WEBVTT - Listener Mail: Hurdy Gurdy Man 0:00:02.960 --> 0:00:05.280 Welcome to Stuff to Blow Your Mind, a production of 0:00:05.360 --> 0:00:10.920 I Heart Radio. Hey, welcome to Stuff to Blow your Mind. 0:00:11.119 --> 0:00:14.920 Listener Mail. My name is Robert Lamb and I'm Joe McCormick. 0:00:14.960 --> 0:00:17.400 And today we're reading messages that you've sent in over 0:00:17.440 --> 0:00:19.480 the past couple of weeks. So most of them concern 0:00:19.600 --> 0:00:22.160 episodes that played in that time period. Occasionally there will 0:00:22.160 --> 0:00:24.759 be one or two that reaches deep into the archive, 0:00:24.840 --> 0:00:27.080 but that's okay. We're always happy to hear about stuff 0:00:27.120 --> 0:00:29.960 that came out a while ago. Today our mail bought 0:00:30.040 --> 0:00:35.680 Carney smells heavily of of not just eggs, not just sulfurous, 0:00:35.720 --> 0:00:38.479 but like burned eggs, and I think that's that's a 0:00:38.520 --> 0:00:40.479 bad sign of things to come. But rob do you 0:00:40.520 --> 0:00:42.239 mind if I jump right in with this message from 0:00:42.320 --> 0:00:50.640 Derek go for it? Okay. This is from the replay 0:00:50.680 --> 0:00:52.960 of our episode Into the Egg Chamber, in which we 0:00:53.040 --> 0:00:56.080 did talk about various not just the biology of egg 0:00:56.200 --> 0:00:59.720 laying an egg incubation, but also how cooked eggs can 0:00:59.720 --> 0:01:02.920 some times explode and so oh and one more thing 0:01:02.920 --> 0:01:05.840 before I start this, I I edited this message to 0:01:05.920 --> 0:01:08.840 remove various apologies for the length of the email, And 0:01:08.840 --> 0:01:11.560 here I want to issue a public service announcement. Folks. 0:01:11.760 --> 0:01:13.960 If it's too long to read, that's okay. We either 0:01:14.120 --> 0:01:15.920 we just won't read it, or we'll pare it down 0:01:15.959 --> 0:01:17.600 before we read it. Either way, there is no need 0:01:17.640 --> 0:01:19.839 to apologize about the length of email. So I'm gonna 0:01:19.840 --> 0:01:22.440 try to try to avoid that in the future. When 0:01:22.600 --> 0:01:24.480 you know, one sentence here there might get through, but 0:01:24.520 --> 0:01:26.560 I'm trying to dance around it. We'll see how well 0:01:26.600 --> 0:01:30.520 we do so, Derek says, Hey, Robert and Joe, I'm 0:01:30.560 --> 0:01:33.280 writing in regards to your recent vault episode into the 0:01:33.319 --> 0:01:36.759 egg Chamber. The strangest thing happened about a week after 0:01:36.800 --> 0:01:39.720 listening to the episode. I came back from work late 0:01:39.800 --> 0:01:43.200 at night to discover that someone had left something burning 0:01:43.280 --> 0:01:46.120 on the stove. Rushing to check what it was, I 0:01:46.120 --> 0:01:49.080 found they had been trying to boil two eggs. I 0:01:49.120 --> 0:01:51.200 don't know how much time had passed by the time 0:01:51.200 --> 0:01:54.000 I got to it, but all the water had evaporated 0:01:54.040 --> 0:01:56.640 from the pot, even though the lid was still on. 0:01:57.400 --> 0:02:00.360 You can imagine what happened next. I went rate for 0:02:00.400 --> 0:02:02.960 the lid, and what followed was a loud bang, with 0:02:03.000 --> 0:02:05.040 the lid flying out of my hand and what I 0:02:05.040 --> 0:02:09.440 can only describe as egg shrapnel flying everywhere. Anyway, no 0:02:09.520 --> 0:02:13.919 one was hurt, and no one is owning up to it. 0:02:13.040 --> 0:02:15.639 This is this? Is this a family situation or a 0:02:15.680 --> 0:02:18.400 roommate situation? I wonder I like to imagine that this 0:02:18.440 --> 0:02:22.520 is just Derek and one other person. He's being very 0:02:22.560 --> 0:02:25.720 polite in his vagueness about placing Blaine. H No, it 0:02:25.840 --> 0:02:28.960 was you, man, But why did I have the bowl 0:02:29.040 --> 0:02:33.720 bart um? Anyway, Derek goes on to say, I've been 0:02:33.720 --> 0:02:36.120 listening to your podcast for almost five years now and 0:02:36.160 --> 0:02:38.080 have been loving every minute of it. The topics you 0:02:38.120 --> 0:02:41.040 cover have something for everyone. I recently started a new 0:02:41.160 --> 0:02:43.680 job and for someone who is as socially awkward as 0:02:43.720 --> 0:02:46.400 I am, your podcast to save me many times because 0:02:46.400 --> 0:02:48.560 I can always bring up a different, interesting or weird 0:02:48.639 --> 0:02:51.440 topic of discussion. Thanks for all your hard work. And 0:02:51.520 --> 0:02:54.240 I've tried to attach a picture of the eggs so 0:02:54.400 --> 0:02:57.280 rob I feel scrolled down in our document here these 0:02:57.320 --> 0:03:00.520 are Derek's eggs. I think this is a it occasion 0:03:00.600 --> 0:03:03.040 to use the thanks I Hate It meme. This truly 0:03:03.080 --> 0:03:07.200 does look absolutely revolting, and it looks like it smells 0:03:07.240 --> 0:03:12.880 like stomach churning Yeah, this is thanks for sending. Now. 0:03:12.919 --> 0:03:14.400 I guess this would go in line with what we 0:03:14.440 --> 0:03:16.560 talked about in the end of the Egg Chamber episode, 0:03:16.600 --> 0:03:19.960 where there was the phenomenon of hard boiled eggs. I 0:03:20.000 --> 0:03:23.639 think often having been reheated in the microwave, that when 0:03:23.639 --> 0:03:26.320 somebody pierces them with a fork or bites into them, 0:03:26.360 --> 0:03:29.520 they will suddenly explode. And it's not known for sure 0:03:29.560 --> 0:03:32.520 why that happened, but the best hypothesis seems to be 0:03:32.560 --> 0:03:36.480 that there are little pockets of superheated steam that form 0:03:36.600 --> 0:03:39.640 inside the matrix of the oolk and when those pockets 0:03:39.640 --> 0:03:42.240 get released, they rapidly expand and kind of turned the 0:03:42.280 --> 0:03:44.760 egg into a bomb. Yeah, and that seems like that 0:03:44.840 --> 0:03:47.360 maybe what happened right here in this picture. Yeah, maybe 0:03:47.400 --> 0:03:50.880 moving the pot disturbed it or something, but I wonder 0:03:51.000 --> 0:03:53.480 that anyway. That's uh. I'm glad no one was harmed. 0:03:53.720 --> 0:04:02.640 I hope the culprit is found. Yeah, all right, here's 0:04:02.680 --> 0:04:04.560 another bit of listener mail. This one comes to us 0:04:04.680 --> 0:04:10.160 from the Home dat Abroad um Home dat Abroad Rights. Greetings, 0:04:10.200 --> 0:04:13.000 Joe and Robert. There are many aspects of your two 0:04:13.040 --> 0:04:15.760 partner on numbers that sparked great interest in thoughts for me. 0:04:16.040 --> 0:04:19.200 But what inspired this note was your query concerning different 0:04:19.200 --> 0:04:23.120 finger counting systems back in the seventies. Until third grade, 0:04:23.279 --> 0:04:26.159 I was segregated from the larger student body and experimental 0:04:26.200 --> 0:04:30.080 class that combined four years of interacting students and three 0:04:30.120 --> 0:04:34.280 shared teachers. When the time came for educational seminars and conventions, 0:04:34.400 --> 0:04:36.520 one of the three would rotate out to attend and 0:04:36.720 --> 0:04:39.800 invariably return with new ideas and approaches to test on 0:04:39.839 --> 0:04:44.799 our captive minds. One such convention during my first grade 0:04:44.880 --> 0:04:47.800 year produced a new methodology for finger counting, which was 0:04:47.839 --> 0:04:51.440 implemented immediately in the classroom. It consisted of using both hands. 0:04:51.760 --> 0:04:54.679 The right represented single digits and the left was double digits. 0:04:54.839 --> 0:04:58.520 The four right fingers were one and the thumb was five. 0:04:59.000 --> 0:05:02.200 The left fing ers were each ten, with the thumb 0:05:02.279 --> 0:05:05.120 as fifty. Just using the two hands, one could easily 0:05:05.160 --> 0:05:10.200 count to If one extended from the left hand two 0:05:10.240 --> 0:05:13.880 fingers and the thumb, while extending four right fingers, it 0:05:13.920 --> 0:05:17.159 would produce the number seventy four. By shifting the fingers, 0:05:17.160 --> 0:05:20.360 it became possible to quickly add, subtract, multiply, and divide. 0:05:20.720 --> 0:05:23.719 It would take a much longer email to adequately describe 0:05:23.760 --> 0:05:26.880 the various techniques that I still barely remember. But it 0:05:26.920 --> 0:05:29.480 was smooth and easy and would often result in the 0:05:29.520 --> 0:05:32.560 dropping of pencils. This became our go to method in 0:05:32.600 --> 0:05:36.880 class for counting and learning the multiplication tables. Subsequently, it 0:05:36.920 --> 0:05:39.400 allowed me to teach myself how to divide at least 0:05:39.400 --> 0:05:42.520 a year before it was covered in the curriculum. The 0:05:42.560 --> 0:05:45.159 system was not adopted outside of that class, which was 0:05:45.200 --> 0:05:47.960 sadly disbanded when I entered fourth grade, and I have 0:05:48.080 --> 0:05:51.320 never been able to track down information online about this method. 0:05:51.480 --> 0:05:54.520 Despite it all, I default to that method to this 0:05:54.640 --> 0:05:57.719 very day and risk the dropping of my phone in 0:05:57.839 --> 0:06:01.360 lieu of pencils. Sheers the home down I brought. This 0:06:01.400 --> 0:06:05.000 is really interesting. I've never heard about this before. Yeah, 0:06:05.080 --> 0:06:07.360 this I would I would be very interested if anyone 0:06:07.440 --> 0:06:10.640 out there listening knows what this counting system is. This 0:06:10.760 --> 0:06:14.040 number system happens to be and uh, yeah, we need 0:06:14.120 --> 0:06:16.880 to to to put a name to it. Maybe it's 0:06:16.960 --> 0:06:24.800 number one. I don't know. Well, Rob. There is an 0:06:24.800 --> 0:06:27.880 email we also got from longtime correspondent Jim in New 0:06:27.920 --> 0:06:31.200 Jersey about a finger counting system that sounds kind of similar. Actually, 0:06:31.240 --> 0:06:34.200 do you want to read this one too. Sure? This 0:06:34.279 --> 0:06:36.719 is from Yes, from Jim in New Jersey, Robert and Joe. 0:06:36.960 --> 0:06:38.960 Anyone with four fingers in a thumb on each hand 0:06:38.960 --> 0:06:42.279 can easily count into basic arithmetic with number zero to 0:06:43.279 --> 0:06:47.039 using a technique called chiss and bop. You use the 0:06:47.040 --> 0:06:50.440 fingers on each hand mimicking one rod with a five 0:06:50.560 --> 0:06:54.120 bead the thumb and four one beads the fingers. The 0:06:54.200 --> 0:06:57.520 right hand represents units, the left hand represents tens. Jim 0:06:57.520 --> 0:07:01.239 in New Jersey PS a podcast on non electronic computing 0:07:01.240 --> 0:07:03.880 devices such as the Abbicus and slide rule would be 0:07:03.920 --> 0:07:08.039 a good addition to this series. I just open this 0:07:08.120 --> 0:07:10.600 up in another tab to look at it. Chisenbop is 0:07:10.720 --> 0:07:15.000 a Korean finger counting system. Actually the word comes from 0:07:15.040 --> 0:07:19.560 the Korean for finger calculation chi or chichi meaning finger 0:07:19.720 --> 0:07:24.040 and scent pop or send beyop. I think for calculation. Oh, 0:07:24.240 --> 0:07:27.120 very interesting and uh and I agree with Jim. I 0:07:27.160 --> 0:07:28.320 think I think it would be great to do an 0:07:28.320 --> 0:07:31.960 episode on non electronic computing devices. There's some really really 0:07:32.000 --> 0:07:35.080 really fun stuff absolutely so I was just trying to 0:07:35.120 --> 0:07:39.040 think about something funny, like what is the correct technological 0:07:39.080 --> 0:07:42.840 analogy for the mental skill you learn that allows you 0:07:42.880 --> 0:07:46.920 to better or more efficiently perform numerical and mathematical tasks 0:07:47.400 --> 0:07:50.880 with the aid of body parts like fingers or external tools, 0:07:50.960 --> 0:07:52.960 like the way that the Ashango bone might have been 0:07:53.040 --> 0:07:55.480 used if the if the hypotheses about it are correct, 0:07:56.440 --> 0:07:58.160 I guess what I'm looking for is something that is 0:07:58.200 --> 0:08:01.840 neither quite software nor hardware, but the or maybe it 0:08:01.880 --> 0:08:04.440 is a kind of software. Be the mental software upgrade 0:08:04.480 --> 0:08:07.920 that makes better use of the existing hardware. Would that 0:08:07.960 --> 0:08:11.720 be like the device drivers in your head? M yeah, 0:08:11.880 --> 0:08:13.600 I don't know. I'm not sure what the what the 0:08:13.600 --> 0:08:16.880 actual terminology for this would be, but as we explored 0:08:16.920 --> 0:08:19.000 in those episodes, it goes way back. You know, this 0:08:19.080 --> 0:08:21.880 actually makes me think about how while there are standard 0:08:22.320 --> 0:08:25.440 finger counting systems, I guess there's nothing to prevent somebody 0:08:25.480 --> 0:08:28.760 from coming up with a totally idiosyncratic finger accounting system, 0:08:28.880 --> 0:08:31.720 right like just making up some system on their own 0:08:31.760 --> 0:08:34.079 and using that. I wonder is anybody out there ever 0:08:34.200 --> 0:08:36.520 did anybody do that? Did you go your own way 0:08:36.559 --> 0:08:40.680 with finger counting, some sort of self taught uh finger 0:08:40.679 --> 0:08:43.320 accounting system? Like you know, what kind of system would 0:08:43.360 --> 0:08:47.480 we come up with if if one wasn't presented to us. Maybe, 0:08:47.520 --> 0:08:49.720 like you know, each wrinkle on the back of your 0:08:49.760 --> 0:08:58.400 knuckle means something. I'm not sure. Yeah, okay. We also 0:08:58.440 --> 0:09:01.160 got some messages in response to the episode that Seth 0:09:01.200 --> 0:09:03.960 and I did about musical free san Uh, Rob, do 0:09:03.960 --> 0:09:05.760 you want to read this one from Hannah or should 0:09:05.800 --> 0:09:09.000 I just I can jump in in Hi, Robert Joan 0:09:09.080 --> 0:09:13.200 Seth loved the episode on musical Frissonne and although I'm 0:09:13.240 --> 0:09:16.400 sure you're getting tons of emails like this one, I 0:09:16.480 --> 0:09:18.400 wanted to share something that tends to set off my 0:09:18.440 --> 0:09:22.920 own musical frisson. Crowds singing together. I think it is 0:09:22.920 --> 0:09:26.120 a combination of a couple of things. First, is the 0:09:26.160 --> 0:09:29.160 pure volume of that many people singing in unison and 0:09:29.200 --> 0:09:31.679 probably at the top of their lungs. Second, I think 0:09:31.679 --> 0:09:34.680 it is the almost magical feeling that comes from communal singing. 0:09:35.000 --> 0:09:37.719 If I'm witnessing it in person, especially if I'm joining in, 0:09:37.840 --> 0:09:41.360 I'm obviously feeling that magic directly. And even if I'm 0:09:41.400 --> 0:09:44.040 listening to a recording of a sound of a crowd singing, 0:09:44.360 --> 0:09:46.360 I can still get those chills because I can imagine 0:09:46.400 --> 0:09:49.760 how awesome that moment must have felt. The last aspect 0:09:49.760 --> 0:09:52.520 that does it for me, which I'm sure not everyone appreciates, 0:09:52.760 --> 0:09:56.720 is that I love, love, love imperfect vocal performances, not 0:09:56.840 --> 0:10:00.000 so much like wasted karaoke level, but maybe someone who 0:10:00.120 --> 0:10:02.800 is untrained but giving it their best shot, or a 0:10:02.880 --> 0:10:06.480 highly skilled vocalist who maybe loses control for a little bit. 0:10:06.720 --> 0:10:09.160 I think it may tie into the performance, subverting my 0:10:09.240 --> 0:10:12.559 expectations with things like a breath taken in a weird place, 0:10:12.600 --> 0:10:15.800 a quick vocal crack, or a half second where they're 0:10:15.840 --> 0:10:18.360 slightly out of tune but then lock in. I know 0:10:18.440 --> 0:10:20.080 a lot of people are not really fans of the 0:10:20.120 --> 0:10:23.199 crowd singing along during a concert quote I paid to 0:10:23.280 --> 0:10:25.960 hear so and so singing, not their fans, which I 0:10:26.000 --> 0:10:28.320 understand to some extent, But for me, it's one of 0:10:28.360 --> 0:10:30.719 the things I love most about a live performance, and 0:10:30.800 --> 0:10:34.000 something I've grown to appreciate even more since the pandemic 0:10:34.040 --> 0:10:36.520 took it away. Not just experiencing something you love, but 0:10:36.640 --> 0:10:39.320 experiencing the way other people love the same thing. Just 0:10:39.400 --> 0:10:43.839 my two cents love the show so much. Hannah p s. 0:10:44.120 --> 0:10:47.040 After Joe mentioned chrono trigger in a listener email episode, 0:10:47.120 --> 0:10:50.720 I gotta know if any of you have played Zeno Gear. 0:10:51.080 --> 0:10:55.959 Zeno was Zeno Gear Gears, Zeno Gears Gears? You know gear? 0:10:56.080 --> 0:11:00.240 What was Alien Pinball Machine? Is this what we're we're 0:11:00.240 --> 0:11:04.520 talking about? Alien Invall Machine, Zeno Gears? Or is it racing? 0:11:04.920 --> 0:11:07.520 It's like Mario cartl really have no idea. Well, I 0:11:07.520 --> 0:11:10.600 would guess it's an RPG from what Hannah is saying here. Okay, 0:11:10.640 --> 0:11:12.080 she says I was a little too young to play 0:11:12.120 --> 0:11:13.880 it when it first came out, but played it out 0:11:13.920 --> 0:11:16.360 emulated last year, and there's a lot about it that 0:11:16.400 --> 0:11:21.680 seems right up this show's alley, lots of max and gnosticism. Well, 0:11:21.679 --> 0:11:23.560 obviously from what we were saying. No, I have not 0:11:23.600 --> 0:11:26.280 played you Know Gears. I'm not like a big like 0:11:26.480 --> 0:11:29.920 JRPG or even RPG in general. Guy, I just happened 0:11:29.920 --> 0:11:32.200 to have at some point played Chrono Trigger, which is 0:11:32.240 --> 0:11:36.200 a wonderful game for the Supernintendo. Um that is definitely 0:11:36.200 --> 0:11:39.000 worth going back and revisiting on emulator or whatever if 0:11:39.040 --> 0:11:41.360 you can. But but beyond that, I don't know a 0:11:41.360 --> 0:11:45.520 lot about RPGs of that era. Well. Um, Hannah makes 0:11:45.520 --> 0:11:49.800 some some great points about communal singing. Um, I don't 0:11:49.880 --> 0:11:52.400 know if if I am necessarily is moved by just 0:11:52.880 --> 0:11:57.720 choral performances so much. But I do appreciate the experience 0:11:57.760 --> 0:12:01.160 of communal singing like I I enjoy singing as a 0:12:01.200 --> 0:12:04.600 part of like a church congregation or um, you know, 0:12:04.679 --> 0:12:09.200 doing like Elizabethan Christmas carols whilst begging for wassaal that 0:12:09.280 --> 0:12:11.560 sort of thing. Uh. You know. Part of it is 0:12:11.600 --> 0:12:13.840 like growing up with these songs and the shared culture 0:12:13.880 --> 0:12:18.679 of these songs. But there's just something also fun about everybody, um, 0:12:18.720 --> 0:12:20.840 you know, everybody singing these songs. At the same time, 0:12:21.000 --> 0:12:24.560 you're getting your your sinking up your neural networks to 0:12:24.600 --> 0:12:28.280 a certain extent and engaging in this sort of you know, 0:12:28.320 --> 0:12:32.280 communal you know, uplifting of music. Yeah. I mean this 0:12:32.520 --> 0:12:34.760 very much reminds me of stuff we talked about in 0:12:34.760 --> 0:12:38.480 our episode on the the emotion of Kama Muda, which 0:12:38.520 --> 0:12:40.160 has to do with, you know, the these sort of 0:12:40.480 --> 0:12:45.080 communal emotions, and I I feel that very much with 0:12:45.520 --> 0:12:48.720 crowds singing along to music that that they love. So 0:12:48.840 --> 0:12:51.600 I love crowd singing along to music, though I have 0:12:51.679 --> 0:12:53.959 the exact opposite reaction about something. Rob. I don't know 0:12:54.000 --> 0:12:55.679 if you've ever been to a show like this where 0:12:56.480 --> 0:13:00.920 the crowd just cannot shut up during rest sore pauses 0:13:01.040 --> 0:13:03.679 in the music. So like anytime there's a rest or 0:13:03.720 --> 0:13:07.520 anytime a song gets quiet, people start going whoa. It 0:13:07.760 --> 0:13:10.520 drives me nuts. I hate really, I don't know. Sometimes 0:13:10.600 --> 0:13:12.680 that's the time to woo. That's that's when you let 0:13:12.720 --> 0:13:15.080 them know, like the song has been really hot and heavy, 0:13:15.120 --> 0:13:17.199 and then you know, it goes down a little bit, 0:13:17.280 --> 0:13:19.679 and and that's when you can get through to the 0:13:20.320 --> 0:13:23.200 musicians on stage. Well maybe if it happens once in 0:13:23.240 --> 0:13:26.280 a concert, okay, but I've been to concerts that literally 0:13:26.400 --> 0:13:31.440 every quiet moment was filled with woo's and unacceptable. I 0:13:31.480 --> 0:13:36.080 think sometimes I'm thinking particularly about well, I guess like 0:13:36.120 --> 0:13:38.120 tool songs come to mind. That was the last concert 0:13:38.160 --> 0:13:41.439 I went to. UM is that sometimes like the you're 0:13:41.480 --> 0:13:43.199 you're on a ride with this song, and it can 0:13:43.200 --> 0:13:45.000 be a rather long song, you know, and it's it's 0:13:45.040 --> 0:13:46.800 it's hitting me hard, and then you finally get to 0:13:46.840 --> 0:13:48.800 the part where things quiet down a little bit and 0:13:48.800 --> 0:13:52.200 there's a short break, and you know, part of it 0:13:52.240 --> 0:13:54.000 is it's quiet and I can yell and be heard, 0:13:54.040 --> 0:13:57.800 but also it's it's it's like you've you've come out 0:13:57.800 --> 0:14:00.240 of the tunnel, right you've you've you've reached be not 0:14:00.320 --> 0:14:02.160 the end of the roller coaster, but like this is 0:14:02.160 --> 0:14:05.760 your your chance to uh to express what you've been 0:14:05.800 --> 0:14:10.200 feeling the last five minutes. I don't know now in 0:14:10.320 --> 0:14:13.920 terms of people singing along with songs, I probably have 0:14:13.960 --> 0:14:17.079 found it uh slightly annoying at times, but I tell 0:14:17.080 --> 0:14:21.000 you I will take it every concert for the rest 0:14:21.000 --> 0:14:25.240 of my life. Over anybody, UM, like visibly filming a 0:14:25.280 --> 0:14:29.680 show using their their phone or essentially but like watching 0:14:29.720 --> 0:14:33.440 the performance through their phone screen. That is the absolute worst, 0:14:33.760 --> 0:14:37.280 because I'm trying to focus on the performance and instead 0:14:37.440 --> 0:14:40.840 like your gooney face is illuminated by your phone, and 0:14:40.840 --> 0:14:43.160 and there's the footage of the thing we're trying to 0:14:43.160 --> 0:14:46.160 watch in real life, and uh and I have to 0:14:46.320 --> 0:14:49.920 like look at that as well. Um that that gets 0:14:49.920 --> 0:14:53.720 on my nerves to no end. Musicians love it. Look 0:14:53.720 --> 0:14:56.160 out in the audience and just see a sea of phones. 0:14:58.480 --> 0:15:02.880 But another thing, Hannaman shad this is the certain types 0:15:02.920 --> 0:15:07.160 of imperfect vocal performances UH caused causing frees on for her, 0:15:07.760 --> 0:15:10.720 and I can definitely identify with that. In fact, one 0:15:10.760 --> 0:15:13.400 of the best examples of a frees on trigger of 0:15:13.640 --> 0:15:16.080 in Like All of Music, which we played briefly in 0:15:16.120 --> 0:15:19.240 that episode, is the backing vocal track from the Rolling 0:15:19.240 --> 0:15:21.520 Stones song Gimme Shelter, which is sung by a singer 0:15:21.600 --> 0:15:25.280 named Mary Clayton, who is a fantastic singer. But there's 0:15:25.280 --> 0:15:28.520 a part where she's singing so hard that her voice 0:15:28.560 --> 0:15:32.400 just kind of cracks, and and it's those cracking moments 0:15:32.440 --> 0:15:36.200 where like the person who is a great singer is 0:15:36.240 --> 0:15:40.120 singing with such intensity that like they're they're singing falters 0:15:40.160 --> 0:15:44.160 that that's like incredibly powerful. Oh yeah, Mary and Faithful 0:15:44.200 --> 0:15:48.920 is wonderful. Um, she's no, No, Mary, Mary Clayton is well. 0:15:48.960 --> 0:15:50.680 I still stand by the fact that Mary and Faithful 0:15:50.760 --> 0:15:52.960 is pretty great. She's great too. Didn't she have some 0:15:53.000 --> 0:15:56.280 connection to the Stones? I think she was. She may 0:15:56.280 --> 0:15:58.280 have sung with them. I think she and Mick jaggerbick 0:15:58.320 --> 0:16:01.440 together at some point. Maybe that's where. Yeah. Anyway, yeah, 0:16:01.440 --> 0:16:04.200 Mary Unfaithful. Uh, I really like her as well. The 0:16:04.280 --> 0:16:07.840 memory remains. I'm gonna say it, great Metallica song. I 0:16:07.880 --> 0:16:10.160 like that. I like that song. I'll put that I'll 0:16:10.200 --> 0:16:12.200 cue that one up sometimes and listen to it. A 0:16:12.240 --> 0:16:18.320 divisive pick I know load. Well, let's reload. I can't 0:16:18.320 --> 0:16:21.680 remember it's unload unload. What's the other one? Yeah? But no, 0:16:22.000 --> 0:16:33.920 this is Mary Clayton, but Mary unfaithful? Also very good? Yes, okay. 0:16:33.960 --> 0:16:37.000 A few more messages about free soon. One comes from James. 0:16:37.360 --> 0:16:40.920 I think this might be the same correspondent who we 0:16:40.920 --> 0:16:44.760 were getting back and forth with about GEX at some point, 0:16:45.480 --> 0:16:48.440 unless I'm mistaken anyway, James says, good day, Joe and 0:16:48.520 --> 0:16:52.120 Seth and Robert Um was excited to see your recent 0:16:52.200 --> 0:16:54.880 episode on the subject of musical free song appear in 0:16:54.960 --> 0:16:58.600 my podcatcher. It's a sensation I've experienced for many years, 0:16:58.600 --> 0:17:00.800 but only recently learned its name game, which I've been 0:17:00.840 --> 0:17:04.280 pronouncing incorrectly. Whoops. I wouldn't worry about. I mean it 0:17:04.320 --> 0:17:07.040 sounds like people just say different ways. Uh yeah, say 0:17:07.080 --> 0:17:10.520 however you want. I most frequently feel it when I 0:17:10.520 --> 0:17:13.200 have a strong personal memory tied to a song, such 0:17:13.280 --> 0:17:16.919 as pop punk tunes by the Atari's that I listened 0:17:16.960 --> 0:17:21.280 to endlessly while daydreaming about early crushes in high school. Additionally, 0:17:21.320 --> 0:17:24.520 I've often found remixes of classic video game melodies trigger 0:17:24.560 --> 0:17:27.760 frees on is they rekindle fond memories of a blissfully 0:17:27.840 --> 0:17:30.919 wasted childhood. One that always does it for me is 0:17:30.960 --> 0:17:34.920 the nerd core artist Mega Rand's track for the Gamers, 0:17:35.280 --> 0:17:38.560 which features samples and lyrics related to many beloved games. 0:17:38.760 --> 0:17:41.040 I'm curious if this song elicits frees on when the 0:17:41.040 --> 0:17:44.040 build up completes uh and gives a gives a time 0:17:44.080 --> 0:17:46.760 stamp here for others who grew up loving these games. 0:17:47.480 --> 0:17:50.119 While I'd always assumed it was just a subjective feeling 0:17:50.160 --> 0:17:54.240 based solely on personal memories and anticipatory dopamine release resulting 0:17:54.240 --> 0:17:58.840 from rhythmic pattern recognition and prediction, makes sense too. I 0:17:58.920 --> 0:18:02.320 noticed your examples of the replacements Alex Chilton and Mary 0:18:02.359 --> 0:18:06.840 Clayton's singing on Give Give Me Shelter, both causing the fun, fuzzy, 0:18:06.920 --> 0:18:08.840 warm feeling for me. So it's hard for me to 0:18:08.960 --> 0:18:12.159 argue on the subject of the feeling itself. I associate 0:18:12.200 --> 0:18:14.639 it more with a warm tingle than a cold shiver, 0:18:15.280 --> 0:18:17.720 and the the term this is a term that was 0:18:17.720 --> 0:18:21.119 cited about it skin orgasm. Though it's obviously not a 0:18:21.119 --> 0:18:25.000 sexual experience, doesn't seem too far off problematic, though it 0:18:25.040 --> 0:18:27.960 may be at any rate, this episode really hit home, 0:18:28.000 --> 0:18:31.159 and as your recent video game correspondent. If you'd do 0:18:31.240 --> 0:18:33.479 me the honor of bestowing such a title, I couldn't 0:18:33.520 --> 0:18:36.080 resist replying to this one. Please keep up the great 0:18:36.119 --> 0:18:39.119 work with one of my favorite podcast Cheers, James. I 0:18:39.600 --> 0:18:42.359 love what what James brought up here about for some 0:18:42.880 --> 0:18:44.960 and it's in its connection to two things where it's 0:18:45.000 --> 0:18:49.199 not just the music that you're that that is in 0:18:49.240 --> 0:18:51.199 your mind when you're experiencing this, but it's something that 0:18:51.240 --> 0:18:56.239 has become immersed with the music, particular memories or in 0:18:56.280 --> 0:18:59.000 my case, it will often be a song that I 0:18:59.040 --> 0:19:01.840 was listening to while I was reading something that made 0:19:02.480 --> 0:19:04.200 had a big impact on me, you know, a work 0:19:04.200 --> 0:19:08.320 of fiction or or um a piece of music. I 0:19:08.359 --> 0:19:11.560 was listening to a lot whilst envisioning a Dungeons and 0:19:11.640 --> 0:19:13.639 Dragons campaign, that sort of thing, you know, where the 0:19:14.000 --> 0:19:18.520 two becomes so uh linked together and then they also 0:19:18.680 --> 0:19:22.040 there's like this feedback loop, I guess, or this uh 0:19:22.240 --> 0:19:25.920 the system where each one makes the other more potent. 0:19:26.200 --> 0:19:28.720 Like the music is more effective because it makes me 0:19:28.760 --> 0:19:32.040 think of the Dungeons and dragon setting, and then you know, 0:19:32.160 --> 0:19:34.920 thinking about the Dungeons and dragon setting is more, uh 0:19:35.280 --> 0:19:37.520 more of an experience because of the music that I'm 0:19:37.520 --> 0:19:40.080 listening to while I'm doing it. Music and a vacuum 0:19:40.080 --> 0:19:42.680 can definitely elicit it, though. I think some of the 0:19:42.680 --> 0:19:44.960 studies we were looking at found it was especially common 0:19:45.000 --> 0:19:48.040 with things like film scores, and I think that there 0:19:48.080 --> 0:19:49.760 may well be a reason to that. It's not just 0:19:49.920 --> 0:19:53.359 that film scores are particularly free so on inducing in 0:19:53.480 --> 0:19:56.800 sonic terms, but that they are paired with scenes in movies, 0:19:57.320 --> 0:20:00.840 and these scenes bring their own emotional heft and sort 0:20:00.840 --> 0:20:03.760 of compliment the song in various ways that they create 0:20:03.840 --> 0:20:07.639 these emotional associations. Yeah, to just crank it up to 0:20:07.680 --> 0:20:11.440 where it's just absolute emotional manipulation. Yeah, you know. A 0:20:11.520 --> 0:20:13.960 quick example that comes to mind is the Hurdy Gurdy 0:20:14.040 --> 0:20:16.719 Man song, which which I don't think I ever had 0:20:16.720 --> 0:20:19.520 a real effect, right, Yeah, I don't think it ever. Really. 0:20:19.560 --> 0:20:22.119 I always appreciate it as a nice song, but it 0:20:22.240 --> 0:20:25.000 wasn't until I saw it used in the Fincher's Zodiac 0:20:25.240 --> 0:20:27.680 Zodiac where it's like it's it took on a new 0:20:27.840 --> 0:20:30.280 quality for me, and uh, and it just gives me 0:20:30.320 --> 0:20:32.560 the shivers when I hear it now if it's used 0:20:32.560 --> 0:20:35.639 in another I saw it recently in a TV show Um. 0:20:35.680 --> 0:20:38.080 That was also had had a great sense of style 0:20:38.200 --> 0:20:42.400 and in setting, but it instantly brought me back to Zodiac. Yeah. 0:20:42.440 --> 0:20:44.920 It's funny how really good use of a pop song 0:20:45.160 --> 0:20:47.879 in a movie can sort of change that song forever, 0:20:48.000 --> 0:20:50.320 Like you can't think about it without thinking about the movie. 0:20:50.359 --> 0:20:53.400 For for me, it's both sides now. I can't hear 0:20:53.440 --> 0:20:56.400 it without thinking of Hereditary. Oh yeah, I haven't seen 0:20:56.440 --> 0:20:59.320 Hereditary yet. Oh wow. Okay, well, I don't know if 0:20:59.359 --> 0:21:02.400 I know this song either, so I'm really look it up. 0:21:02.600 --> 0:21:06.120 Joni Mitchell. Wait, wait, wait, how's it go? I've looked 0:21:06.160 --> 0:21:09.200 at clouds from both sides now, from up and down? 0:21:09.520 --> 0:21:12.560 I mean cheese if I do too much? Yeah, yeah, 0:21:12.640 --> 0:21:15.040 you know. No, Okay, I know the song. Yes, Moons 0:21:15.119 --> 0:21:18.800 and Junes and Ferris Wheels, the dizzy dancing way you 0:21:18.840 --> 0:21:22.680 feel and pieces on the ground. So think that's a 0:21:22.680 --> 0:21:30.879 different Sweet dreams and flying machines. Getting back to listener mail, Okay, uh, 0:21:31.119 --> 0:21:32.520 let's see Rob, do you want to do this one? 0:21:32.560 --> 0:21:43.359 From Robin here? Absolutely all right? From Robin Um. Also 0:21:43.359 --> 0:21:48.000 addressing the Comfort in the Box episodes, Hi, Rob, Joe 0:21:48.000 --> 0:21:49.560 and stuff, I am catching up on some of your 0:21:49.560 --> 0:21:52.520 episodes from the latest round of work from home disruption, 0:21:52.800 --> 0:21:55.600