1 00:00:03,360 --> 00:00:06,240 Speaker 1: Welcome to Stuff to Blow your Mind from how Stuff 2 00:00:06,280 --> 00:00:13,680 Speaker 1: Works dot com. Hey, welcome to Stuff to Blow your Mind. 3 00:00:13,680 --> 00:00:16,279 Speaker 1: My name is Robert lamp and Julie Douglas Julie. Isn't 4 00:00:16,320 --> 00:00:20,439 Speaker 1: there just something delightfully intoxicating about the notion of a 5 00:00:20,520 --> 00:00:24,160 Speaker 1: lost world, a lost continent, a lost city. Yeah, I mean, 6 00:00:24,239 --> 00:00:27,120 Speaker 1: especially in this day and age, where everything is mapped out. 7 00:00:27,200 --> 00:00:29,840 Speaker 1: You have GPS, you can zoom to nearly any street 8 00:00:30,440 --> 00:00:33,080 Speaker 1: and take a gander. The idea that there is this 9 00:00:33,200 --> 00:00:37,520 Speaker 1: continent out there, undiscovered or perhaps once known and now 10 00:00:37,680 --> 00:00:43,000 Speaker 1: just um unknown to us again, just ripe and ready 11 00:00:43,120 --> 00:00:45,920 Speaker 1: to be discovered, is amazing. Yeah, I mean we uh. 12 00:00:46,560 --> 00:00:49,720 Speaker 1: When we were talking about HP Lovecraft in a recent episode, 13 00:00:49,920 --> 00:00:53,479 Speaker 1: we talked about his um, his novella At the Mountains 14 00:00:53,479 --> 00:00:57,200 Speaker 1: of Madness, which which is written in a time when 15 00:00:57,280 --> 00:01:00,320 Speaker 1: when man is on the cusp of exploring ing the 16 00:01:00,640 --> 00:01:07,560 Speaker 1: last unknown um Antarctica, and Lovecraft injects his fiction and 17 00:01:07,800 --> 00:01:13,280 Speaker 1: places some uh, the ancient remnants of a primordial alien 18 00:01:13,880 --> 00:01:18,080 Speaker 1: civilization there, and in in a sense he was investing 19 00:01:18,680 --> 00:01:21,639 Speaker 1: our our last hopes for something undiscovered on this world 20 00:01:21,880 --> 00:01:25,080 Speaker 1: in that place. We love the idea if there's not 21 00:01:25,160 --> 00:01:28,000 Speaker 1: something undiscovered out there in the present, then maybe there 22 00:01:28,040 --> 00:01:30,480 Speaker 1: was something in the past that we've lost, and failing that, 23 00:01:30,600 --> 00:01:32,640 Speaker 1: hey we'll just look to the future and dream something 24 00:01:32,720 --> 00:01:34,720 Speaker 1: up there. Well, I feel like he was tapping into 25 00:01:34,760 --> 00:01:38,560 Speaker 1: something anyway, and this idea that there are cultures so 26 00:01:38,640 --> 00:01:41,319 Speaker 1: very ancient civilization is so very different from us, that 27 00:01:41,400 --> 00:01:44,440 Speaker 1: they did seem or might seem alien to us. And 28 00:01:44,520 --> 00:01:47,280 Speaker 1: especially if you think about all the artifacts in that 29 00:01:47,400 --> 00:01:50,920 Speaker 1: novella that they come across um the ancient writings or 30 00:01:51,000 --> 00:01:54,520 Speaker 1: drawings and things that we discover today when we're trying 31 00:01:54,520 --> 00:01:57,120 Speaker 1: to figure out how people worked in the past. So 32 00:01:57,880 --> 00:02:00,160 Speaker 1: it is this idea that this lost cons and that 33 00:02:00,240 --> 00:02:04,440 Speaker 1: could give us another angle and another lens into humanity 34 00:02:04,440 --> 00:02:08,200 Speaker 1: and what what ultimately helped to create us and where 35 00:02:08,240 --> 00:02:11,040 Speaker 1: we are today. And certainly even just within known history 36 00:02:11,080 --> 00:02:14,399 Speaker 1: there there there are plenty of places and times it's 37 00:02:14,480 --> 00:02:17,120 Speaker 1: very difficult for us to to wrap our heads around, 38 00:02:17,120 --> 00:02:19,160 Speaker 1: like it's it's been pointed out to me before that 39 00:02:19,480 --> 00:02:22,520 Speaker 1: the religion of the ancient Egyptians, for instance, Uh, it 40 00:02:22,720 --> 00:02:26,560 Speaker 1: never really took off behind the ancient egypt because it 41 00:02:26,639 --> 00:02:29,359 Speaker 1: is it is very difficult for an outsider to sort 42 00:02:29,400 --> 00:02:32,679 Speaker 1: of wrap your head around, uh, these these concepts and 43 00:02:33,160 --> 00:02:35,160 Speaker 1: what exactly they were going for, which I think it 44 00:02:35,280 --> 00:02:39,080 Speaker 1: makes makes it even that more romantic, these notions that 45 00:02:39,120 --> 00:02:43,920 Speaker 1: these lands could have existed, these these utopias where you know, 46 00:02:44,040 --> 00:02:48,960 Speaker 1: people were incredibly strong and and the societies were wealthy, 47 00:02:49,120 --> 00:02:52,040 Speaker 1: and and they were technologically advanced. This idea that this 48 00:02:52,080 --> 00:02:55,840 Speaker 1: could have existed. And I'm even thinking about El Dorado, 49 00:02:56,200 --> 00:02:59,120 Speaker 1: which is, you know a perfect example of the sort 50 00:02:59,120 --> 00:03:03,600 Speaker 1: of um romantic version of society, but all through this 51 00:03:03,680 --> 00:03:06,080 Speaker 1: idea that all these treasures exists and you just need 52 00:03:06,120 --> 00:03:08,760 Speaker 1: to go find them and plunder them. And El Dorado 53 00:03:08,800 --> 00:03:13,079 Speaker 1: is the famous city of riches. Seventeenth century European explorers 54 00:03:13,080 --> 00:03:16,480 Speaker 1: were trying to find in South America with all sorts 55 00:03:16,480 --> 00:03:19,560 Speaker 1: of fantastical stories of you know, this Indian chief covered 56 00:03:19,600 --> 00:03:22,560 Speaker 1: in gold and all sorts of gems and rubies just 57 00:03:22,880 --> 00:03:26,960 Speaker 1: there for the taking if you can find the city. Yea. Indeed, 58 00:03:27,200 --> 00:03:29,680 Speaker 1: one of the sources we both read for this particular 59 00:03:29,720 --> 00:03:34,640 Speaker 1: episode an article by else Broad de Camp titled Lost Continents, 60 00:03:34,680 --> 00:03:36,720 Speaker 1: which is published in the National History magazine. You can 61 00:03:36,760 --> 00:03:39,840 Speaker 1: find it online. Uh. He pointed out that as we've 62 00:03:39,840 --> 00:03:42,520 Speaker 1: been saying, we love this idea of utopia. We love 63 00:03:42,560 --> 00:03:44,720 Speaker 1: this idea that there's some lost land somewhere that that 64 00:03:45,280 --> 00:03:50,680 Speaker 1: captures perfection. Um. Our world sucks, but surely we got 65 00:03:50,680 --> 00:03:52,360 Speaker 1: it right at some point, or we will get it 66 00:03:52,440 --> 00:03:55,080 Speaker 1: right at some point in the future. He says that 67 00:03:55,120 --> 00:03:58,000 Speaker 1: we we used to situate these Eden's and Golden ages 68 00:03:58,000 --> 00:04:00,520 Speaker 1: in the remote past or in some unex word portion 69 00:04:00,600 --> 00:04:03,520 Speaker 1: of the world, but now we're we're forced to place 70 00:04:03,600 --> 00:04:06,880 Speaker 1: them on other planets or in the distant future. So 71 00:04:06,880 --> 00:04:09,040 Speaker 1: so one day, one day, maybe we'll get there. But 72 00:04:09,080 --> 00:04:12,280 Speaker 1: failing that, of course we we we fill our our 73 00:04:12,440 --> 00:04:16,039 Speaker 1: our fantasies, we feel our dream worlds with these various places. 74 00:04:16,080 --> 00:04:18,760 Speaker 1: So I think we've already mentioned a few, but just 75 00:04:18,800 --> 00:04:20,440 Speaker 1: some of the writers that come to my mind when 76 00:04:20,520 --> 00:04:24,160 Speaker 1: we think about lost worlds uh Um Lovecraft, of course, 77 00:04:24,440 --> 00:04:27,440 Speaker 1: Clark Ashton Smith wrote whole cycles of short stories set 78 00:04:28,040 --> 00:04:32,000 Speaker 1: on the lost continent of Hyperborea, on the future continent 79 00:04:32,160 --> 00:04:35,720 Speaker 1: of Zofik, and on the last chart of sunken Atlanta 80 00:04:35,760 --> 00:04:39,840 Speaker 1: is known as Poseidonus j R. Tolkien wrote of uh 81 00:04:39,960 --> 00:04:43,520 Speaker 1: New Minore, which I made. The Tolken fanetics will probably 82 00:04:43,560 --> 00:04:47,080 Speaker 1: correct me on that, and the pronunciation of Tolkien's name, 83 00:04:47,080 --> 00:04:49,760 Speaker 1: but I grew up saying Tolkien's though it's grew it. H. 84 00:04:50,240 --> 00:04:52,240 Speaker 1: But this world is another one that a fictional world 85 00:04:52,240 --> 00:04:56,080 Speaker 1: fell into darkness sank beneath the waves Thomas Moore's Utopia 86 00:04:56,200 --> 00:05:01,560 Speaker 1: fifteen sixteen classic. We also in remembering this chapter in 87 00:05:01,680 --> 00:05:05,280 Speaker 1: Ken jennings book map Head, in which he talked about 88 00:05:05,279 --> 00:05:08,839 Speaker 1: this law professor Austin tap And right, who died in 89 00:05:09,600 --> 00:05:13,040 Speaker 1: one but he left behind something like twenty three d 90 00:05:13,440 --> 00:05:18,279 Speaker 1: handwritten pages describing and mapping this fictional country in his 91 00:05:18,360 --> 00:05:23,839 Speaker 1: mind called Islandia and decades long fever dream for him, right, 92 00:05:24,040 --> 00:05:26,120 Speaker 1: you know. And this is beyond the sort of scope 93 00:05:26,120 --> 00:05:27,720 Speaker 1: of his work that he did in his daily life. 94 00:05:27,720 --> 00:05:29,320 Speaker 1: So this is what he did in the mornings and 95 00:05:29,320 --> 00:05:33,400 Speaker 1: when he got home from work, and it detailed, uh everything, 96 00:05:33,480 --> 00:05:37,839 Speaker 1: the population, the culture of the languages. And again here's 97 00:05:37,839 --> 00:05:41,320 Speaker 1: this idea that we can't help but storytelling, we think 98 00:05:41,360 --> 00:05:45,320 Speaker 1: about distant lands, real or imagined. I mean, this is 99 00:05:45,360 --> 00:05:47,560 Speaker 1: something that really takes hold of us. I'm glad you 100 00:05:47,560 --> 00:05:50,560 Speaker 1: mentioned map Head because because that really cuts down to 101 00:05:50,800 --> 00:05:54,400 Speaker 1: two of the key features here. In discussing lost continents 102 00:05:54,400 --> 00:05:57,120 Speaker 1: and lost worlds, on one hand, the mapping of our 103 00:05:57,200 --> 00:06:00,920 Speaker 1: world us as we will roll out as we continue 104 00:06:00,960 --> 00:06:03,920 Speaker 1: in this conversation. UM. A lot of the stems from 105 00:06:03,920 --> 00:06:07,040 Speaker 1: our attempt to understand the shape of our world, the 106 00:06:07,120 --> 00:06:10,080 Speaker 1: layout of our world, where the where the continents are, where, 107 00:06:10,080 --> 00:06:16,880 Speaker 1: where various islands are, and then misinformation theories, hypothesis here 108 00:06:16,880 --> 00:06:19,400 Speaker 1: and there, and and a lot of dreaming. We get 109 00:06:19,440 --> 00:06:22,800 Speaker 1: into the the the theory of what may exist gets 110 00:06:22,800 --> 00:06:25,600 Speaker 1: picked up by the into and transformed into the desire 111 00:06:25,720 --> 00:06:28,480 Speaker 1: for something to exist. Yeah, that's a good point because 112 00:06:28,800 --> 00:06:31,160 Speaker 1: I was thinking about this. You have maps that are 113 00:06:31,240 --> 00:06:34,560 Speaker 1: physical maps, and you have allegorical maps. In the same way, 114 00:06:34,600 --> 00:06:36,279 Speaker 1: you have the same kind of stories, right, you have 115 00:06:36,360 --> 00:06:38,640 Speaker 1: some of their allegorical stories, and then you have some 116 00:06:38,760 --> 00:06:42,720 Speaker 1: stories that may be rooted in historical fact. And I'm 117 00:06:42,760 --> 00:06:46,200 Speaker 1: thinking about the city of Troy, which was written about 118 00:06:46,200 --> 00:06:49,360 Speaker 1: by Homer in the fictional poems Iliad and Odyssey, and 119 00:06:49,560 --> 00:06:54,000 Speaker 1: turns out that the city of Troy is was a 120 00:06:54,080 --> 00:06:58,280 Speaker 1: city that is located in modern day Turkey, and the 121 00:06:58,560 --> 00:07:01,920 Speaker 1: Trojan Wars may actually have happened. So you have all 122 00:07:01,960 --> 00:07:06,240 Speaker 1: of this sort of tinging these ideas of history and 123 00:07:06,960 --> 00:07:12,800 Speaker 1: legend and no more so than the idea of Atlantis. Ah. Yes, 124 00:07:13,200 --> 00:07:14,720 Speaker 1: And I do want to say a place like Troy, 125 00:07:15,040 --> 00:07:18,760 Speaker 1: it instantly makes me think of any number of places 126 00:07:18,800 --> 00:07:22,160 Speaker 1: that have an important role both in real history as 127 00:07:22,160 --> 00:07:24,960 Speaker 1: well as in fiction, as well as in religion and myth. 128 00:07:25,360 --> 00:07:30,600 Speaker 1: And some individuals want to really only take one of 129 00:07:30,600 --> 00:07:33,360 Speaker 1: those or want to combine them all into a single thing. 130 00:07:33,440 --> 00:07:35,239 Speaker 1: But I really feel a place like that, like Troy, 131 00:07:35,480 --> 00:07:38,120 Speaker 1: it kind of exists in a like a quantum superposition. 132 00:07:38,240 --> 00:07:40,240 Speaker 1: You know, it is at once a real place and 133 00:07:40,360 --> 00:07:43,080 Speaker 1: it is this fantasy place. And and these things are 134 00:07:43,120 --> 00:07:47,320 Speaker 1: not necessarily connected. You can't necessarily overlay them like see 135 00:07:47,360 --> 00:07:49,160 Speaker 1: through panels in a book and expect to see a 136 00:07:49,200 --> 00:07:52,040 Speaker 1: concise image. It could be dueled with nature. Yeah. Yeah. 137 00:07:52,240 --> 00:07:56,160 Speaker 1: And indeed Atlantis, the Big One definitely falls into this 138 00:07:56,240 --> 00:07:59,640 Speaker 1: category as well. Well. The thing about Atlantis, though, is 139 00:08:00,040 --> 00:08:03,880 Speaker 1: widely seen as an allegorical story. Yes, right in the 140 00:08:03,880 --> 00:08:07,280 Speaker 1: time that it was written in the present, but we 141 00:08:07,360 --> 00:08:10,680 Speaker 1: just can't help ourselves, right for all the reasons that 142 00:08:10,760 --> 00:08:13,200 Speaker 1: we just ticked through. Um, so when we talk about 143 00:08:13,240 --> 00:08:15,840 Speaker 1: the story of Atlantis, for talking about the lost city, 144 00:08:16,000 --> 00:08:20,160 Speaker 1: and you can't have this actual story about Atlantis unless 145 00:08:20,160 --> 00:08:23,360 Speaker 1: you talk about this other city, this Athenian city that 146 00:08:23,480 --> 00:08:26,560 Speaker 1: existed in the story at the same time. Um, this 147 00:08:26,680 --> 00:08:30,120 Speaker 1: is huge empire that was organized along the lines that 148 00:08:30,160 --> 00:08:32,800 Speaker 1: Plato had set forth in his republic, and the state 149 00:08:32,840 --> 00:08:35,800 Speaker 1: was ruled by a communistic military cast and everybody was 150 00:08:35,840 --> 00:08:43,680 Speaker 1: brave and handsome and virtuous kind of like Garrison Keiller's Yeah, 151 00:08:43,720 --> 00:08:47,840 Speaker 1: something like that Lake Wobegone as Atlantis new theory, new theory. 152 00:08:48,040 --> 00:08:51,559 Speaker 1: Garrison Killer needs to write that episode for like what 153 00:08:51,840 --> 00:08:54,600 Speaker 1: are we gone? Um? But his rival city, of course 154 00:08:54,640 --> 00:08:57,320 Speaker 1: was Atlantis. And this is an island west of the 155 00:08:57,360 --> 00:09:01,080 Speaker 1: Pillars of Hercules, larger than North after good Asia, Asia 156 00:09:01,120 --> 00:09:04,920 Speaker 1: minor combined, right, so just land mass wise huge, right, 157 00:09:05,160 --> 00:09:11,200 Speaker 1: And this was just a rehash written and he's saying 158 00:09:11,679 --> 00:09:17,040 Speaker 1: this was nine thousand years ago from in was like, hey, 159 00:09:17,200 --> 00:09:19,840 Speaker 1: this happened nine thousand years ago, which kind of as 160 00:09:19,840 --> 00:09:23,360 Speaker 1: a red flag anyway, Right, we'll discuss why. Um, this 161 00:09:23,440 --> 00:09:26,680 Speaker 1: is long ago in a galaxy far far away. Basically, yes, 162 00:09:26,840 --> 00:09:30,679 Speaker 1: you're right, but basically this continent had all sorts of 163 00:09:30,679 --> 00:09:33,679 Speaker 1: great power, had tried to conquer the eastern Mediterranean, but 164 00:09:33,840 --> 00:09:37,920 Speaker 1: had been defeated by the Athenians, and up to this 165 00:09:37,960 --> 00:09:40,840 Speaker 1: point in the story, we get all this background on 166 00:09:40,880 --> 00:09:44,080 Speaker 1: Atlantis and how it was an advanced society, but there's 167 00:09:44,080 --> 00:09:47,240 Speaker 1: no flying planes, no laser guns. There's they have a 168 00:09:47,320 --> 00:09:50,560 Speaker 1: really fancy bronze like metal that science shines like the sun, 169 00:09:51,040 --> 00:09:52,960 Speaker 1: but that that's pretty much yet place. It doesn't allot 170 00:09:52,960 --> 00:09:57,199 Speaker 1: anything else sci fi. But they have fancy architecture and art. Yeah, um, 171 00:09:57,280 --> 00:10:00,440 Speaker 1: fancy pants. Okay, But at this point you have a 172 00:10:00,600 --> 00:10:05,680 Speaker 1: great earthquake that devastates this Athenian city and Atlantis, and 173 00:10:05,720 --> 00:10:08,480 Speaker 1: along with it, uh you know, you you then have 174 00:10:08,520 --> 00:10:13,560 Speaker 1: the flood swallowing it, or you have Poseidon mandating that 175 00:10:13,720 --> 00:10:18,400 Speaker 1: these floods um swallow these cities whole, right, because it's 176 00:10:18,440 --> 00:10:22,079 Speaker 1: also laid out in Plato's work that that Poseidon puts 177 00:10:22,160 --> 00:10:25,000 Speaker 1: his ten sons in charge of Atlantis. In the Atlantis 178 00:10:25,040 --> 00:10:28,560 Speaker 1: gets gets kicked off with to begin with, Yeah, the charter, 179 00:10:28,679 --> 00:10:30,839 Speaker 1: if you will. Josh Clark has an article about this, 180 00:10:31,120 --> 00:10:33,640 Speaker 1: this an Atlantis article and has stuff works, and he 181 00:10:33,679 --> 00:10:36,440 Speaker 1: says Plato loses some credibility when he mentions that the 182 00:10:36,440 --> 00:10:39,680 Speaker 1: city was also populated by blood descendants of the sea 183 00:10:39,760 --> 00:10:43,079 Speaker 1: and earthquake god Poseidon. Yeah, I tend to agree with them. Yeah, 184 00:10:43,120 --> 00:10:45,600 Speaker 1: I mean, if you're gonna try and take Plato seriously. 185 00:10:45,679 --> 00:10:48,319 Speaker 1: But it's it's like if you read J. R. Tolkien 186 00:10:48,640 --> 00:10:51,560 Speaker 1: and said, this Middle Earth thing is just completely made up. 187 00:10:51,600 --> 00:10:53,680 Speaker 1: I tried to find it on a map. I couldn't 188 00:10:54,040 --> 00:10:56,439 Speaker 1: you work really hard. I came close a couple of times, 189 00:10:56,440 --> 00:10:58,440 Speaker 1: but it just doesn't pan out. Of course, it doesn't 190 00:10:58,480 --> 00:11:01,600 Speaker 1: pan out because Middle Earth does not really exists. It 191 00:11:01,679 --> 00:11:05,280 Speaker 1: exists as a fiction. It exists. You could argue as 192 00:11:05,280 --> 00:11:09,160 Speaker 1: an allegory for for for Europe during the Second World War, etcetera. 193 00:11:09,280 --> 00:11:12,080 Speaker 1: But wait, wait, wait a second, I saw that documentary 194 00:11:12,120 --> 00:11:16,520 Speaker 1: Lord of the Rings. Yes it exists. Well, New Zealand exists, 195 00:11:16,520 --> 00:11:18,840 Speaker 1: and we'll actually discuss New Zealand a little bit in 196 00:11:18,880 --> 00:11:21,679 Speaker 1: part two of this uh this episode, yeah, the perfect 197 00:11:21,679 --> 00:11:24,800 Speaker 1: setting really for Lord of the Rings, and um, the 198 00:11:24,800 --> 00:11:27,120 Speaker 1: perfect setting as as all lost. The idea of a 199 00:11:27,160 --> 00:11:30,079 Speaker 1: lost continent right has all the elements, all right. But 200 00:11:30,120 --> 00:11:32,480 Speaker 1: there are two remaining points to hit here, and one 201 00:11:32,640 --> 00:11:34,840 Speaker 1: is that the fact that nobody in Greece for nine 202 00:11:34,880 --> 00:11:40,440 Speaker 1: thousand years had mentioned a giant battle between Athens and Atlantis, 203 00:11:40,960 --> 00:11:44,080 Speaker 1: the except for Plato's tail on various commentaries by his successors. 204 00:11:44,280 --> 00:11:48,320 Speaker 1: There's not another surviving word about Atlantis in the Greco Roman, 205 00:11:48,360 --> 00:11:53,040 Speaker 1: Egyptian and Babylonian canon of literature, which is a little suspect. Yeah, 206 00:11:53,120 --> 00:11:55,640 Speaker 1: and again, everyone knew in Plato's day that this was fiction, 207 00:11:55,679 --> 00:11:58,840 Speaker 1: this was allegory. Uh. Those who came after him knew it. 208 00:11:58,920 --> 00:12:03,800 Speaker 1: But as els Brague de Camp points out, critical standards 209 00:12:03,800 --> 00:12:07,440 Speaker 1: in the later Roman Empire degraded, and some began to 210 00:12:07,520 --> 00:12:10,560 Speaker 1: take the tale seriously. And that's kind of the beginning 211 00:12:10,600 --> 00:12:13,400 Speaker 1: of what would later pick back up in terms of 212 00:12:13,559 --> 00:12:18,280 Speaker 1: re examining Atlantis and thinking or wanting it to be true, 213 00:12:18,760 --> 00:12:21,880 Speaker 1: even though and this is the second point, Plato was 214 00:12:22,440 --> 00:12:26,280 Speaker 1: a philosopher, not a historian, so he wrote on an 215 00:12:26,280 --> 00:12:29,200 Speaker 1: allegorical level. Yeah, but he's Plato. He's a big name, 216 00:12:29,320 --> 00:12:32,480 Speaker 1: so you know, especially as the centuries roll by, there 217 00:12:32,520 --> 00:12:35,040 Speaker 1: becomes this there's more of a tendency to want to 218 00:12:35,080 --> 00:12:37,640 Speaker 1: take what he says really seriously. And if he's talking 219 00:12:37,640 --> 00:12:40,960 Speaker 1: about mysteries, all the better. Right, do you think Oprah 220 00:12:41,040 --> 00:12:43,280 Speaker 1: will have that sort of power? And I always ask 221 00:12:43,360 --> 00:12:47,360 Speaker 1: this Tony in some fashion in two hundred years, Yes, yes, 222 00:12:47,520 --> 00:12:51,120 Speaker 1: people will be rereading the works of of Oprah looking 223 00:12:51,160 --> 00:12:53,880 Speaker 1: for the lost works of Oprah and her disciples. Dr 224 00:12:53,960 --> 00:12:58,960 Speaker 1: phil Across Susie Ormon. All right, let's take a quick break, 225 00:12:58,960 --> 00:13:01,040 Speaker 1: and when we get back, we're gonna tell about some 226 00:13:01,120 --> 00:13:03,640 Speaker 1: of the people who are trying to get at the 227 00:13:03,679 --> 00:13:14,160 Speaker 1: bottom whether or not Atlantis could have ever existed. All right, 228 00:13:14,240 --> 00:13:18,120 Speaker 1: we're back. Let's talk about some people who have looked 229 00:13:18,120 --> 00:13:21,439 Speaker 1: at this fascinated idea of I guess it's sort of 230 00:13:21,480 --> 00:13:28,800 Speaker 1: like archaeology meets history meets geography meets could Atlantis have existed? Yeah, yeah, 231 00:13:29,080 --> 00:13:31,520 Speaker 1: this is where it gets, uh, gets even more interesting 232 00:13:31,559 --> 00:13:35,000 Speaker 1: because after about the sixth century, you didn't really hear 233 00:13:35,080 --> 00:13:39,000 Speaker 1: much about Atlantis for a long time until you reach 234 00:13:39,080 --> 00:13:42,280 Speaker 1: the beginning of the European Age of Exploration during the 235 00:13:42,320 --> 00:13:45,640 Speaker 1: fifteenth century. So we're out there, we're exploring the ocean, 236 00:13:45,920 --> 00:13:50,760 Speaker 1: and we are in fact discovering new lands. But then 237 00:13:50,800 --> 00:13:52,640 Speaker 1: of course we're mapping our ways too. But this is 238 00:13:52,679 --> 00:13:56,040 Speaker 1: our Our maps were populated by many a non existent creature, 239 00:13:56,080 --> 00:13:59,120 Speaker 1: which we've discussed before talking about the science of sea monsters. 240 00:13:59,559 --> 00:14:03,440 Speaker 1: So too, do non existing islands pop up throughout the Atlantic. 241 00:14:03,480 --> 00:14:07,440 Speaker 1: It's especially the Atlantic. So in some ways you have 242 00:14:07,840 --> 00:14:10,360 Speaker 1: you're on the cusp of discovery, right, and you have 243 00:14:10,600 --> 00:14:15,360 Speaker 1: these large swaths of undiscovered land in oceans, and so 244 00:14:15,440 --> 00:14:17,440 Speaker 1: it would make sense that people would try to say, 245 00:14:17,520 --> 00:14:22,400 Speaker 1: I think that I have found where Atlantis went under. Yeah, 246 00:14:22,920 --> 00:14:27,120 Speaker 1: and then you have a sect of these people who 247 00:14:27,160 --> 00:14:31,440 Speaker 1: you might consider scientific atlantists. Yes, And and this also 248 00:14:31,440 --> 00:14:34,160 Speaker 1: picks up a lot when we discover America, because oh 249 00:14:34,200 --> 00:14:36,240 Speaker 1: my goodness, here is a world and it has people 250 00:14:36,240 --> 00:14:38,720 Speaker 1: living on it who we've never discovered before. So that's 251 00:14:38,720 --> 00:14:40,960 Speaker 1: even more fuel for the fire right And and in fact, 252 00:14:41,320 --> 00:14:45,160 Speaker 1: some would end up saying, hey, America is the Atlantist 253 00:14:45,840 --> 00:14:49,920 Speaker 1: and well it's not. Yes. Els brag de Camp divides 254 00:14:50,400 --> 00:14:56,120 Speaker 1: Atlantist enthusiasts or atlantists into three categories, the scientific, the 255 00:14:56,160 --> 00:14:59,920 Speaker 1: pseudo scientific, and the occultists. Um, we'll start with the 256 00:15:00,040 --> 00:15:03,360 Speaker 1: scientific because that's the reasonable place to start. And really, 257 00:15:03,400 --> 00:15:06,240 Speaker 1: they it's kind of a progression, right as you sort 258 00:15:06,240 --> 00:15:09,400 Speaker 1: of drift off a little a little more, a little 259 00:15:09,440 --> 00:15:12,880 Speaker 1: more from having a firm grasp in reality, but it's 260 00:15:12,880 --> 00:15:15,720 Speaker 1: trying to be rooted in in reality, it's trying to 261 00:15:15,720 --> 00:15:18,440 Speaker 1: be rooted in data. But then sort of drifting off. 262 00:15:18,480 --> 00:15:22,160 Speaker 1: I was thinking about this, that that cognitive bias that 263 00:15:22,240 --> 00:15:25,800 Speaker 1: we sometimes experience when we're trying to create that picture 264 00:15:25,800 --> 00:15:27,800 Speaker 1: that we want to see. Yeah, he's sort of like 265 00:15:27,840 --> 00:15:32,600 Speaker 1: the scientists, the scientific atlantists are saying, could it be true? 266 00:15:32,680 --> 00:15:34,800 Speaker 1: Let me see, here's my theory about how it could be, 267 00:15:34,960 --> 00:15:38,360 Speaker 1: And then the pseudo scientific the the the desire for 268 00:15:38,480 --> 00:15:41,560 Speaker 1: to be true takes over. And then with the occultists, 269 00:15:41,600 --> 00:15:44,280 Speaker 1: just any other nonsense you might have lying about the 270 00:15:44,320 --> 00:15:48,000 Speaker 1: house gets thrown into it, your fantasy. They're the most fun. Yes, 271 00:15:48,920 --> 00:15:52,800 Speaker 1: so yes for scientific atlantists, Uh, they are again they're 272 00:15:52,800 --> 00:15:56,640 Speaker 1: looking for an ancient culture that could have possibly inspired Plato. 273 00:15:57,080 --> 00:16:00,200 Speaker 1: And and they're not necessarily even getting into the whole 274 00:16:00,480 --> 00:16:04,320 Speaker 1: uh worry over an actual Atlantic island or some sort 275 00:16:04,360 --> 00:16:07,520 Speaker 1: of large land mast sinking into the ocean. So in 276 00:16:07,600 --> 00:16:12,960 Speaker 1: the sixteen seventy nine, Olaf Rudbek Uh supposedly found Atlantis 277 00:16:13,000 --> 00:16:18,280 Speaker 1: in Sweden, and then subsequently other individuals found Atlantis and 278 00:16:18,480 --> 00:16:22,680 Speaker 1: Uh in the Tunisia and Nigeria and South Africa, uh, 279 00:16:22,840 --> 00:16:26,920 Speaker 1: just about everywhere else. Right, Um, the best theories that 280 00:16:27,000 --> 00:16:30,200 Speaker 1: have been put forth regarding the location of Atlanta tend 281 00:16:30,280 --> 00:16:34,560 Speaker 1: to put it in Minoan crete or in tar TESSAs, 282 00:16:34,680 --> 00:16:37,920 Speaker 1: which is a harbor city and the surrounding area on 283 00:16:37,960 --> 00:16:42,120 Speaker 1: the southern coast of the Iberian Peninsula that was abandoned 284 00:16:42,160 --> 00:16:45,280 Speaker 1: to floodwaters, most likely before the Common Era. Meanwhile, the 285 00:16:45,320 --> 00:16:49,600 Speaker 1: Eastern Mediterranean Minoan Empire I really did suffer overwhelming disaster 286 00:16:49,880 --> 00:16:53,240 Speaker 1: around fift dred BC. And this was a Bronze Age 287 00:16:53,240 --> 00:16:56,760 Speaker 1: power that flourished from the twenty seven century BC to 288 00:16:56,840 --> 00:17:01,480 Speaker 1: around the fifteenth century BC. Oh, that's an example of 289 00:17:01,520 --> 00:17:05,760 Speaker 1: scientific Atlantis. Now you have pseudo scientific Atlantis, and a 290 00:17:05,800 --> 00:17:10,560 Speaker 1: good example is Augustus Leclegan. I'm glad you tackled that. 291 00:17:10,600 --> 00:17:13,000 Speaker 1: When you have more of the French tongue. Anyone who 292 00:17:13,080 --> 00:17:15,520 Speaker 1: is proficient in French may take issue with that, but 293 00:17:15,600 --> 00:17:18,159 Speaker 1: I tried. Let it be known, I tried. Um. He 294 00:17:18,240 --> 00:17:21,359 Speaker 1: spent a lot of years in the Mayan ruins of 295 00:17:21,680 --> 00:17:26,040 Speaker 1: the Yucatan. He became quite an expert. He claimed to 296 00:17:26,600 --> 00:17:31,600 Speaker 1: understand the Mayan alphabet, and he considered Egyptian higher growth 297 00:17:31,680 --> 00:17:37,040 Speaker 1: like hieroglyphics similar to the Mayan. And he claimed to 298 00:17:37,080 --> 00:17:39,280 Speaker 1: be able to to sort of sort all of this 299 00:17:39,920 --> 00:17:44,399 Speaker 1: by using a modification of something called rascille de Bobuls's 300 00:17:44,920 --> 00:17:49,000 Speaker 1: modification of a de Landis alphabet. So all of those 301 00:17:49,040 --> 00:17:51,959 Speaker 1: words just falling out of my mouth, I think already 302 00:17:52,000 --> 00:17:56,480 Speaker 1: gives you an idea that this guy was completely obsessed. 303 00:17:56,880 --> 00:18:00,960 Speaker 1: No doubt he was a scholar, but he is uh 304 00:18:01,119 --> 00:18:03,919 Speaker 1: carving things together in such a way that he was 305 00:18:04,000 --> 00:18:09,520 Speaker 1: really really was world building and doing it with language. Yeah, 306 00:18:09,520 --> 00:18:11,320 Speaker 1: and I think world building is key here, Yeah, because 307 00:18:11,320 --> 00:18:13,720 Speaker 1: he's taking what he knows about mind culture and then 308 00:18:13,760 --> 00:18:18,000 Speaker 1: he's connecting it. He's forming connective tissue to not only 309 00:18:19,000 --> 00:18:22,119 Speaker 1: the real ancient Egypt, but to this imagined Atlantis and 310 00:18:22,240 --> 00:18:26,919 Speaker 1: just stitching together a world anew. Can you imagine him 311 00:18:26,960 --> 00:18:30,440 Speaker 1: living today and tackling like the moon landing hoax? Oh yeah, 312 00:18:30,440 --> 00:18:32,720 Speaker 1: he would have a huge following online, I'm sure you know. 313 00:18:32,760 --> 00:18:36,119 Speaker 1: That's one of the things that continually amazes me looking 314 00:18:36,160 --> 00:18:39,200 Speaker 1: around at a variety of topics, not just this one online, 315 00:18:39,480 --> 00:18:43,320 Speaker 1: is just how much material there is out there supporting 316 00:18:43,920 --> 00:18:49,920 Speaker 1: just bad theories, bad ideas about say, uh, how recently 317 00:18:49,920 --> 00:18:54,960 Speaker 1: the dinosaurs, uh when extinct, or where Atlantis is or was, 318 00:18:55,160 --> 00:18:58,600 Speaker 1: or just it's it's it's a little depressing at times. Well, 319 00:18:58,640 --> 00:19:01,280 Speaker 1: I think it speaks to this idea that humans have 320 00:19:01,400 --> 00:19:05,840 Speaker 1: to chew on something and sometimes and a lot of 321 00:19:05,880 --> 00:19:09,280 Speaker 1: the problem here is that our experience is so subjective 322 00:19:09,600 --> 00:19:11,760 Speaker 1: that it's hard to say, well, this is the thing 323 00:19:11,880 --> 00:19:13,920 Speaker 1: all that. It's actually not that hard. In fact, you 324 00:19:13,960 --> 00:19:17,200 Speaker 1: can take scientific data and help yourself guide yourself into 325 00:19:17,359 --> 00:19:21,680 Speaker 1: the right area of exploration. Nonetheless, we are world builders, 326 00:19:21,680 --> 00:19:24,320 Speaker 1: we are storytellers, and we gotta chew on something. I 327 00:19:24,440 --> 00:19:29,639 Speaker 1: found an hour long h amateur documentary on YouTube the 328 00:19:29,680 --> 00:19:33,960 Speaker 1: other day where a man was arguing for the recent 329 00:19:34,000 --> 00:19:38,399 Speaker 1: existence of dinosaurs based on evidence in the Bible. But 330 00:19:38,480 --> 00:19:41,119 Speaker 1: here's the thing. He wasn't trying He didn't seem to 331 00:19:41,119 --> 00:19:44,639 Speaker 1: have any other point, but there are dinosaurs in the Bible. 332 00:19:44,680 --> 00:19:46,760 Speaker 1: He wasn't trying to push any kind of like new 333 00:19:47,119 --> 00:19:49,000 Speaker 1: uh you know, Young Earth kind of a model. He 334 00:19:49,040 --> 00:19:52,280 Speaker 1: wasn't trying to disprove evolution. He was just saying, hey, 335 00:19:52,320 --> 00:19:54,680 Speaker 1: there are dinosaurs in the Bible, and here's an hour 336 00:19:54,760 --> 00:19:57,960 Speaker 1: of me talking about it. Because for him, that is 337 00:19:58,000 --> 00:20:03,480 Speaker 1: the thing that obviously is problematic, and if he could 338 00:20:03,560 --> 00:20:07,440 Speaker 1: just figure out how dinosaurs fit into this, then all 339 00:20:07,440 --> 00:20:09,840 Speaker 1: of it would make sense. Again, you have the cognitive 340 00:20:09,960 --> 00:20:12,400 Speaker 1: bias at play that when you are faced with something 341 00:20:13,200 --> 00:20:16,000 Speaker 1: that really refutes the data in front of you, you 342 00:20:16,040 --> 00:20:18,200 Speaker 1: will double down and find a way to make it fit. 343 00:20:18,920 --> 00:20:23,879 Speaker 1: Speaking of pseudo scientific atlantist, another individual worth mentioning is 344 00:20:24,000 --> 00:20:28,480 Speaker 1: Paul Schlieman. And Paul Schleiman was actually the grandson of 345 00:20:28,520 --> 00:20:32,240 Speaker 1: Heinrich Schleiman, who actually dug up Troy. We mentioned earlier 346 00:20:32,240 --> 00:20:34,439 Speaker 1: about the finding of Troy, and really Troy is a 347 00:20:34,520 --> 00:20:37,280 Speaker 1: real place in addition to you know, whatever else it 348 00:20:37,400 --> 00:20:41,200 Speaker 1: might be in the in in the popular mindset of man. 349 00:20:41,520 --> 00:20:46,400 Speaker 1: But yeah, nineteen twelve, Paul Schleiman um gave the New 350 00:20:46,480 --> 00:20:50,080 Speaker 1: York American magazine a sensational tale about how his grandfather 351 00:20:50,119 --> 00:20:54,679 Speaker 1: had left secret papers instructing him not to instruct him 352 00:20:54,720 --> 00:20:57,159 Speaker 1: to break open an owl headed vase and supposedly they 353 00:20:57,200 --> 00:21:01,960 Speaker 1: were Atlantis secrets in side. But nothing ever came of that, 354 00:21:02,080 --> 00:21:06,199 Speaker 1: no vase was ever presented, no documents, so um, but it. 355 00:21:06,440 --> 00:21:08,840 Speaker 1: But it added just a little more fuel to the fire, 356 00:21:09,160 --> 00:21:13,720 Speaker 1: all right, Um. The last category here would be, as 357 00:21:13,760 --> 00:21:16,640 Speaker 1: you mentioned before, the occult atlantis, and this these really 358 00:21:16,640 --> 00:21:18,960 Speaker 1: are the people that are going to bring the life 359 00:21:18,960 --> 00:21:23,040 Speaker 1: to the party. Here yeah, with occultist Atlantists, and occultist 360 00:21:23,080 --> 00:21:26,640 Speaker 1: doesn't just mean I know it brings to my mind, uh, 361 00:21:27,119 --> 00:21:31,159 Speaker 1: images of individuals and dark cloaks meeting in secret rooms 362 00:21:31,200 --> 00:21:34,920 Speaker 1: and discussing Atlantis. But really, um, we're talking about here 363 00:21:35,000 --> 00:21:40,880 Speaker 1: is just any additional crazy idea, conspiracy theories, fictional imaginings. Um, 364 00:21:40,920 --> 00:21:42,720 Speaker 1: you know, the same kind of energy that would go 365 00:21:42,840 --> 00:21:49,760 Speaker 1: into rectifying the Old Testament with with with modern um paleontology, 366 00:21:50,240 --> 00:21:51,919 Speaker 1: that's the kind of energy you're getting here. So you're 367 00:21:51,920 --> 00:21:55,720 Speaker 1: getting everything from uh you know, ancient airplanes sailing through 368 00:21:55,720 --> 00:22:00,800 Speaker 1: the skies of Atlantis, to know magical powers, um, bisexual 369 00:22:01,000 --> 00:22:05,199 Speaker 1: Lemurian's astral bodies, you name it. It's gonna wind up 370 00:22:05,240 --> 00:22:08,159 Speaker 1: in this version of Atlantis and Atlantis thought, Yeah, it 371 00:22:08,160 --> 00:22:11,320 Speaker 1: gets super cosmic on this level. You could trace some 372 00:22:11,480 --> 00:22:15,200 Speaker 1: of this new life breathed into the legend to someone 373 00:22:15,280 --> 00:22:20,520 Speaker 1: named Ignatious Donnelly, who penned Atlantis the Antediluvian world elishments 374 00:22:20,600 --> 00:22:23,959 Speaker 1: before the flood, before the flood, the flood, because there 375 00:22:24,000 --> 00:22:26,080 Speaker 1: have been many flood in the Big Flood, the Big 376 00:22:26,119 --> 00:22:28,800 Speaker 1: Biblical flood, Yeah, that one. Uh, so we're talking about 377 00:22:28,840 --> 00:22:31,960 Speaker 1: eighteen eighty two and donally argued that small islands have 378 00:22:32,040 --> 00:22:34,719 Speaker 1: disappeared in eruptions, so why not a continent. So this 379 00:22:34,800 --> 00:22:36,879 Speaker 1: is his place of logic that he's beginning at, right, 380 00:22:36,920 --> 00:22:39,120 Speaker 1: which doesn't really hold out because it's of course it's 381 00:22:39,160 --> 00:22:41,320 Speaker 1: one thing for an island to sink, but for a large, 382 00:22:41,880 --> 00:22:45,119 Speaker 1: massive piece, so an actual continent to sink, it just 383 00:22:45,160 --> 00:22:48,560 Speaker 1: doesn't hold up with our our modern understanding of geology. Now. 384 00:22:48,560 --> 00:22:52,399 Speaker 1: He also cited many alleged resemblances between the appearance and 385 00:22:52,480 --> 00:22:56,119 Speaker 1: cultures of the peoples of America, Europe, and the Near East, 386 00:22:56,119 --> 00:22:59,399 Speaker 1: and insisted that therefore the civilizations of all must have 387 00:22:59,520 --> 00:23:06,400 Speaker 1: come from m Atlantis. It's like they're all humans. So well, 388 00:23:06,440 --> 00:23:10,360 Speaker 1: he starts with a good observation, there's something universal here 389 00:23:10,400 --> 00:23:13,800 Speaker 1: there there are there are aspects of various cultures that 390 00:23:13,840 --> 00:23:16,600 Speaker 1: seemed to be connected. There's some sort of connective tissue here. 391 00:23:16,880 --> 00:23:21,520 Speaker 1: What could the reason be? Answer Atlantis Atlantis instead of 392 00:23:21,560 --> 00:23:24,280 Speaker 1: saying like maybe genetics, but of course there's not a 393 00:23:24,320 --> 00:23:27,480 Speaker 1: great understanding of genetics at that time anyway, so you 394 00:23:27,560 --> 00:23:30,320 Speaker 1: gotta give him a little room. But the problem here 395 00:23:30,359 --> 00:23:34,000 Speaker 1: is that he completely besides coming from this place of logic, 396 00:23:34,240 --> 00:23:37,280 Speaker 1: he completely ignores Plato Smith and he replaces it with 397 00:23:37,320 --> 00:23:39,760 Speaker 1: a variation on the biblical myth of the flood that 398 00:23:39,840 --> 00:23:42,480 Speaker 1: wiped out everything except for Noah his family into his 399 00:23:42,520 --> 00:23:45,399 Speaker 1: menagerie of animals. He wrote that Atlantis was sunk in 400 00:23:45,400 --> 00:23:47,439 Speaker 1: the middle of the Atlantic Ocean during the flood, but 401 00:23:47,480 --> 00:23:50,440 Speaker 1: before all this it had given rise to the Egyptian 402 00:23:50,480 --> 00:23:55,080 Speaker 1: and Mayan civilizations, and too, blue eyed, red haired arians 403 00:23:55,119 --> 00:24:01,040 Speaker 1: of Ireland. Here you're going there only so he pulls 404 00:24:01,040 --> 00:24:03,119 Speaker 1: in a lot of ideas in this theory. He's bringing 405 00:24:03,160 --> 00:24:05,800 Speaker 1: in the Biblical theories, bringing in some Irish myth he's 406 00:24:05,800 --> 00:24:10,840 Speaker 1: bringing in um discoveries about ancient Egyptian beliefs, and uh 407 00:24:11,119 --> 00:24:13,600 Speaker 1: about mind beliefs, and just sort of again world building 408 00:24:13,640 --> 00:24:17,479 Speaker 1: at all into this version of reality that doesn't actually 409 00:24:17,520 --> 00:24:20,480 Speaker 1: match up with with what we know to be true. Yeah, 410 00:24:20,600 --> 00:24:22,920 Speaker 1: and think about this time period too. You have a 411 00:24:22,920 --> 00:24:27,800 Speaker 1: ton of excavations going on in the late eighteen hundreds, 412 00:24:27,880 --> 00:24:32,680 Speaker 1: and you also have the occultists exploring these more cosmic 413 00:24:32,880 --> 00:24:35,800 Speaker 1: ideas of how we came to be in these more 414 00:24:35,840 --> 00:24:39,000 Speaker 1: fantastical ideas. So it was sort of like the perfect 415 00:24:39,600 --> 00:24:43,080 Speaker 1: story to Ussher in an expression of all of this 416 00:24:43,800 --> 00:24:47,080 Speaker 1: the ziente gist of the moment. All right, So let's 417 00:24:47,200 --> 00:24:49,560 Speaker 1: let's back up just a little bit then, So we've 418 00:24:49,600 --> 00:24:53,480 Speaker 1: we've ventured head first all the way from scientific to 419 00:24:53,520 --> 00:24:56,639 Speaker 1: pseudo scientific and into the occult and considering Atlantis, and 420 00:24:56,680 --> 00:25:00,680 Speaker 1: at that point we're just lost. We we reached. It 421 00:25:00,960 --> 00:25:03,639 Speaker 1: just turns into pop culture and fiction and uh and 422 00:25:03,840 --> 00:25:07,560 Speaker 1: uh indeed, uh old I think like nineteen eighty two 423 00:25:07,760 --> 00:25:10,840 Speaker 1: Atari game called Atlantis that I remember seeing the trailers 424 00:25:10,880 --> 00:25:15,320 Speaker 1: for in which alien Gorgon's battle the Atlanteans and it 425 00:25:15,440 --> 00:25:19,240 Speaker 1: was an amazing TV commercial for it. Um. But but 426 00:25:19,240 --> 00:25:21,719 Speaker 1: but to back up, let's let's go back to this 427 00:25:21,920 --> 00:25:24,480 Speaker 1: h this period of time in which we are actually 428 00:25:24,520 --> 00:25:28,720 Speaker 1: exploring the world. We are exploring the oceans, and we 429 00:25:28,760 --> 00:25:34,080 Speaker 1: are in fact looking for and expecting to find undiscovered continents. 430 00:25:34,520 --> 00:25:37,800 Speaker 1: Particularly we're looking in the Southern Ocean, all right, in 431 00:25:37,840 --> 00:25:42,400 Speaker 1: the Southern hemisphere. Um. A lot of the early explorations 432 00:25:42,440 --> 00:25:45,440 Speaker 1: of this area were actually an attempt to find what 433 00:25:45,520 --> 00:25:50,000 Speaker 1: was called Tara Australis incognita, not really to explore the 434 00:25:50,000 --> 00:25:52,800 Speaker 1: ocean itself as much. I mean, we we did that, 435 00:25:53,040 --> 00:25:56,080 Speaker 1: but it was simply uh, because there were there had 436 00:25:56,080 --> 00:25:59,000 Speaker 1: to be this great undiscovered continent out there. And there 437 00:25:59,000 --> 00:26:01,840 Speaker 1: are a couple of reasons for this. Um For instance, Uh, 438 00:26:02,000 --> 00:26:04,399 Speaker 1: there's a religious one, and that is that you have 439 00:26:04,800 --> 00:26:07,439 Speaker 1: there's so much land in the northern hemisphere. The truly 440 00:26:07,480 --> 00:26:11,320 Speaker 1: a divine creator would not have created an asymmetrical Earth. 441 00:26:11,520 --> 00:26:15,320 Speaker 1: I mean, forgetting the fact that he apparently created asymmetrical humans, 442 00:26:15,520 --> 00:26:18,199 Speaker 1: because we're not perfectly symmetrical, but surely he would have 443 00:26:18,200 --> 00:26:20,800 Speaker 1: made the Earth symmetrical. So I get it from a 444 00:26:20,800 --> 00:26:24,880 Speaker 1: geographical standpoint and from a sort of god worldview standpoint. 445 00:26:24,880 --> 00:26:26,920 Speaker 1: They're sitting there and they're looking at this land mass, 446 00:26:26,920 --> 00:26:30,040 Speaker 1: and they've they've mapped what they know, and they think 447 00:26:30,080 --> 00:26:33,280 Speaker 1: that symmetrically there should be something on the other side. Yeah. 448 00:26:33,280 --> 00:26:35,320 Speaker 1: I mean, it's like when we look into the night sky, 449 00:26:35,480 --> 00:26:38,720 Speaker 1: and based on our model of what we know, it's 450 00:26:38,880 --> 00:26:41,159 Speaker 1: not unbelievable to think, well, there must there might be 451 00:26:41,160 --> 00:26:43,879 Speaker 1: other planets out there that have life on them. We 452 00:26:43,880 --> 00:26:45,600 Speaker 1: we we just have to sort of fill in the 453 00:26:45,640 --> 00:26:48,359 Speaker 1: blanks based on the existing model. So and this all 454 00:26:48,440 --> 00:26:52,080 Speaker 1: boils down to Plato in his Platonic ideal. Yet again. 455 00:26:52,359 --> 00:26:56,320 Speaker 1: Oh wow, Plato emerges once more to populate our world 456 00:26:56,359 --> 00:27:00,960 Speaker 1: with fictional continents. Um. Now scientifically you can there's also 457 00:27:01,040 --> 00:27:04,720 Speaker 1: the it's not all just completely based in religion and philosophy, 458 00:27:05,200 --> 00:27:07,439 Speaker 1: but scientifically. It was also thought that if you had 459 00:27:07,440 --> 00:27:10,080 Speaker 1: all this land in the north, then there must be 460 00:27:10,280 --> 00:27:13,280 Speaker 1: land in the south, because otherwise the planets of balance 461 00:27:13,320 --> 00:27:16,440 Speaker 1: would be disrupted and uh, and it would spin off 462 00:27:16,480 --> 00:27:19,960 Speaker 1: out into the void of space, and so much of 463 00:27:20,040 --> 00:27:22,000 Speaker 1: the so much of the Earth was unknown. It was 464 00:27:22,000 --> 00:27:25,920 Speaker 1: simply assumed that there was more land in the south. Um. 465 00:27:26,000 --> 00:27:29,680 Speaker 1: And again this doesn't completely line up with the Obviously, 466 00:27:29,840 --> 00:27:33,159 Speaker 1: this doesn't line up with the way uh, the planetary 467 00:27:33,200 --> 00:27:35,600 Speaker 1: science works, because we haven't spun off into the void 468 00:27:35,920 --> 00:27:39,359 Speaker 1: and there is in fact less continental mass in the 469 00:27:39,400 --> 00:27:43,440 Speaker 1: southern hemisphere. But the idea that they even understood that 470 00:27:43,480 --> 00:27:46,280 Speaker 1: there was a kind of mass at play is really interesting. 471 00:27:46,400 --> 00:27:49,679 Speaker 1: And trying to extrapolate that in a in a larger 472 00:27:49,760 --> 00:27:52,119 Speaker 1: view of things. So in other words, that maybe you 473 00:27:52,160 --> 00:27:55,240 Speaker 1: have a weight, um, you know that on one side 474 00:27:55,280 --> 00:27:56,600 Speaker 1: it's got a bunch of rocks and nothing on the 475 00:27:56,600 --> 00:27:59,439 Speaker 1: other side. But to get that concept and to to 476 00:27:59,520 --> 00:28:03,240 Speaker 1: try to apply it to geography is really interesting. Yeah, 477 00:28:03,400 --> 00:28:06,640 Speaker 1: So we ended up setting out into the into into 478 00:28:06,640 --> 00:28:10,560 Speaker 1: the Southern Ocean. We eventually discover Antarctica, and we we 479 00:28:10,640 --> 00:28:13,439 Speaker 1: explore all the waters in between, and there is a 480 00:28:13,520 --> 00:28:16,480 Speaker 1: lot of nothing out there. Um. There's a really great 481 00:28:16,520 --> 00:28:19,880 Speaker 1: episode of Ideas with Paul Kennedy title of the God 482 00:28:19,920 --> 00:28:24,280 Speaker 1: for sacon See that really gets into depth about about 483 00:28:24,280 --> 00:28:27,160 Speaker 1: some of our early explorations of of of the Southern Ocean, 484 00:28:27,200 --> 00:28:29,720 Speaker 1: but also uh, people who've sailed there, people who have 485 00:28:29,760 --> 00:28:33,880 Speaker 1: tried to set records sailing around the globe down there. 486 00:28:33,960 --> 00:28:37,119 Speaker 1: And one of the points was made in that episode 487 00:28:37,119 --> 00:28:40,240 Speaker 1: that that keeps resonating with me pointed out that, uh, 488 00:28:40,320 --> 00:28:43,360 Speaker 1: you're so far away from civilization down there in the 489 00:28:43,360 --> 00:28:47,360 Speaker 1: Southern Ocean. Uh. In fact, you're further from human habitation 490 00:28:47,440 --> 00:28:51,960 Speaker 1: than an astronaut on the International Space Station. So think 491 00:28:51,960 --> 00:28:54,920 Speaker 1: about that the next time you stare at the globe 492 00:28:54,960 --> 00:28:59,000 Speaker 1: and get this false idea of of how how well 493 00:28:59,040 --> 00:29:02,200 Speaker 1: we know everything and how civilized our planet is, or 494 00:29:02,240 --> 00:29:06,040 Speaker 1: if you just feel isolated, yes you know, all right, 495 00:29:06,120 --> 00:29:08,560 Speaker 1: So there you go. That is part one of our 496 00:29:08,680 --> 00:29:11,680 Speaker 1: two part series on the idea of the Lost Continent. 497 00:29:12,040 --> 00:29:14,960 Speaker 1: This one was very Atlantis heavy. The next one will 498 00:29:15,000 --> 00:29:18,160 Speaker 1: be less so, but we'll get into some uh some 499 00:29:18,520 --> 00:29:21,320 Speaker 1: equally wonderful content, and we will set out for the 500 00:29:21,400 --> 00:29:26,840 Speaker 1: lost continent of Limuria. Namers. Hey, do you guys have 501 00:29:26,840 --> 00:29:29,400 Speaker 1: any thoughts so far? Let us know. You can find 502 00:29:29,440 --> 00:29:32,280 Speaker 1: this at stuff to Blow your Mind dot com. Yes, 503 00:29:32,320 --> 00:29:35,000 Speaker 1: that's where you'll find all the podcast episodes, all the videos, 504 00:29:35,120 --> 00:29:37,600 Speaker 1: all the blog posts. And you know there's an old 505 00:29:37,600 --> 00:29:39,440 Speaker 1: fashioned way to get in touch with us as well. 506 00:29:41,600 --> 00:29:44,080 Speaker 1: Send an email to boil the mine at how stuff 507 00:29:44,120 --> 00:29:50,920 Speaker 1: work dot com for more on this and thousands of 508 00:29:50,920 --> 00:29:59,080 Speaker 1: other topics. Is it how stuff works dot com.