1 00:00:09,880 --> 00:00:13,160 Speaker 1: Hi guys, and welcome back to another episode of You 2 00:00:13,240 --> 00:00:17,079 Speaker 1: Need Therapy. My name is Kat and this is a 3 00:00:17,160 --> 00:00:19,680 Speaker 1: podcast with a therapist. But just when to remind you 4 00:00:19,720 --> 00:00:23,119 Speaker 1: before we get started, this is not therapy in itself. However, 5 00:00:23,320 --> 00:00:25,959 Speaker 1: it might encourage you to go to therapy, which is 6 00:00:25,960 --> 00:00:29,120 Speaker 1: really exciting. And I've become very aware of how many 7 00:00:29,120 --> 00:00:33,120 Speaker 1: times I say therapy in the first minute of this show, 8 00:00:33,479 --> 00:00:36,080 Speaker 1: so we might need to workshop that. But I'm excited 9 00:00:36,120 --> 00:00:40,040 Speaker 1: because we have a returning guest. Yeah, we have Amy 10 00:00:40,080 --> 00:00:42,040 Speaker 1: Brown Back. You were here like a month ago. I 11 00:00:42,080 --> 00:00:43,560 Speaker 1: know it was my first time, and then now I'm 12 00:00:43,560 --> 00:00:46,840 Speaker 1: back again, and I'm excited to have this conversation because yes, 13 00:00:46,960 --> 00:00:49,240 Speaker 1: people are well, you can say what we're going to 14 00:00:49,280 --> 00:00:52,040 Speaker 1: talk about, but I think for people exploring therapy or 15 00:00:52,680 --> 00:00:54,959 Speaker 1: that are in therapy and they're maybe not vibing with 16 00:00:54,960 --> 00:00:57,800 Speaker 1: it or feeling it, like that's okay, and that's normal 17 00:00:57,960 --> 00:01:00,120 Speaker 1: and kind of I can walk through what I it 18 00:01:00,400 --> 00:01:02,000 Speaker 1: and people don't talk about that as much. They just 19 00:01:02,120 --> 00:01:03,920 Speaker 1: end up quitting. So we're going to get into that, 20 00:01:04,000 --> 00:01:05,840 Speaker 1: and then we're going to get into and talk a 21 00:01:05,880 --> 00:01:08,840 Speaker 1: little bit about narrative therapy and what that means. Because 22 00:01:09,000 --> 00:01:11,400 Speaker 1: I want to talk about a little bit of my week. Yeah, 23 00:01:11,560 --> 00:01:14,320 Speaker 1: okay without some of the details. But before we get started, 24 00:01:14,319 --> 00:01:15,800 Speaker 1: do you want to talk about your coffee? Yeah? I 25 00:01:15,800 --> 00:01:18,600 Speaker 1: think we should talk about our coffee order because Cat 26 00:01:18,880 --> 00:01:20,920 Speaker 1: stopped by Starbucks on her way over to my house 27 00:01:20,959 --> 00:01:23,639 Speaker 1: to record, which is super kind. And I've been getting 28 00:01:23,800 --> 00:01:29,600 Speaker 1: a tall iced Americano with pumpkin foam cream on top, 29 00:01:29,920 --> 00:01:33,360 Speaker 1: which if you're not into the cold foam at Starbucks yet, 30 00:01:33,400 --> 00:01:36,479 Speaker 1: you're missing out because it's the perfect With addition, yes, 31 00:01:36,680 --> 00:01:40,160 Speaker 1: there's regular cold foam that doesn't have sweetener I don't think, 32 00:01:40,240 --> 00:01:44,160 Speaker 1: or any sugar. And then there's sweet cream foam. I'm 33 00:01:44,200 --> 00:01:46,360 Speaker 1: new to all this. Then there's like a salted caramel 34 00:01:46,720 --> 00:01:50,720 Speaker 1: sweet cream foam. There's pumpkin cream foam, which is what 35 00:01:50,760 --> 00:01:54,040 Speaker 1: I'm now into because it's fall. It's not officially fall yet, 36 00:01:54,040 --> 00:01:57,000 Speaker 1: but it feels like pumpkin all the time right now. 37 00:01:57,320 --> 00:02:00,240 Speaker 1: But pro tip, if you want to save of the 38 00:02:00,280 --> 00:02:03,680 Speaker 1: pumpkin cream and you make coffee at home, you can 39 00:02:03,720 --> 00:02:07,840 Speaker 1: get the Starbucks cream on your thing, but you take 40 00:02:07,840 --> 00:02:09,840 Speaker 1: the lid off and get a spoon and scoop a 41 00:02:09,840 --> 00:02:11,959 Speaker 1: little bit of it into a mason jar and store 42 00:02:12,040 --> 00:02:14,760 Speaker 1: in your fridge and then the next day, boom. You 43 00:02:14,760 --> 00:02:17,200 Speaker 1: can make coffee at home and add the Starbucks pumpkin 44 00:02:17,240 --> 00:02:19,120 Speaker 1: cream on top without having to spend the money to 45 00:02:19,160 --> 00:02:21,600 Speaker 1: go to Starbucks. And that is how you get to 46 00:02:22,200 --> 00:02:27,200 Speaker 1: pumpkiny type special drinks for one or three or three 47 00:02:27,240 --> 00:02:29,520 Speaker 1: if you have enough, I probably it's probably good to 48 00:02:29,520 --> 00:02:32,160 Speaker 1: just split in half and make two. Basically, I got 49 00:02:32,240 --> 00:02:37,320 Speaker 1: everything for free because Cat bought it. But you're welcome 50 00:02:37,360 --> 00:02:41,360 Speaker 1: for your weekly coffee tips. Yes, And then what you 51 00:02:41,560 --> 00:02:44,160 Speaker 1: have the new apple drink? Well, so I got to 52 00:02:44,400 --> 00:02:47,480 Speaker 1: drinks because I got nervous because I was like, what 53 00:02:47,520 --> 00:02:49,240 Speaker 1: if I don't like this? And then you have coffee? 54 00:02:49,240 --> 00:02:51,960 Speaker 1: So I got whatever. The apple is a machiatto. I've 55 00:02:51,960 --> 00:02:53,520 Speaker 1: never had that before. I don't know what that means. 56 00:02:53,560 --> 00:02:56,120 Speaker 1: It's one of their new Faull flavors, the Apple crisp one. 57 00:02:56,520 --> 00:02:59,040 Speaker 1: And then I got my normal almond milk glotte and 58 00:02:59,080 --> 00:03:01,520 Speaker 1: I'm probably gonna drink half of each. Okay, sounds like 59 00:03:01,520 --> 00:03:04,480 Speaker 1: a plant good. You could save the other halts, and 60 00:03:06,360 --> 00:03:09,880 Speaker 1: but do you save your lattete Yes that they're still 61 00:03:09,919 --> 00:03:12,480 Speaker 1: good the next day. Yes, it's really fine. Well, I 62 00:03:12,480 --> 00:03:14,720 Speaker 1: mean you have to put it in the fridge. Probably. 63 00:03:14,800 --> 00:03:18,680 Speaker 1: I mean, I'm fine with water down things, just like 64 00:03:18,960 --> 00:03:22,239 Speaker 1: drink well in life. Probably Well, I don't know. Is 65 00:03:22,280 --> 00:03:25,680 Speaker 1: this a metaphor for life? Growing up, we only had 66 00:03:25,720 --> 00:03:29,440 Speaker 1: skim milk, which I feel like it's sad. As an adult, 67 00:03:29,480 --> 00:03:33,959 Speaker 1: I'm enjoying. Yeah, but we would drink. My whole family, 68 00:03:34,040 --> 00:03:36,040 Speaker 1: me and my sister, we would drink and Mom, we 69 00:03:36,080 --> 00:03:39,680 Speaker 1: would drink water down skim milk because I could only 70 00:03:39,720 --> 00:03:41,920 Speaker 1: drink milk with ice in it, and then the ice 71 00:03:41,960 --> 00:03:47,200 Speaker 1: would start to melt. So I was drinking drinking milk 72 00:03:47,240 --> 00:03:51,160 Speaker 1: water basically. So I guess that's why I'm used to it. 73 00:03:51,280 --> 00:03:53,360 Speaker 1: So if that's not your thing, then you might not 74 00:03:53,520 --> 00:03:57,080 Speaker 1: like saved iced coffee. But I can work handle it. Okay, 75 00:03:57,120 --> 00:03:59,800 Speaker 1: let's get into the Okay. So there's two things I 76 00:03:59,840 --> 00:04:02,680 Speaker 1: want to talk about today. One of them is something 77 00:04:02,720 --> 00:04:06,040 Speaker 1: called narrative therapy. And I started thinking about it mainly 78 00:04:06,080 --> 00:04:10,400 Speaker 1: because I posted on Instagram yesterday a story about it. 79 00:04:10,440 --> 00:04:13,240 Speaker 1: Was just me, you know, rambling. I actually started recording 80 00:04:13,240 --> 00:04:15,960 Speaker 1: the story, and then I forgot that I was recording 81 00:04:15,960 --> 00:04:18,640 Speaker 1: the story, and I posted like one clip of it, 82 00:04:18,800 --> 00:04:21,159 Speaker 1: and then I waited five hours. It's like, oh, I 83 00:04:21,240 --> 00:04:24,880 Speaker 1: never finished that because I got sidetracked because my week 84 00:04:25,160 --> 00:04:28,880 Speaker 1: was a little bit derailed. Oh my gosh, that is 85 00:04:28,920 --> 00:04:31,800 Speaker 1: the word that I've been looking for. Oh, we're welcome. 86 00:04:32,560 --> 00:04:36,240 Speaker 1: It definitely was. I. Yeah, my week was derailed, and 87 00:04:36,760 --> 00:04:38,680 Speaker 1: I am not gonna I don't want to share like 88 00:04:38,720 --> 00:04:41,560 Speaker 1: the details of everything that happened. Every everything's okay, and 89 00:04:41,560 --> 00:04:45,200 Speaker 1: everybody's okay. But something happened in the beginning of my 90 00:04:45,320 --> 00:04:48,120 Speaker 1: week Tuesday, and then it went into Wednesday, and then 91 00:04:48,120 --> 00:04:49,520 Speaker 1: it went into Thursday, and now it's going to go 92 00:04:49,520 --> 00:04:53,760 Speaker 1: into Saturday, where it threw off my schedule. It threw 93 00:04:53,800 --> 00:04:58,280 Speaker 1: off my feelings of being in control and feeling safe. 94 00:04:58,360 --> 00:05:01,560 Speaker 1: It threw off a lot of stuff through off extracurricular 95 00:05:01,600 --> 00:05:03,599 Speaker 1: things I wanted to do with my after work. I 96 00:05:03,600 --> 00:05:05,840 Speaker 1: could threw off a lot of stuff, like we're supposed 97 00:05:05,880 --> 00:05:08,800 Speaker 1: to walk. I think threw that off. Oh my gosh, 98 00:05:08,960 --> 00:05:10,960 Speaker 1: well we were supposed to walk. Okay, Well we'll shall 99 00:05:11,120 --> 00:05:14,440 Speaker 1: share this part to three weeks ago, my my pipe 100 00:05:14,440 --> 00:05:18,039 Speaker 1: burst and I was I literally had finished work, I 101 00:05:18,160 --> 00:05:21,239 Speaker 1: changed my clothes, I went to the office bathroom, felt 102 00:05:21,279 --> 00:05:24,720 Speaker 1: my water before I was going to meet you, and there, 103 00:05:24,760 --> 00:05:27,200 Speaker 1: we was standing water in the bathroom. A pipe had 104 00:05:27,240 --> 00:05:29,920 Speaker 1: burst and our our air conditioning had shut off that 105 00:05:30,000 --> 00:05:32,240 Speaker 1: day and we didn't know what. I thought the batteries 106 00:05:32,240 --> 00:05:37,720 Speaker 1: were dead. Then I learned that the yeah, probably not. 107 00:05:39,080 --> 00:05:41,360 Speaker 1: They're like, yeah, you don't just change the batteries like 108 00:05:41,400 --> 00:05:44,359 Speaker 1: your system shut off. And I was like, okay, anyway, 109 00:05:44,720 --> 00:05:47,960 Speaker 1: So that started three weeks ago, and through that, actually 110 00:05:47,960 --> 00:05:49,839 Speaker 1: you just made me think, like, this has really been 111 00:05:49,920 --> 00:05:53,400 Speaker 1: happening longer than There's been a series of unfortunate events 112 00:05:53,640 --> 00:05:57,840 Speaker 1: at my office. And the reason I'm telling this story 113 00:05:58,040 --> 00:06:00,919 Speaker 1: is because I could have taken in each one of 114 00:06:00,920 --> 00:06:03,160 Speaker 1: those things, because it was really inconvenient. I've had to 115 00:06:03,200 --> 00:06:06,400 Speaker 1: cancel a lot of sessions, a lot of podcast interviews, 116 00:06:06,440 --> 00:06:12,080 Speaker 1: a lot of just downtime, hang out time, walks, walks, 117 00:06:12,800 --> 00:06:17,080 Speaker 1: and I could have taken the series of unfortunate events 118 00:06:17,120 --> 00:06:19,520 Speaker 1: and turned it into the story of like how everything's 119 00:06:19,560 --> 00:06:21,760 Speaker 1: going wrong for me and how things keep going bad 120 00:06:21,800 --> 00:06:24,080 Speaker 1: and especially with the world, and how the world is 121 00:06:24,160 --> 00:06:29,240 Speaker 1: right now. And I didn't do that, And I almost 122 00:06:29,279 --> 00:06:31,120 Speaker 1: like border on. I don't want to sound like to 123 00:06:31,400 --> 00:06:36,920 Speaker 1: like toxically optimistic about life, because I don't think that's 124 00:06:36,960 --> 00:06:41,200 Speaker 1: what I'm doing because I am really frustrated with the 125 00:06:41,279 --> 00:06:45,320 Speaker 1: series of unfortunate events, but they aren't life ruining things 126 00:06:45,360 --> 00:06:48,920 Speaker 1: like everything is going to be okay, Everything is okay. 127 00:06:48,960 --> 00:06:53,159 Speaker 1: That comes from me in the narrative, in the stories 128 00:06:53,160 --> 00:06:55,600 Speaker 1: that I play in my head, and how I frame 129 00:06:55,960 --> 00:06:59,440 Speaker 1: when bad things happen. We're not great. Things happen were inconveniences, 130 00:06:59,720 --> 00:07:02,960 Speaker 1: how been how I frame them? Because I don't have 131 00:07:03,120 --> 00:07:06,680 Speaker 1: a core belief of everything bad always happens to me, 132 00:07:06,960 --> 00:07:10,600 Speaker 1: or nothing works out, or the shoes always there's always 133 00:07:10,600 --> 00:07:12,480 Speaker 1: a shoe that's going to drop. I don't have those 134 00:07:12,600 --> 00:07:15,720 Speaker 1: stories running the back of my head. Now. I'm used 135 00:07:15,760 --> 00:07:19,160 Speaker 1: to have some not great stories, but I've done work 136 00:07:19,280 --> 00:07:24,040 Speaker 1: and changed my narrative, my essential like life script, and 137 00:07:24,080 --> 00:07:26,680 Speaker 1: so that's why it's a little bit easier for me 138 00:07:27,240 --> 00:07:29,640 Speaker 1: than I think a lot of people who are like wow, 139 00:07:29,680 --> 00:07:31,960 Speaker 1: if if you saw the things that happened, you would 140 00:07:31,960 --> 00:07:33,960 Speaker 1: be like why are you not like in a bad mood? 141 00:07:34,480 --> 00:07:37,360 Speaker 1: But that's not how I process things. Because of the 142 00:07:37,760 --> 00:07:40,840 Speaker 1: work you've done, yes, yes, thank you, I feel like 143 00:07:40,960 --> 00:07:44,200 Speaker 1: I'm trying to approach things similarly. There's some stuff in 144 00:07:44,200 --> 00:07:46,440 Speaker 1: my life where I'm still waiting for the other shoe 145 00:07:46,440 --> 00:07:49,160 Speaker 1: to drop. But yeah, it doesn't do me any favors 146 00:07:49,640 --> 00:07:55,680 Speaker 1: living that way. It's very draining and steals any joy 147 00:07:55,720 --> 00:07:59,440 Speaker 1: that you may have. And when I did a therapy 148 00:07:59,480 --> 00:08:03,120 Speaker 1: intense of name as Linda, shout out Linda, he kept 149 00:08:03,160 --> 00:08:06,440 Speaker 1: telling me to keep it down the middle. And you 150 00:08:06,480 --> 00:08:11,080 Speaker 1: are allowed to acknowledge that, you're allowed, you have my permission, 151 00:08:11,520 --> 00:08:16,640 Speaker 1: We are allowed to acknowledge that what happened sucks and 152 00:08:16,680 --> 00:08:20,600 Speaker 1: your feelings surrounding that are totally valid. But then do 153 00:08:20,640 --> 00:08:23,000 Speaker 1: you stay stuck in it and that story over and 154 00:08:23,040 --> 00:08:25,080 Speaker 1: over and that would be too far to the let's 155 00:08:25,120 --> 00:08:27,320 Speaker 1: call it the right. And then if you move too 156 00:08:27,320 --> 00:08:30,200 Speaker 1: far positive like life is great, and then you're too 157 00:08:30,240 --> 00:08:33,360 Speaker 1: far to the left, like what where's the middle? Keep 158 00:08:33,400 --> 00:08:35,040 Speaker 1: it in the middle. And so I think, yeah, you've 159 00:08:35,040 --> 00:08:37,880 Speaker 1: been in this the last few weeks, in this middle ground. 160 00:08:37,920 --> 00:08:40,280 Speaker 1: I feel like you've handled it wonderfully. I don't know 161 00:08:40,280 --> 00:08:42,840 Speaker 1: that I would even be handling it as well as 162 00:08:42,920 --> 00:08:45,439 Speaker 1: you have. And I appreciate that because you're someone that's 163 00:08:45,440 --> 00:08:46,840 Speaker 1: in my life, and you have to think about the 164 00:08:46,880 --> 00:08:49,160 Speaker 1: other people in your life and how they're affected, and 165 00:08:49,520 --> 00:08:52,240 Speaker 1: it can be contagious, and so I'm looking at how 166 00:08:52,320 --> 00:08:54,920 Speaker 1: you're handling that, and I'm like, wow, that's great, and 167 00:08:55,000 --> 00:08:59,200 Speaker 1: everybody's different, but I I'm saying that as you've offered 168 00:08:59,240 --> 00:09:02,240 Speaker 1: me the incur aagement I need, and so therefore anybody 169 00:09:02,240 --> 00:09:04,840 Speaker 1: else listening, if you do that, your thoughts are a 170 00:09:04,840 --> 00:09:07,720 Speaker 1: dominant effect for other people. When you've done that for 171 00:09:07,800 --> 00:09:10,040 Speaker 1: me too, you say I don't know how it handles you. 172 00:09:10,080 --> 00:09:12,559 Speaker 1: Would you have handled it past year and a half 173 00:09:12,640 --> 00:09:15,400 Speaker 1: you have? And what I believe is that because we 174 00:09:15,440 --> 00:09:18,160 Speaker 1: get in these moments where it's very much all or nothing, 175 00:09:18,200 --> 00:09:20,280 Speaker 1: but what you're talking about it's all bad or it's 176 00:09:20,320 --> 00:09:23,960 Speaker 1: all good. And I don't know anybody who who actually 177 00:09:24,000 --> 00:09:26,840 Speaker 1: know Like you might see somebody on Instagram that is 178 00:09:26,880 --> 00:09:29,520 Speaker 1: posting like this, but I don't actually know anybody whose 179 00:09:29,559 --> 00:09:32,640 Speaker 1: life is all good or all bad. That doesn't exist. 180 00:09:33,280 --> 00:09:36,240 Speaker 1: Sometimes our life is a lot of bad, but there 181 00:09:36,360 --> 00:09:38,600 Speaker 1: is some good, and sometimes our life is a lot 182 00:09:38,640 --> 00:09:40,640 Speaker 1: of good in there is some bad if you even 183 00:09:40,640 --> 00:09:43,559 Speaker 1: want to categorize it things as good or bad. And 184 00:09:43,600 --> 00:09:46,520 Speaker 1: so that's kind of speaking to what you're saying, what 185 00:09:46,679 --> 00:09:49,000 Speaker 1: I have done this past week and what I want 186 00:09:49,000 --> 00:09:52,160 Speaker 1: to offer and share with y'all. Is is acknowledging that 187 00:09:52,200 --> 00:09:54,880 Speaker 1: like these things I would not choose to happen in 188 00:09:54,920 --> 00:09:59,720 Speaker 1: my life. On Wednesday, I had a full from nine 189 00:10:00,400 --> 00:10:03,400 Speaker 1: two seven day back to back day planned and I 190 00:10:03,480 --> 00:10:07,400 Speaker 1: was ready to go and I had to cancel basically 191 00:10:07,440 --> 00:10:11,199 Speaker 1: all of it within like ten minutes, and I still 192 00:10:11,280 --> 00:10:14,600 Speaker 1: lived a day that day. I didn't do basically anything 193 00:10:14,640 --> 00:10:17,360 Speaker 1: that I was going to do. But then because of 194 00:10:17,440 --> 00:10:19,520 Speaker 1: the day and how it shifted, I was able to 195 00:10:19,559 --> 00:10:21,959 Speaker 1: spend time with somebody wasn't expecting to spend time with, 196 00:10:22,440 --> 00:10:24,520 Speaker 1: and I was able to get some things done that 197 00:10:24,600 --> 00:10:26,600 Speaker 1: I don't know when I would have gotten them done 198 00:10:26,960 --> 00:10:30,040 Speaker 1: because of what happened. Now I could ignore that and 199 00:10:30,040 --> 00:10:31,920 Speaker 1: just be like, well, I had to do that or 200 00:10:32,160 --> 00:10:34,959 Speaker 1: that was my backup plan, but also I can look 201 00:10:35,000 --> 00:10:37,400 Speaker 1: at that as like, I'm glad that happened. I'm glad 202 00:10:37,440 --> 00:10:39,440 Speaker 1: I was able to have that happened, and then to 203 00:10:39,480 --> 00:10:43,400 Speaker 1: speak to that in another aspect. Every single day we're 204 00:10:43,520 --> 00:10:48,160 Speaker 1: moving through little good moments like getting to have like 205 00:10:48,240 --> 00:10:52,640 Speaker 1: a special coffee drink in the morning, or waking up 206 00:10:52,640 --> 00:10:55,160 Speaker 1: and going outside and like the weather is freaking beautiful, 207 00:10:55,880 --> 00:10:58,520 Speaker 1: or depending on where you live, right here and right now. 208 00:10:58,520 --> 00:11:03,080 Speaker 1: It's right now, all these small little good things that 209 00:11:03,800 --> 00:11:06,240 Speaker 1: I woke up in my turn my bedroom lights and 210 00:11:06,320 --> 00:11:08,760 Speaker 1: the lights worked, like the electricity works in my house. 211 00:11:08,840 --> 00:11:12,520 Speaker 1: There's all these good, mundane things. Because there's people, uh 212 00:11:12,720 --> 00:11:15,840 Speaker 1: in Louisiana right now that do not have power. But 213 00:11:15,920 --> 00:11:18,920 Speaker 1: I again, it's a fine line of like, you know this, 214 00:11:19,160 --> 00:11:22,720 Speaker 1: like you said, being super optimistic and a toxic way 215 00:11:22,840 --> 00:11:25,640 Speaker 1: or toxic positivity. And I have to be careful reminding 216 00:11:25,640 --> 00:11:28,520 Speaker 1: myself not to be too like, oh, well, there's other 217 00:11:28,559 --> 00:11:30,880 Speaker 1: people that don't have this, so I need to be grateful. 218 00:11:31,200 --> 00:11:35,120 Speaker 1: I think both comes inside them. Yeah, so you get 219 00:11:35,120 --> 00:11:36,839 Speaker 1: to it doesn't mean you have to be grateful, but 220 00:11:36,880 --> 00:11:38,640 Speaker 1: it's like, oh, this part of my life is in 221 00:11:39,360 --> 00:11:43,000 Speaker 1: a ship storm and my lights turned on. It doesn't 222 00:11:43,040 --> 00:11:46,520 Speaker 1: cancel either out at all, right, it just puts both 223 00:11:46,920 --> 00:11:57,000 Speaker 1: in your hands. So Mary and I, she's my business 224 00:11:57,000 --> 00:12:00,160 Speaker 1: partner for a company we have called ESPOI, which means 225 00:12:00,160 --> 00:12:02,440 Speaker 1: hope in Haitian creole, and we come up with a 226 00:12:02,440 --> 00:12:05,480 Speaker 1: lot of different items, mostly clothing, but we just ventured 227 00:12:05,520 --> 00:12:08,520 Speaker 1: into the puzzle market just because I'm obsessed with puzzles, 228 00:12:08,520 --> 00:12:10,280 Speaker 1: and that has helped me. That's been a form of 229 00:12:10,320 --> 00:12:13,880 Speaker 1: therapy for me, and my therapist, who cat knows and 230 00:12:14,080 --> 00:12:16,680 Speaker 1: is amazing, said that it's an excellent exercise for my 231 00:12:16,720 --> 00:12:20,640 Speaker 1: brain and very calming, and yes, whatever it's doing inside 232 00:12:20,640 --> 00:12:23,160 Speaker 1: my brain when you're problem solving in that manner, it 233 00:12:23,240 --> 00:12:27,200 Speaker 1: is therapeutic at least for me. So I have been 234 00:12:27,240 --> 00:12:29,400 Speaker 1: doing that, which led us to make a puzzle which 235 00:12:29,440 --> 00:12:32,800 Speaker 1: we have different doodles and hidden messages throughout the puzzle 236 00:12:33,400 --> 00:12:36,160 Speaker 1: and shout out Cat because one of the hidden messages 237 00:12:36,240 --> 00:12:39,320 Speaker 1: is feel your feelings. I don't know there was hidden message. Yes, 238 00:12:39,880 --> 00:12:44,880 Speaker 1: it's on top of the cherry, huh. And then there 239 00:12:45,080 --> 00:12:49,280 Speaker 1: is so that's oh too. And then another hidden thing 240 00:12:49,480 --> 00:12:51,280 Speaker 1: which is not so hidden because the owl is pretty big, 241 00:12:51,280 --> 00:12:53,199 Speaker 1: but it's drawn in. It's not one of the images. 242 00:12:53,280 --> 00:12:55,760 Speaker 1: It's a doodle and it's an owl and next to 243 00:12:55,800 --> 00:12:59,400 Speaker 1: the Alice Hays see things differently, and for us it 244 00:12:59,520 --> 00:13:02,400 Speaker 1: was import to include that because it's a good reminder 245 00:13:02,480 --> 00:13:04,959 Speaker 1: like if because if you're sitting there doing the puzzle 246 00:13:05,480 --> 00:13:07,920 Speaker 1: and it's some form of therapy because you're escaping from 247 00:13:07,960 --> 00:13:10,120 Speaker 1: certain things, not escaping in a way like I don't 248 00:13:10,160 --> 00:13:12,920 Speaker 1: want to deal but acknowledging like I'm going to take 249 00:13:12,920 --> 00:13:14,680 Speaker 1: a break from life right now and work on my puzzle. 250 00:13:15,360 --> 00:13:18,120 Speaker 1: And because I used to hate puzzles, same remember I 251 00:13:18,120 --> 00:13:20,560 Speaker 1: first started doing them and you're like, just wait, yeah, 252 00:13:21,640 --> 00:13:24,520 Speaker 1: because it's awesome, Like now I'm obsessed, and so that's 253 00:13:24,520 --> 00:13:26,120 Speaker 1: why we chose to put on the puzzle. It's fine, 254 00:13:26,160 --> 00:13:29,160 Speaker 1: I'm fine, everything is fine because for me, things we're 255 00:13:29,200 --> 00:13:31,480 Speaker 1: not fine. When I got into puzzles, that's the only 256 00:13:31,520 --> 00:13:33,760 Speaker 1: reason why I got into them, and they weren't fine. 257 00:13:34,360 --> 00:13:38,640 Speaker 1: But the puzzle, piece by piece allows me to see 258 00:13:38,640 --> 00:13:41,719 Speaker 1: things differently. It's therapeutic. So putting the owl on there 259 00:13:41,720 --> 00:13:45,440 Speaker 1: in that statement was important and we might even throw 260 00:13:45,440 --> 00:13:48,880 Speaker 1: it onto a sweatshirt soon just to because it's super 261 00:13:48,920 --> 00:13:52,880 Speaker 1: cute and it's a reminder and yeah, it's a not 262 00:13:53,000 --> 00:13:56,520 Speaker 1: to like just make up a different story, right and 263 00:13:56,720 --> 00:14:01,040 Speaker 1: see things totally differently. But there is another side to things, 264 00:14:01,120 --> 00:14:04,959 Speaker 1: or there is another another thing their story that can 265 00:14:05,000 --> 00:14:07,480 Speaker 1: come alongside. Like I liked when you were talking about 266 00:14:07,480 --> 00:14:10,400 Speaker 1: your stories, like you have you've you've trained your brain 267 00:14:10,480 --> 00:14:12,760 Speaker 1: in a sense to not you have to go off 268 00:14:12,800 --> 00:14:15,560 Speaker 1: the rails. You have too and to one I want 269 00:14:15,559 --> 00:14:17,880 Speaker 1: that sweatshirt if you make it. We're working on it. 270 00:14:17,960 --> 00:14:19,960 Speaker 1: We can't get the owl, so the owl on the puzzle, 271 00:14:20,040 --> 00:14:21,880 Speaker 1: we thought we would just throw on the sweatshirt and 272 00:14:21,920 --> 00:14:24,920 Speaker 1: then the owl looks super cute and the puzzles we 273 00:14:24,960 --> 00:14:27,480 Speaker 1: put it on a sweatshirt and looks very psychedelic, like 274 00:14:27,520 --> 00:14:30,720 Speaker 1: the eyes are like scary because the way, and so 275 00:14:30,880 --> 00:14:33,440 Speaker 1: we're trying to work out the artwork, but I'm pretty 276 00:14:33,480 --> 00:14:36,080 Speaker 1: sure we're gonna be doing it. Okay, I'll send you one. Okay, 277 00:14:36,080 --> 00:14:38,040 Speaker 1: thank you. Oh I brought this is what I for. 278 00:14:38,200 --> 00:14:40,400 Speaker 1: I was trying to figure out what I was trying 279 00:14:40,400 --> 00:14:42,040 Speaker 1: to remember to tell you downstairs. I brought you some 280 00:14:42,080 --> 00:14:44,040 Speaker 1: of the have the day you need to have stickers. Oh, 281 00:14:44,080 --> 00:14:48,680 Speaker 1: thank you anyway, which is that's so perfect. Yeah, because 282 00:14:48,800 --> 00:14:51,520 Speaker 1: you on that day you described where you had, you know, seventh, 283 00:14:52,000 --> 00:14:54,240 Speaker 1: you know, your day was planned or nine to seven whatever, 284 00:14:54,560 --> 00:14:56,240 Speaker 1: you had all these things and it was that's not 285 00:14:56,320 --> 00:14:58,400 Speaker 1: the day you needed to have, and it wasn't a 286 00:14:58,440 --> 00:15:01,280 Speaker 1: good day, but it wasn't a bad day, but you 287 00:15:01,360 --> 00:15:04,920 Speaker 1: ended up having the day to have. Yes. So to 288 00:15:05,040 --> 00:15:08,440 Speaker 1: wrap kind of this up back to the original thing 289 00:15:08,440 --> 00:15:11,080 Speaker 1: I was talking about with narrative, therapy is narrative therapy 290 00:15:11,160 --> 00:15:14,160 Speaker 1: is probably something that if well, if you've worked with me, 291 00:15:14,360 --> 00:15:17,160 Speaker 1: you've probably done it and just not known. You've definitely 292 00:15:17,200 --> 00:15:19,280 Speaker 1: done it even if you didn't know. But it's a 293 00:15:19,360 --> 00:15:23,480 Speaker 1: way for you to rewrite your story because through our lives, 294 00:15:23,480 --> 00:15:26,840 Speaker 1: through the experiences we have, the relationships we have, we 295 00:15:26,920 --> 00:15:30,600 Speaker 1: create meaning out of everything subconsciously that happens to us, 296 00:15:30,600 --> 00:15:32,920 Speaker 1: and we create these scripts for our lives. We've talked 297 00:15:32,960 --> 00:15:35,000 Speaker 1: about the screens, right, I think we've talked about on 298 00:15:35,000 --> 00:15:37,440 Speaker 1: this podcast. Screens are the filters. We've talked about it 299 00:15:37,480 --> 00:15:40,440 Speaker 1: on Outweigh I know, but we create these screens that 300 00:15:40,520 --> 00:15:43,640 Speaker 1: essentially I visualize like holding up a screen in front 301 00:15:43,640 --> 00:15:45,680 Speaker 1: of your face, and it just has these beliefs you 302 00:15:45,720 --> 00:15:49,000 Speaker 1: have about the world on them. Whether it's people are unsafe, 303 00:15:49,120 --> 00:15:50,800 Speaker 1: I'm not good enough. I mean, it could be a 304 00:15:50,840 --> 00:15:54,880 Speaker 1: million things. Bad things always happen, people don't like me. 305 00:15:54,880 --> 00:15:57,520 Speaker 1: It could be anything. This person hates me. I keep 306 00:15:57,560 --> 00:16:00,240 Speaker 1: doing everything wrong, I can't get it right. It's a 307 00:16:00,240 --> 00:16:03,080 Speaker 1: filter I often I've had to work on. This person 308 00:16:03,160 --> 00:16:05,200 Speaker 1: doesn't like I keep messing up, like I can't do 309 00:16:05,240 --> 00:16:07,560 Speaker 1: anything right. This person doesn't like me. What why can't 310 00:16:07,560 --> 00:16:11,240 Speaker 1: Why can't I do anything? It's always yeah, when really 311 00:16:11,720 --> 00:16:13,640 Speaker 1: the story may not have anything to do with me 312 00:16:14,080 --> 00:16:17,800 Speaker 1: at all, but I I for whatever reason because I 313 00:16:18,000 --> 00:16:20,800 Speaker 1: and that went back to my childhood, like junior high, 314 00:16:20,840 --> 00:16:23,920 Speaker 1: high school insecurities of when you know, my dad left 315 00:16:23,960 --> 00:16:25,760 Speaker 1: when I was eight or nine, So some of it 316 00:16:25,800 --> 00:16:30,320 Speaker 1: even went back to not feeling loved and safe and 317 00:16:30,360 --> 00:16:34,560 Speaker 1: secure in in that environment, which then transferred how I 318 00:16:34,760 --> 00:16:38,520 Speaker 1: built other friendships and relationships, which then, you know, I 319 00:16:38,560 --> 00:16:41,360 Speaker 1: always felt like on the outside like people didn't really 320 00:16:41,920 --> 00:16:44,600 Speaker 1: like me. So therefore if I kept people at a distance, 321 00:16:44,680 --> 00:16:47,040 Speaker 1: then it wouldn't hurt as bad if they left me. 322 00:16:47,640 --> 00:16:50,080 Speaker 1: So but then I always questioned if they really liked 323 00:16:50,120 --> 00:16:54,040 Speaker 1: me anyway, and that I'm dealing with that as a 324 00:16:54,040 --> 00:16:56,280 Speaker 1: forty year old adult. That's that screen. I've had to 325 00:16:56,280 --> 00:16:58,480 Speaker 1: work very hard the last year and a half to 326 00:16:58,640 --> 00:17:00,760 Speaker 1: try to, amongst the out of other things that I'm 327 00:17:00,800 --> 00:17:03,720 Speaker 1: working on, to try to change that screen um or 328 00:17:03,800 --> 00:17:06,359 Speaker 1: change that filter so that I filter it through and 329 00:17:06,400 --> 00:17:10,800 Speaker 1: ask myself other questions like, oh, wow, you know, actually, 330 00:17:11,040 --> 00:17:13,680 Speaker 1: just maybe it's nothing I did. Maybe they're just having 331 00:17:13,680 --> 00:17:16,720 Speaker 1: a day, has nothing to do with me, and maybe 332 00:17:16,760 --> 00:17:18,960 Speaker 1: how can I show up for them because they might 333 00:17:19,000 --> 00:17:22,880 Speaker 1: need help, or they might need encouragement, or they might 334 00:17:23,119 --> 00:17:25,639 Speaker 1: It's it's tricky, it's I'm not saying it's easy, but 335 00:17:25,720 --> 00:17:28,800 Speaker 1: I'm just saying it's something too that your your screen 336 00:17:28,880 --> 00:17:30,960 Speaker 1: might not be from something recent. It might be something 337 00:17:31,040 --> 00:17:33,640 Speaker 1: from your childhood, or it could be from something last week. 338 00:17:35,400 --> 00:17:39,679 Speaker 1: Because in in narrative therapy, you're rewriting the screens in 339 00:17:39,680 --> 00:17:43,640 Speaker 1: the script and you're separating the person like you from 340 00:17:43,640 --> 00:17:46,720 Speaker 1: the problem. So you've you've attached those things. How you 341 00:17:46,800 --> 00:17:49,720 Speaker 1: just described that you are the problem. People don't like you, 342 00:17:50,160 --> 00:17:52,800 Speaker 1: like people are acting or behaving in any certain way 343 00:17:52,840 --> 00:17:55,320 Speaker 1: because of you, because you see what happens and it 344 00:17:55,359 --> 00:17:57,479 Speaker 1: filters through that screen people don't like me, and then 345 00:17:57,520 --> 00:18:00,200 Speaker 1: it hits your brain versus it just hits your rain 346 00:18:00,480 --> 00:18:03,160 Speaker 1: and it could be, like you said, a million reasons 347 00:18:03,160 --> 00:18:06,160 Speaker 1: why that person is reacting that way. So in narrative therapy, 348 00:18:06,240 --> 00:18:08,840 Speaker 1: you can look at your story kind of from a 349 00:18:09,920 --> 00:18:15,119 Speaker 1: birds yeah, whatever, you can look yes, you look at 350 00:18:15,160 --> 00:18:17,440 Speaker 1: your story and you can see, Okay, look at all 351 00:18:17,440 --> 00:18:20,040 Speaker 1: the other things that I haven't put into perspective or 352 00:18:20,119 --> 00:18:22,800 Speaker 1: I haven't paid attention to that also could be contributing 353 00:18:22,840 --> 00:18:24,720 Speaker 1: to that thing. Why did I have to make that 354 00:18:24,760 --> 00:18:28,800 Speaker 1: about me? Because when we create a narrative, we have 355 00:18:28,880 --> 00:18:32,680 Speaker 1: this thing called confirmation bias, which is like it is 356 00:18:32,720 --> 00:18:35,639 Speaker 1: not helped I guess it could be helpful certain experiences, 357 00:18:35,680 --> 00:18:38,080 Speaker 1: but not this one. Because if you have that screen, 358 00:18:38,320 --> 00:18:40,120 Speaker 1: you're going to go out and you're going to pick 359 00:18:40,240 --> 00:18:42,760 Speaker 1: up your brain. It's like, have you ever really wanted 360 00:18:42,760 --> 00:18:45,000 Speaker 1: a car that you don't have? Like for me, I 361 00:18:45,040 --> 00:18:47,800 Speaker 1: wanted an extra right after and then you see xterras, 362 00:18:47,840 --> 00:18:51,480 Speaker 1: Oh my gosh everywhere. I don't don't want to exterra anymore. 363 00:18:51,560 --> 00:18:53,520 Speaker 1: But in high school, that's all I wanted, and I 364 00:18:53,560 --> 00:18:56,239 Speaker 1: saw them everywhere because that's what my brain was like 365 00:18:56,440 --> 00:18:59,480 Speaker 1: looped on. Now I don't notice them because I don't 366 00:18:59,520 --> 00:19:02,240 Speaker 1: really want one. That's the same thing that can happen 367 00:19:02,320 --> 00:19:05,160 Speaker 1: with your screen and your story here is if i've 368 00:19:05,200 --> 00:19:08,160 Speaker 1: created this belief or I have this filter that people 369 00:19:08,160 --> 00:19:10,480 Speaker 1: don't like me, I'm going to pick up little things 370 00:19:10,520 --> 00:19:12,920 Speaker 1: that prove that to be right. So let's say we're 371 00:19:12,920 --> 00:19:15,520 Speaker 1: having a conversation and maybe you like I do this 372 00:19:15,560 --> 00:19:17,800 Speaker 1: all the time, maybe like rolled your eyes and I 373 00:19:17,840 --> 00:19:20,200 Speaker 1: would take that as see Amy doesn't like me. That's 374 00:19:20,320 --> 00:19:22,040 Speaker 1: she's rolled her eyes. She's annoyed at what I said. 375 00:19:22,119 --> 00:19:24,680 Speaker 1: I wrote, my eyes all the time, don't take time. 376 00:19:25,960 --> 00:19:29,480 Speaker 1: You have a gift up. Yeah, Mary made a gift 377 00:19:29,720 --> 00:19:32,360 Speaker 1: of me rolling my eyes, and then of my dog 378 00:19:32,440 --> 00:19:34,720 Speaker 1: Kara and my cat Maggie, who are both on the 379 00:19:34,760 --> 00:19:37,159 Speaker 1: puzzle as well. Randomly, but yeah, if you type in 380 00:19:37,240 --> 00:19:42,200 Speaker 1: Amy Brown or the shop forward or I think Espoire four, 381 00:19:42,240 --> 00:19:45,000 Speaker 1: things don't don't come up. Like if you type up 382 00:19:45,000 --> 00:19:46,760 Speaker 1: eye roll. I'm sure there's a lot that come up. 383 00:19:47,200 --> 00:19:50,040 Speaker 1: But if you just type in a Brown, oh my god, 384 00:19:50,119 --> 00:19:52,520 Speaker 1: my eye roll, I think will pop up. And yeah, 385 00:19:52,520 --> 00:19:54,800 Speaker 1: I was pretty intense, but that was at work on 386 00:19:54,840 --> 00:19:56,959 Speaker 1: the Bobby Bone Show. I was rolling my eyes at 387 00:19:56,960 --> 00:19:59,720 Speaker 1: a question that Bobby was asking me, and it was 388 00:20:00,080 --> 00:20:03,679 Speaker 1: a pretty dramatic, dramatic I roll. But yeah, I wouldn't 389 00:20:03,720 --> 00:20:05,440 Speaker 1: take offense to that. But I see your point back 390 00:20:05,440 --> 00:20:08,520 Speaker 1: to your Yeah, it's like, so I'm going to find 391 00:20:08,560 --> 00:20:12,240 Speaker 1: all of this evidence that confirms right. So that's but 392 00:20:12,359 --> 00:20:15,240 Speaker 1: that necessarily might not be true. And that speaks to 393 00:20:15,359 --> 00:20:17,600 Speaker 1: what I was saying earlier about when you're we're in 394 00:20:17,680 --> 00:20:20,080 Speaker 1: these modes and everything's all bad. We're going to pick 395 00:20:20,200 --> 00:20:23,880 Speaker 1: up all the bad things that happen, yes, everything, if 396 00:20:24,200 --> 00:20:27,240 Speaker 1: you're like a magnet, magnet and then you're not paying 397 00:20:27,280 --> 00:20:29,320 Speaker 1: attention to any of the good things. I'm not paying 398 00:20:29,359 --> 00:20:31,520 Speaker 1: attention to. Maybe we had a whole conversation and you 399 00:20:31,560 --> 00:20:33,679 Speaker 1: were smiling at me and engaged the whole time, and 400 00:20:33,720 --> 00:20:35,560 Speaker 1: then you got a text and you rolled your eyes. 401 00:20:35,640 --> 00:20:37,879 Speaker 1: I took that personally, and all I remember is that 402 00:20:37,920 --> 00:20:40,119 Speaker 1: you rolled your eyes at me. Yeah, Amy, it doesn't 403 00:20:40,119 --> 00:20:43,359 Speaker 1: like me. So narrative therapy gives us a chance to 404 00:20:43,400 --> 00:20:45,840 Speaker 1: go back and look at the actual things that we're 405 00:20:45,840 --> 00:20:49,280 Speaker 1: going on, rewrite the script so we can then live 406 00:20:49,320 --> 00:20:52,480 Speaker 1: a life that feels like better to be in. Essentially, 407 00:20:53,480 --> 00:20:55,320 Speaker 1: I have a story at work, and this is just 408 00:20:55,400 --> 00:20:59,119 Speaker 1: me getting vulnerable with what I do. I've been struggling 409 00:20:59,240 --> 00:21:02,240 Speaker 1: for a while with like I don't know what I'm doing. 410 00:21:02,800 --> 00:21:05,679 Speaker 1: I'm not very good at my job. Nobody cares what 411 00:21:05,760 --> 00:21:07,760 Speaker 1: I have to say. But that was my This is 412 00:21:07,760 --> 00:21:11,280 Speaker 1: a heavy narrative of like I'm letting people down. Everybody 413 00:21:11,320 --> 00:21:14,520 Speaker 1: else at work is doing better than me, and you know, 414 00:21:14,600 --> 00:21:17,080 Speaker 1: I had an important conversation that I needed to have, 415 00:21:17,240 --> 00:21:19,399 Speaker 1: which felt good for me to say and be heard. 416 00:21:19,960 --> 00:21:23,560 Speaker 1: But something about sharing that and just voicing it helped me. 417 00:21:23,840 --> 00:21:25,199 Speaker 1: But then I also knew I had to put in 418 00:21:25,200 --> 00:21:28,800 Speaker 1: the work to change my narrative. And I will say 419 00:21:29,040 --> 00:21:31,200 Speaker 1: I've been able to show up at work with more 420 00:21:31,240 --> 00:21:37,280 Speaker 1: confidence and I'm present on the mic, and I feel like, hey, yeah, 421 00:21:37,400 --> 00:21:39,679 Speaker 1: I've been doing this for fifteen years. I guess there 422 00:21:39,760 --> 00:21:43,440 Speaker 1: is a reason why I'm here, And no, I don't 423 00:21:43,440 --> 00:21:46,320 Speaker 1: need to back away. But when I had the negative reel, 424 00:21:46,840 --> 00:21:48,960 Speaker 1: I would back away from the microphone and I literally 425 00:21:49,000 --> 00:21:52,000 Speaker 1: wasn't talking, which is it is my job. I am 426 00:21:52,040 --> 00:21:55,800 Speaker 1: getting paid to talk. Then that confirmed the belief of 427 00:21:55,880 --> 00:21:58,159 Speaker 1: nobody cares what I have to say because nobody's talking 428 00:21:58,160 --> 00:22:00,600 Speaker 1: to me, nobody's asking my opinion. Well, nobody's asking my 429 00:22:00,600 --> 00:22:02,840 Speaker 1: opinion because I'm backed away from the mic, or I'm 430 00:22:02,840 --> 00:22:05,680 Speaker 1: not engaged. I'm looking at my phone. There was a disconnect, 431 00:22:05,760 --> 00:22:09,320 Speaker 1: but I was adding to the disconnect by confirming the 432 00:22:09,359 --> 00:22:11,520 Speaker 1: story over and over in my head. And that was 433 00:22:11,600 --> 00:22:15,600 Speaker 1: my narrative. But then I'm living proof that about two 434 00:22:15,640 --> 00:22:18,000 Speaker 1: weeks ago, maybe a week and a half, I don't know, 435 00:22:18,960 --> 00:22:22,240 Speaker 1: I switched the narrative and I have been having better 436 00:22:22,359 --> 00:22:25,920 Speaker 1: days at work, and literally, I don't think anything else 437 00:22:26,000 --> 00:22:29,040 Speaker 1: is different around me. Nothing in my environment has changed 438 00:22:29,600 --> 00:22:32,520 Speaker 1: except for my thoughts, except for you. What you're talking 439 00:22:32,560 --> 00:22:35,240 Speaker 1: about is a self fulfilling prophecy. So when we look 440 00:22:35,280 --> 00:22:37,919 Speaker 1: at something where we have that belief system, we're going 441 00:22:37,960 --> 00:22:40,399 Speaker 1: to go and behave in ways that then create that 442 00:22:40,440 --> 00:22:43,000 Speaker 1: to happen. We do that in relationships all the time. 443 00:22:43,040 --> 00:22:44,680 Speaker 1: They're going to break up with me. They're going to 444 00:22:44,760 --> 00:22:46,600 Speaker 1: break up with me. Okay, well, guess what When you 445 00:22:46,640 --> 00:22:48,720 Speaker 1: act so anxious that they're going to break up with you, 446 00:22:48,760 --> 00:22:50,800 Speaker 1: and you continue to ask somebody, do you like me? 447 00:22:50,840 --> 00:22:52,520 Speaker 1: Do you love me? Do you want to be with me? Like? 448 00:22:52,560 --> 00:22:53,680 Speaker 1: Do you want to hang out? Do you really want 449 00:22:53,680 --> 00:22:55,240 Speaker 1: to be here? You're going to push them away. Then 450 00:22:55,280 --> 00:22:56,560 Speaker 1: they're going to break up with you, and you're going 451 00:22:56,600 --> 00:22:59,399 Speaker 1: to create that story to be true versus if you 452 00:22:59,440 --> 00:23:03,159 Speaker 1: were just sitting in you can be anxious and not also, 453 00:23:03,800 --> 00:23:05,480 Speaker 1: I guess I don't want to use this word about 454 00:23:05,600 --> 00:23:07,760 Speaker 1: use it like brate somebody if they like you or not. 455 00:23:08,240 --> 00:23:10,399 Speaker 1: You can just sit in that in find ways to 456 00:23:10,480 --> 00:23:13,400 Speaker 1: cope with your feelings of of anxiety or whatever that is. 457 00:23:13,680 --> 00:23:15,600 Speaker 1: Then you actually get to be in that relationship and 458 00:23:15,600 --> 00:23:18,680 Speaker 1: that person gets to be with you versus you're trying 459 00:23:18,720 --> 00:23:20,639 Speaker 1: to like pull them in closer and then they're going 460 00:23:20,680 --> 00:23:23,040 Speaker 1: to end up wanting to walk away. That makes sense. 461 00:23:23,640 --> 00:23:26,800 Speaker 1: So the self fulfilling prophecy is right in line with 462 00:23:26,880 --> 00:23:30,399 Speaker 1: the confirmation bias, right in line with the narratives that 463 00:23:30,480 --> 00:23:32,560 Speaker 1: we have. So I just wanted to talk about that 464 00:23:32,640 --> 00:23:34,720 Speaker 1: because I think that's a really important thing for us 465 00:23:34,800 --> 00:23:37,840 Speaker 1: to acknowledge and pay attention to, because we don't know 466 00:23:37,920 --> 00:23:40,440 Speaker 1: that we might be living in narratives that aren't actually 467 00:23:40,560 --> 00:23:44,159 Speaker 1: reality until we look at them. Yeah, self awareness is 468 00:23:44,160 --> 00:23:47,159 Speaker 1: a huge part of this. Yeah. I mean, now, before 469 00:23:47,280 --> 00:23:50,679 Speaker 1: we transition and wrap this part of the conversation up, 470 00:23:50,720 --> 00:23:54,080 Speaker 1: I do want to just say and and put out 471 00:23:54,119 --> 00:23:56,280 Speaker 1: there that right now that feels like we don't have 472 00:23:56,320 --> 00:23:59,359 Speaker 1: a lot of control and power in the world, and 473 00:23:59,600 --> 00:24:01,680 Speaker 1: it's it's pretty true. There's a lot of stuff going 474 00:24:01,680 --> 00:24:05,520 Speaker 1: on out there that we cannot change by ourselves. And 475 00:24:05,520 --> 00:24:07,399 Speaker 1: what I want to remind you guys, is this is 476 00:24:07,440 --> 00:24:09,080 Speaker 1: something that you do have a lot of power and 477 00:24:09,080 --> 00:24:12,040 Speaker 1: control in and that is your story and the meaning 478 00:24:12,080 --> 00:24:14,399 Speaker 1: making you make up. And that's one of the reasons 479 00:24:14,480 --> 00:24:16,840 Speaker 1: I really wanted to bring this up today because we 480 00:24:16,960 --> 00:24:19,879 Speaker 1: cannot change a lot of the stuff out there, but 481 00:24:20,000 --> 00:24:23,040 Speaker 1: we can change how we're responding to the stuff out there, 482 00:24:23,080 --> 00:24:26,160 Speaker 1: and we're responding to the internal messages that we've been 483 00:24:26,160 --> 00:24:28,480 Speaker 1: holding onto for a long time. I like that. Yeah, 484 00:24:28,600 --> 00:24:37,320 Speaker 1: thank you for the reminder. You're welcome. Now let's transition 485 00:24:37,480 --> 00:24:40,560 Speaker 1: because I got a question that I'm not going to 486 00:24:40,640 --> 00:24:42,360 Speaker 1: read the whole question, but I'm we're going to talk 487 00:24:42,359 --> 00:24:45,000 Speaker 1: about the gist of it because I get questions like 488 00:24:45,040 --> 00:24:47,200 Speaker 1: this a lot from you guys that I usually will 489 00:24:47,520 --> 00:24:49,320 Speaker 1: end up answering on couch chocks. But I want to 490 00:24:49,359 --> 00:24:51,600 Speaker 1: talk about it with Amy. Y have her here because 491 00:24:52,080 --> 00:24:55,280 Speaker 1: she's somebody who I think has some good insight from 492 00:24:55,359 --> 00:25:00,760 Speaker 1: the therapy goer versus the therapist perspective. And it is 493 00:25:00,880 --> 00:25:03,520 Speaker 1: this idea of what do I do, not just how 494 00:25:03,560 --> 00:25:06,240 Speaker 1: do I find a therapist that I like and jive with, 495 00:25:06,600 --> 00:25:09,680 Speaker 1: but what do I do when the therapist that I'm 496 00:25:09,720 --> 00:25:13,840 Speaker 1: working with either isn't working for me, isn't hearing me, 497 00:25:14,040 --> 00:25:16,840 Speaker 1: or I just don't like them? How do I get 498 00:25:16,840 --> 00:25:19,280 Speaker 1: my needs met? Do I just leave? Do I have 499 00:25:19,320 --> 00:25:22,080 Speaker 1: a conversation about it? Do I ask for something different. 500 00:25:22,119 --> 00:25:24,760 Speaker 1: Do I just give up and stop going to therapy. Well, 501 00:25:25,080 --> 00:25:30,240 Speaker 1: I've done it all, and I think that you're it's 502 00:25:30,280 --> 00:25:34,080 Speaker 1: perfectly normal if you're feeling uncomfortable with your therapist, not 503 00:25:34,119 --> 00:25:36,520 Speaker 1: because of anything they've done. There's just not a vibe, 504 00:25:36,600 --> 00:25:39,480 Speaker 1: there's not a connection. I would say, You're not the 505 00:25:39,520 --> 00:25:41,680 Speaker 1: only person in the world that's happened to and so 506 00:25:42,080 --> 00:25:45,399 Speaker 1: it's so important to make sure you find a therapist 507 00:25:45,600 --> 00:25:47,800 Speaker 1: that you vibe with and you may be able to 508 00:25:47,800 --> 00:25:50,360 Speaker 1: speak on your end like you would rather someone. Yeah, 509 00:25:50,400 --> 00:25:52,600 Speaker 1: find someone that they're going to actually get results from 510 00:25:52,800 --> 00:25:56,640 Speaker 1: and connect with and have a good therapist patient relationship. 511 00:25:56,760 --> 00:25:58,399 Speaker 1: I have gone to people before I'm like, this is 512 00:25:58,440 --> 00:26:01,440 Speaker 1: not working. While it has that back my progress because 513 00:26:01,480 --> 00:26:04,360 Speaker 1: I've had to stop going to that person and then 514 00:26:04,480 --> 00:26:08,359 Speaker 1: find a new person. And it's daunting because you you 515 00:26:08,400 --> 00:26:10,320 Speaker 1: maybe did a lot of research to even get with 516 00:26:10,359 --> 00:26:13,280 Speaker 1: the person that now five sessions in you're like, oh, 517 00:26:13,440 --> 00:26:16,160 Speaker 1: this is just not working. I mean I was even 518 00:26:16,200 --> 00:26:19,320 Speaker 1: doing E M d R with this woman and I 519 00:26:19,400 --> 00:26:23,000 Speaker 1: was so excited about doing E M d R, like pumped, 520 00:26:23,320 --> 00:26:25,800 Speaker 1: and I just did not have a good experience to 521 00:26:25,880 --> 00:26:28,760 Speaker 1: where now I haven't gone back to do that. I've 522 00:26:28,760 --> 00:26:32,680 Speaker 1: done other things. I've done the talk therapy, brain spotting 523 00:26:32,720 --> 00:26:35,399 Speaker 1: with Linda shout Out. So I didn't give up. I 524 00:26:35,400 --> 00:26:39,440 Speaker 1: didn't just stop therapy altogether. Um. It did delay the process. 525 00:26:39,560 --> 00:26:44,120 Speaker 1: But I think that you're doing yourself personally a disservice 526 00:26:44,800 --> 00:26:48,439 Speaker 1: if you just continue showing up trying to make it work. 527 00:26:48,760 --> 00:26:52,840 Speaker 1: It's like any relationship, but sometimes people are don't ever 528 00:26:52,880 --> 00:26:55,400 Speaker 1: hurt anybody's feelings. They might continue going to a therapist 529 00:26:55,440 --> 00:26:59,600 Speaker 1: for like a year or which is not healthy, right, 530 00:26:59,680 --> 00:27:02,360 Speaker 1: that's not keeping it down the middle. Yeah, because you're 531 00:27:02,359 --> 00:27:05,520 Speaker 1: too worried about that person's feelings. Or some people might 532 00:27:05,520 --> 00:27:06,959 Speaker 1: just throw in the towel and be like, well this 533 00:27:07,000 --> 00:27:10,800 Speaker 1: was an awful experience, I'm never going again. Well, that's 534 00:27:10,800 --> 00:27:13,679 Speaker 1: also not keeping it down the middle. Those are the 535 00:27:13,680 --> 00:27:16,760 Speaker 1: two extremes. So you want to find a place where 536 00:27:16,800 --> 00:27:19,720 Speaker 1: you can carve out time of like hey, and give 537 00:27:19,760 --> 00:27:22,960 Speaker 1: yourself that permission. Go ahead and set the expectation for yourself, 538 00:27:23,000 --> 00:27:26,840 Speaker 1: because expectations are so important. Have you built this story 539 00:27:26,880 --> 00:27:28,679 Speaker 1: up in your head that like, you're supposed to have 540 00:27:28,680 --> 00:27:31,119 Speaker 1: this magical relationship and you should already be doing so 541 00:27:31,240 --> 00:27:34,600 Speaker 1: much better and light you should be healed in a way, 542 00:27:35,359 --> 00:27:38,640 Speaker 1: and then you're not, so you're let down. But when 543 00:27:38,640 --> 00:27:41,639 Speaker 1: it comes to expectations of finding a therapist that you 544 00:27:41,680 --> 00:27:44,600 Speaker 1: click with, understand that it might take some time, and 545 00:27:44,640 --> 00:27:46,399 Speaker 1: it's going to take some commitment, and it's going to 546 00:27:46,480 --> 00:27:51,280 Speaker 1: take some effort, and you just need to commit. I 547 00:27:51,320 --> 00:27:53,840 Speaker 1: think that you say the expectation thing is huge because 548 00:27:53,840 --> 00:27:56,760 Speaker 1: I think that some people, a lot of people, myself included, 549 00:27:56,760 --> 00:27:58,680 Speaker 1: at times you expect to go to therapy and you 550 00:27:58,760 --> 00:28:02,120 Speaker 1: expect to have a magical experience, and sometimes it's not magical, 551 00:28:02,480 --> 00:28:06,359 Speaker 1: it's mundane or awkward. And I believe one of the 552 00:28:06,359 --> 00:28:09,520 Speaker 1: most important healing agents in therapy is the relationship between 553 00:28:09,520 --> 00:28:13,119 Speaker 1: the client and the therapist. However, that doesn't always just click. 554 00:28:13,560 --> 00:28:16,919 Speaker 1: There sometimes needs to be a period of like testing 555 00:28:16,960 --> 00:28:18,639 Speaker 1: the water is getting to know each other, putting a 556 00:28:18,680 --> 00:28:21,680 Speaker 1: toe in versus jumping in head first. And people don't 557 00:28:21,720 --> 00:28:23,960 Speaker 1: like that because it's time and it's money and it's resources, 558 00:28:23,960 --> 00:28:27,240 Speaker 1: and I get it. But also relationships take time to build, 559 00:28:27,280 --> 00:28:29,760 Speaker 1: and that can even be therapy in itself of what 560 00:28:29,840 --> 00:28:34,440 Speaker 1: does it feel like to slowly lean into a relationship 561 00:28:34,840 --> 00:28:38,000 Speaker 1: versus being all or nothing, Like you're talking about. Yeah, 562 00:28:38,080 --> 00:28:41,360 Speaker 1: I mean we we had some marriage counselors, one guy 563 00:28:41,360 --> 00:28:44,160 Speaker 1: in particular that we went to and it completely kept 564 00:28:44,240 --> 00:28:47,800 Speaker 1: us from going and my husband and I we desperately 565 00:28:47,840 --> 00:28:51,640 Speaker 1: needed it, so had we continued, like that's an example 566 00:28:51,680 --> 00:28:53,840 Speaker 1: of like I just quit going all together. I was 567 00:28:53,880 --> 00:28:56,920 Speaker 1: still doing my my personal Yeah, we didn't like him, 568 00:28:57,200 --> 00:28:59,800 Speaker 1: and I think it was like maybe the second or 569 00:29:00,160 --> 00:29:02,080 Speaker 1: third time we went to him, So it's not like 570 00:29:02,120 --> 00:29:03,960 Speaker 1: but I mean it was clear for me day one. 571 00:29:04,080 --> 00:29:05,880 Speaker 1: I was like, I'm not gonna work, but it was 572 00:29:05,920 --> 00:29:08,240 Speaker 1: referred by some friends and so I thought, well, let's 573 00:29:08,240 --> 00:29:09,920 Speaker 1: give it a go. But then after the third time, 574 00:29:09,920 --> 00:29:12,760 Speaker 1: we both decided, like this is just not working. But 575 00:29:12,800 --> 00:29:14,920 Speaker 1: we should have stayed committed and stayed the course and 576 00:29:15,040 --> 00:29:19,440 Speaker 1: found somebody, but we gave up, which then we probably 577 00:29:19,440 --> 00:29:22,320 Speaker 1: could have resolved some other things sooner if we had. Well, 578 00:29:22,360 --> 00:29:24,200 Speaker 1: then you kind of had Like so if you start 579 00:29:24,200 --> 00:29:25,840 Speaker 1: going to therapy and then you just quit, what you're 580 00:29:25,840 --> 00:29:28,560 Speaker 1: doing is you leave therapy with like an open wound 581 00:29:28,800 --> 00:29:30,680 Speaker 1: and no band aid. Like the band aid kind of 582 00:29:30,720 --> 00:29:33,480 Speaker 1: has been like maybe not taken off completely, but kind 583 00:29:33,480 --> 00:29:35,600 Speaker 1: of been like lifted a little bit. And that's what 584 00:29:35,720 --> 00:29:38,200 Speaker 1: I tell people and first sessions with me. One of 585 00:29:38,200 --> 00:29:39,960 Speaker 1: the things that I make sure to say is, you 586 00:29:40,000 --> 00:29:42,240 Speaker 1: know what, therapy can get worse before it gets better, 587 00:29:42,680 --> 00:29:44,440 Speaker 1: or it can just get uncomfortable and you might just 588 00:29:44,520 --> 00:29:46,920 Speaker 1: not like it. I would like you to tell me 589 00:29:47,320 --> 00:29:50,680 Speaker 1: when that's happening before you just stopped coming. It's okay 590 00:29:50,720 --> 00:29:52,200 Speaker 1: if you don't want to come, and it's okay if 591 00:29:52,200 --> 00:29:54,360 Speaker 1: you don't want to come back and see me. That's 592 00:29:54,560 --> 00:29:57,720 Speaker 1: a dent. Okay, this is for you. But when you 593 00:29:57,840 --> 00:30:00,840 Speaker 1: just quit and you just go off the course, what 594 00:30:00,840 --> 00:30:03,280 Speaker 1: you're doing is you're coming in opening stuff up and 595 00:30:03,320 --> 00:30:06,000 Speaker 1: then you're out in the world without any containment or 596 00:30:06,040 --> 00:30:09,440 Speaker 1: any safety. Now, so it actually might make things worse 597 00:30:09,640 --> 00:30:12,440 Speaker 1: or put you deeper into that unhealthy pattern that you 598 00:30:12,480 --> 00:30:16,000 Speaker 1: came to therapy even stop. So this is a p 599 00:30:16,240 --> 00:30:20,080 Speaker 1: s A to all people who are feeling unsure about 600 00:30:20,080 --> 00:30:22,520 Speaker 1: their therapists or therapy but you're in it, have a 601 00:30:22,560 --> 00:30:26,920 Speaker 1: conversation with your therapists. If your therapist cannot hold their 602 00:30:27,080 --> 00:30:31,480 Speaker 1: feelings and experiences separate from you, therapists or human too, well, 603 00:30:31,480 --> 00:30:34,160 Speaker 1: they are human. Some of them might not get the 604 00:30:34,200 --> 00:30:36,680 Speaker 1: proper reaction. Well, they might not give a propers they 605 00:30:36,760 --> 00:30:40,240 Speaker 1: might be, but that's not on you. That's on That 606 00:30:40,280 --> 00:30:42,080 Speaker 1: would be on the therapist, and that's on the that's 607 00:30:42,120 --> 00:30:45,000 Speaker 1: the therapist job to deal with that. Your job is 608 00:30:45,040 --> 00:30:47,840 Speaker 1: not to take care of our feelings, and our job 609 00:30:47,880 --> 00:30:49,800 Speaker 1: is not to take care of your feelings. We both 610 00:30:50,000 --> 00:30:52,320 Speaker 1: are taking care of our own. So I just want 611 00:30:52,320 --> 00:30:55,360 Speaker 1: to throw that out there because it can be scary 612 00:30:55,760 --> 00:30:57,760 Speaker 1: and feel like, oh, I don't want to be mean 613 00:30:57,920 --> 00:31:00,440 Speaker 1: or bad or whatever, but it's the same kind of 614 00:31:00,440 --> 00:31:02,880 Speaker 1: thing of like you get your hair done or your 615 00:31:02,920 --> 00:31:05,280 Speaker 1: nails done and you hate it. What are you going 616 00:31:05,320 --> 00:31:08,160 Speaker 1: to walk around with like hair that you hate for 617 00:31:08,520 --> 00:31:11,800 Speaker 1: three months? Maybe, but I hope not. Oh well, I 618 00:31:11,840 --> 00:31:14,520 Speaker 1: know my work doesn't come from my hair. Though that's 619 00:31:14,560 --> 00:31:18,280 Speaker 1: my narrative. I was kind of I got some blonde 620 00:31:18,320 --> 00:31:22,240 Speaker 1: highlights and they're a little too like blonde up your hair? 621 00:31:22,320 --> 00:31:25,480 Speaker 1: Oh well, thank you, but I've been stressed about these 622 00:31:25,520 --> 00:31:27,560 Speaker 1: blonde streaks are on my face and I'm like, okay, 623 00:31:27,560 --> 00:31:31,440 Speaker 1: who cares? Like nobody cares. I'm the only one noticing it. 624 00:31:31,920 --> 00:31:35,160 Speaker 1: What yes, but no, but I just got my hair 625 00:31:35,200 --> 00:31:38,640 Speaker 1: done and then you put these and must do a 626 00:31:38,640 --> 00:31:41,040 Speaker 1: bad job. But she put that's very blonde in the front, 627 00:31:41,080 --> 00:31:43,400 Speaker 1: and I was like, so self conscious of it, but 628 00:31:43,440 --> 00:31:44,840 Speaker 1: a couple of people were like, I love your hair, 629 00:31:44,880 --> 00:31:46,560 Speaker 1: and I was like, well, maybe I'm just looking too 630 00:31:46,560 --> 00:31:52,520 Speaker 1: far exactly. And then, by the way, then I remind 631 00:31:52,600 --> 00:31:55,920 Speaker 1: myself little things sometimes that I freak out about when 632 00:31:55,960 --> 00:31:58,760 Speaker 1: it comes to me, or like a looks type of thing. 633 00:31:59,040 --> 00:32:01,480 Speaker 1: I'm more like, well, good thing. My worst doesn't come 634 00:32:01,600 --> 00:32:04,360 Speaker 1: from that any of this stuff, which was a great point, 635 00:32:04,400 --> 00:32:07,880 Speaker 1: and I'm glad you said that against my point, which 636 00:32:07,920 --> 00:32:10,440 Speaker 1: is okay, I'm not trying to counter you, but I 637 00:32:10,480 --> 00:32:14,040 Speaker 1: appreciate it is true. It's true. It's maybe you shared 638 00:32:14,040 --> 00:32:20,680 Speaker 1: about example like I need a new example. My point 639 00:32:20,960 --> 00:32:25,360 Speaker 1: was I want us to have the to share our 640 00:32:25,440 --> 00:32:28,120 Speaker 1: honest feelings and not take care of other people. So 641 00:32:29,240 --> 00:32:33,440 Speaker 1: with you, yeah, actually that was a real life thank 642 00:32:33,480 --> 00:32:36,000 Speaker 1: you for this. You're welcome. Now we're going to stay 643 00:32:36,040 --> 00:32:38,840 Speaker 1: with that example just because we already used it. But 644 00:32:38,880 --> 00:32:43,320 Speaker 1: my pope is that we don't go around filtering our 645 00:32:43,360 --> 00:32:45,880 Speaker 1: responses to take care of other people all day long. 646 00:32:46,200 --> 00:32:47,600 Speaker 1: So I don't want to hurt the girl that does 647 00:32:47,640 --> 00:32:50,040 Speaker 1: my hair is feelings been telling her that I love 648 00:32:50,080 --> 00:32:54,760 Speaker 1: it when I really hate it, and I paid for it, 649 00:32:55,720 --> 00:32:57,280 Speaker 1: so I must say I love it because I don't 650 00:32:57,280 --> 00:32:59,600 Speaker 1: want hurt her feelings. Now, not that big of a 651 00:32:59,600 --> 00:33:01,560 Speaker 1: deal if don't are worth this thing over my hair, 652 00:33:01,920 --> 00:33:06,280 Speaker 1: totally right, but it is important. But speak up. You 653 00:33:06,280 --> 00:33:09,720 Speaker 1: can do it in a kind way. Yes, that is 654 00:33:09,880 --> 00:33:11,640 Speaker 1: a whole. I mean this is I know you're giving 655 00:33:11,640 --> 00:33:13,520 Speaker 1: an example about hair, but it makes me think of 656 00:33:14,040 --> 00:33:20,000 Speaker 1: different Like no, I'm just thinking other relationships where maybe 657 00:33:20,040 --> 00:33:23,880 Speaker 1: you have an unhealthy attachment or something, or you're you know, 658 00:33:24,080 --> 00:33:27,440 Speaker 1: people pleasing or the codependency for that matter, Like there 659 00:33:27,560 --> 00:33:32,720 Speaker 1: is ways you can practice detaching, but you're still It's 660 00:33:32,760 --> 00:33:37,000 Speaker 1: neither kind nor unkind. It's just you. It is taking 661 00:33:37,000 --> 00:33:39,800 Speaker 1: care of yourself and it is what it is. And 662 00:33:39,840 --> 00:33:42,080 Speaker 1: I think that my hair person, my hair is fine, 663 00:33:42,080 --> 00:33:44,080 Speaker 1: by the way, but and I love my hair person, 664 00:33:44,160 --> 00:33:46,360 Speaker 1: but I think she probably would appreciate it if I'm 665 00:33:46,400 --> 00:33:50,120 Speaker 1: like hey, and I probably I micromanage a lot when 666 00:33:50,120 --> 00:33:51,960 Speaker 1: I'm there, and I don't know if my hair person 667 00:33:52,000 --> 00:33:54,000 Speaker 1: loves it or hates it. I hope she's not annoyed 668 00:33:54,040 --> 00:33:55,880 Speaker 1: by it. But I'll go in and specifically, like I'll 669 00:33:55,880 --> 00:33:57,600 Speaker 1: show a picture and be like hey, and last time 670 00:33:57,640 --> 00:33:59,760 Speaker 1: you did this, wasn't really feeling it. So this time 671 00:33:59,800 --> 00:34:03,040 Speaker 1: you try this and she's like, great, she'll cut my 672 00:34:03,080 --> 00:34:04,920 Speaker 1: hair and I'll be like, oh, I think you missed 673 00:34:04,920 --> 00:34:07,360 Speaker 1: a spot. I straight up filler because I don't want 674 00:34:07,360 --> 00:34:09,400 Speaker 1: to drive back, and she'll be like, oh, thank you 675 00:34:09,440 --> 00:34:11,800 Speaker 1: for telling me. I'll fix that. But I think she 676 00:34:11,800 --> 00:34:13,880 Speaker 1: probably would have let me walk out the door because honestly, 677 00:34:13,880 --> 00:34:16,319 Speaker 1: in her opinion, it probably looked fine. But then I 678 00:34:16,360 --> 00:34:19,560 Speaker 1: pick it apart. But she's there to help you, just 679 00:34:19,600 --> 00:34:22,960 Speaker 1: like a therapist is. We're here to help you. This 680 00:34:23,040 --> 00:34:25,440 Speaker 1: is not about us. So yeah, but it's way easier 681 00:34:25,440 --> 00:34:27,840 Speaker 1: for me to say, hey, I guess idea hick and 682 00:34:27,920 --> 00:34:31,120 Speaker 1: choose what i'll speak up about, because I will speak 683 00:34:31,200 --> 00:34:34,680 Speaker 1: up about my hair, but I will not speak my 684 00:34:34,719 --> 00:34:37,279 Speaker 1: truth or speak up about myself in other areas at all, 685 00:34:37,360 --> 00:34:39,720 Speaker 1: because I'm terrified and I don't want to hurt people 686 00:34:40,239 --> 00:34:43,040 Speaker 1: and I but that's where that detachment needs to take place. 687 00:34:43,120 --> 00:34:46,200 Speaker 1: That's where I just was working on this in therapy 688 00:34:46,280 --> 00:34:49,360 Speaker 1: this week. Like sometimes things that I am convicted on, 689 00:34:49,440 --> 00:34:50,880 Speaker 1: like if it has to do with one of my kids, 690 00:34:51,400 --> 00:34:54,000 Speaker 1: I speak up and I'm like, this is what's happening, 691 00:34:54,320 --> 00:34:58,440 Speaker 1: because well, that's what I think is best for our child. 692 00:34:58,840 --> 00:35:01,960 Speaker 1: Then it's like you want me to respond to that 693 00:35:02,040 --> 00:35:06,520 Speaker 1: confidently about something else, and I freeze and I want 694 00:35:06,520 --> 00:35:08,520 Speaker 1: to run away and I don't want to deal with it, 695 00:35:08,600 --> 00:35:11,000 Speaker 1: and I'm not confident in it, and I don't feel 696 00:35:11,000 --> 00:35:13,160 Speaker 1: like I can make a decision. But then I have 697 00:35:13,280 --> 00:35:16,520 Speaker 1: proof that I can make decisions because I just did 698 00:35:16,560 --> 00:35:21,120 Speaker 1: it for my child, so which isn't So then then 699 00:35:21,200 --> 00:35:24,920 Speaker 1: it's a challenge for myself. Yes, like I, oh, this 700 00:35:25,000 --> 00:35:28,720 Speaker 1: was a beautiful revelation. When I'm doing that, I'm the victim. 701 00:35:29,200 --> 00:35:33,160 Speaker 1: Say more. Well, the therapist showed me a little card 702 00:35:33,200 --> 00:35:43,920 Speaker 1: and it said I'm the victim. But because so, there's 703 00:35:44,040 --> 00:35:48,840 Speaker 1: all of these adjectives to describe victim behavior and I 704 00:35:48,920 --> 00:35:51,080 Speaker 1: basically checked off all of them, but only when it 705 00:35:51,120 --> 00:35:53,200 Speaker 1: came to this one particular topic. I guess it's hard 706 00:35:53,200 --> 00:35:56,359 Speaker 1: to discuss without giving the Well, for me, I'm trying 707 00:35:56,400 --> 00:35:58,399 Speaker 1: to filter, but this involves other people, and it's other 708 00:35:58,400 --> 00:36:02,000 Speaker 1: people's stories, so I'm not public with this information, but 709 00:36:02,160 --> 00:36:06,160 Speaker 1: it's it's for me because I'm avoiding, and I'm like, 710 00:36:06,239 --> 00:36:08,480 Speaker 1: woe is me? And I'm stuck in my feelings and 711 00:36:08,520 --> 00:36:10,120 Speaker 1: I don't want to deal with this and I can't 712 00:36:10,160 --> 00:36:16,880 Speaker 1: make a good decision. That's victim helpless behavior help helpless hopeless. Yes, 713 00:36:17,400 --> 00:36:20,600 Speaker 1: but the benefit of that is is I have to 714 00:36:20,640 --> 00:36:22,799 Speaker 1: avoid making a decision. You don't have to do anything. 715 00:36:22,800 --> 00:36:24,560 Speaker 1: I don't have to do anything. Being a victim has 716 00:36:24,560 --> 00:36:30,240 Speaker 1: a benefits. I actually thought, woe is me. I can't 717 00:36:30,280 --> 00:36:33,640 Speaker 1: get in tune with what a decision at my core, Like, 718 00:36:33,840 --> 00:36:36,680 Speaker 1: I don't know what you mean by speak my truth 719 00:36:36,719 --> 00:36:39,000 Speaker 1: on this matter because I don't know what it is. 720 00:36:39,640 --> 00:36:42,759 Speaker 1: And feel bad for me because this sucks. But it 721 00:36:42,800 --> 00:36:46,000 Speaker 1: puts the responsibility in everybody else's hands but yours, yes, 722 00:36:46,120 --> 00:36:49,520 Speaker 1: and then it gives other people mixed messages and it 723 00:36:49,600 --> 00:36:54,120 Speaker 1: causes more drama than necessary. The what countered the victim 724 00:36:54,320 --> 00:36:58,319 Speaker 1: was the like a aggressor both what's the word? Did 725 00:36:58,320 --> 00:37:00,920 Speaker 1: she do the cartman triangle with you? That's what this is. 726 00:37:01,280 --> 00:37:06,200 Speaker 1: It's a it's a key perpetrator, perpetrator so and rescuer, yes, 727 00:37:06,400 --> 00:37:10,279 Speaker 1: rescuer so the but the opposite of the victim is 728 00:37:10,320 --> 00:37:14,680 Speaker 1: the perpetrator. So then if you are the perpetrator, both 729 00:37:14,680 --> 00:37:18,080 Speaker 1: can be passive aggressive and then you get in this dance. 730 00:37:18,360 --> 00:37:20,440 Speaker 1: And then especially if you're in a relationship where you 731 00:37:20,520 --> 00:37:23,879 Speaker 1: kind of even know the other person, you can swap. Well, 732 00:37:23,920 --> 00:37:27,239 Speaker 1: you can go from victim to to persecutor too, and 733 00:37:27,239 --> 00:37:30,760 Speaker 1: then from persecutor to victim depending on what you're talking about. Well, 734 00:37:30,800 --> 00:37:34,600 Speaker 1: and yeah, and the problem we should do a whole 735 00:37:34,600 --> 00:37:37,480 Speaker 1: episode on probably because it's called the apartment triangle or 736 00:37:37,480 --> 00:37:41,200 Speaker 1: the drama triangle, depending on who you're talking to, And 737 00:37:41,320 --> 00:37:43,759 Speaker 1: it is one of the most helpful things that I 738 00:37:43,800 --> 00:37:46,000 Speaker 1: teach clients in sessions. So I think we should. You 739 00:37:46,000 --> 00:37:48,160 Speaker 1: should come back and we should do another episode on that. Yeah, 740 00:37:48,200 --> 00:37:52,000 Speaker 1: we should, because I think it because then the rescuer, 741 00:37:52,040 --> 00:37:54,720 Speaker 1: the victim, and the perpetrator are all kind of the whoe. 742 00:37:54,800 --> 00:37:57,520 Speaker 1: These are red flags we need to not be We 743 00:37:57,560 --> 00:37:59,200 Speaker 1: need to keep it in the middle. And there's a 744 00:37:59,200 --> 00:38:01,000 Speaker 1: way to get me down the don't yes, because then 745 00:38:01,120 --> 00:38:03,799 Speaker 1: while setting healthy boundaries, we don't give it all away. 746 00:38:06,280 --> 00:38:08,160 Speaker 1: But I've already like a new student. But I just 747 00:38:08,239 --> 00:38:10,800 Speaker 1: learned it in therapy yesterday. But I love that because 748 00:38:11,000 --> 00:38:13,200 Speaker 1: I think that a lot of people, going back to 749 00:38:13,239 --> 00:38:15,680 Speaker 1: this original question, we get stuck in this is like 750 00:38:15,760 --> 00:38:17,600 Speaker 1: I can't find a therapist or it's never gonna work 751 00:38:17,640 --> 00:38:20,799 Speaker 1: for me. You're the victim. You're the victim. People don't 752 00:38:20,840 --> 00:38:22,759 Speaker 1: like to be called a victim, but people like to 753 00:38:22,800 --> 00:38:25,840 Speaker 1: be a victim. Absolutely in your you're a victim and 754 00:38:25,880 --> 00:38:28,680 Speaker 1: you don't even know it. Yes, you're acting victim, your victimized. 755 00:38:28,800 --> 00:38:31,239 Speaker 1: I didn't. I certainly didn't when he flipped over the 756 00:38:31,280 --> 00:38:33,640 Speaker 1: card and it's a victim, and I was like, I 757 00:38:33,680 --> 00:38:37,239 Speaker 1: read all the things. I was self aware enough to 758 00:38:37,400 --> 00:38:42,080 Speaker 1: say that is me and like and I, yeah, I 759 00:38:42,120 --> 00:38:45,879 Speaker 1: don't want to I'm strong. I am capable of not 760 00:38:45,960 --> 00:38:50,520 Speaker 1: being the victims. So yeah, somewhere I need to come 761 00:38:50,560 --> 00:38:52,359 Speaker 1: down the middle. But we can talk about more of 762 00:38:52,400 --> 00:38:55,759 Speaker 1: the that that's wrapping all of us together, because there's 763 00:38:55,760 --> 00:38:57,880 Speaker 1: the power that I'm like, you do have power and 764 00:38:58,000 --> 00:39:01,520 Speaker 1: changing this narrative. You are able, yes, and you do. 765 00:39:01,960 --> 00:39:03,640 Speaker 1: It's hard the tools and do it's hard and it 766 00:39:03,680 --> 00:39:06,239 Speaker 1: does take work. But one of the beautiful tools is 767 00:39:06,280 --> 00:39:09,719 Speaker 1: therapy and that will help you. So therefore, to put 768 00:39:09,719 --> 00:39:12,719 Speaker 1: a bow on this, don't give up on finding a therapist. 769 00:39:12,760 --> 00:39:17,080 Speaker 1: It's very important, and I get not everybody has resources 770 00:39:17,120 --> 00:39:18,200 Speaker 1: for it. So I don't want to say it's so 771 00:39:18,239 --> 00:39:20,719 Speaker 1: important and you're completely missing out if you don't have 772 00:39:20,760 --> 00:39:23,360 Speaker 1: access and you can't afford it or something. But you 773 00:39:23,440 --> 00:39:25,279 Speaker 1: just gotta what are your What are other tools you 774 00:39:25,320 --> 00:39:28,000 Speaker 1: can put in your toolbox? Like what are their podcasts? 775 00:39:28,000 --> 00:39:31,080 Speaker 1: You are their books? You can read? Are there people 776 00:39:31,120 --> 00:39:32,919 Speaker 1: you can follow on Instagram that are going to offer 777 00:39:32,960 --> 00:39:36,000 Speaker 1: you the proper encouragement And that might take work in 778 00:39:36,040 --> 00:39:39,719 Speaker 1: itself filtering out what are the right resources for me? 779 00:39:40,360 --> 00:39:44,480 Speaker 1: And then you know, there's even online therapy now with Headspace, 780 00:39:44,560 --> 00:39:48,960 Speaker 1: and there's just different ways to do therapy now, especially 781 00:39:49,000 --> 00:39:52,080 Speaker 1: with COVID. A lot of it is on Zoom and 782 00:39:52,560 --> 00:39:56,240 Speaker 1: that can be highly convenient. Think outside the box. Yeah, 783 00:39:56,520 --> 00:39:58,520 Speaker 1: oh now, I'm excited to have this next conversation. But 784 00:39:58,760 --> 00:40:00,560 Speaker 1: before we and I do want to say there's a 785 00:40:00,600 --> 00:40:03,879 Speaker 1: difference in victimizing yourself and some some of us really 786 00:40:03,920 --> 00:40:06,719 Speaker 1: are victims at parts of our lives. So I don't 787 00:40:06,719 --> 00:40:08,359 Speaker 1: want anybody to hear that and be like, well, I 788 00:40:08,400 --> 00:40:15,319 Speaker 1: was a victim in this experience. I literally was myself. Yeah, 789 00:40:15,840 --> 00:40:19,440 Speaker 1: I am. I am adding to the problem. I am 790 00:40:19,600 --> 00:40:21,600 Speaker 1: doing a dance with myself and we are going round 791 00:40:21,600 --> 00:40:24,239 Speaker 1: and round and we're not getting anywhere because I continue 792 00:40:24,280 --> 00:40:28,800 Speaker 1: to be the victim. So okay, well we're gonna wrap 793 00:40:28,880 --> 00:40:31,839 Speaker 1: this one up because now we're just gonna go get 794 00:40:31,840 --> 00:40:33,760 Speaker 1: excited about the next episode we're going to do together's 795 00:40:33,760 --> 00:40:37,479 Speaker 1: just gonna come back again. Okay, great? Um, all right, well, 796 00:40:37,520 --> 00:40:39,719 Speaker 1: thank you guys for UM. I always want to say 797 00:40:39,760 --> 00:40:41,719 Speaker 1: tuning in, but you don't tune into this, you just 798 00:40:41,760 --> 00:40:43,640 Speaker 1: play it on your phone. Thank you guys for listening. 799 00:40:43,800 --> 00:40:46,880 Speaker 1: If you have a second we would I would personally 800 00:40:46,960 --> 00:40:51,319 Speaker 1: love it. Okay, that's on my podcast network. Okay, well, 801 00:40:51,320 --> 00:40:53,800 Speaker 1: shameless plug. Scroll down to the bottom of Apple Podcast. 802 00:40:54,040 --> 00:40:56,920 Speaker 1: Give us five stars if you feel inclined. If you don't, 803 00:40:57,040 --> 00:40:59,279 Speaker 1: if you're like, oh, this is one star, just keep 804 00:40:59,280 --> 00:41:02,280 Speaker 1: it to yourself. Like if you don't like it, email 805 00:41:02,560 --> 00:41:05,320 Speaker 1: yeah or don't. Yeah, send constructive criticism, but you don't 806 00:41:05,360 --> 00:41:07,120 Speaker 1: have to leave a one star review. I really don't. 807 00:41:07,120 --> 00:41:09,200 Speaker 1: You don't do it, please don't um And if you 808 00:41:09,400 --> 00:41:11,040 Speaker 1: want to say anything, you leave a comment. And then 809 00:41:11,080 --> 00:41:13,400 Speaker 1: if you have questions for couch shocks, remember you can 810 00:41:13,440 --> 00:41:15,440 Speaker 1: send those to me at Catherine at you Need Therapy 811 00:41:15,480 --> 00:41:19,080 Speaker 1: podcast dot com. Thanks Amy for being here. Thank you 812 00:41:19,120 --> 00:41:20,839 Speaker 1: for having me. Should we go on a walk? Yeah, 813 00:41:20,920 --> 00:41:22,040 Speaker 1: let's do it. Okay bye,