot summer 0:04:41.480 --> 0:04:45.920 evening and that that section of that square being packed 0:04:46.160 --> 0:04:50.720 of people with people and the inside but so in 0:04:50.960 --> 0:04:56.039 or maybe four hundred people, but mainly I'd stay between 0:04:56.120 --> 0:04:59.640 hundred two hundred like your it's just the same thing. 0:04:59.680 --> 0:05:05.160 And that's states like bars, larger what you called larger bars, okay. 0:05:05.200 --> 0:05:08.560 And how many of these bars were there? How many 0:05:08.560 --> 0:05:12.919 were in the circuit so to speak, um, ten a 0:05:13.000 --> 0:05:17.240 dozen so not many, no, no, not not a lot 0:05:17.279 --> 0:05:20.839 to know. Okay, So when you start playing the pubs, 0:05:21.040 --> 0:05:24.400 do you how frequently do you play? And do you 0:05:24.440 --> 0:05:28.120 play at the same pub or different pubs? We we 0:05:28.279 --> 0:05:33.719 played in maybe four to six different pubs and once 0:05:33.760 --> 0:05:36.040 a week or once a fortnight. So we were you know, 0:05:36.080 --> 0:05:40.000 we were playing just an ordinary amount, but always mostly 0:05:40.080 --> 0:05:44.760 in pubs. And once you established you could generate a crowd, 0:05:45.400 --> 0:05:50.720 how much revenue could you generate, um, fifty per person 0:05:50.839 --> 0:05:55.720 on the door, maybe a hundred pounds, two hundred pounds, 0:05:55.760 --> 0:05:59.600 not a lot of money, okay, it's like it's like 0:05:59.640 --> 0:06:01.800 it is now. We don't do this for the money. 0:06:01.920 --> 0:06:05.479 We do it because it's fun. That's that's how it 0:06:05.640 --> 0:06:10.160 how it was. We weren't really looking for anything else. 0:06:10.240 --> 0:06:15.080 We just wanted to play. Okay, so Dave Robinson Jermana joing. 0:06:15.120 --> 0:06:19.040 At this point the act is called Brinsley Schwartz. Do 0:06:19.120 --> 0:06:22.640 you say Schwarz with the te or without the tea? 0:06:23.200 --> 0:06:24.880 Now we say it with the T, but it's it 0:06:25.080 --> 0:06:30.560 rhymes with hearts. It's Prinsley Schwartz, not princely Schwartz. One 0:06:30.560 --> 0:06:34.840 more time, I gotta how do you pronounce it? Schwartz? 0:06:35.520 --> 0:06:39.520 Swats so it rhymes with huts. I got it. I'm 0:06:39.520 --> 0:06:43.840 trying to you know, It's like in the UK, Ray 0:06:43.880 --> 0:06:48.880 it's Ray Davis, and here it's Ray Davies. But we'll 0:06:48.880 --> 0:06:52.800 soldier forward. So who's who's in the man Brinsley Schwartz 0:06:52.920 --> 0:07:00.920 at this point myself, Nickla, Bob Andrews, Billy Rankin in gone. 0:07:02.080 --> 0:07:04.800 So that's the five of us. Okay, let's let's go 0:07:04.880 --> 0:07:08.640 back a little bit further when okay, where do you 0:07:08.640 --> 0:07:14.679 grow up? Sorry? Where did I grow up? Yeah? Mostly 0:07:14.880 --> 0:07:17.320 in a place called Tunbridge Wells, which is in Kent, 0:07:18.160 --> 0:07:21.800 or or in villages around. We moved quite a lot, 0:07:21.840 --> 0:07:26.760 but never a long way. So around Tumbridge Wells yeah, 0:07:26.800 --> 0:07:32.200 the south southeast corner. How far from London thirty five? 0:07:33.680 --> 0:07:35.720 And did you go into London a lot or were 0:07:35.800 --> 0:07:41.920 you living like in the country mentally? Um M, well, yeah, 0:07:41.960 --> 0:07:45.559 we went into into London a lot. By the time 0:07:45.800 --> 0:07:48.680 pub Rockets started we were living as a band together 0:07:48.760 --> 0:07:51.560 in a house in a place called Northward, which was 0:07:51.640 --> 0:07:57.080 northwest London. So as the as the debacle in nine 0:07:57.400 --> 0:08:02.760 seventy started, we all moved into London and lived pretty 0:08:02.840 --> 0:08:06.040 much in London. Okay, so let's go back. You're moving around. 0:08:06.080 --> 0:08:08.560 Why are you moving around as a family so much? 0:08:09.680 --> 0:08:14.640 My parents moved along. We we were we were a 0:08:14.760 --> 0:08:18.720 house to do a rothers. They bought houses, we fixed 0:08:18.760 --> 0:08:23.000 them up in the holidays. After a couple of years 0:08:23.000 --> 0:08:26.560 we dined again. And was that Was that their main 0:08:26.720 --> 0:08:30.280 means of employment or did the outside jobs? Now? My 0:08:30.280 --> 0:08:34.240 my father was a school teacher in a in a 0:08:34.280 --> 0:08:38.480 private school, which is the opposite to yours. You would 0:08:38.520 --> 0:08:42.400 call it a public school. Yes, And how many kids 0:08:42.400 --> 0:08:46.560 in the family just too then? Which were you the older, 0:08:46.600 --> 0:08:53.640 the younger, the older? Whatever happened with the younger? Um, 0:08:53.800 --> 0:08:59.000 she got married and moved away. She's she's now living 0:08:59.040 --> 0:09:04.760 in Scotland with a second husband. Okay, so you're growing up, 0:09:06.240 --> 0:09:09.240 when do you get exposed to music and excited about music? 0:09:12.000 --> 0:09:17.320 I think pre pre Elvis, I can remember, so I 0:09:17.360 --> 0:09:21.280 have to dig dig into memories. I remember a record 0:09:21.360 --> 0:09:26.720 called Green Door, which I have no idea Who's who's 0:09:26.760 --> 0:09:34.120 saying that Frankie, Frankie somebody, Frankie Vaughn maybe um. And 0:09:34.160 --> 0:09:37.079 that that's the first record that I I said I 0:09:37.200 --> 0:09:41.520 heard as a record. But pretty soon after that I 0:09:41.600 --> 0:09:46.400 was listening to Elvis Presley and then all of the 0:09:46.480 --> 0:09:53.280 late fifties and early sixties music. And the real turning 0:09:53.320 --> 0:09:58.080 point was when I heard a tune called Patche which 0:09:58.200 --> 0:10:01.559 was performed by a band called the show Days m 0:10:01.840 --> 0:10:04.560 And that is why why I wanted to be a 0:10:04.559 --> 0:10:09.079 guitar player. Okay, so how did you hear these records 0:10:09.080 --> 0:10:12.120 on the radio? Did you buy the records on the radio? 0:10:12.960 --> 0:10:17.240 Mostly historically we've learned that radio was very controlled in 0:10:17.280 --> 0:10:20.400 the UK with the BBC, and people would listen to 0:10:20.480 --> 0:10:25.560 Radio Luxembourg Radio Caroline, what was your experience that well, 0:10:25.559 --> 0:10:28.760 that Radio Luxembourg Radio carry on a bit later later 0:10:28.800 --> 0:10:34.480 than this, but yes, it most most radio was by 0:10:34.559 --> 0:10:39.240 the BBC, and they were very strict um rules about 0:10:39.240 --> 0:10:42.280 what could be played and what couldn't be played. And 0:10:42.360 --> 0:10:46.319 it wasn't until the pirate radio stations started up that 0:10:46.360 --> 0:10:51.200 we started to hear music from from the from more 0:10:51.440 --> 0:10:56.200 from the States um that we hadn't had a chance 0:10:56.280 --> 0:11:02.080 to to hear in England. Now, Liverpool was a dark 0:11:02.200 --> 0:11:04.760 city and they say that the sailors came in with 0:11:04.840 --> 0:11:08.480 blues records and that influenced the scene. There was that 0:11:08.600 --> 0:11:11.400 only in Liverpool. Was it also where you were or 0:11:11.480 --> 0:11:15.120 in the Kent area It wasn't. It wasn't in the 0:11:15.200 --> 0:11:20.160 Kent area. The top forty was probably in stock in 0:11:20.160 --> 0:11:25.920 the late local record store. Um it was. It was 0:11:26.320 --> 0:11:34.920 very very young and and unworldly or experiences at that time. 0:11:35.920 --> 0:11:39.120 It was a long time before I heard of blues record. 0:11:39.600 --> 0:11:42.040 I don't remember which the first had a friend and 0:11:42.080 --> 0:11:46.160 older friend who there was a guitar player who who 0:11:46.240 --> 0:11:48.480 got me around to his place one day said listened 0:11:48.520 --> 0:11:51.920 to this and put on John mel Male Blues Breaker 0:11:52.200 --> 0:11:56.199 album and that was probably the first time I heard 0:11:57.400 --> 0:12:03.520 a blues record. And and I remember I remember listening 0:12:03.559 --> 0:12:08.240 to Albert king In in the local records store. You 0:12:08.240 --> 0:12:11.520 could go into a booze. That happened in the States too. 0:12:12.440 --> 0:12:14.520 You could get into a booth and if there was 0:12:14.559 --> 0:12:16.280 no one in the store, they just played the record 0:12:16.320 --> 0:12:20.920 for you. And so I used to do that. Um okay, 0:12:20.960 --> 0:12:24.559 so you hear you hear apache tell me about picking 0:12:24.640 --> 0:12:29.720 up an instrument and playing. Um. I hustled my parents. 0:12:30.559 --> 0:12:38.000 They gave me a classical guitar for my birthday and 0:12:38.320 --> 0:12:41.400 I just wanted to play a patty. I learned that 0:12:41.440 --> 0:12:45.920 by myself without and they just from the tune figured 0:12:45.960 --> 0:12:49.320 out some chords. And I've got a book called Five 0:12:49.800 --> 0:12:54.320 Common Chords, which was which was a bad book to 0:12:54.360 --> 0:12:56.960 get because it showed you every chord in all of 0:12:57.000 --> 0:13:01.800 its inversions, and so every chord was a different poet 0:13:02.800 --> 0:13:05.640 in your head, but really they were all the same, 0:13:05.800 --> 0:13:09.319 just moved up and down the fingerboard. It was an 0:13:09.679 --> 0:13:12.520 actually much easier thing to learn to play guitar than 0:13:13.040 --> 0:13:15.360 a lot of other instruments, which I tried to play 0:13:15.720 --> 0:13:19.080 later on. And if you started with the book, do 0:13:19.120 --> 0:13:23.520 you know how to read music? No? So I did 0:13:24.520 --> 0:13:27.520 younger at school. I think I got to grade four piano, 0:13:27.600 --> 0:13:31.240 Grade four it's called in this country. So I could 0:13:31.240 --> 0:13:37.720 read music, but once I started playing guitar, I found 0:13:37.720 --> 0:13:41.600 that I could I knew what was coming next and 0:13:41.840 --> 0:13:45.720 where it was quicker than I could read it off 0:13:45.760 --> 0:13:49.840 the of the page. So I ended up really learning 0:13:49.840 --> 0:13:55.240 everything by ear. So you never took a lesson. Much 0:13:55.320 --> 0:13:59.040 later on I took I did some lessons when when 0:13:59.160 --> 0:14:02.800 some guitar dam is opened up in London that would 0:14:02.840 --> 0:14:05.840 have been in the in the eighties, I guess and 0:14:05.920 --> 0:14:07.920 I went to some of that. And what were you 0:14:08.000 --> 0:14:10.800 learning to learn and searching to learn and what did 0:14:10.800 --> 0:14:14.079 you actually learn? Um? I guess I was searching to 0:14:14.520 --> 0:14:18.840 learn steely Den chords and parts. I did learn the 0:14:18.880 --> 0:14:26.040 solo to here's a memory stuff. Uh, well it's a 0:14:26.080 --> 0:14:39.280 major Larry Carlton solo on a on the steely Den charm. So, um, 0:14:39.320 --> 0:14:44.000 when do you get an electric guitar? Um? Well, this 0:14:44.120 --> 0:14:47.720 is where helping my father was with the doing up 0:14:47.760 --> 0:14:52.560 the house was. I got a shilling a day that's 0:14:53.400 --> 0:15:00.240 ten cents maybe maybe it's about ten twelve cents um 0:15:00.280 --> 0:15:03.400 for helping, for which I had to do things like 0:15:03.680 --> 0:15:06.680 crawl under the floorboards to pull the electricity cables through. 0:15:07.600 --> 0:15:10.440 Do you know that spiders are white and alive? When 0:15:10.440 --> 0:15:17.800 they're underneath floorboards. Um. And I got enough money to 0:15:17.960 --> 0:15:23.840 buy a an electric guitar. But when I went to 0:15:23.280 --> 0:15:26.720 to buy one, I thought I knew what it was 0:15:26.760 --> 0:15:30.960 that I wanted. My eye settled on something different, and 0:15:31.200 --> 0:15:36.400 my parents very kindly paid difference for me. So I 0:15:36.480 --> 0:15:41.600 got a half decent electric guitar, which was what it 0:15:41.720 --> 0:15:44.560 was called a Oftener color Rama. It was red and 0:15:44.680 --> 0:15:47.560 looked like the guitar that Hank Martin as the Shadows used, 0:15:47.640 --> 0:15:51.560 and that was good enough for me. And what about 0:15:51.560 --> 0:15:56.080 an amplifier? Yeah, I just got a little one and 0:15:56.200 --> 0:15:58.640 I it had vowels in it, but I didn't really 0:15:58.840 --> 0:16:01.400 know what that meant and important it was until much 0:16:01.480 --> 0:16:05.080 later later on. Okay, So you're playing and at this 0:16:05.160 --> 0:16:12.120 point your hold okay, and at what point do you say, hey, 0:16:12.200 --> 0:16:17.239 I want to play with others? And what happens? Um? 0:16:17.360 --> 0:16:21.920 When I when I left school, I left school at eighteen, Um, 0:16:22.040 --> 0:16:24.840 I didn't want to go to university, although I had 0:16:24.880 --> 0:16:29.720 a place. I wanted to be a guitar player. What 0:16:30.560 --> 0:16:34.400 before we get there, you never played in a group 0:16:34.520 --> 0:16:37.080 or anything in high school or you know whatever, your 0:16:37.160 --> 0:16:41.960 secondary school. Yeah, okay, in my so this is part 0:16:42.000 --> 0:16:44.560 of part of my time that I don't think about 0:16:44.600 --> 0:16:47.560 too much. I went to a boarding school when I 0:16:47.600 --> 0:16:51.560 was fourteen and we had a band. We used to 0:16:51.600 --> 0:16:54.920 sneak out underneath play underneath the stage in the hall 0:16:55.600 --> 0:16:58.560 in the middle of the night. Um. There were six 0:16:58.600 --> 0:17:02.600 of us. We were sounds, four plus two. We didn't 0:17:02.600 --> 0:17:04.359 really know what we were doing, but it was a 0:17:04.400 --> 0:17:08.240 lot of fun and I guess part of it was 0:17:08.280 --> 0:17:10.800 sneaking out at night in the middle of the night 0:17:10.880 --> 0:17:15.720 to smoke cigarettes, drink cider and play underneath the hall. 0:17:16.240 --> 0:17:23.400 But we did go. Nicklay's father was an r af 0:17:24.520 --> 0:17:33.840 UM commander and in Germany and we went to uh 0:17:35.240 --> 0:17:38.760 We went there to play for the for the kids, 0:17:38.760 --> 0:17:41.639 and we were all fifteen sixteen, so I think we 0:17:41.760 --> 0:17:45.760 played five shows. We traveled in my My parents had 0:17:45.800 --> 0:17:50.800 a sleeper bus and yeah, we all piled in with 0:17:50.800 --> 0:17:55.920 it to amplifiers and a snare drum. I went and played. 0:17:56.640 --> 0:17:59.280 That was the only time that I had played before 0:18:00.320 --> 0:18:04.520 leaving school. And do you remember what the material was? Yeah, 0:18:04.520 --> 0:18:06.919 any rock and roll song that we could sing, one 0:18:06.960 --> 0:18:09.520 of us who could sing could put together. Although we 0:18:09.880 --> 0:18:15.439 did we played a lot of Beatles. I remember playing 0:18:15.640 --> 0:18:18.520 you really got me and thinking, well this is fabulous. 0:18:19.640 --> 0:18:23.800 But yeah, that kind of said what we would call 0:18:23.880 --> 0:18:28.600 pop music in England. Okay, did music bring it together 0:18:28.640 --> 0:18:32.320 with Nick Low? Or were you friends before that and 0:18:32.840 --> 0:18:35.360 music brought us to get together? We were two years 0:18:35.359 --> 0:18:38.879 apart in school and you didn't mess with people two 0:18:38.960 --> 0:18:42.800 years apart. So how did you actually cook up with Nick? 0:18:43.840 --> 0:18:48.040 I think we're people were talking one day and we 0:18:48.040 --> 0:18:51.240 all ended up with in the in the room under 0:18:51.280 --> 0:18:55.920 the stage, in the in the hall, and that's that's 0:18:56.000 --> 0:18:58.119 kind of how it started. It was he always a 0:18:58.160 --> 0:19:00.960 bass player or did that just you know we needed 0:19:00.960 --> 0:19:04.920 a bass player in the band. No, it wasn't. I 0:19:05.000 --> 0:19:06.479 think he had a base by the time we went 0:19:06.520 --> 0:19:10.840 and played in Germany. But but before before then he 0:19:10.880 --> 0:19:14.639 had a had along I think probably a bit of 0:19:14.640 --> 0:19:18.959 a clothes line, like plastic lines um sort of broomstick 0:19:19.000 --> 0:19:23.880 and a packing case and and just plucked at it. 0:19:24.720 --> 0:19:27.399 We were all just whatever we had. We just wanted 0:19:27.440 --> 0:19:31.520 to do be in this and and so we did 0:19:32.160 --> 0:19:43.240 what we could. The Beatles hit in sixty two. What 0:19:43.440 --> 0:19:46.320 was it like when the Beatles hit you were still 0:19:46.359 --> 0:19:54.520 in secondary school? It was m hm, it was it 0:19:54.600 --> 0:19:59.280 was everything that was wildly exciting. Um, it was all 0:19:59.680 --> 0:20:03.880 people would talk about. The the anticipation for the next 0:20:03.880 --> 0:20:11.240 single was was was massive? Um, yeah, it was. It 0:20:11.359 --> 0:20:14.640 was a turning point for the as it turned out, 0:20:14.720 --> 0:20:17.800 for the world. I would say, right, but you were 0:20:17.800 --> 0:20:19.640 a couple of years ahead of us in the UK 0:20:20.280 --> 0:20:23.199 and all these other acts that we consider to be 0:20:23.240 --> 0:20:26.320 the British invasion in the US. You know, the ones 0:20:26.400 --> 0:20:29.439 from Liverpool and then you have the Kinks. What was 0:20:29.480 --> 0:20:35.000 it like having that scene in the UK? Um, yeah, 0:20:35.119 --> 0:20:39.760 it was just it was just it was it was 0:20:39.880 --> 0:20:42.600 almost everything that we thought about that I guess. I 0:20:42.640 --> 0:20:46.440 guess we thought about football as as well and girls, 0:20:46.600 --> 0:20:51.320 but otherwise it was it was the music. It's what 0:20:51.400 --> 0:20:57.719 everybody was interested in. All the hangouts in record stores 0:20:57.920 --> 0:21:01.720 and well, right, I was never allowed to go to 0:21:01.760 --> 0:21:05.000 a coffee shop, but I guess a coffee bar as 0:21:05.040 --> 0:21:08.119 they were called. Then that's what we talked about. That 0:21:09.040 --> 0:21:14.679 overtook movies and things like that as the main event. 0:21:15.840 --> 0:21:21.679 It was wildly exciting. Okay, you graduate from what we 0:21:21.800 --> 0:21:24.000 call high school, you decide you don't want to go 0:21:24.040 --> 0:21:25.919 to college. Your father is a teacher, what does he 0:21:26.000 --> 0:21:29.639 have to say about that? He's not happy. Neither of 0:21:29.640 --> 0:21:33.760 my parents are happy, but they could see that it 0:21:33.840 --> 0:21:37.119 was what I wanted to do, and they came up 0:21:37.119 --> 0:21:40.520 with an offer that they would take care of me 0:21:41.520 --> 0:21:45.439 vie if I got any money. I contributed part of 0:21:45.440 --> 0:21:48.400 it to the running of the household and I had 0:21:48.400 --> 0:21:52.000 a year and if I didn't it didn't succeed. After 0:21:52.040 --> 0:21:56.159 a year, then I was either out of out of 0:21:56.280 --> 0:22:02.160 my own or UM gone toinun of city. So they 0:22:02.160 --> 0:22:05.200 looked after me for a for a year, probably longer 0:22:05.240 --> 0:22:08.840 in the end. So what happened in that year? In 0:22:08.840 --> 0:22:12.760 that year somebody somebody knocked on the door or or 0:22:12.840 --> 0:22:16.040 telephoned me. I think they knocked on the door or 0:22:16.080 --> 0:22:21.600 either that or somebody knew my mother UM, and a 0:22:21.680 --> 0:22:24.760 word got sent down a line somewhere, and this guy 0:22:25.160 --> 0:22:27.960 whose name was Dave Cottam turned up and said, I 0:22:28.040 --> 0:22:30.040 hear you play guitar and can sing. Do you want 0:22:30.040 --> 0:22:32.200 to be in a band, to which I said yes. 0:22:33.040 --> 0:22:37.280 So that band came known as three as a Crowd 0:22:38.720 --> 0:22:44.800 and which later turned into Cypington Lodge and we eventually 0:22:44.960 --> 0:22:52.440 made singles for Am I or Parlophone UM. And that 0:22:52.440 --> 0:22:55.600 that was. That was the beginning of what I would 0:22:55.840 --> 0:23:00.359 call a career. Wh Okay, how long after we've calls 0:23:00.400 --> 0:23:04.840 you are you making records for EM? I must must 0:23:04.840 --> 0:23:08.040 be a year, a year, a year and a half 0:23:09.240 --> 0:23:12.040 something like that. A long time and you're still living 0:23:12.080 --> 0:23:14.040 at home? What are you? You know? What are you 0:23:14.119 --> 0:23:19.080 living on? Financially? Very little? Hardly anything at all? Really? 0:23:19.760 --> 0:23:22.600 So how does the band get a deal with the 0:23:22.760 --> 0:23:29.359 m I we h A guy asked to manage us? 0:23:30.440 --> 0:23:33.760 Saw us playing somewhere, asked the manager as we said, okay, 0:23:34.000 --> 0:23:37.520 and he got he got the deal. Um, I think 0:23:37.560 --> 0:23:39.840 they paid for us to do a couple of demos 0:23:40.640 --> 0:23:46.000 and and he carted those around the record labels and 0:23:46.080 --> 0:23:48.720 we ended up getting a deal for five singles, which 0:23:49.119 --> 0:23:55.800 we ended up doing. So what happened with kippington Um? 0:23:55.840 --> 0:23:59.760 We made? We made five singles? People change, We became 0:23:59.800 --> 0:24:03.440 an left so that the drama who was the last 0:24:03.440 --> 0:24:07.600 person to leave, he left and week that's where we 0:24:07.680 --> 0:24:12.359 got when we got Billy ranking in Um the bass 0:24:12.359 --> 0:24:15.760 player whose band it was in the start, he left 0:24:15.800 --> 0:24:19.800 because he wanted to play soul music and we didn't. UM. 0:24:19.840 --> 0:24:24.439 That's when Nick joined UH and then and then we 0:24:24.520 --> 0:24:29.119 decided we needed an organ player, and that's where Barry 0:24:29.200 --> 0:24:32.360 Landerman came, who was at the same school as Nick 0:24:32.440 --> 0:24:35.920 and myself. So basically I phoned around people that I've 0:24:35.960 --> 0:24:37.560 been at school with and said you want to join 0:24:37.600 --> 0:24:43.040 a band? And people did and so um and then 0:24:43.080 --> 0:24:45.520 in the end Barry left. He went and played with 0:24:46.119 --> 0:24:51.080 a real pop group called Vanity Fair and and then 0:24:51.119 --> 0:24:57.520 we had we advertised and found Bob Andrews. Okay, what 0:24:57.680 --> 0:25:01.919 was Nick doing? We've were you called them? I have 0:25:02.040 --> 0:25:05.800 no I have no idea, but see, obviously nothing that 0:25:05.920 --> 0:25:09.840 important because he just jumped at the chance and and 0:25:10.000 --> 0:25:12.520 came down. Okay, when is it goal? From Kippington Lane 0:25:12.560 --> 0:25:16.840 to Brindsley s Keypington Lodge that there was Commington Lodge 0:25:17.840 --> 0:25:22.679 somewhere somewhere in the middle of that appears, so the 0:25:22.720 --> 0:25:27.320 four and after so I guess sometime in sixty six 0:25:27.400 --> 0:25:33.440 days or sixty nine um, and yeah, they showed the 0:25:33.440 --> 0:25:38.480 other three chose the name. Okay, okay, let's stop. The 0:25:38.560 --> 0:25:42.639 name ends up being your name, Brinsley Shot, how does 0:25:42.680 --> 0:25:47.200 that happen? We agreed that that Keypington Lodge was not 0:25:47.280 --> 0:25:49.560 a good name and that we should leave that behind 0:25:50.480 --> 0:25:54.600 and all that it had meant um, and we were 0:25:54.600 --> 0:25:59.720 going to write down or suggested names, get together and 0:26:00.280 --> 0:26:05.800 pick them one at a time and choose one. Uh. 0:26:05.840 --> 0:26:09.720 And when that was due to happen on the Sunday, 0:26:09.760 --> 0:26:13.879 I think, And when I turned up at Nick and 0:26:13.920 --> 0:26:18.400 Bob's flat, they said, no, need to do that, We've 0:26:18.480 --> 0:26:21.560 chosen already and they told me and I thought, oh no, 0:26:21.760 --> 0:26:26.600 that's not pretty good, and but they said they were adamant. 0:26:26.680 --> 0:26:30.320 So that's how I happen. Well, there's a benefit to 0:26:30.400 --> 0:26:34.040 the p and being your name. And I'm sure all 0:26:34.080 --> 0:26:37.480 this all this time later because of the recognition, you're 0:26:37.480 --> 0:26:42.960 probably happy. Yeah. I didn't. I didn't think about it 0:26:43.040 --> 0:26:46.160 much after that, you know, I just complained and then said, yeah, okay, 0:26:46.240 --> 0:26:49.160 let's do that. Okay, it's keeping in livee. You made 0:26:49.240 --> 0:26:52.520 the five records for you, am I. The band keeps 0:26:52.600 --> 0:27:00.960 morphing now, as Brinsley shots what happens then? Um, we 0:27:01.000 --> 0:27:03.359 saw an adverse in the Melody Maker, which was the 0:27:03.480 --> 0:27:09.560 main music magazine of the time, UM, advertising for a 0:27:09.600 --> 0:27:14.080 band that had their own equipment and wrote songs. And 0:27:14.400 --> 0:27:17.040 we did have our own equipment and we did write songs. 0:27:17.240 --> 0:27:20.760 So we called up the person turned up to Dave 0:27:20.880 --> 0:27:24.639 Robinson who came down to Tombridge Wells and saw us play. 0:27:26.520 --> 0:27:29.240 We went to for a few meals, mostly Indian meals 0:27:29.760 --> 0:27:33.840 with him. He told lots of great stories about stuff 0:27:33.920 --> 0:27:37.879 and we agreed to let him manage us. In reality, 0:27:37.960 --> 0:27:42.440 what did he have going on when he was courting you? Um, 0:27:42.520 --> 0:27:47.240 he didn't have very much going on. He was his company, 0:27:47.480 --> 0:27:52.080 which was just him basically was involved with a small 0:27:52.160 --> 0:27:55.760 group of companies of small companies who were involved in 0:27:55.800 --> 0:28:01.760 the payment business. Although Forbidden Fruit who are clothes story 0:28:02.000 --> 0:28:04.720 up in London, it was one of them. There was 0:28:04.720 --> 0:28:12.080 a little film film company um and an album cover 0:28:12.640 --> 0:28:15.879 designer Barney Bubbles, who went on to do quite a 0:28:15.880 --> 0:28:22.920 lot and that was overseen by by this money man 0:28:23.520 --> 0:28:28.679 and so Apart from wowing us with stories about about 0:28:28.720 --> 0:28:34.600 Hendricks and touring and various other things, his idea was 0:28:34.680 --> 0:28:41.000 for us to play and and move up the ladder, 0:28:41.640 --> 0:28:45.400 play the right gigs and trying to move up up 0:28:45.440 --> 0:28:48.360 the ladder, playing bigger places and on tours with people 0:28:48.840 --> 0:28:53.120 with big bands. Okay, tell me about Dave Robinson. Weltimately 0:28:53.200 --> 0:28:56.000 goes on to form Stiff Records and he continues to 0:28:56.040 --> 0:28:58.440 be a manager. What was he like Was he a 0:28:58.560 --> 0:29:02.480 force of nature? Was he lucky? Was he was a 0:29:02.520 --> 0:29:06.760